Speaker 1: You am now listening to soft Core History?
Speaker 2: What is up? Welcome back to Softcore History. I am
your host for the week, Rob Fox, joined as always
by Dan Rochester.
Speaker 3: Always a pleasure to be on your show.
Speaker 2: Ro Happy, happy to have you once again. Thanks for returning,
Thanks coming back you call. I answered, I know, I
appreciate you always there for your baby at the drop
of a hat, but you wouldn't when I asked you, Hey,
can you be on speed dial just in case Courtney
goes into labor in the middle of the night. You're like, dude,
you live so fucking far away.
Speaker 3: Come on, I need my beauty sleep. I can't mess
with that.
Speaker 2: So I had to use someone else a long time. Uh,
you know guest on the show, Gabby monte Mayor. And
today we have not Gabby Montemeor. Nope, we have Christina
monte Mayor, Gabby's little sister and our former who we
actually knew Christina first because she's a former co worker
at Total Frat Move, Total Sorority Move, Total Scrap Move.
Speaker 4: That was a decade ago. I just realized that this
weekend's wild.
Speaker 2: Can you believe I've I've known you for almost thirteen years.
Speaker 3: Well, got laid off for Crazy twenty sixteen.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so it's been a while, but yeah, that was
my nickname in high school. Gabby's little sister, That's what
I was known as. So very familiar with that.
Speaker 2: You're first in my heart.
Speaker 4: Thank you.
Speaker 2: I knew.
Speaker 4: I appreciate that.
Speaker 2: Gabby is the one that came onto the scene.
Speaker 1: Later, she came in hot too. She really integrated herself
with the group. She just found a home, really lazing.
Speaker 2: And I actually don't even think I ever met her
while working at TFF.
Speaker 4: I know, and now it's like you've known her as
long as you've known me.
Speaker 1: It feels like, yeah, because she hangs out with your
wife all the time. Yeah, she And to your point,
she rescued Courtney, or rescued you guys, went into labor.
Speaker 2: Rescued me already driven to the hospital in the middle
of the night in labor.
Speaker 4: That story still makes me laugh.
Speaker 1: Third, baby mom just drives herself to the hospital, Like,
is that what I have to look forward to?
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's just business.
Speaker 4: That's incredible.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: First baby, eh freak out.
Speaker 3: Yeah, thevery exacond baby entire thing.
Speaker 2: Here we go get okay, I hope it goes well,
the first time was crazy.
Speaker 3: The third baby's a nuisance.
Speaker 2: Third Yeah, third baby is just.
Speaker 4: The just the casualness of it was incredible. Yeah, there's
crops to Courtney.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I had to ask, by the way, before we get going,
is Gabby jealous?
Speaker 4: Gabby is jealous.
Speaker 1: She gave me some pointers and she said, don't fuck up, hey,
just so you know, don't suck up.
Speaker 4: And I was like, great, no, presh no, presh.
Speaker 2: Girl sounds about right from Gabby.
Speaker 1: Yeah, No, she has fun here. So she told me
to just have a good time. That's the plan.
Speaker 2: That's all you need to do. And because you were
a first time guest, I asked you for a writer,
which I no longer do.
Speaker 1: For Gabby, she gets like room temp water and I
get what kind of Seltzer's do you want?
Speaker 2: Oh my god, Like do you want wine?
Speaker 3: You want Seltzer?
Speaker 2: Do you need sparkling water?
Speaker 4: The service here is incredible.
Speaker 2: It goes downhill.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, Listen, we've been through the trenches together. It's like
seeing an old war, buddy.
Speaker 4: That's true.
Speaker 1: The content game, we've seen things, we have all of
the things, lots of things.
Speaker 4: That's a different podcast.
Speaker 2: I feel did you see how it is. Did you
see our bosses, our old bosses offs cross Street? No way,
that's where that's where Madison works.
Speaker 4: Now, oh my god, that's cool.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah yeah, way across the highway.
Speaker 2: I do see him walking around sometimes that's an outside
good for him.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: But today we have Christina on for a very specific purpose,
not just because she is a former fellow comedy writer
at Grand ex at TFMTSM, whatever Christina is. And I
apologize to our audience for even doing this to you.
It really goes against everything the show is but an
ex bert, which we don't. We don't love to do, Okay,
I like to I don't. I don't like to have
people here to blast holes in anything. Yeah, but this
is the closest we've come to actually having somebod who
knows what the fuck they're talking about on the podcast
for now.
Speaker 3: For now, we do have somebody lined up in August
that will wipe the floor with us with rum and history.
Speaker 2: Oh I'm not even I think I'm just gonna ask
him questions.
Speaker 3: That's gonna be it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, It's not going to be me being like running
down a thing and having him be like that's actually wrong.
Speaker 3: He's gonna tell us things. I always to be like sit.
Speaker 2: And I believe everything you say. And with you today,
I'll pretty much believe anything you great, no matter how
it is. But what are you an expert in? Exactly?
Speaker 4: I am a couple of things. A makeup artist. I
did your wife's wedding for makeup for your wedding?
Speaker 2: You did? Yeah?
Speaker 4: And did I do your wedding? Did I imagine this?
Or did I do your makeup for the wedding?
Speaker 2: Don't you want to touch me?
Speaker 4: I think I gave you some boyglam. I like think
I went to your room.
Speaker 3: You had some foundation on it.
Speaker 2: I thought it was a light base.
Speaker 1: I think I gave you just like some bronzer, just
brighten up your pale irish complexion. So I think I
did your makeup too for your wedding. And I'm also
a beauty writer and editor. So I've been writing about
beauty for five ish years.
Speaker 2: Now in a bunch of publications.
Speaker 1: Right yeah, I' written for Men's Health, so I covered
grooming for Men's Health for a while. Which can we
just stop on the word grooming as it relates to
like men's beauty, Like the fact that you guys would
rather be close closer to pedophiles in terms of calling
it what it is that word you guys can't use
like men's beauty, you use grooming.
Speaker 4: Why why is that?
Speaker 2: Why do we still use it?
Speaker 4: Yeah, like that's crazy.
Speaker 2: What are we supposed to use now?
Speaker 4: Words? Just call it men's beauty.
Speaker 1: But you guys are so afraid of the word beauty
that you had to call it grooming, Like it's so weird.
Speaker 3: Also, technically grooming is not being a pedophile. It's waiting, Okay,
it's it's called patients.
Speaker 4: Yeah, persistence.
Speaker 2: I guess Baseball's minor leagues are grooming now.
Speaker 3: I guess it's grooming some guy to become a picture
for your major league.
Speaker 2: I mean they do actually say that being groomed to
be the starting quarterback or whatever.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Literally, you guys are obsessed with that word.
Speaker 2: It's a funny word. Yeah, so it is a funny
thing to accuse someone to be well.
Speaker 1: And when I was writing about beauty or grooming for
mental health, I would interview and they're called celebrity groomers,
So like John Hamm and like J. Jallen Hall, I
would talk to their like groomers people that did their
hair and their makeup.
Speaker 4: And I remember like writing this article and I was like,
is this the right word? Are we sure?
Speaker 1: Do we want to think of a different word besides
groomer to describe this person.
Speaker 4: In their men's skin.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and and nope, it's grooming, it's groomer.
Speaker 3: It's I mean, imagine, if you play on the Nashville
hockey team, you're known as a predator. That's also tough.
Speaker 2: They did have it. Did you see the shirt the
other day that went viral?
Speaker 3: It was just.
Speaker 2: Like preds, Preds in Nashville or something like that, or
like like Nashal's favorite Preds or something like that.
Speaker 4: Awful.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was not great. I think they had to
recant that shirt, but they printed a lot.
Speaker 4: No print, keep keeping going. Yeah, just tag all the
men who wear that shirt.
Speaker 2: They're like Ghana and Guatemala. Now they've had a ship
to a place where like where you send the shirts
of the team that loses.
Speaker 4: Right, Yeah, anyways, that's what I do now.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And what's your substack? Real quick?
Speaker 1: Texas Beauty editor substack, which you know is something I
have am I currently writing? You could say every every
month or so.
Speaker 2: I'm currently paying, are you?
Speaker 1: Oh well, okay, now now now I'm gonna come up
with some more things to.
Speaker 2: Write it about.
Speaker 4: Just for you, Rob, I'll do a men's little substack
for you.
Speaker 3: I clearly you know I do.
Speaker 2: Get an email every month your pay with to Christine
and Montame or is going through.
Speaker 3: I'm like, huh, it's.
Speaker 2: The only email from your substack I got this month.
Speaker 4: Interesting, Okay, I'll get up on that.
Speaker 2: I'm a big I support a lot of people's substanct
I probably have like a not one hundred, probably fifty dolls.
Speaker 3: I like that move just collecting chain. Yeah, people forget
about their subscriptions all the time.
Speaker 2: If we stop this podcast, we're not gonna tell anyone,
and we're gonna let Patreon dot com slash software history
keep cash and checks until everyone unsubscribes.
Speaker 3: And I think it would take a couple of months,
it would take a.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're right.
Speaker 3: We would have subscribers for at least two years.
Speaker 4: Yeah, let's go, what are you guys doing?
Speaker 2: I know, why are we working at all?
Speaker 3: We haven't gone to the level of success yet to
really just coast.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so today, because of Christina's expertise, we are talking
about the history of makeup. This is a Jake classic,
the history of the broadest thing you can imagine. Now
we're specifically the history of men's makeup. More specifically, I
didn't want to do like full beautification, so we're not
talking tattoos or beards and hair and stuff like that.
I won't specifically want to talk about.
Speaker 3: Why don't want to talk about me? Rob?
Speaker 2: You really the episode of Dan, We're gonna mention you
a little bit. You got a little neander vibe going on.
You got tattoos, you.
Speaker 4: Got a Viking thing.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know if I appreciate Neanderthal vibe. Like
I'm uninvolved.
Speaker 2: Neanderthals groomed themself. We're gonna talk about that little.
Speaker 5: We'll get there.
Speaker 3: They were the og not quite the slobs you thought
they were, fucking knuckle dragon. No, you look all hunched over. Look,
I'm not a squatty man.
Speaker 2: Dan told me his way before the show started. He
was like, guess what I'm down to?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 4: Can I guess what? To twenty four?
Speaker 2: Wow?
Speaker 4: Is that is that it?
Speaker 3: No?
