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True Murder with your 32 00:01:29.879 --> 00:01:33.120 host journalist and author Dan Zupanski. 33 00:01:41.200 --> 00:01:41.760 Good Evening. 34 00:01:42.359 --> 00:01:46.000 A devoted father, one of the most accomplished criminal law 35 00:01:46.079 --> 00:01:50.079 scholars in the country. Someone wanted him dead, but why. 36 00:01:50.640 --> 00:01:54.640 On the morning of July eighteenth, twenty fourteen, forty one 37 00:01:54.719 --> 00:01:58.359 year old Florida State law professor Dan Markel dropped his 38 00:01:58.439 --> 00:02:01.599 boys off at preschool at the gym and headed home 39 00:02:01.640 --> 00:02:05.439 to his quiet tree canopied neighborhood. Within seconds of pulling 40 00:02:05.439 --> 00:02:08.840 into his garage, two thirty eight caliber bullets fired from 41 00:02:08.919 --> 00:02:12.560 point blank range were lodged in his brain. His brutal 42 00:02:12.599 --> 00:02:17.000 slaying defied explanation. The case went stone cold for nearly 43 00:02:17.039 --> 00:02:21.360 two years before dogget pursued by the Tallahassee Police and 44 00:02:21.400 --> 00:02:24.639 the FBI resulted in the arrest of two lifelong criminals 45 00:02:24.879 --> 00:02:28.240 who had driven ten hours from Miami with one singular 46 00:02:28.280 --> 00:02:32.840 purpose to murder the esteem professor were his ex wife, 47 00:02:33.120 --> 00:02:38.039 Wendy Adelson and her South Florida family. The masterminds behind 48 00:02:38.039 --> 00:02:42.039 this horrific crime. Extreme Punishment is the riveting story of 49 00:02:42.080 --> 00:02:46.120 a divorce between two law professors that spiraled out of control, 50 00:02:46.360 --> 00:02:50.080 wealthy in laws, hell bent on revenge, and an unlikely 51 00:02:50.199 --> 00:02:53.639 love triangle, and the relentless quest to bring Dan's killers, 52 00:02:53.800 --> 00:02:55.479 all of them to justice. 53 00:02:55.800 --> 00:02:56.599 The book that we're. 54 00:02:56.439 --> 00:03:00.759 Featuring this evening is Extreme Punishment, The chillings true story 55 00:03:00.800 --> 00:03:04.719 of acclaimed law professor Dan Markel's murder, with my special guest, 56 00:03:04.840 --> 00:03:08.639 journalist and author Steven b Epstein. Welcome back to the program, 57 00:03:08.680 --> 00:03:11.680 and thank you so much for this interview. Steven b Epstein, 58 00:03:11.879 --> 00:03:14.000 thanks so much for having me Dan. One slight correction, 59 00:03:14.439 --> 00:03:16.840 not a journalist, I'm an attorney. Thank you so much 60 00:03:16.840 --> 00:03:20.879 for that correction. Let's start as you do right in 61 00:03:20.919 --> 00:03:24.599 the very beginning, and you take us to July eighteenth, 62 00:03:24.759 --> 00:03:29.000 twenty fourteen, and too right next door to two thousand 63 00:03:29.039 --> 00:03:33.280 and two one one six Trescott Drive, Benton Hill's a 64 00:03:33.280 --> 00:03:37.599 suburb of Tallahassee, and the neighbors Jim and Sharon Geiger 65 00:03:38.439 --> 00:03:39.319 what do they see? 66 00:03:39.680 --> 00:03:41.000 In twenty fourteen. 67 00:03:41.319 --> 00:03:44.879 It was actually a little before eleven am. They were 68 00:03:45.080 --> 00:03:48.759 sitting in their living room fiddling on an iPad when 69 00:03:49.360 --> 00:03:52.120 Jim Geiger, who was a seventy two year old grandfather 70 00:03:52.280 --> 00:03:55.919 former school teacher, heard something that sounded like a firecracker 71 00:03:55.960 --> 00:03:58.680 go off toward his front yard. He sprang up from 72 00:03:58.719 --> 00:04:01.439 the left seat they were sitting on and started looking 73 00:04:01.479 --> 00:04:04.960 around trying to figure out what had happened, and eventually 74 00:04:05.159 --> 00:04:07.960 cluded on the fact that the noise had come from 75 00:04:08.439 --> 00:04:11.919 Dan Markel's property just next door. So he goes over 76 00:04:12.360 --> 00:04:15.800 to the driveway, walks up toward the garage, but he 77 00:04:15.879 --> 00:04:19.360 notices that Dan's car is there and it's