Speaker 1: The following presentation is Al Marvis Studio's production.
Speaker 2: When you Be on the Sky do you feel?
Speaker 3: The poll question why the stories told? And left me
Speaker 3: high in shadows?
Speaker 4: Where the truth we find?
Speaker 2: They built their tales on crafts and lines on.
Speaker 1: Theories they stake their design.
Speaker 4: Welcome back to truth seekers from around the world. It's
Speaker 4: time for another edition of the Flat Earth Files. I'm
Speaker 4: your host is always George Hobbes, and we have Mark
Speaker 4: from Australia on the line who'll be joining us in
Speaker 4: just a moment before we get started. Don't forget for
Speaker 4: all things Flatter Earth Files. Please do check out the website,
Speaker 4: the flat Earthfiles dot com and if you'd like to
Speaker 4: join the podcast like Mark is today, please do send
Speaker 4: us an email to fefilesguest dot gmail dot com. And
Speaker 4: of course all of this information is in the show notes.
Speaker 4: And do apologize we're a little late on this week's episode.
Speaker 4: Unfortunately last week's guests had a family emergency to deal
Speaker 4: with and we'll keep him in our prayers and his
Speaker 4: family and hope to get him back on later down
Speaker 4: the road. And again my thanks to everyone who continues
Speaker 4: to support the podcast, and again I do leave notes
Speaker 4: in on the website and I noted that we'd be
Speaker 4: delayed this week. So again, thank you all for your
Speaker 4: patience and your continued support. Think that's all the housekeeping
Speaker 4: notes we have for today, So we are going to
Speaker 4: welcome in our guest for this week. His name is Mark.
Speaker 4: He is from Australia. He's an author and he has
Speaker 4: a great story, So welcome aboard Mark. How were you.
Speaker 5: I'm really well, Thanks George, and thank you for having
Speaker 5: me on the show. It's quite surreal to be here
Speaker 5: talking with you after having listened to the show for
Speaker 5: I Reckon it's been about two years now. I started
Speaker 5: listening to it way before Christmas last year, so I've
Speaker 5: been churning in to all the wonderful people that you
Speaker 5: have on the show. It's been such an enjoyable experience
Speaker 5: listening to your show, number one, because I find you
Speaker 5: to be such a grounded and down to earth host,
Speaker 5: which is quite a rarity when you listen to the
Speaker 5: variety of different shows that there are. It's good to
Speaker 5: just have a voice that can discuss and talk and
Speaker 5: communicate with people so well, like you do with the
Speaker 5: guests you have on the show. And also just the
Speaker 5: wonderful conversations that you've had with all the different people,
Speaker 5: and it's sort of over the years of having listened
Speaker 5: to the show, all the conversations sort of blend into
Speaker 5: this synthesis of of of all the ideas and themes
Speaker 5: and topics you've discussed.
Speaker 1: So it's it's just wonderful.
Speaker 5: To be a part of that and be given the
Speaker 5: opportunity to have a good chat with you about something
Speaker 5: that often leaves me feeling like I'm sort of this
Speaker 5: sort of.
Speaker 1: Pariah or you know, outsider.
Speaker 5: Whenever I try to bring up the subject of the
Speaker 5: flat Earth with people, I often feel I know it's
Speaker 5: a bit extreme, but it's just sort of like you
Speaker 5: you're you're someone who's got leprosy, you know, and you
Speaker 5: you sort of bring up this this subject and no
Speaker 5: get away from me, get away, I don't want to know. Don't, don't, don't,
Speaker 5: don't come near me. And it's interesting because I even
Speaker 5: know some some colleagues and people that are Christian, and
Speaker 5: when I try to even bring this subject up with them,
Speaker 5: it's amazing how just in doctrine indoctrinated people are to
Speaker 5: you know, Ball Earth, NASA Space and as I was
Speaker 5: writing my book, which has a huge section and overarching
Speaker 5: theme on all the deceptions, the great deception that we've been,
Speaker 5: you know, subjected to, I sort of really felt motivated
Speaker 5: to word it, and sometimes.
Speaker 1: I can be pretty.
Speaker 5: Abrasive and gruff, and I think with the sections in
Speaker 5: the book, I was really when I was writing that.
Speaker 5: It was at the same time I'd heard flat Earthed
Speaker 5: get ripped to shreds by that really nasty chap who
Speaker 5: was he was having the debate with. I forget the
Speaker 5: guy's name.
Speaker 1: I think his name was.
Speaker 4: Dave too, And yeah, I know you're talking about professor
Speaker 4: Dave right, Well, yeah.
Speaker 5: But apparently word on the street was he's not actually
Speaker 5: a professor as such. If I'm if I'm hearing right,
Speaker 5: I'm only re rephrasing what I've heard.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was. It was a bit of a what
Speaker 1: do you call it?
Speaker 5: When you get one of these martial arts instructors they
Speaker 5: call themselves a black dan when actually they're, you know,
Speaker 5: they're just a yellow belt. I think that might have
Speaker 5: been a bit of the scenario going on there. But
Speaker 5: I think good old Dave flat Earth, Dave just he
Speaker 5: was he was so diplomatic and you know, I just
Speaker 5: felt that that was so unfair what happened with that
Speaker 5: debate and he acted like a complete.
Speaker 1: Complete narcissist. You know, just what happened with that.
Speaker 5: Was it just fueled me to go ahead and write
Speaker 5: the section that I think I sent you a sample of.
Speaker 5: So I got quite quite carried away with my wordage
Speaker 5: describing these these.
Speaker 1: So called astrophysicists in their fields.
Speaker 5: So there's a lot of a lot of nasty wording,
Speaker 5: but I tried to go down the road of not cussing,
Speaker 5: but trying to just be as beers obnoxious as I
Speaker 5: could about what I thought of them, and at the
Speaker 5: same time try and succinctly spell out some of the
Speaker 5: idiocracy of of you know, the physics that they are
Speaker 5: purporting and pushing on us all the time. So, you
Speaker 5: know it, it took me a long time to actually
Speaker 5: just get that that section of the book done because
Speaker 5: I was carefully going over all the fact and the data,
Speaker 5: and you know, it was something that I'd already had
Speaker 5: ruminating away from having listened to your show and also
Speaker 5: from what I'd read previously. I guess, I guess I
Speaker 5: should start off by saying who I am I'm Mark Grangele.
Speaker 5: I live in Corland Gatta in Queensland, which is on
Speaker 5: the east coast of Australia.
Speaker 1: Cooling Gatto is part of Queensland.
Speaker 5: However where we live is right on the border of
Speaker 5: New South Wales, so where you literally look out over
Speaker 5: our back fence and we're looking into Queensland. So technically,
Speaker 5: when we drive in our driveway we're in New South
Speaker 5: Wales and when we drive out of our driveway we're
Speaker 5: in Queensland. And as I was just saying earlier, we've
Speaker 5: got a time difference because New South Wales goes on
Speaker 5: daylight savings for six months of the year and as such,
Speaker 5: now when we drive out of our driveway we are
Speaker 5: going in our backwards in time, and when we drive
Speaker 5: in our driveway we go forwards an hour in time.
Speaker 5: And so we have two daughters and when we drop
Speaker 5: them off at school, one has to go to the
Speaker 5: school on the New South Wales side of the border,
Speaker 5: so we've got to calculate her start and finish time
Speaker 5: with our oldest daughter who goes to Palm Beach High School,
Speaker 5: which is.
Speaker 1: Just north of here in Queensland.
Speaker 5: And so it's a juggling act, and normally with my
Speaker 5: wife working at those times of the day, I'm the
Speaker 5: one who's got to run around and madly kind of calculate,
Speaker 5: and I'm often getting calls from the school to.
Speaker 1: Say, you need to come and pick you need to
Speaker 1: come and pick a rorer up.
Speaker 5: You've for gotten the daylight savings, and I'm all, yeah,
Speaker 5: I'll be there in a few minutes.
Speaker 1: So we've been living here for ten years.
Speaker 5: My daughter's are fourteen and twelve now, and we moved
Speaker 5: here from China. My wife's Chinese, and for ten non
Speaker 5: consecutive years, you know, like three years here, two years there,
Speaker 5: three years here. I've lived in mainland China, working for
Speaker 5: most of that time as an ESL English as a
Speaker 5: second language teacher.
Speaker 1: The last teaching stint that I did in.
Speaker 5: China I was actually working at an international school called
Speaker 5: Dutun International School.
Speaker 1: As a grade two primary teacher.
Speaker 5: I'm kind of in this long, duous journey of trying
Speaker 5: to finish off doing a BA in education, which started
Speaker 5: off initially as a dip ed, but then the university's
Speaker 5: changed and said you can no longer be qualified doing
Speaker 5: a dip hed, a DIPAD used to be one year.
Speaker 1: Then they made it two years.
Speaker 5: You could attach that onto the end of a degree
Speaker 5: in any subject and then walk out of there and
Speaker 5: have a really good grounded knowledge in what your original
Speaker 5: degree was in with the two years of teaching education
Speaker 5: tacked on to the end of it. But I think,
Speaker 5: pointing the finger a little bit at the managers of
Speaker 5: the universities, probably wanting to make a bit more money
Speaker 5: from the whole outfit, they then made that you have
Speaker 5: to now do a BA to be qualified as a teacher,
Speaker 5: and that if you wanted to specialize in anything, they
Speaker 5: just sort of tack something into the middle of it,
Speaker 5: you know, So if you wanted to be an art teacher,
Speaker 5: then they would say, well, in the middle of that BA,
Speaker 5: you're going to.
Speaker 1: Do a whole lot of art subjects.
Speaker 5: So it's sort of circumfunded needing to do a degree.
Speaker 5: But in my personal opinion, I think that's not right
Speaker 5: because you have a lot of great teachers who are
Speaker 5: passionate about whatever their subject was coming out and then
Speaker 5: they do they did BED and they go in there
Speaker 5: and they become great teachers at what they're into. For me,
Speaker 5: it seems a little bit generic and washed out what
Speaker 5: the content is for those specialties within the course. But
Speaker 5: as it were, I started down that track of requalifying
Speaker 5: because I'd let the diploma go while my wife and
Speaker 5: I decided that we wanted to start our own puppet theater.
Speaker 5: So I was looking at you know, of course I
Speaker 5: did with the Tim Tim Winston School of Character Design.
Speaker 5: I was doing an online course about how to make
Speaker 5: muppets and you know, Cookie Monster and Kermit those sort
Speaker 5: of So I got a little workshop studio going and
Speaker 5: I started to get quite good at making less huge,
Speaker 5: you know, sesame street quality muppets, and then we began
Speaker 5: to formulate shows and ideas about education and anti bullying.
Speaker 1: And for a while they're both Louy and my wife
Speaker 1: and I would.
Speaker 5: Go around to kindy's and schools and holiday resorts and
Speaker 5: shopping centers, and we were doing you know, full on,
Speaker 5: you know puppet shows.
Speaker 1: And I made the stage myself out of wood.
Speaker 5: It was a kind of old retro Italian public theater
Speaker 5: style stage that I made that could fold up and
Speaker 5: go on the back of the van. And for a
Speaker 5: while there it was it was okay. But the problem
Speaker 5: was that we were just a husband and wife team
Speaker 5: trying to run a household and then at the same
Speaker 5: time trying to run a business. So it was it
Speaker 5: was up and down and it was a real rollercoaster ride,
Speaker 5: and then eventually we just had to say, okay, we
Speaker 5: need to go back to normal jobs.
