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Speaker 5: r d er ZipRecruiter the smartest way to hire. Sexual
Speaker 5: predators exist in our society, and their evil desire leads
Speaker 5: them to commit heinous, brutal crimes with little concern for
Speaker 5: their victims or the toll it takes on the community.
Speaker 5: Violent sociopaths have no interest in the needs or safety
Speaker 5: of anyone else and see ordinary people as either targets
Speaker 5: or competitors. They have no hesitation taking what they want
Speaker 5: from their victims. Whether they are rapists, pedophiles, or murderers,
Speaker 5: these monsters will do whatever it takes to get their
Speaker 5: needs met and their evil desires satisfied. Captain Dean t Olson, retired,
Speaker 5: is a veteran sex crimes detective with the Douglas County,
Speaker 5: Nebraska Sheriff's Office serving the Omaha area. In his thirty
Speaker 5: year law enforcement career, he has seen some of the
Speaker 5: most horrible crimes committed by one person against another, and
Speaker 5: he has arrested some of the worst sexual predators the
Speaker 5: nation has ever seen. The book they were featuring this
Speaker 5: evening is Evil Desires, The recollections of a sex crime
Speaker 5: Detective with my special guest, detective and author Dean T. Olson.
Speaker 5: Welcome to the program, and thank you very much for
Speaker 5: agreeing to this interview. Dean t Olson.
Speaker 6: Now, thanks for having me.
Speaker 5: Thank you very much. This is an incredible book with
Speaker 5: your experiences as you commanding the Criminal Investigation Bureau of
Speaker 5: the Douglas County Sheriff's Department in Omaha, Nebraska, and you
Speaker 5: retired after thirty years in two thousand and eight. You
Speaker 5: have three other books, Perfect Enemy, Tactual counter Terrorism, and
Speaker 5: The Omega Confluence. Now, you were a sex crimes detective,
Speaker 5: as we mentioned, and obviously the focus of this book
Speaker 5: is rape and murder. But in the beginning of this book,
Speaker 5: you take the reader through the categories of rapists before
Speaker 5: you get to these extreme, graphic and incredible tales that
Speaker 5: show examples of these rapists and the characteristics that you
Speaker 5: outline as you do in the book. Can you tell
Speaker 5: us a little bit about the categories and what they
Speaker 5: entail of these rapists.
Speaker 6: Yeah, it's interesting. Back in the mid to late seventies,
Speaker 6: the FBI started doing some serious research into the categories
Speaker 6: of rapists. Their ultimate goal was to try to provide
Speaker 6: law enforcement officers detectives with information that would help them
Speaker 6: narrow the universal suspects so that they could focus their
Speaker 6: investigative efforts more efficiently, and eventually they came up with
Speaker 6: essentially four categories, the power reassurance rapists, the power assertive rapist,
Speaker 6: the anger retaliatory rapist, and the anger excitation. So essentially
Speaker 6: two power type rapists and two anger type rapists, and
Speaker 6: the characteristics associated with each helps the detective to determine
Speaker 6: which category to rape their investigating fits into, so they
Speaker 6: can focus their investigating efforts more closely on identifying a
Speaker 6: suspect instead of grasping at straws and looking at everybody
Speaker 6: that might be involved in such a crime.
Speaker 5: Now you provide an example of an incredible case. March
Speaker 5: thirty first, nineteen eighty six, and a farmer found a
Speaker 5: body of a boy named Ricky Chaddick. He had been
Speaker 5: forwarded missing. March twenty third, nineteen eighty six. You get
Speaker 5: this call and your partner, fellow detective, what is the process?
Speaker 5: What do you do? First? You get the call, tell
Speaker 5: us take us through what happens next.
Speaker 6: My partner in ed Day was Dave and Salek and
Speaker 6: a really good investigator, and we had worked together for
Speaker 6: so long that we didn't need to talk. We could
Speaker 6: read each other's movements and our thoughts, almost like reading
Speaker 6: each other's minds. But that morning I was in my
Speaker 6: office returning phone calls and Dave and I were backup investigators.
Speaker 6: They had a big pass course organized at Omaha Police
Speaker 6: Central Headquarters. I think there was sixty investigators working NonStop
Speaker 6: twenty four hours trying to find Ricky Chaddick. These type
Speaker 6: of cases are very emotional. They hit a community very hard,
Speaker 6: so people were phoning in a lot of tips, you know,
Speaker 6: thinking well, maybe this tip will help, and a lot
Speaker 6: of times those tips they're not all that good. So
Speaker 6: they would take the what they considered the prime tips,
Speaker 6: the best tips, and give it to the lead investigators.
Speaker 6: The more promising ones and lesser quality tips. They would
Speaker 6: funnel to Dave and I's backup investigators and other backup
Speaker 6: the investigators at other agencies as well, to free up
Speaker 6: the prime investigators. The lead investigators to focus on what
Speaker 6: they consider the more promising tips. And at the beginning
Speaker 6: of an investigation like that, it is pretty much a mess.
Speaker 6: You're just grasping at straws trying to flesh out the
Speaker 6: details of the case and then ass year you have
Speaker 6: to look at everything, because if you overlook one thing,
Speaker 6: it might be the thing that is important. So they
Speaker 6: would take the promising tips, focus it to the lead investigators.
Speaker 6: The less promising ones they would folk, or they would
Speaker 6: send off to backup investigators like me and Dave. That morning,
Speaker 6: I was in my office returning phone calls and looking
Speaker 6: at some tip sheets I had was going to go
Speaker 6: work right away when my lieutenant came up and I
Speaker 6: was on the phone at the time, and he kind
Speaker 6: of patiently stood by my desk, and I knew he
Speaker 6: was in a hurry, so I finished the phone call
Speaker 6: and he said, you need to get out to one
Speaker 6: hundred and sixty eighth in Ida at that time, a
Speaker 6: rolling farm field on the west end of the city.
Speaker 6: And he said the farmer found the body. So Dave
Speaker 6: and I hit it out there. We arrived, the patrol
Speaker 6: deputy was there, and the farmer was there and he
Speaker 6: was pretty upset, and those days that weren't in his
Speaker 6: cell phone. So he had been out to his field.
Speaker 6: He'd seen a body in the ditch and kind of
Speaker 6: backed by some trees a little ways off the road,
Speaker 6: and he knew enough not to approach the body, so
Speaker 6: that he would xaminate the scene. He went home in
Speaker 6: his truck, contacted, they called nine to one one. The
Speaker 6: patrol deputy showed up, and the patrol deputy was smart
Speaker 6: enough to follow in the farmer's footprints, their foot track
Speaker 6: back to the where the body lay. Once he got close,
Speaker 6: he could see that there was a presence of lividity,
Speaker 6: which is the purplish brown looks like bruising, but it's
Speaker 6: not that indicates that the person is deceased because of
Speaker 6: the blood pools and the lower portions of the body.
Speaker 6: Once the patrol deputy had seen that, he knew he
Speaker 6: didn't have to approach, that there was no resuscitation and
Speaker 6: the child was already dead, so he backed out, took
Speaker 6: the farmer back out the same way they walked in.
Speaker 6: So when David I got there, we knew immediately that
Speaker 6: we approached the same way, walked in the same footprints again,
Speaker 6: so we minimize the contamination of the scene to see
Speaker 6: the lividity. So immediately we call the crime lab out
Speaker 6: and they sent out four people in a big mobile
Speaker 6: crime lab van and took hours to check the scene
Speaker 6: and then remove the body for an autopsy. Downicomord which
Speaker 6: I attended the next day. I mean, you can tell
Speaker 6: quite a bit from the condition of the body the
Speaker 6: condition of the crime. Seeing it gives you tips about
Speaker 6: who the offender might be or what type of category
Speaker 6: of murder or rapist that he fits. And I say
Speaker 6: rapists because even though a victim a body may not
Speaker 6: show any obvious signs of sexual assault, it doesn't mean
Speaker 6: the victim hasn't been assaulted in some way. But in
Speaker 6: this case, I can't give a lot of information because
Speaker 6: it's still considered an open case, and we have what's
Speaker 6: called holdback information that you don't release to the public
Speaker 6: because it could jeopardize the investigation or tip off a
Speaker 6: suspect that you're looking at him, that type of thing.
Speaker 6: So I can't talk with a lot of detail. But
Speaker 6: the child had been fed, he'd been missing four or
Speaker 6: five days, he'd been fed, he'd been kept, he was clean.
Speaker 6: There were no obvious or overt signs of sexual assault,
Speaker 6: but again it doesn't mean that he wasn't And from
Speaker 6: the contents of his stomach, they knew approximately when he
Speaker 6: had last been fed and things like that. But from
Speaker 6: that the FBI uses that information the crime scene, the
Speaker 6: family history, of the child and the child's age and
Speaker 6: things like that make a prepare a profile that helps
Speaker 6: you narrow down the universal suspects as you're looking for.
