Speaker 1: Big food and be on.
Speaker 2: With Cliff and Bobo.
Speaker 1: These guys are your favorites, so like say subscribe and
Speaker 1: raid it live.
Speaker 2: Stock and me.
Speaker 1: The Greatest One yesterday and listening watching lim always keep
Speaker 1: it squatching. And now you're hosts Cliff Berrickman and James
Speaker 1: Bubo Fay.
Speaker 2: Hello Cliff, Hello, Bobo. How you doing?
Speaker 3: Man? Good? How's gonna do?
Speaker 2: It's going all right? I'm tired. I'm tired, but generally good,
Speaker 2: generally good. And Matt, you're on the call, aren't you.
Speaker 2: I'm here, very good, glad you're here as well. Yeah, Bobs,
Speaker 2: I'm pretty tired. Just got back from cryptid Con. Great gig.
Speaker 2: Of course everybody was asking where you are? Oh and Bobo.
Speaker 2: That just I got to fulfill my obligation. You know,
Speaker 2: I was at cryptid Con for the last five days.
Speaker 2: Matt Prue was there, a great event. We'll talk about
Speaker 2: that for a while, kind of catch up on how
Speaker 2: things are going.
Speaker 3: But I got to.
Speaker 2: Fulfill my obligation about thirty thirty five people that you
Speaker 2: don't know, may or may not remember, want me to
Speaker 2: say hi to you for them specifically.
Speaker 3: Consider it done and tell them hello for me back.
Speaker 2: There you go, everybody who I said that, all you
Speaker 2: people who said out of Bobo for me, I just did.
Speaker 2: There's proof right there, and of course Bobo remembers each
Speaker 2: and every one of you individually.
Speaker 1: I also have a T shirt for you, Bobo from
Speaker 1: a fan and a listener are a good friend fan
Speaker 1: Mike Madden. Oh yeah, cool, So we got to figure
Speaker 1: out how to get this T shirt your way.
Speaker 2: You just have a p O box.
Speaker 1: Well, I'm hoping I'll be seeing him in a month
Speaker 1: and a half, so we'll see. We won't we won't
Speaker 1: promise anything for the listeners yet, but that sure would
Speaker 1: be nice.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, that's right.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, any chance you're coming up to Squatch Fest, man,
Speaker 2: I mean you can come. You can help me in
Speaker 2: my booth.
Speaker 3: January.
Speaker 2: Oh, it's like the last weekend in January. We have
Speaker 2: an announce at or anything. But I don't care if
Speaker 2: Matt puts it in the podcast here, but we're planning
Speaker 2: on Matt Prut coming down and doing an event at
Speaker 2: the Music the Thursday before. I'll open that up for
Speaker 2: museum members first, and if there are any tickets left,
Speaker 2: I'll open it up for podcast members afterwards, and then
Speaker 2: that'd be Thursday night and then Friday we'll I'll skip
Speaker 2: up the squatch fest. So it'd be great to have
Speaker 2: you in tow awesome.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I wanted to get up there next week. I
Speaker 3: got some bad news the other night. Laverne, my friend
Speaker 3: from Quinnall Drive, the oly woman, that maybe all the
Speaker 3: info and squatches she passed away.
Speaker 2: Oh no, yeah, oh no, I'm sorry to hear that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, they're having services in a couple of weeks. Yas bomb.
Speaker 3: But I couldn't sleep that it too well. But I
Speaker 3: was like thinking about because she lived with her great
Speaker 3: grand her granddaughter and son in law or her grandson
Speaker 3: in law has eight kids and they lived together there
Speaker 3: in Queets and the I never really get out too
Speaker 3: much info w I don't. I just kind of talk
Speaker 3: about her vaguely, you know, like yeah, because I don't
Speaker 3: want people go because when I kind of talked about
Speaker 3: her a lot at first, she had some people drop
Speaker 3: in like just un announced, like people she never met.
Speaker 3: There were big fingers her be talking about her and
Speaker 3: just SHI talked to her, and she wasn't into it.
Speaker 3: So I was always pretty vague, but I think she was.
Speaker 3: I think she was eighty two eighty three something. But
Speaker 3: those kids, I was thinking, like they might not realize
Speaker 3: it now when they get over, it'll be like they
Speaker 3: had a you know, direct link to the old school
Speaker 3: because she was, you know, she grew up. She's like that,
Speaker 3: you know, like the last of that generation I could,
Speaker 3: you know, like taking the boarding schools and grew up
Speaker 3: pretty traditionally, you like, you know, at the end up
Speaker 3: like during World War two, you know, like there was
Speaker 3: not much out there, like they didn't have electricity and
Speaker 3: stuff like that. So she passed on a lot of
Speaker 3: knowledge with the great grandkids.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, shoot, man, that that sucks, man, But you know,
Speaker 2: hopefully she's on the bigger and better things, you know.
Speaker 3: Oh, for sure, she's definitely going where the good people go. Yeah,
Speaker 3: she was. She was a special lady for sure. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I met her once when you you and I were
Speaker 2: up there for something or other and I met her.
Speaker 2: I remember, just briefly said hello to her and shook
Speaker 2: her hand or something like that, if I remember right,
Speaker 2: and said that I heard a lot of good things
Speaker 2: about her, But you have to spend some real quality
Speaker 2: time with her. So that's really neat that you had
Speaker 2: an opportunity to learn like from the source about bigfoots
Speaker 2: and some of the cultural items that they have up there.
Speaker 3: I've said it before, but her husband's family was like
Speaker 3: the family the Sasquatch family for the tribe up there,
Speaker 3: Like they're the ones that held the traditional knowledge for
Speaker 3: the tribe, like all the gathered info. Like they had
Speaker 3: like you know, salmon people, people that knew everything about salmon,
Speaker 3: and like when they were young, they treat them like
Speaker 3: everything about deer or elk or bear whatever, you know,
Speaker 3: where the honey was or whatever. It was. Like they
Speaker 3: had certain families that you know, really focused on like
Speaker 3: you know, all the all the guys that aren't hunting
Speaker 3: and tracking and fishing and like they all learned that,
Speaker 3: but there's like certain things they would concentrate on, like
Speaker 3: this is our family definitely is like this is what
Speaker 3: we're getting master. Yeah, she she had a lot of info,
Speaker 3: and she was really shy and she kind of I
Speaker 3: didn't really realize it at the time, but she you know,
Speaker 3: she get out there in the Reds and Little Seene
Speaker 3: village her whole life. She was pretty uncomfortble get around
Speaker 3: like whiteoplesial people with like credentials like other credentials standards
Speaker 3: like Meldrum and John Bindernagal and she just clammed up.
Speaker 3: You know, she was really shy, and she's why do
Speaker 3: they want to talk to me that, you know they
Speaker 3: were fancy, you know, professors, And I'm like, no, they
Speaker 3: want to know what you know on this subject. They
Speaker 3: want to they want to know it. She I tried
Speaker 3: to get her to talk about you just usually kind
Speaker 3: of clam up a little bit.
Speaker 2: It's unfortunate that we've lost her, of course, and you're
Speaker 2: lucky to have known her, as as is true of
Speaker 2: all great people who pass. Of course. I guess we
Speaker 2: just keep her in our thoughts through some way. I'm
Speaker 2: not sure what to do about that, except for be thankful,
Speaker 2: I suppose, instead of grieving, perhaps be thankful for the
Speaker 2: role she played in your life. And Bob correct me
Speaker 2: if I'm wrong, But isn't she the one that basically
Speaker 2: told you exactly where and when the ghost someplace to
Speaker 2: see a SaaS Quah?
Speaker 3: And she was right, yep, the second BFR expedition back
Speaker 3: in August two thousand and four. She told me because
Speaker 3: I heard about her from for a couple of years.
Speaker 3: Then I finally I was talking to someone of the
Speaker 3: trading posts there as her grandson and you and I
Speaker 3: was saying like, yeah, you know, looking for information. I
Speaker 3: want to talk to me when I can, like the elders,
Speaker 3: you know. And after a couple of years of stop
Speaker 3: and bothering and you know, talking to the people, he
Speaker 3: got I gave him ten bucks and you let me
Speaker 3: go talk to his grandma. That's when I met her,
Speaker 3: and and it was you know, it was kind of
Speaker 3: a little awkward at first because she was real, real shy,
Speaker 3: and I wouldn't say much, but I just every time
Speaker 3: I get like, uh, when I was up there, i'd
Speaker 3: stop buy him, like you know, just you know trudial,
Speaker 3: like especially among their culture. You don't show up at
Speaker 3: the handy, you know, you ship with like you know,
Speaker 3: like angel food cake or a box of cookies or
Speaker 3: a thing, you know, something you know, share good to
Speaker 3: the kids and everything, like give him a treat or something.
