WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.280 --> 00:00:05.599 And I think today we're supporting Yeah, we're supporting url USD, 2 00:00:06.040 --> 00:00:09.080 the ripple stable coin from today and you'll be able 3 00:00:09.119 --> 00:00:13.400 to earn five percent on that from January. So those 4 00:00:13.400 --> 00:00:15.759 are some of the best rewards in the industry. 5 00:00:21.160 --> 00:00:24.359 Hey, everybody, welcome into the Thinking Crypto podcast. I'm your host, 6 00:00:24.440 --> 00:00:27.600 Tony Edward and my guest today is Simon McLaughlin who's 7 00:00:27.679 --> 00:00:29.359 the CEO of Uphold. 8 00:00:29.679 --> 00:00:31.440 Simon. Great to have you back on. 9 00:00:32.240 --> 00:00:34.280 Tony, Thanks for having me back on. Look forward to 10 00:00:34.359 --> 00:00:36.079 chatting absolutely. 11 00:00:36.079 --> 00:00:38.759 Simon. We spoke, I would say maybe four months ago. 12 00:00:38.880 --> 00:00:41.159 We were talking a bit about what bigcoin may look 13 00:00:41.240 --> 00:00:43.320 like towards the end of the year, and you know 14 00:00:43.399 --> 00:00:45.359 some of the things that you mentioned. I came to 15 00:00:45.439 --> 00:00:49.399 fruition and Uphold of course has some big announcements around 16 00:00:49.399 --> 00:00:52.240 the new rewards program. So how about we kick it 17 00:00:52.240 --> 00:00:54.479 off with the rewards program. Tell us a bit about that. 18 00:00:55.240 --> 00:00:59.159 Sure, So we've introduced a rewards program very easy offer 19 00:00:59.240 --> 00:01:02.640 some of the best reward in the industry. The highlights 20 00:01:02.640 --> 00:01:05.760 are you can earn up to five point two five 21 00:01:05.799 --> 00:01:11.200 percent on stable coins, five point two five percent on 22 00:01:11.519 --> 00:01:15.959 a stable coin called USBC, five percent on py USD, 23 00:01:16.400 --> 00:01:21.879 five percent on USDC, and I think today we're supporting Yeah, 24 00:01:21.920 --> 00:01:26.959 we're supporting URLUSD the Ripple stable coin from today and 25 00:01:27.000 --> 00:01:30.560 you'll be able to earn five percent on that from January. 26 00:01:30.920 --> 00:01:34.280 So those are some of the best rewards in the industry. 27 00:01:34.920 --> 00:01:39.359 You can access those rewards on stable coins by doing 28 00:01:39.400 --> 00:01:42.560 really easy everyday stuff. You simply need to log into 29 00:01:42.599 --> 00:01:46.280 the app once a month and if you hold any 30 00:01:46.280 --> 00:01:48.400 of those stable coins, you'll be earning those that level 31 00:01:48.439 --> 00:01:51.840 of rewards. In addition, if you get to level two, 32 00:01:52.560 --> 00:01:56.680 we'll give you access to new token so anything new 33 00:01:56.760 --> 00:02:00.480 that we support for the first time, and as you know, Tony, 34 00:02:00.519 --> 00:02:06.079 we've had a very ambitious listing program this year. You 35 00:02:06.120 --> 00:02:10.400 will get access twenty four hours before anybody else and 36 00:02:10.439 --> 00:02:13.000 that's a that's a really significant advantage because one of 37 00:02:13.039 --> 00:02:16.879 the key differentiators for Uphold is that we not only 38 00:02:17.039 --> 00:02:20.680 source liquidity from centralized venues, we source it from DeFi. 39 00:02:21.080 --> 00:02:24.039 A lot of important new tokens appear first in DeFi, 40 00:02:24.479 --> 00:02:29.879 so we support tokens before other centralized platforms. So being 41 00:02:29.919 --> 00:02:32.879 able to get in twenty four hours before anybody else 42 00:02:32.879 --> 00:02:35.800 on Uphold because your level two in our awards program 43 00:02:36.360 --> 00:02:38.960 is a really big deal. I'll give you an example. 