Speaker 1: Hey, y'all, and welcome to Pink Shade. Today is a
Speaker 1: bonus episode. That's right, it's a bonus episode just because
Speaker 1: I love you. This is the recap that I did
Speaker 1: with my friend Amy Archer four. Should I marry a murderer?
Speaker 1: We decided that the answer is no, No, don't marry
Speaker 1: a murderer. Don't marry this guy. He was kind of
Speaker 1: a hot murderer and that's always the problem. But anyway, guys,
Speaker 1: I love talking to Amy. She's my friend. You know,
Speaker 1: she's got a little miss recap and murder she watched,
Speaker 1: loved chatting with her. So here is your bonus episode,
Speaker 1: and thank you so much for being a listener, and
Speaker 1: I'll always remind you. Please follow me over on Instagram
Speaker 1: at pink Shade Pod and you'll be able to watch
Speaker 1: this video. Also, it's on YouTube. You can look up
Speaker 1: pink Shade over on YouTube and subscribe there. That'd be great,
Speaker 1: Thanks very much.
Speaker 2: Okay, Mary Paine, should I marry a murder?
Speaker 1: Are you a drug addict?
Speaker 2: I will say this as I labeled our recording session.
Speaker 2: He's hot. So should you marry a hot murderer?
Speaker 1: Maybe? I think once somebody tells you that they murdered somebody,
Speaker 1: then you should put down the cocaine and head back
Speaker 1: to your cute single girl apartment with your professional career
Speaker 1: and forget it ever happened.
Speaker 2: That's what I think true. Okay, Mary Pain, I have
Speaker 2: a question for you. Shall I marry a murderer?
Speaker 1: Mother? Shall I sleep a danger?
Speaker 2: No?
Speaker 1: I don't care if he's hot. I do think a
Speaker 1: big part of this show was the addiction. And I
Speaker 1: think that if your boyfriend, even if he's the nicest
Speaker 1: guy you've ever met, who doesn't think you're too much,
Speaker 1: you know, put down the cocaine, head back to your
Speaker 1: profession and tell the police and move on with it.
Speaker 2: I love how David Green and we'll get to him.
Speaker 2: I love how he keeps bouncing and being like, but
Speaker 2: she's so smart, and I'm like, dude, you have no
Speaker 2: idea the power of a hot trash man clearly right,
Speaker 2: Like no amount of college education is going to overcome that,
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 1: And I think she was so into going out there
Speaker 1: and seeing the beauty of the land and the way
Speaker 1: that he lived, which was beautiful. It was so beautiful.
Speaker 1: And then but she was saying it was COVID times
Speaker 1: but I was like, it seems like it was like
Speaker 1: late twenty twenty or twenty twenty one, so you didn't
Speaker 1: have to be isolated. She seemed to be going to
Speaker 1: work just fine. I don't know, well, she works amongst
Speaker 1: the dead, so.
Speaker 2: Right, and I mean, I'm assuming there might be like
Speaker 2: a receptionist to let you in the place. But she
Speaker 2: had that nice boss she did. She did all right,
Speaker 2: So we are talking to you about should I'm Mary Murderer.
Speaker 2: It is on Netflix twenty twenty six. People. I don't
Speaker 2: know about over a pink shade, but on Lima's recap
Speaker 2: Everybody in Murder she watched everybody wants me to cover
Speaker 2: this show?
Speaker 1: Uh well, you and I tried failingly to get screener.
Speaker 1: She did, and I will tell you that even Kate
Speaker 1: Casees and I get screener. Yeah, and she was asking
Speaker 1: as well. And then that's when Kate was like, go
Speaker 1: find these people on LinkedIn, go find them on Instagram,
Speaker 1: asked for it. I was like, you know, I don't
Speaker 1: care that much. A lot of times I don't care
Speaker 1: that much. And I think I did follow them on Instagram.
Speaker 1: I'll be unfollowing them now. But uh yeah, people are
Speaker 1: interested in the story. I personally thought the documentary was
Speaker 1: really good. I thought it was done really well. I
Speaker 1: did watch it on She's okay, what's wrong with me?
Speaker 1: I don't listen. You can have your opinion, and this
Speaker 1: is you know what you do?
Speaker 2: Okay. One of the problems that I always have is
Speaker 2: I just felt like it was too long. It needed
Speaker 2: a story editor. We didn't need twenty minutes of her
Speaker 2: explaining like the exact actions they took in their drunken
Speaker 2: stupor like just say, you know, the next couple of days,
Speaker 2: we did a shitload of coke and we got really
Speaker 2: drunk and here's what happened.
Speaker 1: Okay, Well, I disagree.
Speaker 2: I liked telling, not showing.
Speaker 1: Well, I you know, I also have a big problem
Speaker 1: always with reenactments. Yeah, and because it was a lot
Speaker 1: of like showing the back of her head walking into court,
Speaker 1: but it wasn't the back of her head, you know.
Speaker 1: It was a little bit of like, yeah.
Speaker 2: And doesn't it always We'll get into the recap in
Speaker 2: a second, guys, but I have to get your opinion, like,
Speaker 2: isn't it always wild watching this kind of stuff as
Speaker 2: an American? Because you're like, you know, they're locking people
Speaker 2: up for having a pistol and you're like, what just
Speaker 2: the it feels almost precious. It feels appropriate, but almost
Speaker 2: precious compared to America's idea of violence and what we
Speaker 2: do to each other. Yeah, like I want to live here.
Speaker 2: I want to live in the Scottish Islands.
Speaker 1: It was interesting. We covered Ladies of London this past
Speaker 1: season on the podcast and it was very interesting in
Speaker 1: London because on the show there is a girl whose
Speaker 1: brother was gun down in the street in front of
Speaker 1: his wife and child, you know, on Christmas Eve.
Speaker 2: Oh my god.
Speaker 1: So they're telling the story like this was what happened
Speaker 1: to her brother, and then another person on the cast
Speaker 1: is like, well, who cares, It's just like another drug deal,
Speaker 1: and they're like, ah, you can't say that, Like that's
Speaker 1: actually terrible. That was her brother. Yeah, no matter. We
Speaker 1: kept going like, obviously, no matter how it happened, is
Speaker 1: still her brother. This whole thing I was like, and
Speaker 1: what is so crazy is probably the most egregious part
Speaker 1: of it was they just could not believe the gun
Speaker 1: violence where that didn't phase me at all and gun
Speaker 1: down on the street in front of your child, sure, sure.
Speaker 2: But it's just this American lens and it's I was like,
Speaker 2: I don't want it. It's horrible, but this is where
Speaker 2: we are.
Speaker 1: It was you know, I wanted to know, like was
Speaker 1: it mafia and it was drug related? And it was like,
Speaker 1: was he the king pen? Was this Oh he came
Speaker 1: from this country? Was was he a smuggler? Was he
Speaker 1: a drug garn I was like trying to the shooting
Speaker 1: of the person with the illegal gun did not even
Speaker 1: occur to me, yes, you.
Speaker 2: Know, yeah, And I'm like, okay, so they hit this
Speaker 2: poor cyclist, which you know, rip justice for Tony Parsons,
Speaker 2: but like, okay, like that's not murder, Like we're accustomed
Speaker 2: to murder.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they were like, and they found guns on the property.
Speaker 1: Were like yeah, yeah, yeah, okay.
Speaker 2: So we start with our protagonist, doctor Carolyn Muirhead. She's
Speaker 2: a pathologist living in Glasgow. She's coming off a bad
Speaker 2: relationship and she I guess again, we get a lot
Speaker 2: of detail that we don't need. I guess they're setting
Speaker 2: us up for. She's just in a bad place, vulnerable,
Speaker 2: and she meets this hot guy. Now they were hot,
Speaker 2: these brothers. Correct. Can we get this out of the way.
Speaker 2: You and I have trash taste.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, the brothers were hot.
Speaker 2: Sandy is. She gets on tender. She meets this brother Sandy.
Speaker 2: He's twenty nine, he's six', four he's a. Hunter he's
Speaker 2: wearing a. Kilt, NOW i could not date someone sixty.
Speaker 2: Four you And i've talked about, this well my, husband
Speaker 2: Because i'm only five to one AND i would feel
Speaker 2: like their.
Speaker 1: Child, well my husband is sixty four And i'm five
Speaker 1: four and a, half so he has one foot taller than.
Speaker 2: Me SO i do sometimes try To timmy is one
Speaker 2: foot taller than me because he's six foot on five foot. Essentially,
Speaker 2: okay it, works so they match On. Tinder she immediately
Speaker 2: drives the one and a half hours to go meet
Speaker 2: him at his isolated. FARMHOUSE i totally would have done something.
Speaker 1: Like, yeah not at. THIRTY i mean she was Like whennesday.
Speaker 2: Thirty she's thirty and she's well.
Speaker 1: Educated, okay so, yeah you might want to meet in
Speaker 1: the middle at a coffee. Shop that just, Yeah she.
Speaker 2: Says it's this, beautiful magical place in the, countryside and
Speaker 2: he's hot and manly in all the, things And Mary,
Speaker 2: payton the bar is so low that she's just happy
Speaker 2: he lets her sing in the car without, LIKE i,
Speaker 2: guess smacking her or. SOMETHING i don't.
