WEBVTT 1 00:00:03.919 --> 00:00:07.000 You are listening to the IFAH podcast Network. For more 2 00:00:07.080 --> 00:00:12.679 amazing filmmaking and screenwriting podcasts, just go to ifahpodcastnetwork dot com. 3 00:00:12.839 --> 00:00:16.359 Welcome to the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, Episode number three ninety six. 4 00:00:16.719 --> 00:00:20.280 We must learn to live together as brothers or paris 5 00:00:20.399 --> 00:00:25.960 together as fools. Martin Luther King broadcasting from a dark, windowless. 6 00:00:25.440 --> 00:00:27.879 Room in Hollywood when we really should be working on 7 00:00:27.879 --> 00:00:32.280 that next draft. It's the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, showing you 8 00:00:32.399 --> 00:00:35.039 the craft and business of screenwriting while teaching you how 9 00:00:35.039 --> 00:00:36.920 to make your screenplay bulletproof. 10 00:00:37.240 --> 00:00:42.439 And here's your host, Alex Ferrari. Welcome, Welcome to another 11 00:00:42.479 --> 00:00:45.079 episode of the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast. I am your humble 12 00:00:45.119 --> 00:00:49.560 host Alex Ferrari. Now. Today's show is sponsored by Bulletproof 13 00:00:49.719 --> 00:00:51.039 Script Coverage. 14 00:00:51.280 --> 00:00:51.439 Now. 15 00:00:51.520 --> 00:00:56.439 Unlike other script coverage services, Bulletproof Script Coverage actually focuses 16 00:00:56.479 --> 00:00:59.479 on the kind of project you are in the goals 17 00:00:59.479 --> 00:01:01.920 of the product you are, so we actually break it 18 00:01:01.960 --> 00:01:05.439 down by three categories micro budget, indie film, market, and 19 00:01:05.519 --> 00:01:08.200 studio film. There's no reason to get coverage from a 20 00:01:08.239 --> 00:01:10.879 reader that's used to reading tempole movies when your movie 21 00:01:11.000 --> 00:01:13.359 is going to be done for one hundred thousand dollars 22 00:01:13.480 --> 00:01:16.400 and we wanted to focus on that. At Bulletproof script coverage, 23 00:01:16.599 --> 00:01:22.079 our readers have worked with Marvel Studios, CIA, w MEE, NBC, HBO, Disney, 24 00:01:22.519 --> 00:01:25.879 Scott Free, Warner Brothers, The Blacklist, and many many more. 25 00:01:26.000 --> 00:01:29.439 So if you need your screenplay or TV script covered 26 00:01:29.680 --> 00:01:35.680 by professional readers, head on over to covermiscreenplay dot com. Now. Guys, 27 00:01:35.680 --> 00:01:39.480 today on the show, we had Ted sim from Indie 28 00:01:39.519 --> 00:01:43.680 Mogul and from Aperture Lighting. I've been wanting to get 29 00:01:43.680 --> 00:01:45.560 Ted on the show for quite some time, and we 30 00:01:45.719 --> 00:01:50.319 finally were able to coincide our schedules to make this happen. 31 00:01:50.640 --> 00:01:52.879 I've been a fan of Ted's and what he's doing 32 00:01:53.280 --> 00:01:56.239 at Aperture for a long time. I actually use almost 33 00:01:56.280 --> 00:01:59.239 exclusively Aperture lights when I was making on the Corner 34 00:01:59.319 --> 00:02:03.079 of Ego and Disney, and I just love what he's 35 00:02:03.159 --> 00:02:06.159 doing with not only Aperture, but now that he's part 36 00:02:06.239 --> 00:02:09.280 of the Indie Mogul family and was able to bring 37 00:02:09.360 --> 00:02:13.240 Indie Mogul kind of back to life with him and Griffin. 38 00:02:14.039 --> 00:02:16.280 I was so so excited to sit down and talk 39 00:02:16.319 --> 00:02:19.639 shop with him and see what's going on now. This 40 00:02:19.960 --> 00:02:23.199 was recorded pre COVID nineteen, so that is why you 41 00:02:23.199 --> 00:02:26.960 will not hear anything in regards to COVID nineteen. Was 42 00:02:27.000 --> 00:02:30.400 recorded a little bit before the shutdown. But I think 43 00:02:30.439 --> 00:02:33.360 you're going to enjoy this episode without any further ado. 44 00:02:33.400 --> 00:02:37.400 Please enjoy my conversation with Ted Sim. I'd like to 45 00:02:37.479 --> 00:02:40.680 welcome to the show, Ted Sim, the legendary Ted Sim. 46 00:02:41.439 --> 00:02:43.120 I don't know about legendary. 