WEBVTT 1 00:00:05.280 --> 00:00:09.240 Hey, welcome back to another episode of the JavaScript Jabber podcast. 2 00:00:09.599 --> 00:00:12.960 This week on our panel, we have a j O'Neill yoh. 3 00:00:12.919 --> 00:00:15.279 Yeah yo, coming at you live from Stromboli. 4 00:00:16.839 --> 00:00:17.000 Yeah. 5 00:00:17.039 --> 00:00:19.120 I timed that well. I saw you were chewing food. 6 00:00:19.160 --> 00:00:22.280 But anyway, I'm Charles Maxwood from Top End Devs and 7 00:00:22.320 --> 00:00:25.760 this week we have two special guests. We have is 8 00:00:25.800 --> 00:00:27.480 it how do you say? Ju? 9 00:00:28.320 --> 00:00:28.559 Yeah? 10 00:00:29.000 --> 00:00:29.320 Joel? 11 00:00:29.760 --> 00:00:32.039 Anywhere close you. 12 00:00:31.960 --> 00:00:33.840 Can call me Vita. It's easier, I think. 13 00:00:34.479 --> 00:00:37.200 Okay, do you want to just do a quick introduction 14 00:00:37.240 --> 00:00:38.200 who you are what you do? 15 00:00:39.600 --> 00:00:39.880 Sure? 16 00:00:40.479 --> 00:00:45.359 I work full time as a AI engineer in brazilon 17 00:00:45.640 --> 00:00:49.520 in a innovation lab here, and I also do free 18 00:00:49.560 --> 00:00:53.679 lancing at Coke Maintur and. 19 00:00:53.719 --> 00:00:56.759 I helped, I have helped the people from all the world, 20 00:00:56.880 --> 00:01:01.759 you know, from Cohuxton to Canada. You ask your and 21 00:01:02.399 --> 00:01:07.640 there I met Manny and the Stephan partnership there. 22 00:01:08.920 --> 00:01:13.159 Awesome. Yeah, so you mentioned Manny. Manny is our other guest. Manny, 23 00:01:13.200 --> 00:01:14.599 do you want to introduce yourself real quick? 24 00:01:15.079 --> 00:01:18.400 Yeah? My name is Manny live in Dallas, Texas. 25 00:01:18.519 --> 00:01:23.120 I'm a postact Jabascript developer working with React on an 26 00:01:23.359 --> 00:01:26.959 internal cloud platform for a bank. I been there about 27 00:01:27.000 --> 00:01:30.680 five years now gets sort of like mid year, mid 28 00:01:31.120 --> 00:01:33.840 mid level. I think that's what while was describe me as. 29 00:01:35.239 --> 00:01:38.439 And I actively been seeking mentorship for a while. I 30 00:01:38.480 --> 00:01:41.640 had a very difficult time finding it until I actually 31 00:01:41.640 --> 00:01:44.079 got on code Mentor in in Talms as well. 32 00:01:44.680 --> 00:01:48.879 Okay, so yeah, we're we're talking about I should set 33 00:01:48.920 --> 00:01:49.280 the stage. 34 00:01:49.319 --> 00:01:49.959 I guess. 35 00:01:51.319 --> 00:01:55.000 We're talking about mentorship and friendship and you know how 36 00:01:55.040 --> 00:01:57.200 that helps personal growth and things like that is kind 37 00:01:57.239 --> 00:02:01.359 of the the overall idea that at least was put 38 00:02:01.599 --> 00:02:05.079 put forward, you know when when Manny and Juau or 39 00:02:05.200 --> 00:02:09.199 Victor Detour. Sorry, I'm gonna mess that up the whole 40 00:02:09.280 --> 00:02:14.560 time anyway, So uh, you know that that was the 41 00:02:14.560 --> 00:02:18.000 idea that we got to while, you know, and why 42 00:02:18.039 --> 00:02:20.120 we set up this episode is because this is an 43 00:02:20.159 --> 00:02:23.879 area that I guess we focused a lot on the technology, 44 00:02:24.400 --> 00:02:28.319 and I think this is an important area. So yeah, 45 00:02:28.360 --> 00:02:30.919 I'd love to just kind of get the story. I 46 00:02:30.960 --> 00:02:35.400 love I love hearing stories. So Manny, maybe you should 47 00:02:35.439 --> 00:02:37.599 start out and just kind of tell us, Okay, this 48 00:02:37.680 --> 00:02:40.520 is where I was at, this is this is what 49 00:02:40.560 --> 00:02:43.919 I was looking for, This is how I found code Mentor, 50 00:02:44.039 --> 00:02:46.759 And then you know how you kind of moved into 51 00:02:46.800 --> 00:02:48.639 this you know, mentorship relationship. 52 00:02:49.080 --> 00:02:54.080 Sure, yeah, so I at thirty five, I you know, 53 00:02:54.199 --> 00:02:56.919 which is back like in twenty fifteen to give away 54 00:02:56.919 --> 00:03:00.800 my age, I decided I was going to change my career. 