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Every 55 00:02:26.080 --> 00:02:29.759 week another fascinating author talking about the most shocking and 56 00:02:29.879 --> 00:02:34.400 infamous killers in true crime history. True Murder with your host, 57 00:02:34.800 --> 00:02:49.400 journalist and author Dan Zufanski. Good evening on a cold 58 00:02:49.599 --> 00:02:54.319 January morning, the killer executed Assistant District to Attorney Mark 59 00:02:54.400 --> 00:02:59.120 Haas in broad daylight. Eight shots fired a block from 60 00:02:59.159 --> 00:03:04.479 the Kaufman County Courthouse. Two months later, a massacre the 61 00:03:04.560 --> 00:03:08.719 day before Easter, the couple slept bunnies eggs, a flower 62 00:03:08.800 --> 00:03:13.120 centerpiece gracing the table. Death rang their door bell and 63 00:03:13.199 --> 00:03:16.000 filled the air with the sound of an assault weapon 64 00:03:16.360 --> 00:03:21.360 discharging round after round into their bodies. Eric Williams and 65 00:03:21.400 --> 00:03:25.520 his wife Kim celebrated the murders with grilled steaks. Their 66 00:03:25.560 --> 00:03:29.400 crimes covered front pages around the world, many saying the 67 00:03:29.479 --> 00:03:33.120 killer placed a target square on the back of law enforcement. 68 00:03:34.000 --> 00:03:37.199 Williams planned to exact revenge on all those who had 69 00:03:37.240 --> 00:03:40.800 wronged him one at a time. Throughout the spring of 70 00:03:40.800 --> 00:03:45.560 twenty thirteen, Williams sowed terror through a small Texas town 71 00:03:46.080 --> 00:03:50.240 in a quest for vengeance turned to deadly obsession, his 72 00:03:50.319 --> 00:03:54.080 intention to keep killing until someone found a way to 73 00:03:54.159 --> 00:03:58.360 stop him. Book their feature this evening is in Plain Sight, 74 00:03:58.840 --> 00:04:03.080 the Kaufman County Prosecutors Murders, with my special guest, journalist 75 00:04:03.080 --> 00:04:06.800 and author Katherine Casey. Welcome back to the program, and 76 00:04:06.919 --> 00:04:12.599 thank you very much for agreeing to this interview. Katherine Casey, glad. 77 00:04:12.360 --> 00:04:14.199 To be here, Dan, thank you for inviting me. 78 00:04:15.479 --> 00:04:18.879 Thank you. This is, as I mentioned to you just before, 79 00:04:18.920 --> 00:04:23.439 we got on one really exciting book. Edge of your seat, 80 00:04:23.560 --> 00:04:26.519 page turner. I know those are cliches, folks, but this 81 00:04:27.000 --> 00:04:32.680 is incredible and let's get right to this incredible story. 82 00:04:33.639 --> 00:04:36.360 Now we start, and you start with the book where 83 00:04:37.040 --> 00:04:40.839 we really get a really detailed background on how this 84 00:04:41.000 --> 00:04:48.920 incredible disaster came to be from promising people and careers 85 00:04:49.639 --> 00:04:54.720 and a small little community in Kaufman County. Let's first 86 00:04:54.800 --> 00:04:57.920 talk a little bit about Kaufman County and before we 87 00:04:57.959 --> 00:05:03.560 start talking about the the early life of our main character, 88 00:05:03.839 --> 00:05:06.800 Eric Williams. 89 00:05:07.360 --> 00:05:09.920 Well, Kaufman is kind of a sleepy little town and 90 00:05:09.959 --> 00:05:12.560 it's the county seat. The courthouse is kind of an 91 00:05:12.600 --> 00:05:16.480 undistinguished building in the center of it, and it's surrounded 92 00:05:16.560 --> 00:05:20.399 by a town square with old storefronts, and it's kind 93 00:05:20.399 --> 00:05:22.959 of a quiet little place. But it's on the outskirts 94 00:05:23.000 --> 00:05:26.079 of Dallas, and it's the kind of place where people 95 00:05:26.079 --> 00:05:30.040 of families have been there for generations. There are cattle 96 00:05:30.120 --> 00:05:35.519 ranches surrounding Kaufman Proper. It's the kind of place where 97 00:05:35.639 --> 00:05:39.079 Aunt Ban in the Old Mayberry series might be seen 98 00:05:39.160 --> 00:05:41.199 walking down the street carrying one for pies to a 99 00:05:41.240 --> 00:05:45.639 neighbor's house. It's, you know, not the kind of place 100 00:05:45.680 --> 00:05:47.680 where you would think people would be gunned down in 101 00:05:47.720 --> 00:05:48.680 the street. 