Speaker 1: That was wrong. Button First podcast.
Speaker 2: We're doing great, everybody.
Speaker 1: It's the Internet. You're busy. Let's do this. Welcome to
the Game as Deicides Podcast. This is the podcast where
we decide everything about the world of video games so
you never have to think for yourself. I'm your host
Jeff Greben with me is.
Speaker 2: Jahn Turbo Sean mcdowald.
Speaker 1: In today's episode, PlayStation has killed video game more closures
at Xbox and Rhythm heave and groove. That's pretty fun.
But first, Sean, how are you doing.
Speaker 2: Everything's on fire? Yeah, it's on fire.
Speaker 1: Okay, I can panic. I can. I can handle that much.
I don't know if I can do anything else to
fix the situation, but I can certainly panic. Yeah, it's
all on fire. It's bad. It's a crisis. Gonna I'm
gonna go on vacation here. I'll be out next week, everybody,
And while I'm doing that, I will play some old
video games and try not to think about it, because
that still works. They can't take that from me. I
mean they'll try, but they can't take that from me.
Speaker 2: No, we can always go back to retro if we
look at why I've been playing. Later, that's like all
I've been doing. But it's always a good time, even
if the news about news stuff is a bit dire
this week.
Speaker 1: Yeah I am. We're packing up, we're getting things going.
So you know what, everybody, we are gonna make it
a little bit of an expotit expedited show tonight. You know,
we'll still plenty of fun and me and Sean won't
skimp on talking about all of what's going on in
games right now. So we'll get to that here in
a second. First, let's thank everybody for joining us. Give
us a good rating. Wherever you are listening, hit the
like button on YouTube. Please helps people find the show
and we really do appreciate it. Do you want to
ask a question, there's a way to do that. You
go to YouTube while we're live, hit that super chat button.
We will get to all the super chats before we
are in with the program. Before we're done with the
program tonight. Thanks to Carlos saying who is Insane in
the Rain music on YouTube for the use of our
theme songs. We are on Spotify, Apple Podcast and wherever
pods are caught. Thank you to the mods. Thanks to
Christian for producing and you can get more from Mike
and me and support us by going to patreon dot
com slash game mess That gets you access to our
discord server participation in Q and A sessions, Which what
do you want Tomorrow morning? Before I leave, I'm going
to get up early before everyone else is up here early,
so I'm thinking like, well, maybe not before everyone else
is up maybe we'll do it at like nine am.
But that's what I'm gonna aim for everybody, So nine
am Eastern time, So have your questions ready to go.
I'll do a Q and A session as I get
ready to drive out of Ohio. You could. It also
gets you access to our game club discussions, early access
to new episodes of shows like Columbos, and of course
all of our shows add free. That's Patreon dot com
slash game mess. If you're wonder where Mike is baseball,
I think he's like said, fuck it, I'm going to
a baseball game, which I guess I get it.
Speaker 2: Well, you see, he was really like you know, stressed
and worn out after that vacation he just took, so
he needed to also go watch a baseball game before
three weekend.
Speaker 1: I get it, man, oh boy and vacation from the vacation.
All right, let's see, with all that out of the way,
we're gonna get to the big topics of the week
right after this. All right, Sean, let's just dive into it.
It is all coming apart, unglued. All the bad things
are happening at once. Let's go into some semblance of
an order here. Physical disc production ending in January twenty
twenty eight for new games releasing on PlayStation consoles. This
says a sid human over at the PlayStation Blog wrote
this up as consumer preferences in the broader entertainment industry
continued to shift away from physical discs to digital. Physical
game disc production for all new games releasing on PlayStation
consoles will be discontinued starting January twenty twenty eight, Following
the state, new games will be available in PlayStation store
and at retailers in digital formats only. This transition has
no impact on games that already released or will be
releasing prior to January twenty twenty eight in disc format.
This is a natural direction for Sony Interactive and Entertainment
to adapt consumer trends, as the general preference for digital
media significantly outpaces physical discs. I guess let's start there, Sean,
you think that is that? I mean, we know it's
trending in that direction. Do we think it's trended in
that direction so heavily that this is just a not
what do they say a natural direction for the Sony
Interactive Entertainment Corporation.
Speaker 2: I would not say it's trended in that direction that hard,
because no, that would mean that like ninety plus percent
of your business is digital, and it's not ninety plus
percent across the board. There's still malny of people out
there buying physical games for one reason or another. You know,
the age old statement is like Internet issues and whatnot,
and you might live somewhere where there's data caps, or
you're not slower or whatnot. Also still valid reasons, but
more than ever, it's rough out there. People need to
cut corners where they can, and buying physical games is
an easy way for them to do that and pick
up use games. Physical games go on sale cheaply more
often than digital games, and people aren't People need to
rely on wherever they can to save a bucket. A
lot of times that is physical on top of so
many other reasons. So it does feel bemature is maybe
the word when like, even if the business is trending
that way, the fact that's not the vast, vast majority
of the business feels like they're just trying to find
a convenient excuse to really clamp it down on the
whole production line for games and have full control over
the market on their platform.
Speaker 1: And I think we kind of can see the perfect
ish storm that they are finding themselves in as the
reason to maybe pull the trigger on announcing this right
now and solidifying this January twenty twenty eight date. Grand
Theft Auto six did just get announced as a code
in a box, and then they do have a PS
six that's coming, And I think the expectation for even
people who are diehard physical collectors has been for a
long time now that the PS six is not going
to launch with a disk drive built into that thing.
I think even optimistic people were feeling a little bit
pessimistic about that. This feels like it all but guarantees that.
In fact, Andy Robinson talked to was as and peer
analyst Peers Harding Roles, and it's his opinion that based
on this, there's no way the PlayStation six will launches
before this January twenty twenty eight date. And yeah, so
with the pressure on one side of PlayStation six is
going to be digital only for or the large part
or maybe entirely, Like they are not saying anywhere in
the statement shit sid Chuman did not say anywhere in
the statement Sean like, and we're gonna give you a
way to keep playing your physical games in the future.
They don't say that. So I think we have to
sort of read as this is like the hardest and
harshest scenario, which is there won't be a way to
do that. So on one side, PS six, no disk
drive whatsoever seems very likely. And then this opportunity where
Grand Theft Auto has sort of set the expectation. I
think they're like, let's just barrel right ahead and go
for it. And I think it's led them into the
scenario where it does feel premature. I I kind of
always thought they would just let it peter out, sean
like they would just say, let's here is a PlayStation
six with an external drive, and it's it's more expensive
than it has any right to be, but we're gonna
make quite a few of them. You could buy one
if you really want, and then the people who want
to keep put on keep putting on discs can do so.
And that's not the way they're going. They're just cutting it.
Speaker 2: Off, right. It feels like they're just taking convenient excuse
after convenient excuse to add this all up to give
them a reason to cut a cost right now as
component costs are higher than ever before and they are
trying to maximize profits like now, before there was it
the Sony specifically not PlayStation but Sony. One of the
C suite executives I forget who towards the top said,
you know, we're going to try and maximize our existing
user bases.
Speaker 1: CFO said that, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: I forget exactly what their statement was, but basically, we're
gonna milk PlayStation fans for everything they're worth. It is
like what the statement was, and this is one of
the ways they can do that. They can maximize profit
by Okay, if you're the only game in town figuratively,
if you are the only store around, you get to
unilaterally decide what games cost. And PlayStation has been moving
towards this since twenty nineteen when they got rid of
ad digital game keys. These do not exist for PlayStation
at storefronts anymore.
Speaker 1: What is this then that they're saying here, Okay, so
following this, yeah, I'm just going to ask it for myself,
and I'm sure maybe you'd have an answer. Following the
state new games will be available in PlayStation store and
at retailers in digital formats only, that's stunt me. But
what is that about?
Speaker 2: Okay, So as of right now, there are no keys
for games or PlayStation at retailers. If you want to
buy a digital PlayStation game, you either need to use
your linked payment method or you need to go to
a store and buy PlayStation gift card. So they have
clearly been wanting to like lock things down for a
while now, and now we are at the point where
they are saying we're getting rid of the physical too.
So going forward, Yeah, this is a weird statement of saying, like,
the digital games will be available at the PlayStation store
and at retailers. I can only assume that means that
they will bring keys back in some variety some way.
I mean, certain retailers like Amazon and best Buy will
email you a code and that's the alternative to physical
media at this point. And I think the language there
is also like covering a sort of new type of
cross gen period where like codes in boxes will be
an extremely common thing for them until we get to
the point where they either get rid of codes entirely
or they do just bring back the codes as gift
cards and that's all the games you can get at
retail going forward.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean great, Theft Auto six is a key
in a box? Right, So do they do they need
PlayStations help to do that? I assume they would, right,
they would need play Yeah, PlayStation xboxes help to do that,
So clearly they're ready to they're ready for that.
Speaker 2: Right, because whenever someone manufactures a first party console game,
you need to work with the first party in or
do that like Limited Run for example, they need to
work with the platform holder in or to like physically
manufacture the discs because there's you know, the discs are
DRM to hell, so like they need to come from
the first party, and then they need to be manufactured
by whoever has the partnership with the platform holder as well.
So when it comes to even something like a code
in a box, that company is working with PlayStation Nintendo,
xbox whoever, in order to like manufacture that exact specification
box with like all the legal ees and whatnot, and
like all the logos being correct in every thing. So yeah,
Rockstar and Sony are working together to put out a
code in a box as like a partnership there, like
as if it were a disc. All right.
Speaker 1: So I mean, like, as someone who has been primarily
digital for a long time, now, this still is like
clearly the writing on the wall is I'm also going
to be paying higher prices. I was already playing paying
slightly higher prices, like when I was not buying games
secondhand or waiting for physical to go on sale, which
like you said, does happen more frequently. But now there
will be even less competition. And yes, like you said,
they kind of unilaterally can set the price and they
can you know, still strong arm these retailers with these
codes in boxes of like they're going to have even
more control over that stuff as well. So and I
don't I just don't expect nearly as many games to
do the code and box thing. I think it's going
to be kind of here and there. The biggest games
will get those and they'll go to Walmart and that's
kind of it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that might be like even what collector's editions start
doing Some collector's editions already do that, like you get
a code alongside it as far back as like you know,
this was a small release. I remember my Sonic Mania
Collector's edition came with a code on a metal card,
is what we got. So yeah, absolutely, And that's the
thing that everybody should be worried about and should be like,
you know, apprehensive about. Is like you mentioned, even if
you're not a person who buys physical games yourself. Biscal
games have always kept the market in check because it
is an open market, free market. Once you have a
physical good that you purchase from the first party, you know,
I have a little bit of insight on this working
retail for a while there, Like you know, they purchase
it in bulk for a set price from Sony and
then they get to set the price manufacturers suggested retail price.
They get to them sell that to someone else. And
that's why you get sales on physical games so often
is bec as they're trying to clear inventory of this
physical good and Arthur at that and so that has
made it so that Sony can't say it's their platform,
they can do whatever they want. That has always kept
in checks that they don't say, hey, everybody, publishers seventy dollars,
we really don't want you to drop it lower than that, ever,
seventy dollars, because Walmart can set up for whatever the
hell they want. So that's why there's always been competition.
It has made us, like digital only purchasers at least,
you know, know that things won't get too bad out there.
But if the only way to purchase the game is
through PlayStation directly, that competition has gone, and it's worse
for all of us.
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, the very least. We can rely on
the digital stores being open forever. Anyway, let's get to
this next store of Storia. Sony is closing the PlayStation
store on PlayStation three and Vita. This is from Chris
going at VGC. The timing of this, man, what the hell.
But I think it's also like last time they tried
to do this, where they closed down the PlayStation stores
on PS three and Vita, which they did try to
do back in twenty twenty one. I'm sure that's in
the story somewhere. There was big backlash and they stepped
off and like, all right, we'll keep it around for
a while well, now you'd kind of double these things up.
Let people get mad at the disc thing, and this
thing's kind of actually going under the radar a little bit.
Obviously people are paying them up, but it's like this
is the kind of thing where it's like, oh, okay,
I guess we don't have the energy to be like
furious at both. So this one's going to go through
this time, and it kind of probably always was going
to go through this time, but for sure, but demand
to have these things the same time to be like
by digital. Also, we're closing a digital store. It looks insane, John.
