Speaker 1: Hey everyone, it's Mike from Locations unknown. Thank you once
again for tuning in. Just a quick note about tonight's episode.
You may notice once you start listening that my voice
sounds terrible. Well, I had just gotten over a pretty
bad cold for a couple of weeks. I felt fine,
so we decided to record an episode. But my voice,
to put it bluntly, is terrible, and I apologize for that.
I'm feeling really good now. My voice is probably back
to ninety nine percent. We actually recorded another episode since
this one, so we'll be back to normal soon. I
hope you enjoy this episode, even with my terrible voice.
I've done a lot of editing to try to make
it it sound as good as possible, but there's just
no getting around it. And it is a very interesting episode.
We did an update on Selene Kremer. We covered the
original case back in twenty twenty three, so there's been
a lot of updates. Sunset happens. Hope you enjoy the episode.
I apologize again for my awful voice, and I just
let you know that we're going to be back to normal.
My voice'll be back to normal and see you next time.
Speaker 2: Thousands of people have mysteriously vanished in America's wilderness. Join
us as we dive into the deep end of the
unexplainable and try to piece together what happened. You are
listening to Locations Unknown. Oh what's up everybody? And welcome
back to another episode of Locations Unknown. I'm your co
host Joey roddal with me as always is a guy
who always gets his revenge. Mike vander Bogart Ah, Thank.
Speaker 3: You, Joe, and thank you to all of our loyal
listeners for tuning in. Apologize for my voice, got a
little bit of a.
Speaker 2: You should apologize for being sick. That's ridiculous. How do
I sound terrible? Terrible?
Speaker 3: Joe's gonna do a lot of the talking this one, so.
Speaker 2: Nope, nope, We're gonna make it. I'm just gonna make it.
It's gonna get way worse. So just a few.
Speaker 3: Patreon shout outs before we get going, So thank you
to Sarah McCoy, Ashley Estrada, Dana Tally. And that's it.
I thought we had more. If you want to call
the show, you can call two eight three nine one three.
We also have some other podcasts on the network you
can check out off the trails. Who runs this park?
Crime off the Grid and relish. If you want to
support the show, you can support us through Patreon, YouTube memberships,
premium subscriptions, and Apple buy some stuff on our store.
You can always just like and comment wherever you find
locations unknown. It helps with the algorithms. Outside of that,
what's been going on with you?
Speaker 2: Joe just got back from Cozumela on a diving trip.
It was amazing. I did not get lost in the ocean.
That's good. Those goods on back and that's why it's
been taking so long.
Speaker 3: But you didn't didn't drink the water?
Speaker 2: I did not? Well, I did at the resort. We
had clean water, Okay, so it's perfect. Yeah, So all right, everybody,
let's gear up and get out to explore locations unknown.
In August twenty twenty three, we covered the disappearance of
a thirty one year old Belgian traveler who vanished after
setting out on a short walk to Philosopher Falls in
the dense rainforest of northwest Tasmania. What appeared to be
a brief tourist hike quickly became a mystery shaped by
harsh winter weather, difficult terrain, and weeks of intense search efforts. Now,
nearly three years later, new developments have brought investigators and
her family closer to understanding what may have happened. In
this update episode, we revisit the case, walk through the
latest search efforts, examine newly discovered evidence, and look at
how phone data, volunteer searches, and the unforgiving landscape around
Philosopher Falls have reshaped in the leading theory in Selene's disappearance.
Join us this week as we continue the investigation into
the mysterious disappearance of Selene Kremer.
Speaker 3: So, we've never gotten more comments on our episode like hey,
you know big updates in the case, were like, yeah,
we did this episode three years ago, Like.
Speaker 2: Oh, like everyone is aware of the updates. Like a
lot of people, a lot of people are aware of
this show and they're like, hey, let's go.
Speaker 3: They're like, hey, there's these big updates, and I would
reply back like, yeah, we know, we did this three
years ago.
Speaker 2: So you know what I was wondering just now, Yeah,
I wonder how many of those people are listeners who
knew or they just found out about the case and
that there's updates, and then they'd like Go Keyboard Warrior,
all the podcasts like to be important. Yeah, I don't know.
I mean I'm not saying that's a bad thing, Like
we get to find out either way. But I never
thought of it that way, except I always assumed it
was just listeners who remember every episode right and come
back and like, oh, I knew about this, but I
didn't realize that maybe just amongst the lost forms, when
an update goes, everyone just runs to everywhere. It's like
the town crier.
Speaker 3: Yeah. I mean I think for a while there, the
case was blowing back up again and we were showing
up in a lot of the search results.
Speaker 2: That's what I'm saying. They're listening to the like hey,
this is out of date, and then we come comment
and it was just kind of funny.
Speaker 3: People are like almost like mad at us, like hey,
like they're like, yeah, sorry, we did this three years ago.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I wonder what the conversion rate is
on those people. Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 3: But yeah, we released our original episode in August of
twenty twenty.
Speaker 2: Three, so all right, a few years ago.
Speaker 3: So we're just gonna go through a quick location climate
profile and then we'll get into timeline love it.
Speaker 2: So Selene disappeared in one of those spots that looks
like a quick tourist walk on paper, but sits inside
very serious country once you step off the built path.
