Speaker 1: In a world where fairways meet the airwaves, where Bertie's
Speaker 1: and Banker collide. Welcome to the show that takes you
Speaker 1: beyond the clubhouse and onto the green. There's balls and tees,
Speaker 1: your passport to the golfing universe, where every swing tells
Speaker 1: the story and every part has its punchline. Get ready
Speaker 1: to step onto the large screens and dive into the
Speaker 1: world of givens, drives and delightful.
Speaker 2: Better ladies and gentlemen. Welcomes to Bosanties once again we
Speaker 2: have the big men today and Dedrick, how are.
Speaker 3: You very well? Seople, Thanks for having me on. It's
Speaker 3: a pleasure to be here.
Speaker 2: Hi, Diddric, I know that you've just assumed the position
Speaker 2: of CEO for Can you please tell us a bit
Speaker 2: more about it and yourself with the PGA.
Speaker 3: Sure, maybe I'll start with the PGA, because that's a
Speaker 3: little bit closer to my heart. The PGA is a
Speaker 3: nonprofit organization and we essentially look after the professionals that
Speaker 3: work within the golf industry. So many of our members.
Speaker 3: We've got about seven hundred and twenty full active members
Speaker 3: with the association, and many of them work in all
Speaker 3: sectors of the industry, other being mainly coaching, you know,
Speaker 3: coaching people to play golf. Management, so either managers or
Speaker 3: golf directors at golf clubs that manage these things. And
Speaker 3: then there also a bunch of other sort of areas
Speaker 3: that the guards go into and ladies go into, so
Speaker 3: they either do rules or there's travel. A lot of
Speaker 3: them do social media. So it's a vast, vast different
Speaker 3: sort of job description that our members has. And we're
Speaker 3: we're also a non gender association, so mail and email
Speaker 3: we look after both of those. And you know, our
Speaker 3: members are very successful at what they do and they
Speaker 3: may be turning to me. I'm forty five years old.
Speaker 3: I come from a little town used to be a town,
Speaker 3: but it's a kind of a city now in Jobur
Speaker 3: called Kempton Park and it's probably more commonly known for
Speaker 3: Ernie Els, which is one of our two golfers legends
Speaker 3: of the game on the tour, and he's also an
Speaker 3: honorary member of the PGA of South Africa. So I
Speaker 3: come from there. I joined the PJA slightly different to
Speaker 3: quite a lot of people. A lot of people either
Speaker 3: had a great amateur career and they moved into sort
Speaker 3: of the teaching area and joined the PGA. But there's
Speaker 3: also professional golfers that played on tour that joined the
Speaker 3: program a little later to be able to move into
Speaker 3: the industry and then work with people to enjoy the
Speaker 3: game of health. I mean I started my dad worked
Speaker 3: it in a stainless steel company and he just made
Speaker 3: golf clubs out of steel rods and flat part for me,
Speaker 3: and I had ping pong balls in a back garden
Speaker 3: that I just used to hit so I don't break
Speaker 3: any windows of the house. And from there on in
Speaker 3: my mom saw a program that I did which was
Speaker 3: a provider of education of the PGA. I started there,
Speaker 3: did my three year course through them, went through the
Speaker 3: practical stuff, and then I was able to qualify. So
Speaker 3: I've been a member of the PGA now for twenty
Speaker 3: odd years and I've on a class what they would
Speaker 3: call a Class Advanced Fellow PGA Member, which just starts
Speaker 3: at Class A and it goes double A, Triple A
Speaker 3: Fellow Advanced Fellow, and then it goes to your Master Professional,
Speaker 3: which is the most recognized one that we have. So
Speaker 3: that's a little bit about me.
Speaker 2: Wow. Yeah, he assume that you've been dead with the
Speaker 2: pgo in the perfect fertinity. But I mean, golf is
Speaker 2: evolving faster than ever, so if you're not paying attention,
Speaker 2: you might get left behind. You know, what, what was
Speaker 2: there that PGA is doing right now that every golfer,
Speaker 2: then industry players and needs to know.
Speaker 3: Well, we work with quite a lot of stakeholders with
Speaker 3: in South Africa. There's a there's a vast sort of
Speaker 3: a packet of our stakeholders in South Africa that we
Speaker 3: work with too, you know, from the Sunshine Tour to
Speaker 3: the Club Managers Association to Golf or s A which
Speaker 3: looks after the amateur body. So our members work with
Speaker 3: pretty much all of those in terms of what they
Speaker 3: do for them. So a lot of our members coach
Speaker 3: professional golfers so that they play better on tour. A
Speaker 3: lot of our people, our members, coach amateur golfers. And
Speaker 3: what we really do in terms of the PGA is
Speaker 3: we are there to grow the game of golf through
Speaker 3: our members. And you know, it's a funny thing how
Speaker 3: these things work is that if you play better golf,
Speaker 3: you're going to play more golf, You're going to enjoy
Speaker 3: your golf more. And the idea behind that is that
Speaker 3: our members do that and then grow the game of golf,
Speaker 3: where those beginners that join into sort of the golfing
Speaker 3: fraternity then join a golf club and then make the
Speaker 3: golf community a lot stronger. So that's pretty much what
Speaker 3: our members do and what we do from our side.
