Speaker 2: Writer, Welcome back. How you doing.
Speaker 1: I'm doing great, Chris. Thanks for having me on again.
Speaker 2: It's been a minute, it has and it's wonderful to
Speaker 2: have you back. It has been a wild few years.
Speaker 2: You've been a busy dude. We both have two films released,
Speaker 2: one in the works, A Clockwork Shining with super Badass.
Speaker 2: My friend can't wait for the new one. Right now
Speaker 2: is an amazing time for filmmakers because we can do
Speaker 2: everything ourselves, including distribution. It's a shit ton of work,
Speaker 2: but it can be done. You and I are examples
Speaker 2: of that. And today we're going to talk about your
Speaker 2: new film and the works about psychic spies. We're all
Speaker 2: about this here. Before we get into it, though, remind
Speaker 2: the audience a little bit about yourself and let them
Speaker 2: know how they can find out more.
Speaker 1: I'm writer Lee. I am a director podcast host of
Speaker 1: Raised by a Giants. You can find me on YouTube
Speaker 1: and any and all podcast platforms and on the Forbidden
Speaker 1: Knowledge News Network. Yeah, the psychic spy stuff is really
Speaker 1: interesting to me. I got interested in it going through
Speaker 1: the MK Ultra programs. So I found out that the
Speaker 1: CIA was actually funding the Rockefeller Foundation for Behavioral Science,
Speaker 1: which is psychology, and a few of those studies were
Speaker 1: on gifted people. This was back in the fifties. They
Speaker 1: were funding work into Duke University, Harvard and things like that.
Speaker 1: And that's where things get really weird because mk Ultra
Speaker 1: also had subprojects studying gifted people, more specifically Subproject eighty
Speaker 1: three in Subproject one thirty six, which was dedicated to
Speaker 1: the research and development of ESP and psychic abilities. There's
Speaker 1: actually a document on the CIA's website called Hypnosis and
Speaker 1: Control Behavior that says, if there's a situation where hypnosis
Speaker 1: can be applied on a target individuals or groups, this
Speaker 1: is from the CIA. Okay, you can guarantee that it
Speaker 1: will be used. The CIA also fundering SRI International for
Speaker 1: developmental research into ESP and psychic abilities called remote viewing.
Speaker 1: The CIA chief at that time, Stansfield Turner, said that
Speaker 1: the agency found a man who could see what was
Speaker 1: going on anywhere in the world through his psychic powers.
Speaker 1: Turner said the CIA scientists and officials would show the
Speaker 1: man a picture of any place and he would then
Speaker 1: describe the activity that was going on there. At that time,
Speaker 1: seems pretty important thing to have, especially for the CIA
Speaker 1: at that time. During the Cold War.
Speaker 2: I said, these were going on are in the same
Speaker 2: time as the mk ultra experiments are relatively the same time.
Speaker 1: Well arguably mk Ultra could have been started in the
Speaker 1: fifties or in the sixties. It ran for about twenty
Speaker 1: five to thirty years, officially, stopping in officially in nineteen
Speaker 1: seventy five. So the studies go, I mean, we have
Speaker 1: psychic people going back decades and decades and even centuries.
Speaker 1: You know, they were called shamans. There were you know,
Speaker 1: only supposed to be imbued upon the enlightened people. But
Speaker 1: it's essentially all the same thing. There's different labels to
Speaker 1: all of this stuff. And remote viewing kind of was
Speaker 1: an SRI coined term. Came from the Chinese study into
Speaker 1: remote viewing and psychic abilities and children. So when Stansfield
Speaker 1: Turner said that they had found this man like you
Speaker 1: see what was going on anywhere in the world. That
Speaker 1: man's name was Pat Price. But the CIA cut ties
Speaker 1: with SRI in seventy five when Pat Price suspiciously died
Speaker 1: he was found in a hotel room in Vegas. Russell Targan,
Speaker 1: how put off, then went to the Foreign Technology division
Speaker 1: at RYE Patterson Air Force Base in Dayton, Ohio to
Speaker 1: try and get funding for SRI through the Air Force.
Speaker 1: Now dell Graf worked there and eventually became the operations
Speaker 1: manager for the DIA Stargate program at Fort Mead, Maryland.
Speaker 1: Later on and around the early nineties nineteen ninety to
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety one, but the Air Force picked up the
Speaker 1: funding to SRI. To continue this investigation into remote unit
Speaker 1: psychic abilities, an ESP dell Graph put together a small
Speaker 1: remote viewing unit at RYE. Patterson Air Force Base. They
Speaker 1: then received tasking to find a missing Russian airplane that
Speaker 1: downed somewhere in Africa. Rosemary Smith, which was part of
Speaker 1: the remote Viewing unit at right Patterson Air Force Base.
Speaker 1: This was like an unofficial small unit that dell Graph
Speaker 1: had put together. He gave give her a map, like
Speaker 1: a large area map, and said can you find this
Speaker 1: TU twenty two down Russian airplane? And then she put
Speaker 1: an X on the map where she had seen the
Speaker 1: visions and the psychic impressions of where she believed that
Speaker 1: it was. He then turned that into the CIA and
Speaker 1: they converted where she put that X on a map
Speaker 1: into a coordinate. They then went to where she said
Speaker 1: that she thought that it was, which was in Africa,
Speaker 1: and then they found the missing airplane exactly where she
Speaker 1: said that it was. President Jimmy Carter then talked about
Speaker 1: this mission in an interview in nineteen ninety five. It's
Speaker 1: very difficult to find that interview, but it's on my
Speaker 1: YouTube channel Raised by Giants, and it will also be
Speaker 1: in the upcoming documentary Psychic Agent. But the funding by
Speaker 1: the Air Force stopped to SRI in nineteen eight and
Speaker 1: then the Right Patterson Air Force Base unofficial unit was disbanded,
Speaker 1: but Army Intelligence was forming another remote viewing group at
Speaker 1: for ME called Grill Flame, which was to use psychic
Speaker 1: abilities with gifted people to collect intelligence data on foreign targets.
