Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to side Quest. This is our weekly
video game show here at geek Versus. I'm your host
dil Muss, and I am on my own today because
I got to talk some more about Claire Obscure Exhibition
thirty three, and I think I would feel guilty to
just be in a chat room with Taylor Kirkland or
Travison just you know, talk at them about this game
more than talk with them about it because they haven't
played a bit. So did a little bonus episode here,
and this is gonna be all spoilers because this is
actually my second or third time talking about the game
on the podcast. So if you want some more spoiler
free or spoiler light conversations, go back in the feed
and check out those episodes. But I guess yeah, just
to start out, like my journey that I took with
this game, it started out a little bit rough and
I documented this on side quest where I was into
the game, played for about two or three I was
really really enjoying the game, and then I booted up
the game the next day and then my save was
deleted or partially deleted. It took me all the way
back to the opening section of the game, and so
at that point I was like, ah, I don't know
this kind of what do I want this in the
back of my head at any point my save could
just gomage away. But I eventually I was like, you know,
this game seems really cool. Everyone's kind of praising it
and loving it. I think I should give it one
more shot, And thankfully I did because I didn't have
any other save issues after that point. And yeah, now
I've played through the game, finished it, rold credits, doing
a bunch of postgame stuff, and I, you know, I
absolutely love this game, which is which is great because
this is not necessarily my genre.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: Every once in a while I do like some turn
based RPG sort of things, but I just don't generally
gravitate towards them. And it's funny thinking about this game,
especially as right now I'm playing the Sea of Stars DLC,
and I've realized matter how much similarities there are between
this game and Sea of Stars, which was my Game
of the Year in twenty twenty three when that game
came out. So I think there's a certain special sauce
that this game and that game are doing that just
speaks to me in terms of the RPG side of things.
So I think I'm gonna keep my eyes and ears
out for games that are similar to these kind of
games different ways, because yeah, that's just clearly my cup
of tea. So as I said, this is gonna be
a spoiler spoiler filled episode from here on out, I'm yeah,
spoilers are fully broken open here. I'm not gonna hold
back at all. So you know, listen at your own risks.
Definitely go play the game to available on game Pass
or any other place you want to check it out.
So yeah, after I had that initial you know, save issue,
got into the game and was pretty much hooked from
then on out. Uh And I think, you know, my
interest kind of it went up and down a little
bit throughout, mostly because I feel like the end of
Act one, that's when you know Gustav is killed out,
Like WHOA, what a bold, crazy moment for a video
game to do and to commit to that, especially when
you're like looking forward at his skill tree and like
things you're gonna get and it's like, oh nope, he
is gone and you'll never play them again. I think
it was really smart that they took all the weapons
that he would have used. Or was using, and those
are still usable as on verso you get to use
those same swords in his move set, which I think
is a really clever way of like not feeling like
you got robbed of all this stuff you unlock. So
really all you unlocked for Goose stuff is like these
skills of course, but then also costumes. But then none
of those costumes I don't think are unique. I think
you can get all of them again on Versa or
other characters anyway. So yeah, like, obviously that's such a
huge point in the story, and anytime there's like an
act break in this game, it becomes so much wider. Right,
The game starts out fairly linear, you're kind of funneled
through specific areas, but then eventually opens up, Oh you
can cross the sea, and then obviously like act through
when you get the ability to fly and you can
go absolutely anywhere in the game just does this multiple times,
or it's kind of like that walkout moment in like
an open world game where it kind of has this
and like a top down isometric view instead where it
has the equivalent of a walkout mom where it's like, Wow,
look at all these things you can go do and see,
and it's definitely overwhelming, but you know, in a satisfying
way because it's just like all these new things that
you're gonna be able to go check out. But I think,
you know, once there was a reveal in the story
and I'll get into some of this stuff, like kind
of more towards the end of the episode. But when
there's the reveal in the story that the world isn't real,
it's just a it's a painting, it's a simulation. You know,
it's not a sci fi simulation. It's more of a
fantasy simulation, but same idea there, you know, the world
exists inside this painting. I think the immediate thought for
me was like it kind of took down a bit
of the stakes.
Speaker 2: It's like, Okay, this.
Speaker 1: Grand epic journey I've been going on now feels like
not not that it was for nothing, but it doesn't
feel quite as real.
Speaker 2: You know, at the end of the day, it's.
Speaker 1: Like it's still it's a video game, and it just
pulled back a layer to like still a video game,
so it should feel just as real. But that was
when it comes my initial impression of that story beat,
and then I think, you know, by the time the
game rolls up or you know, rolls credits, I should say,
and you get all these other story reveals and you're
finding out more information about the family and the backstory
and what led to these moments.
Speaker 2: Obviously, it's still it sticks the.
Speaker 1: Landing in that way, but I think it definitely maybe
lost a little bit as team there, not really like
I I didn't stop playing it at all, but just
in terms of that maybe investment from the story side
of things.
Speaker 2: And then it picks up again later.
Speaker 1: On, and then I think I had another minor lull
when I really got to Act three and I had
that moment where I finally got the ability to fly
and the whole map was accessible to me.
Speaker 2: At that point.
Speaker 1: They give you a quest that you can just straight
up go to Loomar and end the game at that point,
but it feels like way too soon to do that
kind of thing. Is there's all these points on the
map that you've been just waiting to see up.
Speaker 2: To this point. You can finally go access those things.
Speaker 1: And I felt really overwhelmed when this first happened, because
you know, one of the criticisms I have, and I
think many do, of this game is a little bit
of the lack of direction at some times, Like there
is an overall world map, but only like very few points.
Is that actually put like a waypoint on that map,
Like you know, for the first three acts, first, early
I guess sections of the game, the map is pretty small,
like you're closed off enough that it's never really a
question of where you're supposed to go. But then when
you get like to these more open areas, when you
get flying and swimming and all that sort of stuff,
there's just so much to do, and since you can't
really quickly zip around the map, like I'm sure it
only takes maybe a min or two to fly from one.
Speaker 2: End to the other, but it feels a little bit sluggish.
Speaker 1: When you're just going around zone to zone to try
and remember, oh, yeah, what's the name of this place?
Speaker 2: Have I've been here before?
Speaker 1: And really the only indicator is like a danger symbol
where it's like, okay, I probably haven't done this out
if it as danger on it, or maybe I walked
in briefly and then got swamped and then.
Speaker 2: Like left immediately.
Speaker 1: So you know, eventually, what I started doing was just
writing down like a quest log on just a piece
of paper because the game doesn't have that built into
the game, which would have been nice. I think even
just the ability to set a way point would have
been fine for me. I can be like, okay, I
can set way points here. These are places I haven't been.
I'll come back and check them out. But even then,
like when you when you get to that act three
and there's so many places that have the danger symbol
on them, it's kind of like, you know, there isn't
like a a It's not like, Okay, this is a
purple danger, this is red danger, this is black danger.
You gotta be careful like it. It's just one static
danger symbol. So it's it's pretty unclear if it's like Okay,
when I'm level sixty, I should go here, seventy I
should go to this place. So it feels just way overwhelming.
So thankfully super Bad Mic in the discord, who he
and I have been talking a lot about this game
and the discord. Come join us talk about it more
there if you want, I asked him. I was like, man,
I don't know what the heck that you do have
any tips because I've gone to like four or five places.
Speaker 2: It absolutely destroyed everywhere I go. What do I do?
Speaker 1: And he recommended that I go to Frozen Hearts. I
believe is the place the name of the place, and
I think it was. I think it did still have
a danger symbol on it when I got to Act three,
But after taking out like two or three enemy camps
in there, which was hard but not impossible, I got
so much XP from that that I got leveled up
and caught up pretty quick. And that place is pretty long.
It's probably the longest maybe two or second or third
longest dungeon in the post game or like Act three
stuff that I've encountered so far. I guess I should
say that right right now too, is I haven't done
everything in this game. There's so much more to do.
There's certain boss fights or areas that still have danger.
Speaker 2: Symbol on them.
Speaker 1: I probably will keep plugging away at it, and I'm
sure there will be additional story beats or little things
here there that come up, and maybe I'll want to
share those thoughts later. But I thought now would be
a good time to get this episode out, because you know,
I kind of got pulled away to do some doom
stuff for an episode and then I'm back on See
If Stars DLC very soon. The Switch two is coming out,
and so I just don't know how much time I'm
gonna have and I want.
Speaker 2: To talk about this game.
Speaker 1: Well it's still fresh, so yeah, anyway, that was kind
of a good spot for me to go is the
Frozen Hearts area kind of get a bunch of lovelops there,
love loops more, you know, pictos, figure out what's going on,
and then you know, after that point, then I felt like, okay,
there's now that I've got a bunch more levels under
my characters, a lot more places feel accessible, and then
it kind of was pretty straightforward. There's still a lot
of that where I'll go into an area I'm like, okay,
it has danger, maybe I should try it out and
I'll get absolutely destroyed. Or maybe I can like sneak
past one enemy or something and find like in a
collectible or something, but it doesn't feel like it's where
I should be, and so I think the game just
lacks a little bit of direction. In that third act,
I could definitely see them patching things like that, Like
I feel like a Year's where the patches under his
belt to like add some quality of life things or
you know, I don't think they'll do any major story DLC,
but I think just minor things like that will turn
this game from what is already an amazing game to
a slightly more amazing game.
