WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.200 --> 00:00:00.760 Get value. 2 00:00:00.800 --> 00:00:03.120 You can't argue with at Tesco with their amazing club 3 00:00:03.160 --> 00:00:06.200 card prices. Serve up something special with our finest meal 4 00:00:06.240 --> 00:00:08.880 deal for two starring one main, two sides and dessert 5 00:00:08.880 --> 00:00:11.720 for only sixteen EU row like succulent board, be approved 6 00:00:11.759 --> 00:00:14.359 IRUs shined a strip loin steaks with peppercorn butter, or 7 00:00:14.400 --> 00:00:18.160 delicious IRUs Chicken Parmesana served with creamy potato gritam and 8 00:00:18.320 --> 00:00:21.800 a mix of rainbow root vegetables. And enjoy Goozillionaire or 9 00:00:21.839 --> 00:00:26.640 Soldier caramel cheesecake. Can't argue with that shop instore or online. Tesco. 10 00:00:26.920 --> 00:00:29.879 Every little helps available to most doores. Prices very express. 11 00:00:30.320 --> 00:00:32.759 Oh hey, it's your neighbor with the smelly trash cans. 12 00:00:32.880 --> 00:00:35.079 What's in there? Ali Ward, I am going to make 13 00:00:35.119 --> 00:00:37.320 this intro as short as possible because I've squirrels on 14 00:00:37.359 --> 00:00:39.640 my pants. I want to start this first things first, 15 00:00:40.079 --> 00:00:42.600 I wanted to interview this person for years. Somehow my 16 00:00:42.640 --> 00:00:46.280 emails never got returned, my dreams never materialized, and then 17 00:00:46.320 --> 00:00:49.600 one day I realized she followed me on social media. 18 00:00:49.840 --> 00:00:53.359 Hot dang. I DMed her with so many exclamation points 19 00:00:53.399 --> 00:00:56.079 it was embarrassing, and from the first second of this interview. 20 00:00:56.119 --> 00:00:58.200 I'm losing my shit and I think you will too. 21 00:00:58.479 --> 00:01:01.560 So she got her undergrad in cell molecular biology at 22 00:01:01.560 --> 00:01:05.000 Arizona State University. She had a master's in ecology and 23 00:01:05.079 --> 00:01:08.040 evolutionary biology at Purdue, and then got a PhD in 24 00:01:08.120 --> 00:01:11.959 wildlife ecology and conservation back at the University of Arizona. 25 00:01:12.040 --> 00:01:14.480 We're going to talk about it. She's now a professor 26 00:01:14.519 --> 00:01:17.439 of biology at Baldwin Wallace University in Ohio, where she 27 00:01:17.519 --> 00:01:20.599 has done many things, one of them co creating a 28 00:01:20.680 --> 00:01:24.560 full length dance work called Liars in fur Coats about 29 00:01:24.599 --> 00:01:28.200 the social and mating habits of squirrels. She's studied fox squirrels, 30 00:01:28.319 --> 00:01:31.799 gray squirrels, ground squirrels, and more for decades, and her 31 00:01:31.799 --> 00:01:36.159 handles on social media reflect this commitment. Squirrel doc it's 32 00:01:36.159 --> 00:01:38.920 linked to the show notes. Also linked patreon dot com 33 00:01:38.920 --> 00:01:41.239 slash ologies for a buck or more a month. You 34 00:01:41.280 --> 00:01:44.280 can submit questions ahead of time and I might say 35 00:01:44.319 --> 00:01:46.760 your name with my face. Ologyes Merch is also linked 36 00:01:46.760 --> 00:01:48.719 to the show notes. And thanks to everyone who leaves 37 00:01:48.920 --> 00:01:51.920 reviews and subscribes. I read all of them, such as 38 00:01:51.959 --> 00:01:54.000 this one left this week by I family who wrote 39 00:01:54.040 --> 00:01:56.599 there are a billion podcasts, but not all are worth 40 00:01:56.640 --> 00:02:00.239 a regularly scheduled listen. This one absolutely is. Thank you 41 00:02:00.319 --> 00:02:03.400 so much. Also, I've been told that this particular episode 42 00:02:03.560 --> 00:02:07.000 has the potential to make life good again. No pressure, 43 00:02:07.200 --> 00:02:11.560 So let's get into it. So scury ideology. It's hard 44 00:02:11.599 --> 00:02:14.199 to say, but it's a real word, people, and it 45 00:02:14.240 --> 00:02:17.560 comes from the Greek for shade tail. And we're going 46 00:02:17.599 --> 00:02:20.800 to talk about who's who and the family of scurity. 47 00:02:20.840 --> 00:02:23.800 I will also chat about the best part of the acorns. 