on, so 78 00:04:19.399 --> 00:04:22.560 he figures everything's fine. He goes back home, and he 79 00:04:22.600 --> 00:04:26.399 figures Dan's going to leave the driveway and go somewhere, 80 00:04:26.480 --> 00:04:29.000 but that doesn't happen. So he goes back a second time, 81 00:04:29.199 --> 00:04:32.319 and when he gets right up beside the car next 82 00:04:32.360 --> 00:04:35.639 to the driver's seat, front window is shattered, the driver's 83 00:04:35.639 --> 00:04:39.040 side window is shattered, and he's stepping on glass, and 84 00:04:39.079 --> 00:04:42.399 he looks inside and Dan Markel is all bloody, slumped 85 00:04:42.439 --> 00:04:44.199 over behind the steering wheel of his car. 86 00:04:44.439 --> 00:04:48.399 At the same time, his wife, Wendy is where is 87 00:04:48.439 --> 00:04:49.920 she and what is she doing? 88 00:04:50.079 --> 00:04:53.040 By that time, Wendy was his ex wife. They had 89 00:04:53.079 --> 00:04:56.639 gotten divorced the prior summer, so they've now been divorced 90 00:04:56.639 --> 00:05:00.439 a little bit more than one year. She is living 91 00:05:00.879 --> 00:05:05.600 about fifteen minutes away, and she's going through her morning 92 00:05:05.680 --> 00:05:08.000 in her home. It's a summer, so neither of them 93 00:05:08.040 --> 00:05:10.759 have teaching responsibilities at Florida State Law School where they 94 00:05:10.839 --> 00:05:13.480 both taught. And she's going about her day now. 95 00:05:13.519 --> 00:05:16.240 She's doing some errands and she's running around. She goes 96 00:05:16.279 --> 00:05:18.920 to a liquor store, and she went to lunch with 97 00:05:18.959 --> 00:05:21.600 a couple of friends. At about two point thirty though, 98 00:05:21.639 --> 00:05:25.439 she's approached by someone correct tell us about that who 99 00:05:25.439 --> 00:05:26.639 approaches her at that time. 100 00:05:27.000 --> 00:05:29.759 The person who approaches her is a police investigator with 101 00:05:29.839 --> 00:05:33.920 the Tallahassee Police Department named Craig Isom, and Craig Isom 102 00:05:34.360 --> 00:05:36.800 says to the three women, is there a Wendy Agelson 103 00:05:36.879 --> 00:05:40.000 here and Wendy She officially says, well, yes, that's me, 104 00:05:40.360 --> 00:05:42.600 and he tells her that there's been an incident and 105 00:05:42.639 --> 00:05:44.639 he needs her to come downtown to the police station 106 00:05:44.720 --> 00:05:45.319 to talk about it. 107 00:05:45.720 --> 00:05:48.879 Now, he wants to speak with her when he gives 108 00:05:48.879 --> 00:05:52.120 her the details, and what are those details, what is 109 00:05:52.160 --> 00:05:52.800 her reaction? 110 00:05:53.120 --> 00:05:55.839 Well, she understand that she was at the police station 111 00:05:56.160 --> 00:06:00.000 from two forty five PM until about seven forty five 112 00:06:00.279 --> 00:06:02.839 or even close to eight o'clock PM, So she was 113 00:06:02.879 --> 00:06:05.800 there for a very long time, and her reactions ranged 114 00:06:05.839 --> 00:06:09.720 the gamut. So she became fairly hysterical upon finding out 115 00:06:09.839 --> 00:06:13.279 that Dan had been shot and that he wasn't going 116 00:06:13.319 --> 00:06:17.040 to survive, And lots of stuff happened during those five 117 00:06:17.079 --> 00:06:19.920 plus hours. In fact, so much so that two entire 118 00:06:20.000 --> 00:06:22.800 chapters chapter two and three of my book are pretty 119 00:06:22.839 --> 00:06:25.480 much just that interview of Wendy Adelson at the police station. 120 00:06:25.959 --> 00:06:29.399 Talk about Wendy Adelson in that five hour interview, and 121 00:06:30.040 --> 00:06:34.199 Investigator Isom felt that it was quite important to talk 122 00:06:34.240 --> 00:06:38.839 to her and talk about the divorce and the divorce proceedings. So, 123 00:06:39.360 --> 00:06:42.759 as you say, much of that is spoken about in 124 00:06:42.800 --> 00:06:46.160 the book. Tell us what she informs him about the 125 00:06:46.160 --> 00:06:49.160 status of their marriage and the reasons for the divorce 126 00:06:49.279 --> 00:06:52.160 and the status of the hearing that was upcoming. 