Speaker 1: What is up? Fellas it goes? I am Damna Valley
coming at you with the one the only My cert
of five Fantabulary's co host, mister Grant hues our off
season look Ahead train rolls onward. We're gonna be focusing
on the Cleveland Cavaliers in this look at rant before
we get started. How that go?
Speaker 2: I'm doing very well.
Speaker 3: I'm excited to cover the calves here because as they
were being eliminated, I had some thoughts about them, and
I'm eager to share them with you.
Speaker 1: Oh that's exciting. Let's let's let's not waste any time.
Then let's dig right into it. Okay, So do you
need to get those thoughts off before we get into
their off season vitals?
Speaker 3: No. I think we'll get to them organically because I
feel they feel like they might like curtail the discussion
if I throw them out right now.
Speaker 2: So let's get through the vitals.
Speaker 1: So I'll do I'll do the vitals on this one.
They're five million dollars into the second Apron in part
because Evan Mobbly won Defensive Player of the Year, so
his track got bumped up to that thirty percent max.
That does not include those new deals for Ty Jerome,
who's an early bird free agent, which basically means they
can give him one hundred and seventy five percent rays
off his current salary or one hundred and five percent
of the league average salary. It'll be one hundred and
five percent of the league average salary if he sticks
around because he's just making so little. It also does
not include Sam Merrill. And I think this is kind
of a question to start with though. Grant is they
did duck the tax at the trade deadline while getting
DeAndre Hunter, which was smart because I think they knew
that this type of season was coming. But when you
start to get into okay they've now it's not just
that they haven't made it out of the second round
in the past three years. It's that they've won two
second round games since trading for Donvo Mitchell, which is
not a lot. They're built in excuses, and I don't
mean excuses in a derogatory way anyway, like they've been
dealing with injuries this season included. But when you kind
of look at this team, do you expect them to
just be like, well, we're just gonna at least spend
deep into the second apron for next season.
Speaker 2: Well, I mean that's the deal, just asn't to illustrate it.
Speaker 3: What I have, and this from Bobby Marx is that
if you give tie Jerome for just as an example,
I'll answer your question, like, four for sixty four is
about as high as they can go, according to his estimates.
And if you're adding fourteen million in salary and twenty
five twenty six all your penalties and stuff, tack another
eighty million onto that, Like so that's.
Speaker 2: A lot, just it's a fair amount. I'd say fair
to middling.
Speaker 3: So like that's just getting to your question is like, well,
how far are these guys gonna go with a core
that like everybody loves and they won sixty four games,
but it's like two second round wins is still just
two second round wins. How much more money do you
dump into this? Or can you spend a little smarter
and maybe get just as good as results without like
just without tie Jerome or whatever, like trim and payroll
a little bit. So I think you are obligable. One,
you're sort of stuck, like all of the guys that
make the most money are just not going anywhere. Like
maybe you consider Jared Allen, but he's a distant fourth
on the like salary pecking order of Cleveland's top guys.
But so I think they will continue to be deep
into the second apron just because, like I think the
moves you'd make to get meaningful salary reduction are just
kind of like not realistic and would like anything really
like salary reducing would make this team way too much
worse to like to justify it. So yeah, I I
mean they're in danger of having what they're twenty thirty
three first frozen, right like if if they don't if
they're in the second apron again at the end, so
like they're up against it.
Speaker 2: It's did the sneak up on you?
Speaker 3: Because it's like, oh, Phoenix is screwed, and Denver and
and Milwaukee AND's like all right, Cleveland also has.
Speaker 1: I'm more so just amazed that it took them this
long to get here because you look at their it
just helped that Evan Mobley was on his rookie deal,
Donovan Mitchell and Darius Garland weren't on like Darre's Garten
still on that first Max deal and he's Darius Garland's
extension eligible can sign for two years, one hundred and
twent eight point four million. I would probably offer it,
but I like, I don't. We normally don't see players
sign that type of extension because especially when they're his age.
