Speaker 1: What's going on? Thank you so much for listening to
this podcast. It is heard live every day from noon
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smartphone or tablet. And again, thank you so much for
your support. And as we do on Mondays at two o'clock,
we chat with ap Dylan. She is a reporter for
the North State Journal. You can read her work at
nsjonline dot com, and she is also the publisher of
More to the Story newsletter. It's on the substack. You
can subscribe over there. Ap. How are you welcome back?
Speaker 2: Happy New Year, Happy New Year.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I feel like I haven't spoken to you since
last year. Sorry, sorry, I got true. I can only
use that joke so many times and it's not even fun. Yes,
so all righty, So I have to say, I know
I got two stories here to cover with you, But
did you hear the good news about our sheriff?
Speaker 2: Actually yes, I got the press release and I got
that thing shotgunned down onto X with the documentation post haste.
In fact, I think I got it out there first.
Speaker 1: But I am so happy today, so happy we got
rid of three comies, we got Maduro, Tim Walls, and
now McFadden, Like this is a great day. Twenty twenty
six is awesome. So far, it's.
Speaker 2: Definitely batting a valid at this point. It's quite the petition.
It's over thirty few pages long and basically it's a
house about Carla Cunningham d Mecklenburg has filed a petition
along with three or four former members of the Mecklenburg
County Sheriff's Office against Sheriff Macbedden, basically demanding his removal
from office.
Speaker 1: Right this, Yeah, this is the only way to do it,
sort of, you know, arresting him for something criminal in nature.
Speaker 2: But the press release said it was for attended extortion, corruption,
wilful misconduct, and maladministration office, as well as wilful and
habitual refusal to perform the duties of his office.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it is like what they lay out. So
we knew from the four member there, the prior employees, right,
the four other members besides Carla Cunningham, we knew about
these types of issues and some of these accusations that
had been going on for several years since McFadden first
was elected eight years ago.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, and he did that video last fall about
all the staff departures, so you finally had to address
it right, normally right.
Speaker 1: And then remember he gave some bizarre speech at the
graduation ceremony for new deputies. You know, he made the
whole event about him and how he's being attacked and
all of a studden, like the guy is a raging,
narcissistic sociopath, in my opinion, non clinical. But I was
not aware, and I don't think anybody had heard the
about the phone call with Carla Cunningham and how he
tried to what she says was to intimidate her, threaten
her with physical harm or not providing security to her
during the fight over House Built three eighteen, which was
you know where she jumped over to vote with the
Republicans to make him make McFadden cooperate with Ice, and
he called her up and you know, made these z
would be a shame if anything happened to your nice
little business there kind of comments, and she hung up
on him and took it as a threat. That's yeah,
she did. Serious.
Speaker 2: I've got a story working right now at North State
Journal and hopefully it'll drop here in the next thirty minutes.
My editors are going over right now. But I wrote
that thing up real fast.
Speaker 1: About this.
Speaker 2: Basically, she basically says he threatened her for her vote
on that and that if she didn't vote her way
that it was she was going to have a rough
time and he wasn't going to protect her because she
was getting death threats even from her own party for
going along with Republicans. She was the one vote needed
to override the veto.
Speaker 1: Right, and all credit to her, she held firm, she
held the line.
Speaker 2: It did.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and uh.
Speaker 2: I mean, and there's nothing in that bill that's you know, outrageous,
to be honest, I mean, it's it's just closing loopholes
that McFadden himself was using to not do his job
when it came to Ice.
Speaker 1: Right, And that tells you, well, he kept saying, oh,
I you know, I will cooperate with Ice and I'm
not the hold up. I'm not the impediment. That's why
I call him not my fault McFadden. It's because nothing
is ever his fault. There's always somebody else to blame
for whatever problems are occurring at the jail, including the
number of deaths that occurred at the jail, which was
a that was an issue for Cunningham. She was not
She was very concerned about all of the deaths and
wanted more inspections. And then he would attack the inspectors
and oh, they're just targeting me, and it's not my
fault and all of this. But during the debate on
House Bill three eighteen, you know, he kept making it
sound like, oh, I'm doing I'm doing everything that I
can do, and this bill won't really do anything, and
I'm not already doing and all this. But that phone
call that sort of gives away the game. He knew
that they were closing down the last loophole that he
was exploiting. That's what that tells me.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, I mean that kind of telegraph.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Some of the other items, and here from some of
the former employees were pretty pretty damning as well. Basically,
the detention officers are being assaulted by inmates apparently regularly,
and instead of reducing their privileges or writing them up
or pressing charges. McFadden is not doing anything and in
fact would go after the officer instead of the inmates.
