Speaker 1: We should read our Bible as men digging.
Speaker 2: For bury treasure.
Speaker 3: The Bible is the world's most popular enigma.
Speaker 4: It's secrets lost to cultures beneath the sins of time.
Speaker 5: Where is it.
Speaker 1: It is the glory of God to conceal things, but
the glory of kings is to search things out. God
wants you to seek to read his word to look
for that knowledge. He wants you to do that.
Speaker 5: And the people and I see, uh, they like chopped
out eighty books in the Bible.
Speaker 4: We need to bring those back. There's more bad guys
in this thing than a Ruce Willis.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that's bad to.
Speaker 5: That, dude.
Speaker 1: I love the intro of the show because.
Speaker 4: It's exactly right. There's some nuggets of gold in his word.
Speaker 2: Because you guys always signed and shot.
Speaker 4: You got to dig it, dig it.
Speaker 2: Show us your negvits, y'all.
Speaker 3: Our creator lies outside of time space.
Speaker 1: And that I feel like guy would be like, hello, McFly,
you ain't got it so far. Then there are secret
societies think that they are descendants of the Giant.
Speaker 4: I mean, isn't this exciting?
Speaker 1: I mean, your reading it's like wow.
Speaker 2: In that philology around fable.
Speaker 1: But these angels were taken to help themedia not pass
goals Backwa's hundred dollars.
Speaker 3: Robinson, dirty hands means clean theology.
Speaker 2: Can you dig it?
Speaker 3: What's going on on? My local guys and gals in
long distance paths?
Speaker 2: We're back.
Speaker 1: You're so good at that?
Speaker 4: You're not? I know, No, you're I've this is something
you do. You do a decent job.
Speaker 1: I can't fill your shoes.
Speaker 3: What's the benfits?
Speaker 4: Only nine and a half, they're not very big.
Speaker 1: No, I guess I can fill those shoes for sure.
Speaker 2: He's not the benfoot, No, I'm not.
Speaker 6: That was hilarious, as I like to call them benfoot.
Speaker 2: Well, benfoot.
Speaker 3: I heard you had a I have had a good week, adventurous.
Speaker 4: And yes, adventurous week would have to be what Yes,
So Sunday, driving driving home, we went out to the
family farm and my stepdad had detractors. I was bringing
it back. So I'm in my twenty five hundred dollars
and I'm sitting at a red light and I go
to pull out and it moves a little bit, and
then I hear a big clunk, and it sounded if
if any of y'all's out there have a a straight
drive kick out of gear. It's what sounded like just cow.
So I went pushed to clutch in which I'm still
moving a little bit. As I cram it in the
first gear again, I'm hearing clunk, clunk, clunk, and I go,
oh no.
Speaker 2: My wife looks over.
Speaker 4: She goes, what's that. I said, that's the drive shaft
hit the ground. So I reach up putting full drive, trying,
you know, I wiggling over get it out of the
out of the traffic lanes on the shoulder and I
get out look and it looked like where the drive
shaft connects to the rear end, the little straps just
you know, rung off the bolts the uh oh well
they call it anyhow, the bolts it had like a
little ledge around it. We just sheared that ledge clean off.
So has a proper name, but I can't think right now.
But anyways, the thing the thingy, So I was like, oh,
this ain't gonna be bad. You know, it's just all
all the bolts were there, so I was able to
back them out. We got a new you joint these
traps put them up. It's like good to go. Pulled
out again, but this time it felt like the truck buckled.
Now when that don't feel good?
Speaker 6: Right?
Speaker 4: When I was taught to drive from my uncle's they
always said you drive by the seat of your pants,
which I know that's like a saying, but you feel
the motion of the car in your butt. It's how
they taught me. Like driving the back home, but you
can kind of feel where the angle of the equipment
by your butt kind of. I don't know, it's weird,
but anyways, it felt really odd. So I went, oh no,
so I cut it off, put it back and forth,
drive e break, went to push it in, and it
was like it wouldn't want to go in, so I
get out. Drive shafts lain on the ground again. But
now the hoghead pumpkin wherever you wanna call, it's pointing
straight up at the.
Speaker 3: Bed of the truck and he's talking about the big
round thing you see axles in the back of the truck.
Speaker 4: So anyhow, my least spring u bolt brackets sheared off.
So luckily I have an awesome family. One uncle stopped
while sitting there waiting on my stepdad to show up
with some tools. All the part store. We could walk
to it. You know, Uncle, you broke down. Yeah, so,
which he has tools in his truck.
Speaker 1: He always does so.
Speaker 4: And then we ended up calling my other uncle who
had a rollback. So we got it here and in
order to get it off the roll back, we had
to chain the axle to my hitch so the axle
wouldn't roll up into the you know, four wards into
the body of the truck for summer like the Because
it was the back you bolt's broke, so went forward
the front you bolt for still intact. It kind of
bound the axles so it wouldn't roll backwards as we
pulled it up. But with the front ones, the back
ones broke, it just slid, so we had to chain
them up.
Speaker 2: Twisted like a pretzel.
Speaker 4: Pretty much. Yeah, took it apart. Everything's good that the
rear end looks completely fine. And then yesterday which I
already told these guys this story already, yesterday, we went
to the Drags out here in Bristol and on the
way home Stonewall my jeep over here. We dropped Dad
off and I said it home with the boys in
the back. We had a guy's day. It's usually followers
Day weekend, but they did it a weekend. Earlier, so
but we still went and all of a sudden, I mean,
it's just kind of a funky feeling. And when I
built a jeep, I tried to use some kind of
off roa track bar, and I've got beadlocks. You have
to look at what beadlocks are if you don't know
what they are. But anyhow, it would do the same thing.
And a turn, it's like you turn and then all
of a sudden it darts into the turn like the
tires roll and then get more grip, and so it
cats you the turn harder and it's sketchy to drive
like that. So I went and got the stock swaybar
put back in, and I figured if I air the
tires down a little bit with the beadlocks, it kind
of tightens up your side walls. So that seemed to
fix it well. Driving home, I got out checked the tires,
which they were hot, so the pressure in them was more.
So let's somewhere out and almost home. I'm like, I
wonder if that swaybar broke, which it didn't break, but
somehow one of the bolts come out and the linkage
fell off, so the linkage fell down. Like I still
had the linkage, but it disconnected it pretty much, so
I've got it to fix. And then yesterday evening, going
into town to go eat some supper, the car wouldn't start,
and it's like the and I mean it was just easy.
It was just that the positive cable was loose on
the battery. How did it come loose out? No idea,
But it's like, come on, it's been it's been a week.
Speaker 2: You're in the clear. Now let's trouble well.
Speaker 4: True speeding tickets, Yeah, I was running threes. That's what
I've always been told. And it's usually you get pulled over,
you just expect two more times knock.
Speaker 2: I would if I get another one, I lose my license.
Speaker 4: How many have you had?
Speaker 1: Well?
Speaker 3: That the whole deal with the hospital, me rushing to
get to the hospital.
Speaker 4: We're doing dagon school zone. Yeah, blowing your horde while
you passed the cop probably wouldn't a get well.
Speaker 3: I mean, I mean either I mean the biggest dumbest
criminal ever, or it's an emergency.
Speaker 4: Hey cop, look at me. Yeah, I thought you was
going to jail. I passed him. He had like eight
cop cars. I'm exaggerating.
Speaker 2: This probably have been a four or five.
Speaker 4: There was at least four eight cop cars behind them.
Speaker 3: Well mean we always exaggerate numbers.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and and there like was like eight cops in
each car. I mean he was like a swat team.
Speaker 1: There justin looks dangerous the car.
Speaker 4: I was like, man, they did have their goods. Yeah
I did. I did see that. I was like, what
the But I was like, should I turn around?
Speaker 1: Like nope, sorry, they got their guns out.
Speaker 2: I pull you pull your guns out and help me.
Speaker 4: I didn't have any us coming home from work, usually
have one on me, but unfortunately works that they frown
upon that in certain certain places I.
Speaker 2: Go, did you have any vehicle breakdowns?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 1: I got a flat tire?
Speaker 4: Yeah. Here on this he's he's part of a jeep.
He's part of the Jeep family.
Speaker 3: Now, oh yeah, I heard you got a cherokee.
Speaker 4: Yeah, little little chair.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and it's a green one, so it's like being
this green.
Speaker 4: Yeah, this Cherokee here is green. It's forced green.
Speaker 3: So he can't get your your hair, so he wants
your car. I just know a few episodes ago, you know,
you made the joke that he's trying to intimidate unions.
Speaker 2: We're going back and forth about hair and what is it?
Speaker 4: Intimidation is the greatest form of flattery, that's all I
gotta say. Oh, that's great. We're just a big jeep family.
Speaker 1: Now that's the way the way it works.
Speaker 4: Well, Justin has to borrow a jeep, which his wife's jeep.
But I mean muscle car, his car or a jeep.
I'd probably stick with the car.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that car is sick.
Speaker 3: I love that car. I've been contemplating selling it.
Speaker 4: I've comtemplated stealing selling stone Wall a couple of times. Yeah,
my wife will get all excited.
Speaker 2: We'll see. I was stilling the wife.
Speaker 4: Did I get to pull the trigger like and get
cold feed? The amount of work I put in that,
I just say, I can't see.
Speaker 3: Derek Gilbert announced that he's doing he always does, a
trip to Israel that went last year, and he announced
this to go that he's going.