So Philosopher Falls is a short rainforest track about ten
minutes drive south of the small mining town of Warata
in northwest tans Mania. Ches. I'm the we had computer
issues for like an hour and a half. We should
be done recording right now, and it's thrown me off
on the fridge in the Tarkien Fringe fringe of the
Darkian near Savage River National Park. Yeah, this is going
to be a rough one with your voice and in
my mental acuity. The drive is a simple sealed then
unsealed road with a small car park in a clearly
marked trailhead leading into cool, temperate rainforest. The form walk
is roughly one point eight miles or three kilometers return,
with about three hundred and fifty to three hundred and
eighty feet or one hundred and fifteen meters of elevation gain,
and is usually graded as an easy to moderate one
to one and a half hour outing to a fenced
viewing platform above multi tiered waterfall. So this is a
very tourist friendly, like kind of paved path that lots
of people do. It's short, quick and sweet, should be
so that tourist friendly track sits at about six hundred
and sixty six fifty meters of elevation in a band
of forest that gets a regular winter snow, icy rain,
and sub zero overnight temperatures. I just never think of
rainforest and snow in ice. I don't. So once you
leave the form path and the safety railings, the terrain
changes immediately steep side slopes dropping towards the creek, slick
roots and mossy rock, tangled her horizontal scrub that forces
you to push and crawl in a maze of old water,
raised cuttings, and informal footpads that are not signposted, not maintained,
and not obvious from above. The broader setting is a
remote is remote by Tasmanian standards, but still close enough
to a town to feel deceptively tame. Waratah is only
about nine to ten kilometers away by road. Yet the
bush around the falls and the Arthur River seven mile
creek corridor is dense, dark and slow to move through,
with limited phone reception and very few obvious landmarks, you're
off Once you're off track, you're off track. Yeah. That
combination a short Instagram hike quote unquote at the edge
of serious rainforest winter conditions and a maze of unmarked
features defines the location where Slen parked her car, walked in,
left the trail, and ultimately vanished. So a little bit
about the climate where she met missing is classic West
Coast Tasmania, cool, wet, voltle with winter conditions that can
turn deadly fast if you're lightly Equippedall sits at the
Takana rainforest belt of northwest Tasmania, a region with a cool,
temperate maritime climate, mild by Australian standards, but very wet,
especially on the western slopes. Statewide, summers are comfortable, with
winters cold and windy, with average highs in winter around
eleven to thirteen celsius that's the low fifties on the coast,
and colder again inland at an elevation the broader islands,
winter maximums typically run about three to eleven degrees celsius.
The Stanley and Tarkaine region, which covers Wartaw and the
surrounding rainforest, gets up to two four hundred millimeters of
rainy year, making it one of the wettest parts of
Tasmania and keeping the rainforest lush, but trails frequently met wet,
muddy and slippery. Up in the rainforest where the Philosopher
Falls track runs at roughly six hundred to six hundred
and fifty meters of elevation. That maritime pattern translates into
frequent low cloud, regular rain and drizzle, and a lot
of cold, damp days even outside midwinter. In winter and
early spring, it's common to see snowfalls, icy winds, and
overnight frosts on the higher ground, with daytime highs sometimes
only just above freezing and the wind chill pushing perceived
temperatures lower. Walker's trip reports talk about raining and the
forest dripping as a normal experience, and locals warn that
weather can pivot quickly from clear to sleet or hail,
especially around fronts, exactly the pattern that was in place
during the June July twenty twenty three season, when freezing temperatures,
snow and rain triggered a bush walker's a weather alert
for the Warataw area. I'm gonna look up what that
is when you're talking, Okay, A bushwalker's weather alert that
mix cold air, high rainfall, frequent wind, and rapid weather
changes over rugged shaded terrain creates high hypothermia risks for
anyone caught out without proper insulation, waterproofs, and shelter partiarticularly
in June when the wet season is ramping up and
days are short. Tell us about Selene Kremer.
Speaker 3: Mike, Yeah, so real quick here. Her name was Selene Kremer.
She was born June thirteenth of nineteen ninety two. Her
last confirmed sighting was June seventeenth, twenty twenty three, when
she was reported missing. June twenty sixth of twenty twenty three.
Like Joe said, she was thirty one at the time
of her disappearance. She was approximately five foot five to
five foot seven. We don't have a reported weight, but
she was described as average build. She had brown hair,
brown eyes, no other widely reported distinguishing marks like tattoos
or scars. Okay, clothing and gears she was last seen in,
so she was believed to being dressed for a short
light day hike, not an overnight or multi day trip.
Reports and later Fine suggests she wore layered clothing, including
a thermal top and a polar fleece jacket with additional
basic Graham protection improvised from a garbage bag, and she
carried a small pack with limited food and water and
her phone. Personality wise, she was portrayed by family and
friends as very adventurous and curious and optimistic, someone who
loved nature and travel and who had saved and planned
for a long Australian trip for years. And you know,
she was very comfortable with independent and solo travel to
remote areas, and this is backed up by a lot
of her social media posts and photos. Far as medical issues,
there was nothing publicly indicated that I have any significance,
you know, pre existing conditions such as seizures or cardiac
issues or any mobility issues and pretty much just a
healthy adult. There really wasn't anything to go on for
that occupation hobby. Back in Belgium, Selene worked in roles
that allowed her to save and then take it extended
travel time. Sources sometimes describe her as having an ordinary
job rather than a professional guiding her outdoor career and
her hobbies were travel, hiking, photography. She was actively exploring
Tasmania at this time. Sounds like a fun, fun trip
Joe's got some pictures over her that he's showing on
the screen here.
Speaker 2: Not yet. I always do that, yep, experience in the wilderness.