Speaker 2: I guess, I don't know.
Speaker 1: I just feels like it's gonna any nitpicks I have
are things that are easily fixable. Maybe not easily because
if it was easy, they probably would have done it
by now, but you know, pretty pretty manageable to add
some basic fixes like that for some of these kinds
of things. So yeah, I really enjoyed my time with
Act three. Still have, like I said, more stuff to
do there, but spent. I don't really have an hour
count for you, but definitely, I don't know, ten, fifteen,
maybe more hours, maybe twenty, I don't know. I definitely
have done a lot in Act three, to the point
that when I finally went back to Loumier to finish
the game fight the final boss.
Speaker 2: I destroyed the final boss.
Speaker 1: Like the areas leading up to the final boss funny
enough actually give me a little bit challenge. Some of
the enemies there were tough, not too bad, but then
the final boss I killed my first try and it
was like two or three hits. I feel like in
both the phases it was really really fast, which is funny.
It's like it's maybe a little anti climactic, but it
also felt like a good reward for all the grinding
I had been doing, all the hours I had spent,
and you know, at that point, it's like, Okay, you
fought Renoire multiple times, and even though the fight's different,
there's different mechanics, different stats and all that it, you know,
different cinematics leading up to it, it's still it felt
pretty good. I was not mad, because, yeah, anything past
the paintress, like, given that that's kind of the beacon
far off in the distance, the goal for most of
this game, Like, I'm kind of I'm surprised that we
got went into this whole act three sequence and there
was all this stuff still to do once I you know,
got past the paintress. Obviously, that was like not quite
the battle you expected for it. It was more of
a story moment though it had did have like combat
associated with it as well, of course, But yeah, I
think I was definitely surprised that there was so much
more after that, and it almost felt like bonus stuff.
It felt like postgame, even though there was still clearly
a lot of game there. And I think part of
that is because I believe it's after that Paintress stuff
is when you you go do the epilogue and then
you go back to Act three, So it's kind of
that's maybe the one time in the game other than
like little flashbacks, I guess where the story is told
out of order for dramatic effect, to give you that
big moment of like you want a bunch of story
reveals when you finally get to the paintriocks, as that's
what like the whole game and marketing of the game was.
But then obviously there's like a bunch more stuff to do,
which yeah, feels like a bit of postgame stuff. And
after I defeated Renoir the final boss fight and rolled
credits picked my ending, which I'll talk about in a
little bit, you know, it just chucks it right back
to Act three and you can just either go see
the other ending, or you can just go explore more
and you can immediately teleport out from the flag that
you're left at and go do more stuff in the overworld,
which which I have done a little bit more of
that so yeah, I think the game had like a
really good pacing to it constantly just like keeping things
fresh with different story beats and whatnot, and then just
like the gameplay constantly evolving, or as you're getting through
your skill trees and getting more unlocked and finding new weapons. Yeah,
it feels like the game just kind of constantly keeps
up pace and doesn't really have like any slow dragging moments.
It was more just when I had that initial reveal
of like, oh, this world isn't real, thet felt a
little a little bit lower for me. But then it
became a more personal journey, more personal story about the
characters in this world. So I think I'm gonna start
talking a little bit more about some combat and things
like that, and then I'll kind of ramp more into
some story beats and character stuff in terms of the
the you know progression of my characters. Early on, you know,
I guess you get Lunae and then you get or
you have Gustav. You get Lunae, and then you get Male.
Then eventually you get cl and then you know, you
have the swapout where Gustav is taken away you get
verse of instead, and then you go get Monoco. I
pretty much always kept Lunae and Mael in my party,
like I think, you know, I think one hundred percent
of the time, except for specific missions that require you
to play as a certain character or certain subsets of characters,
and so Luna was kind of like I always had
her in the middle. I forget, I forget how you
do it, you like select the party in a specific way,
so that she was always in the middle.
Speaker 2: She was kind of the all around her. She was
the Mario.
Speaker 1: She had like really really high speed, so she had
more turns than anyone else, so she could be the
one to like, Okay, I need to do a last
minute revive here, I need to throw some heels on
my team. But primarily she was a damage dealer, and
her primary goal was to just apply burn to enemies,
so like hell was the go to skill for me,
just constantly applying that as much as I possibly can,
and then like in between, you know, if I need
to do a supportive task, I can, But otherwise it
was just doing an attack or something.
Speaker 2: They got to build up my ap to.
Speaker 1: Get to the point where I can just spam more
hell and then putting all of like the picto's and
luminas on there that make it so like it doubles
the amount of fire you put on with every hit,
increasing the damage against fire.
Speaker 2: And then all my.
Speaker 1: Characters had the picto or I guess the lumina where
they would heal by attacking anyone who was burning. And
so her goal was to just get fire on people.
So by the time I was in like the third
late late act three stuff, you know, it's pretty easy
for me to get like thirty forty to fifty like
fire built up on an enemy, and so They're just
gonna be constantly burning. So I'm gonna be constantly getting
like health back from all my characters attacking them. So yeah,
in the fact that she had just super high speed
meant that she could just act more. And then eventually
when I got the cheater picto which all shout out
a little bit later on giving her double turns, and
she's already super fast, just unreal. She was definitely the
she was definitely holding things down and the most like
well rounded character on my team. And then my l
I think I feel like probably until like level thirty
or forty, I only ever put stats into power nothing,
not a single other thing, so she was the ultimate
glass canon. I could fill in some shield abilities with
like the luminas usually or pictos, and that's how it
would make it so she didn't just immediately die all
the time. I giving her shields or like maybe other
characters would boost her up. But yeah, she just did
an insane amount of damage and that's really all the
build was for her. And then eventually I started rounding
her out more, giving her more other stats, make sure
her speak, because eventually she was so slow that she
wasn't even attacking enough, and then she was so squashy
she was dying all the time. So eventually adding in
some of those things too to make her a little
bit more well rounded.
Speaker 2: So those two were always in the party.
Speaker 1: It was always like Lune is like the bit of
the all rounder males as the dps, primarily in the
third slot.
Speaker 2: I'd switch around a lot. I would use cl was
typically like my go.
Speaker 1: To healer slash support type character, so she was always
there on the side. She had the AoE heel that
she would do constantly, and then I also kind of
always had her as the guard breaker, so whenever I'd
build up enough guard she would usually have AP on her,
whereas you know, my alism was spamming her AP to
get as much damage out as possible, or using her
skills to remove shields, things like that. But CL would
try to always keep a little some reserve of apiece
that I could use.
Speaker 2: One of the I think I.
Speaker 1: Had to break abilities on her, so she had options
there of how to break the opponent and keep up
in the pacing. And then the stats wise for her
and pretty much everyone else Minoco, VERSU, n CLI, I
pretty much kept their stats pretty well rounded for the
most part. Maybe highlighting this, like, I think CLI put
a little bit more into defense and health just so
she could be tanky, make sure she's alive for the
healing that she needs to do. Vers So, I think
I made a little bit more of like a second
DPS after my l but the Monoco is definitely like
a all around her as well in terms of the
general stats. And then Monoco I really kept a variety.
Speaker 2: I never really.
Speaker 1: Figured out an amazing strategy for him, and I think
part of that is maybe it's just unlucky or maybe
just how it's designed. I'm not sure, but I definitely
only have like a handful of weapons with him, like
maybe five or six, whereas every other character, I think Versa,
I was like fifteen twenty weapons, and all these weapons,
you know, have different stats or like incentivized different play styles,
so it gives you a little bit more freedom with
Monoco since there's less of those. I never really knew
exactly the best way to play him, and I know
you can math it all out of like, Okay, when
I played this ability, it's gonna move my flag over
four the beast to a wheel four times over, so
now I will be on a red.
Speaker 2: But to me, I just couldn't chest it. I couldn't.
I couldn't think that money moves ahead.
Speaker 1: So I would just kind of go off the cuff
and I would try and give him at least one
ability of all the colors so that he always had.
Speaker 2: Something to do.
Speaker 1: And then I tried to give them a little bit
of everything. He would have some break, he'd have some
AoE damage, he had a heel slash buff always on.
So he's a bit of like I don't know, use
a variety, but I really liked having him in there,
and I've used him a lot because of his like
core mechanic around you know, finding or defeating different enemies
and like that's how you get abilities.
Speaker 2: Because that was a really fun collectible for me.
Speaker 1: You know, it's like such a more engaging collectible where
it's like, okay, go take out all these enemies with
the specific guy equipped, you'll get one of their abilities.
I think I have all but three or four on him,
so that's you know, a pretty high percentage out of
all the ones available. And so because that, I was
often keeping him in that eightier roster along with Male
and Lunae.
Speaker 2: So that he could you know, get those abilities.