44 00:02:39.000 --> 00:02:43.840 We were first to support Turbo a little while ago. 45 00:02:43.879 --> 00:02:47.000 We supported it eight months before Coinbase, and by the 46 00:02:47.039 --> 00:02:49.479 time it listed on Coinbase, Herbo had gone up by 47 00:02:49.520 --> 00:02:55.639 one percent. Another more recent example is virtuals, which is 48 00:02:56.199 --> 00:02:59.439 a very interesting project. We launched that. We're still the 49 00:02:59.479 --> 00:03:01.599 only place in the US among the major ce FI 50 00:03:01.680 --> 00:03:05.120 platforms that support it. It's been on our platform for 51 00:03:05.159 --> 00:03:07.599 seven days, it's gone up by sixty five percent. So 52 00:03:07.639 --> 00:03:10.759 the point is being able to trade these new tokens 53 00:03:10.759 --> 00:03:14.680 that we support before anybody else gives you a sort 54 00:03:14.719 --> 00:03:17.039 of major trading superpower. We think that's going to be 55 00:03:17.280 --> 00:03:19.960 a big deal for people. But the third level of 56 00:03:19.960 --> 00:03:24.199 the rewards program is about education. You open the uphold 57 00:03:24.240 --> 00:03:26.840 out today there are like three hundred token It's a 58 00:03:26.879 --> 00:03:31.039 bewildering offering for anyone who's new. And as you probably know, 59 00:03:31.280 --> 00:03:34.879 we operate a research department where we spend a huge 60 00:03:34.879 --> 00:03:38.400 amount of time trying to identify tokens with at least 61 00:03:38.400 --> 00:03:42.280 the potential to create fundamental value. Typically because they're solving 62 00:03:42.360 --> 00:03:45.599 a problem in the traditional world of finance, they've got 63 00:03:45.599 --> 00:03:51.400 a very precisely defined problem. Good team third level of 64 00:03:51.439 --> 00:03:54.479 rewards gives you access to their research papers, which helps 65 00:03:54.520 --> 00:03:58.039 you to identify important new tokens that you should at 66 00:03:58.120 --> 00:04:01.280 least do further research on yourself, because our research team 67 00:04:01.680 --> 00:04:05.360 see them as particularly promising. We're not doing due diligence. 68 00:04:05.400 --> 00:04:07.759 We're not recommending them, but we're giving you a place 69 00:04:07.840 --> 00:04:11.479 to start, a place to navigate from. So the rewards 70 00:04:11.479 --> 00:04:14.400 program is basically up to five point two five percent 71 00:04:14.439 --> 00:04:18.360 on stable coins twenty twenty four hour early access to 72 00:04:18.519 --> 00:04:23.800 new tokens and access to our research report library, And 73 00:04:24.319 --> 00:04:27.399 unlike on a lot of other platforms, we've kept it 74 00:04:27.519 --> 00:04:32.199 really really simple. We pay out the rewards in US 75 00:04:32.279 --> 00:04:34.759 dollar stable coins. We're not paying you out in platform 76 00:04:34.839 --> 00:04:37.839 tokens that you then have to trade and they charge 77 00:04:37.879 --> 00:04:40.600 a big fee on the trade. So the payout is 78 00:04:40.639 --> 00:04:44.160 in stable coins. There are no complex tiers, and you 79 00:04:44.240 --> 00:04:47.600 get to access these rewards by doing really simple stuff. 80 00:04:47.680 --> 00:04:50.199 You just have to log on level one, you just 81 00:04:50.240 --> 00:04:53.000 have to deposit fifty bucks, Level two, you have to 82 00:04:53.040 --> 00:04:56.920 trade fifty bucks Level three, and we've had it open 83 00:04:56.959 --> 00:05:01.439 now for twenty four hours. Looked at the stats this morning, 84 00:05:01.439 --> 00:05:05.319 four hundred and seventy six thousand people have participated, so 85 00:05:06.160 --> 00:05:07.839 really easy and simple to use. 86 00:05:08.800 --> 00:05:11.439 I love it and I love as a user myself. 87 00:05:11.519 --> 00:05:14.399 I love the incentives and the education part and the 88 00:05:14.439 --> 00:05:17.800 early access to different tokens. I think that's definitely a 89 00:05:17.839 --> 00:05:22.279 major win. So with regards to the different stable coins, 90 00:05:22.519 --> 00:05:25.800 you mentioned r l USD, which was announced I think 91 00:05:25.879 --> 00:05:28.560 yesterday that Uphol will be supporting and so on and 92 00:05:28.639 --> 00:05:32.279 so forth. You mentioned that is five percent and that 93 00:05:32.439 --> 00:05:33.800 is starting in January. 94 00:05:33.920 --> 00:05:36.600 To confirm starts from January. R l USD you'll be 95 00:05:36.639 --> 00:05:39.800 able to one rewards from from January first. 