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Speaker 1: What is up, fellows?

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Speaker 2: That goes I am Dan Valley coming at you with

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the one the only Morton Ensen of the NBA podcast Fame,

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Yahoo Sports Fame and Forbes Fame.

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Speaker 1: We are here to talk about part one of two of.

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Speaker 2: Rebuilding teams and their futures, their overarching directions, the current

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as well, but mostly the futures and where they're headed,

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what we've seen, what we think. We begin with the

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Eastern Conference, But the most important question of this podcast

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is mort how the heck are you doing?

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Speaker 3: Doing? Well? Man? Just enjoying the fact that All Star

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fists are over? I wish I was kidding about that.

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Speaker 2: Not the worst The game itself was the worst presentation

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in all my years of covering the league since twenty eleven.

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It is by far the worst I ever saw, and

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I don't want to make our subscribers slog through because

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I don't have solutions for it. To be honest, I

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just you said this, and I won't say it. I'll

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let you say it, but like I don't have answers

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to fix it. But I also don't know how less

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basketball was ever thought of as the good answer for

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how to fix the All Star Game. So it was

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I appreciate. I do appreciate experimentations. I want to acknowledge

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that you're going to have some whiffs, but this one

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felt the presentation of it, the structure of it, It

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just felt incredibly tone depth to have people sit there

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and we had a breakdown in our discord.

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Speaker 1: Shout out to Mike posted it. I think it was

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from Reddit.

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Speaker 2: They broke down how much actual basketball was played versus

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tributes to TNT versus advertisements, and it's just like disgustingly low.

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Speaker 1: How much actual basketball?

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Speaker 3: Forty two minutes forty two minutes of basketball eighty minutes

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of ads. And here's the kicker. I actually got an

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email today from a PR firm and they were pitching

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me on writing about just what a tremendous success it

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the All Star weekend had been. And one of the

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metrics that they wanted me to implement and in an

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article was ad integration, Right, guys, because that's what fans

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care about. That's what I totally no, I am not

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gonna write that piece. It's just like, no, that's.

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Speaker 1: Things are viewed.

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Speaker 2: The fact that like ranking super Bowl ads ahead of

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the Super Bowl is like a huge thing for us

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in society in America. I just find that, like some

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of the commercials are funny. But I'm like, yeah, let

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me just fucking sit through this ranking of ads. It's

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just like, so, but you said it, and so you

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didn't say. Now, I have no idea who they were

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catering to during like the All Star Game. I know

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you said, I know they've said excuse me, or people

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have said, this is for the kids, the youths, the

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people who are younger than Not sure, I don't know,

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Like I would love to know if if we have

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any I don't know gen zers or younger listening to this,

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and I know we do. Get at me and let

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me know whether you liked just having mister Beast randomly

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integrated right into this gay I just what.

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Speaker 1: Did you like about it? Did you actually like about it?

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They hit miss. I'm open to any and all feedback

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from their alleged target audience. I suppose, I don't know.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so I have a point about that, and then

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we can get on with the show if that's.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So let's move on.

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Speaker 3: God him it. Well, So I've heard from the NBA itself,

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like from many of my contacts within the league, they

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have this saying that the NBA is a league of lawyers,

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and that's never felt more appropriate than during the All

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Star weekend, because it absolutely felt like a bunch of people,

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a bunch of lawyers, had put together a spreadsheet of

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a lot of people with high follower counts and then

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just just decided, Okay, per definition, that's great, and that's

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why we put them in there, completely foregoing the fact

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that even though Kevin Hart has a lot of followers,

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he's not exactly someone who caters to a young audience.

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I mean, even even us who's like in the age

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group of the target audience, are a little tired of

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the dude, like bright now a lot. I'm trying to

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I'm trying to be nice.

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Speaker 1: Even the players were tired of him by the least.

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Speaker 3: It was like just.

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Speaker 1: Over it, over it.

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Speaker 3: But here's the second part, which I think is the

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far more crucial point. They they don't really take into

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account mister beats Beast's audience. They just kind of because like,

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people don't follow mister Beasts because he's an NBA fan.

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They follow mister Beads for what he creates. They follow

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him for the shows, the award money, whatever it is like,

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so the NBA things, Oh, this guy has x amount

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of followers x amount of like, we'll get all those.

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No you won't. No, you won't because you can't be

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guaranteed in any way, shape or form that even one

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percent of his followers are interested in basketball. You're just

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looking at it through spreadsheet perspective. You're not doing your

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due diligence. And I think the league office would be

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so much wiser in using this All Star weekend as

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motivation to get more creative types within the league office

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instead of just it just being a lot of lawyers

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who are doing this. So on those Spreadshet tells arms,

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Now this branded person has a lot of fractors that

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we kind of limit. No, screw that puting guys who

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are actually telling oh, like we need to put this

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person into this event, we need to do this, We

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need to do that because then we cater to this segment.

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Now we cater to the hardcore fans. Now we cater

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to the kids. Now we're because no one's doing that.

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I think Josh Epley said it said it the best

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on Twitter. He said, the NBA has absolutely no idea

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who their core audience is anymore like it's just lost.

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Speaker 1: I think that's fair. I don't know, and I would wreck.

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Speaker 2: I think that's an interesting solution to have maybe more

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creative types in there, and also to make it easier

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for like the basketball sicko stuff to be found to

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where it's I hear people complain about the way the

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game is covered, including some of the player or the

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way the game is played to shout out to Draymond

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Green for just viewing this information there. Like just they

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have alternatives, like the NBA alternative broadcasts, those which you

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are to find, like if you like, if you want

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to listen to a different type of those things. So

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I think there's a lot of things they could try.

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Like I said, I do appreciate experimentation. I didn't understand

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what was like, I didn't see what Josh said, But

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the NBA not seeming to have any idea who they're

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called audiences feels like sort of the best way to

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sum it up at this point. And look, some people

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don't want to talk about it or hear about it,

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and we're not gonna spend any more time on it,

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but it's absolutely an issue worth discussing because they're concerned

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about it and they're making the players just run through

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these you know, Kevin r answer which is just canceled

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All Star weekend because everyone's complaining. I agree, I agree, Yeah,

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I honestly I would normally just say like, no, that's

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not the answer.

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Speaker 1: But after what we just.

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Speaker 2: Saw, like hey, dunk contest was cool, by the way,

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the closest they probably came to hitting the mark. And

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I don't watch him enough or I've seen like maybe

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one or two of his videos, but like Jesser being

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a judge, maybe that was egregious. But like his audience

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is actually interested in basketball all because every video he

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posts is about basketball.

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Speaker 1: So I'm not necessarily supporting that decision. I don't. I

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honestly don't really care.

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Speaker 3: I know, I don't still don't know who that is,

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so like there.

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Speaker 2: But that is like he's closer to being inside the

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ballpark of nice.

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Speaker 1: I can see what they were thinking.

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Speaker 3: That's great. I mean, that's generally just because I don't

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know the guy. That just makes me uninformed, but that like,

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that's great, that's genuinely great that they did, you know,

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the hit one out of twenty seven.

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Speaker 2: I don't even know if it was a hit to

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be honest with you, I'm sure people are annoying that, so.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, no, it's to me, it's just it's a symptom

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of something larger. And it's not just the All Star Game.

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It's again, the way that it's being covered. The C

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and C crew has just like they know they're not

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going to come back, and they are making us all

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very aware of it, and they are just they don't

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give it flying something anymore. And it's just it's a

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gregious coverage. And I think the best way to wrap

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this segment up before we actually get to the actual

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podcast is imagine if the NFL had people covering the

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league talking about football in the same way that the

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people we have covering basketball did, those people would be

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off the air in a matter of hours. And for

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some reason, we still give a platform to players who

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don't even know the names of certain players. We give,

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you know, platforms to players who are trying to like

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tear down the current league just to elevate themselves in

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their prior glory. Like the m A is so obvious

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that it's frankly embarrassing that no one's kind of like, hey,

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maybe these aren't the droids you're looking for. You know,

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it's like, shouldn't be shouldn't be hard?

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Speaker 2: I and I went on a little bit of an

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All Star Sunday Night crusade because when fans kind of

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say that stuff about there's too many threes, things that

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I objectively disagree with. The game is awful, it needs

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like the certain rule changes. By the way, it does

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need certain rule changes. I won't dismiss what fans are

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saying as clearly, I mean, unless they are a holes

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to me, I won't dismits it because I think it's

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a symptom of the coverage you're talking about it when

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I see current players, not even just former players, but

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current players saying that BS, that's really where it's okay, Well,

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now you're not even trying to portray this in an

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accurate light. And so I would just strongly recommend Ben

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Taylor at Thinking Basketball did a video. It's not condescending

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at all, but he went through some of the biggest

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gripes about today's game, and then I.

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Speaker 1: Just had a discussion about, well, could this be true?

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Is it not true?

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Speaker 2: And then kind of showed the evidence as to why

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these main talking points just aren't accurate. And I think

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it speaks to a failure and folly in the way

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that the specifically the NBA is covered. And I will

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recognize that while people like to compare, and I'm not

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saying you specifically like what the NFL is doing, that

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type of coverage, I do think is a lot easier

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to turn mainstream when you have so much time in

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between plays, in between days, and so the NBA has

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a unique challenge there.

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Speaker 1: But I want to also make this clear that does

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not excuse.

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Speaker 2: The state of like why like why the fans, Like

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fans shouldn't have to care about the number of advertisements

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that are being played during the NBA All Star Game,

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and so maybe we're foisting that on them, but when

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there's eighty minutes of advertisements versus forty minutes of basketball.

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Speaker 1: It serves to be a talking point there.

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Speaker 3: Yep.

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Speaker 1: So biggest losers are probably the fans in all this.

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Speaker 2: Unless again, if you are what I think the NBA

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believes their target audience is supposed to be, and you

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loved the NBA All Star Game, let us know there's

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our ten minute joint Dia tribe on the NBA All

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Star Game. In the state of coverage, let's get to

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some rebuilding teams. More is in the east before we

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dive in. Is there anything that I think each team

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is different on a case by case basis, of course,

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but is there any sort of blanket consideration or view

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when you take evaluating how these teams that are focusing on.

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Speaker 1: The future go about their business or how you view

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their current state.

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Speaker 3: Determination. Determination is the first word that comes to mind,

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because if you go into a on rebuild, you have

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to make sure that you do it the right way.

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You go through it organizationally wide. That you don't have

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people in the front office fighting it, that you don't

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have half a front office, was like, no, we don't

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really want to rebuild. Like you all are on the

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same page. Everyone has to want to go through a rebuild.

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I have to have the motivation to keep going when

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shit gets tough. My apologies for for breaking out the

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es worth there, but.

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Speaker 1: Like I'm just our listeners has probably heard so much.

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Speaker 3: I know, I know, I'm trying. I'm trying.

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Speaker 2: Anyone who listens knows Grant has quite a dirty vocabulary.

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Speaker 3: So I'm grand in many many ways. It's fine, Grand

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is grand, and look.

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Speaker 2: By the way, I want to know what he thinks

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of your lawyer voice, Grant as a as an attorney.

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Speaker 3: I mean, look that that might actually gotten his juice

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is warning, so I think it.

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Speaker 1: Sounds exactly like him. I love you, Grant. We're just kidding.

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Let's dive into this though. We begin with the Brooklyn Nets.

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Who this is.

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Speaker 2: I don't want to say it's not the most form

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of egregious rebuilding ever, But when you reacquire the rights

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to your next two draft picks, you know what the

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deal is before I even ask you about your overarching

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thoughts on them in their direction?

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Speaker 1: Did you see what Cam Johnson.

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Speaker 2: Said over the past few days? It was he basically

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this was via Lucas Kaplan of nets Dal. He does

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a fantastic job over there was basically I won't read

259
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through the whole thing is it was quite lengthy, but

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saying that if fans are angry at the players because

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they're not losing enough games or I think you can

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make the case that the Nets have not lost enough

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games this year, that they're not real fans and you

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can't expect players to be active participants in tanking. And

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I agree, like I you tanking or rebuilding like as

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an organizational direction, not like the players all of them

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need to be on board because this oversimplifies it, But

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why are we expecting Cam Johnson to contribute to what

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could be the Nets getting his replacement out of like

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or making it easier to trade him, Like I don't,

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I don't, so I don't understand that thought, but I thought,

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I do think it's interesting because we talk we throw like,

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we use this throwaway Verbia's where's Oh they're rebuilding they

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should lose more like he kind of don't, or at

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least I I'm sure I'm guilty of not giving enough

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credence to like these players are one, they're more talented

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than you probably give them credit forward too, It's like

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they're not going out there trying to throw games. It's

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technically on the team, on the front office and or

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the coaching staff to put out lineups there that don't

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stand a chance and if you end up winning games anyway,

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like the Nets have been doing that all year too.

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Speaker 1: It's like it's that I think.

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Speaker 2: That contributed to them trading Dennis Schruder and Dorian Phinny

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Smith so far before the trade deadline was just okay, like, no,

286
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we need to pull the rip cord on this there's

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too much talent. Jordy Fernandez is too good of a coach.

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These guys are too good.

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Speaker 3: M Yeah, no, I fully agree.

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Speaker 1: I was.

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Speaker 3: I was actually surprised they didn't end up trading Cam

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as well. But I think, honestly, there were some parts

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of that whole thing that just got thrown on a

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whack because of the Luke could trade this way. I

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think there were a couple of things where the nets

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were like, Okay, look, we need to make sure we

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get our bang for the buck. But you kind of

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knew after what the Lakers gave up for Luca, a

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lot of teams were kind of being a little bit

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of dicks to each other, like, oh, well, look, you

301
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know the Lakers came up virtually nothing for Luca, so

302
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why shouldn't I give up anything of significant value for

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camp Johnson. So I kind of get it. I think

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it's fine. He's still got two years left on his

305
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deal after this year, so like you can make a

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summer move there without any problem. I do want to

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clarify something because I think you're absolutely right. I think

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Campus is absolutely right, and when I said before we

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started that determination needs to be organizational wide. I do

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think that is, you know, excluding players and coaching staff

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because I considered him to be in their own little bubble,

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Like you have to have coaches and players trying to win, because,

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like you said, that is their jobs. You're not going

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to find players who are going to be like, hey, look,

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I'm not going to put in an effort. These guys

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are in insanely, insanely competitive. Like it's it's to the

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point where we don't necessarily comprehend it because they wouldn't

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be in the NBA if they weren't. Like, these guys

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are sickos more than we like to call ourselves sickos.

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So obviously, I think it's it's entirely on the ownership

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angle and on the front office. Like coaches, players own

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little thing that's their own little entity.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I would agree with you there. I do wonder

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if the Nets specifically do seem under more pressure to

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where they might be subjected to that type of sweeping

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analysis where this is this is not okay because they

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don't have as intriguing as Cam Johnson might be. As

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much as you may like some of the players on

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this roster, whether it's Cam Thomas or Noah Clowney or

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John Wilson or somebody else, like they don't have the

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face or they're building block of the future, And so

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that increases the stakes of this season, specifically when it

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comes to their lottery odds. At the same time, though

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I don't know how much worse like they're realistically supposed

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because as of right now they have the six they

336
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would have the six best lottery.

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Speaker 1: Odds in the league as we're recording this.

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Speaker 2: And it's just when you look at the teams, the

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five teams below them Raptors, Hornets, Jazz, Pelicans' Wizards, I.

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Speaker 1: Don't like, which are those teams? Are they supposed to catch?

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Speaker 2: And so then I guess you would say, is there

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Cardinal sin not having lost like early on enough? I suppose,

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But I'm just what do you sort of make of

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all that? Where they are playing this it's a different

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type of high stakes game, and maybe it always is

346
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if you're kind of in year one of a retool,

347
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just because you don't have like you can't even point

348
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to someone on this team who might be their building block.

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Speaker 1: Of the future.

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Speaker 3: It's it's one of those things where every single team

351
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who starts off a new season, they want to see

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what's actually going down. Like the Clippers, for example. It's

353
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a great example of a team we all thought would

354
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be awful in many ways. This year they are not.

355
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They are actually quite good. So they with that whole thing,

356
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and if they had lived up to our expectations of

357
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being bad, we would have seen them be far more

358
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active at the deadline, presumably pivoted towards being sellers. So

359
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there are situations where if a team gets off to

360
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a start where ownership is like, oh, this might actually

361
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be good for us to win, and then we can

362
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push this whole rebuild thing down a year. I think

363
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the Nets were in one of those situations because what

364
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they think, They started off the year like three and three,

365
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and so they kind of went with that, and then

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they didn't lose enough to a point where they were

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fully convinced they couldn't make a playoff push, and then

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suddenly the wheels kind of came off, I want to say,

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in late December, mid mid December maybe, and that's when

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I think, rightly so they pivoted, and they should. So

371
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it's the fact that they don't have that guy. It's

372
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the same situation as Portland knowing full well that Scoot

373
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is on his way, but like we still don't know

374
00:18:00,279 --> 00:18:02,920
if Scoo is that guy. It's the same thing with them.

375
00:18:02,960 --> 00:18:05,839
They need to find that dude within the next couple

376
00:18:05,880 --> 00:18:07,480
of years. Is that going to be in this draft?

377
00:18:07,640 --> 00:18:10,000
Who knows could be the next one. As long as

378
00:18:10,039 --> 00:18:12,119
you get as many bites of the apple as humanly

379
00:18:12,160 --> 00:18:14,680
possible over the next couple of years, that's all you

380
00:18:14,680 --> 00:18:17,839
can do, really, I mean, and then do proper scouting

381
00:18:17,880 --> 00:18:21,079
of course. Like then that's part of being determined in

382
00:18:21,200 --> 00:18:24,079
going into rebuild. I think if you are an MP

383
00:18:24,279 --> 00:18:27,880
organization going into rebuilding, you're not You're not investing in

384
00:18:27,960 --> 00:18:32,359
like a worldwide scouting staff, and you're not like expanding

385
00:18:32,359 --> 00:18:36,640
that staff. You're gonna be in for a rough start,

386
00:18:36,759 --> 00:18:38,200
a rough middle, and a rough end.

387
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Speaker 2: It's I don't know if I go as far as

388
00:18:41,039 --> 00:18:43,160
comparing the Little Blazers, because at least the Blazers you

389
00:18:43,200 --> 00:18:45,599
could say you mentioned Scoot, but you could in theory

390
00:18:45,640 --> 00:18:49,119
say they might have two three candidates if you include Donovan,

391
00:18:49,160 --> 00:18:50,920
Klingen and Shane and Sharp with the nets just don't

392
00:18:50,920 --> 00:18:53,839
even have Yeah, that's fair unless your camp Thom is

393
00:18:53,880 --> 00:18:55,279
pilled in which case I respect you.

394
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Speaker 3: But no, but like you know, none of those three

395
00:18:59,599 --> 00:19:04,799
right now are like locked in. You know, Luca Yanni's

396
00:19:04,799 --> 00:19:06,240
wimpy times right like, and.

397
00:19:06,480 --> 00:19:09,519
Speaker 2: They might be closer to like who has the Well,

398
00:19:09,519 --> 00:19:11,200
this isn't the Western I was gonna say, Utah, this

399
00:19:11,200 --> 00:19:15,160
isn't the Western Conference rebuilding podcasts, So we'll get to that.

400
00:19:15,240 --> 00:19:15,599
Speaker 1: Have you.

401
00:19:17,039 --> 00:19:19,799
Speaker 2: Has anything stood out to you about anyone who's currently

402
00:19:19,799 --> 00:19:23,039
in place or just what they've done. I mean, Jordi Fernandez,

403
00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:24,880
they had a really good half court offense when you

404
00:19:24,920 --> 00:19:26,839
gave him any sort of talent at the beginning of

405
00:19:26,880 --> 00:19:28,720
the year and now, like I think there are eleventh

406
00:19:28,720 --> 00:19:32,319
in point slot per possession since January first. Nick Claxton's

407
00:19:32,359 --> 00:19:33,799
done a great job on that end of the four

408
00:19:33,880 --> 00:19:35,920
since around then too as well. After like maybe not

409
00:19:35,960 --> 00:19:38,319
the best start, they're not getting it like super lucky

410
00:19:38,319 --> 00:19:41,160
when it comes to opponent shooting necessarily during that stretch.

411
00:19:41,200 --> 00:19:43,039
They're just anything that kind of stands out to you

412
00:19:43,079 --> 00:19:46,160
about They're current when it comes to trying and informing

413
00:19:46,200 --> 00:19:47,119
their future defense.

414
00:19:47,480 --> 00:19:49,720
Speaker 3: Defense. I think they play on a string. I think

415
00:19:49,759 --> 00:19:52,680
there there's a lot of cohesion there. I think they're

416
00:19:53,160 --> 00:19:55,400
playing for one another, which is always a sign of

417
00:19:55,440 --> 00:19:58,599
a good team. The problem is they can't produce on

418
00:19:58,680 --> 00:20:00,759
the other side of the floor. We're looking at it

419
00:20:00,799 --> 00:20:05,119
through like the competitive lens. Right, this is just a

420
00:20:05,160 --> 00:20:07,720
team where it seems like there's good there are good vibes.

421
00:20:08,000 --> 00:20:11,759
They want to actually achieve something together. And it's also

422
00:20:11,759 --> 00:20:13,640
why it makes it hard to blow it apart. Like

423
00:20:13,680 --> 00:20:16,960
I've seen plenty of nets fans actually say, look like

424
00:20:17,000 --> 00:20:19,519
we're not winning. But I don't hate this product, Like

425
00:20:19,599 --> 00:20:22,279
I don't hate any of these players. It's it's nice

426
00:20:22,319 --> 00:20:24,359
to fall along like these are good guys. I like

427
00:20:24,400 --> 00:20:26,759
to watch Cam Thomas. I like to watch Cam Johnson

428
00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:29,799
before he was traded, like I like to watch Dorian

429
00:20:29,839 --> 00:20:33,440
Finney Smith, like Nick Laxton. Even Ben Simmons was even

430
00:20:33,559 --> 00:20:37,440
beginning to get a little bit appreciated. So it's it's

431
00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:40,799
a really odd and weird dynamic of having to blow

432
00:20:40,839 --> 00:20:44,599
apart a team that the family is actually likes. But

433
00:20:44,680 --> 00:20:47,640
I understand why they like it. They this is a

434
00:20:47,680 --> 00:20:50,119
team that's very unselfish. They go out and put in

435
00:20:50,160 --> 00:20:53,640
the effort. I think they're in far more close games

436
00:20:53,720 --> 00:20:57,559
than what most seems realized. Like they're not a pushover

437
00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:01,319
and when you're what are they right now, like twenty

438
00:21:01,359 --> 00:21:08,279
and thirty something. Yeah, Like you could probably like find

439
00:21:08,319 --> 00:21:10,279
a lot of teams who are like, oh well, like

440
00:21:10,319 --> 00:21:13,640
it's the fourth quarter, we're down twenty, Like we're not

441
00:21:13,640 --> 00:21:17,839
gonna fight. These guys fight all the time. And if

442
00:21:17,880 --> 00:21:20,279
that's not a sign of keeping on Jordy Fernandez, I

443
00:21:20,279 --> 00:21:21,000
don't know what it is.

444
00:21:21,119 --> 00:21:22,880
Speaker 1: I mean, that's they might have to fire him to

445
00:21:22,920 --> 00:21:24,440
lose enough game, but.

446
00:21:26,480 --> 00:21:30,480
Speaker 3: God, that'd be so bad. Now. This is like a

447
00:21:30,640 --> 00:21:33,880
huge compliment to him, I think, and and for players

448
00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:37,839
to buy into his system and his way of looking

449
00:21:37,839 --> 00:21:39,640
at things, like they found a good one on the

450
00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:40,200
bench there.

451
00:21:40,720 --> 00:21:42,440
Speaker 2: It does see in that way, and I would echo

452
00:21:42,599 --> 00:21:43,920
a lot of what you said about the way they play,

453
00:21:43,920 --> 00:21:45,640
if you like when you watch the nets, like you

454
00:21:45,720 --> 00:21:47,680
can kind of see the effort and at least there's

455
00:21:48,039 --> 00:21:50,480
you know, they try and offset the talent deficit, Like

456
00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:52,200
if they get a rebound, like they're gonna try and

457
00:21:52,240 --> 00:21:54,119
run because they know that they just don't have without

458
00:21:54,160 --> 00:21:56,559
Dennis Schuter. They're like they're not going to have someone

459
00:21:56,599 --> 00:21:58,200
who could you know, manipulate the half core.

460
00:21:58,240 --> 00:22:00,400
Speaker 1: They do have d Lo but so.

461
00:22:00,680 --> 00:22:04,119
Speaker 2: That I like the principles that seems like what Jordy

462
00:22:04,279 --> 00:22:06,720
does installed there, and I will you know, Nick Claxton,

463
00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:09,640
I still think some people kind of felt veered away

464
00:22:09,680 --> 00:22:11,240
and wonder if he was on a bad contract. I

465
00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:14,200
think it's an innocuous contract at worse, and that is

466
00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:16,599
they have like when you look at their front court players,

467
00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:18,440
they have like set between him and then there's no

468
00:22:18,559 --> 00:22:20,839
clowny like there's like some real source ability there. So

469
00:22:21,640 --> 00:22:23,880
do you think I have two questions left? Do you

470
00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:25,720
think that there's anyone on this team that you identify

471
00:22:25,759 --> 00:22:27,039
and say okay, like they need to.

472
00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:29,400
Speaker 1: Be here or they will be here or have a

473
00:22:29,400 --> 00:22:32,680
shot at being here, like over the longer term.

474
00:22:33,240 --> 00:22:36,960
Speaker 3: I that's a good question. I'm hoping that there are

475
00:22:37,039 --> 00:22:39,559
some of the young guys who are just locked in

476
00:22:39,720 --> 00:22:43,759
because they don't have the trade value as players yet

477
00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:46,240
to fetch anything of significance, So you really have a

478
00:22:46,359 --> 00:22:51,920
chance to nurture their development, like obviously Clowney that that

479
00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:55,400
goes without saying Tareek Whitehead as well. I think there

480
00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:59,119
are these players who you need to like see properly.

481
00:22:59,640 --> 00:23:01,480
Can we get more out of this guy? Is there

482
00:23:01,519 --> 00:23:04,680
more talent to squeeze, the more potential to squeeze. Now

483
00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:07,400
they're in a tough spot with Cam Thomas, I think

484
00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:11,880
because of the restricted free agency coming up. Fortunately for them, though,

485
00:23:12,400 --> 00:23:14,319
that's a market and you and I've talked about this,

486
00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:17,839
I think last week as well. You can pretty much

487
00:23:17,839 --> 00:23:22,759
squeeze your own restricted free agent a pretty fair amount nowadays,

488
00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:27,599
so maybe that's not gonna be an issue. I actually

489
00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:31,599
realized something a couple of days ago. That Dayron Sharp

490
00:23:31,759 --> 00:23:34,160
is also a restricted free agent. For some reason, that

491
00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:35,319
just flew over my head.

492
00:23:35,559 --> 00:23:38,079
Speaker 1: He's pretty good too the shoulders. How could you just

493
00:23:38,119 --> 00:23:38,839
forget about him?

494
00:23:38,920 --> 00:23:42,000
Speaker 3: I know? And he's like, he's such a good rebounder.

495
00:23:42,039 --> 00:23:44,880
I actually enjoy watching him play. So they have a

496
00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:47,160
couple things that they need to figure out, but like

497
00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:51,839
if they can get those guys back on perfectly reasonable deals, yeah, absolutely,

498
00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:54,240
like stay the course because you're not in the business

499
00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:56,599
of just dumping talent. That'd be bad.

500
00:23:56,920 --> 00:23:58,640
Speaker 2: Nick Klaxon is not a name that would stand out

501
00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:01,480
to you. Is like someone that you think would stick around,

502
00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:03,359
Like you view him as more of okay, I want

503
00:24:03,359 --> 00:24:06,279
to say transient, but that'll be someone they eventually trade. No.