48 00:02:24.039 --> 00:02:27.319 How many trees squirrels plant, why they're so good at 49 00:02:27.360 --> 00:02:29.960 bird feeders, do they glow in the dark, what their 50 00:02:30.080 --> 00:02:34.719 chirps and barks mean, flying squirrels, ground squirrels, litter sizes, 51 00:02:35.039 --> 00:02:40.080 cozy nests, If squirrels love you back, they're absolutely glorious 52 00:02:40.400 --> 00:02:45.599 and terrible, sex lives, hoarding, hiding, gliding, conservation, statuses that 53 00:02:45.680 --> 00:02:48.840 might shock you, and why you should never never put 54 00:02:48.840 --> 00:02:51.439 a squirrel in your pocket before you board an airplane, 55 00:02:51.520 --> 00:02:56.319 and so much more with mammalogist, biologist, and most importantly scuritiologist, 56 00:02:56.520 --> 00:03:10.439 doctor Karen Monroe. 57 00:03:16.360 --> 00:03:18.840 My name is Karen Monroe, and now you she her pronouns. 58 00:03:19.120 --> 00:03:22.879 My god, it's you it's really you, It's really me. 59 00:03:23.039 --> 00:03:23.840 I promise it's me. 60 00:03:24.120 --> 00:03:26.919 Literally, so many people in my life know today is 61 00:03:26.960 --> 00:03:30.400 a really exciting one for me. No chill, zero chill, whatsoever. 62 00:03:30.560 --> 00:03:33.039 And that is the correct way to be when talking 63 00:03:33.080 --> 00:03:36.120 to doctor Karen Monroe. By the way, do you know 64 00:03:36.159 --> 00:03:40.199 that scouriology? Do you know that? Have you ever heard 65 00:03:40.240 --> 00:03:40.599 the term? 66 00:03:41.240 --> 00:03:43.400 No, I've always referred to myself as a mammalogist. 67 00:03:43.639 --> 00:03:47.840 You're very good at squirrels, though, yes, And I just 68 00:03:47.919 --> 00:03:51.879 want you to know that out there in just the 69 00:03:51.960 --> 00:03:56.240 miasma of life and words, a scurtiologist is a term 70 00:03:56.919 --> 00:04:01.199 for someone who is very good at squirrels. I know 71 00:04:01.280 --> 00:04:01.719 this term. 72 00:04:01.759 --> 00:04:04.159 I believe you as I say. I've studied squirrels for 73 00:04:04.240 --> 00:04:07.520 a very long time, longer than I've been married. I 74 00:04:07.520 --> 00:04:09.919 mean since I was my freshman year in college, so 75 00:04:10.039 --> 00:04:13.560 since I was seventeen, I've studied squirrels. But I still 76 00:04:13.879 --> 00:04:17.120 to this day have active squirrel research because people are 77 00:04:17.319 --> 00:04:18.800 just fascinated by it. 78 00:04:19.040 --> 00:04:22.959 We love squirrels, but we're scared of most other rodents. 79 00:04:24.279 --> 00:04:27.360 Right. Why is that? It's the fluffy tail, isn't it. 80 00:04:27.360 --> 00:04:29.000 It's got to be. I mean, that's where they get 81 00:04:29.000 --> 00:04:31.040 their name from even right, I read the right. 82 00:04:31.040 --> 00:04:32.360 Shade tail, shade tail. 83 00:04:32.879 --> 00:04:35.360 Wait a second, Wait a second, Their tail is for 84 00:04:35.439 --> 00:04:36.279 shade partially. 85 00:04:36.319 --> 00:04:38.920 Sure, it's all kinds of thermal regulations, so you know, 86 00:04:39.160 --> 00:04:40.759 you can think of it as an umbrella if it's 87 00:04:40.800 --> 00:04:43.839 just kind of misting raining, but yeah, cover yourself in 88 00:04:44.639 --> 00:04:47.079 sun or you know, when they splat, right, so when 89 00:04:47.120 --> 00:04:49.360 they lay flat, they try to thrmw A regulate. You know, 90 00:04:49.399 --> 00:04:51.240 it's a wait for them to give off heat, pick 91 00:04:51.319 --> 00:04:52.360 up heat, however, you'd. 92 00:04:52.199 --> 00:04:55.079 Like more unbody heat in a bit. But we have 93 00:04:55.160 --> 00:04:59.279 a whole ding dang episode on thermophysiology and body temperature 94 00:04:59.279 --> 00:05:02.759 regulation as well as a kid friendly somologies episode on 95 00:05:02.800 --> 00:05:05.560 It was doctor Shane Campbell Stayton. But I'm getting ahead 96 00:05:05.600 --> 00:05:06.040 of myself. 97 00:05:06.439 --> 00:05:06.920 I got to. 98 00:05:06.879 --> 00:05:09.759 Admit I wanted to talk about squirrels for a long time, 99 00:05:09.800 --> 00:05:11.560 but I don't think I've ever talked about the function 100 00:05:11.600 --> 00:05:13.959 of a squirrel tail. And of course they have a function. 101 00:05:14.199 --> 00:05:16.920 They wouldn't have evolved to have it otherwise, right. 