Speaker 1: Which also you know, this is jumping ahead a little
bit in story stuff character stuff, but like Minoco obviously
being the family's dog, and that's why Versill like brought
him into the painting when he created the painting. I
think that's like a very fun thematic thing that like
this dog character is like finding animal's feet. It's like
almost like that dog maybe in real life, was like
digging up in the yard and always finding weird stuff
like mice or like I don't know, a dead rabbit
or something or something like that. And so it makes
sense that like all this character is like collecting feet
and then that turns into like obviously the painting is
a very different than like an actual dog, But I
thought that was kind of a fun thematic tie there,
which I really like that element of the character and story.
I think when that reveal, when I learned that about Monoco,
just like added so much more depth and like added
like the I just justified the funny dynamic that him
and Verso had. Obviously, it's very different when they're having
actual conversations rather than like, you know, if you can
have a conversation with your dog in real life, that's fine.
I have conversations with my cats and stuff, but it's
not quite the same as talking with someone who can
also you know, speak the same language right back at you.
And then yeah, Verso definitely the one I used the lease.
Speaker 2: I think I didn't.
Speaker 1: Super love his his play style, his move set, and
that's kind of how I feel about Gustav as well.
So I wasn't Gustaff wasn't even in my main party
anymore by the time he passed away, So I was
like not super bummed on the gameplay side of things,
And I think that's intentionally why Gustav's move set is
the most simplified one of like, oh, you literally just
build up this bar that goes to ten and then
you do the big attack pretty straightforward, whereas with Male
it's like, okay, keeping track of all of the different
stances you're in and trying to like minmax that or
you could even turn her into a healer obviously Luna
has all these different abilities and using the stains to
maximize damage or other abilities, and then cl with like
adding these forteil stacks and then triggering them for like
bonus damage, like these are pretty and then the monoco
like keeping track of that wheel and like making sure
you're putting the right abilities on and building the character
in right way so you're being efficient with all that
stuff like pretty complicated mechanics, whereas yeah, verso and good
stuff are a little bit more simplified verses. I found
maybe a little bit tricky to parts. Sometimes Sometimes I
was like, Okay, I'm like on A I'm building up
charge on a D right now. Does that mean like
dabilities will work or is it like only when I'm
up to B that like anything below works. So I
think I always found things a little bit confused, and
even like you know, tens and tens of hours in Lunae,
being always in my party one percent of the time,
I did not have it figured out, like, Okay, on
turn one, I have to do this so that I
built the stains that on turn two I can use
this ability and get the bonus damage off.
Speaker 2: And then on turn three, now I.
Speaker 1: Have this mega attack because I have all these stains
built up, And I think that is leading into one
of the maybe one of the criticisms I have of
this game is I think there's so much build a variety,
whether it is those weapons offering like super unique play styles,
the range of abilities to get, so many different types
of abilities, so many different types of play styles, and
then obviously the lumina and piccto system is ridiculously overwhelming
and great. There's so much to it's so much fun.
But I found like just because of how long it
takes to not necessarily swap out ability as weapons that's
pretty quick, but how long it takes to swatch out
switch out luminas and pictos, especially because I was making
sure I leveled every single picto. As soon as I
got it, I put it immediately on someone so I
could add it as a lumina. So i'd have that option,
but because that menu is really rough, like they needed
to add a lot more organization to it, or I know,
there's like a favorite favoriting you can do, but that
doesn't really cut it. It's not really good enough for
what I need there. I really wish I could have
had like two or three or more like preset builds
that I could make up, not preset in terms of
the game making them, but like I could set like, Okay,
this is play style A for Lunae, and this is
like my fire healer build or something, and Luna too.
This is more my my defensive build ICE ICE defensive
build or like build three, and this is my DPS build,
And then I can just pick one of those presets
and then it automatically gives me the weapon, the abilities
and the pictose luminas I want to equip.
Speaker 2: But I think that's one of the reasons why I
didn't try different play styles.
Speaker 1: It just takes so long to re equip and unequip things,
and it's like, Okay, I can't remember exactly what my
build was, even though it was really good.
Speaker 2: I don't want to like lose this build.
Speaker 1: It kind of feels like that too at times, and
so I think I would have liked to have some
like presets there, or even just like a quicker better
way to select luminas, because I think the game has
like you can you know, select offensive, defensive support or
something like that, but like I wanted to disability to
like google aim and then all the aimabilities pop up
so I can pop all those on real quick. I
just felt like that it was always a little bit
too clunky for me. But we want to switch up
play styles too much, which is too bad because i'd
find a cool weapon, like I eventually found one later
on for Lune that's like an ice ability or an
ice weapon rather that I think it makes it so
you like lose health at the end of your term,
that you like go into this like you like freezes yourself,
but then you come back healed or something like that
and with some other benefits. And obviously I don't know
the exacts of it because I never actually used the weapon,
but it was a really cool idea and as soon
as I read that weapon or picked it up, I
was like, ooh, this is a really cool idea for build.
I want to try this. But then I was like, ah,
my burn build is really good. I don't want to
have to like spend fifteen minutes later like switch back
to this burn build. And so that's something that I
could see them adding with like patches, and I would
really like to see that because there's so much.
Speaker 2: Variety to this, you know.
Speaker 1: I know, Mike in the end the discord was talking
to me about how Mael was his healer support class
I believe, and it's like, I would love to try
that because I can envision that with all the skills
and other pictos and things that I've unlocked. But yeah,
to unselect everything and re select it all, it's just
it's just gonna take too long, and I'm just maybe
a bit too lazy to want to do some of that.
And then yeah, I think especially given for Monoco, just
like the overwhelming looking at his abilities, I feel like
that needed some sort of organization to it, because that
gets a bit heavy as well. When you're trying to
factor in all those ability has plus all the luminous
pictols you can put on him, it just becomes a
bit ridiculous. And from maybe for him, it's a good
thing that he has less weapons that you can pick
from or at least that I have found, because I
think that would be just a little bit overwhelming. I
also like that the game frequently in the commet like
puts you into different types of scenarios. Obviously, at one point,
as Mail you fight against Alicia, and that's really fun
to do. Like a one on one battle you get
like a few of those in the game against like
merchants usually then there was also like a specific battle
that put me as as Verso and Minoco and like
a so a two v one or three or wherever
many opponents there was in that certain mission, and so
I like that there's like four sing and obviously at
the start of the game, before you have all three characters,
you're getting like one on one battles, two on two battles,
and so I think I like that the game kind
of forces you to switch it up, or certain missions
will force you to certain characters, so you're getting that variety.
And I don't know if the game like catches up
people in levels if you don't use them much, but
I found that even if I didn't use Versa for
a few hours, he was.
Speaker 2: Never that under leveled.
Speaker 1: So maybe it's just because you know, I'd go into
a later area and then he would get a lot
more XP because he was under leveled. Not sure exactly,
but it felt like my characters are always caught up,
and obviously five when you always have three person party
is not super overwhelming to try and keep track of.
So uh yeah, I think that that was really fun too,
just in terms of variety sake, and that would be
really hard sometimes. And obviously there's certain builds or certain
pictos rather that are built around like okay, if you
are the only one at a party, obviously I think
that would apply if your two other characters died, but
also to like try that as a build, like I'm
just gonna go for a crazy huge damage build and
then base it off of just like being a solo player,
Like obviously there's one of the gest roles in the
town asks you to do nine hundred and nine nine
nine nine damage to them, And so that was really
fun to like switch builds around with my l who
was my DPS character, to try and figure out a
way that I could make that happen, and eventually I did,
but it was funny like every few hours I'd come
back and try that again, and then I'd put on
like all those pictos and luminas to just make her
so she would do an insane amount of damage with
one hit. Really really satisfying to figure out cool combos
like that. Speaking more on the combat, I mean, as
as I mentioned, I feel like I never really got
the full understanding of how to use Lune's stains, or
like I wasn't always using them super efficiently. I think
with my l her move st was a bit more simplified,
so I was able to do that, and that one
I could force the out two to three turns of
like Okay, I'm building up here, building up here, and
then I'm gonna be in virtuous stance for like three
or four turns in a row because of the way
I'm setting things up here. I also found with cl
I could never really quite get the hang of it.
Hers is a bit simpler, simplified, because it's like, Okay,
well I can see that there's whatever stack on this
enemy right now of the foretel, so I can like
pop it for bonus damage. But I felt like there's
so many more ways that could be a lot more
efficient with her as a character that I could never
just try it out or never quite succeed in that
same way. In terms of the pictos, I think the
cool system. You know, any character can put on any picto.
After four battles, it'll get upgraded to illumina and then
any character can equip it at that point.
Speaker 2: I think that's really smart.
Speaker 1: That it's kind of incentivizing you to try out every
single picto and that way you're like most of them
do make a lot of sense, Like they're pretty straightforward
when you read them, you kind of know how it's
gonna work. But at least that's forcing you to try
out everything a little bit, and that way you can
kind of experiment with things so you know you don't
have to either. And also four battles isn't a lot,
so it's not like you could grind for hours with
any battle. You can do it, you know, in probably
like two minutes if you just like reset on like
a pretty basic enemy there. And I think that is
a really good system. I think other than the menuing,
I really have no notes. I think it's cool that
there's kind of this. You know, every character has unique
things when with their weapons and their abilities, and they're
just basic mechanic. But then the aluminism pictos are kind
of just these more general things narve and then sometimes
they are very specialized, and then you can kind of
put those on any character. So it makes every character
just have the ability to be a tank, a DPS,
a healer, you know, weird niche builds in between. Like
it just it gives you so much variety there. I
also think that the point in the story too, when
I forget when you get the picked out, it's pretty late.
