Speaker 1: Hello, everyone, and welcome to the show on Martin willis
your host, and we have a great show tonight. I've
been really wanting for this one to come along, and
it's John Burroughs and Toby Martinez and we're going to
be talking about a little bit different than what you
may think. We're going to be talking about when it
comes to the Rendellsham Force incident. There's always been some theories,
you know, kicked around about that, but that's kind of
what the general conversation is going to be. I want
to thank everyone that helps support the show, everyone that
watches the show, and I do believe this Friday at
six pm me certainly have Caroline Corey, but there may
be something else in the works. I'm not really sure.
So anyone can actually get a weekly newsletter that updates
everyone with who's coming on the show, and also our
a blog. We do have a blog this week. I
don't have the title to it yet, just waiting on Charles.
I'm sorry, but check out over at podcastufo dot com
and you'll see the blog over there. Last weekend, I
was down with the Tedesco Brothers. I had a really
interesting time and everyone asked me if I witnessed the UFO.
Unfortunately not, but some things looked really, you know, at first,
looking through all these different cameras, types of cameras, night
vision all that, I thought I saw something at one time,
and then I realized it was a boat out at
the sea. But it's a beautiful area down there, Fire Ireland.
I think it's called They. We were going to go
to mon Talk at first, and it's a good thing
we didn't because the weather came in pretty serious up
that way. So we're down a little further down at
Robert Moses State Park and such a beautiful area and
a lot of people you don't come around this curiosity
of what the heck we're doing there with all that
equipment and all that. So there be there's some clips,
some shorts running right now. I'm going to have a
short interview with the Tedesco Brothers up. You'll see that
on my YouTube channel. So again, thank you all for
being here, and to bring in my guests now, John
Burrows and Toby Martinez welcome.
Speaker 2: Hey, thanks for having us.
Speaker 3: Good thanks for having us.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and Toby, you've never been on my show, but
John has a number of times. But Toby if you
would just a little something about yourself.
Speaker 3: Okay.
Speaker 2: So I was born and raised in Roswell, New Mexico,
which I'm sure your audience has heard of. And I
happen to work at the Roswell Day the Record, that
paper that put out the famous nineteen forty seven front
page about the crash, and I actively cover UAPs for
that very paper.
Speaker 1: That's that's pretty amazing that, you know. I mean that
I didn't realize it was the very paper that put
out that they had captured a desk. How about that?
And yeah, so I want to talk a little bit
about that. But first of all, let's bring in John,
and John you've been on a number of times. Just
if you would a nutshelf the windows from force, that's uh.
You know, I always wonder this when I when I
interviewed someone like you. Do you think your life has
been better? Let's take out all the medical history, in
the medical issues, if you didn't have any medical issues.
Do you think your life overall would be better that
this happened or you wish it never happened.
Speaker 3: That's a tough one, but probably the easiest answer would
be that it did.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I know, that's what Charles Hall had said
to me before in the past, But just a little
Nutchell about yourself, how you get it? You know, we're
over there, how you ended up over there in nineteen
eighty and all that prior to that.
Speaker 3: Joined the Air Force in seventy nine was my first assignment.
I've been there a year and a half, spent twenty
seven years in the Air Force, so it was a
good career choice. But as far as you know, the
whole thing was it's a gift that keeps giving. So
at the time, I think the set the tone for
tonight's show is simple. All these people that have come
out with these different experiences that they've had over the years,
they allays come away and say it couldn't have been ours. Well,
I've done a lot of research with different people, Tobe,
James Warrow and stuff, where we've uncovered the fact that
the government itself is really when they say they're working
on technology based off of the UFOs, they really are
developing technology geoffa UAPs. So what we experienced over those
three nights was both a real UAP and what they
were doing studying the up and the different stuff that
they were working on. When we went out into the floors.
Speaker 1: And this would be the US government over there in England.
Speaker 3: The Department of Defense in the mod A.
Speaker 1: You know, I've spoke to someone recently that who you
know and you talked to a lot, and that's Professor
Simon and a great guy, and he thinks that's the
Department of Energy that's involved in all this type of thing.
And what are your thoughts on that?
Speaker 3: Everything that Simon told you came from me? So we'll
leave it at that. Okay. I did a series with
him for a while and it ended up falling flat
on its face simply just for the same fact as
the matter is, is that everything that he was brought
into it is from somebody else over there, and everything
he's talking about is diff information and I supply to him,
and I'll tell you straight up, he has no clue
to what really went on and what's going on. He's
only trying to piece together data that I gave him.
Speaker 1: Interesting. Interesting. So before we move into this whole thing, Toby,
I just want to quickly talk to you about the
Roswell Record, and that is when a story goes out
like it did in nineteen forty seven that they captured
a disc and then it's retracted as a weather balloon.
Is there any did they ever save like the archives
of the original requests that came in, you know, from
the Army, Air Force or anything. Do they have those
documents that you know spawned that whole thing in the beginning,
or is that just you know, I mean that's a
long time ago. I mean, would they save anything like that.
Speaker 2: Well, as far as I know, it was either taken
back by the Army or it's just been lost to time.
What's interesting is most people don't realize they think it
was a day in between the retraction. It was actually
only like twelve or fourteen hours. Because we had a
sister paper at the time called the Rosnel Morning Dispatch,
and that's the morning paper.
