WEBVTT

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<v Speaker 1>I had this like nice thing this weekend though, where well,

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<v Speaker 1>it's kind of sad, right because in my Bockle flats,

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<v Speaker 1>like we're we're all pretty tight and we hang out

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<v Speaker 1>a lot, and one of our neighbors has to move

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<v Speaker 1>out after living there for seventeen years because her landlord

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<v Speaker 1>is selling her flat. And I know, and it's just

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<v Speaker 1>like and it was so interesting, right because the neighbors

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<v Speaker 1>were all hanging out.

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<v Speaker 2>We're having a party, right.

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<v Speaker 1>I magically survived to hangover, probably through my power of

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<v Speaker 1>just like being a fairly regular drinker anyway. But you know,

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<v Speaker 1>like let's not let's not analyze.

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<v Speaker 2>While Eleanor wasn't hungover on Sunday. We don't need to

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<v Speaker 2>go into all that.

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<v Speaker 1>But I was noticing this like really quite interesting sort

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<v Speaker 1>of breakdown politicularly where like my neighbor who was moving out,

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<v Speaker 1>I think she's gonna be like either super young boomer

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<v Speaker 1>or like older gen X, Right, and then like all

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<v Speaker 1>of the zoomers were too cool to hang out with

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<v Speaker 1>us in the building. Ed you know what fair fucking

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<v Speaker 1>play like good, Like you don't need to hang out

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<v Speaker 1>with the zeamers.

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<v Speaker 2>We're all like come over, drink drink this free wine.

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<v Speaker 1>You see us hanging out outside, and they're like, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>I gotta go and look, you know what fair play

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<v Speaker 1>to you. But we were like saying to Sarah, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>it like fucking sucks because like her landlord is like

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<v Speaker 1>selling all his properties because they're going to bring in

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<v Speaker 1>like the like smallest modicum of taxation on landlords uh

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<v Speaker 1>in the UK. So all of these flats are suddenly

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<v Speaker 1>getting sold and she's like, yeah, you know, he owns

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<v Speaker 1>thirteen flats, And the millennials are like, what the fuck

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<v Speaker 1>that's like so immoral Jesus Christ, you know, like I

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<v Speaker 1>mean like like this is disgusting. I can't fucking And

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<v Speaker 1>she's like, no, no, no, he's a nice man like,

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<v Speaker 1>but I'm like the dude who had you paying rent

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<v Speaker 1>for seventeen years, who's now kicking you out of his flat,

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<v Speaker 1>a flat that I hasten to add he paid like

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<v Speaker 1>forty five thousand pounds, so he's just like made money.

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<v Speaker 1>Hand over a fist off. My neighbor now kicking her

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<v Speaker 1>out so that he can like get some other giant

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<v Speaker 1>payout payday and she's got to move out like two

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<v Speaker 1>more zones, like, which is so in like we have

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<v Speaker 1>like these circles, so it's like the zone one is

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<v Speaker 1>the middle and then da dada. So now she's gonna

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<v Speaker 1>be like way the fuck out there, and she's still like, no, no,

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<v Speaker 1>my landlord is fine, and like all millennials are like,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm building a guillotine right now. I'm gonna like starch

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<v Speaker 1>public like registry and I'm gonna go find this address.

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<v Speaker 2>And I just thought it. It was like really interesting, kind

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<v Speaker 2>of like the.

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<v Speaker 1>Dichotomy there, and then like you know, it was also

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<v Speaker 1>Eurovision this weekend, and and then she was like, well,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm gonna go watch Eurovision, and like all of us

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<v Speaker 1>were like, oh, we're not, and she's like, why don't.

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<v Speaker 2>You like Eurovision.

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<v Speaker 1>We're like we all like Eurovision, but Israel's in Eurovision,

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<v Speaker 1>so like we're not We're not watching because of well,

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<v Speaker 1>like you know, the pink washing. And she was like, oh,

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<v Speaker 1>well I don't think about that bye, and we're just

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<v Speaker 1>like okay.

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<v Speaker 3>And I didn't hear it. I didn't hear a god

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<v Speaker 3>damn thing about about Eurovision, to the point that when

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<v Speaker 3>I saw like somebody quote tweeting an article about a winner,

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<v Speaker 3>I was like, did they they have Eurovision and I

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<v Speaker 3>didn't know about it, and I didn't.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, I mean, the thing is like, yo, I gotta

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<v Speaker 1>tell you what, all the comrades, as far as we're.

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<v Speaker 2>Concerned, Eurovision didn't go down. I'm not joking.

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<v Speaker 1>Like Israel put all this money into like running ads

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<v Speaker 1>in Australia and America being like please vote for Israel

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<v Speaker 1>in the Eurovision, so like they came as a result,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, because like everyone's boycotting right like, and then

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<v Speaker 1>the people who aren't boycotting are just watching Eurovision like

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<v Speaker 1>normal people and voting for who they want the most.

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<v Speaker 1>But Israel is like running this thing where everyone is

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<v Speaker 1>like calling in twenty times for them from like America

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<v Speaker 1>and you know, fucking like Australia and all this stuff.

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<v Speaker 1>And then they're like, see everybody loves us, and it's

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<v Speaker 1>like nohing, oh my god, Like it's just that you're

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<v Speaker 1>the only ones left watching, right and it's like.

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<v Speaker 3>And you still got second, and you still couldn't win.

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<v Speaker 3>You rigged the whole thing. The whole thing was pulled out.

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<v Speaker 3>It was rigged, and you couldn't do it. Like that's

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<v Speaker 3>the thing. I don't know who won. I don't care

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<v Speaker 3>they could be the second coming of Abba. Or they

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<v Speaker 3>could be you know, one of those things, one of

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<v Speaker 3>those like Icelandic groups that wins every so often or

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<v Speaker 3>something that's like, nah, we do the the the icy beats, yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>or something, and they're just like not the icy Beats

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<v Speaker 3>and you're like, yeah, man, that's cool. Whatever, Like it

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<v Speaker 3>could be the it could be the worst mumblecore rap

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<v Speaker 3>shit in history. They could be the coming of Abba.

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<v Speaker 3>But like, still, you didn't win. The whole thing's geared

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<v Speaker 3>for you. It doesn't matter.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, I think it was Austria.

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<v Speaker 1>I think Austria one, but I don't But I don't know.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know, Like I don't know what the songs

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<v Speaker 1>are because I'm just like, because you're not going to

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<v Speaker 1>catch a girl participant.

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<v Speaker 3>Do they play the songs on the radio after? Is

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<v Speaker 3>that like the thing? I mean, I don't listen to

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<v Speaker 3>the radio here.

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<v Speaker 2>Really, I mean not here, babe.

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<v Speaker 1>They don't really play Eurovision songs on the radio here,

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<v Speaker 1>do they No. It's like I mean, in theory maybe,

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<v Speaker 1>but it's like I mean, to be fair, like we

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<v Speaker 1>usually have dogshit songs in the UK.

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<v Speaker 3>So I just meant like they like there's like a

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<v Speaker 3>winning song ever, like yeah.

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<v Speaker 4>Since.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, so Justin's take on this is if it's a

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<v Speaker 1>really good song, they'll put it on the radio. But

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<v Speaker 1>the UK hasn't had a good song since arguably books

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<v Speaker 1>Phizz is making your mind up. So you can go

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<v Speaker 1>listen to that afterwards for a little treat.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh, Gena G. That's right, Gena G.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, she had a very small dress on. You know,

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<v Speaker 1>that's what Eurovision is all about. That's what Eurovision is

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<v Speaker 1>all about, small clothes. I mean, I think the first

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<v Speaker 1>time I ever saw it, wait, no, that wasn't the

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<v Speaker 1>first time. It was much after that, but I just

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<v Speaker 1>think of him fondly. There were these real oiled up,

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<v Speaker 1>shirtless irishmen this one year. God, what a time to

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<v Speaker 1>be ill, like they were just so oily luke. Oh

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<v Speaker 1>the Polish milk maids who were like jacking off, like

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<v Speaker 1>the like butter churns.

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<v Speaker 2>That was memorable.

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<v Speaker 1>But we're boycotting that bullshit and it sucks because I

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<v Speaker 1>love Eurovision so fucking much. But I can't even I

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<v Speaker 1>can't even be watching it. But you know what I

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<v Speaker 1>could do is I could go watch like videos of

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<v Speaker 1>old ones Man when there was like the Estonian guys

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<v Speaker 1>who dressed up like pirates ship that was so good.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh my god.

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<v Speaker 3>You know, it is like it has such a cultural

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<v Speaker 3>hold on Europe, and like for good reason I didn't

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<v Speaker 3>and like I couldn't tell you like a thing like there.

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<v Speaker 3>I couldn't tell you a thing about it, about what happens.

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<v Speaker 3>I know, like a couple of bands that are really

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<v Speaker 3>famous and I kind of like have gotten their starts

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<v Speaker 3>there and like, but other than that, it's just like

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<v Speaker 3>some kind of like competition. And when I found out,

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<v Speaker 3>like for a long time, I thought it was like

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<v Speaker 3>a cultural thing, so I was like, we're gonna show

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<v Speaker 3>up and do like our cultural ways or something like that.

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<v Speaker 3>So you have like people doing likes and shit like that.

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<v Speaker 3>And then I was like, oh, it's just a concert

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<v Speaker 3>and oh that's fun, like okay, cool, like but like

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<v Speaker 3>I had a come like one million percent different idea

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<v Speaker 3>of what it was than what it actually was. Like

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<v Speaker 3>I thought, you know, like everybody was kind of like,

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<v Speaker 3>here's are you know, whatever our uh whatever music we

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<v Speaker 3>have that we kind of like or whatever, and that

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<v Speaker 3>was it. And then finding out it's just like this

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<v Speaker 3>huge like loo battle of the Battle of the bands

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<v Speaker 3>for the weirdest fucking shit you've ever heard, and occasionally

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<v Speaker 3>the best electronic music ever, and you're just like.

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<v Speaker 1>Cool, like fundamentally, Luke, this is our culture, but it's

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<v Speaker 1>like our beautiful European culture and like the always sunny

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<v Speaker 1>way where it's likes or I'm European, you know.

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<v Speaker 3>I know I am. I am not hating. I am

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<v Speaker 3>simply saying that I was badly mistaken about exactly what

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<v Speaker 3>Eurovision was.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 3>Probably like it's probably like a I don't know, like

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<v Speaker 3>five or ten years ago, and I was like, oh, okay,

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<v Speaker 3>And I don't know why I thought that, because I

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<v Speaker 3>knew Abba came from it, but I guess maybe I

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<v Speaker 3>thought that, like they I don't clean Dion.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, who represented Switzerland?

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<v Speaker 3>About to say she's not.

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<v Speaker 1>No, but she represented she represented Switzerland. Yeah, I mean

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<v Speaker 1>there's not euphoria song Like that song is real. That's

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<v Speaker 1>a real song, you know.

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<v Speaker 2>Uh, you know, like you occasionally get real songs.

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<v Speaker 1>But it's like, yeah, I mean it just sucks because

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<v Speaker 1>we can't have nice things anymore.

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<v Speaker 2>So uh, and it's such a nice thing.

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<v Speaker 3>You remember that Planet of the Bass song that was yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>a couple of years ago. Yeah, that that is all

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<v Speaker 3>Eurovision songs.

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<v Speaker 2>To me, ideal. Like, I get really annoyed when because

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<v Speaker 2>there's you have two options.

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<v Speaker 1>You have the Planet of the Bass song or well

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<v Speaker 1>actually three, or you have some like an insane metal

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<v Speaker 1>from a lot of the the like the Nordic countries

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<v Speaker 1>will occasionally send metal and you're like, great, fantastic, And

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<v Speaker 1>then the other option is that like sometimes people just

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<v Speaker 1>send these sincere ballads and it's like, get the fuck

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<v Speaker 1>out of here. I hate it. I hate it every

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<v Speaker 1>time someone sends a ballad. I'm like, get I don't

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<v Speaker 1>want to see a ballad. I don't want to hear

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<v Speaker 1>abaid I. Also, I mean, the cute thing I'm telling

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<v Speaker 1>people is that I'm boycotting Eurovision until Australia is kicked

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<v Speaker 1>back out again because I don't think that Australia belongs.

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<v Speaker 2>I think that Australia should be allowed to vote, but

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<v Speaker 2>I don't think that they should be allowed to participate.

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<v Speaker 3>But why should they be allowed to vote? Ah, you know,

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<v Speaker 3>they should be allowed to vote thing. Canada almost certainly should.

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<v Speaker 1>I want them to have participation without representation. That's what

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<v Speaker 1>I think that the Australians should have, Okay, I don't,

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<v Speaker 1>I'd like I And it's so funny because like the

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<v Speaker 1>first one they said, and they were like, oh yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>we said a really good song.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm like my good brothers.

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<v Speaker 1>My brother's in hooning, my brother's in gooning, my brother's

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<v Speaker 1>in christ That song was not good.

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<v Speaker 2>That was a bad ballad.

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<v Speaker 3>And it's it's going to dot gun out there from

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<v Speaker 3>the Olympic regun w the dub.

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<v Speaker 1>Centism, you know, Like I'm doing Australian references now, I'm

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<v Speaker 1>like a send machine Gun Filatio. That's who I want

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<v Speaker 1>to see representing Australia. But if you're gonna come at

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<v Speaker 1>me with some boring ass ballad like I don't want

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<v Speaker 1>to see it. Yes, I'm making references to Australian bands

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<v Speaker 1>from the odds. I don't even know if machine Gun

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<v Speaker 1>Flatio exists anymore. But I tell you what, Paging Mister

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<v Speaker 1>Strike is a banger of an album that, yeah, of

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<v Speaker 1>course you haven't believe look at Australian band.

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<v Speaker 3>I've heard a couple of songs by Australian bands in excess.

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<v Speaker 2>Kylie Minogue, Things of this.

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<v Speaker 3>Nature, Minute Work, The Safety dance. Hello, they taught me

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<v Speaker 3>I could dance if I want to.

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<v Speaker 2>That's so true, That's so fucking true.

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<v Speaker 3>Actually, I'm trying to think of any other Australian bands.

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<v Speaker 4>I know.

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<v Speaker 1>Was Silver Chair from Australia, Yeah, they were there, Nies.

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<v Speaker 1>Who are those ones who did Prisoner of Society and

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<v Speaker 1>west en Riot little Australian band I can't recall anyway.

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<v Speaker 3>I'm sure there are. I'm sure some Australian persons going

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<v Speaker 3>to tell us why this is rude and offensive?

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<v Speaker 1>I love hate Yo, You're looking at a girl who

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<v Speaker 1>has seen the Hilltop Hoods in concert like five times,

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<v Speaker 1>like including here in London, like when the Hilltop has

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<v Speaker 1>come to London, I go because I love Australian rap

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<v Speaker 1>slash Adelaide based rap apparently, so you know, like, don't

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<v Speaker 1>don't worry about what I'm willing to see it in concert, Okay.

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<v Speaker 3>I after this, I'm going to listen to whatever this is,

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<v Speaker 3>and these people do not this. If this does not

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<v Speaker 3>have ristine Australian accents while rapping, I'm gonna be furious

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<v Speaker 3>if they do the English thing where they lose it

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<v Speaker 3>when they start singing.

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<v Speaker 1>So I'm immediately sending you YouTube videos of the Hilltop

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<v Speaker 1>Hoods because you're going to be so delighted.

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<v Speaker 3>I need I need the word war to be rhymed

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<v Speaker 3>with the word na oh, I.

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<v Speaker 1>Mean so true, so true. Uh God, Like, I gotta

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<v Speaker 1>tell you the Hilltop Hoods are the ones to go

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<v Speaker 1>to for all of your Australian based needs if that's

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<v Speaker 1>what you want, and that's what I want.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't want, like, don't give me this iggy Azalia.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm pretending that I don't have an accent ship like

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<v Speaker 1>I want do not put on an American accent.

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<v Speaker 2>I want you to like ride with it.

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<v Speaker 3>So yeah, that her awful song would have been so

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<v Speaker 3>much better. She did just like fast things fast and

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<v Speaker 3>the like what like.

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<v Speaker 1>Realist.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah. If she had been doing that, fine fine whatever

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<v Speaker 3>that we would like at least it would have been funny.

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<v Speaker 3>Instead it was just bad.

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<v Speaker 5>I'm still in the mode of business right right.

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<v Speaker 4>You know.

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<v Speaker 2>Actually, new New New One.

