1
00:00:15,839 --> 00:00:18,719
Speaker 1: Welcome to Popcorn Psychology, the podcast where we watch blockbuster

2
00:00:18,800 --> 00:00:21,719
movies and psychoanalyze them. My name is Brinnie Brownfield and

3
00:00:21,719 --> 00:00:23,640
I'm a child therapist and I'm joined by.

4
00:00:23,719 --> 00:00:25,679
Speaker 2: Ben Stover, individual therapist.

5
00:00:25,519 --> 00:00:27,600
Speaker 3: Hannah Espinoza, marriage and family therapists.

6
00:00:27,719 --> 00:00:31,000
Speaker 1: We're all licensed clinical professional counselors also known as therapists,

7
00:00:31,000 --> 00:00:33,640
who practice out of Chicago. Even though we are licensed

8
00:00:33,679 --> 00:00:37,119
mental health professionals, this podcast is purely for nentertainment purposes

9
00:00:37,399 --> 00:00:39,960
and to fulfill our love of dissecting pop culture.

10
00:00:39,600 --> 00:00:40,320
Speaker 3: And all forms.

11
00:00:40,479 --> 00:00:43,280
Speaker 2: Please remember that, even though we are all licensed therapists,

12
00:00:43,320 --> 00:00:44,439
we aren't your therapist.

13
00:00:44,679 --> 00:00:47,000
Speaker 1: If you are struggling with mental health symptoms, please find

14
00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:50,880
a local mental health provider. Hey everyone, So we will

15
00:00:50,880 --> 00:00:55,000
be talking about e T today by Steven Spielberg. We

16
00:00:55,240 --> 00:00:57,880
are going to be talking about the family within the movie,

17
00:00:57,960 --> 00:01:02,079
specifically the separation that occurs with the parents and how

18
00:01:02,119 --> 00:01:05,879
that changes the family dynamics. We'll also be talking about siblings.

19
00:01:06,319 --> 00:01:08,680
We're talking about kids when they're left alone to their

20
00:01:08,680 --> 00:01:11,400
own devices, which is a big component to a lot

21
00:01:11,480 --> 00:01:14,400
of movies of this time period. We're also going to

22
00:01:14,400 --> 00:01:17,560
be talking about how adults respond to kids and empathy

23
00:01:17,799 --> 00:01:22,319
in communication and as always will do treatment and final thoughts.

24
00:01:22,599 --> 00:01:25,159
For anyone who I don't know has been in a

25
00:01:25,200 --> 00:01:27,719
coma for the past thirty years and has never seen

26
00:01:27,799 --> 00:01:30,239
ET or heard ET or anything like that, I guess

27
00:01:30,280 --> 00:01:31,519
would be forty years by now.

28
00:01:31,799 --> 00:01:33,400
Speaker 3: Forty Oh that's so upsetting.

29
00:01:33,599 --> 00:01:34,640
Speaker 2: Forty four years.

30
00:01:34,760 --> 00:01:36,079
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, ETO, because it was.

31
00:01:36,079 --> 00:01:37,680
Speaker 1: It came out in nineteen eighty two, and I'm going

32
00:01:37,719 --> 00:01:38,640
to be forty four this year.

33
00:01:39,200 --> 00:01:40,920
Speaker 2: And how arymore.

34
00:01:42,280 --> 00:01:46,040
Speaker 1: As beautiful as ever? Fifty almost got to be. Yeah,

35
00:01:46,640 --> 00:01:50,719
so that's you know, she was what six six in

36
00:01:50,719 --> 00:01:51,239
this movie?

37
00:01:51,280 --> 00:01:55,840
Speaker 2: So yeah, forty four plus six is fifty is fifty.

38
00:01:56,159 --> 00:02:00,560
Speaker 3: And that's math corner with Ben Stover. Yep, thanks, not a.

39
00:02:00,519 --> 00:02:05,840
Speaker 2: Corner I suggested follows me too. I am very good

40
00:02:05,920 --> 00:02:07,560
with words, but numbers.

41
00:02:09,120 --> 00:02:12,120
Speaker 1: So for anyone who's not aware, ET is about a

42
00:02:12,159 --> 00:02:16,319
young boy he's ten years old, named Elliott. He finds

43
00:02:16,520 --> 00:02:19,639
a alien in his backyard that he calls ET, and

44
00:02:19,719 --> 00:02:23,120
he slowly gets to know him via different forms of

45
00:02:23,120 --> 00:02:25,680
communicating until he realizes that ET needs to.

46
00:02:25,599 --> 00:02:27,800
Speaker 3: Go home, so he helps him go home.

47
00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:32,960
Speaker 1: While various forms of the government are eavesdropping on their

48
00:02:32,960 --> 00:02:36,919
house listening to their calls, trailing their neighborhood and you know,

49
00:02:37,439 --> 00:02:41,680
slightly antagonistic to their agenda. So, as I said before,

50
00:02:41,719 --> 00:02:43,919
we're first going to talk about the family because I think,

51
00:02:44,000 --> 00:02:47,919
in my opinion, this movie is a lot about a family,

52
00:02:48,520 --> 00:02:51,240
and a lot of the plot points of this movie

53
00:02:51,919 --> 00:02:55,000
I think happen or can happen because they are a

54
00:02:55,039 --> 00:02:57,240
family in change.

55
00:02:57,599 --> 00:03:00,719
Speaker 3: They are a family that's kind of right now.

56
00:03:01,759 --> 00:03:06,919
Speaker 1: We learn pretty early in the movie that their dad

57
00:03:07,000 --> 00:03:08,800
is no longer in the home with them. We don't

58
00:03:08,840 --> 00:03:12,599
really know why exactly. All we know is that he

59
00:03:12,919 --> 00:03:16,639
is not living with them and he's in Mexico with

60
00:03:16,840 --> 00:03:19,680
some woman named Sally, but we don't really know any

61
00:03:19,719 --> 00:03:22,120
other context. We do know later in the movie she

62
00:03:22,159 --> 00:03:25,240
does mentioned that her and her husband are recently separated,

63
00:03:25,400 --> 00:03:27,879
so I assume they're like not even divorced. And it

64
00:03:27,879 --> 00:03:30,520
did kind of feel like a recent thing, Like they

65
00:03:30,520 --> 00:03:35,159
do feel like a household where it is very fresh.

66
00:03:35,759 --> 00:03:37,960
It feels like it's been like maybe like a couple

67
00:03:38,000 --> 00:03:39,479
of weeks at the most.

68
00:03:40,280 --> 00:03:42,560
Speaker 3: Really, Yeah, I mean.

69
00:03:43,280 --> 00:03:45,960
Speaker 1: I have a lot of experience with divorce and separation

70
00:03:46,120 --> 00:03:48,960
and parents not being together, and so one of them

71
00:03:49,000 --> 00:03:50,520
many times that my parents got.

72
00:03:50,400 --> 00:03:54,159
Speaker 3: Divorced about this.

73
00:03:54,240 --> 00:03:58,080
Speaker 1: Mom really reminds me about like three to four weeks after,

74
00:03:58,159 --> 00:04:00,639
like things have said in that like he's really not

75
00:04:00,680 --> 00:04:04,960
coming back, and you start to and that's when you

76
00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:07,520
start to have to do all the pieces of how

77
00:04:07,560 --> 00:04:09,120
am I going to do this now on my own?

78
00:04:09,599 --> 00:04:12,879
Speaker 2: Yeah, getting out of the dissociated fugue state that not

79
00:04:13,080 --> 00:04:17,360
really processing, just surviving and kind of just following the

80
00:04:17,399 --> 00:04:20,920
motions but maybe having still unrealistic ideas. Are not fully

81
00:04:21,079 --> 00:04:24,199
able to accept all that's happened because you're going through

82
00:04:24,199 --> 00:04:27,000
all the court cases and spending all the money. I

83
00:04:27,000 --> 00:04:29,000
don't know if it cost all of the money in

84
00:04:29,040 --> 00:04:31,399
the eighties like it does now, because getting divorced now

85
00:04:31,480 --> 00:04:34,560
is basically all your money. All of it is gone

86
00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:36,759
to the lawyers clients that I have going through that.

87
00:04:36,800 --> 00:04:38,600
It's outrageous money. I don't know if it was then.

88
00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:43,279
But that fugue state eventually ends and reality hits and

89
00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:47,839
the overwhelm is crushing, And yeah, I don't know how

90
00:04:47,879 --> 00:04:49,839
long I would guess under six months, So I think,

91
00:04:50,439 --> 00:04:55,040
you know, whatever she is processing, she has not processed

92
00:04:55,120 --> 00:05:00,399
yet and is very preoccupied with her anger because every

93
00:05:00,399 --> 00:05:02,720
moment we see her alone, she's muttering to herself, he

94
00:05:02,720 --> 00:05:07,040
doesn't even like Mexico. Like there's little comments throughout this

95
00:05:07,079 --> 00:05:11,160
whole thing about her anger. And there's the moment I

96
00:05:11,160 --> 00:05:13,240
think when she's sitting alone in her Halloween costume, like

97
00:05:13,279 --> 00:05:15,800
she's just sitting and straight talking to herself about like

98
00:05:15,920 --> 00:05:19,040
just that like hashtag arguments I want in the shower

99
00:05:19,120 --> 00:05:23,439
kind of energy where she's not hallucinating, she's not having

100
00:05:23,519 --> 00:05:27,639
any mental health crisis other than processing what the fuck

101
00:05:27,759 --> 00:05:29,120
just happened when her life fell apart.

102
00:05:29,720 --> 00:05:32,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, because if she's saying recently separated, I would also

103
00:05:32,360 --> 00:05:34,680
say that's probably been in the last six months, if

104
00:05:34,720 --> 00:05:37,879
not shorter. And the fact that the dad is already

105
00:05:38,000 --> 00:05:44,040
vacationing with another woman, to me insinuates that they're probably

106
00:05:44,040 --> 00:05:48,199
maybe even with some overlap in the situation. Or you know,

107
00:05:48,199 --> 00:05:50,959
there's a lot of people who and I know this

108
00:05:51,000 --> 00:05:53,439
is kind of a trope against men, So apologies men

109
00:05:54,279 --> 00:05:56,959
is like start having like a partner right away. Like

110
00:05:57,000 --> 00:06:01,000
men don't stay single for long post breakups, post divorce.

111
00:06:00,800 --> 00:06:04,160
Speaker 2: They do not usually, I mean usually, once the relationship

112
00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:09,240
is deteriorating, there's on one side or the other, there's

113
00:06:09,720 --> 00:06:13,680
often seeking companionship, so it seems quite clear that dad

114
00:06:13,720 --> 00:06:16,519
had done that and Mom was busy being a mom

115
00:06:16,560 --> 00:06:20,480
and figuring out whatever she was doing to survive, because

116
00:06:20,480 --> 00:06:23,279
there's no at least mentioned in this film of Mom

117
00:06:23,319 --> 00:06:24,480
having any partner at all.

118
00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:27,680
Speaker 1: Could be really cool like my dad and just go

119
00:06:27,800 --> 00:06:30,399
from one woman's bed to the next. That's why me

120
00:06:30,439 --> 00:06:34,600
and my sister are only five months apart to the day.

121
00:06:34,680 --> 00:06:37,160
We are currently both the same age.

122
00:06:37,360 --> 00:06:39,800
Speaker 2: Which obviously happened with one woman right.

123
00:06:40,040 --> 00:06:41,519
Speaker 3: Right, two ladies.

124
00:06:44,639 --> 00:06:47,680
Speaker 1: But no, I think watching this now is like an

125
00:06:47,680 --> 00:06:53,160
adult woman watching it with an adult therapist's brain. I

126
00:06:53,199 --> 00:06:55,800
was really clocking what you're talking about, Ben, which is

127
00:06:56,560 --> 00:06:59,160
this movie actually does a really good job at writing

128
00:06:59,199 --> 00:07:03,160
a fully flagh parent, like she's fully fleshed out as

129
00:07:03,160 --> 00:07:05,480
a character, even though the movie is not really following her.

130
00:07:05,839 --> 00:07:09,519
It's not about her. And it also I think allows

131
00:07:09,720 --> 00:07:12,040
us as the audience to have a way clear understanding

132
00:07:12,040 --> 00:07:14,560
of like I said, like why these kids, as we'll

133
00:07:14,560 --> 00:07:17,920
talk about later, are left alone a lot is that

134
00:07:18,319 --> 00:07:20,480
she's a mom that is like so frazzled like I

135
00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:24,759
think a perfect example of this is when Gertie tries

136
00:07:24,839 --> 00:07:29,839
to show her et like he's right there, and she's

137
00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:32,399
like there, yeah, honey, Yeah, and she's like in the fridge,

138
00:07:32,439 --> 00:07:34,399
she's trying to get groceries and the phone's ringing.

139
00:07:34,920 --> 00:07:36,560
Speaker 3: Like she is a woman on the edge.

140
00:07:37,000 --> 00:07:42,079
Speaker 2: Yeah, she's absolutely on the edge, and she's dissociated as hell.

141
00:07:42,160 --> 00:07:45,120
She's I mean, when you do a mental status exam,

142
00:07:45,240 --> 00:07:48,879
preoccupied is one of your options to look at, and

143
00:07:48,920 --> 00:07:53,600
she would absolutely fall into that category. I see no

144
00:07:53,720 --> 00:07:59,040
evidence of psychosis. I see anxiety, I see overwhelm. I

145
00:07:59,079 --> 00:08:02,920
see a clear evidence of adjustment disorder with her, But

146
00:08:02,959 --> 00:08:05,800
I don't see anything else that I find concerning. She's depressed,

147
00:08:05,800 --> 00:08:09,800
she's anxious, she's overwhelmed, she's all of that because of

148
00:08:09,839 --> 00:08:13,639
her circumstances. Outside of that, we don't have any information

149
00:08:13,720 --> 00:08:16,240
on who she was, how she was before, but we

150
00:08:16,279 --> 00:08:20,079
can see clearly the main antagonist in her life is

151
00:08:20,160 --> 00:08:24,360
that she's going through a divorce and she's now raising

152
00:08:24,720 --> 00:08:28,839
three kids that are quite spaced out in age. I'm

153
00:08:28,879 --> 00:08:32,840
assuming they're each about four years apart. That's a lot.

154
00:08:33,080 --> 00:08:36,279
Speaker 3: Mike is fifteen, Elliott is ten, and she is six.

155
00:08:36,720 --> 00:08:43,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, so pretty close, yeah, right, And that is having

156
00:08:43,200 --> 00:08:47,080
kids myself that are five point five years apart from

157
00:08:47,080 --> 00:08:53,679
each other. The developmental issues put you in different mindsets

158
00:08:53,759 --> 00:08:57,440
that separate your consciousness a lot. And I have two,

159
00:08:57,600 --> 00:09:02,559
not three and now, and I have a spouse around

160
00:09:02,559 --> 00:09:06,320
to help with that, and she does not. Now all

161
00:09:06,360 --> 00:09:09,919
of a sudden, and keeping yourself in the mentality of

162
00:09:10,320 --> 00:09:13,960
how do I give each of these kids what they

163
00:09:14,000 --> 00:09:19,120
need as appropriate would be immensely overwhelming. And that's what

164
00:09:19,159 --> 00:09:22,440
we see is she's just like there's beer. There's beer

165
00:09:22,960 --> 00:09:24,919
sitting out on the counter, and she's getting a call

166
00:09:24,960 --> 00:09:28,919
from the school like, uh so your kid is doing

167
00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:33,559
some real banana shit and acting intoxicid And she's just

168
00:09:33,559 --> 00:09:35,639
like looking at a beer can and just like cleaning

169
00:09:35,720 --> 00:09:38,000
up all the masks and like looks at the beer can.

170
00:09:38,080 --> 00:09:39,240
Then just she smells it.

171
00:09:39,320 --> 00:09:40,240
Speaker 3: No, well she smells it.

172
00:09:40,279 --> 00:09:44,039
Speaker 1: Actually, like I feel like she is like what like

173
00:09:44,120 --> 00:09:46,759
I feel like too much Like just like we said,

174
00:09:46,799 --> 00:09:49,440
like she is just she's someone who's like trying to

175
00:09:49,480 --> 00:09:50,679
go through the motions as well.

176
00:09:50,840 --> 00:09:52,039
Speaker 3: Yeah, like she's trying to get.

177
00:09:51,879 --> 00:09:54,679
Speaker 1: The groceries, get the kid, Like you're right. What also

178
00:09:54,679 --> 00:09:56,279
sucks about the kids being a part in age is

179
00:09:56,360 --> 00:09:58,159
you know they're not any of them are attending the

180
00:09:58,159 --> 00:10:01,840
same school at the same time, which she's like picking

181
00:10:01,919 --> 00:10:04,759
up one kid now she's getting called from school about

182
00:10:04,759 --> 00:10:06,840
another before she's even processing the fact that there's like

183
00:10:06,879 --> 00:10:10,000
an empty beer can on the counter, you know, like

184
00:10:10,039 --> 00:10:12,799
things are happening before she's had time to think about

185
00:10:13,360 --> 00:10:15,720
the last thing or the current thing that's happening.

186
00:10:15,960 --> 00:10:21,000
Speaker 2: Right and she's going on like typical parent autopilot of like, Okay,

187
00:10:21,240 --> 00:10:23,840
if I don't put these girls shees away right now

188
00:10:23,960 --> 00:10:26,679
in the thirty seconds that I have to do it.

189
00:10:26,879 --> 00:10:28,879
I mean I can listen to Gertie talk, but also

190
00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:30,919
like if this doesn't get done, I am going to

191
00:10:31,000 --> 00:10:32,600
be behind on all the other tests I got to

192
00:10:32,600 --> 00:10:35,639
do to stay on top of these kids. Like she's

193
00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:39,480
barely listening, she's not paying attention. She's just focused on

194
00:10:39,519 --> 00:10:43,120
the test she has to do while also connecting to

195
00:10:43,159 --> 00:10:46,200
the kids as much as she has mentally available at

196
00:10:46,200 --> 00:10:49,000
that moment, which is not a lot, which is understandable,

197
00:10:49,720 --> 00:10:55,120
but recognizing how that creates a little bit of a

198
00:10:55,279 --> 00:10:58,679
dissociative state where your brain is separated into multiple tests.

199
00:10:59,080 --> 00:11:03,600
Then add personal shit of processing a divorce. That's where

200
00:11:04,159 --> 00:11:06,679
when you look at a mental status exam preoccupied would

201
00:11:06,679 --> 00:11:10,279
fit because clearly she's trying to digest what the fuck

202
00:11:10,399 --> 00:11:16,320
just happened while also trying to be an only parent

203
00:11:16,720 --> 00:11:19,279
in a household with three kids a very different age,

204
00:11:19,320 --> 00:11:22,279
which is a hell of a lot. And then kids

205
00:11:22,320 --> 00:11:25,639
are also having what she presumes are adjustment issues. But

206
00:11:25,840 --> 00:11:27,679
you know, of course there's an alien in the house,

207
00:11:27,799 --> 00:11:31,720
so you know what adult would believe that as their

208
00:11:31,759 --> 00:11:34,159
first effort, like, yeah, there's just just an alien from

209
00:11:34,159 --> 00:11:37,399
outer space, just from another planet in my house that

210
00:11:37,480 --> 00:11:39,159
my kids are interacting with and brought home.

211
00:11:40,039 --> 00:11:43,080
Speaker 1: Everything's fine, honestly, And like her version of the movie,

212
00:11:43,080 --> 00:11:45,000
I'm sure she's like, this is the last thing I

213
00:11:45,039 --> 00:11:47,919
need right now, Like in the scene where she finally

214
00:11:47,960 --> 00:11:49,840
sees et on the ground and she picks the kids

215
00:11:49,840 --> 00:11:51,519
and she's like what the lock Like I'm sure in

216
00:11:51,559 --> 00:11:54,320
her head she's like all this stuff and now they've

217
00:11:54,360 --> 00:11:57,240
brought this dying animal into the house and they want

218
00:11:57,279 --> 00:12:00,159
me to be cool, because I do think we're I

219
00:12:00,240 --> 00:12:02,120
also want to give her a lot of credit, and

220
00:12:02,159 --> 00:12:02,759
I don't know how.

221
00:12:02,919 --> 00:12:04,759
Speaker 3: I do think she's doing this somewhat consciously.

222
00:12:05,559 --> 00:12:08,480
Speaker 1: Is she's she's making an effort not to take out

223
00:12:08,519 --> 00:12:11,120
any of these feelings on the kids, which I think

224
00:12:11,200 --> 00:12:14,080
is really great given how we can see.

225
00:12:13,879 --> 00:12:15,840
Speaker 3: How frazzled she is the whole movie.

226
00:12:16,600 --> 00:12:19,320
Speaker 1: The only time she really raises her voice is one

227
00:12:19,360 --> 00:12:22,440
out of genuine like shock and fear, which the most scenes,

228
00:12:22,799 --> 00:12:24,960
but like when they're all misbehaving when they go out

229
00:12:24,960 --> 00:12:27,799
in the backyard in the beginning and she's trying to

230
00:12:27,799 --> 00:12:28,279
get them all.

231
00:12:28,240 --> 00:12:28,759
Speaker 3: To chill out.

232
00:12:29,480 --> 00:12:33,240
Speaker 1: And what I really like as like a child therapist

233
00:12:33,279 --> 00:12:36,759
and a family therapist is when the Mexico scene happens

234
00:12:37,519 --> 00:12:40,840
in the beginning of the movie, when they finally let

235
00:12:40,879 --> 00:12:44,440
it slip, which also sucks because then that means that

236
00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:47,399
there's some secret keeping going on. Maybe you'll talk about

237
00:12:47,399 --> 00:12:52,039
the siblings, Hannah, but there's some responsibility the kids are

238
00:12:52,039 --> 00:12:55,919
feeling to like not tell mom everything for whatever reason.

239
00:12:56,080 --> 00:12:59,120
And I do appreciate that she gets up and walks

240
00:12:59,120 --> 00:13:01,720
away from the table and goes to the sink, and

241
00:13:01,759 --> 00:13:04,559
she tries to act normal, but she's clearly like upset,

242
00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:08,240
and ye she's crying. They can tell she's upset because

243
00:13:08,279 --> 00:13:11,480
they're all human beings. But I do appreciate that she

244
00:13:12,320 --> 00:13:15,519
even those moments when she's muttering around Mexico she's really

245
00:13:15,600 --> 00:13:20,039
doing that by herself, Like she's not talking really ill

246
00:13:20,080 --> 00:13:21,639
about their dad in front of them, Like she has

247
00:13:21,639 --> 00:13:23,200
the bad moment where she says like, you don't even

248
00:13:23,279 --> 00:13:26,559
like Mexico in front of them, But to me that

249
00:13:26,559 --> 00:13:29,120
felt more like a human moment, Like I do feel

250
00:13:29,159 --> 00:13:32,639
like she's seems to be trying her best to not

251
00:13:32,759 --> 00:13:36,039
spill any of her bullshit onto the kids, maybe because

252
00:13:36,080 --> 00:13:37,759
the dad is doing all this stuff, which I think

253
00:13:37,840 --> 00:13:40,279
is what happens when I work with families or something

254
00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:44,039
like this is going on, is that there's one parent

255
00:13:44,200 --> 00:13:47,039
who's trying to like keep their shit together, usually the

256
00:13:47,039 --> 00:13:51,799
primary caregiver parent and show up well sometimes because the

257
00:13:51,879 --> 00:13:55,759
other parent is doing whatever the fuck they want and

258
00:13:56,919 --> 00:14:00,480
like they're so this I deal a lot with parents

259
00:14:01,039 --> 00:14:03,720
as individual clients where they're really just trying to like

260
00:14:03,840 --> 00:14:07,840
keep everything stable in reaction to the other parent kind

261
00:14:07,919 --> 00:14:11,080
of causing so much disruption in the family. And I

262
00:14:11,080 --> 00:14:13,080
think you're seeing that here too. And so she's also

263
00:14:13,519 --> 00:14:15,200
I think trying to put on a brave face, like

264
00:14:15,200 --> 00:14:17,919
even her dressing up for Halloween, I feel like, is

265
00:14:17,960 --> 00:14:20,799
her trying to put on a brave face for her

266
00:14:20,879 --> 00:14:24,240
kids while she is like tore up inside and we're

267
00:14:24,240 --> 00:14:28,559
seeing it leak out in these moments when she's like Mexico. Like,

268
00:14:28,600 --> 00:14:31,720
are these little beats that I really like that Steven

269
00:14:31,720 --> 00:14:33,360
Spielberg puts in here, which I feel like is the

270
00:14:33,399 --> 00:14:36,320
Spielberg like sauce where he can put these little moments

271
00:14:36,320 --> 00:14:39,759
into movies to make them feel more like special and human.