Speaker 2: Sorry, I just got sent a link to an article
from The Verge from minutes ago, headline Sony's PlayStation disc
factory is already being repurposed.
Speaker 1: Geeesuses man, w I mean yeah, I mean that's the
word going around. Is like they've been planning this for
a long time, that they have been meaning to make
this happen for a I mean, it sounds like they've
been planning this since like twenty twenty, twenty twenty one,
and here we are. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Anyways, as to the story you just talked about, this
is a one tube any way. Anyway, anybody who gets
mad that we only have shit to say about Xbox.
Don't worry, we got plenty of hey for the other
three platform holders.
Speaker 1: My fuck up tonight as one.
Speaker 2: Of those nights. It just reads as incompetence on PlayStation's
part to pair these together. Like, I can only assume
the thought process was, Yeah, like a look over here
or get all the bad news out of the way
type of strategy. That's not what you're doing. You just
look like morons when you announce, hey, everybody, the future
is all digital, and then at the exact same time
you say, hey, everybody, digital stores are going away. Yeah.
Speaker 1: It's just crazy.
Speaker 2: It is so insane because like even if even if
all right, I did just yet, I think we have
a guest. I'm curious what this guest might have to
say about.
Speaker 1: I just have a little question from the jesh please.
Speaker 3: It's just if I'm sony computer entertainment. Mm hm, why
would I want to make video game?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 2: It seems like you might not, nicky, It's like you
don't want to do that. Yep.
Speaker 3: Interesting, okay, ah, but I think, like Joshawn's point, it
seems like they could make money off of a video
game hah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean that's wisdom. But that's where you're wrong, clearly.
I mean, maybe know better than us.
Speaker 3: And that's why. Listen, I just work for a company
that makes physical games. I don't know personally, it's been
a pretty chill week.
Speaker 1: Oh boy, I mean yea, I'm sure you guys were
giving full heads up though, No I knew what was
going on.
Speaker 3: Oh my god, yeah no, they let us know. Listen,
I've been sitting on this.
Speaker 2: For twelve months.
Speaker 3: They let us know ages ago, and it wasn't a
surprise to us literally at all. Oh yeah, no, it's
uh sorry, I will I'll get in and I'll get out.
This is one of the most insane things. Like I've
been obviously following video games for a minute, but this
is the most like we're obviously in a crash, but
everyone is doing a thing where they are saying like
everyone's pretending that we are not in a crash of
the of the market, of the economy, of this thing.
That it's like, Okay, Sony is obviously stupid, Like obviously
the people, obviously the people who are running this company
don't know what the fuck they're doing. But there's also
so deeply a lack of it interest in sustaining the
industry that on paper they are in that I'm like,
what do you what do you think you do? What
company do you think you work for? Because the company
that you work for, on paper is one that makes
and sells video games.
Speaker 1: Yep.
Speaker 3: So if you every day are like I think it's
we're gonna make it harder to buy video games and
we're gonna make it more expensive to buy video games.
When the option, when the choice, the binary choice that
people are going to be making in twenty twenty eight
if we get to there is do I buy groceries
or do I buy a video game for the PlayStation six? Yeah,
it seems pretty easy to me personally. I'm gonna buy
so I can keep living.
Speaker 2: Part of the ignorance I was speaking to is just
like a complete lack of awareness of what's going on
around us and saying, hey, and anyways, it's going to
be more expensive than ever over here as well, but
you'll still choose us, right, You'll still choose us.
Speaker 1: Right over.
Speaker 3: Over the Campbell's soup that you have vible y because
because you can't eat anything else, Like, it's just such
it's such short sighted behavior, which I've kind of felt
like in twenty nineteen early twenty twenty, I was like, oh,
I just think that Sony is going to shoot themselves
in the dick so thoroughly that it is going to
be Microsoft is going to do whatever the fuck they do,
and Sony is going to shoot themselves in the dick
so thoroughly.
Speaker 1: That they're actually going to be on parody.
Speaker 3: Vibes wise and working at working at the place that
I work and reading the comments too much to my
chagrin of the post that I write, I'm like, it
seems like nobody's happy, Like not.
Speaker 2: A single soul its happy day, no last like one
single morning, the vibes got insanely rancid to the point
that they are on parody with Xbox feels.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's just a conscious it's a conscious decision that
they have made in an effort to rive the market,
like to go up market. But it's like, okay, just
just to do like very basic like consumer analysis. If
you now think that the person that you are trying
to set the PlayStation six two is the like open
ai anthropic employee who was making two hundred and fifteen
grand to like jack Off at the office.
Speaker 1: Yes, the prompt engineer please.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly how long do you think they're going to
have the jobs?
Speaker 2: Yeah? I like a Christian. You had this post the
other day of just say you don't want gaming to
be for poor people?
Speaker 3: No exactly, and that would be so much more concise
and like, honestly, I would risk assult it more, I
would expect it more.
Speaker 1: And it's clear that that is what's what happens across
the economy right now. The case shape economy is what
everyone talks about. And it's like, yo, yeah, everyone is
feeling pretty rough, but not this top fifteen percent. And
it's like, I mean, yo, you can make products for them,
but that is a smaller group of people. You understand that, right?
And this way forever.
Speaker 3: As a company who increasingly is making suffer that top percent, I.
Speaker 2: Am like a gang.
Speaker 1: What where do you think this ends? Uh?
Speaker 3: Because obviously it is not going to be forever, because
when when, not if when this bubble bursts, where do
you think people are going to be? Like how much
money do you think people are going.
Speaker 2: To happen that?
Speaker 1: Yes, I mean clearly they ended up in this situation
in the first place. Where where like because they were
not thinking head right. All these companies got out over
their skis during the pandemic and being like that line
is going up, it's going to keep going up. Let's
invest like crazy. And you know, it really is a
little bit of a we tried nothing and we're all
out of ideas a moment where it's like, okay, they
didn't try nothing, but their idea was concord in live
service games effectively nothing effectively, that was a nothing idea.
We all knew it all along, and now they tried that.
It didn't work, and so they're like, we kind of
have to just blow things up because that's the only
way to like make more money from like like Sean said,
getting back to that CFO comment of we have an audience,
We're going to make more money from that audience. We're
going to squeeze blood from the stone. And that is
not a long term strategy. That is a quarter to
court of strategy, and it's going to implode what happens
after that, and you're gonna be stuck with that. Like
you're positioning everything for the PS six to serve that
top part of the K shaped economy, and when that
does go barely up, you're gonna be left with a
lot of pissed off people who are not gonna forgive
you gamers like that. Yet we have short memories. I
made a post about the Grand Theft Ought of Six
is coming out, and they're counting on that resetting everyone's
memory and we'll just forget about all this bad news
because everyone's gonna be playing Grand Theft out of Six
And that's it's just not true. For a huge number
of people who actually gave PlayStation the power over the
last ten years, it was people so excited that this
company actually seemed like they were the ones that were
like listening to them and doing the video about sharing
the game of the physical disc game with your friends,
and they won in that moment. So to like to
forego that, to like forsake that it's it's just bad strategy.
Like you, they don't know that they run on vibes.
They don't realize that the gaming runs on vibes and
that they have poisoned it.
Speaker 3: And and I think the thing that's so unbelievably like
obviously all of us are are We're not outside looking in,
but we're like we're in the house looking at them
through like a kitchen window or some shit, like it's
an open concept home and we are looking directly into
the room everything. But it's like, okay, Grand Theft Auto six,
just take two seconds to think about Grand Theft Ato six.
People are going to finish that video game. It is
coming out. It is not going to be literally any different.
It is not going to create anything different than GTA
five did. It is just going to be another Grand
Theft Auto game. It does not even have the one
like the online exactly. It does not have the long
tail that when they announce GTA five if they were
like and also it's a live service game and.
Speaker 1: Like nothing like that, and and nothing is sort of
guarantees that when they try to launch that for the
whatever that looks like that is gonna have its own
set of obstacles of getting that audience back over like that.
Nothing is guaranteed then, and the whole like this is
all built on like this idea of like Grand Theft
Auto six can have that UGC component, the user generated content,
it could be roadblocks for adults. And that's crazy to
bet the farm on that. You can't.
Speaker 3: You just cannot, Like that is not an industry. The
idea of being like, oh, the Odyssey starring Matt Damon
is all of movies is basically the calculus that they're
trying to do. And it's like, okay, Gang, you know
that's not true. You just know that's not true. And
the idea that like, oh, we're going to release this
single player experience that will have a beginning and an end,
and the company that you are banking the entire industry
on has not said a goddamn word about the infinite
money machine that they have been building because obviously it's
not coming out until the PlayStation six comes out. Yeah,
because like that's why, because why would you release it
before then? If you're a rock star, you don't, you won't.
Why would you in the interim head your bet the
way that you currently have.
Speaker 2: It doesn't make any fucking sense. Rob. You brought up
them pushing for live service and that failing because it
is a stupid idea, right. I was reminded of this
post I saw from June twenty six. I was like
checking the dates. I'm like, is this old?
Speaker 1: No?
Speaker 2: This is from June twenty six of this year. A
quote from Hideaki Nishano, who is the current president of
PlayStation right ces.
Speaker 1: Yes, you CEO Sony Interactive Entertainment.
Speaker 2: Yeah, in an interview, a new interview with Famitsu. Again,
I checked the date on this to make sure. Yep,
it's a recent interview. We believe that live service games
are content that attract users on global levels, so we
want to continue to revitalize the market through both first
party and third party content. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Man, I would have a hard time quitting Heroin as well. Like, yeah,
and here's the other thing.
Speaker 3: If I just were, let me just check really quick,
who makes Grand Theft Auto?
Speaker 1: Who yeah makes?
Speaker 2: Don't check that.
Speaker 1: I don't think it says it says, it says that
it's Take two.
Speaker 3: It says it's Take two, and it's not.
Speaker 2: So you don't even make the Heroin.
Speaker 1: You don't you doing? And it's like it's like crazy,
Like you talked about it having a beginning and an end,
and for some people it doesn't though that game goes
off forever. But those people do play on PC when
we're talking about the single player experience. Obviously online does
make a lot of money for PlayStation Xbox, but you
already talked about the issues with that. But it's like
the The thing sort of like that they're not maybe
accounting for here, is that PC could still be on
the upswing despite the high cost of everything, because people
are going to go, what's the difference, Like, okay, PlayStation
I could buy discs and I really felt a strong
attraction of the platform because I was building my library
and it felt really good and I want to keep
doing that. That was a huge part of the people
sticking to that thing. And you take that away and
now it's like, once again, the PlayStation six is going
to look more like a sort of lackluster PC with
some exclusives. That's the thing, some exclusives, and there's recent
track record of exclusives. I'm not talking about the quality,
but their ability to deliver them in a timely manner.
And I'm also kind of not blaming them. These things
just got bigger than ever. Now that was everyone, right.
That's the part where.
Speaker 4: It's like two okay, so two things.
Speaker 3: That is their fault, Like they are the ones that
enabled an economy.
Speaker 1: Basic and maybe more than anyone else, like honestly, maybe
Sony more than anyone else.
Speaker 4: They continued to teach this audience that a video game
looked the way that Sony like that Sony first party
games looked like or look like right, they are behind
the shoulder.
Speaker 3: They are unbelievably well animated, voice acted, intricately designed, two
hundred million dollar Last of Us.
Speaker 1: Part two did on a PS four, which only happens
when you have all of the money spent in the world, right.
Speaker 5: It, So that's on them. The other part of it is,
like we we have so frequently right, like the build
has been you can expect if your PC.
Speaker 3: Is at least as powerful as whatever the most quote
unquote most powerful console.
Speaker 4: Is, you'll be fine.
Speaker 3: Yeah, if nobody can afford anything past a PlayStation four,
why are people going to be making video games that
are not going to look like, yes, this is going
to run well on a PlayStation four.
Speaker 1: This is a This is actually like a like the
waiting crisis, right, the crisis in waiting because because like
so they're going to try to sell us a PS six,
and we already talked at at nauseum on this show
about like how do you sell that? Then? How do
you make people excited about it? Especially when I think
we can all assume that PS five is going to
keep going for a very very long time in that
even a lot of first party Sony games, the big
ones are probably going to be cross gen for they
have to be. And I think, but I think I'm
sartain to think it's going to be the entire generation
because I think that handheld that they might put out
is just going to be a handheld PS five and
at that point that connects those two things forever at
the hip. And at the same time, Okay, fine, yeah,
the PS five is more is powerful enough, But they're like,
if you're a developer, you've got to start like, Okay,
we need to really rethink what we like, how we
try to make our game shiny and exciting and making
it take advantage of the most recent box seem like
a death trap at this point, and we got to
maybe just aim for the switch to nobody will have it. Yeah, yeah,
yeah exactly.
