WEBVTT

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<v Speaker 1>Oh, gis Bolts. It's showtime.

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<v Speaker 2>People say, good money to see this movie.

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<v Speaker 3>When they go out to a theater, they want cold sodas,

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<v Speaker 3>hot popcorn, and no monsters in the protection booth.

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<v Speaker 1>Everyone pretend podcasting isn't boring.

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<v Speaker 4>Cut it off.

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<v Speaker 1>Today's my birthday. Nice to be very nice to see y'all.

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<v Speaker 5>Listen.

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<v Speaker 1>I got a very funny story.

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<v Speaker 5>I gotta tell it.

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<v Speaker 3>Have you ever been to an army hospital?

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<v Speaker 2>When you see it live, there's more effect than a protest.

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<v Speaker 5>Thirty I want to sixteen.

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<v Speaker 6>I'm a very frank person, George. I'll lay it right

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<v Speaker 6>on the line. Your script, although it is an excellent one,

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<v Speaker 6>does not have the ingredients for a commercial success. You see,

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<v Speaker 6>I must present the project to my investors, and that

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<v Speaker 6>project must meet certain requirements.

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<v Speaker 3>I mean like writhing love Garden.

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<v Speaker 7>That's sick.

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<v Speaker 3>You've got to wait till she says something.

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<v Speaker 2>Can you just answer and you play it by year?

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<v Speaker 7>That's our Do you like it here?

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<v Speaker 2>Let no blasting?

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<v Speaker 7>Please don't kill this hair.

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<v Speaker 4>You know you're better than him.

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<v Speaker 7>I need him for my bread and butter. If it

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<v Speaker 7>wasn't for him, I'd still be out on the streets.

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<v Speaker 8>Please, please, have mercy.

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<v Speaker 4>On his soul.

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<v Speaker 7>All right, you must be number thirteen. There's no thirteen?

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<v Speaker 1>Who are you? O?

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<v Speaker 4>No one?

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<v Speaker 7>I don't exist, I don't understand. Could you try?

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<v Speaker 2>Welcome to the projection booth. I'm your host. Mike White

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<v Speaker 2>joined me once again as Miss Heather Draine.

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<v Speaker 4>Hello. Hello.

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<v Speaker 2>Also back in the booth is mister Ben Buckingham. It

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<v Speaker 2>a We are kicking off a month looking at lost

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<v Speaker 2>or obscure films with William Sachs's nineteen seventy four film

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<v Speaker 2>There Is No Thirteen. It is an experimental anti war

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<v Speaker 2>film that Sacks shot with a blend of absurdist humor,

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<v Speaker 2>surreal fantasy sequences, and biting commentary on the Vietnam War.

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<v Speaker 2>It centers on draft named George Thomas as he reflects

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<v Speaker 2>on his life. The film spirals into a series of bizarre,

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<v Speaker 2>disjointed vignettes, almost like channels surfing through his mind. One

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<v Speaker 2>of the reasons it's not widely noticed because it was

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<v Speaker 2>effectively suppressed in the US. Sachs has said that it

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<v Speaker 2>was shown at the Berlin Film Festival and got a

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<v Speaker 2>strong response, but it was never given a proper theatric

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<v Speaker 2>release in the States. There's some more about military or

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<v Speaker 2>government pressure due to its anti war content, though that's

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<v Speaker 2>possibly apocryphal. I can just hear our ratings drop whenever

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<v Speaker 2>I do one of these Modi mays, whenever I say,

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<v Speaker 2>if you don't at anything ruined, turn off the podcast

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<v Speaker 2>and come back after you've seen the film. That's not

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<v Speaker 2>going to be very easy with a lot of these films.

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<v Speaker 2>So good luck, buddy, you're gonna need it. Hopefully you're

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<v Speaker 2>a Patreon person and I'm sneaking these films to our Patreon. So, Heather,

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<v Speaker 2>had you seen There Is No Thirteen before coming on

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<v Speaker 2>the show to talk about it?

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<v Speaker 4>No, because, as you just alluded to, this film is

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<v Speaker 4>very hard to track down. I was familiar with it,

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<v Speaker 4>and I was immediately intrigued when I saw it pop

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<v Speaker 4>up and you had mentioned doing a show on it

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<v Speaker 4>because i'd read the rialto report little. They did a

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<v Speaker 4>little article on Geene Jennings's role in it, and I

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<v Speaker 4>was like, Wow, this film sounds really interesting. I wonder

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<v Speaker 4>if somebody considered themselves a bit of a deep cut person.

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<v Speaker 4>I'm like, this is totally new to me, but it

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<v Speaker 4>sounded like it was pretty much considered lost in that article.

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<v Speaker 4>So when you brought it up, I was like, absolutely,

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<v Speaker 4>I want to dive into this film, and I'm so

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<v Speaker 4>glad I did. I'm looking forward to hearing what you

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<v Speaker 4>guys have to say about.

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<v Speaker 2>It, and Ben, how about yourself.

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<v Speaker 1>I realized recently that I had heard of it in

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<v Speaker 1>relation to Mark Damon no longer being an actor, that

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<v Speaker 1>i'd heard it discussed in that context, but no stimulated

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<v Speaker 1>memories or connections or anything. And when I I was

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<v Speaker 1>looking through with the films you've had there, and I

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<v Speaker 1>did a quick google and I was like, ah, lost

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<v Speaker 1>Experimental Response to Vietnam War plus riz Ortolani. I'm in,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm in.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I'm trying to remember how I got a hold

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<v Speaker 2>of this film. I know, I'm pretty sure that it

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<v Speaker 2>is William sax himself who is the source of this,

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<v Speaker 2>according to a lot of these articles we've read. I

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<v Speaker 2>even saw I wanted to tell you whether I saw

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<v Speaker 2>a picture of Alexander Trushinsky with William Sachs, and he

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<v Speaker 2>was like, oh, yeah, you know, he showed me there

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<v Speaker 2>is no thirteen. I'm like, of course, of course, Alexander,

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<v Speaker 2>you always are in those right places at the right time.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm like, that's pretty cool. But yeah, I can't remember

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<v Speaker 2>how I got my hands on this. This was on

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<v Speaker 2>a list that I found years and years ago of

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<v Speaker 2>these are all missing films, and I just was very

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<v Speaker 2>determined to try and track down as many as I

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<v Speaker 2>possibly could, and yeah, managed to somehow. And then, yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>I've been wanting to watch it for years and years.

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<v Speaker 2>I finally used this as an excuse to do so.

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<v Speaker 2>And I have to say, this movie is nothing like

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<v Speaker 2>the movie that I had in my head when I

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<v Speaker 2>read about the movie. It talks about there's a guy.

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<v Speaker 2>He's in Vietnam and he has had sex with twelve

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<v Speaker 2>women over his life, and he's reminiscing about those women

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<v Speaker 2>and they will never be at number thirteen. So I

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<v Speaker 2>pictured this is almost like a guy at a VA

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<v Speaker 2>hospital or a guy like literally in a trench in

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<v Speaker 2>Vietnam talking to somebody else, and this being a series

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<v Speaker 2>of vignettes walking through from number one to number twelve,

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<v Speaker 2>and then right at the end he gets blown up

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<v Speaker 2>or something and then the title comes up. There is

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<v Speaker 2>no thirteen. That's what I was picturing. This what I

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<v Speaker 2>saw totally different than that. Wow. In fact, I want

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<v Speaker 2>to ask you guys, do we ever see like number

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<v Speaker 2>one through nine or we just see like ten, eleven,

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<v Speaker 2>twelve kind of thing.

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<v Speaker 1>Now we only see eleven and twelve. And I have

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<v Speaker 1>written down a transcription of the conversation with the maybe thirteenth,

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<v Speaker 1>which does show that she might not be thirteen. There

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<v Speaker 1>might not be at thirteen. Maybe he is the thirteen

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<v Speaker 1>that doesn't exist. I don't know, but yes, same exact

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<v Speaker 1>same series of thoughts that you had. I had that myself,

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<v Speaker 1>and I have come to the conclusion that that is

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<v Speaker 1>all like marketing blurbs, attempting to sell it at the time,

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<v Speaker 1>because that's the kind of film that they were making

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<v Speaker 1>it at the time of that kind of like a

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<v Speaker 1>little bit sexy, YadA YadA yadak. And then because it's

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<v Speaker 1>just Spanish and no one has cared, no one's been

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<v Speaker 1>saxes and being Internet savvy getting on Internet and writing

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<v Speaker 1>what's there or anything, we're just stuck with what appears

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<v Speaker 1>to be like a marketing pitch and it doesn't reflect

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<v Speaker 1>the film at all.

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<v Speaker 4>Really no, especially because like if somebody like you be

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<v Speaker 4>listening to this and you google it and one of

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<v Speaker 4>the first things pops up a prodes are going to

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<v Speaker 4>be the way and it's just one sentence or a

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<v Speaker 4>man reminiscence about at the first twelve women he had

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<v Speaker 4>sex with. And that's really not with this, is it all?

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<v Speaker 4>You know the earlier girls? Who knows? But it's not

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<v Speaker 4>even the point. It's not even really the main threast

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<v Speaker 4>of it. Also, what blew my mind, like just as

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<v Speaker 4>a film started as is seeing names in the credits

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<v Speaker 4>and I'm like, how in the hell is this so obscure?

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<v Speaker 4>Because while Mark Damon's not like a huge name like

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<v Speaker 4>a Redford or anything like that, Like this guy, before

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<v Speaker 4>he went into producing and being a distributor at all

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<v Speaker 4>of that, had several film credits to his name that

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<v Speaker 4>are very respectable. I believe you said Baba's Black Sabbath.

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<v Speaker 1>He's opposite Vincent Dryson House in Ussia. He's the staxy,

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<v Speaker 1>romantic lead. He has been seen by many faces in

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<v Speaker 1>the mid twentieth century. He is a big deal at

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<v Speaker 1>that time.

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<v Speaker 4>Harvey Lemback, Oh my god.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh there you go. I knew you were going to

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<v Speaker 2>bring up Harvey Lemback.

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<v Speaker 4>You know me so well. You know how much I

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<v Speaker 4>love Harvey lambag My, Oh my god, the smile on

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<v Speaker 4>my face. When I saw his name in the credit,

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<v Speaker 4>I was like, hell, yes, I think I literally wrote

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<v Speaker 4>my notes the mant Harvey Limbeck. So whenever, whenever I

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<v Speaker 4>shovel off this mortal croyl, people are gonna transcribe these

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<v Speaker 4>like my chicken scratch and just be like Harvey lempbag.

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<v Speaker 2>Somewhere in the Mondo Heather library, you know, just like

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<v Speaker 2>what is going on here? Why is she so obsessed

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<v Speaker 2>with Harvey Lembeck? Why is it say Heather plus Eric

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<v Speaker 2>von Zipper forever?

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<v Speaker 4>Now, now, Mike, let's not get it twisted. Let's cut

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<v Speaker 4>the dick. You know that Timothy Carey is the one

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<v Speaker 4>that would be hardy, but I would totally hang out

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<v Speaker 4>with Eric Vonson's.

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<v Speaker 7>I'm true thinking.

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<v Speaker 6>What I'm thinking is that poor little sugar Cane is

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<v Speaker 6>mixed up with undesirable Eric Vonziper is going to protect her.

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<v Speaker 2>I think I adore she's nifty.

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<v Speaker 4>That Skydivond looks like fun. Like to try it, Boss.

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<v Speaker 1>Von Zeppa and chickles is better right right way go.

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<v Speaker 4>I would be one of his rats or mice or

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<v Speaker 4>whatever those girls will call it. But Harvey, like, oh

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<v Speaker 4>my god, Ben, you mentioned riz Orlani and one of

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<v Speaker 4>my favorite film composers, Like if Orderlani's with those guys,

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<v Speaker 4>or even if I've never seen the movie, if I

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<v Speaker 4>find a soundtrack that he's done, I'm like, I have

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<v Speaker 4>to hear this. I want those And so this is

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<v Speaker 4>it's like, I literally I have covered and written about

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<v Speaker 4>films that are literally underground, films that are way easier,

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<v Speaker 4>fine and attracted information. Then this one, like this should

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<v Speaker 4>not be anywhere near the obscure level it is. It's bizarre.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And so much of what's written online is just

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<v Speaker 1>slightly reworded variations on the same three paragraph And then

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<v Speaker 1>even if you listen to Bill sag as Wove sex

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<v Speaker 1>talk or interviews or whatever, and he's saying pretty much

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<v Speaker 1>those same thing. And I only manage to scrape a

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<v Speaker 1>couple of little bits of info here and there, and

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<v Speaker 1>so much of what I figured out is just oh

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<v Speaker 1>this dot, this dot, this dot that like that was

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<v Speaker 1>that the Sacks was in Rome working on anglicizing Italian

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<v Speaker 1>films so they didn't look like they Italian because this

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<v Speaker 1>market was so flooded. They didn't want them in America.

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<v Speaker 1>So he was like changing the names and redubbing into it.

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<v Speaker 1>He'd say, putting in like the sounds of cameras which operating,

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<v Speaker 1>so it sounded like the dubbing was real. That's where

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<v Speaker 1>he met his wife and Mark Damon. Of course Mark

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<v Speaker 1>Damon was in with AIP and all that with the

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<v Speaker 1>barber's connections in Italy and America backers and forwards. But

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<v Speaker 1>then I was like, oh, okay that one of the

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<v Speaker 1>editors plays primarily more a sound and dialogue editor in Italy.

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<v Speaker 1>Which one was that? I think it was George was it?

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<v Speaker 8>No?

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<v Speaker 1>Michael Billingslea sorry who Like I look up, was like,

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<v Speaker 1>doesn't sound very Italian. No, he's born in Zioux Falls, Idaho,

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<v Speaker 1>but he died in Rome, Italy and he worked on

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<v Speaker 1>like Cisplodynamite and Bertolucci's Last Angle in Paris nineteen hundred,

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<v Speaker 1>Stealing Beauty, Cavani's Night, Porter de Martinos Puma Man Deodato's

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<v Speaker 1>Raids of Atlantas and Cut and Run Full She's new Gladiators.

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<v Speaker 1>So I'm like, what who is He's an editor And

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<v Speaker 1>I was like, okay. So the sound recording was done

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<v Speaker 1>in Row that's in the credits of the film. So

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<v Speaker 1>it's like you've got these weird like six degrees come

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<v Speaker 1>out of thing of how it all moves around and

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<v Speaker 1>why then So then that would of course would be

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<v Speaker 1>why Riz is doing the score, because they did all

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<v Speaker 1>the audio in Italy. I was like, somebody could have

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<v Speaker 1>figured that out and put it in the Wikipedia before

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<v Speaker 1>me and saved me like an hour. I'm going into

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<v Speaker 1>letterbox and changing the blot synopsis this week. I've held

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<v Speaker 1>off until we discuss it so we can get some

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<v Speaker 1>sort of four dimenal idea or what is actually happening.

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<v Speaker 1>But I'm definitely changing that fucking blot phenopsis this week

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<v Speaker 1>because it's just it doesn't. It doesn't doesn't, so it's

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<v Speaker 1>such an injustice.

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<v Speaker 4>Rass Kelly's also in or whoever must forget she If

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<v Speaker 4>you look at one of the posters the Time posters,

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<v Speaker 4>her name is on the post's she sent the movie

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<v Speaker 4>for five minutes, but this was her era where she

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<v Speaker 4>she was in a few years before Greetings, like to

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<v Speaker 4>Paul Miss Greetings. So I feel like it would make

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<v Speaker 4>it interesting. There's a few films I kept thinking like

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<v Speaker 4>this would pair well with those like that one, and

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<v Speaker 4>weirdly enough, Robert Downy Senior's Pound. I fel like there's

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<v Speaker 4>some sort of tonality. I don't know, they're films, but

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<v Speaker 4>there's some kind of I don't know, there's like a

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<v Speaker 4>tone about them that I think would match really well.

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<v Speaker 2>Real scrappy, yeah, like this underground kind of thing. I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>you feel like they were squeezing every single penny for

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<v Speaker 2>this movie.

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<v Speaker 4>And there's also like a theatricality to both of them

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<v Speaker 4>and the way that surrealism is implemented. It's very very stagy.

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<v Speaker 4>Course with this one, you have a lot of vaudeville

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<v Speaker 4>themes with especially with the our our patrons saying our

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<v Speaker 4>v leveg But so it's like you have like old

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<v Speaker 4>American culture kind of tropes being played, like the Old

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<v Speaker 4>West sequence. There's a sequence we realized on it like

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<v Speaker 4>a film, like he's actually shooting a film, but it's

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<v Speaker 4>at like a soda counter, which again seems like a

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<v Speaker 4>very Americana kind of thing. It seems like a very

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<v Speaker 4>Americana situation. It's fascinating the Italian influence because this is

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<v Speaker 4>such a if. This film feels intensely American.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, and speaking of de Palma, Ralph Bode, who did

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<v Speaker 2>the cinematography for this one, he would end up going

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<v Speaker 2>on to Dressed to Kill, and quite a lot of

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<v Speaker 2>other things. I mean, he was working very hard until

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<v Speaker 2>his death in two thousand and one. But like, why

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<v Speaker 2>is this one so hard to find when the DP

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<v Speaker 2>at least is doing like Don Juan DeMarco and Bad

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<v Speaker 2>Girls and Made in America like super mainstream things Uncle Buck,

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<v Speaker 2>for God's sakes, you know. But then he was also

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<v Speaker 2>the DP on stuff like the Accused and Distant Thunder,

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<v Speaker 2>like real well done Oscar Baby kind of stuff. And yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>like this was I want to say a second time.

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<v Speaker 2>And I know that we're watching as kind of a

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<v Speaker 2>shitty cop be transferred over from like a three quarter

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<v Speaker 2>you matic tape, and there's some real dropout here and there,

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<v Speaker 2>But I mean, it does look good what we do

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<v Speaker 2>get to see.

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<v Speaker 1>I was actually surprised by how followed the quality of

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<v Speaker 1>it was, ignoring tracking stuff and picking up someone's bobole

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<v Speaker 1>phone signal a couple of point there was. I did

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<v Speaker 1>feel like I was missing a lot though, in those details,

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<v Speaker 1>because it feels like there's a lot happening in the

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<v Speaker 1>missile scene in the background that's like little clues and

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<v Speaker 1>things that is like more Americana pop culture kind of

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<v Speaker 1>stuff and it's just too hard to tell the scene

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<v Speaker 1>where he in twelve are in bed and the pillows

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<v Speaker 1>these giant pillows with some image on them that looks

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<v Speaker 1>like old children's books or westerns or something, and I'm

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<v Speaker 1>just like, I Dad feels like it's really important and

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<v Speaker 1>I just can't make it out. Do not know what

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<v Speaker 1>it is? On that kind of note though, also like

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<v Speaker 1>I looking up all these old white men Harvey Lembeck

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<v Speaker 1>included and just being like, well, how many times is

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<v Speaker 1>Harvey Lembeck in this film where he is just old

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<v Speaker 1>white guys with mustachs. I think he is in it

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<v Speaker 1>four or five times, like different characters quote as much.

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<v Speaker 2>He's credited as old George in the credits, which is

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<v Speaker 2>odd because I'm like, okay, so is he actually the

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<v Speaker 2>older version of our main character kind of revisiting his past?

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<v Speaker 2>Is he really the protagonist rather than younger George? And

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<v Speaker 2>I think there's even another George in the credits, like

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<v Speaker 2>the youngest George. But I know for sure there's two

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<v Speaker 2>George's in the credits.

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<v Speaker 1>So in the opening scene, the person doing the announcing

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<v Speaker 1>and telling the joke, I believe that's Harvey Limbeck.

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<v Speaker 4>It definitely sounded like him.

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<v Speaker 1>I think that Mark Damon is in that chorus as

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<v Speaker 1>one of the singer's last dances as George. So you

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<v Speaker 1>have young and older George in the same sequence, and

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<v Speaker 1>I do think they are the figments of their each

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<v Speaker 1>their own imaginations. This film is that like existential surreal

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<v Speaker 1>strangeness that they are like both coexisting and not coexisting together,

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<v Speaker 1>that needed actually exists was something.

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<v Speaker 2>That song that you're talking about is by Paul Serrato, who, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>he has had a huge career, well not huge, but

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<v Speaker 2>he's had a career as well.

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<v Speaker 1>There's more online about him than this film.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, exactly, there's a whole thing like, oh yeah,

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00:17:31.759 --> 00:17:35.200
<v Speaker 2>he managed a paperback gallery in Greenwich Village where he

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<v Speaker 2>met Jackie Curtis and I'm like, okay, yeah, and I

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<v Speaker 2>went he has an official website. I'm like, okay, great,

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00:17:40.960 --> 00:17:43.240
<v Speaker 2>you know, I mean, so does William Sachs. But yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know why Sachs could never get this one

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<v Speaker 2>out there, because this is all original music for the film.

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<v Speaker 2>And usually that's like always the sticking point where it's like,

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<v Speaker 2>oh no, there was a song in here for thirty seconds,

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<v Speaker 2>so we can't let you put this out, I'm like, what.

