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Speaker 1: If you want to get the show early and ad free,

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head on over to the Peak Kinyonas show dot com.

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There you can choose from where you wish to support me.

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Now listen very carefully. I've had some people ask me

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about this, even though I think on the last ad

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I stated it pretty clearly. If you want an RSS feed,

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if you do that, you will get access to the

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audio file. So head on over to the pekan Yonashow

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dot com. You'll see all the ways that you can

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support me there. And I just want to thank everyone.

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It's because of you that I can put out the

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amount of material that I do. I can do what

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I'm doing with doctor Johnson on two hundred Years Together

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and everything else, the things that Thomas and I are

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doing together on Cindinal philosophy, it's all because of you.

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And yeah, I mean, I'll never be able to thank

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you enough.

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Speaker 2: So thank you.

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Speaker 1: The Pekanyonashow dot com. Everything's there. I want to welcome

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everyone back to the peking Yonas Show. I'm here with

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Andy Edwards. Are you doing Andy, I'm very well. Thanks

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for having me.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, first time on the show. You gotta do it.

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Speaker 1: You got to tell everybody a little bit about yourself.

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Speaker 3: Okay, I am I'm gen X, I'm a seventh generation

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Oregonian and I'm a father of three. You know, maybe

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that's enough to start with. Is there anything else that

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you'd like to know? Yeah?

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Speaker 2: Okay, No, that sounds great.

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Speaker 1: You know we can we can get into it because

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we're going to talk about the book that you you wrote,

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King of Dogs. When did you write that? It's been

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out a little while, hasn't it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: It was published in right at the end of twenty nineteen,

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so pretty much twenty twenty, and it had been floating

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around with me since about two thousand and eight. It

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took quite a while to complete, and you know, it

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was a long and we can get into that if

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you want the whole The whole publishing of it was

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was quite a saga.

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Speaker 1: Sure, why don't you tell everybody a little bit about

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your background? Let me ask, were you in the military?

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Speaker 3: No, nope, I'm in the military. No.

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Speaker 2: I uh, okay, I get that.

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Speaker 3: Question a lot, because there's there's a lot of overlap

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in you know, in the details of the book. And

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somewhere around twenty ten or so, when a lot of

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the the GAT guys head were cycling back, civilian training

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became a real thing and you could get and you

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still can, obviously right now, get you know, some of

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the best quality tactical training in the world. I mean,

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I tend to think that there are civilian just dudes,

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you know, computer programmers, salesmen, what have you, that are

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running around America that if you cobbled them together, you know,

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there's skill sets far exceed probably you know, many militaries

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around the world. So I did. I had the opportunity,

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I got really lucky to dip into a ton of training.

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So you know, a lot of that was guns, a

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lot of it was just more survival tracking these types

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of things. And like I say, it comes up a

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lot just because it's it's a you know, you read

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the book, it's a big piece of it.

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Speaker 2: Why write a book?

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Speaker 1: So, you know, my idea, if I was ever to

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write a book would be probably humors to tell everybody

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what I you know, how smart I am trying and

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explain how smart I am to everyone, and you know

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what I've learned over the year, and try to distill

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it down into something that pretty much anyone could read,

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but still while trying to sound like the smartest guy

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in the room. But that's not usually not fiction. When

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someone writes fiction, they're usually doing it for a reason.

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So why why write fiction?

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Speaker 3: That is a good question. Not for the money. I'll

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tell you that it's it's not. I think that. I mean,

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I think about this a fair bit because you know,

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I'm pushing fifty and this is the life path that

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I'm committed to, and I committed to it way back

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in about two thousand and two, when like the prevailing

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wisdom was, you know kind of head your you have

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two options, like you can you can hedge your bets

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and ryan be like a professor or something like that,

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or you can just burn the ships. No plan B.

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And as far as I could tell, starting out, like

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the only the only people who really pulled it off

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by pulling it up, I mean, wrote a novel that

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was really worth your time were those that didn't have

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a plan B. And that's like a tough thing to

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to sell to like a prospective wife or your parents

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or or you know. In many ways, Pete, I would

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not recommend this to most people. And you hear this,

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you know, and like established, well established novelists will will

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tell people like you should really be you should really

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question your motives. And that's not to make it too

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grandiosa thing. I mean, in the end, it's just stories.

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But what what motivated me, I think was a combination

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of something true, like a belief in the medium, a

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belief in literature, those sorts of kind of high minded ideals,

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and then another aspect, which is just purely you kind

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of come around to like, well, I don't know that

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I can do much else, so and then it turns

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out that a lot of novelists will actually support this idea.

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It kind of occurs to you at a certain point. Well,

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I'm not a lawyer, I'm not a pro athlete. I

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love movies, I love books. Could I take a shot

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at this and along the way, it's you know, like

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I say, it's quite a it's quite a journey. Like

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I'm pretty happy with the way with the course I've taken,

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though it's been extremely difficult in ways that I could

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not have imagined, which is like any you know sort

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of journey or.

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Speaker 2: Saga.

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Speaker 3: I mean you start out like, yeah, I can do this,

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and then about halfway through it's like, man, I'm not

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sure I.

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Speaker 2: Can do this.

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Speaker 3: Then that sort of rolls over into into its own

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internal element. Well, you better find a way to do this, Andy,

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because this is what you're committed to. And I know

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that's kind of an odd answer. It's not maybe you know,

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a singular thing. It would be very hard for me

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to isolate one reason why a guy would do this,

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because you're not just going to say, hey I want

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to change culture or hey I want to get rich.

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None of those make any sense. There are much more

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direct paths to do those things, and so it really

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ends up being a strange catch all of of like

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internal and external motivations. I think.

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Speaker 1: We'll get into the you know, like themes of what

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you wrote about but you dedicate you dedicated it to

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your son. Yeah, are those overarching themes in there?

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Speaker 2: Is that? Why? Is is there a connection there?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? Yeah, there's there are Number one. I think that

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in trying to understand, going back to your earlier question,

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why would a guy do this? I remember as a

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kid I grew up you know in mostly in the eighties,

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and I would see my dad work a long day,

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you know, have dinner, come home, and then apply himself

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to a book, you know, lay in bed and read

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a book, or lay on the couch read a book.

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And I think, looking back on it, there was something

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about him doing that that probably led me to believe, like,

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this is more important than just drinking beer or maybe

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catching up on sleep or even you know, maybe other

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things you could have been doing. But I think it

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starts there where there's like a circuit, you know, between

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father and son, and I'll skip through, you know, some

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of the some of the details of my own personal

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life to say that now I am. I have been

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incredibly lucky. I have three sons young, you know, all

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under the age of five. And you know, I've been

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in this thing that we're all in, you know, our

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thing as we call it, since maybe twenty ten, and

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so it's been a while that I've been looking out

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at the landscape in America and saying, what are the

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prospects or you know, for three you know, above average intelligence,

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white guys with blonde hair. And it's looking better right now.

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But I mean when I was writing most of this

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in you know, say, twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen, like things

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were not looking at good. And so I think that

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part of the motivation with fiction in general. And again

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I don't mean to be too high minded about this stuff,

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but it's kind of like you're trying to reach beyond

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normal sort of topical life and yank something back to give.

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Because if you as the reader, you know, maybe you

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listen to the book, it's ten to fifteen hours of

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your life. And so if my presumption is like, yeah,

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what I'm giving you is worth it, I think that

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entertainment is just fine. Like I love, you know, sort

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of profane stuff as much as the next guy. But

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if you're going to take a stab at it for real,

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which is what my intention was, I feel like you

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got to bring something back, and if I did, it

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does relate to this father son type of circuit, like

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what is our responsibility? How do we and not just

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to my boy, but how do I or my boys,

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you know, how do I honor my father as well

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and my grandfather?

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Speaker 1: And well, in the book, you're basically describing like a

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crumbling American empire, chaos, rural areas or can be untouched

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but still you're getting encroaching threats from, you know, like

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merks and cartels. Is that what you saw at the time,

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is that what you felt was coming, and that's why

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you were writing about it.

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Speaker 3: It seemed, it seemed, it still seems like a distinct possibility,

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and it always has. And I think that maybe again

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going back to one question previously, being in this thing

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of ours for quite a while and seeing some ups

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and downs and seeing trends come and go a little bit,

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you know, the iould remember being a little bit worried

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when I put the novel out that people would sort

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of associate it with like, uh, prepper level sorts of concerns, fantasy,

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and and that I think that the unfortunate facts maybe

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of our situation are such that, like, while things look

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to be on the upswing right now, they're still incredibly tenuous. Probably,

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And I don't I could never. I did my best,

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honestly with King of Dogs to try and think what

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what maybe could happen, you know, like, is it is

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it realistic that like say, Mexican cartels are just going

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to overrun America? Well? Now, probably not what's realistic? And

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I ended up kind of arriving at what you're what

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you're describing there where it's a mixed landscape of of

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just general chaos, where there's there's not a lot to

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turn on or turn to, but you also don't have

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that almost like a relief valve to say, well, it's

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obviously the apocalypse and I could probably just phone this

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in and quit, like everyone's gonna die anyway. There's a

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novel you know, most people are probably familiar with the

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Road by Cormick McCarthy. He has this bit at the

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beginning where the main protagonist, who else is also a father,

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describes his wife, the mother of their son, essentially you know,

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coming to him and saying there's no hope. It's total

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despair and while I love you guys, and you know,

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I'm done, and she just kind of disappears into the

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night and it's left to the father in the most

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dramatic of possible circumstances are like kind of stark circumstances

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to determine, okay, well is she right? Like, you know,

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I don't know what you're you're cussing if I can

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use swear words, but I think it's okay, you know,

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do you just say fuck it? Yeah? Fuck it? I mean,

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do you just say fuck it at that point? And I,

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you know, I think the sad thing is that a

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lot of people actually do will would in those circumstances

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either bring themselves around to admit, like, yeah, fuck it,

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or find a way to sort of justify it along

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the way and effectively also saying fuck it. But I'm

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I think that I look down on that. You know,

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I can't. It's hard for me to empathize with that.

