Speaker 1: Latest interview of Elon Muss.
Speaker 2: How long is the trip from hosting too here quite lately, I.
Speaker 3: Think it's about eight or nine hours.
Speaker 4: Okay, so you're fresh like him in the first morning, Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 4: So first question is about demography, and I spoke with
Speaker 4: you in the past about that, and I think it's
Speaker 4: really important for you, and you pointed on that a
Speaker 4: lot of your discussion and your partners.
Speaker 3: Is it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think, you know, I really want to emphasize
Speaker 1: that it's important to have children and to create the
Speaker 1: new generation. And as simple as it sounds, if people
Speaker 1: do not have children, there is no new generation. So
Speaker 1: so I very very much strongly recommend that, you know,
Speaker 1: I'm very much in favor of humanity expanding and creating
Speaker 1: a bright and exciting future of the world. And but
Speaker 1: but but fundamental to the furtherance of human civilization is
Speaker 1: having humans as as simple and basic as that sounds.
Speaker 1: And uh, you know, every every year I look at
Speaker 1: the the birth rates and I'm like, it's it's kind
Speaker 1: of a bit depressing because, uh, birth rates seem to
Speaker 1: decline every year, and I think, uh, you know that
Speaker 1: pass my my biggest advice to leaders, to government leaders,
Speaker 1: and and and to to the people in general. Would
Speaker 1: would be to make sure to have children to create
Speaker 1: the new generation. And I think any any incentives that
Speaker 1: can be done to incent the new generation, to make
Speaker 1: it easier for men to have children and to support
Speaker 1: the children, I think would be very wise. This is
Speaker 1: so fundamental and I really can't emphasize that enough. If
Speaker 1: if you don't have a new generation, there is no
Speaker 1: new generation, or with current birth rates, I think it
Speaker 1: may be the generations are at birth rates maybe.
Speaker 3: Half half of the replacement rate.
Speaker 1: And what that means is in three generations the population
Speaker 1: will be one roughly roughly one tenth of its current size.
Speaker 1: In three generations maybe four generations that you'll have, the
Speaker 1: population will be one tenth of its current size. So
Speaker 1: I always want to emphasize this point because it is
Speaker 1: so basic and fundamental that if if there's not at
Speaker 1: least a birth rate which is keeping population constant, then
Speaker 1: a people will will will disappear, disappear, disappearer.
Speaker 4: We have a lot of immigration. Somebody says that immigration
Speaker 4: is important.
Speaker 2: For that reason.
Speaker 4: What's your point on that immigrations is coming in Europe
Speaker 4: and is coming in America from the south of America
Speaker 4: and then Europe from the south of the Mediterranean Sea.
Speaker 2: What do you think about that?
Speaker 1: Well, I think one can't depend on other countries for immigration.
Speaker 1: And in fact, if you look at say the population worldwide,
Speaker 1: and this is almost everywhere in the world, and it
Speaker 1: seems to be a function of how once the country industrializes,
Speaker 1: once the country urbanizes, the population immediately starts to decline.
Speaker 1: So what one could say, for example, like like China
Speaker 1: could not possibly solve its population with immigration because if
Speaker 1: you you know, China's currently tracking to be maybe lose
Speaker 1: forty percent of its population every generation. You know, that
Speaker 1: would be seven hundred million, eight hundred million people.
Speaker 3: Or seven hundred roughly seven six seven hundred million people.
Speaker 3: It's a lot.
Speaker 1: Basically, you'd have to have the entire United States immigrate
Speaker 1: there twice every generation to simply maintain numbers just for China.
Speaker 1: So immigration there simply aren't enough numbers in immigration. And
Speaker 1: I think I think there is value to a culture,
Speaker 1: you know, and we don't want cultures. We don't want
Speaker 1: Japan to disappear. We don't want Italy as a culture
Speaker 1: to disappear. We don't want France as a culture to disappear.
Speaker 1: I think we have to have the maintain the sort
Speaker 1: of reasonable cultural identity of the various countries or they
Speaker 1: simply will not be those countries. You know, Italy is Italy.
Speaker 3: Is the people of Italy.
Speaker 1: The buildings are there, but really what is Italy Italy
Speaker 1: is the people of Italy, the probably person. So I mean,
Speaker 1: I just think it's a And I speak as someone
Speaker 1: who is very much, very much and I'm an environmentalist,
Speaker 1: and I believe in having, you know, building a sustainable
Speaker 1: future for the world. I think that there are very
Speaker 1: few people who, as an individual, who have done more
Speaker 1: than I have for to help the environment with electric
Speaker 1: cars and solar and and batteries to create a sustainable
Speaker 1: energy future, because we absolutely need a sustainable energy future.
