1 00:00:28,440 --> 00:00:35,799 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Great Detectives of Old Time Radio from Boise, Idaho. 2 00:00:36,119 --> 00:00:39,399 This is your host, Adam Graham. In a moment, we're 3 00:00:39,399 --> 00:00:43,439 going to bring you this week's episode of The Big Story. 4 00:00:43,600 --> 00:00:46,359 But first, I do want to encourage you, if you're 5 00:00:46,479 --> 00:00:51,200 enjoying the podcast, to please follow us using your favorite 6 00:00:51,200 --> 00:00:54,399 podcast software. Also, I do want to encourage you to 7 00:00:54,479 --> 00:00:57,159 check out our other podcast, and today I'm calling out 8 00:00:57,280 --> 00:01:01,079 The Great Adventurers of Old Time Radio, which is nearing 9 00:01:01,200 --> 00:01:06,040 its one hundredth episode. You can find it at Great 10 00:01:06,159 --> 00:01:14,000 Adventures or info. But now from November twenty ninth, nineteen 11 00:01:14,120 --> 00:01:18,079 fifty here is Killer with the mind of a. 12 00:01:18,000 --> 00:01:18,760 Speaker 2: Little boy. 13 00:01:27,239 --> 00:01:30,159 Speaker 3: Going for just going lit a brunch. 14 00:01:31,079 --> 00:01:34,760 Speaker 4: Hi, I just do a good day with you. I 15 00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:35,560 think really good. 16 00:01:35,920 --> 00:01:38,040 Speaker 3: Oh come on, stop a car. 17 00:01:38,439 --> 00:01:39,640 Speaker 5: I don't want to be late for the show. 18 00:01:39,840 --> 00:01:41,200 Speaker 3: I like calling the little brunch. 19 00:01:41,599 --> 00:01:42,200 Speaker 6: I like you. 20 00:01:42,840 --> 00:01:44,400 Speaker 7: I used to watch your house when you went out 21 00:01:44,439 --> 00:01:48,799 with other men. Now you're with you blinds. Could you 22 00:01:48,920 --> 00:01:51,040 could I lean my head in the two shoulder just 23 00:01:51,040 --> 00:01:51,599 for a minute. 24 00:01:51,719 --> 00:01:52,519 Speaker 3: You're crazy. 25 00:01:53,359 --> 00:01:55,000 Speaker 7: I knew I should never have given you a day, 26 00:01:55,159 --> 00:01:57,799 and you kept testing and testing like a kid. 27 00:01:58,159 --> 00:02:01,040 Speaker 3: Ither one get away from the interview. Say you're long, 28 00:02:01,680 --> 00:02:02,640 make me you. 29 00:02:04,799 --> 00:02:05,439 Speaker 6: Make me sick? 30 00:02:06,040 --> 00:02:06,400 Speaker 3: Let me. 31 00:02:20,199 --> 00:02:20,919 Speaker 8: Salt Lake City. 32 00:02:20,960 --> 00:02:23,840 Speaker 3: You talk on the pages of a salt Lake City Tribune. 33 00:02:24,280 --> 00:02:27,360 The story of a reporter when enough about children to 34 00:02:27,520 --> 00:02:29,039 catch a triplet. 35 00:02:34,240 --> 00:02:37,120 Speaker 8: Salt Lake City. The story is that actually happens? 36 00:02:37,840 --> 00:02:52,479 Speaker 7: Yeah, Johnson's story as he lived it, as you t 37 00:02:52,719 --> 00:02:54,319 I Johnson, the part of. 38 00:02:54,319 --> 00:02:57,520 Speaker 3: The salt Lake City Tribune. Dive along the main highway 39 00:02:57,599 --> 00:02:59,479 to bring hogm in the salt Lake City. 40 00:03:00,240 --> 00:03:01,759 Speaker 8: Everything seems just right. 41 00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:04,599 Speaker 3: A new Green Tadan. You're diving, you're spect. 42 00:03:04,280 --> 00:03:05,000 Speaker 8: To the fact. 43 00:03:06,840 --> 00:03:10,000 Speaker 5: Is warm and a lie, and everything along the road 44 00:03:10,199 --> 00:03:10,400 is a. 45 00:03:10,479 --> 00:03:12,879 Speaker 3: Familiar to you as a hat on your head. 46 00:03:13,479 --> 00:03:13,960 Speaker 8: It ought to be. 47 00:03:14,639 --> 00:03:18,039 Speaker 7: This is your deep You just passed through the Mormon town. 48 00:03:18,080 --> 00:03:21,919 If he's helpful, ways a few friends, and now about. 49 00:03:21,680 --> 00:03:24,240 Speaker 5: A mile past you decided to stop. 50 00:03:24,919 --> 00:03:29,960 Speaker 3: You are that's a great report? 51 00:03:30,120 --> 00:03:31,960 Speaker 8: Looking for a story? Now, I think you might. 52 00:03:32,000 --> 00:03:34,319 Speaker 3: If your mother in law yet it died. 53 00:03:34,039 --> 00:03:35,199 Speaker 5: And left your buzzy lives. 54 00:03:36,719 --> 00:03:37,919 Speaker 8: Will beat you follow up. 55 00:03:37,960 --> 00:03:41,360 Speaker 6: Now I driving a new car. 56 00:03:41,520 --> 00:03:43,360 Speaker 5: Oh like a fine let's. 57 00:03:43,280 --> 00:03:44,680 Speaker 3: They driving out of even my ship? 58 00:03:46,479 --> 00:03:54,000 Speaker 2: Sure s time of the years, your eyes, great time 59 00:03:54,080 --> 00:03:55,159 of the year to be alive. 60 00:03:55,319 --> 00:03:56,319 Speaker 8: With the gas defendant. 61 00:03:56,719 --> 00:04:00,159 Speaker 7: But at that very moment, back in these helpfold as 62 00:04:00,159 --> 00:04:05,560 a man who thought of the world and. 63 00:04:05,639 --> 00:04:08,800 Speaker 3: A half night of dust. The man slowly drag plans 64 00:04:08,840 --> 00:04:11,400 for Open's body, for the field of the ball dry grass. 65 00:04:11,960 --> 00:04:13,800 You don't want to break the grass when he. 66 00:04:15,599 --> 00:04:18,480 Speaker 6: There, Josh, he's dragging comes flow. 67 00:04:18,680 --> 00:04:19,680 Speaker 5: I can't see him clearly. 68 00:04:19,959 --> 00:04:20,720 Speaker 3: He's in a shadow. 69 00:04:21,319 --> 00:04:23,319 Speaker 6: Here you what are you doing? At you? 70 00:04:23,639 --> 00:04:25,160 Speaker 3: I'm casting it all now he's. 71 00:04:33,360 --> 00:04:36,560 Speaker 7: You're back on the highland off yea, on your way 72 00:04:36,600 --> 00:04:37,199 to thought. 73 00:04:37,000 --> 00:04:39,839 Speaker 3: Like At first, you don't notice. 74 00:04:39,839 --> 00:04:40,399 Speaker 2: It's the road. 75 00:04:40,519 --> 00:04:41,519 Speaker 3: It's strange lands. 76 00:04:42,079 --> 00:04:44,000 Speaker 8: They're mat of fact. You don't know if. 77 00:04:43,920 --> 00:04:49,079 Speaker 3: Anything I'm gonna suddenly here You look at the aware 78 00:04:49,079 --> 00:04:51,879 of your mirror. They might they have to somebody else. 79 00:04:52,480 --> 00:04:55,439 What you see your mirror makes you slam your right 80 00:04:55,519 --> 00:05:01,079 now the two supers guns along on you. Okay, you'll 81 00:05:01,199 --> 00:05:03,199 step up and don't try anything. It's trying out, love, 82 00:05:03,319 --> 00:05:08,279 Carl Rifling. What's the matter, g You're lucky, jes you 83 00:05:08,319 --> 00:05:11,360 hadn't stopped right off. We just started shooting shooting your car. 84 00:05:11,519 --> 00:05:12,360 He are greens are? 85 00:05:12,399 --> 00:05:13,800 Speaker 8: Then they make theme. 86 00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:14,240 Speaker 3: Come of the murder. 87 00:05:14,360 --> 00:05:15,040 Speaker 8: You to get away. 88 00:05:15,040 --> 00:05:16,639 Speaker 3: Wait a minute, Carl what murderer? 89 00:05:16,839 --> 00:05:19,240 Speaker 5: Back in eat hopeful some of just kill three people? 90 00:05:19,480 --> 00:05:21,480 Speaker 3: Really listen, I can't let you go any farnt of 91 00:05:21,480 --> 00:05:24,720 this car. You're greens are then? Oh, I guess you 92 00:05:24,800 --> 00:05:25,480 better follow. 