Speaker 1: Yes, I feel like pulmarket is really pushing this industry
Speaker 1: into mass adoption because like the very beginning, people don't
Speaker 1: know this concept, right, so what a prediction market? You
Speaker 1: can't trade them for retavy events, like what's going on?
Speaker 1: Like that's something mad right now? I beforely one odd
Speaker 1: top twenty or thirty all about this concept during that
Speaker 1: time last year around November, so it's it's this thing
Speaker 1: actually is really far away previously from normal people and
Speaker 1: even for crypto people, they don't know about prediction market,
Speaker 1: like about sixty months as ago.
Speaker 2: This content is brought to you by bitco, which is
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Speaker 2: bitgo dot com link in the description. Welcome into the
Speaker 2: Thinking Crypto Podcast. I'm your host, Tony Edward and with
Speaker 2: me is Rain Wu who's the CEO of Predex, and
Speaker 2: Amelia Rain. It is great to have you on the podcast.
Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you for hiring me, and it's great to
Speaker 1: take this interview today. And now I want to ensure
Speaker 1: us more about what they do.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, Rain, you and I have met in person, and
Speaker 2: you're doing some great things building out preducts and Amelia
Speaker 2: and I think it's important for folks to learn about
Speaker 2: it given that your leverage AI and blockchain and crypto.
Speaker 2: So I think the convergence of those things are pretty
Speaker 2: significant and we're seeing some big movements around it. But
Speaker 2: before we get to all that, tell us about yourself,
Speaker 2: where you from and what's your professional background.
Speaker 1: Of course you got to share. So for me, I
Speaker 1: previously originally from China, so I grow up engaging in
Speaker 1: the capital of China. So around twenty thirteen I come
Speaker 1: to us to studying as a computer science PhD student.
Speaker 1: So what I did during the PhD time is and
Speaker 1: constraints recognitions. I built some pipelines for recognizing faces and
Speaker 1: facial landmarks and the unconstrained scenarios, so which has actually
Speaker 1: been what did think adopted there on in the academia.
Speaker 1: So what we do during that time is basically using
Speaker 1: the learning albums to find some of the facial locations
Speaker 1: and basically using the learning to the nice who you
Speaker 1: are and in some changing scenarios. So during that time,
Speaker 1: actually I was thinking about is there a way that
Speaker 1: we can build out something really not only for institution
Speaker 1: but for every people, right like consumer AI. That's finally
Speaker 1: come true. So that is always my dream to build
Speaker 1: out something around this customer AI industry. And then after
Speaker 1: five years I gariated from the University of Houston with
Speaker 1: the best phy student of the convers sign that year
Speaker 1: and then I joined Visa as a researcher. So in
Speaker 1: Visa I many do it so for detention at anti
Speaker 1: money launterings and then a lot of things regarding to
Speaker 1: the transaction risk management. Yeah, so dre's the time. Also
Speaker 1: I have somend of new ideas regarding it is a
Speaker 1: probably a way of doing this kind of AI evaluation
Speaker 1: more efficiently. So as we know, like in Visa or
Speaker 1: any kind of like a big firm. If you do
Speaker 1: mation learning rats a lot of things you need to
Speaker 1: evaluate them day and night. So that is actually occupied
Speaker 1: most of my job. So are probably a better way
Speaker 1: we were thinking, so trying to dominate the democratize this
Speaker 1: evaluation when more people get in touch with evaluations. So
Speaker 1: that is something like what I'm sort of. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: I I was in Visa for four years since two
Speaker 1: nineteen to the earlier twenty three and then I could
Speaker 1: Visa start my compling. Yeah, that is my background.
Speaker 2: And what was your first encounter with bigcoin or crypto
Speaker 2: and when did it click for you?
Speaker 1: Yeah? So where were beginning? I think I hear a
Speaker 1: big cooin in around twenty twenty, twenty eleven or twenty twelve,
Speaker 1: actually very ver early. So during that time, actually some
Speaker 1: of my roommates telling me, okay, so this is a
Speaker 1: new coin called bigcoin. This is actually good on the
Speaker 1: equation aurism instead of like the real coin. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: when I'll take a look. So there time I was like,
Speaker 1: actually get a little bit interesting what happened. But the
Speaker 1: thing is that like during that time, I remember it's
Speaker 1: really hard to get one, so unless you're minding by
Speaker 1: yourself or you actually buy from some of the exchanges.
