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<v Speaker 1>Dark Cast Network.

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<v Speaker 2>Welcome to the Dark Side of podcasting.

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<v Speaker 3>Hi guys, I'm Courtney and I'm Lisa, and we are

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<v Speaker 3>the hosts of the Book of the Dead, a true

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<v Speaker 3>crime podcast based out of New Jersey, where we tell

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<v Speaker 3>you about the most obscure cases that you may have

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<v Speaker 3>never heard of. So join us in the Book of

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<v Speaker 3>the Dead Library for another chapter of the Book of

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<v Speaker 3>the Dead wherever you get your podcasts.

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<v Speaker 1>Hi guys, Hey, y'all, welcome back to Mountain Murders.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm Heather and I'm Dylan. Hey Dylan, how's it going.

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<v Speaker 1>It's going great.

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<v Speaker 2>You look super happy.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, it's one of those days. It's going to

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<v Speaker 1>be one of those days here in the studio when

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<v Speaker 1>you don't know what's going to happen, you know what

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, Like we're going to be on the edge

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<v Speaker 1>of everything, you know, the edge of everything.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I have no idea what that means. Me neither,

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<v Speaker 2>But I'm interpreting that to mean that you will likely

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<v Speaker 2>say something completely unhinged and out in left field, and

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<v Speaker 2>the rest of us will be left to decipher the meaning.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, that's exactly what I meant.

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<v Speaker 2>Because you're a philosopher's sizer.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I'm going to philosophy ze on your face.

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<v Speaker 2>There you go. Okay, okay, it's been a minute, but

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<v Speaker 2>we are back and we are bringing you Part three

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<v Speaker 2>of the Larry Flint Story now.

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<v Speaker 1>And uh, this was one of the more unfortunate things

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<v Speaker 1>about our break. We were in the middle of a

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<v Speaker 1>series here on Larry Flint, a very interesting series in

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<v Speaker 1>my opinion, and I cannot wait for part three.

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<v Speaker 2>Absolutely, Dylan, do not forget. We are part of the

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<v Speaker 2>dark Cast Network. Dark Cast has a big announcement coming

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<v Speaker 2>your way. Make sure you check that out. So many

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<v Speaker 2>good indie podcasts available at the Darkcast Network, including Mountain Murders.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, there's more, too many to name.

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<v Speaker 2>If you'd like to pick up some funky, fresh merch

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<v Speaker 2>heading into fall spooky season, you want to get yourself

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<v Speaker 2>a little spooky gear, check out our website. That's www

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<v Speaker 2>dot Mountain Murders podcast dot com. Lots of merch available, dyling.

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<v Speaker 1>You can find everything Mountain Murders at that site.

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<v Speaker 2>Directly from our website, you can support us on Patreon

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<v Speaker 2>and do not forget Mark your calendar is September twenty fifth,

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<v Speaker 2>Mountain Murders will be at the fuck Yets Fall Festival

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<v Speaker 2>at the Slide Rog in Ashville. It is going to

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<v Speaker 2>be an amazing evening of punk bands, NonStop balls to

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<v Speaker 2>the wallpunk music. I'm super jazzed about this. And they

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<v Speaker 2>are bringing in all kinds of like spooky themed vendors

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<v Speaker 2>heading into the month of October, spooky season around the corner.

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<v Speaker 2>I just can't say fucking say spooky enough.

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<v Speaker 1>Dylan Home, I feel space. Yeah, I cannot wait for this.

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<v Speaker 1>It's gonna be a great evening. I even burned a

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<v Speaker 1>vacation day at work. That's how much I believe in

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<v Speaker 1>this evening. Because those a few.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I want you guys to pause for a moment,

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<v Speaker 2>close your eyes and think about this. We're in the yard.

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<v Speaker 2>There's a big bonfire. Dylan is naked, oh, only he

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<v Speaker 2>is wearing his like orange safety vest. Yeah, and he's

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<v Speaker 2>literally burning a vacation day and burning it and it's

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<v Speaker 2>right rising up. The smoke, the flames are rising up,

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<v Speaker 2>and he's presenting it to the universe like I'd of

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<v Speaker 2>sacrificing this beautiful vacation day so we can go listen

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<v Speaker 2>to punk music. No, it's more like he okay, right, yeah, okay, and.

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<v Speaker 1>Don't forget the high viz gear. You won't be able

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<v Speaker 1>to look away, Dylan from my body. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, I'm just gonna say, I often can't resist gig

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<v Speaker 2>away from your body. I cannot turn away.

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<v Speaker 1>No, I stand in from her neck like this is

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<v Speaker 1>the face of God, stare upon it.

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<v Speaker 2>It's quite delicious. Oh my gosh, the rhymes you were

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<v Speaker 2>given are quite booty delicious. Are you ready to get

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<v Speaker 2>into Larry Flint? I mean, get all up in him,

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<v Speaker 2>get deep inside.

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<v Speaker 1>We need to get We need to finish this Larry Flint.

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<v Speaker 2>You're gonna finish on his on his case, on his story.

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<v Speaker 1>And I'm gonna finish on his chair, right And I

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<v Speaker 1>want to see where it goes. I want to see

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<v Speaker 1>where I end up when this is over.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, Well, when we last discussed Larry Flint, he'd been

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<v Speaker 2>shot in the abdomen by an unknown sniper. Larry and

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<v Speaker 2>Althea decided to move to Los Angeles, California. The Flints

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<v Speaker 2>purchased a Mediterranean style mansion in Beverly Hills, previously previously

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<v Speaker 2>owned by Errol Flynn Share and Sonny if we have

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<v Speaker 2>to mention him, Robert Stack and Tony Curtis, This is.

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<v Speaker 1>All Hollywood royalty, right.

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<v Speaker 2>Absolutely. I would love to live in a home owned

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<v Speaker 2>previously by Share and Robert Stack. How cool would that be?

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<v Speaker 1>So here we have Larry's been an assassination attempt. There's

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<v Speaker 1>no other description of it.

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<v Speaker 2>If I could buy all Mart.

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<v Speaker 1>For a good price, Okay, Yes. And so from their

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<v Speaker 1>point of view, him and his wife's point of view,

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<v Speaker 1>you have to imagine that they're probably feeling like the

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<v Speaker 1>authorities are maybe not going to try to solve the case, right,

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<v Speaker 1>I mean you have to imagine that they don't have

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of confidence, and he's.

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<v Speaker 2>Been targeted a lot by law enforcement and lawmakers and

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<v Speaker 2>the authorities the man, if you will. So, yeah, I'm

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<v Speaker 2>sure he's he's maybe questioning like do they really care

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<v Speaker 2>about this? Yes, I'm in They've been trying to destroy

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<v Speaker 2>me financially, destroy my career, my business. Do they really

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<v Speaker 2>care if I'm gone to Yeah?

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<v Speaker 1>I mean you give given the high jinks of the

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<v Speaker 1>federal government with that whole thing in Kansas, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>having the materials sent there and trying to get him

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<v Speaker 1>for disseminating whatever through the mail and all that. So

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<v Speaker 1>I'm sure he doesn't have a lot of confidence in

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<v Speaker 1>the system.

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<v Speaker 2>Well Larry's not. He's not done with the government yet, Dylan,

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<v Speaker 2>Larry's got He's got more work to do. Damn on

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<v Speaker 2>the government. But let's get back into this. So moving

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<v Speaker 2>to Los Angeles brought a couple of sense of comfort

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<v Speaker 2>because it was a more progressive city where pornography wasn't

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<v Speaker 2>frowned upon as it was in the rust Belt. The

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<v Speaker 2>hustler offices were moved west as well. Unfortunately, Larry would

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<v Speaker 2>live with chronic pain. The only way to manage the

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<v Speaker 2>constant agony was with pain medications, particularly delauded and morphine.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh Wow.

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<v Speaker 2>A nineteen eighty four Vanity Fair article profiled specifically Larry's

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<v Speaker 2>pain and that it had driven him to these addictive medications.

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<v Speaker 2>During this time, Larry began injecting the medication himself as

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<v Speaker 2>well as ingesting it. Not only did Larry abuse the medications,

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<v Speaker 2>but althea started using them too. Damn, Larry isolated in

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<v Speaker 2>the mansion. He's abusing drugs. And during this time Larry

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<v Speaker 2>will overdose roughly six times due to opioid abuse.

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<v Speaker 1>Well yeah, yeah, Well, for one, he's not a doctor.

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<v Speaker 1>So when you started ministering these very strong narcotics yourself

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<v Speaker 1>intraveniously on top of ingesting them, and you're like, oh,

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<v Speaker 1>you're doing You're doing it, likely more often than prescribed,

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<v Speaker 1>maybe bigger doses than what your doctor would like. It's

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<v Speaker 1>a very dangerous situation. And that's the terrible thing about

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<v Speaker 1>chronic pain. People over the years who live with chronic pain, Yes,

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<v Speaker 1>is the very thing, the one thing usually that brings

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<v Speaker 1>them any type of relief, is also the one thing

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<v Speaker 1>that can harm them. Yes, you know. And and it's

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<v Speaker 1>not as easy as say someone who's purely using recreationally,

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<v Speaker 1>they don't have any pain or any conditions, they can say, Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm done with this. You know, I don't. I can't

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<v Speaker 1>control myself around these substances. Therefore I can't have them

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<v Speaker 1>in my life. I substance, I rebealed you in the

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<v Speaker 1>name of Hessus, and so you get away from it.

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<v Speaker 1>But then, if you are someone who truly has a

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<v Speaker 1>genuine chronic pain, you're left with this agonizing pain on

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<v Speaker 1>you know that you have to deal with daily. So

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<v Speaker 1>it makes them, it has to make it much more,

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<v Speaker 1>much harder to control yourself with these substances.

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<v Speaker 2>Right, Delauded is a a hydromorphone, a very potent opioid.

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<v Speaker 2>Morphine is another opioid. So taking them together produces addictive

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<v Speaker 2>opioid effects such as sedation and respiratory depression, and it

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<v Speaker 2>can result in death or a coma. Now Larry is

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<v Speaker 2>self administering these drugs. As I mentioned before, and for

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<v Speaker 2>anyone who's ever been on like a morphine drip in

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<v Speaker 2>the hospital, you get like a little clicker that's going

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<v Speaker 2>to regulate how much medicine you get, Yeah, how much morphine.

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<v Speaker 1>You can administer it yourself, but it will only do

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<v Speaker 1>it every so often.

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<v Speaker 2>Right, and so you can sit there and click it

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<v Speaker 2>a hundred times, but it's still just going to give

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<v Speaker 2>you the little dose that you're allotted in a specific period.

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<v Speaker 1>Right. But I'm sorry. My only experience I had back

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<v Speaker 1>served you on time and they gave me. I had

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<v Speaker 1>a ruptured disc. I was in tremendous pain, and I

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<v Speaker 1>think it was delauded that they gave me in the

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<v Speaker 1>emergency room, like it off the rip to you know,

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<v Speaker 1>calm me down so they could run some tests. And

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<v Speaker 1>I have to say, you know, I see why people

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<v Speaker 1>get hooked to something like that. Right, just the a'm

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<v Speaker 1>an instantaneous, more euphoric wave that washes over you and

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<v Speaker 1>you know, nothing matters. It doesn't matter if you have

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<v Speaker 1>pain or if you're going through something in your life.

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<v Speaker 1>You're just kind of drifting on this, like, I don't know,

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<v Speaker 1>like a cloud.

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<v Speaker 2>It's it's hard to describe, like a cheeseburger down the

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<v Speaker 2>river ketchup.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, maybe, but I understand how someone I wouldn't want,

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<v Speaker 1>let's just say me having issues in the past with

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<v Speaker 1>substances you know, here and there, I would not want

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<v Speaker 1>access full time access to these types of things.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't like those feelings. I mean, I know a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of people are like, yeah, right now, you really

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<v Speaker 2>don't that's euphoric sense or whatever. Look, I am such

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<v Speaker 2>a control freak in my life. I have to have

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<v Speaker 2>like every moment I need to feel like I'm on

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<v Speaker 2>top of it, like the hypervigilance to just like maintain

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<v Speaker 2>a sense of control in my life. That I hate

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<v Speaker 2>those feeling. I don't like feeling out of control. I

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<v Speaker 2>don't like being all doped up, if you will, even

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<v Speaker 2>if it feels good, It's like I I would not

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<v Speaker 2>want to feel that way every day, right Okay, I'm

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<v Speaker 2>a masochist, like I want every day of my life

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<v Speaker 2>to suck, and I want to be fully aware of

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<v Speaker 2>how bad it sucks.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, you want to give an accurate reading on the

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<v Speaker 1>suck scale, right, Plus, I.

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<v Speaker 2>Don't I don't think I've ever had morphine. Like I've

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<v Speaker 2>not had a you know, like a lot of medical

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<v Speaker 2>problems or surgeries. Maybe just a few little things here

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<v Speaker 2>and there, but I don't think I've ever been given

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<v Speaker 2>morphine for pain.

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<v Speaker 1>And that's a good thing because but you know, and

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<v Speaker 1>I was also on the morphine drip that you're describing

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<v Speaker 1>at post surgery a little bit, all recovered. But I

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<v Speaker 1>have to say, even me with my issues in the

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<v Speaker 1>past and now just was I was a kind of

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<v Speaker 1>stimulant guy, so you know, pills and all that.

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<v Speaker 2>God, that's what I don't need.

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<v Speaker 1>No, oh no, it's great, it's super cool. I'm very social.

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<v Speaker 1>No we should just you're like.

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<v Speaker 2>That without stimulants, look broke when you're like kind of manic. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>you get on my damn nerve. So I cannot imagine

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<v Speaker 2>you on stimulants like fully manic all the time.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you would be.

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<v Speaker 2>I would tie you up. You would be in the

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<v Speaker 2>trunk of my car, be up here, and my car

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<v Speaker 2>is very small, so I'd have to fold you up

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<v Speaker 2>like a fourth grade love note to stick you in

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<v Speaker 2>the trunk.

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<v Speaker 1>But I went to my doctor and I was like,

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<v Speaker 1>I don't want these anymore because I was getting you know,

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<v Speaker 1>a multiple things prescribed large amounts monthly, and just I mean, gosh,

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<v Speaker 1>it really affected my system in a negative way.

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<v Speaker 2>Bro, you should just like gotten more. You just sold it.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, yeah, I know I should. That's I saw some

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<v Speaker 1>video and I know this is the right thing to do, Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>But I saw some videos like a home health care

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<v Speaker 1>nurse was like doing a skit, but I guess just

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<v Speaker 1>you know, some reality she deals with and she's like, oh,

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<v Speaker 1>I see your father's passed away. Where's all his medicines

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<v Speaker 1>that are usually on the not stand by this and that.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh some of that stuff's really powerful. We need to

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<v Speaker 1>dispose of it properly and all that. And people's in

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<v Speaker 1>the comment is like, nah, that's not how that's gonna work.

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<v Speaker 1>But what's funny is what a lot of people said,

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<v Speaker 1>and this is true. No, I'm going to take that,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm going to put it back and if I do

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<v Speaker 1>have serious pain of any sort, get injured or something

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<v Speaker 1>like that, I'm going to take it myself because it's

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<v Speaker 1>almost impossible to get a doctor to prescribe you something

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<v Speaker 1>like that if you truly are in pain.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, no, I'm not saying I haven't heard people say

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<v Speaker 2>things like that before, and I'm not saying that's okay,

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<v Speaker 2>but you know.

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<v Speaker 1>Right, yeah, I would sell.

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<v Speaker 2>Hey, I would get caught like right off the bat

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<v Speaker 2>in this. It would I would like try to sell

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00:14:07.840 --> 00:14:09.559
<v Speaker 2>it to someone and then come to find out, like

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<v Speaker 2>my best friend of one hundred years is like an

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<v Speaker 2>undercover cop and I knew it and they arrest me

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<v Speaker 2>or something.

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<v Speaker 1>So yeah, okay, maybe you should just turn him in

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<v Speaker 1>at the first apartment.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm not a like, I'm not a I'm not a drug.

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<v Speaker 1>Dealer, all right. So here we have Larry of self

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<v Speaker 1>medicating with very powerful medicines and uh that has amazing

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<v Speaker 1>stat He's overdosed at least six times. And this is.

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<v Speaker 2>Back in the day and they didn't even have narcir

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah I.

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<v Speaker 1>Know, so that's pretty wild, right though.

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<v Speaker 2>I Mean, he could just be like narc canning himself

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<v Speaker 2>at the dollars store like every every hour if he

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<v Speaker 2>wanted to. Yeah, it's like wheeling around the doll tree.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh now they take they canning himself.

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<v Speaker 1>Keep the nark can in your drug kit so you

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00:14:51.840 --> 00:14:55.159
<v Speaker 1>can actually push your high further than you ever could before.

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<v Speaker 1>And you just have your buddy bring you back from

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<v Speaker 1>the edge of death. Awesome, and you can get extra.

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<v Speaker 2>That's not enabling people, Okay, it's althea. It takes over

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<v Speaker 2>the day to day operations of Hustler because Larry is

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<v Speaker 2>struggling with this chronic pain and substance abuse. She's under

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<v Speaker 2>immense pressure. She's running a full time corporation with many

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<v Speaker 2>employees and ensuring legal requirements are met. Plus she's got

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<v Speaker 2>an invalid husband at home who is high on pain medication.

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<v Speaker 2>This is a very stressful situation, and her courtisol level

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<v Speaker 2>it goes all the way up to eleven.

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<v Speaker 1>Eleven.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I like to play a game like how many

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<v Speaker 2>spinal tap references can I make in a day? Yeah? Okay,

279
00:15:40.360 --> 00:15:41.960
<v Speaker 2>so it goes all the way up to eleven, Doyling,

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<v Speaker 2>which I have to say, my courtisol level has been

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<v Speaker 2>at eleven for like almost two weeks now, and I'm

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<v Speaker 2>really starting to feel it's like taking over my body. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>and I just feel so stressed out. Well, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>like I'm just a big tense muscle, you know what

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<v Speaker 2>I mean.

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<v Speaker 1>See now, this is where the way I'm wired, this

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00:16:03.679 --> 00:16:06.759
<v Speaker 1>is that when it helps me, like when I should

288
00:16:06.759 --> 00:16:10.000
<v Speaker 1>be all to hell, like if the stuff's happened. I'm

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00:16:10.000 --> 00:16:12.480
<v Speaker 1>dealing with some things. You're going through some stuff, and

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00:16:12.519 --> 00:16:14.759
<v Speaker 1>I really should be concerned, like trying to figure out

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<v Speaker 1>how to make it better and like a plan forward,

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<v Speaker 1>a path forward. I don't worry about any of that stuff, right,

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<v Speaker 1>I just you know, we'll just see what happens tomorrow.

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<v Speaker 2>I've never seen you worry about anything since I met you.

295
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<v Speaker 2>You just go where the wind blows you.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, And you.

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<v Speaker 2>Know what they say, dealing ignorance.

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00:16:36.360 --> 00:16:37.600
<v Speaker 1>Is bliss It truly is.

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<v Speaker 2>And I've come to realize that maybe you're one ignorant

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00:16:40.080 --> 00:16:43.279
<v Speaker 2>ass motherfucker because you seem very blissful like a lot

301
00:16:43.320 --> 00:16:43.799
<v Speaker 2>of the time.

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<v Speaker 1>It's true, and I'm not.

303
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<v Speaker 2>And I I just maybe I need to be dumber.

304
00:16:50.159 --> 00:16:51.720
<v Speaker 1>So you just gotta let it go. Dude.

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00:16:51.799 --> 00:16:53.279
<v Speaker 2>Somebody needs to drop me on my head a few

306
00:16:53.320 --> 00:16:55.840
<v Speaker 2>times so we can be I can be on your level.

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<v Speaker 1>You got yeah, you gotta get it with my mama.

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<v Speaker 1>See it exactly how she got my head squared up

309
00:17:01.080 --> 00:17:03.360
<v Speaker 1>from throwing me around and dropping me on my head.

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00:17:04.720 --> 00:17:10.839
<v Speaker 1>She didn't do that on purpose, that she's admitted, damn.

311
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<v Speaker 1>But yeah, you've just got it. Will or it won't, Okay,

312
00:17:16.519 --> 00:17:17.359
<v Speaker 1>it will or it won't.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, my cortisol levels like through the roof, and

314
00:17:19.880 --> 00:17:22.880
<v Speaker 2>I'm so fucking stressed out and on edge. And it's

315
00:17:22.920 --> 00:17:25.799
<v Speaker 2>not even anything related to me. Nothing that's like other

316
00:17:25.839 --> 00:17:28.720
<v Speaker 2>people's other people's stuff stresses me out.

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00:17:28.920 --> 00:17:31.039
<v Speaker 1>You're like a tuning fork because I.

318
00:17:30.960 --> 00:17:34.400
<v Speaker 2>Fucking care so much. You know I am a tuning fork.

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00:17:34.440 --> 00:17:36.279
<v Speaker 1>You're gonna carry yourself into sick.

320
00:17:37.400 --> 00:17:40.279
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, this is why I just have to like isolate

321
00:17:41.119 --> 00:17:44.000
<v Speaker 2>because all y'all's feelings it affects me.

