Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to La Not So Confidential, the premiere
Speaker 1: forensic psychology podcast. My name is doctor Shiloh.
Speaker 2: And I'm doctor Scott, and we host a podcast that
Speaker 2: explores the intersection of forensic psychology, true crime, and how
Speaker 2: those concepts are represented in entertainment. We wanted to take
Speaker 2: a moment and update this very first episode for anyone
Speaker 2: just discovering our little pod and starting off at the
Speaker 2: very beginning with us. No matter what year you're currently
Speaker 2: in now. When we started this show back in twenty seventeen,
Speaker 2: our formula might not have been as clear as that
Speaker 2: description that I just gave you our first recording of
Speaker 2: our first episode. That night, we were just two best
Speaker 2: friends who happened to be forensic psychologists, actively working in
Speaker 2: this profession in actual forensic settings, and we saw a
Speaker 2: void in the podcast space of people talking about the
Speaker 2: real ins and outs of this job and how it
Speaker 2: relates to true crime and the legal system.
Speaker 1: We were hoping to find an audience that would be
Speaker 1: interested in us sharing some real clinical research that found
Speaker 1: endlessly fascinating. This has been an eight year project of
Speaker 1: creative growth, professional growth, and an enormous amount of data
Speaker 1: being put out into the world in these relatively small bites.
Speaker 2: Starting at the beginning of a podcast can be daunting.
Speaker 2: This is why we wanted to take a step back
Speaker 2: and address episode one.
Speaker 1: We are so happy that you're listening, but maybe with
Speaker 1: some of this orientation it will allow you to get
Speaker 1: even more value out of our catalog of work. Yes,
Speaker 1: there is a ton of benefit you can get from
Speaker 1: binge listening through our archives, and we believe that this
Speaker 1: content builds upon itself, but really there's no need to
Speaker 1: listen in order. There might be some repetition, but as
Speaker 1: we know, when you're learning a new skill or topic,
Speaker 1: it can be super helpful to have some reminders along
Speaker 1: the way, and there were a number of episodes that
Speaker 1: we ended up finding new research for later, and we
Speaker 1: definitely go back and address that.
Speaker 2: We are super excited that you're here and you're about
Speaker 2: to start on a journey of getting to know what
Speaker 2: the real forensic psychology world is like and also getting
Speaker 2: to know us. We would love for you to subscribe
Speaker 2: to the show right off the bat, but we also
Speaker 2: know there's a ton of other material that lives on
Speaker 2: beyond this podcast. You can visit our website, which is
Speaker 2: linked in the show notes to peruse all of our resources,
Speaker 2: and there are a lot of them for each episode,
Speaker 2: as well as links to guest spots that we've done
Speaker 2: on other shows, and just a ton of other information.
Speaker 1: And you can also go over to our YouTube channel
Speaker 1: where we hosted a live show called Behind the Couch,
Speaker 1: where we typically talk to other people in the true
Speaker 1: crime criminal justice world. Our Patreon is also still up
Speaker 1: and running and anyone can join for just a dollar
Speaker 1: a month to have access to all of that content
Speaker 1: there as well. With that, we hope you enjoy this
Speaker 1: bumbling first introductory episode to get to know who we
Speaker 1: are and why we started doing this in the first place.
Speaker 2: We hope that you'll show us some grace with the technology,
Speaker 2: the sound quality or lack thereof, and also with us
Speaker 2: finding our way as hosts. Trust us, it gets better
Speaker 2: with time, and we hope that you have as much
Speaker 2: fun listening as we did recording. Let us know what
Speaker 2: you think, thanks, folks. Hi, folks, welcome to the intro
Speaker 2: podcast of La Not So Confidential. This is a podcast
Speaker 2: devoted to the subject of forensic psychology. I'm doctor Scott.
Speaker 2: I'm a forensic psychologist working at Southern California. I'm here
Speaker 2: with my amazing best friend and co hosts.
Speaker 3: Doctor Shiloh, and I am also a licensed psychologist in
Speaker 3: the state of California and a forensic psychologist.
Speaker 4: So we're here because we want to.
Speaker 2: Provide some education on the subject of forensic psychology. In
Speaker 2: the podcast world, there's a lot of great podcasts about
Speaker 2: different kinds of psychology, different.
Speaker 4: Areas, different areas of study.
Speaker 2: And research, but there's virtually nothing on the field of
Speaker 2: forensic psychology by people who are actually working in the field.
