1
00:00:36,719 --> 00:00:38,840
Speaker 1: If you want to support the show and get the

2
00:00:38,880 --> 00:00:43,280
episodes early and ad free, head on over to Freemanbeyond

3
00:00:43,320 --> 00:00:47,079
the Wall dot com forward slash Support. I want to

4
00:00:47,119 --> 00:00:51,759
explain something right now. If you support me through substack

5
00:00:52,359 --> 00:00:56,439
or Patreon, you have access to an RSS feed that

6
00:00:56,520 --> 00:01:01,039
you can plug into any podcastcher including and you'll be

7
00:01:01,079 --> 00:01:04,040
able to listen to the episodes through there. If you

8
00:01:04,079 --> 00:01:08,000
support me through subscribe, star gum Road, or on my

9
00:01:08,079 --> 00:01:11,599
website directly, I will send you a link where you

10
00:01:11,640 --> 00:01:13,959
can download the file and you can listen to it

11
00:01:14,159 --> 00:01:18,640
any way you wish. I really appreciate the support everyone

12
00:01:18,719 --> 00:01:21,599
gives me. It keeps the show going. It allows me

13
00:01:21,719 --> 00:01:25,280
to basically put out an episode every day now, and

14
00:01:25,319 --> 00:01:27,840
I'm not going to stop. I'm just going to accelerate.

15
00:01:28,359 --> 00:01:30,480
I think sometimes you see that I'm putting out two

16
00:01:31,359 --> 00:01:36,799
even three a day, and yeah, can't do it without you,

17
00:01:37,480 --> 00:01:39,640
So thank you for the support. Head on over to

18
00:01:39,640 --> 00:01:43,879
Freeman Beyond the Wall dot com, forward slash support and

19
00:01:44,000 --> 00:01:44,560
do it there.

20
00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:46,040
Speaker 2: Thank you.

21
00:01:47,719 --> 00:01:50,560
Speaker 1: I want to welcome everyone back to the Pekingana Show.

22
00:01:51,319 --> 00:01:54,799
Thomas seven seven seven is back, and do you think

23
00:01:54,799 --> 00:01:57,200
this will be the last Hobbsbomb episode or do you

24
00:01:57,200 --> 00:01:58,239
think there's another one in.

25
00:01:58,200 --> 00:02:02,280
Speaker 2: This to you? Because it's I mean, it's your platform,

26
00:02:02,439 --> 00:02:04,079
and we can go as long as you want on it.

27
00:02:04,159 --> 00:02:09,280
I think that I think three part series are are good.

28
00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:14,159
It's sort of I think it's a good model for

29
00:02:14,280 --> 00:02:17,240
this kind of content. But I'll go as long as

30
00:02:17,240 --> 00:02:22,599
you want on whatever topic. I I was basically going

31
00:02:22,680 --> 00:02:25,280
to conclude what I have to say on the subject today.

32
00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:28,120
Speaker 1: But let's do it that way, and then it gives

33
00:02:28,159 --> 00:02:29,400
us a chance to start something new.

34
00:02:30,159 --> 00:02:35,680
Speaker 2: Yeah indeed, yeah, no before if that's informant live, I

35
00:02:35,680 --> 00:02:38,319
don't feel them right today. So I started repeating myself

36
00:02:38,360 --> 00:02:43,560
for whatever, please advise me of that. And we're hopping

37
00:02:43,599 --> 00:02:46,800
around it. But in terms of the timeline, and but

38
00:02:47,039 --> 00:02:52,120
I think people have been okay with following it. The

39
00:02:53,520 --> 00:02:57,120
what's important to me, especially in terms of at least

40
00:02:57,280 --> 00:03:01,120
what I the kind of real val I find a Hobbsball.

41
00:03:01,159 --> 00:03:05,560
I mean, obviously it's his twentieth century historiography, but especially

42
00:03:05,680 --> 00:03:09,639
World War One because it's so ill understood and it's

43
00:03:09,639 --> 00:03:14,000
such a critical event, you know, like I this is

44
00:03:14,039 --> 00:03:17,919
something of a tangent like the other week. I'm not

45
00:03:17,919 --> 00:03:20,080
gonna name names because I don't have people to think

46
00:03:20,080 --> 00:03:22,439
I'm being mean or I'm not even trying to like

47
00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:25,879
suggest something unitive. But I've done this panel with you guys,

48
00:03:26,639 --> 00:03:30,080
and I was talking about how people especially in America,

49
00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:33,680
but also basically like across anglophone countries and like their

50
00:03:33,719 --> 00:03:38,960
academic culture and stuff. The other idea, they reject historicism

51
00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:42,039
of the continental type, but they fall back in this

52
00:03:42,199 --> 00:03:46,000
kind of like midwid idea of oh, history repeats itself

53
00:03:46,199 --> 00:03:50,080
or alternatively, they like a shoe that. But then they

54
00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:52,599
claim that, you know, well there's not really press it

55
00:03:52,680 --> 00:03:57,080
into extrapolate, so you can't make assertion in XYZ. So

56
00:03:57,199 --> 00:04:00,680
like I was making the point of the twentieth century, basically,

57
00:04:00,680 --> 00:04:03,919
there's nothing you can lean from that moving forward other

58
00:04:03,960 --> 00:04:07,240
in terms of the strategic landscape or power political development.

59
00:04:07,240 --> 00:04:09,560
And this guy's like, well you can't say that. I'm like, actually,

60
00:04:09,599 --> 00:04:12,719
I can you tell me World War one is gonna

61
00:04:12,719 --> 00:04:16,399
happen again? That never ever happens, you know, like that's

62
00:04:16,680 --> 00:04:19,439
that's the equipment of like a meteor strike, you know.

63
00:04:19,519 --> 00:04:26,680
I mean so, but the side Hobsbaum was interesting, especially

64
00:04:26,720 --> 00:04:29,759
the way he characterized the Great War. I mean, obviously

65
00:04:29,839 --> 00:04:33,480
because he was at base at doctor near Marxist Leninist.

66
00:04:34,360 --> 00:04:39,959
He he overstated material and economic causes, but there is

67
00:04:40,079 --> 00:04:45,480
nuance there that I think warrants attention, you know. But first,

68
00:04:45,519 --> 00:04:47,639
I mean a little bit of background in terms of

69
00:04:47,639 --> 00:04:52,360
like what laid the foundation for his sort of breakdown

70
00:04:52,399 --> 00:04:58,079
of the Great War, Hosbom was very much he very

71
00:04:58,120 --> 00:05:00,759
much proposed the theory of what's what's now called the

72
00:05:00,839 --> 00:05:07,879
general crisis. Okay, what the what? What what the general

73
00:05:07,920 --> 00:05:12,319
crisis refers to is this is this odd period in

74
00:05:12,360 --> 00:05:17,879
the nineteenth century whereby on the one hand, there's this

75
00:05:18,000 --> 00:05:22,480
kind of running stability in terms of power, political activity

76
00:05:22,759 --> 00:05:29,480
and interstate warring. You know, after Waterloo. After Waterloo, not

77
00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:32,279
much happened in Europe. I mean, I mean a lot happened,

78
00:05:32,319 --> 00:05:35,959
but I mean the in terms of war and peace developments.

79
00:05:36,319 --> 00:05:38,600
You know, there's the Crimean War, which is very much

80
00:05:38,680 --> 00:05:46,240
restricted to the theater, to the primary battle space, you know, uh,

81
00:05:46,920 --> 00:05:52,680
which you know, very much spared the continent. And there's

82
00:05:52,720 --> 00:05:57,279
the Franco Prussian War, which really that's kind of what

83
00:05:57,439 --> 00:05:59,759
started to knock France out of the game as like

84
00:05:59,800 --> 00:06:04,160
a trough like bourgoning superpower in my opinion, But that also,

85
00:06:04,720 --> 00:06:07,079
I mean that was that was kind of the most

86
00:06:08,560 --> 00:06:11,040
that was one of the greatest like Prussian victories of

87
00:06:11,079 --> 00:06:13,240
all time. But that also, I mean that was kind

88
00:06:13,240 --> 00:06:15,879
of the first blitzkrieg in some ways, you know, and

89
00:06:15,920 --> 00:06:19,959
there there wasn't large scale civilian nutrition in it, you know.

90
00:06:20,000 --> 00:06:21,839
But other than that, I mean some of the reasons

91
00:06:21,839 --> 00:06:25,000
I think, like I mentioned before, so many European mercenaries

92
00:06:25,199 --> 00:06:28,560
like streamed into the United States to like to take

93
00:06:28,639 --> 00:06:32,160
up to take up arms for pay for you know,

94
00:06:32,199 --> 00:06:35,040
the Union or the Confederacy because there just wasn't there

95
00:06:35,079 --> 00:06:37,120
wasn't a lot going on, you know, if you were

96
00:06:38,360 --> 00:06:42,199
if war fighting was your hustle, you know, either because

97
00:06:42,519 --> 00:06:44,160
that's just what you like to do, you know, you

98
00:06:44,199 --> 00:06:46,519
were an action junkie, or like that's how you made

99
00:06:46,519 --> 00:06:48,439
a living. Like well you kind of had to look

100
00:06:48,439 --> 00:06:51,319
abroad if you wanted to fly your trade, you know.

101
00:06:52,079 --> 00:06:57,759
But there was a lot of social instability, and there

102
00:06:57,839 --> 00:06:59,959
was a lot of there was a lot of sociate

103
00:07:00,160 --> 00:07:06,240
logical there's a lot of punctuated disturbances, you know, like

104
00:07:06,319 --> 00:07:12,279
in the social structure of the main European countries. And

105
00:07:12,360 --> 00:07:15,959
like this started really after the Thirty Years War. You

106
00:07:16,000 --> 00:07:20,120
know a huge Trevor Roper is another guy. He was

107
00:07:20,279 --> 00:07:23,319
very very different than Hobsball, but he basically abided this

108
00:07:23,399 --> 00:07:27,079
as well. Okay, Like basically in the middle of the

109
00:07:27,120 --> 00:07:32,399
seventeenth century, there's this total breakdown in politics and social

110
00:07:32,560 --> 00:07:37,079
order and economics and everything else. And this culminated in

111
00:07:37,480 --> 00:07:41,079
you know, the Thirty Years War, you know. Then there's

112
00:07:41,120 --> 00:07:45,399
the English Civil War. Then in France what they call

113
00:07:45,480 --> 00:07:51,079
like the Frond, which was basically like this running civil unrest,

114
00:07:51,199 --> 00:07:54,639
you know, and in some cases just like violent criminality

115
00:07:55,000 --> 00:07:57,439
that didn't even really have a political raison dtro It

116
00:07:57,439 --> 00:07:59,399
was just like guy, he's kind of like clicking up

117
00:07:59,759 --> 00:08:03,319
and robbing, raping and killing people under some like loose

118
00:08:03,399 --> 00:08:11,879
auspices of economic justice by violence. You know. The the

119
00:08:11,879 --> 00:08:16,399
Holy Roman Empire, which, uh, which was actually a really

120
00:08:16,399 --> 00:08:20,920
important political structure, you know. I know that there's a

121
00:08:20,959 --> 00:08:23,959
lot of Anglo phone historians. They they're kind of like

122
00:08:24,000 --> 00:08:26,920
a highly declared like it was neither Holy nor Roman

123
00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:29,879
nor an empire. It's like, okay, that's great, but it

124
00:08:30,680 --> 00:08:35,399
the reason why like it took on that Moniker was

125
00:08:36,039 --> 00:08:38,240
to suggest that, you know, this is a transfer of

126
00:08:38,320 --> 00:08:41,720
sovereignty to Europe. Central like from what was like the

127
00:08:41,919 --> 00:08:47,240
just public on Romanum you know, I mean it does track. Okay,

128
00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:54,759
there was revolts against the Spanish crown in Portugal, there

129
00:08:54,879 --> 00:08:58,799
was there there were secessionist movements in Naples and Catalonia.

