Speaker 1: Hey, what's up all you wonderfully wicked people. I'm Ben
Speaker 1: and I'm.
Speaker 2: Nicole, and I'm very sick and you're listening to Wicked Ingram.
Speaker 1: A true crime podcast. Warning. The following podcast content and
Speaker 1: material intended more mature audience listener discretion. Yeah, well, funny story.
Speaker 1: You kind of jinxed us Nicole with the sick thing.
Speaker 2: This is all my fault.
Speaker 1: Literally, just the other day, Nicole's like, Hey, Ben, what
Speaker 1: happens if one of us ends up getting sick? Because well,
Speaker 1: clearly this is a podcast, it's predominantly voice dependent, and
Speaker 1: here you are with damn near no voice.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it's not that bad, but you guys
Speaker 2: will definitely notice a difference. And I might not, like,
Speaker 2: be quite as chatty because I don't want to.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you gotta it. You gotta kind of keep that
Speaker 1: voice healthy. So I might be doing some heavy lifting
Speaker 1: today as far as the talking goes, which I'm going.
Speaker 2: To try and do feel lots of times the case anyway,
Speaker 2: but my voice, sorry, rasp, is it sexy?
Speaker 1: I mean you could definitely be on one of those
Speaker 1: like phone sex hotlines. Oh this is Nicole.
Speaker 2: How can I help you tonight?
Speaker 1: What are you wearing you should do it? Maybe make
Speaker 1: some money that way. We got the audio equipment.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then I tell them to hang on for
Speaker 2: five minutes because I'm coughing up along.
Speaker 1: True true, So yeah, there might be some coughing fits.
Speaker 1: I'm going to try and cut out as many as
Speaker 1: I can. But I also have to go to work
Speaker 1: in like an hour and a half, so we'll see
Speaker 1: how much editing I can actually do in that time.
Speaker 2: Well, I do have like a ginger lemon tea, so
Speaker 2: I think that's gonna help me.
Speaker 1: I think so will be okay. I think you can
Speaker 1: power through it.
Speaker 2: I think I can do it.
Speaker 1: You're you're a pretty wicked person.
Speaker 2: So no grim just wicked, just wicked.
Speaker 1: You're a wicked person with a grim illness in your
Speaker 1: throat or COVID by the way.
Speaker 2: Well, I know we probably should say that it's just
Speaker 2: like a typical cold that I get every year. But
Speaker 2: I did that guard down because I feel like no
Speaker 2: one really gets this these colds because they're wearing masks
Speaker 2: and using hands, sanny. But I'm like double vaccinated. So
Speaker 2: I was like let my guard down and then instantly, boom, sick.
Speaker 2: You're sick.
Speaker 1: Welcome to sick Cities.
Speaker 2: So now I'm going back to wearing my mask and
Speaker 2: be like, don't touch me.
Speaker 1: Yeah, fair enough. Okay, well let's dive into this right away.
Speaker 1: You can sit back, drink on your lemon ginger tea.
Speaker 2: Yeah, entertain me.
Speaker 1: I will entertain you. I'll do my best. Okay. So
Speaker 1: have you ever heard of the name Amy Carlson?
Speaker 2: No, I can't say I have.
Speaker 1: Have you ever heard of the religious group Love Has Won?
Speaker 2: No?
Speaker 1: No, Well, this religious group is essentially they don't claim
Speaker 1: to be, but it's it's basically a cult. So we're
Speaker 1: going to dive into the cult Love Has Won and
Speaker 1: how Amy became the founding leader and what she claims god.
Speaker 2: That sounds awesome. Cults are kind of like intriguing.
Speaker 1: It is. See, I really like those mystery sort of things.
Speaker 1: But this is also like one of those anything that
Speaker 1: gets you thinking and you can like try and understand
Speaker 1: psychology or mysteries or gets your thought process going. This
Speaker 1: is very thought provoking, So I like this one specifically
Speaker 1: for that. And this is an ongoing case as well,
Speaker 1: so it's almost completely resolved almost However, things like without
Speaker 1: giving away too much there's some sentencing. I guess that's
Speaker 1: still up for debates.
Speaker 2: Such so, so should those names have ring a belt?
Speaker 2: Is it something that's like in the news and stuff.
Speaker 1: It's been very prominent this spring when it came came
Speaker 1: to light more so. Okay, Amy has also appeared on
Speaker 1: Doctor Phil. There's an entire episode of Doctor Phil. I
Speaker 1: watched the whole thing. It's very interesting. Of course, that's
Speaker 1: down the description. You can check out the link on
Speaker 1: there on YouTube.
Speaker 2: So no, I can't say I really watched Doctor Phil.
Speaker 1: So well, watch this episode. I tried to not, you know,
Speaker 1: just copy all the answers and quotes right from Doctor Phil.
Speaker 1: So I left some explanation stuff to that episode. So
Speaker 1: if you go watch it, you'll you'll hear some different
Speaker 1: perspectives and stuff than we talk about today. But we're
Speaker 1: definitely going to cover similar things. Cool, Okay, so let's
Speaker 1: dive into this. The story of Amy Carlson in the
Speaker 1: religious movement that became known as Love Has Won It.
Speaker 1: First off, takes place in Creston, Colorado, where their Love
Speaker 1: Has One begins. Now Creston itself actually has a population.
Speaker 1: It's pretty small of around like one hundred people. The
Speaker 1: last population count I saw was in twenty nineteen of
Speaker 1: like eighty six people. So it's that's super small, super
Speaker 1: small town. It's kind of like our Hickson just south
Speaker 1: of us sort of thing. But I mean, there's of
Speaker 1: course other cities and towns around it, right, but the
Speaker 1: area around Creston has a tendency to attract a fairly
Speaker 1: decent flow of tourists despite it being fairly small, because
Speaker 1: Creston is situated just kind of between kind of above
Speaker 1: to very specific well known locations, one the San Louis
Speaker 1: Valley and two the Great sand Dunes National Park in Colorado. Okay,
Speaker 1: So the sand Dunes first off, are like super crazy
Speaker 1: because it's literally like giant sand dunes that just pop
Speaker 1: out of nowhere in the middle of the state of Colorado.
