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<v Speaker 1>Coming up on eight oh five and fifty five care

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<v Speaker 1>CD talk station. I'm very happy Friday Eve to you.

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<v Speaker 1>Been looking forward to this conversation all morning. My next

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<v Speaker 1>guest Brian Reisinger. He grew up on a family farm

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<v Speaker 1>in Sault County, Wisconsin and loves to talk about the

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<v Speaker 1>hidden stories of rural America. Like most children of farmers,

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<v Speaker 1>he worked with his father from the time he could

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<v Speaker 1>walk before he ultimately entered the world of business and

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<v Speaker 1>business journalism and public policy. He has been published in

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<v Speaker 1>like every single publication you can think of, USA Today, Newsweek,

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<v Speaker 1>Yahoo News, Wisconsin Public Radios, Wisconsin Life. I could go

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<v Speaker 1>on Real Clear Politics and go to that site all

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<v Speaker 1>the time. He also is an award winner National Society

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<v Speaker 1>and Newspaper Calumnists, first Place in Seven Hills Literary Contrast Contest,

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<v Speaker 1>and the Soul Sword And I could go on, But

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<v Speaker 1>today we're going to talk about his very first book,

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<v Speaker 1>Land Rich, Cash Poor, My Family's Hope and the untold

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<v Speaker 1>history of the Disappearing American Farmer. Brian, Welcome to the

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<v Speaker 1>Morning Show. It's a real pleasure to have you on today. Hey,

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<v Speaker 1>good morning, It's good. I feel like I have some

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<v Speaker 1>at least connection with you. I am. I outkicked my

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<v Speaker 1>coverage when I married my wife. She grew up on

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<v Speaker 1>a rural dairy farm out in Pennsylvania, a little town

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<v Speaker 1>no one's ever heard of called Avella. Her dad literally

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<v Speaker 1>worked his entire life every single day. If you don't

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<v Speaker 1>milk the cows twice a day, you don't get paid.

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<v Speaker 1>So it was a small farm, a house he built himself.

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<v Speaker 1>They all grew up, they all worked the farm, never

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<v Speaker 1>had really much money at all, but it was just

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<v Speaker 1>it's just it's an amazing life when you hear the

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<v Speaker 1>stories and the hardships that go along with it. It's

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<v Speaker 1>not an easy life at all. Something I know that

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<v Speaker 1>I'm telling you that you know about, and so quite

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<v Speaker 1>often you know multiple generations. You know, kids want to

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<v Speaker 1>move away, they want to go to the city. They

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<v Speaker 1>don't want to follow in their father's or mother's footsteps.

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<v Speaker 1>And I suppose that's part of this disappearing American farmer concept.

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<v Speaker 1>But it's beyond that, isn't it, Because it's expensive to

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<v Speaker 1>be a small farmer these days.

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<v Speaker 2>You're absolutely right. I'm so glad we share that history.

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<v Speaker 2>And it sounds like your wife's probably a hard working

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<v Speaker 2>person with all values and had a great child that

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<v Speaker 2>you know, you're absolutely right in terms of the way

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<v Speaker 2>you describe the way of life. And here's the issue.

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<v Speaker 2>It goes so deep. It does have to do with

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<v Speaker 2>what's our next generation doing, but it has to do

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<v Speaker 2>with economic factors, governmental factors, technological factors, all kinds of

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<v Speaker 2>ways that we've been leaving our family farmers behind.

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<v Speaker 1>That's what we do in the book.

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<v Speaker 2>We dive into the hidden airs of history that are

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<v Speaker 2>driving that disappearance. Why is it happening and what's the consequence.

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<v Speaker 1>To all of us?

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<v Speaker 2>And then when we leave that with my family's story,

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<v Speaker 2>and those are stories that are probably like the ones

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<v Speaker 2>you heard from your wife's family stories. Is survival of

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<v Speaker 2>you know, weather farm acts and economical people from the

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<v Speaker 2>depression to today. And you know, it's definitely a unique thing.

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<v Speaker 2>It's a life filled with with both beauty and hardship

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<v Speaker 2>that goes hand in hand.

