WEBVTT

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<v Speaker 1>An open and shut case, finding the evidence and knowing

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<v Speaker 1>exactly who did what. In a perfect world, that's just

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<v Speaker 1>how the justice system should work. However, we don't live

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<v Speaker 1>in a perfect world. The case against Ryan Waller seemed

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<v Speaker 1>to be an open and shut case. However, as the

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<v Speaker 1>hours ticked by and his interrogation began, things started to shift,

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<v Speaker 1>and soon police would find themselves in a very bizarre

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<v Speaker 1>situation as they let Ryan walk out the door. Hey,

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<v Speaker 1>welcome back.

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<v Speaker 2>My name's Ben and I'm Nicole, and you're listening to

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<v Speaker 2>Wicked and Grim, a.

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<v Speaker 1>True crime podcast.

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<v Speaker 2>It is a true crime podcast.

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<v Speaker 1>That's just facts. I don't have it happening.

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<v Speaker 2>What else is new?

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<v Speaker 1>What do you mean what else is new that I

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<v Speaker 1>don't have it?

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<v Speaker 2>Know that it's a true crime podcast podcast.

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<v Speaker 1>Hello, Well, I mean we're approaching episode ninety, so I

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<v Speaker 1>would assurely it's known.

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<v Speaker 2>Where does the time go? Eh?

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<v Speaker 1>Oh man, tell me about it? But I do have whiskey,

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<v Speaker 1>so that's that's a nice thing.

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<v Speaker 2>And it's July.

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<v Speaker 1>It is we just had Canada Day long.

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<v Speaker 2>Weekend be Canada Day, and then it's going to be.

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<v Speaker 1>July fourth for Memorial Day. Our American friends down in

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<v Speaker 1>the United States dates trying not to blow off your

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<v Speaker 1>thumb with fireworks on the celebrations, because that is something

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<v Speaker 1>that occurs pretty much every year.

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<v Speaker 2>That that happens to someone.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, yeah, I mean people using fireworks.

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<v Speaker 2>So they can be there, like I'm a bit afraid

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<v Speaker 2>of them. They can be pretty dangerous.

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<v Speaker 1>Well. Yeah, people get a little bit overconfident, especially or

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<v Speaker 1>they're drinking, especially with consumption of alcohol.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh that's where you're going.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and accidents definitely occur, and it's on the rise

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<v Speaker 1>every time they're celebrations revolving around fireworks.

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<v Speaker 2>So well, I also think people to just think, I

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<v Speaker 2>don't know, more and more so that they're like invincible.

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<v Speaker 2>We think we're getting more and more invincible in a sense,

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<v Speaker 2>that's true. I feel like that. I know, I think

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<v Speaker 2>I get personally.

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<v Speaker 1>But I get more and more invincible, I think the

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<v Speaker 1>more I drink. So yeah, I can feel that. What

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<v Speaker 1>are we going to talk about today? Oh, we had

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<v Speaker 1>one hell of an episode over on Patreon. Yeah, the

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<v Speaker 1>exclusive episode and Nicole let us through that. You want

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<v Speaker 1>to give us a little quick rundown on what happened?

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<v Speaker 2>Uh, two runs don't make it right? Just kidding. That's

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<v Speaker 2>a little inside joke. You have to go over there

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<v Speaker 2>too to get yep. But yeah, we covered the Canadian

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<v Speaker 2>case on Albert Johnson Walker. So this dude, he stole

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<v Speaker 2>a lot of money. Mm hmmm, he stole some identities

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<v Speaker 2>m hm, he murdered someone, h among some other shit. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>so he was a bad mofo. Like he was shady

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<v Speaker 2>as fuck.

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<v Speaker 1>That was one hell of a case.

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<v Speaker 2>So it really it was a case that was like

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<v Speaker 2>a soap opera and there was a lot of twists

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<v Speaker 2>and turns and you never knew what the heck was

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<v Speaker 2>going to happen, but it was. It was good. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>I liked it.

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<v Speaker 1>If you want to listen to that, you got to

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<v Speaker 1>head over to Patreon. We drop an exclusive episode the

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<v Speaker 1>last day of every month for our patron listeners, so

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<v Speaker 1>you can go one over there, sign up and listen

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<v Speaker 1>listen to the episode.

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<v Speaker 2>Ye yeah, what.

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<v Speaker 1>Else you got it?

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<v Speaker 2>Oh?

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, there, you send me a link today I did. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>guarding a movie.

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<v Speaker 2>That is being made apparently, what was it a Life

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<v Speaker 2>on Lifetime or something?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Lifetime is making a movie on the case of

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<v Speaker 1>Gabby Patito and Brian Laundry. We just talked about an

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<v Speaker 1>update the other day, and I'm assuming this means all

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<v Speaker 1>the information is out. We haven't been following the case

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<v Speaker 1>too closely, but if they're making a movie, they know everything.

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<v Speaker 2>So I feel like it's so soon, too soon.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know, I don't know, I don't know.

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<v Speaker 2>Hard to say, I feel like it's a bit soon,

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<v Speaker 2>but I mean it's a year ago or so.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it was twenty twenty one, so I'm curious to

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<v Speaker 1>see it. I think I'm gonna wait until that movie

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<v Speaker 1>comes out. I'm going to watch that shit out of

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<v Speaker 1>that and then I'm going to dive into research and

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<v Speaker 1>then we're going to cover that case fully and do

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<v Speaker 1>it full justice again. Yeah, because we did it already,

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<v Speaker 1>but we did it a little rushed. I mean, we

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<v Speaker 1>were trying to be like, hey, let's get it out there,

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<v Speaker 1>let's be one of the first podcasts to cover this,

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<v Speaker 1>and to our own fault, we fell for some falsified

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<v Speaker 1>information that the media was putting out, and like the

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<v Speaker 1>next day it was realized that that was false information.

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<v Speaker 2>So yeah, yeah, because you cannot always trust the media,

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<v Speaker 2>Holy heck, no, could it be unreal?

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<v Speaker 1>We got it from reliable sources too, it's not their

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<v Speaker 1>fault either. It was falsified information. So that's what happens

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<v Speaker 1>when you go a little bit too soon without confirming facts.

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<v Speaker 1>And we did that. We're not going to do that again.

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<v Speaker 2>But the media can also twist things into a certain

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<v Speaker 2>way too, oh yeah, to sell and you know.

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<v Speaker 1>And speaking of media, there was another news article that

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<v Speaker 1>came out today.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you shared this with one with me. This is wild.

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<v Speaker 1>So every year there is this crazy cool stampede that

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<v Speaker 1>happens in a little old town just south of us

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<v Speaker 1>called Williams Lake.

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<v Speaker 2>About three hours or so away, I'd say, yeah, three

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<v Speaker 2>hours so.

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<v Speaker 1>About three hundred klometers away. They have this crazy cool stampede.

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<v Speaker 1>It is actually quite large for the small town.

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<v Speaker 2>Big deal.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, people travel from all over to go to this stampede.

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<v Speaker 1>Apparently there was a shooting in behind the stands, so yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I can't even imagine that happening there, to be honest.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's nuts. So two people were allegedly injured and

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<v Speaker 1>are currently in hospital, one is arrested, and they are

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<v Speaker 1>on the search for another potential shooter. And this happened

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<v Speaker 1>just today, so yeah, that's kind of crazy.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, this is such a small town too.

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<v Speaker 2>That's just going to just shake everyone for sure, one.

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<v Speaker 1>Hundred percent, especially because this was the first time the

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<v Speaker 1>stampede happened since COVID.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh dang, Yeah, that's sad. Things are just kind of

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<v Speaker 2>slowly opening up again and then shit like that happens.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so huh so that's terrible and tragic to hear.

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<v Speaker 1>I hope those two people make a full recovery and

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<v Speaker 1>they get both the individuals responsible in the shooting.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, yeah, maybe there'll be a bit more details coming

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<v Speaker 2>out too, because I'd like to know what the heck

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<v Speaker 2>went on there.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, we'll find out. Finally, we are I think we

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<v Speaker 1>mentioned this before that we're going to be tackling some

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<v Speaker 1>more lesser known cases, not that we are not doing

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<v Speaker 1>some of the bigger known ones as well.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, because I still have some big ones on

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<v Speaker 2>my list.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, oh so do I trust me? And people still

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<v Speaker 1>want us to cover some of the bigger ones, to

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<v Speaker 1>hear you our exactly, So those are definitely going to

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<v Speaker 1>happen too. But you guys seem to really like it

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<v Speaker 1>when we cover these lesser known cases. And I've found

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<v Speaker 1>out recently in my endeavors of trying to learn the

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<v Speaker 1>wonderful world of Reddit that it is a great resource

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<v Speaker 1>for some of these lesser known cases.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm not even a hunter. I'm not very versed on Reddit.

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<v Speaker 1>You should be.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm not searching what it even is, to be honest.

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<v Speaker 2>It's it's a forum, okay where people just like it's

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<v Speaker 2>like a kind.

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<v Speaker 1>Of a blog ish yeah thing, go in there and

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<v Speaker 1>search topics and then people just post on these topics.

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<v Speaker 2>I have used read it before for looking at some

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<v Speaker 2>cases and stuff, but I never just like have gone

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<v Speaker 2>in there. It's always come up on like a.

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<v Speaker 1>Google's yeah, and then you follow that link and you're

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<v Speaker 1>tea yeah, then yeah, put it into it. Well, thanks

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<v Speaker 1>to Reddit. That's how I found out about the case today,

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<v Speaker 1>the case of Ryan Waller and Heather Kwan.

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<v Speaker 2>Super cool.

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<v Speaker 1>This is a roller coast of a case. So if

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<v Speaker 1>you don't know this case, buckle your seat belts. If

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<v Speaker 1>you do know what, you know what's going to happen.

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<v Speaker 1>So don't tell anyone, Okay.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, just everyone else. Sure that I don't know this case, well,

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<v Speaker 2>you were going to do a different one originally, right

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<v Speaker 2>that I did know? Yes, this one, okay, this one

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So this one takes place on Christmas Day of

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<v Speaker 1>two thousand and six. I was thinking of saving this,

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<v Speaker 1>yeah Christmas.

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<v Speaker 2>But like you should have saved this to Christmas.

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<v Speaker 1>It was a hard fond No, I wanted to do

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<v Speaker 1>this one right away.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay.

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<v Speaker 1>So it takes place in Desert Hills, Arizona.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay.

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<v Speaker 1>So Heather Kwan was a twenty one year old college student.

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<v Speaker 1>She was a kind soul who she had the need

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<v Speaker 1>to help other people, which was evident by her teen years.

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<v Speaker 1>She would spend many of her weekends out volunteering for

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<v Speaker 1>foundations to help underprivileged kids. She even dreamed of helping

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<v Speaker 1>people in her adult years, which is why she aspired

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<v Speaker 1>to become a defense lawyer and most likely what she

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<v Speaker 1>was beginning to study in her post secondary education as well. Nice,

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<v Speaker 1>so right off the bat, super awesome person.