Speaker 1: At the base of the dunes, there's this seasonal creek
Speaker 1: that flows and it creates like these cool little beaches
Speaker 1: along the along the dunes. So you basically have these
Speaker 1: like cool desert sand dunes with beaches at the bottom.
Speaker 2: Oh that sounds really nice.
Speaker 1: And then among them, like in behind, there's mountains, there's trails,
Speaker 1: there's views. It's like a crazy place. It's somewhere that
Speaker 1: like shouldn't exist. It doesn't make sense why there's a
Speaker 1: sand dunes there.
Speaker 2: That sounds really cool though.
Speaker 1: And then the San Luis Valley, also referred to as
Speaker 1: Mystic San Luis Valley, is a place that's well known
Speaker 1: for its spiritual connections. Some believe there are energy vortexes
Speaker 1: throughout the whole area which can bring people closer to
Speaker 1: earth each other. You know, there's various claims in these
Speaker 1: spiritual connections and that sort of thing. You can really
Speaker 1: dive deep into a rabbit hole going through that sort
Speaker 1: of theory type thing. So, which is where I start
Speaker 1: to get my rocksuff sort of thing because I get
Speaker 1: to ask questions and learn these sort of things. Right,
Speaker 1: But I don't cover that too much. I'm going to
Speaker 1: leave that for you guys to research if you want.
Speaker 1: But the valley is also a hot spot for UFO sightings.
Speaker 2: Oh gosh, Okay, this sounds like kind of like a
Speaker 2: sweet place.
Speaker 1: There's lots going on here. Yeah, it's one of actually
Speaker 1: the top places in the USA to witness such activity. Wow. Okay,
Speaker 1: so you have spiritual connections, UFOs and like landmarks that
Speaker 1: just don't make sense that they're there. So this all
Speaker 1: combined has people really believing that this is a very
Speaker 1: very special place with connections to Earth or the universe
Speaker 1: or whatever you.
Speaker 2: Want to say.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so, yeah, that's kind of the area. But before
Speaker 1: Amy was actually drawn to the location of Creston, Colorado,
Speaker 1: she led quite a normal life as a younger child,
Speaker 1: and she grew up in Dallas, Texas, within a good home,
Speaker 1: and she did very well in school. She was described
Speaker 1: to her by her sister as very sweet. She had
Speaker 1: apparently a very nice singing voice, you got really good grades,
Speaker 1: that sort of stuff. But as she grew up, clearly
Speaker 1: she began to have some sort of life struggles, as
Speaker 1: she had been married three times by her early twenties.
Speaker 1: Oh wow, Yeah that's a little abnormal.
Speaker 2: Yeah, not there's anything wrong with being married three times,
Speaker 2: but yeah, that a young.
Speaker 1: Age, right, it's definitely not typical. Usually people are if
Speaker 1: they're getting married at a younger age, they're usually experiencing
Speaker 1: their first marriage by the early twenties.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so maybe she was just quick to get married.
Speaker 2: Maybe just boyfriend girlfriend for a bit.
Speaker 1: Yeah, maybe jump on the gun. Maybe searching for something.
Speaker 1: I don't know, that's up for debate. That's who knows, right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: she also grew into becoming a mother. She had three
Speaker 1: kids with three different partners. I couldn't find if it
Speaker 1: was with each husband specifically, but she had three different
Speaker 1: kids with three different partners and three different marriages. Okay,
Speaker 1: so I'm going to assume it's one with each. Maybe
Speaker 1: that's my assumption, but I couldn't find the facts on that.
Speaker 1: Anytime you look up Amy Carlson or Love has Won,
Speaker 1: immediately you find article after article after article on kind
Speaker 1: of the resolution of this story. So it's really hard
Speaker 1: to find a lot prior to Oh. Okay, so regardless
Speaker 1: of that, she'd grew into becoming a mother, and I'm
Speaker 1: pretty sure wasn't really a lifestyle that fit her so much.
Speaker 1: Maybe just the increasing stress and pressure. Her mom actually
Speaker 1: described her on the Doctor Phil episode specifically, so it's
Speaker 1: complete quote from her that she's not a very maternal mother.
Speaker 1: Oh so she didn't really have a good connection with
Speaker 1: her kids. She wasn't really playing that role, wasn't doing
Speaker 1: her thing. Kind kind of distant, I think is the
Speaker 1: best way to describe it. Interesting, and like you were
Speaker 1: really close with your mom, and I think that's a
Speaker 1: pretty important connection for a lot of people if it's available,
Speaker 1: of course.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I think like it's more normal to be to
Speaker 2: probably be a mother with a maternal instinct or connection
Speaker 2: or whatever than not right. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm not going to tell people how they should
Speaker 1: raise their kids, but if you can be there for
Speaker 1: your kid, I mean, that's going to give you some
Speaker 1: awesome person points, especially if you're going to be a
Speaker 1: spiritual person. Maybe karma's going to be on your end. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, don't be a dick.
Speaker 2: But I have also heard sometimes it doesn't come naturally,
Speaker 2: that it's something that you like kind of learn as
Speaker 2: you're like bringing up the child.
Speaker 1: Right, which kind of sucks because you hear so many
Speaker 1: people saying, oh, the moment you hold your kids in
Speaker 1: your arms, like when you first get birth, it just
Speaker 1: all makes sense. It's also magical people. I mean, I'm
Speaker 1: sure there are those magical and beautiful moments, but you're
Speaker 1: now just got this life to look after. Yeah, I'm
Speaker 1: pretty sure there's a lot of fiction surrounding how beautiful
Speaker 1: it's going to be. Yeah, there's a lot of struggles.
Speaker 2: There could probably be a whole lot of mostly a
Speaker 2: lot of holy shit. Moments.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So especially for someone going through three marriages, with
Speaker 1: three kids, with three separate fathers, and being kind of young,
Speaker 1: and being kind of young, there is a lot of stress.
Speaker 1: There's gonna be a lot of holy shit, there's gonna
Speaker 1: be a lot of soul searching, trying to find yourself
Speaker 1: where you should be, what you should be doing. That's
Speaker 1: a lot of fucking pressure to put on a.