Speaker 2: With Timpty Alberino.
Speaker 4: Oh, that would be fun.
Speaker 2: And it'd be about six six thousand bucks.
Speaker 4: I say six bucks.
Speaker 1: I'm there.
Speaker 3: So I was telling her. I was like, I'm really
getting into editing and stuff now. I said, I got
fifteen to twenty thousand dollars just in equity in that car.
It was like, I could sell that, pay for the
trip to Israel, get me a really nice camera and
start doing some documentaries, and.
Speaker 4: You could pay for all of us to go.
Speaker 2: That's right off, right trip.
Speaker 4: You get twenty We'll throw in a hunt or five
hundred apiece. That's twenty one. That covers all three of us,
no doubt. I mean, I take that deal.
Speaker 3: The dig Bible Podcast's first documentary.
Speaker 4: Yeah, the Holy Land with Derek.
Speaker 3: Gilbert, timsy Alberino and the guys from the dig Bible Podcast.
Speaker 1: I think we do in the asterisk section on the
bottom of that though, but that would be that would
be cool. Man. If this goes any longer, we have
to do a toolbox talk for just this. So this
is about the longest intro ever.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, well we're at fourteen minutes. It's okay, Well,
whose turn for prayer?
Speaker 4: They can fast forward it, yep, I'll let you pray, sir.
Speaker 3: Father, Thank you today, Thank for many blessings. Thank you
for all of Ben's car troubles resolved. We thank you
for just all the silver lining blessings that we tend
to miss sometimes when we get caught up in our fields.
But thank you for the weather. We got some rain
of coolest off today. Just we thank you that we're
never alone and we always have that hope in Jesus Christ.
And as always be with us the Holy Spirit, Godess,
give us the sermon of your word, and have it
reached those who it needs to reach.
Speaker 2: Amen.
Speaker 4: Amen. Yeah, talking about I, you know, Mom's like it's okay,
I said, I know nobody got hurt, right, could have
been totally worse. That's doing eighty miles an hour. That
I mean, I wouldn't be doing eighty but going down
the road it had just ripped it clean out at
that point. And then uh, I told her, I said, hey,
we've sat here for three hours. I might have missed
something major happened.
Speaker 2: I got t boned by.
Speaker 4: An eighteen wheeler.
Speaker 1: You never know, I thought.
Speaker 4: If this didn't happen, and the same with the jeep,
if I didn't stop, pull over and checked the air pressure,
what where would I been when some drunk driver on
drugs come across m H. It's always you gotta look
at the class half full, not half empty. Tell them
about that.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I didn't get to tell them.
Speaker 2: This is not good.
Speaker 3: Old Mountain dew as they like to say in our
part of the woods. But uh, this is actually blessed water,
supposedly blessed by an angel. I did a video, like
a little video on the first time we went. It's
called Houston Minerals. It's down next to Jefferson City, but
it's up on my I think it's on that TikTok
page that I had started. But basically, this guy named
Houston way back in the day, like in the early
nineteen hundreds, had some kind of kidney disease and the
doctors told him there's nothing to do for him, that
he was just going to die. Had a dream an
angel told him to drill like a one hundred and
fifty feet or something. That was all documented in the
newspapers and all this stuff. But he dug he found
a well, started drinking that water, and it healed him.
He lived a long, healthy life after that. And then
there's many local people that I met the first time
I went that said that women having yeast infections, never
taking any medicine, just drinking the water it cleared it up.
Men having kidney stones, it busting up the kidney stones
and they passed them.
Speaker 2: And they've never had Kenny.
Speaker 3: Stones since they've started drinking this water. And they even
got papers up on the wall, like they sent labs
and had it tested, and it's just rich in all
these minerals that you can't find anywhere else, and they
can test.
Speaker 2: I let them try it.
Speaker 4: It tastes like nothing.
Speaker 2: That's nothing.
Speaker 3: It's tasteless water. It's pretty good stuff. So anytime you know,
we have some free time or we get low on it,
we take a trip up there and stock up on it.
It's like fifty cents a gallon, I.
Speaker 4: Mean, a secret and bottle of water, wouldn't it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and better.
Speaker 6: I guess you have to carry a bunch of Mason jars.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but a bunch of people carry them like them,
big old like gas jug looking things and fill them up.
Speaker 4: It always tastes better out of glass. It does get
Coca coas better out of glass.
Speaker 3: But getting on, I guess with today's subject. We were
talking about gnosticism one day, and I had always heard
about it, but I didn't.
Speaker 2: Really know exactly what it was.
Speaker 3: And one day at McKay's used books, I found a
couple of books that was on gnosticism and the Gnostic Gospels.
So I got your reading into it and stuff, and
I just found it fascinating.
Speaker 2: So I asked the guys if they.
Speaker 3: Wanted to just take a look at it and study
and just kind of talk over what is it, what
have we found, and stuff like that. So that's what
we're going to attempt to do today. The two books
that I found, everybody this woman named Elaine Pagels, you know,
on the Gnostic Gospels and the viewpoints. She's a historian,
and by the two books that I read, you know,
she's she's kind of a Gnostic sympathizer in the least,
she spun them in a real positive light. You know,
it wasn't hard to tell which way she was leaning,
But those two books were the Origins of Satan and
the Gnostic Gospels. But it was basically the Origins of Satan.
She was in a roundabout way saying that, you know,
Satan's basically a figment of our imagination that we created
up to cast all of our blames on. And the
whole Gnostic you know line of thinking is, you know,
the surrounded around the word nosis, which means knowledge. You know,
the name Gnostic means that they're basically there their knowledge
seekers and we'll get into more detail about, you know,
what they believe in stuff, But it's uh, I thought
it was pretty crazy looking how all the secret societies
and uh, Mysticism, you know, and stuff like that all have.
Speaker 2: Hints of this.
Speaker 3: You know, you go to you know, Pythagoras, you know,
you know, way before Christ there was all kinds of
hints of this, you know, seeking secret knowledge of enlightenment
to bring you closer to God or the Creator or
a god conscience, you know, and then Egypt and uh,
the Masons. It's just when you go through they all
have hints of this, and so I think it's uh,
I'm not a coincidence theorist. I think if something shares
the same details and hints of things like that, it's
you know, usually has a common denominator somewhere. Steved what
kind of stuff did you find in your dig?
Speaker 1: Mostly historical stuff? I did? You know it? It's pretty
amazing because it's it's really diverse, all the different sects
of this and the different paths that went, and actually
kind of interesting that I think they said it's Mandaism
is the only surviving Gnostic religion from antiquity. From prior,
which actually is it's kind of interesting that it's in
Iraq and Iran and they say there's about sixty thousand
to seventy thousand people that still practice that today. But
that's like the only version of because this, as far
as we can track it, it's the first century is
really where you can truly see where it comes from.
And it's interesting because all of the knowledge that we
initially got from this is from those early church fathers
like Irenaeus and a couple other ones, but that's where
Tertullian origin. But these guys all are the ones that
that gave us that initial knowledge, and it was all
and it was all in a negative context because it
was all calling them heretics, you know, so that's where
most people got that information from, was saying don't do this.
Not hey, here's the information on this. No, it's don't
do this because it's heresy. I just thought that was interesting.
Speaker 3: But one thing I thought was, you know, is when
they first started finding these, you know, Gnostic gospels and
things like that was in the eighteen hundreds in the
Upper Egypt, and you know, for those that are unfamiliar,
it's kind of like a flip flop. What we think
is Upper Egypt, they call Lower Egypt, so it's kind
of a flip flop. But they found these papers in
Upper Egypt on papyrus leaves, and many of the Gnostic
gospels were found there, the Secret Book of James, the
Gospel of Thomas, and the Gospel of Mary Magdalene. But
I just got little bits and pieces of stuff that
I just thought was interesting. But the Gospel of Mary,
chapter seventeen through eighteen, records of the disciples were deciding
to write down the teachings of Jesus, and then Peter asks, Mary, sister,
we know the Savior loved you more than the rest
of the women. Tell us the words of the Savior,
which you remember what we do not know and have
not heard. You know, this is the reason for that
whole You know, the Vinci Code books and the movies
alleging that Jesus and Mary had an intimate relationship, And
even one of these Gnostic gospels has a passage say
that you know Jesus kissed Mary, but you know, we
don't know where he kissed her, because it was like
deliberately burnt out. So the early church fathers have a
pretty good reason for you know, calling these guys, you know,
heretics and stuff. But in that book she reveals, you know,
secret teachings on the soul's spiritual journey. And then Andrew
of Jason says, I do not believe the Savior said this.
These teachings are strange ideas. And then Peter joined in
and said, did he really speak this to a woman
in secret? And did he truly love her more than
he loved us? But and then in nineteen forty five
they had another discovery of more Gnostic Gospels at a
hidden library of And forgive me if I mispronounced this,
but nag Hamandi.
Speaker 2: That's is that how you'd say that?
Speaker 3: But and that one greatly extended to understand and of
the early Christian movement and how that happened. Uh, you
got anything in here?
Speaker 1: Well, they said that that besides that little sect over
in Iraq and Iran that still kind of lingered on
that that the that whole movement had pretty much died
out until that Nakamadi was found in nineteen forty five,
and that kind of brought a little bit of a
resurgence of this that returned to enlightenment and things of
this nature and the belief patterns and and you know
what was his name, Valentinius? Yeah, right, and then one
of the founders of what we believe to be a
founder of the Gnostic ideologies. He actually believed like, hey,
we're right in line with Christianity. This is this is
christian this is the belief this is you know, he
believed that. But it was Aaronaus and like you said,
origin Tertullian. And it goes on, I mean further down
the line where all these church fathers were calling him,
we're calling them heretics and whatnot to and and you
saw a big division where the separation happened in all
those different sects, where they kind of branched off and
even their views.