Speaker 1: Know when they showed them in the car and they're
Speaker 1: doing like because she's videoing, EVERYTHING i guess in case
Speaker 1: she does get. Murdered and they're driving through like a
Speaker 1: riverbed or, something and she's singing out, loud and she,
Speaker 1: says he let me sing in the car and my
Speaker 1: ex told me never to sing in the car BECAUSE
Speaker 1: i was too. MUCH i was too. Loud AND i was, like,
Speaker 1: okay well that was What, yeah and that was. It she.
Speaker 1: Says he let her be herself and that's all she. Needed,
Speaker 1: yeah she we do.
Speaker 2: See SEE i think those are snapchat. Videos you think
Speaker 2: she's just been doing herself proof of life kind of.
Speaker 2: THING i think it's.
Speaker 1: Snapchat it probably is, snapchat but you, KNOW i DON'T
Speaker 1: i don't understand the.
Speaker 2: Snapchat like it didn't seemed like TikTok to.
Speaker 1: Me definitely not. TikTok but maybe she was just, like
Speaker 1: let me snapchat my friends to show. Them oh look
Speaker 1: at this crazy Experience i'm. Having because she's like a city.
Speaker 2: Girl, yeah she said she was driving almost every day
Speaker 2: from her job at the mortuary to the, farm and
Speaker 2: they were partying, hard like drinking, drugs and she had
Speaker 2: never done that kind of, Stuff like she was cool girling,
Speaker 2: it which we've all been, there not to this.
Speaker 1: Extent that was weird that she all of a sudden was, like,
Speaker 1: yeah we were like drinking and doing drugs all the.
Speaker 1: Time and first of, All i'm, like, hey what kind
Speaker 1: of drugs and be you never were like a casual
Speaker 1: drug user in. College you're, like this is this will
Speaker 1: be fun with this. Guy all of a, sudden now
Speaker 1: you just out they're doing the, Cocaine.
Speaker 2: LIKE i cool girled it in, that LIKE i would
Speaker 2: go ON i was just talking about, this LIKE i
Speaker 2: would go on long quad, rides which NOW i would never.
Speaker 2: Do timmy dated that, woman did not marry, her got.
Speaker 2: It so there is certain cool girl. BEHAVIORS i engaged
Speaker 2: and probably drinking a little more THAN i, should but,
Speaker 2: Like i'm not going to become a coke.
Speaker 1: User, no that's. Extreme and Also i'm kind of like
Speaker 1: she's she was going out there every, weekend SO i get,
Speaker 1: That but does he ever come in down to her?
Speaker 1: Apartment do they.
Speaker 2: Only when he's on the, Run only when he's on
Speaker 2: the run from the.
Speaker 1: Wall, okay, okay so, yeah that's weird that They it's
Speaker 1: not like a half and half, stitch you. Know, yeah
Speaker 1: he is some kind of.
Speaker 2: Hunter he runs like hunting, expeditions so he knows how
Speaker 2: to kill things and she works on dead. Bodies so
Speaker 2: she's like it was a match made in post life.
Speaker 1: Whatever, yeah and you do wonder what her tender profile.
Speaker 1: Said she says that, Later, yeah for him to swipe
Speaker 1: on her To.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah maybe he's looking for somebody to help him
Speaker 2: out murder more.
Speaker 1: People, yeah because, MAYBE i, mean you could happen. Again
Speaker 1: you never, know the stupid cyclists are going to come.
Speaker 2: By there's a nearby, bar The bridge Of Orchy hotel In,
Speaker 2: sandy and it's twin Brother robert are known to be quite.
Speaker 2: ROWDY i, BET i bet these two are.
Speaker 1: Menace, yeah because they're out, there they're really isolated out.
Speaker 1: There they come into town and they just rip it.
Speaker 2: Up yeah, yeah, Yep caroline, Says sandy would just kind
Speaker 2: of change after a few drinks and become somebody. Else
Speaker 2: and at one point they're out there drinking and shooting
Speaker 2: clay Pigeons and did you ever shoot clay. Pigeons i've
Speaker 2: actually done, that believe it or.
Speaker 1: NOT i want, to, THOUGH i feel LIKE i would
Speaker 1: never hit. ONE i Mean i've done, shooting but you,
Speaker 1: know at camp and, Stuff i've done.
Speaker 2: Shooting mm.
Speaker 1: Hmm is that? Wrong Isn't it's just?
Speaker 2: Cute Good.
Speaker 1: LISTEN i grew up in a gun, family right because my,
Speaker 1: parents you, know my dad and all the men in
Speaker 1: the family and, everybody all big. Hunters still are very
Speaker 1: ding to my husband's, family our.
Speaker 2: Hunters my family was.
Speaker 1: Not, YEAH i, mean you, know, gun the gun cabinet
Speaker 1: with the lock on, it the whole.
Speaker 2: Thing and.
Speaker 1: UH i did tell my mom recently that one TIME
Speaker 1: i opened the bedroom, drawer like the next to my
Speaker 1: dad's side of the, bed and there was like a
Speaker 1: gun in, there like a. Handgun AND i said To,
Speaker 1: MOM i, go thinking back on, that that Probably i'm that.
Speaker 2: Great, yeah this is according to the, scops he should
Speaker 2: have been thrown in.
Speaker 1: Jail, WELL i, MEAN i guess that's just that was
Speaker 1: the eighties who. Cared they're, like we have three, girls
Speaker 1: what are they going.
Speaker 2: To it's jen. X you just had to survive, it that's.
Speaker 1: All there's a. Gun but at CAMP i took shooting
Speaker 1: riflery is what it was. Called took a, riflery so
Speaker 1: you don't have to lay. Down then you graduate on your.
Speaker 1: Knees AND i did graduate all the way to standing
Speaker 1: to shoot the. RIFLE i wasn't bad and AND i
Speaker 1: was we you AND i was pretty good at. IT
Speaker 1: a camp, too, WELL i think you are not allowed
Speaker 1: to take riflery when you're a, junior which is the,
Speaker 1: youngest SO i THINK i think that's like, second, third
Speaker 1: fourth grade you're not. Allowed and THEN i think you're
Speaker 1: allowed to take it like the second year of an,
Speaker 1: intermediate so probably six seventh. Grade. Wow, yeah but you have,
Speaker 1: to LIKE i, said you have to lay, down and
Speaker 1: you have to be good enough and show that you're
Speaker 1: proficient enough laying down to then do it on your.
Speaker 2: Knees this has gotta be A southern.
Speaker 1: Thing it's A southern camp for. Sure it's An Alabama
Speaker 1: AND i can't imagine a.
Speaker 2: World in which they're handing seventh grader's.
Speaker 1: Guns these are literally like their, rifles and they're like
Speaker 1: just target shooting, rifles you. Know, YEAH i, Mean i'm
Speaker 1: sure it would take your eye out or give you
Speaker 1: a real good flesh wound if you got in front of,
Speaker 1: wine but it never.
Speaker 2: Happened, well they're shooting these clay, pigeons and all of
Speaker 2: a sudden he's, LIKE i think we should get, married
Speaker 2: and she's telling all her friends and they're, like girl Doing.
Speaker 2: Yeah at one point they're out at night and they
Speaker 2: start talking about their, secrets and he finally, confesses, like,
Speaker 2: look a few years, ago we were partying at The
Speaker 2: bridge Of, orkie like you, know the wild spot in.
Speaker 2: Town we left pretty. Drunk we hit a cyclist and
Speaker 2: she was, like did he, Survive And sandy at first says,
Speaker 2: no we hit him at a high. Speed there's no
Speaker 2: way he. Survived and then they were, like we didn't
Speaker 2: call the cops because we would have went to jail
Speaker 2: forever and this was just a bad, mistake and we
Speaker 2: panicked and buried. Him AND i was kind of, THINKING
Speaker 2: i don't know if you felt this, way BUT i was, like,
Speaker 2: well that's like a tragic, accident but it's not.
Speaker 1: Murder, YEAH i, yes that's What i'm. Thinking it's a tragic.
Speaker 1: Accident it's not. Murder now where it becomes negligent homicide or,
Speaker 1: whatever when it kind of goes into it is when
Speaker 1: they didn't.
Speaker 2: Tell, anybody, right and he was alive.
Speaker 1: If we think at this, point, oh he was dead,
Speaker 1: immediately and so it was almost, like well he was,
Speaker 1: dead so we just we panicked and we just buried. Him,
Speaker 1: yeah but even that's really really.
Speaker 2: Bad i'm thinking to, myself, like what WOULD i, Do
Speaker 2: god forbid IF i was really. DRUNK i, MEAN i
Speaker 2: would risk the. DUI i would never not tell somebody
Speaker 2: THAT i get somebody they lenient dui, loss.
Speaker 1: Try to get medical attention for the. PERSON i, mean you,
Speaker 1: know that's my first, thought let's get medical.
Speaker 2: Attention but that's what they were scared, of, right is
Speaker 2: getting like A dui or, something because the hit was an.
Speaker 1: Accident the hit was an. ACCIDENT i, mean unless you
Speaker 1: know it's gonna come out later like we saw him
Speaker 1: and we hunted him, down which it never.