102 00:05:17.120 --> 00:05:19.319 And then like when you watch them jump and fall 103 00:05:19.360 --> 00:05:20.920 and stuff like that, they also use it to totally 104 00:05:21.040 --> 00:05:25.160 right themselves so that they land, you know, on all fours. 105 00:05:24.920 --> 00:05:27.079 That makes so much sense. Is it kind of like 106 00:05:27.160 --> 00:05:29.160 when you see a tightrope walker that has one of 107 00:05:29.160 --> 00:05:30.800 those really big poles. 108 00:05:31.120 --> 00:05:33.240 Yeah, absolutely, they kind of like, well, I don't know 109 00:05:33.240 --> 00:05:35.480 about pole, but yeah, Like at the Yankees game last day, 110 00:05:35.680 --> 00:05:37.680 probably ten people sent me this clip. There was a 111 00:05:37.680 --> 00:05:40.639 squirrel in the outfield and the fans were, you know, 112 00:05:40.680 --> 00:05:43.399 shocked by this. It's like running across and then it 113 00:05:43.600 --> 00:05:46.480 falls and it falls eight feet onto the ground. 114 00:05:46.680 --> 00:05:48.480 Now has it become a flying squirrel? 115 00:05:48.480 --> 00:05:48.639 Oh? 116 00:05:48.680 --> 00:05:52.079 This is not good. He sticks to landing much better 117 00:05:52.120 --> 00:05:52.600 than we would. 118 00:05:52.639 --> 00:05:53.319 I'll tell you that. 119 00:05:53.680 --> 00:05:56.800 Like y off to the races. 120 00:05:56.480 --> 00:05:58.079 And you just watch it and it kind of goes 121 00:05:58.120 --> 00:06:00.360 side to side to side, and like you can watch 122 00:06:00.399 --> 00:06:01.959 the tail kind of work as a rudder and then 123 00:06:02.360 --> 00:06:04.360 it lands just fine and runs away. 124 00:06:04.720 --> 00:06:06.399 Is there any part of that that also is just 125 00:06:06.439 --> 00:06:08.920 like a parachute to slow it down? 126 00:06:09.199 --> 00:06:12.079 About a parachute, I mean I think more like flying squirrels, right, 127 00:06:12.160 --> 00:06:14.839 like the gliding with that membrane really kind of is 128 00:06:14.879 --> 00:06:17.319 better to catch the mayor. But gray squirrels, which this 129 00:06:17.439 --> 00:06:19.360 was just a gray squirrel, they kind of use it 130 00:06:19.360 --> 00:06:20.920 more kind of as a rudder side to side. 131 00:06:21.279 --> 00:06:24.920 Oh boy, howdy. We will address different kinds of squirrels, 132 00:06:25.079 --> 00:06:31.000 gray fox, giant dwarf, flying marvel. But first let's talk 133 00:06:31.040 --> 00:06:35.920 about the specimen. Karen Monroe. I got to ask, how 134 00:06:36.519 --> 00:06:40.720 did you get? So I'm gonna say lucky that somehow 135 00:06:40.839 --> 00:06:46.800 life just shot doctor Karen Monroe down a path from 136 00:06:46.800 --> 00:06:50.199 the age of seventeen where she gets to study the 137 00:06:50.240 --> 00:06:51.959 most beloved woodland creature. 138 00:06:52.040 --> 00:06:57.360 There is the perfect confluence of luck and mistakes, I guess. 139 00:06:57.639 --> 00:06:59.360 So when I was in high school, right, my high 140 00:06:59.360 --> 00:07:01.600 school guys, so it was like, oh, you know, like biology, 141 00:07:01.639 --> 00:07:04.040 you should become a vet or a doctor. Right, that 142 00:07:04.079 --> 00:07:06.800 was pretty much the two career paths. And there was 143 00:07:06.839 --> 00:07:08.399 no way I could ever tell somebody they had to 144 00:07:08.399 --> 00:07:11.279 put their pet down. That was not even an option 145 00:07:11.360 --> 00:07:13.120 for me. So I was like, well, I'll be a doctor. 146 00:07:13.120 --> 00:07:15.759 I I like people and I really liked kids, and 147 00:07:15.800 --> 00:07:17.920 so I was like, oh, I'll be a pediatrician. And 148 00:07:18.240 --> 00:07:20.800 my undergraduate advisor one of the smartest things he did 149 00:07:20.879 --> 00:07:23.199 was he made me go shadow a pediatrician for a 150 00:07:23.240 --> 00:07:26.920 week and I learned two very important things during that 151 00:07:27.079 --> 00:07:31.759 week long shadowing experience. One sick kids are no fun, 152 00:07:31.920 --> 00:07:36.279 oh no. Two parents of sick kids are even less fun. 153 00:07:37.040 --> 00:07:40.519 But he at that point had already enveloped me into 154 00:07:40.519 --> 00:07:43.199 his lab, and so I was working for him mainly 155 00:07:43.240 --> 00:07:46.959 as an undergraduate. You know, hourly job collecting acorns and 156 00:07:47.319 --> 00:07:50.480 beating acorns to squirrels is part of his lab component. 