Speaker 1: The Record was the evening paper.
Speaker 2: So the evening paper published the famous headline that the
flying disc has been found. The Morning Record published the
very next morning. All this excitements for nothing. It was
just a watherbloon.
Speaker 1: Ah, I see, wow. Interesting. So you got to let
me know during you gave me a clip and I
can play at anytime during this. You just give me
the heads up when you want me to play that.
And so let's get into the whole story how you
two got together and what you're you know, and John,
I'm really interested to know how you came up with
the theory that there's there's us involved in this in
that encounter.
Speaker 3: You want to start telling me, you want me to start,
I can start.
Speaker 2: In twenty sixteen, the Roswell Daily Records started hosting an
event during the Roswell UFO Festival called the Roszel Incident.
I helped set it up and John happened to come
down with one of the people that was doing the
radio portion of it, and that's when I first met John.
We actually ended up hanging out at I believe it
was Applebee's most of the evening, me and him and
my wife on the same day that I got married,
of all days. So to hear I had seen him
on TV, but to hear his story first firsthand was
just amazing. So I said, John, can we stay in touch?
And he said yeah. He gave me his email and
then there was a span of yours. We kind of
just talked a little bit back and forth, and then well,
John will tell you. I don't know if I agree
with it, but John will say that I brought him
out of retirement in this subject.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, So John, has that been hard for you
to you know, like, are there times you want to
just forget about this and you know, move on daily life?
Speaker 3: And well, okay, I joke and told me about that.
It's somewhat true, but not totally true. It goes all
the way back to the whole fight when I got
sick and almost died. Then I got my settlement. I
you know, the government amnities that took place, that we
were injured myself in another individual oranger during the event,
that are taking care of us. But at that point
I was ready to mail it in. And people will say,
well why because the truth of the matter is this
stuff is so deep and so very deep in the
agencies and everybody it's involved. I'm not saying that my
life's in danger, but let's just say you don't want
to poke the bear. But unfortunately, some of the people
that were involved with this that helped Pat and I
moved forward with this sentiment of Kane's office, you know,
to get the settlement and get taken care of, had
had bigger ideas on how they wanted this to move forward,
so they they didn't let it go. They kept throwing
my name into it. So in essence, no, Toby didn't
really force me into this. They did because they continue
to talk about me, they continue to bring things up
about me, but they failed to want to tell the
whole story. And I'll even go deeper. What I meant
by Professor Simon earlier you have to do the research,
and what I mean by that is everything he talks
about is stuff that was handed to him by James
Warrow and I, James and I and James particularly and
a lot of this stuff. Doug deep to come up
with a lot of the stuff that went on there.
What was outside the back ad at Woodbridge they call
it the British Roswell, but in actual realities the British
area fifty one and there's so much stuff that was
worked on back there, you know, and what was going
on during our timeframe of our incident that at the
time when I walked out of that field after on
two different nights, I couldn't explain it. So the easiest
way to do it was it had to be from
somewhere else, when in reality we've been able to show
a lot of evidence that it was both and We're
going to expand on that coming up in the fall.
But the other thing is is you have to do
the Foyers And right now I have stuff in with
the Department of Energy that I got deflected on, and
they're playing ring around the rosie with me. So, like
I said, the difference between Simon and a lot of
these people that are out there doing this for entertainment
and to make money off of it is they don't
do the research. They just do a show and they
want to reap the benefits off of people like me
that have suffered the consequences.
Speaker 1: Well in essence, you know, maybe you think I might
be doing that. I like to have interesting guests.
Speaker 3: The difference is you're doing a radio show. He's coming
off like he knows what's going on, and that's the difference.
He comes out and makes it a dramatizes rendelssohon he
set up Colonel Halt one time where he did a
video that he got a lot of hits on where
he made it look like Colonel Hall knew exactly what
happened to us and was part of the cover up.
And he did that by tying in different interviews that
he did. And that's this ingenuous. There's a difference between
interviewing people and doing the show and then trying to
come off on an expert on something that somebody experience
I see.
Speaker 1: So I you know one thing I always forget about
this is and I get email from people all the time.
In our audio podcast is really kicking butt, so to speak.
There's sometimes one hundred and fifty one hundred and sixty
thousand downloads a month, so it's been going really well
in the audio. But there's what I'm getting at is
there's a lot of new people that I get emails
from that Hey, you know, I saw this on TV
and I'm looking listening to your show or you know
that type of thing. So if you could, even though
it's probab be painful to do it and you've done
it a million times, please John, if you would a
nutshell of the whole incident, if you would, just for
the new listener.
Speaker 3: So for the new listener, here's the deal. Let us
before us happened. It'll be forty five years in December. Okay,
it happened over a three day period. The main event.