I think probably at the start of act three is
when you get the pickto that removes that like nin
nine and nine damage throttle, which is one of the
best feelings in like a game I can think of
in a very long time, the fact that this game
has just had like training wheels on you the whole
time to make it so you're dealing a specific amount
of damage, which is great for balancing because it means
all the boss fights are gonna be bounced up to
that point in the game, and then the game doesn't
fully open up until afterwards. But man, does that feel
go when you first start, Oh shit, I'm doing twelve
thousand damage. Now I'm doing twenty thirty forty thousand damage.
Now I'm dealing multiple one hundred thousand damage like in
one strike.
Speaker 2: It's such a great.
Speaker 1: Thing, you know, it's a perfect balancing tool. And also
just is this amazing gameplay feeling in like the third
act of the game, So it just kind of revitalizes.
Speaker 2: And then immediately when I then did that.
Speaker 1: I was like, Okay, all these bosses that I thought
were way too hard, now that I'm not gonna be
maxed out on damage, I'm gonna go try them again.
And then you know, there was one I went back
to from earlier in the game and I one shot him,
which was hilarious. It was actually the boss when I
mentioned way back at the beginning that I first started
the game and like, you know, lost my save after
three or four hour markets because I died to a
certain boss and then my like save was gone, and
so that boss. I was so scared of that boss
because I'm like, I don't want to die to this
boss again, have the game glitch and lose my save.
Speaker 2: So I came back in like act three.
Speaker 1: And ye just one shot the boss, which felt absolutely amazing.
And there was a few of those, not that I
was one shotting necessarily, but that I could just do
insane amounts of damage too that I had left from
from earlier in the game at that point. There's also
the picto that I think is hilariously just called Cheater.
I think you get that when you beat Sprong Sprague Sprong.
I think it's Sprong, which you know, just lets you
go twice every time. And so I think it's great that, like,
here's clearly like one of, if not the best picto
in the game, but the game kind of guilty if
you actually use it for a long period of time.
It also costs a ton of Lumina points, so obviously
if you're gonna use it, it's you know, it's it's
it's probably still worth how much it costs. And I
haven't put it on everyone because I do, you know,
the game's taunting me, it's calling me a cheater in
a roundabout way. But I think it's great that adds
something like that, because why not why not give that
ability to the players and they can just choose if
they want to use something like that. Another that's another
similarity to see if Stars has a lot of these
things that are kind of just like extended difficulty options
and things that you can equip or not equip if
you feel like they make the game too easy. But
I think it's great to just give the options to
the players. That's that's always a good thing to do.
I think one ability everything wanted to highlight that you
get late in the game with my l is just
the ability to gomage. That's like, what a crazy moment
that you can get that as an ability after the
game is like, set up this thing so much feels amazing.
Speaker 2: I use it.
Speaker 1: On a boss once and it killed the boss, and
that shocked me that I was allowed to be used
on a boss. I thought that it only be used
for like fodder enemies, But that's just super cool that
they give, like what is this huge thematic thing as
like a move set. Another thing too, is like, you
know there's status effects in the game. You know obviously
like burn or powerless or rush. There were statusffects I
was not seen until like deep into act three, So
I think it's cool that the game held back on
some of those things. Like one was called dizzy I
forget if that's.
Speaker 2: The one that makes you like inaccurate with your free aim, which.
Speaker 1: Is such a minor d buff that it's like it's
almost so minor that they're like, ah, we don't want
to put this on a big story boss, we'll just
stick at somewhere randomly in act three. But I think
it was cool that I was like stumbling upon new
mechanics and getting like tutorial pop ups like whatever, thirty
forty hours into this game, so obviously there's just an
insane amount of depth there, more than they even really
put into use, just like random side things that you
pop into later on. I don't know what are some
highlight boss fights, the the gross tet big Head if
you trends like that one, who is just this guy
that attacks you like three or four times in a row,
and then the next time it texts to you, he'll
do like one more attack things did previously. So the
only way you're gonna beat this boss is if you
get your perry timing down definitely destroyed me.
Speaker 2: I'd come back for hours. Letter destroyed me, come back
fe hours, letter destroyed me. But eventually I.
Speaker 1: Came back when I felt confident enough with the gameplay
and got you know, ten twenty perries off in a
row against eventually get the K on him.
Speaker 2: Feels amazing. So that was great.
Speaker 1: The kind of dark, soulsy boss with the double swords
that fights you on the bridge. I forget his name,
but it is super cool. I always liked the Renoire
boss fights.
Speaker 2: I thought all those were super.
Speaker 1: Good, except for obviously the final boss fight was a
bit too easy because of me being over leveled. And
then one that I stumbled upon it I haven't beat
this guy yet, but it's in uh. I believe it's
accessible through like the water, the underground water, the underwater
area that you can go to once you get the
swim ability. Is that it I forget. Maybe it might
be another section where you go through there's you know,
areas all over the place. It's a pretty big area actually,
And then you can go deep into this void. You
go down deep in the caves, deep below, deep, deeper
than anything you never imagined. And then there's just a
guy down there named Simon who as destroyed me. So
really cool story there. I don't know what's going on
with him because he seems like he was an expeditioner
who's just been like gaining power.
Speaker 2: I don't know why he hasn't been gomaged.
Speaker 1: Maybe he's like so powerful and I feel like this
story thing I'd like to learn more about, so I'll
probably look into that. But yeah, he from what I understand,
that might be like the final, final hardest boss in
the game.
Speaker 2: So I don't know.
Speaker 1: I don't know if I'll ever get to the point
where I can destroy him defeat him. But yeah, he
absolutely destroyed all my characters just one shotting them like
and lapping them at the same time. In that like
the amount of damage he was doing would one shot
my character like four or five times over. So I
was clearly like way too under leveled to fight him.
And then I think I mentioned this in the previous
episodes I've done on Expeditions thirty three, but I think
it's really brilliant. This game borrowed those classic Souls like
mechanics of like the Soul's like checkpoints at reset enemies
and then reset you're like healing and revives and things
like that, just because I feel like I'm playing RPGs.
Those resources either become you get so many of them
that the game becomes trivial because you just can heal
through anything, or you have so few that you don't
want to use anything, and then you just end up
not using them, and then that doesn't feel great either,
And so I think just adopting that souls like model
is a really great mix here worked really well. Meant
I was constantly using things, but never felt like I was,
you know, losing something that was super duper important. I
think moving in Actually, maybe I'll do a quick break here,
catch my breath, I'll come back and I'll get into
some exploration.
Speaker 2: All right, I have thoroughly explored.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I think, as I mentioned Act three confusion
stuff of just being like not too sure where to go,
you know, it eventually rounded it out and all I
needed was a little bump from from Mike in the
in the chat there. But I think other times the
game does lack a little bit direction. Sometimes the art
feels a little it kind of blends together, washes together
in the way that a lot of paintings can if
you imagine jumping into any old painting.
Speaker 2: So there's a little bit of that, not a huge deal.
I really loved.
Speaker 1: Finding flags or you know, the grappling hook things just
what any kind of evidence I guess from like previous expeditions,
that really did make the game. It really reinforced that
theme of like you are saying on the shoulders of giants, right,
like all these decades of people before you who have
come in here and tried to do the one goal
that you.
Speaker 2: Are finally the one who's able to achieve.
Speaker 1: It, and obviously just bodies, bodies, bodies everywhere.
Speaker 2: Great movie, by the way.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I think it was really fun to like
find those things that added contextual like understanding of why
these things would be here. Why is there a random
grappling hook in the middle of this random place, But
it's like, oh, yeah, another expedition was here set this
up here so that I could easily get across this gap.
Speaker 2: Really cool. I really enjoyed that. I also really liked
finding the journals.
Speaker 1: Obviously you can kind of get like a little tidbit
of every expedition that ever happened. I think it was
if you even just go through them on the menu.
It's fun to look at like the formats of entries,
Like some of them will say like Expedition thirty three
bridgets or something like that, and then some one might
be just be like exp thirty three or like they'll
format it and write it in different ways, so it
feels as if it was written by like these different
people who didn't have like a set format for how
to write this thing. It doesn't feel like it was
just someone who is typing this into a game engine
to make it work. Instead, it just makes it feel
like a little bit more realistic, and you'd find all
sorts of fun tidbits in there, whether it's like setting
up like, oh, yeah, we died this snake boss, and
then this snake boss is something you're seeing out in
the overall, and like, man that killed off this expedition,
and I can read about this, and then that kind
of sets up this I don't know, it makes this
like grander entrance to this boss fight. There's the Drunken
Brigade as they they dubbed themselves, and so you kind
of just get like different themes of how these different
exeditions experienced this world or what they did or what
they didn't do, or some of them might just end
it off with like not even really a piece of
info or a tip for the next expedition. Maybe they
just write a badass poem that describes their feelings that
they had going through this experience, and so really like
those I always was happy to find one fact that
it's like voice acted well all of them is like
just a cherry on top. So that was a really
good like bread crumbing of certain things, or maybe it'd
give you clintse clues or hints towards certain things coming up,
and then you know, other than that, Like there there
isn't a lot of mini games in here, but really
the ones you do get are through the gestural beaches,
and so you get like different platforming challenges. You get
like that one where you're climbing up that wall with
there's like bombs coming down.