157 00:07:50.639 --> 00:07:53.360 And I told my students all the time. After I 158 00:07:53.360 --> 00:07:55.079 figured out I did not want to be a pediatrician, 159 00:07:55.279 --> 00:07:58.120 I tried to find an area of medicine that I liked, 160 00:07:58.120 --> 00:08:01.199 and I really didn't. And I tried to find somewhere 161 00:08:01.199 --> 00:08:03.480 else for me to go, like, what is it that 162 00:08:03.560 --> 00:08:05.199 I really was interested in and what did I like? 163 00:08:05.759 --> 00:08:08.360 And I ended up thinking, well, I was at this small, 164 00:08:08.360 --> 00:08:11.279 little arts college, and that if I transferred someplace bigger. 165 00:08:11.560 --> 00:08:13.279 So I was from a small town. If I went 166 00:08:13.279 --> 00:08:15.160 to some place bigger, I would have more opportunities than 167 00:08:15.199 --> 00:08:17.600 I could figure it out. And so I transferred from 168 00:08:17.720 --> 00:08:20.560 Wilkes University, which is at that time, I think thirteen 169 00:08:20.639 --> 00:08:26.199 hundred students to Arizona State University. Oh so across country. Yeah, yeah, 170 00:08:26.240 --> 00:08:28.160 thirteen hundred students to forty thousand students. 171 00:08:28.160 --> 00:08:29.800 Climate differences even. 172 00:08:29.720 --> 00:08:34.000 Yeah, climate, cultural, everything and anything you could possibly imagine 173 00:08:34.159 --> 00:08:37.240 what I really figured out and Arizona was that there 174 00:08:37.240 --> 00:08:40.919 were even less opportunities as a lonely undergraduate to get 175 00:08:41.000 --> 00:08:42.799 involved in research and really kind of figure out what 176 00:08:42.799 --> 00:08:43.559 it is I want to do. 177 00:08:44.039 --> 00:08:47.519 So Karen was majoring in cellular and molecular biology but 178 00:08:47.559 --> 00:08:51.919 couldn't seem to get lab experience in Arizona, so hungry 179 00:08:51.960 --> 00:08:56.639 for research, she would spend summers and spring breaks not 180 00:08:56.679 --> 00:08:59.840 getting crunk on four logos in Miami Beach, but had 181 00:09:00.240 --> 00:09:02.960 back to her small town to work on squirrels. 182 00:09:03.240 --> 00:09:05.879 And so I kind of did a huge one to eighty. 183 00:09:06.320 --> 00:09:09.000 So my undergrad degree is in cellular and molecular biology, 184 00:09:09.480 --> 00:09:12.799 and I went to Purdue and eventually ended up leaving 185 00:09:12.840 --> 00:09:15.399 there with my master's in ecology and evolutionary biology. But 186 00:09:15.440 --> 00:09:18.639 it meant I had to take all of those classes ecology, 187 00:09:18.679 --> 00:09:21.480 evolution and weal behavior, advanced mammology, all those kinds of 188 00:09:21.559 --> 00:09:23.759 things I took as a graduate student. And that's what 189 00:09:23.879 --> 00:09:26.840 I kind of really started putting things together that like, oh, 190 00:09:26.960 --> 00:09:29.440 all this solemn molecular genetic stuff that I really liked 191 00:09:30.039 --> 00:09:34.399 in college, I could actually apply that to the squirrels 192 00:09:34.399 --> 00:09:36.799 and the systems that I do so very well from 193 00:09:37.279 --> 00:09:39.879 working in the lab. So that's kind of where my 194 00:09:39.879 --> 00:09:42.919 PhD ends up. My PhD is actually in a wildlife 195 00:09:42.960 --> 00:09:47.080 conservation management and it really is the confluence of those 196 00:09:47.080 --> 00:09:51.080 two things. It's applying all the genetic stuff to an 197 00:09:51.080 --> 00:09:54.559 animal conservation concern was my original thought, but in that 198 00:09:54.600 --> 00:09:56.720 way to a group of animals that have a great 199 00:09:56.720 --> 00:09:57.720 conservation concern. 200 00:09:57.919 --> 00:10:01.879 Are squirrels in trouble? It seems they're everywhere. Maybe one 201 00:10:01.960 --> 00:10:04.919 tried to even steal your croissant yesterday. They seem like 202 00:10:04.919 --> 00:10:07.159 they're doing fine to some of us. But we will 203 00:10:07.200 --> 00:10:10.039 get into how different species are doing later in the episode. 