WEBVTT

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<v Speaker 1>Oh hey, it's that blueberry bagel that tastes like onions

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<v Speaker 1>because it pressed its face into an everything bagel. Alie

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<v Speaker 1>Ward back with another episode of Ologies. It's the middle

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<v Speaker 1>of January and here in the Northern Hemisphere, lips are chopped,

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<v Speaker 1>feet are cold, Parkers are on. I'm here to give

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<v Speaker 1>you a snow job. But first, thank you to everyone

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<v Speaker 1>who supports on Patreon and who gets merch, including the

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<v Speaker 1>new black T shirts Yes at ologiesmirch dot com. Of course,

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<v Speaker 1>thanks to everyone who rates and subscribes, who leaves reviews

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<v Speaker 1>on iTunes. You know I read them, you know I

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<v Speaker 1>read them. For example, this week, thank you to Evie,

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<v Speaker 1>who said, in the hopes of Ali noticing me, hey,

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<v Speaker 1>I gotta say that this podcast just recently got me

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<v Speaker 1>through some pretty bad flying anxiety. So thank you, thank

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<v Speaker 1>you for taking me into the sky with you, Evie.

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<v Speaker 1>Also Evan DK, I hope you and your pops are

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<v Speaker 1>feeling okay. Okay, So snow snow, not just snow, but big, cold, crumbly, scary,

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<v Speaker 1>dangerous avalanches. What the hell are they?

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<v Speaker 2>So?

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<v Speaker 1>I searched far and wide for a snow expert, and

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<v Speaker 1>I connected with a dude who got his PhD in

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<v Speaker 1>Environmental Science and Management from the University of California, Santa

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<v Speaker 1>Barbara up place Stephen Ray Morris and I both attended.

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<v Speaker 1>But this guy is primarily based up near Mammoth Mountain,

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<v Speaker 1>which is technically a giant lava dome complex Frickin Volcano

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<v Speaker 1>near Yosemite. It's chill. He does not live in la

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<v Speaker 1>because hello, there's snow snow here, but he would be

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<v Speaker 1>passing through Lax on a six hour layover. I coincidentally

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<v Speaker 1>was also flying into Lax that night, so we had

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<v Speaker 1>plans to meet up in a terminal, and then my

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<v Speaker 1>flight was delayed because of snow. It's cute, snow cute,

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<v Speaker 1>so we made another plan. He had another layover at

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<v Speaker 1>Lax a few weeks later, right before the holidays, and

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<v Speaker 1>I drove down there and I waited on a bench

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<v Speaker 1>outside Lax for him with my zoom A, rolling to

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<v Speaker 1>rendezvous at high noon and talk snow. One issue my

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<v Speaker 1>phone was dying, and Lax is huge some days I'm like,

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<v Speaker 1>why am I such a garbage? Also, just a little

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<v Speaker 1>audio note, So, as mentioned, this was recorded on a

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<v Speaker 1>bench at LAX, and so there were a lot of

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<v Speaker 1>ambient noises that we were competing with, and so it's

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<v Speaker 1>not to be annoying. We tried to cut around them

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<v Speaker 1>as best we could, but it's a little bit less

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<v Speaker 1>smooth than most episodes. So if this is the very

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<v Speaker 1>very first episode you're ever listening to, the audio is

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<v Speaker 1>a little different on this one, please bear with us.

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<v Speaker 1>Forgive us. The contents totally worth it, as you're going

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<v Speaker 1>to hear, it was an adventure and you're about to

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<v Speaker 1>learn about the beauty and architecture of snowflakes or either

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<v Speaker 1>so bright white, What to do with you're stranded in snow,

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<v Speaker 1>How avalanches happen, how to survive one, digging out your

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<v Speaker 1>car one oh one, and the best snow for a

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<v Speaker 1>snowball fight. Also how climate change affects snowpack and the

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<v Speaker 1>really riveting backstory of skier avalanche expert and snow hydrologist

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<v Speaker 1>doctor Ned Bar. I thought that was Ned. That wasn't Ned.

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<v Speaker 1>My phone is at two percent. I am at the

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<v Speaker 1>appointed meeting place. It is eleven fifty nine. I do

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<v Speaker 1>not see Ned. My phone has two percent for us

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<v Speaker 1>to meet up with each other before this gets real tragic.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh god, how was it not plugged in? My lord,

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<v Speaker 1>my phone is now at one percent. I see someone walking,

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<v Speaker 1>Please be ned, Please be ned? Are you ned? Yes?

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<v Speaker 3>Hi dad?

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<v Speaker 1>And where did you grow up? Because you're based in

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<v Speaker 1>Santa Barbara or you work out of UCSB? I do?

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<v Speaker 3>I work for UCSB? Yep? I with lakes?

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<v Speaker 1>And where are you from?

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<v Speaker 3>Originally Alexandria, Virginia.

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<v Speaker 1>Do they have snow there?

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<v Speaker 3>No?

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<v Speaker 1>Oh, how did this happen?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah?

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<v Speaker 2>I grew up skiing in winter Green, Virginia, m a

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<v Speaker 2>thousand vertical feet something like thirty inches of annual snowfall.

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<v Speaker 2>I went to school in Maine, went to bat in

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<v Speaker 2>college and skied more there. And then after college, I

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<v Speaker 2>went and my parents weren't too happy about this and

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<v Speaker 2>became a ski patroller and did that for ten years.

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<v Speaker 1>So they like, can you not break all of your bones?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah?

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<v Speaker 2>Well that's not really what they wanted me to go

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<v Speaker 2>to college to do.

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<v Speaker 3>And yeah, it's not the safest job either, but I

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<v Speaker 3>loved it.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, have you been called a ski bum by

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<v Speaker 1>your family?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah? Yeah, I've definitely. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>I've always said that I've wanted to live in a

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<v Speaker 2>ski town for as long as I can remember, and

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<v Speaker 2>so I've sort of managed to do that with a

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<v Speaker 2>professional career. I woint of traveling in a fair bit,

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<v Speaker 2>but also just a lot of time on the computer.

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<v Speaker 1>How did you make the leap from being ski patrol

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<v Speaker 1>for you said ten years to do you have a

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<v Speaker 1>PhD in snow hydrology. How did you go from like,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, air quote ski bum to doctor snow dude.

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<v Speaker 3>So it's kind of a long story.

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<v Speaker 2>But I was working as a patroller and my second

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<v Speaker 2>so was part of that was I was doing my

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<v Speaker 2>PhD while I was still ski patrolling at the end.

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<v Speaker 2>But I had a friend on ski patrol who is

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<v Speaker 2>sort of a mentor for me. His name was Walter Rosenthal.

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<v Speaker 2>He was he was an old patroller, is in his

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<v Speaker 2>mid fifties, and he kind of took me under his

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<v Speaker 2>wing and taught me a lot about snow and digging

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<v Speaker 2>these massive snow pits, you know, like three Sierra snowpack

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<v Speaker 2>because this is really deep.

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<v Speaker 3>At least in the.

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<v Speaker 2>Good it varies, but it can be very deep. And

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<v Speaker 2>so we would be digging these pits and doing these

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<v Speaker 2>you know, crystal identification and stuff like that, I mean

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<v Speaker 2>really deep.

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<v Speaker 3>And he just was a really he loved it. I

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<v Speaker 3>mean he was a guy.

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<v Speaker 2>He's probably one of the only people I've ever met,

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<v Speaker 2>I think, liked to dig more in the snow to

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<v Speaker 2>do anything else.

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<v Speaker 3>So he's kind of like a human backo. And anyway,

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<v Speaker 3>so Walter was.

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<v Speaker 2>My friend on ski patrol, and he taught me a

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<v Speaker 2>lot about the snow and I was patrolling and I

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<v Speaker 2>was kind of looking for something a little more cerebral

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<v Speaker 2>to do, you know. I loved working as a ski patroller.

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<v Speaker 2>I should say this. Walter had a history. He was

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<v Speaker 2>a scientist. Also also worked at e C. Santa Barbara,

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<v Speaker 2>and he had done a bunch of work with remote

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<v Speaker 2>sensing and satellite based mapping at the snowpack and stuff

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<v Speaker 2>that I'm doing now. But what he really liked to

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<v Speaker 2>do is avalanche research, which there's there's almost no funding.

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<v Speaker 3>For in the US. Really, it's what I like to do.

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<v Speaker 2>It's what I wrote my dissertation on, right, And so anyway,

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<v Speaker 2>Walter got an NSF grant with his advisor, Jeff Doser

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<v Speaker 2>to study centering mechanisms in the snowpack, so like how

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<v Speaker 2>snow grains bond together. He was looking at soluble impurities

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<v Speaker 2>in the snowpack and using a scanning electron microscope and

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<v Speaker 2>looking at the geometric struct sure and how the next

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<v Speaker 2>form between him.

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<v Speaker 3>And stuff like that.

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<v Speaker 2>Anyway, Walter just got this NSF grant and then in

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<v Speaker 2>April of two thousand and six, he was killed with

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<v Speaker 2>three other ski patrollers when a volcanic event on Mammoth

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<v Speaker 2>Mountain collapsed.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh my god.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and it was it was. It was a really

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<v Speaker 2>rough ty it actually it happened right next to me.

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<v Speaker 2>I was there when it happened, and he was actually

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<v Speaker 2>killed trying to rescue the other patrollers. So it was

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<v Speaker 2>really Uh yeah, it was a tough, a tough time

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<v Speaker 2>in my life. Not an experience that I, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>had a really hard time getting over. But anyway, Walter's advisor,

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<v Speaker 2>Jeff came to me and asked me if I wanted

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<v Speaker 2>to go to grad school on this NSF grant. Wow,

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<v Speaker 2>no longer had a PhD student to do the research.

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<v Speaker 1>What an impact that must have had on you?

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<v Speaker 3>It did, it had.

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<v Speaker 2>It had a pretty big impact on me. After college.

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<v Speaker 2>I was a ski patroller and I was a climbing guide,

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<v Speaker 2>and I was kind of a climbing bomb ski bump,

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<v Speaker 2>and I pretty soon after that got married and you know,

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<v Speaker 2>I started living, not living out of my truck as

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<v Speaker 2>much anyway.

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<v Speaker 3>And yeah, now I have two little kids and it

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<v Speaker 3>was a tough experience.

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<v Speaker 2>I guess I should mention so James Juarez and Scott

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<v Speaker 2>mcandrew's or the two other patrollers who were killed.

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<v Speaker 1>Well fencing off the area from skiers, Scotty and James

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<v Speaker 1>fell through the snow twenty feet into the volcanic vent,

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<v Speaker 1>and Walter, who wasn't supposed to be working but had

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<v Speaker 1>returned because of the storm, went after Scotty and James

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<v Speaker 1>to save them. All three died of asphyxiation in the

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<v Speaker 1>volcanic gases, namely the heavier CO two. Several others were

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<v Speaker 1>injured in the rescue efforts. And I just learned that

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<v Speaker 1>when volcanic gases reach noxious strengths, they're called a muzuku,

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<v Speaker 1>which in Swahili means an evil wind. It's dangerous.

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<v Speaker 2>So if you ever ski at Mammoth Mountain, there's a

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<v Speaker 2>I think called a fumarole that's on the Chair three

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<v Speaker 2>area and its spews out volcanic gases, hydrogen sulfide, which

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<v Speaker 2>is really toxic, lots of carbon monoxide, carbon dioxide, and

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<v Speaker 2>it's sort of fine if it's not capped over, if

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<v Speaker 2>it's open and it's venting. But this year was a

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<v Speaker 2>really large snow year. This was April of two thousand

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<v Speaker 2>and six, and so it actually capped over for the

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<v Speaker 2>first time that a lot of people who've been there

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<v Speaker 2>for decades could remember. And so these gases sort of

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<v Speaker 2>just sat there and they actually formed like an underground

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<v Speaker 2>chamber that I don't really know, and snowbridge collapsed, and yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>we're pulling up fencing because they're just like fencing to

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<v Speaker 2>keep skewers out of the fumarole.

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<v Speaker 1>There are tons of videos on YouTube of skiers and

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<v Speaker 1>snowboarders stopping at this fenced off plume to just wonder

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<v Speaker 1>at it, and many pay their respects, and a Stowe

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<v Speaker 1>memorial is up at Mammoths Summit to remember the three

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<v Speaker 1>and even ten years after the incident, hundreds gathered at

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<v Speaker 1>Mammoth to observe the anniversary. The community is still pretty

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<v Speaker 1>rocked by it. And so did you have a hard

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<v Speaker 1>time because it was maybe such a visceral and traumatic

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<v Speaker 1>experience to go back to this kind of science, or

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<v Speaker 1>did it make you more passionate about kind of state

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<v Speaker 1>the safety of it.

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<v Speaker 2>I think both. I don't know, it's sort of a

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<v Speaker 2>complicated question.

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<v Speaker 3>I don't know.

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<v Speaker 2>I wasn't going to change my life radically and you know,

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<v Speaker 2>go off and live in a city and do that.

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<v Speaker 3>I wouldn't have been happy doing that.

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<v Speaker 2>But yeah, it certainly made me think a lot about

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<v Speaker 2>the mountains and taking risks. This snowbridge collapsed right next

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<v Speaker 2>to me. It was a couple of feet away, so

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<v Speaker 2>it could have very easily been me falling in for

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<v Speaker 2>the fumarole.

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<v Speaker 1>So wow, yeah, and you're a young person too, I mean, yeah.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I was this. I was twenty six.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, And so what is it about snow that

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<v Speaker 1>you that you love? What keeps bringing you back to it?

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<v Speaker 2>Well, you know, growing up, it was always sort of

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<v Speaker 2>an federal thing, and I didn't get to see it

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<v Speaker 2>very much. And I think I think all kids, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>love snow. It's obviously no school and at least in

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<v Speaker 2>the DC area, so it has nice early memories and

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<v Speaker 2>impressions for me. I think later on, well, I love

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<v Speaker 2>the avalanche part of it. I think the avalanche world

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<v Speaker 2>is fascinating and there are a lot of avenues that

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<v Speaker 2>haven't been explored scientifically.

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<v Speaker 1>So I note this is where I found out what

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<v Speaker 1>ski patrolling means. I honestly, I thought it was just

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<v Speaker 1>like buzzing around the slopes, kind of making sure everyone's okay,

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<v Speaker 1>kind of like a lifeguard, but with no speedos and

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<v Speaker 1>more skis. Turns out I did not know anything about

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<v Speaker 1>ski patrolling.