102 00:05:51.199 --> 00:05:55.839 Now, you talk about Eric Williams and not such a 103 00:05:57.920 --> 00:06:03.160 spectacular or eventful early life, But would you talk about 104 00:06:03.240 --> 00:06:07.519 high school and some of the oddness is noted by people. 105 00:06:07.600 --> 00:06:09.360 So tell us a little bit about some of the 106 00:06:09.399 --> 00:06:14.560 oddness at high school. You mentioned a briefcase, and really 107 00:06:14.560 --> 00:06:17.560 what his character is known for by people in that 108 00:06:17.600 --> 00:06:20.160 little community. What do they see and what are the 109 00:06:20.199 --> 00:06:26.920 first things that he does at high school towards his dreams? 110 00:06:27.399 --> 00:06:31.560 Well, Eric really wanted to go into the military, and 111 00:06:31.879 --> 00:06:37.439 he was really geared toward that mindset. He was very bright. 112 00:06:38.199 --> 00:06:42.920 Eric Williams is a very smart man. He was one 113 00:06:42.959 --> 00:06:45.040 of the brainy kids in high school, and he was 114 00:06:45.079 --> 00:06:48.199 a little quirky. Instead of talking to the other kids 115 00:06:48.240 --> 00:06:50.279 on the school bus, he'd sit and he'd read a book. 116 00:06:51.079 --> 00:06:54.279 He carried a briefcase, which is unusual in a small 117 00:06:54.319 --> 00:06:56.560 town for a kid to do. I think it's actually 118 00:06:56.680 --> 00:06:59.959 unusual any place, but especially in a little Texas town. 119 00:07:01.079 --> 00:07:06.120 And he was an Eagle Scout. He was really well 120 00:07:06.160 --> 00:07:09.279 thought of, but people did notice that he was a 121 00:07:09.319 --> 00:07:13.319 little odd like when he took his Eagle Scout exam, 122 00:07:14.439 --> 00:07:17.920 he was asked some questions, and the man who asked 123 00:07:17.959 --> 00:07:21.680 him the questions, a scout master, noticed that when Eric 124 00:07:21.720 --> 00:07:24.600 couldn't answer a question, his eyes just got kind of 125 00:07:24.680 --> 00:07:28.160 dark and dead, and the guy thought, there's really something 126 00:07:28.240 --> 00:07:31.160 wrong here, but he didn't know what it was. And 127 00:07:31.199 --> 00:07:34.560 then he was off to college and it was just 128 00:07:35.240 --> 00:07:38.279 it continued like that. People have told me that in 129 00:07:38.399 --> 00:07:40.800 high school, Eric and his group of friends. He had 130 00:07:40.839 --> 00:07:44.360 a really tight group of friends that he played games 131 00:07:44.360 --> 00:07:48.000 with like Dungeons and Dragons, where they took on rolls 132 00:07:48.079 --> 00:07:54.240 of fictional fantasy characters. He played Star Trek, and they 133 00:07:54.360 --> 00:07:58.639 played different characters from Star Trek, and he was really 134 00:07:58.680 --> 00:08:01.199 into that. That was his life. And I've heard it 135 00:08:01.360 --> 00:08:03.839 referred to as being a little bit like the popular 136 00:08:03.879 --> 00:08:07.680 show on TV, The Big Bang Theory, right right. 