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<v Speaker 1>I Supposedly the negative was lost, it was just one,

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<v Speaker 1>which is probably likely. I did hear an interview with

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<v Speaker 1>him where because it was released in Italy that he

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<v Speaker 1>sent an internegative to Italy. So there's a possibility somewhere

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<v Speaker 1>out there in Italy there is an intnegative that could

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<v Speaker 1>be found and sourced. But there's just no drive for

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<v Speaker 1>anybody to find it at this point, which is really

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<v Speaker 1>quite bewildering. So I watched it twice, and the first

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<v Speaker 1>time was I watched it with my partner and she

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<v Speaker 1>was like that was good, not don't quite know what

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00:18:33.480 --> 00:18:37.680
<v Speaker 1>to make of it, bit fairly abstract, but like a

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<v Speaker 1>good interesting film. And then I watched it a second time,

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<v Speaker 1>and by the time I got the end of the

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<v Speaker 1>second time, I was just like, I feel real bad vibes,

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<v Speaker 1>like way more than I did the first time. And

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<v Speaker 1>then I watched the Opening Secrets again. Immediately after watching

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<v Speaker 1>the head it was just like, oh, this is a

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<v Speaker 1>circle of hell. This film's got something. Even like the

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<v Speaker 1>first time round, I was not quite got something as

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<v Speaker 1>much as they might return into it and was like, oh,

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00:19:02.839 --> 00:19:06.079
<v Speaker 1>oh wait, this is and that and this and this

348
00:19:06.319 --> 00:19:07.960
<v Speaker 1>and is that. And it was just like, oh man,

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<v Speaker 1>oh man, this is something like there's so many films

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00:19:11.519 --> 00:19:14.720
<v Speaker 1>out there that have survived and lasted longer, Like I

351
00:19:15.240 --> 00:19:17.599
<v Speaker 1>was trying to remember desperately what I thought of it,

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<v Speaker 1>but it kept reminding me of the Jack Nicholson's directorial

353
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<v Speaker 1>debut Drive. He said, for being this kind of like

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<v Speaker 1>revolutionary response, like the youth man, this is what's happening

355
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<v Speaker 1>in America at this time, experimental ever guard I remember

356
00:19:32.599 --> 00:19:36.240
<v Speaker 1>waiting that film and being so bored by it and

357
00:19:36.519 --> 00:19:39.519
<v Speaker 1>so annoyed by it, and this I did not have

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<v Speaker 1>that experience at all. And I went, I watched three

359
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<v Speaker 1>watch of trailer for Drive. He's there trying to stimulate

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<v Speaker 1>some memory of it, and it was like it hard

361
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<v Speaker 1>e gauge just from a trailer. But it's like the

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<v Speaker 1>difference between and I think part of the reason why

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<v Speaker 1>this has disappeared is because it is an experiential film,

364
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<v Speaker 1>Like it's not a statement film. There's not a specific

365
00:20:01.279 --> 00:20:07.079
<v Speaker 1>ideology or there's not it's it's rattling the cages just

366
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<v Speaker 1>by the terrible weirdness and steff everence of experience for

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<v Speaker 1>people at that time and ongoing of the destruction of

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<v Speaker 1>that they are experienced just because people in powers it's

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<v Speaker 1>like this, it's like that, And because there's nothing tangible

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<v Speaker 1>or like to latch onto, it is harder for people

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<v Speaker 1>to get excited about it. But at the same time,

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<v Speaker 1>it means that sixty years, fifty years later, it still

373
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<v Speaker 1>has this hunch because it's not tangled up in whatever

374
00:20:39.200 --> 00:20:42.519
<v Speaker 1>little flame is burning in that person's heart at the

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00:20:42.559 --> 00:20:44.759
<v Speaker 1>time when they made the film. It actually feels like

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<v Speaker 1>an experience of the world. And that's why I've been

377
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<v Speaker 1>watching it the second time, realizing how the end just

378
00:20:51.240 --> 00:20:53.640
<v Speaker 1>folds back into the beginning, that it's a circle of

379
00:20:53.680 --> 00:20:56.319
<v Speaker 1>hell and there's some great, wonderful joys in there because

380
00:20:56.319 --> 00:20:59.559
<v Speaker 1>there are positive memories, but it also just that way

381
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<v Speaker 1>it keeps like cutting it all the whole way.

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<v Speaker 4>That Zach fucked interconnects everything too, because it's like by

383
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<v Speaker 4>the time you get to the ending, which I won't

384
00:21:08.640 --> 00:21:11.400
<v Speaker 4>jump ahead to that quite yet because we're still in

385
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<v Speaker 4>the early midiction. I know of the pond, right, I know,

386
00:21:15.200 --> 00:21:17.240
<v Speaker 4>but it's like when it hits you, it's like my

387
00:21:17.279 --> 00:21:19.920
<v Speaker 4>brain start going back to, oh god, this is all connected,

388
00:21:19.920 --> 00:21:22.440
<v Speaker 4>because you know, when the film and it's so bruined

389
00:21:22.440 --> 00:21:25.759
<v Speaker 4>the way it does it because at first, like you're like, okay,

390
00:21:26.319 --> 00:21:28.240
<v Speaker 4>we definitely get the impression of the sky's of Crispin

391
00:21:28.279 --> 00:21:32.240
<v Speaker 4>through Vietnam and he has he'll hallucinate like a like

392
00:21:32.279 --> 00:21:35.720
<v Speaker 4>a severed foot and like a meat section of a

393
00:21:35.759 --> 00:21:38.240
<v Speaker 4>grocery store and to a wall of bombs, which I

394
00:21:38.279 --> 00:21:40.640
<v Speaker 4>looked up which was a very popular chain of grocery

395
00:21:40.680 --> 00:21:43.640
<v Speaker 4>stores in New York that went out that got bought

396
00:21:43.720 --> 00:21:45.920
<v Speaker 4>up and absorbed by A and P and then that clothes.

397
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<v Speaker 4>So that was sad. I love old business history. But

398
00:21:50.720 --> 00:21:54.240
<v Speaker 4>but you're like, okay, he's probably it's PTSD, and then

399
00:21:54.240 --> 00:21:55.519
<v Speaker 4>by the time you get to the end, you're like,

400
00:21:55.640 --> 00:21:59.079
<v Speaker 4>it's PTSD, all right, but you realize the severity of it.

401
00:21:59.240 --> 00:22:01.400
<v Speaker 4>I do feel like it is a statement film, though,

402
00:22:01.440 --> 00:22:03.960
<v Speaker 4>because I definitely feel like it's very it is anti war,

403
00:22:05.039 --> 00:22:08.960
<v Speaker 4>and that's and sadly because humanity we can ever learn

404
00:22:09.000 --> 00:22:12.559
<v Speaker 4>our lessons and species like, because I do get it's

405
00:22:12.559 --> 00:22:15.200
<v Speaker 4>not it doesn't get lost in some dated rhetoric, which

406
00:22:15.240 --> 00:22:17.920
<v Speaker 4>can be a problem with some films. The time, it's

407
00:22:17.960 --> 00:22:21.640
<v Speaker 4>almost it's got just a universal universal message and way

408
00:22:21.759 --> 00:22:25.000
<v Speaker 4>with that, but it's his whole speech about people in

409
00:22:25.039 --> 00:22:29.440
<v Speaker 4>the bubbles and referring to cars as herds and all

410
00:22:29.480 --> 00:22:31.440
<v Speaker 4>of this, and it's like, and it's always because people,

411
00:22:32.119 --> 00:22:33.880
<v Speaker 4>you know, every day, people just go on in their

412
00:22:33.880 --> 00:22:35.480
<v Speaker 4>lives and as long as they're in the bubble and

413
00:22:35.519 --> 00:22:37.720
<v Speaker 4>they don't have to, they don't have it in their shores,

414
00:22:38.599 --> 00:22:41.839
<v Speaker 4>it's like it doesn't exist. And that's that's sad. That's

415
00:22:41.880 --> 00:22:45.680
<v Speaker 4>applicable I think any period of time. Again, unfortunately, because

416
00:22:45.720 --> 00:22:48.920
<v Speaker 4>that's also how bad things really sneak up on people.

417
00:22:48.960 --> 00:22:52.920
<v Speaker 4>They don't think. It's like awareness is good just in general.

418
00:22:53.119 --> 00:22:56.279
<v Speaker 4>But the way everything is interconnected, I wouldn't say this

419
00:22:56.359 --> 00:22:59.400
<v Speaker 4>is like a perfect film. It's a little draggy in parts,

420
00:22:59.440 --> 00:23:03.440
<v Speaker 4>particularly the middle section, but there is a power to it.

421
00:23:03.519 --> 00:23:05.519
<v Speaker 4>I love I love bed your whole thing of a

422
00:23:05.759 --> 00:23:09.319
<v Speaker 4>circle of hell. That's definitely very present. But but if

423
00:23:09.359 --> 00:23:12.680
<v Speaker 4>the way it's done is initially incredibly subtle, it's so

424
00:23:12.759 --> 00:23:15.640
<v Speaker 4>easy for anybody doing this kind of message to to

425
00:23:15.799 --> 00:23:17.960
<v Speaker 4>just go full tilt boogie and just go over the

426
00:23:17.960 --> 00:23:21.680
<v Speaker 4>top with it, and instead he pulls back, and some

427
00:23:21.799 --> 00:23:26.000
<v Speaker 4>of it's interlaced with like surrealist imagery, it's interlaced with

428
00:23:26.200 --> 00:23:30.599
<v Speaker 4>these weird bits of vaudeville and old showbized kind of

429
00:23:30.680 --> 00:23:33.480
<v Speaker 4>razzle dazzle, But in a way, by the time you

430
00:23:33.480 --> 00:23:35.160
<v Speaker 4>get to the end, that almost makes it more powerful,

431
00:23:35.200 --> 00:23:37.039
<v Speaker 4>because I think the danger if you show all of

432
00:23:37.079 --> 00:23:39.519
<v Speaker 4>your cards at once from the beginning, by the time

433
00:23:39.559 --> 00:23:42.880
<v Speaker 4>you get to the powerful ending, your numb You see,

434
00:23:42.880 --> 00:23:45.599
<v Speaker 4>there's that that that that chance of being overexposed as

435
00:23:45.599 --> 00:23:48.920
<v Speaker 4>a viewer. The way this film does it is really

436
00:23:48.960 --> 00:23:51.960
<v Speaker 4>fascinating and it is really powerful because it is it

437
00:23:52.039 --> 00:23:53.480
<v Speaker 4>ends up being quite the gut punch.

438
00:23:54.160 --> 00:23:57.680
<v Speaker 2>You know. We mentioned some characters that show up multiple times,

439
00:23:57.799 --> 00:24:01.960
<v Speaker 2>and there's also like he goes in towards the beginning

440
00:24:02.119 --> 00:24:06.240
<v Speaker 2>to movie company and he's got a script and everything,

441
00:24:06.839 --> 00:24:09.680
<v Speaker 2>that guy who runs the movie company. He comes back

442
00:24:09.759 --> 00:24:13.359
<v Speaker 2>multiple times. But the one I really noticed was Bonnie Inch,

443
00:24:13.599 --> 00:24:17.240
<v Speaker 2>who she seems to show up at least three times.

444
00:24:17.279 --> 00:24:20.920
<v Speaker 2>I think she might be in that kind of adultish

445
00:24:21.160 --> 00:24:25.319
<v Speaker 2>film towards the beginning where it's she's got a rose

446
00:24:25.720 --> 00:24:26.319
<v Speaker 2>on her end.

447
00:24:26.240 --> 00:24:29.160
<v Speaker 1>She's got the rose tattoo, and she's in the Orange

448
00:24:29.240 --> 00:24:33.599
<v Speaker 1>Julius Diner, which happens immediately before that scene. She definitely

449
00:24:33.640 --> 00:24:38.559
<v Speaker 1>returns in the Western Dina soda joint and she's serving

450
00:24:38.599 --> 00:24:44.039
<v Speaker 1>him in the supermarket as well. With eleven I think

451
00:24:44.039 --> 00:24:47.079
<v Speaker 1>it was yep, yeah, so there's at least goes four.

452
00:24:47.680 --> 00:24:50.720
<v Speaker 2>Her only other credited role was another William Sachs film,

453
00:24:50.759 --> 00:24:53.359
<v Speaker 2>with The Incredible Melting Man, where she played a nurse.

454
00:24:53.480 --> 00:24:56.480
<v Speaker 2>And that's it. That was her film career. But yeah,

455
00:24:56.519 --> 00:24:59.559
<v Speaker 2>she shows up multiple times in here, and I'm just like, Okay,

456
00:24:59.599 --> 00:25:01.680
<v Speaker 2>what the she have to do with this? And then

457
00:25:01.680 --> 00:25:03.759
<v Speaker 2>at first I thought I was like, well, is she

458
00:25:04.359 --> 00:25:08.720
<v Speaker 2>like Girls one, three through ten or something like what

459
00:25:09.039 --> 00:25:09.400
<v Speaker 2>is this?

460
00:25:09.599 --> 00:25:12.559
<v Speaker 1>But she was. She was so much woman. She was

461
00:25:12.599 --> 00:25:15.039
<v Speaker 1>all not the first nine or something to find stand.

462
00:25:16.000 --> 00:25:17.279
<v Speaker 2>Just rolled all into one.

463
00:25:17.519 --> 00:25:19.200
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, what's cool, it's her.

464
00:25:19.519 --> 00:25:22.680
<v Speaker 4>The ask Tattoo in the credits a Spider Webb, who

465
00:25:22.759 --> 00:25:27.119
<v Speaker 4>was this really renowned like pat who are in New

466
00:25:27.200 --> 00:25:30.279
<v Speaker 4>York operating when that was illegal? Like he was like

467
00:25:30.319 --> 00:25:35.000
<v Speaker 4>a cool, counterproachful underground figure who also with more classic

468
00:25:35.039 --> 00:25:37.720
<v Speaker 4>adult connections here. I was good friends with people like

469
00:25:37.799 --> 00:25:39.039
<v Speaker 4>Annie Sprinkle.

470
00:25:39.079 --> 00:25:42.519
<v Speaker 1>I had here. Rosey's credited the Spider Web, who appeared

471
00:25:42.519 --> 00:25:45.920
<v Speaker 1>in Albert Jacoma's nineteen eighty eight VHS film titled Tattoo

472
00:25:46.000 --> 00:25:49.559
<v Speaker 1>Vampire and appeared in nineteen seventy five's SOS Screw on

473
00:25:49.599 --> 00:25:53.200
<v Speaker 1>the Screen, which Ralph Bode was also director of photography on.

474
00:25:53.400 --> 00:25:56.480
<v Speaker 4>Oh My God and I Love Screw on Screen. SOS

475
00:25:56.720 --> 00:26:01.039
<v Speaker 4>is a fun if anybody likes countercultural era friends like

476
00:26:01.160 --> 00:26:04.000
<v Speaker 4>that film has hardcore in it. It's it's not erotic.

477
00:26:04.119 --> 00:26:06.839
<v Speaker 4>I mean it's Screw Magazine made it. Okay, let's just

478
00:26:06.920 --> 00:26:09.359
<v Speaker 4>tell you every right there, but it's it is a

479
00:26:09.559 --> 00:26:12.319
<v Speaker 4>lot of fun. I started funding online and see if

480
00:26:12.319 --> 00:26:14.319
<v Speaker 4>there was like a copy of Tattoo Vampire because I

481
00:26:15.119 --> 00:26:17.519
<v Speaker 4>saw that too, Like, I have to see this because

482
00:26:17.559 --> 00:26:20.960
<v Speaker 4>I love I love shot on video Horror. It shares

483
00:26:21.000 --> 00:26:24.079
<v Speaker 4>a title with a great blue Oyster cult song. I

484
00:26:24.519 --> 00:26:26.799
<v Speaker 4>must see this. So if anybody can get a line

485
00:26:26.799 --> 00:26:27.160
<v Speaker 4>on that.

486
00:26:27.160 --> 00:26:30.160
<v Speaker 1>Let us know. This is the hard to find empathization

487
00:26:30.279 --> 00:26:33.200
<v Speaker 1>in general that I was. I justified Williams. Sax's first

488
00:26:33.279 --> 00:26:34.960
<v Speaker 1>three short films and like not.

489
00:26:35.480 --> 00:26:38.240
<v Speaker 2>I found that interesting because there was an interview with

490
00:26:38.359 --> 00:26:42.480
<v Speaker 2>him by I think it's Christopher Olsen where he says

491
00:26:42.759 --> 00:26:45.279
<v Speaker 2>this is Sax says, I started making films in the

492
00:26:45.319 --> 00:26:47.720
<v Speaker 2>London Film School, which was called the London School of

493
00:26:47.799 --> 00:26:50.480
<v Speaker 2>Film Technique at the time. I was there one year

494
00:26:50.480 --> 00:26:53.480
<v Speaker 2>and made three short films. The first was Dear Missus Smith,

495
00:26:53.519 --> 00:26:56.440
<v Speaker 2>a three minute film about an injured soldier. He is

496
00:26:56.480 --> 00:26:58.920
<v Speaker 2>picked up on a stretcher, carried for a short distance,

497
00:26:58.920 --> 00:27:01.680
<v Speaker 2>and lowered into a pine box. The soldiers bring the lid.

498
00:27:01.920 --> 00:27:04.880
<v Speaker 2>When the lid is lowered, everything goes black. The entire

499
00:27:04.920 --> 00:27:07.359
<v Speaker 2>film was one shot from the POV of the dead

500
00:27:07.400 --> 00:27:10.759
<v Speaker 2>soldier that's in this movie. I don't know if he

501
00:27:10.920 --> 00:27:13.680
<v Speaker 2>just reused his own film, but that sequence is in

502
00:27:13.720 --> 00:27:17.480
<v Speaker 2>this film. Like there's the two soldiers, the one skinny

503
00:27:17.559 --> 00:27:20.400
<v Speaker 2>guy and the other guy who seems a little older,

504
00:27:20.400 --> 00:27:22.720
<v Speaker 2>and he's got the cigarettes, and he offers the cigarette

505
00:27:22.759 --> 00:27:25.119
<v Speaker 2>to the younger guy. Like that whole sequence is in

506
00:27:25.119 --> 00:27:25.720
<v Speaker 2>this film.

507
00:27:26.200 --> 00:27:29.720
<v Speaker 1>He has a tendency to cycle back around in interesting ways.

508
00:27:29.920 --> 00:27:32.319
<v Speaker 1>I heard and curt An interview where you mentioned that

509
00:27:32.680 --> 00:27:36.480
<v Speaker 1>he actually remade Breakfast at like a seventeen minute film,

510
00:27:36.920 --> 00:27:40.119
<v Speaker 1>and I he was in San Francisco, and I was

511
00:27:40.200 --> 00:27:40.480
<v Speaker 1>just like.

512
00:27:40.440 --> 00:27:40.920
<v Speaker 4>Where you mean.

513
00:27:40.960 --> 00:27:44.279
<v Speaker 1>There's two Breakfast short films that I kind of find.

514
00:27:44.640 --> 00:27:48.200
<v Speaker 2>Breakfast about a US space capsule that lands on another planet.

515
00:27:48.240 --> 00:27:51.319
<v Speaker 2>A giant pregnant woman picks it up, cracks it over

516
00:27:51.400 --> 00:27:54.599
<v Speaker 2>the frying pan and a double yolked egg balls out

517
00:27:54.640 --> 00:27:57.799
<v Speaker 2>and cooks while the star spangled banner plays. This film

518
00:27:57.839 --> 00:27:59.960
<v Speaker 2>won a lot of prizes at film festivals.

519
00:28:00.200 --> 00:28:02.960
<v Speaker 1>They must have been circulating it through like the school

520
00:28:03.039 --> 00:28:05.640
<v Speaker 1>circulating it, because in an interview I listened to, he

521
00:28:05.880 --> 00:28:08.000
<v Speaker 1>said he was already back in America when it was

522
00:28:08.000 --> 00:28:10.960
<v Speaker 1>blowing up at festivals in Europe, and he was trying

523
00:28:10.960 --> 00:28:13.200
<v Speaker 1>to get back there, and it ended up in Mexico

524
00:28:13.359 --> 00:28:16.519
<v Speaker 1>for a bit, and then San Francisco or vice versa,

525
00:28:17.000 --> 00:28:19.359
<v Speaker 1>and I don't know. He then managed to get back

526
00:28:19.359 --> 00:28:21.920
<v Speaker 1>to Rome. That's when he started working there. Like the

527
00:28:22.440 --> 00:28:25.359
<v Speaker 1>stories that this guy has, trying to keep track of

528
00:28:25.400 --> 00:28:28.759
<v Speaker 1>them all is just like nuts. Because the reason he

529
00:28:28.839 --> 00:28:31.880
<v Speaker 1>ended up in London was because he was in business

530
00:28:31.880 --> 00:28:35.960
<v Speaker 1>school and he hated it. So he got kicked out

531
00:28:36.039 --> 00:28:40.880
<v Speaker 1>because he hypnotized somebody and then couldn't dehypnotize that. They

532
00:28:40.920 --> 00:28:42.960
<v Speaker 1>were like, it's actually illegal to do that, so we

533
00:28:43.119 --> 00:28:46.400
<v Speaker 1>have to punish you. And so he like bailed on

534
00:28:46.519 --> 00:28:48.960
<v Speaker 1>that and then joined the Air Force before this, before

535
00:28:49.039 --> 00:28:50.920
<v Speaker 1>Vietnam had kicked off, and he joined the Air Force

536
00:28:50.920 --> 00:28:52.559
<v Speaker 1>because I want to go and have adventures. I want

537
00:28:52.559 --> 00:28:55.240
<v Speaker 1>to be a writer, and you figured, like, that's the

538
00:28:55.279 --> 00:28:56.640
<v Speaker 1>easy way, and eat. The one thing I don't want

539
00:28:56.640 --> 00:28:58.039
<v Speaker 1>to do is be a medic because I hate all

540
00:28:58.039 --> 00:29:00.799
<v Speaker 1>like the blood and guts and everything, which is particularly

541
00:29:00.839 --> 00:29:04.559
<v Speaker 1>ironic given his philographic and the like. But he found

542
00:29:04.599 --> 00:29:06.640
<v Speaker 1>out if he did really well in the courses, then

543
00:29:06.680 --> 00:29:09.039
<v Speaker 1>you could choose where he went to next, like for

544
00:29:09.079 --> 00:29:12.200
<v Speaker 1>the second year, and so he went to London. And

545
00:29:12.319 --> 00:29:13.960
<v Speaker 1>the first thing that happened to him when he got

546
00:29:14.000 --> 00:29:18.480
<v Speaker 1>to London was the mortuary scene in this film where

547
00:29:18.680 --> 00:29:22.920
<v Speaker 1>he was sent to go and footprint to the Prince

548
00:29:23.039 --> 00:29:27.079
<v Speaker 1>of a foot of a pilot who had crashed their plane.