96 00:05:40.439 --> 00:05:44.040 Now, with regards to the yield that is earned, is 97 00:05:44.079 --> 00:05:46.800 this how is that generated? Because I'm sure folks are 98 00:05:46.800 --> 00:05:49.160 going to want to know where's the yield coming from. 99 00:05:49.439 --> 00:05:52.360 It's a great question. So it's coming from our balance 100 00:05:52.360 --> 00:05:56.240 sheet with funding this ourselves, so you know, there's no 101 00:05:56.360 --> 00:05:59.519 funky things going on with assets behind the scenes. You know. 102 00:06:00.120 --> 00:06:02.720 Is simply saying this is a great way to spend 103 00:06:02.759 --> 00:06:07.240 our marketing money and allowing people to earn rewards on 104 00:06:07.279 --> 00:06:10.040 stable coins. People put their profits into stable coins, they 105 00:06:10.199 --> 00:06:12.319 use it on DeFi. So we're using this as a 106 00:06:12.399 --> 00:06:17.759 b acquisition opportunity for uphold. You can earn on USDC, 107 00:06:17.879 --> 00:06:20.600 for example, we're paying five percent coinbase I think are 108 00:06:20.639 --> 00:06:23.319 paying four point three five percent when I last looked, 109 00:06:23.800 --> 00:06:27.000 So these are these are really good rewards. They're funded 110 00:06:27.000 --> 00:06:30.240 directly from our balance sheet, and we're able to fund 111 00:06:30.279 --> 00:06:33.000 it because what we find is when people hold significant 112 00:06:33.040 --> 00:06:37.759 balances of stable coins, they transact more, so we generate 113 00:06:37.800 --> 00:06:41.079 far more transactional revenue from their activity. So really it's 114 00:06:41.120 --> 00:06:44.879 a way of rewarding people for holding dry powder on 115 00:06:44.920 --> 00:06:48.199 the platform and making it attractive for people to hold 116 00:06:48.199 --> 00:06:50.439 it on the platform. 117 00:06:50.480 --> 00:06:53.480 And do you have plans eventually, and it may be 118 00:06:53.560 --> 00:06:56.519 too early to answer this, but to add more stable coins, 119 00:06:57.079 --> 00:06:58.800 because it seems like there's going to be a lot 120 00:06:58.800 --> 00:07:00.360 of stable coins in the market. 121 00:07:01.800 --> 00:07:04.639 There is, there's this huge proliferation in stable coins, and 122 00:07:04.680 --> 00:07:07.480 I think I think our feeling about stable coins is, 123 00:07:08.360 --> 00:07:11.399 I mean, it's fundamentally central bank money on blockchain rails, 124 00:07:12.000 --> 00:07:14.720 but it's issued by private companies. So you just need 125 00:07:14.759 --> 00:07:17.759 to be you know, as a retail as anybody, right, 126 00:07:17.800 --> 00:07:20.959 you just need to be super selective about which ones 127 00:07:20.959 --> 00:07:23.439 you choose because they all do the same thing. You 128 00:07:23.480 --> 00:07:25.839 want to make sure that it's being issued by a 129 00:07:25.879 --> 00:07:29.720 company in a highly regulated jurisdiction in a highly compliant way, 130 00:07:29.759 --> 00:07:33.079 and it's properly backed, and there are transparency features and 131 00:07:33.160 --> 00:07:36.879 there's a strong regulator above it. So you know, we've 132 00:07:38.000 --> 00:07:41.600 it's too complex for us to administer rewards on all 133 00:07:41.680 --> 00:07:44.839 stable coins. I think we currently support ten, so we're 134 00:07:45.240 --> 00:07:48.639 starting with rewards on four, you know. And r l USD, 135 00:07:48.800 --> 00:07:51.000 I think is a really good example of a stable 136 00:07:51.040 --> 00:07:54.040 coin that we like. You know, it's it's being issued 137 00:07:54.040 --> 00:07:59.680 by a trust company under the ny DFS, meets rigorous 138 00:07:59.720 --> 00:08:03.079 complete client standards as a monthly audit report. It's from 139 00:08:03.120 --> 00:08:04.279 a reputable company. 140 00:08:04.600 --> 00:08:04.800 You know. 141 00:08:04.879 --> 00:08:07.920 For us, that's like tick tick tick. Yes, we absolutely 142 00:08:08.000 --> 00:08:12.759 want to offer rewards to customers who perform certain activities 143 00:08:12.879 --> 00:08:13.959 on that stable coin. 144 00:08:14.480 --> 00:08:18.519 And then with staplecoin legislation possibly around the corner here 145 00:08:18.519 --> 00:08:20.720 in the United States, and we know it has already 146 00:08:20.759 --> 00:08:25.720 been passing the EU, how's uphol prepared to navigate those waters? 147 00:08:25.759 --> 00:08:29.319 You know, there are significant changes to how stable coin 148 00:08:29.480 --> 00:08:31.120 operators or issuers can operate. 