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<v Speaker 1>Oh get it's show tied.

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<v Speaker 2>People say, good money to see this movie.

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<v Speaker 3>When they go out to a theater, they want clothed sodas, popcorn,

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<v Speaker 3>and no monsters in the protection booth.

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<v Speaker 1>Everyone pretend podcasting isn't boring. Cut it off.

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<v Speaker 4>My goal is an effects artist to show you something

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<v Speaker 4>that there's no way you could have followed yourself.

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<v Speaker 3>Suddenly we had unleashed the writer's minds. They couldn't show

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<v Speaker 3>any story they wanted to. The whole business exploded and

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<v Speaker 3>we did indeed become lock stars.

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<v Speaker 2>I watched this.

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<v Speaker 4>It's more than just a makeup artist. They do practical effects.

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<v Speaker 4>You like to be scared of the movies, well apparently

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<v Speaker 4>you're not alone.

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<v Speaker 2>Eighties four was a big thing. It was so black,

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<v Speaker 2>it's so hot.

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<v Speaker 5>In fact, it's even gained a certain glamor.

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<v Speaker 1>You ever been watching a movie or promercio, You found

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<v Speaker 1>yourself wondering how they do that.

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<v Speaker 3>DEEE.

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<v Speaker 1>Johnson creates the monsters.

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<v Speaker 3>So like I had to prove myself because I wasn't

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<v Speaker 3>good at sports. I had this one thing that I

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<v Speaker 3>could do. That making the best monster I could made

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<v Speaker 3>me kind of belong. Rick Baker my hero, he had

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<v Speaker 3>just done the Cantena sequence for Star Wars.

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<v Speaker 4>He gave me his phone number and.

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<v Speaker 3>He said, listen, you ever make out to Hollywood, gimme

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<v Speaker 3>a pop.

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<v Speaker 4>I loaded up my car. We're just a bunch of kids.

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<v Speaker 4>We don't know how to do this because it's probably

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<v Speaker 4>not possible in the first place.

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<v Speaker 2>They come out of the woodwork. They're so strange.

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<v Speaker 3>If they didn't have this thing to do, they'd probably

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<v Speaker 3>be working at a gas station where.

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<v Speaker 2>We provided a lot of worker. The especial effects guy.

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<v Speaker 4>Went home and bought ten pounds of coocaine.

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<v Speaker 2>I would not have to see.

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<v Speaker 4>James Cameron is the only director that made me cry.

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<v Speaker 4>But I did love it, but because he made my work.

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<v Speaker 4>Without it, you have the work and then you partying,

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<v Speaker 4>which is phenomenal. Steve's favorite word must have been like,

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<v Speaker 4>this really can't be done. We gotta figure out how

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<v Speaker 4>to do it. I just wanted to create fun stuff.

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<v Speaker 3>Our stars are fading, and now technology wipes it out.

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<v Speaker 3>Now where the dinosaurs they put so much love energy,

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<v Speaker 3>The audience thinks it's done digitally anyway.

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<v Speaker 2>He's the architect of his own misfortune.

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<v Speaker 5>Steve was kind of in this other realm.

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<v Speaker 4>These drugs do thank you better tell they take you

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<v Speaker 4>down and I snapped. Really is extraordinary. All these kids had.

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<v Speaker 5>Such a bit fair.

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<v Speaker 4>I don't think Steve ever got the credit that he

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<v Speaker 4>really deserved for a lot of things he did.

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<v Speaker 3>I'm gonna make some of the greatest movies over and

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<v Speaker 3>then I'm just gonna slam it in a great frange

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<v Speaker 3>a brick wall. Don't jump from the smoking wreck, kids,

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<v Speaker 3>this movie's gonna ruin what's left of my ragged career.

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<v Speaker 5>Hey, folks, welcome to a special episode of the Projection Booth.

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<v Speaker 5>I'm your host Mike. On this episode, I'm talking with

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<v Speaker 5>Nick Taylor. He is the director of the new documentary Rubberhead,

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<v Speaker 5>The Life and Monsters of Steve Johnson. If you are

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<v Speaker 5>into effects, especially those from the eighties and nineties, you

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<v Speaker 5>are definitely going to be interested in this film. Even

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<v Speaker 5>if you're not, you're going to be interested in this film.

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<v Speaker 5>It's a lot of fun. Film is getting its premiere

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<v Speaker 5>over at the Fantasia Film Festival in Montreal, Quebec. If

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<v Speaker 5>you are within the son of my voice and able

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<v Speaker 5>to see this movie, definitely check it out. Thanks so

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<v Speaker 5>much for listening, and I hope you enjoyed this interview.