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00:17:44.920 --> 00:17:50.319
<v Speaker 4>Okay, I tell your feelings and leave her loft.

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00:17:50.240 --> 00:17:52.279
<v Speaker 2>A little sponge over here crying.

324
00:17:52.079 --> 00:17:54.680
<v Speaker 1>Don't soak it up. Somebody squeeze this bitch.

325
00:17:54.480 --> 00:17:58.839
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, somebody squeeze. Please squeeze my spongebody.

326
00:17:59.119 --> 00:18:03.480
<v Speaker 1>Let's squirt out something. Sponge juice a running everywhere.

327
00:18:03.599 --> 00:18:08.160
<v Speaker 2>She's over here squirting her feelings like that.

328
00:18:08.200 --> 00:18:09.400
<v Speaker 1>She was slapped full of it.

329
00:18:10.240 --> 00:18:15.799
<v Speaker 2>Okay, but what's not gloss over the fact that Althea

330
00:18:16.039 --> 00:18:18.799
<v Speaker 2>was more than qualified for the job. She'd been by

331
00:18:18.880 --> 00:18:22.640
<v Speaker 2>Larry's side for years and the top position within the company.

332
00:18:23.039 --> 00:18:27.960
<v Speaker 2>Althea takes command of Hustler and the sister magazine, Chic,

333
00:18:28.960 --> 00:18:30.200
<v Speaker 2>which is rarely mentioned.

334
00:18:30.440 --> 00:18:31.200
<v Speaker 1>I've heard of it.

335
00:18:31.480 --> 00:18:33.839
<v Speaker 2>I had not heard of Chic either.

336
00:18:33.920 --> 00:18:35.799
<v Speaker 1>I thought it was gonna be called like Balls or

337
00:18:35.839 --> 00:18:41.079
<v Speaker 1>something like that. So was a Sheic their elegant version

338
00:18:41.319 --> 00:18:43.960
<v Speaker 1>where they tried to be more classy, like you know,

339
00:18:44.200 --> 00:18:45.279
<v Speaker 1>Playboy early on.

340
00:18:45.359 --> 00:18:48.400
<v Speaker 2>And I have no idea because I did not for

341
00:18:48.519 --> 00:18:52.079
<v Speaker 2>the research Chic, because believe me, I I got enough

342
00:18:52.119 --> 00:18:53.920
<v Speaker 2>eye fool when I was researching Hustler.

343
00:18:54.039 --> 00:18:56.599
<v Speaker 1>I imagine by the name Alonge that that probably is

344
00:18:56.640 --> 00:18:57.079
<v Speaker 1>the case.

345
00:18:58.079 --> 00:19:01.279
<v Speaker 2>And this wasn't merely au Thea as like a figurehead

346
00:19:01.319 --> 00:19:05.839
<v Speaker 2>signing off on work that professional managers did. Althea occupies

347
00:19:06.000 --> 00:19:11.039
<v Speaker 2>a large, glass walled office acting as publisher. She's involved

348
00:19:11.079 --> 00:19:13.480
<v Speaker 2>in how ideas are presented and laid out, and can

349
00:19:13.519 --> 00:19:19.240
<v Speaker 2>be even more stubborn than Larry about editorial decisions. Althea

350
00:19:19.319 --> 00:19:22.599
<v Speaker 2>had to function around Larry's addiction, but eventually she joined

351
00:19:22.680 --> 00:19:26.480
<v Speaker 2>him in nineteen eighty three, there was an interview that

352
00:19:26.559 --> 00:19:31.440
<v Speaker 2>gets published with UPI like United Press International believe what

353
00:19:31.519 --> 00:19:34.440
<v Speaker 2>UPS stands for anyway, Althia explained that Larry took drugs

354
00:19:34.480 --> 00:19:37.319
<v Speaker 2>because of pain, and that she was taking them essentially

355
00:19:37.359 --> 00:19:41.440
<v Speaker 2>to share the experience with him. She described their drug

356
00:19:41.519 --> 00:19:46.200
<v Speaker 2>use as eventually becoming something of a mutually reinforcing ritual.

357
00:19:47.119 --> 00:19:51.880
<v Speaker 2>Their home life became extraordinarily dysfunctional. A later account by

358
00:19:52.039 --> 00:19:58.480
<v Speaker 2>Rudy Maxa described the couple using methadone, cocaine, marijuana, sleeping pills, morphine,

359
00:19:58.519 --> 00:20:03.039
<v Speaker 2>and delauded. Both suffered multiple overdoses during this time, and,

360
00:20:03.119 --> 00:20:07.000
<v Speaker 2>according to his account, out the cocaine habit alone reached

361
00:20:07.000 --> 00:20:10.160
<v Speaker 2>an estimated twenty thousand dollars per week.

362
00:20:10.400 --> 00:20:14.559
<v Speaker 1>Damn, damn, this.

363
00:20:14.599 --> 00:20:18.200
<v Speaker 2>Is like jagging. Now, that's a lot, like a mountain

364
00:20:18.240 --> 00:20:18.599
<v Speaker 2>of coke.

365
00:20:18.799 --> 00:20:20.920
<v Speaker 1>That's a lot of blow. And that was that really strong.

366
00:20:20.960 --> 00:20:22.960
<v Speaker 1>I'm not even being funny, but that was that really strong.

367
00:20:23.119 --> 00:20:25.480
<v Speaker 2>Like they're just shut like they've got big snowshovels and

368
00:20:25.519 --> 00:20:27.599
<v Speaker 2>they're just shoveling this coke into her face.

369
00:20:27.759 --> 00:20:30.680
<v Speaker 1>I mean, that'sn't really shot of money strong cocaine back

370
00:20:30.680 --> 00:20:31.400
<v Speaker 1>in the day.

371
00:20:31.519 --> 00:20:34.599
<v Speaker 2>And this isn't like the early eighties. So twenty thousand

372
00:20:34.680 --> 00:20:39.240
<v Speaker 2>dollars is what like two hundred thousand by today's money.

373
00:20:39.240 --> 00:20:41.799
<v Speaker 1>I mean, I mean maybe, oh, easily one hundred thousand

374
00:20:41.920 --> 00:20:45.400
<v Speaker 1>if you account for inflation and all that. But you know,

375
00:20:45.480 --> 00:20:47.759
<v Speaker 1>this is the kind of cocaine that literally can eat

376
00:20:47.799 --> 00:20:50.359
<v Speaker 1>your entire nasal cop and you have like that hole.

377
00:20:50.480 --> 00:20:53.640
<v Speaker 2>Oh, you'll be like that guy, the comedian what's his name, Artie?

378
00:20:53.839 --> 00:20:54.039
<v Speaker 1>Oh?

379
00:20:54.119 --> 00:20:56.839
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, already he was like on Howard Stern show a lot.

380
00:20:57.000 --> 00:20:59.640
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, he's kind of gross, yeah, but he went hard

381
00:20:59.680 --> 00:21:00.440
<v Speaker 1>in to pay. Yeah.

382
00:21:00.480 --> 00:21:01.920
<v Speaker 2>Bro, it's like missing half his nose.

383
00:21:02.279 --> 00:21:03.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And this is the stuff that will eat all

384
00:21:03.960 --> 00:21:09.079
<v Speaker 1>your sonuses out in your deviated septim right, Yeah, that's

385
00:21:09.119 --> 00:21:09.720
<v Speaker 1>what it's called.

386
00:21:09.960 --> 00:21:14.599
<v Speaker 2>No, that's what it's called. Althea's involvement often gets downplayed

387
00:21:14.799 --> 00:21:19.240
<v Speaker 2>or becomes background to Larry's story, But she was a badass,

388
00:21:19.599 --> 00:21:21.960
<v Speaker 2>Like I really want to talk about Althea here. Like

389
00:21:22.000 --> 00:21:24.640
<v Speaker 2>I've mentioned before, she played an important role at Hustler

390
00:21:24.720 --> 00:21:28.559
<v Speaker 2>even before Larry's injuries, Like in the nineteen seventies, she

391
00:21:28.680 --> 00:21:31.119
<v Speaker 2>was earning five hundred thousand dollars a year as an

392
00:21:31.160 --> 00:21:35.359
<v Speaker 2>associate publisher, which was just unheard of for a woman

393
00:21:35.519 --> 00:21:40.079
<v Speaker 2>at that time. Althea has been described as a gatekeeper

394
00:21:40.160 --> 00:21:45.680
<v Speaker 2>within the organization. She wielded considerable power. Althea could fire

395
00:21:45.880 --> 00:21:51.519
<v Speaker 2>senior staff without Larry's permission. Paul Krasner, a renowned subculture

396
00:21:51.559 --> 00:21:55.519
<v Speaker 2>writer and the founder of the Realist, was briefly named

397
00:21:55.559 --> 00:21:58.559
<v Speaker 2>publisher of Hustler, and Althea fired him.

398
00:21:59.079 --> 00:22:00.759
<v Speaker 1>Damn, I guess she just and like him.

399
00:22:00.960 --> 00:22:04.599
<v Speaker 2>And Krassner himself said that Althea told him readers wanted

400
00:22:04.680 --> 00:22:07.440
<v Speaker 2>Larry's name on the masthead, not his.

401
00:22:08.079 --> 00:22:09.680
<v Speaker 1>Oh so, not.

402
00:22:09.599 --> 00:22:12.839
<v Speaker 2>Only is she a shrewd businesswoman, but she genuinely has

403
00:22:13.000 --> 00:22:16.359
<v Speaker 2>Larry's back in all facets of life.

404
00:22:17.000 --> 00:22:19.160
<v Speaker 1>We'll say, when you have a partner like this, who's

405
00:22:19.200 --> 00:22:23.759
<v Speaker 1>really been hands on in a large organization that's continued

406
00:22:23.799 --> 00:22:27.640
<v Speaker 1>to grow, I'm sure this is almost a natural fit

407
00:22:27.799 --> 00:22:31.880
<v Speaker 1>for her to, you know, slide into Larry's job, you know,

408
00:22:31.920 --> 00:22:34.799
<v Speaker 1>because he's unable to do it. And I'm sure even

409
00:22:34.799 --> 00:22:37.640
<v Speaker 1>with everything going on in their lives and her worrying

410
00:22:37.680 --> 00:22:40.400
<v Speaker 1>for Larry and everything that's happened to him, she probably

411
00:22:40.440 --> 00:22:42.440
<v Speaker 1>has also had a lot of stuff on the shelf

412
00:22:42.799 --> 00:22:46.680
<v Speaker 1>ideas that she would like to implement or try, and

413
00:22:46.720 --> 00:22:49.559
<v Speaker 1>this has really given her the opportunity to do just that.

414
00:22:50.720 --> 00:22:53.920
<v Speaker 2>Althea had real editorial instincts, like if she hadn't been

415
00:22:53.960 --> 00:22:56.960
<v Speaker 2>at Hustler, she could have easily slid into a role

416
00:22:57.119 --> 00:23:00.920
<v Speaker 2>at like Vogue or like a fashion magazine, because she

417
00:23:01.000 --> 00:23:03.799
<v Speaker 2>really knew like what, Like she knew what she wanted,

418
00:23:03.839 --> 00:23:06.319
<v Speaker 2>She knew what looked good, she knew styling, she knew

419
00:23:06.400 --> 00:23:10.480
<v Speaker 2>set design like she knew the angles, the shots she wanted,

420
00:23:10.680 --> 00:23:14.960
<v Speaker 2>like everything, she cared about how the magazine looked. In

421
00:23:14.960 --> 00:23:19.240
<v Speaker 2>a Washington Post interview, those who worked with Althea told

422
00:23:19.839 --> 00:23:23.279
<v Speaker 2>journalist Cynthia Gorney that if Althea had an idea for

423
00:23:23.359 --> 00:23:27.880
<v Speaker 2>something that should appear in the magazine, she was extremely insistent.

424
00:23:28.480 --> 00:23:33.240
<v Speaker 2>And though Althea didn't transform herself into a conventional corporate executive,

425
00:23:33.599 --> 00:23:38.000
<v Speaker 2>she maintained a somewhat more informal style. She wondered freely

426
00:23:38.160 --> 00:23:42.720
<v Speaker 2>between being owner, publisher, employee, and sort of the resident

427
00:23:42.920 --> 00:23:47.680
<v Speaker 2>eccentric at Hustler offices, she sometimes spent long stretches in

428
00:23:47.720 --> 00:23:51.240
<v Speaker 2>the mailroom talking to eighteen year old employees and listening

429
00:23:51.240 --> 00:23:55.160
<v Speaker 2>to whatever like mixtapes they brought into work. Okay, really

430
00:23:55.160 --> 00:23:58.759
<v Speaker 2>into music. She would nap on her sofa in the office.

431
00:23:59.000 --> 00:24:02.559
<v Speaker 2>She kept Jack Daniel inside a wooden globe on her desk.

432
00:24:02.880 --> 00:24:04.279
<v Speaker 2>She sounds like a CEO.

433
00:24:04.039 --> 00:24:07.839
<v Speaker 1>To me, No, she sounds like a CEO who's actually

434
00:24:09.119 --> 00:24:12.519
<v Speaker 1>got their finger on the pulse of the company, right anyone.

435
00:24:13.319 --> 00:24:17.839
<v Speaker 1>And I've seen this to a small smaller degree in

436
00:24:17.839 --> 00:24:20.880
<v Speaker 1>my years of working in blue collar trades and being

437
00:24:20.920 --> 00:24:25.279
<v Speaker 1>in factories. Any manager that's willing to get their hands

438
00:24:25.319 --> 00:24:30.559
<v Speaker 1>dirty or take the time to talk to the lowest member,

439
00:24:30.839 --> 00:24:34.319
<v Speaker 1>the least senior member on the team and work their

440
00:24:34.359 --> 00:24:39.519
<v Speaker 1>way up the line, they're really getting a genuine idea

441
00:24:40.799 --> 00:24:44.519
<v Speaker 1>or outlook on how the company is doing, how policies

442
00:24:44.559 --> 00:24:47.720
<v Speaker 1>are being implemented in the real real world, not the

443
00:24:48.319 --> 00:24:51.839
<v Speaker 1>boardroom or not somemra rob meeting of upper management. And

444
00:24:52.119 --> 00:24:54.200
<v Speaker 1>it's really a smart thing to do. It's it's really

445
00:24:54.240 --> 00:24:58.440
<v Speaker 1>a good way to figure out how your company, how

446
00:24:58.440 --> 00:25:00.920
<v Speaker 1>people feel about working at competible.

447
00:25:00.680 --> 00:25:02.839
<v Speaker 2>That and I think it also like creates a really

448
00:25:02.880 --> 00:25:07.480
<v Speaker 2>positive culture that that Larry started that everyone whether you're

449
00:25:07.519 --> 00:25:12.559
<v Speaker 2>the janitor or you're the vice president, he treats everyone

450
00:25:12.599 --> 00:25:16.720
<v Speaker 2>the same. Everyone's important, everyone matters, and so Althea just

451
00:25:16.799 --> 00:25:21.799
<v Speaker 2>kind of continues that philosophy in running this business and

452
00:25:21.839 --> 00:25:23.319
<v Speaker 2>it seems to be really effective.

453
00:25:23.839 --> 00:25:26.440
<v Speaker 1>Well, any place that claims to have an open door

454
00:25:26.480 --> 00:25:29.759
<v Speaker 1>policy as far as your access to upper management and

455
00:25:29.799 --> 00:25:32.359
<v Speaker 1>they truly follow through with that. It's always been a

456
00:25:32.400 --> 00:25:36.240
<v Speaker 1>positive thing from my and from my experience.

457
00:25:36.319 --> 00:25:41.640
<v Speaker 2>Well, you know Timothy Leary O, mister like LSD Daddy himself, Yeah,

458
00:25:41.680 --> 00:25:44.440
<v Speaker 2>well he knew the Flints very well after their move

459
00:25:44.519 --> 00:25:48.279
<v Speaker 2>to Los Angeles, and he described Althea as being bright, shrewd,

460
00:25:48.480 --> 00:25:52.799
<v Speaker 2>and intellectually curious. She was also flamboyant and drawn to

461
00:25:53.160 --> 00:25:59.680
<v Speaker 2>outsiders and dissent. Althea understood Larry, the Hustler audience and

462
00:25:59.720 --> 00:26:03.839
<v Speaker 2>the company's strange culture. She didn't need to turn Hustler

463
00:26:03.920 --> 00:26:08.400
<v Speaker 2>into some high fashion magazine like Vogue. She understood what

464
00:26:08.480 --> 00:26:12.160
<v Speaker 2>Hustler was supposed to be, and she knew exactly how

465
00:26:12.200 --> 00:26:14.519
<v Speaker 2>to give the people what they wanted.

466
00:26:14.960 --> 00:26:17.640
<v Speaker 1>And that's very smart. You know, it's really easy to

467
00:26:18.400 --> 00:26:22.559
<v Speaker 1>lose sight of your lane if you will right unit,

468
00:26:22.720 --> 00:26:27.079
<v Speaker 1>you have customers who expect a certain thing from your product,

469
00:26:27.720 --> 00:26:29.920
<v Speaker 1>and anytime you get too big for your breeches or

470
00:26:29.920 --> 00:26:33.279
<v Speaker 1>you get real egotistical about it. You might lose sight

471
00:26:33.319 --> 00:26:35.799
<v Speaker 1>of that. So it's very important to keep that in mind.

472
00:26:35.920 --> 00:26:38.519
<v Speaker 2>Right Well, after Larry was shot, there was an internal

473
00:26:38.559 --> 00:26:42.960
<v Speaker 2>power struggle that ensued. Althea and Larry's brother, Jimmy became

474
00:26:43.160 --> 00:26:47.319
<v Speaker 2>involved in a dispute over ownership of the Hustler business.

475
00:26:47.799 --> 00:26:52.039
<v Speaker 2>The dispute was settled when Jimmy accepted leisure Time Products

476
00:26:52.160 --> 00:26:55.440
<v Speaker 2>a mail order operation, and released his claims to the

477
00:26:55.480 --> 00:26:59.599
<v Speaker 2>other companies. The entire matter was ultimately resolved through federal

478
00:26:59.640 --> 00:27:03.960
<v Speaker 2>litigation over the company's ownership. So that can be a

479
00:27:04.000 --> 00:27:09.799
<v Speaker 2>little messy. Family family fighting family's business for sure.

480
00:27:10.160 --> 00:27:15.640
<v Speaker 1>That can get that can turn hateful, can be ugly,

481
00:27:15.880 --> 00:27:18.200
<v Speaker 1>it can it can poison the entire company.

482
00:27:18.599 --> 00:27:22.000
<v Speaker 2>I'm poison water in horror. Yeah, when stuff like that happens,

483
00:27:22.079 --> 00:27:25.519
<v Speaker 2>there's just snak in my boot. Yes. Althea also wanted

484
00:27:25.559 --> 00:27:29.000
<v Speaker 2>a magazine of her own. She proposed a publication called

485
00:27:29.240 --> 00:27:32.079
<v Speaker 2>The Rage, and this was a magazine like she had

486
00:27:32.079 --> 00:27:35.200
<v Speaker 2>had in mind for a while. Althea wanted to create

487
00:27:35.200 --> 00:27:40.799
<v Speaker 2>a non pornographic magazine centered on punk culture that was

488
00:27:40.839 --> 00:27:44.640
<v Speaker 2>happening like during the mid nineteen eighties. The project ultimately

489
00:27:44.680 --> 00:27:50.119
<v Speaker 2>didn't materialize and it is tempting to interpret Althea entirely

490
00:27:50.240 --> 00:27:53.160
<v Speaker 2>through Larry, which a lot of people do, but their

491
00:27:53.200 --> 00:27:58.359
<v Speaker 2>professional relationship seems more complicated. And in roughly twelve years

492
00:27:58.759 --> 00:28:02.880
<v Speaker 2>she had a substantial publishing career really, so she was

493
00:28:02.960 --> 00:28:05.559
<v Speaker 2>like a force to be reckoned with. Like she wasn't

494
00:28:05.599 --> 00:28:09.920
<v Speaker 2>just Larry's wife who just happens to work there kind

495
00:28:09.920 --> 00:28:14.640
<v Speaker 2>of flitting about. I mean, she's she's actually like she's

496
00:28:14.680 --> 00:28:18.960
<v Speaker 2>a visionary and she's there. I mean this magazine is

497
00:28:19.000 --> 00:28:21.359
<v Speaker 2>also like she's a big part of this, you know,

498
00:28:21.400 --> 00:28:23.640
<v Speaker 2>like she helped create it and make it what it

499
00:28:23.720 --> 00:28:26.559
<v Speaker 2>is today and what it was for years. You know.

500
00:28:26.880 --> 00:28:29.720
<v Speaker 1>Well, it's like you said earlier, she had real talent.

501
00:28:30.000 --> 00:28:33.319
<v Speaker 1>She did and no matter where or what type of magazine.

502
00:28:33.920 --> 00:28:36.599
<v Speaker 1>And I'm sure it helps if she's passionate about her

503
00:28:36.720 --> 00:28:40.359
<v Speaker 1>you know, whatever the magazine subject matter is. But it

504
00:28:40.440 --> 00:28:43.240
<v Speaker 1>sounds like she would have done fine and it, yeah,

505
00:28:43.559 --> 00:28:44.559
<v Speaker 1>risen through the ranks.

