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Speaker 1: Hey, so ladies and gentlemen, you now tuned into the

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True sticka podcast. I'm your host, truth Seka excited and

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delighted to be with you guys again for another episode. Man.

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We cover all things spiritual, spirituality, anything and everything in

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between of that, so I hope you guys are ready

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to go deep. We're going deep tonight. Shout out to

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everybody hanging out with us in the live streams, Everybody

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listening on YouTube, Periscope, Twitch, Facebook, no matter where you are, man,

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thanks for tuning in. Shout out to everybody who is

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listening from. Thank you guys so much for being a

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part of this community. Means the world. I want to

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give a shout out to everybody supporting my work via Patreon.

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This is a listener supported, listener funded show doesn't exist

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Thank you guys, And if you'd like to support, head

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on over to patreon dot com backslash truth Seeker. There

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which is two hundred plus songs, our Thursday Night School

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of the Mystics, and a bunch of really cool stuff

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ideas off of, make sure you check out our discord server.

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You get access to all that stuff as well. Patreon

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dot com, backslash truth Seeker. Also my new book, I

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say new book. It's been out a year. If you

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haven't had a chance to get it, you can get

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it at truth togod dot com. My book Spirit Realm, Angels,

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Demon Spirits and the Sovereignty of God Forward by Jordan Maxwell.

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If you have not had a chance to get it,

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make sure you go to truth toga dot com get

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your copy. If you need a copy of the audiobook,

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one would be provided for you. You can get a

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free audible download by clicking the link that's in the description.

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If you go to my audible trial, you can listen

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to me read it to you for free. Make sure

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you check it out Spirit Realm Forward by Jordan Maxwell.

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We're gonna go ahead jump into today's discussion. Tonight's discussion,

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I'm joined by my friend Paul Wallace. Friend Paul, What's

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up man, Welcome to the podcast. How are you good?

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Speaker 2: A true secret? Thanks so much for having me on

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your show.

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Speaker 1: Interesting topic to bring to the table, Very near and

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dear to my heart for sure, and ready to dive

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into it with you covering your new book Escaping from Eden.

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Does Genesis teach that the human race was created by

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God or engineered by ets?

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Speaker 2: Very intriguing, Yeah, I can see that would be close

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to your heart. With Jordan Maxwell providing your endorsement on

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your book there, that's fantastic.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I think he's the one who opened the door

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for this talk for me, and it's right up my alley.

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I really appreciate his experiences and his his stories really

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that he brought to the table, and you know, even

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you know, diving into some Assichen's work and for me,

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I started with that kind of stuff and then you know,

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as you know, there wasn't a lot of Christian Christianity

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talk talking about the eloheme or being seated or anything

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to do with the angels coming here and and dealing

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with mankind. But that kind of opened up the door

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for me to look into much later. The Divine Council

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theory with doctor Michael Heiser and both of those who

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are like headbutting each other sitching is wrong that doctor

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Heiser has that website and stuff, they kind of kindterract

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one another. I found my truth in the midst of

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all the studying to be right in the middle of

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Sitchen and doctor Heiser. So they're going to get your

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opinion on some of that stuff too.

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Speaker 2: So well, it's funny because I when I started out

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on the path that led to escaping from Aiden, I

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actually hadn't heard of Zechariah Sitschi, or Michael Heiser, wow

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and or Jordan Maxwell. I didn't know any of these names.

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My way in was really from the Bible. My background

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is in Christian ministry. I was a a church planter

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for many years and a church doctor for many years.

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I worked as a theological educator for Pentecostal churches in

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the UK and Australia, served as an archdeacon out here

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in Australia, and in all that time I was working

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with the Bible. I was training pastors to interpret the Bible.

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And it was really out of that work that I

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found myself on a journey that really got unlocked by

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some translation questions they were That was the doorway down

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this rabbit hole that led to escaping from Eden into

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these what are controversial conclusions in sort of faith circles.

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And as I was doing the research, I started coming

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across Zechariacian, Michael Heiser, Marabininho and I thought, oh goodness,

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so I'm not the first person, I thought to have

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these things thoughts, and what do I do? Should I

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quickly read up on all these guys And at that

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point I thought, no, I'm not going to do that,

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because I'm on a path here of working out for

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myself from a theological start point, what's going on in Genesis,

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what's going on in the Bible, what is the correct

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way to interpret all the language we have here? I

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really need to follow the integrity of my own thoughts.

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And then once I've sort of drawn some conclusions, then

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I can look around and see does anyone else agree

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with me? And at that point I found yes, I'm

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not the first person to tread this territory. And I

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think I'm glad I made that decision because now I

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think there's more significance in the overlap. You know, when

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you go to Michael Heiser, he made his own journey,

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situally made his own journey, and then when you find

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an overlap, there's a significance too, And so that that's

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why I made that choice. I still got a lot

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of reading to catch up on, but it really is

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that journey through Genesis and a work of translation that

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led me to the conclusion that many of the stories

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that our religions have curated as stories about God are

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really memories of our ancestors contact with other species colonizing

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planet Earth in the distant past.

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Speaker 1: What year was this stuff taking place for you where

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you started to kind of open up to this broader

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understanding and started to do a little bit more research.

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What year was it?

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Speaker 2: Well, it's I could put a number of different start

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points on, but I think a really significant seed was

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sown when I was eleven years old, because that's when

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I encountered the work of Eric von Danakin. My mum

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and dad introduced me to actually at a dinner party.

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They were discussing his work. Charits of the Gods was

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charting at that time. It had been out for about

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ten years by that point, but there'd been a movie

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and it was being talked about on the TV, and

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so they introduced me to his work, and my ears

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pricked up because I already felt dissatisfied with the explanations

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I was hearing of where we came from. It seemed

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to me there was a real gap in our ability

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to explain ourselves as a conscious, intelligent, technological species. I

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found that religion was a little bit lazy, and in

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the answer, oh, well, God made us with God's special creation,

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that fell short, and explaining how come we're animals? Then

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how come we're so obviously one of the animals should

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how does that work? And all this commonality that we

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have with other animal species not quite explained there. And

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then the scientific explanation also fell short, because the only

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thing that puts us at the top of the tree

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on this planet is consciousness, intelligence and technology, and science

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couldn't quite say where that came from. There was a gap.

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Eric von Danakin said that an external intervention made sense

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of that gap. That was his thesis, and that got

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me going, so that from the age of eleven that

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was in the back of my mind and the question

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was there. And then I guess the next really significant

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thing that happened in terms of a moment was two

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thousand and nine, when the most conservative pope in my lifetime. Now,

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I'm not a Catholic, I don't follow the popes, but

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I couldn't help noticing that the most conservative pope in

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my lifetime had called on the Pontifical Academy of Sciences

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to hold a colloquium, which was a symposium of top

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theologians and scholars to talk about the theological implications of

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contact with other species. And then his spokespeople came out

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and met the press, and they to give them credit,

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it made a lot of it. There was a year

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lead into the event, and then there was a lot

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of meeting the press, and they were saying, very loud

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and clear, we need to be ready, not just to

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embrace the idea of a populated universe, but to be

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ready to embrace a brother or sister alia. And they

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weren't talking about discovering moss on a moon of Mars.

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They were talking about intelligent, technological alien species turning up

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and the urgency with which that happened. And this phrase

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that kept getting used, we should be ready sooner than

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anyone anticipates to embrace a brother or sister alien got

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me thinking, what do they know, because it looks like

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they're preparing us for some disclosure. It looked like they

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were expecting another authority to disclose that we're in contact,

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and then they could say, Oh, don't worry, everybody, Remember

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we covered this. It doesn't change anything. It just gives

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us a bigger picture of God. And that caught my attention,

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and a gauntlet was really thrown down by the senior

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astronomer of the Vatican Observatory, Reverend doctor Guy Consolmanno. He said,

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we shouldn't be surprised to encounter intelligent alien brothers and sisters.

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He said, because they're in the Bible. They're in the

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Old Testament and the New Testament. And when that happened,

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I thought, I've really got to look into that, because

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how could I have missed that. You know, I've been

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for fifteen years, I've been training passes in how to

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interpret the Bible. Could I really have missed something as

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glaring as aliens in the Bible. And so from that moment,

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I thought, I've got to drill down into this. And

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it wasn't until two thousand and seventeen really that that

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process of research accelerated and I realized I was in

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the process of writing my next book, and I realized

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what direction it was going in, and the moment I

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sat down and asked the translation questions, why is this

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funny word earlier him a plural word? That was the

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red pill. The word Lahim often gets translated as God,

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but it's a plural word. And so the moment I

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addressed that question and said, well, what happens if we

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read that in the plural, what happens to the stories? Well,

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the change that happens changed my world, and that was

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the beginning of the story of escaping from Eden.

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Speaker 1: Well, I'm gonna save you a lot of time, brother,

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because when the word Elohim is used, it means father,

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son and holy Spirit. Yes, I'm kidding. You've heard that.

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Speaker 2: I know you're kidding. I know you're kidding, And I

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have heard that from people. Because, of course, the first

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time people are confronted with this information, an initial reaction

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from a person of faith can be well, that can't

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be right because it disagrees with conclusions I've already drawn.

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And yes, they say, well, there's the plural. It must

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mean father, son and holy Spirit. The problem with that

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is that these Elohim conflict with one another. They go

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to war against one another. Some of the Elohim want

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human beings upgraded and intelligent and conscious. Others of the

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Elohim want the humans so unintelligent that we don't even

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know we're naked, and they go to war. The Father

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Son and Holy Spirit don't go to war. The Elohim

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make mistakes, They make absurd mistakes. They fail to anticipate

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things that the reader can see from the get go,

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so that it just doesn't have any wheels. The argument

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that Elahim is Father Son and Holy Spirit, it means

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if you just look at the root, meaning powerful ones.

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And the thing that convinced me that that was the

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right reading of that word is that the way the

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stories changed when you read the God's stories in Genesis

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and further into the Bible, as stories are the powerful ones,

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they flip and suddenly line up in parallel with the Sumerian, Babylonian, Arcadian,

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and Assyrian stories carried on the ancient uniform tablets. It

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becomes apparent very quickly that the Bible stories are summary

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versions of the stories of the sky people in the

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Mesopotamian canon. And once you've seen that parallel, you can't

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go back to seeing it the old way. Now We

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didn't know this until the eighteen hundreds because we couldn't

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translate the Mesopotamian stories until the eighteen hundreds. Eighteen thirty

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five was when we found the translation key. And so unfortunately,

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the wheels of faith, communities and theological change can grind

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very slow, and so there are lots of people in

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the churches who are unaware of these parallels, unaware of

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these source documents, unaware that the editors of the Bibles

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they're reading mostly believe that the Biblical text are based

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on stories of sky people in the Mesopotamian.

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Speaker 1: Stories, which is every creation story almost right, Yes.