137 00:08:09.360 --> 00:08:12.240 You talked about too that he was very intelligent and 138 00:08:13.120 --> 00:08:16.560 he had got a chemistry scholarship at the Texas Christian 139 00:08:16.680 --> 00:08:20.519 University and he start but then he had joined ROTC 140 00:08:21.319 --> 00:08:24.759 and he focused on law enforcement. Tell us how he 141 00:08:24.800 --> 00:08:29.920 progresses in his interests for military and how that changes 142 00:08:30.000 --> 00:08:31.959 his direction and education. 143 00:08:33.440 --> 00:08:36.279 Well, he really did want to be a soldier. Eric 144 00:08:36.360 --> 00:08:41.600 really wanted to be a career, career army, but the 145 00:08:41.720 --> 00:08:45.120 army was at a downsizing point when he was graduating 146 00:08:45.120 --> 00:08:48.639 from TCU and he wasn't picked up. A lot of 147 00:08:48.679 --> 00:08:52.200 his friends were. And Eric had always been this kid 148 00:08:52.240 --> 00:08:55.440 who was you know, everybody talked about how smart he was, 149 00:08:55.559 --> 00:08:59.360 how great he was, And this was like the first 150 00:08:59.399 --> 00:09:02.559 failure to I mean this, and this was a really 151 00:09:02.600 --> 00:09:06.039 sad one for him. So he enrolled in a or 152 00:09:06.120 --> 00:09:10.639 he joined another group of like a voluntary military organization 153 00:09:11.679 --> 00:09:16.639 and uh then he went into law enforcement and he 154 00:09:16.639 --> 00:09:24.159 he was after college, he started getting jobs working for 155 00:09:24.240 --> 00:09:27.600 small police departments in and around the Fort Worth area 156 00:09:27.639 --> 00:09:29.120 where he was living at that time. 157 00:09:32.360 --> 00:09:36.639 You talk about those early jobs, you say that certainly 158 00:09:36.720 --> 00:09:39.240 there was a disappointment in him not having a future 159 00:09:39.240 --> 00:09:42.919 in the military. Realized that, so you said that he 160 00:09:43.120 --> 00:09:49.519 applied to small police forces in Fortworth, Texas, and you 161 00:09:49.559 --> 00:09:54.960 talk about a suburb called White Settlement. What was the 162 00:09:55.000 --> 00:10:01.080 situation that he left both of those police departments. 163 00:09:59.679 --> 00:10:03.919 Well, he was fired from both and this wasn't something 164 00:10:04.000 --> 00:10:07.679 people expected of Eric Williams. Eric was gung ho and 165 00:10:07.879 --> 00:10:10.960 Eric was going to be a success. And the first 166 00:10:11.000 --> 00:10:15.879 department he was let go after he asked to have 167 00:10:15.919 --> 00:10:18.000 time off to take a college class and he was 168 00:10:18.080 --> 00:10:20.360 denied it and then he called in sick and just 169 00:10:20.360 --> 00:10:23.960 didn't shook for work to go to the class. But 170 00:10:24.080 --> 00:10:28.600 the second one was more troubling. One evening, Eric and 171 00:10:28.960 --> 00:10:35.440 another police officer, instead of circulating through town as they 172 00:10:35.440 --> 00:10:37.759 were supposed to be this is a small Texas town 173 00:10:38.279 --> 00:10:42.639 checking on residents, didn't do that, and it's thought that 174 00:10:42.679 --> 00:10:46.559 they went to a topless bar and instead Eric hacked 175 00:10:46.679 --> 00:10:50.200 into the fourth level of the computer system at the 176 00:10:50.240 --> 00:10:54.440 police office, which was the most secure and changed his 177 00:10:55.919 --> 00:10:58.639 report to show that he had been in town circulating 178 00:10:58.679 --> 00:11:01.960 that night. The police chief got to call that night 179 00:11:02.039 --> 00:11:05.279 reporting and showed up the next morning, looked at the 180 00:11:05.279 --> 00:11:10.720 proof and confronted Eric. Eric denied it, and he fired Eric. 181 00:11:11.360 --> 00:11:15.480 And at the time the police chief thought that the 182 00:11:15.519 --> 00:11:18.480 whole