Speaker 3: So Selene had enough outdoor experience to really be comfortable
during solo hikes on mark trails and foreign countries. She
had spent months traveling around the island visiting popular natural
sites and appeared very confident on maintain trails. At the
same time, though, there is no sign she was a
specialist pushwalker as they call him out there, and evidence
suggests she treated Philosopher Falls as a short tourist walk,
not a serious backcountry trip. So, like we said, light clothing,
no overnight gear, stuff like that. So her experience level
for what she intended to do is pretty normal. I mean,
the trail she was taking was well maintained quick, it
was going to be in and out, so you know, nothing,
no red flags there. So we'll jump right into timeline
here and I will cover the timeline kind of leading
up to our original episode, and then we'll go into
the new theory or the new developments, and then at
the end we're going to play our old theories. I
love it, and then we will discuss the new theories
that have come about since the New Discoveries. Our timeline
starts early twenty twenty three, so Sleen had been living
in Tasmania for about six months, using Hobart as a
loose base while she explored the island. She spent that
time hiking and sight seeing, and on February twenty second
of twenty twenty three, she posted a photo from the
top of Mount Wellington with the caption a Little Devil
in Tasmania, which was a snapshot of how much she
had fallen in love with landscape. Her family would later
go on to say that she had already booked her
next step, a fairy trip on the Spirit of Tasmania
to Victoria on June twenty first. Unfortunately, this was a
booking she never made. In the months before winter, she
became especially drawn to the temperate rainforests and old mining
country in the northwest around Warta and the Philosopher Falls.
She's been all over the island. It's mid June two
thousand and three, twenty twenty three. In the days leading
up to her disappearance, Sleen stayed in interminute touch with
friends and family back in Belgium. Early media reports put
her last contact somewhere between the twelfth and sixteenth of June,
reflecting that no one initially knew the exact day she
stopped replying. Police later summarized that she had not been
in contact since the twelfth, but they were clear that
the last confirmed sighting came a little later. By Saturday,
June seventeenth, she had traveled to Warataw, a small historic
mining town about nine kilometers from Flaster Falls trailhead. Multiple
police briefings and news stories now agree that this is
the last time anyone definitively remembered seeing her, with Inspector
Andrew Hansen later calling it the last confirmed sighting and
describing her as alone driving a white Honda CRV, and
at some point in that day she drove the short
unsealed road from town out to Flaster Falls car Park.
The main track from there is a graded signposted one
point six mile out and back walk through dense rainforest
to a waterfall viewing platform. But beyond that built path,
like Shoe described, the country becomes very remote, steep and
tangled with vegetation. Easy hike if you stay on, very
difficult if you go off trail at all. So on
June seventeenth, Selene left her Honda at the car park.
From all intents and purposes, was a short day hike
to the falls and back. She was, like I said earlier,
only equipped for a light outing, no overnight gear, no
heavy cold weather layers, which police emphasized this early on
in the search, so it was very important for them
to mention that it was going to be a very
light walk. For and for many months, the only solid
framework for her movements that day came from police statements
that her phone was believed to have lost signal around
the twentieth of June, and that she likely left the
car sometime in that window for a day walk. Later,
privately commissioned analysis of tower hits and at base GPS
lugs added more granularity to her movements, placing her leaving
the car park in mid afternoon, following the track to
the falls, and then continuing beyond the platform into scrubby
steep ground above the waterfall. But they treated those details
as tentative because they didn't come from the initial police record.
So in those reconstructions, her phone's GPS shows positions along
a water race line and up to and up onto
a ridge, with a final recorded point around four eighteen pm,
as she appears to turn back off track into the rain.
Police themselves stayed in their statements to the public very broad.
They said they believe she left the mark trail, became
lost and confused and very dense brush, and never made
it back to the car before dark. What everyone could
agree on at this time was that after late afternoon
on the seventeenth, no one saw her return to the
car park, no further calls or messages went out, and
the Honda remained locked and unattended. So between June eighteenth
and twenty fifth, other walkers continued to use Lost or
Falls track. When the missing person's investigation got rolling, police
later said they heard from several hikers who had been
in the area between the seventeenth and the end of
the month, with memories of cars in the car park
and people on the trail. One specific appeal went out
for a person on the trail around two thirty pm Sunday,
June eighteenth. Officers stressed this was not a suspect, just
someone who might help fill in the timeline. The walker
was eventually identified and interviewed, but didn't have any anything
that definitively pinned down Selene's movements, so then June twenty
first came and went without her boarding the Spirit of
Tasmania to Victoria. That missed fairy was a huge red
flag for her family and friends, who had been expecting
to hear from her as she crossed to the mainland.
As days passed with no messages and no sign of
her on the ferry manifest they escalated their concern to
the Tasmanian authorities. It's now June twenty sixth. It's a
Monday of twenty twenty three. Tasmanian Police receive a formal
concern for welfare report from Selene's friends and family. Publicly,
they described a Belgian woman traveling the state in a
white Honda CRV, last seen in Hobart and believed to
be headed toward the West coast, and asked anyone who
had seen her or her vehicle since June twelfth to
contact them. The next day, June twenty seventh, officers checking
likely west coast locations right away found her SUV parked
at the car park. The vehicle was locked and unattended.
There was no trace of Selene in the immediate area.
Search and Rescue teams supported by a police drone then
immediately began searching around the car park and along the
walking track, and police closed the whole area to the
public so they could work without any interference. And it
looks like Joe is showing some pictures.
Speaker 2: Of the yes search, look at all that is? Yeah,
it is gnarly.