Speaker 1: But then you also have the Monroe Institute, which was
Speaker 1: founded by Robert Monroe in nineteen seventy four that created
Speaker 1: this technology called Hemi Sync to induce an out of
Speaker 1: body experience. This has connections to the DIA Stargate program
Speaker 1: because when Grill Flame first opened up, which it changed
Speaker 1: its name a lot of times, it changed it to
Speaker 1: Center Lane Sun Streak, and then it finally landed upon
Speaker 1: Stargate in ninety one. Army Intelligence sent their site gets
Speaker 1: to the Monroe Institute. They paid Robert Monroe two thousand
Speaker 1: dollars to see if Robert Monroe's tapes would help the
Speaker 1: remote viewers be more accurate. It's called perfect sight integration,
Speaker 1: where the viewer can duplicate their physical body and travel
Speaker 1: in their astra body to anywhere in the world and
Speaker 1: then collect information.
Speaker 2: Now, let me ask you, the hymn Sync was allowing
Speaker 2: the remote viewers to also leave their bodies, now, is
Speaker 2: what you're saying.
Speaker 1: Well, that's the thing is that that is the goal
Speaker 1: with the Hemi Sink tapes is to induce an out
Speaker 1: of body experience. But a lot of the remote viewers
Speaker 1: had already been having out of body experiences. Yes, specifically
Speaker 1: Angela Ford, she would have out of body experiences every time,
Speaker 1: all the time whenever she was young. Ingo Swan would
Speaker 1: also have out of body experiences due to trauma from
Speaker 1: being bullied whenever he was younger for being gay. So
Speaker 1: that's like a part of it. But INGOs One had
Speaker 1: developed this terminology to be able to get outside of
Speaker 1: your body. That was called perfect side integration, where you
Speaker 1: could literally go to another area of the world and
Speaker 1: your body is physically duplicated into an asterol body and
Speaker 1: then you can feel the invit. It's like it's like
Speaker 1: remote viewing on steroids is essentially what you can. You
Speaker 1: can then affect the environment, you can move things around,
Speaker 1: like it's almost like your physical body has is also there,
Speaker 1: but it's not quite your physical body. It's just like
Speaker 1: a duplicated version of your physical body. But this is
Speaker 1: also it really seems to me that trauma induces these
Speaker 1: types of abilities, and trauma also induces in out of
Speaker 1: body experience, like if you go through enough trauma, you're
Speaker 1: inevitably going to disassociate from your reality. And sometimes you
Speaker 1: know how people whenever they go through trauma, they're like, oh,
Speaker 1: I seen this from a far distance. It was like
Speaker 1: I was up in the corner of the room and
Speaker 1: I was looking down on myself. That's a forced out
Speaker 1: of body experience through trauma. And with the MK Ultra
Speaker 1: programs what they were doing, it seems as if the
Speaker 1: MK Ultra programs were inadvertently creating gifted individuals, which is
Speaker 1: that would be of course, the ones that survived that
Speaker 1: didn't go catatonic and you know, weren't able to get
Speaker 1: over the trauma or disassociate. They stayed within their physical body,
Speaker 1: like you know a lot of the people at Raven's
Speaker 1: Crag in Canada, which also the Rockefeller Foundation provided a
Speaker 1: grant to help found the Allen Memorial Institute aka Ravens
Speaker 1: Craig Hospital that supported doctor Hughan Cameron's MK Ultra experiments
Speaker 1: and upwards of one hundred and fifty thousand dollars a
Speaker 1: year for five years. And then there was also grants
Speaker 1: that happened after that as well.
Speaker 2: Super interesting man, tell us again, who are you? Who
Speaker 2: do you have in the film?
Speaker 1: All confirmed people within the DIA Army Intelligence Remote Viewing
Speaker 1: Unit at Fort Mead, so Angela Ford Dell graf Dell
Speaker 1: Graph was the operations manager, which I was just mentioning
Speaker 1: that had the small remove viewing unit at Ry Paterson
Speaker 1: Air Force Base Limb Buchanan, which the movie The Minister
Speaker 1: at Goes is kind of semi based off of. And
Speaker 1: then doctor David Moorehouse.
Speaker 2: Oh well, we won't give away too much.
Speaker 1: Then, well, with doctor Hughan Cameron, he's one of the
Speaker 1: ones that created the technology of psyche driving. He would
Speaker 1: all these sessions with patients and he would have a
Speaker 1: patient listen back to one of those tapes, and then
Speaker 1: he noticed that one of his patients had a visceral
Speaker 1: reaction to hearing a certain part of this tape. So
Speaker 1: he started making her listen to this tape over and
Speaker 1: over and over again, day in and day out for months,
Speaker 1: and it's pretty soon he was doing this with all
Speaker 1: of his patients. Now, the people that were experimented on it,
Speaker 1: Ravens Craig ended up getting together and sued the CIA
Speaker 1: and they settled out of court for around eight hundred
Speaker 1: thousand dollars. Now, the psyche driving thing is essentially a programming, right,
Speaker 1: so if you can, there's three steps to it, so
Speaker 1: it's called deep patterning. So he would essentially traumatize these
Speaker 1: people through torture and you know, just fill in the blanks.
Speaker 1: Then he would drug them. And this was an array
Speaker 1: of drugs. See, a lot of people believe that mk
Speaker 1: Ultra was just about LSD were just doing a little No.
Speaker 1: There was over one hundred and fifty different drugs that
Speaker 1: were tested on within the mk Ultra program, some of
Speaker 1: them including caffeine, amphetamine, antidepressants, antipsychotics, marijuana, like all of it.
