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Speaker 1: In the last millennium and in particularly in particular the

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last century. If a better explanation ends up being that

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its actions are explained by geopolitical power and influence, then

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that means that it doesn't make sense to think that

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infallibility and an indefectibility were conferred upon a crime syndicate.

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So if I can prove that the Vatican has for

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a long time been co opted in becoming crime syndicate,

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you must, now, as a Roman Catholic, defind the position

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that Jesus wills us to be giving our children's future,

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giving tithes, etc. Two a goblin sect, a bunch of

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organized crime figures. Now I'm speaking chiefly of Rome, I'm

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not talking about most local Roman Catholic churches. In terms

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of the people in general, they tend to be good hearted,

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well meaning people. The problem, of course, is the subversion

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that has occurred at the top of the Roman Catholic

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system into their office of the papacy. That is not

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a new subversion. It is a subversion that is very

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easily documentable. It's very easily provable from a lot of

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geopolitical texts, and for those that don't know about the

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history with Trent Horn, this is a mirror situation of

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the history with Michael Lofton and Eric you Bara. And

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you might think, why is Jay so mean? Why is

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he just out of nowhere? He just just suddenly becomes

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mean to these poor innocent victim Roman Catholics. You say,

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this is many years of interacting and dealing with these people,

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and you'll notice that in many of these cases, the

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original relationships started out friendly. Everybody had podcasts together, everybody

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had common discourse. People made joke videos. Laura Horne made

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a video making fun of the realm of Catholic apologetics

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and Protestant and orth Docs apologetics, and those videos were entertaining.

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They were It was a lighthearted era. Everybody was sort

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of quote getting along. However, what developed was more and

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more bad behavior that many of those Roman Catholics wouldn't

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exemplify publicly, but would exemplify behind the scenes. And if

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you doubt that, note that, for example, in the case

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of Michael Lofton, almost everyone that he originally interacted with

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and worked with eventually had that bridge burned and came

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to the same conclusion that he's impossible to work with.

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He's exceedingly fragile, he can't take any jokes or ribbing,

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and the lightest, softest things set him off. Now on

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top of that, in the case of Lofton as an example,

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if you recall I was going to be on Gospel

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Simplicity maybe five or six years ago. Lofton and Ibarra

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tried all they could to get me canceled from going

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on that show and other shows. Michael Lofton emailed and called,

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for example, father Deacon Doctor Antonius's diocese trying to get

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him defract, trying to complain because he said the R word. Yes,

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you heard me right, because a deacon used the word

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retard one time in a discord message. This was clipped

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as an attempt to cancel FDA. To me, these tactics

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and techniques are so ridiculous, so leftists, and so just

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bad faith that the public humility and piety signaling is

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the most nauseating of all of it. To have the

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public face of being a perpetual victim as this, like

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the meme says, as you're stabbing people in the back

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and acting so fake, eventually wears on all the people

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that you're around, and when you run everyone else off,

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it's a good sign that maybe it's not everybody else

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that's the problem. In the case of the Roman Catholic domain. Nowadays,

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a lot of those figures have sort of drifted away,

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They sort of waned in interest, their channels are not

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that popular, and now this has all sort of fallen

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to Trent Horn. Trent now has the mantle. You could say,

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I guess of what's left of Roman Catholic apologetics. There's

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not a whole lot there. We have lunatics like Sam

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shamun obvious mental problems, absolutely unstable, and much like all

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the other characters, literally has run off every single person

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who's been kind and tried to work with him. There's

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not a single person. Even his last leather Daddy friend,

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William Albrecht, has been run off due to whatever their

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recent faking gay scandals were. Now. The reason I'm bringing

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up character and behavior is because we don't usually talk

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about that. This isn't a drama channel. That's not what

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we focus on. But I've noticed the pattern that when

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the theological and position arguments start to fail, the inevitable

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shift turns to the bad behavior and piety signaling. Could

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there be times when people deserve to be called out

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for bad behavior. Sure, for example, Voice of Reason, one

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of their rising star apologists. Everybody sort of had inclinations

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and called out Voice of Reason as very sus something

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was going on. And lo and behold this chief piety

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signal or person himself, this vast castle of piety defenses.

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I mean, he was one of the most nauseating piety signalers. Well,

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turns out he's engaged in absolutely horrendous private activities and

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that all comes out. And does he cease being a

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quote minister. No, Now he does everything on Patreon on

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the back end of things, And lo and behold, we

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are still the bad people. The Orthodox are still the nasty,

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disgusting people according to him and his grifter buddy roots

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of Orthodoxy. Now, in the case of Trent Horn, again

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the mantle seems to have fallen to him to be

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the present voice of Catholic apologetics. But Trent Horn himself

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is no stranger to this same shifty suss attitude. And

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everybody falls for the public pretense of niceness and piety

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and all of this. And once again, it always begins

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in a very friendly, charitable way. But as things don't

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go their way, they then turn to more and more

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nefarious backdoor activities, and I'll give you some examples. So

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in the case of Trent Horn, when I've asked for

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this debate, Trent has always explicitly said, I will not

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debate this topic. I will, I can't debate you, it's

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not my topic. Now, every other Roman Catholic apologist that

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I've gone down the line, including Roman Catholic academics and

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historians that I've messaged and reached out to, none of

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them will debate this topic. So it's interesting to me

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that they will not debate this topic. And now that

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we've gotten to an actual public, biggest news story of

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our lifetime, release of the Epstein files that does explicitly,

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in multiple instances, link Epstein to a direct relationship with

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John Paul, to a direct relationship with Poe Francis, to

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scheduling meetings, et cetera, even to sharing weird architectural fetishes

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that they apparently had. All of that must been including,

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by the way, Jeffrey Epstein's intimate knowledge of the inner

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workings of the Vatican Bank, again suggesting this close relationship. Again,

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I'm not claiming that there's explicit evidence that John Paul

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the second did something in that abuse case, the scenario.

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Although he has been called out for many, many years

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by many, many, many Roman Catholics for covering up the

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abuse crises, what you'll notice is that the Roman Catholic

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world isn't concerned with is that true, They're concerned with

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covering it up. There's a pattern here, and Cleeve very

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perceptively notice this that, for example, when he in his

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weekly shows has called out the insane LGBT, trans skittles,

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all that stuff in the Roman Catholic domain going on everywhere.

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You have priests doing gay marriages, you have actual ones,

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you have blessing the couples, you have everything that you

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could think of, including blasphemous artwork, you know, Sacred Heart,

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that's a pig heart. I mean, just all this insane,

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blasphemous stuff. And when Klee brings it up, do you

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have Roman Catholic wanting to cleanse that church and expose that. No,

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they immediately go into cover up mode. So we're gonna

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be looking to see is Trenhorne concerned with the truth

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of the Vatican Bank and it scandals, the truth of

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the role of the papacy in geopolitics and is there

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perhaps smoke where there's fire? Is there fire where there's smoke?

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I should say, rather, it seems that he immediately has

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gone into lawyering mode. Paopal lawyers. You know we talked

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about this years ago with Eric you Borrow. It seemed

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as if a Borrow was more and more and more

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becoming a legate or a legal defense character for the

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papacy versus a seeker of what's true. Now, notice I'm

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not arguing that the Orthodox Church doesn't have geopolitical corruption.

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Of course it does. Whoever thought that there wasn't a

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persecutory relation relationship, for example, between the Soviet state and

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the Orthodox Church in Russia. Everybody knows this. Roman Catholics

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themselves should be aware of the fact that their own

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theologians like Eaves Kongar admit that the Gregorian Reforms was

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a century a period when there was a tremendous amount

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of German Germanic state influence on the papacy and who

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would be the pope So much for cesero papism, because

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that's papelo crism, same position. But when we come to

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trent Horn, because there is a nicer face on the

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front of this, there's this tendency. I think to assume

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that anyone who critiques or comes after Trenhorn must be evil,

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it must be nefarious. And I'm going to show you

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a consistent pattern of absolute inability to admit even the

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slightest era. Now why is that a big deal. Well,

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if you look up the traits of narcissism. And I'm

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not trying to do one of those low tier YouTube

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psychoanalysis things. I'm just giving my own personal opinion. I've

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met a lot of people over the years who literally

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cannot admit that they even made the slightest error at

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all on anything that tends to be a characteristic of

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a narcissistic type of person. In the case of a

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family member, for example, I have a family member who

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I think has this, and they've almost never admitted in

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their life that they've ever done anything wrong, even the

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slightest thing, which is just a bizarre It's almost like

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it's like it's removing your humanity because we all know

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that surely, at some point in your life you did

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something dumb, got something wrong, and surely you need it

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at some point in your life to apologize. But to

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people that have a very fragile narcissistic type of attitude.

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They are absolutely incapable of ever admitting that they made

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a mistake. And I don't just mean making a video

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pretending to say, huh, I got this wrong and I

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want to admit, because you can do a lot of

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those types of things for public consumption. I'm talking about actual,

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deep heartfelt Man, I really screwed up. Man, I've got

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a problem here. I made a mistake. And I think

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anybody in the Orthodox Church knows that as you begin

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to try to fight the passions, as we talked about

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with a Father Turbo today on that podcast, you are

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very quickly going to see not just how many mistakes

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you've made, but how difficult it really is to defeat

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the passions. It really takes the grace of God to

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defeat the passions, and it's a lifelong struggle. But when

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you have people who consistently double, triple and quadruple down

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on things that eventually even become common public knowledge, it's

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very odd. It's very bizarre, and I think that speaks

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to the root of what the problem is here that

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most people are missing. People jump into the debates, jump

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into the comments. I saw dozens of comments that were

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They look to be bots, because it's like Roman Catholic

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profiles with no followers, hardly any tweets, and they suddenly

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pop up to comment on all the Trent stuff out

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of nowhere. Where is this who are who? By the way,

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has a profile that only comments on like a Trent

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horn thing and nothing else. It's just really weird and

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no followers. It's bizarre. I don't I get proved that

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it's boded, but I would not be surprised because Catholic answers,

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of course part of this organizational structure of the Romancaolic

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Church that at all costs must triple down, quadruple down

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to defend the hierarchy at all costs, no matter what.

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And this is really the problem of this system. When

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you have systemic level corruption from the top down in

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that type of autocratic system, it becomes very difficult for

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the members within that system to go after the head

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of it, especially if the fish is rotting from the

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head down, because it then almost everybody intuitally knows that

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if we give up this papal thing, then the whole

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thing falls. It's a house of cards, especially if you

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read Vatican One and in the last several years. Most

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Roman Catholics that have converted to Orthodoxy that I've talked

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to or interacted with, almost all of them have said

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to me, Jay, when I actually went and read Vatican

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One is when I understood the arguments and the position.

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Then I understood why it's a system level defeater. That's

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why we're not arguing that the Russian Orthodox Church has

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no corruption, the Russian Orthodox Church, the Romanian Orthodox Church,

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the Serving Orthodox Church. We are not arguing that nobody

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would be so silly as to argue that our church

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has no corruption, yours has moral corruption. Again, the argument

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is that to show so that the papacy has defected

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or contradicted at a dogmatic level on faith or morals,

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that is a system level defeater. And you can't apply

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that argument copy and paste to the Orthodox system because

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it doesn't have that position. It does not argue that

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the ep or any of the individual bishoprics are infallible

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or that they can't defect. In fact, many of them have.

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The ep has in many cases in church history defected

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and become heterodox. So from our system, we don't have

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a problem saying Rome is heterodox. And then also other

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sees can be heterodox, including the ep Roman Catholics think

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that the Orthodox are a sort of want to be

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papacy system, and so their ecumenical patriarch is a sort

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of little pope or there's five little popes. Now. They

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don't even understand that their own system in the past

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has already recognized the pentarchy as a normative structure of

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the church. I'm going to talk about why I blocked

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Trent Horne in a moment has nothing to do with

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the recent well it does have to do with recent discussions.

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But people are saying, oh, are you going to have

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a debate when you blocked him? Trent has already declined debate.

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Do you not understand this? I block people all the

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time because I lose respect for people when they go

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to the piety signaling and they won't debate. And at

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that point I don't want to interact with you anymore.

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You have lost respect in my eyes. I don't I

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think that you are a coward, because if you really

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believe this system, if you really knew your doctrine and

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your dogmas, it would be easy for you to come

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on here and make the case. You could request Jay,

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I want time to talk about my position. Give me

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two five minutes to state my position. I would give

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you that. We've done that for many people have called

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in over the last eight almost ten years of call in.

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That's easy to do. Oh, you just could have mute people.

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You got a mute people. I don't even hit the

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mute button. I might boot people, but I don't mute people.

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There's no need to mute people because in almost all

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of these cases, except for the rare chance occurrence when

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we get a knowledgeable Roman Cathy, which is pretty rare,

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most of you guys end up hanging your own selves

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when I ask you a series of questions. I don't

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have to mute you when after about five minutes of

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questioning I can easily pull out of you the contradictions.

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Because I know this system so well, I lived it

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intimately for almost a decade. None of the people who

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come on, by the way, have ever even investigated the

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information that I've sent to them. Now. I still like

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many of the Roman Catholics that I'm friends with, like

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Tim Joe Inders is a good guy, Anthony from avoiding Babylon.

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Those are good guys. But all of these people I

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have sent reading lists books suggestions to for all of

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these years, and none of them have even scratched the

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surface of the material. What does that tell me? That

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tells me that they're not actually that interested in the

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position that we're putting forward. Now. The way I approach debates,

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and the reason that I don't lose debates, is that

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I always want to know the material as good as

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my opponent or better. That was a dictum that doctor

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Boonnson always recommended. If you want to win a debate,

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if you want to know how to always win, know

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the opponent's position to his satisfaction, and you'll never lose. Obviously,

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have to know your position too, but it's a great

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principle for debate. And we all know that when I

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debated Trent Horn, whom I've already debated. For those of

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you that you are saying you're scared to debate Trent,

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I've already debated Trent, and all of the polls, even

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Roman Catholics for the majority, admitted that Trent did terrible

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in that debate. In fact, a Roman Catholic today was saying, hey, look,

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I'm not happy with this recent kerfluffle, but you did

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beat you did beat him in a debate. Okay, well

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that's fine, but let's talk about the topics and the issues,

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because ever since that debate, Trent has had a bit

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of a dilemma with me. He's had an issue with me.

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And since that debate, I've said for months years, where

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it's been years, four or five years since God the

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debate a Trent, let's do a debate on the geopolitics

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of the papacy because I actually believe that's a kill shot.

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Here's why he won't do it. He will not do it.

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So why would by the way, why would the Catholic apologist,

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who's the top apologist, now, why would he not debate

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the argument that is I think the kill shot argument?

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Why would he not? Well, to be fair to Trent,

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he does admit that it's not an area that he's

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very knowledgeable in. Well, if this is becoming a consistent

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argument that people opposed to you or making, maybe it's

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time to become familiar with it. Now. Years ago I

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sent Trent four books I said he should read. I said,

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you should read the Gladio text, you should read by

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Paul Williams, you should read the John Courtney Mury text.

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You should read I forget what else it was a

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couple other geopolitical texts related to the same material, no

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interest at all. So again, if people are not interested

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in engaging the line of argument that we're making, and

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if Trent Horne always falls back on just wanting to

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debate the papacy, which by the way, itself is ambiguous. Right,

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Remember in the debate with Tim Gordon, do you Orthodox

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deny the papacy or did Jesus set up the papacy?

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Well that's a equivocation because what the papacy means in

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the post Vatican One system is not the same thing

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as papacy in the Orthodox system. Of course, Orthodox and

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Catholics both believe that Jesus said up a quote papacy

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aka Bishop of Rome. But what the extent of his powers,

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the natures of that power are, is where we disagree.

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So a lot of this debate, a lot of these

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things trade on ambiguities. And to go back to the

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Trent Horn debate, if you recall, Trent wasn't familiar with

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basic epistemic issues and debates. So when I brought up

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the criteria question self evidence and circularity, Trent was lost.