Speaker 2: This is what we hope to bring to you. We
Speaker 2: hope to bring some fun as well as some maybe
Speaker 2: some education. Hopefully you'll enjoy this the way we enjoy
Speaker 2: the exploration of the work that we're very passionate about.
Speaker 2: I'm a licensed m FT. I'm also a licensed psychologist.
Speaker 2: My emphasis in my doctoral studies was family forensics, so
Speaker 2: I have a background of training in being an expert witness.
Speaker 2: I work in the fields of family law, family and
Speaker 2: child child custody, evaluation, mediation, conflict resolution, and I'm also
Speaker 2: trained in crisis negotiation.
Speaker 3: Shiloh, so I hold a master's and a doctorate in
Speaker 3: forensic psychology and those are both from Alliant International University
Speaker 3: here in Los Angeles, and as far as my expertise
Speaker 3: in working with forensic clients, I've really focused on.
Speaker 5: Working with offenders and so I have worked.
Speaker 3: With them before they go to prison. I actually still
Speaker 3: have a private practice in which I do this, and
Speaker 3: then working with them when they get out of prison,
Speaker 3: primarily evaluations and then treatment. So I have recently shifted
Speaker 3: to working in law enforcement psychology this year and I
Speaker 3: have a whole new clientele. So looking at the world
Speaker 3: of forensic psychology, I think between the two of us,
Speaker 3: we have quite of experience from different environments, and that's
Speaker 3: what we really want to bring.
Speaker 4: To this podcast.
Speaker 2: We should almost mention that we both come to this
Speaker 2: field from very different fields. We came to psychology as adults,
Speaker 2: as opposed to some people who go right into doctoral
Speaker 2: work from undergrad. I was an entertainment professional in southern
Speaker 2: California for twenty years, working as an agent's assistant, a
Speaker 2: casting director, a talent manager, and eventually a line producer
Speaker 2: for DVD content. And Shiloh has additionally a fascinating background
Speaker 2: as well.
Speaker 4: Tell us about that well.
Speaker 3: I worked in law enforcement for ten years and seven
Speaker 3: of those ten years I was a police.
Speaker 4: Officer, and you come from a.
Speaker 3: Very heavy law enforcement family, So I like to tell
Speaker 3: my clients now, I am a daughter, sister, wife of
Speaker 3: law enforcement officer, so I have lived and breathed that
Speaker 3: life for a long time, which brings a really unique perspective.
Speaker 5: I'm sure, But yeah, I was just a normal patrol
Speaker 5: cop for seven years.
Speaker 2: Which is really going to be a fascinating perspective on
Speaker 2: everything that we talk about.
Speaker 5: Sure, I think you know.
Speaker 3: When I came to you with this idea, it was
Speaker 3: really trying to marry a few things that were interested in.
Speaker 3: Obviously true crime, obviously some of the entertainment and media
Speaker 3: around it, even if it is fiction, and looking at
Speaker 3: the forensic psychology topics that are kind of weaved in there.
Speaker 3: But I also felt like the other podcasts and other
Speaker 3: entertainment outlets that I turned to are constantly asking for
Speaker 3: experts in the area to come in and talk because
Speaker 3: maybe they don't have that expertise, which is sometimes entirely
Speaker 3: the whole point.
Speaker 5: It's just entertainment based.
Speaker 3: But I feel like a lot of times I'm sitting
Speaker 3: in my car kind of screaming at the radio because
Speaker 3: a term is wrong. I am writing letters to Karen
Speaker 3: and Georgia on my favorite murder because I want to
Speaker 3: just kind of set something straight. And they're so wonderful
Speaker 3: by the way to read these letters and take the input,
Speaker 3: but for us to really be the subject matter experts
Speaker 3: and apply that.
Speaker 4: To all of the above.
Speaker 2: So hopefully we're going to be able to give you
Speaker 2: a perspective on what we do in our work and
Speaker 2: what we want to do to keep it really interesting.
Speaker 4: Is we're going to vary.
Speaker 2: We're going to go back and forth between true crime,
Speaker 2: things that are actually going on right now, that are
Speaker 2: in proceedings that would be known to a larger audience,
Speaker 2: and maybe some things that are kind of obscure. They
Speaker 2: might be subjects or crimes proceedings trials that you don't
Speaker 2: know anything about, but we think that they're really interesting,
Speaker 2: and we'll tell you why these are particularly interesting. It
Speaker 2: may relate to how law is going to change or
Speaker 2: how it's impacting culture at large. We also are going
Speaker 2: to be bringing in other experts in the field. We're
Speaker 2: going to be bringing in law enforcement experts as well
Speaker 2: as mental health experts that go even farther and deeper
Speaker 2: in those certain areas of expertise than we do, because
Speaker 2: we always want to challenge our own fixed notions about things.
