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<v Speaker 1>This episode MA contained content of a graphic nature, including

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<v Speaker 1>descriptions of physical and sexual violence against adults, children, and animals.

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<v Speaker 1>Listener discretion is advised. Hi, this is Tanya.

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<v Speaker 2>Hi, this is Shannon, and we are.

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<v Speaker 1>Crimes and Consequences, a hardcore true crime podcast.

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<v Speaker 2>Hey Shannon, Hey Tanya, how are you?

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<v Speaker 1>I'm doing great? How are you?

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<v Speaker 2>I'm doing pretty good too.

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<v Speaker 3>I know we were talking before we started recording, but

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<v Speaker 3>just like to let everybody know that I'm building my

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<v Speaker 3>lexicon as we speak, my own personal vocabulary, and I'm

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<v Speaker 3>hoping to impress you with my expanded vocabulary someday soon.

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<v Speaker 2>No, I was.

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<v Speaker 1>Telling Shannon how I need to expand my lexicon as well,

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<v Speaker 1>because my reactions in the podcast are pretty much, oh

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<v Speaker 1>my god, right exactly. I mean, yeah, that's the range

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<v Speaker 1>of my emotions that is so funny.

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<v Speaker 3>I feel the same with my especially with exactly exactly.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm like geez a, Luciana, and pick another word.

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<v Speaker 3>You know, any word I know precisely, precisely. No, but

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<v Speaker 3>there's a bunch the surface lexicon is our our fifteen

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<v Speaker 3>hundred words that for sure, we every day we say

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<v Speaker 3>it leaves these same lexicon and then there's a lex

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<v Speaker 3>kind of words that we know, but we just don't

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<v Speaker 3>use them.

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<v Speaker 2>And I was like, outside of the.

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<v Speaker 3>Articles, like the A and so that's gonna fill about

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<v Speaker 3>forty words of my surface lex on our articles. That's

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<v Speaker 3>how much I speak. And then the other ones are like,

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<v Speaker 3>fuck that, fuck this, what's the shit? I really declined

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<v Speaker 3>in my oratory? I don't even know if oratory.

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<v Speaker 2>Is a word. It is, Yeah, thank you, I'm glad

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<v Speaker 2>to hear that. Be guys, I liked you expand it,

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<v Speaker 2>but good things ahead.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, yeah, fuck is definitely in my fifteen hundreds acon.

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<v Speaker 2>Noun, verb, ad verb. It very very useful.

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<v Speaker 3>So tell me, girl, what kind of story are you

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<v Speaker 3>bringing us today?

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<v Speaker 1>Well, before I get into this week's episode, I would

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<v Speaker 1>just like to remind everyone to hit subscriber follow and

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<v Speaker 1>whatever app you're listening to. And the episode that I

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<v Speaker 1>have for everyone today is a pretty well known episode.

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<v Speaker 1>It is about the murder of Gregory Smart And if

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<v Speaker 1>you're not sure, maybe you can't place the name. Once

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<v Speaker 1>I get into this, you're gonna be like, oh, yeah, okay,

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<v Speaker 1>I remember this story. So our Stories begins on the

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<v Speaker 1>evening of May first, nineteen ninety around ten ten pm,

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<v Speaker 1>a woman named Pamela Smart was pulling under her street

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<v Speaker 1>making her way to her condo that she shared with

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<v Speaker 1>her husband Greg. When her headlights hit her condo windows.

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<v Speaker 1>She thought that maybe something was amiss because Greg, who

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<v Speaker 1>was home, he usually turned on the porch light, like

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<v Speaker 1>if he got home from work first, like they had

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<v Speaker 1>this you know thing, like whoever got home first would

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<v Speaker 1>turn on the porch lights, and it was off, and

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<v Speaker 1>she noticed he was home. After Pamela pulled her car

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<v Speaker 1>into the garage of the condo and walked inside the home,

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<v Speaker 1>she turned on the foyer light and saw her twenty

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<v Speaker 1>four year old husband's body laying in a pool of

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<v Speaker 1>his blood right near the foyer of the home. Pamela

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<v Speaker 1>said that on May first, nineteen ninety, that day started

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<v Speaker 1>off carefree, like any other day that she's lived. She

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<v Speaker 1>went to work, she went to a meeting, she left

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<v Speaker 1>for the day, and she found her husband's dead body

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<v Speaker 1>when she came home. Wow, his body was laying in

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<v Speaker 1>a dark hallway and he was still wearing what he

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<v Speaker 1>had on when he left for work that morning. It

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<v Speaker 1>was a gray suit jacket with dress pants. Under his

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<v Speaker 1>body was his wedding ring, his keys, and his wallet.

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<v Speaker 1>Most of his body was on the dining room blue carpet,

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<v Speaker 1>but his ankles were in the foyer and his arm

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<v Speaker 1>was bent backwards at the elbow in an odd way.

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<v Speaker 1>His left foot ended up kind of twisted because it

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<v Speaker 1>had been caught in between a brass candlestick and the

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<v Speaker 1>stairwell wall by the back door of the condo. A

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<v Speaker 1>small television and two sereal speakers had been left behind

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<v Speaker 1>by whoever assumingly attacked Greg and the family dog. His

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<v Speaker 1>name was Halen. He was found hiding in a dark

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<v Speaker 1>place inside the house, and this dog was scared shitless.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh so, when pam discovered Greg's body, she began screaming

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<v Speaker 1>for someone to help her, and she's ringing the neighbor's doorbells,

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<v Speaker 1>she's banging on their doors. One of her neighbors answered

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<v Speaker 1>the door and pulled Pamela quickly inside because you know,

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<v Speaker 1>they don't know if there's still an attacker on the loose.

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<v Speaker 1>God knows when this happened. So she's saying that her

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<v Speaker 1>husband been hurt and that he's lying on the floor

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<v Speaker 1>and Greg had been shot. He was shot execution style.

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<v Speaker 1>The bullet entered his skull above his left ear and

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<v Speaker 1>it was a thirty eight caliber bullet, so he was

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<v Speaker 1>dead like as soon as he was shot shot. At

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<v Speaker 1>this point, most of her neighbors had heard the commotion

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<v Speaker 1>and had stepped outside to see what was happening. They lived,

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<v Speaker 1>like I said, in a condo complex, and they were

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<v Speaker 1>attached condos. They lived on the end. But all of

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<v Speaker 1>this commotion is happening. So two calls were made from

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<v Speaker 1>two different neighbors placed to nine one one. One neighbor

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<v Speaker 1>just assumed that she had been beaten by her husband,

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<v Speaker 1>so I guess that's probably on the nine one one.

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<v Speaker 1>Another neighbor came to see if he could help, and

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<v Speaker 1>when he asked Pamela where her husband was, she pointed

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<v Speaker 1>toward the condo. The neighbor then started frantically looking inside

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<v Speaker 1>all of the cars parked outside the condominium, and he's screaming, well,

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<v Speaker 1>where the fuck is he? And Pamela's like, he's inside,

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<v Speaker 1>he's inside. So when the neighbor ran up to the

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<v Speaker 1>porch steps to add her through the front door, Pamela

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<v Speaker 1>screamed for him not to go outside, just in case.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, the intruder was still there. Right when the

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<v Speaker 1>neighbor opened the front door slowly. The first glimpse was

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<v Speaker 1>of the brass candlestick, since the foyer light was twinkling

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<v Speaker 1>off of it. As the neighbor inspected further, he could

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<v Speaker 1>see Greg's twisted foot. He opened the door a little

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<v Speaker 1>more and he did see Greg laying face down in

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<v Speaker 1>his own blood. It didn't take long for the cops

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<v Speaker 1>to arrive, and at first this killing seemed random. Greg

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<v Speaker 1>was pronounced officially that at eleven nineteen pm, and the

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<v Speaker 1>crime scene tape went up. Police started investigating immediately, looking around,

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<v Speaker 1>and they noticed that the entire condo was completely ransacked.

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<v Speaker 1>Although the murder of Greg looked a lot like a

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<v Speaker 1>burglary gone wrong, when police Captain Jackson got to the scene,

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<v Speaker 1>he immediately noticed some serious red flags. He said, a

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<v Speaker 1>lot of what was visible just didn't make sense. There

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<v Speaker 1>wasn't a single sign of forced entry. The burglary quote unquote,

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<v Speaker 1>took place at night in one of the most heavily

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<v Speaker 1>populated areas in New Hampshire, and the method of the

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<v Speaker 1>shooting was execution style. The police captain didn't believe for

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<v Speaker 1>a second that this was a burglary, even though the

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<v Speaker 1>condo was ransacked. He said there was no sign of

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<v Speaker 1>a struggle. And burglars, though, don't usually fight. They don't

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<v Speaker 1>usually pack guns. They usually like are in and out,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, they steal whatever they need to steal, and

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<v Speaker 1>they leave.

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<v Speaker 2>Out no contact.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and if they do commit murder, it's usually because

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<v Speaker 1>they panicked. Yes, And the police captain noticed that it

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<v Speaker 1>just seems staged somehow, it just didn't seem right. So

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<v Speaker 1>let me tell you a little bit about Greg Gregory.

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<v Speaker 1>Greg Smart was born to his parents, William and Judith

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<v Speaker 1>on September fourth, nineteen sixty five, in Nassau, New Hampshire.

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<v Speaker 1>So that makes him a viurgo, Yes, that does. Greg

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<v Speaker 1>had two brothers growing up, and he went to Londonderry

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<v Speaker 1>High School and graduated in nineteen eighty three. He had

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<v Speaker 1>a pretty decent childhood and some would even say that

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<v Speaker 1>it was picturesque more idyllic. On family vacations, the Smart

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<v Speaker 1>family would go voting on Lake winnip Poseki, which is

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<v Speaker 1>a gorgeous lake in New Hampshire. When he was little,

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<v Speaker 1>Greg played Little League baseball and he even helped his

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<v Speaker 1>team win a championship in nineteen seventy seven. While growing

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<v Speaker 1>up in the eighties, Greg fell in love with heavy

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<v Speaker 1>metal music and he was really passionate about it, and

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<v Speaker 1>it was a passion that he would later share with

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<v Speaker 1>his future wife, Pamela Voyas. Pamela Voyas Smart was born

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<v Speaker 1>on August sixth, nineteen sixty seven, making her a Leo, Leo,

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<v Speaker 1>Leo and Virgo to her parents, John and Linda, and

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<v Speaker 1>she grew up in Coral Gables, Florida, with one brother

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<v Speaker 1>and a sister. Her mother, Linda, was a stay at

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<v Speaker 1>home mom and she ran a tight ship, doing everything

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<v Speaker 1>she could to build a happy home for her family.