504
00:24:06,519 --> 00:24:10,519
Speaker 3: Oh, I think he's I think he's gone, not necessarily

505
00:24:10,759 --> 00:24:14,480
in this summer, but down the road first and foremost.

506
00:24:14,559 --> 00:24:16,839
I think his value right now is the load it's

507
00:24:16,880 --> 00:24:19,359
been in a couple of years. I think his raw

508
00:24:19,400 --> 00:24:23,240
production has dropped off. That's unfortunate. I don't think that's

509
00:24:23,279 --> 00:24:25,160
going to be a sustainable thing. I think he can

510
00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:28,160
bounce back, and I think they're right in just waiting

511
00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:32,359
it out, because his contract diminishes in value every single year.

512
00:24:32,559 --> 00:24:34,480
So if he has a bounce back year and like

513
00:24:34,759 --> 00:24:37,400
let's say he comes into next year, he averages fourteen

514
00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:41,240
and eleven like Elite defense as usual, and we near

515
00:24:41,279 --> 00:24:44,759
the trade deadline, some seems looking at that contract, going okay,

516
00:24:44,759 --> 00:24:47,480
he's earning twenty five zero point three million this year,

517
00:24:47,519 --> 00:24:50,079
and then it drops down to twenty three and to

518
00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:54,240
twenty point nine. Hell yeah, let's go get that and

519
00:24:54,240 --> 00:24:57,400
the Nets can sort of pick their price here. Yeah.

520
00:24:57,440 --> 00:24:59,279
I don't think he's long for this roster in terms

521
00:24:59,279 --> 00:25:04,880
of like twenty six, twenty seven. Why you're not losing

522
00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:07,519
anything with him on the roster until they find the

523
00:25:07,559 --> 00:25:07,960
right deal.

524
00:25:08,720 --> 00:25:10,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you mentioned Darke Whitehead too. I still don't

525
00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:13,079
have a great all the injuries that he's dealt with

526
00:25:13,119 --> 00:25:15,880
and he has what eleven career games under his belt,

527
00:25:16,720 --> 00:25:17,160
but like.

528
00:25:17,079 --> 00:25:18,880
Speaker 1: There were some flashes. I think it was it was

529
00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:19,759
towards the end of January.

530
00:25:19,799 --> 00:25:21,559
Speaker 2: I can't remember the game, but like to see him

531
00:25:21,799 --> 00:25:23,799
coming to the ball and hitting threes off the catcher,

532
00:25:23,839 --> 00:25:25,599
like being able to operate a little bit more methodically

533
00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:26,880
get into the lane off the dribble.

534
00:25:27,480 --> 00:25:28,359
Speaker 1: I'd be curious if.

535
00:25:28,279 --> 00:25:30,599
Speaker 2: We get like, like just what he could turn into,

536
00:25:30,680 --> 00:25:33,279
just because he was so people were so high on

537
00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:36,000
him coming out of high school. Specifically he was recruiting

538
00:25:36,079 --> 00:25:38,640
rank in twenty twenty was number one. That's I don't

539
00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:42,359
think he's anywhere near like a lottery ticket, but just

540
00:25:43,039 --> 00:25:45,200
like there might be something there if he's able to

541
00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:47,200
stay healthy, Like there just might be something there.

542
00:25:47,640 --> 00:25:50,680
Speaker 3: And of course, like if they finally unleashed Trenton Watford,

543
00:25:51,279 --> 00:25:53,240
they're gonna be right in the playoff mix. They just

544
00:25:53,319 --> 00:25:54,480
won't for whatever reason.

545
00:25:54,599 --> 00:25:57,319
Speaker 2: Well, that's they're not trying to win the championship this.

546
00:25:57,359 --> 00:25:59,240
Speaker 1: Year, and that's I know their grant.

547
00:25:59,279 --> 00:26:02,759
Speaker 2: There my final question on them, and I'm not I

548
00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:05,279
actually didn't think they were gonna trade Cam Johnson. After

549
00:26:05,279 --> 00:26:07,160
they traded I guess after the Luca trade, I just

550
00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:09,640
would have you could have told me anything, yeah, be fair.

551
00:26:10,200 --> 00:26:13,559
Speaker 1: But you look at this team. They didn't take back

552
00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:16,119
any long term money this year.

553
00:26:16,119 --> 00:26:17,839
Speaker 2: I think if if you kind of factor in dran

554
00:26:17,880 --> 00:26:22,039
Phinney Smith's player option, they guaranteed themselves easier pass to

555
00:26:22,119 --> 00:26:25,160
cap space this summer. Do you think do you view

556
00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:27,200
that as more just sort of when you look back

557
00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:28,599
on the trades and what they got, that it was

558
00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:30,960
out of convenience, or do you kind of look at

559
00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:33,720
them and say, no, I wasn't expecting them to go make,

560
00:26:34,079 --> 00:26:36,000
you know, a run at Jimmy Butler had he been

561
00:26:36,160 --> 00:26:38,079
still been a free agent, or go after James Harden

562
00:26:38,160 --> 00:26:40,880
again if he opts out, like the kind of I

563
00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:42,920
mentioned this at the time, and I'm still there, like

564
00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:43,839
I've just kind of.

565
00:26:43,799 --> 00:26:45,279
Speaker 1: Circled their cap spaces.

566
00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:49,759
Speaker 2: Okay, this team might do something weird over the summer

567
00:26:49,799 --> 00:26:53,119
because it feels like they actively prioritize keeping it right.

568
00:26:53,359 --> 00:26:56,279
Speaker 3: So I think this is they want to keep their

569
00:26:56,319 --> 00:27:00,000
options open. Remember how Sean Marks was like the biggest

570
00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:04,279
troll in twenty sixteen. I think it was twenty sixteen,

571
00:27:04,359 --> 00:27:07,359
right when he like he he gave the offer sheets

572
00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:09,799
out and Crab he gave back like he gave out

573
00:27:09,799 --> 00:27:10,880
a ton of offer sheets.

574
00:27:12,319 --> 00:27:14,559
Speaker 1: Were they that Johnson offer sheet?

575
00:27:15,079 --> 00:27:17,400
Speaker 3: All right? Yeah? And they ended up with him? Right? No? No?

576
00:27:17,279 --> 00:27:17,480
Speaker 1: No?

577
00:27:17,599 --> 00:27:20,640
Speaker 3: Wait, second that Miami matched and then traded for him

578
00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:23,440
later or was that crab odd? I don't even remember both.

579
00:27:23,519 --> 00:27:25,720
Speaker 2: I think Tyler Johnson and Allen Crab eventually ended up

580
00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:28,440
with the Nets even though they're offer sheets right, were matched?

581
00:27:28,559 --> 00:27:31,839
Speaker 3: Yeah? Now see, I wouldn't be surprised if the Nets

582
00:27:31,839 --> 00:27:35,279
actually did something similar this time around, because they also

583
00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:38,759
know that the second Apron stuff is real. We've seen

584
00:27:38,799 --> 00:27:42,279
that now that teams are not crazy about not having

585
00:27:42,279 --> 00:27:46,720
that flexibility, so for them to just kind of push

586
00:27:46,799 --> 00:27:49,400
the price point up and maybe actually get good players

587
00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:53,079
in return because of it, or are potentially calling up

588
00:27:53,119 --> 00:27:56,400
teams that are deep within the second Apron after they

589
00:27:56,440 --> 00:27:59,640
may have realized, you know, we can't go anywhere, like

590
00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:04,039
what are we to do? And then that's are like, well,

591
00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:07,519
we can give you immediate salary relief, Like that's that's

592
00:28:07,519 --> 00:28:10,400
a thing that exists, and it'll cost you draft picks,

593
00:28:10,519 --> 00:28:13,160
but we're right here for it. Like are those teams

594
00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:15,359
ready to commit to such a deal we don't know.

595
00:28:15,440 --> 00:28:18,400
That remains to be seen, but you can use cap

596
00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:23,319
space in way more ways than just as on free agents.

597
00:28:23,799 --> 00:28:28,160
So I'm pretty I'm pretty excited actually to see what

598
00:28:28,839 --> 00:28:31,920
does with this. I think I would love a return

599
00:28:32,279 --> 00:28:34,519
for him to just be the biggest troll. I would

600
00:28:34,599 --> 00:28:37,960
love that because it forces other teams to make really

601
00:28:38,039 --> 00:28:42,559
uncomfortable decisions and frankly, that's how you play the game.

602
00:28:43,519 --> 00:28:46,279
Speaker 2: I was looking at in prep of this, like restricted

603
00:28:46,279 --> 00:28:48,039
free agents for this summer and trying to fit the

604
00:28:48,079 --> 00:28:50,440
way you phrased it to him be a troll. Yeah,

605
00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:52,759
what is the name where you could just see Sean

606
00:28:52,759 --> 00:28:55,000
Marks throwing a megap like, not even with the attention

607
00:28:55,240 --> 00:28:57,920
of actually getting them, but to fuck with the other

608
00:28:58,000 --> 00:29:01,240
team's books. The two I came up with, Yeah, where

609
00:29:01,279 --> 00:29:06,039
Jonathan Kaminga.

610
00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:06,160
Speaker 1: And Santi al Dama and Aldama.

611
00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:07,599
Speaker 2: I feel like, maybe that doesn't make too much sense

612
00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:09,400
because you have Claxton and maybe you want to keep

613
00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:12,400
around sharp like Aldama could probably play next to either

614
00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:14,799
of them, but he almost feels too gettable because of

615
00:29:14,839 --> 00:29:17,200
how cost conscious Memphis is. But those were the two

616
00:29:17,240 --> 00:29:19,319
that I kind of because I don't think it'll be Giddy.

617
00:29:19,559 --> 00:29:20,759
That would surprise me a little bit.

618
00:29:20,799 --> 00:29:22,359
Speaker 3: I was just about to say they should fuck with

619
00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:24,880
the Bulls for this reason, because of this thing, Like

620
00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:28,599
the Bulls are so infatuated with saving face. This is

621
00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:31,079
something we know about them. They do not want to

622
00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:34,079
lose face. They gave up that deal, like they gave

623
00:29:34,160 --> 00:29:37,160
up Caruso for Josh Giddy. They've started him all year long,

624
00:29:37,200 --> 00:29:39,880
despite the fact that he's not a freaking starter. He's

625
00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:44,319
been bad for them. They are absolutely in a tight

626
00:29:44,359 --> 00:29:47,240
spot when it comes to him. So it would be

627
00:29:47,319 --> 00:29:50,039
the funniest thing ever if Sean Marx goes out and

628
00:29:50,079 --> 00:29:52,359
like signs him to an offer sheet wor it's like

629
00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:55,359
twenty million a year, and the post are like, well,

630
00:29:55,440 --> 00:29:58,039
that's that's just low enough to the point where we

631
00:29:58,079 --> 00:30:00,440
can't we can't just let him walk because we look

632
00:30:00,480 --> 00:30:02,440
like like dumb asses, which they are, but that's a

633
00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:05,400
different point. They'll never want to admit that. So Sean

634
00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:08,319
Marks go troll the fuck out of the Chicago Bulls.

635
00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:11,119
Speaker 2: Isn't that a bit just like stabbing someone when they're

636
00:30:11,119 --> 00:30:13,240
already dead? Though, if you do that to the Bulls

637
00:30:13,319 --> 00:30:15,240
at this point, it's like the bulls self sabotage.

638
00:30:15,279 --> 00:30:16,960
Speaker 1: They don't need any help with it.

639
00:30:16,920 --> 00:30:19,680
Speaker 3: That's true, but it would be funny. And this is

640
00:30:19,720 --> 00:30:20,559
for my amusement.

641
00:30:21,119 --> 00:30:21,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, they just have.

642
00:30:21,799 --> 00:30:23,920
Speaker 2: They both have like Josh Giddy and Patrick Learns for

643
00:30:23,960 --> 00:30:26,480
the next four years or making twenty five million or

644
00:30:26,599 --> 00:30:28,359
between them, like forty million bucks a pot.

645
00:30:29,079 --> 00:30:30,079
Speaker 3: That'd be so bad.

646
00:30:30,559 --> 00:30:31,759
Speaker 1: This is so I think at.

647
00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:34,480
Speaker 2: The end we'll ask of these teams, maybe who's like

648
00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:36,759
future would you be highest on, or like, what are

649
00:30:36,799 --> 00:30:39,000
your vibes if we had a vibe meter of one

650
00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:41,119
to ten, what are you like your vibes on the

651
00:30:41,119 --> 00:30:41,960
Brooklyn's rebuild.

652
00:30:42,960 --> 00:30:47,240
Speaker 3: So it's so early though, right, I mean it's like

653
00:30:47,279 --> 00:30:51,160
if they win the lottery and go with Cooper Flag.

654
00:30:51,240 --> 00:30:55,200
I mean, the vibes instantanely the league grow much more

655
00:30:55,200 --> 00:30:58,519
intense and higher and whatnot. But like, I do think

656
00:30:58,559 --> 00:31:02,200
that they have the approach to this. So my vibes,

657
00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:04,319
if I'm a NETS fan, they're pretty high.

658
00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:06,640
Speaker 2: I mean I think just because you don't know what's

659
00:31:06,680 --> 00:31:09,279
gonna happen, but like you've positioned yourself for flexibility, you

660
00:31:09,319 --> 00:31:12,400
have the year's pick, next year's pick, my vibes will

661
00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:15,079
probably be like at a seven point two, not like

662
00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:16,599
astronomically high, but a seven.

663
00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:18,559
Speaker 3: And this is out of ten because you never gave

664
00:31:18,599 --> 00:31:20,799
me a scale, Like if it's seven point two out

665
00:31:20,799 --> 00:31:22,920
of ten million, I wouldn't have a chance.

666
00:31:22,839 --> 00:31:24,319
Speaker 1: Tib scale from one to ten.

667
00:31:24,680 --> 00:31:27,960
Speaker 3: You did. Oh all right, all right, all right, so.

668
00:31:28,079 --> 00:31:29,880
Speaker 2: I'll go seven point two. Look now we're gonna do

669
00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:31,039
a vibe meter for every team?

670
00:31:31,519 --> 00:31:33,000
Speaker 3: How did you get to point two?

671
00:31:33,039 --> 00:31:34,400
Speaker 1: Though? What's that?

672
00:31:34,839 --> 00:31:36,119
Speaker 3: How did you get to point two?

673
00:31:36,559 --> 00:31:39,960
Speaker 2: Proprietary formula? The contents of which I cannot reveal?

674
00:31:40,079 --> 00:31:42,559
Speaker 3: Sorry, Right, it's like when food bloggers go to a place,

675
00:31:42,599 --> 00:31:45,400
it's like, oh, this is like four point six one,

676
00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:47,519
Like how the fuck it gets the number?

677
00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:50,160
Speaker 2: So the person who wants to be super thorough in

678
00:31:50,200 --> 00:31:51,440
me would try and look at this in like a

679
00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:53,759
bunch of different categories. But I don't think it makes

680
00:31:53,799 --> 00:31:56,319
for necessarily good podcasting. But I kind of look at

681
00:31:56,519 --> 00:31:59,200
when it comes to long term player equity, right, you

682
00:31:59,240 --> 00:32:01,480
can't have great I just don't know that they have

683
00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:04,960
a ton of that. But when you're looking at flexibility, coaching,

684
00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:08,759
and then like understanding and alignment among the front office,

685
00:32:09,119 --> 00:32:11,720
I really think they hit on all three of those boxes,

686
00:32:11,759 --> 00:32:14,799
which like the flexibility. They're going to have more cap

687
00:32:14,839 --> 00:32:19,200
space than probably the entire Western Conference like this, just

688
00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:22,920
like they're flexibility and as you mentioned, and Keith Smith

689
00:32:22,960 --> 00:32:24,759
says this all the time, cap space.

690
00:32:24,559 --> 00:32:25,759
Speaker 1: Is not just for free agency.

691
00:32:25,799 --> 00:32:27,680
Speaker 2: But that's why I just have them circled because it's

692
00:32:27,880 --> 00:32:31,519
you also don't have that much cap space without a

693
00:32:31,599 --> 00:32:33,279
reason to use it.

694
00:32:33,240 --> 00:32:35,039
Speaker 1: Or intention of using it. Yeah, are you ready to

695
00:32:35,039 --> 00:32:38,359
move on to our next team? Absolutely, the Charlotte Hornets.

696
00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:41,279
Speaker 2: More, where do you want to We'll alternate here, So

697
00:32:41,319 --> 00:32:42,960
where do you want to take the discussion on on

698
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:47,400
these Hornets? Is Mark Williams still a member of the Hornets?

699
00:32:47,400 --> 00:32:48,200
How do we factor him in?

700
00:32:48,319 --> 00:32:48,799
Speaker 1: No?

701
00:32:48,799 --> 00:32:53,079
Speaker 3: No, I that's the thing. So so that whole situation

702
00:32:53,240 --> 00:32:58,039
is super uncomfortable for him, and I suppose the organization too.

703
00:32:58,640 --> 00:33:00,920
I see it would be who both parties to just

704
00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:04,480
basically say, look, like, Mark, you're staying home for the

705
00:33:04,480 --> 00:33:07,200
rest of the season. We have nothing to play for regardless,

706
00:33:07,279 --> 00:33:09,880
like there's no reason for you to get injured, Like,

707
00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:12,559
let's get you into the summer. Let's see then and

708
00:33:12,599 --> 00:33:14,880
then we work together on a deal from there, because

709
00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:18,960
like our relationship obviously can't continue after this whole deboggle,

710
00:33:19,680 --> 00:33:23,799
which is super like unfortunate all things considered. I keep

711
00:33:23,839 --> 00:33:28,079
hearing only good things about Marcus Well, so yeah, that's

712
00:33:28,119 --> 00:33:30,680
that's that sucks in terms of like where they have

713
00:33:30,759 --> 00:33:35,079
to go. I don't know, man, it's such a hard

714
00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:39,880
team to get smart on because you're sort of at

715
00:33:40,160 --> 00:33:42,839
the whimsy of LaMelo in many ways. You're also stuck

716
00:33:42,839 --> 00:33:45,000
with a guy who has divided the fan base because

717
00:33:45,039 --> 00:33:49,200
of what he's done. Obviously, you don't really.

718
00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:51,519
Speaker 1: Have a lot of like what did Trey Man do?

719
00:33:53,119 --> 00:33:56,880
Speaker 3: What did Man do? Sor right, go ahead, that's a

720
00:33:56,920 --> 00:33:59,400
good one. Outside of Brandon Miller. You really don't have

721
00:34:00,160 --> 00:34:03,440
you know that guy yet, maybe Salon becomes that down

722
00:34:03,440 --> 00:34:06,319
the line, like maybe someone else steps up. But m m,

723
00:34:06,960 --> 00:34:10,519
that's that seems like a stretch. So like, what are

724
00:34:10,519 --> 00:34:12,480
you what are you actually trying to do? Do you

725
00:34:12,519 --> 00:34:15,639
want to give LaMelo just free reign moving forward? Like,

726
00:34:15,679 --> 00:34:18,480
because I get the whole he's fun part, but I

727
00:34:18,519 --> 00:34:21,360
do think it's fair to ask, is he also like

728
00:34:21,480 --> 00:34:24,639
a top tier superstar? I don't think so, and I

729
00:34:24,719 --> 00:34:28,119
don't think he's anywhere close to it personally.

730
00:34:28,760 --> 00:34:30,639
Speaker 1: So let's actually depend a second on that.

731
00:34:30,719 --> 00:34:33,840
Speaker 2: Then, great, what do you when you mean top tier

732
00:34:33,880 --> 00:34:36,519
superstar and that he's not even like, so what would

733
00:34:36,559 --> 00:34:39,760
be the like what player or player type are you

734
00:34:39,800 --> 00:34:40,639
comparing him to?

735
00:34:41,119 --> 00:34:44,519
Speaker 3: Right? So, actually it's not really the players. What I

736
00:34:45,039 --> 00:34:47,159
usually what I do is I try to look at

737
00:34:47,159 --> 00:34:50,519
the stat lines, and I'm kind of gauging is his

738
00:34:50,719 --> 00:34:56,480
numbers like more volatile than his influence, like, because there

739
00:34:56,480 --> 00:34:59,320
are certain guys who are just way more influential than

740
00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:03,760
the numbers jest and vice versa. I think he's getting

741
00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:08,519
closer to being worth like his statline. I've been very

742
00:35:08,599 --> 00:35:10,519
down on him in the past. I do think this

743
00:35:10,639 --> 00:35:15,199
year he's done better in many many categories. But I

744
00:35:15,239 --> 00:35:17,599
still think he's a guy who put up these huge

745
00:35:17,679 --> 00:35:22,400
numbers without necessarily having the actual impact behind it. I

746
00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:26,159
think he is so unpredictable that it comes at the

747
00:35:26,199 --> 00:35:28,840
cost of also his teammates, who are like, what the

748
00:35:28,880 --> 00:35:31,880
hell just happened? Like, I don't even understand, what did

749
00:35:31,880 --> 00:35:35,000
you just take a thirty seven foot pull up shot

750
00:35:35,039 --> 00:35:37,000
with like twenty two left on the shot clock and

751
00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:41,480
nobody in rebounding position? There are just one of There

752
00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:43,679
are so many small things where I'm like, ah, if

753
00:35:43,719 --> 00:35:46,639
he just dialed back this, or if he just scaled

754
00:35:46,719 --> 00:35:50,559
up this, then we're talking about a guy who would

755
00:35:51,239 --> 00:35:55,679
be somewhat justified of his statistical production at least. And

756
00:35:55,719 --> 00:35:57,760
I just don't think he's there yet. That's not to

757
00:35:57,800 --> 00:36:00,760
say that won't come. I do think he needs a

758
00:36:00,800 --> 00:36:04,320
system in place where he's being rained back in the

759
00:36:04,400 --> 00:36:08,719
right ways. He's ultra talented. He needs a coach who

760
00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:13,480
understands how to maximize his effort level his skill set,

761
00:36:13,800 --> 00:36:17,280
and I don't know if he has that right now.

762
00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:21,280
Speaker 2: I think that might be fair in the sense of

763
00:36:21,599 --> 00:36:25,440
where a lot of people look at him, like the

764
00:36:25,519 --> 00:36:27,880
Hornets are just they're better with him on the floor,

765
00:36:27,960 --> 00:36:30,079
and when I watch them, that might have to do

766
00:36:30,239 --> 00:36:34,519
with the talent around him, but that's also part of it, Okay,

767
00:36:34,559 --> 00:36:36,639
like they're working off a low baseline without him, But

768
00:36:36,639 --> 00:36:38,960
that's also if your biggest look. I watched the Mellow

769
00:36:39,239 --> 00:36:40,920
and there are things that I wish he did more

770
00:36:41,320 --> 00:36:43,800
all the time. There's like the rigid defensive stances, like

771
00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:45,719
he has the tools to be way better or us

772
00:36:45,719 --> 00:36:48,719
stay more consistent than he's ever been on defense. You

773
00:36:48,800 --> 00:36:51,880
mentioned like putting him in kind of the right situation,

774
00:36:52,119 --> 00:36:55,039
and I think that that really has to come down to, right, well,

775
00:36:55,039 --> 00:36:58,639
then improve the talent that's around him, because there is

776
00:36:58,719 --> 00:37:01,840
talent around him, Like Mark is a perfect example, whether

777
00:37:01,880 --> 00:37:04,559
you like him or think he's overrated in terms of

778
00:37:04,559 --> 00:37:07,519
a defensive prospect or somehow underrated there, we just haven't

779
00:37:07,559 --> 00:37:09,360
seen enough of him. And like you just got Brandon

780
00:37:09,360 --> 00:37:12,320
Miller really in the building, LaMelo's not healthy last year,

781
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:15,400
Brandon Miller's not going to play again this season. That

782
00:37:15,440 --> 00:37:18,960
gets it gets really really tough to evaluate, Like what

783
00:37:19,000 --> 00:37:21,599
would he be on the like a better team, because

784
00:37:21,599 --> 00:37:23,119
I don't think they've given him one. And so to

785
00:37:23,159 --> 00:37:25,639
sit here and say the fact that he can improve

786
00:37:26,079 --> 00:37:29,119
the product of a of a let's say a bad team,

787
00:37:29,599 --> 00:37:32,199
I assign real value to that. And until I see

788
00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:35,840
him undermine what should be a winning situation, I find

789
00:37:35,880 --> 00:37:39,840
it really weird that like some and I'm not again

790
00:37:39,840 --> 00:37:41,239
I'm not saying this is you, but like a lot

791
00:37:41,239 --> 00:37:43,199
of the conversations around him just focus on like he's

792
00:37:43,199 --> 00:37:45,159
not a winner is basically what it boils down to.

793
00:37:45,360 --> 00:37:48,679
And if you look at like the quality of the

794
00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:51,960
like the talent around him in catch all metrics per

795
00:37:52,039 --> 00:37:55,239
Peopall Index, he's had one year where like he's ever

796
00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:58,480
had even close to an above average supporting cast around him,

797
00:37:58,559 --> 00:38:01,599
and even this year they're in the twelfth percentile, last

798
00:38:01,639 --> 00:38:03,679
year eighth percentile of teammate quality.

799
00:38:03,760 --> 00:38:06,519
Speaker 1: So that's like, that's not everything.

800
00:38:06,559 --> 00:38:08,960
Speaker 2: I want to make it clear, but I'm not here

801
00:38:08,960 --> 00:38:11,960
to say that I think he's on the level of Luca,

802
00:38:12,239 --> 00:38:14,440
or if he's on the level of Staph or just

803
00:38:14,480 --> 00:38:17,480
anyone that you would build a championship contender around, as

804
00:38:17,519 --> 00:38:19,760
just the a one. When I rule it out, I'm

805
00:38:19,760 --> 00:38:21,519
probably gonna be more stubborn and say no, I won't.

806
00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:21,679
Speaker 1: Rule it out.

807
00:38:21,719 --> 00:38:24,280
Speaker 2: But like I watch the way he plays and stuff

808
00:38:24,280 --> 00:38:26,079
that he can still do away from the ball if

809
00:38:26,079 --> 00:38:28,000
you put him in a situation that will have him

810
00:38:28,039 --> 00:38:30,400
off it more, I think that he could absolutely be

811
00:38:30,440 --> 00:38:32,320
the second best player on a really good team, and

812
00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:34,679
I think that might be why I'll probably higher on

813
00:38:34,760 --> 00:38:37,599
their future than a lot of other people. And even

814
00:38:37,639 --> 00:38:39,239
to move it away from a mellow because I think

815
00:38:39,519 --> 00:38:41,960
this is like a great point that you made, like

816
00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:44,920
the word you use this situation. While the Hornets have

817
00:38:44,960 --> 00:38:47,199
not given him a good enough one yet, it does

818
00:38:47,320 --> 00:38:49,360
feel like and please correct me if you disagree I'll

819
00:38:49,360 --> 00:38:51,800
throw it to you here. This front office regime, the

820
00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:54,559
people who are in charge now. The only thing that

821
00:38:54,599 --> 00:38:58,119
I've really loathed from them is the Miles Bridges and

822
00:38:58,159 --> 00:38:59,679
that's a big thing, like the way they handled it.

823
00:38:59,679 --> 00:39:01,599
But also than giving him that contract, I thought they

824
00:39:01,639 --> 00:39:03,960
had more leverage there. I don't think that's a great deal.

825
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:07,400
But they understand on a basketball court, it seems like

826
00:39:07,440 --> 00:39:09,760
they understand the plot of what needs to happen. And

827
00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:13,000
they've kind of reiterated as much last year's trade deadline

828
00:39:13,039 --> 00:39:15,920
when you trade PG Washington, even this year's trade deadline,

829
00:39:16,079 --> 00:39:19,000
like kind of taking some foresight to soak up the

830
00:39:19,079 --> 00:39:21,000
use of NRDIC deal. Whether you thought they got enough

831
00:39:21,000 --> 00:39:23,800
as different. But that mindset to me is agreed.

