WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.960 --> 00:00:04.559 Where's that sweet spot that sits between the customer's view 2 00:00:04.599 --> 00:00:07.400 of a great outcome and our view of a great outcome. 3 00:00:07.679 --> 00:00:11.759 And that's ultimately the individual seller's job is to try 4 00:00:11.800 --> 00:00:13.359 and merge those two together. 5 00:00:17.760 --> 00:00:20.600 You're listening to the audible Ready Podcast, the show that 6 00:00:20.640 --> 00:00:24.440 helps you and your teams sell more faster. We'll feature 7 00:00:24.480 --> 00:00:26.960 sales leaders sharing their best insights on how to create 8 00:00:27.000 --> 00:00:30.120 a sales engine that helps you fuel repeatable revenue growth. 9 00:00:30.440 --> 00:00:33.200 Presented by the team at Force Management, a leader in 10 00:00:33.280 --> 00:00:35.840 B to B sales effectiveness. Let's get started. 11 00:00:38.520 --> 00:00:41.000 Hello and welcome to the Audible Ready Sales Podcast. I'm 12 00:00:41.079 --> 00:00:43.920 Rachel Klett Miller joining me today as our own Tim Cato. 13 00:00:44.039 --> 00:00:46.240 Hi, Tim, oh, Rachel, how you doing today? 14 00:00:46.600 --> 00:00:49.039 Good good? We got a big topic today. 15 00:00:49.479 --> 00:00:52.560 Well, it's one that comes up all the time. 16 00:00:52.600 --> 00:00:55.000 Yes, and it really spawned from a webinar that we 17 00:00:55.159 --> 00:00:58.520 just did for teams that sell to the government. Now, 18 00:00:58.520 --> 00:01:00.759 if you don't sell the government, stay with me, stick 19 00:01:00.799 --> 00:01:03.479 with me, because we know that government can be a 20 00:01:03.560 --> 00:01:06.239 much different animal than straight up enterprise sales. And God 21 00:01:06.239 --> 00:01:09.959 bless the people that work those contracts and one of 22 00:01:09.959 --> 00:01:13.159 the challenges that those teams deal with in particular is 23 00:01:13.200 --> 00:01:16.959 the need and the ability to communicate back to corporate 24 00:01:17.400 --> 00:01:20.959 what those agencies need, their priorities, et cetera, in order 25 00:01:21.000 --> 00:01:25.359 to drive a great outcome in that final contract for 26 00:01:25.719 --> 00:01:28.719 your company, but also for the buyer. So as the seller, 27 00:01:28.760 --> 00:01:31.760 you have to kind of walk this walk. It's more 28 00:01:31.760 --> 00:01:34.840 of a challenge in government sales because sometimes corporate doesn't 29 00:01:34.879 --> 00:01:37.640 get all the nuances. But I know it's a challenge 30 00:01:37.640 --> 00:01:39.239 for a lot of salespeople. I mean, how many of 31 00:01:39.319 --> 00:01:41.400 us say corporate just doesn't get it. I'm on the 32 00:01:41.400 --> 00:01:44.560 phone of the customer. They don't understand, right, So we're 33 00:01:44.599 --> 00:01:46.599 going to break that down today. We're going to talk 34 00:01:46.640 --> 00:01:51.439 about communicating back to corporate. And there is a foundation 35 00:01:51.519 --> 00:01:53.599 that you need to understand as a seller to be 36 00:01:53.640 --> 00:01:57.159 able to do this well. And it starts with understanding 37 00:01:57.159 --> 00:02:00.159 the key things your company wants in a deal. So 38 00:02:00.200 --> 00:02:02.480 I want to start there, Tim, Can you talk about 39 00:02:02.920 --> 00:02:05.920 what that means kind of if we operationalize that. 40 00:02:06.480 --> 00:02:08.719 Yeah, let's frame up a couple of things here, because 41 00:02:08.719 --> 00:02:12.800 you're right by the way that webinar was on selling 42 00:02:12.960 --> 00:02:15.319 into government these days was awesome. Many of you get 43 00:02:15.360 --> 00:02:17.680 a chance to listen to that, you really should. But 44 00:02:17.879 --> 00:02:22.319 here's what's similar to that environment, that's selling environment, and 45 00:02:22.360 --> 00:02:24.680 what some of you that do not sell into the 46 00:02:24.719 --> 00:02:28.080 government might still be facing that makes this relevant. We 47 00:02:28.159 --> 00:02:32.599 would call those complex selling environments. Complex because of the 48 00:02:32.639 --> 00:02:37.520 customer's organization, Complex because of the political aspects tied to it, 49 00:02:37.560 --> 00:02:41.039 lots of different interests trying to be met, Complex because 50 00:02:41.080 --> 00:02:44.599 of the size scope challenge of the problems. Complex