WEBVTT 1 00:00:01.159 --> 00:00:05.080 You are now listening to the Someone's Favorite Productions podcast network. 2 00:00:07.879 --> 00:00:10.080 At one point I had to make Olympics, so I 3 00:00:10.119 --> 00:00:13.839 always had a job very politically incorrect back then. 4 00:00:15.800 --> 00:00:17.079 Hello there, and welcome back. 5 00:00:17.399 --> 00:00:22.920 What is this place? Is connected? Disconnected? It's connected, disconnected, disconnected, disconnected? 6 00:00:23.120 --> 00:00:29.399 Is connected disconnected, disconnected, disconnected, disconnected, disconnected, disconnected, disconnected. 7 00:00:29.480 --> 00:00:30.679 I'm starting to feel disconnected. 8 00:00:30.960 --> 00:00:32.759 Work the number that has been disconnected. 9 00:00:35.840 --> 00:00:38.280 Hello there, and welcome back to the Disconnected. 10 00:00:38.679 --> 00:00:42.359 I honestly don't even know how to introduce this because 11 00:00:42.840 --> 00:00:45.799 I'm here with one of, in my opinion, the most 12 00:00:46.000 --> 00:00:51.280 esteemed incredible contributors to the horror genre over the last 13 00:00:52.320 --> 00:00:55.079 four at forty years. That's kind of crazy to say 14 00:00:55.079 --> 00:00:58.600 out loud like that, mister Brian Usma, thank you so. 15 00:00:58.560 --> 00:00:59.520 Much for being a part of this. 16 00:01:00.119 --> 00:01:00.920 Nice to be here. 17 00:01:02.000 --> 00:01:04.439 I don't even know where to start. You've had a 18 00:01:04.480 --> 00:01:06.760 hand in so many incredible things over the years, from 19 00:01:06.879 --> 00:01:13.439 producing titles with massive pedigree like Dolls. I Love Dolls, 20 00:01:13.439 --> 00:01:16.480 one of my favorites of all time, writing on things 21 00:01:16.560 --> 00:01:19.239 like Honey, I Shrunk the Kids, and following that up 22 00:01:19.239 --> 00:01:21.280 with one of the most disgusting shots put in film 23 00:01:21.319 --> 00:01:21.840 and society. 24 00:01:21.920 --> 00:01:22.799 We all thank you for. 25 00:01:22.760 --> 00:01:25.599 It, well, thank you for enjoying them. 26 00:01:26.040 --> 00:01:29.879 So you have such an interesting and globe trotting, diverse 27 00:01:29.959 --> 00:01:32.959 background that got you to the entertainment industry. 28 00:01:33.319 --> 00:01:35.239 How how do you feel you got here? 29 00:01:35.439 --> 00:01:37.519 What is the first handful of steps that really got 30 00:01:37.560 --> 00:01:41.200 you to where you were established? 31 00:01:41.840 --> 00:01:45.879 You mean being able to make money making. 32 00:01:45.640 --> 00:01:48.200 Movies, even just getting two movies. I mean, you know, 33 00:01:48.280 --> 00:01:51.000 growing up in other countries and then working as a 34 00:01:51.040 --> 00:01:52.040 carpenter and all that. 35 00:01:52.200 --> 00:01:56.120 Well, growing up, I grew up there were movies. There 36 00:01:56.120 --> 00:01:58.959 were movies everywhere, so I grew up. And then we 37 00:01:59.000 --> 00:02:02.599 didn't have TV when I was a kid until I 38 00:02:02.680 --> 00:02:06.079 was about seven or eight because they didn't have it 39 00:02:06.200 --> 00:02:09.759 in Panama where I lived. But we went to the movies. 40 00:02:11.680 --> 00:02:14.719 One of the first movies when I was very young 41 00:02:14.840 --> 00:02:17.840 that I think I must have been six or something. 42 00:02:19.080 --> 00:02:24.800 I think maybe even earlier. Maybe see anyway, we used 43 00:02:24.800 --> 00:02:27.520 to go to the movies on Sunday, the Kiddy matinees, 44 00:02:28.159 --> 00:02:31.599 Nice and I and I saw The Creature with the 45 00:02:31.680 --> 00:02:38.159 Adam Brain and it just really you know, gave me 46 00:02:38.280 --> 00:02:46.080 sleepless nights. Nice And then the next you know, fantastic movie, 47 00:02:46.159 --> 00:02:52.919 genre movie. I remember, was the Seventh Voyage of Sindbad. 