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<v Speaker 1>Australia can stay in the Eurovision, but only if they

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<v Speaker 1>send Alia and she has to rap with her real accent, or.

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<v Speaker 3>They send Nicole Kidman. They just send Nicole Kibman out there,

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<v Speaker 3>and they're like and just like what am I supposed

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<v Speaker 3>to do?

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<v Speaker 2>Like, I don't know, I don't know.

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<v Speaker 4>What do you do?

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<v Speaker 3>What are you famous for? She's like, I'm an actress.

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<v Speaker 2>Hugh Jackman, he can sing, and dad he can?

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<v Speaker 3>He can't? Yeah he can and he loves to do it. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>you can get him out there. We all love it.

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<v Speaker 3>Does he still I don't does he still really have

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<v Speaker 3>an Aussie accent anymore?

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<v Speaker 2>When yeah, yeah he does.

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<v Speaker 1>It's just you know, I saw this like hilarious comment

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<v Speaker 1>online lunch on, like a video of like Margot Robbie

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<v Speaker 1>doing press and this woman was like what she insist

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<v Speaker 1>on having an Australian accent.

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<v Speaker 2>She knows how to talk properly. She's just doing this

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<v Speaker 2>to show off.

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<v Speaker 1>This woman is like, once you learn how to do

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<v Speaker 1>an American accent, just like keep doing it.

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<v Speaker 2>Like it's very funny.

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<v Speaker 3>I cannot. I cannot talking properly people slandering a good

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<v Speaker 3>Aussie accent.

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<v Speaker 2>It's one of it's one of our best accents.

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<v Speaker 3>It is like I tell, I tell you what if

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<v Speaker 3>if I met an Australian woman when I was younger,

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<v Speaker 3>like they could have talked to me and they just

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<v Speaker 3>be like, oh wow, that's.

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<v Speaker 1>How you end up anything married in my experience, just

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<v Speaker 1>like you know, that's what that's.

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<v Speaker 2>How they fucking get you.

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<v Speaker 3>He starts talking about the Milanda Gildachuk and you're just like.

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<v Speaker 1>Mat next thing you know, you're on You're living in

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<v Speaker 1>Newtown for three years and your wife.

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<v Speaker 3>To the fuck up.

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<v Speaker 2>That's all.

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<v Speaker 1>That's all I'm saying is like you meet, you meet

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<v Speaker 1>an Australian accent at the wrong age.

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<v Speaker 2>That's all over for you.

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<v Speaker 6>So yeah, mm hmm, what what a shit show?

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<v Speaker 2>We should do our job instead. I'm talking about.

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<v Speaker 3>Folks. If you're Australian, right in and uh.

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<v Speaker 2>Hey you got that's a really bad one. Uh.

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<v Speaker 1>If you're Australian, ride in and tell me who your

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<v Speaker 1>favorite Ozzie Rules football team is.

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<v Speaker 2>It should be the Swans.

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<v Speaker 3>I don't know. I have no opinion about that except

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<v Speaker 3>one time. Uh, when we lived in Denver, me and

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00:16:39.200 --> 00:16:45.080
<v Speaker 3>my wife were really really high and we're late and

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<v Speaker 3>on ESPN sometimes in the middle of the night, they

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<v Speaker 3>show fucking Ozzie Rules Football here and we just watch

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<v Speaker 3>like slack job for like two hours. This is great.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 3>I don't do it often because I'm not staying up

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<v Speaker 3>that late, but yeah, it was pretty fun to watch.

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<v Speaker 3>I like Ausie rules football and rugby and all that.

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<v Speaker 3>It's nice, you know, but I prefer my British American football.

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<v Speaker 3>But what is it?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah my boorish.

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<v Speaker 3>My boorish improper football. Yeah anyway, Yeah, let's that's a

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<v Speaker 3>lot like aland that is yep, because they have uh

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<v Speaker 3>ball sports there too.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, there we go, baby.

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<v Speaker 3>Hello, and welcome back to We're Not So Different, a

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<v Speaker 3>podcast about how I've never done a bad segue. My

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<v Speaker 3>name is Luke. I'm an amateur medievalist, and as always

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<v Speaker 3>I'm joined by doctor doctor Ellen. I can't even, I

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<v Speaker 3>can't even or a I don't know many. Yeah, and

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<v Speaker 3>I'm here with doctor Eleanor Yaniga, who is anything but Hello.

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<v Speaker 5>Uh.

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<v Speaker 3>Today we're gonna talk about al Andelous again. But uh,

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<v Speaker 3>first we got a question. I got a couple of questions.

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<v Speaker 3>First from Gaffzie. My impression of the Renaissance papacy is

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<v Speaker 3>that it was viewed as an Italian institution and whoever

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<v Speaker 3>was pope was more than likely going to be from

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<v Speaker 3>the Peninsula. Is this accurate? And if so, how slush?

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<v Speaker 3>When did the state of affairs arise? Where their periods

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<v Speaker 3>where popes were more likely to be from some other

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<v Speaker 3>nationality like German or friends. How did that affect things

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<v Speaker 3>in Rome?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so the thing about the papacy is really, if

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<v Speaker 1>you're being honest, it's mostly an Italian institution of the

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<v Speaker 1>popes two hundred and.

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<v Speaker 2>Seventeen, I've been Italian. I was looking this up.

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<v Speaker 1>Fun fact, any pope that is called Pious, Boniface or

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<v Speaker 1>Paul was Italian, which is really helpful. That's a really

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<v Speaker 1>helpful thing to kind of remember. And but like it's

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<v Speaker 1>just mostly you get Italian. So yeah, you're like, you're

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<v Speaker 1>not wrong, You're goddamn right. Second, up is France? Unsurprising, right,

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<v Speaker 1>because what ends up happening with that is, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>obviously during the avenue and papacy, like that's what's going down, right,

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<v Speaker 1>is it's just like it's it's time to France.

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<v Speaker 2>That isn't saying that there weren't others.

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<v Speaker 1>So like Sylvester is the second he's one, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>and you get the the occasional ones from around the shop,

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<v Speaker 1>like in the High Medieval period, it's more likely that

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<v Speaker 1>you're gonna get the dudes from around the shop, like

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<v Speaker 1>you know, oh, here and there. It's like, oh, we're

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<v Speaker 1>we're having you know, like there's Adrian, right, like the

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<v Speaker 1>one English pope and guys like that.

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<v Speaker 3>You know.

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<v Speaker 1>But in the very earliest bits of the papacy, you

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<v Speaker 1>get popes from a lot of different places, so you

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<v Speaker 1>know the levant like so you'll have like a bunch

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<v Speaker 1>of Syrian popes, right, like that's that's the thing that exists,

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<v Speaker 1>or African.

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<v Speaker 2>Popes, you know, people who've come from Tunisia.

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<v Speaker 1>There's a couple of Byzantine popes for example, and so

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<v Speaker 1>like all of these things are coming about at the

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<v Speaker 1>time when you would expect like very very early on

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<v Speaker 1>year one hundred, year two hundred, things like that. Same

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<v Speaker 1>with like there's like one Portuguese one from.

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<v Speaker 2>From pretty early on.

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<v Speaker 1>You got a couple of Spanish popes and they come

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<v Speaker 1>in like exactly when you think that they're going to

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<v Speaker 1>come in, so end of the fifteenth century, beginning of

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<v Speaker 1>the sixteenth so like when Spain is incredibly powerful, Yeah

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<v Speaker 1>you get a pope. So yeah, like you're bang on here.

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<v Speaker 1>This is one of the things that happens if you

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<v Speaker 1>are in a cultural ascendancy in the medieval and early

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<v Speaker 1>modern period. You are more likely to get a pope

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<v Speaker 1>on the throne because of the way that political influence works,

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<v Speaker 1>just fundamentally fundamentally, whereas kind of like now, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>we were talking about it the other day, like you

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<v Speaker 1>can have an American pope now because America is like

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<v Speaker 1>becoming suitably uninfluential, right, But for the most part, I mean, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>popes are popes are Italian, Like I mean, it's like

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<v Speaker 1>by a measure of hundreds, the popes are telling.

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<v Speaker 2>So yeah, like if you call the Renaissance.

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<v Speaker 1>Babe see Italian, I'm not mad about it at all, Slash.

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00:21:58.119 --> 00:22:00.759
<v Speaker 1>I think that's you know, probably the way that it is.

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00:22:00.799 --> 00:22:04.839
<v Speaker 1>It's just that we're kind of being Italian papacy brackets

401
00:22:04.880 --> 00:22:08.079
<v Speaker 1>bad because it's like that's when you get Borgia of

402
00:22:08.119 --> 00:22:09.119
<v Speaker 1>popes and things like that.

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00:22:09.839 --> 00:22:12.119
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I think the only one that wouldn't really be

404
00:22:12.200 --> 00:22:17.960
<v Speaker 3>Italian is the very earliest ones, like Eleanor was talking

405
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<v Speaker 3>about the African ones, you know, Peter obviously, those early

406
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<v Speaker 3>early ones, and then like the last the post World

407
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<v Speaker 3>War two era. Basically other than that, I.

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<v Speaker 2>Mean, I guess they've.

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<v Speaker 3>Been It's it's real Italian in the you know, between

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00:22:40.039 --> 00:22:45.839
<v Speaker 3>like three hundred or so and you know, nineteen forty or.

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<v Speaker 1>Whatever, Like, I mean, I guess you get the one

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<v Speaker 1>Dutch pope in the Renaissance mix. But that also makes

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<v Speaker 1>sense because of how the Dutch were really important in

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<v Speaker 1>the sixteenth century. So that's that's Adrian the sixth So yeah,

415
00:23:00.880 --> 00:23:03.240
<v Speaker 1>like that's the thing. But yeah, I mean, if you

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00:23:03.279 --> 00:23:07.759
<v Speaker 1>were like posts popes are usually Italian, that's just true, homeboy.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, any anytime. Yeah, I think you know, basically the

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00:23:11.440 --> 00:23:14.319
<v Speaker 3>only time you get German ones is when the Holy

419
00:23:14.400 --> 00:23:17.200
<v Speaker 3>Roman Empire was kind of in descendancy and they could

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<v Speaker 3>put someone on the throat on the paper throne without uh,

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<v Speaker 3>without them having to be an anti pope m.

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<v Speaker 2>Hm oh yeah for sure. And it's like, you know,

423
00:23:26.519 --> 00:23:30.240
<v Speaker 2>you get you got like four Germans and an Austrian.

424
00:23:30.640 --> 00:23:32.640
<v Speaker 2>I think, yeah, you know, it's it's.

425
00:23:32.480 --> 00:23:35.640
<v Speaker 1>More likely that you're gonna get French Holy Roman imperial popes,

426
00:23:35.759 --> 00:23:39.240
<v Speaker 1>but you know, but you do get them, get you gotta,

427
00:23:40.279 --> 00:23:41.319
<v Speaker 1>that's for sure.

428
00:23:41.720 --> 00:23:47.799
<v Speaker 3>Yep, Gussie, Yeah, thank you, thank you very much for

429
00:23:47.839 --> 00:23:52.599
<v Speaker 3>the question. Uh, the papacy an Italian institution with roots

430
00:23:52.640 --> 00:23:58.839
<v Speaker 3>outside of that. Man, it's really funny, like like they're

431
00:23:58.880 --> 00:24:02.640
<v Speaker 3>never gonna elect it now their Italian pope. Ever, they're like,

432
00:24:02.680 --> 00:24:04.400
<v Speaker 3>now we got to reach more people.

433
00:24:04.319 --> 00:24:07.119
<v Speaker 1>Like yeah, like the Italians we got we got their

434
00:24:07.160 --> 00:24:10.720
<v Speaker 1>asses locked down, Like like what are you trying to prove?

435
00:24:11.279 --> 00:24:14.279
<v Speaker 3>That may have shocked me more about about Pope Leo

436
00:24:14.480 --> 00:24:18.200
<v Speaker 3>than than anything like coming here, Like, no, dog, why

437
00:24:18.200 --> 00:24:20.000
<v Speaker 3>aren't you in Africa? Like you got to do? You

438
00:24:20.000 --> 00:24:22.640
<v Speaker 3>either got to do the Africa and the African guy

439
00:24:22.920 --> 00:24:29.000
<v Speaker 3>or uh, the the East guy. Yeah like you yeah anyway,

440
00:24:29.279 --> 00:24:34.640
<v Speaker 3>uh whatever, it's their institution to run. It's not my business. Yeah, Gasie,

441
00:24:34.680 --> 00:24:37.319
<v Speaker 3>thank you very much. Next, we got one from dog Spotter.

442
00:24:37.400 --> 00:24:39.640
<v Speaker 3>How much money could one make if they went back

443
00:24:39.640 --> 00:24:42.440
<v Speaker 3>to the golden age of trade uh in Venice with

444
00:24:42.519 --> 00:24:45.400
<v Speaker 3>a magic computer that always had power and didn't break

445
00:24:45.480 --> 00:24:49.640
<v Speaker 3>down with excel or equivalent, assuming that no one killed

446
00:24:49.640 --> 00:24:52.200
<v Speaker 3>them to take it. Would one family buy them out

447
00:24:52.319 --> 00:24:55.200
<v Speaker 3>and give them all, give them all of the accounting

448
00:24:55.279 --> 00:24:59.359
<v Speaker 3>job sellaries for life, or would Venetian merchants be able

449
00:24:59.400 --> 00:25:02.319
<v Speaker 3>to work as a grea with this tech. I'm not

450
00:25:02.440 --> 00:25:07.000
<v Speaker 3>the person skill issue, but could a revolutionary good corporate

451
00:25:07.039 --> 00:25:10.680
<v Speaker 3>finance accounting person make a bajillion florins? Or would there

452
00:25:10.720 --> 00:25:11.960
<v Speaker 3>be other issues.

453
00:25:12.559 --> 00:25:14.519
<v Speaker 1>I think the major issues that you're going to end

454
00:25:14.599 --> 00:25:17.880
<v Speaker 1>up getting like amalgamated into one of the families.

455
00:25:18.880 --> 00:25:19.920
<v Speaker 2>Yes, I've thought.

456
00:25:19.759 --> 00:25:21.599
<v Speaker 1>About this for a really long time, and I think

457
00:25:21.640 --> 00:25:23.880
<v Speaker 1>that like, yeah, I think the Medichi you are just

458
00:25:23.880 --> 00:25:27.759
<v Speaker 1>going to be like you work for us, right because fundamentally,

459
00:25:28.480 --> 00:25:32.680
<v Speaker 1>the thing that is happening is that we have individuals

460
00:25:32.839 --> 00:25:35.039
<v Speaker 1>who are the ones who are loaning out the money.

461
00:25:35.079 --> 00:25:37.039
<v Speaker 1>So you're going to end up working for them like

462
00:25:37.079 --> 00:25:39.720
<v Speaker 1>they are bank because that's what they are. I don't

463
00:25:39.799 --> 00:25:45.880
<v Speaker 1>see a way of doing individual accounting for several people,

464
00:25:46.039 --> 00:25:47.480
<v Speaker 1>Like I mean, if what you want to do is

465
00:25:47.519 --> 00:25:50.160
<v Speaker 1>make a lot of money, you do it by going

466
00:25:50.160 --> 00:25:52.960
<v Speaker 1>to the Medichi and being like, hello, I can do this,

467
00:25:53.039 --> 00:25:56.440
<v Speaker 1>I can do this all. And that's how you would

468
00:25:56.480 --> 00:26:00.839
<v Speaker 1>bargain it, which would make it easier for them, you know,

469
00:26:00.839 --> 00:26:02.960
<v Speaker 1>and they could get the leg breakers out whenever they need,

470
00:26:03.039 --> 00:26:05.400
<v Speaker 1>et cetera, et cetera. It's I don't think that there's

471
00:26:05.440 --> 00:26:08.359
<v Speaker 1>a way where you play various families off against each

472
00:26:08.400 --> 00:26:12.799
<v Speaker 1>other because of how these people behave, And I don't

473
00:26:12.799 --> 00:26:15.000
<v Speaker 1>think that you're gonna make as much money if you're

474
00:26:15.000 --> 00:26:19.039
<v Speaker 1>doing it with the more piecemeal people. So you're gonna

475
00:26:19.039 --> 00:26:20.599
<v Speaker 1>want to just sell it to the highest better and

476
00:26:21.000 --> 00:26:23.519
<v Speaker 1>I'm going straight to the Medici door. I'm going knock knock,

477
00:26:23.599 --> 00:26:26.680
<v Speaker 1>doc hello. I have basic Excel skills.