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<v Speaker 1>Well. Growing up, you know, I not fully appreciating the

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<v Speaker 1>concept of the small, the family farm by contrast to

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<v Speaker 1>the corporate farm. And of course, if you're a corporate farm,

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<v Speaker 1>you can afford to buy the what I don't know

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<v Speaker 1>how much one of those massive tractors costs there are

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<v Speaker 1>hundreds of thousands of dollars, and I just I can't

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<v Speaker 1>imagine a situation where my now late father in law,

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<v Speaker 1>he lived in ninety three, I think years old, the

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<v Speaker 1>idea that he could ever afford something that costs so

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<v Speaker 1>much in order to just sort of just try to

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<v Speaker 1>keep up in terms of competing. I mean, it's just

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<v Speaker 1>it represents such a colossal challenge for small farmers to

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<v Speaker 1>compete with, you know, somebody who's got tens of millions

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<v Speaker 1>of dollars because they're backed up by major corporations.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, it does.

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<v Speaker 1>And here's what's going on.

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<v Speaker 2>We've got that kind of force going on all across

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<v Speaker 2>our economy. So the food companies are working to keep

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<v Speaker 2>up with the rest of the American economy by getting

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<v Speaker 2>bigger and bigger. The agribusiness companies work and keep a

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<v Speaker 2>food company, and the farmers are not trying to keep

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<v Speaker 2>up with the AGGA business food company sverone's trying to

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<v Speaker 2>keep up with the Joneses. So you got farmers, whether

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<v Speaker 2>they're big, small, or medium, they are all trying to

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<v Speaker 2>keep up with the Jones And everybody has that pressure

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<v Speaker 2>to get bigger or get out. Our bigger farmers got

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<v Speaker 2>that way trying to survive a lot of our medium

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<v Speaker 2>and smaller farms. You ended up not making it because

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<v Speaker 2>that we do still have a lot of family farms

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<v Speaker 2>left in this country. But it's truly against the odds.

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<v Speaker 2>It's people like your father and mom work continue to work,

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<v Speaker 2>trying to figure a way to be competitive, to be efficient,

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<v Speaker 2>to be resourceful, even though the economic crises and government policies,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, hit them in unique ways that people don't understand.

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<v Speaker 2>And even though so much of our technology, to your point,

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<v Speaker 2>has been leaving family farms behind. It doesn't have to

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<v Speaker 2>be this way, but it certainly is this way. With

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<v Speaker 2>the deck stacked against our family farmer who's whatever their

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<v Speaker 2>type of size, fighting to keep.

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<v Speaker 1>Going well, and it almost seems like they're intentionally trying

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<v Speaker 1>to put the small farm out of business. And I

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<v Speaker 1>don't know if you've ever seen it, and I know

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<v Speaker 1>it's Britain or the United Kingdom and Clarkson's farm, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>Jeremy Clarkson has this farm and every show really illustrates

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<v Speaker 1>the insanity of the micro management of government authorities over

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<v Speaker 1>the types of crops that are grown where they can

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<v Speaker 1>be grown. You know, the amount of moisture contact a

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<v Speaker 1>content in a rape seed, And it's almost as if

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<v Speaker 1>they want to drive them ount of business with rules

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<v Speaker 1>and regulations. Then you keep on the whole idea of

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<v Speaker 1>this climate change religion, cow flatulence. We need to regulate that,

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<v Speaker 1>we need to regulate how much space your chickens have

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<v Speaker 1>or your pork has. I mean, it just adds so

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<v Speaker 1>much additional cost burden and I guess paperwork on the

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<v Speaker 1>small farmer.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you know, you're so right. Every single day, government requirements, regulations, taxes,

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<v Speaker 2>different things are really waging war on the American family farmer,

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<v Speaker 2>and you know, the people who care about our environment.

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<v Speaker 2>The irony is that there's nobody who cares as much

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<v Speaker 2>about our soil health and abundant water, clean water as

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<v Speaker 2>our farmers. So there's a lot of room for people

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<v Speaker 2>who care about environment and farmers to work together. But

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<v Speaker 2>the problem is our political debates divide everybody, and we've

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<v Speaker 2>got government that's really stamping out family farmers. I give

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<v Speaker 2>you one brief, perfect example. This happens. This stuff happens

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<v Speaker 2>every single day. But there's really really serious times in

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<v Speaker 2>our history or escalated in the farm crisis. The government

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<v Speaker 2>was pushing more debt on farms to make them get bigger,

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<v Speaker 2>and then within a few years they raised interest rates

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<v Speaker 2>because they were trying to deal with inflation. You can

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<v Speaker 2>argue four or against the government trying to encourage farmers

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<v Speaker 2>to expand, you can argue four or against changing interest rates.

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<v Speaker 2>But when you push debt on them with the government,

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<v Speaker 2>and then you use that same government to make that

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<v Speaker 2>debt more expensive, you wipe out tens of thousands of farms.

