Speaker 1: Welcome to men, Sex and Tantra.
Speaker 2: Discover where your parents, porn and religion never taught you
Speaker 2: about being a man and having extraordinary sex. Get ready
Speaker 2: to have your mind blown and your world rocked. And
Speaker 2: we're back. And anybody who watches this show long enough
Speaker 2: knows that it's usually a four episode kind of the
Speaker 2: same guest four episodes. But yes, Jay Matthias Bennett is
Speaker 2: back with us. He hasn't run right screaming yet. That's
Speaker 2: so awesome. I always wait for some guests to like
Speaker 2: lose it in between. You know, we shoot these back
Speaker 2: to back four episodes, and there are a couple of
Speaker 2: guests who've been like, WHOA about episode three. They're starting
Speaker 2: to go, uh, the vulnerability starts piling up, something starts happening,
Speaker 2: and then they're starting to think, Wow, do I actually
Speaker 2: want to share that I was on this show? You know,
Speaker 2: things get real, but most have courage. So I'm really curious.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna be curious about this because a lot of
Speaker 2: the these conversations may start out. We always start out with
Speaker 2: this kind of high level let's talk about this thing.
Speaker 2: They can evolve, they can go off course, they can
Speaker 2: get led in different directions. And I always prefer not
Speaker 2: to know everything that my guests might know or think
Speaker 2: or whatever on a topic, because then I get surprised,
Speaker 2: and that surprises always fun leads to all sorts of
Speaker 2: different things. Well, agreed, disagree doesn't matter to me. So
Speaker 2: this topic, the truth, is a really interesting one for me,
Speaker 2: And I imagine that this conversation is going to be
Speaker 2: interesting because we may or may not agree on the
Speaker 2: definitions or what it is that we go to here.
Speaker 2: You know, we'll find out, because that's part of the fun.
Speaker 2: So to truth, You've heard me say, I like defining
Speaker 2: words that can be like so broad, nobody freaking knows
Speaker 2: what they actually mean. The truth like from your because
Speaker 2: that's one of your values. This is one of these
Speaker 2: premises like in the book, and everything is right coming
Speaker 2: back to the truth. So yep, waiting with dated breath.
Speaker 1: Waiting with dated breath. Okay, well, I think, uh. What
Speaker 1: immediately comes to mind is back in the Indiana Jones
Speaker 1: the opening scene of Indiana Jones. I can't remember. Maybe
Speaker 1: it's the third one where he's like, there's a difference
Speaker 1: between truth and he writes it on the blackboard and facts.
Speaker 1: He writes so historical. Let's say larger more ads to
Speaker 1: abstract truth and verifiable archaeological facts that.
Speaker 2: Are there out change when science changes.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, okay, reinterpretive, rehash or whatever, right right?
Speaker 1: And you know, yeah, mmmm, it's interesting because it's such
Speaker 1: a it's such a broad you know. It's kind of
Speaker 1: similarly like almost asking like what is your definition for
Speaker 1: the word love? Ye?
Speaker 2: Right?
Speaker 1: It is so it is so broad. I mean, what
Speaker 1: what comes to mind at this immediate moment which is arising?
Speaker 1: And it is interesting that truth is my number one
Speaker 1: value and yet and yet I don't have a dictionary
Speaker 1: definition or at least definition off the off the cuff
Speaker 1: of what it is. However, the thing is is like
Speaker 1: what a just for me at the moment? And this
Speaker 1: might be become a little bit clear, become clearer. Is
Speaker 1: it's like to me, truth is that which is in
Speaker 1: greatest fidelity to reality? Hm?
Speaker 2: Hm right, let's say that again.
Speaker 1: Sure, that which is in greatest fidelity yeah, to reality?
Speaker 2: Right? And wow, so we could parse that fidelity, We
Speaker 2: could parse that reality. So this becomes like wow.
Speaker 1: Right, so so you could have for example, now now
Speaker 1: I'm maybe getting on a role here, Uh you could
Speaker 1: have fidelity. You could you could take a picture with
Speaker 1: a crappy old school camera and it and you know,
Speaker 1: a digital camera and it could be a grainy bit
Speaker 1: resolution right of this digital picture, but it all looks pixelated.
