Speaker 1: All right, Briday's show rolled along here in downtown Salt
Speaker 1: Lake City, Utah. Our next guest, I like to call
Speaker 1: him a friend, but a mentor. First and foremost best
Speaker 1: known I don't know these days Chris Russo, Mad Dog,
Speaker 1: of course, mister Russo best known for me with Mike
Speaker 1: and the Mad Dog. My question out of the gates
Speaker 1: these days, what do you get recognized for the most
Speaker 1: first take?
Speaker 2: Okay, no question about it's ben So the first take.
Speaker 2: You know, if I'm in New York, little Mike and
Speaker 2: the Mad Dog too, because you just said as a
Speaker 2: nineteen year show. But as far as the overall thing,
Speaker 2: if I'm bouncing around a little first take, that would
Speaker 2: be the one. In the power of television see today,
Speaker 2: that would definitely be the one. Serious is a little
Speaker 2: different because it's you know, sort of a it's a
Speaker 2: little nichey. So ifro am mass standpoint, now everybody kind
Speaker 2: of puts everything together right away, takes them a minute
Speaker 2: or two. The riders, oh yeah, that's the guy Mike
Speaker 2: and the Mad Doorgs saw me plenty of times. It's different,
Speaker 2: And of course the first take you on here constantly,
Speaker 2: so those the first take one is by far the best.
Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, that makes sense, and I certainly tune in
Speaker 1: when you're on that show, and I'm glad you brought
Speaker 1: that up. And I should lead with thank you so
Speaker 1: much for your time. You're very kind of do this.
Speaker 1: It's been too long. Every time I watch you on
Speaker 1: First Take, I have this thought like, is it is
Speaker 1: it different or is it similar to the way you
Speaker 1: and Mike approach the show back in the day, Because
Speaker 1: a lot of people don't necessarily remember, in my opinion,
Speaker 1: you guys were the origin of what the modern day
Speaker 1: debate shows have become. So this is not a new
Speaker 1: thing for you. Is doing First Take different or is
Speaker 1: it similar to what you did with Mike and the
Speaker 1: Mad Dog back in the day.
Speaker 2: No, it's similar. It's you know, it's a little bit
Speaker 2: more specific on a topic. It's not as you know,
Speaker 2: the Mike and the Mad Dog thing would do anything.
Speaker 2: It's it's a little bit more NBA NFL dominated. But
Speaker 2: and you got more than just two people in there,
Speaker 2: because it's very rarely just Steve and I. You know,
Speaker 2: sometimes it's you know, it could be football season, you
Speaker 2: got two or three different guys in their basketball season,
Speaker 2: you got two three different guys in there, so it's
Speaker 2: it's very rarely just as two of us. It's more
Speaker 2: of a trilogy per se. So from that standpoint it
Speaker 2: is a little different, but the from that, from the
Speaker 2: amount of people. But I mean the idea is the same.
Speaker 2: The idea is to move the needle. The idea is
Speaker 2: to give obviously your opponent a chance to talk. Your
Speaker 2: idea is to you know, give your opinion and hopefully
Speaker 2: it's organic enough and hopefully it's a situation where it's
Speaker 2: spurs debate, and hopefully it's opposite with your opponent. In
Speaker 2: this case, Steve passed. In other words, I might have
Speaker 2: one opinion and if it really works properly, it would
Speaker 2: be nice if Steve had the other opinion and Mike
Speaker 2: and I the same scenario too. So I think there's
Speaker 2: you know, listen, debate shows on TV came from duet
Speaker 2: shows on radio, so it's the same theme. There are
Speaker 2: some intricacies that are a little different. You want to
Speaker 2: talk a little quicker on TV, you want to be
Speaker 2: eating out a little quicker. Radio is a little bit
Speaker 2: more of a filipbuster element to it. But I mean,
Speaker 2: the same idea holds both ways. Same idea holds both ways.
Speaker 1: Chris Russo, sorry, you're good and finish good and finish dog.
Speaker 2: No, just have an opinion. I think that's the most
Speaker 2: important thing, to go out there and have an opinion
Speaker 2: and be you know, part of being good on radio
Speaker 2: or TV is being a salesman. You want to be
Speaker 2: able to sell your opinion even if you think or
Speaker 2: even if people don't think it's right. You want to
Speaker 2: make a good case for it. And for the most part,
Speaker 2: you try to do that a little more so on
Speaker 2: TV than you do on radio, but you're trying to
Speaker 2: make a good case for it.