127 00:06:52.319 --> 00:06:54.680 Well, she says a lot of things, and again it's 128 00:06:54.800 --> 00:06:57.680 quite a broad range, but she said that Dan Markel 129 00:06:57.839 --> 00:07:01.360 had been emotionally abusive to her during the marriage, that 130 00:07:01.399 --> 00:07:04.439 they had lots of disagreements. They disagreed about Judaism. They 131 00:07:04.439 --> 00:07:07.279 were both Jewish, but they disagreed about how Jewish they 132 00:07:07.279 --> 00:07:09.720 should be and how Jewish they should raise their two boys. 133 00:07:09.759 --> 00:07:12.519 They disagreed about things about the children, and so on 134 00:07:12.600 --> 00:07:14.319 and so on. But one of the things that you 135 00:07:14.360 --> 00:07:17.079 pick up on fairly quickly from the interview is that 136 00:07:17.279 --> 00:07:21.480 her family members, most significantly her mother Donna, her father Harvey, 137 00:07:21.720 --> 00:07:25.240 and her brother Charlie, really don't like Dan Markel, and 138 00:07:25.279 --> 00:07:27.920 we're angry with him for the way they perceived he 139 00:07:28.079 --> 00:07:31.600 was treating her both during the marriage and especially after 140 00:07:31.680 --> 00:07:34.800 they separated, And she brings them up constantly, and at 141 00:07:34.800 --> 00:07:37.759 one point even says that as a joke, Charlie had 142 00:07:37.800 --> 00:07:40.319 said he had gotten her a large screen TV as 143 00:07:40.360 --> 00:07:43.519 a divorce present because it was cheaper than hiring a 144 00:07:43.600 --> 00:07:46.079 hit man. So there's all kinds of stuff that she 145 00:07:46.199 --> 00:07:48.800 says that pretty much points the finger at her family 146 00:07:48.879 --> 00:07:52.439 members as being mad enough to not necessarily do this, 147 00:07:53.000 --> 00:07:53.920 but to do something. 148 00:07:54.079 --> 00:07:56.399 One of the major things that had happened was that 149 00:07:56.480 --> 00:07:59.839 she had lost again along with her family, the real 150 00:08:00.040 --> 00:08:03.600 location motion to be able to relocate near her family. 151 00:08:03.639 --> 00:08:07.399 Can you explain what she how she explained that to im. 152 00:08:07.720 --> 00:08:10.279 I don't remember the specifics of how she explained it 153 00:08:10.319 --> 00:08:12.839 to IM because it blurs in my mind with what 154 00:08:12.920 --> 00:08:15.399 was actually happening in the relocation battle. And in fact, 155 00:08:15.439 --> 00:08:18.319 there is a chapter in the book, chapter ten, entitled Relocation. 156 00:08:18.800 --> 00:08:20.839 But the long and short of it is Wendy and 157 00:08:20.879 --> 00:08:24.680 Dan wound up in Tallahassee, Florida when Dan got a 158 00:08:24.680 --> 00:08:27.959 assistant professor position on the law faculty in two thousand 159 00:08:27.959 --> 00:08:30.319 and five. Wendy was still in law school at the 160 00:08:30.399 --> 00:08:33.440 University of Miami at the time, and ironically she was 161 00:08:33.440 --> 00:08:35.639 living in Miami, he was living in Washington, d C. 162 00:08:36.120 --> 00:08:40.639 They weren't even engaged at that point, and they decide, 163 00:08:40.799 --> 00:08:43.799 you know what, if this whole thing between us works out, 164 00:08:44.039 --> 00:08:46.360 we'll wind up going wherever I land a teaching job. 165 00:08:46.360 --> 00:08:51.080 They eventually get engaged, and that summer they moved to Tallahassee, 166 00:08:51.120 --> 00:08:54.639 Florida to start a life together with Their wedding tended 167 00:08:54.639 --> 00:08:57.519 to take place in February of two thousand and six, 168 00:08:57.600 --> 00:08:59.360 and so they wind up in this place neither has 169 00:08:59.399 --> 00:09:02.480 ever lived. Wendy's family, as you said, is from South Florida. 170 00:09:02.759 --> 00:09:06.120 She's seven hours away, and she doesn't really want to 171 00:09:06.120 --> 00:09:08.360 be there. Dan didn't really want to be there either. 