93 00:05:25,319 --> 00:05:26,519 Speaker 8: Us back to eat, Hopeful. 94 00:05:33,680 --> 00:05:36,680 Speaker 3: You'll follow in the wake of the children, the. 95 00:05:36,720 --> 00:05:41,279 Speaker 7: Warm, living sunset they suddenly turned into a frightening purple 96 00:05:41,319 --> 00:05:44,600 and black sky. A nice time to be alive and 97 00:05:44,920 --> 00:05:48,439 to become a time of set. You drive back and 98 00:05:48,560 --> 00:05:52,560 eat helpful. Everything seems to have lost this familiar loves 99 00:05:53,279 --> 00:05:57,639 everything of fear. Maybe there's death striking three times, but fitn't. 100 00:05:58,240 --> 00:06:02,000 Maybe it was a spell. Never lose at least street somewhere. 101 00:06:02,720 --> 00:06:06,040 You can feel it, even here in the chief's office. 102 00:06:06,040 --> 00:06:07,680 Nobody got to look at him too. 103 00:06:08,319 --> 00:06:08,680 Speaker 6: Nope. 104 00:06:09,519 --> 00:06:11,800 Speaker 3: If we found Blanche Wilson, George nell As, you're. 105 00:06:11,720 --> 00:06:13,720 Speaker 8: Called dead, I phone for roadblocks up and down. 106 00:06:14,879 --> 00:06:16,079 Speaker 5: Figure you'll catch him before. 107 00:06:15,879 --> 00:06:16,399 Speaker 8: The night time. 108 00:06:17,360 --> 00:06:20,480 Speaker 2: Isn't uh? Isn't there anything else? You don't even know 109 00:06:20,480 --> 00:06:23,920 if anybody can do? Sorry, wait, I can't make it 110 00:06:23,920 --> 00:06:24,439 any more. 111 00:06:24,279 --> 00:06:24,839 Speaker 8: Exciting for it. 112 00:06:24,959 --> 00:06:27,040 Speaker 3: Oh no, I didn't mean exact way, chief, that's all right? 113 00:06:28,319 --> 00:06:31,839 Oh well, yeah, I almost forgot. That's talk at Blanche 114 00:06:31,839 --> 00:06:34,600 Wilson's daughter Jenny or what you have to say? Nothing, 115 00:06:35,319 --> 00:06:37,199 he was out when whoever it was called on Blanche. 116 00:06:37,399 --> 00:06:41,519 Speaker 7: Oh, doesn't anybody in town have any ideas. 117 00:06:41,120 --> 00:06:41,720 Speaker 8: That who he is? 118 00:06:42,240 --> 00:06:46,120 Speaker 3: Nope, everybody don't know though, since we're catching. 119 00:06:47,079 --> 00:06:48,920 Speaker 5: Look, Chief, I'm I'm a reporter. 120 00:06:49,000 --> 00:06:49,120 Speaker 7: Now. 121 00:06:49,120 --> 00:06:50,399 Speaker 3: I know it would be stupid of me to go 122 00:06:50,439 --> 00:06:52,839 streching around in my own car. But couldn't you know? 123 00:06:53,920 --> 00:06:54,639 Speaker 8: Okay't at all? 124 00:06:54,800 --> 00:06:58,439 Speaker 3: Yeah, I least behind today. I find some checkers on 125 00:06:58,480 --> 00:06:58,879 the board. 126 00:06:58,920 --> 00:07:00,720 Speaker 8: We can play a bit if. 127 00:07:00,560 --> 00:07:02,000 Speaker 3: You laid it on. We go out together and taken 128 00:07:02,079 --> 00:07:05,040 the ground. You know, Chief Palace as well as he 129 00:07:05,120 --> 00:07:08,160 knows you see Johnson, And it takes you just about 130 00:07:08,199 --> 00:07:10,240 ten seconds to figure out what the old man is 131 00:07:10,319 --> 00:07:12,399 up to me. He knows there are. 132 00:07:12,360 --> 00:07:14,639 Speaker 7: Hundreds of men out there in the dark with gune. 133 00:07:15,519 --> 00:07:18,079 He knows that you are a reporter might very easily 134 00:07:18,079 --> 00:07:20,279 get in the way of a bullet said. You decide 135 00:07:20,279 --> 00:07:23,000 to go looking for the night by yourself. 136 00:07:23,319 --> 00:07:24,439 Speaker 8: So in his own neat. 137 00:07:24,360 --> 00:07:26,240 Speaker 3: Way, he has just trapped. 138 00:07:26,879 --> 00:07:31,120 Speaker 7: So without another car, you obviously join in the Hi. 139 00:07:38,399 --> 00:07:41,560 You've played checkers for about an hour, not every tick 140 00:07:41,639 --> 00:07:43,680 of the old clock and chief palace is offered. 141 00:07:44,279 --> 00:07:47,360 Speaker 3: You get to feeling more jumpy and more help work. 142 00:07:48,399 --> 00:07:53,240 Speaker 7: Finally, no more chief to bed, going to live and 143 00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:56,040 walk around town, get some background material. 144 00:07:56,079 --> 00:07:58,160 Speaker 3: I don't have my story already. When you catch the murderer. 145 00:07:59,120 --> 00:08:01,240 Well do you think I'm going? I thought i'd have 146 00:08:01,279 --> 00:08:02,040 a talk a branch. 147 00:08:02,040 --> 00:08:28,839 Speaker 5: Wilson's daughter Jenny. 148 00:08:04,439 --> 00:08:18,199 Speaker 3: Y, Jenny, have your right? 149 00:08:18,240 --> 00:08:18,839 Speaker 9: This just happen. 150 00:08:20,040 --> 00:08:20,680 Speaker 8: You'd be nice? 151 00:08:20,720 --> 00:08:21,680 Speaker 6: What's coming over to? 152 00:08:22,160 --> 00:08:23,680 Speaker 3: Sure? Need any one to do. 153 00:08:26,639 --> 00:08:27,240 Speaker 5: What you read? 154 00:08:28,240 --> 00:08:28,800 Speaker 10: Your boss? 155 00:08:31,040 --> 00:08:31,360 Speaker 3: Hello? 156 00:08:32,279 --> 00:08:35,559 Speaker 6: H Jenny there, I'll. 157 00:08:36,960 --> 00:08:37,720 Speaker 3: It's amazing. 158 00:08:39,759 --> 00:08:40,039 Speaker 6: Hello. 159 00:08:40,759 --> 00:08:43,840 Speaker 3: Hello? Is that you? Jenny? 160 00:08:45,519 --> 00:08:48,600 Speaker 5: Jenny is your mother? 161 00:08:48,720 --> 00:08:48,879 Speaker 8: There? 162 00:08:50,759 --> 00:08:53,039 Speaker 3: Jenny is your mother there? 163 00:08:54,759 --> 00:08:55,399 Speaker 7: Did you see it? 164 00:08:56,320 --> 00:08:56,759 Speaker 3: Mm hmm? 165 00:08:58,080 --> 00:08:58,759 Speaker 8: That's too bad. 166 00:08:59,840 --> 00:09:02,120 Speaker 11: I'll bet you. 167 00:09:02,279 --> 00:09:03,840 Speaker 6: We don't want to talk about him for you. 168 00:09:19,879 --> 00:09:20,320 Speaker 5: That's wrong. 169 00:09:20,799 --> 00:09:23,639 Speaker 6: I don't call it's a stranger. I can't get. 170 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:24,080 Speaker 5: Out of Jenny. 171 00:09:24,519 --> 00:09:25,559 Speaker 4: This is mister Johnson. 172 00:09:25,639 --> 00:09:26,519 Speaker 5: He hit the papers. 173 00:09:26,679 --> 00:09:28,159 Speaker 6: He can't invite you around the phone. 174 00:09:28,279 --> 00:09:29,360 Speaker 5: He just wants to. 175 00:09:31,279 --> 00:09:33,360 Speaker 8: Happen to keep me so someone. 176 00:09:33,080 --> 00:09:34,240 Speaker 3: You know, Helen. 177 00:09:35,000 --> 00:09:36,399 Speaker 6: I've never heard his first before. 178 00:09:37,600 --> 00:09:39,279 Speaker 7: When I said offer that metal. 179 00:09:40,000 --> 00:09:42,919 Speaker 6: She started to cry and he said, now you know, 180 00:09:43,000 --> 00:09:43,720 how hard are you? 181 00:09:44,159 --> 00:09:46,679 Speaker 8: That is weird? You have no idea how my mother. 182 00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:50,080 Speaker 6: And I know many strange you should picture with the 183 00:09:50,120 --> 00:09:51,240 packing to work. 184 00:09:51,399 --> 00:09:53,440 Speaker 3: Oh, thanks, I won't bother you anymore. 