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Speaker 2: It is, that's right. You can go to almost any

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culture around the world and you will find parallels with

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these stories. And as I started researching Escaping from Eden,

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that was the evidence that for me built up and

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up and up that there is a memory of what happened,

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of where we came from, who we were in contact with,

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and different cultures have found different ways of curating the

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same basic story, the same memories, memories of the same

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traumas that our ancestors experienced, and memories of some of

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the same details about those who came modified our ancestors

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and governed over us.

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Speaker 1: I got so many questions for you, and I can

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we could just keep going, but I want to. I

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want to paint the picture for the for the person like,

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who's the first time hearing this? And we're well studied

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in this stuff, but the person who this is their

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first time hearing this? Going back to Genesis in a

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Garden of Eden and the actual title of the book

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like Escaping Eating Eden? Who were our creators? Then? If

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it wasn't God, what are you saying that aliens created us?

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Like and put in humans here? What are you actually

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saying moving forward?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a very layered story. There are many places

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you could start. But if we start in Genesis one,

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what's very interesting that's happening there and it happens in

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other mythologies and ancestral narratives around the world, is we've

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got something that looks like a creation story and everybody's

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familiar with the Let there be light moment, and then

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we have the sun and the moon and the stars,

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and then the planet gets made and improved and life

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on Earth has developed. Just go back and read that again,

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because before the first word of creation is spoken, the

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planet already exists. So before light, before sun, moon, stars,

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planet Earth already exists flooded and shrouded in darkness. And

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many of the ancient narratives begin that way, with a

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devastated planet Earth and then somebody turning up to rehabilitate it.

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So Genesis follows that pattern. Many of the stories begin

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with the separation of the waters, the clearing of the sky,

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so all of a sudden we can see the sun

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again and the moon and the stars, and then the

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waters are separated in the salt water fresh water, land

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is cleared. You can hear this in Mesoamerican, African Genesis,

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Mesopotamian stories. They all have these same themes and these

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Zulu as well. That's right, and really interesting details about

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the land being cleared by water of wind. Well, that's

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in Genesis because what happens is the powerful ones turn

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up in a Rua, a word that often gets translated

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as spirit, but a bit of translation work reveals that's

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a craft. It's a craft that hovers over the waters,

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and that's where they begin their work. Rua gets used

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further in the Bible. It's in Ezekiel. It's in the

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stories of Moses and Ezekiel, gives us great detail on

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what a rua looked like, what color it was, It

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was silver, it had a glass like canopy, and he

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describes the wheels of the rua in such detail that

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NASA has a patent on those wheels and uses them

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on some of its craft on Mars. So what you've

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got is beings arriving in technology who then do work

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on the planet. And these memorializations represent the fact that

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this is an eyewitness account of our that our ancestors

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have curated. So they were already here in some shape

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or form, and what those who arrived in these stories

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do is not create our ancestors, but modify them, and

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that's how the story goes. So where life originated? I

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now hold the view that Francis crickheld, the co discoverer

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of DNA. He believed that the genetic coding for conscious

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intelligent life landed on the planet because it's been seeded

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through at least this part of the cosmos. The Zulu

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have a wonderful story of that, and that theory is

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called panspermia, and a lot of very serious credential scientists

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hold that view. The European Space Agency has spent more

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than eight billion dollars testing the theory by sending probes

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up onto comets, so the genetic coding arrives whenever it

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lands on a hospitable planet, it will result ultimately in

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the conto life. And then the stories of our mythologies

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seemed to cut in when some neighbors appear probably the

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result of the same pan spermia, the same seeding, and

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then modify what they find here, and the story suggests

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that they found something along the lines of a primate

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and modified the primates into us. If you read the

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meso American version of the story in the Popol Vu,

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it's very specific that apes and us share a common ancestor,

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and that apes and us were part of the same

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experimentation that was performed by these visitors. So that may

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be a bit of a paradigm shift. It certainly was

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for me reading that, But it caught my attention that

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centuries before Darwin, the ancient Mayan culture had made this connection.

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Weren't saying that we were descended from apes, but saying

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that we both were descended from a shared ancestor. And

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that's what science is telling us today. In DNA research, a.

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Speaker 1: Lot more questions to be clear that there's some people

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even in Chat who are saying ANONARCHI, is this the

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same thing as the Annaki or the Elohem? Is this

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the same thing or is it a little bit different.

330
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I've always thought them a little bit different in my mind.

331
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But would you say that this would be the same thing.

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Speaker 2: Yes, the stories that people know are the Anonarchy stories.

333
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They are the stories from the Sumerian canon. In Escaping

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from Eden, I refer to them as sky people because

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the glyph that's used, the little kiniform marking that's used

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on the tablets to indicate these beings simply indicates the sky,

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and the flow of the story tells you that they

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are people or beings who've come from the sky. And yes,

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those are the Anonarchy narratives.

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Speaker 1: Most stories of the Anonaki painting to be like some

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type of bad guys, like these rulers that created humans

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to mine gold is kind of the narrative that comes

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along with that word. Would this be similar to the

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Elohem in our story?

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Speaker 2: I think that is part of the story. And yes,

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the mining gold connection is there in Genesis as well.

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It's very easy to miss, but if you read the

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Eden story in Genesis, we're told for some reason, we're

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told the location of Eden where the humans are safe

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in this enclosed zone, and then we're also told that

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it's conveniently handy for some key mineral deposits. Well, who

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on Earth needs to know that Adam and Eve, in

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their blissful innocence in the garden of Eden, don't need

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to know about key mineral deposits, do they? But there

355
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is another phrase in Genesis that says that the powerful

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ones put the humans to work. And you put those

357
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two together, and there's a little hint that that work

358
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wasn't like gardening. And yes, I think there's real evidence

359
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for ancient ancient gold mining in southern Africa that appears

360
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to be a couple of one hundred thousand years old.

361
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Now science says that our ancestors were here at that time,

362
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looking pretty much as we do today, but not quite

363
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as smart. Not smart enough to farm and build cities,

364
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but smart enough to work in someone else's mine. So yes,

365
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those stories do join up. But I think you see

366
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the word an anarchy or sky people, it's interesting because

367
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it doesn't necessarily tell you that we're talking about a

368
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single demographic ad anarchy. Some people have suggested it would

369
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be helpful for us simply to translate that as astronaut,

370
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because that's what we're looking at, people who've come here

371
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from somewhere else, people who've come from the heavens. And

372
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you don't have to get far into the Mesopotamian stories

373
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or into the Genesis story before you realize there are

374
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factions and there's conflict, and you may have a number

375
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of et species bumping up against each other. And by

376
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the time you get to the stories of the Sky

377
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Council or Heavenly Council, which exists in ancestral memory all

378
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around the world, and it's there in the Bible too,

379
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it's very clear you've got very different demographics. You've got

380
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energy based beings, arconic being arconic beings, and then you've

381
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got physical visitors as well, all sitting in council conflicting

382
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with one another over the management of Project Earth and

383
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Project Humanity. And there are other conflicts too around hybridization

384
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in Genesis six that suggest you've got a number of

385
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different populations, some who may be here purely for the gold,

386
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others because of other things to do with the planet.

387
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Others may be for things to do with us, and

388
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that's part of why there is this conflict rolling on

389
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in the background in a distant past and maybe even today.

390
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Speaker 1: As this conversation with would scare some some people. This

391
00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:14,319
is the first time they're hearing some talk like this

392
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about the Bible, about the creation stories, and and and I.

393
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Right when I go to say this, I'm reading the chat,

394
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they say, what about Jesus? I want to interrupt. And

395
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I want to interject because what sets you apart from

396
00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:31,039
most people who talk about the Annaki in Genesis six

397
00:24:31,119 --> 00:24:34,160
in this type of way as someone who vouches for

398
00:24:34,279 --> 00:24:37,920
these stories. Right, You're a Christian. You are a believer,

399
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And that's one of the main reasons why I was

400
00:24:40,519 --> 00:24:43,319
excited to have you on. You weren't someone trying to

401
00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:48,839
debunk the Bible, disprove Jesus never existed and was a

402
00:24:48,880 --> 00:24:51,960
copy and these kind of things. You're actually a born

403
00:24:51,960 --> 00:24:57,279
again believer. So that's I think that's very interesting to note.

404
00:24:57,359 --> 00:25:00,079
And uh, and you know, so people know where you

405
00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:02,400
coming from, that you have a faith in the Bible,

406
00:25:02,960 --> 00:25:05,119
in Christ and in God in those things.

407
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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right. My agenda is not to debunk the Bible.

408
00:25:09,960 --> 00:25:15,400
It's to understand the Bible, and I it's funny because

409
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I would agree with a lot of what debunkers might

410
00:25:18,839 --> 00:25:22,759
have to say. But my agenda is not to deconstruct

411
00:25:22,839 --> 00:25:27,319
or destroy, but really to understand and all my life

412
00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:29,759
as a preacher, that was my approach. I want to

413
00:25:29,759 --> 00:25:31,759
know what does the text really say, Where did that

414
00:25:31,799 --> 00:25:34,799
text come from, who wrote that, why does it say that?

415
00:25:35,279 --> 00:25:37,240
And I'm really just trying to get to the bottom

416
00:25:37,240 --> 00:25:41,640
of things. It's an obvious question to ask what about Jesus,

417
00:25:41,680 --> 00:25:46,720
because there's no question that this investigation has refrained my

418
00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:52,960
understanding of God, refrained my understanding of Jesus. I still

419
00:25:53,079 --> 00:25:57,440
am a person who likes Jesus. I find it very credible.

420
00:25:57,519 --> 00:26:00,000
I like his teaching. I seek to live my life

421
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is teaching. But I could see that we have framed

422
00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:08,559
our understanding of Jesus very badly, and it flows from

423
00:26:08,759 --> 00:26:13,200
the translation problems in the Old Testament. Right at the

424
00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:16,839
beginning of Christianity, there is a big debate over whether

425
00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:22,480
Christianity should reindorse the Hebrew scriptures, a big debate over

426
00:26:22,519 --> 00:26:25,000
whether they should be glued on to the teachings of

427
00:26:25,079 --> 00:26:28,599
Jesus to make a Bible of Old Testament plus New Testament,

428
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and there were some really significant church fathers right at

429
00:26:31,920 --> 00:26:36,640
the beginning saying, no, don't do that, because we don't

430
00:26:36,799 --> 00:26:42,200
endorse the sixth century BCE edit of those books that

431
00:26:42,359 --> 00:26:46,319
turned the because there are distortions in it, and the

432
00:26:46,359 --> 00:26:51,920
distortions of these what was happening in that editing, And

433
00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:55,839
there's a very broad scholarly consensus that this editing happened

434
00:26:55,839 --> 00:26:59,079
in the sixth century BCE to harmonize it, to make

435
00:26:59,160 --> 00:27:02,559
it a book that taught a single theology. There is

436
00:27:02,640 --> 00:27:06,559
only one God, there is only one source of all things. Well,

437
00:27:06,559 --> 00:27:10,440
that's great, and I agree with that, but that led

438
00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:14,680
them to try and airbrush out of the old old

439
00:27:14,799 --> 00:27:19,240
stories any other kinds of higher beings, airbrush out what

440
00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:22,680
looked like too many gods, and airbrush out what was

441
00:27:22,799 --> 00:27:27,599
actually the memory of et contact. And they air brushed

442
00:27:27,640 --> 00:27:31,319
it out by translating Elohim in some texts where they're

443
00:27:31,319 --> 00:27:35,119
doing wicked things as or they're on the wrong side,

444
00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:40,880
as demon, false god, chieftain, and then in text where

445
00:27:40,920 --> 00:27:44,599
Elohim is clearly in charge, they're translated as God. The

446
00:27:44,640 --> 00:27:47,359
problem with that is that you end up with God

447
00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:51,400
doing abominable things, and you end up with a God

448
00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:53,920
who cannot be morally questioned. You end up with a

449
00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:58,000
God who who will pronounce the death penalty for eating

450
00:27:58,039 --> 00:28:01,680
an apple, or genocide people because he's decided he doesn't

451
00:28:01,759 --> 00:28:04,759
like them anymore, or bomb the human race back into

452
00:28:04,799 --> 00:28:07,880
an animal state because they've built a building that's too tall,

453
00:28:08,559 --> 00:28:11,279
or tell a man to kill his only son and

454
00:28:11,319 --> 00:28:13,640
then only tell him at the last second not to

455
00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:16,920
do it after all. These are the distortions that arise

456
00:28:17,119 --> 00:28:21,079
when we translate Elohim as God, and it's a total distortion.