Speaker 2: You know, it's Christianity.
Speaker 1: I was going to liken it to that to some degree.
But they can't even agree on on the resurrection, well
even like God, like who the creator is and who
this is, because some will believe that the original you know, God,
if you want to call it whatever. They had a
name for him.
Speaker 2: I got it in here somewhere.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I got it written down to monad So and
they called him. The thing is, they said some sects
believe that he created everything, and other sects he believed
that he his his divinity it emanates down, right, So
his divinity, the I can't say that word emanates down
and it created these these beings they called AONs, right,
And one of the one of these AONs was called
the demi Urge, and the demi Urge was the creator
in some of these sects. So not only was it
not the you know, the God who is the way
that they the way that I interpret it and correct
me if I'm wrong, was it that the God that
is the all above all the others in this little
pantheon it's kind of indifferent to us, has doesn't It
was just like, oh, it's just his divinity emanated down.
And then you get into the point where you start
seeing that with these other AONs, and even then they
have that was it, Sophia when those esoteric ideas of wisdom?
Speaker 3: And I'll let you get into that in philosophy. But
the common strain that I've seen was Satan's Genesis three narrative.
What did he say when he gave the knowledge you know,
and he offered the you know, the fruit, He said,
ye shall be as gods. So all of these selks
believe that they themselves, through studying and acts and with
no need of Christ or no need of God, can
ascend to God, you know, through the height of God, yeah,
or the Christ's conscience. And you see a lot of
that New agey stuff. It's reminiscent of.
Speaker 1: That also enlightenment. They're looking for that enlightenment. It's almost Buddhist.
You see that kind of connection with Buddhism. You think,
like you just said, the New Age movement, same kind
of way you're looking at self enlightenment, right. And the
whole point is that the way that they say it
is that only some will have the ability to reach
that at plateau, that.
Speaker 2: Plane the select you the chosen.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: But uh, I just wrote down some of these, you know,
gospels and what they believe, just the exposures to it,
and you can kind of just see how far out
some of this stuff is, you know. Now, the Gospel
of Thomas, it begins with this, It says, these are
the secret words which the living Jesus spoke at which
the twin Judas Thomas wrote down. Well, the first thing
stands out to you is, you know, Jesus didn't have
a twin, okay. But in this book, Jesus, you know,
quote unquote said if you bring forth what is within you,
what you bring forth will save you. If you do not,
it will destroy you, you know. And this was written
in Coptic and goes to the third and fourth century AD.
But these books were believed to be part of a
sacred library, of the oldest library in Egypt, you know.
And these books were burned around three seventy a d.
After Archbishop of Alexandria ordered them to be banned and
deemed them heresy and demanded that they'd be destroyed. But
these books were under attack much earlier than that, about
two hundred years by, you know, Ernelius of Lions.
Speaker 2: He was the first to accept the.
Speaker 3: Four Gospels, Mark Luke, Matthew, Mark Luke, and John as
canonical and exclude the rest. But the Gospel of Thomas
was a quote unquote secret teaching, and it contradicts Mark
chapter one of verse fifteen, where it says the time
is at hand and the Kingdom of God draws near.
Thomas records Jesus saying.
Speaker 2: If those who lead you say to you.
Speaker 3: Lord, the kingdom is in the sky, then the birds
precede you, and if they say it is in the sea,
then the fish precedes you.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: Here to them, the kingdom represents a state of self discovery.
But rather it says in quotations, rather, the kingdom is made,
I'm sorry. Rather the kingdom is inside of you and
is outside of you. When you come to know yourself,
then you will become known, and you will realize that
it is you who are the sons of the Living Father.
So once again you know, you shall be as gods.
Everyone has the divine spark inside of them, the christ consciousness,
and it's up to you to seek that knowledge and
grow yourself.
Speaker 1: You see a lot that's the same thing that you
see a lot of that. With that, the whole New
Age ideas, even though you can repackage it, rename it, it
doesn't necessarily a you know, God per se in the
New Age movement, it might, you know, it's just find
your inner self, find your best self, you know, become enlightened.
It's it's just scary because you see these things and
you see how it's slowly over time, even even back
to the time of the first century. We were talking
right after Jesus. But and you go all the way
through time and you see how these things kind of
shoot off and pervert a little further, a little further,
and you can see the hands of the enemy working
on this and changing things. And what they do is
at first, like I said, at first they showed that
it lined up right with Christianity, and then all of
a sudden, you're gonna just change this little idea here
and tweak this to make it seem okay. Yeah, and
then they take it to the next level. And then
they take it to the next level. And as we
go through history, you can people are able to let
that kind of at first, these little tweaks, these big
tweaks become a little more Oh that makes sense. I
could see that, And I just wanted to throw this
one thing in there real quick. That the urge I
was talking about that a lot of them believe as
a creator is depicted. I think this is great, is
depicted as a creature with a lion's head and a
serpent's body. Now pretty interesting when you really think about that,
especially after what we just talked about with some of
the astrological astronomy stuff that we talked about, you know,
in the last couple episodes you talk about the you know,
Satan masquerading as an angel a light, right, you know,
masquerading as the lion, you know, not the Lion of
Judah that we talk about, but maskating as a lion.
And yet it's the wolf in sheep's clothing. You see
the lion's head with the serpent's body showing himself as
that angel a light, but right behind him all that
evils right there, his true self is exactly exactly.
Speaker 4: And you can take that kind of stuff and look
at even today with the whole you can be a
cow if you want to be a cow.
Speaker 1: Like, oh, it's getting taken into the next level.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, it's just slowly progressed. I mean, you had
the whole in the sixties, the whole you know, love,
free love stuff, which started more I mean, I'm sure
homosexuality was always around, but it kind of made it
more popular, and then it kind of died off a
little bit, and it's coming back. And now you've got
twelve year old girls they can hey, we can do this,
we can go swing. Well, you can be a switch hitter.
That's that's not at all. And then then people goes, well,
she's just twelve, she'll grow out of it. And you're
just saying, oh, that's normal. Well when they I mean,
the thought might happen, but you got like, no, that's
not right. And then you teach them. Then they go, well,
you're right, right, that's not right. You know, two cows
can't have a calf. You gotta have a bull and a cow.
And and that's in nature, you know.
Speaker 2: And that's the problem.
Speaker 3: You have to have an absolute truth. And people say, oh,
it's no, there is no absolute truth. It's it's everyone
has their own truth. Well no, then that's just so
in seeds of deception. You we almost have a standard.
There's a reason why every culture in the world, you know,
no matter what culture you are, language, we all have
universal truths. We all know it's not right to kill, right,
we all know it's not right to steal, and that
that those are absolute you know, they're universal truths. And
and they're trying to all that garbage is just you know,
be your best self now you know you're perfect.
Speaker 2: The way you are, there is no.
Speaker 4: Yeah if God, you know, God knows you. It's like
these these I can't think of what kind of churches
they call it. But it's the come as you are.
I mean, yeah, coming as you are. You know, you
don't have to be fit perfectly fixed and then come
to God. I mean that's the all, that's the journey.
Say there, I'm missing something, I'm broken, I'm living in sin.
Speaker 3: Ten years later, you shouldn't be broken still righting stuff.
Speaker 4: Or you're you're not You're not getting it right at
the whole.
Speaker 2: There are nothing we can do for you, nothing news ones.
Speaker 4: And it's like the Roman Empire. They were these burly, powerful,
aggressive fighting force of soldiers conquering everything and then what
was the They killed themselves. They they got all they
got into this free love, do homosexuality, all this kind
of crazy stuff that's going on today, and it recked them.
Speaker 2: What's a cancer?
Speaker 3: But it always, it.
Speaker 1: Always starts with the truth, and then a slight perversion
from the truth, and then a greater perversion from the truth,
until each one of those things seems more acceptable.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 4: But if like like say today, say if yesterday we
were in the time of Jesus and then you're to
today the way the world is, people would be like,
you're freaking nuts, you can't know, how did you go
from that to this. But if you only look back,
well ten years ago, you know, the you had maybe
a gay parade, and well, people's, wow, what's.
Speaker 2: The frog in the bowling water? Slowly turn up the.
Speaker 4: Heat today and forbid you go out and protest the
gay parade because now you're the bad guy and that,
and then it goes into the whole stuff they're doing
in schools, these different kinds of shows.
Speaker 1: This does, this does go way back though, because it's
always been no, that's what I was going to say.
And you talk about being able to portray herself as
a man or as like the first ever transgender type
deity that would either sleep with mat or a woman
could show herself as a man or woman, and and
it's that's I mean, that's historic.
Speaker 4: I mean that's and and it's going it goes from
like we're saying, it's the slow progressive. You know, you
think ten years from now and the way they are now,
it's not that much different. It's getting different quicker and
quicker now because she's just taking it to I'm gonna
be a unicorn today in an elephant tomorrow. Well but
you know, it's just ignorance. But it's it's to this.
Speaker 1: I don't understand, and that's something I'm glad you don't understand.