Speaker 2: Does but you, know you do keep waiting, though for
Speaker 2: it to get, worse don't.
Speaker 1: You, yeah because you're, Like, okay this is actually kind
Speaker 1: of an understandable, accident and you could sort of be, like,
Speaker 1: okay you could maybe encourage your. Fiance you should go
Speaker 1: to the, police you should tell. Them you probably have
Speaker 1: to go to jail for a, year, like let's work through,
Speaker 1: this unburden. Yourself but, no she just SAID i like
Speaker 1: the cocaine, life and the cocaine life likes. Me let's.
Speaker 2: Go she's searching for a missing cyclists in the. Area
Speaker 2: she finds the articles About Tony. Parsons she realizes it's.
Speaker 2: Him he was like a cancer survivor Crossing scotland for, charity,
Speaker 2: like this is. Horrific he disappeared In september twenty. Seventeen
Speaker 2: so this is, NOW i think it's early twenty, twenty
Speaker 2: so it's been two and a half, years three.
Speaker 1: Years, yes something just happened and the light went really.
Speaker 1: Dumb did that happen for?
Speaker 2: You? No you look, okay you look. Nice, OKAY i keep, check,
Speaker 2: CAPER i thank.
Speaker 1: YOU i just keep checking because you, KNOW i don't
Speaker 1: know what's happening with my. Camera i'm. Audio, okay it
Speaker 1: just all of a, sudden it seems like it got
Speaker 1: a little. Dark but let me just lighten up my camera.
Speaker 1: Here sorry to interrupt with that technical difficulty.
Speaker 2: Containing, Okay so apparently what had happened Is Tony parsons
Speaker 2: went into this same pub and was, like you, KNOW
Speaker 2: i need a drink and the bar was, closed so
Speaker 2: they get the pub owner gave him a cup of
Speaker 2: coffee and a. Biscuit it's offered to put him up
Speaker 2: in a, hotel And Tony parson's, LIKE i gotta finish.
Speaker 2: THIS i gotta finish, this and he's like but it's like, dark,
Speaker 2: Yeah AND i don't know if it was raining or
Speaker 2: if that's in my, head but dark and, raining And
Speaker 2: Tony parson's, Like i'm doing. It i'm, good and then
Speaker 2: that's the last WAY i ever hear from.
Speaker 1: Him it's weird because it's, like do you wonder if
Speaker 1: like the next town over was expecting him and, like
Speaker 1: do you know WHAT i? Mean like he had it routed,
Speaker 1: out so Like i'm going to stop at this particular
Speaker 1: place at myl blah blah. Blah they're giving me the
Speaker 1: room for the night Because i'm, this you, know AND
Speaker 1: i could post it on the Cancer Da da. Da
Speaker 1: SO i wonder if he was, like, NO i just
Speaker 1: have to stop here Because i've only got like eight
Speaker 1: to go UNTIL i get to the hotel that's. Sponsored,
Speaker 1: right that's a good.
Speaker 2: Point she's freaked. Out and, meanwhile the next Day sandy's, like,
Speaker 2: OH i THINK i found someone to marry, us so
Speaker 2: like acting like this never.
Speaker 1: Happened she's, like we can talk about the dead guy
Speaker 1: or not going to talk about the dead.
Speaker 2: Guy she's, like in, RETROSPECT i probably should have went
Speaker 2: to the, police BUT i wasn't. Sure and then we
Speaker 2: get this whole this One i'm talking about a little
Speaker 2: too much for. Me we get this whole description Of
Speaker 2: christmas and her parents and then putting out the picture
Speaker 2: of him and they're going to the house and the
Speaker 2: dog's eating off his lap and the dog loves, him
Speaker 2: and so every the. Parents her parents are, lovely by the,
Speaker 2: way and they Like sandy and they're great with.
Speaker 1: THEM i think that all of that is to show
Speaker 1: she's now in so. Deep it's sort of like when
Speaker 1: people the wedding gifts start to arrive and people have
Speaker 1: booked their hotels and they don't feel like they can
Speaker 1: cancel it because now other people are. Invested you, don't
Speaker 1: do you know WHAT i? Mean whereas, parents, well now as,
Speaker 1: parents we know it could be four minutes before the,
Speaker 1: Wedding please cancel. It you, know we would much rather
Speaker 1: you do.
Speaker 2: That THEN i was just talking about, this like my
Speaker 2: dad was kind of, like do you want to do
Speaker 2: this the first TIME i got? Married and that's like an,
Speaker 2: IDIOT i said, Yes.
Speaker 1: BUT i think it's the same idea is because now
Speaker 1: the family so, invested and she feels, Like, wow they're
Speaker 1: so proud of me because BEFORE i had this shitty
Speaker 1: boyfriend and they put out a picture of him and
Speaker 1: the dog likes. Him.
Speaker 2: OKAY i was a little confused by this because she
Speaker 2: she seemed to insinuate, that like she was this huge
Speaker 2: failure in her parent's, eyes and she was so nervous
Speaker 2: still let them. Down i'm, like, girl you're a doctor
Speaker 2: and you're like.
Speaker 1: THIRTY i, Know AND i don't know what that was.
Speaker 1: ABOUT i don't know if that was about she had
Speaker 1: had a string of failed boyfriends or maybe she partied
Speaker 1: too much and then got her doctorate. LATE i was, like,
Speaker 1: oh it seems like you're kind of killing.
Speaker 2: It, yeah she's killing. It so she finally at one,
Speaker 2: Point sandy's freaking out and he's like this state has
Speaker 2: been sold and they want to dig up where the body,
Speaker 2: is and he's, LIKE i might need you to help,
Speaker 2: Me like how do we burn a? Body and then
Speaker 2: there's this whole discussion Of she's, like, no you need
Speaker 2: a furnace like it needs to be you, know thousands of.
Speaker 2: Degrees and he's, like, WELL i poured a shit ton
Speaker 2: of bleach on the.
Speaker 1: BACK i was waiting for him to, say can we
Speaker 1: dig up the body and will you take it to
Speaker 1: the morgue On friday when you go to.
Speaker 2: Work can you just that would have been better use
Speaker 2: of his of his uh of her.
Speaker 1: Throat throw that body in with somebody. Else nobody'll. Know
Speaker 1: that's WHAT i Was that's WHAT i thought he was.
Speaker 2: Asking, yeah and this is where she, says like it
Speaker 2: did say pathologists on my little tinder.
Speaker 1: Swipe, hmm, yeah but you have to. Wonder so they're
Speaker 1: selling the estate and they're maybe going to develop it or.
Speaker 1: Something there's going to be home but. Something so they're
Speaker 1: concerned that abacco would come.
Speaker 2: Through you're just, LIKE i don't know what that.
Speaker 1: Is but they're just pulling out backos of. Stuff they're
Speaker 1: not going to be, like, OH i want this tiny
Speaker 1: little leg. BONE i don't know because there were deer
Speaker 1: bones in.
Speaker 2: There so she decides she's going to the, police and
Speaker 2: first she drives to her parents' house and has a complete,
Speaker 2: meltdown saying he killed. Someone he killed. SOMEONE a cop comes.
Speaker 2: Over they talk and she realizes, LIKE i have no
Speaker 2: information on. THIS i don't really know where he's. BURIED
Speaker 2: i don't really know what. Happened so she decides now
Speaker 2: that she's gonna need to find the. Location so she
Speaker 2: like cozies up To sandy and they go out, shooting
Speaker 2: and he's kind of, like, oh he's right under our,
Speaker 2: feet and she leaves her red bullcan. There but and
Speaker 2: that's How David green pronounces, it red bull can not red?
Speaker 2: Bullcan the red bull?
Speaker 1: Can, well red bull? Can you know my favorite? Thing,
Speaker 1: sorry you're watching on. Video, Okay i'm so distracted by
Speaker 1: my White victorian face THAT i really am having such
Speaker 1: a hard time. CONCENTRATING i don't know what to do
Speaker 1: about the lighting in, here. Guys, Okay so that part
Speaker 1: was confusing to me because she's drinking a Red bull
Speaker 1: and they go clay, shooting and he, says, oh REMEMBER
Speaker 1: i told, you, well it's right under your. Feet so she,
Speaker 1: thinks how CAN i mark this? Spot because you, know
Speaker 1: in your, mind you're, like, well that's the spot where
Speaker 1: you go clay, Shooting so, duh it's such a vast.
Speaker 1: Spot so she, thinks how COULD i mark this? Spot
Speaker 1: i'm gonna throw my red. Bullcane so she drops it
Speaker 1: and he's, like you can't leave trash out. Here what
Speaker 1: are you doing? Littering, yeah and so she because littering
Speaker 1: is his. Concern but she pretends to get it and
Speaker 1: it throws it back over her shoulder and she doesn't
Speaker 1: know if he sees and guess that he. Doesn't but
Speaker 1: then when she gets in the car without the red,
Speaker 1: bullcan he doesn't, go, hey throw, it throw it in the.
Speaker 1: Bag why didn't he say where's the?
Speaker 2: Can maybe he was so coked out of his mind
Speaker 2: he didn't Realize hey forgot.
Speaker 1: That he even told her, okay, okay all, right if
Speaker 1: you need to remember about the.