Speaker 1: But but, but there is an aspect of the environmental
Speaker 1: movement that I think has gone too far.
Speaker 2: Really said from you.
Speaker 3: Yes, so said for me.
Speaker 1: You know, I think I am objectively one of the
Speaker 1: world's leading environmentalists in terms of doing things like I'm
Speaker 1: an environmentalist who does things up talk of action, not talk.
Speaker 3: I act.
Speaker 1: So I feel I can say, as as an environmentalist
Speaker 1: that the environmentalist movement has gone too far and in
Speaker 1: that if you in the natural extension of the environmentalist movement,
Speaker 1: if you go too far, you start to look at
Speaker 1: humanity as a bad thing. You start to look at
Speaker 1: humanity as though we are a plague on the surface
Speaker 1: of the earth, as though humanity is a bad thing.
Speaker 1: And in fact, there are some people who think and
Speaker 1: say explicitly that. In fact, there was on the front
Speaker 1: page of the New York Times there was a guy
Speaker 1: who said, there are eight billion people on earth. It
Speaker 1: will be better if there were none, which is.
Speaker 2: Crazy, definitely. So you taught me a joke about that.
Speaker 4: You told want to joke about the cows and the
Speaker 4: problem with the cows.
Speaker 1: You remember that, Oh, yeah, don't worry about the cows
Speaker 1: of tels A fine. Cows are not going to destroy
Speaker 1: the environment, hours are fine.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yes, you know, we.
Speaker 4: Have a a lot of lows European laws again against
Speaker 4: all the people who walk to them. You know, it's
Speaker 4: a big issue for it because it seems in green issue,
Speaker 4: but is a very industrial issue for us.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I think farming and cows are not do not have
Speaker 1: any meaningful effect on the environment, Yes, underline please, I yes,
Speaker 1: objectively this is true.
Speaker 3: So so the if you say, like there's.
Speaker 1: There's really only one thing that matters from an environmental
Speaker 1: standpoint for carbon, which is that we are taking billions,
Speaker 1: eventually trillions of tons of carbon from buried deep with
Speaker 1: it under the earth and putting transferring it to the.
Speaker 3: Atmosphere and oceans. That's the that's actually really all that.
Speaker 1: Matters, is taking vast amounts of carbon from underground where
Speaker 1: it's buried and moving it into.
Speaker 3: The atmosphere by burning it.
Speaker 1: And if you do that for long enough enough, eventually
Speaker 1: you will get climate change. Now, I think the climate
Speaker 1: change alarm is somewhat overblown in the short term. It's
Speaker 1: still a concern in the long term, but I think
Speaker 1: it's exaggerated in the short term. Great Now I have
Speaker 1: to I'm trying to thread the needle here between what
Speaker 1: you know, like what is pragmatic and what is sensible,
Speaker 1: what really matters and what doesn't matter. What really matters
Speaker 1: is that over the long term, over the course of
Speaker 1: the next several decades, that we gradually reduce how how
Speaker 1: many millions and billions of tons of carbon that we
Speaker 1: move from underground and to the atmosphere. Because we're running
Speaker 1: sort of a climate experiment that is dangerous, but I
Speaker 1: also don't think that I'll think of it as a
Speaker 1: fundamental civilizational risk. It is it's not going to destroy
Speaker 1: life on Earth, it's not going to destroy humanity, but
Speaker 1: will it will create hardship if you change the climate
Speaker 1: over many decades. So it's it's I think my message
Speaker 1: is like I think much more pragmatic, and I think
Speaker 1: I think correct and sensible, and I don't think we
Speaker 1: should demonize oil and gas.
Speaker 3: I think we.
Speaker 1: Should say, look, that is obviously necessary in the short
Speaker 1: term and the medium term too, and a little bit
Speaker 1: take several decades to become sustainable. So I think if
Speaker 1: we just without getting too worried about it, seek to
Speaker 1: have a sustainable energy future gradually, then that's what will happen.
Speaker 1: And so I think that some of the environmentalists movement
Speaker 1: has is part of what is We're causing people to
Speaker 1: lose hope in the future. So I guess what if
Speaker 1: trying I say is that we should have hope in
Speaker 1: the future. We should be excited about the future, and
Speaker 1: we should both the future we want.
Speaker 2: What about and even.
Speaker 4: You call it the work mind, Yes, sure, it's the
Speaker 4: name you gave to the work work mind illness.
Speaker 2: What's that virus? Yeah, so so it's coming to Europe.
Speaker 1: I have to advise you, yes, well this is not
Speaker 1: something you should import from America. Please don't import the
Speaker 1: work mind virus is bad. So the I mean essentially
Speaker 1: that to summarize maybe the worklind virus, it consists of
Speaker 1: creating very very divisive.