Speaker 1: All of it was essentially tested on. And a lot
Speaker 1: of people don't know that Sidney Gottlieb, which was ahead
Speaker 1: of the mk Ultra programs, I'm pretty much the only
Speaker 1: person that's ever brought this up before. He had a
Speaker 1: brother named David Gottlieb, which was a plant biologist. So
Speaker 1: it stands to reason that Sidney Gottlieb was probably getting
Speaker 1: some of these compounds of these drugs from his brother,
Speaker 1: which was a plant biologist. I don't think that you
Speaker 1: would do all of these experiments with all these types
Speaker 1: of drugs and have a brother that's a plant biologist
Speaker 1: and not utilize what he would be concocting in some
Speaker 1: sort of CIA designer drug. So with the psychic driving things,
Speaker 1: so it's a deep patterning. They remove all of your
Speaker 1: normal thinking patterns, rational thought, cognitive beliefs, and then through
Speaker 1: traumatization and then they drug you with an array of
Speaker 1: drugs and then they psychically drive you. Now, the psychic
Speaker 1: driving can be anything. It could be anything could be
Speaker 1: on the looped audio message that he was giving. And
Speaker 1: then if you could take that a step further and
Speaker 1: put in a TV right, so you would not only
Speaker 1: be getting looped audio messages, but you would also be
Speaker 1: getting visual messages. Now, this isn't something that's official that
Speaker 1: they were actually doing, but I'm common sense says that
Speaker 1: it developed that it turned into something even more. That's
Speaker 1: just the official one. The looped audio message. Well, you
Speaker 1: could take that a step further and you could take
Speaker 1: it to virtual reality. Right, you can take a headset
Speaker 1: put over the person, have them feeding audio into their
Speaker 1: brain and also a visual stimulus to make them believe
Speaker 1: something that didn't even happen, or make them believe something
Speaker 1: about themselves that wasn't even real, or something that was
Speaker 1: real and make them believe that it wasn't real. It
Speaker 1: works both ways. And we know that the military has
Speaker 1: been using video games to training their soldiers for decades now.
Speaker 1: They'll use simulations, they'll use video games, They'll take a
Speaker 1: gun that is just as heavy as a real gun
Speaker 1: and have them shoot imaginary video game targets. They'll use
Speaker 1: data simulations to do explosions and tanks and all of that.
Speaker 1: They've been doing that for a really long time. So
Speaker 1: it only stands to reason that this is going to
Speaker 1: develop into something more and that would be the next
Speaker 1: step of the MK Ultra program would be to depattern
Speaker 1: them right through trauma, drug them, and then have this
Speaker 1: stimulus of something on a TV or even a stuff
Speaker 1: further would be virtual reality. And then when you look
Speaker 1: at our environment and how the world has shaped, over
Speaker 1: fifty percent of the people in the United States is
Speaker 1: in some form of pharmaceutical medication. We are constantly being
Speaker 1: traumatized through the media and these events that are happening
Speaker 1: around us all the time, and then we're being psychically
Speaker 1: driven through the TV, through social media, through programming to
Speaker 1: get the same talking points over and over and over again.
Speaker 1: I mean, there's this clip by George Bush that is
Speaker 1: like George Bush Junior, I was like, I'm going to
Speaker 1: repeat it. I'm going to repeat it a bunch of
Speaker 1: time because you got to repeat it several times for
Speaker 1: them to really drive home the narrative. They really catapult
Speaker 1: the propaganda, all right. So that's that's obviously a technique
Speaker 1: that has carried over from these MK ultra programs is
Speaker 1: just putting the same thing up on the screen over
Speaker 1: and over and over and over again, regardless if it's
Speaker 1: real or not. If you can make people believe that
Speaker 1: it's real, it doesn't matter if it actually is or not.
Speaker 1: As long as the perception is there that it is now.
Speaker 2: I wanted to ask you, I don't want to get
Speaker 2: too far away from the mk Ultra.
Speaker 1: But the mk Ultra programs were wild, dude. They were
Speaker 1: doing all kinds of wild They had so many wild
Speaker 1: thoughts and crazy ideas. There was one that was to
Speaker 1: during World War Two was to paint a bunch of
Speaker 1: foxes with radio active material and throw them off the
Speaker 1: ship of the coast of Japan, and that the Japanese
Speaker 1: would see this as like an omen or a sign
Speaker 1: from the gods, and that they would surrender like wild stuff.
Speaker 1: They were going to poison the president of Cuba at
Speaker 1: that time. What was his name, Yeah, Fidel Castro. They're
Speaker 1: going to poison Fidel Castro with put something in his
Speaker 1: cigars to poison him. They were going to put some
Speaker 1: things in his shoes that would make him lose his hair,
Speaker 1: like just stuff. But there was this book that was
Speaker 1: written in nineteen seventy eight by Walter H. Baward, which
Speaker 1: was called Operation Mind Control that really exposed was the
Speaker 1: entire alien and abduction phenomenon where the military would get
Speaker 1: these kids to dress up as gray aliens and the
Speaker 1: military would abduct their target. The Sudden and the kid
Speaker 1: would then act as aliens, and they would have the
Speaker 1: set all made up, and then they would use these
Speaker 1: drugs and this weapon that was called a stun gun,
Speaker 1: which would act as like a memory suppressor. So then
Speaker 1: later on when the sudden individual got that would it
Speaker 1: would make them like black out right, It would make
Speaker 1: them like kind of raise the thought in the memory
Speaker 1: from their head. And then you know, years later, or
Speaker 1: maybe a little bit of time later, they would be like, oh, man,
Speaker 1: I guess I'm missing time. Something really strange must have happened.
Speaker 1: Then these memories will start kind of coming back to
Speaker 1: them of this experience that they had with these aliens. Okay,
Speaker 1: but they were really just kids dressed up in gray
Speaker 1: alien outfits.
Speaker 2: I can only imagine where things like that have progressed
Speaker 2: to in our in our modern age. But that's a
Speaker 2: whole other show. So how long were they running these
Speaker 2: psychic spy programs.