Speaker 2: Oh?
Speaker 3: I started like two thirty, I'm done to eleven?
Speaker 2: Wow?
Speaker 4: Shit, Okay, you must.
Speaker 2: Be looking puffy today, I must be.
Speaker 3: But uh, I mean if we're gonna pimp other people's stuff,
shouts to my friend Shay who is a personal trainer.
She does my macros m look at you. So if
you want to change your body, hit her up and
that's gonna buy me some goodwill for a while.
Speaker 2: Now. Yeah, at at what life with Shahla sa h
a l A really hope Fitbod's not on the show today.
Uh I haven't checked that yet. About real quick before
we get in this one more thing, I wanted to
ask you what would you have done for us today?
Speaker 4: Oh? Camera god? Okay, So for men's makeup?
Speaker 1: So I also make a artist and I do a
lot of like commercial Yeah I've done a TV show
and just like commercial work here and there. But men's
makeup is really simple but deceiving. Like you guys like
just need some warmth around your face. So like think
of Matthew McConaughey. He always looks like tanned, like.
Speaker 4: He just got back from a vacation.
Speaker 1: That's really the vibe that you're trying to create with men.
Just some warmth arough on the face, some bronzer. You
guys need to like, groom your eyebrows more. I don't
know why you guys don't use like a brow gel
every so often, Like that would just make your eyes
more open.
Speaker 2: Oh I'm my eyebrows is so big that I am
forced to trim them up constantly. But I don't. Well,
so you do something to them, Yeah, but I don't
do browjel.
Speaker 4: Yeah, at a browjell.
Speaker 1: And you know what, here's the thing that I think
every man should do to make themselves look better.
Speaker 4: Do all at home. Spray tan a.
Speaker 1: Little at home moose that you just buy from the
store and you just it's really simple.
Speaker 4: It's like body lotion.
Speaker 1: Be put that on you, marin it, in it for
a few hours, and you look like you just got
back from Tahiti.
Speaker 3: Like se, I prefer going outside, maybe playing golf, wear
a hat and then you have the Stuart sink tan
on your forehead. I prefer that.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I can't do any of what you just said
because people would notice.
Speaker 4: Immediately, I don't think so.
Speaker 1: You've seen my fiance Jesse. He's a redheaded man. He's
a Scottish Man by ancestry, and he loves a little
like tan like he I do him before wedding. So
anytime we've gone to wedding together, he asked me to
tan him and so.
Speaker 3: Give Rob a self tanner.
Speaker 4: I think I will one day for my wedding.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I will.
Speaker 2: You and Jesse, I will self tan for your wedding.
Speaker 4: You and Jesse can have a little date out of it.
He he loves to go.
Speaker 1: He went to go get a spray tan while we
were on vacation. I got one before vacation, and he
was jealous of me, and so he got one while
we were on vacation. That's how dedicayed this man is
to looking tan.
Speaker 2: Also, though this is see, this is why I'm married
pale is because I'm very I'm very you. That also
that i feel like I'm very similar in skin tone
to Jesse. Very and him and you or me and
you next to each other shirtless, which I've been like
on the like cruise or whatever. It's dark.
Speaker 1: It's it's black and white. Really yeah, not quite but black, white,
white and brown.
Speaker 4: For sure.
Speaker 2: One of us looks very healthy.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And that's what a tan gives you. It is
like a healthy looking appearance.
Speaker 2: I look like I escaped from the brig on the curve.
Speaker 4: And we need to fix that. This is what a
tan can do for your wedding.
Speaker 2: I will sonless get.
Speaker 3: Back to them.
Speaker 4: I will keep that on on record.
Speaker 2: Okay, I'll let let Courtney remind Courtney.
Speaker 5: Okay, we'll do She'd actually.
Speaker 2: Probably be into that. She'd be like, yeah, goddamn time. Actually,
today we're going to talk about how this was the
look everybody wanted really in most of human history. So
fuck both of you. You fucking wrong your fucking field hands. Uh,
but we'll get to that.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 2: So yeah, we're gonna talk about mostly facial cosmetics because
that's kind of what we think we think of make up, right, Like,
obviously everyone's groomed throughout history, but facial makeup is the
very specific thing that has fallen out of favor with
men in the last two hundred and twenty ish years
something like that.
Speaker 3: How were people's teeth for the most part of history?
I think bad, yes, although so like enough bacteria builds
up in your mouth, it's good.
Speaker 2: So the two things I've actually read about teeth through
human history is one, it got worse after we started farming,
because then we started getting more sugars with bread and stuff,
like that and that fucked up teeth and the other
thing that I've read, and you just got to kind
of keep in mind, just imagine the world without orthodonal work.
Speaker 4: I don't want to.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like, right now my middle child has like an
extra like just an extra tooth group. So we have
to get it removed in like a year. Oh no,
so right now he's just got two teeth stacked on
top of each other, like, looks like a freak baby.
We don't let him outside red hair, extra teeth.
Speaker 3: This is why you can't marry your cousin.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and presumably me and Coordney you are close, more
closely related than we should be.
Speaker 3: Don't get the DNA test.
Speaker 2: No, no, no, She asked me that one. She was like,
wouldn't be fun to do a twenty three meters And
my literal response was, how related do you want to
find out we are?
Speaker 1: It's good to tell your kids, though, just what they're
in for, maybe once they get older, some diseases.
Speaker 2: You need to marry someone who's ancestry for the last
four hundred six was not from the European continent.
Speaker 4: And this is why I'm marrying Jesse Scottish Man.
Speaker 2: Just pure your Scottish way of South Africa. Yeah, you
have no crisscross whatsoever.
Speaker 1: You know, It's funny. I'm more African than he is.
I did my DNA test and I'm like one percent
something right, and and he did his just to see
if he has any African obviously he doesn't.
Speaker 3: How much conquist the door do you have in you?
Speaker 4: Like most like fifty percent? Like European Portuguese that whole thing.
Speaker 2: Maybe you guys are related.
Speaker 3: Maybe maybe she wouldn't have bred with a jew. He's
Portuguese Jewish, Okay, I mean her ancestors.
Speaker 2: Yeah, her ancestors, which, of course, now yeah, no, they
hunted you and now look at us here we are. Yeah.
So we're going to start in prehistory, which I actually
got from you first off, though, how dare you?
Speaker 4: Yeah? I sent over some references.
Speaker 2: She goes, this is to help lead your research.
Speaker 3: It's the first time a guess has offered that. Dare
wish I had that from my sources. Be real nice? Sorry,
she helped you with your homework.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I know. I was like, oh, this is useful.
So obviously prehistoric makeup existed, it just in terms of
like rituals and even hunting and camo, you know, stuff
like that. But they do have evidence. You showed me
the Neanderthal thing, but both for Neanderthals and Homo sapiens.
Actually they put on maybe a light base.
Speaker 1: Maybe some foundation, a little blush.
Speaker 2: Yeah, helps you look sexier, hotter. One thing I really
appreciated about people in prehistory and even in ancient history
is that they actually we joke about all the time.
It's like, God, I had to be so gross back then.
Did these people even realize it? I think they did.
I think they realized how gross life was, the amount
of makeup they wore. Tells me that even then, even
then they realized it's like ough, who, this is all.
Speaker 1: Horrible, But they had to look good doing it, so
they had to make an improvement upon that, so they
did some I think I read that they would crush
up pi right, yes, and then glitter put that on
all over their face just to like look exactly that
twilight shine.
Speaker 3: I'm sure that the smells weren't really that bad until
the Industrial Revolution.
Speaker 2: I don't know about that.
Speaker 3: Maybe the bo the bo had to be, but the
rivers weren't smelling like sewage.
Speaker 2: There was no necessarily sewage rivers. Unless there was a
village upstream.
Speaker 3: You didn't have giant factories just dumping chemicals into the river.
Speaker 2: It's true. But if you had a village upstream from you,
you're you're kind of fucked because they would walk a
little bit downstream of their village throw whatever into the river,
and then it just floats on down to you. So
then you have go kill them and.
Speaker 3: Take their land.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and yeah, use rape their women.
Speaker 2: Don't drink their they made you drink poop their poop
seems just fun.
Speaker 3: That's how war actually started.
Speaker 2: Yeah, when your four year old dies of dysentery because
Gary up the river was too lazy to take a
dump in a hole, blood has to be shitdy, Yeah, exactly.
So they found a cave in South Africa actually about
one hundred thousand to seventy thousand years ago, so to
put that in perspective, about sixty thousand years before we
even remotely started farming or anything. Archaeologists found an ochre
workshop with abalone shells containing ochre fat mixtures grindstones.
Speaker 3: So he saidn ogre ochre.
Speaker 1: Okra red earth kind of like compound, right. I think
Okre is like a color.
Speaker 2: I'll check real quick, because I didn't even bother to
look that up. This is a softcore history. Brownish yellow
brow so tan.
Speaker 4: So they wanted to be tan.
Speaker 2: They wanted to look tan, and this contained like they
would mix it with fat, typically animal fats to help
applicate it. They had grindstones, They even found applicators, so
according to archaeologists, this pretty much suggests that men and
women systematically Again, this is sixty thousand years before we
even remotely thought about farming, produced cosmetics in I don't
know in a cave or where they did it, but
they had. It was essentially a makeup factory in the
like way prehistoric world and this includes Neanderthals too. Scientists
found shells at two archaeological sites in southern Spain. They
found lumps of yellow pigments. So yellow tan was hot.
People wanted to be tan. So these people weren't educated,
they didn't know any better.
Speaker 3: It wasn't like protecting their skin from the sun.
Speaker 4: I think that was part of it. Yeah, so it
was also a sunscreen some of these. I'd imagine it
was that ingredients and.
Speaker 1: Like a possibly looked insect repellant too. A lot of
these ingredients repelled insects.
Speaker 3: Functional.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there there was a lot of functionality to a
lot of makeups throughout throughout history, especially in the ancient world,
in the pre ancient world, although for a lot of
the Neanderthals, they were probably I don't know if it
was sunscreen, because a lot of them were. They lived
there long enough that they were okay with the environment. However,
this is this is what interested me. They found a
red powder mixed with flex that that are reflective with
a reflective black mineral in these like shells and shit
like that that were also worn as by Neanderthals as
jewelry or whatever. And this was not influenced by Homo sapiens,
the one in Spain, because they found it ten thousand
years before they would have been contact with humans. So
humans and Neanderthals developed makeup completely separately, completely independent of
each other. The question for neander Thals, though, like you said,
this might have been sunscreen, although a lot of them
were relatively acclimated to the amount of sun they got
in something in Spain by that point, however.