Speaker 4: Yeah. Is that the same Stan Winston that was part
Speaker 4: of the Tim Burton films.
Speaker 5: Yes, yeah, he he he's the legendary you know. I
Speaker 5: made the alien characters and the Predator, designed the Predator.
Speaker 5: When the film was going down one road with a
Speaker 5: different character, they stepped got him to step in, and
Speaker 5: he kind of saved the day with the redesign of
Speaker 5: the And also he has a wonderful online school, very
Speaker 5: very comprehensive, well priced. And so I was making Muppets
Speaker 5: as a hobby and I jumped on there and that
Speaker 5: sort of took me up to the next level being
Speaker 5: able to, you know, design and create these muppet characters.
Speaker 1: And I just kept working away at it.
Speaker 5: I guess I like, I love working with my hands anything,
Speaker 5: painting heart It's a very for me, very it's reward, Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 4: You look at something that you created with your hands.
Speaker 4: It's I do woodworking and things like that. It's very
Speaker 4: when you're done after the hard work, the detailed work
Speaker 4: and the time and effort is it's very rewarding and
Speaker 4: it is like it's a stress believer as well.
Speaker 5: Oh definitely, you know it's it's it's that act that
Speaker 5: it's also the necessity is the mother of all inventions.
Speaker 5: So you know, we had we went and got a great, big, huge,
Speaker 5: you know, eighty inch TV, but we didn't have a stand.
Speaker 5: And I'm looking at the process of the stands going.
Speaker 5: You've got to be joking me, and I can go
Speaker 5: do that myself. So you know, I went into Bunnings,
Speaker 5: which is like Australian version of Home Depot. So Bunnings
Speaker 5: sort of generally is where you go for all your
Speaker 5: dool stuff.
Speaker 1: Here in Oz.
Speaker 5: And you know, it took me about a month and
Speaker 5: I made a TV stand. I'm not very artistically woodworky,
Speaker 5: you know, like with joins and all this kind of thing.
Speaker 1: I'm very pragmatic. I'll go hang on.
Speaker 5: I mean, I can put a bolt in here and
Speaker 5: bolt that and you know, and as long as it
Speaker 5: tastes together like the rocket Gibraltar. But I appreciate the
Speaker 5: real artisanry in woodwork. You know, when I see people
Speaker 5: making all these wonderful furniture and someone that's got all
Speaker 5: these amazing dovet all joins and all this kind of thing,
Speaker 5: I think, God, one day, I'd like to One day
Speaker 5: I'd like to have the time to be able to
Speaker 5: get down and sort of make something like that. But
Speaker 5: it's a wonderful feeling to be able to make something
Speaker 5: with your own hands, no matter what it is. And
Speaker 5: so yeah, for me, that's been my go to, always
Speaker 5: trying to have some sort of outlet, whether it's you know,
Speaker 5: painting or sculpting or anything really. But yeah, sadly for us,
Speaker 5: and it was really sad. I got quite depressed that
Speaker 5: we had to stop with the puppet theater. I sort
Speaker 5: of had aspirations of, you know, carrying it further and
Speaker 5: maybe trying to do a TV show or even because
Speaker 5: originally George my degree from what seems like three or
Speaker 5: four lifetimes ago. It was in the late eighties, I
Speaker 5: graduated from a film degree and nothing ever really came
Speaker 5: of it. But there's always that creative drive in the background,
Speaker 5: and in a way, the character for my book that's
Speaker 5: just been released today, he sort of sprung to mind
Speaker 5: years and years and years ago, when I was backpacking
Speaker 5: through mainland China in the early nineties.
Speaker 1: I've been living in Hong Kong and working as a
Speaker 1: health instructor in Hong Kong.
Speaker 5: And my girlfriend at the time, she just traveled this wonderful,
Speaker 5: amazing journey through You're all, through Pakistan and through the
Speaker 5: Kaiba Pass and then she'd been in India before that.
Speaker 5: And when she got back, she showing me all these
Speaker 5: photos and I'm just blown away because my minor in
Speaker 5: my film degree was photography and I had this amazing,
Speaker 5: inspiring photography lecturer, Max Pam, who is a famous I was.
Speaker 1: He traveling photographer.
Speaker 5: So he had all these wild photos of all these
Speaker 5: places he'd visited in the Gabie Desert and the mountains
Speaker 5: of Mongolia and all these other places.
Speaker 1: And I'd always sort of been inspired to do the
Speaker 1: same thing.
Speaker 5: So when I saw the photos of where this friend
Speaker 5: had traveled through, I was all, Okay, I'm going to
Speaker 5: get a backpack, I'm going to get a camera, I'll
Speaker 5: get a lonely planet. And this is in the early nineties,
Speaker 5: so there was no phones or digital or anything. I
Speaker 5: got a map of China and that was it and
Speaker 5: packed my clothes and off I went, got my visa
Speaker 5: of course, and then jumped on the train at Monkok
Speaker 5: station in Kowloon and traveled up across the border into
Speaker 5: Shenzhen and Guangdong, and then off I went on this
Speaker 5: big parapetic journey all around China. But the idea for
Speaker 5: the character of my book came while I was in
Speaker 5: this small, beautiful, little hamlety pocket at the time called
Speaker 5: Sechuan Bana, and it's in southwestern China, and it's called
Speaker 5: Sechwan Bara because it stands for I believe, the Eight
Speaker 5: Tribes or the Seven Tribes region. And this has all
Speaker 5: the hill tribes, all the minority hill tribes that are
Speaker 5: really they don't see themselves as any particular nationality.
Speaker 1: They're they're part of.
Speaker 5: Laos, They're part of Burma, they're they're mountain people. And Jinghong,
Speaker 5: which is the capital at the time, was this beautiful
Speaker 5: little oasis of a of a town. It just had
Speaker 5: this laid back, lovely feel, and there was all these
Speaker 5: foreign backpackers there at the time.
Speaker 1: Because it was too cold to go further north.
Speaker 5: This is around about January February, and so my plan
Speaker 5: was to hang there until things began to warm up
Speaker 5: more north, because I was planning on going into Tibet
Speaker 5: and then further north up into Cashgar and Mongolia. But
Speaker 5: at that moment in time, it was a you know,
Speaker 5: frozen tundra.
Speaker 1: So this lovely semi.
Speaker 5: Tropical kind of place was a good kind of you know,
Speaker 5: location to park up and just you know, enjoy and
Speaker 5: do a.
Speaker 1: Bit of traveling.
Speaker 5: And as it were, there were all these little towns
Speaker 5: nearby called Manglon, Manghai, mang mang Lan, and they generally
Speaker 5: had the same name, and there was all different little
Speaker 5: attractions to go and see in each one.
Speaker 1: There were very small, little rural villages, you know.
Speaker 5: And so I went one night to go stay in
Speaker 5: this treehouse in the Elephant reserve. And what had been
Speaker 5: happening was that all the groups of backpackers had been
Speaker 5: going there and having barbecues and sing alongs, and you know,
Speaker 5: they're all coming back on and it's really and you
Speaker 5: can stay in the treehouse and it's really and I
Speaker 5: thought I'll go do that, and without sort of consulting
Speaker 5: with anyone first, because I thought they'd already gone there,
Speaker 5: I got on the bus and traveled out there, and
Speaker 5: the guy that ran the place goes, oh, there's nobody
Speaker 5: there at the moment. But I walk you there and
Speaker 5: it was like a thirty minute walk into the jungle,
Speaker 5: and along the way, you know, he's pointing and going, oh, yeah,
Speaker 5: look that's a tiger print there. And then he actually
Speaker 5: got quite scared because he saw some fresh tiger poop
Speaker 5: and he's pointing at the tiger poop going on, poking
Speaker 5: up with a stick, going out, and he looked quite scared. Like, yeah,
Speaker 5: at the time, I was kind of like totally obliviously
Speaker 5: in the sense that I thought, oh, wow, yeah, tiger,
Speaker 5: Well look at that there's he's bore.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 5: I hadn't mentally processed the fact that I'm there just
Speaker 5: with this stood on a little trail, completely unarmed.
Speaker 1: Nothing there. And then when I'm.
Speaker 5: Years and years later, when I've watched videos of tigers
Speaker 5: attacking people, I'm going, damn, that.
Speaker 1: Was that was not a good spot.
Speaker 5: But he took me into this little spot where they
Speaker 5: had this treehouse. And when I say treehouse, it was
Speaker 5: more like one of those guard watch towers that you
Speaker 5: see in those old Second World War films, you know,
Speaker 5: the ones that they've got the big watchtower, you know,
Speaker 5: one of the the.
Speaker 1: Prison camps or whatever, you know those kind of towers.
Speaker 5: They built one of those, so it was quite safe,
Speaker 5: you know, as in secure and anyway, So I got
Speaker 5: there at two in the afternoon.
Speaker 1: I thought, oh, maybe some people will show up. Nobody did.
Speaker 5: So by six o'clock at night, I'd gone up to
Speaker 5: the top of the tower and there was a mid
Speaker 5: level entrance way and I closed that and I've gone
Speaker 5: up into the top part of the tower.
Speaker 1: And my real worry was pythons.
Speaker 5: There've been all this scuttle button talk about how this
Speaker 5: particular jungle area was rife with giant pythons and all
Speaker 5: these stories about people getting attacked, and so I'm lying
Speaker 5: there going, well, if I go to sleep, I don't
Speaker 5: want to wake up cuddling up to a python. So
Speaker 5: I'm looking at all the rafters and thinking there's trees
Speaker 5: around they could come in through there.
Speaker 1: That was my biggest worry. But nothing ever came of it.
Speaker 5: But the following morning, as I was walking back out
Speaker 5: of the trail, so I got through the night, I
Speaker 5: was so I sort of went to bed about twelve,
Speaker 5: and I was not really too scared. I was just
Speaker 5: a bit like worried about rats or anything coming into.
Speaker 1: The area because it wasn't sealed off, you know.
Speaker 5: And as I'm walking back out, I got kind of
Speaker 5: quarter of the way down the path and just in
Speaker 5: this small little clearing, I'm looking at this this It
Speaker 5: was a cactus about five foot tall, I would have said.
Speaker 5: And as I kind of walked off the pathway to
Speaker 5: take a good look at it, I'm treading really carefully
Speaker 5: on the ground, mind you, because I'm worried about snakes
Speaker 5: all the other creepy crawlies that there were. I kind
Speaker 5: of get to this palm and it's sitting in this
Speaker 5: little clearing all by itself, and I'm sort of thinking, wow,
Speaker 5: look at you, you know. And it had like one
Speaker 5: of the arms holding up like you know, you'd hold
Speaker 5: your arm up to say hi, you know. And it
Speaker 5: had two arms, like one was hanging down by its
Speaker 5: side and the other one was sort of up. And
Speaker 5: it didn't really have a bulbous head, but it almost
Speaker 5: looked like there was a certain differentiation between the head
Speaker 5: of the top of it and the main body of it.
Speaker 5: I'm sort of looking at it and it just really
Speaker 5: really sort of. It just had an effect on me.