204 00:10:10.120 --> 00:10:14.600 But yes, her interests and experience all converged to make 205 00:10:14.639 --> 00:10:18.679 her a truly lauded securadiologist. It sounds like one was 206 00:10:18.759 --> 00:10:20.759 that peanut butter and the other was the bread, and 207 00:10:20.799 --> 00:10:22.399 you're like, oh, I guess I get make a sandwich. 208 00:10:23.120 --> 00:10:24.679 You've got my chocolate, my peanut butter. 209 00:10:27.279 --> 00:10:30.480 So when it comes to your work, was there anything 210 00:10:30.559 --> 00:10:35.360 about the field work that you were drawn to or 211 00:10:35.440 --> 00:10:38.039 was it more systemic that you liked? 212 00:10:38.279 --> 00:10:40.639 No, it was much more systemic. I mean I really 213 00:10:40.720 --> 00:10:42.840 enjoyed the fact that I could walk and I do 214 00:10:42.879 --> 00:10:45.559 this now right, I walk outside and my study organism 215 00:10:45.679 --> 00:10:48.279 is right there. It's not like I need, you know, 216 00:10:48.399 --> 00:10:50.320 to get on a plane and fly three thousand miles 217 00:10:50.399 --> 00:10:52.360 with all this equipment and things like that. It's right there, 218 00:10:52.559 --> 00:10:54.759 which means it's successible and I can talk about it 219 00:10:54.759 --> 00:10:56.000 to the public, and I can talk about it to 220 00:10:56.000 --> 00:10:59.080 my students, and so I really enjoyed that fact. At 221 00:10:59.080 --> 00:11:01.399 the same point, I've also worked places where I've had 222 00:11:01.440 --> 00:11:04.000 to drive six hours to the top of a mountain 223 00:11:04.279 --> 00:11:06.879 to work with the species, and so there are those 224 00:11:06.879 --> 00:11:09.559 distant and far away species as well. But I really 225 00:11:09.600 --> 00:11:12.000 like the fact that, especially as an undergraduate, you know, 226 00:11:12.039 --> 00:11:14.559 I would get on my bike and bike across campus 227 00:11:14.600 --> 00:11:17.840 and start trapping squirrels and making observations and things like that. 228 00:11:17.879 --> 00:11:21.279 It just was so accessible. I think is probably the 229 00:11:21.320 --> 00:11:23.600 reason I really got hooked and involved. 230 00:11:23.879 --> 00:11:25.960 I gotta say, anyone who's listening to this who's like 231 00:11:26.000 --> 00:11:30.240 working on permacross stuff probably like, right, you were frequent 232 00:11:30.240 --> 00:11:34.720 fire miles. But still, the availability of squirrels, that's why 233 00:11:34.759 --> 00:11:35.559 we love them. 234 00:11:35.919 --> 00:11:38.559 That's what it is. And everybody knows them, and everybody 235 00:11:38.639 --> 00:11:42.919 loves them, and everybody, everybody, everybody has a squirrel story. Yes, 236 00:11:44.039 --> 00:11:46.039 you know, I go to dinners that have you know, 237 00:11:46.480 --> 00:11:49.360 corporate people and business people and whatnot. They're like, oh, 238 00:11:49.399 --> 00:11:50.759 a scientist, We're not gonna able to talk to you. 239 00:11:50.799 --> 00:11:53.240 And I'm like, I bet you are. I bet you, 240 00:11:53.559 --> 00:11:55.039 I bet you will. By the end of the night, 241 00:11:55.080 --> 00:11:57.759 you and I would be friends. And we love shared stories. 242 00:11:57.759 --> 00:12:01.240 Surely there are attention gathering no matter who you are, though, 243 00:12:01.840 --> 00:12:06.000 But where do squirrels live? Speaking of tundra and perma frost? 244 00:12:06.320 --> 00:12:09.919 What continents? Or rather, I guess where don't squirrels live? 245 00:12:10.000 --> 00:12:12.840 I think an articaus the only place squirrels do not live. Wow, 246 00:12:13.039 --> 00:12:15.480 you know from the Arctic circle down into the tropics, 247 00:12:15.519 --> 00:12:18.360 and you know from east to west across the way. 248 00:12:18.679 --> 00:12:21.679 So if you are on a continent, squirrels are native 249 00:12:21.720 --> 00:12:25.960 to it, except Australia, where American gray squirrels were introduced 250 00:12:26.080 --> 00:12:29.200 to Melbourne in the late eighteen hundreds and then a 251 00:12:29.240 --> 00:12:33.600 few days later a scurry of northern palm squirrels busted 252 00:12:33.639 --> 00:12:36.440 out of the Zoo and Perth and honestly, it's all 253 00:12:36.480 --> 00:12:39.039 over the place. How many there still are out there? 