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<v Speaker 2>No kidding.

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<v Speaker 1>Now. At the time, she was at a place with

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<v Speaker 1>her boyfriend Ryan Ryan Waller. She was living there with him,

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<v Speaker 1>and Ryan was a bit younger than her, and Ryan

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<v Speaker 1>was eighteen years old, and Ryan was a gun enthusiast.

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<v Speaker 1>Nothing wrong with that. I'm just going to say that

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<v Speaker 1>there there are many people who are gun enthusiasts. That

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<v Speaker 1>does not make you bad person. It's if you miss

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<v Speaker 1>use yes your power, you will still be responsible at

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<v Speaker 1>one hundred percent. Now, on the night of December twenty

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<v Speaker 1>third of two thousand and six is when we're going

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<v Speaker 1>to go to Okay.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, so we're backtracking two days.

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<v Speaker 1>We are kap because on December twenty third, Heather went

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<v Speaker 1>to Ryan's or sorry, Heather was at Ryan's place where

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<v Speaker 1>she lived with him, and she was there. They were

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<v Speaker 1>enjoying a movie in a pizza knight.

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<v Speaker 2>Specifically Nice I want one of those.

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<v Speaker 1>But nobody had heard from them since. The two days

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<v Speaker 1>rolled by to December twenty fifth, Christmas Day, and neither

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<v Speaker 1>of them showed up for the Christmas Day celebrations. They

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<v Speaker 1>had planned to visit Ryan's father, Dawn, on Christmas, but

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<v Speaker 1>they didn't show. He made dinner and was left there waiting.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh my goodness, that's not good.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So Dawn clearly tried to contact both of them

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<v Speaker 1>and was unfortunately unable to connect. No one answered either phone. Now,

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<v Speaker 1>this was very abnormal. It was very uncharacteristic of them

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<v Speaker 1>to not answer. It was very uncharacteristic of them to

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<v Speaker 1>not show up or you know, let him know or

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<v Speaker 1>not be in contact. So he was immediately worked.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, especially if you like being that time of year, Christmas, right,

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<v Speaker 2>you're more so involved in contact with family.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh, definitely. You usually have schedules planned, who's bringing them

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<v Speaker 1>up for dinner or whatever. And if you got multiple

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<v Speaker 1>families who're stopping off at you know, you're going to

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<v Speaker 1>be planning that all out too, right.

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<v Speaker 2>There's a lot of people you're in contact with around

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<v Speaker 2>that time. Yeah, not for everyone though, not forever.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but generally speaking.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, generally, I mean it's too much.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it is. Honestly, Christmas is Christmas is a good

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<v Speaker 1>time of year, but it's not my favorite.

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<v Speaker 2>It's just too much, you see, my favorite. But it

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<v Speaker 2>gets a little bit daunting sometimes.

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<v Speaker 1>And the consumerism gets me. Consumerism bothers me so much.

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<v Speaker 1>So anyways, our opinions aside. Dawn ended up calling the police.

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<v Speaker 1>He was concerned and he wanted them to do a

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<v Speaker 1>welfare check on Ryan and Heather. Okay, so police arrived

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<v Speaker 1>at their door and they knocked with no answer. The

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<v Speaker 1>police also saw someone's car in the driveway. They weren't

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<v Speaker 1>sure if it was Ryan or Heather's, but there was

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<v Speaker 1>someone's car in the driveway at least, so potentially someone

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<v Speaker 1>was home exactly. Yeah, they looked in the in the

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<v Speaker 1>windows and they saw some lights on, not too many,

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<v Speaker 1>but there was some lights on. Again, maybe someone's home,

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<v Speaker 1>but there's nothing too sure about it, nothing to really confirm,

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<v Speaker 1>and with no one answering the door, there's no way

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<v Speaker 1>to know for sure. So they knocked again, and this

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<v Speaker 1>time they made it clear who they were, and they

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<v Speaker 1>said police were here to issue a wellness check, is

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<v Speaker 1>anyone home? This time it didn't go unanswered. They heard

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<v Speaker 1>the sound of the door being unlocked from the inside

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<v Speaker 1>and the latch clicked and swung open with Ryan standing

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<v Speaker 1>in the doorway. Now immediately police could tell something wasn't right.

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<v Speaker 1>Ryan was standing in front of him with a massive

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<v Speaker 1>black eye and a gash on the side of his

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<v Speaker 1>nose and a couple other cuts on his face as well. Now,

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<v Speaker 1>when I say is I like he had a black eye,

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<v Speaker 1>I mean like this was bad. The bruising was pretty

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<v Speaker 1>much as dark as it gets, and it surrounded the

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<v Speaker 1>entirety of his left eye, like his whole eye SOCKETI

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<v Speaker 1>just like as dark as can be for a bruise.

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<v Speaker 1>So behind him, police could also see a woman laying

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<v Speaker 1>on the couch. They began to explain to Ryan that

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<v Speaker 1>they were there for the wellness check and his father

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<v Speaker 1>had called concerned, and they asked Ryan what had happened

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<v Speaker 1>to his eye. Ryan was acting really odd. He said

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<v Speaker 1>he didn't know what happened to his eye, and he

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<v Speaker 1>seemed very evasive and nonchalant about the whole situation. The

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<v Speaker 1>police asked if the woman on the couch behind him

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<v Speaker 1>if that was Heather, to which Ryan responded, yes, but

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<v Speaker 1>Heather was sleeping, so he didn't want to disturb her

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<v Speaker 1>or wake her up.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay. I was like, is she alive? But she That

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<v Speaker 2>doesn't not really answer the question.

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<v Speaker 1>It doesn't. And now being that this is a wellness check, however,

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<v Speaker 1>sleeping doesn't matter to the police, They're like, well, we're

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<v Speaker 1>not gonna not wake her up. We need to check

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<v Speaker 1>and make sure she's okay.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay good. I thought they might have just taken that

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<v Speaker 2>as so.

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<v Speaker 1>No, they need to confirm that both people are in

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<v Speaker 1>fact okay, okay good, especially considering the initial appearance of

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<v Speaker 1>Ryan and the bruising of his face. Right. So, after

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<v Speaker 1>some more conversations between Ryan and the police, and some

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<v Speaker 1>convincing Ryan eventually accepted that they needed to wake up

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00:14:25.039 --> 00:14:27.360
<v Speaker 1>Heather to check on her as well, so he stepped

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<v Speaker 1>aside and let the police end.

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<v Speaker 2>No problem, okay.

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<v Speaker 1>Once they approached Heather, however, things took a quick turn

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00:14:34.519 --> 00:14:38.039
<v Speaker 1>for the worse because Heather wasn't sleeping on the couch.

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<v Speaker 1>She was laying there in her own blood. Heather had

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<v Speaker 1>suffered a single gunshot wound to the head, and it

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00:14:44.879 --> 00:14:47.480
<v Speaker 1>was clear to the police due to her condition, that

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00:14:47.559 --> 00:14:49.840
<v Speaker 1>this would have occurred a few days ago.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh no, okay, that's what I was not hoping was

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<v Speaker 2>the case.

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00:14:55.480 --> 00:14:57.120
<v Speaker 1>That is the exact case.

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<v Speaker 2>But that so you almost wonder if he was like

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<v Speaker 2>position that so that oh, just like you can see

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00:15:03.399 --> 00:15:06.919
<v Speaker 2>her feet like she's just sleeping. Meanwhile she's like dead

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00:15:06.960 --> 00:15:08.240
<v Speaker 2>on the couch. Holy heck.

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00:15:09.240 --> 00:15:10.480
<v Speaker 1>So I'm going to go to the limb here and

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00:15:10.480 --> 00:15:17.240
<v Speaker 1>I'm going to say something. There is a major twist

305
00:15:17.440 --> 00:15:21.320
<v Speaker 1>in this case. You're allowed to speculate all you want

306
00:15:21.360 --> 00:15:23.960
<v Speaker 1>as I'm talking. Okay, Okay, I am not going to

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00:15:24.000 --> 00:15:26.879
<v Speaker 1>confirm deny or go into conversations with any of it.

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00:15:27.480 --> 00:15:29.440
<v Speaker 2>So literally, that's just our normal.

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00:15:29.159 --> 00:15:35.759
<v Speaker 1>Life pretty much. So what you're saying, is you think

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<v Speaker 1>Ryan could have potentially been positioning her on the coach

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00:15:38.960 --> 00:15:41.600
<v Speaker 1>to try and convince police that she was asleep rather

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00:15:41.600 --> 00:15:42.240
<v Speaker 1>than deceased.

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<v Speaker 2>Well potentially, that was my initial thought. Yeah, like that

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00:15:46.000 --> 00:15:48.919
<v Speaker 2>would be because your hope would be open the door

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00:15:48.960 --> 00:15:52.320
<v Speaker 2>and like yeah, I'm good, everything's good, whatever, and then

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00:15:52.399 --> 00:15:54.679
<v Speaker 2>they just leave and don't actually come in to like

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00:15:54.720 --> 00:15:59.519
<v Speaker 2>make sure that Heather is alive. And well, yeah, that's fair. Yeah,

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00:16:00.039 --> 00:16:04.279
<v Speaker 2>could happen potentially some Oh definitely police maybe just okay, yeah,

319
00:16:04.360 --> 00:16:05.840
<v Speaker 2>like it's Christmas, like whatever.

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00:16:05.879 --> 00:16:10.360
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I see you're sleeping there. Yes, that makes sense. Well,

321
00:16:10.600 --> 00:16:13.200
<v Speaker 1>clearly that's not what happened. They clearly went in, they

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00:16:13.200 --> 00:16:17.519
<v Speaker 1>saw her unfortunately passed away, and immediately Ryan was arrested

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00:16:17.559 --> 00:16:21.960
<v Speaker 1>and in police custody. Yeah, but Ryan seemed a little confused.

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00:16:22.039 --> 00:16:24.840
<v Speaker 1>He didn't know why he was being arrested or exactly

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00:16:24.919 --> 00:16:26.080
<v Speaker 1>what was going on.

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00:16:26.879 --> 00:16:27.759
<v Speaker 2>So he's in shock.

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<v Speaker 1>Potentially, Well, he didn't resist and he was put into

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00:16:31.159 --> 00:16:34.799
<v Speaker 1>the backseat of the squad car while more police processed

329
00:16:34.840 --> 00:16:36.679
<v Speaker 1>the scene and paramedics attended to Heather.

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00:16:37.080 --> 00:16:38.840
<v Speaker 2>Oh that's so sad.

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00:16:39.480 --> 00:16:42.320
<v Speaker 1>Mm hmm. So he was just kind of like, what's

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00:16:42.320 --> 00:16:45.919
<v Speaker 1>going on like why am I arrested? What's happening? So

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00:16:46.039 --> 00:16:48.480
<v Speaker 1>Ryan would sit in the backseat of the car for

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00:16:48.559 --> 00:16:51.840
<v Speaker 1>several hours before police would know how to process this.