Speaker 2: You get like volleyball one.
Speaker 1: I really liked these, and I also really liked how
kind of janky the visuals were for this thing. I
feel like at many times in this game, just thinking
about this is this is like a Triple A quality
game made by a smaller team. It's like incredibly impressive
the visuals, the music is obviously outstanding. They obviously got
like huge actors to do the voice acting, and so
it feels grander than like you would typically expect for
a development team of this size. But I love that,
like for one of these platform and sequences, like who
cares if this thing looks super duper jaky and weird,
it works within the textuff like this whole world being
created in a painting, So like if something doesn't make
sense or looks weird, looks off, or something that's floating
without the support, it doesn't matter. Like it all works
in there. And so I think that helps too, because
it's like, yeah, rather than the building like this huge,
all these new assets to make these weird platform and sequences,
they're just using like giant pitchfork, you know, art that
they used for like this other enemy. And so it
just feels like the game feels very like economical, and
I appreciate that. I think that you know, probably saves
them a lot of money, saves them time, and for me,
added like a fun, janky little platforming sequence. So to me,
that was a smart idea and cool and nonetheless, Okay,
let's talk about some characters and maybe i'll jump a
little bit ahead to uh story stuff. Oh you know,
this is gonna be stories, is gonna be characters, It's
gonna be plot to us, is gonna be probably a.
Speaker 2: Bit of a mess of thoughts.
Speaker 1: But I think the game kind of goes all over
the place in many moments and tell some things out
of order. So I think that's kind of fitting for it.
I'm gonna go here to super Bad. Mic in the
Discord asked, did you choose the Verso ending or the
Mael ending? I went with their Verso ending because it
felt like the most quote unquote good option and the
most emotionally satisfying. So yeah, I think that I definitely
understand that choice and that being the one that feels right.
I went with Mael and it was a tough decision,
but not too tough, because you know, part of it
was also just me being a bigger fan of her
as a character over Verso, and I always had her
in my party obviously, like when you really get into
Act three, like the story becomes her story and it's
kind of all centered around her when you get those
story reveals of her connection with the family, even if
that was like heavily hinted at throughout like the whole game,
obviously you're seeing this girl that looks almost exactly identical
to her, and so you know, it's one of those
things where it's like when you when you set up
a twist like that, where it's like kind of obvious
that that twist is gonna happen, Like obviously for me,
at least I felt like, obviously that girl is Mael
or like her sister or something like that. But then
the fact that they can do that reveal. But then
they can, you know, pull the rug, and there's like
a lot more to it. There's a lot more behind
that one reveal. I think it's like always a smart
thing to do for me. I went with my l
even though it did yeah, definitely felt like maybe even
more of a selfish choice. I think this kind of
leads into not necessarily criticism, but just one of the
things I felt like I didn't fully understand about this
story is that, Okay, so this is Versa's painting. He
created this world, and it's being kept alive by his family,
by his mom Aleen, who's the paintress, or by his
sister Alicia, who's coming here a renoir who's coming in
here and doing stuff as well. It doesn't seem like
the other sister really interacts with the painting at all.
In quick side attention. I feel like that is the
one character that I didn't really get what the point was.
Speaker 2: Like.
Speaker 1: I don't know if there's more to it, more story
stuff that I didn't see, but I just felt like
that sister character didn't really add much to the story.
I didn't know it's like Lune or cl supposed to
be like based off of these characters in a way,
and I didn't really get that vibe. So, yeah, I
don't know there's and that would be exceptionally weird because
of if it was CL. For example, like there's like
sex scenes that happened between Verso, you know, obviously they
don't show it.
Speaker 2: It's like a black screen.
Speaker 1: And then like, yeah, I think you can also romance Lunis,
So I doubt that's what's going on. I don't think
she's being portrayed by one of those two characters. But
I just feel like I didn't really get the emotional
gravitas of what the sister's role in the story was there.
But going back to that choice, you know, yeah, one
of the confusion points I had was like, Okay, so
Verso obviously died. There's a part of him. He created
this painting, and there's a part of him or like
a full on copy clone of his like you know,
exact brain inside.
Speaker 2: Of this painting, but still like he's not real.
Speaker 1: And I think that you know, that kind of almost
comes into like a black mirror, or like sci fi
idea of like if you take someone and make a
perfect clone of them and then let that clone loose,
Like is it ethical, Like do you have to hold
that clone up to like the same ethics and morality
that we would do with a regular person or are
they just like a creation and they're kind of fake
in that way. But then it's like, well, if they
can have the exact same thoughts and then they like
lead their own life and their own opinions and their
own consciousness, Like I don't know is ethical to like
just say that we have control over them or more
power over them, And so I think it does get
into like a bit of a tricky situation, But at
least from my understanding, it's like, hey, Mael wants to
stay in this painting because this world is better for her.
In this world, she you know, still has like full vision,
she has the ability to speak, which are really important things.
She's also kind of grown up again in this painting
and like has friends, and this world feels incredibly real. Obviously,
it feels real as a game for dozens of hours,
and it feels real for her having spent dozens of
years here or I guess for her a dozen dozen
plus a few years here, and so it feels like,
you know, if she wants to make the choice to
stay there, like who am I to take that away
from her? Like this is clearly better than her real
world out there, and yeah, maybe eventually she will have
to face the grief that she you know has on
the outside of losing her brother and how that splintered
her family. But like if she just wants to live
in here, like who is it hurting? It's hurting like
this clone of vers Oh, but that's like it's not
actually vers So it's not like this guy's actually trapped
in here. But then it's like, well, Versa does feel
like a real guy, And so I think it is
definitely a gray area. But for me, I've I sided
with the person who is still alive, and for me,
Mile who is still alive, wanted to stay here, and like,
I'm not gonna stop her. I think that's a totally
valid thing to do. Now, obviously they do him on
the Uh, you feel bad for this kid who's just
essentially being like a slave in here, having a paint
and keep this world alive for the sake of someone else,
but once again there is that yeah, gray area of like,
well it's not actually him, like that guy did die
and he is sleeping peacefully as far as I can tell.
So it's a bit of a tricky situation. Now, I'm
sure Mike, if you're when you're listening to this, like,
I'm sure you did either YouTube the other ending or
just went uh redid the boss fight and then like
saw the opposite ending. So I think you've seen how
Miles ending ends, where you know, she kind of she
defeats that version of Verso in the battle, but then
she kind of can continue to live in this world.
She brings back Gustav, she brings back Pierre, who is
CIL's husband, she brings back like the people of Lumier,
and can continue to live here. Now, obviously there's like
a very dark undertone to this, and like Verso gets
up on stage.
Speaker 2: They're at like the theater.
Speaker 1: He gets up on stage and he plays just like
the grossest try note whatever, like some nasty note that
just is like a horror movie note string right that pops,
and so obviously things feel a little unsettled, and then
you the camera goes back to Mael and her face
is fading away in a way that's almost like the
first steps of what would have happened to her mother
Aleen the Paintress when she first started to fade away
when living in this canvas and so and then so
I'll come back to that in a second. But then
when you go over to versus ending, versus ending is like, Okay,
this world ends this painting, We're gonna close off this simulation.
Everyone in it is going to perish, and then like
the family is finally gonna have like an actual funeral
four vers so they're gonna say goodbye. And then Mayel
kind of has a vision of seeing all of her
friends from the painting. They kind of gomash fade away,
and so it's kind of like just the ending of
that loop. Uh. And I think you know that obviously
is like the more emotionally satisfying ending. But here is
my take on this, And I think that's so cool
that this game didn't have a lot of dialogue choices
or like story choices, Like for the most part, it
is pretty straightforward. I think really only the choice that
I can think of is like whether or not you
date cl or Lunae. From what I understand, if you
want to romance Lunae, you have to not have romance closly.
Speaker 2: It's like a.
Speaker 1: Lower stakes story than like everything else that's going on here.
But the way I see it is that like Mayel
when she starts to fade away at her ending, her
her face is starting to peel away. To the way
I see it is like, Okay, Mayel is now the one,
not her mom, not the paintress, not Aleen. She is
now the one who is keeping this world alive through
her power, her energy, her magic ability, the way that
Aileen did for like decades and decades and decades, while
these other expeditions were like going through and living in
this world in Loumiere. And so eventually it feels like, Okay,
the Paintress Aleen, when she's losing power because she's been
in this canvas too long, she's starting to fade away,
she's trying to think of, like, Okay, what is the
most like ethical way I can kill everyone off in
this world without just it being totally random. We're just
killing everyone off. And so I feel like she actually
came up with like a pretty fair solution, which is
like starting from one hundred and going down. Every year,
everyone of this age is going to die.