Speaker 3: But we work also globally with what we call the
Speaker 3: PJA World Alliance, which is the pg of America, Great
Speaker 3: Britain and Ireland, Canada, Australia, New Zealand. Just to knowme
Speaker 3: a few but yeah, as you say, I mean, since
Speaker 3: COVID golf is just boomed and it changes every single
Speaker 3: day from launch monitors to technology, it's just incredibly how
Speaker 3: fast it's moving at this point, and our members are
Speaker 3: at the forefront of that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean you're speaking more about the changes in golf,
Speaker 2: you know. I mean we can clearly see all these
Speaker 2: big changes coming to the game, the new formats, new stars,
Speaker 2: new ways of how people can play. Can you give
Speaker 2: us an inside or scoop on what's necked for the
Speaker 2: golf in your view?
Speaker 3: Look, we're not so close in terms of what happens
Speaker 3: on the professional tours, so so as we if I
Speaker 3: can give you a little bit of a step a
Speaker 3: little bit back. You know, there's two sort of sections.
Speaker 3: You have what we call the Tour Player Section, which
Speaker 3: is used to be part of the PGA, and then
Speaker 3: in the mid eighties the two bodies split, so you
Speaker 3: had what they call the Tour Player Division and then
Speaker 3: you had the Club Pro division, which is two different
Speaker 3: sections the Tour Player divisions now now known as the
Speaker 3: Sunshine Tour, and the Sunshine Tour looks after the professional
Speaker 3: golfers and what they do within their area. Our aim
Speaker 3: on the other side, from a club pro perspective, is
Speaker 3: we look after the game at golf clubs, at golf
Speaker 3: facilities and grow the game through that, so through kind
Speaker 3: of amateur golfers and through the professionals. But if you're
Speaker 3: talking about sort of more the live and the PGA
Speaker 3: Tour sort of roles and what's currently happening there, I
Speaker 3: think there, I think it's an interesting time for golf.
Speaker 3: You know, golf. Golf is a in a space where
Speaker 3: at least people are talking about the sport, and we
Speaker 3: love that because that's the way it should be. But
Speaker 3: I think at the end of the day, the right
Speaker 3: thing will happen because people want to see the best
Speaker 3: players played together. So I can't give you the end
Speaker 3: game because I absolutely do not know what the end
Speaker 3: game is. We look after we look after our members
Speaker 3: and what they do with industry within South Africa to
Speaker 3: grow the game of golf, and we hope that, you know,
Speaker 3: we hope that they so that out from a professional
Speaker 3: golf perspective at the top level.
Speaker 2: Not fantastic. I mean, you know, some says equipment is
Speaker 2: making the game too easy. Ata says it's helping to
Speaker 2: grow the sport. Where do you stand on this debate?
Speaker 2: And could use could we see any rule changes around
Speaker 2: clubs golf balls in the future.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think currently there's not too many. Too much
Speaker 3: talk about changing rules and that they used to talk
Speaker 3: to roll back the ball a little bit, but that's
Speaker 3: just in the beginning stages and we're not sure where
Speaker 3: that's going to go. But I think if you talk
Speaker 3: about equipment equipment, I mean, as you said earlier on,
Speaker 3: it's moving fast and an equipment equipments they essentially to
Speaker 3: try and make the game of golf easier for people,
Speaker 3: and I think they've done it essentially over the past
Speaker 3: ten fifteen years. They've done it and We've seen a
Speaker 3: lot of people get into golf. It is unfortunately an
Speaker 3: expensive hobby to start playing. But as soon as you
Speaker 3: have the equipment, the equipment last you a lifetime. So
Speaker 3: you know, equipment is changing, but it's day to make
Speaker 3: you play play golf and make it easier for you.
Speaker 3: So I don't think there's any rule changes really on
Speaker 3: the rise and very soon, apart from just maybe the
Speaker 3: roll back of the golf wort.
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, you you spoke a little bit
Speaker 2: more about the PGA, but you know a lot of
Speaker 2: people don't really realize just how how much the PGA
Speaker 2: is doing to shape the future of sports, particularly maybe
Speaker 2: let's say in South Africa. So what's one thing that
Speaker 2: is happening behind the scene that is going to change
Speaker 2: the golf as we know it from the PGA perspective?
Speaker 3: If I tell you, I might have to kill your supports.
Speaker 3: Unfortunately secret I mean, I mean, as I said earlier on,
Speaker 3: it's there's no secrets to it. I mean we we
Speaker 3: as the p GA, we just offer our members and education.
Speaker 3: So we we do continue to education with our members
Speaker 3: so they stay up to date with the latest and
Speaker 3: greatest teaching techniques. You know, from a fitness perspective, our
Speaker 3: people have to look after their bodies to be able
Speaker 3: to play golf. Nutrition. And then also you know, from
Speaker 3: a from a business perspective, we give our members the
Speaker 3: tools to be able to run golf clubs uh successfully.