478
00:26:26.720 --> 00:26:27.000
<v Speaker 2>Thanks.

479
00:26:27.759 --> 00:26:29.839
<v Speaker 3>I'm the only person with the password to turn this on.

480
00:26:29.880 --> 00:26:31.519
<v Speaker 3>If you kill me, you don't get it. If you

481
00:26:31.640 --> 00:26:34.240
<v Speaker 3>let me live, you get more money than you have,

482
00:26:34.680 --> 00:26:36.519
<v Speaker 3>or I can take Downstreet to someone else and they

483
00:26:36.519 --> 00:26:41.119
<v Speaker 3>can have it anyway to me, Like, I mean, yeah,

484
00:26:41.480 --> 00:26:42.799
<v Speaker 3>you're gonna want to get in with one of the

485
00:26:42.839 --> 00:26:45.319
<v Speaker 3>big banking families. But there is like there is kind

486
00:26:45.319 --> 00:26:48.400
<v Speaker 3>of a hard cap on the sheer amount of money

487
00:26:48.440 --> 00:26:53.839
<v Speaker 3>you could make in the Middle Ages, simply because the

488
00:26:53.839 --> 00:27:02.000
<v Speaker 3>economies of especially Europe and West Asia the levant at

489
00:27:02.000 --> 00:27:07.839
<v Speaker 3>that time had not been heavily monetized enough for you

490
00:27:07.920 --> 00:27:11.519
<v Speaker 3>to be able to get like a billion florins. A

491
00:27:11.559 --> 00:27:19.000
<v Speaker 3>billion florins would like destroy their economy by like on

492
00:27:19.039 --> 00:27:23.000
<v Speaker 3>an exponential like a million florins. One person having that

493
00:27:23.079 --> 00:27:26.240
<v Speaker 3>many at one time would almost certainly decimate their economy.

494
00:27:26.359 --> 00:27:28.160
<v Speaker 3>So like anything above that is just going to do it.

495
00:27:28.200 --> 00:27:32.480
<v Speaker 3>You don't get the monetization like that until the Spanish

496
00:27:32.519 --> 00:27:35.599
<v Speaker 3>conquest of the Americas and they start getting those obscene

497
00:27:35.759 --> 00:27:40.920
<v Speaker 3>levels of gold and silver in and even at that point,

498
00:27:41.039 --> 00:27:44.359
<v Speaker 3>it's just going straight through Spain into their creditors. So

499
00:27:45.599 --> 00:27:48.119
<v Speaker 3>you know, in order to start getting those like huge

500
00:27:48.119 --> 00:27:50.319
<v Speaker 3>amounts of money, you really have to go to like

501
00:27:51.119 --> 00:27:54.240
<v Speaker 3>sixteen oh three, sixteen o four, the East India Company,

502
00:27:54.359 --> 00:27:58.279
<v Speaker 3>when that gets established and when like the growth, the

503
00:27:58.319 --> 00:28:03.720
<v Speaker 3>exponential growth happens, and that's you know, two hundred some

504
00:28:03.759 --> 00:28:08.000
<v Speaker 3>odd year to three hundred years after the Venetian you know,

505
00:28:09.160 --> 00:28:14.240
<v Speaker 3>monetary Golden Age. So yeah, yeah, not you can make

506
00:28:14.279 --> 00:28:16.559
<v Speaker 3>a lot of money, but I think there would be

507
00:28:16.599 --> 00:28:22.240
<v Speaker 3>a cap on it because a billion florins what would

508
00:28:22.279 --> 00:28:24.759
<v Speaker 3>they do? What would they do with a billion florence?

509
00:28:24.839 --> 00:28:26.160
<v Speaker 2>You know, I just don't know that you could even

510
00:28:26.160 --> 00:28:28.000
<v Speaker 2>make a billion of florence. I don't think that there

511
00:28:28.039 --> 00:28:33.880
<v Speaker 2>is enough metal, you know, like yeah, like I.

512
00:28:33.839 --> 00:28:35.759
<v Speaker 1>Just don't think that you can you can do it

513
00:28:35.799 --> 00:28:38.359
<v Speaker 1>in terms of like what mining is and what the

514
00:28:38.759 --> 00:28:39.119
<v Speaker 1>you know.

515
00:28:39.279 --> 00:28:42.359
<v Speaker 2>Gold and silver resources of Europe are at the time.

516
00:28:42.440 --> 00:28:45.440
<v Speaker 3>You know, Yeah, yeah, yeah, I don't. Yeah, I don't

517
00:28:45.440 --> 00:28:50.279
<v Speaker 3>think it's possible. Yeah, look they're okay, here's here's a

518
00:28:50.319 --> 00:28:55.079
<v Speaker 3>good thing. There are at press Or as of twenty nineteen.

519
00:28:55.119 --> 00:28:57.119
<v Speaker 3>The last time there's a report, the US Mint said

520
00:28:57.160 --> 00:29:01.319
<v Speaker 3>that there are five hundred and four million cores in

521
00:29:01.400 --> 00:29:05.720
<v Speaker 3>circulation of the United States. So even in our economy

522
00:29:05.920 --> 00:29:08.960
<v Speaker 3>with three hundred and fifty billion I'm sorry, three and

523
00:29:09.079 --> 00:29:14.240
<v Speaker 3>fifty million people, we only have five hundred million quarters,

524
00:29:14.319 --> 00:29:18.200
<v Speaker 3>you know, so like anything anywhere closing like a million

525
00:29:18.319 --> 00:29:22.440
<v Speaker 3>number at that point is going to uh just like

526
00:29:23.759 --> 00:29:26.119
<v Speaker 3>light their economy on fire times a million. But you

527
00:29:26.200 --> 00:29:28.960
<v Speaker 3>know what, it's a fun hypothetical, So who cares.

528
00:29:29.240 --> 00:29:31.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, totally topletely, it's a nice one to think about.

529
00:29:31.960 --> 00:29:35.279
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, yeah, yeah, dog spotter, thank you very much for

530
00:29:35.319 --> 00:29:38.480
<v Speaker 3>the question. If you want to ask us questions like those,

531
00:29:39.359 --> 00:29:41.960
<v Speaker 3>please do subscribe to the Patreon at patreon dot com

532
00:29:42.000 --> 00:29:47.000
<v Speaker 3>slash w NSD pod. You can't get access to our discord,

533
00:29:47.200 --> 00:29:50.160
<v Speaker 3>you can ask us questions. You get two bonus episodes

534
00:29:50.200 --> 00:29:52.519
<v Speaker 3>a month, and we got one coming at the end

535
00:29:52.519 --> 00:29:55.519
<v Speaker 3>of the week. Folks, it's time to visit our good

536
00:29:55.519 --> 00:30:01.519
<v Speaker 3>friend Cassine and Or and the face communists in space,

537
00:30:01.720 --> 00:30:05.920
<v Speaker 3>bourgeois libs that that that make the world turn, that

538
00:30:06.039 --> 00:30:08.200
<v Speaker 3>make our lives a little bit better through their fun

539
00:30:08.240 --> 00:30:12.039
<v Speaker 3>little stories. God, there are there are a lot of

540
00:30:12.039 --> 00:30:15.680
<v Speaker 3>idiots in this season, and I really love some idiot gas.

541
00:30:16.640 --> 00:30:18.960
<v Speaker 2>It was it was making me, it was making me giggle.

542
00:30:19.079 --> 00:30:21.519
<v Speaker 2>So I'm ready to that. I've had to hold back

543
00:30:21.599 --> 00:30:23.279
<v Speaker 2>today because I have a lot to say.

544
00:30:23.160 --> 00:30:26.279
<v Speaker 6>But that's yeah, yeah, uh yeah.

545
00:30:26.319 --> 00:30:30.079
<v Speaker 3>So anyway, uh yeah, subscribe pictureon dot com slash wnctpod

546
00:30:30.160 --> 00:30:32.640
<v Speaker 3>five bucks a month and uh yeah, it's great, you

547
00:30:32.640 --> 00:30:37.839
<v Speaker 3>should do it. But anyway, on to the main show. So, folks,

548
00:30:37.839 --> 00:30:40.359
<v Speaker 3>today we're doing our second episode in the series on

549
00:30:40.599 --> 00:30:43.799
<v Speaker 3>al Andolous and it's a big one because we get

550
00:30:43.799 --> 00:30:46.160
<v Speaker 3>to talk about the real story behind the Battle of

551
00:30:46.200 --> 00:30:49.359
<v Speaker 3>Tours and Charles Martel and then the broader collapse of

552
00:30:49.400 --> 00:30:52.799
<v Speaker 3>the Umiad Caliphate in the levant West Asia and Africa

553
00:30:52.799 --> 00:30:55.799
<v Speaker 3>at the hands of the Abasids, leaving only a rump

554
00:30:55.880 --> 00:30:59.720
<v Speaker 3>state in Iberia known as the Umiyad State of Cordoba

555
00:30:59.759 --> 00:31:03.200
<v Speaker 3>that last until ten thirty one. After this, the series

556
00:31:03.200 --> 00:31:05.359
<v Speaker 3>will speed up a little a little bit more to

557
00:31:05.400 --> 00:31:08.279
<v Speaker 3>cover the rest of Muslim rule and Iberia. It's just

558
00:31:08.319 --> 00:31:11.720
<v Speaker 3>that these early years are crucial to understanding what actually happened,

559
00:31:12.799 --> 00:31:15.799
<v Speaker 3>what's just later propaganda, and why it matters a lot

560
00:31:15.880 --> 00:31:20.279
<v Speaker 3>to our current situation. So following their invasion of the

561
00:31:20.279 --> 00:31:23.440
<v Speaker 3>Iberian Peninsula, which began in seven to eleven CE, the

562
00:31:23.519 --> 00:31:27.200
<v Speaker 3>Umids successfully made treaties with bought off or defeated the

563
00:31:27.279 --> 00:31:31.599
<v Speaker 3>locals in battle, creating the formal Muslim controlled state of

564
00:31:31.640 --> 00:31:35.599
<v Speaker 3>all Ontoluse by seven seventeen. By seven twenty one, the

565
00:31:35.640 --> 00:31:39.240
<v Speaker 3>invasion period had mostly ended as the Umiads, despite suffering

566
00:31:39.240 --> 00:31:42.680
<v Speaker 3>a couple of defeats in Austurias and at Toulouse, had

567
00:31:42.759 --> 00:31:46.880
<v Speaker 3>fully destroyed the Visigothic Iberian leadership. Following the Battle of

568
00:31:47.000 --> 00:31:51.319
<v Speaker 3>a Guadaletta, Muslim forces controlled the entire peninsula up to

569
00:31:51.400 --> 00:31:54.640
<v Speaker 3>the Pyrenees, save for a small strip in the north

570
00:31:54.799 --> 00:31:58.160
<v Speaker 3>known as Austurias, as well as a small spit of

571
00:31:58.279 --> 00:32:03.799
<v Speaker 3>land in southwestern France encompassing the city of Narbon. With

572
00:32:03.920 --> 00:32:07.279
<v Speaker 3>these borders were relatively stable. The situation in Iberia entered

573
00:32:07.319 --> 00:32:10.640
<v Speaker 3>a period of relative calm and stability for about a decade,

574
00:32:10.680 --> 00:32:15.599
<v Speaker 3>as the Umiyad leadership solidified its hold and mostly stopped

575
00:32:15.640 --> 00:32:19.480
<v Speaker 3>the efforts and territorial expansion. Periodic rebellions broke out, mostly

576
00:32:19.480 --> 00:32:23.559
<v Speaker 3>fueled Biostorian holdouts and atter the greats Machinesis in Aquitaine,

577
00:32:23.559 --> 00:32:28.799
<v Speaker 3>but they were successfully suppressed. The Andalusians likewise continued rating

578
00:32:28.799 --> 00:32:32.559
<v Speaker 3>across the Pyrenees and up through Narbon. But that's it. However,

579
00:32:32.680 --> 00:32:36.000
<v Speaker 3>in seven point thirty one, Odo, the great Christian ruler

580
00:32:36.039 --> 00:32:39.359
<v Speaker 3>of Aquitaine, formed an alliance with the Umiyad rulers of

581
00:32:39.400 --> 00:32:42.960
<v Speaker 3>Iberia to stop their raids into his lands. If you

582
00:32:42.960 --> 00:32:45.799
<v Speaker 3>are familiar with popular accounts of the era, you might

583
00:32:45.880 --> 00:32:49.039
<v Speaker 3>be surprised that a Christian Gaulish leader would allie with Muslims.

584
00:32:49.039 --> 00:32:51.960
<v Speaker 3>But as you're going to see, the popular narrative is wrong,

585
00:32:52.119 --> 00:32:56.160
<v Speaker 3>at least according to contemporary and modern historians. In reality,

586
00:32:56.279 --> 00:32:59.880
<v Speaker 3>Odo was more unnerved by the infringements of his sovereignty

587
00:33:00.039 --> 00:33:02.920
<v Speaker 3>by the powerful Christian leader Charles Martel and the Franks

588
00:33:03.000 --> 00:33:06.400
<v Speaker 3>to his north, who were preparing to invade, then he

589
00:33:06.559 --> 00:33:09.960
<v Speaker 3>was of any Muslim threat for Iberia. Auto didn't care

590
00:33:10.000 --> 00:33:14.720
<v Speaker 3>about some civilizational struggle between Islam and Christianity. He had real,

591
00:33:15.039 --> 00:33:19.039
<v Speaker 3>actual material problems, like saving his kingdom and his skin.

592
00:33:20.319 --> 00:33:24.240
<v Speaker 3>Thus Odo did Thus, Odo did the only sensible thing

593
00:33:24.279 --> 00:33:27.359
<v Speaker 3>a medieval ruler would do. Impressed by an aggressor, he

594
00:33:27.559 --> 00:33:31.559
<v Speaker 3>formed an alliance with another strong local power, marrying his

595
00:33:31.680 --> 00:33:35.559
<v Speaker 3>daughter off to a Berber prince named Uthmond, at the

596
00:33:35.559 --> 00:33:38.920
<v Speaker 3>time the governor of the state that would eventually become Catalunya.

597
00:33:39.440 --> 00:33:43.000
<v Speaker 3>In theory, this should have solved Odo's rating and Martel problems.

598
00:33:43.680 --> 00:33:46.720
<v Speaker 3>There's just one little hiccup in the planet. Namely, many

599
00:33:46.720 --> 00:33:49.680
<v Speaker 3>of these Iberian Berbers had long simmering resentment against the

600
00:33:49.759 --> 00:33:53.759
<v Speaker 3>Umids and Salt turrebel So it was that till later

601
00:33:53.839 --> 00:33:57.720
<v Speaker 3>in seven point thirty one, Uthman murdered a local Christian

602
00:33:57.799 --> 00:34:02.279
<v Speaker 3>bishop who was under the protection of Muslim leadership, and

603
00:34:02.359 --> 00:34:07.160
<v Speaker 3>then seceded from the broader Umiad state. Suddenly, Odo was

604
00:34:07.200 --> 00:34:10.119
<v Speaker 3>in deep shit. He had betrayed the Umiad Caliphate and

605
00:34:10.159 --> 00:34:13.320
<v Speaker 3>wouldn't be given leniency, and he had deeply offended Charles

606
00:34:13.320 --> 00:34:16.239
<v Speaker 3>Martel by making the alliance in the first place. Almost

607
00:34:16.239 --> 00:34:21.239
<v Speaker 3>immediately Martel broke broke their peace treaty and began attacking

608
00:34:21.280 --> 00:34:25.079
<v Speaker 3>Occutane from the north, which Odo himself personally defended. Then

609
00:34:25.199 --> 00:34:29.920
<v Speaker 3>at the same time, Abdul Rochman al Gaffiki, an Umiad commander,

610
00:34:30.440 --> 00:34:35.199
<v Speaker 3>brutally suppressed Uthman's rebellion, killing him and sending Odo's daughter

611
00:34:35.320 --> 00:34:38.800
<v Speaker 3>back as a captive to serve in a harem in Cordoba.