Speaker 1: That we don't call them inmates here. Gary wants them
to be called residents, of which their residence.
Speaker 2: The inmates were any need to acts. I'm not gonna
I'm not going to do that. Yeah, that's that's that
reminds me of the whole you know, calling homeless people unhoused.
Speaker 1: Yeah, experiencing unhousedness, or some staff experience.
Speaker 2: Experiencing no no lodging or why it's just okay, so.
Speaker 1: One of the yeah, so one of the things that
McFadden this is like the problem is that you know,
the people that get released, you get the magistrates rolling
all of this stuff too. You had a story I
read this is over on your sub Stack newsletter. More
to the story, this awful story about a thirty two
year old teacher named Zoe Welsh, a science teacher at
Ravenscroft School. Apparently, what two days ago, six thirty in
the morning, somebody breaks into her house and beats her
to death.
Speaker 2: Yeah, while she was on the phone with nine one
one guy break it in. He sees her on the
phone and he beat her and she didn't die immediately.
She was transported to the hospital, but she succumbed to
her injuries after.
Speaker 1: So they did catch the guy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they looked around and they finally found him. That
he was He hadn't gone far. Yes, a guy named
Ryan Vincent Camacho. And yeah, he's got a record, and yeah,
he's released pretty recently on similar charges and the the
the involuntary commitment evaluation was rejected, so he was released
and it was a dismissal without leave with no plea agreement.
Speaker 1: All right, so he has a You write in your
piece here that he's got a long criminal history going
back over two decades, including charges for burglary, theft, trespassing,
breaking and entering, discharge of the firearment occupied property, assault
with the deadly weapon, misdemeanor, stalking, misdemeanor, larceny, injury to
personal property, and violating parole. So what is the timeline here?
What that he it's what he had? What a court
date or something on December fourth?
Speaker 2: Is that the Well in August it looks like he
had been arrested for breaking and entering, an injury du
real property and miscellaneous misdemean larceny in Raleigh, but near
the end of July twenty twenty five, court records show
that he was taking a plea deal in Durham for breaking, entering,
larcity and pearl valations. So he had multiple things going
on over the summer, and those court records show that
he in December fourth, we'll see December fourth, twenty twenty five,
that was the last note on the Wait County larceny,
breaking and entering injury duil property case. The final note
on that was on December fourth, and it read order
to commit defendant for examination and capacity to proceed. And
there's no there's nothing after that except for the case
dismissal without leave, no plea agreement, so that committal examination
apparently never right.
Speaker 1: So this is the involuntary commitment proceedings, much like the
Arena Zarutska murderer.
Speaker 2: Uhh yeah, an arena's law if they have a history
of this kind of violent activity over a three year period,
recent three year period that that has he has to
have that mandatory examination. But you know they're gonna they're
gonna basically split hairs here and say that you know
this guy, you know who was just larcy and breaking
and entering the you know, the the violent activities were
several years back, four or five years back, so that
that wouldn't have applied here. But you know the spirit
of the laws people from repeat offenders from going back
out there.
Speaker 1: Right and and just simple you know, you know, a burgler,
a burglar, you know, somebody who's breaking into places, stealing
stuff whatever. Like, there has to be something other than
that that would have prompted that order to to commit sright,
something something ha happened there, right, because otherwise, okay, you
got this, you know, professional burglar. But that that doesn't
it doesn't seem to me like that would be enough
to order an involuntary commitment unless that was an effort
to keep him off the streets for some reason. I
suspect that they, like the public defender or the DA
or somebody in the court proceeding in dealing with him,
probably figured something's not right with this guy. He needs
to go in for a psych event.
Speaker 2: I think there was something wrong with him because the
original charge for the Durham case from July, the original
charge was was pleed down to a lesser charge. The
original charge five was break enter terrorized injurer so, and
he was given credit for one hundred and thirteen days
in jail for time served against a one hundred and
twenty the day sentence. So he served a week.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, just one extra week after something.
