WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.360 --> 00:00:05.200 Welcome everybody to the Journey Conversations with publisher Chris Milligan. 2 00:00:05.360 --> 00:00:09.560 I am your co host Adam otherwise known as aw Finnigan. 3 00:00:10.320 --> 00:00:14.679 Today we will be talking to Jay Dyer. Jay Dyer 4 00:00:14.800 --> 00:00:18.000 is an author, comedian, and TV presenter known for his 5 00:00:18.120 --> 00:00:22.239 analysis of Hollywood, geopolitics, and culture, and co writer for 6 00:00:22.280 --> 00:00:27.039 the Sam Hide Show. His graduate work focused on psychological 7 00:00:27.079 --> 00:00:30.239 warfare and film, and he is the author of two books, 8 00:00:31.199 --> 00:00:34.679 Esoteric Hollywood one and two, with a third coming out, 9 00:00:35.200 --> 00:00:39.119 and the co creator and co host of the television 10 00:00:39.159 --> 00:00:43.240 show Hollywood Decoded. He has been featured on numerous popular 11 00:00:43.280 --> 00:00:46.320 shows and podcasts and in debates with some of the 12 00:00:46.359 --> 00:00:49.840 world's top debaters, and a fill in host for some 13 00:00:49.880 --> 00:00:55.520 of the largest US radio shows. And now you're in. 14 00:00:55.719 --> 00:00:58.960 Now your host, Publisher Chris Milligan. 15 00:00:59.280 --> 00:01:02.200 Thank you Adam very very much, and thank you Jay 16 00:01:02.399 --> 00:01:05.719 for spending some time with us here. You know, these 17 00:01:05.760 --> 00:01:11.400 are interesting times, to say the least. You know, a 18 00:01:11.439 --> 00:01:14.959 lot going on, a lot to look at. And you know, 19 00:01:15.200 --> 00:01:21.760 I guess I didn't realize your dissertation was about psychological warfare, 20 00:01:21.879 --> 00:01:25.920 because you know, that's been one of a very main 21 00:01:26.079 --> 00:01:30.159 interests of mine ever since my daddy and a professor 22 00:01:30.239 --> 00:01:33.480 took me in a room and blew my mind, told 23 00:01:33.480 --> 00:01:36.959 me stuff that it took me twenty years to understand, 24 00:01:37.040 --> 00:01:45.840 but led me on an interesting path. So, Jake, psychological warfare. 25 00:01:46.040 --> 00:01:49.799 What got you interested in psychological warfare? 26 00:01:51.640 --> 00:01:54.480 I didn't know what that was until probably college. I 27 00:01:54.519 --> 00:01:58.200 remember I'd watched a lot of movies that I liked 28 00:01:58.280 --> 00:02:00.519 growing up in high school. And I remember, you know, 29 00:02:00.680 --> 00:02:04.439 enjoying Oliver Stone films and you know, stuff like that, 30 00:02:04.879 --> 00:02:09.520 and conspiracy movies like Vic Donner's Conspiracy Theory with Mel Gibson. 31 00:02:10.280 --> 00:02:12.080 And I remember when I got to college, I took 32 00:02:12.120 --> 00:02:17.000 some classes on the connection between Hollywood and the history 33 00:02:17.000 --> 00:02:20.919 of Hollywood, some film classes as well as straight up 34 00:02:20.960 --> 00:02:24.800 history classes, and I remember that coming up in some 35 00:02:24.840 --> 00:02:27.280 of the classes. And I remember somehow I got a 36 00:02:27.280 --> 00:02:29.800 hold of one of the Trying Day books back when 37 00:02:29.840 --> 00:02:34.039 I was an undergrad, and I remember reading Sutton's You 38 00:02:34.080 --> 00:02:37.919 published Sutton Skull and Bones book, and I remember you 39 00:02:37.960 --> 00:02:42.199 published the Lavenda trilogy, and I got a hold of 40 00:02:42.199 --> 00:02:45.960 that trilogy. Somebody bought me that, I think for my birthday, 41 00:02:46.680 --> 00:02:48.800 and I read that whole trilogy and I thought, this 42 00:02:48.879 --> 00:02:53.080 is this is crazy, this is wild. So that got 43 00:02:53.120 --> 00:02:55.479 me interested in psychological warfare. And at the same time, 44 00:02:55.520 --> 00:02:58.199 I was taking these you know, college classes, and I 45 00:02:58.240 --> 00:03:00.919 had a professor who was an old old school leftist. 