thing was very odd because obviously Eric was very 183 00:11:18.480 --> 00:11:21.960 well schooled in how to hack into the computer, and 184 00:11:22.000 --> 00:11:23.720 he thought he should have been able to cover his 185 00:11:23.759 --> 00:11:27.000 footprints if he'd wanted to. And the police chief thought 186 00:11:27.039 --> 00:11:29.399 it was almost as if Eric was thumbing his nose 187 00:11:29.440 --> 00:11:32.559 at them, that he wanted them to know that he'd 188 00:11:32.559 --> 00:11:34.639 been able to hack into the computer system and do 189 00:11:34.679 --> 00:11:35.519 what he wanted with it. 190 00:11:37.879 --> 00:11:40.679 Now you talk about In November ninety three, at twenty 191 00:11:40.720 --> 00:11:43.440 six years of age, Eric moves with his friend Paul 192 00:11:43.519 --> 00:11:48.279 Lilly to Kaufman County, says about forty minutes southeast of Dallas, 193 00:11:49.240 --> 00:11:51.399 and his friend Lily got a job at the sheriff's 194 00:11:51.440 --> 00:11:57.120 office and they lived in Terrell and Eric began studying 195 00:11:57.159 --> 00:11:59.799 for a law school entrance exam. So tell us what 196 00:11:59.879 --> 00:12:03.159 he does in terms of he needs money, So what 197 00:12:03.360 --> 00:12:04.679 happens and who does he meet? 198 00:12:06.120 --> 00:12:11.480 Well, Eric went into kaufmin looking for work, and work 199 00:12:11.559 --> 00:12:15.159 got to the county judge that there was this promising 200 00:12:15.240 --> 00:12:18.600 young man who'd been an Eagles scout, who'd been in 201 00:12:18.679 --> 00:12:22.759 law enforcement, who was looking into law school, who was 202 00:12:22.799 --> 00:12:26.480 looking for work in the area. And the county judge 203 00:12:26.519 --> 00:12:29.639 called him in and his name is Ashworth, Glenn Ashworth, 204 00:12:30.320 --> 00:12:33.600 and interviewed him and Eric was very impressive. He you know, 205 00:12:33.679 --> 00:12:37.279 he looked on paper, he looked very good. And the 206 00:12:37.360 --> 00:12:40.279 judge needed a new county clerk, or I'm sorry, a 207 00:12:40.279 --> 00:12:43.799 clerk for his office. The clerk's act is kind of 208 00:12:43.799 --> 00:12:46.720 an assistant. They do the scheduling. They're kind of the 209 00:12:46.720 --> 00:12:49.519 gatekeepers for the judges. They do a lot of the paperwork. 210 00:12:50.840 --> 00:12:53.559 He sat down, talked to Eric, and he hired him. 211 00:12:54.440 --> 00:12:57.879 Glenn Ashworth at that point was the only state level 212 00:12:57.960 --> 00:13:02.159 judge in Kaufman County, Texas, and he wielded a substantial 213 00:13:02.200 --> 00:13:06.879 amount of power in that little community. And with that hire, 214 00:13:07.200 --> 00:13:10.519 Eric became aligned with one of the most powerful men 215 00:13:10.559 --> 00:13:14.039 in this in Coftin County. 216 00:13:14.440 --> 00:13:17.360 You also talk about all of the as you mentioned, 217 00:13:17.600 --> 00:13:20.960 all the things that he oversaw for the judge as 218 00:13:21.000 --> 00:13:24.039 a court coordinator, and he wielded a lot of power 219 00:13:24.200 --> 00:13:29.919 just in that rule, but also what Judge Ashworth suggested 220 00:13:30.039 --> 00:13:35.399 Eric do was register as an unpaid reserve officer with 221 00:13:35.480 --> 00:13:38.120 the DA office. And once he did that, what did 222 00:13:38.159 --> 00:13:41.480 that enable Eric to do which was very important to Eric. 223 00:13:42.679 --> 00:13:45.360 He was able to keep his gun with him to 224 00:13:45.440 --> 00:13:49.320 go through security and into the courthouse and even into 225 00:13:49.399 --> 00:13:52.639 the court room. The judge wanted him to have it. 226 00:13:52.720 --> 00:13:54.759 I mean, it's one of those things a lot of 227 00:13:54.799 --> 00:13:57.080 the you know, the bailiffs are there and they're armed, 228 00:13:57.120 --> 00:14:01.279 and we all have metal detectors now at the entrances 229 00:14:01.320 --> 00:14:05.519 at the courthouses, and this was another level of security. 