Speaker 1: Well, if you count it from the time that they
Speaker 1: started funding SRI, the CIA funding SRI was from nineteen
Speaker 1: seventy two, but if you're not then it would be
Speaker 1: seventy eight, whenever the Army first started implementing the remote
Speaker 1: viewing stuff in to Army Intelligence for MEAD, which was
Speaker 1: grow Flame, but then they shut down that program and
Speaker 1: then they turned it into Sunstreak and Center Lane, and
Speaker 1: then it eventually set aed on Stargate. So officially, Army
Speaker 1: Intelligence had a program from seventy eight and then it
Speaker 1: got transferred to the DIA, and it became a DIA
Speaker 1: under the umbrella of the DoD Special Access Program in
Speaker 1: eighty five, and then it ran for ten more years
Speaker 1: under the DIA and the DoD to nineteen ninety five.
Speaker 2: Any thoughts on how they're integrating it other than what
Speaker 2: you said earlier. Obviously, with the drugs and social media
Speaker 2: and virtual reality, basically that we live in seem to
Speaker 2: have been experimentation to get us to a certain point
Speaker 2: and beyond. But any thoughts on where else these programs
Speaker 2: might have been integrated into.
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, every facet of our existence has essentially
Speaker 1: been turned into some sort of MK Ultra style program
Speaker 1: style syop. Right now when you talk about the the
Speaker 1: type of stranger thing aspect of this, because people are
Speaker 1: probably wondering, oh, well, this is interesting, this is cool,
Speaker 1: but where does the where does the experimentation on kids
Speaker 1: come in right. Well, we know that there were these
Speaker 1: programs set up as Team Beyond Behavioral Modification schools Okay
Speaker 1: in Utah, some in state New York, Okay, where kids
Speaker 1: would literally be abducted from their home where their parents
Speaker 1: would pay this company to come and abduct their kid,
Speaker 1: but handcuff them, blindfold them, throw them in the back
Speaker 1: of a suv sometimes on an airplane, a private airplane,
Speaker 1: and fly them wherever they wherever this facility was. Okay. So,
Speaker 1: some of those first ones started in Utah, and then
Speaker 1: it kind of spread out all over the United States
Speaker 1: and into Arizona, into New York and one of those
Speaker 1: is called Ivy Ridge in New York. So and a
Speaker 1: lot of the people that were involved in these Team
Speaker 1: Behavioral Health Modification schools described them as a form of
Speaker 1: mk ULTRA. Some of the exact same techniques that were
Speaker 1: used on them are the same types of techniques that
Speaker 1: you can read about in these mk ULTRA documents. One
Speaker 1: hundred and forty nine subprojects of mk ULTRA. Now, if
Speaker 1: you get into the Twilight Learner program, which was developed
Speaker 1: by a psychiatrist named Thomas H. Bodinsky, it was a
Speaker 1: neurofeedback program which was started in Colorado, which was dubbed
Speaker 1: Pink Noise to help produce relaxation facilitate learning. And this
Speaker 1: one is kind of a big one, which is the
Speaker 1: alter mental states. Kind of sounds similar to the Monroe Institute. Right,
Speaker 1: the Twilight Learner program is referred to as a sleep
Speaker 1: state suggestion experiments. Now, it's possible that the tapes that
Speaker 1: Thomas Badinsky used was some of the tapes that the
Speaker 1: Monroe Institute was also using. Still doing research into this,
Speaker 1: but I know somebody that was a part of the
Speaker 1: Twilight Learner program in Colorado that has some of these tapes.
Speaker 1: She can't play them yet because she doesn't have a
Speaker 1: cassette tape recorder. But I do know someone that has
Speaker 1: these tapes. So I'm trying to figure out a way
Speaker 1: to play these tapes to see if they are any
Speaker 1: way connected to the Monroe Institute eight Way tapes, because
Speaker 1: this is a very important connection. There's the school gate programs,
Speaker 1: which were gifted individuals public school programs, right, And there's
Speaker 1: also the Gateway program. So there's the and then there's
Speaker 1: a Stargate program. So all this stuff gets very convoluted
Speaker 1: and kind of all mixed together because it all has
Speaker 1: gate at the end of it.
Speaker 2: So, bro, have you seen Wayward Pines on Netflix? Yes,
Speaker 2: that the abducting of kids bringing them to this experimental school.
Speaker 2: That's exactly what that show is about.
Speaker 1: That's exactly what the show is about. And there's also
Speaker 1: another show called The Institute on MGM plus. It's a
Speaker 1: show that's based off of Stephen King's book The Institute,
Speaker 1: where kids are abducted out of their home taken to
Speaker 1: this facility because they have psychic abilities and psychic problems.
Speaker 1: Is Crazy, which is a really good show. I highly
Speaker 1: recommend it. And when I saw that, I was like,
Speaker 1: holy shit, this is basically my documentary in a nutshell.
Speaker 1: I mean, this is a you know, Hollywood version of
Speaker 1: what I believe it was happening on some levels. So
Speaker 1: you have the Twilight Learner Program, which Thomas A. Shbadinsky
Speaker 1: initially worked as an aerospace engineer in southern California, including
Speaker 1: working on a top secret classified projects at Area fifty
Speaker 1: one on the SR seventy one Blackbird, which is so interesting.
Speaker 1: It's a tidbit of information how a lot of these
Speaker 1: guys always seem to work for some sort of Aerospace company,
Speaker 1: and then switch into psychology an experimentation on the human mind.
Speaker 1: But you have the gate programs in school. Now this
Speaker 1: is how it's connected to the Monroe Institute Gateway tapes,
Speaker 1: because there's been this flurry of online activity around the
Speaker 1: Gate programs because people are thinking back to them and thinking, oh,
Speaker 1: that's that was kind of freaking weird. I was being
Speaker 1: pulled out of class. I was had these really strange
Speaker 1: I was asked to do these really strange things like
Speaker 1: mess with ropes, mess with blocks. There was a guy
Speaker 1: that was telling me to say what's on the flash
Speaker 1: card without having to see what's on the flash card.
