WEBVTT 1 00:00:03.919 --> 00:00:06.480 You are listening to the IFAH podcast Network. 2 00:00:06.639 --> 00:00:10.160 For more amazing filmmaking and screenwriting podcasts, just go to 3 00:00:10.359 --> 00:00:12.720 ifahpodcastnetwork dot com. 4 00:00:12.839 --> 00:00:16.480 Welcome to the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, Episode number four thirty eight. 5 00:00:16.640 --> 00:00:19.559 Your dream doesn't have an expiration date, Take a deep 6 00:00:19.600 --> 00:00:22.640 breath and try again. Kat You Whitten. 7 00:00:22.960 --> 00:00:26.480 Broadcasting from a dark, windowless room in Hollywood when we 8 00:00:26.559 --> 00:00:29.000 really should be working on that next draft. It's the 9 00:00:29.079 --> 00:00:33.240 Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, showing you the craft and business of 10 00:00:33.240 --> 00:00:36.640 screenwriting while teaching you how to make your screenplay bulletproof. 11 00:00:36.960 --> 00:00:42.119 And here's your host, Alex Ferrari. Welcome, Welcome to another 12 00:00:42.159 --> 00:00:44.520 episode of the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast. I am your. 13 00:00:44.479 --> 00:00:46.000 Humble host Alex Ferrari. 14 00:00:46.520 --> 00:00:46.679 Now. 15 00:00:46.719 --> 00:00:51.560 Today's show is sponsored by Bulletproof Script Coverage. Now. Unlike 16 00:00:51.679 --> 00:00:56.479 other script coverage services, Bulletproof Script Coverage actually focuses on 17 00:00:56.719 --> 00:00:59.320 the kind of project you are in the goals of 18 00:00:59.320 --> 00:01:01.840 the project you are, so we actually break it down 19 00:01:01.880 --> 00:01:06.040 by three categories micro budget, indie film, market, and studio film. 20 00:01:06.120 --> 00:01:08.280 There's no reason to get coverage from a reader that 21 00:01:08.319 --> 00:01:10.599 she used to reading temp pole movies when your movie 22 00:01:10.680 --> 00:01:13.079 is going to be done for one hundred thousand dollars 23 00:01:13.159 --> 00:01:16.040 and we wanted to focus on that. At Bulletproof Script Coverage, 24 00:01:16.319 --> 00:01:21.799 our readers have worked with Marvel Studios, CIA, wme E, NBC, HBO, Disney, 25 00:01:22.239 --> 00:01:25.640 Scott Free, Warner Brothers, The Blacklist, and many many more. 26 00:01:25.719 --> 00:01:29.120 So if you need your screenplay or TV script covered 27 00:01:29.359 --> 00:01:34.680 by professional readers, head on over to covermiscreenplay dot Com. 28 00:01:34.920 --> 00:01:38.519 Enjoy today's episode with guest host Dave Bullis. 29 00:01:39.760 --> 00:01:42.400 So, my guest today is a literary manager and script 30 00:01:42.439 --> 00:01:45.439 consultant and she runs her own consulting agency. And we 31 00:01:45.519 --> 00:01:47.840 discussed that very question, what does it take to make 32 00:01:47.879 --> 00:01:49.480 it to the next level? And we all know what 33 00:01:49.519 --> 00:01:55.000 that next level is, and that's all really very subjective, 34 00:01:55.599 --> 00:01:57.879 and I want to make sure everyone knows that because 35 00:01:58.280 --> 00:02:00.159 if you know, if you have a reader script for 36 00:02:00.359 --> 00:02:02.560 your next level is writing a script. If you've written 37 00:02:02.560 --> 00:02:04.640 ten scripts in your next levels, you want to get representation, 38 00:02:04.680 --> 00:02:06.640 you have representation in your next level? Is you want 39 00:02:06.680 --> 00:02:09.000 to get it made by an A list cast and crew. 40 00:02:09.960 --> 00:02:15.719 Sounds simple, right with guests Whitney Davis, Hey, Whitney, thanks 41 00:02:15.719 --> 00:02:16.759 a lot for coming on the show. 42 00:02:17.120 --> 00:02:18.520 Hey, thank you for having me. 43 00:02:19.840 --> 00:02:21.719 You know, my my pleasure. You know, it's funny we 44 00:02:21.719 --> 00:02:23.680 were trying to get a hold each other for a while. Now, 45 00:02:24.199 --> 00:02:26.039 who would you just keep missing each other? But I'm 46 00:02:26.039 --> 00:02:31.400 so glad we could finally connect because you know, I 47 00:02:31.639 --> 00:02:35.159 saw your bio and you have a really really cool bio, 48 00:02:35.199 --> 00:02:37.199 and I said, I got to get Whitney on the podcast. 