Speaker 2: So obviously the first.
Speaker 1: Few years she never like communicates that with the people
Illumina Air, so they don't know what's going on. But
eventually when they do figure it out, it becomes this like,
as far as I can tell, that's you know, this
is a big, big ass trolley problem, but like this
is a pretty fair way.
Speaker 2: To do this.
Speaker 1: Like everyone knows exactly how long they have to live,
they know what age they're going to die, they know
the moment because they eventually get down to like they
know when this festivals happen. They know like the down
to like the minute or the seconds when these people
are gonna fade away and when they're gonna die. And
so it feels like the most fair way rather than
just like, Okay, every year, we're gonna randomly kill off
ten percent of people in a completely random draw random lottery.
Now instead you have like perfect and perfect ish information
of exactly when you're gonna pass away, and that feels
like okay. Well, now, since she's killing off a certain
amount of people every year, there's less lives, less people
in the painting, so she's able to maintain that a
bit better, but eventually, like it is gonna fade away.
She's not gonna able to hold this power anymore. And
so that feels like a pretty fair way to go
about that kind of thing. And so obviously it feels
very justified of why the paintress is what she's doing,
and it all makes sense when you get down to
it in the end, and to me, I kind of
just feel like, yeah, the mile ending is kind of
just like, yeah, that's gonna happen again with Mieu. She's
the one maintaining this world as the years go on.
Maybe now she's able to maintain everyone. She has the
power to keep everyone in that painting, But over the years,
she's gonna lose that ability, and she's gonna have to
make that very same or a similar decision, who do
I kill, like make sure I can hold myself in
this painting long enough to keep the rest of these
people alive, And she might have to do the exact
same thing. She might have to start from one hundred
and go down and just like, more and more of
these people are gonna pass away as she loses the ability,
as she loses the power to keep this world alive,
And so for me, like I love cyclical art. Cyclical
stories is why I'm a big Pink Floyd head and
all their albums that end in a cyclical way that
kind of just go right back to the beginning. I
feel like that's kind of what's happening with this story here,
is like, Okay, the paintress. Maybe there was even someone
before the paintress too, who's keeping this painting alive. Probably
not based on the story information we get here, but
it seems like, Okay, Aleen has kept this world alive
for all these years. Now male at the end of
this game, she's the one who's gonna keep it alive.
And maybe when she can't do it anymore, maybe Aleen
jumps back in and they just like keep this cycle
going and keep this painting going. But eventually, and that's
why I think the ending is so freaking good and
why you have that choice. Eventually that verso ending, I
think will be the ending. So the way I see
it is like, Okay, maybe you get a Lien's ending,
maybe you choose my L's ending, but that almost just
feels like a temporary you know, we're going to extend
the life of this painting. But then eventually we will
get to that verse. So ending it all like kind
of funnels back there eventually. And so obviously you don't
see what like that whole world would look like of
another you know, one hundred and seventy years whatever it was,
of Mal's version of the painting and her keeping it
alive and as she has a slowly faded away, but
we'd imagine to be the same thing where like the
people who knew this information at the beginning would eventually
start to like pass away, they wouldn't have that information anymore.
And so yeah, I think that that's why the ending
is so cool to me. And I don't know, I
haven't heard, like I've listened to some other podcasts people
talking about this game, and I haven't heard that interpretation.
So I don't know if I'm off base there. Maybe
there's more information like contradicts that version of it. But
I think that's a really really interesting idea for an ending,
like you're essentially picking one that essentially establishes a cycle
that leads back into the other one eventually. I think
it's an incredibly cool, super super smart idea, and it's
why maybe and you know, maybe all this is just
me with a little bit of copy. I'm trying to
like justify taking what felt like the more brutal action
with the or brutal choice at the end there by
picking my al over, you know, letting Versa rest. But
to me, it's like, Okay, yeah, maybe it's not gonna
rest for another hundred years, but like it does feel
like it's eventually gonna lead to that point eventually. So
I think that's like super cool if that's what they
were going for.
Speaker 2: I love it.
Speaker 1: Even if they weren't. Obviously, that's my interpretation, and I
fucking love that. I think it's incredibly unique for any story,
let alone, especially a video game. So yeah, that's that's
my interpretation there. That's why I went with my l's ending,
But I definitely can see why you went with versus
ending their mic. I think that's a probably better, better
way to go about it, probably a little bit nicer
and more fair. But at the same time, it's like,
you know, you do that, you set Verso free, but
then all these other people in the painting, they also.
Speaker 2: Die and lose their lives.
Speaker 1: You know, maybe they weren't as real as Versa once was,
But yeah, I think it's just it's a great ambiguous
kind of ending in that way, and that it evokes
so many feelings and the ability for me to rant
about it for ten fifteen minutes whatever I just did there,
And then another thing I want to talk about the story.
And this is another thing that I haven't heard in
my other podcast. Listen, I haven't heard anyone talk about this,
So I might be off base and there might be
more information that just weighed some of this, But there
there's some conversation about, Okay, obviously, is the painters. They're
the family that are the ones that are creating maintaining
this this world. Then there's a discussion of like the
writers and the right there's like a war between the
writers and the painters, and the family blames the writers
for the fire. For me, the writers aren't like another
faction or like another family. But it's just like the
game taking another metal layer step back and commenting on
like the writer straight up the writers of the games,
of the of this game specifically, which I think is
a very fun like almost inceptional layery thing to it,
where the game starts out for hours and hours and hours,
it's you in this painted world and you're living this world,
and then eventually you get the the you know, it
peeled back that oh wow, this is actually.
Speaker 2: Not the real world.
Speaker 1: This is a painting within this world that it actually
exists in France, and then with the writer commentary, it
takes like a whole nother step back of like, Okay, well,
now that world isn't actually real in the world that
we live in Planet Earth, the one where a video
game creators made this video game, that's actually the real world,
which we obviously, well we can believe it's true. Maybe
we're all in a simulation.
Speaker 2: Who knows.
Speaker 1: I'm not going to go that deep on that kind
of layer, but to me that makes a lot of sense, Like,
you know, who are the ones who, uh caused the
house fire that you know led to versus death and
the splinter of this family. The writers of this game,
those are the people who are the ones who who
made that plot point happen. Obviously they made everything else
happen and everything that leads into that and the characters
reacting to that information the way they do. So there's
obviously a million layers to it, but in the same
way that like even once people know of like oh,
there's painters created this world, there's still like a disconnect
of like, Okay, well what is real?
Speaker 2: What isn't real? What is you know?
Speaker 1: Not all it's not You don't have one hundred percent
perfect information. Maybe Mael has pretty close to perfect information,
but like you know, Lune and see how they can
never truly understand what the real world outside of the
painting is like. Right, So there's always gonna be that
level of confusion obviouscation. And I feel like that's kind
of what they're hinting out there with the writer's storyline
and blaming the writers for the fire.
Speaker 2: That led to this kind of thing.
Speaker 1: And I think that's a that's a really cool thing
for the for the game developers and the writers to
be commenting on, and just like a third or a
fourth wall kind of breaking thing of just the different
layers of art and commentary on like what it's like
to get lost in a creative work. I definitely have
been at that. I feel like for me it is
kind of relatable in certain ways that there's been phases
of my life like when I was working you know,
cheap plug on my game potion problem here and like, yeah,
like I spent so much time just getting lost in
this world and thinking about this fantasy world, this creation
in my head, and how all this stuff connects in
ways that you know, people who even play the game
will not be able to fully pick up on that
because I'd never even put it in the game or something,
but just feel like getting lost in art for months
or weeks or years. I felt that too, like specifically
with writing, where it's like, man, if I just the
amount of time I've spent writing like specific stories that
are like set in like fantasy worlds, and like, man,
I'm just spending like hours and hours and hours outside
of the real world. You know, I'm just kind of
deep in this thing. And I thankfully I don't think
I've lost myself. You can tell me if I've lost myself,
because I've been ranting into a microphone for an hour now,
so maybe I have lost it. But I think that
commentary from the writers of like, you know, they probably
spent years and years and years writing this game getting
lost in this world, and you know, hopefully they haven't
lost themselves totally.
Speaker 2: They are doing good.
Speaker 1: They're nice and healthy and all that. But yeah, I
think that's definitely a relatable thing. For any artist to
get just completely lost in their art or feeling like
disconnected from the world outside of it because they're just
so invested in their creative pursuit. So I think it's
it's just amazing that this game is able to tackle
some of these themes that I can't say I've really
seen in like video games, let alone like movies or
other things. Like maybe I have seen hints of it,
but I think just the the metal layers that are
at play here, and like this game is silly, but
I think mostly when you get like metal layers and
video games, it's typically more like funnier kind of like
I think of like a Stanley Parable or something like that.