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In fact, he appealed to Descartes cogito as if that

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was actually a good argument. It's a terrible argument. And

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I called all of that out. And you'll notice where

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did that natural theology debate lead? Exactly where I wanted

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it to go, which was in the direction of showing

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that the Roman Catholic position logically leads you to say

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that the Old Testament doesn't teach the triad, it teaches

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a Unitarian deity. And where did Trent go Exactly there,

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he admitted the very point that I wanted to come

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out of that debate, and that caused a lot of

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reaction against Trent's position. Trent admitting that the Old Testament

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doesn't teach a triad was a huge defeat because that

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shows that the natural theology position logically leads to some

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kind of perennialism and or syncretism. Well, lo, and behold,

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what does Vatican two teach. Nostra tate teaches that very thing,

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And Pope Francis and Pope Lee have reiterated that nostra

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tat absolutely means it in that way that we all

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worship the same God, not just the quote monotheists, but

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also Hindus exactly as I argued on Timcast to Tim

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Gordon and to Temple. So Francis reaffirms my reading of

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these texts. Leo reaffirms my reading of these texts. But

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the Roman Catholic apologists all know better than their popes,

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which is amazing. The actions of the papacy demonstrate and

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signify how they understand this by praying in Moss towards Mecca,

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by participating in Hindu religious festivals, by participating in the

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Ascesi festivals back in the nineteen eighties, where all the

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religions come together at a see to pray to whatever

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generic God they're praying to. Lo and behold us. The

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basis for the document of the Declaration on Human Fraternity

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and Religious Freedom, according to the joint statement between Francis

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and the Grand Imam, that became the basis for the

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Abu Dhabi Faith Center. Now, who's going to tell me

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that if the Abu Dhabi Faith Center, which is the

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generic theism of natural theology of the quote monotheistic religions,

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if that's what they build on the basis of Francis's

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document in Philosophy from Vatican two, how are you going

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to tell me that that's not what Vatican two means.

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It becomes utterly absurd to anybody with any discernment. But

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the problem with Roman Catholic apologetics, and I know because

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I was one, I was in this world for many,

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many years, is that you are stuck coming up with

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making squares fit into round holes. It does that you

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force it in, you put in to make it work,

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and you come up with whatever you think might make

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it work. Remember when I first brought up to Trent

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a long time ago, the death penalty. I said, Trent,

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how could the death penalty at the time of Trent

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and the Council of Trent talk about it being something

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part of natural justice? And then by the time of

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the New Catechism John Paul and Pote Francis, it is

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now quote contrary to the Gospel. How can we have

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at the time of Pious the Fifth and Trent the

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statement that homosexuality is liable to the death penalty to

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be handed over to the state. And now all the

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way up to today we have the blessing of the

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allowance of gay priests in the Italian diocese. Now I

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understand they're expected to quote be chased, But as Father

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James Martin said, who is now supported by Poblio openly.

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The difference here is that we're not going to say

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that identifying as a homosexual that bars you from the priesthood.

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It used to and now it will not. So that

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is a specific change in the Italian diocese, and Leo

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agreed with that change. These are obvious, clear changes in

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Catholic morals. Do you remember what Trent said in his

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video as to how to make that work? He actually said,

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there's a lot of different things that you could do

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to make this work. Wait a minute, I thought Catholic

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00:25:27,359 --> 00:25:31,200
theology worked. Why do we need to construct things to

401
00:25:31,319 --> 00:25:34,640
make it work? Why are there different interpretations? As he said,

402
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I think he said something like there's three different ways

403
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you can interpret this. So wait a minute. The purpose

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of the magisterium is to make clear Catholic doctrine so

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that we have clear answers. This is the pop Catholic

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00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:49,400
apologists selling point that they always give you, guys. And

407
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yet when it comes to a very basic moral issue,

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should there be the death penalty? Should we have that?

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Trent says there's three ways to interpret the pope's statement

410
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on the death penalty. Wait a minute, So now we

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00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:06,680
need your three interpretations of a magisterial supposed teaching on morals.

412
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The epistemic issue is so crucial and so devastating that

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once you get the semic issue, it's pretty much over

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because you realize that the magisterial teachings are really whatever

415
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any individual Roman Catholic wants to be the magisterial teachings.

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Let's give an example, because when Trent was asked by

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the way, people said, you're not being fair because this

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is a clipped comment. This is all he offered in

419
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the video. Go watch the full video. When asked a

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specific epistemic question, which he still does not get, Trent,

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what tells us the criteria for when something is infallible

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in binding in your system? Give me the criteria. I

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don't want the things that you think are binding. What's

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the criteria for when we know that it is infallible

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and binding? Magisterium? And let's hear Trend's answer once again.

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Speaker 2: Trend is understood is defined infallibly unless this is manifests

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Lee evident.

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Speaker 1: That's literally what he said. That's all he said. By

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the way, you clipped it. You clipped it. Yeah, it's clipped,

430
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because that's all he said. He said a lot of

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00:27:22,319 --> 00:27:24,680
more words, but there was no other argumentation as to

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what that even means, because he goes to canon law. Now,

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as far as I'm aware, most Roman Catholics do not

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believe canon law is infallible. For one, it's time bound

435
00:27:35,960 --> 00:27:41,880
to a degree, it's changeable, it's updated, and so you

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00:27:41,880 --> 00:27:46,319
could say it's binding, morally binding, but not necessarily eternally

437
00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:50,960
time bound, eternally binding and infallible. So there's some flexibility

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00:27:50,960 --> 00:27:53,359
there with the rulings. You could say that the papacy

439
00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:59,640
gives through canon law. Uh, but it may be still flexible.

440
00:28:00,640 --> 00:28:04,720
But so you went to a thing that's now fallible

441
00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:07,319
as far as I can tell, in your system. And again,

442
00:28:07,440 --> 00:28:10,279
Roman Catholics even debate what that even means, to say

443
00:28:10,279 --> 00:28:14,279
that it's you know, who knows what the actual status is.

444
00:28:14,279 --> 00:28:17,799
This is always debated. Let's say, for the second argument

445
00:28:17,839 --> 00:28:22,279
that it's fallible, you're going to a thing that's fallible

446
00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:29,720
to tell me a generic principle, manifestly evident for identifying

447
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amongst stacks of thousands of documents the things that are infallible.

448
00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:37,079
Who does not see how absurd this is? I mean,

449
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am I in a looney bin and everybody else is looney?

450
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Am I actually the Brad Pitt character in Twelve Monkeys

451
00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:46,039
and I'm like eating bugs and like like, am I

452
00:28:46,160 --> 00:28:50,640
just hallucinating reality that nobody else can see that this

453
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is absolutely ridiculous, just so fundamentally ridiculous at a basic level.

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You don't need a PhD, a THHD in epistelizeology and

455
00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:05,799
philosophy and theology to get this basic question. And you

456
00:29:05,799 --> 00:29:09,160
guys will recall everyonem catholic so called apologist that I

457
00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:12,039
brought this up to absolutely has a meltdown when I

458
00:29:12,039 --> 00:29:14,559
bring it up. When I brought it up to, Uh,

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00:29:14,599 --> 00:29:19,599
what's that guy's name, feels guy, what's it? Pinesapp? Pinesapp

460
00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:22,599
has a meltdown. And so you're a little men. You're

461
00:29:22,640 --> 00:29:25,480
a pathetic little man. Bro. All I asked you was

462
00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:29,680
what's the criteria? Pathetic little man? You're a pathetic little

463
00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:36,680
min This is all they have is a spewing fourth

464
00:29:36,759 --> 00:29:41,720
of insults. Now, when we say, well, diar, you're the worst,

465
00:29:42,440 --> 00:29:44,880
this isn't actually even the case when we talk about

466
00:29:45,519 --> 00:29:49,960
something of jokes and insults, right, and remember when they're

467
00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:55,279
on the ropes, when they're flailing. They immediately shift away

468
00:29:55,279 --> 00:29:59,480
from the doctrine of theology arguments and the philosophy arguments too.

469
00:30:00,279 --> 00:30:03,720
The bad behavior of all the Ortho bros. This is

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what they do. They've been doing this move all the

471
00:30:06,759 --> 00:30:11,240
way back to twenty sixteen, seventeen eighteen. Do you remember

472
00:30:11,319 --> 00:30:14,960
I used to say, Loten, it's not gonna work to

473
00:30:15,039 --> 00:30:17,319
keep building the people in your church, to just say

474
00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:20,960
and whine about Ortho bros, to whine about the fat

475
00:30:21,039 --> 00:30:24,880
joke I made about Ibara eight years ago, Like, how

476
00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:27,240
do you think that's going to keep people in your church?

477
00:30:27,279 --> 00:30:30,200
The only people that keeps in your church are the

478
00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:33,920
most low information, low brow people who don't care about

479
00:30:33,960 --> 00:30:36,720
what's true. And maybe that's what they're after. Maybe they

480
00:30:36,880 --> 00:30:40,240
just care about the numbers. That's all that matters, is

481
00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:42,400
the big numbers, because many of them actually think that

482
00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:45,400
proves their church. They actually think that numbers prove the

483
00:30:45,440 --> 00:30:51,759
truth literally, and they think that winning battles proves the truth.

484
00:30:51,839 --> 00:30:53,880
This is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. They don't

485
00:30:53,920 --> 00:30:57,720
even realize their own greatest saint of the Patrician era,

486
00:30:57,799 --> 00:31:01,359
Saint Augustine, wrote an entire apologetic City of God arguing

487
00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:04,079
that you can't prove or disprove the true faith on

488
00:31:04,119 --> 00:31:08,279
the basis of political success and battles, you idiot, because

489
00:31:08,359 --> 00:31:12,279
Rome said that Christianity caused the Roman impart of fall.

490
00:31:12,640 --> 00:31:14,799
So Augustin wrote to they of God saying, this is

491
00:31:14,799 --> 00:31:17,559
a stupid argument. The whole book is about that. It's

492
00:31:17,599 --> 00:31:22,319
an apologetic against that argument. Most of the online Roman

493
00:31:22,359 --> 00:31:27,359
Catholic idiots literally repeat the Pagan argument, Ah, bro, you lost,

494
00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:32,079
you lost to you fell dog lah, we owned.

495
00:31:31,839 --> 00:31:32,640
Speaker 3: You, dude.

496
00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:35,000
Speaker 1: It fell when it was Uni at you idiot. So

497
00:31:35,039 --> 00:31:38,200
that's an argument against you. Your own argument that when

498
00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:40,680
you lose a battle disproves your church means that Roman

499
00:31:40,720 --> 00:31:43,880
Cathlsen's false because Byzantium fell when it was Roman Catholic,

500
00:31:43,920 --> 00:31:58,400
you idiots. Now on that geopolitical point, the reason this

501
00:31:58,480 --> 00:32:01,119
matters is that all these things in our world you

502
00:32:01,160 --> 00:32:04,039
are connected. It's true that you don't have to have

503
00:32:04,119 --> 00:32:07,559
all of your geopolitics straight to be saved or to

504
00:32:07,559 --> 00:32:10,119
be whatever. That's not the point. The point is that

505
00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:13,079
when you are a public figure, and when you push

506
00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:18,319
various ideologies and ideas, and even if you don't explicitly

507
00:32:18,400 --> 00:32:23,519
know morals such as Stabby's and masking up. You are

508
00:32:23,599 --> 00:32:27,400
taking a stance on a very controversial issue, and I

509
00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:29,920
suspect I can't prove it, but I've asked her. I said,

510
00:32:31,039 --> 00:32:34,079
why did you delete all of your past social media stuff?

511
00:32:34,119 --> 00:32:36,559
All of his tweets up until recently, we're all deleted.

512
00:32:36,559 --> 00:32:39,400
And he put up this thing saying, oh, I'm pious,

513
00:32:39,480 --> 00:32:42,759
and so I'm leaving social media, which he didn't actually

514
00:32:42,839 --> 00:32:44,759
leave because he's out here tweeting all the time, so

515
00:32:45,039 --> 00:32:51,960
that was all performative. But I suspect that being pro life,

516
00:32:52,039 --> 00:32:54,319
he says, means that you want it to be illegal

517
00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:58,519
to directly kill innocent human beings. So he's arguing I

518
00:32:58,599 --> 00:33:06,599
firmly support Stabby and masking up. Thus, Trent was trying

519
00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:10,160
to morally one up people who would doubt what was

520
00:33:10,160 --> 00:33:16,359
not actually a stabby. It was a experimental genetic stabby.

521
00:33:17,319 --> 00:33:19,880
He apparently didn't know that, and probably still doesn't know this,

522
00:33:19,960 --> 00:33:23,599
because even today when this has been brought up, he

523
00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:26,000
can't admit that he's at all. He cannot admit any

524
00:33:26,079 --> 00:33:28,920
error even on this. Now, why do I bring this

525
00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:32,160
up Because there's a lack of discernment at a global

526
00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:37,559
level about spiritual realities that affect the temporal's fear. If

527
00:33:37,559 --> 00:33:41,559
he were to admit that he was wrong about coof

528
00:33:41,960 --> 00:33:45,799
stabby's and lockdowns and masks and social distancing, this would

529
00:33:45,799 --> 00:33:49,119
also implicate his papacy once again in failing to see

530
00:33:49,359 --> 00:33:52,319
a very basic moral principle. And of course, the papacy

531
00:33:52,359 --> 00:33:58,839
openly promoted the stabby's and the lockdowns and Unesco and Davos. Now,

532
00:33:58,839 --> 00:34:01,359
when all that was brought up, what was Trent and

533
00:34:01,440 --> 00:34:06,200
Jimmy Aikins's reaction? The conspirators, with their tin full hats,

534
00:34:06,200 --> 00:34:09,840
believe that there's a global elite. In fact, the first

535
00:34:11,079 --> 00:34:14,679
childish joke that Trent Horn made about me. Now, remember

536
00:34:14,719 --> 00:34:18,199
Trent Horn is so pious, he's above making childish jokes.

537
00:34:20,039 --> 00:34:21,599
The first thing he ever said about me was that

538
00:34:21,679 --> 00:34:25,000
I'm a Jack Chick comic come to life. I'm a

539
00:34:25,039 --> 00:34:30,880
low tier fundamentalist, idiot, conspiracy theorist. That was his portrayal

540
00:34:30,880 --> 00:34:35,000
of me, Jack Chick come to life, low tier fundamentalist, level,

541
00:34:35,519 --> 00:34:38,599
tinful hatter. This was what he was arguing about me

542
00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:43,239
before our natural theology debate. After doing the debate, I

543
00:34:43,280 --> 00:34:47,360
think he regretted that arrogance that he had Now did

544
00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:52,119
he ever, even a little bit perhaps move the needle

545
00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:56,920
and admit I was wrong? Of course not, because Trent

546
00:34:57,039 --> 00:35:01,679
fundamentally can never admit that he's made a mistake. And

547
00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:05,000
isn't that funny? Because that's the system of the papacy.

548
00:35:05,039 --> 00:35:09,559
The papacy is a massive, super fragile system, and like

549
00:35:09,639 --> 00:35:14,159
his pope, to ever admit any defection in teaching a theology,

550
00:35:14,159 --> 00:35:18,039
to admit error, truly sincerely from the heart, would be

551
00:35:18,119 --> 00:35:22,320
for them the undermining of their so called papal perfect system.

552
00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:30,480
They are like the thing that they spiritually commune with.

553
00:35:32,199 --> 00:35:34,840
And so the reason that, for example, we make a

554
00:35:34,880 --> 00:35:39,320
big deal about who we commune with and they don't,

555
00:35:40,239 --> 00:35:43,360
it's precisely because there's a spiritual dimension to this, where

556
00:35:43,400 --> 00:35:47,960
you are linking yourself to these people and participating in

557
00:35:48,000 --> 00:35:53,199
their spirit. And so if you are communing with Francis

558
00:35:53,199 --> 00:35:57,519
and Leo, even if you're critical, you're still communing with

559
00:35:57,679 --> 00:36:02,760
that spirit. You are taking on this delusion and thus

560
00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:08,079
forcing yourself by kind of spiritual contract, to defend at

561
00:36:08,119 --> 00:36:15,599
all costs and cover up at all costs significant degeneracy

562
00:36:16,199 --> 00:36:19,599
and wickedness in that system. And I am not just

563
00:36:19,679 --> 00:36:22,360
saying that it's a question of, oh, do you say

564
00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:24,480
the crew up bishops? Crew up bishops. That's not what

565
00:36:24,480 --> 00:36:29,599
I'm saying. I'm saying way beyond that international crime syndicate level,

566
00:36:29,679 --> 00:36:33,400
evil Epstein level stuff. That's what I'm talking about. That's

567
00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:37,400
way beyond was the bishop stealing money? Was the bishop

568
00:36:37,480 --> 00:36:40,960
secretly gay? Did he touch butts? It's more than that.