because 51 00:02:44.639 --> 00:02:48.000 of the competitive environment. So anyone that's selling into a 52 00:02:48.120 --> 00:02:52.319 complex environment, I think this is topic is really relevant 53 00:02:52.360 --> 00:02:55.479 because you're right, Rachel, it does come up all the time. 54 00:02:55.800 --> 00:02:58.560 And because of that, I found there are three high 55 00:02:58.680 --> 00:03:03.719 level concepts that we need to probably organize our conversation 56 00:03:03.879 --> 00:03:08.319 today around The first one i'll call two way guidance 57 00:03:08.360 --> 00:03:12.639 on a great outcome, not just us hearing from the 58 00:03:12.680 --> 00:03:16.520 customer what they want to achieve, not just us telling 59 00:03:16.560 --> 00:03:19.680 the customer what our company wants to achieve, but a 60 00:03:19.719 --> 00:03:25.280 two way back and forth exchange. Then the second concept, 61 00:03:25.719 --> 00:03:29.879 the external sale, how we manage those ideas of a 62 00:03:29.919 --> 00:03:33.319 great outcome for both sides into the conversation with customer. 63 00:03:33.759 --> 00:03:35.599 But here's the one you are I think referring to 64 00:03:35.639 --> 00:03:39.560 a minute ago, Rachel. The internal sale. You know, I 65 00:03:39.560 --> 00:03:41.400 talk to folks all the time when we do our 66 00:03:41.439 --> 00:03:45.159 negotiating program and say, what's more challenging the negotiation with 67 00:03:45.240 --> 00:03:48.520 the customer the negotiation back inside? And I'll give all 68 00:03:48.520 --> 00:03:51.520 of our listeners a big moment to think what the 69 00:03:51.560 --> 00:03:53.919 most common answer is, and of course it's the one 70 00:03:54.000 --> 00:03:57.560 back inside. So I think when we talk about from 71 00:03:57.759 --> 00:04:03.199 a seller level adual contributor level, how do those three 72 00:04:03.439 --> 00:04:06.919 concepts come into play to give us guidance on what 73 00:04:06.960 --> 00:04:10.479 we do to be able to manage both sides of 74 00:04:10.520 --> 00:04:12.960 the equation we're sitting in the middle of in a 75 00:04:13.039 --> 00:04:14.400 complex selling environment. 76 00:04:15.000 --> 00:04:17.920 Yeah so, and then that's kind of the level set. 77 00:04:18.000 --> 00:04:22.000 And once you kind of assess what your company needs 78 00:04:22.040 --> 00:04:26.519 and you start working through both that external and internal process, 79 00:04:26.560 --> 00:04:28.560 you have to do some anchoring, and you want to 80 00:04:28.600 --> 00:04:32.560 do it early. But I'd love to hear your tips, 81 00:04:33.040 --> 00:04:36.800 Tim on how you're anchoring on those items throughout the 82 00:04:36.839 --> 00:04:39.800 sales process to ensure you don't have a late stage 83 00:04:39.879 --> 00:04:43.279 fire drow when you're working both externally and internally. 84 00:04:43.600 --> 00:04:46.959 Yeah great, you know, so let's talk about this one 85 00:04:47.079 --> 00:04:49.040 a little bit and go back to that first concept 86 00:04:49.079 --> 00:04:53.079 to discuss the two way guidance on great outcomes, you know, Rachel, 87 00:04:53.160 --> 00:04:57.199 In an ideal world, sellers have gotten guidance from their 88 00:04:57.319 --> 00:05:02.720 leadership team on what is it that constitutes a great outcome? Yeah, 89 00:05:02.800 --> 00:05:06.079 you know, not just pricing levels, not just you know, 90 00:05:06.560 --> 00:05:08.519 all the legal terms that we got to make sure 91 00:05:08.600 --> 00:05:11.519 we let the lawyers deal with. But I'm talking about 92 00:05:11.560 --> 00:05:15.639 detailed guidance, the kind of product services to sell, timing, 93 00:05:16.319 --> 00:05:20.079 contractual terms, everything that's included in that. Now he said 94 00:05:20.079 --> 00:05:22.800 it in an ideal world, because what we found is 95 00:05:22.879 --> 00:05:26.279 more often than not that ideal world does not exist, 96 00:05:26.839 --> 00:05:30.560 and so we can hope that the company will give 97 00:05:30.639 --> 00:05:32.879 us that guidance. But more often than not, we find 98 00:05:32.920 --> 00:05:38.560 individual sellers are operating in an environment where, without saying it, 99 00:05:39.120 --> 00:05:42.519 they're just kind of supposed to know what a great 100 00:05:42.560 --> 00:05:45.959 outcome would look like, which, of course, when I work 101 00:05:46.000 --> 00:05:48.279 with senior leaders, I say, why are you surprised that 102 00:05:48.360 --> 00:05:50.920 people come back with all kinds of crazy things in 103 00:05:50.959 --> 00:05:53.600 your opinion? But so what do you do in the 104 00:05:53.759 --> 00:05:57.600 absence of guidance from your organization what a great outcome 105 00:05:57.639 --> 00:06:00.879 could look like. You've got to start capturing it with 106 00:06:00.920 --> 00:06:05.319 the customer and then start socializing back inside that's the 107 00:06:05.480 --> 00:06:09.160 external internal sale that you talked about, and probably the 108 00:06:09.160 --> 00:06:12.040 biggest key to all that is exactly what you said, Rachel, 109 00:06:12.399 --> 00:06:16.079 start early. One of the biggest things that gets in 110 00:06:16.160 --> 00:06:20.360 the way us being able to effectively manage both sides 111 00:06:20.399 --> 00:06:23.199 of trying to achieve a great outcome is we wait 112 00:06:23.240 --> 00:06:28.680 too late to get started externally with the customer. We drive, drive, drive, 113 00:06:28.759 --> 00:06:32.360 to go through maybe a technical proof of concept, We 114 00:06:32.439 --> 00:06:35.279 work with the project team, and it's not till we 115 00:06:35.319 --> 00:06:37.600 get to the end that we start finding out well, 116 00:06:37.600 --> 00:06:40.720 wait a minute, they're legal has some requirements. Wait a minute. 117 00:06:40.759 --> 00:06:43.759 Their IT team has some requirements. Wait a minute, their 118 00:06:43.800 --> 00:06:47.399 security team has some requirements. So we're waiting too late 119 00:06:47.519 --> 00:06:54.319 to capture information from the customer. Slows things down, creates 120 00:06:54.399 --> 00:06:58.600 challenge same thing internally, Rachel. We wait to the end, 121 00:06:59.199 --> 00:07:01.639 and by the way, most of our organizations are set 122 00:07:01.759 --> 00:07:04.360 up to push us to the end. Don't get our 123 00:07:04.439 --> 00:07:07.240 legal involved until you get most of the business terms 124 00:07:07.439 --> 00:07:12.079 all laid out. Don't go to the product team unless 125 00:07:12.120 --> 00:07:14.839 you really have this kind of need. Don't go to 126 00:07:14.920 --> 00:07:18.319 the services team. Don't go So what ends up happening 127 00:07:18.399 --> 00:07:21.399 is if we wait too late to start socializing what 128 00:07:21.480 --> 00:07:25.040 we're hearing and what we believe is going to be required. 129 00:07:25.839 --> 00:07:28.199 Guess what you get the fire drill at the end, 130 00:07:28.360 --> 00:07:32.600 and then you're putting yourself into the worst kind of environment. 131 00:07:33.199 --> 00:07:36.519 Think about it. I know the world has changed a lot, 132 00:07:36.839 --> 00:07:40.279 but some things have not really changed that much. I've 133 00:07:40.279 --> 00:07:44.800 managed worldwide sales for several organizations and almost every single 134 00:07:44.800 --> 00:07:48.279 one that was tied to technology. Guess when we did 135 00:07:48.319 --> 00:07:51.360 most of our business the last couple weeks of a quarter. 136 00:07:51.959 --> 00:07:55.839 So you wait to the end to start socializing internally, 137 00:07:56.519 --> 00:07:59.399 the approvals you might need, the support you might need. 138 00:08:00.040 --> 00:08:02.360 You're trying to do all that in an environment where 139 00:08:03.079 --> 00:08:05.720 everybody else is trying to do the exact same thing, 140 00:08:05.839 --> 00:08:10.639 and resources are scarce, Attention is scarce, and it's just 141 00:08:10.800 --> 00:08:15.879 the perfect storm for delays, problems, fire drills. And I 142 00:08:15.959 --> 00:08:19.240 hate to say it, but when we're doing all that, 143 00:08:19.800 --> 00:08:23.160 there's about fifty other suppliers that our customers are dealing 144 00:08:23.199 --> 00:08:26.319 with that are doing the exact same thing, which creates 145 00:08:26.319 --> 00:08:29.279 those bottlenecks on their side. So I think the more 146 00:08:29.399 --> 00:08:33.000 you socialize that early and start getting out in front 147 00:08:33.600 --> 00:08:36.960 of all this is really helpful because then it allows 148 00:08:37.000 --> 00:08:40.200 you to drive it's time to allow you to drive 149 00:08:40.480 --> 00:08:44.480 discovery that make some of those items higher in relevance 150 00:08:44.960 --> 00:08:49.159 lower in relevance, must haves, nice to haves. You can 151 00:08:49.240 --> 00:08:54.360 start organizing that and start getting closer to determining where's 152 00:08:54.399 --> 00:08:57.759 that sweet spot that sits between the customer's view of 153 00:08:57.759 --> 00:09:00.600 a great outcome and our view of a great outcome. 