I'm glad. But but in all seriousness, when we talk
about this, and it's it's something that we're gonna all face,
Our kids are gonna face. Everybody that we know is
going to face this stuff. And well we already are,
but our but it's gonna keep going. And we have
to understand that we that's that's that's our job. That's
as a Christian group, as the Church of Christ, our
job is to stand firm in our beliefs. But at
the same time, remember what we always say is we
don't condemn the sinner. We condemn the sin. Like I
don't agree with what certain people do. I know God
still loves those people. God wants those people saved. And
and if we treat them like the majority of the
church in the past treats them, all we're gonna do
is drive them away and make them make them feel
lead to this that we're that we're because then it
makes but it makes us heretics too, because we're we're
not going by what Jesus said, We're not going by
the path that we're put on. If we're not taking
the the the way that Jesus was that. I saw
that post. I think Liz reposted it the other day.
But it's like Jesus didn't tell the sinners to go
to church. He told the sinners, or he told the
church to go to the sinners. It's like we go.
And the thing is we have to always remember we're
sinners too. Everybody's this, you know, we're all in the
same boat. The only difference between us and them is
that we have salvation now because we have accepted Jesus.
We have accepted that truth. If we don't have that,
then we're no different than any I don't care what
you do. I don't care if you're Charles Manson or
if you're Ru Paul. We're no different than them. If
we don't have Jesus, we're no difference.
Speaker 4: So and it's.
Speaker 1: I know we got off base.
Speaker 3: Yeah we're way off base.
Speaker 1: But to be fair off to be fair this, well
it is a little off base from the stuff, but
it's but it is a it's it's what this it's
a nacissism, is a view into the way that our
world has changed.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that it's kind of like the stepping stone to
get to us today the world the way the world
is today. But anyhow, go.
Speaker 1: Ahead, now back to you, Jesse, I'm so far off
base now I don't even know.
Speaker 4: Let's back it up. I had to do it for you.
Speaker 2: We're back.
Speaker 3: But going on the Gospel of the Gospel of Thomas,
that where he talked about you know, he referred to
Thomas as Jesus's twin. When I first read that, you know,
I was like, anybody knows the scripture knows Jesus didn't
have a twin, you know, where the hell they come
up with this stuff? So then I kept reading this book.
I found it and I was just like, what it
all goes back to this new age.
Speaker 2: Christ consciousness stuff.
Speaker 3: But according to the Gospel of Thomas, the Kingdom of
God symbolizes a state of transformed consciousness one enters when
they attain self knowledge and when they come to know
oneself at the deepest levels, they simultaneously they come closer
to God and knowing the source of one's being. But
Mark chapter eight is where this comes from. Verse twenty
seven through twenty nine. This is when he Jesus asked Peter,
you know who do you say that I am.
Speaker 2: You know. He says, you know.
Speaker 3: Jesus says, you know, you answer correctly, you know, because
he said he was the Christ. Well, the Gospel of
Thomas records that same event, but instead of Peter, it's
Thomas that he's talking to. And Thomas gets this answer
right when he replies, Master, my mouth is wholly incapable
of saying whom you are like, not are, but who
you are like, because in this account Jesus asked them
who would they compare him to. So in the Gospel
of Thomas, Thomas says, oh, well, you know, my mouth
is unholy. There's no one I can compare you to.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: It says at this moment that Thomas transcends from a
disciple to master. Jesus declares that Thomas has become like himself.
This is where we get the twin language that we
talked about earlier. Jesus then responds and says, I am
not your master, for you have drunk and became drunk
from the bubbling stream that I have measured out. Whoever
drinks from my mouth will become as I am, and
I myself will become that person. And these things that
are hidden will be revealed to him. So basically, it's like,
this is a spirit that attaches to a person, and
then once that person teaches it to another, the spirit
leaves them and goes to the other. Now they're the
master and the teacher. And that's when it hit me.
I've heard people talk about Jesus was not the son
of God. It wasn't until he was baptized. The spirit
came down and Jesus said, this is my son, whom
I am well pleased. And they say that is the
point when Jesus became enlightened and became a Christ.
Speaker 4: I've heard some some people say something to that effect.
Speaker 1: The other part which when I pulled up in logos
and actually it used a different section actually to say
the same thing because it talked about you know, we've
talked about that before, that baptism being where some people
believe that's you know who what I can't remember who
we were talking to, but somebody said how they felt
or that it had been thought that, you know, at
that point, Jesus, you know, Jesus was declared the son
of God. You know, he was it wasn't really the
son of God, but he at that point. But but
is it John seventeen. Jesus actually praised to be This
is a scriptural Jesus prays to be glorified, it says.
Jesus said these things, and lifting up his eyes to heaven,
he said, Father, the hour has come, glorify your son
in order that he may that your son wait, I'm sorry,
in order that your son may glorify you, just as
you have given him the authority over all flesh in
the world. Would jeez, I can't read today. Let's back
that up one more time. I'm gonna take this from
the top here. Jesus said these things, lifting his eyes
up to heaven, and said, Father, the hour has come.
Glorify your son in order that your son may glorify you,
just as you have given him authority over all flesh,
in order that he would give eternal life to them
everyone whom you have given to him. Now this eternal
life that they know you the only true God, and
Jesus Christ, whom you have sent, I have glorified you
on earth by completing the work that you have given
me to do. And now Father, you glorify me at
your side with the glory that I had at your
side before the world existed, So it's this is the
this is actually when I searched gnosticism, I just put
it right in the search and logos. You get the definition,
you get kind of the run down. I love logos
for this reason so many different things. And then it
gives you it straight up gave me that passage right
there to kind of when when that's one of the
passages that not like the Gnostics would have used to
say when it talks about glorifying right, it talks about
that enlightenment. He's trying to enlighten me. Let me be
like you those types of things when you know the
problem is is that anytime and you'll see this with
a lot of different groups, with the Hebrew Roots group
or with different types of groups that we talk about
that will take scripture and they change it to their
narrative how it works for them. So they can make
a verse or a section and say, well, look this
is what it says right here, But you take it
out of context. And if you don't look at the
context of the scripture, then you don't see everything that's there.
So and and and if you I mean, it's it's
hard because if you go back and even look at
because we're talking about you know, a lot of this
these writings were from that first century, and even then
at Irenaeus and then you said it origin Tertullian and
all them, we're already calling it heretical. So you're already
seeing that back at that point that they already you know,
didn't line up. They already didn't have that that even
at that point they didn't agree on some of those teachings.
So you know, at right now, if you aren't invested
in your Bible, if you weren't sitting there and reading
it for yourself, and you're taking and you're taking somebody
else's word. If I'm just going and I'm I'm just
listening to somebody on a podcast or on YouTube or
anything else, and you're not digging into it yourself, it's
very easy to sit there and say, oh, this is
someone's interpretation and it could be out left, you know,
and this is the best way to say it is
the Satan believe in God. You sure darn righty does.
So it's not that hard to say that. You know,
all these different things are it's right in front of you.
You need to check the source, you need to go
back to it, because if you're not digging into the word,
it's very easy for you to get missing some the
wrong information from the wrong thing.
Speaker 3: And not just the verse they quote, like you said,
because they can pull out a context if they say, oh,
Matthew two four says this, So that proves my point,
because I believe this is this, and that says this.
Don't just pull out your phone and google that verse.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, he's right, that's what it says.
Speaker 3: No, read that entire chapter or in the very least,
read eight or ten verses ahead of it and after
in the full picture.
Speaker 4: Yeah, he could be talking about something totally different. Yes,
you know, it was it.
Speaker 1: I always say, though, and when I think, and I
think that this applies in this situation more than most
people realize. When what it says, test the spirits, right,
always test the spirits. And I believe that means that
when someone's telling you something, there could be evil spirit
behind that too, So you need to test that spirit,
which means yes, always go back to scripture, always know,
and just be founded in your Bible. Always be founded
in scripture, and and after that you can have more discernment,
you can have more that's why do you think we
have to pray for discernment because there's so many other
sources that are pushing us in different directions, different ideas,
different ideologies. And you look at just the Christian Church,
like you said before, with how many different denominations are there.
Speaker 3: I mean, they can choose what parts of the Bible
they want to believe.
Speaker 1: And that's the part that bothers me.
Speaker 4: They're all reading the same Bible.
Speaker 1: Yeah, what does Jesus say, he said, Peter Cherry picker,
Well he did, well, he probably did say that, but
he said, but the cherries are really good. But he said,
he said, Peter, and you are the rock in which
I will build my church. Right. He didn't say all
my different churches. He didn't say, this is where I'll
build the Methodists, this is where I'll build the Baptist
the Catholics, the Lutherans. He didn't say that said my church.
We should all be united. And that that part right
there is where I feel the church as a whole
is failing. Is because we're fighting too much among ourselves,
and and we don't even know who the real enemy
is anymore.
Speaker 4: Well, and and if you look at I mean that's
that's the devil. I mean, it's it's it's like we've
always heard about our country, right, if we can, if
we can, you know, put put the men fighting against
the women. The men are or whatever that word is, manly,
but it's not masculine. And the women, you know, they're
the feminist. You know, they hate ben and they're trying
to make it to where to to the women that
men hate the women and look down on them. Now
we're fighting ourselves in our own country and we're not
paying attention at all what the government's doing.
Speaker 1: What does every great and that's what does every great
military strategists do? Oh yeah, divide and conquer.
Speaker 4: That's it.
Speaker 1: If you can divide the church much easier to take
people away from it or or.
