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Speaker 1: And now Audio Theater Central.

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Speaker 2: Hello, welcome to Audio Theater Central. This is the show

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that explores family friendly audio drama through news, reviews and interviews.

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I'm your host, J D. Sutter, and this is episode

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two twenty one. Well, there is a lot of exciting

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stuff to get to in this episode. We've got a

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review of the victory of Joan of Arc from Air

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Theater and I'll be joined by ATC contributor Michael Schrader

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to talk about that. Really looking forward to that. Also

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a whole bunch of audio drama updates to get to.

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Some exciting stuff is happening, and I'm really looking forward

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to sharing this information with you. And we've got some

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feedback from Jeff and Jeremy, and I've got a monologue

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coming up. I'm going to talk about some of my

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thoughts on audio drama trailers. So I hope you'll stick

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with me. Let's jump into the updates.

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Speaker 3: We interrupt this program to bring you a special report.

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Speaker 4: And in other news tonight.

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Speaker 1: A brief look at the headlines.

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Speaker 5: Now they want exciting, fast piece news that's relevant and

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entertaining like this.

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Speaker 2: Just a quick reminder if you are an audio drama producer,

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be sure to send us your updates. There is a

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link right on our homepage to our submission form, or

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you can go to PFM dot link slash atc News

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to let us know what's going on with your show,

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or if you are a big fan of a particular

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show and you haven't heard us talk about it, you

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can definitely let us know as well well. The first

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item I want to talk about real briefly is libro FM.

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You've probably heard us mention that in the past as

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an alternative to Audible, and I like libro because they

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actually give you ownership of the audiobooks that you purchase, Whereas,

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as most people already know, with Audible and other audiobook platforms,

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you only get access in their app or on their website,

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you don't actually own downloadable copies. But when you purchase

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from libro fm, you actually get downloadable files that you

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can save to your library. And because they are an

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audiobook first platform, they are lower quality than you would

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get if you were to purchase directly from a producer

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who offers high quality downloads. But this is one of

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the only places that I've been able to find where

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you can legally acquire downloadable copies of many of the

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BBC radio shows, and they have produced really high quality

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stuff over the years, but it is not easy to

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obtain here in the US, and so this is a

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great option. Now. The other thing I like is that

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they partner with local independent bookstores and your purchases go

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to support a bookstore in your area, which is super cool.

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So I say all of that to say, we have

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partnered with Libro to put together what they call a playlist,

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and this is a dedicated page on their website with

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a list of some great audio drama that they offer

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and that we think are worth checking out. So that

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is linked up in the show notes, the Libro FMATC Playlist.

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Go check it out and you can purchase one off downloads,

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or you can join as a monthly member and you

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get a credit to spend on any title you want

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each month, and they frequently run sales. Sometimes they offer

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two for one and things like that. So if you're

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listening to this in the future, definitely click that link

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and see what they're offering at the time. You might

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be able to download two or three as a bonus

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for signing up as a monthly member. But even if

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you're not interested in being a member, you can purchase

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one off titles and this is a great way to

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access some cool BBC stuff and so I'm excited to

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partner with LIBROFM and I think it's worth checking out.

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This is an affiliate link and so we do get

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credit for that, but it doesn't cost you any extra,

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so your purchases there also help to support ATC. Next

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up is an event that I'm super excited about once again.

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Audio Theater Central is teaming up with Odyssey Geek for

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the third annual Christmas Audio Drama Spectacular. If you're new

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around here and this is your first time hearing about this,

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this is an event where we put together a playlist

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of great Christmas programming and we stream it live and

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we have a great time getting in the holiday spirit

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listening to some really fun Christmas programming. So this time

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it's going to be taking place on December fifth, and

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it will be simulcast on Portulid FM radio and on

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the Odyssey Geek YouTube channel. It's about four hours of

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Christmas themed audio stories hosted by me and produced by

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Austin Peachee and myself. In addition to getting to listen

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to the shows, you're also going to get some exclusive

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behind the scenes content for all of them as well.

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This is content you won't get anywhere else. Well I

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guess that's obvious because that's what exclusive means. But anyway,

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it's going to be a fun night, and I hope

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you'll join us. There will be more details coming along with,

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you know, specific links and a little bit more about

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what the program will entail, as well as the specific

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start times. That's all coming in the very near future

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in a blog post on the ATC blogs, so keep

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your eyes open for that. Austin and I both think

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this is our best lineup yet, so it's going to

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be a lot of fun. So I hope you can

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join us on December fifth. All right, moving into to

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the new releases, This one is one for the audio

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drama voice actors out there. I recently released an episode

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on another show that I do called Content Creation Musings

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called eight Tips for your Audio Drama Demo Reel. So

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if you are a voice actor and you're interested in

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getting into audio drama, or you're already acting for audio

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drama and you don't have a demo reel yet, this

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is a resource that I think will be very helpful

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to you as I break down what are the best

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elements of putting together an audio drama demo reel, and

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it's all in about ten minutes. In addition to the

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audio podcast of this information, it is also available as

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an article so you can refer back to it whenever

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you need and so that is linked in the show

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notes if you want to check that out. All right.

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Our next recent release is from Venture. This is the

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science fiction show from Eternal Future Productions. Episode three is

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out now. It's called It All Started with an Itch.

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It was released mid October and you can listen for

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free on their YouTube channel, or you can head over

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to the Eternal Future Productions website and grab a digital copy,

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or you can purchase a CD that has all three

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episodes and that helps support them so they can keep

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producing this show and more Venture News. They are working

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on a spinoff of sorts. It's called Venture Quick Trips

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and these are going to be five minute parody episodes

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of science fiction. Alisiha Hanson, who is the director of

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the show, met with Glenn Haskell, the writer, and Lee Stang,

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the sound designer, and they brainstorm some ideas. So this

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is going to be parodies of not just Star Trek,

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but also Star Wars as well. She says the possibilities

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are endless here, so keep an eye out for venture

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quick trips if you are a sign fiction fan. Our

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next new release is the latest from Patch. The Pirate

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is out now. It's called Switcher Snatchers. The official summary

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is something fishy is happening in the seaside town of

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till Apooch, but puppies are mysteriously disappearing, and in their place,

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sea lions appear. Join the Patch crew as they uncover

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the sneaky plot of the Switcher Snatchers and learn that

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true identity and purpose come only from God. So that

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is available as a digital download and on CD. Link

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is in the show notes to grab your copy. And

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now we move into upcoming releases. The first is Resurgence Now.

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This one is also from Eternal Future Productions, but this

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is their first feature length audio drama and it is

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coming in mid to late December. Here is the summary.

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A world class voyage pleasure or business. In the early

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nineteen hundreds, many would have done anything to book passage

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on this transatlantic expedition, but the struggle faced by Thomas

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and Hazel Elsner as they bore the ship will bring

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them face to face with some hard realities. Amidst danger

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and mystery threatening to separate them. They must come to

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terms with the possibility that not every story will have

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a happy ending, and not every wish comes true. We

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have talked about this before, and I've been looking forward

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to it for a while. It's been in the works

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and teased for quite some time, so I am really

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really excited about this one. And what I'm going to

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do is play the first three minutes of a preview

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now in the show notes, it's a link to the

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full preview, which is almost seven minutes, So I highly

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recommend you go listen to the whole thing if this

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grabs your attention. But here's the first three minutes. We

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just didn't have time to play the entire thing here,

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but here's a little taste, including the first scene.

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Speaker 6: Ah, Detective Elsner, good morning, Good morning, sir.

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Speaker 1: Everything.

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Speaker 6: Well, I know Hazel wasn't feeling well on Saturday at

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the picnic.

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Speaker 3: Is she doing better?

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Speaker 2: Oh?

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Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, quiet, She was back to herself that afternoon.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 7: She thinks it was just something she ate and settled her.

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She's actually enjoying a visit from her sister this very moment.

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Speaker 6: That's wonderful to hear.

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Speaker 4: Here you are, Hazel, just the way you like. It's

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only a touch of cinnamon and cream.

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Speaker 3: Thank you, Ruth.

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Speaker 6: I'm so glad for your visit today.

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Speaker 4: Likewise, I've missed you so much. It is good to

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be missed. Are things still not well with you and Thomas?

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Things are as they have been.

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Speaker 8: He's still taken with work, always at the office, or

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he brings cases home to work on into the night.

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I know he means well trying to provide for us,

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but it's almost as if he's seeking more work.

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Speaker 6: Please sit down, and we've got a lot to cover today.

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Sounds like every other day, quite right. However, this case

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might be a particular interest to you.

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Speaker 1: Oh how so well.

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Speaker 6: We've recently had a break in the case of jewelry

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heighst you've been investigating. We believe our thief is taking

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a passengership on the Morrow, making their way across the

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Pond in order.

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Speaker 1: To escape fleeing to America.

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Speaker 6: Huh, exactly right, Thomas, and we need you aboard that

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ship to aid in their apprehension.

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Speaker 7: Oh, I couldn't possibly jump onto a ship on such

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short notice, and I would upset Hazel deeply me. I'm

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she already thinks I work too much.

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Speaker 4: But what about that trip you to have been meaning

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to take.

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Speaker 8: I hardly think he would even consider such a thing.

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He almost seems to avoid being with me. I had

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to practically beg him to attend the picnic this weekend,

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and of course I ended up ill and we had

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to leave early.

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Speaker 4: Oh Dear. If anything, I think this only proves all

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the more how much you desperately need some time together,

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a reprieve from everything.

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Speaker 8: I think he fears time together. It would mean facing

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the issues at hand. I know he's disappointed. This is

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not your fault.

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Speaker 4: You think he honestly blames you for the fact that

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you are unable to conceive a child.

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Speaker 8: Who else is to blame?

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Speaker 2: Man, I'm telling you what. I am super excited about

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this one. I think in terms of shows that I've

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known about for a while and been anticipating that haven't

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released yet, this one's kind of at the top of

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my list. I've the whole idea has intrigued me, and

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after hearing this snippet, my goodness, it's pulled me right

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in the acting sounds amazing and I am so excited

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to hear this show. So again, the full preview is

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available at the link in the show notes. But this

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was written by Alicia Hanson, Jonathan Cook, and Glenn Haskell,

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and it was directed by Alicia Hanson, with sound designed

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by Oscar Corral and music by Drew A. Forbes, who

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we know as the composer for Pirateers. And we've heard

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Oscar's work in other shows like Jonathan park and things

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like that. This is a great team and as I

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just said, I'm really excited to hear this one because

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it just sounds really really good. So our major characters

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that we heard about in the summary and in that

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snippet there, Daniel Cross plays Thomas Elsner and Stephanie Nimitt

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Parker plays Hazel Elsner, and they are supported by a

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lot of familiar names that I know you have probably

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heard of, Bethany Baldwin, Jonathan Cook, Craig Hart, Glenn Haskell,

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Jason Markowitz, Kara O'Brien, Tricia Rose, Duffy Weber, Matthew Warner.

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So man, this I'm just repeating myself now, but I'm

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really excited about this. It sounds like it's going to

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be awesome, So again link in the show notes to

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the full preview and to their website so you can

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bookmark that page and when it comes out, grab your

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copy of Resurgence also coming out soon and should be

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very soon, within just a few days of the release

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of this podcast one day in Aspen Creek. This is

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the show that I'm producing. It is a micro audio

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drama series. Episode four called Another Man's Treasure is coming

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out very very soon. It's featuring Rose Beasley, Jason Markowitz,

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and yours truly, and I don't want to spill too

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many details at this point, but this is one of

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my favorite ones of the few that have done so far,

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and the feedback I've gotten from the cast has been wonderful,

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So I'm really excited to bring this to you and

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I hope you really enjoy it. Now, if you haven't

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heard the previous three episodes, there is a link to

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my website so you can go listen to those. They

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are free to stream, and if you'd like to be

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among the first to be notified when this episode four releases,

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there is also a link to join my email list,

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And all that's for is to send out notifications of

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new posts and so I hope you will join me

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over there for episode four of One Day in Aspen Creek.

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And lastly, the Surround Bible. This is a project that

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John Fornoff is spearheading and has been working on for

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quite some time, and coming this year will be the

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first installments from this project, and it's called The Real

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Story of Christmas. The official summary is The Surround Bible

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presents the Real Story of Christmas, an immersive audio movie

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that places you at the heart of the most extraordinary

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moment in history. Told with verbatim scripture, brought to life

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by a cast of renowned voice actors, and enhanced by

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a cinematic score and world class sound production. This is

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more than a listening experience, It's a spiritual journey. So

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the sound design is by Alan Hurley, music by John Campbell,

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directed and produced by John Fornoff. And here is a

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brand new trailer for the Real Story of Christmas.

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Speaker 3: Before Santa Claus, before jingle bells and Rudolph, there was

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an all powerful God who came down to the earth.

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He created as a baby. This is the real story

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of Christmas. Behold, the Virgin shall be with child, rejoice

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highly favorite one.

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Speaker 4: What can this be?

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Speaker 2: And they shall call his name Emmanuel.

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Speaker 1: God with us.

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Speaker 3: The Lord is with you.

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Speaker 1: The star stood over where.

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Speaker 7: The young child was lying in a feeding trough.

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Speaker 3: He was in the world.

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Speaker 1: Mary, wake on.

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Speaker 3: The world was made through him. We have to leave

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the world didn't recognize him. Now please flee into Egypt,

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for Herod will seek the young child.

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Speaker 1: To destroy you. The Lord is with you.

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Speaker 3: The Surround Bible presents the Real Story of Christmas a

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powerful audio experience. Get your free download of the Real

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Story of Christmas. Go to Surround Bible dot com. Surround

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Bible dot com.

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Speaker 2: M so good, so well produced. This is going to

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be an hour long production. Now, as you heard in

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that promo, you can get a free version that will

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have the broadcast breaks and ads and things like that

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in it. That will be entirely free. However, you also

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have the option to go to the website right now

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and pre order a digital download which will be the

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fulk with no breaks and some bonus content like behind

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the scenes photos and things like that. So you can

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get that as a digital download or a CD version.

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So both of those are available for a discounted rate.

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If you pre order now. I don't know exactly when

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it's going to be released at this point, but the

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prices will go up once it is released. But in

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any case, whether you decide to go with the free

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version or the premium one, this sounds like it's going

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to be a great, great show, a great addition to

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the Christmas lineup. And I know this project is one

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that is very dear to John Fornoff's heart, and I

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know he's poured a lot of time, energy and finances

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into this project. So you can help out by going

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in pre ordering this, or you can also just donate

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to the project if you want to help them fund

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the next phase as they move forward, because the goal

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is to produce the entire so it's a huge undertaking.

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And if you want to help them out, go ahead

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and check out that link. It'll take you to surround

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bible dot com where you can donate, listen to that

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trailer again, or pre order your copy of the Real

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Story of Christmas. Well, speaking of great trailers, let's talk

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a little bit more about.

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Speaker 1: That testing one, two, three testing.

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Speaker 2: That was just me talking.

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Speaker 8: I do that a lot.

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Speaker 3: Where's my speech now?

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Speaker 1: Long?

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Speaker 5: You've got to word up.

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Speaker 3: With it, that's what I want to talk about.

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Speaker 2: So here's what I've been thinking about quite a bit lately,

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audio drama trailers. And I've got to give a quick

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shout out to Ben Kimp for prompting this topic. He

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asked a question not long ago asking for recommendations for

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some really good examples of audio drama trailers, and it

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really got me thinking because I realized I've been hearing

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fewer and fewer audio drama trailers with new releases over

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the last few years, and why is that happening? It

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got me thinking about that, and even more importantly, why

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are so few of these that are even being done

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00:21:11,319 --> 00:21:15,319
really good ones? And so I thought this is something

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that I wanted to address here for both producers and

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for listeners because I remember when we did our Audio

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drama survey the first time, we had a significant number

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of people who mentioned teaser audio or trailers being a

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factor that would push them to try out a new show.

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And I've always held the opinion that these are very important.

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It should be an integral part of your marketing strategy

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as a producer. And so as I thought a little

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bit more about this and what makes a good trailer,

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I sort of started breaking down some of the ones

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that I've heard recently. And when I say recently, i'm

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talking about over the last probably five years. They've just

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been decreasing and decreasing, and the quality of the ones

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that are are being produced have decreased, or people are

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just opting to do previews or just sections of the

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show of their production rather than a proper trailer, And

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so that was the first thing that stood out to me.

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A trailer is not just a snippet of the show,

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like an audiobook sample is. When you go to audible

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or one of these other places and you click the

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button to play the sample. It's just going to take

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00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:39,039
a few minute chunk of the audiobook and display it.

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A lot of times it's right from the beginning, but

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not always, and it's just a section of the story

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that's not a trailer. A trailer is also not just

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a random assortment of bits of dialogue. It should be

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an intentionally crafted audio production in its own right. There

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00:22:58,599 --> 00:23:01,680
should be much thought put into it, and it needs

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00:23:01,720 --> 00:23:04,920
to have a narrative arc for those particular clips that

377
00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:10,440
are selected. It should be telling a story on its own. Now,

378
00:23:10,960 --> 00:23:15,880
we don't want to give away what happens major plot points.

379
00:23:15,880 --> 00:23:19,160
We don't want spoilers in the trailer. That is one

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00:23:19,160 --> 00:23:22,319
thing that I don't like for sure. So you have

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to be very intentional, very selective about the bits of

382
00:23:26,119 --> 00:23:30,119
the story that you choose. But they should not be random.

383
00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:38,319
It should be introducing your major characters, the themes, the genre,

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00:23:39,000 --> 00:23:41,680
all of that kind of information should be conveyed in

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00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:48,680
this trailer. So this content will resonate with your target audience. So,

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00:23:49,319 --> 00:23:52,640
just like a logline for a script or an elevator

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00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:56,640
pitch for any creative project, the trailer is an important

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00:23:56,680 --> 00:24:00,200
and extremely valuable marketing tool that is too often being

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00:24:00,240 --> 00:24:04,920
overlooked altogether or not given enough consideration in my opinion.

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00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:09,079
And so I reached out to a couple of people

391
00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:12,839
who are very skilled and have a lot of experience

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00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:17,200
at making trailers for audio drama, specifically to get some

393
00:24:17,279 --> 00:24:18,720
of their feedback. And we're going to get to that

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00:24:18,759 --> 00:24:22,920
in just a moment, but just to show you how valuable,

395
00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:27,519
how important this little tidbit can be, think about the

396
00:24:27,559 --> 00:24:31,319
ways it can be used. Primarily, I think, in my opinion,

397
00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:35,440
embedded on your website. I mean, that's very important, right

398
00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:38,319
on your homepage, if it's your latest release and you

399
00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:41,839
want to really drive traffic to it. But aside from that,

400
00:24:42,319 --> 00:24:46,079
on the product page for that show, whether that's a

401
00:24:46,079 --> 00:24:49,599
CD or a digital download, have that sample there, have

402
00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:54,200
that trailer there to promote that project. Share it on YouTube,

403
00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:58,359
post it on social media if you're distributing on digital retailers.

404
00:24:59,160 --> 00:25:02,119
Like I mentioned a moment, go audible, but there are

405
00:25:02,279 --> 00:25:05,039
several others out there that allow you to have a

406
00:25:05,119 --> 00:25:08,640
sample of the show. That's another usage. You can use

407
00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:13,640
it on radio. Lamplader Theater has promos for every single episode,

408
00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:17,680
not just the feature link show, but every single episode

409
00:25:17,720 --> 00:25:21,880
has its own promos that air on the radio. Some

410
00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:24,680
stations put them throughout the week as it leads up

411
00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:27,400
to the next broadcast, and then of course there are

412
00:25:27,519 --> 00:25:32,279
promos that air in between segments. Things like that. You

413
00:25:32,359 --> 00:25:36,079
can use your trailer as a promo for radio, even

414
00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:39,640
if your show is not in the lineup. There are

415
00:25:39,720 --> 00:25:42,400
radio stations out there that you might be able to

416
00:25:42,680 --> 00:25:46,319
work out some deal and purchase some airtime to air

417
00:25:46,359 --> 00:25:50,119
this as an ad spot. And then there are other

418
00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:54,160
streaming stations that might be willing to play it, like

419
00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:57,119
the Story Channel. Now I'm not saying one hundred percent,

420
00:25:57,359 --> 00:26:01,119
but it's worth exploring that as an option. And of

421
00:26:01,160 --> 00:26:05,319
course podcasts, whether that's free or paid. Now, we don't

422
00:26:05,400 --> 00:26:09,079
charge anybody to play a promo or a trailer for

423
00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:12,920
their show on ATC, but even if the show is

424
00:26:12,960 --> 00:26:16,920
not dealing directly with audio drama, you can find podcasts

425
00:26:16,960 --> 00:26:20,599
that have your potential audience that listens to that show

426
00:26:21,559 --> 00:26:24,400
and you can reach out to them. I know lots

427
00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:28,000
of independent podcasters are looking for content and they would

428
00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:31,640
be willing to share about your audio drama and not

429
00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:34,640
even charge you. But there is of course the option

430
00:26:34,799 --> 00:26:38,039
of paying for an ad for your audio drama on

431
00:26:38,200 --> 00:26:42,039
other podcasts. So, for instance, let's just take an example

432
00:26:43,319 --> 00:26:46,519
of an audio drama that is aimed at Christian families

433
00:26:46,559 --> 00:26:50,039
that have young children, and that is who their show

434
00:26:50,119 --> 00:26:53,440
is aimed at. Well, you find podcasts that are also

435
00:26:53,519 --> 00:26:56,559
catering to that audience and you reach out to them,

436
00:26:56,920 --> 00:27:00,880
and that trailer is a great marketing tool. Now there's

437
00:27:00,920 --> 00:27:04,640
a lot more that goes into that whole thing, and

438
00:27:05,240 --> 00:27:07,599
it's too deep to cover in depth here, but I

439
00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:10,400
just wanted to use that as an example. But you

440
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:14,000
can also just send the trailer as an email attachment

441
00:27:14,039 --> 00:27:17,000
to friends and family and to help them get excited

442
00:27:17,039 --> 00:27:20,480
about your project and ask them to help you spread

443
00:27:20,519 --> 00:27:23,440
the word. It can be used as a free marketing tool.

444
00:27:23,839 --> 00:27:27,200
That's my main point here. Send it out to your

445
00:27:27,279 --> 00:27:30,160
email list. You do have an email list, right right.

446
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:35,480
So there are so many usages for having an audio

447
00:27:35,559 --> 00:27:40,519
drama trailer, and many of them are free. So again,

448
00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:45,039
this is an extremely valuable tool in the marketing of

449
00:27:45,279 --> 00:27:48,920
an audio drama. So, as I was thinking about addressing

450
00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:50,720
this topic, and I was already writing down some of

451
00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:53,319
these notes, I thought, I've got to reach out to

452
00:27:53,359 --> 00:27:55,880
some people, and so I reached out to Alan Hurley

453
00:27:56,599 --> 00:28:01,079
because he has a lot of experience in reducing audio

454
00:28:01,160 --> 00:28:04,319
drama trailers, and so I asked him, what are the

455
00:28:04,759 --> 00:28:07,440
elements that an audio drama trailer, a good audio drama

456
00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:09,960
trailer needs to have. So I'm going to list these

457
00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:11,880
off really quickly, and then we'll go into a little

458
00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:16,039
bit more detail on each one of these. So he says,

459
00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:23,480
first a script, second, a great voiceover, three isolated dialogue clips,

460
00:28:24,559 --> 00:28:33,200
four intentional pacing, five great music, and six multiple versions. So,

461
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:37,279
as I said before, a trailer is telling a story

462
00:28:37,319 --> 00:28:39,240
on its own there needs to be an arc to it.