Speaker 1: Is that a picture of whatever the light or the
Speaker 1: scene or whatever. Yes, does it? But is it the
Speaker 1: greatest fidelity to that scene? No, because it's low resolution. Okay, right,
Speaker 1: So then then what is reality? Well, at least you know,
Speaker 1: for many people, reality is the the physical world we
Speaker 1: can touch. The scientific materialism. Oh, there's there's no God,
Speaker 1: there's no consciousness. There's just kind of molecules as building
Speaker 1: blocks that kind of happened to arrange themselves in interesting
Speaker 1: you know ways because of evolution. There's no organizing divine
Speaker 1: principle behind that. No, no, but we all know that
Speaker 1: that's well we know actually science says that even physical
Speaker 1: things actually mostly empty space. Right, So then you so
Speaker 1: long story, Shirt, I would define in a certain way,
Speaker 1: reality is not just the physical things that we can see,
Speaker 1: but but the multi dimensional reality that is actually most
Speaker 1: that is actually to us as humans, mostly imperceptible.
Speaker 2: So then what you're saying is your truth is in
Speaker 2: is in fidelity in within videlity to the unperceptive like us.
Speaker 2: And now now now what the hell like like like right?
Speaker 1: So so let's let's let's bring it, bring it home
Speaker 1: and make it, make it real, make it as simple
Speaker 1: using you know is is in a certain way. If
Speaker 1: you imagine like a line, what is it like a
Speaker 1: curve of going to a line of like an assymp
Speaker 1: tote it like geometry. You could have a curve and
Speaker 1: it gets closer and closer and closer and closer to
Speaker 1: the line, but it actually doesn't touch it. So I
Speaker 1: think that's for for me and my relationship with truth.
Speaker 1: There's no arrival at capital t truth. How could there be?
Speaker 1: The universe is freaking infinite. Our ability in our capacity
Speaker 1: is so small. We we you know, our potential is
Speaker 1: absolutely absolutely infinite. And and so the more we're able
Speaker 1: to lean in to, first of all, having courage to
Speaker 1: understand and to see what is actually obviously in our faces,
Speaker 1: that's one thing. The next level is to lean into
Speaker 1: those things that we cannot yet understand. We that we know,
Speaker 1: we have a sense is true, but we can't quite
Speaker 1: put our finger on why we think. And we have
Speaker 1: this deep knowing that is true. And so this is
Speaker 1: why as the next logical thing is is, I would say,
Speaker 1: is to be curious about the truth and to have
Speaker 1: a level of curiosity where it's not like a legalistic
Speaker 1: you know, here's the truth or kind of this thing,
Speaker 1: but you know, you're like a child like, oh wow,
Speaker 1: why does that thing happen? Or why does yeah, looking
Speaker 1: at phenomena and just really wondering, without any without bringing
Speaker 1: a bunch of thoughts or reasoning or conceptual models, just
Speaker 1: to actually experience the thing and its purity and to
Speaker 1: be in a state of state of awe.
Speaker 2: About it my favorite state. H So I when I
Speaker 2: assign values, you know, and I work with people and
Speaker 2: you do this as well, like because in your book,
Speaker 2: I you know, I was reading that. I've been delighted
Speaker 2: to get the sneak peak of the book and read
Speaker 2: some chapters, and you know, assign your values weirdly enough
Speaker 2: for somebody who is pretty much all about fairness, and
Speaker 2: you know the this is how it goes. I don't
Speaker 2: have honesty, your truth on my value my first five
Speaker 2: values at all, and one of the reasons is because
Speaker 2: mostly we want honesty. It's not about us, it's about
Speaker 2: other people. So the reason we want truth and honesty
Speaker 2: is because we never want to feel stupid and if
Speaker 2: other people aren't telling us the truth or aren't being honest,
Speaker 2: and that goes back to the fact that we lie
Speaker 2: to ourselves like fucking all day long. So know that
Speaker 2: everybody else lies to us as well. So there is
Speaker 2: no like truth. What the fuck is actual truth? It's
Speaker 2: a moving target that and if for the spiritual crowd,
Speaker 2: their truth moves in nanoseconds like oh I love you,
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, no, that was my truth five minutes ago.