Speaker 3: And I and I don't this part, like I don't
know anything about but like if I was the company
that I work for, I would be like, okay, no,
it seems like as the most powerful you need to
make a video game, or the most the best looking
you need to make a video game is whatever the
best you can get out of the switch too.
Speaker 1: Yep, it doesn't map past that.
Speaker 3: It doesn't fucking matter.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, I said for a long time now video
games do not need to look better than uncharted for
and don't. We should be doing right, We should be
using tools. Tools should be used to make video games
more easily that are at roughly that level. We can
increase resolution if there's headroom, frame rates. If there's headroom,
games don't need to look better than that when you're
spending exponentially more money to get the job done. And
to loop it back to a point that you mentioned,
Nikki of like us not necessarily being on the outside
looking and what about the people who are on the
outside looking at And that's what I'm always most curious about,
because to bring it back to the first story, Mom
and Dad walk into a walmart and they're like looking
for the game and they're like, where the hell is
the game? And the person points to them at a
gift card looking thing and they're like, the game is that?
And they're like, where's the box with the game that
I buy for a relative or for ourselves, for our
weekend entertainer or whatever. It's going to be a foreign
concept to them, and at the low end, people just
aren't gonna want to bother as a certain point. And
at the high end is what Grub mentioned of, well,
us nerds are going to try to maximize our dollars
and probably just go elsewhere. And it feels like there's
just a complete lack of foresight in some of these
moves from PlayStation of the really think that people are
so loyal to you that they won't swap because, let
me tell you, things looked real good for Xbox in
the three sixty era and one bad move was all
it took. One video from Sony was all a toy
to convert a lot of people to a platform that
faith all.
Speaker 1: Was better vibes based. It's so we just want to
feel good about the shit we're playing on, and PlayStation
had that. They've had it multiple times. I don't think
like the excitement for PS four had much to do
with the excitement that I had for like a PS
one or PS two. It's kind of like different generations,
but they found a way to like to transform it
and kind of make it work for the time. But
it was mostly about just sort of posturing against this
force that felt evil that was trying to take something
away from us, and now PlayStations have become that, and
it's that's means it's over, Like there's no kind of
no coming back from this in terms of like getting
these same people to trust you in that way again.
People will still want to play some of their exclusive
games that won't change, but like being able to like
just put it out and be like it's a PlayStation,
get you get it. It's going to feel very different
going forward.
Speaker 3: But does it even make any sense?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 3: Like if you are I've moved, if I'm sure you
can tell who I've moved upstairs, I'm on the podcast now.
Speaker 1: Sorry.
Speaker 3: Is one of those things where it's like, Okay, Sony
can only put out so many video games every fucking year, right, Yeah,
Like like when how frequently do they think that people
are going to be like, oh well, I got to
drop everything to buy Intergalactic when yes, that game comes
literally at this rate once every seven to ten years.
Speaker 1: I mean there's and there's I honestly, like you know,
even like the last of us, those games sold all right,
but they are not the games that like sold. It's
like Spider Man and that's almost it for PlayStation. The
ones that like sell in the twenty five thirty million range.
And there's like there are games that make the world
go round and Sony like they are multi platform and
there's no chance of those changing. Those are the Grand
Theft Autos and the Red Deads and it's like from
games and it's like they have maybe had a chance
one day to have that relationship with from but that's
gone away and something happened. I who could say, like
something happened with that?
Speaker 2: One who could.
Speaker 1: Say, certainly not me. It's just it's just one of those.
Speaker 3: It's like the rate at which people will choose to
do literally anything else that like is so deeply like
not considered by everybody who has power in this industry
is insane.
Speaker 1: People were completely.
Speaker 3: Fine before video games, and people will be completely fine
after them. Like and there's and there's something like this
is my last thing, and I do need to eat
the pizza that I just got out of the oven.
But I'm like, for I have tickets. I have season
tickets to Angel City. Okay, one of those tickets, a
single season ticket is two hundred and fifty dollars every year.
That is, if you do the math, like two and
a half video games I absolutely get more enjoyment out
of going to those games like thirteen fucking times a
year than I do playing a video game. And that's
not because I don't like the medium. I love the medium.
I would not be here if I didn't love the
medium or the medium. But like the calculus that starts
to happen. Yeah, when people are like, okay, if I could,
instead of buying three games a year, go hang out
with people in the real world, interact with them in
a space that is tangible and real and has consequence
that I can literally see and makes me feel something
more easily and more readily than this medium that is
kind of inherently insular. I'm gonna pick the thing that
makes me feel something with other people way more frequently.
Speaker 1: And we've seen, especially like people are when they're giving
up spending, Like one of the last things people are
giving up right now is still travel. Like people want
to be traveling with their friends and families, and they
are like, I will do that, Like they feel like
they get a bigger bang from their buck doing that
than just about anything. And and video games are gonna
have hard time rating up there with that sort of thing.
Speaker 3: They really are you and it you just can't because
it's like it is the thing that.
Speaker 1: You do the most people, we are all freaks.
Speaker 3: If you're if you're on this show, if you're listening
to this podcast, you're not regular. Like the most people
are going to very quickly do the calculus and be like,
I could do literally anything else with this eighty dollars. Yeah,
telling me that the PlayStation six is a thousand American dollars,
I can go to New York and sleep there for
a week instead, Like, I'll just do that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll just do that. Friends do not own a
Currence end console because they said I don't need this,
Like that's the thing that Like, it feels like more
and more companies are taking for granted the fact that
people have the ability to say no, and they think
that they have people so locked down by ecosystems and
everything across the board, you know, tech, games, movies, whatever
whoever it may be. They think they have people locked down,
and it's hubris. It's always hubris, thinking that they can't
do anything wrong. And then we see unforced errors where
they get cocky, they overstep their bounds and then people
just say no and they're like, oh, shit, we didn't
expect them to say.
Speaker 6: What happened in.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, but it really is a bunch of spreadsheet lookers,
a bunch of people who are like, Okay, this numbers here,
but what if we did this? It would add more
to the summer we already have. And they never imagine.
They don't have the capacity in their brain to look
at that barograph and imagine people living inside there that
are that are in a relationship with the company that
they work for, and and then will easily just break
that off if they feel like they're being mistreated and
it's like, no, you you do stand to lose something.
It's not all just going to be additive. There is
going to be give and take. And it's the humorous
it really is. It's a but I mean, yeah, it's
it's hubris because Huber's and panic. Yeah, it's it's like, Okay,
do you think any person on God's Green Earth, the
like an average person is going to know if a
video game that you made cost more than double oh
seven first light to make?
Speaker 2: Oh no, yeah, no, absolutely not.
Speaker 1: The answer is a flat no.
Speaker 3: But the trend that we are on is going is
quote unquote requiring video games continue to cost more than
that video game cost to me, right, which we sustainable.
Speaker 1: Forever, Like we've yes the fact the fact.
Speaker 3: That double A seven first like costs as much as
it costs to make considering what that game is a
game I love very much, but is obviously not finished,
it's not going.
Speaker 1: To pay off, Like what do you think where do
you think it's going to end? And it only pays
off if you get to do it three times and
and you in the third game is like just kind
of using the same technology as all ways, and then
like you get done doing that and hopefully you made
money at the end, and then you kind of have
to start that whole process over again. Because but people
get amaz games this day these days, really they get sick.
Speaker 3: But the Amazon's going to let them make all of
those games on Amazon will obviously they they haven't said
anything otherwise.
Speaker 1: Man, that's all right for sure. Thank you for letting
me crash your podcast anytime. Goodbye. Uh people check out
vgb's Nicky and John Warren do podcast together. It's great.
He's got a whole bunch of other stuff going on.
Be sure to check them out wherever they're doing stuff.
Speaker 7: I'm going the link on the description we need to play,
we pay you in the exposure.
Speaker 1: Of course, it's better better than yeah, better than money.
Uh okay, let's get to this other stuff. In response
to all this, Video Game History Foundation was like, look,
just a quick reminder, we've been pretty sober about this
for a while. Uh, we've not considered discs to be
some great preservation method for a very long time. Now. Again,
these are these are serious librarians, serious researchers of serious
academics over there at the Video Game History Foundation. When
they are talking about preservation, they are talking about it
in a holistic way. They are like, they want to
have not just the way the game was most experienced,
They want to have all the updates in between and
be able to represent that stuff. But really they want
primarily they do want the version of the game that
most people played and these days that has not been
on desk for a very long time. And it's like,
when I think the average person who is collecting a
library of games is talking about preservation, they are talking
about it's you know, it's better than good, it's good
enough because like, fifty years from now, hopefully this disc
still works, and if it does, I'll have a version
of this game that will will resemble the thing that
I mostly played, and if it has some issues beyond that,
that is something I'm willing to accept. As hardcore researchers,
that is something that they are like, No, this is
a problem that we are trying to solve, and we
have worked with this industry or tried to work with
this industry to solve it for a long time, and
they do not seem interested. If anything, the ESA, who
should be trying to create methods for these things to
be preserved for the history and the love of this industry,
they seemingly have no interest in that. So like what
we've been doing is what this we've had to do
from the beginning is sort of like turn the eye
toward piracy, which is where all this happens. And you know,
I think people are a little bit like upset with
Frank Sifaudi for saying, like, you know, discs aren't a
great preservation thing, but it is true and they are
trying to do their job, and he's right, he's right,
and he's pointing out to like the long term problem here,
which still has to be solved regardless of what happens
with discs, right.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Because I say this as someone who is a
fan of physical media, it's still a DRM to solution
in its current iteration. The fact that you cannot rip
your own PS up let's say PS five, because I
don't know PS four may have been correcked. You cannot
rip your own PS five disc and then just have
a backup that you can do freely with whatever you want.
Discs are not a distribution method for retaining that data.
They only exist to serve the DRM in a way
that is more accessible to people. And so you know,
this is another layer beyond what we were talking about earlier,
Like this level of preservation. Preservation needs to happen even
further beyond having any physical media of any way, shape
or form. Like DRM free digital is the only way
that something gets preserved. That's why, like Frank Sofaldi has
reached out to developers and gone to their house to
dump any S cards so that the data is preserved,
because that's the only way that we get it. And
they're they're doing their best over there at the VGHF.
Shouts to them, I love the Video Game History Foundation,
and they're trying their best to keep things preserved. As
best they can, and like right now, I saw Phil
Salvador talking about the Blue Sky today of like, right now,
there's an exemption where they they are allowed to like
jail break a system in order to make uh actual
legal purchases preserved from a library standpoint, But that's also
still not full and proper preservation because it's like, okay, cool,
we have you know, like let's say right now a
WEU that has every game on it. Well, we are
like right now tentatively allowed to like have that, and
like that is a way for us to keep the
data alive. But they can't like loan it out, they
can't use it for research with people. They don't have
that all backed up. So preservation is another nightmare on
top of what's happening right now. There's not a reason
why an all digital future is scary is because that
DRM is the enemy of keeping things alive. Imron had
a good post recently of if you want to see
what a digital storefront that doesn't care about preservations, like,
look at mobile gaming because anything that you remember about
mobile gaming doesn't exist anymore. And that is another big
problem in the all digital future. I mean the concept
of those going away forever.
Speaker 1: Part of the problem of what Frank was even talking
about is like every year, thousands of games come out
that have no disc versions, So like we've been concerned
about this since the first time that happened, and we'll
continue to be concerned about it. So yeah, it's yeah,
it's a big problem on top of all this, and
that doesn't feel like we're any workload. It feels like
we've taken steps backwards on that front constantly, and here
we are again, all right. Xbox is also reportedly thinking
about taking away discs for the next system. They seem
to have a disc to disc to digital thing that
they're testing where people will be able to take their
discs and turn them into digital licenses, essentially turning them
into game key cards. Is the thinking here, Sean, or what.