55 00:03:01.159 --> 00:03:04.280 I know I was going to decided I would change 56 00:03:04.319 --> 00:03:08.960 my career. I know it's all here, but so I 57 00:03:09.000 --> 00:03:10.520 decided I was going to change my career, which at 58 00:03:10.599 --> 00:03:13.479 that stage, like I had like no background in programming 59 00:03:13.560 --> 00:03:16.319 other than some like HTML stuff I had learned while 60 00:03:16.319 --> 00:03:17.080 I was a copywriter. 61 00:03:17.400 --> 00:03:19.400 But I had an interest in all the things that. 62 00:03:19.360 --> 00:03:22.080 I was told not to touch, like CSS and JavaScript, 63 00:03:22.520 --> 00:03:25.960 and I just I wanted a better job with you know, 64 00:03:26.400 --> 00:03:29.479 more fulfilling and you know that way they challenge me 65 00:03:29.479 --> 00:03:32.599 a little bit more intellectually. So I went to like 66 00:03:32.680 --> 00:03:34.280 a I don't know if you'd call it a boot camp. 67 00:03:34.319 --> 00:03:36.159 It is like a nine month kind of like introduction 68 00:03:36.280 --> 00:03:39.159 to JavaScript. And I learned probably like ten percent of 69 00:03:39.199 --> 00:03:41.560 what I needed to know there to be successful. So 70 00:03:42.120 --> 00:03:45.159 I get out of there, I don't know hardly anything, 71 00:03:45.680 --> 00:03:48.280 and I have to from that point actually start making 72 00:03:48.360 --> 00:03:49.520 up all the things I need to know to be 73 00:03:49.560 --> 00:03:51.039 able to get myself into a job. 74 00:03:51.360 --> 00:03:53.879 After thirty five. So I did a lot. 75 00:03:53.759 --> 00:03:55.719 Of self study, put myself through like a lot of 76 00:03:57.080 --> 00:04:00.439 just sort of like rigorous hard lessons of like working 77 00:04:00.479 --> 00:04:03.400 for free, although I don't recommend that doing internships to 78 00:04:03.400 --> 00:04:05.280 be able to get the experience that I needed in 79 00:04:05.360 --> 00:04:08.639 order to be able to build things. So in doing that, 80 00:04:08.719 --> 00:04:10.840 I learned a lot about how to manipulate data, how 81 00:04:10.840 --> 00:04:13.879 to think about state on the front end mobile applications. 82 00:04:13.919 --> 00:04:16.759 I learned a lot from work in solving business problems 83 00:04:16.800 --> 00:04:20.079 and like critical situations where I had like intense pressure 84 00:04:20.120 --> 00:04:22.920 on me to do so, which was good. But during 85 00:04:23.000 --> 00:04:26.879 that process I really like neglected like learning like computer 86 00:04:26.920 --> 00:04:30.439 science stuff. One probably because I was intimidated by it, 87 00:04:30.720 --> 00:04:33.879 in two I didn't necessarily need it to get a job. 88 00:04:35.079 --> 00:04:37.879 And three just like the time allotment that I had, 89 00:04:38.160 --> 00:04:40.240 you know, versus what I could learn versus what I 90 00:04:40.279 --> 00:04:43.240 had time to do. So fast forward in my current 91 00:04:43.279 --> 00:04:45.600 role now for five years, I really liked my job, 92 00:04:45.720 --> 00:04:49.800 like the people I work with. I'm well respected, you know, 93 00:04:50.079 --> 00:04:52.319 I have good time off, like I'm off today for 94 00:04:52.360 --> 00:04:52.920 Labor Day. 95 00:04:53.639 --> 00:04:54.800 So I really like where I'm at. 96 00:04:54.800 --> 00:04:57.720 But I've started feeling like I've been getting too comfortable 97 00:04:58.160 --> 00:05:01.160 and with a lot of the t from the economy. I'm like, okay, 98 00:05:01.160 --> 00:05:02.680 well what would happen if I had to go back 99 00:05:02.720 --> 00:05:05.160 out there and interview again? Like where am I at? Like? 100 00:05:05.639 --> 00:05:07.920 Is the experience that I have building things good enough? 101 00:05:08.000 --> 00:05:11.240 So I was like, I want to learn this stuff. 