457
00:28:21,839 --> 00:28:25,039
These church fathers didn't want to accept that because it

458
00:28:25,119 --> 00:28:29,519
makes God a monster, and then that monster is supposed

459
00:28:29,559 --> 00:28:33,200
to be the God that Jesus reveals. It's a total mismatch.

460
00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:38,359
And I think actually anyone who's got a regard for

461
00:28:38,440 --> 00:28:43,640
the teachings of Jesus will have huge questions already about

462
00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:46,440
these ancient texts, because if Jesus is showing us what

463
00:28:46,519 --> 00:28:54,160
God is like, then he can't be this unforgiving, genociding, unpredictable, punitive,

464
00:28:54,599 --> 00:28:58,200
horrible being that seems to be revealed and the stories

465
00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:01,480
as we have them translated, so for me, Jesus is

466
00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:03,759
actually still a real anchor point for me, because I

467
00:29:03,799 --> 00:29:07,480
love his teaching, but I think we need to reframe him,

468
00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:11,279
get rid of the old framing, of those old stories,

469
00:29:11,319 --> 00:29:16,960
and then also understand how Empire hijack Christianity using that

470
00:29:17,119 --> 00:29:22,920
angry God image to turn Christianity into obedience versus sin,

471
00:29:23,799 --> 00:29:29,559
worship versus idolatry, heaven versus hell. I think these are

472
00:29:29,599 --> 00:29:34,519
all narratives designed to control and minimize human beings, and

473
00:29:34,599 --> 00:29:37,559
the Empire thought we can work with that kind of Christianity,

474
00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:39,599
and indeed they did.

475
00:29:41,640 --> 00:29:43,880
Speaker 1: Going back to Genesis in the Old Testament, and we

476
00:29:43,960 --> 00:29:49,200
have the L or the eloheme the elo, and there's

477
00:29:49,279 --> 00:29:54,359
different I guess races, different types of angels in different

478
00:29:54,400 --> 00:29:58,200
rankings and things like that. Where is God in this?

479
00:29:58,279 --> 00:30:00,559
Because a lot of times we read, you know, in

480
00:30:00,599 --> 00:30:02,960
the English, we just get God, and we get God.

481
00:30:03,079 --> 00:30:06,559
For when we're talking about ghosts in some places, we

482
00:30:06,599 --> 00:30:09,640
get God. If we're talking about a zazel in some

483
00:30:09,720 --> 00:30:13,160
cases like Astrooth is a God, like we're getting it

484
00:30:13,240 --> 00:30:16,359
says God did this. Sometimes it's a capital G, sometimes

485
00:30:16,359 --> 00:30:18,680
it's a small G, and you're supposed to know who

486
00:30:18,720 --> 00:30:22,839
it is. But as far as the L and then

487
00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:26,119
what we know to be like the all mighty, all

488
00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:30,359
knowing God. Some would even say that that's not Yahweh,

489
00:30:30,359 --> 00:30:33,799
that it's something even beyond Yahweh, like Yahweh was another

490
00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:39,039
l himself or a creator God that was over, you know,

491
00:30:39,119 --> 00:30:42,400
the land. So where where does like the God fit

492
00:30:42,519 --> 00:30:45,759
in in the midst of smaller gods in the song

493
00:30:45,839 --> 00:30:48,039
and dance of the scriptures?

494
00:30:48,039 --> 00:30:51,799
Speaker 2: Sure well, the Apostle Paul did us a great service

495
00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:57,599
when he defined God in his wonderful sermon that he

496
00:30:57,720 --> 00:31:02,119
preached in Athens, and it's recorded in Acts seventeen. He

497
00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:08,720
described God as the source of the universe. So that's

498
00:31:08,720 --> 00:31:11,000
what I mean when I use the word God, and

499
00:31:11,799 --> 00:31:15,200
I don't use the word God for anything else in

500
00:31:15,279 --> 00:31:18,960
the universe. I mean the source. The Apostle Poor meant

501
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:24,960
the same. And Maral Billino, who is a very eminent

502
00:31:25,480 --> 00:31:30,640
Bible translator. He worked on Vatican Approved into linear Bibles,

503
00:31:30,680 --> 00:31:34,079
where the translation has to be very, very literal. His

504
00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:39,240
view is that God the Source, doesn't make any appearance

505
00:31:39,640 --> 00:31:43,839
in the Old Testament at all, that it's all stories

506
00:31:44,200 --> 00:31:51,240
about powerful ones, about extraterrestrials. My view is very close

507
00:31:51,279 --> 00:31:55,799
to his view. If you read the Yahweh stories. What

508
00:31:55,960 --> 00:31:59,640
I would say is this that wherever we find Yahweh

509
00:32:00,200 --> 00:32:04,480
appearing as an active character in the texts, we are

510
00:32:04,519 --> 00:32:07,880
looking at an Elahim. We're looking at a powerful one.

511
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:12,440
Yahweh refers to himself as a powerful one. Yahweh is

512
00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:15,880
referred to as a powerful one in the Ten Commandments.

513
00:32:16,440 --> 00:32:20,720
You shall have no other powerful ones, worship only Yahweh,

514
00:32:20,839 --> 00:32:25,079
Joshua says, reject the powerful ones that Abraham and Sarah

515
00:32:25,119 --> 00:32:27,960
and your ancestors served on the other side of the river,

516
00:32:28,039 --> 00:32:33,319
and serve only Yahweh. Yahweh gets really teed off, apparently

517
00:32:33,920 --> 00:32:36,680
when a king who's broken his back wants to know

518
00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:39,759
if he's going to live, and he sends his servants

519
00:32:39,799 --> 00:32:42,640
to try and get a prognosis from the powerful one

520
00:32:42,680 --> 00:32:46,359
of Ekron. You know a neighboring place with foreigners living

521
00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:49,359
in it, and Yahweh says, is there no Elahim here

522
00:32:49,400 --> 00:32:52,720
that you could talk to, pointing to himself. So there's

523
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:56,720
a proof text that Yahweh is an Elahim, and in

524
00:32:56,759 --> 00:32:59,279
all the texts where he is an active character, we're

525
00:32:59,319 --> 00:33:02,839
looking at a for one. My view is a little

526
00:33:02,880 --> 00:33:05,799
different to Marvels because I believe by the time you

527
00:33:05,839 --> 00:33:08,599
get to the end of the Old Testament and listen

528
00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:11,960
to some of the prophets, I think you're beginning to

529
00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:16,200
hear a vision of God the Source, like Jesus talked about,

530
00:33:16,279 --> 00:33:20,160
like the apostle Paul talked about the source of only

531
00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:25,319
one God, God the Source. And when they edited the

532
00:33:25,359 --> 00:33:29,160
Old Testament the Hebrew Scriptures, that was the view they

533
00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:33,359
were trying to paste across the old stories. So hats

534
00:33:33,359 --> 00:33:37,880
off for that, but hats on again because they obscured

535
00:33:38,400 --> 00:33:43,440
the extraterrestrial stories that their ancestors had curated for us

536
00:33:43,519 --> 00:33:44,240
to know about.

537
00:33:45,240 --> 00:33:48,039
Speaker 1: So when we read the Psalms and we hear about,

538
00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:52,119
you know, King David and a different psalmists say praise

539
00:33:52,200 --> 00:33:55,200
him with the timbrel, praise him all you people you

540
00:33:55,240 --> 00:33:58,799
know in these different you know how marvelous as are God,

541
00:33:58,799 --> 00:34:02,480
who created the heaven in who you know we read

542
00:34:02,519 --> 00:34:05,480
tough about in job how we created the stars and

543
00:34:05,519 --> 00:34:08,719
it can ban back to you know, oriyan and plads

544
00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:12,239
and things like that. Is that talking about the essence

545
00:34:12,360 --> 00:34:16,639
of God, the spirit of God behind everything or are

546
00:34:16,679 --> 00:34:21,079
they talking about Yahweh and some of the other creator gods.

547
00:34:22,519 --> 00:34:26,760
Speaker 2: That's a great question. I think David and the other

548
00:34:26,800 --> 00:34:31,440
psalmists are talking about both, and I think the ideas

549
00:34:31,599 --> 00:34:38,599
are really fused and confused in those psalms and songs.

550
00:34:39,760 --> 00:34:42,519
It's unmistakable that there is a cosmic vision of God

551
00:34:42,559 --> 00:34:45,199
in some of those psalms, But some of the psalms

552
00:34:45,239 --> 00:34:50,039
are very rooted in the history of warfare between Yahweh

553
00:34:50,039 --> 00:34:53,760
and the other Elahim. So I think you've got both threads.

554
00:34:54,679 --> 00:34:57,519
That's what makes it such a fascinating topic.

555
00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:02,400
Speaker 1: Are now Like when you get into like a lot

556
00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:05,280
of the Hindu traditions and stuff like that, you kind

557
00:35:05,280 --> 00:35:09,920
of get this, all of these gods are emanations of

558
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:12,639
the one, Like they're just different, Like this is a

559
00:35:12,639 --> 00:35:15,559
worrying aspect of a God, this is the loving aspect

560
00:35:15,599 --> 00:35:18,840
of a God. Almost. We kind of have something similar

561
00:35:18,880 --> 00:35:23,119
like that in the Catholic Faith with the different not popes,

562
00:35:23,159 --> 00:35:25,400
but the different saints. This is the Saint of virtue,

563
00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:27,639
this is the Saint of child bearing. Pray to that

564
00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:31,880
saint to kind of touch this part of God. Would

565
00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:34,960
do you think that that there's something like that in

566
00:35:35,320 --> 00:35:37,760
the Old Testament with the different gods who were an

567
00:35:37,800 --> 00:35:41,039
emanation of the One. For me. I think everything in

568
00:35:41,119 --> 00:35:44,599
every one is an emanation of sort, the good, the bad,

569
00:35:44,639 --> 00:35:47,239
the ugly, all of it. Yes, that's how I feel.