Speaker 3: Or maybe it's camouflage, right, the slender Man comes in
almost wipes them out pretty much does wipe them out?
Speaker 2: Does what literally wipes them out?
Speaker 3: So they want to kind of blend in.
Speaker 2: But this, this is before we take our rightful place
as kings of the planet.
Speaker 3: They were kind of asking for it, I mean, living there.
Speaker 2: I agree. So most Neanderthals had tans, probably like Dan.
You know, to continue with the Dan Neanderthal comparisons about
Dan's complexion, somewhere between you and Dan when you say, uh,
living in Spain, however.
Speaker 3: I'll be the darkest man in the room.
Speaker 2: I be darker than me. I mean, you're all ready
to the darkest man in the room. Oops. Here, you're
darker than Coop.
Speaker 3: I know, yeah, easily.
Speaker 2: There is some evidence though that neander Dolls did carry
in that region the m c R one R gene,
which is associated with fair skin, red hair, and freckles.
So you rob mostly me, I don't have I do
I do carry the red hair gene. You're a day walker, obviously,
do you don't have red hair?
Speaker 4: Pro created red a couple times now twice?
Speaker 3: Yeah, two out of three good odds.
Speaker 2: And the middle one is so is that recessive? At
that point you would think, I.
Speaker 4: Don't know what was you in courtney.
Speaker 2: No, No, it roars to the forefront. There may have
been a market for sunless tanner for ginger cavemen who
would have thought me.
Speaker 3: Because they couldn't come out of the cave.
Speaker 2: Speak that, and because maybe they you know, a lot
of times if someone looks different, they had to wear
it revered.
Speaker 3: They had to wear a T shirt into the pool.
Speaker 2: Never done that, Never done that. I would rather get
sunburned than wear a T shirt in the pool, Like
I would rather I have had a piece of skin
cut out. I would rather deal with that again than
ever get in a swimming pool wearing a T shirt.
I would cancer, mild cancer. I would take over that.
They hit the leg.
Speaker 3: They're wearing their their finest furs into the water.
Speaker 2: There's actually a weird thing at when my kids take
swimming lessons that they took it. It's an indoor pool.
Speaker 3: What's it called again?
Speaker 2: Little fishes?
Speaker 3: Little fishes something like that. Now, who were the little fishes?
Rob They were friends of the Emperor Tiberius. Yea look
up Tiberius's island and don't do that on a work computer.
Speaker 2: Never do that on a work computer. Absolutely, But a
lot of the dads at this indoor pool getting in
there in T shirts.
Speaker 5: Why, I don't know.
Speaker 2: I was like, dude, this is the Burbs. No one
cares about your body.
Speaker 3: Well maybe they don't want to sexualize themselves around kids.
Speaker 2: And they weren't. They didn't have that type of body.
In fact, the one time there was like it was
it wasn't even a chick. It was like a dude
with a hot bod. And I was just like, well,
I look like shit right now, but whatever is what
it is.
Speaker 4: And he went shirt off.
Speaker 2: I was shirt off every time. I don't want to
be that guy ward.
Speaker 4: The children rob with that white chest. You're blinding that.
Speaker 2: It was Finn's swim lessons.
Speaker 4: So so he was paler than you.
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah somehow.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he had somebody to distract from himself.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. Just he actually can't see me. If I'm
holding him in front of you. It's like shining a
flashlight in your face.
Speaker 3: It was like concrete white walls that are always in
like the pool indoor pools. Yeah yeah, yeah, you blend
right in.
Speaker 2: He disappeared. There was just a little tuft of red
floating around. Cosmetics. Also in these ancient prehistoric societies, probably
played a role in attracting mates along with tattoos. A
is it all you know? Was like, Oh, I'm healthy, good,
you want to have a baby with me.
Speaker 4: Because I'm tan?
Speaker 2: Yeah, blah blah blah. It's a horrible time. They couldn't
even read, they didn't know anything.
Speaker 3: Being the tattoo artists for the trip would be dope.
Speaker 2: I wondered. So I didn't get into tattoos.
Speaker 3: But I feel like seems like a misopportunity.
Speaker 2: You're really taking your life into your Like you're really
risking your life getting a tattoo pre antibiotic to look cool.
Speaker 3: Dude, they's hammering it India.
Speaker 2: It's like just a bone that's been in ten other people.
They're not washing it, and you're just getting what like
a shitty stick drawing of a deer on your back.
Speaker 3: So though sleeve tats now are so oversaturated, like every dude,
especially in Austin, has a sleeve tat, it's just become
soft that the generation after us now hates tattoos. It's
uncool to have a sleeve Is that true?
Speaker 4: Gen Z hates tattoos and sleeps well.
Speaker 3: You get a zigwawee zag.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you've dated yourself.
Speaker 3: Yep, so this show's my age right here.
Speaker 2: What's funny to me about the Neolithic or not? This
isn't even Neolithic, this is pre this is Paleolithic. It
took time to find this shit, make this shit, mix
this shit. Cosmetics were valued almost as much as making
tools and food. They were so invested in looking hot
when every day was a question whether or not you
were gonna live. You didn't know where your next meal
was gonna come from. Potentially, they still took time to
make sure they look hot.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but you're looking for a deer, you might as
well grab a couple of plants on the way, grab
other shit when you're tracking an animal. Yeah, you're coming
across things now. Truly, I just like, oh, here's some
cash right here.
Speaker 2: Just don't think we've been great prioritizers throughout history.
Speaker 3: Well, we're the hunters, the women are the gatherers.
Speaker 4: And we both wore makeup. At one point. It was
both important.
Speaker 3: Being hot is kind of important.
Speaker 4: Rob, your wife.
Speaker 3: Maybe don't value it so much these days because you're
kind of, you know, condemned to a life of each other.
Speaker 4: Corny, I love you.
Speaker 2: Don't worry You're not listening. Uh, that's never a threat.
After kid three, though, I imagine you just give up.
What do you mean, just physically physically about cares? I
could tell you that most days. That's why I wear
a hat every day, Like not doing my.
Speaker 3: Hair today is stupid backwards.
Speaker 2: When does it come forward when I drop the kids
off at daycare to look like a serious man, to
look like an adult, and then I just switch it.
Speaker 4: Around backwards again, Yeah, ash.
Speaker 3: Ketchup, steps are going backwards.
Speaker 2: Give a fuck?
Speaker 3: Depends who's there, right, the parents you respect or not.
Speaker 2: If they go to the if it's at their daycare
that's in the city. That is like we're the poorest
family there by a mile because they all all the
other fans. It's in Barton Hills and all the families
live in Barton Hills. So I'll wear it forward to
look semi respectable.
Speaker 3: But no one's gonna take this podcast seriously until you
turn your hat around.
Speaker 2: Wh night. Well, I guess we're fucked. That not happening.
Speaker 3: You're gonna be like a seventy year old man with
a backwards hat.
Speaker 1: And you have a full head of hair too, I
see it. So why do you not show it off more.
Speaker 2: Because I have to do it and I don't want
to do the hair.
Speaker 3: You don't even have to Messi's in style, right.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I guess I just don't care. I don't care
about anything.
Speaker 1: You don't care about self expression, obviously. I just you
have the same outfit on that I've known you for
the last thirteen years. Literally, change the polo shirt, the
khaki shorts, tenny shoes, and backwards baseball hat.
Speaker 4: Same outfit.
Speaker 2: It's a classic. You're the day to one. You got
a fucking Zeppelin on your arm.
Speaker 3: It's wrong with the zeppelin.
Speaker 2: You're what are you? You're gonna be in a nursing home
one day. People are just gonna be like, oh, were
you in the navy? And you be like, no, I
was a tool.
Speaker 3: There's nothing wrong with peanut.
Speaker 4: I was a boy in twenty fifteen.
Speaker 3: Nothing wrong with that, Rob. There's plenty playing that to
go around.
Speaker 2: No, it's actually fucked up that one day in nursing
homes and where you filled with fucking tat sleeves. By
the way, this is how you know my wife doesn't
this podcast because she still doesn't know.
Speaker 4: That I's in well, she's ye that I know, how
dare you.
Speaker 3: She's always like, why do you lick your lips so
much like a lizard man?
Speaker 2: Like, I don't know. She's like, I think it's a
nervous tick, and I was like, oh, maybe, yeah, it's
a ADD Yeah I blame You can blame a lot
on ADD.
Speaker 1: You can blame everything on ADD. You guys get away
with so much shit and just call it. Oh, I
just have an attention deficit to story.
Speaker 2: I'm just saying, not real.
Speaker 3: Yeah, No, I deal with so many people in my
life that add not you.
Speaker 4: Dan, No, I would have thought you also would have it.
Speaker 3: But the master the other end of the spectrum.
Speaker 2: Two detail oriented, you're two in the weeds. All right,
all right, we're gonna move on to the Ancient World. Now,
this was my favorite part. I was saying to you
before the show. It kind of gets a little like
the same after the Ancient World. The ancient world, there's
a lot of diversity and makeup ideas. Once you get
into like Western Europe or even Asia East Asia in particular,
you kind of get the same right theme that everyone
wants to be pale. For the most part. That seems
to be the common denominator across the world post ancient times.
But in the ancient times we're figuring it out, we
didn't know what we wanted. Egyptian men, in particular, Egyptians
were probably the most prolific ancient users of makeup.
Speaker 3: Little eyeliner killed all.
Speaker 2: The way to commoners we're putting oncial cosmetics, little JD.
Speaker 3: Vans.
Speaker 1: More than that, they spent like hours of their morning
getting ready, Like they had manicurists, they had a makeup artist.
They took milk bats in the morning. They exfoliated the pharaohs, yes, yes,
and they waxed their entire bodies too.
Speaker 4: They didn't want any air.
Speaker 2: There's gotta be I don't know what their every day's
a spa genetic situation was in terms of like I
don't but like I feel like Middle Eastern Mediterranean men
are pretty hairy.
Speaker 4: But they keep it right now.
Speaker 1: You know, they're the ones that have like the cleanest beards,
and they still got it.