102 00:05:11.240 --> 00:05:13.279 I don't want to do it alone because I need 103 00:05:13.319 --> 00:05:15.319 some motivation and I know that if I just start 104 00:05:15.360 --> 00:05:17.360 by myself, like it'll like I'll. 105 00:05:17.240 --> 00:05:19.879 Get sidetracked by things. So I went on code Mentor 106 00:05:20.040 --> 00:05:22.240 and look for a mentor and phone as well. 107 00:05:23.120 --> 00:05:25.639 Cool, So what I mean, what's the process you get 108 00:05:25.639 --> 00:05:29.360 into code Mentor? Yeah? I mean did you do they 109 00:05:29.399 --> 00:05:32.199 just match you up based on skills or no? Trying 110 00:05:32.240 --> 00:05:34.399 to get in and say hey this is what I want? 111 00:05:34.560 --> 00:05:37.600 Or yeah kind of like I mean you put all right? 112 00:05:37.639 --> 00:05:39.360 So I think if I remember, you just put like 113 00:05:39.399 --> 00:05:41.839 a basic fielder out there like with a message like hey, 114 00:05:42.240 --> 00:05:43.839 this is where I'm at in my career, this is 115 00:05:43.839 --> 00:05:46.759 what I'm looking for, you know, this is my time zone, 116 00:05:46.959 --> 00:05:49.519 and then within like five minutes you get inundated with 117 00:05:49.639 --> 00:05:53.759 like five thousand people like trying to get you to 118 00:05:53.800 --> 00:05:55.920 sign up with them, and obviously you know they're looking 119 00:05:55.920 --> 00:05:58.560 for business, they're looking to mentors, so you have a 120 00:05:58.560 --> 00:06:01.560 lot of stuff to filter through. So I actually found 121 00:06:01.560 --> 00:06:04.600 someone before juell Or around the same time, and I 122 00:06:04.639 --> 00:06:08.639 met with him and like he the first thing he 123 00:06:08.680 --> 00:06:11.279 did was like started taking me through like merch sword. 124 00:06:11.360 --> 00:06:13.240 I was like, whoa back out, dude, I'm looking for 125 00:06:13.319 --> 00:06:16.279 like long term mentorship here. We haven't been started talking 126 00:06:16.319 --> 00:06:18.240 about a raised yet, why are we getting in? Like 127 00:06:18.879 --> 00:06:21.959 it just felt like he wasn't like targeted towards me. Now, 128 00:06:22.000 --> 00:06:24.800 I had a message from Jewell that said, hey, let's meet. 129 00:06:24.839 --> 00:06:26.720 I want to find out if we can work together, 130 00:06:27.160 --> 00:06:29.680 and that kind of stoock out stood out to me. 131 00:06:29.839 --> 00:06:31.879 And plus he was Brazilian and you know, my dad 132 00:06:31.920 --> 00:06:35.240 had lived down there, and we just made the connection. 133 00:06:35.360 --> 00:06:38.360 We had like an initial meeting and from there, I 134 00:06:38.399 --> 00:06:39.160 think he took some. 135 00:06:39.120 --> 00:06:41.040 Time to figure out if we were going to work together, 136 00:06:41.120 --> 00:06:43.199 and then we decided to and we've been going at 137 00:06:43.199 --> 00:06:44.399 it since the beginning of April. 138 00:06:45.240 --> 00:06:45.560 Cool. 139 00:06:46.879 --> 00:06:50.120 So I'm lucky. I got really lucky. 140 00:06:50.560 --> 00:06:55.399 Right, So, Johile, when you're looking at people that you 141 00:06:55.399 --> 00:06:58.519 can help, right because because it's a two way street, right, 142 00:06:58.560 --> 00:07:00.160 So if you're looking at people you can help up, 143 00:07:01.519 --> 00:07:04.600 how do you decide? Okay, you know, many looks like 144 00:07:04.639 --> 00:07:07.399 somebody I can help versus maybe you know, I'm not 145 00:07:07.399 --> 00:07:08.920 going to pitch this person because I don't know if 146 00:07:08.959 --> 00:07:10.439 I've got what they need. 147 00:07:11.319 --> 00:07:11.839 Mm hmmm. 148 00:07:12.120 --> 00:07:16.279 Yeah, sure, That's why I said to him too, that 149 00:07:16.439 --> 00:07:21.720 we should first meet and talk about his goals, his 150 00:07:21.759 --> 00:07:30.519 struggles and understand him, you know, listing activity and see 151 00:07:30.519 --> 00:07:32.319 if my exkulls. 152 00:07:31.879 --> 00:07:36.560 And uh, the way that I teach would. 