Speaker 3: Identity politics. So it actually.
Speaker 1: Amplifies work virus, myn virus, in my view, amplifies racism,
Speaker 1: amplifies frankly, sexism and all the isms, and.
Speaker 3: While claiming to do the opposite, it actually.
Speaker 1: Divides people and makes them, uh sort of hate each other,
Speaker 1: and it makes people hate themselves. And it's also anti meritocratic.
Speaker 3: It's not like you know, it's not merit based.
Speaker 1: So you want you want to have people succeed based
Speaker 1: on how hard they work and the talents, not who
Speaker 1: they are.
Speaker 3: Whether the man, woman, what what what? Race or you know, gender?
Speaker 3: What's that?
Speaker 1: Stuff is all creating. It's an artificial uh you know,
Speaker 1: mental civil war that is created and it's not and
Speaker 1: let me say it's no fun, okay. It is like
Speaker 1: it is like woke mind virus and fun are incompatible.
Speaker 3: Is no fun in that.
Speaker 1: No joy, it's it's it woke mind virus is all
Speaker 1: about condemning people instead of celebrating people, you know, like
Speaker 1: when in the work, it just doesn't celebrate. It's all
Speaker 1: about condemning and being divisive and and being just I
Speaker 1: think it's just evil frankly, really yeah, yeah, it's.
Speaker 2: Bad, so bad.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but you get a lot of problems saying so
Speaker 4: on on your social and excel. Have this point of
Speaker 4: view you are good friend of about my administration, and
Speaker 4: now they don't really like you so much for this
Speaker 4: kind of speech you're doing in public or not.
Speaker 3: I don't know. I mean, I just I'm very very
Speaker 3: pro human I'm very pro civilization.
Speaker 1: I'm in favor of humanity and our collective consciousness expanding
Speaker 1: on Earth and going beyond Earth, being a multiplanet species,
Speaker 1: a space bearing civilization, and being out there among the
Speaker 1: stars and finding out the nature of the universe, like
Speaker 1: all the things that you know, it's that seems like
Speaker 1: to me, and you know, exciting things.
Speaker 3: Something you can get really excited about, is you to.
Speaker 1: Get excited, like we want to have ideas that make
Speaker 1: you look forward to waking up in the morning, look
Speaker 1: forward to the day, look forward to the future, and
Speaker 1: you know, so you have to say what what excites
Speaker 1: you about the future, What moves your heart about the future,
Speaker 1: what makes you say like, yes, I'm glad about what
Speaker 1: will happen in the future. That's what we must, you know,
Speaker 1: focus on. And that's that's why we have to have
Speaker 1: a new generation. We've got to build, and we've got
Speaker 1: to grow and and uh, like I said, I understand this,
Speaker 1: understand the the the nature of this beautiful universe that
Speaker 1: we find ourselves in and the meaning of life or
Speaker 1: even what questions to ask about, you know, the meaning
Speaker 1: of life. Let us explore this wondrous creation and and
Speaker 1: have a good time doing it. Yeah, that's my philosophy.
Speaker 4: Let me go back for a little because I want
Speaker 4: to ask you about your perception of Europe as a building,
Speaker 4: not as people. Because of Europe do a lot of flow,
Speaker 4: us won, a lot of integration of cultures, different cultures
Speaker 4: and has different approach to the immigration. We heard Meloney
Speaker 4: did a lot on that with the Premier rama I
Speaker 4: see in the first line of Albania. What do you
Speaker 4: think about this approach of Europe approach as a building.
Speaker 2: I would say as an established building.
Speaker 1: Well, I should say, like to be clear on immigration overall,
Speaker 1: I'm very much in favor of legal immigration.
Speaker 3: I think that.
Speaker 1: Generally, I think which one should welcome to a country,
Speaker 1: anyone who is willing to work hard and is honest,
Speaker 1: you know, has high integrity, and will add to you know,
Speaker 1: any given country. If somebody is an asset to the country,
Speaker 1: why not have them drain. That's obviously a great thing
Speaker 1: to do. So I think it's good actually to have
Speaker 1: an increase in legal immigration and and a simple legal
Speaker 1: with paper, with just some some approval process, but with
Speaker 1: a simple requirement that look, if somebody is going to
Speaker 1: add to a country, like just really hard working and high,
Speaker 1: high integrity, let them in.
Speaker 3: I think that's great.
Speaker 1: But if there's if it's illegal immigration and there's no filter, well,
Speaker 1: how do you know who's coming and you don't know,
Speaker 1: So you have to have some you know, uh basis
Speaker 1: for saying somebody should come in or not come in,
Speaker 1: and and and my argument is like it should be
Speaker 1: a very simple basis. Will they will they add to
Speaker 1: the country, will they be a productive part of the economy, And.