570
00:35:47,320 --> 00:35:49,480
But would you because it paint that picture a little bit.

571
00:35:50,559 --> 00:35:54,000
Speaker 2: That's a good question. I haven't asked that question before.

572
00:35:54,119 --> 00:35:58,239
I absolutely agree with what you're saying, the Truth Seeker.

573
00:35:58,679 --> 00:36:04,199
It's absolutely a foundational view of mine now that everything

574
00:36:04,239 --> 00:36:09,360
in the universe is an emanation, an expression of the source.

575
00:36:10,079 --> 00:36:12,920
And that was the vision of God that the early

576
00:36:13,079 --> 00:36:16,800
Christians had who leant towards Plato because the church fathers

577
00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:20,360
I mentioned before, who were saying let's not glue the

578
00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:24,719
Hebrew scriptures on, were almost saying let's glue Plato on instead,

579
00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:28,599
because he's got a really full understanding of what's going on.

580
00:36:28,679 --> 00:36:33,039
He's pulled together the Eastern understanding that you just referenced

581
00:36:33,079 --> 00:36:36,800
with the Western. He's got this beautiful cosmic understanding of

582
00:36:37,559 --> 00:36:41,960
what God is, where everything came from, and it frames

583
00:36:42,000 --> 00:36:45,480
the story of Jesus beautifully. I agree with them, and

584
00:36:45,519 --> 00:36:47,239
I think by the time we get to Jesus, we

585
00:36:47,239 --> 00:36:50,000
see that Jesus is really unpacking a lot of that thought.

586
00:36:50,519 --> 00:36:53,880
And so that applies, as you rightly say, not just

587
00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:57,920
to us as being expressions of God, but visitors too.

588
00:36:58,639 --> 00:37:01,679
And yes, there are hints that you've got Elahim in

589
00:37:01,719 --> 00:37:06,000
the Hebrew stories who are the healing ones, and then

590
00:37:06,039 --> 00:37:09,400
you've got others that are the hybridizing ones, and others

591
00:37:09,440 --> 00:37:13,760
that are the warfaring ones. So yes, that is really

592
00:37:13,800 --> 00:37:18,840
worth probing. I haven't yet taken the time to really

593
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:23,039
get into the Vaders and the Sanskrit texts. I would

594
00:37:23,079 --> 00:37:25,719
love to do that because I'm beginning to become aware

595
00:37:26,440 --> 00:37:32,119
of aspects of that wisdom that made its way into Plato,

596
00:37:32,440 --> 00:37:37,320
and that made its way into the writings of not

597
00:37:37,599 --> 00:37:40,559
only the Apostles, but there are hints of it in

598
00:37:40,639 --> 00:37:44,280
some of the later Hebrew and Greek Hebrew writings as well.

599
00:37:44,639 --> 00:37:48,199
There's so much in that melting pot. So ask me

600
00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:51,039
again next time we talk, and I'll know a little

601
00:37:51,039 --> 00:37:51,840
bit more about that.

602
00:37:52,239 --> 00:37:56,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, with all this, like I, you know,

603
00:37:56,360 --> 00:37:59,440
take a lot of the Bible literal, but I have

604
00:37:59,559 --> 00:38:02,079
a huge which place in my heart for allegory in

605
00:38:02,119 --> 00:38:05,960
the Old Testament, like the deeper meanings of my spiritual

606
00:38:06,000 --> 00:38:10,760
walk played out the hero's journey with each individual with

607
00:38:10,920 --> 00:38:14,000
King David. When I got to face my giants. Will

608
00:38:14,079 --> 00:38:17,079
I sacrifice that thing that's closest to me that I

609
00:38:17,079 --> 00:38:18,960
don't want to let go of, Like will I give

610
00:38:18,960 --> 00:38:21,320
it up only to receive something better? Kind of thing

611
00:38:21,400 --> 00:38:23,840
like in each of these stories, like we see a

612
00:38:23,960 --> 00:38:29,119
mirror as as we're reading this about ourselves. Yes, where

613
00:38:29,159 --> 00:38:33,440
do you stand on the allegory woven within those stories

614
00:38:33,480 --> 00:38:33,880
as well?

615
00:38:34,920 --> 00:38:38,639
Speaker 2: See you have said that beautifully. And this is the

616
00:38:38,719 --> 00:38:40,840
reason why I'd want to say very clearly, I'm not

617
00:38:40,920 --> 00:38:44,719
a deep bunker of the Bible, because there is phenomenal

618
00:38:45,119 --> 00:38:49,360
depth and wisdom in it, and even those editors who

619
00:38:49,400 --> 00:38:55,440
did that reaction were communicating something really important and powerful.

620
00:38:56,079 --> 00:39:00,119
And what you just said about the hero's journey it

621
00:39:00,119 --> 00:39:04,000
it relates to how I wrote Escaping from Eden because

622
00:39:04,519 --> 00:39:09,480
the last sort of prompt telling me, Paul, sit down,

623
00:39:09,920 --> 00:39:12,599
drill down into this work out what's really going on

624
00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:16,920
was when I preached through the stories of beginnings in

625
00:39:17,000 --> 00:39:22,000
Genesis in a church I was working in Victoria, and

626
00:39:22,119 --> 00:39:25,440
I began to think, wait a minute, this is the

627
00:39:25,519 --> 00:39:30,360
hero's journey told over and over and over again. I

628
00:39:30,760 --> 00:39:32,840
started reading the story of Adam and Eve and I thought,

629
00:39:32,840 --> 00:39:37,880
hold on, that's really the same as Abraham's story, that's

630
00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:42,639
really the same as Noah's story, that's David's story, but

631
00:39:42,880 --> 00:39:46,119
that's John the Baptist's story. What's going on here? And

632
00:39:46,239 --> 00:39:52,599
realize that there is this incredible depth of understanding that

633
00:39:52,840 --> 00:39:56,440
has been layered into these stories so that you can

634
00:39:56,519 --> 00:40:00,960
take the story of say Abraham and just read it

635
00:40:01,000 --> 00:40:03,760
in a literal, plain meaning kind of way, and there'll

636
00:40:03,760 --> 00:40:06,280
be information in that. And I love reading it that

637
00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:08,880
way because when I read it that way, there's an

638
00:40:08,920 --> 00:40:14,280
account of close encounters with sky people, a very significant encounter,

639
00:40:15,559 --> 00:40:18,960
but it's been told by a theologian, so there'll be

640
00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:21,840
other theological layers in it as well. And what you

641
00:40:21,880 --> 00:40:25,119
say about the hero's journey, it's so worth probing. It

642
00:40:25,280 --> 00:40:28,440
defines the story of Jesus as well. He's got like

643
00:40:28,480 --> 00:40:33,360
the ultimate hero's journey. So I think that lens is

644
00:40:33,400 --> 00:40:36,920
a really useful one to bring to many many of

645
00:40:36,920 --> 00:40:40,000
our world mythologies, the Bible included.

646
00:40:40,639 --> 00:40:43,000
Speaker 1: And how you kind of mentioned a while ago where

647
00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:46,400
you said that, you know, almost like alluding to if

648
00:40:46,400 --> 00:40:49,760
this world was destroyed and rebuilt, then these stories that

649
00:40:49,800 --> 00:40:52,760
were in our DNA and crafted like they all it

650
00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:56,400
just keeps coming through the lore no matter where. There

651
00:40:56,400 --> 00:40:59,519
are these people who have not you know, physically touched

652
00:40:59,559 --> 00:41:01,559
or represent and it, you know, been close to each

653
00:41:01,599 --> 00:41:03,280
other on the earth, and they all had the same

654
00:41:03,320 --> 00:41:06,599
story they remember as a remembering. And I feel the

655
00:41:06,599 --> 00:41:09,199
same way with the hero's journey, like if this place

656
00:41:09,320 --> 00:41:13,960
was destroyed and comes back, these stories of this dying

657
00:41:14,039 --> 00:41:17,719
and being reborn in the triumph and overcoming obstacles, It's

658
00:41:17,760 --> 00:41:20,679
in every movie, it's in Star Wars, it's in the Bible,

659
00:41:21,159 --> 00:41:25,320
and I just feel like there's something powerful about owning

660
00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:28,519
your story and overcoming your fears and overcoming your enemies

661
00:41:28,559 --> 00:41:31,800
and those things, which is from Genesis, the Revelation as

662
00:41:31,800 --> 00:41:36,039
a whole, and then from each profit, minor prophet, you know,

663
00:41:36,440 --> 00:41:39,280
lay person. You know, they all had their own journey

664
00:41:39,280 --> 00:41:41,440
that they went through, and you know, Jesus is like

665
00:41:41,480 --> 00:41:44,159
beckoning us to take up our cross as well, right

666
00:41:44,519 --> 00:41:47,599
because we have our own hero's journey that we must

667
00:41:47,800 --> 00:41:51,159
die and be reborn and choose love, you know, just

668
00:41:51,239 --> 00:41:54,840
like Luke Skywalker and those guys. There were so many

669
00:41:54,880 --> 00:41:58,079
parallels because during my whole awakening and research and study,

670
00:41:58,119 --> 00:42:01,000
I was watching Star Wars for the first time, and

671
00:42:01,039 --> 00:42:04,719
there's so many parallels to the Scriptures that it's uncanny.

672
00:42:05,079 --> 00:42:07,400
One of the things that you bring to the table

673
00:42:07,960 --> 00:42:12,599
reincarnation and channeling and things like that. Listen, I talk

674
00:42:12,639 --> 00:42:14,639
about all that stuff in my book too, because it's

675
00:42:14,679 --> 00:42:18,599
in the Bible. It's in the Bible and people don't

676
00:42:18,599 --> 00:42:21,840
even know it. And when I found this stuff out,

677
00:42:22,000 --> 00:42:24,480
like it was I seen it in Star Wars, like

678
00:42:24,519 --> 00:42:26,800
they have little things of let me teach you to

679
00:42:26,840 --> 00:42:30,280
commune with your teacher who came before you, and Yoda

680
00:42:30,360 --> 00:42:33,639
takes Luke Skywalker and teaches them how to uh well

681
00:42:34,239 --> 00:42:37,559
obi wan and teaches them how to commune with Qui

682
00:42:37,599 --> 00:42:40,760
gon Jin from behind the grave. And then we read

683
00:42:40,800 --> 00:42:44,079
the scriptures when Jesus was going into deep levels of

684
00:42:44,119 --> 00:42:47,159
prayer upon the mountain, when we kind of got to

685
00:42:47,239 --> 00:42:49,679
follow him at the amount of transfiguration, we got to

686
00:42:49,719 --> 00:42:52,360
see what he was doing, and he had this visitation

687
00:42:52,519 --> 00:42:56,360
where he was meeting with his elders that were teaching

688
00:42:56,440 --> 00:42:58,599
him from beyond the grave, when he would go into

689
00:42:58,719 --> 00:42:59,960
prayer and meditate.