49 00:02:38.719 --> 00:02:39.520 Well thanks. 50 00:02:39.599 --> 00:02:41.840 It's been quite a journey, that. 51 00:02:41.879 --> 00:02:42.560 Is for sure. 52 00:02:44.000 --> 00:02:46.479 Yeah, And I actually wanted to ask about that journey, 53 00:02:46.479 --> 00:02:48.360 and I wanted to ask, you know, Whitney, how did 54 00:02:48.439 --> 00:02:53.120 you get started, you know, in the whole literary management business, 55 00:02:53.120 --> 00:02:55.439 and how did you get involved in the consulting business. 56 00:02:55.879 --> 00:02:57.639 So basically what I'm asking is where did this whole 57 00:02:57.719 --> 00:02:58.240 journey start? 58 00:02:58.360 --> 00:03:00.560 Oh my gosh, this crazy story. 59 00:03:01.280 --> 00:03:04.759 And to make it short, because it obviously has been 60 00:03:04.800 --> 00:03:07.439 a ten year journey. Essentially, I was in the right 61 00:03:07.479 --> 00:03:10.039 place at the right time, with the right person. 62 00:03:10.319 --> 00:03:11.840 Is how this whole journey started. 63 00:03:12.199 --> 00:03:15.159 About ten years ago, I had moved to Los Angeles 64 00:03:15.199 --> 00:03:17.120 with zero aspirations to be. 65 00:03:17.080 --> 00:03:19.560 In the entertainment in the three It wasn't even really. 66 00:03:19.280 --> 00:03:22.319 On my radar, and I had always thought I was 67 00:03:22.360 --> 00:03:25.000 going to be a novelist. Actually that if I ever 68 00:03:25.240 --> 00:03:27.719 really sat down and put pen to paper, which I 69 00:03:27.719 --> 00:03:29.840 think is something that a lot of people struggle with 70 00:03:29.960 --> 00:03:32.960 actually getting started. That if I ever actually got started 71 00:03:32.960 --> 00:03:34.439 that I was going to write a book. 72 00:03:34.479 --> 00:03:36.280 And I was actually at a party. 73 00:03:35.919 --> 00:03:37.840 And this woman approached me and I didn't know who 74 00:03:37.879 --> 00:03:39.599 she was or what she did, and she asked me 75 00:03:39.639 --> 00:03:41.639 what I was doing was myself and I was like, well, 76 00:03:42.000 --> 00:03:44.680 I'm actually raising a baby. And she's like, but no, honey, really, 77 00:03:44.719 --> 00:03:46.199 I mean, what do you want to do? And I 78 00:03:46.240 --> 00:03:48.039 was like, well, you know, maybe I'll write a book, 79 00:03:48.280 --> 00:03:50.599 And so she started asking me about it, and when 80 00:03:50.639 --> 00:03:53.520 I told her about this concept for my book, her 81 00:03:53.560 --> 00:03:55.800 face just dropped and she was like, I'm going to 82 00:03:55.879 --> 00:03:57.680 have my assistant contact to you tomorrow. 83 00:03:57.680 --> 00:03:59.840 And I was like, what is that? 84 00:04:00.400 --> 00:04:03.319 And so her assistant actually did come over the next day, 85 00:04:03.400 --> 00:04:05.680 and I kid you not, this never happens. That was 86 00:04:05.759 --> 00:04:10.719 a stack of TV pilot screeners like DVDs and a 87 00:04:10.759 --> 00:04:13.120 stack of TV pilots and they said, forget your book. 88 00:04:13.120 --> 00:04:16.240 Concepts were turning it into an original television series. And 89 00:04:16.279 --> 00:04:18.519 she happened to be a TV lit agent with William 90 00:04:18.560 --> 00:04:21.360 Morris at the time. And so that is how I 91 00:04:21.399 --> 00:04:24.839 got my start and to segue into the other part 92 00:04:24.879 --> 00:04:27.680 of it. You know, I started in the television business, 93 00:04:27.720 --> 00:04:30.800 and then the ryer strike happened, and so people started 94 00:04:30.879 --> 00:04:33.040 Once I was out of work, people started bringing me 95 00:04:33.079 --> 00:04:34.959 their scripts just being like, hey, can you look this 96 00:04:35.040 --> 00:04:37.279 over since you already kind of broke in, And I. 97 00:04:37.279 --> 00:04:39.319 Was like sure, and so I did it for free 98 00:04:39.360 --> 00:04:40.920 for a while because they didn't know any better. 