463
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:43,559
It's not just random snippets of dialogue. And if you

464
00:28:43,759 --> 00:28:47,599
have a narrator, you know there are trailers that are

465
00:28:47,799 --> 00:28:52,599
just bits of dialogue without having a voiceover, and you

466
00:28:52,640 --> 00:28:56,039
can do that that that can work. I think, if

467
00:28:56,039 --> 00:29:00,160
at all possible, it helps to have at least some narratisation,

468
00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:05,200
especially at the end, to give the pertinent information about

469
00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:08,920
the show. But I have heard some pretty good trailers

470
00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:13,039
that don't have narration all throughout. But if you do

471
00:29:13,079 --> 00:29:15,640
that or not, you still need to have a script.

472
00:29:16,359 --> 00:29:19,759
Alan said. The script needs to effectively convey the tone

473
00:29:19,960 --> 00:29:22,480
and mood of the drama, tell a part of the

474
00:29:22,519 --> 00:29:26,920
story that really grabs the listener's attention or sparks their curiosity,

475
00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:30,640
but without giving away the full plot. It needs to

476
00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:34,920
have momentum. The trailer needs to stand alone as its

477
00:29:34,920 --> 00:29:38,559
own story, which is what I said a moment ago. Now,

478
00:29:38,599 --> 00:29:40,759
he said, one thing that he likes to do is

479
00:29:40,799 --> 00:29:43,720
to intercut storyline, so kind of an A and B

480
00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:47,599
plot that he cuts back and forth and builds some tension,

481
00:29:47,720 --> 00:29:51,839
builds some momentum that works in conjunction with the announcer's

482
00:29:51,920 --> 00:29:55,319
voiceover and each of these elements on their own are

483
00:29:55,359 --> 00:29:57,920
moving the story forward, but when they are cut together,

484
00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:02,160
it just takes it to another lefe. So that's point

485
00:30:02,200 --> 00:30:05,519
one the script. Two, I think we understand a great

486
00:30:05,599 --> 00:30:08,400
voiceover you need it needs to be a good voice Now.

487
00:30:08,640 --> 00:30:11,960
I heard a trailer not long ago that the content

488
00:30:12,200 --> 00:30:15,920
was pretty solid, but the voice that they had selected

489
00:30:15,960 --> 00:30:21,079
to do the trailer just wasn't a fit. Not every

490
00:30:21,359 --> 00:30:24,960
voice actor is going to be great for doing trailers,

491
00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:28,559
so that's just something to keep in mind. So Third,

492
00:30:28,599 --> 00:30:31,519
he likes he said he likes to have the isolated

493
00:30:31,599 --> 00:30:35,279
dialogue clips, so he's not just grabbing chunks of the

494
00:30:35,319 --> 00:30:40,240
produced show. He's taking specific sections of the dialogue that

495
00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:44,079
doesn't have the related dialogue around it, so he is

496
00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:48,039
free to use that however he wants. However that works

497
00:30:48,519 --> 00:30:51,240
for telling the story. Again, he's trying to put together

498
00:30:51,319 --> 00:30:55,799
a story here. For example, he can just completely mute

499
00:30:55,839 --> 00:31:00,480
out the preceding dialogue from other characters or whatever whatever

500
00:31:00,519 --> 00:31:04,799
he needs to do, and even without the final sound

501
00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:07,440
design or music of the show, so he can do

502
00:31:07,519 --> 00:31:10,839
whatever he wants to do in the trailer on its own.

503
00:31:11,279 --> 00:31:15,440
So having those isolated dialogue clips is a really good

504
00:31:15,480 --> 00:31:21,519
tip there to help elevate your trailer. And number four,

505
00:31:21,640 --> 00:31:26,400
the pacing is so important all of those elements coming

506
00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:29,440
together with the pace to match the style of the

507
00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:32,680
story and build the emotion that's needed for that particular

508
00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:36,720
style of story. So pacing is very important. Of course,

509
00:31:37,279 --> 00:31:40,599
that is important in any kind of audio project. You know,

510
00:31:40,799 --> 00:31:43,400
it's important in the show itself. But the pacing for

511
00:31:43,519 --> 00:31:48,640
the trailer might be completely different from the scenes that

512
00:31:48,640 --> 00:31:51,799
that dialogue is pulled from, because again we're trying to

513
00:31:51,839 --> 00:31:55,680
tell a story here with just the selected bits of

514
00:31:56,039 --> 00:31:59,400
the show, and so that pacing might be completely different

515
00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:03,039
from what is in the final project, right, So keep

516
00:32:03,119 --> 00:32:09,480
that in mind. And then fifth, great music, Yes, that's huge. Now.

517
00:32:09,799 --> 00:32:11,599
One thing that I found was interesting is that he

518
00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:14,200
said it's not uncommon for him to edit five to

519
00:32:14,279 --> 00:32:17,720
seven different selections of music in a sixty second promo,

520
00:32:18,039 --> 00:32:20,599
So he's bringing in and out different pieces of music.

521
00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:23,640
It's not always necessarily a single piece of music that

522
00:32:23,759 --> 00:32:27,319
just underscores the entire promo. So that was a really

523
00:32:27,359 --> 00:32:30,960
interesting thing that I hadn't thought about. But whatever you

524
00:32:31,039 --> 00:32:34,519
do with that, the music needs to be good music.

525
00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:37,920
And so he said, even when he's cutting together multiple

526
00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:41,640
selections of a piece of music. The edited project is

527
00:32:41,640 --> 00:32:44,160
going to sound like it was custom scored just for

528
00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:48,519
that promo. And then his last element, the last tip

529
00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:52,599
was number six. Multiple versions. So, as I talked about

530
00:32:52,599 --> 00:32:56,880
those different applications, you might need to have different versions,

531
00:32:56,880 --> 00:32:59,480
a thirty second version, a sixty second version, a ninety

532
00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:02,000
second version, And I don't think I would go, you know,

533
00:33:02,119 --> 00:33:06,440
much longer than you know, a couple of minutes for

534
00:33:06,559 --> 00:33:11,799
any given show. But if you're using these for broadcast radio,

535
00:33:12,359 --> 00:33:14,960
they're going to want to standardize thirty or sixty second,

536
00:33:15,039 --> 00:33:18,039
But all these other applications, if you're sharing it online,

537
00:33:18,119 --> 00:33:20,079
you know you can have a little bit more wiggle

538
00:33:20,119 --> 00:33:24,680
room with a duration there. But keeping them concise and

539
00:33:24,759 --> 00:33:27,119
just pulling people in so that it only takes a

540
00:33:27,119 --> 00:33:29,920
minute or two of their time and really grabs their attention,

541
00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:32,799
I think is the key here. So having multiple versions,

542
00:33:32,839 --> 00:33:35,119
not just with the link, but also with the call

543
00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:39,160
to action information at the end. So depending on how

544
00:33:39,200 --> 00:33:41,759
it's going to be used, if you're going to use

545
00:33:41,759 --> 00:33:45,440
it as a promotion, as a promotional tool for radio

546
00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:49,279
or podcast, you might want to include your website or

547
00:33:50,079 --> 00:33:53,279
release date or the air date or all that kind

548
00:33:53,279 --> 00:33:57,920
of stuff, Whereas if it's being used on your website itself,

549
00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:02,279
you might not necessarily need to have of that particular information.

550
00:34:02,400 --> 00:34:06,440
But the point is think about the particular use that

551
00:34:06,599 --> 00:34:08,559
this version of the trailer is going to be and

552
00:34:09,039 --> 00:34:12,199
then decide what information needs to be included by the

553
00:34:12,360 --> 00:34:16,840
announcer at the end. So having the multiple versions is

554
00:34:16,880 --> 00:34:22,280
a really big key. So I loved hearing that information

555
00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:25,960
directly from Alan Hurley, who's an experienced producer, because it

556
00:34:26,119 --> 00:34:29,599
really helped solidify and confirm a lot of these things

557
00:34:29,599 --> 00:34:33,760
that I was already thinking. And I think it's extremely

558
00:34:33,840 --> 00:34:38,000
valuable information for any producer out there to pay attention to.

559
00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:44,679
These six tips here from Alan Hurley. Now we talked

560
00:34:44,679 --> 00:34:48,440
about the script, how important that element of a trailer is,

561
00:34:49,159 --> 00:34:52,119
and because they work together a lot, I reached out

562
00:34:52,119 --> 00:34:56,320
to John Fornoff about that element. And John's typically the

563
00:34:56,400 --> 00:34:58,960
one who writes the trailer scripts and then he works

564
00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:03,199
with Alan on the audio. So here are John Farnoff's

565
00:35:03,239 --> 00:35:08,360
tips on trailer scripts. First, go through the entire audio

566
00:35:08,440 --> 00:35:12,000
drama script and look for short what he calls grabber moments,

567
00:35:12,760 --> 00:35:17,639
short and poignant dialogue lines. Action lines or significant sound effects,

568
00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:21,920
and then you select the top ones. Then you tell

569
00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:25,159
the story with a narrator in a brief elevator pitch way.

570
00:35:25,599 --> 00:35:29,079
This is the backbone of your script, he says. And

571
00:35:29,159 --> 00:35:32,360
so then you weave together the narrator storyline with your

572
00:35:32,559 --> 00:35:37,199
grabber moments from the production. He says, keep it tight,

573
00:35:37,519 --> 00:35:40,960
short lines, quick moments, keep it moving. So notice he's

574
00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:44,280
talking about that pacing in that momentum, just like Alan was.

575
00:35:45,599 --> 00:35:50,039
He also mentions using music to highlight these particular moments,

576
00:35:50,079 --> 00:35:53,000
which is what Alan said. He does. He takes multiple

577
00:35:53,559 --> 00:35:58,920
snippets of music and weaves them together in different moments

578
00:35:58,960 --> 00:36:04,599
of this production. John says, sprinkle with cool transition effects.

579
00:36:05,400 --> 00:36:07,639
And this is really interesting too, because this is something

580
00:36:07,679 --> 00:36:11,480
else that I noticed a lot. Again, what I'm hearing

581
00:36:11,679 --> 00:36:14,400
from a lot of people these days is just a

582
00:36:14,519 --> 00:36:17,960
random selection of bits of dialogue here and there, and

583
00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:22,039
they're just cut together. And sometimes it's confusing because you

584
00:36:22,079 --> 00:36:25,440
don't know are these supposed to be concurrent pieces of

585
00:36:25,480 --> 00:36:29,360
dialogue here or are these different scenes are because we

586
00:36:29,400 --> 00:36:33,599
don't have context, right, So the selected clips again need

587
00:36:33,639 --> 00:36:36,039
to be telling a story. But as John points out,

588
00:36:36,039 --> 00:36:40,880
which is extremely important use transition effects between the selected

589
00:36:41,199 --> 00:36:45,159
bits of dialogue to help move this along and also

590
00:36:45,239 --> 00:36:48,320
to signal to the listener, hey, this is a separate

591
00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:50,519
This is a separate thing. This is the next section,

592
00:36:50,599 --> 00:36:52,920
This is something else that we want you to notice,

593
00:36:53,719 --> 00:36:56,800
so that the listener doesn't get confused about what's going on,

594
00:36:58,400 --> 00:37:01,079
because again we don't have the full context. These are

595
00:37:01,159 --> 00:37:05,039
all lines taken out of context that we're trying to

596
00:37:05,079 --> 00:37:09,320
string together to make a coherent story that is going

597
00:37:09,360 --> 00:37:11,519
to grab the listeners attention. We don't want to confuse them.

598
00:37:11,719 --> 00:37:15,159
We want to pull them in. They may not understand everything,

599
00:37:15,639 --> 00:37:18,840
but that line that was selected grabs their attention enough

600
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:22,000
to say I want to hear more. Right, So, using

601
00:37:22,079 --> 00:37:26,119
those transition effects in between your selected grabber moments, as

602
00:37:26,159 --> 00:37:30,039
John calls them, is very important. And his last tip

603
00:37:30,159 --> 00:37:32,320
was add a call to action at the end, and yes,

604
00:37:32,840 --> 00:37:38,840
super super important. So again, if you're posting this right

605
00:37:38,960 --> 00:37:41,320
on your main homepage, you might not necessarily need to

606
00:37:41,360 --> 00:37:44,639
have a call to action because they're already on your website.

607
00:37:44,679 --> 00:37:47,360
You can have a button there says buy now, but

608
00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:50,199
if this is going to be used elsewhere, having that

609
00:37:50,239 --> 00:37:53,480
call to action, come visit our website at and then

610
00:37:53,960 --> 00:37:56,360
you give the website and you know, let people know

611
00:37:56,480 --> 00:37:59,199
how to get their copy whatever it is. But having

612
00:37:59,199 --> 00:38:04,760
that call to action is often overlooked. So this was

613
00:38:04,840 --> 00:38:07,719
a bit of a longer segment here, a lot longer

614
00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:11,639
than normal. But I thought this was really really interesting.

615
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:15,000
I think it's fascinating stuff. And for all the audio

616
00:38:15,079 --> 00:38:17,880
drama producers out there, I really want to encourage you

617
00:38:17,920 --> 00:38:21,519
to really make an effort to start making these because

618
00:38:21,559 --> 00:38:26,320
they are an invaluable marketing tool and I think they

619
00:38:26,320 --> 00:38:32,559
are worth some consideration. Now, notice something from that trailer

620
00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:35,199
for the Real Story of Christmas that we played in

621
00:38:35,199 --> 00:38:38,800
the last segment. There were some little bits of the

622
00:38:38,840 --> 00:38:44,639
announcer's voiceover and a few little select sound effects that

623
00:38:44,719 --> 00:38:48,400
were not part of the actual show itself. You noticed

624
00:38:48,440 --> 00:38:51,360
the announcer said, before there was a Santa clause, then

625
00:38:51,360 --> 00:38:55,000
we have that little sound of somebody going ho ho ho,

626
00:38:55,840 --> 00:38:57,679
whatever it is. That's not part of the real story

627
00:38:57,719 --> 00:39:00,639
of Christmas, right, But they were making a point, and

628
00:39:00,719 --> 00:39:04,159
so they use some sound effects or an actual voice

629
00:39:04,199 --> 00:39:07,400
of an actor there to bring home that point. And

630
00:39:07,440 --> 00:39:09,079
I think there were some bells or things like that's

631
00:39:09,079 --> 00:39:11,559
not part of the biblical story of Christmas, but they

632
00:39:11,599 --> 00:39:16,760
were using those elements to tell this story. So keep

633
00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:18,480
that in mind. That is a tool that you can use.

634
00:39:18,519 --> 00:39:20,400
It's not I don't think it's something you must do,

635
00:39:21,079 --> 00:39:24,239
but it is something that you can do, so keep

636
00:39:24,239 --> 00:39:28,559
that in mind. Now. I asked both of these gentlemen

637
00:39:28,960 --> 00:39:32,320
for an example of what they consider to be a

638
00:39:32,480 --> 00:39:36,440
really good audio drama trailer that they worked on and

639
00:39:36,679 --> 00:39:41,400
independently of each other. They both they both named multiple ones,

640
00:39:42,159 --> 00:39:45,360
but both of them specifically mentioned the trailer for The

641
00:39:45,440 --> 00:39:48,280
Dragon and the Raven from the Extraordinary Adventures of JJ

642
00:39:48,400 --> 00:39:51,960
Hinty from Herloom Audio. So I'm going to play that

643
00:39:52,079 --> 00:39:55,199
right now. This is one of the selections from both

644
00:39:55,320 --> 00:39:59,000
Alan Hurley and John Thornoff as a great example of

645
00:39:59,119 --> 00:40:01,960
an effective audio drama trailer. So let's give this a listen.

646
00:40:04,679 --> 00:40:11,000
Speaker 3: Then, from over.

647
00:40:12,559 --> 00:40:18,920
Speaker 9: Field is spreading like shadows, seeking fame and cool.

648
00:40:19,079 --> 00:40:23,159
Speaker 6: The Dames are now pouring over our boarders, laying everyone.

649
00:40:22,800 --> 00:40:24,360
Speaker 4: And everything to waste in their path.

650
00:40:28,199 --> 00:40:31,360
Speaker 3: Edmunds our world could be coming to an head.

651
00:40:31,679 --> 00:40:35,480
Speaker 9: Only one king stands against them, Alfred, the young King

652
00:40:35,480 --> 00:40:36,119
of Wessex.

653
00:40:36,559 --> 00:40:42,320
Speaker 3: He stood m It's all raw. My father in heaven.

654
00:40:42,480 --> 00:40:45,440
We look to you to raise up your standard.

655
00:40:45,480 --> 00:40:49,400
Speaker 9: Discover the part of faithfulness and covenant. Discover the Dragon

656
00:40:49,519 --> 00:40:53,400
and the Raven the exciting audio adventure from Heirloom Audio

657
00:40:53,559 --> 00:40:55,800
featuring John Race Davis from the Lord of the Rings,

658
00:40:55,880 --> 00:40:59,000
Helen George from Call the Midwife, and Brian Deacon, star

659
00:40:59,119 --> 00:41:02,519
of the Jesus film Go to the Dragonandthraven dot com.

660
00:41:03,400 --> 00:41:06,280
Speaker 2: Notice how that has all of those elements that both

661
00:41:06,400 --> 00:41:11,840
Alan and John talked about. Also, interestingly, notice how that

662
00:41:11,960 --> 00:41:15,760
is a sixty second promo and our announcer doesn't come

663
00:41:15,800 --> 00:41:20,000
in till halfway through. They had an actor who was

664
00:41:20,039 --> 00:41:23,239
a great vocalist, and so they could use him singing

665
00:41:23,360 --> 00:41:28,000
that song as part of the trailer, and so the

666
00:41:28,079 --> 00:41:31,760
vocal of that song was actually acting as sort of

667
00:41:31,760 --> 00:41:34,079
a narrator there for a moment and sort of telling

668
00:41:34,119 --> 00:41:37,679
the story along with the snippets of dialogue. And then

669
00:41:37,559 --> 00:41:41,280
the announcer comes in and then at the end, not

670
00:41:41,320 --> 00:41:43,480
only does he give the website, but he also mentioned

671
00:41:43,519 --> 00:41:48,480
some of the cast. So a really really great promo,

672
00:41:48,800 --> 00:41:52,679
really great trailer. It's a wonderful example of what can

673
00:41:52,719 --> 00:41:58,320
be done in just sixty seconds. So producers I would

674
00:41:58,320 --> 00:42:01,440
love to hear your thoughts on this. Listeners and fans

675
00:42:01,440 --> 00:42:04,079
of audio drama that enjoy trailers, or if you don't

676
00:42:04,159 --> 00:42:06,440
enjoy trailers, I would love to hear your thoughts on

677
00:42:06,480 --> 00:42:10,360
this as well. What are your thoughts on audio drama trailers? Now,

678
00:42:10,599 --> 00:42:12,840
if you are a producer and you just don't think

679
00:42:12,880 --> 00:42:17,320
you have the skill or the time to produce an

680
00:42:17,360 --> 00:42:20,400
effective trailer, you can reach out to both of these guys.

681
00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:25,239
John Fornoff's website is circlecreativenow dot com. Alan Hurleys is

682
00:42:25,280 --> 00:42:28,400
the AudioSuite dot net. Both of them are linked up

683
00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:30,639
in the show notes and you can reach out to

684
00:42:30,679 --> 00:42:34,079
these guys and you can hire them to help you

685
00:42:34,199 --> 00:42:38,440
create a promo for your audio drama. But anyway, I

686
00:42:38,480 --> 00:42:41,119
know this was a bit of a longer segment for

687
00:42:41,199 --> 00:42:44,320
this show, but I thought it was really interesting and

688
00:42:44,400 --> 00:42:46,639
I hope you did too. Hopefully it was helpful to

689
00:42:46,719 --> 00:42:48,400
the audio drama producers out there as well.

690
00:42:48,840 --> 00:42:51,960
Speaker 7: I remember her from that radio program what was it?

691
00:42:52,360 --> 00:42:55,920
Speaker 3: A Western musical metodrama? You helped out with the kids

692
00:42:56,039 --> 00:42:57,519
radio program and you were great.

693
00:42:57,840 --> 00:43:03,599
Speaker 7: Another important tool of acting the opt of becoming shouldn't.

694
00:43:03,199 --> 00:43:05,519
Speaker 1: We a or something for what?

695
00:43:09,800 --> 00:43:12,199
Speaker 2: Well? I've wanted to get to this review for a

696
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:15,679
very long time, but life and all kinds of other

697
00:43:15,679 --> 00:43:17,719
stuff just got in the way. And I wanted to

698
00:43:17,760 --> 00:43:23,400
do it justice because these productions that Augustin Institute Radio

699
00:43:23,440 --> 00:43:27,440
Theater put out, they're long. I mean, they're not just

700
00:43:27,559 --> 00:43:32,239
feature length. These are extra long shows, and they pack

701
00:43:32,360 --> 00:43:35,880
a lot into them. And I didn't want to just

702
00:43:35,960 --> 00:43:39,559
do a cursory look over it, a little overview. I

703
00:43:39,599 --> 00:43:43,360
wanted to actually get into the meat of the story

704
00:43:43,519 --> 00:43:46,920
and the production and how it's put together. I wanted

705
00:43:46,920 --> 00:43:51,880
to do it justice. And so we're finally here after

706
00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:56,000
quite some time, and I'm joined by Michael Schrader, frequent

707
00:43:56,239 --> 00:44:01,079
well not so frequent lately, but recurring guest hosts.

708
00:44:00,639 --> 00:44:04,440
Speaker 1: At times a guest host. Yes, I'm pleased to be here, JD.

709
00:44:04,559 --> 00:44:06,280
Thanks for inviting me back.

710
00:44:06,519 --> 00:44:09,280
Speaker 2: Always a pleasure to talk with you, and I'm excited

711
00:44:09,320 --> 00:44:12,920
to talk about this show with you. So let's get

712
00:44:12,960 --> 00:44:15,159
into it. The Victory of Joan of Arc from Augustine

713
00:44:15,199 --> 00:44:18,199
Institute Radio Theater, released in twenty twenty three. Yes, I

714
00:44:18,280 --> 00:44:22,800
know it's been a while, but this show is, as

715
00:44:22,840 --> 00:44:25,320
I said, it's lengthy. We're talking about four and a

716
00:44:25,360 --> 00:44:32,679
half hours, ten episodes, just a massive undertaking. And I

717
00:44:32,719 --> 00:44:35,480
don't think it's wrong to start out this review by

718
00:44:35,519 --> 00:44:41,440
saying right out of the gate that once again, production values, acting,

719
00:44:42,159 --> 00:44:45,480
they nailed it. They really really did.

720
00:44:45,960 --> 00:44:49,480
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, absolutely, all the quality you expect from the

721
00:44:49,519 --> 00:44:52,639
soundhouse studios in London and the different actors, Paul McCusker

722
00:44:52,679 --> 00:44:55,320
as a writer, all the sound design and stuff. It's

723
00:44:55,480 --> 00:44:56,239
all top.

724
00:44:56,079 --> 00:45:01,320
Speaker 2: Notch, exactly exactly, So let's talk about that. You said

725
00:45:01,599 --> 00:45:04,480
Paul McCusker was the writer. He also directed it, with

726
00:45:04,639 --> 00:45:09,679
additional direction by Todd Busteed who also handled the post

727
00:45:09,679 --> 00:45:13,400
production along with his team at Gap Digital, and he

728
00:45:13,480 --> 00:45:17,800
was also credited as one of the producers. And as

729
00:45:17,800 --> 00:45:19,679
you said, these guys know what they're doing. They've been

730
00:45:19,760 --> 00:45:23,480
in audio drama for a very long time and they

731
00:45:23,559 --> 00:45:27,079
just do fantastic work. So I always know going into

732
00:45:27,440 --> 00:45:30,960
a show that they are involved with that it's going

733
00:45:31,039 --> 00:45:33,719
to be great in terms of the production values and

734
00:45:34,079 --> 00:45:36,800
typically with the script as well. We know Paul McCusker's work,

735
00:45:36,920 --> 00:45:39,440
We've heard it for years. I don't know if you have,

736
00:45:39,519 --> 00:45:41,519
but I've read some of his novels as well, and

737
00:45:41,599 --> 00:45:42,800
he's a great writer.