172 00:09:08.399 --> 00:09:11.600 He wanted to be in a higher profile faculty position 173 00:09:11.639 --> 00:09:14.600 on a faculty at He actually had a job interview 174 00:09:14.639 --> 00:09:16.480 at Berkeley, and he wanted to be at a place 175 00:09:16.519 --> 00:09:19.360 more like that than Florida State. But circumstances being what 176 00:09:19.399 --> 00:09:21.960 they were, they wind up in Tallahassee and they have 177 00:09:22.039 --> 00:09:25.360 two kids, and the kids are both in preschool, and 178 00:09:26.000 --> 00:09:29.240 at the time of the separation, Wendy said, I don't 179 00:09:29.240 --> 00:09:32.519 need to stay here anymore. I'm not married to him anymore. 180 00:09:32.600 --> 00:09:35.159 I want to go back home, and she filed emotion 181 00:09:35.559 --> 00:09:38.679 in the family court to permit her to relocate to 182 00:09:38.960 --> 00:09:42.000 South Florida with the two children, which would require Dan 183 00:09:42.159 --> 00:09:45.440 basically to become a long distance dad. And not surprisingly, 184 00:09:45.559 --> 00:09:48.240 Dan said, no, I'm not agreeing to that, and he 185 00:09:48.360 --> 00:09:51.240 fought very hard to prevent it from happening, and he won. 186 00:09:51.480 --> 00:09:54.799 That was in the summer of twenty thirteen, about a 187 00:09:54.879 --> 00:09:55.919 year before he was killed. 188 00:09:55.960 --> 00:09:59.759 Now back to Tallahassee investigators, how do they proceed with 189 00:10:00.279 --> 00:10:04.240 the limited evidence that they do have, like the eyewitness 190 00:10:04.279 --> 00:10:06.960 testimony of the next door neighbors, how do they proceed? 191 00:10:07.320 --> 00:10:11.440 Well, it was interesting because Jim Geiger had seen the 192 00:10:11.600 --> 00:10:15.320 car leaving the driveway. I'm sorry I left that part 193 00:10:15.320 --> 00:10:18.279 out earlier. I apologize, but when that's why he had 194 00:10:18.279 --> 00:10:21.399 a suspicion that something nefarious had gone on. Was not 195 00:10:21.440 --> 00:10:24.519 only about the firecracker, but he saw a car at 196 00:10:24.559 --> 00:10:27.519 the edge of Dan's driveway that was speeding away, and 197 00:10:27.519 --> 00:10:29.919 that's why he initially went over to see if everything 198 00:10:30.000 --> 00:10:32.759 was okay and was convinced it was when he saw 199 00:10:32.840 --> 00:10:35.279 Dan's car running. But he described that car to the 200 00:10:35.360 --> 00:10:37.759 nine to one to one dispatcher as a light colored 201 00:10:37.799 --> 00:10:41.559 Prius and that was the first clue that investigators had 202 00:10:41.600 --> 00:10:44.039 as to who might have done this to Dan Markel. 203 00:10:44.519 --> 00:10:47.639 Very quickly, they were able to retrace dan steps from 204 00:10:47.679 --> 00:10:49.840 that morning and learn that he had been to his gym, 205 00:10:49.840 --> 00:10:53.679 Premier Fitness, and got security camera footage of the parking lot, 206 00:10:53.679 --> 00:10:56.639 and lo and behold, they saw Dan's Honda Accord, his 207 00:10:56.679 --> 00:10:59.120 black Honed Accord, come into the parking lot about nine 208 00:10:59.159 --> 00:11:01.639 to fifteen that more, and right behind it was a 209 00:11:01.720 --> 00:11:04.399 light colored prius, and they were actually able to see 210 00:11:04.480 --> 00:11:07.039 Dan leave the parking lot after his workout and the 211 00:11:07.080 --> 00:11:09.840 prius was following him. They couldn't get the license plate. 