Speaker 2: The actual constructive criticism? Jeff, this is the one time
where you guys not reading this on GMM, really fucked
you guys.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, please, yeah, go go ahead and this help
me out here.
Speaker 2: If this works as reported, this is unequivocally a good
thing because what it is proposing, and this is reporting
from the verds right now, this could be an additional
layer on top of your physical purchases on Xbox to
preserve them for an all digital future where you pop
the disc into a system where they disk drive and
what happens is your account gets credited with that game digitally.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you get the digital entitlements on top of the
disc having this disc.
Speaker 2: So if it again, if it works as proposed, it's
only an additive thing. If they make it the only
way to interact with a disc, that's bad, and that's
the potentially bad part of this. We'll see how if
this works, how they spin it. I don't know. After
the PlayStation stuff, maybe they just take an easy win
and make it a nice additive thing instead of replacing anything.
But the way it would work is that you pop
the disc into your Xbox One or your Xbox Series X,
and then your Microsoft accounts credited with that game, so
you can play it even with the disc ejected. Like,
I genuinely don't know how much you know about this
because you've been like mostly digital for so long. But
the way it works right now is when you pop
a disc into a system Xbox or PlayStation, it copies
over all data, it can.
Speaker 1: Form a desk and installs what it can right yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, text withss server to update with any additional data
that may be necessary for the last version, and then
every time that you want to play the game, the
disc works as a key, and basically you always need
the disc in in order to play that game. And
this is just proposing, well if you didn't need that part,
what if, like we assume, oh, you have the game,
you just pop the disc out, you pop in our
disc in, and then you just swap between the games
and not need the disc in at all times. So
if it's additive, that's really cool because presumably you would
also be able to install the disc and do it
the traditional way as well. This is a something that
PlayStation would, in my opinion, need to do if they
need additional future because what's going to happen that the
PS six doesn't have a disc drive of any way,
shape or form.
Speaker 1: And they have all these backward compatible discs that are
backward compatible toward nothing.
Speaker 8: Yeah yeah, because like PS five, a lot of people
have purchased digital, sure, but PS four most of us
were still physical and just our discs are not gonna
do anything at PS six.
Speaker 2: You can't like just say that that library means nothing
and erasees. So like, you know, the one glimmer of
light in Xbox from the past couple of weeks is
if this works out, and keep saying it because you
know it's reporting, we'll see how, if anything, this actually
pans out. This is how a bridge, a stop gap
should work into a digital future, even though I still
don't like that digital future.
Speaker 1: This is something I mean, they have to have a
solutter then That's that's what's always read to me, Like
it's like they have to have a solution of some kind.
This would be nice. Now, there was the separate report
that I was referencing on Game of Mornings this morning
that they are going to get rid of disks like
just like just like PlayStation like and that.
Speaker 2: Way, and they probably will like it probably past writing
on the wall forever now Xbox wants to be all
digital and they've always wanted to do that.
Speaker 1: Yep, yep, all right, let's see. I will be curious
to see, like you just you just would think if
Sony had a solution in mind, they would have gestured
toward it in that press release. A EXI human wrote,
So it's I think that's why it's kind of right
now feels safe to assume the worst. I don't know,
it's weird, all right, yeah, and then Rockstar in the
news again as a game developer rights or. Chris Kerr
at Game Developer explained that the people who were fired
for trying to form that union allegedly have created kind
of a laundry list of other toxic issues at Rockstar
to help bolster their case, such as paying inequity, and
that pay inequity often being gender based, mandating crunch, including
having a checkbox on your contract employee agreement that says
you waive your rights that you would have in the
UK or on the British isles for protecting you from crunch,
and then weaponizing bonuses excuse me, which always just sounds
like a real nightmare, where a lot of the pay
that eployees got at Rockstar was bonus based, so it's unpredictable,
which is already kind of frustrating, but it's often, you know,
it's it's determined by a single person above you, and
therefore you have to sort of treat that person with
kid gloves, cause they can just decide on a whim
that you're not going to get your bonus, So it
would create a sort of climate of fear, I would.
I would guess, now, all these things, it's like, yes,
these feel like maybe sometimes small fries compared to this
idea of retaliation for firing someone for trying to join
a union, which is just so clearly evil. But it
does pile up and it adds up, and I'm sure
this stuff will help them. Does it surprise me to
here that Rockstar still has stuff like this? It's it
maybe is not the uh devastating crunch of old, but
of course all that stuff is still kind of in
there somewhere, right.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And it all seems really gross considering what we are,
you know, running towards with GTA six set to be
like the biggest media launch of all time, all weeks
of them just still just try to squeeze every employee
for every little ouse that they can, when there's so
many our solutions. Presumably they have enough money that they
don't need to do this.
Speaker 6: I don't know.
Speaker 2: Maybe that's not the case, but almost assuredly they would
after that game comes out, and the fact that they
would want mandate Crunch to like get the game out
a specific date so they can meet a specific quarter
earnings quarter or whatever. Is just it is so disgusting
to me, and I hate seeing everything you mentioned about,
like weaponizing bonuses as well. It's just wild that company
who is going to be on top of the world
here is still resorting to these tactics.
Speaker 1: Yeah, just a quick quote here. When the bonus is
particularly good, it can be a windfall, but often the
bonus is disappointing and one can end up being paid
considerably less than expected for the year. The reasoning given
for this is often nebulous and consistent between departments, even
inconsistent between team members within the same department, and sometimes
hinges on completely sub subjective or retroactive criticisms. So yeah, cool, cool, cool.
Speaker 2: Cool, Yeah, he continues, shocker.
Speaker 1: So there was some whiplash with Obsidian. This morning. Chris
String had a podcast where he was like talking on
the Game Business, which is his podcast uh, where he
added Obsidianto the list of Arcane Compulsion, Double Find Engine
Theory non dead labs as teams who were negotiating to
try to either avoid being shut down or or being
in the process of shutting down, or maybe getting spun
off or sold. Jason Tryer followed up pretty quickly and
said that there are no negotiations and obsidient is safe,
and it's like, how does this happen? And to me,
like that is the story here For the most part,
I'll say that I don't like dream didn't just say that, Like,
he didn't just make that. He did not make that up.
And I know he didn't make that up. I've kind
of since this happened, I kind of went and looked
and it's like, yeah, that's that was going around inside Microsoft.
I'm not like hearing this from other reporters or anything
like that. Inside of Microsoft. This was going around that
something was happening there. But it's happening so fast, and
we do know that it's the case over at Microsoft
and Xbox right now that they are making decisions within
like a twenty four hour period, and these are the
kinds of decisions that previously under the previous leadership would
have taken weeks or months, and now she's turning these
things around instantaneously. And that is you know, you can
go back to the Gears of War e eday thing
where I said that everyone's like that can't be true,
and I heard stories of Xbox employees leaving the Xbox Mixer,
which was happening at the same time that we were
doing GB at night. When I said that, and they
were turning to each other and going, is this true?
They didn't know. It happened so fast it did not
have time to filter through that place. It sounds like
things just happened very fast with Obsidian, and maybe they
weren't ever like at the risk of being shut down.
But I don't know if it's as clear and clear
as like they were always safe. And Jason tried, didn't
say they were always safe. He just said no, no negotiations,
and they're safe. Now. I think that it is a
fucking clown show over there right now.
Speaker 7: Shot, it sounds what a fun place to work, uh
huh to all those people or those families that depend
on that jobs and and that ship, Like.
Speaker 6: What the are you doing?
Speaker 1: What are the studios that are going to have layoffs
on Monday? Seem to still not know the number that
they are going to be laying off that's happening on Monday.
Tomorrow's a holiday, so this weekend's just gonna be able
to what's that fun?
Speaker 2: A fun way to spend the holiday?
Speaker 1: Huh yeah, right, Like so like it's gonna be a long,
dark holiday for a lot of people at Graham and
then they are going to get bad news. A lot
of people are going to get bad news on Monday.
And and that's like there's also reports of like they
were actually going to do those uh those layoffs this
week and then they slipped it back to next week.
It's gone back and forth a couple of times, because
again they're just flying by the seat of their pants.
And the way that they are sort of justifying this,
Sean is you want to hear this. Uh, it's got
to start up mentality. You see the new xbox, Uh
move fast and break things. Yeah, yeah, move move, move
fast and break things. And you could just justify anything
by saying that you could just break things like that's
and then walk away, which certainly feels like what's happening
right now?
Speaker 2: Yeah exactly. So Yeah, to go to the top of
the segment, this uh the story. I saw some clowns
saying like, oh, people are saying that Obsidian is in trouble,
and then real journalists Jason Schreyer shuts them all down.
And know if any of those dinguses hear this, no
conflicting reports happen journalism oftentimes when sources are different, and
that's often the case with journalists, where like the sources
will be different, and maybe one person has a source
lower down the chain, one person has a source higher
up the chain maybe, And I would say, like apartments,
look for the space where both things can be true,
And I would say the same thing here exactly. And
so it's just a matter of Okay, well, isn't it
possible that this was going to be true? And then
things change, you know, like you've said this, Nate has
to say it all the time, like plans change, things change,
And so we know for a fact that Xbox is
moving so fast and loose by their own admission here
seemingly reportedly that yeah, they are making decisions out of
whim Ash's making decisions out of whim Matt if he is.
And that's why, like all of this fucking sucks, and
why I think management specifically are fucking ghouls over there.
It's why, on a personal note, I do try to
avoid saying like fuck Xbox, because I don't want to
say I'll want in any way, shape or form, have
that think someone think that I mean, like, you know,
fuck Obsidian or fucked double finder. I think the people
who are working or they're trying to still just make
cool things and they didn't necessarily want to do so
under Microsoft. That's why I want everyone to remember that
porportions are the problem. Corporations are the enemy. That's why
Microsoft is the enemy. You may like Xbox, you may
like the games that they make. I know I certainly do,
but Microsoft is a fucking problem. And when you have
Satya and Asha and Matt making absolutely god awful decisions
to affect people's livelihoods on a whim off of a
Twitter poll or something that is flown shit, it's immaturity.
It's probably why Phil and Sarah who you know, they
didn't make great decisions all the time, probably part of
why they got the fuck out there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's a deep lack of you know, ethics,
the deep lack of integrity. It is.
Speaker 6: But the like.
Speaker 7: Work in construction, and I have like three four guys
sometimes and we get desperate when we don't get jobs.
Speaker 6: To like to give them to work with them, Like
it's crazy and it's for four people.
Speaker 7: And if people manage thousands and they don't give a fuck,
those are a thousand some families that like rely on
their jobs the economy. Then, well most people, even in
North America, they don't have like health insurance. They need
that ship. It is it is a lack of like
humanity that it's always at me. It's crazy to me.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 6: I guess so based off I ran out of wards.
Speaker 2: You know, it's crazy, that's fair.
Speaker 1: Absolutely blames, Yeah, absolutely for sure. So yeah, I'm going
to try to like burying my head in the sandalmicus.
I will be on vacation next week, but my heart
is going to be with people, yes, and my heart's
going to be with these people. It's like it's, uh,
it is going to be a dark day for this
industry and it's gonna like these feel like mortal wounds
at a certain point, like the industry will move on,
but it's like, I don't know if I care about
the industry anymore. I uh, certainly care about the hobby.
This is like that then, and I think we like
it's going to be up to us to kind of
figure out ways to enjoy this whole thing without bringing
up Xbox and PlayStation on every show and throw Nintendo
in there as well, Like we got to sort of
find the joy elsewhere, yes, and let let these big
companies figure their shit out over there while we enjoy
video games. Over here, We're gonna enjoy video games like
they and are doing that.
Speaker 2: That's exactly That's exactly why you will often hear like
me and you and a lot of our co workers
prop up things like PC and Steam and stuff like that.
Not because we're saying like yeah, not because we're saying like, hey,
buy an expensive machine that is better so you can
be elitist that old you know, PC master race mentality,
which is always bullshit. It's simply because we want to
support people more directly. We want support developers more directly,
and we want cool artists to make cool things. And
it always feels like when we have stories like so
much of what we talked about basically everything we've talked
about so far on today's show, it feels like corporations
gang in the way, first party platform holders gang in
the way and punishing the people who are making the
money by making the cool shit. And so we just
want to lift up, you know, the cool people making
the cool stuff as much as we can in whatever
way best supports to them. And we you know best,
it is easily accessible to us, and that's why we
have these criticisms. It's just because you know, that's my
last like plead you to like the end of fanboyism.