Speaker 3: That is some thick jungle.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the bush, the bush? Right, I had a search
and the bush.
Speaker 3: Then, Mike, I had a guy the other day delivered
door dash to our house that sounded like the Crocodile Hunter.
Speaker 2: It was pretty funny bringing in some doll dash. I
Mike I almost like.
Speaker 3: Asked him, like, could you record a few lines from me?
Speaker 2: Like some dar dash lines in Australia show? Yeah, did
you know why?
Speaker 3: I don't know?
Speaker 2: Do it? Next time? I will order from the same guy.
I have to figure out who who is? You should
be able to look up your driver. Yeah, I don't remember,
like you know, go on your app and learn history.
What do you mean, of course? Do you remember what
you ate? What do you deliver? I was shrimp on
a ball eight right? Where was I playing? Knife? Spoony?
Speaker 3: Knife, spooney, that's not a knife.
Speaker 2: So you played naifey spoony before.
Speaker 1: Okay, so sorry, I'm just gonna swap my section out
with like an Australian guy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, crocking. My threat's been hurt. Got a bit ill
the other day from the little lads running around.
Speaker 3: All right, It's now Wednesday, June twenty eighth. Ground teams
and drone and the drone unit continued to grid the
Philosopher Falls area with a police helicopter on standby. There
was a cold front rolling over Tasmania's west, which meant
conditions were already deteriorating. There was light snowfalling, a bushwalker's
weather alert was active, and nighttime temperatures were dropping below freezing.
By June twenty ninth, Inspector Anthea Maingey was blunt about
the seriousness of the situation. She laid out what had
been done ground cruise drones, planned helicopter sorties, and underline
that no sign of Sleen had turned up since the
car was found. She warned that the combination of freezing temperatures,
snow and rain had created conditions not survivable for the
length of time that celine is thought to have been
exposed in the wilderness, and this was a conclusion obviously
backed by medical advice and based on what she was
wearing and packed with her she was not prepared for
conditions below freezing with snow and wind and all that stuff.
So at this stage police believed her car had been
sitting in the car park since at least June twentieth,
and later refinements to this suggested it might have been
there since as early as June seventeenth, based on witness
reports and phone activity analysis. But throughout they hammered the
point that she had only packed for a light day
when she left.
Speaker 2: Okay, So Bushwicker's Weather ALERTE was a specific weather alert
advised by meteorological agencies in Australia, warning hikers and campers
of forecast conditions at post severe risk outdoor safety. That
like the triggers are what you'd expect, high heat, high winds, cold, wet,
stuff like that. Yeah, but best practices are saying if
they issue a Bushwalker's Weather Alert, like you're supposed to postpone,
cancel or completely re route your trip to avoid the
affected areas. They're not saying like be careful or dress appropriately.
They're just saying like, just don't just don't do it.
So they must only do that if it's very hazardous,
and if we have some listeners from down on that
you can let us know if that's true.
Speaker 3: I wonder in the US what that would be, like
a severe like a winter storm warning if they yes, but.
Speaker 2: They don't ever like say, hey, I guess, yeah, I guess,
Like there's probably somewhere written like if we issue this,
this is the record.
Speaker 3: Probably like yeah, like if they issue one for like Yoseboy,
maybe they add some language like change your plans.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's like when you were there and it was
on fire. Yeah, and like, hey, maybe you don't camp here. Yeah,
it's on fire.
Speaker 3: There's literally ash falling from the sky.
Speaker 2: Maybe. Yeah, you see how everyone's leaving their homes. Yes,
don't go into the woods either. Yeah. Okay, I guess
I could have guessed that, but I wanted to make
sure it was correct. Yeah.
Speaker 3: So it's now Friday, June thirtieth, and the search now
is focusing more on the waterfall and gorge itself. Search
and rescue specialists repelled from the viewing platform down towards
the base of Philosopher Falls, checking ledges, cliff faces, and
thick vegetation along the watercourse or any signs of a fall,
maybe a shelter or drop gear. Walking tracks stayed close
again to the public while they worked. It's now July first.
This is when Tasmanian SES teams brought in ATVs to
work forestry and access roads around the falls. They extend,
you know, extending the search net outwards. While detectives got
piecing together her movements between the seventeenth and when she
was reported missing, people who'd walk there in the period
continued to forward with what they'd seen. On Sunday, July second,
Search and Rescue and SES personnel ran a track offset
search along Butler's Road in the morning. In the afternoon,
the weather finally cooperated enough for the Westpac Rescue helicopter
to fly, giving them an aerial view of the Philosopher
Falls region that hadn't been possible in the earlier low
cloud and snow. All Right, so we're getting into the
final update of our previous episode. So it is July
ninth and tenth of twenty twenty three. So after almost
two straight weeks of operations in this crazy statement snow
affected rainforest, Tasmanian police did a full review of the search.
By Sunday, July ninth, they were already signaling a wind down.
On Monday, July tenth, Commander Stuart Wilkinson formally announced that
the major ground and air search around Warsaw and the
Philosopher Falls area was being suspended. He walked through just
how much had been thrown at the case, police and
SES ground crews, specialist swift water teams, ATVs, drones, and
repeated helicopter missions, and acknowledged that considerable search efforts have
been undertaken in difficult terrain and treacherous weather conditions, but
unfortunately Sleen has not been located. He also made it
clear that, based on medical advice, she could not have
survived the duration and severity of the conditions she likely
experienced since going missing, and at the same time he
emphasized that the missing person investigation itself stayed active. The
message was boots were coming off the ground for now,
but the file was not being closed. So that's where
our old episode left off. We are now going to
pick up the new developments in the case since our
last episode. It's now late July twenty twenty three, so
new pieces of information later that month, which was primarily
refined phone activity analysis and possible earlier sightings over Honda
the car park were enough to justify one more targeted push.