335
00:16:53.080 --> 00:16:55.519
<v Speaker 1>After all, I mean, they were just performing a routine

336
00:16:55.519 --> 00:16:58.120
<v Speaker 1>wellness check, right, and then they knock on the door

337
00:16:58.159 --> 00:17:03.519
<v Speaker 1>and they stumble on to basically a murder scene. So

338
00:17:03.600 --> 00:17:07.200
<v Speaker 1>eventually Ryan would have ended up at the police station

339
00:17:07.400 --> 00:17:11.559
<v Speaker 1>and interrogations regarding the incident would begin with Ryan at

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00:17:11.720 --> 00:17:17.839
<v Speaker 1>five eight am. Okay, Now, the full interrogation footage is

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00:17:18.160 --> 00:17:19.960
<v Speaker 1>actually available online.

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00:17:20.119 --> 00:17:22.039
<v Speaker 2>Oh right, I remember saying that, yes, you.

343
00:17:22.000 --> 00:17:24.400
<v Speaker 1>Can watch this whole thing on YouTube. I've watched it

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00:17:24.440 --> 00:17:29.599
<v Speaker 1>about three times now, probably more if you include going

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00:17:29.720 --> 00:17:33.559
<v Speaker 1>back for clips and stuff. So as it begins, Ryan

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00:17:33.599 --> 00:17:36.359
<v Speaker 1>walks into the room dressed in a complete white jumpsuit

347
00:17:36.400 --> 00:17:40.400
<v Speaker 1>that clearly the investigators put him into. I'm assuming to

348
00:17:40.440 --> 00:17:44.480
<v Speaker 1>take his clothes for evidence, right, okay, and looking very

349
00:17:44.559 --> 00:17:48.680
<v Speaker 1>visibly fatigued and uncomfortable. He's often like swaying back and

350
00:17:48.759 --> 00:17:52.319
<v Speaker 1>forth or changing positions and like very uncomfortable, and he's

351
00:17:52.359 --> 00:17:56.359
<v Speaker 1>even moaning at times, just being like, oh so he's

352
00:17:56.400 --> 00:18:00.559
<v Speaker 1>not having a good time. He is cuugh to the

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00:18:00.599 --> 00:18:03.240
<v Speaker 1>table in the room and sits down on the corner

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00:18:03.319 --> 00:18:06.480
<v Speaker 1>chair as he waits for the questioning to begin. The

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00:18:06.519 --> 00:18:09.920
<v Speaker 1>first thing that happens in interrogation is that they begin

356
00:18:10.000 --> 00:18:13.799
<v Speaker 1>taking pictures of the bottom of his feet. And I'm

357
00:18:13.839 --> 00:18:17.519
<v Speaker 1>presuming this is for forensic reasons. Maybe it could be

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00:18:17.519 --> 00:18:20.680
<v Speaker 1>footprints found in the house or somewhere around the scene.

359
00:18:21.039 --> 00:18:24.759
<v Speaker 2>Okay, I was like, why, okay, that makes sense though.

360
00:18:25.359 --> 00:18:28.720
<v Speaker 1>So once this is going on, the very first thing

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00:18:28.960 --> 00:18:33.519
<v Speaker 1>Ryan says in this interrogation footage is quote, man, I

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00:18:33.839 --> 00:18:38.720
<v Speaker 1>just want to go to sleep, to which the detectives

363
00:18:39.400 --> 00:18:42.640
<v Speaker 1>in the room. The detective sorry in the room later responds,

364
00:18:43.480 --> 00:18:46.480
<v Speaker 1>if you have a concussion, you don't need to sleep.

365
00:18:46.759 --> 00:18:51.000
<v Speaker 1>That's what the doctors will say. So clearly they assume

366
00:18:51.160 --> 00:18:54.400
<v Speaker 1>he's got a concussion and they don't want him to sleep, right,

367
00:18:55.079 --> 00:18:57.319
<v Speaker 1>which we all know if you have a concussion, you

368
00:18:57.319 --> 00:18:57.960
<v Speaker 1>shouldn't be going to.

369
00:18:58.079 --> 00:19:00.160
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you know, you got to stay awake for sure.

370
00:19:00.039 --> 00:19:03.200
<v Speaker 1>Because that can just cause brain damage or anything like that.

371
00:19:04.279 --> 00:19:07.759
<v Speaker 1>So moments later Ryan also did say do I get

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00:19:07.799 --> 00:19:12.480
<v Speaker 1>to go home? Shortly after that, the immediate response from

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00:19:12.519 --> 00:19:16.440
<v Speaker 1>the detective is should go to a doctor? Is where

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00:19:16.440 --> 00:19:17.079
<v Speaker 1>you should go?

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00:19:17.920 --> 00:19:20.200
<v Speaker 2>It's like he has no idea what's going on at all?

376
00:19:22.839 --> 00:19:23.440
<v Speaker 1>Seems like it.

377
00:19:25.799 --> 00:19:27.920
<v Speaker 2>I told you, I'm not going to take some he

378
00:19:28.000 --> 00:19:30.640
<v Speaker 2>has some sort of brain damage already or something. I'm

379
00:19:30.640 --> 00:19:34.680
<v Speaker 2>wondering you think, so, well, potentially, he doesn't seem like

380
00:19:34.720 --> 00:19:37.160
<v Speaker 2>he quite realizes the situation that he's in at all.

381
00:19:38.960 --> 00:19:42.559
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, why are you just laughing at him?

382
00:19:42.720 --> 00:19:45.240
<v Speaker 2>Because you're just like, yeah, yeah.

383
00:19:45.319 --> 00:19:50.839
<v Speaker 1>Well I can't say anything because that's fair. But anyways, yeah,

384
00:19:50.880 --> 00:19:52.759
<v Speaker 1>should go to a doctor's Where you should go is

385
00:19:52.799 --> 00:19:54.119
<v Speaker 1>clearly in reference to.

386
00:19:54.319 --> 00:19:56.640
<v Speaker 2>His bad appearance face. Yes.

387
00:19:57.880 --> 00:20:01.640
<v Speaker 1>So eventually the questionings do begin, and it begins with

388
00:20:01.720 --> 00:20:05.599
<v Speaker 1>the reading of his rights and some rather basic questioning

389
00:20:05.680 --> 00:20:09.680
<v Speaker 1>to open up things like you know his name, age,

390
00:20:09.720 --> 00:20:13.680
<v Speaker 1>did he own the house, who lived there? The highest

391
00:20:13.720 --> 00:20:17.720
<v Speaker 1>grade he achieved through high school. All of these questions

392
00:20:17.759 --> 00:20:22.799
<v Speaker 1>went on only to stir confusion. Ryan mostly answered yes or

393
00:20:22.839 --> 00:20:27.359
<v Speaker 1>no questions pretty vaguely, or often answered with I don't.

394
00:20:27.119 --> 00:20:30.880
<v Speaker 2>Know, well some of those already, Like highest grade in

395
00:20:30.960 --> 00:20:33.160
<v Speaker 2>high school, I mean I wouldn't remember, but it's like

396
00:20:33.160 --> 00:20:33.839
<v Speaker 2>this dude.

397
00:20:33.599 --> 00:20:37.279
<v Speaker 1>Well, no highest grade like graduating like grade twelve?

398
00:20:37.720 --> 00:20:41.240
<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, I see, I see. But he's young too,

399
00:20:41.359 --> 00:20:42.400
<v Speaker 2>isn't he he's eighteen.

400
00:20:42.599 --> 00:20:46.400
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, But Ryan wasn't actually able to answer that question either.

401
00:20:47.119 --> 00:20:47.720
<v Speaker 1>He didn't know.

402
00:20:47.960 --> 00:20:49.440
<v Speaker 2>He didn't even know if he graduated.

403
00:20:50.000 --> 00:20:52.880
<v Speaker 1>The detective at one point asked, do you have your

404
00:20:53.000 --> 00:20:56.920
<v Speaker 1>ged I can't remember his response, but I'm pretty sure

405
00:20:56.960 --> 00:20:59.559
<v Speaker 1>he says, I don't know to that exact question, I

406
00:20:59.599 --> 00:21:00.839
<v Speaker 1>didn't have that one written down.

407
00:21:01.039 --> 00:21:01.640
<v Speaker 2>Interesting.

408
00:21:03.240 --> 00:21:07.119
<v Speaker 1>The detective was clearly getting visibly frustrated as he asked

409
00:21:07.200 --> 00:21:10.960
<v Speaker 1>Ryan these simple questions, and Ryan was getting visibly frustrated

410
00:21:11.000 --> 00:21:14.519
<v Speaker 1>as well with the situation. He was fidgeting and kept

411
00:21:14.519 --> 00:21:16.880
<v Speaker 1>saying he just wanted to go home or wanted to

412
00:21:16.880 --> 00:21:22.799
<v Speaker 1>go to sleep. He was clearly distracted. He was clearly upset. Now.

413
00:21:22.799 --> 00:21:25.440
<v Speaker 1>Anytime he did answer questions for the detective, it didn't

414
00:21:25.519 --> 00:21:28.599
<v Speaker 1>usually make any sense like the previous ones, or it

415
00:21:28.680 --> 00:21:32.759
<v Speaker 1>contradicted itself, contradicting something that he had already said in

416
00:21:32.799 --> 00:21:34.480
<v Speaker 1>the interrogation questions from earlier.

417
00:21:35.599 --> 00:21:36.160
<v Speaker 2>He would go on.

418
00:21:36.240 --> 00:21:39.400
<v Speaker 1>He would say that Heather was his girlfriend, and then

419
00:21:39.440 --> 00:21:42.720
<v Speaker 1>that she was just a friend. He didn't know her

420
00:21:42.799 --> 00:21:44.839
<v Speaker 1>last name, and then he said that she was only

421
00:21:44.880 --> 00:21:48.240
<v Speaker 1>sixteen or seventeen years old, when she was actually in

422
00:21:48.279 --> 00:21:53.079
<v Speaker 1>her twenties. A lot of what he said, again contradicting

423
00:21:53.519 --> 00:21:57.279
<v Speaker 1>not making sense. You look very confused right now.

424
00:21:57.519 --> 00:22:01.119
<v Speaker 2>Well, no, I mean I'm not confused. Doesn't all makes sense,

425
00:22:01.200 --> 00:22:05.880
<v Speaker 2>but it's just like weird, just weird. Yeah, to be

426
00:22:06.079 --> 00:22:08.720
<v Speaker 2>like she's my girlfriend, she's not my girlfriend, not even

427
00:22:08.720 --> 00:22:10.880
<v Speaker 2>knowing your age, just like he's maybe living in the

428
00:22:10.880 --> 00:22:14.400
<v Speaker 2>past a bit or something. Do you think so potentially

429
00:22:16.599 --> 00:22:18.720
<v Speaker 2>potentially I feel like I don't want to say much

430
00:22:18.720 --> 00:22:22.440
<v Speaker 2>because I'm gonna be so wrong that something just the

431
00:22:22.480 --> 00:22:24.359
<v Speaker 2>opposite of what I'm thinking is gonna happen.