506
00:28:44.640 --> 00:28:48.240
<v Speaker 2>Well. Eventually, Larry grows concerned about Althea's drug use and

507
00:28:48.319 --> 00:28:52.160
<v Speaker 2>starts cutting her off from his supply, But Althea is

508
00:28:52.359 --> 00:28:54.599
<v Speaker 2>hanging out. I mean she's in Los Angeles and she's

509
00:28:54.599 --> 00:28:58.680
<v Speaker 2>hanging out at the whiskey and the roxy. In LA

510
00:28:58.880 --> 00:29:01.359
<v Speaker 2>where there's plenty heroin and.

511
00:29:01.519 --> 00:29:03.359
<v Speaker 1>Cocaine, she's not gonna have a problem.

512
00:29:03.640 --> 00:29:07.119
<v Speaker 2>She had problem getting these drugs. And for those who

513
00:29:07.200 --> 00:29:10.640
<v Speaker 2>don't know, Los Angeles in the early nineteen eighties had

514
00:29:10.680 --> 00:29:14.720
<v Speaker 2>one of the most important and volatile punk scenes in America.

515
00:29:15.319 --> 00:29:19.039
<v Speaker 2>It was less a single scene than several overlapping ones.

516
00:29:19.559 --> 00:29:23.200
<v Speaker 2>You had like the aready first wave punk crowd, then

517
00:29:23.599 --> 00:29:27.799
<v Speaker 2>the aggressive hardcore scene. There were these suburban and city

518
00:29:28.160 --> 00:29:32.480
<v Speaker 2>like beach bands that were also kind of punk. Then

519
00:29:32.519 --> 00:29:35.839
<v Speaker 2>you had Latino punk scenes in East LA and then

520
00:29:35.880 --> 00:29:38.599
<v Speaker 2>the darker post punk death rock underground.

521
00:29:39.200 --> 00:29:42.440
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and all these scenes would overlap at times, right.

522
00:29:42.559 --> 00:29:44.599
<v Speaker 2>Exact, Yes, that's what I just said.

523
00:29:44.359 --> 00:29:45.480
<v Speaker 1>Bud in the crowds.

524
00:29:46.200 --> 00:29:49.559
<v Speaker 2>So the earlier Hollywood scenes centered around bands like X,

525
00:29:49.799 --> 00:29:53.480
<v Speaker 2>the Weirdos, the Germs, and the Bags. I love the

526
00:29:53.559 --> 00:29:57.119
<v Speaker 2>Germs like I'm a big Germs fan. Then hardcore arrived.

527
00:29:57.279 --> 00:30:00.880
<v Speaker 2>You get bands like Black Flag, the Circle, jerm Sphere,

528
00:30:01.720 --> 00:30:07.119
<v Speaker 2>the Adolescence, TSOL, and the descendants that made music faster, louder,

529
00:30:07.240 --> 00:30:11.839
<v Speaker 2>and more confrontational. A lot of the Second Wave wasn't

530
00:30:11.880 --> 00:30:15.440
<v Speaker 2>actually coming from Hollywood. Black Flag, for example, came from

531
00:30:15.440 --> 00:30:19.599
<v Speaker 2>Hermosa Beach, the adolescents were from Flords in California, and

532
00:30:19.680 --> 00:30:22.519
<v Speaker 2>a lot of other bands emerged from suburbs scattered across

533
00:30:22.599 --> 00:30:25.880
<v Speaker 2>southern California if you're interested, because I could talk about

534
00:30:25.920 --> 00:30:28.640
<v Speaker 2>this all day, but this is not a music podcast,

535
00:30:28.839 --> 00:30:31.960
<v Speaker 2>and I'm sure people don't want to hear my thoughts

536
00:30:32.000 --> 00:30:35.319
<v Speaker 2>on the La punk scene. But anyway, if you are

537
00:30:35.359 --> 00:30:38.119
<v Speaker 2>interested in learning more about this, I highly recommend watching

538
00:30:38.599 --> 00:30:43.359
<v Speaker 2>The Decline of Western Civilization Part one. It's a wonderful documentary.

539
00:30:43.359 --> 00:30:46.319
<v Speaker 2>There's actually three of them, but the first one focuses

540
00:30:46.359 --> 00:30:49.799
<v Speaker 2>solely on the La punk scene during this time in

541
00:30:49.839 --> 00:30:52.279
<v Speaker 2>the early eighties, and it's really great.

542
00:30:52.599 --> 00:30:55.759
<v Speaker 1>No, it really is a great it's a great documentary,

543
00:30:56.440 --> 00:31:00.039
<v Speaker 1>and it really exposes you to exactly what you just

544
00:31:00.119 --> 00:31:02.359
<v Speaker 1>described in an intimate fashion.

545
00:31:02.920 --> 00:31:06.200
<v Speaker 2>Now, Althina's interest in punk wasn't a fleeting thing, and

546
00:31:06.240 --> 00:31:08.559
<v Speaker 2>so that's why I bring all of this up, because

547
00:31:08.599 --> 00:31:11.200
<v Speaker 2>you hear like she wanted to start a punk rock magazine,

548
00:31:11.240 --> 00:31:14.960
<v Speaker 2>and you know, people might roll their eyes and be like, oh, yeah, okay, well,

549
00:31:15.039 --> 00:31:17.359
<v Speaker 2>but but the thing is like it was a big

550
00:31:17.400 --> 00:31:20.960
<v Speaker 2>deal at this time, and she's kind of you know,

551
00:31:22.160 --> 00:31:25.920
<v Speaker 2>I guess sort of submerged herself into this scene and

552
00:31:25.960 --> 00:31:29.640
<v Speaker 2>she can see how important it is and what it's creating,

553
00:31:29.960 --> 00:31:34.720
<v Speaker 2>and how it's attracting all these young people, and you know,

554
00:31:34.759 --> 00:31:35.640
<v Speaker 2>it's pretty awesome.

555
00:31:36.279 --> 00:31:38.640
<v Speaker 1>No, and I'm sure you know people could roll their

556
00:31:38.640 --> 00:31:40.960
<v Speaker 1>eyes like, oh, like it was some pet project of hers.

557
00:31:41.640 --> 00:31:45.039
<v Speaker 1>But I think that the fact that she did consider

558
00:31:46.079 --> 00:31:49.960
<v Speaker 1>for I'm sure quite some time this magazine and it

559
00:31:50.039 --> 00:31:54.240
<v Speaker 1>being about that she saw an opportunity, and she also

560
00:31:54.279 --> 00:31:56.640
<v Speaker 1>probably felt very strongly about it, right.

561
00:31:56.559 --> 00:31:58.480
<v Speaker 2>And I mean it definitely would have, you know, kind

562
00:31:58.480 --> 00:32:00.599
<v Speaker 2>of like been a niche magazine.

563
00:32:00.680 --> 00:32:01.519
<v Speaker 1>It would have been nice.

564
00:32:01.559 --> 00:32:03.559
<v Speaker 2>I think a lot of people would have been interested

565
00:32:03.599 --> 00:32:04.119
<v Speaker 2>in it.

566
00:32:04.119 --> 00:32:07.759
<v Speaker 1>It would have been niche and CULTI but having real

567
00:32:07.839 --> 00:32:12.920
<v Speaker 1>money and experience and talent behind something representing the punk

568
00:32:12.960 --> 00:32:15.440
<v Speaker 1>scene at that time would have been monumental.

569
00:32:15.720 --> 00:32:18.599
<v Speaker 2>Honestly. I would love I would love to have seen

570
00:32:19.079 --> 00:32:21.240
<v Speaker 2>like I would have loved if this magazine had taken

571
00:32:21.279 --> 00:32:23.680
<v Speaker 2>off and we could see, like I'm just imagining all

572
00:32:23.680 --> 00:32:27.799
<v Speaker 2>the cool photos and interviews and like, how badass this

573
00:32:27.920 --> 00:32:29.000
<v Speaker 2>magazine could have been.

574
00:32:29.160 --> 00:32:31.839
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, just when you see if you were to watch

575
00:32:31.880 --> 00:32:35.119
<v Speaker 1>that doc some a couple of these clubs are basically

576
00:32:35.200 --> 00:32:35.960
<v Speaker 1>holes in.

577
00:32:35.960 --> 00:32:38.559
<v Speaker 2>The wall, empty warehouse space.

578
00:32:38.759 --> 00:32:42.640
<v Speaker 1>People that came through there that ended up turning into legends.

579
00:32:42.799 --> 00:32:44.079
<v Speaker 1>I mean, it's just mind.

580
00:32:43.960 --> 00:32:45.839
<v Speaker 2>Boggling to see these young artists.

581
00:32:46.160 --> 00:32:48.720
<v Speaker 1>Where was the one place where Jane's Addiction was basically

582
00:32:48.799 --> 00:32:49.519
<v Speaker 1>the house band?

583
00:32:49.720 --> 00:32:52.680
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, I can't remember the name of the little club,

584
00:32:52.720 --> 00:32:53.240
<v Speaker 2>but yeah.

585
00:32:53.240 --> 00:32:55.519
<v Speaker 1>So you, as a young person could pop up at

586
00:32:55.519 --> 00:32:58.200
<v Speaker 1>this cool little spot you're hearing about and see a

587
00:32:58.240 --> 00:33:01.920
<v Speaker 1>young Jane's Addiction who was basically the house band for

588
00:33:02.000 --> 00:33:04.440
<v Speaker 1>quite some time there. I mean, are you kidding me?

589
00:33:04.920 --> 00:33:05.440
<v Speaker 2>Exactly?

590
00:33:05.799 --> 00:33:06.240
<v Speaker 1>Oh wow?

591
00:33:06.440 --> 00:33:10.240
<v Speaker 2>Super cool. Now, Larry's legal troubles are far from over.

592
00:33:10.759 --> 00:33:15.359
<v Speaker 2>Penthouse magazine publisher Bob Guccione was married to a woman

593
00:33:15.440 --> 00:33:19.960
<v Speaker 2>named Kathy Keaton, and Kathy Keaton sued Larry for defamation

594
00:33:20.599 --> 00:33:23.960
<v Speaker 2>because the nineteen seventy six issue of Hustler contained a

595
00:33:24.000 --> 00:33:29.240
<v Speaker 2>cartoon of Kathy implying that her husband, Bob, had given

596
00:33:29.279 --> 00:33:33.119
<v Speaker 2>her an STD Oh damn. Now the case was dismissed

597
00:33:33.160 --> 00:33:36.720
<v Speaker 2>when it was revealed that Bob had in fact given

598
00:33:36.759 --> 00:33:38.400
<v Speaker 2>his wife a venereal disease.

599
00:33:38.799 --> 00:33:40.319
<v Speaker 1>So it's not slander, right.

600
00:33:40.440 --> 00:33:44.440
<v Speaker 2>Right, So it's not defamation because it was fact Kathy's

601
00:33:44.480 --> 00:33:47.960
<v Speaker 2>first suit ended up being thrown out of court, one

602
00:33:48.079 --> 00:33:52.400
<v Speaker 2>because it was factual, and two because by the time

603
00:33:52.480 --> 00:33:55.119
<v Speaker 2>she filed this lawsuit in the eighties, the statute of

604
00:33:55.160 --> 00:33:56.599
<v Speaker 2>limitations had expired.

605
00:33:57.880 --> 00:33:59.720
<v Speaker 1>Well, yeah, I mean you could argue that, hey, it

606
00:33:59.759 --> 00:34:02.720
<v Speaker 1>was actual, that was satirical that. I mean, I'm sure

607
00:34:02.720 --> 00:34:05.480
<v Speaker 1>you'd come at that from ten different director, ten different.

608
00:34:05.240 --> 00:34:07.480
<v Speaker 2>Ways, right, And I don't know why, but it's kind

609
00:34:07.480 --> 00:34:12.199
<v Speaker 2>of funny to me, Like people suing because somebody dunked

610
00:34:12.239 --> 00:34:12.920
<v Speaker 2>on them.

611
00:34:13.519 --> 00:34:16.039
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, because it's a crude cartoons, Like, so what.

612
00:34:16.079 --> 00:34:18.960
<v Speaker 2>You got owned? Because like the more a person insists

613
00:34:19.000 --> 00:34:22.639
<v Speaker 2>something isn't true, the more it makes them look like

614
00:34:24.039 --> 00:34:26.000
<v Speaker 2>it is. And they're like you know what I'm saying.

615
00:34:26.239 --> 00:34:28.280
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, Like the more you deny it, then what

616
00:34:28.360 --> 00:34:31.440
<v Speaker 2>it actually makes you look guilty or like, no, it's

617
00:34:31.639 --> 00:34:32.159
<v Speaker 2>the truth.

618
00:34:32.320 --> 00:34:34.639
<v Speaker 1>Well, and you certainly make a bigger deal a mountain

619
00:34:34.639 --> 00:34:37.079
<v Speaker 1>out of a molehill, and way more people hear about

620
00:34:37.119 --> 00:34:40.159
<v Speaker 1>it than it's right, the few people who knew who

621
00:34:40.199 --> 00:34:43.320
<v Speaker 1>you were when they read the cartoon in the magazine, right.

622
00:34:43.320 --> 00:34:46.199
<v Speaker 2>So like, yeah, you might have a few thousand people

623
00:34:46.199 --> 00:34:48.079
<v Speaker 2>who read it and are like whatever, But then when

624
00:34:48.079 --> 00:34:49.559
<v Speaker 2>you make this big fuss about it. It's like you

625
00:34:49.559 --> 00:34:51.880
<v Speaker 2>want the whole world to know, and then they all

626
00:34:51.920 --> 00:34:53.960
<v Speaker 2>find out that this is the true I mean, come

627
00:34:54.000 --> 00:34:57.599
<v Speaker 2>on anyway, Like, come on, Kathy, you got dumped on.

628
00:34:58.119 --> 00:35:01.800
<v Speaker 2>Take it now. She ended up suing Larry in New Hampshire.

629
00:35:01.920 --> 00:35:04.880
<v Speaker 2>And here's the thing. Hustler wasn't published in New Hampshire,

630
00:35:05.239 --> 00:35:09.119
<v Speaker 2>and that's not where Larry resided. But she didn't reside

631
00:35:09.159 --> 00:35:15.360
<v Speaker 2>in New Hampshire either. She specifically picked New Hampshire because

632
00:35:15.519 --> 00:35:19.000
<v Speaker 2>they sold Hustler there and had the longest statute of limitations,

633
00:35:19.039 --> 00:35:21.320
<v Speaker 2>which was six years, so she would be within the

634
00:35:21.360 --> 00:35:25.079
<v Speaker 2>window to sue him there. And New Hampshire ultimately threw

635
00:35:25.119 --> 00:35:27.800
<v Speaker 2>the case out of court as well, but then Kathy

636
00:35:27.920 --> 00:35:31.360
<v Speaker 2>took it to Federal Court and eventually all the way

637
00:35:31.480 --> 00:35:34.159
<v Speaker 2>to the Supreme Court.

638
00:35:34.719 --> 00:35:37.880
<v Speaker 1>So at this point she spent a considerable amount of

639
00:35:37.880 --> 00:35:40.679
<v Speaker 1>money on attorney fees alone.

640
00:35:40.519 --> 00:35:42.000
<v Speaker 2>To look really stupid, and.

641
00:35:41.920 --> 00:35:47.360
<v Speaker 1>Political capital or social capital certainly, to look stupid, just.

642
00:35:47.320 --> 00:35:49.320
<v Speaker 2>So everyone could find out that, like, hey, guess what

643
00:35:49.559 --> 00:35:50.119
<v Speaker 2>like so.

644
00:35:50.079 --> 00:35:51.920
<v Speaker 1>We can have a Matt Locke moment, she.

645
00:35:51.960 --> 00:35:55.159
<v Speaker 2>Had the crowds or whatever, I don't like. So he

646
00:35:55.199 --> 00:35:56.760
<v Speaker 2>gave her the clap. I mean, I don't I'm not

647
00:35:56.800 --> 00:35:58.920
<v Speaker 2>sure what he gave her, but I'm just saying.

648
00:35:58.679 --> 00:36:00.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So matt Lock's a one moment, ma'am. And the

649
00:36:01.000 --> 00:36:03.239
<v Speaker 1>door is sling open and a big crab comes down

650
00:36:03.280 --> 00:36:05.920
<v Speaker 1>the afice. Oh gosh, yeah, that's the big Matlock moment.

651
00:36:06.079 --> 00:36:08.679
<v Speaker 2>When Larry showed up in Washington, d C. He was

652
00:36:08.760 --> 00:36:11.960
<v Speaker 2>hell bent on representing himself in the courtroom. There was

653
00:36:12.000 --> 00:36:15.079
<v Speaker 2>a lawyer that had been appointed to represent Larry, and

654
00:36:15.119 --> 00:36:19.519
<v Speaker 2>this made him really mad. How does that go? So

655
00:36:19.599 --> 00:36:22.960
<v Speaker 2>I'm just curious, does Kathy show up with photos of

656
00:36:23.039 --> 00:36:27.440
<v Speaker 2>like her healthy genitals, like see, look there's no discharge. Like,

657
00:36:27.480 --> 00:36:30.199
<v Speaker 2>I know it's silly, but look if one of my

658
00:36:30.639 --> 00:36:35.159
<v Speaker 2>haters said there has an STD, like, I'm not even

659
00:36:35.199 --> 00:36:38.519
<v Speaker 2>gonna be mad because I'm just like, it's so lame.

660
00:36:38.760 --> 00:36:40.079
<v Speaker 1>The people's exhibit of clean.

661
00:36:40.280 --> 00:36:43.920
<v Speaker 2>I mean, a lot of people have or get STDs, right,

662
00:36:44.039 --> 00:36:48.119
<v Speaker 2>I mean, it's not like it happens. It's uncommon. It's like,

663
00:36:48.159 --> 00:36:53.199
<v Speaker 2>what one in every four people get something or has

664
00:36:53.360 --> 00:36:54.280
<v Speaker 2>something right.

665
00:36:54.239 --> 00:36:57.880
<v Speaker 1>Oh my god, do I have something? Satistically, So if

666
00:36:57.880 --> 00:36:59.840
<v Speaker 1>there's two more people in this room with us one,

667
00:37:00.760 --> 00:37:02.840
<v Speaker 1>you're probably ate up I'm not up.

668
00:37:02.880 --> 00:37:04.639
<v Speaker 2>Well, you do have a big old' herpie on your

669
00:37:04.639 --> 00:37:05.360
<v Speaker 2>lips sometimes?

670
00:37:05.360 --> 00:37:06.880
<v Speaker 1>Well no, but I've had that since I was a kid.

671
00:37:06.960 --> 00:37:09.320
<v Speaker 1>So you're saying I was a little kid whore. I mean,

672
00:37:09.320 --> 00:37:11.800
<v Speaker 1>what are you talking about? A little kid slut.

673
00:37:12.079 --> 00:37:14.079
<v Speaker 2>I'm not sure what you're weird.

674
00:37:14.599 --> 00:37:18.639
<v Speaker 1>That's your thought, that's your thought. We're describing where you

675
00:37:18.760 --> 00:37:21.519
<v Speaker 1>let us you're weird. No, anyway, you're trying to bring

676
00:37:21.559 --> 00:37:26.400
<v Speaker 1>out my fever blisters. Okay out here.

677
00:37:26.639 --> 00:37:28.360
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, eighty five or whatever.

678
00:37:28.559 --> 00:37:31.800
<v Speaker 1>My lawyers will be contacting your team and we'll see

679
00:37:31.800 --> 00:37:34.760
<v Speaker 1>where this actually goes in court whatever.

680
00:37:34.800 --> 00:37:36.760
<v Speaker 2>I have them to bro, I've had them since I

681
00:37:36.840 --> 00:37:39.039
<v Speaker 2>was a kid, and who knows where I know call

682
00:37:39.119 --> 00:37:42.679
<v Speaker 2>them from, because like both my parents have cold cold

683
00:37:42.719 --> 00:37:45.440
<v Speaker 2>stores or fever blisters or whatever you want to call them.

684
00:37:45.519 --> 00:37:47.440
<v Speaker 1>Right, I mean, now I have to say a lot of.

685
00:37:47.360 --> 00:37:49.480
<v Speaker 2>People have the mouth herps. It's fine.

686
00:37:49.639 --> 00:37:52.920
<v Speaker 1>It's a thousand wonders that I never did catch anything.

687
00:37:53.639 --> 00:37:57.119
<v Speaker 1>I can tell you that, So I mean maybe there

688
00:37:57.159 --> 00:37:57.880
<v Speaker 1>is a god.

689
00:37:58.400 --> 00:38:00.760
<v Speaker 2>Oh, so you are admitting that you were like a

690
00:38:00.800 --> 00:38:05.239
<v Speaker 2>big old, crusty chapter slut. Is that what you're telling me?

691
00:38:05.320 --> 00:38:06.920
<v Speaker 1>A crusty lip slut.

692
00:38:07.239 --> 00:38:09.440
<v Speaker 2>What is that crusty lip.

693
00:38:10.239 --> 00:38:11.920
<v Speaker 1>Car mix all over my body?