Speaker 2: We want to make sure somebody comes in and shakes
Speaker 2: us up a little bit as well.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, I think it's also important to note that because
Speaker 3: we are licensed psychologists and we are not just somebody
Speaker 3: starting a podcast that doesn't have any obligation to any
Speaker 3: professional guidelines, we do. Absolutely, so there may be some
Speaker 3: carefully worded sentences coming from us because we need to
Speaker 3: make sure we are not crossing or breaking any guidelines
Speaker 3: or rules or.
Speaker 5: Ethics standards that we do have to abide by.
Speaker 3: So we can't, as much as we're going to keep
Speaker 3: this casual and kind of you make it very personal
Speaker 3: and colorful, we can't just really fly by the seat
Speaker 3: of our pants in a lot of different areas. We
Speaker 3: may even have to stay away from certain cases that
Speaker 3: are sensitive to the agencies.
Speaker 4: That we work with.
Speaker 2: So forensic psychologists are most commonly are licensed psychologists who
Speaker 2: specialize in applying psychological knowledge to areas in the criminal
Speaker 2: and civil arenas that are directly related to legal matters.
Speaker 4: We hold graduate.
Speaker 2: Degrees in psychology, and those are either a PhD or
Speaker 2: a society. Sometimes you can have an EED which is
Speaker 2: an educational psychology degree, but that's very rare.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I would say the simplest way to think about
Speaker 3: it is anywhere where psychology and the criminal justice system overlap, which.
Speaker 5: Could be huge.
Speaker 3: I mean, I have friends that are doing child custody
Speaker 3: evaluations for courts, your experience with working in the prisons,
Speaker 3: just doing evaluations for courts, competency to stand trial, insanity evaluations,
Speaker 3: sexually violent predator evaluations.
Speaker 5: Anywhere when those areas overlap, that's going to be your
Speaker 5: forensic psychology.
Speaker 2: So right, And I should have said that earlier. I
Speaker 2: did work in the state corrections system for many years,
Speaker 2: so in this line of work, sometimes forensic psychologists are
Speaker 2: integrally involved in helping to design newer prisons. Unfortunately, that
Speaker 2: does not happen enough, and a lot of what happens
Speaker 2: in the prison system now is they're sort of trying
Speaker 2: to use an old prison the physical design of the
Speaker 2: building for treating their mentally ill inmates, and that doesn't
Speaker 2: work so well. We wish there was more involvement with
Speaker 2: forensic psychologists and that design process. So, like Charlot said,
Speaker 2: it's that juxtaposition between criminal justice in other words, law enforcement,
Speaker 2: academic training, corrections, and then so criminal Yeah, you're going
Speaker 2: to talk about right.
Speaker 3: So just kind of distinguishing with criminal psychology. I think
Speaker 3: for the audience, probably most people think of criminal profiling
Speaker 3: when they think of something like that very rare, something
Speaker 3: that is, you know, probably not even done by psychologists.
Speaker 5: For the most part.
Speaker 3: You're going to find the most criminal profilers working with
Speaker 3: the Behavioral Analysis Unit in the FBI, and they often
Speaker 3: are not psychologists, and they're special agents that are specially trained.
Speaker 3: But there are case specific type of consultations that law
Speaker 3: enforcement psychologists can be a part of. If you're working
Speaker 3: with a law enforcement a can see that want some
Speaker 3: input on their cold case or their unsolved serial killer
Speaker 3: or serial rape case, that they may go to somebody
Speaker 3: that works with their department as a psychologist and has
Speaker 3: expertise in the background.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, Labby, but because I always think I have
Speaker 2: to explain to people were not Bed Wong kind of
Speaker 2: like just hanging out around the Law and Order Police office,
Speaker 2: those episodes where Bead just suddenly shows up and drops
Speaker 2: some wisdom on.
Speaker 4: When I got this most recent job.
Speaker 3: My brother goes, you're that guy, That's exactly what I was
Speaker 3: talking about.
Speaker 4: No offense to be d wom. He's a wonderful actor.
Speaker 2: We just wish it was a little bit more accurate
Speaker 2: about how law enforcement psychologists are fold into that.
