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Speaker 1: Keeping up with the Cougars. Brought to you by Odion Men'swear,

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Speaker 2: Welcome back Cougar Sports one every nine ninety point three.

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Es bem a fan. I'm at Brittle Broadcasting, crum Are Sky, Chevrolet, DearS.

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Speaker 3: Chev here in Provo, twenty twenty five North University Parkway,

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here in Provo. Would love to see you talk some

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ball with you. Drop off any of your food donations,

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any of your hygiene donations, any of your clothing donations

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at anyone of the Rocky Mountain Chevy dealers as we

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are raising funds and obviously food hygi products for.

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Speaker 2: The road home.

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Speaker 3: Is the season to be giving, and if you have

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been given much, you too must give. Head on down

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to any one of these Rocky Mountain Chevy dealers. Come

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on in, you can talk ball with me. I'll get

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you some pizza and get some Royal Army of Brank

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Gear segment. We're gonna catch up with a former BYU Cougar.

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Great to discuss this BYU Cougar all the Boau Cougar

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football moves. With Kaleijhataki being retained and hopefully the entirety

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of his staff on into the off season, they prep,

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They get ready for the BYU Texas Tech matchup this

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weekend in our Linkton. So it's gonna be brought to

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you by Odeon Men's where Odeon menswor dot com.

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Speaker 2: Look your best, fo.

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I can do high knees, Karaoka butt kicks. In this

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bad Boy, I can pick up my little ones without

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ripping out my slacks, the back end of my slacks.

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Speaker 2: I'll love it.

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Speaker 3: It's truly a sports performance suit that allows me to

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do everything that I need to do and I don't

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feel like I had to get out of it when

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I get home after church. Check it out, utilize the

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Let's get out to the hot line. Welcome in former

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b y u a d. We got val hail on

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the line, vow how.

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Speaker 2: You living brother?

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Speaker 4: Good Ben?

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Speaker 3: How are you doing doing awesome? All this well in

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Cougar Country, my friend? It seems like everything is trending

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in the right direction.

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Speaker 5: That's absolutely right.

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Speaker 4: It's it's nice to get all this behind us so

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we can focus on a game coming up on Saturday.

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Speaker 2: Right, Oh, man, I know it's answered much about it.

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Speaker 3: Man, it feels good to to.

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Speaker 2: Have our guy.

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Speaker 5: Right.

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Speaker 3: You've been a part of these negotiations. You've been a

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part of these situations before. What type of whirlwind do

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you think, Brian Santiago, Shane Reevees, Keith Vorkink, Elder Gilbert

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we're in when when they knew that Penn State was

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swinging big for their guy, Kalani Satake.

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Speaker 4: Well, you know, it's really I think this is unlike

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anything b Way You've ever experienced before, and it's just

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kind of.

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Speaker 5: Fascinating to watch.

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Speaker 4: It's so foreign what I experienced even twenty years ago.

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I remember when Gary Croton came in, he brought an

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agent with him, who incidentally was Tom Holmo's agent when

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he was a cal Also and with Leavell, there was

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no agent. You know, Lavell, had you just sit down,

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come in the office.

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Speaker 5: You'd work out a deal.

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Speaker 4: And so when agents get involved, it makes it a

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much more interesting and I would even say difficult dynamic

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from the university standpoint. But the fact that all of

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these people got involved and they did something unprecedented in

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BYU history and coming up with a compensation package that

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is one of the best in the country from what

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I've heard. I don't know what it is exactly, it's

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just it's amazing to see BYU get to this point.

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I mean, this is the same university. You know, we

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Leavell paid Doug Scoville nineteen thousand a year to come

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and coach at BYU. When you know, when Doug came

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back in the late seventies and when I was athletic director,

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Lavelle's salary at BYU was not even two hundred thousand

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dollars when I came in. And so now we've got

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a coach who's one of the top paid coaches in Americas.

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It shows you how far things have changed and how

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far we've come.

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Speaker 5: And good for Kilani for flexing.

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Speaker 4: And getting this type of a deal. And I'm sure

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it wasn't just for him as has been reported. You know,

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I knew Kilane by doing this would be trying to

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take care of his assistants and trying to get more

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resources for the program. It sounded like he was successful

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in getting all of that good for him.

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Speaker 2: No doubt about it.

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Speaker 3: Look, I mean what needs to happen in order to

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get certain things like this approved. We know you know

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that that BYU's athletic department is self sustaining. You know,

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it's revenue comes from ticket sales, corporate sponsorships, subsidies from donors,

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TV money, uh, you know, merchandising, licensing.