153 00:07:36.360 --> 00:07:44.079 Help him, because I believe that from the standpoint from 154 00:07:44.079 --> 00:07:47.279 the meet and also from the mentor, we have to 155 00:07:47.279 --> 00:07:55.639 deliver an excellent service, right, And yeah, so I also 156 00:07:55.800 --> 00:07:58.240 interview him as a mentor. 157 00:08:01.360 --> 00:08:04.480 So let me back up for a minute, because you know, 158 00:08:04.480 --> 00:08:06.279 I'm looking at this and looking at kind of the 159 00:08:06.319 --> 00:08:08.839 relationship and the process and a j feel free to 160 00:08:08.879 --> 00:08:12.839 jump in anytime you want. But what made you decide 161 00:08:12.839 --> 00:08:15.279 that you wanted to do this kind of mentorship? Right? 162 00:08:16.800 --> 00:08:22.199 How did you get into the code mentor arena? 163 00:08:22.079 --> 00:08:22.120 You? 164 00:08:22.480 --> 00:08:23.720 Me and me are many? 165 00:08:23.800 --> 00:08:24.199 Yeah? You? 166 00:08:26.959 --> 00:08:32.399 I actually I freelanced it for some ad tech startups 167 00:08:32.440 --> 00:08:35.440 and I always love it to help. 168 00:08:35.279 --> 00:08:40.960 People from you know, like from as early as I remember, 169 00:08:41.960 --> 00:08:44.759 I love it to help colleagues. 170 00:08:44.200 --> 00:08:50.120 In class and school, and it's just a personal traits. 171 00:08:50.399 --> 00:08:55.120 It's something that I have passion about and I enjoy 172 00:08:55.559 --> 00:09:01.360 doing this, so it's aligned with my values my beliefs. 173 00:09:02.080 --> 00:09:05.559 So when I do this, I'm happy when I'm helping someone, 174 00:09:05.679 --> 00:09:13.120 teaching someone and making someone progress and accomplished goals. I 175 00:09:13.159 --> 00:09:16.919 feel that when many accomplished goes, it's like I am 176 00:09:17.000 --> 00:09:21.320 also accomplished accomplishing the goals, you know, Like I celebrate 177 00:09:21.360 --> 00:09:26.360 with him, you know when he like his trying to 178 00:09:26.759 --> 00:09:32.080 learn a new pattern encoding, and I give him like 179 00:09:32.159 --> 00:09:38.960 an exercise, some challenge, and I see that he uh 180 00:09:39.440 --> 00:09:43.039 understood and started to generalize two new problems. 181 00:09:43.159 --> 00:09:49.120 That's an important component variable to assess learning. 182 00:09:49.840 --> 00:09:53.120 If you can generalize to new problems, it's not that 183 00:09:53.240 --> 00:09:54.559 you memorize it. 184 00:09:54.559 --> 00:09:56.960 It's like in AI, you know. 185 00:09:57.000 --> 00:10:01.320 Like I like to do this intersection when I'm explaining 186 00:10:01.360 --> 00:10:06.399 things because of my background and AI. You over if 187 00:10:06.399 --> 00:10:11.639 you are model over feet, you know, like the data 188 00:10:12.360 --> 00:10:15.519 he is not. He can't generalize. He can't he didn't learn, 189 00:10:16.039 --> 00:10:17.320 he didn't learn, And the. 190 00:10:17.320 --> 00:10:19.919 Same is for us. You know, if we can generalize 191 00:10:20.200 --> 00:10:21.559 two new problems. 192 00:10:21.679 --> 00:10:28.399 Then you can feel more confident that learning happened. And 193 00:10:29.120 --> 00:10:34.759 many we monitor. So, as we were talking before, some 194 00:10:34.840 --> 00:10:38.519 of the components of great mentorship, one of them is 195 00:10:38.559 --> 00:10:41.600 to monitor progress. So you have to have some kind 196 00:10:41.639 --> 00:10:45.039 of system to monitor progress. So we have a system, 197 00:10:45.360 --> 00:10:50.559 uh that many we and we have we require the data, 198 00:10:50.720 --> 00:10:56.279 so I know which exercise he found hard, easy, medium, hard, 199 00:10:56.440 --> 00:11:00.159 you know, and I can this way, uh set. 200 00:11:01.480 --> 00:11:03.320 A personalized lessons for. 201 00:11:03.399 --> 00:11:11.320 Him and exercise and these way he can progress in 202 00:11:11.320 --> 00:11:12.679 a more accelerated pace. 203 00:11:16.799 --> 00:11:19.519 Gotcha. And just just to give people a little bit, 204 00:11:19.919 --> 00:11:25.879 you mentioned like an AI overfitting