But I guess that's what I want to ask you
because this ties into everything. How much do you read
into this particular postseason when you're trying to figure out
what to do with this team? Because it's we can say, okay, fine,
they're gonna be a second Apron team, but is like,
let's even just say they could lop off Isaacacorro, trade
him into someone's exception and then just resigned Tyjerome after
the series that he had against the Pacers. Is that
something they even want to do? And then it's you know,
Sam Merrow even like kind of struggling at points in
that series. So how much do you read into you know,
what happened in the playoffs and that includes with Darius
Garland versus no like they were injured again, And how
much of it if if you lean towards you know,
last year, you and I were a little bit over
aggressive with what we were calling for with Cleveland. I
don't think any of us are gonna be calling for
that this time, but it does. Yeah, these are small
sample sizes injuries matter, but it's like that's part of everything.
Is I think what was also a huge crux of
their appeal for me is it felt like their depth
was functional to where it would translate to the playoffs.
And I think it did at times, but it didn't
translate like Indiana's depth did as an example. So I'm
just wondering, if you're running this team or just your
view of this team, how much, if at all, has
how the postseason ended influenced you.
Speaker 3: So this kind of gets into what I was, like,
my overarching thought is it not a lot because like, look,
you won sixty four sixty four games, and you lost
in the second round at least partly because of injury,
and like maybe who knows, like maybe entirely because of injury,
just because like Garland was clearly hampered, Mitchell was going
through it even though he was mostly very productive, mobilely
had an issue like you can't you can't really tell
the story of the Cavs season without mentioning key injuries
to key guys at the worst possible time. Yeah, Like,
to me, that and that along with like they're sort
of general like lack of like medium flexibility, Like yeah,
you can be real flexible if you want to trade
your stars, but like they're not gonna do that, So
coupled with their like fairly limited options to change the team,
I don't view this offseason as like all right, like
last years as the foil for it, like all right,
got to make a big change. This doesn't work the
two bigs and too small, Like we were a long
way from where we were on Cleveland just a year ago.
Certainly we are. Maybe the consensus is a long way too,
So maybe it's anti climactic, but I think you probably
run this back and with or without the Ti Jeromes
of the world, because like what this postseason, maybe what
you can take from this postseason that informs informs your
decision making is that Ti Jerome was an awesome regular
season player that was not effective in the postseason, and
you should not care so much about innings eaters and
care a lot more about like who can be on
the floor against Indiana, And we don't have an issue
with it. And maybe Tie Jerome isn't that guy and
it's not worth paying him what you'd have to to
keep him, So it just to me, it just shifts
the focus a little bit to who are our postseason
guys and otherwise we're kind of just we're gonna stick
with the core that we have.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I agree with everything you said there, and what
I thought was actually really cool is I don't know
if you saw Donovan Mitchell had, but I would call
some of the more like forceful and passionate comments I've
seen from a star that lost like pretty handedly against
the Pacers, where he just I mean, the gist of
it was we're going to be back, yeah, and he
apologized he for the city of like we're going to
be back, and I thought that was really cool. And
the whole Mitchell to Cleveland I don't mean to be
I know, we don't necessarily get too romantic when we're
analyzing this, but the whole Mitchell to Cleveland thing just
really fucking rules. Because the Calves were not a team
that was on his primary list, they traded for him
anyway he stayed. Yeah, and now you're at a point
where you go through last season and you had some
idiots like us and like we didn't say trade everybody,
but we were like, well, maybe you look into trading
Jared Allen after what happened and they ended up extending him.
You kept it together, and then now you go through this,
you just won sixty four games and everyone's expectation was
that you were going to make the conference finals at least,
and he comes out of it just saying basically, yeah,
we messed up. We were injured. That's no excuse like
we're going to be back. And that's refreshing because I
do recognize and we talk about a lot windows open
and shut far more quickly than they normally do. But
there's also something to if your best players, all of
whom for the most part, Darius Garland was injured. We
could maybe have a discussion about Jared Allen, but like
all of your best players just kind of being in
sync and wanting to be there and not putting I'll
put there's pressure on the front office, but now it's
not coming from your best player. Like I think that
means a whole lot here.
Speaker 3: I agree, and I think, like again, to sort of
romanticize it, the what's the whole thing? Like the spur
the Dynastics spurs never repeated, you know, they always they
had an and you're just the gap between the first
dunkin title and the last one is like whatever fifteen
years or something ridiculous like that. Like I I as
I was thinking about, like, okay, what does Cleveland do
from here as the last you know, seconds of their
season or ticking away, I did think more about, like
I wonder if one of the effects of the second
apron and like very careful spending and whatever is that,
Like you kind of do have teams that are this
good that realize, like we can't just keep adding It's
like not possible. So let's just like, let's not assume
there's a move we can make that can make us
better than a sixty four win team, because realistically, there
just isn't.