Speaker 2: Person, totally actually, So now I feel bad for her.
Speaker 1: She definitely went through some shit as far as that
Speaker 1: sort of stress and life sit you. So because of
Speaker 1: all that, like soon Amy began to act a little
Speaker 1: bit more strange, wasn't quite so normal as she would
Speaker 1: like she was when she was a child. Okay, she
Speaker 1: would go on rants about various topics, including bizarre things
Speaker 1: like higher callings, powers, that sort of thing. So she
Speaker 1: was getting into that very spiritual life, and a lot
Speaker 1: of her family thought that maybe she was going a
Speaker 1: little bit too far into it.
Speaker 2: Oh okay, when you said rants, doesn't like is she you?
Speaker 2: But you don't rant about those kind of things, So
Speaker 2: we're okay, I rant.
Speaker 1: About people cutting me off on the highway because of
Speaker 1: that being dicks, Yeah, I rant about little things.
Speaker 2: Little are things. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So, as it would turn out, though Amy had turned
Speaker 1: away from the real world quote unquote real world like
Speaker 1: many of us, though, she found an escape online. It
Speaker 1: was two thousand and six when Amy met someone online
Speaker 1: who was a part of a group called the Galactic
Speaker 1: Federation of Life, and he called himself quote unquote Father
Speaker 1: her God. H Okay.
Speaker 2: Interesting.
Speaker 1: So Amy claims she was called upon around this time
Speaker 1: for a higher purpose by angels.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: They told her she must leave her life. She must
Speaker 1: leave her life as a mother of three, oh boy,
Speaker 1: as a restaurant manager, her family, and she must drop
Speaker 1: it all and go join Father God. And if she
Speaker 1: didn't do it, there'd be no one else who'd be
Speaker 1: able to step forward. So she weighed her options, so,
Speaker 1: she says, for a few days and decided that it's
Speaker 1: something that she must do, and she left.
Speaker 2: Okay, but that doesn't sound quite right, But okay.
Speaker 1: I agree. She left without a goodbye to her kids,
Speaker 1: Oh wow, who were approximately the age two, seven and twelve.
Speaker 2: At the time.
Speaker 1: Yis say anything to her current husband, Oh okay, She
Speaker 1: just left to meet quote unquote Father God in Colorado.
Speaker 1: Huh yeah.
Speaker 2: Interesting.
Speaker 1: So together the two took the rather minuscule group known
Speaker 1: as the Galactic Federation of Light and changed it into
Speaker 1: the group known as Love Has Won, and Amy Carlson
Speaker 1: became Mother God. Oh so she was pretty much the
Speaker 1: founder of Love has Won. We're going to dive into
Speaker 1: the good stuff here now that we got this established.
Speaker 2: It's kind of a dope title, though, we'll give it that.
Speaker 1: I'll give it that too.
Speaker 2: Mother God, father God like y and Love has Won. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Mostly though, like the followings, the Disciples, whatever you want
Speaker 1: to say within Love has Won. The group, the community,
Speaker 1: the cult would refer to them as mom or father
Speaker 1: like those sort of things. They wouldn't say mother, God.
Speaker 1: They would refer to him just strictly as like mom
Speaker 1: or mother generally.
Speaker 2: Okip, it isn't that slightly ironic being that she didn't
Speaker 2: have any maternal instincts.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, definitely.
Speaker 2: Okay. I decided to say something about that, if I
Speaker 2: recall correctly.
Speaker 1: Doctor Phil kind of goes over that a little bit
Speaker 1: on his episode. He questions her on that.
Speaker 2: Well, that's interesting.
Speaker 1: So yeah, now Amy was playing the founding leader and
Speaker 1: everything the role of Love has Won. They began posting
Speaker 1: on YouTube daily with live streams some videos, and they
Speaker 1: would spread their their New Age beliefs and they would
Speaker 1: cast doubt on like established science and mainstream spirituality, kind
Speaker 1: of preaching their own ways as being the correct way
Speaker 1: and everything else is wrong.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: The videos actually became became to get great traction on
Speaker 1: the Internet within the spiritual community, and it began to spread,
Speaker 1: not like wildfire, but it began to spread pretty pretty decent.
Speaker 1: Like they were getting quite a bit of views, quite
Speaker 1: a bit of people turning their attention to them within
Speaker 1: the community, and many people around the world actually belie
Speaker 1: that Amy was Mother of all creation and then that
Speaker 1: she was God.
Speaker 2: Wow, for someone who needed to do soul searching herself,
Speaker 2: that's like, I don't know, this is his all. My
Speaker 2: brain's turning.
Speaker 1: It's such an interesting situation because she goes from such
Speaker 1: stress and pressure of life on her. Yeah, and I
Speaker 1: think that she turns the tables and she's putting her
Speaker 1: own stress and stress and pressure on other people because
Speaker 1: life was telling her this is what you need to do.
Speaker 1: You gotta take care of your kids, you gotta have
Speaker 1: the job, you gotta maybe not have three divorces or
Speaker 1: three marriages. By the time in your early twenties, and
Speaker 1: she turns around and saying, this is how you have
Speaker 1: to live life. You have to love, you have to
Speaker 1: do what I say. I am God, listen to me.
Speaker 2: M hm.
Speaker 1: So it became this, rather than everyone's telling her what
Speaker 1: to do, she's telling what everyone needs to do.
Speaker 2: Interesting, wild, okay.
Speaker 1: Amy and her followers claimed this is where stuff really
Speaker 1: gets weird. We're getting into her godlike divinity.
Speaker 2: Good, I want to hear it.
Speaker 1: She claimed that she had experienced a total of five
Speaker 1: hundred and thirty four reincarnations, which she has full recollection
Speaker 1: of each one, and that she has been alive for
Speaker 1: nineteen billion years.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: Among the people she claims to have lived in past
Speaker 1: lives and being reincarnated as she claims she was previously
Speaker 1: Marilyn Monroe, Oh wow, Joan of Arc, Cleopatra, and of
Speaker 1: course Jesus Holy. She remembers every moment very vividly of
Speaker 1: being crucified on the cross.