Speaker 4: To sideline them to believe. Well, yeah that I like
the way. Shoot this church over here says if I
believe this way, I'll be filthy rich. I'm gonna go
that way.
Speaker 1: Thank you. Joel Olstein.
Speaker 4: Yeah that's yep. I just didn't want to name Draws.
Speaker 1: But yeah, yeah, you could be your best self.
Speaker 4: Yep. I seen I did you send me that video
where the preacher guy was went into his church. I've
seen a video where another preacher went into Joel Oldstein's
church and was saying, this is not right. I mean,
I guess in this church it looked like a whole
bookstore selling his books. He said, this isn't right, and they,
you know, tried to rest them kick him out. He said, hey,
Jesus went to the to the temple was slipping tables
because they were doing the exact same thing. Well, this
is private property, he says, Well, don't call it the
church called a place of business, because that's what I mean.
But he got kicked. You know, we'll see. I'll try
to find it now, send it to you into Facebook
or something. I guess I can do that, couldn't I.
But anyways, it's it's.
Speaker 1: Just really like this topic because it's taking us down
some good little rabbit.
Speaker 4: It's like you're saying, you gotta read it in context
because you can pick and cherry pick any durn verse
you want, you know, just and Jesus said you'll be saved. Hey,
if you give me twenty million dollars, check out verse
wherever you will be saved. It tells you right there,
just donate us some money. I don't think it works
so many.
Speaker 1: Because my name ain't Jesus, all right, justin back at it.
Speaker 3: But so the whole, you know, the twin you know,
terminology goes to he had self knowledge, he found the
divine within, you know, Jesus says in the Book of.
Speaker 2: John, you know, I am the door. Whoever enters through
me shall be saved. You know.
Speaker 3: So it's it's already contradicting the Bible. But there's another
book that's the Gnostic book. It says the teaching of
Salvanus points to a different direction. That the teaching of
Salvanus was another Gnostic gospel found at Nagamandi Library, and
it says, knock upon yourself as upon a door, and
walk upon yourself as on a straight road. For if
you walk upon that road, it is impossible for you
to go astray. Open the door for yourself that you
may know what is. Whatever you open for yourself, you
will open. So it's all about you, divine knowledge and
Christ's consciousness.
Speaker 2: Once again, so not God will open the door. You
have to open it.
Speaker 3: Yes, you don't need God, you don't need Jesus.
Speaker 1: I know it's not exactly the same, But every time
we talk about this, it reminds me. It reminds me.
Speaker 2: Sorry, that's what I was talking about. That's why it
ain't working.
Speaker 3: That you need that got the four five.
Speaker 1: It's been working.
Speaker 2: I've seen online. It's that one that has the four
or five.
Speaker 1: I have been using it, but I pulled that one
out because I had that one too.
Speaker 3: That's how it runs off of that thing.
Speaker 1: Well, it's gonna die right now.
Speaker 4: Mm hmmm, hmmmmmmmm yeah, this is going uh h h yeah.
Speaker 2: Now it's got a lot in bold on it.
Speaker 1: I won't turn back on now. Hold on, let me
do this real quick. It's got the battery in it still.
I think that it's it. I can't get it to
do both. When the batteries in it stops at the
battery I should have I didn't even think about it.
But I don't have a case for this battery have
a case for all the other ones. For some reason,
I don't know. I gotta get now. It doesn't want
to turn on at all.
Speaker 2: You got a new battery. You just put a new
battery in to turn it on.
Speaker 1: Like Jesus, that things like one hundred and fifty degrees.
That's hot, that's really hot. That's weird. It says it's
this battery still says it's full.
Speaker 2: Okay, that's pretty warm too.
Speaker 1: That's turned on.
Speaker 4: Yeah, well that's pretty odd to mm hmm.
Speaker 1: All right, it's working again. I remember what I was saying,
what are we talking about? I think I had.
Speaker 4: A good point too. Back he didn't play it. You
do that?
Speaker 3: Well, he's talking about knocking, the door will be open.
Speaker 2: You open the door. It's all on you.
Speaker 1: And oh yeah, what I was gonna say. I know
it's not exactly the same, but it's it's the It
reminds me a little bit of that Founding Father's episode
with the whole you know reason right. I mean, I
know it's not exactly the same, but.
Speaker 2: What's I say?
Speaker 3: And you can see traces of it through as you.
Speaker 1: Can, but the reasoning, like it makes more you know,
if if you want to go down that path, people
could say, well, it makes more sense that I have control.
It makes more sense that I don't have to rely
on a on a god I can't see, so my
only way to to save my soul or save whatever
would be that I have to achieve that. It makes
more sense. Every time I was reading through this stuff,
I could just kind of feel that kind of that
age of reason stuff kind of kind of encapsulating this
a little bit. And like I said, I know it's
not exactly the same, but it just.
Speaker 2: I think it's a branch of it. I truly do.
Speaker 1: You feel it from Yeah, you.
Speaker 2: See spirit behind all of it.
Speaker 1: Well, that one hundred percent is true. But yeah, I
did one more thing, and I know I've I've hit
this a couple of times on a couple of things
with this demi urge, which I think is just it's
kind of an interesting figure. This this aon demiurge that
is supposed creator through the Gnostic ideology. But I thought
it was kind of interesting. And uh, this is just
straight from Wikipedia, believe it or not. This I just
thought when I search that term, looked at that term,
it says the term derives from the Latinized form of
the Greek word demi orgos, Literally it means public or
skilled worker. This figure is also killed or called sorry y'all,
the bath which means blind god or saclus, which means
foolish one.
Speaker 2: So the god of the blind.
Speaker 1: Yes, So then you see, if you go a little further,
it's all this is interesting, Like I said this is,
so take it for the source that it is. That's
why I preface that. But sometimes, uh, other names and
identifications that are given to the same deity are a hireman,
l Yahweh and guess what Satan always called all those
different things at different times in different sects of this,
so they're even confusing. You know when we talk about
Yahweh or Satan or just the word you know, the
god l As we've talked about before, which we heard
of as the actual god of that pantheon, you know L,
but we've alway and the seventy sons, but we also
heard of l As in like l Shouldai and you
know when we talk about our god, you know, the
one true God. So I just think that's very interesting
that all those characters or names i should say, kind
of fall in and people can relate all those names
back to that one creator. They even will talk about
Satan as the potential name of the creator in this
which is I mean, if that's all true, that's very
I don't know, you see how how easy it is
for things to get askew.
Speaker 7: And it's that way intentionally, oh it is, but it's
just it's just amazing how easy it is for people
to fall down these paths, these rabbit holes that if
you're not founded, like I said, in your Bible, you
just you.
Speaker 1: Put yourself at such a greater risk of being told
much easier.
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, the Scottish rite of freemasonry, once you get
up that thirty third degree, they reveal to you that basically,
you know, and I've been reading that Morals and Dogma
book and it's basically they paint Lucifer Satan as the
good guy that God Yahweh was was the creator God,
but he was this evil, benign god, and he holding
us back and he wanted to keep us dumb and
be slaves. And Lucifer here come. He comes in to
be our savior. He wants to give us knowledge and
wisdom and take care of us. And he give us
the apple and gave us wisdom and enlightened us, you know.
And that's why they attribute the name Lucifer to him,
because it's the light bringer, the knowledge bringer, and that
that's the God that they worship.
Speaker 4: And how easy would that be for someone who does
it know the Bible or is new into the Bible.
Speaker 6: Just well, that makes sense, you know.
Speaker 1: It's very Prometheus if that makes sense. You know, coming
to you could easily fall for it. Oh oh yeah yeah,
but coming to you know, coming to our aid, coming
to our rescue against God. You know that's the you
see that time and time against the way we go
back to Genesis six, the same thing when we look
through Enoch, you know they you know, we're coming down
to help you know, initially coming down to help protect us.
All the different stories coming down to the fallen angels
or you know, even going through the Opclu and all
these other different that they were. They were the good guys.
They were coming to save us. They were giving us knowledge,
They were giving us things that were supposed to be
forbidden from us.
Speaker 3: The Indians, you know, their gods came from the stars
and then gave them knowledge and taught them how to
cultivate the land. And yeah, they're always the savior, you know.
Speaker 1: M hm.
Speaker 4: Wrong.
Speaker 1: Well that's it. Then wrapped it up right there.
Speaker 2: Do you want us next time?
Speaker 4: Hey, guys to this topic. Yeah, it's pull grab waste
your time, see you next time.
Speaker 1: I just love the way, like I said, I love
the rabbit holes. It takes you down because it gets
you thinking in different ways.
Speaker 4: And we also, you know, if somebody might be looking
into this kind of stuff listening to us, and I'm like, well,
I didn't think of it that way. This is just
a big poi.
Speaker 3: And a trick that's been played over and over again
and repackaged over and over again.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know it's.
Speaker 3: But with uh Sylvanus when he talked about you know,
you open the door, and you know it's all on you.
You know, you have to to do all these things.
When people asked if they should fast, if they should pray,
you know, shall we give oms? You know, the diets?
Which ones should we observe? Observe the feast, the Holy days?
And Jewish practices and stuff. When the la asked. In
the Bible, the Gospel of Thomas has Jesus replying to them,
do not tell lies, Do not do what you hate,
for all things are manifest in the sight of heaven.
And what does that sound like? Do as that wilt?
Speaker 2: Hyeah? If you don't like it, don't do it.