Speaker 3: They're still kicking the Persians.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they did still let the poof out of the
chest though. If you're like open that open collar, like
I'm I got nothing.
Speaker 3: In here, let's cover that up, rob, Do you have
any hair uh, not really like anywhere you have armpit hair,
you have armpit hair. Jesus Christ have leg hair too.
You can see the leg hair. I can't see like hair.
Do you shave your legs?
Speaker 2: I do?
Speaker 3: Not interesting, but it is light.
Speaker 2: It's kind of ginger, to be honest. So I didn't
fully avoid the red.
Speaker 4: No, it's there.
Speaker 3: S grow mustache. I can't even a little dirt stash.
Speaker 2: Oh I can grow dirt s dash.
Speaker 3: Yeah, do it.
Speaker 2: It's foul and I hate it. I don't know how
you have a beard. It's I if I don't shave.
Speaker 3: For like four days, it's the easiest thing possible. It's
called male makeup right here.
Speaker 1: That was also a male beauty thing. Was like beards
were super in that showed that you were masculine and manly.
Speaker 2: And although Egyptians were more about the fake beard.
Speaker 4: Right Yeah, they had the fake beards.
Speaker 2: The fertile crescent like Babylonians. I don't know about Somearians,
but Babylonians, Assyrians and stuff like that. Persians they did
the real beard and they would oil it up and
put perfume on it, but the Egyptians would more put
a face.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: The chick Farrow had to wear a fake beard.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but it was always fake, Like, it was almost
always fake.
Speaker 4: It's like goat hair something.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they like they really liked Actually red beards too
odd to learn. I don't know why, so jacked off.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just love a man with the red beard.
Can't get enough really.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but like red in that region. I was just like,
what about.
Speaker 5: Red hair to the Egyptians, of all things.
Speaker 4: It's different?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think was it also like a like a
warrior thing, like maybe the red was like going to battle.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Maybe, So I'm not going to battle with that guy, a.
Speaker 4: Guy with the red beard. You don't trust him.
Speaker 2: You said you want to be a viking. That's half
your fucking unit.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I've never said I want to be a viking.
Speaker 2: You have said many times you would like to be
a viking.
Speaker 3: Never on record Saturday, I want to mix me up
with somebody else.
Speaker 2: Listeners of the show, please chime in to him, d
M him or something. Because he said it. I understand
why Egyptians in particular would be very into making that's.
Speaker 3: Your fantasies out of mine, right, stop putting them and
projecting them onto me. Okay, I know you're such a
tryhard with Nordic lore.
Speaker 2: I am not remotely the Nordics obliterated my people. My
red hair is in my bloodline because of the Nordic.
Speaker 3: Well, who was it that was actually an Ireland half dan?
I believe with Viking.
Speaker 2: Oh I don't, I don't even remember. I mean the
Vikings like plundered Ireland for a long time. Yeah, just
as defend I look, we had it coming. I'm not
gonna lie. We were so defenseless for so long, Like
what do you what do you expect to happen? You're
next to England, Vikings are up there, get an army.
For the love of God.
Speaker 3: You can never say we took anyone's land because we
couldn't even defend our own.
Speaker 4: True.
Speaker 2: So I understand why Gypsons were going to make up,
in particular that that climate, you're just getting obliterated by
the sun. You're sweaty all day, and now you potentially
live in an a city, which is gross, like much
grosser than living in the wilderness. And again, like I
said earlier, it's funny to me that even back then
they realized, like God, we're gross. Yeah, like we are gross.
We need to fix. They're human, rob but there's like
a context, you know what I mean. If they don't know,
you wonder what their context is, Like, what's there?
Speaker 3: These people have ambition, they had goals, they had dreams,
but you don't family. They wanted to smell good.
Speaker 2: You don't know, you don't love, You don't know what.
You don't know. You don't know what clean is like
if you've only lived in filth.
Speaker 3: But they knew.
Speaker 2: I guess they did. That's it. I'm amazing.
Speaker 3: So you're exposing yourself for not knowing what you don't know.
I guess.
Speaker 2: So I'm shocked they're playing episode. So men applied a
makeup called coal k O h L like the store
can't imagine it's related, but who knows. It was made
from galina, which is lead, or malachite, which is green
copper high.
Speaker 1: I love the green eyes. Yeah, they would do a
little green around the rim, make your.
Speaker 2: Eyes pop, Yeah, I would, I guess. So. I like
lead based products, but the darker ones, the ones you
see I guess in higher gloss are probably the lead.
Speaker 4: Yeah. The black death sticks all over the eyes.
Speaker 3: It while they're drinking lead wine.
Speaker 2: I assume this didn't go great for them, like especially
it's actually it is a testament to Egypt that it
was such a successful empire for so long, and every
single day their rulers put lead in their eyes, and
all of their offspring were products of incest.
Speaker 3: Little freaks. Of course they're going to try to cover.
Speaker 2: Like it would make the Habsburg's puke. That's how incestuous.
Incestuous the Egyptians were, like. It wasn't like you're gonna
bang your cousin. It was like, here's your sister, she's
your white oh yeah.
Speaker 4: Half sister.
Speaker 1: They would just marr Intermary. It's disgusting, but they look
so good doing it. They did because they wore that
coalon eyes. A little eyeliner can really just hide the
incest from within.
Speaker 2: Your brother put some dark eyeliner on and he looks good.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, you're putting lipstick on a pig.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: King Tut was not king sight for your King Tut
was apparently a monster, like.
Speaker 4: No, like incest monster.
Speaker 5: Yeah yeah, Like.
Speaker 2: Have you ever seen there's like a recreations three D
like recreations of what he looked like just.
Speaker 4: One eye up with the other eye just down. He's
like a.
Speaker 2: Twelve year old with hip dysplacia. Basically like any English
bulldog you've ever seen.
Speaker 4: But alive. Yeah, but a real person.
Speaker 2: Yeah, put a human being terrifying. He was like an
English bulldog of a human being just shouldn't be alive.
It's just a monster from the jump. And that's why
he didn't live very long.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but he's still tours to this day. You get tickets,
you can't mm hmm, so city to city.
Speaker 2: What's interesting about coal though, because men from all classes
put it on? Apparently, it also essentially had the same
purpose of eye black in like football or baseball, help keep.
Speaker 4: The glares, the suns glare.
Speaker 3: Oh, I thought it was to write Bible verses on them.
Speaker 2: I think that maybe they wrote something from the Book
of the Dead John Yeah, chorus five twelve whatever, their
famous verse, favorite verse was. Coal also did have uses
beyond the sun though, too. It protected the eyes from
glare and dust. Like I said, well, didn't say dust
and uh it also but this is true according to
modern studies. It would keep you from getting eye infections. Interesting,
the lead would drive you insane, but it would keep
your eyes from getting infected. So if you're out in
the in the field shoveling shit all day. You're not
gonna get pink eye, do your your brain will rot.
Speaker 3: But you what's wrong with the little schizophrenia.
Speaker 4: Especially if you're looking good.
Speaker 3: You know that's just at hot, crazy scale.
Speaker 4: Toxic sexy man.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's called being fun.
Speaker 2: Rob Uh. Egyptian men did, I will say I go
in this a little bit. They do act. They did
actually have skincare routines as well. They used oils like
myrrh and frankincense to moisturize skin and hair dry.
Speaker 4: Climate need the need the moisture in place like Egypt.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you don't want to be ashy cracking elbows and
shit like that. And they actually found a papyrus that
list recip listed recipes for men's skin creams, including tell
me if this sounds even remotely useful, honey and natron
or naturn to smooth wrinkles and treat scars.
Speaker 1: So even then they were like wrinkles, they don't look good,
We got it. Yeah, you got to keep that skin
nice and soft.
Speaker 3: Honey and toallo is a big thing. Now, Yeah, I
do have a tallow.
Speaker 2: Some a listener of those shows we work for has
like a tallow company, and he gave me like his
skincare product, like the tallow thing. It's not for the face,
it's like for the body.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because it might clog your pores. Hot tip beef tallow.
Don't put on your face, keep it on the body.
Speaker 4: There you go.
Speaker 2: Men also, and this is where they get I start
to agree. They used ochre based powders to uh even
skin tone, but they would also use different chalky things
to lighten skin tone, signaling that they were.
Speaker 1: Not a day laborer, right working outside in the sun,
not hot, no gross disgusting.
Speaker 2: These oils were also insect repellents, like you said earlier. Yeah,
so if you're traveling up and down the nile or
working on the farm and working in the mud on
the nile all day, you're just getting eaten the fuck
alive if you're not putting this stuff on.
Speaker 4: But if you have a little glam on, yeah, you'll
be safem insects.
Speaker 2: The mosquitoes are like, mm mmm, he looks too good.
Speaker 3: I want to fuck that up.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Uh, what's also funny. And again this is how like
quickly civilization gets hyper complex. All of these makeups or
most of these makeups they've found, like the jars they
were stored in, or like the little applicators they were
stored in. Decorated, all decorated, yep, all ornately carved. And
people were marketing even back then, marketing was a thing.
You gotta think that there was some level of influencer
culture at the time. So if like a local famous
person used your makeup, like maybe a high priest or
a rich guy from the area, you could tell people
that more people buy your shit. Yeah, nothing is new,
nothing changes.
Speaker 3: No. Makeup has always been the get rich quick scheme
for women.
Speaker 4: And men, but now it is but now mostly women.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you got to just make a YouTube channel. It's
just you do in your makeup, get a billion followers.
Just come up with the cool money talk about like, oh, yeah,
I found a dog the other day and decided to
steal it.
Speaker 4: Are you talking about my dog? I didn't steal her.
Speaker 1: She she decided to leave her family and she found
us and we said, you know what, we'll help you out.
Speaker 4: Girl.
Speaker 3: You didn't rescue her, she rescued you.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: She was chip though, and I tried my best to
find the owner, but I I didn't really want to.
Speaker 4: I did. I did reach out a couple of times,
but now she's ours and she's adorable. She's a she's
pure white husky, which is a deal for Texas a lot.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the poor girls just struggling in this heat. But
she looks and she's she has that nice coll around
her eye too. She's got some eyeliner to define the eyes.
Speaker 4: Never goes out of style.
Speaker 2: Yeah, do you need dog makeup? Yeah, dress her up
a little bit.
Speaker 1: That's a thing now though. Dog cosmetics are not even cosmetics.