46 00:03:01.319 --> 00:03:05.159 Uh he was a history professor, and he told he 47 00:03:05.240 --> 00:03:09.319 taught us a lot about uh CIA operations, Latin South America, 48 00:03:09.360 --> 00:03:11.199 that kind of stuff. So that was kind of my 49 00:03:11.240 --> 00:03:14.199 introduction was undergrad college. I didn't I still you know, 50 00:03:14.400 --> 00:03:17.280 I don't consider myself an expert, but that got me 51 00:03:17.319 --> 00:03:20.520 interested in just this whole domain of the overlap of 52 00:03:21.039 --> 00:03:25.199 what the military and what intelligence agencies and what corporations 53 00:03:25.240 --> 00:03:27.960 are interested in. And then you've got this other realm 54 00:03:28.000 --> 00:03:31.439 over here of you know, movies and Hollywood and even 55 00:03:31.479 --> 00:03:34.719 fiction writers, British intelligence fiction writers they did the same 56 00:03:34.759 --> 00:03:37.800 stuff where they would you know, put their some of 57 00:03:37.840 --> 00:03:40.280 the some of the elements of their operations into the 58 00:03:40.319 --> 00:03:43.919 novels that they wrote. So that was what got me interested, 59 00:03:44.080 --> 00:03:47.800 was just a combination of books and uh, you know, 60 00:03:47.879 --> 00:03:50.280 some of your materials that you had published back in 61 00:03:50.319 --> 00:03:53.199 the day, and college classes and movies. 62 00:03:53.919 --> 00:03:57.960 Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean psychological warfare comes from the 63 00:03:58.039 --> 00:04:01.639 German term meaning you know warld world view warfare in 64 00:04:01.680 --> 00:04:04.439 other words, you want to get people in, you know, 65 00:04:04.840 --> 00:04:09.159 invested into your worldview and different things. And we've had this, 66 00:04:09.319 --> 00:04:15.840 you know, geopolitical things have been going on well before 67 00:04:16.519 --> 00:04:21.199 we were all born, you know, and now it's very 68 00:04:21.199 --> 00:04:25.680 interesting too. You know. I had the the executive producer 69 00:04:26.399 --> 00:04:30.439 of twenty four, you know, call me up one day 70 00:04:30.959 --> 00:04:35.800 and say, hey, you know, I think that our you know, 71 00:04:36.120 --> 00:04:40.639 this series is being used to propagandize the American people. 72 00:04:40.959 --> 00:04:44.120 I mean, those were his words to me. And and he, 73 00:04:44.240 --> 00:04:47.680 you know, he had felt that, and so he went 74 00:04:47.720 --> 00:04:50.240 out on the internet and started looking around and he 75 00:04:50.279 --> 00:04:52.600 found a bunch of our books and and so you know, 76 00:04:52.920 --> 00:04:59.720 he tried to make him into movies and he was stopped. Okay, 77 00:05:00.240 --> 00:05:03.240 I mean, I'll tell just a little bit of the story. 78 00:05:03.360 --> 00:05:06.399 I mean he called me up one time and you know, 79 00:05:07.199 --> 00:05:09.639 he said he was being chased around town by a 80 00:05:10.079 --> 00:05:13.399 white suv and he couldn't he couldn't shake it, and 81 00:05:13.439 --> 00:05:17.000 he was this guy was driving a Ferrari. Another time, 82 00:05:17.079 --> 00:05:19.680 he calls me up and says, you know, we've got 83 00:05:19.720 --> 00:05:23.720 to redo all of our banking things because most of 84 00:05:23.759 --> 00:05:28.720 their money was coming from a Mexican national and so 85 00:05:29.759 --> 00:05:32.879 because of some laws. They had to really change it, 86 00:05:32.959 --> 00:05:38.079 but they kept on working on these books. Michael Rupert 87 00:05:38.160 --> 00:05:42.079 walked into their office and said, you can't make these movies. 88 00:05:42.120 --> 00:05:45.319 And we hadn't even talked about it, okay, and says, 89 00:05:45.360 --> 00:05:48.319 you got to make a movie about me? Okay, Rupert. 90 00:05:48.600 --> 00:05:51.399 And then and then he finally calls me up one 91 00:05:51.480 --> 00:05:53.839 day and says, you know, well, another time he called 92 00:05:53.879 --> 00:05:56.360 me up and says, they're trying to get me fired. 