154 00:09:00.919 --> 00:09:04.960 And that's ultimately the individual seller's job is to try 155 00:09:05.039 --> 00:09:08.600 and merge those two together to come up with something 156 00:09:08.679 --> 00:09:12.320 that is not only acceptable to both sides, but highly 157 00:09:12.360 --> 00:09:15.799 motivating both sides. And you can't do that as a 158 00:09:15.799 --> 00:09:19.320 fire drill at the end. It's such a challenge, Right. 159 00:09:19.879 --> 00:09:23.159 You talked about what's motivating for both sides, and that's 160 00:09:23.279 --> 00:09:25.440 a critical piece of this because you want to make 161 00:09:25.480 --> 00:09:29.720 sure your customer has what they need in that final contract, 162 00:09:29.720 --> 00:09:33.519 in those final terms, and at the obvious level, right, 163 00:09:33.759 --> 00:09:36.399 that means a solution that aligns with their outcomes they're 164 00:09:36.399 --> 00:09:36.919 trying to drive. 165 00:09:37.039 --> 00:09:37.120 Right. 166 00:09:37.159 --> 00:09:39.080 We say that all the time, and we have a 167 00:09:39.080 --> 00:09:41.080 lot of content on that you can check out and 168 00:09:41.120 --> 00:09:43.759 I'll put it in the show notes. But sometimes, like 169 00:09:43.799 --> 00:09:46.840 what the customer needs can get very granular. It might 170 00:09:46.879 --> 00:09:49.159 team really in the weeds for us, but it's also 171 00:09:49.240 --> 00:09:52.240 very important for them and sometimes those little things can 172 00:09:52.240 --> 00:09:56.919 make or break the final deal. Tim, So what kind 173 00:09:56.960 --> 00:10:00.720 of questions are you asking to ensure that you create 174 00:10:00.759 --> 00:10:04.159 a proposal that hits the mark here on some of 175 00:10:04.200 --> 00:10:07.039 those seemingly minor things for the customer. 176 00:10:07.480 --> 00:10:09.960 Yeah, So back to in the spirit of starting the 177 00:10:09.960 --> 00:10:14.000 external selling and the internal selling early, Rachel, I know 178 00:10:14.039 --> 00:10:16.399 what a great outcome looks like for my company, or 179 00:10:16.440 --> 00:10:19.000 at least I've said I need to understand that more 180 00:10:19.080 --> 00:10:22.200 start shaping and influencing that. But with the customer, let's 181 00:10:22.200 --> 00:10:25.960 go back to an old friend decision criteria. I think 182 00:10:26.000 --> 00:10:28.519 what has up happened a lot of time we start 183 00:10:28.919 --> 00:10:31.639 and we do a great job in early stage discovery 184 00:10:31.679 --> 00:10:35.519 on the outcomes the customers trying to achieve, but we 185 00:10:35.759 --> 00:10:39.480 have sometimes a tendency to stop there and what we 186 00:10:39.799 --> 00:10:42.639 miss are what are some of the requirements or the 187 00:10:42.679 --> 00:10:46.399 decision criteria that they need to put in place to 188 00:10:46.480 --> 00:10:50.399 help them achieve those outcomes. Given the unique organization they are, 189 00:10:50.519 --> 00:10:55.799 their unique workflows, tech stack, organization, regulatory issues, whatever it is, 190 00:10:56.399 --> 00:10:59.960 what are their decision criteria? So I'm driving early stay 191 00:11:00.080 --> 00:11:04.080 age discovery to say, here's where you're at and the 192 00:11:04.200 --> 00:11:07.440 challenges it creates on this issue you have, here's where 193 00:11:07.480 --> 00:11:10.080 you'd like to be and the outcomes great. We all 194 00:11:10.120 --> 00:11:14.679 get that. We recommend going a step further, dig into 195 00:11:14.759 --> 00:11:20.200 those requirements or decision criteria and start getting my preference. 196 00:11:20.919 --> 00:11:26.240 I like to have a written, prioritized, and confirmed set 197 00:11:26.320 --> 00:11:31.240 of decision criteria that I'm starting to socialize early in 198 00:11:31.279 --> 00:11:35.639 a complex environment, maybe across multiple contacts on the customer side. 199 00:11:36.320 --> 00:11:38.320 And guess what I'm doing. I'm not waiting to the end. 200 00:11:38.519 --> 00:11:41.679 I'm bringing some of that back inside to my own organization. 