Speaker 4: But luxury dog like grooming products. That's the new frontier.
Speaker 1: We've done women's makeup, men'skin care is is there?
Speaker 4: But dogs open market.
Speaker 2: I like that. Someone was like, I just don't think
we're gonna crack the men, but dogs, right, we might.
Speaker 1: We'll get to dogs before men just come around to
using one cream at night.
Speaker 3: Well, dogs are an accessory for women mostly, that's true
in their purses.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't think the husky fits.
Speaker 1: And she's only really half husky.
Speaker 4: She looks full husky, just like miniature. She's like husky. Yeah,
she's cute. She's like twenty five pounds. You can carry her.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Oh, so this is actually why the reason they liked hair.
It was associated they.
Speaker 3: Would trying to justify, I'm not I don't have I
do you kind of do.
Speaker 2: Hung the legs. I guess Hannah was used to dye
beards and hair red because they thought that was associated
with vitality.
Speaker 5: Okay, like strong strength.
Speaker 2: And I guess probably virility as well.
Speaker 4: Strong swimmers means red hair, red hair. No, it's obsessive. Interesting, look, I.
Speaker 2: Don't miss I got I got red hair in my bloodline,
and I can't stop get my wife pregnant.
Speaker 4: Yeah, maybe you should think about stopping for your sake.
Speaker 2: Really, I was joking on a show the other day.
I was like, me, getting my wife pregnant again would
be the like existential equivalent of a sixteen year old
getting someone pregnant for the first you know what I mean?
Speaker 4: Like it would be life runing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, it would be like life collapsing, like
oh my god, everything's changed, nothing is Yeah.
Speaker 3: You should do it, but then you get four what's five?
Speaker 2: Six? Yeah?
Speaker 4: To have like ten? Your people used to have like ten.
Speaker 2: No, my dad has nine siblings.
Speaker 4: I remember that. It scared me the moment I heard farm.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you were at my wedding. And what's weird is
only like six of the siblings were there, maybe seven,
six or seven?
Speaker 4: What happened to the others?
Speaker 2: Oh no, it was six. One died.
Speaker 4: That happens when you have ten, Yeah, like one's going
to die, yeah.
Speaker 2: And then the other.
Speaker 3: It's just math yea.
Speaker 2: Two of the others just could make you know.
Speaker 4: Also one of them is gay? Are they is one gay?
What of you? Of your dad's siblings?
Speaker 2: Not of the siblings? No, okay, well that I'm aware of.
Speaker 4: I think statistically one out of ten has to be gay.
Speaker 2: I think you're probably.
Speaker 4: You're you're think you have one right now? Who's like
you could be gay?
Speaker 2: I think in the agenda, I think that, you know, statistically,
one's probably had very strong thoughts.
Speaker 4: But but they're Irish Catholics, so they wouldn't never.
Speaker 2: Right, right. They're all married in head or a sexual relationships.
Speaker 4: So doesn't mean they're happy.
Speaker 2: You're not wrong.
Speaker 3: But Rob's dad stayed with his mom.
Speaker 2: Thick and thin probably the one. Uh so in Mesopotamia
they were also getting their makeup game on. This is
around the same time period men used white lead. There
is so much lead used in ancient makeup. Yeah, it
is a fucking miracle that society was able to last.
Speaker 4: When did we know that lead was bad? Like recently, right,
like the nineteen hundreds.
Speaker 2: Maybe it was late in the game, like the fifties.
Speaker 3: Yeah, think every house was.
Speaker 2: Painting with lead pain Yeah, yeah, like it was lead.
Gasoline was the thing.
Speaker 3: So the nineties, like the eighties, nineties, you ste.
Speaker 2: To say, like this gasoleen's unleaded.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I think they also have like data that proves once
they got rid of let a gasoline, crime went down.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you or less crazy.
Speaker 3: Yeah, people were not breathing in or I guess violent
time went down.
Speaker 4: Yeah, there you go.
Speaker 2: Helps.
Speaker 1: So all the word world wars had happened during this time,
probably because of the lead eyeliner.
Speaker 4: They were all just power crazed men.
Speaker 3: The hitler wasn't on meth, It was just lead.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it was his eyeliner.
Speaker 3: He just snorted like shavings of lead.
Speaker 2: He did have beautiful eyes. That explains a lot now
that I think about it. So they use white lead
and chalk based powders also to lighten their faces for
the same reason men did adopt the Egyptian style coal.
These these civilizations interacted a lot, so they were into
that shit. They thought the Egyptians were really cool. But
makeup was less for everyone in the Fertile Crescent than
it was in Egypt. It was basically just for the
rich men in the Near East, like Phoenicia and ancient
Israel or whatever, ancient Palestine. That whole the Levant.
Speaker 3: I guess you could say make it a political statement.
Speaker 2: There no, no, no, the Levant because it weren't Israel
or ever. It wasn't necessarily it was like Israel. There
was Judah, there's Judea, a million things. Jesus side the
Hebrew Bible actually references King Jayhu might have uh used
subtle makeup for political appearances. Most of these makeups again
not great health wise. The lead based cosmetics would cause
not just neurological problems, but skin damage as well, believe
it or not. So you would put it on to
look better, but underneath your veneer, your face is just
rotting away. Yeah, which ironically then required more lead makeup.
Speaker 4: It's covered up.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, it's called a good business model.
Speaker 2: But the thing is they were so valuable culturally, like
people were like, I can't not be hot.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he created a market. Yeah, that product then causes
more issues, which creates more demand.
Speaker 2: Yes.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: The one thing you can't say is the cure.
Speaker 3: Help with the ailment?
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you just hair the dog your lead makeup essentially, like, oh,
I got some bad lead withdrawals today, I gotta put
more lead on. Now. The book you sent me which
you're holding, what is it.
Speaker 4: It's called Pretty Boys by David Ye.
Speaker 1: He was my boss and I guess now friend, but
he wrote this whole book on the history of men's
beauty essentially, and it's really fascinating. Honestly, I guess that's
all we're doing this podcast today, but it was.
Speaker 2: It's great, Yeah, it's It is interesting because it used
to be extremely normal, at least for a certain class
of people through throughout most of history.
Speaker 1: Literally up until the Enlightenment, which is when men thought that,
like there was a division.
Speaker 4: Before Enlightenment, men and women were considered equal.
Speaker 1: And then Enlightenment happened and men were like, actually, we
think you guys are just not as good as us.
Speaker 3: Yeah God knew, yeah, God knew men were better.
Speaker 4: Well, and that's when they decided to like it was, it.
Speaker 2: Was a move towards like natural and.
Speaker 1: Like usefulness versus like appearances. I think like men want
to be useful, not like pretty, which I guess you
guys want in that sense, Like you guys.
Speaker 4: Like you were right, Like you guys did it did
a whole lot.
Speaker 1: Post enlightenment, when you stop caring about beauty, you can
just get a lot more shit done.
Speaker 4: Turns out, that's that's true cord in history.
Speaker 2: That's why they were making makeup for you know, Paleli
people making makeup. They didn't invent farming for an extra
fifty thousand.
Speaker 1: They were too busy. Glamoring takes up years of women's lives.
When you add it all up at the end of
the end of your life, you're you're spending years in
the make in like Maile salons, in like hair salons.
Speaker 2: You guys getting ready to go out just in the morning.
Speaker 3: How many hours every year?
Speaker 4: Don't even ask me that question.
Speaker 2: It's a lot, to be fair, a lot of CEOs.
Speaker 4: A little that's true.
Speaker 2: Well, they have like blood boys.
Speaker 4: Let's not even talk about the orange man in office
because he needs some tips.
Speaker 1: His spray tan or makeup application is god awful. Look,
it's it's I think the artist hates him.
Speaker 2: It doesn't hit the hairline.
Speaker 4: It No, it doesn't even go to the ears.
Speaker 1: If you look at his ears, you can see where
where he looks like.
Speaker 3: He's getting ready for a competition for bodybuilding.
Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, it's splotchy as it's not.
Speaker 2: It's not all the way there, no, but he.
Speaker 4: Does it for a reason to look presentable for camera.
Speaker 2: I've seen photoshop pictures of him without the spray tan,
and it's the right move. Even if it's not put
on correct.
Speaker 4: Right, he's uglier without it. That's what's terrifying.
Speaker 3: I like the slick back, slickback, Donnie.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but the orange, the tone.
Speaker 1: Can we just add a little bit more like, I
don't know, green to that formula because it's going way orange.
Speaker 2: Naturalize it, yeah, it would.
Speaker 4: The orange is yeah, is a different I think he
has your issues.
Speaker 3: Right now.
Speaker 2: At this point. So we totally enliightenment and how that
was really what like killed male makeup. But it was
not a in the ancient world even like a blanket
thing where it's like, oh, everyone wears makeup. The Greeks
and Romans were actually like pretty They wore a little bit,
but they were pretty low key.
Speaker 3: You found in Father's little powder they did.
Speaker 2: I'll talk about that a little bit, but it kind
of gets it kind of gets a lot more uniform
after the Fall of Rome in terms of like you're
basically doing one thing for a thousand years, which is
some light powder and rouge. Yeah, that's kind of the
move for literally like a thousand years. Again for the
same reason to look like this, I look naturally.
Speaker 3: How did they dress up their eunuch slaves.
Speaker 2: Probably a lot of powder and a lot of ruge.
You want to look cherubic, right, like you want.
Speaker 1: To look That's why you just go shoot in with
the red that you guys were not even blending, just
putting the red right on the cheeks like.
Speaker 2: A little cartoon orphan anny situation.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because they want them to look obviously if they're
unicized or whoever whatever word it is. For that you
want to look boyish.
Speaker 3: They need to appear like they're enjoying it.
Speaker 2: Just paint a smile on their face, but a smile
on that face. So the Greeks of the Romans were
they were way less ostentatious than Egypt or Mesopotamia. Greek
men favored a natural appearance in general, they did use
cosmetics a little bit, basically like a light based situation.
Speaker 4: Just a light beat.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, athletes were a little more. They would do
a little more. You oil up, they did. It was
less for the face actually, but they would oil up
their skin before exercise or competitions to.
Speaker 3: Uh, wrestling, you don't want to get grabbed.
Speaker 2: You don't want to get grabbed. But it would also
like in a bodybuilding competition and show off that physique. Yeah,
show off that bod.