694
00:38:12.000 --> 00:38:17.880
<v Speaker 2>Now, Dyle, I'm confused because you say this and I

695
00:38:17.920 --> 00:38:20.559
<v Speaker 2>know you're joking, because deep down we both know that

696
00:38:20.559 --> 00:38:23.360
<v Speaker 2>that little guy, he needs a lot of encouragement to

697
00:38:23.599 --> 00:38:24.519
<v Speaker 2>like work.

698
00:38:24.679 --> 00:38:29.199
<v Speaker 1>He has to know you. Yes, Oh no, I will.

699
00:38:28.960 --> 00:38:32.239
<v Speaker 2>Say, your penis needs to have a deeply personal relationship

700
00:38:32.239 --> 00:38:35.159
<v Speaker 2>with someone before he decides to like pull out in

701
00:38:35.199 --> 00:38:40.639
<v Speaker 2>the direct and start like fancying hello exactly. Otherwise he's

702
00:38:40.639 --> 00:38:44.159
<v Speaker 2>just hiding before he's the WB frog. It's just hiding. Yes.

703
00:38:44.639 --> 00:38:47.920
<v Speaker 1>Now, I attempted at times in my life when I

704
00:38:47.960 --> 00:38:50.719
<v Speaker 1>was going to be single man and you know, tear

705
00:38:50.760 --> 00:38:53.519
<v Speaker 1>it up. I tempted one night stands.

706
00:38:53.639 --> 00:38:56.840
<v Speaker 2>I tempted things like you left a trail of disappointment.

707
00:38:56.920 --> 00:38:58.880
<v Speaker 1>I left a trail of awkward.

708
00:38:59.199 --> 00:39:01.840
<v Speaker 2>I've heard some of the stories from you, Dylan, sound

709
00:39:02.119 --> 00:39:03.440
<v Speaker 2>very disappoint.

710
00:39:03.760 --> 00:39:06.760
<v Speaker 1>The women because they're just trying to hook up. You

711
00:39:06.800 --> 00:39:08.719
<v Speaker 1>know how it is when you go out to a bar.

712
00:39:08.880 --> 00:39:11.880
<v Speaker 2>Just now, I don't because I'm not a big old whore.

713
00:39:12.000 --> 00:39:14.239
<v Speaker 1>You're a damn lie. You're a damn lie.

714
00:39:14.280 --> 00:39:16.599
<v Speaker 2>Oh now you're calling your what are you saying about

715
00:39:16.599 --> 00:39:17.119
<v Speaker 2>your wife?

716
00:39:17.239 --> 00:39:19.840
<v Speaker 1>Yeah? I know, well it's true.

717
00:39:20.039 --> 00:39:25.000
<v Speaker 2>What are you implying, Dylan, I'm a lady motherfucker who

718
00:39:25.000 --> 00:39:26.239
<v Speaker 2>I'm fighting words.

719
00:39:27.840 --> 00:39:30.159
<v Speaker 1>Anyway, let's get back to the story. Okay, I won't

720
00:39:30.199 --> 00:39:31.239
<v Speaker 1>get too deep into this.

721
00:39:32.559 --> 00:39:35.920
<v Speaker 2>Hey, I ain't never caught nothing either, but my.

722
00:39:35.320 --> 00:39:38.199
<v Speaker 1>My area is healthy, it's pristine.

723
00:39:38.320 --> 00:39:40.639
<v Speaker 2>So, like Kathy, I could bring in pictures of my

724
00:39:40.840 --> 00:39:44.960
<v Speaker 2>very healthy parts and be like, see, look, there ain't

725
00:39:45.000 --> 00:39:52.239
<v Speaker 2>no sores or nothing. There ain't no cankers or nothing.

726
00:39:52.039 --> 00:39:53.920
<v Speaker 1>On there no crotch cankers.

727
00:39:54.880 --> 00:40:02.920
<v Speaker 2>Now, okay, so we've got cat. Yes, we actually have. Kathy.

728
00:40:02.960 --> 00:40:04.480
<v Speaker 2>So her husband gave her an.

729
00:40:04.360 --> 00:40:06.159
<v Speaker 1>STD, which is unfortunate.

730
00:40:06.280 --> 00:40:08.679
<v Speaker 2>So again it's even more kind of silly that she's

731
00:40:09.119 --> 00:40:10.559
<v Speaker 2>dragging this thing out.

732
00:40:10.719 --> 00:40:12.519
<v Speaker 1>She knows what happened, she knows that she had to

733
00:40:12.519 --> 00:40:15.960
<v Speaker 1>get some palicillum. Like, bro, just let it go, Kathy, Yeah,

734
00:40:16.079 --> 00:40:18.440
<v Speaker 1>just take your shot. What the fuck, go down to

735
00:40:18.480 --> 00:40:19.400
<v Speaker 1>your local health bok.

736
00:40:19.440 --> 00:40:22.639
<v Speaker 2>Again, Larry, they're trying they're trying to force Larry to

737
00:40:22.679 --> 00:40:26.760
<v Speaker 2>take legal advice and legal representation, and Larry is like

738
00:40:26.800 --> 00:40:30.079
<v Speaker 2>pissed off about the whole situation, and then this lawyer thing.

739
00:40:30.119 --> 00:40:33.559
<v Speaker 2>It just makes him really mad and he actually screams

740
00:40:33.880 --> 00:40:37.719
<v Speaker 2>from the audience at the Supreme Court justices quote, you're

741
00:40:37.840 --> 00:40:43.519
<v Speaker 2>nothing but eight assholes and a token cunt. Damn because

742
00:40:43.559 --> 00:40:46.920
<v Speaker 2>Sandra Day O'Connor had recently been appointed to the highest court.

743
00:40:47.679 --> 00:40:51.000
<v Speaker 2>So Sandra was indeed the token kunt and you know,

744
00:40:51.079 --> 00:40:54.280
<v Speaker 2>the first woman appointed to the Supreme Court. Own it girl.

745
00:40:57.239 --> 00:41:01.920
<v Speaker 1>He screamed this from the crowd out open Supreme Court.

746
00:41:01.960 --> 00:41:06.199
<v Speaker 2>Oh yes he did. Wow. Larry was held in contemptive court.

747
00:41:06.440 --> 00:41:09.440
<v Speaker 2>They took him to the like back area because they

748
00:41:09.480 --> 00:41:11.760
<v Speaker 2>didn't have a holding cell or anything like that, so

749
00:41:11.800 --> 00:41:13.440
<v Speaker 2>they have to like take him to this little like

750
00:41:14.400 --> 00:41:17.920
<v Speaker 2>area to like, you know, hold him. He's in contempt.

751
00:41:18.800 --> 00:41:21.280
<v Speaker 2>Larry needed to go to the bathroom, but they did

752
00:41:21.280 --> 00:41:23.960
<v Speaker 2>not have a handicap stall available.

753
00:41:24.079 --> 00:41:24.639
<v Speaker 1>Oh wow.

754
00:41:25.440 --> 00:41:28.800
<v Speaker 2>They decided they would have to transport Larry to a

755
00:41:28.880 --> 00:41:33.239
<v Speaker 2>nearby hospital in order for him to use a handicap bathroom.

756
00:41:34.000 --> 00:41:36.199
<v Speaker 2>But then they ran into the problem that there was

757
00:41:36.239 --> 00:41:40.440
<v Speaker 2>not a vehicle available for transporting Larry and his wheelchair

758
00:41:40.519 --> 00:41:42.880
<v Speaker 2>to the hospital to use the bathroom. And I'm just

759
00:41:42.960 --> 00:41:45.679
<v Speaker 2>imagining in the meantime, Larry's over here, like you know,

760
00:41:45.760 --> 00:41:48.440
<v Speaker 2>I gotta take a whiz or he had Mexican and

761
00:41:48.480 --> 00:41:52.000
<v Speaker 2>he's just like, oh god, you know, he's doing Lama's breathing,

762
00:41:52.119 --> 00:41:53.760
<v Speaker 2>like trying to hold this in like I don't know,

763
00:41:53.840 --> 00:41:56.119
<v Speaker 2>I don't know what's going on, but it's but it's

764
00:41:56.159 --> 00:41:56.960
<v Speaker 2>like a whole thing.

765
00:41:57.719 --> 00:41:57.800
<v Speaker 3>Well.

766
00:41:57.840 --> 00:42:01.599
<v Speaker 1>It's also pointing out that even if at this point

767
00:42:01.679 --> 00:42:04.800
<v Speaker 1>I know that the what is it, the.

768
00:42:04.920 --> 00:42:08.559
<v Speaker 2>Uh hey, we need some American with Disabilities Act. Yeah,

769
00:42:08.760 --> 00:42:12.719
<v Speaker 2>you need to make this the Supreme Court handicap accessible, right.

770
00:42:12.599 --> 00:42:16.280
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, this is pointing out that everything you've been saying

771
00:42:16.320 --> 00:42:19.559
<v Speaker 1>about all this stuff is basically lip service because at

772
00:42:19.559 --> 00:42:23.840
<v Speaker 1>the highest parts of our government and our system, we

773
00:42:23.920 --> 00:42:28.840
<v Speaker 1>don't even have a damn handicap bathroom or wheelchair accessibility.

774
00:42:29.000 --> 00:42:32.960
<v Speaker 2>Somebody get this span of portable toilet. Okay. So Larry

775
00:42:33.480 --> 00:42:36.119
<v Speaker 2>is like, Okay, problem solved. We can take my limo

776
00:42:36.360 --> 00:42:39.400
<v Speaker 2>to the hospital, you know, otherwise I'm just gonna ship

777
00:42:39.440 --> 00:42:42.159
<v Speaker 2>my pants right here. And at that point it was

778
00:42:42.199 --> 00:42:45.719
<v Speaker 2>this whole production. So they agreed that Larry could take

779
00:42:45.760 --> 00:42:48.719
<v Speaker 2>his limo to the hospital in order to use the

780
00:42:48.760 --> 00:42:52.280
<v Speaker 2>handicap bathroom that's right now. While on his way back

781
00:42:52.320 --> 00:42:58.199
<v Speaker 2>from the hospital, Larry decided he needed a clothing change,

782
00:42:59.719 --> 00:43:03.000
<v Speaker 2>you know, Larry's a very fashionable guy, and though he's

783
00:43:03.039 --> 00:43:08.239
<v Speaker 2>wearing a suit to court, he decides to take off

784
00:43:08.280 --> 00:43:12.119
<v Speaker 2>his like dress shirt, his suit's dress shirt, and he

785
00:43:12.199 --> 00:43:16.360
<v Speaker 2>changes into a custom made T shirt that says fuck

786
00:43:16.400 --> 00:43:19.599
<v Speaker 2>this Court in huge black lettering. Wow, and I have

787
00:43:19.639 --> 00:43:23.000
<v Speaker 2>a photo. I will post it on Instagram. It's a

788
00:43:23.000 --> 00:43:26.320
<v Speaker 2>pretty great photo. Now, when he returns back to this

789
00:43:26.440 --> 00:43:30.000
<v Speaker 2>like holding area, the marshals tell him, like, you cannot

790
00:43:30.000 --> 00:43:33.239
<v Speaker 2>wear that into the courtroom. But Larry's like, fuck, yeah,

791
00:43:33.280 --> 00:43:35.199
<v Speaker 2>I can. Who's stopping me.

792
00:43:35.440 --> 00:43:36.599
<v Speaker 1>This free speech bud?

793
00:43:36.760 --> 00:43:39.480
<v Speaker 2>And they tell him no, and Larry said like, well,

794
00:43:39.519 --> 00:43:42.519
<v Speaker 2>I'm sorry, I don't have another shirt to change into.

795
00:43:42.760 --> 00:43:45.920
<v Speaker 2>Is this or nothing? It's this or I'm naked. And

796
00:43:45.960 --> 00:43:48.880
<v Speaker 2>they said fine, but you have to wear your jacket

797
00:43:48.920 --> 00:43:53.239
<v Speaker 2>over it, your sports coat. But when he's seated back

798
00:43:53.360 --> 00:43:57.239
<v Speaker 2>in the courtroom, Larry removes the jacket. So he's seated

799
00:43:57.280 --> 00:43:59.800
<v Speaker 2>in front of the Supreme Court wearing this T shirt

800
00:44:00.199 --> 00:44:04.000
<v Speaker 2>and it's just an indescribable scene. Right, it says fuck

801
00:44:04.079 --> 00:44:07.400
<v Speaker 2>this Court. But you know, Larry was exercising his First

802
00:44:07.440 --> 00:44:11.320
<v Speaker 2>Amendment right. And I also forgot to mention above the

803
00:44:11.440 --> 00:44:16.599
<v Speaker 2>lettering fuck this Court. There's also a drawing like a doodle,

804
00:44:16.679 --> 00:44:21.159
<v Speaker 2>if you will, of a penis oozing semen onto the lettering.

805
00:44:21.599 --> 00:44:27.800
<v Speaker 1>Oh my god, hey, like you can take this T

806
00:44:27.960 --> 00:44:31.119
<v Speaker 1>shirt that says fuck this court in the early this

807
00:44:31.199 --> 00:44:35.280
<v Speaker 1>is what early eighties. Yes, this early eighties America is

808
00:44:35.320 --> 00:44:39.480
<v Speaker 1>still rather conservative throughout the entire country, especially when it

809
00:44:39.519 --> 00:44:44.079
<v Speaker 1>comes to obscenity and things like that in public. And

810
00:44:44.159 --> 00:44:47.760
<v Speaker 1>the only way you could ever elevate a shirt like

811
00:44:47.800 --> 00:44:52.480
<v Speaker 1>that is said penis oozing its hot load out onto

812
00:44:52.519 --> 00:44:53.559
<v Speaker 1>the leather lettering.

813
00:44:53.719 --> 00:44:56.159
<v Speaker 2>Yes, I mean, Dylan, it's twenty twenty six, and we

814
00:44:56.280 --> 00:44:59.079
<v Speaker 2>still have people clutching their pearls when they hear us

815
00:44:59.079 --> 00:44:59.960
<v Speaker 2>say fuck on this part.

816
00:45:00.639 --> 00:45:01.159
<v Speaker 1>It's true.

817
00:45:01.360 --> 00:45:07.000
<v Speaker 2>So I can only imagine back then kind of hoop

818
00:45:07.079 --> 00:45:12.440
<v Speaker 2>law if you will, the hullabaloo this caused. Also, I

819
00:45:12.480 --> 00:45:14.519
<v Speaker 2>was thinking, maybe we need some merch that says fuck

820
00:45:14.559 --> 00:45:17.039
<v Speaker 2>this court, or I don't know, maybe a shirt that

821
00:45:17.039 --> 00:45:18.599
<v Speaker 2>says fuck this podcast.

822
00:45:19.280 --> 00:45:21.840
<v Speaker 1>Okay, yeah, yeah, I would wear that. I'd wear it.

823
00:45:22.760 --> 00:45:22.880
<v Speaker 5>Well.

824
00:45:22.960 --> 00:45:26.800
<v Speaker 2>Kathy Keaton ended up winning the lawsuit and was awarded

825
00:45:26.800 --> 00:45:32.280
<v Speaker 2>two million dollars. Really, yes, so the Larry story is

826
00:45:32.320 --> 00:45:33.639
<v Speaker 2>about to take another.

827
00:45:33.480 --> 00:45:36.280
<v Speaker 1>Ou See that's crazy, I know, because it sounds to

828
00:45:36.360 --> 00:45:40.960
<v Speaker 1>me like he pissed the justices off and they found

829
00:45:41.000 --> 00:45:45.280
<v Speaker 1>a you know, ruled against him outside of law and precedent.

830
00:45:45.480 --> 00:45:47.960
<v Speaker 2>Well, don't worry, Dylan, this is not the last time

831
00:45:48.719 --> 00:45:53.400
<v Speaker 2>that Larry will sit before the Supreme Court.

832
00:45:53.840 --> 00:45:55.920
<v Speaker 1>I mean it's almost like they were hell bent on

833
00:45:56.079 --> 00:46:00.559
<v Speaker 1>him taking an l in court, no matter what that was.

834
00:46:01.599 --> 00:46:04.639
<v Speaker 2>Okay, So Larry's story is about to take a turn,

835
00:46:04.800 --> 00:46:06.960
<v Speaker 2>and I have to say, Dylan, it is the most

836
00:46:07.480 --> 00:46:14.360
<v Speaker 2>nineteen eighties turn ever. Are you familiar with John Deloorian?

837
00:46:15.039 --> 00:46:17.440
<v Speaker 1>I am? Okay, the Filled Car Company.

838
00:46:17.599 --> 00:46:21.199
<v Speaker 2>Well, there you go. John Delorian, like Larry Flint, was

839
00:46:21.199 --> 00:46:24.280
<v Speaker 2>one of the most colorful and controversial figures, and not

840
00:46:24.360 --> 00:46:29.199
<v Speaker 2>just automotive history, but I would wager to say American history.

841
00:46:29.320 --> 00:46:32.840
<v Speaker 2>He's a pop culture icon. At least his car, the

842
00:46:32.840 --> 00:46:38.360
<v Speaker 2>DeLorean is. He was a celebrated engineer, like an engineering

843
00:46:38.400 --> 00:46:42.119
<v Speaker 2>executive at General Motors, and he created the futuristic DeLorean

844
00:46:42.199 --> 00:46:45.960
<v Speaker 2>sports car. His ambition was to build his own automobile

845
00:46:46.039 --> 00:46:49.800
<v Speaker 2>company with a sports car that was beyond anything Detroit

846
00:46:49.960 --> 00:46:52.320
<v Speaker 2>was producing at the time, with the.

847
00:46:52.239 --> 00:46:55.199
<v Speaker 1>Gold wing doors, the stainless steel body.

848
00:46:55.360 --> 00:46:57.039
<v Speaker 2>Why are you jumping ahead, ma'm oh?

849
00:46:57.079 --> 00:46:57.639
<v Speaker 1>I'm sorry.

850
00:46:58.280 --> 00:47:03.559
<v Speaker 2>The DMC twelve was a stainless still body, a wedge

851
00:47:03.559 --> 00:47:07.840
<v Speaker 2>shaped car with gold wing doors dn't and underneath the

852
00:47:07.880 --> 00:47:10.840
<v Speaker 2>hood was a two point eight to five liter PRVV

853
00:47:11.159 --> 00:47:16.719
<v Speaker 2>six which was developed by Puijo, Renault in Volvo, which

854
00:47:16.719 --> 00:47:18.119
<v Speaker 2>are all European car companies.

855
00:47:18.280 --> 00:47:20.159
<v Speaker 1>Oh wow, they all like joined.

856
00:47:19.800 --> 00:47:22.800
<v Speaker 2>Forces to create this, you know, this engine or whatever.

857
00:47:24.159 --> 00:47:27.880
<v Speaker 2>Production began in dun Murray, which is near Belfast, Ireland,

858
00:47:27.920 --> 00:47:30.920
<v Speaker 2>in nineteen eighty one, but unfortunately the timing was not

859
00:47:31.039 --> 00:47:33.760
<v Speaker 2>good and the car ended up costing about twenty five

860
00:47:33.800 --> 00:47:37.480
<v Speaker 2>thousand dollars, which in nineteen eighty one was considered expensive,

861
00:47:37.960 --> 00:47:42.960
<v Speaker 2>putting it into the luxury car territory. The early cars

862
00:47:42.960 --> 00:47:46.440
<v Speaker 2>had quality control problems and performance didn't quite live up

863
00:47:46.480 --> 00:47:48.840
<v Speaker 2>to the like exotic appearance of the car.

864
00:47:49.079 --> 00:47:52.480
<v Speaker 1>No, that's the thing. It looks fast, it looks sexy,

865
00:47:53.079 --> 00:47:58.679
<v Speaker 1>but it's actually a lumbering. It doesn't live up to expectations.

866
00:47:58.760 --> 00:48:00.559
<v Speaker 2>Well that's exactly what I just said, But thank you

867
00:48:00.599 --> 00:48:05.159
<v Speaker 2>for man spinning. I'm I'm going to compare it to

868
00:48:05.280 --> 00:48:07.679
<v Speaker 2>like the band Kiss. You see them and you're like,

869
00:48:07.760 --> 00:48:10.039
<v Speaker 2>fuck yeah, this is going to be hard as fuck.

870
00:48:10.119 --> 00:48:15.800
<v Speaker 1>YEA face off and then they're like, well, can look.

871
00:48:15.960 --> 00:48:19.239
<v Speaker 2>I love Kiss, and I'm not downing the boys right

872
00:48:19.760 --> 00:48:22.400
<v Speaker 2>because I love some ace freely. I want to be

873
00:48:22.440 --> 00:48:25.719
<v Speaker 2>in a New York groove. Kiss has its place, but

874
00:48:25.760 --> 00:48:28.960
<v Speaker 2>I mean, come on, they look way cooler than their

875
00:48:29.039 --> 00:48:29.920
<v Speaker 2>their music sounds.

876
00:48:30.199 --> 00:48:33.800
<v Speaker 1>Their music's way softer than they appear, and people back

877
00:48:33.840 --> 00:48:35.920
<v Speaker 1>in the day parents were just like, oh my god,

878
00:48:36.079 --> 00:48:39.800
<v Speaker 1>kiss that means not to shade and service, and you're like,

879
00:48:39.920 --> 00:48:42.880
<v Speaker 1>have you actually listened to the songs because it's pretty.