What I mean by the main event, the one it's
got all the publicity there was other people that had
stuff happened to him before our event. There was British
citizens that had different encounters and sightings prior to our event,
and there was stuff that happened after our event that
continued on almost to this day. It kind of died
out over COVID and it had less to do with
the fact that there may not study stuff going on,
but a lot of the people had to stay home
and then have gotten older and haven't gone through the
forest as much. But there's stuff that still goes on
from what I've heard still to this day. But the
three night event took place started on Christmas night at
eleven o'clock when we came on duty. But it actually
the first event happened at oh three hundred on the
twenty sixth. That was when myself and two other individuals
went out into the forest. After myself and my supervisor
viewed something coming down out of the sky into the forest,
they called the security suit down. They did some checking
on radar and they found out something disappeared on radar
and we went out into the forest and we had
a brief interaction with the whatever it was on the
first night, and the summit up All three of us
that went out there have different memories and views on
what took place. Night two happened with the we went
on a break and the midnight shift came on and
had an encounter to include the shift commander had some
kind of encounter that got to relieve the duty. Night
three was the Colonel halt knight with the memo was
based off of and the tape was made and I
ended up being out there too, and that's the night
I got really close to something. In fact, according to
Adrian Pistons, I disappeared, So it was a three night event.
There was encounters that took place on all three nights,
and like I said, at the time we walked away,
I couldn't explain it, and it felt like whatever we
encounter had nothing to do with our capabilities.
Speaker 1: I see, thank you for that. I appreciate that. And
do you feel as though there could have been missing time?
Did we talk about that? I think we may have
talked about that before.
Speaker 3: There was basically on nine three for sure. Well night
one we came back on and watch this up. Okay,
nine three, I disappeared for a period of time according
to the stands, and we were way at time on
that it's the interesting thing which will be laid out
clearly in the fall. It was partly addressed in the
first book I did. Weaponization in VIPs in twenty twenty
is time dilation was clearly involved and that the American
and Bruce government we are working on the time.
Speaker 1: Ah, you know, there's you just mentioned time dilation and
that's just the term that you know, I seem to
hear a lot when it comes to you know, a
lot of people having different encounters, you know, where it
seems like. I had one person describe it to me.
He said, it's kind of like in the matrix or
everything is like, you know, it felt like it was
moving slow. Did you have any feeling like that as well,
like things were like slowed down?
Speaker 3: And yeah, it's right away. When when Stephans and I
went down to first see what we were doing with
we left the base briefly, as soon as I opened
the car door, there was like an electricity in the
air and it felt like things were different, and whenever
we got close to it, things felt different. But as
soon as it disappeared, it felt like everything was normal again.
So I've talked about that since the very beginning. So
people that will try to come back and say I
brought this up years later, just go back to the
Unsolved Mysteries interview I did way back and green and
I talked about that too.
Speaker 1: So yeah, and just one thing I want to touch
on real quickly, just for a second and move on
from there. You know, the there was always talk about,
you know, the drugging after that, you know, during the
debriefing and all that and with it. I just wanted
to know if that was the case. With that have
been sodium pentathol or any idea.
Speaker 3: It was sodium penthal, then it was sodium amthhol was
brought up. I have no memory of that happening to me.
Kenniston has claimed it happened to him for sure. The
thing is is about it is it all ties into
what's going to be unveiled in the fall that mk
Ulter never went away. In fact, it plays into UAPs.
So when mk Ulter got exposed in the sixties and
seventies and then they claimed they destroyed everything, everything got
packed up and move over to the United Kingdom, and
there was research going on, and it plays into the
whole weaponization and everything else. They were doing it for
a reason, just like all the other stuff that's going on.
What was it so I screwed this up? Toby? What's
the name of the congressman that just came out and
said we're third generation? Now?
Speaker 1: Is that Burlson? Bon Well?
Speaker 3: Interesting enough? I talked about that in twenty twenty with Warrow,
and I've said all along, and I got attacked for
it that that was not uh, it was not a
natural UAP. It's our stuff and it all goes into
the into the propulsion system, which creates the time dollation
of bubble through plasmas and everything else, which all goes
into what a UAP is. And during the hearings that
I had been asked to testify on and I told
Burshett that I would not. I had no desire to
really go up there number one, but number two, i'd
have to be subpoena. At number three. I would want
to talk about what happens to people like me and
the military and Adrian and other people that have been
exposed to this. There needs to be some kind of
system so we could be taken care of, never mind
the civilian public. But ultimately it comes down to the
whole thing, which if you want to take it to
like Star Trek cloaking, but it's not cloaking. It's creating
a bubble and that creates an effect and that's exactly
what the tic TAC was doing. And it's able to
affect how you see it, how you remember it, and
then how it's picked up by sensors including radars. Wow.
Speaker 1: Wow, fascinating. So just I just wanted to let anyone know.
I mentioned earlier that I didn't have a title for
the blog get this week, and so I just it
was just sent to me. I want to get it
out there. So the blog from Child's there this week
is doctor JL and how and the International Center for
Center for UFO Studies. So check that out over PODCASTUFO
dot com. Thank you, John, So Toby, how did you
get I know you said you started hanging out and everything,
but how did you get into the research part of this?
And where do you how do you research something like this?
For yes?
Speaker 2: Well, I guess for me, it goes back to May
of twenty twenty three. I did a long expose article
for the Daily Record on John's case. And even though
I had known about it and seen shows on in
and everything by interviewing Senator John McCain aide, what's your name, John,
Cheryl Bennett? Cheryl Bennett Pat's lawyer, Pat Prescoonie. I'm sure
I got his last name wrong. I learned some interesting
things about the case that I wasn't aware of. Cheryl
told me in the process of trying to get John's
d D two fourteen, which is his military service record
prove he was at rindellshim at the time that she
was actually sent at least twenty different DD two fourteens
with different dates, and none of them had John in
the service at the time of the incident.
