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It allows me to basically put out an episode every

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day now and I'm not going to stop. I'm just

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Head on over to Freeman Beyond the Wall dot com

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Forward slash Support and do it there. Thank you. I

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want to welcome everyone back to the Pekenana Show for

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the first time. Ron Dodson's here.

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Speaker 2: How you doing, Ron, I'm doing great. Thanks for having

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me Pete.

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Speaker 1: Of course, Uh, tell everybody a little bit about yourself.

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Speaker 2: Well, I'm an evil hedge fund manager in Dallas, Texas.

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I do statistical volatility arbitrage and have a family office.

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But I have been into the classics and biblical theology

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for a long time and write, and life's giving me

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the opportunity. Now I've got both kids out of the house.

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I get to do the things I'm really passionate about,

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which is a lot of this and discussing things that matter.

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So been married for almost twenty six years and just

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very happy, very happy with that, and very happy with

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the direction we've seen things go here in the last

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little bit.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, that's I guess that's something we'll talk about today.

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A lot of people who claim the right are either

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really excited right now, cautious, or absolutely black pilling. And

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the last one I don't really I can't understand that.

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I can't get with. I'm too old to be black

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pilling at this point. But it's also one of the

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things we wanted to talk about. So one of the

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things I brought up to you was Trump's negotiating techniques,

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and you brought up you know, people just really Most

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people know Trump from the Apprentice and since he became political,

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But someone like myself who grew up in New York,

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I've known who Donald Trump was since I was a kid.

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And you know you you talked about Trump's early early

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dealings in his business. So just using as an example,

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when Trump says something that seems completely outrageous, like we're

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just going to buy Greenland, or we're going to end Canada,

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We're taking the Panama Canal back, We'll get to the

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one that he did. We'll get eventually gets to the

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one that he did recently, and get your opinions on that.

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But what you know of Trump's history, especially in his

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business dealings, how do you see Trump? How do you

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interpret the thing? How do you interpret Trump when he's

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saying stuff like that.

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Speaker 2: I think he I don't. While I don't think that

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he's sitting around reading game theory literature. I think he

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has a very natural, uh in his gut understanding of

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how how that works. In other words, how do you

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how do you maneuver on the on the battlefield of

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negotiation in such a way that number one, you understand

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the enemy better than he does. And it doesn't don't

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even have to be an enemy, just the guy who's

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across the table from you. How do you understand what

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he wants, maybe even better than he does, so that

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you're able to offer that carrot. And because carrots work

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usually better than the stick. Is costly to everyone, but

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you've got to be able to threaten to use it

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in order to in order for the carrot to be

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credible in the what I saw and family business background

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was in multi family real estate and we did a

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lot of business with a large New York City investment

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bank that is no longer with us. And our lending

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team was Trump's lending team on some of the projects

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he did. Without going into too much detail, there were

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you know, we had some visibility into how he would

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negotiate and it would always be to the great frustration

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of lending team because they just wanted everything to be very,

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very raightforward. But you know, when you're trying to do

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a development in the in the New York, New Jersey,

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you know, Northeast Quarter, you're dealing a lot with unions,

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which which the perception was that that there were some

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corruption and you had to, you know, you had to

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do certain things in order to get your deal done.

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So it was very different from down here where it's

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a right to work state and you just you bid

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out everything. So Trump would often would would realize that,

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you know, there would be these ovations made by the

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other side, that well, you know, you just want to

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screw the little guy. Uh and and we you know,

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we don't get to participate in the in the bounty

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of this development project. And so Trump would often get

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them on the deal. And what that means is they

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they ended up being participants in the risk of the deal,

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and he was able to offload much of his development

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risk onto the contractors onto the deal, which is incredible

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stupid from there from from a rational perspective, because he's

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a he's in the position to take that developmental risk.

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They are not, because ended up they just you know,

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if the deal, if the deal went somewhat sideways, he

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would just reorg wipe them out and then have a

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lower cost. And that happened more than once, I'll put

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it that way. But eventually he stopped getting you know, uh,

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the the he he got his his ultimate goal was

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just from the get go to get fair bids from

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from the these union contractors, and he got that but

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so you saw an ability to what was the goal

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of the other side, Well, we want to participate in

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the deal. Oh well, I want to offload risk. And

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he's just very naturally good at baiting the other side

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into revealing by by saying there are no goalposts on

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the other side, he bates the other side into revealing

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exactly where the goalposts are. And it's brilliant. We go

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through some of these, you know, with Greenland, which is

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I mean the real game there is is access to

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the to the Arctic h and to the polls, which

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if if current trends go and I'm very skeptical about uh,

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you know, uh, the human you know, human uh uh

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being a major factor in global warming, but but the

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Earth does warm and cool, and it seems to be

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in a warming trend. Those that northern access is incredibly important.

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So that's Trump's goal. Uh, he's pulled, He's pulled, you know, uh,

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the Greenland side completely offside. In other words, you now

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see where the local how much power do the locals have?

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How much power is is is European and and it's

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just brilliant. And I think that's been the case in

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all of these The Panama Canal very very similar. Obviously,

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the Panamanians, the elite there want us access and so

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that's immediately what he what he took away, and the

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Chinese were immediately kicked out of the of their contracts

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and they're deciding as to who as to which ships

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get priority through the locks. So it's so far been very,

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very good, and I think just shows an incredible natural

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ability to again have the other side reveal where their

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true goals are without the you know, all the smoke screen.

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Speaker 1: Is one of the problems that people just they're not

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aware that this is the way business works. So behind

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the scenes, we know, you know, I grew up, I

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grew up in a union family, and I heard all

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the stories. I even you know, I had relatives in

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the teamsters when they were a little more they're a

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little more than gangsters who would actually drop bodies, I

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mean if they if they had to, right, But when

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you see these negotiations that happened behind the scenes, I

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think this is really what you're seeing is this is

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the first time that most people are witnessing this happen

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out in the open, and they just don't know what

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to do with it, because sure, it's it's unseemly from

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a simple morality point of view, but this is the

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way power politics and power business works.

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Speaker 2: Well, you're making the you you hit on it right there.

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This is the return of true politics, and uh as

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with metaphysics and biblical theology, politics has been out. The

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myth of the twentieth century is the days of politics

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were over, and they're not. They can you can only

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subdue it for so long. But you're exactly right. This

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is a politics ultimately is and I'm quite Schmidtian in

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this is a battle over way of life and you

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can't always solve that with endless debate, you know, Schmidten

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crisis of parliamentary democracy makes I think a very good

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argument as to the facetiousness of that entire endeavor. You

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have to you want this, I want this, but I

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have the upper hand. So we're going to meet my

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demands first and then we'll see if we can meet

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any of yours. And that's and whatever it is you want,

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it can't impinge on my ability to live the way

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I want to live. And that's what a leader ultimately does,

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is protects the way of life for you know, his people.

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And I think Trump really does see himself as a

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champion for the American way of life, and that seems

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that seems unseemly, and he's willing to do or say

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whatever it takes to get there, especially in the second iteration.

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I less so in the first, but in this in

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this second iteration, I think he really sees himself as that,

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and that's unseemly because again, in the twentieth century, we

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were fed this lie that that is that's not how

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you know, everything is consensus. We'll tell that to the

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guys who are you know, who fought in all the

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wars and ended up dead. It's consensus is is a

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is kind of like self determination. It's it's there's a

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lot of lie built into that.

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Speaker 1: And I think when people start to realize that this

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is the way the game is actually played. Just like

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in any union where you have you have people who

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are just in the union because they have to be

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in the union. You have people who are in the

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union who are there because you know, it's like, well,

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they're protecting me, they're getting they're making sure I get

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a good wage, they're making sure that our health insurance,

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all of our insurance is proper. Then you have the

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group that is like would be throwing bombs in the

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haymarket in the nineteenth century, and those are the ones

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who don't know how these things are played. And I

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think one of the problems with that group is that

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group is still ideological and they don't realize we're not

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in an ideological war. We're in a power war where

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you're just trying to get You're trying everybody's trying to

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get what they want, and the only way you're going

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to do that is you're going to have to play

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the game.

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Speaker 2: Right. Yeah. The whole moving from an ideological construct to

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a way of life for power politics or Schmittian construct

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is there's a lot of friction there at the edges,

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and it's gonna I mean, I think the boomer set

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is just almost completely It's one of the reasons they're

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completely irrelevant now because they can't make that adjustment. Everything

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was about ideology, but ideology ultimately is kind of a

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scam in the sense that it's a distraction from you know,

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it's pretty nice. I lived in a part of Dallas,

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an internal suburb. You know, that's kind of a contradiction,

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but a part of Dallas when I was growing up

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and I'm in my late fifties where we never we

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never had to lock, didn't even own a key to

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my house, We never locked the door, and you didn't

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worry about anything getting stolen. That's a luxury, but that

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kind of should be the norm, right, And so what's

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more important returning to that type of reality or some

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platonic idea? I'm i say platonic. I shouldn't say that.

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I'm a big fan of Plato, but but but this

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this ethereal ideal that that you're constantly chasing, that you

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never get through, and what does it do for you anyway?

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It we're about people. But again that that change is

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is very I still talk to you not and it's

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not just the boomers, a lot of guys my age.

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It's all about ideology, you know. Uh. And and making

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that change to where no, it's about the people is

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is hard. That's that's a difficult and you see it

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with you to really think about it. Should people have

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their right to gather together and exert a level of

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power for a collective good, which is what the unions

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are well? Certainly is that does that have follow on

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after they've done that? Are there later on? Costs externalities

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to that that are often detrimental to society as a whole. Well,

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that's absolutely true too, So it just takes wisdom to

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sort these things out. You can't have an ideology that

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flattens everything out for everybody at all times. It just

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reality doesn't work that way.

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Speaker 1: Then, I guess you can make the argument that one

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of the reasons why unions today would even be a

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necessity is because there are so many different interest groups

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because of multiculturalism, they're vying for power and in a

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in a society that is not multicultural, in a homogenous society,

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the need for unions doesn't If people really were to

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stop and think about that, the most the strong, the

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person who's the most pro union, if they were still

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in like nineteen thirty Sweden, what are you forming a

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union to protect yourself against? Right, Yeah, you haven't been

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invaded yet, so then but then that also, I mean,

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that almost seems like a kind of ideology now. Of well,

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until we basically get the United States back to being

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just heritage Americans whose families have been here since the founding,

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we're not gonna And when I hear that, I hear

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an archo capitalist saying we're not going to have We're

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not going to have free markets until we end the

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until the government goes away.

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Speaker 2: Kind of yeah, that's uh, you know, I was. I

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was a huge fan of in my in the late

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eighties early nineties, spent a lot of time uh with

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Ledwig von Misis Institute, Lluellen Rockwell all those read a

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time back when you know, it wasn't cool. I was

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reading a lot of Papa and when it went hardcore

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and cap because in the in the old days, people

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don't realize the libertarian movement was kind of a palaeocon

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kind of thing. It was it it assumed an that

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that that the social institutions were taking care of a

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lot of the things that they wanted to move off

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of the state's plate, and not realizing that those institutions,

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for the most part were all corrupt and gone right.

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And so when it went hardcore and cap uh, I

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kind of lost. I lost my taste for it. But

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I have a lot of appreciation for a lot of

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those guys. You know. The question now, I think comes

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to the the and and often you don't know what

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the real opponent is until in hindsight, it's like the

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generals always want to fight the last you know, prepare

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for the last war. Right now, it seems to me,

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and I could be wrong on this, that corporate personhood

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is and and the lack of the political will to

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to limit corporate power when it's collective ends up being

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a contra to the power of the state to do

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what's good for the citizens. Now that's that sounds complicated.

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What am I talking about? Well, for instance, you know,

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we're getting to a point now where Amazon is what

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kind of power and you know, Bezos seems to be

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kind of rolling over and playing ice right now. But

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just from a from an employer uh standpoint, the power

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that that Amazon holds over an immense swath of employees

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is alarming if you just look at the numbers and

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the fact that you know, it's run a lot of

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small businesses out Now, maybe we needed a new paradigm,

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Maybe we needed a new model. But I question, you know,

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so is the union the right tool to fight that?

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Maybe not. Maybe it's it's we need we need to

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think about what does corporate personhood really mean? Should if

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we if we grant corporate personhood, then maybe that that

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person should owe the same loyalties that a citizen would

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And maybe that's a better way to think about it.