Speaker 3: Do they admire the culture? Do they want to join?
Speaker 1: Because of the culture, then that's great, but if you know,
Speaker 1: if if there's no process for that, then you don't know.
Speaker 1: I think you know at least some number of the
Speaker 1: people that come in well will not be necessarily And
Speaker 1: I want to be careful because my words will be misconstrued.
Speaker 1: I'm not saying all illegal immigrants are are bad. I
Speaker 1: think probably perhaps most of them are good, but there
Speaker 1: will be some.
Speaker 3: If there's no.
Speaker 1: Process for reviewing not at all, then how can you
Speaker 1: say that everyone who is a legal immigrant is going
Speaker 1: to be honest.
Speaker 3: And hard working. You can't say that because you simply
Speaker 3: don't know.
Speaker 1: So I want to be clear, top line pro immigration,
Speaker 1: but let's increase legal immigration, but we should stop illegal immigration.
Speaker 3: I think this is just logical.
Speaker 4: You have a lot of company, so that's right. You
Speaker 4: can drink because I want to do the list of
Speaker 4: the company. Yeah, you have five to seven minutes to
Speaker 4: do that. I mean, I'm joking with space x X
Speaker 4: narrow len.
Speaker 3: That's already excess. Oh the ex guess what my favorite
Speaker 3: letter is.
Speaker 4: Okay, it's a good Pleased to invest Italy and it's
Speaker 4: a good place. Please to invest some of I mean
Speaker 4: not your money, but have some investment from your company,
Speaker 4: of the American companies, of the I would say competitive
Speaker 4: companies in this place.
Speaker 2: What's your opinion?
Speaker 1: No, I mean I think Italy is an incredible country,
Speaker 1: incredible culture. I love I love visiting, I love the
Speaker 1: Italian people. I think you guys are amazing, like.
Speaker 3: So tall. Yeah, so so I want, I you know, personally,
Speaker 3: I want.
Speaker 1: I want to actually I want the prosperity of Italy
Speaker 1: and I want the prosperity of every country. I want
Speaker 1: the prosperity of humanity as a whole. And like I said,
Speaker 1: I want, I have to ask to have an exciting
Speaker 1: future where we're fired up about what's going to happen
Speaker 1: and really excited. So uh, you know, and I think,
Speaker 1: you know, Italy is a great place to invest. It's
Speaker 1: a great, great country. And but but I do want
Speaker 1: to emphasize that the that I do worry that about
Speaker 1: the low birth rate. And you know, if if a
Speaker 1: if a company is to invest in Italy, they're like, well,
Speaker 1: you have to say, like will there be enough people
Speaker 1: to work there? You know, it's a simple question. You know,
Speaker 1: if if the workforce is declining, then if the workforce
Speaker 1: is declining, then then then then who will work at
Speaker 1: the company.
Speaker 3: Simple if there's no people, there's no people to work.
Speaker 2: I mean in fifty years, but I think it's even
Speaker 2: sooner than that though, you know, if we'll be so
Speaker 2: worried about that is the problem.
Speaker 1: I feel like a total Cassandra here because like I
Speaker 1: seem to be worried about it much more than other people.
Speaker 1: But you know, they're just needs to be people. If
Speaker 1: you don't make a new generation of people, there is
Speaker 1: no new generation of people.
Speaker 3: So that's it.
Speaker 1: And I know I'm I'm being you know, I'm being
Speaker 1: repetitive here, but I'm just I'm just trying to state
Speaker 1: state backed you know so, and uh.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so there's a good place to invest.
Speaker 1: I no, I agree, it's a good place to invest
Speaker 1: and uh and a wonderful country. So please make more Italians,
Speaker 1: is what I'm saying.
Speaker 4: You said once that the Internet that is the is
Speaker 4: the system is the new I've write down that your
Speaker 4: world the nervous system of humanity. What's it's once to
Speaker 4: me a long time religence for your artificially, if that
Speaker 4: is the nervous system inte artificial intelligence? Was I mean,
Speaker 4: use another metaphor.
Speaker 1: You asked me, what do I think of artificial intelligence? Obviously, well,
Speaker 1: you can think of artificial intelligence as.
Speaker 3: This is perhaps the.
Speaker 1: Biggest inflection point in intelligence since Homo sapiens. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: artificial intelligence is will be essentially a sort of a new.
Speaker 3: Species, or is a new species.
Speaker 1: So I think one of the biggest challenges if I
Speaker 1: look at say civilizational risk, you know, the risk to
Speaker 1: the future of humanity. You know, birth rate is one
Speaker 1: of them, if we just don't have kids and dwindle away.