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<v Speaker 5>Can you tell me how you got involved in show business?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, absolutely so. I've been a writer for dread Central

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<v Speaker 2>for about six seven years now. I've had a podcast

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<v Speaker 2>on horror filmmaking. Spent a lot of time just trying

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<v Speaker 2>to figure out how to get into the industry. But

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<v Speaker 2>I've been involved in horror journalism for a while, and

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<v Speaker 2>there was a movie I was working on from like

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<v Speaker 2>for a really long time. I was working on making

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<v Speaker 2>an interactive VR zombie movie, and I spent a lot

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<v Speaker 2>of time doing that. Didn't end up becoming anything because

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<v Speaker 2>it was basically trying to do something that would just

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<v Speaker 2>like millions of dollars for a lot lot less, and

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<v Speaker 2>so spun my wheels on that for many years. But

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<v Speaker 2>it taught me how to write. It taught me how

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<v Speaker 2>to do a lot of things. But yeah, from there,

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<v Speaker 2>just wanted to somehow be peripherally involved in the industry

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<v Speaker 2>and became a journalist. I was writing for Dread and

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<v Speaker 2>started my podcast in the Nick Taylor Horror Show, where

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<v Speaker 2>I talked to horror filmmakers and directors and basically asked

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<v Speaker 2>them how they got their movies made, which was essentially

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<v Speaker 2>my film school because I never went to film school.

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<v Speaker 2>Wanted to learn how you got movies made from people

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<v Speaker 2>who did it. And I have a lot of friends

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<v Speaker 2>who went to film school, and I hear a lot

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<v Speaker 2>of the same thing, which is, it's great, you learn

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<v Speaker 2>a lot. It's fun to just go to college for movies.

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<v Speaker 2>You meet a lot of great people. But there's so

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<v Speaker 2>many practical aspects of filmmaking that they don't cover. So

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<v Speaker 2>I wanted my podcast to basically beat the answer that,

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<v Speaker 2>but specifically for horror filmmaking. So I just spent years

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<v Speaker 2>interviewing horror directors and learning how they got their movies made,

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<v Speaker 2>and then eventually got around and making my own. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>basically it.

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<v Speaker 5>Well, and how did you choose Steve Johnson as your

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<v Speaker 5>subject for this?

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<v Speaker 2>I met Steve at Monster Palooza, and I've been a

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<v Speaker 2>fan of his since I was literally a child, and

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<v Speaker 2>I was a kind of a lonely horror fan. I

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<v Speaker 2>didn't have many other friends who were into the genre,

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<v Speaker 2>and I was into all this weird monster stuff and

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<v Speaker 2>was always drawing monsters and sculpting them. And I had

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<v Speaker 2>teachers at the time who discouraged it because it was

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<v Speaker 2>scaring other kids and things like that. So I think

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<v Speaker 2>I was led to feel like sort of an outcast

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<v Speaker 2>and a misfit. And when you're like six or seven,

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<v Speaker 2>I can make you insecure, and I think a lot

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<v Speaker 2>of us horror fans went through that as a kid.

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<v Speaker 2>You're not sure what to make of you being drawn

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<v Speaker 2>to all sorts of weird stuff and blood and gore

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<v Speaker 2>and monsters and things like that. So I felt like

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<v Speaker 2>a little bit like an outcast. But then I see

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<v Speaker 2>Scare Tactics, and I see Steve and Lena, and there's

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<v Speaker 2>this really cool, strapping, handsome guy who's at the top

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<v Speaker 2>of the industry doing these amazing movies, making a living,

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<v Speaker 2>doing all this stuff that I love making monsters and

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<v Speaker 2>blood and gore effects. And I was just like, oh

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<v Speaker 2>my god, this is first of all, this is a living,

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<v Speaker 2>But second of all, there's this really cool guy who's

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<v Speaker 2>doing it. And I really immediately looked up to him

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<v Speaker 2>because he kind of validated me, you know, it didn't

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<v Speaker 2>make me feel so alone. So I just it gave

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<v Speaker 2>me sort of a permission to pursue this as a

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<v Speaker 2>real career, that you can take this passion for something

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<v Speaker 2>that's so obscure and you can actually make a living

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<v Speaker 2>out of it, because he was at the top of

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<v Speaker 2>the industry around that time. So I felt sort of