Speaker 2: Drugs, yeah she tells the police she marked the red,
Speaker 2: bullcan so they're going to go, in but at the last,
Speaker 2: Minute sandy's going to a friend's, house So carolyn's like
Speaker 2: trying to find, him and then they finally arrest. Him
Speaker 2: so they bring the mckeller brothers in for, questioning and
Speaker 2: the cop so, like we have, nobody no, evidence nothing
Speaker 2: outside of Just carolyn's, word which is hearsay at this,
Speaker 2: point so they have to release. Him and this is
Speaker 2: where we Meet David, green who's kind of the dick
Speaker 2: bag of the.
Speaker 1: Episode, okay but when they show them in that first
Speaker 1: interrogation where they're asking you, questions have you ever killed?
Speaker 1: Anybody no no? Comment have you ever heard of this?
Speaker 1: Cyclist no? Comment have you ever burned somebody? Alive no?
Speaker 1: Comment it's like the questions were that you would be,
Speaker 1: like have you ever killed? Anybody no?
Speaker 2: Right have?
Speaker 1: You so how did he know to just say no?
Speaker 1: Comment have you ever heard Of Tony Parson's?
Speaker 2: No maybe he lawyered up, immediately LIKE i always advise
Speaker 2: everybody to do lawyer up, immediately and then the lawyer
Speaker 2: just said keep saying no.
Speaker 1: COMMENT i, guess but we didn't see any lawyer in. There,
Speaker 1: yeah SO i don't. KNOW i did like. That the
Speaker 1: guy was like behind, plexiglass asking these, guys, yes well
Speaker 1: it WAS covid, Right well.
Speaker 2: We we we're covering On Little Miss. Recap we were
Speaker 2: covering the vow and When keith AND, eari you and
Speaker 2: all those guys are going to, prison it's like right
Speaker 2: at the height OF covid and we were laughing because
Speaker 2: the reporters who are like ten feet away doing their
Speaker 2: solo shots have their. Masks like remember you thought you
Speaker 2: had to wear, Masks like even when no one was
Speaker 2: anywhere near, you you're just sitting in your house in a.
Speaker 1: Mask you just see the people driving in their cars
Speaker 1: by themselves. Masks, yes we didn't know what to. Do,
Speaker 1: yes because we're, covering we're Redoing welcome To platfa and
Speaker 1: it's we've gone THROUGH covid times and they walk into
Speaker 1: a restaurant with their masks and then they sit, down
Speaker 1: no mask and you're, like, oh it makes.
Speaker 2: It you just walked through the.
Speaker 1: Restaurant, okay, yeah but, okay, listen we didn't what we
Speaker 1: had to.
Speaker 2: Do, sure so they let them go and they are, Sure, caroline,
Speaker 2: like we Didn't we didn't say. Anything we kept your.
Speaker 2: Secret they don't know, you but kind of, LIKE i don't,
Speaker 2: know they've got to know it's, Me like this is.
Speaker 2: Weird they're kind of, dumb. Right the, brothers, WELL i
Speaker 2: think the.
Speaker 1: One, brother what's the twin brother's, Name robert And.
Speaker 2: Sandy sandy's the, Boyfriend robert's the.
Speaker 1: Brother So robert immediately goes it's obviously your. Girlfriend the
Speaker 1: only two people in the world that know are me
Speaker 1: and you and we and you told her so obviously
Speaker 1: that's who it. Is, Yeah sandy's, like, oh she would
Speaker 1: never do that to.
Speaker 2: Me, well and the cops are also saying To, caroline,
Speaker 2: like why don't you break up with? Him? Now it's
Speaker 2: a good. Time just you, know me got arrested for.
Speaker 1: Murder, yeah, yeah say that you you.
Speaker 2: Were arrested for murder and that freaked you, out or you,
Speaker 2: know say you're busy at work or. Something you, know
Speaker 2: you're busy at work with the bodies that you've, killed,
Speaker 2: right so you, Know, okay, OKAY i have a cough drop,
Speaker 2: in just letting everyone. Know, sorry. Okay David green says
Speaker 2: we didn't give her witness protection because we assess the
Speaker 2: risk and it wasn't very, high and we advised her
Speaker 2: to break up with him and stay with their. Parents
Speaker 2: and her parents are, like this is. Bullshit she was.
Speaker 2: Terrified NOW i need to talk about, this. Okay they're,
Speaker 2: like when there is somebody in like an abusive relationship
Speaker 2: and a crime is committed for that, witness for that,
Speaker 2: partner they provide all of this. Support this blew my.
Speaker 2: Mind as An, American i'm, like what the fact that.
Speaker 1: They would consider giving her any kind of protection or
Speaker 1: support was pretty pretty. Great it was even. Considered it was. Great.
Speaker 2: Yeah, YEAH i mean in this, country you could be
Speaker 2: in a school shooting and they don't provide support for,
Speaker 2: you and you could be a. Child, yeah wild.
Speaker 1: Wild, Yeah they're, like you should you should really talk
Speaker 1: to somebody about.
Speaker 2: That. Yeah In march twenty, twenty they go out to
Speaker 2: the property look for the Red bullcan they do find?
Speaker 2: It but they need to find the, body and so
Speaker 2: they do all this like weird soil testing before they
Speaker 2: even start digging to make sure that they have found.
Speaker 2: It in the, Meantime carolyne goes running back to her,
Speaker 2: apartment her, flat and her wedding dress is waiting for,
Speaker 2: her and she puts it on and she cries on the.
Speaker 1: STAIRS a lot of a lot of self filming happening,
Speaker 1: HERE a lot of, IT a lot of self. Filming.
Speaker 2: Yeah she gets a message now From robert And sandy's
Speaker 2: friend and she's, like OBVIOUSLY i need to respond or
Speaker 2: they're going to know That i'm The, no you could
Speaker 2: just ghost, them be like Freaking tricia just ghost each.
Speaker 1: OTHER i think she's A i think she's A i
Speaker 1: think she's afraid of being murdered, herself you know. What
Speaker 1: that's WHAT i.
Speaker 2: Thought but like later he shows up at her house
Speaker 2: in a, rage and she's not worried about being. Murdered
Speaker 2: she's just like in a video in case he touches.
Speaker 1: Me, YEAH i would when he showed up in a,
Speaker 1: RAGE i would have immediately called the. Police, yeah and
Speaker 1: sid get over. HERE i would let him, in but
Speaker 1: THEN i would call the. Police, yeah, yep.
Speaker 2: Yep so she essentially gets back together with. Them he comes,
Speaker 2: over they get. Trash they spend like a couple weeks
Speaker 2: just on a. BENDER i don't know how to describe
Speaker 2: it and.
Speaker 1: What AND i understand that she is, like let me
Speaker 1: just numb, out you, know and SO i CAN i
Speaker 1: can do, THIS i can power. THROUGH i guess it's
Speaker 1: not like she's they've asked her to or there's any
Speaker 1: sort of plan where she's like gathering evidence where she's like,
Speaker 1: okay you, know they're like they're meeting with, her Like,
Speaker 1: okay today's the day we need to get you to do.
Speaker 1: This she's doing it a little bit on her. Own
Speaker 1: but she's become a drug addict at this, point AND
Speaker 1: i think we did not hone in enough on the
Speaker 1: she's an addict.
Speaker 2: Now, yeah and she's like quit her job and you're
Speaker 2: just like What that's a good point because she talks
Speaker 2: about it like she's just a recreational drug, user but
Speaker 2: like her whole life is going down the. Toilet, yes
Speaker 2: that's usually the sign of.
Speaker 1: Addiction, yeah and she's given it all up for this.
Speaker 1: Man M.
Speaker 2: Yeah we meet a forensic soil, scientist LIKE i, said
Speaker 2: and she believes this is the burial. Site. Okay she
Speaker 2: was her.
Speaker 1: Boss oh, yeah that, woman that woman that was out
Speaker 1: there and going through the layers of the. Soil, Okay,
Speaker 1: yeah she Was caroline's boss at the. Morgue they work.
Speaker 2: Together, Meanwhile caroline's on a bender with these. Two, yeah
Speaker 2: in her, flat not shown up for. Work.
Speaker 1: YEAH i thought the soil stuff was interesting because they
Speaker 1: were going down cinemeter by centimeter and they would Find,
Speaker 1: okay this type of soil does indicate that something has
Speaker 1: to be under it.
Speaker 2: Happening right. Now you're telling me you were enthralled with the.
Speaker 2: SOIL i.
Speaker 1: WAS i thought it was Fascinating instead of just getting
Speaker 1: a back home and digging it, up like let's go
Speaker 1: down until we hit a. Coffin they were, like let's.
Speaker 1: Go and then as they started to go and they
Speaker 1: were finding all these bones and, things and you're, like,
Speaker 1: no wait a, minute, now wait a. Minute did they
Speaker 1: chop this guy up and then put him in with
Speaker 1: deer bones that they had.
Speaker 2: That they had cars because it was a kill? Pit
Speaker 2: it was a kill pit previously they had. Determined but
Speaker 2: was it a.
Speaker 1: Kill pit that they had covered? Up and then they
Speaker 1: uncovered it and put him in. There that's WHAT i think.
Speaker 1: Happened or was it already it was open and they were, like,
Speaker 1: well what's one more body thrown In?