130
00:08:59,480 --> 00:09:01,759
Like and this also just like jumping off like at

131
00:09:01,799 --> 00:09:05,519
the same time. You know, it wasn't coincidental that something

132
00:09:05,600 --> 00:09:12,240
was happening, you know, and when when the dust kind

133
00:09:12,279 --> 00:09:16,399
of settled, you had this increasing centralization at governments. Okay,

134
00:09:17,360 --> 00:09:21,200
Like we talked about last session, there was this kind

135
00:09:21,200 --> 00:09:24,159
of like nationalism that kind of took rude, but it

136
00:09:24,240 --> 00:09:27,039
was like grow much something enlightenment phenomenon. Like again we

137
00:09:27,080 --> 00:09:29,519
say like nationalism, we're not talking about some return to

138
00:09:29,639 --> 00:09:33,720
sort of like tradition or or some kind of atamistic tribalism.

139
00:09:34,120 --> 00:09:35,919
We're saying that like kind of the court in these

140
00:09:35,960 --> 00:09:39,039
countries consolidated. And it's like, okay, look, you know, like

141
00:09:39,240 --> 00:09:42,399
within these sovereign parameters, like we are the only sovereign

142
00:09:42,919 --> 00:09:45,559
we have the power to tax you, you and you

143
00:09:45,559 --> 00:09:49,480
you know, the only the only legitimate men under arms,

144
00:09:49,519 --> 00:09:52,440
the ones we each are you know, stuff like that, Okay,

145
00:09:54,639 --> 00:09:56,720
and it's kind of this kind of like central bureaucracy

146
00:09:56,919 --> 00:09:59,240
like developed to kind of prevent this chaos that have

147
00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:01,639
been happening. And this was like one hundred and fifty

148
00:10:01,720 --> 00:10:04,639
year cycle from like the end of like the Thirty

149
00:10:04,679 --> 00:10:07,279
Years War and the Peace of Westphalia until like the

150
00:10:07,279 --> 00:10:11,720
start of the nineteenth century, you know. But throughout the

151
00:10:11,759 --> 00:10:16,120
nineteenth century, despite these this this kind of basic stability

152
00:10:16,159 --> 00:10:19,879
in terms of like power political activity, there was this

153
00:10:19,960 --> 00:10:23,039
increasing tension because you like a lot of these a

154
00:10:23,039 --> 00:10:26,919
lot of these like you know, otherwise progressive states that

155
00:10:27,000 --> 00:10:30,519
it centralized, you know, despite that they were they were

156
00:10:30,519 --> 00:10:33,440
most of them were like run by absolute monarchs or

157
00:10:33,519 --> 00:10:37,879
they were run by a court that was essentially staffed

158
00:10:37,919 --> 00:10:43,240
by you know, like an upper house of landed aristocrats. Okay,

159
00:10:44,080 --> 00:10:48,159
and obviously, you know, clergy people still had a lot

160
00:10:48,159 --> 00:10:52,879
of cloud you know, the Roman Church couldn't assert itself

161
00:10:54,840 --> 00:10:58,879
in an absolute way over sovereign governments anymore, but it

162
00:10:59,000 --> 00:11:02,600
still had great power. So there's this weird disconnects. On

163
00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:05,200
the one hand, like structurally, you had the structure of

164
00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:08,080
the modern state like as we know it today, but

165
00:11:08,120 --> 00:11:12,600
it was populated basically by these aristocrats and and uh

166
00:11:12,799 --> 00:11:17,720
and clerical types and people who derive their mandate from

167
00:11:17,759 --> 00:11:21,720
sort of traditional modalities that we're ceasing to exist. Okay,

168
00:11:22,080 --> 00:11:24,200
I want to hosbal. There's big points and a lot

169
00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:28,679
of people don't understand this about Marxists. Marxists don't look

170
00:11:28,720 --> 00:11:32,559
at aristocrats and the bourgeoisie is the same thing. They

171
00:11:32,559 --> 00:11:36,559
look at them as opposing classes, which they are, Okay,

172
00:11:37,399 --> 00:11:41,399
and the first revolution before the proletarian revolution can happen,

173
00:11:41,840 --> 00:11:46,240
like basically the bourgeoisie have to annihilate the aristocracy and

174
00:11:46,519 --> 00:11:49,399
when that does, enter can't happen. There's this kind of

175
00:11:49,440 --> 00:11:54,519
stagnation and like the Marxist Letinist worldview, like nothing is progressing,

176
00:11:55,039 --> 00:11:58,480
you know, there's not like innovation. Government kind of it

177
00:11:58,480 --> 00:12:01,440
has this monopoly on power. There something dynamic about it.

178
00:12:01,759 --> 00:12:04,240
And this is critically important because I've heard people talk

179
00:12:04,279 --> 00:12:08,200
about and especially because I understand why people develop that

180
00:12:08,279 --> 00:12:13,559
impression based on the rhetoric as well as the experience

181
00:12:13,919 --> 00:12:17,960
historically of the Russian Revolution. They view like Bolsheviks's guys

182
00:12:17,960 --> 00:12:20,759
who like want to kill kings or like view like

183
00:12:20,840 --> 00:12:23,440
them as guys who just like want to burn down

184
00:12:23,480 --> 00:12:26,000
the churches because they view the church as they repressor.

185
00:12:26,039 --> 00:12:27,559
That's not the way they look at it. Yeah, they

186
00:12:27,559 --> 00:12:30,440
want to do those things, but their whole notion is

187
00:12:30,480 --> 00:12:35,159
that the bourgeois is a revolutionary element too. It's got

188
00:12:35,200 --> 00:12:37,759
to annihilate like the throne and altar and like the

189
00:12:37,799 --> 00:12:42,120
European court as it's existed for you know, millennia, and

190
00:12:42,759 --> 00:12:46,440
it's now consolidated under the trappings of the modern state.

191
00:12:47,080 --> 00:12:49,759
And then like when the bourgeois is able to consolidate

192
00:12:49,840 --> 00:12:52,639
control of this modern means of production, you know, that

193
00:12:52,759 --> 00:12:57,200
can be applied to you know, basically resolving shortages and poverty.

194
00:12:57,600 --> 00:13:00,440
Like that's like when the proletariat rises up up and

195
00:13:00,480 --> 00:13:03,000
then like takes over those means and that's like the

196
00:13:03,039 --> 00:13:06,000
final revolution. Then there's like no more class, there's no

197
00:13:06,080 --> 00:13:09,279
more cast you know, and like life can be like

198
00:13:09,320 --> 00:13:13,039
socially homogenized, like in circumstances of plenty, and there's not

199
00:13:13,159 --> 00:13:16,720
material need anymore. And because there's not contradictions anymore, and

200
00:13:16,720 --> 00:13:21,000
there's not there's not material deprivation, like there's not war anymore,

201
00:13:21,200 --> 00:13:24,320
and like all the superstructural features that cause those things,

202
00:13:24,759 --> 00:13:27,639
you know, like like like racial problems and things like

203
00:13:27,720 --> 00:13:31,039
those are all like annihilated because they can no longer

204
00:13:31,080 --> 00:13:35,440
be exploited, either deliberately by design or or or just

205
00:13:35,519 --> 00:13:38,840
by you know, or just you're just owing to intrinsic

206
00:13:38,919 --> 00:13:42,720
tensions that that that that cause us stility, owing to

207
00:13:42,720 --> 00:13:46,399
the internal contradictions of of a non ruestic paradigm. Like

208
00:13:46,440 --> 00:13:52,840
that's what they're talking about. Okay. So Hosbaum's view and

209
00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:55,840
Roper's view, albeit for different reasons and a lot of

210
00:13:55,879 --> 00:13:59,879
like Aglo historians, was that this phenomenon I'm talking about

211
00:14:00,320 --> 00:14:03,879
it basically kind of it created this like weird stagnation

212
00:14:04,919 --> 00:14:11,360
and these tensions kept on developed this sort of unsustainable momentum,

213
00:14:12,159 --> 00:14:14,879
and then by the time of the Great War, what

214
00:14:14,960 --> 00:14:18,279
it essentially happened was you had this kind of like

215
00:14:18,399 --> 00:14:25,399
hyper competitive capitalist paradigm between the major European powers, but

216
00:14:27,080 --> 00:14:31,840
it was kind of inconsistent across national frontiers and uneven. Okay,

217
00:14:32,320 --> 00:14:34,840
so you had the Germans that were absolutely killing it,

218
00:14:35,360 --> 00:14:38,240
and they were eclipsing the UK, which had previously been

219
00:14:38,360 --> 00:14:41,120
you know, kind of like the like like like like

220
00:14:41,159 --> 00:14:44,600
the like the factory of Europe, you know, and and

221
00:14:44,600 --> 00:14:47,240
and and British products that had been like flooding the

222
00:14:47,240 --> 00:14:49,480
planet and markets far and wide, like that was over

223
00:14:49,559 --> 00:14:54,039
with but the but the newly consolidated like German state,

224
00:14:54,440 --> 00:14:56,840
like it was cash poor, you know. And then he

225
00:14:56,879 --> 00:14:58,720
had the French, who, like I said, they'd been kind

226
00:14:58,720 --> 00:15:01,919
of like knocked off of their out of stole you know,

227
00:15:02,000 --> 00:15:05,080
by the Franco Prussian War and never really recovered, you know,

228
00:15:05,120 --> 00:15:08,840
frankly from like Waterloo and stuff. You know, so they

229
00:15:08,840 --> 00:15:11,159
were like realizing that like they were gonna like the

230
00:15:11,200 --> 00:15:14,159
future basically was them being like a junior partner kind

231
00:15:14,159 --> 00:15:17,039
of in this like German dominated continent as Europe becomes

232
00:15:17,039 --> 00:15:21,600
a superpower. Okay. And hobbs on view is like, look

233
00:15:21,639 --> 00:15:25,519
with the Great Equalizer raises and military power, and he's right,

234
00:15:26,519 --> 00:15:30,759
and if you don't believe that, I mean I'll relieve this, okay.