272
00:14:40,399 --> 00:14:43,279
And I feel like, I really this is like the

273
00:14:43,279 --> 00:14:47,240
first time I really was impressed by the use of

274
00:14:47,279 --> 00:14:49,320
the mom in this movie to do a lot of that,

275
00:14:49,639 --> 00:14:51,879
because I feel like in any other movie the parents'

276
00:14:51,879 --> 00:14:53,879
is not around and you don't know why they're not

277
00:14:53,960 --> 00:14:56,519
around and why the kids getting away with all this stuff,

278
00:14:56,960 --> 00:14:59,879
or like, yeah, like where the parents are just MIAs

279
00:15:00,080 --> 00:15:03,480
usually the lazy storywriting version of this, And I like

280
00:15:03,519 --> 00:15:06,799
with this version that she feels like a full character

281
00:15:07,759 --> 00:15:11,399
and these beats help you understand how plot wise this

282
00:15:11,440 --> 00:15:14,440
is all unfolding. But yeah, like even she lets Elliott

283
00:15:14,480 --> 00:15:16,720
stay home because she thinks he's sick, well, he tells

284
00:15:16,720 --> 00:15:20,159
he's sick. She comes home and his room is fucking wrecked,

285
00:15:20,679 --> 00:15:23,000
and even then she doesn't yell at him. She's just

286
00:15:23,120 --> 00:15:25,720
like this room, what she say, this isn't a room.

287
00:15:25,919 --> 00:15:27,720
This is like an accident.

288
00:15:29,360 --> 00:15:29,600
Speaker 3: You know.

289
00:15:29,720 --> 00:15:31,720
Speaker 1: So I feel like she's trying to keep her cool

290
00:15:33,080 --> 00:15:36,039
while she's probably just fucking burnout of shit though I

291
00:15:36,039 --> 00:15:37,799
don't even know she has the energy to be like

292
00:15:38,200 --> 00:15:40,200
I can't believe her almost like this, She's just like, well,

293
00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:42,600
and now your room's destroyed.

294
00:15:42,799 --> 00:15:45,879
Speaker 3: I'm gonna go have a glass of wine.

295
00:15:46,440 --> 00:15:50,919
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I feel like this is a I do

296
00:15:50,960 --> 00:15:53,120
feel like she's trying really hard to keep her shit together.

297
00:15:53,559 --> 00:15:55,159
She's trying really hard to not take it out in

298
00:15:55,200 --> 00:15:58,360
her kids, and those are some things that can be

299
00:15:58,399 --> 00:16:00,919
really hard to do when you're at this age of

300
00:16:01,600 --> 00:16:04,320
being separated, but also having all the weight put on

301
00:16:04,360 --> 00:16:07,360
you or all the weight always being on you, and

302
00:16:07,399 --> 00:16:09,480
now being in a position where you absolutely have no

303
00:16:09,519 --> 00:16:12,039
one who can help or no one who can be supportive.

304
00:16:12,519 --> 00:16:14,919
So I feel like it makes a lot of sense.

305
00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:20,000
I have always had nice feelings about the mom, I

306
00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:23,279
think in general, and I think it's because she's not

307
00:16:23,799 --> 00:16:26,639
bad mouthing the dad in front of the kids. But

308
00:16:26,759 --> 00:16:30,320
also my experience of divorce was very My parents are

309
00:16:30,399 --> 00:16:32,799
very unwell people, and so it was very intense all

310
00:16:32,840 --> 00:16:36,320
the time. But even like this common like my dad

311
00:16:36,320 --> 00:16:38,960
would just be gone, and like you just didn't know

312
00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:40,519
when you were going to see him again or if

313
00:16:40,519 --> 00:16:42,360
you were going to see him again. So it was

314
00:16:42,399 --> 00:16:47,159
always like this constant So your parents always in this

315
00:16:47,279 --> 00:16:50,120
constant sense of like just trying to make shit work.

316
00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:52,799
And I feel like that's really where we're seeing her

317
00:16:53,200 --> 00:16:55,320
in this portrayal of her.

318
00:16:56,159 --> 00:16:59,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's really important to connect to the

319
00:17:00,120 --> 00:17:03,120
humanity you see here and that she is, even though

320
00:17:03,159 --> 00:17:07,480
she has some moments where she does not behave optimally

321
00:17:08,160 --> 00:17:14,279
who does? Who can? And especially in circumstances where life

322
00:17:14,359 --> 00:17:17,000
is happening to you right now, in all of the

323
00:17:17,039 --> 00:17:23,440
ways simultaneously, all of the third standard deviation, the most rare,

324
00:17:23,559 --> 00:17:28,839
ridiculous things are happening. The impact and destruction that has

325
00:17:28,960 --> 00:17:32,160
on your your psyche, your sanity, your sense of self.

326
00:17:32,480 --> 00:17:35,359
These little moments like you're saying that Spielberg put in,

327
00:17:35,720 --> 00:17:38,519
we see the devastation, Like she's in her Halloween costume

328
00:17:38,759 --> 00:17:41,240
and she's just sitting by herself.

329
00:17:41,279 --> 00:17:43,920
Speaker 1: That scene makes my stomach hurt. I don't like that scene.

330
00:17:44,119 --> 00:17:45,599
It's too much, it's too real.

331
00:17:46,519 --> 00:17:50,279
Speaker 2: The kids are all old enough that they abandon her.

332
00:17:50,359 --> 00:17:53,440
She's clearly it was like looking forward to like doing

333
00:17:53,480 --> 00:17:55,839
the thing, and I assume she would have done that

334
00:17:55,920 --> 00:17:59,279
with her husband and whatever party they would have gone to,

335
00:17:59,319 --> 00:18:02,880
and does go to a party, she goes somewhere they.

336
00:18:03,359 --> 00:18:05,480
Speaker 1: I don't know, because I really feel she's just setting

337
00:18:05,519 --> 00:18:07,200
in her costume at home, which is happening to.

338
00:18:07,200 --> 00:18:09,440
Speaker 3: Herself, I think, to make herself happy.

339
00:18:09,599 --> 00:18:11,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think she was going somewhere, but I think

340
00:18:11,440 --> 00:18:13,440
she was just really trying to like be the like

341
00:18:13,519 --> 00:18:15,880
happy mom Halloween.

342
00:18:16,319 --> 00:18:18,599
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I think, I mean, I think all of that.

343
00:18:18,640 --> 00:18:20,720
Speaker 2: And then once the kids are out, I think she

344
00:18:20,799 --> 00:18:24,960
was really counting on maybe taking Gerdye around. But Girty's

345
00:18:25,000 --> 00:18:28,240
part of the plan, and then that's true. Mom is

346
00:18:28,279 --> 00:18:29,839
just kind of by herself. But she gets in a

347
00:18:29,880 --> 00:18:31,119
car and goes somewhere.

348
00:18:31,680 --> 00:18:34,240
Speaker 1: Does she yep, Well, she goes to look for the

349
00:18:34,319 --> 00:18:37,079
kids because they haven't come home. Like she's stomping around

350
00:18:37,119 --> 00:18:37,799
outside by.

351
00:18:37,680 --> 00:18:40,000
Speaker 3: The car and is like where these kids? Where the

352
00:18:40,000 --> 00:18:40,720
fuck are these kids?

353
00:18:40,799 --> 00:18:41,000
Speaker 2: Yeah?

354
00:18:41,079 --> 00:18:43,119
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's why she gets that's where she's going.

355
00:18:43,759 --> 00:18:45,400
Speaker 3: But no, I don't feel that she doesn't really have

356
00:18:45,440 --> 00:18:46,240
a social life.

357
00:18:46,440 --> 00:18:49,759
Speaker 1: I feel like there's one scene where like off screen

358
00:18:49,960 --> 00:18:53,599
she kind of like answers the phone or calls someone.

359
00:18:53,640 --> 00:18:56,519
It sounds like maybe she's talking to a friend, like hey, Charmaine,

360
00:18:56,559 --> 00:18:59,720
like that kind of tone. But that's it, and so

361
00:19:00,759 --> 00:19:02,839
we don't really know. Yeah, we just don't know a

362
00:19:02,839 --> 00:19:05,799
lot like this movie does a good job of not

363
00:19:05,839 --> 00:19:08,920
worrying about giving us too many details, but enough details

364
00:19:08,920 --> 00:19:12,200
that we get the vibe right because also like thinking

365
00:19:12,200 --> 00:19:16,720
about the time period, you know, and all the truly

366
00:19:16,799 --> 00:19:18,680
I would I'm with you, Ben, like kind of wild

367
00:19:18,720 --> 00:19:20,640
choices she makes with leaving the kids home alone, even

368
00:19:20,640 --> 00:19:22,599
though I know there's a part of that's a little

369
00:19:23,160 --> 00:19:25,680
of the time, but you know, I wonder if she

370
00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:28,440
was working before, like if she had to start working again,

371
00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:31,720
and that's why she's doing things like letting Elliott stay

372
00:19:31,759 --> 00:19:34,480
home sick by himself, Like can she find childcare?

373
00:19:34,960 --> 00:19:36,000
Speaker 3: Does she have childcare?

374
00:19:36,119 --> 00:19:38,799
Speaker 1: Doesn't seem like there's any family around, Like there's nobody

375
00:19:39,839 --> 00:19:42,200
family wise we hear anything about from either side of

376
00:19:42,240 --> 00:19:44,319
the family. They are living in I think Los Angeles

377
00:19:44,400 --> 00:19:47,240
because of that overhead that shot, that famous shot look

378
00:19:47,240 --> 00:19:50,640
out spot shots. So they don't maybe they're transplants, I

379
00:19:50,640 --> 00:19:56,240
don't know, but they definitely feel also like a very

380
00:19:56,359 --> 00:19:58,160
I don't know there is something kind of lonely about

381
00:19:58,200 --> 00:20:01,160
the family, like they do feel like they've got each other,

382
00:20:01,799 --> 00:20:05,559
and that's kind of it. I think that when you

383
00:20:06,079 --> 00:20:09,039
go through a separation like that, that's that is as

384
00:20:09,119 --> 00:20:12,400
unexpected as what it sounds like that.

385
00:20:15,880 --> 00:20:21,839
Speaker 3: I lost my kind of thought, ring ing ing, I will.

386
00:20:23,079 --> 00:20:25,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I think that when a family is going

387
00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:29,240
through a change like this that's kind of unexpected, that

388
00:20:29,359 --> 00:20:32,200
there is a lot of there is a lot of

389
00:20:32,240 --> 00:20:35,039
isolation that I think that the kids feel and the

390
00:20:35,079 --> 00:20:37,720
family feels because it feels like you're not like other families.

391
00:20:38,440 --> 00:20:41,319
It feels like, you know, your parents couldn't figure it out.

392
00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:46,200
I mean, it feels very much like it's really hard

393
00:20:46,279 --> 00:20:50,279
to not feel lonely and isolated, especially if there was

394
00:20:50,319 --> 00:20:52,720
a parent. I mean, we see the one scene with

395
00:20:53,000 --> 00:20:56,240
the with Mike and Elliott. They're talking about something that

396
00:20:56,279 --> 00:20:58,480
their dad used to take them to. I never really

397
00:20:58,559 --> 00:21:01,599
noticed that scene that much before, but that was gut wrenching.

398
00:21:02,160 --> 00:21:05,599
It really was like them remembering doing fun stuff with their.

399
00:21:05,519 --> 00:21:08,000
Speaker 2: Dad and like smelling the shirt and.

400
00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:10,079
Speaker 1: That it doesn't really happen anymore, and that it doesn't

401
00:21:10,079 --> 00:21:12,559
happen anymore, and like they it seems like the kids

402
00:21:12,559 --> 00:21:15,279
don't know when they'll see him again, you know, and

403
00:21:15,319 --> 00:21:17,680
so I feel like there is a sense of isolation.

404
00:21:17,799 --> 00:21:19,519
There's a sense of I feel like also in some

405
00:21:19,559 --> 00:21:21,680
ways there's even a sense of like, is there something

406
00:21:21,720 --> 00:21:25,160
wrong with us the reason that ways why he's not here. Yeah,

407
00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:28,039
there definitely is a mild vibe that like Dad has

408
00:21:28,079 --> 00:21:32,240
ditched us, because yeah, when they're reminiscing in the garage,

409
00:21:32,279 --> 00:21:35,960
I believe smelling his shirt and they're talking about remember

410
00:21:36,000 --> 00:21:40,039
when Dad would take us to the movies and to games,

411
00:21:40,839 --> 00:21:43,559
and they're talking about it as if like remember when,

412
00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:47,799
like they're nostalgic at the age of like ten and

413
00:21:47,920 --> 00:21:50,119
fifteen about the times they used to have with their dad.

414
00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:52,599
And then Mike says that'll happen again one day or

415
00:21:52,640 --> 00:21:55,759
something like that, that'll happen again sometime soon. It's such

416
00:21:55,799 --> 00:21:58,880
a common thing for an older sibling to say, like

417
00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:01,920
I literally remember. We're saying something similar to my siblings

418
00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:04,759
of like, hey, like he forgot this time, but he

419
00:22:04,799 --> 00:22:06,720
won't forget next time. My dad used to do a

420
00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:10,720
lot of forgetting us on the weekends, and so there

421
00:22:10,759 --> 00:22:12,200
was a lot of explanation around that.

422
00:22:12,240 --> 00:22:12,839
Speaker 3: A lot of the time.

423
00:22:12,839 --> 00:22:15,720
Speaker 1: But I literally remember saying something like that to my siblings.

424
00:22:16,839 --> 00:22:22,200
Speaker 2: That makes sense, and I think something interesting along these

425
00:22:22,240 --> 00:22:24,799
lines that I just looked up. I was trying to

426
00:22:24,799 --> 00:22:27,640
figure out when the time period is. So this movie

427
00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:30,839
takes place in eighty two, right, so.

428
00:22:31,319 --> 00:22:34,039
Speaker 1: It came out on June eleventh, nineteen eighty two. I

429
00:22:34,039 --> 00:22:35,240
looked it up because I wanted to know if I

430
00:22:35,279 --> 00:22:37,079
was born yet, So I was not.

431
00:22:38,039 --> 00:22:43,519
Speaker 2: Nineteen eighty one was the peak of divorce rate in

432
00:22:43,599 --> 00:22:45,680
the country, so these kids might not have been so

433
00:22:46,759 --> 00:22:50,440
alone in that eighty two was the start of a decline.

434
00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:53,640
But a lot of people would this is this is

435
00:22:53,720 --> 00:22:55,839
right when women could get credit cards and things and

436
00:22:55,880 --> 00:22:58,720
weren't trapped in marriages at the same rate.

437
00:22:58,799 --> 00:23:01,200
Speaker 1: I would argue to say that women are still trapped

438
00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:04,039
in marriages. Well, but you're either here or no there, No,

439
00:23:04,119 --> 00:23:05,920
you're right, like, this is the time of women had

440
00:23:05,920 --> 00:23:08,319
a lot more systemic autonomy.

441
00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:13,319
Speaker 2: Systemic autonomy, right, like at least a way out that

442
00:23:13,400 --> 00:23:16,720
they could get credit themselves, not saying that there aren't

443
00:23:16,759 --> 00:23:19,279
other systemic things that would keep them trapped, because of

444
00:23:19,319 --> 00:23:23,359
course they know that the world is fucked and being

445
00:23:23,599 --> 00:23:26,240
born female comes with the host of problems aren't fair.

446
00:23:27,079 --> 00:23:31,039
We'll just accept that. But the thing that I think

447
00:23:31,599 --> 00:23:33,759
recognizing is that there's probably quite a few of their

448
00:23:33,799 --> 00:23:37,960
friends that are also going through crazy divorce and all

449
00:23:38,039 --> 00:23:41,960
the stuff that's that's happening, and realizing these kids maybe

450
00:23:42,039 --> 00:23:44,079
might not feel it as alone in this as we should,

451
00:23:44,119 --> 00:23:47,240
but also still their world is flying apart, so everything

452
00:23:47,279 --> 00:23:50,799
that they knew, regardless of if other people are also

453
00:23:50,839 --> 00:23:54,400
going through it, is still collapsing in this sadness of

454
00:23:55,240 --> 00:23:58,279
looking at them like trying to remember the way their

455
00:23:58,319 --> 00:24:02,920
dad's deodorant would smell like old spice, and the older

456
00:24:02,960 --> 00:24:06,519
brother cracking that going like nope, that's babreeze or whatever.

457
00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:11,839
The sound of voices and the smells of things disappear

458
00:24:11,880 --> 00:24:16,240
from our mind really fast, but old factory senses are

459
00:24:17,079 --> 00:24:21,279
the strongest and most powerful reactions we have, So that

460
00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:27,319
scene really would call up a lot of responses for

461
00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:30,599
these kids, that the feelings of being forgotten and left

462
00:24:30,599 --> 00:24:33,079
behind and that you'd never have that again, and that

463
00:24:33,599 --> 00:24:36,559
rush of emotion they'd be getting from that smell can't

464
00:24:36,599 --> 00:24:41,039
be replicated by anything else. Smell is our most powerful

465
00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:43,880
react to your old factory smell. And taste, because that's

466
00:24:43,880 --> 00:24:46,200
what keeps us from eating shit that's rotten. It's our

467
00:24:46,319 --> 00:24:51,119
most potent memory. Things smell of a perfume can transport

468
00:24:51,160 --> 00:24:54,480
you through time, and these kids experiencing that was put

469
00:24:54,519 --> 00:24:56,400
in on purpose to be tragic.

470
00:24:57,599 --> 00:24:59,799
Speaker 1: I would say that as much as I agree that

471
00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:02,680
divorce is happening all across the board, it was still

472
00:25:02,759 --> 00:25:07,799
something that was pretty taboo at the time because I

473
00:25:07,880 --> 00:25:08,359
know that.

474
00:25:09,480 --> 00:25:11,000
Speaker 3: We didn't talk to it.

475
00:25:11,319 --> 00:25:12,680
Speaker 1: We didn't talk to it, and I mean that was

476
00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:14,240
probably could also have been just a thing in my

477
00:25:14,319 --> 00:25:16,839
family because there's so much stuff that we wouldn't talk about.

478
00:25:17,319 --> 00:25:19,799
But like we didn't tell anybody what was ever going

479
00:25:19,839 --> 00:25:21,880
on with our family because it was like a big

480
00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:24,359
deal if you got divorced, like that meant something. I

481
00:25:24,400 --> 00:25:28,599
felt like in the nineties when that was when I

482
00:25:28,759 --> 00:25:35,440
was like maybe in like fourth grade, probably it probably

483
00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:36,880
had been divorced twice by then.

484
00:25:37,240 --> 00:25:40,519
Speaker 3: I want to say, maybe three times something like that.

485
00:25:40,839 --> 00:25:43,039
Speaker 1: So anyway, but I just I'm remembering the time and

486
00:25:43,119 --> 00:25:45,599
like it wasn't something that we were talking about with

487
00:25:45,599 --> 00:25:48,200
our friends, Like it wasn't something that came up back then.

488
00:25:49,079 --> 00:25:54,680
Speaker 2: No, No, And the just because it was a historic high,

489
00:25:54,799 --> 00:25:58,640
doesn't mean it would have been something that was socially acceptable.

490
00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:04,400
On being othered is never good in humanity, and feeling

491
00:26:04,519 --> 00:26:08,519
othered and just trying to survive but feeling like all

492
00:26:08,599 --> 00:26:10,359
eyes are on you is not good.

493
00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:13,920
Speaker 1: But I would say that the t shirt smelling scene

494
00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:17,079
or the shirt selling scene does seem to like that

495
00:26:17,279 --> 00:26:19,920
confirms that they haven't seen their dad in a while,

496
00:26:20,920 --> 00:26:23,200
at least not in a way that feels fun like

497
00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:27,440
that or positive like that. And also, though I know

498
00:26:27,559 --> 00:26:31,119
they sort of put a stamp on the dad thing

499
00:26:31,119 --> 00:26:33,799
in the movie by saying he's in Mexico, right, but

500
00:26:33,839 --> 00:26:38,000
I do think there is something somewhat telling that none

501
00:26:38,039 --> 00:26:42,160
of the kids, Michael or Elliott, make any attempt to

502
00:26:42,279 --> 00:26:45,519
reach out to their dad, even in Mexico when all

503
00:26:45,599 --> 00:26:49,880
this shit gets crazy, like when the government comes and

504
00:26:49,920 --> 00:26:52,960
they're quarantined, and like Michael just falls asleep in the closet.

505
00:26:53,839 --> 00:26:55,440
Speaker 3: You know, maybe that was the time you can't do

506
00:26:55,519 --> 00:26:56,960
long distant goals to Mexico.

507
00:26:57,079 --> 00:26:58,799
Speaker 1: Who knows if they even know where he's staying or anything,

508
00:26:59,359 --> 00:27:01,480
but I think it does feel it as if he's

509
00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:03,079
even telling the truth about where he is. In the

510
00:27:03,079 --> 00:27:03,880
first fucking place.

511
00:27:04,200 --> 00:27:06,480
Speaker 2: Well true, and they made a point if like on

512
00:27:06,559 --> 00:27:10,599
the TV to show like the long distance calls being expensive.

513
00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:13,079
I assume that also wasn't an accident. They had a

514
00:27:13,079 --> 00:27:18,000
commercial like, oh, it's Uncle Kenny. It's so far away,

515
00:27:18,079 --> 00:27:21,359
it's so expensive, this must be an important call that.

516
00:27:21,599 --> 00:27:22,759
I don't think that was an accident.

517
00:27:23,759 --> 00:27:27,279
Speaker 1: But I just think it's telling that the Dad is

518
00:27:27,400 --> 00:27:31,920
like a void that you don't really hear the kids

519
00:27:32,359 --> 00:27:35,160
other than Elliott saying in the beginning, Dad would have

520
00:27:35,200 --> 00:27:37,079
believed me, which I think is more him just trying

521
00:27:37,119 --> 00:27:40,000
to make a point with Mom. There aren't really any

522
00:27:40,160 --> 00:27:43,559
conversations happening of like I wish we could call Dad,

523
00:27:43,599 --> 00:27:47,319
I wish Dad was here, Like Dad is a non entity.

524
00:27:47,599 --> 00:27:50,359
His memory is there, but like him as like an

525
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:52,640
adult in their life that they would feel comfortable reaching

526
00:27:52,680 --> 00:27:55,240
out to when they want him for help, isn't.

527
00:27:55,039 --> 00:27:57,279
Speaker 2: There, right, Yeah, it's clear that they all understand that

528
00:27:57,400 --> 00:28:00,640
Dad sucks right now, if not always or most of

529
00:28:00,680 --> 00:28:04,359
the time, Like Dad has sucked from X time period

530
00:28:04,359 --> 00:28:05,680
except for the time when he didn't.

531
00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:08,319
Speaker 1: He's just not in the equation, Like these kids aren't

532
00:28:08,319 --> 00:28:10,640
thinking of him as part of the equation. At all, really,

533
00:28:12,079 --> 00:28:14,000
And I think that really shows What that really makes

534
00:28:14,039 --> 00:28:16,440
me think of is like Dad has been disconnected from

535
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:19,480
the kids for quite some time, that it hasn't just

536
00:28:19,519 --> 00:28:21,759
been the six months that he's been gone. The way

537
00:28:21,799 --> 00:28:23,720
that those two kids looked at them looked at each

538
00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:25,880
other when they talked about that shirt and talked about

539
00:28:25,880 --> 00:28:27,880
the fun stuff they used to get to do, that

540
00:28:27,920 --> 00:28:30,960
didn't sound like that happened a year ago. That happened

541
00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:33,960
like it had been maybe a couple of years since

542
00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:38,319
that had happened. So it also feels like they are

543
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:41,680
also grieving, which is a natural part of this experience

544
00:28:41,680 --> 00:28:45,000
of grieving stuff with their dad. And when Elliott, what

545
00:28:45,079 --> 00:28:47,759
I thought when Elliott said that was Dad would believe me,

546
00:28:47,799 --> 00:28:49,359
is that that just came out of his mouth like

547
00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:51,119
that was the thought he was having in his brain

548
00:28:51,720 --> 00:28:53,960
of like, oh, I bet if I told Dad he

549
00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:57,160
would believe me, like not like yes, maybe to step

550
00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:00,000
on mom's toes, but also just like a natural response.