On Friday July twenty eighth, Tasmanian Police called in a
new South Wales Police could have her dog team to
search a fresh area of interest around Philosopher Falls and
Ward Zone. Inspector Mangay said this updated phone data had
given them the tighter focus area and that police and
SES crews had already been through it on foot that
week without finding anything.
Speaker 2: The dog team worked through.
Speaker 3: The weekend, but by Monday, July thirty, First Commander Wilkinson
had to announce that this renewed effort also ended with
no sign of Selene. He repeated the line that when
a person remains missing, the case never closes, and this
is something that we've see all the time in cases
we cover, so now it's when it starts getting interesting.
Two twenty four is Selene's family retained Australian private guest
investigator can Gamble to re examine the case, believing that
further analysis of digital data and on the ground searching
might reveal what the twenty twenty three operations missed. With
the family's permission, Gamble obtained access to her phone and
Google account data, reconstructing app based GPS lugs and tower
connections from the day she disappeared. His analysis suggested that
after leaving the march trail near the falls, Selene had
pushed into the section of horizontal scrub and possibly followed
a water race alignment away from the track before her
phone's GPS activity ceased in the afternoon.
Speaker 2: What do you got here? So, I'm I was looking
at what horizontal scrub was? Yeah? Is that something that
I don't think we have here? And it's a tree
that girls? Let me pull up the I'm trying to
find like a video of it. Yeah, I just went
to like full screen some very ob naxious like legitimately
don't know how to get out of this. Facebook. There
we go, Facebook, you dummy. I'm gonna read exactly what
it says on here. Give me an ai. It sounds
like you're asking about the vory is horizontal scrub found
in Tasmania. It gets his name because its slender trunks
grow vertically, topple over and fall down horizontal, creating an
almost impenetrable tangled mess of vegetation. That bushwalkers must traverse
sounds awful. Yeah, because it's so incredibly solid and dense,
Walkers often have to literally tread or walk on top
of this elevated layer of scrub, which can sometimes sit
several meters above the actual forest floor. Wow, so you're
like walking in the canopy ish type of like, yeah,
just walking high up, navigating through or falling through. The
tangled mess is a major hazard in Tasmania's wilderness and
is the cause of significant injury, getting disoriented and being
severely delayed on the trail. Here's what you need to
know about the infamous horizontal scrub. So basically like walking
on top of plants that can just give way, and
they said they'll get covered with moss because it's the rainforest.
So it's not only are you walking on these branches
that have gone other sideways. Yeah, you now have moss
on it, so it like blankets it. So if there
is like a hole or like a small twig that
you'd like crack through, it's like you're just stepping into
a hole. Sounds dangerous and sounds super dangerous. Hike. Yeah,
So that's gnarly. I'm glad we don't have that yeah.
Speaker 3: So Campbell concluded that she had left the main path,
tried to cut back towards the car park or refuge,
and became very badly lost in extremely dense bush as
the winter rains set in, with no evidence of another
person's involvement. So also Tasmanian filmmaker and YouTuber Rob Parsons
became interested in the case. Around the same time, he
began producing a multi part series, The Search for Selene Kramer,
and his name came up a lot in comments on
our episode. Everyone's like, you need to check out this
guy Rob Parson who is doing a like a search
and recording it. I mean, I'm very familiar with his name.
So he called it the Search for Selene Kremer, and
he combined on location explorations, interviews, and reconstructions of a
route based on Gamble's data. His videos, hosted on YouTube
and heavily shared via Facebook and Instagram, reached a global
audience and gradually recruited an informal army of local hikers
and bushmen willing to volunteer in the private search efforts
in the Philosopher Falls area. Throughout twenty twenty four, small
groups associated with this effort returned to the bush near
the area, scouting ridges, gullies and the Arthur River corridor
for any sign of gear or remains. Unfortunately, none of
these early trips produced breakthrough, so between twenty twenty four
and twenty five mid twenty twenty five, it was really
just kind of slow progress. So by June of twenty
twenty four, exactly a year after he disappearance, commentaris in
outlets like The Tasmanian Times observed that Sleen's whereabouts were
no closer to closure than they were a year earlier.
They noted that Tasmania Police and SES had effectively drawn
a blank and were unlikely to launch further official ground
searches without new information, leaving most on the groundwork to
family backed and volunteer efforts. During autumn of twenty twenty five,
police did quietly recommence a targeted search in the area
northwest of Philosopher Falls, based on updated phone paying information
forwarded from the private investigation reports that Jess Gamble was
present or consulted during that operation. Even with this insider assistance,
the searchers did not locate any conclusive evidence, no clothing, bones,
or gear, so by mid twenty twenty five, Ken Gamble
to me that he had letter anticipated nearly a dozen
separate searches in the area, and most of them documented
in some way by Parsons videos or referenced in Reddit
discussions of people following the case.
Speaker 2: So, okay, those are the people that came and let
let us know we need update. Yes, probably, so real quick,
real quick. Here's that a good video of it. Yeah.
Can you see how like, yeah, far down the forest
floor is.
Speaker 3: Think how slowly you'd boom moved through that?