data. Effectively, the idea 205 00:11:25.960 --> 00:11:29.159 behind overfitting, if you're not familiar with the term, is 206 00:11:29.200 --> 00:11:35.200 that your results too closely matched your training set to 207 00:11:35.240 --> 00:11:39.240 the point where if you try and run other things 208 00:11:39.279 --> 00:11:42.080 through it right, because you train it so that you 209 00:11:42.120 --> 00:11:44.080 can give stuff that it hasn't seen before and it 210 00:11:44.120 --> 00:11:46.559 does the right thing. If it overfits, it means it 211 00:11:46.559 --> 00:11:49.120 fits the training data when you look at the results 212 00:11:49.120 --> 00:11:52.919 on the training data, but it doesn't work well with 213 00:11:53.000 --> 00:11:56.519 things outside the training set. And so exactly, you know, 214 00:11:57.039 --> 00:12:00.600 so what what yeah, what Vitor sat talking about as 215 00:12:00.600 --> 00:12:04.000 he's saying, you know, we want to teach people like 216 00:12:04.080 --> 00:12:08.360 Manning or other people that he's mentoring concepts that they 217 00:12:08.399 --> 00:12:12.039 can use outside of the couple of examples or exercises 218 00:12:12.080 --> 00:12:15.720 that he's giving him. Yes, I state that properly. 219 00:12:16.639 --> 00:12:22.000 Yes, yes, very well. Uh and uh. One of the 220 00:12:22.039 --> 00:12:23.759 great things also. 221 00:12:23.440 --> 00:12:29.360 That I think helps in learning for us humans is, uh, 222 00:12:29.840 --> 00:12:32.879 there is this word that's meta cognition. And I try 223 00:12:32.960 --> 00:12:39.240 to to make although uh many maybe he doesn't know 224 00:12:39.960 --> 00:12:43.840 uh that he's doing meta cognition, but he's doing because 225 00:12:44.360 --> 00:12:48.639 cognition is thinking about your own talk process. So this 226 00:12:48.639 --> 00:12:52.399 this also helps you get better at coing. So how 227 00:12:52.519 --> 00:12:55.480 how do you think? You know, reflect on how you think, 228 00:12:56.080 --> 00:12:59.960 how you sow thinks? What's your talk process to solve problem? 229 00:13:00.279 --> 00:13:00.480 You know? 230 00:13:01.120 --> 00:13:06.159 Did you did you say meditation, the medic cognition? 231 00:13:07.080 --> 00:13:11.840 Yes, megnition, thinking about how you think exactly? 232 00:13:11.919 --> 00:13:19.720 Meta is uh thinking about you won't thinking exactly max yeh. 233 00:13:19.799 --> 00:13:21.879 Yeah, It's it's interesting that you bring that up to 234 00:13:21.960 --> 00:13:24.639 And then I'm going to ask Manny a question because 235 00:13:24.679 --> 00:13:28.080 I've been reading. Uh. So I I've been doing this 236 00:13:28.399 --> 00:13:31.279 uh mental toughness program called seventy five Hard And one 237 00:13:31.320 --> 00:13:32.440 of the things you have to do is read ten 238 00:13:32.480 --> 00:13:34.440 pages out of a book every day, and the book 239 00:13:34.480 --> 00:13:36.720 I've been reading is Awaken the Giant Within, And it's 240 00:13:36.799 --> 00:13:41.120 kind of the same idea where you he talks a 241 00:13:41.159 --> 00:13:44.559 lot more about like changing your state, but you do 242 00:13:44.639 --> 00:13:48.879 a lot of the magnet meg metacognition type things where 243 00:13:48.919 --> 00:13:52.320 you're saying, I'm thinking this and they need to change 244 00:13:52.320 --> 00:13:55.879 it to that, right, And so you're paying attention to 245 00:13:55.919 --> 00:13:59.759 what makes you do what you do? Manny, I'm I'm 246 00:13:59.840 --> 00:14:04.039 kind of curious. U. Vtors talked about a bunch of 247 00:14:04.039 --> 00:14:07.200 different things, like what you want to accomplish, and you know, 248 00:14:07.320 --> 00:14:10.200 kind of setting goals and keeping track of your progress 249 00:14:10.279 --> 00:14:14.080 and then kind of this metacognition. How have these things 250 00:14:14.080 --> 00:14:18.159 worked for you? Like which parts really stand out? 251 00:14:18.720 --> 00:14:22.960 So I would say that, like, the first thing that 