832
00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:24,920
Speaker 1: Hey they get it.

833
00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:29,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, I agree with that. It's just if you

834
00:39:29,599 --> 00:39:33,400
have the right process, but you then in the draft,

835
00:39:33,440 --> 00:39:37,159
for example, choose guys who may not necessarily be the

836
00:39:37,199 --> 00:39:41,800
best pieces to an overarching puzzle, then you kind of

837
00:39:41,840 --> 00:39:45,119
still fall short. Like I'm not out on Brandon Miller whatsoever.

838
00:39:45,239 --> 00:39:47,800
I do wonder if he is going to be because,

839
00:39:48,119 --> 00:39:50,920
like I said this, I think last year I was like,

840
00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:52,920
this guy could be the best player on the Hornets,

841
00:39:52,920 --> 00:39:55,519
like this could be the guy who could actually allow

842
00:39:55,599 --> 00:39:58,440
LaMelo to be that secondary guy where I think he

843
00:39:58,480 --> 00:40:00,440
would be unleashed in a far more effect the way,

844
00:40:01,280 --> 00:40:04,920
But there's also an element of Brandon Miller where his

845
00:40:05,159 --> 00:40:09,800
amount of trigger happiness at times comes at the cost

846
00:40:10,000 --> 00:40:14,800
of overall team cohesion. Now they're young, so like they

847
00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:17,679
have time, but LaMelo is on a big deal. He's

848
00:40:17,719 --> 00:40:19,519
also like one thing by the way, that I forgot

849
00:40:19,559 --> 00:40:22,719
to mention about LaMelo, which is, I don't want to

850
00:40:22,719 --> 00:40:24,920
say it's like fully out of his control, but mostly

851
00:40:24,920 --> 00:40:28,320
it's out of his control. Its availability. Like injuries happen,

852
00:40:29,440 --> 00:40:32,679
but if you consistently missed that many games year in

853
00:40:32,719 --> 00:40:36,039
and year out, I'm sorry. Then just becomes one of

854
00:40:36,039 --> 00:40:38,519
those embeat situations where it doesn't matter how good you are,

855
00:40:38,559 --> 00:40:41,000
if you can't be relied upon being healthy going into

856
00:40:41,039 --> 00:40:45,400
a playoff series, for example, you just automatically put a

857
00:40:45,440 --> 00:40:47,840
cap on your ceiling. But like Brandon Miller, to me,

858
00:40:48,320 --> 00:40:51,960
if he becomes a more consistent two way player, which

859
00:40:51,960 --> 00:40:55,199
I think is in the cards, he's twenty two, right,

860
00:40:55,280 --> 00:40:57,159
like something along those lines, like I'm not out on

861
00:40:57,199 --> 00:40:59,039
anyone who's twenty two and.

862
00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:01,119
Speaker 2: I think as of now, you remember everyone was killing

863
00:41:01,119 --> 00:41:03,519
them for even with how well he's playing at the moment,

864
00:41:04,119 --> 00:41:05,880
like there's still a debate of well, should they should

865
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:07,360
have just gone Scoot at that point, Like that wasn't

866
00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:10,039
even a question until Scoot started started playing better, And

867
00:41:10,079 --> 00:41:11,719
I think the right answer would still be no.

868
00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:13,480
Speaker 1: They were right to default to Brandon Miller.

869
00:41:13,519 --> 00:41:14,360
Speaker 3: They were I was wrong.

870
00:41:14,519 --> 00:41:17,800
Speaker 1: I was wrong. I was wrong, great man, We've had

871
00:41:17,800 --> 00:41:20,639
some misses on this podcast. That was what our bigger one. Look.

872
00:41:20,679 --> 00:41:22,320
Speaker 3: I mean I had missus. But by the way, when

873
00:41:22,360 --> 00:41:24,920
you said earlier that this wasn't coined on you, like

874
00:41:24,960 --> 00:41:27,719
not calling LaMelo a winner, for example, that is coined

875
00:41:27,719 --> 00:41:29,920
on me because I said as much last year. I

876
00:41:30,360 --> 00:41:32,199
last year, I was like, I don't think he's a winner.

877
00:41:32,239 --> 00:41:35,320
I was. I've been very harsh on him because I

878
00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:41,639
thought I saw someone who was tremendously undisciplined, like tremendously undisciplined,

879
00:41:41,679 --> 00:41:46,159
and frankly, someone who his teammates were like very often

880
00:41:46,320 --> 00:41:49,639
just the body language towards him was very dismissive, was

881
00:41:49,760 --> 00:41:52,800
very frustrated, where I was like, oh, oh that that's

882
00:41:52,840 --> 00:41:57,280
not great. We've seen a different version this year, we've

883
00:41:57,320 --> 00:41:59,679
seen players embrace him a little bit more. I do

884
00:41:59,760 --> 00:42:01,960
think he's gonna be a guy who matures. He also

885
00:42:02,039 --> 00:42:05,880
needs to, because he has extremely poor habits both on

886
00:42:05,960 --> 00:42:08,440
and off the court that needs to be addressed. Frankly,

887
00:42:09,239 --> 00:42:13,320
So it's maybe it's time. Maybe maybe time is your

888
00:42:13,320 --> 00:42:15,440
friend here. But at the same time, you've got to

889
00:42:15,480 --> 00:42:18,199
pay guys like after this year, Brandon Miller only has

890
00:42:18,239 --> 00:42:20,039
two years left on his rookie deal. Then you've got

891
00:42:20,079 --> 00:42:22,920
to re up him. So, like the clock is ticking here.

892
00:42:23,079 --> 00:42:25,760
They but they need to find someone in the draft

893
00:42:25,760 --> 00:42:29,239
this year who just kind of, you know, glues everything together.

894
00:42:29,559 --> 00:42:31,360
You know what they need. They need a loule old

895
00:42:31,440 --> 00:42:34,840
dang type, that's what they need. Someone who's like, not

896
00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:37,639
a star, will just come in and play effective two

897
00:42:37,719 --> 00:42:40,280
way basketball. And I'm not saying like as a wing

898
00:42:40,719 --> 00:42:43,519
necessarily because they have a ton of wings, just someone

899
00:42:43,559 --> 00:42:46,400
who is just the glue to everything.

900
00:42:47,400 --> 00:42:49,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't even know what I would identify as

901
00:42:49,039 --> 00:42:50,679
their biggest neede. I think you can make a case

902
00:42:50,679 --> 00:42:53,280
that it's a long term solution at the five, just

903
00:42:53,320 --> 00:42:56,840
because that's Mark Williams. But I think I guess I'm

904
00:42:56,840 --> 00:42:59,400
a little bit more optimistic about their timeline where type, look,

905
00:42:59,400 --> 00:43:01,239
it is, okay, it's two years before Brandon Miller, you're

906
00:43:01,239 --> 00:43:03,360
gonna extend Brandon Miller. But like so it's two years

907
00:43:03,440 --> 00:43:05,840
more years before that money kicks in, and then that's

908
00:43:05,840 --> 00:43:08,199
sort of okay. Then LaMelo has two years left on

909
00:43:08,239 --> 00:43:10,480
his current contract. It's like that's sort of like a

910
00:43:10,559 --> 00:43:13,360
nice pivot point. It seems like it aligns nicely. You did,

911
00:43:13,519 --> 00:43:15,480
what's really interesting? And so I haven't given enough thought

912
00:43:15,559 --> 00:43:17,440
to this, maybe because this year's draft class has been

913
00:43:17,440 --> 00:43:19,639
all over the place. But do we look back at

914
00:43:19,679 --> 00:43:22,280
the t Jon Salon pick, because right now, I think

915
00:43:22,280 --> 00:43:26,760
that dude plays insanely hard. I do not understand or

916
00:43:26,840 --> 00:43:28,400
I don't have a feel for what he could be

917
00:43:28,920 --> 00:43:31,000
in the NBA yet at this point. And that's kind

918
00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:33,440
of when you're gonna come out with such a high

919
00:43:33,519 --> 00:43:35,719
draft pick. And that's what we're gonna say this far

920
00:43:35,760 --> 00:43:37,880
into his rookie season. It's I don't ever want to

921
00:43:37,880 --> 00:43:40,480
write off it. Like Cody Williams, I had him atop

922
00:43:40,559 --> 00:43:42,199
my big board. I'm not ready to write him off yet.

923
00:43:42,239 --> 00:43:45,320
But like what we've seen thus far, or more actly

924
00:43:45,320 --> 00:43:47,599
what we have not seen, like it is. It is concerning,

925
00:43:47,599 --> 00:43:50,000
So there is there's definitely that level of pressure there,

926
00:43:50,000 --> 00:43:52,280
and I do wonder if they'll have the stomach to

927
00:43:53,559 --> 00:43:55,880
because I say, I'm happy or not happy. But they

928
00:43:55,920 --> 00:43:59,039
have two years, like before Brandon Miller's next contract is

929
00:43:59,039 --> 00:44:01,960
is bigger, but like you need to understand and this

930
00:44:02,000 --> 00:44:03,639
is the tough part of rebuilding, Okay, when is the

931
00:44:03,679 --> 00:44:05,920
right time to go for it? And you don't get

932
00:44:05,920 --> 00:44:08,159
to say that, I would say this summer, even if

933
00:44:08,159 --> 00:44:09,840
you wind up with a top five pick, because you're

934
00:44:09,840 --> 00:44:12,039
i think projected to at this point, because you still

935
00:44:12,119 --> 00:44:14,320
kind of need to see, well, what does that player

936
00:44:14,400 --> 00:44:16,920
turn into? With Brandon Miller and LaMelo Ball, so they

937
00:44:16,920 --> 00:44:19,119
are they're on sort of a slippery slope. But I

938
00:44:19,119 --> 00:44:21,440
think the fact that even LaMelo and we know it

939
00:44:21,440 --> 00:44:24,360
doesn't work like this, but he's under team control for

940
00:44:24,360 --> 00:44:26,519
four more years after this one. Brandon Miller's under team

941
00:44:26,519 --> 00:44:28,440
control for even longer when you factor in how these

942
00:44:28,440 --> 00:44:31,039
extensions work. Yeah, if they have the stomach to kind

943
00:44:31,039 --> 00:44:33,440
of see this through, they have a real amount of time.

944
00:44:33,480 --> 00:44:35,960
And I also think, to LaMelo's credit and I agree,

945
00:44:35,960 --> 00:44:38,599
like there's just off court stuffloading around out there, that yeah, yeah,

946
00:44:38,639 --> 00:44:42,000
he's young, but it's also it gives you pause. It's

947
00:44:42,119 --> 00:44:45,039
never seemed like there's nothing unless you've heard differently. I've

948
00:44:45,119 --> 00:44:48,000
never heard a thing about he wants out. He's like

949
00:44:48,039 --> 00:44:50,159
sort of looking at me. He's not happy here. That's

950
00:44:50,199 --> 00:44:50,800
a big deal.

951
00:44:51,760 --> 00:44:55,239
Speaker 3: Yep. I guess it's Charlotte, but just.

952
00:44:55,280 --> 00:44:57,920
Speaker 2: Like it's not even because it's Charlotte, it's this team

953
00:44:57,960 --> 00:45:02,320
has been this organization like it's lacked coherence, I would

954
00:45:02,320 --> 00:45:03,480
say until recently.

955
00:45:03,679 --> 00:45:05,119
Speaker 1: And so you could even if.

956
00:45:05,039 --> 00:45:08,079
Speaker 2: You were in like maybe you could if if the

957
00:45:08,119 --> 00:45:10,639
Los Angeles Lakers were pulling this BS okay, maybe you

958
00:45:10,679 --> 00:45:13,719
get away with it. But there's probably twenty four franchises

959
00:45:14,039 --> 00:45:16,440
if they had kind of followed the same trajectory as

960
00:45:16,440 --> 00:45:17,199
the Hornet since.

961
00:45:17,119 --> 00:45:19,159
Speaker 1: LaMelo entered the league.

962
00:45:19,400 --> 00:45:21,559
Speaker 2: There's a probably a ton of organizations that would then

963
00:45:21,599 --> 00:45:24,719
see their best player during that span would have wanted out.

964
00:45:24,840 --> 00:45:26,639
But no, or you would have heard mumblings about it,

965
00:45:27,280 --> 00:45:29,880
unless there's anything is there? Well, so you mentioned Brandon Miller.

966
00:45:29,920 --> 00:45:33,039
Is there anything is in particular about his game where

967
00:45:33,039 --> 00:45:35,920
you're viewing it as sort of the swing factors as

968
00:45:35,960 --> 00:45:39,039
he projects or doesn't project as a star so.

969
00:45:39,320 --> 00:45:44,679
Speaker 3: There's definitely a part of his current efficiency that's just

970
00:45:45,039 --> 00:45:47,920
you know, tough cities, honestly, where he's just not hitting

971
00:45:47,960 --> 00:45:51,480
that I can't look that's that's no. But like sometimes

972
00:45:51,559 --> 00:45:53,679
it's a Magan misleague, right, So I'm not going to

973
00:45:53,760 --> 00:45:56,039
fold him like right now, he's he's you know, he's

974
00:45:56,079 --> 00:45:58,599
injured obviously, but he's he's hitting like forty percent from

975
00:45:58,599 --> 00:46:01,920
the field on the year. I don't think that's representative

976
00:46:02,000 --> 00:46:04,039
who he is. He's missed a lot of open shots,

977
00:46:04,360 --> 00:46:06,440
at least from what I've seen. I actually haven't pulled

978
00:46:06,440 --> 00:46:08,719
the numbers up, but I'm pretty sure they'll back me up.

979
00:46:08,880 --> 00:46:11,840
I'll be a little bit surprised if they don't. That said,

980
00:46:12,719 --> 00:46:18,519
he's a very sneaky athletic and at six ' nine,

981
00:46:19,000 --> 00:46:22,039
like slithery type of guy. I want to see him

982
00:46:22,079 --> 00:46:24,760
attack the paint a lot more. I think he gets

983
00:46:24,760 --> 00:46:28,800
into these I don't know what it is like attacking

984
00:46:28,840 --> 00:46:31,400
philosophies where he's like, no, no, no, my best ascid

985
00:46:31,559 --> 00:46:33,719
is like the three and I just got a jacket.

986
00:46:34,280 --> 00:46:38,239
It's I just I wanted a little bit more nuanced there.

987
00:46:39,840 --> 00:46:42,960
I spoke with him during the draft or before the draft,

988
00:46:43,440 --> 00:46:46,599
in New York two years ago, and everything he was

989
00:46:46,599 --> 00:46:49,760
talking about was leadership, Like he had to play like leader,

990
00:46:49,800 --> 00:46:51,480
he had to act like a leader, he had to

991
00:46:51,480 --> 00:46:53,800
do all these things where he had to put his

992
00:46:53,880 --> 00:46:57,800
best foot forward. And you know, I believe him, but

993
00:46:58,039 --> 00:47:00,159
I still need to like see it. And maybe that's

994
00:47:00,199 --> 00:47:03,119
a third year jump. Could be I'm not knocking it.

995
00:47:03,119 --> 00:47:05,519
It could be a thing, but we need to see more.

996
00:47:05,719 --> 00:47:09,719
As for your salon thing, I have a theory of

997
00:47:09,760 --> 00:47:12,360
how he's gonna end up, like if he's gonna get

998
00:47:12,400 --> 00:47:14,960
a real crack. I think he's a play finisher, and

999
00:47:15,000 --> 00:47:17,840
I think when you try to put the ball in

1000
00:47:17,880 --> 00:47:21,320
his hands and ask him to create, you're sort of

1001
00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:24,920
negating what his real skill is. He to me, seems

1002
00:47:24,960 --> 00:47:29,239
like someone who has a really strong sense of how

1003
00:47:29,280 --> 00:47:32,119
to be set up and how to position himself. So

1004
00:47:32,840 --> 00:47:35,679
I would like to see him in a role where

1005
00:47:35,679 --> 00:47:38,480
he's not being asked to create, where he's not being

1006
00:47:38,559 --> 00:47:40,559
asked to like get you know, from outside the three

1007
00:47:40,559 --> 00:47:43,239
point line, like go do something. He needs to be

1008
00:47:44,079 --> 00:47:47,400
someone who just kind of catches and shoots, you know,

1009
00:47:47,559 --> 00:47:50,119
rolls and catches and then goes straight up. He needs

1010
00:47:50,159 --> 00:47:52,360
to be someone who's like set up eighty five percent

1011
00:47:52,360 --> 00:47:55,000
of the time and then just focuses on Yeah, I

1012
00:47:55,000 --> 00:47:58,800
have to finish plays because that's gonna take offensive pressure

1013
00:47:58,840 --> 00:48:01,840
off of Brandon Miller. It's gonna make LaMelo's life a

1014
00:48:01,840 --> 00:48:03,920
little bit easier. And I also think that's part of

1015
00:48:03,960 --> 00:48:08,119
how you unlock LaMelo, because if there's one compliment I'll

1016
00:48:08,119 --> 00:48:12,320
give LaMelo that I haven't paid him. His court vision

1017
00:48:13,239 --> 00:48:18,039
is so much better than what we're seeing in terms

1018
00:48:18,039 --> 00:48:20,639
of the raw stats production. Like that's the one area

1019
00:48:20,639 --> 00:48:23,920
where I think he's he has more influence than what

1020
00:48:23,960 --> 00:48:28,519
his line suggests. His court is exceptional and he needs

1021
00:48:28,559 --> 00:48:31,480
to utilize it way way way more.

1022
00:48:32,039 --> 00:48:34,000
Speaker 1: Put better options around him, and I think he might.

1023
00:48:34,440 --> 00:48:36,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I think I do think he's one

1024
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:40,480
of the best at creating like high quality shots for teammates.

1025
00:48:40,519 --> 00:48:42,159
Speaker 1: Like there's a real on ball gravity to him.

1026
00:48:42,199 --> 00:48:44,280
Speaker 2: And like you said, the vision, I don't know if

1027
00:48:44,280 --> 00:48:45,599
I see it with claw on the way you do,

1028
00:48:45,679 --> 00:48:47,320
but I would probably agree that that would be the

1029
00:48:47,360 --> 00:48:49,159
most efficient path. Or Okay, if he's going to be

1030
00:48:49,199 --> 00:48:51,239
you typically don't. I'm trying to think of what would

1031
00:48:51,239 --> 00:48:53,320
be a good example of a higher quality NBA player

1032
00:48:53,320 --> 00:48:55,880
where like that's because the player you just describe feels

1033
00:48:55,960 --> 00:49:00,239
like they're a big and he's not. Defensively, I don't

1034
00:49:00,239 --> 00:49:02,320
think you're ever going to see him at least stably

1035
00:49:02,440 --> 00:49:05,599
play a bunch of five. So what is like, I'm like,

1036
00:49:05,639 --> 00:49:07,760
what are the pro comps for him coming out of college?

1037
00:49:08,039 --> 00:49:13,679
Speaker 3: Yeah, he's He's like, yeah, well play he would need

1038
00:49:13,760 --> 00:49:19,719
to add like how many inches this vertical? I he's

1039
00:49:21,000 --> 00:49:23,920
I don't know if I have like a comp, but

1040
00:49:24,159 --> 00:49:26,400
I think that is the way to use him, at least,

1041
00:49:26,400 --> 00:49:29,159
like if he's not going to be a starter. Okay,

1042
00:49:29,360 --> 00:49:31,480
I do see a pathway for him to become like

1043
00:49:31,599 --> 00:49:35,199
a solid rotational piece, but like you have to streamline

1044
00:49:35,239 --> 00:49:36,920
his role significantly.

1045
00:49:37,559 --> 00:49:40,320
Speaker 1: There was I guess the pro coom that I just

1046
00:49:40,360 --> 00:49:40,800
googled it.

1047
00:49:40,840 --> 00:49:43,320
Speaker 2: So that's not and I'm now remembering Obi Toppin was

1048
00:49:43,360 --> 00:49:44,760
the comp that would use for him a lot.

1049
00:49:45,320 --> 00:49:46,320
Speaker 3: Also very athletic.

1050
00:49:46,360 --> 00:49:50,199
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah there's I guess that's sort of just play finisher.

1051
00:49:50,239 --> 00:49:50,480
Speaker 1: Though.

1052
00:49:50,800 --> 00:49:53,000
Speaker 2: It just feels like those guys are objectively tougher to

1053
00:49:53,000 --> 00:49:55,960
fit into the higher level of rotation. If they're not,

1054
00:49:57,400 --> 00:49:58,719
I don't want to say, if they're not a big man.

1055
00:49:58,760 --> 00:50:00,840
But if they're not a really strong offender.

1056
00:50:01,960 --> 00:50:04,760
Speaker 3: That's fair. That is fair. But like again, he's nineteen,

1057
00:50:05,159 --> 00:50:08,519
let's not rule that out yet. I think that's.

1058
00:50:07,920 --> 00:50:09,360
Speaker 1: Also incredibly fair. Uh.

1059
00:50:09,440 --> 00:50:11,679
Speaker 2: The only other question I want to ask you about

1060
00:50:11,719 --> 00:50:13,280
this team unless you have anything else you want to

1061
00:50:13,280 --> 00:50:15,840
touch upon, of course interesting or is it.

1062
00:50:15,800 --> 00:50:16,960
Speaker 1: Not really an interesting decision?

1063
00:50:16,960 --> 00:50:20,079
Speaker 2: Like they don't have a lot or of tough decisions

1064
00:50:20,079 --> 00:50:22,679
to make This off seem like trade man going into

1065
00:50:22,679 --> 00:50:25,000
free agency. That's someone who we haven't seen like a

1066
00:50:25,039 --> 00:50:27,400
ton of this year because he got injured so early on.

1067
00:50:27,480 --> 00:50:29,880
But when he came over in the trade from Oklahoma

1068
00:50:29,960 --> 00:50:33,320
City last year, like he's shown and including this season,

1069
00:50:33,400 --> 00:50:35,440
like just a ton of sort of shake, some mon

1070
00:50:35,480 --> 00:50:38,719
ball juice, some shooting. And he's been ruled out for

1071
00:50:38,760 --> 00:50:40,639
the year because of the back injury. That's gonna allumit

1072
00:50:40,719 --> 00:50:43,119
him to put he playing thirteen games. How do you

1073
00:50:43,199 --> 00:50:44,800
view I don't think there's going to be a super

1074
00:50:44,880 --> 00:50:47,360
robust market for him. But is this someone you're Charlotte,

1075
00:50:47,360 --> 00:50:48,840
you're looking to keep around.

1076
00:50:48,880 --> 00:50:52,960
Speaker 3: I guess yeah, absolutely, especially because you can now squeeze

1077
00:50:52,960 --> 00:50:55,480
his market even more, which is which sounds horrible.

1078
00:50:55,559 --> 00:50:59,039
Speaker 2: Let me utilize more over here advocating the repression of

1079
00:50:59,039 --> 00:50:59,559
the working time.

1080
00:51:00,760 --> 00:51:04,079
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm a total scap right now. It's horrible. No,

1081
00:51:04,280 --> 00:51:06,559
it's but like that's just the nature of the NBA,

1082
00:51:06,719 --> 00:51:09,599
right like there, that's that's how you negotiate. You're gonna

1083
00:51:09,639 --> 00:51:11,519
go to trade man, Like no, I hear you, I

1084
00:51:11,519 --> 00:51:13,480
hear you. It's just that's gonna be a thing. They're

1085
00:51:13,480 --> 00:51:15,679
probably gonna get back for cheap. I assume it's going

1086
00:51:15,719 --> 00:51:17,400
to be a short term deal, like a two year

1087
00:51:17,440 --> 00:51:18,320
or something.

1088
00:51:18,639 --> 00:51:22,159
Speaker 1: In them if you maybe you inflate his salary for

1089
00:51:22,199 --> 00:51:24,440
a little bit, and like then he becomes if a

1090
00:51:24,480 --> 00:51:25,880
trade opportunity arises.

1091
00:51:26,360 --> 00:51:30,199
Speaker 2: Yeah, they so vibe vibe meter check, what would you

1092
00:51:30,199 --> 00:51:32,480
give the Rebuilding Hornets?

1093
00:51:33,079 --> 00:51:36,000
Speaker 3: Uh six point one two four nine.

1094
00:51:37,239 --> 00:51:39,440
Speaker 1: Six point one two four nine. That feels a little low.

1095
00:51:39,880 --> 00:51:41,519
So you're would you would you say you're high or

1096
00:51:41,599 --> 00:51:43,320
lower on the vibes than in Brooklyn.

1097
00:51:44,599 --> 00:51:47,639
Speaker 3: I'm much lower here on the vibes. It's the Brooklyn vibes.

1098
00:51:47,679 --> 00:51:50,360
Like dig I think this team has more talent though,

1099
00:51:50,400 --> 00:51:53,360
so like if we if we bake talent into the

1100
00:51:53,480 --> 00:51:57,920
vibes section, I'll go like one full up. So seven

1101
00:51:58,000 --> 00:51:59,719
point one. I don't even remember them.

1102
00:52:00,639 --> 00:52:02,440
Speaker 1: You're trolling me, But I'm gonna give them an a

1103
00:52:02,519 --> 00:52:03,039
point four.

1104
00:52:03,400 --> 00:52:06,119
Speaker 3: Oh my god, Okay, fair enough, that's high.

1105
00:52:06,280 --> 00:52:10,679
Speaker 1: That's high that they have. There's a chance. I'm not

1106
00:52:10,719 --> 00:52:11,280
guaranteeing it.

1107
00:52:11,280 --> 00:52:13,159
Speaker 2: But then they already have done the two hardest things

1108
00:52:13,159 --> 00:52:14,920
of a rebuild, and that's get Lamello and Bread and

1109
00:52:14,960 --> 00:52:15,599
Miller in place.

1110
00:52:15,719 --> 00:52:18,199
Speaker 3: Right, huge chance to win the New York lottery too.

1111
00:52:18,519 --> 00:52:21,079
Speaker 2: Well, okay, but they've also accumulated now some extra first

1112
00:52:21,119 --> 00:52:24,199
round draft equity moving forward, so they could be, you know,

1113
00:52:24,760 --> 00:52:26,679
proactive if the right trade opportunity rises.

1114
00:52:26,679 --> 00:52:29,559
Speaker 3: I'm trolling you on that one, yes, yes, but I'm not.

1115
00:52:29,599 --> 00:52:32,000
I'm not that high though, I like, in all legitimacy,

1116
00:52:32,119 --> 00:52:35,360
I'm not eight point four because again, if like let's

1117
00:52:35,360 --> 00:52:38,880
say LaMelo is just that dude who misses forty games

1118
00:52:38,880 --> 00:52:39,440
per year.

1119
00:52:39,679 --> 00:52:42,320
Speaker 2: Then what you've lowered me, I'll go eight point one.

1120
00:52:42,400 --> 00:52:43,639
The jury risks with LaMelo.

1121
00:52:43,719 --> 00:52:44,239
Speaker 1: You know what it is.

1122
00:52:44,559 --> 00:52:46,039
Speaker 2: You know what my rebuke is, and I want to

1123
00:52:46,039 --> 00:52:48,679
make it clear it's not rational or fair. People thought

1124
00:52:48,679 --> 00:52:52,559
the same thing about Steph. We're talking to ankle injuries again,

1125
00:52:52,639 --> 00:52:54,239
and so like in the back of my head, it's

1126
00:52:54,400 --> 00:52:56,159
I'll probably wait another year or two before I get

1127
00:52:56,199 --> 00:52:57,159
really concerned about it.

1128
00:52:57,239 --> 00:52:59,039
Speaker 1: But that is the availability.

1129
00:52:59,199 --> 00:53:01,039
Speaker 2: I think people hate that argument because they feel like

1130
00:53:01,079 --> 00:53:03,840
it's lazy, but it's it's the it's probably the most

1131
00:53:03,840 --> 00:53:05,800
like salient one when it comes to the mellow two.

1132
00:53:06,159 --> 00:53:09,000
Dude needs to play more games for consecutive years.