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And I empathize more with the guy who's going to say,

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despite every odd whatever the odds are, I am going

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to put one more one step in front of another

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and keep going. And you know, there's also the element

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of I got to kind of make it an interesting

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book for people to get through, so.

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Speaker 1: Well before we start getting into like characters, and I'll

240
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try to make some para. You know, ask you about parallels.

241
00:16:38,559 --> 00:16:42,000
It really seems like water rights and like corporate mery,

242
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you know, like corporate mercenaries or something that you're concerned with,

243
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or at least at the time you were writing this,

244
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you're concerned with. I don't know if you saw this,

245
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but Newsweek is reporting that a Chinese millionaire, like one

246
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of the Wall test men in China just bought up

247
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a ton of acreage in New Hampshire, which just so

248
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happens to have the reservoir that basically provides water to

249
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the whole state. So you're, what, you know, your main

250
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two of your main themes, and there were water rights

251
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and corporate like corporate mercenaries. So I mean, that's something

252
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I think we've been thinking a lot of us have

253
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been thinking about for a while, and I guess that

254
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was going to have to make it in there, right, Yeah.

255
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Speaker 3: I you know, the corporate mercenary thing. Like I gather

256
00:17:40,799 --> 00:17:44,680
you're you're kind of like myself. We sort of went through, uh,

257
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maybe a libertarian phase where you know, does this make sense?

258
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And I I don't know entirely where I would stand

259
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on it other than to say maybe it is situational

260
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to some extent at this point. But that said, I mean,

261
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I there was no one in particular that I was

262
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thinking of, like I would never I joke actually a

263
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lot that if I can get this thing made into

264
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a movie, I happen to be just for whatever reasons,

265
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mutuals on X with with Eric Prince, and I would

266
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if I would almost try to insist that he play

267
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a role, you know, like a cameo. I think it'd

268
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be hilarious to have him on there because he gets

269
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he gets such a bad rap. But so setting him

270
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aside just so we know, I'm not like really at

271
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all targeting him, you know, And I know that there

272
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are going to be some serious shitbags out there that

273
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and I tried to complicate it a little bit in

274
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the novel by making it more of an international corpate entity,

275
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which I actually I think is more likely, you know,

276
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I mean, what is the U n You know, there's

277
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probably an argument we can make where in the end

278
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this is this is substantially a corporate sort of body

279
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that just wants to process things and it has you know,

280
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it doesn't care about human rights or ear legalities or

281
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anything like that. And with the with the water rights,

282
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I like I said, I'm a seventh generation or Agonian.

283
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I think that sort of just bled in from being

284
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out here and being on ranches and such. Ah, it's

285
00:19:41,079 --> 00:19:43,799
a big deal, you know. I I there's plenty of

286
00:19:43,799 --> 00:19:46,880
people who are still shooting dudes, you know, their neighbors

287
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out here on occasion over over some little dispute. And

288
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if we did come to a point where where law

289
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and order or the American way, you know, the projections

290
00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:07,839
that we we've seen come and go about Balkanization of America,

291
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which still seems entirely possible to me in some ways.

292
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If that were to play out, you know, the people

293
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who who don't have water and are relying on elaborate

294
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you know, legal mechanisms and deals and payoffs and all

295
00:20:25,079 --> 00:20:28,960
that shit would break down, I would imagine, and you know,

296
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force would would assert itself as well. I tried to

297
00:20:33,559 --> 00:20:41,440
sort of insert maybe like an insinuation that there would

298
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be you know, there may be a technical need for water,

299
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there may be certain certain entities there that and you know,

300
00:20:52,839 --> 00:20:57,680
I'm not a computer guy. Really maybe they've solved the

301
00:20:57,759 --> 00:21:02,480
you know, the cooling issues where with these these data centers.

302
00:21:02,519 --> 00:21:06,680
But a lot of times with fiction, I think that

303
00:21:06,759 --> 00:21:10,680
if you can allude to these things without totally committing it,

304
00:21:10,839 --> 00:21:16,720
sometimes is it's a better read, you know, for for

305
00:21:16,799 --> 00:21:17,240
the reader?

306
00:21:19,359 --> 00:21:22,279
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I get it. There seems to be a

307
00:21:22,279 --> 00:21:27,720
lot of also spangle Arean themes in there, like uh,

308
00:21:27,839 --> 00:21:33,680
you know, just decline of empires, the cycles and are

309
00:21:33,720 --> 00:21:36,920
you is that Spangler someone you've read in the past

310
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or or am I just reading into that?

311
00:21:39,599 --> 00:21:42,119
Speaker 3: Yeah, I did a little time with them. I'm not

312
00:21:42,240 --> 00:21:46,039
no scholar, you know, I couldn't. I couldn't even I don't.

313
00:21:45,920 --> 00:21:50,319
Speaker 1: Think that there are very few Spangler Squad scholars because

314
00:21:50,680 --> 00:21:51,759
it's difficult reading.

315
00:21:51,880 --> 00:21:55,759
Speaker 3: Yeah it was. I had this. I slogged through stuff

316
00:21:55,799 --> 00:21:58,480
like that anyway. But you know, I go I go

317
00:21:58,640 --> 00:22:02,240
back and forth on this all the time, and I

318
00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:05,559
I make fun of it on on, you know, in

319
00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:12,039
talks and such. Ah. Is it like is it some

320
00:22:12,119 --> 00:22:19,039
sort of metaphysical cycle? Is it just simply yeah? Is

321
00:22:19,079 --> 00:22:24,359
it spiritual? Is it just totally beyond the human capacity

322
00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:27,400
to sort of look at where they're going and say, hey, guys,

323
00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:31,440
let's pump the brakes because shit's starting to break apart

324
00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:33,960
a little, you know, it's getting like like any like

325
00:22:34,039 --> 00:22:36,119
you and I would if we were running a hot

326
00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:38,839
dog stand or something and we weren't making numbers, we'd

327
00:22:38,880 --> 00:22:41,400
be like, hey, let's go have a beer and see

328
00:22:41,440 --> 00:22:45,519
what we're doing wrong. And a lot of the excuses

329
00:22:45,559 --> 00:22:49,599
for that, you know, well, it's it's scale, and it's

330
00:22:51,799 --> 00:22:55,279
they're understandable to a degree, Like like the arguments about

331
00:22:55,319 --> 00:23:01,119
globalism being this this hyper vulnerable. So with all it's

332
00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:05,799
not you know, as they say, robust or what have you. Yeah,

333
00:23:05,839 --> 00:23:10,839
that makes sense, and and there are a lot of good,

334
00:23:11,079 --> 00:23:14,240
good explanations, but I don't know that I I could

335
00:23:14,279 --> 00:23:17,359
really subscribe to any of them. I'm I'm just sort

336
00:23:17,359 --> 00:23:21,799
of always I'm looking at it, you know, I look

337
00:23:21,839 --> 00:23:24,799
at the world like a man. Why do we have

338
00:23:24,839 --> 00:23:26,960
to funck this up so much? You know, like this

339
00:23:27,039 --> 00:23:29,880
doesn't seem like it should be that hard, and I

340
00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:36,839
know it is. But uh, yeah, So with Spangler, I mean,

341
00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:39,400
he makes some great points, but I don't know that

342
00:23:39,480 --> 00:23:43,359
the like the Dorian arc or you know, his various

343
00:23:43,480 --> 00:23:48,920
ideas about architecture or whatever. It's like, yeah, I can

344
00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:51,880
see that there's something there, a nice observation on his part,

345
00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:58,079
but I just don't see how I'm not satisfied entirely

346
00:23:58,440 --> 00:24:03,000
with with those sort of totally intellectual explanations. So I

347
00:24:03,079 --> 00:24:06,559
do tend to sort of wind up more on the

348
00:24:06,599 --> 00:24:12,319
spiritual side of it, which is again a thing. In

349
00:24:12,400 --> 00:24:14,960
King of Dogs, that's kind of I worked very hard

350
00:24:15,079 --> 00:24:21,279
to not. While I wanted to make my hero explicitly Christian,

351
00:24:21,359 --> 00:24:24,960
I also wanted to make him very complicated, which is

352
00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:27,160
how how I am. And you know, a lot of

353
00:24:28,839 --> 00:24:33,799
probably your friends and mine are are their relationship with

354
00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:39,400
Christianity in particular, or or whatever religion. It's complicated, it's

355
00:24:39,400 --> 00:24:41,480
not it's not entire We don't we just don't have

356
00:24:41,599 --> 00:24:46,240
the context anymore, the social capital to rely on these