149 00:08:32.799 --> 00:08:35.639 Well, it's a it's a it's great question. So I 150 00:08:35.639 --> 00:08:41.360 mean we've we've we've had to remove tether, for example, 151 00:08:41.399 --> 00:08:44.559 in Europe because tether is not acceptable in Europe. So 152 00:08:44.840 --> 00:08:48.360 we're a highly compliant company. We follow what the regulatory 153 00:08:48.360 --> 00:08:52.000 guidance is in each of the jurisdictions. And you know, 154 00:08:52.039 --> 00:08:55.279 we're very familiar and we're actually a licensed EMI. So 155 00:08:55.360 --> 00:08:59.240 electronic money institution in the UK about to be Europe too, 156 00:08:59.799 --> 00:09:05.399 and that set of rules basically regulates electronic money. Stable 157 00:09:05.440 --> 00:09:08.200 coin is electronic money. It should be regulated in the 158 00:09:08.240 --> 00:09:11.320 same way so that people have a high degree of 159 00:09:11.320 --> 00:09:14.159 confidence in it, you know, and I would be very 160 00:09:15.080 --> 00:09:17.639 It's funny you still occasionally see stable coin offers of 161 00:09:17.720 --> 00:09:22.279 you know, earn forty percent on this stable coin. It's like, no, no, no, 162 00:09:22.559 --> 00:09:27.159 stay away. Just go to stable coins that are issued 163 00:09:27.559 --> 00:09:31.360 by a reputable company and a highly regulated in a 164 00:09:31.399 --> 00:09:37.519 highly regulated jurisdiction. In terms of uphold on stable coins, 165 00:09:38.240 --> 00:09:40.240 I think twenty twenty five is going to see a 166 00:09:40.320 --> 00:09:43.720 massive wave of innovation. We very much believe in a 167 00:09:43.840 --> 00:09:46.759 multichain future. We see a big part of our role 168 00:09:46.799 --> 00:09:49.080 as being a bridge so that you can send stable 169 00:09:49.120 --> 00:09:53.720 coin payments irrespective of what network, you know, stripping away 170 00:09:53.720 --> 00:09:55.879 all the wires and the complexity. We just make stable 171 00:09:55.919 --> 00:09:59.559 coin payments easily. We currently support ten stable coins on 172 00:09:59.600 --> 00:10:02.200 forty networks. By the end of March it will be 173 00:10:02.759 --> 00:10:08.159 on twenty eight networks. So we think twenty twenty five 174 00:10:08.320 --> 00:10:11.759 is really going to be the year of stable coin adoption. 175 00:10:11.879 --> 00:10:15.519 For payments. We're seeing a lot of inflow from cross 176 00:10:15.519 --> 00:10:24.120 border remittance companies, cross border global freelance payment companies, treasury 177 00:10:24.200 --> 00:10:27.720 management companies who are adopting blockchain now to move money, 178 00:10:28.120 --> 00:10:30.480 and they're coming to us because we can provide a 179 00:10:30.559 --> 00:10:35.000 suite of licensing, access to bank rails and one hundred 180 00:10:35.000 --> 00:10:40.639 and fifty countries, and licensing for crypto. I mean, my 181 00:10:40.679 --> 00:10:43.960 own opinion is stable coins are the killer use case 182 00:10:44.000 --> 00:10:48.440 for crypto. There's been a wonderful in different pieces of 183 00:10:48.480 --> 00:10:52.720 the jigsaw have come together, relatively recently. Regulation in twenty 184 00:10:52.759 --> 00:11:00.759 five money centers around the world, increasing multichain functionality in community, 185 00:11:01.399 --> 00:11:05.679 and adoption by real world companies now that the regulation 186 00:11:05.919 --> 00:11:08.879 is there. And I think, you know, the fundamental value 187 00:11:08.879 --> 00:11:13.799 proposition send a dollar anywhere in the world in less 188 00:11:13.799 --> 00:11:18.600 than a second for less than a cent is just like, yeah, 189 00:11:18.720 --> 00:11:20.360 obviously that's going to take off. 190 00:11:22.360 --> 00:11:27.399 Yeah, it's It's fascinating and I'm actually very curious when 191 00:11:27.480 --> 00:11:30.120 big retailers like Amazon and these folks we're going to 192 00:11:30.240 --> 00:11:32.399 are going to start integrating it. I'm sure it's around 193 00:11:32.440 --> 00:11:34.720 the corner, but it's just a matter of timing. 194 00:11:35.399 --> 00:11:38.879 It is, I think. So you think, you know, there 195 00:11:38.879 --> 00:11:42.120 are so many industries which are really low margin, in 196 00:11:42.120 --> 00:11:45.919 industries where the net margins of the companies are like seven, eight, nine, 197 00:11:46.000 --> 00:11:48.960 ten percent and they're paying out two to three percent 198 00:11:49.000 --> 00:11:51.600 to card companies. At the moment, you know, being able 199 00:11:51.600 --> 00:11:54.320 to strip away that part of your cost space with 200 00:11:54.440 --> 00:11:57.600 a much cheaper form of payment that's inherently global, fast 201 00:11:57.639 --> 00:12:01.720 and cheap, I think it's just inevitable that things are 202 00:12:01.720 --> 00:12:04.600 going to go in that direction, and I suspect much 203 00:12:04.639 --> 00:12:07.679 faster than we think, because now we've got the sterilizing 204 00:12:07.759 --> 00:12:09.679 factor of proper regulation. 