551
00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:02,559
Speaker 3: He said it the way my braddy ass would have

552
00:29:02,559 --> 00:29:04,680
said it at that age, which is Doubl'll believe me,

553
00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:07,759
like I think he said it to get mom's goat,

554
00:29:07,799 --> 00:29:10,119
which I respect. I'm not gonna. I mean, it was a.

555
00:29:10,039 --> 00:29:11,519
Speaker 1: Braddy thing to say, and I think he said it

556
00:29:11,559 --> 00:29:13,599
on purpose, But I don't mean I don't think he's

557
00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:16,720
thinking hard enough about it at all, because I do

558
00:29:16,759 --> 00:29:19,680
think we're about to slide into the next part, which

559
00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:22,319
is the sibling dynamic. Is there anything else we want

560
00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:24,839
to say more about the systemic change with than the family.

561
00:29:25,720 --> 00:29:29,119
Speaker 2: No, I think we've covered it, and taking a break

562
00:29:29,119 --> 00:29:32,119
here would make sense. So let's do that. Let's take

563
00:29:32,119 --> 00:29:36,559
that break, and we'll come back and talk about sibling dynamics.

564
00:29:37,319 --> 00:29:39,880
Speaker 1: So I think once again we're going to talk about

565
00:29:39,880 --> 00:29:43,880
the dinner table scene with the Mexico conversation where No,

566
00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:46,759
I'm thinking of the one later when I think this

567
00:29:46,839 --> 00:29:50,519
show also does I think this movie also does a

568
00:29:50,519 --> 00:29:55,559
good job of showing how siblings relationships can change too

569
00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:58,920
when there is a system change like this, Because in

570
00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:01,599
that same conversation we been talking about where they let

571
00:30:01,599 --> 00:30:06,400
it spill that Dad's in Mexico, the whole kind of

572
00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:10,480
cascading situation that happens, the beats that happen right after that,

573
00:30:10,640 --> 00:30:15,920
where Mike gets mad at Elliott because Mom's upset in

574
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:19,200
the corner of the kitchen and Mike is clocking mom

575
00:30:19,200 --> 00:30:22,119
and being like, you're you okay, and holding each other

576
00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:26,200
responsible as the children for Mom's feelings. Even though, like

577
00:30:26,240 --> 00:30:28,119
I said, I give mom credit, I don't feel like

578
00:30:28,160 --> 00:30:31,559
she's trying her best to not make the kids very

579
00:30:31,559 --> 00:30:34,079
aware of what a wreck she is as much as

580
00:30:34,079 --> 00:30:38,720
she's sort of not pulling it off. Is how it

581
00:30:38,759 --> 00:30:42,000
will also change the sibling dynamic, where there's more of

582
00:30:42,039 --> 00:30:45,359
a sometimes a police and going on of what's happening.

583
00:30:46,640 --> 00:30:48,160
I was going to say that I feel like a

584
00:30:48,240 --> 00:30:51,200
part of the reason why we don't hear them talk

585
00:30:51,200 --> 00:30:53,599
about dad is because they're worried about upsetting their mom.

586
00:30:54,720 --> 00:30:57,319
And that's the reason why he feels so distant in conversation,

587
00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:00,160
because that's one of the things that I remember. My

588
00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:02,680
parents were horrible about each other when we were together,

589
00:31:03,039 --> 00:31:05,240
so like they'd both talk shit about each other, say

590
00:31:05,279 --> 00:31:08,200
all kinds of horrible things, and then when we would

591
00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:11,119
come back, both parents did this. When we would come back,

592
00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:12,720
they would ask, what did your mom say about me?

593
00:31:12,799 --> 00:31:16,240
What did your dad say about me? Like that's the

594
00:31:16,359 --> 00:31:18,480
kind of end. Like, luckily that doesn't sound like that

595
00:31:18,559 --> 00:31:20,559
is happening, but it sounds like this is more about

596
00:31:20,559 --> 00:31:25,240
the kids protecting mom than it is about them not

597
00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:27,039
wanting to reach out to dad.

598
00:31:27,400 --> 00:31:32,640
Speaker 2: Which tracks because we see Elliott get shitty and Mom

599
00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:35,720
break down. Dad would have believe me, and then she

600
00:31:37,279 --> 00:31:39,519
That leads to see Brittany was describing earlier. She's at

601
00:31:39,559 --> 00:31:45,240
the sink and clearly weeping, and that tracks.

602
00:31:45,799 --> 00:31:47,839
Speaker 1: Yeah, but it is always such a bummer, And I

603
00:31:47,839 --> 00:31:51,000
give why kids do it, because I did shit like

604
00:31:51,039 --> 00:31:52,400
that with like my siblings.

605
00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:56,960
Speaker 3: I'm the oldest where we would and I look.

606
00:31:56,839 --> 00:31:58,440
Speaker 1: Back on this, and of course I don't look back

607
00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:00,680
on it fondly in terms of like how I behaved

608
00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:05,640
at times is where we would hold each other accountable

609
00:32:05,799 --> 00:32:10,359
for upsetting our mom and something sort of similar, and

610
00:32:10,400 --> 00:32:12,519
how unfair that is that we as kids will do

611
00:32:12,559 --> 00:32:15,359
that to each other, Like you shouldn't have said that,

612
00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:17,000
or you should been thinking about how mom feels, Like

613
00:32:17,039 --> 00:32:18,799
what does Mike say? Why are you so selfish? Why

614
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:21,680
you think about other people? And it's like you're all children,

615
00:32:21,839 --> 00:32:24,559
you know what I mean? Like you're gonna say silly things,

616
00:32:24,599 --> 00:32:26,920
You're gonna put your foot in your mouth, like that's

617
00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:29,359
part of being a kid. You shouldn't have to worry

618
00:32:29,400 --> 00:32:31,240
about it. And even though their mom doesn't seem to

619
00:32:31,279 --> 00:32:34,759
be asking that of them, I think it's very telling

620
00:32:34,839 --> 00:32:38,359
that Mike is kind of holding, which is what happens.

621
00:32:38,400 --> 00:32:42,880
The older sibling, who's more aware of how mom is feeling,

622
00:32:42,960 --> 00:32:46,039
is probably more aware of the dynamics of what's going on.

623
00:32:46,079 --> 00:32:48,839
Mike's probably the one who's in the most know with

624
00:32:49,240 --> 00:32:51,559
what's going on with Dad, And just because he has

625
00:32:51,599 --> 00:32:55,079
more knowledge, he's got he's lived more life, he's of

626
00:32:55,160 --> 00:32:57,160
dating age, like, he kind of has more of a

627
00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:01,279
sense of what's going on, and him trying to make

628
00:33:01,359 --> 00:33:04,960
mom feel better by clamping down on the younger kids

629
00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:08,599
in a way that's not fair, and they're not going

630
00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:10,799
to realize how unfair that is until, like, I don't know,

631
00:33:11,240 --> 00:33:12,519
ten twenty years.

632
00:33:13,039 --> 00:33:15,720
Speaker 2: Do you see Mike's friends, He is a year away

633
00:33:15,759 --> 00:33:21,599
from dating age. They're playing D and D and headphones,

634
00:33:21,680 --> 00:33:25,440
riding bikes. I guess he's a year away from dating age.

635
00:33:26,279 --> 00:33:28,480
He's on the football teams. He's got help but like

636
00:33:30,759 --> 00:33:35,400
and like fighting, but nobody what you're saying.

637
00:33:35,440 --> 00:33:37,720
Speaker 1: And he's more aware of like who Sally is to

638
00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:39,960
Dad than the other two siblings.

639
00:33:40,079 --> 00:33:42,599
Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure, he knows whats the fus up. He's

640
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:43,319
like one.

641
00:33:43,359 --> 00:33:46,359
Speaker 1: He probably talks with Mom more privately like it, just

642
00:33:46,359 --> 00:33:49,640
like he probably leans on him more just because he's

643
00:33:49,799 --> 00:33:52,599
he's so much older to like, fifteen is a big

644
00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:58,039
jump from ten, and so he's gonna naturally be asked

645
00:33:58,279 --> 00:34:00,400
to do more and to be more up.

646
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:02,720
Speaker 3: And he's already doing this stuff like back in the car.

647
00:34:02,640 --> 00:34:04,599
Speaker 1: Out of the driveway, I only know how to drive

648
00:34:04,599 --> 00:34:10,320
in reverse, and so's it's such a real moment when

649
00:34:10,360 --> 00:34:13,760
he gets mad at Elliott, as if Elliot should know better,

650
00:34:13,800 --> 00:34:15,960
and it's like he's ten, He's not going to understand

651
00:34:16,760 --> 00:34:20,280
the nuanced machinations of what's happening.

652
00:34:20,199 --> 00:34:23,320
Speaker 2: Right truly, No, of course not, I mean and when

653
00:34:24,519 --> 00:34:27,920
that's the fun of fifteen year olds is that they

654
00:34:28,920 --> 00:34:31,840
think that they are so grown up in adult and

655
00:34:31,880 --> 00:34:34,920
that they understand the world. But what they don't understand

656
00:34:35,039 --> 00:34:38,000
is that the ten year old doesn't remotely have the

657
00:34:38,039 --> 00:34:41,440
cognitive capacity that you do at all, and he doesn't

658
00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:44,159
see the world the way that you do and know

659
00:34:44,320 --> 00:34:46,519
he shouldn't just know what you know.

660
00:34:47,119 --> 00:34:50,360
Speaker 1: And also, Mike, if you are really that worry about mom,

661
00:34:50,400 --> 00:34:52,679
why are you stressing her up? But ordering pizza without

662
00:34:52,679 --> 00:34:55,639
her permission for the D and D party and causing

663
00:34:55,639 --> 00:34:58,360
so much hubbub and not let Elliott play like they're

664
00:34:58,400 --> 00:35:00,920
also causing your own stuff, which is fine because you're

665
00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:03,679
also fifteen. You're not supposed to be not able to

666
00:35:03,920 --> 00:35:06,320
break the rules and act up a little bit and

667
00:35:06,360 --> 00:35:10,239
act like a teenager, but it is.

668
00:35:10,880 --> 00:35:12,320
Speaker 3: I don't know if I'm going inwhere.

669
00:35:12,079 --> 00:35:16,320
Speaker 1: With that, but I think that that tiny little scene

670
00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:19,679
in the movie is such a good example of how

671
00:35:19,719 --> 00:35:23,599
the sibling dynamic can be impacted by divorce, even if

672
00:35:24,719 --> 00:35:29,400
the parent isn't really asserting that, especially in this situation

673
00:35:29,480 --> 00:35:33,239
where there's the parent that stays and the parent that left,

674
00:35:33,639 --> 00:35:36,599
and how the kids can be very protective of the

675
00:35:36,639 --> 00:35:38,119
parent that stays. Well.

676
00:35:38,159 --> 00:35:40,760
Speaker 2: I know we talked about the idea of a parentified

677
00:35:40,880 --> 00:35:43,320
child a lot in other episodes. I'm not going to

678
00:35:43,360 --> 00:35:46,280
go into that, but I was surprised to see that

679
00:35:46,800 --> 00:35:51,400
Mike only takes a little bit of the parentified child role.

680
00:35:51,840 --> 00:35:54,760
He still kind of feels like older brother, not necessarily

681
00:35:54,920 --> 00:35:58,840
he's been put in charge of the other kids, like

682
00:35:59,119 --> 00:36:01,239
Mom leans on him him a little bit more, but

683
00:36:01,320 --> 00:36:06,119
it didn't feel like she was making him a coping No.

684
00:36:06,199 --> 00:36:09,480
Speaker 1: I agree, which is part of why I reap for

685
00:36:09,559 --> 00:36:12,800
this mom is that I think he's like he's going

686
00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:16,480
to football practice, He's coming in when he's done with practice.

687
00:36:16,760 --> 00:36:19,199
He's not like rushing home because he is to watch

688
00:36:19,239 --> 00:36:22,159
his brother. He's yeah, you're right, Like he still feels

689
00:36:22,199 --> 00:36:23,760
like a big brother in a out of ways who's

690
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:26,800
just a little bit more keen in and probably has

691
00:36:26,840 --> 00:36:28,760
had to grow up a little bit. But I also

692
00:36:28,800 --> 00:36:31,519
think the eat we haven't even talked about, the fucking alien,

693
00:36:31,679 --> 00:36:35,000
the et of it all, the fucking alien in this movie,

694
00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:37,960
I think that also makes him grow up too, But

695
00:36:38,119 --> 00:36:40,119
he does. He is a very good big brother, Like

696
00:36:40,199 --> 00:36:43,360
I think about him going I mean Jonathan from Stranger

697
00:36:43,360 --> 00:36:46,079
Things is obviously ripped right off of him, but like

698
00:36:46,199 --> 00:36:50,480
him going to get et when Elliott can't find him.

699
00:36:50,519 --> 00:36:52,239
Like they do a really good job, which I think

700
00:36:52,320 --> 00:36:55,880
is also something that happens with siblings when something happens

701
00:36:55,920 --> 00:36:59,440
in their family, is they can also bond together and

702
00:36:59,480 --> 00:37:02,159
get really protective of each other. And I think you

703
00:37:02,239 --> 00:37:05,199
see that happen in this movie, where they do a

704
00:37:05,199 --> 00:37:08,599
good job of like taking care of each other and

705
00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:11,159
like keeping secrets in a way that I think is

706
00:37:11,199 --> 00:37:15,239
not age and appropriate for kids, you know, especially with

707
00:37:15,280 --> 00:37:18,679
something so bat shit as finding an alien. And also

708
00:37:18,719 --> 00:37:20,000
I'm sure there's a part of them that's like, Mom

709
00:37:20,039 --> 00:37:24,519
can't handle this. Mom's got enough going on besides an

710
00:37:24,559 --> 00:37:27,000
alien that I have snuck into our home and I'm

711
00:37:27,079 --> 00:37:29,599
keeping in our closet after she has told me expressly

712
00:37:30,280 --> 00:37:31,199
to leave it alone.

713
00:37:31,760 --> 00:37:33,079
Speaker 3: Whatever's going on outside.

714
00:37:33,400 --> 00:37:37,159
Speaker 2: I mean, And there's there's so much stranger things in ET,

715
00:37:37,360 --> 00:37:40,800
especially season one, but there's there's so much. I thought

716
00:37:40,800 --> 00:37:42,719
that too. I was like, as you're talking about Mom,

717
00:37:42,719 --> 00:37:46,000
I was thinking, like, oh my god, season one, Karen

718
00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:48,880
Wheeler is this mom and.

719
00:37:48,920 --> 00:37:52,559
Speaker 3: Joy Spires too. You get that combo of them both

720
00:37:53,159 --> 00:37:53,599
that too.

721
00:37:53,920 --> 00:37:57,280
Speaker 2: Joyce is, yeah, her like being distressed and stuff. But

722
00:37:57,960 --> 00:38:01,599
I thought about Karen because even though the dead is present,

723
00:38:01,719 --> 00:38:09,719
he's a fucking potato and her managing everything by herself,

724
00:38:09,760 --> 00:38:13,320
even though Joyce is doing that too and frazzled. Joyce

725
00:38:13,360 --> 00:38:15,599
gains a lot more power, a lot faster takes care

726
00:38:15,599 --> 00:38:17,559
in a couple of seasons to gain some power. She's

727
00:38:18,280 --> 00:38:21,239
kind of frazzled and just lost for a while, and

728
00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:23,599
I'm like, I'm going to I'm doing this by myself,

729
00:38:23,599 --> 00:38:28,159
like just oblivious to what's going on, including that there

730
00:38:28,239 --> 00:38:33,800
is a child in her basement that does not belong

731
00:38:33,960 --> 00:38:39,280
to her and she's just totally ripped from this mom.

732
00:38:39,400 --> 00:38:44,679
And I mean, of course it is, but man, the

733
00:38:44,719 --> 00:38:48,679
sibling dynamics. Looking at this, mom must be doing a

734
00:38:48,679 --> 00:38:52,639
pretty good job to keep these kids living kid life,

735
00:38:53,280 --> 00:38:58,400
because none of them seem to be really feeling older

736
00:38:58,400 --> 00:39:01,400
than they're supposed to be. Seems to be keeping them

737
00:39:01,800 --> 00:39:05,679
kind of age appropriate, Like Gerty's still walking around with

738
00:39:05,719 --> 00:39:08,679
a dolly and thinking about being a cowgirl and being

739
00:39:09,079 --> 00:39:14,239
a kid, and Elliott is still more or less operating

740
00:39:14,280 --> 00:39:16,119
like a ten year old, and Mike is operating like

741
00:39:16,119 --> 00:39:18,360
a fifteen year old. He may need to be pulled

742
00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:20,639
aside and be like, hey, bro, I know you got

743
00:39:20,800 --> 00:39:24,719
your your friends here, and like, but bro.

744
00:39:25,800 --> 00:39:28,000
Speaker 1: At some point, well that part of it too made

745
00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:31,519
me wonder, going back to the family dynamic changing, is

746
00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:33,920
mom kind of in this weird period with the kids

747
00:39:33,960 --> 00:39:36,480
where she's like they're like testing her authority a little

748
00:39:36,480 --> 00:39:38,360
bit too, like I told you not to do that,

749
00:39:38,400 --> 00:39:41,239
Like there's no like I'm going to tell your father anymore.

750
00:39:41,840 --> 00:39:44,159
You know, if she was more of the softer parent.

751
00:39:44,239 --> 00:39:47,800
Dad was the harder parent. Then there were some few

752
00:39:47,800 --> 00:39:49,519
moments in the movie, especially in the beginning, where I

753
00:39:49,599 --> 00:39:52,599
was like, Oh, she's trying to assert her authority and

754
00:39:52,599 --> 00:39:54,159
they're not listening.

755
00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:55,199
Speaker 3: And I wonder if that has to do with the

756
00:39:55,280 --> 00:39:56,679
change in the dynamic.

757
00:39:56,880 --> 00:40:00,960
Speaker 2: Maybe, And actually, I actually, as you're talking about this,

758
00:40:01,079 --> 00:40:06,679
I found myself wondering if Mike is reverting a little

759
00:40:06,719 --> 00:40:11,039
bit and he's not maybe even being encouraged to age,

760
00:40:11,960 --> 00:40:15,360
because like, thinking about being a fifteen year old football player,

761
00:40:15,400 --> 00:40:17,159
like the last goddamn place I'd be was in my

762
00:40:17,239 --> 00:40:20,360
house growing up, Like that was the last place I

763
00:40:20,440 --> 00:40:26,400
was trying to be. And then he's there playing games

764
00:40:26,400 --> 00:40:29,239
with his friends, who are all also clearly a little

765
00:40:29,280 --> 00:40:34,000
emotionally regressed. And I wonder if mom's not doing a

766
00:40:34,039 --> 00:40:37,679
ton to encourage him to also grow up that maybe

767
00:40:37,960 --> 00:40:40,159
would have been done had Dad been in the picture.

768
00:40:40,159 --> 00:40:44,760
And that's keeping there more tight knit sibling dynamic present,

769
00:40:44,800 --> 00:40:47,960
which is probably easier for her that she's kind of

770
00:40:48,639 --> 00:40:51,719
the system is requiring him to be around more, which

771
00:40:51,760 --> 00:40:54,719
is keeping him more grounded to his younger siblings than

772
00:40:54,719 --> 00:40:58,719
his older peers. He's got football posters on the wall

773
00:40:58,760 --> 00:41:02,199
and he's clearly wearing a Joe Antana new jersey non

774
00:41:02,280 --> 00:41:04,519
jersey because they didn't license the things to say in them.

775
00:41:04,559 --> 00:41:09,199
But he's connecting to that stuff but not quite yet

776
00:41:09,280 --> 00:41:14,880
hitting the teenage puberty, girl crazy, etc. That we typically

777
00:41:14,920 --> 00:41:18,559
see starting to emerge around this time. It's the crossover time.

778
00:41:18,599 --> 00:41:21,000
So it's an interesting one for him because some kids

779
00:41:21,000 --> 00:41:24,360
figure out like, oh girls exist, sorry, bro right around

780
00:41:24,360 --> 00:41:26,840
this stage, but other times they don't, and they stick

781
00:41:26,840 --> 00:41:30,760
to their pack of friends who maybe need reminders to

782
00:41:30,800 --> 00:41:32,840
shower a little too often.

783
00:41:33,719 --> 00:41:38,639
Speaker 1: Still, yeah, I was thinking a little bit about how

784
00:41:39,559 --> 00:41:44,079
they are. How a part of Mike still being fifteen

785
00:41:44,280 --> 00:41:46,639
and still feeling like he's not being asked to do

786
00:41:46,719 --> 00:41:49,920
a lot of different things is also because I'm curious

787
00:41:50,000 --> 00:41:54,400
if Dad didn't really do a lot and maybe Mom's

788
00:41:54,440 --> 00:41:56,960
always done a lot. And it also made me think

789
00:41:57,000 --> 00:42:00,280
of the pushing back and trying to assert themselves in

790
00:42:00,280 --> 00:42:03,000
a different way because maybe dad. Maybe that's how Dad

791
00:42:03,039 --> 00:42:06,599
treated mom, And sometimes kids can pick up on that

792
00:42:07,840 --> 00:42:09,840
because that's how they see their dad treats their mom.

793
00:42:09,920 --> 00:42:12,039
We don't know that, we won't know that, but it's

794
00:42:12,079 --> 00:42:14,840
just something that popped into my head. Too, because sometimes

795
00:42:15,079 --> 00:42:18,119
the way that we see people interact in relationships is

796
00:42:18,119 --> 00:42:20,480
the way that we also think that relationships should go,

797
00:42:20,960 --> 00:42:23,400
because that's the only kind of relationships we've been shown.

798
00:42:24,199 --> 00:42:26,880
So if dad like walked all over mom a little bit, Yeah,

799
00:42:26,920 --> 00:42:29,920
and maybe the kids walk over mom a little bit too.

800
00:42:31,159 --> 00:42:34,000
Speaker 2: Or just didn't do shit and they leave her to do.

801
00:42:33,960 --> 00:42:35,360
Speaker 3: It, yeah, exactly.

802
00:42:37,519 --> 00:42:40,920
Speaker 1: But I think you're making a good point about Mike

803
00:42:41,159 --> 00:42:45,079
probably is a little stunted just because also in this

804
00:42:45,159 --> 00:42:49,280
situation where your dad's kind of fucked off and you

805
00:42:49,360 --> 00:42:52,400
have siblings that are so much younger than you, and

806
00:42:52,719 --> 00:42:55,239
you probably don't feel I could see in his position

807
00:42:55,280 --> 00:42:58,159
feeling like I can't go fuck off as much myself

808
00:42:58,280 --> 00:43:01,639
right now, Like I can't go party or just go

809
00:43:01,679 --> 00:43:04,719
off to friend's houses, like feeling more inclined to, Hey,

810
00:43:04,880 --> 00:43:07,679
come play D and D at our house, you know,

811
00:43:08,679 --> 00:43:11,679
trying to maybe spend more time around your younger siblings

812
00:43:11,719 --> 00:43:15,039
in a way that keeps you more Yeah, just keeps

813
00:43:15,079 --> 00:43:19,159
you more stuck in that time, because I could see me,

814
00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:22,159
even if I wasn't prentified, just wanting to maybe be

815
00:43:22,239 --> 00:43:25,679
around more and and just not feeling is able to

816
00:43:25,800 --> 00:43:28,400
like fuck off and do stuff that I wanted to

817
00:43:28,400 --> 00:43:30,719
do because Mom might need me to do the dishes

818
00:43:30,840 --> 00:43:33,119
or something like that in a way that I wouldn't

819
00:43:33,119 --> 00:43:36,079
think of if this change in the family hadn't happened.