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I don't I don't know the answers, but but I

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do know that when you get to a point where

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some of these some of these uh, some of these

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corporations end up being de facto states within in and

305
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of themselves, I don't know if that's beneficial. Again, it's

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all about the state owes its first loyalty. I'm gonna

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sound like Hobbs here is owes its loyalty to the citizens.

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It's and and I think we've completely lost that and

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we're hopefully getting a little bit of that back. But

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but that's the paradigm which we need to be working in.

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And so some of these old tools unionism, trust busting,

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maybe we need, you know, we need to be really

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thinking wisely about what's the what's what's the best way

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to deal with these issues. Now. I don't know that

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the the and caps, or the Libertarians, or the palaeocons,

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any of them really have it because everything's changing. I

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don't know. What do you You know, you and I

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have kind of very similar reading lists in our past.

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What do you think about you? How would you deal

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with Amazon.

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Speaker 1: They probably need to be well. I think the first

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thing you have to do is you have to evoke

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Citizens United. That has to go away. They Yeah, when

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you look at the amount of convictions quote unquote, let's

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use the term convictions that corporations have against them, many

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of these CEOs would be in jail, right, I mean

327
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would yeah, you have these ten twenty life laws or

328
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not ten twenty life, but a third striking your outlaw.

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And you know, so once you have your third conviction,

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you go to jail for life. These corporations can pretty

331
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much kill people at will, that's right, with what their products,

332
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with whatever they do, denying service things like that. You know,

333
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Luigi Mangione is a psychopath. I mean, it's obvious that

334
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he's he's mentally ill. But if you put that aside

335
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and you look at like the person that he killed,

336
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this is this is somebody who is would probably be

337
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in jail if it wasn't for Citizens United, or he

338
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would have been after the first conviction, he would have

339
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been he had have been fired. They would get rid

340
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of these people. They don't have to because there's no

341
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there's no liability upon upon persons, right, officers, officers of

342
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a corporation cannot be cannot be held liable for things

343
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that they do, right, Yeah, I think that basically the

344
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corporate the corporate liability shields needs to be removed and

345
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they need to be treated like any other business.

346
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Speaker 2: Maybe maybe there's and you see this in financial management

347
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as well. So, uh, you know how big is black Rock? Golly,

348
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what's their ass that's under management now? I mean it's

349
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it's un you know. There there just needs to be

350
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a rethink about you get to this too big to

351
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fail thing with the banks. And that's a whole other topic.

352
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We could talk about endlessly about the debtor, the debtor

353
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nation of our of our culture and society and whether

354
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that's you know, a Christian presupposition, but that really is

355
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another topic.

356
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Speaker 1: Well, you can't have you can't have debtor as prison

357
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when your government is thirty four trillion dollars in.

358
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Speaker 2: Debt exactly, and when you allow usury what amounts to usury?

359
00:24:39,279 --> 00:24:41,559
And I see Trump is really has floated a pretty

360
00:24:41,599 --> 00:24:45,519
interesting trial balloon about capping interest rates at ten percent.

361
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That's a that's pretty ballsy.

362
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Speaker 1: Well, getting rid of getting rid of libor was probably

363
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the easiest, was probably the easiest stepping stone to do

364
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that and going and so forth, because Libor was just

365
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having our interest rates being controlled by foreign by a

366
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foreign energy.

367
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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, no, that's absolutely true. So wait a minute,

368
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where were we? Uh? You know again, you're kind of

369
00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:09,839
talking about the same thing. I am that if you're

370
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going to have corporate personhood the the then you have

371
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to then you have to treat these corporations as if

372
00:25:16,799 --> 00:25:20,799
they were citizens with all the same issues. But I'm

373
00:25:20,839 --> 00:25:23,359
with you as far as the corporate you know, shield

374
00:25:23,759 --> 00:25:27,640
should somebody have the right to as in it that

375
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that original that original limit of liability was for the

376
00:25:32,640 --> 00:25:35,759
sake of Hey, if I want to invest in this

377
00:25:38,119 --> 00:25:42,759
India Indian trading company that's going to be you know,

378
00:25:44,000 --> 00:25:48,920
growing tea, and I have no control over the captains

379
00:25:48,920 --> 00:25:51,960
of the ships, who you know, have to fight off

380
00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:55,880
pirates and everything. I'm limited in in my liability to

381
00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:58,960
the investment. And that's fine for the guy who's just

382
00:25:59,559 --> 00:26:05,599
owns I'm okay with that, but but there's a there

383
00:26:05,599 --> 00:26:08,400
comes a point in time in the management of that entity.

384
00:26:08,680 --> 00:26:11,279
If you're taking you know, we call it in in

385
00:26:11,279 --> 00:26:15,119
in tax law, you have active versus passive investment. If

386
00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:18,759
you're active in that investment, then yeah, you absolutely should

387
00:26:18,799 --> 00:26:22,480
have liability. If that means it's a board level, or

388
00:26:22,519 --> 00:26:25,960
a C suite level, or a VP level, whatever it is,

389
00:26:28,359 --> 00:26:33,480
it's it's clearly we're dealing with some uh uh, some

390
00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:38,400
moral hazard here writ very large.

391
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Speaker 1: Well, I guess that the term that kept coming to mind,

392
00:26:43,720 --> 00:26:46,000
and I don't think it's a term, it's a term

393
00:26:46,039 --> 00:26:48,559
that needs to be reinterpreted for modern day is no

394
00:26:48,640 --> 00:26:49,559
blessed leegh.

395
00:26:50,279 --> 00:26:53,519
Speaker 2: The yeah, oh yeah, we're so far from there though,

396
00:26:54,039 --> 00:26:55,359
I mean sadly.

397
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Speaker 1: But if I don't don't know that any of these

398
00:27:01,720 --> 00:27:06,039
new people who are in charge even understand the concept

399
00:27:06,079 --> 00:27:10,599
of it, understand the concept of patronage networks. The left

400
00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:15,599
understands the concept of patronage networks. They they probably don't understand.

401
00:27:15,799 --> 00:27:18,240
They probably couldn't tell you what a patriotge network is,

402
00:27:18,319 --> 00:27:23,079
but you know, the yeah, yeah, yeah. So you know,

403
00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:26,359
I've taken to saying that the Left gets their radicals

404
00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:29,839
elected and gets them, you know, six figure no show jobs,

405
00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:32,119
and the right cancels their radicals.

406
00:27:32,359 --> 00:27:32,680
Speaker 2: The right.

407
00:27:32,759 --> 00:27:36,400
Speaker 1: Can you know, if if you you've mentioned Carl Schmidt

408
00:27:36,440 --> 00:27:39,960
a few a few times now, no one meant talking

409
00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:44,039
about Carl Schmidt openly, it is taken, is taken seriously?

410
00:27:44,319 --> 00:27:49,920
Is they're actually you're you're suppressed. You know, you're you're

411
00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:52,559
a radical if you're talking about Carl Schmidt, because you know,

412
00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:56,359
there was a certain German painter who allegedly they were

413
00:27:56,559 --> 00:27:58,720
like Buddy Buddy, which is a complete.

414
00:28:00,119 --> 00:28:05,000
Speaker 2: Know, Schmidt was detained because he wasn't he wasn't down

415
00:28:05,079 --> 00:28:08,839
with the final solution stuff. Anyway, we could go all

416
00:28:08,839 --> 00:28:11,960
into that. Yeah, but that's way too complicated for people,

417
00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:16,480
because the average normy can't hold two things intention and

418
00:28:16,519 --> 00:28:19,440
that's what we're really talking about. Oh so a person

419
00:28:19,519 --> 00:28:25,720
who is is incredibly wealthy and and uh and has

420
00:28:25,759 --> 00:28:32,039
been blessed by their citizenship owes this obligation to bless

421
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:35,519
those around it, this idea of nob less obliege. But

422
00:28:35,599 --> 00:28:40,480
that's a very aristocratic ideal. And we've spent the last

423
00:28:41,640 --> 00:28:45,720
holver many years since Wilson saying that, you know, an

424
00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:50,599
aristocracy is in and of itself evil as opposed to well,

425
00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:54,359
there might be there's always abuses where you know, if

426
00:28:54,400 --> 00:28:56,960
you believe in a sin nature and I'm a I'm

427
00:28:56,960 --> 00:29:01,519
a trinitarian Christian, I do people need to be governed.

428
00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:06,640
But but but that's a very that's that aristocratic ideal

429
00:29:06,839 --> 00:29:11,319
that those who have been born with with gifts, abilities,

430
00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:17,160
material blessing use that uh uh for the betterment of

431
00:29:17,240 --> 00:29:19,960
society as a whole. And that's you don't do that

432
00:29:20,119 --> 00:29:23,960
through uh you know, that's where inheritance taxes came from

433
00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:28,160
and everything, which are an incredible blight on this country

434
00:29:28,160 --> 00:29:31,079
because they end up they end up destroying. Oh well,

435
00:29:31,119 --> 00:29:33,599
I'm gonna pay my taxes, I know not, I know,

436
00:29:34,279 --> 00:29:38,000
I owe nothing to anyone because what you're you're just

437
00:29:38,039 --> 00:29:41,000
gonna take it by force. Anyway, Now I am sounding

438
00:29:41,119 --> 00:29:45,200
like my I'm sounded like Happa and my libertarian buddies.

439
00:29:45,240 --> 00:29:48,960
But uh, but it's true. You know, Ron Paul was

440
00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:52,559
has been by the way, Uh you know, uh do

441
00:29:52,599 --> 00:29:56,400
you ever read any Gary North by any chance? Yeah,

442
00:29:56,440 --> 00:29:59,079
of course, yeah, so you know Gary wrote was the

443
00:29:59,119 --> 00:30:04,599
ghostwriter for Ron's newsletter all those years when Ron got

444
00:30:04,599 --> 00:30:09,519
elected to Congress, and uh, anyway, brilliant, Go go read,

445
00:30:09,640 --> 00:30:14,440
go read something. He's Gary died several years ago. But uh,

446
00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:18,240
but well worth perusing if you're if you're a Christian

447
00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:21,359
and interested in in kind of applying some of the stuff.

448
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:22,960
Pretty interesting guy.

449
00:30:25,319 --> 00:30:28,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, we were. I was doing my little, my little

450
00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:30,640
get together with my got my buddies for the Thought

451
00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:33,920
Crime Syndicate recently. And one of the things that one

452
00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:36,079
of the things that D said was he said, you know,

453
00:30:36,359 --> 00:30:40,960
we on the right, we should have no problem having

454
00:30:41,240 --> 00:30:43,279
like a think tank, which is like the John C.

455
00:30:43,519 --> 00:30:47,079
Calhoun What did he say, the John C. Calhoun Center

456
00:30:47,119 --> 00:30:51,119
for Political Thought. He goes, and we have we have

457
00:30:51,240 --> 00:30:54,759
people who we have single people who could find finance it,

458
00:30:55,559 --> 00:31:00,440
and we don't. We don't. No one is doing it.

459
00:31:00,880 --> 00:31:04,559
And you know, every once in a while when we

460
00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:10,039
talk about patronage and it's like, okay, you know, so

461
00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:13,000
a lot of our guys, including myself, can do this

462
00:31:13,079 --> 00:31:17,640
full time out of the out of the generosity of

463
00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:21,799
the listeners who you know, provide, provide for us and

464
00:31:21,839 --> 00:31:24,839
allow and allow me to put out as much material

465
00:31:25,839 --> 00:31:29,319
as I do and hopefully it's uh it's all quality.

466
00:31:30,039 --> 00:31:32,799
Uh it's good. I try, I try real hard for that.