Speaker 1: But I was in China the time. There's that time
Speaker 1: it's really hard to get one. So I was not
Speaker 1: aware of what happened of this field until I think
Speaker 1: it's twenty eighteen nineteen, so some of my friends actually
Speaker 1: get rich by buying big coins. That is actually my
Speaker 1: second time actually take a close look. But actually I
Speaker 1: was actually on til twenty twenty, twenty twenty one, that
Speaker 1: is the Devin summer and nat h trained actually the
Speaker 1: hype of nity. That is actually exact time I started
Speaker 1: to buy some tokens, so I could say like not
Speaker 1: that early, but I think until I really noticed that
Speaker 1: this technique can do something beyond like transfer the money,
Speaker 1: I can really cintimus people to really put their own
Speaker 1: money into this to actually as a as an allocation
Speaker 1: or just a for speculation. At the time, actually I
Speaker 1: read into the game. Yeah, so basically I fall into everything,
Speaker 1: but kind of like get into the game a little
Speaker 1: bit like a in the serve of false wave of
Speaker 1: the crypto.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I wonder if you can tell us a bit
Speaker 2: about your your thoughts on China and their approach to crypto.
Speaker 2: They had banned it and they unbanned it. It's been
Speaker 2: kind of flip floppy, right, But Hong Kong earlier this
Speaker 2: year opened up retail trading to crypto. They launched bitcoin
Speaker 2: and ether et apps, so it seems China started to
Speaker 2: embrace crypto more.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: They put out a I think a paper about Web
Speaker 2: three Shanghai and all that. What are your thoughts on
Speaker 2: China's approach interesting questions? So I think the China actually
Speaker 2: always wanted to like testing some.
Speaker 1: Person that is the actually what previously you will be
Speaker 1: doing in the country. So I I've been in US
Speaker 1: for ten years, but I think that like to gradually
Speaker 1: get into something, there's nothing wrong with that. So basically
Speaker 1: Hong Kong is actually it can think, like an intersection
Speaker 1: between the China and also the world of the world.
Speaker 1: So they're basically trying to testing from the hub from
Speaker 1: the intersection. I think probably is a good way to
Speaker 1: start the business. But I think it's really hard to
Speaker 1: tell like what is actually going on if we actually
Speaker 1: completely you know, adoption the crypto, because like there's always
Speaker 1: a double source like the benefits and the cons right,
Speaker 1: So until then, like we are very good at to
Speaker 1: control some some bad effects. So for for government perspectives, right,
Speaker 1: I feel that like like us, right, so they lit
Speaker 1: they need to be a little bit cautious about what's
Speaker 1: going on. I think the Purple is really decentralized the
Speaker 1: forces of I mean, I could like doing some revolution
Speaker 1: or somehow you know, reblue something like not working. So
Speaker 1: until they have a very strong will of really reublue
Speaker 1: something not working. I mean scriptoprob is not there in
Speaker 1: the big country, but for a small and medium country
Speaker 1: probably this is a little beatale for them. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm I think a lot of people are waiting
Speaker 2: to see when China may open up, you know, training
Speaker 2: to the rest of the mainland China. I think that
Speaker 2: would be very bullish in the market. But who knows
Speaker 2: when they're going to do that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, hard to tell.
Speaker 2: Ye, Okay, tell us about Amilia the platform and products.
Speaker 2: What are what are you trying to build here and
Speaker 2: what the problem.
Speaker 1: Does it solve? Yeah, So in Amilia actually it's a
Speaker 1: decentralized Yeah, evaluation protocol. So our dream is that we
Speaker 1: basically let normal people to fund problems in the AI engines,
Speaker 1: so that we can recomp them the best AI agent
Speaker 1: that we have to the right person. So you know,
Speaker 1: like there are so many A agent authors and there
Speaker 1: are so many people can train different air agents, but
Speaker 1: right now there's not a curation platform or like eup
Speaker 1: for AI. So we're trying to build up this kind
Speaker 1: of Europe for AI that we lend normal people to
Speaker 1: evelinescing more efficiently. But the problem is that you actually
Speaker 1: there are the can evaluing something already out there. But
Speaker 1: for AI, the problem need to come up with normal
Speaker 1: people from the daily works, like who will be present
Speaker 1: something I care right, Like what is stark look like?