432
00:22:24.559 --> 00:22:27.880
<v Speaker 1>Fair enough, Well, the officer knew much of the information

433
00:22:28.039 --> 00:22:31.640
<v Speaker 1>Ryan was giving him wasn't true, but he kept prodding

434
00:22:31.680 --> 00:22:34.319
<v Speaker 1>and kept trying to find out any simple information that

435
00:22:34.359 --> 00:22:37.920
<v Speaker 1>he could. Eventually, he asked Ryan how he got the

436
00:22:37.960 --> 00:22:43.960
<v Speaker 1>bruises on his face, to which Ryan responded, he didn't

437
00:22:44.000 --> 00:22:45.400
<v Speaker 1>know which.

438
00:22:45.599 --> 00:22:47.559
<v Speaker 2>It sounded like it was a dozy of a bruise.

439
00:22:47.640 --> 00:22:50.160
<v Speaker 1>You think you'd know, Oh, it's a doozy of a bruise.

440
00:22:51.759 --> 00:22:54.319
<v Speaker 1>But then later he would say that Heather actually did

441
00:22:54.359 --> 00:23:00.319
<v Speaker 1>it and that it was an accident, something along the

442
00:23:00.319 --> 00:23:02.880
<v Speaker 1>lines of while she was helping a friend do her hair,

443
00:23:03.039 --> 00:23:06.720
<v Speaker 1>she accidentally hit him with her fist. Now it seemed

444
00:23:06.759 --> 00:23:09.559
<v Speaker 1>like the officer was getting somewhere, so he continued to

445
00:23:09.599 --> 00:23:14.240
<v Speaker 1>push forward, but the answers again changed, and he repeated,

446
00:23:14.720 --> 00:23:15.480
<v Speaker 1>I don't know.

447
00:23:17.200 --> 00:23:19.960
<v Speaker 2>But sorry, what was it? Initially that she was helped

448
00:23:20.160 --> 00:23:22.480
<v Speaker 2>or a friend was helping her do her hair, and she.

449
00:23:22.440 --> 00:23:25.440
<v Speaker 1>Had him Heather was helping a friend do her hair,

450
00:23:26.079 --> 00:23:30.200
<v Speaker 1>and in that she accidentally hit him in the face.

451
00:23:30.960 --> 00:23:33.480
<v Speaker 2>Okay, which I mean could happen, But would it ended

452
00:23:33.519 --> 00:23:36.359
<v Speaker 2>up leaving that kind of a bruise in that situation?

453
00:23:36.359 --> 00:23:41.759
<v Speaker 1>Woos to say? Now, the detective was again getting frustrated,

454
00:23:41.960 --> 00:23:44.519
<v Speaker 1>more and more so as time went on, the story

455
00:23:44.599 --> 00:23:48.160
<v Speaker 1>was changing. Ryan clearly wasn't speaking the truth, no matter

456
00:23:48.200 --> 00:23:52.400
<v Speaker 1>how hard he kept or how hard Ryan the No

457
00:23:52.400 --> 00:23:55.880
<v Speaker 1>matter how hard he tried, Ryan kept up the same behaviors.

458
00:23:55.920 --> 00:23:58.759
<v Speaker 1>There you go, sorry, stumbled out a little bit. Even

459
00:23:58.799 --> 00:24:02.720
<v Speaker 1>the questions the exact question, I should say, what happened

460
00:24:02.799 --> 00:24:06.640
<v Speaker 1>last night? Ryan responded with, I don't know.

461
00:24:09.119 --> 00:24:13.359
<v Speaker 2>Meanwhile, your girlfriend is dead on the couch cheek yep.

462
00:24:14.400 --> 00:24:17.880
<v Speaker 1>Now, not knowing what else to do, the detective makes

463
00:24:17.920 --> 00:24:20.960
<v Speaker 1>a change in his tactic. He becomes much more aggressive

464
00:24:21.920 --> 00:24:24.480
<v Speaker 1>in his approach, I should say, not physically or right. Yeah,

465
00:24:24.960 --> 00:24:27.599
<v Speaker 1>And at five point forty two am, he comes right

466
00:24:27.640 --> 00:24:30.720
<v Speaker 1>out and says to Ryan, quote, there's a dead girl

467
00:24:31.079 --> 00:24:37.079
<v Speaker 1>in your living room. And Ryan, though not very upset

468
00:24:37.279 --> 00:24:42.240
<v Speaker 1>or shaken, seemed surprised by this. And right then and there,

469
00:24:42.359 --> 00:24:46.039
<v Speaker 1>something seemed to change with Ryan's story. He immediately began

470
00:24:46.119 --> 00:24:50.480
<v Speaker 1>talking about how some people, quote Richie and his dad,

471
00:24:51.200 --> 00:24:55.279
<v Speaker 1>came over and shot both Heather and himself with a revolver.

472
00:24:57.119 --> 00:24:57.559
<v Speaker 2>Okay.

473
00:24:58.799 --> 00:25:01.759
<v Speaker 1>When he was asked where he was shot, Ryan replied,

474
00:25:01.839 --> 00:25:04.240
<v Speaker 1>he was shot in the eye.

475
00:25:04.519 --> 00:25:06.079
<v Speaker 2>In the eye, that's.

476
00:25:05.839 --> 00:25:07.599
<v Speaker 1>What he said. Yeah, he said he was shot in

477
00:25:07.640 --> 00:25:08.359
<v Speaker 1>the eye.

478
00:25:10.039 --> 00:25:13.279
<v Speaker 2>Okay, which meanwhile he was just like punched or something

479
00:25:13.319 --> 00:25:13.799
<v Speaker 2>in the eye.

480
00:25:15.279 --> 00:25:17.519
<v Speaker 1>Well, I mean, the story doesn't seem to make much sense.

481
00:25:17.559 --> 00:25:20.319
<v Speaker 1>How could someone get shot in the freaking eye and

482
00:25:20.400 --> 00:25:23.519
<v Speaker 1>be around to sit here in interrogation and tell someone

483
00:25:23.519 --> 00:25:27.400
<v Speaker 1>about it? Right? The detective clearly didn't believe him. It

484
00:25:27.400 --> 00:25:29.160
<v Speaker 1>seemed like Ryan was trying to put the blame on

485
00:25:29.240 --> 00:25:32.880
<v Speaker 1>someone else or some sort of other incident. So this

486
00:25:32.920 --> 00:25:36.640
<v Speaker 1>conversation continues and Ryan stays on course with this new story.

487
00:25:37.160 --> 00:25:39.960
<v Speaker 1>He says, two men, Richie and his dad, came over

488
00:25:40.039 --> 00:25:44.559
<v Speaker 1>and entered through the back door Richie used. Richie used

489
00:25:44.559 --> 00:25:47.920
<v Speaker 1>to be his roommate. Oh, and then he entered and

490
00:25:47.960 --> 00:25:50.359
<v Speaker 1>he shot him in the eye, and then he shot Heather.

491
00:25:51.680 --> 00:25:54.079
<v Speaker 1>After that, Ryan said he just wanted to go to sleep,

492
00:25:54.200 --> 00:25:56.359
<v Speaker 1>and he just wanted to let Heather sleep too, which

493
00:25:56.400 --> 00:26:00.480
<v Speaker 1>is why he didn't call any ambulance. But of course

494
00:26:00.519 --> 00:26:01.759
<v Speaker 1>we know Heather wasn't sleeping.

495
00:26:02.119 --> 00:26:03.920
<v Speaker 2>Dang, that's so sad.

496
00:26:04.200 --> 00:26:06.559
<v Speaker 1>Uh So where's your head at on this?

497
00:26:07.880 --> 00:26:10.319
<v Speaker 2>Oh? My head is all over the place. Who the

498
00:26:10.359 --> 00:26:14.640
<v Speaker 2>fuck is Richie? For one? I need to know? And

499
00:26:14.799 --> 00:26:17.400
<v Speaker 2>I'm wondering, Like my brain goes to, Okay, well did

500
00:26:17.440 --> 00:26:20.880
<v Speaker 2>he get hit shot in the eye, but like something

501
00:26:20.960 --> 00:26:24.039
<v Speaker 2>was covering his eye and then there was like some

502
00:26:24.079 --> 00:26:26.640
<v Speaker 2>sort of an impact from that, like it caused the

503
00:26:26.680 --> 00:26:29.279
<v Speaker 2>black eye and like his concussion and everything. But like

504
00:26:29.480 --> 00:26:34.240
<v Speaker 2>clearly he wasn't shot actually shot. I'm trying to make

505
00:26:34.279 --> 00:26:34.799
<v Speaker 2>sense of it.

506
00:26:34.920 --> 00:26:36.640
<v Speaker 1>You're trying to make sense of it, Okay, Well, keep

507
00:26:36.680 --> 00:26:38.440
<v Speaker 1>trying to make sense of it. That's just totally cool.

508
00:26:39.000 --> 00:26:43.799
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but it's very sad. I mean, Heather probably didn't

509
00:26:43.839 --> 00:26:46.880
<v Speaker 2>have a chance, like if he did call someone and

510
00:26:46.920 --> 00:26:49.720
<v Speaker 2>not like have her just sleep but sounding like it,

511
00:26:49.799 --> 00:26:52.440
<v Speaker 2>she probably didn't have a chance anyway.

512
00:26:52.039 --> 00:26:56.920
<v Speaker 1>Regardless regardless of what happened, Clearly Heather did not have

513
00:26:56.960 --> 00:27:01.559
<v Speaker 1>a chance unfortunately. Yes, So at one point in the interrogation,

514
00:27:01.640 --> 00:27:06.759
<v Speaker 1>you can actually see the detective's frustration. He like drops

515
00:27:06.799 --> 00:27:08.759
<v Speaker 1>his pen on the table and his arms kind of

516
00:27:08.759 --> 00:27:11.359
<v Speaker 1>go up, like you can see in that moment he

517
00:27:11.359 --> 00:27:13.680
<v Speaker 1>almost fights himself from like literally throwing his hands in

518
00:27:13.720 --> 00:27:14.039
<v Speaker 1>the air.

519
00:27:14.599 --> 00:27:16.200
<v Speaker 2>That's fair though, because as.

520
00:27:16.039 --> 00:27:17.799
<v Speaker 1>He throws his hands in the air, he just begins

521
00:27:17.799 --> 00:27:20.200
<v Speaker 1>and like puts him behind his head. But oh, you

522
00:27:20.240 --> 00:27:23.680
<v Speaker 1>can see the actual frustration as he quite literally throws

523
00:27:23.680 --> 00:27:26.200
<v Speaker 1>his hands in the air and catches himself in that moment.