235
00:15:30,799 --> 00:15:34,600
Like at peak, I'm talking in the era of like

236
00:15:35,399 --> 00:15:40,440
undeniable strategic parody, like after nineteen seventy seven, the Soviet

237
00:15:40,559 --> 00:15:45,559
Union at peak is it's GDP was like one fifth

238
00:15:45,559 --> 00:15:50,840
out of the United States, Okay, its annual growth was

239
00:15:50,879 --> 00:15:53,559
like one point two percent or like something that would

240
00:15:53,559 --> 00:15:59,200
be like viewed as pathetic by you know, by the UH,

241
00:15:59,679 --> 00:16:02,399
by the Boon this Republic, or by the United States.

242
00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:08,840
But they were probably like the strongest military power that's

243
00:16:08,840 --> 00:16:15,080
ever existed on this planet. Okay, So in the Hosboms view, like, look,

244
00:16:15,120 --> 00:16:19,080
if you're being if you're if you're basically being merked,

245
00:16:19,320 --> 00:16:21,720
like in the game of uh, in the great Game

246
00:16:21,799 --> 00:16:26,320
of of capitalist commerce, and you know, the kind of

247
00:16:26,440 --> 00:16:32,799
zero sum competition before European integration was a reality. Your

248
00:16:32,840 --> 00:16:37,200
trump card is essentially that you can defeat your enemies

249
00:16:37,320 --> 00:16:41,200
on the battlefield, you know. And there was a certain

250
00:16:41,240 --> 00:16:46,039
conveinence here because again, you know, the Crimean War resolved

251
00:16:46,080 --> 00:16:52,000
pretty rapidly. Okay, the Franco Prussian War resolved pretty rapidly.

252
00:16:52,759 --> 00:16:55,720
The war between the states here in America was a bloodbath,

253
00:16:55,919 --> 00:17:01,320
but that oldest peculiar conditions. Okay, So going into World

254
00:17:01,360 --> 00:17:05,920
War One, the combatant states like, yeah, I mean there

255
00:17:05,960 --> 00:17:09,680
was there's complex historical factors that conspired to make it happen.

256
00:17:10,880 --> 00:17:16,839
But the major combatants figured that, well, you know, this

257
00:17:16,960 --> 00:17:22,079
is going to resolve pretty rapidly, you know, and the

258
00:17:22,160 --> 00:17:29,839
British especially thought that. And you know, I this is

259
00:17:29,839 --> 00:17:34,599
a discussion for another series, but I said during the

260
00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:36,480
World War One series that a whole veg I think

261
00:17:36,640 --> 00:17:40,880
was I mean, he was a really sympathetic figure in

262
00:17:41,039 --> 00:17:46,240
the Great War, and that that perfectly exemplifies like what

263
00:17:46,319 --> 00:17:48,799
Howe was talking about, the kind of the the nam

264
00:17:48,839 --> 00:17:51,319
between like a whole veg the consular and and and

265
00:17:51,400 --> 00:17:56,920
the Kaiser. You know, Wilhelm was not a good man

266
00:17:57,480 --> 00:18:01,160
and he he did not have good aptitude. But even

267
00:18:01,200 --> 00:18:05,039
if you had, there was like this bizarre kind of

268
00:18:07,400 --> 00:18:10,640
tango where you had you had like you know, the

269
00:18:10,759 --> 00:18:13,440
leader of government and a Joveg. Then you had literally

270
00:18:13,519 --> 00:18:16,640
the Kaiser who was the king. Then you had these

271
00:18:16,640 --> 00:18:20,400
industrialists and both Hoveg and the Kaiser they had to

272
00:18:20,519 --> 00:18:26,319
organize like purchasing you know, arms, munitions, figuring out some

273
00:18:26,400 --> 00:18:34,359
way to appropriate manufacturing and means the sustain battlefield demands,

274
00:18:34,519 --> 00:18:38,359
but also compensating these private actors for like you know,

275
00:18:38,400 --> 00:18:41,599
their outlays and things. So it's like you got kind

276
00:18:41,599 --> 00:18:44,359
of like three bases of sovereignty that are that are

277
00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:50,200
basically at odds and have competing interests, but they're all

278
00:18:50,279 --> 00:18:56,799
profiting or at least you know, surviving by virtue of

279
00:18:56,839 --> 00:19:01,839
this war enterprise, you know, and it leaves us conditions

280
00:19:01,880 --> 00:19:05,039
where like nobody's really in charge. And like Hobwa made

281
00:19:05,119 --> 00:19:08,480
that point too. You know, and that's why I put

282
00:19:08,519 --> 00:19:12,880
him kind of head and shows above most most Marxists

283
00:19:12,920 --> 00:19:14,400
who just say like, oh, well, world war want to

284
00:19:14,400 --> 00:19:18,440
happen because you know, of overproduction, you know, like and

285
00:19:18,480 --> 00:19:21,240
that that's that's ridiculous, Like, well, Wan didn't happen because

286
00:19:21,279 --> 00:19:23,880
there was some conspiracy of capitalists like well, we got

287
00:19:23,880 --> 00:19:26,440
to kill off, you know, our workers because there's you know,

288
00:19:26,440 --> 00:19:29,200
we can't employ them, and well, you know we we don't,

289
00:19:29,240 --> 00:19:31,240
we don't we don't have a destination for these over

290
00:19:31,319 --> 00:19:33,319
produced goods, so we're just gonna blow them up on

291
00:19:33,359 --> 00:19:36,440
the battlefield. Like nobody thinks that way. And that's also

292
00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:39,839
not like wars happened. And if that was the case,

293
00:19:40,319 --> 00:19:43,680
Like if that was true, like basically anytime there was

294
00:19:43,680 --> 00:19:47,640
a major recession, like the president would just like devise

295
00:19:47,680 --> 00:19:50,480
a war like that, That's not how things happen, you know,

296
00:19:50,559 --> 00:19:53,920
Like if if there was a huge financial crisis next

297
00:19:54,000 --> 00:19:57,279
year and America and the Chinese would be like, let's

298
00:19:57,319 --> 00:19:59,319
like let's pretend to have a war and sink each

299
00:19:59,319 --> 00:20:02,039
other's navies, Like, well, would that accomplished? You know? That's

300
00:20:02,079 --> 00:20:04,720
I mean, I'm being ubtoced deliberately, But this is an

301
00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:08,599
important point because they're refrained. Even a guys should know better.

302
00:20:08,599 --> 00:20:10,759
It's like, well, war is about big business or it's

303
00:20:10,759 --> 00:20:13,359
about money. It's like, no, it's not, man like, how

304
00:20:13,440 --> 00:20:17,480
is it about money? Like how? I mean, yeah, people

305
00:20:17,559 --> 00:20:20,319
definitely find ways to profit from war, but you can

306
00:20:20,359 --> 00:20:23,799
profit from literally anything, you know. I mean, that's that

307
00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:27,839
doesn't tell us anything, you know, but that's this is

308
00:20:27,880 --> 00:20:32,720
fundamentally important. And this not not just the catach to

309
00:20:32,759 --> 00:20:35,200
feel the Great War and you know the fact that

310
00:20:35,200 --> 00:20:38,319
it kind of deformed an entire generation, and I mean

311
00:20:38,440 --> 00:20:41,519
and put an entire generation in the grave as well,

312
00:20:41,559 --> 00:20:46,200
but it these these these tensions and these uncertainties. This

313
00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:49,279
is what's uh, this is what facility. This is what

314
00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:54,200
expedited the Bolshevik Revolution, which very easily, by the way,

315
00:20:54,319 --> 00:20:59,160
could have prevailed europe wide. You know, I mean it's uh.

316
00:20:59,519 --> 00:21:02,880
I'm the first to acknowledge, as any serious student in

317
00:21:02,880 --> 00:21:12,480
the twentieth century, is it's strange that the literal heart

318
00:21:12,759 --> 00:21:18,319
of the of the Communist International was Russia. That's that's weird.

319
00:21:19,279 --> 00:21:23,559
But people conveniently forget or they just don't know because

320
00:21:23,599 --> 00:21:27,839
they they're subjected to bad history, you know. I mean,

321
00:21:27,920 --> 00:21:30,440
there was a communist revolution in Germany, there was a

322
00:21:30,480 --> 00:21:33,519
communist revolution in Hungary. There almost was in the UK.

323
00:21:34,160 --> 00:21:36,680
You know, this stuff was stopped by force of arms.

324
00:21:37,039 --> 00:21:40,400
It didn't just fizzle out or something, you know. But

325
00:21:42,039 --> 00:21:44,599
this is the way to understand the twentieth century and

326
00:21:44,640 --> 00:21:49,559
the degree to which, you know, the twentieth century was

327
00:21:49,640 --> 00:21:56,400
basically a reaction to communism. I mean, they can't be overstated,

328
00:21:57,319 --> 00:22:01,240
you know, in power political terms. I mean, like obviously,

329
00:22:01,279 --> 00:22:06,200
if we're talking about human life at scale in any book,

330
00:22:06,279 --> 00:22:11,400
there's an entire myriad of factors across a broad spectrum

331
00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:21,279
that go into that. But the kind of key takeaway is, uh,

332
00:22:21,599 --> 00:22:27,759
you know what Osbon called the age of capitalism like

333
00:22:27,839 --> 00:22:33,400
facilitated this and like that's he actually he wrote an

334
00:22:33,519 --> 00:22:36,079
essay that became a book called The Age of capital

335
00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:42,440
eighteen forty eight to eighteen seventy five. And he makes

336
00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:45,960
the point the word capitalism it first entered like the

337
00:22:46,079 --> 00:22:50,000
let the academic lexicon in the eighteen sixties, you know,

338
00:22:51,279 --> 00:22:55,960
from eighteen forty eight, like after the revolutions in Europe

339
00:22:56,000 --> 00:23:01,599
were quashed in both Europe and America, there was this

340
00:23:01,680 --> 00:23:06,480
there's this kind of like massive economic boom okay. And

341
00:23:06,519 --> 00:23:09,519
that's one of the things that meant that there wasn't

342
00:23:09,519 --> 00:23:14,799
another like eighteen forty eight like revolutionary sentiment, because like

343
00:23:14,839 --> 00:23:19,359
there's a lot of wealth being produced, you know. But

344
00:23:19,519 --> 00:23:23,400
again there was these kinds of like obsolete social structures

345
00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:29,000
that were sort of organizing people's lives. Nonetheless, yet these

346
00:23:29,039 --> 00:23:35,519
societies were flooded with capital. But it was it wasn't

347
00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:38,799
it was. It was very much like funnel into specific channels,

348
00:23:38,839 --> 00:23:42,759
you know, not by conspiracy of design or something. But

349
00:23:44,599 --> 00:23:47,839
there just was not like a free like like individual

350
00:23:47,880 --> 00:23:50,200
people and not a lot of person power, and this

351
00:23:50,319 --> 00:23:55,359
created like weird disparities, you know, like there wasn't there's

352
00:23:55,400 --> 00:23:59,720
a lot of like if you're a if you're a neoliberal,

353
00:23:59,759 --> 00:24:03,000
like an economists, you look at this as like basic

354
00:24:03,079 --> 00:24:07,119
market and efficiencies. You know, this is why like banking

355
00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:11,599
is so important to like the monitorist view. And then

356
00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:16,880
they're right about that. You know, the availability of capital

357
00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:23,240
and you know, uh competence and financial instruments like that.