Speaker 4: You know, if you do like it, who cares? Yeah,
I don't think that's that's very new age. It is
that very new ag. Well, if you feel like a unicorn,
then just go be a unicorn, grow your horn, think
your polka dot your body.
Speaker 6: And just be a unicorn.
Speaker 1: I'm seeing a photo shoot in your future.
Speaker 3: Set up by his jeep, some Daisy Dick shorts and.
Speaker 6: Ranger panties.
Speaker 4: Yes, that's the inside joke. And if any of y'all
out there were in the military, do you know what
I'm talking about?
Speaker 3: But Luke twenty two and Mark fourteen h and Mark
Jesus declares that neither Satan's roll nor God's preordained plan
absolves Judas guilt, but the son of Man goes as
it has been determined. But woe to that man by
whom he is betrayed. You know, John me armored Roman soldiers.
Luke mentions only Jews, Unlike Matthew and Mark. Luke omits
this verse and says, the son of Man is betrayed
into the hands of the sinners, you know, a ka
the gentiles. You know, Luke was a gentile and was
speaking to the gentile people. But the Gnostics deny the
literal interpretation of the resurrection, and that that's another common thread.
You know, it's beyond there. Like we talked about reason.
You know, remember the episode that we did on the
Founding Fathers. You know, reason was their guide, and many
like Thomas Jefferson, Payne Washington all denied the physical resurrection too.
You know, the Gnostics used Luke and Mark to justify
their beliefs because it appears in spirit form. You know,
he disappears out of sight into the clouds. He orders
Mary not to touch him. You know that he does,
you know, many supernatural quote unquote things that the flesh
is not capable of. And John twenty, verse seventeen, he said,
don't cling to me, as I have not ascended to
the Father.
Speaker 2: You know, I believe you know, this was because he
was the first fruits of the resurrection.
Speaker 3: He wanted to present himself before the Father, you know,
untouched by human hands, undefiled. But they use this as
their backing of he was not flesh, he was spirit,
you know, So it was not a physical resurrection. But
Paul describes the resurrection as a mystery, saying the flesh
and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God. Gnostics believe
Jesus is forty days on earth after the resurrection was
basically the transferring of his power to the apostles, and
they call Christians that believe in the literal resurrection. The
faith of the fools. The Gospel of Mary says that
the appearance of Christ after his death was just dreaming
and visions. Jesus appears to Peter in another Nostic gospel,
the Apocalypse of Peter, in a vision, saying, I am
the intellectual spirit, filled with radiant light.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: The light symbolizes wisdom and knowledge. And remember we said
it already. But Satan disguises himself as an angel of light.
But they believe the resurrection is the moment of quote
unquote enlightenment. The world itself is an apparition, you know,
like the matrix. You know, I'm sure you're sure most
people could see the hidden messaging, you know, in the matrix.
But the Gospel fillip I mentioned earlier, it says those
who say they will die first then resurrect are in error.
They must resurrect first while they are still alive. You know,
are are you woke yet?
Speaker 1: You know?
Speaker 3: Did Satan promise us wisdom and knowledge and that that
we would be as gods?
Speaker 2: You know, it's.
Speaker 3: It's it's pretty easy to see where this, you know,
deception is coming from. They thought themselves special and that
they were given divine knowledge. You know, to me, it
sounds a lot like Genesis six. But they even use
the words of mark Ah to you have been given
the mysteries of heaven. Most of the writers of these
Gnostic gospels openly admit that there are derived from their
own personal experience. You know, it's recorded that they would
ask internal questions and then answers would just spontaneously appear
to them in their minds, and images may appear, you know,
activities of imagination or unconsciousness, and they call them spiritual communication.
I mean, it's just it's just new agey as new
agey could be.
Speaker 1: I think, I really think that that when you talk
about that that that you know in the Genesis six stuff,
the same thing. I firmly believe this, and I think
you can kind of see it throughout history that it's
not the only time that fallen angels have done those things.
I think we still see that to this day, that
we see this this push in a different direction, or
you know, someone given knowledge or something over it just
it it just doesn't sink up. I mean, even the
advancement in our technology, right when you think that we
went from the right brothers to being on the moon
in less than one hundred years or about one hundred years.
I mean, you think about that. That's that the the
different things that we see, the different, the different the
way that the world keeps changing. You can see that
there's definitely an impression that's being that's being put there.
And it takes me down another rabbit hole.
Speaker 6: Though.
Speaker 1: It always makes me wonder. Sorry, this is way off
base again, but it makes me wonder when we you know,
we talked about numerous times in the past. You know,
like when Abraham has the angels come to him, right,
they come in physical form, they're there, they eat. Why
can't a fallen angel take on physical form, show himself
be a I don't be a politician, you don't be uh,
someone that is the head of I don't know certain
movements or or things that cause new way exactly. Why
why can't that happen? I I firmly believe it does.
I also believe in the same breath that when you
saw Jesus, you know, taken by Satan, you know, in
in the saying, hey, you know, if you bow to me,
I'll give you all these kingdoms. And if if you
know if you cast yourself down, says that you know,
not a foot will hit a stone, you know, angels
will rescue you, and he's tempting him that way. He's
but I believe that that same stuff, and this is
once again my belief that that same stuff has happened
in this day and age where someone has, you know,
a Satan whatever you want to call it, chaos, some
form of that entity has come and said, hey, to
I don't care if you're Mark Zuckerberg, whoever you are, coming,
I said, listen, I will give you all this if
you just do this for me, you know, the whole
selling your soul of the devil kind of thing. But
I think that that same thing keeps taking us down
these paths. You have somebody come up, Who's to say
that the father of narcissism wasn't just one of these
fallen angels trying to lead people away from the truth
of Jesus. I mean, I I know that's a whole
nother rabbit trail, and I know that's way off, but
it's just it's just amazing to me how you see
so many people fall away so fast and jump on
these other new ideas, and just because it's the hot
new thing. But I don't believe that people are that stupid.
I really don't. I mean I think that they need
to be pushed in those directions or pulled in those directions.
I don't think people are that dumb. So when we
talk about gnosticism and these ideas of enlightenment and think
these new agey ideas that even the Founding Fathers that
they're in, I mean, who's to say that one of
them fallen angels didn't Their signature is not on the
Declaration Independence. I don't know. I know that sounds crazy
and I can cut this part out, but what but
when we go through and we talk about these things,
I believe that there's so much God has given us
so much free will. You know, we're able to pick
and choose what we do, but just as much as
we have Him here on this side saying hey, you know,
our conscience telling us what's right wrong. Like you said before,
we all know what's wrong to kill. Do people still kill?
Yeah they do. We all know it's wrong to steal.
Do people still steal?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: They do? So where's that other voice?
Speaker 4: Well, it's just like Doug was saying today at church
he said, people who, you know, if you're not walking
with the Lord, not even thinking about God, they're just
living their life. Hey, I'm gonna do this, do that.
Whatever makes me feel good, That's what you're gonna do.
And the on the angel side of things, they have
free will also because they come down the devil, the
devil's tails swoop to third of the angels with them.
Who's to say, oh, Bobby up Aaron heavens got tired
of doing God's will and he's like, you know what,
I'm going down there with him.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's hard. We don't know because like I said,
it's not scriptural. You don't see that. You don't see
like a second incursion or anything. But I I just
firmly before it could it could possibly happen.
Speaker 4: Again. I'm not saying it did.
Speaker 1: But I think some of those same ones because we
can see it. And if we talk about Genesis six,
I'm sorry we're jumping around again, but if we're talking
about Genesis six and you're talking about the fallen angels
and and and the one that were you know, trapped
and taken to Tartarus, right that, then where are these
fallen angels? These other principalities that are the Prince of
Grecia and the Prince of Persia that we hear in Daniel.
I mean, there are other spiritual entities.
Speaker 2: They ruled unjustly.
Speaker 1: But these are other entities that are here that are
not in Tartaris. They're not the same. So we see
that they're here after the fall in Genesis six, after
everything happens, after they were put in Tartarus. So if
we're seeing that, you still see that those evil powers
are here on earth that are pushing people in these
these other ideologies that are trying to and what they do,
like we said before, is they pervert the truth just
a little bit, and guess what, we're gonna take it
a little bit more. And it's that whole you know,
Satan mask rages an angel of light. We all we
said that a million times, but it's so true because
it's like, look, here's the truth, but I'm gonna change
just one little part of it, and I'm gonna change
one little more part, and it's going to get to
the point where you just like.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's that.
Speaker 1: I can believe that because, like I said, I don't
believe people are that stupid.
Speaker 4: No, because I think he has to. He has to
do it in little pieces, because if he goes so
drastic like that's you know, that's but life obvious. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Well even psychologists, you know, like U. I listen to
a lot of Jordan Peterson, and he was talking about
you know how how your neurons fire and the chemicals
your body produces, the serotonin and stuff when you lie.
I mean you can physically see the effects that it
has just from lying. And he said, and it has
been proven with light detector tests. If if a lie
is repeated enough, you believe, you believe it. So think
about it. You get told a small lie, and then
you tell it to your kids, and then your kids
keep passing it on down the line. Well it's done,
went through two or three generations, that lie is now truth.
Speaker 2: Well then what.
Speaker 3: Happens when somebody takes that lie that has become quote
unquote truth and adds a little bit more of a
caveat to it and turns a little bit more than
it travels to or three generations. Now, that lie that's
had another lie added into it is now truth. And
that's how it goes. It just perpetulates on down the line.