Speaker 5: You include a case because a murder of Danny Joe Eberley, thirteen,
Speaker 5: He disappeared while delivering newspapers. What is your connection to
Speaker 5: this story as you write in the book and tell
Speaker 5: us about this story that you've included.
Speaker 6: Especially my connection, Well hit close to home for me
Speaker 6: because Danny Joe Everley was the first of two victims
Speaker 6: in Nebraska that was abducted and killed by I can't
Speaker 6: think of the name off the top of my head,
Speaker 6: John Jubert, John Jubert. He was an Air Force airman
Speaker 6: station at the local Air Force base down and Bell,
Speaker 6: the Offered Air Force Base, which at the time was
Speaker 6: a sprawling Air Force base. It's quite a bit smaller now,
Speaker 6: but there was a home with a strategic air command.
Speaker 6: Any joy really was taken, and then a while later
Speaker 6: a young boy named Christopher Walden was taken. And what
Speaker 6: really hit close to me was that Christopher Walden was
Speaker 6: kidnapped two blocks from my home on his way to school,
Speaker 6: the same school that my son attended. My son and
Speaker 6: daughter so it did really close to home because it
Speaker 6: was right there.
Speaker 5: You were assigned to the patrol division at that time
Speaker 5: when Walden was abducted. What other things did this You
Speaker 5: talk about one hundred officers on that case, and also
Speaker 5: that rules have changed in some of these cases. I
Speaker 5: don't know if they were the president for those changes,
Speaker 5: but when one of these children went went missing, the
Speaker 5: parents didn't find out till the end of the day.
Speaker 5: So rules have changed as a result of these crimes
Speaker 5: in these cases having.
Speaker 6: Yeah, that's that's true. In fact, when Christopher Walden disappeared,
Speaker 6: is the parents had no idea that they didn't show
Speaker 6: up at school because in those days, the school wouldn't call. Well,
Speaker 6: now I don't know of a single school that doesn't
Speaker 6: call if a child didn't show up and say, hey
Speaker 6: it's so and so, excuse for the day, or you know,
Speaker 6: what's the status and it's it's directly as a result
Speaker 6: in the Omaha area, especially of the John Jubert serial
Speaker 6: murder cases.
Speaker 5: Yeah, you were talking about the search for well, eventually
Speaker 5: what they found out to be Jubert, but there was
Speaker 5: no such spec suspects in the case. And you talked
Speaker 5: about a guy that you say that a unique breed,
Speaker 5: a dying breed. A sheriff. Thomas had an idea to
Speaker 5: use the media, but it was controversially the FDI didn't
Speaker 5: agree with him. Tell us about the idea and what
Speaker 5: it did result in.
Speaker 6: Well, I actually saw the case dat Thomas was a
Speaker 6: old school sheriff in Sarpy County. Were the two abductions
Speaker 6: that occurred, and as an executive, he was standing back
Speaker 6: and letting his assigned people do their jobs, which is
Speaker 6: what his job was. He didn't meddle, but he was
Speaker 6: involved in every aspect of the case, but he would
Speaker 6: stand back and watch. And after the Walden abduction, the
Speaker 6: second abduction, he approached the task force and he said, hey,
Speaker 6: we're not getting anything done here. We got kids being snatched.
Speaker 6: He said, how about I get on TV and I'm
Speaker 6: going to appeal to this guy. Turn yourself in, turn
Speaker 6: yourself into a priest. You don't need to turn yourself
Speaker 6: into me. And he said, I'm gonna talk to him.
Speaker 6: I'm going to ask him, why are you picking on kids?
Speaker 6: Why don't you pick on an adult, somebody who can
Speaker 6: defend themselves. And the FBI was just adamant, No, you
Speaker 6: can't do that because if another kid gets taken in
Speaker 6: because you know, irk this guy or in some way,
Speaker 6: it's going to come back on the task force and
Speaker 6: we're going to be blamed for it, and then, you know,
Speaker 6: and that's a legitimate concern. But Pat Thomas was not
Speaker 6: to be dissuaded, and he said, no, he saw I'm
Speaker 6: going on TV tonight and he did. And it turned
Speaker 6: out to be the thing that precipitated the arrest because
Speaker 6: John Gilbert reacted just the way Pat Thomas city would.
Speaker 6: He saw the TV thing because he was watching the
Speaker 6: progress of the case in the news, which Pat Thomas
Speaker 6: also realized. He said, I think this guy's watching us
Speaker 6: in the news. He's watching our newspaper reports, our TV
Speaker 6: reports and seeing how close we're getting. And Gilbert watched
Speaker 6: the broadcast and was just infuriated that Pat Thomas has said,
Speaker 6: you're not a man because you're attacking kids, why don't
Speaker 6: you attack an adult? So then the very next morning
Speaker 6: he did. He went out and attacked a woman, an adult,
Speaker 6: and she was able to get away from him, called police,
Speaker 6: gave a license number of a car he was driving,
Speaker 6: an ultimately led to his arrest.
Speaker 5: It was interesting too. You include a famous criminal profile
Speaker 5: from the FBI, Robert K. Wrestler, and you include and
Speaker 5: this has happened before where he provides a profile and
Speaker 5: you say this thing was useless, but inadvertently it led
Speaker 5: to another murder being connected. Can you explain that interesting story?
Speaker 6: Yeah, wrestlers, And again, you know, a lot of times
Speaker 6: you don't have a lot to work with. Generally they
Speaker 6: like to have at least three serial cases because then
Speaker 6: you have enough information to provide a more accurate profile.
Speaker 6: But in the case of the Jebbert, he was working
Speaker 6: off the first case only, and he was way off
Speaker 6: on some things, like he believed that Danny Joe Everley,
Speaker 6: the first victim, had been kept for a while by
Speaker 6: his killer, which wasn't true. We hadn't found the task
Speaker 6: force hadn't found his body yet. What's the only reason
Speaker 6: why the body hadn't turned up. But Wrestler's profile was
Speaker 6: pretty much not helpful at all, so general and generic
Speaker 6: to the point of being useless. But he came back
Speaker 6: and revised it when Walden was taken and it was
Speaker 6: a little more accurate, but still didn't play a big
Speaker 6: role in the case. The role the case was solved
Speaker 6: by Pat Thomas and Wrestler, though he studies all this
Speaker 6: stuff because he's trying to perfect his craft. And then
Speaker 6: the process of studying the Jewbert case, because of the
Speaker 6: two killings in Omaha, he realized he was talking to
Speaker 6: a group of National Academy cops at the FBI Academy
Speaker 6: in Quantico and he mentioned the cases in Omaha the specifics.
Speaker 6: An officer there was from Maine and he said, you know,
Speaker 6: I've got a case that sounds just like this case.
Speaker 6: And they started looking into it, and sure enough, that
Speaker 6: was Hubert's first kill when he was a juvenile, sixteen
Speaker 6: seventeen year old kid in Maine.
Speaker 5: Incredible, and you provide that whole background to his development
Speaker 5: and evolution as this eventual serial rapist killer.
Speaker 6: It was significant about the Jewbird is that the sexual
Speaker 6: aspects of his crime were more involved with the sadistic
Speaker 6: the torture. They call it peaker is, and the stabbing,
Speaker 6: biting is also a form of peaker ism. It's a
Speaker 6: sexual aspect, the masochistic or sadistic torturing of the victim
Speaker 6: for the pleasure of the of the murder. Neither Dan
Speaker 6: Angel Everley or Christopher Walden had been sexually assaulted in
Speaker 6: an obvious way, but the peaker isn't. The bite and
Speaker 6: the stabbing and things like that indicated that it was
Speaker 6: a sexual crime. And so that was significant because to
Speaker 6: a layman or a cop that doesn't have a lot
Speaker 6: of experience or hasn't been tough training, you would look
Speaker 6: at that saying, well, this guy just likes to stab
Speaker 6: kids or he likes to bite people. I don't see
Speaker 6: a sexual aspect to it. When peagarism is a sexual
Speaker 6: sadist's way of inflicting torture and pain and suffering on
Speaker 6: a victim.
Speaker 5: Yes, absolutely it's You write that he had the death
Speaker 5: penalty imposed and he was executed in July nineteen ninety six,
Speaker 5: and Sheriff Pat Thomas died in two thousand and ten
Speaker 5: at seventy years old, and he had retired at sixty five.
Speaker 5: Let's talk about a case where you earned your first
Speaker 5: award for rape investigation, and that's the Earl LaBelle case.
