Speaker 1: I'm on our show today, Justin Brown, and he has
a podcast that I actually really dig see what they
did there, the dig Bible podcast, And I just wanted
to welcome, welcome to our show today, and we just
want to pick his brain about a lot of really
interesting stuff. We're mostly going to hone in I think
on you know, drug use, formakia, stuff like that, how
it affects seeing in the spirit world. But Lindsey and
I are more than ready to go wherever the Holy
Spirit wants to go and to interview this fascinating guy
here Justin. Tell us your story a little bit. Just
start out, you know what you came from? Where you're
at now? Your testimony, I guess is the word for it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, what's uh? It's pretty Uh, it's like a seesaw.
I started on. I'm Southern, you know, Southern Baptist raised,
you know the Bible Belt.
Speaker 1: Where are the South? Are you from? I was Tennessee, Oh, Tennessee. Okay,
say any thought you're from Alabama because you have kind
of an Alabama twang too, So.
Speaker 2: Oh I do, I got it, I own it. But
uh yeah, but I went to church every Sunday, you know,
good godly family is there every time the doors were open.
I was raised right. Uh, just always had a fascination
with the Word of God. I remember being four and
five years old, and I was that kid in Sunday
school that would raise his hand and ask all these questions.
I probably got on my Sunday school teacher's nerves, but
I was always just really fascinated with it. And everybody
always said that I was going to be called to preach,
you know, because I just had such a fascination with it.
And like, for instance, like an example, my grandmother, good
godly woman. She would always take me to school and
she told me, and it was kindergartener, first grade, she said,
I'll never forget it. She said, I was taking you
to school. You were just staring out the window. She said.
I was like justin you know, what are you looking at?
And I looked at her and I was like, just
a creation. I don't see how anybody can see all
the beautiful things that God has created and deny that
there is a divine hand, you know. So it's like
my mind is not your typical, you know, six seven
year old kid. But you know, there was always church
drama and church file out and it hit our family
and we just kind of quit going to church. And
I was probably ten twelve years old, and long story short,
by the time I got my driver's license and got
the keys of the car, I just went into total rebellion,
started getting into drugs. I wanted to run around with
the cool crowd, and next thing you know, I wasn't
just in the cool crowd. I was leading that cool crowd.
You know, I'd become really good at being bad. But
looking back, it's like I had so many friends overdose
right in front of me, doing the same amounts of
stuff that I was doing. Had many friends dying car
wrecks and pass away. And I had one friend that
ended up being a quadriplegic from the neck down and
was bedridden for like fifteen years before he finally succumbed
to some kind of sickness.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 2: And they were a lot less severe wrecks than the
ones I've had. I remember one time I rolled off
the side of the mountain. I flipped the car three
times and landed on its top. It's moshed like a pancake,
and I hit a tree on the driver's side door
and it broke the car in half. I didn't have
a seatbelt on. I was getting through around that car
the whole way down, walked away without a scratch. And
it's just crazy looking back now, the divine protection that
I had over my life. And it's not because I'm
just so special. It's just because I had a good
firm foundation and praying parents and grandparents. You know, you
can easily say, yeah, I was just lucky, you know.
I mean that was God and.
Speaker 1: A father that loves you a lot, you know, yes,
heavenly Father, yep, yep.
Speaker 2: And ended up, you know, going through divorce, and I
started trying to straighten my life out. And that's when
I went through my divorce because the party was still
going strong for her and I wasn't the fun guy
no more. Started getting my life straightened out. Man met
a good godly woman because God is perfect timing. She
you know, I've always heard it said of a good
woman to make a man better, and that's true. Yeah,
it was probably twenty ten, maybe I discovered Tray Smith
and his videos on YouTube just blew my mind and
it resparked that that loved for the word of God
in me, and I just started studying like crazy and
then bumped into Mike Kaiser started reading his books. It
just lit a fire under me, guys, and I could
stop and here we are. You know, quite a few
years later and hundreds of books later, I wanted to
share that with other people, you know. So I tried
to start a small group and in Hite of like
fifteen twenty guys that I knew, four guys showed up
and after a three meetings, my buddy Stephen was like, man,
we should be recording this stuff. We should do a podcast.
I was like, no, I've never even listened to a podcast.
I mean, I know they talk, but that's about it.
But here we are. I think we started in May
and God's blessed it and it's just something we enjoy. Man,
it's just fun, which I'm sure you guys can identify
with that.
Speaker 3: I think it's cool that that started as just a
small group meeting gonna morphed into.
Speaker 1: Podcast.
Speaker 2: Man.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a new one. I've never heard that one before.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: That's what Lindsey and I do outside of podcasting, is
we plant We call them Kingdom communities. I'm actually an
ordained Anglican priest and I don't really do much with
that at all, because a lot of my theology has changed,
you know, in those days. But we we plant what
we call it, they're really house churches, but we plant
just small kingdom communities, uh, in the Mississippi Delta and
all around Mississippi right now. And we're part of a
big missionary organization. So we understand what you're talking about.
You get a good group of people together, you know,
and the chemistry is really right. The Holy Spirit is
just there. It's like Jesus said, where two or three
are gathered together, he is in the midst of them.
And so that's just that is a really cool genesis
of your of your podcasting career. So that's cool. Y'all
just started in May. Really Yeah, and y'all exploded, man,
I mean you have, like I'm telling you, I.
Speaker 2: Mean, it's blew my mind. I mean, it's just the
guests that we've had and the the people that's just
jumped on board with us. It's God. I mean, there's
no other explanation for it. Extremely just to be able
to participate.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm friends with Chris Probace on Camp Harman on
on Facebook. Yeah, he's good dude. And and I just
you know, I was struggling with like, how do you
get people on your show, you know, with topics blah
blah blah. And he said, look, you have not because
you asked not basically, you know, it is just just
ask people. And now they're already you know, he didn't
say this, but they're already saying no. You know, if
you don't ask them, so you might as well let
them tell you if if they can't.