524
00:27:26.359 --> 00:27:29.319
<v Speaker 2>See, I think that being a detective would be an

525
00:27:29.359 --> 00:27:31.680
<v Speaker 2>awesome kind of like well, I don't know if I

526
00:27:31.680 --> 00:27:34.920
<v Speaker 2>should say awesome, a very interesting job. But then like

527
00:27:35.000 --> 00:27:37.720
<v Speaker 2>interrogating and that sort of thing would just like I

528
00:27:37.799 --> 00:27:39.119
<v Speaker 2>just don't know if I could do it, I think

529
00:27:39.119 --> 00:27:40.559
<v Speaker 2>I would be like, this is shit.

530
00:27:41.000 --> 00:27:45.319
<v Speaker 1>Some of the tactics involved in interrogation is incredible.

531
00:27:45.440 --> 00:27:48.200
<v Speaker 2>Well, and you're in there for hours on edge.

532
00:27:48.440 --> 00:27:50.559
<v Speaker 1>Well that's part of it too. They're trying to.

533
00:27:50.599 --> 00:27:53.559
<v Speaker 2>Wear you down exactly. But your mind is probably always

534
00:27:53.640 --> 00:27:56.640
<v Speaker 2>going like how can I get this information out? And

535
00:27:57.279 --> 00:28:00.519
<v Speaker 2>I feel like it'd be very stressful job. The ent well,

536
00:28:00.559 --> 00:28:01.200
<v Speaker 2>I mean all of it.

537
00:28:01.240 --> 00:28:03.200
<v Speaker 1>Really one of the tactics that I do know what

538
00:28:03.240 --> 00:28:05.880
<v Speaker 1>they use, and it's actually used. I learned this one

539
00:28:05.960 --> 00:28:09.880
<v Speaker 1>actually with another podcast I was on, is when you're

540
00:28:09.880 --> 00:28:12.480
<v Speaker 1>having a conversation with an individual and you want more information,

541
00:28:13.240 --> 00:28:15.559
<v Speaker 1>you just let them talk. You just you don't say anything, right,

542
00:28:16.160 --> 00:28:19.720
<v Speaker 1>you just silence, let them talk and they'll keep talking.

543
00:28:20.240 --> 00:28:24.480
<v Speaker 1>So these these detectives and interrogation they will sit very

544
00:28:24.480 --> 00:28:27.039
<v Speaker 1>close to you and make you very uncomfortable in your

545
00:28:27.039 --> 00:28:30.160
<v Speaker 1>personal bubble, and they will just stare at you. They

546
00:28:30.160 --> 00:28:32.599
<v Speaker 1>will not look away, and they will wait for you

547
00:28:32.640 --> 00:28:36.160
<v Speaker 1>to talk. The first person who looks away basically loses.

548
00:28:36.559 --> 00:28:38.640
<v Speaker 1>The detectives will not look away until you do.

549
00:28:39.480 --> 00:28:41.480
<v Speaker 2>That's a tactic and a lot of things. Even when

550
00:28:41.519 --> 00:28:44.680
<v Speaker 2>I was in a position of fundraising and stuff, lots

551
00:28:44.680 --> 00:28:46.920
<v Speaker 2>of times safe you like asked for a certain gift

552
00:28:47.039 --> 00:28:49.519
<v Speaker 2>or something right, and like lots of people they get

553
00:28:50.039 --> 00:28:51.559
<v Speaker 2>like they'll go in their head like oh my gosh,

554
00:28:51.599 --> 00:28:53.519
<v Speaker 2>I shouldn't asked that or whatever, and then they'll just

555
00:28:53.519 --> 00:28:55.559
<v Speaker 2>like start yapping and like screw it up. But like

556
00:28:55.599 --> 00:28:58.759
<v Speaker 2>if you're just like quiet, right and just like let

557
00:28:58.799 --> 00:29:02.240
<v Speaker 2>the other person speak and stuff like, things can happen.

558
00:29:02.640 --> 00:29:05.079
<v Speaker 2>But it's very awkward and comfortable to do that.

559
00:29:05.200 --> 00:29:08.920
<v Speaker 1>It is. But no matter how quiet this detective was,

560
00:29:09.880 --> 00:29:10.680
<v Speaker 1>it wasn't working.

561
00:29:11.119 --> 00:29:12.200
<v Speaker 2>He just would say nothing.

562
00:29:12.920 --> 00:29:14.799
<v Speaker 1>Basically Ryan was wanting to go to sleep.

563
00:29:15.039 --> 00:29:16.680
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah. He would be like, can you shut up

564
00:29:16.720 --> 00:29:17.759
<v Speaker 2>so I can just have an aup?

565
00:29:17.839 --> 00:29:20.400
<v Speaker 1>Pretty much he would at times even put his head

566
00:29:20.440 --> 00:29:21.200
<v Speaker 1>down on the table.

567
00:29:21.359 --> 00:29:22.279
<v Speaker 2>Oh my goodness.

568
00:29:23.440 --> 00:29:25.920
<v Speaker 1>So the detective was quite literally at his wits end,

569
00:29:26.680 --> 00:29:31.759
<v Speaker 1>and he finally decided to entertain this story of these

570
00:29:31.759 --> 00:29:34.920
<v Speaker 1>two men coming in through bad and someone yeah, Richie

571
00:29:35.000 --> 00:29:38.640
<v Speaker 1>and his dad coming from the back and shooting Ryan

572
00:29:38.680 --> 00:29:39.079
<v Speaker 1>and Heather.

573
00:29:39.359 --> 00:29:41.839
<v Speaker 2>Can I clarify Richie and Richie's dad.

574
00:29:42.240 --> 00:29:43.960
<v Speaker 1>Correct, Yes, Richie and Richie's dad.

575
00:29:44.079 --> 00:29:44.359
<v Speaker 2>Okay.

576
00:29:44.480 --> 00:29:45.559
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so Richie and.

577
00:29:46.359 --> 00:29:48.319
<v Speaker 2>Just making sure it wasn't like his dad.

578
00:29:48.279 --> 00:29:51.119
<v Speaker 1>Richie and Ryan's dad. No, Richie and Richie's dad.

579
00:29:51.359 --> 00:29:51.599
<v Speaker 2>Okay.

580
00:29:52.759 --> 00:29:56.319
<v Speaker 1>So the detective is starting to entertain this idea, and

581
00:29:56.960 --> 00:29:59.440
<v Speaker 1>you can you can see a shift in the whole

582
00:29:59.519 --> 00:30:03.640
<v Speaker 1>attitude d of this detective. He begins to think, okay,

583
00:30:04.039 --> 00:30:07.119
<v Speaker 1>what if Ryan was shot? What if Ryan was shot

584
00:30:07.160 --> 00:30:10.680
<v Speaker 1>in the face? What if something did happen? So the

585
00:30:10.680 --> 00:30:13.440
<v Speaker 1>detective decided he was going to get Ryan to leaning

586
00:30:13.519 --> 00:30:16.319
<v Speaker 1>closer and he was going to take a look at

587
00:30:16.319 --> 00:30:21.079
<v Speaker 1>his face. And to his surprise, the detective could see

588
00:30:21.240 --> 00:30:21.920
<v Speaker 1>a bullet hole.

589
00:30:23.119 --> 00:30:26.279
<v Speaker 2>What yes, in his face?

590
00:30:26.559 --> 00:30:27.440
<v Speaker 1>In his face?

591
00:30:27.920 --> 00:30:30.319
<v Speaker 2>Okay, I was one hundred and ten percent not thinking

592
00:30:30.359 --> 00:30:32.039
<v Speaker 2>that there was actually going to be a bullet hole.

593
00:30:32.799 --> 00:30:36.759
<v Speaker 1>Yep. Where I'll get into the details of where here

594
00:30:36.799 --> 00:30:37.359
<v Speaker 1>in a little bit.

595
00:30:37.880 --> 00:30:40.000
<v Speaker 2>That's crazy, yep.

596
00:30:40.960 --> 00:30:44.440
<v Speaker 1>So he called the fire marshal and uncuffed Ryan as

597
00:30:44.440 --> 00:30:45.000
<v Speaker 1>they waited.

598
00:30:45.359 --> 00:30:47.640
<v Speaker 2>Well, yeah, he needs medical assistance for sure.

599
00:30:47.880 --> 00:30:51.680
<v Speaker 1>Yes, Soon the fire marshal arrived. They begin assessing him

600
00:30:51.680 --> 00:30:55.480
<v Speaker 1>with things like a blood pressure, and they arrived before

601
00:30:55.519 --> 00:30:57.240
<v Speaker 1>the ambulance did, so they were doing this in the

602
00:30:57.279 --> 00:31:01.279
<v Speaker 1>meantime and soon they took to the hospital in the

603
00:31:01.319 --> 00:31:05.880
<v Speaker 1>ambulance when it arrived. As it turned out, Ryan was

604
00:31:05.920 --> 00:31:08.839
<v Speaker 1>telling thee hundred percent truth.

605
00:31:08.720 --> 00:31:10.279
<v Speaker 2>That he was actually shot.

606
00:31:10.559 --> 00:31:13.319
<v Speaker 1>He was shot in the eye. Well, I mean, he

607
00:31:13.359 --> 00:31:15.480
<v Speaker 1>was telling the truth as best he could. The man

608
00:31:15.519 --> 00:31:17.599
<v Speaker 1>had been shot in the face with a twenty two

609
00:31:17.759 --> 00:31:21.480
<v Speaker 1>caliber bullet and he had suffered a horrific head injury.

610
00:31:21.559 --> 00:31:23.319
<v Speaker 1>So of course his memory is going to be foggy.

611
00:31:23.519 --> 00:31:25.640
<v Speaker 1>Of course his decision making wasn't very good.

612
00:31:25.960 --> 00:31:28.400
<v Speaker 2>Well, the fact that he's even alive is insane.

613
00:31:28.720 --> 00:31:31.440
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, right, yeah, he's lucky enough that he survived

614
00:31:31.440 --> 00:31:33.519
<v Speaker 1>and he was able to remember who shot him.

615
00:31:33.559 --> 00:31:35.960
<v Speaker 2>On top of it, how on earth did he survive?

616
00:31:37.079 --> 00:31:40.480
<v Speaker 1>Well, As it turns out, this is how the story unfolds,

617
00:31:40.519 --> 00:31:42.240
<v Speaker 1>and I will answer that question here.

618
00:31:42.359 --> 00:31:43.200
<v Speaker 2>Okay, thank you.

619
00:31:43.839 --> 00:31:47.759
<v Speaker 1>So on December twenty third, Richie Carver twenty three years

620
00:31:47.759 --> 00:31:51.440
<v Speaker 1>old and his father, Larry Carver fifty four years old,

621
00:31:52.039 --> 00:31:55.680
<v Speaker 1>entered their home. Richie had been a roommate of the

622
00:31:55.720 --> 00:31:58.759
<v Speaker 1>couple about a month prior to the incident, and apparently

623
00:31:59.279 --> 00:32:01.839
<v Speaker 1>Ryan got in a bit of a confrontation with Richie

624
00:32:01.880 --> 00:32:04.640
<v Speaker 1>and kicked him out of the house after Richie began

625
00:32:04.759 --> 00:32:06.000
<v Speaker 1>hitting on his girlfriend Heather.