Speaker 1: I had these really weird, strange hearing tests. They would
Speaker 1: do really weird, strange vision tests. And this would happen
Speaker 1: periodically through my upbringing in public school. And what's triggering
Speaker 1: a lot of these people is this clip of this
Speaker 1: hearing test that was done and a lot of people
Speaker 1: remember this was you should be hearing my voice in
Speaker 1: your right ear, And that's triggering a lot of people
Speaker 1: to bring back this memory of these hearing tests that
Speaker 1: was done in public school. Now it turns out that
Speaker 1: that tape is the Monroe Institute Gateway tapes. Whoa So,
Speaker 1: how did the Monroe Institute gateway tapes end up in
Speaker 1: public school? And why did they end up in public
Speaker 1: school and why were they using this as an experiment
Speaker 1: on children in the seventies, the late seventies, eighties, and nineties.
Speaker 2: It is super interesting.
Speaker 1: And they've also a lot of people have said that
Speaker 1: they were told to drink some type of sink.
Speaker 2: Drink, yeah, pink.
Speaker 1: Drink, yellow drinks, And depending on where they were and
Speaker 1: where they lived in what state that they were in,
Speaker 1: they were told it was for a different reason. Not
Speaker 1: everybody got the same reason as to why they needed
Speaker 1: to ingest this liquid. Some people was told it's for
Speaker 1: that it was vitamins. Other people were told that it
Speaker 1: was vaccines. Other people were told that it was asthma medication,
Speaker 1: you know. And then some of the programs too, depending
Speaker 1: on where you lived in the United States, depended on
Speaker 1: what the excuse was for why your kid needed to
Speaker 1: be a part of the program. Some of them were, Oh,
Speaker 1: he's a genius, he needs or they need or the
Speaker 1: girl or whoever it is, they're a genius. They need
Speaker 1: to be put inside of a special type of program.
Speaker 1: Before advanced learning kids. Other people, it was he's an
Speaker 1: unruly child, he has ADHD, he has all these problems.
Speaker 1: He can't sit still, he needs to be put in
Speaker 1: a special class. So if you were in California during
Speaker 1: this period of time, you would probably be told, oh, well,
Speaker 1: your kid needs special attention because he's a really he's
Speaker 1: very smart, he's scoring very high on a lot of
Speaker 1: these tests. We need to put him into a special class.
Speaker 1: He needs to be put into it. And the parents
Speaker 1: were like, okay, yes, do it, do it whatever. And
Speaker 1: then if you were in I don't know, Ohio or
Speaker 1: Pennsylvania or some place northern East coast, more likely that
Speaker 1: it would be your kid is unruly, your kid can't
Speaker 1: say still, he's got problems, he's being disruptive in class.
Speaker 1: He needs to be put into a special class to
Speaker 1: where with other kids that are like him. And the parents, yes, yes,
Speaker 1: put me in. So they're using different techniques and different
Speaker 1: reasons for why the kids need to be put into
Speaker 1: a gifted classroom, depending on what location you live in
Speaker 1: during that time. And these ran from They had to
Speaker 1: have started in the late seventies, yeah, in through the eighties,
Speaker 1: and probably ended in the late nineties, and a lot
Speaker 1: of people remember these programs. They remember them very vividly.
Speaker 1: Now there is a possibility that it didn't have anything
Speaker 1: to do with psychic abilities. There is a possibility that
Speaker 1: it had something to do with recruitment, right, that it
Speaker 1: had to do with putting people in positions of power.
Speaker 2: I'm sure it's multi layered. All of these operations seemed
Speaker 2: to have multiple purposes going on. At one time, they're
Speaker 2: trying to create assassins and at the same time looking
Speaker 2: at spying at people across the world. It's you know,
Speaker 2: they seem to have multiple purposes for their stuff.
Speaker 1: Well, a lot of people that I have talked to
Speaker 1: personally that of finished out these types of programs, like
Speaker 1: the school Gate programs, Yeah, or MGM Mentally Gifted Minds,
Speaker 1: that's what it was known at as in California. They
Speaker 1: all ended up in some form of military.
Speaker 2: Service really.
Speaker 1: Or in I've talked to some people that knew some
Speaker 1: family members that were a part of these programs that
Speaker 1: are had writers for the New York Post or yeah,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. Like it, it's really strange.
Speaker 2: It could be some kind of grooming program. It makes
Speaker 2: me wonder if what they're doing if they're still doing
Speaker 2: this now with the access of technology, and like you
Speaker 2: were saying earlier, the ability to get kids hooked on
Speaker 2: prescriptions and constantly be in a state where they are
Speaker 2: susceptible to hypnosis or some kind of you know, getting
Speaker 2: them to do something, but you know, through technology. Now
Speaker 2: instead of having to actually bring the kid to a
Speaker 2: specific class or kidnap them anymore, it may be just
Speaker 2: easier to access through this stuff.
Speaker 1: Yeah, easily accessed through technology and meet the people with
Speaker 1: the kids where they are online. Just like the most
Speaker 1: recent Rockefeller collaboration with famous influencer mister Beast, That's what
Speaker 1: they talked about is to help children, really we need
Speaker 1: to meet the kids where they are, and where they
Speaker 1: are is online. Yeah, So it's definitely a technology based
Speaker 1: way now. And I really don't think except in maybe
Speaker 1: a special scenario or a special case, that they would
Speaker 1: even need to use a psychic anymore. Because everything is
Speaker 1: tracked online. Everybody has a phone. You can know the
Speaker 1: location of where anybody is at any given moment. You know,
Speaker 1: track the IP address, you know exactly where they are.
Speaker 1: You know, there's pegas' software that could all you literally
Speaker 1: need to do is have the person's phone number and
Speaker 1: you could hack whatever. You can literally have a duplicate
Speaker 1: copy of their phone exactly what they're doing every single
Speaker 1: day on your computer. So the tracking and the data
Speaker 1: collection no longer needs to be done through a psychic individual.
Speaker 1: It's not just technology.