Speaker 2: But I'm you know, I hate you now, like holy crap.
Speaker 2: And then there's triggers. We think our truth is our triggers.
Speaker 2: So there's a hole like, to me, this is such
Speaker 2: a such a like quagmire of swampy you know. Mess.
Speaker 2: So there's a great story that just happened that I
Speaker 2: just wrote about on Facebook. But my housemate and I
Speaker 2: just went through regarding the truth, that is fucking hilarious. Okay,
Speaker 2: So we bought this really special cheese. I'm like, he goes, wow,
Speaker 2: it's pull this out to grill burgers on and I'm
Speaker 2: like awesome. So you know he's he's asking me how
Speaker 2: much to cut, and so you know, I'm looking at
Speaker 2: the cheese and he's cutting it. I'm like, oh, that's good.
Speaker 2: So then you know, I'm out there doing the burgers. Ready,
Speaker 2: he brings the cheese, play do you need more? I'm like,
Speaker 2: now we got it. I remember how many pieces I
Speaker 2: put on there because I'm arranging it because they're not
Speaker 2: like slices. You know, I'm coming to range like tetris
Speaker 2: right here on the burgers so that they all have
Speaker 2: the right amount of cheese. And I go clean up later.
Speaker 2: I don't remember putting the cheese away. So the next day,
Speaker 2: Kevin whoops up in the refrigerator. He pulls out this
Speaker 2: container with cheese in it, and he goes, so should
Speaker 2: we use this for today? You know, the special cheese?
Speaker 2: And he goes, this is it right? He whips open
Speaker 2: the lid. I look at it, see serrations on it
Speaker 2: that looks like grating, and I go, no, that's not
Speaker 2: the cheese, that's the parmesan. Oh okay, okay. So he
Speaker 2: puts it back and then I'm like, he goes, well,
Speaker 2: where is the cheese? He goes, do we eat it
Speaker 2: all on me?
Speaker 1: No?
Speaker 2: No, no, I remember that you know there was this
Speaker 2: much left of the cheese and he goes, well, I
Speaker 2: said I didn't put it away. You were the one
Speaker 2: that last saw it. And he goes, I don't know.
Speaker 2: So now I'm going through the fridge and I'm pulling
Speaker 2: stuff out. It's not there, Like, how the fuck could
Speaker 2: it not be there? So then I go through and
Speaker 2: I touch every single thing in the fridge and the
Speaker 2: drug right. Then I go back to the counter. Then
Speaker 2: I start looking around the counter. Then I'm looking at drawers.
Speaker 2: Now we're looking in the dishwash or whatever. This is
Speaker 2: two at least two one and a half days. I've
Speaker 2: gone through the trash twice because now I need to
Speaker 2: know where the fuck that cheese went. Okay, I cannot
Speaker 2: let this go. I need to understand what happened, so
Speaker 2: you know, And he's like, well, you know, it just
Speaker 2: doesn't make sense. I'm like, I look, I don't know,
Speaker 2: but I can solve this mystery. He's wondering about it.
Speaker 2: So we're constantly talking. He pulls out that first container again. Ah,
Speaker 2: he goes, well, when did you grate the parmesan. I'm like,
Speaker 2: I never grated parmesan, and he goes, well, nuther did
Speaker 2: I I open the lid, I taste a piece and
Speaker 2: it's the freaking cheese. So what's the truth of the
Speaker 2: matter was the fact that I made a snap judgment
Speaker 2: based on the serrated edge of a knife, not a
Speaker 2: greater uh huh. So I think of the truth as
Speaker 2: micro moments, potential micro moments of perspection, perspective, perspective.
Speaker 1: Okay.
Speaker 2: For instance, it was true that that looked grated, and
Speaker 2: because I made that assessment, we don't even have parmesan.
Speaker 2: I mean, that's the other part we in French. I
Speaker 2: was so sure. I was so confident I literally said, no,
Speaker 2: that's parmesan because of that me seeing the pattern of
Speaker 2: the grating, which was just a grated knife, not greater
Speaker 2: uh huh. Two days of crazy town whatever, Okay. So
Speaker 2: I believed in my truth in that moment that that
Speaker 2: was parmesan, that nobody bought and nobody graded. I was
Speaker 2: holding firm to that enough to look at every drawer,
Speaker 2: the garbage can, like everywhere else. That was so hard.