357
00:24:46,279 --> 00:24:50,799
types of like uh, feedback loops where it's like Pete,

358
00:24:50,839 --> 00:24:54,079
you have faith, yeah, and you have faith. Yeah, Okay,

359
00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:58,519
let's let's let's go. We're just we're just mired in

360
00:24:58,759 --> 00:25:01,079
so much like uncertain to you all the time that

361
00:25:02,960 --> 00:25:05,440
it was very important that I try and try and

362
00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:14,319
sort of convey that and and also convey without being

363
00:25:14,359 --> 00:25:18,799
overwhelming that my read on the world at least is

364
00:25:18,839 --> 00:25:23,039
that there are many many forces in play. And I

365
00:25:23,079 --> 00:25:25,759
you know, I'm sure you tuned into our pal you know,

366
00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:33,799
last night Darryl and Tucker two masters, I mean, probably

367
00:25:33,799 --> 00:25:37,920
the best in the game. And I think that both

368
00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:39,839
of them do a good ship. They did a really

369
00:25:39,880 --> 00:25:43,960
great job actually of eluding, like covering all the facts

370
00:25:44,079 --> 00:25:49,480
meticulously so well while also allowing for there and I

371
00:25:49,480 --> 00:25:52,319
don't mean to read too much into what they said,

372
00:25:52,319 --> 00:25:56,039
but I think that both of them share this idea

373
00:25:56,119 --> 00:26:00,519
that there are other forces at play, and some of

374
00:26:00,559 --> 00:26:04,119
those are our evil and some of them are good.

375
00:26:05,839 --> 00:26:07,880
Speaker 1: I think it plays out in everything in life, you know,

376
00:26:07,880 --> 00:26:10,519
when you when you look at like our the administration

377
00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:13,759
right now, it's very easy to see that there are

378
00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:18,279
different factions vying for power, and there's always different factions

379
00:26:18,359 --> 00:26:20,359
vying for power. And if that's the way it is

380
00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:23,039
in the uh, in the real world, in this way,

381
00:26:23,079 --> 00:26:24,839
it's going to be in the spiritual world. It's just

382
00:26:24,920 --> 00:26:28,400
going to everything is a mirror. Everything down here is

383
00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:31,720
a mirror of what's happening in the world we can't see.

384
00:26:31,920 --> 00:26:35,640
Speaker 3: So absolutely, yeah, I couldn't agree more.

385
00:26:36,640 --> 00:26:37,000
Speaker 2: Yeah.

386
00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:39,880
Speaker 1: So, yeah, that was the next question I was going

387
00:26:39,960 --> 00:26:43,119
to be is whenever anybody writes a main character, it's

388
00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:45,599
always somebody they're close to or it's them. I guess

389
00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:48,680
Grayson is a representative of you in some way.

390
00:26:48,799 --> 00:26:49,799
Speaker 2: Huh.

391
00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:55,839
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, I mean there there are there are parts

392
00:26:55,880 --> 00:27:00,880
that are definitely lifted right out of like everything in

393
00:27:00,920 --> 00:27:04,480
the book is is ultimate. There there are some characters

394
00:27:05,039 --> 00:27:07,839
that I think I maybe I have done a better

395
00:27:07,920 --> 00:27:12,680
job of of I don't know what the term is,

396
00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:15,640
but like writing beyond myself, maybe not not just kind

397
00:27:15,640 --> 00:27:22,640
of sinking to this. But in his case, i'd have

398
00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:25,400
to cop to that. Pete, I'd have to say a

399
00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:30,680
lot of his motivations and the way that he behaves

400
00:27:30,799 --> 00:27:35,079
are yeah, things that I believe in, you know, back

401
00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:39,079
to the to the pedo thing. But I don't mean

402
00:27:39,160 --> 00:27:42,880
to you know, jump around on any outlines you have,

403
00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:45,759
But this plays a part in King of Dogs. I mean,

404
00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:51,559
I'm absolutely of the belief that that is. That's not

405
00:27:51,799 --> 00:27:56,880
just like, oh, you know, they need to be punished.

406
00:27:56,960 --> 00:28:02,200
I mean I think they need to be ah, they

407
00:28:02,240 --> 00:28:05,359
need to be executed publicly in the most like brutal

408
00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:09,079
possible way. And I have no problem copying to that.

409
00:28:09,119 --> 00:28:15,039
I really think that that's how as a father, again,

410
00:28:15,119 --> 00:28:18,480
you know, with all of the stuff constantly swirling in

411
00:28:18,559 --> 00:28:24,319
our in our like public lives and what have you,

412
00:28:24,319 --> 00:28:26,960
you kind of I have to think about these things,

413
00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:28,960
just like any father would. I guess, like, well, if

414
00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:31,200
I'm put in this situation, what exactly am I going

415
00:28:31,240 --> 00:28:37,160
to do? And uh, you know, I'm not going to

416
00:28:37,319 --> 00:28:39,920
talk about what I'm going to do. But you know,

417
00:28:40,519 --> 00:28:43,160
just as well as the next guy listening, I think

418
00:28:43,160 --> 00:28:45,440
that's how it has how it always had to be

419
00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:51,440
handled and that's how you know. There you go back

420
00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:56,200
to the how why is that so difficult for us

421
00:28:56,240 --> 00:29:00,440
to work? Because for a while, like shit, everybody from

422
00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:03,480
the judge to the DA to the dad or the

423
00:29:03,519 --> 00:29:06,799
family involved in these horrible things, they knew what the

424
00:29:06,880 --> 00:29:10,960
proper procedure was and it was brutal and swift.

425
00:29:12,920 --> 00:29:16,799
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that was probably the most difficult thing

426
00:29:17,559 --> 00:29:24,400
about listening to that almost three hours yesterday, was knowing

427
00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:27,200
that no one was being held accountable for it. Yeah,

428
00:29:27,240 --> 00:29:36,160
it's just it's just enraging because there was a time when, yeah,

429
00:29:36,279 --> 00:29:38,839
there there were there have been people who've existed in

430
00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:43,400
this world before who knew that that was going on,

431
00:29:46,279 --> 00:29:51,000
accepted that it was going to happen, but also knew

432
00:29:51,039 --> 00:29:53,920
that they would have to be punished, and that they

433
00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:58,599
would have to be punished publicly. And the fact, I

434
00:29:58,640 --> 00:30:01,000
think that probably the worst part of it is is

435
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:05,160
that you and I realize that this has to be

436
00:30:05,200 --> 00:30:11,920
punished publicly in order for it to in order for

437
00:30:12,799 --> 00:30:18,039
in order for people to understand what order is all about.

438
00:30:19,839 --> 00:30:25,759
But then when you listen to exactly what's happening, you

439
00:30:25,839 --> 00:30:31,319
realize that it's not being punished publicly. It's being flaunted

440
00:30:31,759 --> 00:30:39,039
and almost bragged about publicly. Yeah, and what do you know,

441
00:30:41,640 --> 00:30:47,920
I think more than anyone, probably women watching that last

442
00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:50,680
night would probably I would hope they'd be way more

443
00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:52,400
disturbed than we would be.

444
00:30:55,240 --> 00:30:58,640
Speaker 3: I think you're right, I've said, I think that's a

445
00:30:58,680 --> 00:31:03,559
really good point. Actually. You know how in our circles

446
00:31:04,160 --> 00:31:11,920
we're always hearing about the difficulties that that the youngsters

447
00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:15,880
are having with with regard to finding a wife and

448
00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:18,200
a maid and dating game and all of this stuff.

449
00:31:19,240 --> 00:31:21,680
And that's that's an aspect that I don't think it's

450
00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:25,480
touched on enough. Is those guys are in a spot

451
00:31:25,599 --> 00:31:32,640
where and they know this, it's but where if they

452
00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:39,799
take responsibility for the masculine role in its in its

453
00:31:39,920 --> 00:31:48,599
entirety protective, you know. And I I think that vengeance

454
00:31:49,559 --> 00:31:52,039
justice these things. There's kind of a fine line, perhaps,

455
00:31:54,279 --> 00:31:58,319
but that's part of that role. And you're right, So

456
00:31:58,559 --> 00:32:01,480
all of those women who are watching it, and they

457
00:32:01,519 --> 00:32:09,720
have to wonder about the chain of chain of command

458
00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:17,880
or of possession of the responsibility Along the way, how

459
00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:21,799
many hundreds of men you know, passed the buck and

460
00:32:21,839 --> 00:32:26,880
looked the other way, And who could expect those women

461
00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:31,240
then to respect, whether it's a brother or a husband,

462
00:32:31,400 --> 00:32:37,519
or a boss or a coworker or whatever that just

463
00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:42,279
readjusting that one piece would correct. I think all kinds

464
00:32:42,319 --> 00:32:44,960
of things, you know, all kinds of problems that we're having.