99 00:04:41.079 --> 00:04:43.000 And then I was like, maybe I should charge and 100 00:04:43.040 --> 00:04:45.279 people will go away, and then it just got worse 101 00:04:46.079 --> 00:04:48.920 and so I just did script development for a long 102 00:04:48.959 --> 00:04:52.720 time and then crazy enough again, this just organically occurred. 103 00:04:52.800 --> 00:04:55.240 Some of my clients that were starting to do well 104 00:04:55.319 --> 00:04:58.319 in the contest asked if I would consider managing them, 105 00:04:58.360 --> 00:05:00.920 and I said no for a long time, and then 106 00:05:00.959 --> 00:05:03.000 it was just like I was actually already kind of 107 00:05:03.120 --> 00:05:06.040 orchestrating meetings, and so I finally just said what the heck, 108 00:05:06.199 --> 00:05:09.040 and I just jumped in with both feet. 109 00:05:09.279 --> 00:05:11.480 So that is how I got to where I am today, 110 00:05:11.560 --> 00:05:14.000 in a nutshell, very crazy. 111 00:05:15.639 --> 00:05:18.600 So when you when you first moved to LA, was 112 00:05:18.639 --> 00:05:20.959 there a reason that you moved to LA Because I 113 00:05:20.959 --> 00:05:21.920 know you said you didn't want to be in the 114 00:05:22.000 --> 00:05:23.360 entertainment business at that point. 115 00:05:24.639 --> 00:05:27.000 So my husband at the time, he was there for 116 00:05:27.079 --> 00:05:30.759 grad school and so he had come to UCLA to. 117 00:05:32.279 --> 00:05:33.480 Get his master's degree. 118 00:05:33.480 --> 00:05:36.560 And I actually had applied to be an English teacher 119 00:05:36.560 --> 00:05:38.720 at Santa Monica High School, but then I found out 120 00:05:38.759 --> 00:05:41.079 I was pregnant. So I just decided the baby was 121 00:05:41.079 --> 00:05:43.839 coming in December, which was going to be in the 122 00:05:43.839 --> 00:05:44.600 middle of the years. 123 00:05:44.759 --> 00:05:47.519 I just actually decided not to teach at all. 124 00:05:47.560 --> 00:05:51.120 And again, like it was just the perfect timing that, right, 125 00:05:51.199 --> 00:05:53.000 you know, right after the baby was born and I 126 00:05:53.079 --> 00:05:55.800 was kind of had my feet back, you know, up 127 00:05:55.839 --> 00:05:59.639 again that I ran into this woman and started developing 128 00:05:59.680 --> 00:06:03.480 my TV series and all that. So it was just 129 00:06:03.920 --> 00:06:06.120 and it was hilarious because I was so green, I 130 00:06:06.120 --> 00:06:07.079 didn't know anything. 131 00:06:07.160 --> 00:06:08.839 Like I was just like, oh, this is kind of cool. 132 00:06:08.839 --> 00:06:11.680 But now looking back on it, I'm like, oh, my gosh, 133 00:06:11.720 --> 00:06:13.040 what an amazing opportunity. 134 00:06:13.079 --> 00:06:15.079 Like people would have killed to be in my position. 135 00:06:15.160 --> 00:06:17.639 And I was just kind of like doodling along like 136 00:06:17.680 --> 00:06:20.279 it was no big deal. But now looking back at is, 137 00:06:20.319 --> 00:06:22.920 I'm like, Wow, what an amazing you know, what an 138 00:06:22.959 --> 00:06:27.079 amazing blessing and opportunities to just not have been afraid, 139 00:06:27.720 --> 00:06:29.959 you know, I just didn't know anything, and I wasn't jaded, 140 00:06:30.000 --> 00:06:32.439 so I wasn't afraid to open up my mouth and say, 141 00:06:32.439 --> 00:06:33.519 oh yeah, here's my idea. 142 00:06:33.519 --> 00:06:36.720 And I essentially pitched her without knowing I was pitching her. 143 00:06:36.759 --> 00:06:39.199 So that's what I always tell people, that they just 144 00:06:39.279 --> 00:06:42.000 need to do their pitches. You know, when they pitch, 145 00:06:42.360 --> 00:06:44.160 they just need to do their pitches like they're having 146 00:06:44.240 --> 00:06:46.839 a conversation, because whoever they're pitching is just a human 147 00:06:46.879 --> 00:06:48.759 being like you and me. All they want is to 148 00:06:48.800 --> 00:06:51.600 hear a great story. And I think people get really 149 00:06:51.639 --> 00:06:53.720 nervous at the thought of pitching. But you know, the 150 00:06:53.759 --> 00:06:56.480 other person listening to your pitch isn't like a unicorn, 151 00:06:56.639 --> 00:06:59.000 like they just you know, they're just a regular human 152 00:06:59.040 --> 00:07:00.879 who wants to find material. 