93 00:05:57.120 --> 00:06:00.160 They're saying that, you know, I'm out on sunset that 94 00:06:00.279 --> 00:06:04.439 selling OxyContin at night. My boss knows that's not true. 95 00:06:04.839 --> 00:06:08.040 So they kept on working on him. Finally he calls 96 00:06:08.079 --> 00:06:09.519 me up and says, well, I've got to go on 97 00:06:09.519 --> 00:06:14.279 a sabbatical for two weeks. And I say, okay, what's 98 00:06:14.319 --> 00:06:17.720 going on? He says, somebody met his wife on a 99 00:06:17.759 --> 00:06:21.680 street corner and said, you know, if you don't stop 100 00:06:21.720 --> 00:06:25.160 what you're doing, we're going to kill your husband. And 101 00:06:25.199 --> 00:06:28.439 then you what are your children going to do? Okay? 102 00:06:29.000 --> 00:06:32.959 And I said okay. And he went on a sabbatical 103 00:06:33.000 --> 00:06:36.560 and called me back up in about two weeks and said, well, 104 00:06:36.759 --> 00:06:43.959 I guess we're just making Will Ferrell movies. So obviously 105 00:06:44.720 --> 00:06:49.720 there are some people that have some vested interest on 106 00:06:50.199 --> 00:06:55.879 what comes out from Hollywood and what comes out from Hollywood, Jay. 107 00:06:57.600 --> 00:06:59.720 A lot of propaganda. I think you summed it up 108 00:06:59.759 --> 00:07:03.680 right there. I didn't, of course, you know, most of 109 00:07:03.759 --> 00:07:05.720 us didn't know this growing up. I know you had 110 00:07:06.000 --> 00:07:10.000 an oss you know, father or is there father or grandfather, 111 00:07:10.040 --> 00:07:11.120 I don't remember what it was. 112 00:07:11.199 --> 00:07:13.800 It was father. He was C O I O S 113 00:07:13.800 --> 00:07:15.439 S G C I A. 114 00:07:16.000 --> 00:07:17.839 Did you You probably knew a lot of this before 115 00:07:17.839 --> 00:07:18.560 everybody else. 116 00:07:18.600 --> 00:07:22.240 I would assume, well, I had an inkling. I mean, 117 00:07:22.279 --> 00:07:25.759 he told me about his intelligence career and and he 118 00:07:25.879 --> 00:07:32.639 basically he gave me some information that that led me 119 00:07:32.800 --> 00:07:35.639 to look into the subject I call C I A drugs, 120 00:07:36.000 --> 00:07:40.519 which then led you to all kinds of different places 121 00:07:40.560 --> 00:07:43.360 because those people were involved in a lot of the corruption. 122 00:07:43.879 --> 00:07:44.160 Right. 123 00:07:44.839 --> 00:07:48.800 Yeah, I've had a similar situation. I know this is 124 00:07:48.839 --> 00:07:51.560 not on the topic of the question, but my uncle 125 00:07:51.639 --> 00:07:55.560 had a really interesting career. He was an Air Force 126 00:07:55.600 --> 00:07:58.439 intelligence person. And my family didn't tell me this until 127 00:07:58.639 --> 00:08:00.639 way later on, and they told me all this stuff 128 00:08:00.639 --> 00:08:03.399 he was involved in, which I had an inkling of 129 00:08:03.399 --> 00:08:04.920 that too, but they didn't tell me until I was 130 00:08:05.000 --> 00:08:07.079 much older about I think I was about age thirty 131 00:08:07.079 --> 00:08:10.120 five before they told me all that, but there was 132 00:08:10.120 --> 00:08:13.680 some you know, similar things there with I don't know 133 00:08:13.720 --> 00:08:18.120 about drugs, but there was definitely some operations that were 134 00:08:18.120 --> 00:08:21.120 being done that he did in the Cold War out 135 00:08:21.160 --> 00:08:25.519 of Turkey in regard to the Soviets. But regardless, when 136 00:08:25.519 --> 00:08:28.480 you go back into the forties and the fifties, one 137 00:08:28.480 --> 00:08:30.800 thing I learned more recently that I think is really 138 00:08:30.839 --> 00:08:33.919 fascinating is a lot of these A list people were 139 00:08:34.000 --> 00:08:38.039 recruited into the OSS, especially you know, famous Hollywood people 140 00:08:39.240 --> 00:08:42.360 working in different capacities and doing different things with the OSS, 141 00:08:42.480 --> 00:08:45.639 and you then obviously into the CIA as well. So 142 00:08:45.720 --> 00:08:48.000 when I learned that, that kind of shocked me. I 143 00:08:48.039 --> 00:08:50.480 was kind of surprised by that. And that's maybe just 144 00:08:50.559 --> 00:08:53.879 one element of the angle of the propaganda. You know, 145 00:08:53.879 --> 00:08:57.360 you've got people within Hollywood spying on each other during 146 00:08:57.360 --> 00:09:00.519 World War Two and then into the Cold War, and 147 00:09:00.559 --> 00:09:04.000 then you've got people at the production level working with 148 00:09:04.279 --> 00:09:06.639 people from the OSS and CIA as well. 149 00:09:06.679 --> 00:09:07.440 The OSS help. 150 00:09:07.519 --> 00:09:10.840 For example, John Ford, if I recall, win some of 151 00:09:10.840 --> 00:09:14.200 his awards, he