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<v Speaker 2>My parents, we tell the story in the book. They

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<v Speaker 2>just barely survived that they had been dealing with a

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<v Speaker 2>drought and almost had to take out a bunch of

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<v Speaker 2>debt right before the farm crisis hit. They didn't have

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<v Speaker 2>to do that because they've banded together with neighbors to

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<v Speaker 2>get through that drought year, and they avoided taken on

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<v Speaker 2>debt which would have wiped them out in the nineteen eighties,

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<v Speaker 2>just like happened at tens of thousands of farms, all

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<v Speaker 2>at the hand of our government.

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<v Speaker 1>And I'm so glad you brought that up, that banded together,

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<v Speaker 1>because I've also gotten stories from my wife, you know, anecdotes,

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<v Speaker 1>and it's like I shouldn't. I should give credit to

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<v Speaker 1>my dad's side of the family too, because they were

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<v Speaker 1>all what I call dirt farmers in Tennessee. So I

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<v Speaker 1>got farm stock on both sides. But the idea of community,

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<v Speaker 1>and this is one of the more positive things, and

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<v Speaker 1>one of the reality is of you know, when you

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<v Speaker 1>ask yourself, when you hear about you and I talking

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<v Speaker 1>about all this crisis and the problems and the difficulties

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<v Speaker 1>of being a farmer. There are so many rewards to

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<v Speaker 1>being a small farmer. And part of it is that

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<v Speaker 1>sense of community. Because the entire region where my wife

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<v Speaker 1>grew up, they're all farmers. They're all engaged in the

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<v Speaker 1>dairy business or you know, or or at least some

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<v Speaker 1>aspect of farming. And when the hard times hit, when people,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, struggle with difficulties, they all step up to

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<v Speaker 1>the plate and help each other out. It's a beautiful

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<v Speaker 1>thing to behold.

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<v Speaker 2>That's absolutely right. By the way, I'm glad that they

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<v Speaker 2>put a microphone in front of somebody who's got farming

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<v Speaker 2>on both sides of your family. That's outstanding.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, well, you see, I do. You're following the footsteps.

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<v Speaker 1>I practiced law for sixteen years, and I've been on

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<v Speaker 1>the radio now for this is my nineteenth year. I

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<v Speaker 1>think I was frightened away by the hardships that I

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<v Speaker 1>saw when I was exposed to it.

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<v Speaker 2>Brian, Well, I'll tell you we struggle with those same

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<v Speaker 2>things in our family. My sister's work and take over

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<v Speaker 2>the farm for my dad. I worked with my dad

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<v Speaker 2>from the time like a walk. I love my roots,

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<v Speaker 2>but I didn't have their talent for cattle and crops.

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<v Speaker 2>So although I still worked them on the business side

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<v Speaker 2>and they throw me a track from my dad, but

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<v Speaker 2>sue my writing career. I'm just honored to be able

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<v Speaker 2>to tell the stories. So you and I have come

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<v Speaker 2>to some of the same things. But you know your

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<v Speaker 2>point on neighbors banning together. You're absolutely right. That neighbor

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<v Speaker 2>that I mentioned that helped my parents get through the

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<v Speaker 2>farm crisis in nineteen y is what happened is he

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<v Speaker 2>was an elderly man didn't need all the crops in

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<v Speaker 2>his field. My dad was a young man starting out

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<v Speaker 2>and had field that were barely putting up the crops

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<v Speaker 2>he need to feed his animals, so they went what

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<v Speaker 2>they call halves. And you might know this from your

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<v Speaker 2>own family background, when you go have one guy does

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<v Speaker 2>the work and then they split the crop right. Well,

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<v Speaker 2>the old man the name was Leo, and he refused

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<v Speaker 2>to take his fair share. He gave my dad more

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<v Speaker 2>of the crop than he ought to have, and my

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<v Speaker 2>dad kept on going down there trying to pay him money.