Speaker 1: I remember that when they were sick, he wasn't even
in the service, which is crazy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it's it's wild. So I would talk to
John and he would actually send me things to look up.
So for me, the research into his case specifically started
with him leaving like a breadcrumb trail for me. You know,
he had already been through this, him and James war
had already done deep.
Speaker 3: Dives into all this.
Speaker 2: So a lot of it was going back and reading
his book and then just trying to pick his brain
whenever I got the chance. That evolved into us having
some time out near a famous ranch.
Speaker 3: I guess you'd say, John, that's why you brought me
back into this. That's the part where you really Yeah,
we went out to Skinwalker Ranch and Toby got a
taste of what I'd dealt with over the years.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and John, you you like attract things, right, I mean,
you have this That's.
Speaker 3: What I'm That's where I I don't want to claim
that I do. I want to just tell you on
two different occasions, once with Toby's a witness, and another
time in Sedona where things have happened. So yes, there
is some evidence that when I show up in areas
that have known your ap activity that things will take place.
But I'm not going to go on the record like
I'm a Chris Blotsoe and some of these other guys
would show it with me, and I'll show you a UI.
Speaker 1: Hey, well, I wish I had you with me with
the Tedesco brothers this weekend. We could have pulled something
out of the sky. Maybe who knows, But.
Speaker 3: We'll see the man. I'm back a one more big
adventure in the fall, so we'll see.
Speaker 1: Ah ah wow, So John, when this this all happened
to you at the time were and you had to
be quiet about it. I mean, was that like a
really tough time in your life when you know, this
crazy thing happened, but you weren't I don't know, were
you not allowed to talk about it at all? Or
how did they how do they approach that?
Speaker 3: Well, it's twofold, okay, it's no different than what happened
with me with all these all these government people that
showed up after I got sick. It's getting people to
believe what you're telling them anyways. So for me, I
was twenty years old, went out into the forest two
different nights. Weird stuff happened. Couldn't explain it. When I
went in front of my chain of command, they told
me that they were, you know, they were looking into it.
I wrote a statement that to leave it alone. They
had questions, they get back to me, and I was
happy with that because I was this was people got
to realize nineteen days, way before all the social media stuff.
I think there was one thing that somebody else said,
I can't think of his name, who's the guy came
out with the spear Toby.
Speaker 1: And oh yeah, no, no, no, no, it's that guy
that they're using in my place now.
Speaker 3: The guy, yeah, Jake Barbara, I said his injuries were
just like mine, and blah blah blah. But he said
one thing that if Reynoldson would have happened now, it
would they couldn't have covered it up, but back in
nineteen eighty they could, so for me, it was really
easy just to let it go. The problem is is
that I got to my next base and there's a
guy that was at my first base with me. He
ran his mouth about it, and then people started asking questions.
Then at pcsked to my third base, and that's when
the news of the world story broke and then everybody
started chasing me. So in reality, I probably wouldn't have
said much at all, but thank god I did, because
if I hadn't been exposed and took it by the
bull bottle horns, I probably wouldn't be alive right now
talking to you.
Speaker 1: So that's right. And I don't know how you. I
always had a lot of respect for John McCain. I
don't know how you championed his office to pay attention
to that was quite a process to do that.
Speaker 3: No, it actually didn't start with McCain and started with
John Kyle, and I first started with trying to go
to a Democratic congressman who's now a senator out there
and it was a joke. They didn't want to look
at it. So I went to Kyle's because his web
pagea he took care of veterans. I just approached Kyle
with I was injured in line of duty and they're
not taking care of me. And they started digging into it,
and then she was the one the age that was
working on it realized my records were classified because the
first response they got was the records weren't when they
were supposed to be, and she dug deeper and found
out my records were classified. Then she turned around and
uh tried to Oh, she had me to do disability
claim for disability because that should bring my records out. Well,
according to the VA, both with Kyle's office and McCain's office,
they didn't have access to my records. But it's enough
this time, I'll show it. The settlement that I got
actually shows that they actually had my medical records. So
they were lying to both senator to Kyle's office in
McCain's office, but Kyle was retiring, so he handed it
over to McCain's office, and Cheryl Bennett that you couldn't
ask for a finer person what she did for the
case and everything else. She just pressed forward and kept
running into hurdle after hurdle. Toby the interviewers, she told
him about some of the hurdles to include. It ended
up the Inspector General's office in the Attorney General's office,
and then eventually when they actually tried to withdraw my claim,
they actually McCain personally got involved and told them either
they get to taken care of or he would do
hearings on the case. And that seemed to move it
forward quicker. But the interesting thing which most people may
not be aware of, the very people that were helping
me with this behind the scenes that went public lad
Or actually right after I got my settlement, they went
strength to McCain and his committee with the Dirtz papers.
I knew about all those papers. I'd seen them before.
They actually got to given Sean McCain, and they actually
pushed McCain because he had been partly read in and
on what went on. Because most people think Congress has
a really good idea what's going on, they don't, and
most of them don't have access to code word sencidive,
which is way above top secret, so only a few do,
which is usually the Gang of Eight. And even they
don't have total access to all this stuff. So McCain
and Cheryl Bennett did the majority of the work. McCain's
name and you know, his office played into this whole game.
Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah, well that's you know, I mean, just
the fact that you know, when I heard way back
when we're you know what Toby was talking about that
they didn't have you know, they didn't even have your
records that you were in the military or something crazy
like that. Maybe there was a rumor, but I mean,
the whole thing was no.