230 00:14:06.399 --> 00:14:08.200 So Eric liked this. 231 00:14:09.120 --> 00:14:13.000 He started doing some things part time with the Sheriff's Department. 232 00:14:13.480 --> 00:14:15.759 He became kind of an active volunteer. 233 00:14:19.600 --> 00:14:22.480 You also talk about that first summer though that there's 234 00:14:22.519 --> 00:14:26.440 a little, well not a little, an incident that in 235 00:14:26.519 --> 00:14:30.799 hindsight forebod things to happen in the future. But that 236 00:14:30.960 --> 00:14:36.039 first summer he attended a court coordinating a court coordinator's conference, 237 00:14:36.480 --> 00:14:40.080 and he met a woman named Janice Gray. What happened 238 00:14:41.679 --> 00:14:43.679 that summer with janis Gray. 239 00:14:45.720 --> 00:14:49.759 They started dating. Eric hadn't dated a lot of girls. 240 00:14:49.799 --> 00:14:52.600 But he'd had a few girlfriends over the years, and 241 00:14:53.000 --> 00:14:55.840 he liked Janice. Janis liked him initially. She thought he 242 00:14:55.919 --> 00:14:58.639 was just this great guy, you know, a little quirky, 243 00:14:58.840 --> 00:15:02.360 kind of funny, you know. It seemed like a really 244 00:15:02.360 --> 00:15:06.279 sweet guy. And they dated for a while, talked on 245 00:15:06.320 --> 00:15:10.840 the phone, got together even though they lived in separate counties, 246 00:15:10.879 --> 00:15:15.639 they lived quite a distance apart, and then something and 247 00:15:15.679 --> 00:15:18.759 then Janie found somebody she really really was attracted to, 248 00:15:18.960 --> 00:15:22.200 really cared for, and saw a future with, and she 249 00:15:22.320 --> 00:15:25.519 broke it off. She thought that Eric took it well. 250 00:15:26.279 --> 00:15:30.480 But then they showed up at the Cork Coordinators conference 251 00:15:30.679 --> 00:15:35.120 that next year, and Eric came up to her and 252 00:15:36.320 --> 00:15:39.360 showed her a gun in the lobby of the hotel 253 00:15:39.440 --> 00:15:44.440 that they were staying at, and then said that he 254 00:15:44.559 --> 00:15:47.759 brought it to give to her son. Janice didn't want it. 255 00:15:47.759 --> 00:15:51.399 It kind of gave her an odd feeling. So but 256 00:15:51.519 --> 00:15:53.559 later that and he wanted to go out to dinner, 257 00:15:53.600 --> 00:15:57.679 but she refused. Later that evening, she showed up with 258 00:15:57.799 --> 00:16:04.360 friends at a restaurant bar and Eric was suddenly there again, 259 00:16:04.440 --> 00:16:07.799 standing right beside her, and he pulled the gun out 260 00:16:08.039 --> 00:16:11.200 and showed it to her. He pulled her away from 261 00:16:11.200 --> 00:16:18.000 her friends and then showed her the gun and said, 262 00:16:18.360 --> 00:16:21.960 I don't have anything to lose. Her friend saw this 263 00:16:22.080 --> 00:16:25.480 happen and came over and got her and walked off 264 00:16:25.480 --> 00:16:29.240 with her, and they reported it to the police. The 265 00:16:29.279 --> 00:16:32.639 police couldn't find Eric, but when they got into the 266 00:16:32.679 --> 00:16:36.159 conference next morning, there he was sitting in the conference 267 00:16:36.240 --> 00:16:39.679 room as if nothing had happened. The police took him 268 00:16:39.720 --> 00:16:45.759 away and brought him to the courthouse. Janice was filing 269 00:16:45.840 --> 00:16:50.120 charges and they