153 00:07:00.959 --> 00:07:03.079 And so I just say, hey, the best way to 154 00:07:03.120 --> 00:07:04.639 pitch is just having a conversation. 155 00:07:04.959 --> 00:07:07.000 You know, that's the best, the best advice I can 156 00:07:07.040 --> 00:07:09.319 give on that, because that's how it happened for me. 157 00:07:09.439 --> 00:07:12.079 It didn't even know it that it was happening, so 158 00:07:12.399 --> 00:07:12.959 it was great. 159 00:07:14.399 --> 00:07:16.720 It's like what Dan Harmon said about you know, he 160 00:07:16.959 --> 00:07:20.360 gave advice to pitching, and his advice was have you 161 00:07:20.600 --> 00:07:22.160 He said when you ever when you're ever going out 162 00:07:22.160 --> 00:07:23.839 there and you tell your friends about some movie and 163 00:07:23.839 --> 00:07:25.600 they go, oh, should I see that movie? And and 164 00:07:25.639 --> 00:07:28.879 you say yeah, And then your friends says, well what happens? Well, okay, 165 00:07:28.959 --> 00:07:30.439 let me tell you what happens in the movie. He 166 00:07:30.480 --> 00:07:32.800 says that, right there is how you should pitch to people. 167 00:07:33.040 --> 00:07:36.000 He goes, just just telling them about this really cool thing. 168 00:07:36.360 --> 00:07:39.000 Yes, And I think that there's so much pressure these 169 00:07:39.120 --> 00:07:42.639 days for you know, how to pitch, and I really 170 00:07:42.680 --> 00:07:46.680 think there is no you know, formula if you would say, 171 00:07:46.720 --> 00:07:49.519 I mean, I think everybody's so individual that I just 172 00:07:49.839 --> 00:07:52.240 I mean, I did Great American Pitchfest in May, and 173 00:07:52.279 --> 00:07:54.439 I was really amazed. Like I sat and probably listened 174 00:07:54.480 --> 00:07:56.720 to one hundred and fifty pitches, and there was a 175 00:07:56.759 --> 00:08:00.480 real big difference to the ones who were pitching comfortable 176 00:08:00.720 --> 00:08:03.439 and like knwed their story well as opposed to those 177 00:08:03.720 --> 00:08:06.199 who were trying I felt like to follow a very 178 00:08:06.240 --> 00:08:09.519 formula pitch that like they're like like, I'm not doing this, 179 00:08:09.560 --> 00:08:11.240 and you know, I could just tell that they were 180 00:08:11.279 --> 00:08:13.519 tied up and am I giving them the right information 181 00:08:13.600 --> 00:08:15.639 in the right in the right sequence. 182 00:08:15.720 --> 00:08:16.120 I guess? 183 00:08:16.480 --> 00:08:18.680 So yeah, I mean that's just something that I really 184 00:08:18.720 --> 00:08:22.759 love to talk to people about is just pitching bravely, 185 00:08:23.040 --> 00:08:25.920 like not being afraid to just say what they want 186 00:08:25.959 --> 00:08:28.439 to say and not worrying about a formula or anything 187 00:08:28.519 --> 00:08:28.759 like that. 188 00:08:29.399 --> 00:08:30.279 So I love it. 189 00:08:31.600 --> 00:08:33.399 So are you Are you still working with that with 190 00:08:33.480 --> 00:08:34.480 the Asian manager? 191 00:08:35.879 --> 00:08:35.960 No? 192 00:08:36.360 --> 00:08:39.159 Actually, I mean we are still on great terms. But 193 00:08:39.639 --> 00:08:42.320 after the like I said, after the so we kind 194 00:08:42.320 --> 00:08:46.039 of went through the pitching process of pitching my series 195 00:08:46.080 --> 00:08:47.879 at the time, and they had married me. For a 196 00:08:47.879 --> 00:08:49.879 lot of writers that don't know this, I think that 197 00:08:50.399 --> 00:08:54.000 a lot of you know, getting into the TV industry 198 00:08:54.320 --> 00:08:56.919 is or any you know, whether it be feature or 199 00:08:57.080 --> 00:09:00.320 film or feature film or TV, it's just like really 200 00:09:00.399 --> 00:09:05.120 understanding the business aspect of being a writer. So you know, 