185 00:09:55,440 --> 00:09:56,080 Speaker 8: You heard. 186 00:09:57,480 --> 00:10:01,080 Speaker 6: She knows a man on the phone, he sounded on 187 00:10:01,279 --> 00:10:35,200 them all shouted, I've. 188 00:10:19,840 --> 00:10:21,200 Speaker 3: Had some of the women in the plant. They have 189 00:10:21,240 --> 00:10:23,840 told me you were Blanch Wilson. Real well, yes I did, mister. 190 00:10:23,720 --> 00:10:25,159 Speaker 6: Johnson speaking in the office. 191 00:10:25,159 --> 00:10:26,159 Speaker 8: Who's got in for a smoke? 192 00:10:26,240 --> 00:10:27,000 Speaker 10: And who talk? 193 00:10:27,200 --> 00:10:27,559 Speaker 8: Uh huh? 194 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:31,440 Speaker 3: Did she have many admirers who? 195 00:10:31,559 --> 00:10:31,639 Speaker 5: Man? 196 00:10:32,200 --> 00:10:35,200 Speaker 6: Oh, she wasn't bad. She just like growing out that. 197 00:10:35,919 --> 00:10:37,919 Speaker 3: That's the parking lot out that window, isn't it? 198 00:10:38,039 --> 00:10:38,360 Speaker 7: Uh huh? 199 00:10:38,799 --> 00:10:39,600 Speaker 8: Belongs to the plants. 200 00:10:39,679 --> 00:10:41,799 Speaker 3: In the same time, I imagine you can see clear 201 00:10:41,840 --> 00:10:44,120 over to the gate there. Couldn't you clear over to 202 00:10:44,159 --> 00:10:45,000 the cafe, couldn't you? 203 00:10:47,639 --> 00:10:48,240 Speaker 8: That's my job? 204 00:10:49,159 --> 00:10:50,080 Speaker 7: Yeah, uh huh. 205 00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:52,000 Speaker 3: I can see right out to the gates to the cafe. 206 00:10:52,960 --> 00:10:55,120 I haven't see a green sedan waiting for Blanche. 207 00:10:55,720 --> 00:10:55,759 Speaker 10: You. 208 00:10:55,759 --> 00:11:01,000 Speaker 3: No, well, I won't bother you anymore, like thanks anytime? 209 00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:06,200 Speaker 6: Yes, the way he said, admire kind of fee me wrong? 210 00:11:06,960 --> 00:11:09,879 Speaker 5: What do you mean, well, all of a sud. 211 00:11:09,879 --> 00:11:11,120 Speaker 7: It wasn't a boyfriend of Blanche. 212 00:11:11,200 --> 00:11:13,200 Speaker 3: Just so I didn't think of him when you fell. 213 00:11:14,799 --> 00:11:16,000 Speaker 8: That's a battle clown. 214 00:11:16,039 --> 00:11:17,840 Speaker 3: He used to wait for Blanche regularly. 215 00:11:17,519 --> 00:11:17,879 Speaker 7: At the gate. 216 00:11:18,960 --> 00:11:21,000 Speaker 3: Oh no, no, he never would have gone out with him. 217 00:11:21,200 --> 00:11:23,919 Speaker 5: Why well, whyn't used to laugh about him? 218 00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:28,360 Speaker 11: Well, if you were a woman, mister Johnson, you'd understand. 219 00:11:29,600 --> 00:11:30,600 Speaker 6: I don't think he's important. 220 00:11:30,600 --> 00:11:34,159 Speaker 3: Anything might be important, believe me. What what was wrong 221 00:11:34,200 --> 00:11:34,480 with him? 222 00:11:35,519 --> 00:11:35,879 Speaker 1: I don't know. 223 00:11:36,600 --> 00:11:39,279 Speaker 3: He begger for a date, but it was more like 224 00:11:39,440 --> 00:11:42,960 he was just begging to be looked at. Oh that 225 00:11:43,120 --> 00:11:43,720 sounds wrong. 226 00:11:45,279 --> 00:11:46,639 Speaker 8: Well, sometimes nothing. 227 00:11:47,080 --> 00:11:49,679 Speaker 10: Sometimes he just laughs and he'd walk off slowly to 228 00:11:49,759 --> 00:11:50,720 the by himself. 229 00:11:52,600 --> 00:11:55,240 Speaker 3: Sometimes thanks, thanks awful. 230 00:11:55,000 --> 00:11:59,960 Speaker 6: Lot, knowing that that little clown that never even struck me. 231 00:12:00,159 --> 00:12:01,480 Speaker 3: Like a man, like. 232 00:12:03,000 --> 00:12:03,879 Speaker 10: A love little boy. 233 00:12:10,600 --> 00:12:13,039 Speaker 7: It's almost eleven at night when you leave the packing 234 00:12:13,120 --> 00:12:14,360 clam you had. 235 00:12:14,200 --> 00:12:17,120 Speaker 3: Across the black and they spread at a cafe A 236 00:12:17,279 --> 00:12:21,799 love little boy. Little boy cried twice though. 237 00:12:21,720 --> 00:12:24,759 Speaker 7: Wherey you've heard that description and your mind is founding 238 00:12:24,840 --> 00:12:25,480 hard that the. 239 00:12:25,519 --> 00:12:26,960 Speaker 8: Meaning inscribed that description. 240 00:12:27,759 --> 00:12:29,840 Speaker 3: And at the moment that Joe left with that question, 241 00:12:30,840 --> 00:12:34,679 about twenty miles away, a mother and her son frond 242 00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:37,600 their way home from a church social O my. 243 00:12:37,679 --> 00:12:39,480 Speaker 10: Hand, Jaffer Roby crosses. 244 00:12:39,720 --> 00:13:04,360 Speaker 9: Yet This is Sar Harris returning it to your marriagor 245 00:13:04,840 --> 00:13:06,320 and the big story of T. R. 246 00:13:06,519 --> 00:13:12,279 Speaker 7: Johnson as he lived it and piled it. R. Johnson 247 00:13:12,360 --> 00:13:14,679 of the Star Lake City, could bill who they had 248 00:13:14,759 --> 00:13:18,039 to suddenly appeared in the personality of a lost little 249 00:13:18,120 --> 00:13:22,399 boy earlier tonight in the Mormon town of the Polpful. Yes, 250 00:13:22,519 --> 00:13:25,840 struck three times, he vanished in the greens the Dan. 251 00:13:26,759 --> 00:13:29,120 But you've heard the possable killer described as being like 252 00:13:29,240 --> 00:13:33,279 a little boy who is sometimes going to the cafe itself. 253 00:13:34,080 --> 00:13:37,679 Speaker 3: And now you're at the counter of that very can. 254 00:13:39,159 --> 00:13:43,360 Speaker 7: What a bp frothy gray Spratt. I've got a fleet 255 00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:46,440 roll to go with, no thanks, just coffee. Getting a 256 00:13:46,519 --> 00:13:50,000 story on the killing, right, if I can get enough 257 00:13:50,039 --> 00:13:52,759 to write about wrote with every pair of pants in 258 00:13:52,799 --> 00:13:54,039 the county, something around. 259 00:13:53,799 --> 00:13:54,200 Speaker 8: With a gun. 260 00:13:54,519 --> 00:13:56,320 Speaker 7: Seemed to me they kill a proper fellow by now 261 00:13:56,840 --> 00:13:59,320 that happens further heard and they packed out. Which a 262 00:13:59,360 --> 00:14:01,440 branch is is my ilas had himself a new dream to. 263 00:14:01,559 --> 00:14:03,759 Speaker 3: Dan, how about you? Me? 264 00:14:04,639 --> 00:14:05,200 Speaker 5: What about me? 265 00:14:06,039 --> 00:14:07,919 Speaker 7: Looking out of this to say window here you could 266 00:14:08,039 --> 00:14:10,159 just see any of Branch's boyfriends waiting at the gate 267 00:14:10,200 --> 00:14:10,639 for us. 268 00:14:11,519 --> 00:14:12,360 Speaker 3: And you don't have a dream. 269 00:14:12,440 --> 00:14:14,879 Speaker 5: To Dan, maybe you're right at that's here. 270 00:14:14,919 --> 00:14:18,559 Speaker 3: I don't recall one race. You remember A fat little 271 00:14:18,559 --> 00:14:20,399 fellow used to hang around pressing. 