Speaker 2: Right, Like you just.
Speaker 3: That's about as good as you can be, you know,
most years, almost any year. So like maybe there's just
maybe we get like a little bit of a premium
on continuity, and like maybe we don't freak out every
time a team that's this good doesn't deliver on these
huge expectations.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 3: I started thinking maybe there's maybe it's like wishful thinking,
because it would be nice if we had like more
continuity and gave a team more than like one or
two shots to break through. I just I don't know
if that's what's gonna happen, but it does feel like
the right course, at least for this team. Just like,
see if you can win fifty eight games and stay
a little healthier and you know, like maybe you get
a break in the post, maybe Indiana's hurt and you
and you win that series next time it happens, Like,
I just, it's so hard to be better than the
Calvs were that I'm like hesitant to suggest they do
anything you know, consequential, not that they really can.
Speaker 1: Right And I think, so there are two ways to
look at it. Let's let's take the Yannest question. First.
Would you consider so they can trade up to one
first round pick in two thousand and thirty one or
twenty and thirty two right now, would you trade Darius Garland,
Jared Allen and a first round pick for your honest
attent to coopo if it was available to you.
Speaker 3: Uh, I I think I probably would. I think, yeah,
you just you just have to get the you know,
one of the top three guys in the league.
Speaker 1: You have to do it. I think you have to
get it. I don't know that, but I mean, if
Milwaukee isn't getting its own picks back, it's hard to
find a package that would make them, like Darius Garland
kind of a tempo over the future and they could
be competitive. Yeah, maybe you could send Jared Allen in
New Orleans to get back one or both of your
first round picks. If I'm the Cavs though, like I
don't know. I like, I'm not seeking that out because
there are two ways to look at it, because you
kind of mentioned maybe you're healthier. What I kept coming
back to is, in theory, this team did everything right
during the regular season. It's stars weren't overused, and then
you get to the playoffs and they're all banged up anyway.
So in my head, I'm like, what's the point of
necessarily preserving that depth if this could just happen anyway, right,
Like giannest Is you really tether, like right now, Okay,
your asset light, but your timeline is still so open
ended because of Garland and Mobiley specifically, and if you
go the Yannis route, you're very much in this truncated
Donovan Mitchell Yanni's window does help that you still have
Evan Mobile, who's super young and amazing. I don't think that.
I don't know. I think you probably would have to
do it. But it's not something I came away from
the playoffs thinking that, oh, the Calves need to do
something on that level.
Speaker 3: Well, right, And like you mentioned MOBILEI I mean, we've
been having conversations about this Calv's corps, you know, since
it came together, and like I can distinctly remember us
me saying I think you agreeing, like I think the
way forward or like the best case scenario for this
team is that Evan Mobley is the team's best player, unquestionably,
and like he might be that now, but it's questionable
at least just because Mitchell is, you know, just can
do the things on offense that you need someone to
do to win playoff series. But it's not I mean, like,
shouldn't it be the expectation that Mobile is a little
better next year just based on where he is in
the aging curve?
Speaker 1: And I don't like you pay attention to the discourse
that's park like that, you know what I mean?
Speaker 3: And like, isn't Garland young enough to take like a
tiny step forward?
Speaker 1: And it was so good there were people I disagree,
Like there are people for a while that had him,
like above Donovan Mitchell on their all NBA ballots, and I.
Speaker 2: Did, I did for a minute.
Speaker 3: It's just I mean, he's really good and could get
better and and mobiley should get better. So like, yeah,
I mean you you know, okay, so the honest trade, yeah,
you probably got to do it. But what if what
if in like two years Mobile's a better player than
Yannis or like three you know, it's we're not that
far away from where like the trajectory lines have hit
right in the in the in the you know, career
arc chart. So like again, so this is why I
didn't want to get to this main point right away,
because we're supposed to talk about their options. But to me,
it's just like I think this core is as good
as it can be realistically, and I think you should
give it another shot, you know. And whether that a
Bolt Hi Jerome or Sam Merril, who can say. But
but the core just needs another crack at it.