Speaker 1: Treated the truth for a lie.
Speaker 2: Yeah, amen, I mean right there.
Speaker 3: And I want to try to tie this into a
pretty bow because what you talked about was, you know,
the slow perversion over time and the fallen angel or
spirit that's behind it. I can tie I think I
can tie it in with Valentinis because ernalist, you know,
compared to these gnostics, to artists, he said, creating new myths, poems,
and rituals and dialogues with Christ and Marcus, which was
a student of Valentinis. He had a vision of a
naked woman come from heaven and her name was Truth,
you know, aka the Naked Truth. You know, it might
be where we got that from. But he was given
divine knowledge and he had an initiation ritual after quote
unquote invoking the spirit. You know what was this, you know,
like an esoteric ritual with drugs involved. We don't know,
we can only speculate, but they would receive direct contact
with the divine in this ceremony. You know, to me,
it sounds an awful lot like Hollywood elites and their
you know, ayahuasca trips, having these divine encounters and stuff.
But the Gnostics were basically the way, like I said,
I'm pulling all this stuff from that that pagan or pagan.
Yes she is, but what would I say her name
Elaine Pagel's Elaine Pagan, Elaine Pagan. But she compares these
Gnostics as the that stood up against the established church.
She said they believed that it was a power grab.
And this sounds a lot like the Founding Fathers, you know,
escaping England and the Roman Catholic Church so they could
practice and be free to practice their own religions and
do what they wanted to do. But they've seen it
as the Roman Catholic Church as a power grab and
it was meant to enslave the people and control them
and keep them ignorant.
Speaker 2: You know. They believe that the church leaders were holding
back knowledge. You know.
Speaker 3: To me, this goes back to the Garden of Eden.
You know, many secret societies were Sip, Lucifer and Satan.
I talked about that earlier, but now you see this
playing out with these early church fathers and the Gnostics.
Nothing news under the sun, right, So it's like that
quote it Sometimes they believe it's better to rule in
hell than to serve in heaven, and we see that
working out through this Gnostic movement in the separation of
the Church. But Arnelius says, they consider themselves that was mature,
so that no one can con be prepared to them
and their gnoss which means knowledge, not even Peter or Paul.
The apostles, so think, you know, they knew more than
the men that.
Speaker 2: Walked with Christ.
Speaker 3: You know, this has the pride of Satan all over it.
But another Gnostic gospel, the Dialogue of the Savior, praises
Mary as a woman who knew all, you know, the
queen of Heaven. But another one, the Apocalypse of Peter
in the latest most recent version of that Gnostic gospel
found at Nacimande, was two to three hundred a d.
But it was a direct attack against the Roman Church,
calling those self proclaimed bishops and deacons waterless canals. You know,
it sounds a lot like Jude when he was talking
about the false teachers and compared them to waterless clouds.
But the gnostisted rejected the visical resurrect.
Speaker 2: And they also devalued the body.
Speaker 3: You know, it considered its actions of sexual acts and
drugs and things like that unimported, unimportant to the spiritual person.
The Gospel of Thomas Jesus says, if spirit came into
being because of the body, it is a wonder of wonders. Indeed,
I am amazed at how this great wealth the spirit
has made its home in this poverty. Talking about the body.
But the Gnostics they stood close, you know, to Greek
and to Hindu and to Buddhists. You know, philosophic tradition
the spirit residing in the body. And like you said,
you know just enough truth to sound right, but you know,
just pervert it. But the actual person is the spirit.
The body is an instrument to which the soul operates.
And so you see how Satan operates. He gives you
hints of the truth. He perverts it in parts of
the doctrine, you know, parts of these doctrines. You know,
I think even you know, we could agree with, you know,
because there's some partial truth there. But they had some
parts right. And then the things that they had wrong
they had very very wrong, and they were very important.
So you know, sexual acts, drug, strong drink, things like
that didn't bother them, so they didn't align with the whole.
The body is the temple theology that we have in
our scripture, and it's the whole do as that wilt.
But the Christian creed says, I believe in one Godfather, Almighty,
Maker of heaven and earth. You know this was made
exclusively toward the followers of macron in a Christian and
Asia minor, which was Turkey, who saw the contrast between
the gods or the God of the Old Testament and
the God of the New Testament. He said that there
must be two gods. Orthodox Christians usually group Gnostics with
these guys, and they called them the Macronists or the Duellists.
Another Gnostic gospel called the Hypostasis of the Acrons, and
you mentioned those guys earlier, but that book confirms this
belief when it says that the creators vain claim to
hold an exclusive monopoly on the divine power shows that
he is blind because of his power and his ignorance
and his arrogance. He said, it is I who am God,
and there is none other than me. When he said this,
he sinned against the entirety, and a voice came forth
from above the realm of absolute power, saying you are
mistaken sam a l which means God of the blind.
Another book of Theirs was on the Origin of the
world and it kind of goes over that same thing,
but it says this was discovered in the same codex.
At Nakamandi was a variant of the same story, but
only this time Faith was described as a woman who
rebukes him. So the same Sam a l god of
the blind. So we just you know, we see all
over again the whole Genesis three Genesis six narrative. Uh
the hey, I'm just saying it. But the Gnostic authors
uh use in this same uh the origins of the world.
The Gnostic authors use a play on words in their
retelling of Genesis three. I thought this was very interesting.
They use the Aramaic word uh hell whah.
Speaker 2: Which is h e w y a, which I'm sure
I butchered. But they use that word for the serpent,
and that.
Speaker 3: Instructs. It means instructs or teaches. And then for Eve
they used the word hah wah, which sounds similar but
it's spelled h a w a h. And this instead
of tempting Adam, she gives life to him and instructs him.
Speaker 1: Just a little bit. We're going to keep taking it
a little bit and pervert the truth a little bit.
And perverting the truth a little bit.
Speaker 3: But you mentioned that wolves and sheep clothing. I think
it was Arnalis. He used that exact same terminology describing
these guys. He said this about them, such persons are
to outward appearance as sheep, for they seem to be
like us from what they say in public, repeating the
same words of confession that we do. But inwardly they
are wolves.
Speaker 2: Mm hm. You know that goes back to Washington.
Speaker 3: He went to church and prayed and said, recited the
same stuff that they recited the doctrines, but when it
comes time through the last Supper, he would slide on
out the back door.
Speaker 2: Mm hm.
Speaker 1: That's crazy. I mean it. You can see how everything
can acts.
Speaker 3: I'm trying to find the thing about Valentinus, but basically, uh,
it's I can't remember, for it's let me. I don't
want to just air quote that. Let me try to
find it because it was profound. I can't remember I
for it was arn Alias or who. But they called
him out and said that.
Speaker 2: Basically he was a.
Speaker 3: Christian, come to church every day and was even seeking
to be a bishop. And it wasn't until he was
declined and they wouldn't accept him as a bishop. That's
when all of a sudden he become enlightened.
Speaker 1: I did see that too.
Speaker 2: He what it was he was.
Speaker 3: He was ticked off and felt rejected because he was
denied quote unquote the power of a position of authority.
So then he just made up his own religion and
took half the church with him.
Speaker 1: Must be in here I saw it before.
Speaker 2: Okay, here it is.
Speaker 3: But the Gnostics were stealing people from the church and
speaking out against the Catholic Church, calling out their abuse
of power, and basically started on a cult. But the
Gnostics seen it as a power grab. But there is
a clear motive behind the rebellion of Virtulian, who was
the founder of the Gnostic movement. He seeks to be
a bishop of Rome. And it wasn't until he was
selected that he or not selected, that he earned on
the church and became enlightened. So if he come in,
you know, all of a sudden became enlightened after he
was rejected. You know who was he enlightened by?
Speaker 4: You know?
Speaker 3: Tertullian says this about you know, Vultaian arrogance. His arrogance
was unmatched. He said, he possessing all the pompous air
of a cock. You know, it sounds like Fertulian was
full of pride, jealousy, and envy, and these are all
characteristics of Satan. And Arnalius claimed that the gnosticism stemmed
from Simon Magnus. You remember him from our Axe Bible study.
Speaker 2: He was the.
Speaker 3: Magician that tried to buy the power of the Holy
Spirit from Peter. So, you know, Arnalius uh says that's
where a lot of this this gnostic stuff came from too.
Speaker 1: I think that's that part was probably one of the
most interesting to me, because you see, you know, he
supposedly converted that he tries to buy the power of
the Holy Spirit right when we're an axe, and he
goes through and and does that. But it was really
interesting because you can see here it is following conversion,
because it says that that Simon assumed the divine title
of the great power of God. Irenaeus recorded that Simon
actually believed himself to be God, and ieron Aeus's account,
Simon preached himself as God who first created thought, the
mother of all, his female companion. Wait, oh, that was
the mother of all. That was his female companion thought.
Irenaeus further records that Simon claimed that from thought, the
angels and human beings were created, but because the angels
were governing the world so badly, Simon descended into human
form to bring things into order. Goes On, Simon promised
that when order came, his followers would be saved in
this world would be dissolved. And I think that is
just just nuts, it says. Although the account of Simon's
religious beliefs includes no references to saving nosis, Iranaus concluded
that Simon gave up the falsely so called nosis gave
I'm sorry, the falsely so called nosis its beginnings. I
thought that was just so has a whole bunch, you
know what.
Speaker 2: I mean, they're just listening to it now.