254 00:12:39.279 --> 00:12:42.240 Oh and squirrels are also not native to Antarctica. In 255 00:12:42.279 --> 00:12:44.840 case you're listening there, and I am impressed that you 256 00:12:44.879 --> 00:12:47.320 are and that you have Wi FI and I hope 257 00:12:47.360 --> 00:12:49.840 that you didn't bring a squirrel there. And since you 258 00:12:49.960 --> 00:12:53.759 have such a systemic mind about that, what are squirrels 259 00:12:53.840 --> 00:12:57.799 doing right to not only capture our hearts, but also 260 00:12:57.960 --> 00:13:00.679 to be so omnipresent, to be able to live in 261 00:13:00.720 --> 00:13:03.639 all these different biomes? They figured it out kind of right. 262 00:13:03.679 --> 00:13:05.639 I mean, they're just so charismatic, right, Like they have 263 00:13:05.759 --> 00:13:08.039 the little pointy noses in the face, and you know, 264 00:13:08.080 --> 00:13:09.639 the hands and so you can sit there and watch 265 00:13:09.679 --> 00:13:11.759 them rotate the acorn in their hand and get it 266 00:13:11.799 --> 00:13:13.559 just right so they can take the perfect bite. They're 267 00:13:13.559 --> 00:13:16.120 not intimidating, right, even when they make noises and things 268 00:13:16.120 --> 00:13:17.679 like that. I've had people like, oh, the squirrel is 269 00:13:17.720 --> 00:13:21.279 just saying hello as they're likep and like flapping their 270 00:13:21.320 --> 00:13:23.799 pail at them, and I'm like, you know, they're they're 271 00:13:23.879 --> 00:13:25.639 saying that you're a predator, and they're trying to make 272 00:13:25.639 --> 00:13:27.840 sure everybody else knows that you're a predator and and 273 00:13:27.919 --> 00:13:30.000 to get away. But I think that they're just kind 274 00:13:30.000 --> 00:13:34.000 of the right size and shape and they're just charismatic. 275 00:13:34.559 --> 00:13:37.960 From an evolutionary standpoint, What do you think has helped 276 00:13:38.000 --> 00:13:42.519 them survive on prairies and mountains and in the cold 277 00:13:42.559 --> 00:13:43.639 and in jungles. 278 00:13:43.919 --> 00:13:44.080 You know. 279 00:13:44.120 --> 00:13:46.279 I want to say that they're such generalists, kind of 280 00:13:46.279 --> 00:13:48.320 across the board, that they're willing to be just about anything, 281 00:13:48.519 --> 00:13:50.440 but that is not always true, because there are definitely 282 00:13:50.480 --> 00:13:54.360 cases where they really do specifically eat, you know, a 283 00:13:54.519 --> 00:13:56.519 very small number of plants. Things like that. I think 284 00:13:56.519 --> 00:14:00.600 of like ground squirrels really specialize in a plant type 285 00:14:00.600 --> 00:14:02.919 and their whole physiology and when they come out of 286 00:14:02.960 --> 00:14:07.399 hibernation or torpor really is tied to that specific plant 287 00:14:07.440 --> 00:14:10.000 type and precipitation and things like that. But then I 288 00:14:10.039 --> 00:14:12.960 think of like the classic gray squirrel, and man, they 289 00:14:12.960 --> 00:14:17.240 will eat anything from plants to animals, eggs, insects, truffles. 290 00:14:17.720 --> 00:14:20.200 Human food is kind of the last resort. That's not 291 00:14:20.840 --> 00:14:23.720 generally what they're after. But their diet is so general 292 00:14:24.399 --> 00:14:27.399 and they have the ability just to their scatterholders, so 293 00:14:27.399 --> 00:14:28.759 they put a little bit of food here, there, there, 294 00:14:28.799 --> 00:14:30.879 and there. They like to take things like mushrooms and 295 00:14:30.919 --> 00:14:33.399 fungi and up into the trees and they will dry 296 00:14:33.440 --> 00:14:35.399 it and then put it in their dray nests with 297 00:14:35.440 --> 00:14:36.120 them for the winter. 298 00:14:36.399 --> 00:14:40.960 No, wait, they have better meal planting than I do. Right, 299 00:14:41.120 --> 00:14:44.399 that's hurt so bad, And I'm really impressed. 300 00:14:45.879 --> 00:14:47.799 Right, I mean I've seen I have a you know, 301 00:14:47.840 --> 00:14:49.879 a squirl my neighborhood has taken you know, a chunk 302 00:14:49.960 --> 00:14:52.679 of a Halloween pumpkin and put it up in the 303 00:14:52.679 --> 00:14:55.480 tree to dry, and I'm sure it stored it away 304 00:14:55.519 --> 00:14:56.039 for winter. 