47 00:02:44.599 --> 00:02:45.479 Brother. Yo, holding up. 48 00:02:45.520 --> 00:02:48.840 Man, it was good man, doing good, hanging out, working 49 00:02:48.879 --> 00:02:49.719 on a bunch of stuff. 50 00:02:49.879 --> 00:02:52.400 Listen to that NIFILM podcast. Man, here we go. 51 00:02:52.680 --> 00:02:55.039 Yeah, baby, I mean, this is like I was saying earlier. Man, 52 00:02:55.039 --> 00:02:57.240 I think it's a long time coming. Man, it's it's uh. 53 00:02:57.800 --> 00:02:59.319 You know, I've been I've been a fan of yours 54 00:02:59.360 --> 00:03:00.800 for a while, been a fan of what you've been 55 00:03:00.800 --> 00:03:04.360 doing with Aperture and now with Indie Mogul and all 56 00:03:04.360 --> 00:03:06.639 the service that you're doing for the film community in general. 57 00:03:06.639 --> 00:03:06.759 Man. 58 00:03:06.759 --> 00:03:10.319 Because we're such a small group, there's not a lot 59 00:03:10.360 --> 00:03:12.080 of us doing what we do as far as trying 60 00:03:12.080 --> 00:03:13.800 to help the community and trying to be of service 61 00:03:13.840 --> 00:03:16.919 and all that stuff. And we all it's so funny 62 00:03:16.919 --> 00:03:19.360 if we don't know each other personally we know somebody 63 00:03:19.400 --> 00:03:21.879 who knows each other, and it's kind of like it 64 00:03:21.960 --> 00:03:24.319 kind of goes that way. So it's it's very it's 65 00:03:24.680 --> 00:03:25.919 but I've been wanting to get you on the show. 66 00:03:25.919 --> 00:03:28.319 I had Griffin on the show a while ago, which 67 00:03:28.360 --> 00:03:30.919 was so much fun, and it's so much. 68 00:03:30.800 --> 00:03:33.199 Fun, and he's seriously just that. You think he's a 69 00:03:33.240 --> 00:03:34.680 nice guy when you watch the videos and then you 70 00:03:34.719 --> 00:03:36.639 meet him or talk to him in person or online, 71 00:03:36.800 --> 00:03:38.599 and then you're like, oh my gosh, he's like ten 72 00:03:38.680 --> 00:03:41.319 times nicer than I ever thought he could. 73 00:03:41.719 --> 00:03:44.319 Is he like is he like Canadian nice? 74 00:03:46.560 --> 00:03:48.800 That's a really good question. I don't know how to 75 00:03:48.800 --> 00:03:51.960 answer that, but I will say, absurdly nice. So however 76 00:03:52.039 --> 00:03:52.840 you define. 77 00:03:52.599 --> 00:03:57.280 You, because Isaac Canadian nice. Canadian nice is like so nice. 78 00:03:57.439 --> 00:03:59.879 It's like I still remember the first time I went 79 00:03:59.879 --> 00:04:02.240 to Getada and first time ever went there, and everyone 80 00:04:02.319 --> 00:04:03.680 was so nice. I swear I was like in a 81 00:04:03.680 --> 00:04:06.479 horror movie, like they're gonna kill me. This is way 82 00:04:06.520 --> 00:04:07.960 too nice. I don't understand why. 83 00:04:08.919 --> 00:04:11.560 Well, you're also coming from Los Angeles too, a film 84 00:04:12.120 --> 00:04:15.400 of Los Angeles. I mean, you could not ask. 85 00:04:15.280 --> 00:04:19.079 For a more like culture, shock horribly. 86 00:04:18.600 --> 00:04:21.680 Mean, spirited people, the community to come from. 87 00:04:22.000 --> 00:04:24.519 What do you mean, sir, La? What how dare you? Sir? 88 00:04:25.560 --> 00:04:27.920 Los Angeles is where all the friendly people are. 89 00:04:28.600 --> 00:04:31.399 But they are, but La is the nicest. They give 90 00:04:31.439 --> 00:04:34.680 you the nice FEUs, the nicest FEUs ever. Like I've 91 00:04:34.839 --> 00:04:38.879 never it's an art form here. They'll never You'll never 92 00:04:38.920 --> 00:04:43.480 hear the word no ever ever. It's just we're passing. 93 00:04:47.759 --> 00:04:50.040 Like you go to New York, Dude, your stuff sucks 94 00:04:50.480 --> 00:04:51.959 and I'm not going to do it. That's like what 95 00:04:52.000 --> 00:04:52.759 you hear in New York. 96 00:04:54.000 --> 00:04:56.160 I just I just don't I know it's true. 97 00:04:56.319 --> 00:04:58.560 I just don't want to admit that it's true because 98 00:04:58.560 --> 00:05:01.439 I hope that it'll change some days. From Baltimore originally, 99 00:05:01.439 --> 00:05:03.240 by the way, so I'm used to the same thing. 