465
00:32:47,319 --> 00:32:49,960
I like a lot of I don't know, you know

466
00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:54,119
what your situation is with I don't know if you're

467
00:32:54,119 --> 00:32:58,440
married and have kids or not. But I mean, just okay,

468
00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:04,160
so just protecting your wife is in certain circumstances, you know,

469
00:33:04,359 --> 00:33:07,440
is a thing you have to take seriously. You know,

470
00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:09,559
if you live in a really safe neighborhood, great good

471
00:33:09,559 --> 00:33:13,240
for you. Not everybody does. I don't constantly have to

472
00:33:13,279 --> 00:33:16,839
travel through super safe places. And then you add the

473
00:33:16,839 --> 00:33:21,720
element of children, and it's like it's it's it's a

474
00:33:21,759 --> 00:33:25,119
minor military operation in some ways. If you're taking it

475
00:33:25,200 --> 00:33:28,559
like seriously, you've got I've got to do intelligence, I've

476
00:33:28,599 --> 00:33:31,920
got to do logistics. I've got you know, forget about

477
00:33:31,960 --> 00:33:34,640
snacks and baby you know, diapers and all the other

478
00:33:34,640 --> 00:33:40,759
thing that is so much additional stress that are you know, Frankly,

479
00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:47,839
our forefathers fought and died for again and gave their lives,

480
00:33:47,880 --> 00:33:50,039
even if they were just architects or what have you

481
00:33:50,119 --> 00:33:53,240
to ensure that we wouldn't have to do shit like that,

482
00:33:53,240 --> 00:33:55,640
that that we could have some amount of like a

483
00:33:55,720 --> 00:34:03,039
reasonable opportunity to to be safe and comfortable. I can't.

484
00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:06,079
I mean, you must be right that the women and

485
00:34:06,079 --> 00:34:08,079
then who do they even turn to talk about it?

486
00:34:08,599 --> 00:34:11,320
They're not going to turn to their two Instagram.

487
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:13,800
Speaker 1: That's something else I was going to bring up is

488
00:34:15,039 --> 00:34:17,639
you know a lot of people when I when we

489
00:34:17,719 --> 00:34:21,440
talk about this, talking about my buddy Dee and my

490
00:34:21,480 --> 00:34:25,519
buddy Charles, we do with our friend Jose we do

491
00:34:25,559 --> 00:34:28,679
something called the Thought Crime Syndicate, and d and Charles

492
00:34:28,760 --> 00:34:33,159
have been talking for you know, for almost a decade

493
00:34:33,199 --> 00:34:39,960
now about the fix it. And fix it is not

494
00:34:40,199 --> 00:34:44,760
women stepping up to solve our problems, but it's women

495
00:34:44,920 --> 00:34:48,199
getting to a point in society. And this has happened

496
00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:50,840
in the past where they look at their men and

497
00:34:50,880 --> 00:34:53,599
they go fix it. Don't tell me how you're going

498
00:34:53,639 --> 00:34:56,480
to fix it. Don't come please, don't bring it home

499
00:34:56,519 --> 00:35:01,119
with you, but just go fix it. And we're not

500
00:35:01,239 --> 00:35:06,719
at the fix it yet, So you hope and pray

501
00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:12,440
that shows like that yesterday helped to push the fix

502
00:35:12,519 --> 00:35:16,239
it to get us to that fix it moment, because

503
00:35:16,280 --> 00:35:20,880
when the women say just go fix it, then all

504
00:35:20,920 --> 00:35:21,840
bets are off.

505
00:35:23,599 --> 00:35:30,760
Speaker 3: On absolutely yep, yeah, in large, in large part I

506
00:35:29,840 --> 00:35:34,159
I in fact, maybe just in total. That's probably all

507
00:35:34,199 --> 00:35:38,239
it takes. So living through this stuff, you know, one

508
00:35:38,320 --> 00:35:45,119
more week of of solutions being stretched out and put off,

509
00:35:45,159 --> 00:35:47,159
or one more year of it, or one more term

510
00:35:47,199 --> 00:35:54,800
of it at the national level, it Yeah, when does it? Eventually?

511
00:35:54,840 --> 00:35:58,400
I think you're right. It just comes down to I'm

512
00:35:58,400 --> 00:35:59,920
going to steal that too, fix it.

513
00:36:02,119 --> 00:36:05,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what that's what men men have to hear.

514
00:36:06,159 --> 00:36:12,880
Nineteen thirty six Spain, maybe nineteen thirty three Germany.

515
00:36:13,800 --> 00:36:14,760
Speaker 2: Just go fix it.

516
00:36:14,960 --> 00:36:18,320
Speaker 1: Please don't tell me how you're going to do it,

517
00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:22,280
but to move on. Because there's another theme that I

518
00:36:22,280 --> 00:36:24,760
think is really important and it's not really touched upon.

519
00:36:25,559 --> 00:36:28,800
I hope that my show and you know, organization that

520
00:36:28,840 --> 00:36:32,360
I'm a part of is helping with this. But like

521
00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:35,400
the bond between Grayson and Jack and then later later

522
00:36:35,519 --> 00:36:40,519
Phil drives a lot of the story and basically shows

523
00:36:40,599 --> 00:36:45,840
how male friends male friendships like reflect themes of loyalty

524
00:36:45,880 --> 00:36:48,760
and sacrifice, and that seems to be pretty central to it.

525
00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:51,440
So we could probably talk about this for a while,

526
00:36:51,519 --> 00:36:52,559
So why don't you talk about that?

527
00:36:53,199 --> 00:37:00,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, that was as I you know, I don't

528
00:37:00,239 --> 00:37:04,679
spend a lot of time going back to the period

529
00:37:04,719 --> 00:37:07,360
in which I was writing this, but what I have

530
00:37:07,480 --> 00:37:16,360
found is that I can pretty reliably pull up It's

531
00:37:16,400 --> 00:37:19,679
as if a filtering process occurs over time where all

532
00:37:19,719 --> 00:37:22,800
of the other stuff just kind of goes by the wayside.

533
00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:31,320
And I do remember that loyalty specifically was kind of

534
00:37:31,360 --> 00:37:39,000
the main It will a theme for sure, and a

535
00:37:39,079 --> 00:37:43,159
series of questions kind of surrounding loyalty. Once again, there's

536
00:37:43,199 --> 00:37:54,960
a contextual aspect where without this social capital that that

537
00:37:55,559 --> 00:38:01,639
we you know, has been largely just intentionally dismantled, it's

538
00:38:01,800 --> 00:38:07,360
difficult to maybe to even understand what loyalty is now.

539
00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:10,559
When you and I were growing up, I think we

540
00:38:10,679 --> 00:38:14,039
had my friend actually he's still my friend. He's been

541
00:38:14,079 --> 00:38:16,599
my friends since I was in sixth grade. And he

542
00:38:17,039 --> 00:38:21,039
just the other day he pointed out that we're probably

543
00:38:21,119 --> 00:38:27,880
the last generation to kind of fully experience the American dream,

544
00:38:29,320 --> 00:38:31,519
or at least, you know, if it wasn't in my

545
00:38:31,639 --> 00:38:33,559
life for your life, like we could walk down the

546
00:38:33,599 --> 00:38:37,079
street and find it, probably and we're the first ones

547
00:38:37,159 --> 00:38:43,000
to see it dissolve and back. Also, it ties back

548
00:38:43,039 --> 00:38:46,480
to the fixed thing. You know. It's almost impossible, and

549
00:38:47,119 --> 00:38:50,239
that sort of speaks to the action film element of

550
00:38:50,440 --> 00:38:59,000
King of Dogs. But it's almost impossible to affect, you know,

551
00:38:59,079 --> 00:39:03,920
the sort of change or solutions or outcomes that we

552
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:09,199
may want alone, even in you know, just a simple,

553
00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:13,920
you know, tactical scenario, You're much better off with two

554
00:39:14,039 --> 00:39:18,360
or three other guys you know, who you as they

555
00:39:18,480 --> 00:39:21,320
as you know, the meme is like who you can

556
00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:23,440
call it too in the morning, and who are going

557
00:39:23,519 --> 00:39:26,599
to show up with shovels? Like that's a real thing,

558
00:39:26,800 --> 00:39:29,519
and it always has been a real thing. You know.

559
00:39:29,639 --> 00:39:33,320
I think that the I'm not I'm not one to

560
00:39:33,719 --> 00:39:36,000
there's plenty of hate that goes to the boomers, and

561
00:39:36,159 --> 00:39:40,760
it I apply a lot myself. But I'm not sure

562
00:39:40,800 --> 00:39:43,039
that they had it, you know. I think that they

563
00:39:43,119 --> 00:39:47,079
think they had it. And I've noticed in watching them,

564
00:39:47,480 --> 00:39:53,119
you know, people close to me here there, they thought

565
00:39:53,159 --> 00:39:55,079
they had it. And it's all it's kind of sad

566
00:39:55,159 --> 00:39:57,679
actually to watch them wake up in their in their

567
00:39:57,719 --> 00:40:02,000
older years and realize, well, all this time, I thought

568
00:40:02,480 --> 00:40:06,679
these were my guys. And if there's a there's a

569
00:40:06,719 --> 00:40:11,480
lot to be hopeful for. I hope that I'm jumping

570
00:40:11,519 --> 00:40:13,199
around a bit, but I think I can drag this

571
00:40:13,280 --> 00:40:18,599
back for you, King of Dogs. What it really was

572
00:40:18,599 --> 00:40:20,559
was a way to like, can we go through hell

573
00:40:20,719 --> 00:40:23,280
and then get the treasure and come out on the

574
00:40:23,320 --> 00:40:29,159
other side for readers in this to understand, like in

575
00:40:29,199 --> 00:40:33,679
the closest and deepest analysis, there's still hope and we

576
00:40:33,760 --> 00:40:37,360
can win. This is not a game over man sort

577
00:40:37,360 --> 00:40:39,719
of thing, but it's going to be nasty and we're

578
00:40:39,719 --> 00:40:42,360
going to have to look at like really uncomfortable things

579
00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:48,599
like do I have one or two or three people

580
00:40:48,639 --> 00:40:53,679
in my life that will drop what they're doing and

581
00:40:55,360 --> 00:40:59,559
let's just say it, you know, go do things that

582
00:40:59,679 --> 00:41:02,360
you know, don't do crime. Basically you can, you know,

583
00:41:02,519 --> 00:41:05,519
put it in. I'm a novelist, I'm not really advocating anything.