would not have won those awards if 152 00:09:14.200 --> 00:09:17.200 he had not had such such help from the OSS. 153 00:09:17.240 --> 00:09:19.840 So that's an element of excuse me, a propaganda that 154 00:09:19.919 --> 00:09:23.240 was going on there. I believe it was Burnet's that 155 00:09:23.360 --> 00:09:27.159 said Hollywood is the greatest engine of propaganda the world's 156 00:09:27.159 --> 00:09:29.879 ever seen. And then of course you've got a lot 157 00:09:29.919 --> 00:09:33.679 of influence from foreign countries. We could imagine what foreign 158 00:09:33.720 --> 00:09:38.120 countries Israel, in other countries as we get into the 159 00:09:38.159 --> 00:09:41.200 Cold War, they have a lot of influence in Hollywood, 160 00:09:41.320 --> 00:09:43.879 especially when it comes to productions about the Cold War. 161 00:09:44.840 --> 00:09:47.320 I'm not pro Communist or Soviet, but I definitely think 162 00:09:47.360 --> 00:09:51.519 there was exaggeration going on. So, you know, World War Two, 163 00:09:51.799 --> 00:09:54.759 you've got Corda Circle, You've got Hitchcock, You've got those 164 00:09:54.759 --> 00:09:57.799 guys putting out propaganda, You've got Cold War, You've got 165 00:09:58.200 --> 00:10:01.919 you know, CIA putting out consulting on movies, recruiting actors. 166 00:10:02.000 --> 00:10:05.600 You know, there's no end to the propaganda. And corporations 167 00:10:05.639 --> 00:10:08.360 as well. The corporations of course, have a lot of 168 00:10:08.399 --> 00:10:12.559 influence and interest as we get closer to you know, 169 00:10:12.679 --> 00:10:16.399 where we are now, more so maybe than governments, even 170 00:10:17.080 --> 00:10:22.919 determining what themes films will will have, what narratives, what 171 00:10:23.240 --> 00:10:27.320 product placement. You know, think of something like the CIA 172 00:10:27.440 --> 00:10:32.679 consulting on Ben Affleck's Argo, which you know won the award, 173 00:10:32.720 --> 00:10:35.440 the Academy Award that year, and that was of course 174 00:10:35.480 --> 00:10:39.039 based on this CIA operation to have a fake movie 175 00:10:39.080 --> 00:10:43.039 being filmed during the nineteen to what is seventy nine 176 00:10:43.879 --> 00:10:47.279 hostage crisis in Iran. So these are just windows into 177 00:10:47.600 --> 00:10:51.039 you know, the propaganda at different levels that we're talking about. 178 00:10:51.639 --> 00:10:57.879 Right. So now it's it called Lookout that studio that 179 00:10:58.000 --> 00:11:01.080 was up at the top of the canyon, and you know, 180 00:11:01.240 --> 00:11:05.159 that was an obvious facility that they were using to 181 00:11:05.480 --> 00:11:10.480 produce and then also to uh, you know, integrate the 182 00:11:10.519 --> 00:11:13.080 Hollywood people in there. And I mean, you know, it's 183 00:11:13.200 --> 00:11:17.559 very interesting that you know, Ronald Reagan all the like 184 00:11:17.679 --> 00:11:21.559 the training films for for World War two and whatnot, 185 00:11:21.759 --> 00:11:26.399 he was basically the narrator for those, okay, which gave 186 00:11:26.519 --> 00:11:30.240 his voice, you know, into a lot of people, so 187 00:11:30.320 --> 00:11:32.519 they would trust him in blat of blah blah blah. 188 00:11:32.720 --> 00:11:35.399 And then you had, you know, for the CIA films, 189 00:11:35.960 --> 00:11:40.399 who was the narrator for that but Moses Heston you 190 00:11:40.440 --> 00:11:44.840 know and whatnot. So what do you know about that 191 00:11:44.919 --> 00:11:48.480 facility and what is it doing today? 192 00:11:50.240 --> 00:11:53.919 Yeah? Of course, just from an artistic perspective I enjoy. 