201 00:09:05.200 --> 00:09:07.200 I was like, oh, I'm going to sell this pilot, 202 00:09:07.200 --> 00:09:09.600 blah blah blah. But really it was just, you know, 203 00:09:09.600 --> 00:09:11.759 when we went on our general meetings, they just wanted 204 00:09:11.799 --> 00:09:13.879 to see what kind of a writer I was and 205 00:09:13.919 --> 00:09:16.799 what my personality was, and so I thought I just 206 00:09:16.840 --> 00:09:21.919 had all of my expectations like turned upside down. So anyway, 207 00:09:22.000 --> 00:09:24.480 after we pitched it and I didn't it didn't get bought, 208 00:09:24.519 --> 00:09:26.840 but I got hired we went through that, and then 209 00:09:26.840 --> 00:09:30.440 once the once the writers strike happened and I had 210 00:09:30.440 --> 00:09:32.600 the baby and things were getting crazy, I just I 211 00:09:32.679 --> 00:09:35.000 decided to just go with the script consulting and we 212 00:09:35.039 --> 00:09:37.080 just kind of parted ways amicably. But it was just 213 00:09:37.120 --> 00:09:40.039 because I kind of decided not to go back into 214 00:09:40.120 --> 00:09:42.600 a writer's room per se, because it was just more 215 00:09:43.440 --> 00:09:46.799 amenable to being a mom doing this scripts consulting thing, 216 00:09:46.879 --> 00:09:48.919 and put I get so much. 217 00:09:50.240 --> 00:09:52.720 We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor, 218 00:09:56.360 --> 00:09:57.639 and now back to the show. 219 00:09:59.360 --> 00:10:03.879 Satisfact out of people, out of helping people develop their concepts. 220 00:10:03.879 --> 00:10:06.080 Look it really, I really love that. 221 00:10:06.240 --> 00:10:08.919 So I think that's line management was a natural segue 222 00:10:09.039 --> 00:10:12.360 for me because there's so much of that in managing 223 00:10:12.440 --> 00:10:15.639 someone and helping them, you know, get to the next 224 00:10:15.720 --> 00:10:18.639 level and developing their ideas and being a sounding board. 225 00:10:18.720 --> 00:10:21.440 So to answer question, no, I'm not with that agent anymore. 226 00:10:21.440 --> 00:10:23.840 But we you know, it just was a natural kind 227 00:10:23.840 --> 00:10:26.320 of break and we're still on great terms. And I 228 00:10:26.360 --> 00:10:29.000 fear every so often that she's a caa now. 229 00:10:29.039 --> 00:10:31.000 Actually so she even moved since then. 230 00:10:31.120 --> 00:10:34.879 But yeah, so you know, you brought about moving to 231 00:10:34.919 --> 00:10:38.360 the next level, you know, as you know, as some 232 00:10:38.399 --> 00:10:40.720 of the questions as you can see that came in Whitney, 233 00:10:40.840 --> 00:10:42.840 I think that's a hot button issue for a lot 234 00:10:42.879 --> 00:10:45.480 of people, is moving to that next level, you know, 235 00:10:45.639 --> 00:10:49.000 And so spoiler alert for everyone listening, that's some of 236 00:10:49.039 --> 00:10:51.039 the that's some of the questions that have come in. 237 00:10:51.559 --> 00:10:53.639 But but before we get before we get to that, 238 00:10:53.720 --> 00:10:55.559 I just want to ask, you know, Whitney, you know 239 00:10:55.759 --> 00:10:58.879 you have worked under people like Steve Kaplan and Jen Grasani, 240 00:10:59.519 --> 00:11:01.320 Lee jes Up by the way, they've all been on 241 00:11:01.360 --> 00:11:05.879 the podcast. It's them all. Well, so, so how did 242 00:11:05.879 --> 00:11:07.919 you end up working, you know, with a lot of 243 00:11:07.960 --> 00:11:09.960 these people in the field, because these are all, you know, 244 00:11:10.000 --> 00:11:12.480 well known people. Again you you've worked with Steve Kaplan, 245 00:11:12.759 --> 00:11:17.200 Jen Grassani, Lead Jessup, John Truby, Chris Voldler. You know, 246 00:11:17.320 --> 00:11:19.399 how did you end up working and meeting with all 247 00:11:19.440 --> 00:11:19.919 these people? 