Speaker 2: Even how did she just like all of a sudden
Speaker 2: remember all this stuff.
Speaker 1: She's mother God, she just always has been. The angels
Speaker 1: called upon her and I've.
Speaker 2: Well, and it's interesting. Like the figures she is saying
Speaker 2: that she was too like very powerful. Yeah, like I
Speaker 2: don't think one person would be all those things at
Speaker 2: one time.
Speaker 1: Well, that's the thing. She's casting herself as God and
Speaker 1: she's reincarnating herself as these people. Yeah, so it's like
Speaker 1: I'm going to reincarn myself or reincarnate myself as a
Speaker 1: new individual, and I'm going to be powerful. So it's
Speaker 1: like a previously decided thing almost, like what she's portraying.
Speaker 1: She also claimed this one really gets to me because
Speaker 1: I have a soft spot for this individual. So it's like,
Speaker 1: don't fuck with this person. I'll I'll come cut you.
Speaker 2: Who is it?
Speaker 1: She claims that as soon as Robin Williams passed away,
Speaker 1: his spirit immediately came to her and frequently talks to
Speaker 1: her and acts as a guide.
Speaker 2: Okay, you do love Robin Williams.
Speaker 1: I fucking love that man.
Speaker 2: Well yeah, I think a lot of people do.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah. It was unfortunate.
Speaker 1: So she's the claims are outlandish. It's like what the fuck, Like,
Speaker 1: how do you just claim of all people like you
Speaker 1: just oh yeah, Robin Williams as a guide for me,
Speaker 1: but yet you're God.
Speaker 2: Well, because she has the power to be to do that,
Speaker 2: so she's just like doing that, like having fun.
Speaker 1: Yeah exactly, And she's getting all these followers around her
Speaker 1: from her live streams daily on YouTube, from people who
Speaker 1: are joining her. I want to avoid calling it a
Speaker 1: cult throughout this episode as much as second, although I
Speaker 1: strictly believe it's a cult, but I just don't want to.
Speaker 1: I want to give it the the credibility of them
Speaker 1: having a group, because they're I don't know. I don't
Speaker 1: want you guys to immediately think that this is a cult.
Speaker 1: I want you to make your own decision. So I
Speaker 1: want to try and call it that group. So all
Speaker 1: these people within the group just giving her the satisfaction,
Speaker 1: doing her every demand, saying she is God and what
Speaker 1: she says goes no matter what.
Speaker 2: Mm hmm.
Speaker 1: So she says, Robin Williams there, Oh, Robin Williams is there.
Speaker 1: She can make those claims.
Speaker 2: Yeah wow, Okay.
Speaker 1: So not only does she claim to be divine in
Speaker 1: age and experience, she also claims to be able to
Speaker 1: spiritually heal people, including severe diseases such as cancers. Really,
Speaker 1: of which she spiritually healed over one hundred thousand people.
Speaker 2: Holy shit, I want some evidence.
Speaker 1: Yeah, there is no evidence oh okay spoiler alert, dang
Speaker 1: a claim of an ability that our followers fully support.
Speaker 1: Doctor Phil actually breaks down the numbers on his episode too.
Speaker 1: He's like, Okay, if you've healed x amount of people
Speaker 1: since you've started this, like one hundred thousand since two
Speaker 1: thousand and six when this started, that would be like
Speaker 1: almost two hunred people a day.
Speaker 2: And she's like, yep, how does she have the time
Speaker 2: to do that?
Speaker 1: I don't know?
Speaker 2: Or she just sitting on the couch and like manifesting
Speaker 2: it up somewhere? Does she have to visit? Oh am
Speaker 2: I jumping.
Speaker 1: Kind of not really, I'll just say it here instead.
Speaker 1: What happens is there's there's some people who joined the
Speaker 1: group and then had left and such, and there's one
Speaker 1: claim that she doesn't actually heal all herself. That what
Speaker 1: happens is that you'll get a phone call from someone
Speaker 1: who's a part of the group and they will follow
Speaker 1: a script give him by Mother God, who will heal you?
Speaker 2: What? Okay? Then okay?
Speaker 1: Then yeah, this is a really hard story to tell
Speaker 1: because there's a lot of jumping back and forth, so
Speaker 1: I'm trying to stay as linear as possible. But stay
Speaker 1: with me here we got some more information. We'll touch
Speaker 1: on with that in a minute. So Love has won
Speaker 1: and his followers continue to grow, and its disciples never
Speaker 1: really seem to have a fixed set of beliefs specifically. Instead,
Speaker 1: they practiced and preached a fluid ideology of New Age physiology,
Speaker 1: conspiracy theories, spiritual and Messiah worship. The Messiah of course
Speaker 1: being Amy, Mother of God or Mother God or whatever. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they basically just Amy said stuff, and they're just like, yeah,
Speaker 1: that they just made it up as they went is
Speaker 1: essentially how it works.
Speaker 2: Kay, did she almost have more power than Father God then?
Speaker 2: Or you're just kind of chatting mode her more?
Speaker 1: And he went through multiple father gods? Actually really yes?
Speaker 2: Okay, so the.
Speaker 1: Father God that she joined with he ended up leaving
Speaker 1: or she kicked him out. I couldn't find exactly that.
Speaker 1: There was a couple names that popped up of people
Speaker 1: who were father Gods, but I couldn't find information on
Speaker 1: how they left or what. But yeah, she went through
Speaker 1: multiple father Gods and she was just Mother God the
Speaker 1: whole time.
Speaker 2: I literally can't stop thinking about how cool would actually
Speaker 2: be though, to be able to cure cancer like that
Speaker 2: if it was possible if it was possible. Yeah, but yeah,
Speaker 2: that sense of stuff there, you don't.
Speaker 1: Fuck with that because I mean someone could literally be
Speaker 1: fully believing in you, Yeah, thinking they have like they're
Speaker 1: going to be healed. They have stage four fucking cancer
Speaker 1: or something, and they're like, oh, she's gonna save me.