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<v Speaker 1>Linda was the best of the best as far as

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<v Speaker 1>moms go, and she was always there for her kids

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<v Speaker 1>while her husband was working as a pilot. And even

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<v Speaker 1>though her father, John was home irregularly because he was

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<v Speaker 1>a pilot, Pamela had a very close bond with her dad.

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<v Speaker 1>So as far as childhoods go, Pamela had a really

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<v Speaker 1>good and loving childhood. She came from an all American family.

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<v Speaker 1>She was a happy child with lots of friends.

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<v Speaker 2>I think carl Gables is a really nice area. I

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<v Speaker 2>do too, Yeah, I think you're right.

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<v Speaker 1>Eventually, the Voyas family moved to New Hampshire and shortly thereafter,

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<v Speaker 1>Pam started college at Florida State University. She was extremely

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<v Speaker 1>intelligent and graduated college a year early despite working three

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<v Speaker 1>jobs while she went to school. And I have to

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<v Speaker 1>say she must have really been really smart, because I

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<v Speaker 1>was college full time. I didn't go in the spring

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<v Speaker 1>and summer semesters. But it took me five years.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>Job, Yeah, and worked three jobs. One of them was

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<v Speaker 1>a forty hour a week job. She was she was

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<v Speaker 1>hustle on. It was hustling and her family called her

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<v Speaker 1>an overachiever and I.

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<v Speaker 2>Completely blound like that.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, she received her degree in Communication arts and her

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<v Speaker 1>life school was to get into television journalism and be

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<v Speaker 1>the next Barbara Walters. While trying to work her way

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<v Speaker 1>up in the media, she worked as a college DJ

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<v Speaker 1>on the local Telehasse radio station WVFS, the voice on

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<v Speaker 1>eighty nine point seven FM. While at the station, she

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<v Speaker 1>hosted two different shows. One was specifically for rock music,

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<v Speaker 1>and she called herself the Maiden of Metal Oh. Her

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<v Speaker 1>radio show is called Metal Madness. Her favorite bands at

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<v Speaker 1>the time were Motley Crue and Van Halen. One day, though,

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<v Speaker 1>around Christmas nineteen eighty six. That's when she met Greg.

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<v Speaker 1>The two met while Pamela was home from college on

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<v Speaker 1>Christmas break, you know, in New Hampshire. She had a

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<v Speaker 1>boyfriend all throughout high school, but according to her, nobody

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<v Speaker 1>else mattered after she met Greg. She said, initially she

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<v Speaker 1>wasn't attracted to him, but getting to know him, that's

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<v Speaker 1>when she fell madly and passionately in love with him.

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<v Speaker 1>She loved how happy and fun he was. He was

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<v Speaker 1>always smiling, he was just so much fun to be around.

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<v Speaker 1>He also loved the same music as her.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>Shortly after getting to know him, she told her family

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<v Speaker 1>He's the one. Pamli's family loved him almost as much

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<v Speaker 1>as she did. He had a rocker look to him

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<v Speaker 1>and had like big eighties hair. He was everything that

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<v Speaker 1>she'd ever dreamed of for herself. He was about five

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<v Speaker 1>foot ten, He was athletic, build fit, and he had

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<v Speaker 1>these different hobbies such as hiking, fishing, and skiing that

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<v Speaker 1>kept him in shape. Pam was very petite and had

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<v Speaker 1>a vibrant personality, and when they met it was just sparks. Well.

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<v Speaker 1>Pam and Greg fall head over heels in love, and

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<v Speaker 1>Greg moved to Florida to be closer to Pam while

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<v Speaker 1>she was finishing her degree. The two of them tied

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<v Speaker 1>the knot in nineteen eighty nine and together they moved

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<v Speaker 1>to Dairy, New Hampshire after Pam graduated. They also got

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<v Speaker 1>a dog, a Shitsu, and his name was Halen, Like

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<v Speaker 1>I told you after Van Halen.

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<v Speaker 2>That's adorable.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, you know. Van Halen was the rock band that

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<v Speaker 1>brought them together at the beginning of the relationship, and

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<v Speaker 1>their two favorite songs were You Really Got Me and

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<v Speaker 1>Hot for Teacher. That know, I love that song Hot

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<v Speaker 1>for Teaching.

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<v Speaker 3>I had a huge crush on David Lee Roth in

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<v Speaker 3>nineteen years and I had the poster of him where

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<v Speaker 3>he was leaning over like a makeup tha like with

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<v Speaker 3>the lights to get ready. He's leaning over and assless

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<v Speaker 3>leather chaps, you can guys kind of catch from the lighting,

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<v Speaker 3>big old bottle of Jack Daniels. He just looks so

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<v Speaker 3>freaking delicious. My mother hated like that poster. She would

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<v Speaker 3>look at me disgusting. Yeah, you mean if you mean

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<v Speaker 3>hot when you say disgusting, Yes, he's very disgusting.

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<v Speaker 1>Funny, I know, and I can totally picture it with

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<v Speaker 1>that description right with that hair and yeah, oh gosh. However,

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<v Speaker 1>not even six months into their marriage, things began to

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<v Speaker 1>sour between the couple. According to Pamela, the downfall of

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<v Speaker 1>their marriage was due to the fact that Greg had

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<v Speaker 1>admitted to having a one night stand right at the

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<v Speaker 1>beginning of their marriage. Now, I don't know if that's true.

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<v Speaker 2>Mm hm oh right, because that's his first story.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, first story, right, So I don't know if it's true.

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<v Speaker 1>I really, I don't know. I don't know Greg, I

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<v Speaker 1>didn't know. I don't know if he had like a

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<v Speaker 1>guilty conscience about it. But Pamela also seemed kind of

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<v Speaker 1>bored and tired with Greg, especially now that his battle

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<v Speaker 1>head image faded. When he got a grown up job

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<v Speaker 1>in insurance, he cut his hair and wore suits to work.

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<v Speaker 1>She had compared him to looking like John bon Jovi,

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<v Speaker 1>but when he cut his hair, he looked so basic,

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<v Speaker 1>and that wasn't the man she was attracted to. She

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<v Speaker 1>wanted the rock star version of Greg. Pamela quickly wondered

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<v Speaker 1>where the man she married had gone. Like I said,

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<v Speaker 1>he got a job working for an insurance company. He

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<v Speaker 1>needs to support his wife, and he wants to start

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<v Speaker 1>a family. Somedays, so he's getting a real job. And

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<v Speaker 1>at the time, she was working for winn Ackoonant High

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<v Speaker 1>School located in Hampton, New Hampshire, as the media director.

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<v Speaker 1>Gregg had worked his way up the business ladder and

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<v Speaker 1>he became a very accomplished salesman for insurance. While she

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<v Speaker 1>was working for the high school, Pamela was able to

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<v Speaker 1>dabble in broadcasting and continue on her passion for music.

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<v Speaker 1>Her roles at the school included producing educational videos for

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<v Speaker 1>students and they were distributed districtwide. Pamela believed that this

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<v Speaker 1>role was a stepping stone toward her dream job as

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<v Speaker 1>a news anchor. She had her own secretary and student

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<v Speaker 1>intern to help her in any way she needed. Wow

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<v Speaker 1>Every student at the high school looked up to pam

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<v Speaker 1>She was one of the cool people on the staff

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<v Speaker 1>and she spoke to the students like she was like

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<v Speaker 1>a friend. She would always talk to the students about music,

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<v Speaker 1>and she told them about meeting Eddie van Halen and

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<v Speaker 1>getting backstage passes to one of the van Halen concerts.

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<v Speaker 1>From the outside, though, the marriage between Greg and Pamela

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<v Speaker 1>seemed to be peachy to everyone that knew them. Pamela

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<v Speaker 1>described her marriage with Greg as picture perfect. So I

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<v Speaker 1>don't know when she said that, but she so red flag.

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<v Speaker 2>That's the huge red picture perfect.

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<v Speaker 1>You're perfect, okay, unlikely? Yes, yeah, And by all accounts,

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<v Speaker 1>Greg was completely dedicated and truly devoted to his wife.

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<v Speaker 1>He was looking forward to starting a family with Pamela

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<v Speaker 1>and Haylen. But Pamela was a little different. She seemed

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<v Speaker 1>to care tad more for the dog more than Greg.

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<v Speaker 1>It would make the dog home cooked meals and instead

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<v Speaker 1>of Greg. I'm sure though you know Greg got home

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<v Speaker 1>cooked meals too, But.

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<v Speaker 3>That is a little prioritize wise, a little red flag there.

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<v Speaker 1>She's not feeding the dog dog food apparently right. Pamela

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<v Speaker 1>thought herself as a typical Leo who was always looking

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<v Speaker 1>out for her own best interests no matter what. She

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00:17:02.360 --> 00:17:04.599
<v Speaker 1>loved to be the center of attention and said about

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<v Speaker 1>herself quote, everywhere I go, I'm always attracting attention for

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<v Speaker 1>some reason or another. I'm loud, very outgoing and stuff.

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<v Speaker 1>And as you know, I'm a Leo. And she said,

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<v Speaker 1>Leo is a bad name.

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<v Speaker 2>At this moment, she is not portraying Leo's in a

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<v Speaker 2>very good light. No, not at all. No, I love

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<v Speaker 2>the attention either.

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<v Speaker 3>I will always be positive when I say, oh my gosh,

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<v Speaker 3>you're such an attention whore, Like if I said it

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<v Speaker 3>to you, that would be hilarious because I know how

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<v Speaker 3>much you love it, and I love that about you.

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<v Speaker 3>You know what I'm saying. I genuinely love it. I'm

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<v Speaker 3>just like, look at you go. You are in your

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<v Speaker 3>element and I love.

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<v Speaker 2>It just like print.

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<v Speaker 1>But I don't think like I do it on purpose exactly.

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<v Speaker 2>You don't come across like, oh this, but I can.

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<v Speaker 3>When you're in your element, I just sit back.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm your biggest cheerleader.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh thank you.

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<v Speaker 3>Other people can make it look ugly. You know what

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00:18:02.839 --> 00:18:05.079
<v Speaker 3>I'm saying, like, oh, look at me. Everywhere I go

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<v Speaker 3>I get attention.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, like I would never say that I might.

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<v Speaker 2>No, thank you.

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<v Speaker 3>Class, It's called class, girl, learn it.