Speaker 2: You know. I mean, Arena's law was effective December first.
This note on his Way County case was from December fourth,
So Arena's law was in effect, right, And that Durham case,
the original charge, had it not been put down, that
charge would have shown up and he would have had
to have been required to have that examination.
Speaker 1: And maybe that's maybe they saw the prior charge and
maybe that's why they they wanted to get him in
for a psyche val. I don't know, I mean, yeah,
there's just a lot of questions here. I don't know
if I don't know if something fell through the cracks
or somebody wasn't sure, or if this.
Speaker 2: Was intentionally a messy case.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Fact those charges were dismissed without leave, with no plea
agreement in place, and they just you know, gave him
basically time served while he was waiting to have his
court date. You know it just given his history, Yeah,
it seemed a little bit light.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, and now a woman is dead because of that.
So yep, all right, we'll leave it there. AP. I
appreciate your work as always. That's AP Dylan. You can
read her work at her sub stack newsletter. It's called
More to the Story. You can also read her work
at the North State Journal and asjonline dot com. Thanks AP,
Thanks pet all right, Sam, all right, if you're listening
to this show, you know I try to keep up
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Your subscription then not only helps my podcast, but it
also supports Ground News as they make the media landscape
more transparent. All right, so I have to acknowledge what
is evident to all who have been listening. I'm very
happy today. I did not start off the day very happy,
but I have become very happy. Why For almost three
years I have been highlighting the course of action that
can be taken to remove the toxic sheriff of Mecklmer County, Gary.
Not my fault, macfadden. There is a provision in state
law that allows for the removal of a sheriff and
it outlines you know what specifically they can be removed
for and what process, what the process looks like. It
only takes five what are called qualified electors. Those are
just voters, So five voters registered voters in Mecklimburg County.
That's all it requires. The problem is is that if
it was just me, right, if I were to just
be on the petition along with you four other just
randoms from the county. We couldn't make the kinds of
serious allegations that would then trigger this court proceeding. The
court proceeding would be tried either by the district attorney
or the Mecklimberg County attorney. We'll see where it goes
and who tries it. I don't know. It's going to
be tried in the district court, so we'll see what
judge gets it, and may be the chief judge, I
don't know. But this is going to be a test
for the local Democrat party because the accusation are legitimate,
and we've known about this stuff. I've been, you know,
beating this drum for three years saying this is how
you have to try to get him out because he's
running for reelection again. And now that he announced that
he does intend to seek reelection for a third term,
like Democrats could put him back into office and they
look they still very very well might Like we could
see how this could go is he gets ousted and
then he gets re elected. That could happen. There was
a sheriff, I forget where it was, down east someplace.
He got ousted through this same mechanism about a year ago.
I want to say, and then they held a special
election and he ran for reelection and he won. So
that could still happen here with McFadden, But the name
fature of the allegations again particularly from what appeared to
be for and I haven't gone through the entire petition
to confirm that all four of the other petitioners besides
State Representative Carla Cunningham, that they are all former employees.
It appears they are all former employees. And according to
the petition filed with the court by a law firm
located in Raleigh representing the petitioners here, since assuming the
office of sheriff, McFadden committed a wide range of misconduct
in office that warrants his removal, and the petition concerns
the following general categories of misconduct. A misconduct relating to
conditions at the Mecklimer County Detention Center and jail administration.
B Retaliation against crime victims and good faith whistleblowers. C
misuse of office resources, including violations of the Federal Hatch Act.
D misconduct relating to staffing and promotion practices. E. Weaponizing
the machinery of the Mecklemburg County Sheriff's Office Internal Affairs
Unit against perceived enemies while squelching internal investigations into perceived
allies and f threats against a state legislator, which which
amount to attempted extortion and bribery. And in the last
hour I went through that component with Carla Cunningham. So
if you miss that, get the podcast. It's available on
all the podcasting platforms, on the WBT app and at
the peatpod dot com. Okay, so from the petition misconduct
relating to jail conditions, will use the term inmates to
refer to all persons here. Okay, Oh, that's good because
he you know, McFadden doesn't call them inmates, he calls
them residents. McFadden has cultivated a reputation for ruthlessness and
retaliation against any subordinate who raised concerns about his management
of the Sheriff's Office or the jail, his ethics, or
about the safety of correctional staff, detention officers, and inmates there.