Speaker 3: You know, there's there's unfortunately fortunately and unfortunately I think
Speaker 3: golf clubs have got a committee sometimes in place, but
Speaker 3: the experts within those industries is the club managers and
Speaker 3: the golf directors, the retail guys on the floor that
Speaker 3: are at the forefront, and they're there every single day.
Speaker 3: And I think, you know, the changes come at some
Speaker 3: stage where it would be better to just work together
Speaker 3: better from a committee's perspective, with the management at golf
Speaker 3: clubs to make it successful. And and and that's what
Speaker 3: our members does. I mean, our members are trained within
Speaker 3: those areas and they are experts within those areas, and
Speaker 3: we look forward to expanding that within the golfing market
Speaker 3: so that our members show what they can do in
Speaker 3: terms of you know, running facilities, retail facilities, et cetera,
Speaker 3: et cetera.
Speaker 2: I mean, I mean you you look at what you
Speaker 2: speak up art mostly of the work that the PGA
Speaker 2: is doing. And I mean as you look at the
Speaker 2: the play today of golf is changing. You know, players
Speaker 2: are driving longer, play, they are playing smarter, and they
Speaker 2: they are training as our clients as well. So so
Speaker 2: how has that strategy changed in the last decade? And
Speaker 2: then what's next for modern golfers because you're looking at
Speaker 2: the training side of it, but to train these professionals
Speaker 2: putting together the whole logistics of very chain of golf.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, as you rightfully said this, I mean
Speaker 3: people specifically golfers. And if you look at two level golfers,
Speaker 3: and I think at any sport, I think everything, all
Speaker 3: of those people are just becoming stronger, They're becoming taller,
Speaker 3: you know, they just swinging the club faster. So you know,
Speaker 3: I think as good as that is, you know, I'm
Speaker 3: a bit of a traditionalist, so I enjoy the you know,
Speaker 3: the long eating is nice to look at sometimes, but
Speaker 3: I enjoy people actually playing the golf course. From a
Speaker 3: strategic perspective, I don't think you're going to stop that
Speaker 3: in terms of people hitting the ball further, but there
Speaker 3: is going to be a limit some point. You know,
Speaker 3: you can only hit the ball so far, So you know,
Speaker 3: in terms of that sort of thing. From a fitness perspective,
Speaker 3: technology perspective. You know, I think it's just going to
Speaker 3: continue going, but I think it's going to be to
Speaker 3: the good of the game because it's got to keep
Speaker 3: the game interesting for people.
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, did you see people playing now
Speaker 2: we have a lot of more indoor golf, and we
Speaker 2: have the traditional outdoor golf. But you know, if someone
Speaker 2: isn't really following golf closely right now, what's the one
Speaker 2: may achieved that they're going to recret missing out in
Speaker 2: the next few years.
Speaker 3: I mean, you can see it happening in America seper right.
Speaker 3: It's you know, with the start of this tg L movement,
Speaker 3: which they have the indoor facility with teams playing against
Speaker 3: each other, and as you rightfully say, I mean, indoor
Speaker 3: golf is becoming one of the most popular pastimes for
Speaker 3: golfers globally. So you know from recent studies that's done
Speaker 3: globally what they call of course golfer. So these are
Speaker 3: either people doing you know, playing on a simulator, doing
Speaker 3: putt putt, just hitting balls on a driving range that's
Speaker 3: not physically playing on a golf course. That number is
Speaker 3: actually exceeding the number of players that's playing on a
Speaker 3: golf course. So you can see there's there's huge demand
Speaker 3: for golf. But I think from a time perspective, a
Speaker 3: lot of people are choosing shorter versions of golf and
Speaker 3: also potentially less intimidating versions of golf to be able
Speaker 3: to get into golf. But for us, I mean to
Speaker 3: be honest with you, anybody that plays any version of
Speaker 3: golf for us is amazing.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's good for everybody. So you know, we would
Speaker 3: love them to join a golf club and join the
Speaker 3: community of golf. But you know, if they not as
Speaker 3: confident yet, I think they must make a time go
Speaker 3: down to the local PDA professional and just go and
Speaker 3: maybe spend some time with them so that they can
Speaker 3: show them that it's not as intimidating as they think
Speaker 3: it is.
Speaker 2: Okay, Didrick, Now I would like to put you on
Speaker 2: a sport right, What's what? What's one golf rule that
Speaker 2: you think, oh, maybe have had players secretly wish that
Speaker 2: it would disappear, but probably it will never disappear.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, yeah, you're oputting me on the spot
Speaker 3: because I've got to be pretty diplomatic about this simple
Speaker 3: but I've always I've always thought, you know, and and
Speaker 3: it's something that I believe in from my side, you know,
Speaker 3: but we also cu custodians of what happens. But ultimately
Speaker 3: we're trying to make the game easier for people. So
Speaker 3: for me, the one rule that really doesn't make sense,
Speaker 3: and it's a bit tongue in cheek for me, but
Speaker 3: it's the it's the you know, the ball in the
Speaker 3: divid rule. You know that you if you hit the
Speaker 3: ball in the middle of the fairway and you land
Speaker 3: in the divot, that you're not allowed to drop out
Speaker 3: of that divot. So for me, it's not necessarily I
Speaker 3: understand that the rules of golf, you know from the
Speaker 3: RNA is you know, you play the ball as you
Speaker 3: find it, yeah, and as it lies one hundred percent.