Speaker 2: So.
Speaker 1: But yeah, we've we've enjoyed the journey here. We have
a lot to talk about it. I mean, I really
we really want to pick your brain on some some
stuff because this is something that's been fascinating to us.
Number one, coming out of the the drug community here,
and and then me a little bit of my background.
I went through a massive, major depressive disorder which I'm
still quote diagnosed with it unquote, and I had to
take medicine or I would have died. And and so
it was like I really struggled with it because a
lot of my background, and in Lindsey's too, is we're
we come from the charismatic background, and and some good
part of it and some bad part of it. We've
heard the whole don't take medicine. You know, you need
to believe for your healing and stuff like that, which
is true and in different circumstances. But we're we're really
interested in picking your brain about a lot of this
kind of stuff, and particularly talking about little that's where
we really we're really interested in that.
Speaker 2: I tell my wife all the time that you know,
humanity is a very prideful creature. And uh, you know,
if if you ever find that somebody says this is
the way it is, you think that this is the
way it is. God is somewhere in the middle. Yeah, know,
his thoughts are not your thoughts. His ways are not
your ways. So it's like, yeah, there's a lot of
people that says, you know that medicine is the devil.
You know, you should partake in it, and there's other
people that says, no, you should trust in science. I'm
the guy that's kind of in the middle. I mean,
God is the creative of all things. He gave us
medicines and plants and all this stuff for us to use.
But were humanity messages up is where we abuse things.
Speaker 1: It's like it's our intent. It all comes back to
our intent. Am I using this medicine to am I
using DMT to alter my state to get into see
spiritual things? Or you know, or am I taking this
antidepressant to help me through a season. I'm not a
big guy that could is staying on things forever and
all that kind of But yeah, I think Lindsey and
I both sit right where you are. My biggest argument
and I don't like to argue anymore. I used to.
I used to just argue, are you argue? And I
just I just quit because it didn't get anywhere a
lot of times, you know. Yeah, but my biggest argument
was always well, you're wearing glasses, I mean glasses. Why
don't you take your glasses off and read your Bible?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: You know, what's the difference in that? In medicine, you've
given a prescription for your glasses. And usually that kind
of stumps people a little bit. They're like, yeah, you know,
he's kind of right. You know, not all science is bad.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, like you said, it's intent, you know, it's
like the people that really harp on the wall.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: The one thing I always ask to my mother, well,
I bet you one hundred dollars. I don't even see
what you're wearing right now. But I about guarantee you
that you're in violation of that wall that you hold
up so near and dear. Perhaps you're probably wearing two
different types of fabric. You've probably cut your hair, shaved
your beard. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Well, and you can't just stone anybody. I mean that's huge.
I mean, that's the question I want to ask people.
I've Yeah, this is that's another whole podcast, just going.
These Hebrew, Hebrew Roots and Sacred Name people have been
giving me fits on the internet and and they make
me want to learn to argue again, and I just
I just blow it away. I just blow it off.
I mean I just uh, I pray for them, and you.
Speaker 2: Know that's really all you can do. Man.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because a lot of us developed into a cult,
cultic not not not even I mean even Seven Day Adventists,
they were traditionally labeled a cult, but that they've kind
of pulled out of a lot of that cult trying
to become more mainstream. But but the Sacred Name Hebrew
Roots people there, they're full fledged. You know, we're we're
I mean there's even guys out there that say Paul
was a heretic. And yeah, I mean oh man, anyway, way,
off topic, let me shoot that rabbit. So anyway, so,
so tell me about one of the main reasons we
have you on here. The entity that was in your
dreams was it was a Lilith? And how did you
know this? Do you want to just tell the story
about your dreams first before we get into that.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, I was always, like I said, you know,
really close with God and had a love for the
word and far backs. I can remember. I was a
very just vivid dreamer, and I could control my dreams,
you know, a bad guy or whatever came in my dreams.
I could always turn into the superhero with the kve
and fly away, you know. I mean I could control
my dreams. And as I got older and started doing
you know, drugs and stuff like that, they kind of
it's like it tampered with that ability. Either I just
didn't dream as much anymore. I just couldn't remember them.
Speaker 1: M Well, what was your drug? What was your drug
of choice? I'm sorry to interrupt you, but what what
what was the primary drug use? Was it marijuana or
was it something stronger?
Speaker 2: Well, when I first started, honestly, it was it was
just pot. I liked pot. A lot, and then uh
experimented with some pills and stuff. But pot was always
my drug of choice for a very long time. And
it wasn't until uh, I'd say maybe junior. My junior year,
I got exposed to methan fetamine. Yeah, and at that
point I had always just done downers. So the first
time I ever did an upper, you know, I mean,
it was just like a total new thing for me.
And it was like and I struggled with ADHD. I mean,
I was diagnosed with it as a child, but my
mother said it made me a zombie.
Speaker 1: So hold on a second. I'm sorry to interrupt you.
I have to know this. I just got to know this.
Did you take a terall.
Speaker 2: On occasion? Yes?
Speaker 1: Okay, every This is amazing. I mean, I'm sorry when
we deal with the people that come through this place,
ninety percent of them that were hooked on myth took
out of all as kids.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because the thing is too is it's pharmaceutical grade
and fetamine that's all it is.
Speaker 1: It's a legal myth. Yeah, yeah, I never thought about it.
It's legal myth. Yep.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And so well, my mother took me off of it.