I swear to god. People don't support a brand, support
the cool people who make the cool thing.
Speaker 1: Yep, yeah you can. Being fans of people is real cool. Yeah, yeah,
I know. I think I this is a story for
a very long time now, like of like why like
PCs specifically has been like okay, that seems like where
the future still is. And it's just think about games
that came out of nowhere and succeeded, and that has
happened consistently on now Steam and all those platforms have
a lot of trouble, a lot of issues of their own,
but if you think about, like if you had an
idea for a game and it wanted to give it
the best chance to come out of nowhere and succeed,
whether it's like one of these recent friends Slap games
or going back to the Battle Royale and stuff like
that that's happening in usually an early access on PC,
often on Steam, but you go back to Minecraft that
was not on on Steam, that was just outside of
their a you know, a kerbal Space program that was
outside of Steam. It just was an open platform where
you can have an idea and an audience. It's willing
to try out new ideas, and it's kind of all
happening there. So it's like an open platform. And and
now Linux does feel like it stands a fighting chance
for the first time in forever, a truly open platform that.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna spend my weekend is getting cashios replaced over
my baz Eye installation is probably what I'm gonna do.
Speaker 1: Hell yeah, yes, Like that's there's there's reasons to be
hopeful in some of these spots. It's just the corporations
we are our relationship has done. We cannot rely on them.
Speaker 2: Anymore, right, And there might there might be a super
chat where this is more relevant, But I'll just bring
up here before I forget. It's something that I was
thinking about earlier today about like people will inevitably point out,
like you know, talking poorly about a day platform when
you are a PC player, And I want to make
sure that's very clear that the reason that I'm okay
with something like Steam, for example, is deterrence because Valve
can't be stupid because PC is such an open platform.
We got them by the balls because the threat of
piracy is always hanging over them. That's why Gabe had
that quote forever ago of like, you know, if people
are resorting to piracy, that's an issue with your platform. However,
you afraid your just.
Speaker 1: An issue, not a camera what he said, not a
pricing issue, it's a services issue.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, like we always have that deterned against them
of Look, if you fuck up, we'll wait. We will
wait for a crack, we will wait for other means
to get the game. We will wait to support a
developer directly. We don't have to use your platform. And
they know that. And that's the thing that I like
about Valve. Gabe is a multimillionaire. He's ryan around on
his yachts and whatever like that. But at the end
of the day, Valve as a company, they're not stupid
because they're smart enough. People running it are smart enough
to know we just want your money. Yes, give you
the good We'll give you the service and the way
that you want it as long as you give us
the fucking money. And guess what, that's all I want.
Off of business I just want you to give me
the thing I want. I hand you the cash. We
go our separate ways. I don't have to say I'm
a fan of Steam, I don't have to say I'm
a fan of Valve. You give me the game and
we're good. The transaction has ended.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and if the alignment that we have here, which
is kind of what we were talking about with with
Sony Microsoft, maybe there was a time where they aligned
with our interests. That's certainly what PlayStation postured themselves as
during PS four, where they were aligned with gamers, and
I consider Valve to be aligned with me in this
moment where I prefer open platforms and I think that's
the future, and that has, to their credit, been their
modus operandi from the beginning, from the beginning of Steam,
they've been like, open platforms is what we will always
choose when given the option.
Speaker 2: How Steam keys are so great because because we don't
have to buy from them, even if we're using their platform,
we can go to like green Man Gaming and get
the game they get eight zero cut yes, yeah, yeah,
like because again it's like retail, the transaction has already
happened in whatever way that may between Valve and the
publisher and the authorized reseller. So it's like it is
that free market that to bring it to the top
here that Sony is getting rid of. That competition is
important and that's why how you have a thriving digital
platform that people actually like is by just giving people
what they want. And it's not that hard to give
people what they want and we'll give you the money, yep.
Speaker 1: All right, And then that speaks to the to the
competition right where it's like, yeah, they like even if
you're talking about steam Keys, they're still competition to keep
price depressed. And I just it's hard to argue that
like Valve Valve, steam does not have good prices, Like
that's that's a difficult thing to make that point. It's
like it seems like they often have the best prices
and if they don't, a competitor selling steam keys will.
So yeah, all right, let's do this last one real quick.
Unannounced Metroid RABBITUS rated in Brazil, right, wrong.
Speaker 2: One, the wrong horn?
Speaker 1: What the fuck? Sean? You hate Metroid?
Speaker 3: Now?
Speaker 2: No, dude, my computer is fucked up. Windows is ass
I'm clicking on the wrong things constantly. What can I
even click on here can I click on golf clap?
Is it gonna give me that one?
Speaker 6: I'll do it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we'll take it. No, I got masters Combs instead.
Speaker 2: Read the headline again.
Speaker 1: Jeff unannounced Metroid RABBITUS rated in Brazil.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I hate windows.
Speaker 8: Uh.
Speaker 1: Hey, what the hell, Sean, what's happening here?
Speaker 2: Good? I need some good news. I had this one's
because I need some good news today.
Speaker 1: Job. A July twenty twenty sixth edition of a sort
of diary of things that have been submitted to a
Brazil ratings agency seemingly includes Metroid Ravenous from a company
called Nintendo of America, with the production year being twenty
twenty six.
Speaker 2: It sounds to me like, finally we're getting that two
D Metro follow up.
Speaker 1: That's like, oh god, I disappeared and it disappeared from
so just so people know it's not up anymore. It
went up and they took it down.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like, and really, this is just they were gonna
make another two D metright eventually. It is just a
question of when and so like, assuming that this is
a real thing that may exist in some form, I
don't know.
Speaker 1: Hey, remember when.
Speaker 2: Metroid dread got leaked Jeff, do you remember what year
that was?
Speaker 1: No.
Speaker 2: Two thousand and six. So we'll see when this game
comes back. Ye, true, but eventually it will, and I
need a glimmer of hope because the day has been
goddamn depressing days. I'm gonna choose to say, hey, we're
getting new metroight eventually.
Speaker 1: Tell you what Metro Dred came out October twenty twenty one.
It feels like that's the right amount of time. It
came out on a which one, So now you put
out the sequel and switch.
Speaker 2: To Yeah, wait, it's gonna be great.
Speaker 1: All lines up. Fuck you, I'm getting my hopes up
for this year.
Speaker 2: Andy or someone of VDC corrob rated this, didn't They
have a story of saying that.
Speaker 1: People, I mean, when they posted that's where I first
saw this. Is that VGC posted this and then and
so usually I know them. They have a pretty high
bar for publishing and they kind of only do it.
But then people separately said that Andy seemingly corroborated it.
I'm not. I didn't go out to find that myself,
but people in chaper.
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, we won't put words in Andy's mouth or
anyone else's mouth. But just like Brawdy speaking, it seems
like there's a little bit of smoke, and I'm really
excited for the.
Speaker 1: Enough smoke of that. Like I said, I'm getting my
hopes up. Like, let's let's do this. Yes, all right,
let's go ahead and take a break. We'll come back
read super chats. We'll be right back after this. Everybody,
all right, we're back with game. Mess decides. Uh, Sean,
let's do the super chats.
Speaker 2: The fuck is this from Missouri? Matt? Thank you for
the supertas always, but thank you Mike and whoever for
the content. Also, I heard you are getting rid of
the disc based version of the show. I know, weak joke.
Go watch Dan try to use a fishing rod on
min Max.
Speaker 1: No, don't do that. That's so that's painful. I need
to see an Yeah, man, I really want to put
out some content on on various old forms of media. Uh,
you know, we're doing a We do have to do
a zine over at a at Giant Bomb. We talked
about that during the bomathon. So that's a start, but
maybe we got more coming. We'll figure it out.
Speaker 2: Well, we'll figure out talk to Addie, figure out how
he did or whatever. Oh yeah, lex Lutie. Everything is
so cool and normal, yippie smiley face.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, it's like not like these things are.
This news is like hurting the stock price for a
lot of these companies. Obviously some of these things would
be welcome by investors boot job cuts and so yeah,
of course it's not. But uh, like the fire that
we feel is not showing up like on Wall Street
or something for this industry. So we talk about like
a crash. That's a clearly something is happening, but do
we call it a crash. It's it's something like that.
It's something akin to a crash, but it's not something that,
like you, definitionally we'd be able to understand, like how
how would this would be put into textbooks or something
like that. It's we're gonna still be pulling the strings
apart of like what is happening in this moment. I
think for a very long time.
Speaker 2: Yeah, JD. Camp is Ronaldo the Yankees of soccer. Yes, well,
I think fifth Tannin of soccer, like oh yeah, go away.
Speaker 1: All right, And that was that was a salt that
diff was doing. I thought about that. Yeah, man, that
really is with a goddamn good yeah man, and he
was groping that lady.
Speaker 2: Outer having three one three ri ip video game.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've been enjoying those where it's like video game
company like successfully makes video game, decides to end their product,
their popular product, video game, and it's like, yeah, that's
where we're at.
Speaker 7: Iwis her old people talk about lay stage capitalism and
like hold like you're ruined movies in Hollowood and I
was like, oh, that's not going to happen. And now
it's happening to video game. It's like, oh wow, they
were right.
Speaker 2: Yep, zombie porn, says call Mike and Jesse. Y'all hat hat.
Speaker 1: I listening? When he is off, we leave alone the
Cleveland streamer, all right, he just does what he.
Speaker 2: Needs to canonically, the Cleveland Streamer.
Speaker 1: That's right, that's right, that's him.
Speaker 2: Ryan Allen won three three games may be dead, but
ever request legends rules. Not sure how new peeps would
take it, but I'm real experiencing losing my early twenties
all over again. Putus.
Speaker 1: Does it have any sort of multiplayer whatsoever, because my
understanding is it's supposed to be some sort of single
player reimagining of EverQuest content. But I've not looked in
into it beyond that being told to me, so I
don't know neither.
Speaker 2: That seems cool though, Yeah, that's a neat idea.
Speaker 1: Okay, cool. Well, then when I get back, I will
beg Mike to make Yeah that's fine, that's better.
Speaker 2: For interesting, okay, okay from hex prof I have been
buying physical games for PS five and when I finished
beating them, I give them to a friend so they
can enjoy them too. This is the most upsetting news
in video gaming to me.
Speaker 1: Love you guys, I mean, just like sharing things you
love with people.
Speaker 2: Is all right, so cool, It is so.
Speaker 1: Cool, and video games have been that from basically the beginning,
or at least any as far as anyone who is
playing video games today is concerned. It's been that way
from the beginning, and so yeah, taking that away in
such a permanent way is yeah, that's rough.
Speaker 2: By the way, that's this is maybe a good time
to mention, because I saw in the chat that it
seemed like I neglected to mention with the Xbox disc
to digital thing. By the way, so like when you
put the allegedly when you would put the disc into
an Xbox it cris your account with a digital copy.
If you give it to someone else or you sell it,
it credits their account instead, and it takes a transfer.
Speaker 1: It takes yeah, just transfers instantly, which I.
Speaker 2: Think I did mention that's that's part of why I
think that would be cool. And also everybody needs to
do that if they are going all digital sony, that's
pretty convenient to do so on like that because hey,
it's a nice bonus on top of the physical and
it's a way to actually like keep a use mark alive,
well happy, even just a little bit, you know.
Speaker 1: You know. Yeah, I think like we were like came
off especially negative one game of Mornings, this one, because
it's like just starting off thinking like, ah man, this
must have been the plan originally with Xbox one, and
so this stuff has just been lying and wait for
them ready to this stuff because it's like they can't
do it with Xbox three sixty and it's because they
never thought they were going but with Xbox one they
were gonna have all this to digital stuff.
Speaker 2: So yeah, right, this disc too digital presumably would not
work like they you know, the reporting from the Verse
said it would not work with Xbox in three sixty games.
And there's some language apparently going around in Microsoft of
like it may not work with all discs because it
needs the information. So presumably, yeah, the discs are ID coded,
like you.
Speaker 1: Said, some sort of unique idea.
Speaker 2: For that original Xbox One plan and that I actually
think that maybe why PlayStation doesn't have anything like that
where you go is because they never wanted to do
something like that.
Speaker 1: Right, and yeah, maybe that's nuts.