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<v Speaker 2>a spiritual connection to him at a young age. And

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<v Speaker 2>then later many years later, met him at Monster Palooza

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<v Speaker 2>and we started talking and got to know each other,

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<v Speaker 2>and I learned all of these different stories from his

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<v Speaker 2>life was helping him promote a project he was working on,

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<v Speaker 2>where he would tell me a story from his overall

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<v Speaker 2>life and I would pitch it to the media the

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<v Speaker 2>next day. And it was like storytime with Steve for

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<v Speaker 2>about a week, and every story was just one was

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<v Speaker 2>more insane and amazing than the next, and they all

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<v Speaker 2>involved drugs and alcohol. They all took place on these major,

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<v Speaker 2>enormous movies like Ghostbusters, and he would tell them and

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<v Speaker 2>he would be so hilarious, and I just wanted to

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<v Speaker 2>recreate that feeling of just kind of being at a

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<v Speaker 2>bar with this fascinating guy who lived this incredible life

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<v Speaker 2>and just, you know, drink after drink, he's telling you

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<v Speaker 2>his life story, but in any case, I'm jumping all

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<v Speaker 2>over the timeline. He would tell me these wonderful stories,

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<v Speaker 2>I'd pitched them. One of them went viral. There was

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<v Speaker 2>a whole story about Steve doing just insane amounts of

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<v Speaker 2>cocaine to create slanmer for Ghostbusters that bloody disgusting. Put

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<v Speaker 2>that story out and it went fairly viral, and it

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<v Speaker 2>was in different languages, which was really funny. After a while,

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<v Speaker 2>I was like, my god, your life story is amazing.

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<v Speaker 2>Somebody should tell it, and I think it should be me.

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<v Speaker 2>And yeah, it took years because we were as indie

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<v Speaker 2>as a get, but yeah, that was the origin of it.

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<v Speaker 5>Well, yeah, I mean every film is a struggle, right,

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<v Speaker 5>It's like a battle. Some people describe it as So

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<v Speaker 5>what was your battles? What were the things that really

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<v Speaker 5>kind of hurt you or were stopping you, and how'd

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<v Speaker 5>you overcome them?

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<v Speaker 2>Well, it took a long time because we would just

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<v Speaker 2>shoot what we could when we could, and then when

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<v Speaker 2>we ran out of money, we would stop and we'd

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<v Speaker 2>kind of pick it up and put it down, which

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<v Speaker 2>luckily you can do very easily with documentaries because it's

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<v Speaker 2>you don't need you know, we shot this movie over

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<v Speaker 2>the course of many years. Steve's appearance fluctuates a little bit,

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<v Speaker 2>but it doesn't matter really, So luckily you can do that.

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<v Speaker 2>So I think just the eddy nature of it was

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<v Speaker 2>a bit of a challenge. We pitched it for years

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<v Speaker 2>and we kept hearing the same thing from major players,

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<v Speaker 2>like we love this, we love Steve, but it's too

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<v Speaker 2>niche for us, And I mean that was good feedback.

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<v Speaker 2>But from day one, I did want to make something

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<v Speaker 2>that was at niche, that didn't feel like a fan documentary,

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<v Speaker 2>that felt more like an actual, dimensionalized ortrait of an artist,

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<v Speaker 2>albeit a troubled one in this case, but also an

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<v Speaker 2>exploration of this history of practical effects. I wanted the

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<v Speaker 2>movie to stand on its own two feet as a

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<v Speaker 2>compelling character study, but also be something that was fun

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<v Speaker 2>and really amusing for horror and effects fans as well.

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<v Speaker 2>But yeah, I think so those are the challenges. Documentaries

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<v Speaker 2>are incredibly complicated. I had no idea they were as complicated.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, usually when you're shooting a narrative feature, you

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<v Speaker 2>shoot it and you edit. There's always more to it.

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<v Speaker 2>Of course, there's reshoots and there's complexities and difficulties. But

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<v Speaker 2>with a doc you shoot all of the stuff, and

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<v Speaker 2>you keep shooting. You don't know when to stop shooting.

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<v Speaker 2>You keep discovering new material, there's all this arc, endless

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<v Speaker 2>amounts of archival that you can get, rabbit holes you

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<v Speaker 2>can go down. So you have just all of this

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<v Speaker 2>material and you have to somehow be a puzzle together.

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<v Speaker 2>And there's always something you don't have, There's always something

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<v Speaker 2>you don't know that you don't have, and it's definitely complex.