Then I found it later in my later years. And
of course you know, it made me hyper, but it
also it gave me like laser like focus m where
I couldn't sit still and pay attention in class. When
I was doing that stuff in class, I was homed in,
I was studying, I was taking notes, I was cleaning
my room, and I did I did. It really turned
me on. And I always like to draw. I always
was always kind of artistic, you know, so, and when
I would do that stuff, I would just set up
for hours and draw. But it was weird because where
I had that Christian foundation, I knew that it was wrong.
I knew it was wrong. But me and my friends
would have all night sermons. I'm not lying to you.
We'd be sitting there doing these drugs and I'd be
talking to them about God and creation. How can you
deny there's a God? You know, we getting these really
deep you know, theologian solving the problems of the world,
you know, late night hour stuff. But of course, you know,
a teenager, you know, you start looking you know, at
at at porn and stuff like that on the internet.
Well then my dreams I honestly started turning, you know
more more lucid, and I remember, I just had these
lucid dreams all the time. And once I actually started
you know, getting clean, getting my life together, and you know,
it's time to grow up, uh Met, My wife started
going to church, you know, getting my getting my act together,
so to speak. I started having some like really like
lower back pain. So I went to the doctor, you know,
to try to get some scan see what was wrong
with it, if I needed surgery or whatever, and he
tried to put me on antidepressants and I was like, no,
I said, I've read the side effects on that stuff.
I said, besides that, I'm not depressed, I'm hurting, and
he was. He kept pushing it, kept pushing it. He's like, well,
he said, if you're really hurting, then you'll try it.
He said, I'm telling you. He said, there's you know,
these helped with pain, but without all the side effects
of the narcotics. So at this point I was like,
you know, I'll give it a try. So I tried them,
and I took them for about a week or so,
and I just started having all these nightmares, I mean
just demonic nightmares. So then I go back and I
tell him, I'm like I'm not taking this stuff. I'm
getting nightmares. And he's like, well, it's probably the brand.
Let's try a different brand. And we went through I
think three different types, and finally that third type. I'll
never forget it. I mean, just thinking about it makes
the hairs on my arm stand up. I was in bed,
sleeping and I had this vivid dream. I was in
my truck driving down the road, had my wife and
kids in the car, and as we're driving, we're on
this little back road and I see this very huge,
almost like buzzard bent over in the road, like eating
on a like a dead deer or a dead carcass
of some kind. So I stopped the car and I
honked the horn at it, and you know, it's, you know,
really large, bent over and got black feathers in the
headlights of the truck. It's it's almost got a like
a purple shimmer or purple tips to the feathers. And
I remember this, it was just so vivid. So when
I honked the horn, it raised its head up and
then it stood up and it was, you know, five
and a half feet tall, and as it turned around,
and of course the headlights of the truck is shining
right at it. It was a naked woman in the
front with arms of a human, but legs and feet
of a bird, had long hair and a beak instead
of a mouth, and it looked right at me, and
I was just like frozen. I mean, you mean, I
couldn't move. And then all of a sudden, it just
swoops up into the air, and everybody in the vehicle's
freaking out, you know, and I'm leaning over everybody like
that's all right, guys, you know, it's gone. It's gone,
and I'm about to start taking off again, and then
just boom, it lands right beside the driver's side door
and it opens my car door. And at this point,
I'm trying to move. I can't move. I'm trying to yell.
I can't yell. It's like I'm petrified, you know, I
just dreaming puns exactly.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: And she opens the door and she leans in and
she puts her left hand on my inner thigh, and
then it takes her right hand and starts rubbing my
neck and chest and just just like fondling me, and
then leans in and opens its beak and sticks its
tongue out and starts rubbing the sides of my ears
and my neck and stuff. And I can control my eyes,
but that's the only thing I can control. And I
looked over and my wife and kids that are like frozen.
And then she whispers into my ear, I've missed you.
And I'm sitting here just freaking out, and I'm just
but I'm still having the internal dialogue in my head
and I'm just like, Jesus, Jesus, God, please help me, Jesus,
Jesus the name of Jesus, please help me. And I'm
just repeating this over and over and over in my head.
And eventually I can feel my fingers starting to move.
You know that numb and that numb tingling sensation you
get through your fingers and hands when they start to
go to sleep. That's what I started feeling. So my
fingers started moving and I could move my neck, and
then I was like, okay, I can move now, and
I lean over and just just I tried to do
as fast as I could, but I leaned over and
I grabbed the car door and I slammed her arm
and head into the car door. And when I did
it just let out this great screech. I mean that
would just pierce your ears and then flew up back
into the sky and outside. And then I woke up
just in a sweat, freaking.
Speaker 1: Plumb out, imagine. So that's creepy.
Speaker 2: And at this point, you know, I've been studying, you
know what I mean, I've been studying the word and
looking into stuff, deep diving, but I hadn't really been
like looking into like, you know, the demonic and all
this kind of stuff. So I was just like, you know,
this is just some kind of crazy, demonic dream. It's
just brought on by this medicine. So I immediately went
I just flushed that medicine down the commode, and I
told my wife about it, you know, and my wife
it scared her to death too. But my wife, she's
one of those she's got a dream book. She wakes up,
she writes her dreams down, the colors everything, all that stuff,
you know, she thinks holds significance. So I was telling
her about it, and she's like, let's look this stuff
up online and see what we can find. And so
she was looking up you know, birds, black and purple feathers.
She found, you know, purple was a color of royalty.
So and I was like, well, this is a I guess,
a high ranking demonic figure, you know. And then so
then I just started searching, you know, bird woman, you know,
or half woman, half bird, you know, and all this
stuff started searching up. I never even heard of Lilith
at this point, and then there the picture pops up
and it was her. I mean, there was no doubt
about it as soon as I seen it. And I
clicked the image and it said Lilith, the Demon, the
sheet Im and Lilith. So then I got to looking
into her, you know, and the whole incubus succubist thing.