201 00:11:42.200 --> 00:11:46.240 Give me some guidance on some additional decision criteria to 202 00:11:46.360 --> 00:11:48.639 achieve that outcome. What are some other things we'd be 203 00:11:48.679 --> 00:11:51.480 looking for? So I'm working both sides, but I'm not 204 00:11:51.639 --> 00:11:57.679 just aimed at the outcomes, because outcomes are subject to interpretation, right, Like, 205 00:11:57.759 --> 00:11:59.840 how do we get there? I want to get it 206 00:12:00.039 --> 00:12:04.879 to customer my three magic words. Rachel have used this before, Customer, 207 00:12:04.879 --> 00:12:07.600 It's time for me to give me my proposal. Let 208 00:12:07.679 --> 00:12:11.399 me tell you what I'm recommending, because you told me, 209 00:12:12.639 --> 00:12:17.159 you told me these were the twelve decision criteria you're 210 00:12:17.200 --> 00:12:21.039 looking at, and I'm going to demonstrate for you right now, 211 00:12:21.480 --> 00:12:25.679 how my proposal maps to every single one of those. 212 00:12:26.200 --> 00:12:30.840 When we just stop at outcomes, Rachel, it leaves the 213 00:12:30.879 --> 00:12:33.279 door open for our competitors to say, well, we can 214 00:12:33.320 --> 00:12:35.879 achieve those outcomes in a different way. I'm going to 215 00:12:35.960 --> 00:12:39.879 work well upstream from that to really try and drive 216 00:12:39.919 --> 00:12:43.440 discovery to help the customer understand, Yeah, I get the outcome. 217 00:12:43.519 --> 00:12:46.159 You want to reduce costs, or I get the outcome 218 00:12:46.240 --> 00:12:49.639 you want to have access to data no matter where 219 00:12:49.679 --> 00:12:51.799 it is. Yeah, I get you want to be more 220 00:12:52.000 --> 00:12:54.879 whatever it is. I understand that. But let's back it 221 00:12:54.960 --> 00:12:57.279 up to say, given where you're at right now, what 222 00:12:57.440 --> 00:12:59.279 do you have to put in place to move from 223 00:12:59.320 --> 00:13:01.799 where you're at the challenge to where you want to 224 00:13:01.799 --> 00:13:03.960 be in the good things? And I think when we 225 00:13:04.120 --> 00:13:09.039 do that, we're actually helping the customers, our friend John 226 00:13:09.080 --> 00:13:12.360 Kaplan says all the time participate in their own rescue. 227 00:13:12.399 --> 00:13:16.399 We're helping them map out what their requirements are so 228 00:13:16.480 --> 00:13:20.039 they'll be more informed buyers when they go out in 229 00:13:20.080 --> 00:13:23.080 the marketplace. And the more we do that upfront, by 230 00:13:23.120 --> 00:13:26.360 the time we get to the end, we're not introducing 231 00:13:26.440 --> 00:13:30.840 something surprising to the customer. We're just saying, I'm just 232 00:13:31.120 --> 00:13:34.799 responding to what you told me you wanted. Now here's 233 00:13:34.840 --> 00:13:38.159 the little nuance to this, Rachel. Along the way, I've 234 00:13:38.159 --> 00:13:40.679 also been hearing from my company, what are some things 235 00:13:40.679 --> 00:13:46.519 we might want, multi year agreement, the ability to track impact, 236 00:13:46.639 --> 00:13:52.399 we want success metrics, maybe we want access to your 237 00:13:52.440 --> 00:13:55.799 team that sells into the government. Whatever that definition of 238 00:13:55.799 --> 00:13:59.759 a great outcome would be. We are starting to infuse 239 00:13:59.799 --> 00:14:04.240 that into some of our conversation on what a great 240 00:14:04.279 --> 00:14:07.159 outcome would look like, not just for you, customer, but 241 00:14:07.200 --> 00:14:10.000 what we need. I ask and tell customers all the 242 00:14:10.039 --> 00:14:13.600 time for me is what I tell them for me 243 00:14:13.720 --> 00:14:16.600 to get you more of what you're looking for. You 244 00:14:16.759 --> 00:14:20.320 got to help me get my company what we're looking for. 245 00:14:20.919 --> 00:14:23.879 And there's more of those things that actually are in 246 00:14:23.919 --> 00:14:27.080 common and we share than are a post. So let's 247 00:14:27.120 --> 00:14:31.000 work with that upstream to really start socializing. And I 248 00:14:31.039 --> 00:14:34.159 owe it to my customer to give them some guidance 249 00:14:34.399 --> 00:14:37.679 what would make a great outcome for my company that 250 00:14:37.759 --> 00:14:40.679 we might be able to weave