Speaker 2: I'm hanging on to my perspective. So I look at
Speaker 2: the truth as a potential, ever evolving situation based on
Speaker 2: the perspectives of the parties involved. So you know, the
Speaker 2: truth is I used to teach keegels. We had this
Speaker 2: conversation earlier, and that's what I taught, and everybody did them.
Speaker 2: And then I discovered this other thing that was creating
Speaker 2: a problem. So then I said, well, my truth was
Speaker 2: do this. Now my truth is don't do that, do this.
Speaker 2: So the truth is a moving target. That's like the
Speaker 2: short of that is that there might never be a
Speaker 2: complete truth.
Speaker 1: Yep.
Speaker 2: So I don't even know how to fucking design define truth.
Speaker 2: I don't even know what to do with that. So
Speaker 2: I am curious about the truth. Not you had said,
Speaker 2: you know, curious, be curious about the truth. You meant
Speaker 2: it as in be curious. I was kind of like,
Speaker 2: I'm curious about the truth because I don't know what.
Speaker 1: It is, right, I mean, I think it points points
Speaker 1: to this, Yeah, I mean. One also metaphor that you
Speaker 1: may it's a very common metaphor is the three blind
Speaker 1: men and the elephant. They've never seen an elephant before.
Speaker 1: There's a blind man who holds the trunk of the
Speaker 1: elephant and he says, oh, this is like a snake.
Speaker 1: And you know, the one blind man holds the is
Speaker 1: touching the the leg and he's like, oh, this is
Speaker 1: like a tree. And then the other blind person is
Speaker 1: holding the tail and I forgot what this It was like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't know if he said broom, but it was
Speaker 1: another animal that was know something like the tail. Now
Speaker 1: what is the what the overall truth you know that
Speaker 1: which is in greatest fidelity to to reality is Yes,
Speaker 1: all those things were partial views of of the larger
Speaker 1: thing that's that's going on. And so I think at
Speaker 1: least for me, like having truth be the top value
Speaker 1: and also having a level of curiosity about it means
Speaker 1: in that certain way that that I will always be evolving,
Speaker 1: or at least my understanding of what either reality is
Speaker 1: or what is possible will continue to grow, will continue
Speaker 1: to evolve, as distinct from many people on just the
Speaker 1: planet right now, who, for whatever reason and is is
Speaker 1: uh uh, whether it's just for survival or you know,
Speaker 1: it's just because there's a lot trauma or there's a
Speaker 1: lot of things going on, don't have that as a
Speaker 1: value and as as a priority. I'll and I actually
Speaker 1: have a view about why I think maybe truth is
Speaker 1: not on your list, which I yeah, I'll get to
Speaker 1: that because I think because it actually is on the
Speaker 1: kind of a similar thing. So there is this one
Speaker 1: quote that I found. When I saw it, I'm like,
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, this is so so true. So it's
Speaker 1: in Latin, and I'll translated mundo vult decipi ergo decipteur.
Speaker 1: The world wants to be deceived, so let it be deceived. Mm.