820
00:43:37,119 --> 00:43:40,880
Speaker 2: That's all very possible, And it seems like maybe Mike

821
00:43:41,000 --> 00:43:43,440
is not even aware that he's picking up on that,

822
00:43:43,480 --> 00:43:46,119
But Mom does, you know, frequently ask them to like

823
00:43:46,199 --> 00:43:49,239
keep an eye on Gerdy, so they are getting a

824
00:43:49,239 --> 00:43:50,840
bit of that role. I don't find that to be

825
00:43:51,760 --> 00:43:54,079
too much more than I think any parent would ask

826
00:43:54,719 --> 00:43:55,920
look after your little sister.

827
00:43:56,639 --> 00:43:58,840
Speaker 1: Well, and also she's doing it for like can I

828
00:43:58,960 --> 00:44:02,000
watch her so I can take a shower, Like she's

829
00:44:02,039 --> 00:44:04,400
asking them to watch Gerty so she can do basic

830
00:44:04,440 --> 00:44:07,000
at stuff, not so she can like go have fun

831
00:44:07,039 --> 00:44:09,440
with friends or go fuck off you know what I mean,

832
00:44:09,440 --> 00:44:12,920
a fuck off herself. Like she's asking for basic stuff

833
00:44:12,960 --> 00:44:16,199
because well, even though she does leave Gerdy by herself

834
00:44:16,239 --> 00:44:18,679
in the house, which is wild once she goes to

835
00:44:18,800 --> 00:44:21,800
But I guess if you're I feel like if she

836
00:44:21,880 --> 00:44:24,159
was my client, I could see how she would tell

837
00:44:24,199 --> 00:44:26,039
me that I'm like and she would feel shamed about

838
00:44:26,079 --> 00:44:29,400
it like I was, So I could see her reflecting

839
00:44:29,400 --> 00:44:30,880
on them being like I can't believe I did that,

840
00:44:31,960 --> 00:44:35,039
but her being so swept up in like the school's calling.

841
00:44:35,039 --> 00:44:38,960
Like I've worked with plenty of parents that are ragged

842
00:44:39,079 --> 00:44:42,159
like that and they just have to make not great

843
00:44:42,920 --> 00:44:46,599
split decisions in the moment because they don't have support.

844
00:44:46,800 --> 00:44:50,719
But any who, I feel like we're going away from

845
00:44:50,840 --> 00:44:52,360
going back into So I know there'stuff you want to

846
00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:55,639
say about siblings, Sanna, Yeah, so it just really makes

847
00:44:55,639 --> 00:44:57,199
me think of you know, we've been talking a little

848
00:44:57,239 --> 00:44:59,239
bit here and there about how the kids seem really

849
00:44:59,239 --> 00:45:01,800
bonded to each other. The kids really seem like their

850
00:45:01,840 --> 00:45:05,719
own little group, which is really which, like you said,

851
00:45:05,760 --> 00:45:07,599
based on the ages, you know, can be kind of

852
00:45:07,599 --> 00:45:12,079
hard to do. I'm the oldest of the children that

853
00:45:12,119 --> 00:45:16,880
my mother physically had, and I had that big of

854
00:45:16,920 --> 00:45:17,719
age range.

855
00:45:17,719 --> 00:45:19,440
Speaker 3: Me and my brother Nick are ten years apart.

856
00:45:19,760 --> 00:45:22,480
Speaker 1: Me and my youngest sibling Abby are twelve years apart,

857
00:45:22,480 --> 00:45:25,400
and Megan were eleven years apart. So I had a

858
00:45:25,440 --> 00:45:28,840
lot of but I did everything. I mean, I picked

859
00:45:28,840 --> 00:45:30,800
everybody up from school, I took people to school, I

860
00:45:30,800 --> 00:45:32,679
took him to practice, I picked him up for practice,

861
00:45:32,719 --> 00:45:35,239
like I did all the things. So what I don't

862
00:45:35,239 --> 00:45:39,119
think Mike is either a not being asked yet or

863
00:45:39,119 --> 00:45:41,639
maybe his mom really is trying to avoid putting him

864
00:45:41,679 --> 00:45:43,880
in that position the much as much as she can,

865
00:45:44,480 --> 00:45:48,079
you know. So, I feel like what I really like

866
00:45:48,119 --> 00:45:49,960
about the way that the kids talk to each other

867
00:45:50,119 --> 00:45:52,360
is that he does a really good job. Steven Spielberg

868
00:45:52,360 --> 00:45:54,039
does a really good job of showing what kids are

869
00:45:54,039 --> 00:45:56,840
like when they're siblings, and I feel like that's something

870
00:45:56,840 --> 00:45:59,440
I've always enjoyed about his films. And I feel like

871
00:45:59,480 --> 00:46:02,239
the way that they kind of tease each other but

872
00:46:02,280 --> 00:46:05,119
then also have their backs when something's happening right away,

873
00:46:05,679 --> 00:46:08,159
The way that they both talk to Gerty and this

874
00:46:08,360 --> 00:46:10,559
kind of like they understand that she's younger, but they

875
00:46:10,559 --> 00:46:13,199
also try to include her. But she also kind of

876
00:46:13,280 --> 00:46:15,480
knows the rules about like the things she's allowed to

877
00:46:15,480 --> 00:46:17,599
do and not allowed to do in some ways I

878
00:46:17,599 --> 00:46:23,280
feel like with her brothers. And I feel like that

879
00:46:23,320 --> 00:46:27,800
can be really common when parents are getting divorced, because

880
00:46:27,840 --> 00:46:30,360
in some ways, like I said, it kids isolating a

881
00:46:30,440 --> 00:46:32,719
little bit and you.

882
00:46:32,719 --> 00:46:34,159
Speaker 3: Really need to have each other's backs.

883
00:46:34,199 --> 00:46:36,280
Speaker 1: It could also be something where what if mom and

884
00:46:36,360 --> 00:46:39,000
dad fought all the time, something that I would do

885
00:46:39,000 --> 00:46:40,679
as a kid whose parents fought all the time, was

886
00:46:40,719 --> 00:46:43,000
take all my siblings into a room so they couldn't

887
00:46:43,039 --> 00:46:45,679
hear what was happening. So again, it makes me curious

888
00:46:45,679 --> 00:46:47,400
if this family has seen a little bit more of

889
00:46:47,440 --> 00:46:50,440
that maybe, and that's another part of that's another reason

890
00:46:50,440 --> 00:46:52,760
why they're so bonded to each other. But I really

891
00:46:52,840 --> 00:46:56,599
enjoy the way that they problem solve together, the way

892
00:46:56,679 --> 00:46:59,519
that yes, Mike has to see the alien before he

893
00:46:59,559 --> 00:47:02,519
believes that, but also, what fifteen year old brother, What

894
00:47:02,559 --> 00:47:04,800
fifteen year old sibling wouldn't feel the same way if

895
00:47:04,800 --> 00:47:07,440
you're youngest, if your ten year old sibling told you

896
00:47:07,480 --> 00:47:09,280
there was an alien and that they had it proof

897
00:47:09,320 --> 00:47:11,639
in their bedroom, you'd be like, yeah, okay, the exact

898
00:47:11,719 --> 00:47:15,159
way that Mike acts when he's in that room, it

899
00:47:15,320 --> 00:47:19,280
makes a lot of sense. But I think what we're

900
00:47:19,400 --> 00:47:25,320
seeing is that when one parent is gone, it's really

901
00:47:25,360 --> 00:47:29,239
tricky for the family. No matter how involved their dad

902
00:47:29,320 --> 00:47:32,440
was or wasn't, it's really tricky to see who's going

903
00:47:32,519 --> 00:47:35,519
to stand in a different place. As we know, families

904
00:47:35,559 --> 00:47:38,039
all have different roles. Everybody has a different role in

905
00:47:38,079 --> 00:47:41,480
the family, and when one main person is now out

906
00:47:41,519 --> 00:47:45,360
of that group, we all have to readjust and readapt

907
00:47:45,519 --> 00:47:48,960
to how we can now work this dynamic that has

908
00:47:49,000 --> 00:47:52,960
now been completely changed. And that's a big part of

909
00:47:53,000 --> 00:47:55,079
what I feel like I see or talk about with

910
00:47:55,159 --> 00:47:58,320
people who either their parents were divorced when they were young,

911
00:47:58,639 --> 00:48:01,079
or even parents who were even adults who have parents

912
00:48:01,079 --> 00:48:04,679
who are divorcing now, Like, that's a big part of

913
00:48:05,360 --> 00:48:07,960
managing and figuring out how are we going to interact

914
00:48:07,960 --> 00:48:11,599
in the family now, And it can be tricky because

915
00:48:11,639 --> 00:48:14,480
everybody's trying to figure out their place. And so I

916
00:48:14,519 --> 00:48:17,480
also feel like some of the behavior that Elliott has,

917
00:48:17,800 --> 00:48:21,119
some of the behavior that Mike has towards mom, just

918
00:48:21,280 --> 00:48:23,599
makes a lot of sense because their kids and they're

919
00:48:23,639 --> 00:48:25,880
going through something where the person that they thought was

920
00:48:25,920 --> 00:48:27,800
always going to be there is not going to be there,

921
00:48:27,840 --> 00:48:29,639
and maybe we don't know when they're gonna see them

922
00:48:29,679 --> 00:48:34,599
again again. I'm not saying he's dead, but like in

923
00:48:34,679 --> 00:48:38,639
movies in the eighties, dads often just like disappear and

924
00:48:38,679 --> 00:48:41,960
we never hear from them again. So it's like, so

925
00:48:42,039 --> 00:48:44,440
I feel like their closeness makes a lot of sense.

926
00:48:44,480 --> 00:48:46,360
And I was just talking with my brother the other

927
00:48:46,440 --> 00:48:48,519
day and we were talking a little bit about how

928
00:48:48,519 --> 00:48:50,920
close we felt together because we went through so much

929
00:48:50,960 --> 00:48:53,400
together and then we're always together.

930
00:48:53,599 --> 00:48:55,840
Speaker 3: It was always all of us, but we played together.

931
00:48:56,559 --> 00:48:57,280
I cooked for.

932
00:48:57,280 --> 00:48:59,840
Speaker 1: Everyone, like there were all these things that we did

933
00:49:00,039 --> 00:49:02,079
together all of the time. So there's also this kind

934
00:49:02,159 --> 00:49:06,800
of almost like a little bit of like a stronger

935
00:49:07,000 --> 00:49:10,280
connection to each other when you know that something is

936
00:49:10,400 --> 00:49:13,119
changing in your family and you're all gonna and everything's

937
00:49:13,159 --> 00:49:15,440
gonna have to change in one way or another. And

938
00:49:15,480 --> 00:49:17,440
so I feel like the dynamic that we see between

939
00:49:17,480 --> 00:49:19,039
the kids makes a lot of sense, and I think

940
00:49:19,119 --> 00:49:21,639
is very natural and normal for what would happen if

941
00:49:21,639 --> 00:49:22,480
a parent.

942
00:49:22,719 --> 00:49:26,000
Speaker 2: Just dipped become to box card children.

943
00:49:26,519 --> 00:49:30,760
Speaker 1: I uce read those books, and you're right in that,

944
00:49:31,199 --> 00:49:34,199
Like the scene with the T shirt is if nothing else,

945
00:49:34,280 --> 00:49:36,239
like even if you have friends and stuff like that,

946
00:49:36,320 --> 00:49:38,719
and Mike clearly has a lot of friends, that.

947
00:49:38,559 --> 00:49:41,320
Speaker 3: Will that our true rider dies literally.

948
00:49:41,960 --> 00:49:46,480
Speaker 1: Is no one like when you're sibling with someone like

949
00:49:46,519 --> 00:49:48,519
you're the only people that have are in the same

950
00:49:48,559 --> 00:49:51,639
situation as much as the same situation as you can

951
00:49:51,679 --> 00:49:52,920
be in as two individuals.

952
00:49:53,239 --> 00:49:54,360
Speaker 3: And so even those moments.

953
00:49:54,119 --> 00:49:57,800
Speaker 1: Are spelling the shirt are moments where they can commiserate

954
00:49:58,400 --> 00:50:01,800
in a way where like we know what's like support groups.

955
00:50:01,880 --> 00:50:05,840
I know that you know what I know and that

956
00:50:05,880 --> 00:50:08,760
you know how I feel, and that we can commiserate

957
00:50:08,800 --> 00:50:10,679
in a way. And I think it is beautiful into

958
00:50:10,760 --> 00:50:14,440
a lot about how naturally emotional and a positive way

959
00:50:14,480 --> 00:50:17,079
these kids are. That they can have that kind of

960
00:50:17,079 --> 00:50:19,960
conversation with each other that's so like touching and sweet.

961
00:50:20,400 --> 00:50:23,239
And Mike does a good job of reassuring him and

962
00:50:23,320 --> 00:50:27,760
he doesn't do like a toxic eighties guy thing of

963
00:50:27,840 --> 00:50:30,280
like blow him off, And that's something I think that

964
00:50:30,400 --> 00:50:32,119
goes through the whole movie, Like they have those moments

965
00:50:32,159 --> 00:50:36,159
of teasing each other, like threatening to tear apart Girty's

966
00:50:36,239 --> 00:50:38,800
doll and stuff like that. Like they have these moments

967
00:50:38,840 --> 00:50:43,920
that are like true sibling situations worth how truly loving

968
00:50:43,920 --> 00:50:46,840
but also how truly ruthless you can be with your

969
00:50:46,840 --> 00:50:51,639
siblings and just your siblings specifically, And also how much

970
00:50:51,760 --> 00:50:55,199
they care about each other and take care of each

971
00:50:55,239 --> 00:50:57,360
other and support each other.

972
00:50:57,519 --> 00:50:58,280
Speaker 3: Is really sweet.

973
00:50:58,360 --> 00:51:02,840
Speaker 1: Like they do take each other seriously once the aliens

974
00:51:02,840 --> 00:51:05,199
in the mix, Once the aliens in the mix, they

975
00:51:05,239 --> 00:51:08,400
treat each other seriously from jump they do, And I

976
00:51:08,400 --> 00:51:11,039
think It's really sweet that they again, once they see

977
00:51:11,039 --> 00:51:14,639
the alien, everybody is on is on the same page

978
00:51:14,639 --> 00:51:17,079
and understand, Like even Girty understands. I mean, she doesn't

979
00:51:17,119 --> 00:51:19,840
super understand because she tries to show e t to

980
00:51:19,960 --> 00:51:23,320
the mom almost immediately, but but like.

981
00:51:23,400 --> 00:51:25,559
Speaker 3: In some aspects she did understand a little bit.

982
00:51:26,000 --> 00:51:28,039
Speaker 2: So I mean, they do tell her that only grown

983
00:51:28,119 --> 00:51:31,000
ups can or that grown ups can't see them, only kids.

984
00:51:31,280 --> 00:51:35,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, oh, I forgot that they say that to her. Yeah, okay, yeah,

985
00:51:36,159 --> 00:51:37,199
that makes a lot of sense.

986
00:51:37,639 --> 00:51:40,760
Speaker 1: But I really appreciate the sibling dynamic in this, and

987
00:51:40,840 --> 00:51:43,159
I really appreciate that it felt that it feels so

988
00:51:43,239 --> 00:51:45,360
real and so natural and doesn't make kids out to

989
00:51:45,400 --> 00:51:48,760
be brats or whatever, like we just have three kids

990
00:51:48,800 --> 00:51:50,679
who are trying to ADJUSTI with this to the fact

991
00:51:50,719 --> 00:51:52,800
that they now have an alien living in their home

992
00:51:53,000 --> 00:51:55,920
and also their dad's gone. It is curious though, that

993
00:51:56,000 --> 00:52:01,079
like Elliott doesn't seem to have any friends, and that

994
00:52:01,320 --> 00:52:04,159
even in the end when he needs help, it's Mike's friends,

995
00:52:04,199 --> 00:52:07,920
and so it does make me curious also why that's happening.

996
00:52:08,480 --> 00:52:11,360
And then I do think something that's very older sibling

997
00:52:11,519 --> 00:52:16,840
esque is tolerating your younger sibling kind of hanging around

998
00:52:16,880 --> 00:52:18,599
the D and D table, wanted to be part of

999
00:52:18,639 --> 00:52:21,079
the group. Letting them kind of tag along and have

1000
00:52:21,199 --> 00:52:24,760
nicknames with your friends, letting them ingratiate themselves a bit more.

1001
00:52:24,800 --> 00:52:26,960
As if you're like, well, my younger brother, for some reason,

1002
00:52:27,000 --> 00:52:30,840
he can't fucking make any friends, So having some like loving,

1003
00:52:31,679 --> 00:52:34,559
so having some patience with him, even though that patience

1004
00:52:34,599 --> 00:52:37,960
also includes being called what do they call him? What

1005
00:52:38,079 --> 00:52:39,519
is him and his friend? They call each other back

1006
00:52:39,559 --> 00:52:43,239
and forth. No, but when they're in front of the bus,

1007
00:52:43,280 --> 00:52:46,880
the school bus, and they're like, oh, he calls them

1008
00:52:46,880 --> 00:52:47,679
like something Latin.

1009
00:52:48,679 --> 00:52:50,599
Speaker 3: Do you know what I'm talking about? I know the scene.

1010
00:52:50,840 --> 00:52:52,880
Speaker 1: I the scene, but I don't I can't think of

1011
00:52:53,000 --> 00:52:54,079
what they call each other.

1012
00:52:54,400 --> 00:52:56,519
Speaker 2: I just keep thinking penis breath and that's not what

1013
00:52:56,559 --> 00:52:56,880
they read.

1014
00:52:57,480 --> 00:53:00,440
Speaker 1: Well, And that's also something, honestly, like I feel for

1015
00:53:00,480 --> 00:53:02,519
the mom too, like she's trying to catch these moments

1016
00:53:02,519 --> 00:53:05,239
when they're swearing and like using bad language towards each other.

1017
00:53:05,440 --> 00:53:07,800
Speaker 2: Well, they call each other, well, they just like douchebag

1018
00:53:07,960 --> 00:53:08,599
and penis.

1019
00:53:08,599 --> 00:53:11,519
Speaker 1: And she's stop saying that a douchebag in this house.

1020
00:53:11,559 --> 00:53:13,320
That's what she says, Yeah.

1021
00:53:13,119 --> 00:53:17,920
Speaker 2: I was watching this with me and Caroline and Ava

1022
00:53:18,119 --> 00:53:22,760
and Eva is eight and watching this is going like,

1023
00:53:23,400 --> 00:53:23,920
oh my.

1024
00:53:23,800 --> 00:53:26,639
Speaker 3: God, penis breath. She knows it now, she.

1025
00:53:26,679 --> 00:53:32,360
Speaker 2: Knows what that somebody and it's gonna happen, and I'm like, god,

1026
00:53:32,440 --> 00:53:35,360
damn it. Thanks eighties movie.

1027
00:53:35,480 --> 00:53:37,960
Speaker 1: Well, you have the benefit of her being the eldest siblings,

1028
00:53:37,960 --> 00:53:41,079
so she'll learner from movies, whereas a kid like Gertie

1029
00:53:41,119 --> 00:53:43,840
is probably already saying penis breath because they've been hearing

1030
00:53:43,840 --> 00:53:47,039
that word. Like the scene where in Gertie says, what

1031
00:53:47,079 --> 00:53:49,199
you gotta be kidding me or something, but she like

1032
00:53:49,440 --> 00:53:52,239
doesn't buy what they're selling. Is such like the youngest

1033
00:53:52,239 --> 00:53:55,519
sibling of like much older siblings look a little bit

1034
00:53:55,519 --> 00:53:56,440
more wise to it.

1035
00:53:56,960 --> 00:54:00,320
Speaker 2: Ava probably has ADHD because both me and her mother

1036
00:54:00,440 --> 00:54:02,719
have it, so there's like a zero percent chance she's

1037
00:54:02,760 --> 00:54:05,320
not going to And she told me the other day

1038
00:54:05,360 --> 00:54:09,480
that she can't hear us when she's focused on something else,

1039
00:54:09,480 --> 00:54:11,079
and I just like put my head in my hands

1040
00:54:11,119 --> 00:54:12,519
and went like fuck.

1041
00:54:14,480 --> 00:54:17,039
Speaker 3: Because I know what that means.

1042
00:54:18,320 --> 00:54:21,239
Speaker 2: Well, no suspicions connfirm.

1043
00:54:21,800 --> 00:54:23,639
Speaker 4: It's like I can't help, but I get here, like,

1044
00:54:23,800 --> 00:54:29,679
uh shit, but her little sister already will say when

1045
00:54:29,719 --> 00:54:31,840
we're trying to get her to do something, and she's

1046
00:54:31,840 --> 00:54:33,679
two and a half, she's hyperverbal.

1047
00:54:33,679 --> 00:54:36,000
Speaker 2: This kid knows so many words, it's amazing. But she's

1048
00:54:36,039 --> 00:54:40,400
just like one second and Ava loves to tell us

1049
00:54:40,599 --> 00:54:43,920
one second or one minute, and like Emma now does it,

1050
00:54:44,000 --> 00:54:45,360
and we're like, a.

1051
00:54:47,199 --> 00:54:47,480
Speaker 3: Fuck.

1052
00:54:48,320 --> 00:54:50,599
Speaker 2: It annoys the shit out of you with one, but

1053
00:54:50,679 --> 00:54:52,840
when the other one does it, and it's just like

1054
00:54:53,559 --> 00:54:56,440
uses it perfectly in context because their sibling did it.

1055
00:54:56,519 --> 00:55:01,480
You're like the parental brain lights on fire. Your soul

1056
00:55:01,760 --> 00:55:06,119
turns into magma, and you try not to light everyone

1057
00:55:06,199 --> 00:55:13,039
on fire with your destruction. And it's maddening. And just

1058
00:55:13,119 --> 00:55:16,440
think thinking about like, oh my god, his kids are

1059
00:55:16,440 --> 00:55:18,280
in here calling each other penis breath and you know,

1060
00:55:18,360 --> 00:55:23,119
Elliott didn't invent that. That came from playing D and

1061
00:55:23,199 --> 00:55:26,840
D with his friends. And even though Mike begrudgingly doesn't

1062
00:55:26,880 --> 00:55:30,360
stick up for him but doesn't object to him playing,

1063
00:55:30,679 --> 00:55:33,199
knowing full well the kid wants to play and doesn't

1064
00:55:33,440 --> 00:55:36,239
maybe have friends, wants to connect, wants to play, needs

1065
00:55:36,280 --> 00:55:39,559
a group, and has a character sheet in his fucking hands.

1066
00:55:40,280 --> 00:55:43,079
Mike is like, well, oh no, the turance is to doom.

1067
00:55:43,159 --> 00:55:46,400
So we have a little you tool ask him and

1068
00:55:46,519 --> 00:55:48,559
other kids like, of course you can play.

1069
00:55:48,760 --> 00:55:49,599
Speaker 3: But it's very.

1070
00:55:49,480 --> 00:55:53,559
Speaker 1: Much like Mike is both saving face as a teenager

1071
00:55:53,800 --> 00:55:56,199
with his friends of like not letting his ten year

1072
00:55:56,239 --> 00:55:59,599
old brother play, but at the same time having a

1073
00:55:59,599 --> 00:56:03,920
soft for Mike and probably wanting him to not wanting

1074
00:56:04,000 --> 00:56:06,519
him to play, but also wanting him to play simultaneously.

1075
00:56:06,760 --> 00:56:09,039
It's a tough quander to be in, but also something

1076
00:56:09,079 --> 00:56:12,920
about picking up like Gertie picking up on oldest sibling things.

1077
00:56:13,119 --> 00:56:14,280
Speaker 3: She calls their.