272 00:14:20,039 --> 00:14:21,799 Speaker 8: Blands for a day him. 273 00:14:22,720 --> 00:14:26,559 Speaker 3: Sure, boys, it true for a man that's side of 274 00:14:26,600 --> 00:14:27,360 wherever it is they. 275 00:14:27,360 --> 00:14:28,039 Speaker 5: Make you boys. 276 00:14:28,399 --> 00:14:30,879 Speaker 3: I used to come in here regularly, either before I 277 00:14:30,960 --> 00:14:33,320 after branch of brush hims, and he'd always ask. 278 00:14:33,240 --> 00:14:36,759 Speaker 5: The same thing. He got a son, that son? 279 00:14:37,039 --> 00:14:40,519 Speaker 3: Yeah, I say you sure any turn a serious as 280 00:14:40,519 --> 00:14:42,000 a preacher hadn't been paid any years. 281 00:14:42,279 --> 00:14:45,559 Speaker 5: Lecture me what on? Don't make your son sadness? 282 00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:48,200 Speaker 3: Freedom shouldn't change. 283 00:14:49,759 --> 00:14:51,759 Speaker 7: Funny thing about that fat little fellow. You must have 284 00:14:51,799 --> 00:14:53,480 had a poor memory. I els the subject was on. 285 00:14:53,559 --> 00:14:56,120 Speaker 6: His mind every time he'd come in, same question. 286 00:14:56,879 --> 00:14:59,240 Speaker 3: Yes, every little thing sounds cool to me. 287 00:15:00,080 --> 00:15:02,320 Speaker 7: I don't know such a good naked cloud. Please tell 288 00:15:02,360 --> 00:15:04,440 me did you ever get a good look at his car? 289 00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:08,200 Go on to uh, don't tell me suspect that little man. 290 00:15:08,360 --> 00:15:11,399 I was nothing but an overgratiflator thinks back, did you ever. 291 00:15:11,320 --> 00:15:11,879 Speaker 5: See his car? 292 00:15:13,159 --> 00:15:13,320 Speaker 8: Car? 293 00:15:14,000 --> 00:15:14,720 Speaker 3: Paw car? 294 00:15:14,759 --> 00:15:17,559 Speaker 7: I get me a lift one with a greencident M nice? 295 00:15:17,919 --> 00:15:18,159 Speaker 5: Thanks? 296 00:15:18,600 --> 00:15:21,039 Speaker 7: Yeah, wait, he couldn't have done it he was. 297 00:15:21,080 --> 00:15:21,519 Speaker 12: Like a kid. 298 00:15:29,320 --> 00:15:32,320 Speaker 3: You rush out of the cafe married for the midnight streets. 299 00:15:32,399 --> 00:15:35,039 The chief parros is offered to you at the moment. 300 00:15:35,399 --> 00:15:38,720 Speaker 7: The murderers now they object. The teeth chase one along 301 00:15:38,799 --> 00:15:42,480 the dark highway, my men with gun. The other is 302 00:15:42,559 --> 00:15:46,320 going on inside your own mind. Three times now you've 303 00:15:46,320 --> 00:15:50,320 heard him described as a little bore. Desperately you keep 304 00:15:50,360 --> 00:15:52,639 dropping for the conclusion. You know it's hidden somewhere in 305 00:15:52,720 --> 00:15:56,919 your own mind, like the murder himself. The complosion keeps 306 00:15:56,960 --> 00:16:02,159 slipping away, escaping. If you're not play of mind. That's 307 00:16:02,200 --> 00:16:03,440 just talking to the police chief. 308 00:16:03,519 --> 00:16:05,879 Speaker 8: Stop where it been. 309 00:16:06,679 --> 00:16:08,320 Speaker 7: It doesn't rolling up and down the road shooting in 310 00:16:08,360 --> 00:16:10,559 every woman. He's seen the dead, thy winded already on. 311 00:16:10,759 --> 00:16:13,559 Speaker 8: No, what's small? We've lost them. No, I could chill 312 00:16:13,639 --> 00:16:14,360 him with my own hand. 313 00:16:14,399 --> 00:16:16,279 Speaker 7: What do you say he's lost. He's still in the 314 00:16:16,320 --> 00:16:18,559 area somewhere. Can't you see he's just playing for nose 315 00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:20,879 in your face? I plains, that's not here on my desk. 316 00:16:22,080 --> 00:16:24,919 The Paul Free Sudents just play close to autumn, often 317 00:16:24,919 --> 00:16:27,200 to big city. If I were a letter, that's right 318 00:16:27,279 --> 00:16:27,879 hat to a big thing. 319 00:16:27,960 --> 00:16:28,600 Speaker 3: To lose myself. 320 00:16:29,039 --> 00:16:29,399 Speaker 8: That's way. 321 00:16:29,399 --> 00:16:31,360 Speaker 7: He must be right now heading in to Agen. That's 322 00:16:31,440 --> 00:16:36,639 not why not cheek. Look you got the new shootings 323 00:16:36,679 --> 00:16:40,919 marked one, two three the line. The line is from 324 00:16:41,000 --> 00:16:43,279 tak itself. I don't know what's drive in those three 325 00:16:43,320 --> 00:16:44,279 shootings from alive. 326 00:16:45,120 --> 00:16:47,799 Speaker 2: Yeah you see it now. The murderer isn't heading into Ogden. 327 00:16:47,840 --> 00:16:50,720 He's heading back this way, heading back this way. Why citties, 328 00:16:51,279 --> 00:16:52,639 that's what I've been trying to fit a bender in 329 00:16:52,679 --> 00:16:57,600 my mind. Shoo, listen to me. I'm not fantasy psychologist, 330 00:16:57,679 --> 00:17:00,840 but you don't you put up not seem to sit 331 00:17:00,919 --> 00:17:01,360 in his clothes. 332 00:17:01,399 --> 00:17:02,600 Speaker 3: I don't know what's that's talking about this. 333 00:17:02,720 --> 00:17:04,960 Speaker 2: Time to night I heard people describe the man, and 334 00:17:05,039 --> 00:17:06,920 every one of them was the same words, like a 335 00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:09,480 little boy. So yeah, that's mad man about shouting up 336 00:17:09,480 --> 00:17:10,000 the country guide. 337 00:17:10,000 --> 00:17:10,960 Speaker 5: I can't take hre out of it. 338 00:17:11,000 --> 00:17:12,440 Speaker 3: An every woman and that I'm not gonna talked to 339 00:17:12,519 --> 00:17:14,440 him said the same thing, like a little boy. 340 00:17:14,559 --> 00:17:17,559 Speaker 2: I love little boy. Oh it was maybe thirty Dan 341 00:17:17,640 --> 00:17:20,519 person was forty five. He wouldn't want to like them, mom. 342 00:17:21,200 --> 00:17:23,519 He wanted there like a tod wants his mother. All right, 343 00:17:23,519 --> 00:17:25,240 I've heard him. I know you have him I'm only 344 00:17:25,279 --> 00:17:27,279 telling you all this because I need your help. Great 345 00:17:27,319 --> 00:17:29,640 Julbert that very definitely identified to meet him furtherest. He 346 00:17:29,640 --> 00:17:31,920 said he dragged a great at all. He dragging to 347 00:17:31,960 --> 00:17:32,799 his face before I. 348 00:17:32,880 --> 00:17:33,400 Speaker 10: Got got here. 349 00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:37,680 Speaker 5: Don't you see? See he's like a chaw, a lunatic child. 350 00:17:38,319 --> 00:17:39,839 Speaker 3: Dance must have given him a boat and didn't got 351 00:17:39,839 --> 00:17:40,599 destructed with him. 352 00:17:40,920 --> 00:17:42,599 Speaker 5: So he had a temper like a kid. 353 00:17:43,119 --> 00:17:45,400 Speaker 2: I mean, he takes it was a murderous lunatic cancer 354 00:17:46,039 --> 00:17:49,319 and it's still going on, but it's wearing hawk. That's 355 00:17:49,319 --> 00:17:51,359 why he's had him bout to Swis, because that's what 356 00:17:51,440 --> 00:17:53,240 a kid does when a Campton wear a golf he 357 00:17:53,400 --> 00:17:55,359 comes back to see how much damage he's downed to 358 00:17:55,400 --> 00:18:02,119 get a punishment. Okay, I can't he I think you're right. 