Speaker 1: So this was first documented in this book called The
Speaker 1: Ship of Fools, a satirical Allegory in seventeen or fourteen
Speaker 1: seventy four by Sebastian bront in medieval German. And so
Speaker 1: when I read that, I was like, oh my gosh,
Speaker 1: you know, I mean, how much in the world. And
Speaker 1: this actually kind of taps into our previous conversation of
Speaker 1: let's say those that are in power and control and
Speaker 1: as you know, we as like the leaders. If the
Speaker 1: people lead, the leaders will follow. Is that those who
Speaker 1: were let's just say, doing mischief or evil or pulling
Speaker 1: the strings behind the scenes, that are quote unquote in control,
Speaker 1: they they bank on people choosing comfort, choosing all of
Speaker 1: these kind of material things over truth. And so when
Speaker 1: that happens, then well it's basically easy to control people
Speaker 1: because because you can feed them whatever whatever story that
Speaker 1: that is kind of of exactly exactly. And then they're
Speaker 1: they're totally on board, you know, they're like, hey, you know,
Speaker 1: like oh, protecting like protecting women's rights, and and wow,
Speaker 1: women are a victim, not like, for example, realize, oh well, shit,
Speaker 1: if if I if I say and I advocate that
Speaker 1: women are actually victims that actually like takes away self
Speaker 1: agency like ooh hmm, maybe that's not the actual, you know,
Speaker 1: optimum way to approach this or yeah, and so I'll
Speaker 1: link that back to what I maybe see about you
Speaker 1: and truth not being in your top five values for you,
Speaker 1: I I would tell me if this is how accurate
Speaker 1: this is, and based on our conversations, is that for you,
Speaker 1: truth occurs all day, every day in technicolor absolutely? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1: So for you, it's it's like so freaking obvious. It's
Speaker 1: literally in your face every waking moment of the world,
Speaker 1: and and you perceiving all these things that maybe a
Speaker 1: lot of people don't perceive in a lay of detail
Speaker 1: and texture like those POPSICLESA.
Speaker 2: He's torturing me right now.
Speaker 1: You got uh yeah, level of detail that the other
Speaker 1: people like have they they they are just it's they
Speaker 1: totally miss it.
Speaker 2: Okay. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So so in a in a way, my my read
Speaker 1: of you truth not being in your top five of
Speaker 1: those values is is that it's just so obvious to
Speaker 1: you that this is what's happening, and you can immediately
Speaker 1: go right to have a absolutely bang on accurate assessment. Okay,
Speaker 1: here is my read on my super high fidelity perception
Speaker 1: of what right to the fidelity truth? Yeah, so what
Speaker 1: did I say? Truth is like the fidelity with reality.
Speaker 1: So you you are in super super high fidelity perception
Speaker 1: of reality, and so no wonder that something that's totally
Speaker 1: obvious to you that you then say to person, then
Speaker 1: three years later they might go back to you and say,
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, Tanya, hey, you know you said this
Speaker 1: thing three years ago, and then guess what happened. But
Speaker 1: and then you're like duh, Like, yeah, I knew that
Speaker 1: three years ago. That's why it was obvious to me.
Speaker 1: Then that's why I told you, and it's still obvious
Speaker 1: to me.
Speaker 2: Now this is truth. This is true. Yes, that is true. Okay.
Speaker 2: So from a ground perspective, the reason that we one
Speaker 2: of the things that we do with truth in a
Speaker 2: non productive way is holding to this is true? So
Speaker 2: I'm right. And in relationships, here's the way to blow
Speaker 2: the fuck out of your relationship for sure, and that
Speaker 2: is you know, I know the truth about this situation.
Speaker 2: So like with the cheese, I knew the truth about
Speaker 2: the cheese in that fucking moment without being curious and
Speaker 2: taking the next level like oh, let me taste the cheese,
Speaker 2: because then I would have known for sure. No, no,
Speaker 2: no instant judgment. I'm right, you know, look at all
Speaker 2: that now. That doesn't happen to me often. I am
Speaker 2: not typically a person who goes I'm right about that.
Speaker 2: I don't know. I don't know what was going on
Speaker 2: that I decided to make that assumption. Usually I'm curious.
Speaker 2: Usually I'm like, hmm, could that be the cheese. It
Speaker 2: doesn't look like the cheese. Maybe it didn't smell like
Speaker 2: the cheese. It's got great martes. Let me test it.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna try the cheese. That pretty well is gonna
Speaker 2: tell me in an instant. But somehow I was off
Speaker 2: my curiosity moment. Don't know why. It doesn't really matter,
Speaker 2: But when it comes to sex, when it comes to relationships,
Speaker 2: when it comes to any of these things. We typically
Speaker 2: operate from the idea that we know what's true. I
Speaker 2: heard you say this. Now you and I've had the
Speaker 2: conversation where my biggest trigger is when somebody who I
Speaker 2: think knows me takes something I say and assigns it
Speaker 2: an intent I'm not even pucked, like possibly couldn't even
Speaker 2: be me. That is painful to me, like, h so painful,
Speaker 2: like instead of wow, Tanya, hmm, I was really curious
Speaker 2: that you said that. Tell me more about that. Did
Speaker 2: you mean this, this is what I heard or whatever?