Speaker 1: For sure. Chris Russo, better known as the Mad Dog,
Speaker 1: as our guests here on ESPN seven hundred out of
Speaker 1: a Friday afternoon. You know, mister Russo, I'm gonna call
Speaker 1: you that all interview long. Probably you were one of
Speaker 1: the first people I thought about when the news came
Speaker 1: down that the New York Knicks had fired Tom Thibodeau.
Speaker 1: And it just has been so long since they've been
Speaker 1: relevant at all. And you know, for playoffs appearance in
Speaker 1: five years, back to back fifty win seasons for the
Speaker 1: first time since ninety four to ninety five, first Eastern
Speaker 1: Conference appearance since two thousand and It's been so fun
Speaker 1: for me to watch this team rise to relevance again
Speaker 1: and reconnect with a lot of my friends that I
Speaker 1: grew up with back east in southern Connecticut, in the
Speaker 1: surrounding area. And no part of me thought that he
Speaker 1: was in danger of losing his job. And I will
Speaker 1: allow and concede that I think he was probably up
Speaker 1: coach in the Eastern Conference Finals by one of the
Speaker 1: best coaches in pro basketball who's now in the NBA Finals.
Speaker 1: That we'll get to the finals in a moment. But
Speaker 1: what was your reaction when you heard the news that
Speaker 1: Tom had lost his job? And now that it's been
Speaker 1: a few days, why do you think it happened and
Speaker 1: who do you think was behind the decision?
Speaker 2: Well, I listen, I never trust the owner, so I
Speaker 2: was you know, you never know of him, that's of course,
Speaker 2: Jim Dolan, you know, But I'm with you. After they
Speaker 2: beat Detroit, you figured they'd be in good shape. He
Speaker 2: would have actually been better off if they lost at
Speaker 2: Game seven to Boston in a classic series. Tatan doesn't
Speaker 2: get hurt. Then beating this Celtics wedding, everybody's appetite and
Speaker 2: then losing to Indiana the whole series and maybe this
Speaker 2: next one will be that way as well. With okay, see,
Speaker 2: but the whole series obviously turned on the whole situation
Speaker 2: with the with the with Game one with the fourteen
Speaker 2: point lead, and the Natesmith making all those threes there
Speaker 2: and the you know in the last thirty to fifty
Speaker 2: eight seconds of that game, and then of course the
Speaker 2: two misdepos and the shot that Halburton took that bounced
Speaker 2: high and went in and then overtime. The whole series
Speaker 2: changed with that. If the Knicks had won that game,
Speaker 2: they would have been a minimum seventh game, and I
Speaker 2: think they would have probably won the series because I
Speaker 2: don't know if they would have lost the back to
Speaker 2: back Game seven at home. So but once he beat
Speaker 2: the Pistons, I thought he was okay. Once he beat
Speaker 2: the Celtics, whoever thought he'd be And remember the Tatum
Speaker 2: injury had nothing to do with it, because you're up
Speaker 2: to be one when he got hurt. Once they beat Boston,
Speaker 2: I thought that he was in great shape. I thought
Speaker 2: they beat Indiana. I thought it'd be a very close series.
Speaker 2: I wouldn't stake my life on it. But I thought
Speaker 2: that they would not lose back to back game sevens
Speaker 2: at home to the Pacers, so I thought they'd win
Speaker 2: that series. But you know, listen, I think it's a
Speaker 2: it's a group thing. First off, Dolan, nobody makes a
Speaker 2: decision regarding the next of the Rangers of the head
Speaker 2: coach without going through Dolan. First, he's he got to
Speaker 2: write a check for thirty million dollars and because you
Speaker 2: got to pay him off, and you know, you can
Speaker 2: make the argument that Dolan made this form more than
Speaker 2: anybody else. A lot of people tell me that worldwide
Speaker 2: rests who what?
Speaker 3: Who the hell is?