467
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:36,640
But yeah, I mean, there's no there's no reason why

468
00:31:37,640 --> 00:31:40,079
there are people out there on our side who could

469
00:31:40,079 --> 00:31:43,880
be who could just start an institute and all the

470
00:31:44,200 --> 00:31:47,880
all the podcasters they like, can be under you know,

471
00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:50,880
paid through that and take and taken care of and

472
00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:56,079
wouldn't have to rely on people. But it's where the

473
00:31:56,200 --> 00:32:00,240
left sees the benefit in that sees the benefit and

474
00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:05,240
their people having a voice saying things that may go

475
00:32:05,319 --> 00:32:07,599
a little too far, just to push the Overton window

476
00:32:07,599 --> 00:32:09,799
a little bit. And we can talk about the Overton

477
00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:12,359
window too, because we were talking about that. It doesn't

478
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:14,680
seem like the right once that and I think that

479
00:32:14,720 --> 00:32:16,079
a lot of that has to do with the spirit

480
00:32:16,119 --> 00:32:17,400
of the age. It has to do with the post

481
00:32:17,400 --> 00:32:22,279
war consensus. Is everyone scared of the accusations of going

482
00:32:22,359 --> 00:32:25,920
too far right, But yeah, I mean our guys are

483
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:35,039
a lot of our guys are honestly inspiring the change

484
00:32:35,279 --> 00:32:36,960
inspired the change that's happening now.

485
00:32:37,480 --> 00:32:43,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, the patronage deal, I think is, you know

486
00:32:44,079 --> 00:32:49,440
that's Roman Catholics still to a large degree practice this

487
00:32:49,759 --> 00:32:54,279
and they're great at you know, my two daughters both

488
00:32:54,359 --> 00:32:59,920
went to uh Conservative Catholic all girls school here in Dallas.

489
00:33:00,200 --> 00:33:08,440
I'm uh Presbyterian Conservative Presbyterian Reformed, and but I saw

490
00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:12,279
that with the Roman Catholics that that church wasn't just

491
00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:14,880
where you went and got your spiritual fix once a

492
00:33:15,319 --> 00:33:19,200
you know, once a week, but you actually that that

493
00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:22,400
that there was a family, that we're in this together.

494
00:33:22,799 --> 00:33:25,839
And and if somebody you know, oh, hey do you

495
00:33:25,880 --> 00:33:29,000
hear about John, Yeah, they reorged him out. Well, hey,

496
00:33:29,039 --> 00:33:30,680
we got to figure out a way to get John

497
00:33:30,759 --> 00:33:36,640
a job. And that aspect of patronage in Protestant Land

498
00:33:36,920 --> 00:33:40,880
has been lost. Uh. Part of that is the is

499
00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:43,799
the is the uh you know, kind of the megachurch

500
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:47,160
deal where it's a very consumer model. But we treat

501
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:51,960
politics and we treat spirituality, which are two sides of

502
00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:55,640
the same coin. You know, it's funny when Paul, uh,

503
00:33:55,880 --> 00:34:00,960
Paul uses uh this interesting word his the Apostle. Paul

504
00:34:01,079 --> 00:34:05,839
uses this word all throughout his letters when speaking of righteousness.

505
00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:11,880
It's dicaiosune. And if you read Plato's, if you read

506
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:15,960
the Republic, Socrates is always talking about justice. You know

507
00:34:16,039 --> 00:34:20,480
what word it is in the Greek, It's dicaiosune. This

508
00:34:20,719 --> 00:34:25,280
politics and righteousness and justice are two sides of the

509
00:34:25,320 --> 00:34:30,480
same coin. But anyway, we've lost that with this consumer

510
00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:35,960
aspect to that we've embraced in the Protestant churches with

511
00:34:36,079 --> 00:34:38,760
regards to how we do this. And because of that,

512
00:34:38,880 --> 00:34:43,320
I think this idea of patriotage patronage networks has gone away,

513
00:34:43,400 --> 00:34:47,920
but you absolutely should have and with it the old

514
00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:52,199
social clubs that were around that. Again, the Catholics did it,

515
00:34:52,199 --> 00:34:55,360
Great Knights of Columbus and so on and so forth,

516
00:34:55,599 --> 00:35:00,800
and we don't have that. We've lost that in in

517
00:35:00,880 --> 00:35:03,559
the Protestant world, and we need to gain it back.

518
00:35:03,599 --> 00:35:09,800
But I think pastors UH have in in in embracing

519
00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:12,719
the church growth movement of just marketing to as many

520
00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:17,679
people as possible. I think they've lost that ideal, but

521
00:35:17,679 --> 00:35:19,440
but we need to get it back. I think it

522
00:35:19,599 --> 00:35:23,719
really grows out of out of UH that. And then

523
00:35:24,480 --> 00:35:28,159
I'm a leader in a in a in a private

524
00:35:28,559 --> 00:35:33,679
UH fraternal fraternal organization that has chapters all over the

525
00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:36,159
country that has been written up in the Guardian and

526
00:35:36,239 --> 00:35:37,840
so on and so forth, and that's one of our

527
00:35:37,840 --> 00:35:42,840
goals is, Hey, we absolutely are a patronage network for

528
00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:46,840
for our members that if we get persecuted for something

529
00:35:46,880 --> 00:35:49,360
we say or do or you know, not for the

530
00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:52,280
guy who does something wrong and deserves it, but but

531
00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:55,719
if you if you've, if you've just are getting persecuted

532
00:35:55,760 --> 00:36:00,239
because you actually uh are you know, are too far

533
00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:03,400
to the right or a believing Christian or whatever that

534
00:36:03,440 --> 00:36:06,199
we're going to band together and take care of you,

535
00:36:06,719 --> 00:36:10,039
and that absolutely needs to return. But I think it's

536
00:36:10,599 --> 00:36:13,559
for me at least. I think it's it's it's it's

537
00:36:13,639 --> 00:36:16,360
broken down because it's broken down in the churches. I

538
00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:18,400
don't know what your thoughts are on that.

539
00:36:20,320 --> 00:36:22,639
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it, you know, growing up in a

540
00:36:22,920 --> 00:36:25,800
in a Catholic diocese, going to Catholic going to Catholic

541
00:36:25,880 --> 00:36:31,800
high school, Altra boy, I mean yeah, everything baptized when

542
00:36:31,800 --> 00:36:36,920
I was forty five days old on Christmas Eve in Germany.

543
00:36:37,760 --> 00:36:38,480
Speaker 2: In Germany.

544
00:36:39,320 --> 00:36:41,119
Speaker 1: Yeah, my dad was in the My dad was in

545
00:36:41,159 --> 00:36:43,519
the military station over there, my mom, it was it

546
00:36:43,559 --> 00:36:46,840
was at that time where pretty much wives traveled with

547
00:36:46,840 --> 00:36:48,360
with with their.

548
00:36:49,079 --> 00:36:50,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, what THEA do you mind saying?

549
00:36:53,039 --> 00:36:55,360
Speaker 1: I think I said the other day. It's the one

550
00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:58,599
in Heidelberg. I think it was one one twentieth hospital.

551
00:36:58,599 --> 00:37:02,960
It's the one that Patton died in.

552
00:37:04,440 --> 00:37:08,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh, you're gonna draw me outside and get talking about.

553
00:37:09,239 --> 00:37:12,159
Speaker 1: Let's not do that, which is interesting because Patton and

554
00:37:12,159 --> 00:37:17,119
I also share a birthday. But really, wow, yeah.

555
00:37:16,960 --> 00:37:18,519
Speaker 2: Are you Neil Stevenson fan.

556
00:37:20,159 --> 00:37:22,400
Speaker 1: I've read I mean I've read snow Crash, you know.

557
00:37:23,000 --> 00:37:26,199
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, uh, his latest that just came out, Pole a.

558
00:37:26,280 --> 00:37:30,280
Stan Patton is a is a more than minor figure

559
00:37:30,320 --> 00:37:32,679
in that novel. So worth checking out.

560
00:37:32,639 --> 00:37:38,559
Speaker 1: Anyway, Yeah, no, no problem. And you know, something that

561
00:37:38,599 --> 00:37:42,119
we talk about is the fact that if the church

562
00:37:42,280 --> 00:37:45,039
was stronger, you know, I mean, I came after Vatican too,

563
00:37:45,079 --> 00:37:48,519
and Vatican two did a great job of weakening. It

564
00:37:48,599 --> 00:37:51,239
seemed like it weakened a lot of dioceses. And in

565
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:54,679
New York City, of all places, you would think, and

566
00:37:54,880 --> 00:37:56,679
you know, it was like I was supposed to grow

567
00:37:56,760 --> 00:37:58,760
up there. I was supposed to meet a girl at parish.

568
00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:00,840
I was supposed to get married. I was supposed to

569
00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:02,599
stay in that neighborhood. I was supposed to get a

570
00:38:02,639 --> 00:38:05,360
job in New York. But that just that went that

571
00:38:05,400 --> 00:38:11,440
went away. And you see the weakness in so many

572
00:38:11,840 --> 00:38:16,000
in so many denominations in where it's just it's not

573
00:38:16,079 --> 00:38:21,840
the same anymore. It's yeah, basically they've embraced modernity. And

574
00:38:22,280 --> 00:38:27,000
I think you're seeing, you're actually seeing. And the reason

575
00:38:27,039 --> 00:38:30,679
I'm talking about this is the obviously the most obvious

576
00:38:30,679 --> 00:38:36,920
patronage networks and most paid is churches and they were

577
00:38:36,920 --> 00:38:40,239
weakened and they were targeted. You know, I call Vatican

578
00:38:40,360 --> 00:38:45,920
two Catholicism's Nuremberg that they had to go through. They

579
00:38:45,920 --> 00:38:49,079
had to go through their own Nuremberg trials so that

580
00:38:49,679 --> 00:38:52,280
they could be weakened and they could be destroyed, just

581
00:38:52,320 --> 00:38:57,079
as any any right wing thought would be in the future,

582
00:38:57,360 --> 00:39:00,840
real right wing thought. Not you know, free free markets,

583
00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:05,000
and which is leftism? Sorry it is, and.

584
00:39:05,679 --> 00:39:09,880
Speaker 2: Well it's funny men, free markets. Adam Smith assumed Christendom

585
00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:13,480
for that model to work. You know, it didn't work

586
00:39:13,519 --> 00:39:16,360
if you're going you're trading with people who don't share

587
00:39:16,360 --> 00:39:21,280
your presuppositions. You're just asking to you know, get shot

588
00:39:21,320 --> 00:39:24,920
in the back. But anyway, you're absolutely right with the

589
00:39:24,960 --> 00:39:29,119
weakening of the church and and taking true right wing

590
00:39:29,199 --> 00:39:32,079
thought with it, because that's the I mean, I think

591
00:39:32,119 --> 00:39:35,320
that's the source. I don't think right versus left comes from.

592
00:39:35,880 --> 00:39:40,920
Maybe the terminology comes from France, uh, the French Revolution,

593
00:39:41,039 --> 00:39:44,199
But it's this is a this is a battle that's

594
00:39:44,239 --> 00:39:47,960
as old as as humans are, you know, as humanity itself.

595
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:54,480
Of order versus disorder, of beauty versus ugliness of of

596
00:39:54,480 --> 00:40:02,679
of of you know, high trust versus absolute and utter individualism.

597
00:40:03,119 --> 00:40:06,360
This is the that is that is not a two

598
00:40:06,480 --> 00:40:10,159
hundred and some odd year old struggle. This is an

599
00:40:10,239 --> 00:40:13,519
eternal struggle, at least the way I see it.

600
00:40:15,920 --> 00:40:19,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've told this story before that I think it

601
00:40:21,320 --> 00:40:24,920
certain societies get to the point where it's not left

602
00:40:25,000 --> 00:40:27,440
or right anymore. It's people who want you dead and

603
00:40:27,440 --> 00:40:32,440
people who don't. And I remember Jeff dies To, formerly

604
00:40:32,519 --> 00:40:36,239
president of the Mesa's Institute. That's how we met he.

605
00:40:37,119 --> 00:40:39,159
I think it was like February twenty twenty one. We're

606
00:40:39,199 --> 00:40:42,760
still going through COVID stuff. I mean now they're rolling

607
00:40:42,760 --> 00:40:45,679
out the vaccines, and he said, it's not about left

608
00:40:45,719 --> 00:40:48,920
or right anymore. It's not about libertarianism anymore. It's about

609
00:40:48,920 --> 00:40:51,760
people who want you dead and people who don't. And

610
00:40:52,559 --> 00:41:00,800
that's hopefully well we'll see, is what what happened with

611
00:41:00,880 --> 00:41:05,760
the the election of Trump? Is that a reaction to

612
00:41:05,920 --> 00:41:09,159
that people, even if they can't articulate it, is it like, well,

613
00:41:09,440 --> 00:41:11,639
we're at the point where there are people who want

614
00:41:11,639 --> 00:41:15,840
to kill each other, and maybe we need to stop that.