100 00:05:03.279 --> 00:05:04.800 You get on the bus and the bus drivers, you know, 101 00:05:05.120 --> 00:05:06.839 drop an F bomb in there and be like are 102 00:05:06.879 --> 00:05:09.600 you fucking coming on the bus and you leaving the bus. 103 00:05:09.680 --> 00:05:11.199 I'm like, let know you. 104 00:05:11.360 --> 00:05:14.800 Let's move let's move it along kind of thing with 105 00:05:14.839 --> 00:05:15.240 the bus. 106 00:05:16.120 --> 00:05:16.399 All right. 107 00:05:16.439 --> 00:05:18.519 So before we get started, man, how did you get 108 00:05:18.639 --> 00:05:20.160 into the film business in the first place? 109 00:05:21.160 --> 00:05:23.800 That is a great question. Uh, yes, I grew up 110 00:05:23.839 --> 00:05:26.480 in Baltimore. It's basically in Baltimore. If you tell people 111 00:05:26.480 --> 00:05:28.920 you want to make movies or working, well, it's basically 112 00:05:29.000 --> 00:05:31.680 like saying you want to be an astronaut. It's like, honestly, 113 00:05:31.720 --> 00:05:33.319 I think saying you want to be an astronaut is 114 00:05:33.319 --> 00:05:36.839 actually a more reasonable job because there's a GUTA Space 115 00:05:36.879 --> 00:05:38.920 Center and all this stuff out there, Like there's actual 116 00:05:39.000 --> 00:05:43.040 MASSA employees walking around, So it's not really the most 117 00:05:43.040 --> 00:05:46.040 plausible thing to tell people. But uh, you know, I 118 00:05:46.040 --> 00:05:47.680 wanted to work in the film industry because I grew 119 00:05:47.720 --> 00:05:50.079 up and I love movies, and I think I fell 120 00:05:50.120 --> 00:05:52.279 into the trap that most filmmakers fall into, which is, 121 00:05:53.519 --> 00:05:57.120 oh my gosh, watching movies is so fun. I wonder 122 00:05:57.160 --> 00:05:59.360 how much fun it must be to make. 123 00:06:02.759 --> 00:06:04.839 It must be easy, it must be easy. I've seen 124 00:06:04.839 --> 00:06:06.920 the behind the scenes. It shouldn't be that different, of course. 125 00:06:07.040 --> 00:06:09.879 Yeah, I mean everyone's just having fun. You're eating snacks, 126 00:06:09.879 --> 00:06:11.680 so there's there's trailers. 127 00:06:11.120 --> 00:06:15.600 There's sushi, there's lobster tail. I mean, yeah, so you. 128 00:06:16.000 --> 00:06:19.720 Fall for that, and you know, you get into it. 129 00:06:19.759 --> 00:06:22.920 You start. I'd make movies and sounds of kids. It's 130 00:06:22.920 --> 00:06:24.399 like middle school. I was like trying to you know, 131 00:06:24.399 --> 00:06:27.000 play cameras and stuff like that. In high school, I 132 00:06:27.000 --> 00:06:29.040 actually got a job as a projectionist assistant where I 133 00:06:29.079 --> 00:06:31.839 was Actually my grades were terrible in high school, but 134 00:06:31.839 --> 00:06:34.000 I would go to the local theater every day and 135 00:06:34.040 --> 00:06:37.920 I'd work as the assistant over there, and eventually I 136 00:06:37.959 --> 00:06:40.160 made the jump to going to film school. Came out 137 00:06:40.199 --> 00:06:43.680 to when I found out that film schools actually care 138 00:06:43.720 --> 00:06:46.480 about more than just your film experience, which you know 139 00:06:46.560 --> 00:06:49.759 sounds no, it doesn't sound obvious. It was something I 140 00:06:49.800 --> 00:06:52.519 needed to learn. I buckled down. I went to Maryland, 141 00:06:52.839 --> 00:06:54.920 study my butt off, and then eventually got the grades, 142 00:06:54.920 --> 00:06:57.600 got into u c LA, did my film program there, 143 00:06:58.319 --> 00:07:00.279 and then I suffered the I think the thing that 144 00:07:00.279 --> 00:07:01.879 I'm sure a lot of listeners can say that they 145 00:07:01.920 --> 00:07:05.319 suffered from, which is the post film school blues of 146 00:07:06.040 --> 00:07:09.839 feeling elite and you feel like you're the best, and 147 00:07:09.920 --> 00:07:11.759 you worked really hard and you get into this program 148 00:07:11.839 --> 00:07:14.720 and you come out and people literally won't you to 149 00:07:14.879 --> 00:07:15.560 clean their shoes. 