talked. The police talked to the district 270 00:16:50.159 --> 00:16:55.039 attorney and Kaufman, who talked to Judge Ashworth. Judge Ashworth, 271 00:16:55.080 --> 00:16:59.480 who assumed, and probably not unsurprisingly so, just thought that 272 00:16:59.519 --> 00:17:03.600 his young coordinator had done something foolish, had too much 273 00:17:03.639 --> 00:17:07.160 to drink and done something foolish, took responsibility for him 274 00:17:07.200 --> 00:17:11.440 and had him brought back to Kaufman, and Janie agreed 275 00:17:11.559 --> 00:17:14.640 not to go forward with anything as long as Eric 276 00:17:14.720 --> 00:17:17.400 left her alone. 277 00:17:17.640 --> 00:17:20.960 Yeah, amazing. In the fall of ninety five, you write 278 00:17:21.000 --> 00:17:24.480 that at twenty five years of years of age, he 279 00:17:24.519 --> 00:17:27.640 began law school in Fort Worth and his future seemed 280 00:17:27.640 --> 00:17:35.680 really bright, and that Judge Ashworth and Eric became increasingly closer. 281 00:17:36.400 --> 00:17:41.799 Tell Us a little bit about this developing relationship between 282 00:17:41.799 --> 00:17:43.680 the two. How far did it really go and how 283 00:17:43.720 --> 00:17:44.599 close did they become? 284 00:17:45.680 --> 00:17:47.960 You know, they were really good friends. They went out 285 00:17:47.960 --> 00:17:51.039 to the judge included Eric and pretty much most of 286 00:17:51.079 --> 00:17:54.240 the things that he did. Eric was invited into the 287 00:17:54.319 --> 00:17:58.519 judges home for different events when he had parties. They 288 00:17:58.519 --> 00:18:01.799 had lunch together every day, along with a couple of 289 00:18:01.799 --> 00:18:06.119 other people in Kaufman, people from the courthouse and the 290 00:18:06.160 --> 00:18:10.960 county surveyor. They liked Eric. The judge really liked Eric, 291 00:18:11.000 --> 00:18:14.039 thought he was funny. Eric did a good job for him. 292 00:18:14.960 --> 00:18:17.480 Judge Ashworth was proud of the fact that Eric was 293 00:18:17.519 --> 00:18:20.839 going to law school and bittering his future. It got 294 00:18:20.880 --> 00:18:23.079 to the point where they became such good friends at 295 00:18:23.079 --> 00:18:26.680 one point that the judge actually included Eric as a 296 00:18:26.680 --> 00:18:30.720 beneficiary in his will. He just thought, Eric is this 297 00:18:30.799 --> 00:18:33.319 really great kid, and he was trying to help him start. 298 00:18:33.359 --> 00:18:37.000 He was acting as his mentor, and he obviously saw 299 00:18:37.160 --> 00:18:39.960 Eric as his protege and he was proud of him. 300 00:18:40.039 --> 00:18:44.359 And when Eric did so well in law school and 301 00:18:44.400 --> 00:18:48.440 then graduated from law school, Eric actually gave the judge 302 00:18:48.480 --> 00:18:52.039 a plaque thanking him for what he had done for him. 303 00:18:52.720 --> 00:18:55.680 People in Kaufman saw the two of them as just 304 00:18:55.880 --> 00:18:59.160 very close friends. 305 00:18:59.359 --> 00:19:02.839 You said that time, and you include though that again, 306 00:19:02.880 --> 00:19:06.440 he was accepted as a quirky guy with his odd 307 00:19:06.519 --> 00:19:10.759 smile and his behaviors, just accepted overall. They considered him 308 00:19:10.759 --> 00:19:15.160 a nice guy. But you include this odd statement about 309 00:19:15.440 --> 00:19:18.880 if he you say, if I ever if he ever 310 00:19:18.960 --> 00:19:22.519 decided to go out, what did he say? And in 311 00:19:22.559 --> 00:19:24.279 the context of how did he come up with the 312 00:19:24.359 --> 00:19:26.079 statement which people thought was odd? 313 00:19:27.160 --> 00:19:30.599 Eric said