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<v Speaker 1>While Pamela was working on various different projects at the school,

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<v Speaker 1>one of her more notable project was something called Project

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<v Speaker 1>Self Esteem. This was about drug awareness. Participation in the

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00:18:26.279 --> 00:18:29.720
<v Speaker 1>program was mandatory for all freshmen students, and she was

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00:18:29.759 --> 00:18:32.079
<v Speaker 1>able to get them on board pretty easily with how

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00:18:32.079 --> 00:18:35.440
<v Speaker 1>she talked to them like they were her friends. And

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00:18:35.680 --> 00:18:39.839
<v Speaker 1>pressed the program's participants. But one student in particular grew

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<v Speaker 1>completely infatuated with Pamela, and that was fifteen year old

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<v Speaker 1>Billy Flynn. So let me tell you a little bit

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00:18:47.519 --> 00:18:52.160
<v Speaker 1>about Billy. William Patrick Flynn was born on March twelfth,

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<v Speaker 1>nineteen seventy four, making him a Pisces to his parents

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<v Speaker 1>Billemy Lane. His parents' marriage was considered to be turbulent

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<v Speaker 1>and chaotic, and Billy seemed to always be put right

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<v Speaker 1>in the middle of his parents' constant arguing. He grew

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<v Speaker 1>up with two brothers, and Billy took the brunt of

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00:19:10.359 --> 00:19:13.960
<v Speaker 1>their father's anger. Billy, his mother later said, quote, if

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<v Speaker 1>things were going my husband's way, he was a great

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00:19:16.200 --> 00:19:18.200
<v Speaker 1>guy to be around, but as soon as he had

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00:19:18.200 --> 00:19:22.599
<v Speaker 1>to deal with any inconvenience, forget it end quote Willy Yeah.

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00:19:22.640 --> 00:19:25.359
<v Speaker 1>Eline finally chose to leave her husband after she found

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00:19:25.400 --> 00:19:27.319
<v Speaker 1>out that he had been having an affair and had

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00:19:27.319 --> 00:19:31.359
<v Speaker 1>been cheating on her for years. After his parents divorced,

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00:19:31.480 --> 00:19:33.440
<v Speaker 1>twelve year old Billy moved to New Hampshire with his

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00:19:33.519 --> 00:19:36.400
<v Speaker 1>siblings and mom. He never wanted to move, and he

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00:19:36.480 --> 00:19:39.640
<v Speaker 1>felt a lot of animosity toward his mother for making

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<v Speaker 1>him move. When he was about two weeks from his

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<v Speaker 1>thirteenth birthday, his father passed away in a tragic car accident.

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<v Speaker 1>A car had pulled out in front of him while

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<v Speaker 1>he was driving, and he had to swerve out of

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<v Speaker 1>the way to not hit the car. Unfortunately, he swerved

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<v Speaker 1>into a gasoline tinker that was carrying nine thousand gallons

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<v Speaker 1>of gas and there was a massive explosion and Billy's

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00:20:07.200 --> 00:20:11.599
<v Speaker 1>father was burned alive like ferociously. The only remains left

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<v Speaker 1>to help identify his charred body were his teeth. After

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00:20:15.359 --> 00:20:17.599
<v Speaker 1>Billy heard the news of the accident, he shut down

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<v Speaker 1>socially and spent the majority of his time by himself.

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<v Speaker 1>Billy's mother said that he was always acting out while

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<v Speaker 1>at home, but he was never violent. Any little inconvenience

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00:20:27.160 --> 00:20:30.720
<v Speaker 1>would send him into a spiral, and talking to him

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<v Speaker 1>in general was extremely difficult until he would finally calm down.

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<v Speaker 1>His mother said quote that was one side to Billy,

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<v Speaker 1>that he projected to people that he wanted to impress.

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00:20:41.400 --> 00:20:45.000
<v Speaker 1>He wanted to be liked, because she said he was

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00:20:45.240 --> 00:20:48.759
<v Speaker 1>charming and very mannerly. Inside the family is where he

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00:20:48.759 --> 00:20:51.319
<v Speaker 1>took out his anger like a volcano, waiting to erupt

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<v Speaker 1>end quote. Billy became smitten with Pamela almost immediately. His

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00:20:55.960 --> 00:20:59.759
<v Speaker 1>infatuation got pretty serious as he became Pamela's number one

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<v Speaker 1>help on Project Self Esteem. He also visited her office

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00:21:03.960 --> 00:21:06.119
<v Speaker 1>every single day. The first time you saw her was

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<v Speaker 1>at a meeting for the project's discussion leaders, and after

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<v Speaker 1>Pamela was introduced to speak at the meeting, Billy turned

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00:21:12.000 --> 00:21:14.880
<v Speaker 1>to his friend and said, I'm in love. It was

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<v Speaker 1>the fall of nineteen eighty nine, which happened to be

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<v Speaker 1>around the time when Greg made his supposed confession of

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<v Speaker 1>adultery to Pamela, and Pamela said that around this time,

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<v Speaker 1>Greg also encouraged her to hang out with her friends

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<v Speaker 1>that she had made while working at the school, which

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00:21:31.680 --> 00:21:34.480
<v Speaker 1>I really find weird because she's hanging out with a

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<v Speaker 1>bunch of teenagers.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, my friends are students. So when you tell me

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<v Speaker 3>to go hang out with my friends, yeah, I he

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<v Speaker 3>meant colleagues, Yeah right, and she was like fifteen year olds.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, fifteen year old's great. When the work for Project

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<v Speaker 1>Self Esteem was done, Pamela and Billy kept working together

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<v Speaker 1>on a video for an Orange Juice video competition. Like

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00:21:56.559 --> 00:21:58.079
<v Speaker 1>I think it was like a commercial like you had

383
00:21:58.079 --> 00:22:01.759
<v Speaker 1>to submit a commercial about it. Billy was a shy

384
00:22:01.880 --> 00:22:04.839
<v Speaker 1>kid with big eyes and shoulder length hair, so picture

385
00:22:04.920 --> 00:22:07.720
<v Speaker 1>the hairstyle that Greg literally had just chopped off a

386
00:22:08.359 --> 00:22:12.000
<v Speaker 1>job to look more professional. Billy wore a leather jacket

387
00:22:12.119 --> 00:22:15.680
<v Speaker 1>and an earring. He played guitar and people always compared

388
00:22:15.759 --> 00:22:18.799
<v Speaker 1>him to a young Paul McCartney. He had a passion

389
00:22:18.839 --> 00:22:22.000
<v Speaker 1>for music in his favorite band was Motley Crue. Billy

390
00:22:22.039 --> 00:22:25.839
<v Speaker 1>had two close friends, Patrick who they called Pete Randall

391
00:22:26.000 --> 00:22:30.960
<v Speaker 1>in Vance Jr. Vladimir Junior. They were often referred to

392
00:22:31.000 --> 00:22:33.519
<v Speaker 1>as the Three Musketeers, and they did a lot for

393
00:22:33.559 --> 00:22:37.480
<v Speaker 1>the community of South Seabrook and Seabrook is considered blue collar,

394
00:22:38.279 --> 00:22:40.720
<v Speaker 1>but they would do things like shoveling snow for their neighbors,

395
00:22:40.799 --> 00:22:44.400
<v Speaker 1>running errands, doing odd jobs for those who needed them.

396
00:22:44.759 --> 00:22:47.680
<v Speaker 1>They even gave free services to the elderly, and people

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00:22:47.759 --> 00:22:51.440
<v Speaker 1>in that area called them, like I said, the three Musketeers.

398
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<v Speaker 1>The three of them met when they began middle school,

399
00:22:55.160 --> 00:22:58.240
<v Speaker 1>and they were inseparable. Jr. Was two years older than

400
00:22:58.279 --> 00:23:00.960
<v Speaker 1>Billy and one year older than Pete. He had dark,

401
00:23:00.960 --> 00:23:03.640
<v Speaker 1>curly hair and wore very thick glasses. Which made him

402
00:23:03.680 --> 00:23:07.440
<v Speaker 1>look intellectual. His life goal was to join the military

403
00:23:07.519 --> 00:23:10.839
<v Speaker 1>and become a marine. Whenever he had any free time,

404
00:23:10.920 --> 00:23:14.920
<v Speaker 1>he visited his grandma, who lived in Haverhill, Massachusetts, and

405
00:23:14.920 --> 00:23:17.839
<v Speaker 1>he always helped with holiday dinners with his local church

406
00:23:17.920 --> 00:23:20.559
<v Speaker 1>to help those who were in need of a hot meal. Pete,

407
00:23:20.599 --> 00:23:22.160
<v Speaker 1>on the other hand, was a bit of a handful

408
00:23:22.720 --> 00:23:26.559
<v Speaker 1>and his life dream was to become a professional hit man. Yeah,

409
00:23:26.799 --> 00:23:29.640
<v Speaker 1>but his mom described him as being a loving kid.

410
00:23:30.359 --> 00:23:34.039
<v Speaker 1>Pamela was obviously not supposed to fraternize with the students

411
00:23:34.039 --> 00:23:38.079
<v Speaker 1>like she did, but she began to quickly overstep her bounds.

412
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<v Speaker 1>Even with her student in turn, named Cecilia, they became

413
00:23:41.640 --> 00:23:45.200
<v Speaker 1>the equivalent of best friends, and Cecilia knew everything about

414
00:23:45.200 --> 00:23:49.079
<v Speaker 1>Pamela's personal life. The same and worse was set about

415
00:23:49.079 --> 00:23:52.319
<v Speaker 1>her relationship with Billy. The three of them even used

416
00:23:52.319 --> 00:23:55.039
<v Speaker 1>to hang out together. When she was beginning to learn

417
00:23:55.079 --> 00:23:58.160
<v Speaker 1>how to drive, Pamela would take Celia out in her

418
00:23:58.200 --> 00:24:01.720
<v Speaker 1>Honda CRX. We would also let other teenagers drive her

419
00:24:01.720 --> 00:24:04.359
<v Speaker 1>car to which you know that made her super cool.

420
00:24:04.799 --> 00:24:07.920
<v Speaker 2>I can imagine that is some cool shit right there.

421
00:24:09.880 --> 00:24:13.880
<v Speaker 1>The friendship between Cecilia and Pamela began affecting the teenager's

422
00:24:13.920 --> 00:24:17.400
<v Speaker 1>life negatively. Though her school work, her other friendships, and

423
00:24:17.480 --> 00:24:21.720
<v Speaker 1>home life were affected, but Cecilia didn't care. She idolized Pamela.