738
00:45:42,840 --> 00:45:45,480
Speaker 1: I have he is a great writer. Yeah, Paul McCusker

739
00:45:45,519 --> 00:45:48,039
is one of my favorite writers just all around the board,

740
00:45:48,559 --> 00:45:51,360
like not just audio drama scripts, but or maybe I

741
00:45:51,400 --> 00:45:53,480
should say he's one of my favorite storytellers because I

742
00:45:53,480 --> 00:45:56,320
think he knows how to craft a story really well.

743
00:45:56,679 --> 00:46:00,519
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. And then we have the musical score, original

744
00:46:00,599 --> 00:46:06,280
music by Jared Dipesqual and we've got a huge team

745
00:46:06,320 --> 00:46:09,480
here also, I mean Mark Drury was involved in the production.

746
00:46:11,000 --> 00:46:13,599
And then we have Daniel Philpott, who we've heard from

747
00:46:13,679 --> 00:46:16,719
in the past on other productions that are out of

748
00:46:16,760 --> 00:46:21,320
the Soundhouse in London. He did the He was our

749
00:46:21,360 --> 00:46:26,119
casting director as well as the language coach. So these

750
00:46:26,119 --> 00:46:28,239
are familiar names. Again, these are people that we know,

751
00:46:28,360 --> 00:46:31,880
we know their work, we trust it. So I think

752
00:46:31,920 --> 00:46:34,159
we know going in what we can expect. It's just

753
00:46:34,239 --> 00:46:37,360
a matter of how the story itself resonates with us,

754
00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:40,559
and we'll get into that. So before we get too deep, Michael,

755
00:46:40,599 --> 00:46:42,400
would you do us the honors and give us the

756
00:46:42,440 --> 00:46:43,800
summary I.

757
00:46:43,840 --> 00:46:48,360
Speaker 1: Will declare to which she became a saint. Imagine it's

758
00:46:48,440 --> 00:46:51,840
fifteenth century France. A seventeen year old peasant girl enters

759
00:46:51,840 --> 00:46:54,280
the royal courts during one of the longest and bloodiest

760
00:46:54,320 --> 00:46:57,159
wars in history. She claims she's been sent by God

761
00:46:57,199 --> 00:46:59,920
to fulfill a mission, drive out the English enemy and

762
00:47:00,320 --> 00:47:03,280
the true King of France on the throne. Meet Joan

763
00:47:03,280 --> 00:47:06,239
of Arc in this powerful movie of the mind audio drama,

764
00:47:06,280 --> 00:47:08,199
you'll hear the true story of how she rose from

765
00:47:08,199 --> 00:47:11,119
an obscure peasant village to serve God and her country

766
00:47:11,119 --> 00:47:14,400
in the most surprising and miraculous ways. The most experienced

767
00:47:14,400 --> 00:47:17,360
politicians could not thwart her, the most seasoned soldiers could

768
00:47:17,400 --> 00:47:22,039
not outmaneuver her. She was relentless in bravery, determination, boldness, passion,

769
00:47:22,199 --> 00:47:26,639
and holiness, finally yielding to offer the ultimate sacrifice. Spoiler alert.

770
00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:30,320
The Church calls her a saint, History calls her a hero.

771
00:47:30,840 --> 00:47:34,440
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, yes, all right, well, let's give a listen

772
00:47:34,480 --> 00:47:39,280
to the trailer before we get into our breakdown and

773
00:47:39,320 --> 00:47:40,760
our review of this production.

774
00:47:44,559 --> 00:47:47,199
Speaker 5: This is what I know from the voices that guide me.

775
00:47:48,440 --> 00:47:53,079
I will break the siege of Orleans. I will lead

776
00:47:53,199 --> 00:47:55,719
the Dauphin to Rance for his coronation.

777
00:47:57,039 --> 00:48:01,159
Speaker 1: Jehan, Have the voices told you anything else about your future?

778
00:48:13,320 --> 00:48:17,480
Speaker 5: What is your name? In my town? They call me Jeanette.

779
00:48:18,360 --> 00:48:23,159
Since I came to Central France, I have been called Jeanne, Jeanne.

780
00:48:24,519 --> 00:48:27,880
Speaker 1: How did God call you to be his messenger?

781
00:48:28,960 --> 00:48:31,239
Speaker 5: He has been speaking to me through his saints since

782
00:48:31,239 --> 00:48:32,000
I was thirteen.

783
00:48:37,039 --> 00:48:40,760
Speaker 1: Open the gate, maybe, I beg you do not go

784
00:48:40,880 --> 00:48:42,679
out there. It is an open field.

785
00:48:43,000 --> 00:48:46,039
Speaker 5: You may come with me or not, but I am going.

786
00:48:49,960 --> 00:48:51,880
Speaker 3: We are not dealing with a mere girl.

787
00:48:52,679 --> 00:48:56,639
Speaker 2: The battle was lost until she arrived. I have seen

788
00:48:56,679 --> 00:48:58,239
nothing like dinner my years.

789
00:49:06,079 --> 00:49:09,360
Speaker 5: In God's name, we must go against the english Men

790
00:49:09,440 --> 00:49:11,239
at arms, protect a maiden.

791
00:49:12,000 --> 00:49:12,400
Speaker 10: Go now.

792
00:49:13,039 --> 00:49:14,800
Speaker 9: The blood of France is spilling.

793
00:49:26,760 --> 00:49:29,320
Speaker 2: Man. That music yeah so good.

794
00:49:29,960 --> 00:49:32,599
Speaker 1: I saw on the credits that there's a flautist that's

795
00:49:32,760 --> 00:49:36,719
credited Kim Flushaw. I don't know. I don't know how

796
00:49:36,719 --> 00:49:37,239
to say her name.

797
00:49:37,960 --> 00:49:39,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I can't remember how to pronounce her

798
00:49:40,039 --> 00:49:43,480
name either, But yes, she's fantastic. And there's a link

799
00:49:43,480 --> 00:49:45,559
in the show notes to a blog post on our

800
00:49:45,599 --> 00:49:50,440
website where we did a deep dive into the score

801
00:49:50,519 --> 00:49:54,679
and talked with Jared and he shared about his process

802
00:49:54,679 --> 00:49:58,400
of working with Kim to bring in those real instruments. So,

803
00:49:58,760 --> 00:50:02,239
you know, a lot of times composers these days typically

804
00:50:02,679 --> 00:50:06,760
they're going to use all samples in software. But I

805
00:50:06,920 --> 00:50:10,920
like how Jared will bring in actual instrumentalists that are

806
00:50:11,119 --> 00:50:13,639
experts at a particular type of instrument that he wants

807
00:50:13,719 --> 00:50:18,360
to highlight in a score, and it really kind of

808
00:50:18,400 --> 00:50:22,639
just lifts up the whole piece. And so it's a

809
00:50:22,679 --> 00:50:25,800
really cool article. If you haven't read that on our website,

810
00:50:26,320 --> 00:50:27,880
be sure to check that out. It's really cool.

811
00:50:28,199 --> 00:50:30,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, he seems like he's the name, at least in

812
00:50:30,480 --> 00:50:33,360
my mind, for any kind of epic score for an

813
00:50:33,400 --> 00:50:36,719
audio drama. Jared Deepes Squall's the guy to go to.

814
00:50:37,480 --> 00:50:42,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. And in the last interview that I did

815
00:50:42,920 --> 00:50:45,840
with him not long ago, we talked quite a bit

816
00:50:45,880 --> 00:50:48,239
about this particular score. So if you haven't heard that yet,

817
00:50:48,320 --> 00:50:51,760
that's linked in the show notes too, so check that out.

818
00:50:51,920 --> 00:50:56,000
But that summary is a pretty good one. It's about

819
00:50:56,000 --> 00:50:59,639
two minutes or not summary, but the trailer there, and

820
00:51:00,400 --> 00:51:04,320
it's an interesting one because there's a lot of space

821
00:51:04,400 --> 00:51:07,840
in there, like they really just allow it to breathe

822
00:51:07,880 --> 00:51:12,800
and move through and just give little highlight points without

823
00:51:13,079 --> 00:51:14,800
you know, a lot of trailers, it's just like dialogue

824
00:51:14,800 --> 00:51:17,119
boom boom boom boom, boom. They didn't do that with that.

825
00:51:17,519 --> 00:51:20,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, and nlike the audio drama itself, there wasn't a

826
00:51:20,400 --> 00:51:23,159
lot of narration. It was just a lot of snippets

827
00:51:23,159 --> 00:51:24,239
of dialogue in the trailer.

828
00:51:24,679 --> 00:51:28,280
Speaker 2: Mmmmmm. Well, so we're going to talk about some of

829
00:51:28,320 --> 00:51:30,880
the cast members as we as we go through this,

830
00:51:31,000 --> 00:51:35,280
but we'll talk about the main ones real quickly, and

831
00:51:35,320 --> 00:51:38,679
that is Heather Forster as Joan of Arc or Jen

832
00:51:38,840 --> 00:51:42,480
Dark as she's called in this show. We have Harry

833
00:51:42,559 --> 00:51:46,760
Lloyd as Mushar and Finty Williams as the interviewer. Now,

834
00:51:46,800 --> 00:51:49,280
Finty we've heard in a lot of stuff like Lamplighter,

835
00:51:49,320 --> 00:51:52,920
and I think she's been in some of the Heirloom

836
00:51:52,960 --> 00:51:59,119
audio stuff as well. These are really really skilled and

837
00:52:00,039 --> 00:52:03,280
talented actress that they always work with in these shows.

838
00:52:03,440 --> 00:52:08,360
So in terms of acting, man, this was exceptionally done.

839
00:52:08,639 --> 00:52:11,920
Speaker 1: Yeah. I thought the actress who played Joan or Jean

840
00:52:12,159 --> 00:52:15,159
or Jan or however we need to say it, but

841
00:52:15,280 --> 00:52:18,079
I thought she did such a good job. And I

842
00:52:18,119 --> 00:52:21,320
thought she had a great blend of like courage and

843
00:52:21,719 --> 00:52:24,079
like she sounded young. I think she is young. I

844
00:52:24,079 --> 00:52:26,440
think when she recorded it she was like eighteen. I

845
00:52:26,559 --> 00:52:30,800
heard an interview with Paul McCusker about the story. And

846
00:52:31,159 --> 00:52:34,039
I think so, I think she was a teenager anyway,

847
00:52:34,039 --> 00:52:37,840
the actress, and I thought she just nailed the character

848
00:52:38,159 --> 00:52:41,760
and gave gave her so much sympathy. Yeah, I really

849
00:52:41,840 --> 00:52:42,760
enjoyed her performance.

850
00:52:43,519 --> 00:52:47,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, she was phenomenal. I mean I was blown away

851
00:52:47,239 --> 00:52:50,079
by her performance. I think I've mentioned it before, just

852
00:52:50,280 --> 00:52:52,559
in passing. I don't know if it was in an

853
00:52:52,599 --> 00:52:55,599
actual public episode or if it was on backstage, but

854
00:52:56,360 --> 00:52:59,320
she did such a great job. So here's the interesting

855
00:52:59,360 --> 00:53:01,800
thing about her. I don't think she was quite that

856
00:53:01,920 --> 00:53:05,920
young because she's married. Yeah she is young er, but

857
00:53:06,800 --> 00:53:10,920
she's not as young as the character. So here's the

858
00:53:10,960 --> 00:53:14,599
interesting thing about her. So her name is Heather Higher.

859
00:53:14,679 --> 00:53:17,920
She's credited as Higher or Hayer. I'm not sure exactly

860
00:53:18,280 --> 00:53:20,840
how you pronounce that. I think she's done some stage

861
00:53:20,960 --> 00:53:24,280
stuff under that name, but she got married and her

862
00:53:24,320 --> 00:53:26,480
married name is Forrester, So Heather Forster is how she

863
00:53:26,559 --> 00:53:29,079
was credited in this audio drama. This is her first

864
00:53:29,199 --> 00:53:33,239
role credited as that name. But we have heard from

865
00:53:33,239 --> 00:53:36,639
her before because she has performed under stage names in

866
00:53:36,719 --> 00:53:40,440
other shows that I know you have heard. So she's

867
00:53:40,480 --> 00:53:43,519
performed under the name of Lily Milton. So she was

868
00:53:43,639 --> 00:53:47,119
in radio theaters Le Miz as Young Cosette.

869
00:53:47,320 --> 00:53:48,719
Speaker 1: Really yeah, that's awesome.

870
00:53:48,960 --> 00:53:51,880
Speaker 2: And she was Mary Lennox in Radio Theater's Secret Garden.

871
00:53:52,239 --> 00:53:55,280
Speaker 1: Oh no way, she was like a child after Prodigy.

872
00:53:55,320 --> 00:53:57,079
Those are like the heavy hitters.

873
00:53:57,360 --> 00:54:01,199
Speaker 2: Yeah. And she was also the mouse in the Last

874
00:54:01,239 --> 00:54:03,760
Battle from radio theaters Chronicles of Narnia.

875
00:54:04,199 --> 00:54:04,840
Speaker 1: How funny.

876
00:54:05,159 --> 00:54:08,519
Speaker 2: So so all those three roles were credited as Lily Milton.

877
00:54:09,079 --> 00:54:13,920
Then years later she worked on Lamplighter Theater and she

878
00:54:13,960 --> 00:54:17,400
went under the name Zoe Thorne. So she was Jessica

879
00:54:17,480 --> 00:54:20,920
in the Basket of Flowers, and then she played Jesse

880
00:54:21,079 --> 00:54:23,519
and Brittania in a Peep behind the Scenes.

881
00:54:24,079 --> 00:54:27,960
Speaker 1: Wow. Yeah, I know all of those. Yeah, all of those,

882
00:54:28,039 --> 00:54:31,079
and all of those are great performances that I really enjoy,

883
00:54:31,800 --> 00:54:33,480
So that's very cool.

884
00:54:33,679 --> 00:54:36,559
Speaker 2: She was also offered roles in radio theaters all over

885
00:54:36,679 --> 00:54:40,039
Twist Heirloom Audios, The Dragon and the Raven, and air

886
00:54:40,119 --> 00:54:42,400
theaters The Trials of Saint Patrick, but she had to

887
00:54:42,440 --> 00:54:45,280
decline for various reasons on those, so she would have

888
00:54:45,280 --> 00:54:47,400
been in a lot more shows that we are familiar with.

889
00:54:48,000 --> 00:54:50,960
Speaker 1: Wow, I definitely didn't realize that she had all that

890
00:54:51,199 --> 00:54:55,320
experience prior to doing this role, but it showed. Because that,

891
00:54:55,599 --> 00:54:59,320
I feel like this wouldn't necessarily be the easiest role

892
00:54:59,360 --> 00:55:01,599
to play. I think it could be easy to go to.

893
00:55:02,519 --> 00:55:06,920
I don't know, she's she's such a separated figure, so

894
00:55:06,960 --> 00:55:09,639
I think it would be easy to lose like humanity

895
00:55:10,039 --> 00:55:13,480
like her, you know, but she doesn't. She kept that

896
00:55:13,800 --> 00:55:16,079
really well and you can hear the emotion is like,

897
00:55:16,119 --> 00:55:17,599
I think it would be easy to play her flat,

898
00:55:17,639 --> 00:55:19,880
I guess, is what I'm saying. And I don't think

899
00:55:19,920 --> 00:55:21,960
she did at all. So and it would be hard

900
00:55:21,960 --> 00:55:24,960
to listen to if she wasn't such a good actress,

901
00:55:25,119 --> 00:55:26,599
because she's through the whole thing.

902
00:55:26,960 --> 00:55:31,199
Speaker 2: Her performance could have made or broken this show. Like, yeah,

903
00:55:31,239 --> 00:55:34,599
if you didn't have a good actress as that lead role,

904
00:55:35,039 --> 00:55:36,079
the show is gonna be.

905
00:55:36,119 --> 00:55:39,280
Speaker 1: Terrible, right, Yeah, absolutely.

906
00:55:38,920 --> 00:55:41,920
Speaker 2: And yeah, you're right. There are so many layers to

907
00:55:42,239 --> 00:55:46,840
this character because we see her in a lot of

908
00:55:46,880 --> 00:55:50,280
different situations, and of course when we get to the end,

909
00:55:51,400 --> 00:55:56,320
just extremely true. I mean, I can't even imagine what

910
00:55:56,440 --> 00:56:00,840
somebody would be feeling going through, you know, that sort

911
00:56:00,880 --> 00:56:03,920
of situation, being imprisoned and all this kind of stuff,

912
00:56:04,239 --> 00:56:06,239
which we'll get to, and I want to say a

913
00:56:06,280 --> 00:56:09,760
couple of things before we get too much further. You know,

914
00:56:09,840 --> 00:56:12,800
we might give a few slight spoilers on this one.

915
00:56:13,559 --> 00:56:15,800
Our our typical strategy for our reviews is to stay

916
00:56:15,960 --> 00:56:19,440
spoiler free. But this is a historical event. I mean,

917
00:56:19,480 --> 00:56:22,119
we all know the end of the story. It's not

918
00:56:22,199 --> 00:56:26,960
going to be a surprise to anybody that Joan was executed.

919
00:56:26,960 --> 00:56:31,000
I mean, that's history. We know that, right, So even

920
00:56:31,039 --> 00:56:35,599
if you're not super familiar with her story as I wasn't,

921
00:56:36,280 --> 00:56:39,119
you know, everybody at least knows that bit of it, right,

922
00:56:39,199 --> 00:56:44,440
So yeah, we might reference some of the things that happened,

923
00:56:44,519 --> 00:56:46,400
but again, this is all historical records, so.

924
00:56:47,000 --> 00:56:49,039
Speaker 1: Either everybody already knew it or they just found out.

925
00:56:52,000 --> 00:56:54,519
Speaker 2: So we'll try to just stick to things that we

926
00:56:54,760 --> 00:56:57,320
don't think are too much of a surprise. But we

927
00:56:57,920 --> 00:56:59,639
want to again, we want to do this justice and

928
00:57:00,079 --> 00:57:02,920
kind of go in depth on this show. So and

929
00:57:03,000 --> 00:57:06,000
the second thing is, you know, I'm not Catholic, and

930
00:57:06,119 --> 00:57:09,360
this is obviously coming from a very Catholic point of view,

931
00:57:10,199 --> 00:57:13,639
and obviously somebody who is Catholic is going to really,

932
00:57:13,679 --> 00:57:17,800
really love this. There's a lot of Catholic doctrine and

933
00:57:17,840 --> 00:57:21,119
things like that that are in the show because it's

934
00:57:21,159 --> 00:57:25,559
coming from that point of view, and that is the

935
00:57:25,599 --> 00:57:28,920
religion that these characters were a part of, so that

936
00:57:29,320 --> 00:57:30,960
makes sense for it to be part of this story.

937
00:57:31,599 --> 00:57:34,639
But I think as someone who is not Catholic, there

938
00:57:34,679 --> 00:57:38,960
is still value here in these sorts of stories because

939
00:57:38,960 --> 00:57:41,880
of the historical perspective in that coming at it from

940
00:57:41,960 --> 00:57:45,559
that point of view, and I think there's things that

941
00:57:46,880 --> 00:57:52,719
you can still glean from this courageous girl's life regardless

942
00:57:52,760 --> 00:57:56,039
of what religion you have, right.

943
00:57:56,440 --> 00:57:59,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, And I think it's important for us to

944
00:57:59,760 --> 00:58:03,559
write little bit stories like this from history because even

945
00:58:03,639 --> 00:58:07,760
though there are elements probably that were you know, added

946
00:58:07,800 --> 00:58:10,280
in in order to make it flow smoother or whatever.

947
00:58:10,360 --> 00:58:12,800
Like Luchard, I heard Paul McCusker say that was a

948
00:58:12,840 --> 00:58:15,639
character he made up in order to facilitate the telling

949
00:58:15,760 --> 00:58:18,800
the story. But Joan of Arc in particular, there's a

950
00:58:18,800 --> 00:58:22,159
lot of first hand accounts because of the transcripts of

951
00:58:22,199 --> 00:58:26,400
the two trials that she had that are available from

952
00:58:26,480 --> 00:58:29,760
the you know, fifteenth century, and so there's a lot

953
00:58:29,760 --> 00:58:34,119
of documented evidence about her life and the things she

954
00:58:34,159 --> 00:58:37,760
did from like eyewitnesses at the time, and so these

955
00:58:37,760 --> 00:58:40,440
are events that actually happened. And I think it's important

956
00:58:40,480 --> 00:58:42,159
that we wrestled with some of this because I'm not

957
00:58:42,199 --> 00:58:44,800
a Catholic either, and one of the things that is

958
00:58:44,840 --> 00:58:47,079
a little uncomfortable is hearing about like saints talking to

959
00:58:47,119 --> 00:58:50,360
her and stuff. And yet I really appreciated the way

960
00:58:50,400 --> 00:58:53,360
that it was handled because Paul McCusker could have written

961
00:58:53,360 --> 00:58:56,639
the story starting off with like us hearing the voices

962
00:58:56,639 --> 00:58:58,599
of the saints talking to her when she's thirteen or whatever.

963
00:58:58,639 --> 00:59:01,039
That could have been a way that that he approached it. Yeah,

964
00:59:01,039 --> 00:59:04,840
But instead we're not in the position of her hearing

965
00:59:04,920 --> 00:59:07,639
the voices. We're in the position of the other people

966
00:59:07,639 --> 00:59:09,760
that are around her, and we're hearing the claims that

967
00:59:09,800 --> 00:59:12,840
she is making and that she did make, and we

968
00:59:12,880 --> 00:59:15,440
have to wrestle with it just like they did about

969
00:59:15,519 --> 00:59:19,039
you know, what's really going on here, because she she's

970
00:59:19,039 --> 00:59:21,679
doing these things and she's saying she's sent by God

971
00:59:21,760 --> 00:59:24,360
and she But anyways, it's I think that was a

972
00:59:24,360 --> 00:59:27,199
good storytelling choice because it allows us to wrestle with

973
00:59:27,280 --> 00:59:29,039
it in the way that people would have had to

974
00:59:29,039 --> 00:59:31,320
wrestle with it if they were there, you know, yeah.

975
00:59:31,360 --> 00:59:33,880
Speaker 2: It kind of it puts the listener in that same

976
00:59:34,840 --> 00:59:38,000
quandary and same point of view of like do we

977
00:59:38,039 --> 00:59:39,639
take her seriously or not?

978
00:59:40,719 --> 00:59:43,079
Speaker 1: Yeah, because I found myself during a lot of moments

979
00:59:43,119 --> 00:59:46,480
where I was completely rooting for her and on her side.