549
00:29:27.519 --> 00:29:32.079
<v Speaker 1>And they always did prints of pilot's feet because quite

550
00:29:32.119 --> 00:29:35.119
<v Speaker 1>often the only thing that survived was the feet in

551
00:29:35.200 --> 00:29:38.000
<v Speaker 1>the boots. And so he was standing and the guy

552
00:29:38.039 --> 00:29:40.160
<v Speaker 1>gets there and he's, okay, where's this guy? I've got

553
00:29:40.160 --> 00:29:42.720
<v Speaker 1>a footprinted. Oh it's in the sink and it's just

554
00:29:42.759 --> 00:29:46.319
<v Speaker 1>like a sink full of formealdide with a foot in it. He's, oh, okay,

555
00:29:46.519 --> 00:29:49.000
<v Speaker 1>can I have two pairs of gloves? And the guy's no,

556
00:29:49.359 --> 00:29:51.599
<v Speaker 1>it's cleaner than dinner plate. It's fine. I mean it's

557
00:29:51.599 --> 00:29:54.720
<v Speaker 1>in for mal diy it's just like, basically most of

558
00:29:54.759 --> 00:29:57.200
<v Speaker 1>that scene that's in the film really happened to him,

559
00:29:57.400 --> 00:30:00.400
<v Speaker 1>and he attributes that to being his interest in body

560
00:30:00.440 --> 00:30:03.200
<v Speaker 1>and pieces kind of stuff, which does recur a lot

561
00:30:03.200 --> 00:30:06.680
<v Speaker 1>in these films and in the recurring kind of thing.

562
00:30:06.759 --> 00:30:10.240
<v Speaker 1>Like I'm not a big fan of Incredible Melting Man.

563
00:30:10.079 --> 00:30:12.839
<v Speaker 9>But oh my god, part of me would love to

564
00:30:12.880 --> 00:30:16.720
<v Speaker 9>see an edit where you edit in everything of There

565
00:30:16.799 --> 00:30:20.519
<v Speaker 9>Is No Thirteen as the internal world of the Melting.

566
00:30:20.160 --> 00:30:23.119
<v Speaker 1>Man, because that's what it feels like, that this person

567
00:30:23.119 --> 00:30:25.680
<v Speaker 1>who's being sent off on a mission and comes back

568
00:30:26.240 --> 00:30:32.240
<v Speaker 1>disintegrated and is towing through all these chaotic, like interconnected

569
00:30:32.440 --> 00:30:36.559
<v Speaker 1>pieces of fantasy and memory and everything, and there was

570
00:30:36.640 --> 00:30:39.359
<v Speaker 1>something that he was he did keep coming back to

571
00:30:40.519 --> 00:30:42.000
<v Speaker 1>with that, which is fascinating.

572
00:30:42.519 --> 00:30:46.200
<v Speaker 4>His filmography is fascinating because like when I after watched Guests,

573
00:30:46.240 --> 00:30:47.960
<v Speaker 4>I was looking up and I'm like, I know, like

574
00:30:48.799 --> 00:30:51.960
<v Speaker 4>William Sacks, I'm like, oh my god, it's Van Dies Boulevard,

575
00:30:52.839 --> 00:30:55.240
<v Speaker 4>which I long, I do love that movie, but that

576
00:30:55.400 --> 00:30:57.359
<v Speaker 4>is do you want to talk about a million miles

577
00:30:57.400 --> 00:30:59.799
<v Speaker 4>away like the man that gave us the film that

578
00:31:00.559 --> 00:31:05.000
<v Speaker 4>gifted us characters like a choot, because nobody everybody's watched this,

579
00:31:05.119 --> 00:31:07.599
<v Speaker 4>they'll get this. Nobody calls to to creep man, but

580
00:31:08.000 --> 00:31:10.759
<v Speaker 4>it's fantaised boulevard. It's a lot of fun. That is

581
00:31:10.799 --> 00:31:12.880
<v Speaker 4>bizarre to me. It's almost like if if the only

582
00:31:12.880 --> 00:31:15.799
<v Speaker 4>thing you'd seen of Robert Downey Senior was readed lips

583
00:31:16.200 --> 00:31:20.839
<v Speaker 4>like it's it's weird, very weird. Somebody like maybe somebody

584
00:31:20.839 --> 00:31:24.079
<v Speaker 4>should do like we're getting a lot of like more

585
00:31:24.079 --> 00:31:27.440
<v Speaker 4>obscure filmmakers and directors on Tourist getting their due with

586
00:31:27.519 --> 00:31:30.519
<v Speaker 4>these sets like on Blue Ray. It'd be guice for

587
00:31:30.640 --> 00:31:33.720
<v Speaker 4>something for Sax. We still have him that to sound.

588
00:31:33.480 --> 00:31:36.839
<v Speaker 2>More fid We don't though, I believe that.

589
00:31:37.359 --> 00:31:40.839
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it was pancreatic cancer. I know, damn it passed,

590
00:31:41.759 --> 00:31:43.880
<v Speaker 1>but I was always pancreatic cancer. I was not surprised.

591
00:31:43.920 --> 00:31:45.400
<v Speaker 1>That's that shit will take you in a minute.

592
00:31:45.440 --> 00:31:46.759
<v Speaker 4>Well never mind.

593
00:31:46.960 --> 00:31:48.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah him and Mark Damon, Yeah, I know. I was

594
00:31:48.960 --> 00:31:54.319
<v Speaker 2>very surprised because I had been in contact with Sacks

595
00:31:54.359 --> 00:31:56.880
<v Speaker 2>several times over the last few years. I wrote the

596
00:31:56.920 --> 00:31:59.599
<v Speaker 2>liner notes for Incredible Melting Man, which I also agree

597
00:31:59.720 --> 00:32:01.799
<v Speaker 2>is not the greatest film. But I asked him some

598
00:32:01.920 --> 00:32:05.200
<v Speaker 2>questions about it, and then he was he was just

599
00:32:05.279 --> 00:32:08.319
<v Speaker 2>being kind of a prick about stuff. Like I was

600
00:32:08.359 --> 00:32:11.400
<v Speaker 2>trying to line up an interview with him for survival

601
00:32:11.440 --> 00:32:13.720
<v Speaker 2>of the film Freaks, the documentary I helped produce a

602
00:32:13.720 --> 00:32:17.920
<v Speaker 2>few years ago, and he was like, no, you're way

603
00:32:17.960 --> 00:32:21.279
<v Speaker 2>too political and way too open about your political views.

604
00:32:21.319 --> 00:32:23.039
<v Speaker 2>And I was just like, he was like, you post

605
00:32:23.079 --> 00:32:25.000
<v Speaker 2>too much on your page and I was like, yeah,

606
00:32:25.000 --> 00:32:26.799
<v Speaker 2>but it's my page. I can post whatever the hell

607
00:32:26.839 --> 00:32:29.160
<v Speaker 2>I want. He was like no, no, like, don't do

608
00:32:29.279 --> 00:32:31.680
<v Speaker 2>that kind of thing. And I was like what And

609
00:32:31.720 --> 00:32:34.119
<v Speaker 2>he was like and plus you, what was it like?

610
00:32:34.240 --> 00:32:36.920
<v Speaker 2>You don't have voices from both sides? And I was

611
00:32:36.960 --> 00:32:40.680
<v Speaker 2>just like yeah, because I I just eliminate anybody who

612
00:32:40.720 --> 00:32:43.519
<v Speaker 2>is a Trump supporter. I'm sorry, but I can't handle

613
00:32:43.599 --> 00:32:47.440
<v Speaker 2>people that are trying to, you know, openly put down

614
00:32:47.599 --> 00:32:50.119
<v Speaker 2>people who I love, you know, people who I care about.

615
00:32:50.160 --> 00:32:53.359
<v Speaker 2>Like if your whole political basis is based on hate,

616
00:32:53.799 --> 00:32:57.240
<v Speaker 2>I can't really support you. I'm sorry. So we got

617
00:32:57.240 --> 00:32:59.279
<v Speaker 2>into this whole back and forth about how much he

618
00:32:59.319 --> 00:33:01.279
<v Speaker 2>loves to argue, and I was just like, yeah, I'd

619
00:33:01.359 --> 00:33:04.480
<v Speaker 2>rather not argue about things. It was that whole almost

620
00:33:04.799 --> 00:33:07.880
<v Speaker 2>debate me broke kind of thing, and I was just like, yeah, thanks,

621
00:33:07.920 --> 00:33:10.039
<v Speaker 2>mister Sachs, I'm kind of done talking with you. But

622
00:33:10.079 --> 00:33:12.359
<v Speaker 2>then I was like, well, maybe i'll ask him if

623
00:33:12.400 --> 00:33:14.039
<v Speaker 2>he wants to be back on this episode. And I

624
00:33:14.079 --> 00:33:16.599
<v Speaker 2>went to look and I was like, oh, yeah, he's dead. Whoops.

625
00:33:17.400 --> 00:33:20.200
<v Speaker 4>We call it the tall matter of effect in our house,

626
00:33:20.279 --> 00:33:23.920
<v Speaker 4>where there are certain people that you think are still

627
00:33:23.960 --> 00:33:26.519
<v Speaker 4>alive for whatever reason, and then all of a sudden

628
00:33:26.519 --> 00:33:28.359
<v Speaker 4>you'll be like, oh shit, I died a fe years ago.

629
00:33:28.559 --> 00:33:30.200
<v Speaker 4>But then there are people that you think are dead,

630
00:33:30.880 --> 00:33:33.720
<v Speaker 4>and then you still see something and you're like, oh

631
00:33:33.759 --> 00:33:35.519
<v Speaker 4>my god, they're alive, and then you feel terrible.

632
00:33:36.319 --> 00:33:39.599
<v Speaker 1>How did Gary Busey outlive? Wingshauser? How did that happen?

633
00:33:39.720 --> 00:33:41.559
<v Speaker 4>You want to talk about it. I'm still grieving. I

634
00:33:41.599 --> 00:33:42.599
<v Speaker 4>love wings Houser.

635
00:33:43.119 --> 00:33:44.920
<v Speaker 1>I only found out yesterday and the first thing I

636
00:33:44.920 --> 00:33:48.440
<v Speaker 1>did was like, wait, Gary Busey is still alive? Is he? Heat?

637
00:33:48.599 --> 00:33:49.920
<v Speaker 1>My god? How did that happen?

638
00:33:50.400 --> 00:33:52.319
<v Speaker 4>Beersey's got out love as well. He's got to be

639
00:33:52.319 --> 00:33:55.759
<v Speaker 4>like the Keith Richards of character actors, Like it's where

640
00:33:55.880 --> 00:33:58.640
<v Speaker 4>the Collective of conscience though, where like there are just

641
00:33:58.680 --> 00:34:01.119
<v Speaker 4>certain people like that. Hearing that, he was like an

642
00:34:01.200 --> 00:34:04.440
<v Speaker 4>argument bro though, because I can't. Oh, I can't deal

643
00:34:04.480 --> 00:34:05.400
<v Speaker 4>with that kind of person.

644
00:34:05.839 --> 00:34:08.400
<v Speaker 1>It's just really funny because listening to him talk for

645
00:34:08.400 --> 00:34:10.639
<v Speaker 1>about half an hour'll be like, oh, God, this guy's

646
00:34:10.639 --> 00:34:14.079
<v Speaker 1>a pritt, and then the other half hour I'm like, oh, man,

647
00:34:14.119 --> 00:34:16.559
<v Speaker 1>I completely understand where he's coming from and why he's

648
00:34:16.559 --> 00:34:18.840
<v Speaker 1>a prick. And really I think I would have got

649
00:34:18.840 --> 00:34:20.599
<v Speaker 1>along with him. Really the next hour there like, ah,

650
00:34:20.599 --> 00:34:24.400
<v Speaker 1>he's a prick. Oh, he's definitely had a strange life.

651
00:34:24.400 --> 00:34:26.039
<v Speaker 1>There was a lot of stuff in this was like, well,

652
00:34:26.079 --> 00:34:29.280
<v Speaker 1>this sounds and feels familiar of like having been in

653
00:34:29.320 --> 00:34:31.920
<v Speaker 1>a lot of places, but it never clicking over into

654
00:34:31.960 --> 00:34:36.000
<v Speaker 1>more than this side stuff. And then just the fact

655
00:34:36.280 --> 00:34:38.280
<v Speaker 1>that one of the interviews where he was talking about

656
00:34:38.320 --> 00:34:42.440
<v Speaker 1>how he liked being a film doctor more, which we

657
00:34:42.519 --> 00:34:44.960
<v Speaker 1>haven't mentioned yet for those who don't know. Film doctors

658
00:34:44.960 --> 00:34:46.880
<v Speaker 1>are the people that they call in to fix the

659
00:34:46.920 --> 00:34:50.280
<v Speaker 1>film and it's gone wrong, the producers are unhappy or whatever.

660
00:34:51.280 --> 00:34:55.199
<v Speaker 1>And he apparently with a very successful and popular and

661
00:34:55.239 --> 00:34:58.280
<v Speaker 1>widely used film doctor. And there's a couple of them

662
00:34:58.320 --> 00:35:00.800
<v Speaker 1>we know of, most of them being they won't reveal

663
00:35:01.000 --> 00:35:03.280
<v Speaker 1>what they were obviously, and he said that he actually

664
00:35:03.320 --> 00:35:06.079
<v Speaker 1>preferred being a film doctor because the producers left you

665
00:35:06.119 --> 00:35:08.320
<v Speaker 1>alone and he could just get on with the job

666
00:35:08.360 --> 00:35:11.440
<v Speaker 1>and do it without people messing about. Because to the producers,

667
00:35:11.480 --> 00:35:14.480
<v Speaker 1>the disaster had already happened and he was the trusted

668
00:35:14.480 --> 00:35:18.159
<v Speaker 1>person to fix it. But he was the filmmaker, then

669
00:35:18.199 --> 00:35:20.679
<v Speaker 1>the producers would never leave him alone, and that'll always

670
00:35:20.679 --> 00:35:23.480
<v Speaker 1>be getting into it and making his life difficult and hard.

671
00:35:23.639 --> 00:35:26.400
<v Speaker 1>And he didn't work well with people doing that day

672
00:35:26.519 --> 00:35:30.599
<v Speaker 1>that style, and so oh man, like you the amount

673
00:35:30.599 --> 00:35:35.159
<v Speaker 1>of therapy that he probably didn't do to deal with

674
00:35:35.280 --> 00:35:39.000
<v Speaker 1>being the person who he should hate. Like he's to

675
00:35:39.039 --> 00:35:40.880
<v Speaker 1>get to do the job that he wants to do,

676
00:35:40.960 --> 00:35:43.199
<v Speaker 1>he has to be the person who fucked up other

677
00:35:43.239 --> 00:35:46.320
<v Speaker 1>people's films, and like he maybe saved a couple of films, sure,

678
00:35:46.360 --> 00:35:50.559
<v Speaker 1>but like the psychic kind of that's that'll that'll do

679
00:35:50.679 --> 00:35:53.039
<v Speaker 1>bad things to your head, like living for like that

680
00:35:53.199 --> 00:35:56.440
<v Speaker 1>of thirty forty years. It's not I don't envy him

681
00:35:56.679 --> 00:35:59.079
<v Speaker 1>at all. And there's so much stuff where it was

682
00:35:59.119 --> 00:36:02.280
<v Speaker 1>like taking off here and redone this way and redone

683
00:36:02.280 --> 00:36:04.159
<v Speaker 1>that way, like to the point where it's almost like

684
00:36:04.679 --> 00:36:07.320
<v Speaker 1>every film is a different example of how you can

685
00:36:07.360 --> 00:36:10.519
<v Speaker 1>be screwed over as an acre, whether it's like completely

686
00:36:10.599 --> 00:36:14.400
<v Speaker 1>re editing it in the process or judgment aka Hit

687
00:36:15.079 --> 00:36:18.239
<v Speaker 1>with a Z, which was just like relabeled and promote

688
00:36:18.280 --> 00:36:21.239
<v Speaker 1>as a gang film Postboys in the Hood success because

689
00:36:21.239 --> 00:36:22.920
<v Speaker 1>I had a young Cuba Gooding Junior in it, but

690
00:36:23.119 --> 00:36:26.440
<v Speaker 1>is actually like a satire about the legal system and judges,

691
00:36:26.880 --> 00:36:30.239
<v Speaker 1>which has a scene where Elliott Gould hypnotizes Karen Black

692
00:36:30.239 --> 00:36:33.519
<v Speaker 1>and they can't dehypnotize it because he took that he's fans.

693
00:36:34.000 --> 00:36:36.239
<v Speaker 1>But anyways, anyway, I gotta find Hit. When I saw,

694
00:36:36.480 --> 00:36:39.119
<v Speaker 1>I'm like, I'm looking at it like nineteen ninety two,

695
00:36:39.480 --> 00:36:42.239
<v Speaker 1>Elliott girled, Karen Black, Cuba Goody Junior. What were they?

696
00:36:42.360 --> 00:36:42.559
<v Speaker 2>Oh?

697
00:36:42.599 --> 00:36:44.320
<v Speaker 1>It was actually made in nineteen eighty seven and then

698
00:36:44.360 --> 00:36:47.440
<v Speaker 1>only released because YadA, YadA, YadA. You know, he got

699
00:36:47.440 --> 00:36:51.039
<v Speaker 1>screwed over so many different ways. And he does seem

700
00:36:51.079 --> 00:36:55.599
<v Speaker 1>like he was a genuinely interesting, thoughtful person who really

701
00:36:55.719 --> 00:36:59.800
<v Speaker 1>was doing some quite genuinely avant garde stuff, working with

702
00:37:00.400 --> 00:37:03.519
<v Speaker 1>techniques and materials and things way ahead of its time,

703
00:37:04.119 --> 00:37:07.639
<v Speaker 1>and he just licked out the fart crack of history.

704
00:37:07.920 --> 00:37:09.719
<v Speaker 2>Well, at least we'll always have Galaxina.

705
00:37:10.239 --> 00:37:13.039
<v Speaker 1>I only watched that for the first time. I think

706
00:37:13.039 --> 00:37:15.239
<v Speaker 1>the only sex film i'd see I seven seen Venue

707
00:37:15.360 --> 00:37:18.960
<v Speaker 1>is Boulevard, the only sax film i'd seen up until

708
00:37:19.119 --> 00:37:21.480
<v Speaker 1>Really I'm trying to find it, but in Australia it's

709
00:37:21.519 --> 00:37:24.199
<v Speaker 1>not here yet. I was thinking, will melt him? And

710
00:37:26.079 --> 00:37:29.280
<v Speaker 1>I've watched recently Galaxina and I watched The Force Beyond?

711
00:37:29.760 --> 00:37:32.599
<v Speaker 1>Have You Been The Force Beyond? Aka Secrets of the Gods.

712
00:37:33.480 --> 00:37:39.639
<v Speaker 1>So it's his nineteen seventies paranormal documentary about aliens and

713
00:37:39.719 --> 00:37:44.199
<v Speaker 1>Bigfoot and conspiracy stuff. And I was watching and I

714
00:37:44.239 --> 00:37:47.039
<v Speaker 1>was like, this is incredible, And it took me until

715
00:37:47.039 --> 00:37:49.760
<v Speaker 1>halfway through to realize that it was a satire. He

716
00:37:49.840 --> 00:37:51.760
<v Speaker 1>was actually making fun of all the people, and it

717
00:37:51.880 --> 00:37:54.800
<v Speaker 1>was like, oh, sorry, I have twenty first century brain

718
00:37:54.880 --> 00:37:58.800
<v Speaker 1>and you can't tell the difference anymore. This feels normal.