212 00:11:09.960 --> 00:11:13.080 The clarity of the video wasn't good enough to get 213 00:11:13.080 --> 00:11:15.679 the license plate. But then they got more security camera 214 00:11:15.720 --> 00:11:19.480 footage from city buses and they literally watched this prius 215 00:11:19.480 --> 00:11:22.799 following Dan almost all the way to his home before 216 00:11:22.879 --> 00:11:26.080 the buses lost sight of that car. And then after 217 00:11:26.080 --> 00:11:29.559 the murder was committed, another bus had this vehicle, this 218 00:11:29.679 --> 00:11:33.879 Prius in its security footage and it showed not only 219 00:11:33.919 --> 00:11:36.679 a driver, but somebody sitting in the passenger seat. The 220 00:11:36.720 --> 00:11:39.440 windows were tinted so you couldn't really make anything out 221 00:11:39.440 --> 00:11:41.720 as to who these people were. And again they still 222 00:11:41.759 --> 00:11:44.320 didn't have a good image where they could make out 223 00:11:44.320 --> 00:11:47.279 the drivers the license plate, but they were well on 224 00:11:47.320 --> 00:11:50.200 their way, and lo and behold, this vehicle had a 225 00:11:50.600 --> 00:11:54.960 SunPass transponder for the tollways down there, and eventually they 226 00:11:54.960 --> 00:11:58.159 were able through the sun Pass transponder and DOT records 227 00:11:58.200 --> 00:12:02.039 to find the exact vehicle that was pictured in all 228 00:12:02.080 --> 00:12:04.720 of the security camera footage. And the home run for 229 00:12:04.799 --> 00:12:08.600 them was when they got information regarding one of the 230 00:12:08.639 --> 00:12:10.519 men who had actually rented the car. His name is 231 00:12:10.600 --> 00:12:13.320 Louis Rivera. They got bank records from him that showed 232 00:12:13.360 --> 00:12:16.600 he had made a withdrawal of fifty dollars or forty 233 00:12:16.600 --> 00:12:19.720 dollars from his bank down in South Florida that same 234 00:12:19.759 --> 00:12:22.759 evening after the murder had been committed, and the security 235 00:12:22.759 --> 00:12:27.679 camera footage from the ATM gave crystal clear images of 236 00:12:27.759 --> 00:12:31.279 both men, who were Leuis Rivera and Sigfredo Garcia, in 237 00:12:31.399 --> 00:12:34.559 a light colored Toyota Prias, and they had solved it 238 00:12:34.600 --> 00:12:37.360 at that point. Now, everything that I just described took 239 00:12:37.399 --> 00:12:40.799 a year and a half basically for investigators to piece together. 240 00:12:40.960 --> 00:12:43.440 Now, what did they do when they have these two 241 00:12:43.519 --> 00:12:46.200 people that they believe are the hitmen? What do they 242 00:12:46.240 --> 00:12:49.159 do to further expand on their investigation? 243 00:12:49.440 --> 00:12:53.679 They did an undercover sting operation, and so they The 244 00:12:53.679 --> 00:12:56.440 theory of Craig Eisen literally from the moment was sitting 245 00:12:56.440 --> 00:12:59.120 across from him talking about her divorce and how nasty 246 00:12:59.159 --> 00:13:02.360 it was talked about her parents and her brother. His 247 00:13:02.440 --> 00:13:05.639 theory from day one was that that's the motive he 248 00:13:05.720 --> 00:13:09.200 wouldn't cooperate in the relocation Dan Markel and lo and 249 00:13:09.240 --> 00:13:13.519 behold two days after he's killed, Wendy literally was relocated 250 00:13:13.519 --> 00:13:16.519 with her children to South Florida because there was no 251 00:13:16.600 --> 00:13:19.320 more Dan Markel, no more divorce court to stand in 252 00:13:19.360 --> 00:13:21.919 the way. So that was the theory from day one. 253 00:13:22.279 --> 00:13:26.679 And they didn't know initially what the connection was between 254 00:13:26.720 --> 00:13:29.960 these two Hispanic hit men who had long rap sheets 255 00:13:30.000 --> 00:13:32.600 and the Adelson's, but they were determined to find out. 256 00:13:32.840 --> 00:13:34.919 One of the ways they started finding out was street 257 00:13:34.919 --> 00:13:39.960 telephone records, which established that not only did Sigfredo Garcia 258 00:13:40.279 --> 00:13:44.279 father two children with a woman named Katie Magbenowa, that 259 00:13:44.399 --> 00:13:48.279 same woman, Katie Macbaniwa, was in a relationship, a romantic 260 00:13:48.320 --> 00:13:52.960 relationship with Charlie Adelson, Wendy's brother at the time of 261 00:13:53.000 --> 00:13:56.519 the hit on Dan Markel, essentially a love triangle where 262 00:13:56.639 --> 00:13:58.919 Katie was in the middle and the go between between 263 00:13:59.000 --> 00:14:01.559 