205 00:12:11.879 --> 00:12:14.240 Now, I didn't want to ask you about USBC. I'm 206 00:12:14.240 --> 00:12:16.639 familiar with p y U sc PPAL or l U 207 00:12:16.679 --> 00:12:19.159 S d Ripple, USDC Circle. 208 00:12:19.559 --> 00:12:22.440 What is USBC usb C is. 209 00:12:23.039 --> 00:12:27.000 A US dollar blockchain issued by a company called Hardyaka, 210 00:12:28.559 --> 00:12:32.000 and it's on a permission blockchain, which we like, so 211 00:12:32.039 --> 00:12:35.039 that everybody who touches that stable coin has been fully 212 00:12:35.120 --> 00:12:39.559 ky seed and it's part of a much wider project 213 00:12:39.600 --> 00:12:42.960 that they're building out, so i'd encourage you to visit 214 00:12:43.000 --> 00:12:47.000 their website. We really like it because it's clean sheet 215 00:12:47.039 --> 00:12:51.600 of paper, fully permissioned blockchain. Every single person has been, 216 00:12:51.960 --> 00:12:54.919 you know, been through a KYC process, so it's incredibly 217 00:12:55.559 --> 00:13:04.840 it's incredibly rigorous and and sort of clean, clean sheet 218 00:13:04.840 --> 00:13:09.919 of paper, and there we are getting. We are offering 219 00:13:10.000 --> 00:13:12.279 five point two five percent on USBC. 220 00:13:13.919 --> 00:13:15.879 That's pretty high. Yeah, I thought that. 221 00:13:16.080 --> 00:13:17.559 I was like, wait a minute, I haven't heard about 222 00:13:17.559 --> 00:13:19.919 the stable coins. I definitely have to ask you about it. 223 00:13:20.559 --> 00:13:23.279 So that's awesome. I'll link to that in the descriptions 224 00:13:23.320 --> 00:13:25.240 of Folks can go read up and learn about it. 225 00:13:26.440 --> 00:13:26.639 Now. 226 00:13:26.799 --> 00:13:31.679 In regards to availability in different markets, which market is 227 00:13:31.679 --> 00:13:33.840 this rewards program available. 228 00:13:33.440 --> 00:13:37.759 In the rewards program is available globally, so in all 229 00:13:37.799 --> 00:13:41.080 of the markets we operate in, we support different assets 230 00:13:41.120 --> 00:13:43.600 in different territories, so not all of the stable coins 231 00:13:43.600 --> 00:13:46.360 will be available in all of the same regions, but 232 00:13:46.639 --> 00:13:50.000 the rewards program is inherently global, and I mean, one 233 00:13:50.039 --> 00:13:52.600 of the things we're very excited about is we've got 234 00:13:52.600 --> 00:13:56.000 a big felt following in Latin America, so you know, 235 00:13:56.080 --> 00:13:58.600 for using a lot of Latin American countries, they'll be 236 00:13:58.639 --> 00:14:02.480 able to access the US dollar, they'll be able to 237 00:14:02.840 --> 00:14:05.679 preserve purchasing power in the face of you know, in 238 00:14:05.720 --> 00:14:09.159 some of those territories you've got very high inflation, and 239 00:14:09.200 --> 00:14:12.759 you'll be able to earn interest on this US dollar 240 00:14:12.799 --> 00:14:16.879 stable coin. So very very appealing to people in high 241 00:14:16.879 --> 00:14:19.360 inflation countries, and we're already seeing that kind of take 242 00:14:19.399 --> 00:14:23.080 off for us. And you know, it's a cool part 243 00:14:23.120 --> 00:14:27.360 of our philosophy that we want to offer borderless finance 244 00:14:27.480 --> 00:14:31.559 give people access to services around the world that they 245 00:14:31.600 --> 00:14:36.159 can't easily get from traditional finance in their region. So 246 00:14:36.360 --> 00:14:39.879 being able to access the dollar on blockchain rails and 247 00:14:40.000 --> 00:14:42.879 earn up to five point two five percent interest for 248 00:14:43.000 --> 00:14:46.720 people in a lot of countries, that's massively attractive. 