305 00:14:56.759 --> 00:15:00.519 How many of our trees are because of forgetful squirrels? 306 00:15:00.759 --> 00:15:03.039 Almost all of them. I know for my undergraduate research 307 00:15:03.080 --> 00:15:05.840 that if a acorn is handled by a squirrel, even 308 00:15:05.840 --> 00:15:08.480 if it is half eaten by the squirrel, it will 309 00:15:08.519 --> 00:15:10.559 germinate better than an acorn that it's not been touched 310 00:15:10.600 --> 00:15:11.440 at all by a squirrel. 311 00:15:11.480 --> 00:15:14.600 So we owe so much carbon capture to squirrels. 312 00:15:14.840 --> 00:15:17.240 I mean they really are like the gardener of the 313 00:15:17.279 --> 00:15:18.759 planet half eaten. 314 00:15:19.080 --> 00:15:22.440 Really, Yeah, just saunter over to the nineteen ninety three 315 00:15:22.440 --> 00:15:27.679 paper Tannins and partial consumption of acorns implications for dispersal 316 00:15:27.720 --> 00:15:29.879 of oaks by seed predators, and you can get a 317 00:15:29.919 --> 00:15:35.440 little fat snack like germination experiments revealed equal or greater 318 00:15:35.919 --> 00:15:41.679 germination frequencies for partially consumed acorns than for the intact acorns, 319 00:15:41.960 --> 00:15:45.399 and they say, we suggest that the higher tannin levels 320 00:15:45.759 --> 00:15:51.279 may render the apical portion less palatable and thereby increase 321 00:15:51.320 --> 00:15:56.080 the probability of embryo survival after attack by seed consumer, 322 00:15:56.200 --> 00:15:59.639 which would be the squirrel. I guess more delicious fat 323 00:15:59.679 --> 00:16:02.200 is at the top of the acorn. And remember this 324 00:16:02.240 --> 00:16:06.120 for later, because something's gonna blow your mind related to this. Also, 325 00:16:06.200 --> 00:16:09.519 for anyone who has ever I don't know, found a 326 00:16:09.519 --> 00:16:13.159 handful of loose reesis pieces in a blazer pocket that 327 00:16:13.200 --> 00:16:16.440 I rarely wear, you should know that the tastier the 328 00:16:16.480 --> 00:16:20.120 acorn is, the more likely the squirrel says to itself, 329 00:16:20.279 --> 00:16:22.360 None of those other jabbroni squirrels are going to eat 330 00:16:22.360 --> 00:16:25.120 this good one, so they bury them farther away where 331 00:16:25.200 --> 00:16:29.080 they might not find them, which gives the acorn distance 332 00:16:29.120 --> 00:16:31.600 from the parent tree, which it needs to not get 333 00:16:31.679 --> 00:16:34.919 choked out by its siblings. All of this drama under 334 00:16:34.960 --> 00:16:38.840 our noses, under our trees. Also, yes, I did eat 335 00:16:38.840 --> 00:16:40.519 the reesis that I found in my pocket, And no, 336 00:16:40.639 --> 00:16:42.320 I don't know how long they had been in there. 337 00:16:42.639 --> 00:16:47.200 How many acorns are boreal squirrels stashing away. I've read 338 00:16:47.320 --> 00:16:51.679 something that they really only remember like ten percent of them, 339 00:16:51.840 --> 00:16:53.840 or they don't even remember. They just look around and 340 00:16:53.840 --> 00:16:55.919 be like, where might there be acorns? And it might 341 00:16:55.919 --> 00:16:57.840 have been someone else's acorns, but they're like, yep, they're 342 00:16:57.879 --> 00:16:58.840 acorns exactly. 343 00:16:59.080 --> 00:17:03.120 It's part of my under project. We tagged thousands of 344 00:17:03.159 --> 00:17:05.680 acorns and put them out in the forest little brad nails, 345 00:17:05.680 --> 00:17:08.680 and then walked for hours with a mel detector trying 346 00:17:08.680 --> 00:17:11.960 to recover acorns to see how far squirrels were actually 347 00:17:11.960 --> 00:17:15.039 dispersing them. And it's quite a distance. And they they 348 00:17:15.039 --> 00:17:18.359 are so smart. They know acorns that are infested with 349 00:17:18.480 --> 00:17:20.920 weevils or other insects that are not going to make 350 00:17:20.960 --> 00:17:22.720 it through the winter, and they will either eat them 351 00:17:22.720 --> 00:17:26.839 immediately or excise the insect and then carry it. They 352 00:17:26.839 --> 00:17:29.720 will flip the acorn over, they will use their front 353 00:17:29.759 --> 00:17:32.440 and sizers to scrape out the cattle eating, and then 354 00:17:32.920 --> 00:17:35.519 stash it so that it won't germinate and it'll be 355 00:17:35.599 --> 00:17:36.160 there longer. 