584
00:41:05,559 --> 00:41:08,199
I'm just saying, will they will they put skin in

585
00:41:08,280 --> 00:41:12,480
the game in a real way. I think when that

586
00:41:13,199 --> 00:41:18,559
when those bonds of loyalty are re established, it may

587
00:41:18,599 --> 00:41:25,840
be one of those things where a type of wildfire,

588
00:41:26,159 --> 00:41:29,679
you know, is ignited, where there are enough small groups

589
00:41:29,719 --> 00:41:32,760
of men that once again understand, well, the time has

590
00:41:32,800 --> 00:41:35,960
come and it may turn out bad, But I'm going

591
00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:41,519
to have to exercise my rights as an American, you know,

592
00:41:41,599 --> 00:41:45,960
in the whole hierarchy of meaning, there rights, this, this

593
00:41:46,119 --> 00:41:51,840
spiritual inheritance we have and whatnot. But yeah, we could

594
00:41:51,880 --> 00:41:56,840
go on about this forever, because there there are again

595
00:41:56,960 --> 00:42:05,519
like logistical and tactical and psychological considerations. But the way

596
00:42:05,559 --> 00:42:10,039
I handled it in the book is twofold. Maybe one

597
00:42:10,079 --> 00:42:17,880
to point out that Grayson, my hero, is choosing in

598
00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:23,639
many ways to throw his life or caution to the wind,

599
00:42:25,239 --> 00:42:28,119
to sort of prove a point to maybe only himself,

600
00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:35,440
as almost everyone around him betrays him. And I have

601
00:42:35,519 --> 00:42:38,840
found and maybe you've noticed this too, that as we've

602
00:42:39,800 --> 00:42:42,880
marched through maybe the past ten to fifteen years, a

603
00:42:42,880 --> 00:42:47,199
lot of the betrayal comes from maybe people who we

604
00:42:47,239 --> 00:42:49,599
thought were on our side, maybe people who look a

605
00:42:49,599 --> 00:42:53,800
lot like us, who come from the same places as us.

606
00:42:53,880 --> 00:42:58,239
It's not always you know, some super alien, you know,

607
00:42:58,280 --> 00:43:00,800
a Somali coming in or something where it's like, obviously,

608
00:43:00,840 --> 00:43:04,280
I have no relationship with this person. I don't know

609
00:43:04,320 --> 00:43:09,440
what language he's speaking or what is morals are, So

610
00:43:10,000 --> 00:43:13,280
it's it's kind of a dicey thing, you know, And

611
00:43:13,639 --> 00:43:17,480
I think that even though it's dicey, we're still going

612
00:43:17,559 --> 00:43:22,039
to have to wade through and find some some ways

613
00:43:22,840 --> 00:43:28,840
maybe under you know, urgent sorts of circumstances. But maybe

614
00:43:28,920 --> 00:43:33,599
also this plays out in ways that are much more manageable,

615
00:43:33,719 --> 00:43:37,239
Like we we can reinstill some of these things in

616
00:43:37,280 --> 00:43:44,280
our sons and you know, live embody. These these qualities,

617
00:43:44,920 --> 00:43:48,480
transcendental ideals, you know, exchange between each other along the way.

618
00:43:48,719 --> 00:43:51,360
But I think that there's something true about if you

619
00:43:51,400 --> 00:43:54,559
do that a few times. I hate to say that

620
00:43:54,639 --> 00:44:00,559
the phrase like the universe responds. I don't think it's

621
00:44:00,679 --> 00:44:04,360
you know, I think it's God looks at that, and

622
00:44:04,800 --> 00:44:08,559
it's constantly forgiving us our sins, you know, of not

623
00:44:08,599 --> 00:44:11,559
trusting each other, not not actually being a trustworthy person

624
00:44:11,599 --> 00:44:16,000
made and maybe just walking that back a little bit

625
00:44:16,039 --> 00:44:16,920
will go a long way.

626
00:44:20,159 --> 00:44:24,679
Speaker 1: Just looking at it from like a secular, practical standpoint,

627
00:44:24,760 --> 00:44:28,639
I mean, technology is really what durascinated us.

628
00:44:29,079 --> 00:44:30,400
Speaker 2: You.

629
00:44:30,400 --> 00:44:34,599
Speaker 1: You formerly grew up in a in a community where

630
00:44:34,760 --> 00:44:39,400
everyone knows each other. Your grandfathers knew each other. I mean,

631
00:44:39,480 --> 00:44:42,679
you've families lived next to each other that have known

632
00:44:42,719 --> 00:44:46,920
each other for you know, for centuries, and in some

633
00:44:47,039 --> 00:44:51,239
cases not know, not here a couple you know, centuries here,

634
00:44:51,280 --> 00:44:54,079
but you know, more so back in the old country,

635
00:44:54,679 --> 00:45:00,320
and you basically as technology made it easier for people

636
00:45:00,320 --> 00:45:05,119
to leave, as people became more financialized, and you know,

637
00:45:05,360 --> 00:45:08,159
we need to get closer to the city so we

638
00:45:08,199 --> 00:45:10,519
can make money, and we need to chase the quote

639
00:45:10,599 --> 00:45:15,760
unquote American dream, which talk about a term that has

640
00:45:15,880 --> 00:45:20,800
changed definitions, you know, numerous times. And I don't even know.

641
00:45:20,880 --> 00:45:22,679
I don't I have never even looked, like looked at

642
00:45:22,719 --> 00:45:26,519
the genesis of where that came from. But something tells

643
00:45:26,559 --> 00:45:32,199
me it came out of an ad agency somewhere. It

644
00:45:32,360 --> 00:45:37,440
just seems like the more urracinated we become, the more

645
00:45:37,559 --> 00:45:39,440
the easier it is to control us. I mean, I

646
00:45:39,760 --> 00:45:42,599
say all the time, I think we're controlled by like

647
00:45:42,639 --> 00:45:46,639
two hundred people. There's like two hundred people in in

648
00:45:46,679 --> 00:45:51,920
this in the world that control everybody. And the only

649
00:45:52,000 --> 00:45:55,760
reason they're able to do that is because they come

650
00:45:55,800 --> 00:45:59,960
together and they cooperate and have a guild where it's

651
00:46:00,000 --> 00:46:02,800
it's like, we're not going to allow if one of

652
00:46:02,880 --> 00:46:06,960
us goes off to reservation, we'll sacrifice that person. And

653
00:46:08,960 --> 00:46:11,440
we don't have that anymore. That's the way people used

654
00:46:11,440 --> 00:46:14,960
to used to be. If somebody's horse got stolen, everybody,

655
00:46:15,440 --> 00:46:17,960
everybody got together to go figure out who did it

656
00:46:18,000 --> 00:46:23,880
because your horse was next. Well, everything you know, organized

657
00:46:23,920 --> 00:46:29,679
law enforcement, technology and quote unquote advancements has taken all

658
00:46:29,719 --> 00:46:36,400
that away. And really I don't know if getting smaller,

659
00:46:36,800 --> 00:46:39,000
you know, because I do believe mass and scale has

660
00:46:39,119 --> 00:46:45,320
just basically killed killed most everything. You Being able to

661
00:46:45,480 --> 00:46:48,960
roll over three hundred and fifty million people is not

662
00:46:49,559 --> 00:46:52,159
even plausible, And it wasn't the it wasn't the idea

663
00:46:52,199 --> 00:46:56,960
from the start, but it just seems like until you

664
00:46:57,239 --> 00:47:01,199
have until people get back to that for internal and

665
00:47:01,280 --> 00:47:05,079
even family. You know, I've talked about this numerous times

666
00:47:05,079 --> 00:47:10,239
in the show, and it always makes people insane. Arranged marriages, Yeah,

667
00:47:10,280 --> 00:47:13,400
and it's not like, oh, you're gonna marry this guy.

668
00:47:13,440 --> 00:47:16,480
It's like, no, there's five choices, you choose one kind

669
00:47:16,480 --> 00:47:20,119
of thing, you know, until we get back to that

670
00:47:20,320 --> 00:47:23,599
the people who are actually doing that right now, I mean,

671
00:47:23,599 --> 00:47:26,679
think about the think about the show. Last night, We're

672
00:47:26,679 --> 00:47:32,360
watching Tucker, We're watching Darryl connect the dots, and everyone

673
00:47:32,440 --> 00:47:36,440
he talks about is one degree away from everyone else

674
00:47:36,480 --> 00:47:40,119
that he's talked about that's how they have the power,

675
00:47:40,199 --> 00:47:42,639
that's how they can flaunt what they do. That's how

676
00:47:42,800 --> 00:47:45,559
you know, where we think that these people should be.