Speaker 2: See? Who knows? He's sort of an influencer. Brought Kenny
Speaker 2: Payne to Louisville, had that workout. A lot of people
Speaker 2: think he had something to do with it, because it
Speaker 2: was no secret that he and Thibodeau couldn't stand each other.
Speaker 2: And then he had Leon Rose, who, you know, Listens,
Speaker 2: got a lot on the line here. You know, made
Speaker 2: a band Fay with Bridges, but he was the former
Speaker 2: agent for Thibodeaux. You know, I me know, maybe he
Speaker 2: has I don't.
Speaker 3: It's really kind of hard to figure why.
Speaker 2: First off, it's a stupid decision, and Leon Rose made
Speaker 2: good decisions. Dolan has stayed out of it for the
Speaker 2: most part. It appears in the last couple of years,
Speaker 2: so why would he get involved now? And Worldwide Message
Speaker 2: Worldwide WES is not really in that decisive decision making scenarios,
Speaker 2: so it is tricky to pin it on anybody but
Speaker 2: his it. I would say if Jim Dolan wanted Tom
Speaker 2: Thibodeau to be his head coach, he would have told
Speaker 2: Rose and Worldwide West guys, nice guys, just as you
Speaker 2: said Spence back to back, Eastern back to back fifty
Speaker 2: one years, I mean Eastern Conference final. I mean there's
Speaker 2: only two teams in the NBA who had better years
Speaker 2: than we did when I fired him, And he did
Speaker 2: not say that. So he's culpable too. And I think
Speaker 2: the fact that the Knicks are going to try to
Speaker 2: convince somehow, some way Jason Kidd in Dallas to come
Speaker 2: to New York tells you that they don't really have
Speaker 2: a plan B. I mean their number one guy to
Speaker 2: replace Thibodeaux is an existing head coach you signed to
Speaker 2: a big contract. I mean that's their number one guy.
Speaker 2: That's a little lot. Who's gonna coach Cooper Flagg and
Speaker 2: you're gonna have to give him compensation to get him?
Speaker 2: That is a little lot. So the next look terrible.
Speaker 2: Here they did a bad job. The whole world knows
Speaker 2: it was stupid. Thibodeau's did a hell of a job,
Speaker 2: all right. You want to say Carl out was a
Speaker 2: little better, all right, Well, then he was also better
Speaker 2: than Atkinson. He was also better than Doc Rivers, and
Speaker 2: now he might be better than duk No, so let's
Speaker 2: keep that in mind too. But nobody in New York
Speaker 2: can quite figure it out. Everybody realizes this is a
Speaker 2: decision that was kind of difficult to stomach. So I
Speaker 2: feel bad for Tibo. He's a out of a coach.
Speaker 2: Or see if he runs out of it again down
Speaker 2: the road. And I heard he's very down on what
Speaker 2: happened here. I think he was definitely surprised. I don't
Speaker 2: think he saw this coming, and do than anybody else.
Speaker 2: By the way, here in New York City, it's.
Speaker 1: Almost like, don't look a gift horse in the mouth
Speaker 1: like this for the first time, mister Rousseau. The Knicks
Speaker 1: seemed to have played the long game and built up
Speaker 1: a team that had something to say about things in
Speaker 1: the Eastern common fence for a while, if they just
Speaker 1: allowed this process to continue, and what essentially made them
Speaker 1: more or less irrelevant in the landscape of pro basketball
Speaker 1: for nearly two decades, if not a little more, was
Speaker 1: impulsive emotional decision making from an owner that doesn't know
Speaker 1: as elbow from as you know what. And I thought,
Speaker 1: to your point, go build your sphere, go play your kazoo,
Speaker 1: go be in your band, stay out of it, let
Speaker 1: the grown ups run the team. And this, to me
Speaker 1: is a couple of steps in the wrong direction, and
Speaker 1: it just reeks of Isaiah Thomas, Mike D'Antoni, Derek Fisher,
Speaker 1: Kurt Rambus, Jeff horniseack like and all of those people
Speaker 1: are solid guys, and some are good coaches, and Mike
Speaker 1: Woodson did a good job for a minute there in
Speaker 1: New York. But it's almost like they reverted back to
Speaker 1: the emotional decision making that made them irrelevant for two
Speaker 1: decades after you finally built something up. And we'll see
Speaker 1: what happens moving forward, because the roster is still solid
Speaker 1: and they have a lot of good players, but these
Speaker 1: types of decisions are exac exactly why they were basically
Speaker 1: irrelevant for nearly twenty five years, you.