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<v Speaker 2>You go out with explosives and you set off avalanches

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<v Speaker 2>and wait, throw dynamite out your hand.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh I didn't know that. Yeah, I thought you were

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<v Speaker 1>just making sure no one failed.

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<v Speaker 2>No, no, no, no, no, you do active avalanche control. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>so you shoot howitzers and oh my god, I throw dynamite,

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<v Speaker 2>and so it's fun how.

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<v Speaker 1>It served, By the way, is a freaking World War

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<v Speaker 1>two cannon, you guys, It's a cannon. To look it up.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, these avalanches are very difficult to predict, and it's

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<v Speaker 2>not always so clear what causes a really large one

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<v Speaker 2>versus a small one. And you know, they're just sort

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<v Speaker 2>of spectacular too, I mean, just the size of the

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<v Speaker 2>debris and the large blocks and damage you know that

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<v Speaker 2>they can cause. And you can see all kinds of

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<v Speaker 2>markings on you know, mostly in the Sierra and most

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<v Speaker 2>of the United States, most of these happened in wilderness areas,

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<v Speaker 2>so that the marketing, you know, it's trees that are destroyed,

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<v Speaker 2>not like in the Alps or there's more infrastructure. They

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<v Speaker 2>have a lot of history with damage to buildings and

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<v Speaker 2>things like that.

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<v Speaker 1>This is no joke. Each year around one hundred people

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<v Speaker 1>are killed by alpine avalanches, but due to really crazy

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<v Speaker 1>snowfall lately, twenty six lives have been lost just this

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<v Speaker 1>past month. Just a few days ago, two ski patrollers

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<v Speaker 1>in France were killed detonating explosives to trigger an avalanche.

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<v Speaker 1>So the shit is risky. Are there How many avalanches

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<v Speaker 1>are there in Manma per year?

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<v Speaker 3>Do you think in Mammoth? I don't know. A couple thousand.

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<v Speaker 1>Really, Oh my god, I had no idea.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean because you know that when they're triggered

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<v Speaker 2>like that, you have a lot more of them throughout

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<v Speaker 2>the US.

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<v Speaker 3>I don't know, one hundred thousand a year or something

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<v Speaker 3>like that.

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<v Speaker 1>What's the death toll there.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, it's been going down. It's in sort of the

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<v Speaker 2>mid twenties. It's actually been sort of staying steady or

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<v Speaker 2>going down, which is probably due to a number of factors. Airbags,

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<v Speaker 2>better education, better awareness. The avalanche centers do a great

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<v Speaker 2>job with warning people during those high snowfall periods and

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<v Speaker 2>other times when you know the metamorphism has produced layering

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<v Speaker 2>that's unstable.

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<v Speaker 1>Wow. Okay, more on those airbags in a bit. As

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<v Speaker 1>for avalanches, these metamorphosisms in layering just mean that there's

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<v Speaker 1>less stability with a snowshelf depending on what kind of

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<v Speaker 1>layers are underneath it. So maybe some wetter, warmer snow

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<v Speaker 1>or a layer of refrozen ice kind of stacking and stacking,

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<v Speaker 1>kind of like an icy club sandwich. So a steep slope,

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<v Speaker 1>heavy snow cover, a weak layer in the snow, plus

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<v Speaker 1>some kind of trigger, and you have a slide that

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<v Speaker 1>can vary from pretty harmless size one to a size

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<v Speaker 1>two that can bury a person, a three can bury

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<v Speaker 1>a car, and a four can destroy structures and go

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<v Speaker 1>up to eighty miles an hour within a few seconds,

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<v Speaker 1>which is about twice as fast as my two thousand

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<v Speaker 1>and seven PRIs and thus deserves much more respect.

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<v Speaker 2>So yeah, they're exciting, But then also just snow is

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<v Speaker 2>a really fascinating material. As Walter always used to say,

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<v Speaker 2>snow is hot, and which means that it's very close

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<v Speaker 2>to its melting temperature almost everywhere on Earth. Oh wow,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, because it's pretty warm compared to like the

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<v Speaker 2>rest of the planets in our Solar system, and well

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<v Speaker 2>at least the ones past Earth.

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<v Speaker 1>Going back to a really basic question, what is snow?

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<v Speaker 1>What's the deal with snowflakes? Are they all unique? Like?

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<v Speaker 1>If I know nothing about snow, what are the basics?

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<v Speaker 1>I know it's a stupid question, but I don't care.

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<v Speaker 2>My advisor, Jeff Doser, he had a thing where he

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<v Speaker 2>went to Disney for the Frozen movie. They had salting

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<v Speaker 2>work where he showed up and give him some pointers

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<v Speaker 2>on snowflakes, which I thought were pretty good. And actually

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<v Speaker 2>and Carl Barkland, who's actually also on my PhD committee,

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<v Speaker 2>and I thought between them they had some pretty good points.

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<v Speaker 1>Are you ready for this beautiful icy point. It's gonna

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<v Speaker 1>melt your brains.

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<v Speaker 2>Jeff made the point that snowflakes, you know, they grow

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<v Speaker 2>by accretion, meaning that there's like condensation, nuclei dust they

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<v Speaker 2>grow out of that. So you can't have ones with

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<v Speaker 2>holes in the middle, which you see a lot, especially

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<v Speaker 2>around now when people are making snowflake decorations for Christmas.

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<v Speaker 2>So no holes in the middle. They have to have

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<v Speaker 2>six sides. Okay, no pentagons or you know anything like that, right,

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<v Speaker 2>they go from six sided hexagonal water crystals.

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<v Speaker 1>So for kindergartener is out there making a paper snowflake

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<v Speaker 1>with a hole in the middle, definitely yell at them,

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<v Speaker 1>just mercilessly, because frankly, they're never going to learn otherwise,

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<v Speaker 1>humiliate them. Don't do that. Also for a four second

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<v Speaker 1>lesson on hexagonal water crystals, okay, has this? So water

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<v Speaker 1>is two hydrogens and an oxygen atom, and because of

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<v Speaker 1>how much molecules slow down in the cold, the hydrogen

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<v Speaker 1>bonds allow the water molecules to link up in such

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<v Speaker 1>a way that they form a hexagonal lattice structure, which

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<v Speaker 1>is of course why some snowflakes have six sides. Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>what else did the scientists tell the mouse at Disney?

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<v Speaker 2>So Carl also made the point that you cannot yell

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<v Speaker 2>and cause of snow avalanche, Okay, doesn't happen like I

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<v Speaker 2>guess it happened in the movie Heidi.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, I just spent like an hour digging all over

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<v Speaker 1>for this Heidi clip. But he may have been thinking

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<v Speaker 1>of another mountain movie, which incidentally, and I love Lucy

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<v Speaker 1>episode cited.

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<v Speaker 3>Now, don't make a sound, sat all that snow hanging

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<v Speaker 3>over our heads a loud noise to cause an avalanche.

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<v Speaker 3>It's true.

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<v Speaker 1>I read it in a book and you remember that

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<v Speaker 1>picture Seven Brides for seven Brothers.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, that's right.

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<v Speaker 1>Somebody shot a pistol caused a great, big avalanche. Yeah, now,

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<v Speaker 1>don't anybody move, Okay. Also, I went and looked up

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<v Speaker 1>seven Brides for seven Brothers, and from what I can gather,

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<v Speaker 1>it involves a bunch of related horny frontiersmen who romantically

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<v Speaker 1>straight up kidnap women. So I feel like, yes, this

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<v Speaker 1>pistol triggering an avalanche plot point is problematic, but not

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<v Speaker 1>as much as it's kind of lighthearted, musical take on

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<v Speaker 1>human trafficking.

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<v Speaker 2>I guess you went to try and stop that urban

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<v Speaker 2>rural legend from perpetuating.

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<v Speaker 1>So that's a big debunker of flim flam. That's flim flam.

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<v Speaker 1>You can't scream and cause an avalanche, Nope, Okay, to

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<v Speaker 1>scream your head off in the mountains if you need to, Uh, yes, okay,

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<v Speaker 1>good to know. Sometimes that's why you go to the mountains.

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<v Speaker 1>It's just to scream your head off. Yeah, and then

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<v Speaker 1>you go back and you say everything's fine.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, right, So.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, snow. Where does snow form in the atmosphere? Does

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<v Speaker 1>it form right above our heads? Does it form way

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<v Speaker 1>above us?

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<v Speaker 2>Like?

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<v Speaker 1>Where when does it? How does a snowflake become a snowflake?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah? Pretty high up.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean it depends on the level of the clouds

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<v Speaker 2>and you know how deep the storm is and where

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<v Speaker 2>the moisture is. But yeah, I mean, this is all

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<v Speaker 2>the lower atmosphere if you're an atmospheric scientist, But for

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<v Speaker 2>people like me, study what's going on in the ground

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<v Speaker 2>at pretty high up klometers above our heads. And it

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<v Speaker 2>starts off frozen actually because it's cold up there, but

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<v Speaker 2>it turns to raine if it's.

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<v Speaker 1>Not cold enough so to recap water vapor and cold temperatures,

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<v Speaker 1>turns to ice crystals around a piece of dust or

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<v Speaker 1>pollen aka condensation nuclei, and then it falls through the

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<v Speaker 1>air and tumbles and grows, and in warmer air it'll

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<v Speaker 1>melt a little at the edges and form clumps with

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<v Speaker 1>other flakes, resulting in heavier, wet, fluffy snow. And if

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<v Speaker 1>it falls through colder air, it's less likely to stick

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<v Speaker 1>together and it falls as smaller, drier and powdery snow.

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<v Speaker 1>Also side note, I just went down some YouTube poles

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<v Speaker 1>trying to see different sized snowflakes, and one thing I

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<v Speaker 1>didn't need to know about was the video of a

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<v Speaker 1>guy silently scratching dandruff, which quote falls like snow and

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<v Speaker 1>has forty thousand views. Mine now, being one of them

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<v Speaker 1>human beings, we're all a little different into each of their

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<v Speaker 1>own snowflakes being unique, yes or no.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, you can find snowflakes that are pretty similar, okay,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, but they all grow by this pretty complex

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<v Speaker 2>accretion process where there's just a lot of water vapor condensing.

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<v Speaker 2>It's called deposition when it's going straight from vapor to

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<v Speaker 2>solid like that. But I think usually what people are

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<v Speaker 2>referring to, and I think when they talk about, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>how two snowflakes are alike, is that the weather is

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<v Speaker 2>kind of constantly changing, right, and so that causes a

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<v Speaker 2>difference in the crystal habits they call them, that are

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<v Speaker 2>coming out of the sky. Wilson Bentley is taking pictures

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<v Speaker 2>of snowflakes, I think over one hundred years ago, around

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<v Speaker 2>one hundred in Vermont, and there's been all sorts of

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<v Speaker 2>people photographing snowflakes.

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<v Speaker 1>Wilson Bentley of Vermont by the Bye was a pioneer

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<v Speaker 1>in the fields of teeny tiny weather photography and snapped

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<v Speaker 1>his first snowflake picture in the late eighteen eighties by

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<v Speaker 1>attaching a camera to a microscope. And he famously was

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<v Speaker 1>the one that argued that no two snow crystals were alike.

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<v Speaker 1>And then he died at the age of sixty six

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<v Speaker 1>after walking six miles in a blizzard. Oh Man, snow

404
00:20:22.880 --> 00:20:25.680
<v Speaker 1>is a bitchy mistress. But what makes all of these

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<v Speaker 1>glimmering icy flakes so fancy?

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<v Speaker 2>It has to do with the temperature and the super satuation,

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<v Speaker 2>So like relative humidity, you get sort of a different

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00:20:34.440 --> 00:20:38.519
<v Speaker 2>snowflake form. And they can be anything from you know,

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<v Speaker 2>dendrites like the classic snowflake, to like needles, to capped

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00:20:43.880 --> 00:20:47.960
<v Speaker 2>columns to there's a number of different sectored plates. I

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<v Speaker 2>didn't know that Ken Libreckt has a nice book of

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<v Speaker 2>coffee table book of snowflakes.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, So, Ken Lebreck is a Caltech physics professor who

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<v Speaker 1>is probably the world's best snowflakehotographer, Like he can say,

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00:21:01.559 --> 00:21:05.079
<v Speaker 1>hands down, it's him now. Among his many books are Snowflakes,

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00:21:05.279 --> 00:21:09.720
<v Speaker 1>Winter's Frozen Artistry, and Ken le Breck's Field Guide to Snowflakes.

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<v Speaker 1>If you're like, yes, I'm ordering those right now, but

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<v Speaker 1>Alli Ward, I need to see photographs immediately before my

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<v Speaker 1>books are delivered, I understand, and I direct you toward

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<v Speaker 1>his website, Snowcrystals dot com, which also lays out all

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<v Speaker 1>the different types of snowflakes, such as stellar dendrites, which

422
00:21:27.440 --> 00:21:30.160
<v Speaker 1>sounds like a European electronica band, but they're actually the

423
00:21:30.319 --> 00:21:34.119
<v Speaker 1>classic pretty star shaped ones. And then there's capped columns,

424
00:21:34.240 --> 00:21:36.839
<v Speaker 1>which are snowflakes that look like a hand weight from

425
00:21:36.920 --> 00:21:40.160
<v Speaker 1>the gym, or like a tiny, tiny icy tie fighter.

426
00:21:40.559 --> 00:21:44.359
<v Speaker 1>And then there's this shimmering diamond dust crystals. There are

427
00:21:44.400 --> 00:21:47.799
<v Speaker 1>triangular snowflakes. So looking through the gallery, one can't help

428
00:21:47.839 --> 00:21:52.640
<v Speaker 1>it say, snowflakes. I have no idea. Yeah, are you

429
00:21:52.720 --> 00:21:57.839
<v Speaker 1>ever irked by people using the term snowflake politically as

430
00:21:57.880 --> 00:21:58.440
<v Speaker 1>an insult?

431
00:21:59.480 --> 00:22:00.640
<v Speaker 3>You thought about that?

432
00:22:00.839 --> 00:22:01.039
<v Speaker 2>You know?

433
00:22:01.359 --> 00:22:02.160
<v Speaker 3>It doesn't bother me.