Speaker 3: And so then she started talking more and more than
Speaker 3: after I was up there a couple of years. I
Speaker 3: went there one time and she just really like really
Speaker 3: opened up and started telling me all kinds of stuff
Speaker 3: and it was like my mind was blown and everything
Speaker 3: she toltally worked out and then so we were there in
Speaker 3: two thousand and four. She goes, if you really want
Speaker 3: to see one, go at three o'clock in the morning
Speaker 3: and go to the trading post and walk south on
Speaker 3: the one on one They crossed the road there. If
Speaker 3: you walk up and down that road between three and
Speaker 3: five am, you will see them. And we didn't. We did.
Speaker 3: We got there at three, like three am on the
Speaker 3: dot part, started walking up the one o one, pitch black.
Speaker 3: We had night vision on the Colonel, the old Green
Speaker 3: Break colonel, the Colonel, the d colonel, you know, because
Speaker 3: three years up to nine to eleven, so they had
Speaker 3: new night vision gear and so he had he was
Speaker 3: the he ran the southeast quadrant for Washington State Reservists
Speaker 3: for Green Braves, so he was had keys to like
Speaker 3: the supply of rooms and whatever. And so we brought
Speaker 3: like fifteen pairs of night vision goggles with them, like
Speaker 3: their Gen two that nowadays they'd suck, but for us
Speaker 3: back then they were good and we had them on.
Speaker 3: They didn't record though. We were walking up the road
Speaker 3: and I see this thing on the left side of
Speaker 3: the road. We're really walking for about twenty minutes for
Speaker 3: about a mile into the walk and I see something
Speaker 3: big on the side of road and I stopped walking,
Speaker 3: and the other guys kept walking. I started walking again.
Speaker 3: I'm looking, there's one right there. And I was like, god,
Speaker 3: I don't want to I want to make sure it
Speaker 3: steps out again further into the road so that I
Speaker 3: don't know, like I just saw something that no one
Speaker 3: else sees it. You know, I see like a jackass.
Speaker 3: I go, you guys, see that up there on the
Speaker 3: road on the left. And also they're like, oh my god.
Speaker 3: I also just feel like the oh shit, you know,
Speaker 3: like all that's like, oh my god. And it walked
Speaker 3: to three strips across the road, walked to the fog
Speaker 3: line on the upper side of the one O one,
Speaker 3: turned and faced us and just blowed up like it was.
Speaker 3: It stood right next to this, well not right next
Speaker 3: to it. It was really close within fifteen feet of
Speaker 3: a traffic sign was it said fifty five and had
Speaker 3: the curvy swerved little diamond sign below it. It walked right.
Speaker 3: We all saw, well, dude, here's the thing. The only
Speaker 3: car that went by that whole two hours we were
Speaker 3: out there, The only car that went by came by
Speaker 3: exactly from the south heading north towards us. This thing
Speaker 3: was on the almost to the top of the hill,
Speaker 3: and then it dropped down to the other side on
Speaker 3: the south side. We were on the north side, so
Speaker 3: this car coming from the south heading north, its lights
Speaker 3: also started brightening up. And then last thing we saw
Speaker 3: it was standing next to the sign, and then it
Speaker 3: got so bright like it blew our night vision out.
Speaker 3: And the last thing I saw was it turned and
Speaker 3: start to walk head like it was just as you know,
Speaker 3: getting too bright. It turned and stood up the road,
Speaker 3: but it stood there for about ten seconds, just like
Speaker 3: flex like it's arms out like ready to look like
Speaker 3: someone wanted to fight, like fist clenched. Just blowed up.
Speaker 3: It wasn't like super super huge while like some of
Speaker 3: the other ones I saw, but I mean it was big, dude.
Speaker 3: It was. It was, you know, probably three and a
Speaker 3: half foot across the shoulders. It wasn't like one of
Speaker 3: those like five foot across the shoulder looking ones. But
Speaker 3: it was big. And it walked right next to the
Speaker 3: son of sign was nine one or nine four somewhere
Speaker 3: in there, and it walked by that We all agreed
Speaker 3: it was. That's how like its head went right even
Speaker 3: with that from our angle, and so it was about
Speaker 3: a nine footer and then it was like, oh my god,
Speaker 3: like that was insane. And you know, that was like
Speaker 3: the first night, you know, we're there. Twenty minutes into
Speaker 3: the lock. I was like this is going to go
Speaker 3: and like this is not going to stop. And we
Speaker 3: had multiple class as on that trip, and you and I,
Speaker 3: well that's where you and I went. We kind of
Speaker 3: were trespassing camping around out there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, not that I was on that same
Speaker 2: trip though, But to be fair, like back then at
Speaker 2: the time, I was naive and I didn't really didn't
Speaker 2: actually realize for quite a while that I was trespassing.
Speaker 2: So just there's almost nobody out there. So when I
Speaker 2: was out there and I didn't see anybody, didn't you
Speaker 2: know then that it doesn't occur to you that you're trespassing,
Speaker 2: And of course you're trusted seeing on Native land, you know,
Speaker 2: on the reservation. But once I learned that, like, oh
Speaker 2: I'm not supposed to be there, I kind of didn't
Speaker 2: know that, you know, I was kind of naive back
Speaker 2: in the day. I stopped going there, you know, out
Speaker 2: of respect, of course, unless I had somebody with me,
Speaker 2: you know, from the tribe or had permission and like
Speaker 2: to say, you know, no, just drop my name. It's
Speaker 2: cool if if somebody asks you, everybody knows me like
Speaker 2: that kind of stuff.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I got I got permission later on from tribal
Speaker 3: council guys like okay, you can go there, just don't
Speaker 3: you know, don't you know, be respectful like that kind
Speaker 3: of stuff. Right right, That was a crazy trick because
Speaker 3: that's where Tracy found those miniature like four We were
Speaker 3: tracking these two adult bigfoots. I think it was fifteen
Speaker 3: and thirteen inch tracks or twelve and twelve and a
Speaker 3: half inch tracks stuff like that. There were you know,
Speaker 3: like six inches across the ball and four across the hill,
Speaker 3: kind of four and a half across the hill kind
Speaker 3: of thing. And you can see where the smaller set
Speaker 3: of tracks set down, like four inch tracks, like perfect
Speaker 3: little bigfoot tracks. And the thing wandered over to the
Speaker 3: embankment and they were digging clams, the adults, I think that, yeah,
Speaker 3: the clams there they were digging so that you can
Speaker 3: see they had been digging, and where the little baby
Speaker 3: been sitting, they made a little daisy chain out of
Speaker 3: these flower stems, which kind of reminded me. We assume
Speaker 3: that the baby because it was small, and Tracy still
Speaker 3: has it's it's about four inches long or so. But
Speaker 3: it reminded me about when you guys went to the
Speaker 3: nest site and found the looks like a baby bigfooted
Speaker 3: practice making nests just like the big ones. That they're
Speaker 3: kind of janky and all that. I was like, you know,
Speaker 3: that kind of ties in like they do practice from
Speaker 3: a young age and making nests and that eating stuff
Speaker 3: like that sort of stuff.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And of course, the you know, the purported or
Speaker 2: the hypothesized juvenile nests at the Olympic Project site. They
Speaker 2: thought that it might be a juvenile thing because it
Speaker 2: was smaller than some of the bigger ones and also
Speaker 2: is up above the ground. It was in a bush
Speaker 2: or if I remember right, or some sort of you know,
Speaker 2: a lot of it's a huckleberry which grows up to
Speaker 2: be like ten or twelve feet in that area, but
Speaker 2: it was like about three or four feet off the
Speaker 2: ground or something, if I remember. I don't think I
Speaker 2: saw that one with.
Speaker 3: My own eyes. Maybe I did. Actually response to the
Speaker 3: chimps and Oraontians do the same thing they practice, make
Speaker 3: a nest when they're young with kind of crappy ones,
Speaker 3: you know, then they get better and better so they
Speaker 3: get older.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah yeah. Isn't that true of all ape species,
Speaker 2: including our own?
Speaker 1: And if people want to go back and listen to
Speaker 1: Tracy talk about some of that stuff she was on
Speaker 1: episode two oh one.
Speaker 3: I just say, I guess I'm not a good primate
Speaker 3: clipause I have at practice sessin so I was young,
Speaker 3: you know.