Speaker 2: I mean, like, and we have we have friends like
Nick likes to say this, like the original plan for
the Xbox One was good comma actually and kind of
not wrong. Is just like people were so not depending
on the Internet at this point that it just sounded
like a bad thing to be dependent on server check
in any way shape reform. But I think now that
we're moving towards by our games digitally, and also the
store is on a timer. Now we're in that dystopian future. Hey,
a disc work the transfer license somedthening doesn't sound so bad.
Speaker 6: Was the title of our generation.
Speaker 7: He came from the future to warn us and when
you listen to him.
Speaker 2: Sure, Uh, next is g Nitro. The past year I've
been discussing with friends how I'm uninterested in the next
console generation now Sony and Microsoft are guaranteeing I won't partake.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, and I think that's what we'll keep
getting at on on this show and the others is
that you don't have to there's other ways to enjoy
video games, and uh yeah, and and then that and
that is not just go get a PC, you know,
it's go get your old stuff out. And those are
still very good games.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like it's very important video games, Like you know,
jokes aside, jokes aside, video games are not over. You
can play the old stuff. You can like find the
cheapest route to PC. If you want do PC. Your
PS five is gonna be good for a while here.
And even if, like you know, I don't like digital
games on console because it is an extremely drm to
lockdown platform, But if that's how you choose to interact
with them going forward, you can as well, and like
you know, that's your right to do so. And video
games will just keep trucking all along, even if it
looks different and a lot of people, including myself, aren't
gonna be happy about it. Rives is next, not that
Nintendo wouldever disclose the info. But the Okarna Time remake
has the original engine under the hood. What do you
think the chances they looked at the decompilation code while
making the game are I can't tell you with certainty
zero zero. Because companies can license open source software, they
don't like doing so because of the theoretical possibility of
that person, individual team, whoever it may be, then wanting
to say, Okay, but now you gotta give me my cut,
and they just don't want that legal mess.
Speaker 1: YEP. Nintendo especially has avoided that or try to avoid
that where they can.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's why, like you know, the NSO games run
on emulayers designed from the ground up by NERD and
this is why it takes so long for NSL games
to come out. YEP, that to like work with the
emulayer every same time they add a new game. Next
is from Banjo Kazuois sixty four. We are going back. Damn.
Was PlayStation's decision to move their corporate headquarters to USA
and twenty sixteen a massive mistake and the genesis of
a lot of their current issues. I hope you guys
have a great fourth and long weekend.
Speaker 1: I would say that it was simply indicative of the
mistakes that were already happening, the issues that already existed.
It just like that did not cause the problem, but
they're The desire that led to them moving their headquarters
out of Japan certainly led to a lot of where
we're at, you know, and the big part of that
was the unsustainable nature of the games that they produced,
the most of just being like, they need to be
globally appealing instead of they need to be PlayStation games,
which to me is kind of what happened, right. I
think I think they made PlayStation something else. The PlayStation
game means something else, But there was a time where
a PlayStation game meant one thing, and then it needed
to be something else to appeal, appeal globally and to
then that meant that meant let's get out of SAPAM
where a global company, and a global company is headquartered
in the United States.
Speaker 2: So yeah, I think it goes to something that Nikki
said when they popped in of you know, people expect
a PlayStation game is a certain look a certain way,
and that was to look Western, to look like an
uncharted game, to look like some Naughty Dog would make
and internally they just was like like like a movie.
Speaker 1: When when theatic yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: I think it was just them betting big on their
Western studios, on Naughty Dog, Insomniac and Arthur, and wanting
to be closer to them in general, like you know,
headquarters to studios, and I think they just bet big
on that, and that's why we also saw things like
them closing Japan Studio and whatnot. So I think the
stupidity would have happened no matter what, like it would
with any company, and that was just an ext edeting
of the process. Perhaps Taco Belmont's great name as always
no discs just makes PS six feel like a worse PC,
and at such crazy prices, I think I'm better off
just playing PC instead. At this point, he's seen.
Speaker 1: This, Yeah, I mean, this is all this stuff is
the reason that they did pull back on bringing their
games to PC. It's like, oh, it's gonna be hard
to make a distinction between these platforms going forward. We
need something that's kind of the only card they had
to play. Yeah, not paying for online and Steam sales,
you're gonna end up saving a lot of money, even
if you pay a little bit more for the hardware
up front.
Speaker 6: That the machine looking a little more sixy Hey.
Speaker 1: What I mean? I keep using that thing and it's
just it's so handy and so simple, and I just
if it was just one hundred couple hundred dollars less expensive,
it would be the easiest recommendation in the world.
Speaker 2: Yeah, let's see. Next would be there's a lot of
super chest nice. I'm trying to make sure I keep
track of them all as they move up. So thank
you everybody. The hext prop is back. Game stops open
box policy for quote unquote new games with game codes?
How do you even try to trust that Normanis and
grandparents still shop there? At times? You can't, So like
GameStop would have to change the way they do things,
which if you don't know, is still that you know,
they'll have a case on the shelf that you know,
then you they'll they'll put the disc in for you,
and then you walk out of the store with it.
So like, there's no such thing as stealed games in
store purchases for game stops, at least mine mine still does.
I don't know if yours locally has changed that anybody
out there, But like if you buy them. Yeah, they're
they're usually in bad shape and everything like that. If
you buy them online usually they will be sealed, especially
if it's brand new. But also you could get one
that's from a store and they say it's new, so
they would they would have to change that at this point.
Speaker 1: But yeah, yeah, I just I think that they're going
to have to like make that stuff feel a little
bit more special than it does now because yeah, normanis
and grandparents, it's still that's some of the audience. Clearly,
none of these decisions are being made with that in
mind though.
Speaker 2: Next is from Christopher Gardiner. I have to disagree with Sean.
Consumers did this to themselves. It's hard to blame companies
for not choosing uh, not producing physical games when ninety
percent of the market is choosing digital. Love you guys, dumb.
Speaker 6: Victim blame like the straight up they don't.
Speaker 7: They shouldn't have the right to take out take out
like like consumer like, you know, they no matter how
little people use it, you know.
Speaker 1: I think this kind of gets to the heart of
like so many of our issues of like they're just
corporations and they need to do what makes them the
most money. That is almost they're the definitional reason that
they exist to make the most money for their shareholders possible. Therefore,
if there is something that costs money and it doesn't
make as much money as an alternative that makes more money,
already they aren't naturally as as sort of an animal
would go to water, they are going to going to
go in that direction, and no one here disagrees with that.
I think it is. I think what's happening is we've
seen this happen so much in our lives. There was
a chart I saw today that I reskeedd of the
decline in third spaces, the decline and like bars in
our areas, bowling alleys, arcades obviously, like marinas, just things
that people that humans can go to, and because there's
fewer of them, they all cost more because that's the way.
That's also part of the key shaped economy, right, you
make fewer things and you make them more expensive and
more premium to appeal to the people that actually still
have money. And we're losing all these things because people
aren't going out and spending money doing those things, and
that makes them more expensive. So less people are going
out and spending money doing those things. So now we're
getting even less of them, and it's circular, and I
just like we have to sort of at some point
step back and say, when do we get to have
a say in how our lives are affected by these things?
Like where? Why does democracy end when it comes to
the free market? Why do we no longer get a
say in how we purchase our games because it's what's
best for sony. It feels like if we're supposed to
live in a society where you know, every person has
a say in the way things goes, a lot of
people I think, would still vote to have physical games
still be a thing. Now we can't. Can we force
a company to keep making physical games if we don't
lis in that? Like state? Isn't that the state running things?
And it's like that's not necessarily what I'm saying, but
more more say in how our lives go is I
think what people are trying to get at when we
are voting for democratic socialists these days, and when we
are at the whims in mercy of a company that's
saying that we are at the whims in mercy of capitalism,
and we know how that goes over and over again,
and blaming consumers just feels like we don't actually get
to any answer there. That's us going, well, what do
you expect? We wash our hands and we move on
to the next thing that it's going to get closed
down in front of our very eyes, and I just
we have to we have to find a new way
of doing things. We have to find alternatives. And in
some countries there have been there's like the government will
give money for people to create things, and because the
United States doesn't do that, it sort of sets a
precedent and sets a way a standard that we kind
of just go, well, that's the way things are. Yeah,
and we kind of we have to like draw the
line eventually and say, you know, they've gone this far,
this far, no further. And I don't know when we're
going to do that, but they keep pushing me pretty hard,
and I feel like it's the time's coming.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And specific to gaming in particular and the PS five,
Like I was trying to say the numbers as they
were as accurately as possible, because the number does make
a difference, and make a difference, yes, it's not as
reference referencing ninety percent of the market choosing digital first
of all, if I'm looking at the same report they
are referencing, it's eighty five percent. Eighty five is not
one hundred. And also that's eighty five in a quarter,
not specifically the entire year. And so yes, if digital
is approaching, you know it's it's been in the seventy
to eighty percent range. And yeah, sure a quarter can
have eighty five percent, but it's very important to remember
like what games are coming out in that quarter, and
like who is purchasing because of like DT six DT six,
a lot of fucking people are going to walk into
Walmart to pick up GTA six because a lot of
people who want that game, when the biggest games on
the planet are still going to want to go into
a physical retailer to pick up that game because that's
just how they buy video games, because they buy like
one video game of generation, and so you know, the
the split would shift a little bit. My point is
until digital is almost entirely one hundred, you know, we're
talking like ninety seven to ninety eight percent of sales
are digital. Sure, I understand at that point getting rid
of physical, but even when you get to that point,
the point that you brought Jeff of the free market
give us a choice that is so important, and that's
the thing that we're actually mad at because even if
people choose digital, they are choosing digital. They're not forced
to pick the only singular option that is available on
the table. They can go somewhere else if they want to.
And that's what's important, and that is what's being taken
away from us.
Speaker 1: Yes, exactly, Sean, and like and you know, just to
like reiterate your point there, Like, I'm looking at this
chart now, Game and Network Services Segment Supplemental inform from Sony.
Here's how it breaks down. Game software is the total
for the fiscal year of fiscal year twenty twenty five,
they sold a total of two point six million pieces
of software. And then they have two line items below
that where these are sub items. It's physical and digital.
So this is not like eighty five percent of a
game that is sold physically, well, eighty five percent of
those copies are actually all digital. No, it's eighty five
percent of total game sales are digital. That means all
the digital only games are included in that. So if
you actually look at a game that is physical and digital,
it is not going to be eighty five percent, it
is going to be much closer to sixty forty. That
is like, that's my gut reaction. That is me kind
of I'm definitely pulling that number out of my ass
a little bit. But that is going based on like
covering the stuff back when the numbers definitely got reported
and it was forty sixty four long time, forty digital,
sixty physical. Then it went fifty to fifty kind of
halfway through the PS four and stuff like that, and
then it kind of only ever got above there a
couple of times for a game that is on both
I bet it's much closer to sixty forty.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, and that it's very important to like, you know,
read the data as accurately as possible, and that there's
a request to not demand just please keep that in
mind when we're you know, quoting numbers.
Speaker 1: And like I can also I could be guilty of
the same line of thinking as a super chatter though, Sean,
Like when people talk about, hey, they don't make good
romantic comedies anymore, like especially once to go out to
the theater, it's like, yeah, because the consumer stays home
and watches those on Netflix, and they'll watch the crappy
ones and it kind of doesn't matter. So why would
someone make that movie if they can, if it doesn't
feel like an event that gets people out there? But
you know, so I could do that same thing of blaming.
Speaker 2: The trying to find the logic. I get.
Speaker 1: We try try to find the logic, right, So I
get this line of thinking. It's just like there's there's
more going on and we can't help. But you and
I be inundated and all this stuff, so it's like
we see through it a little bit more.
Speaker 2: That's all exactly, okay. Next is from Rob Foster Cosgrove.
Physical media news is bad all over, but the AU
market is fucked. You can get physical games on launch
date twenty to forty dollars cheaper than digital down here,
possibly is about to skyrocket for US twenty to forty
cheaper physically than digital. That is bad.
Speaker 1: That's crazy, And that's just like cause that market is
an afterthought to the digital stores and so they don't
care to like try to position things competitively. That sucks, dude,
I'm sorry, And and that's what's gonna happen kind across the
board here.