569
00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:46,400
It's inverted satanic elements that even some of their own

570
00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:48,800
trag cats have called out over the last fifty years,

571
00:36:50,239 --> 00:36:52,679
ritual abuse. The first book that I read on this,

572
00:36:52,760 --> 00:36:56,199
which Trent thinks is so funny, was from a Roman

573
00:36:56,239 --> 00:37:01,480
Catholic journalist in two thousand and four when all of

574
00:37:01,519 --> 00:37:04,840
this started breaking in the news, especially on the Internet,

575
00:37:05,119 --> 00:37:08,840
and he wrote this book, Lucifer's Lodge sra in the

576
00:37:08,840 --> 00:37:13,119
Catholic Church, William Kennedy. All this book is is a

577
00:37:13,159 --> 00:37:19,440
collation of news articles and journals and papers. That's it. Now,

578
00:37:19,480 --> 00:37:21,480
there's some areas where he speculates on how did this

579
00:37:21,519 --> 00:37:23,760
come into the church in America, et cetera. But the

580
00:37:23,800 --> 00:37:27,760
overall thrust of that book is a Catholic journalist writing

581
00:37:27,880 --> 00:37:31,480
about problems within Rome. And that came out when I

582
00:37:31,519 --> 00:37:33,960
was a tried cat. So when I was a track

583
00:37:34,039 --> 00:37:36,760
keet reading that, that shook me. Not because I thought, well,

584
00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:39,880
I'm gonna immediately leave Catholicism, but I thought, well, at

585
00:37:39,960 --> 00:37:42,079
least this guy's calling this out. We got to deal

586
00:37:42,079 --> 00:37:45,840
with these problems. And in the two thousands, when I

587
00:37:45,920 --> 00:37:48,199
was a Roman Catholic, a tridecthic became a Roman Catholic.

588
00:37:48,199 --> 00:37:53,239
Two thousand and three, I noticed the tendency was constantly

589
00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:58,840
amongst priests, bishops, cardinals, and even the pope to constantly

590
00:37:58,880 --> 00:38:02,159
cover these things up, to move people like Cardinal Bernard

591
00:38:02,239 --> 00:38:05,480
Law that were massively involved in this around, to cover

592
00:38:05,519 --> 00:38:10,199
it up, to protect move the priests around. Does that

593
00:38:10,679 --> 00:38:13,639
exemplify the attitude of for example, Saint Paul when he

594
00:38:13,679 --> 00:38:16,000
writes to the church at Corinth, does he say cover

595
00:38:16,119 --> 00:38:19,639
it up? Or does he say get him out? What's

596
00:38:19,679 --> 00:38:22,159
the proper attitude? Everybody should know what the proper ateurgude is.

597
00:38:23,960 --> 00:38:26,599
So the question then arises, why would they do that?

598
00:38:26,679 --> 00:38:31,360
Why wouldn't they purge the institution? Well, our good buddy,

599
00:38:31,599 --> 00:38:37,079
John Paul's a good buddy. Jeff Stein McAffrey has a

600
00:38:37,119 --> 00:38:42,199
indicator as to why that is, and that is in

601
00:38:42,239 --> 00:38:54,840
the Vatican Bank email. We're going to see why this

602
00:38:54,920 --> 00:38:56,559
matters and why they don't want to talk about it.

603
00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:10,400
This is Epstein's email to Larry Summers, the Clinton era

604
00:39:11,800 --> 00:39:18,840
viper banker. Hey, Jamie should not be in there. The

605
00:39:18,840 --> 00:39:20,800
most important change in the Vatican may not be put

606
00:39:20,840 --> 00:39:23,880
Benedict's sudden retirement, but the change in leadership at the

607
00:39:23,960 --> 00:39:27,480
Vatican Bank. Because the Vatican Bank status as a sovereign country,

608
00:39:27,559 --> 00:39:31,039
it is exempt from transparency rules not only of Italy

609
00:39:31,119 --> 00:39:34,079
but also of the EU. This status allows it to

610
00:39:34,079 --> 00:39:37,400
be an elite client. It's elite clients to evade scrutiny

611
00:39:37,400 --> 00:39:44,800
for money transfers. Epstein is explaining to a Clinton era

612
00:39:45,639 --> 00:39:50,559
high level banker, Larry Summers, and a viper who helped

613
00:39:50,599 --> 00:39:54,559
loot Russia the inner workings of the Vatican Bank. How

614
00:39:54,559 --> 00:39:56,840
does Jeff Stain mcaffery you know the inner workers of

615
00:39:56,840 --> 00:40:00,599
the Vatican Bank. Oh, because he was friends with John

616
00:40:00,599 --> 00:40:08,159
Paul the second. As we said, the status allows its

617
00:40:08,159 --> 00:40:13,159
clients to evade scrutiny. It's a money laundering operation. The

618
00:40:13,199 --> 00:40:17,480
Vatican Bank's president at Tour Tadeshi, was fired after Italian

619
00:40:17,519 --> 00:40:22,320
authorities investigated his bribery schemes in which he allegedly was involved.

620
00:40:22,800 --> 00:40:27,400
He had forty seven dossiers, et cetera. And then this

621
00:40:28,079 --> 00:40:30,719
was the background to the real reason Benedict the sixteen

622
00:40:30,760 --> 00:40:32,880
step up, according to Epstein. Now you could disagree with

623
00:40:33,519 --> 00:40:35,719
the theory of Epstein here, it doesn't matter. But what

624
00:40:35,760 --> 00:40:38,400
it shows is a knowledge of the interworkers of the

625
00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:43,360
Vatican Bank, just like we talked about in the Gladio lectures,

626
00:40:43,360 --> 00:40:46,280
in the Gladio books. So this is Epstein basically saying,

627
00:40:47,039 --> 00:40:49,360
this is the Gladio. So this is how it works.

628
00:40:51,159 --> 00:40:53,880
It's an organized crime, black market bank. And that's the

629
00:40:53,920 --> 00:40:58,960
whole story of Banco de Ambrosio Roberto Calvi and the

630
00:40:59,039 --> 00:41:02,719
collapse and stealing of the Italian people's pensions. This was

631
00:41:02,840 --> 00:41:06,000
huge news back in the seventies. It came out in

632
00:41:06,039 --> 00:41:08,039
the early nineties. They didn't know it was Gladio yet,

633
00:41:08,079 --> 00:41:12,039
but that's what this was. And they had compromised a

634
00:41:12,159 --> 00:41:21,679
large portion of the Italian cardinals and prime members of Parliament,

635
00:41:21,679 --> 00:41:23,920
et cetera, or whatever their government system is, that they

636
00:41:23,920 --> 00:41:28,119
were basically compromised. And this is the entire book by

637
00:41:28,320 --> 00:41:37,280
Catholic FBI consultant John Williams. Again not a conspiracy therist. Okay,

638
00:41:37,360 --> 00:41:41,960
So these things indicate and point to what I'm talking about,

639
00:41:41,960 --> 00:41:44,400
what I've been talking about, and they don't want to

640
00:41:44,440 --> 00:41:49,119
talk about that. Their immediate mode of operation is to downplay,

641
00:41:49,760 --> 00:41:53,719
to downplay, cover it up, downplay, and they've always done this.

642
00:41:54,599 --> 00:41:57,559
The book is Operation Gladio by Paul Williams. And if

643
00:41:57,559 --> 00:41:59,400
you don't want to get the book, the entire book

644
00:41:59,480 --> 00:42:04,199
is on YouTube on audio Paul Williams Opperson Gladia. Now

645
00:42:04,199 --> 00:42:06,679
that's just one text. We've actually lectured through many, many

646
00:42:06,719 --> 00:42:11,920
texts on Gladio. And you might want to know as

647
00:42:11,920 --> 00:42:17,679
well that these relationships this history isn't even controversial. You

648
00:42:17,719 --> 00:42:21,039
can find this in mainline history that, for example, the

649
00:42:21,119 --> 00:42:25,079
Masade established a very close relationship with John Paul the Second.

650
00:42:25,559 --> 00:42:28,440
That's why John Paul the Second had so many overtures

651
00:42:28,440 --> 00:42:35,239
and actions towards promoting Rabbinic Judaism, promoting no strataatee, all

652
00:42:35,239 --> 00:42:38,599
of those things that are so controversial. John Paul the

653
00:42:38,639 --> 00:42:41,440
Second was the champion of that. He did more for

654
00:42:41,480 --> 00:42:45,000
that than anyone else in the history of the Romancolic Church.

655
00:42:45,599 --> 00:42:47,880
So all the bays trad Cats that want to make

656
00:42:47,920 --> 00:42:51,400
this some sort of base trad anti Jewish, anti Zionist thing.

657
00:42:51,920 --> 00:42:57,079
That's not your papacy. Your papacy is a Zionist thing. Explicitly.

658
00:42:57,360 --> 00:42:59,920
I'm not talking about political Zionism, talk about the theolo

659
00:43:00,400 --> 00:43:03,960
of it. Yeah, I'm sure you could say, well, Francis

660
00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:08,519
and Leo, they've criticized the operations in Gaza. Yeah, that's

661
00:43:08,559 --> 00:43:11,000
not what I'm talking about. I'm not talking about were

662
00:43:11,000 --> 00:43:13,239
they ever critical. I'm not talking about do they oppose

663
00:43:14,039 --> 00:43:19,400
desert storm. I'm talking about the theological admissions to not proselytize.

664
00:43:20,000 --> 00:43:22,719
And you notice they lie when they say proselytism doesn't

665
00:43:22,800 --> 00:43:25,960
mean making converts, it means forcing them to become And

666
00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:30,000
that's not true, total bullcrap. The word has never meant

667
00:43:30,440 --> 00:43:33,159
forcing people to become converts. They just make up stuff.

668
00:43:33,199 --> 00:43:39,719
They just lie like crazy, just like them saying that

669
00:43:41,800 --> 00:43:44,840
you blocked Trent Horns so that he couldn't debate you. No, no, no,

670
00:43:45,559 --> 00:43:48,280
He's already said three times he won't debate. What are

671
00:43:48,280 --> 00:43:52,440
you talking about? Here's his email, his Twitter post saying

672
00:43:52,440 --> 00:43:57,519
I will not debate. Now. You can make all this

673
00:43:57,559 --> 00:44:01,559
fuss and smoke the mirrors all you want, guys, but again,

674
00:44:01,840 --> 00:44:05,880
why will none of your Roman Catholics debate the geopolitical

675
00:44:05,960 --> 00:44:08,199
killshot argument that I make? Why won't they do it?

676
00:44:11,079 --> 00:44:13,239
If it's such a weak argument, it should be very

677
00:44:13,280 --> 00:44:16,719
easy for any competent Catholic apologists or scholar or historian

678
00:44:16,760 --> 00:44:19,079
to come on and simply demunk this. Do you know

679
00:44:19,119 --> 00:44:21,280
what they all say in response to that, you're too mean?

680
00:44:22,000 --> 00:44:25,119
I'm too mean? Really? Now, what are the things that

681
00:44:25,199 --> 00:44:28,039
characterize the two mean thing? Well, let's look at that.

682
00:44:28,519 --> 00:44:33,119
Does Trent Horn engage in childish argumentation? Well, we saw

683
00:44:33,239 --> 00:44:36,400
yesterday that he was gloating about a ratio. Ah, I

684
00:44:36,480 --> 00:44:43,800
ratioed jay nyertio. Now there's nothing more immature and four

685
00:44:43,880 --> 00:44:49,440
chan level speak than talking about a ratio. And by

686
00:44:49,440 --> 00:44:52,519
the way, the other posts that I put up ratioed him.

687
00:44:51,960 --> 00:44:55,880
So so what now? The first thing that Trent Horn

688
00:44:55,960 --> 00:44:59,400
said about Andrew Wilson in his video was that Andrew

689
00:44:59,400 --> 00:45:02,159
Wilson ca open a pickle jar hot he's not a

690
00:45:02,199 --> 00:45:06,000
man like, implying Andrew isn't even himself manly because there

691
00:45:06,079 --> 00:45:08,719
was this pickle jar. Now. I know people don't know this,

692
00:45:08,840 --> 00:45:12,800
but when you go on the whatever podcast, that room

693
00:45:13,119 --> 00:45:16,280
is freaking one hundred degrees. It is hot as hell

694
00:45:16,320 --> 00:45:21,199
in there, super hot, and so yes, you are sweaty.

695
00:45:21,360 --> 00:45:24,280
You sweat the whole time you're in there. It's in California,

696
00:45:25,320 --> 00:45:28,360
and so the fact that Andrew couldn't twist the pickle

697
00:45:28,400 --> 00:45:29,840
jar because it was hot as hell and he was

698
00:45:29,840 --> 00:45:32,360
sweating in there is the most ridiculous thing to go

699
00:45:32,400 --> 00:45:35,360
to to prove that Andrew isn't manly or whatever. Total

700
00:45:35,360 --> 00:45:39,719
bull crap that's all they have. But isn't that immature.

701
00:45:40,119 --> 00:45:43,199
I'm confused because we're not supposed to engage in making

702
00:45:43,199 --> 00:45:46,559
fun of people, but it's okay for the Catholics to

703
00:45:46,599 --> 00:45:48,480
do it. They have a free license to do it.

704
00:45:48,519 --> 00:45:53,119
They do it all the time. Michael Lofton used to

705
00:45:53,199 --> 00:45:56,559
make fun of me. Michael Lofton would put up ridiculous

706
00:45:56,840 --> 00:46:02,039
thumbnails of me. Who cares. Guys don't really care about

707
00:46:02,079 --> 00:46:06,840
that level of stuff unless you're very fragile, very sensitive,

708
00:46:07,400 --> 00:46:10,360
and you can't deal with banter. The reason Tim Gordon

709
00:46:10,360 --> 00:46:12,239
and I are still friends and we can banter and

710
00:46:12,280 --> 00:46:16,159
joke around is that he's a normal guy. These weirdos

711
00:46:16,239 --> 00:46:19,920
are not normal dudes. There's something off with them that

712
00:46:20,079 --> 00:46:24,280
makes them sensitive and soy to where the slightest joke,

713
00:46:24,400 --> 00:46:29,960
the slightest reference turns them into women. They become effeminate,

714
00:46:30,079 --> 00:46:34,840
catty women. Now let's listen to Andrew to Trent's comments here,

715
00:46:35,800 --> 00:46:37,800
and remember this comes on the heels of the last

716
00:46:37,840 --> 00:46:41,599
video a few weeks ago blaming all the Ortho bros.

717
00:46:41,679 --> 00:46:45,760
Because debate is now no longer worth it. It's evil. Now,

718
00:46:46,239 --> 00:46:52,320
debate is bad because Jade Eyer Andrew Wilson, they've ruined debate. Well,

719
00:46:52,360 --> 00:46:55,599
first of all, blood sports debate does not come out

720
00:46:55,639 --> 00:46:59,239
of the theology domain. This was something that Andy Wirsky

721
00:46:59,320 --> 00:47:04,119
started with JF to have drama streams and to have

722
00:47:04,280 --> 00:47:08,119
these weird sort of hash outs. It also included at

723
00:47:08,119 --> 00:47:12,239
times people doing theological debates and cultural debates, But originally

724
00:47:12,320 --> 00:47:16,000
it came out of the gaming and Worski sphere I

725
00:47:16,079 --> 00:47:19,719
was right there at the thick of that. It went

726
00:47:19,760 --> 00:47:22,920
through a phase of being associated with Ralph Witz's face,

727
00:47:23,280 --> 00:47:26,920
and then it became the thing this associated with Andrew,

728
00:47:28,079 --> 00:47:33,039
and ironically, Andrew upped the game and the status of

729
00:47:33,119 --> 00:47:37,639
the debate by actually putting on way more formal debates

730
00:47:37,679 --> 00:47:41,719
on the crucible than anything like what Andy Orsky put out.

731
00:47:42,119 --> 00:47:47,679
Those debates were absolute chaos, just degenerate, everybody cussing, everybody out, screaming.