Speaker 1: Whether the stars can be like the Hollywood basically win
Speaker 1: the oscar price or something like that. So they basically
Speaker 1: need to come up the problems from the normal people
Speaker 1: side so that the consumer AIS can We're really so
Speaker 1: many problems that the problem is to be. So we
Speaker 1: want the AMNAIL to be a platform that holding up
Speaker 1: different problems that generated by the decentralist human being, a
Speaker 1: cross sourcing it so that like we have a problem
Speaker 1: marketplace instead of like the model marketplace for AM models
Speaker 1: evaluating them comprehensively. So that is the dream of Amenia
Speaker 1: and predects actually is an application generated from the amenia
Speaker 1: so product application, AM infrastructure, so application perspectives. That is
Speaker 1: really people facing. So we give them a future oriented
Speaker 1: prediction market. What is future oriented? Firstly, would the problems
Speaker 1: come up with human normal people, not actually from a
Speaker 1: centralized committee, so that every people can engage into the
Speaker 1: prediction market. Secondly, we actually give them the capability of
Speaker 1: AI automatic trading or automatic news aggregation. So basically in
Speaker 1: products you can exploring in the future all these news
Speaker 1: is regarding an event so that you can treat the
Speaker 1: even more efficiently. It's actually the future. Why because we
Speaker 1: have become a news aggregation engines with a technique power
Speaker 1: by the amelia. And third the most important thing is
Speaker 1: that we're going to share significant of our revenue to
Speaker 1: people who come up with the best problems for the
Speaker 1: prediction market. So in that sense, actually people will try
Speaker 1: their best to actually think something like very interesting disputing
Speaker 1: and what we will get more can valance by just
Speaker 1: turning their friends or like other people who make interested
Speaker 1: in that, and that will become a hub for other
Speaker 1: agents to evaluating them on this question that most people
Speaker 1: are about the adopted for. So that is actually, I
Speaker 1: think products come up with all this questions that normal
Speaker 1: people to treat the sentiment people to contribute in terms
Speaker 1: of the great questions, but for AMLIA to finally evaluate
Speaker 1: in the air agent on these questions. So that is
Speaker 1: actually the reason why we want to build as under
Speaker 1: four deeper perspectives. What we want to have this architecture
Speaker 1: is because I really noticed that there's a lot of
Speaker 1: speculators in the webstree industry. So, but there are real
Speaker 1: forces that's driving the industry into the future. Yeah, So
Speaker 1: so how we can utilizing the striming forces or motivations
Speaker 1: more efficiently for something good. So that is the problem
Speaker 1: I think we want to solve. I think many of
Speaker 1: the web AI companies they want to divide these two forces.
Speaker 1: They want to AI I mean developers, they only focus
Speaker 1: on air development and they lenure to token. Really for
Speaker 1: the speculators, that's separate them very kind of like you
Speaker 1: know widely. But what we want to do is that
Speaker 1: we want to integrate them so in the prediction market context, right,
Speaker 1: we think that's probably it's one of the best use
Speaker 1: cases that we can integrate these two forces. There's normal
Speaker 1: people indust speculating on this event, but they contribute the
Speaker 1: data looking for what is speculating in terms of actually
Speaker 1: what happened in history, what the news to look like,
Speaker 1: and then we can using the large length model capability
Speaker 1: to help them to better make the decisions, help the
Speaker 1: generally better events. So that is how the AI can
Speaker 1: more deeply integrate with the speculators, so that the money
Speaker 1: can also be distributed to the people who actually developed
Speaker 1: the best AI models. So that is the flow we
Speaker 1: want to build and want to really close the loop
Speaker 1: of the speculator and the AI developers. Yeah, that's why
Speaker 1: we need to have this kind of a set up.
Speaker 2: And which blockchains are you currently operating on? Is the
Speaker 2: ammeiliate platform its own proprietary blockchain or is it built
Speaker 2: on specific a specific blockchain.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so we are built on base many base base,
Speaker 1: but we also working on the others block chains for example,
Speaker 1: say which the orangine come from? And also like a
Speaker 1: in a mental uh recently baras they can link h.
Speaker 1: So the general idea is that I want to go
Speaker 1: a multi chance so that we become the best power
Speaker 1: prediction market in area of the block chains, because we
Speaker 1: feel that prediction market is necessary. But it's not there
Speaker 1: yet for many of the black chairs. We know poly
Speaker 1: market is the best one there at the Polygon, you know,
Speaker 1: for the others blockchain, we really don't think there's a
Speaker 1: lot of people working on prediction markets. So if we
Speaker 1: have air capability, we have the prediction market. It's the
Speaker 1: great Uli, the great talon bots. So we really want
Speaker 1: to bring out this capability to each of the block chains.
Speaker 2: Oh, yeah, for sure. And then there's a prdx token
Speaker 2: if I'm not mistaken for the products application.
Speaker 1: Yes, so we are going to launching a single token
Speaker 1: with production Amlia. Right now we're thinking about the a
Speaker 1: media and we are trying to lancher infrastructure token. Yeah.
Speaker 1: It also does people right now they are earning it's
Speaker 1: called products. But trying to have one single token system. Yeah.
Speaker 2: And then you know, with regards to the predictions market
Speaker 2: and placing bets and so forth, who can participate? Can
Speaker 2: US residents participate on this? Oh?