356 00:17:36.519 --> 00:17:39.519 So, yes, squirrels do not have a one hundred percent 357 00:17:39.640 --> 00:17:42.160 recovery rate with their food, all right, and they don't 358 00:17:42.160 --> 00:17:45.880 pretend to. It can range from twenty five to ninety 359 00:17:45.880 --> 00:17:50.000 five percent recovery rate depending on the species and area 360 00:17:50.160 --> 00:17:53.519 and food. But a ton of research has shown that 361 00:17:53.759 --> 00:17:58.440 squirrels have excellent spatial memory and they know to head 362 00:17:58.480 --> 00:18:01.400 back to their cash, But if they smell a neighbor's 363 00:18:01.480 --> 00:18:04.759 food buried on the way, they might eat that too. Also, 364 00:18:04.839 --> 00:18:08.640 according to the nineteen eighty six paper Gray Squirrel Food 365 00:18:08.680 --> 00:18:13.440 preferences the effects of tannin and fact concentration. Squirrels know 366 00:18:13.519 --> 00:18:17.359 which acorn species are more perishable, and they may bury 367 00:18:17.720 --> 00:18:22.079 like red oak nuts because the last longer and germinate 368 00:18:22.359 --> 00:18:26.000 in the spring, but they might eat white acorns because 369 00:18:26.039 --> 00:18:29.680 they germinate earlier in autumn. Although years later scientists at 370 00:18:29.720 --> 00:18:32.240 Berkeley were like, not so fast. It might just be 371 00:18:32.720 --> 00:18:36.160 that some acorns are just bigger. And it's like taking 372 00:18:36.160 --> 00:18:39.880 a few bites of a huge calzone in October and 373 00:18:39.920 --> 00:18:42.440 then just digging a hole in the backyard tossing it 374 00:18:42.480 --> 00:18:45.319 in there to snack on during the Super Bowl. Also 375 00:18:45.799 --> 00:18:48.640 scrape out the what the cot of lt who? Okay, 376 00:18:48.640 --> 00:18:52.240 so coda leedin. It sounds like a very expensive shade 377 00:18:52.240 --> 00:18:55.039 of paint. Everyone would be telling you to paint your kitchen, 378 00:18:55.279 --> 00:18:58.799 but it's actually an embryonic leaf or a pair of them, 379 00:18:59.119 --> 00:19:01.880 and they're in seas In an acorns, for example, it 380 00:19:01.960 --> 00:19:04.759 stores a lot of energy. And while the squirrels usually 381 00:19:04.759 --> 00:19:07.799 only bury about an inch deep in the soil, their 382 00:19:07.960 --> 00:19:11.799 whole food festival area can be up to seven acres wide. 383 00:19:12.039 --> 00:19:15.839 They're hard workers and also liars. So a two thousand 384 00:19:15.839 --> 00:19:19.440 and eight study titled cash Protection Strategies of scatter hoarding 385 00:19:19.519 --> 00:19:24.279 Rodent to tree Squirrels engage in behavioral deception, It showed 386 00:19:24.480 --> 00:19:27.839 that in about thirteen percent of caching events on a 387 00:19:27.960 --> 00:19:33.319 specific college campus, squirrels dug a hole, pretended to drop 388 00:19:33.319 --> 00:19:36.000 their acorn into it, but kept the acorn in their 389 00:19:36.000 --> 00:19:38.599 mouths and ran away. And this may have been the 390 00:19:38.599 --> 00:19:41.319 result of just a lot of squirrels being around and 391 00:19:41.359 --> 00:19:43.519 they didn't want anyone to see where they were stashed 392 00:19:43.519 --> 00:19:45.880 in their booty. And I didn't even think to ask this, 393 00:19:46.039 --> 00:19:49.160 But in the paper the researchers mentioned that they could 394 00:19:49.200 --> 00:19:53.319 tell which squirrel was which by noting distinctive markings, or, 395 00:19:53.440 --> 00:19:57.160 according to the study quote, others were uniquely marked with 396 00:19:57.279 --> 00:20:01.319 small spots of various brands of men's hair die applied 397 00:20:01.319 --> 00:20:05.279 with a plastic dropper from a short distance without restraining 398 00:20:05.319 --> 00:20:09.039 the animals, so squirrel researgers. They're just out there. They're 399 00:20:09.039 --> 00:20:13.519 offering snacks, makeovers. And then in another study published in 400 00:20:13.559 --> 00:20:17.240 twenty seventeen out of UC Berkeley titled Cashing for Where 401 00:20:17.279 --> 00:20:21.079