Speaker 2: And I'm like, oh shit, now you know. So that
Speaker 2: curiosity we can hang on to the truth, our truth,
Speaker 2: our perception of the truth, a desire to be right
Speaker 2: about it, which clearly I was completely out of my
Speaker 2: normal zone with the fucking cheese, which is why I
Speaker 2: wrote a story about it on Facebook and why I'm
Speaker 2: saying about it now because this People are trustworthy, tell
Speaker 2: they not. People do what they do till they don't,
Speaker 2: And right there, I did not do any of the
Speaker 2: things that I usually do. So you're having a conversation
Speaker 2: with your partner and they say something that is quote
Speaker 2: unquote their truth. This is why when I work with couples.
Speaker 2: I never let people say everything they want to say, no, nogether,
Speaker 2: in separate together and separate because fuck, some shit should
Speaker 2: not ever come out of your mouth. It's just Shitting't
Speaker 2: out of your mouth, say everything unfiltered to somebody if
Speaker 2: you're triggered. So curiosity, what's your feeling about that you
Speaker 2: said this? Oh, let me tell you this is what
Speaker 2: I heard, because look what they said and what are
Speaker 2: two different things?
Speaker 1: Ye were true?
Speaker 2: Right? Yeah?
Speaker 1: And the clarity of communication is is yeah, it's it's
Speaker 1: there's there's a number of different steps in that communication
Speaker 1: process where things could go awry.
Speaker 2: Well, we do not even right right exactly things go awry.
Speaker 2: We go if we never go back to that flip
Speaker 2: to that last you know, open that container and taste
Speaker 2: that damn cheese, We're gonna hang on to the other
Speaker 2: the nex The first step after that, what do you
Speaker 2: mean to like, go back to the truth is? Wow,
Speaker 2: what if we all treated each other with the grace
Speaker 2: of curiosity? Hmm? I wonder what you meant by that? Hmm.
Speaker 2: I wonder you know. I'm curious, can you elaborate more.
Speaker 2: I'm curious why you said that. I'm curious about that
Speaker 2: instead of like I need to be right about what happened.
Speaker 2: I fucking needed to be right about that damn fucking cheese,
Speaker 2: even though I say hours hours hours doing shit like
Speaker 2: by the garbage and looking at cupboards and like every
Speaker 2: single thing except open that damn container and taste it.
Speaker 2: Thank you, Universe, bring me more. So how do we
Speaker 2: let go? How do we hold on to the desire?
Speaker 2: Because truth for us equals assuredly a surety. Is that
Speaker 2: a word?
Speaker 1: It is? It is a word?
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, thank you? Because if I made it up,
Speaker 2: everybody understood it. Anyway, Truth for us feels like a surety.
Speaker 2: It feels like something we can hang our hat on.
Speaker 2: It feels like something tangible and something that stable. It
Speaker 2: feels stable, stability, right, that's m m yeah right. And
Speaker 2: so that stability piece we desire because that way we
Speaker 2: feel like we know what's going on. We rely on
Speaker 2: that we can. That's what people get so shook when
Speaker 2: all of a sudden science blows up. There they're truth
Speaker 2: in something. I like to assert that I know something
Speaker 2: for myself and then go read every single thing I
Speaker 2: can to blow the fuck up out of what I believe.
Speaker 2: Mm hmmm ye my favorite things to change my mind
Speaker 2: except except for the cheese.
Speaker 1: Yep, except for the yep. I get it, I get it.
Speaker 1: I think, yeah, boy, there's there's so many things that
Speaker 1: kind of come up.
Speaker 2: Hmmm.
Speaker 1: So is is around that curiosity I would reframe, slightly reframe.
Speaker 1: I agree with what you said, and I would slightly
Speaker 1: add to it, is that it's our ego that wants
Speaker 1: that solidity or that surety, that sense of oh, this
Speaker 1: is not going to change. Because if this thing changes,
Speaker 1: then that might mean fill in the blank. That might
Speaker 1: mean I'm uncomfortable. That might mean I need to leave
Speaker 1: this relationship. That might mean I need to get vulnerable.
