Speaker 1: Smith and Rogan are irked when Murray expresses his befuddlement
Speaker 1: that Smith has become a prominent voice in the debate
Speaker 1: about Israel and Palestine without ever having visited the Middle East.
Speaker 1: The shock at the idea that someone ought to see
Speaker 1: things with their own eyes before commenting on them is palpable.
Speaker 2: Have you been there?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 4: That's a good point.
Speaker 5: Have you even you haven't been?
Speaker 6: How is he in all these wars? Can I just
Speaker 6: go to wars? By the way, how are you left?
Speaker 6: Are you allowed to just go to wars?
Speaker 7: Can you just go ought to see of going? Can
Speaker 7: I just go to wars?
Speaker 6: Or do I have to come back and say what
Speaker 6: people want me to say about the wars?
Speaker 8: The problem with modern media is there are now continual bullvoks.
Speaker 8: You get rid of Joe Rogan. You got to deal
Speaker 8: with Candace Avenge. You get rid of Candace Avenge. You
Speaker 8: got in Carol, you get rid of in Carrol. You
Speaker 8: got me, you get rid of me. You got to
Speaker 8: deal with Lex Freeman, You get rid of Lex Friedman.
Speaker 8: You got to deal with Daddy evermore, Alex Jones. How
Speaker 8: are they going to control smear, show down every single
Speaker 8: one of those Pundi's you.
Speaker 9: Get rid of Crowder, you get rid of Temple?
Speaker 8: How are you gonna do it? How are you gonna
Speaker 8: do it? And ultimately it's more important. You guys are
Speaker 8: more important. You are the people that mau so in
Speaker 8: a way, whatever you talk about in the rumble chat,
Speaker 8: you're a Zionist giantny Semi. It doesn't really make any difference.
Speaker 8: Even issues as significant as Israel and Israel's power, even
Speaker 8: issues as significant as the Russia Ukraine War, even issues
Speaker 8: as significant as Epstein's power fade when compared to the
Speaker 8: spiritual war that I believe we're in.
Speaker 10: Nat So, since I put out that episode last week
Speaker 10: where I said that there's a cancelation attempt against Rogan
Speaker 10: and a deep platform deplatforming attempt against Dave Smith and
Speaker 10: Daryl Cooper, there has been a firestorm and everyone is
Speaker 10: now engaging in this conversation. So take a little victory
Speaker 10: lap for myself there. I identified this before anybody, as
Speaker 10: best I can tell. I'm sure some of you identified
Speaker 10: it at the same time I did, But in terms
Speaker 10: of commentators, I was definitely on the front lines with
Speaker 10: this one. And I think the reason that I was
Speaker 10: able to catch. It is just simply because these are
Speaker 10: my people, because I'm a huge fan of obviously Davey's
Speaker 10: a friend and Rogan and I've followed them forever, and
Speaker 10: I've followed the news backlash to these things very consistently
Speaker 10: for a very long time. I can sense when people
Speaker 10: are doing things that are reputationally damaging. There's usually a
Speaker 10: catalyst for that. What is that catalyst, and it's if
Speaker 10: it's not evident, well then it's probably hidden. And if
Speaker 10: it's hidden, then it's probably ops show the logical chain there.
Speaker 10: So I think that's what we're witnessing. But I want
Speaker 10: to go through some of the responses because this has
Speaker 10: been a tremendous opportunity to distill who is worth listening
Speaker 10: to and following moving forward in my opinion, and I
Speaker 10: think at the someone who's risen, Well, there's been tons
Speaker 10: of figures that have fallen over the past week. One
Speaker 10: of the figures that I'm very fond of that has
Speaker 10: risen and risen to the occasion is Brett Weinstein, and
Speaker 10: he has put out a video which I'll play for
Speaker 10: you in a second. But before I do that, I
Speaker 10: want to talk about a little bit about why I
Speaker 10: think Douglas Murray setting aside the actual the actual argument,
Speaker 10: and just talk about the tone and delivery and why
Speaker 10: it doesn't land with an American audience, particularly a Joe
Speaker 10: Rogan audience. There is something very different culturally between Americans
Speaker 10: and the Brits. They have a class structure that is
Speaker 10: much more prominent than the way we look at things.
Speaker 10: Certainly we still have you know, class here, but it's
Speaker 10: just not that's not how we decipher truth from fiction.
Speaker 10: And I think that the reason that someone like Rogan
Speaker 10: rose to such high levels of popularity and listenership is
Speaker 10: because he doesn't rely on class, he doesn't rely on credentialism.
Speaker 10: He's just do you have an argument. Okay, you're a
Speaker 10: comic and you want to talk about Israel palasign. Okay,
Speaker 10: let's do it. Let's see if your argument stands up.
Speaker 10: Oh you you're a comic and you have an argument
Speaker 10: about a foreign war. Well how about I bring in
Speaker 10: an alleged expert on that, like Douglas Murray and see
Speaker 10: if you can hold your own I think what rubs
Speaker 10: the Brits the wrong way, And I've realized this after
Speaker 10: listening to both constantin kiss and Douglas Murray and Carl
Speaker 10: Benjamin aka Sargon of a cod is that they they
Speaker 10: definitely ascribe greater value to those that wear a suit
Speaker 10: and speak in a posh accent and come from an
Speaker 10: upper class background, went to Oxford or Cambridge or whatever.
Speaker 10: I think that that's not how Americans really view things,
Speaker 10: and I think that it's increasingly the opposite of how
Speaker 10: Americans view things. Like if you're talking to somebody who
Speaker 10: went to a state school or Harvard or Yale, you're
Speaker 10: probably going to be more doubtful of the legitimacy of
Speaker 10: the claims that comes from someone who was indoctrinated to
Speaker 10: the Ivy League. At least you know people in this
Speaker 10: audience for sure. At least I am. I don't take
Speaker 10: your credentials seriously at all. You're gonna have to demonstrate
Speaker 10: to me that, like, you're actually a free thinker, a
Speaker 10: critical thinker, You're intelligent. I could have gotten through Harvard easily,
Speaker 10: But does that make me smart? Well, I guess you
Speaker 10: could say that it makes me smart because I could
Speaker 10: have done it easily, But that doesn't make me right, right,
Speaker 10: Like that That's the key here. We're trying to find
Speaker 10: truth and constantin kissing will sit there and very very
Speaker 10: nicely lit recording studio, and he sits there and he
Speaker 10: stares dead into the camera, and he talks very eloquently,
Speaker 10: and he wears a suit and his hair's done up,
Speaker 10: and it's just like it's all a delivery that is
Speaker 10: trying to ascribe legitimacy to his claims when the arguments
Speaker 10: aren't actually present, and the opposite is true for someone
Speaker 10: like Rogan or Dave Smith or myself. I'm sitting here
Speaker 10: in a T shirt and a beanie. I don't have
Speaker 10: any lights on. I'm just ambient light from outside, and
Speaker 10: that's it. And I expect you to actually listen to
Speaker 10: what I have to say and decide if I'm right
Speaker 10: or wrong. And I think that that's that's a much
Speaker 10: more American way of analyzing these things, particularly after the
Speaker 10: media has proven itself to be disreputable. They've lied to
Speaker 10: us for decades, and they've gotten us into so many
Speaker 10: wars and I mean lockdown as a whole, I mean
Speaker 10: everything they do. They basically led us into a near
Speaker 10: race war in the summer twenty twenty. So yeah, they
Speaker 10: have rightfully lost our trust. So what we're looking for
Speaker 10: is not honorifics. It's not credentials. It's not even wealth
Speaker 10: or evidence of success. You know, do you drive a
Speaker 10: Ferrari or whatever. It's honesty, sincerity, authenticity, Are you for real?
Speaker 10: Doesn't necessarily mean you're right, But that's kind of a
Speaker 10: prerequisite to being right, is that you're at least trying
Speaker 10: to tell the truth. And I think that's what has
Speaker 10: made Dave Smith rise to such heights, and to such
Speaker 10: high heights so recently, is that he just it's so
Speaker 10: obvious that he's authentic in what he's what he's talking about.
Speaker 10: It doesn't mean he's right about everything, but as I said,
Speaker 10: that's the prerequisite to whether or not he's worth listening to.
Speaker 10: I think Brett Weinstein is a good example of this
Speaker 10: when it comes to the more credentialed academic version of
Speaker 10: a Dave Smith. He's not gonna sit there in a
Speaker 10: T shirt necessarily, and he's not going to drop f
Speaker 10: bombs or or you know, make jokes very often, but
Speaker 10: it's obvious that he's being his authentic self. He's very
Speaker 10: he's a very slow speaking, deep thinking guy, and he
Speaker 10: takes in new information and he contrasts it with his
Speaker 10: previous assumptions on a topic, and then he basically cross
Speaker 10: references the two and he says, Okay, I'm gonna drop
Speaker 10: these previous ideas that I was holding and pushing to
Speaker 10: my audience, and now I'm going to uplift these new
Speaker 10: ideas and I'm gonna kind of integrate them into my worldview.
Speaker 10: And I think that's all most people are asking for.
Speaker 10: You don't have to drop f bombs, you don't have
Speaker 10: to you know, dress like a schlub either, But are
Speaker 10: you actually reconsidering new information as new information comes to light?