into this discussion that 251 00:14:41.600 --> 00:14:44.360 would help me get them some things they want. 252 00:14:44.559 --> 00:14:47.799 Yeah, and then when you go back, you have some things. Hey, 253 00:14:47.840 --> 00:14:49.480 I was able to get this and this, you have 254 00:14:49.639 --> 00:14:55.360 some demonstration of getting the company's interests into your customers 255 00:14:55.600 --> 00:15:01.120 deal and I know you've mentioned working with countless sales teams, Tim, 256 00:15:01.159 --> 00:15:03.720 and I know there's some repetition to this process. And 257 00:15:04.159 --> 00:15:08.519 talk to some of those common internal bottlenecks that a 258 00:15:08.559 --> 00:15:11.000 lot of companies deal with that kind of derail that 259 00:15:11.440 --> 00:15:14.440 success and what can a REP do to work around 260 00:15:14.440 --> 00:15:15.759 those that they can. 261 00:15:16.159 --> 00:15:18.480 One I'll say is the most common is a process 262 00:15:18.519 --> 00:15:22.000 issue and one is a behavior issue. You know, the 263 00:15:22.039 --> 00:15:25.559 process issue is the company a lot of times and 264 00:15:25.759 --> 00:15:30.399 I'll call this the one off approval approach. So some 265 00:15:30.600 --> 00:15:33.720 organizations don't have deal desk, they don't have an internal 266 00:15:33.759 --> 00:15:37.639 function that brings all the approvals required to finalize an 267 00:15:37.639 --> 00:15:41.440 agreement with a customer, especially a complex one together kind 268 00:15:41.480 --> 00:15:45.279 of managed by one group. We work with several organizations 269 00:15:45.279 --> 00:15:49.159 that before we got involved. I remember one an individual 270 00:15:49.200 --> 00:15:51.360 rep had to go out and get up to twelve 271 00:15:51.720 --> 00:15:58.559 individual approvals from different functional areas finance, legal services, product, 272 00:15:59.000 --> 00:16:02.480 this regional lead or that regional leader. It required a 273 00:16:02.519 --> 00:16:04.840 lot of one offs. And what would happen is it 274 00:16:04.879 --> 00:16:06.960 would happen at the end of the quarter, right, Rachel. 275 00:16:07.399 --> 00:16:11.000 So what goes on, well, I need a discount level, 276 00:16:11.159 --> 00:16:13.000 so I'm going to go to finance and we're going 277 00:16:13.080 --> 00:16:16.639 to see if we could get exception beyond the pre 278 00:16:16.759 --> 00:16:20.600 approved level that I could take the discount to. The 279 00:16:20.639 --> 00:16:23.200 finance team says, h let me look at it, and 280 00:16:23.200 --> 00:16:27.919 they make a one off decision relative to the discount, 281 00:16:28.399 --> 00:16:30.360 and then the rep gets a and goes over to 282 00:16:30.360 --> 00:16:33.919 the product team. We need to do some customization on this, 283 00:16:34.240 --> 00:16:37.519 and they're really busy. The product team says, can't you 284 00:16:37.639 --> 00:16:40.320 just sell them you are off the shelf, No, we can't. 285 00:16:40.360 --> 00:16:43.279 We have to have this level of integration. Well, let 286 00:16:43.279 --> 00:16:45.399 me see, and they give a one off approval on 287 00:16:45.440 --> 00:16:48.679 that for that one customer, Rachel, that had up to 288 00:16:48.720 --> 00:16:52.320 twelve individual one of us, they would give twelve concessions. 289 00:16:53.159 --> 00:16:55.919 And then when it was time to go finalize the deal, 290 00:16:56.000 --> 00:16:59.600 someone say, we gave twelve different things. What did we 291 00:16:59.600 --> 00:17:02.679 get back? I can return because it was all isolated 292 00:17:02.799 --> 00:17:07.480 one off approvals and that really slows things down. And Rachel, 293 00:17:08.680 --> 00:17:12.920 I pity the poor fool whose customer says, yeah, eleven 294 00:17:12.960 --> 00:17:15.400 of these look good, but I want to change this one, 295 00:17:15.440 --> 00:17:17.720 and they got to go back through the whole process. Again, 296 00:17:17.880 --> 00:17:22.880 So the one off approval process. If that's a reality 297 00:17:22.960 --> 00:17:26.119 for your company, you need some help with that. But 298 00:17:26.359 --> 00:17:29.519 at a minimum, you likely know it's there. You got 299 00:17:29.519 --> 00:17:32.079 to get out in front of it. And if you don't, 300 00:17:32.599 --> 00:17:37.279 then that comes to the behavior problem. It doesn't happen 301 