odd things at times. You know, he was 314 00:19:30.599 --> 00:19:32.400 one of those guys he sat there and kind of 315 00:19:32.440 --> 00:19:34.319 had a little smile on his face, and people weren't 316 00:19:34.319 --> 00:19:37.279 sure what he was thinking. And at times he'd blurred 317 00:19:37.319 --> 00:19:41.200 out strange things. And there'd been a shooting someplace in 318 00:19:41.200 --> 00:19:44.599 the country that was in the news, and sitting at 319 00:19:44.640 --> 00:19:48.200 lunch one day with a group of friends, Eric said, 320 00:19:48.240 --> 00:19:50.720 if I ever go out, I'm going to take a 321 00:19:50.720 --> 00:19:52.400 bunch of people. If I ever decide to go out, 322 00:19:52.440 --> 00:19:54.079 I'm going to take a bunch of people with me. 323 00:19:56.039 --> 00:19:58.720 And no one knew quite what to think of it, 324 00:19:58.839 --> 00:20:00.920 you know, I mean, it's such an odd thing to say. 325 00:20:00.960 --> 00:20:04.240 They knew Eric, they liked Eric, Eric's friend, They didn't 326 00:20:04.240 --> 00:20:06.920 think Eric would really do that. Why would Eric really 327 00:20:06.960 --> 00:20:09.440 do that? So they kind of looked at each other, 328 00:20:09.519 --> 00:20:11.440 and then one remark to the other when they were 329 00:20:11.519 --> 00:20:15.640 leaving that Charles Whitman, who shot from the ut Tower 330 00:20:15.680 --> 00:20:19.519 in the nineteen sixties, was an eagle scout like Eric, 331 00:20:20.079 --> 00:20:23.000 and somebody wondered if one day Eric would shoot people 332 00:20:23.559 --> 00:20:25.640 from the roof of the Kaufman County Courthouse. 333 00:20:27.559 --> 00:20:33.160 Wow, you talk about that. In ninety six, he was 334 00:20:33.200 --> 00:20:38.920 on online message board and he met someone. Tell us 335 00:20:38.920 --> 00:20:43.000 who he meets and a little bit about Kim Johnson's 336 00:20:43.200 --> 00:20:44.319 early background. 337 00:20:46.160 --> 00:20:49.960 Kim was working at that point at a doctor's office. 338 00:20:50.759 --> 00:20:53.240 She was kind of a medical receptionist. She'd done very 339 00:20:53.240 --> 00:20:57.240 well in high school. Smart, pretty, big, blonde Texas hair, 340 00:20:58.240 --> 00:21:02.960 a great laugh. People liked to Kim. She'd gone to college, 341 00:21:03.000 --> 00:21:07.519 she went to SMU, decided to drop out, and was working, 342 00:21:08.759 --> 00:21:14.039 you know, for a doctor at that point. Kim, on 343 00:21:14.079 --> 00:21:16.440 the surface looked kind of like just a happy, go 344 00:21:16.519 --> 00:21:19.839 lucky girl. The truth was that her home life had 345 00:21:19.880 --> 00:21:24.440 been pretty traumatic. Her father. She describes her father as 346 00:21:24.480 --> 00:21:27.960 having been abusive over the years, and the family home 347 00:21:28.000 --> 00:21:30.559 had not been as happy as people, you know, as 348 00:21:30.680 --> 00:21:33.960 Kim portrayed from the outside. So she was somebody who 349 00:21:34.079 --> 00:21:37.640 had kind of this undercurrent of tension in her life 350 00:21:37.680 --> 00:21:42.279 growing up, and she was looking for somebody kind of 351 00:21:42.359 --> 00:21:46.680 like Eric. She the guys she dated, she decided, were 352 00:21:46.720 --> 00:21:50.960 too you know, laid back, and they weren't the kind 353 00:21:51.000 --> 00:21:54.119 of guys she wanted to be with. And Eric was fun, 354 00:21:54.400 --> 00:21:57.359 and he was smart, and she was really attracted by 355 00:21:57.359 --> 00:22:01.599 his intelligence. And Kim is a smart woman, and they 356 00:22:01.759 --> 00:22:05.799 kind of saw in each other something and in no 357 00:22:05.920 --> 00:22:10.720 time at all, Eric was you know. They