And me and my wife went to a spiritual Warfare
conference back in October when we met Vicky Joy Anderson.
Because my wife, she deals with slip browless's quite off,
so she was actually really excited to talk to Vicky
Joy and she talked to her, and then I did too,
and I just started describing the dream that I had,
and immediately she stopped me and she said, you met Lilis,
And I said, I sure did, and she said that
she's working on a second book. She asked for my
permission to put that in her book. But yeah, it
was very scary at the time. But it was even
more scarier once I realized who I was dealing with,
who was trying to get at me. And now looking
back all those lucid dreams that I had had, I
think it was her then too, in disguise m because
she said I've missed you.
Speaker 1: Yeah, like she had a past with you.
Speaker 2: Yes, And I hadn't seen her had any of them
dreams in a long time.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Wow, Yeah, that's uh, that's something else. Man.
Speaker 3: It's been different if you had studied or read about
Lilith before and then that'd be an easy explanation.
Speaker 1: But you didn't.
Speaker 2: No, I had no.
Speaker 1: Idea did I was gonna ask you after after this occurred,
did you have any more instances of it or any more?
I mean, what did you do to prevent this from
happening again? That's probably a better question, better framed question there.
Speaker 2: And honestly, I think it was it was the medicine,
because that's the only thing that I was doing different,
you know. I mean, of course, you know I prayed
up and uh, it was more I guess, uh only
alert about it, But it was it was the medicine.
I swear I think the medicine just kind of weakened
to be enough to where she could get to me again,
because all the other times I dealt with her was
during weak in states of mind, when I was, you know,
on all these drugs and stuff.
Speaker 3: Yeah, kind of I was going to ask, what do
you think about the drugs you were on? You know,
because people who don't take these medicines encounter them to
what do you think it is about the drugs that
makes you more and these particular drugs that makes you
more susceptible to these sorts of things.
Speaker 2: Well, my opinion, honestly is there's some people, and I
guess I could call it, you know, you know, fruits
of the spirit and gifts of the spirit that are
more in tune with the supernatural and the spirit realm.
My wife being.
Speaker 1: One of them, like sears. I mean, I believe in that. Yeah,
seers still exists. They're not all new age, you know.
Speaker 2: No. And my wife she can, honestly like she can
sense you know, dark or evil people or situations. I mean,
we talked about this one time in one of our
episodes that we had with her, because she's done a
lot of missionary work. We were at a flea market
one time, and she saw some of those salt crystals
and stuff supposed to help you with sciences and all
this kind of stuff. And she's like, I'd like to
go in there and look around. They say that stuff
really helps with sinuses and all this kind of stuff.
So we walk in, and I'm not lying, we steck
one foot inside of this place, and she immediately stops
and she just starts shaking our hands and she says, ooh,
what you know. I thought she'd about to get sick
or pass out or something. And she's like, I just
feel so heavy right now. She said there's something dark
in here. She said, something demonic. She said, a witchcraft.
She says, I have to get out here. She said,
I'm going to be sick. And she turned around, and
I was going out of the store with her, and
as I was turning around, the very back of the building,
on the one of the racks was Ouiji boards and
rooms and all this kind of stuff. I mean, she
didn't see that stuff. She felt it. But I think
some people just got that gift for that thing. But
I mean, if you look at guys, I mean, this
is a multi dimensional place which we live. Yeah, we
share this realm with many spirits and entities. We just
can't see them. You know. It's like we have a
veil over our eyes. I firmly lead the drugs remove
and weaken that fail. You know. Uh like for example, uh,
like a testa rat, you know, a tests are at
You know, when you talk about dimensions, they're essentially directions.
You know, a piece of paper, you can draw a
line straight across, and you can draw a line up
and down X and y axis. A piece of paper
is only two dimensions. You know. In real life we
can also go forward and backwards. You know. This is
what gives us our depth perception. You know, so humanity
sees in three directions or three D three dimensional. You know,
this is all that we can perceive. You know, just
because we can't see something due to id limitations doesn't
mean that it's not there.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: You know, like if like me, for instance, I drew
on a piece of paper figure of a boy and
a stick figure of a girl, and we'll call Tom
and Sally. They're there in their two dimensional world. I'm
right in front of them. In my three dimensional world,
I can get face to face with them and they
can never see me. And even Tom if Tom could
turn his head and see Sally, he would just see
a straight line because he's in a two dimensional world.
You know. I could even take my pencil and stab
through that piece of paper and all he would see
is a circle coming at him, getting bigger, and then
fading away. There's so many dimensions. It's just we are
limited to that. And I swear I think that comes
back to Adam and Eve. You know, when they ate
the apple, it says their eyes were opened, you know.
In other words, I believe that their eyes, their human eyes,
were open to a three D world. They were exiled
from the fourth, fifth, maybe even sixth dimension.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it's been long speculated that, you know,
they say we only use this, well, I forget what
percentage certain percentage of our brains, and that possibly Outam
an Eve used those those other percentages before they fell.
And the other thing I wanted to bring up to
is I'm studying William Ramsey's books right now and I'm
on the first one about Crowley. It's not a coincidence
to me really looking at him, but even going back
thousands and thousands of years that most occultic rituals have
some sort of a drug involved, whether it's Native American,
the Beast himself, you know, or even people nowadays. The
big thing I think today is Ian tea.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and Alasco that's a big thing coming coming out.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Now all the Indians use that stuff to you know,
to communicate with the divine.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, And so yeah, you're right, there's something about
that that just takes the veil because it's really thin.