Charlie Adelson and the Wilson family and the two men 264 00:14:01.600 --> 00:14:04.600 who put two bullets in Dan Markel's head. So they 265 00:14:04.600 --> 00:14:07.600 decided to do this sting operation, and they began it 266 00:14:07.639 --> 00:14:11.120 by what's called a bump where an undercover agent literally 267 00:14:11.159 --> 00:14:14.480 bumps into Donna Adelson who is at her condo in 268 00:14:14.600 --> 00:14:17.279 South Beach and walking across the street to pick up 269 00:14:17.320 --> 00:14:21.159 Wendy's children and Dan's children, Ben and Lincoln at their school, 270 00:14:21.360 --> 00:14:23.840 and hands her a piece of paper and tells her 271 00:14:23.960 --> 00:14:27.879 that my brother, he's incarcerated, and he wasn't taken care 272 00:14:27.919 --> 00:14:30.600 of the same way that Tuto, who is sik Credo 273 00:14:30.639 --> 00:14:33.919 Garcia's nickname, and Katie have been taken care of. You 274 00:14:34.000 --> 00:14:35.679 need to do the right thing and take care of 275 00:14:35.679 --> 00:14:38.159 my brother. And on that sheet of paper that he 276 00:14:38.200 --> 00:14:41.279 handed to Donna Adelson was an article about the one 277 00:14:41.320 --> 00:14:44.759 year anniversary of Dan Markel's slang and a figure five 278 00:14:44.840 --> 00:14:48.679 thousand dollars and a telephone number, essentially a blackmail demand 279 00:14:48.720 --> 00:14:52.960 to pay this guy who's posing as a gangster five 280 00:14:53.039 --> 00:14:55.440 thousand dollars or they're going to rat out the Adelson 281 00:14:55.519 --> 00:14:58.879 family because essentially what they're saying is we know exactly 282 00:14:58.919 --> 00:15:00.960 what happened, and we're going to turn y'all in if 283 00:15:00.960 --> 00:15:03.440 you don't pay us five thousand dollars. And that sets 284 00:15:03.440 --> 00:15:06.480 off a series of events and phone calls, many of 285 00:15:06.519 --> 00:15:10.919 which were wiretapped, that eventually leads to tons of information 286 00:15:11.080 --> 00:15:14.279 about what the Adolson family knew about the hit on 287 00:15:14.399 --> 00:15:16.679 Dan Markell and who was involved and so forth. 288 00:15:16.799 --> 00:15:20.919 This bump was meant designed to battle the cages of 289 00:15:21.000 --> 00:15:24.120 people involved, and one of those people that they believed 290 00:15:24.279 --> 00:15:29.799 Isisen believed was involved heavily was Donna Adelson herself, and. 291 00:15:29.720 --> 00:15:31.799 One of the reasons he believed that goes back to 292 00:15:31.840 --> 00:15:34.759 the divorce. Some of the material that they recovered from 293 00:15:34.799 --> 00:15:37.840 Wendy Adelson's computer, which they got in their possession the 294 00:15:37.960 --> 00:15:40.440 same day she was interviewed the night of the murder 295 00:15:40.519 --> 00:15:43.879 were emails that Donna had written to Wendy both before 296 00:15:43.919 --> 00:15:47.840 and after the relocation battle, where she was adamant that 297 00:15:48.000 --> 00:15:50.639 they were going to get Wendy and the kids relocated 298 00:15:50.840 --> 00:15:53.559 come hell or high water, and told Wendy that she 299 00:15:53.720 --> 00:15:56.519 needed to do some pretty horrible things to convince Dan 300 00:15:56.919 --> 00:15:59.159 to make the move to let the kids move to 301 00:15:59.200 --> 00:16:02.240 South Florida, the most significant of which were converting the 302 00:16:02.320 --> 00:16:05.360 kids to Catholicism. They were Jewish and Dan was very 303 00:16:05.519 --> 00:16:09.039 observant in his religion, and that would have killed them 304 00:16:09.120 --> 00:16:12.080 if the kids were converted to Catholicism. And that's the 305 00:16:12.159 --> 00:16:15.799 type of gamesmanship that Donna Adelson displayed in her emails 306 00:16:15.799 --> 00:16:17.960 to Wendy, who, by the way, didn't go along. She 307 00:16:17.960 --> 00:16:20.080 didn't convert the kids to Catholicism, or do any of 308 00:16:20.120 --> 00:16:22.480 the other things that Donna was urging her to do. 309 00:16:22.840 --> 00:16:25.840 This became Donna Adelson's battle, it was clear from those emails, 310 00:16:25.879 --> 00:16:28.879 perhaps even more so than Wendy's battle to get the 311 00:16:28.960 --> 00:16:32.240 kids relocated to where the Adelsons lived in South Floria. 