1133
00:53:08,960 --> 00:53:12,639
Speaker 3: Right and look, I hope for his sake that he

1134
00:53:12,719 --> 00:53:15,039
figures that out. I also hope, for his sake just

1135
00:53:15,119 --> 00:53:17,599
wrap this up, that he starts striving a little bit

1136
00:53:17,599 --> 00:53:18,239
more carefully.

1137
00:53:18,719 --> 00:53:22,199
Speaker 1: We'll move on to the next team, Your Chicago Bulls.

1138
00:53:22,480 --> 00:53:23,360
Speaker 3: Now you're trolling me.

1139
00:53:23,760 --> 00:53:26,159
Speaker 1: Are they even rebuilding? Is the question that I think

1140
00:53:26,159 --> 00:53:27,119
we begin here with.

1141
00:53:27,840 --> 00:53:31,159
Speaker 3: Uh, based on what our Tori's Corner Show was said

1142
00:53:31,280 --> 00:53:34,639
after the trade that like, no, because they're still they're

1143
00:53:34,679 --> 00:53:36,159
still trying to make the play.

1144
00:53:36,960 --> 00:53:41,159
Speaker 2: That was the the NBA version of the concepts of

1145
00:53:41,199 --> 00:53:41,599
a plan.

1146
00:53:42,159 --> 00:53:42,559
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1147
00:53:42,639 --> 00:53:44,920
Speaker 2: I but is there a level of you that unless

1148
00:53:44,960 --> 00:53:47,639
you don't consider it candor but where him just kind

1149
00:53:47,639 --> 00:53:50,159
of saying like, not in this exact words, but we

1150
00:53:50,199 --> 00:53:51,599
really have no idea what the fuck is going on

1151
00:53:51,679 --> 00:53:51,880
right now?

1152
00:53:51,920 --> 00:53:52,800
Speaker 1: We're trying to You were.

1153
00:53:52,840 --> 00:53:54,719
Speaker 3: Less said it, He said they had to use like

1154
00:53:54,760 --> 00:53:58,519
the remaining forty something game to figure out a plan. Like, dude,

1155
00:53:58,519 --> 00:54:02,159
you've been there since twenty two, Like though, if you're

1156
00:54:02,239 --> 00:54:04,079
if you're looking at the limit or sort of the

1157
00:54:04,159 --> 00:54:07,159
launch of ball injury and like, oh, that really threw

1158
00:54:07,239 --> 00:54:10,440
us off. That happened in what early twenty twenty two?

1159
00:54:11,079 --> 00:54:14,559
Like what are we doing here? It's it's an embarrassment.

1160
00:54:14,760 --> 00:54:17,719
I you know you're trolling me with this one because

1161
00:54:18,079 --> 00:54:20,320
this used to be my former team. You're absolutely right,

1162
00:54:20,400 --> 00:54:20,639
that's what.

1163
00:54:21,000 --> 00:54:23,280
Speaker 1: I have found. The Chicago Bulls like they.

1164
00:54:23,159 --> 00:54:27,039
Speaker 3: Exist nothing I know, but like you put them on

1165
00:54:27,079 --> 00:54:30,639
this list because we're and we're doing a rebuilding episode,

1166
00:54:30,679 --> 00:54:33,960
which I think it's fair to say we have no

1167
00:54:34,039 --> 00:54:36,679
idea if they really are. We know that the Hornets are,

1168
00:54:37,039 --> 00:54:40,239
we know that the Nets are. The Bulls are just

1169
00:54:40,360 --> 00:54:46,239
like stuck in whatever world they seem to live in

1170
00:54:46,400 --> 00:54:48,960
where the only thing that matters is people showing up

1171
00:54:48,960 --> 00:54:52,199
to the game. Like, for example, their viewerships are way

1172
00:54:52,320 --> 00:54:56,000
way way down now. There are granted some issues there

1173
00:54:56,039 --> 00:54:59,480
in terms of like availability with their new sports then

1174
00:54:59,519 --> 00:55:03,199
and whatnot, but like that's not something they care about. Allegedly,

1175
00:55:03,400 --> 00:55:06,000
all they care about is season ticket sales, which is

1176
00:55:06,079 --> 00:55:09,679
like a great way to measure organizational strengths if you're

1177
00:55:09,679 --> 00:55:15,960
in nineteen eighty five. It's just like they're always behind

1178
00:55:16,000 --> 00:55:19,639
the curve, and I just don't anticipate them ever being

1179
00:55:19,679 --> 00:55:22,039
in front of it. I think if they luck out

1180
00:55:22,079 --> 00:55:24,360
and draft Cooper Flag, They're going to be like, look,

1181
00:55:24,400 --> 00:55:25,480
that was our plan all along.

1182
00:55:25,519 --> 00:55:25,960
Speaker 1: We're going to.

1183
00:55:25,960 --> 00:55:30,159
Speaker 3: Rebuild around this guy. And you'll unfortunately find like one

1184
00:55:30,239 --> 00:55:32,920
hundred thousand Chicagoans who are like, oh my god, that's

1185
00:55:32,960 --> 00:55:35,639
a great plan, great work, guys, Executive of the year,

1186
00:55:37,239 --> 00:55:42,039
which is just not the case. This team historically relies

1187
00:55:42,199 --> 00:55:46,480
almost exclusively on luck to get out of bad situations.

1188
00:55:47,320 --> 00:55:52,400
That Derek Rose draft is a perfectly solid example of that.

1189
00:55:52,440 --> 00:55:55,320
They had what one point seven one point eight percent

1190
00:55:55,400 --> 00:55:59,239
chance of that becoming the first overall pick. I like

1191
00:56:00,039 --> 00:56:03,320
Bricilli's I like him. I don't think he's as good

1192
00:56:03,320 --> 00:56:05,559
as Bulls fans are trying to hype him up as

1193
00:56:05,599 --> 00:56:08,199
and I think that's I don't even blame them. I

1194
00:56:08,280 --> 00:56:11,440
just think they need to cling into onto something for hope,

1195
00:56:11,960 --> 00:56:14,679
and that's the guy they're like, oh, he dunk's really good.

1196
00:56:14,800 --> 00:56:18,639
That means he's gonna be a good player, Okay, Like

1197
00:56:18,920 --> 00:56:21,960
I could see a scenario worrying he becomes a perfectly

1198
00:56:22,519 --> 00:56:25,000
solid NBA player, even a two way guy. He's got

1199
00:56:25,000 --> 00:56:28,599
a good shot blocking rate, He's he's got some defensive instincts.

1200
00:56:28,960 --> 00:56:33,280
Do I think he's gonna be like a star? I'd

1201
00:56:33,320 --> 00:56:34,920
be very, very surprised.

1202
00:56:36,519 --> 00:56:38,280
Speaker 2: I think it's fair to say you don't think he'd

1203
00:56:38,280 --> 00:56:42,119
be a star. I maybe I'm like too high on him,

1204
00:56:42,199 --> 00:56:44,760
is my baseline for the bulls, too low. I think

1205
00:56:44,760 --> 00:56:47,760
he's been incredible this year and there's some real I

1206
00:56:47,760 --> 00:56:49,440
know you mentioned like there's the dumps, but like there's

1207
00:56:49,480 --> 00:56:52,559
some real just like the combination of physicality and some

1208
00:56:52,599 --> 00:56:54,599
of the finishing on his drives are not the most

1209
00:56:54,599 --> 00:56:57,679
efficient right now. He's been better as a three point

1210
00:56:57,679 --> 00:57:01,039
shooter than I expected. And I think the two things

1211
00:57:01,079 --> 00:57:02,599
I think it surprised me the most about him. I

1212
00:57:02,599 --> 00:57:05,320
didn't think he would be this maybe the word's not ready,

1213
00:57:05,360 --> 00:57:08,519
but disruptive already defensively, just because I look at someone

1214
00:57:08,599 --> 00:57:10,519
that big who plays like a wing let's slay on offense,

1215
00:57:10,519 --> 00:57:12,679
and he's done some real big man stuff on the

1216
00:57:12,679 --> 00:57:15,320
defensive end. And then I didn't think he was gonna

1217
00:57:15,360 --> 00:57:18,360
shoot like or not shoot like there's like a handle there.

1218
00:57:18,440 --> 00:57:19,880
Maybe I just didn't watch enough of him like in

1219
00:57:19,880 --> 00:57:21,039
preparation for the draft.

1220
00:57:21,239 --> 00:57:23,159
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I think that he has.

1221
00:57:23,119 --> 00:57:26,960
Speaker 2: A higher ceiling than I initially anticipated. And that decision,

1222
00:57:27,079 --> 00:57:29,079
and I would say the Lonzo Ball extension like her

1223
00:57:29,079 --> 00:57:30,960
two that I feel like pretty comfortable with if I'm

1224
00:57:30,960 --> 00:57:33,239
a Bulls fan. It's like, maybe that's the And I

1225
00:57:33,280 --> 00:57:35,840
was an advocate of trading Kobe White, like you have

1226
00:57:35,920 --> 00:57:37,800
Kobe White there, and you should get a high draft

1227
00:57:37,800 --> 00:57:41,480
pick this year. I guess I look at this team

1228
00:57:41,880 --> 00:57:44,320
and aside from echoing a lot of the things that

1229
00:57:44,360 --> 00:57:47,760
you've already said, you do still have to wonder if

1230
00:57:47,920 --> 00:57:51,199
you can even talk yourself into trusting the decision making

1231
00:57:51,239 --> 00:57:54,800
processes here because even the zach Lavine trade, Okay, they

1232
00:57:54,840 --> 00:57:57,679
finally traded zach Lvine, but it's it feels like they

1233
00:57:58,719 --> 00:58:01,599
decided that having the rights to their own first round pick,

1234
00:58:01,639 --> 00:58:03,920
that they could if they were rebuilding properly, they could

1235
00:58:03,960 --> 00:58:07,039
just have kept This wasn't like the Nets in Houston situation,

1236
00:58:07,119 --> 00:58:10,840
where Houston controlled those outright. It was top ten protected

1237
00:58:11,039 --> 00:58:13,440
and then top eight for two years now. I tried

1238
00:58:13,440 --> 00:58:15,119
to rationalize it from there and by saying, well, they

1239
00:58:15,199 --> 00:58:17,360
clearly now this opens it up for the next two years.

1240
00:58:17,599 --> 00:58:20,920
If you're a built Bulls fan, that's almost terrifying because

1241
00:58:20,920 --> 00:58:22,320
as well, now leaders trade that.

1242
00:58:22,320 --> 00:58:25,079
Speaker 1: Pick really easily, Like do they look at it.

1243
00:58:24,840 --> 00:58:27,800
Speaker 2: And say, Okay, now we get to tank unencumbered if

1244
00:58:27,840 --> 00:58:30,760
we're better than expected on accident, fine, or is it well,

1245
00:58:30,800 --> 00:58:33,079
now we don't have to tank, and so let's ratchet

1246
00:58:33,079 --> 00:58:33,599
this up again.

1247
00:58:33,679 --> 00:58:34,000
Speaker 1: Baby.

1248
00:58:35,079 --> 00:58:37,800
Speaker 3: Look, that's and that's the thing you don't ever know.

1249
00:58:37,960 --> 00:58:42,400
And while I can certainly appreciate that there's a managerial

1250
00:58:42,480 --> 00:58:45,599
team in plays that never show their hands, it's because

1251
00:58:45,639 --> 00:58:47,800
they don't have a hand. It's because they don't have

1252
00:58:47,840 --> 00:58:51,679
a plan. Like you know that saying of it's better

1253
00:58:51,719 --> 00:58:55,519
to be quiet and to be looked like you're stupid

1254
00:58:55,599 --> 00:58:59,360
and instead of opening your mind your mouth and then confirming.

1255
00:58:58,880 --> 00:59:02,039
Speaker 4: It like that's heard of that maybe that's a dating

1256
00:59:02,159 --> 00:59:07,079
saying to hear that, but that's the saying at least

1257
00:59:07,079 --> 00:59:11,360
over here, And basically I think that's what Ak is

1258
00:59:11,559 --> 00:59:12,159
kind of doing.

1259
00:59:12,199 --> 00:59:15,000
Speaker 3: Like he always comes off like, oh, I'm fully aware

1260
00:59:15,000 --> 00:59:17,559
of what I'm I'm doing, and then suddenly he'll just

1261
00:59:17,639 --> 00:59:19,840
sit down in a draft boat or like at a

1262
00:59:19,840 --> 00:59:24,599
podium and go, yeah, we'll find a plan. We'll have

1263
00:59:24,719 --> 00:59:27,679
to come up with a plan, and just completely blow

1264
00:59:27,760 --> 00:59:30,480
the solution that they know what they're doing when they

1265
00:59:30,519 --> 00:59:32,960
clearly don't. By the way, I like, I don't disagree

1266
00:59:33,039 --> 00:59:35,440
with you on Busella's Like, I do think that he's

1267
00:59:35,480 --> 00:59:37,960
got some pop, he's got some juice. Like, I'm not

1268
00:59:38,039 --> 00:59:40,320
saying that he's gonna be bad. I don't think he is.

1269
00:59:40,360 --> 00:59:42,639
I think he's gonna be a full time starter. I

1270
00:59:42,679 --> 00:59:45,199
think he's gonna be personally fine NBA player. I just

1271
00:59:45,239 --> 00:59:48,280
don't see, you know, multiple All Stars in his future.

1272
00:59:48,599 --> 00:59:51,119
I'd love to be wrong. I would love to be wrong.

1273
00:59:51,199 --> 00:59:54,440
That'd be amazing, But I don't necessarily think he has

1274
00:59:54,519 --> 00:59:58,079
that game. We've been over this on informal podcast with

1275
00:59:58,159 --> 01:00:00,400
Kobe White. I think they messed up my not trading

1276
01:00:00,480 --> 01:00:02,400
him before the deadline because that would have made him

1277
01:00:02,440 --> 01:00:06,599
eligible for one more you know, playoff year for other

1278
01:00:06,679 --> 01:00:09,400
teams that could have had him for two years and

1279
01:00:09,400 --> 01:00:11,559
stuff just one now, so his value is going to

1280
01:00:11,559 --> 01:00:15,159
decline going into the summer. I don't understand why they

1281
01:00:15,199 --> 01:00:17,440
took on the contracts of Kevin Herder and Sack Collins.

1282
01:00:17,440 --> 01:00:20,159
That to me still seems a little bit hot the

1283
01:00:20,599 --> 01:00:24,679
lawnso ball thing. I agree with you in principle that

1284
01:00:24,760 --> 01:00:27,360
it wasn't the worst thing to happen, but it did.

1285
01:00:27,400 --> 01:00:30,599
It did came out that they had an offer on

1286
01:00:30,679 --> 01:00:34,280
him that included a first round pick. Now, granted, first

1287
01:00:34,360 --> 01:00:36,960
round picks that can mean a lot of things like

1288
01:00:37,119 --> 01:00:39,719
is it an unprotected from a team that's in the lottery?

1289
01:00:39,760 --> 01:00:43,320
Speaker 2: Probably not, And wasn't part of getting Bradley Beal from

1290
01:00:43,360 --> 01:00:44,280
Phoenix or something?

1291
01:00:44,599 --> 01:00:47,559
Speaker 3: Right? Like we don't know, right, Like, we don't know

1292
01:00:47,599 --> 01:00:50,119
what type of first round traff pick was available, but

1293
01:00:50,679 --> 01:00:54,039
one was. So you're looking at that situation going all right,

1294
01:00:54,559 --> 01:00:58,440
is extending Alonzo and then trading him on a smaller

1295
01:00:58,519 --> 01:01:01,719
contract better or like, are we sure we can get

1296
01:01:01,719 --> 01:01:04,559
that same offer in Again, I don't know the answer

1297
01:01:04,639 --> 01:01:07,440
to that. I probably would have opted for the safe

1298
01:01:07,559 --> 01:01:10,719
route and then just taken on that draft pick. But

1299
01:01:10,840 --> 01:01:13,400
that's me. That's that's because I want to play it safe,

1300
01:01:13,400 --> 01:01:15,360
because I don't trust the Bulls to do anything.

1301
01:01:16,000 --> 01:01:18,280
Speaker 2: That's a great segue to what I actually wanted to

1302
01:01:18,320 --> 01:01:21,840
ask you. I actually like the deal for the reasons

1303
01:01:21,880 --> 01:01:23,679
that I'm about to outline, but I also think everything

1304
01:01:23,800 --> 01:01:26,000
that I'm about to throw at you, those will be

1305
01:01:26,039 --> 01:01:28,880
sort of the cross sections of the offseason that the fine,

1306
01:01:29,320 --> 01:01:31,360
what is this team actually trying to do? And so

1307
01:01:31,400 --> 01:01:33,599
if you have Lonzo on your books, and I want

1308
01:01:33,599 --> 01:01:35,519
to make it clear, he's not the same players as

1309
01:01:35,559 --> 01:01:37,599
any of these guys, and there are mega questions about

1310
01:01:37,599 --> 01:01:40,920
his health, right, does it make it less likely that

1311
01:01:40,960 --> 01:01:43,480
they're just gonna let Josh Giddy bend them over a

1312
01:01:43,480 --> 01:01:44,400
barrel somehow?

1313
01:01:44,400 --> 01:01:45,480
Speaker 1: And restricted free agency?

1314
01:01:45,519 --> 01:01:47,920
Speaker 2: Because I think that the two players that I would

1315
01:01:47,960 --> 01:01:50,000
look at leading into this offseason as Okay, what are

1316
01:01:50,039 --> 01:01:52,719
the Bulls doing? What happens with Kobe White? If he's

1317
01:01:52,719 --> 01:01:55,039
still on this team in the next season, I would

1318
01:01:55,039 --> 01:01:56,960
be all sorts of worried about, Well, they're just gonna

1319
01:01:56,960 --> 01:01:58,840
give this guy. I'm not saying he's not worth the money,

1320
01:01:58,880 --> 01:02:00,599
but he won't be worth the money to a team

1321
01:02:01,000 --> 01:02:03,199
on the Bulls this trajectory, I would argue in his

1322
01:02:03,239 --> 01:02:06,280
next deal. But if they don't even entertain offers for him,

1323
01:02:06,440 --> 01:02:09,599
and then if you pay Josh Giddy like and look,

1324
01:02:09,639 --> 01:02:12,480
he's been he's been fined like, I still don't think

1325
01:02:12,519 --> 01:02:14,840
Josh Giddy is good. He's been hitting like forty percent

1326
01:02:14,840 --> 01:02:18,000
of his three since January first. Everything that bolls fans

1327
01:02:18,159 --> 01:02:21,000
or anyone who's a Josh Giddy advocate will and he's

1328
01:02:21,039 --> 01:02:23,679
got like he's got some stands, which I guess kudos

1329
01:02:23,719 --> 01:02:24,280
to his brand.

1330
01:02:25,119 --> 01:02:26,519
Speaker 1: We've seen this movie before.

1331
01:02:27,039 --> 01:02:29,400
Speaker 2: It never sticks and you're never gonna find out with

1332
01:02:29,400 --> 01:02:32,880
the current iteration of the bulls how unuseful he can

1333
01:02:32,920 --> 01:02:35,920
be in the playoffs. Go back and watch some Oklahoma

1334
01:02:36,000 --> 01:02:38,280
City games in the playoffs and notice maybe what's happening

1335
01:02:38,320 --> 01:02:39,920
when he's on the floor, more importantly, when he's not

1336
01:02:39,960 --> 01:02:43,119
on the floor. He's been fine by his own standards,

1337
01:02:43,159 --> 01:02:45,840
but the fact that they traded for him makes me wonder, well,

1338
01:02:45,880 --> 01:02:48,599
how much are they gonna pay him in restricted free agency?

1339
01:02:48,920 --> 01:02:51,239
And so I'm looking at him, I'm looking at Kobe

1340
01:02:51,280 --> 01:02:53,840
White as the decisions they make with those two players

1341
01:02:54,679 --> 01:02:58,360
will define their direction more I think than anything else.

1342
01:02:58,400 --> 01:02:59,760
Like maybe you could look at, well, who are they

1343
01:02:59,760 --> 01:03:01,599
gonna you could look at or will they make any

1344
01:03:01,639 --> 01:03:04,280
other trades? But I think those two players, specifically, what

1345
01:03:04,400 --> 01:03:05,800
happens with them is what I'm watching and so I

1346
01:03:05,840 --> 01:03:08,159
looked at the Lonzo Ball extension and the two things

1347
01:03:08,159 --> 01:03:10,760
that stood out was, okay, the low number he could

1348
01:03:10,800 --> 01:03:13,039
fit into someone's non tax payerment level, and maybe that

1349
01:03:13,159 --> 01:03:15,079
was part of the calculus for them, But I didn't

1350
01:03:15,079 --> 01:03:16,840
actually see the report about them having a first round

1351
01:03:16,880 --> 01:03:19,000
pick on the table and when they took back such

1352
01:03:19,039 --> 01:03:22,440
bad money in the zach Lavine trade with it only

1353
01:03:22,480 --> 01:03:24,480
goes out another year each, But for Zach Collins and

1354
01:03:24,519 --> 01:03:27,679
Kevin Herder, that's actually wild then that they wouldn't have

1355
01:03:27,719 --> 01:03:29,440
taken that. But I also looked at it and said,

1356
01:03:29,880 --> 01:03:32,400
does it may get less likely or even more likely

1357
01:03:32,480 --> 01:03:34,280
that because none of us expect them to just tell

1358
01:03:34,400 --> 01:03:37,199
Josh Giddy to walk when you traded Alex Caruso for him.

1359
01:03:37,400 --> 01:03:38,360
Speaker 1: But does it give.

1360
01:03:38,199 --> 01:03:42,079
Speaker 2: Them some cover or just embolden them to not pay

1361
01:03:42,199 --> 01:03:44,880
Josh Giddy twenty five thirty million dollars a year? And

1362
01:03:44,960 --> 01:03:46,639
I want to make this clear, you don't need to

1363
01:03:46,679 --> 01:03:49,039
tell me what that's worth as a percentage of the

1364
01:03:49,039 --> 01:03:52,400
salary cap people. He's not worth it like that amount

1365
01:03:52,400 --> 01:03:55,559
of money per year. I don't that's me Maybe Galaxy

1366
01:03:55,559 --> 01:03:58,039
branding it and giving the bulls too much credit, especially

1367
01:03:58,079 --> 01:04:01,119
because they do different things. Those were the two kind

1368
01:04:01,119 --> 01:04:03,039
of lenses through which I was looking at this, right.

1369
01:04:03,760 --> 01:04:06,199
Speaker 3: I hate the fact that that we sort of have

1370
01:04:06,320 --> 01:04:09,519
to look at it through that perspective though, Like does

1371
01:04:09,599 --> 01:04:13,280
this allow them It shouldn't matter, Like you should be

1372
01:04:13,320 --> 01:04:16,360
able to in a vacuum look at Josh Gideyon and

1373
01:04:16,400 --> 01:04:21,679
go hell no, just no, go away, like you're not

1374
01:04:22,000 --> 01:04:26,360
you're not a long term piece. Just it's that should

1375
01:04:26,400 --> 01:04:29,840
be pretty easy to identify. But with the Bulls, it's

1376
01:04:29,880 --> 01:04:32,559
always and to correctly outline this, it's that's the way

1377
01:04:32,559 --> 01:04:35,199
they're thinking, like is there a way we can sort

1378
01:04:35,199 --> 01:04:38,159
of save face by doing a B and C before

1379
01:04:38,239 --> 01:04:42,199
we do D. You can't think like that As an

1380
01:04:42,280 --> 01:04:44,880
NB organization, You're always gonna be behind the curve. And

1381
01:04:44,920 --> 01:04:47,400
this is what they've done for years. So like to

1382
01:04:47,440 --> 01:04:51,559
your answer, yes, it like keeping Lonzo will in many

1383
01:04:51,599 --> 01:04:55,000
ways make it easier for them to just not match

1384
01:04:55,039 --> 01:04:57,079
an offer sheet, like all right, let's see if an

1385
01:04:57,079 --> 01:05:02,199
offer sheet even comes in. I don't know what their

1386
01:05:02,239 --> 01:05:05,320
plan is here. I don't know if they want to

1387
01:05:05,599 --> 01:05:08,000
look at the rest of the season and then lay

1388
01:05:08,039 --> 01:05:10,800
up land and then go into next year thinking well,

1389
01:05:10,920 --> 01:05:13,960
full training camp with Kevin Herder and Sack Collins. Maybe

1390
01:05:14,039 --> 01:05:16,920
Pat Williams like bounce us back a little bit. We

1391
01:05:16,960 --> 01:05:19,920
can be right into that eight to ten spot again,

1392
01:05:20,000 --> 01:05:21,840
Like I just can't rule it out, Dan, and we

1393
01:05:21,840 --> 01:05:23,760
can sit here and say, well, if they do a

1394
01:05:24,440 --> 01:05:27,880
then that probably suggests that they're leaning towards rebuilt. But

1395
01:05:27,960 --> 01:05:31,920
like we thought, trading sac Lavine would be that, you know,

1396
01:05:32,039 --> 01:05:35,480
the smoking gun. And then Ak goes out and tells

1397
01:05:35,519 --> 01:05:39,159
the press, no, no, we're still trying to make the postseason.

1398
01:05:39,360 --> 01:05:42,719
Speaker 2: I think you still can hold out. However, scant like

1399
01:05:42,840 --> 01:05:46,360
hope that that is what it does signal. And they

1400
01:05:46,360 --> 01:05:49,360
didn't trade Vouch either. I think the off season is

1401
01:05:49,360 --> 01:05:50,719
gonna have a lot to say. I think they've bought

1402
01:05:50,800 --> 01:05:54,559
themselves not benefit of the doubt. But okay, let's see

1403
01:05:54,719 --> 01:05:57,039
what happens in the off season. My vibe meter here,

1404
01:05:57,119 --> 01:06:00,360
my vibe Jack is still because I like Bousella. Because

1405
01:06:00,360 --> 01:06:03,599
they actually did trade zach Lavine, it's probably a two

1406
01:06:03,639 --> 01:06:06,639
point eight. That's that's that's inflated because of all the

1407
01:06:06,719 --> 01:06:08,800
questions that we both it's so ambiguous.

1408
01:06:09,039 --> 01:06:11,440
Speaker 1: That's a problem after all these years and something eight.

1409
01:06:11,519 --> 01:06:12,199
Speaker 3: I love that.

1410
01:06:12,280 --> 01:06:15,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, but they have at least opened the door by

1411
01:06:15,480 --> 01:06:18,920
trading zach Lavine to me saying maybe they had their

1412
01:06:18,960 --> 01:06:22,039
revelatory come to Jesus moments and it came too late,

1413
01:06:22,400 --> 01:06:24,920
or it should have come way sooner, but they did

1414
01:06:24,960 --> 01:06:28,119
move him, and let's see what decisions they now make

1415
01:06:28,159 --> 01:06:29,000
over the offseason.

1416
01:06:29,559 --> 01:06:33,679
Speaker 3: So, because that realization came so late, and because everything's

1417
01:06:33,800 --> 01:06:38,199
basically always late for the Bulls, I'm also gonna go

1418
01:06:38,239 --> 01:06:40,519
with two point eight, but I'm gonna go minus. I'm

1419
01:06:40,559 --> 01:06:43,440
gonna go negative two point eight on the vibe meter

1420
01:06:43,599 --> 01:06:45,920
here for the Bulls. I have zero faith in their

1421
01:06:45,920 --> 01:06:49,800
ability whatsoever. It's like, what is that that movie with

1422
01:06:49,880 --> 01:06:52,800
Adam Sandler where he gives like the most stupid answer

1423
01:06:52,840 --> 01:06:54,360
to a question and that like.

1424
01:06:54,639 --> 01:06:57,760
Speaker 2: At an Adam Sandler movie the point at an Adam

1425
01:06:57,800 --> 01:06:58,599
Sandler movie.