Speaker 2: But I'd like to think that you're getting better at
Speaker 2: things that you continue to do, though, right, or you're
Speaker 2: not getting worse, are you?
Speaker 3: I can't think of anything I'm getting better at all.
Speaker 2: Right, fair enough.
Speaker 1: Since we didn't mention the specific dates earlier, I did
Speaker 1: pull up a calendar, so we'll be doing the event
Speaker 1: at the NABC on Thursday, January twenty third, and then
Speaker 1: squatch Fest is Friday, January twenty fourth and Saturday January
Speaker 1: Ray twenty fifth, and I'll put the links for that
Speaker 1: stuff in the show notes.
Speaker 3: Cool.
Speaker 2: Cool, Thank you for doing that. Well, anyway, it'd be
Speaker 2: nice to have you up here for that.
Speaker 3: Bobs.
Speaker 2: I don't know if you can make an app and
Speaker 2: that'd be awesome.
Speaker 3: Should take out a couple of days of work, that'd
Speaker 3: be worth it, though, But I only get five days
Speaker 3: off like out of the school of the semester. So
Speaker 3: to leave like early early Thursday morning, get up there
Speaker 3: in time for that all, I could probably pull it off.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well you know what if maybe If not Thursday,
Speaker 2: then just come by on Friday and hang out and
Speaker 2: split on Sunday go back home. Don't you have Fridays off?
Speaker 3: No? No, that was just that one day.
Speaker 2: Oh are you working five days a week?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Oh my goodness, sos to only do three.
Speaker 3: But they like me, so give me. They said, can
Speaker 3: you do this? I said, yeah, the next thing, I'm
Speaker 3: working like five days a week, like three quarters time.
Speaker 2: You're rolling in that sweet sweet public education money.
Speaker 3: Oh god, literally would make more at McDonald's. McDonald's wage
Speaker 3: just starts higher in California.
Speaker 2: You probably smell better after work too.
Speaker 3: You get more respect me and McDonald's employed than being
Speaker 3: a working at the school, as those kids don't respect
Speaker 3: the adults too much.
Speaker 2: But it's sad. I mean, working with the kids is great.
Speaker 2: It's just great, and you're helping them out and you
Speaker 2: never know you just never know the difference you make
Speaker 2: until you know. You probably never know for most of
Speaker 2: the kids, but even you know to this day, maybe
Speaker 2: not today today, but you know, kids show up, like
Speaker 2: former students of mine pop by the museum and tell
Speaker 2: me what a difference they made, And like some of
Speaker 2: the kids were just Hellians who I didn't think would
Speaker 2: make it.
Speaker 3: Honestly.
Speaker 2: It's like, man, that kid has an uphill climb to
Speaker 2: adulthood and he's but they come back and they're all
Speaker 2: together and stuff, and then they say something's kind like,
Speaker 2: you know, a man like you really made a big,
Speaker 2: big difference. It's like really touching.
Speaker 3: Man.
Speaker 2: You just never know what good thing you accidentally put
Speaker 2: out into the world. You know, so just you wouldn't
Speaker 2: be there unless the universe wanted you there. So good
Speaker 2: for you, man, I'm really happy for him.
Speaker 3: The teachers that have the in fact I knew were
Speaker 3: the ones with the hardest on me for sure, are
Speaker 3: the ones that I didn't put up with a lot,
Speaker 3: Like they knew I could skate by just like not
Speaker 3: studying and stuff, you know, get on me and make
Speaker 3: me work harder and all that kind of stuff like that. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I was like I didn't like them at the time.
Speaker 3: I thought they were like mean or whatever. But and
Speaker 3: I was like, oh, these they helped me out more
Speaker 3: than the people. Are just nice and let me cruise.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, love comes in a lot of different forms
Speaker 2: and sometimes it's a little tough. Stay tuned for more
Speaker 2: Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bobo. Will be right
Speaker 2: back after these messages.
Speaker 3: So tell me about Crypticon, man, I missed. I was bound.
Speaker 3: I missed it.
Speaker 2: It was It was a good event. I mean, cryptocon
Speaker 2: is one of the best organized events. You know, it
Speaker 2: really well attended. Of course that a lot of good people.
Speaker 3: This year.
Speaker 2: The speaking list was kind of divided between like entertainment
Speaker 2: people like TV nerds various sorts, and like a like
Speaker 2: researchers who were into doing it out of the level
Speaker 2: the subject. You know, I guess the TV shows that
Speaker 2: were represented. Russ and Maria were there from Expedition Bigfoot.
Speaker 2: They had some guy named Tom who's on that show
Speaker 2: like the Skinwalker Ranch show, whatever that is. And they
Speaker 2: had a woman who was on that Expedition X show
Speaker 2: where they Mark Marsell. Yeah, or they didn't. They didn't
Speaker 2: give Mark the respect that he deserves and they kind
Speaker 2: of stole his thunder by pretending to rediscover the cabin site,
Speaker 2: even though Mark had done so many many years early
Speaker 2: earlier than their television show was filmed.
Speaker 3: Where people do what hell about that?
Speaker 2: But you know what, she actually came up to Mark
Speaker 2: and said I'm sorry about how that worked out or
Speaker 2: something to that effect. So whatever, but she was cool.
Speaker 2: I guess I didn't really speak to her.
Speaker 3: Then.
Speaker 2: Oh, that guy from ancient Aliens with the big the
Speaker 2: forehead and the hair and stuff. He was there, Georgio
Speaker 2: something right. He was a good guy. I saw him
Speaker 2: interact with all the customers and stuff. He was really
Speaker 2: good with everybody. I barely spoke to him, though, Yeah
Speaker 2: I was. I was busy because, you know, between the
Speaker 2: people who wanted to talk to me, and then of
Speaker 2: course Mark Marcelle was in the booth next to me.
Speaker 2: So if I wasn't talking to a you know, a
Speaker 2: potential customer or someone who wanted to talk to me
Speaker 2: for a little while about bigfoot stuff, I was talking
Speaker 2: to Mark or Matt. Prude and Emily were across from me.
Speaker 2: Renee was there.
Speaker 3: Okay, what about Moneymaker?
Speaker 2: No, he wasn't there. He wasn't there, but yeah, he didn't.
Speaker 2: It wasn't in that job. I understand that they tried
Speaker 2: to reach out to him, but he didn't get back
Speaker 2: in time or something like that or some of that effect.
Speaker 2: Maybe he's busy. I don't know. But Renee and I
Speaker 2: were there for our show. I didn't get a chance
Speaker 2: to speak to Renee too much either. You know, she
Speaker 2: she had a flock of followers following around doing stuff
Speaker 2: so that she had a good time talking to people.
Speaker 3: Cool.
Speaker 2: No, it was good, though. It was great. A lot
Speaker 2: of the favorite vendors were there as usual, and well,
Speaker 2: bah the wait mountain mountain monsters. I can't forget them,
Speaker 2: of course, I'm so sorry.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, which ones?
Speaker 2: It was Huckleberry Buck and then a wild Bill and
Speaker 2: it was wild Bill's birthday.
Speaker 3: Oh sixty five, sixty six.
Speaker 2: Right, yep, yeah, yeah, it was funny in the in
Speaker 2: the green room, I gave him. I gave him a
Speaker 2: rash a crap in the green room. Actually, I don't
Speaker 2: think he heard me, though Buck heard me, and that
Speaker 2: was rewarding enough for me. Because somebody joke in the
Speaker 2: green room, you know, we're like getting lunch or something
Speaker 2: like that, and someone asked wild Bill, is it really
Speaker 2: your birthday? He goes sure is sure? Is blah blah
Speaker 2: who Dick.
Speaker 3: Or who you know?
Speaker 2: Like he like all loud and everything like he does.
Speaker 2: And someone says how old are you? And he goes,
Speaker 2: I'm forty two and he clearly isn't forty two, right,
Speaker 2: And he goes, you can't. Someone said you can't be
Speaker 2: forty two, and I said something to the effect of, like,
Speaker 2: he's not, but that's as high as he can count.
Speaker 3: Awesome.
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, I don't. I don't think wild Bill heard me.
Speaker 2: And I wish he would have, because I loved me
Speaker 2: some wild Bill, and you know, I just love the guy,
Speaker 2: and he would have taken it like it was intended,
Speaker 2: just like it's a good natured heckle. But Buck heard it.
Speaker 2: He laughed and laughed and laughed, so at least at
Speaker 2: least the joke landed with somebody who appreciated it.