690
00:43:02,480 --> 00:43:05,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's powerful, and you see, George Lucas is a

691
00:43:06,079 --> 00:43:09,599
very interesting case in point, because not only do you

692
00:43:09,639 --> 00:43:14,679
have layers and layers of ancient mythology being retold in

693
00:43:14,800 --> 00:43:20,320
Star Wars. You've also got information like the Death Star.

694
00:43:20,840 --> 00:43:26,039
No one had seen Iapetus or me Mass, which are

695
00:43:26,079 --> 00:43:30,000
the spitting image of the death Star until oh, when

696
00:43:30,119 --> 00:43:33,920
was it the nineteen eighties. I think there's a little

697
00:43:33,920 --> 00:43:37,360
blurry image we had for the first time, and then

698
00:43:37,800 --> 00:43:40,079
two thousand and four was the first time we could

699
00:43:40,079 --> 00:43:42,360
see that the death Star was the spitting image. So

700
00:43:42,400 --> 00:43:46,039
how did George Lucas have that image in nineteen seventy six.

701
00:43:46,480 --> 00:43:53,760
Scriptwriters do sometimes get fed information that has not yet

702
00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:57,360
been released to the public, and George Lucas may have

703
00:43:57,400 --> 00:44:01,000
had some of that. But I believe that George Lucas

704
00:44:01,280 --> 00:44:06,280
has talked about channeled information going into the mix of

705
00:44:06,360 --> 00:44:09,960
Star Wars, and I believe that, and I actually think

706
00:44:10,039 --> 00:44:12,840
that's where the image of the Death Star came from.

707
00:44:13,320 --> 00:44:17,119
Channeling is in the Bible. You're quite right, and it's

708
00:44:17,159 --> 00:44:21,360
one of those little anomalies that believers skip over when

709
00:44:21,360 --> 00:44:24,800
they're reading the Bible because it's outside of the frame

710
00:44:25,360 --> 00:44:29,800
of the Orthodox mainstream. But if you read John's letters

711
00:44:29,840 --> 00:44:32,480
and the New Testament, he's got a little helpful guide

712
00:44:33,519 --> 00:44:36,920
to do with channeling and makes very clear that channeling

713
00:44:37,039 --> 00:44:41,400
was part of the early Christian experience before the Empire

714
00:44:41,559 --> 00:44:44,800
narrowed it all down to this religion of worship and obedience.

715
00:44:45,719 --> 00:44:48,960
Speaker 1: I think that the Bible or inspired writing is something

716
00:44:49,000 --> 00:44:50,800
we would call auto you know what I'm saying, automatic

717
00:44:50,880 --> 00:44:55,280
writing or channeled writing, where you're getting inspired by the

718
00:44:55,320 --> 00:44:58,800
Holy Spirit or by God. And so I always say

719
00:44:58,920 --> 00:45:01,519
in my stuff, like I channel the heart of God,

720
00:45:01,599 --> 00:45:04,519
the heart of the Father, Like we're channeling his heart.

721
00:45:04,599 --> 00:45:07,000
What would he say to his people to speak to

722
00:45:07,039 --> 00:45:08,920
them in love and to build them up and things

723
00:45:08,960 --> 00:45:12,239
like that, So you know, it's not that far outside

724
00:45:12,239 --> 00:45:14,920
of the realm of understanding and when you're thinking about

725
00:45:15,079 --> 00:45:16,800
channeling information, I.

726
00:45:17,599 --> 00:45:20,199
Speaker 2: Believe in that. I believe that sometimes when we get

727
00:45:20,239 --> 00:45:26,519
into storytelling mode, we are actually beginning to channel without

728
00:45:26,559 --> 00:45:30,920
necessarily realizing that's what we're doing. And sometimes we tell

729
00:45:30,960 --> 00:45:34,559
the truth in fiction very consciously. Sometimes we tell the

730
00:45:34,559 --> 00:45:37,480
truth in fiction without knowing that's what we're doing.

731
00:45:38,519 --> 00:45:40,760
Speaker 1: I don't think that I feel like there's there's not

732
00:45:40,800 --> 00:45:43,639
anything that you can make up and trying to bring

733
00:45:43,679 --> 00:45:45,400
it to the table in fiction that it did not

734
00:45:45,440 --> 00:45:49,960
already exist. Because with that understanding, man, we've seen some

735
00:45:50,079 --> 00:45:53,199
really interesting stuff. And I've interviewed people who have had

736
00:45:53,360 --> 00:45:57,320
encounters with any type of entity that you can think of,

737
00:45:57,480 --> 00:45:59,880
you know, and I've had so many encounters myself. But

738
00:46:00,039 --> 00:46:03,199
it's a place of having faith or believing that it's true,

739
00:46:03,599 --> 00:46:07,199
and then it shows itself to you. And so that

740
00:46:07,239 --> 00:46:10,400
the channeling, the angels, the demons, if you believe it

741
00:46:10,440 --> 00:46:14,239
to be true, what happens it shows itself to you.

742
00:46:14,719 --> 00:46:18,639
Speaker 2: Well, that's right, that's right. You have to have some

743
00:46:18,760 --> 00:46:21,800
kind of a framework to understand what you're seeing or

744
00:46:21,920 --> 00:46:25,159
understand what you're experiencing. And it's why for me, for instance,

745
00:46:26,320 --> 00:46:30,000
when Escaping from Eden came out earlier this year, I

746
00:46:30,280 --> 00:46:35,559
started being contacted weekly and some weeks every single day

747
00:46:35,679 --> 00:46:40,840
by people who had had anomalous experiences, not necessarily of ETS,

748
00:46:41,519 --> 00:46:45,039
but anomalous experiences that they couldn't talk about and they

749
00:46:45,039 --> 00:46:46,639
thought they could talk to me about it. So they

750
00:46:46,679 --> 00:46:49,920
contacted me, and people began asking me, Paul, have you

751
00:46:50,039 --> 00:46:53,760
ever had a close encounter, you know, with an ET?

752
00:46:54,920 --> 00:46:58,559
And early on my answer was no, I haven't. I

753
00:46:58,599 --> 00:47:01,239
know a lot of people who have. But then my

754
00:47:01,320 --> 00:47:03,880
answer started to shift because as I heard more and

755
00:47:03,960 --> 00:47:08,480
more testimony. I realized, wait a minute, there was that

756
00:47:08,519 --> 00:47:13,079
funny thing that happened to me back in nineteen eighty five,

757
00:47:13,199 --> 00:47:15,920
and then that funny thing and that funny thing, and

758
00:47:15,960 --> 00:47:19,000
I began joining the dots and realized that I had

759
00:47:19,000 --> 00:47:23,519
a number of experiences that I had never understood because

760
00:47:23,559 --> 00:47:26,880
I didn't have the framework to understand it. I had

761
00:47:26,880 --> 00:47:29,519
some experiences that I thought, I don't understand it. It

762
00:47:29,599 --> 00:47:32,440
must have been demonic because that was one of my boxes.

763
00:47:32,920 --> 00:47:35,440
Or I had that experience I don't understand. It must

764
00:47:35,440 --> 00:47:37,920
have been angelic because that was one of my boxes,

765
00:47:38,000 --> 00:47:41,440
Or that must have been God. Now I've got more boxes.

766
00:47:41,519 --> 00:47:44,840
I realized there are more kinds of entity and reality

767
00:47:45,079 --> 00:47:47,639
and dimensionality to the universe, and I can look back

768
00:47:47,679 --> 00:47:51,960
and say, wow, actually, those were ety encounters. I just

769
00:47:51,960 --> 00:47:55,920
didn't have the language for it. So the language we

770
00:47:56,000 --> 00:48:00,440
have in our heads really can shape what we think we'reperiencing.

771
00:48:00,519 --> 00:48:02,400
And that's one of the reasons I wrote Escaping for

772
00:48:02,559 --> 00:48:05,480
me and to try and break the taboo, to put

773
00:48:06,119 --> 00:48:11,599
the language of a populated universe back on the table

774
00:48:11,679 --> 00:48:15,280
so people can begin and telling their own stories and

775
00:48:15,360 --> 00:48:18,480
hearing from others. And I think that will shift the

776
00:48:18,519 --> 00:48:20,880
worldview of many if we can talk and listen in

777
00:48:20,920 --> 00:48:22,679
that open minded way.

778
00:48:24,880 --> 00:48:27,400
Speaker 1: My next question, I think the two kind of kind

779
00:48:27,440 --> 00:48:31,119
of tie together a little bit. But what about shamanic

780
00:48:31,199 --> 00:48:37,239
experiences and so like seeing some of the primitive spirituality

781
00:48:37,760 --> 00:48:40,679
of the Bible which is forgotten, you know? And I

782
00:48:40,719 --> 00:48:43,079
think that we can look at the other cultures and

783
00:48:43,199 --> 00:48:48,000
see some similar things that they're doing, whether it's transcendental meditation,

784
00:48:48,119 --> 00:48:51,199
whether it's fasting, Like there's a bunch of like intense

785
00:48:51,280 --> 00:48:55,719
spirituality that was practiced in the Bible that we look

786
00:48:55,760 --> 00:48:58,119
at it now is primitive. Some of it, I feel

787
00:48:58,159 --> 00:49:01,159
like made it over to the charismatic movements and Pentecosta

788
00:49:01,199 --> 00:49:05,480
movements to Quakers and shaking and dancing and shouting but

789
00:49:05,519 --> 00:49:08,800
then getting really still and quiet and allowing God to

790
00:49:08,840 --> 00:49:10,960
speak to you. And there was a lot of like

791
00:49:11,519 --> 00:49:16,559
really deep spirituality that was in the Old Testament that

792
00:49:16,599 --> 00:49:18,880
we look over and forget. Do you have any of

793
00:49:18,920 --> 00:49:21,840
those examples where we would we would call them shamanic

794
00:49:21,960 --> 00:49:23,199
or they would appear to be that way.

795
00:49:24,360 --> 00:49:28,719
Speaker 2: Definitely, And it's so interesting how all this joins up.

796
00:49:29,679 --> 00:49:32,360
First of all, because a lot of shamanic traditions have

797
00:49:32,639 --> 00:49:38,559
language for other dimensional beings and extraterrestrial beings. There is

798
00:49:38,679 --> 00:49:43,440
shamanism in the Bible. It's it's in a way, you've

799
00:49:43,440 --> 00:49:45,840
got to go looking for it. But you start reading

800
00:49:45,880 --> 00:49:50,239
the stories of the prophets, start looking at what the

801
00:49:50,280 --> 00:49:54,000
instructions were to priests, and you realize that you've got

802
00:49:54,039 --> 00:49:56,840
a pattern of shamanism there, that there is a use

803
00:49:57,480 --> 00:50:08,239
of plants, of smoke, technology, silence, dance, vibration. It occurs

804
00:50:08,239 --> 00:50:11,239
in shamanism around the world, and it is there in

805
00:50:11,280 --> 00:50:15,119
the Hebrew tradition as well. What made me make the

806
00:50:15,159 --> 00:50:19,199
connection with shamanism was when I read the pop paul Vu,

807
00:50:19,320 --> 00:50:23,760
which is the Mayan story of where we all came from.