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<v Speaker 2>So I think navigating that was certainly a challenge.

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<v Speaker 5>Well, how was Steve to work with as a documentary

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<v Speaker 5>subject and was he open to being a documentary subject?

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, we had a lot of fun. He was

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<v Speaker 2>a lot of fun. I think I kept saying, like

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<v Speaker 2>one of my jokes was the reason was taking so

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<v Speaker 2>long is because I don't want it to end, because

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<v Speaker 2>it's just so much fun to work on. And Luckily,

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<v Speaker 2>he's very self effacing. He doesn't shy away from talking

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<v Speaker 2>about anything. Really. He would just very easily talk about

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<v Speaker 2>the drugs and debauchery and absolute insanity, but also be

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<v Speaker 2>really honest about bridges that he's burned and things he's

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<v Speaker 2>done wrong and stuff like that. And I think he's

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<v Speaker 2>just had a lot of time to reflect and he's

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<v Speaker 2>very honest, which I think is one of the things

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<v Speaker 2>that I was very refreshed by it, but it was

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<v Speaker 2>a lot of fun. It was definitely a lot of fun.

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<v Speaker 5>Well, you talked about your podcast and how that was

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<v Speaker 5>kind of like your film school by talking with all

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<v Speaker 5>these people, what lessons from that were able to apply

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<v Speaker 5>to this dock.

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<v Speaker 2>With every episode I would do with a director, I

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<v Speaker 2>would summarize like the key learnings that I got at

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<v Speaker 2>the end of every episode, like here's what we learned today.

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<v Speaker 2>And I think over time these lessons just especially me

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<v Speaker 2>going through the exercise of listening to them again and

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<v Speaker 2>then coming up with internalizing and then externalizing what were

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<v Speaker 2>the key lessons learned here? Really helped ingrain directorial sensibilities

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<v Speaker 2>into my head and instinct, which was really good. But

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<v Speaker 2>I think one of the big things was trusting your intuition.

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<v Speaker 2>But there's a counterbalance to them, like you do have

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<v Speaker 2>to trust your intuition, but you don't want to fall

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<v Speaker 2>in love with your own voice too much either. Where

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<v Speaker 2>I did have it's like you're turning into a frequency,

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<v Speaker 2>like the movie had a frequency that I was tuned into.

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<v Speaker 2>But I know myself and I know my sensibility, and

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<v Speaker 2>I know I'm a huge fan. I'm a horror fan.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm a huge fan of practical effects, So there was

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<v Speaker 2>all this cool stuff that I wanted in the movie

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<v Speaker 2>that Luckily, I had a wonderful editor, Joe Krings, who

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<v Speaker 2>is not a horror fan and he's sinophile and an

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<v Speaker 2>incredible editor, and he was able to keep things very objective.

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<v Speaker 2>So then having the counterbalance of the right collaborator is critical.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, I learned it is your job as a

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<v Speaker 2>director to not necessarily have all of the vision and

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<v Speaker 2>all of the answers, but to surround yourself with people

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<v Speaker 2>who will help you find it, who can counterbalance and basically,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, save you from yourself in certain cases. Just

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<v Speaker 2>working with people who can counterbalance you men regard was

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<v Speaker 2>a really big lesson.

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<v Speaker 5>Obviously you've got Steve as your primary source, but what

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<v Speaker 5>were some of those other rich veins that you were

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<v Speaker 5>able to uncover while you're going through this?

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<v Speaker 2>Well, we in choosing who else to interview. We originally

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<v Speaker 2>were going down the path of trying to get some

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<v Speaker 2>major names and bigger, big filmmakers talking, but it's very

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<v Speaker 2>time consuming. It is we really difficult to do that.

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<v Speaker 2>You have to chase them down, and even if you

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<v Speaker 2>do get them, it's like Okay, they're between scenes, maybe

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<v Speaker 2>you can get something, but their energy is not going

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<v Speaker 2>to be great and they're not going to be focused

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<v Speaker 2>on you, and it would have been amazing. It definitely

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<v Speaker 2>helps the prestige of a movie to have big names

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<v Speaker 2>in it. But we started going down that road and

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<v Speaker 2>we were chasing a few names, and then we got

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<v Speaker 2>to the point where we're like, you know what, this

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<v Speaker 2>would be way more intimate if we got people who

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<v Speaker 2>really knew Steve really well, and we made this more

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<v Speaker 2>of an intricate portrait, so that we just decided to

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<v Speaker 2>focus on that, one of which was John Landis, who's

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<v Speaker 2>a major director, and Linea quickly was a just legendary

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<v Speaker 2>stream queen. So we were able to get some some

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<v Speaker 2>pretty great names, but they knew Steve really well, and

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<v Speaker 2>they knew him personally, they knew him professionally, So we

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<v Speaker 2>did want this to be a very personal story, which

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<v Speaker 2>dictated who were some of the people we talked to.