732
00:47:48,079 --> 00:47:53,639
It was just pure drama. The Andrew era has produced

733
00:47:54,199 --> 00:47:57,639
mostly formal structure debates. I'm going to be debating Monday

734
00:47:57,880 --> 00:48:00,800
against Gnostic and Formant. It's a formal debate. We're gonna

735
00:48:00,800 --> 00:48:03,679
be debating his I know, it's crazy. I thought he

736
00:48:03,719 --> 00:48:05,840
was a gnostic with a name like Gnostic informat, but

737
00:48:05,840 --> 00:48:10,440
apparently he's a pantheist monus or something. So again, formal

738
00:48:10,440 --> 00:48:15,239
debates are the tendency there. I've never seen a problem

739
00:48:15,280 --> 00:48:19,559
with going into the sphere of whatever or whatever and

740
00:48:19,599 --> 00:48:22,360
having those other types of debates because I came out

741
00:48:22,400 --> 00:48:26,199
of that domain. It doesn't bother me to have a

742
00:48:26,320 --> 00:48:29,679
heated exchange. But keep in mind that Trent Horn only

743
00:48:29,719 --> 00:48:32,719
thinks of debates in a very formal, structured way, and

744
00:48:32,760 --> 00:48:36,639
that's fine. Like that still exists. Nobody says you can't

745
00:48:36,679 --> 00:48:41,280
do that. But nobody ruined the debate because there was

746
00:48:41,440 --> 00:48:45,480
always the low tier, bloodsport yelling types of debates that's

747
00:48:45,480 --> 00:48:49,119
always existed, and to blame that on me and other

748
00:48:49,159 --> 00:48:51,599
people is just kind of ridiculous that we all ruined

749
00:48:51,639 --> 00:48:54,480
debates and debates are debates are all about image, and

750
00:48:54,679 --> 00:48:57,239
debates are all about the way it looks. Well, Trent,

751
00:48:57,280 --> 00:49:00,679
if that's the case, then why are you folksocusing on

752
00:49:01,000 --> 00:49:04,639
the optics of behavior in people who debate and not

753
00:49:04,800 --> 00:49:08,119
focusing on the arguments. So you're doing the very thing

754
00:49:08,360 --> 00:49:11,760
that you say is the problem in modern debate. It's

755
00:49:11,800 --> 00:49:17,679
become about optics and gotcha's and behavior and not about

756
00:49:17,679 --> 00:49:21,239
the argumentation. That's what you've been doing in your last

757
00:49:21,239 --> 00:49:24,679
several videos. It's all about the optics and who said

758
00:49:24,679 --> 00:49:27,840
a mean joke? And it's just so gay dude, Trent.

759
00:49:27,880 --> 00:49:30,639
This is so gay dude. It's just so weak and

760
00:49:31,199 --> 00:49:34,920
freaking gay dude. And that's what is so annoying to

761
00:49:34,960 --> 00:49:37,360
so many people are actually going to see that the

762
00:49:37,440 --> 00:49:40,400
root of the problem here is multiple, but it's a

763
00:49:40,440 --> 00:49:44,079
spiritual problem, and it's a masculinity problem. And according to Trent,

764
00:49:44,400 --> 00:49:47,920
the Ortho bros Are toxically masculine. You can't make this up.

765
00:49:48,159 --> 00:49:57,400
Because Trent I'm not kidding is a male feminist. In

766
00:49:57,480 --> 00:50:02,079
the debate with Tim Gordon, he defends earlier feminism. Voting

767
00:50:02,119 --> 00:50:06,719
for women is necessary and essential. According to Trent Horne,

768
00:50:06,760 --> 00:50:09,719
now being a conspiracy there is. I don't put a

769
00:50:09,760 --> 00:50:12,559
whole lot of stock in voting, but I certainly don't

770
00:50:12,599 --> 00:50:17,400
take this ridiculous Normy position that we can actually benefit

771
00:50:17,719 --> 00:50:21,360
from women voting when women vote for the worst stuff

772
00:50:21,480 --> 00:50:25,920
in massive numbers. It's a preposterous position. And I hope

773
00:50:25,920 --> 00:50:29,679
Trent really does debate Andrew on that topic. I hope

774
00:50:29,719 --> 00:50:31,519
it comes about. But you have to keep in mind

775
00:50:32,280 --> 00:50:37,400
other Roman Catholics who aren't even SSPX state of accontest trads.

776
00:50:38,039 --> 00:50:43,400
Other Roman Catholics take huge issue with Trent over these issues.

777
00:50:43,400 --> 00:50:47,559
So this isn't just a orthobro versus reasonable Trent position.

778
00:50:48,199 --> 00:50:51,559
Large numbers of Roman Catholics think that Trent is ridiculous

779
00:50:51,599 --> 00:50:54,960
on this position. This is why he has this debating

780
00:50:56,119 --> 00:51:00,159
Tim Gordon on male feminism. And keep in mind too

781
00:51:00,480 --> 00:51:04,119
he debated Pearl on the same topic. I'm defending male

782
00:51:04,679 --> 00:51:07,320
versions early versions of as a male feminist defending the

783
00:51:07,360 --> 00:51:11,079
early waves of feminism. All the waves of feminism are

784
00:51:11,159 --> 00:51:14,039
bad because all the waves of feminism are a form

785
00:51:14,639 --> 00:51:18,119
of gender dysphoria. And Tim is one percent correct on

786
00:51:18,159 --> 00:51:22,400
that Tim has consistently showed in older people teaching that

787
00:51:22,480 --> 00:51:26,000
the popes held Tim's position. So the fact that modern

788
00:51:26,079 --> 00:51:30,400
Roman Catholic apologetics and lectures and talks support this idea

789
00:51:30,559 --> 00:51:36,199
of equal submission is preposterous. And the reason people call

790
00:51:36,320 --> 00:51:40,239
that out in Tran's personal life is that it shows

791
00:51:40,280 --> 00:51:43,639
the problem. You're just being mean, You're just a tucking

792
00:51:43,719 --> 00:51:45,719
him dude. You know how many Roman Catholics have come

793
00:51:45,760 --> 00:51:47,840
after me and my wife for ten years and said

794
00:51:47,880 --> 00:51:53,440
the worst imaginable stuff. It happens all the time. I'm

795
00:51:53,480 --> 00:51:56,519
not saying that's good, but I'm saying, you're gonna have

796
00:51:56,559 --> 00:51:58,960
people looking at your private life, your personal life, and

797
00:51:59,000 --> 00:52:01,280
they're gonna see does does this match up to what

798
00:52:01,320 --> 00:52:06,440
you're publicly saying. You're publicly moralizing all the time. That's

799
00:52:06,519 --> 00:52:10,079
the thing that is so disgusting from these people. It's

800
00:52:10,079 --> 00:52:11,719
not that they take a moral position, it's not that

801
00:52:11,760 --> 00:52:15,440
they defend their positions. It's that they moralize and they

802
00:52:15,639 --> 00:52:19,719
constantly want to one up you spiritually and morally. And

803
00:52:19,760 --> 00:52:25,559
it's nauseating because dudes know that it's just weak. It's

804
00:52:25,639 --> 00:52:30,440
weak sauce to constantly whine about a man saying something

805
00:52:30,440 --> 00:52:33,519
in a debate that hurt your feelings, To constantly say

806
00:52:33,599 --> 00:52:38,440
he shouldn't make jokes about fake Bishop Tilda Swinton. That's mean.

807
00:52:38,599 --> 00:52:43,559
Are you serious? You would rather tone police for a rabbit,

808
00:52:43,679 --> 00:52:48,840
anti white Marxist fake bishop. He's a con man. You

809
00:52:48,840 --> 00:52:51,280
would rather tone police for that guy. That guy deserves

810
00:52:51,280 --> 00:52:54,400
to be trolled. That guy deserves to be laughed at.

811
00:52:54,639 --> 00:52:58,119
He's a ridiculous person. And in the debate on Piers

812
00:52:58,159 --> 00:52:59,920
Morgan it showed he was a ridiculous person. He's completed.

813
00:53:02,599 --> 00:53:05,400
But I'm actually kind of amazed that the only thing

814
00:53:05,440 --> 00:53:11,320
Trent found was me calling Till the Swan Till whatever.

815
00:53:11,320 --> 00:53:12,760
I don't even know what his name is anymore. I

816
00:53:12,760 --> 00:53:15,599
just think him of as Till the Swinton, which I

817
00:53:15,599 --> 00:53:18,480
thought was a funny joke. And I will always troll

818
00:53:18,519 --> 00:53:21,840
and make ridiculous jokes like that. But imagine harping on

819
00:53:21,960 --> 00:53:26,719
that as a moral one up. That is so gay, dude,

820
00:53:27,119 --> 00:53:30,880
it's just freaking gay. At least find something bad, like

821
00:53:31,719 --> 00:53:34,280
me calling a bar of fat. That's a more morally

822
00:53:34,320 --> 00:53:37,960
appropriate thing than me going after some fake con man

823
00:53:38,000 --> 00:53:40,639
activist that your own church agrees a isn't a bishop.

824
00:53:41,400 --> 00:53:45,079
That means he's a fraud, a con man. But I'm

825
00:53:45,119 --> 00:53:47,239
bad because I made fun of him and called him

826
00:53:48,000 --> 00:53:52,440
Tilda Swinton, which everybody agrees was a funny joke. It's

827
00:53:52,480 --> 00:54:03,000
just so weak, dude. Now, I have plenty of criticisms

828
00:54:03,079 --> 00:54:06,800
of Pearl, but I'm gonna mention just this little clip

829
00:54:07,159 --> 00:54:13,719
because people were not attacking Trent Horn over his wife.

830
00:54:13,920 --> 00:54:16,559
Now maybe Grouper's were. I didn't follow that stuff, and

831
00:54:16,599 --> 00:54:18,960
I didn't even talk about any of this, but I'm

832
00:54:18,960 --> 00:54:22,639
bringing it up because it shows the discrepancy between the

833
00:54:22,679 --> 00:54:27,239
things that he says male feminism will do and his

834
00:54:27,320 --> 00:54:33,679
own life when his own wife disrespects him and by

835
00:54:33,719 --> 00:54:36,199
the way, she retires from social media after this event.

836
00:54:37,239 --> 00:54:39,559
Trent has a video where he tries to explain this

837
00:54:39,599 --> 00:54:42,480
away and say, no, no, she didn't cheat. Nobody says she cheated.

838
00:54:42,719 --> 00:54:45,159
The point was that she formed a bond with a

839
00:54:45,199 --> 00:54:47,760
man that was not you, and she talked about it

840
00:54:47,800 --> 00:54:52,280
on a podcast, which is somewhat humiliating, and they played

841
00:54:52,320 --> 00:54:57,480
the victim after all of this, and that deflected from

842
00:54:57,480 --> 00:55:01,440
a lot of these criticisms. He's not addressing the main

843
00:55:01,559 --> 00:55:03,800
point that people are making. Now, maybe some of these

844
00:55:03,800 --> 00:55:06,679
groupers were going to crazy and saying awful stuff. Yeah,

845
00:55:06,679 --> 00:55:13,360
but the main point is, Trent, you're moralizing, hyper moralizing constantly,

846
00:55:14,440 --> 00:55:16,280
and you're doing that more and more and more recently,

847
00:55:17,320 --> 00:55:20,199
and that's really nauseating when people don't see that in

848
00:55:20,239 --> 00:55:22,440
your own life. This is exactly what happened to Voice

849
00:55:22,440 --> 00:55:29,239
of Reason, hyper moralizing, piety signaling NonStop. And of all people,

850
00:55:30,039 --> 00:55:33,440
I have many disagreements with Pearl, and she can, even

851
00:55:33,480 --> 00:55:36,559
as an outsider to the religion, recognize that the people

852
00:55:36,599 --> 00:55:40,880
that constantly morals morally piety signal signal. All these egirls,

853
00:55:40,920 --> 00:55:43,719
they do the exact same of the egirls Sarah Stock,

854
00:55:44,320 --> 00:55:47,480
constantly moralizing about how moral she was because she was

855
00:55:47,480 --> 00:55:50,559
getting married. She beat everybody else, she won the contest,

856
00:55:50,880 --> 00:55:56,920
all the thoughts lost, and it was total hypocrisy. That's

857
00:55:56,960 --> 00:56:02,840
the point here is that when you your channel and

858
00:56:02,880 --> 00:56:07,639
you're apologetic on the moralizing, what happened with Voice of Reason.

859
00:56:08,039 --> 00:56:12,840
He starts out debating ubi debating Protestants and Orthodox on

860
00:56:13,000 --> 00:56:17,639
actual theological issues, then he shifts into all about that

861
00:56:17,760 --> 00:56:22,239
piety signaling. Baby, When you see that shift, there's usually

862
00:56:22,280 --> 00:56:25,280
something else going on, and it's usually a matter of

863
00:56:25,280 --> 00:56:31,639
time before they get exposed. So why am I saying

864
00:56:31,639 --> 00:56:35,480
this Trentanard. I'm not being mean, because the root of

865
00:56:35,480 --> 00:56:38,719
the problem here is that Trent is an effeminate soyman.

866
00:56:38,840 --> 00:56:43,159
That's the problem. Trent cannot admit because he's so fragile,

867
00:56:43,199 --> 00:56:47,239
he's so psychologically weak to admit any theological error, any

868
00:56:47,280 --> 00:56:51,679
geopolitical error, any error on history or papacy, in his mind,

869
00:56:51,679 --> 00:56:57,400
would be to crack this facade. And he's wrong about

870
00:56:57,440 --> 00:56:59,599
all of it. He's been wrong since we had the

871
00:56:59,639 --> 00:57:03,920
debate on natural theology. He's wrong about the Old Testament.

872
00:57:04,440 --> 00:57:07,480
He's quadrupled down on Muslim Christians and Jews worshiping the

873
00:57:07,480 --> 00:57:11,320
same God. And he doesn't care about the various fallacious

874
00:57:11,320 --> 00:57:14,800
critiques that we made explaining how that's not possible. He

875
00:57:14,840 --> 00:57:18,920
doesn't even care about the quantifier shift fallacy. He just

876
00:57:19,079 --> 00:57:23,519
repeats the papal system as if that were an argument

877
00:57:24,000 --> 00:57:26,880
to just repeat the papal doctrine, Like people that don't

878
00:57:26,880 --> 00:57:28,840
believe the papacy are not going to just buy you

879
00:57:28,960 --> 00:57:31,840
repeating the papal theology and the papal arguments and assertions

880
00:57:31,920 --> 00:57:34,039
over and whatever. We need an actual argument. It's a

881
00:57:34,039 --> 00:57:40,639
wise's case, not just the papal positions. So why is

882
00:57:40,679 --> 00:57:44,519
this a root problem in the household.

883
00:57:44,840 --> 00:57:48,360
Speaker 3: Oh saying that men need to get married. You know,

884
00:57:48,440 --> 00:57:52,000
the sleeping round is men, it's not women doing it.

885
00:57:52,480 --> 00:57:56,679
And I just knew. Sometimes my super simp radar goes

886
00:57:56,719 --> 00:57:59,400
off right. I'm like this guy, his wife is running

887
00:57:59,400 --> 00:58:03,000
the relation because of how he thinks and his super

888
00:58:03,039 --> 00:58:04,079
simp tendencies.

889
00:58:04,440 --> 00:58:07,400
Speaker 1: This is accurate. And I'm saying this because Trenton himself says,

890
00:58:07,679 --> 00:58:13,039
my wife chooses my friends for me. Let me play

891
00:58:13,039 --> 00:58:15,760
you the video. Might I might have unshared it. I

892
00:58:15,760 --> 00:58:17,920
can't remember if I shared it or not. But and

893
00:58:17,960 --> 00:58:21,400
this is not just you know again, I'm sure a

894
00:58:21,400 --> 00:58:24,440
lot of people justlike Pearl. The only reason I'm playing

895
00:58:24,440 --> 00:58:27,639
this one is because she has the clip of the

896
00:58:27,719 --> 00:58:30,239
three hour Matt frad podcast. And I don't know where

897
00:58:30,239 --> 00:58:32,440
in that three hour podcast this is. And I'm certainly

898
00:58:32,440 --> 00:58:35,199
not gonna watch a whole three hour podcasts talking about

899
00:58:35,199 --> 00:58:38,280
all this nonsense. So we're gonna listen just to this

900
00:58:38,320 --> 00:58:41,519
brief section where she discusses this, and then we're gonna

901
00:58:41,559 --> 00:58:44,840
listen to what Dr Jordan Peterson, who is absolutely spot

902
00:58:44,880 --> 00:58:48,760
on about male feminists. This is this, This is the psychology,

903
00:58:48,800 --> 00:58:50,519
the psychology of a male feminist.

904
00:58:50,599 --> 00:58:52,679
Speaker 3: Now I think this was the guy who hosted it

905
00:58:52,760 --> 00:58:55,840
Pints with a Quinas. And again, this is the challenge

906
00:58:55,840 --> 00:58:58,639
you get with the religious men. It's it's like, what

907
00:58:58,679 --> 00:59:01,880
they do, what they've attended to do, is they virtue

908
00:59:01,920 --> 00:59:05,039
signal morality. So they say, I am so moral, But

909
00:59:05,199 --> 00:59:07,239
how moral can you be as a man if you

910
00:59:07,239 --> 00:59:09,559
are afraid of your wife? Yeah, like, if you fear

911
00:59:09,599 --> 00:59:11,719
your wife, you're officially a woman. Now you have the

912
00:59:11,760 --> 00:59:14,599
same morals as a woman because you're going to defer

913
00:59:14,639 --> 00:59:17,119
to our morals. And you know, we don't have morality.