Speaker 2: And I I'll you know, I'll claim ignorance on this
one because I don't know how bad it is in
that market. But like Christian, I know you have a
problem with this all the time of like regional pricing.
Oh yeah, some people, some publishers just not doing it
and so things are insanely inflated for you when when
they should be priced, you know, the price should be translated, right, Yeah.
Speaker 7: He needs to adapt to what the the you know,
the income power of the depending power of the right,
the people that lives in that place. So sometimes it
gets you get games there are one hundred dollars and
it's like I can't spend one hundred dollars in the
video game this month. So yeah, right, it's stuff there.
Speaker 6: Good luck Australian, good luck.
Speaker 2: Good luck. Yeah all right. Next is from the Dubious Food.
My heart goes out to the impovers Sony Corporation during
this time of duress and hardship. I feel the need
to donate. Yep, thank you so much, Jay Tinch ninety
four It all caps infinite growth fuckers.
Speaker 1: Huh yeah, that continues to be the heart of it.
Where it's like, isn't Sony making more money than ever?
What else? What's the problem. It's like, yeah, but they're not.
I don't see where the next more money than ever
is coming from, so they have to kind of blow
up the whole house.
Speaker 2: Yeah, next is from Laosian, doesn't doesn't This opened up
Sony to the monopoly argument, and I would say it should.
But also, you know the lawyer is going to point
an Xbox and say, well, they still exist, and plaint
in a Nintendo and say that's our competition.
Speaker 1: Yep.
Speaker 2: You can only hope that some judge is going to say, no,
you borns, they're.
Speaker 1: Not right, because what factors into the pricing decision. And
it's like, we know that it was like competition with
the rest of the market, but yeah, the lawyer will
do tricks to make it seem like it is the
game on the Xbox, and it's like, no, the person
who is purchasing the game is actually usually not deciding
between getting it on a PlayStation and Xbox. It is
getting it digitally or at Walmart. And that's where the
competition came from and that's what defines the price.
Speaker 7: By the way, if this if di ever happened, which
is not gonna happen, but if it happens and he
gets to all the way up to whatever court to
what the Supreme Court.
Speaker 6: Guess who they're gonna side with.
Speaker 7: Like they're not gonna side with the consumer or whoever is,
like to say, with the corporation.
Speaker 1: I mean that's I was designed to protect oligarchy, is
what I'm learning recently. I'm sorry. Yeah, Like the Supreme
Court is there for a reason, and it's to do
exactly that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, next is from Malley Miracle. I have never
seen an industry that hates their consumers more than the
gaming industry throughout the years.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, part of that's just us being cursed
with the knowledge of knowing these fucking companies, Right, but
you're not wrong that they especially once that just kind
of had it all. You have it all, You could
just keep kind of doing this and grow slowly and steadily.
But no, they can't do that.
Speaker 2: Like I was thinking about this earlier today, and I
was thinking of, like, who is truly evil? Who can
get away with evil stuff? And ah, right, music producers
because music industry is corrupt as hell. That's how we
get to stuff like Spotify and some rich ass dudes
just like make as much money as they can nobody
else gets anything, artists getting streaming revenue, which is like
fractions of pennies per play or whatever like that. So
that's the really really evil stuff. But yeah, yeah, that's
just because people can't talk back about music. Really. Hex
prof is back again. This same footshot happened with Unity
three D.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, these companies will kind of do a lot
of these moves of just making everybody hate you. In
one fell swoop because they think they found some new
money glitch.
Speaker 6: Yeah, Unity thing was crazy.
Speaker 7: They were like, if you if we're gonna charge you
as much, people like like how much people need stole
the games?
Speaker 6: Like wait, what, we don't gonna that's.
Speaker 2: Stupid, really dumb. Yeah, then we have slippery moose Cakes,
great name. Why not make the digital game slightly cheaper
and then have a print on demand system for physical
copies and you pay a little bit more because that
would make sense and they're not thinking.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, just you know, off like offload it.
You know, let one of these third party companies like
an iron a bit handle it for you, say, hey,
get big enough to do this for us, and or
just do it at the scale that you can do
it and sell it at whatever you need to sell
it at, and we could serve all these audiences, but.
Speaker 6: You're gonna get a better product.
Speaker 7: Also because like this, the people who is gonna make
the thing that the disc, they're not gonna make it obligation.
They're gonna make it because they're in that business. They
like that business instead of like the big companies.
Speaker 2: Uh, eat your vegetas is next. Xbox is being run
by Twitter and AI.
Speaker 1: Oh yep, and that's how the people working at those
studios feel. They're very frustrated because they feel like they
feel like they're the company is being run by Twitter
and AI. That's how they feel.
Speaker 2: So yeah, when you bring in a new leader, new
leader is supposed to have ideas of how to run
the company. She's not supposed to go to everybody else
and see what the armchair analysts want. Yep, hex prof
one more time, Sony and Xbox are competing for the
largest shit pile. Seems like that some days.
Speaker 1: Yep, it definitely does.
Speaker 2: Let's see and then my let's scrolled pass all of
hogs is next. Thanks for introducing me to dKu deals.
Last year, I got Dragon Quest three and Final Fantasy
Tactics for twenty bucks each have a good fourth.
Speaker 1: Yep, yep. If you are there, especially if you're hunting
for a digital game sales, Deco Deals continues to be
an excellent resource. They just kind of have a good
interface for finding sales.
Speaker 2: Yep. Find the deals where you can, right, Yep. The
drum Kit ninety two can't believe Xbox would make decisions
off community polls. Giant Bob would never do that. Unrelated
but can't wait for backlaur and the Cats suit meowiness.
Speaker 1: That's a good idea. I mean we should do something
with that.
Speaker 2: We should look that to a pole. Yeah, Laser Wolf
watching live Thanks the Holiday tomorrow and Mike isn't here.
Does he hate me?
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what That's what he said.
Speaker 2: That's what called in. It was crazy laser Wolf.
Speaker 1: Yep. He's like, I think laser Wolf might be there.
I'm not going to be there today.
Speaker 2: Yeah, real jackass Uh Jedi Muss for Nintendo has made
mistakes and made bad decisions, but ultimately still believe their
solution to their problems is in making video games, and yes,
hit the nail on the head. Nintendo makes stupid business decisions,
anti consumer decisions all the time, at least they're making
video games in the process.
Speaker 7: They make so many video games, they're like they're having
like saved them enough, save for just in case for
a rainy day. They're like, we've got like a couple
of hitters here that we're just gonna sit on them.
Speaker 1: Yep. And then and then when they add new businesses
like movies and theme parks, it seems like they used
that as a way to launch new video games, which
continues to be the way they make money. So as
long as that continues to be the case, I will
continue to be like, all right, I think I'm once
again aligned with Nintendo, so I can still feel pretty
okay about it while recognizing they make many mistakes.
Speaker 2: Zombie Porin what tier leaker is the country of Brazil?
Speaker 1: That's an s tier leaker for sure, Tier one leaker
of the year.
Speaker 6: Please, I've been pretty leaky pretty good leakers. That sounds bad?
Speaker 2: You have knowledge, dang. Next is the drum Kid ninety
two number one just picked up Makin X on Dreamcast today,
looking forward to playing it this weekend. It seems rad
has anyone played it before? Thoughts on it? Yeah, this
is the shin Macgammi tense game that they put out
on Dreamcast.
Speaker 1: I believe was it? Is it like a like a
hacket slash game?
Speaker 2: Is that?
Speaker 1: Yeah? I think it's first slash interesting.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because the the like, I forget how many SMT
games are like this specifically, I don't think many, but
at least the first two PERSONA games had like first
person dungeon crawling. It seems like, yeah, they played off
of that. But hacking slash game.
Speaker 1: Man, that looks pretty slick, cool man, Dreamcast games rule
love the.
Speaker 2: Dreamcast h T bucket. While I have bought more digital games,
I bought physical games for my brother for birthday gifts
in the past. No more disc games, no more disc
game gifts will suck.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean god, I you know, I just remember
many times in my life giving video games physical games
to other people as gifts, and like, when you get
it right, it feels so good. So it's just a shame.
Speaker 2: Yeah, uh Nintenderic. The video game industry sure confirms my
thoughts on capitalism being a bad system every single day,
doesn't it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's not not really made any of it better. Like,
I mean, people will argue what capital is, what was
what got us the systems in the first place, And
I just it was academics and stuff. Yeah, yeah, I
mean the reality is like the history computers is, it's
all of it. It is all of it working to
get there. It is academics, it's uh, state funding usually
for military applications, but state funding that would fund science.
It is then like private entrepreneurs forget yes, yeah, yes,
since competition, right, but it is like that is the
history of computers. It is shows how when all those
things are healthy and working together, that it can actually
produce some really amazing things. And I think what we're
seeing is there is one part of that that is
quote unquote healthy, and that is capitalism, and the rest
of it's withering on the vine. And that's how things
go so bad.
Speaker 2: Anyone's wondering why I keep eating my hairs because I
have a fan over there blowing in this direction. Well,
the central air ac on me because we only have
so much of b in this frinkingdink apartment. Next is
boondog All Hobbies. Literally just saw a Sony ad for
a PS five disc drive for eighty bucks on Facebook.
I feel sick.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just, I just, I mean, I don't get
why they don't just let it peter out. It would
be it's going they're going to get what they want anyhow,
Like people are going to just keep going more digital
than physical naturally, as as we just sort of talked about,
like these things could just happen because they could just
make it more convenient, and uh, yeah, I just don't
get why they don't let it happen naturally.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like it's so easy to do. It's all
they needed to do, and it's just you didn't have
to play things out this way, you know.
Speaker 1: That's yep.
Speaker 2: I don't see them reversing course unfortunately.
Speaker 1: Yeah, me neither.
Speaker 2: Yeah, hex prof snucknar one in here. Sony made happy
console game er sad? What the fuck?
Speaker 1: So?
Speaker 2: Yeah, did you see that GVG clip going around where
they have the good vibes gaming? I intro of just
like GVG pops up on screen at Casta them as
just John going fuck, that's good, and I was like, oh, no,
bad vibes gaming.
Speaker 1: Yeah, like butt blood curdling screams and it's just like
the event Horizon Ship or whatever.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like Mike just screaming NonStop during the BombCast
on Tuesday. Okay, zombie pouring, putting another one on a
lighter note after these heavy topics. If Dan were to
die via lightning strike, how long would it take Grub
to ask Finelli to join Blake Club.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, like the ten fifteen minutes.
Speaker 2: Yeah sounds right. You know you got replacements lined up,
don't worry. Oh yeah, we have to in the case
of Dan Zac's ac. I love all the old game
content recently, Endurance run the handheld stream, this is the
run Blake Club, especially in this climate. I'm just getting
into retro achievements on Sean's recommendation p penis.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't know. I keep thinking about, like, could
we do some content aroundtro retro achievements. Maybe we should
idea Yeah, okay, maybe we should start with like a
general stream kind of showing it off, and then maybe
go with a focused idea so we'll coot to it over.
Speaker 2: Got it's a structured idea.
Speaker 1: Okay, I love that. I love that. Okay, fantastic.
Speaker 2: Next The Doubler twenty three. I just bought the Last
of Us part one on eBay for forty five dollars.
It's still ninety dollars. Digitally, I'm saying, that's like Canadian
or something.
Speaker 1: It's just like you wouldn't have bought it, right if
that wasn't the op, if you didn't have the option
to get the forty five dollars verse right, the doubler, Like,
it's not like they lost forty five dollars. They gain
like what you got it on eBay, But it's like
like you got a chance to play it, and now
you're using the platform, you're engaged, And I think they
should take that as a win instead of looking at
this as, oh, this person would have spent ninety dollars
if they couldn't get it for forty five. There's no
way you were gonna buy that for ninety. So I
just don't again, like it might move a couple percentage
points of people toward spending more money, but a lot
of people are just gonna choose to do other stuff
with their time, like Nikki was saying.
Speaker 2: Exactly, And it's like, if if you can't get your
games for forty five dollars, you're just not going to
buy the thousand dollars machine. Yeah, so, and that's the
bigger problem for them in the long run. And then
last one for now. Cono necho sama. Hopefully everyone has
a fun and safe weekend. What's your favorite fire work
and grilled food?