358
00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:26,200
That's that's the regulatory mechanism that's essential. But beyond that,

359
00:24:26,240 --> 00:24:29,160
you basically need like capital flow like where it's going

360
00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:34,319
to be most efficiently allocated in order to produce produce wealth,

361
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:36,920
and that that wasn't really happening, despite the fact that

362
00:24:36,960 --> 00:24:40,839
you had you know, you had kind of at the

363
00:24:40,880 --> 00:24:45,519
top and also kind of like unevenly distributed like sort

364
00:24:45,519 --> 00:24:50,240
of throughout the sociological spectrum. You know, you had some

365
00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:53,599
like some incredible innovations that were like aldering people's lives.

366
00:24:54,079 --> 00:24:57,400
And there was like government could simply do things that

367
00:24:57,440 --> 00:24:59,640
it couldn't before. I mean, like wet World War One

368
00:24:59,720 --> 00:25:02,680
like that totally insane. Like the ability to mobilize like

369
00:25:02,799 --> 00:25:06,079
five million men, arm them, equip them, feed them, then

370
00:25:06,119 --> 00:25:09,160
like turn them loose to like assault your ops like

371
00:25:10,160 --> 00:25:12,319
that that would be like unthinkable even in like the

372
00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:17,319
Napoleonic era, you know. And it's not just modern command

373
00:25:17,319 --> 00:25:19,759
and control. It was like transportation, it was you know,

374
00:25:20,680 --> 00:25:23,599
it was a more efficient fuel sources. It was like

375
00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:25,680
more efficient killing technology. I mean it was it was

376
00:25:25,680 --> 00:25:31,839
like it was all these things. But the uh, something

377
00:25:31,880 --> 00:25:34,640
else that's important to is Hoblom said, And he was

378
00:25:34,640 --> 00:25:37,279
writing this in the fifties. You see first world say

379
00:25:37,279 --> 00:25:41,119
like in the fifties, but this age of capital, this

380
00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:43,559
was like the first this was like the Nasca earliest

381
00:25:43,599 --> 00:25:49,960
stage of global globalization, okay, because if you were a

382
00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:53,559
major capitalist power, you know, and again I involved in

383
00:25:53,640 --> 00:25:56,960
our capitalists and within the terms HOSWOM doesn't, I don't

384
00:25:57,039 --> 00:26:02,880
use those kinds of terms. But you know, you the

385
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:07,880
British Empire held equity basically on every continent, you know,

386
00:26:08,240 --> 00:26:13,359
and America was not yet a superpower, but you'd find

387
00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:21,799
American goods basically all over the world. Okay. And there

388
00:26:21,880 --> 00:26:28,440
wasn't a there wasn't a unified banking structure, but lending

389
00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:33,960
across national frontiers at scale, with governments guaranteeing financial instruments

390
00:26:34,519 --> 00:26:38,880
that started blowing up, you know, and that that would

391
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:42,440
have been unthinkable before. You know, in a lot of

392
00:26:42,519 --> 00:26:46,799
countries it was literally illegal for UH national banks to

393
00:26:48,119 --> 00:26:51,720
you know, to trade across national frontiers or to or

394
00:26:51,759 --> 00:26:56,359
to issue financial instruments in foreign markets. But a lot

395
00:26:56,359 --> 00:26:59,440
of countries simply wouldn't deal in your currency, like even

396
00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:01,599
if it was UH, even even if it was viewed

397
00:27:01,599 --> 00:27:04,960
as you know, a desirable currency, and speculators would invest

398
00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:07,920
in it. Oh and and and pursing foreign currencies at

399
00:27:07,920 --> 00:27:10,359
this time was also largely illegal. It was quote unquote

400
00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:13,640
currency speculation. It was like literally a crime, which is crazy,

401
00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:16,920
but that that that that was the norm, you know.

402
00:27:20,799 --> 00:27:26,720
But this, uh, but because of that, like in the

403
00:27:26,759 --> 00:27:30,480
early stages of any economic system or any paradigm, not system,

404
00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:35,400
but like paradigm, there's gonna be like really really uneven growth, okay,

405
00:27:36,279 --> 00:27:39,720
and that's gonna lead to certain disparities. I'm not talking

406
00:27:39,839 --> 00:27:47,039
like social justice disparities. I mean like between enterprises, a

407
00:27:47,079 --> 00:27:49,039
lot of capital is being created, but a lot is

408
00:27:49,079 --> 00:27:55,640
being wiped out, like we just mentioned across national frontiers.

409
00:27:55,640 --> 00:28:01,759
This kind of development is uneven. But also certain industries

410
00:28:01,799 --> 00:28:08,480
develop a kind of outside cloud okay, and not the

411
00:28:08,599 --> 00:28:15,680
arms industry per se, but the the kind of a

412
00:28:15,759 --> 00:28:21,880
terrestrial manufacturing enterprises that facilitate the arms industry. They developed

413
00:28:21,920 --> 00:28:29,119
outsized power like as did again you know, uh, financial institutions.

414
00:28:29,720 --> 00:28:32,160
This wasn't some conspiracy and that's not why World War

415
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:35,759
went happened, but it was a but it facilitated resorting

416
00:28:35,799 --> 00:28:43,039
to military measures to remedy power, political imbalances h at scale. Okay,

417
00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:47,920
it was a perfect storm at things. And again that's

418
00:28:47,960 --> 00:28:51,599
that's really important, you know. And in my own like

419
00:28:51,720 --> 00:28:56,960
manuscript to try and emphasize this point and has I don't.

420
00:28:57,039 --> 00:28:59,519
It's not like my primary authority on that, but I

421
00:28:59,599 --> 00:29:12,480
do site. But uh yeah, moving on, it's also too domestically,

422
00:29:12,680 --> 00:29:16,279
whether you're talking about the United States, the UK, France,

423
00:29:16,359 --> 00:29:20,960
or Germany, the way such things about to mention were

424
00:29:21,039 --> 00:29:25,920
characterized kind of differed along the you know, local custom

425
00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:30,599
and cultural differences and convention, but kind of like the

426
00:29:30,720 --> 00:29:35,279
lingua franc of government became you know this like there's

427
00:29:35,279 --> 00:29:39,599
like this resurgence that sort of like enlightenment shibalus. So

428
00:29:40,319 --> 00:29:43,559
whether you're in Berlin, London, Washington, Paris, all your heart

429
00:29:43,599 --> 00:29:45,920
from government is oh see, like this is like an

430
00:29:46,039 --> 00:29:49,759
age of unprecedented plenty. You know, it's the age of

431
00:29:49,920 --> 00:29:55,039
reason and science and progress. But people were getting like

432
00:29:55,119 --> 00:29:58,200
ground into dust, you know, and like working in a

433
00:29:58,240 --> 00:30:02,160
factory or a slaughterhouse. That was like hell, you know,

434
00:30:02,200 --> 00:30:05,839
it's not I tell a lot of guys in the

435
00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:09,160
right who they you know, they throw shade on stuff

436
00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:13,519
like Upton Sinclair's the jungle, and I'm like, okay, I'm like, yeah,

437
00:30:13,559 --> 00:30:16,480
I don't agree with those kinds of conclusions either. But

438
00:30:16,559 --> 00:30:20,279
what he describes, that's that's that's one hundred percent accurate.

439
00:30:20,920 --> 00:30:25,680
You know, there'd be guys. Uh, there was no welfare state.

440
00:30:25,839 --> 00:30:28,279
You couldn't just get like a link card. So if

441
00:30:28,279 --> 00:30:31,240
you were out of work, like you weren't eating and

442
00:30:31,920 --> 00:30:35,839
basically your ability to make a living depended on your

443
00:30:35,880 --> 00:30:40,160
ability to physically like perform, you know, and guys would

444
00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:42,839
die on the job like there's like ten percent like

445
00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:46,039
attrition and like a steel mill or like a slaughterhouse,

446
00:30:46,599 --> 00:30:48,799
you know, and if god for biddy get injured or

447
00:30:48,839 --> 00:30:52,440
like you lose three fingers on your hand in some machine.

448
00:30:53,519 --> 00:30:58,000
You know, they're the biggest surplus in any major city

449
00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:00,160
at this time was like that of like able lot

450
00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:01,359
of men who want to work.

451
00:31:02,039 --> 00:31:06,039
Speaker 1: So did did hobs Im have anything to say about

452
00:31:06,039 --> 00:31:11,200
the move from agrarianism to basically employment where you're providing

453
00:31:11,200 --> 00:31:14,400
for yourself with your own with your own hands. And

454
00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:17,039
then all of a sudden, it seems, in the span

455
00:31:17,119 --> 00:31:20,240
of a decade, people are moving to cities to get jobs.

456
00:31:21,200 --> 00:31:24,480
Speaker 2: Yeah he uh, yeah, yeah, he got he got a

457
00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:25,000
lot into that.

458
00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:30,319
Speaker 3: I mean, the the extrapolation of you know, the household

459
00:31:30,400 --> 00:31:35,160
being the center of production to people being forced to

460
00:31:35,240 --> 00:31:38,519
sell their lever as some sort of factory worker.

461
00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:43,839
Speaker 2: Like, yeah, that was tremendously disruptive and you know it also,

462
00:31:45,119 --> 00:31:50,519
I mean, hos Mom was insightful in his sociological takedown because,

463
00:31:50,599 --> 00:31:54,519
unlike a lot of people, you know, show Humpeter's big

464
00:31:54,559 --> 00:31:58,000
critique of the Marcus paradigm, and I'm gonna bring this back.