677
00:47:45,800 --> 00:47:48,760
You know that that Vlad, You know that Vlad the

678
00:47:48,800 --> 00:47:54,920
Impaler had the right idea. These people are bragging openly

679
00:47:55,360 --> 00:47:58,800
and mocking us with what they do. And I think

680
00:47:58,920 --> 00:48:04,440
until we get back to to becoming more tight knit

681
00:48:05,039 --> 00:48:10,719
and that being real power, were just erascinated and lost.

682
00:48:12,320 --> 00:48:19,559
Speaker 3: I would agree one hundred percent. And I've noticed even

683
00:48:19,599 --> 00:48:26,280
in the last six months to a year something like

684
00:48:29,320 --> 00:48:36,599
a deeper coherence about related to that idea emerging. I

685
00:48:36,639 --> 00:48:41,199
don't know if more people are if again there's some

686
00:48:41,320 --> 00:48:46,679
filtering process that's that's happening, or maybe maybe our like

687
00:48:47,280 --> 00:48:57,559
aggregated spiritual power is some sort of factor here. David

688
00:48:58,079 --> 00:49:01,320
I think his name is David Roth, and there's a

689
00:49:01,519 --> 00:49:07,280
book called The Superclass. It's probably fifteen years old, and

690
00:49:07,840 --> 00:49:13,000
he's like half an elite himself. I think he's got

691
00:49:13,039 --> 00:49:18,079
some blue blood ties and whatnot. But he wrote this

692
00:49:18,079 --> 00:49:20,519
book called The Superclass, and at that point he was

693
00:49:20,559 --> 00:49:24,960
saying was five thousand people, and I think that that

694
00:49:25,079 --> 00:49:29,559
number is, yeah, a factor of ten at least too big.

695
00:49:32,000 --> 00:49:36,800
Five hundred or something would be much closer or two hundred.

696
00:49:36,880 --> 00:49:39,840
You know, I'm willing to live with that. Sure. And

697
00:49:41,440 --> 00:49:47,679
it's funny how you know that the jock nerd thing

698
00:49:48,800 --> 00:49:54,039
that we've talked about, this flaunting of because if it

699
00:49:54,039 --> 00:50:00,320
were you and me or just anybody mostly normal, we're

700
00:50:00,360 --> 00:50:05,119
to have the hootspa I think they say, to try

701
00:50:05,159 --> 00:50:09,639
and pull something like that off. Uh you know I

702
00:50:09,920 --> 00:50:15,639
I would. I would feel constantly paranoid, constantly ashamed and

703
00:50:15,760 --> 00:50:18,079
afraid that I was going to be found out and

704
00:50:18,320 --> 00:50:25,400
caught out. And it's something it's just diabolical, but so obvious.

705
00:50:25,440 --> 00:50:28,039
It's as if God is he. It's almost like the

706
00:50:28,119 --> 00:50:30,880
thing can't be set up such that if this happen,

707
00:50:30,960 --> 00:50:34,239
it's like in nature, you know, oftentimes poisonous things will

708
00:50:34,280 --> 00:50:37,320
be a bright color like a red coral snake or

709
00:50:37,320 --> 00:50:40,280
what have you. It's as if these people cannot help

710
00:50:40,760 --> 00:50:45,400
but just advertise themselves as Yeah, that's that's a that's

711
00:50:45,440 --> 00:50:48,360
like a main This is this human being is a

712
00:50:48,400 --> 00:50:53,599
mainspring in the in the control and like general apparatus

713
00:50:53,599 --> 00:50:56,719
of degradation. That that's that's fucking us all up all

714
00:50:56,760 --> 00:50:57,159
the time.

715
00:50:59,679 --> 00:51:00,000
Speaker 2: Uh.

716
00:51:00,079 --> 00:51:05,639
Speaker 3: With the Podesta brothers that that whole thing about how Darryl,

717
00:51:06,000 --> 00:51:08,440
you know, they Daryl and Tucker were both going back

718
00:51:08,480 --> 00:51:13,280
and forth about how if this, if this was the

719
00:51:13,320 --> 00:51:16,440
type of art that you liked, you know, little kids

720
00:51:16,559 --> 00:51:21,639
in awful, degraded situations. Okay, I mean I get that's

721
00:51:21,639 --> 00:51:24,639
crazy enough, but it's a whole other level of crazy

722
00:51:24,719 --> 00:51:28,000
to then advertise that and invite people over. And it

723
00:51:28,039 --> 00:51:33,079
really seems like they're almost begging to be managed themselves,

724
00:51:33,360 --> 00:51:36,000
if you know what I mean, in some way for

725
00:51:36,000 --> 00:51:39,719
for and and you know, this is all pretty well understood.

726
00:51:39,760 --> 00:51:45,519
I think you know in our circles that that just

727
00:51:45,639 --> 00:51:50,920
good normal right there. There is a level where that's

728
00:51:50,960 --> 00:51:53,559
actually pretty simple, and we don't need to read Spangler

729
00:51:53,559 --> 00:51:55,559
about it. We don't need to write a whole treat

730
00:51:55,639 --> 00:51:58,000
This is about why this was wrong or right or

731
00:51:58,039 --> 00:52:04,800
any of that sort of thing. Yeah, it's quite a situation.

732
00:52:08,360 --> 00:52:10,880
Speaker 1: Well, let's finish on this because I think this is

733
00:52:10,920 --> 00:52:14,079
something important. This is something that's really bothered me over time.

734
00:52:16,360 --> 00:52:21,679
Is the books called King of Dogs and there's a

735
00:52:21,760 --> 00:52:28,239
human animal bond in it, and you know Liebenberg's idea

736
00:52:28,280 --> 00:52:34,519
that tracking is a scientific and empathetic act and something

737
00:52:34,559 --> 00:52:40,960
that's really bothered me is the in my lifetime, and

738
00:52:41,079 --> 00:52:44,199
I don't know that it was so maybe it's just

739
00:52:44,239 --> 00:52:48,400
because of the Internet, but just the abuse of dogs

740
00:52:48,760 --> 00:52:53,039
and like the dog fighting rings and things like that.

741
00:52:52,400 --> 00:52:58,719
That's not white people, that's not European. That's like coming

742
00:52:58,760 --> 00:53:02,360
from First of all, it's demonic. Second of all, it's

743
00:53:02,400 --> 00:53:09,320
coming from places like Africa and Indian Indian tribes or

744
00:53:09,519 --> 00:53:12,599
you know, Central American and South American Indian tribes. That's

745
00:53:12,639 --> 00:53:16,960
not a white person thing. And I really think that,

746
00:53:17,039 --> 00:53:18,920
you know, when you when you think about some of

747
00:53:18,960 --> 00:53:25,920
the great novels, historically main character has a dog that's

748
00:53:25,960 --> 00:53:29,880
loyal to them and it's always been there. And really

749
00:53:29,920 --> 00:53:33,679
when you look now, like I remember the first time

750
00:53:33,679 --> 00:53:39,920
I started reading about dogfighting rings, I mean that affected

751
00:53:39,960 --> 00:53:45,599
me for days to just know that that existed. And yeah,

752
00:53:45,639 --> 00:53:50,880
so why don't you talk about the the bond there?

753
00:53:51,639 --> 00:53:58,199
Speaker 3: Yeah. Absolutely, there's a guy who doesn't get as he

754
00:53:58,280 --> 00:54:00,719
doesn't seek you know, I don't think he much need

755
00:54:00,840 --> 00:54:06,519
for for acclaim or whatever. But he's in our circles.

756
00:54:06,559 --> 00:54:08,599
He's been in our circles for quite a while, named

757
00:54:08,719 --> 00:54:14,000
James Bowery, and he's the one who first sort of

758
00:54:14,039 --> 00:54:18,159
clued me into to this idea that it may very

759
00:54:18,159 --> 00:54:20,320
well be the and this is in King of Dogs.

760
00:54:22,519 --> 00:54:29,159
It's probably the case that for for the Northern European

761
00:54:31,079 --> 00:54:34,880
there was a bottleneck in population at a certain point

762
00:54:36,159 --> 00:54:41,639
where it's nothing short of divine. I mean, it's nothing

763
00:54:41,679 --> 00:54:46,599
to me and probably others it's it's it's the dog.

764
00:54:47,039 --> 00:54:49,519
You know, the domestication of the wolf into the dog.

765
00:54:49,639 --> 00:54:57,119
It was a gift that literally preserved the species by

766
00:54:57,199 --> 00:55:02,880
way of h he expanded, you know, our hunting capacities.

767
00:55:03,119 --> 00:55:10,480
He's an alarm, he's warmth that night, and it's there.