Speaker 5: You call it a hot prowler rapist. Can you tell
Speaker 5: us what hot prowler refers.
Speaker 6: To that problem case? Either rapist or burglary refers to
Speaker 6: the fact that the burglar or the rapist likes to
Speaker 6: go into a house while people are sleeping. It's considered
Speaker 6: hot prowling because he picks a house specifically because he
Speaker 6: knows there's going to be people inside. In the case
Speaker 6: of rapists, a lot of times it's a sexual turn
Speaker 6: on to be able to skulk around inside and in
Speaker 6: the dark as people are sleeping, as are slumbering. In
Speaker 6: the case of Earl LaBelle, one case in particular, where
Speaker 6: the victim woke up, the victim's husband woke up when
Speaker 6: he was standing next to the bed on his wife's side.
Speaker 6: She normally doesn't remember her dreams or didn't remember her dreams,
Speaker 6: but that day when she was awoke in or woke
Speaker 6: up abruptly because her husband yelled as a man in here,
Speaker 6: she remembers that dreaming as somebody is standing next to
Speaker 6: her with his hands near her face. So Earl La
Speaker 6: Belle was sneaking around in the dark looking for things
Speaker 6: to steal and also for victims to rape if he
Speaker 6: stumbled upon a vulnerable woman, and in the process he
Speaker 6: was considered a hot burglar slash rapist. But it was
Speaker 6: an interesting case in the standpoint that patrol deputy actually
Speaker 6: made the case for me, because I had received the
Speaker 6: information that they had a hot prowl case down there,
Speaker 6: and I knew that sometimes hot prowl burglars also indulged
Speaker 6: in rapes, and I knew that neighboring jurisdictions down there
Speaker 6: had some rapes, but I didn't have a rape case
Speaker 6: in my jurisdiction at the time. Subsequently, a couple of
Speaker 6: weeks later, I had my first rate picked him and
Speaker 6: themo was the same. A woman had gone to bed
Speaker 6: at ten eleven o'clock at night. She was a very
Speaker 6: light sleeper, her daughter was visiting from out of town.
Speaker 6: She left the front door unlocked, and the squirrel of
Speaker 6: bell was an experienced burglar. He'd been arrested at the
Speaker 6: juvenile so he knew that if he carried burglar tools
Speaker 6: to pry into a building, he could get arrested just
Speaker 6: by having those in this possession. Plus they could be
Speaker 6: matched up to tool marks on the door that he
Speaker 6: pried or whatever. So he knew in a big apartment complex,
Speaker 6: a lot of people just forget to lock their doors,
Speaker 6: and they don't lock him at night. In the area
Speaker 6: that he was howling was a fairly relatively crying free area,
Speaker 6: so people were nonchalant about locking their doors. Well, in
Speaker 6: this case, the woman's daughter was visiting. She didn't have
Speaker 6: a key, so she left her front door unlocked sometime
Speaker 6: in the middle of the night. Then one thirty two
Speaker 6: o'clock in the morning, she hears the door open light sleeper.
Speaker 6: She wakes up. She yells out to her daughter, doesn't
Speaker 6: get a response, and so she thinks, okay, she didn't
Speaker 6: hear me. She yells out louder. Well, then suddenly she's
Speaker 6: starting to get scared because her daughter's not responding. And
Speaker 6: suddenly she sees a shadow moving down the hallway towards
Speaker 6: her bedroom, and the shadow's illuminated by the only light
Speaker 6: that's on in the apartment in her hallway. Well, she
Speaker 6: panics because she can't go any where. She's in bed,
Speaker 6: she's trapped. Suddenly, he appears in the doorway with a
Speaker 6: bandana over his face, jumps her in bed, flips her over,
Speaker 6: and puts a pillow over head, and starts punching her
Speaker 6: through the pillow and basically beating her up. He was
Speaker 6: a angry retaliatory, a tag rapist that he was picking
Speaker 6: on females and using them as a surrogate victim for
Speaker 6: perceived wrongs that he had suffered at the hands of
Speaker 6: another woman, maybe a boss or girlfriend, mother, whoever.
Speaker 7: You know.
Speaker 6: You don't know the specifics. But Pete her pretty good.
Speaker 6: And then the process, she was an excellent witness. I
Speaker 6: don't know how these people do with these victims. Without
Speaker 6: victims like that, I would never be able to make
Speaker 6: a case. But she noticed that he's wearing these weird gloves.
Speaker 6: They were like a fish net. And he's an experienced burglers,
Speaker 6: so he knows not to leave fingerprints. Well, she said, look,
Speaker 6: I've got money in my book, my paperback book next
Speaker 6: to the bedstand. There's money in my purses. Take what
Speaker 6: you want, please don't hurt me in the process. Then
Speaker 6: he reaches over for the book and he can't get
Speaker 6: the pages come through to find the two twenty dollars
Speaker 6: bills in it because he's wearing these gloves. So he
Speaker 6: takes a glove off. Well, she's watching him. Even though
Speaker 6: she's got a pillow over her head, she could see
Speaker 6: out the side. She sees him lay his hand on
Speaker 6: the nightstand. So he gets the two twenty dollars bills. Well,
Speaker 6: about the time that he's in the process of raping her.
Speaker 6: The daughter comes home, he's locked the front door again
Speaker 6: so she can't get in. So the daughter's pounding on
Speaker 6: the door. Well, he panics, and the victim is smart
Speaker 6: enough to say, my daughter and her boyfriend are there.
Speaker 6: Even though the daughter didn't have a boyfriend, she wanted
Speaker 6: him to think there was a man in the hallway.
Speaker 6: LaBelle gets up, you know, dresses himself, and then heads
Speaker 6: for the patio door and climbs down the second floor
Speaker 6: patio to the first floor and then he's gone. But
Speaker 6: in the process, she had seen that he'd touched his
Speaker 6: hand to that nightstand. So when I talked to her
Speaker 6: in the hospital, she said yeah. I said, is there
Speaker 6: anything that she saw, you know, where I could might
Speaker 6: identify this guy. Did he touch anything? And she said, well,
Speaker 6: he had these weird fishnet gloves on, and I'll come
Speaker 6: back to those gloves in a minute. But she said, yeah,
Speaker 6: he took those gloves off, and I think he touched
Speaker 6: the nightstand. So I called the crime lab. Guys are
Speaker 6: still at the scene, and I said, look, do that
Speaker 6: nightstand very close. I said, he might have touched his
Speaker 6: fingers or a palm to that nightstand. Well, in most
Speaker 6: cases when a suspect is brought in, they take what's
Speaker 6: called ten print cards, so fingerprints only. They don't do
Speaker 6: the palm prints. But luckily for me, we had a
Speaker 6: really good cop named Gary Kirkle. He changed his name
Speaker 6: in the bookcause they don't have permission to use his
Speaker 6: name in the print. But he's patrolling one night when
Speaker 6: what Belle is doing his hot prowling, and he gets
Speaker 6: what most midnight cops think is a dream call. He's
Speaker 6: got a hot prowler in an apartment and he's a
Speaker 6: block away. He's literally across the street from it. He
Speaker 6: shoots across the street. He sees a stocky black mail
Speaker 6: winding south from the Citadel apartment complex. He turns and
Speaker 6: tries to chase him down in his car, but he
Speaker 6: disappeared and he went with a complex which is just
Speaker 6: south of there, a big, sprawling metropolitan apartment complex with
Speaker 6: a lot of garages and cars to hide behind. So
Speaker 6: he hangs back and he waits and has another car
Speaker 6: go to the scene to talk to the victim. In
Speaker 6: the process of waiting there, he sees a car drive
Speaker 6: through real slow and sees it his brake lights a
Speaker 6: couple of times. As he sits back with his lights off,
Speaker 6: he sees that same stocky blackmail run from between two
Speaker 6: grudges and get in the car, pulls the car over
Speaker 6: and in it is Earl la Bell and the past
Speaker 6: your Side and his girlfriend. He hauls them both in
Speaker 6: impounds the car. In the process of talking to Earl
Speaker 6: of Bell, he says, look, he said, can we take
Speaker 6: your fingerprints? And Earl says we already got him. He says, well,
Speaker 6: can we take your palm prints?
Speaker 3: Now?
Speaker 6: Why he was smart enough to ask for palm prints,
Speaker 6: but that's the sign of a good cop. He went
Speaker 6: the extra mile. He took the Earl of Bell's palm prints.
Speaker 6: And he didn't have enough to make a case on
Speaker 6: the hot prowling case where he was in the apartment
Speaker 6: when the man woke up and chased him out of there.
Speaker 6: But when I got the right case later then went
Speaker 6: back to the crime lab and he asked they said,
Speaker 6: do you have a suspect that we can look at?