48 00:02:53.719 --> 00:02:56.159 Oh wow, that was you know. 49 00:02:56.120 --> 00:03:00.639 And the skeleton part really scared me, and the and 50 00:03:00.680 --> 00:03:04.639 gave me nightmares. And then of course the woman turning 51 00:03:05.120 --> 00:03:08.560 jumping into the urn with the snake and coming out 52 00:03:08.639 --> 00:03:14.599 as the snake woman was very disturbing to me. I 53 00:03:14.599 --> 00:03:19.800 didn't quite know eye. And then another big genre movie 54 00:03:19.800 --> 00:03:24.719 that was very influential to me around that same era 55 00:03:25.080 --> 00:03:28.080 when I was, you know, in grammar school, was The 56 00:03:28.319 --> 00:03:29.319 Ten Commandments. 57 00:03:30.159 --> 00:03:31.800 Oh interesting, which. 58 00:03:31.879 --> 00:03:35.879 Was a which you would think that's you know, it's 59 00:03:35.879 --> 00:03:40.960 a biblical epic, but it was made for all audiences, 60 00:03:41.000 --> 00:03:45.199 you know, back then. But it had all this kind 61 00:03:45.240 --> 00:03:50.159 of real genre stuff like rods that get turned into 62 00:03:50.639 --> 00:03:55.919 snakes and turning the sea red blood and then this 63 00:03:56.199 --> 00:04:02.800 green smoke going through the village killing killing children, and 64 00:04:02.879 --> 00:04:07.039 the sea opening up and all this stuff. So like 65 00:04:07.120 --> 00:04:10.439 a big genre movie. But then when Moses goes up 66 00:04:10.599 --> 00:04:16.879 to abount Sinai, the all the israel Israelites worship this 67 00:04:17.000 --> 00:04:20.920 golden calf and start having a big orgy. Now it was, 68 00:04:22.040 --> 00:04:27.120 I guess g rated, but it was an orgy, you know, 69 00:04:27.519 --> 00:04:31.800 and that really affected me. And when I did start 70 00:04:31.839 --> 00:04:37.240 making movies. I would often try to figure out where 71 00:04:38.199 --> 00:04:46.000 my default instincts came from, because I think anybody, everybody's 72 00:04:46.040 --> 00:04:51.639 coming is coming from something. Most people that make movies, 73 00:04:51.680 --> 00:04:55.240 even on the huge level, are trying originally or trying 74 00:04:55.240 --> 00:04:58.279 to make movies they loved when they were kids, of course, 75 00:04:58.439 --> 00:05:03.040 and I think that's why I have this propensity to 76 00:05:03.160 --> 00:05:06.959 think that a good movie should end with a big, 77 00:05:07.199 --> 00:05:13.879 crazy origin. Because of the Ten Commandments. That's how it ended, you. 78 00:05:13.759 --> 00:05:15.600 Know, well, thank God for that. 79 00:05:15.800 --> 00:05:19.600 It wasn't good. What they were doing was clearly not good, 80 00:05:21.839 --> 00:05:25.839 but it was very satisfying. I mean, Moses comes down 81 00:05:25.839 --> 00:05:27.759 and puts an end to it, so it's not like 82 00:05:27.920 --> 00:05:33.079 it's a horror movie. It ends well, you know, so anyway, 83 00:05:33.120 --> 00:05:38.319 and I did. I saw all the all the you know, 84 00:05:38.480 --> 00:05:42.439 like the the House on Haunted Hill and the Tabler 85 00:05:42.680 --> 00:05:47.839 and the Univers coming out. Then I saw that. When 86 00:05:47.879 --> 00:05:51.199 I was first I only saw the trailers of Hammer, 87 00:05:51.240 --> 00:05:54.079 but that was pretty scary, and then of course I 88 00:05:54.160 --> 00:05:59.240 saw all the Hammers. But by the time I got 89 00:05:59.240 --> 00:06:04.160 to middle school, I was all into Corbin's Poe series. 90 00:06:04.360 --> 00:06:08.639 And you know, I saw Psycho when it first came out, 91 00:06:08.680 --> 00:06:13.439 and I was like, yeah, that was that boy. I was. 92 00:06:13.519 --> 00:06:16.160 I couldn't take a shower for weeks and all that time. 93 00:06:17.720 --> 00:06:20.759 It's very disturbing to me, this idea that there could 94 00:06:20.839 --> 00:06:26.720 be somebody else inside you, you know. Yeah, but so anyway, 95 00:06:26.800 --> 00:06:29.639 but I did, I did read. I read. You know, 96 00:06:29.680 --> 00:06:32.959 it was really into fairy tales when I first started reading. 