768
00:55:10,639 --> 00:55:13,360
There's and if you're not, you know, like an evolutionary guy,

769
00:55:13,400 --> 00:55:17,239
that's fine. I'm not one hundred percent evolutionary guy myself,

770
00:55:17,400 --> 00:55:24,480
but I saw the same, you know, similar stuff. I

771
00:55:24,480 --> 00:55:30,920
remember when I I mean, I'm on X a fair

772
00:55:30,960 --> 00:55:34,400
amount and I've tried to balance social media, but this

773
00:55:34,480 --> 00:55:38,800
notion that you know, it kind of operates as a

774
00:55:38,880 --> 00:55:43,119
type of a source of trauma. You know, some stuff

775
00:55:43,159 --> 00:55:45,760
comes across your timeline and it's like, geez, I wish

776
00:55:45,840 --> 00:55:48,800
I had not seen that, and uh, it does it

777
00:55:48,840 --> 00:55:53,519
effect it? I remember when I saw a dog being

778
00:55:53,559 --> 00:55:59,559
cooked alive in a walk by some chinamen. And this

779
00:55:59,719 --> 00:56:03,159
was this was not this was fifteen years ago. There

780
00:56:03,199 --> 00:56:05,840
was no AI involved, This was not a fake. This

781
00:56:06,000 --> 00:56:08,159
was some it was It was filmed on like a

782
00:56:08,159 --> 00:56:11,559
peanut phone, and it was some of the most heinous

783
00:56:11,559 --> 00:56:15,960
shit that I've ever seen in my life. I've seen

784
00:56:16,159 --> 00:56:18,400
a lot of really heinous shit too, like in my

785
00:56:18,480 --> 00:56:20,880
real life ensure on videos. We've all seen it. But

786
00:56:21,920 --> 00:56:26,440
when I saw that video similarly, it affected me. For

787
00:56:26,599 --> 00:56:29,280
it still affects me today when when that image passes

788
00:56:29,320 --> 00:56:33,599
through my head, I see read I want to, you know,

789
00:56:33,760 --> 00:56:36,760
crush skulls in a sort of a cartoon manner. I mean,

790
00:56:36,800 --> 00:56:41,639
I want to, I want blood, I want vengeance right now.

791
00:56:43,119 --> 00:56:48,880
And in the book it emerged as a theme over

792
00:56:49,000 --> 00:56:53,679
time as I started to like understand tracking in Liebenberg

793
00:56:54,000 --> 00:57:00,239
and and you know, my experience in writing law long

794
00:57:00,320 --> 00:57:03,880
form is that, or doing any sort of long long

795
00:57:04,199 --> 00:57:09,719
form project is uh, you have the internal creative you know,

796
00:57:09,760 --> 00:57:13,880
the goals, the criteria that you might hold, and then

797
00:57:13,920 --> 00:57:18,239
you have you know, your your actual life. And I

798
00:57:18,360 --> 00:57:23,320
found that by letting my actual life inform that and

799
00:57:23,400 --> 00:57:29,719
maybe vice versa. It's been very useful to me. And

800
00:57:29,760 --> 00:57:34,360
so that's just to say the dogs that have come

801
00:57:34,400 --> 00:57:40,000
and gone in my own life, you know, I've lost

802
00:57:42,159 --> 00:57:46,639
I think one pretty pretty tragically, pretty rough, you know,

803
00:57:46,679 --> 00:57:49,199
and a couple when I was when I was a kid,

804
00:57:49,199 --> 00:57:53,360
we always had dogs. But even then, you know, I

805
00:57:53,400 --> 00:57:58,519
had boomer parents and they and for all of their faults,

806
00:57:59,000 --> 00:58:04,519
and they instinctively knew, you know, to honor that that dog.

807
00:58:04,760 --> 00:58:10,119
It wasn't it was never like a light a light

808
00:58:10,119 --> 00:58:12,760
hearted sort of thing, Well the dog's dead, get over it,

809
00:58:12,840 --> 00:58:15,400
or anything like that. It wasn't over the top. We

810
00:58:15,440 --> 00:58:17,800
didn't make an altar to him or anything like that.

811
00:58:18,079 --> 00:58:24,760
But there's something that goes extremely deep with the dogs.

812
00:58:24,960 --> 00:58:30,239
And again in King in the novel, it's approached from

813
00:58:30,239 --> 00:58:34,960
many different angles. You know, you have the hero being

814
00:58:35,039 --> 00:58:42,519
hunted by by some some dog handlers. You have him

815
00:58:44,360 --> 00:58:47,559
coming to know, you know, a dog at a different stage.

816
00:58:47,599 --> 00:58:52,440
There there are dogs coming and going throughout throughout the book. Ultimately,

817
00:58:52,599 --> 00:58:55,079
you know, it's it's a tool. It's like a literary

818
00:58:55,119 --> 00:58:58,559
device to tie us back to loyalty, because the real

819
00:58:58,639 --> 00:59:04,079
thing about a dog to me, where it's heartbreaking that

820
00:59:06,400 --> 00:59:09,360
all the dog Here's another example I'll try to kind

821
00:59:09,400 --> 00:59:13,280
of wind it up on this is that I had

822
00:59:13,280 --> 00:59:16,000
a I had a buddy. I still have this buddy,

823
00:59:16,079 --> 00:59:19,760
and I was talking to him about a dog of

824
00:59:19,840 --> 00:59:22,679
mine that that had an injury and he was saying, well,

825
00:59:23,599 --> 00:59:26,559
you should just put him down. And I was like, well,

826
00:59:26,599 --> 00:59:28,639
I'm not putting the dog down. And it's like, well,

827
00:59:28,679 --> 00:59:32,039
you can't afford this, you know, say, elaborate surgery for

828
00:59:32,119 --> 00:59:35,679
the dog. The last thing the dog wants in his

829
00:59:35,800 --> 00:59:38,639
heart is to be a drag on you, and and

830
00:59:38,679 --> 00:59:43,320
it was like, fuck you. Just he hit me with

831
00:59:43,480 --> 00:59:47,880
the truth so hard. I didn't I didn't put the

832
00:59:47,880 --> 00:59:51,039
dog down. I'm I refuse to do that because it's

833
00:59:51,079 --> 00:59:54,840
not He's not in pain or anything like that. But

834
00:59:54,880 --> 00:59:57,239
that's really the case, Like the the love of the

835
00:59:57,320 --> 01:00:01,199
dog is so pure that it it almost shames me

836
01:00:01,280 --> 01:00:07,119
in a way. And so that's you're right, that that

837
01:00:07,320 --> 01:00:11,159
is not a thing that is that is like a

838
01:00:11,320 --> 01:00:16,719
universal amongst the races or across various nationalities, what have you.

839
01:00:18,000 --> 01:00:20,679
And many people now it's kind of popular to do

840
01:00:20,800 --> 01:00:24,639
the backlash thing of like all right, all right, but

841
01:00:24,719 --> 01:00:26,840
you know, the dog love's gone too far. They should

842
01:00:26,960 --> 01:00:29,599
I'm like, I don't think it's the dog love that's

843
01:00:29,599 --> 01:00:32,760
gone too far. It's it's the rest of the weird

844
01:00:32,800 --> 01:00:37,960
cultural trappings and effects that we've we've onboarded that are

845
01:00:38,039 --> 01:00:41,599
that are retarded. It's not the fact that some old

846
01:00:41,719 --> 01:00:43,639
lady is lonely and has a dog and wants to

847
01:00:43,679 --> 01:00:46,880
take her on the airplane, like that's just her. Problems

848
01:00:46,880 --> 01:00:49,320
are so much bigger and more more fucked up than

849
01:00:49,320 --> 01:00:51,679
that that it's not really about the dog, you know.

850
01:00:52,159 --> 01:00:56,840
So I'm yeah, I'm a die hard. I will that's

851
01:00:56,880 --> 01:01:01,519
a line in the sand where if I see animal

852
01:01:01,559 --> 01:01:06,440
abuse or anything like that, there's going to be problems

853
01:01:06,599 --> 01:01:08,000
if I'm around for it, for sure.

854
01:01:11,079 --> 01:01:17,199
Speaker 1: You know, growing up through the eighties, I strangely had

855
01:01:17,199 --> 01:01:22,039
it pretty easy, you know, outside the house and everything

856
01:01:23,000 --> 01:01:25,920
through the nineties once you move out and everything, the

857
01:01:26,000 --> 01:01:30,119
nineties was a little chaotic, but there was a lot

858
01:01:30,159 --> 01:01:32,519
of fun you could have. You know, I enjoyed the

859
01:01:32,599 --> 01:01:38,320
nineties a lot. Things really changed after nine to eleven,

860
01:01:39,559 --> 01:01:43,119
and that slowly was like that started bringing me to

861
01:01:45,599 --> 01:01:49,920
more cynicism and more you know what people would say,

862
01:01:49,920 --> 01:01:54,360
black pilling, the Michael Vick thing like put me over

863
01:01:54,400 --> 01:02:01,719
the edge because it wasn't it was the dogs, but

864
01:02:01,800 --> 01:02:06,159
it wasn't only the dogs. The stories about them taking

865
01:02:06,199 --> 01:02:10,480
so much pleasure in killing dogs it wouldn't fight. It

866
01:02:10,639 --> 01:02:16,239
just made me realize that those dogs were basically a

867
01:02:16,360 --> 01:02:20,039
stand in for humans, that these are people who are

868
01:02:20,079 --> 01:02:24,639
so nihilistic and so murderous and such they don't even

869
01:02:24,639 --> 01:02:27,440
deserve to be called the animals, because a lot of

870
01:02:27,480 --> 01:02:34,400
animals are very loyal and and you know, worthy worthy

871
01:02:34,440 --> 01:02:39,559
of your admiration. But that, after that, it was just

872
01:02:39,679 --> 01:02:43,239
I was like, I think this world is completely fucked

873
01:02:43,880 --> 01:02:48,039
and it's just survival at this point. That was right

874
01:02:48,079 --> 01:02:51,360
around the time I really started practice, like practicing practicing

875
01:02:51,400 --> 01:02:57,320
with guns, with pistols and rifles. I mean, just that

876
01:02:57,360 --> 01:03:00,000
put that that put me over the edge, having arguments

877
01:03:00,039 --> 01:03:01,800
with people who were saying it was no big deal,

878
01:03:02,840 --> 01:03:08,360
and and you know, just yeah.