252 00:14:23.000 --> 00:14:25.440 really stands out to me is the fact that we 253 00:14:25.559 --> 00:14:28.919 have a way to track progress. So generally, like if 254 00:14:29.000 --> 00:14:30.559 you know, you try to learn something on your own, 255 00:14:30.679 --> 00:14:33.279 there's I mean, you can hold yourself accountable, but you 256 00:14:33.320 --> 00:14:36.039 don't really have anyone outside yourself that can observe you 257 00:14:36.120 --> 00:14:37.879 and really give you like the proper feedback that you 258 00:14:37.919 --> 00:14:41.080 need because you're stuck inside yourself. So from from the 259 00:14:41.200 --> 00:14:45.919 very beginning, like we established like very I guess I 260 00:14:46.080 --> 00:14:47.799 kind of like agile way to think about like the 261 00:14:47.840 --> 00:14:49.919 work that we're doing in terms that we share progress 262 00:14:49.960 --> 00:14:54.840 every day and get feedback every day, and part of 263 00:14:54.879 --> 00:14:57.559 that is being able to share like where I get 264 00:14:57.600 --> 00:15:01.440 stuck in my thinking, and I think you can correct 265 00:15:01.440 --> 00:15:02.279 me if I'm wrong as well. 266 00:15:02.360 --> 00:15:02.759 But like. 267 00:15:04.279 --> 00:15:05.879 From the notes that I take and what I write, 268 00:15:05.879 --> 00:15:07.639 I think you're able to get like some of an 269 00:15:07.679 --> 00:15:09.559 idea of like where I get stuck and where my 270 00:15:09.600 --> 00:15:14.799 thought process is, and it goes beyond just like like oh, 271 00:15:14.840 --> 00:15:17.200 how you know, I don't understand this concept. It's more 272 00:15:17.240 --> 00:15:19.240 about like what am I thinking about myself and my 273 00:15:19.320 --> 00:15:21.600 ability to succeed throughout this. 274 00:15:22.120 --> 00:15:23.600 So a lot of things come down to. 275 00:15:23.519 --> 00:15:28.360 Like internal internal dialogue and pushing through hard things. I 276 00:15:28.399 --> 00:15:29.840 think I kind of went off tracking your question. I 277 00:15:29.879 --> 00:15:32.000 apologize about that, but it's just something that came to 278 00:15:32.039 --> 00:15:32.399 my mind. 279 00:15:33.960 --> 00:15:37.240 Yes, many I think that you're in a great point 280 00:15:38.279 --> 00:15:42.159 as you're talking. That's at the beginning of the show 281 00:15:42.559 --> 00:15:48.879 that the coding. Actually there's more about coding than only coding, 282 00:15:48.919 --> 00:15:54.679 you know, because we are effective emotional beings. Sometimes the 283 00:15:54.759 --> 00:16:01.360 problem is not so much as the coding part of 284 00:16:00.799 --> 00:16:01.960 the process. 285 00:16:01.960 --> 00:16:04.080 But uh, in beliefs. 286 00:16:04.080 --> 00:16:08.480 You know, sometimes you are your self talk is not good, 287 00:16:08.759 --> 00:16:11.559 so you say, oh, it's I can't I can't solve this, 288 00:16:11.720 --> 00:16:16.440 it's too hard. And it's also important for problem solving 289 00:16:17.000 --> 00:16:21.519 your own self talk. And uh, and you create limiting beliefs. 290 00:16:21.519 --> 00:16:25.399 And I think in your book, I'm not sure, but uh, 291 00:16:25.639 --> 00:16:30.679 probably it will touch in these topics about your own 292 00:16:30.720 --> 00:16:36.000 self talk. What is limiting you in in fulfilling your 293 00:16:36.519 --> 00:16:40.480 hole potential? Uh And this is also something that uh, 294 00:16:41.080 --> 00:16:45.120 I think a great meatnership should should do, is to 295 00:16:45.120 --> 00:16:51.279 fulfill your whole potentially because I truly believe that everybody 296 00:16:51.320 --> 00:16:55.600 has a potential and UH should be feeling you know, 297 00:16:55.759 --> 00:16:58.759 you should put the you know, like third max on that. 298 00:17:01.799 --> 00:17:03.720 Yeah, I mean a lot of the stuff that I 299 00:17:03.720 --> 00:17:08.440 struggle with initially, you know that having the structure of 300 00:17:08.480 --> 00:17:10.759 the mentorship is helping me with is