612
00:34:40.000 --> 00:34:44.119
<v Speaker 3>Odo then had to turn his attention south against Algafigi

613
00:34:44.159 --> 00:34:47.519
<v Speaker 3>and his massive rating party, who had pressed beyond Narbone,

614
00:34:47.679 --> 00:34:51.880
<v Speaker 3>ransacking as far as Bordeaux. When they arrived, Odo's forces

615
00:34:52.039 --> 00:34:55.920
<v Speaker 3>were comprehensively smashed outside of Bordeaux at the Garonne River,

616
00:34:56.480 --> 00:34:58.760
<v Speaker 3>and he was left with no choice but to crawl

617
00:34:58.760 --> 00:35:01.400
<v Speaker 3>back to Charles and beg for help or face annihilation.

618
00:35:02.559 --> 00:35:06.000
<v Speaker 3>Charles agreed to help, but Odo gave up his Cherish sovereignty,

619
00:35:06.079 --> 00:35:11.000
<v Speaker 3>accepting overlordship and becoming a Frankish vassal. Meanwhile, the Muslim

620
00:35:11.039 --> 00:35:14.639
<v Speaker 3>forces pushed up into central France near the Loire River

621
00:35:14.760 --> 00:35:19.199
<v Speaker 3>to deal with Odo's betrayal. As a result, Charles, Odo

622
00:35:19.280 --> 00:35:23.280
<v Speaker 3>and their combined forces move south to counter Gaffigi near

623
00:35:23.320 --> 00:35:29.920
<v Speaker 3>a small town known as Tours eleanor without you know,

624
00:35:30.000 --> 00:35:33.719
<v Speaker 3>going into all you know of the of the specifics,

625
00:35:33.760 --> 00:35:37.039
<v Speaker 3>What is it from here? What is the conventional narrative

626
00:35:37.360 --> 00:35:40.960
<v Speaker 3>of the Battle of Tours that you were very likely

627
00:35:41.039 --> 00:35:45.519
<v Speaker 3>to hear from let's say, around at least around one

628
00:35:45.599 --> 00:35:49.519
<v Speaker 3>thousand CE until maybe ten years ago.

629
00:35:50.000 --> 00:35:52.800
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, so this is you know.

630
00:35:54.519 --> 00:36:00.440
<v Speaker 1>The umiad lusts in his heart for France apparently, you know,

631
00:36:00.559 --> 00:36:03.639
<v Speaker 1>like and and they were coming over the mountains with

632
00:36:03.880 --> 00:36:09.360
<v Speaker 1>eighty thousand troops in order to take over Frankia and

633
00:36:09.559 --> 00:36:17.880
<v Speaker 1>continue there hated Islamic rule at but luckily Charles Martel

634
00:36:18.119 --> 00:36:20.800
<v Speaker 1>was out with a plucky bunch. It's like like a

635
00:36:20.840 --> 00:36:24.039
<v Speaker 1>plucky bunch of like twenty thousand troops or whatever.

636
00:36:25.000 --> 00:36:28.079
<v Speaker 3>A ragtag a bunch of twenty thousand troops that he

637
00:36:28.239 --> 00:36:31.920
<v Speaker 3>just casually had moving through the medieval countryside at the time.

638
00:36:32.239 --> 00:36:35.599
<v Speaker 3>Twenty thousand people in France at the time. That's a

639
00:36:35.639 --> 00:36:37.000
<v Speaker 3>whole lot of fucking people.

640
00:36:37.119 --> 00:36:39.639
<v Speaker 2>That's like so much. That's so much. I mean, like

641
00:36:39.679 --> 00:36:42.519
<v Speaker 2>these are just huge numbers in the first place. But

642
00:36:42.559 --> 00:36:43.760
<v Speaker 2>we'll get into that in a bit.

643
00:36:45.159 --> 00:36:50.840
<v Speaker 1>And that they meet outside tour and God wills that

644
00:36:51.800 --> 00:36:55.239
<v Speaker 1>you know, they hated Umiid are killed and it's like

645
00:36:55.280 --> 00:36:59.679
<v Speaker 1>it's a it's a blood bath. They all win, and

646
00:37:00.679 --> 00:37:03.400
<v Speaker 1>they are taught such an important and valuable lesson that

647
00:37:03.440 --> 00:37:06.039
<v Speaker 1>they never come over the purities again.

648
00:37:06.760 --> 00:37:07.119
<v Speaker 2>Hooray.

649
00:37:08.760 --> 00:37:11.000
<v Speaker 1>You can you can throw a roll into this if

650
00:37:11.039 --> 00:37:13.800
<v Speaker 1>you say you yeah, pretty much, you.

651
00:37:13.800 --> 00:37:19.320
<v Speaker 2>Know, yeah, Frankie, Yeah, I don't know.

652
00:37:19.840 --> 00:37:24.679
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, uh yeah. So I mean that's the thing. This

653
00:37:24.800 --> 00:37:31.239
<v Speaker 3>is a foundational piece of the civilizational struggle between Islam

654
00:37:31.320 --> 00:37:35.239
<v Speaker 3>and Christianity. You know that they've supposedly been fighting this

655
00:37:35.400 --> 00:37:39.159
<v Speaker 3>like ever long battle, even though I don't know, Spain

656
00:37:39.360 --> 00:37:44.800
<v Speaker 3>was close to majority christ the area of Spain was

657
00:37:44.800 --> 00:37:45.960
<v Speaker 3>close to majority Christian.

658
00:37:50.000 --> 00:37:51.599
<v Speaker 2>Let's not let you.

659
00:37:51.519 --> 00:37:54.519
<v Speaker 1>Know, statistics get in the way of a good story

660
00:37:54.679 --> 00:37:57.000
<v Speaker 1>about the Umiad, you know.

661
00:37:57.320 --> 00:37:59.719
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, or the fact or the fact that they controlled

662
00:37:59.760 --> 00:38:02.000
<v Speaker 3>so in Italy and Sicily for a long time.

663
00:38:02.400 --> 00:38:04.719
<v Speaker 2>Or like like you know, whatever, any.

664
00:38:04.760 --> 00:38:07.719
<v Speaker 3>Any of the other examples. The point is that like

665
00:38:07.840 --> 00:38:12.239
<v Speaker 3>this is the thing, and this is a result of

666
00:38:12.840 --> 00:38:16.360
<v Speaker 3>at least according to the scholar the people who wrote

667
00:38:16.360 --> 00:38:19.280
<v Speaker 3>at the time, which are very which are few and

668
00:38:19.320 --> 00:38:27.440
<v Speaker 3>far between, and modern scholars, is that it was a

669
00:38:27.480 --> 00:38:30.039
<v Speaker 3>big battle, especially for the time. It was like huge

670
00:38:30.079 --> 00:38:36.599
<v Speaker 3>fucking and it was a hard fought battle. The Muslims

671
00:38:36.639 --> 00:38:40.000
<v Speaker 3>definitely lost. They took a lot of casualties in the process,

672
00:38:40.719 --> 00:38:43.360
<v Speaker 3>most of which happened when they were fleeing, of course,

673
00:38:43.400 --> 00:38:48.039
<v Speaker 3>because that's when a lot of anyway, But you know,

674
00:38:48.079 --> 00:38:51.840
<v Speaker 3>it was a hard fought thing. And then Martel's own

675
00:38:52.239 --> 00:38:57.360
<v Speaker 3>like family propagandistism work. But much later after that this

676
00:38:57.519 --> 00:39:04.599
<v Speaker 3>became like a cause de celeb were like medieval Christian

677
00:39:04.679 --> 00:39:09.039
<v Speaker 3>writers beginning in the eleventh century and on it, and

678
00:39:09.079 --> 00:39:12.440
<v Speaker 3>it started to take on this, you know, twenty thousand,

679
00:39:13.800 --> 00:39:18.599
<v Speaker 3>three hundred and seventy thousand Muslims and defeated, and you're

680
00:39:18.639 --> 00:39:22.280
<v Speaker 3>just like, what the fuck. So, yeah, let's talk about

681
00:39:22.280 --> 00:39:26.199
<v Speaker 3>the actual Battle of Tours, which is interesting. We're not

682
00:39:26.239 --> 00:39:27.880
<v Speaker 3>going to do the whole battle thing because we're not

683
00:39:27.920 --> 00:39:30.599
<v Speaker 3>a military history podcast, but I do think it is

684
00:39:30.679 --> 00:39:34.159
<v Speaker 3>kind of important to talk about this stuff. And one

685
00:39:34.199 --> 00:39:37.440
<v Speaker 3>thing is the sources. As we said last time, there's

686
00:39:37.480 --> 00:39:39.599
<v Speaker 3>one Christian source for this time period. It is the

687
00:39:39.679 --> 00:39:42.960
<v Speaker 3>Chronicle of seven fifty four, which was written by was

688
00:39:43.000 --> 00:39:47.199
<v Speaker 3>written over time by a monk, and it.

689
00:39:47.159 --> 00:39:49.199
<v Speaker 2>Was shoutous monks, Yeah.

690
00:39:49.079 --> 00:39:52.039
<v Speaker 3>Shout out anonymous monks, and it was you know, published

691
00:39:52.079 --> 00:39:54.880
<v Speaker 3>in the medieval sense after his death. You know, it

692
00:39:54.960 --> 00:39:58.800
<v Speaker 3>was passed around and you know it was copied down

693
00:39:58.840 --> 00:40:01.840
<v Speaker 3>by people, et cetera, et cetera. There are a couple

694
00:40:01.880 --> 00:40:08.000
<v Speaker 3>of Islamic source, very scattered Islamic sources. And then we

695
00:40:08.079 --> 00:40:11.440
<v Speaker 3>have the Venerable Bead, who mentions the Battle of Tours

696
00:40:11.480 --> 00:40:14.119
<v Speaker 3>as well, although at this point and in this instance,

697
00:40:14.159 --> 00:40:18.760
<v Speaker 3>he's more like, yeah, it happened, you know, there you go,

698
00:40:18.880 --> 00:40:21.880
<v Speaker 3>and all right, so based on that, what we know

699
00:40:22.320 --> 00:40:29.800
<v Speaker 3>is a battle occurred near the town of Tours or Poitier.

700
00:40:30.440 --> 00:40:33.079
<v Speaker 3>This sometimes is called the Battle of Poitier, even though

701
00:40:33.400 --> 00:40:35.199
<v Speaker 3>there's a much more famous Battle of Plothier. And I

702
00:40:35.239 --> 00:40:37.239
<v Speaker 3>don't know why you'd try to rejig it now, you know.

703
00:40:37.280 --> 00:40:38.599
<v Speaker 2>It doesn't matter whatever we're calling it.

704
00:40:38.760 --> 00:40:42.119
<v Speaker 3>Try to argue with historians. I'm calling it Tours. Anyway.

705
00:40:44.719 --> 00:40:50.440
<v Speaker 3>At least twenty thousand Muslim soldiers were there. They were

706
00:40:50.679 --> 00:40:55.519
<v Speaker 3>laden with booty from ransacking Bordeaux, which was wealthy even then,

707
00:40:56.280 --> 00:41:00.519
<v Speaker 3>and had either heard rumors of additional wealth at a

708
00:41:00.880 --> 00:41:04.679
<v Speaker 3>very sacred shrine in the city of Tour or in

709
00:41:04.679 --> 00:41:07.920
<v Speaker 3>the town of Tours, or we're just going to continue

710
00:41:08.000 --> 00:41:12.800
<v Speaker 3>rating until they got stopped, and then they got turned back.

711
00:41:12.840 --> 00:41:16.920
<v Speaker 3>At the same time, Charles Martel had about twenty thousand

712
00:41:17.199 --> 00:41:20.800
<v Speaker 3>soldiers with him under his control. Auto the second, Auto

713
00:41:20.840 --> 00:41:27.199
<v Speaker 3>the Great was his second in command. And yeah, the

714
00:41:26.639 --> 00:41:30.320
<v Speaker 3>there was a big fight. It was very hard fought.

715
00:41:30.400 --> 00:41:33.760
<v Speaker 3>It lasted a good while. The Muslims got the advantage

716
00:41:33.760 --> 00:41:39.159
<v Speaker 3>for a little while. The Martel actually formed squares. If

717
00:41:39.159 --> 00:41:42.679
<v Speaker 3>you're familiar with Napoleonic warfare. Obviously he's not for it's

718
00:41:42.719 --> 00:41:44.960
<v Speaker 3>not the same principle, but that's what it looked like.

719
00:41:45.039 --> 00:41:48.760
<v Speaker 3>According to reports, he has a square, they are able

720
00:41:48.800 --> 00:41:54.280
<v Speaker 3>to fend off the infantry. They have like FEALANX shields

721
00:41:54.400 --> 00:41:56.920
<v Speaker 3>with them, So this is like an old style Greek

722
00:41:57.039 --> 00:42:00.280
<v Speaker 3>battle mixed with you know what, we would see his

723
00:42:00.360 --> 00:42:04.400
<v Speaker 3>Napoleonic stuff. So it's kind of cool like that. But

724
00:42:05.480 --> 00:42:09.679
<v Speaker 3>the Muslims broke through once, but Martell's forces were able

725
00:42:09.719 --> 00:42:16.440
<v Speaker 3>to push them back, and after hard brutal fighting, they

726
00:42:16.480 --> 00:42:20.360
<v Speaker 3>fled because Odo took some of his troops around, burned

727
00:42:20.400 --> 00:42:25.320
<v Speaker 3>a baggage, burned and looted the baggage for the Union soldiers,

728
00:42:25.320 --> 00:42:27.760
<v Speaker 3>and they were like, oh shit, we gotta go back,

729
00:42:28.480 --> 00:42:30.480
<v Speaker 3>we gotta do that. It turned into a route and

730
00:42:30.800 --> 00:42:33.239
<v Speaker 3>probably seven thousand or so of them died or were

731
00:42:33.239 --> 00:42:38.880
<v Speaker 3>injured in the in fleeing, and they fled back south

732
00:42:38.920 --> 00:42:44.719
<v Speaker 3>of the Pyrenees, and they stayed there pretty much the

733
00:42:44.760 --> 00:42:49.440
<v Speaker 3>whole time. They did push a little bit north up

734
00:42:49.480 --> 00:42:53.119
<v Speaker 3>to Oral later through Narbone, but they didn't go through

735
00:42:53.159 --> 00:42:58.400
<v Speaker 3>the Pyrenees into the center of France again. And yeah,

736
00:42:58.480 --> 00:43:03.239
<v Speaker 3>that's pretty much what we know. Oh and most military

737
00:43:03.280 --> 00:43:07.119
<v Speaker 3>historians now agree that Martel's the thing that actually helped

738
00:43:07.119 --> 00:43:09.199
<v Speaker 3>Martel win the battle more than anything else was that

739
00:43:09.239 --> 00:43:13.960
<v Speaker 3>they got the jump on they they they were able

740
00:43:14.000 --> 00:43:17.880
<v Speaker 3>to sneak around and get the jump on Gaffiki and

741
00:43:17.920 --> 00:43:21.800
<v Speaker 3>his troops, which Gefficke should have sent out scouts, but

742
00:43:21.920 --> 00:43:25.679
<v Speaker 3>you know, it does happen sometimes. Anyway, they were off

743
00:43:25.679 --> 00:43:29.519
<v Speaker 3>on a bad foot, and yeah, the Christians one a

744
00:43:29.719 --> 00:43:39.239
<v Speaker 3>very sound victory, and that was that. Now here's you

745
00:43:39.280 --> 00:43:42.800
<v Speaker 3>know that that that's that's the thing. So after this,

746
00:43:43.800 --> 00:43:51.039
<v Speaker 3>eleanor Charles Martel and especially his his family starts embellishing

747
00:43:51.280 --> 00:43:56.760
<v Speaker 3>this and they start and almost immediately it starts to

748
00:43:56.800 --> 00:44:01.559
<v Speaker 3>take on a little more mythic proportions. And yeah, so

749
00:44:01.599 --> 00:44:05.000
<v Speaker 3>they're just all of a sudden, it's not just we

750
00:44:05.079 --> 00:44:07.719
<v Speaker 3>thought we fought off a rating party. They went back.

751
00:44:07.920 --> 00:44:11.360
<v Speaker 3>You know, they clearly weren't trying to do territorial expansion

752
00:44:11.440 --> 00:44:15.159
<v Speaker 3>that far, because they would have garrisoned all those towns.

753
00:44:15.159 --> 00:44:20.239
<v Speaker 3>They had gone like a Bordeaux and garrisoning Bordeaux would

754
00:44:20.239 --> 00:44:21.920
<v Speaker 3>have taken it. You know, it would have taken a

755
00:44:21.920 --> 00:44:24.960
<v Speaker 3>lot of minute. It doesn't matter how many, but you know,

756
00:44:25.519 --> 00:44:27.960
<v Speaker 3>they're not doing that. So eleanor what is what is

757
00:44:28.320 --> 00:44:30.880
<v Speaker 3>Martel's spin on this?