Speaker 3: Dom Mazeti once said ninety five percent of fitness is lighting.
It's not wrong.
Speaker 2: I agree with that. But face makeup not really used
in Greece, was not a big thing in Greece. It
was associated with women and quote unquote barbarian cultures. Yeah,
so the Greeks. What's what about the Greeks is that
they did a lot of cool stuff, but outside of Alexander,
who was like barely Greek, they never really had an empire.
They never really spread beyond their little A, G and
C realm. But they still looked out at everyone and
we're like, you guys are pieces of shit. Like they
were way more impressive bigger empires like the Persian Empire,
and they would just look at them and be.
Speaker 3: Like, fucking try hard.
Speaker 2: Well, these guys are fucking losers.
Speaker 3: Sometimes it's cool to appreciate what you have. Maybe that's
what Greece wanted to do.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it wasn't.
Speaker 3: Grass is always greener scenario. It's just like we like,
we're cool with Athens. Why go anywhere else?
Speaker 2: It's like a New Yorker, I ain't got to leave
New York.
Speaker 3: Got everything right here, best sitting in the world, am
I right?
Speaker 2: Fellas wrestlers would also they would use oil to show
off their uh lub up their physique, but they would
also like they would dust their bodies with fine powders
as well, and that would also like double up to
even show the physique even more.
Speaker 4: That makes sense, Yeah, you really want that shine.
Speaker 1: IM wearing body oil today, so like it's it just
makes your skin look healthy.
Speaker 4: You guys need to try wearing lotion. I swear you
just get put it on.
Speaker 2: My face, my body. Look at Dan up my whole body.
Speaker 4: Dan should try lubing up daily, right, Yeah.
Speaker 3: You can see the No, then I could pop top?
Speaker 2: Yeah, why don't you get to pop top? Promised to
pop top on the.
Speaker 3: Show, and he hasn't done it yet by September Bicy.
Speaker 4: Okay, what's the weight goal for the pop top I.
Speaker 3: Don't have a goal. No, I just want to I
want to look healthy, slim.
Speaker 2: The amount of time it's going to take you to
do lighting on that episode, yeah, no, it's gonna be obsceeved.
Speaker 1: I'm going to come in from makeup. I can do
some body contouring with some.
Speaker 3: Yeah, lout me up.
Speaker 2: Yeah, just get olive oil, yeah and some dust. Rome
was a little bit more into face makeup than the
Greeks were, but the Romans were still like they kind
of had that, honestly, that Enlightenment mindset. And I assume
that the Enlightenment, because that was around the same time
as Rome kind of came back into vogue. The Enlightenment
at the same time as or the Enlightenment informed all
of our founding fathers, right, who were super into Rome.
So presumably that probably the Roman views on a lot
of things influenced that, including the fact that they were
the same way they were like, we're men, were restrained,
we're conservative.
Speaker 4: We're thinkers, were not have to look good, just think.
Speaker 2: A lot, right, So face makeup was acceptable, but it
had to be subtle. Excessive use was actually lampooned as
a gay basically effeminate.
Speaker 4: The worst thing to be feminine, yees in Like there.
Speaker 2: Were their satirical works from the from the time, from
writers like Juvenile and Marshall who were just like would
just rip on people who guys who wore too much makeup, well.
Speaker 4: And they're kind of right, like it should be natural.
Speaker 1: Like if it's if you can see it and notice it,
like you've done it wrong.
Speaker 2: Right. That's for women too, Yes.
Speaker 1: Yes, exactly, like they were onto something. So just make
it more natural and you'll you're fine.
Speaker 3: Rob tell these bitches out to dress.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and Oxford never goes out of style. I'm not wrong,
so you can laugh all you want. Elite men. Actually,
so again at this point, this is only for the
elite anyway, Like the commoners aren't really doing maybe some
middle classes doing it. But if you did wear too
much makeup, you were shunning. No, you would get gossiped
about girl.
Speaker 1: That's still true today, so nothing's changed.
Speaker 2: Look at what he's wearing, so tacky.
Speaker 4: So obvious, that rouge too much.
Speaker 2: One of the worst offenders of makeup in ancient Rome
for having too much, wearing too much. Nero Unsurprisingly, he's
an ugly man. Yeah, he was a horrifically have have
you seen a picture of Nero?
Speaker 4: No show me.
Speaker 2: This is what Nero allegedly looked like.
Speaker 3: Uh, it's also a terrifying face to see.
Speaker 2: It's not good being. I do understand burned alive for
a party. Yeah, I do understand wanting makeup on.
Speaker 3: Ginger thar yeah, red hair, No, Yeah.
Speaker 4: It's bad.
Speaker 2: It's like your husband's earn it.
Speaker 4: He's way hotter.
Speaker 2: Than your husband's gross cousin, not your husband, that's true.
Like there could be one creature.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but like if you know he let himself go,
maybe maybe no show him that could be his future.
Speaker 4: Just threaten him.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you got to keep it tight, keep it tighter.
This is what you're gonna look like. Romans, like everyone else,
led lead, white lead, lead all fucking over. They were
drinking lead, they were putting lead on their face, they
were doing goddamn everything again. They wanted to have light appearance.
Actually a good comp you've seen it. I have not
seen it, but I've I've seen the pictures. I don't
know if you've seen or not. But the emperors and
Gladiator too, very like they had like powder on their
face and rouge on the That's essentially the look that
was going for and that was probably like the absolute
extreme of what you could do. And one of the
reasons they would do this again it was light in
the skin. They would do it especially for appearances. They
would necessarily do it every day, but if they need
to make a public appearance, so they need to.
Speaker 4: It was political, yeah.
Speaker 2: They so. Cicero when he would speak to the Senate
would make sure he was camera ready.
Speaker 1: Cyrus the Great, the Persian Emperor, whenever he would conquer
a new place, like he would take the leader of
that place and like take him to the salon for
like a makeover. Like have you seen like that America
Sweethearts DCC show on Netflix where like one of the
episodes is like the makeover episode where they take all
the girls who are like from you know, wherever the
fuck like in this you know, in the States, and
they give him like the Texas like girl treatment, like
with the hair and like the makeup just to all
look like this same.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but it's like a Texas.
Speaker 1: Beauty version of like of like a makeover and so
that's what he was doing with his new like would council.
Speaker 2: Persia by him.
Speaker 5: Yeah, so he would make it look.
Speaker 1: Like him, yes, but but yeah, make him look like better,
argive him to makeover and be like here's your makeup artist,
and here's what you're gonna wear, and here's the blush
and yeah.
Speaker 3: The Persons were very good at like assimilating anybody that
that is there.
Speaker 2: The Persians are. There's actually a chapter of the Bible
that literally just talked about how dope Cyrus is. Yea,
because Cyrus was liberated them from Babylon, Yeah, and left
them practice their own religion.
Speaker 1: They loved him and they had been makeover and they
were like, oh my god, you're the greatest conqueror I've
ever had.
Speaker 4: Was so nice.
Speaker 2: I love it. Yeah, but I assume part of it
was to make the king look more Persian. Yeah, right,
so it was like, look, he's into us, so you
should be into us.
Speaker 3: To write, and they were actually pretty original Arians.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know how. I don't know where blonde
came from.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they they dyed everyone's hair black. That was one
thing that they did to make him look similar is
they would dye all the council the hair, the hair
black to look alike.
Speaker 2: Oh interesting, Yeah, because they had naturally black hair the most.
Speaker 4: I think so.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the the Persians, the great. Yeah, so he would
want all of his guys to look have the same
haircut and the same color.
Speaker 2: Your boys just ride and deep.
Speaker 3: Everybody looks the same girl rock and gold chains.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yep.
Speaker 3: Wearing too much perfume.
Speaker 2: Again, this white lead that they put on their faces toxic,
would cause skin lesions, hair loss would of course make
them crazy. And this they knew this, by the way,
They did know this, and they still didn't care. They
didn't care. And they also again they would put rouge
on and stuff like that same thing made from ochre,
carmine plant and other plant based eyes and stuff like that.
Rouge allegedly enhanced a man's vigor, so it would make
you seem more whatever, just cornier, stronger, and hornier. Julius Caesar,
who was known as a meticulous groomer. That's probably in
both ways, to be honest, that's yeah true.
Speaker 1: Yeah, one case where could be used in both Yeah.
Speaker 2: Double groomer. Yeah, he almost certainly was a rouge queen.
Speaker 4: Good for him.
Speaker 2: Yeah, honestly, like absolutely sure again camera ready for his triumphs.
He would when whenever you do his military parades in Rome, Afre,
he conquered someplace in Gaul or whatever, make up on
point during the parade.
Speaker 4: Blush blindness.
Speaker 3: Really, I think before every podcast you should go full
Mulan rouge. Let's just get you all dialed up. Baby.
Speaker 2: Oh, just put me in a some lingerie.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I was gonna say, like just saying that one Yeah, yeah, I.
Speaker 3: Don't care, just rouged up.
Speaker 2: Oh I'll just come into lingerie one day.
Speaker 3: Yeah that's fine. I'll skip the lingerie that your family
friend bought for your wife. Yeah, we talked about off like.
Speaker 2: I don't know if I ever told that story on air,
but one of my family friends, Uh, for our engagement party,
people brought presents and stuff like that, and most people
brought like plates or something, you know what I mean. Yeah,
we didn't even ask for presents. But I remember when
our present, some people brought like silverware, plates or whatever.
And this one family friend who had known me since
I was a baby, walked into a store picked out
lingerie from my wife, presumably, looked at it and thought
got excited. This will give rob an erection and gifted
it to my wife.
Speaker 3: How did they know her?
Speaker 4: That's what I was just gonna ask that. Did they
get it right?
Speaker 2: Yeah? They did. I don't know skinny, so it's yeah whatever. Yeah,
but boobs aze varies. Yeah, that's true. I don't know
how they got the cup.
Speaker 4: Size right, that's concerning.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, just took one look at a photo and
was like, I got this. Yeah that's the super rec
did fit because she did put it on and be
like this is the one that was a joke. Yeah,
this is the one they gave me. And I was like,
now that's his go to set. Now you look pretty good.
To be honest, I'm not gonna lie. Damn it, damn it,
missus Red.
Speaker 3: What was the brand?
Speaker 2: I don't know, I don't remember. It was Cohl's actually, Uh.