980
00:59:46,960 --> 00:59:50,519
And obviously it's written very sympathetically towards her, but there

981
00:59:50,519 --> 00:59:53,880
were there were also times where I was sympathetic with

982
00:59:53,920 --> 00:59:56,360
the people that were maybe not supposed to be sympathetic with,

983
00:59:56,519 --> 00:59:59,039
you know, like the people that are testing her to

984
00:59:59,119 --> 01:00:01,079
make sure because and we even you know, one of

985
01:00:01,079 --> 01:00:03,039
the guys that's testing her, which may not be a

986
01:00:03,079 --> 01:00:05,400
great character. When everybody says, like, you know, the Bible

987
01:00:05,440 --> 01:00:08,039
says we got to test every spirit, and I'm like, yeah,

988
01:00:08,119 --> 01:00:10,880
it does say that, and yes we do. And even

989
01:00:11,199 --> 01:00:13,920
some of the points they were making from scripture to her,

990
01:00:14,400 --> 01:00:17,119
even things like like she's kind of an icon for

991
01:00:17,239 --> 01:00:21,079
non Christians, even like a feminist icon because she went

992
01:00:21,119 --> 01:00:24,800
into battle with soldier's clothes instead of wearing women's apparel,

993
01:00:24,960 --> 01:00:27,440
which was, you know, very unusual at the time, and

994
01:00:27,480 --> 01:00:29,519
she cut her hair short so she could go into battle.

995
01:00:29,960 --> 01:00:31,960
And some of the arguments were like well, the Bible

996
01:00:32,039 --> 01:00:35,239
does say that women shouldn't wear men's apparel or cut

997
01:00:35,280 --> 01:00:36,960
their hair. And the Bible does say that, you know,

998
01:00:37,079 --> 01:00:40,719
in First Corinthians eleven and Deuteronomy twenty two, like that,

999
01:00:40,840 --> 01:00:44,000
those are actual passages and people can debate about how

1000
01:00:44,039 --> 01:00:46,920
to apply or interpret those things, you know, and so

1001
01:00:47,079 --> 01:00:49,519
and yet there's this we still have to wrestle with,

1002
01:00:49,599 --> 01:00:52,280
like what she did and the things she accomplished even

1003
01:00:52,400 --> 01:00:54,320
through all that. So I thought it was I do

1004
01:00:54,400 --> 01:00:58,199
think it's very valuable to say all that, and what

1005
01:00:58,880 --> 01:01:01,559
stands above all of it, It is her commitment and

1006
01:01:01,639 --> 01:01:04,599
sincerity to do what she's saying that God is telling

1007
01:01:04,599 --> 01:01:06,639
her to do, and then it has an effect. And

1008
01:01:06,679 --> 01:01:08,440
I think the way it was written allowed us to

1009
01:01:08,480 --> 01:01:12,360
do that without like, you know, insisting on certain doctrinal points.

1010
01:01:12,400 --> 01:01:14,159
I think it just presented the story in a good way.

1011
01:01:14,639 --> 01:01:17,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I like what Jared said in an interview

1012
01:01:17,360 --> 01:01:20,719
that I referenced a moment ago. He said his role

1013
01:01:21,000 --> 01:01:25,960
as the composer was to help the listener come to

1014
01:01:26,000 --> 01:01:31,159
the conclusion that Joan was sent from God. That you know,

1015
01:01:31,360 --> 01:01:32,960
you can come at it from the perspective of she

1016
01:01:33,000 --> 01:01:36,440
was crazy or she was doing what she was supposed

1017
01:01:36,480 --> 01:01:39,119
to do, and he said, you know, it was his

1018
01:01:39,320 --> 01:01:43,800
responsibility to help facilitate that perspective and help the listener

1019
01:01:43,800 --> 01:01:46,480
come to that conclusion. And I thought that was interesting.

1020
01:01:46,519 --> 01:01:50,360
And so you talk about the storytelling device we have

1021
01:01:50,480 --> 01:01:54,119
here with we have the chronicler, Mushar, and then we

1022
01:01:54,159 --> 01:01:57,519
have the interviewer who we don't know anything about for

1023
01:01:57,559 --> 01:02:01,159
a very long time. She just kind of pops up

1024
01:02:01,679 --> 01:02:04,920
here and there throughout the story and she's interviewing different

1025
01:02:05,239 --> 01:02:10,599
people to get their testimony of what happened all throughout

1026
01:02:10,639 --> 01:02:13,519
this And you're right, Paul could have started the script

1027
01:02:14,159 --> 01:02:18,239
with her family back in her little town and learning

1028
01:02:18,320 --> 01:02:22,559
about all of her family and the life in that

1029
01:02:22,639 --> 01:02:24,679
small village and all of that, but he doesn't. He

1030
01:02:24,719 --> 01:02:28,960
starts it at a very particular point. And so it

1031
01:02:29,039 --> 01:02:31,239
is an interesting way to tell this story through these

1032
01:02:31,280 --> 01:02:35,280
two perspectives of this chronicler Mushar, who is sent along

1033
01:02:35,360 --> 01:02:39,800
with her to just take down everything pretty much, you know,

1034
01:02:40,440 --> 01:02:44,039
And it is a really interesting way to do it. Now,

1035
01:02:44,360 --> 01:02:47,920
the downside of that is you are bouncing around a lot,

1036
01:02:48,599 --> 01:02:51,599
and it does make it a little bit harder to follow. Sometimes.

1037
01:02:52,119 --> 01:02:57,000
It definitely requires much more of an active listening experience.

1038
01:02:58,199 --> 01:03:02,079
Elements are intertwined here in and so I'm not necessarily

1039
01:03:02,119 --> 01:03:04,320
saying that it should have been done differently, but it

1040
01:03:04,400 --> 01:03:06,599
was an interesting choice and I'm pretty sure that it

1041
01:03:06,639 --> 01:03:10,039
was done deliberately. It's one way to tell the story,

1042
01:03:10,239 --> 01:03:13,920
and I think it worked. But again, there is a

1043
01:03:13,960 --> 01:03:17,639
downside to it. I think that it can be easy

1044
01:03:17,679 --> 01:03:20,400
for somebody who's not paying full attention to get lost.

1045
01:03:20,760 --> 01:03:23,840
Speaker 1: Yes, and I'll say that the beginning, like the first

1046
01:03:23,840 --> 01:03:27,719
fifteen minutes were hard for me to engage with and

1047
01:03:27,800 --> 01:03:30,800
understand what was happening. And I think if you had

1048
01:03:30,800 --> 01:03:33,519
some understanding of like one hundred years war going into it,

1049
01:03:33,559 --> 01:03:37,800
then you would maybe be able to jump in there

1050
01:03:37,880 --> 01:03:40,719
a little easier. But I mean, that's not a period

1051
01:03:40,719 --> 01:03:43,239
of history that I'm super familiar with, even though I

1052
01:03:43,280 --> 01:03:45,440
knew a couple things about it going in, and so

1053
01:03:46,119 --> 01:03:49,440
until Joan comes on the scene, it was hard to

1054
01:03:49,920 --> 01:03:53,440
invest in the story. Once she shows up, then I mean,

1055
01:03:53,480 --> 01:03:55,159
I know it does start with her, like the first

1056
01:03:55,159 --> 01:03:57,559
scene is the interviewer talking to her, but then it

1057
01:03:57,639 --> 01:03:59,880
jumps into like the battle scene, and it's jumping back

1058
01:04:00,119 --> 01:04:03,039
forth to different dates. He's like Mushard's writing about the

1059
01:04:03,039 --> 01:04:06,639
different dates during a scene at the castle where different

1060
01:04:06,639 --> 01:04:09,960
people are coming in, but it keeps cutting to him,

1061
01:04:10,039 --> 01:04:13,400
like describing things that are happening through that scene. And

1062
01:04:13,440 --> 01:04:16,400
so that was hard for me to understand what was

1063
01:04:16,400 --> 01:04:18,840
happening at first, and also like because I didn't know

1064
01:04:18,880 --> 01:04:20,920
who he was or anybody, like the only person you

1065
01:04:21,000 --> 01:04:23,679
know anything about coming in really is like you may

1066
01:04:23,719 --> 01:04:26,280
know some of the some like the Kings and stuff,

1067
01:04:26,360 --> 01:04:28,440
and then you'll know Joan of Arc. You know, those

1068
01:04:28,440 --> 01:04:30,880
are the people you know. And so then and Mushard,

1069
01:04:31,159 --> 01:04:33,519
like the way he was introduced, I was like, okay,

1070
01:04:33,559 --> 01:04:36,239
so I like this, it's a you know, a chronicler,

1071
01:04:36,639 --> 01:04:39,360
and it'll help us to know what's going on with

1072
01:04:39,400 --> 01:04:41,159
some of these battles and stuff, which would be hard

1073
01:04:41,199 --> 01:04:44,199
to just put, you know, like just scenes and stuff.

1074
01:04:44,239 --> 01:04:47,639
So I think that was helpful. But then when that

1075
01:04:47,719 --> 01:04:50,159
guy that Peter Morton plays that one of those French captains,

1076
01:04:50,199 --> 01:04:52,559
he says he's talking to him and he's like, who

1077
01:04:52,599 --> 01:04:54,679
are you? Are you a spy for one side or another?

1078
01:04:54,800 --> 01:04:57,079
And there was almost this like creepy like I'm both

1079
01:04:57,119 --> 01:05:00,079
here and I'm not and I'm in the shadows. Oh yeah,

1080
01:05:00,159 --> 01:05:02,360
who is this guy? And then and then it just

1081
01:05:02,400 --> 01:05:04,239
went on. I'm like, Oh, he's just like you go

1082
01:05:04,360 --> 01:05:07,079
along telling the story, you know. But I thought that

1083
01:05:07,159 --> 01:05:10,320
was a weird introduction because it put me on guard,

1084
01:05:10,519 --> 01:05:12,559
like with him and I was like, Oh, I guess

1085
01:05:12,559 --> 01:05:15,519
he's not a bad guy. He's just just showing up

1086
01:05:15,559 --> 01:05:18,679
and telling the story. But I thought that was interesting.

1087
01:05:19,000 --> 01:05:22,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was funny. I did I remember that that moment.

1088
01:05:22,440 --> 01:05:25,280
I was like, Oh, he's getting all sinister on us here.

1089
01:05:25,519 --> 01:05:25,840
Speaker 4: Yeah.

1090
01:05:25,960 --> 01:05:27,639
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was like, what is happening?

1091
01:05:29,039 --> 01:05:31,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, So you talk about the historical context, and that's

1092
01:05:31,639 --> 01:05:33,239
that's a good point, and I had that in my

1093
01:05:33,280 --> 01:05:36,000
notes too, like, this is a complex story. This is

1094
01:05:36,039 --> 01:05:40,679
not your your average biography of a of a person's life,

1095
01:05:40,719 --> 01:05:43,599
Like there is a lot of historical context that's required.

1096
01:05:43,599 --> 01:05:46,880
We have political and military angles on top of this

1097
01:05:47,000 --> 01:05:51,320
personal journey. So there is so much going on, and yes,

1098
01:05:51,519 --> 01:05:54,719
you do have to invest in the story. And it

1099
01:05:54,920 --> 01:05:58,360
is a little bit slow to get started because you're

1100
01:05:58,400 --> 01:06:00,639
you're you're kind of just floundering around. I'm trying to

1101
01:06:00,719 --> 01:06:03,519
grasp these pieces. And as I was thinking about this,

1102
01:06:03,559 --> 01:06:06,480
I was trying to figure out was there a better

1103
01:06:06,639 --> 01:06:10,119
way to do this? Is there a different approach that

1104
01:06:10,159 --> 01:06:13,360
would have made it simpler or easier? And I couldn't

1105
01:06:13,440 --> 01:06:16,599
arrive at a solid alternative. So I'm not trying to

1106
01:06:16,599 --> 01:06:18,400
say that I could have done any better or that

1107
01:06:18,440 --> 01:06:22,400
it should have been done differently. It's just I don't know.

1108
01:06:23,039 --> 01:06:24,960
Speaker 1: I Yeah, I agree, I don't think I could have

1109
01:06:25,000 --> 01:06:28,239
done better necessarily, But as a listener, would I like,

1110
01:06:28,400 --> 01:06:30,039
you know, far be it from me to give advice

1111
01:06:30,119 --> 01:06:34,360
to people better write experience, But as a listener, I

1112
01:06:34,360 --> 01:06:37,079
think what would have helped me is if it did

1113
01:06:37,159 --> 01:06:39,760
cut to a scene with like, I'm glad that he

1114
01:06:39,800 --> 01:06:42,800
doesn't let us hear any of the voices that she's hearing,

1115
01:06:43,079 --> 01:06:45,800
But I would have liked an earlier cut to Joan

1116
01:06:45,840 --> 01:06:48,199
of arc. I would have liked to see her like

1117
01:06:48,320 --> 01:06:50,599
trying to get an audience with that guy or whatever,

1118
01:06:50,880 --> 01:06:53,000
and then cut back to the battle. Stuff like that

1119
01:06:53,280 --> 01:06:56,480
would have helped me because once she's there, then I

1120
01:06:56,519 --> 01:06:58,119
have a through line that I can attach on to

1121
01:06:58,400 --> 01:07:00,639
and all the other stuff around her. You know, she

1122
01:07:00,800 --> 01:07:04,599
harries the storyline obviously, but I think that would have

1123
01:07:04,800 --> 01:07:06,480
helped me out a little bit. As if it had

1124
01:07:06,519 --> 01:07:08,280
cut a little sooner to her. And I was thinking

1125
01:07:08,280 --> 01:07:11,679
even one like a specific place was where I thought

1126
01:07:11,719 --> 01:07:13,440
it was going to cut. And it didn't. The Duke

1127
01:07:13,519 --> 01:07:16,360
of the Duke of Dunoirs or whatever. He the guy

1128
01:07:16,360 --> 01:07:19,559
who's protecting Orleon, and I'm going to butcher all the

1129
01:07:19,559 --> 01:07:22,519
French pronunciations, so we'll just we're just gonna run with it.

1130
01:07:23,119 --> 01:07:27,559
But they're obviously like surrounded in the siege, and and

1131
01:07:27,599 --> 01:07:29,119
the one guy says, well, what are we going to do?

1132
01:07:29,159 --> 01:07:31,719
And he says, hold on for dear life and pray

1133
01:07:31,800 --> 01:07:33,679
that God sends his help. And I thought for sure

1134
01:07:33,719 --> 01:07:35,960
that was going to cut to Joan, and it doesn't.

1135
01:07:36,000 --> 01:07:40,079
It like cuts into another like battleface. So I but

1136
01:07:40,239 --> 01:07:42,920
if it had cut just at some point through that

1137
01:07:43,039 --> 01:07:46,239
first like fifteen minutes or whatever, to her, to give

1138
01:07:46,280 --> 01:07:48,840
a little human angle, because it's hard to know who

1139
01:07:48,960 --> 01:07:51,639
even to be rooting for at the beginning, because you

1140
01:07:51,639 --> 01:07:52,920
don't know who's who or anything.

1141
01:07:53,360 --> 01:07:57,960
Speaker 2: So yeah, that's true. Yeah, I also struggle with with

1142
01:07:58,320 --> 01:08:02,000
some of the French names and places and stuff, and

1143
01:08:02,039 --> 01:08:04,880
it was it was a little bit tough for me

1144
01:08:05,000 --> 01:08:07,679
to keep track of some of that stuff, just because

1145
01:08:08,440 --> 01:08:10,679
I don't know French and so a lot of it

1146
01:08:10,679 --> 01:08:14,079
it just kind of sounds samey to me to my ear,

1147
01:08:14,960 --> 01:08:17,720
so that was a little bit difficult well.

1148
01:08:17,600 --> 01:08:20,760
Speaker 1: And to provide a counter so that may be why

1149
01:08:20,800 --> 01:08:23,479
they did this part. But one of the things that

1150
01:08:23,840 --> 01:08:26,479
just I don't know how if they could have avoided this,

1151
01:08:26,560 --> 01:08:29,239
but it just struck me as odd that, you know,

1152
01:08:29,239 --> 01:08:31,600
we're listening to a story about the French from the

1153
01:08:31,640 --> 01:08:34,520
perspective of the French fighting the English, and every single

1154
01:08:34,520 --> 01:08:38,640
person has an English accent. Dude, there's no French accent

1155
01:08:38,720 --> 01:08:40,439
except when they pronounce a French name.

1156
01:08:40,520 --> 01:08:42,600
Speaker 2: You know, Dude, I have that exact same thing in

1157
01:08:42,600 --> 01:08:43,399
my notes.

1158
01:08:45,159 --> 01:08:47,159
Speaker 1: Which I think it would have been harder to follow

1159
01:08:47,199 --> 01:08:50,640
if everybody did have French accents, you know. But it

1160
01:08:50,680 --> 01:08:53,439
is funny because I thought there was a guy later on,

1161
01:08:53,680 --> 01:08:55,920
like the Bishop, that was British, and then I realized that,

1162
01:08:55,960 --> 01:08:58,399
oh no, no, he's not English, He's he's French. Yeah,

1163
01:08:58,439 --> 01:09:01,239
but they all have English accent. And the only thing

1164
01:09:01,279 --> 01:09:04,800
I could see that differentiated the English the French characters

1165
01:09:04,840 --> 01:09:07,479
from the English characters was like the English characters seemed

1166
01:09:07,479 --> 01:09:10,399
to have more Cockney accents and the French characters for

1167
01:09:10,640 --> 01:09:12,359
like Queen's English accents.

1168
01:09:12,600 --> 01:09:15,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, so I had that exact same thing, because

1169
01:09:16,079 --> 01:09:19,439
it's like we have this war between the British and

1170
01:09:19,479 --> 01:09:22,000
the French. They're all played by English actors and they're

1171
01:09:22,000 --> 01:09:24,199
all like bashing the English the whole time. It was

1172
01:09:24,279 --> 01:09:27,039
just like it was tough to tell whose perspective we

1173
01:09:27,039 --> 01:09:28,560
were in, Like most of the time we're coming at

1174
01:09:28,560 --> 01:09:31,079
it from the French, but there are both times where

1175
01:09:31,119 --> 01:09:34,119
we're hearing about these these English characters. So I had

1176
01:09:34,119 --> 01:09:36,880
to keep reminding myself, this is France, this is France,

1177
01:09:37,000 --> 01:09:39,439
like because I'm not again, I'm not hearing any French accents.

1178
01:09:40,239 --> 01:09:42,920
Speaker 1: So and what reminded me was when they would say

1179
01:09:42,960 --> 01:09:45,079
like a French name and they and then and then

1180
01:09:45,119 --> 01:09:48,039
they must have had a person guiding them, you know,

1181
01:09:48,079 --> 01:09:51,920
in pronunciation and stuff, because their French pronunciations were very

1182
01:09:51,920 --> 01:09:54,199
good when they would do it, but they just didn't

1183
01:09:54,239 --> 01:09:56,039
It just it was like when you hear somebody talking

1184
01:09:56,039 --> 01:09:57,720
in Spanish and all of a sudden they say hamburger.

1185
01:09:57,920 --> 01:10:00,119
It was like a completely American accent, Like wow, well

1186
01:10:00,159 --> 01:10:02,199
what was that? That's what it felt like.

1187
01:10:02,479 --> 01:10:04,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, well, and I think that's one of the

1188
01:10:04,720 --> 01:10:07,960
roles that Daniel Philipott had as the language coach because

1189
01:10:08,000 --> 01:10:10,359
he works he does that sort of thing for a

1190
01:10:10,359 --> 01:10:13,039
lot of different shows, so I'm assuming that he was

1191
01:10:13,039 --> 01:10:16,399
the one who helped out with that. But yeah, and

1192
01:10:16,479 --> 01:10:19,239
it didn't help things that there is a huge cast

1193
01:10:19,279 --> 01:10:22,119
of characters, not just physical cast of actors, but like

1194
01:10:22,479 --> 01:10:26,319
a ton of different characters, and it was a little

1195
01:10:26,359 --> 01:10:30,039
bit tough to keep everyone straight again because some of

1196
01:10:30,039 --> 01:10:32,279
those French names are tough for me, and just the

1197
01:10:32,279 --> 01:10:35,119
sheer volume of characters that are only they only appear

1198
01:10:35,159 --> 01:10:37,319
in a scene here and there, or sometimes only in

1199
01:10:37,359 --> 01:10:38,920
one scene and then you don't hear from them again.

1200
01:10:38,960 --> 01:10:41,760
And so there was just a lot. There's a lot

1201
01:10:41,800 --> 01:10:44,600
going on. So again you have to be an active listener.

1202
01:10:44,640 --> 01:10:46,840
I think in this one you have to be invested

1203
01:10:46,880 --> 01:10:48,760
in the story or you're going to just be lost.

1204
01:10:49,279 --> 01:10:52,039
Speaker 1: And the good thing is that the one person who

1205
01:10:52,159 --> 01:10:55,479
is always like very clear and easy to differentiate his

1206
01:10:55,560 --> 01:10:59,239
joan herself exactly, and so it kind of works because

1207
01:10:59,439 --> 01:11:01,720
there's all these different voices and stuff, but then you

1208
01:11:01,760 --> 01:11:04,520
hear her voice and it's kind of the I don't know,

1209
01:11:04,560 --> 01:11:08,399
it's that that ring of clarity throughout the story with

1210
01:11:08,479 --> 01:11:10,720
all these people that have all their different ideas and things,

1211
01:11:10,720 --> 01:11:13,880
and I could always tell, well, maybe just because they

1212
01:11:13,880 --> 01:11:16,399
would always address him as like my gentle doufun or whatever,

1213
01:11:16,479 --> 01:11:18,359
but I could always tell when you know, with the King,

1214
01:11:18,640 --> 01:11:21,640
and I could usually tell like Muschard, but there were

1215
01:11:21,640 --> 01:11:24,000
a couple of times where you know, like the different

1216
01:11:24,000 --> 01:11:27,720
captains and stuff, they sounded real similar to like the

1217
01:11:27,800 --> 01:11:32,439
Chamberlain and one of her captains, and the duke that

1218
01:11:32,560 --> 01:11:35,920
was like the protector of Orleons. They all sounded pretty similar.

1219
01:11:36,279 --> 01:11:38,560
Even though I met Peter Morton at the Lamplighter Guilt,

1220
01:11:38,600 --> 01:11:40,760
so I could always, i like, recognize his voice. But

1221
01:11:40,800 --> 01:11:42,239
if I if I hadn't met him, I don't think

1222
01:11:42,239 --> 01:11:44,199
I would have been able to tell the difference. But

1223
01:11:44,560 --> 01:11:47,079
I do. I love his acting. He's got a great

1224
01:11:47,119 --> 01:11:49,880
voice and he's a great actor. But and then of

1225
01:11:49,960 --> 01:11:52,279
course at the end, I recognized Philip last Bro or

1226
01:11:52,319 --> 01:11:56,159
Philip Sherlock as his acting credit is. And I what

1227
01:11:56,199 --> 01:11:57,960
I kind of had to do, especially at the beginning,

1228
01:11:58,079 --> 01:12:00,159
was like, Okay, there's a lot of battles and stuff

1229
01:12:00,199 --> 01:12:01,600
that I'm not keeping track of, and I don't know

1230
01:12:01,600 --> 01:12:05,439
who half these people are, but I know that they're

1231
01:12:05,520 --> 01:12:09,800
under siege and they need help. So there's my takeaway.

1232
01:12:09,800 --> 01:12:12,760
And now we're moving on like Oka, and I know

1233
01:12:12,800 --> 01:12:14,399
they're trying to go to the place where the're gonna

1234
01:12:14,359 --> 01:12:16,640
get theim crowned. Okay, so moving on to that part

1235
01:12:16,640 --> 01:12:20,319
of the story. Yeah, yeah, which after that first episode,

1236
01:12:20,600 --> 01:12:22,880
I felt like I was able to track a lot easier.

1237
01:12:23,199 --> 01:12:25,039
It was just the first one that I have trouble

1238
01:12:25,079 --> 01:12:28,000
with the most. But even though there was and you

1239
01:12:28,000 --> 01:12:29,479
know something else that helps me at the end of

1240
01:12:29,520 --> 01:12:31,760
the first episode as far as like keeping people straight,

1241
01:12:32,319 --> 01:12:35,520
is there's a Muchard has a conversation with the Dauphin's

1242
01:12:35,600 --> 01:12:39,039
mother in law and she says, you know who we

1243
01:12:39,079 --> 01:12:41,600
got to watch out for is the chamberlain and the archbishop.