Speaker 5: I don't know why, because I'm in the middle of
Speaker 5: this dense stick jungle and there's this little clearing and
Speaker 5: there's this cactus and it's like an arm kind of
Speaker 5: and I literally just sort of held one arm up
Speaker 5: like the same thing I said, how you doing, buddy,
Speaker 5: kind of thing, like talking to myself, and I just
Speaker 5: had this little moment with this cactus. Then as I'm
Speaker 5: walking back down the trail, I can hear all this
Speaker 5: ruckus going up on my head. Funny thing is like
Speaker 5: there was a thirty forty minute drive out of Ginghong,
Speaker 5: and as I'm walking up the trail, there's this.
Speaker 1: Big, you know, hoo haa boo ha kind of going.
Speaker 5: On, and it's all these businessmen, all dressed up really
Speaker 5: you know flash, and they're all larking around this small
Speaker 5: little platform that was there to look at the elephants,
Speaker 5: but there weren't any elephants around, and they all kind
Speaker 5: of looking at me, going.
Speaker 1: Where did you just come from? Where did you come from?
Speaker 5: And I'm pointing down that way and I kind of
Speaker 5: gesture like I slept there last night, and they're going, oh,
Speaker 5: one of them could just speak a bit of English,
Speaker 5: and so we all walked back to the Butterfly Sanctuary,
Speaker 5: which is where this place was, and it turned out
Speaker 5: that they were a bunch of city officials from Jinghong
Speaker 5: and they'd all driven out there in their flash cars
Speaker 5: to go to the Butterfly Sanctuary and get some photos,
Speaker 5: tank taken or whatever. So they gave me a lift
Speaker 5: back into Ginghong, and then I ended up having lunch,
Speaker 5: a real big, huge gala lunch at these guys. So
Speaker 5: I got a lift back and a free lunch as
Speaker 5: a reward for my troubles.
Speaker 1: But that cactus stuck with me for years.
Speaker 5: And then it would have been I don't know, maybe
Speaker 5: two or three years, four years down the track, nineteen
Speaker 5: ninety six ish and I just come back from working
Speaker 5: in the gold mineup and Mika, Sarah and I had
Speaker 5: got together with an made of mine who'd also done film,
Speaker 5: and we said, let's let's write down this idea for
Speaker 5: a really good children's TV show, you know, like with
Speaker 5: all these characters that live in a forest. And as
Speaker 5: we're kind of running through all the different characters that
Speaker 5: live in the forest, that's when I kind of pitched
Speaker 5: to him the idea of this plant like character that's
Speaker 5: gone and traveled the world, and you know, he's staying
Speaker 5: the good and the bad of humanity. Has you know,
Speaker 5: been in war zones, has been in loving families, has
Speaker 5: you know, experienced the whole spectrum of humanity, and and
Speaker 5: has sort of galvanized into this good hearted but gritty
Speaker 5: kind of character. He's sort of like the foil of
Speaker 5: the more happy, go lucky characters. So you know how
Speaker 5: when you do have some of these kids shows, you've
Speaker 5: got this real chirpy, bubbly kind of character. We thought
Speaker 5: it'd be a bit of a comic foil to have
Speaker 5: this kind of like well, you know, sort of old,
Speaker 5: cranky sort of character. And that's where he sort of
Speaker 5: initially kind of was pitched to life. And my mate
Speaker 5: gave him the double thumbs up. So that's a good character.
Speaker 5: We never got anywhere. We wrote a few We wrote
Speaker 5: a whole.
Speaker 1: Twenty four.
Speaker 5: Series, twenty four thirty minute episode series with all the
Speaker 5: character breakdowns and the synopsis and everything, and you know,
Speaker 5: we went around and peddled it to all the studios
Speaker 5: and TV stations and producers that we could find in Perth,
Speaker 5: and I even reached out to the ABC head of
Speaker 5: ABC Children's Development and center the script. But again, it's
Speaker 5: all comes down to someone not really wanting to cough
Speaker 5: the money up, you know, to produce it. So we
Speaker 5: just shelved it. And that's where it kind of when
Speaker 5: it was, it was a fun endeavor. It was good
Speaker 5: for us because you always, I don't know, it's good
Speaker 5: when you've got hope going. You know, you're operating on
Speaker 5: a sense of hope and mism. So it got shelved.
Speaker 5: And then years later I just sat down and I
Speaker 5: was writing this kind of this this section about a
Speaker 5: guy who joins the French resistance, you know, during German
Speaker 5: occupied France.
Speaker 1: And I was looking and reading a lot.
Speaker 5: Of books on the occupation of France and all the
Speaker 5: things that went on during that period of time in
Speaker 5: the early forties to forty four forty five, and that's
Speaker 5: when I sort of revisited this character, and I thought,
Speaker 5: you know, what, what if this guy, you know, has
Speaker 5: an origin story, and then he keeps going, and he
Speaker 5: keeps meeting people and joining up and you know, he
Speaker 5: wanders through life a little bit Forrest Gumpty, but not
Speaker 5: a full on you know, replication of but in that
Speaker 5: similar vein, you know.
Speaker 4: And similar little.
Speaker 5: Similar, yeah, little little similar, but not quite the you know,
Speaker 5: the exact carbon copy of it, but in that vein.
Speaker 4: So this idea that came in your head almost thirty
Speaker 4: years ago, it's come out in the form of a
Speaker 4: book today.
Speaker 1: Yep.
Speaker 4: Wow, that's incredible.
Speaker 1: Yeah. That's life, isn't it. That's that's everything going on.
Speaker 1: I must say that I've.
Speaker 5: Been writing a bit by bit, you know, over the years.
Speaker 5: I've I've I've had a lot of difficulty with depression,
Speaker 5: and so you know, I'll go through phases where I
Speaker 5: don't do anything creative and I just knuckle down on
Speaker 5: going off and doing a job and bringing in some money.
Speaker 5: And then I start to sort of climb out of
Speaker 5: that and then I go, you know what, I'm going
Speaker 5: to revisit that and go back to it. And I
Speaker 5: guess that's the process that's happened with this book.
Speaker 1: Particular. So in that a couple of years.
Speaker 5: Ago, I I never realized what the detrimental effect of
Speaker 5: having a stalker.
Speaker 1: In your life can have on you.
Speaker 5: I mean, if there's obviously there's people listening who may
Speaker 5: be able to relate to or no people who have
Speaker 5: had stalkers. And I mean we're always led to believe
Speaker 5: that it's males that can be stalkers, you know, and
Speaker 5: females of the but that happens.
Speaker 1: The genders can be different. And I wasn't aware of it.
Speaker 5: I didn't know that I had this person from my past,
Speaker 5: and I mean a long, long time ago on my past,
Speaker 5: who has been following me, stalking me. I'd find out
Speaker 5: that I was working somewhere, living somewhere, and then it
Speaker 5: was only after the fact that I'd find out that.
Speaker 1: This person had turned up there.
Speaker 5: And it gets under your skin because I've had I've
Speaker 5: had friends back when I was living in Perth some
Speaker 5: thirty years ago. My girlfriend at the time, she had
Speaker 5: a friend who had been horribly stalked by this chap
Speaker 5: and he'd not only stalked her, he'd stalked her sister
Speaker 5: as well, and you know, there was telephone calls and
Speaker 5: following around and they turn up and I used to
Speaker 5: shake my head and think, how how on earth do
Speaker 5: you deal with that? And it's it's to the point
Speaker 5: where most of the people and I've known quite a
Speaker 5: few people over the years who have had stalkers. They
Speaker 5: end up relocating continually, you know, and they move away
Speaker 5: from their home, and it's a horrible thing because you know,
Speaker 5: the stork is not only destroying their sense of security,
Speaker 5: but also their relationships with their family and their friends
Speaker 5: because they're literally driven away from where they live, you know.
Speaker 5: And anyway, so a couple of years ago I became
Speaker 5: aware of this person and the fact that they'd also
Speaker 5: I don't even want to give credit or energy to
Speaker 5: the allegations that they were saying, but they were just horrible,
Speaker 5: heneous accusations that were being sort of seeded.
Speaker 1: I guess it's the word.
Speaker 5: And it was funny because I kept recalling having conversations
Speaker 5: with people and I was going, boys, that was odd,
Speaker 5: that was a bit cold. That person's normally warm and jovial,
Speaker 5: and that was a bit gruff. And I couldn't figure
Speaker 5: it out why. And then only after someone very close
Speaker 5: and dear spelled it out to me and what had
Speaker 5: been going on.
Speaker 1: I'm at this point having a discussion.
Speaker 5: With a lawyer, and this lawyer works with the private
Speaker 5: investigator who specializes in defamation.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I try and pray for guidance.
Speaker 5: I pray for guidance every second moment of the day
Speaker 5: with everything, and I kind of feel now like more
Speaker 5: just moving on, moving away. But the problem is how
Speaker 5: do you get the person to stop, you know, and.
Speaker 4: Especially when you have a family, it's ye know, that
Speaker 4: affects everyone, it sure does.
Speaker 5: You know, I know, I mean, you know, we're in
Speaker 5: a nice little community here, you know, we're I'm so
Speaker 5: thankful and lucky for the part time work that I've
Speaker 5: I've got My wife and I both work at hurt
Speaker 5: Call and gadd She works at the front counter doing
Speaker 5: the carbookings and rentals, and I work in the car
Speaker 5: wash where we do the returns and process the cars
Speaker 5: and then we move them around and bust the cars
Speaker 5: from here to they're aware of they're needed. I also
Speaker 5: work at a subsidiary, like a budget version owned by Hertz,
Speaker 5: which is called ACE Car Rentals, and it's more of
Speaker 5: a budget one where they have an off site spot
Speaker 5: and customers go there collect their car and we offer
Speaker 5: a courtesy shuttle bus. So I work at both those sites,
Speaker 5: and the people I work with and the most wonderful
Speaker 5: group of people really fortunate to have taken on the work.
Speaker 5: I was encouraged by initially by the guy who was
Speaker 5: the manager at the wash. He just said, look, no,
Speaker 5: you'll fit in fine here. Don't worry about your age.
Speaker 5: And you know, so two years ago, that was a
Speaker 5: turning point. It was the same time that I found
Speaker 5: out that this person had been you know, following me
Speaker 5: around and spreading malicious kind of you know, gossip and
Speaker 5: romas behind my back that had been unbeknignst to me,
Speaker 5: affecting you know, my interactions. And I was in this
Speaker 5: really deep depression and I started writing. I started writing
Speaker 5: the book, and then I went to do a preface,
Speaker 5: and in that preface, I sort of wrote about where
Speaker 5: I was at in that position. But I also made
Speaker 5: sure that I put in there all the things that
Speaker 5: I was doing to combat that situation, to combat the depression,
Speaker 5: to you know, have a positive outlook, you know, on life,
Speaker 5: and you know, turning to prayer, turning turning to God,
Speaker 5: you know, stepping out of your negative way of thinking.
Speaker 1: And I've worded all that into the preface at that.
Speaker 5: Time, and and I was going to leave that out
Speaker 5: when I sort of got to the point maybe two
Speaker 5: or three months ago, where I neared the end of
Speaker 5: this section Book one, and I thought that's too heavy.
Speaker 1: I'm not going to put that in there.