719
00:37:58.880 --> 00:38:01.760
<v Speaker 1>This is the way that will talk normally about this stuff,

720
00:38:01.960 --> 00:38:05.639
<v Speaker 1>like a giant like green fond comes off diagonally a

721
00:38:05.719 --> 00:38:09.239
<v Speaker 1>couple of screens like big Food Country or something like

722
00:38:09.840 --> 00:38:11.639
<v Speaker 1>what is going on? And it was he was just

723
00:38:11.679 --> 00:38:14.920
<v Speaker 1>like the way he slid from talking about UFOs, Bigfoot

724
00:38:14.960 --> 00:38:17.800
<v Speaker 1>and everything at the time would have been slightly more

725
00:38:17.960 --> 00:38:20.679
<v Speaker 1>like crazy and weird, whereas now it's oh no, he's like,

726
00:38:20.960 --> 00:38:22.840
<v Speaker 1>why aren't you talking about Jack the Ripper two? But

727
00:38:23.039 --> 00:38:27.639
<v Speaker 1>it's really fun and ridiculous and silly. And so then

728
00:38:27.639 --> 00:38:29.639
<v Speaker 1>I watched after that, so I watched Galaxina, and I

729
00:38:29.679 --> 00:38:32.760
<v Speaker 1>was like, Okay, you know, this is not a great film,

730
00:38:32.800 --> 00:38:36.199
<v Speaker 1>but I'm I feel like I have your comedic vibe

731
00:38:36.679 --> 00:38:39.440
<v Speaker 1>carrying across from that, and was just in the right

732
00:38:39.519 --> 00:38:42.400
<v Speaker 1>groove with Galaxina, and I like one of the interviews

733
00:38:42.440 --> 00:38:44.800
<v Speaker 1>I heard with me, he was saying it like, one

734
00:38:44.840 --> 00:38:47.079
<v Speaker 1>of the characters keep telling these bad jokes, and all

735
00:38:47.079 --> 00:38:49.199
<v Speaker 1>these people thought that they were his bad jokes that

736
00:38:49.239 --> 00:38:51.320
<v Speaker 1>he thought was good, and he's I failed in the

737
00:38:51.320 --> 00:38:53.840
<v Speaker 1>writing at that time because they were meant to be

738
00:38:53.880 --> 00:38:56.119
<v Speaker 1>bad jokes. They weren't meant to be funny, and everybody

739
00:38:56.119 --> 00:38:59.679
<v Speaker 1>thought I was very bad jokes, bad bad jokes. I

740
00:38:59.679 --> 00:39:03.039
<v Speaker 1>feel like that is almost his entire filmography was like, no,

741
00:39:03.159 --> 00:39:06.280
<v Speaker 1>I was making this thing, but I either got screwed

742
00:39:06.320 --> 00:39:08.559
<v Speaker 1>over or screwed it up myself, and I came out

743
00:39:09.159 --> 00:39:14.679
<v Speaker 1>either too serious or too stupid, and you like couldn't

744
00:39:14.719 --> 00:39:17.639
<v Speaker 1>get that balance, and this felt there is no thirteen

745
00:39:18.599 --> 00:39:20.800
<v Speaker 1>I don't think he was looking for the balance there.

746
00:39:20.880 --> 00:39:28.239
<v Speaker 1>But whatever his regurgitation blender, whatever that of his is,

747
00:39:28.440 --> 00:39:31.360
<v Speaker 1>does work in There is no thirteen like it's it's

748
00:39:31.400 --> 00:39:33.760
<v Speaker 1>not about balance. It's not about balance, because anything like that.

749
00:39:33.840 --> 00:39:39.519
<v Speaker 1>It's just like that, the detonation of nostalgia and memories

750
00:39:39.559 --> 00:39:45.559
<v Speaker 1>an Americana through genuinely as an avant garde, like advanced

751
00:39:45.559 --> 00:39:50.119
<v Speaker 1>guard probing into something more. And that's like coming out

752
00:39:50.159 --> 00:39:52.599
<v Speaker 1>of this film. I was like suddenly in Walter Benjamin

753
00:39:52.719 --> 00:39:55.840
<v Speaker 1>and Guide Aboard and The Society of the Spectacle because

754
00:39:55.840 --> 00:39:59.239
<v Speaker 1>it was like, ah, I am struggling to make sense

755
00:39:59.280 --> 00:40:03.400
<v Speaker 1>of all this, but he feels like he's directly responding

756
00:40:03.440 --> 00:40:07.840
<v Speaker 1>to these things. Sorry, how the cat going past? Don't

757
00:40:07.880 --> 00:40:10.840
<v Speaker 1>knock over stuff, don't knock over stuff, like very much responded,

758
00:40:10.880 --> 00:40:13.039
<v Speaker 1>But there was some of the quotes. I'm like, oh man,

759
00:40:13.079 --> 00:40:14.880
<v Speaker 1>I was trying to find my book so I could

760
00:40:14.880 --> 00:40:16.760
<v Speaker 1>make more sense of these, to get the original quotes.

761
00:40:16.800 --> 00:40:20.000
<v Speaker 1>But like in Guide to Board Society of the Spectacle,

762
00:40:20.199 --> 00:40:23.360
<v Speaker 1>he wrote, neither death nor procreation is grasped as a

763
00:40:23.440 --> 00:40:27.880
<v Speaker 1>law of time. Time remains immobile, like an enclosed space,

764
00:40:28.719 --> 00:40:31.960
<v Speaker 1>which feels like that that's a better description of the

765
00:40:32.000 --> 00:40:37.599
<v Speaker 1>plots and offsis sort of film and then.

766
00:40:35.679 --> 00:40:38.639
<v Speaker 2>A man recounts the thirteen women he's had sex with,

767
00:40:38.840 --> 00:40:41.840
<v Speaker 2>which is really not here. I mean, we just get

768
00:40:41.960 --> 00:40:45.119
<v Speaker 2>one scene where he's talking with the one girl and

769
00:40:45.119 --> 00:40:48.920
<v Speaker 2>she's like, oh, give me your body count basically I

770
00:40:48.920 --> 00:40:52.239
<v Speaker 2>don't know, nine, maybe ten, and then she's like, oh, well,

771
00:40:52.239 --> 00:40:54.559
<v Speaker 2>maybe I'll be eleven. I'm like, oh, okay, cool. That's

772
00:40:54.599 --> 00:41:00.000
<v Speaker 2>Margaret Markov. By the way, Margaret Markov and Jean Jennings

773
00:41:00.079 --> 00:41:02.480
<v Speaker 2>look kind of similar to me in this, just because

774
00:41:02.519 --> 00:41:07.079
<v Speaker 2>I guess they're both young blondes, but very very different deliveries.

775
00:41:07.159 --> 00:41:10.760
<v Speaker 2>I have to say Geen Jennings is very much more

776
00:41:10.760 --> 00:41:14.760
<v Speaker 2>sedate than Margaret Markov. But I really need to see

777
00:41:14.840 --> 00:41:17.280
<v Speaker 2>Black Mama, White Mama, because I don't know if I've

778
00:41:17.360 --> 00:41:20.159
<v Speaker 2>ever seen that one, and I know i've seen the arena,

779
00:41:20.280 --> 00:41:23.280
<v Speaker 2>but she was very, very striking. I was really very

780
00:41:23.280 --> 00:41:25.079
<v Speaker 2>taken by Markov when I saw her.

781
00:41:25.239 --> 00:41:27.039
<v Speaker 4>She got that great hair. She was like this, like

782
00:41:27.320 --> 00:41:31.440
<v Speaker 4>this main of just like waistlengthd blonde hair, and she

783
00:41:31.519 --> 00:41:35.760
<v Speaker 4>has great precedence. There's something very kinetic about her that

784
00:41:35.840 --> 00:41:38.559
<v Speaker 4>definitely sets her. It's always easy to cast people that

785
00:41:38.599 --> 00:41:41.320
<v Speaker 4>look pretty, but you gotta have something else. You got

786
00:41:41.360 --> 00:41:43.000
<v Speaker 4>to be able to bring something else to the screen,

787
00:41:43.039 --> 00:41:45.760
<v Speaker 4>and she does. It's so funny though, because her character

788
00:41:45.840 --> 00:41:47.760
<v Speaker 4>at first, I was like, is this a red flesh?

789
00:41:48.400 --> 00:41:51.079
<v Speaker 4>I'm like, you first meet somebody and they're like, this

790
00:41:51.119 --> 00:41:54.159
<v Speaker 4>is our property, and then it's like how many of

791
00:41:54.199 --> 00:41:54.480
<v Speaker 4>you that.

792
00:41:54.559 --> 00:41:57.480
<v Speaker 10>I'm like, oh, dude, get out. She's gonna be a

793
00:41:57.480 --> 00:42:01.000
<v Speaker 10>bunny boiler before you know it. But obviously didn't quite

794
00:42:01.079 --> 00:42:04.480
<v Speaker 10>go that way, thankfully. With Jean, I almost wondered if

795
00:42:04.519 --> 00:42:07.960
<v Speaker 10>she was dubbed over because there's this weird accident Jean

796
00:42:08.039 --> 00:42:11.400
<v Speaker 10>Jennings was she was in Florida. She was, and shemost

797
00:42:11.400 --> 00:42:15.599
<v Speaker 10>sounds like there's like almost a European accident going on here.

798
00:42:16.039 --> 00:42:19.039
<v Speaker 1>I know that too. It's it's quite but it feels

799
00:42:19.960 --> 00:42:24.960
<v Speaker 1>like youthful wankerness, Like I am affecting this kind of

800
00:42:25.480 --> 00:42:29.039
<v Speaker 1>personality because it feels so put on in like a

801
00:42:29.079 --> 00:42:32.599
<v Speaker 1>way that does feel like she feels real at the

802
00:42:32.599 --> 00:42:34.079
<v Speaker 1>same time as she feels like she's.

803
00:42:33.920 --> 00:42:35.760
<v Speaker 4>Acting youthful bankardness.

804
00:42:36.039 --> 00:42:36.400
<v Speaker 6>I know.

805
00:42:37.239 --> 00:42:38.280
<v Speaker 1>The most beautiful.

806
00:42:39.719 --> 00:42:42.519
<v Speaker 2>She has a speech about her parents dying in a

807
00:42:42.519 --> 00:42:44.000
<v Speaker 2>firework factory accident.

808
00:42:44.559 --> 00:42:45.280
<v Speaker 3>I'm in orphan.

809
00:42:47.360 --> 00:42:50.280
<v Speaker 7>My parents were killed when the fireworks factory that they

810
00:42:50.400 --> 00:42:58.079
<v Speaker 7>worked in. I'm sorry, that's okay. It must have been beautiful.

811
00:43:00.079 --> 00:43:00.880
<v Speaker 1>Did it happen at night?

812
00:43:02.320 --> 00:43:06.079
<v Speaker 7>Yes, And everybody said it was the most beautiful spect

813
00:43:06.480 --> 00:43:10.800
<v Speaker 7>it had ever seen. People saw for hundreds of miles.

814
00:43:12.679 --> 00:43:16.440
<v Speaker 2>Super stilted. After there, I was like, what the hell

815
00:43:16.559 --> 00:43:17.800
<v Speaker 2>was that delivery?

816
00:43:18.039 --> 00:43:21.360
<v Speaker 4>That was wild? That was wild? Because I'm like this,

817
00:43:21.599 --> 00:43:25.119
<v Speaker 4>it was very beautiful, and it's like, what is this

818
00:43:25.199 --> 00:43:29.760
<v Speaker 4>what we're quite hlordss a youthful wankardness and you're just

819
00:43:29.760 --> 00:43:33.159
<v Speaker 4>getting this slight, weird bitch about I'm an orphan And

820
00:43:33.320 --> 00:43:35.199
<v Speaker 4>he's like, I'm so sorry. She's oh, it's okay.

821
00:43:35.840 --> 00:43:38.440
<v Speaker 1>It's just so beautiful.

822
00:43:38.679 --> 00:43:41.480
<v Speaker 2>And like the first time, sorry to bounce back and

823
00:43:41.519 --> 00:43:43.239
<v Speaker 2>forth between the two women, but the first time we

824
00:43:43.280 --> 00:43:47.599
<v Speaker 2>see Margaret Markov, she's holding this giant inflatable light bulb.

825
00:43:48.079 --> 00:43:52.800
<v Speaker 1>You mean lamp bo? Lamp bo? Doesn't does it lamp up? Again?

826
00:43:52.960 --> 00:43:55.320
<v Speaker 1>The bad joke the lamp She's like, do you call

827
00:43:55.360 --> 00:43:57.679
<v Speaker 1>the lampop? Just the lamp up? No light stop?

828
00:43:57.760 --> 00:43:57.800
<v Speaker 7>What?

829
00:43:58.360 --> 00:44:00.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah? And I'm just like, well, what is this that? Yeah,

830
00:44:00.719 --> 00:44:04.679
<v Speaker 2>what's the meaning of this giant lamp bulp, you know, like, yeah,

831
00:44:04.679 --> 00:44:06.880
<v Speaker 2>that was so strange for me, and that they go

832
00:44:06.960 --> 00:44:09.599
<v Speaker 2>to a castle. I'm like, what that's like thirty four

833
00:44:09.639 --> 00:44:12.360
<v Speaker 2>minutes in when they finally have this talk about his

834
00:44:12.440 --> 00:44:15.280
<v Speaker 2>body count and then her saying they call me eleven.

835
00:44:15.119 --> 00:44:17.440
<v Speaker 1>And then it cuts to like a close up shot

836
00:44:17.440 --> 00:44:20.760
<v Speaker 1>of beach the water coming in, and I started having

837
00:44:20.800 --> 00:44:25.079
<v Speaker 1>like flashbacks to the Terror and Targets because it's like

838
00:44:25.440 --> 00:44:30.159
<v Speaker 1>they had that VHS like old sixties beachy weird sound,

839
00:44:30.639 --> 00:44:32.599
<v Speaker 1>and I'm like, wait, is this is this going to

840
00:44:32.639 --> 00:44:35.199
<v Speaker 1>start like breaking? Was it already doing like a targets

841
00:44:35.280 --> 00:44:37.000
<v Speaker 1>or is that just is this a reference to Rogic?

842
00:44:37.239 --> 00:44:40.039
<v Speaker 1>But because I'm just like I don't I don't even know, man,

843
00:44:40.119 --> 00:44:43.960
<v Speaker 1>the second time rounds oh, that's that where the massacre happened.

844
00:44:44.480 --> 00:44:49.480
<v Speaker 1>Maybe the stand in Vietnam that looks about as Vietnam

845
00:44:49.519 --> 00:44:52.599
<v Speaker 1>as every British representation of Vietnam I've ever seen. Sy

846
00:44:53.800 --> 00:44:56.320
<v Speaker 1>there's a big concrete bunker that means it's Asia what

847
00:44:57.079 --> 00:45:01.280
<v Speaker 1>we have toughets of grass everywhere on a beach. Then

848
00:45:01.320 --> 00:45:02.960
<v Speaker 1>it was like going back, like oh, okay, so this

849
00:45:03.039 --> 00:45:05.199
<v Speaker 1>is the first time that we're starting to flip back

850
00:45:05.239 --> 00:45:08.599
<v Speaker 1>to what might be the place where he experienced the

851
00:45:08.719 --> 00:45:12.159
<v Speaker 1>trauma and violence that has put him where he is.

852
00:45:12.880 --> 00:45:15.639
<v Speaker 1>But it's also coming after, like when you're talking about

853
00:45:15.639 --> 00:45:18.840
<v Speaker 1>red flags, they're driving to the castle and there's the

854
00:45:19.679 --> 00:45:22.360
<v Speaker 1>four three or four men naked being whipped on the

855
00:45:22.440 --> 00:45:26.039
<v Speaker 1>roadside as they're driving there, Like that's well, is that

856
00:45:28.400 --> 00:45:29.280
<v Speaker 1>we'll realizing?

857
00:45:29.440 --> 00:45:32.559
<v Speaker 4>Probably lucky unless you've signed up for a fun resorts.

858
00:45:33.679 --> 00:45:36.079
<v Speaker 1>William Sax himself said this isn't a horror film, and

859
00:45:36.079 --> 00:45:39.039
<v Speaker 1>I'm like, it's not a horror film. It's melting mad

860
00:45:39.079 --> 00:45:44.719
<v Speaker 1>as a horror film. But bad vibes, just bad bad

861
00:45:44.880 --> 00:45:46.199
<v Speaker 1>vibes doing through.

862
00:45:47.159 --> 00:45:49.960
<v Speaker 2>I got a little Messiah of Evil from this for

863
00:45:50.000 --> 00:45:52.320
<v Speaker 2>some reason. Maybe it was the grocery store scene.

864
00:45:52.960 --> 00:45:56.159
<v Speaker 1>I have that note right here. I'm like, Messiah of evil.

865
00:45:56.159 --> 00:45:58.519
<v Speaker 1>What are they beat? I can't help them? There was

866
00:45:58.599 --> 00:46:01.119
<v Speaker 1>it was yeah about the beach, but it was also

867
00:46:01.239 --> 00:46:04.679
<v Speaker 1>like the empty world, like that the world felt dead,

868
00:46:05.239 --> 00:46:08.079
<v Speaker 1>that everything had moved on, and it was just like

869
00:46:08.119 --> 00:46:13.559
<v Speaker 1>the ghosts that hadn't caught up, which is like he

870
00:46:13.599 --> 00:46:17.039
<v Speaker 1>feels like he's one of the living dead in parts,

871
00:46:17.079 --> 00:46:19.199
<v Speaker 1>not as like a zombie living dead, but just and

872
00:46:19.199 --> 00:46:22.400
<v Speaker 1>not not because of his pritical disability, Like he's definitely

873
00:46:22.519 --> 00:46:25.599
<v Speaker 1>he'd just been sacrificed, and this is the ghost of

874
00:46:25.599 --> 00:46:28.800
<v Speaker 1>a person who's been sacrificed for a greater meaning that

875
00:46:28.920 --> 00:46:33.159
<v Speaker 1>is actually meaningless and not productive to anything positive.

876
00:46:33.440 --> 00:46:36.239
<v Speaker 2>When they had that sequence of the person being caught

877
00:46:36.559 --> 00:46:39.920
<v Speaker 2>carried on the stretcher, I was thinking, Oh, I wonder

878
00:46:39.960 --> 00:46:41.800
<v Speaker 2>if that's him in that stretcher. And then when they

879
00:46:41.840 --> 00:46:45.599
<v Speaker 2>put the pine box lid over it, I was just like, Oh, okay,

880
00:46:45.679 --> 00:46:48.519
<v Speaker 2>so whoever we're watching is dead. And then I started

881
00:46:48.559 --> 00:46:51.519
<v Speaker 2>to get thoughts of is this a Jacob's Ladder kind

882
00:46:51.519 --> 00:46:53.519
<v Speaker 2>of thing? Is he dead? But he doesn't want to

883
00:46:53.519 --> 00:46:56.159
<v Speaker 2>admit that he's dead? Is he dead? And this is

884
00:46:56.199 --> 00:46:59.719
<v Speaker 2>all just a dream of his? Like is this his reminiscences?

885
00:46:59.800 --> 00:47:02.719
<v Speaker 2>And way that it's all kind of jumbled together because

886
00:47:02.760 --> 00:47:05.639
<v Speaker 2>there is this whole theme throughout the entire movie of

887
00:47:06.199 --> 00:47:09.559
<v Speaker 2>him wanting to be a filmmaker and you know, showing

888
00:47:09.639 --> 00:47:11.360
<v Speaker 2>up and he's like, oh, I've got the script. And

889
00:47:11.400 --> 00:47:14.519
<v Speaker 2>then there's the want ad that he sees and that

890
00:47:14.639 --> 00:47:17.320
<v Speaker 2>eventually takes him back to the VA Hospital. So I

891
00:47:17.360 --> 00:47:19.280
<v Speaker 2>was like, Oh, maybe he's in the VA hospital. This

892
00:47:19.519 --> 00:47:22.000
<v Speaker 2>entire time, because that's where we start, that's where we

893
00:47:22.119 --> 00:47:24.000
<v Speaker 2>end up going. There's this whole thing too of him

894
00:47:24.039 --> 00:47:26.679
<v Speaker 2>saying like, it's my birthday, and then we have a

895
00:47:26.719 --> 00:47:28.599
<v Speaker 2>birthday party and we have all this other stuff, and

896
00:47:28.639 --> 00:47:30.599
<v Speaker 2>I'm just like, Okay, it's all of these things coming

897
00:47:30.599 --> 00:47:34.639
<v Speaker 2>together all at once. Maybe this is like his last birthday,

898
00:47:34.679 --> 00:47:37.079
<v Speaker 2>but yeah, we never really get all of that, and

899
00:47:37.239 --> 00:47:40.079
<v Speaker 2>obviously I don't want a clear cut explanation what's the

900
00:47:40.119 --> 00:47:43.000
<v Speaker 2>fun in that? But it's just like, Okay, yeah, there's

901
00:47:43.039 --> 00:47:45.079
<v Speaker 2>a lot of things to think about here. And then yeah,

902
00:47:45.199 --> 00:47:49.599
<v Speaker 2>like him going to the VA hospital and being given

903
00:47:49.639 --> 00:47:53.639
<v Speaker 2>that assignment of making that short film about feet and

904
00:47:53.719 --> 00:47:57.920
<v Speaker 2>about footprinting. It's so interesting the way that he mixes

905
00:47:58.039 --> 00:48:01.880
<v Speaker 2>like animation and college and all of these things into

906
00:48:01.920 --> 00:48:05.079
<v Speaker 2>this little short film shows it to the doctors and

907
00:48:05.280 --> 00:48:09.639
<v Speaker 2>just no response. Not that was good, not that was bad.