Speaker 2: Know, hundred percent. And I actually think Indiana was better
Speaker 2: than the Knicks a player for player. I think the
Speaker 2: Knicks may have had, you know, the with Brunson in Towns,
Speaker 2: you can say they had the two of the three
Speaker 2: best players. But I think if you look at the
Speaker 2: whole Lobster bench, of course included Oltherough and the Indiana's
Speaker 2: a little better. But yeah, this is a very puzzling decision.
Speaker 2: And Leon Rose doesn't make a lot of bad ones,
Speaker 2: so that he hasn't at least and he hasn't been impetuous,
Speaker 2: as you just said. So that makes me think that
Speaker 2: somebody must have told him here something was going on,
Speaker 2: because he hasn't made these bad decisions with his coaches.
Speaker 2: He hired the right guy and then a coach for
Speaker 2: five years and they were successful. So all of a
Speaker 2: sudden Leon gets over it. I mean, it is a
Speaker 2: little shan he's his former agent. It is very strange.
Speaker 2: I do know that that Thibodeau and Worldwide West did
Speaker 2: not like each other. Worldwide West has done nothing in
Speaker 2: his career, no rings, He hasn't won any college championships.
Speaker 2: He's never built a team, so the fact that but
Speaker 2: he's you know, he works for Rose, so you wouldn't
Speaker 2: think he'd go over Rose. His head go right to Dolan.
Speaker 2: So that's why it's very puzzling. It's a very very
Speaker 2: strange decision. Nobody here can quite figure it out. You know,
Speaker 2: where they go now for a head coach? I mean again,
Speaker 2: you know, I don't think they want Mike Brown. I
Speaker 2: don't think they want Mike Malone. You know, I thought
Speaker 2: maybe Billy Donovan because he would be maybe easier to get.
Speaker 2: We'll see what kid they though. They're not getting a
Speaker 2: Houston coach. You know, why would Dallas allow the Knicks
Speaker 2: to have kid without compensation?
Speaker 3: Nicks have no theft picks.
Speaker 2: To give them. Now, why would kid want to leave
Speaker 2: Dallas anyway? I mean, they got Cooper Flanner coming there
Speaker 2: for crying out loud. He got to be seventeen years old.
Speaker 2: I mean, the guy might be an old timer, so
Speaker 2: why would you leave coaching him? I know the Eastern
Speaker 2: Conference is a little easier at least next year, but
Speaker 2: why would you leave that to come and work for Dolan?
Speaker 2: I would never do it. So we'll see where they go.
Speaker 2: But everybody puzzled and it was a decision that reverberates it.
Speaker 2: It makes the Knicks look bad. Just as you said,
Speaker 2: they haven't made a lot of bad decisions in here.
Speaker 3: They made a bad hundred percent right one.
Speaker 1: More thing here. And I do want to talk NBA
Speaker 1: Finals with you, mad dog, before I set you loose,
Speaker 1: because I do think you know the messaging as far
Speaker 1: as the statement goes. And then other sources that have
Speaker 1: leaked information across the landscape of the past few days
Speaker 1: is well, we want to take the next step. We
Speaker 1: want to win a championship. I could make the argument
Speaker 1: that this Nick team was ahead of schedule by beating Boston.
Speaker 1: I think I feel like they were put together with
Speaker 1: the idea of Boston maybe having one or two more
Speaker 1: years and then they're going to have to break their
Speaker 1: roster down because the new ownership group probably doesn't want
Speaker 1: to ride a luxury tax check of five hundred million
Speaker 1: dollars just to have the team, And so when the
Speaker 1: Celtics are broken down that I felt like this Nick
Speaker 1: team was ready to take that step. So I really
Speaker 1: think Tom actually brought them ahead of schedule this year,
Speaker 1: going to the Eastern Conference Finals. But I think if
Speaker 1: they want to win a championship, they have a roster
Speaker 1: construction issue they have to figure out, and I think
Speaker 1: it comes down to Cat. Now, Kat just played some
Speaker 1: of the best basketball that I've ever seen him play
Speaker 1: in the spring, Okay, so I want to give him
Speaker 1: credit for that. But defensively, I mean, we talk a
Speaker 1: lot about Nie Smith making his threes in Game one.