Speaker 3: But if you're looking to grow the game of golf,
Speaker 3: you know, if somebody is a twenty four handicapper and
Speaker 3: they've you know, they've hit their best drive in five
Speaker 3: rounds and they hit it for the first time in
Speaker 3: a fair way and they get there and it's in
Speaker 3: a divot, yeah, I just worry that it might demotivate
Speaker 3: that person. But that's that's my opinion. You know, I
Speaker 3: don't make those rules, so that is one that I
Speaker 3: would potentially I could potentially look at.
Speaker 2: But yeah, no, nice one, nice one. I mean, so
Speaker 2: golf is growing in your my case, you know, Asia,
Speaker 2: the rest of Africa, especially a any environments as well.
Speaker 2: Where do you see the biggest opportunities for the game
Speaker 2: in the next decades?
Speaker 3: Yeah, you say markets. I mean there's there's obviously geographical
Speaker 3: markets that it moves into. But we were very passionate
Speaker 3: about I mean, we've got the rights of of the
Speaker 3: of the PGA within Africa, so we do a lot
Speaker 3: of work through the RNA and through our members where
Speaker 3: we move into Africa and we do what they call
Speaker 3: the African High Performance Project, which is moving into Africa
Speaker 3: through our members and they grow the game with some
Speaker 3: of the players within Kenya and Zimbabwe, et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 3: But those are geographical areas. But what we also, what
Speaker 3: we're also quite passionate about, is just our membership base.
Speaker 3: So I set to you early on we are non
Speaker 3: gender membership base and you know our ladies and ladies
Speaker 3: golf within South Africa is also a big market. So
Speaker 3: so I see I see a lot of that happening.
Speaker 3: And also, you know, gender and race. We also see
Speaker 3: quite a lot of black, Indian and colored people moving
Speaker 3: into the space of golf, which is just amazing. I mean,
Speaker 3: wherever we can grow the game of golf, we happy,
Speaker 3: happy to do it. But yeah, so from a geographical perspective,
Speaker 3: I think Africa is a big one. But also from
Speaker 3: a demographical perspective, I think the you know ladies, colored
Speaker 3: Indian men, color, you know that sort of that sort
Speaker 3: of markets are growing definitely.
Speaker 2: I mean, just to put you on this maybe just
Speaker 2: before we take a little bit of praying. So with
Speaker 2: all these changes that were discussing and happening around, and
Speaker 2: there's both broadcasting is also changing. For example, what we
Speaker 2: have right now in comparison to the tra traditional brodcast,
Speaker 2: And how does the PGA pland to tap exciting, educational
Speaker 2: to the next generations of fans. Where are people hearing
Speaker 2: it on digital media, people being able to see it
Speaker 2: on social media and all of all those environments.
Speaker 3: No, look, don't we don't really have a big presence
Speaker 3: within the TV space. I think that's more Sunshine tour space.
Speaker 3: They obviously run tournaments we really haven't explored, and many things.
Speaker 3: We obviously do social media, which we try and promote
Speaker 3: our members, but we are going to do a little
Speaker 3: bit more. You know, these sort of platforms that you
Speaker 3: guys do seeple from a podcasting perspective, we know how
Speaker 3: powerful these things are and it also it also tells
Speaker 3: people a little bit more about the background of what
Speaker 3: the PJ is, how they play their role within the industry.
Speaker 3: But yeah, I mean, I think YouTube, social media, podcasting,
Speaker 3: that sort of thing I think is going to be important.
Speaker 3: We see how big youtub has become from a golfing perspective,
Speaker 3: and we hope we can contribute. Yeah, but as I
Speaker 3: said earlier on, I've got a face for radio, so
Speaker 3: maybe it's nothing new.
Speaker 2: No no, no, no, no, no, no, no problem. Can you
Speaker 2: just take maybe two minutes break so that you can
Speaker 2: some water?
Speaker 3: Perfect?
Speaker 2: Okay, thank you.
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Speaker 2: Welcome back again for the lovers of golf. We hear
Speaker 2: talking with District, the new CEO of PGA, talking about
Speaker 2: golf realizing and lending a little bit more about the
Speaker 2: PGA today, Ditric, I mean, I see you've got a
Speaker 2: Tattleis back behind you. You really really listen to be
Speaker 2: someone who has a relationship with the Taitleist, do you, well?