1078
00:56:14,119 --> 00:56:19,679
Speaker 1: Mom Mary once and then and then Mike calls her

1079
00:56:19,719 --> 00:56:22,599
Mary later, and so there are moments in which the

1080
00:56:22,719 --> 00:56:26,000
kids call their mom Mary, which is very interesting to me,

1081
00:56:26,039 --> 00:56:28,000
and I was like, that's such an interesting little like

1082
00:56:28,679 --> 00:56:31,320
I think what I love about this movie is that

1083
00:56:31,519 --> 00:56:35,280
and the older movies do this better I think than nowadays,

1084
00:56:35,320 --> 00:56:37,679
where they say that what they write movies for the

1085
00:56:37,679 --> 00:56:39,400
person in the other room, they write movies so you

1086
00:56:39,440 --> 00:56:44,800
can be on your phone. Is dropping these little naturalistic

1087
00:56:44,960 --> 00:56:48,559
like lore moments that they don't ever explain, like we

1088
00:56:48,639 --> 00:56:51,000
never know why the kids will sometimes call their mom Mary.

1089
00:56:51,559 --> 00:56:54,559
It's just something that's like lived in in their household,

1090
00:56:55,519 --> 00:56:57,880
and I and I wish there was more of that

1091
00:56:58,000 --> 00:57:00,960
nowadays without it getting beaten to death online about like

1092
00:57:00,960 --> 00:57:02,280
why did the kids sometimes.

1093
00:57:01,920 --> 00:57:03,360
Speaker 3: Call her mom Mary. I don't know.

1094
00:57:03,440 --> 00:57:05,079
Speaker 1: Maybe Mike does it because he thinks it's funny every

1095
00:57:05,119 --> 00:57:06,639
once in a while, and Grudy picked up on it.

1096
00:57:07,079 --> 00:57:08,639
I mean, I used to call my mom Elizabeth to

1097
00:57:08,639 --> 00:57:10,159
get her attention when I was a kid. Maybe it's

1098
00:57:10,159 --> 00:57:12,039
because she's frazzled, so everyone's wanted to call her by

1099
00:57:12,039 --> 00:57:15,400
her government name to get her attention, because mom, Because

1100
00:57:15,519 --> 00:57:17,480
I think most parents know that at a certain point,

1101
00:57:17,519 --> 00:57:20,039
you stop hearing that word when you're in a frazzled

1102
00:57:20,119 --> 00:57:23,199
enough state, like mom, mo, mom, Dad, Dad, Dad becomes

1103
00:57:23,199 --> 00:57:25,519
like wah wah wah blah whah.

1104
00:57:25,000 --> 00:57:28,000
Speaker 2: Maybe and realizing they have to antagonize her to break

1105
00:57:28,000 --> 00:57:32,440
her out of her dissociation, like pay attention to me.

1106
00:57:33,280 --> 00:57:35,599
Speaker 1: But I feel like, yeah, and it might because of that.

1107
00:57:35,679 --> 00:57:37,280
But also, like I said, sometimes I would call my

1108
00:57:37,320 --> 00:57:39,760
mom Elizabeth just to like get her attention if she

1109
00:57:39,800 --> 00:57:43,360
was like focusing on something basically, if she wasn't giving

1110
00:57:43,360 --> 00:57:45,639
me her full attention. After I said Mom fifteen times,

1111
00:57:45,679 --> 00:57:48,320
I would switch to Elizabeth to just like kick it

1112
00:57:48,360 --> 00:57:50,119
up a notch. I would say her nickname that she

1113
00:57:50,199 --> 00:57:52,639
hated when she was younger if I really needed her attention.

1114
00:57:52,840 --> 00:57:54,559
But I respect her enough that I will not say

1115
00:57:54,559 --> 00:57:57,320
it on this podcast.

1116
00:57:57,599 --> 00:58:00,599
Speaker 2: Which seems like it would lend us well into our

1117
00:58:00,639 --> 00:58:04,079
next topic. Do we feel like we've covered what we

1118
00:58:04,360 --> 00:58:07,960
wanted to do with this? So one of the things

1119
00:58:08,159 --> 00:58:13,760
that I wanted to talk about and is really based

1120
00:58:13,880 --> 00:58:18,039
more on honestly my experience as a parent, is the

1121
00:58:18,079 --> 00:58:23,800
way if kids reach out to an adult for guidance

1122
00:58:24,400 --> 00:58:28,000
on something that from their perspective is real and they

1123
00:58:28,079 --> 00:58:32,719
know for sure is real and there, and the adults

1124
00:58:33,000 --> 00:58:37,199
blow them off, kids will not dismiss it the way

1125
00:58:37,280 --> 00:58:41,079
the adult dismissed it. There is a zero percent chance

1126
00:58:41,119 --> 00:58:44,840
of that the kids are going to investigate and look

1127
00:58:44,880 --> 00:58:48,440
into it, and they're going to try to find the

1128
00:58:48,519 --> 00:58:53,239
answers according to their point of view, because the reality

1129
00:58:53,679 --> 00:58:59,599
of reality is that it's subjective. There is no collective reality.

1130
00:59:00,159 --> 00:59:03,880
There is a collective sense of knowledge. There is a

1131
00:59:03,920 --> 00:59:07,119
collective database, a collective unconscious if we're going to go

1132
00:59:07,159 --> 00:59:10,880
into Yuni in terms here, but everybody seems to know

1133
00:59:11,840 --> 00:59:16,559
what the characters of every story are regardless of culture.

1134
00:59:17,159 --> 00:59:22,039
But if you leave a kid alone to investigate a

1135
00:59:22,079 --> 00:59:24,880
story and you blow them off when they're like, hey,

1136
00:59:25,119 --> 00:59:27,039
I think I'm pretty sure I saw something. Maybe it

1137
00:59:27,079 --> 00:59:31,000
was a goblin outside that shit wasn't a coyote. Okay,

1138
00:59:31,519 --> 00:59:34,880
that was not a coyote. Whatever it was was some

1139
00:59:34,920 --> 00:59:39,800
weird shit. And if you diminish, dismiss, tell them to

1140
00:59:39,880 --> 00:59:43,000
not worry about it. Yet Nope, they saw what they saw.

1141
00:59:43,280 --> 00:59:45,800
They're not going to adjust to the reality you try

1142
00:59:45,800 --> 00:59:49,440
to create for them. They're going to go and investigate

1143
00:59:49,480 --> 00:59:52,039
from their own point of view. And I think that's

1144
00:59:52,039 --> 00:59:56,559
what leads us to the entire plot of this movie

1145
00:59:56,599 --> 00:59:58,840
when we get an alien who still haven't really talked about,

1146
01:00:00,559 --> 01:00:04,199
but I mean also he you know, doesn't say a

1147
01:00:04,239 --> 01:00:08,760
whole lot. But what we see with Elliott is that

1148
01:00:08,880 --> 01:00:15,559
because everyone ignores his repeated insistence that he saw what

1149
01:00:15,639 --> 01:00:19,039
he saw and it was fucking weird and it was

1150
01:00:19,199 --> 01:00:24,119
so weird that he was perturbed, he goes outside and

1151
01:00:24,400 --> 01:00:29,719
sits in almost hallucination dream like state to see this thing,

1152
01:00:29,960 --> 01:00:33,800
and no one seems to notice. He just goes outside

1153
01:00:33,840 --> 01:00:37,239
and then he encounters this thing and again tries to

1154
01:00:37,280 --> 01:00:41,239
appeal to everybody that hey, there's some weird shit going on.

1155
01:00:41,280 --> 01:00:46,480
Everyone's like, you're just making this up. Goblins aren't real.

1156
01:00:46,840 --> 01:00:50,760
It's a coyote, but what could it be, like a

1157
01:00:50,880 --> 01:00:54,960
deformed squirrel or whatever they said. I can't remember what exactly,

1158
01:00:55,880 --> 01:01:00,599
but thinking about my kids in moments where we've been like, kiddo,

1159
01:01:01,199 --> 01:01:03,599
that's not how it works. It's not how it works.

1160
01:01:03,880 --> 01:01:07,519
Like the alarm on our house is Ava's current like

1161
01:01:08,599 --> 01:01:11,400
things like that was like, it's the alarm on, like, kiddo,

1162
01:01:11,639 --> 01:01:13,719
they call me, but are they going to call the police, Like,

1163
01:01:13,760 --> 01:01:15,199
and the police is gonna comes, Like there's gonna be

1164
01:01:15,360 --> 01:01:17,880
like a problem if the alarm goes like they call

1165
01:01:18,239 --> 01:01:21,719
me first, if theom goes off. Also, I'll show you

1166
01:01:21,760 --> 01:01:25,400
how to deactivate it. She's because she's anxious about it.

1167
01:01:25,400 --> 01:01:28,400
She's not hearing this. None of my logic is going

1168
01:01:28,480 --> 01:01:34,199
to work because it's emotional activation. And in this story,

1169
01:01:34,960 --> 01:01:40,440
everyone dismisses Elliott's perspective. So Elliott then tries to figure

1170
01:01:40,480 --> 01:01:42,760
it out the way he knows how, and he likes

1171
01:01:42,800 --> 01:01:45,000
Reese's pieces, and because he's ten, he's going to be

1172
01:01:45,320 --> 01:01:48,280
full on egocentric, which means He's only seeing the world

1173
01:01:48,360 --> 01:01:51,119
to his own perspective, which is what all of us

1174
01:01:51,119 --> 01:01:53,440
do all the time. But when you're a kid, you

1175
01:01:53,480 --> 01:01:56,960
can't connect to the larger world. You only see it

1176
01:01:57,159 --> 01:01:59,599
through your perspective. You can't like go like, well, if

1177
01:01:59,639 --> 01:02:02,559
I was mom, how it I feel. Nope, you're just

1178
01:02:03,199 --> 01:02:07,519
cognitively capable of that. But it's just literally turning on

1179
01:02:07,599 --> 01:02:12,239
your frontal lobe is just now at ten developed enough

1180
01:02:12,280 --> 01:02:14,679
that you can do this. So what we see is

1181
01:02:14,719 --> 01:02:18,320
that Elliott goes outside knowing he saw some weird ass

1182
01:02:18,320 --> 01:02:22,079
shit he's never seen before, but also it didn't eat him,

1183
01:02:22,599 --> 01:02:25,840
so maybe I should give it candy and let it

1184
01:02:25,840 --> 01:02:26,519
in the house.

1185
01:02:28,440 --> 01:02:29,559
Speaker 3: I love that.

1186
01:02:30,800 --> 01:02:32,960
Speaker 1: Elliott just does the first thing that he thinks of

1187
01:02:33,119 --> 01:02:34,440
by using the Reese's pieces.

1188
01:02:34,519 --> 01:02:35,800
Speaker 3: I think that's so cute.

1189
01:02:36,079 --> 01:02:38,199
Speaker 1: I also was curious, there's a question I wanted to

1190
01:02:38,239 --> 01:02:41,800
ask you both, So I was like super paying attention

1191
01:02:41,880 --> 01:02:43,519
to this movie today in a way that I feel

1192
01:02:43,519 --> 01:02:45,239
like I don't usually pay attention to the movies that

1193
01:02:45,239 --> 01:02:45,480
we do.

1194
01:02:46,159 --> 01:02:47,719
Speaker 3: No offense anyone, But.

1195
01:02:50,199 --> 01:02:56,360
Speaker 1: When when do you think that et imprints on Elliot?

1196
01:02:56,599 --> 01:03:00,719
Because I think it happens as soon as they engage

1197
01:03:00,800 --> 01:03:03,679
and then we see him staring off into space. I

1198
01:03:03,719 --> 01:03:05,719
think that's when they connect. I think that's I think

1199
01:03:05,719 --> 01:03:10,440
he is already connected to ET before we get to

1200
01:03:12,039 --> 01:03:14,239
like where he where they actually meet and they start

1201
01:03:14,280 --> 01:03:16,320
to talk, like, I think it happens before that. I

1202
01:03:16,320 --> 01:03:19,719
think that they are connected as soon as they encounter

1203
01:03:19,840 --> 01:03:22,840
each other and he yells in his face because they're

1204
01:03:22,880 --> 01:03:25,760
both afraid of each other. That's like that it happens

1205
01:03:25,840 --> 01:03:26,639
the first time you see it.

1206
01:03:26,760 --> 01:03:27,480
Speaker 3: I agree.

1207
01:03:27,559 --> 01:03:29,480
Speaker 1: I literally is gonna ask the same thing or oh

1208
01:03:29,559 --> 01:03:32,800
my god, some idea, which is if we're gonna see

1209
01:03:32,800 --> 01:03:35,760
this from like the science fiction lens. Yes, I was like,

1210
01:03:36,559 --> 01:03:42,199
does he feel drawn, like what's what I'm looking for?

1211
01:03:42,599 --> 01:03:47,000
Does he feel not drawn but like connected? I'm not connected,

1212
01:03:47,079 --> 01:03:53,360
like dogged about finding ET because he is connected, like

1213
01:03:53,599 --> 01:03:56,119
my heart is connected to your heart. Now, So the

1214
01:03:56,159 --> 01:03:59,760
persistence in which he feels like he has to find

1215
01:04:01,239 --> 01:04:03,239
I was wondering. I was like, is there a part

1216
01:04:03,280 --> 01:04:06,440
of him that already feels ET out there and that's

1217
01:04:06,480 --> 01:04:08,960
why he can't give up on it and gets so

1218
01:04:09,039 --> 01:04:13,639
preoccupied by it? Now. My psychological interpretation is that he's

1219
01:04:13,679 --> 01:04:16,239
a kid whose life feels very out of control and

1220
01:04:16,280 --> 01:04:23,079
so he just in pre imprints on something that is

1221
01:04:23,079 --> 01:04:25,159
like a project, you know what I mean the way

1222
01:04:25,199 --> 01:04:28,239
that I think we, even as adults will do when

1223
01:04:28,280 --> 01:04:30,519
something about our life feels out of control, as all

1224
01:04:30,519 --> 01:04:33,079
of a sudden, will decide I don't know, I'm gonna

1225
01:04:33,119 --> 01:04:35,840
get really into this hobby or I'm gonna really get

1226
01:04:35,880 --> 01:04:38,480
into this sport because my life feels out of control,

1227
01:04:38,519 --> 01:04:40,639
and then all of a sudden, I'm like super into

1228
01:04:40,719 --> 01:04:44,960
this one thing. And but yeah, I also was wondering

1229
01:04:45,000 --> 01:04:48,199
watching this now, I was like, how soon are they

1230
01:04:49,079 --> 01:04:49,679
is Et?

1231
01:04:50,360 --> 01:04:51,880
Speaker 3: How soon is Elliott feeling?

1232
01:04:52,719 --> 01:04:55,079
Speaker 1: Yeah, like I don't even know why I have to

1233
01:04:55,159 --> 01:04:57,760
keep finding this thing or figuring out like maybe there's

1234
01:04:57,760 --> 01:04:59,400
something in him that he can't quite understand.

1235
01:05:00,119 --> 01:05:04,960
Speaker 2: I think that that's happening passively and maybe organically at

1236
01:05:04,960 --> 01:05:08,320
that point, but I don't think that each really fully

1237
01:05:08,400 --> 01:05:12,639
makes that connection until they do the where are you

1238
01:05:12,800 --> 01:05:16,159
from thing and he's got the little balls in the air.

1239
01:05:16,800 --> 01:05:19,960
I think that's when the movie shows us they're fully connected,

1240
01:05:20,000 --> 01:05:25,000
because that's the first time Elliott announces feeling his feelings.

1241
01:05:25,760 --> 01:05:29,039
Speaker 1: So I'm going to push on it in that when

1242
01:05:29,039 --> 01:05:30,760
he brings Et into the house for the first time

1243
01:05:30,760 --> 01:05:33,199
they both get tired at the same time and they

1244
01:05:33,199 --> 01:05:35,480
both like fall asleep kind of pass on Sims's I

1245
01:05:35,480 --> 01:05:37,679
feel it's the first big clue to us as the

1246
01:05:37,719 --> 01:05:40,880
audience that they are having the same experience. They're like

1247
01:05:41,079 --> 01:05:44,079
they're copying each other, like living in the same experience

1248
01:05:44,119 --> 01:05:44,719
at the same time.

1249
01:05:45,679 --> 01:05:45,880
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1250
01:05:45,960 --> 01:05:50,159
Speaker 1: Because sure, because I feel like when Et is in

1251
01:05:50,199 --> 01:05:51,920
the room, when they're in the room and they're both calm,

1252
01:05:52,079 --> 01:05:53,800
which I think is the big part of it. When

1253
01:05:53,800 --> 01:05:57,800
they're in the room and they're both calm, they he starts,

1254
01:05:57,920 --> 01:05:59,920
you know, when Elliott starts touching his face and then

1255
01:06:00,039 --> 01:06:02,000
Et touches his face the same way.

1256
01:06:02,280 --> 01:06:05,679
Speaker 3: I think that's a part of them connecting. Yeah.

1257
01:06:05,679 --> 01:06:08,760
Speaker 2: So I think that's the passive side, like the yeah, they're.

1258
01:06:08,719 --> 01:06:10,159
Speaker 3: Communicating in that way.

1259
01:06:10,400 --> 01:06:15,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I think like whatever capability his species has

1260
01:06:16,119 --> 01:06:20,199
connects at that moment, and that's the moment like that

1261
01:06:21,559 --> 01:06:24,239
whatever psychic bond I create happening.

1262
01:06:24,320 --> 01:06:26,360
Speaker 1: No, I agree with you on that, Like I think

1263
01:06:26,760 --> 01:06:31,639
because Et is clearly in his own crisis right that

1264
01:06:31,679 --> 01:06:34,239
I can't I do get. I agree with you in

1265
01:06:34,280 --> 01:06:37,679
that it's probably more of like a passive like an

1266
01:06:37,719 --> 01:06:42,639
accidental maybe psychic link because maybe if this is going

1267
01:06:42,639 --> 01:06:46,760
into what I wander about later, but if ET comes

1268
01:06:46,760 --> 01:06:51,119
from a place where they communicate empathically or like emotionally,

1269
01:06:51,920 --> 01:06:54,360
then maybe he did that without even realizing he did it,

1270
01:06:54,400 --> 01:06:56,480
because that's just so the way that we would start

1271
01:06:56,480 --> 01:07:00,000
talking to someone without even contemplating if they would under

1272
01:07:00,039 --> 01:07:02,679
stand us. Like if I ended up on an alien planet,

1273
01:07:02,719 --> 01:07:05,119
I would probably be like, hey, what's up, without thinking

1274
01:07:05,119 --> 01:07:06,599
about girl, they don't know what the fuck you're saying,

1275
01:07:06,639 --> 01:07:08,519
but I probably just do it well right.

1276
01:07:08,360 --> 01:07:13,840
Speaker 2: And also realizing that he's in whatever version of alien

1277
01:07:13,920 --> 01:07:21,639
id mindset he's in, he's abandoned because his species, family, etc.

1278
01:07:22,039 --> 01:07:26,079
Whatever the cases had to because they had to choose

1279
01:07:26,079 --> 01:07:27,719
to leave in the mind as much have been difficult

1280
01:07:28,039 --> 01:07:32,960
for them given their heart based connection, that he.

1281
01:07:34,239 --> 01:07:37,400
Speaker 3: Is panicked the whole time. He's scared.

1282
01:07:37,480 --> 01:07:39,320
Speaker 2: He doesn't know where the fuck he is or what's

1283
01:07:39,400 --> 01:07:42,679
going on or what if anything is safe. So he's

1284
01:07:42,719 --> 01:07:46,840
in full survival mode. But he's also hungry, and he's,

1285
01:07:47,119 --> 01:07:50,599
as you learned, like slowly dying because he's not getting

1286
01:07:50,599 --> 01:07:54,800
his needs met and food and everything else. He's hungry.

1287
01:07:55,599 --> 01:07:59,360
This person is maybe safe, So I think he's connecting

1288
01:07:59,400 --> 01:08:03,679
to the idea like, well, everything else is not safe,

1289
01:08:03,719 --> 01:08:09,800
but this is safer than not safe. So I think passively.

1290
01:08:09,840 --> 01:08:13,320
But then once Et has decided, oh, he's actually really

1291
01:08:13,440 --> 01:08:17,039
trying to to help me and connect, So I'm gonna

1292
01:08:17,039 --> 01:08:20,239
go ahead and connect that that happens where in the

1293
01:08:20,279 --> 01:08:22,199
transplain where he's from, and.

1294
01:08:22,159 --> 01:08:24,720
Speaker 1: I agree too with where you're It becomes more of

1295
01:08:24,760 --> 01:08:31,159
an active thing when he shows them his little like socials,

1296
01:08:31,840 --> 01:08:35,399
when he shows them his little solar system thing, because

1297
01:08:35,560 --> 01:08:38,239
Elliott looks out the window and he says like I'm

1298
01:08:38,239 --> 01:08:44,000
feeling scared, like something like Elliott is computing it through

1299
01:08:44,239 --> 01:08:47,560
his understanding as a kid. And then Et puts his

1300
01:08:47,600 --> 01:08:50,880
hand on his shoulder to kind of be like, we're

1301
01:08:50,880 --> 01:08:55,000
talking now, Like now we're talking because you're asking me questions,

1302
01:08:55,000 --> 01:08:56,079
So now we're really talking.

1303
01:08:56,600 --> 01:09:00,279
Speaker 3: We're in a conversation. Yeah.

1304
01:09:00,760 --> 01:09:04,680
Speaker 2: So we've covered quite a bit about when those two

1305
01:09:04,760 --> 01:09:07,680
might have imprinted on each other. But we have kind

1306
01:09:07,680 --> 01:09:10,079
of on our board here the opportun to explore how

1307
01:09:10,119 --> 01:09:13,600
adults respund to kids or empathy and communication. Which direction

1308
01:09:13,680 --> 01:09:14,479
we want to go first?

1309
01:09:14,720 --> 01:09:16,840
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, I think kind of going off of

1310
01:09:16,880 --> 01:09:20,279
what you were saying, about when kids are left to

1311
01:09:20,279 --> 01:09:23,600
the oarn device. Well going, well, going back to what

1312
01:09:23,640 --> 01:09:27,399
you were saying about how Elliott is trying to get

1313
01:09:28,319 --> 01:09:32,279
his mom specifically, but is trying to get engagement from

1314
01:09:32,600 --> 01:09:37,640
people about what he's discovering, you know, the goblin outside is.

1315
01:09:37,800 --> 01:09:41,319
It did make me think about how I wish that

1316
01:09:41,600 --> 01:09:45,439
adults would, and I think they do better now, would

1317
01:09:45,520 --> 01:09:50,159
engage in more curiosity with kids like I think nowadays

1318
01:09:50,560 --> 01:09:53,079
because there is so much more of a conversation around

1319
01:09:53,159 --> 01:09:57,039
therapy and specifically like even getting kids in almost like

1320
01:09:57,079 --> 01:09:59,960
preventative therapy. When something like this happens to a family

1321
01:10:01,119 --> 01:10:07,560
is I feel like his persistence around this like invisible

1322
01:10:07,600 --> 01:10:10,800
friend kind of thing in the yard, I could see

1323
01:10:11,000 --> 01:10:14,560
a parent being like, oh God, my kid's going through

1324
01:10:14,600 --> 01:10:17,039
something because of divorce. I need to give them in

1325
01:10:17,079 --> 01:10:21,560
therapy because they keep talking about this like entity that

1326
01:10:21,600 --> 01:10:24,399
lives outside and they're staying out all night and they're

1327
01:10:24,399 --> 01:10:27,319
feeding in our food now like all that kind of stuff.

1328
01:10:27,439 --> 01:10:29,880
Speaker 2: Well now, yeah, in the eighties, No.

1329
01:10:30,399 --> 01:10:31,039
Speaker 3: That's what I mean.

1330
01:10:31,520 --> 01:10:37,239
Speaker 1: Like, I think that now we have we're more encouraged

1331
01:10:37,239 --> 01:10:42,520
as adults to demonstrate more curiosity towards children, even if

1332
01:10:42,520 --> 01:10:46,720
they're bringing up something that to our minds is totally

1333
01:10:47,399 --> 01:10:52,680
unrealistic or off the wall, at least being curious about why,

1334
01:10:54,239 --> 01:10:56,760
like where they're going with that, Like what's going on

1335
01:10:56,880 --> 01:11:00,279
with them? Like they're wanting your attention for something. Maybe

1336
01:11:00,279 --> 01:11:03,399
it's not the exact waky, wacky thing they're talking about,

1337
01:11:04,359 --> 01:11:07,119
but there's something going on, and that's why this kid

1338
01:11:07,199 --> 01:11:08,439
is wanting you so much.