Speaker 3: Those two things that went on. First, they did night
I was in from seventy nine to eighty two. That
was a fact. I've got documentation to show it, and
that's what we were up against. And then the second
thing is is my medical records. They wouldn't give him
access to my civilian doctor from my heart issues and
those are still classified to this day.
Speaker 1: Is that something? So, Toby, what type of hurdles did
you run up against? What he was talking about? Did
she run up against when she was trying to move
that forward.
Speaker 2: Oh, Cheryl, she was completely stonewalled from the beginning. Like
I said, she told me she has three stacks that
are probably at least twelve inches tall of different service
documents for John, and none of them are the same.
It took her an amazing amount of time to get
the proper documentation to prove he was ever in at
the time of Rendelsham. So she's a really passionate woman
that really cares about helping veterans. And I think just
seeing what she did for John in the fight that
she put in really speaks to that and to her
character because she had to fight tooth and nail to
get I mean, it's a simple thing, you think, right,
he served his country. Here's the paper showing he did it. Yeah,
But because this crazy event happened and he was injured
all of a sudden, well maybe he wasn't there when
he knows, damn well, he was there. They know, damn
well he was there. So it's it blows my mind.
And I don't think people understand the implications of this.
Medical records that are classified. The person that first put
that out, Kit Green said, the only other medical records
that were classified that he had ever seen were Hitler's
and JFK.
Speaker 1: I would think of JFK.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Wow, that's a pretty big deal and I think
more people should pay attention to that. And as John
can tell you, just because he got the settlement, he
was still flat out told you you'll never know what
happened to you and you'll never see your medical records.
Speaker 3: Well, I can tell your story A little story on that.
We were at the point when she was working on this.
She got off with AFL PREC, which is the Air
Force Manning System, and they told her there was no
records of me being in from seventy nine eighty two.
So she called me and I kind of like challenged her,
like people challenge every things. She goes, look, call them,
here's a number, ask for this person. So I called
him and I got the same master sergeant on the phone,
and she said, there's no evidence that you were in
from seventy nine eighty two. I said, well, I asked
some paint records the show I was. She goes, are
they certified? And they go, what to me, did we
certify those records? I said no. She said, then they're irrelevant,
and I said, I just was like totally completely amazed.
So I hung up the phone and I actually put
my head down and banged it on the desk, and
they said, well, wait a minute. If I don't have
those three years, I couldn't have retired. So I call
retirement and they answered the phone and they said, what
can we do for you? He said, I'm calling to
confirm I'm not retired. And the girl started laughing. But
she says, say that again, and I said, I'm calling
you confirm I'm not retired. She goes, well, I've never
had a question like that. Where are you going with this? Said, well,
according to the United States Air Force, I did not
serve from seventy nine to eighty two, and that means
that I could not be retired. And I am, And
she said hold on, and she took my name and stuff.
She said, wait a minute, I know who you are,
and I go out. She says, I'm stationed with you
at Castle Air Force Base. Said oh, well, that's great,
and then she told me she was I remembered her,
so she does and she says, oh yeah. She says,
definitely you were in. She goes, but they're flagged. I
go flag, huh. She goes, yep, she goes, it shows
that you just called and so did Cheryl Bennett today.
And I said, so what do I do? And she says, well,
since you're somebody I know, she goes, give me her
contact information. I'll certify certain records that'll get it proven
that you were in from seventy nine to eighty two.
She did, she sent it to Cheryl. So what they
did was they kind a generic ddfour two fourteen. It
said I was in from seventy nine to eighty two.
But it's just generic. It's not really a normal DD
four two fourteen. And I'll tell you another story to this.
I cannot get any of my records still because I'm
in the process of trying to get my retirement DD
four two fourteen, and I'm getting to run around from
records and my current congressman has been no help whatsoever.
So my stuff is still classified today.
Speaker 1: How frustrating that must be to have to convince someone
of a truth, you know what I mean, I can't
even imagine that.
Speaker 3: Well, that's part of my concern because it's not just us,
it's any kind of thing that you're involved with with
the military or and even an agency or whatever, because
when I testify to see Basset's here and citizens hearing,
there was a compression. There's a lot. He's an older guy.
He was consumed from DC and his aid. He still
had a staffer worker and came down and talked to
me after the testifying because he knew exactly what was
talking about the classified record sections and everything else. And
she came down and told me that his district was Langley,
so they know exactly what was going on. And she
actually helped Cheryl too. She took her information and gave
her some advice on how to handle it. But there's
people that are involved in all kinds of stuff that
the stuff never happened, so therefore you could not have
been injured, and so therefore you can't get the care
that you need or any kind of disability or compensation
goes on all the time. I mean, just go back
to what's that they call it the Cuba stuff.
Speaker 1: Of the Havana a fact.
Speaker 3: You saw the reports where they came out when he
denied these people were injured, and he denied it was
that came from our government. And yet these people were
clearly injured by that syndrome which ties into UAPs too,
and they were clearly injured and they're fighting, like heck,
just to get in and get taken care of. Doctors
can't treat you if they don't know what injured.
Speaker 1: You, right yeah, wow wow. So let's get into why
we think that this. I don't know which one of
you want to handle this, but what started you down
the road where this may not be alien technology?