908
00:48:09.719 --> 00:48:11.760
<v Speaker 2>They just all stand up and walk out, And I

909
00:48:11.800 --> 00:48:13.800
<v Speaker 2>was like, well, I guess that's your response right there.

910
00:48:14.559 --> 00:48:16.679
<v Speaker 1>But I love how I'd see it opens, because you've

911
00:48:16.679 --> 00:48:18.679
<v Speaker 1>can hire to make this medical film about how to

912
00:48:18.920 --> 00:48:21.719
<v Speaker 1>put print, how to print a foot, and the open

913
00:48:22.000 --> 00:48:24.519
<v Speaker 1>presentation by saying I am finally going to make a

914
00:48:24.599 --> 00:48:27.559
<v Speaker 1>medical film that's not boring. That could be part of

915
00:48:27.559 --> 00:48:31.800
<v Speaker 1>the reason why they walked out. That could have been

916
00:48:31.840 --> 00:48:34.480
<v Speaker 1>a bunch of stuffy doctors going, how dare you insult

917
00:48:34.519 --> 00:48:36.639
<v Speaker 1>the fine art of medical? Sin them up?

918
00:48:37.719 --> 00:48:41.519
<v Speaker 2>The doctor that hires him, who's taking the brain out

919
00:48:41.519 --> 00:48:44.639
<v Speaker 2>of the dummy, and just his delivery, talking about deliveries.

920
00:48:44.639 --> 00:48:50.199
<v Speaker 2>Holy shit, his is fantastic. I love him. Mighty small breed.

921
00:48:51.199 --> 00:48:55.039
<v Speaker 1>Oh, such a big guy face free.

922
00:48:56.119 --> 00:48:59.760
<v Speaker 6>Have you ever seen such a small breed in such

923
00:48:59.760 --> 00:49:01.000
<v Speaker 6>a big guy?

924
00:49:01.760 --> 00:49:01.800
<v Speaker 7>No?

925
00:49:04.920 --> 00:49:06.440
<v Speaker 11>How did I?

926
00:49:10.679 --> 00:49:11.440
<v Speaker 1>He was drunk?

927
00:49:13.480 --> 00:49:14.159
<v Speaker 10>Thomas own.

928
00:49:22.360 --> 00:49:25.239
<v Speaker 4>I love him too, my note, this is a man

929
00:49:25.320 --> 00:49:30.119
<v Speaker 4>that owns and asked Scott un ironically, there's something very

930
00:49:30.400 --> 00:49:33.480
<v Speaker 4>just like just all I don't know. It was like

931
00:49:33.519 --> 00:49:36.360
<v Speaker 4>I like to describe him, but just like this great

932
00:49:36.400 --> 00:49:40.159
<v Speaker 4>theatrical give Chriswell and Terry Thomas at a baby. I

933
00:49:40.159 --> 00:49:42.559
<v Speaker 4>wanted more of him. Maybe not in this field though,

934
00:49:42.840 --> 00:49:44.400
<v Speaker 4>like another film.

935
00:49:44.320 --> 00:49:48.039
<v Speaker 1>Apparently is in The Mister Papa's Penguins, my character named Reginald.

936
00:49:48.440 --> 00:49:52.719
<v Speaker 1>Really that's that Terry Thomas. I looked him up and

937
00:49:53.199 --> 00:49:56.760
<v Speaker 1>he's like like lots of indies and shorts and occasional

938
00:49:56.800 --> 00:49:59.400
<v Speaker 1>t movies and not much at all. And then suddenly

939
00:49:59.480 --> 00:50:01.440
<v Speaker 1>right at the end these Creer, just before he died,

940
00:50:01.519 --> 00:50:04.480
<v Speaker 1>he's in Mister Poppa's Penguins and then he plays the

941
00:50:04.639 --> 00:50:07.679
<v Speaker 1>old ant Man. I think it was in the Adventures

942
00:50:07.719 --> 00:50:09.280
<v Speaker 1>and Came and then he dies.

943
00:50:09.760 --> 00:50:12.599
<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, the old man when they're trying the time

944
00:50:12.639 --> 00:50:13.719
<v Speaker 2>travel experiments.

945
00:50:13.920 --> 00:50:15.840
<v Speaker 1>Okay, I don't know. I haven't I haven't seen it.

946
00:50:15.880 --> 00:50:17.159
<v Speaker 4>Wow, I haven't seen it either.

947
00:50:17.480 --> 00:50:20.400
<v Speaker 2>I've seen it a thousand times. But yeah, yeah, okay.

948
00:50:20.159 --> 00:50:22.000
<v Speaker 1>Wow, So there you go. You can see more of it.

949
00:50:22.199 --> 00:50:25.280
<v Speaker 1>But the whole thing with the footprinting thing is fascinating

950
00:50:25.280 --> 00:50:27.159
<v Speaker 1>because obviously he's taking it from a real thing that

951
00:50:27.239 --> 00:50:30.119
<v Speaker 1>happened to him. But it has so much meaning for

952
00:50:30.159 --> 00:50:34.960
<v Speaker 1>the film because if he had he is a boiler alert.

953
00:50:35.000 --> 00:50:37.159
<v Speaker 1>We haven't even talked about it yet. But Ampu Tea,

954
00:50:37.199 --> 00:50:41.119
<v Speaker 1>he seemingly doesn't have hands or feet, and how do

955
00:50:41.159 --> 00:50:45.280
<v Speaker 1>you identify somebody? Your fingerprints are a form of identity,

956
00:50:45.760 --> 00:50:48.320
<v Speaker 1>and he has lost all the ways that somebody wouldn't

957
00:50:48.360 --> 00:50:52.079
<v Speaker 1>give him an identity in that clinical kind of way.

958
00:50:52.760 --> 00:50:55.800
<v Speaker 1>So it's like he's it's it's almost him like being

959
00:50:55.840 --> 00:50:59.719
<v Speaker 1>forced to confront a lack that he has in that regard,

960
00:51:00.639 --> 00:51:02.639
<v Speaker 1>so much of the film feels like he's, like I said,

961
00:51:02.639 --> 00:51:05.800
<v Speaker 1>you get these little like interjections of stuff that like

962
00:51:05.880 --> 00:51:09.679
<v Speaker 1>our lose last memories, which could be the trauma trying

963
00:51:09.719 --> 00:51:14.320
<v Speaker 1>to reassert itself in his delusions escapes from that reality

964
00:51:14.400 --> 00:51:19.320
<v Speaker 1>or whatever. But then it also could be like that

965
00:51:19.519 --> 00:51:22.760
<v Speaker 1>he's trying to just exist and be and is constantly

966
00:51:22.840 --> 00:51:26.360
<v Speaker 1>being brought back to ways that he is not, that

967
00:51:26.440 --> 00:51:29.079
<v Speaker 1>he doesn't exist in the society anymore, in this world,

968
00:51:29.159 --> 00:51:32.039
<v Speaker 1>that all of these traditional markers have been removed from

969
00:51:32.079 --> 00:51:36.199
<v Speaker 1>him as possibilities, like on a much more existential level,

970
00:51:36.519 --> 00:51:39.360
<v Speaker 1>which is the old like very albu camou a real

971
00:51:39.599 --> 00:51:43.280
<v Speaker 1>like just existential dread and Beckett. There's some Beckett vibes

972
00:51:43.320 --> 00:51:46.679
<v Speaker 1>here as well, for just like impossible traps.

973
00:51:46.840 --> 00:51:50.239
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and you're right, I've totally forgot about that final

974
00:51:50.360 --> 00:51:53.800
<v Speaker 2>shot where it's him in the bed with no arms

975
00:51:53.800 --> 00:51:56.280
<v Speaker 2>and no legs. And then I'm also like, well, if

976
00:51:56.320 --> 00:51:58.719
<v Speaker 2>he got his dick shot off, then there is no thirteen.

977
00:51:58.880 --> 00:52:03.480
<v Speaker 2>But like her whole thing, when we meet that mysterious thirteen,

978
00:52:03.880 --> 00:52:04.639
<v Speaker 2>she's just like.

979
00:52:05.360 --> 00:52:13.559
<v Speaker 7>You must be number thirteen. There's no thirteen. Who are you? Oh?

980
00:52:13.679 --> 00:52:18.920
<v Speaker 7>No one I don't exist. I don't understand. Could you

981
00:52:19.000 --> 00:52:21.119
<v Speaker 7>try you?

982
00:52:21.159 --> 00:52:21.320
<v Speaker 6>Mad?

983
00:52:21.320 --> 00:52:24.719
<v Speaker 7>I touch you? No, you mustn't. If you touch me,

984
00:52:24.760 --> 00:52:28.519
<v Speaker 7>I'll vanish. I don't exist. I'm nobody.

985
00:52:30.079 --> 00:52:30.440
<v Speaker 2>Why not?

986
00:52:32.119 --> 00:52:34.559
<v Speaker 7>Because my father was killed in the warar before he

987
00:52:34.639 --> 00:52:35.280
<v Speaker 7>met my mother.

988
00:52:37.199 --> 00:52:41.280
<v Speaker 5>Well, if you did exist, would you have been number thirteen?

989
00:52:44.079 --> 00:52:47.960
<v Speaker 5>Perhaps it doesn't really matter that you don't exist?

990
00:52:49.360 --> 00:52:49.719
<v Speaker 7>Why not?

991
00:52:51.360 --> 00:52:52.400
<v Speaker 5>I can't touch you anyway?

992
00:52:53.519 --> 00:52:57.320
<v Speaker 2>Okay, So it's like your No. Thirteen is because you

993
00:52:57.400 --> 00:53:02.199
<v Speaker 2>don't exist, as opposed to our main characters know thirteen

994
00:53:02.280 --> 00:53:05.719
<v Speaker 2>because he's never going to have sex with this woman

995
00:53:05.840 --> 00:53:08.320
<v Speaker 2>or maybe you have a sex again. I'm just like, okay,

996
00:53:08.360 --> 00:53:11.280
<v Speaker 2>that's very very different way of thinking about these things.

997
00:53:11.920 --> 00:53:14.280
<v Speaker 4>That's at thirteen days. I think that her father had

998
00:53:14.320 --> 00:53:15.039
<v Speaker 4>been off to war.

999
00:53:15.679 --> 00:53:17.559
<v Speaker 1>So even like the way that like he says why

1000
00:53:17.599 --> 00:53:19.920
<v Speaker 1>not first, then she says why not? They're like a

1001
00:53:20.119 --> 00:53:22.360
<v Speaker 1>yin and yang. It was sort of like a two

1002
00:53:22.400 --> 00:53:26.320
<v Speaker 1>halves of the same circle. So it's like the feminine

1003
00:53:26.360 --> 00:53:30.159
<v Speaker 1>representation of annihilation in this world and the masculine representation

1004
00:53:30.239 --> 00:53:33.679
<v Speaker 1>of annihilation, And it's like women don't really play a

1005
00:53:33.719 --> 00:53:36.519
<v Speaker 1>part of this film, despite what the blurbs say, and

1006
00:53:36.559 --> 00:53:39.760
<v Speaker 1>the film isn't trying to make a film with not

1007
00:53:39.800 --> 00:53:43.079
<v Speaker 1>about women. It's not trying to exclude women. It's there.

1008
00:53:43.239 --> 00:53:46.480
<v Speaker 1>It's just done in the same sort of it's a

1009
00:53:46.559 --> 00:53:50.119
<v Speaker 1>way like everything's very abcuse like it's not looking at

1010
00:53:50.159 --> 00:53:53.159
<v Speaker 1>things that it's talking about them. But then at the

1011
00:53:53.239 --> 00:53:56.760
<v Speaker 1>same time, like with the ending, do you remember like

1012
00:53:56.920 --> 00:54:00.760
<v Speaker 1>the beginnings, because when I watched this, I went back

1013
00:54:00.760 --> 00:54:04.519
<v Speaker 1>and watched it. What shit says when he's talking about

1014
00:54:04.519 --> 00:54:07.440
<v Speaker 1>what he says Whilight, I was like, says this is

1015
00:54:07.480 --> 00:54:10.800
<v Speaker 1>a bit fun because he says, I love where is

1016
00:54:10.880 --> 00:54:13.320
<v Speaker 1>it my notes of a mess? They've got to get

1017
00:54:13.320 --> 00:54:16.559
<v Speaker 1>better at notes. Okay, So, first of all, the film

1018
00:54:16.599 --> 00:54:21.159
<v Speaker 1>opens with a joke about dismemberment. The Harvey Lemnbeck character

1019
00:54:21.320 --> 00:54:24.679
<v Speaker 1>person whichever one he is at this point, if he's

1020
00:54:24.679 --> 00:54:28.880
<v Speaker 1>introducing vaudeville show, tells a joke about an Italian pow

1021
00:54:29.039 --> 00:54:33.960
<v Speaker 1>who needs to get a limb dismembered amputated, and he says, oh, yes,

1022
00:54:34.000 --> 00:54:35.920
<v Speaker 1>I'm okay with that, but can you put it in

1023
00:54:35.960 --> 00:54:38.440
<v Speaker 1>with the bombs that you drop on Italy tonight? And

1024
00:54:38.440 --> 00:54:40.960
<v Speaker 1>they like the shore and then the next day, oh,

1025
00:54:41.000 --> 00:54:42.880
<v Speaker 1>we have to amputate this lim and same thing can

1026
00:54:42.880 --> 00:54:44.559
<v Speaker 1>you putting in with the bombs? And then like the

1027
00:54:44.599 --> 00:54:47.599
<v Speaker 1>third night they had okay and okay, as long as

1028
00:54:47.599 --> 00:54:49.880
<v Speaker 1>it can be anything. Nope, we're on to you. We've

1029
00:54:49.920 --> 00:54:53.199
<v Speaker 1>figured out that you're trying to escape one piece at

1030
00:54:53.239 --> 00:54:56.960
<v Speaker 1>a time. I was like, oh, oh my god. So

1031
00:54:57.000 --> 00:54:59.840
<v Speaker 1>the joke is not only about this memberment. It's about escape,

1032
00:55:00.039 --> 00:55:02.880
<v Speaker 1>it's about freedom, it's about returning home, even if you're in.

1033
00:55:02.880 --> 00:55:09.239
<v Speaker 8>Peace, and then immediately follows that by saying, I know

1034
00:55:09.360 --> 00:55:13.159
<v Speaker 8>there's one thing you people really like, people that can move.

1035
00:55:14.400 --> 00:55:16.760
<v Speaker 1>That's the line, people that can move. There's nothing you

1036
00:55:16.880 --> 00:55:22.159
<v Speaker 1>like better than watching people move, Like I, oh my,

1037
00:55:22.360 --> 00:55:24.199
<v Speaker 1>they just set up the whole film for us, and

1038
00:55:24.360 --> 00:55:26.400
<v Speaker 1>not be happy about it because it's a film about

1039
00:55:26.440 --> 00:55:30.639
<v Speaker 1>a guy you can't move. He's a sick bastard, it's all.

1040
00:55:30.760 --> 00:55:32.480
<v Speaker 1>And then it got straight to him in the hospital

1041
00:55:32.519 --> 00:55:34.679
<v Speaker 1>talking about have you ever been to an army hospital?

1042
00:55:35.159 --> 00:55:38.760
<v Speaker 1>And it's super grim and it's like you, I've completely

1043
00:55:38.760 --> 00:55:40.840
<v Speaker 1>forgot about that as I'm watching the films. It's like

1044
00:55:41.360 --> 00:55:43.480
<v Speaker 1>what we were saying before about like it's that doesn't

1045
00:55:43.679 --> 00:55:46.159
<v Speaker 1>like it's not really fore grounding and stuff, but like,

1046
00:55:46.159 --> 00:55:50.039
<v Speaker 1>oh no, it full grounds it immediately in three scenes

1047
00:55:50.079 --> 00:55:55.000
<v Speaker 1>of dialogue that eats separate, connected, and then immediately like

1048
00:55:55.119 --> 00:55:57.119
<v Speaker 1>exits that in such a way that you forget it

1049
00:55:57.199 --> 00:55:59.920
<v Speaker 1>unless you watch the film and then hit play immediately

1050
00:56:00.039 --> 00:56:02.159
<v Speaker 1>and you realize it's in this weird loop where the

1051
00:56:02.280 --> 00:56:06.159
<v Speaker 1>ending is immediately responding the beginning is immediately responding to

1052
00:56:06.159 --> 00:56:09.039
<v Speaker 1>an ending of a man who has no limit and

1053
00:56:09.440 --> 00:56:13.719
<v Speaker 1>can't move. We chokes about dismemberment and how audiences love

1054
00:56:13.760 --> 00:56:14.360
<v Speaker 1>people who move.

1055
00:56:15.519 --> 00:56:18.559
<v Speaker 2>Do you think maybe that's why he calls cars turds

1056
00:56:18.719 --> 00:56:22.199
<v Speaker 2>that he's just because they represent the movement that he

1057
00:56:22.320 --> 00:56:26.920
<v Speaker 2>can not have again. And then that crazy the Markov

1058
00:56:27.000 --> 00:56:29.239
<v Speaker 2>character where she's like, oh yeah, put on your helmet

1059
00:56:29.320 --> 00:56:31.800
<v Speaker 2>when they're driving the convertible and stuff, and just the

1060
00:56:32.239 --> 00:56:35.119
<v Speaker 2>freedom of the open road that they have other than

1061
00:56:35.199 --> 00:56:37.960
<v Speaker 2>him having to hold onto that lamp bulb super tight.

1062
00:56:38.360 --> 00:56:41.280
<v Speaker 4>Little thing about the tongue because he makes like a

1063
00:56:41.280 --> 00:56:43.320
<v Speaker 4>silly face and she's doing that again and she's like,

1064
00:56:43.400 --> 00:56:45.000
<v Speaker 4>you have a tongue, and that's quite rare.

1065
00:56:45.000 --> 00:56:48.519
<v Speaker 1>In these parts are tickling leading to violence as well?

1066
00:56:49.199 --> 00:56:53.239
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, that scene was strange. And then even when

1067
00:56:53.239 --> 00:56:55.519
<v Speaker 2>he's in the elevator the very first time, we see

1068
00:56:55.599 --> 00:56:57.679
<v Speaker 2>him and the elevator doors open up, and there's that

1069
00:56:57.760 --> 00:57:00.920
<v Speaker 2>gangster looking guy with a machine gun that shoots at him,

1070
00:57:01.239 --> 00:57:03.639
<v Speaker 2>and then they cut away and then he just walks

1071
00:57:03.639 --> 00:57:06.119
<v Speaker 2>onto the elevator. We get a couple of elevator scenes,

1072
00:57:06.119 --> 00:57:09.119
<v Speaker 2>because there's one later on when he's wandering the city

1073
00:57:09.159 --> 00:57:11.599
<v Speaker 2>again and he's doing that whole thing about the turds

1074
00:57:11.639 --> 00:57:15.039
<v Speaker 2>and talking about the air conditioners dripping on him and everything.

1075
00:57:15.400 --> 00:57:18.239
<v Speaker 2>There's another shot in an elevator with another old man.

1076
00:57:18.400 --> 00:57:20.519
<v Speaker 2>You know, you talked about those old men with cigars,

1077
00:57:20.519 --> 00:57:22.599
<v Speaker 2>and they are everywhere.

1078
00:57:22.079 --> 00:57:25.000
<v Speaker 1>In this Sometimes I miss the city.

1079
00:57:26.000 --> 00:57:30.400
<v Speaker 3>I hate it, but I still miss it. The streets

1080
00:57:30.400 --> 00:57:33.960
<v Speaker 3>smell like puke. The air is damp and heavy as

1081
00:57:34.119 --> 00:57:39.039
<v Speaker 3>he's out of the way. The people tea brains encased

1082
00:57:39.039 --> 00:57:44.599
<v Speaker 3>in physical human forms days are gray, and the air

1083
00:57:44.760 --> 00:57:47.440
<v Speaker 3>is heavy as it pushes millions of tea brains lower

1084
00:57:47.440 --> 00:57:56.039
<v Speaker 3>into themselves, ill venture to their overpriced, dilapidated pods. T

1085
00:57:56.239 --> 00:58:00.000
<v Speaker 3>brain rides home with other p brains and snake likes

1086
00:58:00.039 --> 00:58:04.920
<v Speaker 3>weltering turds piled one after another, reddish brown, with windows

1087
00:58:04.920 --> 00:58:10.159
<v Speaker 3>brown and horizontal stink flavor straws under concrete.

1088
00:58:11.360 --> 00:58:13.079
<v Speaker 2>There are turds above the flavor straws.

1089
00:58:14.000 --> 00:58:17.960
<v Speaker 3>There are turds everywhere, millions of turds piled one after

1090
00:58:18.039 --> 00:58:23.519
<v Speaker 3>and before another. Red turds, blue turds, green turds, truck turds,

1091
00:58:23.599 --> 00:58:29.480
<v Speaker 3>convertible turrets, little turds, big turds, but mostly yellow turds

1092
00:58:31.440 --> 00:58:34.400
<v Speaker 3>which pump out their black poison behind them, which is

1093
00:58:34.440 --> 00:58:38.199
<v Speaker 3>scooped up and swallowed by the pea brains and those

1094
00:58:38.280 --> 00:58:40.400
<v Speaker 3>not fortunate enough to have air bubbles.