758
00:44:31.519 --> 00:44:34.360
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, like Martel's spin on it. It's like, what's so

759
00:44:34.440 --> 00:44:34.800
<v Speaker 2>kind of.

760
00:44:34.760 --> 00:44:37.840
<v Speaker 1>Crucial about this as well is that, you know, if

761
00:44:37.840 --> 00:44:41.239
<v Speaker 1>you go back to the Chronicle of seven fifty four, also,

762
00:44:41.280 --> 00:44:45.679
<v Speaker 1>they're like Martell had way more men. Yes, that's like

763
00:44:46.000 --> 00:44:48.440
<v Speaker 1>the one of the really important things about it. They're like, yeah,

764
00:44:48.840 --> 00:44:50.679
<v Speaker 1>but then they found them and they killed them and

765
00:44:50.760 --> 00:44:51.239
<v Speaker 1>like thank.

766
00:44:51.079 --> 00:44:58.440
<v Speaker 2>You, right. But so Martel's spin on this is that.

767
00:45:00.039 --> 00:45:03.639
<v Speaker 1>Basically this was, you know, an expansionist army that's coming

768
00:45:03.760 --> 00:45:05.840
<v Speaker 1>over the Pyrenees, and there's just so many of them.

769
00:45:05.880 --> 00:45:09.239
<v Speaker 1>It's just like the most the most omids that have

770
00:45:09.320 --> 00:45:11.440
<v Speaker 1>ever been Like sometimes you get figures up to like

771
00:45:11.480 --> 00:45:13.880
<v Speaker 1>almost half a million, which is like, okay, is that

772
00:45:14.000 --> 00:45:15.280
<v Speaker 1>every umiate.

773
00:45:15.159 --> 00:45:19.119
<v Speaker 3>Like not only every umid in the peninsula, but also

774
00:45:19.199 --> 00:45:22.360
<v Speaker 3>a sizeable chunk of all the Christian and Jewish men

775
00:45:22.559 --> 00:45:24.719
<v Speaker 3>in the area. Yeah, it was like, yeah, let's go

776
00:45:24.800 --> 00:45:29.920
<v Speaker 3>do this. This is great. I fucking love fighting frenchmen.

777
00:45:29.920 --> 00:45:32.599
<v Speaker 1>And like, oh, famously, like the Ubid armies are made

778
00:45:32.719 --> 00:45:34.960
<v Speaker 1>up of like the Arabic.

779
00:45:34.559 --> 00:45:36.719
<v Speaker 2>Guys, because that's exactly because of the.

780
00:45:36.679 --> 00:45:39.199
<v Speaker 1>Stratisfied nature of society and how it works, you know,

781
00:45:39.519 --> 00:45:42.039
<v Speaker 1>or like sometimes the berber guys, but you know, like

782
00:45:42.039 --> 00:45:47.639
<v Speaker 1>one way or another, right and what why we know

783
00:45:47.760 --> 00:45:50.079
<v Speaker 1>that that's definitely not the cases as you say, you know,

784
00:45:50.119 --> 00:45:52.199
<v Speaker 1>where there are no garrisons. And if there's one fucking

785
00:45:52.239 --> 00:45:54.960
<v Speaker 1>thing the Ubians were really good at doing, it was

786
00:45:55.000 --> 00:45:58.760
<v Speaker 1>like garrisoning a position in order to expand, right, like

787
00:45:59.000 --> 00:45:59.760
<v Speaker 1>kind of their thing.

788
00:46:00.480 --> 00:46:00.679
<v Speaker 4>Sort.

789
00:46:01.280 --> 00:46:03.360
<v Speaker 3>They would have signed the same treaties with all the

790
00:46:03.400 --> 00:46:07.039
<v Speaker 3>other people that they signed to take over Seville and

791
00:46:07.119 --> 00:46:10.639
<v Speaker 3>Cordoba and Barcelona. They would have signed all those same deals,

792
00:46:11.079 --> 00:46:14.199
<v Speaker 3>but they didn't because that was not the point. And

793
00:46:15.000 --> 00:46:19.000
<v Speaker 3>like nothing shows that like they were coming for the

794
00:46:19.079 --> 00:46:21.840
<v Speaker 3>rest of Europe, but they were.

795
00:46:22.480 --> 00:46:25.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but you know, this is a really useful thing

796
00:46:26.800 --> 00:46:34.960
<v Speaker 1>for Charles Martel because basically he is in the process

797
00:46:35.119 --> 00:46:38.440
<v Speaker 1>of dynastic expansion and dynastic creation.

798
00:46:38.880 --> 00:46:40.519
<v Speaker 2>Right, So here we go, we.

799
00:46:40.639 --> 00:46:44.519
<v Speaker 1>Have got a story that is going to help establish

800
00:46:44.519 --> 00:46:45.599
<v Speaker 1>the Carolingians.

801
00:46:45.840 --> 00:46:46.119
<v Speaker 3>Right.

802
00:46:46.440 --> 00:46:49.239
<v Speaker 1>Why is it that the carolin Jeans are fit to

803
00:46:49.280 --> 00:46:53.480
<v Speaker 1>rule this much land? Well, they are the great defense

804
00:46:53.719 --> 00:46:56.480
<v Speaker 1>against these expanding Islamic hords.

805
00:46:57.159 --> 00:46:58.159
<v Speaker 2>They have a college.

806
00:46:58.320 --> 00:47:02.280
<v Speaker 1>Don't we want an emperor et cetera, et cetera, and

807
00:47:02.440 --> 00:47:04.599
<v Speaker 1>we are the ones who are set up well in

808
00:47:04.719 --> 00:47:06.719
<v Speaker 1>order to do this. And now this ends up having

809
00:47:06.719 --> 00:47:11.360
<v Speaker 1>like some shakedown effects, right, because you start getting it

810
00:47:11.440 --> 00:47:14.760
<v Speaker 1>spread around, like we get it coming up in the

811
00:47:14.800 --> 00:47:19.599
<v Speaker 1>Libra Pontificalis, for example, so like the Liber Pontificalis for

812
00:47:19.679 --> 00:47:22.280
<v Speaker 1>those not in the know, is one of our great

813
00:47:22.320 --> 00:47:23.719
<v Speaker 1>sources where it's like, this is where you get the

814
00:47:23.760 --> 00:47:26.679
<v Speaker 1>lives of the saints, this is where you get like,

815
00:47:26.840 --> 00:47:30.320
<v Speaker 1>this is how the papacy establishes itself is by reading

816
00:47:30.519 --> 00:47:33.519
<v Speaker 1>by writing the Libra pontific Ellis. They're like, yeah, yo,

817
00:47:34.679 --> 00:47:38.000
<v Speaker 1>just fyi, this is the reason why we are a

818
00:47:38.039 --> 00:47:43.199
<v Speaker 1>good pope. So it's telling very specific religious stories and

819
00:47:43.760 --> 00:47:47.880
<v Speaker 1>it more more particularly is attempting to tell the story

820
00:47:47.920 --> 00:47:51.679
<v Speaker 1>on the side of Odo the Great and less less

821
00:47:51.760 --> 00:47:54.239
<v Speaker 1>Charles Bartel, where they're like, oh, yeah, we really like

822
00:47:54.280 --> 00:47:58.559
<v Speaker 1>Odo the Great. He's cool and he won this really

823
00:47:58.639 --> 00:48:02.559
<v Speaker 1>great and impressive battle and isn't that incredible? Right, So

824
00:48:02.880 --> 00:48:07.519
<v Speaker 1>they're jumping on the badwagon for particular reasons, which are

825
00:48:07.920 --> 00:48:10.000
<v Speaker 1>you know, for the papacy, it's important to kind of

826
00:48:10.079 --> 00:48:14.719
<v Speaker 1>establish good versus evil myth with the Muslims.

827
00:48:14.760 --> 00:48:16.559
<v Speaker 2>You know, they're they're aye in Sicily.

828
00:48:17.920 --> 00:48:20.000
<v Speaker 1>They're they're like, I don't I don't care for this, right,

829
00:48:20.280 --> 00:48:23.679
<v Speaker 1>So they're telling a particular story about that. Later on,

830
00:48:23.719 --> 00:48:27.280
<v Speaker 1>your boy Paul the Deacon, he comes up and writes

831
00:48:27.280 --> 00:48:28.239
<v Speaker 1>about this in the History of.

832
00:48:28.159 --> 00:48:32.400
<v Speaker 2>The Lombards, and like he's like just.

833
00:48:32.480 --> 00:48:35.519
<v Speaker 1>Spouting off numbers for who was involved that are like

834
00:48:36.000 --> 00:48:37.920
<v Speaker 1>in no way attached to them.

835
00:48:37.920 --> 00:48:44.199
<v Speaker 3>Three hundred and fifty thousand Muslims, all of their teeth

836
00:48:44.320 --> 00:48:49.159
<v Speaker 3>sharpened to the finest points. They they rip the float,

837
00:48:49.199 --> 00:48:52.159
<v Speaker 3>and you're just like, what the fuck is that? Like

838
00:48:52.599 --> 00:48:57.719
<v Speaker 3>the quotes from the later like stories about this are

839
00:48:58.519 --> 00:49:01.440
<v Speaker 3>fucking insane, and I mean see how they got built up,

840
00:49:01.480 --> 00:49:04.239
<v Speaker 3>because you know it's i mean, from a Christian perspective,

841
00:49:04.239 --> 00:49:06.079
<v Speaker 3>it's a cool story, but like at the same time,

842
00:49:06.159 --> 00:49:08.280
<v Speaker 3>you're just like, what the fuck is this ship?

843
00:49:08.800 --> 00:49:11.440
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Like we're getting into like real Paul Bunny and

844
00:49:11.519 --> 00:49:14.440
<v Speaker 1>Ass territory at this point in time where they're like,

845
00:49:15.039 --> 00:49:18.039
<v Speaker 1>we're just making this the biggest and most outrageous story

846
00:49:18.039 --> 00:49:23.000
<v Speaker 1>that we possibly can and so this is like big, big, big,

847
00:49:23.119 --> 00:49:27.159
<v Speaker 1>and obviously the Carolingians are like, hell yeah, brother, that's

848
00:49:27.199 --> 00:49:32.199
<v Speaker 1>exactly how this went down, because that's really easel for them.

849
00:49:32.559 --> 00:49:35.199
<v Speaker 1>And you know, one of the things that happens is

850
00:49:35.239 --> 00:49:38.079
<v Speaker 1>the Obians do stop kind of rating as much. But

851
00:49:38.159 --> 00:49:39.559
<v Speaker 1>you know, as we're going to get to it's because

852
00:49:39.559 --> 00:49:42.639
<v Speaker 1>they've got other fish to fry. You know, they're they're

853
00:49:42.679 --> 00:49:44.679
<v Speaker 1>and they're kind of like it's not really worth the

854
00:49:44.760 --> 00:49:46.880
<v Speaker 1>rating parties, which is all they were really trying to

855
00:49:46.880 --> 00:49:48.760
<v Speaker 1>do was raid, right, Like.

856
00:49:48.840 --> 00:49:55.159
<v Speaker 3>That's the fucking nerd Gibbon. Uh, he's so Edward Gibbon

857
00:49:55.719 --> 00:49:58.679
<v Speaker 3>in the uh the The History of the Decline follow

858
00:49:58.719 --> 00:50:06.280
<v Speaker 3>the Roman Empire says that that had had Charles fallen,

859
00:50:07.000 --> 00:50:12.559
<v Speaker 3>the Umid Caliphate would have easily conquered a divided Europe.

860
00:50:12.880 --> 00:50:15.719
<v Speaker 3>I need you to think about in your own mind.

861
00:50:15.880 --> 00:50:20.119
<v Speaker 3>At this time Europe has no giant, strong entities. But

862
00:50:20.199 --> 00:50:24.159
<v Speaker 3>I need you to just think about how many people

863
00:50:24.639 --> 00:50:29.920
<v Speaker 3>it would take to conquer even just France, even the

864
00:50:30.079 --> 00:50:33.559
<v Speaker 3>area that we know today is France, forgetting the isles

865
00:50:33.599 --> 00:50:37.639
<v Speaker 3>north of that, forgetting Scandinavia, forgetting Central and Eastern Europe.

866
00:50:38.280 --> 00:50:41.719
<v Speaker 3>Just France. It's gonna take a fuckload of people because

867
00:50:41.760 --> 00:50:45.320
<v Speaker 3>there are a lot of human beings in that area,

868
00:50:45.360 --> 00:50:47.079
<v Speaker 3>and there have been for a long time because it's

869
00:50:47.159 --> 00:50:49.480
<v Speaker 3>nice to grow wheat and grapes there and people like

870
00:50:49.559 --> 00:50:57.119
<v Speaker 3>that stuff. How like, given, I'm given's analysis obviously, but

871
00:50:57.199 --> 00:51:02.880
<v Speaker 3>he's not stupid. He understands some of the stuff. But

872
00:51:02.920 --> 00:51:05.960
<v Speaker 3>that like that sentence right there is like how can

873
00:51:06.000 --> 00:51:09.679
<v Speaker 3>you have credibility after this? You could not conquer They

874
00:51:09.719 --> 00:51:13.559
<v Speaker 3>would need two and a half times the people they

875
00:51:13.599 --> 00:51:16.679
<v Speaker 3>took to conquer Hiberia for that probably.

876
00:51:17.199 --> 00:51:20.360
<v Speaker 1>And like in the second first place, you're exactly right,

877
00:51:20.559 --> 00:51:24.239
<v Speaker 1>you know, there are simply not enough omids on the

878
00:51:24.239 --> 00:51:27.000
<v Speaker 1>face of the planet to make this possible, like we

879
00:51:27.519 --> 00:51:33.000
<v Speaker 1>do we do not have the population, like in terms

880
00:51:33.000 --> 00:51:34.960
<v Speaker 1>of the military numbers.

881
00:51:34.840 --> 00:51:37.239
<v Speaker 2>To make this happen. It just it just won't do.

882
00:51:38.239 --> 00:51:40.400
<v Speaker 1>And in the second place, don't threaten me with a

883
00:51:40.400 --> 00:51:44.440
<v Speaker 1>good time, right, like oh no, and then what would

884
00:51:44.480 --> 00:51:47.079
<v Speaker 1>that do given like, oh, you would still be able

885
00:51:47.119 --> 00:51:49.400
<v Speaker 1>to like worship freely and you would be like giving

886
00:51:49.440 --> 00:51:51.239
<v Speaker 1>your taxes to another bunch of people, like a calm

887
00:51:51.280 --> 00:51:52.079
<v Speaker 1>the fuck down.

888
00:51:52.239 --> 00:51:54.079
<v Speaker 2>Right, like calm the fuck down.

889
00:51:55.000 --> 00:51:59.079
<v Speaker 3>And given thought that Christianity was the reason the Roman Empire.

890
00:51:58.760 --> 00:52:03.440
<v Speaker 2>Fell, I'm just it's it's like it's.

891
00:52:03.320 --> 00:52:06.440
<v Speaker 3>Such that makes sense. How I'm sorry. I'm sorry, I'm sorry.

892
00:52:06.519 --> 00:52:09.719
<v Speaker 2>Keeping like it's it's incredibly like.

893
00:52:11.320 --> 00:52:14.719
<v Speaker 1>A twentieth century view of the world, which is like

894
00:52:14.880 --> 00:52:19.360
<v Speaker 1>religion is bad, but actually like unless it's like the

895
00:52:19.400 --> 00:52:23.000
<v Speaker 1>scariest religion is is when there is Muslim and so

896
00:52:23.119 --> 00:52:24.679
<v Speaker 1>Christianity is better than that.

897
00:52:24.880 --> 00:52:27.360
<v Speaker 2>But actually, like war, it's like just shut the fuck up,

898
00:52:27.800 --> 00:52:29.880
<v Speaker 2>grow up, grow up. And it's like, I mean, it's

899
00:52:29.920 --> 00:52:31.079
<v Speaker 2>it's all just on.

900
00:52:31.000 --> 00:52:34.000
<v Speaker 3>The bandwagon or don't. Either you're an atheist or an

901
00:52:34.039 --> 00:52:37.280
<v Speaker 3>agnostic or you believe in Christianity.