Speaker 3: God, I can start with that, because I mean, Toby
wasn't involved in that. Basically, it started with James Worrow.
And what I mean by that is I knew there
was more to it than just whatever encounter could be
something other than a biological human being. But the interesting
thing was says that Warrel started digging at the area
outside the back Gate, which is steep in technology advancements.
As far as they developed lasers there, they developed nuclear
stuff there, they developed radar there. They were working on
all kinds of technology out there, including plasmas with the
lasers and stuff like that. So he started digging into that.
And I'm going to add a tidbit to your audience
that I don't know if you're most of our awareness,
but Nick Pope's dad was second in command of all
the technical division inside the mod during our event. It
was involved with our event and I'm going to show
proof of that in the fall. So the interesting thing
was this was the British Area fifty one. In fact,
it was probably much more active in nineteen eighty than
our own Area fifty one was with technology development and
everything else because of radars. In fact, the F one
seventeen was caught that's how it got exposed. Partly the
British caught it was flying out of Scotland and it
was testing Their radar systems were the best in the
world at the time, so it got exposed over there
in Britain. And there was a guy I can't think
of his name now he did Project Gringlow that talked
about that on the radio. So I had with Linda Maltow.
So the interesting thing is this all goes into plasmas
and stealth and time dilation and everything else. So he
started finding all this information like the blue lights of
Colonel Hawks saw in the sky where actually were actually
probably UAP plasmas that part of them where we created
ourselves what they had the ability to do at the time,
and they could be controlled by lasers. So the lights
that we saw coming down from these objects could have
very well been coming from the ground up instead of
coming down.
Speaker 1: Oh wow.
Speaker 3: Plus there was another event that That's the one thing
I'll tell you that this engineer that I know from
the UK. It was in the first book and it
was going to be expanded a little bit in the
second one. But there was an event going on at
the time involved they tried to use the cover of
Brendelsom with satellites and the lighthouse and all that. What's
interesting is there's a good possibility during this timeframe they
brought down the state of the art of spy satellite
the Russians had that were watching the area. They actually
brought it down in what came down in the area
right outside the back gate. So that was going on
at the same time.
Speaker 1: Also, so when it comes to what Colonel Halt claims
that he saw the sink bouncing between you know, I
mean there were different people that, like you said that,
people were saying they saw different things, and but you know,
Colonel Halt talks about this thing that looked like an
eyeball kind of bouncing through the woods that you think
that was a wormhole.
Speaker 3: I know it was because I'll say this simply for
the fact is that if you look at Eric Davis's
paper and you look at how it would be viewed
through a starscope, he actually the description he gave of
what he saw is the beginning of a mini wormhole.
And there's a guy that I'm not going to mention
his name, but he's involved deeply in this, and he
worked through the Office of a Net Assessment, which most
people aren't even aware of. And there was a guy
calleding Andy Marshall that ran it forever, and his nickname
was Yoda. And the fact is is that they were
working on all this technology. And one of the statements
City would always make was they discovered radar when they
were working on the death ray, which his lasers. So
a lot of his technology evolves from something they're already
working on or testing and stuff, and those are what
he saw through the starsco Almost one hundred percent was
the mini wormhole, which would then have something to do
with creating a time dollar some level. Wow.
Speaker 1: So, how how would you spect that they would reverse
engineer and create and possibly test. Do you think that's
what it was? They were testing something although they were.
Speaker 3: Working on bringing the satellite down through and its spelled
out completely. The reason why I say it's a good
chance that that's what took place is he lays this
out in detail, exactly what facilities would be used, how
it would happen, and what would go on. Well, okay,
it's like I'll give you example. You remember the food fighters, right, Yeah,
I did that with Professor Simon. That was the beginning
the nuclear era radars and all that was the creation
of where they just started to discover UAPs and how
radars would influence them be involved with them. And I've
told Toby this most likely Roswell had something to do
with radars, because they just put a radar system online
down there right before the Roswell event, and these frequencies
that these radars create and do and will cause these
different effects. And I did a special assignment on that,
but he didn't do the research Worrol and I did,
and he was just part of it. But there's a difference,
I can always say between being involved in something and
researching it. And my hat goes off to James Worrow
for all the hard work he did on these different
areas and projects. And then now with advanced DAYI you
could go even deeper into these projects, and I found
three projects that people weren't even aware of that were
taking place right outside the back. Eight. Margaret, Thatcher's administration
has evolved in it.
Speaker 1: Now, there was a I'm trying to remember Lord nell
or something.
Speaker 3: Norton.
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, he.
Speaker 3: Would have been the krival and the p tech expects job.
The Secretary of Defense.
Speaker 1: Uh, well, he got involved in this, that whole situation.
And you know what I mean, wouldn't he have had
some inside information?
Speaker 3: No, no, you wouldn't. It's co word sensitive. The United
States uses that. It's SAP programs and above the needs
to know, and when you're in the R and D
and initial operation stuff, a lot of times it's so
compartmentalized and kept secret that the only time that it's
actually briefed, even to like the Prime Minister or the President,
is when it's going to be utilized.
Speaker 1: All right, So, John, you were injured by whatever this was,
And do you think, I mean, would they actually test
something like this when there could be the possibility of
injuring you know, servicemen.