465
00:31:58,039 --> 00:32:01,519
I'm going somewhere with this, well, like, look like Marxists

466
00:32:01,519 --> 00:32:04,799
aren't really talking about class. Like the job you do

467
00:32:05,039 --> 00:32:08,079
isn't your class, you know, like your class is what

468
00:32:08,119 --> 00:32:13,240
you're born into, and it's defined by how you relate

469
00:32:13,359 --> 00:32:16,640
to other people similarly born to this kind of like

470
00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:23,240
social stratum that isn't really mobile, you know. So in

471
00:32:23,319 --> 00:32:27,400
Schumpeter's view, which is the traditional view, it doesn't matter

472
00:32:27,440 --> 00:32:30,079
what job you're doing around which money you have, Like,

473
00:32:30,079 --> 00:32:32,079
that's not what we're talking about. We're talking about a class,

474
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:35,279
and class isn't something you can just like jump up

475
00:32:35,279 --> 00:32:39,880
from or down from, like within a generation. And Osbom

476
00:32:40,000 --> 00:32:42,839
accepted some of those premises. He's like, yeah, you know,

477
00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:46,720
one of the reasons why the working class exists is

478
00:32:46,759 --> 00:32:52,480
because the social capital that kind of facilitated no blessedge

479
00:32:52,640 --> 00:32:55,240
oblige as well as you know, kind of the communitarian

480
00:32:55,599 --> 00:33:00,119
impulse that you know, stood in for the wealth or

481
00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:05,039
state in antiquity and things. It's like capitalism like rips

482
00:33:05,079 --> 00:33:07,119
all that apart, and it makes every man like a

483
00:33:07,160 --> 00:33:10,680
stranger and it enshrines the war of all against all,

484
00:33:11,559 --> 00:33:16,279
not only as like an im an implacable reality, but

485
00:33:16,319 --> 00:33:20,480
as like a positive good. Almost. So the only thing

486
00:33:20,519 --> 00:33:23,200
you have in common with like your neighbors, figuratively and

487
00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:27,319
literally is that you're all being crushed like in these

488
00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:31,759
in this like industrial labor environment, and you know, you've

489
00:33:31,799 --> 00:33:35,240
got to stand together or all die. And that's like

490
00:33:35,359 --> 00:33:38,279
what the working class is. You know, it's not it's

491
00:33:38,319 --> 00:33:41,319
not a class in like the traditional sense, or there's

492
00:33:41,359 --> 00:33:46,599
not some like basic affinity between between peoples, like they're

493
00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:50,839
your comrades because you're you're like in the same way

494
00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:53,400
you are like with the guys you're like unjustly locked

495
00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:57,000
in prison with. You know, it's it's circumstances that like

496
00:33:57,119 --> 00:34:01,720
drive you together. So and that and that that actually

497
00:34:01,759 --> 00:34:04,640
tracks with like what marsh was talking about in dos Capital,

498
00:34:04,799 --> 00:34:08,719
Like if when you talk about alienation, he's not just

499
00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:13,159
talking about the process of whereby labor is not personal anymore.

500
00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:16,880
You don't create things, you're not a producer. You're just

501
00:34:16,920 --> 00:34:19,599
doing this like pointless process, like over and over and

502
00:34:19,639 --> 00:34:23,639
over again. It's dangerous and dirty and painful, but it's

503
00:34:23,760 --> 00:34:26,280
alienation from your fellow man. And even if you haven't

504
00:34:26,280 --> 00:34:28,079
to be married, like you never see your wife. She

505
00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:31,320
she's stuck with some dangerous, dirty job like you have

506
00:34:32,159 --> 00:34:35,840
you know, at the end of the day, like maybe

507
00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:37,559
you like get to sleep in the same bed as

508
00:34:37,599 --> 00:34:40,880
her and occasionally you collide in intimacy and have children.

509
00:34:41,599 --> 00:34:45,719
But he's like that that alienation touchs and concerns every

510
00:34:46,760 --> 00:34:49,599
aspect of the workers existence. It's not it's not. It

511
00:34:49,599 --> 00:34:53,239
doesn't just like remove his labor from his own domain

512
00:34:53,519 --> 00:34:57,119
and creative power. It alienates him from like what should

513
00:34:57,159 --> 00:34:59,400
be his community. It alienates him from his eth nose,

514
00:34:59,440 --> 00:35:02,039
It alienates him from his life. That alienates him from

515
00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:05,960
you know, he doesn't have neighbors anymore. You know that

516
00:35:06,400 --> 00:35:10,760
this all tracks and yeah, so he makes a lot

517
00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:13,440
out of that, and that's one of the reasons why

518
00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:20,199
this process whereby the Vestigel aristocracy, he's able to like

519
00:35:20,320 --> 00:35:26,679
hang on to power because people were people like bonded

520
00:35:26,760 --> 00:35:31,719
in pe andage. They are dependent upon like the lord

521
00:35:31,719 --> 00:35:36,519
of the manner. And this is a deeply psychological process. Okay,

522
00:35:37,119 --> 00:35:41,119
and it's enduring. It's in a cosmon view. Okay, this alien

523
00:35:41,159 --> 00:35:44,440
this this this alienation that is a matter of life

524
00:35:44,440 --> 00:35:46,119
and death. In a lot of cases, that sounds a

525
00:35:46,119 --> 00:35:48,840
matter of quoit of life, like it stands to kill you.

526
00:35:50,280 --> 00:35:53,320
He's like, really, the only remedy these people have is

527
00:35:53,519 --> 00:35:56,000
like appeal to the church or to like appeal to

528
00:35:56,960 --> 00:35:59,840
traditional social elements that are kind of like the guardians

529
00:35:59,880 --> 00:36:02,039
of the culture, if you want to think about it

530
00:36:02,039 --> 00:36:06,119
that way. So they appeal to aristocrats and stuff, you know,

531
00:36:06,239 --> 00:36:09,079
for justice. And that's one of the things that keeps

532
00:36:09,119 --> 00:36:12,960
these guys like if not relevant, like able to remain

533
00:36:13,119 --> 00:36:17,199
like in situ you know. That's why hospital made.

534
00:36:17,559 --> 00:36:20,440
Speaker 1: It keeps it keeps the revolution in stasis. There's no

535
00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:22,639
there's no chance of having a revolution.

536
00:36:22,719 --> 00:36:26,559
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, And so guys like a hosball. And he

537
00:36:26,599 --> 00:36:29,920
said this was the big problem in during like this

538
00:36:30,039 --> 00:36:34,400
the long crisis he talked about, because uh, there was

539
00:36:34,440 --> 00:36:37,960
always like technological innovation and this kind of future shock

540
00:36:38,039 --> 00:36:43,239
and disturbance, but putical cultures were like frozen, you know,

541
00:36:43,719 --> 00:36:46,719
and that was that I mean, that's that's the point

542
00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:50,400
of like any revolutionary Marxist in the twentieth century, but

543
00:36:50,440 --> 00:36:55,320
Cosmon especially because I think that he had a particular

544
00:36:55,760 --> 00:36:59,440
emphasis as well as insight into sociological questions. He's like,

545
00:36:59,480 --> 00:37:02,159
we've got to educate people to break them of these things,

546
00:37:02,239 --> 00:37:04,559
of these tendencies. We've basically got to like break them

547
00:37:04,559 --> 00:37:08,480
on their short term self interest or their attachment to it,

548
00:37:08,880 --> 00:37:12,239
because we've got to literally kill the aristocracy. We've got

549
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:15,360
to allow the bourgeoisie to conquer everything. We've got to

550
00:37:15,440 --> 00:37:18,519
let them consolidate, we've got to let them create conditions

551
00:37:18,519 --> 00:37:23,000
of plenty before we kill them tigurically and literally. You know,

552
00:37:23,880 --> 00:37:28,880
it's a very brutal view of a struggle processes, but

553
00:37:29,199 --> 00:37:34,159
within the bound and rationality of Marxist Leninism that tracks,

554
00:37:34,920 --> 00:37:40,480
you know, and there is like a kernel of truth

555
00:37:40,559 --> 00:37:43,199
to it, not in terms of its ethical conclusions, but

556
00:37:44,159 --> 00:37:48,119
I mean, like today this is a bit of a tangent,

557
00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:51,119
but I'm list making the point to guys, this has

558
00:37:51,239 --> 00:37:56,719
died somewhat, but it's it won't die completely. This is

559
00:37:56,719 --> 00:38:00,840
the favorite refrain of dissident p Well, it's gonna be

560
00:38:00,840 --> 00:38:03,559
a massive financial collapse, had a great depression, that's never

561
00:38:03,599 --> 00:38:08,239
going to happen again, okay, because it can't happen in

562
00:38:08,280 --> 00:38:13,719
the state of information awareness. Like to the second information awareness,

563
00:38:14,239 --> 00:38:17,320
that kind of stuff only happens long to uncertainties. There's

564
00:38:17,360 --> 00:38:20,679
not uncertainties anymore. Like that doesn't mean the dollar can't

565
00:38:20,719 --> 00:38:23,440
like bottom out, but even if it did, that doesn't

566
00:38:23,519 --> 00:38:26,519
mean like you're not going to be able to buy food. Okay,

567
00:38:27,280 --> 00:38:32,000
Now there could absolutely be shortages. I don't believe in

568
00:38:32,039 --> 00:38:35,239
climate change in the sense of these crazy people who

569
00:38:35,400 --> 00:38:39,639
think who were to stand in like apocalypse cult for them,

570
00:38:40,480 --> 00:38:45,480
But I'm certain that there's all kinds of environmental factors

571
00:38:45,519 --> 00:38:48,079
that just a way to God's will or the nuances

572
00:38:48,119 --> 00:38:55,320
of of of this planet. I could easily see famines

573
00:38:55,400 --> 00:38:58,480
coming back. I mean, and you know, I mean it's

574
00:38:58,599 --> 00:39:02,119
if they're but it suddenly became impossible to grow certain

575
00:39:02,199 --> 00:39:05,519
kinds of crops that would food oar everything. I mean,

576
00:39:05,599 --> 00:39:08,800
So I absolutely do not say like crises can't happen.

577
00:39:09,039 --> 00:39:13,280
But it's idea that you know, like owing to miscalculation

578
00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:21,280
or owing to like a gap in you know, information awareness,

579
00:39:21,320 --> 00:39:25,400
you know of hours or days, like you know, like

580
00:39:25,239 --> 00:39:27,320
like billions of dollars is gonna be like wiped out

581
00:39:27,360 --> 00:39:30,119
overnight in the stock market. That would never happen again.

582
00:39:30,159 --> 00:39:37,320
That's retarded, you know, And guys like Hoswom predicted that.

583
00:39:37,400 --> 00:39:40,400
He said, stuff's gonna largely be rubberized moving forward. There's

584
00:39:40,440 --> 00:39:42,960
not gonna be like food shortages. You know, there's not

585
00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:45,639
gonna it's gonna be very easy to produce things that

586
00:39:45,920 --> 00:39:49,719
today him talking in like nineteen fifties are hard to produce.