But I feel like for a game that's super serious
and dour and dark and grim like this, it's pretty
pretty rare to go into something like that. Usually you
stick within the fiction of the game. But I think
to take you know, that initial layer obvious gated out
to like the family who created this world that you're
playing in, and then like taking that out to like
the writers of the literal video game of the thing
that you're playing is it's just super super cool. So yeah,
I can't compliment this stuff enough, so I would love
like those two theories. My cyclical ending always leading to
the verse, so ending and this writer's thing. Please jump
in the discord, and Mike, if you're listening, let me
know what you think about these two thoughts, because I
haven't heard anyone else mention them, but I'm sure other
people have had these same thoughts as I have. So yeah,
I think those are two incredibly cool elements of the story.
Probably my favorite parts about the story. I think it
just makes me think about it so much more. I
think I should probably talk a little bit more about
some specific characters. I think, you know, another thing for
me in a lot of fiction is all critique that
you've probably heard me critique this on a movie review
or TV show review if you've seen or listen to
some of those reviews here at geek Verse. But for me,
you know, sometimes a lot of a big crutch that's
often used in writing in these movies and things is
just like, Okay, how do we want the viewer to
feel sympathetic for a character? Oh, they're their parent or
sibling or something died, And then we can immediately kind
of understand like, okay, they're in like this deep grief.
That's obviously something that's incredibly emotional to deal with, and
now we feel sympathy for them, and I think that's
that's kind of what this story is doing here, Like
Mael is someone and the rest of the family too,
like lost she lost her brother, you know, the parents
lost their son Cleia. You know, you don't really see
much of her like what she lost, but just because
she's such a minor part of the story. But you know,
that's the thing you used here as well as like
we don't actually know the real Verso and so we
can't really sympathize.
Speaker 2: Fully of like how they're feeling.
Speaker 1: You know, obviously we can, we can have an idea,
but we didn't really know that guy.
Speaker 2: We didn't know that kid.
Speaker 1: We're seeing like, you know, fading visions of him, shadows
of him in the painting, but we can't really understand
that fully because that's just not part of the story.
But I think instead to have Gustav be this character
who you know, that is the protagonist for the first
few hours.
Speaker 2: He has kind of.
Speaker 1: A brotherly slash like adoptive parent vibe for Mayl and
the fact that he eventually is killed off and after
we've built this big bond with him, we've grown to
love him. Obviously, he's voiced by Charlie Cox, so you
love him even more because of that. But we get
to see like how she feels about him. We get
to see that bond for hours and hours and hours.
They have multiple conversations, super emotional, and once again it
is that kind of hybrid of like a brother slash parent.
But I think when he finally does pass away and
then eventually get the reveals later on the story, it's
perfect of like, Okay, imagine how Mayl was feeling when
Gustav passed away. You can exactly graft that onto what
it was like for her to lose her actual brother
verso in the real world. And so I love that
they kind of took that of like here we'll set
up a bunch of the super emotional story stuff and
losing her brother, and like that's how she feels in
the real world, and that's what's led to some of
her choices and like being in this painting and wanting
to stay here at the end. And so I think
that's a really really clever way to go about that
kind of thing. But then also It's not like Gustav
is just a throwaway character either. Obviously you end up
playing the game for tens and or dozens more hours
after he does pass away, so it feels like a
lot more of the game happens without him. But yeah,
it definitely feels like that was purposeful to set up
how we're supposed to understand mael feeling about everything going
on here. So super cool, really well done, really creative
jumping into Lunae a bit. I think this is a
character and honestly, other than Mael, and like Verso and
the direct family members, I think there definitely could have
been a bit more with their story. Lunay is one
in particular that I think really early on it easy
to grab on her because she's such a cool character
in terms of her design, in terms of her move set,
and like her you know the fact that she flies
around and she has so many cool, like whimsical elements
about her. And I think, you know, a big part
of her story is that her parents were expeditioners and
they were you know, working on this technology that Lunae
is the one who's gonna take over and like finish
that for her. But they eventually you know, were old
enough that they had to go on an expedition and
try and do that thing, and eventually you get, like
with her side quest, you have to go after where
you can go and find her parents because Verso has
information about which I forget what expedition number it was,
but you can eventually get that information, find out which
when her parents were in and then you can go
and find like their last note about her. And this
moment hit really hard for me because when she finds
this last note, it is, you know, obviously she had
a closure. She kind of she didn't know I guess
one hundred percent, but she knew like ninety nine point
nine to nine and nine percent chance that they did
in fact die, but to get that closure of actually
finding their body and finding a note. But I think
it's kind of like a bittersweet moment because she talks
about how like their final note to her wasn't like oh, Lunae,
if you find this, we loved you so much, we're
so proud of you, or not even necessarily writing it
in the perspective that she would be the one to
find it and read it, but even like just talking
about we're so proud of our daughter, We love her,
But instead it's like the way she sees it is
that she wants or she felt like they wanted her
to They hope that she had lived up to their legacy,
or that she had justified their legacy by like finishing
their technology, their research and then like putting it into use,
and so it almost feels like, rather than them loving
her as a daughter, they just like saw her as
like a coworker or like someone who was, you know,
picking up the research that they had left off with.
And it's such a great bittersweet moment. But I also
feel like I think that it's a dialogue scene with
Verso where he kind of tells her like, hey, this
is kind of just you're kind of misreading this, Like
I think I think they do love you.
Speaker 2: I think this is almost maybe.
Speaker 1: Just some unresolved thoughts that you've had about them and
how they felt about you, and you're kind of projecting
that from like the final message, because it's not a
huge message.
Speaker 2: It's pretty pretty like a couple of paragraphs or something
like that. But I really like that dynamic. I think
it was really well done, gives Lune some depth.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I think she was like a very fun,
whimsical character, one who is like kind of just so
excited about finding the gesturals of these other discoveries in
the world. That really smart character and just obviously super
super cool. And then cl CL's character that I felt
like for the first few hours, I was like, what's
going on here? Like, I feel there's not much tour
you know, early on, she's kind of flirting a bit
with Verso and then you can obviously like hook up
with him and all that stuff, and it's like.
Speaker 2: Okay, is that all this story is. She's like a
just like a bit of a fling for Versos. What's
going on here?
Speaker 1: And I think as the story goes on, you get
more and more unleashed about her, And I think it
all really works because I think Luna is a character
who is very what's the word by the by the book,
Luna is a character who's like very on mission. You know,
even in like deep emotional moments when those happen in
my ales, like just just super distraught about what's happening.
Luna is like, yeah, I love that for you, but
like we gotta go right now, We got to move
on to the next thing.
Speaker 2: We don't have much time.
Speaker 1: We got to figure this out. She is so gold driven,
whereas cl does have that emotional side to her, and
I think it's probably because cl had more people in
her life where there was like love with those relationships.
Speaker 2: Dog just talked about her, like with Lune.
Speaker 1: You know, maybe there was some love there with her parents,
but it seemed like almost more of like a a
coworkers type relationship than it did like a love type relationship,
and cl obviously has a bit more of that.
Speaker 2: Also.
Speaker 1: One quick side thing about CL, I love that, like
it's a commentary or it's it's a common at some
point between her and Verso where he's like, oh, do
you use a scythe because like you were a farmer,
She's like yeah, It's like I love that. I think
it's a fun little side detail there. But yeah, with
cl Okay, so, she had this husband. It's like a
really traumatic death because obviously people are dying all the
time in this world. It's a world where everyone's had
to learn and get super good at grieving.
Speaker 2: But she loses her.
Speaker 1: Husband in an accident outside of the gomage and so
it feels like, you know, she even commented she's like
I was supposed to have six more ears, and that's
we're going back to like the paintress, and the way
she kills people off is like feels fair.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: It's like everyone in the world like knows exactly how
long you should have. But there are still people who
are going to die outside of the gomage. Like obviously
on the expeditions, a lot of people are dying technically
before their time. You know, they're almost there anyway, so
it's like maybe a little bit more justified. But I
think even one of the journals is like someone from
like an infection or something like that. But in the
case of Pierre CIL's husband, like he died on this misadventure,
wasn't even like a yeah, expedition, he just died. I
think he was going to an island or something like that,
and she was supposed to have more time with him.
She was pregnant at the time, but was just so
distraught that she was trying to kill herself, so she
just swam off into the ocean to try and drown herself,
swim out so far, but eventually was was saved in
like a miracle way. And then I love that, you know,
cel when she first joins up with the party, or I.
Speaker 2: Guess when you first got Ska. There's like a funny.
Speaker 1: Little connection there, like they know each other, recognize each other,
but like they can't really tell exactly how. I love
that there's that reveal happens like tens of hours later
that Eska was the one that found her swimming off
to try and kill herself, and he saved her and
brought her back, which was just such a such a cute,
little full circle moment of that wasn't like a threat
I was thinking about. I wasn't thinking about like how
did she survive that. I was like, oh, yeah, it's
just some magic. I don't know whatever. Maybe she just
got lucky the wave pushed her back in. But I
think it was such a great connection that Eska was
the one on who's always just been like a sweetie
and there to save people and you know, kept verso company.
I think SKay was like versus stuffy stuffed animal in
the real world, so obviously just like is there to
comfort That's like the purpose of a stuffed animal, and
like that's kind of the role he takes as a
character within the game two and add some just lightheartedness,
some silly factor on top of it, which you know
the Gestrils do.