Speaker 6: And they said, well, I don't have a prime suspect,
Speaker 6: but I said I would start with curl label and
Speaker 6: one of the crime lab guys that remembered him and
Speaker 6: said yeah, he was in here a couple of weeks back.
Speaker 6: I said, yeah, I would start with him, went back
Speaker 6: and started doing my thing. You know, this crime lab
Speaker 6: stuff isn't like on TV. It takes hours and hours
Speaker 6: of tvous work. Went back to my desk and I was.
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Speaker 1: No were necessarily where everybody lost in terms of conditions eighteen.
Speaker 6: Plus doing things and making phone calls, and the crime
Speaker 6: lab guy Bill Kawful came running in. He says, hey,
Speaker 6: he said, I made the palm print on earlabel on
Speaker 6: your rape. I said, well, tell me about it. He says,
Speaker 6: I got a right palm print on the I'm a
Speaker 6: lift that was taken fingerprint lift that was taken off
Speaker 6: of the nightstand. He said it's a partial, but he said,
Speaker 6: I got ten points of identification. Well, then I had
Speaker 6: my suspect because how his palm prints got in there
Speaker 6: could only be one way. He had to be in
Speaker 6: the apartment, and from there I made cases against him
Speaker 6: for the rape of I changed her name to Kosiski,
Speaker 6: but anyway, I made that case. And then a neighboring
Speaker 6: jurisdiction also had a rape similar mo. They weren't making
Speaker 6: any headway, and I called him and asked if they
Speaker 6: wanted me to assist him with it, and they said, well,
Speaker 6: we'll get back to you, and they get tied up
Speaker 6: whether the cases. The victim in their case read that
Speaker 6: I had arrested LaBelle in a newspaper and they called
Speaker 6: and said. The victim called and said, can you work
Speaker 6: our case for us? And they said I can't. I said,
Speaker 6: it's not my jurisdiction, but I said, I will call
Speaker 6: that jurisdiction. I'll talk to the chief and see if
Speaker 6: I can assist him. And she asked me, she said,
Speaker 6: do you think it's the same guy. I said, yeah,
Speaker 6: I almost bet it's the same guy. I called the
Speaker 6: chief and to my surprise, he said yeah. He says,
Speaker 6: please feel free to work. If we don't have a suspect,
Speaker 6: we'll give you anything you need. So I talked to
Speaker 6: the victim and he had worn a blue bandana, so
Speaker 6: she wasn't able to make an id from him. But
Speaker 6: it came to me in the process of talking to
Speaker 6: her that she was a very resolute and smart witness.
Speaker 6: I called her up and I said, I can't identify
Speaker 6: this guy because he wore a bandana. I said, could
Speaker 6: you recognize his voice? And she said, yeah, I think so.
Speaker 6: So I said, if I get recordings and play them,
Speaker 6: would you think you'd be able to recognize his voice
Speaker 6: on a recording? She said, I think so, And so'll
Speaker 6: do me a favor. Write down four or five phrases
Speaker 6: that he said exactly, and then I'll meet with you
Speaker 6: and we'll prepare basically a transcript and I'll see if
Speaker 6: I can, you know, get the sample, and then you
Speaker 6: can listen to and if you identify somebody, fine, If not,
Speaker 6: we'll keep going some other direction that the voice example
Speaker 6: are played it. She identified the guy immediately. They had
Speaker 6: five other voices on there, and she had no doubt
Speaker 6: it was him and made the case on it for
Speaker 6: the second case. But it was a very unique case.
Speaker 6: I don't know of any other case that's been solved
Speaker 6: in Nebraski history based on a voice exampire voice ID.
Speaker 5: I'd never as I mentioned before the interview, I'd never
Speaker 5: heard of anything like that, and I thought this was
Speaker 5: just the most incredible story of utilizing this body warrant
Speaker 5: to be able to do something like this, and at
Speaker 5: first you say that he's very hesitant. The perpetrator, Lebelle,
Speaker 5: was very hesitant to do this, but then he submits
Speaker 5: to it. You talk to his lawyer and can you
Speaker 5: explain that again why it was the duty of his
Speaker 5: lawyer to be able to honor that warrant.
Speaker 6: When I went down to the correction center where lebel
Speaker 6: was how at the time on my previous arrest for
Speaker 6: the palm print, I had to transcript with me in
Speaker 6: a tape recorder, and I sat him down and I said, look,
Speaker 6: I've got a body warrant here to get a voice
Speaker 6: sample from you. I showed him the warrant, gave it
Speaker 6: to him, you'd look right it over and he said,
Speaker 6: I'm not going to do it. And I said, well,
Speaker 6: you don't have a choice. They said, the judges signed that.
Speaker 6: I said, here's the transcript I want you to read.
Speaker 6: And he goes, that's some racist bullshit. I said no,
Speaker 6: I said, the other voices are also black. He said,
Speaker 6: oh are? They said, Well on, it's a black police officer,
Speaker 6: I know a couple of black deputies and a black
Speaker 6: city prosecutor. Head I'm not going to read it. And
Speaker 6: as you read the transcript, he really got upset. You
Speaker 6: could see him getting visibly upset because he realized that
Speaker 6: my victim from the neighboring jurisdiction's case had nailed him.
Speaker 6: I mean, she had his phrases down pat and then
Speaker 6: he just threw everything on the desk. He said, I'm
Speaker 6: not going to do it. So I handcuffed him, put
Speaker 6: him in my car, drove him two blocks north to
Speaker 6: the courthouse, where I just got in the body, warn't
Speaker 6: signed him, brought him before the judge. The judge told me,
Speaker 6: he goes, Look, he says, the guy he's already in jail.
Speaker 6: He said, the statue doesn't have a lot of teeth
Speaker 6: in it to force compliance. He goes, I don't know
Speaker 6: what the contempt citation would do for the guy who's
Speaker 6: already in jail. He can't post bond, so you know,
Speaker 6: he basically be spinning your wheels. I can't force to
Speaker 6: give you the voice examplar. So I thank the judge.
Speaker 6: I took the label back down to the correction center,
Speaker 6: grabbed him off, and I it'd seen on his papers
Speaker 6: from corrections that he had a defense attorney named Don Klein. Well.
Speaker 6: Don Klein was a former prosecutor who had left the
Speaker 6: Prosecutor's office went into private practice, and I knew Don
Speaker 6: from prior cases that I worked with him. So I
Speaker 6: called Don up and I said, hey, look, I've got
Speaker 6: a body warrant on your client. I need a voice examplar.
Speaker 6: And he's refusing to give it to me. And he said, okay,
Speaker 6: what's the docket and page number on the warrant? So
Speaker 6: I told him and I said, look, I gave label
Speaker 6: a copy of the warrant. He basically crumpled it up
Speaker 6: and threw it away, and I said, I need you
Speaker 6: to tell him to comply with this. You're an officer
Speaker 6: of the court. Could you do that for me? He goes, yeah,
Speaker 6: no problem. He said, I'll talk to him later on today.
Speaker 6: If I don't call you back tomorrow morning, he said,
Speaker 6: give me a call. I'm kind of busy with other cases.
Speaker 6: But he says, I'll get him to comply. So he
Speaker 6: went down. He talked to his client, LaBelle and Corrections,
Speaker 6: and he said, you got a body warn't it's legitimate.
Speaker 6: I can't tell you not to do it because I'm
Speaker 6: an officer of the court. There's a compelling reason to
Speaker 6: give it because the judge assigned it you need to
Speaker 6: give it to him. I called client up the next
Speaker 6: morning because I was anxious. I wanted to get it done,
Speaker 6: and he said, yeah, he said, I talked to him yesterday.
Speaker 6: He'll give you the sample today. Went back down there
Speaker 6: again and the guy was dragging his feet, but I
Speaker 6: just stayed with it. Took about an hour and a
Speaker 6: half to get him, to convince him to do it,
Speaker 6: and he balked at some of the more damaging or
Speaker 6: incriminating comments that he had to read, but he ultimately
Speaker 6: gave it to me. And once I had that, then
Speaker 6: I took the samples out, had the victim come in
Speaker 6: from the other jurisdiction, and she picked his name out
Speaker 6: of it. What's essentially a voice lineup of one suspect
Speaker 6: mixed in with four or five other people. Interesting case.
Speaker 5: Now, it's to add to this interest though it looks
Speaker 5: like all these heroic efforts and have resulted in this,
Speaker 5: you know, would be conviction here. What is the monkey
Speaker 5: wrench in this whole deal? Here? What happens?