Speaker 10: And this good example of this was Brett Weinstein early
Speaker 10: on in the Lockdowns. Some people say that he supported
Speaker 10: the lockdowns. I didn't follow his show closely back then,
Speaker 10: but he did have some photos of him wearing a
Speaker 10: mask and big goggles. And he's been dragged mercilessly for that.
Speaker 10: But don't I don't feel that way, particularly if you're
Speaker 10: doing it in the you know, late February early March timeframe,
Speaker 10: when Fauci and others were saying, you don't need these things,
Speaker 10: and for him to still be thinking critically and thinking
Speaker 10: freely and to kind of contrarian, but maybe right is
Speaker 10: to go, well, we don't know what this is, so
Speaker 10: I'm gonna take precautions. I don't have any problem with that.
Speaker 10: And if you as new information comes out and you realize, oh,
Speaker 10: this isn't efficacious, well I'm gonna drop it and I'm
Speaker 10: gonna notify my audience. I think that this is this
Speaker 10: is all bad guidance that you're getting from HHS, fauci,
Speaker 10: et cetera. And he did that consistently for the past
Speaker 10: five years. And like, that's how you that's how you
Speaker 10: earn respect. It's not about credentials, it's about track record.
Speaker 10: And Douglas Murray, as I've demonstrated so many times, I'm
Speaker 10: not going to recap it, but this guy has advocated
Speaker 10: every single war that we've been in, and they've all
Speaker 10: been disastrous. And like, I don't give a shit that
Speaker 10: you went to Oxford. I don't care that you wrote
Speaker 10: four or five books. You've been wrong about the biggest
Speaker 10: issues time and time and time again, to the detriment
Speaker 10: of my country. Why should I not hold you accountable
Speaker 10: for that? Well, on the inverse of that is, did
Speaker 10: you get the biggest issues right? Brett Weinstein has, at
Speaker 10: least in recent memory. That's to his credit and he
Speaker 10: deserves despite the fact that, like I think, he also
Speaker 10: supported Andrew Yang, which I find to be insane and
Speaker 10: totally counter to my political worldview. I'm still going to
Speaker 10: forgive that because that's the difference of opinion. That's not
Speaker 10: so much being wrong on the issue as much as
Speaker 10: having a different perspective on political solutions. He's more left leaning,
Speaker 10: he's going to advocate for more left leaning solutions, but
Speaker 10: he's still being honest, he's still seeking truth. And I
Speaker 10: won't talk out of school here, But after I posted
Speaker 10: something saying I'm left wondering if the IDW the Intellectual
Speaker 10: Dark Web, was subverted or if it was created from
Speaker 10: its inception to basically curtail the non interventionist right when
Speaker 10: it comes to foreign policy. And a lot of people
Speaker 10: got upset with me about that, because you know, they're saying, well,
Speaker 10: these are all former lefties, like, how would they possibly
Speaker 10: curtel the right? Well, let me explain. These are still
Speaker 10: very influential figures, figures that became extraordinarily prominent largely because
Speaker 10: of their relationship to Joe Rogan and their continuous access
Speaker 10: to enormous audiences for a four or five six year period. Yes,
Speaker 10: they're the moderate lefties, but they come over, they get
Speaker 10: this huge platform and they start to talk about this
Speaker 10: is this is the over This is the We don't
Speaker 10: agree with this Overton window. This is the new Overton window.
Speaker 10: But this Overton window includes within it Empire, It includes
Speaker 10: within it our greatest ally and continuing foreign intervention. A
Speaker 10: lot of people got upset about it, as I said,
Speaker 10: but I'll tell you without disclosing anything that would you
Speaker 10: violate privacy. I got a text message from Brett Weinstein,
Speaker 10: and I'm not gonna say what he said to me,
Speaker 10: but let's just say he is also viewing what's happening
Speaker 10: now and he's concerned by it. And instead of telling
Speaker 10: you what he talked to me about, I'm just gonna
Speaker 10: play you his clip because it basically gets to the point,
Speaker 10: and it's also public information, so I won't be talking
Speaker 10: out of school. Let's check it out.
Speaker 4: The mechanism by which we discovered it is well known.
Speaker 4: It is the exact thing that the founders of this
Speaker 4: great country put first on the list of our enumerated
Speaker 4: rights for a goddamn reason. It was they couldn't name
Speaker 4: a podcast, they couldn't have called out Joe Rogan, but
Speaker 4: they came as close as they could come to saying, sorry,
Speaker 4: there's no source of high quality information versus low quality information, malinformation, disinformation.
Speaker 4: You can't know ahead of time. The mechanism by which
Speaker 4: you come to understand what is true, Douglas is discussion.
Speaker 4: It is discussion in which nobody gets to set the
Speaker 4: rules about what kinds of opinions can be investigated. And yes,
Speaker 4: that does cause some garbage stuff to be said, But
Speaker 4: what reveals that it's garbage stuff? Free and open inquiry,
Speaker 4: that reveals that actually it doesn't stand up to scrutiny.
Speaker 4: That's how you do it. Constantine Kissin, I don't know
Speaker 4: what's wrong with these people. It's really like somebody has
Speaker 4: figured out how to threaten them into saying things that
Speaker 4: they full well know aren't true. They're becoming what they
Speaker 4: were fighting against. They are becoming what they were fighting against.
Speaker 4: And I must say, in both of those cases, I
Speaker 4: feel like I don't think I was duped to begin
Speaker 4: with that they actually held free speech as a high value.
Speaker 4: So the fact that they are backing away from it
Speaker 4: and calling for some kind of standard, self imposed or
Speaker 4: otherwise to prevent certain You know, the fact is, heterodoxy
Speaker 4: is heterodoxy, and it often sounds crazy, and most of
Speaker 4: it is. But the good stuff is the stuff that
Speaker 4: sounds crazy that then does strangely stand up to scrutiny.
Speaker 4: That's how you figure out what's coming is you look
Speaker 4: at the heterodox stuff and you figure out what has
Speaker 4: predictive power. And you can't get around that. And the
Speaker 4: people who tried fail.
Speaker 10: Kudos tremendously well said, and I could not agree more.
Speaker 10: And I think in some ways the reason that Brett
Speaker 10: has become such a stalwart advocate for free speech and
Speaker 10: open debate is that his origin story was getting kicked
Speaker 10: off of Evergreen College and being threatened by the woke mob.
Speaker 10: And you know that that left an indelible mark on him,
Speaker 10: at least as best I can tell. And I think
Speaker 10: you know essentially what he conveyed in that message of
Speaker 10: Dark Dark Horse podcasts is you know what we talked
Speaker 10: about privately, and I think it's it's obviously just true.
Speaker 10: Like who were the heterodox thinkers back in twenty twenty one,
Speaker 10: doctor Peter McCullough. You know, like some legitimate experts, but
Speaker 10: they were heterodots in that moment of kind of cult,
Speaker 10: just group think, psychosis, doctor Robert Malone, a bunch of
Speaker 10: guys that have been proven empirically to be far closer
Speaker 10: to the truth than the so called experts. And this
Speaker 10: is the value of the podcast sphere, and this is
Speaker 10: the value of the Jero Rogan podcast writ large, is
Speaker 10: that he enables large audiences to hear and consider what
Speaker 10: are heterodox ideas when it matters most. And if you
Speaker 10: don't do that, well, then in my opinion, you're doing
Speaker 10: your audience a disservice, trusting that your audience will be
Speaker 10: intelligent enough to decipher truth from fiction or at least
Speaker 10: take in ideas, consider the and then do further research
Speaker 10: to establish whether or not they are accurate. What's even
Speaker 10: more galling about this, though, is that Douglas Murray is
Speaker 10: sitting right across the table from this guy who he
Speaker 10: believes to be a smear merchant or a deceptive figure
Speaker 10: in Dave Smith, then just call him on the bullshit
Speaker 10: right then and there, lay it all out. You have
Speaker 10: an opportunity that Dave and I would just dream of
Speaker 10: to call you out in your bullshit, But you're sitting
Speaker 10: right there and you can't do it in real time.
Speaker 10: Seems a little odd, doesn't it. So it's not as
Speaker 10: if it's not as if they're critiquing Rogan for having
Speaker 10: on Dave Smith by himself, which sure you could argue, well,
Speaker 10: he's only platforming people that have these crazy ideas he's
Speaker 10: never having on But that's not true either. He has
Speaker 10: on Douglas Murray. Just the week prior, he had on
Speaker 10: constantin Kissing, which by the way, has no credentials outside
Speaker 10: of what Dave Smith does. He's a stand up comic,
Speaker 10: So why should you be platformed Constantin? Shouldn't we only
Speaker 10: listen to you when it comes to comedy. You talk
Speaker 10: about everything, you talk about the war in Ukraine. You've
Speaker 10: debated Dave on the war in Ukraine. But the truth
Speaker 10: is is that it's not about credentials. It's about gatekeeping
Speaker 10: and only permitting a certain narrative, and that certain narrative
Speaker 10: is obviously intervention on behalf of a country in the
Speaker 10: Middle East. Time and time again. This is the tie
Speaker 10: that binds every single figure that has come out aggressively,
Speaker 10: including Michael Rappaport, who had this to say.
Speaker 11: But Joe Rogan, it's an open discussion. You know, we're
Speaker 11: just floating ideas. We're not married to them being facts
Speaker 11: are not facts, and they don't have to be experts.