914
00:59:17,360 --> 00:59:19,480
You know, we don't have Okay, so here we go.

915
00:59:19,639 --> 00:59:21,840
Speaker 4: Hey, so I got super close to a male co work.

916
00:59:21,880 --> 00:59:23,119
Speaker 3: Make sure this isn't on two X.

917
00:59:23,599 --> 00:59:25,920
Speaker 4: Okay, Hey, so I got super close to a male

918
00:59:26,000 --> 00:59:29,280
coworker and I share this testimony and we used to

919
00:59:29,360 --> 00:59:31,440
do like a marriage encounter weekend and I shared this

920
00:59:31,480 --> 00:59:35,280
testimony and I got too close to him, and you start,

921
00:59:35,519 --> 00:59:38,599
I wouldn't say developing feelings. And Trent knows all this stuff,

922
00:59:38,760 --> 00:59:42,320
but I think that's how affairs happen. They happen very slowly.

923
00:59:42,360 --> 00:59:44,239
It's not like you, you know, just have an affair

924
00:59:44,280 --> 00:59:46,400
with someone even to know them. You're attracted to their temperament.

925
00:59:46,440 --> 00:59:49,360
They see the best side of you. And like, Trent

926
00:59:49,480 --> 00:59:51,400
was very uncomfortable with it, and I was like, well,

927
00:59:51,400 --> 00:59:53,679
we're just friends. But he's not a jealous person at all.

928
00:59:54,000 --> 00:59:55,679
So he was like, you know, I'm just asking that

929
00:59:55,719 --> 00:59:58,519
you don't do anything that you wouldn't be uncomfortable with

930
00:59:58,760 --> 01:00:02,320
me doing with a woman like you have that same standard,

931
01:00:02,760 --> 01:00:05,440
Like if I was like talking to a coworker often

932
01:00:05,480 --> 01:00:07,800
and joking around with that person and they were, you know,

933
01:00:07,880 --> 01:00:08,599
like getting.

934
01:00:08,599 --> 01:00:11,400
Speaker 3: So she's talking publicly about how she wanted to smash

935
01:00:11,440 --> 01:00:12,079
another dude.

936
01:00:12,280 --> 01:00:16,480
Speaker 1: And now again, the reason I'm playing this is because

937
01:00:16,480 --> 01:00:22,199
it shows the discrepancy between Trench's picturing of how feminism

938
01:00:22,280 --> 01:00:24,480
and male feminism is supposed to work and why it

939
01:00:24,599 --> 01:00:27,679
actually is a good thing, and why it's the Christian

940
01:00:27,760 --> 01:00:32,960
way to go. And yet in the real dynamics what's

941
01:00:33,039 --> 01:00:36,280
going on to Everybody who has any sense can see

942
01:00:37,440 --> 01:00:43,239
that's not how that works. Women do not respect male feminists.

943
01:00:44,039 --> 01:00:49,280
Women do not respect weak, simply effeminate men. They do not,

944
01:00:49,599 --> 01:00:52,400
and it eventually will make them resent the man and

945
01:00:52,440 --> 01:00:56,519
they will want to find masculinity elsewhere. I don't care

946
01:00:56,559 --> 01:01:00,000
how Christian you want to say you are and pretend

947
01:01:00,119 --> 01:01:07,079
the reality is the biology oftentimes overrides the professed things

948
01:01:07,079 --> 01:01:10,199
that come out of people's mouths. Now, we're all liable

949
01:01:10,239 --> 01:01:12,320
to those temptations. So I'm not trying to be mean,

950
01:01:12,440 --> 01:01:15,679
not trying to be unfair. But Trent wants to go hard.

951
01:01:15,800 --> 01:01:19,320
He wants to come at me constantly. Now, okay, let's

952
01:01:19,320 --> 01:01:22,719
do it. Let's talk about what masculinity actually is. Let's

953
01:01:22,719 --> 01:01:25,360
talk about what the real problems are. Let's talk about

954
01:01:25,400 --> 01:01:29,679
behavior and hypocrisy, because that's where Trent wants to go. Now,

955
01:01:29,679 --> 01:01:33,000
what does Jordan Peterson say about men who identify as

956
01:01:33,119 --> 01:01:36,320
male feminists? And Jordan Peterson, I think he's got his

957
01:01:36,440 --> 01:01:39,599
issues as well, but he is very perceptive and correct.

958
01:01:40,360 --> 01:01:43,519
And you see this in the history of many scandals.

959
01:01:44,119 --> 01:01:49,880
Think about all the men public leftists, Josh Weeden for example, right,

960
01:01:49,920 --> 01:01:53,039
and there's been some other cases of very prominent democrat,

961
01:01:53,920 --> 01:01:57,400
famous leftists who identified as male feminists and lo and

962
01:01:57,440 --> 01:02:02,280
behold it comes out. They are absolute moral savages. They're

963
01:02:02,880 --> 01:02:07,559
absolutely involved in some crazy stuff. Why is that, Am

964
01:02:07,599 --> 01:02:10,400
I saying that Trent is some crazy immoral I don't

965
01:02:10,400 --> 01:02:14,559
know Trent personally, but when you get people like that,

966
01:02:15,719 --> 01:02:18,840
like your wife, going on podcasts and admitting things that

967
01:02:18,920 --> 01:02:24,239
are humiliating to the man, it's people are not wrong

968
01:02:24,360 --> 01:02:28,639
to say this is weird. Same with Candace. Where's Candace's

969
01:02:28,760 --> 01:02:33,199
husband in the midst of her spouting all this insane nonsense.

970
01:02:33,639 --> 01:02:36,199
Does she not have a husband with some degree of

971
01:02:36,719 --> 01:02:40,000
guard and care for what her His wife is saying

972
01:02:40,119 --> 01:02:45,000
it's just weird. It's bizarre, right, And if Jamie went

973
01:02:45,039 --> 01:02:47,840
on a podcast and started talking about how she was

974
01:02:47,880 --> 01:02:52,119
developing possibly developing feelings or whatever on the road to

975
01:02:52,159 --> 01:02:54,840
developing feelings, because they want to qualify this a million times,

976
01:02:55,280 --> 01:02:57,480
because that's what Trent does. In his coat video where

977
01:02:57,519 --> 01:02:59,559
he tries to explain this away, he says, my wife

978
01:02:59,639 --> 01:03:04,800
didn't it wasn't anything. Well, why would she say that

979
01:03:05,000 --> 01:03:08,639
on a podcast? It's just weird, dude. It's bizarre and

980
01:03:08,679 --> 01:03:13,519
it is humiliating. And what came out of all this victim?

981
01:03:13,880 --> 01:03:19,559
Trent plays the victim as always. It's a Roman Catholic pattern,

982
01:03:20,800 --> 01:03:25,760
Vara lofton all of them. They're always victims, never wrong,

983
01:03:26,199 --> 01:03:29,960
never making serious mistakes, victims in fact, surprise Voice of

984
01:03:30,000 --> 01:03:32,760
Reason hasn't said that he's a victim, that the poor

985
01:03:32,840 --> 01:03:35,599
chicks were texting him too much, and he was the

986
01:03:35,719 --> 01:03:36,880
victim in this scenario.

987
01:03:37,039 --> 01:03:39,960
Speaker 5: It's not only women that engage in I said it's

988
01:03:40,000 --> 01:03:43,079
female type anti social behavior, but men can engage in

989
01:03:43,119 --> 01:03:46,960
reputation savaging too, and some of the worst of those

990
01:03:47,000 --> 01:03:53,960
are the men that ally themselves so to speak, with feminists,

991
01:03:54,039 --> 01:03:56,679
so that they have a sneaky way into popularity with girls.

992
01:03:57,039 --> 01:04:00,159
There's no shortage of that kind of appalling psychoe have

993
01:04:00,480 --> 01:04:01,360
behavior either.

994
01:04:03,440 --> 01:04:07,400
Speaker 4: Well, yes, some of the bitchiest behavior I've seen online

995
01:04:07,599 --> 01:04:10,840
is from men, and most of them might identify as

996
01:04:10,840 --> 01:04:13,400
male feminists, but they can be quite misogynistic.

997
01:04:13,559 --> 01:04:18,400
Speaker 1: App Peters is absolutely right as a lifelong, you know,

998
01:04:18,599 --> 01:04:22,440
person in the realm of psychiatry and diagnosing and studying

999
01:04:22,519 --> 01:04:24,599
these things. You can disagree with, you know, a lot

1000
01:04:24,599 --> 01:04:27,360
of his positions, as we do gnosticism and all that,

1001
01:04:28,400 --> 01:04:32,159
but he's absolutely right here in the tendency to think

1002
01:04:32,239 --> 01:04:35,159
that you're gonna get an end, you're gonna be popular,

1003
01:04:35,199 --> 01:04:37,519
that the women are gonna like you when you pretend

1004
01:04:37,880 --> 01:04:40,800
and when you signify that you're a male feminist, it

1005
01:04:40,920 --> 01:04:44,039
is absolutely pathetic and all of us out here in

1006
01:04:44,079 --> 01:04:48,679
this sphere who have been normal dudes and have spent

1007
01:04:48,920 --> 01:04:54,079
time dating various women or understanding female nature and understanding

1008
01:04:54,079 --> 01:04:57,199
the reality of the world, do not fall for this.

1009
01:04:57,760 --> 01:05:04,320
That's why it's so popular to simping simping behavior, which

1010
01:05:04,400 --> 01:05:08,719
is exactly what Trent exemplifies in these In these cases

1011
01:05:09,639 --> 01:05:13,480
does not actually show a person who is virtuous, who

1012
01:05:13,559 --> 01:05:17,519
is pious, that's the intention. It actually shows a weak

1013
01:05:18,440 --> 01:05:23,320
inability to understand and admit female nature, female biology, and

1014
01:05:23,360 --> 01:05:25,639
the reality what's going on. It's a form of the

1015
01:05:25,679 --> 01:05:29,320
alying and delusion. When you read the Proverbs, do you

1016
01:05:29,440 --> 01:05:34,159
think Solomon has a male feminist attitude at all? Of

1017
01:05:34,199 --> 01:05:38,480
course not. Now that's not just Solomon. But even according

1018
01:05:38,519 --> 01:05:43,559
to the New Testament, the Proverbs are inspired literature, So

1019
01:05:43,599 --> 01:05:48,039
the Holy Spirit is actually speaking through the Proverbs. And

1020
01:05:48,280 --> 01:05:52,679
how to modern feminists and male feminists and people in

1021
01:05:52,760 --> 01:05:57,159
the so called church say that Proverbs should be treated

1022
01:05:57,280 --> 01:06:00,000
as an old, outdated text when it comes to gender.

1023
01:06:01,599 --> 01:06:04,480
In other words, I don't care what the Holy Spirit

1024
01:06:04,519 --> 01:06:10,039
said through Proverbs. I have a new, updated theology of masculinity,

1025
01:06:10,239 --> 01:06:13,719
which is femininity. And if you think I'm wrong about

1026
01:06:13,760 --> 01:06:18,679
that you realize that this is the very argument that

1027
01:06:18,719 --> 01:06:22,119
Tim Gordon makes against Trent. This is Tim's line of argumentation,

1028
01:06:22,159 --> 01:06:24,599
not so much about proverbs, but he's saying that the

1029
01:06:24,639 --> 01:06:28,840
papal system has already stated that the attitude and the

1030
01:06:28,840 --> 01:06:31,440
relationship between men and women is much more accurate in

1031
01:06:31,480 --> 01:06:36,079
the ancient medieval world than the post nineteen sixties feminist

1032
01:06:36,199 --> 01:06:42,320
revolution and post even first wave feminist suffragette revolutions. These

1033
01:06:42,320 --> 01:06:46,039
people all want to defend the first waves because they

1034
01:06:46,119 --> 01:06:51,599
think that was rational, that was reasonable, and that's true.

1035
01:06:52,000 --> 01:06:57,639
Male femininity or excree me, male feminism. Male feminists are frauds.

1036
01:06:57,719 --> 01:07:01,559
And I can tell you that right away. Every dude

1037
01:07:01,599 --> 01:07:07,320
that has good testosterone levels recognizes this simpory and this weakness.

1038
01:07:07,679 --> 01:07:10,880
That is the root problem. It's not just going after

1039
01:07:11,039 --> 01:07:12,639
so you have to go after him because you don't

1040
01:07:12,639 --> 01:07:15,639
have any arguments. We've already spent seven years doing the arguments.

1041
01:07:15,679 --> 01:07:19,719
What are you talking about. I've got hours. I've got

1042
01:07:19,719 --> 01:07:23,800
at least twenty hours of video refuting point by point

1043
01:07:23,840 --> 01:07:30,199
Trent Horn. In fact, we collated together one hour. We

1044
01:07:30,239 --> 01:07:32,239
wanted to make it underneath one hour on the clips

1045
01:07:32,280 --> 01:07:37,000
channel here dire archive one hour refuting every single low

1046
01:07:37,039 --> 01:07:39,159
tier theological argument from Trent Horn. So don't give me

1047
01:07:39,199 --> 01:07:43,000
this nonsense. You ain't got no real theology argument. You

1048
01:07:43,079 --> 01:07:46,039
gotta go out to you personally. No, we never did that,

1049
01:07:46,400 --> 01:07:49,440
never even talked about him at any personal level until now,

1050
01:07:49,480 --> 01:07:53,719
because he's decided to do that. So let's watch his

1051
01:07:53,880 --> 01:07:59,159
video and see is he consistent with what he's saying

1052
01:07:59,159 --> 01:08:02,800
and arguing, And then we're going to open it up

1053
01:08:02,800 --> 01:08:05,039
to calls to anybody has any questions, challenges. You want

1054
01:08:05,079 --> 01:08:06,800
to come on and refute me, You're more than welcome

1055
01:08:06,840 --> 01:08:08,440
to You can have as much time as you want.

1056
01:08:08,440 --> 01:08:10,719
You want to talk for five minutes, be my guest.

1057
01:08:10,960 --> 01:08:15,360
Just indicate that at the beginning. So here's the most

1058
01:08:15,360 --> 01:08:17,640
recent video. I will remind you too that the previous

1059
01:08:17,720 --> 01:08:22,520
video is him saying that debate is no longer good.

1060
01:08:23,079 --> 01:08:27,920
He's above debate now, he's too pious for debating because

1061
01:08:28,279 --> 01:08:32,680
the theological area has been absolutely dominated by the Orthodox

1062
01:08:32,680 --> 01:08:35,520
the last few years. Every one of their debates, they

1063
01:08:35,520 --> 01:08:40,399
go into the polls say Orthodox majority win, Orthodox majority win,

1064
01:08:40,479 --> 01:08:46,199
Orthodox majority win, me versus ten the last few years,

1065
01:08:46,960 --> 01:08:54,800
Luigi pinsap Alex Soren, whoever, I'm forgetting I apologize if

1066
01:08:54,800 --> 01:08:58,119
I'm forgetting you. But over and over and over, Trent

1067
01:08:58,199 --> 01:09:05,079
Doherty huge just absolute chaos, not going good for the RCS.

1068
01:09:06,399 --> 01:09:09,640
So where are we at now, Well, the mantle has

1069
01:09:09,680 --> 01:09:13,319
fallen to Trent, and Trent's basically at a position where

1070
01:09:13,680 --> 01:09:16,680
he's not going to engage. It doesn't sound like given

1071
01:09:16,720 --> 01:09:18,920
that he's better than debate now he's not going to

1072
01:09:19,000 --> 01:09:23,079
engage at the debate level anymore because evil Andrew Wilson

1073
01:09:23,119 --> 01:09:26,039
and Jay Dyer have ruined it. But apparently he also

1074
01:09:26,520 --> 01:09:28,960
has got a lot to say about Tim Gordon and

1075
01:09:29,000 --> 01:09:31,000
the Roman Catholics as well who disagree with him.

1076
01:09:31,479 --> 01:09:36,039
Speaker 2: Recently, Eastern Orthodox cultural commentor Andrew Wilson criticized me as

1077
01:09:36,039 --> 01:09:39,239
a virtue signaller who is too critical of political Christians

1078
01:09:39,319 --> 01:09:41,720
like him that are actually trying to fix the culture.