Speaker 1: Right now? We actually really always a law of at TC,
Speaker 1: so that like we are open to the non US
Speaker 1: residents unfortunately and basically and also not manage China, but
Speaker 1: you can actually trying to go yeah, out of the
Speaker 1: country or like some way to actually get into the game. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we're pretty much learned from what poly market did. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Oh sure, And I guess what type of predictions are
Speaker 2: you seeing? Is it like presidential election predictions? Different types
Speaker 2: of markets and things happening. What are some of the
Speaker 2: you know, things that are popping up that people are
Speaker 2: interested in?
Speaker 1: Yeah, so how our a platform? I think people in
Speaker 1: three different type of events personally about celebrities. Yeah, therapy
Speaker 1: is basically famous people and whatever. Celebrity like trauma is
Speaker 1: one of the celebrities. Uh, and on is one and yeah,
Speaker 1: and also the Hollywood starts. Yeah, so that because celebrities. Second,
Speaker 1: you think it's Mimi points or any points riven to
Speaker 1: the cripple in general. Right, so because the price is
Speaker 1: actually something people really care about and right now actually
Speaker 1: in the traditional trading rights, like the price is really
Speaker 1: actually wildtile It's actually not like saying that okay, that
Speaker 1: pretty civil about seventy seventy k or budeo of fifty k.
Speaker 1: So this kind of like a judgment based kind of
Speaker 1: like corresponding to a concept that humans really want to
Speaker 1: to bet on. It's very very interesting and we feel
Speaker 1: like draw a lot of people attention. Yeah, it's kind
Speaker 1: of like a you know, a cirt hold of the price. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that is something we have. And the third one we
Speaker 1: feel that is very interesting. It's somehow relevant to the Yeah,
Speaker 1: so to the sports. So you know, the sports is
Speaker 1: actually about the think they will become very popular. Like Olympics,
Speaker 1: we have all aero championship, and later around we may
Speaker 1: have others like also E games, right like for Themple
Speaker 1: Delta you know this kind of like electric yeah competition
Speaker 1: basically electric games. So this all these kind of things
Speaker 1: like might draw people attention. So all these competitions we
Speaker 1: feel like people really want to be expressing our opinions on.
Speaker 1: So that is a three topic feel very interesting. And
Speaker 1: then they have like a bigger trading volumes mm hm.
Speaker 2: And you know, do you have plans for expansion you
Speaker 2: know who are you looking to partner with different companies
Speaker 2: and so forth?
Speaker 1: Yes, we are actually firstly we are thinking about partnership
Speaker 1: with uh the big layer one or layer twos, So
Speaker 1: we're trying to become like somehow like a Dacks you know,
Speaker 1: thats like necessary in each other, the kind of like
Speaker 1: dig the one layer two. And then we feel that
Speaker 1: like catching up the attention of people. It's also become
Speaker 1: very very interesting and critical thing for each other Buchain.
Speaker 1: So we feel prediction market is a good way to
Speaker 1: catch up people's attention. So that is why we want
Speaker 1: to have this for each other ut chains. So collaborating
Speaker 1: with layer one lyric two is our the top parity.
Speaker 1: And second we feel like it will be somehow like
Speaker 1: the AI or Sienter Analysis company who want to evaluate
Speaker 1: in their air agents or they have the capability of
Speaker 1: holding their agents, but for other people to brainding their
Speaker 1: own agents on there right. So so that is something
Speaker 1: because we want to build up this AI army for
Speaker 1: solving out people's problems and then we canting them and
Speaker 1: basically becoming the right AI agent to write people. So
Speaker 1: the AI the central AI company of course someone we
Speaker 1: want to partnership with and then we can invalidate them
Speaker 1: or they can find us some of the services. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that is the second big proNT of like companies we
Speaker 1: are partnership with and the third one we think very
Speaker 1: interesting with the oracle. Yeah, so we basically just have
Speaker 1: a conversation with the channeling labs and also like other oracles,
Speaker 1: is that we need to have the very good data
Speaker 1: sources and the people can really find the source of truth, right,
Speaker 1: and that is something we want to have. Right now,
Speaker 1: our system is driving by voting machaism, So basically, if
Speaker 1: people don't agree with something, they can dispute our platforms
Speaker 1: and basically we give them this like one or two
Speaker 1: days distributing period. If everyone not agree with what's selected
Speaker 1: by creators, well revert back the whole process. Right. So,
Speaker 1: but we feel that like that may may still not
Speaker 1: the final kind of solution. So I think that if
Speaker 1: there's someone can kind of r the data in terms
Speaker 1: of what is the objective, I mean results of the
Speaker 1: event even better. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Now, I think you mentioned it earlier, but your platform
Speaker 2: is decentralized, right or is it centralized or are you
Speaker 2: working towards getting more decentralized.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I think right now as a hybrid, we learn
Speaker 1: a lot of the dads in FROST. So basically we
Speaker 1: have an un chain costudium, so all the user money
Speaker 1: is basically fully transparent on chain. Uh. Yeah, so people
Speaker 1: can see where the money is in a smart contract,
Speaker 1: so that brings us some transparency and safety. But we
Speaker 1: also think that in terms of the efficiency for example,
Speaker 1: the other book system, we bring it up chain, so
Speaker 1: basically you will have a fully kind of control internal
Speaker 1: which I mean order can be metted with another one
Speaker 1: so that we can boost in the efficiency. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: that is actually on chain because like for this kind
Speaker 1: of technique, we feel like it's good to protecting users
Speaker 1: from like a potational attacks. Uh. Yeah, just a little
Speaker 1: bit for jail and some of the like smart contract,
Speaker 1: it's a little bit harder to fully audit it audited.