359 00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:15,559 That's where I watched for there in the Chief's office. 360 00:18:15,960 --> 00:18:18,960 We're absolutely sure of yourself. And now I'm sitting in 361 00:18:19,039 --> 00:18:22,240 the chief car. Most of you are nerves is gone. 362 00:18:23,240 --> 00:18:25,359 We've both decided if the best way to watch at 363 00:18:25,400 --> 00:18:28,160 the cafe. You can see the chief next to you 364 00:18:28,720 --> 00:18:32,680 doing the little patience After all. H. G. R. 365 00:18:32,839 --> 00:18:36,960 Speaker 7: Johnson A reported from Saltmake City there suddenly started figuring 366 00:18:37,039 --> 00:18:37,400 that the. 367 00:18:37,440 --> 00:18:39,720 Speaker 3: Involved mind of a lunatic. 368 00:18:44,880 --> 00:18:45,599 Speaker 8: There known. 369 00:18:47,119 --> 00:18:51,920 Speaker 3: For And I'm going back to the officer. Don't he 370 00:18:52,440 --> 00:18:54,559 all right? I'm standing watch out here, and the streaking 371 00:18:54,680 --> 00:18:57,640 right good good at the city. Think do you want 372 00:18:57,680 --> 00:18:57,960 to think? 373 00:18:58,000 --> 00:18:58,559 Speaker 11: That's all right? 374 00:19:00,200 --> 00:19:00,920 Speaker 8: Back to a later. 375 00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:09,720 Speaker 3: Now you're alone all along the waiting in the autumnce, 376 00:19:09,799 --> 00:19:12,720 show the president your reserve of confidence. 377 00:19:13,519 --> 00:19:18,359 Speaker 13: To begin the feelings of school, cold lonely school, we 378 00:19:18,559 --> 00:19:21,400 decide to warm up a bit by walking quickly. 379 00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:21,960 Speaker 5: Around the block. 380 00:19:22,559 --> 00:19:25,559 Speaker 3: Nothing to lose because the cards up in the stillness 381 00:19:25,599 --> 00:19:27,160 of the night had. 382 00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:27,759 Speaker 8: Here at a meaning. 383 00:19:29,039 --> 00:19:34,039 Speaker 3: We start walking, hoping, hoping that something will happen the 384 00:19:34,200 --> 00:19:35,000 food that you. 385 00:19:35,079 --> 00:19:35,960 Speaker 13: Are not a fool. 386 00:19:54,680 --> 00:19:56,279 Speaker 4: It should cold. 387 00:19:57,680 --> 00:19:59,240 Speaker 13: Yeah, yeah it is. 388 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:01,880 Speaker 3: I think that's getting a brook if they don't know. 389 00:20:02,759 --> 00:20:04,839 Speaker 5: Yeah, got out of hud. 390 00:20:08,759 --> 00:20:11,640 Speaker 3: A group of ship down. 391 00:20:12,920 --> 00:20:14,839 Speaker 5: How I come? 392 00:20:15,799 --> 00:20:15,920 Speaker 8: How? 393 00:20:16,920 --> 00:20:17,920 Speaker 3: I don't how you drive up? 394 00:20:18,519 --> 00:20:22,079 Speaker 13: I got a little old show myself called that so 395 00:20:23,799 --> 00:20:27,440 h my looking out the window. 396 00:20:28,599 --> 00:20:31,400 Speaker 5: Look, bay, I didn't realize. 397 00:20:32,160 --> 00:20:34,160 Speaker 3: Hello, what at your audience? 398 00:20:40,799 --> 00:20:48,960 Speaker 11: I add, I don't know. Okay, you're so good asome cock. 399 00:20:49,079 --> 00:20:52,599 I guess I was looking a long time, and then 400 00:20:54,039 --> 00:21:01,519 the older and you didn't much and we would you 401 00:21:01,680 --> 00:21:03,200 like any happy. 402 00:21:04,599 --> 00:21:06,079 Speaker 8: H thank you. 403 00:21:07,960 --> 00:21:13,200 Speaker 4: Being had a son? Yeah, I didn't. That's the sounds 404 00:21:13,319 --> 00:21:22,039 sad set him moves them things I do, I make 405 00:21:22,119 --> 00:21:32,640 you talking? I n proper grows, okay, I should I 406 00:21:32,759 --> 00:21:32,880 like to? 407 00:21:34,799 --> 00:21:35,000 Speaker 13: Yeah? 408 00:21:35,799 --> 00:21:40,880 Speaker 2: Should get me to beat up? Not a thing that 409 00:21:42,359 --> 00:21:45,759 rolls along proper grows now for the first time. Because 410 00:21:45,759 --> 00:21:53,200 he came to the packing the first thing then just 411 00:21:53,279 --> 00:21:54,000 put in her hand. 412 00:21:54,799 --> 00:21:55,000 Speaker 8: Fell. 413 00:21:55,119 --> 00:21:56,039 Speaker 3: We can just stop in front of. 414 00:21:56,039 --> 00:21:59,920 Speaker 8: A coupling fast to the blue. 415 00:22:01,839 --> 00:22:07,759 Speaker 2: Anything wrong goes and I'll go to cracking in a minute. 416 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:12,640 One off, I said that Monday handed and the boat 417 00:22:14,799 --> 00:22:20,480 the sun saying I'm not looking at the pop. 418 00:22:20,039 --> 00:22:22,519 Speaker 8: Icist fellow goes to fuss and see. 419 00:22:23,839 --> 00:22:34,680 Speaker 10: Don't get gas. I have a play before you. It's 420 00:22:34,720 --> 00:22:47,240 this concession all now, yeah, I've got your concession. Worn't nice? 421 00:22:47,920 --> 00:22:50,240 Speaker 1: So what is other? 422 00:22:50,359 --> 00:22:51,279 Speaker 10: Be nice to me? 423 00:22:53,200 --> 00:22:53,559 Speaker 8: It was. 424 00:22:55,119 --> 00:22:58,880 Speaker 5: Some little to get easy that. 425 00:23:13,599 --> 00:23:16,160 Speaker 3: I would us that telegram from pre armpon of a 426 00:23:16,279 --> 00:23:17,440 tall lead. 427 00:23:17,599 --> 00:23:20,599 Speaker 2: At style of matter Internet take story with ACTI editor 428 00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:25,319 in secting whether as the dating the sentence him for life. 429 00:23:25,160 --> 00:23:26,000 Speaker 8: To the sight of sidn. 430 00:23:26,680 --> 00:23:27,720 Speaker 3: He died two years later. 431 00:23:35,359 --> 00:23:35,839 Speaker 5: In order to. 432 00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:39,599 Speaker 13: Protest the names of people about above will not name 433 00:23:39,640 --> 00:23:41,359 it the ball park. If he's gone to take him 434 00:23:41,359 --> 00:23:43,519 the train could be attacting to the hoof paper reporter, 435 00:23:58,839 --> 00:23:59,799 good story, that's. 436 00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:14,400 Speaker 11: Education, welcome back. 437 00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:17,599 Speaker 1: Well, now let me go ahead and we'll get the 438 00:24:17,720 --> 00:24:21,720 rest of our cast information. Our hero, T R. Johnson 439 00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:26,279 was played by John Sylvester. Also in the cast were 440 00:24:26,839 --> 00:24:35,160 Gene Robin, Agnes Young, Amzi Strickland, Joan shay Owen, Jordan 441 00:24:35,799 --> 00:24:41,599 Merril Jones, and Les Damon. Now, our story tonight was 442 00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:47,799 about an obsessed and stunted local man who was generally 443 00:24:48,039 --> 00:24:53,079 marked as a loser and got a date with a 444 00:24:53,240 --> 00:24:57,079 local woman named Blanche and murdered her and then went 445 00:24:57,240 --> 00:25:01,599 on a big murder spree. And all of that is correct, 446 00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:05,279 except the man was not