1079
01:09:42,319 --> 01:09:46,239
Speaker 1: It's actually correct, you are a virtue signaling piety signaler

1080
01:09:46,239 --> 01:09:47,439
and his Andrew is spot on there.

1081
01:09:47,520 --> 01:09:49,920
Speaker 6: Most people to me are like the lowest of the

1082
01:09:49,960 --> 01:09:52,640
low or the low, you know, reps like Trent Horn

1083
01:09:52,960 --> 01:09:53,640
people like this.

1084
01:09:53,880 --> 01:09:55,960
Speaker 2: So in today's episode, I'll talk about where I agree

1085
01:09:56,000 --> 01:09:58,800
and disagree with Andrew and the difference between being a

1086
01:09:58,880 --> 01:10:02,520
strong assertive crit Christian and a bad overly aggressive one.

1087
01:10:02,800 --> 01:10:05,199
And to make sure I didn't misunderstand anything I met.

1088
01:10:05,399 --> 01:10:09,119
Speaker 1: Don't be overly aggressive. Please make sure and up your

1089
01:10:09,279 --> 01:10:12,640
estrogen levels. Please make sure and get a full dose

1090
01:10:12,800 --> 01:10:15,079
of gauge us today and drink your soy milk.

1091
01:10:15,199 --> 01:10:18,239
Speaker 2: Messaged Andrew and showed him this script. So my reply

1092
01:10:18,359 --> 01:10:21,680
incorporates some of what he wrote to me in our exchange. First,

1093
01:10:21,800 --> 01:10:24,199
let's take a look at Andrew's comments on the Patrick

1094
01:10:24,199 --> 01:10:25,039
Bette David Show.

1095
01:10:25,119 --> 01:10:28,399
Speaker 6: Most of my criticisms don't actually come from leftist though

1096
01:10:28,399 --> 01:10:31,720
many of them do. They actually come from a particular

1097
01:10:31,800 --> 01:10:34,000
brand of Christian virtue signalers.

1098
01:10:34,319 --> 01:10:34,439
Speaker 1: Right.

1099
01:10:34,439 --> 01:10:36,720
Speaker 6: They're always trying to signal their virtues. And it's always like,

1100
01:10:36,760 --> 01:10:40,279
oh my god, you smoke, he smocks cigarettes. Ah, you

1101
01:10:40,359 --> 01:10:42,840
drank beer, Career Christians don't drink beer.

1102
01:10:42,960 --> 01:10:43,039
Speaker 4: Like.

1103
01:10:43,119 --> 01:10:45,159
Speaker 1: It's always petty criticisms.

1104
01:10:45,680 --> 01:10:48,720
Speaker 6: But anytime there's controversy around me, or clip taken out

1105
01:10:48,720 --> 01:10:51,319
of context or something like this, these are the first

1106
01:10:51,319 --> 01:10:55,680
people to rush in and give me universal condemnation, mostly

1107
01:10:55,720 --> 01:10:58,279
so that my enemies will look at them. And these

1108
01:10:58,279 --> 01:11:01,119
are leftists, right, They want leftist to look at them

1109
01:11:01,119 --> 01:11:03,039
and think you're the good Christians.

1110
01:11:03,560 --> 01:11:06,039
Speaker 1: This is exactly what I just I've not seen this

1111
01:11:06,039 --> 01:11:07,920
clip yet, by the way, so this is exactly what

1112
01:11:07,960 --> 01:11:11,079
I was saying, and exactly what Jordan Peterson said about

1113
01:11:11,079 --> 01:11:15,640
the psychology of the male feminist. It's a weird, low

1114
01:11:15,680 --> 01:11:19,840
tier thing to think. If I show how much I'm

1115
01:11:19,880 --> 01:11:22,479
on the side of these insane people and the women

1116
01:11:22,520 --> 01:11:25,359
and the leftists, they'll like me, and I'll get a

1117
01:11:25,359 --> 01:11:27,279
big crowd and they're going to love me.

1118
01:11:27,560 --> 01:11:30,439
Speaker 2: Andrew maybe speaking of critics more generally here, but I

1119
01:11:30,439 --> 01:11:33,359
don't have a problem with drinking beer or smoking. I

1120
01:11:33,399 --> 01:11:36,439
have a hard time justifying habitual smoking, but if other

1121
01:11:36,520 --> 01:11:38,560
Christians want to smoke or drink, I'm not going to

1122
01:11:38,560 --> 01:11:41,439
say they're sinning. I do think smoking can come off

1123
01:11:41,479 --> 01:11:44,319
as an embarrassing larp when people lean into it as

1124
01:11:44,359 --> 01:11:46,840
part of their identity as a Christian influencer. And I

1125
01:11:46,840 --> 01:11:49,640
think Andrew would agree that no one is above criticism.

1126
01:11:49,960 --> 01:11:52,079
In a previous video, which I'll link to below, I

1127
01:11:52,159 --> 01:11:56,039
praised Wilson for using shrewd debate tactics that resulted in

1128
01:11:56,039 --> 01:11:59,680
Matt dillahunty Rage quitting their debate. In that debate, Andrew

1129
01:11:59,720 --> 01:12:02,239
plays fully kept calm and got Dila Hunty to flip

1130
01:12:02,279 --> 01:12:04,640
out by bringing up stuff that was personal to him,

1131
01:12:04,840 --> 01:12:07,920
like Dilla Hunty being in a de facto same sex relationship.

1132
01:12:08,199 --> 01:12:10,760
Speaker 1: Well no, wait a minute, So Trent is okay with

1133
01:12:10,920 --> 01:12:15,319
bringing up personal life contradictions with the way that you live.

1134
01:12:15,960 --> 01:12:18,159
Yet he seemed to have a very big problem with

1135
01:12:18,279 --> 01:12:23,159
people calling out the seeming inconsistency between what he says

1136
01:12:23,199 --> 01:12:28,079
about feminism and the relationship between his wife and the

1137
01:12:28,079 --> 01:12:31,039
guy at the place that she worked beginning to form

1138
01:12:31,079 --> 01:12:34,720
that relationship or possibly forming that relationship. So if that's

1139
01:12:34,760 --> 01:12:37,199
the case, then he should have no problem with people

1140
01:12:37,319 --> 01:12:40,560
calling into question the very thing that he made a

1141
01:12:40,600 --> 01:12:43,840
response video saying not to call into question about. Now again,

1142
01:12:44,119 --> 01:12:46,680
I'm not talking about people who quote attacked his wife.

1143
01:12:46,720 --> 01:12:50,399
If they did that, that's separate from people calling out

1144
01:12:50,479 --> 01:12:55,000
the inconsistency in what Trent says male feminism will produce

1145
01:12:55,479 --> 01:12:59,319
versus his own personal life and relationship as the head

1146
01:12:59,319 --> 01:13:00,000
of a household.

1147
01:13:00,399 --> 01:13:03,079
Speaker 7: Attempting to lie to people who claim men can be

1148
01:13:03,159 --> 01:13:06,880
women isn't human flourishing? Why you ask, would people be

1149
01:13:07,279 --> 01:13:10,960
this over the top stupid? Well, it's simple. The good

1150
01:13:11,039 --> 01:13:13,199
is the good man. We have to do what's good

1151
01:13:13,239 --> 01:13:15,520
for human society and human flourishing. And if you don't

1152
01:13:15,520 --> 01:13:18,479
call these range lunatics don't think they obviously aren't, they

1153
01:13:18,560 --> 01:13:20,840
might self terminate. So in order to avoid that, we

1154
01:13:20,880 --> 01:13:23,359
need to make everybody on planet Earth lie to them.

1155
01:13:23,680 --> 01:13:26,000
Speaker 1: This guy's not serious and I'm leaving James. If you

1156
01:13:26,000 --> 01:13:28,079
want to refund you well, sir, and So.

1157
01:13:28,159 --> 01:13:31,239
Speaker 2: Andrew won the exchange, but on the Whatever podcast recently,

1158
01:13:31,319 --> 01:13:34,079
Andrew was generally seen as losing this part of an

1159
01:13:34,079 --> 01:13:37,359
exchange with a feminist who used the same tactic against him.

1160
01:13:37,840 --> 01:13:41,039
She calmly brought up a legal fact about Andrew's wife,

1161
01:13:41,239 --> 01:13:43,760
and then Andrew aggressively responded to her.

1162
01:13:43,720 --> 01:13:46,159
Speaker 4: Your wife has three baby daddies and has been married

1163
01:13:46,199 --> 01:13:47,159
twice before.

1164
01:13:46,960 --> 01:13:53,079
Speaker 1: And you under and youlix your religion. Huh what is that?

1165
01:13:54,119 --> 01:13:55,760
Speaker 6: Don't talk about my wife, He's stupid.

1166
01:13:56,000 --> 01:14:00,279
Speaker 1: Shut your mouth, Shut your stupid mouth. Your wife with

1167
01:14:00,319 --> 01:14:03,520
the three baby did I just say I with the sorry, Donald,

1168
01:14:03,520 --> 01:14:04,000
I'm sorry?

1169
01:14:04,399 --> 01:14:07,439
Speaker 6: Is she morally in consequential in comparison to your clicking?

1170
01:14:08,319 --> 01:14:11,960
Speaker 1: So? Notice Trent has no problem highlighting and calling out

1171
01:14:12,279 --> 01:14:15,840
what he sees as inconsistencies in people's personal lives and

1172
01:14:15,880 --> 01:14:18,359
what they say on the debate stage and publicly, which

1173
01:14:18,399 --> 01:14:22,159
is exactly what people did in regard to Trent and

1174
01:14:22,199 --> 01:14:26,239
his own wife's inconsistency when it came to the Matt

1175
01:14:26,279 --> 01:14:29,600
frad Pintes with a Quietess podcast talking about her beginning

1176
01:14:29,680 --> 01:14:31,840
to develop an affection and a relationship with a guy

1177
01:14:31,880 --> 01:14:36,239
that could have become inappropriate. So again, there's a lot

1178
01:14:36,279 --> 01:14:39,119
of hypocrisy that we're going to see in Trent Horne,

1179
01:14:39,119 --> 01:14:43,760
because it's the same with the jokes. It's okay when

1180
01:14:43,840 --> 01:14:47,640
Roman Catholics make immature, childish jokes, but if you do

1181
01:14:47,720 --> 01:14:49,560
it at a certain thing that he doesn't like, or

1182
01:14:49,560 --> 01:14:52,560
a certain way or over his line, then it's the

1183
01:14:52,680 --> 01:14:55,399
end of the world and they're absolute victims. These are

1184
01:14:55,439 --> 01:14:58,760
the people who play victim but stab you in the back.

1185
01:14:58,840 --> 01:15:01,680
Speaker 2: Like the me power discus with people insulting you, it's

1186
01:15:01,680 --> 01:15:04,119
not uncommon to lose your cool. We're all only human,

1187
01:15:04,479 --> 01:15:07,920
But this kind of aggressive behavior isn't uncommon for Andrew

1188
01:15:08,000 --> 01:15:10,439
and other people in his orbit, so it's fair to

1189
01:15:10,479 --> 01:15:13,159
point it out and discuss the merits of acting like this.

1190
01:15:13,920 --> 01:15:17,279
Like any public proponent of Christianity. There's good and not

1191
01:15:17,319 --> 01:15:20,479
so good elements to Andrew's approach. In our email exchange,

1192
01:15:20,560 --> 01:15:23,560
Andrew said, sowing circle Christians tend to focus on why

1193
01:15:23,600 --> 01:15:26,239
the person who is moving policy and people's minds on

1194
01:15:26,319 --> 01:15:29,760
policy isn't acting in a pure enough way, and often

1195
01:15:29,800 --> 01:15:32,720
will actually side with the critics of that person affecting

1196
01:15:32,840 --> 01:15:35,439
change in order to purity signal no iigue.

1197
01:15:35,479 --> 01:15:36,399
Speaker 1: This is true, Aree.

1198
01:15:36,479 --> 01:15:39,279
Speaker 2: It's cringey when some Christians do everything they can to

1199
01:15:39,359 --> 01:15:43,119
please non Christian critics, even by taking unnecessary potshots at

1200
01:15:43,119 --> 01:15:46,760
fellow Christians. It's a kind of ideological simping, similar to

1201
01:15:46,880 --> 01:15:49,720
male feminists who throw all men under the bus to

1202
01:15:49,720 --> 01:15:50,399
appease women.

1203
01:15:50,760 --> 01:15:53,640
Speaker 1: Oh you mean, like you as a male feminist because

1204
01:15:53,640 --> 01:15:56,840
you identify as a first wave male feminist. So does

1205
01:15:56,840 --> 01:15:59,279
that include you or what is this talking about.

1206
01:15:59,840 --> 01:16:03,840
Speaker 2: My criticisms aren't because of how other people complain. It's

1207
01:16:03,840 --> 01:16:08,359
because God's revelation has said we shouldn't engage in these behaviors,

1208
01:16:08,720 --> 01:16:10,680
and I definitely care about appeasing God.

1209
01:16:10,800 --> 01:16:12,520
Speaker 6: And it's like the whole time, so in other words,

1210
01:16:12,600 --> 01:16:14,800
the whole time, these people are burning the whole forest

1211
01:16:14,880 --> 01:16:17,760
down around our ears, right, and I say, hey, put

1212
01:16:17,800 --> 01:16:22,600
those matches down, Hey, don't say the F word, Like, well, wait,

1213
01:16:22,640 --> 01:16:25,239
we got a bigger problem here, we got Now.

1214
01:16:25,560 --> 01:16:30,079
Speaker 1: It's important to note that Trent's long time still, as

1215
01:16:30,079 --> 01:16:33,920
I understand, good friend Tim Gordon says the F word constantly.

1216
01:16:34,560 --> 01:16:37,600
Tim says it all the time. I've not yet seen

1217
01:16:37,720 --> 01:16:42,039
Trent call out Tim Gordon on a public video for

1218
01:16:42,199 --> 01:16:46,079
saying the F word. Did you want to say something?

1219
01:16:46,239 --> 01:16:49,800
What happened? Hello? Are you? Are you talking to me?

1220
01:16:50,640 --> 01:16:50,840
Speaker 3: Yeah?

1221
01:16:50,960 --> 01:16:57,560
Speaker 1: I'm ahead? What's that call out?

1222
01:16:55,640 --> 01:16:55,760
Speaker 4: Uh?

1223
01:16:59,319 --> 01:17:02,840
Speaker 1: Oh? I totally forgot about that. Remember when Trent Doherty

1224
01:17:03,039 --> 01:17:05,520
lost his mind and just screamed and cussed me out

1225
01:17:05,600 --> 01:17:10,000
and then streamed and cuss Cleve out. So again, this

1226
01:17:10,159 --> 01:17:14,239
standard is not applied to their team. This is all

1227
01:17:14,359 --> 01:17:16,800
very team based stuff, and it's like, yes, we have

1228
01:17:16,880 --> 01:17:20,319
this standard, but we pull this when we need it,

1229
01:17:20,800 --> 01:17:24,359
when it's an ortho bro, when it's you know whoever.

1230
01:17:24,399 --> 01:17:25,840
But we're not going to say it about Trent Doherty,

1231
01:17:25,840 --> 01:17:28,600
who was an absolute disaster for them. We're not going

1232
01:17:28,640 --> 01:17:30,319
to say it about Tim Gordon, who says the F

1233
01:17:30,319 --> 01:17:32,680
word all the time. So it's very convenient sort of

1234
01:17:33,079 --> 01:17:35,840
rolling this out when it needs to be rolled out

1235
01:17:36,560 --> 01:17:42,199
and what happens again, Andrew's point right here is absolutely correct.