1426
01:06:59,119 --> 01:07:02,199
Speaker 3: That is fair, No, but like it's a specific movie

1427
01:07:02,239 --> 01:07:05,679
where there's a guy who gives like that is incorrect

1428
01:07:05,880 --> 01:07:08,079
and like make God have mercy on your soul.

1429
01:07:08,000 --> 01:07:09,840
Speaker 1: Like this Billy Madison game.

1430
01:07:10,639 --> 01:07:13,400
Speaker 3: There we go. That's right, that one, Like that is

1431
01:07:13,440 --> 01:07:17,000
how I look at the Bulls, like perpetually whenever they

1432
01:07:17,039 --> 01:07:20,280
do a thing. That's that That video just plays in

1433
01:07:20,280 --> 01:07:23,440
my head, that's just that's the bulls. I don't trust

1434
01:07:23,440 --> 01:07:25,559
them to even get a draft pick. Right, that's where we.

1435
01:07:25,519 --> 01:07:27,960
Speaker 1: Are minus two point eight, all right, I favor it.

1436
01:07:28,079 --> 01:07:32,199
Speaker 2: That's I think it's it's brutal, but it's it's deservedly brutal.

1437
01:07:32,440 --> 01:07:34,920
Next up is the Detroit Pistons, who are in the

1438
01:07:34,960 --> 01:07:37,840
playoff hunt. But this is still You don't look at

1439
01:07:37,840 --> 01:07:39,920
this team what they did over the offseason and say.

1440
01:07:39,800 --> 01:07:45,239
Speaker 1: Okay, they've completed their rebuilt, right, that's okay, that's okay.

1441
01:07:45,480 --> 01:07:48,840
Speaker 2: I just think some there's a negative We we celebrate

1442
01:07:48,920 --> 01:07:52,199
the moves that teams make to enter fox blown rebuilds,

1443
01:07:52,239 --> 01:07:54,519
but if they've been there longer, then we think they

1444
01:07:54,559 --> 01:07:58,000
should be we it has a negative connotation to it, right,

1445
01:07:58,000 --> 01:07:59,519
the word rebuilding. So I want to make it clear

1446
01:07:59,559 --> 01:08:02,519
this is not us trying to you know, drum up

1447
01:08:02,559 --> 01:08:07,159
Piston's utility talk. How are you feeling or what what

1448
01:08:07,199 --> 01:08:09,320
does this season change for this team moving forward?

1449
01:08:09,360 --> 01:08:10,960
Speaker 1: I think is actually the biggest question.

1450
01:08:11,239 --> 01:08:14,320
Speaker 3: Oh a lot, a lot. This team has found an identity,

1451
01:08:14,559 --> 01:08:18,239
like and they've done it despite a couple things Like

1452
01:08:18,520 --> 01:08:21,159
I think if we were to look at the current

1453
01:08:21,159 --> 01:08:24,079
success of this team going into this year, we were

1454
01:08:24,279 --> 01:08:26,840
all would be assuming that, oh, you know, that kid

1455
01:08:26,880 --> 01:08:30,319
obviously reaching this level that he's on, that Jayden Ivy sorry,

1456
01:08:30,319 --> 01:08:33,039
would just be way up higher than even this. And

1457
01:08:33,079 --> 01:08:36,319
I think Jalen Duran, we'd been talking about him like, oh,

1458
01:08:36,359 --> 01:08:39,840
then he's probably taken like a Dwight leap. Jalen Duran

1459
01:08:40,039 --> 01:08:43,560
is actually not having the best type of season for

1460
01:08:43,600 --> 01:08:47,880
his standards. So for them to have this success while

1461
01:08:48,000 --> 01:08:51,840
some of their young players are unavailable and have been unavailable,

1462
01:08:52,520 --> 01:08:57,279
and with some of them not necessarily playing up to expectations, huge,

1463
01:08:58,039 --> 01:09:01,880
That's huge because it gives the more room to improve further.

1464
01:09:02,399 --> 01:09:04,960
Like if everyone comes back healthy next year and are

1465
01:09:05,279 --> 01:09:07,800
more healthy than they've been this year, if Durtan has

1466
01:09:07,840 --> 01:09:10,720
improved and Ivy's improved healthy, if even Kate takes a

1467
01:09:10,760 --> 01:09:15,039
little another step in the right direction, then who's to

1468
01:09:15,079 --> 01:09:17,840
say this team couldn't you know, get it go all

1469
01:09:17,880 --> 01:09:20,640
in and have a top four seed. I can't rule

1470
01:09:20,680 --> 01:09:26,520
that out. It's it speaks so much to the necessity

1471
01:09:26,960 --> 01:09:30,359
of getting rid of the team that was in place

1472
01:09:30,600 --> 01:09:35,960
last year, Like managerial wise, coaching wise, everything had to go.

1473
01:09:36,520 --> 01:09:39,840
That was the right call, Like I'm not crowning them yet,

1474
01:09:39,880 --> 01:09:43,399
but I'm very optimistic about their long term future now.

1475
01:09:43,840 --> 01:09:45,840
Speaker 1: Which I think you you should be.

1476
01:09:46,199 --> 01:09:49,960
Speaker 2: I'm curious to see how they attempt to straddle this

1477
01:09:50,119 --> 01:09:52,319
line between I don't think they need to come in

1478
01:09:52,359 --> 01:09:53,840
next season or look at all those things say oh,

1479
01:09:53,880 --> 01:09:55,359
we need to get a lot better and be that

1480
01:09:55,479 --> 01:09:57,800
top four seed in the East. But it does get

1481
01:09:57,800 --> 01:10:00,520
interesting because how do you straddle that line between giving

1482
01:10:00,560 --> 01:10:04,319
players time and space to develop versus trying to upgrade

1483
01:10:04,600 --> 01:10:07,479
your roster when it might take, whether it's creating cast

1484
01:10:07,479 --> 01:10:10,119
space and using it or more likely like looking at trades.

1485
01:10:10,880 --> 01:10:13,279
I'm just super I don't know how they're gonna deal

1486
01:10:13,319 --> 01:10:14,760
with it, but I think the fact that they are

1487
01:10:14,800 --> 01:10:16,439
as good as they've been this season while sort of

1488
01:10:16,479 --> 01:10:21,399
juggling it effectively. I think probably the two biggest questions

1489
01:10:21,439 --> 01:10:24,279
I have for them is do they have that final

1490
01:10:24,359 --> 01:10:27,760
running mate for Cade already on the roster? And I

1491
01:10:27,840 --> 01:10:29,920
don't know, like we're not gonna see j Navy again

1492
01:10:29,960 --> 01:10:32,399
this season? Of course, I think even as he did

1493
01:10:32,399 --> 01:10:35,560
a better job of fitting in alongside Kate, I don't

1494
01:10:35,600 --> 01:10:38,039
know that you could have looked at his season and said, Okay,

1495
01:10:38,079 --> 01:10:40,600
he's the answer. They have Asar Thompson, who I still

1496
01:10:40,640 --> 01:10:43,600
am just incredibly high on, and they have Ron Holland

1497
01:10:43,680 --> 01:10:46,640
both of those guys have similar limitations on the offensive end, though,

1498
01:10:46,920 --> 01:10:48,920
and so it'll be interesting to see how that dynamic

1499
01:10:49,279 --> 01:10:52,600
continues to grow. And then you mentioned Jalen Duran. I mean,

1500
01:10:53,079 --> 01:10:56,520
I don't I don't know what I There's definitely players

1501
01:10:56,520 --> 01:10:58,680
who I flip flop on a lot. Yeah, he is

1502
01:10:58,680 --> 01:11:00,560
one of them, and he's probably in like the ninetieth

1503
01:11:00,560 --> 01:11:03,079
percent tile of players that I find myself flipping on.

1504
01:11:03,279 --> 01:11:07,880
I don't know, like specifically defensively, I don't know if

1505
01:11:07,920 --> 01:11:09,800
I view him as someone Okay, you can go ahead

1506
01:11:09,800 --> 01:11:12,399
and just build a longer term, really good.

1507
01:11:12,199 --> 01:11:14,880
Speaker 1: Defense with him as your back line anchor. I think

1508
01:11:14,920 --> 01:11:15,239
that is.

1509
01:11:15,279 --> 01:11:18,840
Speaker 2: You know, his rim protection metrics are they're fine this year,

1510
01:11:18,920 --> 01:11:21,199
Like he's covering around the sixtieth any any way you

1511
01:11:21,239 --> 01:11:24,159
slice it, expected field goal percentage, rimpoints save per one hundred.

1512
01:11:24,279 --> 01:11:26,319
He's just kind of in the sixtieth percent tile, which

1513
01:11:26,359 --> 01:11:29,800
is like meh, and is like, you know, he can finish,

1514
01:11:29,840 --> 01:11:32,680
but he's not like the most efficient finisher necessarily, especially

1515
01:11:32,720 --> 01:11:35,199
when there's other steps involved, like if he has to

1516
01:11:35,239 --> 01:11:37,319
go through contact as an example.

1517
01:11:37,840 --> 01:11:40,199
Speaker 3: But yet they're just wild considering how he's built, by

1518
01:11:40,199 --> 01:11:41,079
the way he is.

1519
01:11:41,279 --> 01:11:44,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, he is massive, and so he's also still young though,

1520
01:11:44,600 --> 01:11:48,199
So like I have questions about like this season is

1521
01:11:48,199 --> 01:11:50,560
is has been awesome for them, and I think that

1522
01:11:50,960 --> 01:11:53,000
your default to being incredibly high on their FEUTU.

1523
01:11:53,000 --> 01:11:53,880
Speaker 1: They're still flexible.

1524
01:11:54,079 --> 01:11:55,960
Speaker 2: They don't have a ton of extra picks, but you

1525
01:11:55,960 --> 01:11:58,039
don't necessarily need that. If you're flexible and you have

1526
01:11:58,359 --> 01:12:01,000
you have your directional polst to me, and that is

1527
01:12:01,039 --> 01:12:03,279
the hardest thing to do when rebuilding. And so you

1528
01:12:03,279 --> 01:12:06,039
found him in Kid, but I think you could argue

1529
01:12:06,079 --> 01:12:09,520
that every other spot around him is still very much

1530
01:12:09,640 --> 01:12:11,840
TBD and that I don't know if it puts them

1531
01:12:11,880 --> 01:12:15,119
in a precarious situation, but it's it's definitely an interesting situation.

1532
01:12:15,880 --> 01:12:18,319
Speaker 3: I think it does to an extent because obviously when

1533
01:12:18,319 --> 01:12:21,640
you have someone like Kid who finally broke through, you're

1534
01:12:21,680 --> 01:12:25,399
gonna need that second guy that's like what you're searching for,

1535
01:12:25,560 --> 01:12:27,800
like right off the bat, when you realize, oh oh

1536
01:12:27,920 --> 01:12:32,520
he's him. So I do have I closed the door

1537
01:12:32,640 --> 01:12:37,560
on Jaden probably not. I mean Ferdy game sample sized

1538
01:12:37,600 --> 01:12:39,800
this year is not a whole lot. And I also

1539
01:12:39,880 --> 01:12:43,479
think he kind of like had basketball PTSD from last

1540
01:12:43,560 --> 01:12:47,079
year because God, he was jerked around on that roster

1541
01:12:47,439 --> 01:12:52,680
to an extent that was, I mean, unprofessional. Honestly, it

1542
01:12:52,760 --> 01:12:55,560
was ridiculous how he was just he would not get

1543
01:12:55,720 --> 01:13:00,439
a stable roll, stable minutes, whatsoever. Then he got it

1544
01:13:00,520 --> 01:13:03,079
this year, but still sort of had to like, oh,

1545
01:13:03,479 --> 01:13:05,960
oh I'm actually I'm actually playing for the Mints per

1546
01:13:05,960 --> 01:13:09,760
game like that's that was an acclamation period as well,

1547
01:13:09,760 --> 01:13:12,840
and then he goes down. That's just tough. So I

1548
01:13:13,119 --> 01:13:14,800
do think it's going to be interesting to see what

1549
01:13:14,840 --> 01:13:17,000
type of season he's gonna have next year. The same

1550
01:13:17,000 --> 01:13:19,880
with Duran. There are some teams that are more inclined

1551
01:13:19,920 --> 01:13:23,600
to use like the rookie contracts period, especially for young pigs,

1552
01:13:23,640 --> 01:13:27,640
to basically say, look, all we need is a sign

1553
01:13:27,760 --> 01:13:31,439
within those first four years to see where this guy

1554
01:13:31,520 --> 01:13:34,279
is headed. And if the Pistons are like, okay, year four,

1555
01:13:34,319 --> 01:13:36,840
that's where he takes maybe a step up, they're like yep, yep,

1556
01:13:36,880 --> 01:13:40,960
we're comfortable. Let's move ahead and extend him or oh whali,

1557
01:13:41,119 --> 01:13:42,920
they can. Then you have to go into a restrict

1558
01:13:43,000 --> 01:13:45,880
free agency, but you catch my drift. I think this

1559
01:13:46,079 --> 01:13:48,640
is very much a reread and react type of situation

1560
01:13:48,720 --> 01:13:50,279
for them. I don't think they're gonna go out this

1561
01:13:50,279 --> 01:13:53,560
summer and be super aggressive. I think I think they'll

1562
01:13:53,600 --> 01:13:55,680
make changes. I think they'll make moves, and I think

1563
01:13:55,720 --> 01:13:58,439
they'll be buyers. But I don't think they're out there

1564
01:13:58,479 --> 01:14:01,520
just like, oh yeah, we'll trade and we'll trade. Janel Duran.

1565
01:14:01,600 --> 01:14:04,279
I think they're very much patient and I think that

1566
01:14:04,319 --> 01:14:07,119
patients is probably the right call at this point in time.

1567
01:14:07,560 --> 01:14:10,079
Speaker 2: I could see them doing something similar, and I think

1568
01:14:10,079 --> 01:14:14,479
they're at a different point in their phase of development,

1569
01:14:14,560 --> 01:14:17,600
rebuilding whatever, something sort of like what the Toronto Raptors did,

1570
01:14:17,600 --> 01:14:19,319
but you're not giving up a first round pick because

1571
01:14:19,359 --> 01:14:22,399
they just don't have extras. Where it's if someone has

1572
01:14:22,439 --> 01:14:24,600
a contract they don't necessarily want, or a player they

1573
01:14:24,600 --> 01:14:27,000
don't plan on keeping long term. But it fits with

1574
01:14:27,119 --> 01:14:29,560
the Pistons need where it's would you do some type

1575
01:14:29,600 --> 01:14:33,520
of structure where it's Tobias Harris plucks small salary.

1576
01:14:33,119 --> 01:14:34,239
Speaker 1: Acts and you're taking back CG.

1577
01:14:34,359 --> 01:14:36,680
Speaker 2: McCollum or something and you're just sort of rolling over

1578
01:14:37,159 --> 01:14:39,079
salary slot. That's just an example, and even if I'm

1579
01:14:39,079 --> 01:14:41,199
advocating for it. That feels like what they might do

1580
01:14:41,239 --> 01:14:43,359
this off season in addition and then bringing in well,

1581
01:14:43,359 --> 01:14:45,760
they might convey their pick to. But that's also what

1582
01:14:45,760 --> 01:14:47,079
makes them interesting, by the way, is that if they

1583
01:14:47,079 --> 01:14:50,039
send their pick to the Timberwolves, then like everything is

1584
01:14:50,119 --> 01:14:51,920
kind of on the players already in place, and then

1585
01:14:51,920 --> 01:14:53,760
how you upgrade around them.

1586
01:14:53,960 --> 01:14:55,560
Speaker 1: So I agree with you that it's read and react.

1587
01:14:55,720 --> 01:14:56,920
I'm just very curious.

1588
01:14:57,039 --> 01:14:58,399
Speaker 2: Is the word I've been throwing around a lot during

1589
01:14:58,399 --> 01:15:00,800
this segment, Well, how are they going to react to

1590
01:15:00,840 --> 01:15:01,439
what they've done?

1591
01:15:01,520 --> 01:15:02,239
Speaker 1: Yeah this year?

1592
01:15:02,279 --> 01:15:05,199
Speaker 2: And there's I think Jamie Bickerstaff, at least right now,

1593
01:15:05,199 --> 01:15:08,199
seems like a really good coach, like for what they've

1594
01:15:08,199 --> 01:15:10,640
been able to do for like really long stretches defensively

1595
01:15:10,680 --> 01:15:13,279
this year their third in points lab per possession since

1596
01:15:13,880 --> 01:15:16,880
January first. I don't think you look at this roster

1597
01:15:16,960 --> 01:15:19,000
and say that's something they should have done at any

1598
01:15:19,000 --> 01:15:22,520
point this year. So that's kudos to them. And what's

1599
01:15:22,960 --> 01:15:25,520
again in place? I think my final question here and

1600
01:15:25,560 --> 01:15:27,600
anything else you want to talk about, of course, who

1601
01:15:27,680 --> 01:15:30,319
is the player aside from k that you are highest

1602
01:15:30,359 --> 01:15:32,720
on long term on the Pistons.

1603
01:15:33,039 --> 01:15:36,199
Speaker 3: I'm still an Ivy guy. I buy the upside. I

1604
01:15:36,279 --> 01:15:40,880
totally buy into that this season was just hell on

1605
01:15:40,960 --> 01:15:43,680
him for an injury perspective, and last year was a

1606
01:15:43,760 --> 01:15:46,960
mentally tough season to get through because it was incompetence

1607
01:15:47,119 --> 01:15:51,359
from you know, the entire coaching staff and front office.

1608
01:15:51,800 --> 01:15:55,279
So I think with him coming back next year, hopefully

1609
01:15:55,279 --> 01:15:58,800
fully healthy, knowing that his spot is secure in the rotation,

1610
01:15:59,600 --> 01:16:05,119
I could I've seen him unleashing finally the torrent of

1611
01:16:05,119 --> 01:16:08,680
offensive efficiency that we know he can provide. I'm a

1612
01:16:08,720 --> 01:16:09,560
Nagrey guy still.

1613
01:16:10,279 --> 01:16:13,199
Speaker 2: I think I'm still on the Asar train there as

1614
01:16:13,239 --> 01:16:16,000
the second most important player for them moving forward.

1615
01:16:16,039 --> 01:16:16,760
Speaker 1: And I think if we can.

1616
01:16:16,680 --> 01:16:19,359
Speaker 2: Get to a point where we see even more lineups

1617
01:16:19,359 --> 01:16:22,000
that are built to have him playmake out of them,

1618
01:16:22,039 --> 01:16:23,520
and a lot of it's going to be in transition,

1619
01:16:23,560 --> 01:16:25,079
because yeah, I don't think you want to slow things

1620
01:16:25,119 --> 01:16:26,800
down and send him ball screens and run a ton

1621
01:16:26,800 --> 01:16:27,880
of pick and rolls necessarily.

1622
01:16:28,199 --> 01:16:29,319
Speaker 1: I won't rule it out, of course.

1623
01:16:29,359 --> 01:16:30,760
Speaker 2: I think it comes down to and it's the same

1624
01:16:30,760 --> 01:16:33,479
thing with Holland, like what is their range on offense,

1625
01:16:33,479 --> 01:16:35,800
Like does it include being able to get to mid rangers,

1626
01:16:35,800 --> 01:16:37,760
get up floaters like just looking away from the basket,

1627
01:16:37,880 --> 01:16:40,359
or will either one of them develop into a bankable

1628
01:16:40,359 --> 01:16:42,279
three point shoot. I don't know, but I think because

1629
01:16:42,279 --> 01:16:46,479
of what Asar can do defensively, it makes me really

1630
01:16:47,159 --> 01:16:51,239
excited for what he could be long term. And I'm curious,

1631
01:16:51,279 --> 01:16:53,880
if there's that word again, I wonder who they view

1632
01:16:53,880 --> 01:16:56,079
as the most like the second most important player in

1633
01:16:56,119 --> 01:16:58,399
the building. And I almost wonder if they might think

1634
01:16:58,439 --> 01:17:01,560
it's Ron Holland just because this front office drafted him.

1635
01:17:01,760 --> 01:17:04,560
Speaker 3: I don't know that I'd be worried if they said that.

1636
01:17:04,600 --> 01:17:05,439
At least it.

1637
01:17:05,439 --> 01:17:07,079
Speaker 2: Could be Malik Beasley at this point, like how we're

1638
01:17:07,119 --> 01:17:09,439
gonna keep this guy in And by the way, that's

1639
01:17:09,479 --> 01:17:09,760
the vase.

1640
01:17:09,840 --> 01:17:10,319
Speaker 1: So they didn't.

1641
01:17:10,760 --> 01:17:12,800
Speaker 2: They're not good enough or set enough to where you

1642
01:17:12,800 --> 01:17:16,039
could have said, well, we're not trading players X at

1643
01:17:16,039 --> 01:17:17,960
the at the deadline. But the fact that they kept

1644
01:17:18,039 --> 01:17:20,880
him was one predictable. I think they should have, but

1645
01:17:20,920 --> 01:17:22,319
at least me to believe, like, well, they're gonna try

1646
01:17:22,359 --> 01:17:24,279
and keep him even though they have non birs. Sure,

1647
01:17:24,920 --> 01:17:27,399
I'm saying they should, but that's another thing that's looming

1648
01:17:27,399 --> 01:17:29,760
over this is some of their most important guys when

1649
01:17:29,760 --> 01:17:31,319
it comes to creating the space that I think has

1650
01:17:31,319 --> 01:17:34,640
helped Kate a ton. Tim Hardaway Junior is a free agent. Uh,

1651
01:17:34,680 --> 01:17:37,920
Malik Beasley's going to be a free agent. So I

1652
01:17:37,960 --> 01:17:40,880
like they're They're a real delicate place. But I think

1653
01:17:40,920 --> 01:17:43,399
that you can look at this organization, at least the

1654
01:17:43,399 --> 01:17:45,159
talent there and some of the things they've done this year,

1655
01:17:45,359 --> 01:17:47,399
at least under this front office, and say, well, I

1656
01:17:47,439 --> 01:17:50,840
trust them to at least make decisions that might result in,

1657
01:17:50,920 --> 01:17:53,600
you know, a minimum of the sixtieth to seventieth percentile outcome.

1658
01:17:53,720 --> 01:17:56,039
Speaker 3: Well, at least on Tekio will not be a free agent,

1659
01:17:56,239 --> 01:17:56,880
So there we go.

1660
01:17:57,279 --> 01:17:58,760
Speaker 2: Oh, it's not a team option for him. They're not

1661
01:17:58,880 --> 01:18:02,640
just gonna decline that. So what's your vibe check on

1662
01:18:02,680 --> 01:18:03,560
the Pistons rebuilt?

1663
01:18:03,880 --> 01:18:06,520
Speaker 3: Oh that's high. I'm actually gonna steal your eight point

1664
01:18:06,640 --> 01:18:09,840
four from the Hornets and put it on Detroit.

1665
01:18:11,319 --> 01:18:12,600
Speaker 1: Do I feel better about it?

1666
01:18:12,640 --> 01:18:13,960
Speaker 2: I do feel better about I'm gonna go to eight

1667
01:18:14,000 --> 01:18:16,000
point six on Detroit.

1668
01:18:16,239 --> 01:18:18,199
Speaker 3: Oh, wow, you're so petty. You just had to top

1669
01:18:18,239 --> 01:18:20,119
me there. Okay, yeah you went, what'd you go? Eight

1670
01:18:20,119 --> 01:18:20,439
point four?

1671
01:18:20,520 --> 01:18:21,199
Speaker 1: Yeah? I'm gonna way.

1672
01:18:21,239 --> 01:18:23,079
Speaker 2: Well, I feel a little bit better than I do

1673
01:18:23,119 --> 01:18:26,960
about the Hornets, even though I might feel better inaggregate,

1674
01:18:26,960 --> 01:18:28,960
like I think the Pistons have a better collection of talent.

1675
01:18:29,000 --> 01:18:31,000
But there's a chance that Detroit, when you look at

1676
01:18:31,000 --> 01:18:33,960
their excuse me, Charlotte, when you're trying to weigh the

1677
01:18:34,039 --> 01:18:37,000
value of their two best players like LaMelo and Brandon Miller,

1678
01:18:37,039 --> 01:18:40,520
could end up exceeding the value of Caid plus whoever

1679
01:18:40,600 --> 01:18:42,319
is the second best player in Detroit.

1680
01:18:42,039 --> 01:18:44,520
Speaker 3: Right right? Yeah, I hear you, I hear you. Yeah.

1681
01:18:44,600 --> 01:18:50,399
Speaker 2: Our next team is the Toronto Raptors, Brandon Ingram's Toronto Raptors,

1682
01:18:50,439 --> 01:18:54,560
Scottie Barneses and Brandon Ingram's Toronto Raptors. This is Grant

1683
01:18:54,600 --> 01:18:56,880
and I just did a breakdown of the extension Brendan

1684
01:18:57,000 --> 01:18:57,640
Ingram's side.

1685
01:18:57,880 --> 01:18:59,800
Speaker 1: This team's direction is fascinating.

1686
01:19:00,600 --> 01:19:04,279
Speaker 3: Yes, yes it is. I wrote about them over at

1687
01:19:04,359 --> 01:19:08,119
Yahoo too, and I'm like, I'm not smart on this

1688
01:19:08,159 --> 01:19:09,920
team at this point, I have no idea what the

1689
01:19:09,960 --> 01:19:14,439
direction is. I think the extension was aggressive. It was

1690
01:19:14,600 --> 01:19:19,399
very aggressive Raptures fans surprisingly to me, at least, we're like,

1691
01:19:19,520 --> 01:19:22,840
oh yeah, the Slabs. I'm like, really like, you're okay

1692
01:19:22,880 --> 01:19:27,239
with that? This was a guy who the Pelicans had

1693
01:19:27,279 --> 01:19:31,359
a tough time fighting a trade partner for so for

1694
01:19:31,399 --> 01:19:33,479
the Raptures to take him and extend him to this

1695
01:19:33,560 --> 01:19:38,119
extent is interesting, to say the least. I thought they

1696
01:19:38,159 --> 01:19:40,600
could have gone into this offseason and just kind of

1697
01:19:40,640 --> 01:19:43,560
like played it out to see first, like, are you

1698
01:19:43,640 --> 01:19:46,479
even a good fit for us? Because, as I think

1699
01:19:46,520 --> 01:19:50,239
we both agree Ingram can be a little bit too

1700
01:19:50,760 --> 01:19:54,000
trigger happy on the pull up twos, and while he's

1701
01:19:54,079 --> 01:19:56,800
up to three point rate this year, it's still a

1702
01:19:56,800 --> 01:19:58,920
lot of twos. It's still a lot of mid range

1703
01:20:01,239 --> 01:20:03,479
area spend time spend in the mid range area, I

1704
01:20:03,520 --> 01:20:06,079
should say, And I don't think you get full bang

1705
01:20:06,159 --> 01:20:08,479
for the buck playmaking wise, despite the fact that he's

1706
01:20:08,520 --> 01:20:12,039
actually got decent breads. But my most problematic thing with

1707
01:20:12,079 --> 01:20:16,079
this Dan is he's kind of occupying the spaces where

1708
01:20:16,119 --> 01:20:19,279
both RJ. Barrett and Scottie Barnes operate. So I'm like,

1709
01:20:19,760 --> 01:20:23,359
you have three wings right now who sort of operate

1710
01:20:23,479 --> 01:20:28,399
in virtually the same areas, And what exactly are you

1711
01:20:28,880 --> 01:20:32,920
hoping to achieve from this? That's my question. I'm guessing RJ.

1712
01:20:33,000 --> 01:20:36,359
Barrett is probably gonna be traded in the summer to

1713
01:20:36,640 --> 01:20:37,840
make room for this, But.