97 00:06:33.680 --> 00:06:37.800 And that's basically the origins of I guess you'd call 98 00:06:37.839 --> 00:06:44.319 it folk core. It comes ultimately from folk wore. And 99 00:06:44.360 --> 00:06:46.879 we when I was a kid, you know, not having 100 00:06:47.000 --> 00:06:50.879 your TV, and if we did have it, it'd be 101 00:06:50.879 --> 00:06:52.959 a few hours a day and just be kind of 102 00:06:53.000 --> 00:06:55.720 like the news and stuff. But we used to gather, 103 00:06:56.439 --> 00:07:02.000 you know, at dusk, the kids, and somebody always knew 104 00:07:03.160 --> 00:07:08.240 some uncle, who's somebody crawled out of a grave, or 105 00:07:08.279 --> 00:07:11.199 there's some kind of wood who you know, there's sort 106 00:07:11.199 --> 00:07:16.600 of monkey spaw style of horror. It's just the whole 107 00:07:17.519 --> 00:07:21.920 grisly fact of it. And then I was I was 108 00:07:22.040 --> 00:07:25.920 raised a Roman Catholic in and my father was a 109 00:07:26.439 --> 00:07:29.759 was a practicing Catholic, so I would go to church. 110 00:07:29.800 --> 00:07:35.639 I went to church faithfully, and and I lived in 111 00:07:35.839 --> 00:07:40.920 of course, these Catholic kind of third world countries, where 112 00:07:41.240 --> 00:07:43.839 you know, they'd have processions through this. I mean, it's 113 00:07:44.040 --> 00:07:49.000 very heavy, and of course in you know, Catholicism is 114 00:07:49.040 --> 00:07:54.040 all about you know, eating the flesh and drinking the 115 00:07:54.120 --> 00:07:58.839 blood and you know, suffering and you know, and so 116 00:07:59.040 --> 00:08:01.399 that I think that had a good effect on me. 117 00:08:02.079 --> 00:08:07.439 I always thought that, especially the Western kind of horror 118 00:08:08.120 --> 00:08:14.120 basics of Frankenstein, Dracula, and I guess Jekyl Hyder or 119 00:08:14.240 --> 00:08:20.120 the werewolf kind of blend together, that it works best 120 00:08:20.279 --> 00:08:26.199 in like a kind of Christian Roman Catholic tradition where 121 00:08:26.399 --> 00:08:29.680 because you know, in the Catholic Christian the devil and 122 00:08:29.720 --> 00:08:32.879 the demons are real. This is not right, this is 123 00:08:32.919 --> 00:08:35.840 for real, you know, And so it's not much of 124 00:08:35.879 --> 00:08:41.240 a jump from there to you know, thinking that vampires 125 00:08:41.279 --> 00:08:45.279 could show up. It's true, and I always thought it 126 00:08:45.360 --> 00:08:47.519 kind of took a little away from it when it 127 00:08:47.519 --> 00:08:50.360 would get to you know, when it didn't have that 128 00:08:50.440 --> 00:08:53.600 sort of religious underpinning. But then when you'd see the 129 00:08:53.799 --> 00:08:59.279 Asian non Christian based or you'd see that they do 130 00:08:59.399 --> 00:09:02.799 quite well with their vampires and were wolves and ghosts 131 00:09:02.799 --> 00:09:07.320 and stuff. You just have to settle into the into 132 00:09:07.440 --> 00:09:12.399 the you know the culture of it. But that was 133 00:09:12.519 --> 00:09:14.679 kind of how I got I think that's how I 134 00:09:14.720 --> 00:09:18.159 got a taste for horror. I just always liked it. 135 00:09:18.919 --> 00:09:22.720 And then when I ended up having to make a living, 136 00:09:24.320 --> 00:09:27.519 I grew up. I didn't grow up anywhere near LA, 137 00:09:28.679 --> 00:09:34.399 and back in the fifties, sixties, even seventies, you didn't. 138 00:09:34.879 --> 00:09:39.039 I mean, movies were just basically made in LA and 139 00:09:39.080 --> 00:09:44.159 to a certain degree in New York, but mostly LA. 140 00:09:45.159 --> 00:09:51.000 And I didn't know anybody in the movies. All I 141 00:09:51.039 --> 00:09:54.559 knew about was from what I could read. But you know, 142 00:09:54.799 --> 00:10:01.200 I remember seeing Day for Night, that true movie. You know, 143 00:10:01.240 --> 00:10:05.480 in the sixties, art movies were a real big thing, 144 00:10:06.240 --> 00:10:09.320 you know, that new way for stuff on tour. Stuff 145 00:10:09.480 --> 00:10:16.000 was just real entertaining. And in that Day for Night, 146 00:10:16.279 --> 00:10:20.159 it's basically kind of a musical about making a movie. 