434
00:22:02.359 --> 00:22:05.039
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I guess you know it makes sense, right,

435
00:22:05.119 --> 00:22:07.720
<v Speaker 2>I mean, it's a funny question, like the classic snowflake

436
00:22:07.880 --> 00:22:10.119
<v Speaker 2>that we were talking about the dendrite. Right, those are

437
00:22:10.359 --> 00:22:16.279
<v Speaker 2>delicate and they do fracture and break apart easily. That's

438
00:22:16.359 --> 00:22:20.279
<v Speaker 2>not so much the case in the Sierra, for instance,

439
00:22:20.680 --> 00:22:23.799
<v Speaker 2>or most mountain ranges where it's windy. The snow that

440
00:22:23.880 --> 00:22:26.720
<v Speaker 2>falls there, well, for one thing, it's not really falling,

441
00:22:26.880 --> 00:22:30.440
<v Speaker 2>it's usually coming sideways because the winds are so strong.

442
00:22:30.640 --> 00:22:33.839
<v Speaker 2>There's a process called fragmentation by the wind where the

443
00:22:33.880 --> 00:22:38.640
<v Speaker 2>crystals are just mechanically blown apart. Oh wow, So like

444
00:22:38.759 --> 00:22:41.160
<v Speaker 2>they might start off, you know, and the clouds as

445
00:22:41.240 --> 00:22:44.200
<v Speaker 2>nice dendrites, but by the time they get to the surface,

446
00:22:44.599 --> 00:22:45.440
<v Speaker 2>they're blown apart.

447
00:22:45.839 --> 00:22:47.599
<v Speaker 1>Kind of like how at the beginning of the night

448
00:22:47.640 --> 00:22:51.880
<v Speaker 1>you might be perfectly orderly, just a complex and symmetrical vision,

449
00:22:52.119 --> 00:22:54.839
<v Speaker 1>but then maybe it's one am and one shoe broke

450
00:22:55.119 --> 00:22:58.440
<v Speaker 1>and an eyelash fell off and you got redeposited at

451
00:22:58.480 --> 00:23:01.039
<v Speaker 1>a diner instead of a dis go, if you will.

452
00:23:01.519 --> 00:23:04.519
<v Speaker 2>So, yeah, snowflakes they can actually be pretty durable. And

453
00:23:04.559 --> 00:23:06.680
<v Speaker 2>they look different like those ones are. You know, they're small,

454
00:23:06.759 --> 00:23:12.920
<v Speaker 2>they're like little specks, you know, versus larger you know,

455
00:23:12.960 --> 00:23:16.000
<v Speaker 2>all snowflakes probably look smaller to people, but right they

456
00:23:17.279 --> 00:23:19.759
<v Speaker 2>some are much much smaller. You know, like an order

457
00:23:19.799 --> 00:23:22.720
<v Speaker 2>of magnitude smaller, especially when they're disaggregated like that.

458
00:23:23.119 --> 00:23:26.440
<v Speaker 1>And then what's happening with a hailstone? What's the difference there?

459
00:23:27.200 --> 00:23:29.640
<v Speaker 2>So a hailstone is something that's liquid, but then because

460
00:23:29.680 --> 00:23:33.200
<v Speaker 2>of updraft, it comes back up and is refrozen and

461
00:23:33.400 --> 00:23:36.640
<v Speaker 2>it's usual turbulence and yeah, wow.

462
00:23:36.480 --> 00:23:38.720
<v Speaker 1>So it's a rain drop. It almost hits the ground

463
00:23:38.720 --> 00:23:41.319
<v Speaker 1>and then it's like nope, a head up to the clouds. Yeah,

464
00:23:41.440 --> 00:23:45.039
<v Speaker 1>hailstorms I just learned, are different from grapple, which is

465
00:23:45.119 --> 00:23:49.200
<v Speaker 1>when super cooled water forms around a snowflake and it

466
00:23:49.240 --> 00:23:51.519
<v Speaker 1>looks like hail, but it's not. Kind of like a

467
00:23:51.519 --> 00:23:53.839
<v Speaker 1>ball of ice made up of tiny balls of ice

468
00:23:54.079 --> 00:23:57.839
<v Speaker 1>encasing symmetrical ice crystals that formed around a speck of something.

469
00:23:58.119 --> 00:23:59.960
<v Speaker 1>It's just layers and layers.

470
00:23:59.599 --> 00:24:01.759
<v Speaker 3>Of drawn huh.

471
00:24:01.799 --> 00:24:03.960
<v Speaker 1>And then at the center of each snowflake, is there

472
00:24:03.960 --> 00:24:04.799
<v Speaker 1>a speck of dust?

473
00:24:05.960 --> 00:24:08.519
<v Speaker 2>Uh, there's some kind of condensation nuclear it could be

474
00:24:08.640 --> 00:24:12.079
<v Speaker 2>like salt, but yeah, it's basically dust for the most part.

475
00:24:12.599 --> 00:24:15.519
<v Speaker 1>And then let's get back a little bit to your

476
00:24:15.559 --> 00:24:22.000
<v Speaker 1>patrol days and avalanches and so what is causing an avalanche?

477
00:24:22.119 --> 00:24:24.400
<v Speaker 1>How much snowpack do you have to have to cause

478
00:24:24.440 --> 00:24:26.680
<v Speaker 1>an avalanche, and what is it? Essentially? Is it a

479
00:24:26.720 --> 00:24:29.680
<v Speaker 1>shelf of snow that just slips off a mountain? That

480
00:24:29.799 --> 00:24:32.799
<v Speaker 1>was an avalanche of questions. I'm sorry.

481
00:24:33.079 --> 00:24:37.279
<v Speaker 2>Ground is pretty much always right around freezing, so you know,

482
00:24:37.880 --> 00:24:42.799
<v Speaker 2>zero centigrade thirty two fahrenheit, But the snow surface can

483
00:24:42.880 --> 00:24:45.640
<v Speaker 2>really vary, in fact, right at the surfaces where all

484
00:24:45.680 --> 00:24:47.720
<v Speaker 2>the radiative transfer takes place, so that it can get

485
00:24:47.759 --> 00:24:48.279
<v Speaker 2>really cold.

486
00:24:48.440 --> 00:24:50.000
<v Speaker 1>You're like, quick, let me look at your notes on

487
00:24:50.079 --> 00:24:53.000
<v Speaker 1>radiative transfer. But I gotta admit, dog, I just copied

488
00:24:53.000 --> 00:24:56.640
<v Speaker 1>these off Wikipedia's test. But okay. Radiative transfer is the

489
00:24:56.680 --> 00:25:01.440
<v Speaker 1>physical phenomenon of energy transfer in the form of electromagnetic radiation.

490
00:25:02.039 --> 00:25:04.559
<v Speaker 1>So the surface of the snow can melt and then

491
00:25:04.559 --> 00:25:06.920
<v Speaker 1>get very cold again. I think that's what that means.

492
00:25:07.359 --> 00:25:10.440
<v Speaker 2>That can grow different crystals. So that's where you can

493
00:25:10.480 --> 00:25:13.359
<v Speaker 2>get snow that changes once it's on the ground. It

494
00:25:13.359 --> 00:25:16.720
<v Speaker 2>becomes weaker because of the metamorphic process, and there's all

495
00:25:16.799 --> 00:25:18.799
<v Speaker 2>kinds of different ones. And also new snow is just

496
00:25:19.039 --> 00:25:22.200
<v Speaker 2>it's much weaker than older snow typically, and so if

497
00:25:22.200 --> 00:25:24.279
<v Speaker 2>you're on a steep enough slope, it ca an avalanche.

498
00:25:25.519 --> 00:25:28.480
<v Speaker 2>But there's a lot to the avalanche. It has to

499
00:25:28.599 --> 00:25:32.200
<v Speaker 2>form a slab, which is like a sort of cohesive

500
00:25:32.720 --> 00:25:35.640
<v Speaker 2>like a shelf like you're talking about. Yeah, that is

501
00:25:35.720 --> 00:25:37.759
<v Speaker 2>much more dangerous than You can also have avalanches that

502
00:25:37.799 --> 00:25:39.559
<v Speaker 2>are more like something you see on a sandpile. It's

503
00:25:39.599 --> 00:25:42.319
<v Speaker 2>like a slough, and that's where it's not so well

504
00:25:42.440 --> 00:25:45.200
<v Speaker 2>stuck together. Snow is just inherently like a lot of

505
00:25:45.319 --> 00:25:51.000
<v Speaker 2>geologic it's materials. It's a layered medium, right, depending on

506
00:25:51.039 --> 00:25:52.599
<v Speaker 2>what happened with the weather and how it fell and

507
00:25:52.640 --> 00:25:54.359
<v Speaker 2>all that, it has different layers and they can have

508
00:25:54.400 --> 00:25:57.359
<v Speaker 2>different strengths if you get that the correct layering, and

509
00:25:57.400 --> 00:26:01.640
<v Speaker 2>you do have the block or shelf and slides downhill

510
00:26:01.680 --> 00:26:03.400
<v Speaker 2>and then you know the slope angle matters.

511
00:26:03.599 --> 00:26:07.960
<v Speaker 1>So what causes most avalanches if not people screaming at them?

512
00:26:08.119 --> 00:26:09.720
<v Speaker 2>Well, new snow, I mean, and this goes back to

513
00:26:09.759 --> 00:26:14.599
<v Speaker 2>Manti Atwater and the fifties. There's ten contributory factors.

514
00:26:14.839 --> 00:26:18.559
<v Speaker 1>Okay, So side note. Montgomery Atwater of Alta, Colorado is

515
00:26:18.599 --> 00:26:22.079
<v Speaker 1>the granddaddy of avalanche research. He is the dude. He's

516
00:26:22.119 --> 00:26:25.039
<v Speaker 1>also the first one who thought, well, holy hell shit,

517
00:26:25.160 --> 00:26:28.680
<v Speaker 1>let's launch small missiles at a mountain to make controlled

518
00:26:28.759 --> 00:26:33.920
<v Speaker 1>avalanches happen. Everyone's like Monty dope idea. Now his was

519
00:26:33.960 --> 00:26:36.880
<v Speaker 1>not a work I was familiar with. But among the

520
00:26:37.000 --> 00:26:40.960
<v Speaker 1>ten contributory factors are things like old snow depth, new

521
00:26:41.039 --> 00:26:45.519
<v Speaker 1>snow depth, slope angle, temperature, and Atwater's work has now

522
00:26:45.559 --> 00:26:49.599
<v Speaker 1>become like avalanche one oh one, like the no doy

523
00:26:49.839 --> 00:26:50.839
<v Speaker 1>of ic nar Nars.

524
00:26:51.000 --> 00:26:52.200
<v Speaker 3>We've known this for a long time.

525
00:26:52.279 --> 00:26:55.920
<v Speaker 2>It's when you have new snow, especially a lot of

526
00:26:55.920 --> 00:27:00.000
<v Speaker 2>new snow, it stresses the snowback. That's when you get adeline.

527
00:27:00.480 --> 00:27:04.960
<v Speaker 2>There's other things, you know, skiers. I mean, it's stress, really,

528
00:27:05.039 --> 00:27:05.640
<v Speaker 2>is what it is.

529
00:27:05.720 --> 00:27:06.319
<v Speaker 3>Skiers.

530
00:27:06.880 --> 00:27:10.839
<v Speaker 2>You can exert stress through what's called the stress ball.

531
00:27:10.960 --> 00:27:15.519
<v Speaker 2>They're affecting this weak layers. But yeah, the avalanche hazard

532
00:27:15.880 --> 00:27:18.039
<v Speaker 2>really goes up with a lot of new snow.

533
00:27:19.519 --> 00:27:22.079
<v Speaker 1>And so tell me a little bit about your work

534
00:27:22.839 --> 00:27:26.160
<v Speaker 1>blowing up these shelves of ice.

535
00:27:27.880 --> 00:27:31.680
<v Speaker 2>So when I was a ski patroller, and ski patrollers

536
00:27:31.680 --> 00:27:33.559
<v Speaker 2>all across the country and all across the world do

537
00:27:33.640 --> 00:27:38.240
<v Speaker 2>this every time it snows. And you know a significant

538
00:27:38.279 --> 00:27:41.880
<v Speaker 2>amount in big ski resorts in the Western US and

539
00:27:41.920 --> 00:27:45.480
<v Speaker 2>the Alps all over they throw explosives at the snow

540
00:27:46.160 --> 00:27:50.119
<v Speaker 2>pack to trigger avalanches so that they don't come down

541
00:27:50.359 --> 00:27:54.319
<v Speaker 2>on the gas er skiing there. And it's very much

542
00:27:54.400 --> 00:27:58.480
<v Speaker 2>an old fashioned cowboy wave controlling the hazard because you

543
00:27:58.559 --> 00:28:00.920
<v Speaker 2>light these sticks of dynamite in your hand or a

544
00:28:00.920 --> 00:28:03.200
<v Speaker 2>lot of place, Mamma still use dynamite, but a lot

545
00:28:03.240 --> 00:28:06.720
<v Speaker 2>of places use some kind of cast primer. But you know, anyway,

546
00:28:06.720 --> 00:28:10.400
<v Speaker 2>it's a high explosive and and throw it at the

547
00:28:10.480 --> 00:28:13.200
<v Speaker 2>you know, and watch it go off and see what happens.

548
00:28:13.200 --> 00:28:14.440
<v Speaker 3>And a lot of time nothing happens.

549
00:28:15.279 --> 00:28:18.480
<v Speaker 1>But oh my god, what does that sound like? The

550
00:28:18.519 --> 00:28:19.279
<v Speaker 1>whole shebang?

551
00:28:19.599 --> 00:28:20.480
<v Speaker 3>Oh? It's very loud.

552
00:28:20.599 --> 00:28:23.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and you want to watch out and damage that

553
00:28:24.119 --> 00:28:26.559
<v Speaker 2>you don't make sure that you you try to cover

554
00:28:26.559 --> 00:28:29.160
<v Speaker 2>your ears as well as you can, but of course

555
00:28:29.200 --> 00:28:31.559
<v Speaker 2>you need, you know, to be able to talk on

556
00:28:31.599 --> 00:28:33.480
<v Speaker 2>the radio and stuff like that, so it's hard to

557
00:28:33.480 --> 00:28:36.640
<v Speaker 2>totally keep your ears plugged all the time.

558
00:28:36.839 --> 00:28:38.720
<v Speaker 1>What does an avalanche sound like itself?

559
00:28:39.200 --> 00:28:41.160
<v Speaker 3>Yeah? I get that question a lot. Usually there's silent

560
00:28:41.559 --> 00:28:43.119
<v Speaker 3>what yeah, I mean.