1095
00:58:41.880 --> 00:58:42.320
<v Speaker 1>And something.

1096
00:58:42.360 --> 00:58:44.920
<v Speaker 4>It's hitty me like, because when you were talking earlier

1097
00:58:44.960 --> 00:58:47.480
<v Speaker 4>about just a lot of the troubles that Sax ran

1098
00:58:47.519 --> 00:58:50.840
<v Speaker 4>into throughout his whole career. Because our character here is

1099
00:58:50.880 --> 00:58:53.840
<v Speaker 4>a filmmaker, like he was going into filmmaking before he

1100
00:58:53.920 --> 00:58:58.400
<v Speaker 4>got called drafted. I'm assuming, and do you think there's

1101
00:58:58.400 --> 00:59:01.039
<v Speaker 4>almost like a parallel though of just I'll edit filmmakers

1102
00:59:01.039 --> 00:59:04.360
<v Speaker 4>and directors get caught off at the limb metaphorically because

1103
00:59:04.559 --> 00:59:07.239
<v Speaker 4>thinking about like how the way that his films reacted

1104
00:59:07.280 --> 00:59:10.760
<v Speaker 4>to the medical institution, even though it's like really creative,

1105
00:59:10.760 --> 00:59:12.840
<v Speaker 4>I was like, man, he got super ambitious for this.

1106
00:59:13.000 --> 00:59:15.280
<v Speaker 4>What is all what is basically just like a trial

1107
00:59:15.400 --> 00:59:17.679
<v Speaker 4>run film to see if he gets a job. But

1108
00:59:17.719 --> 00:59:19.880
<v Speaker 4>I also noticed he didn't actually use the severed foot

1109
00:59:19.880 --> 00:59:23.000
<v Speaker 4>that he was supposed to use. He did everything but that.

1110
00:59:24.199 --> 00:59:29.239
<v Speaker 2>And reuse the the end gag as well. No tad

1111
00:59:29.280 --> 00:59:29.960
<v Speaker 2>Tooo that one.

1112
00:59:30.000 --> 00:59:34.199
<v Speaker 4>I love that, I love. I can't help it. It's

1113
00:59:34.239 --> 00:59:37.480
<v Speaker 4>my maybe it's my inner like nineteen sixties, like no

1114
00:59:37.599 --> 00:59:42.639
<v Speaker 4>budgets exploitation self. I love, but with the end on it,

1115
00:59:42.639 --> 00:59:46.159
<v Speaker 4>it's so stupid. It just always makes me smile. And

1116
00:59:46.199 --> 00:59:50.039
<v Speaker 4>there's a little baby stepping and pie doing the footprint

1117
00:59:50.199 --> 00:59:52.440
<v Speaker 4>and just but it was so creative. I was actually like,

1118
00:59:52.480 --> 00:59:55.079
<v Speaker 4>you know what, this is smart because it's honestly like

1119
00:59:55.119 --> 00:59:57.679
<v Speaker 4>this is he's showing you how to footprint without actually

1120
00:59:57.679 --> 01:00:02.199
<v Speaker 4>being like, here's a literal severed human flo and that's

1121
01:00:02.199 --> 01:00:04.159
<v Speaker 4>the doctors are going to have to cut off each

1122
01:00:04.280 --> 01:00:08.719
<v Speaker 4>toe and ten diff it. It's like, God, damn, that was.

1123
01:00:08.639 --> 01:00:11.679
<v Speaker 2>His wife, I believe in that Formeldehyde and then she

1124
01:00:11.920 --> 01:00:13.880
<v Speaker 2>I think it was her with the scissors cutting off

1125
01:00:13.920 --> 01:00:18.159
<v Speaker 2>the paper toe. And I don't know if the girl

1126
01:00:18.280 --> 01:00:20.559
<v Speaker 2>in there, I don't think that was his daughter because

1127
01:00:20.599 --> 01:00:23.719
<v Speaker 2>they I think he met his wife on this film.

1128
01:00:24.039 --> 01:00:26.320
<v Speaker 4>Oh wow, Okay. I kind of wonder because usually with

1129
01:00:26.400 --> 01:00:29.119
<v Speaker 4>these kind of films that you fight out. Okay again,

1130
01:00:29.239 --> 01:00:33.519
<v Speaker 4>go back to Robert Daddy soon senior, you know, and pounds.

1131
01:00:34.159 --> 01:00:36.599
<v Speaker 1>He met his wife and row so they I think

1132
01:00:36.639 --> 01:00:38.280
<v Speaker 1>they had been married for a little bit dispoint, but

1133
01:00:38.320 --> 01:00:39.880
<v Speaker 1>I don't know if they would keep not done. I

1134
01:00:39.880 --> 01:00:40.960
<v Speaker 1>think it was a child that all.

1135
01:00:41.320 --> 01:00:44.800
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it was credited to Randy Geller.

1136
01:00:45.000 --> 01:00:45.519
<v Speaker 7>R A. N.

1137
01:00:45.719 --> 01:00:49.039
<v Speaker 2>D Ee is a little girl in Georgie's film So

1138
01:00:49.360 --> 01:00:52.519
<v Speaker 2>and Bonnie Sachs as the girl in Fermaldehyde.

1139
01:00:53.119 --> 01:00:56.920
<v Speaker 1>The interesting thing about that film is that when he's

1140
01:00:56.960 --> 01:01:00.280
<v Speaker 1>meeting with the producers with his script and they're like, no,

1141
01:01:00.400 --> 01:01:03.440
<v Speaker 1>we just want pits and ass and Adam and Eve

1142
01:01:03.639 --> 01:01:05.639
<v Speaker 1>in the Garden of Eden, the nudity and all this

1143
01:01:05.760 --> 01:01:08.840
<v Speaker 1>kind of thing. It's sex seal spectacle. And he's trying

1144
01:01:08.840 --> 01:01:12.840
<v Speaker 1>to make something more meaningful. And then he's tasked with

1145
01:01:12.960 --> 01:01:16.840
<v Speaker 1>making a films for communicating information and he hands in

1146
01:01:17.000 --> 01:01:20.599
<v Speaker 1>something that's much more entertaining and feels aimed at kids.

1147
01:01:21.000 --> 01:01:24.480
<v Speaker 1>So it's it's a mirror image of the earlier one

1148
01:01:24.480 --> 01:01:28.039
<v Speaker 1>where he's the one failing to be meaningful in education.

1149
01:01:28.079 --> 01:01:29.880
<v Speaker 1>Even though it's great and it's fine, it's like it

1150
01:01:29.920 --> 01:01:31.960
<v Speaker 1>isn't what they ask for, and it's a whole bunch

1151
01:01:32.000 --> 01:01:36.039
<v Speaker 1>of stuffy doctors like they want the boring medical film.

1152
01:01:36.199 --> 01:01:38.719
<v Speaker 1>This is why, like when I said, like the complicated

1153
01:01:38.800 --> 01:01:41.440
<v Speaker 1>figure of sex is he's not dealing with stuff, but

1154
01:01:41.519 --> 01:01:43.079
<v Speaker 1>yet he's dealing with a lot of things from a

1155
01:01:43.119 --> 01:01:47.320
<v Speaker 1>lot more angles than some filmmakers. Like even when he's

1156
01:01:47.360 --> 01:01:51.039
<v Speaker 1>getting railing against this society of the spectacle and TNA

1157
01:01:51.119 --> 01:01:55.119
<v Speaker 1>and exploitation and everything, it's I don't know, matter of facts,

1158
01:01:55.199 --> 01:01:57.960
<v Speaker 1>not quite the right word, but it's there's a practicality

1159
01:01:58.039 --> 01:02:00.719
<v Speaker 1>to it that it's like, it doesn't feel like someone

1160
01:02:00.800 --> 01:02:02.880
<v Speaker 1>getting old, but the arts are important at the more,

1161
01:02:03.039 --> 01:02:06.079
<v Speaker 1>I don't want to do something else. And then like

1162
01:02:06.239 --> 01:02:09.039
<v Speaker 1>when he's tasked for doing something else, he does the

1163
01:02:09.119 --> 01:02:11.480
<v Speaker 1>like nice version of the things he didn't want to do.

1164
01:02:12.360 --> 01:02:16.000
<v Speaker 1>It's it's interesting, it's it's complicated, it's messy. Like it

1165
01:02:16.320 --> 01:02:17.119
<v Speaker 1>There's something that.

1166
01:02:17.039 --> 01:02:21.159
<v Speaker 4>The like the distributor producer character says that really stuck

1167
01:02:21.159 --> 01:02:24.880
<v Speaker 4>with me, because when when George tells the times are changing,

1168
01:02:25.960 --> 01:02:28.719
<v Speaker 4>and the guy says times are changing, but the audience

1169
01:02:28.800 --> 01:02:33.079
<v Speaker 4>isn't this producer stuck in the times. But given the

1170
01:02:33.119 --> 01:02:37.480
<v Speaker 4>treatment this film got outside of Italy. It's sadly true

1171
01:02:37.800 --> 01:02:40.480
<v Speaker 4>and it's fake as thinking about the whole thing. What's

1172
01:02:40.480 --> 01:02:45.519
<v Speaker 4>this film like intentionally oppressed too? In America? It's like

1173
01:02:45.559 --> 01:02:50.039
<v Speaker 4>the main Vietnam War centric film that came out the

1174
01:02:50.079 --> 01:02:51.920
<v Speaker 4>same year that this one did was Hearts and Mind,

1175
01:02:52.920 --> 01:02:55.360
<v Speaker 4>which now is very it's very easy to get hold

1176
01:02:55.360 --> 01:02:57.960
<v Speaker 4>of and Criterion has it out, But it was like

1177
01:02:58.320 --> 01:03:01.840
<v Speaker 4>that was a very controversial film and like Columbia refused

1178
01:03:01.880 --> 01:03:06.239
<v Speaker 4>to distribute it and it was basically suppressed. That's a

1179
01:03:06.280 --> 01:03:10.199
<v Speaker 4>sneaky way things get censored, I find in modern American

1180
01:03:10.239 --> 01:03:12.639
<v Speaker 4>times it's ever so much like something super obvious with

1181
01:03:12.719 --> 01:03:15.960
<v Speaker 4>the government says we've banned it. Instead, it's more nobody's

1182
01:03:16.000 --> 01:03:17.519
<v Speaker 4>going to distribute it.

1183
01:03:17.519 --> 01:03:18.679
<v Speaker 1>It's a free market. It work.

1184
01:03:18.960 --> 01:03:21.760
<v Speaker 2>Well. It's like Captain Milkshake from nineteen seventy. That's a

1185
01:03:21.880 --> 01:03:26.280
<v Speaker 2>virulent anti war film that other than the filmmaker's selling it,

1186
01:03:26.360 --> 01:03:28.880
<v Speaker 2>you can't get your hands on it, you know. And

1187
01:03:28.920 --> 01:03:31.760
<v Speaker 2>it was wonderful, this whole thing of this guy coming

1188
01:03:31.800 --> 01:03:34.599
<v Speaker 2>back from Vietnam and just not being able to handle it,

1189
01:03:34.920 --> 01:03:37.719
<v Speaker 2>and what was it. The stuff at home is shot

1190
01:03:37.800 --> 01:03:40.000
<v Speaker 2>in black and white. The stuff in the war is

1191
01:03:40.000 --> 01:03:42.000
<v Speaker 2>shot in color, because it's like that's the only time

1192
01:03:42.039 --> 01:03:45.199
<v Speaker 2>he actually felt alive was when he was in the wartime,

1193
01:03:45.760 --> 01:03:49.039
<v Speaker 2>and it's like it was nineteen seventy. You know, we're

1194
01:03:49.079 --> 01:03:51.480
<v Speaker 2>still like Ben you and were asking as far as

1195
01:03:51.559 --> 01:03:55.239
<v Speaker 2>like when was the war and like, I mean the

1196
01:03:55.280 --> 01:03:59.280
<v Speaker 2>beginning of the whole conflict. I honestly can't tell you,

1197
01:03:59.320 --> 01:04:02.280
<v Speaker 2>because there was all that the French involvement then eventually

1198
01:04:02.320 --> 01:04:04.800
<v Speaker 2>starts to move into the American involvement. But I remember

1199
01:04:04.840 --> 01:04:08.159
<v Speaker 2>even Kennedy's sending troops over there. So it had been

1200
01:04:08.199 --> 01:04:10.440
<v Speaker 2>going on for while, over a decade.

1201
01:04:11.199 --> 01:04:13.559
<v Speaker 1>I knew that it would have wrapping up around this time,

1202
01:04:13.559 --> 01:04:15.840
<v Speaker 1>but I wasn't sure exactly when it does seem seventy

1203
01:04:15.840 --> 01:04:18.960
<v Speaker 1>four was about when it was like really over as

1204
01:04:19.039 --> 01:04:21.519
<v Speaker 1>much as it could be. Is there were over sorry

1205
01:04:21.719 --> 01:04:22.840
<v Speaker 1>ran Bo tweets.

1206
01:04:22.440 --> 01:04:24.960
<v Speaker 2>Only over when I say it's over. Yeah.

1207
01:04:25.000 --> 01:04:27.719
<v Speaker 1>This was one of the first American films to really

1208
01:04:27.800 --> 01:04:30.280
<v Speaker 1>tackle it and not in a way of being like, oh,

1209
01:04:30.400 --> 01:04:33.440
<v Speaker 1>something and such was in the war move on. Most

1210
01:04:33.440 --> 01:04:36.760
<v Speaker 1>of the films were like that, and so it is

1211
01:04:37.079 --> 01:04:43.039
<v Speaker 1>entirely possible that it was leaned on. I have heard

1212
01:04:43.360 --> 01:04:47.000
<v Speaker 1>far stupidest stories about what Army Intelligence and the CIA

1213
01:04:47.199 --> 01:04:49.079
<v Speaker 1>was up to at this time with all of the

1214
01:04:49.119 --> 01:04:52.960
<v Speaker 1>spare time that they had, that somebody sitting there watching

1215
01:04:52.960 --> 01:04:55.039
<v Speaker 1>every film that comes out that relates to it, and going,

1216
01:04:55.199 --> 01:04:56.880
<v Speaker 1>they didn't even need to watch the whole film. You

1217
01:04:57.000 --> 01:04:59.000
<v Speaker 1>just watched the first five minutes, and you react to

1218
01:04:59.039 --> 01:05:01.280
<v Speaker 1>that because they're talking about the Vegan hospitals and you

1219
01:05:01.280 --> 01:05:03.199
<v Speaker 1>didn't talk You could talk about the war, you don't

1220
01:05:03.199 --> 01:05:05.320
<v Speaker 1>talk about the Vegeans, not like that. You don't talk

1221
01:05:05.360 --> 01:05:08.000
<v Speaker 1>about them in pieces. You don't show the hospitals and

1222
01:05:08.039 --> 01:05:10.639
<v Speaker 1>the suffering. But they didn't be even in the eating

1223
01:05:10.719 --> 01:05:13.400
<v Speaker 1>now they don't really want to still talk about that

1224
01:05:13.519 --> 01:05:17.119
<v Speaker 1>aspect of the aftermath. And so I can imagine like

1225
01:05:17.159 --> 01:05:20.800
<v Speaker 1>a very easily someone watching just the first five minutes

1226
01:05:20.840 --> 01:05:22.760
<v Speaker 1>of this film and going, let's lean on some people

1227
01:05:22.760 --> 01:05:25.239
<v Speaker 1>and make sure this doesn't appear. And even down to

1228
01:05:25.280 --> 01:05:28.840
<v Speaker 1>the stories with it going to Berlin Film Festival that

1229
01:05:29.079 --> 01:05:32.119
<v Speaker 1>you know, apocryphary, we are told that the jury love

1230
01:05:32.199 --> 01:05:34.559
<v Speaker 1>didn't thought it was the best film, but the people

1231
01:05:34.639 --> 01:05:37.679
<v Speaker 1>running the show were afraid there would be riots because

1232
01:05:37.679 --> 01:05:41.639
<v Speaker 1>there was such huge anti American sentiment that it very

1233
01:05:41.840 --> 01:05:45.679
<v Speaker 1>very familiar to our current time. That the pushback was

1234
01:05:45.719 --> 01:05:48.280
<v Speaker 1>just so intense that even though this film was obviously

1235
01:05:48.320 --> 01:05:52.599
<v Speaker 1>not pro like that they were. People were apparently turning

1236
01:05:52.599 --> 01:05:55.119
<v Speaker 1>the lights on the cinema's protests and were yelling over

1237
01:05:55.159 --> 01:05:57.159
<v Speaker 1>it and everything like that, just because it was American

1238
01:05:57.199 --> 01:06:00.159
<v Speaker 1>and about the war. It's really easy to imagine that

1239
01:06:00.199 --> 01:06:03.239
<v Speaker 1>it just got shuffled off to the side and no

1240
01:06:03.280 --> 01:06:06.000
<v Speaker 1>one noticed and no one cared because who would and

1241
01:06:06.119 --> 01:06:09.960
<v Speaker 1>it is it is just a it does seem likely

1242
01:06:10.039 --> 01:06:12.960
<v Speaker 1>to maybe given how much they've disappeared. But Hearts and Mind,

1243
01:06:13.119 --> 01:06:16.239
<v Speaker 1>this has a connection to Hearts and Mind. Cans Ralph

1244
01:06:16.239 --> 01:06:19.800
<v Speaker 1>b do the Bode, the cinematographer, was a second unit

1245
01:06:19.800 --> 01:06:25.159
<v Speaker 1>cameraman on Hearts and Mind, so that there's there's they're

1246
01:06:25.360 --> 01:06:28.400
<v Speaker 1>very present, like they would have been aware right at

1247
01:06:28.440 --> 01:06:31.519
<v Speaker 1>the heart of the conversation around all of this, and

1248
01:06:31.599 --> 01:06:35.159
<v Speaker 1>it's that actually makes it feel more fascinating, like there

1249
01:06:35.320 --> 01:06:38.239
<v Speaker 1>is only really a couple of bits that confront it

1250
01:06:38.400 --> 01:06:41.000
<v Speaker 1>head on, but those bits do it head on in

1251
01:06:41.039 --> 01:06:44.960
<v Speaker 1>a way that was not happening in the seventies and

1252
01:06:45.239 --> 01:06:49.480
<v Speaker 1>even now would feel a bit strange, like this, this

1253
01:06:49.599 --> 01:06:51.239
<v Speaker 1>is hissed off Monty Python.

1254
01:06:51.760 --> 01:06:53.800
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's a really good way of putting it, especially

1255
01:06:53.840 --> 01:06:56.199
<v Speaker 2>with the way that it changes so often. I mean

1256
01:06:56.679 --> 01:07:01.000
<v Speaker 2>just thinking about like the Western scene where it's kind

1257
01:07:01.000 --> 01:07:03.840
<v Speaker 2>of western, kind of not. I mean it's taking place

1258
01:07:03.880 --> 01:07:06.000
<v Speaker 2>in a diner to the point where it has like

1259
01:07:06.039 --> 01:07:08.519
<v Speaker 2>the sliding door. It feels like it was a railroad

1260
01:07:08.559 --> 01:07:12.800
<v Speaker 2>car at some point, and it's like the whole thing

1261
01:07:12.800 --> 01:07:16.880
<v Speaker 2>of him having Harvey Lembeck playing music on the jukebox

1262
01:07:17.880 --> 01:07:21.400
<v Speaker 2>like as if it were a player piano. And then yeah,

1263
01:07:21.440 --> 01:07:23.639
<v Speaker 2>he ends up shooting one guy, but then there's the

1264
01:07:23.639 --> 01:07:26.760
<v Speaker 2>guy at the chessboard, and doesn't he end up just

1265
01:07:26.840 --> 01:07:30.920
<v Speaker 2>cutting that guy's hand off. So again with the dismemberment stuff,

1266
01:07:30.920 --> 01:07:32.960
<v Speaker 2>I'm just like, fuck yeah.

1267
01:07:33.119 --> 01:07:35.039
<v Speaker 1>Like that Bitty says it, it pulls out the player,

1268
01:07:35.199 --> 01:07:38.480
<v Speaker 1>chops his hand off and says, sorry, stranger, I thought

1269
01:07:38.519 --> 01:07:42.360
<v Speaker 1>you were cheating, which is just oh, that's like American

1270
01:07:42.440 --> 01:07:46.159
<v Speaker 1>collateral damage. Oh sorry, we invaded your country because we

1271
01:07:46.159 --> 01:07:51.199
<v Speaker 1>thought he might be a Domino, really davage. But I

1272
01:07:51.239 --> 01:07:52.840
<v Speaker 1>have to say I was like looking at that guy

1273
01:07:52.840 --> 01:07:55.679
<v Speaker 1>and being like, that guy looked so familiar. He gets

1274
01:07:55.719 --> 01:07:58.960
<v Speaker 1>his hand cut off, that is that is he's American.

1275
01:07:59.039 --> 01:08:01.519
<v Speaker 1>So I don't know if it's young Saint or Jan Saint.

1276
01:08:01.519 --> 01:08:05.400
<v Speaker 1>I'll say Jan Sat. He is the street preacher in

1277
01:08:05.519 --> 01:08:06.320
<v Speaker 1>Frank and Hooker.