Speaker 1: Those were walking practice threes with not a lot of
Speaker 1: defensive pushback, and more often than not, the only time
Speaker 1: I thought the Knicks had a chance in the series
Speaker 1: is when they were actually guarding. Now, this is not
Speaker 1: a team in the ILK of nineteen ninety five. Charles
Speaker 1: Oakley's not walking through that door, et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 1: But I think if they want to take the next step,
Speaker 1: they've got a roster issue, and I think it comes
Speaker 1: down to Cat. Do you think they look at a
Speaker 1: deal for a Durant or a deal for a Gyiannis?
Speaker 1: I mean, even Lowry markin out here in Salt Lake
Speaker 1: is available. I'm not saying that makes sense, But if
Speaker 1: they want to take the next step, it doesn't matter
Speaker 1: if their coaches. Tom Thibodeau Jason Kidd whoever. I think
Speaker 1: they have a roster construction issue. Do you think they
Speaker 1: adjustin pivot with their personnel this offseason?
Speaker 2: Well, I don't think Giannis is coming here, so that's
Speaker 2: number one. I think if the Bucks, the Bucks won't
Speaker 2: call Anthony Towns. I mean, I wouldn't want call Anthony
Speaker 2: Towns to build my franchise around. That is not what
Speaker 2: I would want. So from that standpoint, I think if
Speaker 2: he goes anywhere, it might be the Spurs so or Toronto.
Speaker 2: So I'm not in love with getting that. And you're right,
Speaker 2: the roster is where it is. I don't know exactly
Speaker 2: what they could. They have no draft picks based on
Speaker 2: that Bridger's trade. They only got a five I don't
Speaker 2: pay too much attention to this capologist nonsense, but they
Speaker 2: only got a five and a half million dollar mid
Speaker 2: level exception. And the other thing you got to remember
Speaker 2: with the Knicks, what would they bring in here? Bring
Speaker 2: ever they bring in here? Next year they gonna want
Speaker 2: to They're gonna get to the finals. I mean, you
Speaker 2: can't bring somebody Eier to lose in the conference final.
Speaker 2: What's the point of doing that? And next year the
Speaker 2: East is going to be very easy. And so as
Speaker 2: a result, if you somehow don't get to the final
Speaker 2: next year you did, I mean, the Celtics don't have
Speaker 2: Tatum Lillard's not playing for Milwaukee and Beide, who knows, uh,
Speaker 2: you know, you got clear. We'll see how they respond.
Speaker 2: And he got Indiana. I mean there's nobody else EA stinks.
Speaker 2: So that puts an awful lot of pressure on a
Speaker 2: coach coming in here knowing that he'd better get to
Speaker 2: an NBA final if he doesn't want to hear from
Speaker 2: the fans. So, I mean, I think they're in a
Speaker 2: little bit of a tough spot. I completely agree, and
Speaker 2: I think they put more pressure on themselves with this decision,
Speaker 2: which I think is it puts It's gonna make everybody say, well,
Speaker 2: now you fire Thibodeaux. And he even gets to the final,
Speaker 2: I'll come the next guy loses in the second round,
Speaker 2: how does he stead? So I think that plays into
Speaker 2: two Remember before Thibodau, they had twelve coaches. I'm sorry,
Speaker 2: they won one playoff I think it was twelve. In
Speaker 2: the last twenty five years, they've had twelve coaches. They
Speaker 2: won one playoff series. You know, Larry Brown and Derek
Speaker 2: Fisher and David Fizdale and you know, go on No.
Speaker 1: No.
Speaker 2: One playoff series with Thibodeau, they won five. So I mean,
Speaker 2: the next guy next year is gonna have to win three.
Speaker 2: I don't know what the knickt solution is. I think
Speaker 2: they're a good team. They're a tough team, but I
Speaker 2: don't think necessarily they are a championship team. And let's
Speaker 2: as we swing to Indiana quickly, that's remember this too.