312 00:16:32.399 --> 00:16:36.279 To put everything in context too, though Donna hated the family, 313 00:16:36.360 --> 00:16:39.600 hated Dan Markel, but in the proceedings with his ex 314 00:16:39.639 --> 00:16:45.679 wife Wendy, he had quite the aggressive behavior re litigiously 315 00:16:45.759 --> 00:16:46.159 as well. 316 00:16:46.240 --> 00:16:48.720 Can you explain no question about it. Dan was very 317 00:16:48.799 --> 00:16:51.399 skilled with the use of language. He was a prolific 318 00:16:51.559 --> 00:16:54.720 criminal law and criminal theory scholar. He had written twenty 319 00:16:54.799 --> 00:16:58.919 plus Lauriview articles a book, was speaking all over the country, 320 00:16:58.960 --> 00:17:02.080 all over the world on on topics regarding punishment and 321 00:17:02.120 --> 00:17:06.200 criminal punishment theory. And though he didn't represent himself in 322 00:17:06.240 --> 00:17:08.920 the divorce proceedings, he wrote all of the pleadings that 323 00:17:08.960 --> 00:17:11.440 were filed in Port and there was a lot of 324 00:17:11.480 --> 00:17:15.079 vitriolic language that he used. And you know, Wendy's parents 325 00:17:15.119 --> 00:17:17.559 were paying for her legal bills, and they were reading 326 00:17:17.599 --> 00:17:19.880 every word and it was just riling them up. And 327 00:17:19.880 --> 00:17:22.200 it was clear from the back and forth, Dan would 328 00:17:22.200 --> 00:17:24.440 file something and then the next day Donna would be 329 00:17:24.480 --> 00:17:27.480 emailing Wendy about it, and it was riling everybody up. 330 00:17:27.680 --> 00:17:29.880 And you know, nobody would have thought at the time 331 00:17:30.039 --> 00:17:31.880 that they would get so angry with him they would 332 00:17:31.920 --> 00:17:33.960 put two bullets in his head. But that's exactly what 333 00:17:34.000 --> 00:17:35.359 investigators believe happened. 334 00:17:35.559 --> 00:17:40.400 Now with Donna and this bump, and she's approached, and 335 00:17:40.680 --> 00:17:43.920 investigators believe that this will rattle her cage. But does 336 00:17:43.960 --> 00:17:47.640 it rattle Donna's cage? And but does But how does 337 00:17:47.680 --> 00:17:49.319 she react? And who does she speak to? 338 00:17:49.720 --> 00:17:53.240 The very first person she calls is Charlie Adelson, and 339 00:17:53.319 --> 00:17:56.480 she uses some cryptic language. But he asked her who 340 00:17:56.480 --> 00:17:59.799 does it involve, and she says, under her breath home 341 00:18:00.359 --> 00:18:02.640 the two of us. He says who, because he didn't 342 00:18:02.680 --> 00:18:05.160 hear her, and she says, the two of us. I 343 00:18:05.200 --> 00:18:08.119 think you know what I'm talking about, which is obviously 344 00:18:08.160 --> 00:18:11.279 highly incriminating. She doesn't say, I have no idea what 345 00:18:11.359 --> 00:18:13.880 this is about, Like why on earth would somebody be 346 00:18:13.960 --> 00:18:16.759 talking about this and handing me a thing about Danny's murder? 347 00:18:16.920 --> 00:18:19.079 Should we go to the police? And none of that happened. 348 00:18:19.160 --> 00:18:21.119 It was right away. This involves the two of us. 349 00:18:21.200 --> 00:18:23.119 I think you know what I'm talking about, and they 350 00:18:23.200 --> 00:18:26.519 arrange to get together the next day. In fact, Donna 351 00:18:26.640 --> 00:18:29.759 really wanted to talk with him that afternoon, but it wasn'tconvenient, 352 00:18:29.839 --> 00:18:31.680 and Wendy was going to come pick up the kids, 353 00:18:31.799 --> 00:18:33.559 and then there was Harvey and where was he going 354 00:18:33.640 --> 00:18:35.759 to fit in? So they arranged to meet the next 355 00:18:36.000 --> 00:18:39.519 day around lunchtime, which they