1236
01:17:42,600 --> 01:17:45,560
What's going on right now the biggest news story of

1237
01:17:45,600 --> 01:17:51,920
our lifetime with Epstein stuff, And what's Trent's concern? Who's

1238
01:17:51,920 --> 01:17:56,399
saying the F word on a PbD podcast. Trent's concern is,

1239
01:17:56,920 --> 01:18:02,079
let's rebut Epstein and the Vatican so immediate cope and

1240
01:18:02,199 --> 01:18:08,000
cover mode. Why why is that the concern in the

1241
01:18:08,039 --> 01:18:12,279
midst of the biggest scandal of our time. This is

1242
01:18:12,319 --> 01:18:17,039
what is so ridiculous. This proves Andrew's point about sewing

1243
01:18:17,119 --> 01:18:21,319
circle of Christians is that the world will be burning

1244
01:18:21,359 --> 01:18:26,800
down around them and they're capitalizing on piety signaling over

1245
01:18:26,840 --> 01:18:30,079
the frickin' F word. It's just insane. Now I'm going

1246
01:18:30,159 --> 01:18:33,159
to see what he thinks he can do to rebut

1247
01:18:33,880 --> 01:18:38,640
the absurd conspiracy theories about the Vatican. Note he's still

1248
01:18:39,079 --> 01:18:44,960
quadrupling down that after Epstein, there's no global conspiracy, there's

1249
01:18:44,960 --> 01:18:48,399
no tinfoil hat stuff going on. Remember him and Jimmy

1250
01:18:48,399 --> 01:18:51,279
A can put out things saying Davos is not involved

1251
01:18:51,439 --> 01:18:55,680
in a globalist elite conspiracy for a technocratic order. They

1252
01:18:55,760 --> 01:18:57,920
put out in from it during Coke during the coop

1253
01:18:59,000 --> 01:19:02,279
when he was pushing stabbies and masks. This dude is

1254
01:19:02,319 --> 01:19:03,640
the ultimate normy.

1255
01:19:07,119 --> 01:19:10,239
Speaker 6: A bigger problem here. Nope, you said the F word. Yeah,

1256
01:19:10,279 --> 01:19:10,960
that's no good.

1257
01:19:11,199 --> 01:19:14,880
Speaker 2: I agree with Andrew that being overly puritanical about language,

1258
01:19:14,960 --> 01:19:17,720
I e. What i'd call true tone policing is lame.

1259
01:19:18,159 --> 01:19:20,399
I covered this in my episode on Christian swearing, where

1260
01:19:20,439 --> 01:19:23,640
I said profanity in itself isn't wrong and it could

1261
01:19:23,680 --> 01:19:25,039
be justified in some cases.

1262
01:19:25,319 --> 01:19:27,560
Speaker 1: I use the example yeah, because he knows that that's

1263
01:19:27,600 --> 01:19:29,039
exactly what Tim Gordon argues.

1264
01:19:29,159 --> 01:19:33,119
Speaker 2: Hiplo Stephen Colbert engaging Philipszimbardo, who said that God was

1265
01:19:33,159 --> 01:19:35,800
wrong and the devil was right. When Colbert gave him

1266
01:19:35,800 --> 01:19:38,960
the correct theology on the Matterszimbardo said, you learned well

1267
01:19:38,960 --> 01:19:42,399
in Sunday School, to which Colbert epically replied, I teach

1268
01:19:42,439 --> 01:19:45,720
Sunday School mother effort. But that's different than just dropping.

1269
01:19:45,920 --> 01:19:51,279
Speaker 1: Oh, it's different. So when Colbert, who is an absolute, disgusting,

1270
01:19:51,319 --> 01:19:58,319
degenerate Catholic goblin, uses it in a comedic way, it's acceptable.

1271
01:19:58,760 --> 01:20:02,399
But if I make fun of Bishop fake Bishop Tilda Swinton,

1272
01:20:02,479 --> 01:20:07,279
a radical anti white Marxist activist I'm the bad person.

1273
01:20:07,399 --> 01:20:11,319
So even right here within this stupid video, he's already

1274
01:20:11,359 --> 01:20:15,439
contradicted his own allowances, which shows you that there's no

1275
01:20:15,520 --> 01:20:21,039
consistent application of some moral puritanism about holy speech. It's

1276
01:20:21,279 --> 01:20:25,399
just arbitrary to figure out when and where it's applicable.

1277
01:20:25,399 --> 01:20:27,439
What do you mean, I mean Colbert at least used

1278
01:20:27,479 --> 01:20:28,800
to say is Catholic. I don't know whether he is

1279
01:20:28,880 --> 01:20:32,319
or not, but he's identified, at least in the past

1280
01:20:32,439 --> 01:20:36,119
as a member of the Catholic Church. I think, could

1281
01:20:36,159 --> 01:20:40,159
you give me a espresso and also a water? Thank you?

1282
01:20:45,039 --> 01:20:48,079
Speaker 2: Hopping an F bomb to insult somebody like Andrew does

1283
01:20:48,079 --> 01:20:49,359
in this clip, I will.

1284
01:20:49,159 --> 01:20:52,279
Speaker 6: Never be able to convince you of my worldview, Charlie.

1285
01:20:52,319 --> 01:20:54,960
I just think, honestly, you're too stupid to understand them.

1286
01:20:54,960 --> 01:20:57,680
Speaker 2: Saint Paul repeatedly says that overseers in the Church must

1287
01:20:57,720 --> 01:21:01,000
be gentle and not quarrelsome or violent, and that all

1288
01:21:01,119 --> 01:21:05,520
Christians must put away anger, wrath, malice, slander, and foul

1289
01:21:05,600 --> 01:21:08,399
talk from their mouth. Jesus said in Matthew five twenty two,

1290
01:21:08,720 --> 01:21:11,720
whoever insults's brothers shall be liable to the council, and

1291
01:21:11,760 --> 01:21:14,520
whoever says you fool shall be liable to the hell

1292
01:21:14,560 --> 01:21:16,920
of fire and Sewod Simothy chapter two set.

1293
01:21:17,039 --> 01:21:20,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, the text is not making a joke or making

1294
01:21:20,720 --> 01:21:24,039
fun of people. The text is accuses his brother and

1295
01:21:24,079 --> 01:21:27,840
thus liable to the council. So that's some Roman Catholic translation.

1296
01:21:28,399 --> 01:21:31,520
But regardless, there's many places in scripture where we're told

1297
01:21:31,560 --> 01:21:35,239
to actually identify the fool, and it is appropriate to

1298
01:21:35,279 --> 01:21:37,880
call people fools. In fact, most of the Church Fathers,

1299
01:21:37,920 --> 01:21:46,520
when dealing with persistent, obstinate heretics, call them demons, idiots, morons, devils, dogs, morons,

1300
01:21:46,520 --> 01:21:48,560
et cetera, over and over and over. This is a

1301
01:21:48,560 --> 01:21:52,079
common refrain. Saint Cyril. Saint Cyril Jerusalem says in the

1302
01:21:52,079 --> 01:21:55,600
Catechetical Lectures that all heretics should be hated. They should

1303
01:21:55,600 --> 01:21:58,039
be loathed for their system and for their error and

1304
01:21:58,039 --> 01:22:02,359
for their theology. Again, does that mean that we can't also,

1305
01:22:02,359 --> 01:22:04,840
at the same time love them. No, it is possible.

1306
01:22:05,199 --> 01:22:07,920
It is possible to have disdain for someone and at

1307
01:22:07,920 --> 01:22:10,880
the same time love them, wanting the best for them.

1308
01:22:11,199 --> 01:22:16,079
But sometimes what's best for people, especially exceedingly wicked frauds

1309
01:22:16,359 --> 01:22:19,840
like Bishop Tilda Swinton, they should be publicly called out

1310
01:22:19,840 --> 01:22:23,239
and rebuked, And that's the only thing. It's amazing actually

1311
01:22:23,239 --> 01:22:25,159
to me that that's the only thing that he could

1312
01:22:25,199 --> 01:22:29,840
find to call me out on. Now, there's nobody worse

1313
01:22:30,399 --> 01:22:34,479
at this than scam chemou. Is he gonna apply this

1314
01:22:34,680 --> 01:22:38,239
to his own Catholic apologetic buddy, I'm assuming that other

1315
01:22:38,279 --> 01:22:40,840
buddies in the sense of the same church, his own

1316
01:22:40,920 --> 01:22:45,159
ally in Catholicism, scam chamou Or is this only selectively

1317
01:22:45,199 --> 01:22:48,359
applied when trend decides that you could say the F

1318
01:22:48,439 --> 01:22:51,760
word when it's Stephen Colbert in a joke setting against

1319
01:22:51,760 --> 01:22:54,000
an atheist or something like that, you can't say it

1320
01:22:54,079 --> 01:22:58,840
against another person. Okay, So he's interjecting his arbitrary standards

1321
01:22:59,159 --> 01:23:04,079
to justify his own moral stance. And this whole thing

1322
01:23:04,359 --> 01:23:10,119
is about his moral position, why he's moral, and nobody

1323
01:23:10,119 --> 01:23:13,600
else matches his morality. That's the problem here, is that

1324
01:23:13,640 --> 01:23:15,880
the debate has shifted away from the issues and the

1325
01:23:15,920 --> 01:23:21,279
topics into piety signaling. And once you're there, that's you

1326
01:23:21,600 --> 01:23:24,760
on the ropes. That's the last legs of the defense

1327
01:23:24,800 --> 01:23:27,520
of your system, because you've got nothing else to come

1328
01:23:27,560 --> 01:23:30,479
at in terms of the system. You can only come

1329
01:23:30,520 --> 01:23:34,840
after the perceived moral infractions and why you're morally superior.

1330
01:23:35,279 --> 01:23:37,800
That's why we've seen the last couple of days just

1331
01:23:37,880 --> 01:23:42,560
a flood of Roman Catholic bots pidi signaling like crazy.

1332
01:23:42,840 --> 01:23:48,640
Why my thesis is they are concerned about the attachments

1333
01:23:48,760 --> 01:23:50,960
of Epstein to John Paul the second and the Vatican.

1334
01:23:51,399 --> 01:23:54,000
Why is that such a big deal if it calls

1335
01:23:54,039 --> 01:23:57,000
into question the sanctity of John Paul the second. And

1336
01:23:57,039 --> 01:24:00,560
that's the key point here is that Epstein identified himself

1337
01:24:00,600 --> 01:24:05,439
as getting special gifts, particularly architectural novelties, from a John

1338
01:24:05,479 --> 01:24:09,920
Paul the second, And because associates and allies of Epstein

1339
01:24:10,039 --> 01:24:12,680
say in the emails that Epstein spent significant time at

1340
01:24:12,720 --> 01:24:16,359
the Vatican, and because we do have vindication of Epstein

1341
01:24:16,399 --> 01:24:19,319
being blessed at the Vatican during that time period, this

1342
01:24:19,439 --> 01:24:22,399
means that the sanctity of John Paul the Second would

1343
01:24:22,399 --> 01:24:26,840
obviously be in question, and that means that sainthood in

1344
01:24:26,880 --> 01:24:31,760
the Roman Catholic system would fall apart. That means Roman

1345
01:24:31,880 --> 01:24:35,920
Catholic dogma would fall apart. Because sainthood is part of

1346
01:24:35,960 --> 01:24:41,720
the ordinary universal magisterium.

1347
01:24:39,640 --> 01:24:42,880
Speaker 2: As the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome but kindly

1348
01:24:42,920 --> 01:24:47,640
to everyone. An apt teacher forbearing correcting his opponents with gentleness. Now,

1349
01:24:47,640 --> 01:24:49,279
if I were to just tell people all of this

1350
01:24:49,359 --> 01:24:53,039
without citing scripture, they'd probably say I was effeminately tone

1351
01:24:53,079 --> 01:24:56,239
policing them. So I appreciate when Nick Fuentes admits he

1352
01:24:56,319 --> 01:24:58,000
thinks this way about the Bible itself.

1353
01:24:58,119 --> 01:24:59,199
Speaker 1: Rod twenty dollars.

1354
01:24:59,239 --> 01:25:01,640
Speaker 2: Those nerds in sixteen forget Bibical masculinity involve Samson killing

1355
01:25:01,680 --> 01:25:03,920
a hundred people, David killing a giant, and Jesus winning people.

1356
01:25:04,680 --> 01:25:06,439
Speaker 1: Yeah, they forgot that.

1357
01:25:06,399 --> 01:25:11,199
Speaker 8: They worked out the Bible. They did deadlifts, and they's

1358
01:25:11,600 --> 01:25:14,680
rights and.

1359
01:25:14,000 --> 01:25:15,279
Speaker 1: They beat people up.

1360
01:25:16,279 --> 01:25:20,159
Speaker 8: Biblical masculinity is based let's just be honest.

1361
01:25:20,239 --> 01:25:22,880
Speaker 1: Biblical masculine. Oh wait, I'm not seeing a lot of

1362
01:25:22,960 --> 01:25:25,319
Nick point this in a while. But that's funny that.

1363
01:25:26,000 --> 01:25:27,279
I guess I'm not the only person that does a

1364
01:25:27,359 --> 01:25:31,159
retard voice. But I'm sure Trent would call out that

1365
01:25:31,239 --> 01:25:33,399
it's mean to say the word retard.

1366
01:25:34,039 --> 01:25:37,600
Speaker 8: The Bible tells men to be feminine, Like, let's be honest,

1367
01:25:38,880 --> 01:25:41,880
let's just be honest. Typical twenty dollars. Hey, Nick, let's

1368
01:25:41,880 --> 01:25:44,119
not cope about it. The Bible is not a story

1369
01:25:44,119 --> 01:25:48,000
of like men being jacked and going to the gym.

1370
01:25:49,840 --> 01:25:52,520
Speaker 2: But that's only true if you think masculinity is raw

1371
01:25:52,640 --> 01:25:55,239
power that doesn't give an f about anything, instead of

1372
01:25:55,279 --> 01:25:58,920
seeing true masculinity is controlled strength that submits to God

1373
01:25:58,920 --> 01:25:59,960
impatiently endoor his heart.

1374
01:26:00,680 --> 01:26:04,199
Speaker 1: Yeah, but your own church. Prior to the nineteen sixties,

1375
01:26:04,199 --> 01:26:07,439
in Vatican two, Trent did not teach that first wave

1376
01:26:07,520 --> 01:26:13,319
feminism was an acceptable Roman Catholic masculinity or femininity. In fact,

1377
01:26:13,840 --> 01:26:17,880
pre Vatican two teaching actually says what Tim Gordon says,

1378
01:26:18,039 --> 01:26:20,079
which is that the role of women is to not

1379
01:26:20,319 --> 01:26:23,880
at all supplant the role of men, and that includes

1380
01:26:24,439 --> 01:26:27,880
gender dysphoria of thinking that women should in any way

1381
01:26:28,199 --> 01:26:32,319
predominantly be in masculine roles. Now, I don't necessarily agree

1382
01:26:32,359 --> 01:26:35,479
with every single point of Tim Gordon, but Tim Gordon

1383
01:26:35,600 --> 01:26:39,640
is way more correct in Catholic teaching and Catholic theology

1384
01:26:40,159 --> 01:26:44,479
traditionally speaking, than what Trent Horn is pushing. But Trent

1385
01:26:44,520 --> 01:26:48,319
Horn is a modern neo Catholic that absolutely supports all

1386
01:26:48,359 --> 01:26:51,119
of the Vatican two nonsense that he has to, and

1387
01:26:51,159 --> 01:26:52,880
so it only makes sense that he would support two

1388
01:26:52,960 --> 01:26:59,279
days Vatican, which tends towards skittles and gay feminist theology.

1389
01:26:59,000 --> 01:27:01,960
Speaker 2: First Corinthian sixteen thirteen. Paul even says to be strong

1390
01:27:02,039 --> 01:27:06,119
and Andrithas say, literally act like men, because men are

1391
01:27:06,119 --> 01:27:07,039
the standard of strength.

1392
01:27:07,159 --> 01:27:09,880
Speaker 6: And so those people to me are like the lowest

1393
01:27:09,920 --> 01:27:11,079
of the low or the low.

1394
01:27:12,079 --> 01:27:12,399
Speaker 1: Well.

1395
01:27:12,479 --> 01:27:14,359
Speaker 6: I mean, if you want specific names.

1396
01:27:14,199 --> 01:27:16,720
Speaker 1: Specific names, if you're comfortable saying who are some of them?

1397
01:27:16,760 --> 01:27:21,079
Speaker 6: So I would say people like Lilah Rose, Representatives like

1398
01:27:21,159 --> 01:27:24,920
Lila Rose. I would even say, you know, reps like

1399
01:27:25,119 --> 01:27:29,199
Trent Horn, people like this. These are people who they

1400
01:27:29,239 --> 01:27:33,239
themselves may not necessarily levy the criticism directly, but it's

1401
01:27:33,279 --> 01:27:35,760
the influence that they have over the various audiences that

1402
01:27:35,800 --> 01:27:38,479
they have that then go and direct these criticisms towards you.

1403
01:27:38,520 --> 01:27:41,880
Speaker 1: Got it, And this is correct because this is the

1404
01:27:41,920 --> 01:27:44,840
same critique that Tim Gordon makes of all of these

1405
01:27:44,880 --> 01:27:47,399
same Catholics. And I don't have to necessarily agree with

1406
01:27:47,439 --> 01:27:49,199
every single position of Tim were I'll give an example.