Speaker 2: So like look at this, you got to walk on that. Yeah,
so if you slip and fall there, you can bust
your leg with a heavy pack on. Yeah, you're like,
it's like the second floor of the forest. Yeah, that's gnarly.
That's so wild that there's just people like hiking on
different levels. Yeah, that's weird, the next level of hiking.
Yeah nice, all right, all right, all right that training
video for like steakhouse. Yeah, do you watch a game yesterday?
All right, it's like training people how to talk in
the buffet line that it's like for like harassment. It
is it still hot out there? All right?
Speaker 3: All right, go ahead, all right, So it is December
of twenty twenty five, we have a major shift in
the case. At this time, Selene's friends and family, coordinated
with Gamble and Parsons, organized a renewed five day search
operation Your Philosopher False, drawing about thirty volunteers, including several
of her Belgian friends who flew out.
Speaker 2: Specifically to help.
Speaker 3: This privately organized search was not led by police, but
police were aware of it and offered support. On December thirteenth,
on the hours into operation, the team made their first
concrete discovery since twenty twenty three. In dense scrub at
a location variously described as roughly sixty meters from our
last known GPS coordinates and around three meters off the
walking path. A volunteer at the back of the line,
identified by the media's Tony Hage, spotted a purple Samsung phone.
So Celia's friends immediately recognized it as her phone.
Speaker 2: So they found her phone.
Speaker 3: Can you imagine that's luck?
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's because like just looking at these search photos,
we'll hear I mean, this is like a little more open.
But that's if she walked exactly here, exactly there. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 3: So the police quickly confirmed that the device plunged to
Selene and issued a media release stating that the phone
would undergo forensic examination. They also announced that in light
of this find, the police resources would formally join the
independent search effort, with trained search and rescue officers and
SEES volunteers to be on the ground whenever weather allowed.
In the days that followed, the same volunteer group located
additional items in the vicinity. They located a water bottle,
a plastic garbage bag that appeared to have been fashioned
into a makeshift poncho. Gamble described these finds in interviews,
cautioning that it was not yet certain that the water
bottle was Sleens, but acknowledging it is a significant clue
in an area otherwise devoid of human debris. So police
collected these items for DNA and trace analysis. In some
media posts and Reddit threads tracking the search shared rough coordinates,
photos of the dense horizontal scrub wall where the phone lay,
and screenshots of ABC coverage. One Reddit user summarized that
the phone had been located roughly, like I said, sixty
meters from her last known position, about five hundred meters
from the waterfall and trail. The weather, unfortunately would take
another turn during this search, so there was heavy rain, hail,
possible snow both days, which forced the group and police
to pause operations for several days while forensic work on
the phone and items begin. It is now January twenty
twenty six, so only a few months ago. As summer
progressed and river level's fluctuated, volunteers continued to scour new ground,
informed by phone day to reconstruction. One of them, a
Bernie local, Jared Boys, had become deeply involved after watching
Parsons videos in following the case online. Motivated by a
desire to finally bring answers to Selene's family, he planned
his own solo search along the Arthur River, downstream from
the waterfall. On Wednesday, January twenty eighth of twenty twenty six,
while traversing tough country several several kilometers northeast of the
main falls area, Boys came across two bones he thought
could be human. He noted their location about three kilometers
northeast of a water race alignment where Selene was believed
to have walked, and immediately contacted police. Inspector Andrew Hansen
later told media that a pathologist had reviewed images of
the bones and confirmed they were human. He stressed that
though at these early stages there was nothing else at
the site, no clothing, no personal items to directly indicate identity,
but acknowledged that the proximity to where Selene went missing
made it as strong possibility the remains were hers. As
he put it at the press conference, police had to
treat the remains as a separate investigation until formal identification
could be made, but there really was no doubt that
the proximity of those bones is close enough to the
area where she went missing that it was very strongly
considered to be hers. News of this discovery spread quickly
via ABC and social media, and all across the Reddit sphere.
People were talking about retisphere. Okay, it's now late January.
Early February twenty twenty six. With discovery of the bones
near Arthur River, police launched a fresh, tightly focused operation.
On the twenty ninth and thirtieth, they winched a team
of six specialist search and rescue officers into an isolated
section of the Arthur River Corridor downstream from the initial
fine site. The team conducted a line search along a
three hund and fifty to five hundred meters stretch of river,
moving upstream and downstream, checking banks, snags, and the riverbed
itself for further remains and items. During this search, police
located additional bones and pieces of clothing, including a polar
fleece jacket believed to be Selenes. Commander Nathan Johnson noted
that many of these items were found under debris or
lodged in the riverbed.
Speaker 2: Wow, so they were like thorough, Yeah, that's so difficult.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Once they had like you find a couple bones,
like you and you like, ye pick up every rock
and sure.
Speaker 2: Still like the odds, Yeah, like finding bone in a
river that's like got rocks and moving water.
Speaker 3: And just yeah yeah, it said, you know it was
found under debris and lodged in the riverbed. It underscored
how easily the evidence was missed earlier in the searches,
and at this time the train and weather remained punishing,
so at one point the Star team had to camp
overnight in the bush because weather prevented the helicopter from
extracting them. And after two days without further significant discoveries,
police announced the search. We paused while forensic analysis of
the newly recovered remains and clothing proceeded. It is now
February tenth, twenty twenty six, so on Sunday and Mondays.
Shortly after that pause, police resumed a very targeted search
of the same Arthur River section, again inserting personal personnel
by helicopter as conditions permitted. This two day operation produced
perhaps the most conclusive non DNA evidence. They found five
more bones, two teeth, and a Honda KHARKI.