Speaker 2: I want to get your thoughts on some of the
Speaker 2: things that I've heard over the years that may be
Speaker 2: associated with these remote viewers or psychic spies. Many have
Speaker 2: said that when you are out of body, are your
Speaker 2: remote viewing, that there may be some sort of psychic
Speaker 2: block or someone else that is out in the astral
Speaker 2: waiting for people to stop them from accessing certain information
Speaker 2: certain areas. Do you think that's true.
Speaker 1: I mean, it could be true in a sense, but
Speaker 1: hiring people to do that seems kind of silly, you
Speaker 1: know what I mean, Yeah, let's hire these military astral
Speaker 1: travel people. It is because you can't really be doing
Speaker 1: this while you're out just like doing everyday normal life,
Speaker 1: Like you can't be outside of your body while you're
Speaker 1: washing the dishes, like you have to be in a
Speaker 1: certain meditative state and a certain deep consciousness level that
Speaker 1: allows you to get outside of your body and then
Speaker 1: to be able to even control that, to know how
Speaker 1: to control to get outside of your body is very
Speaker 1: difficult to do. I don't think that anybody can actually
Speaker 1: do it verbatim every single time that they try. It's
Speaker 1: normally something that just kind of happens. Now there's something,
Speaker 1: there are ways to try and induce it. You can
Speaker 1: try and do breath work really late at night when
Speaker 1: you're melatonin is the most highest in your brain, and
Speaker 1: you might be able to get outside of your body
Speaker 1: doing it that way. But it's not something that you
Speaker 1: can just lay down and expect to immediately get outside
Speaker 1: of your body. It's just not the way that it works.
Speaker 1: So I highly doubt it. It seems like that if
Speaker 1: people are saying that that's what's going on now, there
Speaker 1: are ways to block remov vieing through certain materials, I believe.
Speaker 1: I believe Uri Geller has talked about how the CIA
Speaker 1: has or some intelligence agency or the military has some
Speaker 1: sort of psychic energetic blocking room to where that because
Speaker 1: they were afraid that the Soviets were spying on them
Speaker 1: and in that they were getting their intelligence data leaks,
Speaker 1: so then they created this room where nothing could no
Speaker 1: psychic could possibly get into. That's just rumor. I don't
Speaker 1: know if that's true yeah or not, but I highly
Speaker 1: doubt that it would be it would really be possible.
Speaker 2: You mentioned guards, Yeah, yeah, well, you know, it's a
Speaker 2: it's a fun concept. You mentioned Uri Gala, Uri Geller,
Speaker 2: and Ingo Swan. In recent years, they have been part
Speaker 2: of the quote unquote UFO disclosure movement. You hear about
Speaker 2: remote viewing aliens on the moon and extra terrestrials. They
Speaker 2: seem to be supporting this UFO narrative. Of course, they
Speaker 2: were working with the CIA. So how much trust can
Speaker 2: you put into that? Right? Yeah?
Speaker 1: I don't necessarily believe a lot of the things that
Speaker 1: you're a yaller, says he but I do believe him
Speaker 1: on one thing, which I think is a really important thing.
Speaker 1: When he talked about to Russell targ on the documentary
Speaker 1: Third Eye Spies, and he said that in a roundabout way,
Speaker 1: that Pat Price didn't die, that they didn't that he
Speaker 1: wasn't murdered, and that his death was essentially fated, and
Speaker 1: then he was taken into this black budget underground program
Speaker 1: that the CIA was doing. Because it's just a coincidence
Speaker 1: that after Pat Price died even though sr I had
Speaker 1: other psychics such as Ingo Swan and Hella Hammond and
Speaker 1: a few others. Whenever Pat died, the CIA was almost
Speaker 1: immediate like, oh yeah, we don't care anymore, We're out
Speaker 1: of this cut. The funny Nessri, the only reason that
Speaker 1: you would do that is if you already had another program,
Speaker 1: or you had or that you had the individual, the
Speaker 1: best individual for the job already, because then you wouldn't
Speaker 1: need to fund them searching and looking in studies and
Speaker 1: all that. For another thing, if you already have the
Speaker 1: best guy that can already do it, Like the CIA
Speaker 1: said back whenever in the early seventies, that they have
Speaker 1: someone they can see anything anywhere. All they need to
Speaker 1: do is show him a picture of that thing. So
Speaker 1: if they already have him, there's no point in continuing
Speaker 1: funding for anybody else. So that's what I believe happened.
Speaker 1: Because there's so many really strained which is all going
Speaker 1: to be in the documentary as well. There's a lot
Speaker 1: of very strange things that surrounded Pat Price's death.
Speaker 2: M Now go ahead, Uh.
Speaker 1: No, I was just saying that there's very strange things,
Speaker 1: like he called his family members before the day before
Speaker 1: that he was found out in the hotel room and
Speaker 1: gave them very cryptic goodbyes. He took out a very
Speaker 1: large life in insurance policy right before he died the
Speaker 1: whenever he was the family wasn't informed of his death
Speaker 1: until he was already cremated.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: Interesting, they'd already cremated the man before they ever called
Speaker 1: his wife and called his family to say that he
Speaker 1: was dead. Whenever he died, a man came in with
Speaker 1: what could be described as men in black, came in
Speaker 1: with briefcases and told everyone to clear out of the
Speaker 1: clear out of the building that they had under control.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: So there's a really And then mix that with what
Speaker 1: Juri Geller was saying that they do not kill people
Speaker 1: that lay golden eggs.
Speaker 2: Yeah, right, and that it wouldn't make sense, It doesn't
Speaker 2: make any sense. Not to give away too much more
Speaker 2: from the film, but is there anything else that we
Speaker 2: didn't cover yet that you can give the audience a
Speaker 2: little sneak peek about.
Speaker 1: Well, there's going to be a lot of The documentary
Speaker 1: is going to run about an hour and forty minutes
Speaker 1: that it's going to cover a lot of information really quickly.