Speaker 2: Jesus and that that's why he needs to.
Speaker 1: Know it's.
Speaker 2: Fascinating and, again this guy's just trying to raise money for,
Speaker 2: charity like he's not hurting.
Speaker 1: Anybody it's just like a cyclist that was trying to
Speaker 1: raise money for cancer.
Speaker 2: Research in one of these drunken, Nights robert the brother
Speaker 2: Tells caroline That Tony parsons was actually still alive when
Speaker 2: they hit. Him see now we're crossing into murder. Territory
Speaker 2: and they went, home they changed cars and. Closed they
Speaker 2: left THEIR sim cards and then they go. Back they
Speaker 2: get him and they throw him in the back of the,
Speaker 2: truck keep him in the woods, overnight do a whole hunting,
Speaker 2: expedition and then come back and bury him. Later like that's.
Speaker 1: Dark it's, Dark AND i do wonder if on that
Speaker 1: hunting expedition they're, Like, okay we got twelve deer on,
Speaker 1: them and so we've got twelve carcasses and we'll put
Speaker 1: him in with that. One, yeah and nobody'll ever. Notice.
Speaker 2: Yeah she, Records carolyn records him saying some, stuff and
Speaker 2: she finally Gets sandy to say the closest thing to a,
Speaker 2: confession which is it was either my life or. His
Speaker 2: so are we to Believe Tony parsons was fighting back
Speaker 2: or does he mean my life for? His like my
Speaker 2: life would have ended IF i went.
Speaker 1: To jail BECAUSE i had to go to. Jail, okay,
Speaker 1: yeah that's what he.
Speaker 2: Meant Greg bryce was a community police officer and, he you,
Speaker 2: know spend time in schools and my kid's school had
Speaker 2: something like, this like a community resource yea or something like.
Speaker 2: This he knew the boys when they were, young and
Speaker 2: to borrow a turn of, phrase from My. Graham he
Speaker 2: said they were rabble. Rousers it's pretty much what are you?
Speaker 1: Saying they were up to no? Good actually no.
Speaker 2: Good he learned that they were exposed to some wild
Speaker 2: shit at, home and there were allegations that were enough
Speaker 2: for them to search the. House and this is where
Speaker 2: they find, quote firearms all over.
Speaker 1: The place at their house growing up right with the,
Speaker 1: Parents like the dad had lots of. Firearms, yes, okay.
Speaker 2: They found pistols which are illegal to, own and there
Speaker 2: were firearms strung around the. House And greg says it
Speaker 2: was so, serious so we had to Arrest tom mckeller
Speaker 2: and throw them in. Jail i'm, Like Greg, bryce you
Speaker 2: need to never come To. America just never.
Speaker 1: Wonder a long was he in? Jail like two? Days LIKE.
Speaker 2: I was confused To Mary, payin like whose house was
Speaker 2: this this? Estate like was it?
Speaker 1: Theirs, no it's just where they. Work they were like
Speaker 1: the groundskeepers and they just. Worked, okay that's my understating
Speaker 1: is that was their the two, brothers that was their.
Speaker 2: Job they just work and commit murders there got, right,
Speaker 2: well just the one.
Speaker 1: They.
Speaker 2: Do some forensic evidence Of robert And sandy operating the
Speaker 2: kill pit as they're call as they're calling. It and
Speaker 2: so they like they've linked these two to the kill,
Speaker 2: pit and they're pretty sure this is where the body,
Speaker 2: is but they just need to kind of cross some.
Speaker 2: More there's A i don't know how much evidence these people.
Speaker 1: NEED i kept going, like what at least to hold
Speaker 1: them in, jail but they didn't even hold them in. Jail.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah so they go over To caroline's for like
Speaker 2: a well, check just to check on, her the detectives
Speaker 2: and they Find sandy And robert inside and they make
Speaker 2: them leave and when the female cop knocked on the,
Speaker 2: door she's, like ding ding, Dnk, caroline it's me your,
Speaker 2: buddy the, Cop lisa or whatever your name. Is And
Speaker 2: sandy this dingbat.
Speaker 1: Is still like does she know? You? Carol yea, yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah so the female detective literally screaming while this is going, On,
Speaker 2: caroline you're our. Witness what are you? Doing sandy's still,
Speaker 2: LIKE i wonder who told on. Us sandy Decides carolyn
Speaker 2: would never betray him and he's gonna stay there with. Her, okay.
Speaker 2: Okay later he gets a text from a friend that
Speaker 2: the police are searching the kill. Pit he goes bananas
Speaker 2: he starts trashing the. Apartment this is another. Thing her,
Speaker 2: friend the one normal friend that she was talking to
Speaker 2: in the, beginning that, guy his name Was jane or
Speaker 2: something like. That he came over at one point because
Speaker 2: she was having a meltdown and invited him over and he's,
Speaker 2: like this place was absolutely, Trashed like it looked like you,
Speaker 2: know a drug den if you, will. Yeah. Yeah So
Speaker 2: sandy assumes that this more that the cops and put
Speaker 2: a listening device In caroline's.
Speaker 1: Apartment seeing device Is caroline because he.
Speaker 2: Knows he Knows mary Paying caroline would never betray. Him.
Speaker 1: Never, meanwhile she's, like did you get that eight? Ball
Speaker 1: because bleink over here blinking.
Speaker 2: It. Yeah they do Find Tony parsons in the, pit
Speaker 2: And sandy and his brother are allowed to return to the,
Speaker 2: estate so they just drop them. Off carolyn drops them
Speaker 2: off and then she goes to the police and she
Speaker 2: shares that final recording she. Had did you notice that
Speaker 2: she made that recording while they were playing scrabble they.
Speaker 1: Kept showing that it. WAS i was, like is this?
Speaker 1: Scrabble and is it? Online because they kept showing a.
Speaker 1: COMPUTER i was, like they play that?
Speaker 2: Online so earlier she had a chess game that she
Speaker 2: was playing. Online, okay then later it showed in a
Speaker 2: reenactment excuse, me that they were all coked up playing.
Speaker 1: Scrabble i've never done, cocaine BUT i can't imagine that
Speaker 1: scrabble would be a good, thing Because he's, like your
Speaker 1: brain wouldn't or maybe your brain is just so fast
Speaker 1: with the. Words you AND i got on cocaine and
Speaker 1: then tried to play a game like scrabble or something
Speaker 1: that involved, grammar it would be so much we would,
Speaker 1: actually that's probably a great.
Speaker 2: Idea we would probably. Dominate we would Kill let's put
Speaker 2: that on the.
Speaker 1: Top tiers of our, patrio very painted amy to cocaine
Speaker 1: and play scravel for four hundred dollars a.
Speaker 2: Person, Yes so Now David green says we could charge
Speaker 2: him with murder after hearing that recording because he was still.
Speaker 2: Alive so he, says In scotland you need two points
Speaker 2: of evidence to corroborate a. Crime so the pathologist has
Speaker 2: to come to the conclusion like this is all hearsay so.
Speaker 2: Far they have to come to the conclusion That tony
Speaker 2: was indeed. Alive and at the same, Time caroline gets a.
Speaker 2: Call sandy has heard from a neighbor who was out,
Speaker 2: there which would have been me snooping digging up the kill. Pick, yes,
Speaker 2: yes and she this neighbor reports back that they found
Speaker 2: the kill pit because they found a red, bullcan a
Speaker 2: sugar free red. Bullcan so he starts freaking. Out he's,
Speaker 2: screaming you fucked up our lives. Forever i'm coming over.
Speaker 2: There she's, like, Okay i'm, like, girl you're in.
Speaker 1: Danger all of a, sudden she felt no, danger and
Speaker 1: she AND i think THEY i don't had it been
Speaker 1: like eleven, months so they had really almost been together
Speaker 1: at that, point like two years.
Speaker 2: Practically, yeah it's a.
Speaker 1: Lot and so SHE i think she was just going
Speaker 1: about her business and just, like you, Know i'm just
Speaker 1: gonna kind of forget about this looming murder trial THAT
Speaker 1: i helped, instigate you.
Speaker 2: Know and then he shows up at the, door and
Speaker 2: instead of like freaking out and throwing her against the
Speaker 2: waller screaming at, her he's, LIKE i love. YOU i
Speaker 2: never meant to drag you into. THIS i love you so. Much.
Speaker 2: Okay do you think there was like a part of
Speaker 2: him that wanted it to come? Out maybe it was torturing.
Speaker 2: Him mm.
Speaker 1: Hmmm, NO i do think his brother was a little
Speaker 1: worse than. Him, yeah but maybe that's just because we
Speaker 1: don't have enough information about the, brother and SO i
Speaker 1: was sort of led to believe that the brook BUT
Speaker 1: i don't know the brother did tell the truth about
Speaker 1: the guy being. Alive either, way the fact that they
Speaker 1: hit the guy and saw that he was alive still
Speaker 1: in the, road, left went and got a different, car
Speaker 1: left THEIR sim cards at, home and came, back made
Speaker 1: sure he was good and, dead then put him in
Speaker 1: the back of the truck and let him sit there
Speaker 1: for a. DAY i, mean you, know there was just
Speaker 1: there's fifteen steps that could have happened to possibly have
Speaker 1: saved this.