150 00:07:16.240 --> 00:07:20.600 So you mean reality, you're talking about reality? 151 00:07:21.040 --> 00:07:24.160 I'm just reality TV. 152 00:07:24.439 --> 00:07:27.720 No No, no, that's that's life. You mean life hitting you, 153 00:07:27.800 --> 00:07:30.920 smacking you upside the head and going no, no, no, 154 00:07:31.160 --> 00:07:33.360 you're not as cool as you think you are. Yes, 155 00:07:33.399 --> 00:07:35.839 we all. 156 00:07:35.839 --> 00:07:37.120 It's the worst feeling in the world. 157 00:07:37.160 --> 00:07:40.000 If there's anyone listening to this that it feels like 158 00:07:40.040 --> 00:07:43.439 they're in that place in their life. I'm not going 159 00:07:43.439 --> 00:07:45.160 to say that it doesn't get worse than that, but 160 00:07:45.199 --> 00:07:46.759 I'm going to say that that is a low point, 161 00:07:46.759 --> 00:07:48.720 and it's normal to being a low point there. 162 00:07:48.800 --> 00:07:52.560 That's okay, Yeah, it isn't It is a normal place 163 00:07:52.639 --> 00:07:53.920 out of I mean out of film school. 164 00:07:53.959 --> 00:07:54.279 I was. 165 00:07:55.000 --> 00:08:00.240 I started working at Universal Studios Florida doing PA work. 166 00:08:01.120 --> 00:08:02.199 Oh, I was. 167 00:08:02.160 --> 00:08:05.279 In PA work. I was a translator for Global Guts, 168 00:08:06.600 --> 00:08:10.800 the Nickelodeon show. And then I just realized a while 169 00:08:10.920 --> 00:08:13.120 I was like, this sucks. This is not what theyre 170 00:08:13.480 --> 00:08:15.240 I was told that I was gonna make one hundred 171 00:08:15.279 --> 00:08:17.839 million dollar movies. This is this is you know, my 172 00:08:17.920 --> 00:08:19.120 last name should be Spielberg. 173 00:08:19.160 --> 00:08:22.959 I don't understand to me who lies around. 174 00:08:23.040 --> 00:08:24.399 Oh, I can tell you who lied to you. The 175 00:08:24.439 --> 00:08:26.199 one that you're paying that bill to every month to 176 00:08:26.199 --> 00:08:31.000 pay back your student loan, that's the one that's the 177 00:08:31.000 --> 00:08:32.720 one who lied to you. 178 00:08:32.720 --> 00:08:34.840 You're driving a hot take there, like in terms of 179 00:08:34.919 --> 00:08:37.279 the you know, obviously the film school versus no film 180 00:08:37.320 --> 00:08:39.120 school debate. It's a hot topic, right. 181 00:08:39.120 --> 00:08:43.279 Yes, I gotta be honesome when I when I. 182 00:08:43.240 --> 00:08:47.320 First got out, and for probably ten years afterwards, I 183 00:08:47.399 --> 00:08:51.279 thought for sure no film school, right, because I was 184 00:08:51.320 --> 00:08:53.080 like the golden boy in film school too, Like I 185 00:08:53.080 --> 00:08:54.600 graduated like top my class, I like. 186 00:08:54.519 --> 00:08:57.320 A director's all this stuff, and it came out in just. 187 00:08:57.360 --> 00:09:03.519 Nothing right, crickets. But I think it takes a certain 188 00:09:03.519 --> 00:09:06.240 amount of time to see the people around you grow 189 00:09:06.360 --> 00:09:08.200 up and become because I think when you first graduate, 190 00:09:08.240 --> 00:09:09.440 you look around and you look at your friends and 191 00:09:09.480 --> 00:09:11.720 you're like, man, I'm an idiot, and all of these 192 00:09:11.759 --> 00:09:15.039 people that I graduated with our idiots, Like what network 193 00:09:15.080 --> 00:09:18.600 are they talking about here? And what you don't realize 194 00:09:18.759 --> 00:09:20.519 is that it's not that it's idiots, and it's not 195 00:09:20.519 --> 00:09:22.679 that you're an idiot. It's just that it takes time 196 00:09:22.759 --> 00:09:24.799 for everyone to grow into the thing that they've become. 197 00:09:25.080 --> 00:09:26.879 And you know, now everyone that I look to now 198 00:09:27.000 --> 00:09:29.720 is you know, producing something or shooting something or directing something. 