did just outside of the 356 00:18:39.559 --> 00:18:42.119 South Beach condo that Donna lived in. It's actually a 357 00:18:42.160 --> 00:18:44.480 picture in the book of the two of them sitting 358 00:18:44.559 --> 00:18:48.000 in plotting strategy. And right after that meeting with Donna 359 00:18:48.119 --> 00:18:50.720 and Charlie goes to meet with Katie macbanoa. Now I 360 00:18:50.720 --> 00:18:53.079 should say that right after he gets off the phone 361 00:18:53.119 --> 00:18:57.799 with Donna, Charlie calls Katie mcbanawa and tells her what 362 00:18:58.400 --> 00:19:02.799 had happened with the bump and of significance, Katie mcbana, 363 00:19:02.839 --> 00:19:05.799 what hasn't been his girlfriend? This is April of twenty sixteen. 364 00:19:05.839 --> 00:19:08.759 This is happening. She hasn't been his girlfriend since the 365 00:19:08.799 --> 00:19:11.559 fall of twenty fourteen. And the reason why he says 366 00:19:11.599 --> 00:19:16.960 he's calling her is because Donna told him that that 367 00:19:17.000 --> 00:19:19.079 the undercover agent, who she at the time thought was 368 00:19:19.119 --> 00:19:22.799 a gangster, had mentioned one of Charlie's ex girlfriends, and 369 00:19:22.839 --> 00:19:26.039 that's the pretense under which Charlie says he's calling her, 370 00:19:26.079 --> 00:19:27.839 and they say. She says to him, well, you have 371 00:19:27.839 --> 00:19:29.680 like a thousand ex girlfriends, Why are you calling me? 372 00:19:29.880 --> 00:19:32.279 He says, yeah, that's right, I do. Maybe it's one 373 00:19:32.319 --> 00:19:34.400 of the other ones. But he never calls anybody else 374 00:19:34.480 --> 00:19:37.839 because he knows this is about this bump, is about 375 00:19:38.160 --> 00:19:41.880 what happened to Dan Markel, and this bump therefore had 376 00:19:41.880 --> 00:19:43.960 to do with who was involved in the plot. And 377 00:19:44.000 --> 00:19:46.160 the first person he calls after Donna tells him about 378 00:19:46.160 --> 00:19:49.160 the bump is Katie mcbana. Why her, well, because she 379 00:19:49.319 --> 00:19:52.160 was the middle person between the Atolsins and the hitman. 380 00:19:52.440 --> 00:19:56.119 Now investigators believe that they may be able to pressure 381 00:19:56.160 --> 00:20:00.920 her into giving up this entire scheme and who were involved. 382 00:20:01.319 --> 00:20:02.880 How does it work though, when she's. 383 00:20:02.759 --> 00:20:06.720 Questioned, well, you're talking about Katie mcmanawa, Yes, she isn't questioned. 384 00:20:06.960 --> 00:20:10.880 So they tried to talk to her. They got to 385 00:20:10.920 --> 00:20:13.359 the point where they had gotten all the useful information 386 00:20:13.680 --> 00:20:15.920 they were going to get out of the undercover operation, 387 00:20:15.960 --> 00:20:19.559 which essentially ended when both Charlie and Donna called the 388 00:20:19.640 --> 00:20:23.079 undercover agent and professed to knowing nothing. And so they 389 00:20:23.119 --> 00:20:27.079 were getting about ready to arrest Sigfredo Garcia. That was 390 00:20:27.160 --> 00:20:29.400 going to be the first arrest, and they showed up. 391 00:20:29.480 --> 00:20:32.519 The FBI shows up at his workplace, and at the 392 00:20:32.599 --> 00:20:36.880 same time, Craig Isom is banging on the front door 393 00:20:37.079 --> 00:20:39.359 to the town home that the two of them are 394 00:20:39.400 --> 00:20:42.319 living in. They're back together again. They got back together, 395 00:20:42.640 --> 00:20:45.440 you know, less than a year after the murder, and 396 00:20:45.680 --> 00:20:48.000 as I said, Charlie Adelson was no longer her boyfriend, 397 00:20:48.160 --> 00:20:50.200 and they're living together in this town home. And so 398 00:20:50.440 --> 00:20:52.839 now you have Sigfredo Garcia at his workplace having to 399 00:20:52.880 --> 00:20:55.480 answer questions from the FBI, and he tries to be 400 00:20:55.559 --> 00:20:57.920 cooperative or says he's trying to be cooperative. At the 401 00:20:57.960 --> 00:21:01.359