193 00:11:54.360 --> 00:11:56.519 I don't think I've ever watched a Ronald Reagan movie, 194 00:11:56.519 --> 00:11:59.200 but I definitely enjoyed a lot of those Trump Hess 195 00:11:59.320 --> 00:12:02.600 movies growing up up. But I wouldn't be surprised, you know. 196 00:12:02.639 --> 00:12:05.000 I think he was friends with doctor Jillian West, which 197 00:12:05.039 --> 00:12:07.519 is an odd connection, but I think, you know, Charlton 198 00:12:07.559 --> 00:12:11.799 Hesson probably had some of those ties, shall we say, 199 00:12:13.159 --> 00:12:17.399 as do many A listers still to this day. But yeah, 200 00:12:17.480 --> 00:12:21.559 you're talking about Lookout Mountain Studios, which was if you 201 00:12:21.679 --> 00:12:26.440 drive up Wonderland Avenue up into like if you're coming 202 00:12:26.519 --> 00:12:29.200 from LA and you drive up into Tepanga Canyon, you 203 00:12:29.200 --> 00:12:32.480 can go up up that route and you get up 204 00:12:32.519 --> 00:12:34.799 to the very top. We've gone up there many times 205 00:12:35.120 --> 00:12:38.000 since I wrote the first book, and you can still 206 00:12:38.039 --> 00:12:40.639 see some of the elements of the old Air Force 207 00:12:40.679 --> 00:12:43.759 stuff that the different owners I think has passed from 208 00:12:43.919 --> 00:12:46.679 various Hollywood celebrities have owned this facility now, the last 209 00:12:46.679 --> 00:12:49.320 being Jared Ledo. There's still some of the old Air 210 00:12:49.320 --> 00:12:51.559 Force memorabilia there that you can see over his fence. 211 00:12:51.600 --> 00:12:54.159 I wasn't stalking him, right, but you can peek over 212 00:12:54.200 --> 00:12:56.399 the fence. You can peek over the fence and see 213 00:12:56.440 --> 00:12:58.440 like some of the old Air Force stuff there. But yeah, 214 00:12:58.519 --> 00:13:00.960 this was the most cutting edge studio of its time 215 00:13:01.600 --> 00:13:05.120 back in fifties and sixties, and all of these Hollywood 216 00:13:05.159 --> 00:13:09.879 executives had access to it. Walt Disney, starlet's like Merilyn 217 00:13:09.879 --> 00:13:13.000 Monroe could go there. We don't even know all the 218 00:13:13.039 --> 00:13:15.759 films that they did produce there, what always produced there, 219 00:13:16.360 --> 00:13:17.840 but some of the things that have come out you 220 00:13:17.840 --> 00:13:20.480 can still find on YouTube that we have some of 221 00:13:20.480 --> 00:13:24.120 the propaganda movies that Jimmy Stewart did. He boy did 222 00:13:24.120 --> 00:13:25.840 all of the voiceovers he's in a lot of the 223 00:13:26.679 --> 00:13:30.799 those were pro FBI type films. He actually started in 224 00:13:30.840 --> 00:13:33.360 a few of those FBI propaganda films back in the day. 225 00:13:33.440 --> 00:13:36.159 So yeah, I mean, that's that's a great one to 226 00:13:36.279 --> 00:13:42.919 demonstrate just this key tie in between corporations and Hollywood, 227 00:13:42.960 --> 00:13:47.480 the studio system, the deep state government system, and you 228 00:13:47.519 --> 00:13:50.320 know what they're churning out, and you know, you've got 229 00:13:50.360 --> 00:13:53.559 basically the top people at the time driving up here 230 00:13:53.600 --> 00:13:55.440 to that and then driving back to you know, the 231 00:13:55.480 --> 00:13:59.080 other studios. So it's a big complex that's all intertwined. 232 00:13:59.200 --> 00:14:00.919 And that's one of the key ways to prove that 233 00:14:01.919 --> 00:14:02.679 right now. 234 00:14:03.000 --> 00:14:05.720 Uh, you know, you you do a lot of uh 235 00:14:05.879 --> 00:14:09.720 explot well, I don't know about expose a's, but expositions 236 00:14:09.759 --> 00:14:13.240 I would say about about different movies in your in 237 00:14:13.279 --> 00:14:16.279 your books. And you know one thing that you know, 238 00:14:16.519 --> 00:14:19.480 just I like movies, you know, I thought they were great. 239 00:14:19.519 --> 00:14:22.759 You know, they'd be on TV. You know, you'd watch 240 00:14:22.759 --> 00:14:25.559 them and different things. And and one thing that I 241 00:14:25.919 --> 00:14:29.519 started thinking about, you know, because when you look at 242 00:14:29.519 --> 00:14:32.320 Hollywood and la I mean, there's always been a lot 243 00:14:32.360 --> 00:14:37.600 of cults and interesting people around there. And you know, 244 00:14:37.759 --> 00:14:40.399 when you've got when you're making a movie and you're 245 00:14:40.440 --> 00:14:44.720 making a movie about some of these occult and you know, 246 00:14:44.919 --> 00:14:48.600 devil type themes, it seems to me that, you know, 247 00:14:48.960 --> 00:14:53.600 the whole movie set becomes to a certain extent a 248 00:14:53.679 --> 00:14:58.679 place to have rituals and to do quote unquote workings 249 00:14:58.879 --> 00:15:01.840 when they're doing these movies. Do you have any thoughts 250 00:15:01.840 --> 00:15:02.360 about that? 251 00:15:03.799 --> 00:15:04.399 Absolutely? 