1339
01:11:09,359 --> 01:11:13,399
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's I think where the first like real

1340
01:11:14,159 --> 01:11:16,279
besides the sibling dynamics and the divorce things that we've

1341
01:11:16,279 --> 01:11:19,640
been talking about, is the first part of this movie

1342
01:11:19,720 --> 01:11:22,760
is definitely shot more like a horror movie, more like

1343
01:11:22,760 --> 01:11:26,439
his Jurassic Park, and even something as simple as people

1344
01:11:26,520 --> 01:11:29,800
walking through the woods is meant to feel scary, and

1345
01:11:29,840 --> 01:11:35,840
it's shot in ways that are scary, and we see

1346
01:11:36,520 --> 01:11:41,760
once they reveal Keys, the lead scientist, he's the first

1347
01:11:41,760 --> 01:11:47,399
one that's not a kid to actually start compassionately acknowledging

1348
01:11:47,439 --> 01:11:53,039
the reality that Elliott is seeing, validating that, Yeah, I've

1349
01:11:53,079 --> 01:11:57,520
been looking for aliens my whole life too, talking to

1350
01:11:57,560 --> 01:11:59,439
him about it as if what he's seeing is real,

1351
01:11:59,479 --> 01:12:03,479
because clearly at this point it's all real. Never mind

1352
01:12:03,520 --> 01:12:07,720
that the government just busted in fucking base suits like

1353
01:12:07,880 --> 01:12:13,039
NASA and that's terrifying, and hazmat suits like Level three here.

1354
01:12:13,079 --> 01:12:16,520
But when he takes all that off, that's a moment

1355
01:12:16,640 --> 01:12:22,720
of humanization where it becomes clear that even though the

1356
01:12:23,279 --> 01:12:26,720
g men, as it were, are antagonistic and the kind

1357
01:12:26,720 --> 01:12:28,920
of the central antagonists from the point of view as kids,

1358
01:12:29,079 --> 01:12:33,800
there's no real villains in this movie. They're scientists and

1359
01:12:33,920 --> 01:12:39,159
doctors behaving as scientists and doctors do there and the

1360
01:12:39,199 --> 01:12:42,399
government of course wanting to know if, like, so, what's

1361
01:12:42,439 --> 01:12:43,760
that machine he built doing?

1362
01:12:43,840 --> 01:12:46,760
Speaker 3: By the way, is that of a bomb?

1363
01:12:47,159 --> 01:12:50,319
Speaker 2: Is that dangerous to like literally everyone, are we all

1364
01:12:50,359 --> 01:12:54,199
super fucked? Because can you please tell us? But he

1365
01:12:55,039 --> 01:12:59,039
got down to Elliott's level, He spoke to him kindly,

1366
01:12:59,520 --> 01:13:03,800
He was sympathic towards him, he was understanding, he was

1367
01:13:03,800 --> 01:13:08,079
taking efforts that literally nobody else in that scene, and

1368
01:13:08,479 --> 01:13:11,399
like mom was taking care of the other kids. But

1369
01:13:12,319 --> 01:13:17,159
Elliott didn't bond to any other adults, even kind of

1370
01:13:17,199 --> 01:13:21,439
his mom, except to this other guy. He's clearly like

1371
01:13:21,520 --> 01:13:25,039
a foil to Elliott of showing like the difference between

1372
01:13:25,119 --> 01:13:29,880
childhood wonder and adulthood reality of like, hey, these things

1373
01:13:29,880 --> 01:13:32,680
that you can be interested in also could be dangerous,

1374
01:13:32,880 --> 01:13:36,760
and Elliott is not perceiving ET is dangerous at all,

1375
01:13:36,920 --> 01:13:41,199
or that Et might not survive until he gets sick

1376
01:13:41,279 --> 01:13:45,680
and everybody busts in. But Keys is taking time to

1377
01:13:45,800 --> 01:13:49,720
explain what's happening as much as possible with Elliott and

1378
01:13:49,760 --> 01:13:55,520
trying to demonstrate compassion, and I feel like it's important,

1379
01:13:55,560 --> 01:13:59,479
and that juxtaposition of how mom has been kind of

1380
01:13:59,520 --> 01:14:02,800
dismissed until it becomes quite clear that what Elliott is

1381
01:14:02,840 --> 01:14:05,840
experiencing is real, and then she works to take care

1382
01:14:05,840 --> 01:14:09,560
of her children and be compassionate and empathic to them

1383
01:14:09,600 --> 01:14:13,800
and hold Girdy and take her away from what she

1384
01:14:13,840 --> 01:14:16,479
doesn't need to see and give her permission to be

1385
01:14:16,560 --> 01:14:20,720
scared and not offer answers she doesn't have and bullshit,

1386
01:14:21,479 --> 01:14:25,640
and also not interfere with people providing Elliot answers that

1387
01:14:26,239 --> 01:14:29,520
are the best answers available. But I think when adults

1388
01:14:30,359 --> 01:14:34,880
take time to give kids answers to questions that they

1389
01:14:34,920 --> 01:14:40,000
have and not dumb it down, not mute it, not

1390
01:14:40,239 --> 01:14:43,079
tell them oh, well, let the grown ups handle this,

1391
01:14:43,199 --> 01:14:47,479
but provide age appropriate in maybe even a little beyond

1392
01:14:47,520 --> 01:14:52,600
age appropriate answers, but tell kids the truth has been

1393
01:14:52,720 --> 01:14:55,159
a long thing we've advocated for on the show. I

1394
01:14:55,199 --> 01:14:59,760
know we all advocate it in practice, tell children the truth.

1395
01:15:00,439 --> 01:15:04,880
None of the adults except Keys tell Elliott the fucking truth.

1396
01:15:05,560 --> 01:15:09,239
In this entire film. Mom doesn't tell the truth necessarily

1397
01:15:09,279 --> 01:15:12,880
about what's happened with Dad and what's happening with them,

1398
01:15:13,039 --> 01:15:18,239
or even fully acknowledge what's going on once she's completely

1399
01:15:18,319 --> 01:15:22,359
overwhelmed by all that's happening. But we do see Keys

1400
01:15:22,359 --> 01:15:25,079
could be an older adult Elliott like this is this

1401
01:15:25,159 --> 01:15:27,159
is what adulthood does to us. It shows you the

1402
01:15:27,199 --> 01:15:29,680
truth of the world, the childhood wonder and connection of like,

1403
01:15:30,399 --> 01:15:34,079
but all of this feels okay, So it's okay, and

1404
01:15:34,119 --> 01:15:40,119
adult's gonna be like yeah, maybe, But I feel like

1405
01:15:40,640 --> 01:15:42,920
they didn't. Movie didn't have to do that. This movie

1406
01:15:42,920 --> 01:15:45,479
did not have to show an adult in that kind

1407
01:15:45,479 --> 01:15:47,720
of position of power and authority focused on is this

1408
01:15:47,760 --> 01:15:50,880
a threat or is this a scientist? Just like it's

1409
01:15:50,880 --> 01:15:53,640
just a validation of my entire life. Here, fuck your feelings.

1410
01:15:53,720 --> 01:15:56,560
I'm gonna explore this scientifically so we know that there's

1411
01:15:56,600 --> 01:15:58,119
life on other planets and I can prove it. Now

1412
01:15:58,119 --> 01:16:00,000
I'm gonna be famous because we caught.

1413
01:16:01,359 --> 01:16:05,239
Speaker 3: He doesn't do that. He takes care of Elliott's feelings. Well,

1414
01:16:05,279 --> 01:16:08,920
I think Spielberg does what I feel like. What Spielberg does.

1415
01:16:08,960 --> 01:16:10,680
Speaker 1: I think in all of his movies that our kid

1416
01:16:10,840 --> 01:16:17,039
focused is respecting children and respecting their worldview and respecting

1417
01:16:17,079 --> 01:16:23,640
their opinions and their experiences. And I think what I

1418
01:16:23,720 --> 01:16:27,439
like about that exchange is not so even much that

1419
01:16:28,640 --> 01:16:31,000
I hear what you're saying in that Keys is kind

1420
01:16:31,039 --> 01:16:34,000
of a grown up Elliott in the sense of there

1421
01:16:34,039 --> 01:16:37,600
is realities about the world that make us more jaded

1422
01:16:38,039 --> 01:16:42,119
and maybe more cynical sometimes the necessary ways. And also

1423
01:16:42,319 --> 01:16:45,600
I like that he respects Elliott and that he acknowledges

1424
01:16:46,159 --> 01:16:49,680
that there are some things about children that are better

1425
01:16:50,399 --> 01:16:54,319
than adults. When he says I'm glad he found you first,

1426
01:16:54,880 --> 01:16:57,239
I think that's such a powerful line in the movie

1427
01:16:57,800 --> 01:16:59,680
that I really love, and that always makes me like

1428
01:16:59,760 --> 01:17:01,720
kind of tear up. A lot of moments in those

1429
01:17:01,760 --> 01:17:03,640
scenes make me tear up in that part of the movie,

1430
01:17:04,159 --> 01:17:07,840
and in that one because in that moment he's saying like, well, one,

1431
01:17:07,880 --> 01:17:10,239
you took really good care of him, which I think

1432
01:17:10,319 --> 01:17:13,119
is always so powerful for a kid to hear especially

1433
01:17:13,159 --> 01:17:15,800
when the outcome at that point in the movie is

1434
01:17:15,800 --> 01:17:19,039
so bleak that like, you didn't do anything wrong, you

1435
01:17:19,079 --> 01:17:21,239
did a really good job taking care of him, and

1436
01:17:21,279 --> 01:17:25,479
that also like maybe it was good that he found

1437
01:17:26,239 --> 01:17:28,479
a kid with like an open heart, the way that

1438
01:17:28,600 --> 01:17:32,760
kids have more curious open hearts than an adult, who,

1439
01:17:32,840 --> 01:17:35,680
as we see in this movie, maybe would have like

1440
01:17:35,720 --> 01:17:37,439
come at him with a flashlight and like shot him

1441
01:17:37,439 --> 01:17:39,079
in the face, you know what I mean, Or like

1442
01:17:39,119 --> 01:17:41,000
the way that like the adults in this movie are

1443
01:17:41,039 --> 01:17:45,600
seen as more invasive, right, like they literally invade their house,

1444
01:17:45,960 --> 01:17:49,239
they're coming after the kids on their cars, Like the

1445
01:17:49,239 --> 01:17:52,039
way even the scene of them coming over the hell

1446
01:17:52,079 --> 01:17:55,159
over the hill to like quarantine the area. It's just

1447
01:17:55,319 --> 01:17:59,159
very much like ironically, like the adults are the invasive

1448
01:17:59,199 --> 01:18:04,159
species to this world that's been kept pretty chill up

1449
01:18:04,159 --> 01:18:10,079
to this point. And also side note, honestly, I don't

1450
01:18:10,079 --> 01:18:12,079
think anything would have changed for the better or the

1451
01:18:12,119 --> 01:18:15,079
worse if the adults hadn't gotten involved at all, because

1452
01:18:15,119 --> 01:18:20,000
even though et was dying, the scientists didn't save him.

1453
01:18:20,479 --> 01:18:24,239
He only came back to life because his machine did

1454
01:18:24,279 --> 01:18:26,560
work and they did hear and they did come back.

1455
01:18:26,600 --> 01:18:28,399
So if they would have left it all alone. That

1456
01:18:28,520 --> 01:18:30,760
probably would have played out the exact same way in

1457
01:18:30,800 --> 01:18:34,079
Elliott's house, like Et might have. Foe died. Maybe they

1458
01:18:34,119 --> 01:18:35,920
covered up with a blanket. They're like, oh my god,

1459
01:18:36,239 --> 01:18:38,640
oh worse a wreck. But then he comes back alive.

1460
01:18:38,880 --> 01:18:41,680
They land in their backyard or the pass in the metal.

1461
01:18:41,720 --> 01:18:43,279
They take him back there and he goes up to

1462
01:18:43,359 --> 01:18:48,079
him and nothing's damaged, nothing's bad. And I feel like

1463
01:18:48,079 --> 01:18:52,079
a part of the reason why Et wakes up, which

1464
01:18:52,119 --> 01:18:54,600
is also the reason why he got caught. So you know,

1465
01:18:54,640 --> 01:18:56,399
in the very beginning of the movie, when he's running

1466
01:18:56,399 --> 01:18:58,119
through the woods and all of a sudden, his heart

1467
01:18:58,640 --> 01:19:02,439
light comes on because the person at the ship was

1468
01:19:02,439 --> 01:19:04,720
trying to connect to him to let him know his

1469
01:19:04,760 --> 01:19:08,000
time to leave. And that's why I think he gets

1470
01:19:08,039 --> 01:19:11,039
caught by keys, or almost gets caught by keys, initially

1471
01:19:11,239 --> 01:19:14,479
because he can't hide anymore once his heart light is on.

1472
01:19:15,119 --> 01:19:16,640
Speaker 3: And so I think the thing that brought him.

1473
01:19:16,560 --> 01:19:20,479
Speaker 1: Back alive is that they reached him and they got

1474
01:19:20,520 --> 01:19:23,159
his message, and so his light heart started beating. They're

1475
01:19:23,159 --> 01:19:25,079
Bluetooth connected, they're Bluetooth connected.

1476
01:19:25,159 --> 01:19:28,760
Speaker 3: They're paired, they're paired, So anyway, I don't know how

1477
01:19:28,800 --> 01:19:30,239
you all feel about all that part of it.

1478
01:19:30,319 --> 01:19:33,680
Speaker 1: But I think this is what I wish for Keys,

1479
01:19:34,279 --> 01:19:38,079
because even as a kid, I didn't like Keys. You

1480
01:19:38,079 --> 01:19:40,960
know why, because he was nice to Eliot, but he

1481
01:19:41,000 --> 01:19:42,119
was nice to Elliot to get.

1482
01:19:41,960 --> 01:19:43,439
Speaker 3: Information out of him.

1483
01:19:43,960 --> 01:19:45,479
Speaker 1: I did not feel like he was nice to Aliot

1484
01:19:45,520 --> 01:19:47,039
just because he was like, oh, you're like me as

1485
01:19:47,039 --> 01:19:48,600
a little kid. I thought it was being nice to

1486
01:19:48,640 --> 01:19:49,880
him because he's trying to get shit out of the

1487
01:19:49,960 --> 01:19:50,840
information out of him.

1488
01:19:50,840 --> 01:19:52,840
Speaker 3: He was good copping him. Yeah, exactly.

1489
01:19:53,319 --> 01:19:56,039
Speaker 1: And so I have always thought that Keys is the

1490
01:19:56,039 --> 01:19:58,319
bad guy of the film since the first time I

1491
01:19:58,359 --> 01:20:00,640
saw this movie, and I still feel the same way.

1492
01:20:00,840 --> 01:20:03,600
He's the bad guy in terms of he is proof

1493
01:20:03,680 --> 01:20:06,520
that adults can't be Yes, he can be nice to

1494
01:20:06,600 --> 01:20:08,199
him in that moment, but was the only nice to

1495
01:20:08,279 --> 01:20:10,560
him to get information out of him. I've never trusted

1496
01:20:10,600 --> 01:20:13,119
that guy and I'm never gonna trust him. Then, and

1497
01:20:13,159 --> 01:20:16,239
missus Scorpio corner with Hannah.

1498
01:20:15,720 --> 01:20:16,319
Speaker 3: You're welcome.

1499
01:20:17,199 --> 01:20:19,920
Speaker 1: I do feel like I do like the points that

1500
01:20:19,920 --> 01:20:22,880
you're both making about Keys, and yes, he is in

1501
01:20:22,920 --> 01:20:25,960
those moments very kind and very compassionate, and that's nice.

1502
01:20:26,279 --> 01:20:28,239
But like I said, I think he's just trying to

1503
01:20:28,239 --> 01:20:31,439
get information out of Elliott because.

1504
01:20:31,039 --> 01:20:31,960
Speaker 3: He screwed the pooch.

1505
01:20:32,000 --> 01:20:33,560
Speaker 1: He knew he screwed the pooch, and he should have

1506
01:20:33,560 --> 01:20:35,880
fucking said something sooner to Elliott. That's the part that

1507
01:20:35,960 --> 01:20:38,239
I didn't like. What's Hannah is saying is don't get

1508
01:20:38,279 --> 01:20:41,479
complacent in front of Uncle Sam, don't you do it?

1509
01:20:42,319 --> 01:20:43,199
Speaker 3: Yeah?

1510
01:20:43,239 --> 01:20:46,720
Speaker 2: Well, this is great is Ari and Reagan's America at

1511
01:20:46,720 --> 01:20:48,840
this point? I think? So we're at the end of

1512
01:20:48,960 --> 01:20:51,680
Carter and the depending Yeah, yeah.

1513
01:20:51,479 --> 01:20:53,279
Speaker 1: Because I looked up where president was president when I

1514
01:20:53,319 --> 01:20:56,399
was born and it was Carter, So yeah, depending on

1515
01:20:56,439 --> 01:20:57,800
I don't really know us history.

1516
01:20:57,840 --> 01:20:58,600
Speaker 3: I just know that.

1517
01:20:58,840 --> 01:21:00,600
Speaker 2: Depending on where we're at, where e're at, the beginning

1518
01:21:00,640 --> 01:21:02,880
of Reagan or end of Carter was seventy eight to

1519
01:21:02,920 --> 01:21:08,880
eighty two. So yeah, the uh, I think. But looking

1520
01:21:08,920 --> 01:21:11,640
at this like I had a different take on Keys,

1521
01:21:11,680 --> 01:21:14,319
like that all of the adults scared all of us

1522
01:21:14,399 --> 01:21:17,920
kids as kids. But watching it this time, I took

1523
01:21:17,960 --> 01:21:21,720
a minute to watch, like I felt there was a

1524
01:21:22,760 --> 01:21:26,279
curiosity that was getting reawakened in Keys, and he softened

1525
01:21:26,479 --> 01:21:30,039
throughout the film, and by the end he facilitates and

1526
01:21:30,159 --> 01:21:34,199
helps et get home. He didn't facilitate, but he doesn't interfere.

1527
01:21:34,680 --> 01:21:36,920
He stops interfering once they get away.

1528
01:21:38,479 --> 01:21:40,600
Speaker 1: They all show up at the same time. They drive

1529
01:21:40,680 --> 01:21:42,479
him like maniacs, and he's one of them.

1530
01:21:42,680 --> 01:21:47,039
Speaker 2: They do, but they also don't do anything crazy once

1531
01:21:47,079 --> 01:21:50,840
it's clear the ship is there and he's stopping them,

1532
01:21:51,319 --> 01:21:54,039
stopping the rest of the g men, as it were.

1533
01:21:54,079 --> 01:21:59,680
But looking at the importance of how adults responding to

1534
01:21:59,760 --> 01:22:04,039
kids kind of coming back and remembering that kids don't

1535
01:22:04,159 --> 01:22:08,319
know everything that adults know, and they're not capable of it.

1536
01:22:08,399 --> 01:22:10,880
But the more you start explaining to things, the easier

1537
01:22:10,920 --> 01:22:15,239
it is for kids to digest and understand. And even

1538
01:22:15,279 --> 01:22:18,079
though Keys has you know, it looks like he's in

1539
01:22:18,119 --> 01:22:20,960
his fifties, maybe mid to late fifties.

1540
01:22:21,119 --> 01:22:22,319
Speaker 3: He's probably twenty nine.

1541
01:22:22,319 --> 01:22:25,520
Speaker 1: He's probably supposed to be thirty eighties exactly Exeah.

1542
01:22:25,520 --> 01:22:29,439
Speaker 2: I mean, if you want to be depressed, look at

1543
01:22:29,439 --> 01:22:30,279
the cast of Cheers.

1544
01:22:30,359 --> 01:22:31,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, they're probably thirty.

1545
01:22:31,359 --> 01:22:34,479
Speaker 1: Two, but no, he's probably he's probably the ages on

1546
01:22:34,600 --> 01:22:36,399
Cheers are crazy, but I bet you he's probably in

1547
01:22:36,479 --> 01:22:39,600
his late thirties, early forties. And I do wonder I

1548
01:22:39,920 --> 01:22:41,560
think what I'm getting out of this is how I

1549
01:22:41,600 --> 01:22:43,760
feel like how you think of Keys as almost like

1550
01:22:43,840 --> 01:22:47,119
a war shock test for where you're coming at personality

1551
01:22:47,119 --> 01:22:50,760
wise and maybe your own point of view, because because

1552
01:22:50,760 --> 01:22:52,760
I do vibe with what you're saying, and because also

1553
01:22:52,800 --> 01:22:54,880
but also how I've sort of read Keys, that speech

1554
01:22:54,880 --> 01:22:57,399
he gives or that little TALKI ass Elliott is almost

1555
01:22:57,439 --> 01:23:01,159
like and maybe I'm just my Warshop test projecting is

1556
01:23:01,199 --> 01:23:03,800
like almost like Spielberg kind of saying like this is

1557
01:23:03,840 --> 01:23:07,199
a cautionary tale about growing up. Like when you're growing up,

1558
01:23:07,640 --> 01:23:10,239
you start as an Elliott, and if you aren't careful,

1559
01:23:10,760 --> 01:23:15,560
your interest will become more like predatory the way that

1560
01:23:16,680 --> 01:23:18,520
or more like you've lost your way a little bit,

1561
01:23:18,560 --> 01:23:21,560
like like he doesn't have that whimsy anymore, or he's

1562
01:23:21,600 --> 01:23:24,119
getting it back and talking about this, but the curiosity

1563
01:23:24,119 --> 01:23:25,039
becomes more.

1564
01:23:26,880 --> 01:23:31,560
Speaker 3: Dogged and or fear based and cynical, yees, cynical.

1565
01:23:32,239 --> 01:23:32,479
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1566
01:23:32,479 --> 01:23:33,720
Speaker 3: I think that's a really good point.

1567
01:23:33,720 --> 01:23:36,119
Speaker 1: And I know that a part of what Steven Spielberg

1568
01:23:36,239 --> 01:23:40,319
usually does is have some there's some adult who is

1569
01:23:40,359 --> 01:23:42,760
actually paying attention to the children. There is some adult

1570
01:23:42,800 --> 01:23:44,960
who knows how to speak to them and knows how

1571
01:23:44,960 --> 01:23:47,239
to connect with them, but also an adult who has

1572
01:23:47,239 --> 01:23:52,039
awareness that they are no longer a child. And that's fine,

1573
01:23:52,359 --> 01:23:57,319
but again, get fucked Keys. I'll stop talking about him now.

1574
01:23:57,439 --> 01:24:03,479
Speaker 2: Thank you, Scorpio. But looking at I looked at up

1575
01:24:03,479 --> 01:24:08,239
Peter Code. Peter Coyote was forty during the filming of this.

1576
01:24:08,760 --> 01:24:12,720
Speaker 1: Is that Keys, I'm guessing yes, okay, Ages, I'm so

1577
01:24:12,760 --> 01:24:13,439
good at ages.

1578
01:24:13,560 --> 01:24:15,960
Speaker 3: Peter Coyote is a dope name. I will back him

1579
01:24:16,039 --> 01:24:19,439
up on that, Peter Coyote. That's cool with that face.

1580
01:24:20,159 --> 01:24:22,119
Speaker 1: Sure, I don't mind him. Actually, I think it's kind

1581
01:24:22,119 --> 01:24:23,880
of handsome. Don't cancel me.

1582
01:24:24,520 --> 01:24:29,760
Speaker 2: But yeah, that's I think recognizing that there is a

1583
01:24:29,760 --> 01:24:32,560
lot of softening of the adult's mom is clearly shown

1584
01:24:32,600 --> 01:24:36,760
as kind of disconnected, kind of preoccupied. And yeah that

1585
01:24:36,920 --> 01:24:43,159
Keys is shown as cynical and focused in like scientific

1586
01:24:43,279 --> 01:24:47,680
and detached. I guess scientifically detached. Professionally detached is where

1587
01:24:47,680 --> 01:24:51,920
I put him. He's on his mission, but he softens

1588
01:24:52,199 --> 01:24:56,720
and mom softens and becomes mom. She's holding her kids,

1589
01:24:57,039 --> 01:25:00,920
she's guiding them, and then you know, the Keys gives

1590
01:25:01,119 --> 01:25:03,359
Elliott's like, do you need a minute alone with him?