Speaker 5: But then I read back through it and I thought, no,
Speaker 5: there's stuff in here that could help someone.
Speaker 1: There's there's there's messages.
Speaker 5: In this prefaces heavy as it is that I believe
Speaker 5: could be of value to someone in the same shoes,
Speaker 5: you know. So I left it in there. I don't
Speaker 5: know if it was the right thing to do, but
Speaker 5: I left it in there. So it's a sort of
Speaker 5: it's a funny, it's a funny, eclectic kind of narrative
Speaker 5: this book. It goes well into the whole conspiracy of
Speaker 5: the elites and what's being done to it, you know,
Speaker 5: the the machinations of what's created wars in the past
Speaker 5: and what will continue to create wars if we don't
Speaker 5: wake up to it and do something about it. It's
Speaker 5: a call to arms in many aspects of the book.
Speaker 5: So when people say to me, what's it about, I say,
Speaker 5: it's it's.
Speaker 1: It's a kind of it's a rocky roads. It's a
Speaker 1: p and ham soup kind of narrative.
Speaker 4: The reader will get a lot of bang for their buck.
Speaker 4: It's pages, so you certainly put a lot of thought
Speaker 4: and effort in detail into your book.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's Look, if I don't if they don't get
Speaker 5: a good rate out of it, at least have got
Speaker 5: a good doorstop.
Speaker 4: There you go. I have a couple of questions to
Speaker 4: ask you. First of all, going back, you were in
Speaker 4: China for three years. I know personally a handful of
Speaker 4: people who have lived in China multiple years, some English
Speaker 4: a second language as well, others in the tech industry.
Speaker 4: They all loved it. And I know every country uses
Speaker 4: propaganda to narrate or to dictate a certain mindset to people,
Speaker 4: but everyone who I know personally who has gone just
Speaker 4: loved it. What was your thoughts exactly that it was?
Speaker 1: It was a bit of a love height relationship.
Speaker 5: I say that because it's a wonderful place in the
Speaker 5: Chinese people in general are just the most loveliest people.
Speaker 5: The thing that used to get this is a nauty
Speaker 5: expression doing my head in. The thing that used to
Speaker 5: do my head in was when you would encounter sort
Speaker 5: of everybody's not a lot of people are on the take,
Speaker 5: you know, so there's always a shakedown going on somewhere.
Speaker 5: You might be you're buying a pair of shoes in
Speaker 5: a shop, or you're you know, you're you're trying to
Speaker 5: do something somewhere or whatever, and there's always this kind
Speaker 5: of like shakedown.
Speaker 1: It's the red envelope syndrome. Everybody.
Speaker 5: Everybody needs a red envelope put in their hand to
Speaker 5: grease the wheels to make things, you know, happen and move.
Speaker 5: And not always, but in general, my love of it
Speaker 5: was the vivacity, the good humor there there. They've got
Speaker 5: a damn good sense of humor of the Chinese.
Speaker 1: And I loved it. I love that.
Speaker 5: I love the kind of I think as an Australian
Speaker 5: there's there's a certain certain similar kind of outlook and
Speaker 5: vibe to life that the Chinese general, Chinese people have
Speaker 5: that is a little bit kind of in many ways.
Speaker 1: And I know someone might argue with me that it's not,
Speaker 1: but I.
Speaker 5: Say that there's a bit of ozziness to their outlook
Speaker 5: on life. You know, they've got this kind of rough
Speaker 5: and ready, you know, let's let's give it a crack,
Speaker 5: let's have a go. These are expressions that we use
Speaker 5: a lot nice you know, like old expressions. You know,
Speaker 5: have a go mate, have a go mate, go on,
Speaker 5: give it a go, and that sort of attitudes like,
Speaker 5: you know, get in there, give it to give it
Speaker 5: a shot. And that's how I used to see a
Speaker 5: lot of the Chinese people. I knew they had that
Speaker 5: outlook on life. But also, you know, the you never
Speaker 5: really hear discuss or talk much about the politics while
Speaker 5: you're there. Nobody gets into great deep discussions about the
Speaker 5: government doing this or the government doing that.
Speaker 1: It's just life.
Speaker 5: Everybody's getting on with life, you know. And I've met
Speaker 5: hung out with and talked with government officials, city officials,
Speaker 5: and you know, they're just doing business, getting on with life.
Speaker 1: It's all bit business, you know.
Speaker 5: And so my biggest negative, George was and it's the
Speaker 5: reason why that we put the sort of why I
Speaker 5: put my foot down to stay here and not go back,
Speaker 5: because we initially came down here to deliver our second
Speaker 5: daughter with the intention of going back to Qingdao and
Speaker 5: Lou Lou and my wife, she had about a month
Speaker 5: ago before delivering Aurora, our second, our youngest, and we
Speaker 5: were going to get back on the plane and fly
Speaker 5: back up.
Speaker 1: There as soon as you know.
Speaker 5: The bub was ready to go, and Lou was ready
Speaker 5: to go too, and The thing that got me the
Speaker 5: most and really put me off is the food safety
Speaker 5: issues in China.
Speaker 4: You didn't like the bat soup.
Speaker 5: Everything, George, Like, I'll run a few off, like for
Speaker 5: a while. They're my favorite brand of dumplings, frozen dumplings
Speaker 5: that I would go and get at the supermarket and
Speaker 5: always have them in the freezer, and they were kind
Speaker 5: of like a quick go to snack. Yeah, we got home,
Speaker 5: we we got homemate from work, and I wanted just
Speaker 5: to check something in the in the boiler and have
Speaker 5: a food. I'd grab these dumplings and sometimes I'd fry them,
Speaker 5: and you know, they were they were great.
Speaker 1: You know, I know, I just knew that brand, knew
Speaker 1: that packet.
Speaker 5: Then Lou Shows put me some undercover video footage of
Speaker 5: a factory where they've got all these old people sitting
Speaker 5: around with piles of newspaper and they're smushing them up,
Speaker 5: mashing them up, adding flavor, doing they're doing that. They
Speaker 5: were the fillings for the dumplings that I've been eating.
Speaker 4: Oh my goodness.
Speaker 5: Yeah away, yeah, well I've been eating them for about
Speaker 5: six months. Yeah, I was okay, no problem at all.
Speaker 5: It's just that when I go past the news agency.
Speaker 5: Now and I smell that newspaper smell, I start to salivate.
Speaker 4: Incredible.
Speaker 5: Yeah, when I when I when I when I smell newspaper,
Speaker 5: I get hungry.
Speaker 4: Now that's funny. I was going to joke about the
Speaker 4: hardest part of living in China was fund in a
Speaker 4: good Chinese restaurant. But after that story, my goodness, gracious.
Speaker 1: There's no there's no shortage of good restaurants. There really is.
Speaker 5: There's a lot of them, there's and you find all
Speaker 5: these little wonderful hole in the wall kind of little
Speaker 5: family run you know. It's just a matter of being
Speaker 5: in that city long enough, discovering this. Someone shows you this.
Speaker 5: I come to this little noodle shop and you go
Speaker 5: in there and it's just the most delicious food you've
Speaker 5: ever eaten in the most rustic, you know, very basic setup,
Speaker 5: you know, and at the end of the day, you know,
Speaker 5: you know, it's it's it's the quality can be anywhere
Speaker 5: to be found. And I just love so many other
Speaker 5: things about living there.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 5: We used to get to and from work on an
Speaker 5: old electric scooter. This is back in two thousand and seven,
Speaker 5: before all the electric craze has taken over. Now that's
Speaker 5: and we used to jump on that and ride it
Speaker 5: into work. And you know, we could put all our
Speaker 5: grocers and shopping loaded up on it rain hale or shine,
Speaker 5: and we park it in a little urage and charge
Speaker 5: it overnight. So you know, we just had this wonderful lifestyle.
Speaker 5: The classes were good. The school that I taught at
Speaker 5: was just fantastic. It was enjoyable. I did a good job.
Speaker 5: I was a good E s L teacher. And I
Speaker 5: can say that not out of ego, just out of
Speaker 5: self satisfaction and confidence that that I delivered a good
Speaker 5: job when I was there and made sure that they
Speaker 5: got to be able to speak English well and understood.
Speaker 5: And I taught in a kind of you know quite
Speaker 5: uh yeah, so we we really I loved it. And
Speaker 5: the beautiful part about it was that in the city
Speaker 5: we lived in, which was Young Joe, which is one
Speaker 5: hour north of Nanjing, we were so lucky because we
Speaker 5: had an actual proper functioning Catholic church with a priest,
Speaker 5: and it was a beautiful little cathedral, and they had
Speaker 5: Sunday Mass on a Sunday morning, and Louyanne and I
Speaker 5: would go every Sunday morning to to to the to
Speaker 5: the mass, and then when we when I proposed to
Speaker 5: Lou and she said yes, then we organized to have
Speaker 5: the wedding and we actually got to have a traditional
Speaker 5: Western wedding in a in a in a church with
Speaker 5: a priest in China, and my family all flew out,
Speaker 5: and Lou's family who all live in the Northern interland
Speaker 5: in Shandong, way up in the north, they all jumped
Speaker 5: on a number of vehicles that made the epic journey
Speaker 5: down to jung Zhau. So what was beautiful about that
Speaker 5: as well, was we got to bring both families together
Speaker 5: like you do at a wedding, you know, and to
Speaker 5: be able to do that as an international marriage couple
Speaker 5: was quite thing. And so you know, we had a
Speaker 5: beautiful little wedding and this beautiful little church, and then
Speaker 5: we had a traditional Western style reception afterwards where everyone
Speaker 5: got to sit around and have a drink, talk to
Speaker 5: each other speeches.
Speaker 1: The Chinese version of a reception is a little bit rushed.
Speaker 1: It's very very part part, part, part, next thing, next thing,
Speaker 1: next thing.
Speaker 5: Here's the dishes is this is that okay, dune, dun dun, dun, dune, Okay,
Speaker 5: everybody out. I don't mean to sound disrespectful or too critical,
Speaker 5: but it is very rushed and you don't get time
Speaker 5: to talk to everybody else who's at the reception. You'll
Speaker 5: just sit at your table and they'll bring the dishes out,
Speaker 5: there'll be some.
Speaker 1: Speeches, there'll be this, they'll be.
Speaker 5: That, and it's very short, only goes through about an
Speaker 5: hour or hour and a half, whereas we didn't want that.
Speaker 1: So we were lucky.
Speaker 5: We got to have a really good, old fashioned reception
Speaker 5: and all her family and the kids and everyone mixed,
Speaker 5: and we had to speed, and I was so thankful.
Speaker 5: When I look back on it now, I think we
Speaker 5: were lucky, you know. And so I don't have any
Speaker 5: really bad reflections on China other than the problem with
Speaker 5: the food. And that's why I didn't want to raise
Speaker 5: the kids with that always looming threat of something. And
Speaker 5: there's unscrupulous, unscrupulous business operators with food who will do
Speaker 5: anything without account in the world, you know, like you
Speaker 5: would have heard about the Do you ever hear about
Speaker 5: the malamine and the baby formula?
Speaker 4: Yes, I've heard that, yes, And.
Speaker 5: That's just kind of a glaring another one that's quite
Speaker 5: horrendous and this isn't made up at the crematoriums. You know,
Speaker 5: if you can imagine how many people in China pass
Speaker 5: away each day, it's one.