Speaker 3: Time after time. Look at MK Ultra, look at the
bomb test, the radar tests, all this stuff. They've done
it over and over, the nimits, and I always forget
the other incident, the Gibbel incident, I think it was
I called it. I'm sorry what the Roosevelt, Yeah, the Roosevelt. Right,
those are both located by facility that no one wants
to acknowledge. Lou Alzando almost gave up the goods unidentified.
But it was interesting, you know. Obviously the interview was
done and they cut it. He was in a segment
talking about it, and as the segment was ending, he said,
there's a lot of stuff involved that was set off
of Catalina Island and they broke for the commercial and
when they came back, they didn't talk about what it was.
So there's a lot of stuff that's in these different
areas that these two incidents took place, have played into
those incidents, including the second one is when they said
they saw drones. Okay, but people wanted to disregard that.
But they've gotten to the point now where they've got
the competing which is quantum quantum satellites and the energy
sources that they no longer have to be close to
these facilities to create those effects.
Speaker 1: Now, what about the theory. I think it was Penison
probably Is he the only one that thinks this could
be a time to travel situation or are there other
people that have that thoughts as well.
Speaker 3: The problem with Pedicine is is he's not off base
on the technology involved and what the applications could be.
My issue with pedisin was always twofold number one. He
didn't come out with the facts till years later, and
then the excuses he provided moren't truthful because some of
the excuses he provided. I was there when he could
have exposed the notebook in the early nineties and he didn't,
and then he held on to the codes till later.
But the fact of the matter is is that is
that it very well could involve time travel, yes, which
is what time dilation is?
Speaker 1: Ah wow? And how is this just beyond understanding or
is there some way you can.
Speaker 3: Well, I'm going to tell me now. I A're going
to try to explain it in the book. But I
don't claim to be an expert or scientist. But the
facts are there. You just have to look at the
dirt papers, and you have to look at what Davis
talked about, what wormholes are, what time violation is, what
put Off talked about the proposal system, which is given
as evidence at the hearing with Gresh. The evidence is there.
The problem is the nuts and mults. UFO people don't
want to accept any of it. And maraje Man even
basically the documentary in the book went into some of it,
including what Green said about how people don't realize they
were conditioned to believe what UFOs are, but in reality
is a lot different and it's not as bad as
the conditioning. They're not going to come here and eat you,
you know, and destroy you or try to take take
you know, you know, take you away. But there is
an other intelligence life. It just may not be a
biological being. It could be something totally different to include Reynolds,
whom could involve our own consciousness and our consciousness coming
back from the future.
Speaker 1: Wow, Toby, do you have anything you want to add
to that?
Speaker 2: No, I think John summed it up very well. Okay,
maybe now's a good time since he's talking about the book.
Speaker 3: We have a three part series we've been working on.
Speaker 2: The first book is out. The second book is going
to be I feel extremely impactful because it's gonna be
about John's journey from Rindlesham to where he is now.
All right, from my perspective, there's a lot of things
about his story that people haven't heard that it's gonna
blow their minds.
Speaker 1: Yeah, oh yeah.
Speaker 4: Back in nineteen eighty, a time when the East's nuclear
threat was still a major concern, strange objects were seen
over woods near the abbase at Woodbridge.
Speaker 1: Okay, we're back, so so that shows all the information.
I'll have all that information down in the show notes
for those of you with that are listening to the
audio segment of that. But uh wow, DNA What I
saw the word DNA? What does that have to do
with this? Where does that all fit in that?
Speaker 3: That has to do with the fact that it was
a long story. But the short jest of it is
Kick Green, when you first showed up, met with my attorney,
Pat for Sconia, then came out to Sedona with Pat
and his wife, who's attorney Annas, evaluated me and then
I wanted to take a DNA sample and it wasn't
the normal one where you spit into it too, it
was blood. And I told him that because there was
no way to verify the information, and so he left
and he still sent Gary Nolan and Colon Kala her
down the next day. It reached from a sci fi
it does, and it's hard for people to believe. But
I've got the proof that it happened. There were minding
pat can verify it. But Gary Nolan, they flew him
from Stanford to Vegas. Colin Hunter and him drove down
the next day and they met with us in a
hotel to try to convince me to give up my blood,
which I wouldn't do, and they wanted to be part
of the DNA study that they were doing. That they
weren't ever going to tell you any of the results
or anything else. Well, they eventually got my DNA when
they did the heart surgery. I found that out to
John Alexander, but the facts behind it added up. I
knew something went on. He just verified what I knew
took place, and then they got my DNA. Green came
back and visited me in Illinois with some documents he
didn't want to put out over the Internet, and some
formulas and stuff that had to do with time dilation
and stuff that effected our case. But he also wanted
me to give a sample of a spit sample this time,
not the blood, and I agreed to it because I
knew they already had it, so whenever they got the
first time, obviously they wanted to have my permission to
use it all right, And whatever they were doing, most
likely it was behind closed doors with the DVD. So
but to get to the point was the test came
back and Green and Nola made a big deal which
will be exposed in the upcoming book of what they
said was involving myself, my son, and my family exactly
what it involved. But it was all done through a
Repido lab in Pennsylvania. I have the reports and everything else.
But another interrucy tibbet that will come out in the
fall is I actually have an interaction between Christopher Green
and one of my VA doctors talking about a lot
of stuff that took place. So, I mean, this was
just started the whole thing with DNA Gary Nolan's involvement.