Some Egyptian men liked to once they conquered Egypt, or
like Egypt became a protectorate, they did kind of like
to imitate the Egyptian stuff a little bit. But that
was almost like the equivalent of like an all emo
kid wearing makeup. But you could do it, and but
people would look at East sideways.
Speaker 4: It was too far.
Speaker 2: It was a little too far, like it could be
pulled off like you could Pete Wentz it. Yeah, and
you can walk around and if you were powerful enough
or famous enough like Pete Wentz was, people will be like,
all right, well it works for him, I guess, but
that's still kind of fucking weird.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but Pete Wentz looked good an eyeliner.
Speaker 2: Yeah. The one people in Rome that were allowed to
use makeup pretty much NonStop was like actors and stuff
like that.
Speaker 4: You know, well you have to stay.
Speaker 2: Yeah, actors ironically and musicians and I don't know if
maybe we should go back to this. Uh, they were
considered gross and low class in ancient Rome.
Speaker 4: Let's bring that back.
Speaker 3: I never stopped, never stopped, like if you were, if
you were a creative in ancient Rome, like people would
be like, they want to go see things, but that
is a that was a low class profession. Agreed. Yeah,
as a filmmaker myself and you being the actor.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you guys both have been in many things.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I agree with it. We're garbage, absolute garbage.
It was also seen as like foreign and feminine, so
they didn't again like.
Speaker 5: Pete webs Fey feminine bad.
Speaker 2: Yeah. The Greek restraint obviously influenced the Romans. It did
get a little wilder during the Imperial period the more
they got integrated with the East, but it didn't ever
go full bore. And from what I can tell, European makeup,
like I said, through the Middle Ages was pretty much
the same. The Catholic Church really down on it. This
is all the way from even like Saint Augustine in
the fifth century, all the week we stepped up, Yeah,
all the way through John Wycliffe in the fourteenth century.
A lot of riders are just.
Speaker 4: Like this is dumb.
Speaker 2: It's it's extravagant.
Speaker 4: It's a waste of time, right, Yeah, and it is.
It's silly, it is fun.
Speaker 2: It is very funny.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: That men are kind of like shit on for being
like this is stupid in a waste of time. But
women are championed like Pam Anderson, right, yeah, being like
make up stupid. I don't want to wear it. I'm
gonna go natural.
Speaker 4: Yeah, And they're like, you crazy bitch, why would you
do that?
Speaker 2: Wild? Yeah, look at you. She still looks good.
Speaker 4: But Christians like hated like make up too for that reason.
They were like this is to be so concerned with
yourself and your appearance is ungodly.
Speaker 2: It was ungodly, and it was also uh pagan. Yeah,
because the Pagans would still be painting their faces. They're
doing whatever they would do.
Speaker 3: Also, they had a hard enough time keeping their hands
off the altar boys.
Speaker 2: As is right. You put some extra rouge on an altar.
Speaker 4: Boys, boys aren't safe no more.
Speaker 3: Then you go back to being full Roman.
Speaker 2: No, that's that's blood in the water, rouge on an
altar boys, blood in a shark filled pool.
Speaker 3: Gross.
Speaker 2: Despite the clergy being against the rich, people in kings
and stuff would still and even bishops sometimes would still
use it to just obviously again they're mostly making themselves
pale with some rouge to make themselves appear refined, not
field workers. Blah blah blah. So a lot of it,
and this happens all throughout history. Essentially is if you're
rich enough, you can kind of tell the church to
fuck off. Yeah, like you can't Henry the Eighth it,
but you, to a large extent you can be like, man,
what are you gonna do.
Speaker 1: That's not for me. That rules not for me. It
applies to the pleebs down there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it feels like you might need me more than
I need you sometimes, So I'm just gonna I'm gonna
powder up and ignore that rule. Yeah you can, you
can fuck off. Thankfully they did dump lead during this time.
Lead was used quite a bit less during the Middle Ages.
Speaker 3: Supply issue.
Speaker 2: No, they just finally were like, yeah, I don't want
my face to be gross.
Speaker 4: It was like skin Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was like I looked like I did look
good at the party, but I washed my face.
Speaker 4: The next day and now there's holes in it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was a nightmare. Uh, what happened to it?
Makeup does make a comeback though in the Renaissance, yep,
all the way up to the end of the eighteenth
century to the Enlightenment.
Speaker 3: Brings to one man.
Speaker 2: What you're gonna get a Dvinci credit for that? Of course?
Probably right?
Speaker 3: He did everything else.
Speaker 2: No, Da Vinci was a hobo.
Speaker 3: Da Vinci was a genius.
Speaker 2: But he was like hobo life. He had no time
for anything other than not making.
Speaker 3: Not a hobo came from a poor family.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but he just he was like Howard Hughes at
his worst, you know what I mean, like just peeing
in jars and drawing airplanes. So that was all he
was doing.
Speaker 3: It's a simple life.
Speaker 2: At least Howard Hughes made them.
Speaker 3: Uh he's a man before the time he was supposed
to be in.
Speaker 2: Clearly it did become more prominent. Uh a lot like
obviously was in with wealthy people, but even without, like
even in middle classes and stuff like that too. The
Italian and French, of course, were the at the forefront
of that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know if the checks are it doesn't.
Speaker 2: Feel very German.
Speaker 4: No, it doesn't very British, very Irish.
Speaker 2: Yeah. But Russia no, no, no, certainly not. Those people
are fully backwards at this.
Speaker 3: Point, except uh, when Peter the Great came back and
forced everybody to shave their beards, right.
Speaker 2: Forced them to share their beards, and then they adopted
friend there's several times in Russian history where they're like,
oh my god, we're the grossest people on this country.
We have about it.
Speaker 4: And shaved beard.
Speaker 3: I think it was Peter the Great made everybody shave
their beard and kind of have like a traditional European look.
Speaker 2: He went to France and was like, they thought I
was a caveman, and the goddamn king of a country,
and they thought I was a hobo.
Speaker 1: Sometimes that clean shaven look makes you just look like
a real like a real man professional.
Speaker 2: I agree.
Speaker 1: Beardless, stupid beardless guy right here, compared to this spiking
over here, which vikings. There's actually a law that you
could not cut a man's hair off without his consent
because they really value their hair.
Speaker 2: So yeah, in Norse culture.
Speaker 4: In Nordic culture, yeah, they loved their beards. They wore
long hair their dreads and stuff.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and they would tie their little man buns into
battle to like keep their hair out of their face.
Speaker 2: Well you don't want it. You don't want someone yanking
you from behind.
Speaker 1: Well yeah, and maybe the sword would cut their ponytail off,
Like that'd be awful.
Speaker 4: We gotta tuck it in.
Speaker 2: I actually do like a ponytail down the back to
protect from a sword swing. Just get a thick braid.
Speaker 5: Yeah, you know.
Speaker 4: What I mean, just avoid that sword to the neck.
Speaker 2: It's just an extra little bit of like their distance. Yeah,
they would put sometimes in World War Two, they would
put logs on the side of tanks. Obviously a log
is not gonna do much to a shell, but just
that little just kind of keep it.
Speaker 3: They were unstable, they went full berserker mode. They're high
on mushrooms.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they're absolute lunatics. Another reason people start to like
make up in this time period, by the way, covered
blemishes from diseases like smallpox.
Speaker 1: Which that's gonna give you some some some marks on
your face, like.
Speaker 2: Yeah, acne, scarring times a million.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that hyper pigmentation is gonna jump out.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. They also just in general, the Renaissance was
very artsy, so they just encourage men to express themselves,
you know what I mean, just glow up however you want,
especially again in Italy and France, they want.
Speaker 3: To mention how rampant were the STDs back then.
Speaker 2: Horrifics.
Speaker 3: If you got syphilis, it's a gnarly situation down there.
Speaker 2: You can cover, it's a gnarly situation in your whole body,
I know.
Speaker 3: But were there marks? I imagine have.
Speaker 2: You ever seen the face of a syphilitic woman?
Speaker 3: Now, oh boy, I don't know much about cyphialis actually,
except that a killed out capone.
Speaker 2: Yeah he got out before it was too bad. Oh god,
oh yeah, this is the one I saw.
Speaker 3: She have no doors or something.
Speaker 2: She might have been.
Speaker 3: Does she lose something?
Speaker 2: This is a woman with syphilis. Ah, what would your
skincare routine be for her?
Speaker 4: Kill you myself? Just end it.
Speaker 1: No, there's nothing to be done. There's no laser in
the world that can fix that.
Speaker 2: At that point, you just go to the island of
misfit syphilitics.
Speaker 4: And just fall off a cliff.
Speaker 2: That's pretty much the end of it. The Baroque period
saw male face makeup reach its peak. Particularly it did
get all the way to England, but France and Spain
as well. Elaborate appearances were essentially a display of power. Right,
The more makeup you had, the more elaborate you were
with the wig and everything.
Speaker 4: They love their wigs.
Speaker 2: The richer you were. Yeah, and the story also I
did read that wigs were They did also have a
a normal you like, a practical use, which is lice. Yea. Yeah,
you cut your hair off so you don't.
Speaker 1: Get lise Sah, you're bald under the wig, and then
you just PLoP it on when you're going out, which is.
Speaker 4: Great also because jump to your hair. Have you tried
have you thought about a wig?
Speaker 2: Wig? Actually?
Speaker 4: Yeah, just go full bald and get a wig of
your own hair. You should consider that.
Speaker 2: I might. That sounds way better, way easier.
Speaker 4: Yeah, just no bad head ever.
Speaker 5: Yeah, oh my god, I'm down.
Speaker 2: I would have to wear it during sex.
Speaker 3: So I don't you just shave your head.
Speaker 2: Rob, Why not? I'll wig. I'll make a wig out
of my own hair, shave my head. Yeah that sounds fine. Honestly,
it sounds better. They did go back to using lead.
That's a face white hair.
Speaker 3: H Yeah, you just default back old habits die. Yeah.
Speaker 2: The face makeup was especially big for candle light balls.
You wanted to stand out in the low light, which
I don't even understand because low light is everybody's good
a game.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you look your best.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I wouldn't say everyone's a game. Sometimes that low light,
especially in the right angle, you can look like cast.
Speaker 4: It casts the wrong shadows. That's why you have the makeup.
Speaker 2: What the lighting situation that you're running, it's gonna.