880
00:48:43.079 --> 00:48:45.320
<v Speaker 2>My dad and his brother shared her room, my dad

881
00:48:45.320 --> 00:48:49.199
<v Speaker 2>and my uncle, and up until my grandparents passed away,

882
00:48:49.679 --> 00:48:52.719
<v Speaker 2>there was a big like around. It was a circular

883
00:48:53.199 --> 00:48:56.280
<v Speaker 2>kiss sticker. Oh yeah, in the back of the bedroom

884
00:48:56.320 --> 00:48:57.079
<v Speaker 2>closet door.

885
00:48:57.239 --> 00:49:00.440
<v Speaker 1>I wish we had that now. It'd be awesome, asked.

886
00:49:00.239 --> 00:49:02.159
<v Speaker 2>My actual what she did with it when she inherited

887
00:49:02.159 --> 00:49:05.400
<v Speaker 2>the house. But yeah, anyway, I just remember my nana

888
00:49:05.760 --> 00:49:08.719
<v Speaker 2>because as a kid, I was like, kissed, you know, yeah, Nana, no,

889
00:49:09.000 --> 00:49:10.840
<v Speaker 2>and my nana being like, that stands for nats and

890
00:49:10.880 --> 00:49:12.119
<v Speaker 2>Satan's service, and I was.

891
00:49:12.079 --> 00:49:13.599
<v Speaker 1>Like, hm, no, it does.

892
00:49:13.599 --> 00:49:17.559
<v Speaker 2>Linda Gale, I don't think so, but all right, anyway,

893
00:49:18.519 --> 00:49:21.519
<v Speaker 2>Nanny was convinced it was Deevil's music.

894
00:49:21.719 --> 00:49:24.440
<v Speaker 1>Well between Jean's tongue and the face paint, and.

895
00:49:24.760 --> 00:49:26.480
<v Speaker 2>They wanted to rock and roll all night and party

896
00:49:26.519 --> 00:49:26.920
<v Speaker 2>every day.

897
00:49:27.039 --> 00:49:28.840
<v Speaker 1>And the big boots, I mean they in order to

898
00:49:28.880 --> 00:49:30.679
<v Speaker 1>think of it, they have big boots. I know you do.

899
00:49:30.880 --> 00:49:32.599
<v Speaker 2>I think I actually have a pair of kiss boots.

900
00:49:32.599 --> 00:49:34.119
<v Speaker 1>I'm sure you do have stars on them.

901
00:49:34.159 --> 00:49:40.440
<v Speaker 2>They're pretty stompy. Anyway, sales plummeted and the DeLorean company

902
00:49:40.679 --> 00:49:44.239
<v Speaker 2>burned through cash. It's a disaster.

903
00:49:44.559 --> 00:49:48.000
<v Speaker 1>Well yeah, I mean him going overseas with his production

904
00:49:48.159 --> 00:49:51.360
<v Speaker 1>to get outside of the big three in Detroit and

905
00:49:51.400 --> 00:49:55.039
<v Speaker 1>the markets here in America and their influences. Actually, all

906
00:49:55.039 --> 00:50:00.679
<v Speaker 1>he did was create an expensive luxury import that did

907
00:50:00.679 --> 00:50:04.960
<v Speaker 1>not live up to its specs and to all the hype.

908
00:50:05.039 --> 00:50:07.920
<v Speaker 2>And perhaps we have some younger listeners out there who

909
00:50:08.960 --> 00:50:12.639
<v Speaker 2>as we're describing the Dolorean, they still are like, what

910
00:50:12.679 --> 00:50:14.480
<v Speaker 2>the fuck are y'all talking about? It sounds like a

911
00:50:14.480 --> 00:50:17.360
<v Speaker 2>gross cyber truck or something with the goal wing doors

912
00:50:17.400 --> 00:50:19.599
<v Speaker 2>and stuff. It's the back to the future car.

913
00:50:19.800 --> 00:50:22.480
<v Speaker 1>Yes, if surely you've seen at least a poster for

914
00:50:22.559 --> 00:50:25.079
<v Speaker 1>Back to the future, you know the concept of back

915
00:50:25.119 --> 00:50:26.239
<v Speaker 1>to the future that's certainly.

916
00:50:26.440 --> 00:50:28.440
<v Speaker 2>Look and if you're a young person and you're you're

917
00:50:28.480 --> 00:50:30.880
<v Speaker 2>sitting there like heathern zul and I have not seen

918
00:50:30.920 --> 00:50:33.599
<v Speaker 2>back to the future. I'm very disappointed in you. And

919
00:50:33.639 --> 00:50:34.320
<v Speaker 2>you have homework.

920
00:50:34.440 --> 00:50:37.079
<v Speaker 1>You need to watch those watch all three of them.

921
00:50:37.079 --> 00:50:38.679
<v Speaker 1>Why not are you in there? McFly?

922
00:50:39.960 --> 00:50:45.719
<v Speaker 2>Okay, okay. So then the cocaine happens. By nineteen eighty two,

923
00:50:46.280 --> 00:50:50.599
<v Speaker 2>his company, Delorean's company, was hemorrhaging cash. Delorian became involved

924
00:50:50.599 --> 00:50:54.360
<v Speaker 2>with this guy named James Hoffman, who was secretly cooperating

925
00:50:54.400 --> 00:50:59.159
<v Speaker 2>with federal authorities during the FBI sting. Delorian was secretly

926
00:50:59.199 --> 00:51:03.480
<v Speaker 2>recorded to using a cocaine transaction supposedly worth tens of

927
00:51:03.559 --> 00:51:04.800
<v Speaker 2>millions of dollars.

928
00:51:04.880 --> 00:51:08.840
<v Speaker 1>He was desperate to get cash to keep his company afloat.

929
00:51:09.440 --> 00:51:12.519
<v Speaker 2>In October of nineteen eighty two, Delaurian was arrested in

930
00:51:12.519 --> 00:51:16.039
<v Speaker 2>a Los Angeles hotel room after agents produced a suitcase

931
00:51:16.039 --> 00:51:19.280
<v Speaker 2>full of cocaine. So now he's charged with conspiring to

932
00:51:19.320 --> 00:51:24.239
<v Speaker 2>distribute cocaine. And it was a sensational story. However, there

933
00:51:24.400 --> 00:51:27.559
<v Speaker 2>was a problem. And this is where Larry gets involved,

934
00:51:27.639 --> 00:51:31.079
<v Speaker 2>because you're probably like, what does John Dolurian, what could

935
00:51:31.079 --> 00:51:34.599
<v Speaker 2>that possibly, how could that relate to Larry Flints.

936
00:51:34.679 --> 00:51:36.639
<v Speaker 1>Now this part I do not know, So I'm very

937
00:51:36.679 --> 00:51:37.679
<v Speaker 1>interested to hear this.

938
00:51:37.719 --> 00:51:40.360
<v Speaker 2>Well, I'm about to educate you. Dylan. An anonymous sore

939
00:51:40.559 --> 00:51:46.000
<v Speaker 2>sent Larry the videotape that showed the sting operation. Oh wow,

940
00:51:46.039 --> 00:51:49.320
<v Speaker 2>so evidence, and it revealed what the FBI had done

941
00:51:49.599 --> 00:51:54.159
<v Speaker 2>was entrapment. The tape implicated the FBI agent was not

942
00:51:54.199 --> 00:51:58.679
<v Speaker 2>only responsible for supplying cocaine to DeLorean, but the undercovers

943
00:51:58.719 --> 00:52:02.320
<v Speaker 2>had like coerced de Laurian into selling it in the

944
00:52:02.360 --> 00:52:05.440
<v Speaker 2>first place. Yeah, or tried to encourage him to sell it.

945
00:52:05.639 --> 00:52:10.719
<v Speaker 1>This is the FBI handbook. How many times, how many situations,

946
00:52:10.719 --> 00:52:13.679
<v Speaker 1>how many huge stories in our history as a country

947
00:52:14.159 --> 00:52:15.599
<v Speaker 1>have they done this very thing?

948
00:52:15.719 --> 00:52:19.840
<v Speaker 2>Cough cough, Ruby Ridge cough cough. Okay, Well, they didn't

949
00:52:19.840 --> 00:52:22.760
<v Speaker 2>have any real proof that John Delaurian was selling cocaine,

950
00:52:23.280 --> 00:52:24.840
<v Speaker 2>and so the whole thing, I mean, it's just like

951
00:52:24.960 --> 00:52:28.800
<v Speaker 2>suspicious the FBI set him up. The tape in Larry's

952
00:52:28.840 --> 00:52:33.440
<v Speaker 2>possession ended up being broadcast on Sixty Minutes Why, which

953
00:52:33.440 --> 00:52:38.239
<v Speaker 2>at the time was like an enormously popular show book,

954
00:52:38.559 --> 00:52:42.719
<v Speaker 2>and like everybody watched sixty Minutes and this caused a

955
00:52:42.920 --> 00:52:46.760
<v Speaker 2>media uproar. People were like, what the hell is going

956
00:52:46.800 --> 00:52:48.559
<v Speaker 2>on with the government, the FBI.

957
00:52:49.199 --> 00:52:52.960
<v Speaker 1>Isn't it crazy to think back when these large news

958
00:52:53.000 --> 00:52:58.360
<v Speaker 1>shows and organizations newspapers actually did investigative journalism.

959
00:52:58.639 --> 00:53:01.440
<v Speaker 2>Oh, they weren't just like ainion and propaganda.

960
00:53:00.920 --> 00:53:03.519
<v Speaker 1>Machines and they would drop a dime, they would bust

961
00:53:03.559 --> 00:53:05.079
<v Speaker 1>these huge stories.

962
00:53:04.639 --> 00:53:05.960
<v Speaker 2>And objective journalism.

963
00:53:06.159 --> 00:53:11.440
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, because that's damn rip and that scare you

964
00:53:11.480 --> 00:53:17.079
<v Speaker 1>because that is so important for a truly healthy, functioning society.

965
00:53:17.239 --> 00:53:19.760
<v Speaker 2>I agree, Dylan. All I ever wanted to be from

966
00:53:19.760 --> 00:53:22.320
<v Speaker 2>the time I was a little, just a little sprout

967
00:53:22.920 --> 00:53:25.199
<v Speaker 2>with my little toe head run ground. I wanted to

968
00:53:25.199 --> 00:53:27.199
<v Speaker 2>be a reporter. I wanted to be a journalist, and

969
00:53:27.239 --> 00:53:31.320
<v Speaker 2>I would make little fake newspapers and interview my neighbors

970
00:53:31.360 --> 00:53:33.239
<v Speaker 2>and write articles and then try to sell my newspaper

971
00:53:33.239 --> 00:53:35.440
<v Speaker 2>to my parents for like a quarter. Yeah, it's all

972
00:53:35.480 --> 00:53:37.800
<v Speaker 2>I ever wanted to be. So yeah, I find it

973
00:53:37.840 --> 00:53:42.960
<v Speaker 2>deeply disappointing that we don't really have news anymore, that

974
00:53:43.039 --> 00:53:48.360
<v Speaker 2>it's all just pop propaganda and it's bullshit. It is,

975
00:53:48.440 --> 00:53:53.039
<v Speaker 2>but it's like biased and they don't present a true story,

976
00:53:53.400 --> 00:53:58.400
<v Speaker 2>and it's just ridiculous. What passes as news today.

977
00:53:58.480 --> 00:54:03.320
<v Speaker 1>It's entertainment, right, entertainment news. But the one bright spot

978
00:54:03.360 --> 00:54:05.000
<v Speaker 1>we'll get back to it. But the one bright spot

979
00:54:05.199 --> 00:54:11.400
<v Speaker 1>is with the this billing journals, the citizen journal journalist online,

980
00:54:12.119 --> 00:54:13.000
<v Speaker 1>and I mean.

981
00:54:13.199 --> 00:54:15.719
<v Speaker 2>Surely is probably like some kind of sip or whatever,

982
00:54:15.800 --> 00:54:17.639
<v Speaker 2>but he's probably a fed but like I mean, at

983
00:54:17.679 --> 00:54:19.559
<v Speaker 2>least he seems to be kind of doing a bit

984
00:54:19.599 --> 00:54:23.840
<v Speaker 2>of that. And of course you have podcasters and grounded

985
00:54:23.920 --> 00:54:26.760
<v Speaker 2>News is a really good They need to support our show,

986
00:54:26.800 --> 00:54:30.039
<v Speaker 2>but they kind of like, let you know, hey, this

987
00:54:30.119 --> 00:54:34.840
<v Speaker 2>is real, this is crap. Read this, don't read this right. Well,

988
00:54:34.840 --> 00:54:38.159
<v Speaker 2>there's another audio tape that Larry got his hands on,

989
00:54:38.599 --> 00:54:42.440
<v Speaker 2>but it wasn't very clear because it's like a cassette tape.

990
00:54:43.159 --> 00:54:46.840
<v Speaker 2>The technology back then, I mean, obviously cassette players. You're

991
00:54:46.880 --> 00:54:51.199
<v Speaker 2>recording a conversation, it's kind of shitty, staticky.

992
00:54:51.000 --> 00:54:53.599
<v Speaker 1>Well, especially if you try, if you make recordings of

993
00:54:53.639 --> 00:54:55.599
<v Speaker 1>the recording rush shit like that.

994
00:54:55.760 --> 00:54:58.480
<v Speaker 2>So there's this audio tape that Larry has and it's

995
00:54:58.519 --> 00:55:01.639
<v Speaker 2>just kind of floating around out there, but it also

996
00:55:01.880 --> 00:55:06.480
<v Speaker 2>is evidence in this Dolorean case. So the judge presiding

997
00:55:06.599 --> 00:55:10.079
<v Speaker 2>over the case ordered Larry to produce the tape, which

998
00:55:10.239 --> 00:55:15.519
<v Speaker 2>had mysteriously gone missing according to Larry, and that Larry

999
00:55:15.679 --> 00:55:19.159
<v Speaker 2>was to appear in court, but Larry refused to do so.

1000
00:55:19.679 --> 00:55:22.800
<v Speaker 2>Larry was arrested because he's like, I'm not coming to court.

1001
00:55:22.880 --> 00:55:25.440
<v Speaker 2>I'm not revealing my source and I'm not handing over

1002
00:55:25.480 --> 00:55:29.840
<v Speaker 2>the tape like I'm protected as a journalist or whatever.

1003
00:55:30.559 --> 00:55:35.280
<v Speaker 2>So Larry's arrested, but still he resists. Larry was like,

1004
00:55:35.480 --> 00:55:37.599
<v Speaker 2>you know, fuck you, You're not getting the tape. He

1005
00:55:37.679 --> 00:55:41.559
<v Speaker 2>refused to give up the source, like he's just doubling down.

1006
00:55:42.320 --> 00:55:44.559
<v Speaker 2>The more this judge is like, I'm gonna punish you,

1007
00:55:44.599 --> 00:55:48.719
<v Speaker 2>the more Larry's like, I'm ready smack me, big daddy,

1008
00:55:48.960 --> 00:55:53.280
<v Speaker 2>step on me. Yeah, okay. So journalist's ability to protect

1009
00:55:53.360 --> 00:55:58.159
<v Speaker 2>confidential sources is often known as like a journalist's privilege

1010
00:55:58.320 --> 00:56:01.159
<v Speaker 2>or a reporter's privilege. In the United States, it is

1011
00:56:01.199 --> 00:56:04.760
<v Speaker 2>not an absolute right, and the level of protection depends

1012
00:56:04.800 --> 00:56:07.920
<v Speaker 2>heavily on whether the case involves state or federal law.

1013
00:56:08.599 --> 00:56:14.400
<v Speaker 2>And since this is a federal case, obviously the judge

1014
00:56:14.480 --> 00:56:17.519
<v Speaker 2>is like, yeah, you don't have you don't have that,

1015
00:56:17.679 --> 00:56:21.719
<v Speaker 2>you don't have protections. Oh shit, right when Larry argued

1016
00:56:21.760 --> 00:56:25.079
<v Speaker 2>about his right to protect his source. The judge ordered

1017
00:56:25.159 --> 00:56:27.639
<v Speaker 2>him in contempt of court and find him ten thousand

1018
00:56:27.679 --> 00:56:30.360
<v Speaker 2>dollars a day for every day he did not produce

1019
00:56:30.400 --> 00:56:35.079
<v Speaker 2>the tape. Damn and now always true to himself, Larry

1020
00:56:35.119 --> 00:56:38.519
<v Speaker 2>pulls a number from the old playbook and he decides

1021
00:56:38.559 --> 00:56:41.559
<v Speaker 2>he's gonna pay his fines in one dollar bills. So

1022
00:56:41.639 --> 00:56:46.480
<v Speaker 2>what does he do. He brings in one dollar bills

1023
00:56:46.599 --> 00:56:49.960
<v Speaker 2>ten thousand one dollar bills and just dumps them out

1024
00:56:49.960 --> 00:56:52.239
<v Speaker 2>in the courtroom like out of a garbage bag, like

1025
00:56:52.320 --> 00:56:53.960
<v Speaker 2>here you go, fine.

1026
00:56:53.719 --> 00:56:55.079
<v Speaker 1>Paid, dude.

1027
00:56:55.079 --> 00:56:56.800
<v Speaker 2>He's such a like back in the day when he

1028
00:56:56.920 --> 00:56:58.360
<v Speaker 2>rolled the pennies into the bank.

1029
00:56:58.559 --> 00:57:03.199
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, something the pt Barnhum element of Larry the showman.

1030
00:57:03.480 --> 00:57:06.440
<v Speaker 1>Oh he's a showman, right, but it's really smart and

1031
00:57:06.599 --> 00:57:12.480
<v Speaker 1>and shrewd actually, because back then with the limited you know,

1032
00:57:13.440 --> 00:57:16.679
<v Speaker 1>news outlets and things like that, just making this big spectacle,

1033
00:57:16.960 --> 00:57:20.199
<v Speaker 1>it would be everywhere. It'd be in all the newspapers,

1034
00:57:20.559 --> 00:57:24.360
<v Speaker 1>all the major news shows, everyone would be talking about

1035
00:57:24.400 --> 00:57:25.159
<v Speaker 1>something like this.

1036
00:57:25.280 --> 00:57:28.599
<v Speaker 2>Well, the following day, Larry was scheduled to be photographed

1037
00:57:28.639 --> 00:57:33.280
<v Speaker 2>by famed photographer Annie Lebovitz and in these food in

1038
00:57:33.320 --> 00:57:38.119
<v Speaker 2>these photos, Larry is nude draped in an American flag.

1039
00:57:39.199 --> 00:57:42.039
<v Speaker 2>Because Libavitz is known for like, you know, pushing the envelope.

1040
00:57:42.480 --> 00:57:44.960
<v Speaker 2>These very uh, I guess you could say editorial, very

1041
00:57:45.000 --> 00:57:47.119
<v Speaker 2>stylized photos portraits.

1042
00:57:47.280 --> 00:57:48.000
<v Speaker 1>Okay, right.

1043
00:57:48.599 --> 00:57:50.639
<v Speaker 2>One of my favorites is of the portraits she did

1044
00:57:50.719 --> 00:57:53.199
<v Speaker 2>of Meryl Streep where she's just like wearing this white

1045
00:57:53.199 --> 00:57:58.159
<v Speaker 2>face makeup. It's really cool. Anyway, So Larry's due to

1046
00:57:58.280 --> 00:58:01.679
<v Speaker 2>reappear in court that same that he's got this photo

1047
00:58:01.760 --> 00:58:06.679
<v Speaker 2>shoot scheduled. So he decides, well, he's got a little

1048
00:58:06.719 --> 00:58:09.119
<v Speaker 2>something of his sleeve, right, so he decides he's gonna

1049
00:58:09.119 --> 00:58:12.159
<v Speaker 2>take this flag with him. Larry rolls the flag up

1050
00:58:12.840 --> 00:58:17.360
<v Speaker 2>and you know, rolls into court in his wheelchair and

1051
00:58:17.400 --> 00:58:21.440
<v Speaker 2>he's wearing the American flag fashioned as a diaper.

1052
00:58:22.960 --> 00:58:26.320
<v Speaker 1>Now, this is one of the scenes I remember from

1053
00:58:26.360 --> 00:58:26.800
<v Speaker 1>the movie.

1054
00:58:28.039 --> 00:58:29.719
<v Speaker 2>I was just gonna say, Dylan, if you've seen The

1055
00:58:29.760 --> 00:58:33.079
<v Speaker 2>People Versus Larry Flint, this is one of the like

1056
00:58:33.440 --> 00:58:38.920
<v Speaker 2>probably most widely known scenes from that movie. Is Woody

1057
00:58:38.960 --> 00:58:43.920
<v Speaker 2>Harrelson wearing the American flag as a diaper and Larry

1058
00:58:44.000 --> 00:58:44.800
<v Speaker 2>actually did that.

1059
00:58:46.079 --> 00:58:48.039
<v Speaker 1>I mean, the balls on this guy, Well, I should.