808
00:50:24,079 --> 00:50:29,199
And like many of the stories of humanity's evolution, their

809
00:50:29,280 --> 00:50:33,280
story is that we were engineered from a primate ancestor

810
00:50:33,480 --> 00:50:38,000
and an upgraded, upgraded, upgraded, until we were US plus

811
00:50:38,760 --> 00:50:46,800
US plus precognition, telepathy, remote viewing, self healing, and the

812
00:50:46,840 --> 00:50:49,039
engineers as they're called, and the pope or Vu the

813
00:50:49,119 --> 00:50:53,360
visitors said, these humans are a little bit difficult to manage.

814
00:50:54,079 --> 00:50:57,800
I mean, how do you enslave or heard a creature

815
00:50:57,840 --> 00:51:02,599
that's got precognition? I mean you're losing wicket. So they decided,

816
00:51:02,599 --> 00:51:05,880
we've got to downgrade these humans, and so they created

817
00:51:05,920 --> 00:51:09,440
a vapor that, when it was sprayed over human populations,

818
00:51:09,920 --> 00:51:13,960
damaged our neurological connections and brought us back down to

819
00:51:14,519 --> 00:51:20,360
a three D world and our five physical senses. What's

820
00:51:20,519 --> 00:51:23,239
interesting about that how it connects with shamanism, is that

821
00:51:23,320 --> 00:51:26,440
the same culture that curated that story of the final

822
00:51:26,519 --> 00:51:31,519
downgrade has curated all kinds of practices to re upgrade

823
00:51:32,079 --> 00:51:35,800
our experience. And so in the Meso American tradition, you've

824
00:51:35,800 --> 00:51:39,320
got psycho effective teas that are designed to do exactly

825
00:51:39,360 --> 00:51:42,519
that make us more conscious, allow us to see beyond

826
00:51:43,199 --> 00:51:49,199
the physical limitation of our locality, psycho effective teas that

827
00:51:49,280 --> 00:51:52,760
mean we can interact with other kinds of being, that

828
00:51:52,800 --> 00:51:56,320
we can begin to see ourselves as a consciousness that

829
00:51:56,440 --> 00:52:01,360
precedes this life and follows it. That of shamanism is

830
00:52:01,599 --> 00:52:07,079
very connected with this et narrative. My ears pricked up

831
00:52:07,079 --> 00:52:10,000
when I read that, because I already knew about this syndrome,

832
00:52:10,760 --> 00:52:15,079
a neurological syndrome called acquired savant syndrome, which is where

833
00:52:15,119 --> 00:52:18,599
people have an accident, they get a brain injury. There's

834
00:52:18,599 --> 00:52:22,920
a central nervous system event, and it actually releases phenomenal

835
00:52:23,039 --> 00:52:26,239
skills that they didn't have before, mathematical skills, a new

836
00:52:26,320 --> 00:52:29,800
language they couldn't speak before, musical artistic ability they didn't

837
00:52:29,800 --> 00:52:35,679
have before, very very objective shift in the upwards direction.

838
00:52:36,119 --> 00:52:38,519
And it's so strange. How can an injury make a

839
00:52:38,599 --> 00:52:42,960
human being cleverer? And the neurologist to study this, Darryl

840
00:52:43,039 --> 00:52:46,320
Trefford of Marian University, has more than seventy cases of

841
00:52:46,360 --> 00:52:49,760
this that he's tracked. You see, our science baffles at that,

842
00:52:50,320 --> 00:52:53,840
but the mythology of the popol vu says that's perfectly understandable.

843
00:52:54,719 --> 00:52:58,039
We all have those higher capacities, but they've been put

844
00:52:58,079 --> 00:53:03,400
into the opposition. Shamanism mystical traditions are all about turning

845
00:53:03,440 --> 00:53:06,519
the inhibitors off re upgrading us, and so you can

846
00:53:06,559 --> 00:53:11,199
find psycho effective teas, smoke and smoking, ceremonies, use of vibration,

847
00:53:11,679 --> 00:53:17,079
chanting music, dance control, conscious breathing. These are elements of

848
00:53:17,119 --> 00:53:20,639
shamanism in cultures with no contact with each other, apparently

849
00:53:20,719 --> 00:53:23,719
all around the world, and that is what they're aiming at,

850
00:53:23,760 --> 00:53:28,599
getting us more conscious, more intelligent, better able to self heal.

851
00:53:29,000 --> 00:53:32,719
And many people who practice those things, myself included, would

852
00:53:32,760 --> 00:53:37,760
say it does release these abilities. I can say I've

853
00:53:38,039 --> 00:53:45,360
experienced fragments, fragmentary moments of remote viewing, precognition, telepathic connection

854
00:53:46,079 --> 00:53:49,559
through using those mystical and shamanic modalities, and that I

855
00:53:49,599 --> 00:53:52,880
find that really exciting and to begin to honor those

856
00:53:52,920 --> 00:53:56,239
traditions instead of seeing talking about witch doctors and seeing

857
00:53:56,239 --> 00:53:58,960
them as primitive and so on and so forth. No,

858
00:53:59,079 --> 00:54:02,800
they have curated something really really important. If we could

859
00:54:02,840 --> 00:54:05,679
all live more intelligently on this planet, what would that

860
00:54:05,760 --> 00:54:06,159
look like?

861
00:54:08,519 --> 00:54:14,880
Speaker 1: The the evil aliens are wicked rulers or whoever? Why

862
00:54:15,079 --> 00:54:18,400
is this stuff forgotten? Why is this scheduled one substance

863
00:54:18,440 --> 00:54:20,639
that will lock you up forever if they catch you

864
00:54:21,199 --> 00:54:23,559
with any of some of these things that we're talking about,

865
00:54:23,559 --> 00:54:27,519
the plant medicines and shamanic medicines, and and it's forgotten

866
00:54:27,599 --> 00:54:32,960
that their church calls it evil wicked. Who's running the show?

867
00:54:33,599 --> 00:54:37,199
You know? Is there are there? I feel like all

868
00:54:37,239 --> 00:54:40,559
sources say the bad guys are are running this thing

869
00:54:40,639 --> 00:54:44,119
at the at the top levels of schooling, of society,

870
00:54:44,159 --> 00:54:48,480
of government, of the pharmaceutical industries, like that these people

871
00:54:48,880 --> 00:54:51,239
do not have our best interest in mind and want

872
00:54:51,239 --> 00:54:54,800
to you're talking about ruling us. They're definitely the ruling

873
00:54:54,960 --> 00:54:58,039
class of what we have. Who are these people? We

874
00:54:58,079 --> 00:55:00,599
call them our presidents, we call them our dict Who

875
00:55:00,679 --> 00:55:03,039
are they?

876
00:55:03,239 --> 00:55:08,679
Speaker 2: Yes? I think the more you read world mythologies and

877
00:55:08,800 --> 00:55:13,480
ancient ancestral narratives, the boy you start thinking that these

878
00:55:13,480 --> 00:55:18,480
guys writing about twenty twenty, because the themes really are

879
00:55:18,519 --> 00:55:21,760
the same. If you just go to Genesis, for instance,

880
00:55:21,800 --> 00:55:26,039
and you look at what the Sky Council is debating over.

881
00:55:26,679 --> 00:55:31,880
In Genesis, they're debating over how healthy should the human

882
00:55:31,920 --> 00:55:35,800
beings be, what access should they have to medical cures,

883
00:55:36,199 --> 00:55:40,199
how long lived should they be, how intelligent should they be,

884
00:55:40,320 --> 00:55:44,119
how much access to information? How much awareness and access

885
00:55:44,119 --> 00:55:48,480
should they have to us the powerful ones. These are

886
00:55:48,519 --> 00:55:50,760
all the debates they have, and it seems to me

887
00:55:50,840 --> 00:55:55,039
they're the same debates being had in the twenty first century.

888
00:55:55,760 --> 00:56:00,199
Access to clean and safe drinking water, access to safe food,

889
00:56:00,239 --> 00:56:06,360
access to medication, access to education, access to the truth

890
00:56:06,400 --> 00:56:09,440
of what's going on. These are all live issues. Is

891
00:56:09,440 --> 00:56:12,880
it a coincidence that these are the same live issues.

892
00:56:13,280 --> 00:56:18,599
Genesis suggests that there is this cabal of other species

893
00:56:18,639 --> 00:56:22,320
who all have a stakeholding in Project Earth and Project

894
00:56:22,400 --> 00:56:26,880
Humanity and they're conflicting over it. Then is that story

895
00:56:26,920 --> 00:56:29,000
told to tell us why things work the way they

896
00:56:29,039 --> 00:56:33,920
do today? And my suspicion is yes, it's a story

897
00:56:33,960 --> 00:56:37,719
about now just as much as then. And then there's

898
00:56:37,760 --> 00:56:40,239
the question of, well, how does this relate to the

899
00:56:40,280 --> 00:56:44,119
past structures we can see, because there's a very interesting

900
00:56:44,199 --> 00:56:47,440
moment that comes if you follow the stories of the Bible,

901
00:56:48,000 --> 00:56:53,079
where you've got the powerful ones seemingly running the show,

902
00:56:53,920 --> 00:56:56,920
but all of a sudden they're not there anymore. You've

903
00:56:56,960 --> 00:57:00,119
just got the priesthoods, You've just got the technology, you've

904
00:57:00,159 --> 00:57:02,280
got the Ark of the Covenant, you've got the Urim

905
00:57:02,280 --> 00:57:05,880
and Thummin, you've got people going and consulting their totems.

906
00:57:05,920 --> 00:57:10,480
But where actually are the powerful ones? And that story

907
00:57:11,400 --> 00:57:15,320
anyone who's watched the original series of Star Trek knows

908
00:57:15,360 --> 00:57:17,519
that story got told a couple of times where it

909
00:57:17,559 --> 00:57:19,639
turned out things were being rung by the priests but

910
00:57:19,719 --> 00:57:24,360
the gods had disappeared. But it raises a really interesting question,

911
00:57:24,960 --> 00:57:27,599
the one you've just asked, who's in charge? Why are

912
00:57:27,599 --> 00:57:30,360
these the issues and why are they the issues in

913
00:57:30,400 --> 00:57:34,480
twenty twenty, after we've had you know, revolutions, we've got democracy,

914
00:57:35,519 --> 00:57:40,119
we've got the media. Why yeah, clean energy exactly, why

915
00:57:40,239 --> 00:57:43,039
is this still an issue? And you see, clean energy

916
00:57:43,079 --> 00:57:48,320
is a really good illustration of the question because Ed Mitchell,

917
00:57:48,840 --> 00:57:52,360
the sixth man to walk on the moon, as a

918
00:57:52,559 --> 00:57:56,119
NASA alumnus, he would have been bound by layer on

919
00:57:56,320 --> 00:57:59,840
layer of official secrets laws, and yet he was very

920
00:58:00,239 --> 00:58:03,840
spoken in championing the cause of disclosure, and he said

921
00:58:03,880 --> 00:58:06,880
one of the things that motivated him was that the

922
00:58:06,960 --> 00:58:11,639
human race should be benefiting from clean, free energy, which

923
00:58:11,679 --> 00:58:17,079
he believed was available through our technological contact with et species.