Speaker 2: Maybe Indiana and losing to them is not gonna be
Speaker 2: such a big deal. I mean, maybe they beat Oklahoma City,
Speaker 2: and maybe they beat Oklahoma some easier than they beat
Speaker 2: the Knicks after what we saw in Game one, where
Speaker 2: they continually do these miracle pullbacks and win these crazy games.
Speaker 2: And you know, I wasn't that impressed in Oklaoma City
Speaker 2: last night, who gave up, by the way, sixty something
Speaker 2: points in the second half and a lot of Indiana
Speaker 2: to shoot fifty two percent. So the idea that no, listen,
Speaker 2: Okay sequens to come back and win. But that was
Speaker 2: an awful, awful loss. So who knows, Maybe Indiana wins
Speaker 2: the whole thing makes the Nick loss look a little better.
Speaker 2: So very issue. A lot of interesting issues with the
Speaker 2: nickobocracy here in New York, right, A lot of issues.
Speaker 1: One question about our local basketball team as we find
Speaker 1: ourselves in unchartered territory, you know, in the Miller's forty
Speaker 1: year stewardship of the Utah Jazz. More or less every year,
Speaker 1: while we've never won a championship out here, we've always
Speaker 1: had really good teams, and the rebuilds have only taken
Speaker 1: one or two years. And they were able to bridge
Speaker 1: the gap between socked him alone to Darren Williamson Carlos Boozer,
Speaker 1: and then it was Gordon Hayward and then Donovan Mitchell
Speaker 1: and Rudy Gobert. We're about to enter our fourth year
Speaker 1: of a rebuild after Ryan Smith bought the team from
Speaker 1: the Millers and Danny Ainge left the Celtics for the
Speaker 1: Jazz Austin as Danny Sun was just hired to run
Speaker 1: basketball operations. But I wanted to get your take, mister
Speaker 1: Russo on the lottery situation.
Speaker 2: Joke.
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, yeah, go ahead.
Speaker 2: I mean it. I mean, there's no way that Dallas
Speaker 2: and San Antonio should be won.
Speaker 3: Too in a lottery, and Utah what a fourth fit
Speaker 3: whatever might be them.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we're fifth with Wizards. I mean it's a joke.
Speaker 2: I mean, the idea that the NBA has got to
Speaker 2: do this because these teams lose on purpose to get
Speaker 2: these picks the last fifteen twenty games of the year
Speaker 2: is an absolute disgrace. But I know they waited, we
Speaker 2: all know that, and it's ping punng balls and all that.
Speaker 2: But Dallas getso has a one point seven percent chance
Speaker 2: to win the lottery. They and they went flag. I
Speaker 2: mean that is a little rough. I don't know what
Speaker 2: the solution is, but it's it's a disaster. I mean
Speaker 2: at Drivesha're crazy and I don't like it. And if
Speaker 2: you're a Utah fan, you know Flags the one guy
Speaker 2: who wanted to get he's the one, at least on paper,
Speaker 2: the one guy there that is the transformational player. And
Speaker 2: he goes to a team that you know, traded Luca
Speaker 2: and they end up getting another kid now the next year,
Speaker 2: seventeen years of age. That's why I don't know why
Speaker 2: kid were go to leave when he's got this guy
Speaker 2: for the next fifteen years. I know it's the Western Conference,
Speaker 2: but I feel bad for Utahn. I feel bad for
Speaker 2: the Wizards, and I feel bad for Charlotte. Those three
Speaker 2: teams had the worst records and they theoretically she get
Speaker 2: the three top players. Now, I don't know. You know,
Speaker 2: I understand these teams will lose. They give themselves the
Speaker 2: better chance to get that worst player. But uh, you know,
Speaker 2: I'm not sure what the solution is.
Speaker 3: But I've had enough with a lottery. They know Atlanta
Speaker 3: had a.
Speaker 2: Three percent chance last year to win the lottery.
Speaker 3: They won it.
Speaker 2: I don't like it at all. It's a grand big
Speaker 2: it's a TV show, and I think something needs to
Speaker 2: be done. Your solution is better than mine. I don't
Speaker 2: know what exactly you could do.