Speaker 11: We're having we're having to talk. We're just having it talking,
Speaker 11: smoking a cigar. Sometimes they smoke weed. We're just talking.
Speaker 11: That's Joe Rogan's here. And it's great for everything except
Speaker 11: for facts. It's great for everything except for people that
Speaker 11: are disparaging week after week podcast after his podcast and
Speaker 11: not telling the truth and the reality of what has
Speaker 11: happened October seventh and beyond. So you bring on one
Speaker 11: scumbang after the next comeback and they said, well, I'm
Speaker 11: not an expert. I'm a comedian. I'm not an expert,
Speaker 11: but I know this. I'm not an expert on on Hitler,
Speaker 11: but blah blah blah blah blah. I'm not an expert
Speaker 11: on Churchill but blah blah blah blah blah. I'm not
Speaker 11: an expert on the conflict in the Middle East. But
Speaker 11: here's all of my thoughts. I'm a comedian, but we're
Speaker 11: not gonna do any jokes. We're not gonna talk comedy.
Speaker 11: I'm just gonna expound.
Speaker 5: On all my thought.
Speaker 10: Yet another example of a comedian and actor who's talking
Speaker 10: out of school. Live by your own rules. Shut the
Speaker 10: fuck up, stop stop talking about this, right?
Speaker 12: I mean?
Speaker 8: What what?
Speaker 10: Why are you an authority as to who's able to
Speaker 10: talk about this stuff? If you can't talk about it either,
Speaker 10: why are you talking about it? How do you know
Speaker 10: what the truth is? He claims that Dave Smith isn't
Speaker 10: telling the truth all these lying motherfucker Okay, well, then
Speaker 10: how do you know what the truth is? Aren't you
Speaker 10: just a stand up comic? Are you an expert? Like
Speaker 10: this is the point is that you can't. You can't
Speaker 10: just assume that someone's an expert because they say they are.
Speaker 10: Dave Smith repeatedly says, I'm not an expert. But the
Speaker 10: truth is, if you want to be really honest about it,
Speaker 10: Dave's about as close to an expert on that conflict
Speaker 10: as you'll find. Listen to the guy. He has read,
Speaker 10: I don't know, dozens of books on the issue. I'm
Speaker 10: not saying that that makes him an expert, but compared
Speaker 10: to the general public, he's damn close, damn close, And
Speaker 10: compared to Douglas Murray, obviously closer. I mean, explain to
Speaker 10: me how Douglas Murray has been to Ukraine and been
Speaker 10: to Israel and yet he gets things wrong over and
Speaker 10: over again. Oh, Ukrainians are about to win this war.
Speaker 10: Just need to continue to give them aid. They'll be
Speaker 10: pushing the Russians out within months, weeks. Even it's a lie,
Speaker 10: it's a lie. So his his lived experience didn't amount
Speaker 10: to shit. But that's not the point. It's not about credentials,
Speaker 10: it's not about expertise, about crafting and maintaining a narrative
Speaker 10: and an Overton window that leaves people like the non
Speaker 10: interventionist right wing out out of the conversation. We don't
Speaker 10: want a guy like Dave Smith having an audience of
Speaker 10: fifteen million people because it's damaging to what we want
Speaker 10: to see happen. That's all this is. That's all it is.
Speaker 10: Because if it was just about challenging his bad ideas,
Speaker 10: you had the biggest opportunity in the world to do
Speaker 10: so you sat there with the guy for three hours.
Speaker 10: The fact that you got beat up is not Dave's fault,
Speaker 10: that's yours. You didn't bring any facts to offset like Rapaport,
Speaker 10: just keeps saying it's about facts. It's not just oh, sure,
Speaker 10: you can have an opinion, but no, when it comes
Speaker 10: to facts, Dave has the facts. People, he's not making
Speaker 10: it up. You can disagree with his conclusion, but in
Speaker 10: terms of the facts that he's bringing leaked State Department
Speaker 10: cables and you know Smotrich and net and Yahoo and
Speaker 10: all of these other reporting from Israeli reporting, you know outlets.
Speaker 10: Sure argue that all of that's wrong or the conclusion
Speaker 10: is wrong, that's fine, but he's not making that stuff up.
Speaker 10: And you know the reason that you know that is
Speaker 10: because there is no hit piece is circulating that demonstrate
Speaker 10: that Dave is lying. None try and find one. The
Speaker 10: clip that goes viral over and over again is just
Speaker 10: Dave hasn't been there, You've never been That's it. There's
Speaker 10: no breakdown, there's no challenging of actually the points that
Speaker 10: he brings up, which should be easy to do if
Speaker 10: he's such a liar, if he's such an idiot, but
Speaker 10: no one's done it because they can't because it's an
Speaker 10: impenetrable case. I just want to really emphasize that point.
Speaker 10: It's not about expertise or credentials. It's that Dave is
Speaker 10: fucking right. He is right about this. And why does
Speaker 10: it matter that Dave Smith is right? Well, because his
Speaker 10: argumentation is convincing a lot of his buddies who are
Speaker 10: extraordinarily influential, like Tim Dillon, like Joe Rogan list goes
Speaker 10: on and on that maybe we shouldn't continue to stand
Speaker 10: shoulder to shoulder with the country as they destroy their neighbor.
Speaker 7: Deporting them because they've been critical of a foreign government
Speaker 7: seems to feed the conspiracy theories that the United States
Speaker 7: is acting and doing things in the.
Speaker 10: Behast of Israel.
Speaker 7: What you want to do, if you're creating a political culture,
Speaker 7: you want to try to prevent people from drifting to
Speaker 7: the extremes.
Speaker 10: Rogan's got an audience of fifteen million. I don't know
Speaker 10: how many people listen to Tim Dillon, but it's got
Speaker 10: to be a couple million at least. And this is
Speaker 10: not this shouldn't be surprising to people. These guys are
Speaker 10: at their core. To be a good comic, you have
Speaker 10: to be interested in truth because and then unspeakable truths,
Speaker 10: particularly are things that you want to if you want
Speaker 10: to be you know, cutting edge, you want to bring
Speaker 10: those up you want to push the envelope, you want
Speaker 10: to see where that line is. But also stand up
Speaker 10: comics value tremendously free speech. Of course, their career depends
Speaker 10: on it. They've also all dealt with censorship and blacklisting
Speaker 10: and deplatforming, threats and strikes and everything else. So they
Speaker 10: very much care about free speech. So when they see
Speaker 10: these laws or these deportation regimes that are focused on
Speaker 10: the words of protesters like that is obviously going to
Speaker 10: draw their ire. Whether they agree with the protests or not,
Speaker 10: that's not the point. The point is do you have
Speaker 10: a right to speak freely? Now, this is a slightly
Speaker 10: different situation because we're largely talking about people that are
Speaker 10: either you know, immigrants are on green cards, is what
Speaker 10: most of the controversy is about, because so they're legally here.
Speaker 10: So if you're legally here, are you then protected by
Speaker 10: the constitution. There's some debate about that. I would say probably.
Speaker 10: So it seems to me that the problem is not
Speaker 10: that Dave Smith is lying on a large platform. But
Speaker 10: Dave Smith is telling the truth on the biggest platform
Speaker 10: in the world, and he is reaching more and more
Speaker 10: influential guys who are going to spread this same message
Speaker 10: to their audience, and therefore sirens go off. Problem. Problem, problem,
Speaker 10: This has to stop. And as I open up the
Speaker 10: show with Russell Brand, he's pointing out that you're not
Speaker 10: going to be able to get all of them. It's like, okay,
Speaker 10: so you take out Dave, well then you got Scott,
Speaker 10: and you got Tom, and you got Me and you
Speaker 10: got Dada. Or you take out Rogan, then you got
Speaker 10: Russell Brand, you got Aan Carroll, then you got that
Speaker 10: Dada Dada Jimmy Dore. I mean, there's so many people
Speaker 10: that are all basically in this world now, and they
Speaker 10: all have such enormous audiences. Well, you can't really stop
Speaker 10: all of them unless you go full you know, tyrannical
Speaker 10: shut down the Internet style, I mean, which is impossibility unfortunately.
Speaker 10: So the angle that they're taking is that they're going
Speaker 10: to try and increase the the pain if you get
Speaker 10: outside of this kind of forced Overton window where they say,
Speaker 10: sure have on people that Rogan's a great example of
Speaker 10: this too, because he has on Eddie Bravo and Sam
Speaker 10: Tripoli and they're talking wild shit, I mean talking fake
Speaker 10: moon landing and flat earth and all this other stuff.
Speaker 10: Jfkn every conspiracy you could possibly think of. They've talked about.
Speaker 10: There's no controversy. No one talks about that. What are
Speaker 10: the two times? What are the two times that Rogan
Speaker 10: has been attempted to be canceled?
Speaker 9: I'll give him to you.