Speaker 1: So what would actually be their needs to you? Where
it's you have to you're gonna look at minimums, like
maybe they're I mean, they have movable salaries, so if
they really wanted to go all in. You could trade
a first round pick salary. And if you're doing something
like that, what are you looking to address?
Speaker 3: Well, if it's a trade, then you're it's a little
bit of a different conversation. But like, if you decide
you don't want to pay fourteen plus eighty and penalties
for tie Jerome, you're gonna need a third ball handler,
I think, unless you really think Mobile is going to
take a huge step there to where if one or
the other of Garland or Mitchell's not on the floor,
Mobile's just like, yeah, it's great, We're fine with him,
like bringing the ball up and running a lot of
the offensive sets. So you have to find someone to
replace what Jerome gave you. But like, other than that,
like you the easy answer used to be, well, we
need someone to play the three or you know, undersized four.
It's like DeAndre Hunter's here, that's like that's what he's for.
And you still have Max Struce and maybe a Korro
is someone that you try to flip, but like it
just if it, My answer I guess is just like well,
whoever they don't bring back they need to replace, And
that's like, you know, you're talking six, seventh, eighth, wherever
you think Jerome falls in the hierarchy, like eighth, ninth guy,
something like that.
Speaker 1: I wondering if they would be anything they could do.
I agree with everything you said there, but where it's
sort of you're melding two of those three things together,
where it's I think a perfect example would be like
if a Corps and DeAndre Hunter could be the same player,
which would just feel like a lot of needs for them.
Or it's can you get someone who's another like a
third ball handler but they're also bigger, like maybe they're
tied your own size, but they're better on defense. That's
a tall order, But I think if you're putting a
first round pick on the table, maybe you could go like,
you're not gonna go out there and address that on
the minimum? Maybe would it's Spencer Dinwity, it's not with you, sure,
but that's not going to be cheaper than tie your
own probably, but that's not going to solve your everything.
And so I still think they could probably hope to
upgrade in those types of spots, But I don't like
a name doesn't spring to mind or be like, oh no,
that's worth it, and you should absolutely do it, and
if they do, it's you know, they're probably they're not
going to be a bit like Herb Jones on this team,
even though at the shooting like that would be incredible,
but hey, guess what, like you're not getting Herb Jones
for one first round pick.
Speaker 3: Probably not, Yeah, especially at his set, Like, Yeah, I
don't know. I think, like, I mean, I I wonder too,
had the Cavs been healthy and Ti Jerome just may
not have played that much, it would I just maybe
he'd maybe maybe you would bring him back then.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 3: It's just like the conversations about their needs would be
very different. I think if the core guys had been healthier,
because in like Ty Jerome, if you think he got
exposed or whatever, like that would have been minimized because
he just wouldn't have played as much because you could
have leaned harder on Garland for example, who missed you know,
significant time in the in the postseason.
Speaker 1: I do like just to throw names out there so
we're not just saying do nothing. I'm like, I don't know,
what will Torrem Prince still be a minimum player after
this year? Might be kind of interesting. Yeah, as a
trade target. I don't know if he gives you enough
of the ball handling. And I said about gonna like
Kean Ellis on this team, maybe just a little bit
too small if you're willing to put a pick on
the table, that could be kind of interesting. Mm hmm.
But I honestly, and I hate saying this, but they
might be the one team I say this about there
in the entire look aheads which just like they feel
after the DeAndre Hunter team, like they just feel so
close to complete. I would ask you, though, so if
you had the option of if you could get rid
of Isaaca Korro so you bring back to like, who
do you view is more important if it was an
either or situation for them.
Speaker 2: Between him and Jerome.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I would say Jerome probably matters more, But that
gets tricky if you're committing what it might take to
keep him, although like, yeah, I guess you should assume
it's gonna cost you mid level or close to it,
because someone will probably be willing to give him the
mid level.
Speaker 1: Even honestly, I don't know. I would go through the
list of teams the other day of who's even gonna
have the mid level and you can get to a
point where it's like twelve mite. But I think more realistically,
if we're including cap space teams and then full non
tax payer mid level teams, we're looking at fewer than ten,
probably like eight or six. And then how many of
those teams are just gonna want to like Brooklyn's not
paying I don't fit well. I mean, I they could
a ball, but they're not gonna come and give Ti
Jerome half of their caps. But like here's twenty million
dollars like or something. I don't think anyway.