424
00:24:22.359 --> 00:24:26.400
<v Speaker 1>Cecilia's mother said, quote, as this relationship went on and on,

425
00:24:26.640 --> 00:24:29.480
<v Speaker 1>I liked it less and less. I was actually getting

426
00:24:29.559 --> 00:24:34.920
<v Speaker 1>really angry end quote. Right after Cecilia met Pamela, her

427
00:24:34.960 --> 00:24:37.960
<v Speaker 1>grades began to get worse, and her mother even had

428
00:24:38.000 --> 00:24:40.599
<v Speaker 1>to speak with the administration because of how much time

429
00:24:40.680 --> 00:24:44.359
<v Speaker 1>Cecilia spent at the high school's media center, where Pamela's

430
00:24:44.359 --> 00:24:48.440
<v Speaker 1>office was. The assistant principal agreed with Cecilia's mom, but

431
00:24:48.480 --> 00:24:52.119
<v Speaker 1>nothing ever came of the conversation. Pamela was so excited

432
00:24:52.200 --> 00:24:54.119
<v Speaker 1>to be able to hang out with her students outside

433
00:24:54.119 --> 00:24:56.960
<v Speaker 1>of school, and since most of them were from Southbrooks,

434
00:24:57.000 --> 00:24:59.000
<v Speaker 1>she would invite the kids over to her condo to

435
00:24:59.039 --> 00:25:02.119
<v Speaker 1>work on school project. Greg was spending more and more

436
00:25:02.119 --> 00:25:05.599
<v Speaker 1>time with his own friends and Pamela with hers, and

437
00:25:05.640 --> 00:25:10.480
<v Speaker 1>this is when she also developed an infatuation with Billy Gross.

438
00:25:10.839 --> 00:25:15.400
<v Speaker 1>He's fifteen oh boy. One day, when Billy was in

439
00:25:15.480 --> 00:25:18.240
<v Speaker 1>Pamela's office, she asked him flat out, do you ever

440
00:25:18.319 --> 00:25:21.480
<v Speaker 1>think about me when I'm not around. Billy responded back

441
00:25:21.519 --> 00:25:25.200
<v Speaker 1>by simply saying sure. Pamela said, well, I think about

442
00:25:25.240 --> 00:25:28.359
<v Speaker 1>you all the time. After Billy heard that there was

443
00:25:28.400 --> 00:25:32.599
<v Speaker 1>no stopping his romantic obsession with her, Pamela told him

444
00:25:32.599 --> 00:25:35.920
<v Speaker 1>that she didn't understand her feelings for him, and she

445
00:25:35.960 --> 00:25:37.799
<v Speaker 1>said she didn't know what to do with all of

446
00:25:37.839 --> 00:25:40.200
<v Speaker 1>these feelings for him since she was a married woman.

447
00:25:40.880 --> 00:25:43.440
<v Speaker 1>She couldn't shake this kid from her brain. And not

448
00:25:43.599 --> 00:25:46.480
<v Speaker 1>even a month later, she found herself in his bedroom

449
00:25:46.599 --> 00:25:50.039
<v Speaker 1>kissing him while the two lay on his bed. The

450
00:25:50.079 --> 00:25:53.759
<v Speaker 1>whole time they were making out, Motley Cruz's Starry Eyes

451
00:25:54.279 --> 00:25:55.200
<v Speaker 1>was playing over and.

452
00:25:55.279 --> 00:26:02.480
<v Speaker 3>Oh my gosh, this is a romance on Bizarre World.

453
00:26:04.759 --> 00:26:06.200
<v Speaker 1>Fueled by Motley Crue.

454
00:26:06.359 --> 00:26:06.720
<v Speaker 2>Yes.

455
00:26:07.200 --> 00:26:10.680
<v Speaker 1>Sometime in late March of nineteen ninety, Pamela invited Billy

456
00:26:10.759 --> 00:26:13.160
<v Speaker 1>and Cecilia over to Ricondo to have a little bit

457
00:26:13.160 --> 00:26:15.039
<v Speaker 1>of fun while her husband was out of town on

458
00:26:15.119 --> 00:26:18.839
<v Speaker 1>business for his insurance company. Rather than watch a movie

459
00:26:18.880 --> 00:26:22.000
<v Speaker 1>that was age appropriate, Pamela decides that she's going to

460
00:26:22.079 --> 00:26:25.319
<v Speaker 1>put on that movie nine and a half Weeks, starring

461
00:26:25.359 --> 00:26:29.359
<v Speaker 1>Mickey Rourke and Kim Bassenger. Yes, have you ever seen that? I?

462
00:26:29.559 --> 00:26:32.559
<v Speaker 2>Was too young and was forbidden you see it.

463
00:26:32.599 --> 00:26:34.839
<v Speaker 3>And then by the time the window was closed, I

464
00:26:34.880 --> 00:26:37.599
<v Speaker 3>was like, no, baby, did you see it?

465
00:26:37.599 --> 00:26:38.519
<v Speaker 2>Did you? Oh?

466
00:26:38.680 --> 00:26:43.039
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah I saw it and it was very steamy.

467
00:26:43.519 --> 00:26:50.079
<v Speaker 2>I remember he at that time, right, he was.

468
00:26:50.039 --> 00:26:53.920
<v Speaker 1>Super sexy and Kim Bassenger was beautiful. Yeah, yeah, I

469
00:26:54.039 --> 00:26:55.720
<v Speaker 1>just remember there was one scene where they were in

470
00:26:55.720 --> 00:26:59.359
<v Speaker 1>front of the refrigerator, like just basically making out and

471
00:27:00.039 --> 00:27:02.000
<v Speaker 1>feeding each other like whip creamy.

472
00:27:02.279 --> 00:27:05.839
<v Speaker 2>Yes, I do remember that little hot scene.

473
00:27:06.160 --> 00:27:11.279
<v Speaker 1>So you know, she puts on this movie for the teenagers.

474
00:27:10.279 --> 00:27:13.319
<v Speaker 2>And he's so impressionable. My god, he's fifteen right.

475
00:27:14.240 --> 00:27:17.640
<v Speaker 1>Shortly after the movie ended, Cecilia went outside to walk

476
00:27:17.680 --> 00:27:21.599
<v Speaker 1>Halen the dog, and when Pamela and Billy were alone,

477
00:27:21.920 --> 00:27:24.119
<v Speaker 1>she asked him to come upstairs to her bedroom that

478
00:27:24.200 --> 00:27:27.000
<v Speaker 1>she shared with Greg. Once the two of them were upstairs,

479
00:27:27.799 --> 00:27:31.400
<v Speaker 1>Pamela put on a turquoise colored lingerie piece that she

480
00:27:31.440 --> 00:27:34.279
<v Speaker 1>had bought specifically to wear to seduce Billy. For the

481
00:27:34.319 --> 00:27:37.039
<v Speaker 1>first time, the two had sex, and while they were

482
00:27:37.039 --> 00:27:41.400
<v Speaker 1>having sex, Pamela blasted her stereo speakers with Van Halen

483
00:27:41.559 --> 00:27:42.960
<v Speaker 1>and Sammy Hagar songs.

484
00:27:43.400 --> 00:27:43.799
<v Speaker 3>Wow.

485
00:27:44.279 --> 00:27:47.240
<v Speaker 1>After this, the two of them met frequently over the

486
00:27:47.240 --> 00:27:51.119
<v Speaker 1>next couple of weeks for secks. It was sometime over

487
00:27:51.240 --> 00:27:54.200
<v Speaker 1>these sex filled weeks that Pamela said to Billy, you

488
00:27:54.359 --> 00:27:57.559
<v Speaker 1>have to get rid of Greg, otherwise we can't keep

489
00:27:57.599 --> 00:28:00.920
<v Speaker 1>on seeing each other. Billy asked Pamela she couldn't just

490
00:28:00.960 --> 00:28:03.960
<v Speaker 1>get a divorce, and Pamela told him that Greg was

491
00:28:04.000 --> 00:28:07.359
<v Speaker 1>basically obsessed with her and she was convinced that he

492
00:28:07.359 --> 00:28:10.720
<v Speaker 1>would never allow her to have another relationship with someone.

493
00:28:11.480 --> 00:28:14.400
<v Speaker 1>She added that she would also lose the condo, that's

494
00:28:14.440 --> 00:28:18.920
<v Speaker 1>the real reason, I think, beautiful furniture, and their little dog, Halen.

495
00:28:19.359 --> 00:28:22.160
<v Speaker 1>She couldn't bear the thought of losing everything, especially Halen.

496
00:28:22.559 --> 00:28:25.000
<v Speaker 1>And she told Billy that Greg physically beat her on

497
00:28:25.039 --> 00:28:27.319
<v Speaker 1>a regular basis, so the only way to get rid

498
00:28:27.359 --> 00:28:30.079
<v Speaker 1>of him was for Billy to kill him. And just

499
00:28:30.200 --> 00:28:35.200
<v Speaker 1>to defend Greg, that's never been proven that Yeah physically

500
00:28:35.279 --> 00:28:39.319
<v Speaker 1>abused her. Pamela knew Billy would have done anything to

501
00:28:39.400 --> 00:28:42.039
<v Speaker 1>be with her, and he agreed to kill Greg for her.

502
00:28:42.599 --> 00:28:45.400
<v Speaker 1>Later at trial, when he was on the stand, Billy

503
00:28:45.440 --> 00:28:48.519
<v Speaker 1>testified that he tried to kill Greg two times before

504
00:28:48.799 --> 00:28:51.759
<v Speaker 1>he actually went through with the murder. When he aboorded

505
00:28:51.799 --> 00:28:54.480
<v Speaker 1>the mission twice Pamela threatened to break up with him

506
00:28:54.640 --> 00:28:57.920
<v Speaker 1>and scolded him. According to Billy, she screamed at him,

507
00:28:57.960 --> 00:29:01.319
<v Speaker 1>if you love me, you'd do this. Yeah, that was

508
00:29:01.359 --> 00:29:04.319
<v Speaker 1>when things took a serious turn. He began talking to

509
00:29:04.359 --> 00:29:07.920
<v Speaker 1>his friends Pete and Jr. About his plan to kill Greg.

510
00:29:08.400 --> 00:29:11.519
<v Speaker 1>Pamela let Billy know that the day of May first

511
00:29:11.559 --> 00:29:13.599
<v Speaker 1>would be a perfect day to go through with their

512
00:29:13.640 --> 00:29:16.920
<v Speaker 1>plan to murder Greg. Greg had appointments later in the

513
00:29:16.960 --> 00:29:19.880
<v Speaker 1>evening and Pamela would have an airtight alibi with a

514
00:29:19.880 --> 00:29:23.519
<v Speaker 1>school meeting to discuss salary review. She even told Billy

515
00:29:23.559 --> 00:29:26.759
<v Speaker 1>that she would pay him money from Greg's life insurance payout.