Speaker 3: The PGA is a relationship with Titleist and what we
Speaker 3: call a kushnet, which is start Joy and they they
Speaker 3: the patron of our Pathway to Membership program and what
Speaker 3: that is is there's sort of two ways to get
Speaker 3: into the PGA as a member and to study the
Speaker 3: PJ program. So you can either do as I said,
Speaker 3: two pathways. The one is what we call an associate pathway,
Speaker 3: and the associate pathway is you have to find a
Speaker 3: job within the industry. You've got to have a handicap
Speaker 3: less than four, you have to go some through some
Speaker 3: sort of safeguarding process which which just allows us to
Speaker 3: make sure that you don't have a criminal record, you know,
Speaker 3: you know, the normal safety things, and then you are
Speaker 3: able to join the PJA as an associate. So you
Speaker 3: do that as a full time employee at a club
Speaker 3: and then on a yearly basis that they go to
Speaker 3: a residential where they then study for the week and
Speaker 3: then they go back to the workplace and they work
Speaker 3: within the industry. Now, the other partway is what they
Speaker 3: what we call a provider pathway, which is what I did.
Speaker 3: You we have seven providers throughout the country that that
Speaker 3: give our education and then there's students that join those providers.
Speaker 3: They stay amateurs so they can play, but they study
Speaker 3: full time, full time. They don't work within the industry.
Speaker 3: So they do their studies for the three years and
Speaker 3: then after that they would then join the PGAs as
Speaker 3: a member, and then they would start their process. They
Speaker 3: do one thousand hours at a golf club and then
Speaker 3: they would either do a teaching ability test and a
Speaker 3: playing ability test, and then they would become a member.
Speaker 3: So sorry I diverted a little bit there, but but
Speaker 3: your titleist is our patron of that program, which which
Speaker 3: allows us to do the good work we do. So
Speaker 3: we're very thankful for their for their support in that.
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, you sound like someone who's very,
Speaker 2: very busy. How often do you play golf?
Speaker 3: I think you you play more golf than what I do.
Speaker 3: I mean, I come from a I come from a
Speaker 3: management background, so I for the last eighteen or twenty years,
Speaker 3: I've worked either in a golf club. So I started
Speaker 3: as a person that just you know, cleaned golf carts,
Speaker 3: you know, that sort of thing, and then I work
Speaker 3: myself up into the retail space at a golf club,
Speaker 3: then into golf directorship, and then into a general manager position,
Speaker 3: which I had just before I came to the PGA.
Speaker 3: So my background is management. So yes, I've been busy,
Speaker 3: but you know, if you love what you do, you
Speaker 3: don't get busy. I mean it's we're passionate about what
Speaker 3: we do. So from a playing perspective, if I play
Speaker 3: twice a month, that's maybe a lot. So a lot
Speaker 3: of people think we work within the industry and we
Speaker 3: out on the golf course every day because I head
Speaker 3: officers yet Royal Johannesburg, which is a lovely facility. They
Speaker 3: think we go out there and play golf every every
Speaker 3: single day at lunch hour. Player I olls, but it's
Speaker 3: totally the opposite. There's so much to do and if
Speaker 3: we get the chance, we love it, but we unfortunately
Speaker 3: don't get the chance too often to do that.
Speaker 2: No, thank you. I mean you know there's a c
Speaker 2: you you also have a classroom, right, and then there's
Speaker 2: a say that tool here as an h us when
Speaker 2: you get the lessons where people are saying that golf
Speaker 2: is a mental game. So so what's one of of
Speaker 2: aspect player development? Is that going to separate future champions
Speaker 2: to to the rest based on the mental of the game.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean mental. The mental side of the game
Speaker 3: has also taken a huge leap forward as much as
Speaker 3: the technology side has done. So there's there's lots of
Speaker 3: very good psychologists that work with with players out there,
Speaker 3: and it's a huge part of golf because I mean
Speaker 3: I've always set up I played many sports within my life,
Speaker 3: which is which is mainly you know, a lot of
Speaker 3: sports involved moving moving balls. So it's other rugby that
Speaker 3: the ball moves, or cricket that the ball comes to you,
Speaker 3: or tennis that the ball moves. But golf is such
Speaker 3: a psychological sport because the ball is sitting stationary on
Speaker 3: the on the ground and you as the person, have
Speaker 3: to try and move it. So there's all these thoughts
Speaker 3: that run through your head. You know, don't miss it
Speaker 3: right in the water, don't eat it left out of bounds,
Speaker 3: or don't duff it. But from a mental perspective, I personally,
Speaker 3: I am quite bad with the mental side. So that's
Speaker 3: why I never turned professional to go and play on tour.
Speaker 3: I'm a social golfer. I really love going out and
Speaker 3: playing golf with people and enjoy the day with them
Speaker 3: and try and make them play better. But yeah, from
Speaker 3: a psychological perspective, there's so much happening within that space
Speaker 3: and you've got to be so good at it. If
Speaker 3: you want to play at the at the highest level,
Speaker 3: you know you've you've got to shut or all the
Speaker 3: noise that goes goes in around you and what people
Speaker 3: say and and what you think. But it's all about process.