Speaker 1: That's one which I've talked a lot about. The other is,
Speaker 1: you know, there's always like potentially nuclear war of course,
Speaker 1: that kind of thing that an AI is also an
Speaker 1: existential risk, and we need to be I think we
Speaker 1: need to be careful with the advent of AI. But
Speaker 1: it is very much it's very much a double edged sword.
Speaker 1: You can think of AI as kind of like the
Speaker 1: magic genie. You know that like digital superintelligence will be capable.
Speaker 2: Of doing anything anything, pretty much anything, but he doesn't
Speaker 2: have any consciousness. I'm wondering about that.
Speaker 1: I mean, there is a whole question of like what
Speaker 1: is consciousness in fact? So here's like I always say,
Speaker 1: I've thought a lot about.
Speaker 3: What is consciousness and where does consciousness arise?
Speaker 1: You know, to say, like, because I think in terms
Speaker 1: of physics, you know, and at least if physics is true,
Speaker 1: then we go from a start of the universe where
Speaker 1: things are almost entirely hydrogen.
Speaker 3: And then if you leave the hydrogen.
Speaker 1: Out long enough, eventually it coalesces into stars, and then
Speaker 1: those stars explode and then they recondense, you know, And
Speaker 1: so like most of the mass in your.
Speaker 3: Body was once at the center of a star, which
Speaker 3: is kind of wild, billions of years ago.
Speaker 1: And so where where along the lines of hydrogen to
Speaker 1: human does consciousness arise?
Speaker 2: You get very serious when you speak about that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, always a real question.
Speaker 1: If you leave hydrogen out in the it's not long enough,
Speaker 1: it starts talking to itself.
Speaker 3: Here we are hydrogen talking to itself.
Speaker 2: How to deal with that?
Speaker 4: So if it is so important, how to deal I mean,
Speaker 4: right lows personal behavior?
Speaker 2: How to deal with that? I think you intelligence because the.
Speaker 1: Process I mean, I think we need to kill keep
Speaker 1: a close eye on artificial intelligence. I mean I am
Speaker 1: in favor of some regulatory insight, just so that there's
Speaker 1: someone can at least be a referee, like if you
Speaker 1: think of any game, like there's always a referee for
Speaker 1: a game. For industries that affect the good of the people,
Speaker 1: there's there are regulatory agencies that oversee those industries. Anything
Speaker 1: that's dangerous is overseen by some kind of referee or regulator.
Speaker 1: I think we should have the same thing for AI,
Speaker 1: just to help ensure that it is beneficial. The good
Speaker 1: part of AI is that we are headed for a
Speaker 1: future of abundance. So AI and robotics will mean that
Speaker 1: there are no shortage of goods and services. There's there
Speaker 1: will be goods and services. If you can think of it,
Speaker 1: you can have it, basically, So this is a quite
Speaker 1: profound Like I said, it's the magic genie.
Speaker 3: AI. AI and robotics will get you anything you want.
Speaker 1: Now, usually in these sort of fairy tales about magic genies,
Speaker 1: it doesn't turn out so well. You have to be
Speaker 1: careful what you wish for, even if you wish for
Speaker 1: our wishes. So it's just something we should be cautious about.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 3: On the plus side, it will bring many benefits.
Speaker 1: Like I said, it will usher in an age of abundance,
Speaker 1: so that the positive scenario of AI is that there's
Speaker 1: an age of abundance, and there are no shortage of
Speaker 1: goods and services that any scarcity that is that exists
Speaker 1: will be only because we define in it to be scuts.
Speaker 1: So and it just seemed to be somewhat of an
Speaker 1: inevitable thing.
Speaker 3: AI.
Speaker 1: So you know there's that supposedly that that's Chinese saying
Speaker 1: about may you live in interesting times? Well, I think
Speaker 1: we currently live in the most interesting of times in
Speaker 1: all of history right now. So anyway, so my recommendation
Speaker 1: on AIS, I think we want some kind of regulatory
Speaker 1: oversight just to make sure.
Speaker 3: That it's beneficial. AI.
Speaker 2: Great, we hope.
Speaker 4: So and what about what the governments like, I mean
Speaker 4: they are elected by people like Maloney and this government
Speaker 4: and the other government, they have any risks or what
Speaker 4: do you think about these challenge for the for the
Speaker 4: executive of the nations about all these new processes.
Speaker 3: Sorry, I'm not try to understand the question.
Speaker 4: What's a risk for the government of these or if
Speaker 4: you have intelligens, are they any risks?
Speaker 2: I mean that democracy is finished.
Speaker 1: Well, I think there's certainly risk of artificial intelligence affecting
Speaker 1: voting opinion I suppose, and manipulating public opinion. So I
Speaker 1: think there's there's some risk of yeah, AI manipulating the public.