924
00:58:17,440 --> 00:58:20,360
And that's what he was allowed to say, So goodness

925
00:58:20,360 --> 00:58:22,679
only knows what he was not allowed to say. Now,

926
00:58:22,719 --> 00:58:25,159
if you listen to him and you come to that conclusion,

927
00:58:26,119 --> 00:58:29,159
then you come back to the question of why is

928
00:58:29,199 --> 00:58:33,360
that technology suppressed and who's suppressing it? Who and by

929
00:58:33,400 --> 00:58:35,840
what authority has made the decision we're not going to

930
00:58:35,880 --> 00:58:37,679
have free energy and we're going to be enslaved to

931
00:58:37,719 --> 00:58:40,800
oil companies and so on and so forth. We see

932
00:58:40,840 --> 00:58:43,920
the conflict over clean energy playing out in our politics,

933
00:58:44,519 --> 00:58:49,159
But is the root of it actually somewhere else you

934
00:58:49,159 --> 00:58:51,599
can see it. Also, I talk about this and the

935
00:58:51,599 --> 00:58:54,719
sequel to Escaping from Eden. There is a conflict on

936
00:58:54,800 --> 00:58:59,599
planet Earth right now between two models of farming. There's

937
00:58:59,599 --> 00:59:05,559
the tradition model of farming, which is rotational, natural, organic, sustainable,

938
00:59:06,280 --> 00:59:09,679
and then you've got an industrial model where you have

939
00:59:09,920 --> 00:59:15,320
infertile soil and you need petrochemicals to grow your food,

940
00:59:15,599 --> 00:59:18,599
and then you have to buy patented foods every year

941
00:59:18,639 --> 00:59:21,679
to grow them. Those are two different models of farming,

942
00:59:22,280 --> 00:59:25,400
and my studies in Escaping from Eden and for its

943
00:59:25,400 --> 00:59:29,519
sequel suggest to me that those conflicts originate off planet

944
00:59:29,880 --> 00:59:33,079
and in cultures that came from somewhere else.

945
00:59:35,280 --> 00:59:38,800
Speaker 1: It's interesting, I think. I think these these so called

946
00:59:38,840 --> 00:59:42,199
leaders have you know, malicious intent and feeding us things

947
00:59:42,239 --> 00:59:44,559
that our bodies weren't meant to eat, and they're okay

948
00:59:44,599 --> 00:59:46,880
with signing off one stuff. I mean, it's the list

949
00:59:46,920 --> 00:59:48,280
goes on and on and on.

950
00:59:49,000 --> 00:59:51,400
Speaker 2: Just just not to make it too bleak. As something

951
00:59:51,480 --> 00:59:54,480
I forgot to say though, is worth remembering. On that council.

952
00:59:54,800 --> 00:59:58,079
There's a spectrum. There's a spectrum of beings. There's some

953
00:59:58,400 --> 01:00:02,280
who have no empathy for humanity at all, and there

954
01:00:02,320 --> 01:00:06,000
are others who I believe are here because they are

955
01:00:06,119 --> 01:00:09,639
concerned for us and they are advocating for us. And

956
01:00:09,719 --> 01:00:12,880
there's been this strange kind of stability and a stability

957
01:00:12,880 --> 01:00:16,880
of non disclosure for at least seventy years because there

958
01:00:17,039 --> 01:00:19,480
is a power balance with a little bit of hope,

959
01:00:20,119 --> 01:00:24,960
because I think there is a positive eachy presence that's

960
01:00:25,000 --> 01:00:28,039
involved in the story of humanity right now as well.

961
01:00:30,360 --> 01:00:32,679
Speaker 1: I mean some people with you know, I mean, how

962
01:00:32,679 --> 01:00:35,960
do you choose though? Do we vote these these individuals in?

963
01:00:36,159 --> 01:00:40,480
Surely not the Democratic Republic is one good and one

964
01:00:40,519 --> 01:00:43,639
bad because the Church will definitely tell you that the

965
01:00:43,679 --> 01:00:48,559
Democratic Party is the satanic God hating party and the

966
01:00:48,599 --> 01:00:52,440
Republican is the God fearing you know, keep God in

967
01:00:52,519 --> 01:00:56,840
school like traditional like they literally see it like that

968
01:00:57,079 --> 01:01:00,960
for sure. But that's not what we're saying, right we

969
01:01:01,280 --> 01:01:03,039
colect our gods? Right?

970
01:01:04,920 --> 01:01:08,639
Speaker 2: No, we can't. And I think one of the things

971
01:01:08,679 --> 01:01:16,920
that when people get this paradigm shift and they realize

972
01:01:17,079 --> 01:01:19,320
there is an eaty presence. It's been here a long

973
01:01:19,400 --> 01:01:22,880
time and there are layers of government that know about it,

974
01:01:22,880 --> 01:01:25,199
it can be a very deflating moment because you can

975
01:01:25,239 --> 01:01:29,280
feel so disempowered by that and as you begin to

976
01:01:29,320 --> 01:01:35,800
absorb the implications of it, you realize how little we're

977
01:01:35,840 --> 01:01:40,960
able to affect through our democratic structures. Democracy, I think

978
01:01:41,079 --> 01:01:46,960
achieved some wonderful things, particularly after democratic reforms in the

979
01:01:46,960 --> 01:01:50,880
eighteen hundreds, right up until when I was a young boy.

980
01:01:51,719 --> 01:01:54,719
And since that time, we've seen power shift away from

981
01:01:54,719 --> 01:01:58,920
democratic structures again, and it's becoming depressingly clear that there

982
01:01:59,079 --> 01:02:02,559
is an elite that's stands above democracy, and we see

983
01:02:02,599 --> 01:02:06,199
it reflected in the power of corporations, but we also

984
01:02:07,599 --> 01:02:11,039
understand that it's happening at a covert level. The mythologists

985
01:02:11,079 --> 01:02:14,719
tell us this. I've come to conclude that is the case,

986
01:02:15,360 --> 01:02:18,559
and so my questions have had to shift because when

987
01:02:18,599 --> 01:02:23,079
I was younger, I was hopeful that political processes could

988
01:02:23,119 --> 01:02:26,599
really bring reform and positive change, because I'd seen a

989
01:02:26,599 --> 01:02:29,440
little bit of that as a boy. Now I'm not

990
01:02:29,639 --> 01:02:33,039
very hopeful. I think our democratic structures have really been hijacked,

991
01:02:34,679 --> 01:02:38,840
and so my question has to shift to how do

992
01:02:38,960 --> 01:02:41,840
I live in this world? How do we live in

993
01:02:41,880 --> 01:02:44,960
this world, this world where there has been this sky

994
01:02:45,039 --> 01:02:48,400
Council present all this time. How do we have the

995
01:02:48,440 --> 01:02:51,880
best most conscious human experience we can? How do we

996
01:02:51,920 --> 01:02:56,280
empower ourselves, and I think that peer to peer conversation

997
01:02:56,440 --> 01:03:00,559
and disclosure is really important in this whole process, because

998
01:03:00,599 --> 01:03:04,880
if we simply allow ourselves to be made too busy

999
01:03:05,360 --> 01:03:09,039
by the world of work or syllabus bound in the

1000
01:03:09,039 --> 01:03:13,360
world of education, then we won't look above the parapet

1001
01:03:13,400 --> 01:03:15,400
and see a much bigger picture. This is why I

1002
01:03:15,519 --> 01:03:18,239
love what you're doing, Truth Seeker. I think your show

1003
01:03:18,280 --> 01:03:21,159
and shows like this are really really important in the

1004
01:03:21,199 --> 01:03:26,440
twenty first century because it's how we empower ourselves. Talking, listening,

1005
01:03:26,599 --> 01:03:31,039
getting the bigger picture, understanding who we are, and knowing

1006
01:03:31,039 --> 01:03:35,960
that our power doesn't come from our superiors, doesn't come

1007
01:03:36,000 --> 01:03:38,639
from the governments over us. It comes from who we

1008
01:03:38,679 --> 01:03:42,159
are and our relationship to the cosmos, our relationship to

1009
01:03:42,199 --> 01:03:46,079
consciousness and intelligence. And that's more and more where my

1010
01:03:46,599 --> 01:03:49,719
confidence and my hope comes from.

1011
01:03:50,559 --> 01:03:52,800
Speaker 1: You know, they've been here the whole time, and all

1012
01:03:52,800 --> 01:03:56,079
we had to do was stop and look up or

1013
01:03:56,920 --> 01:03:59,559
stop and look within one or the other. But we're

1014
01:03:59,599 --> 01:04:02,920
so on you know these things that you've mentioned out here,

1015
01:04:02,960 --> 01:04:05,360
and it's very well, it's very much a matrix that

1016
01:04:05,480 --> 01:04:08,679
keeps you locked in that you can't literally all you

1017
01:04:08,760 --> 01:04:10,880
have to do is just like stargates for just a

1018
01:04:10,880 --> 01:04:14,320
couple of days or something, go out and the part

1019
01:04:14,440 --> 01:04:16,559
is that to say, hey, I'm gonna spend seven hours

1020
01:04:16,559 --> 01:04:21,239
outside tonight stargazing, or you spend seven hours doing other things,

1021
01:04:21,440 --> 01:04:25,000
working your job, but you know of you know, just

1022
01:04:25,079 --> 01:04:27,800
being present in the moment. So I mean all of

1023
01:04:27,840 --> 01:04:31,199
the things you've mentioned about, you know, the spirituality and

1024
01:04:31,239 --> 01:04:35,159
the meditation and breath work and uh, plant ceremonies which

1025
01:04:35,199 --> 01:04:38,440
are like booming right now, and it like you know,

1026
01:04:38,440 --> 01:04:42,440
knowledge is increasing about there. There are connection with the

1027
01:04:42,480 --> 01:04:44,800
plants and how they can help us and serve as

1028
01:04:44,800 --> 01:04:48,360
a medicine. And so this stuff is because of these talks,

1029
01:04:48,360 --> 01:04:51,159
because of these podcasts and art and music and books

1030
01:04:51,199 --> 01:04:53,559
and everything is bringing this stuff back to the table.