Speaker 2: Guy it's THE sim cards for, Me, like that's so,
Speaker 2: old because you could, argue, like we don't know what
Speaker 2: they were. Driving maybe they couldn't fit him in the
Speaker 2: car in some, way so they had to go get
Speaker 2: a truck to get him to.
Speaker 1: Go they showed they showed the car later and they
Speaker 1: could fit.
Speaker 2: Him they could have fit.
Speaker 1: Him it was a pickup truck and the whole front
Speaker 1: of it was bashed. In remember from where they, Are,
Speaker 1: oh that's.
Speaker 2: Right the.
Speaker 1: Cops yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah all, Right So carolyn is flipping out on the,
Speaker 2: police saying you couldn't even provide me, safety and she,
Speaker 2: SAYS i feel like the police and the crown abandoned
Speaker 2: me that.
Speaker 1: Day, okay well you could have told him to meet
Speaker 1: you at a coffee shop.
Speaker 2: Again, Yeah David green is. Back he says they needed more.
Speaker 2: Evidence it wasn't enough to find the body buried on
Speaker 2: the mckeller property or have a confession on. Tape we
Speaker 2: need the, bike we need the. Helmet it's.
Speaker 1: Crazy it is crazy that they literally had this man's
Speaker 1: LIKE dna and body exactly where she said it was
Speaker 1: that she got the information. From she's got him pretty
Speaker 1: much confessing on tape and the shopkeeper bar owners as
Speaker 1: he was here at the sign that he was. Killed
Speaker 1: with This, like they've got all the information and yet
Speaker 1: it's still not. Enough it's.
Speaker 2: Crazy so they have the body sent to the same
Speaker 2: mortuary That carolyn works at and it's a conflict of,
Speaker 2: interest so she has to. Resign so she loses her job,
Speaker 2: now WHICH i don't even know how much she was
Speaker 2: going to work to begin.
Speaker 1: With it sounded like she was too busy being on
Speaker 1: vendors to go to.
Speaker 2: Work this was during, lockdown And caroline is now. Alone
Speaker 2: she has no, job she has no. Partner she's. Spiraling
Speaker 2: she starts recording. Everything her parents are so worried about,
Speaker 2: her and they ask the, police could you get her a?
Speaker 2: Therapist could you get her some? Help and they're, like,
Speaker 2: no she can't talk to anybody because she'll compromise the.
Speaker 2: Investigation sandy meanwhile sending her video SAYING i love. You
Speaker 2: and what does she? Do she goes back to.
Speaker 1: Him she's back. Again oh, YEAH i don't even feel
Speaker 1: like they're ever really broken up for more than a few.
Speaker 2: Days this is some love after lock up, shit isn't.
Speaker 1: IT i, mean with a gorgeous. Accent, yes that's.
Speaker 2: True, yeah, Beautiful i'm really smart. People yeah, yeah, so
Speaker 2: well one really. Person so they sort of live in
Speaker 2: a bubble for the next couple of, weeks And robert
Speaker 2: even forgives. Her he's, like, WELL i guess it's just
Speaker 2: us on this coke and booze, bender AND i need
Speaker 2: to make peace with the fact that you turned us
Speaker 2: into the. POLICE i.
Speaker 1: Know and you wonder there at some point it was
Speaker 1: like it's just this one girl and these two guys
Speaker 1: and they're, twins AND i guess it's questionable what happened.
Speaker 2: Questionable David green is, like is she losing her? Mind
Speaker 2: what is going? On she says there was a piece
Speaker 2: of her that thought MAYBE i was, wrong like maybe
Speaker 2: he didn't do.
Speaker 1: THIS i don't.
Speaker 2: KNOW i kind of had some empathy for her.
Speaker 1: HERE i did, too BECAUSE i think that she brainwashed
Speaker 1: herself into thinking like this was just but because at
Speaker 1: the beginning she knew right for, wrong and she knew
Speaker 1: to turn him. In she, knew and then she, thought,
Speaker 1: Well i'm going to gather this evidence and all that
Speaker 1: was the right thing to. Do and then somewhere along the,
Speaker 1: line AND i do think it was the drugs that
Speaker 1: made be, like, WELL i don't want to stop doing.
Speaker 1: DRUGS i really like doing, drugs and IF i give
Speaker 1: up this, life THEN i, Well i'll just stay with
Speaker 1: them do drugs until it gets, yeah till he kills
Speaker 1: me or somebody.
Speaker 2: ELSE i GUESS i agree with. You AND i also
Speaker 2: think there was an element of, like the police don't
Speaker 2: really seem to think they did, this so MAYBE i
Speaker 2: am kind of like the police are not acting.
Speaker 1: With, Urgency, no not at, all and maybe that's just
Speaker 1: how it goes. There and can you imagine the frustration
Speaker 1: we're just used. To you, know there was enough evidence
Speaker 1: here in my mind to go ahead and hold these
Speaker 1: guys in jail and then build the.
Speaker 2: Case she says there was or, No i'm. Sorry they
Speaker 2: can't Find Tony, spike but they can Find robert's. Vehicle
Speaker 2: So robert's vehicle was the one that was involved in
Speaker 2: the hit and. Run the mechanic actually had saved before
Speaker 2: pictures from when he fixed the, vehicle and he says
Speaker 2: it was a cash. Job they didn't want it. Reported
Speaker 2: so this was basically a circumstantial case and a lot
Speaker 2: depended On caroline's testimony because even with the, car they
Speaker 2: couldn't test it for his blood or his fabric or
Speaker 2: the paint from the bike like they. Couldn't that's WHY
Speaker 2: i think they wanted the bike frame to try to
Speaker 2: get chips of paint of the.
Speaker 1: Car, yeah BECAUSE i think ALSO i think the bike
Speaker 1: frame also there was something about the bike frame that
Speaker 1: was so so. Important was it The was it the
Speaker 1: chips of paint because that the chips of The, no
Speaker 1: it was the piece of something from the bike was
Speaker 1: found in the kill. Pit it was like blue pieces of.
Speaker 1: Something was it like the?
Speaker 2: MENTALITY i think it was the metallic, paint wasn't.
Speaker 1: It, Yeah BUT i think that it was from the,
Speaker 1: bike not the. Car SO i think they're, like when
Speaker 1: they threw him in the kill, pit it had pieces
Speaker 1: of the bike that were probably on his clothes or.
Speaker 1: Whatever so that's where, like we'll be able to match
Speaker 1: these pieces we pulled out of the kill pit with
Speaker 1: the bike if we could find the. Bike.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah she eventually just. Snaps and at one point
Speaker 2: he had talked about putting the bike in a, waterfall
Speaker 2: and the police search all these. Waterfalls don't go chasing,
Speaker 2: waterfalls and they can't find. Them so she. Snaps she
Speaker 2: sells her, flat she moves back with their, parents and
Speaker 2: she tells the, detectives, LIKE i have another, recording and
Speaker 2: this was the one where they were playing scrabble and
Speaker 2: he talks about throwing the bike in the waterfall and
Speaker 2: the police they just can't find. It they just can't find.
Speaker 2: It she, says you can hear me snorting coke on the,
Speaker 2: tape AND i didn't know if it was a, reenactment
Speaker 2: but we heard.
Speaker 1: It that's, YEAH i mean we do when we cover
Speaker 1: before the ninety days and we talk About joshua And,
Speaker 1: elise and we do a lot of.
Speaker 2: You, know we do a lot of he Like Alec,
Speaker 2: MURDOCH i do a lot of, yeah, yeah and his
Speaker 2: big boy mins that he keeps this little altoid. Container oh,
Speaker 2: yeah it's big boy.
Speaker 1: Mens, yes those are called carcasset but, yes, Yes.
Speaker 2: David green. Says so there's a little bit of talk
Speaker 2: here about the services afforded to witnesses in these types of.
Speaker 2: Cases And David green, says they were only in a
Speaker 2: relationship for a few, months and you, know it wasn't high.
Speaker 2: RISK i, mean she's a, doctor she can't have mental.
Speaker 2: Illness who is this.
Speaker 1: Guy it's crazy that they said she was not in
Speaker 1: any sort of physical danger because she wasn't an abused.
Speaker 1: Woman and they will normally offer assistance in cases if
Speaker 1: an abused woman has turned on her, attacker and they
Speaker 1: would offer the which of course Again i'm, like whoa,
Speaker 1: wow how, amazing but that they they did not see
Speaker 1: her as being abused or in any need of police
Speaker 1: resources because she's just, fine she's, smart she figured. Out
Speaker 1: it's like wait a, minute, wait a. Minute we meet this, Woman.
Speaker 2: Francis she's a legal, advisor and she Says caroline was
Speaker 2: a highly vulnerable. Witness not only is she a drug
Speaker 2: addict at this, point, essentially but she's in danger from
Speaker 2: being around these, people and she has the idea that
Speaker 2: this entire case rests on her. Shoulders that's a dark
Speaker 2: place to.
Speaker 1: Be and you do wonder, too if he has sort
Speaker 1: of dragged her further into this drug addiction on, Purpose,
Speaker 1: yeah to make her sort of an unreliable, Narrator, like
Speaker 1: how can you believe? Her she's been doing drugs for
Speaker 1: two solid.