Speaker 1: Point five billion people.
Speaker 5: I got told that a thousand people a day die
Speaker 5: on the roads, and I said, that can't be right.
Speaker 5: A thousand people a day. You know, we win in Australia.
Speaker 5: We've got an annual road toll of about two hundred
Speaker 5: at the you know, they're about three.
Speaker 1: Hundred if it's bad.
Speaker 5: And someone's trying to tell me a thousand people a day,
Speaker 5: and I thought, no, that can't be right. But then
Speaker 5: a lot of people started to say no, it averages
Speaker 5: out to about a thousand people a day die on
Speaker 5: their roads, and I was all, no, that can't be
Speaker 5: But there's a lot of people dying each day, that's
Speaker 5: a given. And when they cremate them, there's a lot
Speaker 5: of the this is quite gross, but a lot of
Speaker 5: the body fat they collect, you know, the fat from
Speaker 5: the when they cremate the body. And so there's a
Speaker 5: lot of unscrupulous restaurants that go and buy that byproduct
Speaker 5: or the waste the fat from the crematoriums and take
Speaker 5: it back to their restaurants and use it in their
Speaker 5: restaurants as unbelievable.
Speaker 4: As they are eating any shrimp fried race anytime soon
Speaker 4: after this conversation. But going back with what you said,
Speaker 4: there is articles while you were talking. According to the
Speaker 4: United Nations World Population Prospects Report, approximately this is as
Speaker 4: of twenty nineteen, about twenty seven hundred people die in
Speaker 4: China every single day.
Speaker 1: Wow, so's it's pretty.
Speaker 4: Spattle and yep, that's amazing when you think about it.
Speaker 5: So, the the Garta oil was another one where they
Speaker 5: would collect the dirty sewer. The sewers would outside the
Speaker 5: restaurant districts would be full of all the oil that
Speaker 5: they'd wash wash down the sink and you know, they
Speaker 5: call it Garta oil because it would float on top
Speaker 5: of the all the others and all these people would
Speaker 5: go in lift the lid off the manhole and they'd
Speaker 5: have these scoops and they'd scoop out the oil and
Speaker 5: take it back and reprocess it to sell.
Speaker 1: So oil was the other thing. Getting good oil was
Speaker 1: always a worry.
Speaker 5: But anyway, yea, So there was only that that was
Speaker 5: my biggest one. The air pollution wasn't too bad in
Speaker 5: the cities we lived in. Yeah, Young Jail was a
Speaker 5: lovely city with weather. Ching Dao was beautiful too, so
Speaker 5: we didn't have that problem that some of the biggest
Speaker 5: cities have where it can literally be too dangerous to
Speaker 5: go outside some days if the weather's not waxing lyrical.
Speaker 5: So the flat Earth journey for me George began I
Speaker 5: around about two thousand and seventeen, and.
Speaker 1: It was when we hadn't been.
Speaker 5: Put under the spell of the algorithms that would stop
Speaker 5: you from going to look at anything you know now
Speaker 5: as it is now. You know, if I go and
Speaker 5: put in you know, the Flat Earth by Dave Weice
Speaker 5: or something that is a video that's been put together
Speaker 5: by Eric Dubai or someone, I won't get that, even
Speaker 5: though if I put in the exact words, it.
Speaker 1: Won't bring it to me.
Speaker 5: But back in I think it was two thousand and
Speaker 5: seventy eight, I've been sitting there and I was looking
Speaker 5: at this guy doing a YouTube video on the Apollo
Speaker 5: fifteen lunar module lander and he was going over it
Speaker 5: bit by bit with a fine to his climb, just
Speaker 5: looking at all of these anomalies and inconsistencies, and it
Speaker 5: was just this one bit that jumped out of me,
Speaker 5: and it was these panels on the side of the
Speaker 5: lunar module that looked like they've been put together by
Speaker 5: a bunch of year ten students doing the craft project.
Speaker 5: And they were out of kilter. They weren't even sitting
Speaker 5: on properly. One was overlapping, and I thought, hang on
Speaker 5: a minute, this is this is NASA, this is a
Speaker 5: it is supposed.
Speaker 1: To be a you know, a.
Speaker 5: State of the art, no expense spared everything, lock stock
Speaker 5: and two smoking barrels in place, and this thing looks
Speaker 5: so shoddy.
Speaker 1: It's not funny.
Speaker 5: And then I began to drill down on the lunar module,
Speaker 5: just looking more and more at it, going this whole thing,
Speaker 5: even the old crater underneath it, there's no there's no
Speaker 5: splash throwing underneath it. You know, whether that one thruster should.
Speaker 4: Have anything nothing.
Speaker 5: Nothing, You know, you've you've got that big how many
Speaker 5: hundred pounds thruster on the bottom and it hasn't as
Speaker 5: so much as even you know, created a saucer sort
Speaker 5: of within the you know, the powdery dust that by rights,
Speaker 5: I mean you should be looking at that. Those three
Speaker 5: legs should be should be on the edge.
Speaker 1: Or part way down a big, huge crater, you know.
Speaker 5: And so I started looking at it more and more,
Speaker 5: and that for some reason brought up on my feed
Speaker 5: a whole lot of stuff by Eric Dubai Dubai, and
Speaker 5: so I started to look at that, and straight away
Speaker 5: it was kind of like everything started to make sense.
Speaker 5: Everything began to make sense as I looked at it,
Speaker 5: watched it. All these experiences I've had over the years here,
Speaker 5: there and everywhere all started to add up. Like I
Speaker 5: mentioned before, I worked in Mekasarra, which is seven hundred
Speaker 5: kilometers northwest of Perth, the capital of Western Australia, and
Speaker 5: Mekasara sits out in the desert, and I was working
Speaker 5: in a gold mine. I was on the drill and
Speaker 5: blast crew and we didn't have fly in and fly
Speaker 5: out back in the early nineties. We had drive yourself in,
Speaker 5: drive yourself out, and it was the seven hundred kilometer
Speaker 5: drive and we only got one weekend off every two weeks.
Speaker 5: So we'd work twelve days straight and we'd knock off
Speaker 5: early on Friday, and if you wanted to go down
Speaker 5: to the big city, you had to get in your
Speaker 5: car and drive down there and then be back.
Speaker 1: At work for Monday.
Speaker 5: So I had to come back seven hundred kilometers on
Speaker 5: Sunday afternoon. So I used to drive my car down
Speaker 5: and back all the time, so you can imagine.
Speaker 1: And on that drive, I used to.
Speaker 5: Sit there and I just stare off at the road
Speaker 5: going look at that I can that just goes, you know,
Speaker 5: directly off into the distance, an event horizon, you know.
Speaker 5: And when I started to watch the flat Earth videos,
Speaker 5: I just.
Speaker 1: Went, Okay, I get that. And then I.
Speaker 5: Started to look at the pythagorm serreum, the curvature of
Speaker 5: the Earth, and how much of a drop we get
Speaker 5: per meter or something gets away from us.
Speaker 1: If I stand here at the groin at Kira.
Speaker 5: Beach, we call it groin like a rock jetty jettie
Speaker 5: made of rocks. So if I stand on the outcrop
Speaker 5: of rocks at Kira Beach here and I look north
Speaker 5: along the coast to where surface paradise is, I can
Speaker 5: see all the skyline. They're clear as day on a
Speaker 5: flat day. Now, that's no refraction, that's no light reflecting
Speaker 5: on you know, h two gas in the and as
Speaker 5: all these other people trying to explain it, away.
Speaker 1: There's no explaining it away.
Speaker 5: You stand there on a good clear day when there's
Speaker 5: a flat, low swell ocean, and you can see from
Speaker 5: top to bottom all of those big skyscrape business surface paradise,
Speaker 5: And if you look even further to the right, you
Speaker 5: can see the skyline at Brisbane. And once this fell
Speaker 5: into place, I just went, well, here's your proof, and
Speaker 5: this makes sense to anyone.
Speaker 1: Why can I see that when I shouldn't be even.
Speaker 5: Able to see at least the bottom third of those
Speaker 5: buildings or halfway, and I should not be able to
Speaker 5: see any way, shape or form any of the skyline
Speaker 5: in Brisbane off in the distance. But yet there they
Speaker 5: are there, just like that lake I think you've got
Speaker 5: in the States.
Speaker 1: What is it? Is it Lake Michigan?
Speaker 4: Yep, yep.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: That was a big what to do about some Chicago
Speaker 4: news stations saying it's refraction what you're seeing.
Speaker 1: Folks, that's that's right. Yeah.
Speaker 5: I remember seeing all the news, the weatherman trying to
Speaker 5: put a bit of GST over the top of it
Speaker 5: to try and explain it away. So that for me,
Speaker 5: it just fell into place. And when it did it
Speaker 5: something happened. It really something beautiful. I think you could
Speaker 5: say it has beautiful happened. I just I really just
Speaker 5: had this beautiful feeling come over me. And it was
Speaker 5: like like I was looking at the world through a
Speaker 5: whole new lens, and a lot of the darkness that
Speaker 5: I had in me about the world and all of
Speaker 5: the machinations and all of the dark, sinister stuff that
Speaker 5: you know, I was out there. It's somehow or rather
Speaker 5: managed to mitigate that. It's somehow or other managed to
Speaker 5: make that go down. I had a more uplifted perspective.
Speaker 5: It brought me closer to God. It made me realize
Speaker 5: that we're not some insignificant spec floating around in space.
Speaker 5: I'm not just a little dust particle of existence meaning nothing.
Speaker 1: We're not hurtling through space.
Speaker 5: We're not about to get obliterated by a media or
Speaker 5: any minute now. We're in a beautiful little goddenrarium that
Speaker 5: was created by something we just can't even place and
Speaker 5: process in our mind as to the grandeur of what
Speaker 5: God's handiwork is.
Speaker 4: And I think that's the common theme that people come
Speaker 4: to understand. And then that is really the veil that
Speaker 4: falls from man's eye and you start to understand things
Speaker 4: like the Big Bang and evolution and all this other
Speaker 4: nonsense that science and sadly our governments try to push
Speaker 4: to us and our children via the education system. And
Speaker 4: I'm so glad by the way that you brought up
Speaker 4: the Apollo fifteen because that was probably, pardon me, one
Speaker 4: of the things that led me to believe wait a second,
Speaker 4: because I'm always you know, I was always a numbers guy,
Speaker 4: So you know, I look at the Apollo fifteen, the
Speaker 4: lunar roving vehicle, and I'm like, wait a second. You know,
Speaker 4: piece by piece, if you look at it, there's a
Speaker 4: lighting umbrella that photographers use. At the very top of
Speaker 4: that is like a sprinkler head, like the thing with
Speaker 4: if you want to turn on your faucet outside for
Speaker 4: your water. Just tires from a military vehicle. The two
Speaker 4: chairs are actually just seat frames ripped out of probably
Speaker 4: a military vehicle from the sixties. It's a joke. And
Speaker 4: when I found out that the US government, the taxpayers.
Speaker 1: Spend four forty seven million, which.
Speaker 4: In today, if you adjusted to today, that's three and
Speaker 4: a half billion dollars, there's something that probably cost them,
Speaker 4: I don't know, five or six thousand dollars.