McFadden appears to view inmates, including certain violent criminals with
whom he has a personal connection. He appears to view
inmates and their families and friends as his most important constituents. Correct, correct,
That's why you end up building a recording studio and
bringing some accused murderer in there for a photo op
with the local media and never tell the victim's family
that that you're gonna highlight this guy and his rap career.
McFadden prides himself on his personal connections with inmates, including
some of the most violent felons in Mecklimber County. In
an unusual move for a sheriff, McFadden gives out his
personal cell phone number to inmates and their families. That's
not misconduct per se. Maintaining personal connections with witnesses in
high crime areas was undoubtedly an effective source of information
when McFadden was a homicide detective, I Am Homicide. That
was his TV show that he got where he used
his old detective files, probably unethically so, but he used
those old files to turn into a TV show and
talked about how he cracked cases and the name of
the show was I Am Homicide. So while that probably
was an effective source of information before becoming sheriff and
obtaining such information was part of his job. Rather, McFadden's
practice of giving inmates and their families personal access to
him is emblematic of the culture that McFadden has created,
in which demonstrations of personal loyalty to McFadden lead him
to intervene in favor of supplicants, directing subordinates to ignore
otherwise applicable rules and policies. What is what is he?
What is this describing He's he's buddying up to criminals
and the criminals families and then he gives them privileges
via the staff. Yeah, this isn't good. The more I
read the well, the worse it is, and the happier
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reading through the petition that has been filed now seeking
the removal by court ruling of Mecklimber County Sheriff Gary
my Fault McFadden on a slew of allegations related to
maladministration as well as threats, bribery and extortion that were
communicated by him to State Representative Carla Cunningham in a
phone call where he was trying to convince her to
change her vote and block the House Bill three eighteen,
bill that would force him to cooperate with Ice. Right,
and remember he said that the bill wasn't needed, it
wouldn't really do anything, there's all these problems with it
and whatever, and he kept minimizing it while that bill
was making its way through the legislature, and the reason
it was going through the legislature was because he was
once again using loopholes to avoid cooperating with Ice, while
claiming he really wants to cooperate with Ice. But that
phone call that he made in July to Carla Cunningham
is proof that he's been lying. He wanted that bill defeated,
and he pressured her to flip her vote and credit
to her and her intestinal fortitude, her bravery and standing
up to a literally a violent mob. She had to
have police security, she had to hire private security. These
were leftists that were mad at her because she was
voting with the Republicans on this bill that she supported.
She supported working with Ice. She's been consistent on that
position too, and she bucked her party and voted with
Republicans to override Governor Stein's veto, and so it became law.
House Bill three eighteen became law. And it was a
very tumultuous summer for her. She was targeted and then
she gets this call from him, who basically he says like, oh,
you know, be ashamed something happened to you. I don't
want any harm to come from you know, the people
are gonna come after you, and I don't want to
see you harmed. You know, you live in my county,
like my county, it's not your county. So that's the like,
that's the probably the more newsworthy, but like in a
way it's not because the record here of McFadden's maladministration,
his wilful neglect overseeing the detention center and staff. This
has been well known. We've talked about this for years.
We had one of his chief deputies in here after
he quit, and he wrote a big letter public letter.
Kevin Canty, who is one of the people on this petition,
goes on to state McFadden's policy of providing personal direct
access to him for the inmates and the inmates' families,
giving them his personal cell phone number you call me.
Its side steps the usual chain of command, and it
encouraged inmates to take their complaints about jail discipline or
conditions directly to him. But inmates generally don't complain when
rules are not enforced, only when they are. When inmates
or their families complain about the enforcement of rules, McFadden
usually gives them what they want. He doesn't change policy.
He simply makes ad hoc decisions or exceptions or orders
non enforcement of the rules. In so doing, McFadden undermines
the authority of his detention officers and staff. McFadden is
frequently heard to say that there is no chain of
command and disparaging the concept of a chain of command.