902
00:52:36.599 --> 00:52:42.159
<v Speaker 2>Like whatever, yeah, whatever, it like, I get it. Englishmen,

903
00:52:42.679 --> 00:52:46.679
<v Speaker 2>Like I get it. You are like white supremacy pilled.

904
00:52:47.719 --> 00:52:50.199
<v Speaker 1>That's fine, Yeah, that's fine, you know, but it is

905
00:52:50.400 --> 00:52:52.400
<v Speaker 1>very like it is the sort of thing that I

906
00:52:52.440 --> 00:52:56.079
<v Speaker 1>can imagine like getting into an argument with like you know,

907
00:52:56.320 --> 00:52:58.960
<v Speaker 1>online atheists about in the Ear of Our Lord two

908
00:52:58.960 --> 00:53:01.159
<v Speaker 1>thousand and two. So it's interesting because like this this

909
00:53:01.280 --> 00:53:06.280
<v Speaker 1>view really does shape the twentieth century view of the

910
00:53:06.440 --> 00:53:10.000
<v Speaker 1>entire thing, but it also just is like so incredibly

911
00:53:10.679 --> 00:53:13.920
<v Speaker 1>lacking in rigor from a historical perspective, because you know,

912
00:53:13.960 --> 00:53:15.239
<v Speaker 1>all you got to do is go back and look

913
00:53:15.239 --> 00:53:17.480
<v Speaker 1>at the original chronicles and they're just not saying.

914
00:53:17.239 --> 00:53:18.360
<v Speaker 2>That that happened. Now.

915
00:53:19.559 --> 00:53:22.639
<v Speaker 1>Mind, like the chronicles, as you said, like from the

916
00:53:22.679 --> 00:53:25.760
<v Speaker 1>eleventh century onwards start telling this story again, like real big,

917
00:53:25.800 --> 00:53:27.199
<v Speaker 1>and it's like, yeah, what else was happening in the

918
00:53:27.199 --> 00:53:31.480
<v Speaker 1>eleventh century, Oh, the Crusades, right, And so they've got

919
00:53:31.480 --> 00:53:33.920
<v Speaker 1>a vested interest in being like, oh yeah, they were

920
00:53:33.920 --> 00:53:35.480
<v Speaker 1>so big, it's gary and they were going to like

921
00:53:35.480 --> 00:53:38.800
<v Speaker 1>and they thrown to beat me up and they said that,

922
00:53:39.320 --> 00:53:42.880
<v Speaker 1>you know, my mom was ugly, and it's just like, dude,

923
00:53:45.280 --> 00:53:47.760
<v Speaker 1>grow up, you know, like it's it's fine, Like you

924
00:53:47.760 --> 00:53:48.920
<v Speaker 1>can see exactly what it's doing.

925
00:53:48.960 --> 00:53:50.360
<v Speaker 2>And it's this useful myth.

926
00:53:50.880 --> 00:53:53.599
<v Speaker 1>And it's a useful foundational myth and a useful myth

927
00:53:53.760 --> 00:53:57.599
<v Speaker 1>in terms of when you are attempting to send a

928
00:53:57.599 --> 00:54:02.679
<v Speaker 1>bunch of French guys to the Aunt to attempt to

929
00:54:02.719 --> 00:54:06.599
<v Speaker 1>take over Jerusalem, right, because this is like it creates

930
00:54:06.639 --> 00:54:12.079
<v Speaker 1>a story wherein the Muslims are at war specifically with Franks,

931
00:54:12.119 --> 00:54:15.320
<v Speaker 1>you know, with with the French French speakers, and so

932
00:54:15.360 --> 00:54:17.039
<v Speaker 1>now it's like, oh, yeah, so now go take the

933
00:54:17.079 --> 00:54:20.800
<v Speaker 1>fight to them, right, turn about as fair play sort

934
00:54:20.840 --> 00:54:21.599
<v Speaker 1>of sort of by the.

935
00:54:21.920 --> 00:54:27.320
<v Speaker 3>Here, yeah, and I mean, like you like I meant

936
00:54:27.320 --> 00:54:31.480
<v Speaker 3>to read it earlier, but like the the brief synopsis

937
00:54:31.519 --> 00:54:34.440
<v Speaker 3>of this battle in the Chronicle of seven fifty four

938
00:54:34.559 --> 00:54:39.320
<v Speaker 3>really is one of the most even sided accounts you

939
00:54:39.400 --> 00:54:44.960
<v Speaker 3>will find. There's very little hyperbole in here. God does

940
00:54:45.000 --> 00:54:49.599
<v Speaker 3>not miraculously come down and touch the shields of the Christians.

941
00:54:49.320 --> 00:54:56.440
<v Speaker 3>It it goes quote, while Abdul Abdul all Rothmann Algafiki,

942
00:54:56.519 --> 00:55:00.599
<v Speaker 3>I'm sorry God, They okay, sorry, While I'm Uel Robin

943
00:55:00.679 --> 00:55:04.679
<v Speaker 3>Algafiki was pursuing Odo, he decided to despoil Tours by

944
00:55:04.679 --> 00:55:08.199
<v Speaker 3>destroying its palaces and burning its churches. There he confronted

945
00:55:08.199 --> 00:55:12.280
<v Speaker 3>the consul of the Consul of Austrasia, which is Europe,

946
00:55:12.599 --> 00:55:15.239
<v Speaker 3>by the name of Charles, a man who, having proved

947
00:55:15.280 --> 00:55:17.280
<v Speaker 3>himself to be a warrior from his youth and an

948
00:55:17.360 --> 00:55:21.159
<v Speaker 3>expert in things military, had been summoned by Odo. After

949
00:55:21.239 --> 00:55:24.119
<v Speaker 3>each side had tormented the other with raids for almost

950
00:55:24.119 --> 00:55:27.320
<v Speaker 3>seven days, they finally prepared their battle lines and fought fiercely.

951
00:55:27.719 --> 00:55:31.360
<v Speaker 3>The northern peoples remained as immobile as a wall, holding

952
00:55:31.400 --> 00:55:34.079
<v Speaker 3>together like a glacier in the cold regions. In the

953
00:55:34.119 --> 00:55:37.039
<v Speaker 3>blink of an eye, they anihilate the annihilated the Arabs

954
00:55:37.079 --> 00:55:40.840
<v Speaker 3>with the sword. The people of Austrasia, greater in number

955
00:55:40.880 --> 00:55:46.880
<v Speaker 3>of soldiers and formidably armed, killed the king Algafiki when

956
00:55:46.920 --> 00:55:49.719
<v Speaker 3>they found him, striking him in the chest, but suddenly,

957
00:55:49.800 --> 00:55:52.840
<v Speaker 3>within sight of the countless tints of the Arabs, the

958
00:55:53.039 --> 00:55:58.639
<v Speaker 3>Franks despicably sheathed their swords, postponing the fight until the

959
00:55:58.679 --> 00:56:01.800
<v Speaker 3>next day, since night have fallen during the battle. Rising

960
00:56:01.800 --> 00:56:03.760
<v Speaker 3>from their own camp and dawned, the Europeans saw the

961
00:56:03.760 --> 00:56:07.239
<v Speaker 3>tents and canopies of the Arabs all arranged just as

962
00:56:07.239 --> 00:56:10.119
<v Speaker 3>they appeared the day before, not knowing that they were empty,

963
00:56:10.159 --> 00:56:12.920
<v Speaker 3>thinking that inside them were the Saracen forces ready for battle,

964
00:56:12.960 --> 00:56:16.760
<v Speaker 3>they sent officers to reconnoiter and discovered that all the

965
00:56:16.880 --> 00:56:19.719
<v Speaker 3>troops had left. They had indeed fled silently in the

966
00:56:19.800 --> 00:56:23.119
<v Speaker 3>night in type formation, returning to their own country. That's it.

967
00:56:23.639 --> 00:56:26.000
<v Speaker 3>That's the whole thing, you know, And that's it. So

968
00:56:26.039 --> 00:56:29.760
<v Speaker 3>there's nothing of like this, you know, Like Charles gave

969
00:56:29.800 --> 00:56:32.400
<v Speaker 3>a big stirring speech about how like they had to

970
00:56:32.679 --> 00:56:36.960
<v Speaker 3>rescue European Christendom, which was not a thing then at all,

971
00:56:38.079 --> 00:56:40.679
<v Speaker 3>a thing until the Crusades, at least not the way

972
00:56:40.719 --> 00:56:43.719
<v Speaker 3>we think about it. Actually probably until after the that's

973
00:56:43.760 --> 00:56:47.920
<v Speaker 3>a different story, but you know that was definitely not

974
00:56:47.960 --> 00:56:51.639
<v Speaker 3>a thing at this time. And yeah, it's just, you know,

975
00:56:53.119 --> 00:56:57.960
<v Speaker 3>it's a battle and it happened, and it was important

976
00:56:57.960 --> 00:57:02.119
<v Speaker 3>in the sense that it like stopped this push, and

977
00:57:02.239 --> 00:57:04.800
<v Speaker 3>it was a very large battle, having between forty and

978
00:57:04.880 --> 00:57:09.360
<v Speaker 3>fifty thousand soldiers, and in the early Middle Ages, that

979
00:57:09.559 --> 00:57:13.920
<v Speaker 3>was like that's a lot, a million, a million, but yeah,

980
00:57:14.000 --> 00:57:19.000
<v Speaker 3>like it was, Yeah, it's it's just a battle. And

981
00:57:19.280 --> 00:57:20.960
<v Speaker 3>I think, you know, I don't want you to think

982
00:57:21.000 --> 00:57:22.559
<v Speaker 3>that we're just harping on this to harp on it,

983
00:57:22.599 --> 00:57:25.159
<v Speaker 3>but like it is important, and like people see this

984
00:57:25.280 --> 00:57:29.159
<v Speaker 3>as like some kind of like hinge point in history

985
00:57:29.840 --> 00:57:33.960
<v Speaker 3>for like the turning of this relationship, and it's not

986
00:57:34.119 --> 00:57:37.119
<v Speaker 3>the hit that hinge point is probably the first crusade,

987
00:57:37.199 --> 00:57:45.239
<v Speaker 3>but this is a you know, the entire Deis vault

988
00:57:45.559 --> 00:57:50.360
<v Speaker 3>Opus day, let's redo the crusades thing. Yes, it's obviously

989
00:57:50.360 --> 00:57:52.280
<v Speaker 3>based on their crusades, but it also goes back to

990
00:57:52.320 --> 00:57:55.360
<v Speaker 3>this stuff. And oh, I'm Charles Martell and blah blah blah.

991
00:57:55.400 --> 00:57:57.960
<v Speaker 3>And look, I'll give Martella's credit. He was a good warrior,

992
00:57:58.239 --> 00:58:02.159
<v Speaker 3>he was apparently a good leader, of soldiers. He did

993
00:58:02.199 --> 00:58:05.880
<v Speaker 3>good stuff Martel, which means the Hammer is a fucking

994
00:58:05.960 --> 00:58:11.239
<v Speaker 3>great name. I'll give him that. But you know, yeah

995
00:58:11.280 --> 00:58:13.719
<v Speaker 3>he won and that and it was that, there was

996
00:58:13.800 --> 00:58:15.480
<v Speaker 3>you know, all this other shit.

997
00:58:16.760 --> 00:58:20.559
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, fully, you know, like shout out to Charles the

998
00:58:20.599 --> 00:58:24.800
<v Speaker 1>Hammer Martel. Great sounds sounds like a fucking wrestling name.

999
00:58:24.960 --> 00:58:26.159
<v Speaker 2>Absolutely love it does.

1000
00:58:26.400 --> 00:58:26.920
<v Speaker 3>Yeah it does.

1001
00:58:27.400 --> 00:58:29.440
<v Speaker 2>But you know we have to harp on about it

1002
00:58:29.440 --> 00:58:30.679
<v Speaker 2>because this is so misused.

1003
00:58:31.039 --> 00:58:32.800
<v Speaker 1>You know, this is exactly one of those things where

1004
00:58:32.800 --> 00:58:34.760
<v Speaker 1>it's like massive hinge point and it's like, babe, it

1005
00:58:34.840 --> 00:58:38.599
<v Speaker 1>was a skirmish, right, It was a skirmish between a

1006
00:58:38.719 --> 00:58:43.239
<v Speaker 1>rating party and a better and more equipped force who

1007
00:58:43.280 --> 00:58:45.719
<v Speaker 1>were reinforcing what would be the frontier.

1008
00:58:46.320 --> 00:58:49.719
<v Speaker 2>That's it, and it is you know, useful in.

1009
00:58:49.719 --> 00:58:52.119
<v Speaker 1>Terms of like a dynastic turning point if what we're

1010
00:58:52.159 --> 00:58:54.760
<v Speaker 1>talking about is, well, how does propaganda work? And how

1011
00:58:54.760 --> 00:58:57.519
<v Speaker 1>did these things work? But you should be fundamentally fucking

1012
00:58:57.559 --> 00:59:02.760
<v Speaker 1>embarrassed of yourself as a historian, and if you believe the.

1013
00:59:02.760 --> 00:59:03.679
<v Speaker 2>Proper yid.

1014
00:59:05.960 --> 00:59:09.239
<v Speaker 1>Like that, that's our entire job, our whole last job

1015
00:59:09.599 --> 00:59:11.000
<v Speaker 1>is to be like, yeah, why are they saying this?

1016
00:59:11.079 --> 00:59:11.599
<v Speaker 2>Who said it?

1017
00:59:12.800 --> 00:59:13.079
<v Speaker 3>Yeah?

1018
00:59:13.679 --> 00:59:16.639
<v Speaker 1>And follow the breadcrumb's bag. But if like you're you're

1019
00:59:16.679 --> 00:59:21.440
<v Speaker 1>taking anybody at face value, let alone the fucking Carolingians,

1020
00:59:22.360 --> 00:59:23.719
<v Speaker 1>then babe, I don't know what to tell you.

1021
00:59:24.480 --> 00:59:28.079
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, media studies.

1022
00:59:28.760 --> 00:59:34.280
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, it's you know, not good versus evil, not anything

1023
00:59:34.400 --> 00:59:37.079
<v Speaker 3>like that. It's just you got pushed back past the

1024
00:59:37.119 --> 00:59:40.280
<v Speaker 3>Pyrenees and that's where you stayed. They didn't try to

1025
00:59:40.280 --> 00:59:42.400
<v Speaker 3>push them off the peninsula. They could even if they

1026
00:59:42.400 --> 00:59:47.320
<v Speaker 3>won't even finest wish, he did not have enough soldiers

1027
00:59:47.639 --> 00:59:51.239
<v Speaker 3>to remove all of them, like, and at this point

1028
00:59:51.239 --> 00:59:53.599
<v Speaker 3>they had been in some parts of the peninsula for

1029
00:59:53.960 --> 00:59:58.480
<v Speaker 3>over twenty years. Like it not. You know, that's that's

1030
00:59:58.519 --> 01:00:01.480
<v Speaker 3>an you know, that's an adult lifetime to many too

1031
01:00:01.480 --> 01:00:04.199
<v Speaker 3>many people, you know this time, you know, it's it's not.

1032
01:00:05.000 --> 01:00:08.079
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and I think that it's fundamentally also, that particular

1033
01:00:08.159 --> 01:00:13.039
<v Speaker 1>view just misunderstands how multicultural life was on the peninsula,

1034
01:00:13.079 --> 01:00:15.519
<v Speaker 1>how many Christians there were. And then these Christians are

1035
01:00:15.559 --> 01:00:17.840
<v Speaker 1>not like going to Charles and being like, oh Charles,

1036
01:00:17.840 --> 01:00:20.360
<v Speaker 1>please free us, it's like to go do it. They're

1037
01:00:20.400 --> 01:00:23.639
<v Speaker 1>just like, oh, yeah, whatever, Like these these things don't

1038
01:00:23.679 --> 01:00:28.119
<v Speaker 1>matter to that, you know, like we don't have correspondence

1039
01:00:28.119 --> 01:00:30.400
<v Speaker 1>being like I beg you to break my chains or whatever,

1040
01:00:30.639 --> 01:00:32.800
<v Speaker 1>so you know, and and there would be and we

1041
01:00:32.840 --> 01:00:34.519
<v Speaker 1>would have great sources for work because we have great

1042
01:00:34.559 --> 01:00:37.039
<v Speaker 1>sources from the Iberian Peninsula at this point.

1043
01:00:37.599 --> 01:00:44.119
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, they just don't the all the stuff doesn't add

1044
01:00:44.199 --> 01:00:48.679
<v Speaker 3>up to anything more than a rating party was stopped.