Speaker 3: Don't worry if this part seems dry, We're gonna weave
Speaker 3: in a hefty amount of entertainment.
Speaker 5: For you with all of those shows that you guys
Speaker 5: love so much.
Speaker 4: But yeah, so, I guess I didn't say that.
Speaker 3: Currently I work for a large law enforcement agency where
Speaker 3: my job is divided between clinical services for law enforcement.
Speaker 5: As well as training and then soon to be part
Speaker 5: of crisis negotiation team.
Speaker 3: Right, You're going to love that there's options for a
Speaker 3: case specific consultation that I was just speaking about.
Speaker 2: We're both really really lucky in that we get to
Speaker 2: do some of the most amazing trainings, really hardcore trainings
Speaker 2: for our job. Shiloh's about to come up on a
Speaker 2: training that I got to do last year with the FBI.
Speaker 2: I'm incredibly jealous because I would I would pay to
Speaker 2: do it again.
Speaker 5: It's the.
Speaker 2: Crisis Negotiation Tactics or Christious Negotiation Team training for the FBI,
Speaker 2: and it's really really amazing because the FBI has a
Speaker 2: standardized protocol for or how to handle full on SWAT
Speaker 2: situations and de escalation of really really tense situations, you know,
Speaker 2: which can include someone you know that's a hostage situation
Speaker 2: or a barricade situation, or someone that's about to you know,
Speaker 2: not only cause harm to themselves, but their attempt to
Speaker 2: commit suicide could cause harm to a lot of other people.
Speaker 2: So it's a great training we'll.
Speaker 3: Share with you as we get to go to these
Speaker 3: different trainings. I have lovingly referred to myself as a
Speaker 3: training whore throughout my career because I think it's part
Speaker 3: of just loving to learn and how much it motivates
Speaker 3: me to want to put these new skills to task.
Speaker 2: We call it La Not So Confidential because living in
Speaker 2: a large urban area, there's a lot of crime here
Speaker 2: and even though it's a better environment than it was
Speaker 2: in the past, you know, this city, the juxtaposition between
Speaker 2: criminality and entertainment has long existed, and there's a lot
Speaker 2: of great material to pull from. We're both obsessed with
Speaker 2: a lot of very well known cases such as Heaven's
Speaker 2: Gate that was a major event that happened here years ago.
Speaker 2: In fact, I think We're at the twenty year anniversary,
Speaker 2: so we got to cover that pretty soon.
Speaker 4: We got to talk talk about Calton involvement.
Speaker 5: Southern California seems to be a breeding ground for.
Speaker 4: Cults, Yeah, definitely, But just the history.
Speaker 5: I mean, I love the history of.
Speaker 3: The city now that we're both working downtown proper in LA,
Speaker 3: you know, from famous cases like the Black Dahlia case,
Speaker 3: just to no locations of driving by the area where
Speaker 3: USC now is and thinking, oh, that's where her body
Speaker 3: was dumped, or she hung out.
Speaker 5: At this bar and some of those locations.
Speaker 3: Are still there, or the old architecture and buildings are
Speaker 3: still there.
Speaker 5: All of that I think comes into.
Speaker 3: Just the interest and fascination with it all, and weaving
Speaker 3: that into our title I.
Speaker 5: Think is fitting as well.
Speaker 3: Right, So I think it's really important to talk about why,
Speaker 3: just leading up to doing this, how we got interested.
Speaker 3: I mean, obviously we have a career that mirrors some
Speaker 3: of our sort of nerdy interest in this stuff. Like
Speaker 3: you had mentioned before, I grew up in law enforcement family,
Speaker 3: so it was just there in front of me, parents
Speaker 3: talking in code, talking about different events that had happened
Speaker 3: or cases they worked. My dad worked as a child
Speaker 3: abuse detective, my mom worked as a domestic violence detective.
Speaker 3: My stepdad worked major narcotics crimes.
Speaker 5: So yeah, it really rancam it right when.
Speaker 2: You said that is like great, she's talking about coming
Speaker 2: from law enforcement and I come from a family of
Speaker 2: mental illness.
Speaker 4: Well, just what got me into psychiogy? And yeah, right exactly, So.
Speaker 3: That was always around. I don't know that necessarily sparked
Speaker 3: my interest. That just felt kind of normal, but really early.
Speaker 3: I mean I grew up in the eighties, so my
Speaker 3: parents would watch things like Unsolved Mysteries, which was the
Speaker 3: creepiest shit.
Speaker 4: Now, yeah, for again, Yeah, that was You're right, I.