252 00:15:04.679 --> 00:15:09.279 I think I think it might have been Sensor Force's 253 00:15:09.279 --> 00:15:12.120 trilogy where I first heard that idea, or maybe it 254 00:15:12.200 --> 00:15:14.159 was some other article somebody had written a long time 255 00:15:14.159 --> 00:15:19.840 ago to remember, But when you look into the way 256 00:15:19.919 --> 00:15:22.440 that people who do ritual magic, who are interested in 257 00:15:22.440 --> 00:15:25.399 that subject matter when they see their actions or even 258 00:15:25.399 --> 00:15:28.919 their artwork. Even something like a film could be seen 259 00:15:28.960 --> 00:15:31.360 as a ritual action. So you're putting your will and 260 00:15:31.399 --> 00:15:34.600 your intention out there into the world through this product 261 00:15:34.600 --> 00:15:38.399 to try to get your worldview accepted. You mentioned, you know, 262 00:15:38.600 --> 00:15:43.159 velten schungskriga worldview warfare earlier. That's kind of what is 263 00:15:43.240 --> 00:15:46.600 going on from a propaganda perspective with movies. But also 264 00:15:46.679 --> 00:15:51.759 you could be trying to put out your worldview in 265 00:15:51.799 --> 00:15:55.960 a more symbolic occult way like you're talking about. And 266 00:15:56.360 --> 00:15:59.200 so the first chapter or section of the third book, 267 00:15:59.639 --> 00:16:02.759 I call that Hollywood is Megas or magician, because there's 268 00:16:02.799 --> 00:16:06.320 a great there's a classic novel that's in the canon 269 00:16:06.320 --> 00:16:10.639 and Western Canadon literature called The Megas by John Fowls, 270 00:16:11.799 --> 00:16:14.399 and he's famous because he wrote a really well known. 271 00:16:14.240 --> 00:16:16.360 Serial killer story. 272 00:16:16.399 --> 00:16:19.480 But The Vegas is interesting because you have this character 273 00:16:19.519 --> 00:16:23.440 who's kind of an Aristotle of Nassas billionaire guy who 274 00:16:24.279 --> 00:16:27.759 kind of can engineer everything in regard to this one 275 00:16:28.000 --> 00:16:30.879 guy's life that he's kind of messing with. So he's 276 00:16:30.919 --> 00:16:32.799 this wealthy guy who has nothing else to do other 277 00:16:32.840 --> 00:16:37.240 than to kind of mess with young idiotic guys and 278 00:16:37.320 --> 00:16:40.879 bring them to your billionaire island and sort of tweak 279 00:16:40.919 --> 00:16:43.279 their worldview and see what you can get them to 280 00:16:43.320 --> 00:16:46.519 believe and not believe. And so I said, you know 281 00:16:47.039 --> 00:16:51.799 that character. I think his name is a Conchiese. He's 282 00:16:51.879 --> 00:16:54.600 kind of an image of the way Hollywood works. You, 283 00:16:54.679 --> 00:16:57.519 Hollywood's is the same kind of a thing, where it's 284 00:16:58.200 --> 00:17:02.080 kind of giving us this world you throughout all these stories, 285 00:17:02.120 --> 00:17:05.559 a lot of propaganda, a lot of bad messages, some 286 00:17:05.599 --> 00:17:08.680 good messages here and there slipped through, but probably fewer 287 00:17:08.880 --> 00:17:13.279 good than bad. But yeah, I think you also have directors, 288 00:17:14.079 --> 00:17:18.240 to be more precise, who are explicitly into ritual magic, 289 00:17:18.319 --> 00:17:21.519 who you have the idea that they're actually participating in 290 00:17:21.599 --> 00:17:26.160 ritual workings. Somebody like Darren Aronofsky, who pretty clearly is 291 00:17:26.200 --> 00:17:30.079 into Kabala. Kubrick, you could debate that. I've had some 292 00:17:30.119 --> 00:17:34.359 discussions with Vivian and his daughter, and I keep trying 293 00:17:34.359 --> 00:17:36.160 to get her to come to an interview, but she's 294 00:17:36.240 --> 00:17:39.400 real hesitant to do that. But I think that clearly 295 00:17:39.480 --> 00:17:42.880 Kubrick included some of these themes. How serious he took 296 00:17:42.960 --> 00:17:45.680 any of that is up for debate. But other directors 297 00:17:45.720 --> 00:17:48.279 are more well known. I think David Lynch definitely included 298 00:17:49.160 --> 00:17:54.160 Tibetan Buddhist themes. You know, he included transital meditation themes. 