561
00:28:43.440 --> 00:28:45.160
<v Speaker 2>So I've talked about this with other people who've seen

562
00:28:45.160 --> 00:28:47.079
<v Speaker 2>bigger avalanches than I have, and they say that you

563
00:28:47.079 --> 00:28:48.680
<v Speaker 2>can hear them when they're really big. Especially a lot

564
00:28:48.680 --> 00:28:50.640
<v Speaker 2>of times, like when they're breaking stuff, you hear the

565
00:28:50.640 --> 00:28:52.440
<v Speaker 2>stuff that they're breaking, like the trees.

566
00:28:52.759 --> 00:28:55.440
<v Speaker 3>There's a lot of friction being you know.

567
00:28:57.119 --> 00:29:01.480
<v Speaker 2>Down frictional heating and stuff with these massive avalanches. But yeah,

568
00:29:01.480 --> 00:29:05.400
<v Speaker 2>like most avalanches, there's size scale like one to five,

569
00:29:05.519 --> 00:29:06.799
<v Speaker 2>say for destructive size.

570
00:29:06.839 --> 00:29:09.200
<v Speaker 3>And you know, most of the.

571
00:29:08.680 --> 00:29:13.880
<v Speaker 2>Avalanches I've seen or destructive size three maybe two to

572
00:29:13.960 --> 00:29:15.799
<v Speaker 2>three and pretty silent.

573
00:29:17.160 --> 00:29:21.200
<v Speaker 1>Oh my gosh. And then have you ever triggered one

574
00:29:21.240 --> 00:29:23.799
<v Speaker 1>that surprised you, that was like, oh, that was bigger

575
00:29:23.799 --> 00:29:24.240
<v Speaker 1>than I thought.

576
00:29:24.400 --> 00:29:26.880
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, I got caught in a couple

577
00:29:26.960 --> 00:29:29.160
<v Speaker 2>of them as a ski patroller. And it's just one

578
00:29:29.160 --> 00:29:32.160
<v Speaker 2>of the you know, hazards of the job. I think

579
00:29:32.160 --> 00:29:36.240
<v Speaker 2>a lot of the public, I don't know what sort

580
00:29:36.240 --> 00:29:40.559
<v Speaker 2>of risks ski patrollers are subjecting themselves to to get

581
00:29:40.640 --> 00:29:43.200
<v Speaker 2>that mountain open. You know, it can be really dangerous

582
00:29:43.240 --> 00:29:47.000
<v Speaker 2>because for one thing, after done with the explosives, a

583
00:29:47.000 --> 00:29:49.279
<v Speaker 2>lot of the slopes will be ski cut ps.

584
00:29:49.319 --> 00:29:51.160
<v Speaker 1>I did have to look up what ski cutting is,

585
00:29:51.200 --> 00:29:54.920
<v Speaker 1>and it's when a ski patroller intentionally skis across a

586
00:29:55.039 --> 00:29:59.920
<v Speaker 1>dangerous pocket to maybe start an avalanche, aka in actual nightmare.

587
00:30:00.079 --> 00:30:02.759
<v Speaker 1>They do actual nightmares? Did I mention? They're not just

588
00:30:02.799 --> 00:30:05.200
<v Speaker 1>like hanging out in case you need a band aid.

589
00:30:05.200 --> 00:30:06.200
<v Speaker 3>To clean up.

590
00:30:07.039 --> 00:30:08.759
<v Speaker 2>And there's some places you don't want to ski cut,

591
00:30:08.839 --> 00:30:12.519
<v Speaker 2>and you won't ski cut, but sometimes there's just little

592
00:30:12.559 --> 00:30:14.960
<v Speaker 2>pockets that have to be dealt with. There's sort of

593
00:30:14.960 --> 00:30:18.160
<v Speaker 2>a systematic process for doing that. But it means you're

594
00:30:18.279 --> 00:30:21.240
<v Speaker 2>you know, inexposed. You you can be really exposed. And

595
00:30:21.240 --> 00:30:24.720
<v Speaker 2>that's how I've gotten caught in the few avalanches that

596
00:30:24.759 --> 00:30:26.720
<v Speaker 2>I've been in, has always.

597
00:30:26.480 --> 00:30:27.240
<v Speaker 3>Been ski cutting.

598
00:30:27.559 --> 00:30:28.559
<v Speaker 1>Did you dig your way out?

599
00:30:28.720 --> 00:30:28.880
<v Speaker 3>You know?

600
00:30:28.920 --> 00:30:31.039
<v Speaker 2>I didn't get fully buried, so mostly just went for

601
00:30:31.039 --> 00:30:34.359
<v Speaker 2>a ride, you know, a couple hundred feet like buried

602
00:30:34.400 --> 00:30:36.119
<v Speaker 2>up to my waist that kind of thing. Oh man,

603
00:30:36.200 --> 00:30:38.000
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, but you know I never got hurt in

604
00:30:38.039 --> 00:30:39.240
<v Speaker 2>an avalanche.

605
00:30:39.440 --> 00:30:41.559
<v Speaker 1>That was just like a Tuesday at the office.

606
00:30:41.200 --> 00:30:44.000
<v Speaker 3>For you, I guess. Yeah. It's a hard thing with

607
00:30:44.039 --> 00:30:44.680
<v Speaker 3>the ski cutting.

608
00:30:44.759 --> 00:30:48.160
<v Speaker 2>You know, it's kind of a controversial practice, but you know,

609
00:30:48.200 --> 00:30:51.039
<v Speaker 2>if you really think about it, it's it's something that

610
00:30:51.039 --> 00:30:53.039
<v Speaker 2>you can't get away from as a ski patroller.

611
00:30:53.079 --> 00:30:54.799
<v Speaker 3>I mean, there's certain areas they're always gonna have to

612
00:30:54.799 --> 00:30:55.200
<v Speaker 3>ski cut.

613
00:30:55.279 --> 00:30:58.480
<v Speaker 1>So oh man, what do you do? To warm up

614
00:30:58.519 --> 00:31:00.759
<v Speaker 1>when you've done this. Is it Is there part of

615
00:31:00.839 --> 00:31:03.000
<v Speaker 1>working in snow that involves going to a lodge and

616
00:31:03.079 --> 00:31:05.279
<v Speaker 1>drinking cocoa or is that just a fantasy that I have.

617
00:31:05.920 --> 00:31:07.759
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, well, it depends on where you are. I mean

618
00:31:07.799 --> 00:31:10.799
<v Speaker 2>when I was keep patrolling, there's ski patrol shacks where

619
00:31:10.799 --> 00:31:13.440
<v Speaker 2>you sit bump, which means you wait for like someone

620
00:31:13.440 --> 00:31:15.359
<v Speaker 2>to get hurt and then you you know, and you

621
00:31:15.400 --> 00:31:17.640
<v Speaker 2>try to keep one or two people up there at

622
00:31:17.640 --> 00:31:19.799
<v Speaker 2>all times so that someone you because you want to

623
00:31:20.119 --> 00:31:23.599
<v Speaker 2>go downhill to get people when you're out in the

624
00:31:23.640 --> 00:31:27.839
<v Speaker 2>field for some of these you know, like doing snow research,

625
00:31:28.160 --> 00:31:31.240
<v Speaker 2>like for instance, I'm involved in this NASA snowex experiment,

626
00:31:31.400 --> 00:31:35.240
<v Speaker 2>which is a large field campaign for validating some instruments

627
00:31:35.279 --> 00:31:38.319
<v Speaker 2>that be flown on planes. You know, if you're in

628
00:31:38.359 --> 00:31:41.799
<v Speaker 2>that wilderness sort of a setting, yeah, there's nowhere to go,

629
00:31:41.920 --> 00:31:43.960
<v Speaker 2>so you just try to really bring a lot of

630
00:31:44.000 --> 00:31:46.200
<v Speaker 2>warm clothes and moving, I mean moving around is really

631
00:31:46.240 --> 00:31:48.480
<v Speaker 2>the best thing you can do. It's really cold, but

632
00:31:49.160 --> 00:31:51.759
<v Speaker 2>sometimes it just sucks, like you're just a really cold

633
00:31:51.799 --> 00:31:54.119
<v Speaker 2>and you know, you bring extra like especially when you're

634
00:31:54.119 --> 00:31:57.680
<v Speaker 2>doing a lot of snowpedwork, your gloves get like, even

635
00:31:57.680 --> 00:32:00.519
<v Speaker 2>if they're you know, whatever, the best court gloves you

636
00:32:00.519 --> 00:32:02.640
<v Speaker 2>can get, are they get soaking wet, so you know,

637
00:32:02.920 --> 00:32:06.240
<v Speaker 2>rum multiple pairs of gloves and switch them and and yeah,

638
00:32:06.279 --> 00:32:09.160
<v Speaker 2>sometimes it's just cold and miserable. And that's just you know,

639
00:32:09.240 --> 00:32:12.160
<v Speaker 2>my hands get cold. I'm not sure they get especially cold,

640
00:32:12.160 --> 00:32:15.599
<v Speaker 2>but I'm definitely not. I definitely have problems with that.

641
00:32:15.640 --> 00:32:17.839
<v Speaker 2>And it can be no fun. Sometimes you can be

642
00:32:17.880 --> 00:32:20.480
<v Speaker 2>freezing cold in some pretty cool places. I guess, right,

643
00:32:20.759 --> 00:32:22.799
<v Speaker 2>I guess cool. I guess I should think cool is

644
00:32:22.839 --> 00:32:26.359
<v Speaker 2>a poor choice of the word. There's a lot of beauty.

645
00:32:26.400 --> 00:32:27.680
<v Speaker 2>I guess that makes up for it.

646
00:32:28.519 --> 00:32:30.400
<v Speaker 1>And what is the research that you're doing right now?

647
00:32:30.440 --> 00:32:30.960
<v Speaker 1>Focus on?

648
00:32:31.440 --> 00:32:33.920
<v Speaker 2>Okay, So what I do now is I do a

649
00:32:34.000 --> 00:32:37.599
<v Speaker 2>large scale hydrologic and remote sensing work. So I'm doing

650
00:32:37.720 --> 00:32:43.559
<v Speaker 2>snowpack astimates across large areas and concentrating in high mountain Asia,

651
00:32:43.720 --> 00:32:46.920
<v Speaker 2>in particularly in the western parts of high mountain Asia,

652
00:32:47.039 --> 00:32:52.799
<v Speaker 2>like Afghanistan and Pakistan, the Upper Indus River, which is

653
00:32:53.119 --> 00:32:58.519
<v Speaker 2>huge source of drinking water, particularly like Afghanistan, and a

654
00:32:58.559 --> 00:33:02.839
<v Speaker 2>lot of the Upper Indus shares of climatological similarities with California.

655
00:33:02.960 --> 00:33:04.559
<v Speaker 2>And then it kind of a wet winter and then

656
00:33:04.559 --> 00:33:06.599
<v Speaker 2>a dry it's more continental and it is different, but

657
00:33:07.200 --> 00:33:10.519
<v Speaker 2>dry summer and it's not monsoon dominated. It's mostly water

658
00:33:10.559 --> 00:33:15.240
<v Speaker 2>resources work to estimate snowpacked volumes because because the snow,

659
00:33:15.440 --> 00:33:18.880
<v Speaker 2>it sort of acts as a reservoir because it's frozen

660
00:33:18.960 --> 00:33:20.000
<v Speaker 2>up there, and then if you're in a place like

661
00:33:20.039 --> 00:33:22.720
<v Speaker 2>afghanister in California conveniently starts melting in the summer, which

662
00:33:22.759 --> 00:33:23.440
<v Speaker 2>is the dry season.

663
00:33:24.200 --> 00:33:25.240
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, it feeds the rivers.

664
00:33:25.839 --> 00:33:28.000
<v Speaker 2>Going back to the stuff about the spatial variability in

665
00:33:28.039 --> 00:33:30.559
<v Speaker 2>the snowpack, it's it's a tough thing to figure out

666
00:33:30.960 --> 00:33:34.160
<v Speaker 2>how much snow is up there. And the two big

667
00:33:34.160 --> 00:33:35.920
<v Speaker 2>problems right are like how much is up there and

668
00:33:35.960 --> 00:33:37.039
<v Speaker 2>how fast is it going to melt?

669
00:33:37.039 --> 00:33:37.960
<v Speaker 3>When's it going to melt?

670
00:33:38.920 --> 00:33:43.319
<v Speaker 2>But in a place like Afghanistan, there's no snowpack measurements,

671
00:33:43.359 --> 00:33:46.440
<v Speaker 2>so the rivers will just go dry in September and

672
00:33:46.440 --> 00:33:49.880
<v Speaker 2>it's a humanitarian crisis. And so we can we can

673
00:33:49.960 --> 00:33:51.799
<v Speaker 2>kind of help out with that a little bit with

674
00:33:51.799 --> 00:33:55.279
<v Speaker 2>the remote sensing by giving an idea of what sort

675
00:33:55.279 --> 00:33:57.200
<v Speaker 2>of runoff to expect based on how much snow is

676
00:33:57.279 --> 00:33:59.680
<v Speaker 2>up there, and that can be really useful for hu

677
00:33:59.720 --> 00:34:02.720
<v Speaker 2>managed aid and lead lead times.

678
00:34:02.920 --> 00:34:07.000
<v Speaker 1>And stupid question. Favorite or least favorite movie about snow

679
00:34:07.799 --> 00:34:09.480
<v Speaker 1>or ice or avalanches?

680
00:34:10.039 --> 00:34:11.039
<v Speaker 3>Least favorite or favorite?

681
00:34:11.079 --> 00:34:13.000
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, whatever, whatever you have a reaction to.

682
00:34:13.840 --> 00:34:16.599
<v Speaker 2>Oh, I'm trying to remember the name of the movie,

683
00:34:16.639 --> 00:34:18.920
<v Speaker 2>but it was really bad. It was Josh Hartnett was

684
00:34:18.920 --> 00:34:21.000
<v Speaker 2>in it and he got there's this guy who got

685
00:34:21.039 --> 00:34:22.800
<v Speaker 2>lost off the back of Mammoth Mountain.

686
00:34:23.159 --> 00:34:25.960
<v Speaker 1>Okay, I looked into it and it was six degrees

687
00:34:26.239 --> 00:34:29.400
<v Speaker 1>Miracle on the Mountain about a guy who loses this

688
00:34:29.480 --> 00:34:31.840
<v Speaker 1>way I think math is involved, and then is like,

689
00:34:32.199 --> 00:34:34.960
<v Speaker 1>maybe I'll clear my head shredding on some fresh powder.