199 00:09:29.720 --> 00:09:33.440 And it's a great feeling because it's like sceeds, right, 200 00:09:33.519 --> 00:09:35.799 they got to grow up into something someday. So now 201 00:09:35.919 --> 00:09:37.679 I don't really know. I'm kind of torn on the 202 00:09:37.679 --> 00:09:40.360 film school thing. I do believe that if you're really 203 00:09:40.559 --> 00:09:43.360 motivated and dedicated, you can learn everything that you've learned 204 00:09:43.360 --> 00:09:46.679 in film school plus more online. You can learn it 205 00:09:46.720 --> 00:09:49.159 from other people. I can learn it just by doing it. 206 00:09:49.159 --> 00:09:50.600 If you take that money and make a movie, you 207 00:09:50.600 --> 00:09:52.279 can do it. I feel the same way about business. 208 00:09:52.320 --> 00:09:56.200 But we'll be right back after a word from our 209 00:09:56.200 --> 00:10:01.559 sponsor and now back to the show. 210 00:10:03.720 --> 00:10:07.240 Or a certain person out there that you know can't 211 00:10:07.559 --> 00:10:10.960 make that jump or doesn't have that self drive, I 212 00:10:10.960 --> 00:10:13.759 don't think it's a bad move anymore. I've flipped on that, but. 213 00:10:13.799 --> 00:10:16.320 Argua but arguably speaking though, if you don't have the 214 00:10:16.399 --> 00:10:19.120 drive to go to to self educate yourself, do you 215 00:10:19.159 --> 00:10:20.440 think you're going to have the drive to make it 216 00:10:20.480 --> 00:10:21.200 in this business? 217 00:10:22.120 --> 00:10:24.679 That's a really good question. That's a really good film. 218 00:10:24.759 --> 00:10:26.519 I mean, if you're like I don't want to like 219 00:10:26.600 --> 00:10:28.759 have to do work to learn, I need someone to 220 00:10:28.799 --> 00:10:30.519 tell me what to do, because that's the way the 221 00:10:30.519 --> 00:10:32.720 film business is. Yeah, that's there's going to be someone 222 00:10:32.720 --> 00:10:35.480 holding your hand through this entire product, especially indie film. 223 00:10:35.559 --> 00:10:39.679 Oh absolutely, yeah, Ani film is a nightmare, right and 224 00:10:39.720 --> 00:10:41.879 like again, I'm speaking to people mostly that are in 225 00:10:41.919 --> 00:10:44.360 the States, right, because you know, you got publicly funded 226 00:10:44.440 --> 00:10:47.320 arts in like Germany, sure and like a lot of places. Sure, 227 00:10:47.399 --> 00:10:50.200 that's a different thing, and there's there's downsides to that, 228 00:10:50.279 --> 00:10:52.679 and there's outsides to that. But if you're doing indie 229 00:10:52.679 --> 00:10:54.639 film in the States or any place that doesn't have 230 00:10:54.720 --> 00:10:57.320 publicly funded arts, man, it is. 231 00:10:58.720 --> 00:11:00.399 It ain't easy. 232 00:11:00.440 --> 00:11:02.159 It ain't easy in this world, all right. So you 233 00:11:02.200 --> 00:11:06.039 get out, you realize that the world sucks and they 234 00:11:06.080 --> 00:11:09.080 lied to you, and now you're in this dark, depressive place. 235 00:11:09.240 --> 00:11:10.440 Where do you go from there? Sir? 236 00:11:11.279 --> 00:11:15.279 Okay, So I get lucky. Actually, so I start. I 237 00:11:15.320 --> 00:11:17.480 just I just start owner operating. I just I got 238 00:11:17.480 --> 00:11:20.039 a camera. I start shooting things. I shoot everything. I 239 00:11:20.120 --> 00:11:23.159 shoot bad weddings, I see horrible commercials for the people 240 00:11:23.200 --> 00:11:26.240 down the street. I start taking on just little gigs 241 00:11:26.279 --> 00:11:27.960 here and there. I find my way eventually onto a 242 00:11:28.000 --> 00:11:30.960 set until I started doing a kind of a spiff 243 00:11:31.000 --> 00:11:35.799 in terms of working in reality documentary. And this is 244 00:11:35.840 --> 00:11:38.480 back when I think, you know, Shark Week was. I 245 00:11:38.480 --> 00:11:40.000 don't know if it's still as big as it was 246 00:11:40.120 --> 00:11:43.080 back then, was a big Yeah, it's still a big deal. 247 00:11:43.919 --> 00:11:45.480 I got in because originally from. 248 00:11:45.360 --> 00:11:49.320 Baltimore in Silver Spring Over in Maryland. Discovery channels out there. 