Speaker 3: Mean just and I know there's other podcasts to talk
Speaker 3: about how nostalgic hearing the host's voice or hearing the music.
Speaker 4: To me, it's frightening.
Speaker 5: I mean, I just.
Speaker 3: Especially the unsolved crimes and there's people still out there,
Speaker 3: and that was really scary.
Speaker 2: Well, and that was also very different from any other
Speaker 2: show at the time, any other cop show, any other mystery,
Speaker 2: any other supernatural show, because it was dark and you're
Speaker 2: sitting there watching it knowing this happened.
Speaker 4: These are real now, you know.
Speaker 2: He made it a little bit more lurid, but really
Speaker 2: I was sucked in by that as well.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I think another big point for me, I
Speaker 3: don't know if it sparked my interest or just also
Speaker 3: scared the shit out of me, was I remember being
Speaker 3: at my dad's house and the news coming on and
Speaker 3: they had the breaking news that the night stocker, Richard Marris,
Speaker 3: had been caught, and I remember being very frightened and.
Speaker 5: My dad saying, no, it's okay, he's caught now.
Speaker 4: But something about that.
Speaker 5: News broadcast just really stuck with me.
Speaker 3: And I also think that's just such a fascinating case
Speaker 3: and taking place in all kinds of southern California.
Speaker 5: Areas and then eventually ending up in East LA was
Speaker 5: really interesting.
Speaker 3: When I decided to major in criminal justice and undergrad
Speaker 3: I eventually got a job as a police cadet at
Speaker 3: a local police department and I was put in charge
Speaker 3: of property and evidence, and I really I think my
Speaker 3: first obsession was the John Vaney Ramsey case. It is
Speaker 3: for a lot of people, but I was on forums
Speaker 3: back then when that was kind of the only thing,
Speaker 3: and talking to these other I don't know, seem like
Speaker 3: housewives all over the country just kind of doing our
Speaker 3: own web slewth thing and throwing theories out there, and
Speaker 3: I thought it was just amazing.
Speaker 5: And I still to this day if.
Speaker 4: I feel like God would say, Hey, what.
Speaker 5: Question do you want to answer before you die?
Speaker 4: I want to know who child?
Speaker 3: No money arounds because with as much research and reading,
Speaker 3: and even with kind of the new look at it
Speaker 3: that was done earlier this year and the.
Speaker 5: TV show they put together on that, I'm still as
Speaker 5: clueless as I.
Speaker 4: Was day one.
Speaker 2: Well, it's confusing, it's completely because they I mean, we'll
Speaker 2: go into it. We definitely have to do an episode
Speaker 2: on that because the crime scene got so polluted. I mean,
Speaker 2: it's if we'll ever know.
Speaker 5: And that's what the experts have really said.
Speaker 3: You know, you look at doctor Henry Lee and he
Speaker 3: has re examined that scene and just said, this will
Speaker 3: never be solved, Yeah, because of the evidence being destroyed.
Speaker 5: So but for me, I mean, that was a real
Speaker 5: big obsession.
Speaker 3: And after that I ended up graduating and getting a
Speaker 3: job as a.
Speaker 5: Police officer, and then you know, a couple of years
Speaker 5: later started my graduate studies.
Speaker 3: So it stayed with me. I remember, you know, turning
Speaker 3: to podcasting. I mean that is sort of new for me.
Speaker 3: I know it's not for you, but you want to
Speaker 3: talk a little bit how you got.
Speaker 4: Interested in true crime.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, there my intro to it was a little
Speaker 2: bit different because I wasn't obviously, I wasn't from a
Speaker 2: law enforcement family, and I worked in entertainment, and I
Speaker 2: think that there were there were two seminal things that
Speaker 2: grabbed my attention. One I remember I was living in
Speaker 2: Chicago back in the late eighties for a couple of
Speaker 2: years after I got an undergrad and I remember when
Speaker 2: Oprah was not a huge show, but it was the
Speaker 2: show to watch because there was always something interesting on,
Speaker 2: right And it was when they interviewed Ray Bucky from
Speaker 2: the McMartin preschool hearings. And I had never heard of it,
Speaker 2: because at that time in my life was young and
Speaker 2: dumb and didn't you know, did not stay up on
Speaker 2: current events. But here I am watching this show and
Speaker 2: I remember I think I was eating dinner or something,
Speaker 2: and like the fork stopped halfway to my mouth as
Speaker 2: they were interviewing him. Because even in my ignorance of
Speaker 2: world events, and you know, I was living a different life,
Speaker 2: then I thought, this guy's innocent wow thought, I mean,
Speaker 2: like as clear as a bell, it came to me,
Speaker 2: this guy is innocent, this is messed up.