1244
01:12:41,640 --> 01:12:43,399
And I was like, all right, I got my bad guys,

1245
01:12:43,399 --> 01:12:45,600
and I'm gonna I know that every time I hear them,

1246
01:12:45,720 --> 01:12:47,359
like I know where I'm at.

1247
01:12:47,600 --> 01:12:52,199
Speaker 2: So yeah, yeah, yeah. And I've talked about this before

1248
01:12:52,680 --> 01:12:56,840
generally not being a fan of narration, but I think

1249
01:12:56,880 --> 01:13:00,600
the way that Paul usually does it with these Earthia shows,

1250
01:13:01,279 --> 01:13:03,840
they are a character in the story and so it

1251
01:13:03,920 --> 01:13:08,079
makes it a little more natural, and it's not even

1252
01:13:08,159 --> 01:13:12,960
like with the Ga Hinty series, we have Brian Blessed

1253
01:13:13,079 --> 01:13:18,039
as Hinty, who is not really a character. He's narrating throughout,

1254
01:13:18,319 --> 01:13:20,520
but he's not actually in the story, whereas here we

1255
01:13:20,560 --> 01:13:24,359
have Mushar and he's actually in scene as well, several times,

1256
01:13:24,359 --> 01:13:27,359
many times, yeah, all throughout. So I think that was

1257
01:13:27,600 --> 01:13:30,560
a really smart move because it would have been much

1258
01:13:30,680 --> 01:13:32,880
tougher to track everything.

1259
01:13:33,319 --> 01:13:35,199
Speaker 1: Yes, I do think the narration was a good move.

1260
01:13:36,159 --> 01:13:38,920
And Mushar is like even so he's chronicling it, but

1261
01:13:38,960 --> 01:13:41,760
then he's also a good character and he's he's usually like,

1262
01:13:41,960 --> 01:13:44,680
if there's a funny line, it's usually him that's, you know,

1263
01:13:44,760 --> 01:13:47,760
saying it. So he was a good, like through character.

1264
01:13:47,880 --> 01:13:50,079
And like the first one of the first times I

1265
01:13:50,159 --> 01:13:53,520
laughed out loud was when you know, he goes to

1266
01:13:53,600 --> 01:13:56,399
the guy that Joanavarc's first going to who of course

1267
01:13:56,439 --> 01:13:59,359
I forgot the name of, like Robert day something court,

1268
01:13:59,479 --> 01:14:02,279
I don't know. He goes to him, you know, he's

1269
01:14:02,319 --> 01:14:04,239
asking who he is and he says, well, have you

1270
01:14:04,239 --> 01:14:08,000
ever heard of Chaucer? And he says no, I haven't.

1271
01:14:08,039 --> 01:14:11,359
He goes good because I'm nothing like the man man,

1272
01:14:11,439 --> 01:14:12,880
And that line made me laugh out loud.

1273
01:14:13,199 --> 01:14:15,279
Speaker 2: We are on the same page, because I had that

1274
01:14:15,319 --> 01:14:18,960
in my notes as well. Yes, yeah, I literally did

1275
01:14:19,079 --> 01:14:21,239
laugh out loud at that it was and the way

1276
01:14:21,319 --> 01:14:24,680
he delivers the line, yes, oh good because I am

1277
01:14:24,720 --> 01:14:26,680
nothing like the man. Yeah. I was just like I

1278
01:14:26,720 --> 01:14:27,119
loved it.

1279
01:14:27,600 --> 01:14:29,880
Speaker 1: And it was good too because like Chaucer was like

1280
01:14:30,039 --> 01:14:32,000
around the one hundred years more like a little earlier,

1281
01:14:32,039 --> 01:14:35,439
so it was like perfect historical like shade and everything. Yeah,

1282
01:14:35,720 --> 01:14:37,720
very very well played well.

1283
01:14:37,760 --> 01:14:40,880
Speaker 2: And of course he's French and Chaucer was English, so

1284
01:14:41,000 --> 01:14:43,399
there's a little bit more perspective there too.

1285
01:14:43,920 --> 01:14:46,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. One more thing I just want to say about, like,

1286
01:14:46,800 --> 01:14:50,239
so the interviewer. I think that was helpful for telling

1287
01:14:50,239 --> 01:14:53,000
the story, and she was like talking to different people

1288
01:14:53,000 --> 01:14:55,279
and getting what they were thinking, and it was actually

1289
01:14:55,279 --> 01:14:56,479
one of the things is my wife and I were

1290
01:14:56,520 --> 01:14:58,560
listening to it that were like We're like, oh, who

1291
01:14:58,640 --> 01:15:01,520
is this interviewer and we're noticing different things. And I

1292
01:15:01,560 --> 01:15:03,960
really thought that the way it was going to play it, well,

1293
01:15:04,000 --> 01:15:05,119
I don't know, I don't know if this is a

1294
01:15:05,159 --> 01:15:07,399
spoiler or not, but it's not really a spoiler because

1295
01:15:07,439 --> 01:15:11,359
nothing happened. But I was expecting the interviewer to be

1296
01:15:11,600 --> 01:15:14,239
like somebody involved with the trial or after the trial

1297
01:15:14,279 --> 01:15:17,920
that's gathering the information. And at the end, unless I

1298
01:15:17,960 --> 01:15:20,600
missed something, it just seemed like like they didn't go

1299
01:15:20,640 --> 01:15:23,479
anywhere like that. She wasn't anybody like she was just

1300
01:15:23,680 --> 01:15:26,600
some it was just a storytelling device. It wasn't actually

1301
01:15:26,600 --> 01:15:28,359
like it didn't seem like she was actually part of

1302
01:15:28,359 --> 01:15:31,000
the story. And one of the things that made it

1303
01:15:31,039 --> 01:15:33,760
even like it detached her even more, and it was

1304
01:15:33,800 --> 01:15:36,479
like a deliberate choice is that her voice echoed a

1305
01:15:36,520 --> 01:15:40,079
little bit and the other the people she was interviewing

1306
01:15:40,159 --> 01:15:44,680
did nots be in your notes too. Yes, sorry, I'm

1307
01:15:45,239 --> 01:15:48,840
taking the points before you. Yes, so, but what did

1308
01:15:48,880 --> 01:15:50,039
you make I do want to hear what you made

1309
01:15:50,039 --> 01:15:52,039
of that cause her, you know, it like detached her

1310
01:15:52,039 --> 01:15:54,199
a little bit as her voice was echoing and theirs wasn't.

1311
01:15:54,279 --> 01:15:56,520
I was like, that's strange, like who is she? And

1312
01:15:56,560 --> 01:15:58,800
then and I was kind of engaged with it, like

1313
01:15:58,840 --> 01:16:00,720
I wanted to see how it ended up, like how

1314
01:16:00,760 --> 01:16:02,880
she played into it, and I felt like I didn't

1315
01:16:02,920 --> 01:16:03,960
get that payoff at the.

1316
01:16:04,000 --> 01:16:08,000
Speaker 2: End exactly the entire time through, I'm like waiting for

1317
01:16:08,199 --> 01:16:11,119
the reveal you know, like, what is the context of

1318
01:16:11,199 --> 01:16:15,359
these interviews here? Where is this happening? Because as you

1319
01:16:15,359 --> 01:16:18,720
point out that that effect on her voice, there's a

1320
01:16:18,720 --> 01:16:23,960
lot of room reverberation, and then in every single scene,

1321
01:16:24,520 --> 01:16:27,439
whoever she's speaking to, it feels like we're right there

1322
01:16:27,479 --> 01:16:30,079
next to them, there's no reverb on their voice, right,

1323
01:16:30,079 --> 01:16:33,439
and it's very intentionally done on hers. So, yeah, I'm

1324
01:16:33,479 --> 01:16:35,800
still at a loss as to what that was supposed

1325
01:16:35,800 --> 01:16:38,119
to be because you're right, there is no reveal. We

1326
01:16:38,159 --> 01:16:40,439
don't know who she is, like what.

1327
01:16:40,640 --> 01:16:42,560
Speaker 1: For sure it was like one of the sources that

1328
01:16:42,640 --> 01:16:45,479
he used or something. And even just like her voice

1329
01:16:45,520 --> 01:16:48,159
is really cool, like Finty Williams is her name, Yeah,

1330
01:16:48,159 --> 01:16:50,720
Finny Williams voice is really cool. And so she was

1331
01:16:50,840 --> 01:16:52,840
very engaging, like the way she was asking the questions

1332
01:16:52,840 --> 01:16:55,319
and stuff, and so as we were getting to the

1333
01:16:55,439 --> 01:16:57,760
end and then it was getting passed, like the point

1334
01:16:57,800 --> 01:17:00,279
where I would have thought she showed up, seem like

1335
01:17:00,279 --> 01:17:01,960
the would have been a good opportunity to do that

1336
01:17:02,000 --> 01:17:04,439
because of all the questions and the trial and the

1337
01:17:04,479 --> 01:17:07,720
documentation that was done at the time. It seems like

1338
01:17:07,720 --> 01:17:09,479
there would have been a way to incorporate that in.

1339
01:17:09,680 --> 01:17:12,199
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I still I mean I've listened to this

1340
01:17:12,239 --> 01:17:14,359
thing three times all the way through. I still don't

1341
01:17:14,399 --> 01:17:17,920
know who she is, where she you know, how does

1342
01:17:17,920 --> 01:17:21,000
she fit into this? But yeah, you're right, her Finty

1343
01:17:21,039 --> 01:17:24,199
Williams performance was great and so like she's very neutral,

1344
01:17:24,560 --> 01:17:26,560
like and I don't mean in a monotone, boring sort

1345
01:17:26,600 --> 01:17:29,000
of way, but the way she asks the questions, you

1346
01:17:29,039 --> 01:17:32,000
can't tell like is she leaning this way or that?

1347
01:17:32,199 --> 01:17:34,439
You know, you don't know whose side she's are, right.

1348
01:17:34,720 --> 01:17:39,800
Speaker 1: I know I was excited to find out, but I didn't.

1349
01:17:41,159 --> 01:17:44,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, and so we should say that Harry Lloyd as

1350
01:17:44,760 --> 01:17:49,039
Mushar was fantastic too. You know, they are the three

1351
01:17:49,520 --> 01:17:53,239
main characters, main voices throughout this. We have a whole

1352
01:17:53,239 --> 01:17:57,199
lot of supporting characters, but they were the one ones

1353
01:17:57,239 --> 01:17:59,800
that carry the story, and all three of them just

1354
01:18:00,079 --> 01:18:01,000
a fantastic job.

1355
01:18:01,159 --> 01:18:02,880
Speaker 1: Yes, absolutely, So.

1356
01:18:02,880 --> 01:18:04,199
Speaker 2: We're still on episode one here.

1357
01:18:05,479 --> 01:18:08,680
Speaker 1: Okay, sorry that was a lot of like a stage settings.

1358
01:18:09,079 --> 01:18:13,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, but there is a line like in the latter

1359
01:18:13,680 --> 01:18:17,880
part of that first episode where somebody says something about

1360
01:18:18,159 --> 01:18:21,000
Joan being a divine messenger and I loved her her

1361
01:18:21,119 --> 01:18:23,840
come back to that, she says I am not a

1362
01:18:23,840 --> 01:18:26,880
divine messenger, only a messenger from the divine.

1363
01:18:27,359 --> 01:18:30,000
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that was really good. She had a lot

1364
01:18:30,000 --> 01:18:32,840
of really cool lines that I was I was kicking

1365
01:18:32,840 --> 01:18:34,640
myself for not writing down more of them, because there

1366
01:18:34,680 --> 01:18:36,039
was a couple times where my wife and I looked

1367
01:18:36,039 --> 01:18:38,840
at each other like that's good. Yeah, and now that

1368
01:18:38,960 --> 01:18:40,960
was one of them. Yeah, I'm glad you brought that out.

1369
01:18:42,000 --> 01:18:45,840
Speaker 2: So we'll We'll not spoil exactly what happens here, but

1370
01:18:46,920 --> 01:18:50,479
as we move into the next episode, there's I should

1371
01:18:50,840 --> 01:18:52,800
set this up a little bit, as you said in

1372
01:18:52,840 --> 01:18:54,960
the in the summary, and I think he is even

1373
01:18:55,000 --> 01:18:57,720
referenced in that trailer that we heard her. What she

1374
01:18:57,840 --> 01:19:02,239
believed her mission was was to get to the prince

1375
01:19:02,399 --> 01:19:05,640
or he was, the heir apparent to the throne. They

1376
01:19:05,640 --> 01:19:08,239
call him the dauphant, which is in French the word

1377
01:19:08,600 --> 01:19:11,399
means dolphin, but that is a title that they give

1378
01:19:11,479 --> 01:19:17,439
to the heir apparent to the throne and do Yeah, yeah,

1379
01:19:17,640 --> 01:19:21,520
gentle dolphin. I don't know exactly how that started. I

1380
01:19:21,760 --> 01:19:25,239
was if it started as a term of endearment or what,

1381
01:19:25,479 --> 01:19:27,479
but I had to look it up to see what

1382
01:19:27,520 --> 01:19:30,720
it actually meant. But yeah, it means dolphin. But anyway,

1383
01:19:31,159 --> 01:19:33,960
that was her mission to get to him, help him

1384
01:19:34,359 --> 01:19:37,840
to end the siege of Orleans and get him crowned.

1385
01:19:38,399 --> 01:19:42,479
And I mean, can you imagine a teenage girl just

1386
01:19:42,720 --> 01:19:46,039
kind of forcing her way into the upper crust of society,

1387
01:19:46,319 --> 01:19:48,760
not just a teenage girl, but a peasant teenage girl

1388
01:19:48,800 --> 01:19:51,880
who used to mind livestock, you know, I mean, yeah,

1389
01:19:52,319 --> 01:19:55,319
the audacity, you know, it's just like it's such a

1390
01:19:55,359 --> 01:19:59,039
remarkable thing, and he rightly wants to test her. And

1391
01:19:59,079 --> 01:20:01,800
so there's a really cool scene where that happens when

1392
01:20:01,880 --> 01:20:05,399
he first meets her, and I loved how that played out.

1393
01:20:05,680 --> 01:20:09,159
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's such a good scene. And it does feel

1394
01:20:09,159 --> 01:20:11,560
like something that God would do, you know, in order

1395
01:20:11,600 --> 01:20:15,720
to bring about a great victory, use the most unlikely person. Yeah, no,

1396
01:20:16,239 --> 01:20:19,560
use a peasant girl, a teenager, in order to lead

1397
01:20:19,600 --> 01:20:22,560
the army to victory. Like that feels like a god thing.

1398
01:20:23,119 --> 01:20:27,279
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, And also it is kind of a literary

1399
01:20:27,359 --> 01:20:30,079
device too, right, Like I mean I'm reading through The

1400
01:20:30,079 --> 01:20:32,039
Lord of the Rings again right now, for like this

1401
01:20:32,199 --> 01:20:35,399
fifth or sixth time, and that what is that all about?

1402
01:20:35,479 --> 01:20:39,600
But having the lowliest of peoples of Middle Earth, the Hobbits,

1403
01:20:39,720 --> 01:20:43,399
be the ones who end this massive war, the reign

1404
01:20:43,439 --> 01:20:45,880
of the Dark Lord. Nobody thought that they were going

1405
01:20:45,920 --> 01:20:49,199
to succeed, right, and plenty of people didn't want them

1406
01:20:49,239 --> 01:20:52,479
to succeed, But you know, those two little hobbits crossed

1407
01:20:52,479 --> 01:20:56,520
the entire continent, you know, to complete this task. And

1408
01:20:57,199 --> 01:20:59,600
in some ways this feels kind of like that sort

1409
01:20:59,600 --> 01:21:02,199
of a story, and it's the underdog.

1410
01:21:01,880 --> 01:21:05,319
Speaker 1: Right, absolutely, yeah, it's yeah, it's very David and Goliath.

1411
01:21:05,399 --> 01:21:06,359
That's how it feels.

1412
01:21:06,840 --> 01:21:10,439
Speaker 2: So. And there are all these things that as you

1413
01:21:10,520 --> 01:21:14,159
as you alluded to earlier, there are historical records for

1414
01:21:14,199 --> 01:21:17,119
some of these things that happened. I'm assuming that Paul

1415
01:21:17,199 --> 01:21:19,560
had to do a ton of research into all of

1416
01:21:19,560 --> 01:21:22,479
these things and make sure that he's including the right

1417
01:21:22,800 --> 01:21:25,399
historical references and the dates, because we have dates that

1418
01:21:25,439 --> 01:21:30,399
are mentioned all throughout, and so there are witnesses to

1419
01:21:30,720 --> 01:21:32,880
a lot of these things. But the one of the

1420
01:21:32,880 --> 01:21:36,680
crazy things, aside from her actually being accepted by the

1421
01:21:37,960 --> 01:21:42,600
would be king and actually taken into his confidence, the

1422
01:21:42,600 --> 01:21:46,119
whole thing with Catherine's sword. I don't know if I

1423
01:21:46,159 --> 01:21:50,239
should spoil that exactly, but that was an amazing thing too.

1424
01:21:50,920 --> 01:21:52,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was there was there was a lot of

1425
01:21:53,199 --> 01:21:56,720
really cool like sign things that is like this is

1426
01:21:56,760 --> 01:21:59,359
too good to be true. Did this really happen? You know?

1427
01:22:00,079 --> 01:22:02,640
But yeah, that was very cool and just one of

1428
01:22:02,680 --> 01:22:05,279
the as part of the tests, like she says she's

1429
01:22:05,319 --> 01:22:08,279
going to tell the king or the prince something that

1430
01:22:08,319 --> 01:22:10,520
only him and God know, and it's something that he

1431
01:22:11,079 --> 01:22:13,119
prayed when he was by himself that he hasn't told

1432
01:22:13,159 --> 01:22:17,079
anybody else. And there's like three very specific requests and

1433
01:22:17,159 --> 01:22:21,239
I loved the request. They were so humble and genuine

1434
01:22:21,520 --> 01:22:24,239
and since like and if he really prayed those things,

1435
01:22:24,680 --> 01:22:27,479
then it makes sense to me also that God would

1436
01:22:27,520 --> 01:22:29,800
want to put him on the throne, you know. Like

1437
01:22:29,840 --> 01:22:33,359
that showed a lot about his character, even though now

1438
01:22:33,399 --> 01:22:35,119
I don't know a whole lot about him historically, and

1439
01:22:35,279 --> 01:22:38,119
Muchard makes some references to like people in the castle

1440
01:22:38,119 --> 01:22:39,439
that makes me think there was like a lot of

1441
01:22:39,479 --> 01:22:41,600
messed up stuff that was going on at the time

1442
01:22:41,640 --> 01:22:45,840
as well. But that part of it where the way

1443
01:22:45,880 --> 01:22:48,319
he prayed and the way she uses that as a

1444
01:22:48,359 --> 01:22:50,800
way to show that she really is coming from God

1445
01:22:50,880 --> 01:22:51,640
was really neat to me.

1446
01:22:52,000 --> 01:22:54,600
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, and we should say, just in case you're

1447
01:22:54,600 --> 01:22:58,680
not familiar, this is Charles the seventh of France.

1448
01:22:59,560 --> 01:23:01,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, Charles the seventh. Do you know much about him

1449
01:23:02,000 --> 01:23:02,439
other than this?

1450
01:23:02,640 --> 01:23:05,319
Speaker 2: I don't. Man, history class was such a long time

1451
01:23:05,319 --> 01:23:08,680
ago and I haven't kept up on it all well.

1452
01:23:08,720 --> 01:23:10,359
Speaker 1: And it is funny because I do feel like I'm

1453
01:23:10,399 --> 01:23:12,800
usually more of an Anglophile than a Francophile, even though

1454
01:23:12,800 --> 01:23:14,760
like technically I have, I have no English in me

1455
01:23:14,960 --> 01:23:17,199
like genealogically I have, and I do have French in

1456
01:23:17,279 --> 01:23:19,760
me as so you know, this was bringing out my

1457
01:23:19,760 --> 01:23:21,439
French roots, you know, me rooting for the French in

1458
01:23:21,479 --> 01:23:25,720
this series. But it is funny because like Henry the

1459
01:23:25,720 --> 01:23:28,800
Fifth is a really well known story from Shakespeare, you know,

1460
01:23:29,880 --> 01:23:31,720
and it's the English, you know, when they when one

1461
01:23:31,760 --> 01:23:33,760
hundred years wor starts and they mentioned it in here,

1462
01:23:33,800 --> 01:23:36,359
like the Battle of Agincourt, And when I hear that story, like,

1463
01:23:36,359 --> 01:23:38,159
I'm totally on the side of the English, you know.

1464
01:23:38,560 --> 01:23:42,079
I listen to this, I'm like, oh man, they're the worst. Yeah,

1465
01:23:42,119 --> 01:23:43,600
but it's very interesting.

1466
01:23:44,000 --> 01:23:47,560
Speaker 2: Well, and I don't mean to muddy the waters too much,

1467
01:23:47,560 --> 01:23:49,680
because I did want to talk about this a little

1468
01:23:49,680 --> 01:23:53,000
bit later on too, but I mean that that does

1469
01:23:53,079 --> 01:23:56,560
sort of bring up the whole idea of how do

1470
01:23:56,640 --> 01:24:01,479
you know whose side God is on? In history? Like, yeah,

1471
01:24:01,760 --> 01:24:05,359
that's a that's a tough, tough call to make, like

1472
01:24:05,399 --> 01:24:08,359
when you look back. I mean there are sometimes sometimes

1473
01:24:08,359 --> 01:24:12,079
in history there there are very obvious things that are

1474
01:24:12,479 --> 01:24:16,039
you know, absolutely right and wrong, and other times you're like,

1475
01:24:16,880 --> 01:24:19,640
it's a little bit more on the gray area side

1476
01:24:19,680 --> 01:24:20,159
of things.

1477
01:24:20,640 --> 01:24:23,479
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, And I think this is a great story

1478
01:24:23,520 --> 01:24:26,479
to wrestle with that with. And one of the things

1479
01:24:26,479 --> 01:24:28,840
I liked about the way this played out is like

1480
01:24:29,039 --> 01:24:33,439
how many times jan keeps trying to get the English

1481
01:24:33,560 --> 01:24:37,720
to repent and surrender, like, and she keeps giving them

1482
01:24:37,840 --> 01:24:40,760
chance after chance. And there's this moment lay way later

1483
01:24:40,800 --> 01:24:43,119
on in the trial where they ask, you know, does

1484
01:24:43,159 --> 01:24:45,119
God hate the English or the is are all the

1485
01:24:45,159 --> 01:24:48,880
English going to hell? And she says, she says, God

1486
01:24:48,920 --> 01:24:52,399
will chastise any of us. He'll chastise all of us

1487
01:24:52,439 --> 01:24:56,279
for our sins, regardless of victory or defeat. Which was

1488
01:24:56,279 --> 01:24:58,680
a great answer, you know, And I think that that

1489
01:24:58,880 --> 01:25:03,640
was born out God was reaching for everybody. And sometimes

1490
01:25:03,720 --> 01:25:08,000
history does like you know, nationalities and stuff, it is

1491
01:25:08,119 --> 01:25:11,840
muddy and gray, but there is a clear like I

1492
01:25:11,880 --> 01:25:13,399
don't know, I don't know the exact right of way

1493
01:25:13,399 --> 01:25:14,920
it is, but I feel like there is a clear

1494
01:25:15,600 --> 01:25:18,399
call to anybody in any nation or any side of

1495
01:25:18,439 --> 01:25:21,399
a war or anything to be right with God, you know.