Speaker 4: Be low lighting, guys, prepare yourselves. Yeah, a lot of
candle a lot of candle light.
Speaker 5: Yeah, love that.
Speaker 2: The last thing you want it is to be like
noon outside direct right white light.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, No, we're.
Speaker 1: Gonna hire some cloud cover to get that diffusion light.
Speaker 2: Yea, yeah, maybe have some cloud seed a little bit before. Right,
They did this in ancient Rome too, but in this
period that basically this is like French Revolution American Revolution
time period. Uh, they would put little black patches glued
to their face to cover blemishes. But this would apparently
be like a charming thing. There would be shapes like
stars or crescents.
Speaker 1: That's so crazy because that's that's in fashion.
Speaker 4: Now. Have you seen girls wearing their.
Speaker 1: Pimple patches out in the world. They have like they
have stars, so they didn't may pimple patches now in
different shapes star that's true, and you're a parent, don't
go out. Well let me tell you guys, the pimple
patches are a thing and they're an accessory now, so
they have nothing changes nothing stars.
Speaker 3: You tell me the world has nothing to offer me.
Speaker 4: Thank you, no, stay home, nothing.
Speaker 2: But yeah, they would wear men would wear all this stuff.
Hearts as well, I guess was another shape. Women would
be like, oh, look at that guy with that cool patch.
Definitely out to.
Speaker 3: The bar and do like a licoln stick under my eye,
yeah and be okay.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: But of course at the same time this was happening,
Puritans were like.
Speaker 4: Makeup.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, look at these fucking losers. But obviously they
didn't win out. No. However, the two things that killed
it were like, really put the final nail in the
coffin where the French Revolution because they hated the aristocrats.
Anyone wearing makeup was right. Yeah uh, And the rise
of Romanticism kind of shifted male ideals towards like rugged
natural masculinity, mountain man, my makeup is the dirt on
my face.
Speaker 4: That's still in style.
Speaker 2: I would say that's one hundred percent still.
Speaker 3: So you gotta think the women caught on a little
faster not to kind of lather themselves in oil when
they were accused of being a witch. You go up
way faster.
Speaker 2: I think that's actually ideal. Yeah, you want to burn
faster or slip out of the rope.
Speaker 5: We can't hang her slippery.
Speaker 2: Yeah, she keeps sliding witchcraft and you go up for
the last thing you want to do is have a
long burning at the stake.
Speaker 4: Yeah, just go straight up.
Speaker 2: And the whole point is get it done as fast
as possible.
Speaker 3: If you go up too quick and you die too fast,
it's kind of embarrassing, though.
Speaker 2: Not for you. No, I don't think you're worried about
what other people are thinking of that.
Speaker 3: It's like, wow, you only went thirty seconds.
Speaker 2: I think everyone's opinions on you have been finalized. When
you're ring tied to a steak on top top of a.
Speaker 3: Pyre, you know it'll echo for eternity.
Speaker 2: But yeah, the French the turn of the century, by
eighteen hundred, basically makeup was more or less out for men,
and it's been that way ever since.
Speaker 1: Yeah, a brief period of American history the presidents were
makeup and the Congress did not like it.
Speaker 4: Apparently.
Speaker 2: When was that.
Speaker 4: This was Martin van Buren's presidency.
Speaker 3: Oh, the van Buren boys.
Speaker 1: He had like cosmetics on his desk, and Congress was like, hey,
this guy maybe isn't fit to run this country if
he's like concerned about how he looks.
Speaker 2: That makes sense. He was the first and maybe only
president in US history whose first language wasn't English. They
hate that he was a Dutchman. Yeah, with the Dutch.
The Dutch don't strike me as a fancy people, though.
Speaker 4: I think he was just trying to look the part.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Actually, also, I think he was known as like
pretty vain.
Speaker 3: We just got done with Jackson at that point. You know,
we're going from.
Speaker 2: The exact opposite of a makeup where.
Speaker 3: You know, one of the manliest guys of the time
to some prissy.
Speaker 2: But Van Buren was his boy though, like van Buren
was the heir to Jackson.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but if he saw the cosmetics, I'm sure Jackson
separated him.
Speaker 1: And then William Henry Harrison right ran after him and
used that in his campaigns of like, this guy's too
soft to be president if he's wearing makeup.
Speaker 2: Which is deeply ironic because William Henry Harrison died thirty
or forty days into office, specifically because he wanted to
show how much of a man he was and not
wear a jacket at his freezing cold inaugural speech, and
he got sick and died.
Speaker 1: Yep, this is what masculinity does to you. It's just
gonna kill you.
Speaker 2: It makes you. Allegedly, everyone remembers William Henry Harrison.
Speaker 4: How he died from his own.
Speaker 2: Ugh, that's all I got for today on the history
of men's face makeup. What'd you guys learn today? Dan?
Speaker 3: Pretty much? Everything I don't really mess with the stuff.
Call me old school Catholic, but.
Speaker 2: Not gonna put some lead eyeliner on.
Speaker 3: I'm not going to do that, start seeing stuff. Not
gonna go full Egyptian like you.
Speaker 2: I'll do some Egyptian eyeliner.
Speaker 4: Fuck it go crazy, yeah.
Speaker 3: Full exotic.
Speaker 2: Yeah, just I hope you do.
Speaker 3: Actually, yeah, let's every episode, let's have you wear lead
makeup until we see damaging results.
Speaker 2: I mean how long those episodes would get as I
just go into an unhinged like lead psychosis.
Speaker 4: M hm, listens would go way up.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Like the visual aspect, maybe not so much because you
will turn pretty fairal.
Speaker 2: I think that would actually.
Speaker 5: Help vision could be good.
Speaker 2: Yeah, some raving, slobbering lunatic with killer eyeliner. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Hello, yeah you look like a cat anally cat.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: They just got into a little fight.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I'll probably just make that noise a lot too
in your face.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 4: I can't wait. Can't I to see my wedding tan.
That's gonna be something.
Speaker 5: I will to see.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm excited for.
Speaker 1: That Fox Tanned tune in October thirteenth or after what.
Speaker 2: If I like it?
Speaker 3: Well, he's gonna this is the point.
Speaker 4: Yes, your wedding October thirteenth.
Speaker 2: Oh boy, it's gonna be a crazy weekend.
Speaker 4: Sorry, yep, what else do you have going on?
Speaker 3: I can't don't say on air because it seems like
an off air conversation.
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, I can't say anymore because I don't think
he's listening.
Speaker 4: But just in case, well, certainly you'll end with a bang?
Which is the wedding?
Speaker 2: Exactly would you learn to day, Christina?
Speaker 1: I learned that you guys are afraid of makeup still,
that it persists, but you're more open to it, Rob,
which I would have assumed.
Speaker 2: I'm already beautiful, Dan, I've probably I've certainly worn more
makeup in my life that Dan.
Speaker 4: I was a theater kid, certainly.
Speaker 2: Yeah, quite a bit of makeup applied to me back
in the day.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and lead makeup. Maybe let's bring it back for
like certain world theaters. I don't know, it could be interesting.
Speaker 2: Yeah, let's have some fun anymore big ones anyway, in like.
Speaker 4: Killer Islander again, Like if you're going to fight a war,
at least look good doing it.
Speaker 2: Yes, uh, And then we do a thing on every show.
I guess you said you did some homework on it.
Speaker 4: I did.
Speaker 2: But who is today's Hitler?
Speaker 4: Today's Hitler?
Speaker 1: Honestly, that Viking guy that you should not Viiking guy,
the read guy nero him with his face, that good choice.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's bad. He is. He is generally looking in
many ways, just as bad as Hitler, not as prolific,
but an absolute psychopath and horrible to look at. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah,
but you who's your Hitler to that?
Speaker 3: So the guy that brought back Lead into the fold, Yeah.
Speaker 2: He was like, I don't know, man, this stuff is
everywhere and then it works. Yeah.
Speaker 3: It's kind of like trends these days, where you're going
back to those old school diets or those old school
fashion trends.
Speaker 2: I would actually make really love if truthism became a
thing where people like the belonging to you Lead's flying.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: There's people that are anti sunscreen.
Speaker 1: That's the whole thing. Don't even get me started. That's
a different podcast.
Speaker 2: That's a self selecting group anyway, truly.
Speaker 4: Yeah, let nature take its course, That's what I say.
Speaker 2: They won't breed as much and they'll.
Speaker 4: They'll die early.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, So that's fine if you don't like sunscreen
mazletof Today's hitler, though.
Speaker 3: Is you compare me to a neanderthal multiple times.
Speaker 2: Not intellectually, just visually. In fact that you don't understand
that makes me want to start comparing you intellectually.
Speaker 3: It wasn't that you kind of alluded to it that
you have to say, actually one number once when I
see you outside, I'm gonna bash you over the head
with a stick like a neanderthal. Damn it.
Speaker 2: This point Danrichester at Christina Montemeo our expert makeup artist.
We love you, Thank you for coming one more time.
If you want to plug anything.
Speaker 4: Follow me on Instagram.
Speaker 1: Chris Monty cr no h Monty two, why's that's me?
And yeah, let's wear some makeup bend. Let's bring it
back a little bit plea. Yeah, a little concealer and
some bronzer. That's all you need, truly, Yeah, that's the
that's the secret concealer and bronzer.
Speaker 4: Thank me later and.
Speaker 2: Enough so that like a woman wouldn't notice.
Speaker 4: Yeah, no, don't go crazy.
Speaker 3: Yeah, don't don't do this, because I feel like a
chick would see that and be like turned off immediately.
Speaker 4: Now she'd be like, let me help you.
Speaker 3: Maybe have like an established relationship with this woman first.
Speaker 4: Yeah sure, okay, fine.
Speaker 3: Don't do it like first my meat and fire. Okay,
might not be the woman you want to.
Speaker 2: It's like this type of thing where like it's something
like ninety nine percent of men would date a chick
that hooked up with a chick, and it's like twenty
percent of women with date a dude they hooked up
with a dude, you know what I mean. Yeah, So
it's like the type of thing where it's like women
are like, yeah, men need more open and it's like, hey,
guess what I wear makeup?
Speaker 3: And they're like's not you though, Rob, I guess your
mom falls into twenty percent.
Speaker 2: God damn it for Dan Chester and Christina montemayor. I
guess we'll end on that note. I'm Rob Fox.
Speaker 3: You just got saw served