1591
01:25:03,399 --> 01:25:06,399
To talk to him? Like a funeral director would not

1592
01:25:06,560 --> 01:25:08,760
like a scientist. Science has been like, yep, wrap it up,

1593
01:25:08,840 --> 01:25:12,079
he's dead. But he didn't. He didn't.

1594
01:25:13,039 --> 01:25:13,520
Speaker 3: He did.

1595
01:25:13,640 --> 01:25:15,479
Speaker 1: He did from that chance, but you know why, because

1596
01:25:15,479 --> 01:25:17,039
he wanted to see if something happened with E.

1597
01:25:17,159 --> 01:25:19,399
Speaker 3: T while he was talking to him.

1598
01:25:21,279 --> 01:25:21,720
Speaker 1: I don't know.

1599
01:25:22,880 --> 01:25:24,279
Speaker 3: I don't take that. I don't care.

1600
01:25:24,479 --> 01:25:26,960
Speaker 1: That's what I don't care.

1601
01:25:29,960 --> 01:25:31,640
Speaker 2: That was kindness, Hannah, and that was.

1602
01:25:31,600 --> 01:25:34,640
Speaker 3: Softening because here's one thing I think is true.

1603
01:25:34,760 --> 01:25:35,720
Speaker 2: They thought he was dead.

1604
01:25:36,720 --> 01:25:37,399
Speaker 3: I don't think.

1605
01:25:37,600 --> 01:25:40,520
Speaker 1: I think what this movie is showing is that adults

1606
01:25:40,560 --> 01:25:44,279
really don't know what's going on and through through the

1607
01:25:44,319 --> 01:25:46,039
mom in a very literal sense. But I think like

1608
01:25:46,119 --> 01:25:49,000
Et is like a metaphor of that in that I

1609
01:25:49,039 --> 01:25:52,319
think they think he's dead because the adults don't really

1610
01:25:52,399 --> 01:25:55,800
know what's going on. They're not connected on the same

1611
01:25:55,800 --> 01:26:00,840
wavelength that a child would be to Et because Et

1612
01:26:01,159 --> 01:26:03,840
is from an empathy based culture.

1613
01:26:04,159 --> 01:26:06,439
Speaker 3: And so we can talk more about that after this break.

1614
01:26:06,760 --> 01:26:10,800
Speaker 2: There's no accidents. In Spielberg movies, they go through painstaking

1615
01:26:10,840 --> 01:26:15,720
amounts of detail to show us the cognitive connection between

1616
01:26:15,840 --> 01:26:20,039
Et and Elliott, breaking, to show that they understand. The

1617
01:26:20,119 --> 01:26:24,880
scientists understand how different ET's biology is and that he

1618
01:26:25,359 --> 01:26:31,039
is dead dead dead capital D dead. According to their science,

1619
01:26:31,560 --> 01:26:34,039
he is dead. So the adults are assuming their science

1620
01:26:34,079 --> 01:26:35,319
now has shown them no.

1621
01:26:35,479 --> 01:26:35,760
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1622
01:26:35,840 --> 01:26:39,039
Speaker 1: I think that's an example of like how adults are

1623
01:26:39,079 --> 01:26:43,279
missing something important because they're not thinking that way. They're

1624
01:26:43,319 --> 01:26:46,920
stuck in their rigidity of adulthood, which is definitely something

1625
01:26:46,960 --> 01:26:48,880
that Spielberg is always pointing out. I feel like in

1626
01:26:48,920 --> 01:26:49,439
his films.

1627
01:26:50,640 --> 01:26:52,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, usually he used Robin to do it, though, with

1628
01:26:53,039 --> 01:26:59,000
you know, Getting or Sam Neil. I guess what Robin

1629
01:26:59,039 --> 01:27:00,560
Williams like can hook?

1630
01:27:01,239 --> 01:27:04,800
Speaker 1: Oh wow, Brittany I did notice think about the hook

1631
01:27:04,840 --> 01:27:06,520
thing when she's written Peter Pan and that was kind

1632
01:27:06,520 --> 01:27:09,439
of narrating a scene. I was like, Oh, he's been

1633
01:27:09,479 --> 01:27:11,399
wanted to do a Peter Pan story for a while.

1634
01:27:12,520 --> 01:27:17,000
Speaker 2: But showing keys kind of like letting Elliet have a

1635
01:27:17,039 --> 01:27:19,039
moment with them, knowing how close they were and that

1636
01:27:19,039 --> 01:27:21,319
that got severed, and that he's witnessing death maybe for

1637
01:27:21,319 --> 01:27:23,560
the first time in his life. Are think what we're

1638
01:27:23,560 --> 01:27:27,319
seeing is like an opportunity to be compassionate. And I

1639
01:27:27,800 --> 01:27:30,159
don't think at that point he was thinking anything would happen.

1640
01:27:30,199 --> 01:27:32,039
I think he's just trying to take care of that

1641
01:27:32,159 --> 01:27:35,359
kid because he felt connected to the kid. So we're

1642
01:27:35,399 --> 01:27:39,479
seeing the impact of ET's empathy based connection. We're seeing

1643
01:27:39,800 --> 01:27:42,479
oh right, if humans remember to connect to each other,

1644
01:27:43,199 --> 01:27:47,439
we can do kindness things. There's all of that in

1645
01:27:47,479 --> 01:27:51,079
the filmmaking magic of that that being shown in metaphor

1646
01:27:51,119 --> 01:27:53,439
to us there and then that's all I have to

1647
01:27:53,439 --> 01:27:54,239
say about that.

1648
01:27:55,520 --> 01:27:57,039
Speaker 3: All right, let's take a break here and we'll be

1649
01:27:57,119 --> 01:27:57,560
right back.

1650
01:27:58,840 --> 01:28:01,640
Speaker 1: So this is more of the when we like to

1651
01:28:01,720 --> 01:28:06,520
go on our little fun hypothetical psychology introduced into wackiness

1652
01:28:06,560 --> 01:28:09,760
sections that we do occasionally on the podcast. Because my

1653
01:28:09,920 --> 01:28:15,079
brain was really thinking about how obviously a key component

1654
01:28:15,119 --> 01:28:17,960
to this movie is the fact that Et communicates to

1655
01:28:17,960 --> 01:28:24,920
Elliott via emotions and empathy, which I some I don't

1656
01:28:24,960 --> 01:28:26,640
know if I want to say that like interchangeably, because

1657
01:28:26,720 --> 01:28:29,079
when he says like he's feeling his feelings, but it

1658
01:28:29,119 --> 01:28:31,279
more seems like you're just like aware of each other

1659
01:28:31,960 --> 01:28:37,199
in a way that erodes individualism, you know, because there's

1660
01:28:37,199 --> 01:28:38,880
the point in the movie when he starts to say,

1661
01:28:38,920 --> 01:28:44,359
wee Elliott instead of I or him. We are fine,

1662
01:28:44,640 --> 01:28:47,760
We're not We're sick, you know, like he is. It

1663
01:28:47,800 --> 01:28:51,439
made me really think about how that would impact us

1664
01:28:51,479 --> 01:28:56,359
psychologically if we did think collectively like that and how

1665
01:28:56,960 --> 01:28:59,800
I don't know it like really made my brain think

1666
01:28:59,800 --> 01:29:00,359
really hard.

1667
01:29:01,000 --> 01:29:02,399
Speaker 3: It made me really explore that.

1668
01:29:02,399 --> 01:29:06,199
Speaker 1: Idea and then just thinking about us talking obviously, this

1669
01:29:06,279 --> 01:29:09,239
is a big part of the movie, right of this

1670
01:29:09,319 --> 01:29:11,920
idea that they are feeling each other's feelings and connected

1671
01:29:11,960 --> 01:29:15,680
in that way, like what it would do to your psyche?

1672
01:29:16,319 --> 01:29:19,760
And I wonder if it works easier on a kid

1673
01:29:19,800 --> 01:29:23,680
because kids are also so much more flexible in what

1674
01:29:23,720 --> 01:29:28,319
they believe to be possible and more open hearted than

1675
01:29:28,359 --> 01:29:30,840
adults are. That's what I love about working with kids.

1676
01:29:31,159 --> 01:29:35,720
They're very honest, even when they're lying. It's they lie

1677
01:29:35,720 --> 01:29:37,640
in a very honest way where they can't they don't

1678
01:29:37,640 --> 01:29:41,720
lie very well, or they lie very obviously, And they're

1679
01:29:41,760 --> 01:29:46,079
just more receptive to ideas, And it would I think

1680
01:29:46,119 --> 01:29:48,239
it'd be really interesting if we did see a version

1681
01:29:48,279 --> 01:29:52,600
of this where et tried to connect with an adult,

1682
01:29:53,359 --> 01:29:54,479
Like how different would that be?

1683
01:29:54,640 --> 01:29:55,199
Speaker 3: Would that look?

1684
01:29:55,279 --> 01:29:55,359
Speaker 1: Like?

1685
01:29:56,279 --> 01:29:58,399
Speaker 2: I don't think an adult would ever have been safe

1686
01:29:58,520 --> 01:30:01,000
enough or open enough. It had been too scared and

1687
01:30:01,039 --> 01:30:07,159
overwhelmed than not connecting to oh you're also scared. Maybe

1688
01:30:07,199 --> 01:30:11,560
if I give you food. I think about how many adults,

1689
01:30:12,039 --> 01:30:14,600
but adults connect to ET. I would you?

1690
01:30:15,239 --> 01:30:17,039
Speaker 1: I mean, of course I would like to think I would,

1691
01:30:17,520 --> 01:30:21,640
But I'm also a child therapist who thinks these thoughts already.

1692
01:30:22,520 --> 01:30:25,720
And also he is like, what goes up to my

1693
01:30:26,039 --> 01:30:27,760
fucking thigh?

1694
01:30:27,960 --> 01:30:28,520
Speaker 3: You know what I mean?

1695
01:30:28,680 --> 01:30:31,039
Speaker 1: Like it might be different if ET was the same

1696
01:30:31,079 --> 01:30:32,119
size as me.

1697
01:30:32,479 --> 01:30:34,680
Speaker 2: Unless he goes directly up to your belly button and

1698
01:30:34,720 --> 01:30:36,800
it happens to have a second mouth, like the alien

1699
01:30:36,880 --> 01:30:41,039
queen you don't know, Yeah, see right in your belly button.

1700
01:30:41,039 --> 01:30:43,600
Speaker 1: But I think if like a little a little creature

1701
01:30:43,680 --> 01:30:47,560
was like like screaming and looked really freaked out, I

1702
01:30:47,600 --> 01:30:49,720
think I'd just be more like, please, don't be an animal

1703
01:30:49,640 --> 01:30:52,079
that would bite me would be my first thought. But

1704
01:30:52,119 --> 01:30:54,000
then if they imprinted on me, I don't know, I'd

1705
01:30:54,039 --> 01:30:57,039
like to. I want to believe in myself that ET

1706
01:30:57,279 --> 01:31:00,880
could imprint upon me if needed. I want to believe

1707
01:31:00,920 --> 01:31:05,640
in that version of myself. And so now we're going

1708
01:31:05,680 --> 01:31:09,920
to talk about treatment today. I am just going to

1709
01:31:09,920 --> 01:31:13,960
be talking a little bit about co parenting in divorce

1710
01:31:14,199 --> 01:31:19,640
situations or separation experiences. And part of the reason why

1711
01:31:19,680 --> 01:31:23,479
I wanted to talk about. This is because being in

1712
01:31:23,520 --> 01:31:26,359
the field for ten years, I work with a lot

1713
01:31:26,399 --> 01:31:32,039
of people who are changing their relationship, ending their relationship,

1714
01:31:33,640 --> 01:31:37,960
just doing different things that affect their children, And I

1715
01:31:38,079 --> 01:31:41,720
feel like one of the really big missed aspects of

1716
01:31:41,760 --> 01:31:46,960
this is, no matter what happens, you're both going to

1717
01:31:46,960 --> 01:31:50,920
be the parents to these kids until you're both dead, okay,

1718
01:31:52,079 --> 01:31:55,079
which means you have to find a way to act

1719
01:31:55,199 --> 01:31:59,000
like a fucking grown up and co parent with someone

1720
01:31:59,039 --> 01:32:03,239
else because it's about the children and not about whatever

1721
01:32:03,279 --> 01:32:07,439
bullshit you and your partner had going on before when

1722
01:32:07,439 --> 01:32:09,680
you had kids. Now that you're not together, it's all

1723
01:32:09,720 --> 01:32:12,159
about the children. How are you going to manage that?

1724
01:32:12,560 --> 01:32:15,119
How are you going to help them adjust? How are

1725
01:32:15,159 --> 01:32:17,119
you going to make sure that the kids have room

1726
01:32:17,159 --> 01:32:18,960
and space to talk about what they need to talk

1727
01:32:19,000 --> 01:32:21,880
about and not feel the way that Mike and Elliott do,

1728
01:32:22,319 --> 01:32:24,279
which is where they have to protect their mom from

1729
01:32:24,359 --> 01:32:26,880
information they know about their dad, because, believe it or not,

1730
01:32:27,159 --> 01:32:30,560
the other parent will teach them everything they need to

1731
01:32:30,600 --> 01:32:34,239
know about what kind of person they are. You trying

1732
01:32:34,279 --> 01:32:37,119
to instill that in the children ahead of time is

1733
01:32:37,119 --> 01:32:39,640
going to have an impact on your relationship with your

1734
01:32:39,720 --> 01:32:41,920
children more than it's going to have an effect on

1735
01:32:41,960 --> 01:32:47,479
their relationship with your ex partner. So something that I

1736
01:32:47,600 --> 01:32:50,760
want to just make clear, and also something that I

1737
01:32:50,880 --> 01:32:54,479
really experienced as a kid growing up just having parents again,

1738
01:32:54,640 --> 01:32:59,199
my parents are also almost like they're so effed up

1739
01:32:59,239 --> 01:33:02,079
that it's like hard to even it's hard to use

1740
01:33:02,119 --> 01:33:04,680
them as a comparison sometimes honestly because of how kind

1741
01:33:04,680 --> 01:33:09,119
of unwell people they are. And I had two parents

1742
01:33:09,640 --> 01:33:12,359
who were both bad mouthing each other on a regular

1743
01:33:12,399 --> 01:33:15,319
basis to us kids, putting us in a place where

1744
01:33:15,319 --> 01:33:17,399
now we had to decide how we felt about that

1745
01:33:17,560 --> 01:33:21,720
parent in front of the other parent. So just make

1746
01:33:21,800 --> 01:33:25,319
sure that even if you're done having a relationship with

1747
01:33:25,359 --> 01:33:28,439
this person that you made children with, you will still

1748
01:33:28,479 --> 01:33:30,239
have to find a way to get along with them.

1749
01:33:30,640 --> 01:33:33,319
It is still your job to help support the children

1750
01:33:33,800 --> 01:33:37,560
as they grow up. And yes, past eighteen, all that

1751
01:33:37,560 --> 01:33:39,920
shit about oh it's over when they're eighteen, you are

1752
01:33:39,960 --> 01:33:42,279
so fucking wrong. You know when it's over when you're dead.

1753
01:33:43,039 --> 01:33:47,720
That's the real answer. So please have some insight and

1754
01:33:47,760 --> 01:33:51,159
some awareness that you are pulling the rug out from

1755
01:33:51,199 --> 01:33:54,079
underneath your children's feet. And if you can't figure out

1756
01:33:54,119 --> 01:33:56,520
a way to co parent, you are going to have

1757
01:33:56,600 --> 01:33:58,960
a really big impact on the way that your children

1758
01:33:59,039 --> 01:34:03,399
see relationship, the way that they communic about communicate about relationships,

1759
01:34:03,399 --> 01:34:07,159
and their expectations when they're in relationships with a partner,

1760
01:34:07,399 --> 01:34:10,000
and how they would treat their own children. So please

1761
01:34:10,520 --> 01:34:15,279
don't be a fucking asshole, because kids really need time

1762
01:34:15,359 --> 01:34:18,359
and space to have this big adjustment that we're talking

1763
01:34:18,359 --> 01:34:22,760
about that Mike and Gerty and Elliott all have. That's

1764
01:34:22,760 --> 01:34:26,800
all I have to say about treatment and to jump

1765
01:34:26,800 --> 01:34:29,520
on that. What I wanted to tell people too, is

1766
01:34:29,560 --> 01:34:33,880
that there is family therapy you can do that's like

1767
01:34:33,920 --> 01:34:36,760
co parenting, Like I've worked with co parents where I'm

1768
01:34:36,840 --> 01:34:39,079
just working with them, I'm not working with the kids,

1769
01:34:39,119 --> 01:34:42,359
so it's like family therapy without the kids there. And

1770
01:34:42,439 --> 01:34:45,960
you can also do like mediation that's more therapeutically and

1771
01:34:46,039 --> 01:34:49,960
that's more therapeutic in nature to kind of help mediate

1772
01:34:50,039 --> 01:34:53,720
what Hannah's talking about, which is if there is bad

1773
01:34:53,800 --> 01:34:57,319
blood because of what happened between the two of you,

1774
01:34:57,439 --> 01:35:01,359
or you can't even maybe have like a conversation without

1775
01:35:01,399 --> 01:35:04,560
it falling apart emotionally between the two of you, that

1776
01:35:04,640 --> 01:35:07,159
there are people who do our job that can do

1777
01:35:07,199 --> 01:35:10,560
it in a more structured way that isn't even necessarily

1778
01:35:11,239 --> 01:35:14,239
emotional in nature, like you don't have to get into

1779
01:35:13,760 --> 01:35:17,159
the what force about your relationship to each other and

1780
01:35:17,199 --> 01:35:20,119
like making yourself good with each other necessarily. They can

1781
01:35:20,199 --> 01:35:23,560
be more how do we run the business of our

1782
01:35:23,640 --> 01:35:28,359
family civilly as like and when I've worked with parents

1783
01:35:28,439 --> 01:35:31,039
like that, it is more about like how do I

1784
01:35:31,079 --> 01:35:32,479
can we get on the same page with how we're

1785
01:35:32,560 --> 01:35:36,079
viewing our relationship to each other and what it means

1786
01:35:36,159 --> 01:35:40,960
to be healing our relationship as a couple versus as

1787
01:35:41,000 --> 01:35:45,520
co parents, and which is different than also friends, like

1788
01:35:45,600 --> 01:35:47,359
do we want to be friends and co parents? Do

1789
01:35:47,399 --> 01:35:50,079
we just want to be business partners? Which, depending on

1790
01:35:50,079 --> 01:35:53,199
how the relationship ends, it can be different, Like they

1791
01:35:53,199 --> 01:35:56,319
can have different opinions too, Like I've worked with divorce

1792
01:35:56,399 --> 01:35:58,279
code parents where one of them wanted to be friends

1793
01:35:58,640 --> 01:36:00,880
and the other one was like, I'm not interesting because

1794
01:36:00,880 --> 01:36:05,640
of how we ended our relationship what happened. And my

1795
01:36:05,760 --> 01:36:11,199
job in those situations has been to kind of support

1796
01:36:11,199 --> 01:36:14,079
both the parents, but both support the parent who's asking

1797
01:36:14,119 --> 01:36:16,279
for that, but also support the other print understanding like

1798
01:36:16,800 --> 01:36:18,720
it's Okay, if they don't want to be your friend

1799
01:36:18,800 --> 01:36:22,159
right now, you can still be friendly and how you

1800
01:36:22,199 --> 01:36:25,520
parent your kids. But for my treatment, I was thinking

1801
01:36:25,560 --> 01:36:29,119
about working with the mom, and really all I wanted

1802
01:36:29,119 --> 01:36:31,039
to articulate with the mom is I think she would

1803
01:36:31,039 --> 01:36:33,239
just do great with just probably good old fashioned talk therapy.

1804
01:36:33,439 --> 01:36:36,359
Just having someone another adult that she can just talk

1805
01:36:36,399 --> 01:36:38,600
about Mexico, with all those moments where she mutters about

1806
01:36:38,600 --> 01:36:41,560
Mexico in the movie, would have been a great if

1807
01:36:41,560 --> 01:36:44,199
she'd had an outlet like therapy. Maybe she could go

1808
01:36:44,279 --> 01:36:45,439
to therapy and just be like.

1809
01:36:45,399 --> 01:36:47,399
Speaker 3: He's going to Betico, Da da da.

1810
01:36:47,479 --> 01:36:49,359
Speaker 1: So I think she needs an outlet one And then

1811
01:36:49,800 --> 01:36:52,840
but two, I wanted to just put a reminder out

1812
01:36:52,880 --> 01:36:56,319
there that there's no like coping skill I could teach

1813
01:36:56,319 --> 01:37:01,079
her that will overcompensate for her lack of support system.

1814
01:37:01,159 --> 01:37:03,000
So I think what I would also want to figure

1815
01:37:03,039 --> 01:37:07,279
out with her early in our work together is what

1816
01:37:07,439 --> 01:37:11,760
your support system look like? Could it be better? And

1817
01:37:11,800 --> 01:37:13,399
what does that look like? Because also going back to

1818
01:37:13,439 --> 01:37:17,079
what we were saying about how divorce was maybe more

1819
01:37:17,119 --> 01:37:20,840
common but still pretty socially taboo at that time, or

1820
01:37:20,880 --> 01:37:23,560
it was still more like that's your family's business kind

1821
01:37:23,600 --> 01:37:28,359
of thing is is she letting people help her because

1822
01:37:29,119 --> 01:37:31,199
she's trying to seem fine, you know what I mean?

1823
01:37:31,199 --> 01:37:32,439
Speaker 3: Which I think would be really real.

1824
01:37:33,079 --> 01:37:35,279
Speaker 1: Is their family that's far away that she needs to

1825
01:37:35,319 --> 01:37:36,720
ask for help with?

1826
01:37:36,840 --> 01:37:38,239
Speaker 3: Does somebody to come out and help them?

1827
01:37:38,600 --> 01:37:40,720
Speaker 1: So I think I just want to put out there

1828
01:37:40,760 --> 01:37:43,800
too that like, you can't out therapize a lack of

1829
01:37:43,800 --> 01:37:46,119
a support system and a lack of resources. And so

1830
01:37:46,199 --> 01:37:48,359
I think for her, part of what I want to

1831
01:37:48,399 --> 01:37:50,439
work on her with is like, do you have friends,

1832
01:37:50,520 --> 01:37:52,760
do you have family? Are there people that you could

1833
01:37:52,840 --> 01:37:55,159
be sharing more with that you're not that you could

1834
01:37:55,199 --> 01:37:58,359
be asking for more help from. Is it okay if

1835
01:37:58,399 --> 01:38:01,159
you need to put your kids in latch key? Are

1836
01:38:01,199 --> 01:38:03,720
you not using some resources like that because you feel

1837
01:38:03,760 --> 01:38:07,199
a type of way about it. So that's something i'd

1838
01:38:07,199 --> 01:38:08,960
want to hammer out with her first, as well as

1839
01:38:08,960 --> 01:38:10,600
giving her a place to just kind of like talk

1840
01:38:10,640 --> 01:38:13,159
and cry. I don't think she needs more than that

1841
01:38:13,279 --> 01:38:15,960
in therapy. We'd have to hit those two things and

1842
01:38:15,960 --> 01:38:17,560
then go from there. But that's what I would do

1843
01:38:17,600 --> 01:38:18,079
with the mom.

1844
01:38:19,199 --> 01:38:23,199
Speaker 2: So as I was watching this, realizing that there's a

1845
01:38:23,239 --> 01:38:26,159
lot of people who are probably going to need therapy.