Speaker 10: There's two. One because he had on a bunch of
Speaker 10: doctors that said that the lockdown regime and the mandates
Speaker 10: and everything else was insane and inefficacious and it had
Speaker 10: to stop. And they're like, whoa problem You're going up
Speaker 10: against the regime's narrative here. What's the second time? Well,
Speaker 10: he's had on Daryl Cooper and Dave Smith, and they're
Speaker 10: talking about the kind of foundational premise by which our
Speaker 10: empire was established. World War two, the hagiography around it,
Speaker 10: the kind of flowery, pure good versus evil story that
Speaker 10: we're all supposed to just believe and espouse consistently, despite
Speaker 10: the fact that millions and millions and millions of people died,
Speaker 10: and it's obviously tragic and any war has complicated factors
Speaker 10: that you ought to consider, especially if you want to
Speaker 10: avoid it. But if you actually question it, well then
Speaker 10: it kind of defeats the whole argument that every every
Speaker 10: dictator has to be stopped now lest we end up
Speaker 10: in another World war, because then you'd understand that, oh,
Speaker 10: it was actually the Allies were doing XYZ that was
Speaker 10: bad too, and this is actually much more complicated, and
Speaker 10: then in fact, Putin probably isn't going to roll across Europe.
Speaker 10: So like that foundational narrative matters a lot, which is
Speaker 10: why they don't like Daryl Cooper. The reason they don't
Speaker 10: like Dave Smith is because one, and this is just
Speaker 10: the truth, he's Jewish. So it's really hard to call
Speaker 10: him an anti Semite. As he's saying, hey, maybe we
Speaker 10: don't need to continue to blow out our deficit and
Speaker 10: our national debt to defend and fight a bunch of
Speaker 10: wars for a country that is in America, and they're like, oh,
Speaker 10: normally we just call you a slur and then we
Speaker 10: move on. But both your parents are Jewish? You sure
Speaker 10: one of them's not? No, no, they both are. Yeah,
Speaker 10: real problem, real fucking problem.
Speaker 13: Huh.
Speaker 10: So that's the reason that Dave Smith had The pain
Speaker 10: threshold has to be cranked up on Rogan so that
Speaker 10: he stops having on Daryl Cooper and Dave Smith. And
Speaker 10: if he stops, well then maybe Jimmy door stops. Maybe
Speaker 10: these other people that are all looking around and going,
Speaker 10: you know, I'd like to talk to these guys. They
Speaker 10: seem interesting, but I don't wanna. I don't wanna deal with,
Speaker 10: you know, potential for a strike or have op eds
Speaker 10: written about me, and I just it's just not worth
Speaker 10: the headache. So this is kind of a soft power
Speaker 10: as opposed to a state based power where it actually
Speaker 10: becomes overtly censorious, where they actually are striking you down
Speaker 10: or banning your deplatforming you. And I think that's what
Speaker 10: we're witnessing. And the reason I feel that way is
Speaker 10: because my Twitter feed is just filled filled with Israeli Flagg,
Speaker 10: Dave Smith, idiot, Here's the Ugus, Murray God King, legend man,
Speaker 10: and that's it. And they're like they're small accounts, but
Speaker 10: they've got huge activity, and it just looks like an optomy.
Speaker 10: As I've said before, can I prove it? No, I
Speaker 10: can't prove it. But I just once you've been in
Speaker 10: this world long enough, you sense when things aren't organic.
Speaker 10: Give a good example, I was one of the first
Speaker 10: people that identified when there was a bunch of conservative
Speaker 10: influencers that were aggressively pushing that Coca Cola products, that
Speaker 10: soda beverages ought to be included in SNAP, which is
Speaker 10: the Supplemental Nutritional Assistance Program I think is what the
Speaker 10: acronym stands for. And I'm like, wait, wait, your conservative
Speaker 10: influencers arguing like over what food stamps ought to be
Speaker 10: able to buy what. I'm like, you're damaging your reputation
Speaker 10: with this. So something's up.
Speaker 9: And I was right.
Speaker 10: And then there was a quick investigation and someone actually
Speaker 10: proved out, Yeah, these dudes are getting paid for it.
Speaker 10: They're lying to their audiences. They're paid operatives. Is it
Speaker 10: so far fetched to believe that if there's paid operatives
Speaker 10: that dictate whether or not soda is included in you know,
Speaker 10: welfare benefits, that there might be paid operatives that try
Speaker 10: and curtail messaging that says, hey, maybe we shouldn't continue
Speaker 10: to fight foreign wars that have bankrupted us.
Speaker 9: That.
Speaker 10: Does that seem like a stretch? Do you think that
Speaker 10: the Do you think that Coca Cola and Pepsi et cetera,
Speaker 10: et cetera have a larger marketing and lobbying budget than
Speaker 10: the military industrial complex? Do I need to make do
Speaker 10: I have to make myself any more clear than this.
Speaker 10: Of course there's a fucking marketing and lobbying budget. Of
Speaker 10: course they deplatform. And if you think they don't go
Speaker 10: harder than that, if you think that they don't take
Speaker 10: people out that oppose wars, well you just got to
Speaker 10: go back through history. There's plenty of examples, folks. So
Speaker 10: I rest my case. I think that there's an opera
Speaker 10: being ran, and I think that it's essentially a pressure
Speaker 10: campaign that's trying to turn down the volume on Dave Smith.
Speaker 10: Here's the beautiful thing. It's doing the exact opposite. This
Speaker 10: is striis and effect all day. And what's even better
Speaker 10: is it is now. As I said earlier, it has
Speaker 10: distilled who's worth listening to. Should you take Sam Harris
Speaker 10: or Constantin Kissen or Douglas Murray or any of these
Speaker 10: guys seriously on really anything moving forward, Well that's for
Speaker 10: you to decide, but I'll tell you personally, I'm gonna
Speaker 10: take them with a grain of salt because I don't
Speaker 10: think that they're I don't think that they're sincere actors.
Speaker 10: I think that they are basically hired guns. Why should
Speaker 10: I take them seriously moving forward? On the inverse of that,
Speaker 10: As I said, it distills who should be listened to
Speaker 10: as well, not just who shouldn't be And I think
Speaker 10: Brett Weinstein has risen to the occasion and he ought
Speaker 10: to grow in influence and grow an audience. And I
Speaker 10: think that's the beautiful thing about this entire ecosystem. And
Speaker 10: this is actually the beautiful thing about open dialogue and
Speaker 10: debate is that it enables us as an audience. Because sure,
Speaker 10: I'm a podcaster, but I'm also a fan of podcasts
Speaker 10: and I listened to him tremendously, I like a lot
Speaker 10: is that this is what we as an audience ought
Speaker 10: to be doing. Is we ought to be actually checking
Speaker 10: the track record of the people that we listen to,
Speaker 10: and if they lead you astray time and time again,
Speaker 10: well then fucking stop listening to him. Like there's so
Speaker 10: many options. That's the cool thing about the free market.
Speaker 10: That's the cool thing about a competitive marketplace of ideas.
Speaker 10: Who is best at this. The reason I'm like a
Speaker 10: lot of people think that, you know, I go hard
Speaker 10: in the paint and I defend Dave Smith because he's
Speaker 10: you know, he's helped my career or something, or because
Speaker 10: he's my friend. It's like, sure, that's certainly the friend
Speaker 10: part is true, because he's helped my career is not
Speaker 10: the reason. Just being honest, It's not like the reason
Speaker 10: I defend Dave so aggressively is because he's been right
Speaker 10: about everything for a decade. That's why this is the
Speaker 10: same reason I like, I've never even met Joe Rogan,
Speaker 10: I still very much defended him when CNN was making
Speaker 10: his face jaundiced and saying he's on XYZ drugs and
Speaker 10: he's killing people with his mis and disinformation. I defended
Speaker 10: Joe Rogan not because it was gonna help my career.
Speaker 10: I could have never even dreamt of being on his
Speaker 10: show at that time, not because he's my friend, but
Speaker 10: because I recognize value in what he does, because it's
Speaker 10: valuable to an audience to have open dialogue with sometimes
Speaker 10: contrarian or heterodox views that helped me distill the truth
Speaker 10: for myself before the expert class permits it to be
Speaker 10: known to the general public. And I've done that time
Speaker 10: and time again as a consequence of that. So, as
Speaker 10: I said, that's the main reason I go hard in
Speaker 10: the paint for Dave Smith. Yes, I'm a loyal friend,
Speaker 10: and yes, I would defend him even if I thought
Speaker 10: he was wrong. I'd probably defend him, but not nearly
Speaker 10: as aggressively as I have been because he is fucking right.
Speaker 10: That's the reason I go hard in the pain. And
Speaker 10: that's the reason everybody that is a fan of day
Speaker 10: Smith ought to be doing the same. And I know
Speaker 10: that sounds kind of like cult defend your guy thing,
Speaker 10: but like when you see an operation that's being ran
Speaker 10: by a bunch of bunch of very influential people, I mean,
Speaker 10: these are not like small timers. These are million follower accounts,
Speaker 10: hundreds of thousands of viewers and listeners and blah blah blah,
Speaker 10: and they're all besmirching his name and they're all not
Speaker 10: making an argument. They're all just lying. So I think
Speaker 10: it's really important. Like we're in an information war, that's
Speaker 10: what this is. And they're also deploying bot networks and
Speaker 10: everything else, so it's like, yeah, let's let's show organic
Speaker 10: support for our guys. I do the same thing if
Speaker 10: they were coming after Scott Horton because he's right about everything,
Speaker 10: and yes he's also my friend. That's not the reason though,
Speaker 10: It's because he's right about everything, and the message matters
Speaker 10: and they're lying. So why shouldn't we engage in this?