His stated desire is that line employees and inmates with
complaints should all come directly to him. But by undermining
his employees and managers, and by creating ad hoc exceptions
to policies rather than just changing the policy, he ultimately
creates unsafe conditions at the jail. McFadden has removed and
or intentionally under enforced jail policies and safety measures that
existed to minimize the flow of contraband into the jail
and sure that correctional staff could maintain physical control, segregate
the most violent inmates from other portions of the jail population,
and limit the most violent inmates access to certain portions
of the facility. These rules existed to promote innate and
staff safety. On information and belief, McFadden knows that his
decisions have increased the prevalence of assaults and contraband within
the jail. The jail is dramatically understaffed and requires correctional
employees to work mandatory over time. It takes eighty one
deputies to staff a shift, but during the last few years,
shifts are frequently assigned to just thirty or forty officers,
sometimes even fewer. It's half staffing. Some assigned officers are
on medical leave at any given time, so shifts are
staffed even more leanly in practice. When McFadden took office,
the Sheriff's Office employed thirteen hundred people. Within three years,
that figure dropped to around eight hundred. It is now
at about seven seventy. He's lost half of the staff.
This is why I call him. Not my fault. McFadden like, oh,
we can't open jail North. It's not my fault. I
can't hire people. We're all fishing from the same pier
into the same pool of applicants, and nobody wants to
work at the Sheriff's Office. And it's not my fault. Yeah, yeah,
it is. It absolutely is. How do you go from
thirteen hundred employees down to seven hundred and seventy that's you, man.
Many officers left because of the intolerable work environment created
by McFadden, and many of those who left did not
retire or change careers, but instead went to work for
other law enforcement agencies in the area. Understaffing leads to
unsafe conditions. It was a state policy or county policy,
and state policy require four to five officers per hallway.
This is also required for American Correctional Association and accreditation,
but Mecklenburg County has recently been staffing one to two
officers per hallway, or sometimes no hallway personnel at all.
That makes officers more vulnerable to assault. Understaffing is the
predictable result of McFadden's decision to create a culture that
intentionally undermines the authority of the detention officers by encouraging
inmates to complain directly to the sheriff whenever the officers
try to enforce jail rules. In short, the relaxation and
lax enforcement of rules in conjunction with a culture that
intentionally undermines the authority of the officers has predictably led
to a greater prevalence of weapons, drugs, and other contraband
in the jail than was the case prior to his tenure.
It also leads to unsafe conditions for inmates and detention officers.
And then there are the threats and the retaliation against
whistleblowers and crime victims and others. Deputies and other office
employees are at will employees who served the pleasure of
the sheriff. They have limited protection against demotion, termination, or
other retaliation if they speak up against his abuses and
frequently reminds his subordinates that they serve at his pleasure,
and uses expressed or implied threats of retaliation to deter
employees from speaking up about assaults and unsafe conditions at
the jail or other abuses. Working as a detention officer
or unsworn staff in a jail or prison involves some
unavoidable risk of assault. In practice, a lot of minor
scuffles that might result in assault charges if they happen
in the civilian world end up overlooked or result in
internal prison discipline, but no new charges. But assaults resulting
in serious injury should be, and in most places are reported,
but apparently it's not happening.
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From the text line, ye, we'll see what else is
happening over here. This is Spencer who says, is there
any chance of a trial for some infraction? Maybe a
jail term for a guilty verdict. Yeah, I don't know.
I don't know if they Yeah, I mean theoretically you
could bring criminal charges for the the extortion, the attempted bribery,
you know, like, but this is just a petition to
have him removed. And so now that process is underway,
and the petitioners are asking that McFadden be suspended pending
the adjudication of the petition. So we'll see, we'll see
how that goes. And we'll see. First I guess we're
gonna we got to find out who's going to who's
going to prosecute the petition. Is it the Mecklimber County
District Attorney or is it the Mecklimberg County Attorney. So
we'll see, let's see, Richard, I'm curious if anyone other
than Carla Cunningham was present for that call. Did they
record it otherwise, it's her word versus his true that
is true. I somewhat doubt that she recorded it, but
maybe she did. And the petition makes no mention of
somebody else that was there on the or on the
call with her and mcfaddott, So we don't know if
there's another witness to this. That would be awesome if
there was a witness to confirm her account. And then
they spring that on him in the trial. Right, It's
like he doesn't know if somebody was on the until
he lies and says I didn't say those things, and
then aha, well we have this witness. She was on
the call too, she heard you say it. That would
be awesome. Look, I look, okay, I know there are
a lot of black pilled people in the audience and
they're like, nothing's gonna happen to this guy, right, And
I get that feeling. But look, just let me have
this moment today, Okay, Please just let me enjoy this
for now. We'll see what happens. We'll see, you know,
all right, back to the petition, McFadden. This seems problematic,
and this is also why that North Carolina House Oversight
Committee has summoned McFadden to appear at a hearing in
Raleigh on January twenty second. McFadden discourages detention officers from
reporting use of force incidents involving inmates and staff within
the jail, and has admonished staff from documenting such incidents. Right,
so that's one way to get better stats. Say, oh,
we run a safe jail here. Yeah, well it's safe
if you don't report all the violence by the stats
at least in fact on information and believe McFadden has
threatened retaliation against detention officers who report assaults by inmates.