147 00:10:20.240 --> 00:10:22.679 So you see the crew making the movie, and you 148 00:10:22.720 --> 00:10:27.320 see all these different people performing functions, and that sort 149 00:10:27.320 --> 00:10:30.080 of became the basis of what I knew about what 150 00:10:31.000 --> 00:10:34.840 making a movie was. But I never thought that. It 151 00:10:34.879 --> 00:10:39.279 never occurred to me that you could actually make a 152 00:10:39.320 --> 00:10:43.759 living doing TV or movies. It didn't It didn't seem 153 00:10:43.840 --> 00:10:52.080 too far too far thatched. Of course, now everybody can 154 00:10:52.240 --> 00:10:57.799 and everybody does make movies always, all the time, constantly. 155 00:10:59.399 --> 00:11:06.240 But when I I didn't, really I didn't start. I try. 156 00:11:06.480 --> 00:11:11.679 I started shooting with a sixteen millimeter camera when I 157 00:11:11.720 --> 00:11:17.399 was given a Bolex sixteen millimeter wind up three lens. 158 00:11:17.840 --> 00:11:21.200 These were these Bulex cameras that were used for news 159 00:11:21.240 --> 00:11:25.159 gathering in the seventies. When a crew would go out 160 00:11:26.399 --> 00:11:29.159 to do the news, they would have that and they 161 00:11:29.360 --> 00:11:31.600 didn't have sound or anything. It was and you had 162 00:11:31.679 --> 00:11:35.519 three lenses. You wound it up for like one hundred feet. 163 00:11:36.240 --> 00:11:38.320 I got one, and at that time I was living 164 00:11:38.320 --> 00:11:41.519 in the country, and I started shooting my goats and 165 00:11:41.600 --> 00:11:47.679 my turkeys and stuff. And then I projected at night 166 00:11:47.720 --> 00:11:50.960 on my projector after I developed it. It would be 167 00:11:51.000 --> 00:11:55.200 in black and white. If I went, wow, it's like bergman, 168 00:11:58.639 --> 00:12:05.480 this is a movie. And so then I started. I 169 00:12:05.519 --> 00:12:09.120 tried making a short film, and because I got a 170 00:12:09.240 --> 00:12:15.200 I got a Beta Max. Nice first in my neighborhood 171 00:12:15.200 --> 00:12:18.679 to have a Beta Max. And then I recorded a 172 00:12:18.679 --> 00:12:22.639 couple of movies and watched them over and over. One 173 00:12:22.679 --> 00:12:27.960 was Kubrick's The Killing and the other was The Spiral Staircase. 174 00:12:29.320 --> 00:12:34.759 The first time I could see that there's there's shots. 175 00:12:35.960 --> 00:12:40.279 There's not just scenes, there's shots. And that was a 176 00:12:40.320 --> 00:12:44.840 big eye opener for me. That then I started realizing, 177 00:12:46.360 --> 00:12:50.559 you know, because I could go back and forward, I 178 00:12:50.559 --> 00:12:52.919 could control it. When I went to the movies, it 179 00:12:53.080 --> 00:12:58.120 just happened close as I could get because I wanted 180 00:12:58.120 --> 00:13:01.440 to get inside it. Of course, one I started making movies, 181 00:13:01.480 --> 00:13:05.320 I wanted to see the frame. I went just the 182 00:13:05.399 --> 00:13:08.120 other way. I don't want to be immersed in it. 183 00:13:08.919 --> 00:13:13.639 But so anyway, that was, you know, I started getting 184 00:13:13.639 --> 00:13:19.759 interested in it and started reading like Box Office Magazine 185 00:13:19.879 --> 00:13:25.320 and Weekly Variety and going, God, maybe you could could 186 00:13:25.320 --> 00:13:29.000 you make a money? You know, I'll try making a movie. 187 00:13:29.240 --> 00:13:31.440 I did a short film. I thought it was great 188 00:13:31.519 --> 00:13:34.879 till I showed it to my friends, and then it 189 00:13:35.000 --> 00:13:39.720 turned out it wasn't, you know. And I'm like that 190 00:13:39.799 --> 00:13:42.720 as a cook too. When I cook for myself, it's 191 00:13:42.919 --> 00:13:46.360 just delicious. But if I have to share the meal 192 00:13:46.480 --> 00:13:51.080 with somebody, I start realizing it's not that good, you know. 193 00:13:51.720 --> 00:13:55.279 And so then when I decided to try to make 194 00:13:55.360 --> 00:13:58.240 a I thought, I'm going to try to make a 195 00:13:58.279 --> 00:14:01.840 real movie. I'll go out and so I put an 196 00:14:01.879 --> 00:14:09.440 ad in Variety that said horror movie director wanted, and 197 00:14:09.600 --> 00:14:13.519 I got. This is before fax machines, It's like nineteen 198 00:14:13.600 --> 00:14:20.279 eighty two. I got like hundreds of letters. I would 199 00:14:20.279 --> 00:14:24.080 say ninety percent were from LA and ten ten or 200 00:14:24.080 --> 00:14:26.440 twenty percent were from New York. Well, New York was 201 00:14:26.480 --> 00:14:29.200 easy because I could drive up there from North Carolina. 