local, the woman didn't agree 447 00:25:05,319 --> 00:25:08,880 to a date with him, and he didn't have creepy 448 00:25:09,039 --> 00:25:13,400 mommy issues. But the woman's name was Blanche. I mean, 449 00:25:15,079 --> 00:25:18,759 if you're going to say we changed the names, why 450 00:25:18,839 --> 00:25:21,119 did you leave the name of the victim the same? 451 00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:26,400 But we do know the story upon which this was based, 452 00:25:26,519 --> 00:25:30,599 thanks once again to the ever vigilant doctor Joseph Webb 453 00:25:30,960 --> 00:25:36,799 writing on these stories behind the big story and the 454 00:25:37,079 --> 00:25:42,119 person who did this came to town using the name 455 00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:48,119 George Ruffledge. He was a San Diego butcher. His real 456 00:25:48,400 --> 00:25:53,279 name at birth was Pascal Boyer, and he grew up 457 00:25:53,599 --> 00:25:57,160 in Missouri and he lost his parents. His father died 458 00:25:57,200 --> 00:26:00,839 when he was four, and then his mother away when 459 00:26:00,880 --> 00:26:06,240 he was fifteen, and then he married. He ran a 460 00:26:06,319 --> 00:26:12,039 grocery young ran a grocery store and had marital problems, 461 00:26:12,079 --> 00:26:17,079 started drinking, tried to commit suicide, and then they moved 462 00:26:17,119 --> 00:26:21,480 to Colorado, changed their names, and then moved to California. 463 00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:25,000 And then he got a job in construction and some 464 00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:30,720 scaffolding fell on him. And after that point he had 465 00:26:31,440 --> 00:26:36,559 injuries that were or he had actions that we would 466 00:26:36,759 --> 00:26:43,559 now associate with some sort of traumatic brain injury web rights. 467 00:26:43,640 --> 00:26:46,799 There were a series of incidents, some innocent and some not, 468 00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:49,759 where he forgot significant things that he had done to others, 469 00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:52,759 one of which was beating his wife. Doctors told him 470 00:26:52,799 --> 00:26:54,759 he was doing too much and was burning the candle 471 00:26:54,839 --> 00:26:58,839 at both ends. The problem with forgetfulness of even the 472 00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:03,039 most recent personal and events persisted. In court testimony. His 473 00:27:03,160 --> 00:27:05,720 wife related that he would sometimes forget he was living 474 00:27:05,799 --> 00:27:09,319 her asking when she arrived in town. They moved from 475 00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:13,880 Colorado to Wyoming. He developed crime fits in addition to amnesia, 476 00:27:13,960 --> 00:27:21,359 and had persistent exhaustion. He also suffered from epileptic auto motonism, 477 00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:27,240 which are behaviors that occur during a seizure. Bab Right's 478 00:27:27,559 --> 00:27:30,680 little was known about brain injuries in the nineteen thirties. 479 00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:34,279 In today's imaging and other technologies may have diagnosed the 480 00:27:34,359 --> 00:27:37,319 extent and nature of its particular problems and led to 481 00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:41,039 management of his condition. So this may have been a 482 00:27:41,319 --> 00:27:45,000 case where these deaths were caused by the fact that 483 00:27:45,279 --> 00:27:49,640 this man had an injury that the medicine of his 484 00:27:49,839 --> 00:27:54,960 day just could not understand, and as a result, it 485 00:27:55,279 --> 00:28:00,799 ended in tragedy. Now, since it was unexplained, I said, yeah, 486 00:28:00,920 --> 00:28:04,839 let's just go ahead and make up this story about 487 00:28:04,960 --> 00:28:09,279 the whole mother's fixation. It'd be great for radio. Also 488 00:28:09,400 --> 00:28:12,960 had to chuckle a bit at the narration because the 489 00:28:13,079 --> 00:28:18,680 way that it stated is this reporter keeps thinking, well, 490 00:28:18,799 --> 00:28:23,160 we're I'm going to this Mormon town and the idea 491 00:28:23,400 --> 00:28:29,160 of Mormon country from the reporter's perspective. The thing is 492 00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:35,039 that from the perspective of a reporter in Utah in 493 00:28:35,839 --> 00:28:40,119 the nineteen thirties, Utah was about seventy percent Mormon, and 494 00:28:40,279 --> 00:28:45,799 the rural counties and small towns of Utah were more 495 00:28:48,079 --> 00:28:52,039 LDS than the rest of the state. And that's still 496 00:28:52,119 --> 00:28:55,960 the case. The rural counties in Utah have a much 497 00:28:56,119 --> 00:29:01,079 higher percentage of LDS adherents than the rest of the state. 498 00:29:01,359 --> 00:29:06,119 And the idea of driving through like every single town 499 00:29:06,240 --> 00:29:10,279 in Utah and there's a Mormon town in the nineteen thirties, 500 00:29:10,319 --> 00:29:16,359 it's just it reminds me of a cartoon where a 501 00:29:16,599 --> 00:29:21,680 very strange family played spot the car by not like 502 00:29:21,799 --> 00:29:24,920 spotting the red car the blue car, but spotting any car. 503 00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:29,039 So for audiences in Utah, this might have been some 504 00:29:29,359 --> 00:29:33,440 odd choice of language, though they were probably used to it, 505 00:29:34,079 --> 00:29:37,000 and I think it was meant to draw a dramatic 506 00:29:37,079 --> 00:29:43,640 image based on the idea that people had about Utah. 507 00:29:44,720 --> 00:29:50,759 This happened in a close knit community that's very wholesome, 508 00:29:50,759 --> 00:29:54,759 where everybody knows everybody else's name. That's the sort of 509 00:29:55,240 --> 00:29:58,440 image that Utah evoked at the time, and so that 510 00:29:58,759 --> 00:30:02,359 was the word picture being drawn for the rest of 511 00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:05,759 the country, even though it didn't make much sense the 512 00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:08,279 way that it was stated in the episode. Now we 513 00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:12,519 turn to listener comments and feedback, and we start with 514 00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:16,160 an email from Derek, who writes on the Latest Big Story. 