248 00:11:20.120 --> 00:11:20.600 You know what? 249 00:11:21.000 --> 00:11:25.639 Honestly, I sauce them out, Like I was just like, 250 00:11:25.759 --> 00:11:27.559 if I'm going to do this, and I want to 251 00:11:27.639 --> 00:11:31.000 learn and you know, learn from the best, and so 252 00:11:31.120 --> 00:11:33.799 I just made an effort, you know, to save like 253 00:11:33.879 --> 00:11:35.759 this is kind of in that journey where I was 254 00:11:35.840 --> 00:11:38.399 it was kind of this weird in between period where 255 00:11:38.399 --> 00:11:40.480 I was doing the scripture consulting and was kind of 256 00:11:40.480 --> 00:11:43.159 deciding like as I personally wanted, and I guess I'm 257 00:11:43.240 --> 00:11:46.360 kind of an entrepreneur in that degree, deciding if I 258 00:11:46.399 --> 00:11:48.879 wanted to take my career to the next levels and 259 00:11:49.120 --> 00:11:52.279 going into management, and so I just knew who the 260 00:11:52.320 --> 00:11:54.360 experts in the field were, and I was just like, 261 00:11:54.399 --> 00:11:56.279 you know what, I'm going to go. I'm going to 262 00:11:56.360 --> 00:11:57.799 find them out. I'm going to seek them out and 263 00:11:57.840 --> 00:11:59.919 find them and talk to them. And so essentially I 264 00:12:00.200 --> 00:12:02.000 just kind of made like a business plan that I 265 00:12:02.080 --> 00:12:04.240 was going to save up certain amounts of money and 266 00:12:04.279 --> 00:12:06.960 like invest in myself to go to their classes and 267 00:12:07.080 --> 00:12:11.120 meet them and start relationship with them. And so that 268 00:12:11.320 --> 00:12:14.159 I think is part of where why I am where 269 00:12:14.159 --> 00:12:16.960 I am today because I wasn't afraid and I was like, 270 00:12:16.960 --> 00:12:19.000 I'm going to do whatever it takes to just kind 271 00:12:19.000 --> 00:12:21.600 of get get in front of these people and meet 272 00:12:21.639 --> 00:12:24.919 them and talk to them, and so you know, and 273 00:12:24.960 --> 00:12:26.960 then it's start being crazy that like we I mean, 274 00:12:26.960 --> 00:12:29.159 it's such a small world. And now that I'm kind 275 00:12:29.159 --> 00:12:32.440 of getting into that world with them, like I see 276 00:12:32.440 --> 00:12:35.440 them everywhere, Like I was just with Jen and New York. 277 00:12:35.559 --> 00:12:39.639 We were doing a conference together and I see lead 278 00:12:39.720 --> 00:12:42.320 Jess up and like, I'm helping Steve with his comedy 279 00:12:42.360 --> 00:12:45.080 class in January. So, I mean, that's how I did 280 00:12:45.159 --> 00:12:48.399 it was I just took the initiative myself and went out, 281 00:12:48.480 --> 00:12:50.519 was like, I want to be associated with the people 282 00:12:50.519 --> 00:12:52.200 who know what they're doing, and I just took the 283 00:12:52.200 --> 00:12:55.840 initiative to go find them and to build relationship with them. 284 00:12:55.840 --> 00:12:59.799 Actually, so that's how it happened. I just wasn't afraid, 285 00:12:59.879 --> 00:13:03.039 I guess. So I hope that answers the question. 286 00:13:04.360 --> 00:13:06.399 So, I mean, you know, with the advent of the Internet, 287 00:13:06.600 --> 00:13:09.519 I think it's made you know, everything a little easier 288 00:13:09.600 --> 00:13:11.360 and a little harder at the same time. And one 289 00:13:11.399 --> 00:13:13.759 of the things that's made a little easier is finding 290 00:13:13.759 --> 00:13:15.600 these people because you know, all the people that we 291 00:13:15.679 --> 00:13:20.320 just mentioned, they all have websites, yes, and so did 292 00:13:20.399 --> 00:13:22.759 you did you find them through their websites or did 293 00:13:22.840 --> 00:13:25.000 you bump into them maybe at a conference Goop? 294 00:13:25.120 --> 00:13:27.799 You know, I bumped into him all at conferences. 295 00:13:27.879 --> 00:13:30.039 I mean I knew people in the industry and I 296 00:13:30.039 --> 00:13:32.279 had just been hearing about these people, and so like 297 00:13:32.399 --> 00:13:33.919 I either attended I. 298 00:13:33.919 --> 00:13:35.240 Mean I met them all in person. 