McFadden's threat to retaliate against crime victims and whistleblowers on
his staff has been conveyed through the chain of command
two supervisors, who then convey it two line employees. Well
that's not smart. So McFadden is telling the supervisors to
tell their staff that he will retaliate against the staff
if they file these complaints or if they file reports
of violence or assaults. And I guess that's the mention
of the crime victims. He's talking about staff and detention
officers that are victimized by inmates or inmates that are
victimized by other inmates, And so he's threatening retaliation against them.
You were victimized by an inmate, you were beaten up,
you were attacked, or whatever you want to enforce jail
rules against that inmate. And McFadden gets a phone call
from the inmate's mother who says, oh, you know, he
didn't mean it, and oh please don't punish him, please
please please, And then McFadden says, I'm going to retaliate
against that detention officer if they file a report on
this incident. Is that what's happening. McFadden has downplayed injuries
sustained by deputies who were assaulted at the jail. McFadden
also inevitably blamed jail deputies who were assaulted, including assaults
that resulted in serious injury, regardless of the facts. McFadden's
threats are not limited to his subordinates. And then it
talks about the the phone call with Carla Cunningham. Okay,
And then there's this on the misuse of official resources
in or around September and October of this past year.
So what three months ago McFadden directed that official resources,
specifically the work time of information technology staff at the
Sheriff's Office, be used to work on his campaign website. Dude,
that's a really bright line in the law. How do
you not know that you're not supposed to do that?
The campaign website not his official business. Obviously, McFadden's misuse
of official resources to support his campaign violates the Hatch Act,
which prohibits McFadden from directly or indirectly coercing, attempting to coerce,
or commanding a state or local officer or employee to
contribute anything of value to a political campaign committee. It
also violated the Hatch Acts implementing regulations so misused official
resources in his treatment of reserve deputies. Sheriffs are allowed
to employ reserve deputies on volunteer or unpaid basis if
they are otherwise qualified. Often, reserve deputies are retired law
enforcement officers from other agencies who wish to keep their
law enforcement certification and work private duty security engagements. Law
enforcement officers typically must complete a certain amount of active
duty time per year to maintain their qualifications. In practice,
reserve officers are frequently volunteers for the number of hours
required to maintain that certification. Mecklimber County policy specifies that
reserve officers are unpaid when called into action up to
a certain number of hours per month, but should be
paid for work above that number of hours. On information
and belief, McFadden has repeatedly directed that reserve deputies work
security at certain collegiate sports, ving events and parades at
Johnson C. Smith University, which McFadden attended on information and belief.
At times, McFadden was informed that this would put certain
reserve deputies over the amount of time where they could
be asked to work unpaid. On information and belief, McFadden
ordered that these reserve deputies work the JCSU events without pay. Anyway,
he did not similarly direct that reserve deputies work without
pay to benefit any other Mecklenburg County institution. It basically
compelled deputies to donate their time to a cause McFadden
cares about. It's because he's an alum of Johnson C.
Smith and because of his reputation for retaliation against anybody
who crossed him or who were not viewed as personally
loyal to him. Reserve deputies knew they would have to
work without the pay they were entitled to, or potentially
risk losing future hours and thus their certification. Everything we
thought we knew about this guy was true. That's what
this petition lays out. It's all been true. Petty, narcissistic, sociopathic,
terrible manager. All right, that'll do it for this episode.
Thank you so much for listening. I could not do
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