met, they 358 00:22:10.759 --> 00:22:13.519 met online, and then they met in person, and they 359 00:22:13.559 --> 00:22:16.359 spent time together and they fell in love. 360 00:22:19.400 --> 00:22:24.000 You say. Shortly after this union really seemed to change 361 00:22:24.240 --> 00:22:28.519 Eric around the office, and his character almost seemed to change, 362 00:22:29.359 --> 00:22:32.680 including some things in behavior where he lost weight, seemed 363 00:22:32.680 --> 00:22:34.839 to get healthier. Tell us a little bit about some 364 00:22:34.880 --> 00:22:37.640 of the positive changes it seemed to happen. 365 00:22:37.720 --> 00:22:41.000 But once he met Ke, well, Eric's friends were a 366 00:22:41.039 --> 00:22:43.759 little worried about this relationship in the beginning. You know, 367 00:22:43.799 --> 00:22:46.160 people who meet on the internet, especially back then. A 368 00:22:46.160 --> 00:22:48.880 lot of people do it nowadays, but back then this 369 00:22:49.000 --> 00:22:52.200 was all pretty new, and people were concerned about who 370 00:22:52.319 --> 00:22:54.559 Kim was and you know whether or not should be 371 00:22:54.559 --> 00:22:58.480 good for Eric. But Eric's friends saw that he was happier. 372 00:22:58.720 --> 00:23:03.039 He seemed more content in his life. He was really 373 00:23:03.119 --> 00:23:06.079 proud of Kim. He carried a picture of her in 374 00:23:06.119 --> 00:23:08.559 his wallet, had a picture of her on his desk, 375 00:23:09.799 --> 00:23:12.319 talk to people about, you know, how beautiful she was. 376 00:23:13.039 --> 00:23:15.400 And he just seemed to be opening up to life. 377 00:23:15.519 --> 00:23:20.599 He did. He looked healthier, life looked really promising, he 378 00:23:20.640 --> 00:23:24.680 was finishing law school, the future was ahead. Everything looked 379 00:23:24.720 --> 00:23:26.880 really good for Eric Williams. 380 00:23:28.759 --> 00:23:31.720 Now you talk about that he lost weight, but that 381 00:23:31.839 --> 00:23:35.279 at the same time, the again, this story has got 382 00:23:35.279 --> 00:23:38.720 a lot of people with not good health. So what 383 00:23:38.839 --> 00:23:41.400 does he discover in terms of his own health. Soon 384 00:23:41.480 --> 00:23:44.160 after meeting Kim, well. 385 00:23:44.240 --> 00:23:48.279 Had they had some bad turn of events. Shortly after 386 00:23:48.359 --> 00:23:52.720 they married, Eric found out he started losing weight. He 387 00:23:52.799 --> 00:23:56.079 started having to rush to the restroom all the time. 388 00:23:56.720 --> 00:24:01.480 It turned out that he had type one diabetes, and 389 00:24:02.240 --> 00:24:06.519 this was something that really changed his life in many ways. 390 00:24:06.960 --> 00:24:09.400 He had continued to be a volunteer in the Armed 391 00:24:09.400 --> 00:24:14.279 Services and at that point had to tender his resignation 392 00:24:14.359 --> 00:24:16.720 because he knew he could never be called up for 393 00:24:16.799 --> 00:24:21.359 active duty and things hadn't really gone very well for 394 00:24:21.559 --> 00:24:24.119 Eric at that point. I mean, his life was opening 395 00:24:24.200 --> 00:24:26.400 up for him. His legal degree was you know, he 396 00:24:26.480 --> 00:24:28.400 was getting to the point where he was graduating. But 397 00:24:29.119 --> 00:24:33.039 he'd had all of those disappointments. The military thing, hadn't 398 00:24:33.079 --> 00:24:35.559 worked out, the law enforcement thing, he'd been fired at 399 00:24:35.559 --> 00:24:39.039 the jobs that he'd had, and now this, you know, 400 00:24:39.160 --> 00:24:44.039 now this health thing. And then Kim got some bad news. 401 00:24:45.559 --> 00:24:47.759