202 00:14:31.159 --> 00:14:33.600 But La i'd have to fly out for a few 203 00:14:33.679 --> 00:14:37.159 days and I just have meetings all day. And then 204 00:14:37.200 --> 00:14:43.720 I started realizing that everybody that I met up there 205 00:14:43.879 --> 00:14:47.600 was just like me. There were people who were from 206 00:14:47.639 --> 00:14:50.759 somewhere else, but they wanted to make movies. And of 207 00:14:50.759 --> 00:14:53.080 course the ones I met were the ones that wanted 208 00:14:53.080 --> 00:14:59.000 to make genre movies. And you know, not having gone 209 00:14:59.039 --> 00:15:02.919 to film school or had any any kind of education 210 00:15:03.840 --> 00:15:07.919 in entertainment, I just picked it up from meeting people. 211 00:15:08.639 --> 00:15:12.320 And the first time I went to a film market 212 00:15:12.440 --> 00:15:15.919 it was the American Film Market. And when I saw that, 213 00:15:16.080 --> 00:15:18.240 I went, Oh, this is how you do it. You 214 00:15:18.360 --> 00:15:20.519 kind of make the movie, you go and sell it 215 00:15:20.559 --> 00:15:23.720 to all these countries. Because this was the great era 216 00:15:23.799 --> 00:15:27.240 of video, when anybody could go to market with your movie, 217 00:15:27.639 --> 00:15:30.440 which is kind of why the movies of the eighties 218 00:15:30.799 --> 00:15:35.320 have this unique characteristic. They were being financed by video 219 00:15:36.039 --> 00:15:39.159 when the majors wouldn't get into it. And so there's 220 00:15:39.200 --> 00:15:43.080 a lot of people, a lot of people making companies, 221 00:15:43.399 --> 00:15:46.720 producing and selling movies who had who would never be 222 00:15:46.840 --> 00:15:49.600 let into the big thing, could never worked in the 223 00:15:49.600 --> 00:15:52.720 big time, you know. Once I saw that, saw how 224 00:15:52.799 --> 00:15:57.120 that worked, and everybody was kind of doing it right. 225 00:15:58.559 --> 00:16:03.200 I was lucky because I I raised the money to 226 00:16:03.279 --> 00:16:07.000 make my own movie so I could start out at 227 00:16:07.000 --> 00:16:07.360 the top. 228 00:16:08.279 --> 00:16:11.600 It's a smart man, that's a good choice. So around 229 00:16:11.600 --> 00:16:17.039 this time, one Stuart Gordon came into your life. Obviously 230 00:16:17.120 --> 00:16:20.559 Stuart has passed now and a lot of people have 231 00:16:21.559 --> 00:16:25.679 really begun to discover the magic that Stuart was and 232 00:16:25.399 --> 00:16:26.919 you and you and Stuart had a lot in common. 233 00:16:26.919 --> 00:16:31.120 I mean, showing, you know, these crazy practical effects that 234 00:16:31.200 --> 00:16:35.639 are depraved and terrifying, but also with this just amazing 235 00:16:35.679 --> 00:16:38.039 sense of humor with it that we all come to love. 236 00:16:39.399 --> 00:16:41.440 Tell us about Stuart Gordon those early days. 237 00:16:41.440 --> 00:16:44.200 What did you like When I was looking for a director. 238 00:16:45.480 --> 00:16:50.399 It eventually led to me going to Chicago and meeting Stuart, 239 00:16:50.480 --> 00:16:54.480 who at that time was a had been working for 240 00:16:54.559 --> 00:16:59.039 ten years in theater. Yeah, so he had never made 241 00:16:59.039 --> 00:17:03.039 a movie. But he was a professional. He was the 242 00:17:03.039 --> 00:17:07.200 creative director of his own, his own theater, and he 243 00:17:07.319 --> 00:17:12.000 loved to shock people because the first time he really 244 00:17:12.039 --> 00:17:14.880 got any, got his picture on the front page of 245 00:17:14.920 --> 00:17:19.240 the paper in Madison, Wisconsin, where he went to college, 246 00:17:20.079 --> 00:17:24.680 was because he in college he put on a theatrical 247 00:17:25.359 --> 00:17:29.000 play version of Peter Pan where all the actors were naked. 