690
00:34:35.360 --> 00:34:38.119
<v Speaker 1>I said it away for a few days, enjoy the mountain.

691
00:34:38.159 --> 00:34:42.079
<v Speaker 1>There always do any whosel A storm comes, but it's

692
00:34:42.119 --> 00:34:45.239
<v Speaker 1>not just the winter that's harsh. This movie scored a

693
00:34:45.480 --> 00:34:48.239
<v Speaker 1>twenty two with critics on Rotten Tomatoes.

694
00:34:48.719 --> 00:34:51.159
<v Speaker 2>I was not a big fan of this. This film

695
00:34:52.119 --> 00:34:53.960
<v Speaker 2>went straight. I don't think it even made it to

696
00:34:54.000 --> 00:34:54.639
<v Speaker 2>the theaters.

697
00:34:54.800 --> 00:34:55.719
<v Speaker 3>It's not orth.

698
00:34:55.599 --> 00:34:59.000
<v Speaker 2>Even I'm remembering. This happened while I was patrolling the

699
00:34:59.039 --> 00:35:01.440
<v Speaker 2>made of movie out of it. There were wolves and

700
00:35:01.480 --> 00:35:04.760
<v Speaker 2>there's like, you know there are no wolves and have

701
00:35:04.840 --> 00:35:07.960
<v Speaker 2>sort of this terrible I mean not to. I think

702
00:35:08.000 --> 00:35:10.639
<v Speaker 2>maybe a better filmmaker could have made the story more

703
00:35:10.639 --> 00:35:13.119
<v Speaker 2>convincing anyway. But of course, my all time favorite movie

704
00:35:13.199 --> 00:35:15.840
<v Speaker 2>is Aspect Extreme, which is a ski film from the

705
00:35:15.880 --> 00:35:16.559
<v Speaker 2>mid nineties.

706
00:35:16.639 --> 00:35:19.880
<v Speaker 1>Sorr's about one hundred guys maybe to make until spring. Okay,

707
00:35:19.880 --> 00:35:23.719
<v Speaker 1>so ask An Extreme from nineteen ninety three features cool

708
00:35:23.800 --> 00:35:27.559
<v Speaker 1>dudes with borderline mullets, and as fate would have it,

709
00:35:27.559 --> 00:35:30.880
<v Speaker 1>it too scored a twenty two percent on Rotten Tomatoes.

710
00:35:31.039 --> 00:35:33.639
<v Speaker 2>It's just more formative for me when I saw it

711
00:35:33.639 --> 00:35:34.760
<v Speaker 2>because I was younger, and.

712
00:35:34.599 --> 00:35:37.159
<v Speaker 1>It's inspiring and inspiring.

713
00:35:37.800 --> 00:35:43.559
<v Speaker 3>Perhaps, Yeah, yeah, so I don't have you know, those

714
00:35:43.559 --> 00:35:44.000
<v Speaker 3>are the two.

715
00:35:44.000 --> 00:35:45.519
<v Speaker 2>They just just off the top of my I mean,

716
00:35:45.519 --> 00:35:48.119
<v Speaker 2>there's been a lot of you know, terrible ski movies that, yeah,

717
00:35:48.280 --> 00:35:51.039
<v Speaker 2>people love, so I guess that's one of mine.

718
00:35:51.400 --> 00:35:55.280
<v Speaker 1>Okay, I have questions from listeners. Oh okay, you ready, sure,

719
00:35:55.840 --> 00:35:59.199
<v Speaker 1>But before we take questions from you, our beloved listeners,

720
00:35:59.239 --> 00:36:01.559
<v Speaker 1>we're going to take a quick break for sponsors of

721
00:36:01.599 --> 00:36:04.280
<v Speaker 1>the show. Sponsors. Why sponsors? You know what they do?

722
00:36:04.400 --> 00:36:08.159
<v Speaker 1>They help us give money to charity of our ologists' choice,

723
00:36:08.239 --> 00:36:12.840
<v Speaker 1>which this week is the Eastern Sierra Avalanche Center. Esavalanche

724
00:36:12.880 --> 00:36:17.000
<v Speaker 1>dot org and it's a nonprofit that provides quality avalanche

725
00:36:17.079 --> 00:36:20.119
<v Speaker 1>and snowpack information to folks in the eastern Sierra Nevadas

726
00:36:20.360 --> 00:36:23.039
<v Speaker 1>with a goal of helping them make better decisions while

727
00:36:23.079 --> 00:36:27.039
<v Speaker 1>traveling in avalanche terrain, so saving lives now. It was

728
00:36:27.119 --> 00:36:31.039
<v Speaker 1>founded by ned's mentor, Walter Rosenthal, who lost his life

729
00:36:31.159 --> 00:36:35.480
<v Speaker 1>rescuing others. Walter remains the president in memoriam. So thank

730
00:36:35.519 --> 00:36:38.679
<v Speaker 1>you patrons and listeners for helping ologies contribute to that cause. Again,

731
00:36:38.719 --> 00:36:44.840
<v Speaker 1>it's es avalanche dot org. Okay, okay, your questions all right,

732
00:36:44.920 --> 00:36:48.760
<v Speaker 1>listener questions, let's have them. Here we go. A lot

733
00:36:48.760 --> 00:36:51.199
<v Speaker 1>of questions. People excited about snow. Oh okay, So I'm

734
00:36:51.199 --> 00:36:53.719
<v Speaker 1>just gonna list these off. Several people Marissa Brewer, May

735
00:36:53.760 --> 00:36:56.519
<v Speaker 1>Merrill and Juan Pedro Martinez wanted to know what makes

736
00:36:56.559 --> 00:36:57.559
<v Speaker 1>the snow white.

737
00:36:57.960 --> 00:36:58.920
<v Speaker 3>Oh, that's a good question.

738
00:36:59.480 --> 00:37:03.159
<v Speaker 2>So the snow is white invisible wavelengths, because that's what

739
00:37:03.199 --> 00:37:05.800
<v Speaker 2>we see in it's actually wouldn't be and if we

740
00:37:05.800 --> 00:37:08.239
<v Speaker 2>could see into then you know, near infra red actually

741
00:37:08.239 --> 00:37:11.639
<v Speaker 2>gets really dark, which is one way you can figure

742
00:37:11.679 --> 00:37:14.239
<v Speaker 2>out what you're looking at. When you have a satellite

743
00:37:14.320 --> 00:37:18.639
<v Speaker 2>or a spectrometer something that senses in multiple wavelengths, a

744
00:37:18.719 --> 00:37:22.559
<v Speaker 2>multi spectral instrument. But it's white just because snow has

745
00:37:22.599 --> 00:37:26.159
<v Speaker 2>a very low what's called the complex index of refraction,

746
00:37:26.440 --> 00:37:31.639
<v Speaker 2>so it's very transparent. And what that means actually is

747
00:37:31.679 --> 00:37:33.960
<v Speaker 2>that it tends to scatter.

748
00:37:34.800 --> 00:37:36.639
<v Speaker 3>Light that comes into it instead of absorb it.

749
00:37:37.199 --> 00:37:40.079
<v Speaker 2>Okay, and absorbing is what makes something dark, right, Right,

750
00:37:40.159 --> 00:37:42.880
<v Speaker 2>the photons are coming in and they bounce around in

751
00:37:42.880 --> 00:37:44.159
<v Speaker 2>the snowpack and then come back out.

752
00:37:44.719 --> 00:37:46.400
<v Speaker 3>And that's that's bright when.

753
00:37:46.280 --> 00:37:52.400
<v Speaker 2>You white because it's an all the wavelengths getting scattered

754
00:37:52.760 --> 00:37:53.320
<v Speaker 2>back at you.

755
00:37:53.840 --> 00:37:56.280
<v Speaker 1>Ah, So it doesn't absorb it.

756
00:37:56.320 --> 00:38:00.760
<v Speaker 3>Well, that's right in the visible wavelengths. Yeah, got it exactly.

757
00:38:00.920 --> 00:38:04.760
<v Speaker 1>Ah, there we go. A ton of people had avalanche questions, obviously,

758
00:38:05.039 --> 00:38:06.920
<v Speaker 1>and I will list them all in and aside because

759
00:38:06.920 --> 00:38:09.840
<v Speaker 1>there's a lot of names. Okay, they are Tony Ben Venuti,

760
00:38:10.000 --> 00:38:14.159
<v Speaker 1>all Off, Josh Key, Brooke Besone, Barbara Blackie Grace Gonzalez,

761
00:38:14.199 --> 00:38:18.880
<v Speaker 1>Henry Strong, Wendy Fick, Christopher Enberer, Danny Bockheiser, Greer Nelson,

762
00:38:19.320 --> 00:38:23.039
<v Speaker 1>Dustin Parish. Also, please remember we're sitting on a bench

763
00:38:23.199 --> 00:38:25.760
<v Speaker 1>outside an airport, so do enjoy the ambient sounds of

764
00:38:25.800 --> 00:38:29.679
<v Speaker 1>a few trucks rumbling passed. Also, his layover was almost up.

765
00:38:29.719 --> 00:38:32.360
<v Speaker 1>Oh and here's that info about airbags that I promised

766
00:38:32.400 --> 00:38:35.239
<v Speaker 1>you earlier. Jane Ennis essentially asked, what is the best

767
00:38:35.239 --> 00:38:39.239
<v Speaker 1>way to survive an avalanche other than not being in one?

768
00:38:39.440 --> 00:38:42.239
<v Speaker 3>So I think the air avalanche airbags have.

769
00:38:42.239 --> 00:38:47.920
<v Speaker 2>Been a revolution in protective personal protective equipment is what

770
00:38:47.960 --> 00:38:50.599
<v Speaker 2>they call it, which you know first key patroller used

771
00:38:50.599 --> 00:38:53.599
<v Speaker 2>to be like CPR, mask and gloves and stuff, and

772
00:38:53.679 --> 00:38:55.960
<v Speaker 2>now include helmets and avalanche air bags.

773
00:38:56.079 --> 00:38:57.559
<v Speaker 3>Interesting story about it.

774
00:38:57.760 --> 00:39:02.559
<v Speaker 2>The guy who invented the the air bag system ABS

775
00:39:02.840 --> 00:39:05.880
<v Speaker 2>was a German hunter who had been in a couple avalanches.

776
00:39:06.199 --> 00:39:06.599
<v Speaker 3>One time.

777
00:39:06.599 --> 00:39:09.239
<v Speaker 2>He had a shamois, which is like a little European

778
00:39:09.559 --> 00:39:12.280
<v Speaker 2>deer Oh wow, slung around his neck and you've rowed

779
00:39:12.320 --> 00:39:14.480
<v Speaker 2>to the top of the avalanche and figure out, hey,

780
00:39:14.480 --> 00:39:17.000
<v Speaker 2>this worked pretty well. And you thought it was a

781
00:39:17.079 --> 00:39:20.719
<v Speaker 2>surface area thing. That's not quite right. It's an effect

782
00:39:20.800 --> 00:39:24.280
<v Speaker 2>called inverse segregation. But it's the brazil nut effect. It's

783
00:39:24.280 --> 00:39:28.360
<v Speaker 2>like shake a can of nuts and basically all the

784
00:39:28.360 --> 00:39:31.280
<v Speaker 2>little nuts fill in the holes and make the big nut.

785
00:39:31.320 --> 00:39:33.920
<v Speaker 2>The brazil nuts rise to the top huh.

786
00:39:33.480 --> 00:39:36.320
<v Speaker 1>And remember how ice floats in a glass. I also

787
00:39:36.360 --> 00:39:39.679
<v Speaker 1>read that icy snow is less dense than your watery

788
00:39:40.000 --> 00:39:42.320
<v Speaker 1>human body and so you'll sink in it fast. So

789
00:39:42.400 --> 00:39:45.360
<v Speaker 1>having a large light air bag, which kind of looks

790
00:39:45.400 --> 00:39:47.639
<v Speaker 1>like a U shaped pillow you'd use to take a

791
00:39:47.719 --> 00:39:49.960
<v Speaker 1>nap on an airplane, but like four times as big,

792
00:39:50.119 --> 00:39:52.440
<v Speaker 1>can float you right up to the top of the slide.

793
00:39:52.719 --> 00:39:55.199
<v Speaker 1>So if you don't have an air bag, another way

794
00:39:55.239 --> 00:39:57.559
<v Speaker 1>to survive an avalanche is just to try to move

795
00:39:57.599 --> 00:40:00.679
<v Speaker 1>to the side of it as quickly as possible and

796
00:40:01.039 --> 00:40:03.599
<v Speaker 1>to struggle to get your head above the snow wants.

797
00:40:03.639 --> 00:40:06.039
<v Speaker 1>The movement is slowing down, so you want to get

798
00:40:06.039 --> 00:40:09.360
<v Speaker 1>your head up Those first fifteen minutes after an avalanche critical. Now.

799
00:40:09.400 --> 00:40:13.000
<v Speaker 1>Another strategy is to just never go outside ever again. Ever,

800
00:40:13.199 --> 00:40:16.079
<v Speaker 1>stay warm, watch that seventy show on cable even if

801
00:40:16.079 --> 00:40:17.239
<v Speaker 1>you don't really like it.

802
00:40:17.360 --> 00:40:20.639
<v Speaker 2>Or Yeah, airbags so so no, those are those are

803
00:40:20.760 --> 00:40:25.519
<v Speaker 2>I think the biggest safety improvement that I've seen in

804
00:40:25.559 --> 00:40:26.360
<v Speaker 2>my lifetime.

805
00:40:26.480 --> 00:40:27.880
<v Speaker 3>And I ski with an airbag.

806
00:40:27.920 --> 00:40:29.599
<v Speaker 2>It doesn't add too much weight, you know, it's like

807
00:40:29.880 --> 00:40:31.920
<v Speaker 2>maybe four pounds extra or so in a pack.

808
00:40:33.679 --> 00:40:35.559
<v Speaker 1>Did you say he had a deer around his neck.

809
00:40:35.639 --> 00:40:39.360
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, shamoa is that a living deer? Dead one because

810
00:40:39.400 --> 00:40:43.280
<v Speaker 3>he's a hunter? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, you.

811
00:40:43.159 --> 00:40:44.119
<v Speaker 1>Just ski with one of these.

812
00:40:44.280 --> 00:40:46.039
<v Speaker 3>No, no, okay, he was just bringing it home, you know.