516
00:29:27.240 --> 00:29:29.839
<v Speaker 1>Pamela and Greg were basically roommates at this point in

517
00:29:29.880 --> 00:29:32.480
<v Speaker 1>their marriage, and people began to notice the strain and

518
00:29:32.559 --> 00:29:36.640
<v Speaker 1>their relationship. Cecilia even testified at trial that she overheard

519
00:29:36.680 --> 00:29:39.119
<v Speaker 1>a conversation while Pamela was on the phone with Greg

520
00:29:39.160 --> 00:29:42.119
<v Speaker 1>and said, quote, she was saying something about getting a divorce,

521
00:29:42.319 --> 00:29:44.920
<v Speaker 1>and then they started fighting over who was going to

522
00:29:45.000 --> 00:29:47.880
<v Speaker 1>take the dog in furniture and everything, and then she

523
00:29:47.920 --> 00:29:50.960
<v Speaker 1>said fine, take the dog and hung up end quote.

524
00:29:51.000 --> 00:29:54.079
<v Speaker 1>In the month before the murder, Greg was consistently coming

525
00:29:54.079 --> 00:29:56.240
<v Speaker 1>home to an empty house, and he was eating every

526
00:29:56.279 --> 00:30:00.000
<v Speaker 1>meal alone crazily. Billy was in the house one night

527
00:30:00.119 --> 00:30:03.599
<v Speaker 1>to kill him, and Greg suddenly experienced an overwhelming feeling

528
00:30:03.640 --> 00:30:06.240
<v Speaker 1>of danger as he walked into the condo, like his

529
00:30:06.920 --> 00:30:07.960
<v Speaker 1>sixth sense went.

530
00:30:07.799 --> 00:30:10.200
<v Speaker 2>Off, you know, his spidy senses. Yes.

531
00:30:10.680 --> 00:30:12.519
<v Speaker 1>Greg told a friend that as soon as he felt this,

532
00:30:12.640 --> 00:30:15.119
<v Speaker 1>he turned right back around and left the condo. Greg

533
00:30:15.200 --> 00:30:17.920
<v Speaker 1>said that this feeling was unexplainable, but he just knew

534
00:30:17.960 --> 00:30:20.559
<v Speaker 1>that he was in immediate danger and needed to leave

535
00:30:20.599 --> 00:30:23.039
<v Speaker 1>the house as soon as possible. In the days leading

536
00:30:23.119 --> 00:30:26.799
<v Speaker 1>up to Greg's execution style murder, Billy was talking with Jr.

537
00:30:26.839 --> 00:30:29.839
<v Speaker 1>And Pete regularly walking through the plan, which was that

538
00:30:30.039 --> 00:30:32.480
<v Speaker 1>all three of them are going to wear their darkest

539
00:30:32.519 --> 00:30:34.680
<v Speaker 1>clothing they could find, and that they were going to

540
00:30:34.759 --> 00:30:37.680
<v Speaker 1>park it a nearby shopping mall. Pamela was going to

541
00:30:37.759 --> 00:30:39.920
<v Speaker 1>leave the cellar door open along with the back door.

542
00:30:40.200 --> 00:30:42.519
<v Speaker 1>Billy was going to enter the condo through one, and

543
00:30:42.559 --> 00:30:45.519
<v Speaker 1>Pete was going to enter the condo through another. They

544
00:30:45.599 --> 00:30:47.559
<v Speaker 1>needed to stage the house to make it look like

545
00:30:47.759 --> 00:30:51.480
<v Speaker 1>a burglary, and Pamela told them to take anything they wanted,

546
00:30:51.640 --> 00:30:56.039
<v Speaker 1>such as any electronics that they could carry an expensive jewelry. Jr.

547
00:30:56.160 --> 00:30:59.200
<v Speaker 1>Was going to wait at the plaza at the mall

548
00:30:59.279 --> 00:31:03.720
<v Speaker 1>for them to return. Billy had three specific rules for me. First, one,

549
00:31:03.880 --> 00:31:05.839
<v Speaker 1>they could not turn on any of the house lights.

550
00:31:06.400 --> 00:31:08.680
<v Speaker 1>Pam said, Greg is a real whimp. If he sees

551
00:31:08.720 --> 00:31:12.079
<v Speaker 1>the lights on, he won't come inside. Two, nobody could

552
00:31:12.160 --> 00:31:14.400
<v Speaker 1>hurt the dog, and they were to place Halen in

553
00:31:14.440 --> 00:31:16.680
<v Speaker 1>the basement so he didn't have to see Greg get

554
00:31:16.720 --> 00:31:21.359
<v Speaker 1>brutally murdered. Billy said, Pamela didn't want Halen to be traumatized.

555
00:31:21.839 --> 00:31:24.920
<v Speaker 1>And three, Billy wasn't to use a knife, only a gun.

556
00:31:25.240 --> 00:31:26.880
<v Speaker 1>A knife would leave way too much of a mess,

557
00:31:26.880 --> 00:31:29.279
<v Speaker 1>and Pamela didn't want any of her husband's blood to

558
00:31:29.319 --> 00:31:31.440
<v Speaker 1>get on their beautiful white leather couch.

559
00:31:32.079 --> 00:31:36.319
<v Speaker 3>She has some long game thinking, she's writes, apful the dog.

560
00:31:36.720 --> 00:31:40.839
<v Speaker 2>I don't want the big mess. Mmmm yeah, Oh my gosh,

561
00:31:40.880 --> 00:31:42.960
<v Speaker 2>this monster of a woman I know.

562
00:31:43.559 --> 00:31:45.759
<v Speaker 1>On the morning of the murder, Pama left the house

563
00:31:45.839 --> 00:31:49.759
<v Speaker 1>in her silver Honda CRX that had a vanity license

564
00:31:49.759 --> 00:31:53.240
<v Speaker 1>plate that read Halen. Her plan was to be home

565
00:31:53.279 --> 00:31:56.319
<v Speaker 1>well after Greg's murder. Later in that day, she met

566
00:31:56.319 --> 00:31:59.079
<v Speaker 1>Billy at his locker to tell him the doors were unlocked.

567
00:31:59.759 --> 00:32:01.519
<v Speaker 1>All of the jewelry that she didn't want the boys

568
00:32:01.559 --> 00:32:04.359
<v Speaker 1>to take was warn to school that morning. Around two

569
00:32:04.480 --> 00:32:06.599
<v Speaker 1>thirty in the afternoon, Billy called her to let her

570
00:32:06.640 --> 00:32:09.039
<v Speaker 1>know that there had been a small problem. They needed

571
00:32:09.079 --> 00:32:12.559
<v Speaker 1>a ride to pick up their getaway car, Jr's Grandma's

572
00:32:12.680 --> 00:32:16.720
<v Speaker 1>nineteen seventy eight bright yellow Chevy Impala, which was going

573
00:32:16.759 --> 00:32:17.880
<v Speaker 1>to be their getaway car.

574
00:32:18.519 --> 00:32:20.039
<v Speaker 2>Awesome, so Pamela.

575
00:32:19.799 --> 00:32:22.000
<v Speaker 1>Agreed that she was going to drive them over to jr.

576
00:32:22.240 --> 00:32:25.559
<v Speaker 1>Grandma's house. Around eight thirty pm on the night of

577
00:32:25.599 --> 00:32:28.440
<v Speaker 1>the murder, Billy and Pete entered the house as Jr.

578
00:32:28.519 --> 00:32:31.559
<v Speaker 1>Stayed at the shopping plaza. Next, the boys tried to

579
00:32:31.640 --> 00:32:34.359
<v Speaker 1>move Halen. As soon as Billy went to scoop his

580
00:32:34.400 --> 00:32:37.519
<v Speaker 1>little ass up, he began growling and barking while he

581
00:32:37.640 --> 00:32:40.799
<v Speaker 1>ran away. Billy chased the dog around the house and

582
00:32:40.839 --> 00:32:44.759
<v Speaker 1>finally caught him. Then he literally threw Halen down into

583
00:32:44.799 --> 00:32:47.640
<v Speaker 1>the basement, and the two boys laughed later on about

584
00:32:47.680 --> 00:32:51.160
<v Speaker 1>hearing the dog slump as he tumbled down the stairs.

585
00:32:51.519 --> 00:32:54.440
<v Speaker 1>The two boys then went on to completely ransack the house,

586
00:32:54.480 --> 00:32:58.119
<v Speaker 1>scooping up jewelry along with CDs and taking apart pieces

587
00:32:58.119 --> 00:33:01.000
<v Speaker 1>of the entertainment center. Everything's tall enough was placed into

588
00:33:01.000 --> 00:33:04.200
<v Speaker 1>a black pillowcase. After the place was torn apart, they

589
00:33:04.240 --> 00:33:07.440
<v Speaker 1>waited in darkness for Greg. When Greg arrived home and

590
00:33:07.480 --> 00:33:09.680
<v Speaker 1>walked in the front door, he called out, hey, len

591
00:33:10.079 --> 00:33:13.160
<v Speaker 1>on cube. Billy jumped out from behind the door and

592
00:33:13.240 --> 00:33:17.160
<v Speaker 1>grabbed Greg's the shoulder of Greg's sport coat, and just

593
00:33:17.200 --> 00:33:19.839
<v Speaker 1>like that, Greg was overpowered. One of the kids told

594
00:33:19.920 --> 00:33:22.759
<v Speaker 1>Greg to give them his wallet, which he did, and

595
00:33:22.799 --> 00:33:25.680
<v Speaker 1>Pete told Greg to give him the diamond encrusted wedding band,

596
00:33:25.759 --> 00:33:27.880
<v Speaker 1>which said no, I can't do that. My wife would

597
00:33:27.920 --> 00:33:31.480
<v Speaker 1>kill me. Right before Billy pulled the trigger to kill Greg,

598
00:33:31.759 --> 00:33:35.319
<v Speaker 1>Billy uttered the words God, forgive me. Billy and Pete

599
00:33:35.440 --> 00:33:37.359
<v Speaker 1>then ran out of the condo as fast as they

600
00:33:37.440 --> 00:33:40.279
<v Speaker 1>could to get to the getaway car. Well Pamela was

601
00:33:40.279 --> 00:33:42.160
<v Speaker 1>on her way home. She told Billy later that she

602
00:33:42.160 --> 00:33:45.079
<v Speaker 1>had actually seen their getaway car while passing them on

603
00:33:45.119 --> 00:33:47.160
<v Speaker 1>the road, and she flicked her lights on and off

604
00:33:47.200 --> 00:33:51.960
<v Speaker 1>to say, Hi, oh my gosh, this woman huh so

605
00:33:52.240 --> 00:33:53.039
<v Speaker 1>fucking delusion?