248 00:17:29.240 --> 00:17:32.119 You got to remember, this is in the hippie times, 249 00:17:33.039 --> 00:17:36.559 and so the police shut it down and there was 250 00:17:36.599 --> 00:17:40.359 a lot of go and Stuart loved it. He was like, 251 00:17:40.519 --> 00:17:43.839 this is what I want. And in the organic theater 252 00:17:43.960 --> 00:17:47.359 that he ran, he did regularly. He did, you know, 253 00:17:47.519 --> 00:17:51.799 just regular plays, but he did really ambitious sci fi 254 00:17:52.039 --> 00:17:55.599 and kind of horror stuff. And I just I went 255 00:17:55.720 --> 00:17:58.599 to see a couple of them, and I thought, Wow, 256 00:17:58.640 --> 00:18:01.640 this guy, I like, I could work with him, and 257 00:18:01.680 --> 00:18:05.400 he knows what he's doing, you know. And so he 258 00:18:05.559 --> 00:18:11.759 had already co written a pilot for a reanimator TV show, 259 00:18:13.319 --> 00:18:19.880 and so we developed it into a feature and shot it. 260 00:18:21.559 --> 00:18:25.160 We Luckily for both of us, he was of course, 261 00:18:25.799 --> 00:18:30.039 I knew he liked he was excessive, so I like that, 262 00:18:31.240 --> 00:18:38.440 and I also also he was lucky that I did 263 00:18:38.519 --> 00:18:41.920 want that, and we didn't have to argue with anybody. 264 00:18:43.079 --> 00:18:47.440 And I wanted it to be very exploitative because as 265 00:18:47.480 --> 00:18:51.480 a horror fan, I liked bad horror movies, of course, 266 00:18:52.039 --> 00:18:56.160 and not bad regular movies, but bad horror movies I like, 267 00:18:57.559 --> 00:18:59.880 which I think is the definition of a horror fan. 268 00:19:00.799 --> 00:19:08.079 The the so I thought, you know, I'm risking I 269 00:19:08.119 --> 00:19:11.680 had two kids by then. I thought, man, I'm risking 270 00:19:13.119 --> 00:19:19.039 my family's future. Is I'm borrowing money? So I know 271 00:19:19.279 --> 00:19:23.200 when I watched horror movies, the worst thing are the 272 00:19:23.240 --> 00:19:26.240 horror movies that sort of pull their punches thinking they're 273 00:19:26.279 --> 00:19:30.160 going to get some kind of respect. So my feeling 274 00:19:30.400 --> 00:19:34.799 was that I did, and I told him this. I said, 275 00:19:34.839 --> 00:19:37.839 I just we just have to make it real entertaining, 276 00:19:37.880 --> 00:19:44.160 which means very bloody and very sexy and just all 277 00:19:44.240 --> 00:19:47.480 the way so that the movie's no good, I know, 278 00:19:47.599 --> 00:19:50.920 there'll still be an audience sort you know. So that 279 00:19:51.079 --> 00:19:55.119 was that was the you know, And luckily, of course 280 00:19:55.359 --> 00:19:58.599 I didn't even I didn't choose to take it to 281 00:19:58.640 --> 00:20:01.839 the MPAA for our rating because I knew they wouldn't 282 00:20:01.920 --> 00:20:04.599 wouldn't They would just take out all the all the 283 00:20:04.640 --> 00:20:10.839 good stuff, and you know, it meant it was difficult. 284 00:20:10.920 --> 00:20:13.200 We had to you know, we had to put an 285 00:20:13.359 --> 00:20:16.000 X rating on it because that's what you could if 286 00:20:16.039 --> 00:20:20.680 it wasn't rated. And now X is just sex, but 287 00:20:20.839 --> 00:20:25.160 back then it was also you know, it's just anything 288 00:20:25.319 --> 00:20:32.200 that like obsity. Yeah, it's it's like anything, you know, 289 00:20:32.359 --> 00:20:35.960 anything could be X rated if it was just adult. 290 00:20:36.079 --> 00:20:39.039 That was the original idea. It would just be adult 291 00:20:39.160 --> 00:20:45.279 because they only had g rated that are rated, you know, right. 292 00:20:46.119 --> 00:20:51.119 But but anyway, that's as Stewart used to say, we 293 00:20:51.200 --> 00:20:54.880 brought out the worst in each other. Well we were 294 00:20:54.880 --> 00:21:00.119 really very really very different. I mean, Stuart is a 295 00:21:00.160 --> 00:21:07.440 lifelong kind of kind of director, entertainer put on shows, 296 00:21:08.559 --> 00:21:12.240 and I just sort of came into it, you know, 297 00:21:12.480 --> 00:21:15.279 when I was thirty years old, going hey, what else 298 00:21:15.319 --> 00:21:19.200 am I going to do? Let's try this. I learned 299 00:21:19.240 --> 00:21:22.359 from just being on the set and hiring people and 300 00:21:22.400 --> 00:21:27.160 going through the process. But I never had any you know, 301 00:21:27.200 --> 00:21:32.119 I didn't have any education at it. And Stewart was 302 00:21:32.759 --> 00:21:35.160 I mean, he was kind of a you know, kind 303 00:21:35.160 --> 00:21:39.039 of a born storyteller. Some people just tell a good story. 