00:17:37.279 --> 00:17:40.480 as much today because we've put process improvements in place, 302 00:17:41.000 --> 00:17:44.000 but I'll say, Rachel, back in the day, every once 303 00:17:44.000 --> 00:17:46.680 in a while, some reps knew that there was this problem, 304 00:17:47.000 --> 00:17:49.920 and in fact they found the approval process went a 305 00:17:49.920 --> 00:17:53.759 lot faster if I just kind of kept the company 306 00:17:53.759 --> 00:17:56.319 a little blind to some of these special issues that 307 00:17:56.440 --> 00:17:59.240 were coming up until the last couple weeks of a quarter, 308 00:17:59.559 --> 00:18:02.000 whenever one was so rushed, and it would be much 309 00:18:02.039 --> 00:18:06.160 more likely I'd get a quick approval. Right, those days 310 00:18:06.200 --> 00:18:10.920 are long long gone. And so when we don't bring 311 00:18:11.039 --> 00:18:15.759 back the internal sale or the internal negotiation, Rachel, we 312 00:18:15.839 --> 00:18:20.079 actually contribute to our own challenge. We're the architects of 313 00:18:20.160 --> 00:18:23.200 some of our own demise. Right. We wait, we wait, 314 00:18:23.359 --> 00:18:26.440 and then when we go want to move fast, the 315 00:18:26.440 --> 00:18:30.119 internal machine isn't ready for it. So those two things 316 00:18:30.279 --> 00:18:34.319 create undoe bottlenecks that really get in the way. So 317 00:18:34.559 --> 00:18:37.000 what do you do as an individual, I think you 318 00:18:37.079 --> 00:18:40.319 got to be mindful of what's the environment you're working in. 319 00:18:40.440 --> 00:18:44.319 On the customer side, that's your job, right, but you 320 00:18:44.480 --> 00:18:46.720 also have to be mindful of what you're dealing with 321 00:18:46.839 --> 00:18:50.559 on the internal side. Some of our listeners work in 322 00:18:50.839 --> 00:18:55.279 very closely held organizations where the approvals required might come 323 00:18:55.279 --> 00:18:59.319 down to one or two people. Great, good for you, right, 324 00:19:00.039 --> 00:19:02.200 but there might be complexity on the customer side. You 325 00:19:02.240 --> 00:19:05.880 still have to manage others of us work in that environment, 326 00:19:05.960 --> 00:19:08.839 like our one customer that had twelve different functions they 327 00:19:08.839 --> 00:19:11.680 had to deal with to get a deal done. Yeah, 328 00:19:11.759 --> 00:19:14.759 got to know upfront what you're dealing with and weave 329 00:19:14.799 --> 00:19:18.960 that into your plan. We don't often keep in mind, Rachel, 330 00:19:19.160 --> 00:19:25.079 the internal selling, the internal negotiation, and we've lived to 331 00:19:25.160 --> 00:19:28.519 learn with the frustration why is it so hard internally? 332 00:19:28.920 --> 00:19:32.319 And I frequently tell people it's because you're not planning 333 00:19:32.359 --> 00:19:35.319 for it upfront and you've pushed it off to the 334 00:19:35.440 --> 00:19:38.000 end and you kind of get what you deserve. I 335 00:19:38.079 --> 00:19:41.079 wish it was different for you as well, but it's not. 336 00:19:41.400 --> 00:19:44.359 And that's bigger than what you can control. Control what 337 00:19:44.480 --> 00:19:47.119 you can control and get out in front of it early. 338 00:19:47.559 --> 00:19:49.279 Yeah, That's such a good point because it's easy to 339 00:19:49.279 --> 00:19:51.880 stay here and say, oh, this company's messed up. They 340 00:19:51.920 --> 00:19:54.319 should be able to work this better for us. But 341 00:19:54.359 --> 00:19:56.279 it is what it is, and you still have a 342 00:19:56.359 --> 00:20:00.680 quoted ahead. So let's talk first, like the good strategies 343 00:20:01.000 --> 00:20:04.960 that you've seen to ensure the teams are instinct during 344 00:20:04.960 --> 00:20:07.920 complex deals like sales, legal, finance. I know that that 345 00:20:08.039 --> 00:20:10.200 can represent a big headache for REP. 346 00:20:10.799 --> 00:20:14.480 Well. One of the things is I'm either relying on 347 00:20:14.680 --> 00:20:18.119 my experience in my own company, or I'm leveraging the 348 00:20:18.160 --> 00:20:21.720 experience of some mentors or my manager that kind of 349 00:20:21.759 --> 00:20:24.680 know maybe some of the ways to get things done 350 00:20:24.720 --> 00:20:27.920 in this company. And Rachel, all our listeners know. The 351 00:20:27.960 --> 00:20:31.279 