Speaker 1: The history of the remote viewing unit. It's going to
Speaker 1: get into the gate programs is going to get into
Speaker 1: the Monroe Institute gateway tapes. Because that's another thing. Whenever
Speaker 1: Army Intelligence sent the Army person out to the Monroe
Speaker 1: Institute to study under Robber Monroe to see if being
Speaker 1: outside of the body it could increase or make the
Speaker 1: remote viewing more accurate or the psychic ability is more accurate.
Speaker 1: They also brought those tapes back to Fort Mead, Maryland,
Speaker 1: so they had access to those tapes, and according to
Speaker 1: Lim Buchanan and some other people that were actually there
Speaker 1: said that they would use those tapes to like cool
Speaker 1: down and like after a remote viewing session, to like
Speaker 1: relax and like gather their thoughts back into it. Now,
Speaker 1: I don't want people getting the wrong impression of remote
Speaker 1: viewing and how remote viewing works. It's not one hundred
Speaker 1: percent accurate. It's never been one hundred percent accurate. And
Speaker 1: sometimes the people that are seeing these things aren't really
Speaker 1: even seeing them. They're getting impressions. M okay. So how
Speaker 1: it would work is they would get into the relaxed state,
Speaker 1: we get into their what could be considered a meditative state.
Speaker 1: Then they'll get a piece of paper and a pen,
Speaker 1: and then they will be assigned the coordinate. I mean
Speaker 1: there's different ways of remote viewing. There's extended remote viewing,
Speaker 1: could coordinate remote viewing, long range remote there's many different
Speaker 1: ways to do it. But with coordinate remote viewing, they
Speaker 1: would be assigned the target. The person that is giving
Speaker 1: the target to the individual is supposed to be blind
Speaker 1: to the target because if they're not blind to the target,
Speaker 1: then they can then influence the target. So the person
Speaker 1: that's assigning the target essentially has to imbue what is
Speaker 1: what the target is onto the coordinate. The coordinate literally
Speaker 1: does not matter. The coordinate isn't a real coordinate, it's
Speaker 1: a series of numbers. Yeah, So the person that's assigning
Speaker 1: the target has to be highly trained in order to
Speaker 1: not subliminally get things mixed up with the coordinate and
Speaker 1: then imbue things that aren't real and create their perception
Speaker 1: so that the remote viewer can't see the thing that
Speaker 1: they're supposed to be seen. It's a very complicated and
Speaker 1: complex process. When you get into the military remote viewing stuff.
Speaker 1: It's not as easy as sitting down and looking out
Speaker 1: a picture and then remote viewing the picture. Nine times
Speaker 1: out of ten. If you're doing that, then you're you're
Speaker 1: just using your imagination. You're just seeing things that you
Speaker 1: want to see. Thus, the whole point of remote viewing
Speaker 1: is to be blind to the target because then the
Speaker 1: information the things that you see is pure, because if
Speaker 1: you know what it is that you're supposed to be viewing,
Speaker 1: then that gets subliminal. Yeah, that messages into your brain
Speaker 1: to trick your brain into seeing what you think that
Speaker 1: you should see. Makes sense, So you need to be blind.
Speaker 1: The person that's giving you the target needs to be blind.
Speaker 1: So there has to be a middleman in between there.
Speaker 1: So the person that signs a target and the person
Speaker 1: that gives a target has to be different people. And
Speaker 1: then you sit down, then you take your pen and
Speaker 1: your piece of paper, and then you view. You get
Speaker 1: impressions of what you think that it is, and then
Speaker 1: you draw on a piece of paper and any words
Speaker 1: or any thoughts that come to mind on the piece
Speaker 1: of paper. That's what these military or remote viewing sessions were,
Speaker 1: and that's how they operated, and that's how they worked.
Speaker 1: And I think that with you know, social media and
Speaker 1: these self proclaimed remote viewers and self proclaimed psychics have
Speaker 1: the wrong impression or the wrong idea of how remote
Speaker 1: viewing is. There's a difference between being remote viewing and
Speaker 1: and being psychic. There are two separate things. If you
Speaker 1: can look at a picture and see what's going on
Speaker 1: currently at that place in based off of that picture,
Speaker 1: that means you're psychic. That's basically what Pat Price was.
Speaker 1: Pot Price was a very powerful psychic. Now you can
Speaker 1: argue that he was remote viewing or whatever. That's what
Speaker 1: they would call it. It would be remote viewing. But
Speaker 1: if you take a picture and you can describe what's
Speaker 1: going on at that location, you are a psychic. You're
Speaker 1: not a remote viewer. Remote viewing is a completely separate protocol.
Speaker 1: There's a protocol to remote viewing. So people are getting
Speaker 1: these things mixed up thinking that they're remote viewing when
Speaker 1: they're not actually remote viewing. There's they're literally setting down
Speaker 1: and using their imagination to come up with what their
Speaker 1: brain believes might possibly be going on at that location.
Speaker 2: Now, I know we went over the possibility of remote assassins,
Speaker 2: but do you know if they were also able to say,
Speaker 2: affect the environment of what they were trying to remote
Speaker 2: view in any way?
Speaker 1: Many experiments of that Ingo Swan would do that on
Speaker 1: many occasions. That's one of the things that he dow
Speaker 1: that got the military and the CIA interested in the phenomenon.
Speaker 1: You know, he would be able to remotely affect the
Speaker 1: environment and move things around where that he wasn't even near.
Speaker 1: It's called remote perturbation. That's the official term, which would
Speaker 1: translate to something like remote telekinesis where you can move
Speaker 1: an object that is nowhere near you or around you.
Speaker 2: That's crazy.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the Russians were also into remote perturbation, remote influence.
Speaker 1: So yeah, but recently that it is possible to do
Speaker 1: and you can remotely what you do then gives a
Speaker 1: whole new definition to you know, haunted activity and spirits
Speaker 1: and ghosts. Maybe it's maybe it's not even ghosts. Maybe
Speaker 1: it's not even spirits, dude. Maybe it's literally a living
Speaker 1: person that's remote viewing you and affecting your environment.