They never can get the story right now. Gary Nolan's
trying to claim that he saw my medical records. He
couldn't have. No one's seen him. And then he's trying
to say there's nothing to them, but again he couldn't
have seen them. But they clearly were doing a study
on people that had exposed or UAPs that were confirmed,
and I was one of them, and they were trying
to figure out how it affected our DNA or was
it our DNA that attracted this phenomenon.
Speaker 1: Wow, now I know Gary Nolan has taken brain scans.
Did he ask you to do that as well?
Speaker 3: Yeah? But that got pooh pooh because I was a
pacemaker and even though it's one that could be susceptible
to that, they couldn't justify. They claimed they couldn't justify it.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, well I think that that whole part of
it is fascinating that there could be changes made, you know,
or maybe, like they said, maybe that's you know, there
are some people that seemed to you know, you mentioned
Chris Blood, so I don't know this. Some people think
that's real, some people don't. I don't really know him
on the fence about it, but uh, you know, I
have seen videos that seemed of things, but I don't
know how how those videos have been analyzed.
Speaker 3: Everything I've got with in mind, and I'm not saying
that he doesn't have an ability to do something. So
I'm not a scientist. I haven't seen the data, and
I haven't been around him. But what I will tell
you is this, if he had that kind of ability,
why is he still walking.
Speaker 1: Around in what? In what way?
Speaker 5: If he's got that kind of ability, he can be weaponized,
just saying you have them in some kind of program
and some kind of thing going on, and why would
they want it out there for the public view?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I have.
Speaker 1: I mean, I guess you're right about it. Seems like
the government and the military are always looking for ways
to weaponize whatever, whatever it is. I mean, I'm sure
AI will be weaponized or used.
Speaker 3: Oh no, no, no, you don't understand. That plays into
part of what we're going to talk about. You notice
they talk about, uh, the way they were what is
the de I Toby, one of the one of the
they use which is artificial intelligence. But they're working on
and this will blow your mind, but this is real
because they've already admitted the space the Science Division said
they have the ability to manipulate space and time. But
ultimately artificial intelligence. You explained to me first, Martin, what
is artificial intelligence? To you?
Speaker 1: It's just advanced. It's almost like all the information gets
put in and then it's sorted intelligently. To regurgitate whatever it.
Speaker 3: Is, Where does it come from?
Speaker 1: It comes from us originally, so and all our information
it comes from our consciousness, right, I guess you would
say that, yeah.
Speaker 3: It's our consciousness, biological consciousness that it's putting it all together. Now,
here's the interesting thing. Think about the DNA studies. They
made them cheap, but they're analyzing everybody's DNA for a reason.
The study you get back is not what they're doing
with you. Like my DNA test was a ten thousand
dollars pop test that was done by a lab in Pennsylvania.
They're probably doing that. They're looking for certain markers of
trying to understand different people that may have different markers
and abilities. But DNA goes to consciousness, which comes into
the biological body, and they are now taking every time
somebody uses it, everything that gets put in there is
creating a database that can be used by this artificial intelligence.
Now that's from the biological What they're trying to do
and they're working on it is separate the consciousness from
the biological body. Because of the difficulties they're having with
AI is taking over the consciousness that the computing that
they're putting into it, okay, And they're trying to put
consciousness separated from the biological body to control the AI
and they're losing that battle too. So all this information,
all this stuff that's out there, all the data is
coming together. There are people that they're trying to put
stuff together with UFO stuff, stories and stuff. His name
was out of England. Who was doing that, Isaac coy Let.
Everybody's articles and research. This is on a national Every
single thing that's out there, every belief you have, everything
that you know. They're putting it all together into a database.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and they're scraping. I heard AI is even scraping
every YouTube.
Speaker 3: No, everything that's gone on.
Speaker 1: Out hundreds of hours minute it go up there and
it's being scraped constantly. Crazy.
Speaker 3: This is stuff that's being put together so AI. But
where where does it become sent When does it become sentient?
You know? Yeah, And when consciousness is separated from the
biological body, it comes into the body, you know, as
it's being formed in the mother's roomb so it matches
up with the body and the DNA and the body.
That's how deep this is being looked at and' going
to be weaponized.
Speaker 1: Wow, pretty scary. Well, it's been a real pleasure to
speak to you both, and let's go ahead and throw
how people can find your information. I will have it
down below, but just for those listening now.
Speaker 2: So we have the book series coming and we also
have a documentary coming out on John's case that is
going to have world exclusive, never before seen documents that
I think definitively put to bed that something happened to him.
So definitely keep an eye out for both of those things.
The website is Warrenthshadows dot com. And Martin, I'd like
to give a shout out to my Roswell research partner,
Paul Simoni's he heard I was coming on your show
and he was really excited. Oh great, Yeah, maybe we
can have me and him on because we're digging up
new information on a case that's almost eighty years old.
Speaker 3: That's just.
Speaker 2: Mind boggling.
Speaker 1: Love to have that. Yeah, all right, well, thanks so
much for you both. It's been a real pleasure.
Speaker 3: Thanks for having us, Thanks for having us.
Speaker 1: All right, all right, take care, all right everyone. We'll
be back next week and thanks so much for tuning in,
and we'll also be here on Friday at six pm.
Every Friday at six pm. Thanks so much, and remember
to keep your eyes to this