Speaker 4: And I became obsessed with that. But that was you know,
Speaker 4: before we had so much.
Speaker 2: Information accessible from a computer, where now you can get
Speaker 2: all sorts of stuff. But that stayed with me for years,
Speaker 2: all through my other career and entertainment, just always wondering.
Speaker 2: And there's some other things that have recently come up
Speaker 2: about that that are really shocking, I mean shocking in
Speaker 2: that that family, the BUCkies, the mc martin's, they were
Speaker 2: completely failed by the justice system and by the mental
Speaker 2: health system as well.
Speaker 4: And we'll talk more about that.
Speaker 5: Did I ever tell you that my dad was called
Speaker 5: in as a special investment?
Speaker 3: No shit, Okay, yes, okay, we got to get your dad.
Speaker 4: I did not know that those I know.
Speaker 2: And then the other thing was a show that was
Speaker 2: you know, people who aren't who are not familiar with it,
Speaker 2: or you know, watch a lot of reality television now,
Speaker 2: don't realize how little of it there was back in
Speaker 2: the early nineties. And you know, as cable expanded, the
Speaker 2: networks had to generate content content, you know, so one
Speaker 2: of the earliest ones was a show called Citydial so good.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, that was such a great show. And
Speaker 2: it was a great show, not because it was perfectly
Speaker 2: well done. There was a lot of holes in it,
Speaker 2: but it was made the most sort of run of
Speaker 2: the mill crimes.
Speaker 4: It turned them into the most lurid things, oh so salacious.
Speaker 3: I could sit there and lay in bed and probably
Speaker 3: watch six episodes and not even know the times.
Speaker 2: It's like forensics files, like forensic files, like completely addictive.
Speaker 2: But the thing that hooked me in as I'm sitting there,
Speaker 2: you know, living in my crappy apartment in Hollywood, you know,
Speaker 2: with like I think it was the middle of a
Speaker 2: heat wave or something and I didn't have any air conditioning,
Speaker 2: but I remember that one of the episodes came on
Speaker 2: and Paul Winfield, God rest his soul, he had a
Speaker 2: most wonderful voice. It was a voiceover artist that worked
Speaker 2: for years in television and film, and he had a
Speaker 2: grade voice. He would speak like this, and he caught
Speaker 2: me because the episode was about something that happened in
Speaker 2: my hometown, and the way he described my hometown, which
Speaker 2: is Huntsville, Alabama, was the rich upper crust of Huntsville, Alabama,
Speaker 2: didn't like the.
Speaker 4: Low life trash from Birmingham coming in which one were
Speaker 4: you by the life?
Speaker 2: Well that's little LEVI I was not rich, upper crust
Speaker 2: of a Hunt school. But the thing that was amazing
Speaker 2: was it was a crime. It was my optometrist, and
Speaker 2: he had been he had been murdered, and it was
Speaker 2: set up by his family members. And so we'll we're
Speaker 2: gonna explore out in a little bit later too. But
Speaker 2: I also like other podcasts.
Speaker 4: I know you like.
Speaker 5: I love my Favorite Murder. I mean my favorite Murder,
Speaker 5: not those women are hilarious, and yeah, I just I
Speaker 5: adore them.
Speaker 3: I adore everything about the podcast that I.
Speaker 4: Listened to that they are.
Speaker 3: There's so much entertainment value there that I don't mind
Speaker 3: that podcasts don't get everything right or that they're not
Speaker 3: subject matter experts. And that's where we're coming in obviously, right.
Speaker 3: But I don't want to listen to me talk necessarily.
Speaker 3: It's like when I come home.
Speaker 4: I don't watch cop shows.
Speaker 3: I don't really like anything too heady. My husband loves
Speaker 3: like quantum physics, Discovery Channel stuff. I just want to
Speaker 3: veg out when I listen to entertainment or watch entertainment.
Speaker 4: And see I'm the opposite.
Speaker 2: I'm a bit of the opposite though, because I will
Speaker 2: get obsessed with those shows and you know, if there's
Speaker 2: nothing on, and how is it possible that there's nothing
Speaker 2: on with Netflix? I mean, we have so many options,
Speaker 2: but Investigation Discovery has changed the landscape for me and
Speaker 2: my husband will walk through and just shake his head
Speaker 2: and go, you deal with this all day? Why are
Speaker 2: you watching these shows? Because I just I mean I
Speaker 2: completely get immersed.