1714
01:20:40,119 --> 01:20:43,479
Speaker 2: I so I wouldn't shock me if r J Barrett

1715
01:20:43,560 --> 01:20:46,640
is the one who gets traded. They have room to

1716
01:20:46,800 --> 01:20:49,000
like bring back Chris Bouchet and we'll see where their

1717
01:20:49,079 --> 01:20:51,159
draft pick lands and stay under the tacks after resigning

1718
01:20:51,199 --> 01:20:53,279
brandon Ingram. So it wouldn't shock me if they go

1719
01:20:53,279 --> 01:20:55,239
into the season and see how this works. Is there

1720
01:20:55,239 --> 01:20:59,239
a dynamic where it's RJ. RJ probably gets paid at

1721
01:20:59,239 --> 01:21:01,159
a clip to the salary cap of if he can

1722
01:21:01,159 --> 01:21:03,319
come off the bench and be a sixth man type guy,

1723
01:21:03,560 --> 01:21:06,119
now would he want that role? I'm optimistic to play

1724
01:21:06,119 --> 01:21:08,319
devil's advocate because I have the same questions you do.

1725
01:21:08,960 --> 01:21:12,800
But I'm optimistic to the extent of I didn't see

1726
01:21:13,039 --> 01:21:15,520
RJ playing within the flow a lot of New York's

1727
01:21:15,560 --> 01:21:16,840
offense when he was there.

1728
01:21:16,840 --> 01:21:18,840
Speaker 1: He comes to Toronto, there's more off ball movement.

1729
01:21:19,079 --> 01:21:20,640
Speaker 2: They did better jobs of getting him the ball to

1730
01:21:20,640 --> 01:21:23,000
give him ahead, or at least more a more consistent

1731
01:21:23,079 --> 01:21:25,319
job of getting him the ball in situation where he

1732
01:21:25,319 --> 01:21:27,800
could create advantages, because we saw some of that with

1733
01:21:27,920 --> 01:21:30,840
RJ in those second those vaunted second units with New

1734
01:21:30,960 --> 01:21:33,720
York a couple of years back. And can Brennan Ingram

1735
01:21:33,720 --> 01:21:36,159
benefit from the same type of usage to where it

1736
01:21:36,199 --> 01:21:40,359
feels like anecdotally, when they were trying to use him

1737
01:21:40,359 --> 01:21:42,720
away from the ball, it was just a lot of

1738
01:21:42,760 --> 01:21:46,119
stand still stuff and in Toronto it's not going to

1739
01:21:46,159 --> 01:21:48,239
be that. And he's actually always been when you dig

1740
01:21:48,279 --> 01:21:52,199
into the numbers, he's been an efficient off ball shooter.

1741
01:21:52,640 --> 01:21:55,439
He just doesn't take them usually in enough volume. Maybe

1742
01:21:55,479 --> 01:21:57,640
this year and like a year like three, or maybe

1743
01:21:57,640 --> 01:21:59,359
when he first came to New Orleans whatever year that

1744
01:21:59,520 --> 01:22:01,880
was might have been the exceptions. And so I think

1745
01:22:01,920 --> 01:22:03,840
maybe that and they look at that and say, we

1746
01:22:03,920 --> 01:22:05,399
have a bunch of these like sized guys.

1747
01:22:05,399 --> 01:22:06,359
Speaker 1: Emmanuel Quickly.

1748
01:22:06,640 --> 01:22:08,760
Speaker 2: He's been up and down since he came and not

1749
01:22:08,880 --> 01:22:11,399
healthy of course, but that's someone who could play off

1750
01:22:11,399 --> 01:22:13,920
the ball really well. And to me, it feels like

1751
01:22:13,960 --> 01:22:17,039
trying to create as many different options as possible so

1752
01:22:17,079 --> 01:22:20,720
that Scottie Barnes is able to sort of one shape

1753
01:22:20,720 --> 01:22:24,000
shift his role but to make things easier on him.

1754
01:22:24,520 --> 01:22:27,239
But I don't think this isn't the surest way to

1755
01:22:27,319 --> 01:22:28,079
do that though.

1756
01:22:28,399 --> 01:22:29,600
Speaker 1: Definitely what I agree.

1757
01:22:29,359 --> 01:22:34,680
Speaker 3: With I hear you on the off ball opportunities. That said,

1758
01:22:35,159 --> 01:22:38,840
we've also seen reported. I think about a year ago

1759
01:22:39,600 --> 01:22:43,279
that the Pelicans have really tried for Ingram to embrace

1760
01:22:43,319 --> 01:22:45,720
that role a little bit more, like try to like

1761
01:22:45,920 --> 01:22:50,239
encourage more Pig and pops more, you know, running towards

1762
01:22:50,600 --> 01:22:53,439
a certain spot on the outside, like just basically getting

1763
01:22:53,520 --> 01:22:56,319
him more involved as an off ball shooter where he's

1764
01:22:56,399 --> 01:22:59,439
just kind of been no man, like I want to

1765
01:22:59,439 --> 01:23:02,279
be on the ball. So it also comes down to

1766
01:23:03,279 --> 01:23:06,119
him like that, that's just the think of it, Like

1767
01:23:06,199 --> 01:23:09,560
he has to also embrace Yeah, I'm coming into a

1768
01:23:09,600 --> 01:23:12,760
new situation. I have to adapt to the players around

1769
01:23:12,760 --> 01:23:15,159
me as well. I'm not coming in to be, you know,

1770
01:23:15,439 --> 01:23:18,199
the main guy. I Am not the main attraction here.

1771
01:23:19,279 --> 01:23:21,840
If he comes in with that mindset and he's like no, no, no,

1772
01:23:21,840 --> 01:23:24,760
I'm gonna take over possessions again and you're still gonna

1773
01:23:24,760 --> 01:23:26,840
see that pattern of him not taking a lot of

1774
01:23:26,840 --> 01:23:31,880
shots softball, then it's gonna be really ugly really quickly.

1775
01:23:32,800 --> 01:23:36,479
I'm gonna be positive about it and say I hope

1776
01:23:36,479 --> 01:23:38,720
for the best here. I hope that Ingram like just

1777
01:23:38,760 --> 01:23:41,319
the change of scenery is what did it is, that

1778
01:23:41,319 --> 01:23:44,359
that's what he opens up for. But I still need

1779
01:23:44,399 --> 01:23:46,159
to see it before I'm like fully.

1780
01:23:45,800 --> 01:23:47,119
Speaker 1: In I think that's fair.

1781
01:23:47,159 --> 01:23:49,840
Speaker 2: I would just be surprised if I think you mentioned

1782
01:23:49,880 --> 01:23:51,880
the change of scenery is important. And these are definitely

1783
01:23:51,920 --> 01:23:54,800
discussions that happened already, And there's probably even a mutual

1784
01:23:54,840 --> 01:23:56,840
agreement where even if brent Ingram might view this as

1785
01:23:56,840 --> 01:23:58,680
sort of a stop gap in his career, where it's

1786
01:23:59,000 --> 01:24:01,880
you come here, you look more scalable and plug and play,

1787
01:24:02,079 --> 01:24:03,840
and it either ups your value in time for us

1788
01:24:03,880 --> 01:24:05,520
to pay you in two more years when you have

1789
01:24:05,560 --> 01:24:07,840
the player option, or if you want to go somewhere else,

1790
01:24:07,880 --> 01:24:09,359
they'll be a market for you.

1791
01:24:09,840 --> 01:24:12,039
Speaker 1: So I don't want to say I expect it to work.

1792
01:24:12,119 --> 01:24:16,640
Speaker 2: I expect brandon Ingram to look and play differently, willingly

1793
01:24:16,960 --> 01:24:20,000
relative to what he was in New Orleans. The thing

1794
01:24:20,000 --> 01:24:23,399
that I get stuck on here with Toronto, I don't

1795
01:24:23,439 --> 01:24:26,800
even know what the what the upside then becomes for

1796
01:24:26,880 --> 01:24:29,199
this group if everything sort of pans out when you

1797
01:24:29,199 --> 01:24:32,039
look at all the talent in place, I like, I

1798
01:24:32,079 --> 01:24:34,800
don't know, is this the the core that's there plus

1799
01:24:34,840 --> 01:24:38,640
your twenty twenty five draft pick, is that enough to

1800
01:24:38,800 --> 01:24:40,800
like blossom into a contender?

1801
01:24:40,920 --> 01:24:41,600
Speaker 1: I just don't.

1802
01:24:42,000 --> 01:24:45,479
Speaker 2: I still view Scottie Barnes as someone who can be like,

1803
01:24:45,520 --> 01:24:47,960
this isn't all NBA type player to me at his peak,

1804
01:24:48,000 --> 01:24:50,640
I still view him as that. I don't view anybody

1805
01:24:50,720 --> 01:24:53,880
else on the rosters anywhere near that brand Ingram is

1806
01:24:53,960 --> 01:24:56,239
probably to me still a fringele if he comes in

1807
01:24:56,600 --> 01:24:59,720
and he becomes like three indeed plus playmaking and like

1808
01:24:59,760 --> 01:25:01,359
the he really holds his up his end of the

1809
01:25:01,359 --> 01:25:03,119
bargain on defense, Yes, he can make an All Star

1810
01:25:03,159 --> 01:25:05,640
game in Eastern Conference, but I think Scottie Barnes is

1811
01:25:05,720 --> 01:25:08,800
very clearly the only all NBA type talent on this team,

1812
01:25:09,199 --> 01:25:12,479
and so I don't really know what the upside is there,

1813
01:25:12,479 --> 01:25:14,640
and that might be a lack of foresight.

1814
01:25:14,680 --> 01:25:16,920
Speaker 1: I'm not, like, maybe I'm not imaginative enough.

1815
01:25:17,359 --> 01:25:18,960
Speaker 2: But the other thing that sort of puzzles me too

1816
01:25:19,039 --> 01:25:23,199
is like they've chosen to like they're not cheap relative

1817
01:25:23,239 --> 01:25:25,800
to a team that you would consider rebuilding. And I

1818
01:25:25,800 --> 01:25:29,439
would argue that if they're still in this exercise this

1819
01:25:29,520 --> 01:25:32,600
time next year, something's gone wrong, because it seems.

1820
01:25:32,359 --> 01:25:33,079
Speaker 1: Like they verrely.

1821
01:25:33,520 --> 01:25:35,920
Speaker 2: They clearly view this as sort of a short term

1822
01:25:36,000 --> 01:25:38,640
layover in Okay, next year, we're gonna resume trying to

1823
01:25:38,640 --> 01:25:39,720
be competitive in the East.

1824
01:25:40,159 --> 01:25:42,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, I mean in to their credit here or

1825
01:25:42,840 --> 01:25:47,439
not credit, but like to their defense. The injuries were

1826
01:25:48,119 --> 01:25:52,439
extremely devastating to start the year. Like I mean, it

1827
01:25:52,600 --> 01:25:55,640
was the one guy, second guy, third guy, and everyone

1828
01:25:55,800 --> 01:25:58,199
kind of rotated in between each other with the injuries.

1829
01:25:58,279 --> 01:26:02,199
And now it did help some silver linings. Grady Dick

1830
01:26:02,239 --> 01:26:05,239
for example, in Yaka Peartle, both of whom with you know,

1831
01:26:05,319 --> 01:26:09,239
increased responsibilities, really rose up to the challenge. And we

1832
01:26:09,279 --> 01:26:13,399
saw that Grady dig was far more well around it

1833
01:26:13,479 --> 01:26:16,159
in year two than he wasn't year one. I certainly

1834
01:26:16,239 --> 01:26:18,600
didn't expect him to. Now he's dropped back down to

1835
01:26:18,640 --> 01:26:20,199
like fifteen points a game, but there was a time

1836
01:26:20,199 --> 01:26:24,520
he was averaging like eighteen something along those lines. Even

1837
01:26:24,600 --> 01:26:27,239
Yaka Parle was at like sixteen and eleven or something

1838
01:26:27,239 --> 01:26:31,079
along those lines. I mean, we saw them, you know,

1839
01:26:31,800 --> 01:26:36,079
feature more and was able to respond to the increased pressure.

1840
01:26:36,760 --> 01:26:41,560
That's a good sign. So when everyone's finally back healthy fully,

1841
01:26:41,680 --> 01:26:44,560
which most are right now, but like again the second half,

1842
01:26:44,560 --> 01:26:48,319
it's beginning to get laid into the season. They're seventeen

1843
01:26:48,399 --> 01:26:51,720
and thirty eight, so like the mojo probably isn't there

1844
01:26:51,760 --> 01:26:55,920
either I would imagine coming into next year, full training camp,

1845
01:26:55,960 --> 01:27:00,119
full off season again crossing everything I got that they're healthy,

1846
01:27:00,600 --> 01:27:04,880
that they will have a much much better start than

1847
01:27:04,920 --> 01:27:06,640
this year because.

1848
01:27:08,000 --> 01:27:09,680
Speaker 2: And you know, because we kind of been talked about,

1849
01:27:09,720 --> 01:27:12,680
like they do have just some intriguing surrounding players where

1850
01:27:12,840 --> 01:27:15,520
Grady Dick is one, and I would say him in

1851
01:27:15,560 --> 01:27:17,800
the aftermath of this trade, I would argue that him

1852
01:27:17,840 --> 01:27:20,760
and ochaiak Boji become more important to this team because

1853
01:27:20,800 --> 01:27:23,399
of how complimentary they can be on offense. And ak

1854
01:27:23,439 --> 01:27:25,720
Bogie of course, like I think he'd be integral to

1855
01:27:25,840 --> 01:27:28,039
kind of tying the perimeter defense all together, because it

1856
01:27:28,079 --> 01:27:30,760
makes the job of Ingram Scottie Barnes. He may be

1857
01:27:30,800 --> 01:27:33,520
a manual quickly a little bit easier. They can throw

1858
01:27:33,560 --> 01:27:36,199
out some really cool lineups if they keep Chris Bouchet around.

1859
01:27:36,439 --> 01:27:38,720
Jamal Shd has shown some stuff this year when he

1860
01:27:38,880 --> 01:27:42,279
is I'm not gonna predict this, but when he is

1861
01:27:42,359 --> 01:27:45,479
hitting his catch and shoot threes, it's just he's shooting

1862
01:27:45,479 --> 01:27:47,359
thirty eight point five percent on two and a half

1863
01:27:47,359 --> 01:27:49,640
attempts per game since January first from beyond the arc.

1864
01:27:50,000 --> 01:27:53,520
What he does defensively is undeniable and so like that

1865
01:27:53,560 --> 01:27:56,439
could be huge for them. Jacoby Walter, I don't know

1866
01:27:56,439 --> 01:27:59,199
if I like yet. Like I've seen some offensive dynamism there.

1867
01:27:59,239 --> 01:28:00,600
I've even seen some on defense.

1868
01:28:00,640 --> 01:28:01,279
Speaker 1: I just don't know.

1869
01:28:01,520 --> 01:28:03,199
Speaker 2: He's another one where I don't have a great feel

1870
01:28:03,239 --> 01:28:05,600
for what his fit would be on a good team.

1871
01:28:05,880 --> 01:28:08,720
But they have a lot of guys here, And I

1872
01:28:09,039 --> 01:28:10,800
don't know if you've thought about this at all. I've

1873
01:28:10,800 --> 01:28:13,760
almost kind of wondered everyone's kind of focusing on what

1874
01:28:13,800 --> 01:28:15,560
does this mean with Ingram coming? What does it mean

1875
01:28:15,600 --> 01:28:19,119
for Barrett or quickly even Grady Dick. I almost wonder,

1876
01:28:19,479 --> 01:28:22,600
do you think it needs to change the direction of

1877
01:28:22,600 --> 01:28:25,720
how they're going at the center position right now? Like

1878
01:28:25,800 --> 01:28:28,920
is yakab Peartle, Because when you're looking at what Yaka

1879
01:28:29,000 --> 01:28:32,319
Peartl does best at both ends of the floor, is

1880
01:28:32,359 --> 01:28:35,600
he with Ingram now here? And like, do you see this?

1881
01:28:35,720 --> 01:28:37,439
I mentioned this to Grant already, so people listen to

1882
01:28:37,479 --> 01:28:39,960
that episode. I apologize for repeating myself. Couldn't you see

1883
01:28:39,960 --> 01:28:42,640
a scenario this becomes almost an an RJ. Barrett or

1884
01:28:42,720 --> 01:28:44,960
Yakub Peartle proposition.

1885
01:28:46,640 --> 01:28:49,680
Speaker 3: In terms of like relinquishing one of them.

1886
01:28:50,119 --> 01:28:52,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, just like, because if you're trying to view this

1887
01:28:52,479 --> 01:28:56,520
team through its long term fit together, right, I don't know,

1888
01:28:56,560 --> 01:29:00,239
Like I'm I'm struggling to see because it hasn't happened.

1889
01:29:00,279 --> 01:29:02,039
Speaker 1: Let's make it clear, like I need to see it

1890
01:29:02,039 --> 01:29:02,439
to believe it.

1891
01:29:02,479 --> 01:29:04,960
Speaker 2: I guess I just don't know if both of those

1892
01:29:05,000 --> 01:29:07,840
guys on top of Ingram, on top of Scott.

1893
01:29:07,920 --> 01:29:09,840
Speaker 3: Okay, I got you, I got you. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1894
01:29:09,840 --> 01:29:11,359
But but then I don't think it's going to be

1895
01:29:11,520 --> 01:29:15,000
a a Pearl or Barrett situation. It's gonna be just

1896
01:29:15,039 --> 01:29:15,880
a Barret situation.

1897
01:29:16,039 --> 01:29:19,319
Speaker 2: Because so you need a different type of five with

1898
01:29:19,399 --> 01:29:22,039
the type of perimeter set up that they're sure, but.

1899
01:29:22,039 --> 01:29:23,720
Speaker 3: I don't think they can get one. That's the thing,

1900
01:29:23,760 --> 01:29:28,039
because the type of five they need here is someone

1901
01:29:28,039 --> 01:29:31,279
who can space the floor, someone like they need rayfle Friends.

1902
01:29:31,720 --> 01:29:36,720
That guy is not around, and I'm not sold on

1903
01:29:36,760 --> 01:29:41,560
that one. I'm not. I'm just not. I understand you

1904
01:29:41,600 --> 01:29:46,279
want more movement from your five. I definitely do. Those

1905
01:29:46,319 --> 01:29:49,319
guys are just not widely available, Like can they get

1906
01:29:49,399 --> 01:29:52,640
Killo where like if they can sign me the fuck up?

1907
01:29:52,640 --> 01:29:55,319
But like is he available? I don't think so.

1908
01:29:56,399 --> 01:29:58,960
Speaker 1: No, But it's I'm not so like, yeah, they need

1909
01:29:58,960 --> 01:29:59,920
almost that. It would have to be.

1910
01:30:00,239 --> 01:30:02,079
Speaker 2: These are sort of different types, but like if it

1911
01:30:02,119 --> 01:30:04,720
was Santi al Dama or Miles Turner like Christops, but

1912
01:30:04,800 --> 01:30:06,600
they need that type of big rot.

1913
01:30:06,720 --> 01:30:08,239
Speaker 1: To me, that's how I look at it.

1914
01:30:08,279 --> 01:30:09,880
Speaker 2: Someone who gives you some stretch and is going to

1915
01:30:09,920 --> 01:30:14,039
be a stronger rim protector than Yaka Pearl. And I

1916
01:30:14,119 --> 01:30:16,199
almost feel like if I was running the team, that

1917
01:30:16,319 --> 01:30:18,479
might be something I try and harp on, Which is

1918
01:30:18,479 --> 01:30:20,600
not to say I think Yaka Pearl's actually been a

1919
01:30:20,680 --> 01:30:23,319
much better fit, especially on offense, than I had expected

1920
01:30:23,560 --> 01:30:26,800
when they made that initial trade for him. But I'm wondering,

1921
01:30:26,800 --> 01:30:30,039
in the aftermath of this trade, if, when everyone's healthy,

1922
01:30:30,399 --> 01:30:32,600
if that fit is going to be exhausted. And I

1923
01:30:32,600 --> 01:30:35,239
think I've settled on yes, but I'm open to being

1924
01:30:35,239 --> 01:30:37,039
wrong just because we were not going to see it

1925
01:30:37,079 --> 01:30:37,439
this year.

1926
01:30:37,880 --> 01:30:40,600
Speaker 3: I mean, you might be right, but even if you

1927
01:30:40,680 --> 01:30:43,680
are right, what I'm thinking about is can they even

1928
01:30:43,760 --> 01:30:46,359
upgrade that position? That's what I'm wondering.

1929
01:30:46,680 --> 01:30:47,600
Speaker 1: Why why couldn't they?

1930
01:30:47,600 --> 01:30:49,560
Speaker 2: I guess are you saying it's they don't have the

1931
01:30:49,640 --> 01:30:52,279
assets or that player type is just too hard to.

1932
01:30:52,239 --> 01:30:54,039
Speaker 3: Get yeah, number two.

1933
01:30:54,319 --> 01:31:00,279
Speaker 2: Okay, I think that's fair because I basically named every

1934
01:31:00,279 --> 01:31:00,840
that would fit that.

1935
01:31:00,960 --> 01:31:03,439
Speaker 1: I mean, there's Brook Lopez a free agent.

1936
01:31:03,479 --> 01:31:06,880
Speaker 3: This year, all right, and so when he turns into

1937
01:31:06,960 --> 01:31:11,319
dust by approximately Christmas next year, well so.

1938
01:31:11,239 --> 01:31:13,199
Speaker 2: Then I will counter with this then though, And it's

1939
01:31:13,239 --> 01:31:16,520
kind of a similar different different structures of the roster,

1940
01:31:16,600 --> 01:31:18,680
but it's kind of a similar thing to with New Orleans.

1941
01:31:18,760 --> 01:31:21,079
Some of our biggest criticism not that you need the

1942
01:31:21,119 --> 01:31:23,840
floor space or next to z Ion specifically. Then get

1943
01:31:23,880 --> 01:31:26,840
someone who's just a caps lock ring protector and gives

1944
01:31:26,840 --> 01:31:29,279
you vertical gravity, which is why Jared Allen was such

1945
01:31:29,319 --> 01:31:31,960
a popular name there. It almost feels like that would

1946
01:31:32,000 --> 01:31:34,159
be the other direction that would make more sense for Toronto.

1947
01:31:34,560 --> 01:31:37,239
Speaker 3: Are you trying to ship Mitchell Robinson into Toronto?

1948
01:31:38,479 --> 01:31:41,000
Speaker 2: I think that no, they need someone who's healthier and

1949
01:31:41,039 --> 01:31:43,000
he just can't catch the ball on off right.

1950
01:31:43,039 --> 01:31:46,399
Speaker 3: Okay, But the theory of Mitchell Robinson.

1951
01:31:46,399 --> 01:31:49,000
Speaker 2: Well, I'll say the theory of Robert Williams, the third

1952
01:31:49,119 --> 01:31:49,680
who might.

1953
01:31:49,600 --> 01:31:52,880
Speaker 3: Oh oh, oh, okay, oh I like that actually because

1954
01:31:52,920 --> 01:31:54,680
then he can also play Mago a little bit, so

1955
01:31:54,720 --> 01:32:00,560
he can mimic Yaka Purdles playmaking in some capacity. Okay,

1956
01:32:01,159 --> 01:32:04,279
I hear you. I still like the fact that JACKA.

1957
01:32:04,279 --> 01:32:08,039
Peartl is like legit seven to one though, like Robert

1958
01:32:08,079 --> 01:32:11,960
Williams six ' nine, six ' ten, Like I hear you,

1959
01:32:12,520 --> 01:32:14,640
but he does have to overcome a little bit like

1960
01:32:14,720 --> 01:32:19,439
Yaka Purtl is just an enormous human being and sometimes.

1961
01:32:19,279 --> 01:32:21,199
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I mean they're already this year they're what

1962
01:32:21,279 --> 01:32:24,000
are they bottom five in defensive rebounding. So that's not

1963
01:32:24,680 --> 01:32:27,119
especially because Robert Williams another health risk. I was more

1964
01:32:27,159 --> 01:32:29,520
so as in, is there a bigger guy then that

1965
01:32:29,640 --> 01:32:32,079
sort of fits that khalel Ware, Yes, but that's not

1966
01:32:32,159 --> 01:32:35,680
he's he aren't trading him, right, I.

1967
01:32:35,640 --> 01:32:40,159
Speaker 3: Mean they might look the MAVs traded Luka Doncic. Everything

1968
01:32:40,239 --> 01:32:42,680
is open. I'm just I'm not gonna sit here and

1969
01:32:42,680 --> 01:32:45,560
say that the Heat are not gonna trade Gilaware. Maybe

1970
01:32:45,560 --> 01:32:47,880
maybe they can't, which maybe maybe I was being just

1971
01:32:47,880 --> 01:32:48,359
a little bit.

1972
01:32:48,600 --> 01:32:51,520
Speaker 1: If I'm five first round pick for Walker Kessler for this.

1973
01:32:51,520 --> 01:32:57,319
Speaker 3: Team, Oh, I think that's a little spicy, adds some

1974
01:32:57,399 --> 01:33:01,399
protection on it rolling over to next year. Maybe that's

1975
01:33:01,439 --> 01:33:03,560
a good name though, like that.

1976
01:33:03,800 --> 01:33:05,520
Speaker 1: He's conventionally huge, yeah.

1977
01:33:05,560 --> 01:33:09,479
Speaker 3: He oh, big time. Big time will fit the timeline

1978
01:33:09,479 --> 01:33:14,439
a lot more. Yeah, I don't hate that whatsoever. The

1979
01:33:14,800 --> 01:33:18,600
question is like for that pick, like right now.

1980
01:33:18,840 --> 01:33:20,840
Speaker 1: You have to pay him soon too, which is all

1981
01:33:21,000 --> 01:33:21,640
have to pay.

1982
01:33:21,520 --> 01:33:22,960
Speaker 3: Him, and now you have to give up like the

1983
01:33:23,039 --> 01:33:26,640
number five pick currently projected at least.

1984
01:33:27,079 --> 01:33:31,319
Speaker 2: What about about Jay Huff. He's not a free agent,

1985
01:33:31,399 --> 01:33:32,600
but he's on under contract.

1986
01:33:32,600 --> 01:33:34,439
Speaker 1: He's cheap. I don't know what Memphis we want for him.

1987
01:33:34,680 --> 01:33:37,920
Speaker 3: No, I have no idea either. He'd be fun because

1988
01:33:37,920 --> 01:33:39,039
he even space is the floor.

1989
01:33:39,840 --> 01:33:41,760
Speaker 1: Yeah he does. I mean we've never seen it in

1990
01:33:41,800 --> 01:33:43,560
like real volume though, right.

1991
01:33:43,359 --> 01:33:46,680
Speaker 3: We well, no, no, that's true, but we like to

1992
01:33:46,720 --> 01:33:48,359
think so because we like Jay Huff.

1993
01:33:50,279 --> 01:33:52,560
Speaker 2: Nick Clapton will be another interesting name. But to get

1994
01:33:52,600 --> 01:33:54,560
to the money, you would have to trade Pertle for him,

1995
01:33:54,600 --> 01:33:56,079
So there's probably a risk there.

1996
01:33:57,000 --> 01:34:00,319
Speaker 3: I mean, look, Peartle deserves to play somewhere. It's not

1997
01:34:00,319 --> 01:34:02,399
in Toronto, so I could see why he would not

1998
01:34:02,560 --> 01:34:05,880
necessarily be fully satisfied with a Bentrol.

1999
01:34:06,479 --> 01:34:09,239
Speaker 1: I honestly forget about trades.

2000
01:34:09,279 --> 01:34:12,239
Speaker 2: If they used like an exception this year to sign

2001
01:34:12,279 --> 01:34:14,039
clean Capella, I don't know what his market is. And

2002
01:34:14,079 --> 01:34:17,399
so then you have the just to have that he's older,

2003
01:34:17,720 --> 01:34:19,199
he's not what he was, but like, yeah, I have

2004
01:34:19,239 --> 01:34:21,720
that dynamic on the roster to see what it might

2005
01:34:21,760 --> 01:34:24,479
look like if you invested more in it like that,

2006
01:34:24,560 --> 01:34:27,039
and then you still have peerdle presumably if you're signing, Yeah.