Speaker 2: So, five more bones, how's that non DNA? Can you
not get DNA from a bone? From a bone?
Speaker 3: I don't, I don't think so. After it's been let's
see what mmmm.
Speaker 2: They were in the river? Yeah, yes, you can extract
DNA from the bone found the river. Because the hard
mineralized structure of the bone shields genetic material. DNA could
survive water submersion for months or even years, though the
river environment accelerates degradation. So I bet it probably was
getting beaten and worn down on box and stuff that
they couldn't get any But I.
Speaker 3: Mean, so they found teeth. You might be able to
match down a records with teeth. Yeah, and they found
a Honda cry So pretty conclusive.
Speaker 2: But as to say, if you can determine their human bones.
Then you find stuff that's very clearly hers. Yeah, that
is seemingly more conclusive. Yeah.
Speaker 3: And Andrew Johnston told media that the car key had
been formally verified as belonging to Sleen by using its
unlocker white Hanta CRV.
Speaker 2: Very scientific. Yeah, I know right, yeah, Yeah, it's the
one yeah.
Speaker 3: Which remained in police custody. He described the search along
the three hundred and fifty meter river section as comprehensive
and systematic, with many items found buried or wedged under
a debris you know. The media and social media really
picked up on this, and Reddit threads summarized developments. People
are noting other items of clothing found, including a bra,
thermal top, polar fleece jacket had been found alongside skeletal remains.
Private investigator Ken Gamble publicly reflected with the phone remains
and key now located, investigtors could make a fairly good
determination of what had happened.
Speaker 2: I did just ask to like close the sloop. The
odds of the key fob unlocking a similar car. Newer
models practically zero, roughly one in several billion. Older models
can be anywhere from one in a million to one
in several thousands, so it's pretty definitive that that's Hers.
I'm like, this is the longest shop I wanted to actually,
I just never thought of that though, Yeah, what are
the odds because of the rolling codes.
Speaker 3: So it's now late February. Over the following weeks, the
recovered bones and teeth went through a multi step forensic process,
examination by pathologists, anthropologists, tenel comparisons against records obtained from Belgium,
and DNA analysis by Forensic Science Services of Tasmania. On
February twenty seventh, Tasmania Police announced that, with Selene's family's permission,
they were able to say that the remains found near
Philosopher Falls and along Arthur River had been provisionally identified
at Hers. Commander Johnson explained that expert reports that provided
compelling evidence that the remains belonged to Slean, though the
former legal identification would still come via Corners report. He
added that in the light of this, there would be
no further planned searches of the Arthur Rivers. Adjusting investigators
considered the recovery phase effectively complete, so.
Speaker 2: They did a really good job getting all the stuff.
That's pretty gnarly.
Speaker 3: So if you can, and I can added out the
dead space in between this, but find our old episode
and maybe play a few minutes of our theories.
Speaker 2: Okay, finally back in a time when you like, right here,
my voice worked. Yes, let's see how close I am
like to getting it? Show the screen. It's cool that
they have the video on Spotify too, just so everyone knows.
You can watch the video of us from Where is
this from this Spotify web player episode eighty eight? This
must be from Patreon? Nope, it is, Yes, subscriber is Oh, okay.
There's things that don't make sense when you when you
have a search like that. If you're not prepared and
it's cold, you're not going to be going crazy off trail.
And even if she did, that's where you have that dog.
Let's say it said the best one was recorded again
in miles twelve miles away of sensing a cadaver. Yeah,
this trail is less than a mile at one point
six miles or whatever. Yeah, so if you have a
dog on that trail, let's let's benefit the doubt. Okay,
maybe it's half as good. Yeah, should be able to
pick up a cent six miles away? Maybe maybe only
two miles away. That's a pretty big radius around that
trail that if you're not prepared at that's thick as
all get out. Yeah, Like I would look at that
and say, she is not there. Yeah, So if she's
not there in the car, is that means somebody removed
her or she got in another car with somebody else,
or something is going on. That doesn't make sense.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And there was no indication of her car like
broke down and she tried to you know, hitchhike back.
Speaker 2: So yeah, very puzzling.
Speaker 1: That's why I'm leaning towards Obviously, not having the required
gear for those conditions is a big probability of why
she's missing. But and the thickness of the location is
why searchers may have not a founder. Like we said,
she may have gotten hypothermia and then was making poor decisions.
And one interesting theory too is because she's from the
Northern Hemisphere and she's hiking in the Southern Hemisphere, she
may have gotten if she's got hypothermia, now was getting confused.
She may have gotten mixed up directionally because you're your
directions are going to be different if you're hiking in
the Southern hemisphere.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but you know, like, how so explain this? It
doesn't make sense to me.
Speaker 3: So maybe this this is really because.
Speaker 2: The seasons are opposite. But north is still north, South
is still south.
Speaker 1: I guess I don't know. I was just trying to
think of another theory and why maybe she directionally got confused.
I mean the sun.
Speaker 2: Yeah that's all. I don't know. I'm just thinking out
loud here. Yeah, no, no, that's fine, but I don't think. Well, no,
I'm just gonna question. I think you we have.
Speaker 3: The audio from the computer plane.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's why you could hear it in your ears?
Could you not hear it?
Speaker 1: No?
Speaker 2: I could? Okay, Yeah, that's funny. You hit like the
nail on the head. Like obviously they don't know exactly
what happened, but you're but you said, oh, this arch
just might not have found anything, and that's true. Well
I was way off, Hollywood.