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, I think what is a Korral?
Speaker 3: I think a Koro makes like eleven, So if you
could get Jerome near that number, I think, like he's
a very good third guard right like playoff stuff aside.
I think if you believe that this past season was
like eighty percent real, then he's he's just he's worth
the mid level, probably because he's a guy that can
start on a good team if you need him to.
Probably don't want that for a full season or postseason,
but yeah, if if you could get him at like
the a Coorro rate, then I would just way rather
have Ti Jerome. He feel like Hunter being there means
a Korro is kind of like, yeah, he's the great
defender hustle guy, but it's like you're playing him behind
Struce an Hunter essentially in that same role.
Speaker 2: So it's like he's the more expendable one of Korro.
Speaker 1: I think anything else on them or any name or
target who would be the most likely player to be
traded for that.
Speaker 3: Well, So like if you do look into this, you
can't say it's seismic because he's the fourth guy. But
if you look at Moving Allen for example, like you're
trying to even though we just said it's very hard
to get better than sixty four wins, let's say, well,
we think mobile can play center full time. Doesn't make
a whole lot of sense to have a guy who
we think maybe should just be a super high end
backup or like when we need to go too big
kind of kind of option making twenty and then eventually
gets up to like twenty eight and beyond on the
next extension. What do you get, Like, who's out there,
Like we're a Jared at we need Jared Allen to
be our starting center, and we'll give you like a
like a wing of some kind, Like I was.
Speaker 1: Gonna say I have a prospective trade, there would be
other math would need to be involved or in other teams.
Allen for Jalen Wells and Zach Edy.
Speaker 2: Jalen Wells and Zach Edy. Oh man, that's really interesting.
Speaker 1: You could say no if it's not actually this is
off the cuff. I did not come in here with
any trade ideas playing.
Speaker 3: Well I kind of like that for both because Edie
makes more sense as like, yeah, we're not relying on
him as a full time starter, but man, we can
throw him in there against the right matchups and or
go double big and Wells the same issues with Wells.
Speaker 2: Just follow him to Cleveland where it's like.
Speaker 3: He's a little small to be guarding threes. But I
mean he's on a dirt cheap deal. So maybe that's
your a Coro upgrade and you can trim a Korro somehow.
From the books, that's a fun trade. If you just
came up with that right off the cuff.
Speaker 2: I'm impressed.
Speaker 1: The other one. I don't think this is enough, but
if I mean, maybe if you could, what would it
take for you to get send him to the Lakers,
Like if they sent back they have a first round pick,
in twenty seven, they could send you like his Austin
Reeves and a twenty seven for Allen, Like there'd have
to be more salary if you were getting Dorian Finny
Smith is part of that deal too. I think the
Lakers say no at that point. Yeah, Austin Reeve an
expiring contract and the twenty seven first round pick, that's
your third ball handler. Then you have to go out
and find another big unless. I mean, part of the
money coming back could be Jared Vanderbilt, but that contract
is not yeah, not great.
Speaker 3: Right in that scenario, I think the Calves because Reeves
is I don't know, very valuable to them.
Speaker 2: To the Lakers too. I wonder if if.
Speaker 1: He's redundant in Cleveland like you're if you're playing right, you're.
Speaker 2: A luxury third ball handler, like yeah, high luxury.
Speaker 3: So you'd have to almost like if I'm the Lakers,
I'm like, you're taking I guess it's Vanderbilt, but it's
like you're taking our worst contract back just because you
have to.
Speaker 1: Honestly, I might. I don't know if I would do
it if I'm cleaning, but like I wouldn't mind having
Vanderbilt if I'm getting Reeves and then I'm also getting
another first round pick. Yeah, I think Jared Allen's super valuable,
but like he that was not his best series against
the Pacer. Is that I don't know that I like
that for either team.
Speaker 3: No, I don't like it as much as the Memphis one.
And like it's we're not trying to trade Allen. It's
just like, Okay, if you're the Calves and you're trying
to make a meaningful upgrade, you're not trading any of
those other you know, Mobiley, Garland, Mitchell, Like you're just
not gonna trade those guys. So it just almost has
to be Allan if you really want to make a difference.