626
00:32:06.559 --> 00:32:07.839
<v Speaker 2>Okay, that seems fair.

627
00:32:07.960 --> 00:32:11.000
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So Richie in turn decided he was going to

628
00:32:11.039 --> 00:32:14.839
<v Speaker 1>plot some revenge and came back to the house gun

629
00:32:14.880 --> 00:32:19.079
<v Speaker 1>in hand, with his dad tagging along with him. On

630
00:32:19.200 --> 00:32:21.759
<v Speaker 1>that night, Richie and Larry tried to enter through the

631
00:32:21.799 --> 00:32:26.599
<v Speaker 1>back glass sliding door of their place, but Ryan saw

632
00:32:26.640 --> 00:32:29.599
<v Speaker 1>them through the glass trying to enter, and he tried

633
00:32:29.640 --> 00:32:33.519
<v Speaker 1>to prevent them from getting in. As a struggle ensued,

634
00:32:34.000 --> 00:32:36.160
<v Speaker 1>Ryan tries to tried to close the door on the

635
00:32:36.160 --> 00:32:39.079
<v Speaker 1>two men, but Richie managed to reach his arm through

636
00:32:39.160 --> 00:32:43.480
<v Speaker 1>the door before it was completely cold, closed while holding

637
00:32:43.519 --> 00:32:47.400
<v Speaker 1>the gun and pointed it towards Ryan and pulled the trigger.

638
00:32:48.079 --> 00:32:50.440
<v Speaker 2>Wow, this guy meant business.

639
00:32:50.680 --> 00:32:54.680
<v Speaker 1>He shot Ryan two times point blank in the face,

640
00:32:55.599 --> 00:33:01.720
<v Speaker 1>but due to the extreme angle, Ryan thankfully didn't take direct.

641
00:33:01.519 --> 00:33:03.240
<v Speaker 2>Hits, but Heather did.

642
00:33:04.480 --> 00:33:07.680
<v Speaker 1>We'll get to Heather in a moment. The first bullet

643
00:33:07.799 --> 00:33:11.079
<v Speaker 1>went through the right side of his nose and exited

644
00:33:11.240 --> 00:33:16.680
<v Speaker 1>on the left side, directly under his eye. It deflected

645
00:33:17.119 --> 00:33:21.480
<v Speaker 1>against his bones and went back underneath his eye, lodging

646
00:33:21.480 --> 00:33:24.880
<v Speaker 1>itself into his brain along with multiple skull fragments.

647
00:33:25.000 --> 00:33:25.720
<v Speaker 2>Oh shit.

648
00:33:26.200 --> 00:33:29.759
<v Speaker 1>The second shot hit just above his left eye and

649
00:33:29.839 --> 00:33:32.920
<v Speaker 1>grazed him enough that it just deflected off his skull

650
00:33:33.119 --> 00:33:35.319
<v Speaker 1>while still breaking off a bone fragment.

651
00:33:35.640 --> 00:33:37.240
<v Speaker 2>That is lucky.

652
00:33:37.359 --> 00:33:41.039
<v Speaker 1>Yes, these injuries left a total of four bullet holes

653
00:33:41.200 --> 00:33:41.920
<v Speaker 1>on his face.

654
00:33:42.799 --> 00:33:45.039
<v Speaker 2>Wow, I can't believe how lucky that is. I mean, grant,

655
00:33:45.119 --> 00:33:46.680
<v Speaker 2>he still does have a bullet in his brain.

656
00:33:47.000 --> 00:33:52.599
<v Speaker 1>Yes, from these shots, Ryan was knocked unconscious and dropped

657
00:33:52.640 --> 00:33:54.920
<v Speaker 1>to the ground, and the two men were free to

658
00:33:55.079 --> 00:33:59.680
<v Speaker 1>enter the home. Now the men were only there for Ryan. However,

659
00:34:00.079 --> 00:34:03.559
<v Speaker 1>Heather was now a witness, so Richie stepped over Ryan

660
00:34:03.640 --> 00:34:06.480
<v Speaker 1>as he presumed he was now dead, and proceeded to

661
00:34:06.519 --> 00:34:09.199
<v Speaker 1>walk into the living room to find Heather cowering on

662
00:34:09.239 --> 00:34:13.079
<v Speaker 1>the couch. Richie didn't hesitate. He walked right up to her,

663
00:34:13.280 --> 00:34:15.800
<v Speaker 1>pointed the gun in her face, and pulled the trigger,

664
00:34:16.760 --> 00:34:18.559
<v Speaker 1>then left brutal.

665
00:34:20.360 --> 00:34:24.800
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, who the fuck is this? Like just a roommate, Like,

666
00:34:24.960 --> 00:34:29.159
<v Speaker 2>I'm sorry about what kind of argument could I mean,

667
00:34:29.199 --> 00:34:31.199
<v Speaker 2>you already said, but it's like that is not.

668
00:34:31.239 --> 00:34:36.480
<v Speaker 1>A reason that some ridiculous pride factor in getting kicked

669
00:34:36.519 --> 00:34:40.760
<v Speaker 1>out or something to do with I don't know, maybe

670
00:34:40.840 --> 00:34:44.239
<v Speaker 1>he couldn't get Heather and Ryan had her or something.

671
00:34:44.280 --> 00:34:46.079
<v Speaker 1>I don't know. All I know is this Richie guy

672
00:34:46.719 --> 00:34:47.840
<v Speaker 1>douche canoe.

673
00:34:47.519 --> 00:34:50.280
<v Speaker 2>Oh totally, and the fact that his dad is just

674
00:34:50.440 --> 00:34:53.559
<v Speaker 2>there with with doing all of this, instead of being like,

675
00:34:53.599 --> 00:34:57.039
<v Speaker 2>actually that's a terrible idea and like we're not gonna

676
00:34:57.039 --> 00:35:00.559
<v Speaker 2>go and shoot your ex roommate in his girlfriend.

677
00:35:00.800 --> 00:35:02.840
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Instead he's like, oh, you want to go shoot

678
00:35:02.840 --> 00:35:06.880
<v Speaker 1>some people up for an argument your son, Wow, Yeah,

679
00:35:06.920 --> 00:35:08.000
<v Speaker 1>that's great parenting.

680
00:35:08.800 --> 00:35:10.159
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's crazy.

681
00:35:10.920 --> 00:35:15.119
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. So after they left. It's not known how long

682
00:35:15.159 --> 00:35:18.159
<v Speaker 1>it was before Ryan woke up, but for the next

683
00:35:18.280 --> 00:35:21.159
<v Speaker 1>two days Ryan would have been left with massive pain

684
00:35:21.280 --> 00:35:24.119
<v Speaker 1>in his head and a complete fog over his memory.

685
00:35:24.760 --> 00:35:26.840
<v Speaker 1>He would have assumed Heather was sleeping on the couch

686
00:35:26.880 --> 00:35:29.960
<v Speaker 1>and didn't want to disturb her, and most likely forgot

687
00:35:30.000 --> 00:35:33.159
<v Speaker 1>about the shooting entirely. He would have probably gone to

688
00:35:33.199 --> 00:35:35.840
<v Speaker 1>bed and woke up the next day, only to wander

689
00:35:35.960 --> 00:35:39.519
<v Speaker 1>aimlessly about the house in a daze doing so until,

690
00:35:39.840 --> 00:35:43.360
<v Speaker 1>of course, the wellness check was issued by police when

691
00:35:43.360 --> 00:35:46.800
<v Speaker 1>they arrived to find the horrific scene on Christmas Day.

692
00:35:47.320 --> 00:35:51.159
<v Speaker 2>Hey, that's actually really sad, hey, isn't it. You're just

693
00:35:51.159 --> 00:35:54.519
<v Speaker 2>like wandering around your home aimlessly and like just think

694
00:35:54.559 --> 00:35:55.960
<v Speaker 2>your girlfriend's sleeping.

695
00:35:56.639 --> 00:36:02.400
<v Speaker 1>Yep. Oh my gosh, that's his state for two entire days.

696
00:36:02.519 --> 00:36:04.960
<v Speaker 2>Gosh. It almost just takes me there like fly on

697
00:36:05.000 --> 00:36:07.360
<v Speaker 2>the wall watching that, Like that's I.

698
00:36:07.360 --> 00:36:12.639
<v Speaker 1>Couldn't imagine a being in those shoes though. What he

699
00:36:12.760 --> 00:36:14.639
<v Speaker 1>was going through, what he was suffering, what he was

700
00:36:14.639 --> 00:36:20.480
<v Speaker 1>feeling alone, incredibly painful. I'm sure what he was thinking,

701
00:36:21.199 --> 00:36:23.400
<v Speaker 1>Oh my god, I can't even imagine what was going

702
00:36:23.400 --> 00:36:26.280
<v Speaker 1>through someone's head like that, Like, what would does person's

703
00:36:26.320 --> 00:36:28.880
<v Speaker 1>thought be with a bullet lodged in your brain for

704
00:36:29.000 --> 00:36:29.639
<v Speaker 1>two days?

705
00:36:29.679 --> 00:36:31.760
<v Speaker 2>Well, the fact that he even survived and stuff and

706
00:36:31.840 --> 00:36:35.199
<v Speaker 2>was probably sleeping and stuff, and was like, it's almost

707
00:36:35.239 --> 00:36:36.440
<v Speaker 2>amazing that he didn't.

708
00:36:36.199 --> 00:36:39.840
<v Speaker 1>Just Oh, it's miraculous, you know, Yeah, it's incredibly miraculous

709
00:36:39.880 --> 00:36:40.519
<v Speaker 1>as far as I'm.

710
00:36:40.400 --> 00:36:43.320
<v Speaker 2>Concerned, survived two days of that, Yeah.

711
00:36:43.400 --> 00:36:46.440
<v Speaker 1>With a bullet and skull fragments lodged in your brain.

712
00:36:46.760 --> 00:36:48.360
<v Speaker 2>Oh my gosh.

713
00:36:48.400 --> 00:36:52.559
<v Speaker 1>So for this reason alone, Ryan Waller is our badass

714
00:36:52.599 --> 00:36:53.719
<v Speaker 1>of the day.

715
00:36:53.880 --> 00:36:57.199
<v Speaker 2>Pretty amazing to survive. That's like a survival story right

716
00:36:57.239 --> 00:36:57.800
<v Speaker 2>there and a half.

717
00:36:58.000 --> 00:37:02.519
<v Speaker 1>Oh is it ever? Where am I here? Okay? Yeah?