1031
01:04:53,599 --> 01:04:56,440
So kudos to you as well. We're at the top

1032
01:04:56,440 --> 01:04:57,760
of the hour. We're gonna go ahead and go to

1033
01:04:57,840 --> 01:05:00,320
a quick break and then we'll come back. Got a

1034
01:05:00,320 --> 01:05:02,719
bunch more questions for you, Paul. I'm enjoying it so much, man,

1035
01:05:02,840 --> 01:05:06,280
We'll be right back. Thank you, guys. Likewise, thanks, and

1036
01:05:06,360 --> 01:05:09,679
just so you guys know, we're in the middle of

1037
01:05:09,679 --> 01:05:12,400
a hurricane. We're in the middle of a hurricane. Like

1038
01:05:12,440 --> 01:05:17,400
there's literally one hundred mile an hour winds back and

1039
01:05:17,440 --> 01:05:21,679
forth outside. So I'm hearing it outside my window. Sounds

1040
01:05:21,719 --> 01:05:24,440
pretty scary. We're going through a hurricane right now. But

1041
01:05:25,400 --> 01:05:29,440
we've got the internet, we've got power. We're making it happen. Paul,

1042
01:05:29,719 --> 01:05:33,599
we're talking about your book, Escaping from Eden. Enjoying it

1043
01:05:33,679 --> 01:05:37,639
man so far, and really excited to dig into your

1044
01:05:37,639 --> 01:05:41,519
work because it's not a one stop shop, like it's

1045
01:05:41,559 --> 01:05:44,800
not just you know, this isn't your song and dance

1046
01:05:44,840 --> 01:05:46,480
and you ride off into the wind, like you have

1047
01:05:46,599 --> 01:05:48,320
a lot of stuff that you're bringing to the table

1048
01:05:48,320 --> 01:05:51,559
when it comes to spirituality, when it comes to what

1049
01:05:51,639 --> 01:05:54,480
I would say is true Christianity and returning to the

1050
01:05:54,639 --> 01:05:57,519
essence of living from the heart, as someone would say,

1051
01:05:57,679 --> 01:06:00,920
in many different aspects with that. And so I'm uh,

1052
01:06:01,320 --> 01:06:03,079
you know, I, like I said, I went to your

1053
01:06:03,079 --> 01:06:05,880
website whenever I got the email from from your publicist

1054
01:06:05,960 --> 01:06:08,039
or whatever to check out your work. And and I

1055
01:06:08,320 --> 01:06:11,079
do with a quick, quick, you know, two minute glance,

1056
01:06:11,199 --> 01:06:13,159
I go and say, okay, that that that okay, that's

1057
01:06:13,159 --> 01:06:16,840
a great conversation. I've got questions and literally that's it. Okay,

1058
01:06:16,920 --> 01:06:19,039
let's book it, it's gonna be a great talk. And

1059
01:06:19,119 --> 01:06:22,760
so I had a quick, you know, synopsis of what

1060
01:06:22,760 --> 01:06:23,480
you were bringing to the.

1061
01:06:23,440 --> 01:06:26,039
Speaker 2: Tiger than me. So you must have been learning at

1062
01:06:26,039 --> 01:06:28,679
a really rapid rate through real life.

1063
01:06:29,400 --> 01:06:31,480
Speaker 1: Well I didn't. You know, I didn't do well in school,

1064
01:06:31,599 --> 01:06:35,079
and I didn't I never learned how to study in school,

1065
01:06:35,119 --> 01:06:37,039
Like I just showed up and didn't. I don't know

1066
01:06:37,039 --> 01:06:39,559
if it was a d D or whatever. I couldn't study.

1067
01:06:39,559 --> 01:06:43,480
It didn't interest me. And then when I finally got

1068
01:06:43,519 --> 01:06:46,360
born again and started reading the scriptures, and then all

1069
01:06:46,360 --> 01:06:49,840
of this other material, uh for the first time, like

1070
01:06:50,519 --> 01:06:55,920
studying became a new world for me. All right, ladies

1071
01:06:55,960 --> 01:06:58,159
and gentlemen, we're back. Like I said, we're going through

1072
01:06:58,320 --> 01:07:01,599
a hurricane down here in Mobile, Alabama right now, and

1073
01:07:01,639 --> 01:07:04,880
there's like over we have wind gusts sustain up to

1074
01:07:05,039 --> 01:07:07,679
one hundred miles an hour, so the power is still

1075
01:07:07,719 --> 01:07:09,679
on but it's going in and out. So we're gonna

1076
01:07:09,719 --> 01:07:12,039
have to make this short. But we got to make

1077
01:07:12,079 --> 01:07:14,679
it happen again, Paul, because I really have enjoyed this

1078
01:07:14,760 --> 01:07:17,840
conversation right up my alley, my research. I love it. Man.

1079
01:07:18,199 --> 01:07:19,840
We have to make this happen again for sure.

1080
01:07:20,519 --> 01:07:23,000
Speaker 2: Definitely. I look forward to it all.

1081
01:07:22,960 --> 01:07:24,719
Speaker 1: Right, So if people want to get the book, man,

1082
01:07:24,800 --> 01:07:27,159
because you go into all of this stuff and more

1083
01:07:27,199 --> 01:07:29,679
that we've been talking about. This is the first time

1084
01:07:29,719 --> 01:07:32,239
for a lot of people hearing about this stuff. Where's

1085
01:07:32,280 --> 01:07:34,280
the best place for them to go to check out

1086
01:07:34,280 --> 01:07:35,280
your book and get a copy?

1087
01:07:36,079 --> 01:07:40,960
Speaker 2: Sure, go to Amazon, Kindle, Bonds and Noble. Wherever they

1088
01:07:41,000 --> 01:07:43,559
sell books, they'll sell Escaping from Eden. You can go

1089
01:07:43,599 --> 01:07:47,920
to my website which is Paulanthony Wallace dot com, Anthony

1090
01:07:47,960 --> 01:07:50,440
with an H. Wallace w A L L I S.

1091
01:07:50,559 --> 01:07:52,840
Paul Anthony Wallace dot com. Go to the pul Wallace

1092
01:07:52,920 --> 01:07:56,239
channel on YouTube or the Fifth Kind TV, and you

1093
01:07:56,239 --> 01:07:57,760
can keep up with everything I'm doing.

1094
01:07:58,719 --> 01:08:01,320
Speaker 1: Sounds good. I was the comments a while ago and

1095
01:08:01,400 --> 01:08:03,840
there was a couple of people like like again, it

1096
01:08:03,880 --> 01:08:05,800
was the first time hearing this, and I got to

1097
01:08:05,800 --> 01:08:07,880
talk to this man, I have to know more. You

1098
01:08:07,960 --> 01:08:10,000
got a lot of stuff at your website, right, because

1099
01:08:10,039 --> 01:08:12,880
I actually just go to the website.

1100
01:08:13,599 --> 01:08:16,000
Speaker 2: Definitely, go to Paul Anthony Wallace dot com and you

1101
01:08:16,039 --> 01:08:19,039
can reach me through the About Paul and contact page

1102
01:08:19,399 --> 01:08:20,880
and we can get into a conversation.

1103
01:08:21,680 --> 01:08:23,760
Speaker 1: Good stuff, Paul, thanks so much for coming on. Man.

1104
01:08:24,239 --> 01:08:26,840
Enjoyed this talk and hopefully we can make it happen

1105
01:08:26,840 --> 01:08:30,520
again when there's no hurricane, but you know we can't prepare. Mother.

1106
01:08:31,600 --> 01:08:33,520
Speaker 2: I wish you well and I look forward to our

1107
01:08:33,520 --> 01:08:35,880
next conversation. Thanks so much for today.

1108
01:08:36,000 --> 01:08:39,199
Speaker 1: For sure, Brother, Thank you so much. God bless.

1109
01:08:41,000 --> 01:08:44,720
Speaker 2: It is such a relief that people feel and a

1110
01:08:44,800 --> 01:08:48,359
boost of confidence to trust your own judgment again, which

1111
01:08:48,359 --> 01:08:50,239
I think is you know, if you can't trust your

1112
01:08:50,239 --> 01:08:53,479
own judgment, it's so depressing. But the moment you get

1113
01:08:53,479 --> 01:08:56,399
someone else affirming you that it changes all that.

1114
01:08:57,479 --> 01:09:00,960
Speaker 1: I didn't ask you, but did you go through some

1115
01:09:01,039 --> 01:09:05,880
type of excommunication or gossip and betrayal and stuff like that.

1116
01:09:06,000 --> 01:09:09,079
As you kind of begin to embody your experience and

1117
01:09:09,119 --> 01:09:11,399
be vocal about it, you're what you were finding.

1118
01:09:11,880 --> 01:09:16,199
Speaker 2: Not yet Oh wow, but I'm not. I'm not employed

1119
01:09:16,359 --> 01:09:19,760
by religious organizations, so I couldn't I couldn't be de

1120
01:09:19,960 --> 01:09:23,640
licensed or default or anything like that. And I'm really

1121
01:09:23,760 --> 01:09:28,039
still in the process of finding out what the response

1122
01:09:28,119 --> 01:09:31,800
will be. A lot of my colleagues in ministry have

1123
01:09:31,960 --> 01:09:33,760
just sort of taken a step back, and I sort

1124
01:09:33,800 --> 01:09:39,159
of stopped communicating with me because I think they're trying

1125
01:09:39,199 --> 01:09:41,399
to work out what on what on earth is going

1126
01:09:41,439 --> 01:09:45,640
on there. I have some though, who I've known a

1127
01:09:45,640 --> 01:09:51,079
long time who sharing the journey with me, and then

1128
01:09:52,199 --> 01:09:55,560
pastors coming out of the woodwork all around the world

1129
01:09:55,680 --> 01:09:58,840
coming to me via my website and saying, Paul, thank

1130
01:09:58,880 --> 01:10:02,039
you so much. It's such a relief bearing a pastor

1131
01:10:02,079 --> 01:10:06,840
talking about these things. These are my experiences, and particularly

1132
01:10:06,920 --> 01:10:12,520
pastors who've been involved in paranormal ministry are saying, look,

1133
01:10:13,079 --> 01:10:15,279
I know about this, but I'm not allowed to talk

1134
01:10:15,319 --> 01:10:18,039
about it in my diocese. Can we have a conversation.

1135
01:10:18,880 --> 01:10:24,279
So I am actually quite I've been quite pleasantly surprised

1136
01:10:24,359 --> 01:10:28,439
at how much engagement, support and encouragement has come. It's

1137
01:10:28,479 --> 01:10:31,199
awesome from Christian and pastoral quarters.

1138
01:10:32,279 --> 01:10:35,560
Speaker 1: Was so called awakening. Like I think things are changing

1139
01:10:35,600 --> 01:10:38,920
too though. You know, it was like twenty twelve when

1140
01:10:38,920 --> 01:10:42,479
I started talking about but I was probably reckless with it,

1141
01:10:42,520 --> 01:10:45,079
you know, and everything was brand new. And I'm sharing

1142
01:10:45,199 --> 01:10:47,760
articles on UFOs and talking about what I've seen in

1143
01:10:47,800 --> 01:10:51,800
the night sky and all kinds of stuff on social media.