1045
01:00:49.920 --> 01:00:52.639
<v Speaker 3>It was in central France, which is a long way

1046
01:00:52.840 --> 01:00:55.440
<v Speaker 3>like they were a long way north of Bordeaux at

1047
01:00:55.440 --> 01:00:58.920
<v Speaker 3>that point anyway, But like, you know, you're just not

1048
01:00:59.679 --> 01:01:03.159
<v Speaker 3>it's it's not that thing. It's just a battle that

1049
01:01:03.199 --> 01:01:07.119
<v Speaker 3>took place and they lost, and they would win future battles,

1050
01:01:07.239 --> 01:01:12.400
<v Speaker 3>and you know that was that, and yeah, it's the

1051
01:01:13.000 --> 01:01:15.880
<v Speaker 3>thing about it. You know. The stuff that's interesting about

1052
01:01:16.039 --> 01:01:23.960
<v Speaker 3>all of this is just that the way that we

1053
01:01:24.000 --> 01:01:29.000
<v Speaker 3>think about Spain, Spain is a late forming thing, even

1054
01:01:29.280 --> 01:01:33.280
<v Speaker 3>like even in the early modern period. That is, like

1055
01:01:34.119 --> 01:01:39.360
<v Speaker 3>you know, Castilla, Cassias and Aragon and all that sort

1056
01:01:39.400 --> 01:01:43.000
<v Speaker 3>of shit, and they're like different principalities, different kingdoms, and

1057
01:01:43.039 --> 01:01:47.000
<v Speaker 3>eventually they got meshed together. But like that's not a

1058
01:01:47.039 --> 01:01:49.679
<v Speaker 3>thing at this time. And these people weren't yearning to

1059
01:01:49.719 --> 01:01:52.039
<v Speaker 3>be freed from the yoke or whatever. It was just

1060
01:01:54.639 --> 01:01:59.079
<v Speaker 3>they ruled, they doesn't you know, you gotta pay taxes anyway.

1061
01:01:59.119 --> 01:02:02.159
<v Speaker 3>Does it matter if it's a use or a you know,

1062
01:02:02.840 --> 01:02:07.079
<v Speaker 3>tex on X, what's the difference? Who cares? Yeah?

1063
01:02:07.079 --> 01:02:08.480
<v Speaker 1>And I think that if you spend a lot of

1064
01:02:08.559 --> 01:02:12.000
<v Speaker 1>time in Spain now, which I do because I love it,

1065
01:02:12.000 --> 01:02:14.760
<v Speaker 1>it becomes very clear when you go to different regions

1066
01:02:14.800 --> 01:02:18.719
<v Speaker 1>that they're really fucking different, right, Like a Catalonia is

1067
01:02:18.800 --> 01:02:22.960
<v Speaker 1>nothing like castille Leon, which is nothing like you know, Galicia,

1068
01:02:23.119 --> 01:02:25.400
<v Speaker 1>or like, you know, you go to Granada and things

1069
01:02:25.400 --> 01:02:29.679
<v Speaker 1>are just completely different. Again, the accents are really different country.

1070
01:02:29.719 --> 01:02:33.719
<v Speaker 3>They fucking language isolict It is not connected to anything else,

1071
01:02:34.119 --> 01:02:36.599
<v Speaker 3>like to Spanish, what are you like?

1072
01:02:37.079 --> 01:02:41.480
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, they're Celtic. You know they have Yeah, yeah

1073
01:02:41.559 --> 01:02:44.119
<v Speaker 2>you don't you know who fucking longs to be freed

1074
01:02:44.159 --> 01:02:45.159
<v Speaker 2>from the yoke of whatever?

1075
01:02:45.280 --> 01:02:49.960
<v Speaker 1>The Castilians like sorry, the Catalonians and the Basque and

1076
01:02:50.039 --> 01:02:52.960
<v Speaker 1>the Basque want the fuck out, like they're like, I'm

1077
01:02:53.000 --> 01:02:55.920
<v Speaker 1>not Spanish hello. So you know, like all of these

1078
01:02:56.000 --> 01:02:59.760
<v Speaker 1>ideas are so modern where it's like none of them

1079
01:03:00.719 --> 01:03:03.920
<v Speaker 1>how you know this idea or this wish you know,

1080
01:03:04.039 --> 01:03:06.440
<v Speaker 1>like you know, go to Barcelona right now and ask,

1081
01:03:06.800 --> 01:03:09.360
<v Speaker 1>you know, an actual Catalonian what they fucking think of

1082
01:03:09.400 --> 01:03:12.719
<v Speaker 1>Spain and you know, get ready for them to like

1083
01:03:12.840 --> 01:03:13.760
<v Speaker 1>go there to tell.

1084
01:03:13.639 --> 01:03:17.119
<v Speaker 3>You how much it's just a continuation of uh, Franco's

1085
01:03:17.199 --> 01:03:20.079
<v Speaker 3>bullshit and all that. And I mean then some a

1086
01:03:20.079 --> 01:03:22.079
<v Speaker 3>lot of ways it is there some ways at least

1087
01:03:22.079 --> 01:03:26.079
<v Speaker 3>I know, but like, yeah, they don't. It's not a

1088
01:03:26.159 --> 01:03:29.239
<v Speaker 3>you like if you think like people in America talk

1089
01:03:29.239 --> 01:03:32.159
<v Speaker 3>about secession like ho ho, Texas is going to succeed

1090
01:03:32.320 --> 01:03:38.480
<v Speaker 3>or whatever. Like no, they the Catalans and the Basque

1091
01:03:38.599 --> 01:03:43.079
<v Speaker 3>people's they are like, dear EU, please let us hold

1092
01:03:43.159 --> 01:03:47.800
<v Speaker 3>sovereignty referendum on this, and the and the EU is

1093
01:03:47.840 --> 01:03:49.199
<v Speaker 3>being cross.

1094
01:03:49.679 --> 01:03:49.840
<v Speaker 4>Uh.

1095
01:03:51.519 --> 01:03:53.480
<v Speaker 3>Other people are talking to you and they're being like,

1096
01:03:54.119 --> 01:03:56.960
<v Speaker 3>don't do that, because that's gonna get like because if

1097
01:03:57.199 --> 01:04:02.960
<v Speaker 3>that happens, an idea and like you're gonna and uh, you.

1098
01:04:02.920 --> 01:04:05.840
<v Speaker 1>Know, Breton like the Brittany's probably got a guy like

1099
01:04:05.920 --> 01:04:07.760
<v Speaker 1>the Breton Brittany.

1100
01:04:08.159 --> 01:04:11.320
<v Speaker 3>How how many German states are just gonna be like

1101
01:04:11.440 --> 01:04:14.519
<v Speaker 3>I don't know about all this, dog I'm good, you know,

1102
01:04:14.559 --> 01:04:22.400
<v Speaker 3>like it's yeah, yeah, it's yeah, it's you know, it's

1103
01:04:22.760 --> 01:04:26.840
<v Speaker 3>a fine and weird place. Spain as like a corporeal entity.

1104
01:04:26.920 --> 01:04:30.400
<v Speaker 3>Exists for like, I don't know, it's still around I

1105
01:04:30.400 --> 01:04:32.719
<v Speaker 3>guess like five hundred or so years, but everybody's been

1106
01:04:32.760 --> 01:04:33.440
<v Speaker 3>trying to leave it.

1107
01:04:33.920 --> 01:04:35.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, like can I go now?

1108
01:04:37.960 --> 01:04:48.119
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Surprisingly, though after the Battle of Tours, you know it, Uh,

1109
01:04:48.159 --> 01:04:51.079
<v Speaker 3>it turns a little it gets a little chill for

1110
01:04:51.079 --> 01:04:55.079
<v Speaker 3>for a while. In seven thirty five, the Umians did

1111
01:04:55.119 --> 01:04:59.719
<v Speaker 3>push a little farther north of Narbonne to Oral. Uh.

1112
01:05:00.000 --> 01:05:03.199
<v Speaker 3>But they're going to lose all of that shortly anyway,

1113
01:05:03.360 --> 01:05:07.960
<v Speaker 3>due to a big thing that happens not anywhere near Spain.

1114
01:05:08.079 --> 01:05:15.239
<v Speaker 3>But yeah, in in later on, around like seven forty,

1115
01:05:15.360 --> 01:05:19.320
<v Speaker 3>the Berbers there's a Berber revolt in North Africa and

1116
01:05:19.360 --> 01:05:26.679
<v Speaker 3>that extended up into Iberia, and the Berber rebels in

1117
01:05:26.719 --> 01:05:29.159
<v Speaker 3>North Africa were able to kind of carve something out

1118
01:05:29.199 --> 01:05:35.159
<v Speaker 3>for them, but the Umids put down the ones in Iberia.

1119
01:05:35.360 --> 01:05:39.800
<v Speaker 3>But things started to break up because the wider Umid

1120
01:05:39.880 --> 01:05:47.320
<v Speaker 3>Califate was not doing so great, and by seven two

1121
01:05:48.000 --> 01:05:55.360
<v Speaker 3>Alandulous starts to break apart into some smaller competing states

1122
01:05:55.360 --> 01:06:01.480
<v Speaker 3>and fiefdoms, though they were still Muslim in character. But yeah,

1123
01:06:01.880 --> 01:06:07.320
<v Speaker 3>about this time, perhaps unsurprisingly, it's really hard to administer

1124
01:06:07.480 --> 01:06:12.239
<v Speaker 3>the seventh largest land empire in history in the eighth century.

1125
01:06:12.320 --> 01:06:15.960
<v Speaker 3>That's not a very easy thing to do, especially when

1126
01:06:15.960 --> 01:06:18.639
<v Speaker 3>it spread out over such a vast distance. It's not like,

1127
01:06:18.800 --> 01:06:20.320
<v Speaker 3>you know, if you were in China where you could

1128
01:06:20.320 --> 01:06:24.119
<v Speaker 3>control like you know, it's not it's not technically the

1129
01:06:24.119 --> 01:06:30.480
<v Speaker 3>same thing. So the Umids, uh, man, it's uh, they

1130
01:06:30.519 --> 01:06:32.559
<v Speaker 3>just fall apart. And when they fall apart, they fall

1131
01:06:32.599 --> 01:06:37.719
<v Speaker 3>apart fucking hard. What what happened to the Umids? Why

1132
01:06:37.960 --> 01:06:40.559
<v Speaker 3>why couldn't they Well.

1133
01:06:40.840 --> 01:06:44.119
<v Speaker 1>So what happens with the Ubiids is, uh, they be

1134
01:06:44.199 --> 01:06:48.079
<v Speaker 1>living too high on the hog. They were very busy

1135
01:06:48.239 --> 01:06:49.559
<v Speaker 1>being fancy little lads.

1136
01:06:49.599 --> 01:06:49.760
<v Speaker 2>You know.

1137
01:06:49.840 --> 01:06:52.719
<v Speaker 1>Last time we talked about how the real plum jobs

1138
01:06:52.719 --> 01:06:55.280
<v Speaker 1>are given to their cousins, you know, and and they're

1139
01:06:55.320 --> 01:06:57.239
<v Speaker 1>really spending a bunch of time trying to keep it

1140
01:06:57.239 --> 01:06:59.079
<v Speaker 1>in the family. And the reason they're keeping it in

1141
01:06:59.079 --> 01:07:04.679
<v Speaker 1>the families they're wealthy and they enjoy being fancy and

1142
01:07:04.760 --> 01:07:08.679
<v Speaker 1>having a bath and eating a fig and like what's

1143
01:07:08.679 --> 01:07:12.440
<v Speaker 1>over there. And so when we have the Berber revolts,

1144
01:07:12.440 --> 01:07:15.559
<v Speaker 1>this is like the first symptom where what the Berbers

1145
01:07:15.599 --> 01:07:19.760
<v Speaker 1>are saying when they do this is you are insufficiently pious.

1146
01:07:20.320 --> 01:07:22.119
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, you like.

1147
01:07:22.199 --> 01:07:23.800
<v Speaker 2>You be drinking.

1148
01:07:24.639 --> 01:07:28.840
<v Speaker 1>You are, you know, just not actually caring that much

1149
01:07:29.000 --> 01:07:33.760
<v Speaker 1>about the tenants of Islam. And you are oppressing all

1150
01:07:33.800 --> 01:07:35.480
<v Speaker 1>of us and like taking our taxes and you're not

1151
01:07:35.519 --> 01:07:37.360
<v Speaker 1>you're not giving back what we need. So right, Like

1152
01:07:37.400 --> 01:07:41.880
<v Speaker 1>that's that's something the Berbers are saying. Meanwhile, back on

1153
01:07:42.039 --> 01:07:46.800
<v Speaker 1>the Arabian Peninsula, there are a group called the Abbasids

1154
01:07:47.039 --> 01:07:50.519
<v Speaker 1>who heartily agree with this, right, and they're they're jumping

1155
01:07:50.519 --> 01:07:56.280
<v Speaker 1>on the back wagon, right. And the Abasids are coming

1156
01:07:56.320 --> 01:08:02.079
<v Speaker 1>to us via the prophet Muhammad's uncle and that is

1157
01:08:02.360 --> 01:08:04.119
<v Speaker 1>who they are coming out of. So they've got like

1158
01:08:04.159 --> 01:08:06.639
<v Speaker 1>a nice pedigree to them as well, so they can

1159
01:08:06.639 --> 01:08:09.679
<v Speaker 1>trace themselves back to the prophet brilliant great And right

1160
01:08:09.840 --> 01:08:12.920
<v Speaker 1>after the Berber revolts, they're like, can we do that?

1161
01:08:14.639 --> 01:08:16.560
<v Speaker 3>Oh shit, okay, right, and.

1162
01:08:16.560 --> 01:08:18.479
<v Speaker 2>So and they go in on it.

1163
01:08:19.239 --> 01:08:26.159
<v Speaker 1>And in particular they are really able to exploit the

1164
01:08:26.800 --> 01:08:32.319
<v Speaker 1>discontent with the Umiads on the peninsula. Like in particular,

1165
01:08:32.399 --> 01:08:34.520
<v Speaker 1>they're drawing from the heartlands, you know, they they are

1166
01:08:34.640 --> 01:08:38.159
<v Speaker 1>kind of like a drawing in you know, kind of

1167
01:08:38.239 --> 01:08:40.760
<v Speaker 1>like Iran places like that. And everyone is like, yeah,

1168
01:08:40.760 --> 01:08:43.600
<v Speaker 1>I think that. I think homeboys are too big for

1169
01:08:43.640 --> 01:08:48.119
<v Speaker 1>their breeches, and a lot of people agree with them.

1170
01:08:48.279 --> 01:08:49.279
<v Speaker 2>A lot of people agree with them.

1171
01:08:49.279 --> 01:08:51.560
<v Speaker 1>They're like, yeah, okay, like whatever, let's like let's let's

1172
01:08:51.640 --> 01:08:54.520
<v Speaker 1>topple these guys. And the other thing that the Abysins

1173
01:08:54.560 --> 01:08:56.560
<v Speaker 1>do really well is they go to all the non

1174
01:08:56.640 --> 01:08:59.840
<v Speaker 1>believers and they're like, damn, doesn't it suck how you're

1175
01:08:59.880 --> 01:09:03.319
<v Speaker 1>like a second class citizen but your parents around here,

1176
01:09:03.640 --> 01:09:05.800
<v Speaker 1>and like people are like, damn, yeah, that does suck.

1177
01:09:07.359 --> 01:09:09.520
<v Speaker 1>I would like to not be a second class citizen.

1178
01:09:09.560 --> 01:09:12.439
<v Speaker 1>So you get the non believers on board as well,

1179
01:09:13.159 --> 01:09:21.000
<v Speaker 1>which is absolutely key to such an incredibly disparate empire. Right, So,

1180
01:09:21.560 --> 01:09:23.199
<v Speaker 1>and they just fall over like a deck of cards.

1181
01:09:23.199 --> 01:09:30.119
<v Speaker 1>Now again, like as we were saying about the physicals

1182
01:09:30.359 --> 01:09:34.159
<v Speaker 1>in Spain, this is partially showing us like how well

1183
01:09:34.199 --> 01:09:37.119
<v Speaker 1>administered they actually were, because you just like blow and

1184
01:09:37.199 --> 01:09:39.119
<v Speaker 1>the house of card falls over. Ye you know, I

1185
01:09:39.119 --> 01:09:40.960
<v Speaker 1>guess it's just like oh, yeah, like you needed all

1186
01:09:41.000 --> 01:09:44.640
<v Speaker 1>those bits to work, and it's still really well centralized.