Speaker 1: Well, you know, you could just do in verse order
Speaker 1: the way pro football does, right, You just reward the
Speaker 1: top pick to the worst team. Now, that doesn't de
Speaker 1: incentivize tanking, which Commissioner Silver has gone on record saying
Speaker 1: he very much wants to do. But I think the
Speaker 1: tough thing for us out here in Salt Lake is
Speaker 1: we're looking at an NBA finals with Oklahoma City in Indianapolis.
Speaker 1: And over the past five or six years, teams in
Speaker 1: Milwaukee and Denver have been able to win championships in
Speaker 1: Minnesota has a good team, and Denver still will have
Speaker 1: something to say about it as long as they have
Speaker 1: Nicola Jokic. We've entered mad dog, this era of parody
Speaker 1: where teams in smaller cities have been able to build
Speaker 1: up really, really competitive and championship level teams, and I
Speaker 1: think I'm just afraid that, you know, the Jazz are
Speaker 1: going to miss out on this opportunity to build a
Speaker 1: championship team during this era where teams in smaller markets
Speaker 1: have been able to do just that.
Speaker 2: Boy, you have to be lucky. You gotta be terrible
Speaker 2: when that big player comes out, is what it comes
Speaker 2: down to. You know, San Antonio was terrible, There's Wemba
Speaker 2: Yama and they got the top pick. Dallas terrible, they
Speaker 2: get flagged. He's going to be great. You would think
Speaker 2: top pick. You know, you need to be I don't
Speaker 2: know what Giannis pick was. I don't think he was
Speaker 2: the top pick. But the bottom line is you need
Speaker 2: to be an awful basketball team and then at the
Speaker 2: right time that the right player comes out of college
Speaker 2: is what it comes down to. And Utah hasn't had
Speaker 2: that advantage yet. Noahs Charlotte nor his Washington know those
Speaker 2: kind of teams. And you know, the NBA is about
Speaker 2: the great player. You got to get one to win one,
Speaker 2: and there's only about ten or to four out there.
Speaker 2: You know, Giannis is one of them. Indeed, healthy as
Speaker 2: one of them. We all know about Jokic, he's certainly
Speaker 2: one of them, Luca probably one of them. Lebron was
Speaker 2: one of them. You need one of those guys to
Speaker 2: build your team and have a chance to win. I'll
Speaker 2: let you want to get lucky with a guy like
Speaker 2: Curry who turns out to be an old timer.
Speaker 3: When he was the seventh ticket the draft.
Speaker 2: So tricky stot for the Jazz. They've been a great franchise,
Speaker 2: run properly, but sometimes luck is involved here too. They
Speaker 2: great there for those years in the nineties, and they
Speaker 2: got to sit there and I got to do with
Speaker 2: Jordan so and they lose a couple of tough series.
Speaker 2: It's it's tricky. I mean, it's it's very, very hard
Speaker 2: to win these championships. You know, there's a reason why
Speaker 2: the Celtics and the Lakers or they got about thirty
Speaker 2: two of the seventy championships.
Speaker 3: I mean, you know that's the very few.
Speaker 2: You know, Jordan's got six, but Bron's got a half
Speaker 2: of whatever. He's got four or five. Let's see what
Speaker 2: got He's got four? Right? Is the woman the Lakers
Speaker 2: two with Miami woman Cleveland? You know the Curry's got four?
Speaker 2: You know, the one great player dominates and wins a
Speaker 2: lot of these rings. And Utah hasn't had that great
Speaker 2: player yet. So obviously stocked in great and alone great,
Speaker 2: but they ran into Jordan for the most part, they
Speaker 2: haven't had those great players yet, that one transformational player.
Speaker 1: All right, before I set you loose, you referenced it earlier,
Speaker 1: and like everybody else, I picked Oklahoma City, I actually
Speaker 1: picked them in five. And it's funny, dog. I was
Speaker 1: watching the game with some buddies last night, and after
Speaker 1: Shay hit the layup to put them up seven with
Speaker 1: about I don't know, ninety seconds left or so, one
Speaker 1: of my buddies said, well, okay, that's over. I said, no,
Speaker 1: it's not. You didn't watch any of the Nick Indiana series,
Speaker 1: said tight, let's see how this ends. I am so
Speaker 1: impressed with them, and I'm so impressed with Rick Carlisle.