1278
01:08:06.800 --> 01:08:08.800
<v Speaker 4>I am so glad you said that, because there's another

1279
01:08:08.880 --> 01:08:14.599
<v Speaker 4>head that way. Yes, because Beverly Bonner is credited for

1280
01:08:14.679 --> 01:08:16.960
<v Speaker 4>playing like a street walker. This is where I wish

1281
01:08:17.039 --> 01:08:19.079
<v Speaker 4>the print was cleaned up, because you can't really tell

1282
01:08:19.119 --> 01:08:22.199
<v Speaker 4>it's her, But Beverly Banner, Bond of Courses are beloved

1283
01:08:22.239 --> 01:08:26.039
<v Speaker 4>sex worker character in basket Cake amazing, I know, like

1284
01:08:26.079 --> 01:08:29.439
<v Speaker 4>the connections of this film are insane.

1285
01:08:29.640 --> 01:08:32.800
<v Speaker 1>And he would also play Santa in Jacob's Ladder.

1286
01:08:33.600 --> 01:08:36.000
<v Speaker 4>Oh my god, is there.

1287
01:08:35.840 --> 01:08:38.239
<v Speaker 1>Is no third Ain't actually like a weird like a

1288
01:08:38.720 --> 01:08:40.840
<v Speaker 1>is it like one of the in Stephen King's The

1289
01:08:40.920 --> 01:08:44.079
<v Speaker 1>doc Tower. It's like one of the beams. It connects

1290
01:08:44.079 --> 01:08:44.680
<v Speaker 1>the universe.

1291
01:08:44.760 --> 01:08:47.359
<v Speaker 4>It's going by the credits that which, by the way,

1292
01:08:47.399 --> 01:08:50.680
<v Speaker 4>there's so many great tracking shots in this fall beautiful,

1293
01:08:50.880 --> 01:08:53.840
<v Speaker 4>Like even even with the kind of not the best

1294
01:08:53.880 --> 01:08:56.680
<v Speaker 4>quality print we had to work with, you can still

1295
01:08:56.720 --> 01:08:59.239
<v Speaker 4>tell like the level of just carrot artistry. But there's

1296
01:08:59.239 --> 01:09:01.000
<v Speaker 4>a amazing track shot at the end when we get

1297
01:09:01.000 --> 01:09:06.439
<v Speaker 4>that just heartbreaking reveal and you realize, see you're in this,

1298
01:09:06.840 --> 01:09:09.479
<v Speaker 4>You're surround there's all kinds of people that are various

1299
01:09:09.560 --> 01:09:12.359
<v Speaker 4>levels of amputee and those are real veterans. This was

1300
01:09:12.359 --> 01:09:15.119
<v Speaker 4>shot at an actual hospital and it was late because

1301
01:09:15.119 --> 01:09:17.640
<v Speaker 4>there's like what in the thanks there's like a veterans

1302
01:09:17.720 --> 01:09:22.720
<v Speaker 4>group of like dismembered veterans, which again would not surprised

1303
01:09:22.760 --> 01:09:25.119
<v Speaker 4>mes sense like that doesn't make the country look good.

1304
01:09:25.640 --> 01:09:27.520
<v Speaker 4>If if this is what this is what we did

1305
01:09:27.560 --> 01:09:30.520
<v Speaker 4>to the young men that we sent off for this,

1306
01:09:30.920 --> 01:09:33.079
<v Speaker 4>so we'll just put them off to the side, forget

1307
01:09:33.119 --> 01:09:37.039
<v Speaker 4>them and again the bubble. That's where you get also

1308
01:09:37.560 --> 01:09:40.239
<v Speaker 4>is that like eleven and twelve are nurses. It's almost

1309
01:09:40.279 --> 01:09:41.399
<v Speaker 4>like a Wizard of Oz thing.

1310
01:09:41.920 --> 01:09:43.920
<v Speaker 1>The ending is one hundred percent doing the Wizard of World.

1311
01:09:43.920 --> 01:09:47.119
<v Speaker 1>They're all there, every person who has appeared is back

1312
01:09:47.119 --> 01:09:50.520
<v Speaker 1>there again, except it's not like the Wizard of Oz

1313
01:09:50.560 --> 01:09:54.079
<v Speaker 1>because it's like they're not they knew they wasn't like

1314
01:09:54.199 --> 01:09:55.600
<v Speaker 1>you were there and you were there and you were

1315
01:09:55.600 --> 01:09:56.880
<v Speaker 1>there because they all nowhere.

1316
01:09:57.239 --> 01:10:01.720
<v Speaker 4>It's not unhappy and what sort of it's but but

1317
01:10:01.880 --> 01:10:04.439
<v Speaker 4>almost in a wonder is we're eleven and twelve just

1318
01:10:04.439 --> 01:10:05.239
<v Speaker 4>like a fantasy.

1319
01:10:06.279 --> 01:10:09.239
<v Speaker 1>Personally, I think like I did see some people being like, oh,

1320
01:10:09.239 --> 01:10:11.279
<v Speaker 1>it's hard to tell what's Like a few people who

1321
01:10:11.319 --> 01:10:12.800
<v Speaker 1>have seen it's like, it's hard to tell what's real

1322
01:10:12.840 --> 01:10:15.359
<v Speaker 1>and not real, and I'm like, that's not the point.

1323
01:10:16.000 --> 01:10:19.479
<v Speaker 1>It's not. It's it's much more European in the way

1324
01:10:19.479 --> 01:10:21.840
<v Speaker 1>that it's approaching that way. It's like he's obviously sacked

1325
01:10:21.840 --> 01:10:24.000
<v Speaker 1>that there much he loves Fellini and all these people,

1326
01:10:24.359 --> 01:10:27.279
<v Speaker 1>and it is definitely leaning more to that honor. You

1327
01:10:27.359 --> 01:10:30.159
<v Speaker 1>don't have to explain things. It's not necessarily even though

1328
01:10:30.159 --> 01:10:32.640
<v Speaker 1>obviously the word absurdist mention a lot, I know it

1329
01:10:32.720 --> 01:10:36.479
<v Speaker 1>is actually more surrealist, and it even it just doesn't

1330
01:10:36.600 --> 01:10:39.359
<v Speaker 1>really matter. You just have to roll with it. And

1331
01:10:39.399 --> 01:10:43.479
<v Speaker 1>I think it's it's kind of like we mentioned Jacob's Ladder,

1332
01:10:43.479 --> 01:10:45.640
<v Speaker 1>and I've also seen a couple of people mention Johnny

1333
01:10:45.680 --> 01:10:48.840
<v Speaker 1>got He's gun and how this film is similar to that.

1334
01:10:50.479 --> 01:10:53.079
<v Speaker 1>There's a couple of ways that it's really significantly different.

1335
01:10:53.119 --> 01:10:55.560
<v Speaker 1>It's because Johnny got his gun, like you, sets you

1336
01:10:55.640 --> 01:10:58.399
<v Speaker 1>up from the beginning to know what's going on, so

1337
01:10:58.439 --> 01:11:02.159
<v Speaker 1>you can more like going with this person on a journey,

1338
01:11:02.960 --> 01:11:05.359
<v Speaker 1>whereas in this film, we're not going with him on

1339
01:11:05.399 --> 01:11:08.960
<v Speaker 1>a journey, were with him on whatever his quest is,

1340
01:11:09.960 --> 01:11:13.840
<v Speaker 1>and the structure reminded me a lot of modern video games,

1341
01:11:14.319 --> 01:11:17.239
<v Speaker 1>the way it's like these separate, little enclosed spaces and

1342
01:11:17.640 --> 01:11:20.159
<v Speaker 1>entering into them knowing that there's going to be something

1343
01:11:20.359 --> 01:11:25.319
<v Speaker 1>but not sure what it is, just to not coincidence exactly,

1344
01:11:25.359 --> 01:11:27.800
<v Speaker 1>but just fascinating how much it much like it feels

1345
01:11:27.840 --> 01:11:30.279
<v Speaker 1>more like that kind of structure, which in a video

1346
01:11:30.319 --> 01:11:32.760
<v Speaker 1>game we don't think about how chaotic and strange and

1347
01:11:32.800 --> 01:11:35.159
<v Speaker 1>separated all the parts are. You to roll with it,

1348
01:11:35.840 --> 01:11:40.239
<v Speaker 1>but it actually reminded me more of if there isn't

1349
01:11:40.239 --> 01:11:43.439
<v Speaker 1>a thirteen, feels like somewhere like halfway between Johnny Got

1350
01:11:43.520 --> 01:11:47.840
<v Speaker 1>His Gun and Ambrose. Abuse is an occurrence at our

1351
01:11:48.039 --> 01:11:52.159
<v Speaker 1>creek bridge, which is Jacob's ladder, but it's like the

1352
01:11:52.199 --> 01:11:55.439
<v Speaker 1>way that it differs from those is fascinating because it's

1353
01:11:55.520 --> 01:12:00.560
<v Speaker 1>like in an occurrence that our bridge character is fleeing something,

1354
01:12:00.600 --> 01:12:04.199
<v Speaker 1>they are trying to escape to something, whereas our hero

1355
01:12:04.359 --> 01:12:07.479
<v Speaker 1>in this film is so lost, like he's not even

1356
01:12:08.199 --> 01:12:13.640
<v Speaker 1>he is seemingly somewhat questing for something, but it's so

1357
01:12:13.920 --> 01:12:17.760
<v Speaker 1>fragmented and deavored and dismembered that he can't even put

1358
01:12:17.760 --> 01:12:21.560
<v Speaker 1>that together. And like in looking at thinking about this

1359
01:12:21.600 --> 01:12:25.640
<v Speaker 1>film and how it deals with violence and spectacle is

1360
01:12:25.680 --> 01:12:29.760
<v Speaker 1>also really fascinating because that is quite grotesque in parts

1361
01:12:29.920 --> 01:12:32.800
<v Speaker 1>literally in the mortuary sequence, that the great mortuary and

1362
01:12:32.840 --> 01:12:35.239
<v Speaker 1>auticition is pulling the brain out and making jokes about

1363
01:12:35.279 --> 01:12:38.039
<v Speaker 1>the guy's small brain to his large body and the

1364
01:12:38.159 --> 01:12:42.600
<v Speaker 1>hands and the feet and the meat. But it feels

1365
01:12:42.640 --> 01:12:45.560
<v Speaker 1>like a kind of five or six years before this,

1366
01:12:45.680 --> 01:12:48.560
<v Speaker 1>you have Bonnie and Clyde and the Wild Bunch, which

1367
01:12:48.600 --> 01:12:51.840
<v Speaker 1>he is universally seen has been, if not a response

1368
01:12:51.920 --> 01:12:55.159
<v Speaker 1>to Vietnam, at least like a side effect to Vietnam

1369
01:12:55.239 --> 01:12:57.880
<v Speaker 1>that you end up with his explosion of violence because

1370
01:12:57.920 --> 01:13:00.760
<v Speaker 1>of what people are experiencing and seeing what the news, etc.

1371
01:13:01.439 --> 01:13:05.439
<v Speaker 1>But also how the explosion of that kind of violence

1372
01:13:05.640 --> 01:13:07.600
<v Speaker 1>is also seen as a way of having This is

1373
01:13:07.600 --> 01:13:09.600
<v Speaker 1>where I was appearing to the water Benjamin and the

1374
01:13:09.600 --> 01:13:12.920
<v Speaker 1>guide bored. My brain was just breaking hat that it's

1375
01:13:13.359 --> 01:13:17.760
<v Speaker 1>this like the collapsing of histories and the returning to

1376
01:13:17.960 --> 01:13:23.319
<v Speaker 1>transferring the horror of the violence into nostalgia and displacing

1377
01:13:23.359 --> 01:13:25.600
<v Speaker 1>it into the past as a way to let it

1378
01:13:25.640 --> 01:13:29.399
<v Speaker 1>go and excuse it and forget it, and then having

1379
01:13:29.479 --> 01:13:33.600
<v Speaker 1>the film can ultimate scene be a Western quite violent.

1380
01:13:33.680 --> 01:13:36.520
<v Speaker 1>We have a dismemberment, we have like multiple people dead,

1381
01:13:37.239 --> 01:13:41.520
<v Speaker 1>but it's all encapsulated in this actual collapsing of history

1382
01:13:41.560 --> 01:13:44.880
<v Speaker 1>that it is seemingly like a train card Dino. Very modern,

1383
01:13:45.680 --> 01:13:48.119
<v Speaker 1>and that way also remind me Eliminade Joe, like it

1384
01:13:48.159 --> 01:13:52.439
<v Speaker 1>felt very check at time, the pop modern pop culture

1385
01:13:52.560 --> 01:13:56.920
<v Speaker 1>kind of collisions. I just I found that fascinating. How

1386
01:13:57.000 --> 01:14:00.960
<v Speaker 1>much of this film is like very society but very

1387
01:14:01.039 --> 01:14:05.119
<v Speaker 1>much like refusing to be that. Like there's no Catharsis

1388
01:14:05.119 --> 01:14:10.199
<v Speaker 1>in the Violin, there's no release, there's no here you go.

1389
01:14:10.279 --> 01:14:13.279
<v Speaker 1>So I film writer Katherine Russell, she's got a great

1390
01:14:13.279 --> 01:14:17.439
<v Speaker 1>book on narrative mortality and death and cinema in particularly

1391
01:14:17.520 --> 01:14:20.920
<v Speaker 1>new wave cinema, and she wrote that most of the

1392
01:14:21.000 --> 01:14:24.319
<v Speaker 1>violence in recent American film is grounded in a cyclical,

1393
01:14:24.560 --> 01:14:29.279
<v Speaker 1>repetitive schema of vengeance. And it's that final scene appears

1394
01:14:29.319 --> 01:14:31.880
<v Speaker 1>to be that like at the cyclical well, someone's coming

1395
01:14:31.880 --> 01:14:33.560
<v Speaker 1>back for revenge and this and that and all the

1396
01:14:33.560 --> 01:14:36.920
<v Speaker 1>sheriff for finishing, but it's all stripped of everything. It's

1397
01:14:36.960 --> 01:14:40.560
<v Speaker 1>not pretending to have anything that all the other films

1398
01:14:40.560 --> 01:14:43.640
<v Speaker 1>are like doing it. Just know this is you're just

1399
01:14:43.760 --> 01:14:47.159
<v Speaker 1>being confronted with this act of violent almost like a

1400
01:14:47.680 --> 01:14:51.239
<v Speaker 1>slightly more successful version of irreversible, of trying to strip

1401
01:14:51.239 --> 01:14:53.319
<v Speaker 1>out all the reasons and meanings for why you get

1402
01:14:53.359 --> 01:14:55.399
<v Speaker 1>to this cathartic act that you're allowed to enjoy as

1403
01:14:55.399 --> 01:14:58.920
<v Speaker 1>an audience. Instead, you're just displaced into this little mini

1404
01:14:58.960 --> 01:15:01.720
<v Speaker 1>prison filled with there fascinating.

1405
01:15:02.640 --> 01:15:05.239
<v Speaker 2>Just so you know, the comic strip that is on

1406
01:15:05.319 --> 01:15:09.319
<v Speaker 2>the pillow behind them, that is from Gasoline Alley, which

1407
01:15:09.359 --> 01:15:12.680
<v Speaker 2>is a long running comic from the US. I think

1408
01:15:12.680 --> 01:15:15.640
<v Speaker 2>it was started in nineteen eighteen and I don't know

1409
01:15:15.680 --> 01:15:19.079
<v Speaker 2>if it's still running today. I think it actually is.

1410
01:15:19.199 --> 01:15:21.119
<v Speaker 1>So there was a bunch of stuff on this So

1411
01:15:21.199 --> 01:15:23.479
<v Speaker 1>I'm just like, we need some old Americans here to

1412
01:15:23.680 --> 01:15:27.239
<v Speaker 1>explain who these people are. Because you were talking therese

1413
01:15:27.319 --> 01:15:29.960
<v Speaker 1>one that I looked up, the Orange Julius.

1414
01:15:30.439 --> 01:15:31.800
<v Speaker 2>Oh God, Orange Julius.

1415
01:15:31.880 --> 01:15:34.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and he's Buddy Clayton, and I managed to, like

1416
01:15:35.039 --> 01:15:38.000
<v Speaker 1>almost like the shadow of information, figure out that he's

1417
01:15:38.000 --> 01:15:40.880
<v Speaker 1>an old board Field period. But there's so many. I

1418
01:15:41.520 --> 01:15:43.920
<v Speaker 1>bet money that all the old dudes old board Field dudes.

1419
01:15:43.960 --> 01:15:46.479
<v Speaker 1>But the majority of them, the Internet hasn't found a

1420
01:15:46.520 --> 01:15:48.880
<v Speaker 1>reason to remember them yet. So you just end up, Oh,

1421
01:15:49.000 --> 01:15:52.640
<v Speaker 1>they were in one documentary or something and related to vaudeville,

1422
01:15:52.680 --> 01:15:54.560
<v Speaker 1>and it's like, Okay, cool piece of information.

1423
01:15:55.439 --> 01:15:58.119
<v Speaker 2>And just so you know, the secret to Orange Julius

1424
01:15:58.239 --> 01:16:01.880
<v Speaker 2>is egg white powder and milk powder and sweat. That's

1425
01:16:01.960 --> 01:16:07.039
<v Speaker 2>the secret. Yeah. Yeah, despite the rumors to the contrary. Yeah,

1426
01:16:07.079 --> 01:16:09.399
<v Speaker 2>and yeah, Heather, you're right about these tracking shots. There

1427
01:16:09.439 --> 01:16:11.439
<v Speaker 2>are some amazing ones that are going on. I mean,

1428
01:16:11.479 --> 01:16:13.119
<v Speaker 2>like I was saying, the whole thing with the that

1429
01:16:13.239 --> 01:16:15.520
<v Speaker 2>short film that's in there, when the guys are walking

1430
01:16:15.560 --> 01:16:18.880
<v Speaker 2>and they're in Vietnam, then suddenly they're in New York,

1431
01:16:18.960 --> 01:16:21.039
<v Speaker 2>so the you've got that kind of great use of

1432
01:16:21.079 --> 01:16:23.600
<v Speaker 2>the camera. But yeah, those tracking shots, especially down the

1433
01:16:23.600 --> 01:16:27.319
<v Speaker 2>hallways at the VA hospital. I mean the very first one,

1434
01:16:27.359 --> 01:16:29.560
<v Speaker 2>the first time we see them back the way, and

1435
01:16:29.600 --> 01:16:32.000
<v Speaker 2>I love the way he slides into the frame and

1436
01:16:32.039 --> 01:16:34.960
<v Speaker 2>then starts telling that joke and then yeah, the camera

1437
01:16:35.079 --> 01:16:38.119
<v Speaker 2>just slowly pushing in on him rolling down the hallway

1438
01:16:38.199 --> 01:16:39.000
<v Speaker 2>is fantastic.

1439
01:16:40.000 --> 01:16:43.439
<v Speaker 4>Oh God. And then that shot when he's with number

1440
01:16:43.479 --> 01:16:46.880
<v Speaker 4>twelve in bed and they embrace and then it just

1441
01:16:46.880 --> 01:16:49.439
<v Speaker 4>starts pulling away and it's almost like you're an elabyrinth

1442
01:16:49.479 --> 01:16:53.680
<v Speaker 4>of lamps and lighting and mirrors that it's really it's

1443
01:16:53.760 --> 01:16:58.279
<v Speaker 4>disorienting and it's beautiful. And it also feels like, even

1444
01:16:58.800 --> 01:17:00.680
<v Speaker 4>even in your first watch, do you feel like this

1445
01:17:00.720 --> 01:17:02.680
<v Speaker 4>is going to lead to something bad? Though we can't

1446
01:17:03.039 --> 01:17:05.199
<v Speaker 4>going in again to bed your whole feeling about the

1447
01:17:05.279 --> 01:17:09.760
<v Speaker 4>vibe of this film. It's just there's just just havness.

1448
01:17:10.159 --> 01:17:15.399
<v Speaker 4>And again it's something like super obvious. It's really just

1449
01:17:15.640 --> 01:17:18.119
<v Speaker 4>riveting how everything is balanced.

1450
01:17:18.920 --> 01:17:21.000
<v Speaker 2>And at the end of the film, like after we

1451
01:17:21.079 --> 01:17:23.800
<v Speaker 2>visit George and we get back to the birthday song

1452
01:17:24.319 --> 01:17:26.600
<v Speaker 2>and then we kind of move away from him, move

1453
01:17:26.920 --> 01:17:29.479
<v Speaker 2>out ast all those people that we're talking about. Then

1454
01:17:29.479 --> 01:17:32.119
<v Speaker 2>we again go through the halls of the VA hospital,

1455
01:17:32.159 --> 01:17:35.159
<v Speaker 2>but this time it's teeming with life, as opposed to

1456
01:17:35.279 --> 01:17:38.439
<v Speaker 2>the first time, where it's just there's Lembeck, there's the

1457
01:17:38.560 --> 01:17:42.079
<v Speaker 2>dancers and the piano player and the singer. That's it.

1458
01:17:42.159 --> 01:17:45.159
<v Speaker 2>You know, it feels very abandoned all that that montage

1459
01:17:45.239 --> 01:17:48.920
<v Speaker 2>of all the empty hallways, empty areas, and now during

1460
01:17:48.960 --> 01:17:51.319
<v Speaker 2>the day it's just filled with all of these people.