Speaker 10: Why shouldn't we get in the trenches like this is
Speaker 10: an information war? Fucking back up your people. You don't
Speaker 10: need to call for reinforce. I'm already there. And what
Speaker 10: did Tim Dillon say? He said, deporting them for criticizing
Speaker 10: a foreign government seems to feed into the conspiracy theories
Speaker 10: that the United States is doing things on the behest
Speaker 10: of Israel or at the behest of Israel. It's like
Speaker 10: we are Donald Trump is It's just the truth that
Speaker 10: doesn't It's not anti Semitic. Dave Smith would say it too.
Speaker 10: Does that do you think that he hates himself as
Speaker 10: a consequence, No, he's just for real America first. That's it.
Speaker 10: So am I I could I can open up every
Speaker 10: single discussion about Israel and its influence in America, and
Speaker 10: I could start it by saying, love Jewish people. I
Speaker 10: do got no beef. Brett Weisign love him, Dave Smith,
Speaker 10: love him, lots lots of Jewish friends growing up too.
Speaker 10: I've got no beef. But I don't like having a
Speaker 10: foreign country that influences my nation. And I don't like
Speaker 10: having a foreign country, whatever country it is that bankrupts
Speaker 10: my country or sacrifices tens of thousands of my fellows lives,
Speaker 10: I don't like it. Oh might I add I also
Speaker 10: don't like killing millions of innocent people. So I don't
Speaker 10: care what the religion of your fucking country is. I
Speaker 10: don't give a shit about that. What I care about
Speaker 10: is the influence is creating evil. It's creating evil actions,
Speaker 10: and I want to stop it, and I have to
Speaker 10: talk about that honestly, or I should just hang it up.
Speaker 10: There's no reason to me for me to be doing
Speaker 10: this If I can't just tell you the truth, that's
Speaker 10: the truth. I want to stop doing that. And I
Speaker 10: have to acknowledge the catalyst for those misguided decisions. And
Speaker 10: I don't think that it's a secret anymore. I've shown
Speaker 10: you the clips Natanya who talking to our Congress for decades, decades,
Speaker 10: Ron's days away and the reason I think that there's
Speaker 10: a grander op And I've already explained this in the
Speaker 10: prior episode. But now over the past twenty four hours
Speaker 10: there's been reports from I think it was MPR. I
Speaker 10: forget who was reporting on it, but they were saying
Speaker 10: that heg Seth is like they are looking for a
Speaker 10: replacement for Pete Hegseth. Well, if the New York Times
Speaker 10: article is accurate, which I tend to believe it is
Speaker 10: because of the smear pieces that are coming out about
Speaker 10: Hegseth over the past twenty four to forty eight hours,
Speaker 10: is that heg Seth was one of the guys as
Speaker 10: a Secretary of Defense who's saying, let's not bomb the
Speaker 10: nuclear facilities. Let's let's give you know, negotiations and diplomacy
Speaker 10: a chance. Suddenly within a week of that, there's a
Speaker 10: bunch of reports about how, oh he's you know, the
Speaker 10: signal chat and this and that, and he's been messaging
Speaker 10: the many strike strike details to his wife or his
Speaker 10: girlfriend or whatever. It's like, all right, maybe that's all true.
Speaker 10: I don't even know obviously, how could I know. But
Speaker 10: if it is true that he's the one, he's one
Speaker 10: of the roadblocks to bombing Iran, well I'm gonna get
Speaker 10: his back because I don't really care about, you know,
Speaker 10: state secrets when it comes to a illegal, unconstitutional, undeclared
Speaker 10: war in Yemen, Like that's that's something that shouldn't be happening.
Speaker 10: So like, I'm not saying Hegset's my guy. I'm not
Speaker 10: saying he's anti war. I'm saying he's an ally in
Speaker 10: this moment. If it's true that he's actually a roadblock
Speaker 10: to bombing Iran, well I'm gonna get his back because
Speaker 10: guess what, Trumpe ain't gonna replace him with a less
Speaker 10: war friendly guy. Right. Do you think that the media
Speaker 10: is circling the wagon? And it's not just been Heseth
Speaker 10: by the way it's been I think two or three
Speaker 10: of his assistants, his like high level assistance, have also
Speaker 10: been under investigation and getting kicked out too. So and
Speaker 10: here's the crazy thing. It was Waltz, the security advisor,
Speaker 10: who's the one who put Goldberg the reporter in the
Speaker 10: original group chat where all of this information was transmitted.
Speaker 10: Why is Waltz not the one being kicked out? Why
Speaker 10: are the news organizations not pushing to see Waltz evicted?
Speaker 10: It's all about Hegseth. Well, guess what. According to the
Speaker 10: New York Times reporting, it was Waltz and Rubio who
Speaker 10: were like, bombs away, baby, and heck Seth was like,
Speaker 10: I don't think so. And they're like, oh, well, guess what. Now,
Speaker 10: all of our you know, top notch investigative reporters aka
Speaker 10: propagandists over at WAPPO or New York Times are gonna,
Speaker 10: you know, sink you. So I think that's that's the
Speaker 10: real danger that we're facing. And just to show you
Speaker 10: that maybe I'm not a crazy person, here's another thing
Speaker 10: that Brett Weinstein said today. Hypothesis the US is being
Speaker 10: steered into war with Iran, a reboot of a plan
Speaker 10: from the nineties that was shelved when the Iraq quagmire
Speaker 10: discredited the architects. For a reboot to work, the alternative
Speaker 10: media space must be controlled, hence the battle over Joe
Speaker 10: Rogan and standards Bingo. Now, I'll be the first to
Speaker 10: admit pure confirmation bias. That's my hypothesis. But I just
Speaker 10: like it when I see someone else, who I trust,
Speaker 10: who I respect, who I think has a you know,
Speaker 10: good analytical mind, come to the same kind of general
Speaker 10: hypothesis that I've come to. And I think that if you're,
Speaker 10: as I said in the prior episode, like I'm connecting
Speaker 10: some dots here. This is not definitive, but I think
Speaker 10: we're all kind of sensing it like the war drums.
Speaker 10: They do be a beaten and suddenly there's this big
Speaker 10: cancel mob that's out to get someone like Dave Smith,
Speaker 10: who normally is dismissed. I mean, if you remember, Ben
Speaker 10: Shapiro would be talking about Dave without bringing him up.
Speaker 10: By the way, Douglas Murray went on Bill Maher, they
Speaker 10: talked about the debate, mentioned Joe Rogan a bunch of times,
Speaker 10: never once mentioned Dave's name. So he's kind of like
Speaker 10: this Voldemort figure where everybody knows who he is, but
Speaker 10: no one wants to say his name, which I love
Speaker 10: because I'm like that they're talking about my friend. But
Speaker 10: it's just it's just indicative of how powerful what he's
Speaker 10: doing and what he has to say is, in my opinion,
Speaker 10: because it's like they can't contend with his arguments. They
Speaker 10: sit there, they try, they fail, and then the only
Speaker 10: like respite that they get is to go on to
Speaker 10: corporate media outlets that Dave doesn't have access to and
Speaker 10: then to shit talking and they're like we win, just
Speaker 10: pat ourselves on the back. It's like, well, actually, within
Speaker 10: the fire, you couldn't contend. And I think that this
Speaker 10: is a much bigger trend the comedic world is what's
Speaker 10: now adopting this as a consequence, in my opinion in
Speaker 10: port because of what Dave's doing. Listen to what Andrew
Speaker 10: Schultz had to said.
Speaker 4: The state of Israel's the single greatest garent tour.
Speaker 6: Israel serves as an example over the course of the
Speaker 6: last year for the rest of Western civilization.
Speaker 5: Yeah wait a minute, crazy, I was so, is the
Speaker 5: Daily Wire an American media platform or is it an
Speaker 5: Israeli media platform? If the rule is, I'm just saying,
Speaker 5: if the rule is, you cannot be critical because he
Speaker 5: has no problem being very critical of America. Yeah, critical
Speaker 5: of the last in America. Left is half the country
Speaker 5: has no problem in this rating has But you can't
Speaker 5: criticiz Israel as a country that's just another country unless
Speaker 5: you're saying, and you are clearly admitting that the Daily
Speaker 5: Wire is an arm of the Israeli propaganda machine. Flump
Speaker 5: is that are you manipulating the religious right in America
Speaker 5: so these two can take all their money and then
Speaker 5: in the process restricting free speech one of the core
Speaker 5: tenets of the American identity.
Speaker 1: Ben Ben beno, Benjamin ben what is happening?
Speaker 5: There's Trouble in Paradise.
Speaker 10: It's one thing when you have Nick Foontz, Ryan Dawson
Speaker 10: or some of those figures that are talking like that.