Speaker 1: No part of me will ever be able to cheer
Speaker 1: for the Indiana Pacers. But last night made things really interesting.
Speaker 1: I think I'm still leaning okay see, but after last night,
Speaker 1: what say you about these NBA Finals?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, you know, listen, you can begin to
Speaker 2: start to think it just happens to be Indiana's year.
Speaker 2: I mean, it went four games like they've won in
Speaker 2: this postseason is miraculous. Last night may have been the
Speaker 2: biggest one. Well, I guess the nick game was in
Speaker 2: Game one, they were down five more points, but you
Speaker 2: know the fact that they only led for three tenths
Speaker 2: of a second, I mean, geez, and then it was
Speaker 2: the last basket of the game. You know, I thought,
Speaker 2: okay see, in six, I did think Indiana would be
Speaker 2: very competitive in this series, you know, I know, okay see,
Speaker 2: he covered against Denver and had a great game two
Speaker 2: after they lost kind of a similar game in that
Speaker 2: first game. But this team right now is more dangerous
Speaker 2: than Denver was. They're a younger team, they're a hungrier team.
Speaker 2: They got more of a you know, this year, they
Speaker 2: got more of a foundation under them. They got a
Speaker 2: bigger belief than Denver had. I think, you know, Denver
Speaker 2: a coaching change, and you know, only won the fifty
Speaker 2: games anything else. And I think okay See was very
Speaker 2: familiar with Denver than not as familiar with Indiana, So
Speaker 2: this will be. And I think Indiana in game two, well,
Speaker 2: they got do in game two. Don't get blown out,
Speaker 2: you know, don't throw away that first game by getting
Speaker 2: killed in game two. I think Denver kind of did
Speaker 2: that in that second game where they got destroyed and
Speaker 2: never competitive. Don't let Oklahoma City have an easy game,
Speaker 2: put sless on them. Make that game anybody's game with
Speaker 2: eight minutes to go, and if you lose, you lose,
Speaker 2: but you make Oklahoma City get a little nervous. And
Speaker 2: I think that would be interesting to see how okay
Speaker 2: See handles that. Now. They did handle that Denver game
Speaker 2: four well, when they were down you know, eight nine
Speaker 2: points in the fourth quarter and they came back to win.
Speaker 2: And they did handle game five well, don't get me wrong,
Speaker 2: because they were in trouble. They were at to two.
Speaker 2: But Indiana's got loose something going on right now. I
Speaker 2: would agree with you, Spence. I still think the okay
Speaker 2: See probably will win, but you know, and Indiana is
Speaker 2: a goodbye. It's worth a shot because of that karma
Speaker 2: and that belief. I remember. Okay, see now I said,
Speaker 2: this is the deep end of the pool here. This
Speaker 2: is not the second round. This is deep end of
Speaker 2: the pool against the team that has been around a
Speaker 2: lot with a big coach. So we shall see. But
Speaker 2: it's got a chance to be a good series. Now,
Speaker 2: how's a chance?
Speaker 1: Well, mister Ussa always a pleasure. I still listen whenever
Speaker 1: I can. And as I often say when people ask
Speaker 1: me when I wanted to get into this business, it's
Speaker 1: when I used to listen to you and Mike driving
Speaker 1: around town. And so I appreciate your time. I know
Speaker 1: you're busy. I'll set you loose and again, thanks so much.
Speaker 1: I really appreciate it.
Speaker 2: I stance. You do a wonderful, wonderful job. You're a
Speaker 2: good talk so saying your old man's a good man.
Speaker 3: You know that I love you for all.
Speaker 1: No, that's kind of you. Appreciate that.
Speaker 2: Have a great show today, Okay, okay, buddy, appreciate all right.
Speaker 1: The great Chris Russo, mad Dog, Mike and the mad
Speaker 1: Dog one of my uh uh really uh, I would
Speaker 1: say kind of muses or rosebuds that made me consider
Speaker 1: doing this for a living. A number of different years
Speaker 1: ago and Chris is still doing it at a very
Speaker 1: high level.
Speaker 2: You can see him.
Speaker 1: I think it's Wednesdays with Stephen A. Smith on First Take.
Speaker 1: He has his own show daily on Sirius XM