Speaker 1: So that's why we actually want to protecting yeah, this
Speaker 1: part and keep it ourselves. Yeah. But so we are
Speaker 1: trying to towards a solution that's fully out chained. Yeah.
Speaker 1: If all the technique we already have, I'm resolved. Yeah.
Speaker 2: So the question for you, you know, regarding security, because
Speaker 2: you mentioned the funds will be in a smart contract unchained,
Speaker 2: people can view that. What security levels do you have
Speaker 2: there to avoid any type of exploits on that.
Speaker 1: Yeah. So we have audited by like wory log and
Speaker 1: also another famous uh security company. So their idea is
Speaker 1: that one thing is keeps the smart contract simple. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so don't have too much kind of like a floating component. Uh,
Speaker 1: we're clearly writing and so they're like, since this actually
Speaker 1: really kind of can be seen by people and that
Speaker 1: should be date. So it's the first thing. Second thing
Speaker 1: is that like we should put a lot of very
Speaker 1: i mean critical operations of chain and even this basic
Speaker 1: disconnect from the Internet. It's actually our internal kind of
Speaker 1: like the service we have, like some of the competitions
Speaker 1: and uh, and you're really limited about all these kind
Speaker 1: of forces that open to the Internet, so that we
Speaker 1: can protect a lot of like something i mean some
Speaker 1: newer applications from a sesstor or system.
Speaker 2: And have you done any fundraising? Are you currently looking
Speaker 2: to raise additional funds?
Speaker 1: Yeah, so we have raised the precede half a million.
Speaker 1: We reached the seed, some portion has been committed, so
Speaker 1: almost a million has been invested by mutual like Prisina cbcs.
Speaker 1: We are raising and what the one I meaning at
Speaker 1: around certain meal evaluation. Yeah, so that's still ongoing. So
Speaker 1: if then there's investors press contact us. Yeah, so then
Speaker 1: is also helping us. Yes, he's a pr O, so
Speaker 1: very good guy. Yeah, so we're working together around this.
Speaker 1: I think.
Speaker 2: So this kind of answers it itself, this question because
Speaker 2: obviously you're building a solution but you know, do you
Speaker 2: see the predictions market growing significantly? As you know, crypto
Speaker 2: is a way for people to trade twenty four to seven,
Speaker 2: and you know people are getting more speculative because everything's
Speaker 2: on the internet. Now, do you see this market growing significantly?
Speaker 2: Kind of like how the presidential election poly market. I
Speaker 2: think it is right, people are tracking that who's going
Speaker 2: to be president and so forth.
Speaker 1: Yes, I feel like play market is is really pushing
Speaker 1: this and that's free into mass adoption because like very beginning,
Speaker 1: people don't know this concept, right, so what a prediction market?
Speaker 1: You can trade them for relay events? Like what's going on?