1060
00:58:47.800 --> 00:58:50.519
<v Speaker 2>Can imagine this was outrageous and people were not happy,

1061
00:58:50.559 --> 00:58:53.760
<v Speaker 2>including the judge. Larry ended up speaking with the judge

1062
00:58:53.800 --> 00:58:56.920
<v Speaker 2>without incident, but on his way out of the courtroom,

1063
00:58:57.079 --> 00:59:01.079
<v Speaker 2>Larry was arrested for desecrating the flag. During the arraignment

1064
00:59:01.159 --> 00:59:04.480
<v Speaker 2>for this flag charge, Larry had an outburst in court

1065
00:59:04.920 --> 00:59:07.519
<v Speaker 2>and this caused him to be sentenced to a fifteen

1066
00:59:07.599 --> 00:59:09.760
<v Speaker 2>months stay in a psychiatric facility.

1067
00:59:10.000 --> 00:59:11.679
<v Speaker 1>Damn, so he's.

1068
00:59:11.480 --> 00:59:13.599
<v Speaker 2>Been pushing his leg a little too.

1069
00:59:13.480 --> 00:59:17.039
<v Speaker 1>Much, Dyne, Maybe you could have done without the flag stunt.

1070
00:59:17.280 --> 00:59:20.800
<v Speaker 2>In nineteen eighty three, Larry underwent surgery which would alleviate

1071
00:59:20.840 --> 00:59:24.000
<v Speaker 2>the chronic pain he had had since being shot. And

1072
00:59:24.039 --> 00:59:25.440
<v Speaker 2>it is successful, you.

1073
00:59:25.400 --> 00:59:27.639
<v Speaker 1>Said ninety three, eighty three? Eighty three.

1074
00:59:27.719 --> 00:59:29.679
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I'm sorry, I thought I said eighty three. But

1075
00:59:29.920 --> 00:59:32.760
<v Speaker 2>in eighty three, so he undergoes with surgery and so finally,

1076
00:59:32.920 --> 00:59:35.920
<v Speaker 2>like for the first time in years, Larry is able

1077
00:59:35.960 --> 00:59:40.599
<v Speaker 2>to like function with you know, pain free, without all

1078
00:59:40.760 --> 00:59:44.280
<v Speaker 2>out the tripioids. Yes. Now, that same year, Larry decided

1079
00:59:44.320 --> 00:59:47.880
<v Speaker 2>to shock the masses with the ultimate publicity stunt to

1080
00:59:47.920 --> 00:59:52.159
<v Speaker 2>promote his new magazine. It's a news magazine called Rebel.

1081
00:59:52.880 --> 00:59:54.920
<v Speaker 2>Larry threw his hat in the ring to run for

1082
00:59:55.000 --> 00:59:58.599
<v Speaker 2>President of the United States. So in December's nineteen eighty

1083
00:59:58.599 --> 01:00:02.000
<v Speaker 2>three issue, Larry appeared wearing a Larry Flint for President

1084
01:00:02.079 --> 01:00:05.440
<v Speaker 2>campaign t shirt with a big caption that says, who

1085
01:00:05.480 --> 01:00:08.519
<v Speaker 2>will be our next president? Now? All the while he

1086
01:00:08.599 --> 01:00:12.320
<v Speaker 2>is still locked up at this psychiatric facility. While he's

1087
01:00:12.360 --> 01:00:17.159
<v Speaker 2>doing all of this, really, yes, he Now, in this

1088
01:00:17.480 --> 01:00:20.920
<v Speaker 2>December issue he calls out President Ronald Reagan and calls

1089
01:00:21.000 --> 01:00:27.599
<v Speaker 2>him quote a dumb, fascist, bigoted motherfucker. Well, Larry, I

1090
01:00:27.639 --> 01:00:30.679
<v Speaker 2>might hate to tell you, but just hold your horses,

1091
01:00:30.719 --> 01:00:33.159
<v Speaker 2>because a lot of people will will have more to

1092
01:00:33.199 --> 01:00:38.199
<v Speaker 2>say in a few, you know, decades about another president. Now,

1093
01:00:38.239 --> 01:00:41.639
<v Speaker 2>when Larry is finally released from the facility, which by

1094
01:00:41.679 --> 01:00:43.159
<v Speaker 2>the way, he does not have to spend the entire

1095
01:00:43.199 --> 01:00:46.840
<v Speaker 2>fifteen months in the facility, he is released early, Larry

1096
01:00:46.920 --> 01:00:49.480
<v Speaker 2>takes it upon himself to send every member of Congress,

1097
01:00:49.519 --> 01:00:54.880
<v Speaker 2>every Senator, and the Supreme Court justices subscriptions to Hustler Magazine.

1098
01:00:55.039 --> 01:00:59.239
<v Speaker 1>Nice, yeah, what, I bet more than one to him

1099
01:00:59.280 --> 01:01:00.480
<v Speaker 1>up on And by the way, I.

1100
01:01:00.519 --> 01:01:02.480
<v Speaker 2>Checked into it. And you can actually get yourself a

1101
01:01:02.559 --> 01:01:05.360
<v Speaker 2>year subscription to Hustler Magazine for like eight ninety nine.

1102
01:01:05.199 --> 01:01:08.400
<v Speaker 1>For the physical magazine. Pretty sure, Yeah, eight dollars ninety

1103
01:01:08.440 --> 01:01:08.960
<v Speaker 1>nine cents.

1104
01:01:08.960 --> 01:01:10.960
<v Speaker 2>I was thinking we should get we should get.

1105
01:01:10.840 --> 01:01:12.760
<v Speaker 1>A subscription due we should just keep a stack of

1106
01:01:12.800 --> 01:01:15.400
<v Speaker 1>hustlers on the coffee table when people come home. Yeah,

1107
01:01:16.719 --> 01:01:17.880
<v Speaker 1>people be like, what the fuck?

1108
01:01:17.960 --> 01:01:20.519
<v Speaker 2>Well, I was thinking we could also gift subscriptions WO

1109
01:01:20.800 --> 01:01:21.440
<v Speaker 2>to my dad.

1110
01:01:21.679 --> 01:01:22.639
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that'd be sweet.

1111
01:01:22.920 --> 01:01:25.079
<v Speaker 2>Maybe one to your mom. Your mom would probably think

1112
01:01:25.119 --> 01:01:25.599
<v Speaker 2>it was funny.

1113
01:01:25.719 --> 01:01:26.800
<v Speaker 1>She would now.

1114
01:01:26.840 --> 01:01:30.639
<v Speaker 2>By fall of nineteen eighty three, Althea is experiencing serious

1115
01:01:30.679 --> 01:01:35.159
<v Speaker 2>health problems. She was addicted to drugs, yes, but Larry

1116
01:01:35.159 --> 01:01:40.000
<v Speaker 2>felt like there's more to her declining health, right, so

1117
01:01:40.119 --> 01:01:43.480
<v Speaker 2>he urges her. You know, Althea, I don't think it's

1118
01:01:43.559 --> 01:01:45.760
<v Speaker 2>just the drug use, Like, you really need to go

1119
01:01:45.800 --> 01:01:49.760
<v Speaker 2>see a doctor. After a series of tests were performed,

1120
01:01:50.320 --> 01:01:55.159
<v Speaker 2>it was determined that Althea had contracted AIDS. Oh shit,

1121
01:01:55.480 --> 01:01:58.559
<v Speaker 2>AIDS in the nineteen eighties was a death sentence, and

1122
01:01:58.639 --> 01:02:01.039
<v Speaker 2>as we know, the AIDS at pandemic of the nineteen

1123
01:02:01.039 --> 01:02:05.119
<v Speaker 2>eighties was both a medical catastrophe and a profound social

1124
01:02:05.199 --> 01:02:08.840
<v Speaker 2>and political crisis. People were initially dying from a disease

1125
01:02:08.880 --> 01:02:13.440
<v Speaker 2>that doctors didn't yet understand, and many institutions were painfully

1126
01:02:13.519 --> 01:02:17.039
<v Speaker 2>slow to respond. Tens of thousands of Americans died from

1127
01:02:17.079 --> 01:02:20.679
<v Speaker 2>AIDS during the decade, and it was a global epidemic.

1128
01:02:21.360 --> 01:02:24.920
<v Speaker 1>You know, some people say that the main medicine they

1129
01:02:24.960 --> 01:02:27.639
<v Speaker 1>were prescribing back then were actually killing people.

1130
01:02:28.079 --> 01:02:29.079
<v Speaker 2>Does that surprise you?

1131
01:02:29.320 --> 01:02:33.159
<v Speaker 1>And guess who had a big hand in this epidemic?

1132
01:02:33.320 --> 01:02:35.559
<v Speaker 1>Faulci Fauci wasn't it?

1133
01:02:35.599 --> 01:02:36.280
<v Speaker 2>Was it Fauci?

1134
01:02:36.480 --> 01:02:39.119
<v Speaker 1>Like I thought, so I cannot.

1135
01:02:39.719 --> 01:02:40.719
<v Speaker 2>I'm pretty sure it was him.

1136
01:02:40.840 --> 01:02:45.119
<v Speaker 1>I plead the fifth. I want to reserve my right to.

1137
01:02:45.079 --> 01:02:50.960
<v Speaker 2>Sell your diary. Kim Kardashian, he's my friend. Yes, fucking

1138
01:02:50.960 --> 01:02:52.800
<v Speaker 2>piece of shit guy anyway.

1139
01:02:52.960 --> 01:02:55.960
<v Speaker 1>But yes, it was Fauci. But yeah, I mean at

1140
01:02:56.079 --> 01:02:58.079
<v Speaker 1>Dallas Buyers Club that.

1141
01:02:58.039 --> 01:03:02.559
<v Speaker 2>If you watch that movie is so o moving, visceral,

1142
01:03:03.119 --> 01:03:06.119
<v Speaker 2>very tragic. I mean, it's like a movie that really

1143
01:03:06.360 --> 01:03:07.360
<v Speaker 2>like left the mark on me.

1144
01:03:07.519 --> 01:03:10.519
<v Speaker 1>But it's true. People were trying to circumvent.

1145
01:03:10.199 --> 01:03:12.079
<v Speaker 2>The Ryan White story.

1146
01:03:12.199 --> 01:03:16.840
<v Speaker 1>Trying to circumvent the America's system to get these access

1147
01:03:16.880 --> 01:03:20.320
<v Speaker 1>to these other medicines that people who took them claimed

1148
01:03:20.360 --> 01:03:24.360
<v Speaker 1>had a lot more healthier impact on the disease.

1149
01:03:24.559 --> 01:03:28.760
<v Speaker 2>And that's what I guess today. I understand they're like

1150
01:03:28.880 --> 01:03:34.039
<v Speaker 2>medications and it's not a death sentence in twenty twenty six.

1151
01:03:34.719 --> 01:03:42.039
<v Speaker 2>But the fact that the HIV doesn't even come up anymore.

1152
01:03:42.880 --> 01:03:47.000
<v Speaker 2>Know that when you're talking about safe sex and you know,

1153
01:03:47.119 --> 01:03:50.440
<v Speaker 2>birth control options and protections, like, people don't even mention

1154
01:03:51.000 --> 01:03:54.840
<v Speaker 2>HIV venereal disease. And I know we've discussed this before,

1155
01:03:54.920 --> 01:03:58.719
<v Speaker 2>but just we grew up watching people die. I mean

1156
01:03:58.760 --> 01:04:02.039
<v Speaker 2>we you know, I knew people who died of AIDS

1157
01:04:02.159 --> 01:04:07.320
<v Speaker 2>when I was a kid. Right, It's just mind blowing

1158
01:04:07.400 --> 01:04:10.639
<v Speaker 2>to me that it's not part of the conversation. I mean,

1159
01:04:10.719 --> 01:04:14.320
<v Speaker 2>fifty percent of the population in Atlanta, Georgia has HIV.

1160
01:04:15.239 --> 01:04:17.559
<v Speaker 2>It's got like one of the highest rates of HIV

1161
01:04:17.639 --> 01:04:18.360
<v Speaker 2>in the country.

1162
01:04:18.559 --> 01:04:19.119
<v Speaker 1>That's crazy.

1163
01:04:19.280 --> 01:04:21.800
<v Speaker 2>Yet what's being done about it.

1164
01:04:21.920 --> 01:04:22.920
<v Speaker 1>Nobody even talks.

1165
01:04:23.000 --> 01:04:25.519
<v Speaker 2>Nobody even talks about it. It's like not a big deal.

1166
01:04:25.639 --> 01:04:28.519
<v Speaker 2>And I just don't I can't understand that they.

1167
01:04:28.400 --> 01:04:31.760
<v Speaker 1>Just show prep commercials if you're poor enough to have

1168
01:04:31.800 --> 01:04:36.920
<v Speaker 1>ads on your streaming service, which is true, which it's crazy, dude.

1169
01:04:37.000 --> 01:04:40.639
<v Speaker 1>So we've been trying to trim our streaming because everybody

1170
01:04:40.719 --> 01:04:44.800
<v Speaker 1>knows it's out of control, the pricing if you have

1171
01:04:44.920 --> 01:04:47.880
<v Speaker 1>multiple ones. I mean, now what's the difference than me

1172
01:04:47.960 --> 01:04:49.880
<v Speaker 1>having a cable bill. I mean, it's all that.

1173
01:04:50.000 --> 01:04:52.199
<v Speaker 2>Well not only that, but I just feel like they're

1174
01:04:52.239 --> 01:04:56.519
<v Speaker 2>not updating content, They're not fast enough, and like some

1175
01:04:56.599 --> 01:04:59.880
<v Speaker 2>of these services, especially the ones that seem to charge

1176
01:05:00.079 --> 01:05:03.800
<v Speaker 2>most money, Like I don't know, Netflix are the stalist.

1177
01:05:03.880 --> 01:05:05.360
<v Speaker 2>It's like the same shows that have been on there

1178
01:05:05.360 --> 01:05:07.440
<v Speaker 2>for ten years, the same movies that have been on

1179
01:05:07.480 --> 01:05:08.159
<v Speaker 2>there for ten years.

1180
01:05:08.360 --> 01:05:12.440
<v Speaker 1>It's true, like toob is fresher than fucking Netflix. Yeah,

1181
01:05:12.440 --> 01:05:15.360
<v Speaker 1>and it's free. But anyway, so we're ending up with

1182
01:05:15.400 --> 01:05:19.679
<v Speaker 1>the lower tiers the ads and some are more aggravating.

1183
01:05:19.960 --> 01:05:22.320
<v Speaker 2>I don't even care because it's like I'm so bored

1184
01:05:22.360 --> 01:05:25.079
<v Speaker 2>with like streaming anyway. Yeah, I know that I don't

1185
01:05:25.119 --> 01:05:29.719
<v Speaker 2>even care to watch the prep commercial over or or

1186
01:05:29.760 --> 01:05:32.000
<v Speaker 2>the psoriasis medication commercial.

1187
01:05:32.079 --> 01:05:35.480
<v Speaker 1>That's what's crazy. That's the only people paying for this

1188
01:05:36.079 --> 01:05:41.000
<v Speaker 1>advertisements are is the pharmaceutical industry. Yeah, and it's really

1189
01:05:41.039 --> 01:05:41.559
<v Speaker 1>weird to me.

1190
01:05:41.719 --> 01:05:43.400
<v Speaker 2>It reminds me I need to check my A one

1191
01:05:43.519 --> 01:05:48.719
<v Speaker 2>C right you too? Now, althea getting this diagnosis, you know,

1192
01:05:48.800 --> 01:05:52.960
<v Speaker 2>she felt hopeless and she just snds further into a

1193
01:05:53.039 --> 01:05:53.840
<v Speaker 2>drug spiral.

1194
01:05:55.480 --> 01:05:57.400
<v Speaker 1>Well, I could I could see that from her point

1195
01:05:57.400 --> 01:05:59.559
<v Speaker 1>of view, like, why does even matter? Now? I'm gonna die.

1196
01:06:00.119 --> 01:06:02.559
<v Speaker 2>November of nineteen eighty three, Hustler decided to run a

1197
01:06:02.559 --> 01:06:10.599
<v Speaker 2>satirical like parody advertisement mocking televangelist and conservative activist Jerry Folwell.

1198
01:06:10.880 --> 01:06:14.960
<v Speaker 1>Wow, they were always around the edge of all these

1199
01:06:14.960 --> 01:06:18.559
<v Speaker 1>big things happening in our society. Okay, I mean growing up,

1200
01:06:18.599 --> 01:06:21.920
<v Speaker 1>I remember all this stuff, right, well, yeah, Fallwell and

1201
01:06:22.280 --> 01:06:23.880
<v Speaker 1>the Bakers and all that stuff.

1202
01:06:23.920 --> 01:06:26.360
<v Speaker 2>That's one reason why I like, I mean, there's a

1203
01:06:26.400 --> 01:06:28.639
<v Speaker 2>lot of reasons why I thought we should cover Larry

1204
01:06:28.639 --> 01:06:32.280
<v Speaker 2>Flint's story. He's a hillbilly, he's from the mountains.

1205
01:06:32.320 --> 01:06:33.719
<v Speaker 1>There's an assassination a time.

1206
01:06:33.880 --> 01:06:36.760
<v Speaker 2>But there's just so much and I mean, honestly, you know,

1207
01:06:36.840 --> 01:06:38.320
<v Speaker 2>you can be like, oh, he's just a snut pellar,

1208
01:06:38.360 --> 01:06:40.480
<v Speaker 2>but he's so much more than that, and he really

1209
01:06:40.519 --> 01:06:46.480
<v Speaker 2>has led one of the most fascinating lives I think. Right, So,

1210
01:06:46.599 --> 01:06:50.639
<v Speaker 2>this ad was a parody of a real Campari campaign

1211
01:06:51.199 --> 01:06:55.239
<v Speaker 2>ad that featured celebrities like being interviewed about their first

1212
01:06:55.280 --> 01:06:56.880
<v Speaker 2>time drinking the beverage.

1213
01:06:57.119 --> 01:06:59.280
<v Speaker 1>From what I understand, okay.

1214
01:07:00.280 --> 01:07:04.239
<v Speaker 2>The ad featured a picture of a young Jerry Folwell

1215
01:07:04.360 --> 01:07:09.280
<v Speaker 2>discussing his first time, but it's incest with his mother.

1216
01:07:09.840 --> 01:07:10.639
<v Speaker 1>Oh my god.

1217
01:07:10.760 --> 01:07:14.559
<v Speaker 2>Jerry Fallwell was displeased with this joke. Not only did

1218
01:07:14.599 --> 01:07:18.760
<v Speaker 2>the ad insinuate that he was drinking campari in an outhouse,

1219
01:07:19.159 --> 01:07:21.440
<v Speaker 2>but that he also was having sex with his mother.

1220
01:07:21.679 --> 01:07:22.679
<v Speaker 1>What is campari?

1221
01:07:22.840 --> 01:07:28.480
<v Speaker 2>It's some sort of liquor spirit. It's a beverage, dylin. Okay,

1222
01:07:28.480 --> 01:07:31.840
<v Speaker 2>it's an alcoholic beverage. I have no idea because I

1223
01:07:31.840 --> 01:07:35.000
<v Speaker 2>don't drink it, and I don't even know anybody who.

1224
01:07:34.880 --> 01:07:36.519
<v Speaker 1>Drinks CAMPARKI I've never even heard of it.

1225
01:07:36.519 --> 01:07:39.039
<v Speaker 2>Think it's kind of a thing of the past, right,

1226
01:07:39.800 --> 01:07:41.480
<v Speaker 2>But I'm sure you can go to some hipster bar

1227
01:07:41.519 --> 01:07:44.199
<v Speaker 2>and they'll try to give you some like campari with

1228
01:07:44.239 --> 01:07:44.960
<v Speaker 2>like a side.

1229
01:07:44.760 --> 01:07:47.519
<v Speaker 1>Of activated charcoal and like a.

1230
01:07:47.400 --> 01:07:49.719
<v Speaker 2>Basil ice cube or something.

1231
01:07:50.840 --> 01:07:57.519
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, you have to blow through this stick into the

1232
01:07:57.639 --> 01:08:01.719
<v Speaker 5>drink to activate the little gold fishing side.

1233
01:08:01.920 --> 01:08:04.280
<v Speaker 1>What are you doing, man, The chemistry's not even done, dude.

1234
01:08:04.280 --> 01:08:06.719
<v Speaker 1>You gotta let that drink breathe for like forty five

1235
01:08:06.760 --> 01:08:07.960
<v Speaker 1>minutes before you drink it.

1236
01:08:08.039 --> 01:08:12.000
<v Speaker 2>Okay, moving along time, So, Jerry Folwell filed a forty

1237
01:08:12.000 --> 01:08:15.400
<v Speaker 2>five million dollar lawsuit against Larry Flint and Hustler magazine.

1238
01:08:16.079 --> 01:08:20.079
<v Speaker 2>Fallwell seued Larry for libel, using his image without consent

1239
01:08:20.199 --> 01:08:28.520
<v Speaker 2>and causing emotional distress. Now this is this is again.