304 00:21:40.559 --> 00:21:42.759 You kind of want Stuart to be at dinner with 305 00:21:42.799 --> 00:21:46.240 you because he'll pick up the slack when you need 306 00:21:46.279 --> 00:21:53.039 a little entertainment, Like he's like a recontour. And so 307 00:21:53.200 --> 00:21:57.839 we you know we I think we complimented each other 308 00:21:58.720 --> 00:22:02.079 that way. You know, we were you know we were 309 00:22:02.640 --> 00:22:05.640 And as then as Thaoli, his writing partner, would say, 310 00:22:05.680 --> 00:22:07.279 he said, you know, Stuart and I could have made 311 00:22:07.319 --> 00:22:10.200 any kind of movie you wanted to do. Horror. Of course, 312 00:22:10.240 --> 00:22:14.680 whatever you start doing that ends up being stuck in it. Yeah, 313 00:22:14.720 --> 00:22:18.359 but that's not exactly true. I mean Stuart already would 314 00:22:18.359 --> 00:22:21.519 have had the reanimator pilot. Of course it was for 315 00:22:21.680 --> 00:22:27.200 like all audiences, like you know, right back then, who 316 00:22:27.200 --> 00:22:32.319 wants to do TV? Nobody? That's true now, you know, 317 00:22:33.039 --> 00:22:36.119 with the streaming services. 318 00:22:37.279 --> 00:22:38.799 That's the prestige now. 319 00:22:38.759 --> 00:22:40.799 Although I must say I think a lot of them. 320 00:22:41.440 --> 00:22:44.920 There's horror. I mean, horror is just everywhere. I mean, 321 00:22:44.960 --> 00:22:48.680 it's never been bigger. But in a way it's it's 322 00:22:48.720 --> 00:22:52.720 for me, it's never been more boring. I just you know, 323 00:22:52.839 --> 00:22:55.200 I think that well, I forgot to mention this the 324 00:22:55.240 --> 00:22:59.640 first my first introduction to horror, before I could read, 325 00:23:00.240 --> 00:23:03.000 the first time I got money to buy a comic book. 326 00:23:03.519 --> 00:23:05.240 I don't think I was I think I was four 327 00:23:05.319 --> 00:23:10.640 years old, I got a horror comic. Wow, And those 328 00:23:10.640 --> 00:23:13.799 horror comics were really kind of disturbing until I had 329 00:23:14.480 --> 00:23:18.240 got a little older and was introduced to Mad Magazine, 330 00:23:18.720 --> 00:23:22.720 And then I started understanding satire because all the horror 331 00:23:22.799 --> 00:23:28.720 comics they were kind of they were grizzly, but the 332 00:23:28.799 --> 00:23:32.559 guys writing were grown ups and they just they were 333 00:23:32.640 --> 00:23:37.759 just joking around. I mean, they were so ironic and satirical. 334 00:23:39.359 --> 00:23:42.480 But of course when I first first time I read 335 00:23:42.519 --> 00:23:49.640 Mad Magazine, I was shocked they were selling I think 336 00:23:49.640 --> 00:23:54.160 they at a fake ad. You know. Back then on 337 00:23:54.400 --> 00:23:56.519 match books they used to try to sell you a 338 00:23:56.559 --> 00:23:59.759 course in plumbing or electric and they would sell a 339 00:23:59.799 --> 00:24:03.200 course and bank robbing or you know, right and buzzley, 340 00:24:03.359 --> 00:24:07.119 you know, and I'd go, how can they do that? 341 00:24:07.480 --> 00:24:12.000 Oh my god? You know, but you have to learn 342 00:24:12.119 --> 00:24:15.680 the concept of satire. Yeah, and I think the I 343 00:24:15.680 --> 00:24:21.440 think the when you especially in the Easy comics, which 344 00:24:21.559 --> 00:24:24.920 really laid it on thick, you know, I mean that's 345 00:24:25.319 --> 00:24:29.799 basically Return the Living Dead of Dan O'Bannon is post 346 00:24:30.000 --> 00:24:34.240 comics in the movies for the first time, not the 347 00:24:34.319 --> 00:24:36.839 Creek shows stuff where they think you were a batman 348 00:24:36.960 --> 00:24:39.480 TV series where they think the way you make a 349 00:24:39.559 --> 00:24:42.440 comic to a movie is by showing frames and going 350 00:24:42.480 --> 00:24:48.400 into them and having primary colors and putting pals and no, no, no, 351 00:24:49.000 --> 00:24:52.640 but that whole idea of eating brains. Who eats brains? 