Speaker 3: I love those guys.
Speaker 2: I love those guys too, and I got a great
Speaker 2: heckl for the next time somebody lies to me about
Speaker 2: their age.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: You know when somebody somebody's turning sixty and they're saying,
Speaker 2: I'm fifty three and somebody, I got a good heckle now.
Speaker 3: So good one I got, I got I got that
Speaker 3: one now too.
Speaker 2: Yeah, feel free to use it, everybody, feel free to
Speaker 2: use it. So but no, Wild Bill is great. And
Speaker 2: you know what was really touching is that, you know,
Speaker 2: Jennifer and Lee, the organizers. We had Jennifer on the
Speaker 2: podcast last week, I think or a week before, and
Speaker 2: then Lee we had last year at some point, because
Speaker 2: you know, they do paranormal stuff and bigfoot stuff and
Speaker 2: encrypted the organized events. They're just great folks. But they're
Speaker 2: so kind and so loving and like they're more than
Speaker 2: just you know, managers or you know people who invite
Speaker 2: us to speak at events and stuff like that. They're friends.
Speaker 2: They're legitimately friends.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: They love all their their their their quote unquote talent
Speaker 2: that they manage through creepy people management.
Speaker 3: You know. I listened to the Jennifer interview and I
Speaker 3: was so bond of us. I was like a bunch
Speaker 3: of times like, oh I could have added something there,
Speaker 3: I could have added something. I was like, still do music.
Speaker 3: She's she's so positive and lasting, like the world can
Speaker 3: be melting crumbling around and she just goes aha, you
Speaker 3: know it just takes care of it.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, you know, and you know they have
Speaker 2: such big hearts. They actually went out and got a
Speaker 2: birthday cake for wild Bill and they were kind of
Speaker 2: walking around on Saturday during his birthday, you know, and
Speaker 2: handing out pieces to you know, very speakers and that
Speaker 2: sort of stuff. And it was really touching because it
Speaker 2: really touched wild Bill. He said that something to the
Speaker 2: effect of, like no one had ever done anything like
Speaker 2: that for him before they got up a birthday Really yeah,
Speaker 2: thank god, Like wild Bill is like one of the
Speaker 2: most loving kind people I've ever met. How did he
Speaker 2: go to sixty six or forty two, our ever old
Speaker 2: he is, and not have somebody to get him a
Speaker 2: birthday cake? But anyway, so yeah, that's kind of an
Speaker 2: update on some of the stuff that happened.
Speaker 3: Matt.
Speaker 2: You were going to say some stuff.
Speaker 3: Right, Oh, I was just saying it was it was
Speaker 3: a great time.
Speaker 1: What I love about that event because now I've done
Speaker 1: it four years in a row, is I recognize like
Speaker 1: eighty percent of the faces. It's a lot of the
Speaker 1: same people that come back every year, which is super cool,
Speaker 1: you know, so it really feels like a little unity,
Speaker 1: you know, I recognize names and faces, and that's a
Speaker 1: cool thing to see.
Speaker 3: You know that it genuinely is.
Speaker 1: Comprised of people who are actually interested in the subject
Speaker 1: and come back every year, and they've built up a
Speaker 1: familiarity with the speakers that are returning, and so it's
Speaker 1: like a continuing conversation in a way, and that's super cool.
Speaker 2: Yeah, a lot of members, of course members, and not
Speaker 2: only the museum, but the podcast people come up and
Speaker 2: they remind me that there are actually people listening to
Speaker 2: the podcast. Because I see it all the time. I
Speaker 2: kind of forget sometimes I'm just hanging out with you know,
Speaker 2: the Bobs and Matt, you know, shooting the poop. But
Speaker 2: a lot of people really really enjoy this thing.
Speaker 3: Man.
Speaker 2: It's always surprising, almost shocking to me that so many
Speaker 2: people are out there listening.
Speaker 1: I can't tell you how many people I met that
Speaker 1: walked up to me, either at the Friday meet and
Speaker 1: greet or at my booth and they're like, hey, Matt,
Speaker 1: I'm so and so I'm an honorary Pigeon, and.
Speaker 3: Then they would continue to introduce themselves. That's a pretty
Speaker 3: big claim.
Speaker 1: We call our members the honorary Pigeons. And if you're
Speaker 1: not a member, you probably want to become one so
Speaker 1: you can hear the episode about the pigeons and learn why.
Speaker 1: Even though I teased it a few episodes ago.
Speaker 3: I heard you saying that wasn't I wasn't sure how
Speaker 3: I felt.
Speaker 1: It's just so funny to hear people come up like, Hi,
Speaker 1: I'm an honorary pigeon, you know, like that's their job titled.
Speaker 3: I gotta get those pictures to you, prude, I send
Speaker 3: those to you.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, people would love to see that. I
Speaker 1: want to see them too. Now that I'm a big
Speaker 1: pigeon fan.
Speaker 3: I found some Red Rover pictures. Oh, send them over.
Speaker 3: But no, that's a great one. Red Rovers threw it
Speaker 3: right over. It was a great event. You were sorely missed.
Speaker 1: Like Cliff said, lots of people asked about you, So
Speaker 1: it's always fun to hear all the positive feedback and
Speaker 1: people that really enjoy it and love it. And met
Speaker 1: a lot of those folks. So if you came up
Speaker 1: and said, hey, thank you so much, made my weekend.
Speaker 2: For sure, I always get asked about you and the
Speaker 2: other folks I'm funding bigfootinget. Oh, I get that all
Speaker 2: the time, and you know, and you know, it doesn't
Speaker 2: matter who believes, doesn't matter if I believe, let alone
Speaker 2: Renee right, But uh, you know what, what are the
Speaker 2: other guys doing? You know, it's like we're Scooby doing
Speaker 2: we live together in the Mystery Machine or something. I
Speaker 2: know exactly what everybody's up to, and it's like, I
Speaker 2: don't know they want to live in the same state. Man.
Speaker 2: But my favorite way of asking about any other cast
Speaker 2: member is when they come up and they go, how's
Speaker 2: my bobo? My bobo like that that they love you
Speaker 2: so much. They always they think they own you. How's
Speaker 2: my bobo?
Speaker 3: They're on a piece of my heart. You know.
Speaker 1: One of the things we should figure out, especially if
Speaker 1: we get together in January, is people are always asking
Speaker 1: if think can get something signed by the both of you,
Speaker 1: and I always try to tell them like, uh, that
Speaker 1: might be tricky because they live pretty far apart and
Speaker 1: everything would have to be mailed around. But lots of
Speaker 1: people ask. So maybe if the three of us can
Speaker 1: get together there in January.
Speaker 3: The shipping is so expensive, that's the product media, Clive
Speaker 3: and back.
Speaker 1: Absolutely, maybe we can solve that. The reason I'm saying
Speaker 1: this on the record here is because we do get
Speaker 1: a lot of emails about that, and then many people
Speaker 1: ask me about that at Crypticon, I probably have like
Speaker 1: six or seven people ask so putting it out there
Speaker 1: for anyone who listens that that's not the easiest thing
Speaker 1: to do.
Speaker 3: But maybe maybe we'll figure out a solution in the future.
Speaker 3: Let's just say for members, we got to do one
Speaker 3: of those things like how people write in like a
Speaker 3: just an easy little contest and you know, pick a
Speaker 3: couple winners for give out do outgoing voicemail messages for
Speaker 3: him or send a messages to when they pick leave
Speaker 3: a message on their phone for him.
Speaker 1: I think that would be fun. And you're still on
Speaker 1: cameo right, yeah, I need to put a link to
Speaker 1: that in the show notes. Oh yeah, please do, Matthew.
Speaker 2: And how is that going by the way, that you
Speaker 2: have any like weird requests like tell my ex wife
Speaker 2: to go screw herself or something.
Speaker 3: Only rarely I get some roast ones, like lately having
Speaker 3: get some roast ones. It's almost all them birthdays in roasts.
Speaker 1: I did see a pretty great ro to him because
Speaker 1: you know it will show previous cameos, and there was
Speaker 1: one of you say like, hey, so, so your co
Speaker 1: workers reached out to me.
Speaker 3: They said, you're the dumb.
Speaker 1: Guy in the office that doesn't believe in Bigfoot.
Speaker 3: That sucks.
Speaker 1: You're like the You're like to Michael Scott, if you
Speaker 1: want to be cool, will be like Dwight true and
Speaker 1: believe in this ass.