1461
01:17:51.319 --> 01:17:53.399
<v Speaker 2>And I love how when the credits start, because I

1462
01:17:53.399 --> 01:17:57.159
<v Speaker 2>think we go we go back to an elevator and

1463
01:17:57.239 --> 01:18:00.199
<v Speaker 2>we stop there and that's when the credits roll, and

1464
01:18:00.199 --> 01:18:03.199
<v Speaker 2>then you still hear all the chatter and the voices

1465
01:18:03.239 --> 01:18:05.880
<v Speaker 2>and stuff. You hear all of the noise that's happening

1466
01:18:05.920 --> 01:18:06.760
<v Speaker 2>at the hospital.

1467
01:18:07.600 --> 01:18:10.199
<v Speaker 4>I'm so glad we got to do this and that

1468
01:18:10.239 --> 01:18:12.159
<v Speaker 4>we got to see it like I would I would

1469
01:18:12.199 --> 01:18:14.800
<v Speaker 4>love for this film to like get get more eyes

1470
01:18:14.840 --> 01:18:17.760
<v Speaker 4>on it, even if and it's something I can't implore

1471
01:18:17.840 --> 01:18:19.560
<v Speaker 4>because I do feel like, and I don't know if

1472
01:18:19.600 --> 01:18:21.479
<v Speaker 4>you guys have run into this, I do feel like

1473
01:18:22.319 --> 01:18:25.119
<v Speaker 4>there's like a newer sort of breed a film fan

1474
01:18:25.159 --> 01:18:29.399
<v Speaker 4>where it's like, if something isn't in this pristine restoration print,

1475
01:18:29.399 --> 01:18:32.279
<v Speaker 4>they they're like, oh, I can't watch that. I've literally

1476
01:18:32.520 --> 01:18:34.319
<v Speaker 4>met people that are like, oh I can't, and I'm

1477
01:18:34.399 --> 01:18:37.479
<v Speaker 4>just like and I'm just ideally, of course, like in

1478
01:18:37.520 --> 01:18:39.720
<v Speaker 4>a perfect way to be great. If everything was in

1479
01:18:39.960 --> 01:18:43.760
<v Speaker 4>this ideal situation. A lot of films aren't. There's still

1480
01:18:44.159 --> 01:18:47.560
<v Speaker 4>so many films that are just waiting. And in this case, well,

1481
01:18:47.600 --> 01:18:51.800
<v Speaker 4>probably if there's no negative, there's no negative, this is it.

1482
01:18:52.000 --> 01:18:53.960
<v Speaker 4>This is It's probably about as good it is going

1483
01:18:54.039 --> 01:18:54.800
<v Speaker 4>to get.

1484
01:18:55.239 --> 01:18:58.600
<v Speaker 1>This is the one place where I've been waiting for

1485
01:18:58.720 --> 01:19:03.119
<v Speaker 1>AI for that we have good quality. AI trained to

1486
01:19:03.159 --> 01:19:06.399
<v Speaker 1>look at something like this, and I'm sure maybe we'll

1487
01:19:06.439 --> 01:19:09.600
<v Speaker 1>never be able to get the pillar boxing get rid

1488
01:19:09.600 --> 01:19:11.319
<v Speaker 1>of that, but to look at the image and just

1489
01:19:11.439 --> 01:19:14.399
<v Speaker 1>actually make it, clean it up, get the detail back

1490
01:19:14.439 --> 01:19:15.960
<v Speaker 1>in there. So this is the one thing that I

1491
01:19:16.000 --> 01:19:18.560
<v Speaker 1>want AI Corp. To say these loss all, like the

1492
01:19:18.600 --> 01:19:21.119
<v Speaker 1>one most of all on Ario Bava's Rabbit Dogs, to

1493
01:19:21.199 --> 01:19:25.319
<v Speaker 1>go back and fix all those awful VHS lips that

1494
01:19:25.359 --> 01:19:28.399
<v Speaker 1>pop in every six seconds and make it a very

1495
01:19:28.399 --> 01:19:32.079
<v Speaker 1>difficult watch Like that is definitely going to happen. That

1496
01:19:32.199 --> 01:19:35.239
<v Speaker 1>is at least one plus, but there is definitely. I

1497
01:19:35.560 --> 01:19:38.479
<v Speaker 1>don't haven't run into those people yet, but there's times

1498
01:19:38.520 --> 01:19:41.039
<v Speaker 1>we'll watch something I actually no, I don't need to

1499
01:19:41.079 --> 01:19:43.319
<v Speaker 1>see this like this. I can wait until it pops up.

1500
01:19:43.319 --> 01:19:45.840
<v Speaker 1>But that's with stuff that I know will one day

1501
01:19:45.880 --> 01:19:49.079
<v Speaker 1>pop up, and it comes to these This is it guys.

1502
01:19:49.399 --> 01:19:51.239
<v Speaker 4>If you're listening to this and you feel like you

1503
01:19:51.319 --> 01:19:53.680
<v Speaker 4>might be like this, open your mind, open your right

1504
01:19:53.720 --> 01:19:57.399
<v Speaker 4>because sometimes like it's better is it ideal? Now? But

1505
01:19:57.439 --> 01:19:59.920
<v Speaker 4>what in life is ideal? Like sometimes you just take

1506
01:20:00.119 --> 01:20:03.079
<v Speaker 4>take the riches where you can get them, and it's

1507
01:20:03.119 --> 01:20:05.359
<v Speaker 4>better to get a chance to see something that's great

1508
01:20:05.520 --> 01:20:08.920
<v Speaker 4>and that opens kind of your film experience than just

1509
01:20:09.319 --> 01:20:11.840
<v Speaker 4>I don't know and seeing Patch Adams, and.

1510
01:20:12.880 --> 01:20:15.720
<v Speaker 2>I hope that nobody that listens to the projection booth

1511
01:20:15.800 --> 01:20:18.680
<v Speaker 2>is one of these people that's like, oh, if it's

1512
01:20:18.720 --> 01:20:22.159
<v Speaker 2>not streaming, it doesn't exist for me. It's like, look

1513
01:20:22.239 --> 01:20:24.560
<v Speaker 2>behind us, you know, look behind the three of us.

1514
01:20:24.600 --> 01:20:27.800
<v Speaker 2>I'm sure we all have piles of DVDs and Blu rays.

1515
01:20:27.840 --> 01:20:30.159
<v Speaker 2>You know. It's like, yeah, physical media, you need to

1516
01:20:30.159 --> 01:20:33.159
<v Speaker 2>have it in your life because go to fucking Netflix.

1517
01:20:33.199 --> 01:20:36.760
<v Speaker 2>Nothing before what nineteen seventy four is streaming on there?

1518
01:20:36.800 --> 01:20:39.159
<v Speaker 2>Like one movie from the seventies, maybe a few, And

1519
01:20:39.199 --> 01:20:41.479
<v Speaker 2>it's like, for Fox's sakes, guys.

1520
01:20:41.920 --> 01:20:47.000
<v Speaker 1>It's like media breth aiuans like just to survive on

1521
01:20:47.079 --> 01:20:48.319
<v Speaker 1>something that's not there.

1522
01:20:49.199 --> 01:20:51.960
<v Speaker 4>To me, streaming is like a it's like a great appetizer,

1523
01:20:52.199 --> 01:20:54.359
<v Speaker 4>but you don't always need an appetizer for your meal.

1524
01:20:54.560 --> 01:20:57.520
<v Speaker 4>Like it's great if it's there, but physical media is

1525
01:20:57.560 --> 01:21:01.479
<v Speaker 4>where it's at because streaming also nothing security. Things disappear

1526
01:21:01.520 --> 01:21:04.359
<v Speaker 4>all the time, and then you're just kind of left, oh, shoot,

1527
01:21:04.520 --> 01:21:07.399
<v Speaker 4>I was going to rewatch this movie. It's not there anymore.

1528
01:21:07.439 --> 01:21:09.359
<v Speaker 4>But if you own it. You don't have to worry

1529
01:21:09.399 --> 01:21:09.720
<v Speaker 4>about that.

1530
01:21:10.720 --> 01:21:12.760
<v Speaker 1>I think if you, if you are any people out

1531
01:21:12.760 --> 01:21:14.720
<v Speaker 1>there who are interested in this, but maybe do you

1532
01:21:14.720 --> 01:21:20.640
<v Speaker 1>struggle with those kind of impose limitations on quality watch

1533
01:21:20.760 --> 01:21:24.079
<v Speaker 1>video drome before this and then immediately mainline this film

1534
01:21:24.119 --> 01:21:28.000
<v Speaker 1>and just like you are experiencing a VHS broadcast from

1535
01:21:28.039 --> 01:21:31.079
<v Speaker 1>the inferiority of someone's hell, and it's perfect.

1536
01:21:31.680 --> 01:21:34.359
<v Speaker 4>I love that. I also support the projection booth to

1537
01:21:34.439 --> 01:21:35.199
<v Speaker 4>become a patron.

1538
01:21:35.880 --> 01:21:37.760
<v Speaker 1>I do have to say one thing before we wrap

1539
01:21:37.800 --> 01:21:41.239
<v Speaker 1>it up. There was one other person in the credits

1540
01:21:41.239 --> 01:21:43.359
<v Speaker 1>who when I saw that was like, what I know?

1541
01:21:43.520 --> 01:21:47.640
<v Speaker 1>That name Virginia Field, who was the assistant art director

1542
01:21:48.560 --> 01:21:51.039
<v Speaker 1>would go on to be the art director and production

1543
01:21:51.119 --> 01:21:53.880
<v Speaker 1>designer on Friday the thirteenth.

1544
01:21:54.000 --> 01:21:54.279
<v Speaker 8>Yeah.

1545
01:21:54.359 --> 01:21:57.479
<v Speaker 1>I was like, actually that feels that's that's interesting. This

1546
01:21:57.720 --> 01:22:04.359
<v Speaker 1>that really tactile America Anna like nostalgia but dangerous. It

1547
01:22:04.439 --> 01:22:07.119
<v Speaker 1>was like, that makes a lot of sense that she

1548
01:22:07.159 --> 01:22:09.600
<v Speaker 1>would be involved in both. She also worked here on

1549
01:22:09.640 --> 01:22:13.880
<v Speaker 1>A Strangers Watching Exterminated too, I'm assuming the Harp that

1550
01:22:13.960 --> 01:22:18.800
<v Speaker 1>William Sachs made, and my own personal nostalgia filmography and

1551
01:22:18.880 --> 01:22:22.640
<v Speaker 1>Moving Violations. She was the art director on that was

1552
01:22:24.119 --> 01:22:27.680
<v Speaker 1>Virginia Field has imbued my childhood brain to a high

1553
01:22:27.720 --> 01:22:29.239
<v Speaker 1>degree with just two films.

1554
01:22:30.000 --> 01:22:30.439
<v Speaker 7>Is that the.

1555
01:22:30.399 --> 01:22:32.600
<v Speaker 4>Company that Fred Willard has a pardon?

1556
01:22:33.520 --> 01:22:36.720
<v Speaker 1>I can't remember Fred Willer, isn't it but that weird

1557
01:22:36.760 --> 01:22:38.680
<v Speaker 1>skinny guy and he gets the chainsaw and he's got

1558
01:22:38.680 --> 01:22:39.319
<v Speaker 1>the hockey mask.

1559
01:22:39.359 --> 01:22:39.479
<v Speaker 7>Go on.

1560
01:22:39.600 --> 01:22:41.880
<v Speaker 1>I was like, they all lose their licenses and so

1561
01:22:41.920 --> 01:22:43.399
<v Speaker 1>they have to go to a driving school. I think

1562
01:22:43.399 --> 01:22:45.720
<v Speaker 1>it's it's got like somebody's brother in it. Might be

1563
01:22:45.840 --> 01:22:47.640
<v Speaker 1>like Doyle Murray.

1564
01:22:48.039 --> 01:22:49.760
<v Speaker 4>That sounds like something I saw a lot as a

1565
01:22:49.760 --> 01:22:52.560
<v Speaker 4>little kid on Keyble. This is you just un likely some.

1566
01:22:52.640 --> 01:22:58.600
<v Speaker 1>Memory horror Police Academy Comedies nineteen eighty five, directed by

1567
01:22:58.640 --> 01:23:07.800
<v Speaker 1>Neil Israel, John Murray, not even not even Brian Jennifer Tilley, Jamesker.

1568
01:23:07.560 --> 01:23:11.840
<v Speaker 2>The woman that played the Where's the Beef Girl? The

1569
01:23:11.920 --> 01:23:13.439
<v Speaker 2>lady was in that, I think too.

1570
01:23:14.239 --> 01:23:16.960
<v Speaker 1>Clara Peller, Fred Willard, yep.

1571
01:23:17.800 --> 01:23:19.960
<v Speaker 4>Call blast Clara Peller Yeah.

1572
01:23:19.960 --> 01:23:23.800
<v Speaker 2>And Wendy Joe Sperber. Yeah. This the cast is amazing.

1573
01:23:24.800 --> 01:23:27.159
<v Speaker 4>Oh god, because there's this whole interaction with Wendy Josperber

1574
01:23:27.199 --> 01:23:30.840
<v Speaker 4>and Fred Willard about oh my god, oh my god, Ben,

1575
01:23:30.880 --> 01:23:34.039
<v Speaker 4>this is wild I saw this much as a kid,

1576
01:23:34.159 --> 01:23:36.840
<v Speaker 4>like this dangerous don cheetle.

1577
01:23:37.239 --> 01:23:41.119
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, that was another Neil Israel pat Proft joint.

1578
01:23:41.239 --> 01:23:44.239
<v Speaker 2>I talked with those guys for what was that real genius?

1579
01:23:44.279 --> 01:23:48.159
<v Speaker 1>I think Sally Kellerman, Hey ga moving violations of rewatch

1580
01:23:48.239 --> 01:23:48.680
<v Speaker 1>coming up.

1581
01:23:49.000 --> 01:23:50.640
<v Speaker 2>All right, we're going to take a break and play

1582
01:23:50.640 --> 01:23:53.760
<v Speaker 2>a preview for next week's show right after these brief messages.

1583
01:23:54.600 --> 01:23:58.439
<v Speaker 2>Some people think Move is about movie. Some people think

1584
01:23:58.520 --> 01:24:00.840
<v Speaker 2>Move is about the system breaking.

1585
01:24:00.600 --> 01:24:06.319
<v Speaker 6>Down, the loasi, there's no respect for anything.

1586
01:24:06.800 --> 01:24:09.439
<v Speaker 2>Some people think Move is about the communication.

1587
01:24:09.000 --> 01:24:10.600
<v Speaker 3>Gap blah blah blah.

1588
01:24:10.680 --> 01:24:11.920
<v Speaker 2>Some people think Move.

1589
01:24:11.800 --> 01:24:13.239
<v Speaker 5>Is about the battle of the sexiest.

1590
01:24:14.520 --> 01:24:16.239
<v Speaker 6>I think you really are going crackers.

1591
01:24:16.439 --> 01:24:21.359
<v Speaker 3>You live so nice dream no Jewish brega wig law.

1592
01:24:23.880 --> 01:24:27.199
<v Speaker 6>Some people think Move is just an entertaining comedy.

1593
01:24:27.479 --> 01:24:30.600
<v Speaker 2>Some people think Move is more than that. Tell me

1594
01:24:31.439 --> 01:24:34.840
<v Speaker 2>when we start picking up weird laws, I come for

1595
01:24:34.960 --> 01:24:36.239
<v Speaker 2>you right in short.

1596
01:24:36.920 --> 01:24:40.159
<v Speaker 6>Some people think, and some people don't, and some.

1597
01:24:40.079 --> 01:24:45.680
<v Speaker 2>People just move. It's pure goove, move right it are

1598
01:24:57.720 --> 01:25:00.600
<v Speaker 2>That's right. Our look at obscure films continues next week.

1599
01:25:00.640 --> 01:25:03.760
<v Speaker 2>When we take a peek at Move, get ready to

1600
01:25:03.760 --> 01:25:06.640
<v Speaker 2>have that soundtrack song stuck in your head. Until then,

1601
01:25:06.680 --> 01:25:08.520
<v Speaker 2>I want to thank my co hosts Other and Ben,

1602
01:25:08.640 --> 01:25:10.239
<v Speaker 2>so Ben, what's going on with you, sir?

1603
01:25:10.960 --> 01:25:14.079
<v Speaker 1>Not a whole lot at the moment. In between things,

1604
01:25:14.399 --> 01:25:17.560
<v Speaker 1>I did a bunch of rushes for Apple Side of Vinegar,

1605
01:25:17.600 --> 01:25:21.079
<v Speaker 1>which is like taking Netflix by storm and stirring up

1606
01:25:21.159 --> 01:25:26.039
<v Speaker 1>various amounts of dialogue on either side about shitty Australians

1607
01:25:26.039 --> 01:25:29.239
<v Speaker 1>in the health industry. It looked good for the thousand

1608
01:25:29.359 --> 01:25:30.840
<v Speaker 1>or so hours have I watched of it, so I'd

1609
01:25:30.880 --> 01:25:33.920
<v Speaker 1>recommend that it's not a thousand hours long, just the

1610
01:25:34.039 --> 01:25:38.079
<v Speaker 1>rushes were Otherwise, I'm just on letterboxed as usual. You

1611
01:25:38.119 --> 01:25:42.279
<v Speaker 1>can find me. There is dissolve Pet, one word diss

1612
01:25:42.960 --> 01:25:47.720
<v Speaker 1>l ved pet, and I come say hi and like

1613
01:25:48.399 --> 01:25:51.079
<v Speaker 1>I'm trying to make sense more and I write on

1614
01:25:51.239 --> 01:25:56.760
<v Speaker 1>the bear with Me though sometimes I forget about the

1615
01:25:56.800 --> 01:25:59.800
<v Speaker 1>making scent part and Heather, what's keeping you?

1616
01:26:01.199 --> 01:26:03.359
<v Speaker 4>I'll use this chance to mention I have some essay

1617
01:26:03.560 --> 01:26:07.399
<v Speaker 4>work that has popped up the recent Arrow has released

1618
01:26:07.399 --> 01:26:11.159
<v Speaker 4>this beautiful edition of the Cell which has many great

1619
01:26:11.159 --> 01:26:15.479
<v Speaker 4>supplements and mad Thanks to Alexandra Hella Nichols for bringing

1620
01:26:15.479 --> 01:26:17.319
<v Speaker 4>me up board for that where I get to write

1621
01:26:17.359 --> 01:26:21.119
<v Speaker 4>about music video a work and how that plays into

1622
01:26:21.319 --> 01:26:24.359
<v Speaker 4>the film and its director and you can get that

1623
01:26:24.359 --> 01:26:26.920
<v Speaker 4>that is currently available now and terror Vision. I have

1624
01:26:27.119 --> 01:26:30.039
<v Speaker 4>essays on thirty release of Dance or Dive, which is

1625
01:26:30.079 --> 01:26:33.479
<v Speaker 4>a very fun if you love low budget mid eighties

1626
01:26:33.720 --> 01:26:40.680
<v Speaker 4>Las Vegas horror, monsters, ballet, modern dance guests please Cocaine,

1627
01:26:40.880 --> 01:26:43.960
<v Speaker 4>Oh my God, check it out. My essay is on

1628
01:26:44.000 --> 01:26:46.359
<v Speaker 4>that as well as their at least of the very

1629
01:26:46.399 --> 01:26:51.479
<v Speaker 4>technicolor gorgeous early eighties Korean horror film Suddenly in the Dark.

1630
01:26:52.079 --> 01:26:54.760
<v Speaker 4>So those we're both through terror Vision. For anything else

1631
01:26:54.800 --> 01:26:57.680
<v Speaker 4>in other sundries, go to my linktree Linktree dot com.

1632
01:26:57.720 --> 01:26:59.319
<v Speaker 4>Forward slash Mondo Heather.

1633
01:27:00.039 --> 01:27:02.000
<v Speaker 2>Thanks again folks for being on the show. Thanks to

1634
01:27:02.039 --> 01:27:03.800
<v Speaker 2>everybody for listening. If you want to hear more of

1635
01:27:03.800 --> 01:27:05.319
<v Speaker 2>me shooting off my mouth, check out some of the

1636
01:27:05.319 --> 01:27:07.159
<v Speaker 2>other shows that I work on. They're all available at

1637
01:27:07.199 --> 01:27:10.680
<v Speaker 2>Weirdingwaymedia dot com. Thanks especially to our Patreon community. If

1638
01:27:10.720 --> 01:27:13.479
<v Speaker 2>you want to join the community, visit patreon dot com.

1639
01:27:13.479 --> 01:27:16.640
<v Speaker 2>Slash Projection Booth. Every donation we get helps a Projection

1640
01:27:16.680 --> 01:28:44.720
<v Speaker 2>Booth take over the world.

1641
01:28:00.520 --> 01:28:53.680
<v Speaker 11>Time the first at the Crowning Rock, The Guy, a

1642
01:28:53.920 --> 01:30:06.000
<v Speaker 11>Boy with a Girl, They gud required to condy to

1643
01:30:06.199 --> 01:30:17.000
<v Speaker 11>return to contact of this stuffs to confist of the

1644
01:30:17.199 --> 01:30:20.800
<v Speaker 11>first man, Spectac