Speaker 1: Like that's something magics right now? So I think I
Speaker 1: did some of the like research or like just asking
Speaker 1: different people in the US or New York City, right,
Speaker 1: like one out of five or two oluf of five
Speaker 1: people heard of this kind of concept. Yeah, but the
Speaker 1: other welder world, for example, I've got to uh Pasmania
Speaker 1: like in Philadelphia or like attend some of the events
Speaker 1: in UPE. Right, So I'm probably one out of twenty
Speaker 1: or thirteen all about this concept during that time last
Speaker 1: year around November. So it's it's this thing actually is
Speaker 1: really borrow away previously from normal people and even for
Speaker 1: crypto people, they don't know about prediction market like five
Speaker 1: sixty months as ago. But the poly market actually sex
Speaker 1: for their uveits getting some investment and also being basically
Speaker 1: pressed a lot by you know Italic. So people know
Speaker 1: this product concept. Yeah so, but there's a lot of
Speaker 1: things to do beyond point market. Firstly, you see the
Speaker 1: geologic location people who are adopting this concept of like
Speaker 1: a prediction market, right only US, I mean people are
Speaker 1: trading I could say, like mostly on poly markets. All
Speaker 1: the other parts. Actually there's no poly market, no poly
Speaker 1: marketing in Asia, no podley market in Europe. Right so
Speaker 1: in potly marketing ninety five of the training warring I
Speaker 1: think really from the predidential election, Yeah so there's a
Speaker 1: huge amount of topics that like they haven't covered. I
Speaker 1: think this year, the podiational election, of course is one
Speaker 1: of the most important things to focus on. But how
Speaker 1: about after this years, I think there should be a
Speaker 1: lot of dicentest topics and there's a lot of things
Speaker 1: made people get interesting. But as long as they're already
Speaker 1: familiar with this concept, they may come to treat again
Speaker 1: in point market or any prediction market I product or
Speaker 1: like others. So we need to prepare for that day. Right,
Speaker 1: So what we have is actually we have a good
Speaker 1: recommendation system then we can recome people the right event
Speaker 1: that may interesting. Yeah, we have two telegram bars one
Speaker 1: Tagram basically like TikTok, you can spid your phone and
Speaker 1: switch a different event, but we actually will measure how
Speaker 1: much you stay on each event and see basically advising
Speaker 1: your interest in that event and we're recom to you
Speaker 1: more about this event. So that is something like we
Speaker 1: can solve in the long tail distribution problem at least
Speaker 1: to be atminding that. Yeah. The second boss, what we're
Speaker 1: doing is actually let people to rating the different event
Speaker 1: based on all they think the other people will rate
Speaker 1: out this event. So you can think we're guessing what
Speaker 1: the other people may pay interesting in something. And that's
Speaker 1: way basically people will give us some of the thoughts
Speaker 1: and we will see okay, so people, oh, every people
Speaker 1: say this eventually are more interesting in So how about
Speaker 1: like we are improving the rank of this egaine. So
Speaker 1: that is all these kinds of things we have done
Speaker 1: to like bring this the diction marketing to mass adoption.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that absolutely makes sense. And you know you mentioned
Speaker 2: like polymarket is only mostly US based, so it gives
Speaker 2: you an opportunity to grab market share globally because there's
Speaker 2: elections happening globally in different countries, different sporting events, different
Speaker 2: things that people may want to you know, do prediction
Speaker 2: trading on. So certainly the market is right for adoption
Speaker 2: to and for penetration into different markets.
Speaker 1: Yes, of course, Yeah, we see a lot of opportunities
Speaker 1: on there in the globally.
Speaker 2: Yeah awesome, I love it. And you know, regards to
Speaker 2: AI and how you're leveraging that, I think you touched
Speaker 2: the bit on it. But the AI is helping to
Speaker 2: assist the the traders.
Speaker 1: It's a general idea. AI actually really can help us
Speaker 1: in three different directions, right. The first one, of course,
Speaker 1: as you mentioned, is assistney treaders fully automatic even training experience. So, man,
Speaker 1: I've actually being up the first U fully automatic qualitative
Speaker 1: training on prediction market. Actually that the actually word is
Speaker 1: connecting preducts, poly market and reightw engineer also tell me
Speaker 1: to connect with the calchhip. Yeah, so if we want
Speaker 1: to build up this kind of general prediction market automatic
Speaker 1: training AI bot, so you can think like they will
Speaker 1: help you gathering knowledge and news from different places and
Speaker 1: they can help you make better decisions. But internally, I
Speaker 1: think that really can acceterate AIS capability of processing real
Speaker 1: ward information. Yeah, so because you're really the AI is
Speaker 1: evaluating very closed angles. Is they're not evaluating in the
Speaker 1: open by every single person. So we feel like this
Speaker 1: can really have the AI pushing this forward, not only
Speaker 1: helping the no people treat better, but help internally the
Speaker 1: AI engine to processing the rural events better. Yeah, that
Speaker 1: is AI as for layers. We also have AAR as creators.