Speaker 6: Well, the weakest case obviously was the voice identification, because
Speaker 6: there's no fingerprints, there were no eyewitness, she couldn't identify him,
Speaker 6: and the defense attorney was going to make a big
Speaker 6: deal out of the fact that she couldn't identify Hi
Speaker 6: because he wore a bandana. Was his understandable. They have
Speaker 6: to vigorously defend their client. So I lost track of
Speaker 6: the case because I was working other cases, and I
Speaker 6: seldom went to court to watch a trial unfold because
Speaker 6: I just didn't have the time, So I didn't pay
Speaker 6: much attention, and I didn't realize that the prosecuting attorney
Speaker 6: decided that he would arrange a plea bargain for LaBelle
Speaker 6: because my fingerprint or prom print case was so wrong,
Speaker 6: that LaBelle would plead guilty to that essentially one count,
Speaker 6: and they would drop the count for the victim from
Speaker 6: the other jurisdiction that made the voice identification. Well, she
Speaker 6: was in court with her husband and was just furious
Speaker 6: because the prosecutor didn't tell her that that was the case. Now,
Speaker 6: what the prosecutor did was as part of the plea arrangement,
Speaker 6: he said that even though he's only pleading to one case,
Speaker 6: the palmprint case, I'm going to enter into court for
Speaker 6: sentencing that he's also accused of the second crime, second rate,
Speaker 6: and that case is while a strong case is not
Speaker 6: being prosecutor. It's part of the plea arrangement. But that
Speaker 6: way the judge will know when it comes down to
Speaker 6: the sentence that he's actually involved in two rapes instead
Speaker 6: of just won. Well, to the victims sitting at court,
Speaker 6: it sounded like her case wasn't important because they dropped it.
Speaker 6: So I get a phone call from her and her
Speaker 6: husband hours later, and they're visibly upset. And I don't
Speaker 6: blame him, you know, you can understand where they're coming from.
Speaker 6: And then got on the phone he goes, I can't
Speaker 6: believe this. You know, my wife goes through this, and
Speaker 6: you did your job, and a prosecutor fell fell down
Speaker 6: on his And I said, well, let me call and
Speaker 6: find out what the logic was. And I called on
Speaker 6: and talked to the prosecutor. I said, look, you know,
Speaker 6: how about telling these people what's coming so they're not
Speaker 6: blindsided like that. Well, I understand. I kind of understand
Speaker 6: where the guy's coming from, because he's also got to
Speaker 6: hit the caseload. But I said, you know, these people
Speaker 6: felt that they weren't important enough for justice, justice to
Speaker 6: be served for them. He was, well, that's not the case.
Speaker 6: And I said, well, can you call them? Well, no,
Speaker 6: he never did. But the bottom line is I told him,
Speaker 6: I said, here's why, and they said, the bottom line is,
Speaker 6: and he comes up for sentencing in about six weeks.
Speaker 6: I said, he'll be sentenced for essentially two cases, yours
Speaker 6: and the other one. I said, So he's not getting
Speaker 6: off scott free, and I said, it saves your wife
Speaker 6: having to get on the stand and testify against him
Speaker 6: and being cross examined, which is an unpleasant experience sometimes
Speaker 6: in those cases. The interesting note on this case is
Speaker 6: that Earl of Bell excuse me, Earl we Bill. Yeah,
Speaker 6: he was just released in prison like two years ago.
Speaker 6: He was the longest serving inmate that I had in prison.
Speaker 6: He must have been a disciplined nightmare because he should
Speaker 6: have been out much earlier. But he's out, and hopefully
Speaker 6: he's old enough now where he's aged out of reoffending
Speaker 6: because he's a dangerous individual.
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Speaker 5: we were talking about your incredible book, and as it progresses,
Speaker 5: the examples of the four categories of rapist become even
Speaker 5: more extreme, more interesting, but far more disturbing. One of
Speaker 5: the most disturbing cases I've ever read about is this
Speaker 5: Thomas red and Nesbitt, a member of the Omaha chapter
Speaker 5: of the Hells Angels motorcycle Club. You talk about not
Speaker 5: to get too far into it, but you just describe
Speaker 5: some of the behavior of these outlaw motorcycle members. You
Speaker 5: refer to a term called sweeties. Tell us what sweeties
Speaker 5: is and introduce this Thomas red and Nesbit and what
Speaker 5: type of rapist category he falls into.
Speaker 6: Nesbit was a member of the Omaha Chapter of the
Speaker 6: Hell's Angels. For those who do not know, the Omah
Speaker 6: chapter was the first Hell's Angels chapter organized outside of California.
Speaker 6: It was the first extra territorial chapter that the Hell's
Speaker 6: Angels established, so there was a long history there. It's
Speaker 6: originally the chapters were in California only, but as a
Speaker 6: gang started to grow and expand, Omaha became one of
Speaker 6: his first chapters outside the state. They had a concept
Speaker 6: they viewed women as property in chattel. Sometimes they would
Speaker 6: trade women like they traded motorcycles. And Nesbitt was an anger,
Speaker 6: retaliatory type rapist. He viewed women as property that they
Speaker 6: owed him sex and ever he wanted it, and if
Speaker 6: he didn't get it, he would beat him up to
Speaker 6: take it, and there was no remorse, nothing like that.
Speaker 6: And the concept that the Angels operated under was that
Speaker 6: women in a bar that if a guy wanted a
Speaker 6: woman to grab her, take her home and rape her
Speaker 6: against her will, snatch her off a barstool or whatever.
Speaker 6: They called him. Sweeties. They were women that were brought
Speaker 6: to parties or tricked into being alone or secluded where
Speaker 6: an angel could rape him, and the sweeties term was
Speaker 6: an ironic term obviously, because they weren't sweet. Nothing sweet
Speaker 6: was going to happen to them. They were going to
Speaker 6: be victimized. And in case of Mary Kay Harmer that
Speaker 6: they write about the book, she was tricked into coming
Speaker 6: to one of the angels houses in Carter Lake, which
Speaker 6: is a city actually in Iowa, but it's on the
Speaker 6: adjacent to Omaha. And Nesbit had a girlfriend at the time,
Speaker 6: and he said, call up some of your high school
Speaker 6: friends and tell him you got a housewarming party and
Speaker 6: invite them over. And of course it was a trick
Speaker 6: to get innocent young girls there to the house where
Speaker 6: Nesbit and his neighbor, Wayne Bieber, who was also a
Speaker 6: Hell's Angel, could attack and rape them. So the girlfriend
Speaker 6: contacted some friends and Mary Kay Harmer was one of
Speaker 6: the girls, and she thought she was coming to a
Speaker 6: party with high school friends and didn't realize that it
Speaker 6: was all a setup for her to be she was
Speaker 6: a sweetie. It was all set up and was going
Speaker 6: to be raped, and because she fought back and was
Speaker 6: probably going to call the police to report the rape,
Speaker 6: Nesby decided to kill her.
Speaker 5: You talk about the involvement of this woman named Ray,
Speaker 5: and this is Nesbit says. You say, old lady again
Speaker 5: despite the threat of Hell's angels. Tell us, as you
Speaker 5: write in the book about Ray and why on Earth
Speaker 5: and how get in the crosshairs of the Hell's Angels.
Speaker 6: Well, there's a lot of psychological processes underway with women
Speaker 6: that decide to hook up with these angels. Sometimes it's
Speaker 6: low self esteem. Sometimes they've been victims of sadistic men
Speaker 6: in their past, raped or abused by loved one's father, husband, whatever.
Speaker 6: But essentially they cling to an outlaw biker like a
Speaker 6: Hell's Angel because it provides them with security and maybe
Speaker 6: a little bit of self esteem and some prestige in
Speaker 6: a six sort of way. She was attracted to the
Speaker 6: lifestyle because for one of those reasons, I don't know.
Speaker 6: I've never really talked to her about it, but the
Speaker 6: bottom line was that she was attracted to that. And
Speaker 6: she worked three or four jobs so that Nesbit could
Speaker 6: not work and basically was shiftless.
Speaker 7: With the.
Speaker 6: The house and do to open drink and ride his
Speaker 6: motorcycle and steal and thieve and sell dope, and and
Speaker 6: she paid the bills because she was at you know,
Speaker 6: one of these beaten women who kissed the hand of
Speaker 6: her abuser just so you would pay attention to it
Speaker 6: from time to time. I think at the time she
Speaker 6: had the three jobs and Nesba didn't have any job,
Speaker 6: and she paid all the bills while he could hang
Speaker 6: around with his game. But he's.
Speaker 5: So you have that is in terms of that night,
Speaker 5: she and another friend again the old lady of this
Speaker 5: Wayne Bieber, they are ordered to go pick up these sweeties.