249 00:14:47.799 --> 00:14:51.480 Absolutely, And in addition to being able to earn the rewards, 250 00:14:51.600 --> 00:14:55.080 they can easily move money cross border if needed, faster, cheaper, 251 00:14:55.159 --> 00:15:00.080 instant settlement, So you get all these great benefits and 252 00:15:00.000 --> 00:15:03.840 and bypass maybe the legacy banking system which has been slow. 253 00:15:05.200 --> 00:15:08.039 You mentioned hyperinflation and all these things. So it's a 254 00:15:08.080 --> 00:15:10.000 win win, it is. 255 00:15:10.120 --> 00:15:12.840 It is. It's an offer that we've wanted to make 256 00:15:12.879 --> 00:15:14.960 for a long time. We wanted to have a rewards 257 00:15:14.960 --> 00:15:18.039 program to reward our loyal customers, but being able to 258 00:15:18.080 --> 00:15:23.399 offer rewards on stable coins as part of that program 259 00:15:23.679 --> 00:15:26.480 and in return in return for doing such very simple 260 00:15:26.559 --> 00:15:30.159 things as logging onto the app, depositing fifty bucks, trading 261 00:15:30.200 --> 00:15:34.879 fifty bucks. You know, it's a very easy to access 262 00:15:35.360 --> 00:15:38.399 a universal program. 263 00:15:38.440 --> 00:15:41.559 Now in regards to the process of logging on and trading, 264 00:15:42.120 --> 00:15:44.320 are there is there like a cut off date throughout 265 00:15:44.320 --> 00:15:46.519 the mind? Like, how do you guys track that? So 266 00:15:46.639 --> 00:15:50.159 let's say I decide to log in December thirtieth. 267 00:15:52.559 --> 00:15:54.360 Yeah, so a really nice feature of it is you 268 00:15:54.360 --> 00:15:57.720 can literally log in December thirtieth and you'll get rewards 269 00:15:57.759 --> 00:16:00.279 for the whole of the month of December. Can do 270 00:16:00.279 --> 00:16:02.200 it at any point during the month. 271 00:16:03.360 --> 00:16:05.919 Oh that's great, Okay, I like that. A lot of 272 00:16:05.919 --> 00:16:10.679 flexibility there, Okay, awesome. I know you guys did a 273 00:16:10.720 --> 00:16:13.360 lot this year in twenty twenty four with the USD 274 00:16:13.480 --> 00:16:17.799 interest accounts, obviously launching the rewards program. Anything you want 275 00:16:17.840 --> 00:16:20.399 to highlight that's on your roadmap for twenty twenty five. 276 00:16:21.200 --> 00:16:22.840 Well, I just looking at some of the stuff we 277 00:16:22.879 --> 00:16:25.440 did this year to start with, I mean, we had 278 00:16:25.480 --> 00:16:29.480 a phenomenally strong year. I mean, our business is more 279 00:16:29.519 --> 00:16:33.480 than doubled in size, and one of the core benefits 280 00:16:33.480 --> 00:16:36.799 of Uphold is we bring you important new tokens before 281 00:16:36.840 --> 00:16:40.200 anybody else, So we had a whole slew of important 282 00:16:40.200 --> 00:16:44.240 tokens this year. The launch of the USD Interest Account 283 00:16:44.600 --> 00:16:48.200 allows people to hold US dollars in the Uphold app 284 00:16:48.879 --> 00:16:51.120 The funds are actually held by a US broker dealer 285 00:16:51.279 --> 00:16:53.720 part of a cash suite program. You can earn four 286 00:16:53.720 --> 00:16:56.879 point six percent on those dollars and you can trade 287 00:16:56.879 --> 00:17:01.159 them direct into Bigcoin, completely seamless access. And it's a 288 00:17:00.960 --> 00:17:04.480 the FDIC insured account and it's insured up to two 289 00:17:04.480 --> 00:17:10.240 point five million fd ICE in insurance. That has taken 290 00:17:10.279 --> 00:17:15.039 off spectacularly for US because you know, particularly if you're 291 00:17:15.079 --> 00:17:19.160 a wealthier client, what an incredibly convenient and safe way 292 00:17:19.200 --> 00:17:23.839 to hold dollars that are immediately adjacent to the trading venue. 293 00:17:24.160 --> 00:17:27.279 In terms of what's coming up next year, there's a 294 00:17:27.319 --> 00:17:29.279 whole bunch of stuff. It's going to be a very 295 00:17:29.359 --> 00:17:32.279 very busy year for us. So we're going to be 296 00:17:32.400 --> 00:17:36.359 very focused on payments. So beginning of the year, US 297 00:17:36.440 --> 00:17:39.799 customers will get bank account credentials. You'll be able to 298 00:17:39.880 --> 00:17:43.599 send make payments to people cross border using a really 299 00:17:43.640 --> 00:17:49.640 interesting combination of stable coins, multiple blockchain rails, and programmatically 300 00:17:49.680 --> 00:17:53.720 created unhosted wallets. That's a huge program. We're going to 301 00:17:53.720 --> 00:17:58.119 allow people to deposit their salary into Uphold in any 302 00:17:58.119 --> 00:18:03.440 combination of digital assets or fear that they wish, and 303 00:18:03.480 --> 00:18:05.960 that can be done on a dollar cost average basis. 