299 00:17:54.799 --> 00:17:59.160 So in those examples, it's clear. More recently, Robert Eggers 300 00:17:59.160 --> 00:18:01.640 that directed The Witch and those fraw two, I mean, 301 00:18:01.640 --> 00:18:04.119 I think he's pretty clearly a Crollian of some kind. 302 00:18:04.799 --> 00:18:08.480 So yeah, that's what's going on at multiple levels once again. 303 00:18:09.079 --> 00:18:13.319 Right, I love that whole like vampire thing that became 304 00:18:13.400 --> 00:18:13.960 really big. 305 00:18:15.359 --> 00:18:20.640 Yeah, all occult things, aren't you know. You know, it's 306 00:18:20.640 --> 00:18:22.880 a it's a thing like a gun. I mean, it's 307 00:18:22.920 --> 00:18:25.400 not you know, evil or bad. It's what it's what 308 00:18:25.480 --> 00:18:28.079 people do with it because it is it is a 309 00:18:28.200 --> 00:18:33.319 reality of what uh you know, happens in our in 310 00:18:33.359 --> 00:18:36.839 our life. And I'd like to just go to a 311 00:18:38.079 --> 00:18:41.400 different place here just for a little bit. I'd like 312 00:18:41.440 --> 00:18:47.000 to talk about advertisements that we see on TV. Okay, 313 00:18:47.160 --> 00:18:51.480 because I think that's one of the main ways that 314 00:18:51.559 --> 00:18:57.160 they're radicalizing people and getting people into camps, and one 315 00:18:57.200 --> 00:18:59.759 of the main ways that they're messing with us is 316 00:19:00.200 --> 00:19:03.559 advertisements on TV. Do you have any thoughts about that? 317 00:19:04.799 --> 00:19:07.480 You know, it's a good one that I didn't really cover. 318 00:19:07.839 --> 00:19:11.680 You know, I focused on sort of major films, TV 319 00:19:11.799 --> 00:19:16.759 shows and some independent films and B movies. But yeah, 320 00:19:16.799 --> 00:19:19.319 I think that's actually a good overlooked point at music 321 00:19:19.359 --> 00:19:21.799 industry too, music videos, which are not as popular as 322 00:19:21.799 --> 00:19:26.759 it used to be. But you know, it's funny. I 323 00:19:26.839 --> 00:19:31.799 got rid of quote TV probably fifteen to twenty years ago. 324 00:19:31.880 --> 00:19:34.400 I just got rid of it, and so I don't 325 00:19:34.400 --> 00:19:37.079 see a whole lot of TV. Yeah, like when I 326 00:19:37.119 --> 00:19:39.039 go over to somebody's house or if we're eating at 327 00:19:39.079 --> 00:19:40.880 a restaurant, Well, that's really annoys me too. You can't 328 00:19:40.920 --> 00:19:43.319 go to a restaurant now without TVs everywhere, which is 329 00:19:44.240 --> 00:19:46.359 that to me is dystopian. We should be able to 330 00:19:46.400 --> 00:19:49.279 have a meal without having to watch you know, sports 331 00:19:49.279 --> 00:19:51.240 and ads. So I do see ads here and there. 332 00:19:51.319 --> 00:19:53.200 And one thing I noticed, at least in the last 333 00:19:53.240 --> 00:19:58.920 ten years is pharmaceutical ads everywhere. I mean, it's just 334 00:19:59.039 --> 00:20:03.000 like you're just you can't even turn the channel without 335 00:20:03.000 --> 00:20:05.839 you seeing just in you know, constant pharmaceutical, which to 336 00:20:05.880 --> 00:20:09.079 me is very brave, New world, very dystopian. The idea 337 00:20:09.160 --> 00:20:12.400 that there's a pill for every single, you know, thing 338 00:20:12.480 --> 00:20:14.799 going on in your life. I think we're meant to 339 00:20:15.640 --> 00:20:19.039 have depression at times in life. We're meant to have 340 00:20:19.599 --> 00:20:22.640 bad experiences that you know, helps balance out with the 341 00:20:22.680 --> 00:20:25.440 good experiences. So the idea that you should medicate yourself 342 00:20:25.480 --> 00:20:28.720 at all times to have no experiences is kind of 343 00:20:29.119 --> 00:20:33.519 you know, uh, kind of crazy to me. But you know, 344 00:20:33.559 --> 00:20:38.039 advertisements also have a lot of odd themes of men 345 00:20:38.119 --> 00:20:41.759 are usually in this sort of women role, or they're subservient, 346 00:20:41.799 --> 00:20:43.839 the women are always bossing the men around. The men 347 00:20:43.880 --> 00:20:47.039 are all idiots, they're all Homer Simpson, they're all you know, 348 00:20:47.160 --> 00:20:55.400 Albundi type characters who are just total idiots. Advertisements probably well, 349 00:20:55.440 --> 00:20:57.480 I mean they just kind of further the whole idea 350 00:20:57.559 --> 00:21:01.000 of just endless, infinite, you know, consumption and consumerism. So 351 00:21:01.640 --> 00:21:04.880 I think you're absolutely right that advertisements are overlooked and 352 00:21:05.119 --> 00:21:05.599 ads to. 353 00:21:07.640 --> 00:21:09.200 A lot of the directors who. 354 00:21:09.039 --> 00:21:13.680 Became kind of prominent directors, many of them began with advertisements. 