352 00:24:52.839 --> 00:24:56.440 Nobody except in the comic books, because that's funny. It's 353 00:24:56.480 --> 00:25:01.640 fun grisly. People are always getting revenge on each other. 354 00:25:03.119 --> 00:25:08.240 I don't know. And to me, the horror was I 355 00:25:08.240 --> 00:25:11.960 think the horror that I loved was kind of tended 356 00:25:12.000 --> 00:25:15.559 towards the carnival type of you know, Carnival eye type 357 00:25:15.559 --> 00:25:19.319 of horror, whereas it's just a fun ride, you know, 358 00:25:19.759 --> 00:25:24.400 it's just really entertaining. But I loved you know, Rosemary's Baby, 359 00:25:24.599 --> 00:25:28.440 the Exorcist and the you know, the real kind of 360 00:25:29.200 --> 00:25:30.799 high end horror. Right. 361 00:25:31.960 --> 00:25:34.079 Well, you say hor today is boring. What do you 362 00:25:34.119 --> 00:25:36.240 feel like it's missing? What do you think we've lost 363 00:25:36.319 --> 00:25:37.160 since Reanimator? 364 00:25:38.000 --> 00:25:39.880 I don't know, just the fun of it. I think 365 00:25:39.920 --> 00:25:47.519 people take themselves so seriously. You know, everybody, everybody's a author, 366 00:25:48.119 --> 00:25:53.519 you know, everybody's the movie, isn't It's not just a movie. 367 00:25:53.559 --> 00:25:57.759 It's not just the horror movie. It's really about, you know, 368 00:25:58.480 --> 00:26:03.519 something else it's message forward, you know, everything's made, everything's 369 00:26:03.599 --> 00:26:07.759 like more than that, it's not or it ends up 370 00:26:08.039 --> 00:26:11.039 being like The Walking Dead or something where it's basically 371 00:26:11.079 --> 00:26:17.440 a soap opera with a with EFTs. Well it's I mean, 372 00:26:18.079 --> 00:26:20.960 obviously it's got a huge audience. I'm not you know, 373 00:26:21.000 --> 00:26:21.319 I'm not. 374 00:26:21.839 --> 00:26:29.039 He I wish I made Walking Dead, but you know, 375 00:26:30.200 --> 00:26:33.359 for my money, I prefer to watch you know, humanoids from. 376 00:26:33.160 --> 00:26:39.000 The deep, and I'm not. And even stuff like Halloween 377 00:26:39.240 --> 00:26:44.599 was was ironic. Of course it wasn't. You didn't laugh 378 00:26:44.680 --> 00:26:47.599 at it, but it was just ironic and it was funny. 379 00:26:47.640 --> 00:26:50.279 How could this guy he didn't just kill him? And 380 00:26:50.279 --> 00:26:51.960 he had to put up a tombstone? 381 00:26:52.079 --> 00:26:57.319 And you know, knowing knowing how you. 382 00:26:57.720 --> 00:27:00.680 Then there's the Last House on the Left and Bill 383 00:27:00.759 --> 00:27:04.119 Snape Eyes and those don't give you much room. 384 00:27:03.960 --> 00:27:07.480 For irony, although Wes Craven classically has a lot of 385 00:27:07.519 --> 00:27:09.440 humor in his stuff too, So yeah, it's. 386 00:27:09.359 --> 00:27:12.039 All there's Freddie especially, Yeah. 387 00:27:13.039 --> 00:27:16.400 Knowing knowing how you feel about the current horror realm, 388 00:27:16.440 --> 00:27:18.759 are you watching much current stuff? 389 00:27:18.759 --> 00:27:20.039 Are you just kind of letting it go by? 390 00:27:20.680 --> 00:27:24.160 No? I don't. I don't watch much. I mostly do 391 00:27:24.279 --> 00:27:25.440 books these days. 392 00:27:26.160 --> 00:27:27.200 What have you been reading. 393 00:27:28.680 --> 00:27:31.640 Right now? Yeah, well, I've been doing a lot of 394 00:27:31.680 --> 00:27:32.599 Elmore Leonard. 395 00:27:33.200 --> 00:27:33.839 Oh nice. 396 00:27:35.440 --> 00:27:38.160 You know, I'm always interested if I see a movie 397 00:27:38.200 --> 00:27:40.640 I like, I'll get the book. 398 00:27:41.039 --> 00:27:41.599 Yeah. 399 00:27:41.880 --> 00:27:46.160 I mostly do audio books because then you can do stuff. 400 00:27:46.359 --> 00:27:46.799 Of course. 401 00:27:47.240 --> 00:27:53.000