2007
01:34:26,840 --> 01:34:29,079
Speaker 3: If you still have purdle, I'll do it. Because I

2008
01:34:29,239 --> 01:34:33,359
just saw my my facial expression.

2009
01:34:32,920 --> 01:34:36,960
Speaker 2: Just get I wouldn't even view I mean, maybe I

2010
01:34:36,960 --> 01:34:39,199
would view Nick Claxton as like the finishing piece here,

2011
01:34:39,239 --> 01:34:40,560
but like a lot of the names we've thrown out,

2012
01:34:40,560 --> 01:34:42,640
like Robert will if you went with Robert Williams, Mitchell

2013
01:34:42,680 --> 01:34:45,279
Robinson or Mark even Mark Williams could offensively would be

2014
01:34:45,279 --> 01:34:48,800
interesting for this team, but those are all stabs in

2015
01:34:48,800 --> 01:34:51,239
the dark because their health like those are not.

2016
01:34:51,439 --> 01:34:53,119
Speaker 1: Oh, we've got our big man in the future.

2017
01:34:53,439 --> 01:34:56,399
Speaker 3: So basically we're still calling Miami about killll.

2018
01:34:56,159 --> 01:34:58,520
Speaker 2: Werris what you're saying and what is Miami telling you

2019
01:34:58,520 --> 01:34:59,199
to go fuck off?

2020
01:34:59,199 --> 01:35:02,479
Speaker 3: It that we just we just tell them, we tell

2021
01:35:02,520 --> 01:35:05,000
them we'll finally acquire dame for you.

2022
01:35:07,319 --> 01:35:09,880
Speaker 2: But I guess my point was, and it's fine if

2023
01:35:09,880 --> 01:35:11,880
you disagree, Like you don't think that there needs to

2024
01:35:11,880 --> 01:35:13,960
be any sort of change up now I'm not even

2025
01:35:13,960 --> 01:35:15,880
saying get rid of Perle, but a different type of

2026
01:35:15,920 --> 01:35:17,039
five on.

2027
01:35:16,960 --> 01:35:18,880
Speaker 3: This I wouldn't mind place on the RJ.

2028
01:35:19,000 --> 01:35:20,520
Speaker 1: Barrett type of at all.

2029
01:35:20,760 --> 01:35:22,960
Speaker 3: No, I hear you, I wouldn't mind. But again, it

2030
01:35:23,039 --> 01:35:24,840
has to be under the right for the right price,

2031
01:35:24,880 --> 01:35:27,600
in the right circumstances. Like is Chris Bruschet like you

2032
01:35:27,840 --> 01:35:31,640
brought him up yourself. He's sort of that guy a

2033
01:35:31,680 --> 01:35:36,399
little bit, but he's he's not huge, He's not and.

2034
01:35:36,319 --> 01:35:39,399
Speaker 2: He is still shooting like nine from three over the

2035
01:35:39,439 --> 01:35:40,199
past couple of months.

2036
01:35:40,239 --> 01:35:43,520
Speaker 3: Though, yeah, perhaps they got enough.

2037
01:35:43,640 --> 01:35:48,560
Speaker 2: No, well, well I do think this is I said

2038
01:35:48,560 --> 01:35:50,279
this in our trade deadline right wait, I'm.

2039
01:35:50,119 --> 01:35:52,159
Speaker 3: Sorry to interrupt you, but they can fix this problem,

2040
01:35:52,239 --> 01:35:56,520
by the way, during the draft, well they could malo.

2041
01:35:56,760 --> 01:35:59,560
Speaker 2: Right about I know enough about like the top two

2042
01:35:59,560 --> 01:36:01,079
prospects and that's all I got. They could fix all

2043
01:36:01,039 --> 01:36:03,079
the flag Maybe just play without a center? Would that

2044
01:36:03,119 --> 01:36:03,880
work for just.

2045
01:36:04,600 --> 01:36:09,199
Speaker 3: Cooper Flag's teammate? Come on, Malouk seven two two fifty

2046
01:36:10,000 --> 01:36:14,239
is anchoring Duke's defense this year? Like he is that

2047
01:36:14,319 --> 01:36:16,199
type of guy you're actually talking about.

2048
01:36:16,359 --> 01:36:18,520
Speaker 2: Do you think John he's again not How tall is

2049
01:36:18,560 --> 01:36:20,640
Jonathan Mobo like he's had some nice moments for them.

2050
01:36:20,640 --> 01:36:21,319
Speaker 1: I don't view him I.

2051
01:36:21,319 --> 01:36:23,439
Speaker 3: Want to say six ' ten or something. Let me

2052
01:36:23,560 --> 01:36:24,119
just check.

2053
01:36:24,479 --> 01:36:27,119
Speaker 2: I do think to people joke about my love for

2054
01:36:27,199 --> 01:36:29,399
Chris Bouchet, but I really do think that once they

2055
01:36:29,720 --> 01:36:33,039
went into brandon Ingram trade talks, it became critical for

2056
01:36:33,079 --> 01:36:35,520
them to keep him over Kelly Olinik. And not just

2057
01:36:35,520 --> 01:36:37,439
because Kelly Olinick's money for next year was probably a

2058
01:36:37,479 --> 01:36:40,079
net negative, Like they kind of need in theory at

2059
01:36:40,159 --> 01:36:43,119
least what Chris Bouchet can give you given this roster.

2060
01:36:43,319 --> 01:36:45,800
Speaker 3: Now, I don't think that's wrong.

2061
01:36:46,079 --> 01:36:47,159
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's all.

2062
01:36:47,239 --> 01:36:48,960
Speaker 2: I just wanted you to say something semi nice about

2063
01:36:49,000 --> 01:36:51,000
Chris Bouchet, then we can move on. Do you have

2064
01:36:51,000 --> 01:36:52,399
anything else that you want to talk about before I

2065
01:36:52,399 --> 01:36:53,520
ask you about the vibe check?

2066
01:36:54,319 --> 01:36:58,199
Speaker 3: One small thing shouldn't take a whole lot. I think

2067
01:36:58,279 --> 01:37:03,680
people are getting a little too like critical of Emmanuel quickly,

2068
01:37:04,079 --> 01:37:06,760
Like he's just he's only played sixteen games this year,

2069
01:37:07,000 --> 01:37:09,640
He's been banged up a ton. I don't think he's

2070
01:37:09,680 --> 01:37:11,760
back to being fully healthy yet, and people were like

2071
01:37:11,840 --> 01:37:14,399
overpaid one of the worst contracts in the league, and

2072
01:37:15,439 --> 01:37:19,359
I'm just not there yet, Like maybe down the line

2073
01:37:19,479 --> 01:37:23,399
if he is like, can't prove himself to be healthy,

2074
01:37:23,680 --> 01:37:27,560
or if like an injury patent emergence like that, I

2075
01:37:27,680 --> 01:37:30,720
just I can't get there. I still really like that

2076
01:37:30,840 --> 01:37:32,079
dude at the PG.

2077
01:37:32,560 --> 01:37:35,520
Speaker 1: I would uh so, I would agree with you. I

2078
01:37:35,560 --> 01:37:38,000
don't view him. I was kind of open to it.

2079
01:37:38,479 --> 01:37:41,399
Speaker 2: I just the live dribble playmaking has never been what

2080
01:37:41,439 --> 01:37:42,720
I think it needs to be for him to be

2081
01:37:42,760 --> 01:37:44,439
a point guard. But I think now that you have

2082
01:37:44,600 --> 01:37:49,359
Ingram and Barnes and Barrett, he is so perfect, like

2083
01:37:49,560 --> 01:37:51,840
alongside to all three of them, two of them, one

2084
01:37:51,840 --> 01:37:52,039
of them.

2085
01:37:52,119 --> 01:37:55,720
Speaker 1: Whatever. I wouldn't be out on him. WHAT'SO like whatsoever? Either.

2086
01:37:56,079 --> 01:37:58,880
Speaker 2: I do worry because his defense has been weird in Toronto.

2087
01:37:59,039 --> 01:38:01,600
I've chalked it up to a lack of familiarity, not

2088
01:38:01,640 --> 01:38:03,720
being on the court a ton since the trade. But

2089
01:38:03,760 --> 01:38:06,000
the hip stuff is because the way he played defense

2090
01:38:06,039 --> 01:38:07,760
and what he did that was most valuable in New York.

2091
01:38:08,039 --> 01:38:10,079
If there's any sort of long term damage to like

2092
01:38:10,199 --> 01:38:12,640
kind of the hip mobility's ability to fight through screens

2093
01:38:12,680 --> 01:38:14,960
or disrupt away from the ball, i'd watch that, but

2094
01:38:14,960 --> 01:38:15,720
I'm with you, I can't.

2095
01:38:15,720 --> 01:38:17,319
Speaker 1: I didn't even see that talk. I feel like he's

2096
01:38:18,279 --> 01:38:18,680
I didn't.

2097
01:38:18,720 --> 01:38:20,920
Speaker 2: I have not seen any strong Emanuel Quickly takes because

2098
01:38:20,920 --> 01:38:23,479
he's been so injured. But if that's the any not

2099
01:38:23,479 --> 01:38:25,840
even the prevailing consensus, but if that's even a sentiment

2100
01:38:25,880 --> 01:38:28,520
that's out there, I would say it's at least a

2101
01:38:28,600 --> 01:38:29,279
year too early.

2102
01:38:29,680 --> 01:38:32,399
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I think so too. So I just I

2103
01:38:32,439 --> 01:38:34,680
want to give Emanual quick to at least a little

2104
01:38:34,680 --> 01:38:35,520
bit of support.

2105
01:38:36,000 --> 01:38:39,000
Speaker 2: This might be one of my most just teams to

2106
01:38:39,039 --> 01:38:40,840
watch over the next like two or three years. I

2107
01:38:40,960 --> 01:38:43,920
just don't like I'm so excited to see what it becomes.

2108
01:38:44,479 --> 01:38:46,039
Vibe check scale of one.

2109
01:38:46,000 --> 01:38:48,800
Speaker 3: Point oh because I'm so fucking confused, five point oh.

2110
01:38:49,000 --> 01:38:50,760
Middle of the pack. I have no idea.

2111
01:38:51,279 --> 01:38:53,720
Speaker 2: It's interesting because I think they are in a vacuum.

2112
01:38:53,760 --> 01:38:56,760
The most talented team we've talked about thus far. Yeah,

2113
01:38:56,800 --> 01:39:00,960
that's fair, but the direction and the fit is still

2114
01:39:01,039 --> 01:39:02,800
kind of hazy. I'm gonna go, you know what I'm

2115
01:39:02,800 --> 01:39:05,840
gonna do. I'm gonna go six ' nine six point nine.

2116
01:39:06,760 --> 01:39:10,039
We're onto the Washington Wizards. And I'd like to remind

2117
01:39:10,079 --> 01:39:12,840
everyone before we get started here that we're talking about

2118
01:39:12,880 --> 01:39:13,479
rebuilding teams.

2119
01:39:13,520 --> 01:39:15,079
Speaker 1: We're trying to cover the entire league.

2120
01:39:14,880 --> 01:39:18,159
Speaker 2: So hit that sub button if you've not already, Apple, Spotify, YouTube,

2121
01:39:18,359 --> 01:39:21,800
the NBA podcast as well. These exercises are fun, but

2122
01:39:21,800 --> 01:39:23,920
if you want to hear more about teams that most

2123
01:39:23,920 --> 01:39:26,840
people aren't talking about at the moment, subscribe to Mort

2124
01:39:27,199 --> 01:39:30,199
and Hardware Knocks mort and the NBA podcast as well

2125
01:39:30,199 --> 01:39:31,680
as hard with Knox so that we can continue to

2126
01:39:31,680 --> 01:39:35,319
pump out content like this. And with that said, the

2127
01:39:35,399 --> 01:39:37,239
Washington Wizards Mort But do we just want to give

2128
01:39:37,279 --> 01:39:39,079
them a vibe check of an eleven and move forward?

2129
01:39:40,920 --> 01:39:41,520
Speaker 3: Pretty much?

2130
01:39:41,680 --> 01:39:41,720
Speaker 2: No.

2131
01:39:41,840 --> 01:39:44,760
Speaker 3: I mean, look, this is a team that I think

2132
01:39:44,840 --> 01:39:47,600
they're doing everything they need to be doing. They're acquiring

2133
01:39:47,600 --> 01:39:50,319
additional draft picks, they have a lot of young guys

2134
01:39:50,319 --> 01:39:54,439
that are flanking them with veterans who, for the most part,

2135
01:39:54,439 --> 01:39:56,600
should be good teachers. Do I think they've gone a

2136
01:39:56,720 --> 01:39:59,760
little overboard with the amount of veterans they have currently

2137
01:39:59,800 --> 01:40:02,920
on the roster, Yes, I do, But look that's not

2138
01:40:02,960 --> 01:40:05,039
going to be a long term issue. Malcolm Broxton's going

2139
01:40:05,079 --> 01:40:07,800
to come off the books this year, so it's not

2140
01:40:07,880 --> 01:40:12,399
necessarily something that's a major problem. I just think they're

2141
01:40:12,439 --> 01:40:15,119
playing it smart. I think they're playing it the right

2142
01:40:15,199 --> 01:40:20,800
way with patience, keep justin. Champagne's kind of my point,

2143
01:40:20,920 --> 01:40:24,680
keep him around, make sure that's keep him around. He's

2144
01:40:24,720 --> 01:40:27,119
too good to just be a two way guy. Like,

2145
01:40:27,239 --> 01:40:29,159
let's let's make sure we lock his ass up.

2146
01:40:30,079 --> 01:40:33,439
Speaker 2: Yeah, I one, I agree with the Champagne people think

2147
01:40:33,439 --> 01:40:36,439
we're kidding, Like the Champennies have turned into excellent glue

2148
01:40:36,439 --> 01:40:39,760
guys and not even not even gluoy stick guys like Grant.

2149
01:40:39,760 --> 01:40:41,319
And that's like a cut below where it's like the

2150
01:40:41,319 --> 01:40:43,560
glue sticks that don't really have a strong of an adhesive.

2151
01:40:43,920 --> 01:40:49,000
So with the Wizards, it's fascinating because I think that

2152
01:40:49,560 --> 01:40:51,960
they're still so early in the process, but it feels

2153
01:40:52,000 --> 01:40:54,319
like much longer because of they kind of went through

2154
01:40:54,319 --> 01:40:58,039
their Chicago Bulls era of just like the path to nowhere,

2155
01:40:58,399 --> 01:41:00,600
and so it's almost like Portland with Day though you

2156
01:41:00,640 --> 01:41:03,399
mentioned his name before, where it feels like they're rebuild

2157
01:41:03,439 --> 01:41:06,039
to rebuild, excuse me, is older because of kind of

2158
01:41:06,079 --> 01:41:07,640
like the two or three years that they spent with

2159
01:41:07,720 --> 01:41:11,760
him where they didn't level up. Now, I guess the

2160
01:41:11,840 --> 01:41:14,640
problem with them is similar to the problem that we

2161
01:41:14,680 --> 01:41:17,800
talked about with like as the overarching problem as we

2162
01:41:17,840 --> 01:41:19,760
talked about at the top of this with Brooklyn, except

2163
01:41:19,800 --> 01:41:22,680
they have players who might identify as, oh, this is

2164
01:41:22,760 --> 01:41:25,680
our guiding light moving forward. I think it comes down to,

2165
01:41:25,800 --> 01:41:27,600
unless you want to add anyone there, it's Alex Sar

2166
01:41:27,800 --> 01:41:28,840
or Bala Kulabali.

2167
01:41:29,279 --> 01:41:31,079
Speaker 1: I don't think it's like those will be the only

2168
01:41:31,119 --> 01:41:31,800
two candidates.

2169
01:41:32,239 --> 01:41:38,119
Speaker 3: I'm yeah, Bob Carrington is doing something that I'm finding interesting,

2170
01:41:38,520 --> 01:41:42,039
but I'm not there where I'm like putting him on

2171
01:41:42,079 --> 01:41:44,680
that same level yet. But I'm also not closing that

2172
01:41:44,800 --> 01:41:45,640
door entirely.

2173
01:41:47,119 --> 01:41:48,680
Speaker 1: That's fair. I really like him.

2174
01:41:48,680 --> 01:41:50,520
Speaker 2: I think the poise he has on the ball and

2175
01:41:50,800 --> 01:41:53,520
his positional size, I think the shooting is going to

2176
01:41:53,600 --> 01:41:55,439
be fine. The lack of room pressures are concerned, But

2177
01:41:55,479 --> 01:41:57,600
if you can get to your mid range spots, if

2178
01:41:57,600 --> 01:41:59,520
you can hit threes and you could be a good passer,

2179
01:41:59,840 --> 01:42:02,439
I think he's gonna be really good. A cool BALI

2180
01:42:02,600 --> 01:42:04,439
I still don't necessarily know what's going to be the

2181
01:42:04,479 --> 01:42:08,920
best offensive wheelhouse for him. He can really finish through contact. Still,

2182
01:42:09,119 --> 01:42:11,520
they've experimented with some self creation. There's probably room for

2183
01:42:11,600 --> 01:42:12,960
him to do more of that, but he's just not

2184
01:42:13,000 --> 01:42:16,079
efficient in those situations. Big believer in what he can

2185
01:42:16,119 --> 01:42:18,680
do defensively. I think if we fast forward three to

2186
01:42:18,720 --> 01:42:21,680
four years, I would be mildly surprised if he's not

2187
01:42:21,760 --> 01:42:24,239
kind of mentioned in some just even if it's peripheral

2188
01:42:24,399 --> 01:42:27,159
all defense conversations. And I've come to.

2189
01:42:27,119 --> 01:42:28,119
Speaker 1: Really like Alex Sar.

2190
01:42:28,199 --> 01:42:31,000
Speaker 2: I wasn't big on him coming out of the draft, like,

2191
01:42:31,119 --> 01:42:33,520
has shown that he has three point touch, has shown

2192
01:42:33,520 --> 01:42:35,520
that what he can do defensively, has shown that they're

2193
01:42:35,600 --> 01:42:36,239
passing there.

2194
01:42:36,640 --> 01:42:39,000
Speaker 1: I think he's now their highest upside play.

2195
01:42:40,000 --> 01:42:41,920
Speaker 2: They don't have any definitives, of course, but I think

2196
01:42:41,920 --> 01:42:45,079
they're early on enough that it's okay. And even just

2197
01:42:45,079 --> 01:42:50,159
like getting someone I like Keishaan George still too, Yeah,

2198
01:42:50,239 --> 01:42:51,479
well go ahead, what were you gonna say?

2199
01:42:51,479 --> 01:42:53,840
Speaker 3: No, I was just gonna say I do too. But

2200
01:42:54,239 --> 01:42:56,800
it's it's and it's pretty clear that I like the

2201
01:42:56,800 --> 01:43:00,960
fact that he's accepted his role. George mean, just like

2202
01:43:01,159 --> 01:43:03,520
he knows I'm a three point gunner, and that's kind

2203
01:43:03,560 --> 01:43:05,920
of it. That was the same in college. I do

2204
01:43:06,039 --> 01:43:09,880
wonder if there's more to him, like is there is

2205
01:43:09,880 --> 01:43:12,680
the defense gonna you know, be attached to that down

2206
01:43:12,680 --> 01:43:17,319
the line like he's right now, I'm considering him primarily

2207
01:43:17,359 --> 01:43:19,640
a one trick pony, whereas I think the rest of

2208
01:43:19,680 --> 01:43:22,199
the guys that you just kind of outlined at least

2209
01:43:22,199 --> 01:43:24,600
has you know, a little bit more elements to play

2210
01:43:24,680 --> 01:43:24,960
off of.

2211
01:43:25,680 --> 01:43:27,439
Speaker 2: He you know, I said glue guy before, but he

2212
01:43:27,520 --> 01:43:30,079
kind of feels like he will be a jack of

2213
01:43:30,760 --> 01:43:33,159
fewer all trades and sort of a master of none.

2214
01:43:33,199 --> 01:43:34,000
Speaker 1: I think there's more.

2215
01:43:34,079 --> 01:43:37,199
Speaker 2: There's definitely more ball skills to him on offense, his

2216
01:43:37,319 --> 01:43:39,720
size on defense right now, size and effort I think

2217
01:43:39,720 --> 01:43:41,359
go a long way. But he's gonna probably have to

2218
01:43:41,359 --> 01:43:44,119
get smarter and more disruptive and be able to handle

2219
01:43:44,159 --> 01:43:45,880
some even tougher assignments.

2220
01:43:46,359 --> 01:43:47,760
Speaker 1: But like that's like when you when you.

2221
01:43:47,760 --> 01:43:50,000
Speaker 2: Got him, you weren't looking at Okay, we need someone

2222
01:43:50,039 --> 01:43:50,479
like that's who you.

2223
01:43:50,479 --> 01:43:53,960
Speaker 3: Can no, no, yeah, yeah yeah cool. Believe by the way,

2224
01:43:54,039 --> 01:43:56,880
is the guy before you, like because you were like

2225
01:43:57,520 --> 01:44:02,479
Kulibili and Sarr you had those two like yeah right, yeah.

2226
01:44:02,680 --> 01:44:03,560
I think it's equability.

2227
01:44:04,119 --> 01:44:06,039
Speaker 2: I do you think he has the like the I've

2228
01:44:06,079 --> 01:44:08,359
been anyone who's listener this knows that I'm a big,

2229
01:44:08,399 --> 01:44:10,680
like cool Bali guy. But do you think that he

2230
01:44:10,800 --> 01:44:15,279
has the offensive chops? To be the player around whom

2231
01:44:15,319 --> 01:44:17,159
you are structuring everything.

2232
01:44:17,600 --> 01:44:18,840
Speaker 1: No. I so.

2233
01:44:20,479 --> 01:44:22,399
Speaker 3: This is this to me reminds me a little bit

2234
01:44:22,399 --> 01:44:25,319
of a Scutty Barnes situation where he's not gonna be

2235
01:44:25,399 --> 01:44:28,800
like your primary offensive score. He's not gonna be the

2236
01:44:28,840 --> 01:44:32,840
guy who's gonna go out and get you necessarily twenty

2237
01:44:32,840 --> 01:44:35,760
five for thirty points every single game. Like that said,

2238
01:44:35,840 --> 01:44:37,960
the night is young. The guy is just twenty years old.

2239
01:44:38,000 --> 01:44:40,680
He's in his second he's in his second NBA season,

2240
01:44:40,680 --> 01:44:44,079
and I actually think offensively speaking, he's doing pretty damn well.

2241
01:44:44,319 --> 01:44:47,319
I know the efficiency is not there, but his feel

2242
01:44:47,399 --> 01:44:50,439
for the offensive game it's there. He's able to get

2243
01:44:50,479 --> 01:44:52,600
to the free pro line. He does have a touch.

2244
01:44:52,920 --> 01:44:55,520
It's just a question of reps. It's a question of

2245
01:44:55,600 --> 01:44:59,159
him just having to understand how to be more efficient.

2246
01:44:59,239 --> 01:45:01,239
I'm just you know, I have a hard time with

2247
01:45:01,279 --> 01:45:03,680
people basically saying, oh, year two, he should mean so

2248
01:45:03,760 --> 01:45:06,960
much better. He's twenty twenty year soul like, relax.

2249
01:45:08,359 --> 01:45:11,359
Speaker 2: Well, I think it's also just I don't I tend

2250
01:45:11,359 --> 01:45:13,279
to throw out efficiency for like at least the first

2251
01:45:13,319 --> 01:45:14,840
two years of the career and kind of look at

2252
01:45:14,880 --> 01:45:16,560
more of the function and there are moments when I

2253
01:45:16,600 --> 01:45:18,479
see it from him, and I don't know if it's

2254
01:45:18,479 --> 01:45:20,439
an issue of well, should they be trying him out

2255
01:45:20,439 --> 01:45:23,800
in this situation higher volume? So maybe it's not seen

2256
01:45:23,920 --> 01:45:25,920
enough of it yet, even now that we're more than

2257
01:45:25,920 --> 01:45:28,159
a year and a half into his career. I just

2258
01:45:28,520 --> 01:45:31,239
to be the guy to me, you need to either

2259
01:45:32,039 --> 01:45:34,880
like have this sort of trademark offensive skill that you

2260
01:45:34,920 --> 01:45:37,920
can spearhead it. And maybe Alex Sardisant profiles that either,

2261
01:45:37,920 --> 01:45:39,600
which is why it's sort of like between the two,

2262
01:45:39,880 --> 01:45:44,399
but he feels more anomalous offensively for his player, for

2263
01:45:44,479 --> 01:45:45,000
his position.

2264
01:45:46,520 --> 01:45:49,000
Speaker 3: It's funny, right because both of them, both of them

2265
01:45:49,039 --> 01:45:52,159
have this thing where their defense is so far ahead

2266
01:45:52,159 --> 01:45:56,479
of their offense. So we judge them currently on primarily

2267
01:45:56,520 --> 01:45:59,640
on what they do well because that's human nature. And

2268
01:45:59,760 --> 01:46:02,560
so we're looking at the defense and we're kind of going, oh, right,

2269
01:46:02,960 --> 01:46:05,279
do we need something else here? Like how are we

2270
01:46:05,600 --> 01:46:08,439
projecting the other side of the court to project or

2271
01:46:08,479 --> 01:46:12,319
to progress? So it's interesting. I think for me, we

2272
01:46:12,439 --> 01:46:14,319
just have to, like you said, give it a couple

2273
01:46:14,359 --> 01:46:18,399
of years to see how they develop offensively. I do

2274
01:46:18,479 --> 01:46:20,720
think another element to all this that we're kind of

2275
01:46:20,760 --> 01:46:24,279
forgetting is that they don't have a lot of reliable

2276
01:46:24,399 --> 01:46:28,319
offensive players around them to sort of lean on. Like

2277
01:46:28,479 --> 01:46:32,119
Jordan Poole, with all due respect to is twenty one

2278
01:46:32,159 --> 01:46:36,840
points per game, still not always the most efficient scorer

2279
01:46:37,000 --> 01:46:40,960
in the NBA. So you're looking at guys who are

2280
01:46:42,479 --> 01:46:47,239
not capable of carrying an entire offense on their shoulders

2281
01:46:47,279 --> 01:46:50,880
for long stretches. That forces Gula believe the forces are

2282
01:46:51,079 --> 01:46:54,079
forces some time. George so also and Bob Carrington into

2283
01:46:54,119 --> 01:46:56,359
situations where they're sort of forced to being a little

2284
01:46:56,359 --> 01:47:00,800
bit low volume. I would love for them to go

2285
01:47:00,840 --> 01:47:03,319
out in the draft. They have their pick right now.

2286
01:47:03,520 --> 01:47:06,399
Speaker 2: I'm not all that they technically don't, but it's protected

2287
01:47:06,520 --> 01:47:07,880
to hell them back.

2288
01:47:07,880 --> 01:47:10,640
Speaker 3: So yes, they right, Yes, so they do. Yeah, and

2289
01:47:10,680 --> 01:47:12,520
they're so bad it's not going to convey all right,

2290
01:47:12,560 --> 01:47:16,680
So they have their own pick if they if they

2291
01:47:17,079 --> 01:47:19,720
unless of course they win the lottery and it's Cooper flag.

2292
01:47:20,439 --> 01:47:24,000
If they get a chance of a guy where it

2293
01:47:24,039 --> 01:47:27,600
makes sense drafts slot wise, who's just a bucket, getther

2294
01:47:28,479 --> 01:47:30,600
go that route, because that's what you need on this team.

2295
01:47:30,640 --> 01:47:32,760
You need someone who can just fill up the damn

2296
01:47:32,840 --> 01:47:36,279
cup because that's going to elevate the play of Kulab,

2297
01:47:36,760 --> 01:47:40,239
of Sar, of Carrington, of George. That's going to give

2298
01:47:40,279 --> 01:47:43,039
them something to lean on. It's going to help turn

2299
01:47:43,159 --> 01:47:46,439
those guys into more efficient versions of themselves. So I

2300
01:47:46,439 --> 01:47:49,319
think this is a roster issue more than anything.