304 00:18:06.799 --> 00:18:09.799 You'll be able to get paid your paychecker day early. 305 00:18:10.279 --> 00:18:13.440 So there's a whole range of neo banking features coming 306 00:18:13.920 --> 00:18:17.799 that helped crystallize this vision we have of our consumer 307 00:18:17.880 --> 00:18:24.559 wallet is a crypto enabled neo bank, and the payments 308 00:18:25.160 --> 00:18:29.000 side of it is extraordinarily important. Also, we're going to 309 00:18:29.039 --> 00:18:33.400 make setting up on Uphold account radically simple, radically simpler. 310 00:18:34.400 --> 00:18:36.559 We're going to allow people to basically set up in 311 00:18:36.559 --> 00:18:38.799 the US by giving their phone number and then within 312 00:18:38.880 --> 00:18:42.200 four steps you can have an account that comes in January. 313 00:18:42.799 --> 00:18:47.759 So much value derives from convenience and ease of use, 314 00:18:49.559 --> 00:18:52.799 and there's a lot more to come next year. 315 00:18:53.559 --> 00:18:57.079 That's exciting and Simon I I'm a user of the 316 00:18:57.079 --> 00:19:00.400 platform and I really appreciate all the board things thinking 317 00:19:01.319 --> 00:19:04.839 initiatives that you guys are have been putting together, thinking 318 00:19:04.839 --> 00:19:08.480 about your customers. It's really really amazing and I'm a 319 00:19:08.519 --> 00:19:10.400 benefit sure of that as a user has mentioned, so 320 00:19:11.240 --> 00:19:16.160 really great, Jenny. Yes, I've been for a very long time. 321 00:19:17.079 --> 00:19:20.000 I remember the first time I came across Uphold because 322 00:19:20.039 --> 00:19:23.400 I wanted to buy XRP and I remember Greg Kid 323 00:19:24.640 --> 00:19:26.960 I think he was talking about it. This was back 324 00:19:27.000 --> 00:19:29.000 in like twenty eighteen or something like that, and I 325 00:19:29.039 --> 00:19:31.920 signed up for Upholds. I've been using you guys for years. 326 00:19:32.680 --> 00:19:36.799 Oh fantastic. Well, USBC comes from Greg Kids group of companies, 327 00:19:36.839 --> 00:19:42.559 so you know, oh yes, yeah, So USBC is is 328 00:19:42.559 --> 00:19:46.000 issued by hard Yaka, so it's you know, it comes 329 00:19:46.000 --> 00:19:48.519 from a really well regarded company. 330 00:19:49.160 --> 00:19:51.440 Oh yeah, for sure. Yeah. I love that. 331 00:19:51.880 --> 00:19:55.160 On Uphole you can swap between different assets. It's like 332 00:19:55.240 --> 00:19:57.720 you can go between gold and crypto and Fiat and 333 00:19:57.759 --> 00:19:58.039 all that. 334 00:19:58.079 --> 00:19:58.799 It's so easy. 335 00:19:59.480 --> 00:20:02.200 Yeah, forget you know, we don't have the concept of 336 00:20:02.839 --> 00:20:05.400 trading payers. You can trade in one hot between any 337 00:20:05.759 --> 00:20:08.319 any digital asset or any physical asset. The other thing 338 00:20:08.359 --> 00:20:10.799 I want to flag is from Q two. We have 339 00:20:11.240 --> 00:20:14.160 US equities in the Uphold app in the United States, 340 00:20:14.200 --> 00:20:17.079 which will be the first time, so we're offering US 341 00:20:17.119 --> 00:20:21.559 equities through our US broker dealer, and we're thrilled. We've 342 00:20:21.599 --> 00:20:23.960 been working on that for a few years. Again, the 343 00:20:24.240 --> 00:20:29.839 whole concept is money and digital assets. That they're all 344 00:20:30.160 --> 00:20:33.920 digital information, whether it's money or asset, they all live 345 00:20:33.960 --> 00:20:38.480 on ledgers. Therefore you should be able to trade between them. 346 00:20:39.480 --> 00:20:43.119 The asset should be fundible. It's just digital information that 347 00:20:43.160 --> 00:20:48.039 should be sent and transferable as easily as email. That's 348 00:20:48.079 --> 00:20:50.079 the vision that we're pursuing. 349 00:20:51.480 --> 00:20:54.319 I love it. Let's talk about the crypto market. 