Speaker 1: They put all their faith in you, and she's just
Speaker 1: like you get a phone call from fucking.
Speaker 2: Steve who read some script.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and you're like, Okay, I'm healed now, and you're
Speaker 1: families like, what the fuck you should be doing chemo? No,
Speaker 1: mother's got me. Yeah, what the fuck you're You're fucking
Speaker 1: with people's lives.
Speaker 2: Here, you are.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So it's no longer just a power trip. It's
Speaker 1: it's getting into other people. It Yeah, it's crazy. So
Speaker 1: the group continued gaining such support that they moved through
Speaker 1: a few places including Colorado, Oregon, California, Florida, and at
Speaker 1: one point even for a short period of time Hawaii.
Speaker 1: They continue to spread the word of their group and
Speaker 1: try to stay in appealing locations, you know, painting the
Speaker 1: picture of beautiful oasis filled with love, spirituality, and members
Speaker 1: literally began to drop their lives to go be with
Speaker 1: Amy and love has won and experienced Mother God. They
Speaker 1: would donate money. There's claims of hundreds of thousands of
Speaker 1: dollars being in their bank accounts.
Speaker 2: Oh wow.
Speaker 1: They would get donations from live streams, they would get
Speaker 1: merch that they would sell on their website and such.
Speaker 1: It's just it seems like a giant scam.
Speaker 2: People just trying to search for a better life because
Speaker 2: they're not happy with their own.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and they're taking advantage of that, fully, taking advantage
Speaker 1: of that. So through their community, however, members were put
Speaker 1: through trials. When you get there, it's not this oasis
Speaker 1: that you're painted pictures with. They're put to work, doing
Speaker 1: labor for long days on the current whatever current property.
Speaker 1: They were staying really with little or no breaks.
Speaker 2: Holy, I don't know why that surprises me.
Speaker 1: The claim was every moment you spent resting is spiritual
Speaker 1: energy you are taking from Mother God, and that causes
Speaker 1: her pain.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, that's so bullshit.
Speaker 1: That is so bullshit. After all, she is God and
Speaker 1: she is forced to live in this fleshy human vessel.
Speaker 2: And she's just not freaking resting all day. Probably, well,
Speaker 2: everyone's doing work.
Speaker 1: Most definitely, we'll get into that in a second year though,
Speaker 1: So if you were caught ever sitting down resting at all,
Speaker 1: you were immediately harassed by the people around you, like
Speaker 1: you're stealing in her loud God sort of thing. And
Speaker 1: you're not a true believer, like you are harassed by
Speaker 1: your peers that you don't truly belong here.
Speaker 2: So this just sounds so awful.
Speaker 1: It's brutal. You're trying to devote yourself to something you
Speaker 1: believe in and you're getting harassed to give more and
Speaker 1: more and more consistently. It's fucked up. Yeah, they use
Speaker 1: serious metal games here, like serious metal games, Like I said, like,
Speaker 1: it's you're being harassed consistently. They're trying to prove that,
Speaker 1: Like what you're doing is just wrong. So you keep going,
Speaker 1: keep working. You're working to exhaustion, but you don't get
Speaker 1: to sleep. Really, imagine you're working tirelessly, giving yourself all
Speaker 1: this devoted energy. You're exhausted, you're physically tired. You're gonna
Speaker 1: want to sleep right well, Typically you're made to stay
Speaker 1: up till like midnight or later, working doing whatever bidding
Speaker 1: it might be. But no matter how late you stay up,
Speaker 1: you will at five am.
Speaker 2: Seriously, seriously.
Speaker 1: So you might only get three four hours sleep, but
Speaker 1: you get up at five am and you do it
Speaker 1: all over again, and if you don't, more harassment.
Speaker 2: These people must be like so exhausted.
Speaker 1: So exhausted. They're using sleep deprivation, they're using mental games,
Speaker 1: they're using physical exhaustion. It's brutal. So now, like you said,
Speaker 1: Amy's most likely kicking it back and a couch some
Speaker 1: of her all while this is happening, Amy is nowhere
Speaker 1: in sight. She sits in her room, away from all
Speaker 1: the work. And when you arrive, because people are want
Speaker 1: to expecting and wanting to see Mother God or yeah, right,
Speaker 1: of course, it takes you weeks before you ever actually
Speaker 1: get to see her because you have to prove yourself,
Speaker 1: prove your worthy sort of thing.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: So when people did finally get to see Amy, she
Speaker 1: was in a room, she was with her chosen few
Speaker 1: disciples around her, which I read contradicting numbers somewhere anywhere
Speaker 1: between like seven to twenty different people who are a
Speaker 1: little close knit group with her. Okay, when you see her,
Speaker 1: she's this frail, skinny little woman. She said that she
Speaker 1: was paralyzed and couldn't even go to the bathroom by
Speaker 1: herself without assistance, and she even claimed on Doctor Phil
Speaker 1: that she has stage five cancer. Stage five a thing. No,
Speaker 1: it doesn't exist, Doctor Phil asked her. He's like, what's
Speaker 1: stage five can because I.
Speaker 2: Was like, I only have heard it going up to
Speaker 2: stage four.
Speaker 1: Stage four is throughout the body, and she's like, stage
Speaker 1: five is to the bone.
Speaker 2: So she just made that shit, made that up. Was
Speaker 2: she actually on Doctor Phil herself?
Speaker 1: Yeah, she was. I mean she wasn't on the show physically,
Speaker 1: but she was skyping in.
Speaker 2: Oh geez, I want to watch this for sure, so
Speaker 2: I want to see what she looks like. But you'll
Speaker 2: be putting that on insta definitely. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So there's two things though that I draw from this one.
Speaker 1: This may have played more into the idea of spiritual
Speaker 1: energy being taken from Mother God because it causes her pain, right,
Speaker 1: like you go in, you see this frail woman. Oh,
Speaker 1: we aren't working hard enough, like we got to take
Speaker 1: the pain away from her. Though I don't, I personally
Speaker 1: don't think she's faking any ailments, but I do think
Speaker 1: it would have played into that hand.
Speaker 2: Well, how old has she even? Like, she's probably youngish.