615
00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:18,800
Maybe we need someone to come in and try to

616
00:41:18,880 --> 00:41:23,239
fix that, or maybe someone to destroy the people who

617
00:41:23,239 --> 00:41:26,079
want to kill because just as in the Spanish Civil War,

618
00:41:26,559 --> 00:41:31,800
it's very obvious who who the bloodthirsty murderers are. And

619
00:41:31,840 --> 00:41:35,119
they're the same They're the same people from the Spanish

620
00:41:35,159 --> 00:41:38,000
Civil War. They're the same people who won World They're

621
00:41:38,039 --> 00:41:39,800
the same people who won World War two.

622
00:41:40,440 --> 00:41:44,039
Speaker 2: Spiritually, Yeah, when nuns start getting lit on fire, you

623
00:41:44,119 --> 00:41:48,800
know who the bad guys are, right, you know who

624
00:41:48,880 --> 00:41:52,280
the bad guys are. And that was I remember, you know,

625
00:41:52,440 --> 00:41:56,480
I was a young idiot and oh, you know, I

626
00:41:56,480 --> 00:41:59,039
guess Franco is bad and all that. Somebody showed me

627
00:41:59,079 --> 00:42:01,599
a picture of a nun getting lit up and I

628
00:42:01,639 --> 00:42:05,039
was like, oh, that happened, you know, I didn't know.

629
00:42:05,199 --> 00:42:09,239
This is when I was in a oh, freshman sophomore

630
00:42:09,239 --> 00:42:14,760
in college, and I had a h it's not important,

631
00:42:14,840 --> 00:42:21,239
but anyway, yeah, I remember being absolutely red pilled on

632
00:42:21,360 --> 00:42:22,960
that very quickly.

633
00:42:25,079 --> 00:42:27,239
Speaker 1: But you know, it gets to the point where you

634
00:42:27,320 --> 00:42:31,000
start you start recognizing all of those tendencies with your

635
00:42:31,159 --> 00:42:34,960
within your own society, and well, what do you do.

636
00:42:36,000 --> 00:42:41,079
And because of the society we live in, because the

637
00:42:41,159 --> 00:42:45,400
way we've been structured, and because we've imported so many

638
00:42:45,519 --> 00:42:50,880
people who either hate us or are completely their culture

639
00:42:50,920 --> 00:42:56,079
is antithetical to ours. It's you know, you wouldn't even

640
00:42:56,159 --> 00:42:59,000
know how to begin to do what they had to

641
00:42:59,079 --> 00:43:02,079
do then, so it becomes a political solution. And it

642
00:43:02,119 --> 00:43:05,599
seems like the political solution was people were just like, Okay,

643
00:43:05,880 --> 00:43:08,519
we're going to vote for Trump and cross our fingers.

644
00:43:08,639 --> 00:43:12,960
And I guess the only thing that I guess what

645
00:43:13,079 --> 00:43:14,960
a lot of people are hanging their hats on, or

646
00:43:15,000 --> 00:43:18,800
at least not hanging not. I don't think anybody has

647
00:43:19,079 --> 00:43:22,360
one hundred percent confidence that Trump's going to fix all this,

648
00:43:23,039 --> 00:43:27,559
but I think they're getting a champion.

649
00:43:28,519 --> 00:43:32,639
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, they're just they're getting a champions. It's very

650
00:43:32,679 --> 00:43:35,920
hobbsy in that, oh you're going to protect me. Somebody

651
00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:38,800
is finally going to bear you know, is going to

652
00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:42,559
stand up and protect me and keep me from getting

653
00:43:42,639 --> 00:43:45,480
killed or harmed or my way of life being destroyed.

654
00:43:46,239 --> 00:43:49,360
It's it's not that complicated. And we can talk about

655
00:43:49,400 --> 00:43:53,000
theory cell stuff when I love to, but but even

656
00:43:53,039 --> 00:43:56,679
a six year old can understand, oh, that guy's going

657
00:43:56,760 --> 00:43:59,400
to protect me, that guy's going to stand up and

658
00:43:59,719 --> 00:44:06,360
and and not you know, my sweet dad, you know,

659
00:44:07,000 --> 00:44:12,480
lifelong Republican and uh hey, you know, just can't stand

660
00:44:12,519 --> 00:44:16,079
Trump and I was like, he kept saying, why do

661
00:44:16,159 --> 00:44:17,400
you like Trump? And I go, you know why I

662
00:44:17,440 --> 00:44:22,960
like Trump? Dad, because he doesn't hate me. He's willing

663
00:44:23,079 --> 00:44:27,119
he he he looks at my at my way of

664
00:44:27,159 --> 00:44:29,239
life and says, yeah, I'm willing to fight for that.

665
00:44:29,880 --> 00:44:34,039
It's really you know, that's not that's not Uh. You

666
00:44:34,039 --> 00:44:39,679
don't have to read Leviathan or political theology to understand

667
00:44:39,960 --> 00:44:41,519
that basic truth.

668
00:44:43,880 --> 00:44:46,320
Speaker 1: And Trump's never read any of that stuff. Of course,

669
00:44:46,559 --> 00:44:50,239
Trump just knows. Trump just knows what he knows, right, Yeah,

670
00:44:50,280 --> 00:44:53,800
and yeah, I'm sure you and Trump could you being

671
00:44:53,800 --> 00:44:56,679
in hedge funds, you and Trump could have a lot

672
00:44:56,719 --> 00:44:58,719
in common and be able to talk. But Trump could

673
00:44:58,719 --> 00:45:01,880
also He it seems like he finds something in common

674
00:45:01,920 --> 00:45:02,880
to talk with everyone.

675
00:45:02,920 --> 00:45:06,880
Speaker 2: He encouraged everyone with everyone that Barrett and we don't

676
00:45:06,920 --> 00:45:07,280
do that.

677
00:45:07,440 --> 00:45:11,159
Speaker 1: We we well, we're while we're judging Trump, we don't

678
00:45:11,199 --> 00:45:12,840
do that, right, No.

679
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:15,559
Speaker 2: You're that's a great point, Pete. You know that Rona

680
00:45:15,639 --> 00:45:19,000
Barrett interview from back in what it was eighty four

681
00:45:19,079 --> 00:45:21,719
or eighty five something like that that you can find

682
00:45:21,719 --> 00:45:27,559
on YouTube. It he's the same guy. Actually he's better now,

683
00:45:27,920 --> 00:45:31,199
but he but the basis of that knowledge in his

684
00:45:31,519 --> 00:45:35,480
bones of all this. Again, do I think Trump is

685
00:45:36,440 --> 00:45:41,719
eating a big mac and reading De Maestra, No, I don't.

686
00:45:41,800 --> 00:45:46,519
But some guys just just get it, you know, And

687
00:45:46,800 --> 00:45:50,320
God bless him that. I don't expect everybody to be

688
00:45:50,440 --> 00:45:55,760
that way, but thank God for him.

689
00:45:55,880 --> 00:45:58,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's like my in laws. My in laws

690
00:45:58,360 --> 00:46:02,960
are I hope they don't know a lot of the

691
00:46:03,000 --> 00:46:07,239
things that I read and that I talk about and everything,

692
00:46:07,800 --> 00:46:12,000
but they're just genuinely good people. Yeah, they're just genuinely

693
00:46:12,039 --> 00:46:15,519
good people. If they do these are the kind of

694
00:46:15,519 --> 00:46:17,880
people that if they do something, if they vote in

695
00:46:17,920 --> 00:46:21,280
a certain way, or they have an opinion that in

696
00:46:21,800 --> 00:46:26,760
some way affects your life. If they if they vote,

697
00:46:26,840 --> 00:46:30,199
end up voting for somebody that that affects your life

698
00:46:30,239 --> 00:46:32,519
in a negative way. They didn't do it on purpose.

699
00:46:33,199 --> 00:46:40,519
They're just feeling their way through life. And here's the thing. This,

700
00:46:41,159 --> 00:46:44,679
what we know is not for everybody. You see that,

701
00:46:44,840 --> 00:46:48,599
you see that online. You know, somebody can get a

702
00:46:49,000 --> 00:46:51,559
you know, somebody can pick up a book like Israel

703
00:46:51,599 --> 00:46:57,880
Shahak's Jewish History, Jewish Religion, or Sulcianes's Two Hundred Years

704
00:46:57,920 --> 00:47:01,280
Together and they read that and they can't handle it.

705
00:47:01,400 --> 00:47:06,480
They can't handle the information that's in there because they

706
00:47:07,119 --> 00:47:11,320
they immediately go, they immediately all fly all the way

707
00:47:11,360 --> 00:47:14,400
over to one side and have an opinion and there

708
00:47:14,440 --> 00:47:18,280
and now they become ideological again, right, and their ideology

709
00:47:18,320 --> 00:47:19,920
is never going to manifest into reality.

710
00:47:20,719 --> 00:47:25,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's hard. I've got some I've got some friends

711
00:47:25,519 --> 00:47:31,960
who who are great folks, but you know, have come

712
00:47:32,000 --> 00:47:37,639
across you know, the have started noticing and to try

713
00:47:37,679 --> 00:47:41,880
to keep them from getting ideological about it as opposed

714
00:47:41,880 --> 00:47:45,840
to uh, you know again, as a as a Christian,

715
00:47:45,880 --> 00:47:48,519
I think we've got answers for these things. Yeah, humanity

716
00:47:48,559 --> 00:47:52,400
is sinful, it's it's just flawed, and you need whise.

717
00:47:53,480 --> 00:47:56,559
You need to first of all, look outside yourself. That

718
00:47:56,679 --> 00:48:00,719
truth isn't something that bubbles up from within you, outside

719
00:48:00,719 --> 00:48:05,000
of you. Even Plato spoke of uh uh, you know,

720
00:48:05,239 --> 00:48:10,199
justice being alien to to yourself. That that that you

721
00:48:10,280 --> 00:48:15,599
have to understand that that thing that laws truth is discovered,

722
00:48:15,719 --> 00:48:21,400
not made right. We reject positivism, but but this ideology

723
00:48:21,480 --> 00:48:26,800
is always that is always that that beckoning apple. You know,

724
00:48:27,079 --> 00:48:30,079
if I just had the right if I had the

725
00:48:30,199 --> 00:48:34,599
right rules, I could fix everything. Right, if I could.

726
00:48:34,679 --> 00:48:38,760
I don't because people are flawed. That's that's the that's

727
00:48:38,880 --> 00:48:42,800
the temptation, because how can I rely on a person

728
00:48:42,920 --> 00:48:47,199
to be wise when it's people who are flawed? Yet

729
00:48:48,119 --> 00:48:54,039
look at you know, managerialism or or you know, talmudism

730
00:48:54,320 --> 00:48:57,000
or all of these things where you try to regulate

731
00:48:57,199 --> 00:49:02,559
life to the end. It doesn't war idea. Again, you

732
00:49:02,599 --> 00:49:08,239
can have first principles, you can have things that are true.

733
00:49:08,800 --> 00:49:13,119
You know, multiplication tables are true. It seems to be eternally.

734
00:49:13,760 --> 00:49:17,559
But when you make that leap to this governing rubric

735
00:49:17,599 --> 00:49:21,519
of ideology that's going to that's going to determine every

736
00:49:21,599 --> 00:49:25,480
response to every situation, it doesn't. It doesn't work. It

737
00:49:25,559 --> 00:49:30,000
never has. You're gonna ultimately you've got to have wise, mature,

738
00:49:30,840 --> 00:49:36,920
virtuous people. And that's just uncomfortable. And while we're still

739
00:49:36,960 --> 00:49:41,239
living in the myth of the twentieth century.

740
00:49:41,920 --> 00:49:44,840
Speaker 1: Well, what it comes down to is is that most people,

741
00:49:45,519 --> 00:49:50,760
overwhelming majority of people, should they shouldn't even be concerned

742
00:49:50,760 --> 00:49:54,039
with politics. Politics shouldn't be something they think about. You know,

743
00:49:54,320 --> 00:49:57,280
But you know, Yaki wrote in Imperium, he said, you

744
00:49:57,320 --> 00:49:59,599
know this is we're in the age of absolute politics.