1187
01:09:45.560 --> 01:09:50.800
<v Speaker 1>But yeah, it's just kind of about dissconnect there where

1188
01:09:51.159 --> 01:09:54.319
<v Speaker 1>people from the Muslim side don't like that they're not

1189
01:09:55.119 --> 01:09:57.640
<v Speaker 1>Muslim enough, and people from the non believer side don't

1190
01:09:57.680 --> 01:10:02.520
<v Speaker 1>like how they are basically treated as completely second class.

1191
01:10:02.640 --> 01:10:06.960
<v Speaker 1>So yeah, they just go pop out in the Middle

1192
01:10:07.000 --> 01:10:11.159
<v Speaker 1>East and you know, largely across the coast of Africa

1193
01:10:11.199 --> 01:10:11.560
<v Speaker 1>as well.

1194
01:10:12.399 --> 01:10:18.880
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, they the unions. Man, they really thought they were

1195
01:10:18.880 --> 01:10:22.680
<v Speaker 3>something special and that they were the only ones, and

1196
01:10:23.439 --> 01:10:27.039
<v Speaker 3>that wrinkled a lot of people. Plus like, how are

1197
01:10:27.079 --> 01:10:29.720
<v Speaker 3>they ever going to keep control of the fucking like,

1198
01:10:29.840 --> 01:10:34.159
<v Speaker 3>how are you going to control of berbers in Morocco

1199
01:10:34.359 --> 01:10:38.800
<v Speaker 3>in Tunis in the year like seven forty, How are

1200
01:10:38.840 --> 01:10:40.439
<v Speaker 3>you going to do that? You do not have enough

1201
01:10:40.439 --> 01:10:43.800
<v Speaker 3>people to form a giant land army and an ultra

1202
01:10:43.920 --> 01:10:46.960
<v Speaker 3>giant fleet to go over like it's not like you

1203
01:10:47.119 --> 01:10:51.479
<v Speaker 3>just don't have that. And you know, they, I mean,

1204
01:10:51.720 --> 01:10:55.119
<v Speaker 3>they found out a hard lesson that many others found out,

1205
01:10:55.159 --> 01:10:58.960
<v Speaker 3>which is that regardless of what you do in Anatolia

1206
01:10:59.000 --> 01:11:00.960
<v Speaker 3>and how much you kind of burn it and everything,

1207
01:11:02.840 --> 01:11:06.520
<v Speaker 3>those walls in Contantinople, you cannot get via them, like

1208
01:11:06.560 --> 01:11:09.439
<v Speaker 3>you can't. And so they like kind of rantacked their

1209
01:11:09.439 --> 01:11:11.520
<v Speaker 3>Anatolia and got to the walls and were like fuck.

1210
01:11:11.560 --> 01:11:14.000
<v Speaker 3>And then they immediately got pushed out of Anatolia again.

1211
01:11:15.199 --> 01:11:16.760
<v Speaker 2>And that's where they were putting all their energy.

1212
01:11:16.800 --> 01:11:18.640
<v Speaker 1>They were putting all their energy into, like let's go

1213
01:11:18.680 --> 01:11:19.960
<v Speaker 1>fuck with Constantinople.

1214
01:11:20.239 --> 01:11:22.479
<v Speaker 2>And it's like, maybe, why don't you just like keep

1215
01:11:22.880 --> 01:11:26.039
<v Speaker 2>people happy? And they didn't want to. But that's you know,

1216
01:11:26.159 --> 01:11:28.239
<v Speaker 2>Empires their expansionist by nature.

1217
01:11:28.479 --> 01:11:35.439
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, yeah, and I mean the uh, the the Abbosid

1218
01:11:35.520 --> 01:11:41.239
<v Speaker 3>Caliphate is just it's just a slightly smaller version of

1219
01:11:41.520 --> 01:11:47.119
<v Speaker 3>the Umids. And they start to take over in about

1220
01:11:47.159 --> 01:11:55.319
<v Speaker 3>seven fifty and they are going to rule lands throughout

1221
01:11:55.359 --> 01:11:59.760
<v Speaker 3>the Middle East, North Africa, and West Asia until twelve

1222
01:12:00.640 --> 01:12:07.159
<v Speaker 3>when the Mongols when he ron when Laku comes through

1223
01:12:07.279 --> 01:12:13.680
<v Speaker 3>the Mongols and just sieges and decimates bag Dad. But yeah,

1224
01:12:13.920 --> 01:12:21.319
<v Speaker 3>it's Sia uh siya Umid's They there was a huge

1225
01:12:21.439 --> 01:12:25.920
<v Speaker 3>purge at the end and they thought they got everyone,

1226
01:12:26.079 --> 01:12:28.039
<v Speaker 3>but there was you know, there was just one guy.

1227
01:12:28.840 --> 01:12:33.600
<v Speaker 3>Just one guy escaped and he was like fuck that shit.

1228
01:12:33.760 --> 01:12:36.119
<v Speaker 3>I do not want to die. I do not want

1229
01:12:36.359 --> 01:12:38.399
<v Speaker 3>to uh. I don't want to go out like that.

1230
01:12:39.600 --> 01:12:46.319
<v Speaker 3>And he took uh, you know, he secreted himself across

1231
01:12:46.359 --> 01:12:51.439
<v Speaker 3>the Mediterranean. His name was Abdu r Robin. The first

1232
01:12:52.399 --> 01:12:57.319
<v Speaker 3>he fled and uh he landed in Spain with his

1233
01:12:57.439 --> 01:13:02.760
<v Speaker 3>followers drummed up some more follows, defeated the leader of

1234
01:13:04.279 --> 01:13:08.960
<v Speaker 3>the small Emirate of Cordeba at the time, and over

1235
01:13:09.000 --> 01:13:14.600
<v Speaker 3>the next twenty five years, proceeded to unify Iberia after

1236
01:13:14.640 --> 01:13:17.439
<v Speaker 3>they've broken out into the competing fiefdom. So there's one

1237
01:13:17.439 --> 01:13:22.800
<v Speaker 3>in like Barcelona, Cordoba, I think zaragosas something like that.

1238
01:13:22.840 --> 01:13:27.640
<v Speaker 3>There were more and they he rolled them up over

1239
01:13:27.680 --> 01:13:32.840
<v Speaker 3>twenty five years and established the Umid state of Cordobo,

1240
01:13:32.960 --> 01:13:38.439
<v Speaker 3>which lasted from seven fifty six to ten thirty one.

1241
01:13:38.800 --> 01:13:41.439
<v Speaker 3>And yeah, they got.

1242
01:13:41.399 --> 01:13:44.399
<v Speaker 1>It, did because they theyave it the Mosquita and we

1243
01:13:44.479 --> 01:13:45.720
<v Speaker 1>love the Mosquito folks.

1244
01:13:45.840 --> 01:13:51.840
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, yeah, it gave us. You know, it's funny that

1245
01:13:51.880 --> 01:13:57.479
<v Speaker 3>they just like turn these negative they just turned these

1246
01:13:57.520 --> 01:14:02.319
<v Speaker 3>negative externalities into to this thing, and the Umids look

1247
01:14:02.399 --> 01:14:04.640
<v Speaker 3>like they're all but lost. And then like it's some

1248
01:14:04.720 --> 01:14:10.600
<v Speaker 3>fucking movie. The last son who was stuffed out of

1249
01:14:10.680 --> 01:14:13.840
<v Speaker 3>the palace in like a box. I don't know if

1250
01:14:13.840 --> 01:14:17.039
<v Speaker 3>that's true, but like whatever, and they shoved him on

1251
01:14:17.079 --> 01:14:20.520
<v Speaker 3>a boat. He goes lands in Spain in the last place,

1252
01:14:20.840 --> 01:14:24.039
<v Speaker 3>like the farthest place away where the abbassets can't really

1253
01:14:24.079 --> 01:14:29.760
<v Speaker 3>attack him, and takes over Iberia in twenty five years,

1254
01:14:30.199 --> 01:14:33.880
<v Speaker 3>and even with all that upheaval, even with the Yumid

1255
01:14:33.920 --> 01:14:38.159
<v Speaker 3>stick breaking into constituent parts for a while, none of

1256
01:14:38.159 --> 01:14:40.000
<v Speaker 3>the Christians tried to push them off the.

1257
01:14:41.399 --> 01:14:42.199
<v Speaker 2>They don't care.

1258
01:14:42.640 --> 01:14:43.479
<v Speaker 3>They didn't care.

1259
01:14:43.640 --> 01:14:44.479
<v Speaker 2>That was the point.

1260
01:14:44.880 --> 01:14:49.680
<v Speaker 3>The whole point is that at this point, if they care,

1261
01:14:49.760 --> 01:14:52.319
<v Speaker 3>they don't care enough to actively do anything about it.

1262
01:14:54.640 --> 01:14:57.079
<v Speaker 3>So it's like a minor nuisance where they just didn't

1263
01:14:57.079 --> 01:14:59.640
<v Speaker 3>care at all. Now that were there people in Asterias

1264
01:14:59.640 --> 01:15:02.560
<v Speaker 3>who care, clearly, and I'm sure there were. I'm sure

1265
01:15:02.560 --> 01:15:06.640
<v Speaker 3>there are people in South Francia who definitely cared as well,

1266
01:15:06.680 --> 01:15:12.720
<v Speaker 3>but didn't really matter. Uh, yeah, they did eventually. I

1267
01:15:12.720 --> 01:15:15.720
<v Speaker 3>think when was it. It was a couple of you.

1268
01:15:16.399 --> 01:15:22.399
<v Speaker 3>It was just after the Umi state of Cordoba was

1269
01:15:22.439 --> 01:15:27.640
<v Speaker 3>set up. They lost narbone narbone, and so they were

1270
01:15:27.640 --> 01:15:29.760
<v Speaker 3>fully pushed south of the Pyrenees. Yeah, that was its Sep.

1271
01:15:29.840 --> 01:15:33.960
<v Speaker 3>Fifty nine, So you know, from that point on, it's

1272
01:15:34.159 --> 01:15:38.319
<v Speaker 3>just south of the Pyrenees. And now we get to

1273
01:15:38.319 --> 01:15:41.960
<v Speaker 3>see how long they can hold onto this, because while

1274
01:15:42.000 --> 01:15:47.560
<v Speaker 3>it's not a thing right now, the first precursor crusade

1275
01:15:47.560 --> 01:15:51.079
<v Speaker 3>events are going to be called down on these people

1276
01:15:52.359 --> 01:15:54.720
<v Speaker 3>in the eleventh century, So hey.

1277
01:15:54.640 --> 01:15:57.640
<v Speaker 2>Check this out they lost their narbone or.

1278
01:16:00.279 --> 01:16:04.319
<v Speaker 1>Yes, yes, I'm a public intellectual.

1279
01:16:04.760 --> 01:16:05.520
<v Speaker 3>I love it.

1280
01:16:05.640 --> 01:16:12.279
<v Speaker 6>Yeah, yeah, oh yeah, folks. As we said, I'm gonna

1281
01:16:12.319 --> 01:16:15.319
<v Speaker 6>take I'm gonna start moving a bit faster with things

1282
01:16:15.359 --> 01:16:19.159
<v Speaker 6>the next time. But yeah, we wanted to talk about

1283
01:16:19.159 --> 01:16:24.680
<v Speaker 6>this because yeah, it's neat and it's also funny that

1284
01:16:26.039 --> 01:16:29.680
<v Speaker 6>the It's very funny to me that the contemporary scholars

1285
01:16:29.760 --> 01:16:33.920
<v Speaker 6>and the postmodern scholars completely agree, and basically everyone in

1286
01:16:33.960 --> 01:16:38.359
<v Speaker 6>between who's not a specific Muslim scholar is like, oh, yeah,

1287
01:16:38.359 --> 01:16:41.119
<v Speaker 6>this is a civilizational thing, you know, like the battle

1288
01:16:41.159 --> 01:16:42.520
<v Speaker 6>of good versus evil.

1289
01:16:43.000 --> 01:16:45.119
<v Speaker 1>Man Like, I guess it looks like that if you

1290
01:16:45.199 --> 01:16:46.399
<v Speaker 1>never read a fucking book.

1291
01:16:46.720 --> 01:16:51.880
<v Speaker 3>Some fucking monk is like, yeah, they fought. Charles Martel's

1292
01:16:51.920 --> 01:16:56.960
<v Speaker 3>a dick in Odo cool, Like we kind of like Odo,

1293
01:16:57.159 --> 01:16:59.000
<v Speaker 3>I do. I think he's very interesting. That's why I

1294
01:16:59.000 --> 01:17:02.000
<v Speaker 3>wrote the intro about him, because I just find like,

1295
01:17:02.039 --> 01:17:05.800
<v Speaker 3>he's like cool, I'm gonna allie with them. Oh fuck

1296
01:17:06.119 --> 01:17:08.720
<v Speaker 3>the guy I allied with his idiot. Oh fuck, they

1297
01:17:08.760 --> 01:17:10.800
<v Speaker 3>took my daughter into a harem of.

1298
01:17:13.039 --> 01:17:15.279
<v Speaker 2>Oh there's the reason why he gets to be at

1299
01:17:15.279 --> 01:17:17.279
<v Speaker 2>the great that's all that is true.

1300
01:17:18.439 --> 01:17:22.319
<v Speaker 3>Hmmm, that is true. I like uh. I like Odo

1301
01:17:22.359 --> 01:17:27.159
<v Speaker 3>though uh he abdicated when into a monastery, which I

1302
01:17:27.199 --> 01:17:30.920
<v Speaker 3>always think is a fun way for people to And yeah,

1303
01:17:30.960 --> 01:17:32.760
<v Speaker 3>as I said, next time we'll be back. We'll talk

1304
01:17:32.800 --> 01:17:36.600
<v Speaker 3>about the rest of the Umiad state of Cordova and

1305
01:17:36.680 --> 01:17:40.199
<v Speaker 3>all that. And then uh, when this kind of does

1306
01:17:40.279 --> 01:17:43.000
<v Speaker 3>start to become in a European Christendom thing and they

1307
01:17:43.039 --> 01:17:46.920
<v Speaker 3>start getting old, up jumped and up aty about these things,

1308
01:17:48.039 --> 01:17:53.560
<v Speaker 3>but yeah, we'll get uh, we'll get to that, Eleanor

1309
01:17:54.319 --> 01:17:55.439
<v Speaker 3>what's going on with you?

1310
01:17:56.079 --> 01:17:58.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean at the minute, not much checked me

1311
01:17:59.039 --> 01:18:02.079
<v Speaker 1>out on the social at going medieval. I made a

1312
01:18:02.079 --> 01:18:04.680
<v Speaker 1>good and Or joke last night, and I'm very proud. Yeah,

1313
01:18:05.840 --> 01:18:08.600
<v Speaker 1>very you know, special interest overlap. I think you should

1314
01:18:08.640 --> 01:18:09.359
<v Speaker 1>leave an and.

1315
01:18:09.439 --> 01:18:10.920
<v Speaker 2>Or together at last.

1316
01:18:12.399 --> 01:18:14.079
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but you know, I got a lot of things

1317
01:18:14.119 --> 01:18:16.119
<v Speaker 1>in the work, none of which have come to the fruition.

1318
01:18:16.359 --> 01:18:18.640
<v Speaker 1>But if you follow me on the socials, you can

1319
01:18:19.239 --> 01:18:22.199
<v Speaker 1>see there when they come out. So yeah, that's a

1320
01:18:22.199 --> 01:18:22.840
<v Speaker 1>smart thing to do.

1321
01:18:23.720 --> 01:18:27.079
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Yeah, you can find me on the social media.

1322
01:18:27.680 --> 01:18:31.239
<v Speaker 3>Luca's amazing. You can find my old show about Star

1323
01:18:31.239 --> 01:18:34.239
<v Speaker 3>Wars called A People's History of the Old Republic. If

1324
01:18:34.239 --> 01:18:36.600
<v Speaker 3>you want to check that out and hear me gap.

1325
01:18:36.720 --> 01:18:39.600
<v Speaker 3>You can listen to it wherever you're listening to this otherwise.

1326
01:18:39.920 --> 01:18:42.359
<v Speaker 3>Thank y'all so much and we'll see you next time.

1327
01:18:43.119 --> 01:18:43.640
<v Speaker 5>By