Speaker 1: You don't it's a good question. I never actually looked
Speaker 1: at her age. I think she's around her in her
Speaker 1: forties if I'm correct.
Speaker 2: So why is she like this tiny, frail woman.
Speaker 1: I don't think she's faking ailments.
Speaker 2: I'll say that, Okay, okay, go to the gym. Sorry, well,
Speaker 2: I mean like maybe she needs to or she should
Speaker 2: go do some of that work to like get some
Speaker 2: may maybe.
Speaker 1: Yeah. And two, why doesn't she just heal herself?
Speaker 2: Oh? I never even went there.
Speaker 1: And there. There's several times that question has been asked,
Speaker 1: Like I've I've gone through Reddit, I've gone through different
Speaker 1: interviews and stuff. I've never seen a straight answer to it.
Speaker 2: Never Oh, well, I bet she would just put something out.
Speaker 2: They're like, oh, should only heal others?
Speaker 1: Blah blah blah pretty much. Yeahh so, yeah, one of
Speaker 1: these people who drop their life to join love has won.
Speaker 1: Apparently their energy wasn't compatible with them, so he dropped
Speaker 1: his life. He donates I think was like ten to
Speaker 1: fifteen thousand dollars. Wow, And he goes and joins them
Speaker 1: and he spends a couple of days working and they're like, yeah,
Speaker 1: his energy doesn't match ours. And he was abandoned by
Speaker 1: the rest of the group after only two days, and
Speaker 1: he was left on the far side of a near
Speaker 1: mountain and was found a day later by police wandering
Speaker 1: naked on private property. He was disoriented, confused, and thought
Speaker 1: he was in the fifth dimension. The belief by his
Speaker 1: family is that he was drugged and left dead on
Speaker 1: the other side of the mountain.
Speaker 2: It kind of sounds like that, and they probably took
Speaker 2: the donation money.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yep. The I'm not saying the man's name
Speaker 1: because he's he clearly he's not in the group anymore,
Speaker 1: and he's quite embarrassed about, you know, being taken by
Speaker 1: these people and what he went through and everything. But yeah,
Speaker 1: they lost like ten fifteen thousand dollars and he went
Speaker 1: through this ordeal. It's just ridiculous.
Speaker 2: Okay, that sounds so brutal. Yeah, like so brutal, so brutal.
Speaker 1: So one thing I haven't really talked much about yet,
Speaker 1: Like I said, any bouncing back and forth a bit
Speaker 1: because it's hard to stay linear on this. The YouTube
Speaker 1: videos and live streams, the daily live streams that were
Speaker 1: posted to Love has Won. There's a lot and I
Speaker 1: mean like a lot of shady shit that goes on
Speaker 1: in these videos. Okay, I watch them. There's a major
Speaker 1: rabbit hole. I do suggest you taking a look into it,
Speaker 1: but it's a major rabbit hole. You'll don't go too deep.
Speaker 2: Are they like still up or like still doing them
Speaker 2: daily and stuff?
Speaker 1: No? I couldn't find their YouTube videos, okay, but I
Speaker 1: did find like reposts and that sort of stuff. So
Speaker 1: they in these videos, they literally lose whatever credibility they
Speaker 1: may have had. In my mind, I can't comprehend why
Speaker 1: someone would see them as a spiritual group to start with,
Speaker 1: let alone.
Speaker 2: Divine somewhere you'd want to be part of or something
Speaker 2: you can to be part of.
Speaker 1: Oh, definitely not. Amy is often seen either very drunk
Speaker 1: or very high. Really, there is consistent drinking and drug use.
Speaker 1: The ref they refer to mushroom trips and Mother God's
Speaker 1: mushroom visions very frequently interesting. However, when confronted by the question,
Speaker 1: they just simply deny, deny, deny. There's literal videos of
Speaker 1: these two followers of hers, very close followers that were
Speaker 1: interviewed on Doctor Phil. There's a video of them denying
Speaker 1: ever even using mushrooms or being around mushrooms. No, one
Speaker 1: in the group uses it, and then there's videos of
Speaker 1: them talking about their mushroom trips like what that's weird. Hey,
Speaker 1: it's literally compulsive lying, And I think that's what keeps
Speaker 1: this group going, is they just makeshift ship up as
Speaker 1: they go. It's compulsive lying to make themselves feel better
Speaker 1: for whatever reason. Maybe they're coming from really dark backgrounds,
Speaker 1: but there's lying that's going on for whatever reason, to
Speaker 1: make themselves feel better about being in this higher position.
Speaker 1: And I don't think it's to the point that they're
Speaker 1: doing it on purpose. I think they literally believe their
Speaker 1: own lies.
Speaker 2: Hmm wow, which is scary because she just got them
Speaker 2: like so wrapped around her finger and her beliefs.
Speaker 1: Yes, but I also think it got to the point
Speaker 1: where she didn't have control of them anymore either. Oh really,
Speaker 1: everyone was just so wrapped up in it that it
Speaker 1: was just this entity on its own. The group wasn't
Speaker 1: entpty on its own operating. And it's so hard, it's
Speaker 1: so hard to describe it. So fucked up. Okay, Like
Speaker 1: I'll touch a little bit on that a little bit
Speaker 1: later because there's something specific that that I touch about that. Okay, Okay, Anyways, Okay,
Speaker 1: where am I at here? Oh? Here we are? Okay.
Speaker 1: So there's a video that I watched specifically where they
Speaker 1: claim heart attacks are not real. They claim that it's
Speaker 1: quote unquote the dark side that fooled you into believing them. Wow,
Speaker 1: that feeling a heart attack is actually your heart growing
Speaker 1: and you are filling up with more love.
Speaker 2: Meanwhile you're like actually dying.
Speaker 1: Yep. So they strictly say to their followers and these
Speaker 1: people on this live stream, do not go to the
Speaker 1: doctor because they won't help you. Just just breathe through it.
Speaker 1: It's your heart growing.
Speaker 2: People are will die.