And we're just sitting here saying, like I'm not even
sure that's the right move.
Speaker 1: What would you do Jared Allen for? I mean the Kings.
The Kings wouldn't trade Keegan Murray for Jared Allen, right,
I mean.
Speaker 3: They wouldn't trade Keegan Murray for for anybody?
Speaker 1: What about Monk and Kean Ellis for Jared Allen? And
maybe there's a pick need to go out in that one.
Speaker 3: What are Monk and Ellis? I mean that then then
you're talking those are your third and fourth guards.
Speaker 1: Yeah, ke Alas could play some three for you a
little bit.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I think you're yeah, that's possible. I
almost rather have Hunter Hunters a little bigger, maybe a
lot bigger.
Speaker 1: I mean, if Cleveland could duck the second eight, well, no,
that would be like way too the nets would have
to be involved. There'd be really funny if they use
Jared Allen in their first round pick is like the
vehicle through which they acquire Kevin Durant for this team.
Would that work for you?
Speaker 2: Good? God? How sure? Let's do it?
Speaker 1: That? Would you be worried? Though? Could he fit with
Donovan Mitchell, Evan Mobley and uh Darius Carland? I'm not.
Speaker 3: I mean for the eighteen months you have him, it's
gonna be great, and then whatever happens after that happens.
Speaker 1: I'm kind of out of random off the cuff, Jared Well,
I mean New Orleans, like, would you give herb Jones
and stuff for or or You're like, no, we have
eaves Musians. Iion, we don't know where we're going. We're
not going that.
Speaker 3: Rat Well, I don't know if New Orleans knows where
it's going full stop. But like, if you're giving up,
don't you in a vacuum? Isn't Herb Jones more valuable
than Jared Allen or is it?
Speaker 2: Do you view it the other way?
Speaker 1: It'd be nice to see Herb Jones play some playoff basket.
Speaker 3: Sure, that's not that's not entirely his fault, right, I
don't know.
Speaker 1: It's tough because this season for Herb Jones was rough
with the injuries, and yeah, I think it would be close.
But if you have, like if New Orleans doesn't really
know what it's doing, you're not gonna I mean like
and then also the money would be tough here because
there's Herb Jones that you need to come up with
another twenty million or something. And that's just you're not
taking back to Jante Murray if you're Cleveland that right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Yeah, I just think like a lot if you're
really trying to figure out ways for the Cavs to
get even better, I keep circling back to, like, well,
you just have to reconfigure the team so that so
that Mobley's playing center and instead of Alan, you have
a cheaper like second big for a two big look,
and then just another like big wing slash forward type
like I mean, Herb Jones isn't a big wing, but
like someone like that, you just change the makeup a
little bit.
Speaker 2: And maybe maybe if Mobley.
Speaker 3: Is just like yeah, no, he's he's like a full
on anchor. Now he can do all that stuff. Like
that's that's the different look you might go for.
Speaker 1: Can I Galaxy brain something?
Speaker 2: Please?
Speaker 1: This is this is we're not checking the framework. I
could make it work if people are interested and give
them the exact details of the deal. A three team
trade between Golden State, Brooklyn and Cleveland, where Jared Allen's
up in Golden State, coming is in Brooklyn, and Cam
Johnson is in Cleveland.
Speaker 3: I actually had a thought because as we're recording today,
we'll just pull the curtain back. We're gonna do a
Warriors look ahead too. It's like, is there a framework
where Kaminga is part of an Allen acquisition for Golden State.
I hadn't thought about the third team and getting Cam
in there.
Speaker 1: That Warriors have to send out picks. Yeah, it scenario
which is four, which is actually kind of wild when
you think.
Speaker 2: I was surprised by that too. Yeah that's interesting.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but is Jared Allen, like the type of big
that you think would work well in Golden State.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think, I mean he's better.
Speaker 3: You know, you're not getting the spacing, but like he's
better than Trace Jackson, Davis and Kevon Looney.
Speaker 1: So if you're if it's like Jonathan Kaminga and too, like,
how many picks are you attaching to Jonathan Aminga to
get Jared Allen? Because I think you could like, is
Cam Johnson for Jared? The first part of this would
be from this is the Cleveland podcast? Do you like
Cam Johnson on the Cavaliers better than Jared Allen? And
if it's like a scoach less then you also need
to say in Cleveland and something for this deal to work.