Speaker 5: Do you know the finme the the actual fine which
Speaker 5: is the only real chesy body pot that you can see.
Speaker 5: To me, that looks like a weight up betle frame.
Speaker 5: I look at that and I think they've got a
Speaker 5: vede up betle fi. They've chucked a couple of lazy
Speaker 5: boy deck chairs on there. They've got, you know, some
Speaker 5: sort of battery pack on the back, and I question,
Speaker 5: I don't know about if you've had the same question
Speaker 5: come to mind as well. They allege that the wheels
Speaker 5: are made out of some sort of elaborate mesh frame with.
Speaker 1: With plating, and then they show.
Speaker 5: You these close up pictures of this alleged mesh framing,
Speaker 5: but then you never sort of get a good close
Speaker 5: up of it in situ with that mesh framing, alleged
Speaker 5: mesh framing that they used. So when you're looking at
Speaker 5: it from a distance, they look to me just like
Speaker 5: normal tires.
Speaker 4: Absolutely, yep. They look like heavy, douty military vehicle tires,
Speaker 4: like yeah from a cut beee yeah.
Speaker 5: And they are purporting, purporting that those tires are not
Speaker 5: air filled. There were some state of the art who
Speaker 5: was it? He made them?
Speaker 1: Uh?
Speaker 5: General not General? I think general motors were supposed to be.
Speaker 5: They designed this this mesh wiring fame with platelets on
Speaker 5: the out on the outside and so on and so forth,
Speaker 5: and they're not air filled. And then they show you
Speaker 5: these close ups of the tires.
Speaker 1: And they're they're they're, they're they're they're.
Speaker 5: They're like chicken not chicken white, but you know what
Speaker 5: I mean, like a kind of they're the one that
Speaker 5: they've got in.
Speaker 1: I've got a.
Speaker 5: Photo here I'm looking at right now, and it's it's
Speaker 5: in some museum somewhere.
Speaker 1: It's the rover.
Speaker 5: Where is it doesn't say because I've just got the picture,
Speaker 5: but it looks like it's sitting in a science museum
Speaker 5: or somewhere like that. And clearly in this photo you
Speaker 5: can see they're they're alleged mesh frame wheels tires, you know.
Speaker 1: There they are.
Speaker 5: Well, look that's the mesh tires with the little stirrups inside,
Speaker 5: you know, the steel strips.
Speaker 1: On the inside of the mesh.
Speaker 5: And I'm looking at that, I'm thinking, that doesn't look
Speaker 5: anything like the photos they've shown us, where it just
Speaker 5: looks like a plane old military rubber tie, you know,
Speaker 5: for jeep. So I think that's another big giveaway. When
Speaker 5: you look closely, you don't see that mesh on the tires.
Speaker 5: They look like good old rubber tires and they reckon.
Speaker 5: Also that the thing did ninety kilometers. So back in
Speaker 5: nineteen sixty nine, a couple of truck batteries, you know,
Speaker 5: batteries out of a Mack truck, a couple of Mac
Speaker 5: truck batteries as good as they would have been in
Speaker 5: sixty nine, weighing as much as they would have done
Speaker 5: to I can imagine they did ninety kilometers. They in
Speaker 5: an electric vehicle run onto truck batteries, and I'm thinking,
Speaker 5: hang on a minute. There was a guy coming in
Speaker 5: on a real snazzy looking e scooter through our front
Speaker 5: gate as I was driving in one day, and I
Speaker 5: was looking at us, going, mate, that, how fast does
Speaker 5: that thing you've got there go? And he said it'll
Speaker 5: do one hundred kilometers an hour?
Speaker 1: And I'm like, oh, my goodness, you know, like a hundred.
Speaker 1: I said what's your range?
Speaker 5: And he said, oh, one hundred and twenty kilometers, And
Speaker 5: I'm thinking, so that's where we are now. We've got
Speaker 5: these e scooters and e bikes that have a range
Speaker 5: of one hundred kilometers back in nineteen sixty nine. And
Speaker 5: that's with our new fangled lithium batteries. And I know
Speaker 5: from when Lou and I lived in.
Speaker 1: China and we're riding around on our.
Speaker 5: Electric scooter back in two thousand and seven that every
Speaker 5: six months when I went to change the batteries out,
Speaker 5: they got better and better.
Speaker 1: So every time the batteries.
Speaker 5: Needed changing, and they did, you know, with the running
Speaker 5: around that we did, he put new batteries in and
Speaker 5: he goes, oh, these ones are better. And I noticed
Speaker 5: that we got more mileage less charge time than the
Speaker 5: batteries we had prior to that set that got put in.
Speaker 5: And that's now all those years ago, nineteen sixty nine,
Speaker 5: they're claiming they drove ninety kilometers in this thing with
Speaker 5: two of them sitting in it. So two guys sitting
Speaker 5: in it all the doesn't look too heavy, I guess,
Speaker 5: But nonetheless try like that to me just doesn't add
Speaker 5: up either.
Speaker 4: So if you go back twenty years to two thousand
Speaker 4: and five, one of the more top of the lane EV's,
Speaker 4: the General Murders EV one had a range of roughly
Speaker 4: fifty to sixty miles on one charch. So that was
Speaker 4: two thousand and five, which was about twenty five years
Speaker 4: more advanced than the Lunar Rover.
Speaker 5: But in sixty nine they hooked it up to a
Speaker 5: couple of old Matt truck batteries and they drove ninety
Speaker 5: kilometers around on the Moon in it.
Speaker 4: Right, Yeah, And I'm sure they'll say it was you know,
Speaker 4: the lack of gravity and it didn't it was able
Speaker 4: to go yes, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 5: There was no there was no wind, no wind or
Speaker 5: something like that or the you know. But at the
Speaker 5: same time as well, have you ever seen the video
Speaker 5: of them popping.
Speaker 1: It out of the.
Speaker 5: Popping it out of the boot of the landing module
Speaker 5: where where the guy gets on the end of a
Speaker 5: rope and he kind of you see him go off camera,
Speaker 5: So i'd even say it's ah was thinking, yeah, how
Speaker 5: do you even know he's pulling on that cord like
Speaker 5: it First he grabs this cord, so to put it
Speaker 5: in perspective, you're looking at the bottom of the lunar
Speaker 5: modules sitting on the Moon, and he's got this cord
Speaker 5: attached to what looks like a kind of glove box
Speaker 5: on the bottom of the LM and then he walks
Speaker 5: around to the side of the right hand side of
Speaker 5: the camera and he gets off camera, and then the
Speaker 5: cord gets tugged on a little bit more, and so
Speaker 5: they're tugging on it and you sort of see you
Speaker 5: sort of see the glovebox. I'll call it a club
Speaker 5: box because that's what it looks like. You sort of
Speaker 5: see the cloudbox kind of pop open, and out pops
Speaker 5: the two front wheels of the lunar module lander like
Speaker 5: they kind of go boom, like it's a blow up, you.
Speaker 1: Know, one of those bloon animals.
Speaker 5: And they've had like a blue animal tucked in the
Speaker 5: glove box and it kind of popping out as they
Speaker 5: do it. Then he pulls it a bit further and
Speaker 5: it kind of folds folds folds out, so they've had
Speaker 5: it folded in half and it's kind of gone boom
Speaker 5: and it sprung out as a complete, you know, four
Speaker 5: wheel thing.
Speaker 1: And I'm thinking that just.
Speaker 4: Doesn't look right, not at all. And by the way,
Speaker 4: I should note that it is on display at the
Speaker 4: National Air and Space Museum in DC, which is only
Speaker 4: about ninety minutes from me. I should get a really
Speaker 4: good quality camera, go down there and take and close
Speaker 4: up pictures of that sone.
Speaker 5: It's probably the photo that I was just looking at
Speaker 5: where I said if clearly you can see those mesh wheels, yes,
Speaker 5: and yet it doesn't match up to the photos that
Speaker 5: you see of it on the moon.
Speaker 1: And at the end of the day, how on.
Speaker 5: Earth, how on earth did they ever come to forty
Speaker 5: seven million dollars for that?
Speaker 1: I mean, it's what's on there that's worth forty.
Speaker 4: Seven million, four hundred and forty seven million dollars, one
Speaker 4: hundred and four hundred and forty seven million US dollars
Speaker 4: half a billions, Oh my yeah, nice little seventy four
Speaker 4: hundred and forty seven million dollars, which is three point
Speaker 4: seven billion today. And you know, at first, when you
Speaker 4: hear those numbers, you laugh at how silly, how preposterous
Speaker 4: it is, but then you kind of get angry, like,
Speaker 4: not only did they deceive hundreds of millions, if not
Speaker 4: billions of people around the world, they stole from the blood,
Speaker 4: sweat and tears of the American.
Speaker 5: Taxpayers, yeah, hard and cash, how to and tax past
Speaker 5: dollars that could have gone into hospital, health schooling. I
Speaker 5: just care all the things that this money that they
Speaker 5: Citanists have, because that's what I at NASA is essentially an.
Speaker 1: Appendage of Sitan. That's all they are. That's that snake
Speaker 1: tongue in their logo is the serpent's.
Speaker 4: Tongue, and the symbolism is right there for people to see.
Speaker 4: And and and again. The people who are pro Trump
Speaker 4: but are flat earthers, that is like, I just don't
Speaker 4: get it. The guy who created space space force, the
Speaker 4: guy who was the godfather of warp speed. I could
Speaker 4: go on and on, but I want to keep it
Speaker 4: a political you know. It's just, man, it's right in
Speaker 4: your face. And people still like going back full circle
Speaker 4: to the beginning of your conversation, just trying to get
Speaker 4: people to even look at it, just to sit down
Speaker 4: for five minutes and to look into it. And it's
Speaker 4: so hard.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I like you.
Speaker 5: You say to someone who very very intelligent person, you say, look,
Speaker 5: the sun is ninety three million miles away, allegedly ninety
Speaker 5: three million miles away. And you'll be standing there on
Speaker 5: a beach with this person who's got very good rational,
Speaker 5: critical thinking skills, and you'll say, ninety three million miles away,
Speaker 5: those light rays should not be diffracting out like that
Speaker 5: right now, you point and you go look at those
Speaker 5: I forget the words you useful when they fan out
Speaker 5: the light rays planet fan out.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, I know what you're talking about. It's I'm
Speaker 4: escaping you right now, you know.
Speaker 5: So I sort of pointed out, I go, you do
Speaker 5: realize that if the sun is ninety three million miles away,
Speaker 5: like they alleged it is, that should not be happening.
Speaker 1: You should not be seeing that.
Speaker 5: You should not be seeing those light rays from the
Speaker 5: sun at this point in the afternoon with the clouds
Speaker 5: and all the beauty and everything that we're looking and now,
Speaker 5: because it's very beautiful, I said, we should not be
Speaker 5: seeing that. They should be if anything, if we could
Speaker 5: see them, which we shouldn't be able to see the
Speaker 5: rays because it's so far away. It should just be
Speaker 5: a diffuse, generic washed out. You know, it's so far away,
Speaker 5: you should not be getting that fanning out.
Speaker 1: And then they go yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, crepuscular race.
Speaker 1: That's it.