1496
01:25:22,000 --> 01:25:25,279
And that's that's the clear message that comes through even

1497
01:25:25,279 --> 01:25:27,560
in this audio drama, like even more because it really

1498
01:25:27,600 --> 01:25:30,279
wasn't even though it's like, you know, obviously she's saying

1499
01:25:30,319 --> 01:25:33,239
that God has ordained the you know, Charles the seventh

1500
01:25:33,319 --> 01:25:35,199
to be the king and all this stuff, and yet

1501
01:25:35,239 --> 01:25:37,399
there was still this I felt like there was like

1502
01:25:37,560 --> 01:25:38,680
some love for the English.

1503
01:25:39,159 --> 01:25:39,720
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1504
01:25:39,800 --> 01:25:41,439
Speaker 1: And there's a point where she's like crying on the

1505
01:25:41,439 --> 01:25:43,840
battlefield because they did they hadn't had a chance to

1506
01:25:43,880 --> 01:25:46,359
confess their sins before they died. And she's like, make

1507
01:25:46,399 --> 01:25:48,800
sure our soldiers are confessing their sins, you know, before

1508
01:25:48,800 --> 01:25:51,239
they go. And I think that it's cool that those

1509
01:25:51,279 --> 01:25:52,239
elements were brought out.

1510
01:25:52,600 --> 01:25:57,279
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, Well, and to that point, once she actually

1511
01:25:57,279 --> 01:26:01,640
gets control of an army, she sets down these ground

1512
01:26:01,720 --> 01:26:05,439
rules all right, no more swearing, no more women around,

1513
01:26:05,560 --> 01:26:07,000
which is funny because she was a woman.

1514
01:26:08,199 --> 01:26:11,079
Speaker 1: It's a certain kind I know.

1515
01:26:13,359 --> 01:26:15,960
Speaker 2: And you have to go to church, like yeah, she's

1516
01:26:16,079 --> 01:26:17,880
I mean, she put on all these rules in place,

1517
01:26:17,880 --> 01:26:20,319
and you're like, well, yeah, those are all good things.

1518
01:26:20,359 --> 01:26:22,000
Speaker 1: One of my favorite things for that scene is she

1519
01:26:22,039 --> 01:26:25,680
said she said no swearing and no blasphemy, and Peter

1520
01:26:25,760 --> 01:26:31,119
Morrion's character goes impossible, which is like totally like a

1521
01:26:31,159 --> 01:26:34,600
battle art and guy would say, yeah, his captain's name

1522
01:26:34,640 --> 01:26:37,119
meant like hedgehog. I think that he was prickly like

1523
01:26:37,119 --> 01:26:38,880
a hedgehog, which oh so perfect.

1524
01:26:41,239 --> 01:26:44,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I think about that today modern soldiers like,

1525
01:26:46,079 --> 01:26:47,920
it's it's a shame that it is this way, but

1526
01:26:48,000 --> 01:26:50,680
they're they're they're rough, rough dudes. Most of the time.

1527
01:26:50,720 --> 01:26:53,520
It's like telling them not to swear as they're in

1528
01:26:53,600 --> 01:26:57,279
battle and you have to go to church right right.

1529
01:26:57,000 --> 01:26:58,840
Speaker 1: Well, and even the day they want to press the

1530
01:26:58,880 --> 01:27:00,720
attack and she's like, no, we got to have church

1531
01:27:00,760 --> 01:27:02,359
out on the field. And they're like the English will

1532
01:27:02,399 --> 01:27:03,960
come and kill us, and she's like, or maybe they'll

1533
01:27:04,000 --> 01:27:08,760
join us. Yeah, which was that's another like in line

1534
01:27:08,880 --> 01:27:10,600
with what we were just talking about. You know, that's

1535
01:27:10,600 --> 01:27:14,600
another evidence of the focus being on doing what's right

1536
01:27:14,680 --> 01:27:17,399
before God for her versus like all the counselors and

1537
01:27:17,399 --> 01:27:19,920
stuff that are it seemed like such a clear thing

1538
01:27:19,920 --> 01:27:22,079
all the time, like they have all this worldly wisdom

1539
01:27:22,159 --> 01:27:24,720
and battlefield strategy and stuff like that, and then she

1540
01:27:24,960 --> 01:27:27,159
has this consistent like, well, we got to be honorable

1541
01:27:27,159 --> 01:27:28,119
to God, you know, over.

1542
01:27:28,039 --> 01:27:32,079
Speaker 2: Over, yeah, and yeah. She says that this line in

1543
01:27:32,680 --> 01:27:37,279
this episode, episode three, after things are finally getting rolling's

1544
01:27:37,560 --> 01:27:41,079
she says, I was born for this. I believe God

1545
01:27:41,159 --> 01:27:44,119
is with me. And I mean just the confidence, like

1546
01:27:45,000 --> 01:27:48,239
I was that confident at eighteen nineteen years old.

1547
01:27:48,279 --> 01:27:50,720
Speaker 1: Man, well that's because you weren't hearing from saying Catherine

1548
01:27:50,760 --> 01:27:51,920
and sant Margaret.

1549
01:27:53,479 --> 01:27:54,600
Speaker 2: That is very true.

1550
01:27:56,039 --> 01:27:59,079
Speaker 1: No, sorry, no, but yeah, I agree, Like that is

1551
01:27:59,119 --> 01:28:01,279
the thing that stands out so much about her is

1552
01:28:01,279 --> 01:28:05,319
her confidence and boldness and yeah, and that's why people

1553
01:28:05,800 --> 01:28:09,840
follow her because she's unwavering and she's consistent, and she

1554
01:28:09,960 --> 01:28:13,560
doesn't have any guile, you know, there's no political ambition

1555
01:28:13,680 --> 01:28:17,199
or anything versus like there's other people that are representing

1556
01:28:17,239 --> 01:28:19,960
like the Catholic Church in the in these episodes, like

1557
01:28:20,000 --> 01:28:23,760
the archbishop that is one of her greatest antagonists, you know,

1558
01:28:24,199 --> 01:28:28,039
who's clearly not he's more motivated by political things than

1559
01:28:28,079 --> 01:28:31,479
he is by serving God, you know, at least the

1560
01:28:31,520 --> 01:28:33,520
way the story presents him. You know, I don't know

1561
01:28:33,560 --> 01:28:36,000
him personally or anything, but you know, and he had

1562
01:28:36,000 --> 01:28:37,880
like that nasally voice, So that tells you something right

1563
01:28:37,960 --> 01:28:38,560
right off the bat.

1564
01:28:39,279 --> 01:28:39,479
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1565
01:28:39,680 --> 01:28:43,159
Speaker 1: Yeah, But anyways, like that, and I like how there

1566
01:28:43,199 --> 01:28:46,479
was an acknowledgment of like, you know, where people are

1567
01:28:46,720 --> 01:28:49,000
putting their focus in their trust versus where she was.

1568
01:28:49,359 --> 01:28:52,760
Speaker 2: Yeah. And and there's there's an interesting dynamic too. We

1569
01:28:53,079 --> 01:28:56,680
talked about the layers and the nuance to this character

1570
01:28:56,840 --> 01:29:00,199
that Heather really had to bring to make her believable,

1571
01:29:00,720 --> 01:29:03,840
and that is like she's both naive and bold. Like

1572
01:29:04,359 --> 01:29:06,359
the way she speaks to the group who made those

1573
01:29:06,399 --> 01:29:10,000
plans without her in that one scene in episode four,

1574
01:29:10,720 --> 01:29:12,960
You know that that's the bold side of her. And

1575
01:29:12,960 --> 01:29:15,520
then the way she expected to just be able to

1576
01:29:15,520 --> 01:29:18,520
write off into battle without even having any training or equipment,

1577
01:29:19,199 --> 01:29:23,319
and then just she expects that the opposing force is

1578
01:29:23,359 --> 01:29:26,680
going to just heed her her letter that she sends

1579
01:29:26,680 --> 01:29:29,119
to them, right, you know. So there's the there's the

1580
01:29:29,560 --> 01:29:33,479
naive side, and then you have the other contrasting the boldness.

1581
01:29:33,479 --> 01:29:36,000
And and I guess that that sort of begs the

1582
01:29:36,079 --> 01:29:38,239
question sort of what we mentioned a moment ago, is

1583
01:29:38,600 --> 01:29:42,640
like where's the line between faith and God and naivete.

1584
01:29:42,760 --> 01:29:45,159
Speaker 1: It's like, well, I think I think faith and God

1585
01:29:45,199 --> 01:29:47,600
does come across as naivete to a lot of people. Yeah,

1586
01:29:47,640 --> 01:29:50,239
and I think there is a simplicity that comes from

1587
01:29:50,479 --> 01:29:53,520
being confident that God's on your side. And that's dangerous

1588
01:29:53,560 --> 01:29:55,880
if God's not on your side, but it's the most

1589
01:29:55,920 --> 01:29:57,880
logical thing if he is. You know, Like some of

1590
01:29:57,880 --> 01:30:00,880
the things she was saying, it's like, yeah, let's charge

1591
01:30:00,920 --> 01:30:03,560
forward and will win. And they're like, well, but they

1592
01:30:03,560 --> 01:30:04,880
have a lot more people, and she's like, yeah, but

1593
01:30:04,920 --> 01:30:07,439
God's with us, So what do you mean you know, Yeah,

1594
01:30:07,520 --> 01:30:09,800
that's and like you know, the Bible says the righteous

1595
01:30:09,840 --> 01:30:12,600
or as bold as a lion, and and so there's

1596
01:30:12,720 --> 01:30:15,520
there is an element of that, but that only comes

1597
01:30:15,520 --> 01:30:18,720
from really being sure that you're right with God, you know.

1598
01:30:18,800 --> 01:30:22,359
Like that kind of boldness I think has to be

1599
01:30:22,600 --> 01:30:26,680
connected with holiness. You know. If it's not, I think

1600
01:30:26,720 --> 01:30:30,399
that you're gonna have a lot of doubt and second

1601
01:30:30,399 --> 01:30:31,560
guessing and stuff like that.

1602
01:30:31,880 --> 01:30:34,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, And for the most part, she never does, I

1603
01:30:34,399 --> 01:30:37,199
mean we we There is a moment towards the end,

1604
01:30:37,359 --> 01:30:40,600
but all throughout, when she's in the thick of it,

1605
01:30:40,880 --> 01:30:42,439
she moves forward unquestioningly.

1606
01:30:42,680 --> 01:30:44,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, and there is there are times where you can

1607
01:30:44,960 --> 01:30:47,720
tell she but like one of my favorite moments, she

1608
01:30:47,720 --> 01:30:50,319
she's being very insistent on something with a Dove fan

1609
01:30:51,079 --> 01:30:53,399
and he says, did your voices tell you this? And

1610
01:30:53,439 --> 01:30:56,600
she says no, you know, like she kind of hesitates

1611
01:30:56,640 --> 01:30:58,880
and then but she's honest enough to say, no, they

1612
01:30:58,880 --> 01:31:00,760
didn't tell me that, you know. Yeah, And I think

1613
01:31:00,800 --> 01:31:03,119
that's important for us to we can really get carried

1614
01:31:03,119 --> 01:31:05,880
away with our you know, strong opinions. So we have

1615
01:31:06,000 --> 01:31:09,119
to be able to distinguish what's a strong opinion from

1616
01:31:09,119 --> 01:31:10,680
God and what's a strong opinion from us.

1617
01:31:10,560 --> 01:31:13,800
Speaker 2: You know. Yeah, yeah, Well I wanted to point out

1618
01:31:14,079 --> 01:31:17,039
a cool little thing in episode five. So there's a

1619
01:31:17,079 --> 01:31:22,000
scene where we have this battle going on and Joan

1620
01:31:22,119 --> 01:31:25,000
is climbing up this ladder, climbing up the wall, and

1621
01:31:25,039 --> 01:31:27,880
there's this English archer who is at the top of

1622
01:31:27,880 --> 01:31:31,359
the wall. She's climbing up, and he says, I see you,

1623
01:31:31,439 --> 01:31:34,359
little cock Sparrow. That was Todd Busteed.

1624
01:31:34,720 --> 01:31:39,800
Speaker 1: Oh it was Yeah, there was something so distinctive about

1625
01:31:39,800 --> 01:31:43,920
that voice. I didn't know it was him. He disguised

1626
01:31:43,920 --> 01:31:46,840
it well. But now it all makes sense why it

1627
01:31:46,880 --> 01:31:51,800
resonated so strongly. You got to be the archer that

1628
01:31:51,880 --> 01:31:52,720
shot Joan of Arc.

1629
01:31:53,159 --> 01:31:57,279
Speaker 2: Yeah, little cameo there. He talked about this in a

1630
01:31:57,319 --> 01:32:01,039
panel discussion with Paul at Sonic Con, and I can't

1631
01:32:01,079 --> 01:32:03,920
remember the specific story, so I maybe getting this a

1632
01:32:03,960 --> 01:32:06,640
little bit wrong, but as I remember it, what happened

1633
01:32:06,720 --> 01:32:09,279
was he's in the edit there trying to get this

1634
01:32:09,359 --> 01:32:13,880
scene together and either something happened with a line from

1635
01:32:13,960 --> 01:32:17,520
the actor in the studio or the pacing was just

1636
01:32:17,640 --> 01:32:20,720
needed something there, and so he said to Paul, I'm

1637
01:32:20,720 --> 01:32:23,880
gonna go ahead and record this voice or something like that. Again,

1638
01:32:23,920 --> 01:32:25,600
I may be mixing it up slightly, but it was

1639
01:32:25,640 --> 01:32:28,760
something like that, and so he ended up recording that

1640
01:32:28,800 --> 01:32:30,279
and putting it in there, and it ended up in

1641
01:32:30,279 --> 01:32:30,920
the final mix.

1642
01:32:31,000 --> 01:32:34,640
Speaker 1: So that's well, if he's doing the final mix then yeah.

1643
01:32:34,760 --> 01:32:37,279
But he said that has zonagon. Yeah that's fun.

1644
01:32:38,159 --> 01:32:41,359
Speaker 2: And so right after that, there's that that whole scene

1645
01:32:41,399 --> 01:32:45,119
with where she gets wounded. We have that that cauterization.

1646
01:32:46,359 --> 01:32:48,760
The sound effects there, Yeah, oh my goodness, it was

1647
01:32:48,840 --> 01:32:52,840
grimace inducing, like fantastic job there with the sound effects.

1648
01:32:52,960 --> 01:32:55,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, that was rough.

1649
01:32:56,840 --> 01:33:00,359
Speaker 2: So you know, things do pick up in the her

1650
01:33:00,800 --> 01:33:03,600
half of the episodes and start moving a little bit quicker.

1651
01:33:04,119 --> 01:33:06,640
And there's not like a ton of things that we

1652
01:33:06,680 --> 01:33:10,239
can get into too much without getting into little bitty

1653
01:33:10,239 --> 01:33:13,079
plot points and start spoiling things. But the gist of

1654
01:33:13,119 --> 01:33:16,359
it is that, you know, she has become this respected leader,

1655
01:33:16,439 --> 01:33:19,800
like the general populace of France. They love her. She

1656
01:33:19,880 --> 01:33:24,600
has become this icon of the resistance against the English.

1657
01:33:24,720 --> 01:33:29,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, and there is this interesting shift that happens where

1658
01:33:29,479 --> 01:33:32,880
she goes from you know, winning these great battles and

1659
01:33:32,920 --> 01:33:35,800
having it and to where now she's the hero. But

1660
01:33:35,840 --> 01:33:38,279
it's almost as if she's not being listened to. She's

1661
01:33:38,319 --> 01:33:41,399
being like listened to less, even though she's a proven

1662
01:33:41,760 --> 01:33:43,960
you know that she was able to help win these

1663
01:33:44,000 --> 01:33:47,239
great victories. But as they're trying to get these political

1664
01:33:47,359 --> 01:33:50,439
things uh sorted out that don't end up handing out,

1665
01:33:50,920 --> 01:33:53,439
there is this interesting shift that happens in and that

1666
01:33:53,920 --> 01:33:55,680
it wasn't just the same thing over and over through

1667
01:33:55,720 --> 01:33:58,560
the story And obviously like that's that's because you know,

1668
01:33:58,600 --> 01:34:01,359
based on the history of how things went down, but

1669
01:34:01,960 --> 01:34:04,479
it also helped to keep your attention as you went

1670
01:34:04,560 --> 01:34:08,239
further through the storyline. That as things were changing, you know,

1671
01:34:08,359 --> 01:34:10,239
it wasn't just a battle after battle.

1672
01:34:10,840 --> 01:34:15,359
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, So I wanted to talk a little bit

1673
01:34:15,399 --> 01:34:19,880
about the music because all throughout like it fits like

1674
01:34:20,000 --> 01:34:24,039
hand and glove, like it's so tightly integrated into this

1675
01:34:24,079 --> 01:34:29,279
production that it doesn't make itself really known. It's easy

1676
01:34:29,319 --> 01:34:33,000
to miss because it's done so well. But there is

1677
01:34:33,119 --> 01:34:37,960
one scene in episode seven, about five minutes in, there's

1678
01:34:38,000 --> 01:34:41,000
a scene where the narrator he starts to talk about

1679
01:34:41,079 --> 01:34:44,000
some of the infighting in France, and there is a

1680
01:34:44,039 --> 01:34:47,199
cue there that Jared wrote that, Oh my goodness, it's

1681
01:34:47,439 --> 01:34:51,640
just amazing and I absolutely loved it, and I mean

1682
01:34:52,359 --> 01:34:55,199
talking about it here like it's it's not like you

1683
01:34:55,199 --> 01:34:57,239
can picture it, you know, it's not a scene that

1684
01:34:57,319 --> 01:34:59,279
you can have unfolding in your mind. But I thought

1685
01:34:59,319 --> 01:35:01,520
it was worth mentioning just because it was a good

1686
01:35:01,720 --> 01:35:05,399
illustration of how it just fits so nicely. Now, there

1687
01:35:05,439 --> 01:35:07,840
are a couple of moments that are really stand out,

1688
01:35:07,960 --> 01:35:10,960
like where the music really does sort of step up

1689
01:35:11,000 --> 01:35:14,439
and almost take a center stage, but it works so

1690
01:35:14,560 --> 01:35:18,239
well with the dialogue and sound effects that yeah, hard,

1691
01:35:18,319 --> 01:35:20,680
it's just at all. Yeah, it's just very good.

1692
01:35:20,920 --> 01:35:23,319
Speaker 1: But yeah, it does carry the emotion very well.

1693
01:35:23,600 --> 01:35:23,960
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1694
01:35:24,279 --> 01:35:26,600
Speaker 1: One interesting spot with the music was when her parents

1695
01:35:26,640 --> 01:35:30,319
show up at the court and like the music, it

1696
01:35:30,359 --> 01:35:33,439
definitely huges you that this was like a little bit comical,

1697
01:35:33,600 --> 01:35:37,079
you know, of her like peasant parents coming to visit

1698
01:35:37,239 --> 01:35:39,119
the king. And that's one of the places where the

1699
01:35:39,159 --> 01:35:41,079
music like jumped out of me as being very different

1700
01:35:41,119 --> 01:35:45,399
than everything else in these episodes, when her dad's like

1701
01:35:45,479 --> 01:35:47,039
asking if he can talk to the king about a

1702
01:35:47,119 --> 01:35:51,920
tax break or whatever. Yeah, and the music like it

1703
01:35:51,960 --> 01:35:53,920
was definitely like a break from everything else. Like the

1704
01:35:54,000 --> 01:35:56,880
music like changed dramatically to where, you know, it was

1705
01:35:57,039 --> 01:35:58,920
almost I don't know how to describe it other than

1706
01:35:58,960 --> 01:36:01,600
that it like had a comic feeling to it of like,

1707
01:36:02,640 --> 01:36:06,840
well this isn't really the point, you know, but I

1708
01:36:06,880 --> 01:36:08,560
don't know how to describe it. But that was a

1709
01:36:08,600 --> 01:36:11,560
place where the music got jumped out of me in

1710
01:36:11,600 --> 01:36:14,600
a different way, like yeah, it just changed.

1711
01:36:14,960 --> 01:36:18,800
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. And there are times throughout and of course,

1712
01:36:19,399 --> 01:36:21,760
again this is a biography, this is about Joan of

1713
01:36:21,840 --> 01:36:24,920
Arc and so her theme that that Jared spent a

1714
01:36:24,960 --> 01:36:29,079
lot of time crafting is woven all throughout and it's

1715
01:36:29,319 --> 01:36:33,479
just done masterfully. But I highly recommend if you love

1716
01:36:33,920 --> 01:36:38,439
music and scores, you can listen to the entire the

1717
01:36:38,600 --> 01:36:42,000
entire soundtrack of this this show on its own, and

1718
01:36:42,079 --> 01:36:44,520
it's just absolutely gorgeous music.

1719
01:36:45,000 --> 01:36:46,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know, And of course I at the at

1720
01:36:46,840 --> 01:36:50,079
the very end, well, you know, as her story is

1721
01:36:50,119 --> 01:36:53,479
wrapping up, and there's the part that's just so lands,

1722
01:36:53,520 --> 01:36:56,640
so heavy when she's crying out the name of Jesus

1723
01:36:56,680 --> 01:37:00,399
in different ways, and that was so good and it

1724
01:37:01,600 --> 01:37:04,359
could have like gone on just so long, but it

1725
01:37:04,399 --> 01:37:06,199
felt like every time she said it packed like a

1726
01:37:06,199 --> 01:37:09,159
different emotional punch, and the and the music around it

1727
01:37:09,199 --> 01:37:12,159
and stuff really really had a had a powerful that

1728
01:37:12,279 --> 01:37:14,399
was like where you know, obviously it's supposed to be

1729
01:37:14,479 --> 01:37:19,199
like that climactic moment, but I guess it's worth mentioning.

1730
01:37:19,560 --> 01:37:23,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, And so we talked about the you know, our

1731
01:37:23,920 --> 01:37:27,119
our core cast members of Heather and Harry and Finty

1732
01:37:27,159 --> 01:37:30,920
as Joan Muchard and the interviewer, but a couple of

1733
01:37:30,920 --> 01:37:33,560
others that they stood out. You know, you mentioned the

1734
01:37:33,640 --> 01:37:36,880
Dauphin Tom Byrne is I think how you say that

1735
01:37:37,600 --> 01:37:41,319
he was great And also another one you already said

1736
01:37:41,359 --> 01:37:44,760
as well, the Archbishop Roger May Oh my goodness. He

1737
01:37:44,840 --> 01:37:46,880
was so good. So this guy's like a bit of

1738
01:37:46,920 --> 01:37:52,560
a weasel and he's he's just played perfectly, especially in

1739
01:37:52,600 --> 01:37:56,119
this scene where Charles sends him with Joan and he

1740
01:37:56,199 --> 01:37:59,239
you know, you can tell he does not want to go, right,

1741
01:37:59,600 --> 01:38:02,039
but he cannot say no to the king, right, and

1742
01:38:02,239 --> 01:38:06,720
so it just the hesitation in the way he delivers

1743
01:38:06,760 --> 01:38:10,840
the lines that just you can you can absolutely hear

1744
01:38:10,920 --> 01:38:13,359
the wheels in his brain turning as he's trying to

1745
01:38:13,359 --> 01:38:17,159
figure out how to get out of this but he can't, right, Yeah,

1746
01:38:17,199 --> 01:38:17,840
in any way that.