350 00:20:54.359 --> 00:20:56.480 Last time, you and I had a really great conversation 351 00:20:56.599 --> 00:20:59.839 about where things were at, and I remember you talked 352 00:20:59.880 --> 00:21:03.720 they the opening interest around bitcoin, it was around ninety thousand. Well, 353 00:21:03.920 --> 00:21:06.559 you know we've blown past ninety thousand. We touched one 354 00:21:06.640 --> 00:21:10.319 hundred and seven thousand yesterday. Simon, it seems like twenty 355 00:21:10.359 --> 00:21:12.359 twenty five is going to be a boom year. You 356 00:21:12.440 --> 00:21:15.240 get a pro crypto president, pro crypto Congress, a pro 357 00:21:15.319 --> 00:21:18.480 crypto sec charit that's coming in in addition to a 358 00:21:18.480 --> 00:21:20.759 bunch of other folks. What are you expecting in twenty 359 00:21:20.799 --> 00:21:21.319 twenty five? 360 00:21:21.920 --> 00:21:24.480 Well, I think I spoke to you just before the interview, 361 00:21:24.559 --> 00:21:26.319 right where I said I've been speaking to our head 362 00:21:26.319 --> 00:21:29.640 of research. He's normally really conservative and usually comes up 363 00:21:29.680 --> 00:21:32.079 with lots of caveats about how the market is about 364 00:21:32.119 --> 00:21:34.759 to correct his view, and he does not know the future, 365 00:21:34.839 --> 00:21:37.839 so do not take this as investment advice. His view 366 00:21:37.960 --> 00:21:42.079 is you've got a perfect combination of different factors. You've 367 00:21:42.119 --> 00:21:46.680 got multichain technology coming together, you've got clear regulation, you've 368 00:21:46.720 --> 00:21:50.079 got corporate adoption. You look at the top one hundred 369 00:21:50.079 --> 00:21:52.240 banks in the world. We looked at it the other day, 370 00:21:52.359 --> 00:21:56.920 ninety six of them have blockchain teams. So this technology 371 00:21:57.039 --> 00:22:00.680 is it has now reached a degree of excess, and 372 00:22:00.720 --> 00:22:03.400 it's sort of reached that tipping point I think where 373 00:22:04.039 --> 00:22:07.240 people understand that. Look, this is a revolution in computer science. 374 00:22:08.680 --> 00:22:11.960 It puts an infrastructure layer over the Internet which allows 375 00:22:12.000 --> 00:22:17.000 the secure movement of value, which has so many applications 376 00:22:17.400 --> 00:22:21.079 in a globalized world. And what's been missing is clear regulation. 377 00:22:21.640 --> 00:22:24.960 And now you've got it in the EU comes in 378 00:22:25.079 --> 00:22:28.480 June next year. In the UK, you've got a very 379 00:22:28.519 --> 00:22:33.680 pro crypto government and the FCA is about to make 380 00:22:34.079 --> 00:22:38.160 crypto a directly regulated asset class. Up to now there's 381 00:22:38.200 --> 00:22:41.920 been an AML registration, but they're about to bring it 382 00:22:41.960 --> 00:22:44.960 in from I think from January twenty sixth. It's the 383 00:22:45.039 --> 00:22:48.480 last I heard. There's a consult period of consultation in 384 00:22:48.519 --> 00:22:52.599 twenty five, but clear direct regulation from twenty six And 385 00:22:52.640 --> 00:22:58.240 now we've got the prospect of a clear regulatory framework 386 00:22:58.279 --> 00:23:01.599 in the United States. And what the difference that makes 387 00:23:01.640 --> 00:23:03.839 to a business like US is A wee can plan 388 00:23:04.480 --> 00:23:09.279 but be we just have inbound inquiries now from corporates 389 00:23:09.680 --> 00:23:12.519 where thereas before, you know, you really had to go 390 00:23:12.559 --> 00:23:15.279 out and hunt people who were brave enough to you know, 391 00:23:15.319 --> 00:23:20.000 adopt the technology. So it looks, you know, it looks 392 00:23:20.000 --> 00:23:23.559 pretty promising. And you've got a prospect of a federal 393 00:23:23.599 --> 00:23:27.319 bitcoin fund of two hundred million dollars. I mean, who 394 00:23:27.319 --> 00:23:28.960 would have thought that six months ago. 395 00:23:29.799 --> 00:23:33.759 Yeah, it's almost unbelievable. The stars are really aligning here 396 00:23:33.799 --> 00:23:37.160 for our industry and asse a class. It's amazing. And 397 00:23:37.640 --> 00:23:41.200 A boy, I'm so fascinated by that bitcoin reserve because 398 00:23:41.519 --> 00:23:44.720 I know, of the United States makes some sort of move, 399 00:23:44.759 --> 00:23:47.519 it's going to trigger some a fomo globally, right, all 400 00:23:47.559 --> 00:23:49.880 the other central banks and governments are going to want 401 00:23:49.880 --> 00:23:52.519