Speaker 3: Us always time stuff back to do it true whenever possible.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so, you know, the Krypton can thing was. I
Speaker 2: really enjoyed the presentation part of it. And part of
Speaker 2: it is because well number one asked one of my
Speaker 2: favorite segments of any gig, you know, like I like
Speaker 2: meeting people and all that sort of stuff, being at
Speaker 2: the table and all that jazz, but really being on stage.
Speaker 2: I really enjoy that part. It reminds me of being
Speaker 2: a teacher and that sort of thing. And my presentation
Speaker 2: this year, I'd kind of do one for the most
Speaker 2: of the for the majority of the year unless there's
Speaker 2: something special that people request. Was the best of the
Speaker 2: museum in twenty twenty three, and you know, I narrowed
Speaker 2: it down to about an hour or something like that.
Speaker 2: It was really hard to pick because so many good
Speaker 2: things happened in twenty twenty three, of course, and this
Speaker 2: is here. We are at the end of twenty twenty four,
Speaker 2: so it's kind of fun to look back that far
Speaker 2: and realize all the stuff that has happened in between.
Speaker 2: So when we do go to squatch Fest in January,
Speaker 2: I'll probably I'll have a brand new presentation, and I
Speaker 2: suspect it'll probably be what the museum was up to
Speaker 2: in twenty twenty four, because not only is it easy,
Speaker 2: but it's also there. There's just so much really good
Speaker 2: squatchy stuff.
Speaker 3: Man.
Speaker 2: I can I sometimes just go out. There's some stuff happening, man, And.
Speaker 3: You got the slides to match it with too. You
Speaker 3: got plenty of that.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah. Every time I go out, I bring
Speaker 2: a video camera and a regular camera, so there's tons
Speaker 2: and tons of footage of things. And of course now
Speaker 2: I got the three D scanning technology on top of it.
Speaker 2: Lots going on. But I'm looking forward to actually piecing
Speaker 2: together my next presentation.
Speaker 3: You're looking forward to that? That's how as hell?
Speaker 2: Well, you know, I'm looking forward to having another one
Speaker 2: and kind of refining it, you know, because the last
Speaker 2: couple of years I busted a brand new one out
Speaker 2: at squatch Fest every year and then close down the year. Well,
Speaker 2: you know, I change it a little bit throughout the season,
Speaker 2: but I mostly closed down at a cryptid con. It's
Speaker 2: like the end of the season. It's like it's like
Speaker 2: I'm on summer break, except it's you know, the end
Speaker 2: of November December, and it's crappy outside. Well, I've been
Speaker 2: plowing through a new book, A little species, Big Mystery.
Speaker 2: I think it's called by Debbie Argue. I finally got
Speaker 2: my teeth into that for I'm only like two or
Speaker 2: three chapters in, but I will say this, man, I
Speaker 2: think everybody should read that. It is absolutely fantastic, And
Speaker 2: of course it's about Homo fleesiensis. And it's recent enough
Speaker 2: that it even includes some stuff on Homo lose on ensis,
Speaker 2: which is the newest species of diminutive hominin from Indonesia
Speaker 2: in that general area, although loots on ensiss was from
Speaker 2: the Philippines, but you know, same general part of the world,
Speaker 2: Southeast Asia at least. And man, when you're reading through
Speaker 2: the description of Homo fleesiensis, except for the size, you're
Speaker 2: kind of just talking bigfoot, and there's there's a lot
Speaker 2: of small there's all differences like they don't have a
Speaker 2: pronounced sagital crest for example. Most probably because of size,
Speaker 2: honestly more than anything else. But they're talking about how
Speaker 2: the upper segment of the leg is shorter than it
Speaker 2: is in human you know, I believe that's called the
Speaker 2: cural index. I remember right talking about how the feet
Speaker 2: are longer in proportion to the height of the animal.
Speaker 3: I thought sasquatch ha longer thigh than shin.
Speaker 2: Maybe that's what cral indexes. It could be incorrect about that,
Speaker 2: but the thing is like that the torso seems to
Speaker 2: be longer than the legs, and it's because one of
Speaker 2: the legs is shorter. And then that they're talking about
Speaker 2: how the foot is longer in proportion to the body
Speaker 2: than what they expected it to be. And because of
Speaker 2: those two features together, how they have to lift their
Speaker 2: leg on every single step basically to the ninety degree
Speaker 2: mark to lift the toes over as they cross the substrate,
Speaker 2: which is exactly what you see in the Patterson Gimlin film.
Speaker 3: What's the ratios on that? Like footprint like because they
Speaker 3: found they found footprints in the cave.
Speaker 2: Right, Like, no, no, they didn't know they found these
Speaker 2: like a few meters underground, so there are no footprints
Speaker 2: in the cave, and also the cave has been occupied
Speaker 2: by humans for a long time as well. But I'm
Speaker 2: only a handful of chapters in. I've got a long
Speaker 2: ways to go, but so far, I'm very very impressed
Speaker 2: with this book and the examples of archaic common in
Speaker 2: features that that doctor Argue is laying out in front
Speaker 2: of you is very very impressive. Like these things are
Speaker 2: not you know, you know, some sort of strange mutated
Speaker 2: humans by any means they are. They're not even a homoerectus,
Speaker 2: as is often claimed, like some sort of like homoerectus
Speaker 2: taken into the grips of island dwarf ism. That is
Speaker 2: not That does not seem to be the case at all,
Speaker 2: based on the evidence that she's laying out, these are
Speaker 2: clearly some sort of archaic common and uh, Homo habilists
Speaker 2: Homo rudolph insis like in that general zone, Homo habilists
Speaker 2: was the first Homo species you know of our genus.
Speaker 2: Before that, they were australopithe scenes. And what we're looking
Speaker 2: at with Homo three zience is my even be in
Speaker 2: that like in that zone Australia pithesenes, Homo habilists, maybe
Speaker 2: rootolphenses and that sort of zone there, basically some sort
Speaker 2: of weird like upright walking apes sort of deal, but
Speaker 2: using tools like Homo ablists was It's really really interesting
Speaker 2: and of course that has huge consequences for our subject.
Speaker 2: You know, if if some sort of archaic or early
Speaker 2: early hominin, you know, early Homo laid Australia pithscene or
Speaker 2: something like that, radiated out of Africa and made it
Speaker 2: to Indonesia, where else could such a creature have gone to,
Speaker 2: like North America for example, And it makes sense that
Speaker 2: they would be small of course in Indonesia because it's
Speaker 2: pretty much right at the equator. And that's Bergmann's rule.
Speaker 2: The further away from the equator you live, an animal
Speaker 2: lives like the larger they become. So something archaic like
Speaker 2: a or even Homo habilist, although I doubt that would
Speaker 2: be Homo hablists probably before that because of the tool
Speaker 2: lack of tool use, but something like a some species
Speaker 2: of australopithescene radiating out of Africa and going to the
Speaker 2: northern climes where it could get larger over time. That
Speaker 2: that has Bigfoot all over it, all over it, and
Speaker 2: the physical descriptions that they're given for Homo three ziensis
Speaker 2: are just pretty much spot on in a lot of ways,
Speaker 2: and not all not all, of course, but some of
Speaker 2: the some of the specific features and the mosaic of
Speaker 2: features that they lay out or you know, like basically bigfoot,
Speaker 2: you know, talk about the flat, flexible feet. It's just
Speaker 2: really really interesting books. So go get it. Check it out.
Speaker 2: Little Species, Big Mystery by Wie Argue. The book was
Speaker 2: recommended to me by doctor Jeff Meldrum, so it's got
Speaker 2: to be pretty good, right, Stay tuned for more Bigfoot
Speaker 2: and Beyond with Cliff and Bobo. Will be right back
Speaker 2: after these messages.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've definitely been interested in reading that. I hadn't
Speaker 1: picked up a couple of year because we've been traveling
Speaker 1: so much. He is a pretty big proponent that they've
Speaker 1: been misdiagnosed right, that they should not be placed within
Speaker 1: the genus Homo. I don't know if that argument is
Speaker 1: later in the book, but is she already kind of
Speaker 1: laying out the case from what you've read.
Speaker 2: I have not gotten to any argument about the nomenclature.