Speaker 1: Yeah. So back to Amy though, how I said, this
Speaker 1: entity is like, well, clearly with heart attack bullshit, they're
Speaker 1: just making shit up. But Amy specifically, she's often, like
Speaker 1: I said, very intoxicated on something. During these live streams.
Speaker 1: She's also seen ranting, yelling, cursing, belittling her followers, claiming
Speaker 1: very are saying really harsh names to them. Consistently, she
Speaker 1: to them as whores. Very often. She continues with the
Speaker 1: psychological manipulation gets what she wants from her followers, including money.
Speaker 1: There's even a video where she's like demanding this one person.
Speaker 1: She's like I had a vision of chicken parmesan, and
Speaker 1: you fucking brought me meatballs, Like, what the f Like?
Speaker 1: What the fuck?
Speaker 2: Really?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Is she like smart?
Speaker 1: No? Definitely not. Okay, Okay, nope, I thought I was
Speaker 1: at one point. That's gonna be later. So I'm gonna
Speaker 1: touch on that whole ant tee being wrapped up in
Speaker 1: its own shit. She does control hearing a bit.
Speaker 2: So.
Speaker 1: The man who who's there was a man whose son
Speaker 1: who's actually living inside the residence of Love has Won
Speaker 1: when they were back in Colorado, uh this spring so
Speaker 1: twenty twenty one, and he was inside the residence. This
Speaker 1: son was very young, kind of almost being held captive
Speaker 1: sort of thing. It's really shady on how this is
Speaker 1: being described. I think this father was kind of being
Speaker 1: a part of this, wanting to be a part of
Speaker 1: the group, and they were holding his son trying to
Speaker 1: get the sun to be spiritual or something.
Speaker 2: Anyways, it almost seems like all of them are held
Speaker 2: captive in a way.
Speaker 1: Oh definitely. Yeah. And the man reported there being a
Speaker 1: dead body inside Love has One's location. Okay, so immediately
Speaker 1: there are police got a search warrant and entered the
Speaker 1: house and inside they found something that they did not expect.
Speaker 1: So this this was I believe April twenty eighth, when
Speaker 1: they entered the house of one of twenty twenty eight,
Speaker 1: so this past week, like that's.
Speaker 2: Yeah, just a little ways away or back, yeap.
Speaker 1: So when they entered the house, upon a makeshift shrine
Speaker 1: was Amy's lifeless, mummified body. She was wrapped in a
Speaker 1: sleeping bag and decorated with Christmas lights. Her eyes were missing,
Speaker 1: and around her hollowed out eye sockets was glittery eye makeup.
Speaker 2: Really.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Seven people were rested inside the house and charged
Speaker 1: with quote unquote abusing a corpse. They were worshiping the corpse, right,
Speaker 1: they wrapped it up.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean they probably didn't think they were abusing
Speaker 2: it in anyway.
Speaker 1: Oh, they definitely didn't. They were worshiping God as far
Speaker 1: as they knew, which, like I said, it's this group
Speaker 1: that's out of control. They're just making shit up.
Speaker 2: It's so wild that she's dead.
Speaker 1: Yeah. So it was actually thought that Amy had died
Speaker 1: sometime in early March, so that would leave her dead
Speaker 1: for about two months before she was found. So they
Speaker 1: had her body worshiping it on a.
Speaker 2: Shrine for the visuals coming from this interesting.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so they just continued to worship her. They were
Speaker 1: so far gone from reality that her death literally meant
Speaker 1: nothing to them.
Speaker 2: And like I bet a lot of people even in
Speaker 2: the group quotation mark group didn't even know she was dead.
Speaker 1: No, she was. She just left her vessel. She's God.
Speaker 2: She just went to another plane, another demension and recarnation.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so they were just worshiping was what she left
Speaker 1: behind as far as they were concerned making shit up again.
Speaker 2: Wow. Wow.
Speaker 1: So we're still waiting on the autopsy report on Amy's body,
Speaker 1: which should be coming out soon. Uh. There are some
Speaker 1: speculations as malnutrition being a cause maybe why she was
Speaker 1: so skinny, overdosing mm hmmm, alcohol poisoning.
Speaker 2: Like she was probably like an addict.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and heavy metal poisoning as well. Is also a
Speaker 1: theory from quote unquote health potions that the group frequently
Speaker 1: sold oh jeez, and many other who knows undiagnosed health
Speaker 1: issues because Amy never saw a doctor, why would she,
Speaker 1: She's divine. However, this is where I said she didn't.
Speaker 1: I don't think she really had power over the group anymore.
Speaker 1: It was the group was its own entity, and just
Speaker 1: what the group decided was the loudest voice kind of
Speaker 1: got it right. This is really fucked up. It was
Speaker 1: about a year ago, on one live stream video, two
Speaker 1: of her disciples, the same two that were on the
Speaker 1: Doctor Phil episode, being interviewed. Okay, they were talking about
Speaker 1: her being ill, hence why she's so frailed, being paralyzed,
Speaker 1: that sort of stuff. Yeah, and she's asking to be
Speaker 1: brought in to see doctors, but they refuse to take her.
Speaker 1: They refused to take Amy and to see the doctors.
Speaker 1: They said that doctors would be so perplexed by her
Speaker 1: and that they would just try and hijack her in
Speaker 1: some and do some crazy shit to her. And so
Speaker 1: they told her absolutely not.
Speaker 2: Wow, but that's probably because she's told people that in
Speaker 2: the past. Yeah, So they were like learning from her
Speaker 2: and literally not letting her get the help she needed.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it got so out of control that she
Speaker 1: didn't have power anymore. The group itself had power. The
Speaker 1: loudest voice in the group is what's going to have
Speaker 1: the power if someone stands up and says this is
Speaker 1: what it is, this is how it is, this is love,
Speaker 1: and they just rally enough people behind them, very much
Speaker 1: so like how Hitler fucking rallied Germany into a fucking
Speaker 1: World war. It's the same thing. It's manipulation. Whoever has
Speaker 1: the most power within the group to manipulate the others
Speaker 1: is going to have say. These two girls I think
Speaker 1: are very high on that list for the manipulation within
Speaker 1: the group.