just like the 301 00:17:10.759 --> 00:17:13.599 belief that I can do it right. Like I'm you know, 302 00:17:13.680 --> 00:17:15.200 kind of past the point where a lot of people 303 00:17:15.240 --> 00:17:17.400 I think are learning new things. Like I said, I'm 304 00:17:17.400 --> 00:17:19.279 pretty comfortable where I'm at, Like I don't feel like 305 00:17:19.559 --> 00:17:21.640 an immense threat to my job, like I've been there 306 00:17:21.680 --> 00:17:25.440 a while, but was uncomfortable with kind of being too 307 00:17:25.480 --> 00:17:30.319 comfortable and going through this you know, learning like computer 308 00:17:30.400 --> 00:17:32.279 science and algorithms, data structures. 309 00:17:32.559 --> 00:17:33.319 It's not easy. 310 00:17:33.480 --> 00:17:36.160 Like especially it's been a long time since I was 311 00:17:36.200 --> 00:17:39.000 in college taking a math class, so you know, I've 312 00:17:39.039 --> 00:17:39.440 had a. 313 00:17:39.359 --> 00:17:41.759 Big thing hanging over my head for a long time 314 00:17:41.839 --> 00:17:43.079 that probably. 315 00:17:43.119 --> 00:17:45.960 Led to my avoidance and things that this basically said, yeah, 316 00:17:46.000 --> 00:17:48.319 you're not smart enough to do this, right. I mean, 317 00:17:48.359 --> 00:17:50.519 that's a that's a thought that I have, you know, 318 00:17:51.000 --> 00:17:53.160 that comes up in the back of my head a lot. 319 00:17:53.240 --> 00:17:57.200 And through the mentorship process, like I think that's been 320 00:17:57.240 --> 00:17:58.559 one of the main things that we've come to. 321 00:17:58.720 --> 00:18:01.000 I don't sit around being myself football day. 322 00:18:00.960 --> 00:18:02.960 But there are times when I'll get like a super 323 00:18:02.960 --> 00:18:05.039 hard problem and then I'll see that, you know, the 324 00:18:05.079 --> 00:18:05.680 answer might. 325 00:18:05.559 --> 00:18:07.640 Make I never would have come up with that on 326 00:18:07.680 --> 00:18:08.000 my own. 327 00:18:08.480 --> 00:18:10.599 And like we kind of discussed like that feeling of 328 00:18:10.680 --> 00:18:12.559 going through that, because that's a place where a lot 329 00:18:12.640 --> 00:18:15.440 of people, when you start to feel uncomfortable, hit those 330 00:18:15.480 --> 00:18:18.920 walls when people quit. And I think that that's probably 331 00:18:19.000 --> 00:18:21.720 the reason that most people, a lot of people don't succeed, 332 00:18:21.880 --> 00:18:23.880 is like when they get there and it feels bad, 333 00:18:24.319 --> 00:18:26.599 they think that as a sign like that they're not capable, 334 00:18:26.640 --> 00:18:29.480 when actually that's a sign that you're actually learning, and 335 00:18:29.720 --> 00:18:31.200 that's when you push through harder. 336 00:18:32.680 --> 00:18:38.640 So I have some some questions about this because I 337 00:18:39.960 --> 00:18:43.480 have the controversial opinion that not everybody can code, that 338 00:18:43.559 --> 00:18:46.079 it's not something that you can just work hard at 339 00:18:46.240 --> 00:18:49.640 and be good at. I kind of believe more in 340 00:18:49.640 --> 00:18:54.799 the philosophy that you could spend your whole life investing 341 00:18:54.839 --> 00:18:58.119 in something that you're not talented at. Invest all of 342 00:18:58.160 --> 00:19:01.960 your skill where you have no talent, and you'll become mediocre. 343 00:19:02.559 --> 00:19:05.119 But if you invest your skill where you have talent, 344 00:19:05.279 --> 00:19:09.200 you can become great. And so I'm of the opinion 345 00:19:09.240 --> 00:19:13.480 that not everybody should learn to code, because not everyone 346 00:19:13.599 --> 00:19:18.720 is talented in that area. But I'm I'm curious to 347 00:19:18.799 --> 00:19:23.000 whether or not, Like I discovered it early and I 348 00:19:23.119 --> 00:19:28.079 was talented in it. Like the first few programs I wrote, no, 349 00:19:28.200 --> 00:19:32.359 I didn't really understand it. I struggled, but I don't know. 