Speaker 2: Years it's a good. Point. Yeah the pathologist opinion is
Speaker 2: That Tony parsons was still live after the. Collision the
Speaker 2: expert opinion is it was between twenty and thirty. Minutes.
Speaker 1: Yeah and when they said that twenty to thirty, MINUTES
Speaker 1: i also wondered if they were pointing that out to,
Speaker 1: say if an ambulance had been, Called, yep he probably
Speaker 1: could have been, saved or if they're just saying there's
Speaker 1: no way to save, him but he's laid there and
Speaker 1: suffered for twenty to thirty. Minutes, yes it's, horrible.
Speaker 2: Horrible David green tells us you could commit murder intentionally
Speaker 2: or by wicked, recklessness which is essentially. Manslaughter so they
Speaker 2: arrest the McKellen's for murder And december, first twenty twenty,
Speaker 2: first it's been eleven months since their initial. Arrest they
Speaker 2: are hauled in and interrogated about. This in the interrogation
Speaker 2: they play the recordings For. Sandy he. Stunned he had
Speaker 2: no idea. That, wait they did have a listening device
Speaker 2: in the, apartment And caroline got caught on it. Too
Speaker 2: that's what he was. Thinking he's, like.
Speaker 1: You know, what notice she just reached in her pocket a.
Speaker 1: Lot BUT i just thought she was getting some more.
Speaker 1: COCAINE i Think.
Speaker 2: Robert is the brains in this.
Speaker 1: Operation in Maybe, So maybe.
Speaker 2: So. Yeah they Call, caroline they let her know they've
Speaker 2: been arrested and you're going to be called as a,
Speaker 2: witness and she's, like this is not. Good they do
Speaker 2: try to plead, out but the lawyer's like M. M
Speaker 2: the judges like, no, no. No so their lawyer believes
Speaker 2: the whole case was built around one witness unreliable at. Best,
Speaker 2: Now Mary, pain we can relate to. This may twenty twenty,
Speaker 2: Three caroline, says all great stories do not start WITH
Speaker 2: i bought a box of home hair. Dye she's in crisis,
Speaker 2: hair crisis, hair but. Reverse normally we see crisis hair
Speaker 2: going to.
Speaker 1: Platinum, yes she goes pitch.
Speaker 2: Black. Yeah, YEAH i don't even know which, character which
Speaker 2: storyline on Ninety day that that originated.
Speaker 1: With, uh, well it's there's been a lot of people
Speaker 1: on our. Television they have gone into crisis. Hair we've
Speaker 1: Had we Had gina On The Real, House ees OF
Speaker 1: oc did a platinum? BLONDE i Mean.
Speaker 2: Sophie Did sophie do? It on Ninety?
Speaker 1: Day sophie started with crisis hair and then she went.
Speaker 1: Opposite but, okay that the crisis hair goes way way,
Speaker 1: back way way. BACK i would have To i'd have
Speaker 1: to really really think about. That i'd have to look
Speaker 1: at a list OF.
Speaker 2: I bet you your listeners will be able to. Remember
Speaker 2: yeah they. WILL i hope they really become.
Speaker 1: It, yeah let leave a comment as to where crisis hair.
Speaker 1: Started it's when you go into crisis and dye your
Speaker 1: hair platinum.
Speaker 2: Blonde, now, yes when that was all, happening my sister
Speaker 2: AND i had our GEN. X this is Why Little
Speaker 2: House podcast and we used to say Ma, Ingles caroline
Speaker 2: would get crisis. Hair when her hair was, down it
Speaker 2: was she was in. Crisis that's when she had to
Speaker 2: cut her leg. Off Or pa wasn't. There she's banging
Speaker 2: the handyman when it's uptight in the. Bun everything's.
Speaker 1: FINE i don't recall ma ingles happened to cut her leg?
Speaker 2: Off why so don't you? Remember, no there was a whole.
Speaker 2: Episode it was so traumatic where she was going to
Speaker 2: have to like do something to her leg with the,
Speaker 2: knife and then like something happened in. It she was, saved.
Speaker 1: Like the guy it was in that was stuck in
Speaker 1: the river.
Speaker 2: Because paul went to Man. Cato When paul went To,
Speaker 2: mankato everything went to.
Speaker 1: Shit, NO i don't remember.
Speaker 2: That that's, terrible all, Right WELL i don't want to tell,
Speaker 2: you all. Right so the trial date is set For,
Speaker 2: july And caroline is running around filming herself with bright red, hair,
Speaker 2: smoking smoking like a, chimney just always a cigarette in the.
Speaker 2: Mouth was it bright?
Speaker 1: Redd? Er was?
Speaker 2: Black it was like bright red at, first and then
Speaker 2: it got to like a, burgundy like a dark almost
Speaker 2: like a purply.
Speaker 1: Black, OKAY i Think i'm thinking Of black AS i.
Speaker 1: WAS i might even thinking ABOUT i was watching Some
Speaker 1: Billy oulish compilation, videos of which Was bond To. Buy
Speaker 1: it could HAVE i could have Had Billie alice on the.
Speaker 2: BRAIN i could be wrong, too so it might have been.
Speaker 2: Black at some point she essentially. Spiral she, Said i'm
Speaker 2: hanging out with coke. Heads i'm on a path of.
Speaker 2: Destruction mom And dad are, like we almost lost, Her
Speaker 2: like it was, dark it was. Crazy the defense attorney he's,
Speaker 2: like this is an, Opening chuck. Case we're basing everything
Speaker 2: on this. Girl i'm, good.
Speaker 1: Which WAS i think might have Been robert And sandy's, point,
Speaker 1: like let's drag her down so she looks. Unreliable once
Speaker 1: he realized his brother squealed on. Him, Yeah and at.
Speaker 2: One, Point, francis that woman tells us there's a procedure
Speaker 2: for vulnerable. Witnesses normally we do the you, know the
Speaker 2: whole testimony giving outside of the. Courtroom it's recorded and
Speaker 2: then it's brought. In but they were forcing her to
Speaker 2: come in and testify and face. Them she knew she
Speaker 2: was gonna be cross examined and it would be it
Speaker 2: would not be. Good, Yeah so the day finally comes
Speaker 2: when she's to, testify she doesn't show up because she's
Speaker 2: fucking off to check the waterfalls for the bike Craz,
Speaker 2: OKAY i need to know what happened here because she
Speaker 2: says there are helicopters. Overhead she's stealing a tractor she's.
Speaker 2: Driving were the helicopters real or was it all in her? Imagination?
Speaker 1: Oh you mean like When Good fellows with the helicopters?
Speaker 2: Real?
Speaker 1: Yes, NO i think the helicopters were. REAL i think
Speaker 1: that she went out there and because she's, Like i'm
Speaker 1: on mile three of'm eighteen mile, hike AND i, think you.
Speaker 1: Know and then she got to the. TRACTOR i was,
Speaker 1: Like i've never driven a tractor, before got out the,
Speaker 1: manual talk it hard to. DRIVE i would imagine it wouldn't.
Speaker 1: Be you can't just crank it up with from. Driving,
Speaker 1: No but then she got like halfway to the, waterfall
Speaker 1: and then she said she blocked the road so the
Speaker 1: cops wouldn't get, Her AND i was, like what, cops
Speaker 1: it was looking for? You and then it reals they
Speaker 1: were actually looking.
Speaker 2: For, her, okay BECAUSE i, was it wasn't sure they
Speaker 2: did in fact find her at the, waterfall and she
Speaker 2: there's part of her that's, LIKE i still don't know
Speaker 2: if they really did this or, like was it all
Speaker 2: in my? Imagination girl they fond a.
Speaker 1: Body, yeah SHE'S i think she's so confused at that
Speaker 1: point that she's, like maybe this is all like a
Speaker 1: few and MAYBE i made it up that they said,
Speaker 1: that and maybe you know WHAT i. Mean she's questioning
Speaker 1: everything at that point because she's, Like i'm gonna go
Speaker 1: to this waterfall and she thinks that she's gonna look
Speaker 1: at the bottom of the waterfall like a rainbow with
Speaker 1: a gold pot and the bike is going to be
Speaker 1: there with the water pouring over. It BUT i mean
Speaker 1: because she, GOES i looked at it in the way
Speaker 1: that the water would, go it would be under SO
Speaker 1: i was LIKE i could and this she and again
Speaker 1: it's self. Filming, yes, yeah the whole.
Speaker 2: Thing, yes she, was she, was she, was she.
Speaker 1: Had, snapped she'd, mentally she.
Speaker 2: SAYS i was not saying she had a, break she
Speaker 2: had a break from. Reality, Yes, uh she never found the.
Speaker 2: Bike she's taken a high, court she's facing prison. Time
Speaker 2: mom and dad break, down. Crying dad is crying over,
Speaker 2: it and all of a, sudden they changed the charges
Speaker 2: from murder to. KILL i think they realized that she
Speaker 2: was not a good.
Speaker 1: Witness if they're basing everything on, her then, right, right.