Speaker 2: I guess i'd be the taxonomy. I'm not sure. I'm
Speaker 2: of swimming over my head in that vocabulary there, but
Speaker 2: I haven't heard any contention about them being homeo versus
Speaker 2: Australia pittascene or anything like that. But she is laying
Speaker 2: out the arguments and showing the results of various testing
Speaker 2: and cladistics or cladistics, I guess, and a handful of
Speaker 2: other avenues for finding out which animals these are most
Speaker 2: closely related to, and they're all coming back, you know,
Speaker 2: Homo habilis, and then there's a lot of discrepancies between
Speaker 2: them and like homoerectus and whatever else, and they share
Speaker 2: a lot in common with Australa pitthtoscenes as well. So
Speaker 2: at this point in the book, I'm not sure if
Speaker 2: she has a problem with the genus name or not,
Speaker 2: but I'll get there. I believe Darren Naish wrote me,
Speaker 2: and I got the double check. I don't want to
Speaker 2: put words in Darren's mouth, of course, and he's a listener,
Speaker 2: so if you're listening there, and you can always shoot
Speaker 2: an email or something about it. But I think I
Speaker 2: believe he said that these things are basically ostrolopitth the scenes,
Speaker 2: which I think is so so interesting. So put that
Speaker 2: in your new reading list there, Bobes, you'll dig it.
Speaker 3: It'll come out on Kendall eventually, wasn't that I would hope.
Speaker 1: So, I mean, it really just depends on the publisher.
Speaker 1: But you know, I end up reading that way so much,
Speaker 1: just because we're always on the road and I read
Speaker 1: a lot at night, so it's just easy to pull
Speaker 1: out my phone and read on the app, you know,
Speaker 1: because you don't need a light, you don't need to
Speaker 1: carry around a physical book with you. So a lot
Speaker 1: of new books out purchase that way. And then you know,
Speaker 1: I'll go to use bookstores and just look around and
Speaker 1: see if anything jumps out at me and pick up
Speaker 1: print books that way. But if it's a new book,
Speaker 1: I almost always go for the epub version of the
Speaker 1: e book.
Speaker 3: I hate buying digital books, so I just feel like
Speaker 3: I'm getting ripped off for some reason that I get
Speaker 3: the same information. I just I don't know. I prefer
Speaker 3: the hard but I like, I prefer you on the computer,
Speaker 3: but I don't like buying the books that way. It's weird.
Speaker 1: Well, what I love about it is that you can
Speaker 1: highlight sections and then you could export all your highlights.
Speaker 1: And so you know, every book that I have is
Speaker 1: just so full of highlights, and then you know, I
Speaker 1: can either email those to myself or export it to
Speaker 1: my notes or a different app on my phone, or
Speaker 1: just pull up the book and click the highlights and
Speaker 1: scroll through it. So there's very often I'm in conversations
Speaker 1: with people and they'll ask about something and I'm like,
Speaker 1: hold on, and I'll just pull up the specific reference
Speaker 1: in seconds, because it's just all in my pockets stored
Speaker 1: that way, you know, and then I can read off
Speaker 1: the exact verbiage, which is kind of nice so to
Speaker 1: me the convenience of that. And again reading at night,
Speaker 1: like I've read before bed every night, so get in bed,
Speaker 1: lights are out, and applau the phone or read a
Speaker 1: few chapters.
Speaker 2: You know, we've already spoken about cryptidcom But one thing
Speaker 2: I forgot to mention Bobo. It's one person who sends
Speaker 2: his regards, of course, is Tom Shay to ask about Tom. Yeah,
Speaker 2: Tom was there, the great Tom Shay was there, and
Speaker 2: versus lovely wife Crystal, who's a spitfire to say the
Speaker 2: very very least.
Speaker 3: Yeah, she's classic. Yeah, she's great.
Speaker 2: You know what she said to me when this time
Speaker 2: she always says something awesome to me, and this time
Speaker 2: the gem that I'm walking away with is something. And
Speaker 2: forgive me for not having the numbers right. But you know,
Speaker 2: she was much younger than Tom when they met, and
Speaker 2: she said something to the effect of like, he didn't
Speaker 2: choose me, I chose him. I think I was like
Speaker 2: twenty three or whatever, she said, and he was like
Speaker 2: forty three or there's like a twenty year difference or
Speaker 2: almost twenty years. That's something that effect. And she says, yeah,
Speaker 2: I was twenty three and he was like forty three.
Speaker 2: And when I looked over at him and I said,
Speaker 2: that is one sweet piece.
Speaker 3: Personally, I thought when I saw him.
Speaker 2: Totally totally yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1: You know, I was the MC there, so I had
Speaker 1: to introduce every speaker, and you know, some of the
Speaker 1: ones that you know, I wasn't as familiar with. I
Speaker 1: didn't try to elaborate too much in their background because
Speaker 1: I didn't want to get any details wrong. And also
Speaker 1: note that you know, if the room is packed for
Speaker 1: that person in the crowd already knows because they might
Speaker 1: watch that person's show or I've already read that person's books.
Speaker 1: But when Tom came up, you know, I was I
Speaker 1: had asked the crowd, like, how many of you listened
Speaker 1: to big Foot of Beyond? And almost everyone raised their hands,
Speaker 1: and I was like really yeah, And I I said like, well,
Speaker 1: then you've heard, you know, Cliff Berrickman talk many times
Speaker 1: about this gentleman being you know, one of the greatest
Speaker 1: field researchers that ever lived, and maybe the greatest living
Speaker 1: field researcher. And I built him up pretty hard, and
Speaker 1: I was like, you know, he's a Kentucky guy. Give
Speaker 1: him a you know, a home welcome. Make a bunch of.
Speaker 3: Noise for the greatest living field researcher.
Speaker 1: They went crazy, and I made a ton of noise
Speaker 1: and I turned to Tom and I was like, no pressure.
Speaker 3: Try didn't dig that. He looked a little like, oh man,
Speaker 3: why are you setting me up like this? Well he's
Speaker 3: so hum man, he's the best.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, he's just so humble about it too.
Speaker 3: Man.
Speaker 2: It's really great, you know, And which actually brings something
Speaker 2: else to mind. And again I know that we circle
Speaker 2: back to cryptocon after talking about something else, So forgive
Speaker 2: us all for being non linear. But at the end
Speaker 2: I had some extra time, which is very rare. I
Speaker 2: don't know if I had an hour hour and a
Speaker 2: half to speak. Maybe I had an hour and a
Speaker 2: half and that's why I had extra time. But I
Speaker 2: decided to do questions and I was asked a question
Speaker 2: that I didn't really like, but I went with it.
Speaker 2: And if you're the person who asked me for forgive me.
Speaker 2: But they asked me like, Okay, so you think Tom's
Speaker 2: doing great work, and Mark Marcel is doing great work?
Speaker 2: Who else, like, who else is doing stuff right now
Speaker 2: that you think is doing good important work? Well, thank you.
Speaker 2: I appreciate that, But I had a hard time thinking
Speaker 2: of it, and I realized that's by by having very
Speaker 2: few people to mention. Afterwards, it sounded almost like I
Speaker 2: was dissing people who are who are doing work in
Speaker 2: various ways. But I realized that the problem I had
Speaker 2: with that question is that I had to couch it in.
Speaker 2: There's a lot of people doing a lot of different
Speaker 2: kinds of bigfoot research. I'm just not interested in a
Speaker 2: lot of those different kinds of research, and I think
Speaker 2: that was a problem I had with answering that question.
Speaker 2: Although when I was trying to answer it on stage
Speaker 2: that hadn't occurred to me yet, that that hadn't clicked,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean. Like, for example, I was thinking, well,
Speaker 2: like Charlie Raymond's tracking down you know, people and talking
Speaker 2: to them all the time, witnesses and stuff. He's not
Speaker 2: really into the casting thing and doing it. He's got
Speaker 2: his own set of stuff. I didn't bother mentioning Charlie
Speaker 2: Raymond or anybody like that, or or I mean there's
Speaker 2: dozens of people who work for the BFRO, for example,
Speaker 2: and like who are just no, no, I just don't
Speaker 2: have time of course, And of course Dave Ellis, I
Speaker 2: don't know if I mentioned him or not. I'm thinking yeah,
Speaker 2: because I was. I was just stuck in the mode
Speaker 2: of the kind of research that I'm interested in and
Speaker 2: who's doing something that I find interesting and valuable in
Speaker 2: that way? You know, So whatever it's worth, I didn't
Speaker 2: mean that this anybody by not mentioning them, which is
Speaker 2: why I didn't. I didn't particularly like the question when
Speaker 2: I when I'm asked to like who's doing good stuff?
Speaker 2: And I don't mention somebody, It's most likely I just forgot.