249 00:11:49.480 --> 00:11:51.200 So I had a couple of friends that were from 250 00:11:51.240 --> 00:11:53.080 the Discovery Channel people, and I met some people on 251 00:11:53.120 --> 00:11:56.200 set and I just started working as the like go 252 00:11:56.240 --> 00:11:59.080 to guy for the Shark Week people. And I was 253 00:11:59.120 --> 00:12:02.679 the guy that was no as And really this is 254 00:12:02.679 --> 00:12:04.519 because I was just some kid out of film school. 255 00:12:04.519 --> 00:12:06.720 I was known as the guy that could do it 256 00:12:06.759 --> 00:12:07.519 for really cheap. 257 00:12:08.080 --> 00:12:10.600 It would be okay, not that great, but I could 258 00:12:10.600 --> 00:12:12.759 get it done quickly and for a budget that everyone 259 00:12:12.799 --> 00:12:14.519 else would be like, hell no, we're not doing that. 260 00:12:15.720 --> 00:12:19.279 Eventually, the guys that I started working. 261 00:12:19.000 --> 00:12:21.279 For were the company that would get contracted down to 262 00:12:21.320 --> 00:12:23.000 do Sharp Week, and they'd get contracted to do these 263 00:12:23.039 --> 00:12:24.600 kind of like big discovery gigs here and there. But 264 00:12:25.120 --> 00:12:28.759 you know, just like any freelancer, entrepreneur, company owner knows, 265 00:12:29.240 --> 00:12:31.200 you get reached out to from time to time with 266 00:12:31.240 --> 00:12:33.559 low ball gigs, right, And they used to just say 267 00:12:33.559 --> 00:12:35.360 no to those gigs and they would just start throwing 268 00:12:35.360 --> 00:12:38.120 them to me. And I was the guy that was like, oh, 269 00:12:38.360 --> 00:12:44.399 you'll pay me the holy camera, Hell yeah, I just 270 00:12:44.639 --> 00:12:48.200 would shoot anything. I would work anything, didn't matter, right. 271 00:12:49.759 --> 00:12:52.840 I did that for a while until eventually I got lucky. 272 00:12:53.480 --> 00:12:55.960 Those group of guys actually reached out to me after 273 00:12:56.000 --> 00:12:58.639 a couple of years of doing videos, and I think 274 00:12:58.639 --> 00:13:00.279 what they were noticing is the same thing that I 275 00:13:00.279 --> 00:13:02.279 think everyone could say is still happening now, is that 276 00:13:02.440 --> 00:13:05.600 the budgets for all these projects were going down and 277 00:13:05.639 --> 00:13:07.720 they felt like they needed to bring on someone that 278 00:13:07.960 --> 00:13:09.879 you know, was scrappy, that could do the kind of 279 00:13:09.919 --> 00:13:12.320 the lower budget project that they got thrown. So they 280 00:13:12.320 --> 00:13:15.639 actually ended up bringing me on as their C string director, 281 00:13:16.039 --> 00:13:18.000 which I didn't know what that was until the time. 282 00:13:18.039 --> 00:13:20.200 But there's a a director, there's a B director and 283 00:13:20.240 --> 00:13:23.639 a C string director. It's like legal firms, right, Like 284 00:13:23.679 --> 00:13:25.799 when you hire like a law firm or something, you 285 00:13:25.799 --> 00:13:28.440 go after the first person the name whose person is 286 00:13:28.480 --> 00:13:30.679 on the legal firm, but then they don't actually work 287 00:13:30.720 --> 00:13:32.399 on it. They pass it to their B person if 288 00:13:32.399 --> 00:13:33.759 their B person doesn't want to work on at their 289 00:13:33.799 --> 00:13:37.519 president of person. Right. So that was me doing educational 290 00:13:37.600 --> 00:13:41.200 videos for McDonald's and doing you know, I would do 291 00:13:41.240 --> 00:13:43.480 like the how to set up your car BMW videos 292 00:13:43.519 --> 00:13:44.279 and stuff like that. 293 00:13:44.320 --> 00:13:46.279 Oh hey, it paid, It paid something, it. 294 00:13:46.320 --> 00:13:47.840 Paid, and you know what I was. 295 00:13:47.879 --> 00:13:49.840 I was really lucky because I think I got paid 296 00:13:49.840 --> 00:13:51.879 to direct really early on, which is something that I 297 00:13:51.879 --> 00:13:53.519 think a lot of people, Oh that's awesome. 298 00:13:53.559 --> 00:13:55.720 I mean, yeah, look, I would have killed to direct. 