1747
01:38:18,079 --> 01:38:20,359
Speaker 1: The guy who plays the Chamberlain like was playing off

1748
01:38:20,399 --> 01:38:22,520
of that, like they were playing off each other, and

1749
01:38:22,560 --> 01:38:24,920
he's like, well the archbishop can do it, and he's like,

1750
01:38:24,960 --> 01:38:28,800
oh ah, well, uh yeah. Yeah. Just just the little

1751
01:38:28,840 --> 01:38:32,159
noises that he made to indicate he was feeling about it.

1752
01:38:32,000 --> 01:38:34,600
It was very good. Like I could see his facial expression,

1753
01:38:34,720 --> 01:38:34,880
you know.

1754
01:38:35,119 --> 01:38:39,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, it was so good, so good. So I

1755
01:38:39,560 --> 01:38:42,479
guess that brings us to things. Things start wrapping up.

1756
01:38:42,479 --> 01:38:48,359
You know, Joan is captured, and I love her spunky attitude.

1757
01:38:48,399 --> 01:38:51,079
She's so dismissive of the Duke of Burgundy, Like this

1758
01:38:51,079 --> 01:38:55,960
guy's a trader. Right, and just the the little snippy

1759
01:38:56,000 --> 01:38:59,920
things that she says to Yeah, yeah, it's kind of funny.

1760
01:39:00,159 --> 01:39:02,079
Speaker 1: Yeah, I had some lines done and now we can't

1761
01:39:02,119 --> 01:39:03,920
find the find some of the lines that I was

1762
01:39:03,960 --> 01:39:08,560
gonna bring up. There's a part where somebody is talking

1763
01:39:08,560 --> 01:39:10,319
to her and pretending to be her friend and is

1764
01:39:10,359 --> 01:39:13,880
clearly a spy, you know. And afterwards he's trying to

1765
01:39:13,880 --> 01:39:17,199
get her to just say something and she won't do it.

1766
01:39:17,439 --> 01:39:19,560
Then he finally says, well, I've done all I can,

1767
01:39:19,680 --> 01:39:22,239
and she says as a spy or as someone who

1768
01:39:22,239 --> 01:39:25,800
claims to be my friend, and it just reveals like

1769
01:39:25,920 --> 01:39:28,039
that she knew all along what he was up to.

1770
01:39:28,319 --> 01:39:31,319
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, that's the other thing too. And I'm not

1771
01:39:31,359 --> 01:39:34,399
sure how much creative license Paul took and how much

1772
01:39:34,399 --> 01:39:39,880
of this is actually from the historical records. But like again,

1773
01:39:39,960 --> 01:39:43,279
we're talking about a pretty young girl. Yeah, even though

1774
01:39:43,439 --> 01:39:47,479
back then people of late teens were much more mature

1775
01:39:47,520 --> 01:39:50,800
than they are these days. Sure, but she still had

1776
01:39:50,920 --> 01:39:55,000
such a way about her that she seemed like she

1777
01:39:55,159 --> 01:39:58,840
was much wiser than her age should have allowed her

1778
01:39:58,880 --> 01:39:59,039
to be.

1779
01:40:00,039 --> 01:40:03,079
Speaker 1: There were a couple moments of failure towards the end,

1780
01:40:04,279 --> 01:40:05,920
if that's if that's the right word for it. That

1781
01:40:05,960 --> 01:40:09,359
did surprise me, which I don't know that somebody would

1782
01:40:09,359 --> 01:40:13,039
have necessarily included if that wasn't what it actually happened.

1783
01:40:13,159 --> 01:40:15,439
You know, Yeah, like a couple of moments of weakness

1784
01:40:15,439 --> 01:40:19,560
and despair. But it made it. She did illustrate that

1785
01:40:19,640 --> 01:40:22,199
she is a teenage girl and all the stuff that

1786
01:40:22,239 --> 01:40:24,800
she's going through. How could you even process through all

1787
01:40:24,800 --> 01:40:27,720
these things? And it did it brought out her humanity?

1788
01:40:28,279 --> 01:40:29,039
Yeah quite a bit.

1789
01:40:29,720 --> 01:40:33,439
Speaker 2: Well, you referenced him earlier. But Philip Glasboro slash Sherlock,

1790
01:40:34,199 --> 01:40:37,560
he plays the scribe monchan is how you say it?

1791
01:40:37,600 --> 01:40:40,119
I think, man, I begus how to pronounce the name.

1792
01:40:40,159 --> 01:40:41,279
Speaker 1: That sounds exactly right.

1793
01:40:43,680 --> 01:40:47,239
Speaker 2: But this the scene that he appears in for the

1794
01:40:47,239 --> 01:40:50,479
first time, I think is in episode eight. And this

1795
01:40:50,560 --> 01:40:53,760
is the scene that we actually got to play just

1796
01:40:53,840 --> 01:40:56,680
the voice edit of at the senecas a couple of

1797
01:40:56,760 --> 01:41:00,279
years back that Paul allowed us to share that NIK

1798
01:41:00,399 --> 01:41:03,000
preview of the show, and so it was really kind

1799
01:41:03,000 --> 01:41:05,680
of cool to hear contrast just the voice track that

1800
01:41:05,720 --> 01:41:09,239
we heard back then with the final scene here and

1801
01:41:09,520 --> 01:41:11,359
you know, the sound effects and everything in place, and

1802
01:41:12,239 --> 01:41:14,560
the full context of what's going on in that scene?

1803
01:41:14,600 --> 01:41:16,840
So that was really cool, and it's always great to

1804
01:41:16,880 --> 01:41:17,439
hear Philip.

1805
01:41:17,920 --> 01:41:21,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, and he has such a like soothing voice that

1806
01:41:22,479 --> 01:41:24,880
when he comes on, you know, you were like, okay,

1807
01:41:24,920 --> 01:41:26,880
he's going to be well, I don't know if his

1808
01:41:27,319 --> 01:41:29,640
this probably isn't. I feel like I'm like disrespecting his

1809
01:41:29,680 --> 01:41:32,399
acting to be able to play evil characters. But when

1810
01:41:32,399 --> 01:41:34,840
I heard his voice, I'm like, Oh, he's a good guy.

1811
01:41:34,880 --> 01:41:37,399
You know, he's I could trust this guy. And I

1812
01:41:37,680 --> 01:41:41,119
really feel like his character was purely to establish why

1813
01:41:41,159 --> 01:41:44,800
the court records are true, even though the people that

1814
01:41:44,840 --> 01:41:48,439
were running the court were so obviously corrupt. But then

1815
01:41:48,520 --> 01:41:51,079
his characters like, we've got to make sure we write

1816
01:41:51,119 --> 01:41:53,279
down exactly what happens and what are you doing here?

1817
01:41:53,960 --> 01:41:56,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's the quality assurance guy.

1818
01:41:56,319 --> 01:41:58,720
Speaker 1: He's the quality assurance guy. Yeah, for why we can

1819
01:41:58,760 --> 01:42:01,199
trust the sources. Yeah.

1820
01:42:01,239 --> 01:42:03,079
Speaker 2: And and he did a great job with it too.

1821
01:42:03,119 --> 01:42:06,840
And he's such a like a guy full of integrity, right,

1822
01:42:06,920 --> 01:42:09,279
So it's like a check and balance to all this

1823
01:42:09,319 --> 01:42:12,520
other stuff, because we know that there was some crazy

1824
01:42:12,520 --> 01:42:15,640
stuff going on there. But you know, talk about Philip

1825
01:42:15,760 --> 01:42:19,680
and his ability to do villains or whatever, one of

1826
01:42:19,720 --> 01:42:23,399
my favorite roles that he ever did was in Lamplightder Theaters,

1827
01:42:24,039 --> 01:42:27,800
was the great question.

1828
01:42:28,079 --> 01:42:31,159
Speaker 1: Yes, oh my goodness, that's a point, and that that

1829
01:42:31,279 --> 01:42:33,600
works even better because of his soothing voice. You know

1830
01:42:33,680 --> 01:42:37,239
that he drew us all out there. Yeah, that was

1831
01:42:37,439 --> 01:42:39,560
he did a great job with that. That evil character,

1832
01:42:39,600 --> 01:42:43,079
that's true, Yeah, so good. Yeah, I'm not saying he

1833
01:42:43,079 --> 01:42:44,720
can't play evil people. I'm just saying he has a

1834
01:42:44,720 --> 01:42:46,760
super voice.

1835
01:42:48,079 --> 01:42:52,960
Speaker 2: Just shows his range. What a talent. Yeah. So, so

1836
01:42:53,039 --> 01:42:58,079
her trial begins in February of fourteen thirty one, and

1837
01:42:58,880 --> 01:43:01,760
it was a really interesting way that because this thing

1838
01:43:02,000 --> 01:43:04,760
goes on and on for weeks and weeks, and so

1839
01:43:05,279 --> 01:43:07,159
what Paul does here is he writes this sort of

1840
01:43:07,239 --> 01:43:11,319
montage scene where we have all these interrogators asking questions.

1841
01:43:11,319 --> 01:43:13,880
So it's just a summary of the trial with a

1842
01:43:13,960 --> 01:43:18,119
montage of questions there, and there's no responses until we

1843
01:43:18,159 --> 01:43:20,079
get to like this last question, and then we get

1844
01:43:20,079 --> 01:43:23,159
a response from Joan. You know, it was just just

1845
01:43:23,199 --> 01:43:26,439
cut together really nicely, just a way to show progression

1846
01:43:26,439 --> 01:43:29,600
of time and not just have to make us go

1847
01:43:29,680 --> 01:43:31,600
through the entire shing as well.

1848
01:43:31,880 --> 01:43:33,279
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was really fascinating.

1849
01:43:33,720 --> 01:43:36,479
Speaker 2: Yeah, and At the same time, he's also illustrating the

1850
01:43:36,520 --> 01:43:39,600
repetitiveness of this stuff because they're trying to trip her up,

1851
01:43:39,600 --> 01:43:42,479
trying to catch her in things. So they're just rephrasing

1852
01:43:42,560 --> 01:43:46,359
things a little bit or asking it slightly differently, just

1853
01:43:46,399 --> 01:43:48,279
to try to get her to mess up.

1854
01:43:48,640 --> 01:43:51,199
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a great point. And the strength of what

1855
01:43:51,319 --> 01:43:53,159
she does say when we do get answers from her

1856
01:43:53,760 --> 01:43:57,239
is it its simplicity. You know, she just sticks with

1857
01:43:57,840 --> 01:44:01,039
she knows and this isn't during the trial, but there

1858
01:44:01,039 --> 01:44:02,920
was a point where she says, why are you baiting

1859
01:44:02,960 --> 01:44:05,479
me with this question? You know, Archbishop in an earlier scene,

1860
01:44:06,000 --> 01:44:08,920
and well, one of the great lines came from this

1861
01:44:09,039 --> 01:44:11,680
that I really loved, where they asked, so you believe

1862
01:44:11,680 --> 01:44:14,279
you were in God's grace? And she said, if I

1863
01:44:14,319 --> 01:44:16,520
am not, may God put me there? And if I am,

1864
01:44:16,640 --> 01:44:17,640
may God so keep me.

1865
01:44:18,199 --> 01:44:19,960
Speaker 2: Mm oh that's that was a good one.

1866
01:44:20,039 --> 01:44:22,840
Speaker 1: That's a great line. That's a great piece of wisdom

1867
01:44:22,920 --> 01:44:25,119
to live by, you know, great attitude to live by.

1868
01:44:25,319 --> 01:44:29,239
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, and my goodness, like towards the end, she

1869
01:44:29,359 --> 01:44:30,760
was treated like an absolute dog.

1870
01:44:31,039 --> 01:44:32,359
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, horribly.

1871
01:44:33,359 --> 01:44:37,560
Speaker 2: So this trial, at least the first one, it lasts

1872
01:44:37,640 --> 01:44:38,640
like three months.

1873
01:44:38,920 --> 01:44:41,800
Speaker 1: Oh wow, I didn't even realize that from just listening.

1874
01:44:41,560 --> 01:44:46,000
Speaker 2: From February twenty first to the day where they actually

1875
01:44:46,199 --> 01:44:49,680
decide that they're going to go through with the execution

1876
01:44:49,920 --> 01:44:51,039
was the twenty fourth of May.

1877
01:44:51,800 --> 01:44:53,560
Speaker 1: Oh wow, that is a long time.

1878
01:44:54,119 --> 01:44:57,359
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, And so that brings us to I mean,

1879
01:44:57,399 --> 01:45:00,439
there are a few other things that transpire in between

1880
01:45:00,479 --> 01:45:04,439
that date and then her actual execution, which was the

1881
01:45:04,520 --> 01:45:10,079
thirtieth of May. And I tell you what that scene,

1882
01:45:11,720 --> 01:45:17,159
My goodness, you mentioned it earlier, when she's screaming Jesus. Yeah,

1883
01:45:17,199 --> 01:45:20,800
it just grabs you. And yeah, I am not ashamed

1884
01:45:20,800 --> 01:45:22,319
to say that I was tearing up for sure.

1885
01:45:22,640 --> 01:45:27,760
Speaker 1: Yeah. That was probably the most emotionally impactful, and rightfully so.

1886
01:45:28,079 --> 01:45:30,880
And it's the way, it's the personal way that she

1887
01:45:31,119 --> 01:45:33,680
was crying out to Jesus. That's why it hit me.

1888
01:45:33,960 --> 01:45:36,039
It wouldn't have hit quite as strongly as she was

1889
01:45:36,039 --> 01:45:38,920
crying out some other name, but the way she was

1890
01:45:38,960 --> 01:45:41,600
crying out on the name of Jesus is really powerful.

1891
01:45:41,920 --> 01:45:45,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it kind of I mean, they're very different stories,

1892
01:45:45,960 --> 01:45:48,800
but it kind of brought to mind the Heirloom audio,

1893
01:45:48,880 --> 01:45:53,520
the g A HINTI story of William Wallace and his execution.

1894
01:45:53,800 --> 01:45:55,960
Speaker 1: Oh sure, yeah, that's a good parallel.

1895
01:45:56,319 --> 01:45:59,520
Speaker 2: But that scene was very impactful to me when I

1896
01:45:59,560 --> 01:46:02,199
first heard it, and then so it sort of came

1897
01:46:02,239 --> 01:46:04,159
to my mind as I was I was listening to

1898
01:46:04,199 --> 01:46:08,479
this one, and my goodness, I mean, and and again

1899
01:46:08,760 --> 01:46:14,199
we've already said this, but Heather's performance like it. It's

1900
01:46:14,520 --> 01:46:17,079
heart wrenching in those moments there.

1901
01:46:17,359 --> 01:46:19,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

1902
01:46:19,840 --> 01:46:23,760
Speaker 2: And the way in which you talked about this earlier too,

1903
01:46:23,880 --> 01:46:27,800
the music and the sound effects and her performance kind

1904
01:46:27,800 --> 01:46:31,920
of are are weaved together so expertly. The music comes

1905
01:46:31,920 --> 01:46:34,079
in when it needs to, it goes out when it

1906
01:46:34,119 --> 01:46:37,720
needs to to let the scene breathe and just really

1907
01:46:38,000 --> 01:46:40,199
hit home. And there's a there's a moment, I mean

1908
01:46:40,279 --> 01:46:42,880
several seconds where all you hear are the flames.

1909
01:46:44,199 --> 01:46:47,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, And if anybody's feeling, you know, uncomfortable with that,

1910
01:46:48,039 --> 01:46:49,720
because you know, you you know what's coming up, so

1911
01:46:49,760 --> 01:46:51,279
you kind of get a little I got I get

1912
01:46:51,319 --> 01:46:53,279
a little apprehensive when I know it, seeing like that's

1913
01:46:53,359 --> 01:46:56,199
coming up. But I think it was handled hastily. I

1914
01:46:56,199 --> 01:46:59,600
don't think it was grotesque or no, I don't know

1915
01:46:59,760 --> 01:47:02,279
where I'm looking for, but it wasn't it wasn't overdone

1916
01:47:02,359 --> 01:47:05,720
in focusing on like the pain and the gore, But

1917
01:47:05,960 --> 01:47:08,039
it was the emotion of what was happening with her

1918
01:47:08,159 --> 01:47:09,279
that was what came.

1919
01:47:09,079 --> 01:47:11,880
Speaker 2: Through for me. Yeah, it wasn't gratuitous.

1920
01:47:11,920 --> 01:47:13,279
Speaker 1: Gratuitous that's a great word.

1921
01:47:15,239 --> 01:47:18,560
Speaker 2: And so then you know, that was in fourteen thirty one.

1922
01:47:18,600 --> 01:47:21,760
It wasn't until fourteen fifty six that she was absolved.

1923
01:47:22,640 --> 01:47:23,279
Just crazy.

1924
01:47:23,600 --> 01:47:27,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's interesting that they did it when there

1925
01:47:27,880 --> 01:47:32,760
was still people alive apparently that were witnesses of what happened,

1926
01:47:33,000 --> 01:47:35,560
you know. Yeah, So in my head, I kind of

1927
01:47:35,560 --> 01:47:38,039
thought that it didn't happen until like the nineteen hundreds,

1928
01:47:38,560 --> 01:47:41,800
to be honest, like that she was absolved. I didn't

1929
01:47:41,800 --> 01:47:43,199
realize that it happened so soon after.

1930
01:47:43,359 --> 01:47:46,880
Speaker 2: Well that was the canonization that happened in the twenty nineteen.

1931
01:47:46,640 --> 01:47:48,960
Speaker 1: Twenty it was Okay, okay, that's what it was.

1932
01:47:49,399 --> 01:47:51,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, so it was I mean, that's a long

1933
01:47:51,640 --> 01:47:56,279
time from fourteen fifty six to nineteen twenty, right, So yeah.

1934
01:47:55,800 --> 01:47:58,359
Speaker 1: But they had a trial that absolved her in the

1935
01:47:58,399 --> 01:48:02,079
fourteen hundreds. You're saying, yeah, okay, okay, like twenty years

1936
01:48:02,119 --> 01:48:04,159
later or whatever. Yeah, yeah, that's cool.

1937
01:48:04,359 --> 01:48:06,520
Speaker 2: But I mean It just also goes to show, like

1938
01:48:07,239 --> 01:48:12,399
there's some illustrations from history where these people were supposedly

1939
01:48:12,720 --> 01:48:16,880
on the side of God themselves, they were supposedly on

1940
01:48:16,960 --> 01:48:21,319
the side of right, but they did a horrendous thing here. Well.

1941
01:48:21,359 --> 01:48:24,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, because even the people that were in charge of

1942
01:48:24,319 --> 01:48:27,600
the trial were like French traders, you know, they were

1943
01:48:27,640 --> 01:48:29,600
they were cited with the English, but they were still

1944
01:48:29,640 --> 01:48:32,199
the you know, the French people, right or am I

1945
01:48:32,239 --> 01:48:34,680
misunderstanding that, like the there were the Burgundians I'm guessing

1946
01:48:34,720 --> 01:48:37,880
because it was that duke, and it was the that

1947
01:48:37,960 --> 01:48:39,800
bishop was a French bishop.

1948
01:48:40,439 --> 01:48:44,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, and they were being influenced by the English like

1949
01:48:44,680 --> 01:48:49,640
it was the English. I think primarily that were they were.

1950
01:48:49,720 --> 01:48:51,600
They didn't want to let it go. They wanted to

1951
01:48:52,560 --> 01:48:54,720
they wanted to make a lesson of her, right I think,

1952
01:48:54,760 --> 01:48:55,039
you know.

1953
01:48:55,359 --> 01:48:58,279
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, exactly. Well, and because she was a figurehead

1954
01:48:58,319 --> 01:49:00,399
that's why, you know, how can you keep fighting a

1955
01:49:00,439 --> 01:49:04,159
war against somebody that everybody you know is believing is

1956
01:49:04,199 --> 01:49:06,520
from God. So you have to proclaim her as like

1957
01:49:06,560 --> 01:49:09,920
a witch or a heretic or whatever right in order

1958
01:49:09,960 --> 01:49:12,119
for your cause to be just. But what she does

1959
01:49:12,159 --> 01:49:14,760
it does seem like, you know, just in broad strokes

1960
01:49:14,800 --> 01:49:16,920
of history. You know, my wife and I were having

1961
01:49:16,920 --> 01:49:19,640
a conversation like so like of what she actually accomplished,

1962
01:49:19,680 --> 01:49:23,720
and I'm like, well, the English don't control France, you know,

1963
01:49:24,279 --> 01:49:27,000
like there was an effect like that claim was that

1964
01:49:27,039 --> 01:49:30,920
the English monarch should inherit the thrones of both England

1965
01:49:30,960 --> 01:49:33,399
and France. You know, so that there was an effect

1966
01:49:34,039 --> 01:49:35,640
through this, Like I think this was towards the end

1967
01:49:35,680 --> 01:49:38,319
of the Hundred Years War, and now I feel like

1968
01:49:38,359 --> 01:49:40,359
on shaky ground because I can't exactly remember when the

1969
01:49:40,439 --> 01:49:43,399
Hundred Years were ended. But and you know, there was

1970
01:49:43,399 --> 01:49:45,399
an interesting part. This is going all the way back

1971
01:49:45,399 --> 01:49:48,000
into episode one, but where we shard he's just like

1972
01:49:48,399 --> 01:49:51,279
musing to himself about, you know, who's going to care

1973
01:49:51,399 --> 01:49:54,199
in a one hundred years that we've been occupied all

1974
01:49:54,239 --> 01:49:56,720
this time by the English? Who's going to care in

1975
01:49:56,760 --> 01:49:59,239
five hundred years? You know, like he was he was

1976
01:49:59,319 --> 01:50:02,760
like bringing down It felt like a almost a break

1977
01:50:02,760 --> 01:50:04,840
heat of the fourth wall, like reaching out to like,

1978
01:50:05,000 --> 01:50:07,640
you know, here's why you should care about this, you know.

1979
01:50:07,800 --> 01:50:10,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I didn't pick up on that. That's

1980
01:50:10,520 --> 01:50:14,039
a that's an interesting point, and you know, it's kind

1981
01:50:14,079 --> 01:50:19,560
of interesting to we reference William Wallace different time here,

1982
01:50:19,600 --> 01:50:23,840
but they talked about how the Scottish were supporting the

1983
01:50:24,199 --> 01:50:27,079
French in their resistance against the English.

1984
01:50:27,279 --> 01:50:29,960
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, I noticed that, like there was there was

1985
01:50:30,079 --> 01:50:33,680
Scottish bagpipe players that I can't remember what ceremony it

1986
01:50:33,760 --> 01:50:37,399
was for her, but they were there supporting her. It

1987
01:50:37,520 --> 01:50:40,520
is an interesting the alliance. You know, the enemy of

1988
01:50:40,520 --> 01:50:43,319
my enemy is my friend or whatever. Yeah, yeah, that's

1989
01:50:43,319 --> 01:50:43,920
the idea there.

1990
01:50:43,960 --> 01:50:47,520
Speaker 2: I think, Well, you know, we've we've touched on a

1991
01:50:47,560 --> 01:50:51,039
lot of different things and the bottom line I think

1992
01:50:51,079 --> 01:50:53,800
that I walked away with from this is just like

1993
01:50:54,880 --> 01:50:58,760
you definitely need to examine your own life and to

1994
01:50:58,840 --> 01:51:03,319
make sure you are in line with with the Word

1995
01:51:03,359 --> 01:51:06,159
of God and with with what God wants you to

1996
01:51:06,199 --> 01:51:09,640
do in your day to day life. We need to

1997
01:51:09,640 --> 01:51:13,520
be bold to share the gospel, but we also need

1998
01:51:13,560 --> 01:51:16,439
to make sure that we are our footing is firm,

1999
01:51:16,479 --> 01:51:18,199
we're in the right place, you know what I mean?