Speaker 3: You know, if you've just got a good process, a
Speaker 3: good pre shot routine, you're always going to be successful
Speaker 3: if you do that. So if you want to play
Speaker 3: high level, I definitely suggest that you go and go
Speaker 3: and search for somebody that that can help you with that,
Speaker 3: because it does definitely help.
Speaker 2: I mean, did you as you elaborate that you've been
Speaker 2: around the golfing environment for at least two decades and
Speaker 2: then you just assume that one of the big roles
Speaker 2: in in the golfing fertinity. I mean not to go
Speaker 2: into details to end for for for us as the
Speaker 2: amateur golfers, social golferst and probably even from the people
Speaker 2: who are coming into your program. What are the things
Speaker 2: just a few things, uh, maybe we need to look
Speaker 2: out look out for from your direction and then also
Speaker 2: from the this this position that you you would probably
Speaker 2: like to see that can even attract young young people,
Speaker 2: young players and even the players of color and orda. Look.
Speaker 3: I mean, we've we've done lots of good work also
Speaker 3: with the previous CEO that was in place. There's been
Speaker 3: a lot of work done in terms of you know,
Speaker 3: diversity and inclusion that we have within the industry. So
Speaker 3: there's our base of ladies, our base of races either
Speaker 3: being black colored India, and that base is definitely grown
Speaker 3: and there's a lot of work that goes into it
Speaker 3: from us. We we as I said earlier on, we
Speaker 3: were very inclusive. So we want people to join the program.
Speaker 3: But unfortunately, it's like any program that you have to
Speaker 3: have some sort of criteria to allow people into the
Speaker 3: into that that space. You know, the PGA worldwide, there's
Speaker 3: only sixty thousand PGA members. If you look at it,
Speaker 3: that's such a small it's such a small niche membership
Speaker 3: base around the world that really do touch so much
Speaker 3: in terms of a global fraternity. I mean so so,
Speaker 3: I think from our side, we just want to make
Speaker 3: sure that we grow the game of golf through our members.
Speaker 3: We support our members, and we would love to get
Speaker 3: more and more young people to join the PGA to
Speaker 3: experience what I've experienced from the game. I mean, the
Speaker 3: game has given me so much, not just from a
Speaker 3: you know, from a growth perspective, but also just from
Speaker 3: a relationship perspective. You know, it's such a wonderful game.
Speaker 3: And you know, I think if I talk to people
Speaker 3: that want to do the PGA membership, of course they
Speaker 3: must definitely look look for us. But I think if
Speaker 3: you're looking just from an amateur side that wants to
Speaker 3: play better golf or understand better golf, I mean, there's
Speaker 3: no there's no better person to go and speak to
Speaker 3: other than a PGA professional at a golf club or
Speaker 3: a golf facility. These guys and ladies are so passionate
Speaker 3: about what they do and hopefully we can wrap that
Speaker 3: off onto the younger generation or just the amateurs that's
Speaker 3: out there to be able just to play better golf
Speaker 3: and enjoy it more, because that's ultimately what we want
Speaker 3: to is get people to enjoy it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean you know that you when when we
Speaker 2: see a look at golf and how people really got
Speaker 2: introduced into into into the golfing environment. Sometimes people come
Speaker 2: to golf not really by the PGA program. So I
Speaker 2: have friends who play golf, they will invite me and
Speaker 2: someone and then the next time I invite a friend
Speaker 2: of mine. So but and then now I am I'm
Speaker 2: not a professional coach or a professional from a PGA.
Speaker 2: But I've introduced myself my friend to golf. But how
Speaker 2: important are the rules of golf in that part? Because
Speaker 2: I mean, if I've been introduced by someone, then I
Speaker 2: introduced another person, I might have a lot of pending
Speaker 2: on the rules of golf. But how important is it
Speaker 2: are the rules of golf for for for amateurs, especially
Speaker 2: the ones who are introducing their friends, who are introducing
Speaker 2: them and their families who won't necessarily go through the
Speaker 2: pg A coaching system.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean the rules are very important. I'm not
Speaker 3: sure if you're talking about the rules of golf as in,
Speaker 3: you know, from the r n A side, or if
Speaker 3: you're talking more from an etiquete perspective, but both are
Speaker 3: equally important.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so no, I was just saying about the rules
Speaker 2: from Irene for for example. Is there a role that
Speaker 2: the PGA is playing to really get the people who
Speaker 2: just that team to play golf to understand the rules
Speaker 2: and the ety kids.
Speaker 3: Yeah, definitely. I mean the PJ is not the custodian
Speaker 3: of the rules of golf, so we just play our
Speaker 3: part to educate people of the rules of golf. I mean,
Speaker 3: golf is the custodian of it in South Africa and
Speaker 3: the RNA obviously support them. But I mean, the rules
Speaker 3: of golf is incredibly important. I mean, you've got to
Speaker 3: have a set of rules that you play any sport by.