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Speaker 2: Right, Like, there's there's a number of funnels.

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Speaker 3: That booy up the athletic department and uh, you know,

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and then they utilize those funds to pay their W

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two employees, their FTEs, their coaches.

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Speaker 2: Et cetera.

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Speaker 3: It's becoming a little bit more interesting now with revenue

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sharing et cetera. There, But like, how how involved do

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the Barder trustees get in these situations where uh, it

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seems like, you know a lot of the funds aren't

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necessarily coming from the institution itself, like meaning upper campus

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as a university, but like it does impact maybe public perception.

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I guess we don't know how it operates from a

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P and L standpoint, from from a monetary standpoint, necessarily.

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Speaker 2: We don't have access to that.

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Speaker 3: Could you give us a little bit of enlightenment about

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how involved the border of Trustees is in to approve

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such things?

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Speaker 4: Well, in this particular case, I'm guessing they were very

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involved because as I mentioned, this is unprecedented and even

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though it's not necessarily coming from tiding funds in the church,

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it's the perception issue, you know. I'm sure the conversation

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is do we really want to be paying our coach

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that much money? You know, when people are thinking that,

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you know, we might be using the widows might to

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do this, which they aren't, but people still think they

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I'm sure they had the conversation and it shows the

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respect that they have for Kilane that they were willing

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to go this far and do this much. And you know,

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it would have been catastrophic for Kilanie to leave right now.

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I mean, you think about recruiting, recruit signing is today

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what would have happened if he would have announced Monday

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or Tuesday that he's going to Penn State. Any of

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these recruits would have said, oh well, let's see maybe

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not what if you took all his staff with him.

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You know, BYU football would have been starting from scratch

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again pretty much.

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Speaker 5: You know, maybe Jay Hill.

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Speaker 4: Stays and becomes the head coach, and you know, things

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go on, but the disruption would have been phenomenal. And

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I think they realized that. And Klane, quite frankly, has

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had great success in the last two or three years

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and he represents everything that the board of trustees wants

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in a coach. I mean, he's doing it the right

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way at BYU. So you know, hats off to them

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for saying, let's go, let's do this, and for the

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donors who were willing to step up and make it happen.

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And that's what I understand is really driving a lot

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of this. And quite frankly, you know, we get a

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lot more money by being in the Big twelve than

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we used to. But the way I see it, the

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big difference between BYU right now and even three years

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ago is the way the donors have stepped up. I mean,

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it's just remarkable to see how they've come forward. Back

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back when I was athletic director, We had a few

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donors and they gave some money, but it was nothing

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like happens now with the Silicon Slopes coming into the

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valley and these other businesses primarily you know, started by

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LDS people. They've just been phenomenal at supporting the program.

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It's it's remarkable.

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Speaker 3: Well, it's truly a new era of BYU athletics, one

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that has tremendous momentum right now, tremendous investment and.

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Speaker 2: You just love you love to see it.

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Speaker 3: If you're a BYU fed, you love to see the

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momentum right now. And look, I mean, lots of things

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have changed since you've been the ad. Like you even

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commented on social media that Johnny Harlen playing the national anthemon.

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Speaker 2: Is electric guitar.

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Speaker 3: No way the Cougar fan would have allowed that, you know,

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twenty five years ago.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, it was funny because every time somebody

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sang the national anthem even a little bit unique, I

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would get I literally would get letters and emails and

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oftentimes copied to the president of the church and the

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president of the university complaining about and you know what,

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in fairness, a lot of these people were like World

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War two veterans, yes, and they.

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Speaker 3: Were typically it's going to be the fats, right, yeah,

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in godless American God bless those that are serving in

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the military, and were grateful for them, no doubt.

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Speaker 4: Yeah. But it was just funny, you know, because if

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we had allowed something like that to happen back then, man,

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all heck would break. Was kind of like when Tom Holmo,

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you know, when the Cougarrettes.

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Speaker 5: Played a song.

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Speaker 4: It was edited, but apparently it was a song that

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was had some pretty risque lyrics that were edited out

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that people still wrote and complained and Tom had to

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step up and say, hey, that's my bad.

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Speaker 5: I'm sorry.

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Speaker 4: We'll you know, we'll take care of that.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: That's kind of the way it was all the time.