745
00:50:00,079 --> 00:50:01,840
For the whole form of our life is now a

746
00:50:01,880 --> 00:50:06,280
function of power, and it almost seems like if you're

747
00:50:06,360 --> 00:50:09,039
living in the age of absolute politics, it demands that

748
00:50:09,079 --> 00:50:12,320
people become political. I said one of the one of

749
00:50:12,320 --> 00:50:18,760
the artist. Yeah. One of the things that I noticed

750
00:50:18,800 --> 00:50:22,159
from like the first Trump campaign, the twenty fifteen to

751
00:50:22,239 --> 00:50:25,960
sixteen was you had a lot of people who became

752
00:50:26,159 --> 00:50:28,840
who started following Trump who had never been political before.

753
00:50:28,840 --> 00:50:31,719
I'd never been openly political, never been like, yeah, this

754
00:50:31,880 --> 00:50:34,400
is my candidate. I'm just going to sit back and

755
00:50:34,480 --> 00:50:36,920
vote for whoever I think, you know who I think

756
00:50:36,960 --> 00:50:40,679
I should vote for. But people actually became political. And

757
00:50:40,719 --> 00:50:44,320
there's a problem when you have the Internet and anyone

758
00:50:44,320 --> 00:50:46,079
can go out there and be political, and anyone can

759
00:50:46,119 --> 00:50:49,880
start spewing and they have no political background. They have

760
00:50:50,079 --> 00:50:53,199
never read a book on political theory. They don't know

761
00:50:53,239 --> 00:50:57,639
how politics works. They think politics works. Their politics is

762
00:50:57,639 --> 00:51:01,239
the politics of the post war consensus, and it's a lie.

763
00:51:01,760 --> 00:51:07,440
So you're adopting politics. It's a lie. And hopefully I

764
00:51:07,480 --> 00:51:13,039
think what we're seeing, at least now so far, is

765
00:51:13,079 --> 00:51:16,960
that there are people who are going in there who know,

766
00:51:18,119 --> 00:51:22,599
who understand have figured out how politics works, and They're like, okay,

767
00:51:22,679 --> 00:51:26,360
well we need to strip away. Politics only works if

768
00:51:26,360 --> 00:51:31,239
we don't have this insane bureaucracy. And the bureaucracy is

769
00:51:32,119 --> 00:51:38,079
funding funding our enemies, public and private. So how do

770
00:51:38,119 --> 00:51:41,039
you you know, so what do we do? How do

771
00:51:41,079 --> 00:51:44,679
we take them down? And the problem is is things

772
00:51:44,679 --> 00:51:46,440
have been so bad and there are people who are

773
00:51:46,480 --> 00:51:50,280
of an age where all they've known is internet politics

774
00:51:50,280 --> 00:51:53,599
for so long. They don't think that anything can change.

775
00:51:53,760 --> 00:51:56,519
They don't think change is possible. They see bu Kelly

776
00:51:56,559 --> 00:51:59,519
and El Salvador and they still don't think change is possible.

777
00:52:00,360 --> 00:52:03,400
Malay is They see what Malay is doing in Argentina

778
00:52:03,480 --> 00:52:06,840
and they still don't. They don't think the change is possible. Right,

779
00:52:07,920 --> 00:52:09,360
It takes will, and.

780
00:52:09,360 --> 00:52:13,599
Speaker 2: It takes will. Yeah, yeah, absolutely, It turns out you

781
00:52:13,639 --> 00:52:17,039
can just do things. As a friend of mine says,

782
00:52:17,760 --> 00:52:23,599
you know you mentioned and you know Trump's really really

783
00:52:23,599 --> 00:52:27,079
dealing with it now, with this this concept of impoundment,

784
00:52:27,360 --> 00:52:32,400
that that as the as the UH as the chief executive.

785
00:52:32,760 --> 00:52:35,800
And I'm a big Article two guy. I think you know,

786
00:52:35,840 --> 00:52:39,320
the chief executive should run the executive branch. That's his job.

787
00:52:40,119 --> 00:52:43,480
UH and and the whole thing serves at his pleasure.

788
00:52:45,239 --> 00:52:48,000
But in doing in doing so, you know, he he

789
00:52:48,119 --> 00:52:53,639
has he has chosen to practice impoundment of of any

790
00:52:55,719 --> 00:52:59,280
mandated spending by the by the executive. And you know,

791
00:52:59,360 --> 00:53:02,679
there in nineteen seventy because Nixon tried to do the

792
00:53:02,719 --> 00:53:08,480
exact same thing, and and there was the nineteen seventy

793
00:53:08,519 --> 00:53:12,599
four Impoundment Act where Congress basically said, no, we can

794
00:53:12,679 --> 00:53:15,960
choose to tell the executive what to do by law,

795
00:53:16,719 --> 00:53:21,480
and Trump's Trump's basically saying, uh huh, that's an unconstitutional law.

796
00:53:21,519 --> 00:53:25,519
And so now you have you have two big concepts

797
00:53:25,519 --> 00:53:28,719
that are that are going to really be the interesting

798
00:53:29,239 --> 00:53:32,880
I mean I'm making I'm talking about you know, application

799
00:53:33,039 --> 00:53:35,559
is trying to bring it down to current events right now.

800
00:53:35,599 --> 00:53:40,599
But but is is does the does the chief executive

801
00:53:41,039 --> 00:53:45,360
have the final say over how the how the uh

802
00:53:46,000 --> 00:53:52,760
you know that the executive branch spins spends its dollars,

803
00:53:53,599 --> 00:53:57,599
can it practice impoundment similarly? It's it's kind of similar

804
00:53:57,639 --> 00:54:02,079
to can the states practice nullification? Kind of similar but

805
00:54:02,159 --> 00:54:06,480
in the executive And then so you've had in two

806
00:54:06,639 --> 00:54:11,800
judges now come out one is this uh ingle Meyer,

807
00:54:12,840 --> 00:54:15,519
Paul Inglemeyer. And then I can't remember the name of

808
00:54:15,519 --> 00:54:19,440
the other one. It was in the hill today in

809
00:54:19,679 --> 00:54:23,920
Rhode Island. Uh, John McConnell. So you've had these two

810
00:54:24,039 --> 00:54:30,119
district judge judges attempt to enjoin the entire the administration,

811
00:54:30,480 --> 00:54:34,840
the entire executive branch, and say no, that the president

812
00:54:34,960 --> 00:54:40,559
doesn't have the ability to to impound these these congressionally

813
00:54:40,719 --> 00:54:45,280
ordered expenses that are expended by the by the executive

814
00:54:45,920 --> 00:54:49,519
So so the two things are, is is impoundment as

815
00:54:49,559 --> 00:54:52,880
a concept? Does the does the president have the ability

816
00:54:52,920 --> 00:54:55,199
to do that? And that's that's going to be a

817
00:54:55,239 --> 00:54:59,079
Scotus decision and I not. I don't have a ton

818
00:54:59,159 --> 00:55:03,320
of man. That's a big thing to go against. For Roberts,

819
00:55:03,719 --> 00:55:05,880
that may be a bridge too far. Even the in

820
00:55:05,920 --> 00:55:10,239
it's and it's Roberts and uh oh gosh, uh uh,

821
00:55:10,400 --> 00:55:12,679
I can't remember the other judge's name. Who those are

822
00:55:12,679 --> 00:55:16,320
the two that are they're big on start decisis on

823
00:55:16,320 --> 00:55:20,360
on on precedent. But the bigger issue I think is

824
00:55:20,480 --> 00:55:25,360
does a district judge have the ability to enjoin the

825
00:55:25,559 --> 00:55:29,360
entire country when they are their authority just exit. In

826
00:55:29,360 --> 00:55:32,400
other words, you know, if a district judge says, hey,

827
00:55:32,440 --> 00:55:36,199
I enjoin the administration to spend these dollars in my district.

828
00:55:37,159 --> 00:55:40,760
There may be some constitutional authority there, but for the

829
00:55:40,960 --> 00:55:44,000
entire country, and this question has never come up before

830
00:55:44,000 --> 00:55:47,199
the court. And I think it's very interesting. So that

831
00:55:47,559 --> 00:55:49,519
is one to really look for. And I think that

832
00:55:49,599 --> 00:55:54,639
will that will rise quickly, uh to the Supreme Court level. You'll, you'll.

833
00:55:55,760 --> 00:55:58,639
So those are two very interesting things. I was actually

834
00:55:59,079 --> 00:56:01,519
emailing with John on you, who is kind of the

835
00:56:03,639 --> 00:56:08,400
probably the pre eminent constitutional he teaches at Berkeley, but

836
00:56:08,440 --> 00:56:13,000
he's a conservative, uh, probably the pre eminent constitutional theorist

837
00:56:13,079 --> 00:56:17,519
on these things. And and uh, anyway, I'm really looking

838
00:56:17,519 --> 00:56:20,440
forward to see how you know, it's and it's really

839
00:56:20,519 --> 00:56:23,000
up to Kavanaugh and Roberts on that. I don't have

840
00:56:23,039 --> 00:56:26,079
a ton of hope for Roberts but we'll see.

841
00:56:29,119 --> 00:56:32,360
Speaker 1: Or you can just go to the Andrew Jackson wrap. Yeah,

842
00:56:32,519 --> 00:56:36,760
you can just defy him. Yeah, and yeah, I mean

843
00:56:36,800 --> 00:56:39,840
he could start, he could start looking to have them removed.

844
00:56:40,480 --> 00:56:43,360
Speaker 2: Well, and that's and that's the thing too that.

845
00:56:43,760 --> 00:56:46,679
Speaker 1: I think we're at that point. I I I'm just

846
00:56:46,719 --> 00:56:48,639
going to say we're at that point. We're at the

847
00:56:48,679 --> 00:56:53,199
point where if a president who wants to make drastic change.

848
00:56:53,239 --> 00:56:57,199
Who wants to leave a legacy of fixing what was

849
00:56:57,280 --> 00:57:01,239
what's been broken for one hundred years. Then they're going

850
00:57:01,280 --> 00:57:03,960
to have to They're gonna have to cross, They're gonna

851
00:57:03,960 --> 00:57:06,159
have to go to the across the rubicon and not

852
00:57:06,239 --> 00:57:08,760
swim on the other side. We're gonna have to keep going.

853
00:57:09,159 --> 00:57:13,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, No, I think that's true. I just think these

854
00:57:13,039 --> 00:57:15,199
are the steps that are going to lead up to that.

855
00:57:16,039 --> 00:57:20,039
I think he'll defy them until you know, uh, but

856
00:57:20,119 --> 00:57:25,280
you're going to have these because the question becomes, you know,

857
00:57:25,360 --> 00:57:28,000
you and I both know that the Constitution is written,

858
00:57:28,039 --> 00:57:33,440
as you know, we are in a post constitutional state,

859
00:57:33,559 --> 00:57:36,639
but there is still the as Yarvin talks about, there's

860
00:57:36,679 --> 00:57:42,880
this informal versus formal power and the and the informal.

861
00:57:44,119 --> 00:57:47,199
The question is how do you best how do you

862
00:57:47,239 --> 00:57:51,440
best challenge those if you're going to get across the rubicon?

863
00:57:52,000 --> 00:57:54,559
And I don't know, I don't know the answer to that.

864
00:57:54,599 --> 00:57:57,719
I think this too pronged approach, which is defy but

865
00:57:57,840 --> 00:58:01,039
also go the other fight the back on two fronts

866
00:58:01,239 --> 00:58:04,199
because honestly, as long as he's president, he owns the

867
00:58:04,239 --> 00:58:07,000
biggest army. And I don't mean the actual army. But

868
00:58:07,079 --> 00:58:09,760
the he sits at the you know, he has the

869
00:58:09,800 --> 00:58:13,719
pulpit of the nation, so to speak. Uh, and he's

870
00:58:14,280 --> 00:58:16,880
riding a wave of popularity. You know. I was just

871
00:58:17,280 --> 00:58:22,119
uh saw that today. The Democrats the way they're they're

872
00:58:22,119 --> 00:58:26,760
fighting back on this. Uh. Senator Andy Kim, who's from

873
00:58:26,800 --> 00:58:30,159
New Jersey said that the way they're going to fight

874
00:58:30,239 --> 00:58:33,400
back is they're threatening a government shut down. And I

875
00:58:33,440 --> 00:58:36,480
mean Trump should, Trump should go on TV and I

876
00:58:36,519 --> 00:58:39,800
can say, bring it on, love it, let's shut it down.