Speaker 2: In general.
Speaker 1: I love the Gestrils, super funny, tons of great dialogue
in there, a lot of funny references I was finding
in ran random areas and all of them up through
like these different things. And I think the idea of
the afterlife or like them having reincarnation, that's something I
wondered for many hours in this game, is like, Okay,
when the expeditioners die, do they get revived like in
the light, in the body of a Gestural and like
maybe their memories get wiped enough that like they obviously
can't remember their human body and like be like, hey,
my name is Jim from Expedition, you know sixty two,
Like I'm actually in this Gestrils body now, It's not
like quite that obvious.
Speaker 2: But that was something I was wondering, was if what
they're leading up to the whole game.
Speaker 1: And I don't think that was a reveal, and maybe
it is deep in some notes somewhere, but yeah, I
think they just such a fun dynamic. I love the
town going around, talk everyone, see all the goofy stuff
they're doing, even like the big sacta patat that they
set up.
Speaker 2: They're like their ultimate siege weapon.
Speaker 1: Which is obviously just so flawed and at any moment
is like set up to accidentally self implode any given moment.
So I think, you know, the game is super funny,
whether it's like the mind fights that have like this
deep French accordion music going on there, the silly outfits,
the silly things that you're countering, or just like straight
up funny lines of dialogue. Really, you know, it could
have made the game feel super messy because like, oh,
you have super deep, deep, dark, serious themes, you have
super funny light moments what's going on here? But it's
somehow they find the perfect balance. So show outs to
the writers. You know, their family hates the writers because
they burn their house down, But I love the writers.
I think they wrote an outstanding work here. Let's see
who else Monoco. You know, I think I mentioned this already,
but like him being like the family dog, I think
it's a really fun element, and and like the collect
them all like pokemon ness to his move set was
like a really fun thing of building that up. Story wise,
I don't know if there's like too much there. I
think that like there's there's a bluntness to him that
is funny and confusing. Obviously it's like why he's a
weird creature. But it's like, okay, this is like the
mind ish of a dog brought to life in a
weird way. But he always just wants to fight everyone,
always looking to pick a fight, which you know, a
lot of dogs will just bark at, you know, inanimate objects,
and so obviously that makes a lot of sense for
a character who is based off a dog. Renoir is
a character who you know definitely makes a lot of
sense by the end, and I think, you know, he
definitely sets up the player to choose the vers so
ending when they finally get to that point and justifying
it and be like, you know, Eli mal I was
about to say, Lasia, but I guess it's kind of both,
Like you gotta choose the real world eventually, you do
got to come back, and that's something that I, you know,
I just don't understand, Like I just don't know how long,
like with with Ellen, how long she's been inside the
painting as the paintress, I don't know what that equates
to in real world time. Like I can't tell if
it's like hours and like an insane sort of way,
or if it has straight up dragged on for years,
then like, I don't know, how would you not like
die like Starvations, I don't know how the rules all
work there, But I think Renoir is a character who's
very practical but also very cutthroat.
Speaker 2: And also holds back of a lot of information.
Speaker 1: But it was like a really good villain obviously voiced
by Andy Circus there so just one of the best
actors in the world, such a well rounded guy who
can do all sorts of stuff, but he is great
at being a menacing villain type, which leads me into
a lean the mom the Paintress. This is a character
that I think they should have maybe added a bit
more to her, because obviously that's like the that's like
the goal for the whole game is take out the
Paintress or for most of the game, and eventually you
find out why that can't be the case. But yeah,
I think I wanted a bit more characterization of her,
her personality, maybe getting a few more scenes there other
than just like you know, you get a lot of
scenes of like Renwar walks through the front door of
the manner and you see like her faceless body along
with Alicia in the door or something like that, but
you don't really get a lot of dialogue sequences.
Speaker 2: And I don't know.
Speaker 1: I think I think given how important she is to
the story, I think I maybe wanted a bit more
of that. So once again, maybe there is some other
story stuff hidden notes somewhere, or maybe there are some
side quests in the game that would like jump back
into that, but like she wouldn't be in the painting anymore,
so I don't know exactly how that will work, but
I think that was maybe the one character that I
felt like needed a bit more sauce, because even like
Clea the Sister, like, I don't think she really needed
more sauce. I just don't really know what her purpose
was at all then to be in the game, And
so I might be missing something there. Let me know
if I'm missing any any cool details. And then yeah,
I think verso like just this this guy who is
eventually like learns that he is a clone of someone
but he's not real, but yet the world feels so
real to him and he can be a bit of
this guide. I think he you know, for the first
couple hours after he took over as the kind of
the main character. I mean, I guess Act two is
named Verso, right, so he kind of becomes a protagonist.
He's the one you're at camp with, walking around talking
to people. As for the first couple hours, I was like,
I don't know I'm feeling about Versa. Eventually I just
warm up to him as a character. Think he's fun.
Obviously another great voice performance there, but yeah, I still
I think maybe part partly because of his move set
is when I didn't get as to attack as attached
to because I just didn't use him in combat a
whole lot other than like when I really needed to,
and then like certain story beats, i'd put him in
there because it just felt right, But for the most
probably kind of keep him on the side. And you know,
I think that's okay. But I think he definitely like leads,
he's that perfect bridge to like lead into my LB
and the clearly the protagonists of this game. And like
voice by I think Jennifer English as their name, who
also did Shadow Heart and boulders Gate three, and like,
god damn, what an amazing actress, just like the she
has so much Gravitaster her characters, because shadow Heart I
think was my favorite character, and boulders Gate three as well,
so obviously mixture of my ol and like those those
bloody writers, but like what a what a god like
combo those two things can be all right. I don't
know what else I have to say about this game.
I feel like there are definitely more things. I have
a few more notes here, but I think I've kind
of hit on the big things. I mean, maybe the
last couple of notes here. Music is outstanding, like such
an amazing job. I'm definitely gonna be adding a lot
of these songs into my playlist and listening to some
of these things on repeat. But like the way some
of these music beats chart up with like the credits roll,
super emotional stuff like and then, but also can be
like fun and playful, just tons of variety there, super
super good. I adore the frenchness of this game, you know,
as someone who learned French in school as a Canadian
for like ten, ten or eleven years, you know, I
don't have per French anymore, but I can like a
lot of the words I recognize. I'm like, oh, that's
a funny name. For this kind of thing and other
things I you know, can't remember the translation of anymore,
but there was enough in there. There was like, oh,
that's just a funny name that sounds like a good
you know, RPG boss end of me. But also Doubles
is like a goofy like word in French or a
goofy phrase in French. I you know, how you can
get like the bag at costume, the mime stuff, like
the outfits.
Speaker 2: I just love that, you.
Speaker 1: Know, you don't don't see a lot of games that
are just like so incredibly French. You know, maybe get
like Civilization where you can play as France or something,
but I feel like to have an FRPG, like a
French RPG is really cool, and I think I love
that they leaned into it, whether with like the art
style with kind of some of the vibes of the
music and the enemy design, the names, or just like
the art otherwise, like this game is so jam packed
with aren't artists touch a painter's touch everywhere you look,
whether it is like the the art style of the enemies,
which is always fun to like when you go back
to the manner and you can see that people have
been like sketching out these paintings essentially around the house,
and those are the creatures that get brought into the world.
There's just such a never, never ending like praise for
this game. It's so great, there's so much to it.
I'm really excited to see kind of where it lands
a with like game of the Year stuff for certain people,
and most like you're just whatever the studio is next.
I'm like on board, which I feel like has been
the case for a lot of people. I've said, this
is a first game, so you couldn't have been a
fan previously in the studio because it didn't exist. But like,
whatever they make next, I can't wait to see what
it is. Because this game from the very first trailer,
which like, here's a badass premise and we're gonna deliver
the heck out of that premise and then offer so
much more and as I mentioned some of these like
fourth Wall like really deep interesting thoughts about the creation
of art and obsession. Like I feel like this game
just goes so deep in so many ways. And then
it has like an outsiding you know, combat system, which
is like just makes RPG term based combat more fun
and fresh and fast paced with like I didn't really
talk about the free aim things. I think I talked
about it in the first episode I did on Exhibition
thirty three, the non spoiler episode, But like, just such
an in depth great system there, and like all these
characters and all the depth, So I certainly have missed
some things. So maybe I might have an epilogue sequence,
you know, just like this game does if I forgot
of any thoughts that I'll make a little add on
episode after or something like this. But yeah, like, please
jump in the discord if there's anything I forgot or
things you want to talk about more or responses. Please
I want to hear your thoughts on my theories that
I brought up here.
Speaker 2: I love this game.
Speaker 1: I'm definitely gonna keep playing it, you know, do some
more of these boss fights and things like that. And yeah,
I just just absolutely dodore this game, really curious to
see if it shakes out. Is my personal game of
the year right now, it's number one, but yeah, there's
some other big hitters coming out later in the year,
so we'll see where it winds out, winds up, I
should say at the very end of it, but thank
you everyone for listening to this big juicy spoiler episode,
and uh yeah, we continue.