1407
01:27:49,279 --> 01:27:53,239
I disagree. Tim thinks that Proverbs thirty one is like

1408
01:27:53,439 --> 01:27:59,439
uniquely some sort of Hebrew Jewish queen text and it

1409
01:27:59,560 --> 01:28:03,640
only applies to Jewish queens. No, it's a pattern, I

1410
01:28:03,640 --> 01:28:06,399
would say for the godly woman. It's not just for

1411
01:28:06,560 --> 01:28:10,800
Hebrew queens. So I disagree with Tim on that point

1412
01:28:10,800 --> 01:28:13,680
as an example, and so it's not necessarily wrong in

1413
01:28:13,680 --> 01:28:17,239
my view for a woman to do a side job,

1414
01:28:17,399 --> 01:28:20,079
or if she can not at the expense of the children,

1415
01:28:20,159 --> 01:28:22,560
if she wants to have a part time job or

1416
01:28:22,600 --> 01:28:26,399
something like that. Again, that doesn't jeopardize the household or

1417
01:28:26,439 --> 01:28:28,600
the man in that relationship first and foremost, or the

1418
01:28:28,640 --> 01:28:31,720
children first and foremost right. So that's one area of

1419
01:28:31,760 --> 01:28:35,000
minor disagreement I would have with Tim Gordon. But in

1420
01:28:35,159 --> 01:28:38,239
the main, when it comes to the Roman Catholic system,

1421
01:28:38,279 --> 01:28:40,520
you have to keep in mind Trent doesn't seem to

1422
01:28:40,520 --> 01:28:43,640
be aware that pre Vatican two popes already spoke on this.

1423
01:28:44,119 --> 01:28:48,199
They already talked about at the time of the suffrage movement,

1424
01:28:48,479 --> 01:28:53,319
the problems of suffragism and why suffragette ideology coming out

1425
01:28:53,359 --> 01:28:56,479
of the French Revolution is just an older form of

1426
01:28:56,520 --> 01:29:00,760
liberalism that today's conservatives think is a concert a position.

1427
01:29:02,119 --> 01:29:07,640
Just like the people that defend democracy and last year's

1428
01:29:08,000 --> 01:29:10,359
you know, like the Democrats and the Republicans, right, we

1429
01:29:10,399 --> 01:29:13,399
talked about this, the GOP is defending, you know, the

1430
01:29:14,199 --> 01:29:17,680
liberalism of twenty years ago. The Democratic Party has now conservatism. Well,

1431
01:29:17,720 --> 01:29:22,680
guess what the tradcat apologists are defending the liberalism of

1432
01:29:22,720 --> 01:29:26,399
the French Revolution as traditional Catholic conservative values. That's how

1433
01:29:26,560 --> 01:29:33,520
ignorant these people actually are. Though I never Tim has

1434
01:29:33,600 --> 01:29:36,920
multiple places and examples where he goes through those older

1435
01:29:36,960 --> 01:29:40,039
papal minds and people quotes. I don't even care to

1436
01:29:40,039 --> 01:29:42,279
do that. It's boring to me. I used to do that.

1437
01:29:42,279 --> 01:29:45,000
I used to live that world. But there are multiple

1438
01:29:45,359 --> 01:29:49,439
pre vaticant to papal teachings on the appropriate role of

1439
01:29:49,560 --> 01:29:53,399
men and women and why suffragette nonsense is an earlier

1440
01:29:53,479 --> 01:29:56,640
version of feminism. That is, by the way, what Trent

1441
01:29:56,720 --> 01:30:01,199
Horn openly defends. He says he's a male femin But

1442
01:30:01,319 --> 01:30:04,960
Rachel Wilson is absolutely correct in her book A called Feminism,

1443
01:30:05,000 --> 01:30:10,880
where she says you could not have today's trends without

1444
01:30:11,000 --> 01:30:15,680
all the waves of feminism, including the first one. Even

1445
01:30:15,720 --> 01:30:20,720
the first one was an intentional social revolution to upend

1446
01:30:21,560 --> 01:30:25,760
male female dynamics. And as Tim has hammered home and

1447
01:30:25,800 --> 01:30:28,319
as Lyla Rose and these other people like Tim Trent

1448
01:30:28,319 --> 01:30:33,239
Horne don't get, is feminism is the original gender dys

1449
01:30:33,239 --> 01:30:36,800
for you, not because it's teaching the Tierra and z

1450
01:30:36,960 --> 01:30:41,039
stuff explicitly, but because it's beginning to plant the seeds

1451
01:30:41,520 --> 01:30:44,319
of women taking the role of men and men taking

1452
01:30:44,359 --> 01:30:48,520
a step back. Hands off, let the women, let the

1453
01:30:48,560 --> 01:30:49,720
slag queens do their shit.

1454
01:30:49,800 --> 01:30:53,720
Speaker 6: Bro or actually see these people in the arena debating

1455
01:30:53,800 --> 01:30:56,720
these social issues with anybody. They'll do abortion, debate things

1456
01:30:56,760 --> 01:31:00,079
like this, but I never see them surrounded with a

1457
01:31:00,239 --> 01:31:03,960
panel of like the worst degenerates on earth, debating all

1458
01:31:04,000 --> 01:31:07,079
of their worldview simultaneously. But they have tons of criticisms

1459
01:31:07,079 --> 01:31:08,479
for people who do, and I'm like.

1460
01:31:08,439 --> 01:31:09,159
Speaker 1: Well, where are you now.

1461
01:31:09,199 --> 01:31:12,039
Speaker 2: I'm sympathetic to some of Andrew's criticism. For example, I'll

1462
01:31:12,039 --> 01:31:14,640
get people who criticize how I debate non Catholics like

1463
01:31:14,720 --> 01:31:17,760
Gavin Ortland or Alex O'Connor and say I'm too nice

1464
01:31:17,840 --> 01:31:20,479
or I'm not blunt enough, to which I say, Okay,

1465
01:31:20,600 --> 01:31:24,000
then why don't you debate the best defenders of Protestantism

1466
01:31:24,079 --> 01:31:26,640
or atheism and show us how it's done.

1467
01:31:26,479 --> 01:31:31,000
Speaker 1: By the way, I've tried that, and Alex O'Connor, funny enough,

1468
01:31:31,319 --> 01:31:34,119
will not debate me and decline to debate me on

1469
01:31:34,159 --> 01:31:36,640
more than one occasion, but he will debate Trent Horn?

1470
01:31:36,840 --> 01:31:38,600
What does that tell you? That tells you that there

1471
01:31:38,600 --> 01:31:42,600
are certain people that they're so soft that they're not

1472
01:31:42,680 --> 01:31:46,159
afraid to debate with. But everybody knows that they will

1473
01:31:46,159 --> 01:31:48,720
not debate me, including Trent Horne, who won't do a

1474
01:31:48,760 --> 01:31:51,279
new debate with me. You blocked him so he could

1475
01:31:51,279 --> 01:31:53,920
he debate you. I blocked him because he already said

1476
01:31:54,000 --> 01:31:56,760
months ago he won't debate, and I have no interest

1477
01:31:56,760 --> 01:31:57,920
in interacting with him anymore.

1478
01:31:58,119 --> 01:32:01,520
Speaker 2: That's one Andrew's criticism is Simil, don't critique how I

1479
01:32:01,560 --> 01:32:04,960
engage people unless you're willing to engage them yourself. But

1480
01:32:05,039 --> 01:32:07,680
I don't see how this criticism applies to me. In particular,

1481
01:32:07,960 --> 01:32:10,760
I used to do debates surrounded by college students, and

1482
01:32:10,760 --> 01:32:12,960
now I focus on just engaging the best defenders of

1483
01:32:12,960 --> 01:32:15,000
other worldviews in one on one debates.

1484
01:32:15,319 --> 01:32:18,640
Speaker 1: But Trent, you just said in your previous video that

1485
01:32:19,439 --> 01:32:22,000
you don't like debates anymore. So are you going to

1486
01:32:22,000 --> 01:32:23,920
do debates or are you not going to do debates?

1487
01:32:23,920 --> 01:32:27,760
And why would you not debate the position that I've

1488
01:32:27,760 --> 01:32:30,920
been hammering for several years now, which is causing quite

1489
01:32:30,920 --> 01:32:33,000
a few people to leave your church. In fact, I'll

1490
01:32:33,000 --> 01:32:36,239
show you comments of people saying that they are now

1491
01:32:36,319 --> 01:32:39,520
leaving the Roman Catholic Church because of the arguments that

1492
01:32:39,560 --> 01:32:43,239
we're making, including the geopolitical arguments. Why do none of

1493
01:32:43,239 --> 01:32:46,159
the Roman Catholics want to address this issue? And you

1494
01:32:46,239 --> 01:32:48,840
can keep pretending that, oh, it's a dumb argument. I

1495
01:32:48,840 --> 01:32:51,000
don't want to listen to a good keep pretending that,

1496
01:32:51,079 --> 01:32:53,119
because that's not going to keep people in the Roman

1497
01:32:53,119 --> 01:32:56,279
Catholic Church, I assure you, nor will the constant piety

1498
01:32:56,399 --> 01:32:59,600
signaling in moral signaling that will keep the lowest to

1499
01:32:59,640 --> 01:33:02,199
your peace people there. But maybe that's what you want.

1500
01:33:02,479 --> 01:33:05,000
Speaker 2: I've applied to beyond Jubilee, and I'm open to being

1501
01:33:05,039 --> 01:33:07,600
on panels with hostile opponents, but I don't want to

1502
01:33:07,640 --> 01:33:10,560
engage in a fruitless shouting match. I'm also not sure

1503
01:33:10,600 --> 01:33:13,159
if I want to do something like a whatever podcast discussion,

1504
01:33:13,479 --> 01:33:15,960
because one of its main effects is just giving free

1505
01:33:15,960 --> 01:33:19,479
publicity to OnlyFans pornographers. Though it can be a good

1506
01:33:19,479 --> 01:33:22,840
place to evangelize these people. But even in environments like

1507
01:33:22,840 --> 01:33:26,199
the whatever podcasts or Jubilee, there are political Christians like

1508
01:33:26,279 --> 01:33:29,359
Charlie Kirk or Michael Knowles who have done well without

1509
01:33:29,399 --> 01:33:32,479
resorting to the more aggressive tactics that Andrew Wilson uses.

1510
01:33:32,600 --> 01:33:34,520
Speaker 6: And where are you, by the way, when anybody wants

1511
01:33:34,560 --> 01:33:38,520
to debate you on why it is that you're so

1512
01:33:38,560 --> 01:33:42,439
inactive when it comes to the culture war and social issues, right,

1513
01:33:42,560 --> 01:33:44,800
they turn all that stuff down. They refuse to argue

1514
01:33:44,800 --> 01:33:47,119
with the red pillars, They refuse to argue with any

1515
01:33:47,159 --> 01:33:50,359
of these people. They literally just refuse to engage. Tons

1516
01:33:50,399 --> 01:33:53,560
of criticisms, absolute refusal to engage when it comes.

1517
01:33:53,560 --> 01:33:56,920
Speaker 1: And the same thing applies to the apologetics domain from

1518
01:33:56,960 --> 01:34:00,720
this whole crowd of moral piety signalers. Yes, Trent did

1519
01:34:00,720 --> 01:34:02,960
a debate with me five or six years ago, but

1520
01:34:03,800 --> 01:34:06,319
he won't do it again. And what has been the

1521
01:34:06,359 --> 01:34:09,800
constant refrain and the excuse, Oh, he's too mean, he's

1522
01:34:09,800 --> 01:34:12,840
too mean, he's too mean again, an effeminate excuse to

1523
01:34:12,920 --> 01:34:17,199
not debate when we've already shown that in a formal setting,

1524
01:34:17,479 --> 01:34:20,000
I can absolutely be civil to you and we can

1525
01:34:20,039 --> 01:34:22,279
have no meanness. There was no meanness in the debate

1526
01:34:22,359 --> 01:34:24,800
that I had with Trent Horn, so he knows that

1527
01:34:24,840 --> 01:34:30,039
there was. There's no there's no infallible necessity to me

1528
01:34:30,239 --> 01:34:33,119
being mean to him. And imagine even being at this

1529
01:34:33,199 --> 01:34:37,279
stage where actual men in the public sphere are saying

1530
01:34:37,319 --> 01:34:40,880
they won't engage in a debate because people are mean.

1531
01:34:41,119 --> 01:34:45,399
This is so fake and gay Just that alone is fake.

1532
01:34:45,239 --> 01:34:47,880
Speaker 2: And gay a culture war issues. I'm not sure what

1533
01:34:47,960 --> 01:34:50,960
Andrew means. I did a discussion with alex A playing

1534
01:34:50,960 --> 01:34:53,800
with Fire on premarital sex, which is fruitful. And I

1535
01:34:53,840 --> 01:34:56,399
debated Pearl on men in marriage, which felt like banging

1536
01:34:56,439 --> 01:34:57,399
my head against a wall.

1537
01:34:57,479 --> 01:35:00,199
Speaker 9: And how do you think a man should approach the

1538
01:35:00,199 --> 01:35:01,520
subject of headship.

1539
01:35:01,199 --> 01:35:02,520
Speaker 1: In their marriage? What does that mean?

1540
01:35:02,680 --> 01:35:05,720
Speaker 3: I think it's more that women should be obedient to

1541
01:35:05,760 --> 01:35:06,840
their husbands and all things.

1542
01:35:06,840 --> 01:35:09,439
Speaker 1: Do you agree with, Trent, though, as long as it's rational.

1543
01:35:09,159 --> 01:35:11,039
Speaker 3: I see a lot of women weaponize that.

1544
01:35:11,159 --> 01:35:15,239
Speaker 9: But yeah, just as husbands should correct their wives if

1545
01:35:15,239 --> 01:35:17,239
they have a really bad idea that could hurt the marriage,

1546
01:35:17,560 --> 01:35:19,800
wives have that same role because husbands sometimes get pretty

1547
01:35:19,800 --> 01:35:22,199
bad ideas that could be hard haul. Yeah, but who

1548
01:35:22,600 --> 01:35:25,960
determines it the human brain in the marriage?

1549
01:35:26,039 --> 01:35:26,840
Speaker 8: Yes, so the men.

1550
01:35:29,880 --> 01:35:30,039
Speaker 4: Yes?

1551
01:35:30,279 --> 01:35:32,960
Speaker 2: And in this debate, we know which side is the

1552
01:35:32,960 --> 01:35:33,720
more rational one?

1553
01:35:33,760 --> 01:35:37,680
Speaker 1: Right in our message, Trent thought that was an own. No, Trent,

1554
01:35:37,680 --> 01:35:39,920
I don't think you understood that. Actually, wasn't an own

1555
01:35:40,479 --> 01:35:44,039
like whatever you think of Pearl, Pearl was correct in

1556
01:35:44,119 --> 01:35:47,520
that statement, in your attempt to try to equalize the

1557
01:35:47,560 --> 01:35:51,640
idea of headship, which is this equalitarian position that many

1558
01:35:51,760 --> 01:35:55,760
Roman Catholics take that Tim Gordon h is so behement

1559
01:35:55,920 --> 01:36:00,720
to oppose. I mean, bro, did you not catch that? Now? Again?

1560
01:36:01,079 --> 01:36:04,680
Roman Catholics said, Jay, you clipped Trent? You clip Trent H?

1561
01:36:05,000 --> 01:36:07,760
What has Trent done throughout this whole video? Oh? Eclips

1562
01:36:08,079 --> 01:36:11,600
ten twenty second clips of people? So I'm confused. Is

1563
01:36:11,600 --> 01:36:16,319
it dishonest to clip people? Or is it actually okay?

1564
01:36:16,399 --> 01:36:19,800
Because many many Roman Catholics went after me for my

1565
01:36:20,039 --> 01:36:22,680
short calling out Trent saying that the way that we

1566
01:36:22,720 --> 01:36:26,159
know Catholic dogma is when it's manifestly evident. They said, well,

1567
01:36:26,199 --> 01:36:31,439
you shouldn't clip him. This is so dishonest. Trent is clipping?

1568
01:36:31,479 --> 01:36:32,520
What do you mean change?

1569
01:36:32,560 --> 01:36:36,239
Speaker 2: Andrews said that Christian apologists don't focus on dating culture,

1570
01:36:36,399 --> 01:36:40,520
world affairs, policy, politics, and prescriptions. Well, in many cases

1571
01:36:40,560 --> 01:36:43,680
that's because our own audience and critics tell us to

1572
01:36:43,720 --> 01:36:44,199
stay in our