Speaker 1: I think that's probably that's the risk of that. So yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: you know, but I think probably, like like I said,
Speaker 1: eighty percent probable that AI is beneficial, harmful something like that.
Speaker 4: I'm always worried because you know, we have a new
Speaker 4: government is two years, this government almost two years, and
Speaker 4: who have a Europe for us is our artificial intelligence.
Speaker 4: It seems like artificial intelligence, but it's not very intelligent
Speaker 4: sometimes Europe, and so I'm wondering what do you think
Speaker 4: about the government and about Europe? For us, it's so
Speaker 4: important the relation. I understand our different intelligence in the future,
Speaker 4: but in the present we have laws, you know, constraints
Speaker 4: that comes from Europe.
Speaker 2: What do you think about that? If you have any.
Speaker 4: Opinion that, what do you think about Italian government which
Speaker 4: is trying to have a position. I would say a position, Meloni,
Speaker 4: I don't know if there's more than a position. You
Speaker 4: want need to be more tough than a position.
Speaker 2: It's okay, what do you think it's good to have
Speaker 2: a position in Europe? To be I mean, I would
Speaker 2: say different from the main course of European politics.
Speaker 3: You mean like country decisions versus decisions.
Speaker 4: Or decision about green about the politics immigration.
Speaker 1: Of I mean there's a separate question of like I
Speaker 1: think regulations in Europe there are too many regulations in general.
Speaker 1: I'm not speaking about specific case of AI. I think
Speaker 1: one could look at this as overall a fundamental function
Speaker 1: of a stable civilization. The longer that any given civilization
Speaker 1: is stable and does not have a big war, the
Speaker 1: more rules and regulations will accumulate over time. So rules, regulations, laws,
Speaker 1: they are immortal, they never die, but people die. So
Speaker 1: if every year more and more rules, regulations, and laws
Speaker 1: are added, you will eventually make everything illegal. And you
Speaker 1: can think of it sort of like Gulliver's travels, where Galiba,
Speaker 1: if the nation is Gulliver, is being tied down by
Speaker 1: one little regulatory string at a time, and eventually you
Speaker 1: have millions of strings, and then the giant can't move.
Speaker 1: And so I think there needs to be something where
Speaker 1: we delete rules, regulations and laws, because if we keep,
Speaker 1: if we simply, if all we do is add them,
Speaker 1: eventually we will be able to do nothing.
Speaker 4: Okay, should I do some questions about your companies? Because
Speaker 4: here there are all the young people not only the
Speaker 4: young people from an important Italian party and they most
Speaker 4: of them use the social network.
Speaker 2: They use X.
Speaker 4: And I saw in the past days that the CEO
Speaker 4: of this and they said, I don't want to invest
Speaker 4: any advertising on X. And he's investing, for example, in
Speaker 4: the May tie in the Instagram and he said that
Speaker 4: there are problem.
Speaker 2: I don't know which kind of problem they find on
Speaker 2: what's that? Yeah?
Speaker 3: What?
Speaker 2: What's what's going on? And why why an important investor
Speaker 2: like this? They said something so tough on X? What's
Speaker 2: going on there?
Speaker 1: Well, I think, first of all, I think X will
Speaker 1: be will be fine, and we are actually already seeing
Speaker 1: advertisers return to two X, so I guess they were
Speaker 1: I don't know if set with something I said or
Speaker 1: something I don't know, but they, you know, advertisers, I
Speaker 1: think are the brand. Advertisers are a little they're always
Speaker 1: worried about their brand, and you know, maybe I.
Speaker 3: Think maybe a bit more than they should be. But
Speaker 3: I think it's a short term issue.
Speaker 1: Like I said, the advertisers and sometimes get upset, but
Speaker 1: then they usually calm down and they return to advertising.
Speaker 4: So come on, you know that there's a walk virus
Speaker 4: over there? Well, oh, yes, right to say, I don't
Speaker 4: want to answer for you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, no, no, you're right.
Speaker 3: You're right.
Speaker 1: If we're going to fight the work mind virus, then
Speaker 1: the work work mind virus will fight back, and unfortunately
Speaker 1: Disney is deeply infected with the work mind virus. In fact,
Speaker 1: if you ask an ai what is the most work
Speaker 1: company on Earth? It's Disney, you know.
Speaker 3: But and you have to say, what would I mean?
Speaker 1: I think they should be asking themselves what would Walt
Speaker 1: Disney think of Disney today?
Speaker 3: I think he's turning in his grave. I think he's
Speaker 3: not happy. Sure, sure, you know, if the namesake.
Speaker 1: Of the company is not happy, that's probably a bad sign.
Speaker 1: You know, because Walt Disney, what did he care about?