877
00:58:40,800 --> 00:58:42,880
Let's see how long you want to shut it down.

878
00:58:42,920 --> 00:58:46,000
If you want to shut it down, great, Uh, you

879
00:58:46,039 --> 00:58:47,800
know that's kind of what we're looking for.

880
00:58:48,159 --> 00:58:51,079
Speaker 1: Shut but this time, shut everything down. Shut a payment

881
00:58:51,119 --> 00:58:53,960
going shut every payment going out, and see how long

882
00:58:54,199 --> 00:58:56,440
people who are on Social Security and people who are

883
00:58:56,480 --> 00:58:58,239
on all the entitlements.

884
00:58:58,320 --> 00:58:59,639
Speaker 2: That's exactly right.

885
00:59:00,519 --> 00:59:03,599
Speaker 1: And all you do is take control. You take to

886
00:59:03,679 --> 00:59:05,920
the airwaves and you say, this is the Democrats who

887
00:59:05,920 --> 00:59:06,760
are doing this to you.

888
00:59:07,119 --> 00:59:07,519
Speaker 2: That's right.

889
00:59:07,800 --> 00:59:10,960
Speaker 1: I mean, it's with these judges. Okay, a judge made

890
00:59:10,960 --> 00:59:14,920
a ruling. Let's see you enforce it. You and what army? Yeah,

891
00:59:15,199 --> 00:59:15,960
you and what army.

892
00:59:16,480 --> 00:59:21,679
Speaker 2: That's exactly right. But it is harbon, it is a rubicon.

893
00:59:21,719 --> 00:59:25,199
But I think, you know, Stephen Miller, everybody talks about

894
00:59:25,199 --> 00:59:29,920
the power that that Elon has, uh, and that's true,

895
00:59:29,960 --> 00:59:33,119
but but Stephen Miller is really swinging a big stick

896
00:59:33,239 --> 00:59:34,920
up there. So if you want to kind of know

897
00:59:35,039 --> 00:59:39,119
some of the thoughts behind this, I would suggest your

898
00:59:39,199 --> 00:59:42,400
viewers go kind of look at the stuff Stephen has

899
00:59:42,679 --> 00:59:48,239
said and has written, and then uh, Anton has uh

900
00:59:49,480 --> 00:59:53,760
who's Anton has a pretty big I don't want to

901
00:59:53,800 --> 00:59:59,119
overstate Michael's authority, but but I think the intellect, the

902
00:59:59,119 --> 01:00:02,519
the the inte e actual heft is there as far

903
01:00:02,599 --> 01:00:06,079
as in you know, Anton's a Claire monster, which might

904
01:00:06,480 --> 01:00:08,920
frighten some of your guys. But I'm friends with all

905
01:00:08,960 --> 01:00:12,119
those guys, and I really like Michael, and so that

906
01:00:13,039 --> 01:00:17,440
I or we don't always agree on everything that excites

907
01:00:17,480 --> 01:00:23,679
me because those guys absolutely have the intestinal fortitude to say, yeah, yeah,

908
01:00:23,760 --> 01:00:25,559
we're getting in the river, we're going.

909
01:00:28,239 --> 01:00:29,840
Speaker 1: Do you have how much more time do you have?

910
01:00:31,079 --> 01:00:33,039
Speaker 2: How much you need? This is fun.

911
01:00:33,119 --> 01:00:37,519
Speaker 1: I'm loving it. Let's let's get into this. Okay, let's uh,

912
01:00:37,639 --> 01:00:42,599
let's circle back to the beginning. Okay, what what's how

913
01:00:42,599 --> 01:00:46,079
are you reading Trump's strategy on everything he said about Gaza.

914
01:00:48,920 --> 01:00:54,840
Speaker 2: Well, I think there's an absolute uh what would the

915
01:00:54,880 --> 01:00:59,599
game theory be? Uh? The mad men mad man? Uh?

916
01:01:00,599 --> 01:01:04,960
You know mad Man theory there? And that sounds like

917
01:01:05,000 --> 01:01:09,840
I'm saying Trump's acting crazy. No, you just you practice unpredictability.

918
01:01:09,920 --> 01:01:12,880
Like you if you saw net and Yahu's face when

919
01:01:12,920 --> 01:01:16,400
he was saying that Net and Yahoo had no clue

920
01:01:16,920 --> 01:01:20,639
what he was being hit with. Okay, so so I

921
01:01:21,000 --> 01:01:23,800
mad Man theory is just the idea strategy where a

922
01:01:23,880 --> 01:01:28,079
leader cultivates an image of unpredictability to intimidate adversaries or

923
01:01:28,079 --> 01:01:31,559
opponents into concessions. I think there is an app there

924
01:01:31,679 --> 01:01:34,960
is part of that. Again, I think, Do I think

925
01:01:35,000 --> 01:01:38,400
Trump's studying mad Man theory? No? I just think he

926
01:01:38,480 --> 01:01:43,039
has it in his gut. But there is an absolute

927
01:01:43,639 --> 01:01:48,159
rational explanation for this. Now in my heart of hearts,

928
01:01:48,199 --> 01:01:51,920
do I wish we could wash our hands and be

929
01:01:52,079 --> 01:01:57,360
this pure, you know, just be worried about our own

930
01:01:57,440 --> 01:02:02,559
borders and we have two oceans and a failed state

931
01:02:02,639 --> 01:02:07,039
and an incompetent state on our borders, and we just

932
01:02:07,440 --> 01:02:11,679
want to maximize the advantages of what God has given

933
01:02:11,760 --> 01:02:15,400
us geopolitically, a geography, you know, in a geographic way.

934
01:02:16,719 --> 01:02:21,239
Sure that a reality because Egypt and this is I

935
01:02:21,280 --> 01:02:24,000
haven't heard a lot of people talk about this. Stormy

936
01:02:24,079 --> 01:02:27,280
might have mentioned it once or twice, but Egypt is

937
01:02:28,079 --> 01:02:32,760
the problem over there. First of all, there's there's zero

938
01:02:32,840 --> 01:02:37,360
political will to do anything that is directly against Israel.

939
01:02:38,119 --> 01:02:45,039
I am not a Zionist. I think Zionism has caused

940
01:02:45,519 --> 01:02:49,920
more problems than it attempted to fix. But that's neither

941
01:02:49,960 --> 01:02:52,320
here nor there. We're in the world that's created. Okay,

942
01:02:52,599 --> 01:02:54,960
we're in a post nineteen forty eight world, and we

943
01:02:55,039 --> 01:02:58,639
do not have the political will to just say, hey, Israel,

944
01:02:58,719 --> 01:03:02,440
figure it out and of your else because Israel figuring

945
01:03:02,480 --> 01:03:05,880
it out in and of themselves. Here's what that looks like.

946
01:03:05,960 --> 01:03:09,039
If we were to just not have any foreign giving

947
01:03:09,159 --> 01:03:15,199
whatsoever because of the peace accords, you know, Sadat and

948
01:03:15,280 --> 01:03:22,480
began Camp David Accords. We give Egypt so much foreign

949
01:03:22,559 --> 01:03:27,480
aid because of that. Now do they technically do we

950
01:03:27,679 --> 01:03:30,719
pay for their food? Not directly, but they use that

951
01:03:30,840 --> 01:03:36,840
foreign aid to buy grain from Russia. Their GDP is.

952
01:03:38,480 --> 01:03:40,960
Speaker 1: Did you see the news today that Russia has record

953
01:03:41,000 --> 01:03:42,000
grain exports.

954
01:03:42,280 --> 01:03:47,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, and that's and this is all tied together.

955
01:03:47,559 --> 01:03:51,519
But we basically have been buying Egypt off for the

956
01:03:51,599 --> 01:03:57,000
last forty five years or so fifty years. But because

957
01:03:57,000 --> 01:04:00,000
of that, they now have a population that's grown way.

958
01:04:00,039 --> 01:04:03,800
We've subsidized this population growth. It's far beyond their ability

959
01:04:03,840 --> 01:04:04,519
to support.

960
01:04:05,199 --> 01:04:09,679
Speaker 1: Well, where's one hundred and thirteen million and pretty much

961
01:04:09,800 --> 01:04:12,400
ninety percent of the country is uninhabitable.

962
01:04:12,280 --> 01:04:16,960
Speaker 2: Uninhabitable and their biggest slums are right across the street

963
01:04:17,039 --> 01:04:20,440
from where their seat of government is. You know, the

964
01:04:20,840 --> 01:04:23,440
elite have all moved out into the desert and all

965
01:04:23,480 --> 01:04:27,480
that kind of thing. But Cairo is a disaster. But anyway,

966
01:04:28,320 --> 01:04:30,440
the point being is where's the release about where's all

967
01:04:30,440 --> 01:04:36,000
the food grown right nearby? It's sitting up there in Israel. Now,

968
01:04:38,039 --> 01:04:40,639
Israel's nuclear We could go through and I did this

969
01:04:40,719 --> 01:04:43,679
for some folks. You can go through all the balance

970
01:04:43,719 --> 01:04:47,280
of power things with Israel versus Egypt. But Egypt's got

971
01:04:47,320 --> 01:04:50,800
a lot more people and a lot more tanks and

972
01:04:51,119 --> 01:04:57,519
way more reserved forces. Israel's got nukes and Egypt's sitting

973
01:04:57,519 --> 01:05:01,599
on the Suez Canal. So do we if we what

974
01:05:01,800 --> 01:05:05,440
happens if we abandon that is China's gonna come in

975
01:05:06,000 --> 01:05:08,079
big and hard, and Russia's gonna come in big and

976
01:05:08,119 --> 01:05:14,679
hard to Egypt, and do they stay being I mean,

977
01:05:14,800 --> 01:05:16,440
I don't know what the answer to that is. But

978
01:05:16,480 --> 01:05:19,960
do we want do we want a nuclear war with

979
01:05:20,159 --> 01:05:24,840
China and Russia being part and parcel to the to

980
01:05:24,920 --> 01:05:28,039
the to the parties in the Middle East? Because we

981
01:05:28,039 --> 01:05:30,360
get drug into that very fast, because again, we don't

982
01:05:30,480 --> 01:05:33,559
have the political will to let Israel be off on

983
01:05:33,639 --> 01:05:37,039
its own. We just don't do. I wish we would, sure,

984
01:05:37,199 --> 01:05:40,760
but it's not happening. So I think there's a the

985
01:05:41,239 --> 01:05:45,360
understanding that there has to be just like Ukraine has

986
01:05:45,440 --> 01:05:48,880
to be a buffer state for Russia. Why because it's flatland,

987
01:05:49,159 --> 01:05:53,280
Russia's surrounded by planes, there's no you know, full the

988
01:05:53,320 --> 01:05:58,800
gap Ukraine. Ukraine just means frontier, the Ukrainian frontier. Russia

989
01:05:58,880 --> 01:06:04,239
needs buffer states. Well, Israel and Egypt need a buffer

990
01:06:04,320 --> 01:06:07,719
between them. So there is a there is this game

991
01:06:07,800 --> 01:06:13,480
theory that says we weren't gonna Trump really doesn't want

992
01:06:13,519 --> 01:06:16,280
to say, Oh, you're gonna genocide all the You're gonna

993
01:06:16,280 --> 01:06:19,960
genocide all the Palestinians, and then we're just gonna help

994
01:06:20,039 --> 01:06:23,119
you bulldoze Gaza and you get to take it BB.

995
01:06:23,800 --> 01:06:28,400
That wasn't happening, not especially after BB played nice with Biden,

996
01:06:28,440 --> 01:06:31,679
after you know, and Biebe gets the Intel reports, he

997
01:06:31,719 --> 01:06:36,679
knew what happened with twenty twenty. So, uh, that wasn't happening.

998
01:06:36,719 --> 01:06:39,159
So I think there is some there is actually some

999
01:06:39,320 --> 01:06:44,360
practical Uh. They're going to try to negotiate something that

1000
01:06:44,519 --> 01:06:48,199
looks like a prosperous buffer state that neither Egypt nor

1001
01:06:48,280 --> 01:06:52,760
Israel wants to encroach upon. What that ends up looking like,

1002
01:06:52,920 --> 01:06:58,599
I don't know. Does it look like a US exclave Maybe?