I mean, I read a guy several years ago named
Dallas Willard, and he really opened me up to the
nearness of the Kingdom of God. I used to always think,
like when I would read the Book of Hebrews and
would say, there were surrounded by a great cloud of witnesses,
that we were like in some kind of colisseum, and
they were all looking down at the earth and all this,
and I start I started to realize that, no, we're
really literally surrounded by a great cloud of witnesses. These
people are literally around us. They're just in an extra
dimension that we can't see, like your example of Tom
and you you know, and and the Kingdom of God
is at hand, and there's all these thin spaces and
in places. That's what the Celts used to call it
then spaces in places where where it's so thin that
it's like it wasn't eden. I think drugs are an
illegal so to speak, way to get into that dimension,
you know, without going through the legal way, which would
be a God given gift, you know, like your wife.
Speaker 2: Well, even look at your eye, you know what I mean.
If you're looking at an apple, you see it as red. Well,
physically that apple is not red. That color is every
single color of the spectrum except red. Your eye picks
up the color that that object rejects. Your eye is
basically a transmitter, and your brain is the computer, you know.
You know, doctor Sir John Eckles, he said, the human
brain is a machine that a ghost can operate. You know.
The body is a vehicle, and the soul or the
conscience if you want to call it, it is the driver. Yeah.
So if you're not behind the wheel, who's driving exactly?
Speaker 1: Exactly? And sometimes we're driving and when we have somebody
in the passenger seat with us that we don't need
to need to have, you know, it's telling us where
to go.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: But yeah, that goes back to Sadie And I've been
doing a law study and on frequency and sound, and
and that that's all intertwined, you know, because color is
a frequency too, and the occult knows how to manipulate
all that. That just comes back down from I wasn't
going to bring it up, but Genesis six when the
Watchers gave all this knowledge to us, Yeah, we.
Speaker 2: Got to bring.
Speaker 1: Yeah every episode. Yeah, Well, I mean it's the different sciences.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you have the cutting of roots like the Book
of Enoch cause it you know, they talked to stuff.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yep, yep, definitely. So Lizzie, did you have a
question you want to ask him?
Speaker 3: Well, I was gonna ask did you see anything other
than Lilith? Do you see any other entities beings that you.
Speaker 1: Well, any of them, any of your any if you've
seen anything else, were they benevolent? That's that's my part
of the question.
Speaker 2: Well with me, it's like like I was talking about,
you know, there are some people that's more sensitive to
it and stuff like that. Uh. Either I am just
not really that sensitive to the spiritual spirit realm, or
or honestly I had with all the drug abuse, I
have desensitized myself. Uh. I remember when I was younger,
I used to look for the supernatural I was that guy,
and honestly that that would play with a wichi board
and hope for something. I was the guy that would
watch all the hauling shows, go to these haunted houses
and stuff to try to see something, and never would.
But now I have had experiences, you know, uh, with
with certain drugs, with with with people and being up
for two three days with no sleep and nothing to
eat and see the shadow people mm hm, and hear
people walking through the house and you know, peeking out
the blinds and all that stuff, you know, and everybody
just you know takes that to well know, you're just
you know, they caught you know, your tweaking. You know,
you ain't had any sleep or nothing to eat. Your
mind's playing tricks on you. But it's it's funny how
that correlates with with sleep paralysis and all these people,
because what they all say, they say they see shadowy
apparitions and and the hat people. Yeah, I mean I
think they're connected too.
Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely nept from mind.
Speaker 3: I had the little just the paralysis version. I know,
I don't know why. I'm glad I didn't see anything.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you know, my my wife and now she
gets some quiet off and she'll have them where they
sit on the edge of the bed, scratch her back,
jump over the top of the bed, back and forth,
and just you know, toy with her. Honestly, one night
she had one, and I was actually home because I've
worked night shift most of my life, so she has to,
you know, be here by herself a lot. But I
was actually home. I think it might have been a weekend,
and I was in the living room playing Call of
Duty or something like that, was playing some kind of
video who game, and I heard her like moaning and
like tuesseling in bed. So I went to go check
on her, and I'm I'm not crapping you. I walked
down the hallway and she had a little lamp on
beside the knights dam because she would always she always
sits up and reads till she nods out. So I
walked into the bedroom. I mean I literally just entered
the threshold of the door, and when I did, she
like jumps up out of bed, like she just was
sprung loose, I guess, but she just like set up.
She sprung up real fast and took a huge gasp
from when she did. The light bulb blue and I
saw that Wow, there ain't no you know, this was
somebody's mind playing tricks. I don't know. I was a
third party and I witnessed. It's like me walking in
the room startled it or severed its connection and like
I don't know, maybe it taking off and leaving the
room so fast it sucked the energy out of the
room and killed the ball. M wild stuff.
Speaker 1: That is wild stuff.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, just because you don't see it don't mean
it ain't there. And what's crazy is like when you
used research, especially like the tests are at you know,
this is scientific geometry and stuff. You know, these are
the science guys. They they say, plainly, that's how they
described the tests. Rat they say, you know, just because
you can't see it, you know, it doesn't mean that
it's it's not there.
Speaker 3: Well, Carl Sagan, who didn't really believe as far as
he knew in a spiritual world, still believed there must
be some other Yeah, he used it.
Speaker 1: I watched an old.
Speaker 3: Video of him. It was that guy that was a
billions and billions and billions guy.
Speaker 1: That was kind of his thing.
Speaker 3: But yeah, he he talks about that. And but as
a materialist doesn't believe in anything spiritual. I don't know
how that works, but yeah.
Speaker 2: And how do you guys ever actually looked into the
tests are at.
Speaker 1: No, I'm going to have that out.