299 00:13:55.759 --> 00:13:58.279 I was. I was editing. So basically when you were 300 00:13:58.279 --> 00:14:00.759 doing a camera I was doing in posts. So that's 301 00:14:00.759 --> 00:14:03.679 why my IMDb is like one hundred credit long. And 302 00:14:03.679 --> 00:14:06.080 that's not even including the yeah, just post and not 303 00:14:06.159 --> 00:14:09.080 even including commercials, music videos and all this other crap 304 00:14:09.080 --> 00:14:12.240 that I did. And I did anything for any if 305 00:14:12.279 --> 00:14:15.159 it walked in the door, I did it. 306 00:14:15.840 --> 00:14:17.720 Were you an editor or were you like an editing 307 00:14:17.720 --> 00:14:22.519 assistant on pioscoping for a long time and it was like, man. 308 00:14:23.120 --> 00:14:24.120 No, I did editing. 309 00:14:24.279 --> 00:14:24.600 I did. 310 00:14:24.960 --> 00:14:27.399 I was an assistant for like a minute. And then 311 00:14:27.440 --> 00:14:30.279 I went off and started freelance editing commercials and music 312 00:14:30.360 --> 00:14:32.960 videos and things like that. Then slowly I got into 313 00:14:32.960 --> 00:14:36.679 feature editing. Then after that I got into color grading. 314 00:14:36.960 --> 00:14:40.120 After that I did online editorial, and then and then 315 00:14:40.120 --> 00:14:42.639 post production supervision and then VFFCT super So I started 316 00:14:42.679 --> 00:14:45.759 just adding more tools in the toolbox because if I 317 00:14:45.759 --> 00:14:47.720 couldn't get paid to edit, I could color, and if 318 00:14:47.720 --> 00:14:49.279 I'm not getting paid to color, I could do post 319 00:14:49.279 --> 00:14:50.960 supervisor and then package it all together. 320 00:14:51.039 --> 00:14:56.639 Dude, dude, I think post is the smartest way to Again, 321 00:14:56.879 --> 00:14:58.840 and maybe the grass is always greener, but I actually 322 00:14:59.039 --> 00:15:02.000 legitimately believed editing if you want to if you want 323 00:15:02.000 --> 00:15:03.919 to write or direct or any of that stuff, like right, 324 00:15:03.960 --> 00:15:05.639 let me write. Most people want to write and direct. Right, 325 00:15:07.200 --> 00:15:08.879 if you want to do either of those things, I 326 00:15:08.919 --> 00:15:11.000 really think post is the way to enter because that's 327 00:15:11.000 --> 00:15:13.759 when you assembly. This is going to sound like belittling 328 00:15:13.759 --> 00:15:15.639 a bunch of jobs. That Again, I'm coming from a 329 00:15:15.720 --> 00:15:19.200 very camera heavy cinematography world, so please, if you're hearing 330 00:15:19.240 --> 00:15:22.600 it from anyone, please hear it from me. Almost everything 331 00:15:22.759 --> 00:15:26.039 is like building the blocks for someone to edit. Right, 332 00:15:26.080 --> 00:15:27.639 You're like making a bunch of legos. At the end 333 00:15:27.679 --> 00:15:29.480 of the day, someone's got to put the story together. 334 00:15:29.480 --> 00:15:31.799 That's the editor. So if you want to write and direct, 335 00:15:32.120 --> 00:15:33.879 I don't think that there's any better practice in the 336 00:15:33.919 --> 00:15:34.559 world than post. 337 00:15:34.720 --> 00:15:36.840 Oh I would agree with thee hundred percent. It helps me. 338 00:15:36.879 --> 00:15:40.039 So when I started directing commercials and directing TV and 339 00:15:40.120 --> 00:15:42.240 all that kind of stuff, it I could move so 340 00:15:42.320 --> 00:15:44.080 much quicker than anybody else. I mean I was doing 341 00:15:44.919 --> 00:15:48.480 and ten and twenty setups a day, just flying because 342 00:15:48.519 --> 00:15:50.799 I just knew what I needed. I didn't have to 343 00:15:50.799 --> 00:15:52.320 wait to like, oh, we're just going to take that 344 00:15:52.399 --> 00:15:54.480 whole shot. I'm like, no, no, stop right there, I'm 345 00:15:54.480 --> 00:15:56.399 going to cut there. Let's move on here. Yeah, And 346 00:15:56.440 --> 00:15:59.720 it just it works so so much better. And not 347 00:15:59.720 --> 00:16:02.039 that I'm a bit older than you, but so you know, 348 00:16:02.240 --> 00:16:06.639 I did. I didn't have the ability to learn editing 349 00:16:06.639 --> 00:16:09.120 at home. I had to you know, I had to 350 00:16:09.279 --> 00:16:12.240 drive an hour, get there early, work on the Avid, 351 00:16:12.759 --> 00:16:13.360 stay late. 352 00:16:13.919 --> 00:16:16.120 It's I don't care even if it was slower, even 353 00:16:16.120 --> 00:16:19.279 if it was harder. Just learning how to assemble something, yes, 354 00:16:19.320 --> 00:16:21.720 and just know and be that close to the finished product. 