2301
01:47:50,439 --> 01:47:52,359
Speaker 2: And do you think that was probably the general idea

2302
01:47:52,359 --> 01:47:54,640
they were thinking when it was okay you have Jordan Poole,

2303
01:47:54,960 --> 01:47:58,399
so recently you had Kyle Kuzma and you have Malcolm Brodden.

2304
01:47:58,479 --> 01:48:00,520
It seems like they were trying to sit up that

2305
01:48:00,560 --> 01:48:03,359
type of environment for their and by the way, to

2306
01:48:03,399 --> 01:48:05,479
an extent, I think it's worked like a like with

2307
01:48:05,560 --> 01:48:07,760
Alex r specifically the strides he's made on offense. I

2308
01:48:07,760 --> 01:48:10,760
think it's helped him for sure, But I don't know

2309
01:48:10,800 --> 01:48:12,720
that they've necessarily succeeded because you even said like they

2310
01:48:12,760 --> 01:48:14,800
might have too many veterans on the roster, and I

2311
01:48:14,840 --> 01:48:16,840
think that's certainly true for when you're looking at it

2312
01:48:16,880 --> 01:48:19,600
as was it supposed to lead to X and it

2313
01:48:19,640 --> 01:48:22,560
clearly has not. But it also hasn't. It doesn't seem

2314
01:48:22,600 --> 01:48:24,840
like it's harsh the vibes the word we're using. It

2315
01:48:24,880 --> 01:48:27,560
definitely has not hurt the tank, and I think I'm

2316
01:48:27,600 --> 01:48:29,359
also you know, when we're talking about the draft and

2317
01:48:29,399 --> 01:48:31,760
don't look the lottery, they're gonna They're gonna have the

2318
01:48:31,760 --> 01:48:35,119
best lottery odds in the league. So like they'll be

2319
01:48:35,159 --> 01:48:36,880
a bottom four team. And right now I think they

2320
01:48:36,880 --> 01:48:39,319
are the worst team as we're recording this. I don't

2321
01:48:39,319 --> 01:48:41,960
even think is anyone gonna catch the Wizards. No, the

2322
01:48:42,039 --> 01:48:45,039
Jazz are three losses of the Pelicans, excuse me, are

2323
01:48:45,079 --> 01:48:47,800
three losses better than them. So the Wizards will have

2324
01:48:48,199 --> 01:48:49,920
the worst record, which is just a kin to having

2325
01:48:50,000 --> 01:48:53,640
top four lottery odds. I'm curious just like what happens

2326
01:48:53,720 --> 01:48:55,880
over the off season outside of the draft for them,

2327
01:48:55,920 --> 01:48:59,439
because you have smart you Brockeden's a free agent, you

2328
01:48:59,479 --> 01:49:01,520
still have Jorge Pool the lights like you could see

2329
01:49:01,520 --> 01:49:03,279
the light at the end of the tunnel for his contract.

2330
01:49:04,000 --> 01:49:05,960
And I'm also one of the things I look at too,

2331
01:49:06,039 --> 01:49:07,159
is like, what is Middleton going to do with.

2332
01:49:07,159 --> 01:49:07,840
Speaker 1: His player option?

2333
01:49:09,319 --> 01:49:09,840
Speaker 3: Pick it up?

2334
01:49:10,600 --> 01:49:12,119
Speaker 2: So if he picked it up, I think that's something

2335
01:49:12,119 --> 01:49:14,279
they could probably trade for like actual.

2336
01:49:13,960 --> 01:49:15,079
Speaker 1: Value if he's high.

2337
01:49:15,199 --> 01:49:16,640
Speaker 3: They wouldn't.

2338
01:49:17,640 --> 01:49:19,439
Speaker 1: You can't. You just said they have too many veterans.

2339
01:49:19,840 --> 01:49:21,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's not the guy I was referring to that's

2340
01:49:21,760 --> 01:49:27,000
a good ass veteran like Marcus Smartest available anymore, Marcus

2341
01:49:27,039 --> 01:49:27,760
Smartest cooked.

2342
01:49:28,079 --> 01:49:29,720
Speaker 2: I think you can, oh, if you're looking, if you're

2343
01:49:29,720 --> 01:49:32,520
basically an availability. You can can say similar things about

2344
01:49:32,560 --> 01:49:33,800
Chris Middleton at this stage too.

2345
01:49:33,880 --> 01:49:36,720
Speaker 3: You can say that, sure, but at least when Chris

2346
01:49:36,720 --> 01:49:39,920
Middleton's playing, he's still efficient, He's still a playmaker. His

2347
01:49:40,399 --> 01:49:46,560
game is still wrapped in high IQ place like every

2348
01:49:46,600 --> 01:49:49,800
single time he's on the floor, I would, ten times

2349
01:49:49,880 --> 01:49:52,920
out of ten, even in the current state of Chris Middleton,

2350
01:49:52,960 --> 01:49:54,359
take him over Marcus smart Oh.

2351
01:49:54,359 --> 01:49:56,159
Speaker 2: I don't that's I would have taken him over Kyle

2352
01:49:56,279 --> 01:50:01,880
Kusma to be cool, say it's interesting with him, because

2353
01:50:01,920 --> 01:50:04,439
are they gonna say? I want to know how willing

2354
01:50:04,520 --> 01:50:06,920
is he to play for them? And be where is

2355
01:50:06,960 --> 01:50:08,079
this going to be? Have to be sort of a

2356
01:50:08,079 --> 01:50:11,039
task agreement of all right, he's opted in, and you're

2357
01:50:11,039 --> 01:50:13,359
gonna come play your ass off for a half a season,

2358
01:50:13,399 --> 01:50:15,199
rebuild your value, help the guys around us, and then

2359
01:50:15,199 --> 01:50:17,680
we'll move you you a contender. That might be the

2360
01:50:17,720 --> 01:50:19,119
best course for both parties.

2361
01:50:19,399 --> 01:50:23,840
Speaker 3: Yep, And frankly, I think Chris from everything I've heard

2362
01:50:24,079 --> 01:50:26,920
from like about him, and like just when he's the

2363
01:50:26,960 --> 01:50:30,359
way he speaks, he seems to be, you know, the

2364
01:50:30,399 --> 01:50:32,319
best type of adult in the room that you can

2365
01:50:32,479 --> 01:50:33,359
you can ask for.

2366
01:50:33,600 --> 01:50:36,239
Speaker 2: Well, then they give him and Marcus smart time, basically

2367
01:50:36,279 --> 01:50:38,720
like mental health weeks to cope with the fact of

2368
01:50:38,760 --> 01:50:40,920
being traded to the Wizards. Isn't that what actually happened

2369
01:50:41,000 --> 01:50:42,399
or something like that, So maybe he's wrapped his head

2370
01:50:42,439 --> 01:50:45,359
around it and what's gonna happen moving forward.

2371
01:50:46,399 --> 01:50:48,720
Speaker 3: By the way, speaking of Sar, I want to get

2372
01:50:48,760 --> 01:50:52,359
into this because I don't want to forget it. I'm

2373
01:50:52,399 --> 01:50:57,439
a little pissed at Washington's guards throughout this course of

2374
01:50:57,760 --> 01:51:00,359
the year, even Malcolm Brockton, who I usually might opinion

2375
01:51:00,399 --> 01:51:04,079
of him is super super high, they have not been

2376
01:51:04,119 --> 01:51:08,000
good enough to give Sar the ball in advantageous positions.

2377
01:51:08,079 --> 01:51:11,119
Like Sar is actually pretty good at identifying when to

2378
01:51:11,199 --> 01:51:13,279
like dug in or when to cut to the basket,

2379
01:51:13,840 --> 01:51:17,399
especially on fast breaks, and there is a lot of

2380
01:51:17,560 --> 01:51:21,039
like guard reluctance to giving up the ball when he's

2381
01:51:21,239 --> 01:51:24,239
clearly a lob threat or when he's like in the

2382
01:51:24,319 --> 01:51:29,119
dunker spot. He's being ignored in a way that I

2383
01:51:29,159 --> 01:51:33,319
think is unreasonable, Like I'm not saying it's intentional. I

2384
01:51:33,359 --> 01:51:35,640
don't I'm not sitting here and saying, oh, Alex Saarr

2385
01:51:35,720 --> 01:51:39,279
would be like you know, AB and C. He's still

2386
01:51:39,520 --> 01:51:43,039
super inefficient, and also because he loves to take shots

2387
01:51:43,159 --> 01:51:47,000
like from the outside, perhaps too many, but there are

2388
01:51:47,760 --> 01:51:50,319
at least two or three times every single game that

2389
01:51:50,359 --> 01:51:54,079
I watched him where you're like, what are you guys doing?

2390
01:51:54,279 --> 01:51:57,800
Like if it's Bob Carrington, if it's Jordan Poole, is Brogden, whoever?

2391
01:51:58,560 --> 01:52:01,359
Who just failed to see that seven to one guy

2392
01:52:01,640 --> 01:52:05,319
standing below the rim or even jumping up over the

2393
01:52:05,399 --> 01:52:08,119
rim ready to catch a lob and they're just like, no, no,

2394
01:52:08,119 --> 01:52:12,119
I'm gonna go in for a contested layup Jesus. Like

2395
01:52:12,760 --> 01:52:15,760
that to me is kind of concerning that. We're like

2396
01:52:15,880 --> 01:52:18,159
I noticed it pretty early in the season, and like,

2397
01:52:18,199 --> 01:52:21,199
how many games have they played, like fifty four, We're

2398
01:52:21,239 --> 01:52:23,960
fifty four games into the season and we're still seeing this,

2399
01:52:24,720 --> 01:52:30,880
Like that's that's annoying, Like Brian Keith, get it together, man,

2400
01:52:31,000 --> 01:52:32,079
like tell your guards off.

2401
01:52:33,199 --> 01:52:35,199
Speaker 2: Sure do you think that any of them have the

2402
01:52:35,279 --> 01:52:38,279
talent to do like that? Like none of that of

2403
01:52:38,560 --> 01:52:41,239
any player on this roster. I would argue, no one

2404
01:52:41,359 --> 01:52:44,680
is like an above average lob pass thrower or creator.

2405
01:52:45,159 --> 01:52:47,920
Speaker 3: We're talking about short love like Dan, you could make

2406
01:52:47,960 --> 01:52:48,600
those passes.

2407
01:52:48,960 --> 01:52:54,159
Speaker 1: Whoa whow, I don't pass. I get buckets. I miss bucket.

2408
01:52:54,199 --> 01:52:57,159
Speaker 3: All right, well, Grant can make those passes. It's it's

2409
01:52:57,920 --> 01:53:01,760
these are not you know, court vision like Rashaun Rond

2410
01:53:01,840 --> 01:53:04,399
or Jason kitt type of passes that I'm seeking here.

2411
01:53:04,520 --> 01:53:09,840
I'm seeking like fairly simplistic dump offs or like Malcolm

2412
01:53:09,920 --> 01:53:13,720
Brockton being literally eight feet from the basket and just

2413
01:53:14,479 --> 01:53:17,680
not realizing Alex Sar is right there. It's just going

2414
01:53:17,680 --> 01:53:19,760
into the second half of the season, that is like

2415
01:53:19,800 --> 01:53:22,920
a major, major driver that I'm looking for, Like, I

2416
01:53:22,960 --> 01:53:26,000
hope the entire coaching staff is like on this and

2417
01:53:26,079 --> 01:53:28,840
actually kind of going into this the second half, say

2418
01:53:28,960 --> 01:53:32,119
telling their guards just look for the big feller at

2419
01:53:32,199 --> 01:53:36,720
least just recognize his pat presence because he's losing out

2420
01:53:36,800 --> 01:53:39,840
on I think a solid like two to four points

2421
01:53:39,840 --> 01:53:43,359
every single game just by being looked off. And I'm

2422
01:53:43,399 --> 01:53:45,560
at that point now where it just feels weird.

2423
01:53:46,199 --> 01:53:48,279
Speaker 2: I think the last thing at least I want to

2424
01:53:48,279 --> 01:53:51,119
talk about with regard to this team is what do

2425
01:53:51,159 --> 01:53:54,119
you make of the vision, the front office execution, or

2426
01:53:54,119 --> 01:53:56,720
what they've been doing since we've seen you know, the

2427
01:53:56,960 --> 01:53:59,520
Michael Winger era, Will Dawkins are like since their takeover.

2428
01:54:00,840 --> 01:54:02,960
Speaker 3: I mean, again, they've done it the right way.

2429
01:54:03,000 --> 01:54:06,359
Speaker 1: I think, Oh that already sawry. I didn't hear that.

2430
01:54:06,600 --> 01:54:08,640
Speaker 3: Ye, no, no, no, I mean I've just basically said

2431
01:54:08,720 --> 01:54:10,760
I started by saying that I think they've done the

2432
01:54:10,840 --> 01:54:15,640
right thing by accumulating draft picks and also pairing, you know,

2433
01:54:16,520 --> 01:54:19,840
veterans with the young guys. So so I I think

2434
01:54:19,880 --> 01:54:22,239
it's pretty solid. I mean it's not.

2435
01:54:25,880 --> 01:54:26,199
Speaker 1: Go ahead.

2436
01:54:26,239 --> 01:54:28,239
Speaker 3: No, I was just about to say it's not necessarily

2437
01:54:28,439 --> 01:54:31,800
their fault, that this might be the worst offensive roster

2438
01:54:31,960 --> 01:54:35,119
that we've seen over the past five years. Like there

2439
01:54:35,319 --> 01:54:37,000
there are a lot of kids on this team, and

2440
01:54:37,000 --> 01:54:38,920
there are a lot of veterans who are injured, like

2441
01:54:38,960 --> 01:54:41,279
it's and then you throw Jordan Poole into the mix

2442
01:54:41,399 --> 01:54:42,640
like done.

2443
01:54:42,479 --> 01:54:43,600
Speaker 1: This year for the most part.

2444
01:54:43,640 --> 01:54:45,239
Speaker 3: Though, for the most part, that's fine.

2445
01:54:47,000 --> 01:54:49,279
Speaker 2: Yes, I think the biggest compiment you could give them

2446
01:54:49,279 --> 01:54:51,920
is they haven't done. I don't know if anything they've

2447
01:54:51,960 --> 01:54:54,800
done has been like an incredible hit. I like a

2448
01:54:54,840 --> 01:54:56,279
lot of the young guys. But we kind of need

2449
01:54:56,279 --> 01:54:58,399
to let that marinate over the next few years. They

2450
01:54:58,399 --> 01:55:02,199
haven't done anything that's reversibly wrong. I think their biggest misstep,

2451
01:55:02,239 --> 01:55:05,000
which speaks to how I think coherent their vision, is

2452
01:55:05,319 --> 01:55:07,000
they held onto Kyle Kuzma too long.

2453
01:55:07,039 --> 01:55:09,119
Speaker 1: First trade value that just like all.

2454
01:55:09,079 --> 01:55:10,520
Speaker 2: Right, but they didn't try to hold on to him

2455
01:55:10,520 --> 01:55:13,079
even longer to correct that value. They ended up trading

2456
01:55:13,119 --> 01:55:15,880
for him for someone who, in Chris Middleton, might get

2457
01:55:15,880 --> 01:55:17,520
them some assets on the way out, but might be

2458
01:55:17,560 --> 01:55:20,039
a better guy to have around. I mean, you're talking

2459
01:55:20,079 --> 01:55:22,960
about getting a bucket getter. This is Chris Middleton, who's

2460
01:55:22,960 --> 01:55:25,159
a better passer than Kyle Kuzma, a better shot maker

2461
01:55:25,159 --> 01:55:27,239
than Kyle Kuzma. And someone's gonna play more within the

2462
01:55:27,239 --> 01:55:30,880
flow of an offense than even peak Kyle Kuzma. If again,

2463
01:55:31,039 --> 01:55:32,680
he's going to be with the Wizards for more than

2464
01:55:33,279 --> 01:55:34,000
a brief spell.

2465
01:55:34,359 --> 01:55:37,119
Speaker 1: So I think this this front office gets it.

2466
01:55:37,680 --> 01:55:39,319
Speaker 2: Like of the teams we've talked about in the East,

2467
01:55:39,399 --> 01:55:42,000
I think I guess Toronto's front office with Messiah is

2468
01:55:42,039 --> 01:55:46,680
taking risks, but you you understand, maybe you don't understand

2469
01:55:46,760 --> 01:55:47,359
the endgame.

2470
01:55:47,520 --> 01:55:49,079
Speaker 1: But like they're all defensible.

2471
01:55:49,479 --> 01:55:52,600
Speaker 2: Of the teams we talked about, Chicago's front office is

2472
01:55:52,640 --> 01:55:55,239
really the only one that might not understand where it's

2473
01:55:55,279 --> 01:55:58,960
headed or what it's even trying to do. Yeah, vibe

2474
01:55:59,000 --> 01:56:07,079
check on the Wizards rebuild. M eight ooh, this is

2475
01:56:07,119 --> 01:56:08,800
the first team I think that you're higher on than

2476
01:56:08,840 --> 01:56:13,079
I am. I'm gonna go I'm gonna go seven point five,

2477
01:56:13,399 --> 01:56:15,039
seven and a half there.

2478
01:56:15,720 --> 01:56:17,159
Speaker 3: Well, not too far up, that's fair.

2479
01:56:17,239 --> 01:56:20,359
Speaker 2: No, I think it's people could criticize that they haven't

2480
01:56:20,399 --> 01:56:22,560
maybe hit any home runs yet, but I think that

2481
01:56:22,600 --> 01:56:25,239
they have a bunch of guys who at minimum are

2482
01:56:25,279 --> 01:56:28,159
gonna be really good NBA players even if they haven't

2483
01:56:28,199 --> 01:56:31,119
found there. And it's okay to say maybe they don't

2484
01:56:31,119 --> 01:56:32,680
have their best player of the future on the roster,

2485
01:56:32,800 --> 01:56:35,039
you know why, they're not winning enough to be in

2486
01:56:35,039 --> 01:56:36,720
a situation where they won't still have a chance of

2487
01:56:36,800 --> 01:56:39,239
drafting that player this year being the perfect example of that.

2488
01:56:40,119 --> 01:56:44,359
Speaker 3: One final question to wrap up, like the Wizards, something

2489
01:56:44,399 --> 01:56:48,479
I just thought of right now, if like, what is

2490
01:56:49,119 --> 01:56:52,199
the draft pick that the Spurs would have to win,

2491
01:56:52,479 --> 01:56:55,000
either through their own or if the Atlanta pick goes

2492
01:56:55,000 --> 01:56:59,520
into the lottery for this the Wizards to accept like

2493
01:56:59,600 --> 01:57:04,119
a sp pick for trade, Like how high does that

2494
01:57:04,159 --> 01:57:07,560
pick need to be? Oh?

2495
01:57:07,640 --> 01:57:09,840
Speaker 1: Man, I don't know.

2496
01:57:10,039 --> 01:57:16,359
Speaker 2: I think if the Spurs get if they had in

2497
01:57:16,399 --> 01:57:19,000
this draft, if they had seven or higher, and you

2498
01:57:19,079 --> 01:57:20,840
offer it to the Wizard, you have to think about

2499
01:57:20,840 --> 01:57:23,399
that right as the Wizards.

2500
01:57:24,000 --> 01:57:27,199
Speaker 3: Yeah, I might actually be a little bit more like

2501
01:57:27,479 --> 01:57:32,720
five and higher. Like I I think really highly of globally,

2502
01:57:33,119 --> 01:57:37,239
So I'm like, I think it's really hard to like pinpoint.

2503
01:57:37,239 --> 01:57:39,079
That's why I'm asking you because I don't.

2504
01:57:38,800 --> 01:57:43,319
Speaker 2: Have like objectively bizarre if the Spurs like made the

2505
01:57:43,399 --> 01:57:45,600
dr and Vox trade but then also made and then

2506
01:57:45,680 --> 01:57:47,840
like they made that Rob Dillingham trade last year, but

2507
01:57:47,840 --> 01:57:50,520
then they turn around and they're trading for like they'd

2508
01:57:50,520 --> 01:57:52,439
be trading a pick for a prospect whose two years in,

2509
01:57:52,479 --> 01:57:54,960
but that the Spurs' order of operations at that point

2510
01:57:55,039 --> 01:57:57,000
would write I melted.

2511
01:57:57,279 --> 01:57:58,119
Speaker 1: I would not like.

2512
01:57:58,319 --> 01:58:00,359
Speaker 3: The reason I'm thinking about it is because that's the

2513
01:58:00,399 --> 01:58:02,520
team where we're going to talk about them in the

2514
01:58:02,560 --> 01:58:06,319
next pot. But like you and I have also talked

2515
01:58:06,319 --> 01:58:09,880
about before that they need probably a wing moving forward. Well,

2516
01:58:10,960 --> 01:58:13,279
what is Bilbli right there?

2517
01:58:13,359 --> 01:58:13,479
Speaker 1: Right?

2518
01:58:13,600 --> 01:58:15,760
Speaker 3: He would kind of fit into the things pretty easily.

2519
01:58:15,960 --> 01:58:19,159
Speaker 2: I would be concerned though, now you have like shooting

2520
01:58:19,199 --> 01:58:21,279
deficits at a lot of positions as of now, where

2521
01:58:21,279 --> 01:58:23,119
it's well, okay, well what is Stefan Castle?

2522
01:58:23,439 --> 01:58:27,640
Speaker 1: What is Jeff? What is Blai? There's some deficits there.

2523
01:58:27,520 --> 01:58:30,119
Speaker 3: But you still have Julian Champagne.

2524
01:58:29,960 --> 01:58:31,439
Speaker 1: And that's the all. Can you get? What it?

2525
01:58:31,840 --> 01:58:34,079
Speaker 2: What's the pick you'd be wing to give up? Or

2526
01:58:34,159 --> 01:58:36,119
as the Wizards, how high a pick do you need

2527
01:58:36,359 --> 01:58:41,279
to get justin Champagne out of Washington number two overall

2528
01:58:41,319 --> 01:58:44,239
or high.

2529
01:58:43,039 --> 01:58:44,880
Speaker 3: Flag and nothing short of flag.

2530
01:58:45,399 --> 01:58:48,039
Speaker 2: Moret you have anything else that you want to discuss

2531
01:58:48,239 --> 01:58:50,760
or do you just want to tell our fine listeners

2532
01:58:50,760 --> 01:58:52,880
and subscribers where they can find you and all the

2533
01:58:53,039 --> 01:58:56,560
fantastic work that you're also telling your subscribers this so

2534
01:58:56,680 --> 01:58:57,640
that's even just.

2535
01:58:57,800 --> 01:59:00,800
Speaker 3: Indeed, yes, So you can find my work over at

2536
01:59:00,840 --> 01:59:04,600
the NBA Podcast, where you feature quite a bunch like

2537
01:59:04,640 --> 01:59:07,760
we're doing these crossover episodes. You can also find my

2538
01:59:07,840 --> 01:59:10,760
work over at Yahoo Sports at Forbes taking a little

2539
01:59:10,760 --> 01:59:13,079
bit of a break from the SI right now, if

2540
01:59:13,079 --> 01:59:16,399
you speak Danish, you'll be able to catch me over

2541
01:59:16,479 --> 01:59:19,079
at a Busser Beater and while we're at it. While

2542
01:59:19,079 --> 01:59:23,560
we're at it, if you're interested in getting like dinner

2543
01:59:23,600 --> 01:59:26,640
boxes from HelloFresh, you can actually use the code that

2544
01:59:26,680 --> 01:59:30,119
I use on my Danish podcast that works globally. You

2545
01:59:30,239 --> 01:59:33,439
just have to go to HelloFresh dot com slash busser

2546
01:59:33,479 --> 01:59:37,039
Beater and type in the promo code busser beater in

2547
01:59:37,119 --> 01:59:40,760
one word, and that will give you a major percentage

2548
01:59:40,840 --> 01:59:42,239
of your first purchase.

2549
01:59:42,560 --> 01:59:45,640
Speaker 2: Can you get them to change it to slash OnlyFans

2550
01:59:45,800 --> 01:59:46,920
as your promo code?

2551
01:59:47,279 --> 01:59:48,920
Speaker 3: I will try.

2552
01:59:49,199 --> 01:59:51,159
Speaker 1: Now does it work? It works globally?

2553
01:59:51,199 --> 01:59:55,079
Speaker 2: Does it work intergalactically just for wembs like.

2554
01:59:55,199 --> 01:59:59,319
Speaker 3: I should hope so, because Wempy's family out there in

2555
01:59:59,359 --> 02:00:02,760
the Great Beyond will actually deserve to get like just

2556
02:00:02,920 --> 02:00:06,000
delivered a food box because I'm sure they're busy.

2557
02:00:06,720 --> 02:00:08,960
Speaker 2: And now are you ready to close? What is the

2558
02:00:09,039 --> 02:00:13,680
Danish word that I'm gonna be wording? I know soloplex

2559
02:00:14,319 --> 02:00:16,640
and nyla sucks not Oh that.

2560
02:00:16,760 --> 02:00:20,880
Speaker 3: Was really good. The first one is sola.

2561
02:00:20,199 --> 02:00:24,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, that means sunglasses right exactly. And sucks is

2562
02:00:25,279 --> 02:00:26,880
scissors or clippers.

2563
02:00:26,800 --> 02:00:32,359
Speaker 3: Nail clippers specifically nail clippers. That's like this, clippers and yes,

2564
02:00:32,520 --> 02:00:34,640
so I plant this a little bit ahead because you're

2565
02:00:34,680 --> 02:00:37,760
always wearing a cap. So let's get that one out

2566
02:00:37,760 --> 02:00:42,640
of the way. Kisk it kiss git, cask it. Kisk

2567
02:00:42,680 --> 02:00:44,079
it sounds like casket?

2568
02:00:44,159 --> 02:00:44,560
Speaker 1: Am I saying?

2569
02:00:44,560 --> 02:00:47,319
Speaker 3: It? Almost sounds like casket? Kiss it? And that's it's

2570
02:00:47,399 --> 02:00:48,920
the e sound at the end. You have to put

2571
02:00:48,960 --> 02:00:50,319
emphasis on caskit casket.

2572
02:00:51,399 --> 02:00:52,359
Speaker 1: This is cascat.

2573
02:00:52,960 --> 02:00:54,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, Oh, there we go. That was good. Loved it.

2574
02:00:55,720 --> 02:00:57,439
Speaker 1: So I know three words or I guess two because

2575
02:00:57,439 --> 02:00:59,439
I pronounced the solo pla what is it?

2576
02:01:00,039 --> 02:01:01,479
Speaker 3: Soaplela?

2577
02:01:01,680 --> 02:01:03,600
Speaker 1: Okay, where's that? To see how many of these I remember?

2578
02:01:03,640 --> 02:01:05,560
Speaker 2: I feel like the one you thought was really hard,

2579
02:01:05,640 --> 02:01:08,119
I'm gonna remember Nihilis sucks for the to the end

2580
02:01:08,159 --> 02:01:09,199
of time, and that.

2581
02:01:09,399 --> 02:01:12,039
Speaker 3: Was actually the one I was most worried about. You're

2582
02:01:12,039 --> 02:01:14,520
absolutely right, so you're doing a good shout.

2583
02:01:14,920 --> 02:01:15,920
Speaker 1: Mort This was great.

2584
02:01:16,279 --> 02:01:17,960
Speaker 2: Until next time we leave everybody with a shout out

2585
02:01:17,960 --> 02:01:21,359
to the one the only another player this bers should probably.

2586
02:01:21,119 --> 02:01:22,840
Speaker 1: Figure out a way to acquire They're gonna get the

2587
02:01:22,920 --> 02:01:24,399
lad pull the ball, will eat a pair with Wembe

2588
02:01:24,720 --> 02:01:26,359
Mister Frank Tila Kea