Speaker 1: He cared about bringing joy to people's lives. He put up,
Speaker 1: you know, making wonderful things that children and families can
Speaker 1: enjoy it. And you know, he was it created some
Speaker 1: of the coolest, you know, art in the world and
Speaker 1: stuff that even one hundred years after it's created, we
Speaker 1: still remember it and it's still it's still a major thing.
Speaker 3: But you have to say, how great was Walt Disney?
Speaker 3: Was amazing?
Speaker 1: But now Disney, at least for now is deeply infected
Speaker 1: with the work mya virus.
Speaker 3: I think that will you know, that will change?
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh I hope.
Speaker 4: So right at that, the European Commission they're not investing
Speaker 4: on excer Do you know that maybe they're a.
Speaker 3: Little they got the work my envirus too.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you don't care, I think so, you know, And
Speaker 1: and it's like, why are they importing this this crazy
Speaker 1: thing from America? You know, It's like it's just some
Speaker 1: thing that was created basically by sort of far left
Speaker 1: crazy people in US colleges, and now it's spreading all
Speaker 1: over the world. And it's it's like, you know, like
Speaker 1: the thing is the work my Advice. It's it's not
Speaker 1: a message of joy, it's a it's a message of division.
Speaker 1: It's not a message of love. It's a message of hate.
Speaker 3: And it's like and so I'm like, I'm like, like,
Speaker 3: you know, let's.
Speaker 1: I don't know, I'm I'm in favor of like, let's
Speaker 1: have a future that's got more love more like more
Speaker 1: and let let us build a fun, exciting future. And
Speaker 1: and and the work by Advice is all about condemning
Speaker 1: one group and condemning this condemning that it's like and
Speaker 1: and and and it's also like just being like it
Speaker 1: just wants to scold.
Speaker 3: You all the time and and treat you like a
Speaker 3: you know, I don't know if who wants to be scolded?
Speaker 3: You know, it's not fun. So anyway, I think we
Speaker 3: wanna you know, have a like. So I guess at
Speaker 3: its heart, my concern is that the coin virus is anti.
Speaker 1: Civilizational, end of civilization, anti civilization.
Speaker 2: I think it suld.
Speaker 4: But if it represents a cost for your company, what's
Speaker 4: you know, you have a trade off between the cost
Speaker 4: of your position and and the cost for the company.
Speaker 2: What's your choice?
Speaker 4: And what how much is important in your behavior? The
Speaker 4: free speech standing, that's the question.
Speaker 1: But I do think free speech is incredibly important because
Speaker 1: if people cannot speak their minds and then we won't
Speaker 1: have a democracy. Democracy is the foundation of democracy is
Speaker 1: freedom of speech.
Speaker 2: But also saying something.
Speaker 4: Y so and Andrea is laughing at that because he
Speaker 4: knows that it's so important for you. But tell me
Speaker 4: more about the free speech because here is very important
Speaker 4: person here couldn't speech for a lot of people because
Speaker 4: they were considered with the Mavericks and worse than that,
Speaker 4: free speech for everybody is important, not just for the
Speaker 4: person who say the right things erect.
Speaker 3: Exactly, no, no, exactly. Free speech means that the free
Speaker 3: speech is only relevant.
Speaker 1: Free speech is only meaningful when if you allow people
Speaker 1: you don't like to say things you don't like.
Speaker 3: So that's how you know it's working. That's how you
Speaker 3: know it's working, because.
Speaker 1: Once you start to censor people you don't like saying
Speaker 1: things you don't like, it's only a matter of time
Speaker 1: before that censorship turns on you eventually, you know, live.
Speaker 3: By the sword, die by the sword. Live by censorship,
Speaker 3: die by censorship.
Speaker 2: Hey, Giovanni Krushian comminity, coming from.
Speaker 5: Bloom, I got to see what's.
Speaker 2: Even why you spoke about free speech.
Speaker 4: You're both Twitter for this free speech, just for the
Speaker 4: free speech, not for the business inside you both.
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, well I mean he here's the thing.
Speaker 1: So, you know, I think you have to say, like,
Speaker 1: if civilization is not strong, if civilization doesn't grow, then
Speaker 1: nothing else matters. You know, profits doesn't matter. If civilization collapses,
Speaker 1: there's there's no profits, there's no you know, we were
Speaker 1: not we cannot exist absence civilization. So sometimes people may say, like, well,
Speaker 1: is this an altruistic thing. I mean, I think it's
Speaker 1: for me, it feels altruistic. But even if it's even
Speaker 1: if one is not altruistic, even if one is very
Speaker 1: self centered, you have to say, if you simply think
Speaker 1: long term, you have to be pro civilization because you
Speaker 1: cannot exist without civilization.
Speaker 4: How important from zero to ten in the sky? From
Speaker 4: zero to ten money you are the richest.