299 00:13:35.440 --> 00:13:37.399 I made an effort and again this is hard if 300 00:13:37.399 --> 00:13:39.360 you're not local to LA, because a lot of the 301 00:13:39.519 --> 00:13:41.039 people are local to LA. 302 00:13:41.120 --> 00:13:41.879 But I made the. 303 00:13:41.840 --> 00:13:44.279 Effort to know, go to the conferences to make sure. 304 00:13:44.320 --> 00:13:46.440 I went up to them afterwards and spoke to them. 305 00:13:46.519 --> 00:13:49.960 And you know, now I really consider them friends and colleagues. 306 00:13:50.000 --> 00:13:51.519 So I just I mean, I was truthful. 307 00:13:51.559 --> 00:13:53.360 I was like, hey, like I want to I want 308 00:13:53.360 --> 00:13:55.120 to learn from you, like I want to know what 309 00:13:55.200 --> 00:13:57.559 to do. But for people who aren't local to LA, 310 00:13:57.919 --> 00:14:01.799 I mean all these people again, Lee, Steve, John Truby, 311 00:14:01.919 --> 00:14:05.080 Chris Vogeler, Robert McKee, you know, all of these people 312 00:14:05.279 --> 00:14:07.799 have I just say, the best thing that you can 313 00:14:07.840 --> 00:14:11.440 do is access their information. I mean they have podcasts, 314 00:14:11.480 --> 00:14:15.600 they have you know, online seminars, they have these things. 315 00:14:15.639 --> 00:14:17.480 Like these people know what it takes to get to 316 00:14:17.559 --> 00:14:20.440 the next level. I mean, they are the experts. And 317 00:14:20.519 --> 00:14:22.799 I say, if you can't meet them in person, like 318 00:14:22.840 --> 00:14:24.360 tweet at them, email them. 319 00:14:24.639 --> 00:14:26.200 You know, they do phone consults. 320 00:14:26.240 --> 00:14:29.159 They know that Lee does for sure, and like, just 321 00:14:29.480 --> 00:14:32.519 stoke up everything you can from them because they definitely 322 00:14:33.080 --> 00:14:35.919 they definitely know what they're doing. I do consults as well. 323 00:14:36.039 --> 00:14:37.879 So I mean, you know, you just I think you 324 00:14:37.960 --> 00:14:40.120 just got to put yourself out there and like make 325 00:14:40.159 --> 00:14:42.519 it known. Like I always tell the writers I work with, 326 00:14:42.600 --> 00:14:44.519 like make it known within the first five minutes of 327 00:14:44.519 --> 00:14:47.399 a conversation that you want to write and you want 328 00:14:47.399 --> 00:14:49.240 to do this and this is what your goal is. Like, 329 00:14:49.320 --> 00:14:51.840 I think it's important to speak that step out into 330 00:14:51.840 --> 00:14:54.279 the universe, to like let the world know, because it's 331 00:14:54.279 --> 00:14:56.360 like you don't speak it, how would anybody know it, 332 00:14:56.480 --> 00:14:57.799 you know what I mean. So I think there's a 333 00:14:57.840 --> 00:15:02.679 lot to making verbal commitments and letting people know that 334 00:15:02.679 --> 00:15:04.960 that's your goal because they can hold you accountable to 335 00:15:05.000 --> 00:15:05.279 it and. 336 00:15:05.240 --> 00:15:07.879 Ask can you know? So I think that that's an 337 00:15:07.919 --> 00:15:10.200 important aspect of a writing. 338 00:15:09.840 --> 00:15:15.039 Career, definitely. And I definitely think also, you know, finding 339 00:15:15.039 --> 00:15:17.279 out who you actually want to talk to and zeroing 340 00:15:17.279 --> 00:15:20.320 in on those people is really important as well, and 341 00:15:20.360 --> 00:15:21.039 in terms you. 342 00:15:21.000 --> 00:15:23.240 Know, in terms of like I think one of the 343 00:15:23.320 --> 00:15:25.799 questions that the guy asked there was a guy that 344 00:15:25.879 --> 00:15:27.840 was like, maybe he wasn't local to LA, but he 345 00:15:27.879 --> 00:15:30.559 asked about queering. He's like, is that my only option? 