Speaker 10: It's a totally different thing when you have a bunch
Speaker 10: of guys with like a dozen Netflix specials that are
Speaker 10: saying this to the audience of millions that are dominant
Speaker 10: on YouTube, dominant in the comedy space, dominant in the
Speaker 10: podcast world, like massively influential. And the reason that they're
Speaker 10: saying it, I don't think it's because it's increasingly popular,
Speaker 10: though Dave is certainly popularizing it, but because these guys
Speaker 10: are just truth tellers, Like they're just interested in the truth,
Speaker 10: and it just becomes obvious, like Ben Shapiro is a
Speaker 10: gifted speaker. But when you espouse something and then you
Speaker 10: do something that's contradictory or you say something that's contradictory
Speaker 10: to some of the other foundational things that you've laid out,
Speaker 10: people start to notice it. They go, Hey, you sure
Speaker 10: you sure that you're like really right? Or die from
Speaker 10: America because I'm not getting that vibe from you, homeboy,
Speaker 10: what are you talking about? And I think that's why
Speaker 10: Tim Dillon and Andrew Schultz All of these guys, by
Speaker 10: the way, are friends with Dave and Rogan, and it's like,
Speaker 10: this is a trend that they are very fucking disturbed by,
Speaker 10: And I don't blame them. If I was on that
Speaker 10: side of the battle lines, i'd be disturbed too. But
Speaker 10: I personally am thrilled about it because this is the
Speaker 10: debate that we ought to be having, and honestly, we
Speaker 10: ought to be having it in what I think is
Speaker 10: a much more respectable fashion where you actually sit down
Speaker 10: and you actually debate someone like that or Scott Horton
Speaker 10: for that matter, Like they're not going to run away
Speaker 10: from it, so take them on. And even when Dave's
Speaker 10: not there, brogan saying stuff like.
Speaker 2: This, Israel's going to go into Palestine already bombing, and
Speaker 2: their world is killing people. Their world is controlling resources
Speaker 2: and it's not They don't play fair, like they release
Speaker 2: stories that aren't true, they use disinformation to switch narratives,
Speaker 2: They have social media posts that aren't real so they
Speaker 2: can get people riled up about certain things, and then
Speaker 2: they're also coordinating military attacks. That's their world. We just
Speaker 2: don't think about that world because we're not in that world.
Speaker 2: But people have been in that world since the beginning
Speaker 2: of time. What they've done with us is they've sheltered
Speaker 2: us in such a way and then censored all the
Speaker 2: mainstream media in such a way that they completely control
Speaker 2: the narrative.
Speaker 10: So obviously it's having a lasting impact on Rogan. And
Speaker 10: even when Dave Smith isn't there, or Candae Owns or
Speaker 10: whoever else, he's going to continue to have these ideas
Speaker 10: in his mind. And if you have someone that comes
Speaker 10: in then that's aggressively pro war, he's gonna he's gonna
Speaker 10: fire back. He's going to be thinking about these things.
Speaker 10: That's powerful. And this is why I think it's so
Speaker 10: important that we kind of circle the wagons and defend
Speaker 10: Dave and defend Rogan in this moment. Not that they
Speaker 10: need a ton of defense, because I think they'll be fine,
Speaker 10: but just to like be in the fight, be in
Speaker 10: the fight alongside them, and it's not you don't always
Speaker 10: have to debate, you don't always have to be serious.
Speaker 10: Just taking the piss out of these guys is kind
Speaker 10: of a good way to defeat them, which is what
Speaker 10: Rogan and Tim Dillon did yesterday.
Speaker 9: Check it out.
Speaker 2: Have you been there?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 9: That's a good point.
Speaker 5: Have you even you haven't been.
Speaker 6: How is he and all these war? Can I just
Speaker 6: go to wars? By the way, how are you? Are
Speaker 6: you allowed to just go to wars?
Speaker 1: Is the can you just go to?
Speaker 7: Want to see of going? Can I just go to wars?
Speaker 6: Or do I have to come back and say what
Speaker 6: people want me to say about the wars? Can I
Speaker 6: go to the wars and have my own opinions or
Speaker 6: do I have to have.
Speaker 5: The opinions you want to go back?
Speaker 7: That's right, that's right.
Speaker 6: I like the idea of going to a war and
Speaker 6: then coming back having a.
Speaker 7: Very black and white view.
Speaker 4: I've been there, I get it.
Speaker 7: And I know and and interesting, Okay, I like that.
Speaker 9: I like that.
Speaker 14: I love that you feel better than the other people.
Speaker 6: Well, of course there's a lot of people. It gets
Speaker 6: very murky. Most people I know that have been to
Speaker 6: war have a very murky complex view of things. But
Speaker 6: it is good to go to a war and then
Speaker 6: come back and be as sure as you were before
Speaker 6: you came.
Speaker 10: And you don't have to go for very long.
Speaker 7: No, you go for an hour, a couple hours.
Speaker 6: It's a lunch.
Speaker 10: So, as I told you, guys at the very end
Speaker 10: of my last episode, I had it on good authority
Speaker 10: that Rogan was aware of what was happening and he
Speaker 10: was not taking it kindly. Well, I was right, That's
Speaker 10: why he's taking the piss out of Douglas Murray, and
Speaker 10: rightfully so. They don't like the condescension. These are fucking red,
Speaker 10: white and Blue Americans, ladies and gentlemen. They like open dialogue,
Speaker 10: they like genuine arguments and good faith arguments. And Murray
Speaker 10: failed on all accounts. And now you've got Tim Dillon, Rogan,
Speaker 10: a bunch of other people that are going to be
Speaker 10: taking the piss out of it. I mean, honestly, Douglas
Speaker 10: Murray is a well known figure, but I'm not sure
Speaker 10: that he will ever be better known for anything than.
Speaker 14: Have you been there?
Speaker 10: Like that is that is not going to leave him,
Speaker 10: That's going to stick to him like glue. And that's beautiful,
Speaker 10: Like that's how you actually kind of rip the veneer
Speaker 10: off of these fucking fraudulent propagandist people. I think Tim
Speaker 10: Dillon's point at the end of that is so brilliant.
Speaker 10: Most of the people I know that have been to
Speaker 10: war have a very nuanced view of it, you know,
Speaker 10: and if you talk to military veterans, most of them,
Speaker 10: even if they went in you know, gung ho, and
Speaker 10: they come out still confident about what they did there,
Speaker 10: they still have a very different view from before and after.
Speaker 10: To a man, they all have a different perspective on
Speaker 10: what transpired, and a big percentage of them have a
Speaker 10: perspective that goes, yeah, I think we got lied to, man.
Speaker 10: I think a bunch of that was a fucking lie.
Speaker 10: And I think that some of them also feel as
Speaker 10: if what they did was not a good thing. A
Speaker 10: lot of the Libertarians that are military veterans feel that way.
Speaker 10: So I know a lot of those people. I'm not
Speaker 10: just making it up. And I think Tim Dillon's point
Speaker 10: is well taken. That you know, Douglas Murray's been, He's
Speaker 10: been to Godz, He's bean to Ukraine. But if you
Speaker 10: actually talk to the people on the front lines, the
Speaker 10: Ukrainian soldiers that are trying desperately not to get black
Speaker 10: bagged and thrown in a van and then put on
Speaker 10: the front line with a clock ticking as to how
Speaker 10: long they're going to exist on this earth, Yeah, it's
Speaker 10: a very different thing from the way Douglas Murray talks
Speaker 10: about it, and I think, as I've demonstrated in the
Speaker 10: prior episode, the reason for that is that he is
Speaker 10: a paid propagandist. That's my opinion.
Speaker 6: Prove it.
Speaker 10: But sitting on an NGO and telling me that I
Speaker 10: don't know Dougie, I don't know buddy boy. And one
Speaker 10: other little bit of insight for you guys, I don't
Speaker 10: know if I should be talking about this, but I'm
Speaker 10: going to because I don't. I just say whatever's on
Speaker 10: my mind. There is a serious effort to get people
Speaker 10: of influence to Israel. And I think probably some of
Speaker 10: you already aware of this, but being in this world
Speaker 10: that I'm in now, I've seen it firsthand. I have
Speaker 10: seen figures. I'm not going to name any names because
Speaker 10: I'm not trying to like burn Bridges, but people I
Speaker 10: know have been and talking to other people that I
Speaker 10: know right in front of me, have invited them to
Speaker 10: go to Israel to tour it. The obvious intention with
Speaker 10: that is that, well, you kind of get the Douglas
Speaker 10: Murray treatment. You go there. It's like all expenses paid,
Speaker 10: You get to have the time of your life. They
Speaker 10: give you a very curated view of everything and then
Speaker 10: you come back and then when people start to ask you, like,
Speaker 10: how do you feel about Israel? Israel's fucking great man
Speaker 10: had an incredible vacation there. This is not to say
Speaker 10: that Israel is not a great place. Maybe it is.
Speaker 10: I haven't been, but there's an obvious influence and propaganda
Speaker 10: campaign that has been being ran for decades across Hollywood
Speaker 10: music industry and now the podcast world. And I'm talking
Speaker 10: about podcasters. I just want to be very clear. These
Speaker 10: are podcasters that are basically advised or offered or gifted
Speaker 10: these trips to go there with the expectation that they're
Speaker 10: going to come back and they're going to give more
Speaker 10: favorable coverage to that country. And I don't know about you,
Speaker 10: but if if the CCP was hitting up Joe Rogan
Speaker 10: and saying, Hey, buddy, I want to bring you into Shanghai.
Speaker 10: I'm going to give you an all expenses paid trip.
Speaker 10: We're gonna have a bunch of bunch of attractive ladies
Speaker 10: that'll meet you when you get off the plane, and
Speaker 10: we're gonna go to the clubs and we're gonna do
Speaker 10: this and that, and then yeah, just have a good one.
Speaker 10: You'd be like, why are you doing that?
Speaker 9: Right?