Speaker 1: That might mean I need to take a risk and
Speaker 1: do the thing that I've been saying that I I
Speaker 1: am going to do.
Speaker 2: Wethink everything my life stood for before.
Speaker 1: Before the cheese. Right. So one of the things, and
Speaker 1: this could also be a just a general good let's
Speaker 1: say action point is instead of this idea of truth
Speaker 1: is something fixed and solid going back also to touch
Speaker 1: in and weave back into what you're saying, it's ever
Speaker 1: ever fluid. And so so this idea of let's say curiosity,
Speaker 1: it's like have it's like kind of to me, it's
Speaker 1: like light and playful and spontaneous sense of, oh, this
Speaker 1: is curious. So instead of, for example, like if you're
Speaker 1: on a date, to be really curious about who is
Speaker 1: this person on the other side of the table, or
Speaker 1: if you're an intimate situation, be like curious about, okay, well,
Speaker 1: how could I touch this person in a way that
Speaker 1: they would appreciate? Or even the next level is how
Speaker 1: how could I drop into the space of of and
Speaker 1: feel this energy between us so that so that whatever
Speaker 1: next action effortly arises. Yeah, so it's like this constant
Speaker 1: sensing into the moment about okay, well what is arising here,
Speaker 1: what wants to unfold, what wants to emerge. So it's
Speaker 1: like a listening of of of openness and anticipation of
Speaker 1: of what wants to but wants to happen that that
Speaker 1: could be good for you, could be good for this
Speaker 1: other person, could be good for the world.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so then that would mean your value of truth
Speaker 2: is really listening into what's being woven into that moment.
Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah, that it taps into. For example, from
Speaker 1: my from a book, part of the definition of a
Speaker 1: regenerative leader is is someone who listens and co creates
Speaker 1: wholeness into existence for themselves others in the world.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so okay, so what I'm gonna take. What I'm
Speaker 2: going to drop in here then on the how too
Speaker 2: is don't solidify truth.
Speaker 1: Love it, love it, love it, love it.
Speaker 2: I think that should be like you've got your new quote.
Speaker 2: This should be that my new quote. I'm gonna write
Speaker 2: it down. Don't solidify the truth relying on the truth,
Speaker 2: nor like expecting other people's truth to be like carved
Speaker 2: in stone. That is never ever going to change. I'll
Speaker 2: tell you when it comes to women, and if you
Speaker 2: nail the truth of what they said yesterday means they're
Speaker 2: going to feel the same way today. You're already lost.
Speaker 2: That is probably the most varied truth on the planet.
Speaker 2: What turns a woman on now, thirty seconds, half an
Speaker 2: hour from now not gonna be the same thing. So
Speaker 2: that other thing is the truth. Somebody can love you
Speaker 2: today and not love you tomorrow. That there's so many
Speaker 2: things that we believe. When it comes out of somebody's mouth,
Speaker 2: it's the truth. And you are going to nail that,
Speaker 2: lay it, You're going to come back. I can't tell
Speaker 2: you how many relationship, things, communication. I've heard with the
Speaker 2: whole like, well you told me that, Like that's it.
Speaker 2: I said that, and that is forever. Now that said,
Speaker 2: like how many people have said till death to hoest part.
Speaker 2: You're all still fucking alive. So clearly you weren't telling
Speaker 2: the truth or you were in that moment. So don't
Speaker 2: to fight the truth and hang everything you have and
Speaker 2: go keep going back to make that instead, as Matthiah says,
Speaker 2: be curious about the ever evolving moment of truth. Make
Speaker 2: it so. I guess the easy way we all know
Speaker 2: this is stop fucking making assumptions. Would you agree with that?
Speaker 2: So how do we do that? How do we do that?
Speaker 2: It's easy, show up, curious, stop hanging onto what was
Speaker 2: said done. Just don't be me and the fucking cheese
Speaker 2: just just there, Just remember the cheese story. Don't be
Speaker 2: me and the cheese. Go taste that thing, whatever that
Speaker 2: thing is. We'll be back. We'll leave you with that