606
00:33:53.119 --> 00:33:55.880
<v Speaker 2>Oh man, just cold yes.

607
00:33:56.599 --> 00:33:59.440
<v Speaker 1>During the next few weeks of the police investigation, Pamela

608
00:33:59.519 --> 00:34:01.599
<v Speaker 1>was telling the police that her husband was probably killed

609
00:34:01.640 --> 00:34:04.680
<v Speaker 1>by quote some jerk, some drug addict person looking for

610
00:34:04.720 --> 00:34:08.000
<v Speaker 1>a quick ten bucks end quote. The town of Dary

611
00:34:08.119 --> 00:34:11.079
<v Speaker 1>hadn't had a murder in quite some time, in actually

612
00:34:11.119 --> 00:34:13.679
<v Speaker 1>nineteen ninety. This was the only murder that happened in

613
00:34:13.679 --> 00:34:17.519
<v Speaker 1>the town, so everyone was thinking, you know, it's gang

614
00:34:17.559 --> 00:34:22.400
<v Speaker 1>related or some outlanders story. Yeah, right, But the police

615
00:34:22.400 --> 00:34:25.039
<v Speaker 1>had a haunch that somehow Pamela was behind her husband's

616
00:34:25.079 --> 00:34:28.840
<v Speaker 1>death due to her detachment over the whole thing. They

617
00:34:28.880 --> 00:34:31.719
<v Speaker 1>got their break two weeks later when the police received

618
00:34:31.719 --> 00:34:35.559
<v Speaker 1>an anonymous tip about Greg's murder. On May fourteenth, the

619
00:34:35.599 --> 00:34:38.360
<v Speaker 1>police received a call from an unknowned woman who told

620
00:34:38.400 --> 00:34:41.159
<v Speaker 1>the lead detective that Pamela had been involved in the murder.

621
00:34:41.760 --> 00:34:45.360
<v Speaker 1>The caller was a friend of Cecilia's, and Cecilia had

622
00:34:45.400 --> 00:34:48.719
<v Speaker 1>confided in her with this bit of important information.

623
00:34:49.639 --> 00:34:51.039
<v Speaker 2>Right Oddly.

624
00:34:51.480 --> 00:34:54.360
<v Speaker 1>There were also rumors around Dary that the murder was

625
00:34:54.400 --> 00:34:56.880
<v Speaker 1>committed with a gun that belonged to j R's father,

626
00:34:57.320 --> 00:35:01.559
<v Speaker 1>which was true, Oh yeah. After his father looked at

627
00:35:01.599 --> 00:35:04.599
<v Speaker 1>the gun and noticed that it had been cleaned, he

628
00:35:04.639 --> 00:35:06.960
<v Speaker 1>gave it to the police and it was placed into evidence.

629
00:35:07.440 --> 00:35:09.800
<v Speaker 1>Not long after, the gun was turned over. All three

630
00:35:09.840 --> 00:35:13.119
<v Speaker 1>boys were arrested for the murder of Greg Smart. The

631
00:35:13.159 --> 00:35:16.360
<v Speaker 1>police later arrested a fourth guy, a nineteen year old

632
00:35:16.400 --> 00:35:20.239
<v Speaker 1>named Raymond Fowler. After the boys were arrested, they all

633
00:35:20.320 --> 00:35:23.320
<v Speaker 1>sung like a bunch of canaries and told police investigators

634
00:35:23.599 --> 00:35:27.280
<v Speaker 1>that Pamela had seduced and manipulated Billy into killing her

635
00:35:27.320 --> 00:35:29.960
<v Speaker 1>husband so that the two of them could be together.

636
00:35:30.480 --> 00:35:34.360
<v Speaker 1>On August first, nineteen ninety, Pamela was arrested at the

637
00:35:34.400 --> 00:35:36.639
<v Speaker 1>high school that she worked at in the parking lot.

638
00:35:37.039 --> 00:35:39.880
<v Speaker 1>And this next part is just kind of hilarious. The

639
00:35:39.960 --> 00:35:44.079
<v Speaker 1>detective told Pamela upon seeing her in the parking lot. Quote, well, Pam,

640
00:35:44.159 --> 00:35:46.519
<v Speaker 1>I have some good news and I have some bad news.

641
00:35:46.840 --> 00:35:48.760
<v Speaker 1>The good news is that we've solved the murder of

642
00:35:48.800 --> 00:35:51.679
<v Speaker 1>your husband. The bad news is you're under arrest.

643
00:35:52.280 --> 00:35:54.880
<v Speaker 3>And that is so I wonder if he practiced that,

644
00:35:55.159 --> 00:35:57.719
<v Speaker 3>you know, the night before, Like, how do I present

645
00:35:57.800 --> 00:35:58.320
<v Speaker 3>this tour?

646
00:35:58.440 --> 00:35:58.679
<v Speaker 1>Yeah?

647
00:35:59.400 --> 00:36:04.320
<v Speaker 3>Yeahoo, he's my cleverness. I know.

648
00:36:04.440 --> 00:36:07.199
<v Speaker 1>I think that's great. Hey, we solved it.

649
00:36:07.440 --> 00:36:09.320
<v Speaker 2>You're it tag?

650
00:36:09.760 --> 00:36:14.360
<v Speaker 1>Yeahar it. Pamela plaied not guilty, and her trial was

651
00:36:14.400 --> 00:36:18.800
<v Speaker 1>the first ever fully televised murder trial in the US.

652
00:36:19.239 --> 00:36:22.239
<v Speaker 1>Wow and I think that's how we all know it. Yes,

653
00:36:22.760 --> 00:36:24.800
<v Speaker 1>it has to be. And you know the fact that

654
00:36:24.880 --> 00:36:27.679
<v Speaker 1>she's a teacher at a high school fucking one of

655
00:36:27.719 --> 00:36:31.719
<v Speaker 1>her students, So I mean, which that was quite salacious.

656
00:36:31.360 --> 00:36:33.320
<v Speaker 2>For sure, great word too.

657
00:36:33.519 --> 00:36:36.599
<v Speaker 1>Yes, it's part of my lexicon.

658
00:36:37.880 --> 00:36:40.199
<v Speaker 2>I just put it down on mine as well. I

659
00:36:40.320 --> 00:36:41.440
<v Speaker 2>do like salacious.

660
00:36:42.119 --> 00:36:45.199
<v Speaker 1>The entire country was glued to their televisions as they

661
00:36:45.199 --> 00:36:48.239
<v Speaker 1>watched Billy take the stand to tell his side of everything.

662
00:36:49.079 --> 00:36:51.239
<v Speaker 1>And I do remember seeing the video like of him

663
00:36:51.239 --> 00:36:52.760
<v Speaker 1>crying on the snadh.

664
00:36:52.800 --> 00:36:53.159
<v Speaker 3>I got.

665
00:36:53.599 --> 00:36:56.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. The prosecution had zero issues talking about how unhappy

666
00:36:56.920 --> 00:36:59.119
<v Speaker 1>Pamela was in the marriage and how she was looking

667
00:36:59.159 --> 00:37:01.960
<v Speaker 1>forward to Greg's life insurance payout of one hundred and

668
00:37:02.000 --> 00:37:06.360
<v Speaker 1>forty thousand dollars, which is equivalent to roughly three hundred

669
00:37:06.400 --> 00:37:09.280
<v Speaker 1>and thirty eight one hundred and twenty five dollars today.

670
00:37:09.639 --> 00:37:10.400
<v Speaker 2>WHOA.

671
00:37:10.719 --> 00:37:14.400
<v Speaker 1>Cecilia agreed to wear a wire after the murder took place,

672
00:37:14.599 --> 00:37:18.039
<v Speaker 1>and the recordings of her conversations with Pamela were played

673
00:37:18.159 --> 00:37:21.679
<v Speaker 1>during the trial. In the tapes, Pamela acknowledged her role

674
00:37:21.760 --> 00:37:25.079
<v Speaker 1>in the murder, and she told Cecilia, quote, you'd be

675
00:37:25.079 --> 00:37:27.800
<v Speaker 1>better off just lying to the police. We'd go to

676
00:37:27.840 --> 00:37:30.320
<v Speaker 1>the slammer for the rest of our lives end quote.

677
00:37:30.519 --> 00:37:32.719
<v Speaker 1>Pamela was also on tape saying that the murder was

678
00:37:32.760 --> 00:37:35.679
<v Speaker 1>almost perfect. Billy just had to brag about it to

679
00:37:35.760 --> 00:37:36.760
<v Speaker 1>his friends.

680
00:37:37.039 --> 00:37:42.440
<v Speaker 3>I just kid, she just zero responsibility and then trying

681
00:37:42.440 --> 00:37:45.920
<v Speaker 3>to make us seem to Cecilia that we're going.

682
00:37:45.880 --> 00:37:49.639
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, we're going. Cecilia is like, bitch, I didn't do nothing.

683
00:37:49.639 --> 00:37:53.360
<v Speaker 3>Because what how fucking she's Another thing about my lexicon

684
00:37:53.480 --> 00:37:56.360
<v Speaker 3>is I am trying not to swear so much, you know,

685
00:37:56.679 --> 00:37:58.400
<v Speaker 3>using fuck as an adjective.

686
00:37:58.559 --> 00:38:01.079
<v Speaker 1>So why haven't you seen the studies that if you

687
00:38:01.159 --> 00:38:02.719
<v Speaker 1>swear a lot, you're more intelligent.

688
00:38:03.360 --> 00:38:05.760
<v Speaker 2>I do. It needs to balance out with good words.

689
00:38:06.079 --> 00:38:12.639
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I just can't rely on'm fuck fuckery about her

690
00:38:12.679 --> 00:38:15.840
<v Speaker 3>being such a predator to these boys and the girl

691
00:38:16.039 --> 00:38:18.480
<v Speaker 3>you know she's yeah, she's really groomy.

692
00:38:18.639 --> 00:38:19.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah she knows or not.

693
00:38:20.440 --> 00:38:23.320
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, she really made them do what she wanted.