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And what was funny is I right after he played

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that thing, I turned to my son when the cougar

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Rats were out dancing, and they do an amazing job,

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I said, when Ernest Wilkinson was president of the university,

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if they had done that routine, they had all been

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expelled from school. You know, that's how far we've come.

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Speaker 5: You know.

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Speaker 4: Back then, it was just a different era. I mean,

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it was very strict and rigid and there's no way

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they would allow that kind of dancing out on the

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floor or out on the field. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Well, hopefully it's all good growth.

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Speaker 3: Obviously, we want to abide by all the laws and

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regulations and stay true, you know, you know, and keep

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your hand to the rod, obviously, but I do think

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we've made some really good progress in that regard. Well,

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there's a lot of them, agree, there are a lot

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of them meant to me in the athletletics world right now,

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and BYU basketball, BYU football highly ranked, and when you

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look at the overall momentum, like, what's the cap what's

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the ceiling for BYU athletics right now, especially for its flagship.

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Speaker 4: Programs, Well, you know, gosh, after considering what's been accomplished

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and where we're headed and the recruiting classes we're having,

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I would say the cap is that we typically ought

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to have programs that are competing for a national championship.

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We may not always, you know, be right at the top,

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but top ten programs in the various programs at sports

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football and basketball that we have, and maybe even a

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few others we're already there, and some like our cross

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country teams and a few others here and there. But

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you know, you think that with the resources we have,

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if we can continue to recruit like we have, that

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should be kind of just the goal. You know, we're

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going to compete for a Big twelve championship and both

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sports as well as you know, be a top ten

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ranked team. That doesn't seem out of the realm of

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possibility given what we've accomplished lately.

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Speaker 2: Val Hell Ladies and Gentlemen.

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Speaker 3: Former b YU A D talking some BYU Athletics here

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on your Utah ESPN Radio network. You're looking at how

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BUYU is getting stiff armed in the College Football Playoff

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Committee's eyes.

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Speaker 2: How do you evaluate that?

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Speaker 3: I get asked all the time, like why is it

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that they don't want BYU and the Big Boys Club?

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Is it the product on the field. It's hard to

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argue their resume right now, but they're doing it. They're

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just leaving the entirely, They're just keeping them fixated at eleven?

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Is it religious bigotry?

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Speaker 2: Is is it?

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Speaker 3: You know, maybe institutional bigotry and discrimination?

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Speaker 4: Is it?

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Speaker 2: You know, maybe last year I brought this up.

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Speaker 3: Last year the colleg Football Playoff Committee did invite, did

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bring in Boise State in SMU, and they really weren't

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that competit, so they want to bring in and Alabama

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was was tossed to the side. And Alabama's a perennial

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over the last twenty plus years, one of the best

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teams in college football, obviously led by a legendary coach.

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Speaker 2: What do you make of it?

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Speaker 5: Val Well?

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Speaker 4: By you has always been shunned, you know, rightly or wrongly?

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You know, clear back in ninety six, I remember going

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with Levell in New York City. We were there for

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an event and they invited us to go to the

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announcement party that I can't remember CBS or somewhere so

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level and I go there and and course they had

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they really had no intention of inviting BYU. That's what

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was so embarrassing that we knew that they weren't going

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to include BYU, even though b way you deserved to

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be included. And as soon as they announced it that

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BYU wasn't there, all of the coaches just immediately vacated

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the room, left Levell just standing there. It was really

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I felt so bad for Lavell because it was really

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a tremendous show of disrespect for him. They shouldn't they

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knew that Bayu wasn't going to be invited there. There's

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no way they were going to do that. And it

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was because they didn't want to share the money. I mean,

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let's be honest, this is a financial decision.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and.

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Speaker 4: So you know, leavell we just kind of had to

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wander out, find a taxi and find our way back home.

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You know, they had brought a car over to pick

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us up, but they weren't going to give us a

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car going back, you know. And again in two thousand

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and one, you know, we're undefeated and we're getting ready

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to go. I can't remember what stage it was, but

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they end up basically telling us, no, we're not in

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the you're not included, and lo and behold, we go

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out and lose it. It was a big distraction for

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us back then.

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Speaker 3: I want to pivot back to some of our original

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conversation here, Val I was pulling up US Department of

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Education numbers.

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Speaker 2: I was trying to compare and contrast.

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Speaker 3: What BY has how BYU financially has changed from an

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athletic Department standpoint since about two thousand and five, if

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I'm not mistaken, I was looking at those numbers and

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I don't know if they're accurate, but two thousand and five,

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the athletic department revenue generated about twenty million dollars.