1003
01:06:59,440 --> 01:07:04,639
I don't know. But they can't just allow Israel to

1004
01:07:04,760 --> 01:07:07,920
move all the way down the coast to Egypt's border.

1005
01:07:07,960 --> 01:07:12,679
That's not going to happen in my opinion. Yeah.

1006
01:07:12,840 --> 01:07:16,800
Speaker 1: Basically, the way it's been explained to me is that

1007
01:07:17,159 --> 01:07:19,400
the money that we give to Egypt and that three

1008
01:07:19,480 --> 01:07:21,800
point eight million dollars that we give to Israel that

1009
01:07:21,800 --> 01:07:24,599
we're never going to stop giving to Israel is a

1010
01:07:24,639 --> 01:07:26,199
bribe that they don't kill each other.

1011
01:07:26,639 --> 01:07:30,519
Speaker 2: That's right, one hundred percent, one hundred percent. That was

1012
01:07:30,519 --> 01:07:32,800
the secret to the Camp David of courts.

1013
01:07:33,920 --> 01:07:36,320
Speaker 1: And people will say, well, what do we have to

1014
01:07:36,360 --> 01:07:39,960
do with this? What do we what we have to

1015
01:07:39,960 --> 01:07:44,719
do with this is the fact that basically anything Israel

1016
01:07:44,800 --> 01:07:46,599
does gets blown back on us.

1017
01:07:47,079 --> 01:07:47,400
Speaker 2: Mm hm.

1018
01:07:48,960 --> 01:07:53,320
Speaker 1: So in many ways, you're going to have to negotiate

1019
01:07:53,360 --> 01:07:57,199
with Israel. You're going to have to at least play

1020
01:07:57,239 --> 01:08:01,079
the game of doing everything you can to troll them

1021
01:08:01,280 --> 01:08:04,480
so they don't do something that is so far outside

1022
01:08:05,079 --> 01:08:10,360
the realm. Cairo, Yeah, that it's going to blow back

1023
01:08:10,400 --> 01:08:12,280
on us. I mean people were like, oh, well, what

1024
01:08:12,400 --> 01:08:13,880
I mean there are people out there who will be

1025
01:08:13,920 --> 01:08:18,039
who are so anti Israel that they'll say, well, what

1026
01:08:18,159 --> 01:08:19,760
do we care if they knew Cairo?

1027
01:08:20,279 --> 01:08:25,199
Speaker 2: Okay, probably I mean Cairo by that point is a

1028
01:08:25,319 --> 01:08:30,039
Russian and it probably has dual alliances with Russia and China,

1029
01:08:30,920 --> 01:08:32,560
and so they just.

1030
01:08:33,079 --> 01:08:37,600
Speaker 1: They just they just imported. How many jets and anti

1031
01:08:37,880 --> 01:08:40,199
anti aircraft systems did they just get from China?

1032
01:08:41,119 --> 01:08:43,680
Speaker 2: Oh? Did they get did they get J twenties? I

1033
01:08:43,720 --> 01:08:46,880
mean something pretty sophisticated. Yeah, So.

1034
01:08:48,359 --> 01:08:51,920
Speaker 1: I mean if yeah, they have J ten cs and

1035
01:08:51,960 --> 01:08:54,439
PL fifteen's okay.

1036
01:08:54,039 --> 01:08:59,680
Speaker 2: Well, okay, so the PL fifteen go look up you

1037
01:08:59,720 --> 01:09:04,960
know on if if your viewers aren't familiar with the

1038
01:09:05,000 --> 01:09:08,600
war zone, which sounds it's a cheesy name, but it's

1039
01:09:08,600 --> 01:09:14,000
some of the absolute best open, open source intelligence on

1040
01:09:14,159 --> 01:09:17,640
the web. It's it's and go read about the PL

1041
01:09:17,720 --> 01:09:20,640
fifteen and and that means they're in line for the

1042
01:09:20,680 --> 01:09:24,720
PL sixteen, which is also in production but not being

1043
01:09:24,800 --> 01:09:30,600
let out outside of China at this point. Very capable

1044
01:09:30,960 --> 01:09:40,159
weapon systems, very capable. And again, you just can't. Again,

1045
01:09:40,319 --> 01:09:44,359
you can play this ideological game that the US is

1046
01:09:44,399 --> 01:09:47,079
going to wash its hands and we're going to be

1047
01:09:47,119 --> 01:09:51,960
over here. But the problem is because of communication, because

1048
01:09:52,000 --> 01:09:57,520
of travel, because of commerce, and certain amounts of all

1049
01:09:57,560 --> 01:10:05,840
those things are just necessary for life. Not globalist, not homogenization,

1050
01:10:06,079 --> 01:10:10,399
not cosmopolitanism, but you know, a certain amount of those

1051
01:10:10,399 --> 01:10:12,960
things because of the reality of those things. It's an

1052
01:10:12,960 --> 01:10:17,199
interconnected world. You just got to live in reality. Again.

1053
01:10:17,640 --> 01:10:22,399
Can we move towards a more nationalist standpoint where we're

1054
01:10:22,520 --> 01:10:25,520
more concerned about our own citizens in our own backyard.

1055
01:10:25,560 --> 01:10:28,199
I mean, heck, let's deal with how we're going to

1056
01:10:28,239 --> 01:10:32,279
deal with Mexico, Venezuela and Cuba. That's I would like

1057
01:10:32,319 --> 01:10:35,319
that to be a priority. But you can't leave. You

1058
01:10:35,359 --> 01:10:41,000
can't just you can't just you can't just carte blanche. Uh,

1059
01:10:42,039 --> 01:10:52,640
leave the leave that mess that we created behind.

1060
01:10:50,560 --> 01:10:55,800
Speaker 1: You know, and I would love for our interest in

1061
01:10:55,920 --> 01:10:59,119
this to not be happening. At the same time that

1062
01:10:59,199 --> 01:11:02,279
APEC pretty much which owns every politician in the country.

1063
01:11:02,560 --> 01:11:04,319
But it just it is what it is.

1064
01:11:04,680 --> 01:11:07,159
Speaker 2: Well, you've got you've just got a huge you've got

1065
01:11:07,159 --> 01:11:11,279
a huge population of Jews here, and so you're gonna

1066
01:11:11,319 --> 01:11:14,520
have to now do the two and a half to

1067
01:11:14,520 --> 01:11:17,600
two point seven percent whatever it is somewhere in that area.

1068
01:11:18,159 --> 01:11:22,159
Do they exercise way too much political clout compared to

1069
01:11:22,199 --> 01:11:25,920
the Christian majority or the or the you know, the

1070
01:11:25,920 --> 01:11:26,880
rest of the people.

1071
01:11:27,239 --> 01:11:31,760
Speaker 1: Absolutely, a lot of the Christians, the majority of Christians

1072
01:11:31,880 --> 01:11:34,920
are one hundred percent behind them. Yeah. Well, my friend Jeremy,

1073
01:11:35,239 --> 01:11:37,640
my friend Jeremy ra Hammon, who wrote Obstacle to Peace,

1074
01:11:37,680 --> 01:11:41,720
which is a great book on Israel, Gaza said that

1075
01:11:42,600 --> 01:11:45,399
when it comes down to it, you don't even need

1076
01:11:45,479 --> 01:11:48,359
a pack, you just need all these Christians who've bought

1077
01:11:48,359 --> 01:11:51,439
into the last two this false theology of.

1078
01:11:51,439 --> 01:11:56,199
Speaker 2: The last dispensational framework. Yeah we can. Yeah, now you're

1079
01:11:56,239 --> 01:12:02,000
getting in my wheelhouse, but uh, it is you know,

1080
01:12:04,039 --> 01:12:07,840
and Whitney, you're familiar with Whitney Webb. I'm sure you are. Uh.

1081
01:12:07,880 --> 01:12:10,319
You know, Whitney wrote a great article a couple of

1082
01:12:10,439 --> 01:12:15,199
years ago that really focused on Pompeo and and that

1083
01:12:15,359 --> 01:12:21,000
crowd really stoking a lot of that too, really nasty

1084
01:12:21,119 --> 01:12:27,399
kind of stuff. Uh there's a you know, Bagbee does

1085
01:12:27,399 --> 01:12:30,279
a great reading. I think that's on YouTube of Whitney's.

1086
01:12:31,880 --> 01:12:34,399
Speaker 1: Burden has played that on his on his channel.

1087
01:12:34,720 --> 01:12:38,239
Speaker 2: Has Jay Okay, well, I love Jay. What a great Jason,

1088
01:12:38,319 --> 01:12:43,479
dear friend. Doesn't surprise me. But anyway, Uh, you know,

1089
01:12:44,159 --> 01:12:47,640
these are all of these questions that we're talking about

1090
01:12:48,159 --> 01:12:54,000
demand uh, leadership, wisdom and a certain amount of Van

1091
01:12:54,119 --> 01:12:59,800
Guardian noose, so to speak, that you're not going to

1092
01:13:00,159 --> 01:13:03,560
you need the decision maker. You need the person who's

1093
01:13:03,600 --> 01:13:07,680
going to rule the exception and do so in a

1094
01:13:07,720 --> 01:13:12,399
way where the people just see that they're being again

1095
01:13:12,520 --> 01:13:17,520
being protected, being provided, being blessed by. And that's how

1096
01:13:17,560 --> 01:13:21,560
I mean, that's what FDR did. And I don't you know, Fdr,

1097
01:13:23,359 --> 01:13:27,000
I have no time for but you but there was

1098
01:13:27,039 --> 01:13:30,439
your you know again speaking of Anton who talks about

1099
01:13:30,479 --> 01:13:33,800
red versus Blue Caesar, there was your blue Caesar. You know,

1100
01:13:34,079 --> 01:13:37,960
FDR mad remade the nation in his image and we're

1101
01:13:38,000 --> 01:13:41,680
still dealing with it. So it's not like this hasn't

1102
01:13:41,720 --> 01:13:44,760
been done before. It's just a matter of exerting the

1103
01:13:44,800 --> 01:13:46,199
political will to do so.

1104
01:13:48,640 --> 01:13:51,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it does all come back to will. You know.

1105
01:13:53,640 --> 01:13:57,479
I immediately when I started learning about bou Kelly, I

1106
01:13:57,560 --> 01:13:59,760
tried to find out everything I could about him. And

1107
01:14:00,479 --> 01:14:02,720
it's remarkable how they tried to keep him out of

1108
01:14:02,720 --> 01:14:06,640
office and tried to keep him from running for president

1109
01:14:07,399 --> 01:14:10,600
and he was able to form a party at the

1110
01:14:10,680 --> 01:14:14,560
last minute, and it was it's absolutely crazy. That's will.

1111
01:14:15,199 --> 01:14:17,960
And I think what you're seeing now is will. And

1112
01:14:18,880 --> 01:14:25,159
I don't know that Trump has the will to do

1113
01:14:25,479 --> 01:14:28,279
everything that he's doing. I think he is the executive,

1114
01:14:28,800 --> 01:14:33,159
but I think, like all good executives, he is deferring

1115
01:14:33,199 --> 01:14:36,439
to people around him, and it's the people around him

1116
01:14:36,439 --> 01:14:39,279
who have the will to do this. And I think,

1117
01:14:39,520 --> 01:14:42,840
you know, one of the great one of the great

1118
01:14:42,880 --> 01:14:46,760
things about this is if you remember, in the last

1119
01:14:46,760 --> 01:14:50,720
ten years, the term weaponized autism has has been out there,

1120
01:14:51,199 --> 01:14:55,960
and what Musk has done is he's weaponized autism. He's

1121
01:14:55,960 --> 01:15:00,560
brought in all of these kids who are they're probably

1122
01:15:00,560 --> 01:15:04,399
not ideological in the least, well maybe big Balls is

1123
01:15:04,680 --> 01:15:06,560
considering some of his tweets, but.

1124
01:15:08,760 --> 01:15:11,279
Speaker 2: The uh beautiful, so beautiful.

1125
01:15:12,039 --> 01:15:14,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, just having just getting leftists to have to say

1126
01:15:14,600 --> 01:15:16,600
that on TV, or even.