718
00:37:02.559 --> 00:37:06.039
<v Speaker 1>So Richie and Larry Carver were later identified and arrested

719
00:37:06.079 --> 00:37:09.880
<v Speaker 1>in or sorry, We're arrested, and in two thousand and eight,

720
00:37:10.000 --> 00:37:14.519
<v Speaker 1>both men were convicted of felony murder, burglary because after

721
00:37:14.559 --> 00:37:16.920
<v Speaker 1>they did shoot them, they did steal some things.

722
00:37:16.760 --> 00:37:19.039
<v Speaker 2>From the hall oh my gosh, of course.

723
00:37:18.920 --> 00:37:25.519
<v Speaker 1>Aggravated assault and misconduct involving weapons. Richie Carver was sentenced

724
00:37:25.519 --> 00:37:32.079
<v Speaker 1>to a term of natural life However, Richie's father a

725
00:37:32.079 --> 00:37:33.320
<v Speaker 1>little bit of a different story.

726
00:37:33.760 --> 00:37:35.519
<v Speaker 2>Okay, I thought you were going to say that Richie

727
00:37:35.559 --> 00:37:36.760
<v Speaker 2>was like out or something.

728
00:37:38.159 --> 00:37:41.599
<v Speaker 1>No, the case against Larry was based mostly on confessions

729
00:37:41.639 --> 00:37:44.400
<v Speaker 1>he made to his wife, and after she invoked her

730
00:37:44.440 --> 00:37:48.480
<v Speaker 1>marital privilege right and refused to testify against her husband

731
00:37:48.480 --> 00:37:51.920
<v Speaker 1>in court, the case against him was all but dismissed.

732
00:37:53.119 --> 00:37:53.599
<v Speaker 2>The dad.

733
00:37:53.840 --> 00:37:57.480
<v Speaker 1>Yes, what so he got away scott free.

734
00:37:57.679 --> 00:37:58.960
<v Speaker 2>Wow, I don't get that.

735
00:38:00.440 --> 00:38:07.199
<v Speaker 1>There. I'm assuming Richie was not saying anything, not throwing

736
00:38:07.239 --> 00:38:10.440
<v Speaker 1>his dad into the basically, yeah, so could have been

737
00:38:10.519 --> 00:38:12.880
<v Speaker 1>just like no, it was just me blah blah blahlah blah.

738
00:38:12.920 --> 00:38:14.800
<v Speaker 1>And there's nothing else you could say or do to

739
00:38:14.880 --> 00:38:18.559
<v Speaker 1>prove that the dad was there except for the confessions

740
00:38:18.599 --> 00:38:23.400
<v Speaker 1>he made to his wife, which the whole marital privileged thing.

741
00:38:23.840 --> 00:38:26.320
<v Speaker 2>Well, what about and they can they not take the

742
00:38:28.840 --> 00:38:34.719
<v Speaker 2>what's his name again, Richie or Larry? No, Heather's boyfriend

743
00:38:34.880 --> 00:38:38.239
<v Speaker 2>Ryan Ryan? Can they not take Ryan's word at all?

744
00:38:38.440 --> 00:38:41.400
<v Speaker 2>Or because like he was having some I don't know,

745
00:38:41.559 --> 00:38:43.440
<v Speaker 2>a lot going on in his mind there, they couldn't.

746
00:38:43.440 --> 00:38:46.880
<v Speaker 1>Maybe, I don't know. There's not a lot of information

747
00:38:47.039 --> 00:38:51.119
<v Speaker 1>on this case. After the interrogation has taken place, yes,

748
00:38:51.320 --> 00:38:53.559
<v Speaker 1>and there's probably a reason for that. But I'll touch

749
00:38:53.599 --> 00:38:54.519
<v Speaker 1>on it here in a second.

750
00:38:54.920 --> 00:38:57.519
<v Speaker 2>Oh does it just keep getting worse and worse here.

751
00:38:58.320 --> 00:39:02.480
<v Speaker 1>We'll touch on this. Don't worry about it. But yeah,

752
00:39:02.519 --> 00:39:07.960
<v Speaker 1>So Richie Carver is serving a natural life sentence.

753
00:39:09.599 --> 00:39:11.760
<v Speaker 2>Toby never gets out basically.

754
00:39:12.119 --> 00:39:19.760
<v Speaker 1>Pretty much, okay, ye, while his father is walking the streets, hopefully.

755
00:39:19.360 --> 00:39:20.679
<v Speaker 2>Not murdering any other people.

756
00:39:20.920 --> 00:39:24.679
<v Speaker 1>Yep. Now, as for Ryan, he was held in police

757
00:39:24.679 --> 00:39:31.000
<v Speaker 1>custody for over six hours without any medical treatment, not

758
00:39:31.079 --> 00:39:35.360
<v Speaker 1>even assessment that six hours that could be causing or

759
00:39:35.440 --> 00:39:38.840
<v Speaker 1>continuing to cause irreversible brain damage and hemorrhaging.

760
00:39:41.360 --> 00:39:44.440
<v Speaker 2>Yes, but he'd already spent two days, that's true.

761
00:39:44.599 --> 00:39:46.159
<v Speaker 1>That's true, And he.

762
00:39:46.119 --> 00:39:48.840
<v Speaker 2>Would have spent longer if there wasn't for this wellness check.

763
00:39:48.920 --> 00:39:50.719
<v Speaker 2>But okay, that's true.

764
00:39:51.800 --> 00:39:54.280
<v Speaker 1>But eventually, when they finally realized that they had made

765
00:39:54.320 --> 00:39:56.840
<v Speaker 1>a mistake and found the bullet holes in his face,

766
00:39:56.960 --> 00:39:59.519
<v Speaker 1>he was rushed to the hospital where he was where

767
00:39:59.519 --> 00:40:04.639
<v Speaker 1>he underwent immediate emergency surgery. Ryan thankfully survived the injury

768
00:40:04.760 --> 00:40:07.239
<v Speaker 1>and the surgery, but he didn't come out of the

769
00:40:07.280 --> 00:40:10.199
<v Speaker 1>surgery the same. To save him, they had to remove

770
00:40:10.199 --> 00:40:13.519
<v Speaker 1>a portion of his brain and at least one of

771
00:40:13.599 --> 00:40:18.199
<v Speaker 1>his eyes. Some sources say both, and others say only one.

772
00:40:19.079 --> 00:40:21.280
<v Speaker 1>Part of the reason for this is again because there's

773
00:40:21.320 --> 00:40:25.280
<v Speaker 1>not a lot of information surrounding his case after the interrogation. However,

774
00:40:25.639 --> 00:40:29.519
<v Speaker 1>Ryan sorry, however Ryan was doing afterwards. I did find

775
00:40:29.559 --> 00:40:33.480
<v Speaker 1>a picture of him after his surgery and after his recovery,

776
00:40:33.800 --> 00:40:35.400
<v Speaker 1>and to me it does look like he has his

777
00:40:35.480 --> 00:40:37.800
<v Speaker 1>one natural eye saved and the other one has been

778
00:40:37.840 --> 00:40:42.000
<v Speaker 1>replaced with a prosthetic. Okay, but other reports also say

779
00:40:42.320 --> 00:40:45.039
<v Speaker 1>even though he still has his eye, he's still completely blind,

780
00:40:45.639 --> 00:40:50.599
<v Speaker 1>so that's completely up for contention. However, that is my

781
00:40:50.760 --> 00:40:53.159
<v Speaker 1>speculation that he has his one eye and one prosthetic,

782
00:40:53.199 --> 00:40:56.199
<v Speaker 1>So just throwing that out there. So while he did survive,

783
00:40:56.320 --> 00:40:59.000
<v Speaker 1>his life would of course not be the same. And

784
00:40:59.079 --> 00:41:02.960
<v Speaker 1>ten years later, unfortunately, Ryan would succumb to a seizure

785
00:41:03.039 --> 00:41:05.519
<v Speaker 1>and lose his life on the twentieth of January and

786
00:41:05.599 --> 00:41:09.760
<v Speaker 1>twenty sixteen, a seizure that was directly correlated to the

787
00:41:09.760 --> 00:41:14.159
<v Speaker 1>injury sustained and directly correlated to the lack of care

788
00:41:14.199 --> 00:41:16.679
<v Speaker 1>he received. Whether the six hours that he was in

789
00:41:16.719 --> 00:41:21.639
<v Speaker 1>custody before he would receive that care. That medical attention,

790
00:41:22.559 --> 00:41:27.320
<v Speaker 1>if that would have made the difference is unknown. Now

791
00:41:27.360 --> 00:41:30.679
<v Speaker 1>that's harsh. There is major speculation on why there is

792
00:41:30.679 --> 00:41:34.679
<v Speaker 1>so little surrounding this case after the interrogation is because

793
00:41:34.719 --> 00:41:39.119
<v Speaker 1>of the authorities not wanting much information out there, because

794
00:41:39.159 --> 00:41:42.480
<v Speaker 1>of the oopsie that they did, because of those six

795
00:41:42.559 --> 00:41:44.039
<v Speaker 1>hours without medical attention.

796
00:41:45.000 --> 00:41:47.559
<v Speaker 2>Okay, but can I just say something really quick. You're

797
00:41:47.639 --> 00:41:51.239
<v Speaker 2>like staring at someone for like six hours? Okay, okay,

798
00:41:51.320 --> 00:41:54.119
<v Speaker 2>would you like literally not notice that they had bullet

799
00:41:54.119 --> 00:41:57.639
<v Speaker 2>holes in their face? What were they looking at exactly?

800
00:41:58.440 --> 00:42:02.719
<v Speaker 1>The bullet holes weren't super obvious bullet holes. They looked

801
00:42:02.719 --> 00:42:07.079
<v Speaker 1>more like cuts and gashes. Apparently, even in the interrogation,

802
00:42:08.639 --> 00:42:11.039
<v Speaker 1>the detective at one point asks him about how he

803
00:42:11.079 --> 00:42:14.679
<v Speaker 1>got the gash or the cut on his nose, So

804
00:42:14.719 --> 00:42:17.440
<v Speaker 1>he identifies the exit wound from one of the bullets

805
00:42:18.159 --> 00:42:21.360
<v Speaker 1>as a cut. That's what it apparently looked like.

806
00:42:21.760 --> 00:42:24.079
<v Speaker 2>But then just thinking about this too, this just popped

807
00:42:24.079 --> 00:42:27.079
<v Speaker 2>in my head, like murder or not. I mean, he

808
00:42:27.239 --> 00:42:29.119
<v Speaker 2>was in rough shape. They maybe should have had him

809
00:42:29.159 --> 00:42:32.440
<v Speaker 2>looked at before he was brought and we're questioning.

810
00:42:32.039 --> 00:42:36.320
<v Speaker 1>Hey, well, in that interrogation, you hear him say you

811
00:42:36.360 --> 00:42:39.719
<v Speaker 1>should go to a hospital, and you also hear him

812
00:42:39.719 --> 00:42:43.000
<v Speaker 1>say you shouldn't sleep because you most likely have a concussion.

813
00:42:44.039 --> 00:42:45.559
<v Speaker 1>Yet they're still not treating him.