Speaker 1: Hey one of us has Hey, you get to go, Hollywood.
This is the most likely scenario. Now, this is the
theory that police and the private investigators believe happens lost
off trail death by exposure and or drowning.
Speaker 3: So not like super shocking. So the you know, like
I said, this is the working theory, so what happened
was and this is what they believe happened. Through phone data,
reconstructions and on the groundwork shows that Selene went beyond
the end of the maintained philosopher false She followed an
old water race and climbed onto a ridge above the
falls instead of simply turning back on the form trail.
Later analysis suggests she checked Google Maps, saw her car
directly south and either chose to inadvertently follow a shortcut
line rather than staying on the mark path. That line
pushed her into dense horizontal scrub and steep untracked slopes,
which we showed is terrible place to be in late
afternoon in the winter down there, and her phone data
does show like a shelter attempt, So the last GPS
points and the December twenty twenty five discoveries the phone
the makeshift pacho from a garbage bag branded water bottle
suggests she dropped or lost the phone while forcing herself
through the scrub, then attempted to shelter at a natural
wind break as the rain and cold set in. From
that off track position, both the private and skaters and
the police reconstruction argues she likely moved downslope drawn by
the sound, and trained towards the water race and then
the Arthur River seven mile Creeks system. Then the remains
the clothing and carcaying were recovered along that three hundred
and fifty meters stretch of the river, plus the way
the bones and fabric were lodged in the riverbed fit
a scenario where she either succumbed to hypothermia near the
water and was later scattered by flow, or she fell
or was swept into the river and drowned while trying
to cross it at the time. So the reason why
they think this is the top theory is that it
matches her known route, the GPS trail, the location of
her phone, improvised gear, and the eventual location of her remains.
It's consistent with expert medical advice from the time that
they were warning that there's no way she's going to
survive this with the gear she had, and again police
and the private investigators explicitly said there was no evidence
of foul play and that misadventure really was the cause
of her death. Some side theories this is a variant
just an injury hypothermia near the river. I mean, we
don't need to really go into that much. That's kind
of the same theory. These are other minority theories.
Speaker 2: I was gonna say, I feel like they hit the
nail right up. Oh yeah.
Speaker 3: So one of the minority theories is a fall near
the waterfall. Some early reddit and forum comments floated the
idea that she might have slipped well observing the falls
fallen from the viewing areas.
Speaker 2: Is this before they recover this up? But they're saying
that she slipped and the falls swept her down there.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's what like early theories were saying that. So
they thought she maybe had fallen. So our teams repelled
below the viewing platform and searched the waterfowl area intensely.
In twenty twenty three, her phone and all her gear
and remains were eventually found well beyond and downstream of
the falls. So not right under Northern hemisphere internal compass theory.
This is what I was trying to get at before.
So a popular discussion thread idea was that being from
the Northern Hemisphere, Sleen may have misjudged the Sun's path
and internal compass leading her ahead the wrong way when
she was trying to shortcut back to her car. And
there is a small kernel of truth here in the
sense that she likely tried to take a straight line
shortcut south based on her phone map and got badly
off route. But the Northern Hemisphere compass explanation is more
of a metaphor than a concrete cause.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I agree with that. Yeah, but that's what I
was trying to get at in the original theory. I'm
sure I was just giving you a crap No, I mean, rightly. So, Yeah,
just like Straddle.
Speaker 2: Months, people text me when they hear that they listen
to the show.
Speaker 1: It's like it's hilarious, Cat's unknown bingo, Yeah, oh yeah,
smart your card and then finally foul play. They've basically
completely removed that other than kind of the fringe missing
four on one crowd.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was my guess. That was way off.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so what do you think I think? I mean,
your theory at the time was a decent theory because
there was no gear and her car was still there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it makes sense because we had no
data or information, and then as soon as you get
access to all the information, you start seeing everything that's possible. Yeah,
and it becomes pretty straightforward, I guess. So, yeah, I mean,
I'm happy for the family. I'm I'm just trying to
make myself feel better.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, oh hey, one of these times, your Hollywood
theory will be what happens?
Speaker 2: Yeah, No, it's it's good that they got closure. That's
a great way to put it. Because the people that
we've talked to, so we do have a lot of opinions,
and we don't know what goes on every case, but
we all so I have had the opportunity to meet
the real family members of some of the cases we've
done with, and all of them say the same thing.
All of them say if they're of the group that
have found the remains. Eventually, they're very, you know, somber
happy that they can close the door, and everyone who
doesn't just is hoping that something will turn up one day. Yeah,
and they'll know they want the closure. So it is
really great for her family that they can get that closure.
Very sad obviously because it's going to reopen old wounds,
but it's always a good thing when you can get
the closure. And yeah, what happened. So there you go.
So I think they're right. I mean, yeah, the Devil's
and the details and now they have the details. So yeah,
thanks for tuning into our show. We appreciate all of
you for listening and sharing locations and known with your
friends and family. Be sure to like and follow us
on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, and YouTube, where you can watch
videos of each episode. Also, if you'd like to support
the show monetarily, please visit our website or Facebook store
to buy some Sweet Sweet swag, and you can subscribe
to your Patron account and YouTube as well as Apple
to have access to special events, additional shows for paid
customers only, and you can watch a video on Spotify
if you're a Patron member. Yeah. Lastly, when enjoying the
beauty of nature, whether backpacking, camping, or simply taking a walk,
always remember to leave no trace. Thanks and we will
see you all next time.