Speaker 2: Person in the world. How is important money for you?
Speaker 2: From zero to ten? Zero is the less important, and
Speaker 2: then that is the good one.
Speaker 3: I don't know. I don't want to one or two
Speaker 3: or something.
Speaker 2: Now, come on, no, I mean just one of them.
Speaker 1: Well, I mean the reason I guess I have what
Speaker 1: so called wealth or it's really just shares in the company,
Speaker 1: is that I've created these companies, you know, in these
Speaker 1: companies like SpaceX and Tesla.
Speaker 3: Tesla's one hundred and forty thousand.
Speaker 1: Jobs direct wide, and five times that number, maybe maybe
Speaker 1: almost a million jobs when you look at the whole
Speaker 1: supply chain is what tells us created. And then SpaceX
Speaker 1: is is about fifteen thousand people. And also you know,
Speaker 1: like maybe full total supply chain fifteen thousand people. So
Speaker 1: you know, I mean, I basically with the help of
Speaker 1: many talented people built these companies and then the circle
Speaker 1: These wealth statistics simply they simply add up what the
Speaker 1: ownership is in the companies and say, okay, this is
Speaker 1: a certain amount of money, but I don't actually have
Speaker 1: that in money, I have it in stock. Just it's
Speaker 1: just it said that the companies have succeeded.
Speaker 2: But how was the last loanch of the SpaceX?
Speaker 4: That me something last question, please Jomini the last lounch,
Speaker 4: I see that are sitting on the floor. Why are
Speaker 4: you sitting on the floor? Are you worried about the highness?
Speaker 2: How was the last launch? Was you were optimist about
Speaker 2: your space X?
Speaker 3: The yeah, so we'll Starship.
Speaker 1: So the exciting thing about Starship is that it's the
Speaker 1: first rocket design that could make life multiplanetary, that could
Speaker 1: enable a self sustaining base on the Moon and a
Speaker 1: city on Mars. So because it is it's not just
Speaker 1: a very large vehicle, but it is designed for full
Speaker 1: and rapid reusability, So that would lower the cost of
Speaker 1: access to space by I don't know, maybe one hundred
Speaker 1: or more. And so, and basically it's the it's the
Speaker 1: first rocket that is capable of building a base on
Speaker 1: Mars and a base on the Moon.
Speaker 3: Yes, that's that's that's yeah. So you know, you know,
Speaker 3: there's the.
Speaker 1: The great Italian physicist Enrico Fermi. I'm a big admirer
Speaker 1: of Furmi, and he had he was very good at
Speaker 1: asking profound questions. And one of his questions, which is
Speaker 1: called the Fermi paradox, is where are the aliens? And
Speaker 1: one of the explanations is that, And perhaps I think
Speaker 1: the one that I think is most appears to be
Speaker 1: most accurate is that consciousness is extremely rare. That it's
Speaker 1: you know, we people often ask me, have I do
Speaker 1: I know about aliens or something like that, you know,
Speaker 1: asked that a lot. And the crazy thing is that
Speaker 1: I've seen no evidence of aliens whatsoever. This this means
Speaker 1: that I think, most likely, at least in this part
Speaker 1: of the galaxy, we are the only consciousness that exists.
Speaker 1: And so you can think of human consciousness really as
Speaker 1: like a tiny candle in a vast to darkness, and
Speaker 1: we must do everything we can to ensure that the
Speaker 1: candle does not go out.
Speaker 3: That's great.
Speaker 2: We can finish with that. We can finish with that.
Speaker 2: Even okay, we can finish with this, and so, so.
Speaker 1: It's worth reading about the Fermi paradox, and because people
Speaker 1: have thought very hard about.
Speaker 3: This, because there are these because one of the things
Speaker 3: is like, well maybe they.
Speaker 1: Are these great filters, and and and and these civilizations
Speaker 1: don't pass these filters.
Speaker 3: One of the filters is do we become a multiplanet
Speaker 3: species or not.
Speaker 1: If we do not become a multiplanet species, then eventually,
Speaker 1: at some point something will happen to the planet. Either
Speaker 1: it will be uh man made or it will be
Speaker 1: something natural, like a media or like whatever killed the dinosaurs,
Speaker 1: for example. And then eventually the sun will actually expand
Speaker 1: and we'll destroy all life on Earth.
Speaker 3: So if one cares about life on Earth at all, we.
Speaker 1: Should care about becoming a multiplanet species and eventually going
Speaker 1: out there and becoming a multi stellar species and having
Speaker 1: many star systems. You know, we want the exciting parts
Speaker 1: of science fiction to not be fiction forever. We want
Speaker 1: to make them real.
Speaker 3: And yeah, great, thanks for listening.
Speaker 1: See you in the next episode.