Speaker 3: I think if you if you go out with your
Speaker 3: friend on a Friday afternoon and you're just having playing
Speaker 3: a nine holes, I think you can be a little
Speaker 3: bit more lenient on the rules. But unfortunately, when you
Speaker 3: do play in club competitions or competitions with your friends,
Speaker 3: or competitions in a golf day, et cetera. Of golf
Speaker 3: is incredibly important because unfortunately, golf is a you've you've
Speaker 3: you've got to you've you've got to kind of look
Speaker 3: after yourself. You you manage yourself when you're out there.
Speaker 3: There's no rules official that walk along with you every
Speaker 3: single time you play. So you've got to be honest
Speaker 3: and and and I mean that's the beauty about golf.
Speaker 3: The beauty about golf I've always said is, you know,
Speaker 3: teaches you so much more than just golf. That teaches
Speaker 3: you to be punctual, that teaches you to be respectful,
Speaker 3: you know, honest, there's there's so many values that you
Speaker 3: get from golf that you don't get from any other sport.
Speaker 3: And that's why I love golf, not necessarily about golf,
Speaker 3: but because all the piper peripheral stuff that come with it.
Speaker 2: No, no thank you for for that, did you? So?
Speaker 2: I just want to get a little bit more controversial question,
Speaker 2: just to get the CEO insider. How does coli success
Speaker 2: of the game balance with its intracrity? Is there ever
Speaker 2: a conflict between tradition and business growth around golf? You know?
Speaker 3: I mean if there weren't sponsors and partners within golf,
Speaker 3: there wouldn't be golf. I mean there's a lot of
Speaker 3: people that play, you thought, either being with us and
Speaker 3: our partners that plays a massive role in what we
Speaker 3: do to travel around the country to support our members,
Speaker 3: to be able to get the message out and grow
Speaker 3: the game of golf, but also to all the other
Speaker 3: bodies within South Africa. So corporate South Africa is usually important.
Speaker 3: But it's you know, it's like anything, you've just got
Speaker 3: to be when you have those partners, you've got to
Speaker 3: treat them with respect because a lot of them have
Speaker 3: you know, are also passionate about golf. I mean there's
Speaker 3: so many people that are passionate with about golf within
Speaker 3: the golf in fraternity that love just supporting either us
Speaker 3: or any other of the the bodies within South Africa.
Speaker 3: So you know, it's I think it's crucial. It's just
Speaker 3: the way you manage it within your business as an entity.
Speaker 2: You know, as I said, the tradition and the controversial
Speaker 2: around this, but the you know, with my perceptions. So
Speaker 2: what I've realized is the traditionally if we look at
Speaker 2: the corporates that have a tradition of golf, so oftentimes
Speaker 2: now based on the empowerment women are literally in big
Speaker 2: corporates holding key positions. For example, the marketing. You find
Speaker 2: that the marketing executive in a particular company doesn't necessarily
Speaker 2: play golf. When they look at the golf, they see
Speaker 2: golf as an environment where people who play golf are
Speaker 2: reach so they don't have to put their CSI projects
Speaker 2: around golf. But when you look at a lot of
Speaker 2: social golfers, they play golf for social cohesion, so they
Speaker 2: raise money to put that part. So in your perspective,
Speaker 2: what is it that you think we need to do
Speaker 2: to really educate the people to get golf closer to
Speaker 2: the people I mean from our side, there's a media
Speaker 2: that is driving the growth of the game. There's only
Speaker 2: enough that you can do. But in your perspective, what
Speaker 2: do you think we should probably do to really engage
Speaker 2: the people who might not necessarily know anything about golf,
Speaker 2: but they will be sitting on those budgets to say way,
Speaker 2: I mean, they support different types of sports, they support education,
Speaker 2: but when it comes to their view around golf, they say, well,
Speaker 2: why should we support the golf because people who are
Speaker 2: playing golf already have money, but they don't really see
Speaker 2: the way that the golfers are doing behind it. Social
Speaker 2: golfast golf itself where they go there, do the charity
Speaker 2: work and then contribute for for social coersion.
Speaker 3: I mean, social careasion is obviously very important, and I
Speaker 3: think you know, it's not for us to tell corporates
Speaker 3: where they need to spend their money. But you know,
Speaker 3: if I the only thing that I can say to
Speaker 3: corporates is, you know, if you if you want to
Speaker 3: if you want to get people to understand golf, you've
Speaker 3: actually got to come and play the game before you
Speaker 3: actually have to sort of have an opinion about it,
Speaker 3: because it really is such a great game. Everybody loves it.
Speaker 3: It It sounds intimidating and it looks like it's rich
Speaker 3: people that that that play the sport, but it's essentially
Speaker 3: it's not. I mean, there's such a wide variety of
Speaker 3: golf facilities within South Africa that can cater to anybody
Speaker 3: within any range of economic sphere. So so for me,
Speaker 3: you know, it's always difficult to get corporates to come
Speaker 3: together to some sort of main cause, but I think
Speaker 3: a lot of them also have their own interests. But
Speaker 3: the only thing that I can say to corporate South
Speaker 3: Africa is that you know, if you want to if
Speaker 3: you want to spend an afternoon out with your staff
Speaker 3: and the office, there's no better way just to bring
Speaker 3: them down to a golf course. Search and look for
Speaker 3: the nearest PJA professional close to you and let them
Speaker 3: do a clinic for whomever is there. You know, if
Speaker 3: it's a clinic for ten people or fifteen people, put
Speaker 3: them down, tell them a little bit about golf, the rules.