Speaker 3: Just taking video a little bit. He did something along
those lines.
Speaker 2: Is it's more than a box in a madel movie.
But it's uh, you know, it's it's basically a cube
and they show you, you know how you know, we
perceive it in a two dimensional or a three dimensional world,
you know, but if it's separated a cube, it you know,
it's six shapes in a two dimensional space, six shapes
compiled into one. Well then that turns into eight in
a three dimensional space, and and it makes a cross.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's unfolding the cube and the way they
draw it in their geometry and everything else. It's across.
Speaker 1: You see. I wonder back to the drug thing, if
if we can see into more dimensions, not just the
spirit realm, so to speak, but into into more dimensions
with drug use, you know, if that's a possibility, I
think so.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because me and I used to experiment. I mean
I I've experimented with a lot of stuff. Uh, And
I had one friend in particular, me and him would
like to, you know, take trips. Ever so often we
just you know, talked about that. But me, I never
had any religious experience with it. And I honestly believe
it's because I had a good firm foundation. Now I
know some people saying, oh, well, you're talking about having
a good firm foundation and doing drugs. I was the
prodigal son embodied. I wasn't doing what I needed to
be doing. But I knew right from wrong. I knew,
you know, I mean, the foundation was there, but this
other friend of mine, the foundation wasn't. So me, I
would see, you know what I mean. I'd see the
carpet rolling a conveyor belt, or the wills melt, you know,
or the stars dancing the sky, you know, little stuff
like that. But my other friend, he would see shadowy figures, numbers,
beings appeared to him and talk to him. And I'll
never forget it. I'll never forget it. One night, h
after tripping, when he come back to and it could
actually you know, talking form of conversation, he was like,
oh man, he said, said I had the most beautiful vision.
He said, he said, if it wasn't God, it was
an angel, you know, And all this stuff, and this
was a guy that, you know what I mean, didn't
really profess God, you know what I mean, right, And
and I'm like, well, well did you see And he
was like, I seen this dark apparition. He's like a
shadowy figure. And they were dancing in front of me,
he said, and kind of twisting side to side, and
he was sitting there mimicking it. And it looked like
a serpent twisting, and he said. And they were dancing
and weaving their head side to side and twisting, and
he said, and walking towards me. And in their hand
they had a ball of light, he said. And as
they were twisting and coming up to me, they extended
the ball and thrust it into my chest, he said.
And I immediately, he said, just felt warmth, he said,
all threw out my body. I felt my toes tingling,
and the hair on my head standing up, he said,
he said. And I was just glowing with light, he said.
And it was the most beautiful and peaceful, just grand
thing that that ever felt, he said, he said. And
I was just basking in it like I was basking
in the sun, he said. And I had my eyes closed,
he said, And I went to open my eyes to
try to communicate with this thing, he said, and it
was gone, he said, in my life just faded away.
And I was like, dude, that wasn't know God and
no angel. I mean it was dark and it was
twisting at you like a serpent.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I mean that's that's what Scrapcher says.
Speaker 2: You know, Satan portrays himself as an angel of white.
Speaker 1: Well, if you've read Doug van Dorn's book on Giants,
you remember those pictures in that book about the what
the snakes they there, their their legs were snakes, the nephilem,
which that that just fascinates me. How it's cultural wide.
I mean, that's what I thought about when you were
when you were telling that that story. No, that that
was It might have been an angel, but it wasn't
a good one.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So and one thing too, I want to relay,
you know, to anybody listening. I'm not trying to glorify,
right drugs.
Speaker 1: No, we aren't either.
Speaker 2: It's very humbling for me to even say these things
because I'm so not proud of them. But with that
being said, I'm hoping if somebody hears this that's just
now starting to dabble or know, somebody get out why again? Yeah,
And I'm choking up as I say this.
Speaker 3: Sorry, it's okay, man.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I had a lot of friends that wasn't as
lucky as I was. And you've got a father that
loves you. M you don't want you in that crap. Yeah,
and you've got a lot higher purpose that said around
just get high.
Speaker 1: Yeah yep.
Speaker 3: Well, right before you got on, we were talking a
little bit because I was reading about him, just because
they both had anyway back during the whole Jesus Freak
Jesus People movement in the sixties and seventies, when the
hippies were starting to come to faith in Christ. You
had Keith Green, he was a musician and big in
that movement. And then you had Lennie Frisbee, who he's
in a movie that just came.
Speaker 1: Out they did about revolution. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Revolution.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Both of them talk about experiences with acid and Keith Green.
I never took acid. I had friends who did. But
Keith Green's situation, he referred to it as a bad trip.
I read a read a biography years ago, but he
said the Lord still kind of in the midst of
all that darkness, kind of came to him, and it
was before he had fully committed to the Lord, but
was kind of on the the way, I think, if
I remember correctly, and just comforted him and was there.
And in Lonnie Frisbee's case, and he was a much
more controversial figure, and I don't think he ever necessarily
said he wasn't. But in his case, you know, it
wasn't necessarily a bad trip. But you know, he claimed
the Lord kind of revealed himself to him while he
was on acid and brought him out of that. Yeah,
we got to meet us in any state and we're
in and you know, it's it's not hopeless.
Speaker 2: I guess I wanted to.
Speaker 1: Well, do you remember that time we were out prayer
walking in Yazoo and and that that guy was drunk
on the porch and we prayed for him and he
sobered up? You remember that. I mean, I may not
have been with y'all for that one, but but obviously,
see God, you know he's he's he's in the miraculous business.
So he can do Yeah, he can appear in an
LSD trip. And that's why I was asking earlier if
you if you had ever encountered anything benevolent. It's it's
hard to tell though when That's why you should even
really even dabble in that world is because you don't
have the word of God there to help you discern
what what am I? What am I experiencing exactly?