879
01:03:06,559 --> 01:03:09,800
Speaker 3: You know when on that on that stame line of

880
01:03:09,800 --> 01:03:16,119
thinking when Christy Noel I think is her name, when

881
01:03:16,119 --> 01:03:18,719
the business came came out maybe whatever, that was a

882
01:03:18,760 --> 01:03:23,559
year ago, where she I mean, I'm you know, I'm

883
01:03:23,559 --> 01:03:25,960
not in charge. I'm not making any decisions, but no

884
01:03:26,000 --> 01:03:28,639
matter what she does, I'm not going to trust her.

885
01:03:30,119 --> 01:03:33,119
There are other ways to manage whatever her problem was.

886
01:03:33,440 --> 01:03:35,360
The dog I have now is a.

887
01:03:36,159 --> 01:03:38,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, here's the thing she said, Oh the dog were

888
01:03:39,039 --> 01:03:42,440
the dog was killing the chickens and everything. Okay, separate

889
01:03:42,440 --> 01:03:46,239
the dog from the chickens. Send the dog to send

890
01:03:46,239 --> 01:03:48,880
the dog someplace to get adopted where there are no chickens,

891
01:03:48,920 --> 01:03:51,679
where it's not going to Just because the dog's killing

892
01:03:51,719 --> 01:03:54,760
chickens doesn't mean it's going to attack children. It doesn't

893
01:03:54,800 --> 01:03:57,559
mean you you wanted to kill something.

894
01:03:58,599 --> 01:03:59,039
Speaker 2: That's it.

895
01:03:59,480 --> 01:04:02,599
Speaker 1: You want to you wanted to end a life, Yeah,

896
01:04:02,639 --> 01:04:04,400
and that's it, and you had the chance to do

897
01:04:04,440 --> 01:04:07,239
it and you did it. This isn't trophy hunting. I

898
01:04:07,320 --> 01:04:11,639
understand trophy hunting. I understand hunting. I understand that you know,

899
01:04:11,719 --> 01:04:16,119
hunting really helps the environment. I mean you have to understand.

900
01:04:16,159 --> 01:04:19,239
I mean, like I live in Alabama, North Carolina gets

901
01:04:19,280 --> 01:04:22,280
overrun by deer and they pay people to go out

902
01:04:22,280 --> 01:04:25,679
there and shoot them or else you're or else the

903
01:04:25,719 --> 01:04:31,000
ecosystem is going to be screwed. But just I mean,

904
01:04:32,320 --> 01:04:34,320
there are so many things she could have done to

905
01:04:34,400 --> 01:04:36,960
avoid that, and she did that because she wanted to.

906
01:04:38,440 --> 01:04:43,400
Speaker 3: I agree. That's like if she can't manage that situation

907
01:04:45,719 --> 01:04:48,519
in an upright manner, why would I trust her to

908
01:04:48,559 --> 01:04:51,840
manage some giant federal agency And I don't. And to

909
01:04:52,280 --> 01:04:55,960
the same point, I think that she had a wire

910
01:04:56,000 --> 01:04:58,519
haired pointer, which is a certain type of like a

911
01:04:58,679 --> 01:05:01,599
very good hunting dog. That's what I have. And I

912
01:05:01,719 --> 01:05:06,199
got him. I drove I don't know, three states. Let's

913
01:05:06,199 --> 01:05:09,159
say I found him online and I drove three states away.

914
01:05:09,639 --> 01:05:14,719
And they had this very good program at a prison

915
01:05:15,199 --> 01:05:21,679
where strays and you know, unwonted animals were taken to

916
01:05:21,719 --> 01:05:25,840
the prison and they try and sort of, you know,

917
01:05:25,960 --> 01:05:28,480
give these guys an opportunity. Maybe, I mean, these are

918
01:05:28,639 --> 01:05:31,960
awful fucking people. You know, this is not like the

919
01:05:32,000 --> 01:05:37,119
guy who wrote bad checks. These these are themselves people

920
01:05:37,159 --> 01:05:39,280
that probably shouldn't be alive anyway, but they try and

921
01:05:39,320 --> 01:05:45,320
rehabilitate them to some degree through a process of kind

922
01:05:45,320 --> 01:05:47,239
of giving these dogs a second chance. And I went

923
01:05:47,280 --> 01:05:50,519
out and I got this dog, Riker his his name,

924
01:05:51,239 --> 01:05:56,800
and the story is basically that he was not fit

925
01:05:57,159 --> 01:06:00,960
to be like a high dollar hunting dog, so somebody

926
01:06:01,000 --> 01:06:03,480
bred him and then it turned out, you know, he

927
01:06:03,519 --> 01:06:09,000
had different personality and that that's what Christy Num could

928
01:06:09,000 --> 01:06:12,159
have done. That she could have released that dog or

929
01:06:12,199 --> 01:06:16,239
that puppy to anybody who just wants, you know, a companion,

930
01:06:16,679 --> 01:06:19,039
but to drag him out in the sandlot and fucking

931
01:06:19,079 --> 01:06:22,159
blow his head out, that's exactly I agree. She's she

932
01:06:22,360 --> 01:06:28,800
had some fantasy, some twisted thing in there was completely unnecessary,

933
01:06:30,039 --> 01:06:34,840
and yeah, I get I get very emotional, and uh again,

934
01:06:35,360 --> 01:06:37,280
I don't feel bad about it at all. I think

935
01:06:37,320 --> 01:06:41,840
it's I think it's part of the if you will,

936
01:06:42,239 --> 01:06:44,800
you know, the way God intended it. We're supposed to

937
01:06:45,039 --> 01:06:50,840
kind of have a hand in, especially with dogs. I

938
01:06:50,880 --> 01:06:54,400
mean we do. We kind of chose to to bring

939
01:06:54,440 --> 01:06:57,400
them into our world. And it's one thing if it's

940
01:06:57,400 --> 01:07:02,280
a cougar or something, but we changed the course of

941
01:07:02,360 --> 01:07:07,039
their you know, that species history, and so we're responsible

942
01:07:07,079 --> 01:07:08,079
for it in my opinion.

943
01:07:09,639 --> 01:07:12,159
Speaker 1: Well, I'm about ready to wrap up. Do you have

944
01:07:12,159 --> 01:07:18,079
anything you want to anything further? You want to say, Yeah,

945
01:07:18,159 --> 01:07:20,400
here's your chance to sell the book?

946
01:07:20,920 --> 01:07:26,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, I'll just say it. It's been out

947
01:07:26,280 --> 01:07:30,519
for a while, it's got very good reviews. It's it's

948
01:07:30,559 --> 01:07:35,199
a far cry from your normal kind of novel that

949
01:07:35,280 --> 01:07:38,159
was put out in our thing. Nothing against those books,

950
01:07:38,880 --> 01:07:43,360
but it's exceptional. What can I say? I mean, it's mine.

951
01:07:43,400 --> 01:07:47,199
I did a good job, and yeah, I would certainly

952
01:07:47,280 --> 01:07:51,159
appreciate it. If you check it out, it's on Amazon,

953
01:07:52,440 --> 01:07:56,840
you can find me on x It's Golden Goat Guild

954
01:07:57,599 --> 01:08:03,599
or Andrew Edwards. But yeah, if any of this is intriguing,

955
01:08:04,800 --> 01:08:07,239
I would hope that that your listeners would check it out.

956
01:08:07,599 --> 01:08:09,960
But mostly, you know, I'm glad I got to talk

957
01:08:09,960 --> 01:08:13,840
to you. It's it's been an actual pleasure. So thank

958
01:08:13,880 --> 01:08:14,480
you very much.

959
01:08:15,559 --> 01:08:18,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, it has. We need need to have you back

960
01:08:18,840 --> 01:08:22,319
on where we can just talk about talk about life.

961
01:08:22,399 --> 01:08:24,359
I'd be pretty close to that, pretty close to the

962
01:08:24,359 --> 01:08:25,439
same age I think we've been.

963
01:08:25,560 --> 01:08:26,960
Speaker 2: We've got through a lot of the same shit.

964
01:08:27,119 --> 01:08:29,840
Speaker 3: So I'd be thrilled to do that. And we don't

965
01:08:29,880 --> 01:08:32,039
do that enough where we just take a little time

966
01:08:32,079 --> 01:08:36,239
to say, you know, because you mentioned the nineties and

967
01:08:36,239 --> 01:08:38,399
it's like, yeah, I know what you're saying. There was

968
01:08:39,720 --> 01:08:42,279
and and it's gone and if we don't have those chats,

969
01:08:43,840 --> 01:08:46,600
maybe we'll forget it. So I'd be thrilled to do

970
01:08:46,640 --> 01:08:47,239
that anytime.

971
01:08:47,720 --> 01:08:49,880
Speaker 2: Thank you all right, man, thank you very much.

972
01:08:50,479 --> 01:09:26,760
Speaker 3: You too,