346 00:15:30.720 --> 00:15:33.559 Like I'm not in LA and like, you know, I 347 00:15:33.600 --> 00:15:36.080 always say, even if you can make one trip out 348 00:15:36.080 --> 00:15:38.639 to LA and go to like one of the big 349 00:15:38.840 --> 00:15:44.159 conferences like Great American Pitch Fest or Story Expo or 350 00:15:45.039 --> 00:15:47.399 like I know there's others that are like American Film 351 00:15:47.440 --> 00:15:50.320 Market or any of those things, Like so many people 352 00:15:50.360 --> 00:15:52.919 are at those and just even making face to face 353 00:15:53.000 --> 00:15:56.399 contact for five minutes and handing them your business card 354 00:15:56.519 --> 00:15:59.799 and making a contact, Like that's enough. There been in 355 00:15:59.840 --> 00:16:02.720 a itself to like send a query and like agents 356 00:16:02.720 --> 00:16:05.600 and managers show up to these things like to film 357 00:16:05.639 --> 00:16:08.039 festivals and all these things. But I think that a 358 00:16:08.080 --> 00:16:11.000 cold query can be a little hard and difficult in 359 00:16:11.080 --> 00:16:13.159 terms of taking things to the next level. But I'm 360 00:16:13.200 --> 00:16:15.440 just like, man, if you can invest and take one 361 00:16:15.480 --> 00:16:18.399 trip out to LA like a year, like it can 362 00:16:18.440 --> 00:16:20.559 do what and you go to the right event and 363 00:16:20.879 --> 00:16:23.200 you know, make sure you talk to the right people, 364 00:16:23.360 --> 00:16:26.799 like it can radically change the trajectory of your career. 365 00:16:26.879 --> 00:16:27.639 Absolutely. 366 00:16:30.759 --> 00:16:33.279 You know, we were talking about you know you you're 367 00:16:33.399 --> 00:16:35.960 you went to the management side, uh, you know of 368 00:16:36.919 --> 00:16:39.399 the business. And I wanted to ask your whitney, what 369 00:16:39.519 --> 00:16:42.000 are some of the things that you know that have 370 00:16:42.120 --> 00:16:45.600 if you have seen and that sort of like it is. Uh, 371 00:16:45.720 --> 00:16:48.399 That's what I'm trying to say, is sort of like 372 00:16:48.440 --> 00:16:50.279 a normal thing that you see, like the most common 373 00:16:50.399 --> 00:16:52.759 error screenwriters make. Because I was trying to say, oh. 374 00:16:52.679 --> 00:16:59.120 Gosh, you know, that's a really tough question, because I 375 00:16:59.120 --> 00:17:02.799 think everyone and obviously is so individual that I think 376 00:17:02.919 --> 00:17:08.119 that one of the common errors that will turn either 377 00:17:08.160 --> 00:17:11.799 an agent or a manager off is just the way 378 00:17:12.000 --> 00:17:14.920 in which they go about contacting them. 379 00:17:15.359 --> 00:17:17.240 Actually, like you really. 380 00:17:16.920 --> 00:17:21.079 Need to research the agent or manager that you're trying 381 00:17:21.079 --> 00:17:21.599 to talk to. 382 00:17:21.839 --> 00:17:22.839 I know that one of the. 383 00:17:22.759 --> 00:17:26.079 Big things among agent managers often if you're sending a 384 00:17:26.160 --> 00:17:28.680 query letter that you're sending to a lot of different people, 385 00:17:29.119 --> 00:17:32.640 a lot of times, like the person sending in either 386 00:17:32.720 --> 00:17:35.279 the query for their film or their TV show or 387 00:17:35.319 --> 00:17:39.000 their literary novel will sell the agent's name wrong or 388 00:17:39.039 --> 00:17:41.319 spell the manager's name wrong. And that is like the 389 00:17:41.400 --> 00:17:45.039 number one turnoff, Like you're not even paying attention to 390 00:17:45.119 --> 00:17:47.599 what you're doing, you know, So number one, I think 391 00:17:47.599 --> 00:17:51.240 you should paying attention to detail and showing that you're serious. 392 00:17:51.359 --> 00:17:54.200 I think another things that they look for, like which 393 00:17:54.240 --> 00:17:57.319 is crazy, is typos. They'll forgive them, but they're like 394 00:17:57.400 --> 00:18:00.519 if an email is just chock full of type. They're 395 00:18:00.559 --> 00:18:03.000 just like and people want to write like what is this? 396 00:18:03.200 --> 00:18:03.400 You know? 397 00:18:03.799 --> 00:18:06.759 So things said, those detail oriented things are one of 398 00:18:06.759 --> 00:18:07.279 the things. 399 00:18:08.359 --> 00:18:10.559 The other thing is it's good to be. 400 00:18:10.640 --> 00:18:13.519 Persistent, Like I think it's always good to follow up 401 00:18:13.519 --> 00:18:16.160