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<v Speaker 2>And he walked into the guy's cigarette you know, filled

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<v Speaker 2>living room, trying to hand him money. There after dame

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<v Speaker 2>finding the guy said you just got married. You don't

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<v Speaker 2>know me nothing to take it and go, And we

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<v Speaker 2>get emotional just thinking about what he's been gone for

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<v Speaker 2>a number of years now. But if he hadn't done that,

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<v Speaker 2>my parents would have taken out a load of debt

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<v Speaker 2>potentially just before the farm crisis hit. And it was

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<v Speaker 2>that working together and that sense of local community that

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<v Speaker 2>really got people through. And by the way, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>my dad was able to help this guy, but he

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<v Speaker 2>put in extra hours working around the clock to get

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<v Speaker 2>the crops off this guy's feel. So it's people helping people,

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<v Speaker 2>you know.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And the other sense I always get is in

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<v Speaker 1>another story back in from my wife. Back in the seventies,

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<v Speaker 1>we went through stagflation and the economy went down the

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<v Speaker 1>toilet and I'm sure it happened in multiple different times

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<v Speaker 1>over the life of that particular farm and my father

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<v Speaker 1>in law. But because they were realistic and not materialistic,

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<v Speaker 1>they pretty much were self sufficient. They didn't you know,

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<v Speaker 1>want more. They didn't think that, oh my god, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>I wish I had a better this, or that they

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<v Speaker 1>had everything they needed. And so when hard times hit

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<v Speaker 1>the general population and people then had to do without something,

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<v Speaker 1>they became used to like, oh, we're going to have

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<v Speaker 1>to cut back on this, or we need to drop

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<v Speaker 1>the country club membership because of the you know, the

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<v Speaker 1>economic day, their life remained static. They continued to live

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<v Speaker 1>at the same level, which was enough to feed them

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<v Speaker 1>and satisfy them and pay the bills, and they it

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<v Speaker 1>was sort of if they didn't have a newspaper, they

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<v Speaker 1>didn't even realize the rest of the world was going

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<v Speaker 1>through this turmoil.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's absolutely right. You know, It's one of the

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<v Speaker 2>things that I encountered so much when I was working

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<v Speaker 2>on the book, because I knew these family stories, I

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<v Speaker 2>knew bits and pieces of them, and I wanted to

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<v Speaker 2>reconstruct and be able to tell the survival stories. But

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<v Speaker 2>then I started researching what was going on around us

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<v Speaker 2>at that time. What was happening to my great grandparents

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<v Speaker 2>in the early nineteen nine So what was happening to

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<v Speaker 2>my grandparents and the depression? What were the bigger forces

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<v Speaker 2>at play? And it's so true that you know, when

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<v Speaker 2>you're on the ground and the farm, you don't necessarily

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<v Speaker 2>have a way to see the bigger forces affecting you.

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<v Speaker 2>And then vice versa. Right the rest of the country

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<v Speaker 2>that's living out some of those forces doesn't necessarily get

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<v Speaker 2>a chance to see what's on the farm. And that's

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<v Speaker 2>really the challenge, that's the core reason that our farms

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<v Speaker 2>are disappearance because that disconnects And here's the thing. It

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<v Speaker 2>impacts not only our rural communities like where I'm from

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<v Speaker 2>and like where your family has roots that are getting

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<v Speaker 2>hollowed out, but it impacts every single American dinner table,

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<v Speaker 2>because when we're losing our farms, we're impacting the price,

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<v Speaker 2>the health, the security of the foot would supply for

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<v Speaker 2>every single American.

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<v Speaker 1>Brian Rising here, the author of the book we're talking

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<v Speaker 1>about today, land Rich, Cash Poor of my Family's hope

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<v Speaker 1>and the untold history of the disappearing American farmer. Brian,

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<v Speaker 1>if you could fix something, And I mean, I guess

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<v Speaker 1>for an initial question of the answer, can the small farm,

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<v Speaker 1>can the the the American small farmer be saved? Can

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<v Speaker 1>they continue assuming they desire to continue farming as opposed

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<v Speaker 1>to corporate sized farms? Can they survive? And if there's

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<v Speaker 1>something if the answer may be leaning toward no because

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<v Speaker 1>of all the things that we sort of scratch the

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<v Speaker 1>surface of that you dive in your dep two in

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<v Speaker 1>your book, what would you change that might lead to

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<v Speaker 1>a better life for them or a more successful, lasting

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<v Speaker 1>farm life.

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<v Speaker 2>Absolutely, you know there is reason for hope. We've lost

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<v Speaker 2>seventy percent of our farms in the past century, which

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<v Speaker 2>is devastating, but we still got nearly two million left.

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<v Speaker 2>And here's the incredible thing. Ninety six percent of them

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<v Speaker 2>are family farms. And it's because people have farms that

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<v Speaker 2>they're working part time, walls, pulling two to three jobs

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<v Speaker 2>to keep things going. So these are families, nearly two

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<v Speaker 2>million families that are you know, continuing to fight forward

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<v Speaker 2>even though we haven't, you know, made the economics work

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<v Speaker 2>in this country. Imagine if we made the economics work again.