Speaker 5: And it's hard.
Speaker 4: I mean, there are people out there like.
Speaker 5: Him that don't give a shit about true crime.
Speaker 3: Yeah, oh yeah, and I don't understand how those people exist.
Speaker 5: It's amazing and it's fascinating.
Speaker 3: But I think that's one of our questions too, kind
Speaker 3: of coming to the table here is why are people
Speaker 3: so interested in this?
Speaker 4: Okay, well my theory.
Speaker 2: I mean there's a lot written on this and you know,
Speaker 2: and I come from now the podcast you know, you like, right,
Speaker 2: my favorite murder, you know my I think Criminal has
Speaker 2: an amazing podcast. I mean it is short, sweet, She's
Speaker 2: a wonderful producer, does great stories. Cereal changed the landscape
Speaker 2: that non say Ed's trial has was just riveting for
Speaker 2: a year and a half.
Speaker 5: I remember listening to that.
Speaker 3: You and I were on our way to this therapist mixer,
Speaker 3: and You're like, have you listened to Cereal yet?
Speaker 4: It's great?
Speaker 5: And I was kind of like no, And then finally.
Speaker 3: I did and just burned through that baby, and then
Speaker 3: ended up listening.
Speaker 2: To Disclosed and Discloses another Rabba Chadrey does a wonderful job. Sure,
Speaker 2: And then I mean I also like and then s
Speaker 2: Town or shit town, right, Okay, shit town. Also my
Speaker 2: connection to that is I went to school with that
Speaker 2: guy at Birmingham Southern in Birmingham, Alabama. So that is
Speaker 2: a story that is a wonderful you know, psychological profile
Speaker 2: and criminal aspects to it.
Speaker 4: But I like some weird stuff too.
Speaker 2: I like mysterious universe right with these two wonderful Aussies
Speaker 2: that talk about you know, sort of high what do
Speaker 2: they call it?
Speaker 4: High? Strangeness is all over the place.
Speaker 3: Laura Lore is great, We love lare coming out on
Speaker 3: Amazon as a show.
Speaker 4: Yeah, good job.
Speaker 2: Aaron Mankee who sounds like a teenage William Shatner Captain Kirk,
Speaker 2: we love him and what else? Yeah, that's kind of
Speaker 2: that keeps me pretty busy those fourth podcasts.
Speaker 3: So what about television now, what are you watching anything
Speaker 3: in particular that's true criming or or something that you
Speaker 3: would recommend.
Speaker 2: Well from a fiction standpoint. This is we're going to
Speaker 2: have to do a show on this in the future.
Speaker 2: Is The Sinner. It is a short form like single
Speaker 2: series that may get I guess pulled into a separate
Speaker 2: series or it's a series two, but they're kind of
Speaker 2: a lot of television shows are following the American horror
Speaker 2: story where it's a different story every season but uses
Speaker 2: the same actors. I cannot recommend this show enough because
Speaker 2: it's got phenomenal twists. But we're going to use it
Speaker 2: to talk about a really fascinating psychological state called dissociation.
Speaker 2: Because Jessica Biel knocks it out of the park as
Speaker 2: an actor in this work. I mean, everybody's great and
Speaker 2: Cammy Patten heads up to Cammy Patton, Oh my god,
Speaker 2: great casting director.
Speaker 4: She did an awesome job with this. But we're going
Speaker 4: to go into depth on.
Speaker 5: Topic because I think there's a lot of misconceptions about that.
Speaker 4: There's a lot it's so exceedingly rare.
Speaker 2: It's so rare, but when it's real. It's real, and
Speaker 2: it's always it's always due to trauma, you know. But yeah,
Speaker 2: a lot of things get it wrong. We'll talk about
Speaker 2: some of the shows that really entrance the country but
Speaker 2: really got it wrong, like Sybil. Sybil was something that
Speaker 2: I watched when I was young, and we all fell
Speaker 2: for it right and it was all disproved and it
Speaker 2: made great television, made a great book one Sally and Emmy,
Speaker 2: but not accurate.
Speaker 3: I feel like there's a lot being revisited, like we're
Speaker 3: at the twentieth year anniversary of a lot of things.
Speaker 3: So I think most recently what I've been interested in,
Speaker 3: there's been recaps and kind of updates like I'm a
Speaker 3: Natalie Holloway case.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, and.