Speaker 5: Corpuscular race. Yeah, that's the one. And that's a local
Speaker 5: light source that's sitting in there, you know, And it's
Speaker 5: there in Genesis, it's there, and you know, you go
Speaker 5: through I wanted to ask a question though, in regards
Speaker 5: to what I know that's been brought up on the
Speaker 5: show before, but it escapes me as to what the
Speaker 5: general consensus was. I still wonder about shooting. When you
Speaker 5: see a shooting star falling star, what is it was saying?
Speaker 5: Has that come through the firmament? Has it maybe pushed
Speaker 5: its way or sort of somehow moved, trans transfused itself
Speaker 5: through the firm moment.
Speaker 4: There are a lot of theories on them, and obviously
Speaker 4: everybody's opinion is a theory. I always go back to.
Speaker 4: I try to be to be careful, and I tell
Speaker 4: this to people not as to use as a crutch,
Speaker 4: but to simply say that I'm not sure that God
Speaker 4: wants us to understand everything. It goes all the way
Speaker 4: back to the Tree of knowledge. I think there are
Speaker 4: just some things in the realm we live in that
Speaker 4: we can't even comprehend how it operates. Now, when when
Speaker 4: we pass on and we meet, you know, Jesus at
Speaker 4: the parlygates, will we look down and see all that
Speaker 4: and learn all that knowledge? Maybe, But I just think
Speaker 4: it's it's a lot. There's something is that just and
Speaker 4: again that's part of scientism, right, there has to be
Speaker 4: an explanation for everything. That's why they create evolution and
Speaker 4: the Big Bang theory and heliocentrism and all these things,
Speaker 4: because man, it's smarter than God. We have all the answers.
Speaker 4: But in retrospect, to be honest with you, I just
Speaker 4: think some things like why you can't see certain stars
Speaker 4: because you're in the the you know, southern equinox. Uh.
Speaker 4: These type of things are questions we can opine on
Speaker 4: and come up with theories, but that that's at the
Speaker 4: end of the the day, that's what they really are.
Speaker 1: Yeah, No, exactly. There couldn't agree more.
Speaker 5: There's some things you just don't get an answer to,
Speaker 5: you don't, you know, it's not not asked to know.
Speaker 5: And I think that's that's like you said, scientism always
Speaker 5: has to have an answer for it.
Speaker 1: Absolutely, you know.
Speaker 5: Just an interesting aside. I was doing a unit and
Speaker 5: I think it was about maybe you're and a half
Speaker 5: ago as one of the units for my course. It
Speaker 5: was a science teaching course, you know, like education and
Speaker 5: pedagogy and science or whatever it was called. And we
Speaker 5: had to do a video presentation at the end. And
Speaker 5: in the video presentation. We had to comment on the
Speaker 5: different subjects that we covered, and so I did. We
Speaker 5: got to the space and the moon landing, and of
Speaker 5: course I.
Speaker 1: Just I just unclipped. Anyway, I got a good mark.
Speaker 5: For the video because I presented it well, I wrote
Speaker 5: it well, and it was all you know, referenced and
Speaker 5: everything to a t. But then the lecture, the head
Speaker 5: lecture got me in asked me to come into office.
Speaker 5: You didn't drag me in by the ear or anything,
Speaker 5: but said she needed to urgently discuss the.
Speaker 1: Matter with me about the assignment.
Speaker 5: And I had an idea what it was, and she
Speaker 5: said that she needed to clarify with me that I
Speaker 5: would not.
Speaker 1: I had no.
Speaker 5: I did not intend to go into the classroom and
Speaker 5: teach my beliefs on flat Earth and NASA being a
Speaker 5: fakery factory and so on and so forth, because if
Speaker 5: she did, she could not allow me to do the
Speaker 5: course or something along those lines. It would mean I'd
Speaker 5: run into some serious flack. And I forget what the
Speaker 5: consequences were.
Speaker 1: But she was.
Speaker 5: More or less saying that these views were beliefs, and
Speaker 5: I needed to keep like religious beliefs, and I needed
Speaker 5: to keep those to myself, and I thought, wow, we're
Speaker 5: supposed to be a university that is teaching open and
Speaker 5: free thinking and trying to put teachers out there who
Speaker 5: might be able to make a change so on, and
Speaker 5: yet there we are, in some ways opera like a
Speaker 5: very traconian.
Speaker 1: Factory.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's our way or the highway instead of a
Speaker 4: group thing where you know, listen. Much of this we
Speaker 4: talk about biblical cosmology is biblical. However, using their math
Speaker 4: we can prove them wrong. So that should be something
Speaker 4: that you should be able to challenge.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 5: Well, funny enough, we were sitting where the university I
Speaker 5: go to is just next door to the Gold Coast Airport,
Speaker 5: which is just near the foreshore. So the building's quite tall.
Speaker 5: It's like five or six stories tall. So we're in
Speaker 5: her office and we're in the we're in the fourth
Speaker 5: floor or fifth floor, I think it was, of the
Speaker 5: building looking out over the Curra Beach in the ocean
Speaker 5: off into the distance on a sunny afternoon, and there's
Speaker 5: the Gold Coast off in the distance, and I'm looking.
Speaker 1: At that and looking at her, and I'm going thinking
Speaker 1: to myself, should.
Speaker 5: I should I point and bring them.
Speaker 1: And I thought, nah, forget. I just don't bother.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I guess you have to understand where the
Speaker 4: line is. And yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean we've all
Speaker 4: had to kind of put our not our pride, but
Speaker 4: you know, our beliefs. It's a tricky situation and the
Speaker 4: matrix we live in. Sometimes you have to make compromise.
Speaker 4: That's probably the correct word to use.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's unfortunate, but yeah true.
Speaker 5: To move to move through life, to get on, you've
Speaker 5: sort of got to I've been trying to explain this
Speaker 5: to my fortine year old daughter because she's become a
Speaker 5: bit of a fire brand. And I said to her,
Speaker 5: you know, and at fourteen, I know, I was that
Speaker 5: age and I was the same I you know, I
Speaker 5: just wouldn't back down from an argument. And she's my wife,
Speaker 5: being very fire brand herself. I've got these two at
Speaker 5: the moment they sort of go a bit.
Speaker 1: Head a head, you know, they go quite a lot
Speaker 1: head to head, you know, and I've got a.
Speaker 5: Sort of referee and and I was just explaining to
Speaker 5: my daughter this morning, you know, look, you know, sometimes
Speaker 5: you've just got to take a step back, nod your
Speaker 5: head and let go of it, you know, pick your battles.
Speaker 1: Pick what hill you want to make a stand on?
Speaker 5: But I said, you can't make a stand on every hill,
Speaker 5: and she's, I don't know if that's sunk in or not.
Speaker 4: Well, they're at that age where it's you know, you
Speaker 4: have to be patient and as they get older, they'll
Speaker 4: remember that conversation and it'll click, I hope.
Speaker 5: So it's tricky at this age now though, because you know,
Speaker 5: they want to they want to challenge everything, so you know,
Speaker 5: and but yeah, that was that was sort of that
Speaker 5: example where I just looked down at the window and
Speaker 5: I thought I could just point to those skyscrapers in
Speaker 5: the in the surface paradise now, that's what the name
Speaker 5: of the area is.
Speaker 1: It's called Service Paradise, and.
Speaker 5: It's about fifteen mile away from here. And I thought, look,
Speaker 5: I could just point there now and say to her
Speaker 5: do you see the skyline all the way from the
Speaker 5: top of the building to the bottom and even the shoreline?
Speaker 1: Can you?
Speaker 5: And I thought, then then she'll say yes, because clearly
Speaker 5: she wouldn't. Then I'll say, well, let's look at me,
Speaker 5: and I just saint, you know what, I just leave it.
Speaker 5: You know, that's sometimes I think, you know, I really
Speaker 5: struggle sometimes with the how much do you push and
Speaker 5: how much do you take a step back?
Speaker 4: You know, that's something we all struggle with, Mike.
Speaker 5: You know, at the end of the day, George, when
Speaker 5: I do pray for all the different things that I
Speaker 5: need help with, the number one thing I always pray
Speaker 5: for is guidance. I always always say, please guide me
Speaker 5: and everything I say and everything I do, please show
Speaker 5: me signposts or try and help me, you know, because
Speaker 5: I think guidance is just guidance is gold. And trying
Speaker 5: to you know, I'm fifty nine years of age, and
Speaker 5: I still have such challenges with trying to decide on
Speaker 5: all sorts of things, you know, decision making, and it's
Speaker 5: sort of I guess when I get to this age now,
Speaker 5: I'm trying my hardest to mitigate regret in my life,
Speaker 5: you know, to mitigate bad decisions, to mitigate having said
Speaker 5: the wrong thing to a person and having upset them
Speaker 5: and being a little bit on the spectrum. I've got Asperger's.
Speaker 5: It's always been a problem for me. I've always had
Speaker 5: a difficulty in you know, communicating where I'm trying to
Speaker 5: read the room and read the person. Do you know,
Speaker 5: what I mean absolutely, and that for me has been
Speaker 5: you know, one of the grounding forces is for me
Speaker 5: always in my prayer it's it's please guide me.
Speaker 1: Please, please just steer me in the right direction.
Speaker 5: Help me to do your work wherever it's possible for
Speaker 5: me to do it. Help me to guide me in
Speaker 5: my words, you know, please, you know, if if I'm
Speaker 5: going somewhere or whatever, I'm always well, you know, please
Speaker 5: please just steer me.
Speaker 1: Protect me.
Speaker 5: And you know, the same prayer I say over my kids,
Speaker 5: for my wife as well. But yes, it's not easy
Speaker 5: trying to make your way through the world when you
Speaker 5: know this. There's so much bipolar viewpoints and perspectives.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 4: And with the Internet and social media and instant gratification,
Speaker 4: I think as helpful as the Internet is, I think
Speaker 4: it has kind of disconnected people personally.
Speaker 5: Yeah, we've lost I mean, you know, I grew up
Speaker 5: as a kid in the seventies. I turned a teenager
Speaker 5: I was third I turned thirteen in January. My birthdays
Speaker 5: in early January, so I'm on my sixty now. I'm
Speaker 5: about five weeks away from sixty. I turned a teenager
Speaker 5: in thirteen in nineteen eighty, so the early eighties were
Speaker 5: my teenage years, and my twenties were the later eighties,
Speaker 5: you know, And I grew up as I imagine yourself
Speaker 5: many others listening, devoid of digital devices, devoid of when
Speaker 5: we brung each other up in the evening. It to
Speaker 5: be on the landline and you get on there and
Speaker 5: start having a yarn with your friends, and you must
Speaker 5: be I'll get off the phone.
Speaker 1: You know, you're that kind of thing.
Speaker 5: That was communication. It was the telephone, you know. And now,
Speaker 5: well what gets me is people will text message rather
Speaker 5: than just go, you know what, It's just as quick
Speaker 5: if I push the dial button then call them and go, hey,
Speaker 5: what blah blah blah blah blah blah, But no, they've
Speaker 5: got a text message.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 5: I can understand it if you're in a situation where
Speaker 5: you can't talk, But nine times out of ten people
Speaker 5: will be sitting downstairs and not text message someone in
Speaker 5: their family upstairs, And you know, just it's a whole
Speaker 5: different dynamic of communication, and this generation has lost I
Speaker 5: feel I'm not sure about a lot of the listeners,
Speaker 5: and yourself might agree, but I feel like a lot
Speaker 5: of the younger generation just don't know how to talk
Speaker 5: in you know, if you're standing at a bus stop or.