Speaker 3: I mean I think that that's what I'm That's kind
of the look I'm talking about where it's like you
could argue about whether Cam Johnson's better than Jared Allen,
like you know, just objectively, but if you're trying to
change the calves in a way that's like maybe we're
more playoff fit this way. I think Johnson would be
someone that could could get you there, Like he's he's
not maybe he's exactly as good as Jared Allen, but
like he's different, Like he makes the team different offensively
principally because you really can be a full five out
without giving up too much size. Like your rebounding is
gonna be a problem, because.
Speaker 1: It's also a problem with the two bags, right.
Speaker 3: Johnson's not a good rebounder, and if you're swapping out
your best rebounder for him or like that, or maybe
you know, maybe that's mobile, but a good rebounder for him,
that's that's gonna accentuate something that's already like pretty weak. Right,
So that's the other thing is like if the calves
are gonna get better, they're gonna give it back somewhere else. Probably,
Like if you're talking about a big trade so unbalanced,
maybe you're just different and that matters.
Speaker 1: I don't know, do you still believe? And I think
this would be the good wrap up because I'm I'm
with you. So we went through this exercise. The Cam
Johnson one's super interesting. I don't know if you liked
the Memphis trade I pitched that's like leaning so far
into just young guys that I would that wud be
a little hesitant. We would run it back, but like
do you still believe if they were gonna move Jared Allen,
who of the core four, if they would move, any
of them, does feel like the most likely to go.
Do you still believe that you can approximate like good
value in center on the cheap. Whereas because all the
trades we kind of talked about, with the exception that
the Memphis one, you're getting Zach Edie, But like, all right,
I would love to know who's the other big or
two bigs that are in their rotation at that point.
Speaker 3: I think I still think that like capable backup center play,
which is what you would be talking about. I think
if you're trading Alan like as a need for Cleveland
because you're not, the whole idea is like Mobile's the center.
I think it's still easier at center to get a
minimum guy or close to it, as like a good
enough backup who could play in two big looks than
it is to get like we need a wing or
we need a ball, like you just those guys just
aren't you know right, you don't run into it. It's
uncommon that like Gary Trent Junior and like Torrian Prince
or like Malik Beasley signed for super like those guys
are the exceptions, and even they aren't like really what
we're talking about for the Cavs. So yeah, I mean
that's still the case.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 3: We haven't swung the pendulum, hasn't gone all the way
back on centers where like suddenly it's not the easiest
position to replace cheaply.
Speaker 1: No, I'm with you, and I think Bismack beyondbo exists.
So it's just as fo sure. I mean, honestly, I
thought I had what we were going through. This is
what if they because you could probably duck the second
apron if you're getting rid of if you're not bringing
back tydromar Merril's like what if brook Lopez was just like, hey,
I'll sign for the mini mL E or even the minimum. Now,
I mean then it's like, okay, that's a different type
of big from Jared Allen. I'll make that clear. But
uh yeah, do you have anything else on this team?
Are you ready to take us out of here?
Speaker 3: Now?
Speaker 2: I think that's gonna do it.
Speaker 3: What I would add and I think we agree on,
is like sixty four wins is very good. You should
just kind of see if you can do that again
and then not be hurt fair enough. Like that, that's
our that's our cutting analysis.
Speaker 1: If I'm Kobe Altman, the most extreme thing I'm looking
at would be, is it like, can we bring back
Ti Jerome when we need to lop off salary elsewhere?
Or is it should we put our first round pick
on the table, attach it to salary and try and
take like not bring in another star. But it's not
trading the core for it's trying to augment them yet again.
Speaker 3: Scientias Jones for the minimum something like that, he's a
free agurent.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Let Cavs fans especially, let us know what you think.
Let us know how comfortable you are with with standing
pat because it's easy for us to say we don't
have any skin in the game, but.
Speaker 2: I feel like that's the right call. Be interested to
hear counter opinions.
Speaker 3: Wherever you're listening to this or watching this rate review, subscribe,
leave us some comments on YouTube, join our discord.
Speaker 2: At least for that on YouTube.
Speaker 3: Podcast for tell your friends, Tell your enemies shouts, Frank
nol Kin apologies, Jared Allen