way you get things done varies from company company. There's 352 00:20:31.279 --> 00:20:33.960 the formal and then there's the what we all really know, 353 00:20:34.559 --> 00:20:38.119 and you've got to try and manage those. But here's 354 00:20:38.160 --> 00:20:41.720 a best practice I learned years ago from the number 355 00:20:41.720 --> 00:20:45.359 one seller in my organization at the time, and our 356 00:20:45.559 --> 00:20:48.039 organization in those days, Rachel looked more like the one 357 00:20:48.119 --> 00:20:52.079 off approval process kind of company, And he said, you 358 00:20:52.079 --> 00:20:54.920 know what I do, Tim, once I start getting an 359 00:20:54.960 --> 00:20:59.240 idea of what the customer is looking for and I 360 00:20:59.519 --> 00:21:01.680 kind of have an idea the things that would matter 361 00:21:01.720 --> 00:21:05.720 for us. I sponsor a call. I sponsor a call, 362 00:21:06.279 --> 00:21:09.839 and I'll bring in someone from finance. I'll bring in 363 00:21:09.960 --> 00:21:13.200 someone from legal. I'll bring in someone from the product team. 364 00:21:13.400 --> 00:21:16.480 I'll bring in someone from the services team. I'll bring 365 00:21:16.519 --> 00:21:19.720 it whoever is going to be from the product team. 366 00:21:20.039 --> 00:21:23.720 And I actually sponsor a call. Now, it was really 367 00:21:23.759 --> 00:21:26.079 easy for him because he had the biggest deals in 368 00:21:26.119 --> 00:21:30.319 the company every single time, and so people knew, if 369 00:21:30.319 --> 00:21:33.279 he makes the request for this call, we should have 370 00:21:33.400 --> 00:21:37.480 representation on that call. And a funny thing happened when 371 00:21:37.519 --> 00:21:41.359 I started practicing that and then did it in subsequent organizations. 372 00:21:41.880 --> 00:21:45.319 I did it one time, and the inevitably all those 373 00:21:45.319 --> 00:21:48.079 people I invited would say, this is a really good idea. 374 00:21:48.640 --> 00:21:51.920 We should do this more often. Maybe we shouldn't depend 375 00:21:52.000 --> 00:21:55.599 on an individual contributor like Tim to pull it together. 376 00:21:56.240 --> 00:21:58.359 Maybe this is the kind of thing we should have 377 00:21:58.359 --> 00:22:02.680 our deal desk do. So. I think getting people in 378 00:22:02.759 --> 00:22:06.519 line from the beginning, starting to socialize. I'm not saying 379 00:22:06.559 --> 00:22:08.720 this is what I'm asking to prove on You're saying 380 00:22:08.839 --> 00:22:12.279 this is what I'm hearing. The customer's interests are if 381 00:22:12.319 --> 00:22:15.119 we can achieve those, what can I ask for back 382 00:22:15.160 --> 00:22:19.400 in return? Start getting that guidance early. Because here's the thing, Rachel, 383 00:22:19.400 --> 00:22:23.599 we aloys often forget as an individual contributor. You see 384 00:22:24.519 --> 00:22:29.359 your opportunities, You've got your history of experience. You don't 385 00:22:29.400 --> 00:22:31.960 understand all the wild, crazy ones that people dealt with 386 00:22:32.319 --> 00:22:35.599 and odds are there are people in your organization that 387 00:22:35.720 --> 00:22:39.640 dealt with some really wild complex situations and found a 388 00:22:39.680 --> 00:22:43.160 way through that. They decided not to socialize because they 389 00:22:43.200 --> 00:22:46.680 didn't want everybody on it, but they've dealt with it before, 390 00:22:47.079 --> 00:22:49.680 and getting out in front they help you understand how 391 00:22:49.680 --> 00:22:52.720 can I just it while I still have runway left 392 00:22:52.759 --> 00:22:55.720 in the opportunity to be able to stick the landing. 393 00:22:56.160 --> 00:22:59.640 So you know, it's get out in front, socialize across 394 00:22:59.640 --> 00:23:04.519 from amultiple groups, maybe sponsor. Let's all come together and 395 00:23:04.559 --> 00:23:08.960 create a crazy idea, Rachel. Our negotiation strategy. 396 00:23:09.480 --> 00:23:10.640 Oh my gosh, you don't. 397 00:23:10.880 --> 00:23:12.680 I don't have to wait till the end to form that. 398 00:23:12.799 --> 00:23:15.559 What if I started doing it up front that allowed 399 00:23:15.559 --> 00:23:17.880 me to start executing with the customer. I got a 400 00:23:17.880 --> 00:23:20.480 whole bunch of people aligned with me on my side. 401 00:23:21.039 --> 00:23:23.119