813
00:40:46.199 --> 00:40:48.079
<v Speaker 1>Got it? Okay? I was like you just you just

814
00:40:48.119 --> 00:40:50.880
<v Speaker 1>walk around with a live, cute deer on your Okay,

815
00:40:50.960 --> 00:40:51.679
<v Speaker 1>that makes more sense.

816
00:40:51.719 --> 00:40:53.840
<v Speaker 2>But they're a little or too I don't know. I

817
00:40:53.840 --> 00:40:57.599
<v Speaker 2>don't know too much about shamwaya.

818
00:40:56.599 --> 00:41:01.360
<v Speaker 1>Ps A shemois is a European goat antelope. Sam Wow

819
00:41:02.239 --> 00:41:05.639
<v Speaker 1>m Maer and Cynthia Barts both had igloo questions. How

820
00:41:05.679 --> 00:41:07.360
<v Speaker 1>can an igloo keep you warm when it's made of

821
00:41:07.360 --> 00:41:08.760
<v Speaker 1>tiny frozen water droplets?

822
00:41:09.039 --> 00:41:12.039
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So snow is actually a great insulator because it's

823
00:41:12.039 --> 00:41:14.400
<v Speaker 2>got a lot of air in it. So if you

824
00:41:14.400 --> 00:41:18.199
<v Speaker 2>think about it, any material that has a lot of

825
00:41:18.320 --> 00:41:20.880
<v Speaker 2>air and it can kind of work as a good insulator.

826
00:41:20.880 --> 00:41:23.840
<v Speaker 2>I mean sick of strawb ale or something like that.

827
00:41:24.079 --> 00:41:26.480
<v Speaker 2>And so that's the idea, right, if you build up

828
00:41:26.480 --> 00:41:29.719
<v Speaker 2>blocks like that, and also they keep out the wind.

829
00:41:30.280 --> 00:41:32.360
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, it's actually a pretty good insulate. That's why

830
00:41:32.360 --> 00:41:33.639
<v Speaker 2>snow sticks around for so long.

831
00:41:34.199 --> 00:41:36.320
<v Speaker 1>Oh, because there's so much air in it.

832
00:41:36.320 --> 00:41:37.159
<v Speaker 3>It's a good insulator.

833
00:41:37.280 --> 00:41:38.920
<v Speaker 1>I didn't know that. So if there were blocks of

834
00:41:38.920 --> 00:41:41.800
<v Speaker 1>ice and igluo wouldn't be as warm but the snow

835
00:41:41.880 --> 00:41:43.559
<v Speaker 1>because there's more air in the snow.

836
00:41:43.679 --> 00:41:44.119
<v Speaker 3>That's true.

837
00:41:44.199 --> 00:41:47.679
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, solid blocks of sea ice would not work as well, okay,

838
00:41:48.159 --> 00:41:50.639
<v Speaker 2>although they would still provide shelter from the wind, which

839
00:41:50.679 --> 00:41:51.480
<v Speaker 2>which helps a lot.

840
00:41:51.760 --> 00:41:54.199
<v Speaker 1>Okay. Also side note, I just learned that igloo in

841
00:41:54.320 --> 00:41:57.760
<v Speaker 1>some Inuit languages can mean broadly a house or a

842
00:41:57.760 --> 00:42:00.800
<v Speaker 1>home built out of any material, and that the snow

843
00:42:00.840 --> 00:42:04.280
<v Speaker 1>house that's typically called an igloo actually has a much

844
00:42:04.280 --> 00:42:07.679
<v Speaker 1>more specific name. And yes, linguists have studied a bunch

845
00:42:07.760 --> 00:42:10.719
<v Speaker 1>of Arctic regional languages and yep, there's a ton of

846
00:42:10.760 --> 00:42:13.519
<v Speaker 1>words for different kinds of snow. The Sami people of

847
00:42:13.559 --> 00:42:17.079
<v Speaker 1>northern Scandinavia and Russia they got a thousand words just

848
00:42:17.119 --> 00:42:20.119
<v Speaker 1>for reindeer. How boss is that also part in the

849
00:42:20.159 --> 00:42:22.519
<v Speaker 1>planes taking off? Did I mention that we recorded this

850
00:42:22.599 --> 00:42:25.519
<v Speaker 1>on a bench outside of lax I feel like I did. Okay.

851
00:42:25.599 --> 00:42:29.760
<v Speaker 1>Let's talk eating snow, which was asked by patrons Alisa Norman,

852
00:42:30.119 --> 00:42:33.119
<v Speaker 1>Jason Steinhoff, and m Mauer. A lot of people had

853
00:42:33.199 --> 00:42:36.400
<v Speaker 1>questions about eating snow. Kristin Long in particular, asked as

854
00:42:36.440 --> 00:42:38.079
<v Speaker 1>a child, I was never sure if it was okay

855
00:42:38.119 --> 00:42:41.559
<v Speaker 1>to eat snow, obviously not the yellow kind, or if

856
00:42:41.599 --> 00:42:43.880
<v Speaker 1>it really was full of chemicals? Do this smog and

857
00:42:43.920 --> 00:42:47.079
<v Speaker 1>the atmosphere? So does where you live make a difference

858
00:42:47.320 --> 00:42:48.920
<v Speaker 1>on whether or not it's okay to eat snow?

859
00:42:49.239 --> 00:42:50.000
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, it does.

860
00:42:50.199 --> 00:42:52.360
<v Speaker 2>I mean it's all that stuff in the atmosphere and

861
00:42:52.400 --> 00:42:54.880
<v Speaker 2>the condensation nuclei and all that stuff we're talking about.

862
00:42:54.920 --> 00:42:57.320
<v Speaker 2>You know, you can definitely have impurities in the snowpack.

863
00:42:57.320 --> 00:43:00.760
<v Speaker 2>And then we also you also get deposition from dust,

864
00:43:00.960 --> 00:43:02.679
<v Speaker 2>for instance, on the snow. That's a big issue in

865
00:43:02.679 --> 00:43:04.559
<v Speaker 2>the Western US, and so that's once it's on the ground.

866
00:43:04.679 --> 00:43:07.519
<v Speaker 2>But they get these big dust storms in southern Colorado

867
00:43:07.960 --> 00:43:10.159
<v Speaker 2>and more of these continental areas because you know, we

868
00:43:10.239 --> 00:43:11.679
<v Speaker 2>just have the ocean and most of the dust, like

869
00:43:11.679 --> 00:43:14.119
<v Speaker 2>from China, that's not making it over here, but they

870
00:43:14.159 --> 00:43:16.719
<v Speaker 2>have local sources of dust that they can trace, and

871
00:43:16.800 --> 00:43:17.239
<v Speaker 2>they get.

872
00:43:17.079 --> 00:43:19.760
<v Speaker 3>These apocalyptic looking dust storms.

873
00:43:20.079 --> 00:43:22.719
<v Speaker 2>There's just other stuff, Especially the older and longer that

874
00:43:22.800 --> 00:43:24.559
<v Speaker 2>the snow has been there, it tends to get stuff

875
00:43:24.559 --> 00:43:28.039
<v Speaker 2>on top, like like there's an algae that grows on

876
00:43:28.079 --> 00:43:29.880
<v Speaker 2>the snow, claiming Donnas.

877
00:43:29.559 --> 00:43:31.480
<v Speaker 1>In the vallis that snow boo?

878
00:43:31.639 --> 00:43:33.079
<v Speaker 3>Yeah? I think is it a it's a funk.

879
00:43:33.199 --> 00:43:35.760
<v Speaker 2>No, it's an algae I think anyway, make you sick

880
00:43:35.840 --> 00:43:37.519
<v Speaker 2>if you eat too.

881
00:43:37.440 --> 00:43:37.880
<v Speaker 3>Much of it.

882
00:43:38.119 --> 00:43:39.800
<v Speaker 1>Side notes, So I look this up and it's called

883
00:43:39.920 --> 00:43:43.639
<v Speaker 1>watermelon snow because of this pink blush that the algal

884
00:43:43.719 --> 00:43:46.920
<v Speaker 1>blooms cost and it even smells like watermelon. But don't

885
00:43:46.920 --> 00:43:49.719
<v Speaker 1>eat it now of course. Of course, just like snail,

886
00:43:50.440 --> 00:43:53.039
<v Speaker 1>it's somehow popped up as an ingredient and way too

887
00:43:53.119 --> 00:43:56.480
<v Speaker 1>expensive face serums because I don't know, maybe a drop

888
00:43:56.519 --> 00:44:00.239
<v Speaker 1>of snow algae juice will make me look younger, so

889
00:44:00.280 --> 00:44:03.440
<v Speaker 1>somebody loves me, and I don't die alone with my

890
00:44:03.519 --> 00:44:07.159
<v Speaker 1>mini Schnauzer left to devour my corpse. I think that's

891
00:44:07.199 --> 00:44:09.760
<v Speaker 1>the thinking behind it, anyway, So maybe don't now What

892
00:44:09.840 --> 00:44:12.480
<v Speaker 1>if you are kind of stranded like Jason Steinhoff asked,

893
00:44:12.519 --> 00:44:14.480
<v Speaker 1>is it true that a stranded human cannot eat snow

894
00:44:14.519 --> 00:44:18.960
<v Speaker 1>fast enough to stay properly hydrated? And m maur asked,

895
00:44:19.079 --> 00:44:21.920
<v Speaker 1>is eating snow actually dehydrating because you spend more energy

896
00:44:22.000 --> 00:44:23.679
<v Speaker 1>melting the snow than you get from drinking the water.

897
00:44:23.880 --> 00:44:25.719
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you're definitely better off melting it if you have

898
00:44:25.800 --> 00:44:28.880
<v Speaker 2>fire or like a stove. I mean, that's pretty standard

899
00:44:28.880 --> 00:44:31.880
<v Speaker 2>in most expeditions. You are, you know, getting it to

900
00:44:31.880 --> 00:44:33.800
<v Speaker 2>go through that phase change. It does require a lot

901
00:44:33.800 --> 00:44:35.559
<v Speaker 2>of energy, so it's not the most efficient way, but

902
00:44:35.800 --> 00:44:38.679
<v Speaker 2>you are still getting the water. So yeah, if you're desperate,

903
00:44:38.760 --> 00:44:41.119
<v Speaker 2>I mean, you can melt somebody. Yeah, it'll make it

904
00:44:41.159 --> 00:44:41.639
<v Speaker 2>really cold.

905
00:44:41.920 --> 00:44:44.760
<v Speaker 1>So what if you have nothing to melt snow with? Okay,

906
00:44:44.840 --> 00:44:47.400
<v Speaker 1>I spent way too long on survivalist message boards, and

907
00:44:47.440 --> 00:44:50.280
<v Speaker 1>apparently if you have a canteen, you fill it up

908
00:44:50.280 --> 00:44:52.599
<v Speaker 1>with snow and you tuck it between your layers of

909
00:44:52.599 --> 00:44:55.559
<v Speaker 1>clothing and you let your body heat melt it such

910
00:44:55.559 --> 00:44:58.960
<v Speaker 1>your body do it, or you can suck on small

911
00:44:59.000 --> 00:45:01.800
<v Speaker 1>amounts of snow in a time. I just don't eat ice

912
00:45:02.119 --> 00:45:05.559
<v Speaker 1>like it's pudding. Also, one thread said you could pee

913
00:45:05.599 --> 00:45:07.760
<v Speaker 1>in a bucket of snow and just melt it that way,

914
00:45:07.960 --> 00:45:11.039
<v Speaker 1>so you wouldn't be eating yellow snow. I guess technically

915
00:45:11.079 --> 00:45:13.440
<v Speaker 1>at that point it would be a beverage. What's my point?

916
00:45:13.599 --> 00:45:16.679
<v Speaker 1>Just bring a canteen or stay inside forever. A lot

917
00:45:16.719 --> 00:45:19.039
<v Speaker 1>of questions about climate change metal in Heistein wanted to know.

918
00:45:19.119 --> 00:45:20.719
<v Speaker 1>I live in Boston. Last winter we had a bomb

919
00:45:20.719 --> 00:45:23.840
<v Speaker 1>cyclone storm that everyone was freaking out about. And she's

920
00:45:23.880 --> 00:45:25.760
<v Speaker 1>embarrassed to say, I really don't know what that means.

921
00:45:25.800 --> 00:45:27.760
<v Speaker 1>What is a bomb cyclone? And who gets to make

922
00:45:27.840 --> 00:45:28.679
<v Speaker 1>up these dramatic names.

923
00:45:28.679 --> 00:45:30.199
<v Speaker 2>Wait, I don't know. I don't know what a bomb

924
00:45:30.239 --> 00:45:32.800
<v Speaker 2>cyclone is. Yeah, you got me there. It sounds bad.

925
00:45:32.960 --> 00:45:35.880
<v Speaker 2>I think you'd want to talk to an atmospheric scientist

926
00:45:35.920 --> 00:45:36.280
<v Speaker 2>that one.

927
00:45:36.440 --> 00:45:39.119
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I'll look it up. It doesn't sound good.

928
00:45:38.960 --> 00:45:40.880
<v Speaker 1>Though, Okay, my friends, I look this up and a

929
00:45:40.920 --> 00:45:45.639
<v Speaker 1>bomb cyclone is also known as explosive cyclogenesis, a weather bomb,

930
00:45:45.840 --> 00:45:52.239
<v Speaker 1>meteorological bomb, explosive development, mid latitude cyclone, cyclone, bomb or

931
00:45:52.280 --> 00:45:57.119
<v Speaker 1>bomba genesis, or snowmageddon or a nor'easter. Now, if you're

932
00:45:57.159 --> 00:46:01.119
<v Speaker 1>counting linguists, that is ten English terms for just one

933
00:46:01.199 --> 00:46:04.039
<v Speaker 1>kind of storm, and it means that the pressure drops

934
00:46:04.079 --> 00:46:06.559
<v Speaker 1>a bunch at least twenty four millibars in a short

935
00:46:06.599 --> 00:46:09.239
<v Speaker 1>amount of time twenty four hours. It's when a mass

936
00:46:09.280 --> 00:46:12.480
<v Speaker 1>of cold air meets warm air and the storm gathers

937
00:46:12.519 --> 00:46:15.599
<v Speaker 1>intensity really quickly. But an ain't a blizzard unless the

938
00:46:15.639 --> 00:46:18.760
<v Speaker 1>winds are at least thirty five miles an hour, visibility

939
00:46:18.800 --> 00:46:20.599
<v Speaker 1>is reduced to a quarter mile or less. And this

940
00:46:20.639 --> 00:46:23.599
<v Speaker 1>thing lasts at least three hours. And yes, climate change

941
00:46:23.639 --> 00:46:26.639
<v Speaker 1>affects the amount of warm air that slams into cold

942
00:46:26.679 --> 00:46:30.599
<v Speaker 1>air slightly. Warmer air can also hold more moisture, So

943
00:46:30.719 --> 00:46:34.559
<v Speaker 1>we may be seeing shorter snow seasons, but heavier snow

944
00:46:34.679 --> 00:46:38.880
<v Speaker 1>dumps because of that. So climate change the unnatural earth

945
00:46:38.960 --> 00:46:43.119
<v Speaker 1>puberty that nobody wants. In terms of fake snow, what

946
00:46:43.360 --> 00:46:46.199
<v Speaker 1>are your feelings, Jordan Merryfield wants snow. What are your

947
00:46:46.239 --> 00:46:48.480
<v Speaker 1>feelings on artificial snow made for ski resorts?