Speaker 3: It's not as intimidating as people think, but yeah, it
Speaker 3: is challenging. I think we're also in a challenging economic
Speaker 3: environment and people are looking at spending their money correctly.
Speaker 3: According to what they need to spend it to. So
Speaker 3: you know, they also look at a different sort of
Speaker 3: return on investments. But you know, sometimes the return on
Speaker 3: investments also just creating something at us, at a place
Speaker 3: for people. You know, the golf club is a community
Speaker 3: and if you can help that community to thrive, it
Speaker 3: also helps your brand at the end of the.
Speaker 2: Day, No, thank you for that, did you sow? I mean,
Speaker 2: we come into our confusion over show. So, but I
Speaker 2: just want to get this. As a CEO of the PGA,
Speaker 2: you play a major role in shaping Gold's future. What
Speaker 2: legacy do you hope to leave behind in the game.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, you know, legacy is such a big word.
Speaker 3: I'm not I'm not really you know, I'm not really
Speaker 3: into those leaving legacies behind. I think I think if
Speaker 3: you do what you need to do, you leave a
Speaker 3: footprint behind for somebody else to take over and move on.
Speaker 3: I don't think there's a specifically legacy that I'm searching
Speaker 3: to do. I mean, we as the PGA and the
Speaker 3: body of professionals within South Africa, we're just looking to
Speaker 3: grow the game of golf and let people enjoy the
Speaker 3: game of golf. So I think if we can do
Speaker 3: that as a as an association and I can be
Speaker 3: a little bit of a part of that, I mean,
Speaker 3: that would be that would be great. So I don't
Speaker 3: I'm not begging to leaving legacies behind. It's you know,
Speaker 3: I know a lot of people want to do that,
Speaker 3: but it's not something I personally want to do. If
Speaker 3: it comes with a territory after I've left, that's great,
Speaker 3: but it's not something that I'm that I'm striving towards.
Speaker 3: I'm striving towards making our members understand that we grow
Speaker 3: the game of golf through you know, getting the amateurs
Speaker 3: to play better golf, them joining golf clubs, and then
Speaker 3: letting the whole community thrive. I mean, that's, at the
Speaker 3: end of the day, what we want. So I don't
Speaker 3: know if that answered your question, but yeah, that's ultimately
Speaker 3: what I think I would want to do when I
Speaker 3: leave here one day.
Speaker 2: No, No, definitely, I mean thank you for for for
Speaker 2: for that insight. I mean, I know that trick. You
Speaker 2: are very busy individual to really make sure that our
Speaker 2: game grows. So any advice would like to live with
Speaker 2: our audience, the young players of the amateurs, beginners and
Speaker 2: and those that wish to start playing the game and
Speaker 2: all those things. So just the fun facts around around
Speaker 2: the game.
Speaker 3: I mean, I don't I don't think there's too much
Speaker 3: to say. I mean, all I'm going to say to
Speaker 3: everybody that's to join. You know, if you want to
Speaker 3: join a journey to become part of the golfing community
Speaker 3: in terms of getting people to play better golf, so
Speaker 3: become a PGA professional, You're more welcome to go to
Speaker 3: our website and go and have a look at at
Speaker 3: the educational side of things, which is www dot pg
Speaker 3: A dot do z. And if you want to start
Speaker 3: a journey on that direction, we would love to have
Speaker 3: you pease engage with us. But then just from from
Speaker 3: another side, from the beginning that doesn't play, even just
Speaker 3: a normal amateur. I mean, I invite you go down
Speaker 3: to your local golf facility, look for your nearest pg professional,
Speaker 3: have a chat to them, get them to to take
Speaker 3: you out and you know, get get get a little
Speaker 3: bit of practice and see what golf is all about.
Speaker 3: They will give you the best advice. And that's kind
Speaker 3: of the only advice I can give people. I mean,
Speaker 3: they have to go look for your nearest PG Professional
Speaker 3: and just go and visit them.
Speaker 2: Didrick, thank you very much for your time. Ladies and
Speaker 2: gentlemen you had today we had Dittri, who is the CEO,
Speaker 2: the new c of PGA. This is the man who
Speaker 2: is going to make sure and help us understand a
Speaker 2: bit more of golf. Ditrick, thank you so much for
Speaker 2: the work that you guys are doing at the PGA.
Speaker 2: Please keep on doing their good wik so that we
Speaker 2: can clode the game to get more amateurs, to get
Speaker 2: more players and getting more members to quote the sport that.
Speaker 3: We love perfect. Thanks you, thanks for having us and
Speaker 3: we hope to see you on the fairways at some point.
Speaker 2: No, no, definitely no, thank you very much.
Speaker 3: Thank you everyone, Thanks for having me.
Speaker 2: Thank you, Bye bye