Speaker 2: So they can plead to culpable. Homicide no, Try and
Speaker 2: that's what they. Did they Let caroline leave and they're,
Speaker 2: like you have no criminal charges of. Contempt you're, Good
Speaker 2: like this never, happened goodbye Wild august twenty twenty, three
Speaker 2: she goes to the sentencing their, Sentence So robert is
Speaker 2: sentenced to five years three, Month sandy to twelve. Years
Speaker 2: what's going on? Here?
Speaker 1: Wait, okay WHY i don't Did? Okay one one of
Speaker 1: them must have flipped on the. OTHER i, Mean robert
Speaker 1: must have flipped On sandy and, Said, okay he's the
Speaker 1: one that said we should, leave and he's the one
Speaker 1: that said you know WHAT i. Mean that has to
Speaker 1: be the reason that it turned out that most of
Speaker 1: this Was sandy's.
Speaker 2: Idea you, know, Yeah i'm trying To, okay wait here,
Speaker 2: HERE i got, IT i got, IT i got. It,
Speaker 2: Okay sandy, McKellar he was driving the car that Hit Tony.
Speaker 2: Parsons they're under the influence of. Alcohol there you. Go robert.
Speaker 2: McKellar he was not, driving but was present and heavily
Speaker 2: involved in the subsequent cover.
Speaker 1: Up, okay because in my, Mind i'm like five years
Speaker 1: for a murder is pretty good over there In. Scotland but,
Speaker 1: okay so it was twelve years because he was the, driver.
Speaker 2: He was the primary perpetrator who caused the, death And
Speaker 2: robert was chruched as an.
Speaker 1: Accomplice, okay, okay, Okay but you just, think like all,
Speaker 1: along like number, one if they would have called right,
Speaker 1: away what would the sentence have? Been and number, two
Speaker 1: if the judge would have taken their, plea what would
Speaker 1: the sentence have? Been would all of this have been?
Speaker 1: Lesser you? Know?
Speaker 2: Yeah and what's even, interesting what's even more interesting is
Speaker 2: The parsons family came out and said To, caroline, like
Speaker 2: we thank you because he might father my. Husband whatever
Speaker 2: never would have been.
Speaker 1: Found they would have never known what happened to. Him
Speaker 1: never between that pub and wherever he was to, stop
Speaker 1: where he was going for the, night they would Never
Speaker 1: they didn't, FIND i, mean any evidence on the road
Speaker 1: that this accident had. HAPPENED i, mean did they pick
Speaker 1: up every single tiny piece of, bumper you know WHAT i?
Speaker 2: MEAN i don't, know did we get The Karen reid
Speaker 2: crew out there picking up all THE dla.
Speaker 1: Pieces with a with a oh yeah. YEAH i mean
Speaker 1: you just want there had to have been this is
Speaker 1: in the middle of the. Night there had to have
Speaker 1: been something on the road or on the side to
Speaker 1: show that that's where that guy was.
Speaker 2: HIT i.
Speaker 1: Agree were that truck driver that like the? Light they
Speaker 1: were blinded by those, lights AND i mean the truck
Speaker 1: driver could have seen something in his rear.
Speaker 2: View. Yeah. Yeah Crazy caroline is in. Therapy now she's
Speaker 2: met someone who she describes as kind and, healthy and
Speaker 2: she's repaired her relationship with her. Family AND i just
Speaker 2: want to say the end song is. FANTASTIC i think
Speaker 2: it's Called change By Big. Thief it was really. GOOD
Speaker 2: i enjoyed. It. Sober, yeah she's. Sober so that's where we.
Speaker 2: END i mean it was now That i'm recapping, it
Speaker 2: it was pretty. Wild it was.
Speaker 1: Wild there were so Many swiston. Turns, yeah and even
Speaker 1: just listening to, you like telling me, THINGS i was,
Speaker 1: like oh, yeah oh, yeah oh, Yeah and that's what
Speaker 1: made me realize talking to, you like the reason he
Speaker 1: only wanted to get a coffee at that place and
Speaker 1: not take the room Because i'm sure a lot he
Speaker 1: had it all mapped.
Speaker 2: Out, yeah we have a local weather guy who does
Speaker 2: something like. This he does a big charity bike, ride
Speaker 2: and you're, right like is certain hotels put him, up
Speaker 2: he has certain, stops he makes people gather, There so
Speaker 2: you're absolutely. Right he was probably do in town the
Speaker 2: next day and how to get.
Speaker 1: There, YEAH i do in that. Town and then also
Speaker 1: from THAT a TO, b the fact that they didn't
Speaker 1: find anything on the road to me because they weren't
Speaker 1: really looking that, hard because they could have scoured all
Speaker 1: of that road and found some evidence that there was
Speaker 1: an accident right at that. Spot, yeah in my, mind
Speaker 1: BUT i don't. KNOW i don't, Know Mary.
Speaker 2: Payne should we take them in it and tell each
Speaker 2: other's audiences what we're.
Speaker 1: Doing let's do. That you go, first you tell.
Speaker 2: Me, okay if you're listening On, shade you may know me.
Speaker 2: Already you should Yumpink. SHADE i. Am i'm the host
Speaker 2: of murder she watched where we solve murders from our.
Speaker 2: Couches we. Do we're Doing Tiger king right, now and
Speaker 2: we're doing making a. Murderer two really important cases to
Speaker 2: seminal documentaries in the true crime genre and we're having a.
Speaker 1: Blast So i'm listening To making A. Murderer, yes oh my,
Speaker 1: god it's wild right, yeah, WELL i Mean i've watched,
Speaker 1: it But i'd forgotten so much of.
Speaker 2: It and we're getting the wiscants and. Accents. Damn, really
Speaker 2: it's a lot of. Them oh, yeah don't go wauch, yeah. Weird, yeah, yeah, Yeah,
Speaker 2: okay your.
Speaker 1: Turn well you also have a podcast podcast Called Little
Speaker 1: mistercap don't forget about that ONE i.
Speaker 2: Do and if you're a Big Sister wives, fan come
Speaker 2: on over Waters warm, now.
Speaker 1: Yeah for your murder she watched. AUDIENCE i Cover, mondays
Speaker 1: we Do Much. Shop, monday we Do Love after Lock.
Speaker 1: Up right, now we're on a little break and we
Speaker 1: just Covered ladies Of london and for the next three
Speaker 1: weeks we're going to be covering the six part documentary
Speaker 1: that appears On hbox Called neighbors that's a little murderous
Speaker 1: if you're. Interested And tuesdays we DO. Tlc tuesdays we
Speaker 1: cover the main ninety day, show And THURSDAYS i Cover.
Speaker 1: Bravo it's Called pop And, bravo AND i have a
Speaker 1: different host Every thursday To chat ninety nine Percent bravo
Speaker 1: unless there's like a crazy pop culture, story and THEN
Speaker 1: i cover the Second dairy ninety day show on the
Speaker 1: weekends With kimberly from a day With. Dayline and Also
Speaker 1: i'm Doing welcome To platfel on The Free feed And
Speaker 1: welcome to plathfill rewatch, o which is so, fun which
Speaker 1: is it's my brain is so scrambled doing a rewatch
Speaker 1: at the same time that a new season is. Airing
Speaker 1: that's tough because also the exact same things. Happen do
Speaker 1: you use nobody learns any?
Speaker 2: Lessons do you consider yourself BECAUSE i KNOW i. DO
Speaker 2: i Think i'm like a plot. Filx oh, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1: One question you could ask me THAT i wouldn't know the.
Speaker 2: Answer. Yeah amanda is definitely A Sister wives, expert And
Speaker 2: i'm pretty good With Sister. Wives but like, Plathvill i've got.
Speaker 1: It, well that's why this SEASON i was, like all,
Speaker 1: right it's a new season and we're gonna do. It
Speaker 1: but then because you've got your own you know, thing
Speaker 1: AND i was, like, oh it's, LIKE i hate for
Speaker 1: you not to do it with. Me But kimberly is
Speaker 1: interested and it has also watched it all And kimberly
Speaker 1: is great and you said we'll always have flat.
Speaker 2: Pill yeah all, right, well thank, You Mary. Pain this
Speaker 2: has been. Fun thank you So, Amy thank.
Speaker 1: YOU i love doing episodes with. You it always just
Speaker 1: makes me happy and saying to the good brings me
Speaker 1: back to the good old. Days Yeah MeOH and should
Speaker 1: we Tell, yeah let's tell people. Too we are doing
Speaker 1: a little mis recap. Murder she Watched Pink shade meet
Speaker 1: up In New York City october. Tent details will be.
Speaker 1: Forthcoming yeah it.
Speaker 2: Is it Is libra, Themed libra.
Speaker 1: Themed we are finalizing the, details but our joint meetup
Speaker 1: will Be, Saturday october, Tenth so just our market on your,
Speaker 1: calendar come To New york and we will give you
Speaker 1: the details as soon as we nail them all.
Speaker 2: Down And i'm just. Waiting you, know anytime That kimberly
Speaker 2: should fall ill or something should happen To kimberly that
Speaker 2: you need a plath person to just tag.
Speaker 1: In i'm, HERE i, KNOW i know that you're here
Speaker 1: for me for the. Platoffs But kimberly has not fallen,
Speaker 1: ill and we don't wish that on.
Speaker 2: Her, no we do. Not even though she's not a,
Speaker 2: libro we still wish her.
Speaker 1: Well we start. Sure thank, YOU i