515 00:30:16,200 --> 00:30:22,000 You mentioned programs based on real events, including The Big Story, 516 00:30:22,119 --> 00:30:25,319 Tales of the Texas Rangers, Dragon Nats, and also The 517 00:30:25,440 --> 00:30:28,839 Silent Men. First question, are there any others you can 518 00:30:28,920 --> 00:30:31,240 think of? And second question can you rank them in 519 00:30:31,319 --> 00:30:34,599 your opinion? Who gets it closest to the most accurate 520 00:30:36,319 --> 00:30:40,680 and to the least accurate? Well, I did find a list. 521 00:30:40,759 --> 00:30:44,160 There are some shows that are listed that I probably 522 00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:47,279 wouldn't include, but the ones I would include, I couldn't 523 00:30:47,319 --> 00:30:50,599 think of any that were not on this list. Calling 524 00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:54,599 All Cars, which was a program from the thirties that 525 00:30:54,839 --> 00:31:00,880 dramatized true police cases the FBI in p War and 526 00:31:01,079 --> 00:31:07,759 This Is Your FBI, both of which dramatized cases from 527 00:31:07,839 --> 00:31:16,079 the FBI. True Detective Mysteries which was based on stories 528 00:31:16,279 --> 00:31:22,720 from true crime magazines, and then there was Unsolved Mysteries, 529 00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:27,480 not to be confused with the later Robert Stack program. 530 00:31:27,599 --> 00:31:30,000 We've played a couple episodes on the old time radio 531 00:31:30,119 --> 00:31:35,640 snack Wagon, then Tales of the Texas Rangers, not watch 532 00:31:35,920 --> 00:31:40,799 twenty First Precinct, True Adventures of the Junior g Men, 533 00:31:41,559 --> 00:31:47,480 and I would also add Gangbosters and Unit ninety nine. Now, 534 00:31:47,480 --> 00:31:50,920 I think you kind of have to take Unit ninety 535 00:31:51,039 --> 00:31:55,359 nine and not Watch as being a very separate thing, 536 00:31:56,240 --> 00:32:03,200 because these were essentially a record boards of policemen actually 537 00:32:03,359 --> 00:32:07,839 out on calls. It was like Cops, but over radio 538 00:32:08,279 --> 00:32:11,799 or not scripted at all. I do feel I can't 539 00:32:12,519 --> 00:32:15,599 give you a full answer to the question, though, because 540 00:32:16,359 --> 00:32:20,599 most of these series I have encountered, but I think 541 00:32:20,759 --> 00:32:25,400 to list them all in order it would require having 542 00:32:25,759 --> 00:32:31,079 listened to them in enough depth that you could definitively 543 00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:37,240 and intellectually explain why you thought. If you did that, 544 00:32:37,880 --> 00:32:42,160 the FBI in Peace and War was a more realistic 545 00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:47,839 series than Calling All Cars. It's also hard to measure 546 00:32:48,079 --> 00:32:55,759 the accuracy of an entire series, particularly when a lot 547 00:32:55,839 --> 00:32:59,640 of it might be missing. Although I guess, in my opinion, 548 00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:05,119 there's one clear winner and leader in the category, and 549 00:33:05,240 --> 00:33:11,680 that's Dragnant. I think there are many ways that Dragnet wins, 550 00:33:12,039 --> 00:33:18,079 and that's not because they don't occasionally change facts to 551 00:33:18,519 --> 00:33:22,279 suit the needs to simplify the case to get it 552 00:33:22,400 --> 00:33:26,359 to air, or to ensure they don't lose their audience, 553 00:33:26,920 --> 00:33:32,920 or whatever other reason. Where I think Dragnet wins. If 554 00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:35,920 I were to put to the one central fact, it 555 00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:39,400 is what they say at the start of the episode, 556 00:33:39,880 --> 00:33:43,319 you will walk step by step on the side of 557 00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:47,759 the law to an actual case from police files, and 558 00:33:47,920 --> 00:33:52,880 that following this from the side of the law means 559 00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:58,359 approaching the case differently. A lot of these true time programs, 560 00:33:58,519 --> 00:34:03,440 particularly in the pre Dragnet era, would spend a lot 561 00:34:03,519 --> 00:34:07,720 of time with the criminals and focusing on their side 562 00:34:07,759 --> 00:34:13,280 of the operation rather than looking at how police or 563 00:34:13,400 --> 00:34:16,840 the FBI were able to track them down. You see 564 00:34:16,960 --> 00:34:21,239 the problem with this when you reach an episode where 565 00:34:21,639 --> 00:34:26,760 all the criminals involved in all potential weaknesses ended up dying. 566 00:34:27,679 --> 00:34:32,440 It just becomes readily apparent those scenes are based on 567 00:34:32,639 --> 00:34:37,199 dramatic imagination, and really in most episodes that would be 568 00:34:37,320 --> 00:34:43,559 the case, with writers imagining what the criminals would or 569 00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:48,760 did say based on at best educated guesses. Because I 570 00:34:48,880 --> 00:34:52,800 think most of these programs focused on the idea that 571 00:34:53,079 --> 00:34:58,519 crimes were interesting, that true crimes, things that actually happened, 572 00:34:58,599 --> 00:35:03,519 and crimes that were committed that shock people. That's interesting, 573 00:35:04,280 --> 00:35:08,840 and I think that by and large there's a sort 574 00:35:08,920 --> 00:35:14,239 of hotened level to the performances and the writing to 575 00:35:14,440 --> 00:35:18,679 make it dramatic. It's not always bad, but because so 576 00:35:18,920 --> 00:35:23,119 much of it is dedicated to making up or imagining 577 00:35:23,199 --> 00:35:26,719 what the criminals might or could have said, it's hard 578 00:35:26,800 --> 00:35:32,159 to say that it resembles reality much, particularly in episodes 579 00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:36,639 where that takes up, you know, more than half the 580 00:35:37,559 --> 00:35:44,559 running time. What Dragnett decided was that the investigation itself 581 00:35:45,360 --> 00:35:51,920 was interesting. The process by which police catch criminals is interesting, 582 00:35:52,199 --> 00:35:56,159 and there is drama in that and around that, and 583 00:35:56,280 --> 00:36:00,000 the great advantage of telling the story of the investigation 584 00:36:00,480 --> 00:36:04,360 and that being the core, is that we do have 585 00:36:04,840 --> 00:36:08,320 from the police files they use to write the cases, 586 00:36:09,559 --> 00:36:13,719 the actual story and evidence. Now, of course there are 587 00:36:13,920 --> 00:36:18,159 changes made to that for radio, and some of it is, 588 00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:22,199 as the opening said, to protect the innocent, some is 589 00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:27,400 to protect the production team from lawsuits, and some is 590 00:36:27,679 --> 00:36:33,320 to make the story work within the frame of a 591 00:36:33,519 --> 00:36:39,159 half hour radio program that's about to Los Angeles Detectives. 