Speaker 10: What the fuck are you doing that? It's like, well,
Speaker 10: the answer is obvious, because they want you to speak
Speaker 10: positively about their country to your enormous American audience and
Speaker 10: basically serve as an arm of their propaganda campaign against
Speaker 10: domestic population. Could it be any more fucking obvious? That's
Speaker 10: what's happening. So, yeah, that happens in this world. That happens,
Speaker 10: and I think you should know that. So when you
Speaker 10: see guys that are talking out of what seems to
Speaker 10: contrast with some of their prior espouse beliefs, and then
Speaker 10: when it comes to that one country, they just go, oh,
Speaker 10: not that one though, There's a reason, and I think
Speaker 10: you ought to be paying attention to it and maybe
Speaker 10: changing your opinion on the people that don't speak to
Speaker 10: you honestly and in a consistent, logical fashion, because when
Speaker 10: you start to sense that someone is not being rational
Speaker 10: and logical on every issue, when it comes to this
Speaker 10: one issue, there might be an underlying reason. And I've
Speaker 10: just told you what it is.
Speaker 7: You have anything nice to say about his room, I'm
Speaker 7: waiting for the money. I texted Parry Wise ago. Here's
Speaker 7: the way this game works.
Speaker 6: I get a little bit of money.
Speaker 2: First.
Speaker 6: If Israel said to a fundamental Christian, if now called
Speaker 6: my company said we're gonna have the new Kiran, he'd go.
Speaker 5: Let's do it.
Speaker 6: That's what Jesus, let's do it. That's what Jesus would want.
Speaker 6: A nuclear war. So that's where we've gotten.
Speaker 2: Jesus wants us to use the nukes.
Speaker 14: As soon as it's ideological, you can justify anything. This
Speaker 14: is how how tch Americans are justifying well excuses people
Speaker 14: as human shields. Like they'll say things like that, like
Speaker 14: it's the way you can justify mass murder. It's the
Speaker 14: way you can justify anything.
Speaker 10: So I wasn't making it up. Tim Dillon just confirmed
Speaker 10: it right there. Barry Weiss's a friend of his, but
Speaker 10: sounds as if she's probably been offering to give him
Speaker 10: a trip over to Tel Aviv too, and he's like, nah,
Speaker 10: I need that money first. I think he's kidding about that.
Speaker 10: But I just wanted to point out influential people, actors, comedians, whatever, musicians, politicians,
Speaker 10: y'all get a free trip and we all expect something
Speaker 10: in return, don't we. We're not doing it for fucking
Speaker 10: just good of our heart. I doubt that I saved
Speaker 10: it for the end, because I know most of you'll
Speaker 10: just shut the show off as soon as I start
Speaker 10: playing this. But Sam Harris had on Douglas Murray today
Speaker 10: and this is what they had to say. You know,
Speaker 10: Dave Smith's non expertise is a complete failure to appreciate
Speaker 10: the reality of jihadism and just what Israel is actually
Speaker 10: dealing with in Hamaz.
Speaker 13: I believe that it's also a strain of anti Americanism
Speaker 13: and anti Westernism, which is a belief that nobody in
Speaker 13: the world can do something wrong and bad unless we
Speaker 13: have somehow pushed them to it.
Speaker 10: That's not at all my belief. I'm not going to
Speaker 10: speak for every libertarian and you know, Dave or anybody else,
Speaker 10: but I'll just say I am not a fan of
Speaker 10: radical jihad. Do I need to say that? I guess
Speaker 10: I'll say it, but it should kind of go without saying.
Speaker 10: But here's the issue, though, and this is factually true.
Speaker 10: The Israelis and the American intelligence community Pentagon State Department
Speaker 10: have uplifted the more radical elements of Islam time and
Speaker 10: time again as part of the Clean Break memo. Like
Speaker 10: this is what they were doing tactically. So the fact
Speaker 10: that they then turn around and use this as a
Speaker 10: reason that we need to be as Islamophobic as possible
Speaker 10: is not rational, and it leaves out a very big
Speaker 10: factor which Dave would immediately fire at him if they
Speaker 10: were debating this issue right now, is that it's not
Speaker 10: to say that there is no evil that's done across
Speaker 10: the rest of the world that isn't a direct response
Speaker 10: to the American Empire. That's obviously nonsense, but it's also
Speaker 10: nonsense to pretend as if there is no impact from
Speaker 10: American foreign policy. I mean, how many democratically elected leaders
Speaker 10: have been toppled by our intelligence community, if not our
Speaker 10: pentagon over the past fifty years. It's astronomical. It's like
Speaker 10: dozens and dozens and dozens. So yeah, there's a big impact.
Speaker 10: And if you're going to continue to topple people's leadership,
Speaker 10: at some point they're going to get really upset with
Speaker 10: you and they might do fucking crazy stuff. So you
Speaker 10: have to include both sides of that. Yes, there is
Speaker 10: an organic ideology that I'm not fond of, and also
Speaker 10: there are actions that contribute to that ideology taking hold
Speaker 10: and growing.
Speaker 13: It's a profound and deep anti Americanism, which I cannot
Speaker 13: sign up for I will know profound anti Westnism. I
Speaker 13: completely reject this, and I reject it for many reasons,
Speaker 13: but one is that similar riding shotgun with the claim
Speaker 13: that only the West, only America, can lead anyone to
Speaker 13: do bad things is what you rightly identify sam as
Speaker 13: the utter inability to recognize that some people seek utterly
Speaker 13: different things that we do.
Speaker 10: That line at the end is just mystifying to me.
Speaker 10: I mean, certainly, the non inventionalst Libertarians are not a galitarian.
Speaker 10: We do not believe that all cultures are equal, and
Speaker 10: there are certainly cultures across the world that I am
Speaker 10: not fond of and that would brutalize me if they
Speaker 10: had the opportunity to. So that's not the point. All
Speaker 10: I'm arguing is I don't want to be at war
Speaker 10: with them. They're six seven, eight thousand miles away. So
Speaker 10: we can have that difference of opinion and difference of
Speaker 10: belief or faith or cultural framework or anything else. It's
Speaker 10: not relevant to me. It might be relevant if your
Speaker 10: primary concern is Israel, then it might be relevant, but
Speaker 10: it ain't relevant to me. I'm an American and I'm
Speaker 10: far the fuck away from there, So why am I
Speaker 10: funding this? Right? But here's the part that really drives
Speaker 10: me nuts, And this is a consistent retort that libertarians,
Speaker 10: non inventionists broadly receive all the time, is that we
Speaker 10: are un American, that we are not fond of America,
Speaker 10: that we hate America. Like couldn't be further from the truth.
Speaker 10: I love this country. I love the cultural framework, I
Speaker 10: love the ideologies that founded this country. I love the
Speaker 10: Constitution of the Bill of Rights. A lot of libertarians
Speaker 10: get mad at me for that because it's a you know,
Speaker 10: it's a dead document and it's not worth the fucking
Speaker 10: parchment it was written on. I get it, I get it,
Speaker 10: I get it. I'm just saying the ideas are beautiful,
Speaker 10: Like you have to acknowledge that those ideas are beautiful.
Speaker 10: So I love this country. I'm just very very clear
Speaker 10: about that. What I don't love is some of the
Speaker 10: actions of my government. I love America, I love Americans.
Speaker 10: I don't love my government all the time. Rarely, in fact,
Speaker 10: almost never, and especially when it comes to foreign policy.
Speaker 10: It's been disastrous and it has devastated what I love
Speaker 10: about America. The constant expenditures, blood and treasure that has
Speaker 10: gone into police the world and dominating the world has
Speaker 10: been to the detriment of the domestic population, to our
Speaker 10: cultural framework. So much of this that we lament when
Speaker 10: it comes to our cultural breakdown is a consequence of
Speaker 10: the warfare of the empire. Do you think that?
Speaker 9: I mean?
Speaker 10: Europe's a great example of this which Douglas Murray has
Speaker 10: no capacity for self reflection. He has advocated for every war.
Speaker 10: The toppling of Gaddafi and Libya and Saddam Hussein in Iraq,
Speaker 10: Kadafi and Libya in particular was like the lynchpin that
Speaker 10: prevented African migration into Europe. As soon as he was gone,
Speaker 10: it was a deluge. And then he writes books talking
Speaker 10: about the deluge of immigrants and how this has to stop. Motherfucker,
Speaker 10: you created it. They weren't all trying to get to
Speaker 10: Europe before that. They are because you destroy their country. Dumb,
Speaker 10: dumb central banking. The inflation has made it so that
Speaker 10: we can't have have one parent staying home with their kids.
Speaker 10: It's hurt our opportunities and our chances of buying a home,
Speaker 10: starting a family, having a cohesive family unit, which creates
Speaker 10: kind of a foundational building block for a good cultural framework.
Speaker 10: All of this has been damaged not just for empire,
Speaker 10: but by central banking. But the central banking is the
Speaker 10: prerequisite for the empire, and therefore they all tie into
Speaker 10: one another. Therefore, to oppose it is not to hate America,
Speaker 10: but to love it. In fact, I would argue the
Speaker 10: opposite that if you don't hate the empire, you probably
Speaker 10: don't really love America, or at least you don't understand
Speaker 10: what is necessary for America to stay standing. You don't
Speaker 10: agree with me on this, that's fine, but I hope
Speaker 10: you'll reflect on the points I'm making that as a
Speaker 10: consequence of our empire building thirty seven almost thirty seven
Speaker 10: trillion in debt over a trillion in interest per year,
Speaker 10: that we're just burning with a federal government that spends
Speaker 10: only six to seven trillion, which by the way, is
Speaker 10: more than it takes in in taxes, So therefore there's
Speaker 10: already deficit, and then we're going to expend another trillion
Speaker 10: on interest alone. At some point this becomes totally unsustainable
Speaker 10: and everything starts to collapse. So when people say, well, sure,
Speaker 10: the American Empire has some mistakes and missteps. But would
Speaker 10: you prefer that China control the world. What about Russia?