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<v Speaker 2>But I think Linea was a real game changer in

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<v Speaker 2>terms of the dimension. She was able to bring the

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<v Speaker 2>Steve because she knew him personally and she knew him professionally.

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<v Speaker 2>She lived with him, they were married, but She also

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<v Speaker 2>knew the horror industry incredibly well. They were on multiple

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<v Speaker 2>movies together, so she saw every side of him during

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<v Speaker 2>one of his big pinnacle, you know, seasons of life,

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<v Speaker 2>so she was able to see a lot of that.

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<v Speaker 2>She was able to see the destructive aspects of his addictions,

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<v Speaker 2>but also his work ethic also is genius, and she

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<v Speaker 2>genuinely loved them. They genuinely loved each other. I mean

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<v Speaker 2>there was a real tragedy in their ultimate you know, splitting.

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<v Speaker 2>So she was wonderful to talk to you. There's very

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<v Speaker 2>rich conversations with her.

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<v Speaker 5>Frankly, I can't think of a better audience for you

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<v Speaker 5>with the Dock than Fantasia. It's kind of feeling pretty

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<v Speaker 5>great to have your first movie being able to premiere there.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm very honored. Yeah, yeah, it does feel great and

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<v Speaker 2>I can't wait. It's really wonderful. But it was very

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<v Speaker 2>humbled in touched that they chose us.

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<v Speaker 5>Nick. Where can people go to find out more about

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<v Speaker 5>the movie and where it's playing near them.

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<v Speaker 2>You can follow me on Instagram and I am Nick Taylor,

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<v Speaker 2>or on our production company's website, American Nightmare dot co.

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<v Speaker 2>It's not dot com but dot co will definitely be

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<v Speaker 2>posting updates there and if you're gonna be in Fantasia,

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<v Speaker 2>come check us out July twenty third and twenty sixth.

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<v Speaker 5>Fantastic, Nick Taylor, thank you so much for your time, sir.

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<v Speaker 5>Good luck at your premiere.

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<v Speaker 2>Thank you, Mike.

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<v Speaker 1>Goodbye rubber head, so long, boob going blower in right cube,

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<v Speaker 1>it's a good bye rubber head, so long boobe. I

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<v Speaker 1>told my baby nice, please don't blurt around and don't

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<v Speaker 1>give us the other guys that makes my poor heart pound.

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<v Speaker 1>And as I told her, nice, please don't make me dread,

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<v Speaker 1>she winked her eye at another guy, and when I left, hears,

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<v Speaker 1>but she said goodbye rubber head, so long, boob going blower,

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<v Speaker 1>and I got a brand news sugar cube. It's a

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<v Speaker 1>good bye rubber head, so long boobe. I phone my

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<v Speaker 1>baby twice to say she heard me bed and ask

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<v Speaker 1>her when she's for you again? To make my poor

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<v Speaker 1>heart glad. Oh yes, I pound her twice, and as

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<v Speaker 1>with her eye bled, she left me alone on the

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<v Speaker 1>puzzle phone with a memory of what she said. Good

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<v Speaker 1>Bye rubber head, so long boob going lower in her too.

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<v Speaker 1>A plang on a Ramdow sugar cube, it's a good

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<v Speaker 1>bye rubber head, so long boob. Well, I was feeling

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<v Speaker 1>kind of bad around that time, and well I took

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<v Speaker 1>some good advice, and I met me another girl and

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<v Speaker 1>just the lock with her one belongas that's my heart

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<v Speaker 1>the world. And when we met my ex, well did

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<v Speaker 1>her face get red? She must have burned that the

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<v Speaker 1>way I turned my nose up in the air and said,

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<v Speaker 1>good bye, rubber head, so long boob going lower and

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<v Speaker 1>doo a plang of a ram sugar cube. It's a

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<v Speaker 1>good bye rubber head, so long boob, good bye rubber head,

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<v Speaker 1>so long boob, so long boob, so long. Boom bu

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<v Speaker 1>ba boo boo boo boom