Speaker 5: They are asked to invite their friends to lure their
Speaker 5: own friends to this party. At first it was this
Speaker 5: Jorgensen was was scheduled to go, but she changed her mind.
Speaker 5: So unfortunately, this harmer was interested in the drugs that
Speaker 5: that we've promised to be supplied there. Now Ray and
Speaker 5: this Bridget are It's an incredibly disturbing story because you
Speaker 5: have that this bridget is concerned that her old man
Speaker 5: is having sex with this woman that they're going to rape,
Speaker 5: so that she's going over to this house next door
Speaker 5: trying to interrupt what she believes is just her husband
Speaker 5: being adulteress rather than the horror that's actually being perpetrated
Speaker 5: on this young girl. Eventually, this woman has to go
Speaker 5: to work, so she has to go into the house.
Speaker 5: What does this lead to in terms of this person
Speaker 5: ray and what does she do as a result of
Speaker 5: all of this?
Speaker 6: Well, did you say she had to go to work?
Speaker 6: So she finally forced her way into the house, and
Speaker 6: she saw blood on the floor and went into the
Speaker 6: bathroom and Nesbit and Biaber the Hell's Angels, when they
Speaker 6: yelled at her to get out of the bathroom, and
Speaker 6: they said, did you see her? Well, if shower curtain
Speaker 6: was pulled, So she claimed that she never saw anything.
Speaker 6: But what they had done is they they're smart enough
Speaker 6: to know that they contained the mess. If you're going
Speaker 6: to kill somebody, to do it in the bathtub where
Speaker 6: you can wash down the after effects of a killing
Speaker 6: in the drain. So she said she never saw the
Speaker 6: body that the shower curtains pulled. She got yelled at
Speaker 6: to get out of there, so she did. But she
Speaker 6: saw blood in the kitchen, saw blood other locations in
Speaker 6: the house, and said that she had to go to work,
Speaker 6: so she left, having to her recollection, never her claim
Speaker 6: had never seen the body. She got home that night
Speaker 6: after working and found out that the house had been
Speaker 6: thoroughly cleaned with bleach and sanitized, and all of the
Speaker 6: bed linens had been washed, and some carpet had been
Speaker 6: torn up and was now missing from the floor, and
Speaker 6: she didn't realize it at the time, or claimed she
Speaker 6: didn't realize it, But Biaber and Nesbud had rolled up
Speaker 6: Mary Kay Harmer's body and the carpet, and they had
Speaker 6: carried it next door to Bieber's house and hid it
Speaker 6: in the garage because they knew that eventually the police
Speaker 6: are going to come to the house looking for Mary
Speaker 6: Kay Harmer, so sure as heck that day, then the
Speaker 6: family gets notified by Jorgenson. Harmer's roommate, Harmon, never came home,
Speaker 6: so they called the police. It was a sheriff's department
Speaker 6: because the place she lived was outside the city limits
Speaker 6: at the time. Detectives went to the location and asked
Speaker 6: permission to search, and of course Nesbit had nothing to
Speaker 6: hide because he knew full well that Mary Kay Harmer,
Speaker 6: the victim, was next door rolled up in a roll
Speaker 6: of carpet. They had stripped her, washed her body, cleaned it,
Speaker 6: and burned her closed. Bieber had burned her clothed in
Speaker 6: a burn barrel in the backyard. Detectives searched the house,
Speaker 6: didn't find anything obviously, and went their way, and then
Speaker 6: she was missing for nine years. What had happened was
Speaker 6: they found a manhole, unused manhole, about half a block
Speaker 6: away from the house, in an industrial area that wasn't
Speaker 6: built up, dump her down there, poured lie on her
Speaker 6: with the mistaken assumption that it was going to dissolve things,
Speaker 6: and it didn't, and essentially her family suffered for nine
Speaker 6: years not knowing what had happened to her, had no
Speaker 6: word of where she was. The two old ladies from
Speaker 6: the Hells Angels weren't talking for obvious reasons. They were afraid.
Speaker 6: But Nesbit and his girlfriend fled Omaha. They moved to
Speaker 6: Chicago and changed their name because they were worried obviously
Speaker 6: that the police are looking at him, and Bieber and
Speaker 6: his girlfriend they fled. They went to ended up in
Speaker 6: the suburb of San Diego, and then of course when
Speaker 6: the body turned up, then the heat started again because
Speaker 6: now they had a crime for sure, because they had
Speaker 6: the body would look like two bullet holes in the head,
Speaker 6: and it opened the case again. The body was found
Speaker 6: by Yes survey crew. The survey crew popped the manhole
Speaker 6: and to their surprise there was a skeleton in the bottom. Obviously,
Speaker 6: they called the police right away, processed the scene, recovered
Speaker 6: the body and started checking this in persons and we
Speaker 6: could tell you from the nature of the body that
Speaker 6: it was a female early twenties, late teens. And right
Speaker 6: away Mike captain at the time Tim Dempsey, who had
Speaker 6: worked the case as a young detective, he said, this
Speaker 6: could be Mary Kay Harmer because the Hell's Angels houses
Speaker 6: are like one hundred yards from this manhole. Would have
Speaker 6: been a good place to dumper in the middle of
Speaker 6: the night. Nobody would see him that type of thing.
Speaker 6: In the process or in the meantime, red Nesbit the
Speaker 6: killer had fled to South America. He used the Sell's
Speaker 6: Angels connections to get a phony passport on Their last
Speaker 6: name was Stein. I think it was Michael or Thomas Stein.
Speaker 6: He fled to Brazil and him and his Angel buddies
Speaker 6: down there helped the Brazil Hills Angels get their chapters
Speaker 6: started down there. Well. After a while, they get tired
Speaker 6: of living down in Brazil, so he came back to
Speaker 6: Chicago area where it was originally from. Using the phony
Speaker 6: passport and the phony name and promptly started cooking meth.
Speaker 6: The DEA had a clever sting going at the time.
Speaker 6: They would monitor bulk purchases of the chemicals, the precursor
Speaker 6: chemicals used to make meth, and if they noticed that
Speaker 6: people were buying these, they would conduct an investigation to
Speaker 6: see if these people were in the process of using
Speaker 6: these chemicals legitimately or if they were in the process
Speaker 6: of manufacturing meth. And they set this company up in
Speaker 6: Chicago called North Central Interstate Chemicals or something, which the
Speaker 6: abbreviation for the word of the company was NCIC, which
Speaker 6: is ironic because that's also the name of the computerized
Speaker 6: system that held the warrant for Thomas Nesbit for murder.
Speaker 6: Flipping back a little bit after the body was found
Speaker 6: and they got a warrant for Nesbit, couldn't find him
Speaker 6: because he was in Brazil obviously, but eventually came back
Speaker 6: home and had a phony name, and he'd been told
Speaker 6: by other angels that the body had been found, so
Speaker 6: he was laying low, but he couldn't resist cooking meth.
Speaker 6: And so they started ordering chemicals from NCIC, a chemical company,
Speaker 6: and they had a chemist for DEEA would look at
Speaker 6: the hoarders and extrapolate from the purchases what quantity of
Speaker 6: meth was being produced and that type of thing. So
Speaker 6: they started survailing the people that were buying these things,
Speaker 6: and it turned out that one of the people involved
Speaker 6: in the purchase was a Brazilian woman named Anna I
Speaker 6: remember her last name, And so Thomas the Silva and
Speaker 6: Thomas Nesbit's brother, they followed him to a house in Indiana,
Speaker 6: a kind of a suburb of Chicago, set up a
Speaker 6: surveillance and arrested them and said who's the cook, who's
Speaker 6: the chef, and they said, well, it's Mike Stein, still
Speaker 6: using Nesbitt alias. They talked to the owner of the property.
Speaker 6: He said, yeah, I rented this to a guy named Stein,
Speaker 6: and no, I had no idea what they were doing
Speaker 6: with the property, but you know, I rent a lot
Speaker 6: of properties and his name was Michael Stein. Didn't anything
Speaker 6: out of Michael Stein because it's a fictitious name. So
Speaker 6: eventually he ended up arresting Stein. He found a lot
Speaker 6: of chemicals, a lot of meth in the house, and
Speaker 6: they booked him under the name Stein. Well, the next
Speaker 6: day in court that he came clean. He goes, now
Speaker 6: I'm tom Nesbitt. He said he might be looking for
Speaker 6: me for murder in Omaha, and that's how they linked
Speaker 6: him to the case.
Speaker 5: And what was the result of all of that.
Speaker 6: He has stood trying, He stood trial and got convicted.
Speaker 6: He didn't have money for an attorney, he claimed he
Speaker 6: did in any way. So one of the best criminal
Speaker 6: defense attorneys in town is head of the public Defender's office.