587
00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:52,360
You know, you're gonna like a lot of these problems

588
00:39:52,360 --> 00:39:54,920
are gonna go a way, you know, and that and

589
00:39:54,960 --> 00:39:58,239
that happened, you know, And that's one of the reasons

590
00:39:59,320 --> 00:40:02,559
why this is I mean, it's probably not the skupe.

591
00:40:02,639 --> 00:40:05,360
But one of the ways we can tell like our

592
00:40:05,400 --> 00:40:08,400
government is like full of like crackheads and insane people

593
00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:13,360
is because if they didn't overreach and remotely smart, they

594
00:40:13,360 --> 00:40:17,400
could basically hold on to power indefinitely. Because this isn't

595
00:40:17,400 --> 00:40:21,480
the nineteen twenties, because because people aren't going hungry, because

596
00:40:21,480 --> 00:40:23,719
there's not a military draft or we're respected to like

597
00:40:23,800 --> 00:40:27,119
sacrifice your son in a meat grinder. You know, there's

598
00:40:27,159 --> 00:40:31,519
not a Soviet Union whereby you know, at any at

599
00:40:31,559 --> 00:40:35,920
any time basically, you know, some enemy society that's like

600
00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:39,639
mobilized at massive scale could decide to like sue for

601
00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:46,239
war to remedy the kind of uneven power paradigm, you know.

602
00:40:46,320 --> 00:40:49,320
Like so so it's it's you can tell these people

603
00:40:49,320 --> 00:40:52,039
are insane because like they're they're basically burning the house

604
00:40:52,119 --> 00:40:56,840
down when there's no reason to do that. But you

605
00:40:56,880 --> 00:41:01,079
know that the degree to which, uh that that's also

606
00:41:01,079 --> 00:41:05,000
why too. I mean, like I said, I I it's

607
00:41:04,800 --> 00:41:07,239
it's it's dumb for people to claim that people like

608
00:41:07,320 --> 00:41:12,000
Missus Harris are Marxists anyway, but it's Marxism isn't just Marxism,

609
00:41:12,039 --> 00:41:16,320
isn't wokeism. It's not it's not it's not liberalism. It's

610
00:41:16,800 --> 00:41:21,920
it's it's it's a very discreete uh like claim and

611
00:41:22,039 --> 00:41:27,920
series of claims about historical processes. And in the short term,

612
00:41:28,320 --> 00:41:32,199
Marxists absolutely want capitalists to succeed. They don't want it

613
00:41:32,239 --> 00:41:35,480
to fail. They wanted to fully succeed. They wanted to

614
00:41:35,559 --> 00:41:38,159
conquer everything, and then they want to kill the people

615
00:41:38,239 --> 00:41:42,159
at the helms of the apparatus. Like that's the whole point.

616
00:41:42,360 --> 00:41:48,800
You know what what's strange about how it developed in

617
00:41:48,920 --> 00:41:55,800
terms of actual praxis is that it did it did

618
00:41:56,079 --> 00:41:59,519
again like the like like the quite literally like the

619
00:41:59,559 --> 00:42:02,159
heart of the of the Bolshrek Revolution in the real

620
00:42:02,199 --> 00:42:05,440
world was a place that really had no like industrial

621
00:42:05,519 --> 00:42:09,239
working class. You know. It was just like basically backwards

622
00:42:09,320 --> 00:42:14,760
monarchy that ruled over this this this is this massive territory,

623
00:42:15,000 --> 00:42:16,719
you know, like the Russian Empire had more in common

624
00:42:16,760 --> 00:42:19,639
with the Ottomans than it did with Europe. Okay, I'm

625
00:42:19,679 --> 00:42:22,960
not saying like racially or whatever. Like, I'm not taking

626
00:42:23,000 --> 00:42:24,599
a position on that, So I don't know if people

627
00:42:24,639 --> 00:42:27,280
get mad, But in terms of the way it was

628
00:42:27,320 --> 00:42:30,079
structured and in terms of it being like an anachronism

629
00:42:31,239 --> 00:42:33,719
in the twentieth century when it finally got brought down,

630
00:42:34,400 --> 00:42:38,159
it's really really strange that this is where the Bolshrek

631
00:42:38,239 --> 00:42:42,400
Revolution was consolidated and truly succeeded. You know. That's why

632
00:42:42,480 --> 00:42:47,039
That's one of the reasons why when I talk a

633
00:42:47,079 --> 00:42:50,679
lot to these guys. I'm not Jackson Hinkle himself, I

634
00:42:51,039 --> 00:42:53,559
don't know him, but I know guys in his orbit

635
00:42:53,639 --> 00:42:57,079
and guys described to that kind of worldview. So like,

636
00:42:57,079 --> 00:42:58,800
there are a lot of the like rebuttals to people

637
00:42:58,840 --> 00:43:00,559
like me are like, well, you can't strap late a

638
00:43:00,559 --> 00:43:03,920
lot in the Soviet Union. It's like, well, I can

639
00:43:04,039 --> 00:43:07,280
but even if I accept that postulate, well, I can't

640
00:43:07,400 --> 00:43:12,320
extrapolate a lot, even by your own criteria from East Germany. Okay,

641
00:43:12,400 --> 00:43:13,840
you know, and it's well there you go. Okay, you

642
00:43:13,880 --> 00:43:16,119
tell you tell me, like East Germany wasn't an industrial

643
00:43:16,159 --> 00:43:19,159
state like it I I mean, if you want to

644
00:43:19,159 --> 00:43:22,199
perfectly realize, like marcis Alana state, it was the DDR.

645
00:43:22,480 --> 00:43:25,119
I mean that they can't be argued. I mean, I

646
00:43:25,119 --> 00:43:27,840
suppose like they're I suppose they're like rebuttal of that

647
00:43:27,880 --> 00:43:30,760
would be like, well, that was an artificial state that

648
00:43:30,880 --> 00:43:34,360
emerged out of like military exigencies, and you know the

649
00:43:34,400 --> 00:43:40,599
fact that it was beliguered and threatened, you know, owing

650
00:43:40,639 --> 00:43:44,840
to conditions imposed by capitalists like is somehow like takes

651
00:43:45,000 --> 00:43:48,840
off the tables as a pure example of practice, but

652
00:43:49,239 --> 00:43:56,239
because it may you know, the to bring it back again,

653
00:43:56,239 --> 00:44:01,679
I forget from ramblings. I don't feel good. But the uh,

654
00:44:02,039 --> 00:44:05,760
the degree of which again, like Mark, actual Marxists viewed

655
00:44:05,800 --> 00:44:09,840
these things as necessary processes like can't be denied. Like

656
00:44:10,159 --> 00:44:13,840
Marxist would not be in the street saying like we need,

657
00:44:14,039 --> 00:44:17,559
we need, we need Acne Widget Company to hire more

658
00:44:17,559 --> 00:44:20,760
women because it's bad not to, and they wouldn't be

659
00:44:20,760 --> 00:44:23,559
saying like we need to text these people more like

660
00:44:23,880 --> 00:44:27,239
none of that would be like in their horizon. They'd

661
00:44:27,280 --> 00:44:29,559
be like, we want Acne Widget Company to become like

662
00:44:29,599 --> 00:44:33,199
as massive as possible. We wanted to insinuate itself into everything.

663
00:44:33,760 --> 00:44:36,599
We wanted to be able to produce everything we need,

664
00:44:37,360 --> 00:44:40,440
you know, almost like magic. And then and then we

665
00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:42,559
want to kill the people who own it, and we

666
00:44:42,599 --> 00:44:45,039
want to take it and we want to make it

667
00:44:45,559 --> 00:44:49,159
the public domain of the workers. That's what they want

668
00:44:50,119 --> 00:44:54,239
or wanted. Like I said, I I like guys like

669
00:44:54,360 --> 00:44:56,840
Jackson Hinkel. I think they're playing an important role right

670
00:44:56,920 --> 00:45:00,280
now if if you're any kind of dissident or and

671
00:45:00,480 --> 00:45:02,360
any kind of actual resistance actor.

672
00:45:02,480 --> 00:45:06,440
Speaker 1: But the really interesting, the interesting thing about that is

673
00:45:07,800 --> 00:45:09,960
it's the way you know that these people who call

674
00:45:10,039 --> 00:45:16,199
themselves Marxists or call themselves communists nowadays aren't because they

675
00:45:16,199 --> 00:45:20,440
would want Elon to succeed and take over and become

676
00:45:20,840 --> 00:45:23,920
you know, like my friend Matt says his own Hensiatic league.

677
00:45:24,199 --> 00:45:26,960
They'd want him to do that so then they could

678
00:45:27,480 --> 00:45:30,679
take it over by force. But they they ship all

679
00:45:30,719 --> 00:45:32,320
over him and oh you know.

680
00:45:32,480 --> 00:45:35,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, the point that the degree to which these

681
00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:39,239
people today are just like goofy envy crats who were

682
00:45:39,320 --> 00:45:42,400
like it's just they're just like people who are like

683
00:45:42,760 --> 00:45:45,079
that guy's a big shot. I don't like him. It's

684
00:45:45,079 --> 00:45:47,159
like that basic, you know, and it's like it doesn't

685
00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:50,960
and like you can only that too is a symptom

686
00:45:51,000 --> 00:45:54,760
of prosperity as well, because even you read Ernest Younger

687
00:45:54,840 --> 00:45:57,920
was a fascinating guy in all kinds of ways, but

688
00:45:58,000 --> 00:46:01,679
he lived through this stuff and you know, he kind

689
00:46:01,719 --> 00:46:04,360
of he was kind of a strass arrist man, you know,

690
00:46:04,400 --> 00:46:07,960
like he he was very much a socialist. And if

691
00:46:08,000 --> 00:46:11,400
you read something like The glass Bes, the character of Zapparoni,

692
00:46:12,079 --> 00:46:14,000
like he's he's obviously like kind of a matchup. But

693
00:46:14,079 --> 00:46:19,800
like Howard Hughes and Andrew Carnegie and and like Walt Disney,

694
00:46:20,360 --> 00:46:23,679
but uh, you know, and like that, guys like Zapperoni

695
00:46:23,719 --> 00:46:27,960
are real type. But you know, guys like Younger thought,

696
00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:31,039
these guys were historical giants. They're like, these guys are

697
00:46:31,079 --> 00:46:33,760
gonna change the world. They're gonna change everything, and they're

698
00:46:33,800 --> 00:46:37,360
playing an essential role in this historical process. You know,

699
00:46:39,239 --> 00:46:43,679
that's it's not I mean, I'm I'm as anti communist

700
00:46:43,679 --> 00:46:46,239
as it's possible to be. I don't think that should

701
00:46:46,239 --> 00:46:50,480
be in dispute. But communists they're they're not dummies, or

702
00:46:50,519 --> 00:46:52,880
they weren't dummies. We're just like, I'm I don't like

703
00:46:52,960 --> 00:46:55,159
that guy because he has more stuff than me. It

704
00:46:55,360 --> 00:46:57,920
has nothing to do with that, you know, Like it's

705
00:46:57,920 --> 00:47:00,159
not it's not just like dumb lump in bullshit it

706
00:47:00,360 --> 00:47:04,559
or like guys who think like gangster rappers or something like.