Speaker 2: And that's why he tells you not to. You know,
we can't care the difference. We judge too much things
on feelings, what feels good, you.
Speaker 1: Know, emotions. Yeah, my wife tells me this all the time,
and she says, you don't want your emotions to ride
in a trunk because then they'll they'll they'll come back
to haunt you. You don't you don't want them to drive,
because if they drive, then you're going to be pretty
screwed up. You want them to be over in the
passenger seat. That way they can help you out if
they need to, and then they can just shut up
if they don't, you know.
Speaker 2: So yeah, and that's the thing till I love that
analogy with the driving because you know, I was talking
to your wife for a show. You know, I used
to be a big nerd back in dialogue days. You know,
I used to do all that HTML coding and stuff
like that.
Speaker 1: So bulletin boards, bulletin boards.
Speaker 2: I was an angel fire guy.
Speaker 1: You remember those days, yep, I remember those days.
Speaker 2: Yeah. But you know, back then, you had a at
the top. You know, you had a show and source key.
You know, you see all these beautiful images and links
and all this kind of stuff. But when you hit
show source, all you had was a bunch of arrows
pointing and numbers and just crazy letters and equal signs
and all this stuff. That's the coating that makes up
the Internet world to make these images and stuff you see.
I believe like when you do these these drugs and
stuff like that, because I mean even some of these
guys that do the you know, d MT and alasca
and all this stuff talk about they see numbers and
letters and all these kind of coding and stuff. It's
like almost like you're hitting the show key button on
the realm, you know. And it's d MT is an
actual chemical your body produces before death. You know. It's
kind of like before death, your body releases this to
unveil you, to get you ready to go into the
next dimension. And it's your soul, your conscience, whatever you
want to call it, is who you are. This body
is nothing but a vehicle in which you drive, and
think about it when you're sixteen years old, if you
were you know, fortunate enough, and your parents got you
your first car, you got a piece of jump for
you first one, because they knew more than likely you're
going to wreck it, you're going to destroy it. But hey,
they're going to give you an honest chance to see
what you can do with it. Now, if you drive
good and then you're responsible, you don't get no tickets.
That's when you get the upgrade and get the nice right,
Our heavenly father is no difference to give you this
piece of junk flesh to see what you're going to
do with it and how you're going to behave and
how you're want to drive it. Let's all get our
act together and get the get the ferrari so to speak.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yep, yeah, that that really intrigues me. You were
talking about the you know, the the d MT being
like a kind of a key, you know that that
that opens that world up. And and I think a
lot a lot of people don't realize because we have
such a pluralistic world that that not everything supernatural is good,
you know, And and I think that that's that's one
of our responsibilities is Bible believe in Christians, is to
just disciples of Christ just just to get out there
and and warn people. That's kind of what we see.
I mean, yeah, Lindsey and I have we have a
great time doing this podcast, and a lot of this
stuff is just just fun and it's just it's it's
cool to listen to and stuff. But but we kind
of we kind of see our podcast, like you had
said early on, as the tip of the spirit, to
be able to have discussions with people to get them
just to open their eyes, to get them just to
just to see the supernatural. And that that kind of
leads to our question. We we copy this from the
blurry guys, I guess it could be ours.
Speaker 2: I don't.
Speaker 1: Oh no, it's not Bigfoot. Nope, nope, nope, we want
we we usually ask it first off, and we didn't
get a chance to. But what is the the most
supernatural or miraculous thing that you've ever seen?
Speaker 3: It may very well just be that little story. I
don't know, the.
Speaker 2: Most miraculous thing I've ever seen.
Speaker 1: And we differentiate between the supernatural and the miraculous. I
know that, Uh, we had Frank Viola on our show,
and he he really helped us out to differentiate between
the two. Miraculous being more like a miracle, and supernatural
can be not necessarily something that goes against law, the
laws of physics, but just something you know, like you see, Okay,
example supernatural be waking up at three thirty three, you know,
uh every morning. That's that's supernatural. That's not a miracle. Right,
So so what what what? What is your What? What
do you think is your if you can share it,
if it's too private, don't worry about it.
Speaker 2: Well, I guess what's me is? You know, like I said,
you know, some people's got that that gift, and and
mine I'm I'm I always joke with my wife and
you know she'll always call me, you know, Debbie Downer
and all got No, I'm Reggie the realist.
Speaker 1: Hey, I'm using that, bro, I've stole that.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: So it's like, you know, show me the facts. I'm
the facts guy. And uh so I've probably really desensitized myself,
you know to a lot of stuff. Uh me, personally,
I've not witnessed, or at least I believe I haven't
witnessed a miracle or anything like that. Uh, but I
think it's pretty miraculous when you see people with similar
stories like mine. Yes, you see people that it was
just like like Mike Kerr for instance. Mike Kerr is
a prime example. Uh went from uh Wall Street CEO
exec travel in the world, had anything and everything you wanted,
to being homeless and a heroine at it and going
from there to leading here the Watchmen, you know, one
of the the most well known Christian organizations, gathering Christians
and doing conferences and doing all these kinds of things.
I mean to me that that's that's pretty miraculous. You know.
If you ask my mother now, my mother would would
say that that car wreck incident, yeah it was. Uh.
I just was like, you know, I was pompous. I
was like, oh I was lucky. No, man, Now that
I'm almost forty years old, looking back, I've seen friends
been getting vendor venders or just hit another car head
on and die. I mean, I flipped off a mountain
bro and over end, split the car in half and
didn't get a scratch.
Speaker 1: That's amazing. You must you must be Tennessee then if
you're up in the mountains.