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<v Speaker 2>And so we do need to change things, and there's

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<v Speaker 2>moves we can make that can inject new entrepreneur opportunity

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<v Speaker 2>out there for our farmers. We need to research and

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<v Speaker 2>development revolution so that all of our technology is bringing

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<v Speaker 2>farms of all sizes, medium and small as well as

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<v Speaker 2>large along. We need to change our policies to make

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<v Speaker 2>sure we got fair markets for small businesses in this country.

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<v Speaker 2>And we need to make sure the consumers who care

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<v Speaker 2>about where their food comes from take steps toward buying

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<v Speaker 2>from local farmers. Buy from a farmer down the road,

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<v Speaker 2>you know that kind of thing.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I imagine that that was an injection of positivity

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<v Speaker 1>the whole buy local, buy from your local farmers that

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<v Speaker 1>you know, eat and consume local. What's available fresh from

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<v Speaker 1>the farm, you know, grass raised, a grass fed beef

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<v Speaker 1>raised from your local farmer. It should be easier for

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<v Speaker 1>I suppose farmers to slaughter their own beef and sell

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<v Speaker 1>it locally. Maybe I knew Congressman Tom some Mess. He's

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<v Speaker 1>on my program a lot. I'm a huge fan of

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<v Speaker 1>it is he has his own farm, and you know,

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<v Speaker 1>he is a big fan of you know, raw milk

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<v Speaker 1>or some health benefits of that. My wife grew up

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<v Speaker 1>drinking it, you know, straight from the cows. It's as

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<v Speaker 1>healthy as she could possibly be. So, you know, but

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<v Speaker 1>maybe this RFK junior emphasis towards health might give that

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<v Speaker 1>much needed infusion for the local farmer.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you know, that's the hope. There's always opportunity in

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<v Speaker 2>peril and for the farmer, and you know, people caring

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<v Speaker 2>about where the food comes from and us shifting toward

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<v Speaker 2>farmers able to meet the markets they are meet now,

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<v Speaker 2>but also meet new markets from people who care about local,

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<v Speaker 2>regional fresh food, who care about specialty foods. Being able

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<v Speaker 2>to shift our farm economy in that direction. That creates

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<v Speaker 2>an entrepreneur opportunity for our farmers. It also creates more

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<v Speaker 2>options for our consumers. We've got to make sure that

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<v Speaker 2>we make those transitions. Understand that farms are small businesses.

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<v Speaker 2>Then I have a whole lot of money sitting around

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<v Speaker 2>and investing new things, but they can make change over time.

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<v Speaker 2>And if we can get focused on that and every

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<v Speaker 2>consumer takes a step toward the farmer, I know the

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<v Speaker 2>farmers are ready to take more steps toward the consumer.

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<v Speaker 1>And knowing the farmers the way I do, I know

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<v Speaker 1>you you are right on that. Brian Rising, your author

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<v Speaker 1>of land Ridge Cash Poor, My family's hope and the

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<v Speaker 1>untold history of the disappearing American farmer. Hopefully we can

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<v Speaker 1>reverse that process. Brian, it's been a real pleasure talking

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<v Speaker 1>with you today. I appreciate you spending time with my

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<v Speaker 1>listeners of me and for writing the book, which is

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<v Speaker 1>now available on my blog page at fifty five krs

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<v Speaker 1>dot com so people can easily get a copy of it,

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<v Speaker 1>and I strongly encourage them to do that because you

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<v Speaker 1>will have a much more profound appreciation for the hard

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<v Speaker 1>work that these men and women put in every single day. Brian,

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<v Speaker 1>you take great care of yourself.

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<v Speaker 2>Hey, thank you too, thanks for having me my pleasure.

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<v Speaker 1>It's eight nineteen right now, fifty five KR City Dog Station,

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<v Speaker 1>it being Thursday. I heard me the aviation expert Jay

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<v Speaker 1>Ratliffe waiting in the wings. Looking forward to having him

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<v Speaker 1>back on as I always am. Maybe a word or

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<v Speaker 1>two about the markets, given his experience with and activities

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<v Speaker 1>trading stocks every day. Jay Radley will be up soon.

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<v Speaker 1>I hope you can stick around for that. But first,

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<v Speaker 1>speaking of farming, you can get I'll tell you what,

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<v Speaker 1>but our remot is in addition