Speaker 10: It's like, no, that's not what I'm arguing. What I'm
Speaker 10: arguing is empire destroys your country. It does inevitably. Sure,
Speaker 10: for a time you get the knock on benefits of
Speaker 10: having the reserve currency or whatever else. I'm not saying
Speaker 10: it's not without some benefit, but as a consequence of
Speaker 10: being the reserve currency, we've now exported our fiat currency abroad.
Speaker 10: Along with that, when our jobs, our industry, or quality
Speaker 10: of living, and then our cultural framework starts to degrade
Speaker 10: as a consequence of that. So if China wants to
Speaker 10: take that on, have at it, it'll be their demise too.
Speaker 10: Russia wants to take it on, have at it, it'll
Speaker 10: be their device too, not to mention they don't have
Speaker 10: the capacity to do it, and also they've just watched
Speaker 10: us destroy ourselves with that same paradigm. I think that
Speaker 10: the more logical answer to this is that hopefully some
Speaker 10: empire doesn't step into the void and be this militaristic
Speaker 10: empire that we've dealt with with America leading that way,
Speaker 10: but rather regional hedgemons, and while we're at it, Let's
Speaker 10: try and keep what made America special, free speech, ability
Speaker 10: to defend ourselves, property rights, all things that are being
Speaker 10: jeopardized as a consequence of being an empire and working
Speaker 10: at the behest of a country that is not America,
Speaker 10: which is exactly what Douglas Murray espouses. And let me
Speaker 10: just finish by saying, it's going beyond words that a
Speaker 10: British guy who has no experience being an American. Have
Speaker 10: you ever been an American, Dougie? Have you ever been
Speaker 10: an American at all? Douglas, No, you haven't, so you're
Speaker 10: not an expert on being an American, so you can't
Speaker 10: tell me what being Unamerican is or anti West. Fuck
Speaker 10: you eat shit. I ended another episode with that. I'm sorry, God,
Speaker 10: I gotta come up with a better catchphrase. I really
Speaker 10: don't like that guy. We're gonna get into regular news
Speaker 10: after this, I swear to God, But I really I
Speaker 10: think this is a very important moment in the fact
Speaker 10: that it's circulating around a debate that matters a lot.
Speaker 10: Does America first mean America first or second? That's what's
Speaker 10: really going down here. If you're going to be passing
Speaker 10: hate speech laws and doing all sorts of things to
Speaker 10: the benefit of another country. Well, then expect pushback, and
Speaker 10: don't you dare lecture me about being Unamerican as a
Speaker 10: consequence of that. I believe in equal treatment under the law.
Speaker 10: That's not Unamerican. That is American. I believe in free speech.
Speaker 10: That's not Unamerican, it is American. I believe in non intervention.
Speaker 10: George Washington talked about entangling alliances. John Adams did the same,
Speaker 10: Samuel all of them, They all fucking said the same thing.
Speaker 10: If you build an empire, you will not have a republic. Choose.
Speaker 10: I'm choosing the republic. That doesn't make me un American.
Speaker 10: How dare you? How dare you?
Speaker 9: Have you even been there? How dare you?
Speaker 10: Well? You can have your fucking fancy accent and your
Speaker 10: suits and your novels. But I'll sit here in a
Speaker 10: beanie and a T shirt and I'll chew your non
Speaker 10: arguments up all day long and spit them back out,
Speaker 10: because that's being an American. If you guys enjoyed the show,
Speaker 10: I want to support my work at Liberty lockbot on X.
Speaker 10: Subscribe there, I'll follow you back. Liberty Lockdown is the
Speaker 10: show If you want to subscribe. On audio podcasters, we're
Speaker 10: almost at one thousand reviews like twenty away, So if
Speaker 10: you guys can go leave a five star review on
Speaker 10: Apple Podcasts, I really appreciate it. Spotify reviews are also helpful,
Speaker 10: so if you listen on either of those right now,
Speaker 10: please do leave a five star review. It's the easiest
Speaker 10: way to help with the algos. Very few shows get
Speaker 10: to a thousand review so it'd be really cool if
Speaker 10: I could hit that mark this month. And we just
Speaker 10: broke twenty five thousand subscribers on YouTube. We did one
Speaker 10: hundred and ten thousand viewers over the past month. I
Speaker 10: only do two shows a week, so that's really cool
Speaker 10: and I've never done that before, especially not with any
Speaker 10: major guests on over the past month. So this is
Speaker 10: all you guys do. This is all you guys sharing
Speaker 10: the show, telling people, and couldn't couldn't be more appreciative,
Speaker 10: And I hope that I can continue to deliver, you
Speaker 10: know whatever, this is to the best of my ability
Speaker 10: and I will see so please quick reminder before I leave,
Speaker 10: go to my pillow dot com pick up them geeza
Speaker 10: sheets be fucking swell like Mike Lindell gets swoll like,
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Speaker 10: Get you some cozy, Get you a big old pillow,
Speaker 10: and just remember that Clint Russell sent you promo code
Speaker 10: lockdown my pillow dot com. Get you some cozy? Are
Speaker 10: you suggestingly invited the nine to eleven.
Speaker 4: Attacks, sir?
Speaker 12: I'm suggesting that we listen to the people who attacked
Speaker 12: us and the reason they did it, and they are
Speaker 12: delighted that we're over there because Osama Ben Lawden has said,
Speaker 12: I am glad you're over on our sand because we
Speaker 12: can target you so much easier. They've already now since
Speaker 12: that time, have killed thirty four hundred of our men.
Speaker 12: And I don't think it was necessary.
Speaker 15: Why don't mad I have to comment on that. That's
Speaker 15: really an extraordinary statement. That's an extraordinary statement off someone
Speaker 15: who lived through the attack. Is September eleven, that we
Speaker 15: invited the attack because we were attacking Iraq. I don't
Speaker 15: think I've ever heard that before, and I've heard some
Speaker 15: pretty absurd explanations for September eleven, and I would ask
Speaker 15: the Congressman to withdraw that comment and tell us that
Speaker 15: he didn't really mean that, Congressman.
Speaker 12: I believe very sincerely that the CIA is correct when
Speaker 12: they teach and talk about blowback. When we went into
Speaker 12: Iran in nineteen fifty three and installed the Shaw, yes
Speaker 12: there was blowback. A reaction to that was the taking
Speaker 12: of our hostages, and that persists. And if we ignore that,
Speaker 12: we ignore that our own risks. If we think that
Speaker 12: we can do what we want around the world and
Speaker 12: not incite hatred, then we have a problem. They don't
Speaker 12: come here to attack us because we're rich and we're free.
Speaker 12: They attack us because we're over there. I mean, what
Speaker 12: would we think if we were if other foreign countries
Speaker 12: were doing that to us.
Speaker 3: I have almost every campus in America, the major one
Speaker 3: certainly are filled with the instances like this of Jewish
Speaker 3: students being harassed. If you stand in Britain with a
Speaker 3: Hamaz flag, you should not be allowed to be free.
Speaker 3: We should not have to put up with people marching
Speaker 3: through our streets.
Speaker 13: You should be arrested, have your citizenship withdrawn police single law.
Speaker 13: Otherwise we wouldn't have all of these videos of people
Speaker 13: inciting violence on the street. You should not be given
Speaker 13: the right to insult and to taunt what's the point
Speaker 13: of having a law if you can't believe.
Speaker 9: Tell me about this emergency Coalition against hate. People are
Speaker 9: just deciding anything I don't like I will perceive to
Speaker 9: be a crime against my particular group of people. And
Speaker 9: this is a whole industry.
Speaker 12: Now.
Speaker 9: It's an industry in the law, it's an industry in
Speaker 9: the police. People competing to be the most offended person.
Speaker 9: This is why we have the competition Olympics of offendedness,
Speaker 9: with people going to the police saying I'm the most
Speaker 9: offended person. But we've got a lot more people on
Speaker 9: the side of free speech who actually loathe these censorious bullies,
Speaker 9: who loathe their priggishness, their boringness, their bullyingness. They're endless
Speaker 9: rapidity and stupidity, their tendency to say that we have
Speaker 9: to educate themselves when they seem to have no knowledge
Speaker 9: at all. But it all comes down to one of
Speaker 9: the great gifts that Britain gave the world. The concept
Speaker 9: of liberty of speech is important not just because you
Speaker 9: need to know truthfully the widest possible array of argument,
Speaker 9: but because you need to be able to find out
Speaker 9: if you yourself are in error. Clamp down on free speech,
Speaker 9: and you do not permit yourself the ability to find
Speaker 9: out when you're wrong. That's why free speech matters. Is
Speaker 9: one of Britain's great gifts to the world, and it's
Speaker 9: something that we should protect in this generation as much
Speaker 9: as those who went before us.
Speaker 11: You are not the fuck out man.
Speaker 6: Welcome to liberty, lockdown, less deliberty and go.
Speaker 10: But yeah, it's our whole.
Speaker 9: Where did it come from and where did it go