Speaker 1: The general ideas that how about like that generated AI
Speaker 1: generally is a good event or problem like people to trade. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so that is also relevant to the information or news
Speaker 1: processing capability. But the AI also need to understand what
Speaker 1: is the people attentional how to face the question a
Speaker 1: good way that drove people's attention. Yeah, So that is
Speaker 1: the second like AI capability we have, and the third
Speaker 1: one of this recomindation system that is actually has been
Speaker 1: there for a while, like Tikta using it. But in
Speaker 1: terms of even trading, right, that might be slightly different
Speaker 1: because in events they have like a lifetime right, So
Speaker 1: it's a process, right, so there were time you recomme
Speaker 1: to the right person. This person I mean more focused
Speaker 1: on some events going to the end, or some new
Speaker 1: events or something like the biased towards one direction. It's
Speaker 1: actually a little bit more complicated than a video because
Speaker 1: video is actually stable, right, But this is a kind
Speaker 1: of dynamic how you recommend this event to a right
Speaker 1: person in a different stage. That is somehow more than
Speaker 1: the problem that techtolo is trying to tackle. But we
Speaker 1: feel like that as an interesting problems that can really
Speaker 1: help me useargly better.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that makes sense. It's exciting. I see a
Speaker 2: lot of blockchain in AI merging. They have kind of
Speaker 2: a symbiotic relationship where blockchain can be used to verify
Speaker 2: different aspects of AI, like content generated by AI and
Speaker 2: so forth, and an AI can help enhance blockchain attributes.
Speaker 2: So they seem to they will be working together moving forward.
Speaker 2: And obviously you're you're kind of doing.
Speaker 1: That, yeah for the bush perspective, because we actually that
Speaker 1: are also from multicle angles, right, so from incentive layer
Speaker 1: of course, like people trying to like expect a little
Speaker 1: bit more on tokens as well as somehow relevant to
Speaker 1: the bloch and anything realm to chen that it's good
Speaker 1: to catch people's eyeball. But underlying the very important thing
Speaker 1: is that the bloosham bring out the transparency. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: our design is that will put all the evidences and
Speaker 1: in first chain on the blot chain so that they
Speaker 1: know how these AI systems, what can informations they use
Speaker 1: to draw the final conclusions. So this can reasoning past
Speaker 1: that things should be fully transparent producers so that they know, okay,
Speaker 1: does it actually make some bad move or make some
Speaker 1: wrong decision by looking to some like the wrong evidence.
Speaker 1: So we feel that this kind of parch is very
Speaker 1: good to put down chain and the an also learn
Speaker 1: from each other saying oh you guys make this mitecht
Speaker 1: or you got to using this evidence and also need
Speaker 1: to learn from you so that I can make better
Speaker 1: move in the next time. So we feel like question
Speaker 1: is probably one of the best way of holding up
Speaker 1: these kind of near media solutions, both for a verification
Speaker 1: perspective but also from like learning and imploring themselves doing
Speaker 1: the called co evolution perspectives.
Speaker 2: Yeah, ah, okay, yeah, let's talk about the crypto market
Speaker 2: at large. I would love to get your thoughts on
Speaker 2: the Bitcoin ETF launches, the ETHERERM ETPs launched this morning.
Speaker 2: Of course it's a big time for the market as
Speaker 2: crypto is going more mainstream. What are your thoughts on
Speaker 2: on these ETFs.
Speaker 1: Yeah, ETF actually is a variable way for normal people
Speaker 1: to get into it, especially the people who actually from
Speaker 1: the stocks, but I have no idea what the crypto is,
Speaker 1: So give them a legitimate way of taking part in
Speaker 1: the game. And that's also actually boosting the price of
Speaker 1: demand of actually the true at as well as p TCUs.
Speaker 1: So I think that is a very good way, and
Speaker 1: we feel in the upcoming years propose a little bit
Speaker 1: more in ETFs coming in. For example here Salona ATF
Speaker 1: is actually being proposed. And we also have like a
Speaker 1: mid goal like a bucket of investment. It's just kind
Speaker 1: of like you can pratitionally investment bucket of this ETF
Speaker 1: or IDFF that may happen later on. So we feel
Speaker 1: that like there's a lot of like good things coming in,
Speaker 1: and especially for the institutions right for example, like a
Speaker 1: normal the every defunds right or some others like rias.
Speaker 1: So previously it's really hard for them to allocate their
Speaker 1: assets or clients of money into this alternative assets. Right
Speaker 1: but right now it's like very think the sentiments coming
Speaker 1: in and they become like a good asset that everyone
Speaker 1: want to fight for, you know, Trump and Harry Is
Speaker 1: they also have their own policies regarding this. So we
Speaker 1: feel like in half here one year, I mean there's
Speaker 1: a lot of like money, will institution money pour into well,
Speaker 1: I hear that it's a huge money. It's taken them
Speaker 1: sometime like half year to one year to get hold
Speaker 1: up appool like you know the RPS and also like GPS,
Speaker 1: and that might be still a little bit like we
Speaker 1: still need to wait a little bit until the real
Speaker 1: is the huge money get into the market. But I
Speaker 1: think we see some influence. So that's a good time.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah for sure. Now on the note of like
Speaker 2: crypto regulations, you know, you as an entrepreneur builder how
Speaker 2: and you're based in the US. You're building this great
Speaker 2: platform and service, but there's not clarity in the United
Speaker 2: States where the SEC can still come after different projects
Speaker 2: saying oh you're token to security and these type of things.