1846
01:38:26,199 --> 01:38:31,000
I also like honed in on Mom, and the trauma

1847
01:38:31,039 --> 01:38:35,520
therapist's side of my brain and grief therapist side of

1848
01:38:35,560 --> 01:38:38,479
my brain was looking at This is a person who

1849
01:38:38,520 --> 01:38:44,359
is grieving and is stuck and clearly the impact of

1850
01:38:44,439 --> 01:38:49,319
what is happening to her and how it happened. There

1851
01:38:49,399 --> 01:38:55,319
is a running subtext in her story here. She has

1852
01:38:55,319 --> 01:38:58,279
not had time or space. And while I agree that

1853
01:38:58,319 --> 01:39:01,840
traditional talk therapy is a method that would certainly work

1854
01:39:01,840 --> 01:39:04,399
for her, time and space to talk to another adult

1855
01:39:04,439 --> 01:39:07,520
who's there to show to let her be cared for

1856
01:39:08,199 --> 01:39:12,279
is huge, and it may not require the specialty things,

1857
01:39:12,279 --> 01:39:18,359
but space, empathy, support, non judgment, basic person centered skills

1858
01:39:18,399 --> 01:39:22,520
would go really far for someone like her. However, the

1859
01:39:22,560 --> 01:39:26,680
trauma therapist side in me wonders with the impact of

1860
01:39:27,880 --> 01:39:33,640
an alien dying on your floor and your child also

1861
01:39:33,880 --> 01:39:37,000
almost dying because it is psychically connected to this alien,

1862
01:39:37,119 --> 01:39:41,560
You being helpless while also having to care, especially for

1863
01:39:41,600 --> 01:39:47,600
your youngest child. That would cause some split brain processing

1864
01:39:48,079 --> 01:39:53,800
which she's already stuck in. So this is grounds for

1865
01:39:54,399 --> 01:39:57,199
complex trauma to exist. And what I mean by split

1866
01:39:57,239 --> 01:40:01,159
brain processing is that when we are are overwhelmed by

1867
01:40:01,159 --> 01:40:05,239
the circumstances, our survival side of our brain, which is

1868
01:40:05,239 --> 01:40:09,239
on the right your amygdalan olympic system turn on to

1869
01:40:09,680 --> 01:40:13,039
respond to threat, and you're going to do whatever it

1870
01:40:13,119 --> 01:40:15,479
is that occurs to you is the most likely thing

1871
01:40:15,800 --> 01:40:19,279
to handle the situation. Clearly, she could not help Elliott.

1872
01:40:19,359 --> 01:40:22,399
She had doctors there, they had people there to help her,

1873
01:40:22,439 --> 01:40:24,720
like she was trying to comfort him and be with him,

1874
01:40:24,760 --> 01:40:28,880
but she couldn't do anything. But she could help Gertie,

1875
01:40:30,159 --> 01:40:32,720
so she did. She did what she could do. But

1876
01:40:32,840 --> 01:40:35,760
the mom's side of her that's also attached to her

1877
01:40:35,800 --> 01:40:38,640
other child that couldn't do anything to help him, is

1878
01:40:38,680 --> 01:40:42,159
going to struggle with that later when she has time.

1879
01:40:42,600 --> 01:40:46,760
Split brain processing means that survival side I mentioned is

1880
01:40:46,840 --> 01:40:50,239
on and responding, but your logical side is recording at

1881
01:40:50,239 --> 01:40:53,520
the same time. And processing is the word we use

1882
01:40:53,600 --> 01:40:58,079
for when the event is over and those two databases

1883
01:40:58,199 --> 01:41:02,279
try to sync back up, and sometimes that happens all

1884
01:41:02,279 --> 01:41:05,920
by itself with some time. It's why acute stress event

1885
01:41:06,279 --> 01:41:09,520
like this we give people thirty days before we can

1886
01:41:09,560 --> 01:41:14,199
assign them a diagnosis of PTSD. Oftentimes these things resolve,

1887
01:41:14,760 --> 01:41:18,920
especially if the pearson has afforded space to care for themselves,

1888
01:41:19,439 --> 01:41:22,399
a place and a way to debrief and talk about this,

1889
01:41:23,000 --> 01:41:25,399
that their emotions are cared for, that they're given some

1890
01:41:25,520 --> 01:41:28,760
reassurance that they did the best that they could. Because

1891
01:41:29,520 --> 01:41:32,359
our feelings brain is going to know one thing, and

1892
01:41:32,399 --> 01:41:34,439
it knows the truth of what we did and didn't do,

1893
01:41:34,880 --> 01:41:38,560
and our logical brain knows the why. And there's a

1894
01:41:38,560 --> 01:41:42,039
lot of times in therapy like this where the why

1895
01:41:42,239 --> 01:41:45,680
and what we did come really close to seeking up

1896
01:41:45,720 --> 01:41:48,560
and you can feel someone almost buying into like, Hey,

1897
01:41:48,960 --> 01:41:51,920
you did the best you could. You did what you

1898
01:41:51,960 --> 01:41:54,560
could and that was all you could do. It's okay

1899
01:41:54,800 --> 01:41:56,800
that that's all you could do. That that's the truth,

1900
01:41:57,600 --> 01:42:01,000
and they're still going to be liked. Almost get there

1901
01:42:01,000 --> 01:42:04,359
and then yeah, but I didn't go like rush to

1902
01:42:04,399 --> 01:42:06,279
my child's side. I didn't do it. I didn't do that.

1903
01:42:06,600 --> 01:42:08,760
I just didn't do all that I could have possibly

1904
01:42:08,800 --> 01:42:13,399
done under all possible theoretical circumstances. Did there were things

1905
01:42:13,399 --> 01:42:16,600
I didn't do and they know that. In processing, we

1906
01:42:16,640 --> 01:42:19,560
find peace with that, going no, there really wasn't anything

1907
01:42:19,560 --> 01:42:20,920
I could do. I did all that I could do,

1908
01:42:21,119 --> 01:42:24,159
and I'm not a bad person because of that. That's

1909
01:42:24,199 --> 01:42:28,000
just all there was. The emotional side doesn't give a shit,

1910
01:42:28,520 --> 01:42:30,239
and it's like, yeah, you weren't the best mom you

1911
01:42:30,279 --> 01:42:33,720
could be, so you're terrible. So when I am watching her,

1912
01:42:33,840 --> 01:42:37,840
not only is she struggling with whatever happened in her

1913
01:42:38,000 --> 01:42:42,800
marriage where and you know, as we assume, it's quite

1914
01:42:42,840 --> 01:42:46,399
possible that there was some extramarital activity on the side

1915
01:42:46,439 --> 01:42:49,640
of the husband, and that he's moving on awful quick

1916
01:42:49,760 --> 01:42:51,680
and going to a place that maybe she would have

1917
01:42:51,720 --> 01:42:54,199
liked to go because they live in the valley, and

1918
01:42:54,439 --> 01:42:56,880
maybe she wants to crane kick this motherfucker in the

1919
01:42:56,960 --> 01:43:01,319
head like Daniel l Arrusso. But maybe she also really

1920
01:43:01,359 --> 01:43:03,079
would have liked to go on vacation with him when

1921
01:43:03,079 --> 01:43:07,119
they're married to Mexico and do the whole tropical fantasy

1922
01:43:07,159 --> 01:43:10,600
thing because the valley is not that. But she didn't

1923
01:43:10,600 --> 01:43:11,800
get to do that, and now he's doing it with

1924
01:43:11,840 --> 01:43:15,800
another woman, and she's clearly struggling at that. But now

1925
01:43:15,840 --> 01:43:19,600
you combine that trauma and that loss with the trauma

1926
01:43:19,680 --> 01:43:25,880
and loss of possible loss of her child to space disease.

1927
01:43:26,720 --> 01:43:29,960
You can't anticipate respond to protect him from There's nothing

1928
01:43:29,960 --> 01:43:32,960
you can do that is ground for complex trauma because

1929
01:43:33,000 --> 01:43:35,119
there are multiple layers of things going on in an

1930
01:43:35,199 --> 01:43:39,520
already weakened state. So I think, from my point of view,

1931
01:43:40,479 --> 01:43:45,159
exploring that and offering care for mom to kind of

1932
01:43:45,199 --> 01:43:50,560
reconnect her to her resources, do trauma debriefings and then

1933
01:43:50,680 --> 01:43:57,159
work on using EMDR or CPT or somatic experiencing type

1934
01:43:57,199 --> 01:44:01,840
techniques all geared at helping her says whatever she could

1935
01:44:01,880 --> 01:44:07,159
not physically handle feeling, and help her work through all

1936
01:44:07,199 --> 01:44:14,159
of those likely stuck emotions from the horrified, frozen, stuck

1937
01:44:14,239 --> 01:44:16,359
place she was where that was really all she could do.

1938
01:44:16,399 --> 01:44:17,840
The best thing she could do was get out of

1939
01:44:17,840 --> 01:44:20,039
the way, and that's the truth. But the part of

1940
01:44:20,079 --> 01:44:21,680
her that's a mom wants to care for her baby.

1941
01:44:21,720 --> 01:44:24,800
I care for my child needs care too, and how

1942
01:44:25,119 --> 01:44:30,359
permission to have stepped back? So it would take knowing

1943
01:44:30,439 --> 01:44:32,399
Mom's character a bit more to give you an accurate

1944
01:44:32,399 --> 01:44:34,439
answer of what technique would choose, But I would be

1945
01:44:35,199 --> 01:44:41,199
likely floating in and out of techniques helping Mom ground feel,

1946
01:44:41,760 --> 01:44:45,479
reassure her, and help her connect to a way that

1947
01:44:45,520 --> 01:44:49,520
she can feel everything she needs to feel while also

1948
01:44:49,680 --> 01:44:54,880
having any negative thoughts about herself, judgments, shame, and guilt

1949
01:44:55,680 --> 01:44:59,319
resolve so that she can give herself permission to process

1950
01:44:59,359 --> 01:45:01,800
the rest of it without holding on to guilt of

1951
01:45:01,800 --> 01:45:05,520
what she didn't do because she couldn't. So let's take

1952
01:45:05,520 --> 01:45:07,239
a break here and we'll go to final thoughts.

1953
01:45:08,119 --> 01:45:09,760
Speaker 3: Or who wants to go first with final thoughts?

1954
01:45:09,760 --> 01:45:15,479
Speaker 1: I'll go first, and we're back with final thoughts now

1955
01:45:15,520 --> 01:45:16,640
that I turned my microphone on.

1956
01:45:17,960 --> 01:45:21,560
Speaker 3: So I love ET. I've always loved ET.

1957
01:45:21,840 --> 01:45:23,960
Speaker 1: I don't know how old I was when I watched it,

1958
01:45:24,680 --> 01:45:29,039
but a part of watching it today was really I

1959
01:45:29,079 --> 01:45:31,840
invited some of my younger parts to watch it with me,

1960
01:45:32,680 --> 01:45:36,720
just to see, and I felt some like goosebumps at

1961
01:45:36,720 --> 01:45:39,199
different parts that I don't remember feeling that I only

1962
01:45:39,279 --> 01:45:41,760
remember feeling the first time I watched it, So that

1963
01:45:41,920 --> 01:45:45,439
was really fun and interesting. But mostly I just really

1964
01:45:45,720 --> 01:45:49,720
enjoyed the relationship between the siblings, and I love the

1965
01:45:49,760 --> 01:45:53,640
relationship with Elliott and Et. And also as a fun

1966
01:45:53,760 --> 01:45:57,960
silly thing, when I was a baby, I used to

1967
01:45:58,000 --> 01:46:00,680
stretch my neck up like Eat he did, and my

1968
01:46:00,720 --> 01:46:04,479
mom called me Et because I was brown and fuzzy,

1969
01:46:06,399 --> 01:46:07,960
but she said that I would do that. I would

1970
01:46:08,000 --> 01:46:09,800
like stretch my neck up like I was ET, and

1971
01:46:09,800 --> 01:46:10,520
she would call me that.

1972
01:46:13,079 --> 01:46:15,000
Speaker 3: But yeah, so I really love this movie.

1973
01:46:15,159 --> 01:46:19,239
Speaker 1: It's I remember I was very young when I saw

1974
01:46:19,279 --> 01:46:21,159
it the first time for sure, don't even remember how

1975
01:46:21,199 --> 01:46:24,159
old I was, But I love this movie and I

1976
01:46:24,199 --> 01:46:25,640
will definitely watch it again.

1977
01:46:27,079 --> 01:46:31,560
Speaker 2: I haven't watched ET in years, but as I watched

1978
01:46:31,600 --> 01:46:35,359
it just this weekend and introduced my childhood for the

1979
01:46:35,399 --> 01:46:39,119
second time, and she, like her mama, tends to fall

1980
01:46:39,119 --> 01:46:42,279
asleep watching movies sometimes, so we're gonna have to watch

1981
01:46:42,319 --> 01:46:45,960
the rest of it later. But realizing how scary it

1982
01:46:46,079 --> 01:46:50,720
is in the beginning and how how many horror techniques

1983
01:46:50,760 --> 01:46:53,000
of Eelberg used to kind of capture the fear of

1984
01:46:53,039 --> 01:46:57,119
ET really stuck out to me. And then as we evolve,

1985
01:46:57,239 --> 01:47:00,279
watching the growth in all of that, and every thing

1986
01:47:00,359 --> 01:47:02,159
isn't what it seems, and if you can learn to

1987
01:47:02,239 --> 01:47:06,359
approach things with a childlike wonder, you might see something

1988
01:47:06,600 --> 01:47:10,119
different than you thought you were going to. It seems

1989
01:47:10,119 --> 01:47:11,800
to be like really the theme of this movie, and

1990
01:47:11,800 --> 01:47:15,359
that reconnecting to things with heart can really open you

1991
01:47:15,520 --> 01:47:20,079
up to experience the world in a safer, more universal way.

1992
01:47:20,079 --> 01:47:24,399
And realizing that living things all feel fear, feel love,

1993
01:47:24,439 --> 01:47:27,039
feel connection, and know when they're safe and when they're not.

1994
01:47:27,119 --> 01:47:31,079
And if you can create safety, you can find love

1995
01:47:31,119 --> 01:47:33,159
and connection in a way that you'd never find before.

1996
01:47:33,319 --> 01:47:35,479
If you ever owned a pet, you'll understand that real quick.

1997
01:47:35,920 --> 01:47:38,319
I don't speak the same language, but you've got to

1998
01:47:38,359 --> 01:47:40,840
convince each other that this is a bond and this

1999
01:47:40,920 --> 01:47:43,760
is our best chance for survival. I think this movie

2000
01:47:43,800 --> 01:47:48,279
did that in beautiful ways, and it's why it's even

2001
01:47:48,319 --> 01:47:51,840
though it's a movie with puppets and weird goofy hands

2002
01:47:51,920 --> 01:47:56,680
and some really scary sequences, people have taken to it

2003
01:47:56,760 --> 01:47:58,119
for a long time, and I think it's going to

2004
01:47:58,159 --> 01:48:00,920
continue to enter because it's a special film and the

2005
01:48:01,239 --> 01:48:05,119
Star Wars nerd in me very much enjoys all the references,

2006
01:48:05,239 --> 01:48:08,560
especially et looking at the kid that's Yoda, Justice Yoda

2007
01:48:08,600 --> 01:48:15,000
and goes like home. And then for later because Spielberg

2008
01:48:15,039 --> 01:48:18,880
and Lucas are friends and frequently collaborate, even officially or unofficially,

2009
01:48:19,399 --> 01:48:24,720
that later on, apparently Spielberg directed some of the Yoda

2010
01:48:24,800 --> 01:48:30,399
versus Palpatine fight in episode three, and we see et

2011
01:48:30,680 --> 01:48:33,880
species show up in Star Wars in a couple of points.

2012
01:48:33,960 --> 01:48:37,159
So really, what this movie is establishing if we're going

2013
01:48:37,199 --> 01:48:41,359
to play the meta narrative back is that a long

2014
01:48:41,399 --> 01:48:44,479
time ago in a galaxy far far away is still

2015
01:48:44,479 --> 01:48:48,439
connected to our world because if Et exists in our world,

2016
01:48:48,680 --> 01:48:54,760
therefore so too does Star Wars Transit of property. Praise be,

2017
01:48:54,960 --> 01:48:58,239
but I still enjoyed this movie. It was a It

2018
01:48:58,279 --> 01:49:00,640
was a fun watch and watching it from the adult

2019
01:49:00,680 --> 01:49:02,800
point of view and catching all those things that you

2020
01:49:02,880 --> 01:49:05,359
don't catch during the scary parts of the film as

2021
01:49:05,399 --> 01:49:08,439
a kid because they're scary, but watches an adult realize

2022
01:49:08,920 --> 01:49:10,760
he goes. It's kind of like what a hospital is,

2023
01:49:10,800 --> 01:49:13,800
and what adults do is they operate out of fear

2024
01:49:13,920 --> 01:49:17,279
and think that their knowledge is going to be the

2025
01:49:17,359 --> 01:49:20,560
key to everything, and it's not. It's hard, just like

2026
01:49:20,600 --> 01:49:25,600
being a therapist, technique or relationship which one works relationship.

2027
01:49:27,840 --> 01:49:30,159
Speaker 1: I love this movie. I've loved it since I was

2028
01:49:30,199 --> 01:49:32,840
a kid. I get emotional every time I watch it.

2029
01:49:33,359 --> 01:49:37,920
I get emotional in the scene in the Quarantine when

2030
01:49:39,640 --> 01:49:42,680
Elliott's saying like he came to me, when there's all

2031
01:49:42,720 --> 01:49:45,800
the confusion going on and ET's dying and Elliot's kind

2032
01:49:45,800 --> 01:49:49,399
of starting to die but come back to life. I

2033
01:49:49,439 --> 01:49:53,439
also cry a lot in the very end scene when

2034
01:49:54,600 --> 01:49:56,800
each says to him like I'll be right here, and

2035
01:49:56,880 --> 01:50:00,159
like touches his third eye. And I think it's such

2036
01:50:00,359 --> 01:50:03,960
wonderfully sensitive movie. I think it's a really compassionate movie.

2037
01:50:04,520 --> 01:50:06,880
I think, like I said, a lot of movies by

2038
01:50:06,880 --> 01:50:12,600
Spielberg really respect kids. And I obviously respect kids as

2039
01:50:12,640 --> 01:50:14,680
I work with them. And I think it, like I said,

2040
01:50:14,680 --> 01:50:19,800
it respects how much that kids can't understand things well

2041
01:50:20,439 --> 01:50:23,279
because they're coming at it from a more emotional, open

2042
01:50:23,279 --> 01:50:28,159
hearted place. And I think it's a really beautiful movie

2043
01:50:28,199 --> 01:50:34,239
about connection and empathy. And I like that it ends

2044
01:50:34,279 --> 01:50:39,279
with the Keys, the guy keys, standing back and kind

2045
01:50:39,319 --> 01:50:42,600
of letting them have their goodbye and then letting it

2046
01:50:42,720 --> 01:50:47,119
t go off. That is more important about like being human,

2047
01:50:47,239 --> 01:50:52,920
like showing humanity and empathy versus conquering and power and domination,

2048
01:50:53,039 --> 01:50:54,880
all that stuff that kids don't really think about.

2049
01:50:55,520 --> 01:50:57,479
Speaker 3: Kids aren't really awkward like that unless.

2050
01:50:57,159 --> 01:51:00,199
Speaker 1: They are being raised by adults or around it all

2051
01:51:00,239 --> 01:51:01,119
to operate like that.

2052
01:51:01,840 --> 01:51:03,159
Speaker 3: And so I love this movie.

2053
01:51:03,520 --> 01:51:05,319
Speaker 1: I think every time I watch it, I notice more

2054
01:51:05,399 --> 01:51:09,159
parts that are clues to us that Et and Elliot

2055
01:51:09,760 --> 01:51:13,399
are connected, like almost right away, like the getting tired.

2056
01:51:13,399 --> 01:51:16,039
At the same time, there's all these little moments where

2057
01:51:16,920 --> 01:51:21,119
Elliott seems to know psychically obviously that Et is like

2058
01:51:21,199 --> 01:51:23,119
hungry or you know what I mean. Like there's a

2059
01:51:23,159 --> 01:51:28,479
lot of It's a really well written script that really

2060
01:51:28,560 --> 01:51:30,359
answers a lot of questions before you even realize that

2061
01:51:30,399 --> 01:51:31,159
they're questions.

2062
01:51:31,760 --> 01:51:33,479
Speaker 3: And So I love this movie. I should.

2063
01:51:33,920 --> 01:51:36,119
Speaker 1: I should have my little nieces and nephew's watch it soon.

2064
01:51:36,159 --> 01:51:36,920
I think they love it.

2065
01:51:37,279 --> 01:51:39,840
Speaker 3: My one niece is really into Grumlins right now, so

2066
01:51:39,920 --> 01:51:41,920
I think ET would be right in her wheelhouse and

2067
01:51:41,960 --> 01:51:46,800
obviously a lot less inappropriate than Grumblins and Grumlins.

2068
01:51:46,279 --> 01:51:47,640
Speaker 2: Too, which I need to do.

2069
01:51:48,600 --> 01:51:49,000
Speaker 3: I don't know.

2070
01:51:49,079 --> 01:51:51,560
Speaker 1: I've watched Grumlins a few times now recently because of her,

2071
01:51:52,159 --> 01:51:54,479
and they're ain't much their homie unless you want to

2072
01:51:54,520 --> 01:51:59,199
talk about a guy who can't get his dreams off

2073
01:51:59,199 --> 01:52:01,279
of the ground, which is the dad of the main

2074
01:52:01,319 --> 01:52:03,840
character and Grandmains who keeps inventing different things that go

2075
01:52:04,000 --> 01:52:06,239
to shit in his house. It's also a movie about

2076
01:52:06,239 --> 01:52:09,720
a really permissive, loving wife who just lets that stuffkeep

2077
01:52:09,720 --> 01:52:13,119
opening in our house. But I love this movie. I

2078
01:52:13,119 --> 01:52:15,359
think this movie so has a lot to tell the kids.

2079
01:52:15,359 --> 01:52:18,840
I saw it the music Box live on a big screen,

2080
01:52:19,199 --> 01:52:22,239
which was really cool to see with kids there who

2081
01:52:22,319 --> 01:52:25,000
probably sing it for the first time. And I really

2082
01:52:25,600 --> 01:52:27,199
this is one of my favorite movies I think of

2083
01:52:27,239 --> 01:52:31,439
all time, especially kid movies. So on that note, if

2084
01:52:31,520 --> 01:52:33,840
you want to tell us what you think about the movie,

2085
01:52:33,880 --> 01:52:36,960
you can always email us at popcorn psychologygmail dot com.

2086
01:52:37,359 --> 01:52:41,520
You can find us on Facebook and Instagram at popcorn Psychology.

2087
01:52:42,159 --> 01:52:45,199
We're not really on TikTok anymore because of you know,

2088
01:52:45,279 --> 01:52:50,000
fascist buyouts. We're not on Twitter anymore because of fascist biouts,

2089
01:52:50,279 --> 01:52:52,680
so it's really shrinking. We're barely on the other ones

2090
01:52:52,720 --> 01:52:56,159
because of fascist buyouts. We're trying to figure out a

2091
01:52:56,159 --> 01:52:57,720
way out of meta, but I don't know if that's

2092
01:52:57,720 --> 01:52:58,640
possible right now.

2093
01:52:58,840 --> 01:52:59,720
Speaker 3: Ben's working on that.

2094
01:53:00,239 --> 01:53:03,279
Speaker 1: So the best way to get to us directly consistently

2095
01:53:03,399 --> 01:53:06,119
is three email, and also you can listen to us

2096
01:53:06,119 --> 01:53:08,600
wherever you find podcasts, and if you can rate and

2097
01:53:08,600 --> 01:53:11,359
review us wherever you listen. That is the best way

2098
01:53:11,439 --> 01:53:15,159
and the freest way to let other people know about us.

2099
01:53:15,199 --> 01:53:18,600
We really appreciate it. We read your reviews. And if

2100
01:53:18,640 --> 01:53:21,159
you want to sponsor us for a little bit of cash,

2101
01:53:21,199 --> 01:53:22,720
if you have any on hand, which I know is

2102
01:53:22,760 --> 01:53:26,239
a tough ask right now in this economy. We do

2103
01:53:26,319 --> 01:53:30,880
have a Patreon which you can subscribe to a different tiers,

2104
01:53:31,119 --> 01:53:32,760
and we also have a tea public if you'd like

2105
01:53:32,840 --> 01:53:36,000
some merch. So everyone be nice to the little alien

2106
01:53:36,000 --> 01:53:38,279
you find in your yard. You'll never know if their

2107
01:53:38,319 --> 01:53:43,920
heart might link to yours Bluetooth style, all right,