Speaker 2: But in this case I was trying to think of, like, Okay,
Speaker 2: who's research am I am I interested in? But you
Speaker 2: got to remember that's just what Cliff is interested in
Speaker 2: and being you know, inundated with sasquatch stuff for the
Speaker 2: last thirty years. I'm just a lot less interested in
Speaker 2: certain kinds of research, you know, like like tracking down
Speaker 2: witnesses or something like that. I'm just less interested in
Speaker 2: talking to witnesses unless it's fresh. Because I've said it before,
Speaker 2: a witness to me isn't the goal. A witness to
Speaker 2: me is a sign post where I should go, you
Speaker 2: know that. And that because I'm interested in looking at
Speaker 2: stuff in the ground, trying to find spore, you know,
Speaker 2: hair and footprints and foraging. I'm interested in that stuff,
Speaker 2: not necessarily a story that somebody had from ninety six
Speaker 2: or something like that. It doesn't mean it's it's not
Speaker 2: valuable research. You can learn a lot from that sort
Speaker 2: of stuff. I'm just not as interested in it. So
Speaker 2: if you were in the audience, you know, and you
Speaker 2: felt that I was being down on some people that
Speaker 2: I didn't mention, that's probably why.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: I'm interested in field biology basically, you know, and the
Speaker 2: and the siding reports are yeah, yeah, and the siding
Speaker 2: reports are cool and all, you know, to a certain
Speaker 2: point until you hear thousands and thousands and thousands of them.
Speaker 2: But and eventually they turn into a dot on the map,
Speaker 2: or you know, a little bit of supporting data for something,
Speaker 2: or every once in a while an insight into some
Speaker 2: interesting behavior or something like that. But for the most part,
Speaker 2: there's just another road crossing story and and that's a
Speaker 2: place where I could go look. But beyond that, there's
Speaker 2: not much for me personally to do that do with it,
Speaker 2: because that's just not my thing. But for someone like
Speaker 2: Charlie Raymond, yeah he loves that stuff, then great more
Speaker 2: power to you go get him. And that stuff does
Speaker 2: play a role and it is interesting to a lot
Speaker 2: of people and stuff. So so whatever it's worth, I
Speaker 2: meant no disrespect to anybody out in the big foot
Speaker 2: field who I didn't happen to specifically mention. It's just that,
Speaker 2: you know, when I mentioned Chris Spencer or Mark Marcell
Speaker 2: doing either field stuff or these horse sort these historical
Speaker 2: deep dives and stuff, that's what blows my mind and
Speaker 2: really gets me turned on.
Speaker 3: So there's people doing great stuff that we've never heard of.
Speaker 3: Like every once in all, i'll see a link like something,
Speaker 3: maybe like on a on A West's Sasquatch chronicles his
Speaker 3: blog posts. I'll click on there. Sometimes I'll go through
Speaker 3: them and like, well, this person, I've never heard of,
Speaker 3: this person, this group and there get a lot of
Speaker 3: results and doing good work.
Speaker 2: And I did. I did have the clarity of mine
Speaker 2: to mention that. I said, there's probably a lot of
Speaker 2: people who are doing great stuff. And again I use
Speaker 2: Tom Shay as an example, because I had never even
Speaker 2: heard of Tom Shay until somehow the producers I'm Finding
Speaker 2: Bigfoot doug him up. You know, I'd never even heard
Speaker 2: of the guy and now become really good friends with
Speaker 2: him and you know, and trade information and stuff. So yeah,
Speaker 2: I'm sure there's dozens of people out there doing good things.
Speaker 2: I just don't know him. I didn't even mention Todd
Speaker 2: Prescott the great historical work that he's doing and stuff,
Speaker 2: So yeah, I don't know. I was kind of like,
Speaker 2: it's one of those things, you know, how I am
Speaker 2: about beating myself up about stuff. Man, Like on the
Speaker 2: on the walk back from the from the stage to
Speaker 2: my table, I was thinking, oh, shoot, I didn't mention
Speaker 2: this person. I didn't mention that person. And it's like,
Speaker 2: oh man.
Speaker 3: So that's what you say, you know who you are?
Speaker 2: Yeah, maybe I should have done that. Where are you
Speaker 2: when I need you?
Speaker 3: Bobs?
Speaker 2: Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bobo.
Speaker 2: We'll be right back. After these messages.
Speaker 3: I'm going crabbing. The model is support crabbing.
Speaker 2: Are you off of work this week?
Speaker 3: Yeah? Yeah? Thanksgiving?
Speaker 2: Oh wow, that is indeed something to be thankful for.
Speaker 3: They get a whole week nowadays. When I was in school,
Speaker 3: I just got off Thursday Friday. Now it's all week.
Speaker 2: Yeah, me too. Hopefully that'll give us a bump in
Speaker 2: the museum. It's been a little slow lately.
Speaker 3: Really. I kind of image that thing ever being slow.
Speaker 3: It's so bitching in there.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, definitely slow, very very weather dependent, you know.
Speaker 2: But yeah, so we we just got to crawl our
Speaker 2: way through February. Then we'll pick back up again. December
Speaker 2: is okay because Christmas and stuff.
Speaker 3: But right January's are well, Generuary. That's probably not too
Speaker 3: bad with all the skiers writer or is that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's not that great now the skiers because you know,
Speaker 2: picture being a skier, right, So you take off early
Speaker 2: to the mountain, you see the sign on the side
Speaker 2: of the road. We got to go there someday. And
Speaker 2: then when you drive back at whatever time skiers stop skiing,
Speaker 2: you know, noon or three or something like that, you're
Speaker 2: already exhausted. You've been out in the sun and the
Speaker 2: snow all day and stuff. You don't want to stop.
Speaker 2: N We catch some of course, you know, but not
Speaker 2: as much as uh as one one might think.
Speaker 3: An updates on acquisitions for the museum.
Speaker 2: Well, talking to Mike Rugg, so we're kind of waiting
Speaker 2: for some things to fall into place for him. But
Speaker 2: it looks like that might be a good deal or
Speaker 2: done deal, should say. So I'll be coming down to
Speaker 2: Santa Cruz some time the next month or two and
Speaker 2: talking to Mike about that. Made a few interesting phone
Speaker 2: calls lately to some historical people, and we'll see if
Speaker 2: anything comes from those. I don't really want to talk
Speaker 2: about those on the air so much. But yeah, there's
Speaker 2: always something cooking, man, there's always something cooking.
Speaker 3: I think if he got mix that'd be pretty cool.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, yeah, he wants it to go somewhere that
Speaker 2: is going to be like honored and you know, and
Speaker 2: then kind of got the thing set up for that
Speaker 2: at this moment. Yeah, but some interesting things are happening.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: When I was out in cryptied Con, Tom Shay sent
Speaker 2: me home with an original cast, so that was extraordinarily
Speaker 2: generous of him, of course. And also moments remember that
Speaker 2: story he told us about seeing that Sasquatch Goliath. You know,
Speaker 2: he was casting its footprint and it was on the
Speaker 2: other side of the side by side. Well, when he
Speaker 2: got home that day, he drew a picture of it,
Speaker 2: and he sent me an email with that picture and it,
Speaker 2: you know, a couple of years ago. And at the
Speaker 2: cryptid Con this past weekend, he actually gifted me the
Speaker 2: original drawing that's going to go up in the museum
Speaker 2: as well. And I dropped by the museum. They had
Speaker 2: to drop it off in fact, so that should be
Speaker 2: in the wall in the next day or two.
Speaker 3: But then in the members section, I got I want
Speaker 3: to see a picture of that.
Speaker 2: Oh, it's pretty cool. It's pretty cool. I think I'm
Speaker 2: pretty sure I have a drawing of it. I can
Speaker 2: certainly email it to you. Yeah, I actually I know
Speaker 2: I have a scan of it. I know I have
Speaker 2: a scan of it, So I mean that.
Speaker 3: Picture, I mean that story stuck out to me so hard.
Speaker 3: That's that's another ultimate just freaking missed opportunity. I thought
Speaker 3: he was filming it, but he was feeling himself backwards
Speaker 3: on a flip phone.
Speaker 2: It was like, I know, so disappointing, but you know, whatever,
Speaker 2: this shows he's really bigfooting. He's making mistakes like everybody
Speaker 2: else does. You know, Tom is one of the greatest,
Speaker 2: But it's not like you know, the greats don't make mistakes,
Speaker 2: that's for sure.