350 00:19:32.440 --> 00:19:37.200 After I had probably less than one hundred hours programming, 351 00:19:38.039 --> 00:19:40.480 I was like, Okay, I get this, I understand what 352 00:19:40.559 --> 00:19:42.039 this is about. And I made a lot of poor 353 00:19:42.119 --> 00:19:44.119 choices because I didn't have the skill and I didn't 354 00:19:44.160 --> 00:19:47.839 have the wisdom, but I had a knack for it. 355 00:19:47.880 --> 00:19:52.279 And so I'm curious with your experience, do you feel 356 00:19:52.319 --> 00:19:56.200 like you're someone who has a knack for it or not? 357 00:19:56.480 --> 00:19:58.519 Do you feel like you're someone who is going to 358 00:19:58.599 --> 00:20:03.079 become great at it or not? And you know, like 359 00:20:03.319 --> 00:20:06.759 what are what are you? Some thoughts around around that. 360 00:20:09.480 --> 00:20:15.799 So it's I'm like, historically, like in my life, like 361 00:20:15.799 --> 00:20:18.279 pretty hard on myself, where I don't really think I 362 00:20:18.319 --> 00:20:19.039 can do anything. 363 00:20:19.680 --> 00:20:22.319 So that sort of like clouds over just about everything 364 00:20:22.359 --> 00:20:22.880 that I do. 365 00:20:23.000 --> 00:20:25.720 Right, the one thing that led me to think that 366 00:20:25.799 --> 00:20:28.240 I possibly could do it was the fact that when 367 00:20:28.240 --> 00:20:30.400 I was in college, I learned how to play jazz 368 00:20:30.480 --> 00:20:34.960 music and that was really hard, and yeah, it was 369 00:20:35.079 --> 00:20:37.039 like that it was kind of someone the programming in 370 00:20:37.079 --> 00:20:39.519 that like you you first have to like learn like 371 00:20:39.839 --> 00:20:42.440 the language, right, and then you have to start learning 372 00:20:42.480 --> 00:20:45.720 how to play music. And then like the best challenging 373 00:20:45.720 --> 00:20:50.440 part is you're taking language and you're taking music that 374 00:20:50.519 --> 00:20:52.599 might have like some structure, but you're being asked to 375 00:20:52.640 --> 00:20:54.480 create something completely new on the spot. 376 00:20:54.599 --> 00:20:54.799 Right. 377 00:20:55.240 --> 00:20:58.599 So I've been able to sort of relate that to 378 00:20:58.640 --> 00:21:01.319 programming and the fact that like you have to kind 379 00:21:01.359 --> 00:21:06.119 of grind through like a lot of like at least 380 00:21:06.119 --> 00:21:07.839 for me, like the tougher things. It's getting used to 381 00:21:07.839 --> 00:21:11.039 the concepts and stuff. But over time, as as I 382 00:21:11.079 --> 00:21:14.559 start as I'm not, I wasn't struggling with the language 383 00:21:14.559 --> 00:21:16.920 so much and I was able to start to create things. 384 00:21:17.119 --> 00:21:18.799 That's when I started to have the belief that I 385 00:21:18.799 --> 00:21:21.880 could do it. When I was able to have somebody 386 00:21:21.880 --> 00:21:25.400 give me an idea and then I've never seen what 387 00:21:25.400 --> 00:21:27.039 they want to do. I don't have any code written 388 00:21:27.039 --> 00:21:29.319 about it, but I can create that idea, you know. 389 00:21:29.880 --> 00:21:32.240 So that helped give me the belief that I could 390 00:21:32.240 --> 00:21:34.960 do it. Whether I'm great or not, I don't. I 391 00:21:35.079 --> 00:21:37.400 let other people make that judgment. And generally it's the 392 00:21:37.400 --> 00:21:40.960 people who pay me money, right, That's that's how I go. 393 00:21:41.079 --> 00:21:42.759 And if they think I am, then that's good enough 394 00:21:42.799 --> 00:21:43.000 for me. 395 00:21:43.680 --> 00:21:45.880 That's yeah, that's that's a great way to go about it, 396 00:21:45.880 --> 00:21:46.200 for sure. 397 00:21:48.039 --> 00:21:51.440 And yeah, I mean, so yeah, I have fun. 398 00:21:51.440 --> 00:21:51.720 You know what. 399 00:21:51.799 --> 00:21:52.400 Here's the deal. 400 00:21:53.039 --> 00:21:55.039 I when I was first learning, and it was hard, 401 00:21:55.559 --> 00:21:57.119