948
00:46:50.159 --> 00:46:52.679
<v Speaker 2>You know, I think they really help these ski resorts.

949
00:46:52.840 --> 00:46:55.400
<v Speaker 2>The artificial snow helps the ski resorts maintain on more

950
00:46:55.440 --> 00:46:57.800
<v Speaker 2>consistent product as they'd call it, I mean mammoth. They

951
00:46:57.800 --> 00:47:00.880
<v Speaker 2>miss their opening day by one day this year for

952
00:47:00.920 --> 00:47:03.159
<v Speaker 2>the first time since it installed snowmaking, and it's just

953
00:47:03.199 --> 00:47:05.679
<v Speaker 2>one day since you know, in the early nineties, and

954
00:47:05.760 --> 00:47:07.920
<v Speaker 2>so they can, you know, on the snow at all.

955
00:47:07.960 --> 00:47:10.159
<v Speaker 2>They can still have skiing, and they can supplement, and

956
00:47:10.159 --> 00:47:12.519
<v Speaker 2>in some places it's pretty much all they have, Like

957
00:47:12.559 --> 00:47:14.719
<v Speaker 2>where I grew up in Winter Green, Virginia, So I

958
00:47:14.719 --> 00:47:18.000
<v Speaker 2>don't you know, I certainly think it's okay. What one

959
00:47:18.000 --> 00:47:20.840
<v Speaker 2>thing that's come up with the fake snow is people

960
00:47:20.880 --> 00:47:23.719
<v Speaker 2>somehow think that water use is all consumptive and it's

961
00:47:23.760 --> 00:47:25.920
<v Speaker 2>just gone. But the truth is just kind of goes

962
00:47:26.000 --> 00:47:28.280
<v Speaker 2>right back into the It just runs off, you know,

963
00:47:28.320 --> 00:47:31.159
<v Speaker 2>in the snow melts and goes, you know, right back

964
00:47:31.159 --> 00:47:34.400
<v Speaker 2>into the watershed or down into groundwater. Mostly it's the energy,

965
00:47:34.519 --> 00:47:36.400
<v Speaker 2>I'd say, the consumptive part of it. We uses up

966
00:47:36.440 --> 00:47:39.719
<v Speaker 2>the most energies. You have to ionize this now so

967
00:47:39.880 --> 00:47:43.280
<v Speaker 2>big air compressors. It's a lot of electricity to run

968
00:47:43.360 --> 00:47:44.320
<v Speaker 2>the compressor houses.

969
00:47:44.639 --> 00:47:46.599
<v Speaker 1>I was curious how these work, and I just watched

970
00:47:46.599 --> 00:47:50.199
<v Speaker 1>a bunch of videos of huge hoses using compressed air

971
00:47:50.400 --> 00:47:53.760
<v Speaker 1>or fans to blast tiny water droplets high up in

972
00:47:53.800 --> 00:47:56.480
<v Speaker 1>the sky so that they freeze and then flutter down

973
00:47:56.519 --> 00:47:59.920
<v Speaker 1>into powder. And apparently this can be an overnight job,

974
00:48:00.199 --> 00:48:02.199
<v Speaker 1>kind of like the snow fairy comes at night in

975
00:48:02.280 --> 00:48:05.559
<v Speaker 1>a beanie and a north face parka and unleashes its

976
00:48:05.719 --> 00:48:08.800
<v Speaker 1>giant hose arm octopus creature to cover the mountain and

977
00:48:08.840 --> 00:48:12.159
<v Speaker 1>frozen confetti while you sleep. Cute Caroline Lewis and Asrael

978
00:48:12.239 --> 00:48:14.639
<v Speaker 1>King both want to know there are there any ways

979
00:48:14.679 --> 00:48:17.639
<v Speaker 1>to better clear snow off your car, walkway, et cetera,

980
00:48:17.760 --> 00:48:21.360
<v Speaker 1>aside from scraping and shoveling. As a snow expert.

981
00:48:21.039 --> 00:48:24.119
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I don't have any good answers. I mean, I

982
00:48:24.119 --> 00:48:27.880
<v Speaker 2>don't like to use the salt because pets can and

983
00:48:27.920 --> 00:48:30.480
<v Speaker 2>it sort of marks things. And I kind of enjoy

984
00:48:30.519 --> 00:48:32.400
<v Speaker 2>it that. You know, It's like a good way to

985
00:48:32.800 --> 00:48:34.559
<v Speaker 2>get some exercise when you're just stuck inside.

986
00:48:34.800 --> 00:48:39.320
<v Speaker 1>Right, it's CrossFit. Yeah, CrossFit, You got to watch your

987
00:48:40.360 --> 00:48:40.880
<v Speaker 1>That's okay.

988
00:48:40.920 --> 00:48:43.960
<v Speaker 3>I think the main there's there is Uh.

989
00:48:44.079 --> 00:48:47.320
<v Speaker 2>They even teach in avalanche classes I think called strategic shoveling,

990
00:48:47.360 --> 00:48:52.199
<v Speaker 2>which is more about how to most quickly extract people.

991
00:48:52.400 --> 00:48:54.880
<v Speaker 2>Has to do with like tiered levels and stuff like that.

992
00:48:54.920 --> 00:48:56.480
<v Speaker 2>You don't just want to dig straight into the ground.

993
00:48:56.519 --> 00:49:00.360
<v Speaker 2>But just like any any working at your desk, there are.

994
00:49:00.320 --> 00:49:02.079
<v Speaker 3>Correct ways to sit.

995
00:49:02.599 --> 00:49:05.599
<v Speaker 2>It's correct ways to shovel, correct ways to hold your

996
00:49:05.920 --> 00:49:07.079
<v Speaker 2>so you don't damage your back.

997
00:49:07.599 --> 00:49:10.119
<v Speaker 1>Well shoveling, so when you're digging someone out of an avalanche,

998
00:49:10.159 --> 00:49:11.199
<v Speaker 1>it's almost like terraced.

999
00:49:11.920 --> 00:49:12.159
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

1000
00:49:12.400 --> 00:49:14.920
<v Speaker 2>This is something that Bruce Edgerly came up with, which

1001
00:49:14.960 --> 00:49:17.320
<v Speaker 2>is great. The strategic shoveling for one thing, if they're

1002
00:49:17.320 --> 00:49:19.159
<v Speaker 2>on a steep slope, you want to shovel in towards them,

1003
00:49:19.199 --> 00:49:21.519
<v Speaker 2>not straight down at them, because it's the fastest way

1004
00:49:21.559 --> 00:49:24.840
<v Speaker 2>to shovel out to excavate. And then also if usually

1005
00:49:25.280 --> 00:49:26.960
<v Speaker 2>it depends on what kind of setting you're in, but

1006
00:49:27.039 --> 00:49:28.480
<v Speaker 2>especially if you're at like a ski resort where a

1007
00:49:28.519 --> 00:49:31.320
<v Speaker 2>lot of people, you have more than chances are you

1008
00:49:31.320 --> 00:49:33.039
<v Speaker 2>can only have like one or two people up front

1009
00:49:33.079 --> 00:49:35.119
<v Speaker 2>doing fast shoveling. Then there's going to be other people

1010
00:49:35.119 --> 00:49:36.960
<v Speaker 2>who maybe aren't doing anything. So if they can get

1011
00:49:37.000 --> 00:49:39.599
<v Speaker 2>behind them on like a terrace, you know, if you

1012
00:49:39.599 --> 00:49:42.239
<v Speaker 2>can imagine like steps going down and shovel out that

1013
00:49:42.360 --> 00:49:46.039
<v Speaker 2>debris from the first group, Oh right, you can. That's

1014
00:49:46.119 --> 00:49:47.960
<v Speaker 2>kind of efficient with a dig.

1015
00:49:48.440 --> 00:49:50.679
<v Speaker 1>Also, if your car is snowed in, I did see

1016
00:49:50.719 --> 00:49:53.400
<v Speaker 1>some tips like using a lighter to heat your key

1017
00:49:53.559 --> 00:49:56.519
<v Speaker 1>if your lock is frozen, or putting on a pre

1018
00:49:56.679 --> 00:49:59.079
<v Speaker 1>snow car cover so you can just remove that sucker

1019
00:49:59.159 --> 00:50:02.480
<v Speaker 1>do a little less scrape. Another option is just to

1020
00:50:02.519 --> 00:50:06.360
<v Speaker 1>never go outside again. Now. Main advice lift with your

1021
00:50:06.440 --> 00:50:09.719
<v Speaker 1>legs and not your back. And if you're my dad,

1022
00:50:09.800 --> 00:50:11.880
<v Speaker 1>please wait until I can come up and help you.

1023
00:50:12.079 --> 00:50:15.159
<v Speaker 1>Please thank you, sir. Also, a lot of you had

1024
00:50:15.360 --> 00:50:17.400
<v Speaker 1>a similar question, and I'm just going to say your

1025
00:50:17.480 --> 00:50:20.840
<v Speaker 1>name's with my mouth now. Spencer Gillespie, Billy Marino, Carla

1026
00:50:20.880 --> 00:50:24.360
<v Speaker 1>Hick and Luober, Lauren Harder, Sarah Clark, Barbara Blackie, and Eva.

1027
00:50:24.559 --> 00:50:26.599
<v Speaker 1>A lot of people had questions about climate change. Are

1028
00:50:26.599 --> 00:50:28.760
<v Speaker 1>you seeing your work change a lot in the last

1029
00:50:28.800 --> 00:50:29.320
<v Speaker 1>ten years?

1030
00:50:30.199 --> 00:50:31.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, in the last ten years. You know, that's a

1031
00:50:31.880 --> 00:50:37.559
<v Speaker 2>particularly interesting period of time. There's strong evidence that from

1032
00:50:37.639 --> 00:50:41.880
<v Speaker 2>snow radars. For instance, Ben Hatchett is doing some great work,

1033
00:50:42.079 --> 00:50:44.159
<v Speaker 2>but he's at the Desert Research Institute in you and

1034
00:50:44.320 --> 00:50:46.920
<v Speaker 2>r They've got these snow radars that they can look

1035
00:50:46.960 --> 00:50:49.639
<v Speaker 2>at the snow levels and they've had a huge increase,

1036
00:50:49.679 --> 00:50:53.039
<v Speaker 2>statistically significant over the last ten years. And you know,

1037
00:50:53.079 --> 00:50:55.440
<v Speaker 2>one problem is these snow radars haven't been around that long,

1038
00:50:55.440 --> 00:50:57.760
<v Speaker 2>so it's hard to place that history, you know, in contact.

1039
00:50:57.880 --> 00:51:01.199
<v Speaker 2>It could be that this is just a warm ten

1040
00:51:01.280 --> 00:51:05.199
<v Speaker 2>year episode that might not all be due to climate

1041
00:51:05.239 --> 00:51:08.519
<v Speaker 2>chain or partly due to you know, it's unclear, but anyway,

1042
00:51:08.559 --> 00:51:10.559
<v Speaker 2>what that has meant. Even at Mammoth, which has a

1043
00:51:10.559 --> 00:51:12.880
<v Speaker 2>pretty high elevation, you know, the base is nine thousand

1044
00:51:12.920 --> 00:51:16.239
<v Speaker 2>feet of Main Lodge. There's tons of mid winter rain

1045
00:51:16.320 --> 00:51:20.280
<v Speaker 2>now even up higher up on the mountain, oh wow,

1046
00:51:20.320 --> 00:51:23.800
<v Speaker 2>which just never happened. And they've had some interesting wet

1047
00:51:23.920 --> 00:51:26.199
<v Speaker 2>snow avalanche. You get different kinds of avalanches when the

1048
00:51:26.199 --> 00:51:28.039
<v Speaker 2>snow's wet like that and it's raining on it and

1049
00:51:28.239 --> 00:51:30.480
<v Speaker 2>stuff that a lot of the patrollers have never seen before.

1050
00:51:31.079 --> 00:51:34.679
<v Speaker 2>It's so yeah, it's definitely warmer. The climate protections are

1051
00:51:34.719 --> 00:51:37.199
<v Speaker 2>pretty dismal over the next fifty especially one hundred years,

1052
00:51:37.320 --> 00:51:39.960
<v Speaker 2>it's the time to definitely think about for California, especially

1053
00:51:40.000 --> 00:51:44.280
<v Speaker 2>think about the way that we depend on snow melt

1054
00:51:44.559 --> 00:51:48.000
<v Speaker 2>to give us the stream flow that we need throughout

1055
00:51:48.000 --> 00:51:50.800
<v Speaker 2>the summer. It'll basically mean, you know that the snow

1056
00:51:50.840 --> 00:51:55.400
<v Speaker 2>starts smelting earlier, it'll coincide with more snow melt during

1057
00:51:56.599 --> 00:52:02.199
<v Speaker 2>the wet season. Oh it, so more rain on snow events, flooding, yeah,

1058
00:52:02.199 --> 00:52:06.199
<v Speaker 2>a lot of things, and just less water throughout the summer.

1059
00:52:06.400 --> 00:52:09.320
<v Speaker 2>You know, we've already seen that. You know, forest fires

1060
00:52:09.360 --> 00:52:12.119
<v Speaker 2>and you know, thats a big soil moisture right is

1061
00:52:12.199 --> 00:52:13.880
<v Speaker 2>very important to whether or not.

1062
00:52:14.000 --> 00:52:16.039
<v Speaker 3>Forest fires occur. And that's it direct.