Speaker 3: He's not a tech you know, some twenty year old
Speaker 3: tech whiz kid. He had a flip phone for crying
Speaker 3: out loud.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I just sent you the Goliath drawing by Tom
Speaker 2: Shay had the original in the museum, kind of give
Speaker 2: you an idea. And of course he drew this, I
Speaker 2: believe the same day he saw it, so it was
Speaker 2: fresh in his mind at the time.
Speaker 3: He can schedule a little bit, Kenny. He can sketch decent, canny.
Speaker 2: Not bad. It's not bad. I've seen way worse, way worse.
Speaker 2: But while we're waiting for that to go through, I
Speaker 2: do have an update because a lot of people were
Speaker 2: asking me because I guess I've been talking about it
Speaker 2: on the podcast. See, maybe I should listen to our podcast.
Speaker 2: Everyone walks, I never remember what we talked about, and
Speaker 2: then people come up and ask me about stuff, and like,
Speaker 2: how'd you know that we talked about on the podcast?
Speaker 2: So I just still listen. But I talked about Sochi,
Speaker 2: I guess a couple of weeks ago on the podcast,
Speaker 2: and how they found a tumor in her do claw
Speaker 2: in her thumb basically, and we had to have her
Speaker 2: thumb amputated. Well, got everything taking care of the surgery
Speaker 2: went well. The stitches were removed on Sunday when I
Speaker 2: was encrypted gon So and she's doing great. Man, she's
Speaker 2: feeling good. I'll tell you that she's feeling great because
Speaker 2: she is such a pain in the ass right now,
Speaker 2: just running around and like running full force and slamming
Speaker 2: her cone into your leg and stuff like that. She's
Speaker 2: having a really good time.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: We take her out to take her out to pee
Speaker 2: in the yard or take a dump on the art
Speaker 2: or whatever she does, and then like we have a
Speaker 2: hard time getting her back in the house because she's
Speaker 2: just feeling awesome. So that's great news. But we did
Speaker 2: get the lab results back and Sochi is one hundred
Speaker 2: percent cancer free. It was, in fact, it was cancer.
Speaker 2: She had cancer. I thought she like screwed up her
Speaker 2: dew claw while running on the gravel or something like that,
Speaker 2: you know, like pulled the pulled the nail out of
Speaker 2: the quick or whatever that's called, just you know, some
Speaker 2: dog thing. But that wasn't the case at all. Apparently
Speaker 2: it was. It was melanoma in her bone. I guess
Speaker 2: I didn't know that. I thought melanoma was just skin cancer,
Speaker 2: but apparently not. They tested it and h or maybe
Speaker 2: maybe it started on the skin and went down. I
Speaker 2: have no idea. I have no idea that I don't
Speaker 2: really know. I wish I could tell you more, but
Speaker 2: I kind of don't care in a way, because all
Speaker 2: that matters is that Sochi is one hundred percent cancer
Speaker 2: free and a royal pain in the ass, and I
Speaker 2: just love her a bits for it. So yeah, super
Speaker 2: super good news, super good news. So I got the drawing. Yeah,
Speaker 2: what do you think?
Speaker 3: It's another one of those ones that looks pretty human.
Speaker 2: You know, like not really that looks human to you. Well,
Speaker 2: you live in Humble, you know.
Speaker 3: It does to me, it looks it doesn't look like
Speaker 3: it looks more like a human than than a champ.
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, but you know, they don't have a big prognathism,
Speaker 2: you know, or anything like that. I mean, I don't know.
Speaker 2: Maybe it looks like you know, uh, Jesse Rubber Jaw
Speaker 2: McGraw or whoever the guys you're hanging out with, you know,
Speaker 2: than an Humble, But that doesn't look human to me.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's like saying a dog looks more human than
Speaker 3: a gecko. I disagree for it.
Speaker 2: Well, we'll put that drawing up in the members section
Speaker 2: so for members can weigh in on it and see
Speaker 2: what they think, you know, human or not. I don't
Speaker 2: think it looks very human to me. But but still,
Speaker 2: I mean, well, sasquatches kind of look humany you know.
Speaker 2: Then again soda orangutans in a lot of ways.
Speaker 3: So yeah, well it looks like a human. Would say
Speaker 3: it looks I should say it looks human ish. Well
Speaker 3: they all do.
Speaker 2: I guess it's certainly not anthropomorphized, you know, like a
Speaker 2: lot of these drawings in the books are.
Speaker 3: Right, I just some things stare When he thought it
Speaker 3: was nine feet tall or something. The imagine things staring
Speaker 3: at you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, over your side by sides, like thirty or forty
Speaker 2: fifty feet away or whatever part it was while you're
Speaker 2: casting its footprint.
Speaker 3: Oh my god, that's nuts. Did he see less after
Speaker 3: he'd cast that and he saw cast it? Did he
Speaker 3: find his footprints less after that? I imagine did he?
Speaker 2: No, he's still finding one, man like he regularly. Gliath's
Speaker 2: just one of the locals, man like, they're just He's
Speaker 2: just one of the ones that he finds.
Speaker 3: He's not he's not more careful where his steps.
Speaker 2: Now apparently not.
Speaker 3: I thought I would have lived and learned well.
Speaker 2: As you said, man, they're not all rocket scientists. In fact,
Speaker 2: I venture to say, go on a limb here that
Speaker 2: none of them are rocket scientists.
Speaker 3: That's a pretty good assention, Cliff.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, you know, I'm going, like I said, I'm
Speaker 2: willing to take a chance on that statement, because you know,
Speaker 2: when you talk about bigfoot for a living like I do,
Speaker 2: in a lot of ways, you see a lot of
Speaker 2: things that are just factually incorrect. So it makes me
Speaker 2: feel good when I can say something that I know
Speaker 2: is one hundred percent.
Speaker 3: Correct that's true. That's true.
Speaker 2: I don't lie, but I'm I'm very often wrong about something.
Speaker 3: So I guess it's about it for this episode. Huh.
Speaker 2: I think so.
Speaker 3: I think so.
Speaker 2: It is good catching up with everybody.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I get here from you guys. I like to
Speaker 3: getting the crypt of Con up. They s that places.
Speaker 3: Thought it was at the same hotel, right, that big
Speaker 3: long hallway and all that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, but they renovated it. They renovated it, and.
Speaker 3: They were working on the last of miles early they started.
Speaker 3: They just started working on it. Just sell the game
Speaker 3: room and all that stuff.
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, the game room, that real long hallway. And
Speaker 2: by the way, thank you for the listener who gave
Speaker 2: me a bag at Super Bowls to go play with, right, Okay, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: so I really appreciate that. Yeah yeah, but trip to
Speaker 2: Con was great, and thank you to Lee and Jennifer
Speaker 2: putting it on. And they're doing it next year. I
Speaker 2: guess Melissa told me on Facebook. I guess they're asking
Speaker 2: them if they should do it in September or November.
Speaker 2: I don't know what they'll decide, but I know in
Speaker 2: September I can't go. I've got a job in New
Speaker 2: York that same weekend, so I'll be out there in
Speaker 2: New York and next September in twenty twenty five.
Speaker 3: Whitehall.
Speaker 2: No, no, it's not the white Hall event. It's a
Speaker 2: brand new one that I've never been done before. But
Speaker 2: I think Alderman and I are signed up for it,
Speaker 2: so it should be good. I think it's in the
Speaker 2: cats Skills or something. I don't know much about it
Speaker 2: yet because it's brand new and there you know, if
Speaker 2: there is anything about it, it's on social media, and
Speaker 2: I don't do social media really, so we will see.
Speaker 2: But as it gets closer, I'll let everybody. I'll keep
Speaker 2: everybody in the loop.
Speaker 3: Well I guess that's it, folks.
Speaker 2: Well we got a whole members thing to do now, so.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, Well for these people that aren't going to
Speaker 3: aren't members, that's it for them.
Speaker 2: I can't believe that not everybody's a member yet.
Speaker 1: And if you want to be a member, we offer
Speaker 1: annual memberships now ten percent off, so it's a pretty
Speaker 1: great deal.
Speaker 2: You can come learn about the pigeons.
Speaker 3: I can't coop very good anymore. I can't even do it.
Speaker 3: My throat's too thrashed.
Speaker 2: All right, I let's just slide on this time.
Speaker 3: But all right, okay, folks and honorary pigeons out there
Speaker 3: and real pigeons. It makes a lot of tune it in.
Speaker 3: We appreciate you guys listening, and we'll talk to you
Speaker 3: members here in a little bit and until next y'all,
Speaker 3: keep it squatchy.
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to this week's episode of Bigfoot and Beyond.
Speaker 2: If you liked what you heard, please rate and review
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