Speaker 6: He defended him, and he was convicted. He's filed four,
Speaker 6: maybe five different appeals and lost each one. Sentence to
Speaker 6: life in prison without parole. So he's going to die
Speaker 6: behind the walls and the state Penitentiary in Lincoln, Nebraska.
Speaker 5: Deservedly. Let's talk about one more incredible case, the Christina
Speaker 5: O'Day rape murder. You call it the babysity the babysitter killers.
Speaker 5: And you say this is by far the most brutal. Well,
Speaker 5: a judge in this case that it was by far
Speaker 5: the most brutal murder trial he's ever heard.
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Speaker 5: Tell us about this killer and what type of just
Speaker 5: this killer is? Before we talk about Christina Day and
Speaker 5: Martha Beshawan.
Speaker 6: And Christina o' day was a young high school girl.
Speaker 6: A friend of the family needed a babysitter to watch
Speaker 6: a young child six years old. I believe at the
Speaker 6: time because the mother was recently divorced or was no
Speaker 6: longer married. I don't know if it was a divorced
Speaker 6: or death in the family or whatever. But the mother
Speaker 6: was working nights, and so she needed somebody to come
Speaker 6: in and babysit in the house overnight while the child slept,
Speaker 6: and get the child up in the morning to go
Speaker 6: to school. She knew the mother knew this Oday family
Speaker 6: and trusted them, and so she hired Christina to come
Speaker 6: into the house every night Monday through Friday, spend the
Speaker 6: night there, get the child up in the morning, feed
Speaker 6: her dresser, get her off to school. Well, Christina o'
Speaker 6: day knew a couple of guys and from high school.
Speaker 6: One of them was no longer attending high The other
Speaker 6: guy she didn't know, but he had worked with this
Speaker 6: I'm trying to think of what his name is. Garza
Speaker 6: knew this guards a kid from high school. Garza had
Speaker 6: dropped out of high school, and he knew that Christino
Speaker 6: Day was spending the night in his house. So he
Speaker 6: came over to the house one night, But it was
Speaker 6: a night that the mother happened to be home, so
Speaker 6: he was basically told to leave. The mother didn't marshall Bouchan.
Speaker 6: The mother didn't think too much of it. She basically said, well,
Speaker 6: who's at the door ten o'clock at night and Christino
Speaker 6: dasa some kid named Michael Garza, and why was he here? Well,
Speaker 6: he knew me and I told him he couldn't be here,
Speaker 6: So the mother basically chased the kid away. The next night,
Speaker 6: he came back two o'clock in the morning with a
Speaker 6: guy named Wayne Brewer that he met. Both were working
Speaker 6: at a Kentucky Fried Chicken at on the west end
Speaker 6: of town. They broke in. Garza broke in and cut
Speaker 6: the phone line at the back of the house. Went
Speaker 6: in the house, supposedly to steal things to pawn so
Speaker 6: he could get money to pay his car insurance. But
Speaker 6: once he got in there, he let brew her into
Speaker 6: the front door. Of course, Christina a Day and the
Speaker 6: six year old girl is sleeping. They have no idea.
Speaker 6: He goes upstairs. He wakes up Christina a Day, ties
Speaker 6: her up, strips her naked, ties her to the bed,
Speaker 6: puts the gag on her, and beats her and then
Speaker 6: rapes her and sodomizes her. He goes down and he
Speaker 6: ridicules Wayne Brewer. He didn't want anything to do with
Speaker 6: the race. Brewer goes up and he assaults her, wapes her,
Speaker 6: and then Garza decides he's going to kill her because
Speaker 6: he can't leave a witness. In the process, the young girl,
Speaker 6: the six year old, had awakened and he went into
Speaker 6: her room with Christina o Day by the wrist, holding
Speaker 6: her by the wrist and said tell her it's okay,
Speaker 6: it's you know, to calm down. We're going to be
Speaker 6: leaving soon, and please go back to sleep. So the
Speaker 6: little i went back to sleep. Garza got a twelve
Speaker 6: inch butcher knife from the kitchen and basically stabbed cut
Speaker 6: Christino a Day so she bled to death. He piled
Speaker 6: up some items like a VCR and some other items
Speaker 6: was going to steal by the front door. He had
Speaker 6: taken a taken a door closer, hydrawl a door closer
Speaker 6: off the front door, and had beat her with that,
Speaker 6: so the assault was very very brutal. In the process,
Speaker 6: Christino Day bled to death, and then Brewer her guards
Speaker 6: and Brewer Brewer when they flooded and and bothered taking
Speaker 6: the items, they reportedly went in to steal. But the
Speaker 6: next morning the little girl got out, she heard the
Speaker 6: alarm going off in the room, looked inside and saw
Speaker 6: her babysitter laying there. And I was scared to death.
Speaker 6: So she went to a neighbor's house and said, I
Speaker 6: think something bad has happened to my babysitter. They called
Speaker 6: nine on one the patrol deab. He showed up and
Speaker 6: realized they had a homicide. That's when the case started.
Speaker 5: It's interesting and it's horrifying to realize that as you
Speaker 5: bring the reader in that the girls runs from home
Speaker 5: to home and nobody answering that doorbell, and then finally
Speaker 5: she's there seeing the horror and listening to the babysitter
Speaker 5: being tortured and raped and assaulted. So how does the
Speaker 5: how did the police get to find out about Wayne
Speaker 5: Brewer and Garza?
Speaker 6: Well, we first thing you do is you talk to
Speaker 6: the people closest to the victim, in this case, her
Speaker 6: mother and also the mother of the six year old girl.
Speaker 6: And in the process she said, well, there were two
Speaker 6: boys here at the house last a couple of nights ago,
Speaker 6: and she described him as Wayne, or not Wayne, but Garza,
Speaker 6: and so with that name then they were able to
Speaker 6: look at him as a possible suspect. They went to
Speaker 6: where he worked and they said who does he hang
Speaker 6: around with here? And they said, well, he worked with
Speaker 6: a guy named Wayne Brewers, so now they had the
Speaker 6: other name started looking for these two kids, and in
Speaker 6: the process, Garza went underground. He fled as Stanley was
Speaker 6: actively hiding him and Brewer, to his credit, his mother said,
Speaker 6: I'll bring him in to talk to you. Brought Brewer
Speaker 6: into the Sheriff's department headquarters and sat him down and
Speaker 6: started interviewing him, and eventually he confessed, and that's when
Speaker 6: we had the details of the case because he said, yeah,
Speaker 6: it was me and Garza and we'd gone in there.
Speaker 6: Garza broke into the back window and basically laid out
Speaker 6: the whole scene, points of events with in graphic detail.
Speaker 6: Brewer at the time was eighteen, so when he got sentenced,
Speaker 6: he got sentenced to life without parole. But Garza was
Speaker 6: sixteen or seventeen at the time. So they had a
Speaker 6: Supreme Court ruling that came up a number of years ago,
Speaker 6: so he had to be resentenced because they said it
Speaker 6: wasn't fair to a juvenile to sentence him to an
Speaker 6: adult sentence because his brain wasn't fully formed, and so
Speaker 6: they had to resentence him.
Speaker 5: It was concerning for the family, but he did receive
Speaker 5: a sentence that essentially will his first parole date might
Speaker 5: be when he's sixty five years old. And yes, that's
Speaker 5: his eligibility. So that's his eligibility, right, It doesn't mean
Speaker 5: you'll get out, but yeah.
Speaker 6: The judge in the case, Burkhart, had seen a lot
Speaker 6: of murder cases in Omaha, says he had presided over
Speaker 6: a lot of murder cases. He made the commedy said
Speaker 6: this was by far the most brutal murder case he'd
Speaker 6: ever seen. And for us who had worked at ben
Speaker 6: to the autopsy and then to the crime scene and
Speaker 6: stuff we concur with it. It's a needlessly brutal and
Speaker 6: again part of that sadistic thing where you beat somebody
Speaker 6: beyond they call it expressive rage, or you know, you
Speaker 6: have utilitarian rage or the type of stab wounds for example,
Speaker 6: that will kill a person. You stab them two or
Speaker 6: three times, then you stop. But when you have somebody
Speaker 6: that beat somebody with a door closer and gags them
Speaker 6: so they can't breathe, and they cut their wrists so
Speaker 6: they bleed to death and stuff, that's overkill and that's
Speaker 6: a sign of the sickness of the person that's committing
Speaker 6: that crime.
Speaker 5: It was interesting too and fascinating when you talk about
Speaker 5: the mother bringing him in, and they both came in
Speaker 5: eventually with mothers. It was it's always the mother, but
Speaker 5: he came in with the mother, and first tea he
Speaker 5: denied it, but then the mother. He had to talk
Speaker 5: with his mother and she basically said tell him, tell
Speaker 5: him him what you did, tell him what happened, and
Speaker 5: later she tried to defend her son from the death penalty.