1063
00:52:16.119 --> 00:52:18.400
<v Speaker 2>You know, if you have snow sitting on top of

1064
00:52:18.440 --> 00:52:22.400
<v Speaker 2>that soil for longer and it melts later there's more moisture.

1065
00:52:22.559 --> 00:52:24.880
<v Speaker 2>So we know that the dwindling snowpacks have a lot

1066
00:52:24.880 --> 00:52:27.519
<v Speaker 2>of far reaching effects.

1067
00:52:27.920 --> 00:52:31.320
<v Speaker 1>Right, So snow hydrology work is not just about skiing

1068
00:52:31.679 --> 00:52:34.599
<v Speaker 1>and avalanches. We need data that folks like net are

1069
00:52:34.599 --> 00:52:37.519
<v Speaker 1>collecting and crunching to figure out how much water we

1070
00:52:37.559 --> 00:52:40.519
<v Speaker 1>can expect the rest of the year. Another very one,

1071
00:52:40.559 --> 00:52:44.239
<v Speaker 1>more scientific question, Gillian Leech wants to know what scientifically

1072
00:52:44.280 --> 00:52:45.800
<v Speaker 1>is the best kind of snow for snowballs.

1073
00:52:45.960 --> 00:52:47.920
<v Speaker 3>The warm and dense kuy and okay.

1074
00:52:47.760 --> 00:52:49.599
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, zero hesitation there.

1075
00:52:49.840 --> 00:52:53.400
<v Speaker 2>Yes, Colorado tends to get the lightest snow sort of

1076
00:52:53.519 --> 00:52:55.039
<v Speaker 2>at least in the mountain regions in the US that

1077
00:52:55.119 --> 00:52:57.840
<v Speaker 2>need the upper Peninsula of Michigan and some of the

1078
00:52:57.920 --> 00:53:01.360
<v Speaker 2>Lake Effect areas, but not so much in this air

1079
00:53:01.480 --> 00:53:04.119
<v Speaker 2>or the Cascades or some of these maritime areas.

1080
00:53:04.159 --> 00:53:05.599
<v Speaker 3>A dense like heavy.

1081
00:53:06.159 --> 00:53:09.480
<v Speaker 2>Snow is what you you want because it'll pack better

1082
00:53:09.519 --> 00:53:11.840
<v Speaker 2>into a snowball as it gets closer to freezing.

1083
00:53:12.079 --> 00:53:14.239
<v Speaker 3>It's easier to make snowballs with Do.

1084
00:53:14.280 --> 00:53:16.360
<v Speaker 1>Snow hydrologists ever have snowball fights?

1085
00:53:17.960 --> 00:53:23.119
<v Speaker 3>No, have them with my kids.

1086
00:53:23.159 --> 00:53:25.559
<v Speaker 1>But you don't get being in the face by a colleague.

1087
00:53:25.800 --> 00:53:27.760
<v Speaker 3>No, you're like, Mark, what are you doing?

1088
00:53:27.920 --> 00:53:28.239
<v Speaker 1>Okay?

1089
00:53:28.320 --> 00:53:30.480
<v Speaker 2>I think, yeah, I think that's just a you know,

1090
00:53:31.159 --> 00:53:33.360
<v Speaker 2>it's you sort of get used to everything right, and

1091
00:53:33.480 --> 00:53:34.880
<v Speaker 2>just get used to being around a lot of snow.

1092
00:53:34.960 --> 00:53:38.400
<v Speaker 1>That makes sense. Two last questions. What's the worst thing

1093
00:53:38.400 --> 00:53:39.360
<v Speaker 1>about your job.

1094
00:53:39.920 --> 00:53:41.679
<v Speaker 2>Or the worst thing is I don't I don't get

1095
00:53:41.679 --> 00:53:44.119
<v Speaker 2>outside as much as I would like to, or you know,

1096
00:53:44.280 --> 00:53:46.039
<v Speaker 2>not in the snow as much as I want to,

1097
00:53:46.159 --> 00:53:49.280
<v Speaker 2>because to be because you.

1098
00:53:49.199 --> 00:53:51.920
<v Speaker 3>Know, scientific research science, it can be really tough.

1099
00:53:51.719 --> 00:53:53.719
<v Speaker 2>You know, like writing and being in front of a

1100
00:53:53.719 --> 00:53:57.119
<v Speaker 2>computer is not always the easiest thing to do. I

1101
00:53:57.559 --> 00:54:00.599
<v Speaker 2>think anyone who is being honest would say that, you know,

1102
00:54:00.719 --> 00:54:03.000
<v Speaker 2>it can be very rewarding in a lot of other ways.

1103
00:54:03.360 --> 00:54:05.800
<v Speaker 2>I would like to be sort of in the snow

1104
00:54:05.840 --> 00:54:06.960
<v Speaker 2>more so to speak.

1105
00:54:11.639 --> 00:54:13.559
<v Speaker 1>Do you get to ski a lot when you're up

1106
00:54:13.599 --> 00:54:14.280
<v Speaker 1>there in Mammoth?

1107
00:54:14.639 --> 00:54:17.039
<v Speaker 2>I do, Yeah, I do. Yeah, I get out quite

1108
00:54:17.079 --> 00:54:19.599
<v Speaker 2>a bit. I do cross country skiing, skate skiing. I

1109
00:54:19.639 --> 00:54:21.440
<v Speaker 2>do a lot of back country skiing. Yeah, it depends

1110
00:54:21.440 --> 00:54:23.079
<v Speaker 2>on the year. This year looks like a good one

1111
00:54:23.199 --> 00:54:23.679
<v Speaker 2>so far.

1112
00:54:24.000 --> 00:54:27.400
<v Speaker 1>What is your favorite thing about snow or about your job.

1113
00:54:28.360 --> 00:54:31.440
<v Speaker 2>My favorite thing about my snow or my job, I

1114
00:54:31.480 --> 00:54:37.599
<v Speaker 2>mean two sort of different questions, I guess. But for me,

1115
00:54:38.280 --> 00:54:43.760
<v Speaker 2>it's that I get to work on something that I love.

1116
00:54:43.840 --> 00:54:45.920
<v Speaker 2>But I love, you know, I love being out there

1117
00:54:46.119 --> 00:54:49.920
<v Speaker 2>and the physical parts of working with snow and on

1118
00:54:50.000 --> 00:54:53.800
<v Speaker 2>the snow and the places that I've been to do that.

1119
00:54:54.280 --> 00:54:57.760
<v Speaker 2>It also intellectually is just a really interesting material, and

1120
00:54:57.800 --> 00:55:00.239
<v Speaker 2>it's like one of the brightest substances on Earth. If

1121
00:55:00.239 --> 00:55:03.280
<v Speaker 2>that exists near its smelting temperature, it is extremely weak

1122
00:55:03.599 --> 00:55:06.559
<v Speaker 2>compared to any other material, you know. I think those

1123
00:55:06.559 --> 00:55:08.639
<v Speaker 2>are some of the reasons why people find snow just

1124
00:55:08.679 --> 00:55:11.599
<v Speaker 2>fascinating in the first place. As you peel that onion,

1125
00:55:11.639 --> 00:55:14.800
<v Speaker 2>it's just seems to have more and more layers and

1126
00:55:15.960 --> 00:55:17.199
<v Speaker 2>interesting things about it.

1127
00:55:17.840 --> 00:55:19.480
<v Speaker 1>I wonder why does it smell? Why does snow have

1128
00:55:19.480 --> 00:55:19.880
<v Speaker 1>a smell?

1129
00:55:20.400 --> 00:55:20.840
<v Speaker 3>A smell?

1130
00:55:20.920 --> 00:55:23.679
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, shouldn't Okay, Yeah?

1131
00:55:23.719 --> 00:55:28.360
<v Speaker 2>Sometimes, I mean it's like when it's really quiet, Uh,

1132
00:55:28.519 --> 00:55:30.280
<v Speaker 2>it sounds like it's quiet when it's a snow starts

1133
00:55:30.280 --> 00:55:32.360
<v Speaker 2>out to you because the snow's acting like a baffle,

1134
00:55:32.480 --> 00:55:34.559
<v Speaker 2>like a sound baffle, and so maybe the same thing's

1135
00:55:34.599 --> 00:55:36.320
<v Speaker 2>going on. And with smells, I mean they're not really

1136
00:55:36.360 --> 00:55:38.519
<v Speaker 2>so whatever, you know, if you're long under or smells

1137
00:55:38.599 --> 00:55:40.800
<v Speaker 2>terrible or whatever, it's just kind of coming back at

1138
00:55:40.840 --> 00:55:42.440
<v Speaker 2>you when it's snowing and it's not really.

1139
00:55:42.800 --> 00:55:46.000
<v Speaker 1>That's funny though, that's pat question. Thank you so much

1140
00:55:46.000 --> 00:55:48.679
<v Speaker 1>for doing this and for meeting me essentially in a

1141
00:55:48.679 --> 00:55:50.119
<v Speaker 1>parking lot in Lax.

1142
00:55:50.280 --> 00:55:51.960
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Problem, it's weird.

1143
00:55:52.199 --> 00:55:56.159
<v Speaker 1>Probably one of the weirdest part of your juts. Okay,

1144
00:55:56.199 --> 00:55:59.519
<v Speaker 1>so email a stranger, find a bench and asks more

1145
00:55:59.599 --> 00:56:03.079
<v Speaker 1>people stupid questions because they have such good stories and

1146
00:56:03.119 --> 00:56:05.960
<v Speaker 1>you'll never see snow the same. Now. Ned is not

1147
00:56:06.039 --> 00:56:09.039
<v Speaker 1>on social media, but Ologies is. It's at ologies on

1148
00:56:09.360 --> 00:56:13.519
<v Speaker 1>Instagram and Twitter. I'm Ali Ward with one L on both.

1149
00:56:13.920 --> 00:56:17.239
<v Speaker 1>There are more links up at aliward dot com slash

1150
00:56:17.280 --> 00:56:21.880
<v Speaker 1>ologies and to support via Patreon and submit ologists questions

1151
00:56:21.920 --> 00:56:24.440
<v Speaker 1>before I record and to see some behind the scenes

1152
00:56:24.519 --> 00:56:28.239
<v Speaker 1>videos of my closet where I'm currently recording this. You

1153
00:56:28.280 --> 00:56:31.440
<v Speaker 1>can head too Patreon dot com slash Ologies. Thank you,

1154
00:56:31.519 --> 00:56:35.039
<v Speaker 1>Bonnie Dutch and Shannon Feltis for managing ologiesmerch dot com,

1155
00:56:35.079 --> 00:56:37.320
<v Speaker 1>where you can get pins and hats and toads and shirts.

1156
00:56:38.039 --> 00:56:40.719
<v Speaker 1>Thanks Aaron Talbert and Hannah Liippo for admitting the Facebook

1157
00:56:40.760 --> 00:56:44.639
<v Speaker 1>Ologies group. Thank you to the vulvasaurus on Twitter for

1158
00:56:44.840 --> 00:56:47.559
<v Speaker 1>gently letting me know when talking about the benefits of

1159
00:56:47.599 --> 00:56:51.079
<v Speaker 1>having episode transcripts, deaf and hard of hearing is preferred

1160
00:56:51.119 --> 00:56:54.000
<v Speaker 1>over the term hearing impaired, which many folks consider offensive.

1161
00:56:54.119 --> 00:56:56.159
<v Speaker 1>I'm so sorry I had no idea. Thank you for

1162
00:56:56.280 --> 00:56:59.559
<v Speaker 1>upgrading my brain with that info. Extra editing help this

1163
00:56:59.599 --> 00:57:01.960
<v Speaker 1>week was done by Jared Sleeper of the mental health

1164
00:57:01.960 --> 00:57:05.480
<v Speaker 1>podcast My Good Bad Brain. Also his Instagram stories while

1165
00:57:05.519 --> 00:57:10.599
<v Speaker 1>shopping at Ross are my favorite jareded Underscore Sleeper on Instagram.

1166
00:57:11.000 --> 00:57:14.880
<v Speaker 1>Main editing was done Biologies Top brazil Nut, Stephen Ray

1167
00:57:14.920 --> 00:57:18.199
<v Speaker 1>Morris of the podcasts The per Cast and See Jurassic

1168
00:57:18.280 --> 00:57:21.599
<v Speaker 1>Right those are about cats and dinos. Thank you, Steven,

1169
00:57:21.639 --> 00:57:24.400
<v Speaker 1>You're the best. Once again. A donation was made this

1170
00:57:24.440 --> 00:57:28.639
<v Speaker 1>week to Esavalanche dot org in memory of Walter Rosenthal. Now,

1171
00:57:28.679 --> 00:57:30.400
<v Speaker 1>if you listen to the end of the episodes, you

1172
00:57:30.440 --> 00:57:33.119
<v Speaker 1>know I tell you a secret, And this week my

1173
00:57:33.239 --> 00:57:35.800
<v Speaker 1>secret is I had a dream that I bought like

1174
00:57:35.840 --> 00:57:38.320
<v Speaker 1>a Costco size box at Frosted Flakes, and I was

1175
00:57:38.719 --> 00:57:41.840
<v Speaker 1>so pissed to wake up and realize it wasn't real,

1176
00:57:42.199 --> 00:57:46.039
<v Speaker 1>and I was so horny for cereal. I crumbled up

1177
00:57:46.039 --> 00:57:48.079
<v Speaker 1>a bunch of rice cakes and then I poured vanilla

1178
00:57:48.119 --> 00:57:50.400
<v Speaker 1>coffee creamer over them, and I was like, this is

1179
00:57:50.400 --> 00:57:52.960
<v Speaker 1>pretty tight. And then I had another bowl, and by

1180
00:57:52.960 --> 00:57:55.480
<v Speaker 1>bowl I mean mug. This all happened in a mug. Anyway,

1181
00:57:55.639 --> 00:57:58.639
<v Speaker 1>live your life, cut your own hair, Pick an obscure

1182
00:57:58.639 --> 00:58:01.199
<v Speaker 1>color like umber over million, and then type it into

1183
00:58:01.199 --> 00:58:04.000
<v Speaker 1>Google image search. You deserve it. I love you, Okay,

1184
00:58:04.000 --> 00:58:09.920
<v Speaker 1>bye bye, Stay warm. Pacodermatology, mombiology or doo zoology. Lithology

1185
00:58:10.000 --> 00:58:18.639
<v Speaker 1>is technology, meteorology, mettology, ethnology, zeriology, sethnology