Speaker 5: The new show that's going to come out about the
Speaker 5: Menandos Brothers.
Speaker 3: I cannot whoa that's going to be a good one.
Speaker 3: So we will definitely cover that. But I think we're
Speaker 3: probably going to focus even in our first real episode,
Speaker 3: on the Lacy Peterson case, which also has some updates
Speaker 3: to it and some stuff in the works, and that
Speaker 3: they're revisiting in a TV show.
Speaker 4: And we really want to touch on that.
Speaker 2: I mean that Scott Peterson looking at his profile as
Speaker 2: an example of someone who truly led a double life
Speaker 2: out in the open, right, that's going to be my
Speaker 2: trademark phrase as he read a double life, but out
Speaker 2: in the open. It wasn't like he was the BTK
Speaker 2: killer who had a double life, had a double life
Speaker 2: that was you know, completely subsumed, subsumed in night and
Speaker 2: serial killing. This guy, you know, he's a special kind
Speaker 2: of personality that we're going to go in depth.
Speaker 5: On the podcast I'm late to is the Missing Mara
Speaker 5: Murray podcast, which is going to be the next episode
Speaker 5: or next season of Disappeared.
Speaker 3: Which was a Natalie Holloway on Oxygen and they're going
Speaker 3: to do a Missing More Murray season and it is
Speaker 3: for you guys that haven't heard about it. I believe
Speaker 3: late nineties.
Speaker 4: College student in.
Speaker 5: New Hampshire just crashed your car and went missing. And
Speaker 5: there's a lot of interesting, strange twists along the way
Speaker 5: that made it get not so run of the mill
Speaker 5: and it's still unsolved.
Speaker 4: To this day. So wow, that sounds great. People really
Speaker 4: like cold cases.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they really do, well, I do. I mean it's
Speaker 2: fascinating and it's scary. That's I think one of the
Speaker 2: things that's scary about is like when there's not a
Speaker 2: black and white, clear cut answer for something that you know,
Speaker 2: it makes it uncomfortable.
Speaker 5: A Fester's theory, and yeah, you're right, it makes people uncomfortable.
Speaker 4: I think that's one of the things.
Speaker 2: The hallmarks of what brings those of us that are
Speaker 2: into this is that we look at it and it's
Speaker 2: alien to us.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 2: That's why I like the more weird end of the
Speaker 2: spectrum as well as you know, some of the more
Speaker 2: violent crimes. Is like really understanding that there are certainly
Speaker 2: people who are one off criminals, that are they commit
Speaker 2: crimes of passion, But then there are other people that
Speaker 2: really are psychologically they are wired differently, they are formed
Speaker 2: differently from an internal stance, and that can be alien.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's more it's getting we're getting more used
Speaker 2: to it because we see this stuff all the time. Sure,
Speaker 2: but that's one of the things that's continually fascinating.
Speaker 3: The average person does not have exposure to that, and
Speaker 3: so it's so hard to wrap your mind around that
Speaker 3: this is a human being.
Speaker 4: Doing these that makes these choices right.
Speaker 3: And so we like to label them and categorize them
Speaker 3: as monsters or psychopaths or evil or whatever. But the
Speaker 3: real scary part is that it's just a real person.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's not a supernatural monster. It actually exists, right, So, folks,
Speaker 2: we've been a little bit over the map in our
Speaker 2: introduction today and thanks for bearing with us. We're really
Speaker 2: excited about bringing this project to you. This is it
Speaker 2: for our introduction podcast. We're really excited and looking forward
Speaker 2: to bringing you our absolute official first episode, which is
Speaker 2: going to be focusing on criminals who lead double lives.
Speaker 6: So we're going to definitely explore Scott Peterson and I
Speaker 6: really would like to get into some of the new
Speaker 6: theories that are out there now and developing about the murder.
Speaker 5: But please let us know what you want to hear about.
Speaker 4: Definitely, we want your ideas, we want your input. So
Speaker 4: here's a.
Speaker 5: Few ways that you can contact us.
Speaker 3: Our email address is LA not So Confidential at gmail
Speaker 3: dot com. Our Twitter handle is La not So Pod.
Speaker 3: You can find us on Instagram at La Not So Podcast,
Speaker 3: and then on Facebook you can find us on the
Speaker 3: page La not So Confidential. So, thank you so much,
Speaker 3: and this has been La not So Confidential.
Speaker 4: Thanks a lot, folks,