707
00:47:04,599 --> 00:47:11,559
That's not like that. That's fucking retarded, you know. And this, uh,

708
00:47:12,639 --> 00:47:15,039
the these it's it's these like internet guys who have

709
00:47:15,119 --> 00:47:16,920
never read a book in their life, like calling people

710
00:47:17,559 --> 00:47:21,119
it's like goofy as fuck. But but no, I think

711
00:47:21,880 --> 00:47:24,679
you know, and today, uh I realizn't going kinside the scope.

712
00:47:24,760 --> 00:47:28,440
Don't forgive me for that. If it's some boring people,

713
00:47:28,519 --> 00:47:36,800
But guys like Emmanuel Wallerstein, guys who uh, these kinds

714
00:47:36,800 --> 00:47:41,119
of post Marxist types who do like talk about you know,

715
00:47:41,599 --> 00:47:44,920
social justice within globalism. I mean, yeah, obviously I don't

716
00:47:45,400 --> 00:47:48,679
like have common cause with those guys, but they're really

717
00:47:48,679 --> 00:47:51,719
the only like intelligent aspect of the left, and I

718
00:47:51,760 --> 00:47:54,519
think those guys are making a comeback because everybody hates

719
00:47:54,559 --> 00:47:57,519
the fucking regime and like literally everybody hates liberals, like

720
00:47:57,559 --> 00:47:59,960
everybody fucking hates liberals and things that are like awful.

721
00:48:00,039 --> 00:48:03,960
He's as a shit, you know. That's why, like I said,

722
00:48:04,039 --> 00:48:05,800
like people, I mean, he'll throw shaite on me all

723
00:48:05,800 --> 00:48:07,440
the time, and I don't care, like I'm not here

724
00:48:07,480 --> 00:48:11,239
to make friends, and I'm used to it. But you know,

725
00:48:11,360 --> 00:48:15,320
the they get mad at me, whether it's because you know,

726
00:48:15,360 --> 00:48:18,199
I got respect for Moslims and view them as like

727
00:48:18,239 --> 00:48:20,960
an essential part of the new resistance, or they get

728
00:48:20,960 --> 00:48:24,280
mad at me for like retweeting like Jackson Hinkle or something.

729
00:48:24,320 --> 00:48:29,239
But it's like they don't understand part of bringing down

730
00:48:30,599 --> 00:48:34,199
the regime and discrediting it is like pointing out not

731
00:48:34,239 --> 00:48:37,559
just how morally bankrupt it is, but how like staggering

732
00:48:37,760 --> 00:48:40,840
like ignorant it is and it's acolytes are you know?

733
00:48:40,880 --> 00:48:44,559
And if there's if there's a serious left wing with

734
00:48:44,679 --> 00:48:49,679
revolutionary ambitions, that's not a bunch of degenerate natural slaves,

735
00:48:49,719 --> 00:48:51,519
Like that's that's a good thing, man, Like how is

736
00:48:51,559 --> 00:48:53,880
that bad? You know? Like you got people can't like

737
00:48:53,920 --> 00:48:56,320
take their like personal feelings out of stuff. It's pathetic.

738
00:48:56,360 --> 00:48:58,360
It's like talking to a bunch of like it's like

739
00:48:58,440 --> 00:49:00,840
talking to a much other little kids, or like modeling

740
00:49:00,880 --> 00:49:07,079
old women or something. But the but that's you know,

741
00:49:07,119 --> 00:49:12,239
and that's also why you know again the like I said,

742
00:49:12,280 --> 00:49:15,000
we started out like that, that dude I'm not gonna name,

743
00:49:16,159 --> 00:49:20,440
you know, acting like uh, I was dropping cap when

744
00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:25,400
I was saying, like, you know, the it's ass nine

745
00:49:25,440 --> 00:49:32,679
to you know, to arrange force structure or to conceptualized

746
00:49:32,760 --> 00:49:36,039
grant strategy in like twentieth century terms, you know, like

747
00:49:36,079 --> 00:49:40,119
the like like twentieth century wars can never happen again.

748
00:49:40,159 --> 00:49:42,880
That's never going to happen again. You know, it's not

749
00:49:42,880 --> 00:49:46,440
gonna happen again in a thousand years, you know, like

750
00:49:46,519 --> 00:49:52,920
that that's the end of the uh. The the changing

751
00:49:53,440 --> 00:49:57,119
like like everything these days is changing, like I you know,

752
00:49:57,159 --> 00:49:59,519
like I mean the point before about like just today

753
00:49:59,519 --> 00:50:01,480
I was talking some of the fellas about like public

754
00:50:01,599 --> 00:50:05,599
education is dying and nobody believes anymore. Like those law

755
00:50:05,679 --> 00:50:08,960
enforcement like a couple of months back, they're like I

756
00:50:09,000 --> 00:50:12,400
see in Chicago now, like I said, even you know,

757
00:50:12,480 --> 00:50:15,679
like like policing is going to be privatized. It's you

758
00:50:15,719 --> 00:50:17,800
know in the South, like I mean you're in I'm

759
00:50:17,800 --> 00:50:19,920
sure you see this, you know how like they're still

760
00:50:19,920 --> 00:50:22,199
trying to fight the run drugs like it's nineteen eighty

761
00:50:22,239 --> 00:50:26,000
two or something, and like there was this ridiculous press

762
00:50:26,039 --> 00:50:30,599
conference and they like the Tennessee Threau of Investigation, they

763
00:50:30,679 --> 00:50:34,159
held this like press conference. It was them Homeland Security

764
00:50:34,360 --> 00:50:40,360
atf FBI. There was this holeless investigation that literally bust

765
00:50:40,480 --> 00:50:44,559
these like twoe like outlaw bikers like sligging meth. And

766
00:50:44,599 --> 00:50:47,400
they're like, we were taking drugs off the street. And

767
00:50:47,440 --> 00:50:50,480
the comments were like you people are idiots, you know,

768
00:50:50,519 --> 00:50:52,000
they're like what what do you think this is? You

769
00:50:52,039 --> 00:50:54,800
know it's like like there wasn't like a single positive

770
00:50:54,880 --> 00:50:58,320
comment man, and it's like this is like a time war.

771
00:50:58,639 --> 00:51:01,119
It's like what the fuck are these people doing? You know,

772
00:51:01,239 --> 00:51:04,000
like nobody believes in that garbage anymore. Now now you

773
00:51:04,039 --> 00:51:08,320
got Homeland security like shaken down like trailer park meth heads. Really,

774
00:51:09,039 --> 00:51:12,320
you know, like that's like that's pathetic, man. You know,

775
00:51:12,400 --> 00:51:19,960
this whole apparatus, the people sustaining it, there's like increasingly

776
00:51:20,039 --> 00:51:23,760
aged parasites who can't like adapt to the twenty first century,

777
00:51:24,480 --> 00:51:26,360
you know. And that's one of the things that swept

778
00:51:26,360 --> 00:51:30,320
Trump into power. It's the kindess of hobbsbamb and Franklin,

779
00:51:30,440 --> 00:51:34,119
the Marxist we're talking about, like like they the way

780
00:51:34,159 --> 00:51:37,400
they would have viewed Trump is like you know this,

781
00:51:37,519 --> 00:51:39,639
They wouldn't have viewed him some like arch reactionary. It

782
00:51:39,679 --> 00:51:41,800
would have been like, well that this guy's basically a

783
00:51:41,880 --> 00:51:44,119
con man, but he's saying he's gonna like sweep away

784
00:51:44,199 --> 00:51:49,119
these obsolescent aspects of state that people like don't think

785
00:51:49,159 --> 00:51:52,239
serves their interests anymore. And that and that's why a

786
00:51:52,239 --> 00:51:54,800
lot of people voted for Trump. It's not I mean, yeah,

787
00:51:54,800 --> 00:51:58,000
there's like people who just like love Trump. There's people

788
00:51:58,000 --> 00:52:01,719
who you know, like uh who would have voted for

789
00:52:01,840 --> 00:52:05,000
RFK Junior, who are just like protest voters, but like

790
00:52:05,079 --> 00:52:08,639
your average like man or lady, like it's not particularly

791
00:52:08,719 --> 00:52:12,000
politically sophisticated or inclined. Like they voted for Trump because

792
00:52:13,320 --> 00:52:16,519
their instincts are basically sound and they're like what what

793
00:52:16,519 --> 00:52:18,960
what the hell is going on here? Like we they'll

794
00:52:19,000 --> 00:52:21,119
put together that's a regime they live under, is like

795
00:52:21,159 --> 00:52:24,960
this twentieth century obsolete structure they don't think about in

796
00:52:24,960 --> 00:52:26,920
those turns and they realize, like this is like a

797
00:52:27,000 --> 00:52:31,360
zombie regime, like it doesn't make sense anymore, like why

798
00:52:31,400 --> 00:52:36,320
you know, like it's it's and then you know, it's

799
00:52:36,400 --> 00:52:40,960
a it's really interesting to see this develop in real time, man,

800
00:52:41,320 --> 00:52:45,400
you know. And that's why one of the things like

801
00:52:45,480 --> 00:52:48,480
part of my vetting process with people who I kind

802
00:52:48,480 --> 00:52:53,000
of take on as allies. I mean, that's a complicated process.

803
00:52:53,000 --> 00:52:55,519
I can't really break it down into like criteria, but

804
00:52:55,599 --> 00:52:57,800
one thing that's essential is like if like we do

805
00:52:57,880 --> 00:53:00,280
not want reactionaries. We do not want people who think

806
00:53:00,320 --> 00:53:02,679
the good old days were dope, or that we need

807
00:53:02,719 --> 00:53:05,760
to like turn back time or that, or people who

808
00:53:05,760 --> 00:53:10,000
think that like ncigue is like making things like where

809
00:53:10,000 --> 00:53:12,719
we take over the government and can like manage its pious.

810
00:53:12,880 --> 00:53:16,280
It's like people like that or not with the program.

811
00:53:16,719 --> 00:53:18,599
And I mean now that not only is that like

812
00:53:18,639 --> 00:53:21,559
not at all what we're about, but that's that's got

813
00:53:21,599 --> 00:53:24,840
nothing to do with the trajectory of history and stuff

814
00:53:24,840 --> 00:53:29,760
like that. I don't mean to be I don't mean

815
00:53:29,800 --> 00:53:31,679
to like abrogate this, but I really don't feel good.