355 00:21:14.720 --> 00:21:18.640 David Fincher, I think he went from ads and music 356 00:21:18.720 --> 00:21:20.960 videos to being you know, one of the top sort 357 00:21:20.960 --> 00:21:24.559 of directors that it's pretty nihilistic. Most of his movies 358 00:21:24.599 --> 00:21:29.279 are pretty dark and nihilistic. So yeah, that's a good point, Chris, 359 00:21:29.319 --> 00:21:30.640 I should have I should have. 360 00:21:30.880 --> 00:21:33.079 And then and then they also got into things like 361 00:21:33.160 --> 00:21:37.599 subliminal messaging. I remember that by Jim Keith. What was 362 00:21:37.640 --> 00:21:40.039 that book Jim Keith put that book out about mind 363 00:21:40.039 --> 00:21:41.319 control I have over here. 364 00:21:42.119 --> 00:21:47.000 Yeah, yeah, but they did mass control, mask control that. 365 00:21:47.200 --> 00:21:52.240 Right, right, yeah, right, and it just you know, it's 366 00:21:52.319 --> 00:21:56.359 part of the whole toxic soup. Okay. But then movies, 367 00:21:56.759 --> 00:21:59.680 you know, I mean it's like you know, the the 368 00:22:00.079 --> 00:22:03.799 quote unquote powers that be have you know, tried to 369 00:22:03.839 --> 00:22:07.119 stop me many times and try to put us out 370 00:22:07.160 --> 00:22:11.480 of business because you know, they don't like us publishing books. 371 00:22:11.799 --> 00:22:16.440 But you know, it's hard to stop stubborn people sometimes. 372 00:22:16.799 --> 00:22:20.880 And then also but when it gets to movies, they 373 00:22:20.920 --> 00:22:24.160 move in with the big guns and stop it because 374 00:22:24.440 --> 00:22:27.839 everybody goes to the movies. I mean, you know, we 375 00:22:28.000 --> 00:22:31.640 have kids and we try and raise them and whatnot, 376 00:22:32.039 --> 00:22:35.799 but you know, uh, they listen to the movies more 377 00:22:35.839 --> 00:22:38.319 than they listen to the parents most of the times. 378 00:22:38.559 --> 00:22:41.960 And then you know, you'll see how the movies take 379 00:22:42.000 --> 00:22:45.839 a life of their own in the society where people 380 00:22:45.960 --> 00:22:49.839 are relating what's going on in the world to the movies, 381 00:22:50.279 --> 00:22:52.960 you know, and and and so they're making you know. 382 00:22:53.440 --> 00:22:59.720 So it's it's really quite a toxic soup. So Adam, 383 00:22:59.839 --> 00:23:02.559 you know what what what are your thoughts and all 384 00:23:02.599 --> 00:23:05.319 of this and comments. 385 00:23:05.400 --> 00:23:10.119 Yeah, it's like I I'm like him. I got rid 386 00:23:10.200 --> 00:23:12.599 of my TV a while back, and I started I 387 00:23:12.720 --> 00:23:16.200 just read all the time, like I love books, and 388 00:23:16.680 --> 00:23:19.119 you know, talking to other people, it's just it became 389 00:23:19.160 --> 00:23:22.039 apparent to me people are so used to having the 390 00:23:22.160 --> 00:23:25.519 TV and stuff. It's that a lot of people can 391 00:23:25.559 --> 00:23:27.920 hardly even read a page. They're just like, oh, I 392 00:23:27.920 --> 00:23:32.240 don't you know. It's like we've been really just kind 393 00:23:32.279 --> 00:23:37.319 of dumbed down and almost like a trance. The TV 394 00:23:37.480 --> 00:23:41.920 kind of puts them into a trance. And yeah, I 395 00:23:42.079 --> 00:23:44.599 just said, it's it's it's something else. I mean I 396 00:23:44.960 --> 00:23:47.759 like movies though, you know, I do watch movies and stuff. 397 00:23:47.759 --> 00:23:50.519 It's just I have a TV here, but it's never on, 398 00:23:50.880 --> 00:23:52.599 like I've never I. 399 00:23:52.759 --> 00:23:54.160 Barely even use it. 400 00:23:53.839 --> 00:23:58.519 I'm always reading and I keep a long list of 401 00:23:58.640 --> 00:24:02.599