2000
01:51:18,640 --> 01:51:23,359
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, to be sensitive enough to hear his voice

2001
01:51:23,520 --> 01:51:29,000
beyond like the conventions you know of our time, and

2002
01:51:29,199 --> 01:51:32,960
also to recognize when God is doing something. God does

2003
01:51:33,039 --> 01:51:35,199
a lot of times does stuff out of the ordinary,

2004
01:51:35,920 --> 01:51:38,960
because that's what shows his glory, you know, the most strongly,

2005
01:51:39,680 --> 01:51:43,000
and I do think there's a warning in here for

2006
01:51:43,119 --> 01:51:45,880
us to make sure that we're not on the side

2007
01:51:45,880 --> 01:51:47,439
of it. You know. It kind of makes me think

2008
01:51:47,439 --> 01:51:51,399
of like Gamaliel with the Apostles talking about if this

2009
01:51:51,479 --> 01:51:54,560
is of God, then we can't overthrow it, but if

2010
01:51:54,560 --> 01:51:57,319
it's not of God, it won't come to anything, you know. Yeah,

2011
01:51:57,359 --> 01:52:01,279
and just not be so entrenched in our own ideas

2012
01:52:01,319 --> 01:52:04,640
that we can't recognize when God is moving in an

2013
01:52:04,720 --> 01:52:05,840
unconventional way, you know.

2014
01:52:06,199 --> 01:52:09,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, being willing to let him do what he

2015
01:52:09,720 --> 01:52:13,720
wants to do, right, right, exactly. So I guess I

2016
01:52:13,760 --> 01:52:17,279
don't I'm still conflicted, Like when it comes to general

2017
01:52:17,359 --> 01:52:19,319
I don't know. I don't really know where I stand

2018
01:52:19,760 --> 01:52:22,399
on the whole thing. But I think there's still huge

2019
01:52:22,479 --> 01:52:24,439
value in listening to her story.

2020
01:52:24,680 --> 01:52:27,279
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, I am unsettled by it, and it's the

2021
01:52:27,439 --> 01:52:30,680
unsettling parts of it that that I think land the

2022
01:52:31,279 --> 01:52:33,840
I think that's why the story is so powerful in

2023
01:52:33,840 --> 01:52:36,560
some ways, you know, because there are things that make

2024
01:52:36,560 --> 01:52:40,199
me uncomfortable about the story, and that causes me to

2025
01:52:40,319 --> 01:52:42,119
check myself in different ways too, you know.

2026
01:52:42,479 --> 01:52:47,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, it sort of insites self reflection, and yeah, that's

2027
01:52:47,000 --> 01:52:48,720
always a good thing, I.

2028
01:52:48,640 --> 01:52:51,199
Speaker 1: Believe, yeah, right, and not just.

2029
01:52:51,199 --> 01:52:53,199
Speaker 2: Self reflection, but also, as you said, you you've been

2030
01:52:53,199 --> 01:52:56,640
having conversations with your wife, so it gives you opportunity

2031
01:52:56,680 --> 01:53:00,520
to discuss these different points with your family. And for

2032
01:53:00,560 --> 01:53:03,279
people to have kids who are of the age where

2033
01:53:03,520 --> 01:53:07,399
you know, they start thinking about these sorts of issues,

2034
01:53:07,520 --> 01:53:10,119
you know, typically going to be like teenagers or whatever,

2035
01:53:10,520 --> 01:53:13,479
but you know, it's good to have discussions about this

2036
01:53:13,479 --> 01:53:15,520
this sort of stuff. So yeah, I think it's great.

2037
01:53:15,800 --> 01:53:18,319
Speaker 1: Yeah. Even when I was praying earlier this week after

2038
01:53:18,359 --> 01:53:20,279
listening to it, and I was just thinking about her

2039
01:53:20,880 --> 01:53:24,119
devotion to prayer. And there's this part where she says

2040
01:53:24,960 --> 01:53:27,520
to the captains, like they say, well, the council met

2041
01:53:27,560 --> 01:53:29,880
together and we decided blah blah blah, and she says,

2042
01:53:30,239 --> 01:53:31,880
you have been at your counsel and I have been

2043
01:53:31,920 --> 01:53:35,479
at mine. Yeah, And I thought that was a great line.

2044
01:53:35,479 --> 01:53:38,840
And the commitment there is just to having a genuine

2045
01:53:38,960 --> 01:53:40,960
relationship with God, and that's something that we can take

2046
01:53:41,000 --> 01:53:43,399
from this, no matter you know, what we think about

2047
01:53:43,399 --> 01:53:45,279
some of the other parts of the story, you know.

2048
01:53:45,560 --> 01:53:50,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, So I think to wrap this up one

2049
01:53:50,960 --> 01:53:54,279
quick note on the music there too. That final closing

2050
01:53:54,399 --> 01:53:57,439
cue right before we get to the credits just just

2051
01:53:57,600 --> 01:54:02,680
superb like, absolutely amazing job there. Sound design, as we've

2052
01:54:02,680 --> 01:54:06,159
said throughout, Todd Busted and his team with all the

2053
01:54:06,199 --> 01:54:10,039
folly and stuff, just an amazing job. The score was phenomenal.

2054
01:54:10,600 --> 01:54:14,239
And I think it's worth pointing out here that Augustine

2055
01:54:14,239 --> 01:54:18,840
Institute Radio Theater is like a masterclass in story framing devices.

2056
01:54:18,920 --> 01:54:21,720
And I think I did talk with Paul a little

2057
01:54:21,720 --> 01:54:24,720
bit about this at Sonic Con, but we didn't get

2058
01:54:24,720 --> 01:54:26,680
to get into it too deeply. I would have loved

2059
01:54:26,680 --> 01:54:29,119
to have picked his brain a little bit more about this,

2060
01:54:29,239 --> 01:54:31,920
but it feels like to me that he has been

2061
01:54:32,720 --> 01:54:35,119
he's been using these shows to be a little bit

2062
01:54:35,279 --> 01:54:40,359
experimental with his approach to storytelling. Obviously, Adventures and Odyssey

2063
01:54:40,399 --> 01:54:42,319
is very constrained, like there are certain things you just

2064
01:54:42,399 --> 01:54:46,079
don't do in an Odyssey episode, right, You have certain

2065
01:54:46,479 --> 01:54:50,640
parameters that you have to work within, and radio theater

2066
01:54:50,760 --> 01:54:53,800
a lot of those were adaptations of classic literature. I mean,

2067
01:54:53,840 --> 01:54:56,279
there were some originals like Father Gilbert and things, but

2068
01:54:56,760 --> 01:54:59,479
for the most part, those are the stories that you're

2069
01:54:59,479 --> 01:55:02,600
trying to tell. Well, this is something completely different, and

2070
01:55:02,680 --> 01:55:05,000
so he was able to do some different things. And

2071
01:55:05,680 --> 01:55:07,920
I think I've referenced this on the show before. I

2072
01:55:08,000 --> 01:55:11,039
know I've said it in conversations with people, but each

2073
01:55:11,079 --> 01:55:14,479
one of these releases has tackled storytelling from a different

2074
01:55:14,560 --> 01:55:19,840
sort of way. So with Francis, each chapter of Francis's

2075
01:55:19,920 --> 01:55:22,359
life was told from the perspective of a person who

2076
01:55:22,479 --> 01:55:25,399
interacted with him at that time of his life. So

2077
01:55:25,439 --> 01:55:28,720
we had these different points of his life, and so

2078
01:55:28,760 --> 01:55:32,920
that was the framing of that. Then with Patrick, we

2079
01:55:33,000 --> 01:55:36,880
had this whole framing device of the interrogation of these

2080
01:55:36,960 --> 01:55:40,239
church officials who are basically grilling Patrick on all these

2081
01:55:40,279 --> 01:55:44,479
things that he's done throughout his life and the choices

2082
01:55:44,520 --> 01:55:46,960
that he made and all this kind of stuff. Then

2083
01:55:47,000 --> 01:55:50,560
with Cecilia we have this whole setup of the different

2084
01:55:50,680 --> 01:55:56,600
muses that helped set up the whole production. And then

2085
01:55:56,640 --> 01:56:00,319
with Robinhood we have the troubadour narrator who sort of

2086
01:56:00,359 --> 01:56:05,439
presents this story as as this sort of traveling, you know,

2087
01:56:05,720 --> 01:56:10,039
storyteller kind of vibe. And then with Joan we have

2088
01:56:10,159 --> 01:56:15,479
the chronicler of Mushar and the interviewer who kind of

2089
01:56:15,800 --> 01:56:19,119
set up everything and they carry the whole story all

2090
01:56:19,159 --> 01:56:22,359
the way throughout. So each one of these he's done

2091
01:56:22,439 --> 01:56:25,720
different things, and so again I think it's a it's

2092
01:56:25,720 --> 01:56:28,760
a masterclass in how to write audio drama and do

2093
01:56:28,880 --> 01:56:33,720
it in different ways, and overall these are world class

2094
01:56:33,720 --> 01:56:36,399
productions in every regard. This is top notch.

2095
01:56:36,920 --> 01:56:40,119
Speaker 1: Yeah, and this was my first Augustine Institute Radio Theater

2096
01:56:40,479 --> 01:56:43,119
drama that I've heard. In full disclosure, I don't know

2097
01:56:43,119 --> 01:56:45,479
if that was a requirement to listen to any others

2098
01:56:45,479 --> 01:56:49,319
before it came on this show, but coming in hearing

2099
01:56:49,359 --> 01:56:52,199
this one for the first time, it was, you know,

2100
01:56:52,239 --> 01:56:55,039
it was very easy to just jump in and listen

2101
01:56:55,079 --> 01:56:57,760
to it because obviously their standalone stories. But I think

2102
01:56:57,800 --> 01:57:00,880
this was a great representation of the of the quality

2103
01:57:01,199 --> 01:57:03,159
and it makes me want to hear some of these

2104
01:57:03,199 --> 01:57:03,800
other ones too.

2105
01:57:04,119 --> 01:57:09,079
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just fantastic stuff, So kudos to Paul McCusker

2106
01:57:09,159 --> 01:57:15,039
and the whole team, the entire massive cast. Just a

2107
01:57:15,079 --> 01:57:18,920
fantastic story. Now, you know, there's some intense moments and

2108
01:57:19,079 --> 01:57:23,279
there are some references that never get graphic, but there

2109
01:57:23,680 --> 01:57:28,039
are some adult themes of hints at things that are

2110
01:57:28,079 --> 01:57:31,840
that are happening. This is not one for little kids,

2111
01:57:31,880 --> 01:57:34,359
and frankly they probably be bored by it. Anyway, they're

2112
01:57:34,920 --> 01:57:37,439
to be able to follow what's going on, and that's

2113
01:57:37,520 --> 01:57:39,119
not the point of this. This is not aimed at

2114
01:57:39,239 --> 01:57:43,279
at children, but they're they're just extremely well done. So

2115
01:57:43,359 --> 01:57:46,880
I thoroughly enjoyed it, and again, even coming from a

2116
01:57:46,920 --> 01:57:51,279
non Catholic perspective, I think these are are fantastic audio dramas.

2117
01:57:51,680 --> 01:57:53,800
Here here well, link is in the show notes. If

2118
01:57:53,800 --> 01:57:57,439
you'd like to get your copy, and I think you should.

2119
01:57:57,640 --> 01:58:00,840
It's available as as a podcast. This is something they

2120
01:58:00,840 --> 01:58:03,680
did for the first time with these releases. It was

2121
01:58:03,720 --> 01:58:06,720
released as a podcast and in a couple of different

2122
01:58:07,359 --> 01:58:11,159
meditation apps, so it's freely available, but links are in

2123
01:58:11,199 --> 01:58:14,800
the show notes. It's also available on CD, and if

2124
01:58:14,840 --> 01:58:17,800
you want to grab your copy, those links are available. Michael,

2125
01:58:18,039 --> 01:58:19,960
thank you so much for coming on the show. Again,

2126
01:58:19,960 --> 01:58:22,000
I appreciate it. It was a great discussion as always.

2127
01:58:22,239 --> 01:58:23,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you. I always enjoy it.

2128
01:58:24,479 --> 01:58:28,359
Speaker 2: And by the time you hear this, Michael will likely

2129
01:58:28,439 --> 01:58:31,039
be a father, So congratulations to you and your wife.

2130
01:58:31,439 --> 01:58:35,840
Speaker 1: Yes, thank you. Yeah, we are anxiously awaiting this podcast

2131
01:58:35,840 --> 01:58:37,720
recording was touching go because we don't know when the

2132
01:58:37,720 --> 01:58:41,079
baby's going to come, but she held off for you

2133
01:58:41,520 --> 01:58:45,640
the ATC community. My wife's rolling her eyes.

2134
01:58:48,600 --> 01:58:52,159
Speaker 2: Well, thank you for holding off their little one.

2135
01:58:52,800 --> 01:58:54,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, because this is.

2136
01:58:54,840 --> 01:59:00,800
Speaker 2: So much more important. So are you think of the show?

2137
01:59:05,520 --> 01:59:07,079
Speaker 3: Please leave your message after the zone.

2138
01:59:07,479 --> 01:59:08,920
Speaker 4: Hi, Audi Theater Central.

2139
01:59:09,039 --> 01:59:10,640
Speaker 3: Hey guys, this is awesome Peach.

2140
01:59:11,039 --> 01:59:14,359
Speaker 5: Hello, jd Royan Andrew Minum is Victoria Now.

2141
01:59:14,439 --> 01:59:16,600
Speaker 8: Yesterday I received a letter from a big fan.

2142
01:59:16,880 --> 01:59:17,680
Speaker 3: No time to Josh.

2143
01:59:17,920 --> 01:59:18,640
Speaker 2: I've got an email.

2144
01:59:18,840 --> 01:59:22,399
Speaker 1: This another package for me today? No exactly, just your mail.

2145
01:59:25,800 --> 01:59:27,920
Speaker 2: Yes, it is that time to hear from you, the

2146
01:59:28,000 --> 01:59:30,920
ATC listener. Thank you so much for always sending in

2147
01:59:30,960 --> 01:59:33,560
your feedback. You can reach us at feedback at Audio

2148
01:59:33,640 --> 01:59:36,520
Theatercentral dot com. You can comment on the show notes,

2149
01:59:36,680 --> 01:59:38,520
or you can send a text or leave us a

2150
01:59:38,600 --> 01:59:42,399
voicemail at six two three six eight eight two seven

2151
01:59:42,640 --> 01:59:46,840
seven zero. Well. First up is a comment from Jeff

2152
01:59:47,439 --> 01:59:52,000
on Spotify. Actually you can actually leave comments on Spotify,

2153
01:59:52,079 --> 01:59:54,600
but he left a comment on ATC one eighty seven,

2154
01:59:54,760 --> 01:59:59,600
the interview with composer John Campbell. Jeff says, would you

2155
01:59:59,640 --> 02:00:02,560
mind put the announcements at the end. I'm a first

2156
02:00:02,560 --> 02:00:04,760
time listener and I came here to learn about production

2157
02:00:04,840 --> 02:00:08,319
design for Adventures Odyssey, and I immediately felt very confused

2158
02:00:08,319 --> 02:00:12,000
about what I had gotten into. Well, first of all, Jeff,

2159
02:00:12,039 --> 02:00:14,279
thank you for checking out the show. If you're still listening,

2160
02:00:14,439 --> 02:00:18,560
hope you are. But if there is a reason why

2161
02:00:18,640 --> 02:00:22,319
I put the news updates at the top, because that

2162
02:00:22,439 --> 02:00:25,920
is the most timely information of each episode, I want

2163
02:00:25,960 --> 02:00:29,399
to get to that stuff first. And each segment is

2164
02:00:29,640 --> 02:00:32,439
clearly marked. There is a segment transition. Each one is

2165
02:00:32,479 --> 02:00:34,880
marked in the show notes and on the website show

2166
02:00:34,920 --> 02:00:39,560
notes with a timestamp saying what each segment is. So

2167
02:00:39,760 --> 02:00:42,600
if you want to skip to the interview, you can

2168
02:00:42,640 --> 02:00:45,520
absolutely do that. If you want to skip to the

2169
02:00:45,640 --> 02:00:49,560
feedback segment, whatever the case is, those are there for

2170
02:00:49,680 --> 02:00:54,760
your usage with the timestamps on the website version and

2171
02:00:55,199 --> 02:00:58,439
on the show notes in your app that you're listening in,

2172
02:00:59,079 --> 02:01:02,880
soe free to skip around. I mean, obviously my preference

2173
02:01:02,920 --> 02:01:05,920
would be that everybody listens to the full episode, but

2174
02:01:06,079 --> 02:01:08,560
if there's something in particular you want to hear, feel

2175
02:01:08,600 --> 02:01:12,600
free to skip around to whatever segment you want. But no,

2176
02:01:12,720 --> 02:01:16,760
we're not going to move those Generally, there is a

2177
02:01:16,880 --> 02:01:19,840
reason for the flow of the content in each episode,

2178
02:01:20,600 --> 02:01:23,199
but I do appreciate the feedback and thank you so

2179
02:01:23,279 --> 02:01:28,600
much for listening. Jeff next up as an email from Jeremy,

2180
02:01:28,760 --> 02:01:30,520
and he says, I hope the Audio drama Camp was

2181
02:01:30,560 --> 02:01:33,119
a big success, and I hope it will continue for

2182
02:01:33,159 --> 02:01:36,640
many years to come. Yes, I hope that that event

2183
02:01:36,760 --> 02:01:40,640
does continue as well. He continues, I really enjoy the

2184
02:01:40,680 --> 02:01:43,680
clever titles that the nick guy Private Eye comes up with,

2185
02:01:44,000 --> 02:01:48,239
and I hope to check out this audio drama soon. Absolutely. Yeah,

2186
02:01:48,680 --> 02:01:52,319
I've said it before. I love Frank Ughley's sense of humor,

2187
02:01:52,359 --> 02:01:55,439
and not just the titles, but also in the dialogue throughout.

2188
02:01:55,720 --> 02:01:59,079
He's always there's always layers to the humor and I

2189
02:01:59,119 --> 02:02:02,079
always appreciate that as well. So yeah, I think he

2190
02:02:02,079 --> 02:02:06,199
should check it out. Jeremy says, I also really enjoy

2191
02:02:06,279 --> 02:02:08,479
listening to focus on the family radio theater, and I

2192
02:02:08,560 --> 02:02:10,840
might check out some of the other old time radio

2193
02:02:10,880 --> 02:02:14,239
theater when I have time. I have also noticed that

2194
02:02:14,279 --> 02:02:18,760
the Sugar Creek episodes also sound like they are older episodes. Yes,

2195
02:02:18,960 --> 02:02:22,319
that those were all produced quite some time ago. The

2196
02:02:22,359 --> 02:02:27,119
majority of the programming by Moody was from decades ago,

2197
02:02:27,479 --> 02:02:29,560
and some of it from a very long time ago.

2198
02:02:29,600 --> 02:02:33,239
Like the Ranger Bill shows, those are quite old. Those

2199
02:02:33,239 --> 02:02:36,000
are technically that part of the old time radio era.

2200
02:02:36,920 --> 02:02:39,239
So yeah, Sugar Creek those were They were done quite

2201
02:02:39,239 --> 02:02:41,920
some time ago, so they're not quite as immersive as

2202
02:02:41,960 --> 02:02:44,279
some of the more modern audio drama productions, but I

2203
02:02:44,359 --> 02:02:48,319
still really like them, he continues. Would the Sugar Creek

2204
02:02:48,359 --> 02:02:53,239
Gang episodes be available to download or to get on CD? Well,

2205
02:02:53,399 --> 02:02:56,000
they are not available on CD as far as I know,

2206
02:02:56,079 --> 02:02:59,560
and I don't believe they ever were. But good news,

2207
02:02:59,560 --> 02:03:02,479
they are available for download. In fact, they are available

2208
02:03:02,520 --> 02:03:05,640
to download for free. So quite some time ago, Moody

2209
02:03:05,680 --> 02:03:07,640
made the decision to put a bunch of their old

2210
02:03:07,720 --> 02:03:11,239
audio drama programming available for free download. So they set

2211
02:03:11,279 --> 02:03:15,239
up a website Moodyaudio dot com, and there is a

2212
02:03:15,239 --> 02:03:17,760
bunch of great stuff there that you can download for free.

2213
02:03:18,319 --> 02:03:20,880
We did an entire post on our website about some

2214
02:03:20,960 --> 02:03:23,399
of the content that is featured on this site, so

2215
02:03:23,520 --> 02:03:26,119
I've linked that post in the show notes for this episode,

2216
02:03:26,600 --> 02:03:28,840
so you can go see what is also available in

2217
02:03:28,840 --> 02:03:31,319
addition to Sugar Creek Gang. But I also have a

2218
02:03:31,399 --> 02:03:34,920
link directly to the page on the Moody website for

2219
02:03:35,079 --> 02:03:37,880
the Sugar Creek Gang show, so you can go directly

2220
02:03:37,880 --> 02:03:40,000
there and download that show if you want to check

2221
02:03:40,000 --> 02:03:45,000
it out. So thank you Jeremy for the feedback as always,

2222
02:03:45,039 --> 02:03:47,960
and I would love to hear back from you if

2223
02:03:48,000 --> 02:03:50,560
you check out more Sugar Creek Gang or if you

2224
02:03:50,600 --> 02:03:53,359
listen to Nick Guy, well that's going to do it

2225
02:03:53,399 --> 02:03:56,720
for this episode. Thanks again to Alan Hurley and John

2226
02:03:56,760 --> 02:04:00,960
Fornoff for sharing their expertise about audio drama trailer, and

2227
02:04:01,000 --> 02:04:03,119
thank you to Michael Schrader for joining me to talk

2228
02:04:03,199 --> 02:04:07,319
about the victory of Joan of Arc. As always, show

2229
02:04:07,359 --> 02:04:10,319
notes with links to everything we talked about and discussed

2230
02:04:10,399 --> 02:04:13,920
in this episode are at Audio Theatercentral dot com slash

2231
02:04:13,960 --> 02:04:16,279
two two one. If you'd like to get in touch

2232
02:04:16,279 --> 02:04:19,560
with us, head over to Audio Theatercentral dot com slash contact.

2233
02:04:19,960 --> 02:04:23,640
All the ways to reach out are listed there. It

2234
02:04:23,720 --> 02:04:26,800
is the fall. We have Thanksgiving coming up here in

2235
02:04:26,840 --> 02:04:28,680
the US at the end of this month. I hope

2236
02:04:28,720 --> 02:04:31,520
you have a wonderful Thanksgiving time and I will see

2237
02:04:31,520 --> 02:04:33,439
you next time. Thanks for listening.

2238
02:04:39,199 --> 02:04:41,840
Speaker 10: Hi guys, this is Kenny Sargent from Sergeant Family Productions.

2239
02:04:41,880 --> 02:04:44,720
I'm here with my friend JD. We're live from Audio

2240
02:04:44,800 --> 02:04:49,520
Drama Institute, about three thousand feet higher than Colorado Springs.

2241
02:04:50,359 --> 02:04:53,439
Audio Theater Central is a production of Porchlite Family Media.

2242
02:04:53,680 --> 02:04:57,159
The theme music was composed by Sam Avendanio. The show

2243
02:04:57,239 --> 02:04:59,159
is produced and edited by my friend JD.

2244
02:04:59,279 --> 02:04:59,600
Speaker 1: Sutter.

2245
02:05:00,119 --> 02:05:09,079
Speaker 10: Website, of course, is audio Theatercentral dot com.

2246
02:05:09,119 --> 02:05:13,319
Speaker 3: Sporchlight Familymedia your source for family centered content.

2247
02:05:13,880 --> 02:05:18,119
Speaker 1: Scorchlightfamilymedia dot com