816
00:53:31,800 --> 00:53:35,199
So if we could, like if we could if we

817
00:53:35,199 --> 00:53:37,559
could wrap it up, that'd be great. And if you

818
00:53:37,599 --> 00:53:39,760
want to, if you want to do another episode because

819
00:53:39,760 --> 00:53:43,599
this wasn't up to snuff, we can absolutely do that. No.

820
00:53:43,800 --> 00:53:46,880
Speaker 1: I I appreciated the conversation at the ending because I

821
00:53:46,880 --> 00:53:49,480
think that's a conversation that people on the right need

822
00:53:49,559 --> 00:53:50,000
to hear.

823
00:53:50,800 --> 00:53:51,039
Speaker 2: That.

824
00:53:51,400 --> 00:53:54,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think there's too much of a jump towards

825
00:53:55,159 --> 00:53:58,719
capitalism solves everything, you know, And I've been reading some

826
00:53:58,880 --> 00:54:02,679
A List's letters lately and it's really opening up my

827
00:54:02,719 --> 00:54:12,599
eyes to just how damaging the especially the overseas, the globalism,

828
00:54:13,559 --> 00:54:17,400
just what it does to you know, the vault and.

829
00:54:18,000 --> 00:54:20,920
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, what's also why it's crazy these people with

830
00:54:21,119 --> 00:54:23,599
like think they hate Maslims for no reason because some

831
00:54:23,719 --> 00:54:26,119
like Zionists on TV told them to, or because they

832
00:54:26,119 --> 00:54:29,159
think that because they think that like some like shit

833
00:54:29,239 --> 00:54:31,119
bag immigrants who did something to do to them is

834
00:54:31,159 --> 00:54:33,280
like Islam. It's like, man, you want to know, like

835
00:54:33,400 --> 00:54:36,719
darl Islam has been getting crushed man by globalism for decades.

836
00:54:37,280 --> 00:54:39,039
I mean, like they're on the front line of this shit,

837
00:54:39,119 --> 00:54:40,679
like it's happening to them is as bad as what

838
00:54:40,800 --> 00:54:43,119
was done to Europe. Like you're you think that's cool,

839
00:54:43,199 --> 00:54:45,320
like these guys you're ops because they're like fighting back

840
00:54:45,320 --> 00:54:48,320
against that shit. It's like, get the fuck out of here.

841
00:54:48,440 --> 00:54:50,960
I mean people actually think that way, are my ops?

842
00:54:51,199 --> 00:54:55,320
You know, like it's yeah, yeah, but it's also too

843
00:54:55,360 --> 00:55:01,400
like they it's probably internalizing, like enemy the septual vocabulary,

844
00:55:02,079 --> 00:55:06,400
like people who they they just like mirror like that.

845
00:55:06,480 --> 00:55:09,199
They use terms like racist or like they think like, oh,

846
00:55:09,239 --> 00:55:11,800
I'm a capitalist because that's who my ops like say,

847
00:55:11,840 --> 00:55:15,079
I am. It's like, so you define yourself, I will

848
00:55:15,159 --> 00:55:17,840
like somebody like Missus Harris or Joe Biden says, or

849
00:55:17,880 --> 00:55:21,920
like what some like idiot whet professor says like I

850
00:55:21,920 --> 00:55:24,280
I mean, how basic are you? You know? I don't

851
00:55:24,360 --> 00:55:26,079
use the kind of terms so they again we're talking

852
00:55:26,079 --> 00:55:29,960
about people like Osbam. I I kind of have to

853
00:55:30,039 --> 00:55:33,599
use a shorthand. You know. It's like but I don't.

854
00:55:33,719 --> 00:55:39,480
There's not there's there's not really. I'm not like a

855
00:55:39,519 --> 00:55:41,599
Kazinsky guy. I know like a lot of like I

856
00:55:41,639 --> 00:55:43,480
know a lot of like dissident type dudes really like

857
00:55:44,079 --> 00:55:46,159
head K. I mean, there's nothing wrong with like being

858
00:55:46,159 --> 00:55:51,840
into him. I've studied him extensively. I've read about Yeah,

859
00:55:51,840 --> 00:55:54,559
but what you called the industrial society, that's a lot

860
00:55:54,639 --> 00:56:01,400
more accurate, you know, like and coo industrials. People think

861
00:56:01,440 --> 00:56:04,119
that that book. People think that book is like I

862
00:56:04,159 --> 00:56:06,400
have a friend who says, oh, you can take an

863
00:56:06,440 --> 00:56:09,199
al Gore book and hold it right up next to it,

864
00:56:09,239 --> 00:56:11,280
and it's the same exact thing. It's like, No, he's

865
00:56:11,280 --> 00:56:15,039
writing about the human condition. He's right, what you know

866
00:56:15,239 --> 00:56:18,840
what the what the industrial revolution did or the human

867
00:56:18,880 --> 00:56:23,519
condition is? And I read out foor No, that's fucking retarded. Well,

868
00:56:23,519 --> 00:56:25,199
I mean these guys are just like say things like

869
00:56:25,199 --> 00:56:27,039
they don't I guarantee these guys like never read a

870
00:56:27,039 --> 00:56:31,400
book except maybe like some fucking airport paperback. But I no,

871
00:56:31,480 --> 00:56:36,519
I remember when the Manifesto dropped in ninety five or

872
00:56:36,599 --> 00:56:38,880
ninety six, I think it was. I think it was

873
00:56:38,880 --> 00:56:40,920
like late summer ninety five, but like when it ran in.

874
00:56:40,920 --> 00:56:42,960
Speaker 1: That late summer, late summer ninety five.

875
00:56:42,880 --> 00:56:45,639
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, when I ran the papers, like I made

876
00:56:45,639 --> 00:56:48,199
sure like I read it, you know, and it was

877
00:56:50,039 --> 00:56:52,280
it was, uh, it was insightful stuff. I mean he's

878
00:56:52,320 --> 00:56:54,599
got some blind spots, like especially a lot of like

879
00:56:54,639 --> 00:56:56,960
Massavon types do like a lot of those guys don't

880
00:56:56,960 --> 00:57:01,199
really fully grasp like politics, but uh, the stuff when

881
00:57:01,239 --> 00:57:04,480
when he was talking about technological development and the impact

882
00:57:04,480 --> 00:57:08,360
of production and labor and like how man like individually

883
00:57:08,440 --> 00:57:11,599
and collectively interfaces with that, that was pretty that was

884
00:57:11,639 --> 00:57:14,880
that was pretty insightful. And like I said, the term

885
00:57:14,960 --> 00:57:19,360
industrial society, that that that's a lot more meaningful than capitalism,

886
00:57:19,519 --> 00:57:22,119
you know, and it's and obviously too like a terms

887
00:57:22,119 --> 00:57:25,880
inherently reduction. It's like like the capitalist is everything he

888
00:57:25,920 --> 00:57:29,000
does is just like stack up capital and like assets.

889
00:57:29,039 --> 00:57:31,119
Like that's not that's not the way people think. Like

890
00:57:31,159 --> 00:57:33,039
even some guy in Wall Street who's like, you know,

891
00:57:33,119 --> 00:57:35,000
kind of a stereotypical walk he huster, that's not like

892
00:57:35,039 --> 00:57:40,119
the way he thinks, Like he's you know, he and

893
00:57:40,199 --> 00:57:42,239
at bas the reason he, like the reason a guy

894
00:57:42,320 --> 00:57:44,840
like that his world is defined by money is because

895
00:57:44,880 --> 00:57:47,840
that's like power activity in his world. And that's like

896
00:57:47,880 --> 00:57:50,159
a way, that's a way he can like engage in

897
00:57:50,199 --> 00:57:54,679
power activity congruous with like his discrete capabilities and and

898
00:57:54,760 --> 00:57:57,800
like psychology. It's not because like it's not like money

899
00:57:57,920 --> 00:58:00,199
is like this ending itself to everybody like in the

900
00:58:00,280 --> 00:58:03,760
capitalist system. But so I mean, that's these these things

901
00:58:03,800 --> 00:58:06,360
are important. But yeah, like again, man, like I said,

902
00:58:06,400 --> 00:58:08,800
sorry if this wasn't not the par but I it's been.

903
00:58:08,880 --> 00:58:11,039
I'm not trying to be a martyr. But just because

904
00:58:11,079 --> 00:58:14,920
like I do have responsibility to people, I thinks this

905
00:58:14,960 --> 00:58:17,239
week has not been great in terms.

906
00:58:17,079 --> 00:58:19,360
Speaker 1: Of what I think people. I think people like this

907
00:58:19,440 --> 00:58:20,559
episode more than you think.

908
00:58:21,000 --> 00:58:22,280
Speaker 2: Okay, that makes me happy.

909
00:58:23,239 --> 00:58:24,960
Speaker 1: Do do plugs real port?

910
00:58:25,760 --> 00:58:31,199
Speaker 2: Yeah? Man? As always, Uh, try and direct people to

911
00:58:31,280 --> 00:58:35,559
my website. It's Thomas seven seven seven dot com. It's

912
00:58:35,639 --> 00:58:39,400
number seven h on the S seven seven seven dot com.

913
00:58:39,480 --> 00:58:41,400
I'm gonna tweak that some man. I was gonna try

914
00:58:41,400 --> 00:58:43,239
and get on top of it this week, but it

915
00:58:43,360 --> 00:58:45,960
but what it's it's dope, the kid who put it together.

916
00:58:46,079 --> 00:58:50,480
He is great. And anytime I drop anything new, it

917
00:58:50,519 --> 00:58:53,280
pops up there on like the feed. So that's like

918
00:58:53,320 --> 00:58:55,280
a good way to keep up with stuff if you

919
00:58:55,440 --> 00:59:00,360
like the stuff I do. I'm on social media, uh

920
00:59:00,760 --> 00:59:05,440
at Capital r e A L underscore number seven hm

921
00:59:05,440 --> 00:59:09,599
A S seven seven seven. The best place to find

922
00:59:09,639 --> 00:59:14,079
me is sub stack. That's from my pods and stuff.

923
00:59:15,360 --> 00:59:20,880
It's uh real Thomas seven seven seven at substack dot com.

924
00:59:21,159 --> 00:59:27,239
And yeah, if in the description if you could include, uh,

925
00:59:28,039 --> 00:59:30,519
the Merse wings too. You know, I got big like

926
00:59:30,679 --> 00:59:36,280
T shirt and clothes and Mersey and uh that's actually

927
00:59:36,280 --> 00:59:40,559
been selling pretty well, which makes me very happy. But yeah,

928
00:59:40,760 --> 00:59:42,920
that's that's what I've got.

929
00:59:43,920 --> 00:59:45,639
Speaker 1: I'll take care of that for you, all right, Thank

930
00:59:45,679 --> 00:59:46,679
you appreciate it.

931
00:59:47,039 --> 01:00:19,599
Speaker 2: Yeah. Likewise man,