1240
01:08:29.239 --> 01:08:32.359
<v Speaker 2>If something embarrasses you, why do you go to great

1241
01:08:32.399 --> 01:08:35.720
<v Speaker 2>links to let even more people know about this humiliating

1242
01:08:35.800 --> 01:08:40.319
<v Speaker 2>thing that embarrasses you? Because Jerry Folwell sent photocopies of

1243
01:08:40.319 --> 01:08:44.800
<v Speaker 2>the parody to one million of his quote prayer partners.

1244
01:08:45.079 --> 01:08:49.680
<v Speaker 1>Okay, okay, that makes sense. Yeah well, And honestly, someone

1245
01:08:49.760 --> 01:08:53.840
<v Speaker 1>like Fallwell, he was a fucking sleeze bag. I always thought,

1246
01:08:53.960 --> 01:08:57.079
<v Speaker 1>even as a young person, he seemed gross to me,

1247
01:08:57.119 --> 01:08:59.119
<v Speaker 1>and he certainly didn't seem to be a true man

1248
01:08:59.159 --> 01:09:04.920
<v Speaker 1>of God or anything like that. But it's probably a

1249
01:09:04.960 --> 01:09:08.520
<v Speaker 1>money grab for you know, a tempted money grab as well,

1250
01:09:08.560 --> 01:09:11.760
<v Speaker 1>because you sufered this forty five million back then is

1251
01:09:12.600 --> 01:09:15.880
<v Speaker 1>a crazy amount. It's a crazy amount now well backgain.

1252
01:09:17.000 --> 01:09:22.039
<v Speaker 2>It's like one of those lawsuits where you know, Fallwell

1253
01:09:22.199 --> 01:09:24.279
<v Speaker 2>like hoping he can bankrupt.

1254
01:09:23.840 --> 01:09:29.000
<v Speaker 1>Hustler bankrub them or for millions of dollars. Yeah, okay.

1255
01:09:29.640 --> 01:09:32.680
<v Speaker 2>Fallwell holds a fundraiser to pay for his legal fees

1256
01:09:32.800 --> 01:09:36.920
<v Speaker 2>and raises about seven hundred thousand dollars Jerry Fowell then

1257
01:09:37.000 --> 01:09:42.319
<v Speaker 2>hires Bob Guccioni's lawyer to represent him, and Larry is like, oh,

1258
01:09:42.359 --> 01:09:46.199
<v Speaker 2>so you're gonna hire the guy who defends a pornographer

1259
01:09:47.479 --> 01:09:52.880
<v Speaker 2>Fallwell to defend you against a fellow pornographer, even though

1260
01:09:53.039 --> 01:09:55.319
<v Speaker 2>pornography is so bad. But you're going to hire a

1261
01:09:55.359 --> 01:10:00.239
<v Speaker 2>lawyer that is basically Bob Guccion's like personal attorney, right right,

1262
01:10:00.640 --> 01:10:04.479
<v Speaker 2>So he's like, isn't this ironic or hypocritical or don't

1263
01:10:04.520 --> 01:10:08.680
<v Speaker 2>you think what? Yeah, maybe it's all the things. Now,

1264
01:10:08.760 --> 01:10:13.840
<v Speaker 2>Larry featured Fallwell and his lawyer, this guy named Grutman

1265
01:10:14.319 --> 01:10:18.119
<v Speaker 2>as asshole of the Month in Hustler magazine. This was

1266
01:10:18.159 --> 01:10:21.640
<v Speaker 2>a regular feature and it kind of picked on different folks,

1267
01:10:22.760 --> 01:10:26.399
<v Speaker 2>so he nominates them for Asshole of the Month. Larry

1268
01:10:26.439 --> 01:10:30.000
<v Speaker 2>pokes fun at Fallwell for taking little old ladies social

1269
01:10:30.000 --> 01:10:34.520
<v Speaker 2>Security money through his television ministry, which of course really

1270
01:10:34.560 --> 01:10:38.680
<v Speaker 2>pisses Fallwell off, Like, how dare you they want to

1271
01:10:38.720 --> 01:10:39.560
<v Speaker 2>send me that money?

1272
01:10:40.600 --> 01:10:43.359
<v Speaker 1>Like you send one thousand dollars now we can have

1273
01:10:43.399 --> 01:10:44.199
<v Speaker 1>a prayer circle.

1274
01:10:44.319 --> 01:10:47.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Well, he's just like, you know, here, you are predatory, dude,

1275
01:10:47.720 --> 01:10:50.079
<v Speaker 2>you know, asking like these little old ladies to send

1276
01:10:50.880 --> 01:10:54.680
<v Speaker 2>money to donate to your legal fund.

1277
01:10:54.640 --> 01:10:57.000
<v Speaker 1>For a suit that you initiate.

1278
01:10:57.119 --> 01:11:00.479
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, over a joke, right, I mean, whether you agree

1279
01:11:00.560 --> 01:11:02.079
<v Speaker 2>or disagree.

1280
01:11:01.680 --> 01:11:02.720
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's pretty Larry.

1281
01:11:02.760 --> 01:11:05.199
<v Speaker 2>He's just like what the fuck you know, Like you're ridiculous.

1282
01:11:06.560 --> 01:11:09.600
<v Speaker 2>Larry filed a countersuit claiming that Jerry Folwell had infringed

1283
01:11:09.640 --> 01:11:12.880
<v Speaker 2>on copyright law because Jerry Folwell had reproduced the parody

1284
01:11:12.960 --> 01:11:16.039
<v Speaker 2>ad as part of a fundraiser without permission from Hustler magazine.

1285
01:11:16.479 --> 01:11:19.720
<v Speaker 2>And it's a very clever move on Larry's part. And look,

1286
01:11:19.800 --> 01:11:21.800
<v Speaker 2>I'm not saying what Larry did was right. I mean

1287
01:11:21.880 --> 01:11:25.439
<v Speaker 2>it's honestly juvenile, and it is distasteful in my opinion, Like,

1288
01:11:25.479 --> 01:11:29.479
<v Speaker 2>regardless of how anybody feels about Jerry Folwell, Yes it's

1289
01:11:29.520 --> 01:11:33.560
<v Speaker 2>a joke, but I mean, come on, like incest with

1290
01:11:33.640 --> 01:11:37.279
<v Speaker 2>his mom, it's too much. It's like, okay, I mean,

1291
01:11:37.880 --> 01:11:40.279
<v Speaker 2>it's not even it's not even really that funny.

1292
01:11:40.359 --> 01:11:42.640
<v Speaker 1>It's not even that funny. It's not even making moan.

1293
01:11:42.760 --> 01:11:45.760
<v Speaker 2>I guess at the time, maybe we're looking at it

1294
01:11:45.760 --> 01:11:48.600
<v Speaker 2>through a twenty twenty six lens. Maybe at the time

1295
01:11:48.680 --> 01:11:51.760
<v Speaker 2>it was so salacious and people found it funny. I

1296
01:11:51.760 --> 01:11:52.079
<v Speaker 2>don't know.

1297
01:11:52.479 --> 01:11:55.039
<v Speaker 1>I think, you know, obviously shock value there, but it's

1298
01:11:55.039 --> 01:11:57.319
<v Speaker 1>not even that good of a parody of what Fallwell

1299
01:11:57.560 --> 01:12:00.239
<v Speaker 1>was and what he was doing or anything like that

1300
01:12:00.239 --> 01:12:03.279
<v Speaker 1>that clever. To be honest with you, it's really just

1301
01:12:03.840 --> 01:12:05.720
<v Speaker 1>shocking and right over the top.

1302
01:12:05.760 --> 01:12:08.760
<v Speaker 2>But I guess you know what it boils down to is,

1303
01:12:08.880 --> 01:12:10.960
<v Speaker 2>you know, does Larry have the right to do this?

1304
01:12:11.239 --> 01:12:15.279
<v Speaker 2>And is this protected under the First Amendment, which is

1305
01:12:15.479 --> 01:12:18.600
<v Speaker 2>you know, I mean, those are very very important questions,

1306
01:12:19.439 --> 01:12:24.279
<v Speaker 2>especially considering that our free speech is under attack and

1307
01:12:23.920 --> 01:12:25.800
<v Speaker 2>we may not have it in a couple of years.

1308
01:12:26.359 --> 01:12:28.640
<v Speaker 1>Oh I'm always gonna have mine.

1309
01:12:29.000 --> 01:12:30.319
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, me too.

1310
01:12:30.359 --> 01:12:31.760
<v Speaker 1>They can't never shut me up.

1311
01:12:32.960 --> 01:12:38.079
<v Speaker 2>They'll like, they'll cut your tongue out. Oh gosh, please

1312
01:12:38.159 --> 01:12:40.960
<v Speaker 2>don't now. The trial beginning December of nineteen eighty four,

1313
01:12:41.439 --> 01:12:45.760
<v Speaker 2>in a humiliating round of questioning, a lawyer asked Jerry Fallwell, quote,

1314
01:12:45.920 --> 01:12:49.199
<v Speaker 2>did you and your mother ever commit incest? Nice Fallwell

1315
01:12:49.239 --> 01:12:54.000
<v Speaker 2>categorically denies the accusation, saying absolutely not. At no point

1316
01:12:54.079 --> 01:12:56.600
<v Speaker 2>did I fuck my mom in an outhouse while drinking

1317
01:12:56.680 --> 01:13:01.079
<v Speaker 2>can party, nor outside of the out house exactly. I mean,

1318
01:13:01.720 --> 01:13:02.800
<v Speaker 2>that's again.

1319
01:13:02.680 --> 01:13:05.880
<v Speaker 1>That's great, that's on the record, bro I yuess.

1320
01:13:07.319 --> 01:13:11.640
<v Speaker 2>I mean it's almost like maybe he's a massacres, Like

1321
01:13:12.039 --> 01:13:14.880
<v Speaker 2>do you want to be humiliated further with this? Right?

1322
01:13:16.119 --> 01:13:19.600
<v Speaker 2>I mean, who wants to to sit in a courtroom

1323
01:13:19.600 --> 01:13:21.560
<v Speaker 2>in front of a judge and a jury talking about

1324
01:13:21.600 --> 01:13:23.079
<v Speaker 2>whether or not they fucked their mama?

1325
01:13:23.199 --> 01:13:27.720
<v Speaker 1>Now? Is this before Fallwhell's fall from in disgraceful fall

1326
01:13:27.840 --> 01:13:29.760
<v Speaker 1>from public life and all that.

1327
01:13:29.880 --> 01:13:31.880
<v Speaker 2>Well, he didn't really have a disgraceful fall.

1328
01:13:31.880 --> 01:13:34.239
<v Speaker 1>I thought he had like a mistress or something come

1329
01:13:34.239 --> 01:13:35.560
<v Speaker 1>out that was pretty greasy.

1330
01:13:36.640 --> 01:13:38.760
<v Speaker 2>Now, I think you're maybe confusing that with like Jimmy

1331
01:13:38.800 --> 01:13:43.399
<v Speaker 2>Swaggert or Jim Baker, or maybe Fallwell Junior. There was

1332
01:13:43.439 --> 01:13:45.920
<v Speaker 2>some story about Fallwell Junior and his wife and a

1333
01:13:45.960 --> 01:13:48.920
<v Speaker 2>pool boy that was just that in the last like

1334
01:13:49.000 --> 01:13:50.039
<v Speaker 2>ten years. I don't know.

1335
01:13:50.560 --> 01:13:54.560
<v Speaker 1>I thought Fallwell Feill No, not really.

1336
01:13:54.640 --> 01:13:57.880
<v Speaker 2>No, no, No, he went onto you know, Liberty University.

1337
01:13:58.159 --> 01:14:01.039
<v Speaker 2>I mean no, he was a he was a I

1338
01:14:01.039 --> 01:14:06.000
<v Speaker 2>guess a respected minister and all up until he wasn't.

1339
01:14:06.319 --> 01:14:09.119
<v Speaker 1>I may be thinking of because he was close friends

1340
01:14:09.159 --> 01:14:12.479
<v Speaker 1>with Baker when all that shit went down, one to

1341
01:14:12.520 --> 01:14:16.560
<v Speaker 1>Tammy Baker. Jim and Tammy Baker, Right, I think he

1342
01:14:16.680 --> 01:14:17.680
<v Speaker 1>was in that.

1343
01:14:17.680 --> 01:14:19.199
<v Speaker 2>I think you don't know what you're talking about, so

1344
01:14:19.239 --> 01:14:22.000
<v Speaker 2>you should probably just sit over there and look beautiful.

1345
01:14:22.039 --> 01:14:23.960
<v Speaker 1>Well, then sue me for slander. I don't know what

1346
01:14:24.000 --> 01:14:26.319
<v Speaker 1>to fuck to tell you. You can sue me for forty

1347
01:14:26.319 --> 01:14:27.520
<v Speaker 1>five meal if you won't.

1348
01:14:28.319 --> 01:14:29.079
<v Speaker 2>You're exhausting.

1349
01:14:29.119 --> 01:14:29.880
<v Speaker 1>I don't have it.

1350
01:14:30.119 --> 01:14:30.800
<v Speaker 2>You're exhausting.

1351
01:14:30.840 --> 01:14:32.399
<v Speaker 1>I don't have forty five dollars.

1352
01:14:32.720 --> 01:14:37.600
<v Speaker 2>You just stop, You're exhausting. So of course you know,

1353
01:14:37.720 --> 01:14:39.359
<v Speaker 2>he's like, this is all not true. I did not

1354
01:14:39.439 --> 01:14:41.720
<v Speaker 2>fuck my mom in an outhouse. I don't drink and

1355
01:14:41.800 --> 01:14:44.319
<v Speaker 2>PARI if I was gonna fuck her, wouldn't be the

1356
01:14:44.319 --> 01:14:47.600
<v Speaker 2>out house. And I'm just kidding, Senator Jesse Helms. I'm

1357
01:14:47.640 --> 01:14:52.880
<v Speaker 2>also an equally terrible person, testified on Folwell's behalf. And honestly,

1358
01:14:52.960 --> 01:14:55.199
<v Speaker 2>those of us who are from North Carolina might know

1359
01:14:55.279 --> 01:14:59.479
<v Speaker 2>the name Jesse Helms. And again, no, he's maybe not

1360
01:14:59.520 --> 01:14:59.960
<v Speaker 2>the best person.

1361
01:15:00.279 --> 01:15:02.479
<v Speaker 1>I thought he always thought he was a dirt bag.

1362
01:15:02.680 --> 01:15:04.960
<v Speaker 2>Well, he's a character witness for Jerry Fallwell.

1363
01:15:05.039 --> 01:15:07.199
<v Speaker 1>Well, that makes sense. That makes sense.

1364
01:15:08.359 --> 01:15:11.920
<v Speaker 2>Larry testified in his defense that the ad was a parody,

1365
01:15:12.119 --> 01:15:16.000
<v Speaker 2>as it stated at the bottom of the advertisement. Hustler

1366
01:15:16.000 --> 01:15:19.000
<v Speaker 2>had ran several parody ads in the past. Like one

1367
01:15:19.039 --> 01:15:24.359
<v Speaker 2>of those ads, for example, featured the Marlborough man like naked,

1368
01:15:24.720 --> 01:15:28.640
<v Speaker 2>lying in some hay next to his horse, smoking as

1369
01:15:28.680 --> 01:15:29.119
<v Speaker 2>if like.

1370
01:15:29.399 --> 01:15:31.760
<v Speaker 1>They had sex, he had fucked his horse, And did

1371
01:15:31.840 --> 01:15:34.960
<v Speaker 1>the Marlboro man have to go to court and say no, indeed,

1372
01:15:34.960 --> 01:15:36.319
<v Speaker 1>I did not fuck my horse.

1373
01:15:36.720 --> 01:15:38.560
<v Speaker 2>No, but the horse sued Larry.

1374
01:15:38.680 --> 01:15:39.039
<v Speaker 1>Ah.

1375
01:15:39.119 --> 01:15:42.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Larry's point was like, we do this to everybody,

1376
01:15:42.920 --> 01:15:43.960
<v Speaker 2>and you know, take.

1377
01:15:43.840 --> 01:15:45.560
<v Speaker 1>A joke, dude, public figure.

1378
01:15:46.000 --> 01:15:48.800
<v Speaker 2>The defense attorneys argued the parody was too ridiculous to

1379
01:15:48.840 --> 01:15:52.239
<v Speaker 2>be taken seriously and no one would genuinely, genuinely believe

1380
01:15:52.279 --> 01:15:55.000
<v Speaker 2>that Jerry Folwell had sex with his mother in an outhouse.

1381
01:15:55.600 --> 01:15:59.039
<v Speaker 2>Larry and Hustler were found not guilty of libel. He

1382
01:15:59.239 --> 01:16:02.119
<v Speaker 2>was found guilty of emotional distress, though in order to

1383
01:16:02.119 --> 01:16:05.760
<v Speaker 2>pay Fallwell two hundred thousand dollars, Larry appealed the emotional

1384
01:16:05.800 --> 01:16:10.720
<v Speaker 2>distress ruling to the Fourth Circuit Court. That appeal was denied,

1385
01:16:10.920 --> 01:16:13.720
<v Speaker 2>so Larry took it to the Supreme Court because of

1386
01:16:13.720 --> 01:16:17.960
<v Speaker 2>course he did, yes, because he's not told the court,

1387
01:16:18.079 --> 01:16:19.560
<v Speaker 2>you know, fuck this court.

1388
01:16:19.479 --> 01:16:21.640
<v Speaker 1>Enough, damn I bet the justices are like no.

1389
01:16:24.720 --> 01:16:27.279
<v Speaker 2>But then tragedy would strike Larry. In the summer of

1390
01:16:27.399 --> 01:16:30.279
<v Speaker 2>nineteen eighty seven. Althea and Larry had been in bed

1391
01:16:30.319 --> 01:16:34.439
<v Speaker 2>together watching television when she tells him she's going to

1392
01:16:34.479 --> 01:16:37.479
<v Speaker 2>go take a bath. Larry couldn't tell really how much

1393
01:16:37.479 --> 01:16:40.399
<v Speaker 2>time had passed, but suddenly kind of realized that the

1394
01:16:40.439 --> 01:16:44.079
<v Speaker 2>water was still running in the bathroom, so he starts

1395
01:16:44.079 --> 01:16:48.560
<v Speaker 2>to worry. When their nurse comes in to check on Larry,

1396
01:16:48.680 --> 01:16:51.239
<v Speaker 2>he asks her, like, will you go look in on Althea?

1397
01:16:51.960 --> 01:16:55.640
<v Speaker 2>And the nurse finds Althea submerged in water. She wasn't breathing.

1398
01:16:56.119 --> 01:17:00.079
<v Speaker 2>Paramedics were called, but they were unable to revive her.

1399
01:17:00.239 --> 01:17:06.319
<v Speaker 2>Althea had died of a heroin overdose. Basically, she overdosed,

1400
01:17:06.439 --> 01:17:12.840
<v Speaker 2>went unconscious and then like you know, drowned, slash overdosed underwater.

1401
01:17:13.720 --> 01:17:19.960
<v Speaker 2>She died, Yes, she passed. She was buried in the

1402
01:17:19.960 --> 01:17:24.600
<v Speaker 2>Flint family plot in Lakeville, Ohio. Larry was devastated. In

1403
01:17:24.680 --> 01:17:26.920
<v Speaker 2>his book, he wrote, quote, how could I go on?

1404
01:17:27.239 --> 01:17:30.239
<v Speaker 2>What was there to live for? He went on to say,

1405
01:17:30.279 --> 01:17:32.720
<v Speaker 2>you know, he owned one of the most lucrative publishing

1406
01:17:32.760 --> 01:17:35.840
<v Speaker 2>empires in the world and was wealthy beyond his dreams.

1407
01:17:36.359 --> 01:17:39.640
<v Speaker 2>The Supreme Court would soon be hearing his appeal, an

1408
01:17:39.680 --> 01:17:42.880
<v Speaker 2>important First Amendment case that could change history, and that

1409
01:17:42.920 --> 01:17:45.239
<v Speaker 2>he was just a poor heill billy kid from Kentucky

1410
01:17:45.720 --> 01:17:49.119
<v Speaker 2>and has succeeded, you know, in every way imaginable. But

1411
01:17:49.199 --> 01:17:52.640
<v Speaker 2>that losing Althea, Larry felt life as he knew it

1412
01:17:52.720 --> 01:17:55.439
<v Speaker 2>was over because he lost his wife, his best friend,

1413
01:17:55.479 --> 01:17:59.079
<v Speaker 2>and his business partner. Larry saw Althea as his soulmate

1414
01:17:59.399 --> 01:18:05.239
<v Speaker 2>and this loss for him was just incredibly crushing. Well,

1415
01:18:05.840 --> 01:18:09.880
<v Speaker 2>I think he never truly you know, like recovered emotionally

1416
01:18:09.920 --> 01:18:11.039
<v Speaker 2>from losing Althea.

1417
01:18:11.239 --> 01:18:13.399
<v Speaker 1>Well, yeah, it sounds like she was his one and

1418
01:18:13.439 --> 01:18:15.439
<v Speaker 1>if you lose your one, you're never going to be

1419
01:18:15.479 --> 01:18:15.880
<v Speaker 1>the same.

1420
01:18:16.199 --> 01:18:18.479
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. And so you know, as much as people, you

1421
01:18:18.520 --> 01:18:22.039
<v Speaker 2>know might think Larry's just a smart peddler and whatever,

1422
01:18:22.239 --> 01:18:24.760
<v Speaker 2>I mean, he did genuinely have love for this woman.