Speaker 3: I'm just like, how can anybody believe it?
Speaker 4: Well, it's the thing, it's like they I don't know,
it's like they wanted to believe something but the whole
truth for a lie. They didn't want to believe the truth.
Speaker 3: Well, see, to me, I think it's funny is that
they're completely guilty of what they were accusing the Roman
Catholic Church of. They said, the Roman Catholic Church just
wanted to and it was a power grab and well,
then you're getting all this secret knowledge and ascending to enlightenhood,
you know, and getting these extra special powers.
Speaker 4: And different when you're the one getting the power.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, or Simon right here, who's who's like you
said claiming he is God?
Speaker 3: Like how much more do you want?
Speaker 1: Exactly? How much more do you want? Attention? I just
thought that was pretty amazing and that, like, again, I
can't plug it enough, but love logos. That stuff comes
straight out of there just by searching certain things like
that just blows me away. But yeah, I absolutely love that.
Speaker 4: Wow.
Speaker 1: Don't love that it happened, but love the information, love
that that you can see it. I always want to
see it scripturally and then to have it connected by
a first century, first century church father, you know, to
see that you're seeing the correlation between the Biblical account
and through something that's non you know, nine cannon, but
you're seeing that correlation. I just think I always find
that fascinating because to me, it just keeps continuing to
prove the Bible true. So I just love seeing that.
Speaker 3: But I mean I already had my doubts anyway about
this this Elaine woman in the books I was reading
because it's how she was wording things. But if I
had any doubt when I got to this section, she
was like taking up for the Gnostics, and you know,
she was repeating the same thing she was saying.
Speaker 2: You know, it was a power graph. They were keeping
the people.
Speaker 3: Dumb, and these guys had visions from God and told
about their visions, and they were labeled heresy. But at
the same time, it's okay for the church fathers to
have dreams of enlightenment and the Holy Spirit tell them things,
but when they try to do it, it's not it's
not cool.
Speaker 2: They're heretics.
Speaker 3: And where the Roman Catholic Church had so much power
And basically what she said was is, you know, the
winner tells the story is the Roman Catholic Church had
so much power and influence they snuffed out the Gnostics
and drove them underground, having their books burned and destroyed,
and labeled them as heretics and cast them out of society.
You know that the only books that remained were the
ones that were hid. And you know, she really paints
a favorable picture for the Gnostics as poor victims of
the powerful, you know, Roman Catholic Church. And don't get
me wrong. I ain't defending the Roman Catholic Church, you know.
Speaker 2: I mean they've done a.
Speaker 3: Lot of wicked stuff, but so is all of humanity.
You know, you don't throw out the baby with the
bathwater or judge, you know, religion by one person's or
a handful of you know, their actions and misusing it. Yes, agreed,
that's a very uh straw man tactic, you know.
Speaker 1: Well, And that right there is the truth because if
you see it, you can It's what I said earlier
about the church, is that you can have someone who
who drives someone away from the church because they treat
somebody like they're a sinner like and they're not, you know,
just the judgment that people give when that's so not
the case. When you have to look at the whole
and you have to look at how forgiving God is
and not worry about like how how humans perceive you,
or or that your sin is any greater than anybody else's.
You have to always remember that that Jesus loves you,
God loves you, and not to look at what other people,
how other people come off to you. It's the same
it's the same thing again. It's just like I said,
it's repackaged a little bit.
Speaker 3: And you even have this transgender stuff in the Gospel
of Thomas.
Speaker 2: Did you run across that.
Speaker 3: Listen to this the Gospel of Thomas and others, you know,
one of the Gnostic gospels. I've mentioned a couple of times,
but here it has Jesus saying this about women and marry.
I will lead her in order to make her male,
so that she too may become a living spirit resembling
you males. For every woman who will make herself male
will enter the Kingdom of Heaven.
Speaker 4: Wow.
Speaker 2: No, it didn't sound off to you.
Speaker 1: Didn't catch that one.
Speaker 3: You are a few French right short of a happy meal.
Speaker 2: My gosh.
Speaker 1: But like you said, it's been. I mean, it's been
around forever, been brought that up. This stuff has been
you see it, and it just it just continues, and
it just gets more and more accepted over time. But
you see it back even to those biblical times, antiquity.
It just blows me away.
Speaker 3: But it stems from because where I got here says
that the Gnostics believed God to be what they called
a diad, both male and female. You know, well, to me,
what stands out that's male and female well, the baff
of me it he's got a little serpent twisting up
from his crotch area and boobs too. It's pretty clear
to me to me of being out. But I grew
up in church and stuff like that. But it's like,
you know, pretty clear to see who the message is
coming from. But there's they believe in also to the
esoteric symbolism and stuff like that, and just reading how
these people believe in stuff was just really intriguing to me.
They believe Paradise was an allegory for the mother's womb.
It says I am he that formed thee in the
mother's womb. That's Isaiah forty four two. Eden was the placenta,
and the river that flowed forth from Eden symbolizes the
navel which nourishes the fetus. And Simon Magnus says that
Exodus was symbolic the Red Sea crossing was the womb
and the blood of the womb. But there's another sect
called Scythians. But the Seythian Gnostics, they say that heaven
and Earth have similar shapes as a pregnant womb and
at the firm moment separates.
Speaker 2: The waters from the waters.
Speaker 3: But a lot of them point to Clement too of
Alexandria and say that he was a gnostic because in
his writings he said God has a feminine and masculine characteristics.
And it says, quote the word like a mother nurses
the child with milk of love, and those suck at
the breast are truly happy, you know.
Speaker 2: So they're really.
Speaker 3: Caught up in this whole male and female. And you know,
but wouldn't it Christ himself that said that in me
there is no male or female, free or slaves, you
or gentile, Just just a lot of interesting stuff to
dig through. And it's just crazy just looking at the
correlations of today and how you can see hints and
bits and pieces of this everywhere. Ancient Egypt, Buddhists, you know,
the Dallists, the Freemasons, the the skull.
Speaker 2: And Bones, the rose and Cross.
Speaker 3: I mean, it's just I like how Derrek Gilbert says,
it's the the finger puppet on each hand, you know
what I mean. But it's all coming from the same source.
Speaker 1: It's just I think that the I guess the moral
of the story looking at this is seeing how how
all these things, this evil that that has always been there,
we can see this through time, how things have been perverted,
and things keep changing, and and and they keep we
keep accepting, you know, or I shouldn't say we as
a whole, but I guess we as a people of
this country, of this world keep accepting ruths. And I
use truths in air quotes there, but new truths that
allow us to to be more, like I said, your
best self or or or you know, whatever you want
to be. And it keeps taking us further and further
away from you know, that absolute truth that you were
talking about before, like Jesus is the only way, but
nobody wants to be responsible for their actions, so they
find a different way. And that makes these other ideas
and these other ways and these other parts of this
belief that much more attractive, because well, I don't have
to answer to somebody, And you see that all the
way through history with this is that all of a sudden, Oh,
it's up to you just to become self enlightened. So
I don't have to answer anybody. I can just do
this on my own, at my own speed. I can
this is my own truth. This is my exactly, I mean,
that's what it's turned into. But it's the same thing.
It's repackaged. And this, this whole Gnostic idea, this whole
Gnostic movement, is right here right now. We see it
different name, different name, same thing, the same idea, same
basic principles that we're seeing right now. You're watching news
and see it the whole time. I mean, it's just
it's right there in front of you. Go to the
grocery store, it's right there all the time. Then turn
on the TV. It's right there all the time.
Speaker 2: And I think you guys would agree with me. It's
usually somewhere in the middle.
Speaker 3: And I'm not saying the middle of Nostilism, but what
I mean is is like, there's nothing wrong with philosophy.
There's nothing wrong with wisdom. There's nothing wrong with reading
and studying and having some self growth and trying to
better yourself, and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.
And it's actually biblical.
Speaker 2: But Jesus is the way. Jesus is the truth, and
Jesus is the life.
Speaker 3: And I love just how Timothy Alvarino said that in
that episode with Us.
Speaker 2: You know, he said digging into the scriptures, and I
would apply this too with the whole self growth.
Speaker 3: Both of those things you know are good things to do.
But only if you got down the message of Christ
what that is, and be able to articulate that, and
not only articulate that and defend that. That's your foundation.
And once you have that, then go digging. You know,
there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. But if you don't
have that foundation and you just start diving into all
these deep subjects and start looking at what these other
religious people and belief systems are and what they believe in,
things like that, you're basically walking into a storm and
you're gonna get pushed around, tossed around, rained on. And
if you might build a really great looking forty foot
tall mansion but it's built on sand, and that you're
one wind gust away from being tore down.
Speaker 1: M M.
Speaker 3: But I guess we can wrap this up if you
guys are good, But I do we always want to
end on good notes.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 2: And I know you talk about Origin a lot.
Speaker 5: Uh.
Speaker 3: I love what him and our Nelius said, And I
thought these were good, uplifting things to kind of close with.
But Origin said God would have not offered a way
of salvation accessible only to an intellectual or spiritual elite,
that it must be simple and accessible to all. And
then Ournalist declares, as the Sun, a creation of God,
is one and the same throughout.
Speaker 2: The whole world.
Speaker 3: Also, the preaching of the truth shines everywhere and enlightens
all people.
Speaker 2: Who are willing.
Speaker 1: Truth.
Speaker 3: I hope this has been an enlightening conversation.
Speaker 2: Keep digging.
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