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Speaker 2: Does that sound accurate?

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Speaker 4: That's yes, that's what it was when I left in

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two thousand and four.

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Speaker 2: Okay, right in twenty million, twenty million dollars.

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Speaker 3: The most recent numbers that we have in twenty twenty

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three is one hundred and thirty million dollars. Give us

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some perspective here, like what's going on? What happened over

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that that expansive time.

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Speaker 4: Well, like I say, I think, I think fundraising has

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taken off and done significant things. I think obviously in

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the Big twelve now it's the rev new share is

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significantly more. I think with just TV revenue, even when

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we went independent, that became a lot more because we

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weren't sharing it with all of the other mount West

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conference people. So I think it's a combination of everything.

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But I really think the fundraising aspect has been one

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of the biggest things. You know, that does accounted for

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that increase in revenue, and now with the Big twelve

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revenue that significant as well.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, there's a there's a lot happening here. Well, the

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thing is the twenty twenty three they didn't they didn't

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get a share of the TV money at that time.

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That would have been the former deal that I think

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it was during independence, which would have been I don't know,

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four or five million, right which you know it's a sum,

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but you know, these big, these Power four conferences, they're

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going to get, you know, twenty thirty forty million dollars

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in TV distribute.

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Speaker 2: So we're at one thirty right now.

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Speaker 3: Once you become a full member, you're looking at one

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hundred and fifty hundred sixty hundred seventy one hundred and

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eighty million dollars. That's a that's that's not just a

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small business anymore. That's a that's a pretty that's a

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that's a growing business.

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Speaker 2: That's a robust set of personnel.

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Speaker 3: I don't know how many employees were there when you

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were in two thousand and five, howenty in two thousand

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and four, two thousand five, how many ployees.

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Speaker 4: I would say we had maybe about one hundred. I

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would bet there's more than twice, maybe almost three times

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as many now as there were. I mean, you think

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about it. Levell when he started coaching at BYU in

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nineteen seventy two, there were six football coaches, including Leavell

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Utah and Utah State had eight on their staff at

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the time. And now you know, they also had a

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couple of trainers, or probably three trainers, Rod Kimball, Marv Roberson,

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you know, Oli Julkinen and some of those guys. Now

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they've got more basketball assistant coaches. And they had football

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coaches back then. And you know, when the basketball team played,

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this kind of funny because you know, all these guys

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come out on the floor and I'm thinking, Man, when

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I was athletic director, you had one head coach, three assistants.

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I think he had a director of basketball operations then

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and maybe one other person. But now I don't know,

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I don't even know how many are on that staff.

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Same thing with football, they've got, you know, all kinds

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of people. They even got general managers. Now they got

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a general manager for the program.

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Speaker 5: So the size of.

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Speaker 4: The staff has just grown significantly over the last few years.

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And I guess that's I guess they You know, when

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you joined a big conference like the Big twelve, you

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kind of have to do that keep up I guess

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with everything.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, crazy times, no doubt about it. Val Always love

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chaddick with you. Always learned something from you. I know

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our listeners love hearing from you. Best way to support you?

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00:18:55,039 --> 00:18:56,079
Speaker 2: What do you do? How you do it?

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Speaker 3: I know you've You're still staying busy, got projects.

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Speaker 2: You also wrote a book for recently.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, a year ago I wrote a book called Out

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of the Blue and Insiders look at the Rise of

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BAU Athletics. That was a fun experience. I'm just kind

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of starting the process of recording it and having it

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as an audible book. So I still have some printed

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copies that did quite well, and then I'm going to

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put it out on audio format for those it'd probably

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be I don't know if I'll get it done before

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the end of the year, but right after that I

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hope to have it out. I'm surprised how many people

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don't really read books anymore. They listen to them, so

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I thought that would be fun to get out so

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people could It's just my memoirs my time in the

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athletic program, and not basically during the Lavelle Edwards years

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and the croaking years. You know what happened?

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Speaker 2: Love that, man, It's a great book.

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Speaker 3: I've read through it and I invite everyone to download it,

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especially once the audible version is ready to go. You

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got a great voice for it as well. Val, you

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got sultry tones. Man, I'll listen to that on audible

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any day of the week.

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Speaker 4: Okay, all right, well Ben, it's always fun to chat

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with you. Thanks for taking time to golf.

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Speaker 2: All right, appreciate you. Val. Hell ladies and gentlemen.

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00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:10,279
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point three ESPN The Fan