Speaker 2: Yeah, huh yeah. But now my wife. Now, now she
could tell some stories. Man, my wife. Now, I've never
met a more godly woman in my wife. Uh. She's
been to India, Haiti, South America. She's been all over
the world missionary for God. Uh. She has actually seen
a cripple heel and walk. Yeah, hear and a bunch
of and hear her tell that story is hilarious. She says. Here,
I am a young teenage girl. She said, you know, uh,
well Amid you know, upper teenage, almost in her twenties.
And she was leading a bunch of young teenagers and
there was this homeless, homeless kid you know that's lame,
begging for money in India. And they were going through
and she said, this group of teenage girls, uh, you know,
on fire for God. You know, just kind of you know,
inint experienced life yet you know what I mean. And
they were like, we're going to go heal this man.
And my wife was like, now, guys, you know, if
you want to go pray for him, we go pray
for him.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 2: They're like, no, we're going to go heal this man.
So they went over there and she said, no, I'm
not gonna lie. She said, you know she said, I
had had my dad, you know, and she said. We
walked over there, she said, and we all laid hands
on and started praying. She said. We prayed for about
ten minutes or so and tried to stand him up.
He couldn't stand up. She said, oh my god, guys,
we tried, let's move on, and there's like, no, we're
not leaving until he stands, and they kept praying for him.
She said it probably went on twenty minutes, and then
she said finally they went to stand him on his
feet and he stood up on his own, and that
his mother, his aunt, whatever, some woman come by. And
I was like, oh my god, oh my god. You know,
well I'm paraphrasing. She probably did say that, but you know,
I want to know what they did to him. And
it was like, we just prayed for him, and you
know what, what God did you pray? Because if they
worshiped me, three million gods over there and they're like,
you know Jesus. And she was like, oh, well we will,
we will worship this god too, And she was like, no,
you can only worship this one god. You know, try
to explain it to him. But I always tell her when
she tells that story. I'm like, I don't know how
I would have took that. I mean, i'd be wild
to see.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I took a class on on healing and one
of the one of the lectures was an African guy
and he was just saying, I mean, he was very
blunt because he could be. And I appreciate that because
I'm wired that way. I've I've been tempered over the
years by my lovely wife to a little a little
less rigid on the edges. But I'm pretty blunt. He
just he just says, Western white people they quit too soon.
That's why they don't see healing. I'm like, you know,
that's amazing, and that that's your story. Your wife's story
reminds me of that. I mean, how often do we
quit too soon when we need to labor in there
until say, okay, now, we're not I leaving until this
is done. Yeah, that's cool story. I like that story too. Well,
let's let's uh justin tell us where they can find you,
what all the different things you got going on, and
how they can connect websites, podcast all that kind of stuff.
Speaker 2: Oh, thanks, man, I appreciate that.
Speaker 1: We're gonna put it we're gonna put it in the
show notes too, but I just want to just give
you an opportunity to Oh.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I appreciate that. Yeah. Our podcast it's called the
Big Bible Podcast. We've got a website. It's thedig Bible
podcast dot com.
Speaker 4: Uh.
Speaker 2: I do blogs on there so often in his face
with blogs, as I should. But Uh, we released a
show every Friday, three km eastern senterd time. Uh. We
got a Facebook, TikTok, Instagram, all that stuff. Uh, but
we also have a Facebook community called the dig Bible
Podcast Community. Uh. We've got a little six hundred members
right now. But it's just a just a place where
we get together and talk and discuss things. You know,
we like to say iron sharp AND's iron. Uh. We
got to do there for each other, talk about difficult things.
And we're not always going to agree on everything. That
that's fine, you know, we just do it respectfully and
los it's not a salvation issue, you know, we can
we can debate stuff and uh, but we also do
prize giveaways stuff like that. We give way t shirts,
DVDs sets and stuff like that.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 2: Just a just a good place to fellowship. Yeah, and
we're gonna have you have you guys on our show.
I actually want to do a show, especially with all
the things going off with Michs right now, we pray
for Mike. Uh. If it wouldn't for Mike, people like
us wouldn't be doing what we're doing. I think it's
safe to.
Speaker 1: Say absolutely, yeah, he's a gateway drug.
Speaker 2: He's the Gandalf. But I want to do a show
where we get like, you know, maybe you guys, Chris Price,
and we just have a podcaster's episode where we just
talk about Mike and his influences and just just kind
of the journey that we're going through. I think that
would be really great.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yep, yep, yeah. I mean, long before podcasting, I
bought The Unseen Realm. I read it and it didn't
affect me. Then I went back and listened to it
on audio, and then it started affecting me, and then
you know, Lindsay's the one that introduced me to podcasts
as far as The Blurry Guys, and then Sword.
Speaker 2: And Staff and Good Job Lindsay.
Speaker 1: So I'm addicted now. I mean I listened to at
least one podcast every night when When You Yours comes
out and listen to it, and I like the Confessionals
dude and and can permon and blurry guys anyway, but
I've got It's just there's just so much good stuff
out there, and I think personally, you know, we need
we all need to work together to get the word
out that people need to take the red pill. I
mean they need to take the red pill. They need
to believe that the that that this universe, this this
this earth that we live on, like you said earlier,
is a stranger that that we know. And it's it's
a lot bigger and faster.
Speaker 2: You know, we know, we're all back for the same team.
Speaker 4: Man.
Speaker 2: We got to hold each other like Joseph Collin boys
did it for Moses. You know, we got to hold
each other up exactly.
Speaker 1: Yep, exactly. So well, thank you, justin.
Speaker 2: We appreciate guys, thanks for having.
Speaker 4: Me, thanks for listening and supporting us, and remember stay
naturally supernaturally
Speaker 2: Inter