355 00:16:22.000 --> 00:16:24.000 I think it's priceless, man, because everything else is just 356 00:16:24.039 --> 00:16:26.960 so vague and ephemeral, and you don't know what's important 357 00:16:27.120 --> 00:16:28.320 until you see it in the edit. 358 00:16:28.519 --> 00:16:31.080 Absolutely so then, so I wanted to ask you, man. 359 00:16:31.360 --> 00:16:33.960 You obviously you know, the first time I, you know, 360 00:16:34.200 --> 00:16:38.159 discovered you was through Aperture and in that company, and 361 00:16:38.200 --> 00:16:40.799 you're the president of Aperture. Uh. And for people who 362 00:16:40.840 --> 00:16:43.759 don't know what aperture is, it's a lighting company, a 363 00:16:43.919 --> 00:16:47.960 very cool lighting company. How did you get involved with 364 00:16:48.000 --> 00:16:52.000 that company? And you know, how did you jump from 365 00:16:52.320 --> 00:16:56.000 you know, doing really bad wedding videos to the president 366 00:16:56.000 --> 00:16:56.639 of aperture. 367 00:16:57.320 --> 00:16:59.519 It's a really good question. That's a really good question 368 00:17:00.200 --> 00:17:01.120 that obviously. 369 00:17:00.799 --> 00:17:03.679 I had my stent kind of doing the directing for 370 00:17:03.759 --> 00:17:05.839 that production company, which which that was. That was good, 371 00:17:05.880 --> 00:17:09.119 that was fun. I would basically get asked to bid 372 00:17:08.759 --> 00:17:12.240 on a job maybe probably somewhere between fifteen and twenty 373 00:17:12.240 --> 00:17:14.440 times a year. I would put bids in and realistically 374 00:17:14.519 --> 00:17:17.839 it probably on a good year, i'd win I don't 375 00:17:17.880 --> 00:17:19.799 know what, six to seven. On a bad year, i'd 376 00:17:19.839 --> 00:17:21.720 only win like three or four gigs out of that, 377 00:17:21.960 --> 00:17:23.640 and they were like pretty big gigs. I could spend 378 00:17:23.640 --> 00:17:25.079 my time and shoot that. I could live off that 379 00:17:25.119 --> 00:17:27.680 for a while. At a certain point, things start to 380 00:17:27.799 --> 00:17:30.640 slow down, so I decided, oh, man, I need to 381 00:17:30.759 --> 00:17:33.480 find other work outside of just this being repped at 382 00:17:33.480 --> 00:17:35.799 this company. It's they're not giving me enough work right now. 383 00:17:36.599 --> 00:17:39.039 So I can't say the name of the people. But 384 00:17:39.119 --> 00:17:40.799 I went off and I eventually ended up becoming a 385 00:17:40.839 --> 00:17:44.960 channel manager for a jumbo YouTube star. And I'm talking 386 00:17:45.000 --> 00:17:47.359 like early early YouTube. What year? 387 00:17:47.359 --> 00:17:49.160 What year are we talking about? What years are we 388 00:17:49.200 --> 00:17:49.680 talking about? 389 00:17:49.960 --> 00:17:52.079 I don't want to say, okay, okay, it's early. 390 00:17:52.079 --> 00:17:53.960 Look, it's only been around for like fifty ten to 391 00:17:53.960 --> 00:17:54.839 twelve years, so it's not. 392 00:17:54.920 --> 00:17:57.240 Yeah that long, someone's gonna piece it together, right. 393 00:17:57.640 --> 00:17:59.960 But I ended up working for a really early YouTube. 394 00:18:00.519 --> 00:18:02.279 It's a little cringe, is why I say it too. 395 00:18:02.359 --> 00:18:05.319 Because I wasn't really happy with a lot of the 396 00:18:05.319 --> 00:18:07.440 work that I was doing, but it was paying, it 397 00:18:07.519 --> 00:18:09.920 was regular. This is like the gold rush of YouTube 398 00:18:09.920 --> 00:18:12.200 to A lot of money was coming in and you. 399 00:18:12.119 --> 00:18:14.000 Could and you can still cheat. You can still cheat 400 00:18:14.000 --> 00:18:15.680 to get your stuff up on on the on the 401 00:18:15.680 --> 00:18:16.400