1127
01:15:16,359 --> 01:15:19,159
Speaker 2: The normy conservatives that I you know, I have to

1128
01:15:19,199 --> 01:15:21,840
swim through a lot of that. It's hilarious.

1129
01:15:23,039 --> 01:15:25,720
Speaker 1: But he's brought all these kids in who you know,

1130
01:15:25,760 --> 01:15:28,640
are just like, Okay, show us what we need to

1131
01:15:28,720 --> 01:15:31,479
do and we will get the job done. We will

1132
01:15:31,560 --> 01:15:34,079
root all of this out, you know, and you know

1133
01:15:34,279 --> 01:15:37,399
the leftists are just they're great. You know, like a

1134
01:15:37,520 --> 01:15:40,079
nineteen year old or a twenty two year old or

1135
01:15:40,079 --> 01:15:42,600
a twenty four year old should have nothing to do

1136
01:15:42,760 --> 01:15:46,439
with with national politics, yet like a five year old

1137
01:15:46,479 --> 01:15:48,840
can choose what gender they are and whether they can start,

1138
01:15:48,880 --> 01:15:53,199
you know, basically castrating themselves. I mean, these people are

1139
01:15:53,399 --> 01:15:57,039
just utter scum and they need to be defeated. And

1140
01:15:59,319 --> 01:16:04,279
I don't know that that is a goal. But I

1141
01:16:04,319 --> 01:16:07,159
think as this goes on more and more and the

1142
01:16:07,239 --> 01:16:11,399
reaction becomes more of what it is, I think maybe people,

1143
01:16:11,800 --> 01:16:14,079
maybe people who are in there, are going to start

1144
01:16:14,119 --> 01:16:15,119
to realize.

1145
01:16:14,720 --> 01:16:19,800
Speaker 2: That mm hmmm, mm hmmm. Yeah. Well just even the

1146
01:16:20,439 --> 01:16:24,199
even among the populace among the Holy POLOI you're seeing

1147
01:16:24,239 --> 01:16:30,119
a huge this the popular the popular popularity of Trump

1148
01:16:30,279 --> 01:16:36,640
is growing daily. People again, people love a champion, people

1149
01:16:36,640 --> 01:16:39,960
love a winner, but people love the guy who they

1150
01:16:40,039 --> 01:16:44,840
know is on their side. So it's again, I'm very encouraged.

1151
01:16:45,680 --> 01:16:50,239
Uh I know that there will be you know, things

1152
01:16:50,239 --> 01:16:55,159
could go sideways. He might do something out of his

1153
01:16:55,279 --> 01:17:00,640
gut that that is hackneyed or a little offer not

1154
01:17:00,760 --> 01:17:04,199
quite thought through, or even against some of the things

1155
01:17:04,239 --> 01:17:08,199
we think are good and right. Hopefully he's earned the

1156
01:17:08,279 --> 01:17:12,119
great the to be viewed, to be given the benefit

1157
01:17:12,159 --> 01:17:18,079
of the doubt and be given great grace because the

1158
01:17:18,079 --> 01:17:23,159
the the fortitude he's shown to do, I mean, the

1159
01:17:23,159 --> 01:17:31,359
the affirmative action executive order alone, I'm surprised that's not

1160
01:17:31,520 --> 01:17:38,880
being that's not leading every podcast almost because nobody, you know,

1161
01:17:39,439 --> 01:17:43,880
Reagan thought about it for about five minutes and everybody's like, no, no, no,

1162
01:17:43,960 --> 01:17:48,319
you're not touching that. Uh So the intestine, the fortitude

1163
01:17:48,359 --> 01:17:51,319
to do that is pretty impressive. But but the list

1164
01:17:51,479 --> 01:17:57,000
just goes on and on and on. You know, functionally

1165
01:17:57,119 --> 01:18:01,359
we've got our say back with the Panamaica. Now, functionally

1166
01:18:01,520 --> 01:18:03,760
we don't and we don't have to have soldiers down

1167
01:18:03,800 --> 01:18:06,239
there protecting it. You're going to do what we're going

1168
01:18:06,319 --> 01:18:07,720
to tell you to do. I mean, we've created a

1169
01:18:07,760 --> 01:18:13,239
sat trappy down there. May that, you know, may that

1170
01:18:14,079 --> 01:18:19,600
strategy again extend to the rest of at least Central America,

1171
01:18:19,600 --> 01:18:23,520
if not all of get to a lot of Latin

1172
01:18:23,560 --> 01:18:26,640
America on the same page, it would be good.

1173
01:18:29,119 --> 01:18:32,680
Speaker 1: I think it's interesting that really their only fight now

1174
01:18:33,319 --> 01:18:37,560
is that either democracy is being destroyed or the rule

1175
01:18:37,600 --> 01:18:42,359
of law is being destroyed. And James Kirkpatrick greg Hood

1176
01:18:42,359 --> 01:18:45,560
I thought his uh, he had the best tweet about it.

1177
01:18:45,640 --> 01:18:48,319
He said, the role of law ended about twenty million

1178
01:18:48,319 --> 01:18:50,800
illegal immigrants ago. We're not doing this anymore.

1179
01:18:51,279 --> 01:18:56,960
Speaker 2: Mm. Yeah. And it's it's it's always the rule of men,

1180
01:18:58,399 --> 01:19:04,199
you know, it just is law can help if you've discovered,

1181
01:19:04,279 --> 01:19:08,079
as opposed to created good law, you can have it

1182
01:19:08,239 --> 01:19:10,720
guide you. It functions the same way a lock on

1183
01:19:10,800 --> 01:19:16,479
your door front door does. It keeps hopefully you know,

1184
01:19:16,640 --> 01:19:20,600
keeps honest people honest. But it doesn't do a whole

1185
01:19:20,680 --> 01:19:23,840
lot more than that. You still got to have Again,

1186
01:19:23,880 --> 01:19:31,199
I'm sounding like Aristotle here, but you need you need virtue, maturity, morality,

1187
01:19:31,319 --> 01:19:37,640
all those things that or you're you're up a really

1188
01:19:37,680 --> 01:19:43,199
bad creak. I'm about I'm about running out. I'm gonna

1189
01:19:43,520 --> 01:19:45,680
I'm gonna have to I don't want to bail, but

1190
01:19:46,039 --> 01:19:47,319
probably another five minutes.

1191
01:19:48,359 --> 01:19:50,760
Speaker 1: Oh, no problem, no problem, I'll let you get out

1192
01:19:50,800 --> 01:19:53,720
of here. Yeah, it's just interesting that Aristotle was telling

1193
01:19:54,039 --> 01:19:56,239
saying that you have to have a Christian society before

1194
01:19:56,960 --> 01:19:57,640
before Christ.

1195
01:19:57,960 --> 01:20:01,479
Speaker 2: Okay, let's finish with this, because this is I've got

1196
01:20:01,600 --> 01:20:04,520
to I've got to hear. This is awesome. Pete Agay,

1197
01:20:04,560 --> 01:20:07,680
I've got a huge so I write for American Reformer,

1198
01:20:07,800 --> 01:20:09,720
not just for an American Reformer. They just happened to

1199
01:20:09,720 --> 01:20:12,840
pick up all my most of my stuff got about

1200
01:20:12,880 --> 01:20:16,119
a thirty page. It's kind of a scholarly bit on

1201
01:20:17,439 --> 01:20:21,279
the Inner Testamental period. But you know, Plato and Aristotle

1202
01:20:21,800 --> 01:20:26,800
were always on the run. And why well again, look

1203
01:20:26,800 --> 01:20:29,439
at the use of we mentioned earlier, this strange term,

1204
01:20:29,479 --> 01:20:32,319
this dikaia sune. That they used the same language that

1205
01:20:32,359 --> 01:20:37,199
the apostle Paul used in the New Testament. Uh, they

1206
01:20:37,199 --> 01:20:43,399
were rejecting the they were rejecting the pantheon and on

1207
01:20:43,479 --> 01:20:45,720
the run because of it, because it was the pantheon

1208
01:20:45,800 --> 01:20:48,119
that kind of help that, in the view of the

1209
01:20:48,119 --> 01:20:51,319
old timers, held that society together. And they were both

1210
01:20:51,560 --> 01:20:56,439
realizing that there was this unmoved mover, this this one source,

1211
01:20:57,199 --> 01:21:02,479
this alien source of truth that was that was behind

1212
01:21:02,680 --> 01:21:09,840
all things. You know, we don't have Aristotle's exoteric writings anymore,

1213
01:21:09,840 --> 01:21:11,840
those are all lost, but we have quotations from them.

1214
01:21:11,880 --> 01:21:17,359
And Cicero quotes Aristotle in this beautiful passage where he

1215
01:21:17,399 --> 01:21:19,399
talks about the farmer going up and looking at the

1216
01:21:19,439 --> 01:21:23,279
sky and comprehending its beauty at night with all the stars,

1217
01:21:23,600 --> 01:21:28,680
and being humbled knowing that something much greater than him

1218
01:21:28,720 --> 01:21:33,680
personally created all that, and being being convicted by the

1219
01:21:33,680 --> 01:21:36,159
beauty of it that there was in a sense of

1220
01:21:36,199 --> 01:21:40,760
holiness there. And so I think Plato and Aristotle were

1221
01:21:40,920 --> 01:21:45,119
in a sense some kind of you know, gentile prophets

1222
01:21:45,199 --> 01:21:49,960
that were pointing the way. Look, Aristotle inspired Alexander in

1223
01:21:50,039 --> 01:21:54,039
some way to conquer the entirety of the known world

1224
01:21:54,640 --> 01:21:57,159
at that point in time, give them a common language.

1225
01:21:57,239 --> 01:22:01,239
And it was by that common language that the you know,

1226
01:22:01,399 --> 01:22:09,039
this this gospel of this nas nasbarene king spread all

1227
01:22:09,079 --> 01:22:14,079
throughout the world. And what's really interesting, so Alexander obviously

1228
01:22:14,159 --> 01:22:20,239
from Macedonia, son of Philip of Macedon. The Paul has

1229
01:22:20,319 --> 01:22:24,199
this interesting vision in the Book of Acts where he

1230
01:22:24,279 --> 01:22:28,159
has a dream and the man, a man from Macedonia,

1231
01:22:28,199 --> 01:22:30,520
appears in his dream and beckons and says, come bring

1232
01:22:30,560 --> 01:22:34,159
this gospel and gospel this Greek word and gaelion, which

1233
01:22:34,199 --> 01:22:39,319
literally means a royal announcement, Come bring this to my people. Now,

1234
01:22:39,319 --> 01:22:41,680
in the ancient world, there would have been only one

1235
01:22:41,760 --> 01:22:45,760
man who the readers would have understood that being so,

1236
01:22:45,960 --> 01:22:49,039
was it Alexander himself appearing in a dream to the

1237
01:22:49,079 --> 01:22:52,239
apostle Paul as a result of the teaching of Plato

1238
01:22:52,239 --> 01:22:56,359
and Aristotle. It's something interesting to think about. So you

1239
01:22:56,439 --> 01:23:00,880
mentioned Aristotle preaching these Christian things before or they were

1240
01:23:00,920 --> 01:23:04,840
ever written or thought of. I think you're onto something.

1241
01:23:04,600 --> 01:23:10,039
Speaker 1: There, all right, Ron, You mentioned American Reformer. Is that

1242
01:23:10,079 --> 01:23:11,640
where people can read your stuff and.

1243
01:23:11,920 --> 01:23:14,239
Speaker 2: Read me an American Reformer. I also have a substack.

1244
01:23:15,279 --> 01:23:20,319
I'm on Twitter and do the occasional podcast as well.

1245
01:23:21,359 --> 01:23:24,680
But yeah, American Reformer and that latest piece that discusses

1246
01:23:24,720 --> 01:23:26,520
those things. It should be coming out in the next

1247
01:23:27,159 --> 01:23:30,399
oh month or so. It's going through editorial. It's long

1248
01:23:30,479 --> 01:23:31,199
so it needs it.

1249
01:23:33,319 --> 01:23:35,560
Speaker 1: Awesome, awesome, Well, going to have you back real soon.

1250
01:23:35,720 --> 01:23:36,760
Thank you, appreciate it.

1251
01:23:36,760 --> 01:24:00,680
Speaker 2: Thanks Pete, appreciate its