Speaker 1: You're waiting somewhere or whatever.
Speaker 5: I've always been the type of person to strike up
Speaker 5: a conversation with anyone anywhere. And you know, it just
Speaker 5: seems now that if the person is the right age
Speaker 5: and the vintage, you have that wonderful conversation that you
Speaker 5: strike up out of nowhere.
Speaker 1: But if they're under a certain age, they're quite rude.
Speaker 1: They don't even realize they're rude. I don't think they're
Speaker 1: kind of like, they just don't want to talk. It's
Speaker 1: not comfortable for them to talk that much. It's not Yeah,
Speaker 1: they've lost it.
Speaker 5: They've lost the skill of enjoying having a good conversation
Speaker 5: with someone.
Speaker 1: They don't know how.
Speaker 5: They can only exist and operate and communicate via this
Speaker 5: thing in their hand.
Speaker 1: And it's sad. It's really sad.
Speaker 4: We are down to our last few minutes. I wanted
Speaker 4: to make sure I told everyone that Mark's book, The
Speaker 4: Tale of the Nomadic Shrub Book one is in. It's
Speaker 4: the very first note in the show notes the link
Speaker 4: to Amazon. It's a great deal, please support fellow like
Speaker 4: minded people. And it's and again, it's just a very
Speaker 4: well thought out book. I will be purchasing this tomorrow.
Speaker 4: It's a quick turnaround, you get it looks like in
Speaker 4: two days here in the United States, obviously, Yeah, depending
Speaker 4: on where you live, it could take. You could be
Speaker 4: sooner if you live in a city. But two days
Speaker 4: to get your book in your hands, that's that's outstanding.
Speaker 4: So I do, Mark, I do want to give you
Speaker 4: the final word, sir, before we bid you ado.
Speaker 1: Well.
Speaker 5: First of all, George, it's a huge thank you for
Speaker 5: the for putting this show together the way you have.
Speaker 5: It's meant a lot to myself and I'm sure countless others.
Speaker 5: So you know this is this is just a heartfelt
Speaker 5: thank you because you were a voice that gave me comfort,
Speaker 5: because you were bringing the community of people together, that
Speaker 5: that gave me a sense of I guess the words
Speaker 5: solidary and that I wasn't alone in this beautiful belief.
Speaker 1: It's not a belief, I say belief. I know I
Speaker 1: could use the word belief. I believe the earth is flat.
Speaker 1: I don't. I know it's flat. I know.
Speaker 5: Intrinsically in my heart and in my soul, in my mind,
Speaker 5: I know this is the case, So it's not even belief.
Speaker 5: It's like, I know God is real, I know the
Speaker 5: Earth is flat. I know we live in this beautiful,
Speaker 5: this beautiful realm. I believe there's this land beyond the
Speaker 5: Antarctic Barrier that's being kept from us by the greedy,
Speaker 5: wealthy elite. They're denying us of our sovereign right. They
Speaker 5: keep telling us we're overpopulated, there's too many obviously, Oh
Speaker 5: we haven't got enough land. Oh this all that blah
Speaker 5: blah blah, all this blogoney that we're being fed when
Speaker 5: several hundred kilometers the Antarctic from one shore to the
Speaker 5: other lies the Outer Rim and the Outer Rim beyond that.
Speaker 5: Just a quick throw in there the movie Elysium with
Speaker 5: Matt Damon. If nobody, if anybody's seen that. I think
Speaker 5: they've buried some really symbolic little key factors into that
Speaker 5: when they talk about the Outer Ring where all the
Speaker 5: elite live in this ring, but in Elysium it's set
Speaker 5: up in space. I think that a lot of these
Speaker 5: elites have these beautiful panoramic oasis and places that are
Speaker 5: beyond the Antarctic ice wall, on the continents that exist
Speaker 5: out there that Admiral Bird spoke about in that famous
Speaker 5: interview that undoubtedly you would have seen and many others
Speaker 5: would have seen, where he talks about land beyond Antarctica
Speaker 5: and continents beyond Antarctica.
Speaker 4: And recently, I.
Speaker 1: Just feel like we've been trapped. We're being kept in
Speaker 1: a prism.
Speaker 5: We're being kept in a mental prism and a physical prism,
Speaker 5: and that humanity.
Speaker 1: Is all this.
Speaker 5: Fairy tale of space and colonizing planets and star wars
Speaker 5: and star trek and all of this. Much as I
Speaker 5: love all that, it kind of I can still watch it,
Speaker 5: but it doesn't gel with me anymore, because I think
Speaker 5: our colonization, on our expansion are but desire to go
Speaker 5: and explore that lays beyond Antarctica, that lays beyond the
Speaker 5: sea that surrounds Antarctica, beyond the next ice barrier that goes.
Speaker 1: Beyond that, and there's lands this continence.
Speaker 5: We know there is. Those of us who who have
Speaker 5: come to this flat earth reality know that we're being
Speaker 5: trapped inside here. We're being kept like a bunch of
Speaker 5: people being kept inside a foot over a football oval
Speaker 5: and the stadium is Antarctic current. You're not allowed to
Speaker 5: go anywhere near the stadium, not allowed to pass through
Speaker 5: any of the channels. On the other side of that
Speaker 5: stadium is more land, more space, more opportunity, and they're
Speaker 5: keeping up from us.
Speaker 4: Well, and I'm sorry, go ahead.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I just pray to God that that you know,
Speaker 5: one day we can we can be we can be
Speaker 5: delivered from the deception, you know. I pray for the
Speaker 5: the the awakening and the downfall of the evil ones.
Speaker 1: But it's it's just for me at the moment. Comfort
Speaker 1: in knowing there's other people out there.
Speaker 5: I can tune in and listen to your show and
Speaker 5: Flat Earth Dave, I love listening to and and Yeah, so,
Speaker 5: as I said, thank you, thank you for putting this
Speaker 5: show on the internet.
Speaker 1: Thank you for the website.
Speaker 5: I enjoy going to the forum and having a bit
Speaker 5: of a read around on there too.
Speaker 1: Is the community there.
Speaker 5: And most importantly, I don't feel a line in the
Speaker 5: world as I did before when I know that there's
Speaker 5: other people out there that can see this. You know,
Speaker 5: I'm not just sort of watching YouTube videos and trying
Speaker 5: to you know, feel like I'm sort of this this
Speaker 5: you know, one off unicorn wandering around in the forest
Speaker 5: on my.
Speaker 1: Own you know there's other people out there, so yeah,
Speaker 1: thank you, George.
Speaker 4: Well, thank you very much. And to wrap on it,
Speaker 4: just to say a few other people have mentioned Elysium.
Speaker 4: I need to go back and watch it because any
Speaker 4: film that has Jody Foster in it, oh well yeah,
Speaker 4: if you don't know she was, you know, everybody's heard
Speaker 4: of Skull and Bones, which is you know, almost two
Speaker 4: hundred year old secret society. Yell. She is in the
Speaker 4: Manuscript Society, which is the first secret society for females
Speaker 4: at Yellow so she is part of the club. And
Speaker 4: then you know, the word lyseum is Greek classic mythology,
Speaker 4: which the same as Apollo and Artemis and everything else.
Speaker 4: So that is their way of disclosure. Possibly, like you said,
Speaker 4: instead of space, it's the outside of the wall.
Speaker 1: They they've got to show us, don't they.
Speaker 5: There's there's some caveat somewhere that they are bound to
Speaker 5: a deer to where this legal cosmic loophole is that
Speaker 5: they need to show us via away of Hollywood. So
Speaker 5: it's in our faces and we watch it. I just
Speaker 5: add I heard word on the street. Word on the
Speaker 5: street is that Jodi Foster was the head witch of
Speaker 5: Hollywood allegedly. Allegedly. I'm just saying, that's some YouTube video
Speaker 5: I'm going to watch somewhere somewhere like that said, she's
Speaker 5: the Queen Bee.
Speaker 4: There are I've been a few names thrown out there,
Speaker 4: people say the Kardashians, shar has been out there, Jody
Speaker 4: Foster has yep, yep for sure, and they're probably look
Speaker 4: the movie The Witches of Eastwick from the nineties, maybe
Speaker 4: late audience. So again it's in our face. So well,
Speaker 4: there you go. Thank you so much again. I really
Speaker 4: appreciate your time, Mark.
Speaker 1: And you're welcome. George.
Speaker 4: Thank you all the success in the world with your book,
Speaker 4: and folks, don't forget Mark's link to his book is
Speaker 4: in the show notes. His email is in the show
Speaker 4: notes as well as well as the links to everything
Speaker 4: we talked about today. God bless you all. Have a
Speaker 4: great rest of your week. Hopefully we should have another
Speaker 4: episode this Sunday night. Keep your head on a swivel.
Speaker 4: God bless you, and until we meet again, my friends,
Speaker 4: we will see you.
Speaker 1: I know it's been a struggle.
Speaker 6: I don't know you've had feel the tied.
Speaker 1: Hell, don't by all the way, yeah, don't you feel the.
Speaker 6: More you smile ain't the same. I saw you way
Speaker 6: go from you feel like you've.
Speaker 7: Lost your way. Don't give it, No, don't give it
Speaker 7: and never is home. Don't let call the primise. It
Speaker 7: ain't done yet. He's gone up, glad, Why it's a
Speaker 7: way down?
Speaker 8: Got up?
Speaker 1: Let me come.
Speaker 4: Why away?
Speaker 1: God up? Y called?
Speaker 9: I can see the straight beside you.
Speaker 6: Child, you putting up the fid.
Speaker 8: Oh, you're stronger than a thing. C Yeah, you're gone
Speaker 8: and be all right. You're accepting a dead found.
Speaker 4: Beautiful.
Speaker 9: You're shoving bride. Yeah, you're live and breathing. Move you
Speaker 9: can hold your head a pie. Don't give up, No,
Speaker 9: don't give in. Never loves home. Don't let gone on
Speaker 9: the primies. It ain't Donion's God.
Speaker 10: I plant.
Speaker 1: What's a way down?
Speaker 10: The God of me?
Speaker 1: Because don't give up. No, don't give in.
Speaker 10: You never love home.
Speaker 1: Don't let go on the promise. It ain't God likeness
Speaker 1: worth living?
Speaker 4: What's a way town? The God of mine called? Why
Speaker 4: a play down?
Speaker 7: The god sav.
Speaker 10: Oh yeah, what's the play down? The god baby call?
Speaker 10: Oh yeah, got the TV cat.
Speaker 6: Don't give up, No, don't give in.
Speaker 11: Never do they go off the prim smell In and
Speaker 11: dumb Yas got up playing why Me kind of Even
Speaker 11: colts don't give no.
Speaker 1: Dog giving, never home? Don't they go out the crimes?
Speaker 6: It ain't done others worth eve in. What's the god
Speaker 6: of NICs.
Speaker 7: Ah?
Speaker 1: The god of needles? Why's due god of.
Speaker 4: You're listening to the Fact Hunter Radio Network.
Speaker 1: Just the facts, ma'am m