694
00:38:23.519 --> 00:38:25.639
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, And who doesn't think that a girl is so

695
00:38:25.760 --> 00:38:28.440
<v Speaker 3>you know, a young student or a young teacher. It's

696
00:38:28.480 --> 00:38:32.719
<v Speaker 3>so cool. It's very impressionable, and she had a big responsibility.

697
00:38:32.760 --> 00:38:37.000
<v Speaker 3>She totally took advantage of it. I don't pleasure. Yeah,

698
00:38:37.000 --> 00:38:39.119
<v Speaker 3>I'm pretty sure it wasn't worth it, pam.

699
00:38:38.920 --> 00:38:41.440
<v Speaker 1>But yeah, I know. I remember when I was in

700
00:38:41.519 --> 00:38:43.719
<v Speaker 1>high school. There was a new teacher and he was young.

701
00:38:43.800 --> 00:38:47.679
<v Speaker 1>He was the typing teacher, and we were all excited

702
00:38:47.719 --> 00:38:53.559
<v Speaker 1>to take typing.

703
00:38:51.039 --> 00:38:53.840
<v Speaker 2>A huge surge. There was a waiting list for typing.

704
00:38:55.679 --> 00:38:57.039
<v Speaker 2>Oh but back to our story.

705
00:38:57.239 --> 00:39:00.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, jury found Pamily guilty of being an accomplice to

706
00:39:01.000 --> 00:39:05.199
<v Speaker 1>premeditated first degree murder on March twenty second, nineteen ninety one.

707
00:39:05.400 --> 00:39:08.760
<v Speaker 1>She was also found guilty of witness tampering. She was

708
00:39:08.840 --> 00:39:11.000
<v Speaker 1>sentenced to spend the rest of her life in prison

709
00:39:11.079 --> 00:39:15.079
<v Speaker 1>without any possibility of parole, and she remains serving out

710
00:39:15.119 --> 00:39:18.000
<v Speaker 1>the rest of her natural life at a maximum security

711
00:39:18.039 --> 00:39:21.280
<v Speaker 1>prison in New York. Since Billy was a minor and

712
00:39:21.320 --> 00:39:25.719
<v Speaker 1>completely manipulated by Pamela, he was found guilty of second

713
00:39:25.760 --> 00:39:28.559
<v Speaker 1>degree murder and his sentence was a pretty hefty one

714
00:39:28.880 --> 00:39:31.840
<v Speaker 1>twenty eight years to life, but he was paroled and

715
00:39:31.920 --> 00:39:35.199
<v Speaker 1>let out of prison in twenty fifteen. Pete was also

716
00:39:35.280 --> 00:39:39.199
<v Speaker 1>paroled in twenty fifteen, while Jr. And Raymond Fowler were

717
00:39:39.239 --> 00:39:42.159
<v Speaker 1>released in two thousand and five. Since the murder, this

718
00:39:42.280 --> 00:39:44.159
<v Speaker 1>case has been made into a movie that you and

719
00:39:44.199 --> 00:39:47.360
<v Speaker 1>I talked about called To Die For and it stars

720
00:39:47.559 --> 00:39:51.639
<v Speaker 1>Joaquin Phoenix and Nicole Kidman. Did you ever see it?

721
00:39:51.639 --> 00:39:55.159
<v Speaker 1>It's been so long, but Joaquin, you know, he's one

722
00:39:55.159 --> 00:39:56.880
<v Speaker 1>of the people I go to the movies for.

723
00:39:57.239 --> 00:39:59.960
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, even if I'm not interested in the movie.

724
00:40:00.159 --> 00:40:02.039
<v Speaker 2>Oh, oh it's Joaquin. I'm there.

725
00:40:02.199 --> 00:40:05.840
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's Joaquin, I'm there. Yeah, I remember seeing it.

726
00:40:05.840 --> 00:40:07.639
<v Speaker 1>It was what was really good.

727
00:40:07.719 --> 00:40:11.079
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, she looked really good, just like her sex appeal.

728
00:40:11.280 --> 00:40:13.960
<v Speaker 3>And you know, you can just see from the clips

729
00:40:14.400 --> 00:40:17.360
<v Speaker 3>you could get the gist of the problem that Joaquin

730
00:40:17.400 --> 00:40:18.960
<v Speaker 3>would be facing, right.

731
00:40:19.440 --> 00:40:23.599
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Absolutely. Billy was released on his forty first birthday,

732
00:40:23.880 --> 00:40:27.480
<v Speaker 1>and during his parole hearing, he said, quote, I will

733
00:40:27.480 --> 00:40:30.920
<v Speaker 1>always feel terrible about what happened twenty five years ago.

734
00:40:31.159 --> 00:40:33.840
<v Speaker 1>Parole will not change that. I know that nothing I

735
00:40:33.880 --> 00:40:36.679
<v Speaker 1>can say here today will be of comfort to the

736
00:40:36.719 --> 00:40:39.920
<v Speaker 1>Smart family, but at the very least, I sincerely hope

737
00:40:40.079 --> 00:40:42.639
<v Speaker 1>that this will be the last time they have to

738
00:40:42.679 --> 00:40:46.400
<v Speaker 1>be publicly reminded of their grief, and I am truly

739
00:40:46.480 --> 00:40:48.400
<v Speaker 1>sorry for the pain I have caused them.

740
00:40:48.800 --> 00:40:49.280
<v Speaker 2>End quote.

741
00:40:49.639 --> 00:40:51.760
<v Speaker 1>He met a woman while in prison and he married

742
00:40:51.800 --> 00:40:54.719
<v Speaker 1>her and once he was finally released, He and his

743
00:40:54.760 --> 00:40:57.280
<v Speaker 1>wife moved to Maine and butt a pretty large piece

744
00:40:57.280 --> 00:40:59.119
<v Speaker 1>of land to live out the rest of their lives

745
00:40:59.199 --> 00:41:00.320
<v Speaker 1>out of the spot late.

746
00:41:00.960 --> 00:41:01.599
<v Speaker 2>That's nice.

747
00:41:01.880 --> 00:41:04.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And I don't know what happened to the rest

748
00:41:04.880 --> 00:41:06.880
<v Speaker 1>of the bunch, but yeah, I mean, so.

749
00:41:06.920 --> 00:41:08.440
<v Speaker 2>She's still in prison and.

750
00:41:10.000 --> 00:41:15.119
<v Speaker 3>Sounds like the ride the getaway driver and another accomplice

751
00:41:15.280 --> 00:41:18.599
<v Speaker 3>got out in two thousand and five and then the other.

752
00:41:18.440 --> 00:41:22.639
<v Speaker 2>Two twenty and fifteen. I mean, what a life lesson? Yeah,

753
00:41:22.679 --> 00:41:25.039
<v Speaker 2>for these the nineties were a trip.

754
00:41:25.239 --> 00:41:26.920
<v Speaker 1>Right, I know, they absolutely were.

755
00:41:27.280 --> 00:41:29.599
<v Speaker 3>Oh, if you wanted it, you just took it, and

756
00:41:29.639 --> 00:41:31.840
<v Speaker 3>you just made a lie. Oh, probably just somebody who

757
00:41:31.880 --> 00:41:35.039
<v Speaker 3>came in the house of some drug person wanting ten bucks.

758
00:41:35.320 --> 00:41:38.480
<v Speaker 2>You didn't really think about the story much, did you after?

759
00:41:39.039 --> 00:41:40.639
<v Speaker 2>Because that sounds like a child.

760
00:41:41.239 --> 00:41:43.559
<v Speaker 1>She put a lot of thought into how to do it,

761
00:41:43.719 --> 00:41:47.079
<v Speaker 1>leaving the doors unlocked, make sure you ransacked the place,

762
00:41:47.280 --> 00:41:49.960
<v Speaker 1>blah blah blah blah blah blah. Boy, oh boy. She

763
00:41:50.039 --> 00:41:52.079
<v Speaker 1>did not prepare for the long game at all.

764
00:41:52.119 --> 00:41:55.239
<v Speaker 3>No, And that is so important. Don't start anything unless

765
00:41:55.280 --> 00:41:58.320
<v Speaker 3>you can have a long game. That's where that's where

766
00:41:58.320 --> 00:41:59.199
<v Speaker 3>you're going to fuck up.

767
00:42:01.559 --> 00:42:04.199
<v Speaker 1>And you know, she's like she's like distant about it,

768
00:42:04.239 --> 00:42:06.760
<v Speaker 1>Like she's not like acting like she's distraught. Like, girl,

769
00:42:06.880 --> 00:42:09.320
<v Speaker 1>you have to put on the act, like you have

770
00:42:09.400 --> 00:42:12.320
<v Speaker 1>to act distraught and upset that somebody came and murdered

771
00:42:12.320 --> 00:42:14.639
<v Speaker 1>your fucking twenty four year old husband, like.

772
00:42:14.800 --> 00:42:16.880
<v Speaker 2>You know exactly the disconnect.

773
00:42:17.320 --> 00:42:21.239
<v Speaker 3>You might as well wear a red cape with how

774
00:42:21.400 --> 00:42:22.719
<v Speaker 3>little you're expressing.

775
00:42:23.119 --> 00:42:23.360
<v Speaker 2>You know.

776
00:42:23.840 --> 00:42:28.320
<v Speaker 1>But if I did it, she should I did it.

777
00:42:29.280 --> 00:42:32.519
<v Speaker 3>I'm lying, Well, that was a good That was so

778
00:42:32.599 --> 00:42:35.119
<v Speaker 3>long ago, but it's still so fresh. I know that

779
00:42:35.280 --> 00:42:38.719
<v Speaker 3>Nicole did such a great job of portraying the story

780
00:42:38.840 --> 00:42:39.840
<v Speaker 3>with Jaquin.

781
00:42:41.000 --> 00:42:41.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, we were all over.

782
00:42:42.039 --> 00:42:45.079
<v Speaker 3>I did not realize that it was the first televised

783
00:42:45.519 --> 00:42:49.280
<v Speaker 3>yeah either for everything. We know, the bigger ones like

784
00:42:49.320 --> 00:42:53.800
<v Speaker 3>the OJA and Johnny depf, but we have to take

785
00:42:53.800 --> 00:42:57.840
<v Speaker 3>a bow to the archaeotype case you know.

786
00:42:59.719 --> 00:43:04.119
<v Speaker 1>This. Yeah, yeah, this one is. I didn't realize it

787
00:43:04.159 --> 00:43:06.840
<v Speaker 1>was the first one either, so I was like, wow,

788
00:43:06.960 --> 00:43:08.320
<v Speaker 1>you know, and then I was thinking about it and

789
00:43:08.360 --> 00:43:10.639
<v Speaker 1>like that's pretty crazy, and it's like I said, that's

790
00:43:10.639 --> 00:43:13.199
<v Speaker 1>probably how we all know it. And at least if

791
00:43:13.239 --> 00:43:16.840
<v Speaker 1>you were an adult in nineteen ninety or close to it,

792
00:43:17.159 --> 00:43:19.039
<v Speaker 1>you know, you would have seen it in the.