1423
01:18:24.920 --> 01:18:28.880
<v Speaker 2>And people may not have understood their relationship, but it

1424
01:18:28.920 --> 01:18:32.399
<v Speaker 2>worked for them and they truly were like in love

1425
01:18:32.439 --> 01:18:36.279
<v Speaker 2>with each other. They were deeply in love. So you know,

1426
01:18:36.439 --> 01:18:40.840
<v Speaker 2>it's just a really sad situation. Oral arguments began in

1427
01:18:40.840 --> 01:18:43.479
<v Speaker 2>front of the Supreme Court in December of nineteen eighty seven.

1428
01:18:44.000 --> 01:18:48.960
<v Speaker 2>Alan Is Isaacman, Larry's attorney, addressed the court regarding the

1429
01:18:49.000 --> 01:18:52.920
<v Speaker 2>First Amendment. He argued that if Jerry Folwell, a public figure,

1430
01:18:52.960 --> 01:18:56.680
<v Speaker 2>can sue for emotional distress, that you know, this opens

1431
01:18:56.760 --> 01:18:59.159
<v Speaker 2>up a door for anyone in the public eye to

1432
01:18:59.199 --> 01:19:02.680
<v Speaker 2>be able to sue for emotional distress agerous president at

1433
01:19:02.680 --> 01:19:05.920
<v Speaker 2>any time, like if something, you know, if someone says

1434
01:19:05.920 --> 01:19:09.279
<v Speaker 2>something they don't like, they can sue for emotional distress.

1435
01:19:09.760 --> 01:19:13.960
<v Speaker 2>And like, how do you really measure emotional distress?

1436
01:19:14.840 --> 01:19:18.039
<v Speaker 1>Right? Right, right? It's a dangerous president and it's something

1437
01:19:18.039 --> 01:19:19.399
<v Speaker 1>that can't even be policed.

1438
01:19:19.520 --> 01:19:19.640
<v Speaker 3>Well.

1439
01:19:19.720 --> 01:19:22.159
<v Speaker 2>Larry won the case in nineteen eighty eight, and it

1440
01:19:22.199 --> 01:19:26.439
<v Speaker 2>was a huge win. Finally, around the same time, it

1441
01:19:26.479 --> 01:19:29.920
<v Speaker 2>was revealed that serial killer Joseph Paul Franklin, who we

1442
01:19:30.000 --> 01:19:32.119
<v Speaker 2>covered years ago on the pod if you want to

1443
01:19:32.159 --> 01:19:35.039
<v Speaker 2>go back and find that episode we cover his case,

1444
01:19:35.520 --> 01:19:39.359
<v Speaker 2>he confessed to shooting Larry Flint. Franklin was executed by

1445
01:19:39.439 --> 01:19:43.399
<v Speaker 2>lethal injection in twenty thirteen. In two thousand and three,

1446
01:19:43.680 --> 01:19:46.920
<v Speaker 2>Larry ran for governor of California during the recall of

1447
01:19:47.000 --> 01:19:50.600
<v Speaker 2>Gray Davis, and at this time there were a ton

1448
01:19:50.800 --> 01:19:54.600
<v Speaker 2>of Dalists celebrities running for governor, like I remember this.

1449
01:19:55.359 --> 01:19:57.880
<v Speaker 2>It was just a big mockery. There was like Gary Coleman,

1450
01:19:58.960 --> 01:20:01.119
<v Speaker 2>porn star mayor Carey.

1451
01:20:02.640 --> 01:20:02.960
<v Speaker 1>Nice.

1452
01:20:03.079 --> 01:20:08.119
<v Speaker 2>There was something, you know, like seventeen people running for governor.

1453
01:20:08.840 --> 01:20:10.640
<v Speaker 2>Most of them were like it was either like these

1454
01:20:10.720 --> 01:20:15.479
<v Speaker 2>dealerss celebrities or like unknowns. But at the end Arnold

1455
01:20:15.479 --> 01:20:16.520
<v Speaker 2>Schwarzenegger won.

1456
01:20:17.319 --> 01:20:23.479
<v Speaker 1>Oh wow, Yeah, We're going to make California wacky times.

1457
01:20:23.920 --> 01:20:28.560
<v Speaker 2>Larry's slogan for this campaign was vote for the smut

1458
01:20:28.560 --> 01:20:29.760
<v Speaker 2>peddler who cares?

1459
01:20:30.159 --> 01:20:31.000
<v Speaker 1>I like it now.

1460
01:20:31.039 --> 01:20:34.760
<v Speaker 2>At this point, Larry is an aging, very wealthy businessman.

1461
01:20:35.239 --> 01:20:40.079
<v Speaker 2>He rolls around in a gold plated wheelchair. He increasingly

1462
01:20:40.600 --> 01:20:46.880
<v Speaker 2>treated American politics as another arena for publicity stunts, ideological fights,

1463
01:20:46.920 --> 01:20:51.560
<v Speaker 2>and attempts to embarrass powerful people, like in nineteen ninety eight,

1464
01:20:51.600 --> 01:20:55.960
<v Speaker 2>he offered money for like, you know, information and evidence

1465
01:20:56.000 --> 01:21:02.560
<v Speaker 2>about Bill Clinton's mini sexual exploits. He remained at the

1466
01:21:02.600 --> 01:21:06.199
<v Speaker 2>home of Larry Flint Publications and continued expanding the Hustler

1467
01:21:06.239 --> 01:21:12.439
<v Speaker 2>brand into retail stores, clubs, websites, videos, and television. He

1468
01:21:12.520 --> 01:21:18.119
<v Speaker 2>opened the Hustler Casino in Gardenia, California, Guardina, California. His

1469
01:21:18.239 --> 01:21:20.880
<v Speaker 2>fortune was later estimated to be more than one hundred

1470
01:21:20.880 --> 01:21:24.079
<v Speaker 2>million dollars, and in case she wondered how Larry fared

1471
01:21:24.119 --> 01:21:27.800
<v Speaker 2>in the election for governor, he received about seventeen thousand

1472
01:21:27.840 --> 01:21:29.479
<v Speaker 2>votes and came in seventh place.

1473
01:21:29.720 --> 01:21:32.840
<v Speaker 1>Nice, yeah, I would like.

1474
01:21:32.800 --> 01:21:36.439
<v Speaker 2>To meet the people who voted for Larry. Right. Larry

1475
01:21:36.479 --> 01:21:41.039
<v Speaker 2>Flint later directed his attention to Donald Trump. Before the

1476
01:21:41.079 --> 01:21:44.960
<v Speaker 2>twenty sixteen election, he offered one million dollars for recordings

1477
01:21:45.000 --> 01:21:49.319
<v Speaker 2>showing Trump engaging in illegal or sexually degrading behavior. The

1478
01:21:49.359 --> 01:21:53.399
<v Speaker 2>award went unclaimed. Then he dramatically increased the amount to

1479
01:21:53.439 --> 01:21:55.880
<v Speaker 2>ten million dollars for any information that would lead to

1480
01:21:55.920 --> 01:22:00.199
<v Speaker 2>Trump's impeachment. So, even in his late seventies, Flint had

1481
01:22:00.239 --> 01:22:05.600
<v Speaker 2>not lost his flare for shock value and going after politicians.

1482
01:22:06.399 --> 01:22:10.520
<v Speaker 2>In twenty nineteen, Larry Flint Publication sent some Republican members

1483
01:22:10.560 --> 01:22:15.000
<v Speaker 2>of Congress a Christmas card depicting President Trump lying dead

1484
01:22:15.000 --> 01:22:18.199
<v Speaker 2>in a pool of blood, accompanied by a joke referencing

1485
01:22:18.239 --> 01:22:20.560
<v Speaker 2>his famous line that he could shoot someone on Fifth

1486
01:22:20.560 --> 01:22:25.119
<v Speaker 2>Avenue without losing supporters. Flint was pleased with the outrage

1487
01:22:25.239 --> 01:22:30.920
<v Speaker 2>it generated. As usual, Flint was surprisingly serious about some

1488
01:22:31.119 --> 01:22:34.880
<v Speaker 2>political issues. He was a staunch opponent of the death penalty,

1489
01:22:34.920 --> 01:22:37.880
<v Speaker 2>He supported same sex marriage and opposed the two thousand

1490
01:22:37.880 --> 01:22:41.239
<v Speaker 2>and three invasion of Iraq. He described himself as a

1491
01:22:41.279 --> 01:22:46.000
<v Speaker 2>civil libertarian. Free speech was especially important to him. His

1492
01:22:46.119 --> 01:22:50.119
<v Speaker 2>proudest achievement was winning the case Hustler Magazine versus Jerry

1493
01:22:50.159 --> 01:22:54.159
<v Speaker 2>Folwell in front of the Supreme Court. And in old age,

1494
01:22:54.319 --> 01:22:58.039
<v Speaker 2>Larry still lived like Larry. He operated from an enormous

1495
01:22:58.079 --> 01:23:02.960
<v Speaker 2>Beverly Hills office us used an extraordinarily pricey gold wheelchair,

1496
01:23:03.479 --> 01:23:08.000
<v Speaker 2>which cost eighty five thousand dollars nice. By the twenty tens,

1497
01:23:08.119 --> 01:23:12.600
<v Speaker 2>Larry's health issues had left him incredibly frail. He experienced

1498
01:23:12.640 --> 01:23:16.279
<v Speaker 2>more personal tragedy in twenty fourteen, when his daughter Lisa

1499
01:23:16.399 --> 01:23:19.279
<v Speaker 2>Flint Fuget died in a car wreck at the age

1500
01:23:19.279 --> 01:23:23.560
<v Speaker 2>of forty seven. Flint nevertheless kept working and giving interviews

1501
01:23:23.560 --> 01:23:26.960
<v Speaker 2>well into his seventies. He died in February of twenty

1502
01:23:27.000 --> 01:23:29.600
<v Speaker 2>twenty one, at the age of seventy eight. The cause

1503
01:23:29.640 --> 01:23:33.600
<v Speaker 2>of death was heart failure. So my sources for this

1504
01:23:33.760 --> 01:23:38.960
<v Speaker 2>three part series mostly Larry's autobiography, which was co written

1505
01:23:39.000 --> 01:23:43.439
<v Speaker 2>by Kenneth Ross, called An Unseemly Man. There's also a

1506
01:23:43.439 --> 01:23:46.079
<v Speaker 2>book called One Nation Under Sex, and then of course,

1507
01:23:46.239 --> 01:23:53.439
<v Speaker 2>various interviews with Flint, Vanity Fair, other publications.

1508
01:23:53.600 --> 01:23:56.239
<v Speaker 1>Okay, wow, what a character.

1509
01:23:56.479 --> 01:24:03.199
<v Speaker 2>What a character. So that is the story of Larry Flint.

1510
01:24:03.840 --> 01:24:06.840
<v Speaker 1>Well, thank you. That was a very interesting story and

1511
01:24:06.880 --> 01:24:08.760
<v Speaker 1>a bit of a break from what we normally do.

1512
01:24:08.840 --> 01:24:12.600
<v Speaker 1>But you know, we have had some just horrific cases

1513
01:24:12.640 --> 01:24:14.159
<v Speaker 1>we've covered in recent months.

1514
01:24:14.239 --> 01:24:15.399
<v Speaker 2>You know, it's nice to have a little bit of

1515
01:24:15.439 --> 01:24:21.319
<v Speaker 2>a palate cleanser. Larry was obviously a controversial figure. There

1516
01:24:21.800 --> 01:24:26.439
<v Speaker 2>were crimes surrounding Larry. Not only was he the victim

1517
01:24:26.560 --> 01:24:29.600
<v Speaker 2>of a crime, crimes, but you know it was also

1518
01:24:31.119 --> 01:24:34.199
<v Speaker 2>charged with crimes, convicted of crimes.

1519
01:24:34.479 --> 01:24:37.119
<v Speaker 1>But I mean, he was a very big, big figure

1520
01:24:38.279 --> 01:24:43.479
<v Speaker 1>in some pretty major issues in our country for many years, right,

1521
01:24:43.680 --> 01:24:46.800
<v Speaker 1>And I have no doubt that he passionately. He felt

1522
01:24:46.920 --> 01:24:53.199
<v Speaker 1>very passionately about the thing things like free speech and

1523
01:24:53.239 --> 01:24:55.760
<v Speaker 1>basically your right to pursue the American dream.

1524
01:24:56.359 --> 01:24:58.279
<v Speaker 2>And fuck your mama now house if you want to.

1525
01:24:58.520 --> 01:25:02.720
<v Speaker 1>And while you drink campari, I betaris like what the

1526
01:25:02.720 --> 01:25:06.479
<v Speaker 1>fuck is catching strays? Bros?

1527
01:25:06.479 --> 01:25:07.760
<v Speaker 2>Like what the fuck do we did to Larry?

1528
01:25:08.479 --> 01:25:08.840
<v Speaker 1>Dude?

1529
01:25:09.000 --> 01:25:10.840
<v Speaker 2>The outhouse is like what do we do to you?

1530
01:25:11.119 --> 01:25:11.239
<v Speaker 5>All?

1531
01:25:11.319 --> 01:25:13.920
<v Speaker 4>I've been I've been taking people's ship all these years

1532
01:25:13.960 --> 01:25:16.319
<v Speaker 4>and some bet and you're gonna put me on blast street,

1533
01:25:17.680 --> 01:25:20.399
<v Speaker 4>all right till all right, So thank you for that, Heather,

1534
01:25:20.880 --> 01:25:23.359
<v Speaker 4>And then we will return with a more traditional case,

1535
01:25:23.399 --> 01:25:24.840
<v Speaker 4>I'm sure in the very near future.

1536
01:25:24.920 --> 01:25:28.159
<v Speaker 2>Oh, we had a case ready for next week. It

1537
01:25:28.279 --> 01:25:33.479
<v Speaker 2>is going to be, well, your your standard true crime case,

1538
01:25:33.680 --> 01:25:36.640
<v Speaker 2>and it's it's a sad one, but I think it's

1539
01:25:36.680 --> 01:25:38.760
<v Speaker 2>important to talk about. It's one of those cases I'm

1540
01:25:38.760 --> 01:25:42.680
<v Speaker 2>actually surprised doesn't have more coverage. Okay, it's a more

1541
01:25:42.720 --> 01:25:46.960
<v Speaker 2>recent case. So yeah, we got that in the works

1542
01:25:47.000 --> 01:25:51.439
<v Speaker 2>for you guys. Until then, we just dropped our midweek

1543
01:25:51.680 --> 01:25:55.479
<v Speaker 2>or sometimes week. Everybody's an expert. Go check that out.

1544
01:25:55.920 --> 01:25:59.119
<v Speaker 1>Yes, please do, and we'll have another edition of sometime

1545
01:25:59.159 --> 01:26:02.640
<v Speaker 1>this week, sometime this week, sometime this week. All right.

1546
01:26:02.720 --> 01:26:05.840
<v Speaker 1>So until next time, stay safe and we hope this

1547
01:26:05.880 --> 01:26:07.760
<v Speaker 1>podcast find you healthy and fed.

1548
01:26:08.039 --> 01:26:09.279
<v Speaker 2>No, no, we don't.

1549
01:26:09.279 --> 01:26:12.720
<v Speaker 1>Didn't you want people to be unhealthy and yell bitch?

1550
01:26:13.039 --> 01:26:14.159
<v Speaker 2>Yeah that's right.

1551
01:26:14.479 --> 01:26:15.640
<v Speaker 1>She wants you to be hungry.

1552
01:26:15.680 --> 01:26:18.000
<v Speaker 2>I'm the token khunt of this podcast.

1553
01:26:18.119 --> 01:26:18.520
<v Speaker 1>You are.

1554
01:26:18.600 --> 01:26:21.239
<v Speaker 2>I want people to run around saying, fuck this podcast.

1555
01:26:21.319 --> 01:26:23.359
<v Speaker 1>She wants you to just be starving? Why you listen.

1556
01:26:23.680 --> 01:26:25.359
<v Speaker 2>But I do want to take a moment to give

1557
01:26:25.359 --> 01:26:29.000
<v Speaker 2>a shout out to some of our awesome listeners out there, Carrie,

1558
01:26:30.159 --> 01:26:34.600
<v Speaker 2>h Courtney, folks who reached out and were like, look,

1559
01:26:34.680 --> 01:26:36.359
<v Speaker 2>we were starting to wonder.

1560
01:26:37.159 --> 01:26:38.439
<v Speaker 1>If you were coming back, if we.

1561
01:26:38.399 --> 01:26:41.439
<v Speaker 2>Needed to get a welfare check on you guys, So

1562
01:26:41.520 --> 01:26:44.279
<v Speaker 2>thank you for that. It's nice to know we're missed,

1563
01:26:46.760 --> 01:26:47.960
<v Speaker 2>and I have to appreciate that.

1564
01:26:48.039 --> 01:26:50.520
<v Speaker 1>I have to say also, in our little tiny Discord family,

1565
01:26:50.560 --> 01:26:52.880
<v Speaker 1>I got to say this right quick. They were having

1566
01:26:52.920 --> 01:26:59.159
<v Speaker 1>some very in depth discussions of Holly Alyssa Angie about

1567
01:26:59.199 --> 01:27:05.600
<v Speaker 1>the Clancy case and honestly making some really good points,

1568
01:27:05.760 --> 01:27:09.000
<v Speaker 1>okay about the case and some of the really you know,

1569
01:27:09.680 --> 01:27:12.760
<v Speaker 1>the details of that case. And I think maybe there's

1570
01:27:12.800 --> 01:27:15.279
<v Speaker 1>a little more to it than our point of view

1571
01:27:15.319 --> 01:27:19.000
<v Speaker 1>represented on our sometime this week. And I do find

1572
01:27:19.000 --> 01:27:21.079
<v Speaker 1>that interesting and I appreciate.

1573
01:27:20.560 --> 01:27:25.039
<v Speaker 2>Them, well, I appreciate different points of view, And I mean,

1574
01:27:25.079 --> 01:27:28.439
<v Speaker 2>I'm not discounting what other people's thoughts are subject.

1575
01:27:28.479 --> 01:27:29.920
<v Speaker 1>I'm not saying you were, and no.

1576
01:27:29.960 --> 01:27:32.760
<v Speaker 2>I'm just saying, like you know, I do appreciate and

1577
01:27:32.880 --> 01:27:37.159
<v Speaker 2>always welcome, you know, opinions and different thoughts and feelings

1578
01:27:37.199 --> 01:27:39.479
<v Speaker 2>about the case. It is definitely a hot button issue.

1579
01:27:41.319 --> 01:27:45.319
<v Speaker 2>It is. It's definitely something people are debating and discussing

1580
01:27:45.359 --> 01:27:48.720
<v Speaker 2>heavily on social media. So it'll be interesting to see

1581
01:27:48.760 --> 01:27:53.840
<v Speaker 2>what the outcome of this trial is. And I'm always

1582
01:27:54.279 --> 01:27:58.079
<v Speaker 2>down to just, you know, hear different points of view

1583
01:27:58.520 --> 01:28:00.880
<v Speaker 2>and how people come to that conclusion.

1584
01:28:01.039 --> 01:28:04.039
<v Speaker 1>Speaking of our Discord family, if you're a patron and

1585
01:28:04.199 --> 01:28:06.159
<v Speaker 1>I want a link to get in our little our,

1586
01:28:06.479 --> 01:28:09.960
<v Speaker 1>our our it's a little family. Sometimes we talk, sometimes

1587
01:28:10.039 --> 01:28:10.399
<v Speaker 1>we don't.

1588
01:28:10.439 --> 01:28:12.680
<v Speaker 2>Someone's gonna have to send me a link because I

1589
01:28:12.720 --> 01:28:15.199
<v Speaker 2>have managed to get myself like kicked out of the

1590
01:28:15.279 --> 01:28:17.439
<v Speaker 2>server and can't get back in. Oh god, I've been

1591
01:28:17.479 --> 01:28:18.600
<v Speaker 2>trying for a few days.

1592
01:28:18.920 --> 01:28:19.119
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

1593
01:28:19.479 --> 01:28:23.000
<v Speaker 2>See, I'm goofy and I'm like not very technically savvy.

1594
01:28:23.039 --> 01:28:24.359
<v Speaker 1>So I think I can send you a link.

1595
01:28:24.439 --> 01:28:26.920
<v Speaker 2>So I'm just like what and just keep clicking, like

1596
01:28:26.960 --> 01:28:27.960
<v Speaker 2>why does it work?

1597
01:28:28.359 --> 01:28:30.239
<v Speaker 1>I think I can send you a link anyway, Just

1598
01:28:30.279 --> 01:28:32.600
<v Speaker 1>hit us up at Mountain Mers Podcast at gmail dot

1599
01:28:32.640 --> 01:28:35.760
<v Speaker 1>com and we'll get you in the Like I said,

1600
01:28:36.199 --> 01:28:38.399
<v Speaker 1>we'll get you in our tiny Discord family. They rock

1601
01:28:38.720 --> 01:28:41.720
<v Speaker 1>all right. Until next time, Bye Dylan, Bye,