Speaker 2: He's remoter masturbating you. Bron Well, right on, man, I
Speaker 2: can't wait for this film last few minutes. I know
Speaker 2: you've done some great work in colle go out BSUFO narratives.
Speaker 2: People who are involved that are spreading disinformation and some
Speaker 2: of the some of the I guess you could say
Speaker 2: some of the current happenings that tend to involve UFOs
Speaker 2: or the narrative is pushed towards a UFO or an
Speaker 2: extraterrestrial But as far as where we're at now, we
Speaker 2: have at least more congressional hearings that pop up here
Speaker 2: and there. What are your thoughts on the state of
Speaker 2: quote unquote disclosure?
Speaker 1: Oh man, Honestly, I haven't really been paying too much attention.
Speaker 1: I kind of left that whole thing because I it's
Speaker 1: almost like whenever you're when you're onto something too soon,
Speaker 1: it almost feels like that you're wrong, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean, Like you get you get attacked by all
Speaker 1: kinds of people. You get you know, hate comments, hate messages,
Speaker 1: and all kinds of nonsense and stupid ass, ridiculous emails,
Speaker 1: you know, basically telling you that you're a propagandist and
Speaker 1: that you're working for the government, you cover up the UFOs,
Speaker 1: and that you're it's just ridiculous, dude. So that's what
Speaker 1: it feels like when and I'm not the only one
Speaker 1: that's experienced that. Several people have experienced that throughout, you know,
Speaker 1: just in the past. You know, ten years. So often,
Speaker 1: being too soon on a topic often feels like that
Speaker 1: you're wrong topic. And I felt like that I was
Speaker 1: really soon.
Speaker 2: Well us soon, but you were definitely onto something. I
Speaker 2: agree with much of your much of your thoughts on
Speaker 2: the matter, but I just thought that we were currently
Speaker 2: entering a very uh, well, we've been in a very
Speaker 2: interesting place when it comes to the narratives that they're
Speaker 2: trying to push forward. And like I said, you were
Speaker 2: doing a great job calling that out and I get
Speaker 2: it it. People don't respond well to things that they're
Speaker 2: not ready to let go of yet. And there's a
Speaker 2: lot of people out there that are not ready to
Speaker 2: let go of the UFOs and little Green Men yet.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's obviously an agenda. And where I think
Speaker 1: that this kind of heading is with AI. I think
Speaker 1: that AI is going to be responsible for so much
Speaker 1: and they're going to pin a lot of things on AI.
Speaker 1: I mean, I know now that they're already talking about
Speaker 1: how that they want to what's that call whenever you like,
Speaker 1: pardon that you're part of all of these different companies
Speaker 1: and these people that's been holding all the secrets to
Speaker 1: the UFO technology. We're going to pardon him. We're not
Speaker 1: going to hold them responsible for Whenever all this information
Speaker 1: comes out, I think that it's going to be used
Speaker 1: as an excuse for defense in the name of an
Speaker 1: invisible boogeyman, just like we've been led to believe the
Speaker 1: visible invisible boogeyman. It's always been an invisible boogeyman. It's
Speaker 1: always been that thing that no one can see, no
Speaker 1: one really has firsthand knowledge of that it's you know,
Speaker 1: just happening, and we need all this money to help
Speaker 1: protect you from the invisible boogeyman. So I do one
Speaker 1: percent believe that it's going to be used as a
Speaker 1: military budget to funnel more money into to then protect
Speaker 1: us from the aliens.
Speaker 2: Right, And I think of all those YouTubers that for
Speaker 2: years their content was about presenting video evidence. We're at
Speaker 2: a point now where unfortunately it's gotten to look too
Speaker 2: real and in many instances it's extremely difficult to tell
Speaker 2: the difference, and that's only going to get better. So
Speaker 2: it seems like the era of any video evidence maybe did.
Speaker 1: It really is? And when you look at the history
Speaker 1: of this stuff and you just like what I mentioned
Speaker 1: with the man who wrote the book Operation Mind Control,
Speaker 1: where the military would get these kids to address up
Speaker 1: and great alien costumes and abduct people and make them
Speaker 1: believe that they had been abducted by imans. They took
Speaker 1: them to some kind of area that had a background
Speaker 1: stet that made them believe that they were on a
Speaker 1: spaceship and stuff like that. If they're willing to go
Speaker 1: that far, yeah, could you to pull something off like that?
Speaker 1: If they're willing to go as far as to break
Speaker 1: into Paul Benowitz's house in the early eighties to replace
Speaker 1: his computer with an NSA modified computer to make him
Speaker 1: believe that he's in contact with aliens while the NSA
Speaker 1: is posted up across the street, be mean signals into
Speaker 1: his house. Oh okay, man, If they're going to go that.
Speaker 2: Far, so diabolical.
Speaker 1: What else are they willing to do? Man?
Speaker 2: Have you read the book Cameleo heard about this story
Speaker 2: with the Invisible Miserable that we're sitting to this guy's house.
Speaker 2: If they were doing shit like that back then, who
Speaker 2: knows what they've got going on now? And you have
Speaker 2: to question everything, even paranormal phenomena. We live in wild times. Brother,
Speaker 2: Before I let you go, remind the audience where they
Speaker 2: can find out more you again.
Speaker 1: You'll find me on YouTube, any and all podcast platforms
Speaker 1: for Good Knowledge, News Network, Facebook, Instagram, x, Twitter, and
Speaker 1: you can watch my documentary as GFKX and The Clockwork
Speaker 1: Shining on Amazon Prime Video to b TV. And thanks
Speaker 1: for having me on and be looking forward to my
Speaker 1: new documentary, Psychic Agent, Real Life Stranger Things, which is
Speaker 1: hopefully going to be released soon, which we'll cover everything
Speaker 1: that me and Chris talked about here today and much
Speaker 1: much more. Thank you very.
Speaker 2: Much, right on man, can't wait for that to come out.
Speaker 2: Until next time. Everyone, have a wonderful evening. We will
Speaker 2: talk again tomorrow. We'll see y'all. Dan