793
00:43:18.960 --> 00:43:20.440
<v Speaker 2>News for sure.

794
00:43:20.800 --> 00:43:24.360
<v Speaker 1>It's such a sad story that I and I don't

795
00:43:24.400 --> 00:43:26.760
<v Speaker 1>know what her long game was. I doubt it was

796
00:43:26.840 --> 00:43:28.559
<v Speaker 1>to stay with Billy for the rest of it.

797
00:43:28.639 --> 00:43:30.480
<v Speaker 2>I don't think so. I think she just loved the

798
00:43:30.639 --> 00:43:31.599
<v Speaker 2>thrill of the chase.

799
00:43:32.119 --> 00:43:35.719
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, that's when you're fifteen in a world you're twenty

800
00:43:35.760 --> 00:43:38.519
<v Speaker 3>six in your love of your life is fifteen.

801
00:43:39.639 --> 00:43:41.519
<v Speaker 2>There was some delusional problems there.

802
00:43:41.559 --> 00:43:44.360
<v Speaker 1>I think she was only twenty two or twenty three actually.

803
00:43:44.320 --> 00:43:49.239
<v Speaker 3>Each Okay, even's I'm an adult and you're a child.

804
00:43:49.360 --> 00:43:52.599
<v Speaker 3>Thing that happens when you're eighteen, right, you know, whether

805
00:43:52.679 --> 00:43:53.400
<v Speaker 3>you're aware of it.

806
00:43:53.559 --> 00:43:55.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So not that I'm trying.

807
00:43:55.519 --> 00:43:58.679
<v Speaker 1>To make it sound less gross, but you're yeah, I

808
00:43:58.719 --> 00:44:02.760
<v Speaker 1>mean Billy, I hope he's having I feel so terrible

809
00:44:02.920 --> 00:44:06.719
<v Speaker 1>naturally for the Smart family with Gregory, and then it's

810
00:44:06.800 --> 00:44:10.599
<v Speaker 1>just so many factors, the youth of Billy.

811
00:44:10.280 --> 00:44:12.719
<v Speaker 2>And then my god, it's the teacher.

812
00:44:12.880 --> 00:44:16.039
<v Speaker 3>If you're a teacher, is inviting you to her home

813
00:44:16.440 --> 00:44:21.559
<v Speaker 3>by specific lingerie for you, is blasting Van Halen and

814
00:44:21.679 --> 00:44:25.559
<v Speaker 3>Sammy Hagar. He never listens to I can't drive fifty

815
00:44:25.599 --> 00:44:28.760
<v Speaker 3>five again, because you know what I'm saying, like he.

816
00:44:29.079 --> 00:44:31.000
<v Speaker 2>Thinks she is a goddess.

817
00:44:31.400 --> 00:44:33.320
<v Speaker 1>Oh for sure, rock and roll.

818
00:44:33.639 --> 00:44:38.079
<v Speaker 2>And she was doing this while this song was playing. Hello.

819
00:44:38.239 --> 00:44:43.519
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, she's older, she's beautiful, she's experienced, and she's him.

820
00:44:43.719 --> 00:44:46.320
<v Speaker 1>And I doubt that he had a lot of sexual

821
00:44:46.360 --> 00:44:47.840
<v Speaker 1>experience at fifteen years old.

822
00:44:47.880 --> 00:44:49.000
<v Speaker 2>Oh my goodness.

823
00:44:49.039 --> 00:44:53.360
<v Speaker 1>Totally manipulated him through sex. And you know, he's just

824
00:44:53.400 --> 00:44:57.119
<v Speaker 1>a kid. He And again, I'm not trying to excuse

825
00:44:57.159 --> 00:44:57.760
<v Speaker 1>what he did.

826
00:44:57.760 --> 00:44:58.679
<v Speaker 2>No, not at all.

827
00:44:58.719 --> 00:45:03.159
<v Speaker 1>But I mean him too, I only manipulated into doing this.

828
00:45:03.199 --> 00:45:05.679
<v Speaker 1>He knew what was wrong and that's why he ended

829
00:45:05.760 --> 00:45:08.719
<v Speaker 1>up in prison. But I feel it's just so senseless.

830
00:45:08.760 --> 00:45:12.039
<v Speaker 1>I feel for Greg's because he sounded like a great

831
00:45:12.079 --> 00:45:15.199
<v Speaker 1>guy and what like she just didn't want to give

832
00:45:15.280 --> 00:45:17.880
<v Speaker 1>him the dog or the furniture. I don't get I

833
00:45:17.880 --> 00:45:20.039
<v Speaker 1>don't get it, like she just wanted the money. Really

834
00:45:20.039 --> 00:45:22.480
<v Speaker 1>wasn't even that much money, I mean three hundred grand

835
00:45:23.079 --> 00:45:25.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeah right, it's not worth killing your husband for. I mean,

836
00:45:26.320 --> 00:45:28.800
<v Speaker 1>I'm in I'm not killing my husband for three hundred

837
00:45:28.800 --> 00:45:29.519
<v Speaker 1>thousand dollars.

838
00:45:31.679 --> 00:45:32.760
<v Speaker 2>I need a bigger number.

839
00:45:33.199 --> 00:45:36.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Like I might think about it if it's like

840
00:45:37.039 --> 00:45:38.239
<v Speaker 1>thirty million dollars.

841
00:45:38.280 --> 00:45:41.239
<v Speaker 2>But I mean that's right, we're just in the hundred thousands.

842
00:45:41.519 --> 00:45:47.679
<v Speaker 1>Come on, I'd pissed that away, so fat So anyway,

843
00:45:48.239 --> 00:45:51.960
<v Speaker 1>the long game, Yeah, she wasn't mature enough either, No,

844
00:45:53.480 --> 00:45:56.039
<v Speaker 1>and you know she just you know, when you're young

845
00:45:56.079 --> 00:45:58.360
<v Speaker 1>and you get married, you married someone because they're hot.

846
00:45:58.440 --> 00:46:01.079
<v Speaker 1>And now Greg cut his hair and wearing boring ass

847
00:46:01.079 --> 00:46:03.639
<v Speaker 1>suits and she doesn't find him hot anymore, and you

848
00:46:03.679 --> 00:46:04.239
<v Speaker 1>know what.

849
00:46:04.199 --> 00:46:08.199
<v Speaker 3>And that's like so shallow, like you didn't like anything

850
00:46:08.199 --> 00:46:10.760
<v Speaker 3>about like you don't have any roots that you loved

851
00:46:10.760 --> 00:46:14.679
<v Speaker 3>about them. I mean, we can all change our appearance, right,

852
00:46:15.039 --> 00:46:18.719
<v Speaker 3>it's our core. That is the fun.

853
00:46:19.039 --> 00:46:20.960
<v Speaker 1>I mean he sounded fun and great.

854
00:46:21.159 --> 00:46:23.920
<v Speaker 3>Totally, oh my gosh, and you're not. You don't become

855
00:46:23.960 --> 00:46:28.039
<v Speaker 3>a very successful sales guide and insurance by being a dick.

856
00:46:28.639 --> 00:46:29.840
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I'm sure.

857
00:46:30.760 --> 00:46:35.119
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, you had any like terrible qualities about him, the

858
00:46:35.199 --> 00:46:36.760
<v Speaker 3>simple divorce could take care of.

859
00:46:37.159 --> 00:46:39.719
<v Speaker 1>But it's just sad. So well, thank you Shannon, and

860
00:46:39.760 --> 00:46:42.400
<v Speaker 1>thank you everyone for listening to this week's episode. If

861
00:46:42.440 --> 00:46:45.840
<v Speaker 1>you haven't done so already, please hit subscribe or follow

862
00:46:45.960 --> 00:46:48.639
<v Speaker 1>on whatever app you're listening to if you would like

863
00:46:48.760 --> 00:46:51.880
<v Speaker 1>more episodes with Shannon and I and We also have

864
00:46:51.920 --> 00:46:54.679
<v Speaker 1>an archive of all of the episodes with TULEA two

865
00:46:54.800 --> 00:46:58.239
<v Speaker 1>hundred something. Yes, you can join our Patreon it's p

866
00:46:58.400 --> 00:47:02.960
<v Speaker 1>A t R e O n slash TNT Crimes, or

867
00:47:03.000 --> 00:47:05.719
<v Speaker 1>you can join through the Apple podcast app and we

868
00:47:05.800 --> 00:47:09.400
<v Speaker 1>release one additional episode a week, So if you sign

869
00:47:09.480 --> 00:47:12.199
<v Speaker 1>up for first degree or through the Apple Podcast app,

870
00:47:12.239 --> 00:47:14.719
<v Speaker 1>you will get an additional episode per week. You can

871
00:47:14.760 --> 00:47:18.280
<v Speaker 1>go to our website Crimes and Consequences dot com. We

872
00:47:18.360 --> 00:47:22.119
<v Speaker 1>have merch that we're probably going to be updating soon

873
00:47:22.360 --> 00:47:25.480
<v Speaker 1>at some point. It's in progress. Like I tell everybody,

874
00:47:25.960 --> 00:47:28.000
<v Speaker 1>can get Shannon on the website and.

875
00:47:28.599 --> 00:47:30.320
<v Speaker 2>On the stem a time. We're getting there.

876
00:47:30.320 --> 00:47:35.960
<v Speaker 1>We're moving forward right exactly. So anyway, I think that's

877
00:47:36.000 --> 00:47:40.000
<v Speaker 1>all the business. So until our next episode, Shannon, I.

878
00:47:40.000 --> 00:47:40.679
<v Speaker 2>Love you girl.

879
00:47:40.760 --> 00:47:43.480
<v Speaker 3>You take care of yourself till next time, which could

880
00:47:43.519 --> 00:47:45.360
<v Speaker 3>be tomorrow or the day after.

881
00:47:45.559 --> 00:47:48.280
<v Speaker 1>It could be one of these days. I will see

882
00:47:48.320 --> 00:47:50.480
<v Speaker 1>you again very soon, So I love you.

883
00:47:51.039 --> 00:47:55.079
<v Speaker 3>I love you too, you guys, take care YouTube bye

884
00:47:55.159 --> 00:48:01.760
<v Speaker 2>Ra think so