Speaker 2: Now the SEC has been losing in court. Congress is
Speaker 2: working on some regulations, but it's not law. Yet, what
Speaker 2: did your take on all that and how things have
Speaker 2: been progressing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think like it's also a good minute, so
Speaker 1: go come from student present. I think I really understand that,
Speaker 1: like they can now like have all different laws and
Speaker 1: changing all the days, like, because there's still a lot
Speaker 1: of uncertainty in the field and they need to be
Speaker 1: really cautious unless they get enough like people's world in
Speaker 1: terms of the consensus, and then they come move forward.
Speaker 1: But in terms of like it started up right, like
Speaker 1: you know, this has been it's really cooling the startup.
Speaker 1: So the general idea is that like you know, people
Speaker 1: saying that they're asking for for for forgiven, it's not
Speaker 1: asking for permission, right, that is most of the people
Speaker 1: thinking like what they do. So I think, yeah, for us,
Speaker 1: for an entrepreneur who actually working on this area, we
Speaker 1: actually need to take some risks in terms of pushing
Speaker 1: things forward. But I think there are two things that
Speaker 1: I'm really uh, pay attention. Why is there what is
Speaker 1: the red line? What is a grade line? Right? So
Speaker 1: don't touch the red lines? I mean that is really
Speaker 1: forbid by law. I mean, don't do something wrong. I
Speaker 1: mean seriously, I mean we need to all wi that. Yeah. Second,
Speaker 1: really about the grade line. So grade line is really
Speaker 1: kind of like somehow like moral but or somehow you
Speaker 1: can really look into different cases, right, what is the
Speaker 1: case like like like how you navigated and trying to
Speaker 1: protect them from like going to these cases one to
Speaker 1: that cases, and so that is something we can we
Speaker 1: can do probably the best. But fundamentally you know, like yeah, real,
Speaker 1: really true. Probably take some risk from move forward, but
Speaker 1: take some vice risk and don't actually yeah, step on
Speaker 1: the red lines. That's what I said, Yeah.
Speaker 2: For sure, reen. I got some wrap up questions here. First,
Speaker 2: if you could create your own meta verse, what would
Speaker 2: the theme be?
Speaker 1: Oh, that's very interesting. Actually so actually I I think
Speaker 1: I'm not sure if you have ever seen a movie that,
Speaker 1: like it's called a Castle in the Sky actually from Japanese.
Speaker 1: The general idea is that like, so that is is
Speaker 1: a cuto movie. Yeah, so basically just describing a future
Speaker 1: that like in the future, all the AI and the
Speaker 1: nature will actually integrate togethers and people are living in
Speaker 1: a very green world, like I mean all the leaves
Speaker 1: and the plants actually integrated with AI, you know, very
Speaker 1: fresh manners. So basically you're really back into the forest time,
Speaker 1: but everything is fully automatic, so that is probably something
Speaker 1: we want. I personally want to pursue. It's a matter
Speaker 1: words that I mean, kind of like a rare harmoning
Speaker 1: between the human and the nature. Yeah, that's what I'm
Speaker 1: I'm pursuing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, awesome, And then some rapid fire questions.
Speaker 1: Favorite food, Favorite food I think is Shueshy. Yeah, that
Speaker 1: is my favorite Flix.
Speaker 2: Favorite musician or band.
Speaker 1: I really like the melodic, dumb step this kind of
Speaker 1: style of music. But for a band, I'm still like navigating.
Speaker 1: But anyone any can schood melodic can make me high?
Speaker 1: That be good. Yeah. Favorite movie movie. I feel that
Speaker 1: the metrics is of the best one I ever saw.
Speaker 1: And somehow so really want to sign Fine For example,
Speaker 1: recently as has also really wanted to the books I
Speaker 1: just called us three Body Surry Body is actually sime
Speaker 1: fine moving. I really like the most that is actually Yeah,
Speaker 1: so a lot of things happening basically the nature and
Speaker 1: how people think about the future.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I don't know if this answers the question,
Speaker 2: but favorite.
Speaker 1: Book Yeah the same, okay.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And when you're not working, what are you doing
Speaker 2: for fun?
Speaker 1: Yeah? I was going to the gym and doing a
Speaker 1: bodybuilding Yeah, that is one of the things I really
Speaker 1: like the most. And secondly that sometimes I play the
Speaker 1: video games Yeah, but not too much recently.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Rain, great stuff man. I love what you're building
Speaker 2: and looking forward to the future updates. Thank you for
Speaker 2: joining me.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much. I really appreciate having me bask
Speaker 1: PA Bostock, postopt, post talk, basks