Speaker 2: Oh, like the two that didn't let her get help. Yes,
Speaker 2: are females.
Speaker 1: Yes, I believe they go by the name Hope and Aurora.
Speaker 1: They're interviewed on the Doctor Phil.
Speaker 2: They're okay, yes, O, why but I just pictured men
Speaker 2: for some reason.
Speaker 1: No, it's two females there. I would say they're probably
Speaker 1: like late twenties, mid twenties, very young. But they seem
Speaker 1: to be very like, very loud and opinionated. And I
Speaker 1: don't want to paint a bad picture for anyone who's
Speaker 1: who aligns this way, but they're very stereotypical far left
Speaker 1: wing or I guess far right wing. But those people
Speaker 1: who are just very loud and opinionated. My way is
Speaker 1: the right way. Yeah, they seem like those kind of
Speaker 1: people who are just like, no, if you're against me, you're.
Speaker 2: Wrong, which I honestly like, I don't know. Unpopular opinion, Well,
Speaker 2: maybe not, but I don't like people like that.
Speaker 1: But the thing is Amy was very much like that too, Yeah,
Speaker 1: the whole way. If you're not against me, or if
Speaker 1: you're not with me, you're wrong. You're against me, And
Speaker 1: I think.
Speaker 2: Are allowed to have other opinions.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but she just recruited people who had a louder
Speaker 1: voice in her and I think it bitter in the
Speaker 1: ass in the end.
Speaker 2: So are they like the ones that are up on trial? Then?
Speaker 1: Basically, I don't know if there's no trial yet as
Speaker 1: far as I'm aware. Other than being arrested for the
Speaker 1: desecration of a corpse or whatever.
Speaker 2: Is it just those two arrested story?
Speaker 1: There were seven people total?
Speaker 2: Seven people, Okay, As of right now.
Speaker 1: We're still waiting for the autopsy report and Amy.
Speaker 2: Why is it taken so long?
Speaker 1: I don't know. But I mean, once the autopsy report
Speaker 1: comes out, we could find that murder was involved. Someone
Speaker 1: else could have been saying like I want to be
Speaker 1: mother God and taken her out. It could have been
Speaker 1: malnutrition that she wasn't taken care of. It could have
Speaker 1: been that she had cancer. We don't know. We're at
Speaker 1: the point where we're just waiting for the autopsy report.
Speaker 1: And yes, it's been a few months, so I would
Speaker 1: assume that it's going to be coming out fairly soon.
Speaker 2: Like just the picture that you painted, this whole thing
Speaker 2: just sounds so undesirable to me that it's almost shocking
Speaker 2: that like they got people.
Speaker 1: I don't know how they did, because, like I said,
Speaker 1: in their live streams, they're they're ranting, they're raving, they're
Speaker 1: they're drugged up, they're drunk. There's there's live stream videos
Speaker 1: of them trying to reform these kids who haven't really
Speaker 1: been disciplined of parents who are now coming into the group,
Speaker 1: and they're putting him in time out. They're just locking
Speaker 1: him in closets for a couple of minutes. It's like
Speaker 1: it goes over that. Yeah, it's that's that's imprisonment. That's
Speaker 1: not time out.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: There's another video where Amy is seen, uh I wouldn't
Speaker 1: say beating her cat, but she is seen shaking and
Speaker 1: holding her cat up in this gruff neck being very
Speaker 1: aggressive with her animal.
Speaker 2: Oh she's just a monster.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and she they do this on their live stream
Speaker 1: or did it on their live stream openly and willingly.
Speaker 2: It's just like literally people wanting just the idea of
Speaker 2: a better life so strongly, Yeah, that they will almost
Speaker 2: just do anything.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's what this group took advantage of.
Speaker 2: There are other ways, my friends, but.
Speaker 1: Again I don't think. I mean, there is to some
Speaker 1: degree where they took advantage, like, for example, spending money
Speaker 1: fucking moving to Hawaii that was donated to you labor labor.
Speaker 1: But I do literally think that they believe their own lies.
Speaker 1: They would make up some fucking lie and say, yes,
Speaker 1: we are divine, we know, and they're just making it
Speaker 1: up and they believe it. They believe that they just know.
Speaker 2: Hm.
Speaker 1: So I think they're a victim of their own circumstance
Speaker 1: to a degree. However, they still fucking trash, They still
Speaker 1: did all this, They still rope people in and did
Speaker 1: some fucking weird sick shit.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Probably, And you, I mean, you named the one
Speaker 2: person that was embarrassed and stuff, But I bet you
Speaker 2: there's so many more.
Speaker 1: I bet you there's so many more.
Speaker 2: Oh my goodness.
Speaker 1: So that's the story of Amy Carlson and the cult.
Speaker 1: As far as I'm concerned, love.
Speaker 2: Has won and literally everyone's shutting off this podcast and
Speaker 2: going to the doctor. Phil episode now.
Speaker 1: It'll be linked below. It's it took two episodes because
Speaker 1: it was like two half episodes, but it's a pirated
Speaker 1: version on YouTube. I got down there. It's all stable together.
Speaker 1: It's about an hour long. It was worth the watch.
Speaker 2: That's so interesting.
Speaker 1: They talk with Amy's family, some of her followers, they
Speaker 1: talk with an author who's right in to cult psychology
Speaker 1: and everything. They talked to Amy herself. It's it's an
Speaker 1: interesting episode.
Speaker 2: And her poor kids. They just popped in my head. Yeah,
Speaker 2: she's three kids, she does, So there you go.
Speaker 1: That is love has won, and I don't think in
Speaker 1: that sense love did not win.
Speaker 2: No, yeah, not at all. So it's wild.
Speaker 1: Maybe you guys out there can stay wicked, but don't
Speaker 1: stay quite as wicked as this group because they're fucked up. Yes,
Speaker 1: and we'll see you in the next episode when maybe
Speaker 1: Nicole's feeling a little bit better.
Speaker 2: Yeah, maybe my voice will be better. Let's see.
Speaker 1: We got one week fingers crossed. Okay, all right, Well
Speaker 1: until then
Speaker 2: Peace, stay wicked.