Speaker 1: I like the firework that looks like the weeping Willow
tree where it kind of like all spreads down in
a really like satisfying and slow motion way. That's my
favorite firework. And then my favorite grilled food is I mean,
I like it all, but I know on a fourth
of July, I think I probably just do want a
hot dog. That's that's good stuff. How about you, Sean, I.
Speaker 2: Got some beer broughts in the fridge. I'm looking forward
to frying up. That's good stuff for sure. Yep, some beer,
brought some potato salad. It's gonna be a good time.
And then based on where I live, we don't do
fireworks here anyways. Based on where I live, we still
do fireworks here. So I like the little guys that
like spin around on the ground as like a sparkler
kind of thing.
Speaker 1: Oh I love those two absolutely.
Speaker 2: Yeah, for like a smaller scale one. That is it
for out Jeff and insane amount of super chest Thanks
everybody for support everybody.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it means the world, it really does, all right,
Good job, Sean reading all those let's go to a break.
We'll come back. We're gonna talk about what we've been
what we've been playing. Show has been going on a
long time. I'm trying to do a quick one like
goal pace and here we are. It's eleven o'clock. All right,
we'll be right back, all right, Sean. Uh yeah, no,
no segment tonight. We did have one maybe we're going
to do and Christians like, ah, we'll see how how
long we go. And I think we probably went too long.
So instead we're too long.
Speaker 6: Brother a game though for the next you know.
Speaker 1: Then yeah, time, We've got some stuff in our pocket
for when for next week and when I'm back after that. Okay, Sean,
what have you been playing?
Speaker 2: I can keep this quick, Jeff, because it hasn't been much.
I've been floating a little bit, so mostly some older games.
Hey actually, wait a second, way saying, yep, entirely old games.
This past week, that's the last time we talked. Uh,
you know a new game that is actually an old game.
I did play star Fox. I did do a full
run normal route and the hard route.
Speaker 1: Yep.
Speaker 2: And I think star Fox for an Intel switch too
is a very pretty version of Star Fox sixty four
and that's about it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but yeah, and that's I mean, you just exactly
what it is. And uh, I think whether it's gonna
hit is going to depend a line on the person. Generally,
it seems like most people are like, yeah, that kind
of rules, and I think for me, it like I'm
in that bucket that kind of rules, with the caveat
of like I hope this just leads to more starfucks
and it does feel that way. But you know, as
far as playing this game, when I'm playing it, I'm
having a really good time, just like I always do
playing Star Fox sixty four.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and like it is one of those rare cases
where I do actually wish even as a budget game.
You know, I had the same experience with Invincible Verses
even as a budget game. For what's there, I do
wish it was even just a little bit cheaper, even
like ten bucks cheaper.
Speaker 1: At forty dollars, this is like a this is a
real banger.
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, forty t that make sense. Okay, you're remaking
one of the all time greats. Like it probably did
take quite a bit of where to like put out
a game that looks as good. But at the same time,
there's not a ton of content in there unless you
really get into a multiplayer. So yeah, I still love it.
Though I'm a huge Star Fucks fan. It's one of
my favorite video game series and so seeing it sixty
four is a masterpiece of a game. Look this good,
having all the little flavor between the different characters and
everything like that. I love Kat in this game. They
overhauled Cat and she's awesome now and I had a
good time with it, even if Yeah, it's I think
it's an unexciting project. Is kind of how I would put.
Speaker 1: The characterization of all the characters. I know there's some
stuff that's added new you into that. I know you're
a Star Fucks person.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like it's kind of all stuffed. That is alrighty there.
It's kind of like, you know, like when they really
address Samus being a bounder hunter and a bounty hunter
in the Prime series, it's like, this isn't necessarily something
you get in the two D games as much, but
it's always been there, so it makes sense for them
to all that out, and I think all the characters
are a characterized good in uh, the six Star fucks remake.
I think some of the voice performances are buying like
they're well done. It's just like there's not the character
of like, you know, Falco being from Brooklyn basically or
something like that. So I think they kid used a
little bit more of that, but it is nice to
like get some of the extra lore drops as well,
and you know, like, uh, I think it was revealed
in this game, like your cat being part of Falco's
old crew and like adding little bits of flavor like
that was really nice.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't I don't remember if the whole thing
about the the Big Ship being like the.
Speaker 2: Great Fox being on loan for eighty years.
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, having a Yes, having a mortgage, Yeah, mortgage.
That that that that Fox is still paying back even
though it's dead.
Speaker 2: I believe that's new.
Speaker 1: Yes, that kind of stuff. I'm like, oh man, there's
something about that that really hits. And I kind of
like kind of hope that is that is part of
the next game where it's like you are making money
to pay off the ship or whatever. That could be
a fun system to miss around with. I hope that's
what they're table setting here. No idea if they actually
are but if Vellin Studios is gonna get the follow up,
I think they can handle.
Speaker 2: I do hope. I really hope this is a repeat
of the Metroid situation where you know, Mercury Steam did
SAMs Returns to prove that they could do an original one.
I hope this is val and getting their chance to like, hey,
we did a great remake of Starfux sixty four NINTEO
season numbers angries, and they're like, yep, all right, yeah,
permission making a new one. Let's go, We'll get the budget.
Al yeah, So I mister now has a wider support
for retro achievements beyond just like the nes NS was
like the first core to get an updated with miss
retro achievements support. Now Super Nintendo Denesis and sixty four
and PS one, you can get retro achievements on your
mister choice, including my superstation over here. It was very cool.
I was streaming the r day ging achievements in Super
Mario sixty four on something resembling original hardware. That was
very cool. So I love that they add that and
then another sort of mod type of thing. I did
discover IW four X for the first time, which is
a community fix and mod and like framework for Modern
Warfare two, the original multiplayer on PC. Okay, yeah, and
that's had security issues for a long time. The performance
wasn't great, it didn't have controller support, and they fixed
all that. It's it's more secure now. It has a
server list where you can go, and there's like people
do community servers and stuff like that. There's performance tweaks.
So I was running at two hundred and forty fps
at fourteen forty p and it has native controller supports,
so I got to play with my Xbox with am
assist just like it kind of feels like playing MW
two as it should have been remastered this whole time
instead of just the campaign, and it feels like I'm
kind of even though it's only PC, it kind of
feels like almost play being able to use my controller
against people with keyboard mouse and then you know, like
with our people with controllers and everything like that. So yeah,
i W four x's name of the mod. I believe
there's some copycast scam sites, so I'll even like get
the r L I U S so.
Speaker 1: I W four dot com.
Speaker 2: Sorry, go ahead, Oh yeah, Mike, Mike knows, he knows
all about uh yeah, I W four X the number
four dot io is the r L I okay yeah
it uh. Me and my friends play at the R
night and it was like we're, you know, back in
high school, the good old days of just like you know,
staying up, like playing in Marrow Warfare two. It was
it was a fun time.
Speaker 1: Okay. Man, that's that's really cool, although very illegal according
to the es. Are all right, he uh uh all.
Speaker 2: Right, anything else, Sean, that's it from me, how about you, Jeff?
Speaker 1: Rhythm Heave and Groove. I reviewed it over in Giant Bomb.
It's doing all right in the on Open Credit and
stuff like that. Run at eighty three eighty four or something,
and I think that's about right. It is for me.
It's like, man, this is still rhythm Heaven. The songs,
the music really good. The games that you're doing are
in that right and that sweet spot of it's simple inputs.
You are either pressing a or one of the direction buttons,
and that's kind of it, and that's that's ideal. But
then like sort of the rhythms that come at you
or like sort of the setups for pressing the buttons.
So a lot of times there are audio cues. Those
will come hot and heavy, or they'll have some sort
of little twist to them, and you have to keep
up with it. So it's like that's where the depth
and the complexity comes from. And so it's simple and
complex at the same time. And so that's exactly what
you want from a rhythm game, but especially Rhythm Heaven,
it's always been really good at that. There's just something
occasionally a little off with the way the game looks,
especially like the menus. I wish I had like a
screenshot of that, open that first menu, but it just
looks like Unity placeholder stuff. It looks very generic. And
then that does cross over into some of the mini
games here and there, where I think the art looks
a bit stiff, a little bit generic, not across the board,
and a lot of times it's very cute and very
well done. Most of the time it is, so it's
just occasionally I'm gone, huh and I raised my eyebrow
a little bit, and then the song plays and that
sort of all washes away, and then you know, eighty
five percent of the time, it's like, no, this level
just looks really cute, this is great art. I'm having
a wonderful time with no caveats, so a worthy sort
of follow up to what has happened with Rhythm Heaven
and like one of these great fun games to get
at the somewhat discounted price on switch to a switch
and switch to of fifty dollars. I think this is
what this one is. So yeah, I don't know, have
you ever been into a Rhythm Heaven game. I'm not
sure if that's ever been your thing.
Speaker 2: No, just because you know, it is sort of one
of those that kind of just flew under the radar
in general, and I think I want to go back,
and I want to play not the Original Guy Translator,
game Boy Advance. I had to go through all of them,
so it's easy to do so now because I do
love warrio Ware and I do love rhythm games.
Speaker 1: So it seems like a me, that's that team Rhythm
Heaven megamix on it was three d.
Speaker 2: S right, it was at the yes three yes, yes.
Speaker 1: Yes, that's a that's a good way to sort of
get a good glimpse of the whole series for sure, gotcha, Uh,
that's kind of it for me. I've also been pretty busy.
There's you know, some other stuff I can't talk about
quite yet, but some stuff I'll be able to talk
about soon. Yeah, do that when I get back. I
think I think that's said Sean. Any other super chats?
Speaker 2: No, But did you see the message from one to
more Hussein in the chat?
Speaker 1: Oh? No, I might have missed it. What's up?
Speaker 2: He said? Hello? Everyone, please support the UTEP minors. Thank you.
Speaker 1: You and Nicky were talking earlier, and something I'm like,
is that Tam And I look down and my Instagram
just had a picture of this. Maybe AI created a
mascot for the U TAP minors and it just looks
like it looks like it sounds like Tam. It looks
so much like Tam. It was very distracting. Check out
you want to posted on Blue Ski. Everybody go check
that out?
Speaker 2: All right?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Like I said, any did you say there's no
other super chats?
Speaker 2: Nope. We are caught up long episode for a big
news day, So let's get out here, Jeff.
Speaker 1: Yeah, fantastic. Sean. Tell people where they can find you
on the internet, what you have going on, where they
could catch your streams stuff like that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Turbo Shawn everywhere on the internet. Shawn I stream
nowadays on twitch do tv slash Turbo Shawn on Saturdays
and Sundays noon Central for like four or so hours,
and then I post the VODs over on my YouTube
channel the same name. You know what I asked people
to show up for, like the superstation video that I
put up on the YouTube channel, and hey, people showed up,
So thanks everybody. First week, just a VOD upload of
a stream that I did to get like over twelve
hundred views, was like really cool. So I'm glad people
found that informative. I liked doing stuff like that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think you were smart to kind of present
it like this could be a show as well. So
so that's a good way to do something like that.
So yeah, well done.
Speaker 7: All right links on the description for the people listening.
Speaker 2: Thank you, Christian.
Speaker 1: Well, I'll make Mike figure out what's happening next week, everybody,
but he's he's planning to do shows. Yeah, these guys
figure it out, probably exactly so, but yeah, so tune
in for last than nintend Dogs next Tuesday and uh
and decides on next Thursday. And then of course got
us doing stuff during the day over on Giant Bomb.
That's always happening and uh, this is the run just
started over there with Mike playing Sewer Shark and it's
uh we were we balk recorded a handful of episodes practices,
uh you know, tech tests, it's it's it gets wacky,
So definitely tune in for more of that on on Saturday.
But yeah, boy, I am looking forward to this, uh
you know, actually looking forward to the drive. I like
a roach, Sean, I like kind of hopping in the
van and yeah, just like sort of like, oh, I
have a something that can keep me engaged and I
don't have to think about anything else. You just got
to keep this thing going forward in a safe way.
So that's sort of a good way to begin to
begin unwinding at the beginning of a trip. And then man,
I just like Traverse City a lot. That's that's my
kind of sound. Thanks for listening, everybody, You're the best
audience in gaming. Have a good one, take care of yourself,
and goodbye.
Speaker 2: Let me see if Windows wants to give this one
to me.
Speaker 1: Man, for so long I fantasized about sucking their own dick.
Make sure you get a good screenshot on this ball.