Speaker 5: But it's very interesting that you got to watch that
Speaker 5: as detectives question Brewer.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I was watching through the two way mirror and
Speaker 6: it was interesting because the mother came up and said, look,
Speaker 6: I need to talk to him again. We agreed that
Speaker 6: he would come in here and tell you everything he
Speaker 6: knew and let me talk to him again, because one
Speaker 6: of the detectives had gone to her and said, look,
Speaker 6: he's not cooperating with us. Can you help us out?
Speaker 6: And she said, do we need even know what happened?
Speaker 6: And she said yeah, I said he was. We agreed
Speaker 6: on the way down here that he was going to
Speaker 6: come in and tell the truth. So she went in
Speaker 6: and with the detective sitting there, and she said, Wayne,
Speaker 6: you know, you know what we talked about you were
Speaker 6: going to come down here and do the right thing
Speaker 6: and tell these people what happened. So after that, Wayne
Speaker 6: Brewer shoulder started to slump. He leaned forward. You could
Speaker 6: tell he was resigned to giving up the information and
Speaker 6: ultimately confessed and played exactly what happened, who was involved
Speaker 6: in when, and what they did afterwards and in the
Speaker 6: ensuing days after he was charged, he actually called detectives
Speaker 6: back a number of times and took them to different
Speaker 6: spots so they had thrown things. So he assisted for
Speaker 6: quite a few days, and then eventually when the mother
Speaker 6: and the family learned exactly how serious it was that
Speaker 6: he was facing the potential death penalty, she changed her
Speaker 6: mind and said in court that nowd a chorus. Then
Speaker 6: they tricked him, and of course he was on tape,
Speaker 6: so it was pretty hard to prove that he'd been
Speaker 6: tricked or anything. But you know that's understandable. The mother's
Speaker 6: trying to defend her child.
Speaker 5: Sure, yeah, certainly you had to attend Christino Day's autopsy again,
Speaker 5: very difficult, wasn't it.
Speaker 6: Yeah, you know, I've been to a lot of autopsies
Speaker 6: as a detective. You know, that's a stock in trade.
Speaker 6: That's one of the things you do is you go
Speaker 6: to the autopsy. But to see a young girl there
Speaker 6: in the prime of her life, with all the potential
Speaker 6: that youth holds, to see there's such a needless waste.
Speaker 6: That really bothered me a lot.
Speaker 5: You talk about too, that Michael Garza, his brother, and
Speaker 5: his cousin were all convicted of attempted rape before Christino
Speaker 5: Day's murder. So it was at least the mindset was
Speaker 5: among family members and relatives, wasn't it.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I heard. I don't know for sure, but I
Speaker 6: heard that his father was in a prison in another
Speaker 6: state for sexual assault also, so there's there's some family
Speaker 6: dynamic there too, because the brother was involved in a rape,
Speaker 6: Michael Garza was involved in a rape murder. The father
Speaker 6: reportedly was also a rapist, and you know, so you've
Speaker 6: got something going on that just doesn't happen. That there's
Speaker 6: some dynamic there impacting that family. And it's hard to
Speaker 6: say if it was a father or something else. But
Speaker 6: that's not more.
Speaker 5: You have a part of the book you call the conclusion.
Speaker 5: What can you tell us that you can conclude after
Speaker 5: thirty years of service and experience with again, as we
Speaker 5: mentioned some of the most heinous, psychopathic rapist murderers in
Speaker 5: the nation. What do you conclude.
Speaker 6: Well, I conclude that it's lucky for us that they're
Speaker 6: a very small percentage of the population. But the damage
Speaker 6: they do, or the potential for damage that they can do,
Speaker 6: is beyond imagination. And people tell me that if they
Speaker 6: read the book, they had trouble sleeping, nightmares, that type
Speaker 6: of thing. Because I get pretty graphic in it. I
Speaker 6: want to explain to the reader exactly what these victims
Speaker 6: go through and the whorees that they face. But I
Speaker 6: guess the key the thing to remember is that these
Speaker 6: people walk among us. They look just like you and I.
Speaker 6: You're sociopaths, and they have no conscience, no ampithy for
Speaker 6: anybody else. And you know, if they get a chance
Speaker 6: to use you for some purpose, they will without batting
Speaker 6: an eye. And sometimes they're violent. Oftentimes there are a
Speaker 6: lot of serial killers associopaths, and the damage the potential
Speaker 6: for damage that they inflict on society's horrendous, and people
Speaker 6: need to be aware of the fact that they don't
Speaker 6: look like monsters. They look like you and I.
Speaker 5: You also talk about the language. It was fascinating throughout
Speaker 5: the theme of this whole book is that almost every
Speaker 5: type of rapist in those categories use the same kind
Speaker 5: of language of I won't hurt you if you comply,
Speaker 5: otherwise I'll kill you if you don't do what I
Speaker 5: tell you. Is the lesson in most of these cases
Speaker 5: to comply was a good idea.
Speaker 6: Well, it's difficult to say, because if you resist a
Speaker 6: power reassurance rapist, the least violent of them, they will
Speaker 6: generally flee because their fantasy in committing these rapes doesn't
Speaker 6: include violence. So if you start to destroy that fantasy
Speaker 6: by resisting or fighting back violently, suddenly the reason for
Speaker 6: committing the rape, the power and control, the fantasy involved, disappears,
Speaker 6: and so they'll wait. They'll find somebody who's not going
Speaker 6: to resist. But the danger is if you try to
Speaker 6: resist an anger excitation rapist like Thomas red Nesbitt, the
Speaker 6: Hell's Angel, he'll just overcome your resistance with more resistance,
Speaker 6: potentially rising to the level of lethal violence. He doesn't care.
Speaker 6: I mean, he's gonna get his He's going to take
Speaker 6: what he wants from you, and if you fight back,
Speaker 6: he feels entitled to overcome your resistance, but they will
Speaker 6: buy whatever means necessary. And of course, if you're you
Speaker 6: have the misfortune of running into an anger excitation rapist,
Speaker 6: the sadistic rapist. He feeds off of the fear and stuff,
Speaker 6: so you know, you fight back. In that case, you
Speaker 6: probably going to be doomed because he's going to click
Speaker 6: as much pain and suffering on you as he desires,
Speaker 6: because that's what he's into it for. But also in
Speaker 6: the process, his ultimate goal may be to kill you
Speaker 6: as the ultimate form of control. Because some of these
Speaker 6: guys have actually choked the person to the point where
Speaker 6: they pass out and then revived them to again choke
Speaker 6: them to the point of near death and then revive
Speaker 6: them again because that's the ultimate turn on for him.
Speaker 6: That's suffering that he feeds off them. But you know,
Speaker 6: people need to be aware there are people out there,
Speaker 6: dangerous evil people, and they walk among us. You can't
Speaker 6: spot him because they don't have horns sticking out of
Speaker 6: their head or they don't have a big red e
Speaker 6: on their forehead for evil.
Speaker 5: Yes, absolutely, I want to thank you very much for
Speaker 5: coming on and talking about evil desires. The recollections of
Speaker 5: a sex crime detective. It's been fascinating. Dean, tell us
Speaker 5: how they might take a look at this book. Is
Speaker 5: there a Facebook page or an Amazon page? Tell us
Speaker 5: about that.
Speaker 6: There is an Amazon page under authors under Dean t Olson. Also,
Speaker 6: the book is at Genius book Publishing dot com. But
Speaker 6: if you go to Amazon and you type in Evil
Speaker 6: Desire or even Dean t Olson, it'll come up. I
Speaker 6: think it's a fascinating read only because what I try
Speaker 6: to do for the reader is lay out the gritty,
Speaker 6: nasty details that people don't see on TV, because they
Speaker 6: wanted them to be aware of what these poor victims
Speaker 6: go through. And hopefully they'll find it as interesting as
Speaker 6: a lot of people have told me they found it,
Speaker 6: and maybe they can learn something about the evil that
Speaker 6: treads our existence in the process.
Speaker 5: Absolutely, it's a fascinating book, and you take the reader
Speaker 5: absolutely inside all of these horrible details and in the
Speaker 5: minds of these psychopathic rapist murderers. It's a fascinating book.
Speaker 5: I want to thank you very much for coming on
Speaker 5: and talking about Evil Desires the Recollections of a sex
Speaker 5: crime Detective. Thank you very much, Dean t Olson. You
Speaker 5: have a great night, all right, Thanks Adam, thank you.
Speaker 5: Good night