814
00:42:45.719 --> 00:42:47.679
<v Speaker 2>Yet, We're still gonna sit you here and ask you

815
00:42:47.719 --> 00:42:49.440
<v Speaker 2>a million questions exactly.

816
00:42:50.159 --> 00:42:51.119
<v Speaker 1>That's the problem.

817
00:42:51.679 --> 00:42:52.599
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's not great.

818
00:42:52.760 --> 00:42:56.679
<v Speaker 1>Put it this way. If you have an assailant stab someone,

819
00:42:57.519 --> 00:43:00.800
<v Speaker 1>but they end up getting stabbed too, you still need

820
00:43:00.840 --> 00:43:04.920
<v Speaker 1>to treat both individuals. Yes, So why didn't they treat

821
00:43:05.000 --> 00:43:07.360
<v Speaker 1>him even though they know he has a concussion and

822
00:43:07.360 --> 00:43:08.800
<v Speaker 1>they know he needs medical attention.

823
00:43:09.719 --> 00:43:11.679
<v Speaker 2>Well, like even just thinking about the fact that he

824
00:43:11.719 --> 00:43:14.679
<v Speaker 2>wasn't making any sense and all that jazz, like you think, okay,

825
00:43:14.960 --> 00:43:16.920
<v Speaker 2>because even when you were going through it at first,

826
00:43:16.920 --> 00:43:19.199
<v Speaker 2>it's like okay, like maybe they should just stop here,

827
00:43:19.280 --> 00:43:21.559
<v Speaker 2>Like something's not not quite right.

828
00:43:22.159 --> 00:43:26.239
<v Speaker 1>And when you watch that interrogation footage, it's almost immediate

829
00:43:26.559 --> 00:43:28.159
<v Speaker 1>that you can tell something's not right.

830
00:43:30.039 --> 00:43:31.719
<v Speaker 2>Okay, that's really sad.

831
00:43:31.840 --> 00:43:35.400
<v Speaker 1>He's like putting his head down on the table. He's moaning,

832
00:43:35.719 --> 00:43:41.159
<v Speaker 1>he's very uncomfortable, very disoriented. He looks like he's been

833
00:43:41.199 --> 00:43:45.840
<v Speaker 1>awake for the last week, like he is in rough shape.

834
00:43:45.840 --> 00:43:47.679
<v Speaker 2>Oh my gosh. So if I watched some of this.

835
00:43:47.760 --> 00:43:50.079
<v Speaker 2>It's probably gonna just like destroy my heart a little.

836
00:43:50.199 --> 00:43:53.119
<v Speaker 1>Yes, it's extremely obvious he needed medical attention.

837
00:43:53.559 --> 00:43:53.880
<v Speaker 2>Dang.

838
00:43:53.960 --> 00:43:56.880
<v Speaker 1>However, he was held in custody for six hours before

839
00:43:56.920 --> 00:44:00.639
<v Speaker 1>he received it. I'm not saying that he didn't need

840
00:44:00.679 --> 00:44:03.159
<v Speaker 1>to be questioned. I'm not saying it's not right that

841
00:44:03.199 --> 00:44:07.239
<v Speaker 1>he was a suspect. I'm just saying they still need

842
00:44:07.280 --> 00:44:08.400
<v Speaker 1>to get medical attention.

843
00:44:08.880 --> 00:44:12.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Nope, that's totally fair. But I also feel like, okay,

844
00:44:12.920 --> 00:44:15.760
<v Speaker 2>that's six hours. It's six hours too long. But then,

845
00:44:15.800 --> 00:44:18.400
<v Speaker 2>grant you, he was like two days just alone. So

846
00:44:18.519 --> 00:44:20.360
<v Speaker 2>I mean there was a lot of damage. I haven't

847
00:44:20.400 --> 00:44:22.599
<v Speaker 2>mentioned that earlier could have been done at that point.

848
00:44:22.880 --> 00:44:25.719
<v Speaker 1>Yes, I'm not certain that six hours would make a

849
00:44:25.719 --> 00:44:30.119
<v Speaker 1>difference in the end to save whatever portion of brain,

850
00:44:30.360 --> 00:44:33.320
<v Speaker 1>or save his sight, or even save him from the seizure.

851
00:44:34.199 --> 00:44:39.320
<v Speaker 2>But he still was not being treated like a human being. Yes,

852
00:44:39.400 --> 00:44:40.239
<v Speaker 2>that needed help.

853
00:44:40.360 --> 00:44:42.599
<v Speaker 1>He needed medical attention and it was not being provided.

854
00:44:42.719 --> 00:44:43.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. No, that's not right.

855
00:44:44.199 --> 00:44:49.159
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so that is a wild case. That is the

856
00:44:49.159 --> 00:44:53.440
<v Speaker 1>case of Ryan Weller and Heather Kwan. Yeah, that one

857
00:44:53.440 --> 00:44:56.880
<v Speaker 1>I found on Reddit. It was under the subtext of

858
00:44:57.480 --> 00:45:01.719
<v Speaker 1>cases that you that you've heard with crazy twists and

859
00:45:01.760 --> 00:45:02.840
<v Speaker 1>turns or something like that.

860
00:45:03.440 --> 00:45:06.440
<v Speaker 2>So well, that's just like a pile of shit. Really,

861
00:45:06.880 --> 00:45:09.519
<v Speaker 2>that was a pile of shit. Wow, Okay, Like I mean,

862
00:45:09.559 --> 00:45:12.679
<v Speaker 2>you did it well, but it's just like that's just sad.

863
00:45:12.920 --> 00:45:15.360
<v Speaker 2>And I mean he got ten years, I guess, but

864
00:45:15.400 --> 00:45:17.239
<v Speaker 2>it's like that's sad that he died in the end.

865
00:45:17.280 --> 00:45:21.639
<v Speaker 2>And I wonder exactly how how those ten years of

866
00:45:21.679 --> 00:45:25.159
<v Speaker 2>his life were he probably, like I mean, he had

867
00:45:25.440 --> 00:45:27.280
<v Speaker 2>the sight and stuff, but I mean also a lot

868
00:45:27.320 --> 00:45:28.199
<v Speaker 2>of trauma. I'm sure.

869
00:45:28.320 --> 00:45:30.280
<v Speaker 1>Well, those ten years of his life. Last ten years,

870
00:45:30.360 --> 00:45:32.519
<v Speaker 1>he did have to move back in with his parents

871
00:45:32.519 --> 00:45:35.679
<v Speaker 1>because he was not able to completely look after himself.

872
00:45:35.719 --> 00:45:40.519
<v Speaker 1>He was no longer dependent. He needed someone to assist

873
00:45:40.599 --> 00:45:48.440
<v Speaker 1>for assisted living. Yeah, dang, So yeah that's the.

874
00:45:48.400 --> 00:45:53.599
<v Speaker 2>Case, and Richie's dad is just living his best life

875
00:45:53.679 --> 00:45:57.559
<v Speaker 2>probably yep. Well who knows. But yeah, don't love that.

876
00:45:58.159 --> 00:46:00.559
<v Speaker 1>No, I don't love a lot of stuff about this case.

877
00:46:00.599 --> 00:46:02.320
<v Speaker 1>But that's how it went down.

878
00:46:03.239 --> 00:46:06.239
<v Speaker 2>Okay, Well that's interesting. I'm curious if like many people

879
00:46:06.280 --> 00:46:06.840
<v Speaker 2>have heard this.

880
00:46:07.199 --> 00:46:09.119
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, let us know if you've heard of this case before.

881
00:46:09.639 --> 00:46:11.639
<v Speaker 1>Like I say, we're trying to find some more lesser

882
00:46:11.719 --> 00:46:13.960
<v Speaker 1>known cases for you. You guys seem to be enjoying it,

883
00:46:14.400 --> 00:46:16.840
<v Speaker 1>but don't count out those big ones, because we're gonna

884
00:46:16.840 --> 00:46:19.079
<v Speaker 1>be doing those two. If you want to hear more,

885
00:46:19.199 --> 00:46:20.880
<v Speaker 1>of course, you can listen to the rest of our

886
00:46:20.880 --> 00:46:23.199
<v Speaker 1>episodes if you haven't already. You can find us on Patreon,

887
00:46:23.199 --> 00:46:26.039
<v Speaker 1>where you can get exclusive episodes and some more behind

888
00:46:26.039 --> 00:46:29.400
<v Speaker 1>the scenes content. You can also find us on Instagram, Facebook.

889
00:46:29.400 --> 00:46:31.719
<v Speaker 1>We even have a Reddit page, a web page. We

890
00:46:31.840 --> 00:46:33.679
<v Speaker 1>got a lot of stuff going on. Look us up,

891
00:46:33.719 --> 00:46:36.119
<v Speaker 1>we could agram. All the links are down below. You

892
00:46:36.159 --> 00:46:37.239
<v Speaker 1>can even check out our.

893
00:46:37.199 --> 00:46:40.159
<v Speaker 2>Merch we got We've just got it all. What do

894
00:46:40.199 --> 00:46:40.760
<v Speaker 2>we not have?

895
00:46:41.119 --> 00:46:44.400
<v Speaker 1>Right? And for the record, the merch is drawn.

896
00:46:44.280 --> 00:46:47.159
<v Speaker 2>All by oh my gosh. Yeah, and hey, I'm like

897
00:46:47.199 --> 00:46:48.519
<v Speaker 2>representing the merch right now.

898
00:46:48.559 --> 00:46:49.119
<v Speaker 1>You're wearing it.

899
00:46:49.159 --> 00:46:51.320
<v Speaker 2>I live in the shirt and you look good.

900
00:46:53.239 --> 00:46:55.039
<v Speaker 1>Well. Thank you for being here and thank you for listening.

901
00:46:55.079 --> 00:46:58.159
<v Speaker 1>We do truly appreciate it. If you're still listening this far,

902
00:46:58.320 --> 00:46:59.719
<v Speaker 1>you're here to the very bitter end.

903
00:47:00.199 --> 00:47:01.840
<v Speaker 2>You're a true rock star.

904
00:47:02.159 --> 00:47:05.079
<v Speaker 1>You are, and may we ask you go give us

905
00:47:05.079 --> 00:47:07.320
<v Speaker 1>a rating. We don't ask all the time. Give us

906
00:47:07.320 --> 00:47:10.360
<v Speaker 1>an honest rating, whether it's one, but I suggest five stars.

907
00:47:10.559 --> 00:47:13.079
<v Speaker 1>You can give us rating on Spotify or Apple. Podcast

908
00:47:13.320 --> 00:47:14.119
<v Speaker 1>means a world to us.

909
00:47:14.119 --> 00:47:17.119
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, it totally helps. It means so much, but

910
00:47:17.280 --> 00:47:20.719
<v Speaker 2>us honestly, well done, Ben, thank you, Case, thank you,

911
00:47:20.960 --> 00:47:23.199
<v Speaker 2>and until next time, stay wicked.