592 00:36:39,400 --> 00:36:44,079 So there are all sorts of changes that can be necessary, 593 00:36:44,440 --> 00:36:48,760 but these tend to be on a different level than 594 00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:51,920 the big story or others which go for these sort 595 00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:59,800 of big sensationalist sort of inventions like he killed because 596 00:37:00,519 --> 00:37:04,280 he had an unexplained mother fixation, and while I think 597 00:37:04,599 --> 00:37:09,119 once the show gets going, tells The Texas Rangers tends 598 00:37:09,199 --> 00:37:12,039 to be really good, and it is, let's be clear, 599 00:37:12,199 --> 00:37:17,599 still a great program in terms of realism. We begin 600 00:37:18,320 --> 00:37:26,599 most episodes with the crime occurring, oftentimes with dialogue. They 601 00:37:26,639 --> 00:37:31,280 would have no way of knowing that this was what 602 00:37:31,599 --> 00:37:34,840 was said, and I think the purpose of those sort 603 00:37:34,880 --> 00:37:38,400 of scenes is to be this sort of big, melodramatic 604 00:37:38,519 --> 00:37:43,760 attention grammar, but it's not often to the benefit of accuracy. 605 00:37:44,039 --> 00:37:48,519 Now shows I think can be a bit inaccurate and 606 00:37:48,719 --> 00:37:52,800 still reflects some of the truth of what happened, or 607 00:37:53,079 --> 00:37:56,840 quite a bit. But I would tend to give Dragnet 608 00:37:56,920 --> 00:38:00,719 the Knowed and the Silent Men I will I don't 609 00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:05,719 think there's enough episodes for us to really evaluate that 610 00:38:06,360 --> 00:38:10,280 at scale. It would be fascinating to hear if there 611 00:38:10,360 --> 00:38:13,599 have been more episodes made in this series, because when 612 00:38:13,639 --> 00:38:18,599 we were comparing The Silent Men to The Big Story 613 00:38:18,679 --> 00:38:23,880 and Tales of the Texas Rangers, it's not a fair comparison. 614 00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:27,280 With the case of the Big Story, you're dealing with 615 00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:34,039 a series that ran on radio for more than seven years. 616 00:38:34,800 --> 00:38:37,800 Dragon at more than six years, Texas Tales of the 617 00:38:37,880 --> 00:38:43,280 Texas Rangers two years more than ninety episodes, and then 618 00:38:43,559 --> 00:38:49,079 you've got The Silent Men, which just has around twenty 619 00:38:49,199 --> 00:38:53,960 episodes in circulation and so didn't really have a chance 620 00:38:54,079 --> 00:38:58,199 to build up. I do enjoy The Silent Men for 621 00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:04,199 its dedication to the more obscure branches of government. Of course, 622 00:39:04,280 --> 00:39:07,800 one disadvantage of the obscurity. It's hard to say how 623 00:39:07,920 --> 00:39:12,920 one hundred percent realistic is this. I think it definitely 624 00:39:13,079 --> 00:39:16,679 has a realistic feel to it, and for the very 625 00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:20,480 short series it is, it's well worth a listen, and 626 00:39:20,880 --> 00:39:23,440 I would encourage listeners who didn't catch it the first 627 00:39:23,559 --> 00:39:26,760 time to go check it out. Now it's time to 628 00:39:26,880 --> 00:39:30,960 thank our Patreon supporter of the day, and I want 629 00:39:31,000 --> 00:39:35,239 to go ahead and think thank you to Calleen, Patreon 630 00:39:35,519 --> 00:39:40,199 supporter since March of twenty twenty one, currently supporting the 631 00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:44,280 podcast at the Detective Sergeant level of seven dollars and 632 00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:47,320 fourteen cents or more per month. Thanks so much for 633 00:39:47,440 --> 00:39:50,079 your support, Calleen, and that will do it for today. 634 00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:54,519 If you're enjoying the podcast, please follow us using your 635 00:39:54,719 --> 00:39:58,320 favorite podcast software and be sure to rate and review 636 00:39:58,400 --> 00:40:02,280 the podcast wherever you download from We will be back 637 00:40:02,840 --> 00:40:06,480 next Tuesday with another episode of the Big Story. But 638 00:40:06,679 --> 00:40:09,880 join us back here tomorrow for Broadways. My bait where. 639 00:40:10,800 --> 00:40:12,840 Speaker 12: Trying to find out for me, as Dailius, whether you 640 00:40:12,920 --> 00:40:16,280 knew this man, whether you've ever talked to him, whether. 641 00:40:16,639 --> 00:40:18,679 Speaker 3: There's a reason why he should be dead in front 642 00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:19,119 of my door. 643 00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:19,639 Speaker 8: That's right. 644 00:40:19,760 --> 00:40:21,599 Speaker 12: From what I can tell, this man was beaten to death. 645 00:40:21,679 --> 00:40:23,880 In the way he's lying, he probably struck his head 646 00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:25,519 against this wall here where there's blood. 647 00:40:25,679 --> 00:40:28,440 Speaker 6: Well, I told you, I told you all I know 648 00:40:28,519 --> 00:40:28,880 about it. 649 00:40:29,039 --> 00:40:34,199 Speaker 8: Tell me again. Like I was on the town, nightclubs, parties, 650 00:40:34,320 --> 00:40:38,480 you know, go on life. I came home. I saw 651 00:40:38,559 --> 00:40:42,519 this man, this man who's delivers milk. His identification says 652 00:40:42,519 --> 00:40:45,000 his name is Raymond Grant. Do you know I'm just 653 00:40:45,199 --> 00:40:48,400 talked to him. You keep asking me that I told 654 00:40:48,440 --> 00:40:52,960 you that I came home and I came home alone. Yes, 655 00:40:54,239 --> 00:40:58,079 I always come home alone, mister Kober's It's a good deed. 656 00:40:58,159 --> 00:40:59,559 Speaker 3: I do myself whenever I go out. 657 00:41:00,880 --> 00:41:02,760 Speaker 7: I came home alone and I found this man. 658 00:41:03,639 --> 00:41:05,480 Speaker 8: He was dying Jesse as he is now. He went 659 00:41:05,559 --> 00:41:08,159 into an apartment, called the police. Yeah, what do you do, 660 00:41:08,320 --> 00:41:11,960 miss Daily? I study his tea. 661 00:41:12,039 --> 00:41:15,000 Speaker 6: Mister Klover, I'm a graduate student university. 662 00:41:16,119 --> 00:41:18,639 Speaker 8: How long ago did you come home, Miss Daily, I. 663 00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:22,760 Speaker 7: Don't know, half hours and twenty minutes or more. 664 00:41:23,480 --> 00:41:26,159 Speaker 8: I don't know about Papa. I'd say this man is 665 00:41:26,239 --> 00:41:28,519 killed just a little while before you got here. Say that. 666 00:41:31,039 --> 00:41:33,159 Speaker 1: I hope you'll be with us then in the meantime. 667 00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:37,639 Send your comments to Box thirteen at Greatdetectives dot net, 668 00:41:38,239 --> 00:41:40,880 follow us on Twitter at Radio Detectives, and check us 669 00:41:40,920 --> 00:41:47,239 out on Instagram, Instagram, dot com, slash Great Detectives from BOISEATAH. 670 00:41:48,119 --> 00:41:50,960 This is your host, Adam Graham's signing off.